Military Review

Alexander Kisten: "You can’t hide your muscles from a knife"

57
An exclusive interview with the famous knife fight instructor, special forces officer A.M. Kistenen. Usually Alexander Mikhailovich does not appear in the media, and only employees of such structures as the Federal Security Service, Alpha, Vityaz, Special Forces of the Federal Drug Control Service and the like can get to his trainings, but he made an exception for the Military Review.


Alexander Kisten: "You can’t hide your muscles from a knife"


- First I would like to know your biography. Where did you study, served?
- Finished Ryazan Airborne School. He studied at the faculty of foreign languages ​​- this is special forces. In the Soviet Union there were 2 schools where special forces were trained - Ryazan and Kiev. Received a diploma as a translator. Served in Afghanistan (1985-1987). In 1987, I got into a special forces brigade in Maryina Gorka (Belarus). Then he served in the Belarusian Alpha on a full-time position as a mine-bomber, and freelance was also a hand-to-hand combat instructor. Combined, as the state there was less than in Moscow Alpha. Now there is already such a full-time position, but then I checked all new arrivals - I fought with them.



- Afghanistan was a special training ground?
- Yes, all the special forces were driven through Afgan.

- What did you do from martial arts?
- I started with the classical struggle (now it is Greco-Roman). The school began to engage in Soviet karate. Fought in full contact. When they banned karate, they began to practice hand-to-hand combat. They made their own protective gear. Then our coach changed - he started giving more taekwondo.

- Hand-to-hand fight was what? Which direction?
- There were no directions, they just fought in defense - they took the plates, tied them up with slings. It turned out quite flexible protection, such as body armor. At the same time it was solid.

- Let us turn to the topic of our conversation. Why teach exactly knife fight?
- In 1995, I retired from Alpha and was the vice-president of the Russian Martial Arts Federation. I went to the USA to the seminar of the International Ju-Jitsu Federation - Carnegie Hall, 12 tatami, 1500 people ... There I saw an Englishman's instructor. He was from the marines. Very well owned a knife. Now I understand that there was nothing unusual in his technique, but then I was impressed.

“Was there really no knife fighting in the GRU?”
- Did not have. There were complexes of RB-1, 2. And nfp. And there were enthusiasts in each division - someone owned boxing, someone struggled. Accordingly, in this division there was an emphasis on boxing or wrestling. And nobody knew that.

- We had the richest experience after the war, there were front-line intelligence officers. They knew how to use a knife.
- There was no system.

- That is, someone served somewhere, someone showed something to someone?
- Absolutely. There was nothing systemic. This is strange, but nevertheless it is. And nothing has changed since then. There is no systematic preparation for close combat. By the way, close combat is not only a fight with a knife, it is the whole range of impact on the enemy at a distance of up to 5 meters. I train guys from different departments, they can confirm. One gives so, the other so. And there is no state program, at least for some subdivision. There is no instruction or guidance. And modern military operations show that during a battle in the city or at infrastructure facilities, it is these skills that are needed.

So when I saw this, I realized that I had to do it. In the Federation of Russian Martial Art there was an applied section of work with weapons - at the then level. But I have not seen such work with a knife until that moment. At Rethunski I liked some of the knife selection techniques, but working with a knife against an armed enemy is not well developed. I am a patriot, but the main thing is efficiency, and not that ours is indigenous or not.

- What are you interested in the Philippine system?
“Through the Rethunean, I learned about Bram Frank, who is an internationally recognized master.” So, his teacher is Filipino. When I started to deal with this issue, I found out that the main instructors in the world on NB are Filipinos, or their students. Now even the South Koreans show - and at a good level - the Philippine technology. And this is natural, since for the Filipinos it is a tradition. There is still blood feud in the Philippines. Of course, their program must be adapted for us. The Philippines Marine Corps often conducts military operations in the jungle and they have a short sword besides a rifle, a pistol and a knife in a fighter's outfit. They work a lot with sticks. We work with sticks only as with a simulator. Usually the knife on the knife.

- Should work with a stick, a knife and bare hands be based on the same biomechanical model?
- Yes.

- Why do you need to be able to work with two knives?
- Good question. A knife may never be useful in life, not even once. But it’s better than a knife to develop speed, reaction, ability to respond quickly to the situations offered to you there is nothing. You can pump up big muscles, but you will not cover them with a knife. You have two knives, I have two knives. I have to control both your knives and my own. If I miss something, then for a lethal injection, enough effort in 4 kilograms. A child can do. The press from the knife is also not pumped.

Therefore, I have to control all the blows. This is tremendous speed, this is deconcentration - because I cannot track every knife. I have to control both knives at the same time. This is a completely different perception. When you work with two knives, you even start thinking differently. In the fight, tunnel vision can be activated, and you will not see a blow from the side of the knife. Such activities help to avoid this. At first, this state appears in 10 minutes after the start of the workout, after a month of training - through 8, then 3, and then you start to beat - and it immediately appears.
From the side it does not understand until the instructor shows.

I remember in Afghanistan we specialized in raids. The ambushes were staged only in the zone of action of another battalion. Often worked in the mountains, you come very close. And in the village the enemy may seem literally "because of the angle." By the way, we never had hand-to-hand fights. And imagine what should be the speed of identification (friend or foe) and response to changing situations. It happened that the enemy was at a distance of two meters. I am alive because my reaction was better. And the knife further improves the reaction.

- Is mass needed for practicing knife fighting?
- We need - and the mass, and strength, and speed, and the development of "hinge". There are different exercises. "Fizuha", speed and strength endurance needed. To produce at a certain period of time greater speed and power. There may be several opponents, and if you hold out for 5 seconds longer, then you won.

I also give exercises on both hands in order to become oboer and successfully work with both hands. We start at a slow speed, then work out.

- There are disputes about the effectiveness of a shot or cut. What do you think is better?
- Equally good. It is better to combine them. The prick is easier to redirect to the cut. Cutting a shot is harder.

- It is believed that modern soldiers wear body armor, so the shot is more effective than a cut.
- Yes, but there is a small nuance - you cut the biceps (which does not close the armor) and the arm becomes like this. Or cut the triceps, and the arm becomes that way. And the leg can be cut the same way - it tucks and the person falls on his knee. The main thing is to know the physiology. Cut your fingers and everything falls out of them - a gun, an automatic ...

- Do you agree with the statement that reception is the sum of technical elements?
- A little differently, I will give an example: there are bricks in “Lego”, from which you can make everything — a house, a ship. These are unshakable bricks, "base". They can mix, fold. We learn to work according to principles, and not according to methods. All the situation. If a person works with techniques, a situation may arise in which this technique will not work. And what then, the crisis of the genre?

- Probably, this principle - according to the situation - should be reflected in the methodology?
- We do that. First the bricks. Then we train the combinations on the basis of certain complexes. I introduced the following exercise for my bodyguards. Two people are standing opposite each other. One has a gun, another has a knife (real). I stand behind the one with the pistol and show my partner with a knife, in which sector to beat - at the signal of the timer. Beat can be in any sector, with any hand. The one with the gun does not know where. He must perform a specific technical action — for example, shoot in 3 seconds. I, as an instructor, look at the correctness of performance. We have 2 targets - at a distance of 2 meters and 5 meters. The first target is like a person who attacks you, and the second is an additional one (if we are modeling a situation with several opponents). 3 seconds, 4 shot.

- That is, you are positive about the stress method?
- Of course. The knife itself is stressful. If we teach a person using this technique, a knife on the street will not be a stressful factor for him, as he is used to it in training.

If you work with stamps, clichés, then it is difficult for a person to later adapt to a real, rapidly changing situation. A stress technique helps him in this.

- Judging by the video, you only move on the 6 sides, "snowflake." And there is no back and forth. What is the reason?
- Our principle is attack and counterattack. We have no protection. We have a backward movement, but psychologically we form a person’s desire to move forward. A block with a hand gives rise to a block in the head. The person gets used to it and then retreats in case of danger. This is often the case with athletes who burst their distance, bouncing backwards. That's what comes when a unit is trained in sports skills. I respect boxing and wrestling, but I understand what it does. The first movement should be attacking, oncoming, not bouncing back. Accordingly, we train and movement.

- How do you feel about the sport of knife fights?
- Ok, positive. It’s like the Federation of Practical Shooting - it forms the culture of handling firearms. This is not what is used in combat, but it produces speed and accuracy of impact. The only thing that there is no tactics for a real fight. The same with a sports knife fight. You just need to understand that this is not for reality.

- Do you agree that in order to use a knife, you need to be able to step over the “psychological threshold”?
- This is important, but not the most important thing. You can cross the threshold, but if you are not technically prepared, you will not live long. In my opinion, not only the cowardly perishes quickly - the evil optimist also does not live long. The spirit can suffice, and the skill is not enough.
On the other hand, it happens that there is a skill, but there is no readiness to apply. I was told such a case - there were two guards with weapons, six people ran for them from a distance of fifteen meters. They slaughtered these two, because the guards were not ready psychologically to use weapons.

- How to overcome this threshold?
- Again - our training knives are made of metal, and then we train with real knives.

- Do you agree that you need to be able to work against three objects: sticks, chains and a knife?
- Somewhat categorically. Not necessarily against three, but I understand that they have different trajectories and impacts. In this regard, I agree on the qualities that such work forms. When you train, you estimate everything a little differently. For example, the chain: threaten it for a long time, it has its own inertia.

Need to be like water. Do not go head-on - there can always be an opponent who is stronger and healthier than you. Once in the Philippines, they asked for a lesson, although I came there as a student. I told them that you fight face to face, and we go to the side or back - this is a tactic. Of course, it is easy to say - in fact, no one will let me just behind the back, we must train. We are always trying to win tactically. You go to the enemy side - the situation has changed. And no matter what a person owns. Here are other categories.

- Thanks for answers!
Author:
57 comments
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  1. PKK
    PKK 24 March 2016 07: 17
    0
    If you advance yourself into a faster Time, become faster than your opponents by your head with the help of a simple simulator. Then you can wind up pieces of wood on your wrist and walk so if you are stabbed with a knife, but it is advisable to fight if the running did not help, 2 -3 seconds, after legs again. The main thing is not to force yourself to train constantly, then you will survive.
    1. Riv
      Riv 24 March 2016 09: 04
      +1
      "head faster" ... Now I figured out how to become a Jedi. :)))
      1. marlin1203
        marlin1203 24 March 2016 09: 59
        +1
        "You don't need these droids ..." and went on to himself laughing
        1. Riv
          Riv 24 March 2016 11: 11
          +1
          ... and if there is a lightsaber in your pocket, then do not give a shit about those with knives. And you can beat off bullets.
          1. Bashibuzuk
            Bashibuzuk 24 March 2016 14: 29
            +1
            ".. and if you still have a lightsaber in your pocket, then .." -
            the main thing is not to accidentally press a button!
            ...
            With a cry of a cue, and a kick
            daddy's ... they slipped into boots.
            ...
            Itchy-buzzing sound, uzhzhzhzhzhzhzhzhu ... and you become a tenor.
  2. Same lech
    Same lech 24 March 2016 07: 28
    +9
    By the way, close combat is not only a fight with a knife, it is the whole range of impact on the enemy at a distance of up to 5 meters.


    Absolutely right...

    I saw how strong men and guys were killed with short knives ...

    the killers with one hand held a person by a part of the body or clothes and with the other hand with a short knife poked blows crushed the throat, face, chest ... it’s very difficult to fight off such without blood loss. on HBO)
    Therefore, I believe that a person who owns and knows how to use sharp objects (including a knife) in an attack is very dangerous.
    smile I must say that in the conditions of RUSSIA an attempt to defend myself with a knife amounts to breaking the law and a respectable citizen who stabbed an attacking bandit usually goes to prison and then you have to choose between his life and freedom ... sadness.
    1. Maegrom
      Maegrom 24 March 2016 08: 20
      +4
      And thank God. Too many who want to know respond to a push to the chest with a pen in the stomach. P.S. I carry the knife itself as a tool and a measure of EXTREME self-defense.
      1. novel66
        novel66 24 March 2016 09: 12
        +3
        I agree, the wording is wonderful. somehow I feel myself naked without a knife in my pocket - but only to the extreme.
      2. otto meer
        otto meer 24 March 2016 11: 02
        +5
        Quote: Maegrom
        Too many who want to know respond to a push to the chest with a pen in the stomach.
        You do not work in the judicial system by chance? A "push to the chest" is a direct attack, and logically (but unfortunately not according to the law) I must and must defend myself in ALL ways available to me. There is a knife - with a knife, a stick - with a stick. The life and health of any citizen is IMPACT! And only this principle should be elevated to law.
        1. Maegrom
          Maegrom 24 March 2016 17: 09
          -1
          Proof of the above.
          1. otto meer
            otto meer 24 March 2016 20: 51
            0
            Quote: Maegrom
            Proof of the above.

            ??? !!! Do not understand. Miles sorry.
    2. marlin1203
      marlin1203 24 March 2016 10: 03
      +2
      Well, don't hit the vital organs. You can poke with a knife in the shoulder, thigh, etc. Or cut superficially, but for the external effect - more blood. This is all, of course, only if it is already "edge", i.e. You are alone, and your loved ones are behind you, there is nowhere to run and there is no help.
    3. Chiropractor
      Chiropractor 24 March 2016 11: 58
      +3
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      I believe that a person who owns and knows how to use sharp objects (including a knife) is very dangerous in an attack.


      When teaching some types of martial arts, we are working with "forms". In the future, any object of a suitable shape becomes a weapon.
      For example, when mastering the "cube" form, the effectiveness of any stool (a mass weapon of kitchens and barracks) increases many times over.
      Therefore, when mastering a knife, everything that is at hand becomes a weapon: a key, a comb, a chopstick, a broken branch, a pencil / fountain pen, a female hair clip, a plastic card, an adhesive bubble with a sharp nozzle .... Any office becomes a weapon.
      I no longer mention awls, drills and screwdrivers, needles for filing documents ...
    4. Oslyabya
      Oslyabya 24 March 2016 12: 22
      +3
      I’ll clarify. The defender sits for bloodletting or self-mutilation. For actual damage.
      And THAN he achieved this - a secondary matter. Only if it was the Cold Weapon that was with you at the time of the attack, they would try to turn this fact as preparation (intent) on the part of the victim (or a provocateur?)
      Ideal with t.z. self-defense - the weapon is taken away from the attacker and the aggressor by it and calms down. If no luck.
  3. Maegrom
    Maegrom 24 March 2016 07: 33
    +8
    The first recent material on hand-to-hand combat, in which, at first glance, it’s not a freak that is promoted, but a realist with a well-grounded approach, interestingly reasoned methods.
  4. Mikhalychch
    Mikhalychch 24 March 2016 07: 42
    -4
    The article is simple and everyone knows about it for a long time, nothing new ... Moreover, there are no illustrative illustrations.
  5. a.hamster55
    a.hamster55 24 March 2016 08: 54
    +1
    It is necessary to develop in the Airborne Forces even among contract soldiers - experience will be transferred. And then it’s a shame when the airborne demobil (almost Rambo) is killed by a mountain boy with a scalpel.
  6. Riv
    Riv 24 March 2016 09: 02
    +3
    Even without reading the articles, but simply looking at the starting photo, in which the "professional" holds the referee with a reverse grip, we can say that there is nothing special to read here. Such a grip was called "stupid", because it limits the fighter to three strictly defined blows, and even reduces the distance of the knife. Remember, comrades: the knife must be held with a direct grip, in no case the opposite.

    The author does not see systems in army training, because he does not know how to look. In fact, the entire "army system" can be defined as a set of skills required to achieve victory in any battle. Anyone in general. For example: you have a shovel, the enemy has a machine gun with ammunition, win. And we must win. How? It's your problem. Or: the enemy is a dog, and your hands are shackled. And the galaxy doesn't care where you put your own automaton.

    The army training system is primarily aimed at developing such an attitude to combat. In the training unit, they do not deal with special forces, but with conscripts - "spirits". One out of ten will survive and will be able to kill tanks with a crowbar, but first he needs to believe in himself and learn to win. And the author's view is extremely narrowed, for him there is only special forces. Well, in principle, nothing surprising, he trains bodyguards.

    Actually, how many times have I had to deal with serious fighters - they all liked to mess with the young. Drive them out for exercises, show off in front of them on a horizontal bar, train in hand-to-hand combat, or carry out with weapons, in the field for tactics, skiing, etc ... Teach something, in short. If such classes are carried out regularly (systematically, aha!), Then the benefits are undeniable and the younger the "spirit", the more benefit. A person must see what he should strive for, know what he needs to be able to and believe that someday he will be able to do better.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 24 March 2016 22: 54
      0
      Quote: Riv
      The author does not see systems in army training, because he cannot watch.

      Or maybe the other way around?
      I'm afraid you are completely off topic.
  7. unknown
    unknown 24 March 2016 09: 13
    +3
    Strange article.

    My combat instructor, melee himself, liked to repeat that in the USSR the most prestigious type of martial arts among army and specialty professionals was the so-called fencing with bayonet-knives. So, the system was.
    1. marlin1203
      marlin1203 24 March 2016 10: 06
      +1
      An ordinary unsharpened bayonet-knife can only hammer the enemy like a piece of iron. He does not cut and hardly stabs. Special lovers bring them to razor sharpness, but this is damage to property, and you can get it "on the hat".
      1. Riv
        Riv 24 March 2016 11: 16
        +2
        Normally he stabs. But you cannot sharpen a bayonet-knife for the same reason that the bayonets never sharpened bayonets in the Russian army. They only got the tip so that they would not pierce the clothes, but tear them and drive the fibers of the tissue into the wound.
        If you need a really sharp combat knife, it is better to have a fink with you.
        1. Olezhek
          Olezhek 24 March 2016 14: 31
          0
          and tore it and drove tissue fibers into the wound


          But why?
          1. Riv
            Riv 24 March 2016 16: 28
            +1
            And so that the wound is suppressed. Antibiotics were invented relatively recently. Before that, any penetrating wound required a sufficiently complicated operation to clean the wound and if he hesitated - hello, gangrene. It happens only in the movies: a man was shot in the arm and he pays no attention. In reality, urgently to a doctor, or even antibiotics will not help.
        2. Kunar
          Kunar April 8 2016 11: 05
          0
          As an option. Although I prefer a mini-budget .... It’s double-edged ...
  8. pimen
    pimen 24 March 2016 09: 28
    -2
    how does the knife speed up the reaction rate? you either have it or not, and you have to live with it
    1. Bashibuzuk
      Bashibuzuk 24 March 2016 14: 39
      0
      This is not about the speed of reaction is directly stated.
      About a special way of perceiving the situation that is being developed.
      And the more dangerous such an operating time is, the faster it works.
      If there is an ability.
      ...
      Simply put, a person learns not to think with his head, but to "think" with reflexes and premonitions.
      The spinal cord "think".
      And the knife, the more sharpened, the switching process speeds up at times.
      1. pimen
        pimen 24 March 2016 18: 40
        0
        those. other things being equal, you will also be "two bars" behind your opponent
  9. Stas57
    Stas57 24 March 2016 09: 28
    +6
    I quoted many times, I repeat ..

    US Police - Six Meter Rule - Why are cops so nervous

    A test was conducted among Los Angeles police officers. The experiment involved 85 police officers who were not warned about the experiment (they were all engaged in a training session on a different topic "in the field"), the attacker was a man in "camouflage" with a covered knife (a very accurate model), who, after approaching the policeman on three steps, drew a knife, and shouting: "I will kill you, pig!" tried to "kill" a police officer.
    What came of it:
    - 3 of 85 saw the knife before the moment of contact.
    - 10 of 85 realized that they received several stabs only when the attack had already begun.
    - 72 out of 85 !!! they did not understand at all that they were being attacked with a knife, and after the "battle" they twisted their heads, looking at the chalk stripes on their uniforms.
    - the first reaction of the majority was a retreat back, which the "aggressor" immediately compensated for, reducing the distance and continuing the attack.
    - most of the contacts started with a block and elbow and knees in the clinch, 60 fights ended in the stalls.
    - after analyzing the hassles, the author of the experiment came to the conclusion that only 1 (alone !!!) the policeman was able to effectively defend himself from the attack.
    The last part of the experiment was to grab a weapon and use it as a reaction to a knife attack. A police officer stood with a weapon in a holster (the holsters are closed with a latch or Velcro, open with one hand, the Glock pistol, naturally, without a safety catch), several people passed by him, he did not know which of them had a knife (opponents were trained to use knife). At a distance of up to 4 meters, no one managed to grab a pistol, ahead of the attack; at 5 meters, only a few police officers could do it. Terrible statistics for LA police, where the police are traditionally considered the most trained in hand-to-hand combat. "
    1. Riv
      Riv 24 March 2016 11: 35
      +2
      Invalid experiment. At a distance of two meters, it is impossible to resist an unexpected attack with a knife, or cane. Even if you are warned with a scream and a weapon is shown in advance (and you can’t hide the cane), the factor of surprise is not lost. The vast majority of people still need to be aware of the danger before they begin to defend themselves.

      In such a situation, a direct kick would be correct, stopping and knocking back the opponent. Mae-giri, or yoko-giri (when attacking from the side). But such a reaction must be trained as a reflex response to any sharp reduction in distance. You, after taking a hot iron, do not think about the need to pull your hand back? So it is here. A stop blow must be born out of reflex, not logic. Well, of course, long workouts are needed to get the hit quickly. The same is true with the interception of an armed hand: thousands of repetitions are required for it to begin to turn out automatically.

      Now think: will a person be able to live normally in a society who has been kicked "on reflex" while closing the distance? And after all, training must be carried out so that the blow follows, even if the fighter does not see the weapon, in the event of any aggression, or what he considers aggression. What if the knife is hidden behind the forearm? And if it's a switch-off? What if the enemy has a straight razor? You want to stay alive, which means you need to be prepared for the worst case anyway, even if you didn't notice the weapon.
      1. goose
        goose 24 March 2016 15: 30
        +1
        Quote: Riv
        In such a situation, a direct kick would be correct, stopping and knocking back the opponent.

        This is the wrong method. Not only are the techniques impracticable, they are still sensitive to distance, clothing, shoes, etc. And most importantly - slow. A person ready for an attack can easily avoid such a blow with even more unpleasant consequences for the defender, because he will be immobilized on one leg and not able to dodge a knife strike.
        And even if it succeeded? Which is more dangerous? get a cut of the leg, a knife under the rib or a sluggish repulsive kick in the stomach.
        As an option (a priori is not the best), it is more effective - padding the legs - and is faster by an order of magnitude, and is not visible, does not lose balance and can very likely disorient the attacker.
        1. Riv
          Riv 24 March 2016 16: 38
          0
          What ??? Slow? Go to any karate certification, admire the "slow" strikes. At one time, my wife tried to photograph Tobi Mae Geri on a digital camera at training, but she did not succeed. Jump - yes, landing later - yes, and the impact itself is a blur in the photo. But I am not a professional and this blow is the only thing that I did in the jump normally.

          By cutting, he was going to stop the knife ... Simpu Tokubetsu ... :)
  10. raid14
    raid14 24 March 2016 11: 17
    0
    The knife is a weapon and you need to treat it that way, the bulk of the killings in Russia falls on it.
    The main thing in cases of attack and street conflicts is to keep a distance without allowing the enemy to capture or strike. We saw the enemy did not need a knife to heroize, it is better to run away.
    1. otto meer
      otto meer 24 March 2016 12: 06
      +6
      Quote: raid14
      The knife is a weapon and you need to treat it that way, the bulk of the killings in Russia falls on it.
      In! The normal approach! Every fifth murder on household grounds is completely a kitchen knife. Let's ban the free circulation of kitchen knives! Permission, license - what a benefit to the state! Previously, even such a thing (a knife is a weapon!) Could never have occurred to anyone.
      1. raid14
        raid14 24 March 2016 12: 35
        0
        Someone talked about the prohibition of knives? This is your speculation, I repeat the knife in the "unkind" hands, a dangerous weapon that some people (now deceased) have seriously underestimated .. yut.
        1. Bashibuzuk
          Bashibuzuk 24 March 2016 14: 43
          +1
          A standard sheet of A4 paper has
          terrific cutting action.
          Ban Finnish paper products?
          And for the sharp movement of the secretaries, we will conduct a yoko-gir with finishing off the skull with the base ... by fax.
          Yes?
          1. Riv
            Riv 24 March 2016 16: 44
            0
            About that and speech. You can’t be ready for anything and no one is safe from inadequacy with a knife. If they want to kill you and you let the enemy get to the strike distance (option: the distance of dagger fire in the case of firearms), then you won’t go anywhere, you will have to die.
        2. Razvedka_Boem
          Razvedka_Boem 24 March 2016 17: 48
          0
          In skilled hands, anything can be a weapon, starting from a book and ending with ... well, let's say with bare hands)
        3. otto meer
          otto meer 25 March 2016 12: 02
          0
          Quote: raid14
          Someone talked about banning knives? These are your speculations
          Yeah, I agree, I thought a little. You did not say that. I acknowledge and promise to recover repeat It’s just painful already, the knife is a weapon, they can be killed, a hunting rifle is a weapon, they can be killed the same. Soon we will wait, the ax - a weapon, a car, a screwdriver, a leg from a stool - all weapons, prohibit everything, license, impose duties, taxes, levies. But how come we Russian Amno, alcoholics, drug addicts, degenerates will kill each other right there!
  11. teacher
    teacher 24 March 2016 11: 35
    +1
    Special Forces Officer
    what it is?
  12. Air defense Valga
    Air defense Valga 24 March 2016 11: 55
    +1
    Who cares about combat knives is the work of my close friend.
    Here is the link - http://rusknife.com/topic/8797-нр-11- father-soldier/
  13. Air defense Valga
    Air defense Valga 24 March 2016 11: 59
    0
    Fas.
    http://rusknife.com/topic/8797-нр-11-отец-солдата/
  14. nishestakovani
    nishestakovani 24 March 2016 12: 29
    -5
    Men! Then I decided to give moonshine still to their holiday, they write that this one is good http://germania1.ru, your opinion is interesting, what say? winked
  15. Olezhek
    Olezhek 24 March 2016 14: 22
    +1
    and only employees of such structures as the FSO, Alpha, Vityaz, Special Forces of the State Drug Control Committee can get to his training

    You have two knives, I have two knives. I have to control both your knives and mine. If I miss something, then for a lethal injection, enough effort in 4 kilograms.


    In short, this is all for the samurai: if two trained chelas, each with a pair of knives engage in decisive close combat - both of them are a fighter (most likely - the body works on reflexes even after a mortal wound)

    This knife was given to you.
    1. goose
      goose 24 March 2016 15: 34
      0
      Quote: Olezhek
      if two trained chelas, each with a pair of knives, engage in decisive close combat - both of them

      I do not agree. if the kabzdets are both not trained. Even a small advantage in the technique of knives, provided that both are ready, is almost irreplaceable, here accidents are almost excluded. First of all, due to the speed of execution. Beat a powerful armored turtle with a dangerous beak - what could be easier?
  16. Wolka
    Wolka 24 March 2016 14: 24
    +2
    the author of the rights, there really was no systematic approach to the study and mastering of NB techniques in the USSR, there were only some special developments, but narrow-profile ones, borrowed at one time, for example, from the Cossacks, SMERSH, even typical gopnik-criminals, which were not perfectly mastered by many of the specialists , but it is imperative to develop the topic and not only at the level of specialists, it is useful to master the basic level of protection at the general army level, and the same "construction battalion" will not be superfluous ...
    1. family tree
      family tree 24 March 2016 19: 06
      -1
      Quote: Volka
      there was really no systematic approach to the study and development of NB techniques in the USSR,

      But it’s not necessary. Put two or three hits. A knife, a weapon sudden and ambush, or as a last chance. A knife fight, with four knives, yeah, wood carving, a chance to meet, one in a billion, not because there are few of them, because hand-to-hand fighting, this is the last thing, this is when the cartridges ran out recourse by you.
      1. Olezhek
        Olezhek 24 March 2016 19: 46
        0
        Put two or three hits. A knife, a weapon sudden and ambush, or as a last chance.

        Absolutely! Weapons for emergency.


        A knife fight, with four knives,


        But the "individual" specialists must be sharpened precisely for a knife fight with two knives: for example, quickly and quietly to clear a small closed room: in a small space, nothing plays against an experienced "knife cutter".
  17. teacher
    teacher 24 March 2016 20: 10
    +1
    and there will be another "sharpened" specialist, only with two pistols. Or not, with two katanas, or alternatively a Jedi with two laser swords
    1. Olezhek
      Olezhek 24 March 2016 20: 18
      0
      there will be another "sharpened" specialist, with only two pistols. Or not, with two katanas


      1 Hardly there it will be

      2 In a closed / small room gun / katana WORSE knife.
  18. teacher
    teacher 24 March 2016 20: 21
    0
    then with a machine gun or atomic charge. Thank God no one takes seriously these two-legged clowns in the troops
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 24 March 2016 22: 57
      +1
      Quote: hoca
      Thank God no one takes seriously these two-legged clowns in the troops

      The troops do not take seriously the companies that run with their subordinates every morning to charge. The rest are limited to one Monday, and then not always.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Riv
        Riv 25 March 2016 14: 21
        0
        Company on charge ??? I smoked for a long time ... I thought ...
    2. Olezhek
      Olezhek 25 March 2016 10: 52
      0
      Thank God no one takes seriously these two-legged clowns in the troops


      Nobody needs this in the troops. For free. There are full-time weapons.

      This technique is very relevant for a few.
  19. Logos
    Logos 24 March 2016 21: 32
    +1
    [quote = Olezhek] [quote]
    2 In a closed / small room a gun / katana is WORSE than a knife. [/ Quote]
    This is if only a man with a knife makes a SURROUND attack on a man with a gun. If both are warned in equal conditions, then the man with the pistol will push the full clip into the hacksaw from the hip before he can do anything. The same is with katana - it also has a higher range and the samurai will cut the hacksaw before he approaches the distance of the knife. The fact that in different trainings the knifemen during a sudden attack cut the samurai or cowboys only indicates the advantage of the surprise attack as such, and not the advantage of the knife over the sword or firearm
    1. Olezhek
      Olezhek 25 March 2016 10: 39
      +1
      This is if only a man with a knife makes a SURROUND attack on a man with a gun.


      With special operations - this is normal

      If both are warned and in equal conditions,


      Type of competition in public?
      Where did you see "equal conditions" in real life?

      That
      the same with katana - she also has a higher range and the samurai will cut the knife before


      Take a katana - wave it in the apartment ...
      What is it like?
  20. teacher
    teacher 24 March 2016 23: 25
    0
    Quote: Spade
    Quote: hoca
    Thank God no one takes seriously these two-legged clowns in the troops

    The troops do not take seriously the companies that run with their subordinates every morning to charge. The rest are limited to one Monday, and then not always.

    because there are platoon commanders, logically commander of the district’s troops, so that he would be taken seriously, too, should he run the district’s head every morning?
    you better do this, poke with two knives, indoors
  21. The comment was deleted.
  22. saygon66
    saygon66 25 March 2016 01: 06
    0

    -Good stuff...
    - But! A lot of questions are raised right away: Who to train, and how then will they use this knowledge?
    - At one time, in TAVA (there was such an organization), on all those registered in the martial arts section, they got a personal card with personal data and a photograph ... And this is not a panacea ...
    - Well, again - you will need to raise the level of training of law enforcement officers ...
  23. The comment was deleted.
  24. Jamuqa
    Jamuqa 11 May 2016 14: 22
    0
    It’s interesting what Kochergin would say about this ...