Military Review

A piece of forests and marshes

41
A piece of forests and marshes



26 November 1939 of the year in 15 h. 45 min. Finnish artillery shelled the positions of the 68 Infantry Regiment in the area of ​​the village of Mainila. Four Soviet soldiers were killed. An 20 implicitly smoldering conflict between neighboring states has finally emerged. The war between the USSR and Finland became inevitable.

6 December 1917, the Finnish Seym, unilaterally declared its independence from Russia. December 31 of the same year V.I. Lenin signed a decree of the Council of People's Commissars on the recognition of Finnish independence, which was personally served on the Prime Minister of the newly formed state of Per, Evindou Svinhodududu. By order of the Council of People's Commissars, a commission was created to work out joint decisions on the settlement of property, civil and territorial issues in which it was supposed to include representatives of the Finnish side. However, the Soviet government could not assume that the country, which had just received sovereignty from their hands, was not going to sit down at the negotiating table, but would try by any means, including armed aggression, to profit from the former metropolis. The rulers of the newly baked state did not want to separate from Russia within the borders of the Grand Duchy of Finland. Taking advantage of the weakening of the central government in the country, almost the day after independence, the Finnish leadership decided to increase its territory at the expense of Ingermanlandia (present Leningrad Region), Karelia and the Kola Peninsula under the specious pretext of “gathering all Finnish peoples under one roof”.

By the beginning of 1918, the collapse of the Russian army, demoralized by previous events, reached its apogee. The 42 Russian Corps, stationed in Finland since 1915, was few in number, the soldiers did not want to serve, and in every way they tried to go home as quickly as possible. Separate subdivisions, loyal to military duty, by all means tried to save military depots, objects and state property of the former Russian empire, as well as protect the property and lives of numerous Russian people subjected to brutal persecution in the light of the growing anti-Russian hysteria.

10 January 1918 in Finland first clashes between armed detachments of workers and workers (security units, originally intended to maintain public order in the absence of the police), which subsequently led to the beginning of a full-scale civil war in the country. The commander of the sützkor squad, from 12 in January 1918, recognized by the Finnish Seym as "government troops", was received by the former general of the Russian Imperial Army, Karl Gustav Mannerheim.


Per Evind Swinhovud, Regent of the Kingdom of Finland, Prime Minister


At the end of January, 1918, in Helsingfors (Helsinki), the Red Guard detachments in response to the active terrorist actions of the white Finns seized the central institutions, as well as the Sejm building. The bourgeois government of Svinhouvud fled to Nikolastadt (Vasa). As a result of the successful actions of the Red Guard units under the authority of the Council of People's Commissioners (SNU) created by 28 in January 1918, the entire south of the country turned out to be. The north and the central part remained under the rule of the white Finns.

Thus, in Finland, two states were formed: a republic led by the SNU and a formally proclaimed monarchy under the direction of regent Svinhovud, who led the German prince Friedrich Karl of Hesse on behalf of the guest to the throne of Finland.

1 March 1918 in Smolny Lenin and Vice-Premier of the Finnish Socialist Worker Republic Edward Polling signed the “Treaty on the Strengthening of Friendship and Fraternity between the RSFSR and the FSRR”. Of course, the Soviet government was sympathetic to the red Finns, but for objective reasons, it could not really help them. With an acute shortage of weapons to the newly formed Red Army, the CPC could still distinguish the Finnish Red Guard detachments 10 thousand rifles, 35 guns and 10 three-inch guns, and to send a volunteer detachment in the number 1450 people to participate in the defense of the village Rautu (now Pine) an important strategic point. Other councils bound hand and foot by the conditions of the “prepohabious” Brest world, the Soviets could not render red to the Finns. With about 100 of thousands of people in its structure, the armed forces of the FSRD could independently do away with their adversary, but a third party intervened. Frightened by the popular movement, the government of Svinhuvuda-Mannerheim turned to Kaiser Germany for help. Sending his representative, Senator E. Elta, to Berlin, Svinhuvud almost begged him: “Arrange for the Germans to come here. Otherwise we will not cope. " March 7 The German-Finnish contract for the introduction of troops was signed, but even before it was signed, the 27 th Jäger battalion, battling Russian troops near Riga, was transferred from Germany through Sweden to the Vasa city area. This battalion was the frame of the emerging Belofin army. In April, the German Expeditionary Force, commanded by Lieutenant-General Rüdiger von der Goltz, landed in Finland 1918 in Finland, and from May of that year became the de facto commander-in-chief of all the armed forces of the country. This was the beginning of the end of the FSRR: the semi-guerrilla Red Guard units could not fight on equal terms against the German regular troops.



Finnish Red Guards at Terijoki Station


On the night of April 14, 1918, under the joint attack of the German paratroopers and the White Finns, fell Helsingfors. By the end of April, the combined forces of the Germans and the white Finns managed to surround the red Finns and force them to surrender. The Finnish Civil War ended in a victory for the reaction. Soon after the capture of Helsingfors, Abo and other cities, the latter-day winners began mass repressions against their political opponents and the Russian population. Russian warships were taken under armed guard by German troops, and commercial ships belonging to Russian merchants and businessmen were captured and looted. Groundless arrests of Russian sailors and officers began, Russian citizens were forced to leave Finland as soon as possible, not only by the arbitrariness of the authorities, but also by public harassment, insults, and complete lack of rights. In particular, the day after the capture of Helsingfors, 15 on April 1918, the city was posted announcements of the White command of the proposed urgent forcible eviction of all Russian subjects. The winners did not stop in front of outright terror, for example in Vyborg they shot several dozen Russian officers and students of local gymnasiums who had nothing to do with the armed confrontation between the Red and White Finns.

At the height of the raging Civil War, March 7, the head of the Finnish government regent Svinhovud put forward an official statement that the Finnish government was ready to make peace with Soviet Russia (by the way, no one had declared war on the RSFSR on their part), that is, Karelia, a part of the Murmansk railway and the Kola Peninsula should have moved to Finland. However, the aggressive appetites of the Finnish elite were not supported even by their ally. 8 in March, Kaiser Wilhelm II officially announced that Germany would not wage war with the Soviets for Finnish interests and would not support them if hostilities were moved beyond the territory of the former Grand Duchy. However, despite the negative reaction of the German leadership, 15 in March, Mannerheim approves of the “Wallenius Plan”, suggesting the seizure of a part of the territory of the former Russian Empire along the Petsamo (Pechenga) –Kola Peninsula – White Sea – Onega Lake –Svir – Lake Ladoga line. Mannerheim also put forward the idea of ​​seizing Petrograd and turning it into a “free city” of the Danzig type, but the Germans strongly opposed this. Only thanks to the strongest pressure of the German side, which reasonably believed that the seizure of the former capital of the empire would lead to unpredictable consequences, the “march on Petrograd” was canceled. Nevertheless, the expansionist policy of the Finnish authorities regarding the border lands of Russia continued. On the borders with Soviet Russia concentrated 50-thousandth army, well armed and well trained. “To implement the plan of attack on Russia, all men are called up from 18 to 40 years. They are trained by so-called huntsmen in the number of 5000 people who arrived from Germany. The campaign to Russia will be carried out without declaring war by individual detachments in 3-5 thousand people together with German and Swedish volunteers, ”the report of the Chief of the Naval General Staff of Soviet Russia dated 22 on April 1918 said about this. On March 18, a puppet "Provisional Committee for Eastern Karelia" was created in the village of Ukhta, occupied by Finnish troops, which decided on the accession of Karelia to Finland.


Solemn meeting of German troops in Helsinki, 1918 year


The landing of the German troops in Finland and its appearance on the German side caused serious concern among the Entente countries. At the request of the Soviet government, British troops were brought into Murmansk to protect the military assets that had accumulated there and to protect the Murmansk railway.

In April, 1918, the Finnish military stepped up its actions. A large detachment of White Finns launched an attack on the Pechenga. The British reacted promptly. Admiral Kemp sent the cruiser Cochrane with a detachment of Red Guards from Murmansk to Pechenga, which was based on the sailors of the Russian cruiser Askold. Together with a small division of the British, they managed to repel two assaults undertaken by the Finns 11 and 12 in May 1918. Red Guard and Allied detachments were also sent to other menacing sites, in particular, a detachment of 150 English marines arrived in Kandalaksha.

In central Karelia, in early April, the Finns launched an offensive against Kem. The military council of the city declared the county under siege, mobilizing the male population from 18 to 42 years into the militia. Part of the defenders of the city joined the part of the Red Finns and groups of railway workers armed with revolvers and hunting rifles. The icebreaker Mikula Selyaninovich, urgently sent by the Russian authorities, managed to break through the ice and bring the long-awaited weapon, ammunition and reinforcements. After several days of fierce fighting, the aggressors, led into battle by the German colonel Malmö, were defeated and driven back to the west. The losses of the Finns, according to domestic sources, only killed more than 100 people.

The Soviet government continued to take decisive measures to counteract the penetration of Finnish armed units into the territory of the RSFSR. By an order of April 18, 1918, the Military Council of the Petrograd District, the head of the "Northern Section of the Veil" was ordered to strengthen the border sections of the territory, and was tasked with forming a border division from the local population loyal to Soviet power. Baltic warships were sent to Lake Onega and Ladoga fleet, including several submarines, was intensively used for patrolling aviation. Regular units of the Red Army were transferred from the central regions of Russia to Karelia. These actions, as well as the increasing pressure of the Entente countries on Finland, de jure being an ally of Germany, slightly cooled the heads of hot Finnish guys. By the summer of 1918, active hostilities were stopped in Karelia. In June-July, preliminary negotiations between the RSFSR and Finland on a ceasefire and demarcation of the border began. The Finns made a proposal to transfer the borders on the Karelian Isthmus farther from Petrograd, in return demanding territories in East Karelia, including the city of Olonets. Ironically, this draft agreement was a copy of what Stalin would offer the Finns in 1939.


Council of People's Commissars of the RSFSR, 1918 year


From 3 to 27 in August, official negotiations began between the Kingdom of Finland in Berlin, and Suomi’s country became 18 in August 1918, and the delegation of Soviet Russia. The Soviet delegation was headed by Vaclav Vorovski, the Finnish delegation was headed by Foreign Minister Karl Enkel. The negotiations did not yield positive results mainly because of the tough position of the Germans, who ultimately demanded that the Finns moderate their appetites, stop the armed attacks on the neighboring side, and also gave Russia firm guarantees of its territorial integrity. Despite the formal cessation of hostilities, a company of Finns under the command of Ensign Walte Sario 15 on October 1918 of the year occupied the Rebol volost in Eastern Karelia. The war began to flare up again.

To be continued ...
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  1. aszzz888
    aszzz888 19 March 2016 06: 47
    +7
    Thank you for the article. The photo shows an interesting sign, or rather an inscription. What did its authors (author) mean in the meaning of the word "Honest Warrior"? +
  2. semirek
    semirek 19 March 2016 07: 00
    +9
    Thanks to the author for the excellent situation in the relations between Red Russia and white Finland, which removes, I personally have some questions. We look forward to continuing.
    1. AUL
      AUL 19 March 2016 11: 32
      +6
      The landing of the German troops in Finland and its appearance on the German side caused serious concern among the Entente countries. At the request of the Soviet government, British troops were brought into Murmansk to protect the military assets that had accumulated there and to protect the Murmansk railway.

      In April, 1918, the Finnish military stepped up its actions. A large detachment of White Finns launched an attack on the Pechenga. The British reacted promptly. Admiral Kemp sent the cruiser Cochrane with a detachment of Red Guards from Murmansk to Pechenga, which was based on the sailors of the Russian cruiser Askold. Together with a small division of the British, they managed to repel two assaults undertaken by the Finns 11 and 12 in May 1918. Red Guard and Allied detachments were also sent to other menacing sites, in particular, a detachment of 150 English marines arrived in Kandalaksha.

      This moment - the interaction of the Red Army and Entente troops - came as a surprise to me. Especially that the British troops were brought into Murmansk at the request of the Soviet government!
      1. Rivares
        Rivares 19 March 2016 19: 20
        +1
        Quote: AUL
        Especially that the British troops were brought into Murmansk at the request of the Soviet government!

        And I used to think that it was an intervention .. however!
        1. PHANTOM-AS
          PHANTOM-AS 19 March 2016 19: 43
          0
          Quote: Rivares
          Quote: AUL
          Especially that the British troops were brought into Murmansk at the request of the Soviet government!
          And I used to think that it was an intervention .. however!

          interesting little treat!
          I wonder what sources the author used?
          In fact, the Brest Peace Treaty, the Brest-Litovsk (Brest) Peace Treaty is a separate peace treaty, signed March 3, 1918 in Brest-Litovsk, representatives of Soviet Russia on the one hand and the Central Powers (Germany, Austria-Hungary, the Ottoman Empire and the Bulgarian kingdom) on the other, the RSFSR were withdrawn from the war!
          The British were afraid that Russia would give Murmansk military property to the Germans under this agreement.
          This is the same wording, but it is closer to the truth than the author's "poem"
          1. Pomeranian
            20 March 2016 11: 02
            +1
            Quote: PHANTOM-AS
            This is the same wording, but it is closer to the truth than the author's "poem"

            Actually, at that time there was an open mess in the country and property located in Murmansk de jure belonged to a non-existent state, and de facto to no one. Regarding the sources, if my memory serves me right, Alexander Shirokorad wrote about this.
          2. def89
            def89 20 March 2016 11: 15
            +1
            March 2, 1918 at a meeting attended by: deputy. Chairman of the Murmansk Council of Workers' Deputies Yuryev, British Admiral Kemp, English Consul Hall, Captain Sherpentier, manager of the Murmansk Council Veselago, an agreement was adopted "Verbal agreement on joint actions of the British, French and Russians in the defense of the Murmansk region."
      2. Pomeranian
        20 March 2016 10: 58
        0
        Quote: AUL
        Especially that the British troops were brought into Murmansk at the request of the Soviet government!

        Yes, it was. The fact is that in Romanov-on-Murman accumulated a lot of military equipment received by Russia from the countries of the Entente. The railway was not yet functioning at full capacity, and they simply did not have time to take property to central Russia. And since de jure Finland took the side of the Triple Alliance, the Bolsheviks called on the only serious force that could resist them: the former tsarist allies.
  3. parusnik
    parusnik 19 March 2016 08: 23
    +11
    In April 1918, a German expeditionary force landed in Finland... On the German bayonets "democracy" "shone" in Finland, on their own in Georgia, Ukraine .. They only prefer not to remember this .. like everything yourself ... Thank you, good material ..
  4. Ramzes33
    Ramzes33 19 March 2016 08: 49
    +5
    To the author for the article plus.
  5. Makarych
    Makarych 19 March 2016 09: 13
    +8
    Quote: aszzz888
    Thank you for the article. The photo shows an interesting sign, or rather an inscription. What did its authors (author) mean in the meaning of the word "Honest Warrior"? +

    The badge “To the Honest Warrior of the Karelian Front” is a badge established by the RVSR order No. 570 of March 5, 1922 in memory of the liberation of Soviet Karelia from the White Finnish gangs (September 1921 - February 1922) [1]. The honorary award of the Red Army, was awarded for the courage and heroism shown during the 2nd Soviet-Finnish War on the Karelian Front.

    The order stated that:

    “The right to wear a token is assigned to all Red Army men and military personnel who took part in the elimination of the invasion of White-Finnish gangs into the territory of Karelia” [2].

    This is the first Soviet award memorial sign. The certificates were not attached to it, however, information about the right to wear a commemorative badge was recorded in the Red Army books and in the commander's track records.

    The sign is a wreath of laurel and oak leaves with a red five-pointed star with a picture of a plow and a hammer. A curly shield is inscribed on the wreath with the inscription "Honest warrior of the Karelian front." The 56x37 mm sign was made of copper and tin. Separate custom-made items were made of silver. (Wikipedia https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_to the Honest_Karelian_front_ warrior ")
  6. iury.vorgul
    iury.vorgul 19 March 2016 10: 01
    +5
    In April 1918, a German expeditionary corps landed in Finland ... On German bayonets "democracy" "shone" in Finland, on their own in Georgia, Ukraine ... Only they prefer not to remember this ... like everything yourself ...
    And this is real democracy in action. You can rob a weak neighbor - you are a "democrat". And if the neighbor turned out to be stronger and did not allow himself to be robbed, then he is an imperialist and a totalitarian.
  7. V.ic
    V.ic 19 March 2016 10: 04
    +5
    So that's it. The wicked tsarism of the poor Chukhonts cherished and cherished, but not for the horse. Instead of peacefully leaving and giving up the RUSSIAN territory, together with the city of Vyborg, they began to simply slaughter the Russians. How do the Finns differ from the Central Asians of the 90s? The fact that, unlike the "Czechs", they did not fight with Russia after secession?
  8. Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 19 March 2016 10: 43
    +3
    Thanks so much for the article. Born and live in St. Petersburg.
    I always read articles on this topic with interest. He has been to Finland several times. Naturally, in this century.
  9. Francois de Vivre
    Francois de Vivre 19 March 2016 11: 24
    -4
    seizure of the building of the Diet and, presumably, the telegraph office, post office, etc. a good response to "terrorist" actions. wouldn’t have to hit the shutskor's detachments .. it’s banal that the "taarischi balsheviks" wanted to seize power.
    1. Pomeranian
      20 March 2016 12: 20
      +1
      Quote: François de Vivre
      a good response to "terrorist" actions. wouldn’t hit the shutskor's detachments ..

      Apparently, you are an inveterate bourgeoisophile. wink
      Well, here's an example. 1944, Warsaw Uprising. Instead of seizing the "post, telegraph and telephone", including the bridgeheads across the Vistula, the AK troops grappled with the "Shchutskor troops" in a battle for destruction. Is it worth reminding how it ended?
  10. nekromonger
    nekromonger 19 March 2016 12: 06
    +3
    the situation is similar to Ukraine - they are not the same as horseradish passed the territory of our territory. It is not bad that she returned and preferably without war.
  11. Cap.Morgan
    Cap.Morgan 19 March 2016 14: 17
    -11%
    How interesting.
    In the 18th year, the Finnish socialist government was quickly knocked together.
    And at 39, too! Soviet troops stormed the forts of the Mannerheim Line in full force, but Molotov argued that there was no war, because the USSR has excellent relations with the "government" of Kuusinen.
    The same handwriting, the same masters of political intrigue and export of revolutions.

    Only the Finns did not want universal proletarian happiness, common sense won, and therefore live happily ever after. Unlike us. I want to ask the builders of communism - where is your communism? What did you build for 70 years, which led to empty shelves and kilometer-long queues? You and the Finns wanted to bring such a bright future. Fortunately, there are no fools there.
    1. Pomeranian
      20 March 2016 12: 30
      +2
      Quote: Cap.Morgan
      but Molotov argued that there is no war, because the USSR has excellent relations with the "government" of Kuusinen.

      Well, of course, it is possible for noble and civilized Finns to attack the USSR three times without declaring war, and Russian savages are not even allowed.
      Kuusinen’s government was necessary to put pressure on the Finnish side, if you don’t get too far — get Kuusinen and the FDR army near Helsinki, the leadership of the USSR did not take the Teriyok government seriously. And the idea with the FDR government did not come from Stalin and Molotov, but from Mehlis and Zhdanov, who had no real influence on the course of events.
      1. Alexey T. (Oper)
        Alexey T. (Oper) 20 March 2016 19: 20
        0
        Quote: Pomoryanin
        Well, of course, it is possible for noble and civilized Finns to attack the USSR three times without declaring war, and Russian savages are not even allowed.
        And not just attack. Shooting from the bushes at the Russian border guards since pre-revolutionary times has been the national amusement of the forest Chukhon savages.

        ... Sentries were repeatedly fired upon by the Finns from the opposite bank of the river. Sisters. The alarms made by the sentries and the arrival of the platoon on duty immediately stopped the shelling, but two or three days later the same thing was repeated again, and V.V. Volsky decided to stop this hunt for the Finns on our sentries. The opportunity was not slow to introduce itself soon. Sometime in the evening, at the end of January, shots suddenly rang out, approximately at checkpoint No. 3 or No. 4. Quickly, on alarm, a platoon on duty jumped out, under the command of a quick jerk. ounce of. 6th company Butenko. We, officers, also hurried to the shots. It turned out that the shots were at the sentry post No. 4, the hunter of the 5th company V. Denisov, and we found on one of the trees fresh traces of bullets from a small-caliber rifle, such as the Winchester carbine. Denisov fired several retaliatory shots, but of course he could not see who was firing at him in the deep forest.

        Due to the fact that the shooting was constantly at this site and it was clear that the Finns were shooting at the village of Tammelselke, which was located a mile away from these posts, VV decided to give them a good lesson. At his order, I platoon crossed the border, passing the Sestra River through deep snow, got out to the edge of the forest and fired volleys at the village. Immediately all the lights went out in the huts, the dogs howled in fright, screams rang out. Having made five volleys in different areas of the village, firing all 90 live ammunition, we returned.

        The threat worked, and since then, for the entire time we were at the border, the sentries no longer fired.


        D. Khodnev. On the Finnish border. 1907 / 8 - 1937 / 8, http://ristikivi.spb.ru/docs/border-1908-finl.html

        The history of Russian-Soviet-Finnish relations can be understood only with an adequate assessment of the Finnish mentality of those years. The Finns of the first half of the last century differed little from the Chechens of the end of the last century. Only this "Chechnya" was just a stone's throw from St. Petersburg-Leningrad.
  12. Vadim42
    Vadim42 19 March 2016 14: 27
    +1
    -1 probably put the fin.
  13. Rivares
    Rivares 19 March 2016 19: 21
    +2
    It turns out that the Finns, too, of the Civil War drank with the collapse of the Russian Empire.
  14. Francois de Vivre
    Francois de Vivre 19 March 2016 19: 21
    -6
    the science of Marxism-Leninism can be regarded as a kind of fairy tale or fantasy - in theory it is consistent, logical, and the result is remarkable. but nothing can be done about implementation - stupidity, dullness, primitivism. fairy tales are better left to children and harmless eccentrics.
    1. Rivares
      Rivares 20 March 2016 02: 07
      0
      Quote: François de Vivre
      the science of Marxism-Leninism can be seen as a kind of fairy tale or fantasy

      Unfortunately or fortunately, you can't. What a fairy tale, what a fantasy is understandable to a common Russian person. And who will read the volumes of Marxism-Leninism? And who of those who read will understand? And as the well-known expert on Marxism Volodya-Lenin wrote: in order to understand Marxism, you need to understand Hegel's dialectics. It turns out in fact that 99.99% will not understand this Talmud. And if people do not understand the teaching by 99.9%, then what happens? And it turns out that people will not accept. In fact, it happened. An ideology that has existed for only 70 years in the historical period is not worthy of attention as a viable one. Although in fact, the "bloodthirstiness" with which it was implanted, it stands next to Christianity in Russia.
      PS cons are not mine.
  15. Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 20 March 2016 19: 01
    0
    Watching the life of the Finns now, I saw their respect for any work --- worker, teacher, seller, etc. Whatever a person does for society --- he deserves respect.
    They are very, scrupulously law-abiding, children can live separately from their parents in social, municipal housing, they are given a allowance for this.
    Full social security, benefits and various benefits. The right to free higher education, up to 30 years old, can be applied at least 10 times. In general, somehow I did not think about their social topics, I wrote not everything. Does it somehow look like socialism?
    Their medicine is insurance and much worse than ours (this is my personal opinion). Many of them come to us for a fee.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 20 March 2016 19: 25
      0
      Quote: Cap.Morgan
      How interesting.
      Only the Finns did not want universal proletarian happiness, common sense won, and therefore live happily ever after. Unlike us. I want to ask the builders of communism - where is your communism? What did you build for 70 years, which led to empty shelves and kilometer-long queues? You and the Finns wanted to bring such a bright future. Fortunately, there are no fools there.

      It was necessary first to quote, and then write what he saw.
      Well, what else? DO NOT STEAL in everyday life. If you forget something ---- everything will wait for your return. Why not socialist consciousness? If I remember --- I’ll write.
      As before, I cannot shake off the thought that the Finns "copied" a lot from the principles of socialism. They have worked on it for themselves.
      1. Alexey T. (Oper)
        Alexey T. (Oper) 20 March 2016 19: 48
        0
        Quote: Reptiloid
        It was necessary first to quote, and then write what he saw.
        Well, what else? DO NOT STEAL in everyday life. If you forget something ---- everything will wait for your return. Why not socialist consciousness? If I remember --- I’ll write.
        As before, I cannot shake off the thought that the Finns "copied" a lot from the principles of socialism. They have worked on it for themselves.

        When you finish painting which Chukhons are white and fluffy, remember how they behave here in St. Petersburg or Vyborg. I am sure, after these recollections, the raid of European civilization will instantly disappear from them.

        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 21 March 2016 06: 33
          0
          I write that I saw. How do Finns behave in St. Petersburg? Yes, just like everyone who drinks to death.
          The stores do not steal.
          ABOUT the separate lives of children, of course about youth, in my opinion from the age of 18. At the same time, they are employed.
          Although now the youth does not want to work, many of them, because allowance like 500 €.
          And if you sign up to the doctor and be late or not come --- then they will be fined. They are afraid of this.
  16. Mikado
    Mikado 21 March 2016 01: 50
    +2
    Plus to the author and thanks for the article, we are waiting for the continuation good
  17. nivander
    nivander 21 March 2016 10: 39
    +1
    saw an interview in 1939, which was given by two Finnish border guards to the French agency "GAVAS" regarding the incident in Mainel. Pure Finns boldly answered any questions - about the flight trajectory, the type of ammunition, the type of weapon, they even drew (without trembling hand) graphics - all clearly minute by minute. I'm not Stanislavsky, but even I said "I DO NOT BELIEVE" !!!
    1. Pomeranian
      21 March 2016 10: 47
      +2
      Quote: nivasander
      I'm not Stanislavsky, but even I said "I DO NOT BELIEVE" !!!

      You see, under the USSR, no one had doubts about the Finnish shelling of our border guards. Now, liberal historians are so imposingly teaching us: they say, the Finns did not have artillery guns in this area and they could not fire at all, therefore, the "mining incident" was the work of the "bloody NKVD" and so on. Liber nobles, apparently, do not know that the burst of an 81 mm mine in the snow is difficult to distinguish from the burst of a 76 mm projectile. And the Finns had 4 mortars per regiment.
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 21 March 2016 11: 54
        0
        But let these libervelians walk along our forests, but across the Finnish ones. Yes, they compared. Earth itself testifies to how everything was.
      2. Alexey T. (Oper)
        Alexey T. (Oper) 21 March 2016 18: 41
        +1
        Quote: Pomoryanin
        Now, liberal historians are so imposingly teaching us: they say, the Finns did not have artillery guns in this area and they could not fire at all, therefore, the "mining incident" was the work of the "bloody NKVD" and so on. Liber nobles, apparently, do not know that the burst of an 81 mm mine in the snow is difficult to distinguish from the burst of a 76 mm projectile. And the Finns had 4 mortars per regiment.

        The distance that the projectile flew into the USSR is approximately 2-2,5 km from the state border line - just the range of the mortar.

        Therefore, liberalism urgently gave birth to a new version of the Mayil incident: there was supposedly a very secret NKVD unit that penetrated the territory of Chukhni with a mortar and fired from there.
        1. Pomeranian
          21 March 2016 22: 37
          0
          Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
          Therefore, liberalism urgently gave birth to a new version of the Mayil incident: there was supposedly a very secret NKVD unit that penetrated the territory of Chukhni with a mortar and fired from there.

          You correctly noted. The funniest thing is that liberal historians do not even consider the version with a mortar (which is easy to drag away in the snow and forest anywhere in a disassembled state). Mannerheim wrote in his memoirs that there was no shelling from the Finnish side. How then, the general of the tsarist army, the nobleman will begin to lie? In the liberal brain, these things cause congruent dissonance.
    2. Alexey T. (Oper)
      Alexey T. (Oper) 21 March 2016 18: 38
      +1
      Quote: nivasander
      saw an interview in 1939, which was given by two Finnish border guards to the French agency "GAVAS" regarding the incident in Mainel. Pure Finns boldly answered any questions - about the flight trajectory, the type of ammunition, the type of weapon, they even drew (without trembling hand) graphics - all clearly minute by minute. I'm not Stanislavsky, but even I said "I DO NOT BELIEVE" !!!

      At the same time, Finnish witnesses interviewed during the investigation conducted by the Finnish border guard showed that they first heard the sound of a shot and only then the sound of an ammunition rupture.
      And this can only mean one thing - the witness was closer to the place of the shot than to the place where the projectile fell, i.e. fired from the Finnish side.
  18. Torins
    Torins 21 March 2016 20: 03
    0
    Quote: V.ic
    So that's it. The wicked tsarism of the poor Chukhonts cherished and cherished, but not for the horse. Instead of peacefully leaving and giving up the RUSSIAN territory, together with the city of Vyborg, they began to simply slaughter the Russians. How do the Finns differ from the Central Asians of the 90s? The fact that, unlike the "Czechs", they did not fight with Russia after secession?

    And why should they give the city of Vyborg? He was never Russian, he became them only on the basis of the 2-th World hi
    1. Alexey T. (Oper)
      Alexey T. (Oper) 21 March 2016 20: 10
      +1
      Quote: Torins
      And why should they give the city of Vyborg? He was never Russian
      Vyborg became Russian in the 1710 year. In 1719, it was the center of the Vyborg province of St. Petersburg province. In the 1744 year, the Vyborg province was formed. And only in the 1811 year Vyborg and its environs entered the Grand Duchy of Finland
    2. Pomeranian
      21 March 2016 22: 44
      0
      Quote: Torins
      And why should they give the city of Vyborg? He was never Russian, he became them only on the basis of the 2-th World

      Vyborg and Keksholm provinces were Russian. It was Alexander who gave them to the Finns. Yes, and the Korelian land was given to Yaroslav the Wise as a dowry to his wife Igegerda in 1019. So this land is Russian, and "our city". Or do you, God forbid, think that since Yaroslav ruled in Kiev, therefore Vyborg should raise the "zhovto-blakitny ensign" over the main tower ???
  19. Torins
    Torins 21 March 2016 20: 13
    +1
    Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
    Quote: Torins
    And why should they give the city of Vyborg? He was never Russian
    Vyborg became Russian in the 1710 year. In 1719, it was the center of the Vyborg province of St. Petersburg province. In the 1744 year, the Vyborg province was formed. And only in the 1811 year Vyborg and its environs entered the Grand Duchy of Finland

    As far as I know the city is more than 700 years old, of which less than two hundred belonged to Russia, including modernity. :)
    And the Swedes founded it in general on the site of the trade settlement of the Karelians.
    P.S. if you follow your logic, then Smolensk is a primordially Belarusian city and the Russian Federation should return it to us. After all, Vitovt once captured him :)
    1. Alexey T. (Oper)
      Alexey T. (Oper) 21 March 2016 20: 35
      +1
      Quote: Torins
      As far as I know the city is more than 700 years old, of which it belonged to Russia less than two hundred,

      You wrote that Vyborg was NEVER Russian. I brought you evidence that he WAS a Russian for 100 years, and for 100 years he was part of the Russian Empire, being presented to the Finns.

      Quote: Torins
      Smolensk is a native Belarusian city
      What kind of fright did he suddenly become an original Belarusian? Smolensk was based on the lands of Krivichy - i.e. Union of East Slavic tribes, which formed in the upper reaches of the Western Dvina, Dnieper and Volga and became part of Kievan Rus.

      Someone who, and Belarusians to him at all no side. As for Vytautas, he once conquered Smolensk, it is. Well, we won it back.
  20. Torins
    Torins 21 March 2016 21: 01
    -1
    Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
    Quote: Torins
    As far as I know the city is more than 700 years old, of which it belonged to Russia less than two hundred,

    You wrote that Vyborg was NEVER Russian. I brought you evidence that he WAS a Russian for 100 years, and for 100 years he was part of the Russian Empire, being presented to the Finns.

    Quote: Torins
    Smolensk is a native Belarusian city
    What kind of fright did he suddenly become an original Belarusian? Smolensk was based on the lands of Krivichy - i.e. Union of East Slavic tribes, which formed in the upper reaches of the Western Dvina, Dnieper and Volga and became part of Kievan Rus.

    Someone who, and Belarusians to him at all no side. As for Vytautas, he once conquered Smolensk, it is. Well, we won it back.

    So I do not pretend that Smolensk is a Belorussian city, just based on your logic about Vyborg it turns out that way)) Krivichis and Belarusians lived on the territory of Belarus, like Drigavichs) But I'm not talking about that. Initially, the conversation was that one comrade expressed the opinion that the Finns should immediately give up the RUSSIAN TERRITORY together with the city of Vyborg and all surrounding territories and not soar anyone’s brain)) I said that at that time Vyborg was considered to be a Russian city could not)
    1. Alexey T. (Oper)
      Alexey T. (Oper) 21 March 2016 21: 11
      -1
      Quote: Torins
      So I don’t pretend that Smolensk is a Belarusian city,
      And how then to regard these words?

      Quote: Torins
      Smolensk is a native Belarusian city
      ??


      Quote: Torins
      just based on your logic about Vyborg it turns out that way
      No need to pull an owl on a globe trying to attribute to me what I never said. It is impossible to draw a similar conclusion from my words.


      Quote: Torins
      Krivichi and in Belarus lived, like Drigavichs
      You are mistaken. in Belarus they did not live. For one simple reason - Belarus wasn’t even in the project then. They lived on the Western Dvina River. Do you catch the difference?
      Quote: Torins
      I said that at that time Vyborg could not be considered a Russian city)

      You said something completely different, namely the following:
      Quote: Torins
      And why should they give the city of Vyborg? He is never been Russian

      Therefore, they quite rightly explained to you that such a statement is incorrect.
  21. Torins
    Torins 21 March 2016 23: 11
    0
    Quote: Alexey T. (Opera)
    Quote: Torins
    So I don’t pretend that Smolensk is a Belarusian city,
    And how then to regard these words?

    Quote: Torins
    Smolensk is a native Belarusian city
    ??


    Quote: Torins
    just based on your logic about Vyborg it turns out that way
    No need to pull an owl on a globe trying to attribute to me what I never said. It is impossible to draw a similar conclusion from my words.


    Quote: Torins
    Krivichi and in Belarus lived, like Drigavichs
    You are mistaken. in Belarus they did not live. For one simple reason - Belarus wasn’t even in the project then. They lived on the Western Dvina River. Do you catch the difference?
    Quote: Torins
    I said that at that time Vyborg could not be considered a Russian city)

    You said something completely different, namely the following:
    Quote: Torins
    And why should they give the city of Vyborg? He is never been Russian

    Therefore, they quite rightly explained to you that such a statement is incorrect.

    Yes, I’m not talking about your words, you got involved in my discussion with another person, while pulling the words out of context, fu, it’s not beautiful, I thought so only ideologists from the United States do it))))
    And as for the Krivichs, the Western Dvina flows right through the territory of modern Belarus, so study geography, history, and methods of discussion hi