Military Review

Dreamland

115



There is such a hot topic: 3 billion borrowed by Yanukovych, and the categorical unwillingness of the country of Ukraine to return them. And the most offensive and unpleasant for us is that this, frankly “illegal” position finds support and understanding in the West. Yes, in Soviet times, money to “friends and allies” was often distributed through very strange schemes (the socialist brotherhood of the people!), Which made their subsequent return extremely difficult. The friendship ended abruptly, and no one was in a hurry to return the money. But with the country Ukraine, in this case, everything was categorically the opposite: no “trust in the word”, but only the official formalization of this loan. In fact, Mr. Putin did everything so formally and formally that there’s simply no place to go. Irish stock exchange, British law ... The question is, why all these formalities between the two fraternal Slavic peoples?

However, as the sad practice showed, these “formalities” were not only not excessive, but even proved insufficient. Although, as they say: there is simply nowhere else to go. Or, maybe the deal should have been “consecrated” by Ben Bernanke and the Pope? What happened? Ukraine asks for a loan from Russia. And Russia, following all the formalities and rules of the Western financial system (they laughed at our rules), lends money. After that, due to political changes inside Ukraine, this financial transaction is immediately questioned. No, Ukraine is forced to pay interest, but the loan itself is called “a bribe to Yanukovych,” and the need to repay it is constantly debated.

At the same time, no one denies the fact that Ukraine received money from Russia on time and in full, no one denies that this money was spent on quite “official” expenses. If it were possible to find any flaws, they would be instantly found. But no, everything is clean. However, repayment of the loan by Ukraine (with the support of its Western sponsors) was not even considered. This amount was not credited to the 2015 budget. In fact - this is very serious. We were constantly offered and offered to abide by certain general “rules of the game”, a kind of “international law”. And what do we see in fact? The same countries frankly (I would even say impudently) ignore these rules of the game. But the amount of 3 billion is ridiculous compared to the total volume of "sovereign loans." There, after all, the conversation is about hundreds of billions and trillions of dollars.

At the same time, the system is quite tough: Russia faced it in the 90s, when it was forced to pay all-Union debts from a half-empty budget. The slogan was: "Die, but pay!". At the beginning of 90, our German "partners" stated about our debts rather firmly and briefly: "Debts have to be paid." And the point. The fact that, say, a plant in Ukraine (now sovereign) was built for the loan amount or a port in the Baltic States did not bother anyone. Moscow should pay - it was more convenient for them. We were popularly explained that the “civilized world” has its own rules of the game and they must be strictly followed, only in this way can we achieve respect and prosperity. Yes, difficult, yes, it hurts in some places, but it's worth it. Well, Russia played by these rules and successfully: paid off the debts of the USSR and even got a plus.

And she continued to play by these very "civilized rules", for example, giving out a sovereign loan to Ukraine. This is where everything stalled. That is, we can give them something, there is no ban on this, but to claim back ... Here the “international law” interrupts its work. In fact, financial paradoxes began much as before. All the “gas wars” with Ukraine is a complete and concrete absurdity. Is there a need for gas? Buy it! Sign a contract, pay money and get gas. Russia has never refused to sell gas to Ukraine (or to someone else if it is technically possible). The problem was client solvency. But, according to “international law”, solvency problems are the problems of the client. No money - sit without gas. The West spoke about “gas blackmail” on the part of Russia and about “energy security”. Suppose I want to buy a Mercedes, but I don’t have any money ... Can I talk about the “transport blackmail” of gentlemen from Stuttgart? But the logic is the same. Or at least it should be the same. Imagine, I went to a solo picket near the Mercedes dealership. Demanding to knock off my 50% cost. What, I wonder, will be the reaction of the Germans? Or imagine the manifestation of "red-nosed citizens" next to the liquor store. They want cheap vodka for the people.

You may say that it is absurd, but it is in this vein that the “gas wars” in Europe are unfolding over the past ten years. There is a market economy, there is a Russian Gazprom, which offers gas. Do not like the prices? - invite competitors and achieve reduction. Instead, we have endless political discussions and the struggle for "energy independence" from Russia. So what is this “international law”? I will say more, if the West had explained to the Ukrainians from the very beginning that it was necessary to pay for Russian gas and not to frown, then the whole история Ukraine would have gone some other way. More logical and civilized, perhaps. But instead, Ukrainians were told that Gazprom was offending them. These words fell on fertile ground, and the last ten years instead of business, we have endless political games around the pipe. But what does politics have to do with it? After all, this is pure business.

The example with Mercedes is not accidental: Russia wants to buy something in Europe? She signs a contract, pays money and gets the goods (the latter is not always). But Westerners tried to build our relations in the gas sphere with Ukraine by completely different principles: the Ukrainian consumer should have gas, money is a separate question. In principle, our energy companies worked this way in 90s in Russia: if you want to sell something abroad, be kind enough to supply fuel to the impoverished domestic consumer. But this may be normal within one country (or may not be). But with intergovernmental relations, this is utterly absurd. Russia, in fact, was confronted with the fact: if you want to sell gas to Europe, supply Ukraine. Is this some form of socialism? After all, if we work within the “free market” framework, the conflict is incomprehensible in principle. Now, if you turn away from all these "games", then the gas conflict with Ukraine is absurd in its essence. We sign a long-term contract and work on it. What could be the questions? We are so accustomed to politicizing the issue of gas trade, that we no longer feel the abnormality of this situation. But everything is simple. Goods - money - goods. Classic. Gas - hryvnia - fat. Romance.

The paradox and window of Overton at the same time - for us gas is already, as it were, not a commodity, but something - completely from the sphere of “high politics”. And everything is quite simple: the economy of Eastern European countries is energy-intensive and not profitable, which makes it dependent on Russian energy supplies. This is typical for Lithuania and Poland. But this means a certain political dependence on the Kremlin. And here the West is making a “knight's move”: no, they are not investing billions in the re-equipment of the industry of these countries, they are starting to take out sales of Russian gas from a market economy to politics. For some reason, Gazprom and the Kremlin’s “energy blackmail” are to blame for the internal problems of European countries. Well, where are these the most: simple, clear and civilized rules of work in the European market?

In fact, de facto imposition of a rejection of the "market economy" occurs. Because within its framework neither Lithuania, nor Ukraine is viable in the given political alignments. And "civilized Europeans" are trying to bring them out of the action of market laws. Is there no gas in Ukraine, and people are freezing? Blame the Russians. If this is not socialism, then what is socialism? And even when Ukraine started “gas extraction” from the export pipe, it did not cause any condemnation from the European Union. They were surprised to note the “drop in volumes” of incoming fuel. Blame, of course, Russia, which can not solve "their" problems with Ukraine. But Ukraine’s position was purely market-based - either you sell us gas at the prices that suit us, or we “select” it ourselves. In fact, this is where the root of many Ukrainian problems is - the West has silently allowed them to “pull gas from the pipe”. In fact, this entire endless scandal around the “most beautiful country in the world” is explained very simply: after the first Maidan, the West decided to withdraw Ukraine from a market economy in relations with Russia.

This lack of understanding of this simple fact is surprising to ordinary Russians, but in fact everything is elementary: Ukraine can not abide by contracts with Russia, do not pay gas bills, frankly steal this very gas. For all this, the EU closes its eyes, fixing only the shortage at the exit from Ukraine. But Gazprom is to blame. That is, from their (Ukraine and EU) point of view, Russia is obliged to supply this country on non-market conditions. Hence the battle for the pipe. From the very beginning, nothing good could come of it. Nothing happened. In fact, the West has provided Ukraine with a very, very “disservice”, making it believe in the possibility of non-market methods of management.

And here is the logical conclusion: Ukraine is in need of everything: from coal to food, but cannot pay for anything. And at the same time in the Parliament there are continuous meetings, and the Ukrainian patriots make ardent speeches. But the situation does not change for the better at all. And you can say these speeches even in Ukrainian, even in Turkish, in fact the “independent Ukraine” did not take place. And the thing is precisely in this (not in the language, of course). The point is the economic insolvency of the Ukraine system. You will laugh: capitalism (no matter what we understand by this expression) did not take place in Ukraine. In order not to enter into endless discussions, I will say this: capitalism is when you have to pay bills. In Ukraine, this excellent situation has not arisen. You see, there is a scoop, a clean scoop, when “shanovni Panov”, instead of paying incoming bills from a current account, are engaged in a political “movement”.

Therefore, all our calls for Ukraine to pay for gas are not met with understanding. To do this, one must live under capitalism, and a person of a “socialist type” does not understand such things in principle. Yes, they would have paid, definitely. But they simply have no money. And to no, as you know, and there is no court. As we all have long been convinced: Western law is very, very selective, that is, for Parisian homosexuals, for example, it applies, but for Donbass miners no longer. You will not believe it, but with the “principles of market economy” the same cholera: they work somewhere, but they refuse to work somewhere. Amazing isn't it? If you look at the "Ukrainian gas conflict" and the financial relations between Russia and Ukraine as a whole from this point of view, then everything falls into place.

In general, for any normal person, all these endless gas negotiations with Ukraine look very, very unusual. But if we take into account the fact that Ukraine is a kind of socialism, and the EU and the US maintain non-market relations of this country with Russia, then everything suddenly and suddenly becomes clearer. That is why the last years of 10 negotiations with Ukraine go almost continuously. The point is not the complexity of the subject under discussion, the point is “the collision of systems”. And that is why, after the first Maidan, Russia resolutely began to look for workarounds for the export of gas to Europe. In general, of course, everything turned out for Ukraine as foolishly as possible: this very gas export through its territory could be a big plus and give a lot of bonuses, and in many ways “feed” the population. Ukraine, on the other hand, turned its biggest plus into a giant minus: endless scandals, debts for gas, reduced transit, higher prices, and finally a coup and a civil war.

Here, in principle, it is the gas issue that proves the complete state failure of the Ukrainian “elites”: the Russians have created at their own expense a strategic megabusiness of billions and tens of billions. And this very gas transit business sharply raised the geopolitical significance of this Eastern European “power”. It was possible to collect a bunch of "buns". And it is easy, elegant and not straining. Ukrainians "brilliantly" managed to turn this giant plus into a nightmare. Talented people, unusually talented. Instead of engaging in a billion-dollar gas business, they engaged in primitive gas blackmail. “If you want to supply gas to Europe ...” - that was how it sounded at the beginning. "If you want to receive gas from Russia ..." - so it sounds now. “Did you try to work and pay the bills?” - I would like to ask in reply. You see, this is the classic psychology of roadside thugs: someone produces goods, someone buys them, transports them, transports them ... And someone comes out with a brush on a big road. By the way, I am not an expert in economic theory, and I can’t say whether it is possible to include these “individuals” in the description of the economic system. And how to include them? Workers of the knife and ax ... romance from the back streets of evroshlyakh. This is not a deviation, it is a “postsocialist” system: the overlapping of the canal with water to the Crimea, the explosion of the supports of the electric main ...

People don’t even think about doing business: they can sell water, electricity and watermelons at high prices, they do much easier. Our mistake is that we perceive the Ukrainians as quite a European civilized nation, albeit an extremely Russophobic-minded, but European. A sort of "eastern France". After that, all our efforts about something agree with them endure an epic Fail. Alas, it is not even "northern Gabon", it is some kind of "fabulous Land Ground." Imagine that the power line to your city passes, so to say, through the territory of a “fairy-tale narod”, for example goblins (it was shorter there). Now try to explain to an ordinary goblin that it is not good to throw down the pillars of this line.

Submitted? This is it! Now the next quest: get three chests of gold coins from the goblin king. In these statements, only a fraction of the irony, the rest is true. Ukraine is in fact an extraordinary interest for all kinds of “reenactors” and lovers of “combat fantasy”. Many (most!) Do not understand this, but the Ukrainians, at the cost of incredible efforts, managed to make an extraordinary breakthrough into a different dimension. They abandoned the norms and conventions of modern civilization completely, completely and completely. Well-armed groups of adventurers roam all over Ukraine, human life is not worth a penny ... Recently, one of these groups demanded a ransom from Holland for the stolen paintings. "Scary!" - You say. Scary, but unusual and interesting!

Who, by the way, is the typical hero of a fantasy novel? A person with no place to live and work, but definitely talented and smart. He, as a rule, does not plow, does not sow, does not bargain and does not even "take pride in the social system." That's why he is the hero of the fantasy world. Working and paying bills is boring. To understand Ukraine, we need to abandon our usual logic and value system. Ukrainians simply already live in another world. And, of course, they will never return any money to us. How do you imagine commodity-money relations "according to Marx" with a fabulous narodtse?

Dreamland
Author:
Photos used:
http://www.novilist.hr/Multimedija/Foto/Najbolje-Reutersove-slike-Foto-REUTERS/MDF41207?meta_refresh=true
115 comments
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  1. 33 Watcher
    33 Watcher 23 January 2016 09: 38 New
    32
    How do you imagine commodity-money relations “according to Marx” with a fabulous folk?

    Yes, it's very simple, to take something for this amount in a completely physical way. That's all the fairy tales. For example, to transfer this debt to Gazprom, let them keep it from transit. And even if these storytellers then cut off the transit of their Euro-peers if they want, they will be enough for two hours, I think.
    1. Ami du peuple
      Ami du peuple 23 January 2016 09: 46 New
      50
      Quote: Observer 33
      For example, transfer this debt to Gazprom, let them keep it from transit

      The Ukrainians have a nightmare with their antimonopoly committee Gazprom - they issue fines of billions of dollars, and you propose to transfer the collection of the state debt to him. It is necessary to send "polite" collectors to Kiev, then there will be a sense.
      They will help to translate the Russian proverb "debt by payment is red" into Ukrainian
      1. SRC P-15
        SRC P-15 23 January 2016 09: 49 New
        11
        In Ukrainian it sounds elementary: "Debt by default is red!" yes
        1. Tusv
          Tusv 23 January 2016 09: 57 New
          25
          Quote: SRC P-15
          In Ukrainian it sounds elementary: "Debt by default is red!"

          Rather like that
          Cazav not brave, mean no
        2. wasjasibirjac
          wasjasibirjac 23 January 2016 10: 36 New
          +5
          Quote: SRC P-15
          In Ukrainian it sounds elementary: "Debt by default is red!" yes
          a bit wrong - non-payment debt is credited. true for Ukrainians.
          1. Eaglealex
            Eaglealex 23 January 2016 21: 19 New
            +6
            Accordingly, only cowards repay debts ....
            1. Leshy111
              Leshy111 25 January 2016 15: 18 New
              +1
              Hmm ... But card debts even give a cheater. We need to transfer the debt to the card - we lost the Crimea - be so kind as to repay the debt, otherwise you can get into the guts! laughing
        3. captain
          captain 23 January 2016 13: 40 New
          10
          The Leninist national policy, which was carried out at the expense of the Russian people, will come back to haunt us more than once. Read Lenin in the original, you will learn interesting things about the "Russian Derzhimords" and the solution of territorial disputes at the expense of the Russians, "... let them endure."
      2. vlad66
        vlad66 23 January 2016 09: 51 New
        51
        Quote: Ami du peuple
        It is necessary to send "polite" collectors to Kiev, then there will be a sense.

        And even then they are unlikely to be given these characters by munching, so they will steal anyway.
      3. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 23 January 2016 09: 52 New
        11
        I suggest that I do not negotiate, and do not discuss already signed documents, but I OFFER SEARCH. To take and recover, without any judges there, etc. Do you feel the difference?
        1. Nikolay K
          Nikolay K 23 January 2016 10: 30 New
          10
          To recover without trial means to take or rob. Let's not go down to the level of Ukrainian under-state.
          And it will not work to offset in the legal plane, even if the rights of claim on the loan are transferred to Gazprom. Because in one case there is a debt of the Ukrainian state, and in the second, Gazprom’s obligation to a commercial organization for the payment of transit. These are different subjects.
          1. 33 Watcher
            33 Watcher 23 January 2016 10: 54 New
            13
            Let's not go down to the level of Ukrainian under-state.

            But with this approach, we won’t achieve anything. At the same time, some do not believe that they are being lowered, but quite rising themselves (above the law). And I must say, achieve their goals.
            In the meantime, I have a feeling that they sat down with a sharpler in the cards ... But then how, fingers, then the sharpler will be more dexterous, but the fists are smaller ... It's easier.
            1. zennon
              zennon 23 January 2016 15: 42 New
              +8
              Quote: Observer 33
              But with this approach, we won’t achieve anything.

              We will achieve it for sure. The debt is not controversial. It is recognized as sovereign in the IMF. Yes, now you have to sit in the courts, but this is a purely technical procedure. The Kohland has no hopes of challenging it. The other task is to play for time, constantly shouting about the treachery of the Russians who "imposed" on them money. They say this is a bribe to Yanukovych, but the "freedom-loving" outskirts will have to pay, "which has chosen d.e. r.y.m.o.k.r.a.t.i.ch.s.s.k.i. values. They not stupidly judged, anti-Russian rhetoric is not badly paid. That is, you need to attract as much attention as possible, and there will be happiness! Do you think that they do not understand that they will lose the process? Right now! They understand perfectly. The task is to work out slander against Russia and get for this their 30 pieces of silver. Well, or a barrel of jam and a box of cookies, as you like. They will lose the process. After that we will have the right to collect their property abroad. Not to pay for gas transit for this amount, and so on ...
              1. OlegLex
                OlegLex 25 January 2016 21: 19 New
                +1
                I'm afraid you are mistaken, but the judicial prospect at first glance is quite certain and the legal structure is clear, but you just forgot about the Big Politician, when seemingly unshakable rules seem to change by wave of hand, so the outcome of the trial may well be what exactly we we will have to, or do you think that just like that, the Maidan government puts forward multibillion claims to us both for Crimea and Gas, they may well bring this nonsense with counterclaims and it will be accepted.
                So for three yards you need to either forget or pick up, there are no other options
            2. Victor Demchenko
              Victor Demchenko 25 January 2016 11: 13 New
              +5
              Quote: Observer 33
              In the meantime, I have a feeling that they sat down with a sharpie in the cards to spread ...

              you know, but there is one indispensable rule in the cards: a sharpie caught on the spot is beaten on the head with a shandal ... good
          2. meriem1
            meriem1 24 January 2016 07: 07 New
            +2
            Quote: Nikolai K
            To recover without trial means to take or rob. Let's not go down to the level of Ukrainian under-state.
            And it will not work to offset in the legal plane, even if the rights of claim on the loan are transferred to Gazprom. Because in one case there is a debt of the Ukrainian state, and in the second, Gazprom’s obligation to a commercial organization for the payment of transit. These are different subjects.


            Absolutely agree. Moreover, an unknown disease has raised their discordant ranks. The epidemic is progressing. Every morning the first thought is "What did the neighbors come up with for today?" At the time of betting with the bookmakers.
          3. 2С5
            2С5 25 January 2016 09: 27 New
            +7
            ... kaneshnazhe !!!! Dear !!!! Let's not go down !!!! We will give, give and give without having anything in return, dumping everything and everything on politics and "non-state", but let go ?! What do you mean !!!! They will soon begin to behave like refugees in the EU, they will JUST come and take and you won't wait for them, if only on the sopatka, instead of this, thank you ... and we naturally won't go down, we weren't raised that way and we are sooooo proud of it! !!! For starters, I would nationalize all the "theirs" businessmen's property located on OUR territory and not go down ... let them rent, work and taxes into OUR treasury ... but ...Let's not go down to the level of Ukrainian under-state. yafshoke !!! wassat
            1. Victor Demchenko
              Victor Demchenko 25 January 2016 11: 22 New
              +2
              set a plus for such a poisonous sarcasm! great bro! I have been writing here for a long time, and not only here: why in our country having "national property" (Gazprom, if that) our poor have freeze in their own homes (stupidly turn off the gas and no sentiment), but to Ukraine, no way, well, no way to apply such a measure, Europe will suffer and the business of our poorest. and one more thing: I didn’t like Dvorkovich’s last statement about raising gas prices. Our liberals are screaming about the whole Ivanovo market, because in my opinion it doesn’t smell like the market here, because OIL IS CHEAPER, and for some reason prices are rising ... Well, it does not fit into the theory. maybe we have a specific market? what
              1. Leshy111
                Leshy111 25 January 2016 15: 24 New
                +1
                Well, yes ... It seems that they are selling oil inside the Russian Federation for dollars, damn it, as a foreign company in the form of Russian citizens ...
          4. kotvov
            kotvov 25 January 2016 18: 55 New
            +1
            To recover without trial means to take or rob. Let's not go down to the level of Ukrainian under-state. ,,
            that is, you offer to play with cheaters according to the rules? I’ll disappoint, the cheater understands only the sense of reckoning. The rest does not work.
        2. skeptic
          skeptic 23 January 2016 11: 49 New
          17
          Quote: Observer 33
          I suggest that I do not negotiate, and do not discuss already signed documents, but I OFFER SEARCH. To take and recover, without any judges there, etc. Do you feel the difference?


          It’s like - Ukrogastarbeiter transfers money to non-stop, and in return receives a piece of paper with gratitude for a part of the paid debt of Urina to Russia?
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. Nikolay K
              Nikolay K 23 January 2016 18: 35 New
              +4
              And didn’t you think that those same Ukrainian migrant workers who are not so susceptible to Ukrainian propaganda can eventually become a link between the countries? That they will remain one of those Ukrainian citizens who will keep the sane and with whom it will be possible to talk. Why chop the branch on which you sit?
              1. Victor Demchenko
                Victor Demchenko 25 January 2016 11: 25 New
                +5
                Quote: Nikolai K
                And didn’t you think that those same Ukrainian migrant workers who are not so susceptible to Ukrainian propaganda can eventually become a link between the countries? That they will remain one of those Ukrainian citizens who will keep the sane and with whom it will be possible to talk. Why chop the branch on which you sit?

                that there are few sane. Of all those with whom we have to contact now, only visitors from Donbass have now become more or less adequate No. , and from the center, and especially zapadentsy-this is the song of the Svidomo nationalist! they see only one thing: we have robbed them and must give, preferably all that they need, for nothing! what
                1. Leshy111
                  Leshy111 25 January 2016 15: 26 New
                  +1
                  visitors from Donbass have now become more or less adequate - ??? And we were them, if that)))
              2. max702
                max702 25 January 2016 21: 28 New
                0
                Quote: Nikolai K
                And didn’t you think that those same Ukrainian migrant workers who are not so susceptible to Ukrainian propaganda can eventually become a link between the countries? That they will remain one of those Ukrainian citizens who will keep the sane and with whom it will be possible to talk. Why chop the branch on which you sit?

                By the way, I knew one of these, and his name was Nikolai .. He worked in an office that earned a denyuzhka on the construction of facilities in Sochi and fed them a family for several years .. And with this, he fiercely hated Putin's Russia, and accused him of all mortal sins .. That again, did not bother to take her godly money .. That's such a hypocritical type .. Straight tribal representative Khokhlop people ..
      4. Philemon
        Philemon 25 January 2016 08: 14 New
        +6
        I propose new words of the Ukrainian anthem: "We do not plow, nor sow, we do not build ... We are proud of the social system ...")))
    2. Tersky
      Tersky 23 January 2016 09: 48 New
      24
      Well, yes ... who and what is this "Gazprom"? But Ukraine is the country of the victorious Maidan, known throughout the world. It is impossible not to reckon with her opinion! It is she who has determined the agenda of global players in the past two years! yes !
      For her sake, in order to satisfy her sacred ambitions and scolded honor, Russian sanctions were announced and oil prices fell negative . It is PARAschenko and Senya Kulyavlob who are the people who control the global processes, forcing the great powers to dance to their tune - for example, to give loans to Ukraine. Although the whole world has long known that there is nothing to give them to her. request
      For the sake of her, the IMF redrawn its rules, and now even countries that have defaulted can lend - is this not a worldwide change? fellow laughing
      1. SRC P-15
        SRC P-15 23 January 2016 09: 58 New
        10
        Quote: Tersky
        For the sake of her, the IMF redrawn its rules, and now even countries that have defaulted can lend - is this not a worldwide change?

        You are mistaken, the IMF has already secured:
        "The IMF lifted the rule that allowed lending to insolvent debtors January 20, 2016 - Russian banks. The IMF canceled the so-called systemic exemption, which was adopted in 2010 at the height of the financial and economic crisis in Greece and allowed the fund to lend to countries on an exceptional basis. with unbearable debts in the presence of a real threat of the crisis spreading to adjacent economies. Reporting on Wednesday about this, the official representative of the IMF Jerry Rice wrote this step in the context of the ongoing reforms in the fund, aimed in this case at revising the emergency rules, that is, exceeding the limits imposed by the national quota , access to the fund's resources. According to him, the decision is on a par, in particular, with the recent lifting of the ban on lending to countries with official arrears. Rice said that later this year, the IMF intends to engage in “reviewing (its) policy in relation to lending to borrowers with overdue loans femininity to private creditors. ”On the sidelines of the foundation, the“ system clause ”has always been considered controversial due to its clearly arbitrary approach to its application,“ inequality and moral hazard associated with large-scale rescue operations ”. - See more at: http://www.rusbanks.info/article/MVF-otmenil-pravilo-pozvolyavshee-kreditovat-ne



        sostoyatelnyh-dolzhnikov.html # sthash.fzk1J2AI.dpuf
        1. Tersky
          Tersky 23 January 2016 10: 28 New
          +9
          Quote: СРЦ П-15
          You are mistaken, the IMF has already secured:

          I know, yes , The IMF will find a thousand reasons for not giving tranche to a bankrupt country; they know the saying about throwing beads in front of a pig. Alexander, hi !
          1. SRC P-15
            SRC P-15 23 January 2016 11: 07 New
            +8
            Quote: Tersky
            I know, the IMF will find a thousand reasons for not giving a tranche to a bankrupt country

            Right! By this decision, the IMF warned other debtor countries not to "roll their lips" to receive assistance in case of non-repayment of loans received. Ukraine is in a special row for them, but they also have a hint: in case of further non-repayment of debts to other countries (except Russia), they will not see the help from the IMF as their ears. Victor, hi!
      2. Amurets
        Amurets 23 January 2016 10: 16 New
        11
        Quote: Tersky
        For the sake of her, the IMF redrawn its rules, and now even countries that have defaulted can lend - is this not a worldwide change?

        There is NO such country as Ukraine. In early January, the UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon declared that there is no state of Ukraine, since the territory of the state and a number of other determining signs, including the assumption of part of the obligations of the former USSR, were not defined and delimited. says the Secretary General, there is no state of Ukraine, but there is the territory of the state of Russia, which is the legal successor of the USSR. Ban Ki-moon’s statement immediately fell under strict ban in Ukraine. This statement could bring Russia a lot of trouble, as the unregistered borders between the EU, Ukraine and Russia and not signing other documents makes it possible to merge Ukraine, as the territory of Russia, with all the ensuing consequences.
        1. Tersky
          Tersky 23 January 2016 10: 24 New
          +3
          Quote: Amurets
          NO country like Ukraine

          Read between the lines ... my comment is just about a fabulous country. Colleague, hi !
          1. Amurets
            Amurets 23 January 2016 12: 08 New
            0
            Quote: Tersky
            Read between the lines ... my comment is just about a fabulous country. Colleague,

            I apologize! I didn’t get it right away!
        2. revnagan
          revnagan 25 January 2016 11: 11 New
          0
          On December 5, 1994, the United Kingdom, Russia, the United States, and Ukraine signed the Budapest Memorandum. This document provided guarantees of territorial integrity of Ukraine
          in exchange for the renunciation of nuclear weapons. Thus, the UK, Russia and the United States recognized that the state of Ukraine exists, and within those borders that existed as of December 5, 1994. Further: where did Ban Ki-moon make such a statement? Proof can be seen ? The concept of “registering borders at the UN” does not exist. Ukraine is an officially recognized state within the existing legal borders. In addition, Ukraine and Russia mutually recognized their land borders at the presidential level back in 2003, and in 2004 this treaty was ratified by parliaments. The only part of the border between Ukraine and Russia that has not been delimited so far is the Kerch Strait, that is, the sea border.
          1. KaPToC
            KaPToC 25 January 2016 22: 29 New
            0
            But what about Sevastopol? He was not transferred to Kiev with Crimea. Ukrainians pressed Sevastopol, Russian Crimea, all for garlic.
      3. region58
        region58 23 January 2016 11: 11 New
        16
        Quote: Tersky
        But Ukraine is the country of the victorious Maidan, known throughout the world. Her opinion cannot be ignored! It is she who determines the agenda of global players in the last two years!

        It looks like China has a different opinion:
    3. Voha_krim
      Voha_krim 23 January 2016 10: 11 New
      14
      Ukrainians simply already live in another world. And, of course, they will never return any money to us.
      1. Leshy111
        Leshy111 25 January 2016 15: 30 New
        0
        more like a hole. Between 2 buttocks ...
    4. Civil
      Civil 23 January 2016 10: 53 New
      +5
      Even if Yanuk is at least Pig, none of them would give that money ... but in Russia now 3 lard bucks could turn the tide in any given region!
      1. DPZ
        DPZ 23 January 2016 13: 15 New
        +3
        Yanuk would creak but give it away. he is cowardly. I was afraid to calm down the rebellion. and then I would have scored.
    5. DPZ
      DPZ 23 January 2016 13: 12 New
      +4
      it is necessary to create a collection agency headed by Kadyrov and "sell" Khokhlyatsky debts to him.
    6. RDX
      RDX 23 January 2016 16: 34 New
      +1
      great grunts, this is the poison of a civilized society
    7. tank64rus
      tank64rus 25 January 2016 19: 18 New
      0
      It’s better to do so. Poroshenko sabotaged so take to evaluate his property total Kolomoisky and others in Russia. To warn that it will be arrested with further confiscation of everything. Remember how they arrested our property in the 90s. Enough to behave with them in Russian, we will be in European. Must-pay.
    8. tank64rus
      tank64rus 25 January 2016 19: 18 New
      0
      It’s better to do so. Poroshenko sabotaged so take to evaluate his property total Kolomoisky and others in Russia. To warn that it will be arrested with further confiscation of everything. Remember how they arrested our property in the 90s. Enough to behave with them in Russian, we will be in European. Must-pay.
    9. sarmaght
      sarmaght 25 January 2016 21: 15 New
      0
      For a long time it is necessary to put kaklov in place, hard to explain, by deed! - where the legs grow from, and where there is free cheese! Ukraine is a terrible mixture of Poles, Lithuanians, Turks with the great and powerful Russian people. Of the many qualities of Russians, love for a freebie dominates. Put them on the counter - for the debt - to take real assets! - they are in the "independent"!
    10. Sharapov
      Sharapov 25 January 2016 22: 14 New
      0
      The topic is topical, and the article is voluminous, but the author ruined the whole impression with the first line. Yes, Yanukovych did not take 3 yards from Russia (by the way, these are the words of Yatsenyuk, as an excuse not to return them) - this state "independent Ukraine" received money on credit.
  2. Alex ..
    Alex .. 23 January 2016 09: 39 New
    35
    This is how to look ... winked
  3. izya top
    izya top 23 January 2016 09: 39 New
    +2
    an ordinary fairy tale - the farther, the stricter. although you can change it, the weirder and weirder what
  4. Same lech
    Same lech 23 January 2016 09: 40 New
    12
    You see, this is the classic psychology of roadside bandits: someone produces goods, someone purchases, transports, transports ... And someone goes with a brush on the big road.


    In the Kremlin, they are affectionately called by our partners .... just like in sex .. only someone who has no idea.
    1. Lelek
      Lelek 23 January 2016 10: 13 New
      +6
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      And someone goes with a brush on the big road.


      And all this under the sauce of "hurray-patriotism", reaching insanity. You don't know whether to laugh or cry about this:
      (cry.)
      1. Mikhail Krapivin
        Mikhail Krapivin 23 January 2016 11: 00 New
        +2
        Clowns, they are clowns in Ukraine :)
  5. Putinets
    Putinets 23 January 2016 09: 40 New
    +5
    What socialism is there? Ordinary raspberries and the gangway of thieves
  6. The comment was deleted.
    1. izya top
      izya top 23 January 2016 09: 49 New
      +4
      Quote: dchegrinec
      why run after a pig with a trough, if she herself must follow him

      Guidness itself does not allow. Civilization should-let them feed
  7. Fisman
    Fisman 23 January 2016 09: 41 New
    +9
    But Russia constantly makes Ukraine gas discounts, although no one will even say thank you.
  8. aszzz888
    aszzz888 23 January 2016 09: 42 New
    +8
    Then "international law" interrupts its work. In fact, financial paradoxes began much earlier. All the "gas wars" with Ukraine are a complete and concrete absurdity.


    No money - no sale. It's so simple. And if you don’t have money, you won’t go to the store (unless by appointment for acquaintances). No money for gas - your problems. And the geyropa will whimper, let it stop.
    1. SSR
      SSR 23 January 2016 10: 17 New
      +8
      Quote: aszzz888
      Then "international law" interrupts its work. In fact, financial paradoxes began much earlier. All the "gas wars" with Ukraine are a complete and concrete absurdity.


      No money - no sale. It's so simple. And if you don’t have money, you won’t go to the store (unless by appointment for acquaintances). No money for gas - your problems. And the geyropa will whimper, let it stop.

      Our citizens do not want to realize only one moment - European and the so-called international law, act only on their own, they may ask everyone else to stand at the door or even kick out at all. Anglo-Saxon law honed on the looting of other countries
    2. major147
      major147 23 January 2016 10: 24 New
      +5
      But the opposite is true. Ukraine does not have money for gas - these are our problems. They stupidly begin to steal gas paid for by Europeans, and they reproach Russia for their inability to work with a transit country.
  9. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 23 January 2016 09: 49 New
    13
    as sad practice has shown, these “formalities” were not only not superfluous, but were even insufficient

    At the present time, don't be on the safe side, but if there is an order to "wrinkle" Russia in full, then it (the order) will exert influence in international courts as well. Hence the simple conclusion - to stop focusing on the "friendly" people and send all the claims of foreign courts (arbitration, criminal) against Russia to such and such a mother, placing Russian legislation in supremacy. And let the Americans and the Europeans then go for simple shit. For insurance on our territory, their property is enough, on which, in extreme cases, can be seized.
    1. revnagan
      revnagan 25 January 2016 12: 06 New
      +1
      Quote: rotmistr60
      send all claims of foreign courts (arbitration, criminal) against Russia to such and such a mother, putting Russian law in the lead.

      Primarily ... what? World law? International law? Yes, please. The case for small things is to MAKE the whole world adopt new rules, including in the territory of the United States and other sovereign states.
      Quote: rotmistr60
      For insurance in our territory, their property is sufficient, which in extreme cases may be seized.

      Well, thank God that there is no Russian property on THEIR territory on which the actions of the Russian side can be mirrored fool .In general, apart from emotions, what are you guided by in your rational proposals? Kindergarten, she-bo ...
  10. A1L9E4K9S
    A1L9E4K9S 23 January 2016 09: 53 New
    +2
    Dreamland

    Yes, the country, it’s not a fairy tale to tell, it’s not a pen to write, even though we had the dashing nineties, (since then hyenas and jackals have been stealing billions from the neck of the people), but Russia has not reached such an extent and thank God and the Russian To the people.
    1. Lelek
      Lelek 23 January 2016 10: 16 New
      +3
      Quote: A1L9E4K9S
      Yeah, the country, not in a fairy tale to say, not write with a pen


      This is for sure: "Neither describe with a pen, nor use foul language." (cry.)
      1. solohan
        solohan 23 January 2016 12: 40 New
        0
        [media = http: //SSMaker.ru/476fda44/] for that matter .... why such stuffing
  11. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  12. LPD17
    LPD17 23 January 2016 10: 00 New
    +6
    So far, they have not even shown themselves to sue Ukraine to sue. What did they expect in the Kremlin? Return lards? So you know that the goblins did not register this debt in the budget? Is it criminal? Dizziness or crime? Why didn’t they just close the border with the malicious and evil payer? Why hundreds why? And these gentlemen, after all, for the elections in the fall. Vote for the traitors and the thugs with thieves?
    1. Victor Demchenko
      Victor Demchenko 25 January 2016 11: 42 New
      +1
      but I wonder who specifically vote for it? call me, I will run at a trot! look at the meeting of our Duma, with a capital letter, since there is not a single law aimed at the development of the country DOESN'T PASS APPROVAL IN THE DUMA AND MAYBALLY DRAW ON! am
  13. The comment was deleted.
  14. Nymp
    Nymp 23 January 2016 10: 06 New
    +4
    With the "civilized" (who even called him that? The zealous does not mean civilized. Throwing bombs on the heads of civilians, and then indignant at the crowd of refugees, there is no longer any further civilization!) West in general, it turns out that it is impossible to do business! They are allowed not to repay debts for political reasons, and the purchased goods (mistrals) too. But they will gnaw through the throat for their hard-earned money. DIKARI.
  15. bmv04636
    bmv04636 23 January 2016 10: 14 New
    +2
    Well, we, too, can allow our companies not to repay debts to Western partners. How will they accept it?
  16. AKS-U
    AKS-U 23 January 2016 10: 20 New
    +3
    Ukraine resembles the situation when sex is changed. That is, they make a boy out of a girl. Or vice versa. On the one hand, a person, but already of the other sex. So it is in Ukraine. When "brothers in the cross" appear in an Orthodox state, what happens is what happens. Treason. Human values, memory, language, faith, history.
    But on bills, you still have to pay.
  17. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  18. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 23 January 2016 10: 29 New
    +9
    How much you can "talk" about absolutely obvious things, you have to do the job, and for this it seems that our government has neither the desire nor the political will! Either they do not want to "offend the brotherly people", then they are "persuaded" by the West, but only the interests of their people and country are in the background (and about the "brotherly people" I want to remind the Ukrainian proverb: "... my uncle has better devils .. . "!) It's time for us to switch to this Durko-European language, understandable to" civilizers "and see how they will win on their loans!
  19. fa2998
    fa2998 23 January 2016 10: 30 New
    10
    I think the majority of Russians (and on this site) are looking forward to the end of 2018 - at this time the contract for the transit of gas through Ukraine is terminated. Everyone has a thought - to get rid of such a restless transit country and a thief. But there is a sixth sense that even we having bypass routes, we will still pump gas to Ukraine! Maybe there are some "higher interests", but the actions of our leadership are diametrically opposed to the opinion of the people. Well, we will live and see. There may be changes in Kiev (but this will not make them rich , now - theft and blackmail, then - help to the brotherly people) recourse hi
    1. major147
      major147 23 January 2016 10: 48 New
      +3
      Policy. Dirty business.
    2. Tersky
      Tersky 23 January 2016 11: 58 New
      +4
      Quote: fa2998
      I think most Russians (and even on this site) are looking forward to the end of 2018, at which time they terminate the gas transit agreement through Ukraine.

      One thing is interesting, whether Ukraine will survive until this time in the form in which it is today.
      Quote: fa2998
      . But there is a sixth feeling that even we, having gas bypasses, will still pump to Ukraine!

      It is possible in the fallen segments of Ukraine, as it is now in the same Donbass, for example.
    3. revnagan
      revnagan 25 January 2016 12: 13 New
      0
      Quote: fa2998
      even we having gas bypasses

      And it is possible in more detail about these very "ways"? It has already been said and negotiated: They do not exist. And there will not be. These are colossal funds that Russia does not have (but Russia does). for the construction of new pipelines, and the state will not be able to pull them out. Projects like Urengoy-Pomary-Uzhgorod were only within the power of the USSR with its powerful economy. already mentioned) Where should you post them? Think and don't write any more nonsense.
  20. Rock_n_roll
    Rock_n_roll 23 January 2016 10: 33 New
    +2
    It is necessary to tax all Gaster from Ukraine with a special tax, until 3 yards with interest will come. If there are about 3 million, then $ 1000 is quite capable of paying within a year. Correspondingly transfer to them the right to claim the debt of Ukraine. Upon return, they may demand repayment from Yaytsenyukh with accomplices.
  21. Zomanus
    Zomanus 23 January 2016 10: 34 New
    +2
    Europe supports Ukraine because of its gas pipe.
    Well this is a type of association on the topic of a cancerous tumor on a vessel.
    Try to touch the tumor and the vessel will burst.
    Because Ukraine is forgiven a lot.
    The SP-2 project is a shunt bypassing the tumor.
    As soon as the SP-2 is built, the tumor will be promptly removed.
    Removal of this tumor is unprofitable for America, therefore, it and its euroclaws against SP-2.
    Therefore, while Europe receives gas through Ukraine, it will continue to blow it in the ass.
  22. region58
    region58 23 January 2016 10: 42 New
    +2
    They constantly suggested and offer us to observe certain general “rules of the game”, a kind of “international law”. And what do we see in fact? The same countries openly (I would even say brazenly) ignore these rules of the game.

    Yes, there is no international law. In fact, the one who is stronger is the one who dictates the rules, and if the forces are equal, then agreements appear that are even respected for a while, because for a violation you can get a good deal. And then everyone interprets these agreements in their own way.
  23. Gormenghast
    Gormenghast 23 January 2016 10: 45 New
    +7
    Since 92, it was necessary to sell gas on market conditions and on a prepaid basis. To not get used to the freebie. Then, by now, there would have been no questions — either they would have self-destructed, or had learned to live by the bourgeois laws, for which pan Kravchuk so actively advocated.
  24. Ros 56
    Ros 56 23 January 2016 10: 48 New
    -1
    So it seems to be so, but not quite. This is correct only in one case, if you do not take into account the Donbass and those who came to a rally in Kiev yesterday, but how many did not work out? If you do not take into account those who periodically breaks the memorial plaques of Bandera in western Ukraine.
    It is not yet evening, and the near future will show what will ultimately come out of this misalliance of Ukraine with the United States and the EU. There are many options, and the collapse of the country, and a change of leadership, and a real slaughter, no one can foresee anything. Patience friends, patience and the right actions on our part. I think so. I understand that many hurry-racers would wave a saber, and I am like that, but life experience and certain types of activities have taught me not to chop.
    1. Victor Demchenko
      Victor Demchenko 25 January 2016 11: 48 New
      0
      Yur, it’s interesting, but how long do you personally agree to receive the most natural rudeness from your neighbor in response to good deeds? I personally be patient as it is not comme il faut! so minus you, dear, minus your attitude towards us, they showed in all its glory, and most importantly, they are not going to change it. hi
  25. Snail N9
    Snail N9 23 January 2016 10: 51 New
    +6
    But if you “think a little”, then a reasonable question arises: “why is it, despite the constant“ theft ”of gas by Ukraine, the constant non-payment of this country for the gas it consumes,“ Gazprom ”with the insistence of an“ idiot ”continues to pump this gas there?" What, really, over 17 years of such a situation, it was impossible to draw up contracts in such a way as to exclude the "theft" of gas by Ukraine or to shift the responsibility and control over gas transit onto the Europeans who need this gas, or at least share this responsibility? Or does Gazprom deliberately draw up contracts under which only Russia is the "injured" party, while the rest consider profit and laugh at the unlucky "Rashka" that makes the same mistake every year? But the point here is most likely that Gazprom did not want to sign the so-called "energy" packages developed by the EU to protect against monopoly on energy resources and did not want to divide its transport gas pipeline system in Europe into jointly managed companies or sell it to private hands, as a result, the Europeans said, you don’t want to share responsibility, you will now be responsible for everything yourself, we “wash your hands”, because they don’t help Russia “knock out” the debt from the debtor-Ukraine and help the “debtor” avoid payment in every possible way. And I’m wondering, because it doesn’t sign “energy” packages, Gazprom is losing billions of dollars and continues not to sign them, why? It is clear that the gas pipeline system of "Gazprom" in the EU costs a lot of money, but after all, it is not taken away but offered either to be sold or to form joint companies, but Gazprom stubbornly refuses to go for it. Why?
    1. Ros 56
      Ros 56 24 January 2016 08: 22 New
      0
      Quote: Snail N9
      Why?


      Remember the saying about the finger and hand. Really incomprehensible. You don’t see how they feel about us, it's time to stop being naive. This joint venture is working normally in our territory, and there ...? Can't you see how they stand behind the dill (despising them) as a mountain.
    2. Gormenghast
      Gormenghast 24 January 2016 09: 33 New
      +3
      Gazprom did not want to sign the so-called "energy" packages,


      Gazprom did not want to build gas pipelines, with a subsequent obligation to let them in all sorts of vanes and pitches that were not invested in construction. it unlawful restriction of ownership, in the form of limitation of the right to use and disposal of own property. In all civilized countries (including Russia), they are judged for this. If I built an apartment, I don’t have to let a Wahhabi into it, even if the Wahhabi will partially pay for the apartment.

      to protect against a monopoly on energy


      Gas is an ordinary commodity, and there is nothing to come up with special conditions for it. Do you want to buy - build a gas terminal and buy LNG, or look for a seller and build the pipeline itself. Everything is simple; there is no monopoly, there is a desire not to pay (for the construction of infrastructure). All packages are intended to unlawfully infringe on Gazprom.

      sell it privately


      The packaged Baltic states illegally forced Gazprom to sell transportation assets. Made to sell! This is unthinkable, this is eastern despotism, and not democracy at all. And, in general, in civilized countries (to which the gang of European troglodytes does not apply), there is freedom of economic activity - I want it, and I mine and sell myself. No one has the right to dictate. Even cavemen themselves killed mammoths and distributed their meat themselves. There were no packages.
  26. drags33
    drags33 23 January 2016 10: 56 New
    +4
    dill - damned unfinished with an artificially created (not created ...) nation, which is currently ruled by Satanists. And it is impossible to expect something good from them by definition. It is necessary to work with them "hard", breaking all their "wishes" and debut notions. The only way!!!
  27. borys
    borys 23 January 2016 10: 59 New
    15
    Already said here, but I will not be too lazy to repeat. The culprits of this gas
    almost 100% of the phantasmagoria are Kremlin and Gazprom figures
    90s. How could you conclude gas supply contracts with euro-
    consumers in Russia, if Russia had no formal legal
    What are the possibilities to control the passage of gas through the pipe? Elementary
    common sense tells a different scheme. Sell ​​gas to the outskirts (and only
    her) upon payment, do not conclude contracts with any Europeans.
    as Europeans need Russian gas, they wouldn’t go anywhere,
    would bathe at the outskirts. In this case, the Europeans would not have any formal
    grounds to make a claim to Russia. Accordingly, the Europeans were
    vitally interested in the presence of a sane government in Kiev.
    Incidentally, today you can switch to such a scheme. State
    February 2014 coup is a force majeure circumstance and gives
    Russia's full right to revise the agreements that are still in force for the last
    gas rate to Europe.
    1. epsilon571
      epsilon571 23 January 2016 16: 27 New
      +2
      borys uz today
      Elementary common sense tells another scheme. Sell ​​gas to the outskirts (and only) upon payment, do not conclude contracts with any Europeans.
      as Europeans need Russian gas, they wouldn’t go anywhere,
      would bathe at the outskirts. In this case, the Europeans would not have any formal
      grounds to make a claim to Russia.


      Your idea is correct, but Ukraine will not agree to this, because in order to be a seller you need to have a store. In other words, it is necessary to repair the gas transmission system at its own expense, build new hubs, and most importantly, all this must be coordinated with the EU. It is much easier to transfer your GTS to reverse mode and include it in the general GTS of Europe, which, by the way, they are trying to do. Why do they care when prices for Russian gas are steadily declining, because according to Gazprom's contracts they are tied to oil prices.

      If you look at the statistics, it’s like this: in 2015, the price of gas was $ 238 per thousand cubic meters, and the year before last 349. In a word, we set a trap for ourselves, and the reason (as you say) is the short-sightedness and greed of the Kremlin figures, and I I completely agree with you.

      The article that we are discussing today is correct, although it is perceived painfully, but cannot be otherwise - it cannot be good for everyone !. Gas prices are falling, but we know that it is not free. Gas is extracted later with the blood of our comrades, and so far there is no other alternative for me to quote the article:
      "..All" gas wars "with Ukraine are a complete and concrete absurdity. Is there a need for gas? Buy .."
    2. Saratoga833
      Saratoga833 23 January 2016 19: 34 New
      +3
      Quote: borys
      February 2014 coup is a force majeure circumstance and gives
      Russia's full right to revise the agreements that are still in force for the last
      gas rate to Europe.

      While Putin is in power, this will never happen! To revise the treaty, political will is needed, which I do not observe with Putin.
  28. vladimirvn
    vladimirvn 23 January 2016 11: 12 New
    +2
    ".. The example with Mercedes is not accidental" .. Probably the case with Opel was meant. So, why are you surprised? request Surprising is the criminal stupidity of ours, which they gave. fool Forecasters !!!!
  29. Earnest
    Earnest 23 January 2016 11: 21 New
    +2
    Quote: avg-mgn
    Suddenly, Mosk-al says:
    - Crest, it seems to me that you and I have eaten up shit for free?

    In fact, from childhood I remember that two Ukrainians appeared in a joke. And a hundred rubles. Take and exchange heroes for Moldovans, in accordance with the flag of the respected avg-mgn?
  30. The comment was deleted.
  31. OlegV
    OlegV 23 January 2016 11: 32 New
    12
    Evrohokhlam from Eurocat
  32. gergi
    gergi 23 January 2016 12: 25 New
    +3
    To give money does not mean to buy loyalty. You can’t play their cards with cheaters, you need to create your own and not look back from barking pseudo-free shit democracy.
    1. Lelek
      Lelek 23 January 2016 19: 49 New
      0
      Quote: gergi
      To give money does not mean to buy loyalty.


      This is understood even by American generals, but again - retired. The establishment is oppressing its scum line.
      (cry.)
  33. NordUral
    NordUral 23 January 2016 12: 40 New
    +1
    And what else to expect from the advanced storytellers of the 21st century? At the end of the 20th we were led by the much more primitive idea of ​​fabulous capitalism. Now they have explained to us for whom he is a fairy tale, and for whom it is a difficult reality with the infamous thieves' oligarchy in power and an unclear, but frightening, future.
  34. atamankko
    atamankko 23 January 2016 12: 40 New
    +1
    It's time to seriously respond to all the vile antics of our Ukrainian enemies.
  35. tehnokrat
    tehnokrat 23 January 2016 13: 40 New
    +5
    "... I'm offended for the State"

    Quote: LPD17
    So far, they have not even shown themselves to sue Ukraine to sue. What did they expect in the Kremlin? Return lards? So you know that the goblins did not register this debt in the budget? Is it criminal? Dizziness or crime? Why didn’t they just close the border with the malicious and evil payer? Why hundreds why? And these gentlemen, after all, for the elections in the fall. Vote for the traitors and the thugs with thieves?


    "+++"!
    I support you and support just such an approach!
    About the application to the court strictly, severely, they spoke even before the New Year;
    now new news: until the end of January ...
    Shaw, do you still hang around with the kurshavels ?! Do not move away? Oh yes, sorry, the crisis, once ...

    To recover debts from a private person, if not the oligarch - a million ways, but for the State - it will wait! ...
    Cut off gas, el. for non-payment, eviction - everything is quickly possible, but for the State?
    Ehhhh, you, the country! ..
  36. robbihood
    robbihood 23 January 2016 13: 48 New
    0
    Ten years ago, Gazprom was doing well. It had the world's largest natural gas reserves, and Moscow was about to lead the GXNUMX for six months. She chose "energy security" as the leitmotif of her presidency. It seemed that Gazprom was in the ideal position to present itself as a reliable alternative to Middle Eastern suppliers, writes The Financial Times.

    And then he shut off gas to Ukraine.

    Ten years later, those events look like an outstanding sabotage against themselves. Especially after Gazprom resorted to the same step in 2009, which affected gas supplies further to the EU. The concern severely damaged its reputation as a reliable partner, which has been nurtured since Soviet times, and made Europe realize that Russia is using energy resources as a weapon.

    It seems that Moscow was confident that the West would blame Kiev for what happened, which refused to agree to a significant increase in prices. And Europe and the United States regarded this as revenge for the democratic "orange revolution" that took place in Ukraine in 2004. For the first time since the Cold War, Russia has placed geopolitics above economic interests. The result was not long in coming: “if in 2008 the market value of Gazprom reached $ 365 billion, today it is about $ 38 billion.

    "10.06.2008
    Miller believes that Gazprom will become the world's largest joint-stock company within seven to eight years, by which time Gazprom's capitalization will reach $ 360 trillion versus $ XNUMX billion at present. "
    But outwitted themselves. And we have what we have. 38 billion dollars instead of 1 trillion It is called trade in Millerovsky.
    1. Phantom Revolution
      Phantom Revolution 23 January 2016 20: 54 New
      +3
      Quote: robbihood
      But outwitted themselves. And we have what we have. 38 billion dollars instead of 1 trillion It is called trade in Millerovsky.

      132 billion dollars at the moment. Regarding gas, the Europeans only needed an excuse, a clue with which they could accuse the Russian Federation of blackmail and push other companies of the USA and Saudis (as now the sanctions, "if Ukraine had not come up with it").
  37. boroda64
    boroda64 23 January 2016 14: 31 New
    -4
    ......
    - almost - 90% - fantasy
    - what is printed in Russia
    - written by authors from Ukraine
    / it is a fact/
  38. iouris
    iouris 23 January 2016 15: 38 New
    +2
    Firstly, in this "fairyland", not all the people live, but the top "ten thousand", the rest simply do not have enough available resources.
    Secondly, it is easy for us to reason, and there is a global system of surveillance, identification and prosecution of people who do not agree with the "general opinion". Moreover, the principle operates: no man - no problem.
    Thirdly, no one canceled the principle: "look for who benefits." Beneficial to the oligarchs who privatized the USSR. But oligarchs are just agents. Subjectivity is in Washington.
    Finally, why is it all started? All debts are virtual. The real debt is in the USA. They owe all of humanity. The US will not be able to pay off creditors, so they shake and even destroy "bad" friends in order to support "good" friends. But the balance of friends changes all the time. ISIS and Ukraine are projects to rob bad friends of the United States.
    1. revnagan
      revnagan 25 January 2016 12: 31 New
      -1
      Quote: iouris
      "look for who benefits." Beneficial to the oligarchs who privatized the USSR.

      I’m here about this I want to quote from the article. So:
      “At the same time, the system is quite tough: Russia faced it in the 90s, when it was forced to pay off the all-Union debts from a half-empty budget. The slogan was:“ Die, but pay! ”In the early 90s, our German“ partners ” stated about our debts rather harshly and briefly: “The debts must be paid.” And the point is that the fact that, for example, a plant in Ukraine (now sovereign) or a port in the Baltic was built for the amount of the loan did not bother anyone. - it was more convenient for them. We were popularly explained that the "civilized world" has its own rules of the game and they must be strictly observed, the only way we can achieve respect and prosperity. Yes, it is difficult, yes, it hurts in places, but it's worth it. Well, Russia played by these rules and successfully: paid off the debts of the USSR and even came out in plus. "
      I want to ask a question: what about the debts to the population of the USSR? Let me remind you: there was no Sberbank of Belarus (for example) under the USSR. Sberbank of Lithuania, Ukraine, the RSFSR. All citizens of the USSR kept their savings in the Sberbank of the USSR. In Moscow. These are billions of full-fledged Soviet rubles secured by state assets. And then they suddenly disappeared somewhere, and in Russia, oligarchs like Abramovich or Berezovsky suddenly appeared. Coincidence? I don’t think so! laughing So here it’s offsetting. The plant may have been built in Ukraine for the money of the USSR, but billions of savings of Ukrainian citizens remained in Moscow. So everything is fair.
  39. Karabin
    Karabin 23 January 2016 16: 49 New
    +5
    Our mistake is that we perceive Ukrainians as a completely European civilized nation,

    The mistake is that we, from Lenin's revolution to Putin's "stability", perceive the so-called Ukrainians as a nation, and not as schismatics of the Russian World. Everything else is a consequence of this cause.
  40. samarin1969
    samarin1969 23 January 2016 16: 51 New
    11
    To whom is the author trying to address a yellowed statement of facts?
    Infantile to our ministers?
    Cynical Dzhareskam?
    Our people who earned 3 billion, who profiled Shuvalov and K?
    Ukrainians who 98% want to see my Crimea deserted?
    Lavrov, who is forced to pretend to believe in "international law"?

    I would like to ask (a respected author, economic guru of the government, anyone else ...): what did Russia do real to return funds ... Just don't talk about "international" Irish "law" ... Except for Russia and its lawyers no one observes ... It's time to send your Sudoplatovs and Skorzeny, block the Kerch Strait, give weapons to the "good bad guys"

    ... And Gref is really a ward of livestock farming.
    1. Olezhek
      23 January 2016 17: 38 New
      -1
      Our people who earned 3 billion, who profiled Shuvalov and K?


      Do not be so naive - everything is not so simple and straightforward ...

      3 lard raccoons have become the cause for global financial squabbling ...

      Learn! hi
      1. samarin1969
        samarin1969 23 January 2016 18: 28 New
        +1
        I envy your awareness, I did not notice the "squabble"
        1. Olezhek
          23 January 2016 18: 53 New
          0
          A fundamental change in the rules of the IMF - is it, nonsense?
          1. samarin1969
            samarin1969 23 January 2016 21: 11 New
            +1
            For Russia, "changing the rules of the IMF" is a problem, for the United States, the field for maneuver has been expanded, I did not notice the "squabble" between the founders, enlighten ... hi
  41. palm
    palm 23 January 2016 17: 14 New
    +2
    Ukraine as a state 404 should disappear. The Kremlin’s stupidity in recognizing Ukraine. 3 billion is not a pity. There is no Ukraine and there are no problems associated with it
  42. The comment was deleted.
  43. rus-5819
    rus-5819 23 January 2016 19: 49 New
    0
    Sign a contract, pay money and get gas. Russia has never refused to sell gas to Ukraine
    The formula "commodity-money-commodity" has not yet been canceled, only the "404s" have contrived to eat bacon and not get into a mousetrap with the consent and connivance of Europe.

    The West tacitly allowed them to "gas the pipe
    And Gazprom was forced to increase supplies to cover the "shortage" of "freezing Europe"!

    here the West makes a “horseback ride”: no, they don’t invest billions in the re-equipment of industry in these countries,

    And to sell them a "pipe" to the border with Russia, let them be engaged in transit through 404!
  44. KRIG55
    KRIG55 23 January 2016 22: 32 New
    +5
    To enable Europe to winter one winter with American shale gas and everything will settle down right away. There will be a lot of howling and stench, but since they can afford to change the rules of the game, then they will bear it from us. Any gesture of goodwill is perceived by everyone as weakness, any rudeness with their sides are like a victory. For some reason, all of us are led to the idea that the buyer dictates the conditions. In winter, heat the euro and the hryvnia and you will be happy.
  45. Earnest
    Earnest 23 January 2016 22: 54 New
    0
    Quote: boroda64
    - almost - 90% - fantasy
    - what is printed in Russia
    - written by authors from Ukraine
    / it is a fact/

    I rephrase this:
    90% of fantasy sales by Ukrainian authors go to Russia. On whose money these famous and beloved people live / create, we all know. But there are almost no stoned ones among them - except, perhaps, Surkov (not "that one", but a lesser-known one, which Alexander) has already smelled, demanding the duet Oldie to leave for Russia, following the Dyachenki and Zorichi https: // www .opentown.org / news / 62375 /.
  46. Riv
    Riv 24 January 2016 06: 25 New
    0
    How is it in "Zvirmarillion"? "It's a very sad story. In general, everyone died."
  47. nemec55
    nemec55 24 January 2016 08: 47 New
    +2
    The bottom line is that the whole Western elite holds us (Russia) for suckers, and this is natural for the actions of our elected people are an occasion for us to think so for our citizens. Second, it’s a shame for our people that we have endured something to always rake for all the failures of our politicians. Where is cheap gas and in every village house where there is cheap gas ???? Why does someone not pay someone we help someone we write off debts and people lived lives in poverty. I live a hundred kilometers from the city to work, I wound up in the city, I work 60 hours a week and they tell me on TV that we residents of Russia do not work much (scum).
    Just as people spread rot and they spread rot, and they themselves carry hari according to the curls, this is the essence of fear for their hard-working people traveling abroad, and for dogs they don’t live in a village where there is no water, no gas and no road only in winter.
    1. Victor Demchenko
      Victor Demchenko 25 January 2016 13: 24 New
      0
      Quote: nemec55
      and roads only in winter.

      and then on the third day after a snowstorm ... when they trample and it is not a fact that they will trample. then the road workers did not bring diesel fuel from the emirates, then the Ministry of Emergencies lipistricia ended ... belay in general, the northern furry animal is slowly starting to sneak up on us ... repeat
  48. vic58
    vic58 25 January 2016 08: 59 New
    0
    And then say, if: "Cleaner baba Nyura = manager for the ecology of the office (namely the office) AV Tarakanova."!?!
    It's just that, having seen enough of Der-May, "everyone wants more respect ... not for knowledge, but for the title of the position!
    Example: We have such a "Baba Nyura" (54 years old, 2 higher) working for us, they have appointed an office ecology manager (24 years old, PTU named after Down) ... but she knows PC! How !?! request
  49. BARKHAN
    BARKHAN 25 January 2016 12: 18 New
    +2
    I read the article with pleasure. Thanks to the author. It is not always possible for the authors to express their thoughts intelligibly and in simple words. So Ukraine has passed into another reality too long ago. I also had a version about the external impact on the collective mind of this country.
    But the most interesting thing is that they have no way out. Although in Europe, even in Russia no one is able to help them. Well, who, tell me, wants to pull 40 million parasites on the hump? After all, investing in the Ukrainian economy will require astronomical amounts now, and this is no guarantee of success. It's just a huge stone on the neck for any economy.
    And in order to pacify the entire scale of the armed that is bubbling inside the country, you need to shed a lot of blood, and then for a long time to repress the embryos of resistance. Who needs this?
    And I really, I sincerely wish Ukraine to join the EU. And tomorrow too. They should be together during this period of history, they both deserve it.
    Sodomites, migrants, juveniles, Charlie, konchitavyurst ... this is such a lure ...
  50. Horn
    Horn 25 January 2016 12: 20 New
    0
    How do you imagine commodity-money relations “according to Marx” with a fabulous folk?

    - In fact, sometimes it’s enough not even to hire a collector, but simply to sell the debt to the agency. And if the collection office is also Chechen ...