The divisions of the 1 and 20 armies of the ZVO will have 6 regiments

Divisions 1st tank and the 20th combined arms of the Western District will have 6 regiments in their composition, reports Look with reference to tass.

“The formations already deployed as part of the 1 tank army (Taman motorized rifle and Kantemirovsky tank divisions), as well as two motorized rifle divisions formed for the 20 army, received a six-regimental oriental structure that existed in the Soviet ground forces and was liquidated during the Anatolia period, which was in the position of Anatolia. Minister of Defense ",

said the source at the General Staff.

He recalled that at that time “the divisions were reduced to brigades, the main combat units of which were battalions.”

"Now, as it was in Soviet times, each tank division will have three tank regiments, a motorized rifle regiment, a self-propelled artillery regiment and an anti-aircraft missile regiment, and each motorized rifle division will have three motorized rifle regiments, a tank regiment, a self-propelled artillery regiment and an anti-aircraft missile regiment regiment ", - explained the source.

At the same time, he said, “each division will receive units of intelligence, communications, logistics, electronic warfare, radiation, chemical and biological protection, and so on.”

“By the end of this year, two new motorized rifle divisions (as part of the 20 Army) should be formed in the Smolensk and Voronezh regions. Their headquarters will be located in Elna and Boguchar respectively. The number of personnel of each of these compounds will be about 10 thousand people, “- said the source.

Comments

[Vladimirets]

"liquidated during Anatoly Serdyukov's term as Minister of Defense"

Shay, come on, don’t sit idle.

[SHAMAN]

Tank "fist" must be created, as in the USSR!
Otherwise, we will be destroyed as a state and a nation .... I think so!

[Knight Rider]

Quote: SHAMAN

Tank "fist" must be created, as in the USSR!

And also - Group of forces in Germany, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Mongolia, Cuba, Vietnam, Angola, Yemen, Ethiopia ...

[SHAMAN]

Quote: KnightRider

And also - Group of forces in Germany, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Mongolia, Cuba, Vietnam, Angola, Yemen, Ethiopia ...

It was a matter, but alas, they kicked us out of there and still took all our money ... A good lesson to us!
Okay, Russians always come back for their money .. (I hope so.)))

[Alekseev]

Quote: Vladimirets

Shay, come on, don’t sit idle.

That's right!
At one time, I had to serve a little in the aforementioned Boguchar.
A new military town, built after the withdrawal of 10th Guards TD from Germany, was handed over to the city, the dismissed apartments were privatized and sold for nothing. Tepericha need to build a new town.
We also need to equip the parks with warehouses there, only one barracks ... A normal training ground is also needed ...
In general, you’ll definitely not have to sit idle
But this division was at one time the only combined-arms formation from Voronezh and almost to Rostov ...
Not necessary, it was. Saved radishes.

[the most important]

Quote: Alekseev

Saved radishes.

stolen, to put it bluntly ...

[Finches]

For a huge land power brigade - complete shit! Serdyukov, far from the army, did not understand this, for a long time the leaders of the state did not understand this, and only thanks to the conflict in the Donbass came the insight that we did not have troops in the Western direction capable of repelling NATO aggression! The formation of divisions and the army began urgently - thank God there’s no scumbag in Hitler’s caliber in the West, otherwise there would have been fierce fighting in the Volokolamsk area, where we could have managed to transfer the squalid brigades from the East and stop the enemy a little! Now you need one thing - time! And of course, money, money, and once again money ... and we give Ukraine a discount on gas! A rich country - Russia ....

[Igor V]

Serdyukov and others are not fools, they understood everything, but it is not clear what task they performed and for what purpose. Everyone saw the result.

[Igor V]

Serdyukov and others are not fools, they understood everything, but it is not clear what task they performed and for what purpose. Everyone saw the result.

[svp67]

Yes, well now I would have to restore the hull system, with all its means and amplification forces, and everything will be the way ...

[Mountain shooter]

Wow! Great news. These are real divisions - a full-fledged combat unit, with more than 300 tanks in each tank. During World War II, there was not much more in tank armies. NATO, what do you think? Ready or not, here I come!

[Boa kaa]

Work on mistakes or repeat the past!(C)
But Shamanov, even under Taburetkin, did not let his airborne divisions be cut.
We need to return the army aviation in operation! Then such a * gingerbread man * will be too tough for any cunning Amish fox.
Now the main threat to our tanks is helicopters and attack aircraft. That's what you need to take care of seriously! Our Armata will deal with Leopolds and Abrashkas, but an umbrella overhead is very necessary!
IMHO.

[ARES623]

OSHS SA of the USSR was born and improved in battles and in blood, and Serdyukovskaya - on accounting calculators. Between them is a huge distance. They began to conduct real exercises, they realized that the SA was not commanded by fools at all, as all 90s and 2000s tried to convince us. Woke up. And thank God.

[cap]

Quote: ARES623

OSHS SA of the USSR was born and improved in battles and in blood, and Serdyukovskaya - on accounting calculators. Between them is a huge distance. They began to conduct real exercises, they realized that the SA was not commanded by fools at all, as all 90s and 2000s tried to convince us. Woke up. And thank God.

The tactics and strategy of the USSR frightened, and it was falling apart by all means. Thank God, I had the intelligence to fight on the maps and make sure that if the war was not against the Indians, then the brigade would not be enough.
Army aviation and tactical nuclear weapons to the army commander and see what the sworn "friends" in the west will sing.
Good luck to our strategists in the General Staff of the Russian Federation.

[black]

Well, they returned the old structure. Applause. What's the point? Shock fist? The question still remains, which is better, more convenient, more efficient - regimental or brigade system?

[cap]

Quote: black

Well, they returned the old structure. Applause. What's the point? Shock fist? The question still remains, which is better, more convenient, more efficient - regimental or brigade system?

On a wide front, without a single command, splayed fingers break one at a time.
Try to draw a map of the hostilities from the Baltic to the Black Sea, then organize the communication and interaction of the troops, well, do not be too lazy to draw up a combat order, for the failure of which in wartime, the punishment is one-shot.

[ARES623]

Quote: black

Well, they returned the old structure. Applause. What's the point? Shock fist? The question still remains, which is better, more convenient, more efficient - regimental or brigade system?

Dear comrade with the American flag, war is not only shooting in different directions, war is a whole life that requires, in addition to cartridges, bread, water, equipment and weapons repair. The division, from this angle, is a kind of state with well-functioning mechanisms for providing both combat and rear life. Without falling into higher arithmetic, there will be about 6 people in 6000 regiments, while the remaining 4000 are engaged in ensuring the full life of military regiments. Passing to the brigade structure, this support system was lost. This is equivalent to the fact that a person cut off his arms and legs, he will become much easier, and will live, but will not be able to fully act. This is what a division is, in short, for pre-conscripts.

[vch62388]

I beg to differ. The modern Russian brigade is a motorized rifle regiment, "pulling" a divisional "tail" in the form of a pontoon company ISB, a field bakery OBMO, RIRTR orb company, etc. Weak hands, fat woman ... This is good in terms of autonomy, but not always necessary in a European theater of operations. The division is better balanced in this regard. The regiment as part of the division simply does not need so many transport vehicles, tk. the delivery arm from divisional warehouses is immeasurably shorter. In complex theaters - yes, the autonomy of the connection is necessary, albeit by a certain reduction in combat power. But not for Europe.

[black]

Thank you for telling what a division is ... A graduate of a combined-arms school. Admin, well, change my flag to Russian, pzhl. And to all detractors and minus speakers, I would like to note that the question of which regiment or brigade is better has not yet been resolved unequivocally. Which is better - power or mobility. Blow or maneuver. Okay. Let's delve into the essence of the issue. In the First World War, a separate combat mission received formations up to the regiment. In the second world - battalions. The combat capabilities of infantry units are increasing. Companies and platoons receive separate combat missions. The abbreviation BTg has become a consumable item. Battalion tactical group. The setting and tasks dictate the structure of the unit. For example, I propose to disassemble the structure of the BTgr of the Armed Forces of Ukraine defended at the village of Redkodub in winter from 14 to 15 years. Leadership: the commander of the battalion strongpoint, with him the UAV aircraft controller, artillery spotter. Subdivisions of the 128th brigade - two mountain rifle platoons, a reconnaissance platoon, a sniper platoon, a sapper squad, a medical department, a mortar platoon - "Cornflowers", 4 pcs. Company of the 25th Terbat Kievan Rus. An anti-aircraft artillery platoon was attached - 2 memory units, an artillery brigade (I don't remember the number). Tank company, tank brigade. The artillery used from the area of ​​N of the item Kamenka - 120 mm mortar battery, self-propelled guns platoon - 2 units. And where is the regimental or brigade structure here? Practice is the criterion of truth, not nostolgia for the Soviet army.

[cap]

Quote: black

Practice is the criterion of truth, not nostolgia for the Soviet army.

For example, I propose to disassemble the structure of BTgr APU defending itself near the village of Redkodub in the winter from the 14th to the 15th year.

Your level of subordination and decision-making has stopped at the maximum shelf. Think bigger. Ready-made decisions at the shelf level are not strategic tasks. The war with NATO is not a fight against terrorists.
Understand at last.

Think a little higher rank.

[Dart2027]

Quote: cap

The war with NATO is not a fight against terrorists

Well, why, if we have an arsenal of nuclear weapons, NATO is fighting like that. The organization of the Armed Forces must meet current tasks and threats, the structure can be a brigade, division, or some other, let the general staff decide this.

[cap]

Quote: Dart2027

Quote: cap

The war with NATO is not a fight against terrorists

Well, why, if we have an arsenal of nuclear weapons, NATO is fighting like that. The organization of the Armed Forces must meet current tasks and threats, the structure can be a brigade, division, or some other, let the general staff decide this.

Yes. If you look from your point of view. So NATO is at war but not with us.
Subject to the conduct of hostilities with the Russian Federation, the doctrine of which is based on the answer "WITH ALL POSSIBLE MEANS IN RESPONSE TO THE THREAT."

Will it be a regiment or a US Marines brigade does not play a big role.
Or they won’t reach (reach, swim, reach). There will remain a personal number (fused), which there is no one to send, due to the lack of an address on the world map.

[Dart2027]

Quote: cap

So NATO is fighting but not with us

It is with us. Because a direct military clash between the Russian Federation and the USA is nuclear weapons and the end to everything.

[cap]

Quote: Dart2027

Quote: cap

So NATO is fighting but not with us

It is with us. Because a direct military clash between the Russian Federation and the USA is nuclear weapons and the end to everything.

The intention of NATO structures, as the vanguard of the "gray wolf" plan, is to provoke the use of inadequate force in a local conflict.
The principle of a yard fight "why do you offend the little ones?"
Therefore, getting involved in deep polemics is not worth it. History will prevail in any version. Who and what fought will remain to archaeologists.

[ARES623]

Quote: black

Thank you for telling us what a division is ... For a graduate of a combined arms school.

And what have you finished, if not secret? When? I repeat to you, as a graduate of VOKU: a division is a viable organism. It is possible to make any tactical groups from it, depending on the task, in scale of application — up to and including the divisional task, there will be few — from several divisions — an army group can be assembled. You just think the level of street hooligan showdowns.

[cap]

Quote: ARES623

Quote: black

Thank you for telling us what a division is ... For a graduate of a combined arms school.

And what have you finished, if not secret? When? I repeat to you, as a graduate of VOKU: a division is a viable organism. It is possible to make any tactical groups from it, depending on the task, in scale of application — up to and including the divisional task, there will be few — from several divisions — an army group can be assembled. You just think the level of street hooligan showdowns.

You don’t have to offend the military man. What you learned and knows. It's like a pianist.
School level: platoon - company-battalion. Regiment - overview.
Secondary - military, higher special.
Academy level: regiment-division-army. Front-overview.
Higher military, higher special.
So it was during the USSR.
30 years have passed since that time. I can’t say who and how to cook now.
Judging by the commentary, the scale seems to be lacking.
A marshal’s wand should be worn in a satchel. It seems like a forgotten truth.
Or the suggested code, if dad is not a general, you won’t become a general.
The rotten legacy of the era of Grachev and co.
That something like this.

[ARES623]

Quote: cap

You don’t have to offend the military man. What you learned and knows. It's like a pianist.

You do not boil like this, half a turn. I myself am one of those regions, infantry. I didn't make it to the stripes, and I don't regret it. And he served in the army, and in the training center of the Uzbeks at the BMP train. Only with your "what was taught, he knows" fundamentally disagree. The teaching should not end with graduation. And to think and think like on the march - either you look at the heels of the one in front, or into the perspective. Raise your head and horizons expand.

[black]

Thanks for the kind word.

[black]

1990-1993 - ORJVOKU, 1993-1994 - NOCO. Brigades or regiments is still a question. My level of military education is not high. Just one scientific work that hit the press a long time ago, and another that was stolen by a certain general. But, okay, a thing of the last century. He retired in 33 of the year. According to the length of service. Managed to rewind twenty-odd. Five months in the DPR Ministry of Defense. The time of large masses of tanks and infantry ends. A regiment on the march is very beautiful, especially during exercises. And when the enemy has a high-precision weapon - a very invoice is obtained.

[SHAMAN]

Comrade served in the GDR .. as a tank driver! When the USSR collapsed, he told (it was already possible ..))) Often, they were put forward to the border with the FRG in full combat readiness and the engines were warming up ... Europe and in Lohmansche the tracks of the tanks would be washed from the guts .. (not all of course,) ... "You pedal on a powerful diesel engine and wait for an order, guys! ..." The adrenaline said went off scale ..! Such were the cases ...

[lis-ik]

I don't know about the warming up of engines at the border, various foreign missions sat tightly on the tail of our division when we went out on marches or training grounds. It was in my time when the tank was forgotten at the railway crossing (it broke down a little, and it was time to go back for dinner), as a result, the train (in my opinion, the train was soft-boiled), since then our "Urals" or "Krazy" with rigid coupling. Your friend probably exaggerated a little.

[vch62388]

Well, finally guessed that the brigades could not replace divisions in the European theater of operations. A full-fledged division with 16 linear battalions, 8 artillery divisions and a single command will be stronger than the 2,5 brigades of the same number (10 battalions, 5 divisions and 3 commanders). Brigades are good at remote and complex theater of operations (mountains, the Arctic, etc.), and in Europe, in its developed road network and flat terrain, the independence of the brigades is not in demand, and its striking power (3 tank and 9 motorized rifle companies of 4000 personal composition) is clearly small. Was it really necessary to disperse all the divisions and wait 7 years to understand this?

[Air Force Colonel]

Have the most concerned already expressed their utmost concern?

[vch62388]

The autonomy of the brigades is a good thing, but ... A division commander with 3 motorized rifle regiments can strengthen the main direction of art. regiment, tanks, sappers, etc. The 3 brigades operating under similar conditions, though nominally, have about the same forces and means, but these forces and means are evenly "smeared" along the entire front, without concentration on the decisive sector. At the same time, an excess of means of combat support (for example, ISB in each brigade) may be unclaimed. In addition, for example, an air defense and anti-tank defense system will be built by each brigade commander independently, which is not good. This was talked about in 2009-2010, but no one heard.

[Pvi1206]

We are starting to enlarge the combat formations. It’s better to set up controllability of troops before it starts.
With GDP, we will not wait until they give us the teeth, but we will act in advance ...

[Spartanez300]

Permanent formations, numerically and organizationally consistent with the level of the division, existed in all historical eras and had different names. For example, in the Roman Empire, the modern concept of the division corresponded to the legion, which was a combination of units (maniples) of light cavalry, heavy cavalry and infantry with a total number of up to 6 people. [000] In the Army of the Mongol Empire, as well as in the Army of Tamerlane, the division corresponded to Tumen, which was an analogue of the cavalry division of 1 horsemen, which, in turn, consisted of 10 thousand (000 horsemen corresponded to the cavalry regiment).
[2] In the Army of Ancient China, such a connection was the june, which was a formation of 12 people, which in turn consisted of 500 si (5 people each) [2500].

[SokolfromRussia]

10 000 for the division is clearly not enough ...

[vch62388]

Quite enough. The ZGV / GSVG divisions had approximately the same number (80% of the wartime staff), and no one would dare to call them incapable. The motorized rifle division of the USSR in the so-called "training" state (not to be confused with training divisions !!!) had 12924 people (without a rocket drone and a helicopter AE) according to the wartime state.
For example - the deployed air defense missile system "Osa" from the Ministry of Internal Affairs had 427 people around the world, in the war - 529 without changing the structure. Moreover, it is about the expanded part. Reduced salary - 185 people. This did not greatly affect the combat capabilities. In the main firing unit - zrbatr, the following were added: a medical instructor, a second radiotelephone operator and 3 people. - calculation of MANPADS.

[infantry76]

Lord comrades!
Time is the best advisor and healer. I myself am 21 years old from my 30-year officer service, served in motorized rifle and tank divisions. This structure has been developed by the vast experience of our army since the pre-war period (before the Second World War). Yes, there were flaws. In particular (especially after the Second World War) there were a large number of so-called personnel ("dead") divisions. State funds were spent on their maintenance and providing them with combat missions. Apparently there was a need for them during the Cold War. But to destroy the divisions deployed in the peacetime or reduced composition of divisions with the elimination of their historical merits, Battle Banners and regalia, as was done during the Serdyukov period, is a SEVERE MISTAKE, with which many military leaders disagreed (for which they suffered: some resigned, others " gone ") Thank God, there were clever heads who defended this structure and under the current military leadership, their revival began.
I have the honor!

[pv1005]

Quote: infantry76

But to destroy divisions deployed around the state in peacetime or reduced personnel with the elimination of their historical merits, Battle Banners and regalia, as was done during the period of Serdyukov, is a GREATER ERROR,

A hundred times right dear. It’s a pity you can put one plus.

[cap]

Quote: infantry76

... But to destroy the divisions deployed in the peacetime or reduced composition of divisions with the elimination of their historical merits, Battle Banners and regalia, as was done during the Serdyukov period, is a SEVERE MISTAKE, with which many military leaders disagreed (for which they suffered: some resigned, others " gone ") Thank God, there were clever heads who defended this structure and under the current military leadership, their revival began.
I have the honor! soldier

It’s good to shoot all the reformers.
Although they do not even understand why.
Jackets.

[SHAMAN]

We need modern tanks and a lot! Powerful fist .. Ready to tear in any direction (where Russia is threatened) by air defense and air force this is primary and the cover itself! Russian tanks should be the best! These are the things in the tank troops ..... (it's time to gas and tear forward ...!)))) We are the best troops!

[erased]

The full-time division of the sample of 70-80 years in the composition has 14-15 thousand. But the idea itself is true.

[Igor V]

Remember the pre-war history with the creation of the corps? There were also different opinions, but when they finally began to form, they did not have time, the war began. And although the corps fought desperately, what could they do if, for example, the 4th Panzer Corps had 4 tanks. It was called that - "four-tank". So we need to be ready for anything, especially when the Merikos are transferring a new division to us in the Baltics.

[Bigriver]

Quote: Igor V

... although the corps fought fiercely, but what could they do if, for example, the 4th tank corps had 4 tank ...

Neither on the eve of the war, nor at its beginning, the Red Army had tank corps.
They were mechanized, in which there were a couple of tank divisions.
If you mean in this way the 4th MK, then again by. It was one of the most equipped corps, not only in the southwest, but also in the whole of the Red Army.
The truth needs to be clarified: it was well equipped with tanks, including new models.

[moskowit]

"And God saw that it was good ..."

[SHAMAN]

Quote: moskowit

"And God saw that it was good ..."

And the Russians began to wet everyone ....

[mamont5]

Quote: Karjala

The truth is that history does not teach anyone anything!

Right. Especially, this can be said about the "west". How many times ... they received people from Russia, but everything is itching to do it.

[stapler 2]

Quote: Karjala

The truth is that history does not teach anyone anything! Before you spend hundreds of billions on an army (like America), you first need to learn how to earn these hundreds of billions (like America)
PS. The army of the USSR was larger and more efficient than the army of the Russian Federation now. As a result, the USSR lost the Cold War. Just yesterday at RBC there was an article that industrial production in Russia has been declining for 14 months in a row !!!! Well, yes, a couple of new armored divisions are what you need to fix the situation.

why make money, you can take it away ...

[voyaka uh]

By Jane's in the Army
Russia has approximately 150 thousand trained soldiers.

How not to rearrange them: divisionally, brigade, battalion -
they will not turn into 300 thousand ...
To scare NATO, it’s more spectacular than the division and the army.
For real local wars, brigades and
battalion groups.

[kirieeleyson]

On the topic of news - a very good understandable decision, it was not necessary at the time of reform to look at the alleged "mobility" and operational management of teams. The lack of professionalism in management as a whole caused the need for such a formation of forces in Europe, and we have vast experience in commanding full-blooded divisions, almost 70 years.
The scheme of rotation of the army during a clash along the front, a width of up to 100 km. the division closes perfectly, with a defense level of 15 km it is easy, and the brigade will close with an interference fit, and without reserves. The brigade formation against the natives works well, especially if the enemy is obviously weaker. IMHO of course. But I am glad for such news.