Black International
“It is necessary to support the struggle of moderate Islam against extremist movements”
The Taliban, Al-Qaida, IG were supported and strengthened by the United States and Great Britain in their geopolitical interests. While such organizations are being used by one or another state for their own purposes, terror cannot be defeated, a world-class political scientist and former head of the Israeli special service Naativ Yakov Kedmi is convinced.
- Jacob Iosifovich, let me start with the question: what caused the current outbreak of international terrorism?
- It happened not recently, but much earlier. The twentieth century was full of terror. Usually, it is gaining strength where, on the one hand, there are some conflicts, and on the other, power and society weaken, the state goes out of stability. But if in the past, terror was used on a national basis (for example, Irish) or in ideological confrontation (as a means of achieving political goals of various kinds of ultra-left, Trotskyist groups that walked around Europe), now the main type we face is religious. Extremist Islamic movements are trying to achieve their goals in this way. The heyday of terror in the last 25 years is the result of the destabilization of the situation in Africa and Asia, especially in the Middle East. The emergence of international terrorism as a phenomenon began during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. The power in this country was precarious, but not the fault of the USSR. Taking advantage of the war in Afghanistan, smart people in the West decided to support terrorist organizations - religious, Islamic - as one of the tools in the fight against the Soviet Armed Forces. Thus, they provided the basis for creating a rather effective terrorist structure.
- You mean al-Qaeda?
- Yes, but in a slightly different way. Prior to this, Pakistan (more precisely, its military intelligence) created a terrorist organization with the aim of destabilizing the situation in Indian Kashmir, a disputed area fraught with religious conflict with the Muslim population. And already at its base, the United States, together with the British, organized their own similar structure to fight against the Soviet army in neighboring Afghanistan. That is, the first serious terrorist organization was created by the United States and Great Britain. This is the first sin. She began to use in Afghanistan against the Soviet army, because the conditions are suitable.
From the very beginning, the organization was notable for serious Muslim indoctrination, but no one paid any attention to this. They even considered it positive that the terrorists were operating under the slogan of fighting the infidels. That is, the struggle against the USSR was explained to the representatives of the Muslim movement throughout the world as resistance to the wrong. Everything else — neither the Afghan people, nor its present and future — interested anyone. And it was the second crime against the world community and to the Muslims themselves.
Therefore, people with extremist religious ideology have reached out for the Taliban. Gradually, the movement began to take more and more aggressive, fundamentalist forms. It was a combat organization. Joining Bin Laden and other people with significant capital, support for Saudi Arabia (she sponsored almost all Muslim movements and groups that fought against the Soviet army) created a serious base. When the Afghan problem was actually solved, of those who fought on the side of the Taliban, a new extremist terrorist organization Al Qaeda was created by Bin Laden. She enjoyed the support of the West, primarily the United States and Great Britain, who not only gave weapon, but also trained militants. Especially in this business the British have succeeded.
Then the organization took part in two conflicts. The first is Balkan, where it fought on the side of the Bosnians, which was welcomed positively, because the United States, Great Britain and the whole West sought to dismember Yugoslavia, wanting to cause as much damage as possible to the Serbs, who were considered the main supporters of the Soviet Union. After the fall of the USSR, New Russia did not pursue any international policy, slowly degrading. However, everything that happened in the Balkans, as before, happened with a clear anti-Russian emphasis.
In the West, they looked quite favorably on the independent participation of Al-Qaida in the Chechen war, helping with the supply of militants and money. Then for the first time, camps for training international terrorists were organized at the expense of Bin Laden. They operated in Chechnya under the leadership of Arab instructors, one of them was the famous Khattab. Terrorists from Europe, and from China, and from other countries were trained in these camps. That is, then the practical foundation of international terror was laid.
After the end of the Chechen war, terrorism entered the international arena. The al-Qaeda action against the United States itself was the apogee. That is, this monster, the genie that was released from the bottle, has been fighting as an independent force since the beginning of 2000, to achieve the goals of Al-Qaida. At that time, it was the largest and most organized Islamic terrorist organization. And when it was understood, it was already too late.
The fight against al-Qaida Americans are 14 years. There were triumphant reports and statements by the presidents of the United States. There was a war in Afghanistan and the presence of American troops in it. Nevertheless, al-Qaeda is growing and expanding. It turned into a banner of the Muslim, Arab world, gave the goal and form for the revival of Islam, as they understand it.
Al-Qaida cells in different places began to form not as a result of its efforts, but at the initiative of certain Muslim groups based on the local population. They organized themselves and declared to Al-Qaida: "We accept your principles and join you." And this is the worst. Appeared the first form of international Islamic terror. Al-Qaida had its own goals - to seize power in the Muslim world, to take control of Islamic states one by one. However, this was not possible in any country, including Afghanistan. But the situation was thus destabilized, including in Africa. One of the best examples is Nigeria, Boko Haram.
The next stage, which sharply increased the terror, was the destabilization of regimes in the Middle East. Here in all countries except Israel, authoritarian or dictatorial regimes existed to one degree or another. This is a necessary, natural and the only form of existence of states in the Middle East, because for the most part these states are artificial, multi-tribal, multi-confessional, created more than a hundred years ago by those imperialist states, mainly Great Britain and France, which owned their territories.
The first country that was destabilized and liquidated by the United States as a single state under the banner of the fight against al-Qaeda was Iraq. Saddam Hussein was accused of collaborating with Bin Laden. Although Hussein fought against al-Qaeda.
Then Libya was destabilized and crushed. Then Syria. In the end, the entire Middle East turned into organized, unmanaged chaos. It was an open field for al-Qaida. She came to Iraq against the background of the intensified struggle of the Sunnis against the Shiites. At the same time, Saddam’s administration, officers and generals of Hussein’s defeated army joined the tribes supported by Al-Qaida.
Only for a certain period, when the American authorities, who were there, finally heeded those expert advice and began paying Sunni tribes fighting against Baghdad so that they would not cooperate with Al-Qaeda, the situation seemed to stabilize. Then the Americans decided that this was not necessary. And the Iraqi government decided to attack them. It was then that al-Qaida was established in Iraq. And then the war in Syria just arrived. And as it was in 80 in Afghanistan, the United States and Europe looked favorably on radical Muslim organizations, including Al Qaeda, to emerge as part of the forces fighting against Assad.
In Syria, its branch was organized, called “Jabhat al-Nusra”. The goal was to seize power in this country. Al-Qaida members from Iraq joined the militants. And one of them, Albakr, decided after the destruction of Bin Laden to create a new, more powerful movement with the aim of not just capturing any Islamic state, but creating a single Muslim caliphate in the Middle East. And he created, using those political, military and organizational resources that were before him, starting with the Afghan war. Thus arose ISIS (the former name of the Islamic State banned in Russia. - “MIC”).
The bottom line is a difficult situation all over the world. On the one hand, the destabilization of the situation in the Middle East, a huge number of Muslim refugees from Afghanistan, Pakistan and Africa, which created an excellent ground for propaganda of extremist views. On the other hand, the Islamic population of Europe, which has lived there since the beginning of the collapse of the French empire and a little bit of the British, has already begun to organize into certain groups based on Islam. And when the most attractive and romantic, from their point of view, image of ISIS emerged, they stood under its banners.
It was not ISIS that sent its emissaries to this or that country, it was they who said there: “We are joining. We agree to accept your ideology and strategy, we are your soldiers. ” This is what Boko Haram in Nigeria says. The militants who fought in Libya, more and more new Islamist cells in Europe began to declare this. Indicative of the recent terrorist attacks in Europe. Their performers were not members of ISIS two years ago. These groups in Belgium and France announced that they were becoming members of ISIS, only at the beginning of last year. Before that, they were separate Muslim groups, and now we are dealing with a new International under the auspices of ISIS, which unites all or most of the Islamic fundamentalist groups that are ready to fight with the help of force and terror with the reality in which they live. These may be Arabs living in France, in England, in Spain or in any other country. They are joined by young people who converted to Islam - ordinary Germans, Belgians, Italians, anyone. And since ISIS is surrounded by the aura of romance of armed struggle with the surrounding reality, they are drawn to it.
Thus arose the contagion we call international terrorism. All other types of terror today almost do not exist.
- The picture, of course, joyless. As you said, these organizations have a religious base in the form of a perverted interpretation of religious canons, and on the other hand, they use youth’s dissatisfaction with life. How to deal with this evil?
- The situation is complicated and confusing, so you need to go in several directions at once. If you look with a long-term view, the worst thing that can happen is that most of the half billion Muslims accept the world’s extremist ideology. Therefore, it is necessary to support the struggle of moderate Islam with these trends. This is one of the main problems. With the help of moderate Islam, you can stop the spread of fundamentalist. This is the first direction.
Another is the curbing of the success line of ISIS. People are attracted to the terrorist organizations of their victory. And the more committed terrorist attacks, blood and murder, the wider the circle of supporters. Intelligence agencies that track this, see that after each terrorist attack sympathy for this organization among a certain group of young people is sharply enhanced. Today in the ranks of ISIL in Syria and Iraq, fighting from 30 to 40 thousands of volunteers from other countries. The influx does not decrease, although they are trying to stop it with the help of special services, borders, army ...
It is necessary to eliminate the base of ISIL, especially in Syria and Iraq. Until these countries are liberated, until the organization loses the main part of its territorial base, it is impossible to say that the spread of terrorism has stopped. This is not done by bombing - they do not fight that way with partisan formations. That is, until there are fighters who will catch, kill, arrest the members of these organizations, we will continue to run after them, like ghosts.
At the same time, it is necessary to conduct work on the destruction of all the cells and processes of ISIS in any country, using the most stringent and effective methods. I will give an example. Five years ago, an Israeli Arab went to Syria, fought, returned. He was arrested and tried. He sat a year and a half, went out. He organized a group of six Arabs, again went to Syria. This time he did it by flying over the border in a small plane. And those whom he recruited had to go to Syria and meet him there. That is, if he had been planted years on 20 or 30, this would not have happened. Methods must be so effective and unambiguous as to leave no chance for the revival of such movements.
- You absolutely correctly noted that the Taliban, Al-Qaida, ISIL were supported and strengthened by the United States and Great Britain in their geopolitical interests. Does this mean that they are fully responsible for the crimes of these terrorist organizations?
- They bear the same responsibility as any state that supports terrorist organizations on the basis of certain considerations. It must be remembered that terrorists can always start a war against those who "supervise" them today.
Here is an example. In Sinai, a terrorist organization was established on the basis of local Bedouins to fight the current government in Egypt, supporters of Morsi and the Muslim Brothers, who had been removed from power. It was a terrorist organization. On the way of her development, she maintained contacts and received assistance, conducted joint operations with another related organization, which, as you know, is called Hamas. She is in Gaza. Earlier this year, announced: we are now ISIS. The bomb in the Russian plane was planted by representatives of this organization, in the creation and strengthening of which Hamas took part.
If you pursue a policy of singling out “good” and “bad” among terrorists, then one day they or their allies will bomb a plane into your plane.
Today, the United States defends its terrorists, that is, the Muslim Brotherhood organization, which was created in Syria, Turkey, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia. The Americans, the British, the Turks and the Saudis want them to be recognized as a legitimate opposition. Regarding “Jabhat al-Nusra” and ISIS, they finally agreed: they are illegitimate. On the other hand, there is Hamas - nobody says anything against it. And against Al-Jihad Al-Islami, too. That is, they seem to fall out of the field of terrorist organizations that must be fought. This is extremely dangerous. Until the use of any terrorist organizations in their own interests, their coverage or inviolability, because they seem to correspond to our interests, terror cannot be defeated!
The Taliban, Al-Qaida, IG were supported and strengthened by the United States and Great Britain in their geopolitical interests. While such organizations are being used by one or another state for their own purposes, terror cannot be defeated, a world-class political scientist and former head of the Israeli special service Naativ Yakov Kedmi is convinced.
- Jacob Iosifovich, let me start with the question: what caused the current outbreak of international terrorism?
- It happened not recently, but much earlier. The twentieth century was full of terror. Usually, it is gaining strength where, on the one hand, there are some conflicts, and on the other, power and society weaken, the state goes out of stability. But if in the past, terror was used on a national basis (for example, Irish) or in ideological confrontation (as a means of achieving political goals of various kinds of ultra-left, Trotskyist groups that walked around Europe), now the main type we face is religious. Extremist Islamic movements are trying to achieve their goals in this way. The heyday of terror in the last 25 years is the result of the destabilization of the situation in Africa and Asia, especially in the Middle East. The emergence of international terrorism as a phenomenon began during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. The power in this country was precarious, but not the fault of the USSR. Taking advantage of the war in Afghanistan, smart people in the West decided to support terrorist organizations - religious, Islamic - as one of the tools in the fight against the Soviet Armed Forces. Thus, they provided the basis for creating a rather effective terrorist structure.
- You mean al-Qaeda?
- Yes, but in a slightly different way. Prior to this, Pakistan (more precisely, its military intelligence) created a terrorist organization with the aim of destabilizing the situation in Indian Kashmir, a disputed area fraught with religious conflict with the Muslim population. And already at its base, the United States, together with the British, organized their own similar structure to fight against the Soviet army in neighboring Afghanistan. That is, the first serious terrorist organization was created by the United States and Great Britain. This is the first sin. She began to use in Afghanistan against the Soviet army, because the conditions are suitable.
From the very beginning, the organization was notable for serious Muslim indoctrination, but no one paid any attention to this. They even considered it positive that the terrorists were operating under the slogan of fighting the infidels. That is, the struggle against the USSR was explained to the representatives of the Muslim movement throughout the world as resistance to the wrong. Everything else — neither the Afghan people, nor its present and future — interested anyone. And it was the second crime against the world community and to the Muslims themselves.
Therefore, people with extremist religious ideology have reached out for the Taliban. Gradually, the movement began to take more and more aggressive, fundamentalist forms. It was a combat organization. Joining Bin Laden and other people with significant capital, support for Saudi Arabia (she sponsored almost all Muslim movements and groups that fought against the Soviet army) created a serious base. When the Afghan problem was actually solved, of those who fought on the side of the Taliban, a new extremist terrorist organization Al Qaeda was created by Bin Laden. She enjoyed the support of the West, primarily the United States and Great Britain, who not only gave weapon, but also trained militants. Especially in this business the British have succeeded.
Then the organization took part in two conflicts. The first is Balkan, where it fought on the side of the Bosnians, which was welcomed positively, because the United States, Great Britain and the whole West sought to dismember Yugoslavia, wanting to cause as much damage as possible to the Serbs, who were considered the main supporters of the Soviet Union. After the fall of the USSR, New Russia did not pursue any international policy, slowly degrading. However, everything that happened in the Balkans, as before, happened with a clear anti-Russian emphasis.
In the West, they looked quite favorably on the independent participation of Al-Qaida in the Chechen war, helping with the supply of militants and money. Then for the first time, camps for training international terrorists were organized at the expense of Bin Laden. They operated in Chechnya under the leadership of Arab instructors, one of them was the famous Khattab. Terrorists from Europe, and from China, and from other countries were trained in these camps. That is, then the practical foundation of international terror was laid.
After the end of the Chechen war, terrorism entered the international arena. The al-Qaeda action against the United States itself was the apogee. That is, this monster, the genie that was released from the bottle, has been fighting as an independent force since the beginning of 2000, to achieve the goals of Al-Qaida. At that time, it was the largest and most organized Islamic terrorist organization. And when it was understood, it was already too late.
The fight against al-Qaida Americans are 14 years. There were triumphant reports and statements by the presidents of the United States. There was a war in Afghanistan and the presence of American troops in it. Nevertheless, al-Qaeda is growing and expanding. It turned into a banner of the Muslim, Arab world, gave the goal and form for the revival of Islam, as they understand it.
Al-Qaida cells in different places began to form not as a result of its efforts, but at the initiative of certain Muslim groups based on the local population. They organized themselves and declared to Al-Qaida: "We accept your principles and join you." And this is the worst. Appeared the first form of international Islamic terror. Al-Qaida had its own goals - to seize power in the Muslim world, to take control of Islamic states one by one. However, this was not possible in any country, including Afghanistan. But the situation was thus destabilized, including in Africa. One of the best examples is Nigeria, Boko Haram.
The next stage, which sharply increased the terror, was the destabilization of regimes in the Middle East. Here in all countries except Israel, authoritarian or dictatorial regimes existed to one degree or another. This is a necessary, natural and the only form of existence of states in the Middle East, because for the most part these states are artificial, multi-tribal, multi-confessional, created more than a hundred years ago by those imperialist states, mainly Great Britain and France, which owned their territories.
The first country that was destabilized and liquidated by the United States as a single state under the banner of the fight against al-Qaeda was Iraq. Saddam Hussein was accused of collaborating with Bin Laden. Although Hussein fought against al-Qaeda.
Then Libya was destabilized and crushed. Then Syria. In the end, the entire Middle East turned into organized, unmanaged chaos. It was an open field for al-Qaida. She came to Iraq against the background of the intensified struggle of the Sunnis against the Shiites. At the same time, Saddam’s administration, officers and generals of Hussein’s defeated army joined the tribes supported by Al-Qaida.
Only for a certain period, when the American authorities, who were there, finally heeded those expert advice and began paying Sunni tribes fighting against Baghdad so that they would not cooperate with Al-Qaeda, the situation seemed to stabilize. Then the Americans decided that this was not necessary. And the Iraqi government decided to attack them. It was then that al-Qaida was established in Iraq. And then the war in Syria just arrived. And as it was in 80 in Afghanistan, the United States and Europe looked favorably on radical Muslim organizations, including Al Qaeda, to emerge as part of the forces fighting against Assad.
In Syria, its branch was organized, called “Jabhat al-Nusra”. The goal was to seize power in this country. Al-Qaida members from Iraq joined the militants. And one of them, Albakr, decided after the destruction of Bin Laden to create a new, more powerful movement with the aim of not just capturing any Islamic state, but creating a single Muslim caliphate in the Middle East. And he created, using those political, military and organizational resources that were before him, starting with the Afghan war. Thus arose ISIS (the former name of the Islamic State banned in Russia. - “MIC”).
The bottom line is a difficult situation all over the world. On the one hand, the destabilization of the situation in the Middle East, a huge number of Muslim refugees from Afghanistan, Pakistan and Africa, which created an excellent ground for propaganda of extremist views. On the other hand, the Islamic population of Europe, which has lived there since the beginning of the collapse of the French empire and a little bit of the British, has already begun to organize into certain groups based on Islam. And when the most attractive and romantic, from their point of view, image of ISIS emerged, they stood under its banners.
It was not ISIS that sent its emissaries to this or that country, it was they who said there: “We are joining. We agree to accept your ideology and strategy, we are your soldiers. ” This is what Boko Haram in Nigeria says. The militants who fought in Libya, more and more new Islamist cells in Europe began to declare this. Indicative of the recent terrorist attacks in Europe. Their performers were not members of ISIS two years ago. These groups in Belgium and France announced that they were becoming members of ISIS, only at the beginning of last year. Before that, they were separate Muslim groups, and now we are dealing with a new International under the auspices of ISIS, which unites all or most of the Islamic fundamentalist groups that are ready to fight with the help of force and terror with the reality in which they live. These may be Arabs living in France, in England, in Spain or in any other country. They are joined by young people who converted to Islam - ordinary Germans, Belgians, Italians, anyone. And since ISIS is surrounded by the aura of romance of armed struggle with the surrounding reality, they are drawn to it.
Thus arose the contagion we call international terrorism. All other types of terror today almost do not exist.
- The picture, of course, joyless. As you said, these organizations have a religious base in the form of a perverted interpretation of religious canons, and on the other hand, they use youth’s dissatisfaction with life. How to deal with this evil?
- The situation is complicated and confusing, so you need to go in several directions at once. If you look with a long-term view, the worst thing that can happen is that most of the half billion Muslims accept the world’s extremist ideology. Therefore, it is necessary to support the struggle of moderate Islam with these trends. This is one of the main problems. With the help of moderate Islam, you can stop the spread of fundamentalist. This is the first direction.
Another is the curbing of the success line of ISIS. People are attracted to the terrorist organizations of their victory. And the more committed terrorist attacks, blood and murder, the wider the circle of supporters. Intelligence agencies that track this, see that after each terrorist attack sympathy for this organization among a certain group of young people is sharply enhanced. Today in the ranks of ISIL in Syria and Iraq, fighting from 30 to 40 thousands of volunteers from other countries. The influx does not decrease, although they are trying to stop it with the help of special services, borders, army ...
It is necessary to eliminate the base of ISIL, especially in Syria and Iraq. Until these countries are liberated, until the organization loses the main part of its territorial base, it is impossible to say that the spread of terrorism has stopped. This is not done by bombing - they do not fight that way with partisan formations. That is, until there are fighters who will catch, kill, arrest the members of these organizations, we will continue to run after them, like ghosts.
At the same time, it is necessary to conduct work on the destruction of all the cells and processes of ISIS in any country, using the most stringent and effective methods. I will give an example. Five years ago, an Israeli Arab went to Syria, fought, returned. He was arrested and tried. He sat a year and a half, went out. He organized a group of six Arabs, again went to Syria. This time he did it by flying over the border in a small plane. And those whom he recruited had to go to Syria and meet him there. That is, if he had been planted years on 20 or 30, this would not have happened. Methods must be so effective and unambiguous as to leave no chance for the revival of such movements.
- You absolutely correctly noted that the Taliban, Al-Qaida, ISIL were supported and strengthened by the United States and Great Britain in their geopolitical interests. Does this mean that they are fully responsible for the crimes of these terrorist organizations?
- They bear the same responsibility as any state that supports terrorist organizations on the basis of certain considerations. It must be remembered that terrorists can always start a war against those who "supervise" them today.
Here is an example. In Sinai, a terrorist organization was established on the basis of local Bedouins to fight the current government in Egypt, supporters of Morsi and the Muslim Brothers, who had been removed from power. It was a terrorist organization. On the way of her development, she maintained contacts and received assistance, conducted joint operations with another related organization, which, as you know, is called Hamas. She is in Gaza. Earlier this year, announced: we are now ISIS. The bomb in the Russian plane was planted by representatives of this organization, in the creation and strengthening of which Hamas took part.
If you pursue a policy of singling out “good” and “bad” among terrorists, then one day they or their allies will bomb a plane into your plane.
Today, the United States defends its terrorists, that is, the Muslim Brotherhood organization, which was created in Syria, Turkey, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia. The Americans, the British, the Turks and the Saudis want them to be recognized as a legitimate opposition. Regarding “Jabhat al-Nusra” and ISIS, they finally agreed: they are illegitimate. On the other hand, there is Hamas - nobody says anything against it. And against Al-Jihad Al-Islami, too. That is, they seem to fall out of the field of terrorist organizations that must be fought. This is extremely dangerous. Until the use of any terrorist organizations in their own interests, their coverage or inviolability, because they seem to correspond to our interests, terror cannot be defeated!
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