Military Review

Media: T-90A transferred to Syria need improvement

111
Filled in recent days, Internet photos of the "Syrian" tanks At first, the T-90A caused joyful excitement among users: now the militants will receive in full on the ground. However, the tone of the debate gradually changed - visitors to social networks began to express concerns about the lack of protection of military equipment, the agency writes. Messenger of Mordovia.


Media: T-90A transferred to Syria need improvement


According to experts, "in the form in which T-90А were delivered to Syria, they are not optimized enough for fighting in this" hot spot "," writes the publication.

“Experts have noticed that tanks are used in very limited quantities, and the loss of even one car will have negative consequences. In addition, they note that the Blind-1 optoelectronic suppression system increases the tank's chances of survival, but does not guarantee complete protection. It's one thing to protect the airbase, another thing is to conduct offensive operations, ”the author writes.



The publication reminds that recently at the exhibition in Nizhny Tagil T-72 was demonstrated with a set of additional protection. In front of the hull there is a powerful dozer TBS-86 dump for making a passage in the rubble, and on the side projections of the tower and sides there is a dynamic protection mounted. The back of the machine is protected by anti-cumulative screens.



"For the first time such protection was demonstrated back in the 2013 year, but for some reason they did not receive the tanks" sent to Syria, although, as is known, this kind of economy during the war usually turns into vain losses, ”the publication concludes.

Photos used:
http://vestnik-rm.ru/
111 comments
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  1. The black
    The black 30 November 2015 13: 09 New
    19
    Unfortunately, there is no war without loss. So be that as it may, the decision to deliver the T-90A to the Syrians is CORRECT!
    1. Sasha 19871987
      Sasha 19871987 30 November 2015 13: 12 New
      25
      for some reason everyone has forgotten about the “arena” active defense complex, this is a worthy thing in the duet with “curtain-1” !!!
      1. maxiban
        maxiban 30 November 2015 13: 16 New
        +9
        To correct the shortcomings, you need to test the equipment in real combat conditions. Further, the identified deficiencies to fix and all
        1. cheega69
          cheega69 30 November 2015 13: 28 New
          33
          Well yes. Just minus the crew.
          1. Vladimir 1964
            Vladimir 1964 30 November 2015 22: 07 New
            +2
            Quote: cheega69
            Well yes. Just minus the crew.

            Boris, Dear, so Vasily (maxiban), you don’t have to be in the tank yourself, he is interested in the process of practical testing of equipment, that he is a man far from the army, or shot at him only in some club, this is understandable, do not pay attention.
            I somehow had the opportunity to see what was left of the 2 battalions of the Maykop brigade, after the "storm" of Grozny, personally, after that, of all these ushlopki like Vasya, I take it for sure, especially with such an avatar. hi
        2. kodxnumx
          kodxnumx 30 November 2015 14: 07 New
          +1
          I would like to believe once they say about this, who needs to have done this report already and will eliminate all these shortcomings!
          1. Homo
            Homo 30 November 2015 14: 52 New
            +6
            Quote: kod3001
            I would like to believe once they talk about it ...

            And who is talking? Another "sofa" experts - "... visitors to social networks began to express concerns about the lack of protection of military equipment ..."? While there are no comments from experts, we will wait for an authoritative assessment.
        3. TVM - 75
          TVM - 75 30 November 2015 16: 24 New
          -1
          Learn guys and quickly correct mistakes and shortcomings. And those whose decisions were incorrect or ill-conceived, removed from decision-making. Only then will technology ready for war go and the decisions will be right.
      2. Now we are free
        Now we are free 30 November 2015 13: 23 New
        33
        I did not put the article a minus or a plus. T-90A located in Syria are designed to protect Russian bases and are used by Russian crews. The issue of using them in offensive operations has not yet been discussed.
        At the same time, one must understand that even with a hypothetical order, the ground contingent of the RF Armed Forces to take part / assist in suppressing the militants with the help of armored vehicles should take into account that the main danger for armored vehicles will be: RPG-7V and American ATGM “TOU” (in large numbers " Suddenly "appeared at fighters). Those. the main enemy of our armored vehicles will again be the infantry, in this case, again, it is advisable to use the BMPT Terminator (NOT the Terminator-2) to a greater extent, both separately simultaneously and in conjunction with tanks. At the moment, the tank that best meets the requirements of PT protection is the T-90MS "Breakthrough".
        1. i80186
          i80186 30 November 2015 13: 38 New
          +7
          Quote: Now we are free
          The issue of using them in offensive operations has not yet been discussed.

          What planet are you from? Photos of the T-90 column near Aleppo hang throughout the network. A week ago they were still discussing here. winked
          1. Now we are free
            Now we are free 30 November 2015 13: 56 New
            31
            Quote: i80186
            What planet are you from? Photos of the T-90 column near Aleppo hang throughout the network. A week ago they were still discussing here.

            Well, firstly, welcome hi
            Secondly, I saw these photos and what? Yes, they’re traveling in a convoy, and where is the photo of the video that the T-90A are fighting / firing at the positions of the militants ??? The video that you posted is something other than a hoax, do not understand anyone against the background of a standing T-90 and cutting frames in which the T-72 of the Syrian army is firing. I have known this video since last year (Storm Homs). I, too, can do such a cut for you, I’ll come to Kubinka, curl before the M1A1 Abrams and then under the video sequence where the Abrams fires at someone I will comment -The United States has sworn allegiance to Russia, and now, on the orders of Vladimir Putin, they are destroying their former ISIS proteges and Al Qaeda ... laughing
            1. i80186
              i80186 30 November 2015 14: 17 New
              +3
              Quote: Now we are free
              The video that you posted is something other than antics do not understand anyone on the background of the standing T-90

              Well, if you didn’t pay attention, then the photo in the article of this particular tank, namely the "grimacing" people, of exactly the same moment as in the video (look at the clouds) So you can go to their Facebook page. And the "Messenger of Mordovia" I tend to trust for example.
            2. jjj
              jjj 30 November 2015 15: 03 New
              +4
              Quote: Now we are free
              I, too, can do such a cut for you, I’ll come to Kubinka, curse before the M1A1 “Abrams” and then under the video sequence where “Abrams” fires at someone I’ll comment on -USA swore allegiance to Russia and now, on the orders of Vladimir Putin, they destroy their former ISIS proteges and al Qaeda ...

              And what to do. Then we look at the reaction of the "world community"
            3. Alekseyklg
              Alekseyklg 1 December 2015 17: 13 New
              0
              Greetings!
              Enlighten please, and what appeared in the Cuban “Abrams”? I'm talking about the museum if that.
        2. tomket
          tomket 30 November 2015 14: 43 New
          +2
          Quote: Now we are free
          protection is T-90MS "Breakthrough".

          Comrade Serdyukov, to "divert" the eyes of the West, this tank cut off, by the way, why didn’t the B3 be sent to Syria, which adherents of the "Putin torpedo" are not overjoyed with?
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. ermak.sidorov
        ermak.sidorov 30 November 2015 14: 02 New
        +1
        And the Arena will be able to cut off a TOW type ATGM, which is not a contact one, but one that hits the tower with a cumulative core from above?
        1. SergGrey318
          SergGrey318 30 November 2015 22: 44 New
          +2
          Sorry. Cumulative than?
          1. ermak.sidorov
            ermak.sidorov 1 December 2015 09: 54 New
            0
            Sorry! I know the terminology far from perfect =) But judging by your question, you perfectly understood what I wanted to say ...
      5. Tor5
        Tor5 30 November 2015 14: 06 New
        0
        Of course, if possible, it is necessary to protect the crew, as reliable as possible!
        1. Throw
          Throw 30 November 2015 15: 41 New
          +6
          Yes, the question is whether the Arena will be able to cut, the striking element will reach the TOW, and whether it will be first classified as a target, because the missile trajectory goes past the tank, above it.
          1. SergGrey318
            SergGrey318 30 November 2015 22: 56 New
            0
            This is a fake video. The tank is filled with explosives.
            The rocket itself is small.
      6. The comment was deleted.
      7. gladcu2
        gladcu2 30 November 2015 17: 29 New
        0
        Sasha1987

        By the way, to you and who will be able to answer.

        These arena-type active defenses work on the principle of approaching ammunition. Presumably a radar is used to determine the target.

        How does dustiness of air, after a shot of a tank gun affect the timeliness of the system?
      8. ramzes1776
        ramzes1776 30 November 2015 18: 49 New
        +3
        We ourselves have neither Arena nor Shtor on tanks, and are not expected.
      9. Forest
        Forest 30 November 2015 22: 04 New
        0
        The arena is not placed in series on 90 ticks - it is rather inefficient and very dangerous for its infantry. So for now, we still have the old T-72Б the best tank for round-robin bookings.
      10. Maz
        Maz 1 December 2015 22: 50 New
        +2
        Hmm, modern tactics interpret an attack on a tank at the same time as several anti-tank weapons of at least three or four directions. In the conditions of the city it works flawlessly. Tested at DLNR. The curtain and the arena will work for the first two shots, the rest will have nothing to repel.
    2. tracker
      tracker 30 November 2015 13: 13 New
      14
      ATGM TOU at dofig balmaleev, therefore protection should be maximum
      1. kil 31
        kil 31 30 November 2015 13: 19 New
        +3
        Quote: Pathfinder
        ATGM TOU at dofig balmaleev, therefore protection should be maximum
        This T 72 is in a single instance. To put on a stream you need a lot of time. It was urgent to protect the base, which was a hand then they brought.
        1. afdjhbn67
          afdjhbn67 30 November 2015 13: 22 New
          14
          Quote: Kil 31
          It was urgent to protect the base, which was a hand then they brought.

          Do not you think your colleague that we are increasingly drawn into the maelstrom of war? For saying A cannot but say B ..
          1. cheega69
            cheega69 30 November 2015 13: 32 New
            +7
            Worse, the goals are incomprehensible. I’m not talking about isles; it’s impossible to destroy it with military force; I’m talking about a common goal. So far, it seems that we are acting tactically right, but without strategic planning.
            1. Alekseev
              Alekseev 30 November 2015 15: 49 New
              +4
              Quote: cheega69
              Worse, goals are incomprehensible

              It’s bad that the goals are still not clear. laughing
              In short, they are these goals.
              (explanation in the style of Colonel von Zillergut from the immortal novel about the adventures of the brave soldier Schweik)
              To preserve our influence in the Middle East - friendly Syria, Egypt and Jordan are looking at Syria.
              Why do we need to influence something there?
              And if we do not influence, then the Americans can order a barrel of oil to sell not at 10, but at 5 dollars. But we also prohibit buying a ton of grain and a unit of equipment, not to mention large-scale infrastructure projects.
              It is time.
              The growing base for Islamic terrorism is two.
              For some reason, these terrorists are very fond of shitting in Russia, although they also do not favor others.
              This is perhaps the main thing.
              Now about the tank.
              The T-90A is well protected against PTS, but there are no invulnerable BTT samples. I do not think that they will be transferred to the Syrians. There is another war, tank formations are not needed.
              There, mainly, it is necessary to deprive the gangs of supply. And things will go smoothly!
              1. pilot8878
                pilot8878 30 November 2015 17: 43 New
                0
                Quote: Alekseev
                In short, they are these goals.

                Here you can see right away - Marshal. laughing The task is set, proceed with implementation. Sorry, plus only one intermeddle.
              2. Aleks tv
                Aleks tv 1 December 2015 00: 06 New
                0
                Quote: Alekseev
                Now about the tank.
                The T-90A is well protected against PTS, but there are no invulnerable BTT samples. I do not think that they will be transferred to the Syrians. There is another war, tank formations are not needed.

                good
                To the point, Alexey.
                And more:
                These are LINEAR tanks of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, and not ... export vehicles.
                Those who know will understand.
            2. gladcu2
              gladcu2 30 November 2015 17: 34 New
              0
              cheega69

              The overall goal was defined as the withdrawal of Assad’s government troops to the borders of Turkey in order to cut off ISIS from the supply routes.

              While the task is successfully completed.

              And the tanks were most likely sent to roll in real conditions.
        2. tomket
          tomket 30 November 2015 14: 51 New
          +1
          Quote: Kil 31
          it would take a lot of time to stream. It was urgent to protect the base, which was a hand then they brought.

          Why put it on the stream, if this is a city kit ????
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. cosmos111
      cosmos111 30 November 2015 13: 17 New
      13
      T-90 A NEED TO INSTALL KAZ !!! without this, tanks are an easy target for ATGM bumazhezhov ...

      Merkava tank and Trophy tank active defense system
    5. Scoun
      Scoun 30 November 2015 13: 21 New
      +5
      Quote: Black
      Unfortunately, there is no war without loss.

      According to experts, "in the form in which the T-90A were delivered to Syria, they are not optimized enough for fighting in this" hot spot ""

      do not you think that neither how does your proposal "fight" with the one stated in the article?

      Quote: Black
      So be that as it may, the decision to deliver the T-90A to the Syrians is CORRECT!

      Specialists drew attention to the fact that tanks are used in very limited quantities, and the loss of even one vehicle will have negative consequences.

      What for me is so if you do something so do it right immediately (thinking well including) send the T-90 so that later it would be "applied in a limited way" for a reason
      not optimized enough for battles in this hot spot", - writes the publication.
      Everything should be “sufficiently” optimized and applied to a limited extent unlimited should be simply the lot of decision-makers.
      1. perm23
        perm23 30 November 2015 13: 42 New
        +5
        It must be forgotten that there is no war without loss. It is necessary to set a goal, so that there are no losses.
        1. Basarev
          Basarev 30 November 2015 14: 54 New
          0
          And why put this tower on the tower? Isn't it more correct to just deliver a remotely controlled KPVT?
          1. Lord_Sita
            Lord_Sita 30 November 2015 20: 41 New
            0
            Quote: Basarev
            And why put this tower on the tower? Isn't it more correct to just deliver a remotely controlled KPVT?

            A budget option?
    6. The comment was deleted.
    7. The comment was deleted.
    8. Lord_Sita
      Lord_Sita 30 November 2015 17: 22 New
      +1
      Unfortunately, there is no war without loss. So be that as it may, the decision to deliver the T-90A to the Syrians is CORRECT!

      The question is not what is right and wrong. The question is, why aren't "full stuffing" machines used in combat? What are they protected for parades and exhibitions? Then the question arises: why then are they so good needed?
      And as for losses, the first task of the RF Ministry of Defense is to minimize them, and in Russia there are few people left. Every combat-ready citizen is worth its weight in gold. In Israel, they understood this a long time ago, but here, as usual, the price of human life is a penny.
      1. Tuxuu
        Tuxuu 1 December 2015 02: 21 New
        -1
        Every combat-ready citizen is worth its weight in gold. In Israel, they understood this a long time ago, but here, as usual, the price of human life is a penny. [/ Quote]
        I’m already tired of reading this phrase !!! this is nonsense and Western propaganda! The future MBT Armata is an example of this and the rest of the line of military equipment! Just say this is an officer who passed through Chechnya and Afghanistan. And the Jews were already humming their brains. As they begin to discuss some kind of attack, so again, Jews are put as an example as brave Jews take revenge, and the fact that our services do not publicize all the guilty parties, so everyone is silent for some reason !!!
        1. Lord_Sita
          Lord_Sita 1 December 2015 06: 28 New
          -1
          From the USA, of course, it is always more visible negative
  2. chikenous59
    chikenous59 30 November 2015 13: 10 New
    12
    Life does not teach. When will we stop saving on security?
    1. a52333
      a52333 30 November 2015 13: 14 New
      13
      And the terminators do not want to put there?
      1. pettabyte
        pettabyte 30 November 2015 13: 17 New
        +4
        And BMPT generally adopted?
        Or current prototypes yes for export?
      2. jovanni
        jovanni 30 November 2015 14: 16 New
        +3
        And where to get them? At ourselves, - bye bye ... Thanks to stool and his followers ...
      3. Cossack Ermak
        Cossack Ermak 30 November 2015 14: 41 New
        +1
        I recently read somewhere that the Terminators released only 4 pieces
        1. Per se.
          Per se. 30 November 2015 19: 28 New
          +3
          Quote: Cossack Ermak
          I recently read somewhere that the Terminators released only 4 pieces
          The BMPT Kazakhstan has purchased more than a dozen vehicles for its army from us; moreover, it is planned to produce them in Kazakhstan together with UVZ. Our all will not find in the charters how to use this technique ... In the photo, the BMPT line.
    2. 44 World
      44 World 30 November 2015 13: 16 New
      +1
      On the one hand, you say it right, but on the other, for some reason they did just that, and that I doubt that people in the General Staff are dumber than us
      1. pettabyte
        pettabyte 30 November 2015 13: 25 New
        +1
        The General Staff has more information than ours. It is a fact.
        1. gladcu2
          gladcu2 30 November 2015 17: 40 New
          +1
          pettabyte

          In fact, the General Staff is of course informed, but it seems 30 percent more than you can get information from the news. Journalists justify their bread. The hunt for news will be stronger than deep intelligence.
  3. sever.56
    sever.56 30 November 2015 13: 10 New
    16
    Give the ears to those who equipped and controlled the equipment for shipment to Syria. Not only do they substitute the crews of tanks, they also give occasion to our “liberot” and the Western media enthusiastically nibble our defense, again screaming about the “rusty Russian pieces of iron”. You can’t do a good thing with the headlessness of stupid people !!!
    1. Vadim Zhivov
      Vadim Zhivov 30 November 2015 13: 15 New
      +8
      Better afford than ears ... So nowadays it comes faster hi
    2. pettabyte
      pettabyte 30 November 2015 13: 23 New
      +7
      Quote: sever.56
      give occasion to our "liberot" and the Western media with delight to gnaw our defense, again yelling about the "rusty Russian pieces of iron."


      And these will yell at anyone.
      As options, "the T-64s themselves are still in operation, and the brand-new T-90s are being driven by them."
      The squeals of liberotas they are magnitude constant. Only the direction vector in which this quantity multiplies changes.
      1. lukewarm
        lukewarm 30 November 2015 16: 30 New
        +3
        Quote: pettabyte
        Well, squeals about "that's where the taxes go."

        and not one liberal m. ya. d. did not blather something like that about the Yeltsin center.
  4. izya top
    izya top 30 November 2015 13: 11 New
    +1
    what equipment did the Syrians have, and they bought one
    1. lukewarm
      lukewarm 30 November 2015 16: 31 New
      0
      ... with our crews .... winked
  5. chikenous59
    chikenous59 30 November 2015 13: 13 New
    +6
    Quote: iza top
    what equipment did the Syrians have, and they bought one

    Do not make people laugh. The war goes on for 4 years, where to get the money? All equipment is either free or in long-term installments.
    1. izya top
      izya top 30 November 2015 13: 21 New
      +1
      Quote: chikenous59
      , or in long-term installments.

      so they took it on credit. We figured out that in this configuration we can afford n ​​pieces, and in the other k pieces, we figured it out and chose the quantity to the detriment of quality
  6. Bobxnumx
    Bobxnumx 30 November 2015 13: 14 New
    +6
    If the T-90A went to Syria, it is likely to break in in real combat conditions and identify weak spots.
    1. DIVAN SOLDIER
      DIVAN SOLDIER 30 November 2015 13: 20 New
      +3
      Why then not T72b3 or armature, T90, we have not so many, and they were refused purchases.
      1. lukewarm
        lukewarm 30 November 2015 16: 32 New
        +2
        T72B3 is even worse.
    2. gladcu2
      gladcu2 30 November 2015 17: 43 New
      0
      bob0859

      And crew training.
  7. novobranets
    novobranets 30 November 2015 13: 15 New
    12
    Are DZs and lattices really so expensive that they were saved on them? After all, each wrecked tank is a minus to Russian tank building, and the whole world, including potential buyers, is now closely watching the theater of operations in Syria. request
    1. pettabyte
      pettabyte 30 November 2015 13: 19 New
      +1
      Well, how can I say, DZ is not cheap (it’s all military). Of course not more expensive than a tank, but the difference is noticeable.
  8. zanoza
    zanoza 30 November 2015 13: 17 New
    +3
    Apparently, the T-90 data was transferred to Syria with a double purpose: to use it for the defense of the airdrome and subsequently transfer it to the Syrians (do not send all the equipment, after the operation, back to Russia).
    Perhaps there was no situation when these tanks would be handed over to the Syrians earlier, and in exchange tanks that were more adapted to the Syrian theater would be transferred.
    Let's hope.
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 30 November 2015 14: 38 New
      +4
      The check will be like this:
      whether the modern integrated DZ of the frontal part of the T-90 can withstand
      TOU rocket shot.
      And the answer, for sure, will not keep itself waiting.
      The militants also watch youtube and know that the T-90 arrived.
      1. APASUS
        APASUS 30 November 2015 15: 36 New
        +1
        Quote: voyaka uh
        The check will be like this:
        whether the modern integrated DZ of the frontal part of the T-90 can withstand
        TOU rocket shot.
        And the answer, for sure, will not keep itself waiting.
        The militants also watch youtube and know that the T-90 arrived.

        As a rule, such equipment is dragged not only for the protection and defense of objects, it is a 100% landfill. Look at how many 080808 frank rubbish our drags from Georgia, but there was some kind of appliance, a door made of incomprehensible armor, and all this is subjected to serious analysis and testing.
        So far, there is no serious video showing the T-90's combat use in the inent, how much more equipment and which was transported to Syria is also not clear.
      2. lukewarm
        lukewarm 30 November 2015 16: 33 New
        0
        Will the Javelin stand it? "Tou" IMHO a bit old already.
      3. Forest
        Forest 30 November 2015 22: 08 New
        0
        The forehead and 72 of the latest modifications will be able to withstand. Not throughout the silhouette, but outside the weakened zones will withstand.
  9. avva2012
    avva2012 30 November 2015 13: 17 New
    0
    T-90, what is the range of the cannon shot? Larger, smaller than the T-55, what is shown in the video? It is possible to use it as long-range artillery, or, for targeting Babai armored vehicles. That is, elite work. Apparently, the same T-55 will go to the assault.
    1. Izotovp
      Izotovp 30 November 2015 13: 23 New
      +1
      As often happens, with serious complications and special forces infantry. As it gets hotter, 90 will be allowed to storm or to plug a hole.
      1. avva2012
        avva2012 30 November 2015 14: 38 New
        0
        What for? The filling of the T-90, and the gun itself, is more modern. Range, ammunition, obviously better. Some tanks are used for urban battles, others, like a sniper rifle, to destroy particularly tasty targets.
        1. gladcu2
          gladcu2 30 November 2015 17: 45 New
          0
          avva2012

          Tanks are not used as artillery. They have their own tasks.
  10. vetluga
    vetluga 30 November 2015 13: 21 New
    +1
    Do not make people laugh. The war has been going on for 4 years, where can I get the money? All equipment is either free or in long-term installments. [/ Quote]
    But what, in the territories controlled by the Syrian army there is no oil?
  11. Monos
    Monos 30 November 2015 13: 22 New
    +4
    It is not clear which tanks are in question; about those who put the Syrians or about those that our units have. Our, it seems, should be equipped in full. Well, the Syrians and this is for happiness.
  12. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 30 November 2015 13: 25 New
    +2
    Syrians can supply tanks with bulldozer dumps, and with enhanced armor protection, but only to convert a couple of hundred tanks is not too fast. IMHO, work is already underway. I hope the new BMPs go there for testing. Sorry, the terminators are just trial copies. For battles in the city and the intersection - they were created. And the “Blind” versus the “Toe” - that’s it. Will work efficiently.
  13. BARKHAN
    BARKHAN 30 November 2015 13: 27 New
    11
    And again we rest against the next "why"!
    Why did "drying" fly without cover? ... Why did the Turks believe recklessly? ...
    Why did tanks in this form end up in Syria, although concrete photographs from the exhibition prove that we can defend ...
    If we can’t provide the Syrians with these types of protection (and if we can, why don’t we?), Then we can supply our own dozens in the state. Where is the “Shtora”, where is the “Arena” which has been widely promoted on TV? Who is specifically responsible for these tanks? Or the president himself must poke a finger at the problem so that it is solved. And the question of prestige is here, after all, directly.
    1. chunga-changa
      chunga-changa 30 November 2015 14: 11 New
      +3
      Negative selection in action. Career-free do-it-yourselfers with a thirst for profit make everything that resists the system or does not keep up, throw it away without pity, despite any merits.
      But there is a plus, they are absolutely manageable, as soon as they say from above - they will do everything right there and hang the screens and everything else.
    2. Nehist
      Nehist 30 November 2015 14: 19 New
      +3
      But is it really not clear that this is all PR? In fact, we have very few really combat-ready units.
    3. pettabyte
      pettabyte 30 November 2015 14: 23 New
      +1
      It seems like an old saying (or a proverb, or the like): "God is high, and the king is far away."
      One of the tools to reduce such a distance "from the king" is a denunciation, anonymous.
    4. gladcu2
      gladcu2 30 November 2015 17: 51 New
      0
      BARKHAN

      I also can’t understand why they allowed me to leave the bomber without cover.

      When the USSR was in Afghanistan, carpet bombing of gorges was carried out in order to collapse destroy supply routes. So, in my opinion, long-range aviation was then accompanied by cover fighters. A threat was posed by Pakistan.
      1. BARKHAN
        BARKHAN 30 November 2015 18: 12 New
        +3
        The wisdom of rulers is not always in the ability not to step on the rake ... but in the ability not to step on them again. And the first rake was in my opinion in Tskhinvali, when attacking our peacekeepers ... Don’t trust anyone! Listen to and probe all intelligence. Keep enemies close, and "friends" even closer ... otherwise this rake has already been stoned ...
    5. Forest
      Forest 30 November 2015 22: 11 New
      0
      Su-34 flew to the north of Latakia with the cover of Su-30, that day the 30s returned from Iraq, where the danger from American aircraft was considered higher. There is no onboard DZ on the T-90, the Curtain is standing, the Arena is not in service, because dangerous for infantry and poorly intercepts targets.
  14. BARKHAN
    BARKHAN 30 November 2015 13: 29 New
    +5
    This complex. What's the problem?
    1. ermak.sidorov
      ermak.sidorov 30 November 2015 14: 10 New
      +1
      I apologize for the repetition, but it is very interesting: can this thing cover up from what flies into the tower from above ... especially if it is a cumulative core from a special anti-tank missile? Who knows, please clarify!
      1. Vadim237
        Vadim237 30 November 2015 15: 00 New
        +2
        Of course not - the strike core hits a tower from a height of five meters.
      2. gladcu2
        gladcu2 30 November 2015 18: 11 New
        +1
        A smoke screen could theoretically interfere with the accurate aiming of the TOU. As well as the high dustiness of the air at the location of the target most likely should create restrictions.
        The TOU shell has guidance elements that should not like very dusty air. The projectile is not cheap and without a good confidence of success no one will spend it.

        This is supposed to be.

        REB systems also protect to a good extent. But a tank does not protect one hundred percent from defeat.

        It is important to understand the tactics of using tanks. Since only this knowledge truly preserves the technique.
    2. ermak.sidorov
      ermak.sidorov 1 December 2015 10: 16 New
      0
      Arena - GOOD!
      But the video says that it works on missiles and grenades ... I wonder if it will work on a sub-caliber armor-piercing projectile of another tank or gun ... it seems to me there are slightly different speeds. Looking at the picture of placing the arena on the tower, one gets the feeling that there is almost no space left for the DZ ... but if it remains, how will they affect each other when triggered?
      KETTLE OFFER:
      Jews have a gizmo (in my opinion, it is called the "iron dome") and it was written about her that she can use a laser to remove or destroy not only missiles with mines, but also artillery shells. So here - it glues over the tank unit "Arena", we hide the infantry to hell, and give this unit an analogue of the "iron dome" on a mobile armored chassis. The arena covers from missiles, the dome from shells and TOW, which will chase someone nito into the tower from above to gasp ... it seems that it should work in the field, but it will not roll in urban development anyway ...
  15. Yak-3P
    Yak-3P 30 November 2015 13: 33 New
    +2
    the new tank itself is good, but the Bashar doesn’t have it .. the most important crew !! how many tanks with TOU killed ??? judging by the u-tube of 100 pieces maximum and everything else just got up due to running out of motor resources or shot off its fluff - then they beat at least 2-bq per day at least
    1. pettabyte
      pettabyte 30 November 2015 14: 25 New
      0
      It is precisely what tanks in such conflicts especially save (and how not to save it, if they are a little more than not, new plants will not be built).
  16. ALX
    ALX 30 November 2015 13: 39 New
    +1
    Yes, they will not be used in urban battles. For those purposes, more likely another technique has already been delivered. Ehh, this is where Klub systems are needed to cover the base and control borders, and more shells are needed. God forbid, the Turks were tasked with creating a conflict (to legitimately block the strait and squeeze our forces out of the region). I wonder what the base is covered from cruise missiles? Indeed, as NATO practice shows, they like to deliver a massive blow. How many missiles launched at once can we repel?
    1. qwaigon
      qwaigon 30 November 2015 14: 37 New
      +1
      Who cares how many missiles. Read the new military doctrine of the Russian Federation. The possibility of a nuclear weapons response when the aggressor uses conventional weapons.
      1. ALX
        ALX 30 November 2015 14: 59 New
        +3
        Yes, never ours will be applied first, so we are different. The Turks are bait, the States are just waiting for this from us. And there is still time to cover the base.
      2. ALX
        ALX 30 November 2015 14: 59 New
        0
        Yes, never ours will be applied first, so we are different. The Turks are bait, the States are just waiting for this from us. And there is still time to cover the base.
  17. chikenous59
    chikenous59 30 November 2015 13: 51 New
    +1
    [quote = vetluga] Do not make people laugh. The war has been going on for 4 years, where can I get the money? All equipment is either free or in long-term installments. [/ Quote]
    And what, in the territories controlled by the Syrian army there is no oil? [/ Quote]
    Countryman, and what to feed people for? And how much oil will you get when you are constantly under fire?
    1. pettabyte
      pettabyte 30 November 2015 14: 26 New
      0
      Plus, the price of oil (speculative), as we know from the news, fell two times.

      But it is possible and on credit (all the same, the Russian Federation loves to forgive them, there is a chance), under preferences (trade, development of deposits, something else), under the eternal presence of our military bases there (for free). Well, the city (or a place for it) by the sea will not be given to us (as China gave statues to Hong Kong), but you can think of a lot.
  18. Mestny
    Mestny 30 November 2015 14: 29 New
    -1
    Quote: sever.56
    they also give an occasion to our “liberot” and the Western media enthusiastically nibble our defense industry, again screaming about the “rusty Russian pieces of iron”.

    The media and others will still do this, regardless of the quality of our technology.
    Well, in fact, why did all the experts fuss about that? Well put, well it is possible (though so far according to experts) it turned out that the protection is insufficient. So that's the reason to make it sufficient.
    That’s why they sent it, so as not to evaluate it at the training ground, but in real conditions.
  19. Maksus
    Maksus 30 November 2015 14: 39 New
    0
    Quote: Now we are free
    I, too, can do such a cut for you, I’ll come to Kubinka, curse before M1A1 “Abrams” and then under the video sequence where “Abrams” fires at someone I will comment -The United States has sworn allegiance to Russia, and now, on the orders of Vladimir Putin, they are destroying their former ISIS proteges and Al Qaeda ... laughing

    Make such a video, I beg! Although I’ll look at Abrams live)))) And before you, no one has announced its availability in Kubinka.
  20. Dim Bes
    Dim Bes 30 November 2015 14: 58 New
    0
    Quote: Now we are free
    I swear in front of the M1A1 Abrams and then

    Sorry for the ignorance, but in Kubinka, there’s exactly Abrams, no matter what modification?
    1. novobranets
      novobranets 30 November 2015 15: 42 New
      0
      He is not there.
  21. mvg
    mvg 30 November 2015 15: 16 New
    0
    voyaka uh IL Today, 14:38 PM ↑ New

    The check will be like this:
    whether the modern integrated DZ of the frontal part of the T-90 can withstand
    TOU rocket shot.
    And the answer, for sure, will not keep itself waiting.
    The militants also watch youtube and know that the T-90 arrived.


    And T-90MS "Breakthrough" and T-72 "for work in the city" - single copies .. Terminators are still not adopted. T-72B3 is a "biathlon" version, toy (the cheapest upgrade).
    T-90A - not much different from the T-72M (and options).
    TOU-2A - armor penetration up to 800 mm per DZ. Herenovo will have to T-90A.
    If we do not have the opportunity to deliver 200-300 tanks to Syria (but it is not), then we must set the best so that the failure of 4-5 pieces of equipment does not become a disaster. Remember the bad word Grozny .. There not only burned T-62 without DZ. There were both T-80U and T-72M.
    The Syrian army is really bloodless. Kurds are not so heavily armed. There are few Iranians. Hezbollah - light infantry, special forces. There is nothing easy to attack the city. That is why neither Aleppo nor Racca have yet been taken. Yes, and not a single large city, too .. And the Saudis and Turks have dofig money .. And they are close at hand .. Bearded ones are abundant. And their training course is not 1.5 months, as in the Syrian army.
    Aviation, if not on a scale of 1000-1500 sorties per day, does not do weather. Now, ISIS will appear MANPADS, medium-range air defense (there will be old KHOKi, Krotal'i, South Africa pulled up .., Ukrainians, then in Syria and Iraq were captured air defense bases, and then S-75, S-125 ..) and the airborne will suffer losses .. Specials will be bought (Ukrainians, Croats, Bosnians).
    10-15 thousand from the "corps of guardians of the Islamic revolution" will not solve strategic problems. It needs many times more. In ISIS there are not whipping boys; there are professional military men from Iraq and Syria, mercenaries who have had years of war behind them, and modern weapons.
    So it's too early to talk about victory. "Afghanistan" we can not pull now ..
    1. avva2012
      avva2012 30 November 2015 15: 49 New
      0
      And what, we have with the generals, absolutely seams? They don’t understand this? Possible use, as an exit, of vacuum bombs? Why are there few Iranians? Bargain, want something extra? Some questions.
      1. Lord_Sita
        Lord_Sita 30 November 2015 18: 36 New
        0
        Quote: avva2012
        And what, we have with the generals, absolutely seams? They don’t understand this? Possible use, as an exit, of vacuum bombs? Why are there few Iranians? Bargain, want something extra? Some questions.

        You forgot about the "party policy", and it, as usual, decides a lot.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. vandarus
      vandarus 30 November 2015 16: 03 New
      0
      The loss of tanks during the assault on Grozny is a separate issue. There are a lot of reasons: zero training of crews, erroneous tactics of use and, at the end, criminal offense (let’s recall how they stole explosives from DZ in places where equipment was stored), but we won’t remember that some of the “crews” consisted of mechanics and KBM. But I agree with the fact that "T-90A - not much different from the T-72M (and options)" I can not. If you look at the layout of the engine-transmission-weapons, then yes. And the rest of the SLA, reservation elements, Curtain, ARENA-increase the chances. It is only surprising that on the frontal projection of the t-90 under the emitters of the Curtain there is no DZ.
    4. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 1 December 2015 16: 16 New
      0
      for mvg:
      Yes, I do not argue with your general conclusions on Syria ...
      A difficult situation. Protracted campaign.
      I'm interested in the technical aspect now. Which DZ is better:
      built-in or mounted? Can modern remote sensing delay
      modern ATGM. Israel is also experimenting with DZ, although it is not on Merkava-4.
      A check gives only a fight. I always regret the dead tankers
      but war is war.
  22. vandarus
    vandarus 30 November 2015 15: 44 New
    +2
    The use of tanks in battle conditions in the city requires skills that our crews do not have. And in general, the expediency of using a tank in the city, especially on the narrow streets of Syrian cities, is doubtful. In these circumstances, BMPT with its greater visibility of the crew would be useful to support assault groups in urban neighborhoods.
  23. dchegrinec
    dchegrinec 30 November 2015 15: 54 New
    0
    Naturally, they should not be anymore naked! This is a war, not a tank striptease ..
  24. Riv
    Riv 30 November 2015 16: 13 New
    0
    Well, tanks are needed there in order to guard the base. What is the problem?
  25. tolmachiev51
    tolmachiev51 30 November 2015 16: 28 New
    +1
    At times you are surprised that they forgot to send cover to the bombers, now to put up protection for the tanks, is that a war or a show of gouging generals ??? !!!
  26. Vladimir
    Vladimir 30 November 2015 16: 28 New
    0
    If new developments exist, I don’t think that Syria is the best testing ground, and it all depends on the crew, competent tactics and knowledge of the area will also be a kind of weapon.
  27. mamont5
    mamont5 30 November 2015 16: 39 New
    0
    Quote: Black
    Unfortunately, there is no war without loss. So be that as it may, the decision to deliver the T-90A to the Syrians is CORRECT!

    But were they delivered? A company (10 pcs.) For an oran base is not a delivery.
  28. VadimSt
    VadimSt 30 November 2015 16: 40 New
    +1
    There are strange comments, such as - why full protection, because the tanks delivered to Syria are intended to protect the base, and not for a tank breakthrough. So maybe the "protection" of ammunition to issue only in a direct attack.
  29. Vittt
    Vittt 30 November 2015 16: 45 New
    -4
    Quote: Sasha 19871987
    for some reason everyone has forgotten about the “arena” active defense complex, this is a worthy thing in the duet with “curtain-1” !!!

    But, for sure, our valiant senior officers from the rear services didn’t forget to compromise, and they probably didn’t forget to share either.
    It is a disgrace to put tanks in the minimum configuration in the area of ​​military operations.
    And the impression is that we only see it.
    Shoigu does not see, Gerasimov does not see (what if there are only two of these gratings in the army (one at the exhibition, the other at the exercises)?
  30. mvg
    mvg 30 November 2015 17: 33 New
    +1
    Quote: vandarus
    The loss of tanks during the assault on Grozny is a separate issue. There are a lot of reasons: zero training of crews, erroneous tactics of use and, at the end, criminal offense (let’s recall how they stole explosives from DZ in places where equipment was stored), but we won’t remember that some of the “crews” consisted of mechanics and KBM. But I agree with the fact that "T-90A - not much different from the T-72M (and options)" I can not. If you look at the layout of the engine-transmission-weapons, then yes. And the rest of the SLA, reservation elements, Curtain, ARENA-increase the chances. It is only surprising that on the frontal projection of the t-90 under the emitters of the Curtain there is no DZ.

    When one well-known general of the Russian Ministry of Defense spoke of the T-90 as the 17th reincarnation of the T-72, do you think he was cunning? Played in public? Does not confuse the fact that we buy T-72B3? And the T-90s project is "fucked up" after 400 units with which "went" to the troops? Maybe in the Moscow Region not only the robbers are sitting?
    Yes, an improved SLA (the new Sosna-U sight, it seems, a French thermal imager, etc.), an engine of 1130 hp instead of 780. DZ of a new generation .. Only all this can be stuck on 72 matches. There is no qualitative breakthrough. Tagil just needed to live.
    This is not enough to "pick up the visor" to go to war in Syria. After they start to burn, there will be so much noise ... Remember 2006, the Jews were blasphemed, after the assassination of 2-3 Merkav .. And this is the most protected tank in the world (at least the God-chosen ones truly believe in this).
    In our case, there will be more .. TOU-2A, several thousand delivered, RPGs — but FIG knows how many were captured in Iraq and Syria ... I think even more. Jordan itself produces, under license, our ATGMs .. Given that teaching arap to fight is not an easy task (Tom Cruise would give up, despite all the "impossible missions"), the losses will be terrible ..
    The Iranians, I think, also understand this very well ... therefore they support only instructors .. someone else's "meat" is not a pity ..
    PS: For myself, I "concluded": The minimum task is to squeeze out territories where the Alawites live mainly, where resources (oil, gas), the Syrian-Turkish border, the entire coast and ... gain a foothold .. The election must be won .. the pro-Asad candidate should win .. Freeze the conflict. The maximum task - I do not think that is real .. to return Syria to the borders before the civil war .. and save Assad.
    Let the West deal with Iraq .. Somehow the Iraqis did not ask for help, do not know why? repeat
    1. avva2012
      avva2012 1 December 2015 04: 46 New
      0
      The United States did not enter Iraq to give it away.
      If you look at the map, do you not consider the convergent strike of Kurds and Syrians on Idlib? In any case, for starters, of course, you need to take Allepo. In addition, sanctions were lifted from Iran. Is there no option that the Syrians will officially ask Iran for help?
    2. hydrox
      hydrox 1 December 2015 13: 43 New
      0
      Quote: mvg
      Somehow the Iraqis never asked for help, you don’t know why


      When an American sergeant is brought to your apartment, I’ll also see to what extent you will show your independence in choosing a lifestyle, communicating with your wife, raising children ...
      laughing
  31. hartlend
    hartlend 30 November 2015 20: 15 New
    +1
    The photos of the “Syrian” T-90A tanks that filled the Internet in recent days at first aroused joyful excitement among users: now the militants will get the full amount on the ground. However, the tone of the controversy gradually changed - visitors to social networks began to express concerns about the lack of protection of military equipment, the Vestnik Mordoviya agency writes. According to experts, "in the form in which the T-90A were delivered to Syria, they are not optimized enough for battles in this" hot spot "," the newspaper writes.


    Now our tanks are evaluated by Internet users, visitors to social networks (apparently not related to Internet users) and some experts. Why then the General Staff. Let's decide by voting which technique to use.