Military Review

Turkish armored vehicles ... In spite of everything

29

Altay became the first major combat a tankcreated in Turkey. After testing four prototypes, an order for 250 production vehicles is expected to be issued. The main armament of the tank - 120-mm smooth-bore gun L55


While many European countries have reduced their armored platform industry, and in some cases have completely abandoned their capacity to develop and manufacture such vehicles, Turkey is moving in the opposite direction.

Otokar and FNSS Savunma Sistemleri originally developed and manufactured armored combat vehicles (BBMs) only for the Turkish armed forces, but now both have become global players in a competitive export market, securing significant sales in Africa, Asia and the Middle East.

Otokar Company

For many years, Otokar was the largest manufacturer of wheeled armored vehicles in Turkey, but now has shifted its priorities somewhat and entered a more complex, but potentially profitable tracked field.

Otokar General Manager Serdar Gorgiu said: “We have been working in the defense industry for more than 28 years since our first tactical armored vehicle was manufactured for Turkey. Today, our machines are operated on five continents, in 30 countries, almost by 50 operators. Feedback and expectations of our users are our guide to expanding the range of products. Today, we manufacture 4x4 tactical wheeled vehicles and 800 kg armored vehicles to 60 tons. ”

According to the results of the competition held in August 2008, Otokar won the main prize in the form of a contract worth 500 million dollars and the duration of 78,5 months for the development of the main battle tank (MBT) Altay, which is the most ambitious program on the ground weapons system implemented in Turkey . The contract provides for the design, development, testing and qualification of the Altay MBT in three stages.

The first phase began in January 2009 of the year and lasted about 18 months. It included the analysis of system requirements and the development of technical specifications. The second stage included the detailed design and manufacture of two experimental samples, which were made and first shown in November 2012 of the year.

An experimental model for testing the driving characteristics of the MTR (Mobility Test Rig) passed over 8000 km when conducting running tests on different types of terrain, and the second experimental sample for firing tests FTR (Firing Test Rig) shot over 1000 120-mm ammunition.

Following the FTR and MTR in the second half of 2014, two more experimental machines (PV1 and PV2) were made, after which acceptance tests began, which should be completed at the beginning of 2016 by troop tests.

The original contract with Otokar ended in the middle of the 2015 of the year, so it was revised in the spring, so the entire project will be completed at the beginning of the 2016 of the year. Preliminary negotiations between the Turkish Defense Industry Directorate (SSM) and Otokar continue, and at the end of 2015, the company is scheduled to sign a serial production contract and issue an 250 MBT order to the company Altay, according to which the first Altay tank will be made at the end of 2017.

In the middle of 2015, the only MBT produced in Europe (except Russia) was Krauss-Maffei Wegmann’s Leopard 2A7 tank and if additional export orders did not appear, by the end of this decade the Altay tank could become the only MBT produced in Europe . In this regard, significant export opportunities are opening up for Otokar.

The main weapon for the tank Altay full weight 68 tons is 120-mm smoothbore hand-loading gun L55, equipped with an ejection device for blowing the barrel bore, a thermoprotective barrel cover and a system for determining the curvature of the gun barrel.

Auxiliary armament consists of a 7,62-mm machine gun, paired with a gun. Another optional 7,62-mm machine gun is mounted on the roof of the turret on the left side, and the loader fires from it.

A remotely-controlled combat module (SDM), armed with an 12,7-mm machine gun, from which the commander or loader can fire, is also installed on the roof of the turret. The electric system of the turret and the gun is integrated with the fire control system (FCS), which includes stabilized commander and gunner aiming complexes.

Altay tank has a hydropneumatic suspension, which provides increased cross-country maneuverability.

The MTU EuroPowerPack power unit consists of a V-12 MTU MT 883 Ka 501 Common Rail diesel engine (develops 1500 hp power at 2700 rpm) connected to an Renk HSWL 295TM automatic transmission with five forward gears and three rear gears, and an efficient cooling systems.

According to Otokar, the power unit allows you to accelerate the Altay tank to a maximum speed of 65 km / h, the typical speed over rough terrain is 45 km / h and the cruising range for 450 km fuel.


Turkish armored vehicles ... In spite of everything

The Tulpar BBM can be equipped with a variety of combat modules, including this uninhabited Otokar Mizrak RCT turret, armed with an 30-mm cannon and an 7,62-mm machine gun paired with it

The standard equipment of the Altay serial tank will include a warning system for laser irradiation connected to groups of smoke grenade launchers, an air-conditioning system, a target identification system, an information control system and a communication system, a fire detection and fire-fighting detection system, means for overcoming a deep-water barrier ford, auxiliary power plant and all-situational situational awareness system.

Otokar began in 2011 on a proactive basis the development of a Tulpar AIFV armored infantry fighting vehicle (armored infantry fighting vehicle). Factory tests of the first prototype began in January 2013 of the year, and the first public display of the car took place at IDEF in May 2013 of the year. At the start of the 2015 of the year, during the sea trials, Tulpar AIFV traveled 3000 km both on paved roads and over rough terrain.

Serdar Gorgiu further continued: “In the 2013 year, we replenished our range of wheeled vehicles with a new tracked vehicle. The new machine was created as an equal or superior competitor to the combat vehicles of the new generation of infantry, which are being developed in the framework of similar programs of the NATO countries; Tulpar is Otokar's own development. The car is named for the mythical winged horse, who guarded the soldiers in the Turkish epic Manas. BMP Tulpar meets the requirements of the 21 century, and its characteristics allow it to work in the same battle formations with MBT. "

The first copy of the Tulpar was equipped with a remote-controlled turret Mizrak RCT (remote-controlled turret) own company Otokar, which has already passed fire tests on this chassis. The Mizrak turret is armed with an 30-mm Mk44 cannon with selective power from ATK Armament Systems and an 7,62-mm machine gun paired with it, connected to a computerized FCS. The RCT turret can also accept other weapons of the 20-40 mm.

The commander and gunner installed stabilized day / night sighting systems, which also include a laser rangefinder, the commander has a panoramic sight.

The hull of the Tulpar machine is designed in such a way that it can receive other towers and the DBMS in accordance with customer requirements. The body of the car is all-welded from armored steel with the ability to install a set of hinged composite armor that increases the level of ballistic protection.

The hull design allows you to get a large number of options for performing various combat missions, ranging from basic armored personnel carrier to specialized options, such as sanitary, engineering, command and control station, mortar transporter and armament platform. In addition to the commander, gunner and driver in the first version of the BMP Tulpar is located nine paratroopers.

The power unit consists of a Scania diesel engine with a common DI 16 fuel line power 810 hp, connected to an SAPA SP-850 automatic transmission. The power unit allows you to reach a maximum speed on the highway over 70 km / h and have a power reserve of 600 km. Hydropneumatic suspension of the machine provides excellent cross-country maneuverability.

Otokar has now also moved to larger wheel platforms, including the Arma 8x8 and 6x6 family of machines, which are highly unified to reduce the cost of full service life.

The Arma machine in the 6x6 version was first shown in the 2010 year, later four experimental machines were made, followed by the 8xXNNXX version.

Otokar received at least two overseas contracts for Arma 6x6, and it is clear that one of the customers is Bahrain, which operates the Otokar Cobra 4x4 armored car fleet.

The total weight of the Arma depends on the level of ballistic protection and the installed weaponry, but for the 8x8 variant it is declared in 24 tons, while the 6x6 variant weighs 18,5 tons.

In both versions, an eight-cylinder diesel engine with a turbocharged horsepower 450 hp, coupled with an automatic transmission, is installed. The transmission of the 8x8 variant has seven forward and one reverse gears, and the transmission of the 6x6 variant has six forward and one reverse gears.

The company Otokar declare maximum speed 105 km / h and hydropneumatic suspension of both options.

Arma floating machine, in the water is driven by two water cannons installed in the stern of the hull.

On the Arma machine can be installed various weapons systems. The 8x8 variant has already been shown with the CT-CV twin-turret Belgian company CMI Defense, armed with an 105-mm rifled cannon, in which the automatic loader is located in the stern of the turret.

The newest Cobra II 4x4 wheeled armored vehicle developed by Otokar was first shown in the 2013 year. According to the company, the development of the Cobra II is completed and production can begin upon receipt of orders for this machine.

Armored Car Cobra II structurally significantly different from its predecessor. With a total mass of 12 tons, it has a larger volume and useful payload compared with the previous version, which allows you to perform a larger range of tasks. The key difference is that this armored car can be used for various tasks with minimal modification.

A special amphibious version was also developed and tested. In the same version of the armored personnel carrier are placed two crew members and eight paratroopers.


Arma 8x8 can be equipped with heavy towers, such as the CT-CV tower of the Belgian company CMI Defense, armed with an 105-mm rifled cannon with an automatic loader in the rear stern of the tower


It was made over 2500 Cobra 4x4 armored vehicles. This version is equipped with a protected combat module, armed with a 12,7-mm machine gun M2 HB

On the car Cobra II installed diesel engine with turbocharged water cooling power 281 hp or 360 hp, coupled with an automatic six-speed transmission and a two-speed transfer case.

Standard equipment includes a thermal camera installed in front, an air-conditioning system, a centralized tire pressure control system, anti-rim wheels and an anti-lock braking system.

The light armored Cobra 4x4 was originally developed by the company on its own initiative and soon entered service with the Turkish army. At the beginning of 2015, more than 3000 machines were manufactured for the local and overseas markets. The production of this armored vehicle for the needs of Turkey under the contract worth 113 million dollars, issued at the end of 2013, continues.

The Cobra usually has an all-welded armored body with undercarriage components from the HMMWV (High-Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicle) all-purpose multi-purpose wheeled vehicle from AM General.

In the version of the BTR Cobra has a total mass of about 6,5 tons, it accommodates a crew of two people and seven people landing. Many specialized options have been developed for this vehicle, for example reconnaissance, ambulance, anti-tank installations with ATGM launchers installed on the roof, a command post, a special operations vehicle and a reconnaissance version with a telescopic mast sensor station.

The BTR variant, designated Ural, was first shown in 2013; he is in service with rather Turkish security forces, and not the Turkish army.

The Ural armored vehicle has a total tonnage of 6,3, available in a ten-seat, three-door configuration and a nine-seat five-door configuration, including in both cases the driver and the commander.

Compared with the design of previous 4x4 cars of Otokar 4x4, the Ural exterior design has more streamlined shapes. This is done in order to get a less threatening appearance of the car to participate in peacekeeping operations and operations to ensure internal security. The car is equipped with a diesel engine connected to a six-speed automatic transmission and a two-stage transfer case.

Otokar has manufactured a significant number of light armored vehicles of the Akrep family (Scorpio) in two versions: an armored personnel carrier and reconnaissance. Production of the Akrep armored car is completed, but it can be resumed upon receipt of export orders.

The company also manufactured a large number of lighter APCs based on the Rover Defender 4x4 chassis. Over the 2500, APV (Armored Patrol Vehicle) armored patrol vehicles were manufactured for local and overseas markets. The largest customer was Iraq, which bought 600 machines. Although the production line is currently stopped, there are plans to continue the production of the Defender car in Turkey when Jaguar Land Rover closes its line in the UK at the end of 2015 and the APV production can be switched to “on demand” mode.

FNSS expands its product range

Initially, the Turkish company FNSS Savunma Sistemleri was created for the production of armored vehicles of the company FMC Corporation. According to the results of competitive tests, in which the German Puma and the British Warrior BMP also took part, she was chosen by the Turkish army to fulfill the requirements of the Turkish infantry fighting vehicle (TIFV).

Initially, the company was owned by FMC (51%) and Turkish Nurol (49%), but today 51% is owned by Nurol and 49% by BAE Systems.

In total, 1698 TIFV vehicles were manufactured in four versions: BMP (650 machines with a single turret with a 25-mm selective-powered cannon and a paired 7,62-mm machine gun), advanced Advanced Armored Personnel Carrier armored personnel carrier (830 machines with an 12,7-mm machine gun in turret), anti-tank installation (48 machines with ATGM TOW) and mortar transporter (170 machines with 81-mm mortar on a turntable).

Later, the second contract was obtained from the Turkish armed forces for another 551 AAPC car, which were delivered in 2001-2004 years.

The TIFV vehicle became the starting point for the development by FNSS Savunma Sistemleri of a complete family of vehicles for the export market, which was designated ACV (Armored Combat Vehicle).

At first, it was offered with a hp 300 or 350 diesel engine. depending on customer requirements. Currently, the machine has received a new designation ACV-15, the last figure indicates the total mass of the machine in tons.

The United Arab Emirates became the first overseas customer by purchasing the ACV-136 15 machines. Five options have been improved under the conditions of the Middle East through the installation of air conditioning and a new engine cooling system.

These options include: 52 ACV-ENG (ACV-Engineering Squad Vehicle), 8 evacuation vehicles (RARV) and 76 artillery support (ASV). The last option is divided into three: targeting, fire control center and control point.

Malaysia placed the second major contract for 211 ACV-15 machines, locally designated Adnan, in 10 configurations. Then came the second contract for 48 machines in seven specialized versions. The final assembly of the machine was carried out in Malaysia.

The ACV-15 family provides end-users with the ability to fine-tune the machine configuration to suit their needs, for example, installing various towers with appropriate weapon systems or round-the-clock surveillance equipment.

Haluk Buluchu, marketing director at FNSS Savunma Sisterleri, said that "in Turkey, we have gone from simple production of armored vehicles under license to design, development and production of complete vehicles, as well as major subsystems, such as towers."

The need of customers for a platform with a large volume and carrying capacity has led to the development of machines with an extended chassis Armored Combat Vehicle - Stretched (ACV-S).

Currently, the machine has received the designation ACV-19; as in the ACV-15 designation, the figure indicates the total mass of 19 tons. The level of unification with the ACV-15 variant is 90%, it has a similar layout, but an additional support roller is installed on each side, which made it possible to lengthen the machine body.


FACE's AACE comes ashore during testing in Turkey


AAAB Turkish self-propelled floating bridge used as ferry

Typical versions of the ACV-19 include a BMP with an installed single or double turret or a remote-controlled RCT turret with various weapon systems, a sanitary / medical evacuation option, a commander vehicle, an armament platform and a tracked supply vehicle. In the latter, the power unit and the habitable compartment are located in front, and the cargo platform with folding sides in the rear. Immediately behind the habitable compartment, a hydraulic crane with a telescopic boom is installed.

The first buyer of the ACV-19 option was Saudi Arabia, which received 10 vehicles in the configuration of the tactical command post Tactical Command Post Vehicle (TCPV).

The second buyer was Malaysia, which ordered eight ACV-19 machines, differing in the raised roof under which the rollback 120-mm mortar complex TDA 120 2RM was installed.

For the head company Aselsan, FNSS has developed, manufactured and supplied several pre-series complete tracked ACV-30 tracked vehicles (total weight 30 tons). The ACV-30 version is similar in appearance to the ACV-15 and ACV-19 variants, but has a wider and longer body.

The ACV-30 engine is equipped with an 600 horsepower engine, coupled with an automatic transmission, and as options for the ACV-15 and ACV-19. it is equipped with a set of mounted armor, installed in the front and on the sides.

The first option based on the ACV-30 chassis was the self-propelled anti-aircraft gun Korkut SPAAG, designed for the Turkish army, which currently does not have such a modern unit. Pass qualifying tests of this machine.

A typical Korkut battery will consist of one machine fire control station and three anti-aircraft installations. A fire control station with a surveillance radar and a day / night optoelectronic station transmits target data to the SPAAG anti-aircraft installations that capture targets for destruction. The anti-aircraft gun is a chassis on which an RCT turret is installed, armed with a twin 25-mm gun mount, as well as tracking radar and an optical-electronic station for capturing targets in all weather conditions.

This version of the ACV-30 is completely floating and is driven in water by two water cannons located in the stern of the hull.


Korkut anti-aircraft gun



Malaysian ACV-19 machine in 120-mm mortar conveyor configuration


Cobra II is undergoing tests of water quality in one of the countries of the Middle East. On the water, the machine is driven by two propellers

Another variant of the ACV-30 is a short-range anti-aircraft missile launcher developed by Roketsan (rocket) and Aselsan (electronics and SLA) under a contract with the Turkish army; This option does not float. A radar on a telescopic mast is installed at the back of the platform.

Land-to-air missiles in launch canisters are lowered horizontally in the stowed position, but are raised to a vertical position before launch.

In the middle of 2013, the company showed a full-scale model of the Kaplan LAWC-T light armored Weapon Carrier-Tracked light tracked platform concept.


Light Armored Weapon Carrier-Tracked Light Tracked Platform

According to Mr. Buluchu, “This experimental machine has absorbed all our experience in designing and manufacturing tracked and wheeled armored vehicles. The crew seats in the front of the car, equipped with modern systems, are similar to the crew seats of the Pars armored vehicle. Rubber track tracks from Soucy International were installed, which made it possible to reduce noise, vibration and mass. ”

Currently, with the aim of expanding its market share, the company entered the extremely competitive field of wheeled vehicles with its Pars platform, which is now promoted as a family of 6xXNNXX and 6x8 machines with all-wheel steering.

The first customer of the Pars 8x8 option was Malaysia, which issued a local company, DEFTECH, a contract for 257 machines, designated AV8. The first batch of 14 machines was delivered at the end of 2014 of the year.

The first cars AV8 descended from the Turkish production line. AV8 enclosures are mass-produced in Turkey and Malaysia, and machines are currently being assembled in Malaysia. Final deliveries are scheduled for 2018 year.

All Malaysian cars have a “right-hand drive" configuration, equipped with air conditioning systems and RCB protection.

Malaysian Pars vehicles come in 12 variants: 30-mm turret, BMP (25-mm turret), BMP-BTR, anti-tank missile with laser-guided, control point, military observation point, ambulance, 120-mm mortar, evacuation, machine communications engineering workshop and RCB-intelligence.

With the exception of the machine in the configuration of the BMP with the LCT-30 tower from the South African company Denel Land Systems and the evacuation option, all Malaysian cars are floating.

FNSS Savunma Sistemleri develops engineering machines

In accordance with the contract concluded with the Turkish army, FNSS Savunma Sistemleri manufactured a total of 12 serial AACE (Amphibious Armored Combat Earthmover) Floating Combat Armored Digging Machines, the last of which was delivered in January 2013, although the company does not exclude the resumption of production upon receipt of additional orders.

AZMIM, which is the second development project of the Turkish Defense Ministry in the field of ground vehicles after the FNSS project on the Mobile Amphibious Assault Bridge (SYHK), is a system designed to prepare river banks (slopes, ground hardness, surface roughness, etc.) to enter the water floating machines during the forcing of rivers. In addition, it is the only armored amphibious bulldozer in the world.

The AZMIM or AACE tracked earthmoving machinery (Amphibious Armored Combat Earthmover) is used to train the river banks when they are forced. It can perform work such as site planning, rough alignment, digging, skidding and leveling.

One of the remarkable features of AACE is that this machine is floating, driven by two water cannons in the water and has a maximum speed of 8,6 km / h.

FNSS is responsible for the supply of all 12 machines, including a prototype for qualification and compliance tests.



Turkish AZMIM earthmoving machine

Although the Turkish AACE conceptually resembles the M9 Armored Combat Earthmover (ACE) earthmoving machine of the American army, but unlike it, the crew is two people, not one.

After winning the competition, the company received a contract worth 130 million dollars for the supply of the Turkish Army self-propelled floating bridges Armored Amphibious Assault Bridge (AAAB). The 52 system was delivered, including one training system consisting of 4 machines.

One AAAB axle is used as a MLC 21 (Military Load Class) ferry, two AAAB axles provide the MLC 70 (tracked vehicle), and three AAAB axles provide the MLC 100 (wheeled transport). When the AAAB 12 bridges are connected, a crossing with the carrying capacity of MLC 70 (tracked vehicles) and MLC 100 (wheeled vehicles) is formed, which makes it possible to cross rivers that are up to 150 meters wide.


The AAAB bridge has a fully protected, air-conditioned cab in front, the suspension is the same as that of the Pars cars and all-wheel steering.

Comment

Turkey has created an industry capable of designing, developing and producing armored combat vehicles to meet the needs of the Turkish army. Turkey has been successful in overseas markets, but the support of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt has weakened its defense position.

Its new armored vehicles were created with a view to foreign markets, and in the case of light and medium armored vehicles, they are equipped with a variety of weapons systems in order to meet the requirements of the end user.

Turkey is also interested in joint ventures with foreign partners (one of them is Malaysia), which also makes offers on technology transfer.

Materials used:
www.otokar.com.tr
www.aselsan.com.tr
www.fnss.com.tr
www.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org
Author:
29 comments
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  1. qwert
    qwert 7 December 2015 07: 26 New
    +4
    In Altai, the hodovka is very similar to that of the T-64. And 68 tons speaks of probably good protection, and on the other hand, not the best mobility, since it is unlikely that the Turks have an engine with a capacity of about 1700l.s. The rather narrow tracks are also embarrassing.
    1. Falcon
      Falcon 7 December 2015 07: 44 New
      +7
      Quote: qwert
      68 tons speaks of probably good protection, and on the other hand, not the best mobility, since it is unlikely that the Turks have an engine with an output of the order of 1700l.s.


      There's also an MTU engine. The Turks generally do not have their own engines. And the power there is 1500 l / s like on a leopard. If you really want to, then MTU will supply them with 1700 l / s.

      So the German MTU and the engines were planned to be installed on our corvettes and delivered to Belaz - the industry leader can be said (in its segment)

      1. Falcon
        Falcon 7 December 2015 07: 47 New
        +3
        Their bridge is certainly a very interesting system. This doesn’t hurt us, yet it’s not a bridge spreader.
        1. Siberia 9444
          Siberia 9444 7 December 2015 14: 46 New
          +3
          It seems to me that it’s cheaper to throw pantons with an airstrike, it’s easier to lose part of the pontoon than a whole car, but you don’t need to burn salyarka (and yes, the diesel fuel is free) and the idea is interesting.
        2. KazakPatrol
          KazakPatrol 9 January 2016 04: 36 New
          0
          And on what to deliver these beautiful cars to the place of crossing? Judging by the width of the technique, it won’t pass forest roads, nor will it be on the railway platform.
  2. inkass_98
    inkass_98 7 December 2015 08: 13 New
    +7
    Quote: qwert
    In Altai, the hodovka is very similar to that of the T-64.

    It is similar to the Leopard, since it is done on the same platform (MVT in girlhood), it is also based on Abrams, it is also based on the Korean Black Panther, from where the legs grow on the Turkish tank. The gun and engine are also German, by the way, like the Israeli "chariots."
  3. andrei.yandex
    andrei.yandex 7 December 2015 08: 27 New
    +2
    Since the West itself doesn’t really want to fight, the British are going to use Turkey as before, transferring some technologies. in the tank "Altai" is not only a German cannon, but also an engine. Yes, and the BMP is too painfully looks like a German Puma.
  4. EvilLion
    EvilLion 7 December 2015 08: 27 New
    +3
    To bomb in the Stone Age, barbarians are not supposed to have tanks.
  5. dmitriygorshkov
    dmitriygorshkov 7 December 2015 08: 53 New
    +6
    One name annoys me: Altai? Ural !!!
    Is it from great love for a neighbor?
    1. Ruslan
      Ruslan 7 December 2015 09: 15 New
      +1
      I also ask this question. maybe they have such words in the language, but with a different meaning?
      1. Yeraz
        Yeraz 7 December 2015 16: 47 New
        +6
        Quote: ruslan
        I also ask this question. maybe they have such words in the language, but with a different meaning?

        Simply, the Altai region is the ancestral home of all the Türks.
        Therefore, the name Altai and the name Altai are not uncommon in the Turkic countries.
        In Azerbaijan there is a city with exactly the same name as in Kyrgyzstan. And so there are a lot of names of villages and cities with similar names in the Turkic countries. And in Russia there is Altai with the Altai people living there in the Turkic people. Therefore, this is normal. Nobody has anything special don't steal.
      2. Awp
        Awp 8 December 2015 16: 37 New
        0
        and Pars is an allusion to Persia. Attention to the developers of military equipment! contest for the best name! in response, the following models of our new models of equipment for Syria would be nice: ATGM (let's say the new Cornet-E model in Turkish is called “Ortaparmak (middle finger)”, BMP (export Kurganets) - “Dirsek” (elbow), and the new export modification Medium-range air defense system (BUK-M4) "Chuk (by the way, also of three letters, the first x)" laughing
  6. Papapg
    Papapg 7 December 2015 09: 08 New
    10
    And I bought a Turkish pneumatics, Hatsan-125, but I’ll tell you, Tula and Izhevsk are eating something, unfortunately, the engineer’s thought froze.
  7. Dimon-chik-79
    Dimon-chik-79 7 December 2015 09: 27 New
    +1
    Hmm, in short it’s probably not worth worrying about the Turks (((
  8. 72jora72
    72jora72 7 December 2015 09: 36 New
    +1
    For the most part, expensive scrap metal .....
    1. 72jora72
      72jora72 8 December 2015 12: 56 New
      0
      You can put another twenty minuses, but only Turkey is saturating its troops with mostly American or German equipment. And in the desert, all this MIRACLE of armor and other equipment is destroyed by aircraft and jet systems ....
  9. vladimirvn
    vladimirvn 7 December 2015 09: 37 New
    +4
    The Turks are a serious opponent for us militarily. They must be fought with in other ways of hybrid warfare.
  10. iouris
    iouris 7 December 2015 12: 08 New
    -3
    The Russian Federation cannot afford to fight separately with Turkey or with Poland. A war with Turkey or Poland is a nuclear war with the United States with all its consequences. There are many people who want to fight with Turkey without us.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 7 December 2015 15: 55 New
      0
      Do you really think that the United States will harness for Turkey and even more so some God-forgotten Poland ?! It’s ridiculous. Why do they need it?
      1. Dad Uassia
        Dad Uassia 7 December 2015 18: 17 New
        +1
        Quote: Greenwood
        Do you really think that the United States will harness for Turkey and even more so some God-forgotten Poland ?! It’s ridiculous. Why do they need it?

        It will be over. Otherwise, they will discredit themselves and NATO.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. lexx2038
        lexx2038 7 December 2015 22: 36 New
        +1
        Quote: Greenwood
        Do you really think that the United States will harness for Turkey and even more so some God-forgotten Poland ?! It’s ridiculous. Why do they need it?

        Well, they won’t fight directly with us over the Turks, they won’t throw nuclear bombs either, but they will do everything so that we are left without pants - war, an expensive event. Compare our economic potential, and the potential of the countries of the NATO bloc. As a result, the Americans will get what they want - BV in chaos, weakened Russia, and fragmented Turkey, they will only have to divide BV into zones of its influence, and we will pass by - raking in the heat with our own hands.
        1. Logos
          Logos 8 December 2015 15: 01 New
          0
          Well, they will not fight with us directly over the Turks

          I think they will. And the point is not in a particularly great love for the Turks, but in the fact that Turkey is a member of NATO and if the US does not harness for an ally, then they will lose their face and, ultimately, world leadership.
          Of course, no one will arrange a nuclear war; a big chopper in the style of world wars of the 20th century, too, will be arranged only by a limited military operation in a single region (Crimea or Syria), where Russia will be exemplary flown out.
          Most of all, it will be like the Crimean War of 1854, which also began because of the Turks, by the way
    2. ILDM1986
      ILDM1986 7 December 2015 16: 11 New
      +2
      only of those who want to give Turkey’s horns to do this in this region objectively no one can, with the exception of Israel, but they are still far away and will not get involved in the conflict until they are satisfied that the Arabs are slaughtering Arabs.
      In connection with this, the question has long ripened — it’s clear that Israel does not have a very good relationship with Syria and Hasbullah, but will they really calmly watch how the radicals absorb one state after another? I understand that they can’t openly support Assad, and he is unlikely to accept such help in public, but how do you need to get out? can someone enlighten what are Israel's long-term plans for this eastern mess if Turkey begins expansion and continues to support the radicals?
  11. Griboedoff
    Griboedoff 7 December 2015 12: 46 New
    +1
    Quote: dmitriygorshkov
    One name annoys me: Altai? Ural !!!
    Is it from great love for a neighbor?

    Not from love, that's for sure. Rather, the reason is that our history and languages ​​are strongly and repeatedly mixed. So, both Altai and the Urals have a version of the Turkic etymology. Turkic is certainly not equal to Turkish, but nonetheless.
  12. aspid163
    aspid163 7 December 2015 13: 14 New
    +3
    nothing purely Turkish, everything is licked from NATO technology and naturally from the Russian one (who only couldn’t come up with it)
  13. aspid163
    aspid163 7 December 2015 13: 16 New
    +2
    and this tank, and even with such screens, is not 1700 horsebacks, but all two are probably armor chobhem
  14. bos83bos
    bos83bos 7 December 2015 13: 22 New
    +1
    Yes, I'm more than sure that all this is laced and bought!
  15. Yereke
    Yereke 7 December 2015 13: 26 New
    +3
    Tulpar, Korkut .. native Turkic words. There is a hockey club near the Bashkirs or Tatars, it seems Tolpar is called in the VHL or somewhere else. We have a Tulpar mini football club with Kazakhs from Karaganda, now moved to Astana, which constantly plays in the Eremenko Cup with Russian clubs.
  16. A.Lex
    A.Lex 7 December 2015 13: 28 New
    +2
    Interesting ... but purely from their spare parts can they not create a tank? Or like a car - from around the world on a thread?
  17. Support
    Support 7 December 2015 13: 59 New
    +2
    And by chance, did theirs Cobra participate in the Georgian-Abkhaz conflict? Who knows?
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 7 December 2015 15: 56 New
      +2
      Yes, she is the most.
    2. Yeraz
      Yeraz 7 December 2015 16: 48 New
      +2
      Quote: Prop
      And by chance, did theirs Cobra participate in the Georgian-Abkhaz conflict? Who knows?

      Yes their Cobra.
  18. vandarus
    vandarus 7 December 2015 16: 48 New
    0
    Korkut anti-aircraft mount- missing anti-aircraft missile weapons, or did they put the air-guns into the building?
  19. aba
    aba 7 December 2015 23: 50 New
    +2
    One can argue for a long and tedious fact that the Turkish or NATO or Russian armored vehicles are competitors or not, but that they raise their design and production is worthy of respect.
  20. aba
    aba 8 December 2015 15: 19 New
    0
    Yes, an interesting article on the Star is just about Altai:
    http://tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/201512080724-j9bs.htm
  21. ferrumio
    ferrumio 10 December 2015 04: 28 New
    0
    seven rinks :)