Media: India asks Moscow to lease the second submarine

On Wednesday, a telephone conversation took place between Sergei Shoigu and Indian Defense Minister Manohar Parrikar, during which issues of military-technical cooperation were discussed. The parties will also have to decide on the transfer of the second nuclear submarine to the Indian Navy. Kommersant.

“Kommersant” reminds that in 2012 r the Indian fleet leased a nuclear submarine of the 971 project, which it called Chakra.

The possibility of renting a second submarine for 10 years is currently under discussion. This question "was raised in the middle of December 2015 of the year, during the visit of the Prime Minister of India Narendra Modi to Moscow at the highest level, but it was not possible to agree quickly: technical disagreements affected," the source said. The next round of talks should take place in April.

The problem is that the Indians have chosen to rent a submarine project 885 "Ash". The Russian side opposed.

“There were a number of reasons for this,” said the top manager of the shipbuilding industry. - First, the first head submarine was adopted by the Russian Navy only in 2014 year and is still the only one of its kind. Secondly, the Russian, Russian Navy submarines Kazan, Novosibirsk and Krasnoyarsk impose special tasks related to ensuring national security on the Sevmash submarines, and no one is going to open access to their technologies. ”

Finally, according to the interlocutor, “the question rests on the price: if the leasing of the 971 nuclear submarine of the project was estimated at $ 785 million, the rent of Yasen, based on its characteristics, will be much more expensive for India”.

According to Kommersant’s information, the Russian negotiators intend to make a different offer to their Indian partners: to rent another NPS from the 971 project.

2 options are considered here: “either withdrawing a submarine from the Russian Navy with subsequent modernization to customer requirements at the Zvezdochka plant in Severodvinsk, or completing the hull preserved at the Amur shipbuilding plant from Soviet times,” the source told the newspaper.

According to him, “the final decision should be expected no earlier than 2017 of the year: by this time, India will have to respond to Russian proposals.”

Comments

[PalSanych]

And what is not fate to complete for the Russian Navy ... why sell it right away ???

[Primus pilus]

But the Borey with the Bulava complex do not want the Hindus? Quite already insolent.

[Vladimir16]

So the whole fleet can be rented?
And why is it actually being built?
The country's defense is somehow not keeping up with liberal values.
The bureaucrats dough cut down in an easy way.
The media will explain to us that it is beneficial for all residents.

If the Indians ask for rent, then our bureaucrats have given a reason to discuss this option of "cooperation".

[cniza]

I do not think that this will happen, as they say - to want is not harmful.

[g1v2]

For them, they want to repair and upgrade Sperm Whale from the reserve to their requirements. And they want something new. They will manage it - either they take Sperm whale or let the beggars from mattresses apl - the choice is not great.

[vovanpain]

Quote: Vladimir16

So the whole fleet can be rented?

And why waste time on trifles, I will not be surprised if all the RF Armed Forces will be on lease, the Indians are quite sick, maybe they can turn the Borey on them, the gub will not crack.

[Pereira]

Hindus well done. Wise and far-sighted politics.
For all their shortcomings, they are quite sure what they want.

Apparently, they are determined to build a second Arihant-class nuclear submarine and are preparing the crew in advance. Or maybe their plans go even further.
Then it’s quite possible to complete the building and just sell it, and not rent it out.
This seems to me a very good solution for both sides.

As for the decline in our defenses, this is not worth fearing. Moreover, we are taking much more costly foreign policy steps with much less results than strategic linking to ourselves of a country with a billion people.

[Kibalchish]

The media will explain to us that it is beneficial for all residents.

Considering how the Hindus operate submarines - in 10 years we will return the trash, which is only for disposal immediately.

[faridg7]

Nobody will return anything - the boat is leased. This is a lease with a buyout.
Here is the option with completion, in my opinion, very attractive. But getting a ship out of the fleet is a bad idea.

[scientist]

Quote: Primus Pilus

Already quite insolent

Rather, they became insolent with their British and American partners, who are trying to get access to modern Russian technologies through India.

[DMB_95]

Not so much the Indians were insolent as ours were fucking. "To withdraw from the fleet, upgrade and sell .." They sailed bl ***!

[73bor]

But what did it so impatient to them? Hindus like no one threatens to such an extent!

[vlad66]

then the Indians chose to rent a submarine of project 885 Ash

Lip is not stupid, however, even "Boreas" would be asked to boot.

the Russian Navy assigns special tasks related to ensuring national security to the Kazan, Novosibirsk and Krasnoyarsk submarines laid down at Sevmash, and no one is going to open access to their technologies.

Though sometimes, common sense triumphs.

The question rests on the price: if the lease of the Project 971 nuclear submarine was estimated at $ 785 million, then the Yasen lease, based on its characteristics, will be much more expensive for India. "

Well, yes, yes, yes, for the money we’ll give the last shirt and pants.

[Armax]

Quote: vlad66

Well, yes, yes, yes, for the money we’ll give the last shirt and pants.

Nevertheless, national security is not completely forgotten:

the Russian Navy assigns special tasks related to ensuring national security to the Kazan, Novosibirsk and Krasnoyarsk submarines laid down at Sevmash, and no one is going to open access to their technologies.

[Wiruz]

If we had 30 Ash-trees (namely, they planned to build so many from the very beginning) - please! Leasing, so leasing! And to give one single of the built submarines of this project is an extreme degree of stupidity. Did the Indians really think that they would give it to them ?!

[Bongo]

Quote: Wiruz

Did the Indians really think that they would give it to them ?!

Why not? Not so long ago, the top officials of the state "kicked themselves in the chest" that there would be no deliveries of S-400 and Su-35S abroad until their own armed forces were fully saturated with them and more advanced models were not put into mass production. And what, the S-400 and Su-35S have been delivered in sufficient quantities, while the S-500 and PAK FA are being built in series? However, the contract for the supply of S-400 and Su-35S to the PRC has already been signed.

[Cananecat]

You do not confuse With 400 with the new submarine. It’s incompatible.

[Bongo]

Quote: Canecat

You do not confuse With 400 with the new submarine. It’s incompatible.

And why actually no? Do you know what is the share of new C-400 air defense systems and modernized C-300ПМ2 in the structure of our air defense systems? And how many regiments are armed with the Su-35S?

[Alex von Dorn]

As far as I know, the contract has been signed, but it still needs ratification. So far, yes, there will be a S-500, and the SU-50 will go into production. And selling yesterday is very profitable. Moreover, the Chinese do not know where this weapon has a "button" that can be used to turn it off at the right time. In addition, other surprises can be hidden in the electronic filling, from espionage to self-destruction.

[DMB_95]

"There will be S-500, and the SU-50 will go into production" .. This is tomorrow. And before it comes, it's too early to sell today

[zyablik.olga]

Quote: Alex von Dorn

And selling yesterday is very profitable. Moreover, the Chinese do not know where this weapon has a "button" that can be used to turn it off at the right time. In addition, other surprises can be hidden in the electronic filling, from espionage to self-destruction.

Blessed is he who believes There are no "buttons", leave these conspiracy theories for other resources. Moreover, the Chinese are planning to buy Su-35S and S-400 in very small quantities, I think everyone understands why. As for the T-50 and S-500, can you say when they will start entering the troops? moreover, by and large, the replacement of the S-400 is not expected. The S-500 is more of an anti-missile system for dealing with satellites in low orbits.

[krops777]

Did the Indians really think that they would give it to them ?!

If Taburetkin would give it, and Shoigu a tough nut.

[xtur]

> And giving one of the built submarines of this project is an extreme degree of stupidity

Not so simple.
if in this way the Indians would become attached to the Russian military-industrial complex and guarantee the safety of technologies, then it would be quite possible to consider the option with "Ash", because in the field of aviation, the Russian Federation is not afraid to transfer its most modern technologies to the Indians - the technologies of the fifth generation aircraft will be transferred to the Indians over time ...
The Russian Federation cannot build the same "Ash trees" in the amount of 30, which is too expensive for the country, and the transfer of modern technologies to an ally, with whom the absence of strategic differences is declared, is a kind of option for scaling ash trees up to 30. But in any case, the question should be posed differently - is it all Ash's technologies should be passed on, because we are talking about both strikes on the shore and about "Calibers", because "Ash" is not a simple hunter for enemy submarines.
Those there is a lack of coverage of the conceptual sphere of disagreementIt’s not clear what kind of combat capabilities the Russian Federation agrees to give to India, which not

[RUS96]

Well, the ash stump will not give up new boats.

[st25310]

So a good submarine ...

[Ased]

You can’t even imagine how the Indians are capable of trashing the nuclear submarines and screwing up everything they can ...

[musorg]

Listening to this mess is disgusting. On T.F. one is on the go pr.971 just from repair, the rest are under repair. What is this ringing about?

[Mareman Vasilich]

Hindus take the opportunity. The weak and weak-willed are always crushed.

[avvg]

If the "appetite of India" is fulfilled, as the people say, "the shoemaker will remain without boots."

[NDR-791]

But don't you need yourself anymore? For India, modernizations are amenable, but for themselves already outdated?

[Wiruz]

Why? Recently, the Kuzbass submarine, which was modernized and rearmament to Caliber, was handed over to the Pacific Fleet

[atamankko]

So I liked the first one.

[jjj]

And this also suggests that even Indian crews can operate our nuclear boats

[Wiruz]

that even Indian crews can operate our nuclear boats

Well yes These Indian carriages remind me of persons of "n" nationality who, when buying a car, look at a leather steering wheel and a shiny body. They say "Oooh, karoshiy car" without even opening the hood

[iliitchitch]

And she's rolling, their lip - "Ash" give. Matches are not a toy for children, and in general - WHY give a nuclear submarine for rent, that, completely the money ran out, or what?

[Amurets]

Since that is the case, it is preferable to complete the building in Komsomolsk-on-Amur. And the case does not need to be disposed of and new equipment installed is still easier to remodel than to remodel the old one. Although it will not do without alterations here. And the 885 project itself is needed . The fleet, especially the Pacific Fleet, needs to update the ships. Japan abruptly set about updating its fleet, against whom it is not clear. Maybe against the PRC, and maybe against the Russian Federation.

[Bongo]

Quote: Amurets

Since that is the case, it is preferable to complete the building in Komsomolsk-on-Amur.

Nikolay, this boat has been at the NEA for over 25 years. It will be quite problematic to complete it, when 8 years ago the Nerpa was handed over to the Indians, it was necessary to make incredible efforts and attract pensioners. Many of them are no longer alive.

[Amurets]

Hi! Sergey! Yes, everything is clear. But it’s also not worth giving new cases. I don’t know how many percent of the equipment was changed at Nerpa according to Indian requirements, but it seems to me that everything needs to be changed on this case if the case has not rusted.

[Bongo]

Quote: Amurets

Hi! Sergey! Yes, everything is clear. But it’s also not worth giving new cases. I don’t know how many percent of the equipment was changed at Nerpa according to Indian requirements, but it seems to me that everything needs to be changed on this case if the case has not rusted.

Hi Nikolay! The case is of course in good condition. The Nerpa for India was being completed according to a simplified version of the equipment. Everything that was possible was changed, but the comfort for the crew was improved. The management of the plant stole a lot on this order, but the workers also had good earnings. The fact is that now in Komsomolsk there are not so many specialists who know the equipment of nuclear submarines. The training center of the Pacific Fleet has not been preparing anyone for a long time, and the "Amur Era" was liquidated.

[Amurets]

Quote: Bongo

The training center of the Pacific Fleet has not been preparing anyone for a long time, and the "Amur Eru" was liquidated

What are you? Does nuclear shipbuilding in Komsomolsk end?

[zyablik.olga]

Quote: Amurets

What are you? Does nuclear shipbuilding in Komsomolsk end?

I’ll answer for Sergey. The Russian Ministry of Defense several years ago officially announced that only surface ships would be built for the Pacific Fleet in Komsomolsk. Sent to summer in Big Stone diesel-electric submarines at the NPS were repaired for 10 years. Although if the Indians pay well perhaps. that for the sake of such a thing they will bring experts from St. Petersburg and Severodvinsk.

[alexmach]

perhaps. that for the sake of such a thing they will bring experts from St. Petersburg and Severodvinsk

And who will work in St. Petersburg and Severodvinsk?

[snifer]

KEMSK VOLOS? Take away, it’s one. Those who will minus pay attention, the question is in price.

[Cat man null]

Quote: snifer

For those who will be minus pay attention, the question is in price

You, dear, read somehow .. selectively, apparently:

There were a number of reasons for this.

1. The first head submarine was adopted by the Russian Navy only in 2014 and so far is the only one of its kind.

2. The Russian Navy assigns special tasks related to ensuring national security to the Kazan, Novosibirsk and Krasnoyarsk submarines laid down at Sevmash, and no one is going to open access to their technologies.

3. the question rests on the price: if the lease of the Project 971 nuclear submarine was estimated at $ 785 million, then the Yasen lease, based on its characteristics, will be much more expensive for India

Please note: the price is the last thing. And then, it seems, in the sense that "the toad will crush the Indians .. completely"

PS: I will not "minus"

[snifer]

no no no, you selectively read it, The first and second paragraph is the rationale of the price, so to speak, and yes, the third paragraph sounds a little different
"Finally, according to the interlocutor," the question rests on the price: if the lease of the Project 971 nuclear submarine was estimated at $ 785 million, then the Yasen lease, based on its characteristics, will be much more expensive for India. " That is, there is a price that the Indians did not want to pay. But negotiations are underway Indians will give the price, I’m sure they will sell the boat, they will also sell the sailors on lease, the question is the price

[Mavrikiy]

What is there in the MoD again that the Skameikiny-stools came to power? Except $ we see nothing?

[Wiruz]

You carefully read the article! Nobody will give them Ash! A Pike .. Pike is possible. We have them in a more or less residual amount, they are gradually modernizing with re-equipment at Caliber-PL complexes. With the proceeds, it will be quite possible to patch up old submarines or lay new ones

[Auralski]

Ash Leasing - undermining Russia's defense.
Leasing of the nuclear submarine of project 971 is a logical continuation of cooperation.

[xam0]

Wow Hindus lip rolled out! Take out and lay down the latest submarine with all the secrets and novelties! They kind of wanted to develop their own, but apparently it’s not possible to do something completely modern, so they want a breakthrough at our expense. I think they need to roll their lip back.

[Rokossovsky]

I don’t understand, we have so many modern boats ?! The 971 project is one of the best nuclear submarines in the world, and we can easily give away unique boats, even if on lease (what a nasty word!), Though to partners, but still to sailors of another state! What the hell ?! They need a submarine - let them order construction, preferably a series, otherwise the damn lip is rolled out!

[Kupez4]

Let them rent from the Amerikos. They also buy a lot from them. Such a cow is necessary for himself.

[kenig1]

Indians do not demand, but they ask. There is a seller and a buyer, and I think we will find common ground. Higher-ranking citizens are against the sale of the full range of weapons produced in Russia, is it necessary to be permanent?

[avg-mgn]

It looked like an Internet, the Americans judging by the publications, the boats are not put on lease or for sale, although they are ahead of us in the export of weapons more than 10 times!

[Vitalii21]

Well, they threw a fishing rod, ours refused. Let them go around the market, I don’t think that the nuclear submarines are leasing at every corner, they will get their second 971, repaired or new, which is too early to scream.

[valent45]

This once again shows that our weapons around the world in value.

[Alexander S.]

here are the alarmists ... blurted out something in the top manager ... and everything was in a panic ... They were selling their homeland ... they found an authoritative opinion)) What to give to sell is decided not by the factory .. and the state ... already said something ... what ash ourselves need for the coming years. That's when the contract will be signed for the transfer of apl India or to whom else ... then you need to panic ... and there are no reasons for the village. And the Indians ... they are such Indians ... they will ask for cheap cheap Western Siberia and they will be truly surprised our failure.

[Viewer 1.0]

Oh, this love of money, you’ll see the whole fleet in the advertisement column

[CRASH]

Of course, I’m not the most cunning, but why shouldn’t I sell the Shark to India, and not let it go to the museum? And then under this business, to develop rockets for the Hindus, for their money?

[gfs84]

Of course, I’m not the most cunning, but why shouldn’t I sell the Shark to India, and not let it go to the museum? And then under this business, to develop rockets for the Hindus, for their money?

Well, at least because they do not need a strategist but a multi-purpose nuclear submarine ...

[_NortoN_]

let them finish building the square. 971 ave. since it looks like we ourselves have already abandoned it, and we will get the money and we will seriously help the Indians. And let them not dream about ash

[RussianRoulette]

The Premier League is a serious tool of strategic dominance. Is it something that has collapsed from oak? Even for one such interest, it is necessary to begin to reconsider relations with the so-called partner. Gentlemen Indians in general than explain the need for super-tech nuclear submarines? It smacks of industrial espionage at the interstate level! It is clear that with the Russian equipment of the boat no one will provide, but nevertheless, there will be something to study.

[Cat man null]

Quote: RussianRoulette

The Premier League is a serious tool of strategic dominance. Is it something that has collapsed from oak?

Dear, did you consider the word "second" in the title well?

They already have one in this ... thu !! leasing ... what else, to truffles, industrial espionage ...

You yourself .. from oak

[Alex_59]

Enough for the Indians and one. All new boats are part of our Navy!

[kote119]

don’t worry, no one will lease new boats, the most interesting thing is that the rental scheme of our nuclear power plants has existed since the Soviet era (the Indians rented a 670 ave., at that time not the most outdated)

[Ustinov 055 055]

Maybe they still have Peter the Great for a walk to drive, X them and not modern nuclear submarines

[kote119]

so they have 971 ave. on rent, and it’s quite modern

[RussianRoulette]

Quote: Cat Man Null

You yourself .. from oak

Perhaps it was just that the slonder was boiling :)) The guys at the top, I would hope that if they practice such leases, it’s not to the detriment of the country's defense and technology. And if they make money from this, then wisely ... I repeat - I would like to hope (because there are so many evil spirits now in the departments).

Regarding the fact that they already have one, this is understandable. She also meant it.

[vglazunov]

Russian crooks and liberals need to be leased to Indians so that they are tested in all places.

[Evgeniy667b]

We have built "Arihant", so let them continue building, even with our technical assistance. But squandering submarines, which themselves have nothing at all, can only be full of submarines. and. l. s.
Collectors are figs.
Decommissioned from sedimentation tanks to upgrade, at their expense is still somehow acceptable

[pts-m]

Well, they said that in India they created a 3D printer, which, when loading composite materials into it, prints the PL series (hemp) like seeds. However, I’m lying. It’s better to get from Russian steel.!

[Ros 56]

Lord from MO, and you give them your wives for rent. What are completely crazy, such things for rent. Either sell or not at all.

[Ros 56]

You are a walking plague, except for sticks you can write something.

[Wolka]

I don’t believe in the sincerity of the Maharajas, the Hindus have been walking under the Anglo-Saxons for so many years, and now they worship all English, push them together, I remember the story of our Vladimir, business business, and you should not squander your military technology, it’s not Gazprom, it’s really public property, the more leasing ...

[afrikanez]

You read such messages and it immediately seems that we simply have an excess of nuclear submarines. So not only that, the Indians are still asking for almost the latest developments. Wisely invented. I wonder what they will eventually agree on.