Media: Russian equipment, dismantled with the "Mistral", delivered to the Leningrad region at the expense of France

All Russian equipment previously installed on the “Mistral” delivered to Vyborg at the expense of the French side, the act of reception and transmission will be signed in the coming days, reports Look with reference to tass.

“All equipment was dismantled and sent to Russia, on December 13 it arrived by sea in Vyborg. In the next day or two, representatives of the Saint-Nazaire shipyard will arrive in Vyborg to check the integrity of the cargo, then customs clearance will begin, after which the act of acceptance will be signed, ”a military diplomatic source told the agency.

“A total of eleven 20-ton containers and two oversized loads were delivered - platforms with large antennas,” he said.

“Among these cargoes is the Russian combat control system, previously associated with the French combat control system SENIT-9,” the source added.

“The question of using this equipment by Egypt is still open,” he said. “If the Egyptians do not buy this equipment, it will be used on Russian warships.”

The source also noted that "the Russian Mistral crews were disbanded, the sailors were distributed to other ships."

Comments

[The black]

Without a sucker - life is bad ... thanks to Uncle Hollande, who, due to his undisguised servility to Obama, missed a lucrative contract, and managed to get burned out on it.

[Sterlya]

The French are whores who have tarnished us and their heads with these Mistrals. Let only ours decide what else to buy, order from them. I will laugh for a long time.

[MIKHALYCH1]

Quote: Sterlya

The French are whores who have tarnished us and their heads with these Mistrals. Let only ours decide what else to buy, order from them. I will laugh for a long time.

And I’m even glad, to be honest! We ourselves know how to build .. It’s easier to buy, of course, but such a farce-walrus can happen (as with Ukraine)! Everything is going fine ...

[oleg-gr]

The epic with the Mistrals is over. Well, thank God. Let them load the capacity of domestic shipbuilders.

[Dr. Bormental]

Actually, either the bow or the stern was made in St. Petersburg at the Admiralty Shipyards. Let them give it back (bow or stern)! Here!

[Extraneous]

the epic with the "Mistrals" is only in full swing. They are now in the region where they should have been. Egypt received them with the consent of Russia and will have to "buy" from Russia and "stuffing" and helicopters, and "subscribe" to service and training of l / s. Which, in essence, means control over the use of these vessels by Russia.
An attempt to attract other manufacturers to the equipment of these pelvis is doomed to failure. they were originally made for Russian insides and tasks. Unprofitable project.
The whole story with the transfer of the Mistral to Egypt was initially oriented to Russia. I will not be surprised that the Americans do not object to such a statement in principle. They needed only a delay in putting these vessels into operation. In the future, they are called upon to carry out police operations in the BV region, which is subject to a complete redistribution between the main players. In this scenario, Russia is given the role of a counterweight to Iranian influence, which will allow the Anglo-Saxons to focus on countering China.

[Nyrobsky]

Quote: Stranger

In this scenario, Russia is given the role of a counterweight to Iranian influence, which will allow the Anglo-Saxons to focus on countering China.

Here I do not agree with you)))
The fact that the mattresses will oppose China is, of course, an indisputable fact, but the fact that the mattresses so easily assign Russia the role of a counterweight to Iran, here you gave a blunder.
The question is, why then did the United States rock the whole region for so many years? In order to ditch Hussein and Gaddafi, thousands of their soldiers and a diplomat, rocking Syria, spawning ISIS and investing in it hundreds of millions of dollars to transfer the flag of the leader in the Russian region?
I do not see the logic.
Zigzag with Mistral, for mattresses was important in terms of demonstrating its influence in Europe and nothing more. The fact that this project was beneficial for Russia only in terms of obtaining technologies and no more, is also a fact.
Everyone understands that their further use would be burdensome for the budget of the RF Ministry of Defense, and therefore Oland's trick with his ears with the refusal to transfer them was perceived with "understanding." with a sigh of relief. Note that Russia did not file a claim to the court for the payment of a penalty. The French returned the funds actually spent, dismantled the equipment at their own expense and paid for the delivery of the equipment to the owner.
Here recently, Oland said that he was counting on cooperation with Russia in shipbuilding and receiving orders from it !!!
Is Vorpros a joke or schizophrenia?

[Extraneous]

: o) Not Hochma or schizophrenia.
The whole story with the "mistrals" is sewn with white threads. It is Russia that benefits from France's refusal to supply Mistrals. Russia itself could not refuse - it would have to pay dearly. So the "political stupidity" of the French government, so convenient for us, was organized. As a result, the money was returned to us and the pelvis was transferred to a country that is in no way able to bring it to mind without the help of Russia. Any technologically developed country will not undertake this project due to its focus specifically on Russian equipment and weapons. Alteration will cost more than building new pelvis.
The only ones who can take on this are China. And here the states are already very opposed.
Regarding Iran ... Have you ever wondered - why suddenly the states decided to lift sanctions from Iran and bring it to the big stage?
The fact that the states destroyed BV does not mean that they do not need control over this region. Israel is too unacceptable for the Arabs. Turkey is too tied to Europe and poorly predicted. Saudis - conduct their own policy and the states do not like it already because it is its own, and not theirs. All that remains is to blow up the region, which will strengthen the dollar and delay the time of its collapse. And for this it is necessary to bring large players to the field: Iran and Russia.
It is now that Iran and I have partially coincided interests in Syria. But very soon they will become very opposite. Not only in the BV, but also in Central Asia and in the Caucasus.

[Hon]

Are you a specialist in military equipment? Do you know for sure that no other equipment besides Russian can be delivered? And they probably studied the contact, because you know all its conditions.

[Tor5]

So - we will sell to Egypt, or whoever buys these boxes there.

[Homo]

Nobody yet. Just going.

[79807420129]

As they say - "Maxim died, and the devil is with him" One thing is now clear that the real French like de Gaulle, there are no more tolerant Charlie Hebdo.

[Nyrobsky]

Quote: 79807420129

As they say - "Maxim died, and the devil is with him" One thing is now clear that the real French like de Gaulle, there are no more tolerant Charlie Hebdo.

You are so vain.
There is one "man" there, really a woman)))
Marie Le Pen - future president of France.
There, when it becomes very tight, an aunt appears and saves France. Only they do not value them. So Jeanne d, Ark surrendered to the British for burning in 1431.

[Hon]

The plant received a lucrative contract from the United States, which compensates for all losses. Mistrals were sold, a small penalty was paid. Why is Oladnd so hot?

[venaya]

Here is the question, really and how to more rationally use this equipment. It is possible that the best solution would be to sell it to the Egyptians, if not yet found another application.

[Vladimir 1964]

Quote: venaya

Here is the question, really and how to more rationally use this equipment.

Probably really, colleague, this is a question, since unfortunately we are not building ships of comparable size to the Mistrals at the moment. In general, if I understand correctly, the "stuffing" of each ship is created for specific tasks and dimensions of the ship.

[Dr. Bormental]

But Taburetkin gave money for the rollback of jabo-eaters for these Mistrals or hooted?
In general, I like him to look at the helicopter theme ... maybe in childhood I wanted to become a helicopter pilot? ..

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Dr. Bormental

But Taburetkin gave days for the rollback to the frogs for these Mistals or hooted?

And what does the stool have to do with it? He did not decide the issue of the Mistral contract.
We still have the Minister of Defense can not independently order 2 ships in the country of NATO.

[Dr. Bormental]

So you want to say that without his influence, this happened? The Minister of Defense does not decide how to support this defense (or rather the collapse of the defense)?

[Extraneous]

The Minister of Defense is a performer, and nothing more. He can voice someone’s wishes for making a strategic decision, but he cannot accept them.

[Dr. Bormental]

I don’t know why you are justifying him. Personally, I who work directly with the Ministry of Defense can express a general opinion (both mine and my colleagues) that he should have been tried for undermining the state’s defense.

[Max otto]

There it was like this: Sarkozy helped to extinguish the wave from Russia's actions in Georgia, for which Medvedev promised to do something useful for them, the order of two Mistrals turned out to be useful. Like compensation for services, so the top management ruled here, and chose the least useless option (if you look closely, there is nothing special to take from France for money. Their auto industry has long been in Russia, in space, nuclear power, aircraft construction and tank construction, they even behind Russia.Shipbuilding is the only thing that can be taken from them), therefore, the Ministry of Defense simply decided what type of ships to order and no more.

[Altona]

Something like that too "civilized" decided the question - the deal was thwarted, the ships were razed.

[staryivoin]

Interestingly, Monsieur Hollande will pay the expenses of the Saint-Nazar shipyard out of his own pocket. Or does the French budget include "default" costs? Or maybe the State Department is already paying for "free France" ??? Well, isn't it interesting?
For some, freedom is to fight the world's "evil" in the form of ISIS. For some, the freedom to drop bombs anywhere (a hospital in Kunduz, a residential area in Syria ... but you never know the USAF had "freedom") - after all, the USA is also a "free country" ...
But after all, Albert Camus, such a Frenchman, said - "Freedom is, first of all, not privileges, but duties."
And then something with responsibilities in a mattress country today is bad ...

[Hon]

The USA helped, the contract was a big one, so the plant with good profit

[Max otto]

Quote: Hon

The USA helped, the contract was a big one, so the plant with good profit

The shipyard paid off its debts by prepaying for the American contract, it still needs to be worked out, so there is no profit and cannot be. Upon completion of the American contract, the shipyard will again find itself in the same hole as it was and with the same debts, until they get their Mistrals in to someone and receive money for them. Even it does not matter with your accounting.

[Hon]

Quote: Max Otto

Shipyard repaid its debts with prepayment for an American contract

where do you get this information from?

Quote: Max Otto

Upon completion of the American contract, the shipyard will again be in the same pit as it was with the same debts

and in which pit was the shipyard?

[Max otto]

Quote: Hon

where do you get this information from?

How everything is running then! You are a specific humanitarian.
I am depicting the basics of any activity for naive children:
To engage in ships you need from large things:
1. To buy sheet metal and profile rolled products of a huge assortment, a cloud of welding wire and electrodes, tons of hardware (bolts and nuts in Russian), no one will give it for nothing, you have to pay for them;
2. Pay for electricity, because this iron must be bent, cut and cooked, and it must be light and clean in the production itself;
3. We need a huge assortment of related chemistry: fluxes, primers, paints, varnishes. Cable production tons and electrical equipment are also tons;
4. And yet you can’t do it all with your bare hands and with a bare booty, you need special clothing and tools, huge cranes need to be serviced because the equipment works forever without repairs only for humanities, for engineers it is serviced in accordance with the regulations. This is all called overhead;
5. And still there are such terrible things as the salary fund, taxes, social insurance and medical insurance, payments there can finally be held back.
For this, there is working capital at any enterprise, but you are not in the know, I believe what it is, google it.

Quote: Hon

and in which pit was the shipyard?

Almost all over the world, a standard contract for such large items provides for an advance payment of 50 to 80%. These are practically the rules of good form in business. The final settlement usually occurs when 100% is ready. Those. in 50-20% of the finished product, the manufacturer invests his money, which is never superfluous. (specifically for the "Mistrals" the feed was made in St. Petersburg, since it remains in France anyway, you just need to pay for it). So, the humanist, this feed, as well as the payment for dismantling the equipment, ate all the working capital of this shipyard. And now there is nothing to pay salaries, pay for electricity, water and materials received. This is all understandable to any materially thinking person, here you don't even need to read the news, why you have such questions is incomprehensible to me, or rather understandable, a humanitarian.

[Hon]

Quote: Max Otto

How everything is running then! You are a specific humanitarian.
I am depicting the basics of any activity for naive children:
To engage in ships you need from large things:
1. To buy sheet metal and profile rolled products of a huge assortment, a cloud of welding wire and electrodes, tons of hardware (bolts and nuts in Russian), no one will give it for nothing, you have to pay for them;
2. Pay for electricity, because this iron must be bent, cut and cooked, and it must be light and clean in the production itself;
3. We need a huge assortment of related chemistry: fluxes, primers, paints, varnishes. Cable production tons and electrical equipment are also tons;
4. And yet you can’t do it all with your bare hands and with a bare booty, you need special clothing and tools, huge cranes need to be serviced because the equipment works forever without repairs only for humanities, for engineers it is serviced in accordance with the regulations. This is all called overhead;
5. And still there are such terrible things as the salary fund, taxes, social insurance and medical insurance, payments there can finally be held back.
For this, there is working capital at any enterprise, but you are not in the know, I believe what it is, google it.

Well, ok, is there a cost of the contract that costs end-to-end? profit is not pledged? in fact, Egypt takes ships not much cheaper than Russia, despite the fact that Russia was supposed to transfer technologies, I believe that the cost of these technologies was very significant in the price of the Mistrals.
You estimate the cost of the ship only on the basis of costs, often the remuneration of the manufacturer very much exceeds the cost of goods.
The French got a very profitable contract, plus they still have ships for which there are already buyers.
You talk with confidence about the financial problems of the shipyard, without seeing their accounting documents.

[Max otto]

I talk about the financial problems of the shipyard because I clearly understand the organization, economy and functioning of any production facilities, and in the technological part I have a thorough understanding of construction and woodworking, I have such a job and have a lot of experience. Salary costs, for example, in prime cost range from 8-14%, on average, taxes and various mandatory contributions from 25 to 65%, depending on the country. Typical profits in heavy industry are in the amount of 5-17% higher you do, you just do not sell the product, it will be expensive. The above can only be in construction (in the most kosher legal cases, up to 25%, in illegal and up to 60%), pharmaceuticals and drug trafficking (which is also, in principle, pharmaceuticals) can be from 10% to 1000%, in the energy sector profit can be from 3 up to 60% (everything is very complicated and confusing here, since tariffs for industrial sectors and consumers are not only different, they differ by season and time of consumption, the devil will break his leg there).
As for the big money, you miscalculate it. You consider them at the level of a small man and his wallet. In business, everything counts differently. For example, the same "Mistrals" have been ready for over a year already. 1,2 billion euros is in the air, this money is not invested in the subsequent turnover, i.e. not received from them (1,2 billion euros multiplied by 1,1 (let's say 10% of the profit, we take so little so as not to upset our French partners) = 1,32 billion euros, we consider the lost profit: 1,32 billion - 1,2, 120 billion = XNUMX million euros - this is the most direct losses of the shipyard at the very minimum. If you add more legal services and costs for dismantling and transportation costs, then millions of losses keep growing and growing monthly. This figure can be safely multiplied by two, since these the ships were frozen for at least another year.

[Hon]

Quote: Max Otto

Almost all over the world, a standard contract for such large items provides for an advance payment of 50 to 80%. These are practically the rules of good form in business. The final settlement usually occurs when 100% is ready. Those. in 50-20% of the finished product, the manufacturer invests his money, which is never superfluous. (specifically for the "Mistrals" the feed was made in St. Petersburg, since it remains in France anyway, you just need to pay for it). So, the humanist, this feed, as well as the payment for dismantling the equipment, ate all the working capital of this shipyard. And now there is nothing to pay salaries, pay for electricity, water and materials received. This is all understandable to any materially thinking person, here you don't even need to read the news, why you have such questions is incomprehensible to me, or rather understandable, a humanitarian.

can you give an example of a contract indicating the exact cost of costs inherent in the price of profit, terms of payment?

[Max otto]

I gave you the typical numbers above.
For your information, from what you ask in the contract there are only payment terms and delivery dates for the goods or services, as well as penalties (penalty) in case of violation of these same terms. Costs are taken into account in the planned costing for products, which are a purely internal document of the organization and are not subject to disclosure, although it is not a secret. This value is aggregated based on the experience of the operation of a particular enterprise (because it depends on the material intensity, energy intensity of the degree of mechanization of production and many other factors). If you are interested, then at any enterprise for 0,5 liters any economist from the planning department will give you a detailed calculation for any product of this enterprise (he really won’t understand why, but he will give it). It just won’t give a darma, but there’s another reason - just in case, you never know what you’re up to. Find the typical costing on the Internet, practice the production economics, this is interesting.

[Hon]

Well, where is the cost of materials and work in your numbers? What is the size of the fines? Talk about costing. Can you show this very kalyukulyatsiya?

[Max otto]

What will the cost of materials and the amount of penalties give you? Show you a calculation on the Mistral or what? You have clung to this something, but this is not relevant, I showed you how to calculate direct losses, in fact, nothing else is needed. Think about these lines again:

In business, everything counts differently. For example, the same "Mistrals" have been ready for more than a year. 1,2 billion euros is in the air, this money is not invested in the subsequent turnover, i.e. not received from them (1,2 billion euros multiplied by 1,1 (let's say 10% of the profit, we take so little so as not to upset our French partners) = 1,32 billion euros, we consider the lost profit: 1,32 billion - 1,2, 120 billion = XNUMX million euros - this is the most direct losses of the shipyard at the very minimum

About 0,5 and economists and about costing, I will not explain anything. You and simpler things still do not understand.
You remind me of Starikov, he also talks about everything, but he doesn’t understand anything specifically, so just slogans and general phrases without specifics come out.

[Hon]

And what kind of enterprises are these, where economists work for 0,5 liters? Chet, I doubt that such economists can give out something worthwhile.

[sober]

RP: Of course, yes. This is a control point, a helicopter-based platform, and much more. This, of course, is a lot. Just the SENIT-9 system - we can say the most valuable thing that is on Mistral, and Russia, of course, does not want to overpay
R.P-Roman Pukhov. Director of the Center for Analysis and Strategies.


So the boats then shit turns ??

[individual]

What is that?
Russia allowed the French to poke around in more than 11 20-ton containers of our military equipment?

[Extraneous]

Quote: individ

What is that?
Russia allowed the French to poke around in more than 11 20-ton containers of our military equipment?

There is nothing top-secret in those containers. Everything that does not need to be declassified, should have been installed already in Russia.

[atamankko]

Again, the United States giggles maliciously.

[TOR2]

And as you know, such ships should be 4, and 2 should be built at our shipyards. It will be interesting to build or how?

[Zubr]

Quote: TOR2

And as you know, such ships should be 4, and 2 should be built at our shipyards. It will be interesting to build or how?

Most likely no. Under the terms of the contract, France, in place with the Mistrals, was to transfer a complete set of technical (executive) documentation. Well, since the deal failed, it is unlikely. Specifications for materials, steel grades, technology. These are all things calculated, given that the internal structure of the building and the plan of the premises are redesigned to our requirements. Let's just say, not a typical performance.

[sounddoc]

Quote: MIKHALYCHXNNX

Quote: Sterlya

The French are whores who have tarnished us and their heads with these Mistrals. Let only ours decide what else to buy, order from them. I will laugh for a long time.

And I’m even glad, to be honest! We ourselves know how to build .. It’s easier to buy, of course, but such a farce-walrus can happen (as with Ukraine)! Everything is going fine ...

I especially liked the phrase "FARS-major" ... You can't say more precisely! I add it with all my heart))))

[sounddoc]

Quote: Nyrobsky

Quote: Stranger

In this scenario, Russia is given the role of a counterweight to Iranian influence, which will allow the Anglo-Saxons to focus on countering China.

Here I do not agree with you)))
The fact that the mattresses will oppose China is, of course, an indisputable fact, but the fact that the mattresses so easily assign Russia the role of a counterweight to Iran, here you gave a blunder.
The question is, why then did the United States rock the whole region for so many years? In order to ditch Hussein and Gaddafi, thousands of their soldiers and a diplomat, rocking Syria, spawning ISIS and investing in it hundreds of millions of dollars to transfer the flag of the leader in the Russian region?
I do not see the logic.
Zigzag with Mistral, for mattresses was important in terms of demonstrating its influence in Europe and nothing more. The fact that this project was beneficial for Russia only in terms of obtaining technologies and no more, is also a fact.
Everyone understands that their further use would be burdensome for the budget of the RF Ministry of Defense, and therefore Oland's trick with his ears with the refusal to transfer them was perceived with "understanding." with a sigh of relief. Note that Russia did not file a claim to the court for the payment of a penalty. The French returned the funds actually spent, dismantled the equipment at their own expense and paid for the delivery of the equipment to the owner.
Here recently, Oland said that he was counting on cooperation with Russia in shipbuilding and receiving orders from it !!!
Is Vorpros a joke or schizophrenia?

Subtle French humor? Glamorous)))))

[Wolka]

yes everything is fine, from the very beginning this transaction caused a lot of controversy, the grandmothers returned, now the main thing is the gained experience, gentlemen, we have acquired it, and now we can build it ourselves, and similar floating suitcases today unfortunately yesterday, time requires different performance characteristics large landing ships and floating bases, because the approaches and concepts in construction should be reviewed and go to a more advanced new level, but we can ...