Military Review

How Erdogan Israel punished

233
The conflict between Turkey and Russia (as if due to the downed Su-24) is rapidly expanding, and now Moscow is preparing a package of economic sanctions against Erdogan, starting with the ban on importing harmful products and ending with the ban on tourist trips.


How Erdogan Israel punished


I involuntarily recall a very similar situation when in the summer of 2010 this same Erdogan was furious that Israeli special forces attacked the Turkish flotilla in the Gaza Strip (Mavi-Marmara raid on Wikipedia), and 9 Turkish Islamists were killed in a shootout. By the way, the same Islamist organization IHH, whose convoy with weapons Russian bombing for ISIS aviation last night.

In 2010, Turkey was so outraged that some small Israel took and stopped their imperial ambitions, not being afraid to stop the Islamists who violated the Israeli border, which immediately expelled the Israeli ambassador from Ankara, in one fell swoop ordered to stop all types of economic cooperation, stop flights and enter visas for Israelis.

Readers living in Turkey will not let me lie that this country has been raging the whole 2010 year. A wave of anti-Israeli demonstrations swept through Turkish cities, leaders called for Israel to declare war and return the greatness of the Ottoman Empire. In parallel, the Turkish court declared the entire military and political leadership of Israel war criminals. Turkish demonstrators in Istanbul carried fascist flags and shouted "Hitler was right!"

How does the conflict between Turkey and Israel differ from the conflict between Turkey and Russia?

First, Russia is a much more serious player on the world stage than Israel. Secondly, the trade turnover between Russia and Turkey is five times more than between Turkey and Israel. Third, the attitude of the “Turkish street” towards Israel was initially quite negative due to the growing Islamization of Turkey. If in Russia the Turks see a strong neighbor, whom they dislike, but are forced to reckon with it, then Israel for them is not clear where the “education” which came from, which surprisingly managed to quickly turn into a regional superpower with a nuclear arsenal.

Thus, the Turks behaved too emotionally from the very beginning, underestimated Israel and the pro-Israel lobby in Europe and the USA.

Erdogan stopped all military cooperation between Israel and Turkey, and yet it was Israel that was one of the three main suppliers of weapons for the Turkish army, especially on equipment with modern technologies. Interrupting all contracts, the Turkish budget was short of one and a half billion (!) Dollars already paid in advance to Israeli military factories. In addition, maintenance of the already supplied equipment was discontinued, due to which hundreds of Turkish combat aircraft undergoing modernization turned out to be inoperative and the Turks hastily began to look for alternative partners, losing hundreds of millions again and again. By the way, all these senseless wastes imputed to Erdogan his opponents and the opposition.

Erdogan has banned Turkish travel to Israel, but the fact is that no Turkish tourism existed in Israel even before the conflict. Of the modest 10-15 thousands of Turks who visited Israel annually, 90% were businessmen, not tourists. As for the Israelis, they themselves stopped traveling to Turkey. The Israeli authorities did not cancel any tours, did not cancel the flights. They simply warned that there is a risk of Islamic terrorism in Turkey. And instantly, Israeli tourism to Turkey stopped on its own, because the Israelis did not want to go to a country where it was dangerous and where they were not expected.

All decisions of the Turkish courts were absolutely meaningless and not valid outside of Turkey itself, since Interpol is not authorized to deal with the leaders of the UN member states. The courts are sluggishly drawn to this day and the Turks are suing themselves, since there are no defendants or any legal basis for their prosecution. This is tantamount to, as if an aunt of the peace of some 147 plot Elektrougli Moscow region found Barack Obama guilty of the troubles of Russia.

Erdogan absolutely spontaneously even began to actively make friends with the leader of Syria, Bashar Assad, promising the latter all possible assistance in the fight against Israel. And by the way, everything between Turkey and Syria was not easy even in the best years because of the perception of the Syrians by the Turks as a breakaway region of the Ottoman Empire. However, acting on the principle of the enemy of my enemy - my friend, Erdogan ordered to cancel visas for Syrians to Turkey.

And a year has not passed since Turkey and Syria began to “make friends” against Israel, and Erdogan has already quarreled with Assad. There could not be a real union, if only because of mutual territorial claims and the Kurdish question. But Erdogan got millions of Syrian refugees who, taking advantage of free entry, rushed to Turkey, fleeing from the war.

If the conflict between Israel and Turkey were limited to “parochial” disassembly of two neighbors at the level of “oh, you are so - then I will forbid your chicken”, then the Americans would not intervene. A bit small. But in a situation where a project called ISIS got out of control of its creators, the conflict between two key players in the Middle East created a lot of problems. Each side bent its line and defended its own interests, creating problems for each other and the Americans. Israel was supported by some Syrian factions, Turkey by others, Saudi Arabia and Qatar by third parties. Then came Iran, whose presence in the Syrian war is not in the interests of either side.

The Americans and Europe put pressure on both sides, both on Turkey and on Israel. The general idea is that the conflict between the two countries harms the common position of the West on Syria. Israel was demanded to apologize to Turkey for the death of its citizens on that ship with the Islamists, and the Turks were obliged to return relations between the countries as they were before the conflict. As a result, Netanyahu made a lengthy statement that “... Israel regrets that Turkish citizens died and, for humanitarian reasons, will pay compensation to their families,” while not recognizing Israel’s guilt for their deaths.

Jews deceived us! - Erdogan exclaimed after two years of dismal negotiations with the Israeli delegation on the amount of compensation to the Turkish Islamists who died on that ship in 2010 year. After dozens (!) Of meetings and conferences, it was not agreed how much Israel would pay the Turks. Figures leaked to the press that the Turks wanted 5 million dollars for each family, and Israel was ready to pay only 100 thousand. Oh funny, is not it? East market. Then it turned out that the negotiators from the Israeli side were not at all authorized to decide anything. Several times people changed, amounts, terms. Now it's the end of 2015 of the year, and Israel has not paid a cent to the Turks. Well, who would doubt.

Formally, this was explained by the fact that the Turks first wanted money, and then were ready to go to the world. And the Israelis, who in the same measure did not believe Erdogan’s single word (“love and trust” are mutual here) dragged time. Many Turkish families, meanwhile, who watched the negotiations, were offended and refused to take money from Israel, as stated in the Turkish media, they say, stop the humiliating bargaining on our behalf with the enemy that we disdain to take money from them. The position of the families was held by many political parties in Turkey, who accused Erdogan of humiliating for Turkey a bargain about ridiculous amounts by state standards, while Israel did not even admit its guilt, and as a result is only ready to render incomprehensible humanitarian assistance to "poor Turks".

On the other hand, both the United States and its own opposition put pressure on Erdogan. The conflict with Israel had to somehow stop, but without losing face. A lot of words were said, a lot of recriminations were made, a lot of money was lost. Someone had to answer for all this.

The Turks thought and decided - and we will freeze the conflict! For the past six months, nothing has been heard about the courts against the leaders of Israel, or about compensation. No visas were entered into the Israelis by the Turks, the air traffic even expanded (now not only Turkish but Pegasus flies to Israel), trade increased from 2,6 billion dollars to 2009 year, that is, to conflict, to 5,7 billion in 2014 year. The Israeli ambassador somehow imperceptibly materialized in Ankara again, and the Turkish - in Tel Aviv. No apology has followed, compensation has sunk into oblivion.

Turks are Turks.
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233 comments
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  1. Cetegg
    Cetegg 28 November 2015 06: 28 New
    50
    Erdogan is a political corpse! With p and n d about with and you will be led - you will get nipped by ties!)
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 06: 35 New
      52
      Quote: Cetegg
      With p and n d about with and you will be led - you will get nipped by ties!)

      It’s good to throw hats, Turkey is a strong enemy with a strong army. How many we did not fight with, and we did not have easy victories. If there is a warrior with them, before he begins to chew ties, he will spend quite a lot of time and our losses will not be small.
      1. icas
        icas 28 November 2015 06: 43 New
        10
        Fighting with Erdogan does not mean fighting with Turkey and the Turks.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 07: 04 New
          30
          Quote: icas
          Fighting with Erdogan does not mean fighting with Turkey and the Turks.

          Yeah, but to fight Obama is not to fight the United States.
          Fighting with Putin does not mean fighting with Russia. Bu ha ha
          1. nadezhiva
            nadezhiva 28 November 2015 09: 47 New
            +4
            US media are broadcasting about the possible entry of contingent to the Turkish-Syrian border.
            "US officials say that the additional contingent on the Turkish border, which will include infantry and artillery, could be the most effective way to block the key transit routes relied on by IS fighters in Syria, as well as stop the flow of foreign fighters to Europe," The Wall Street Journal.
            "The rules of the game have changed. Enough is enough. The border should be closed," the representative of the US administration quotes the issue as saying. "There is a threat of international proportions, it comes from Syria and passes through Turkey."

            Grushko: NATO understands that Turkey creates risks for the entire alliance
            The United States has not officially indicated how many troops are in question, the newspaper notes. According to estimates of its sources in the Pentagon, more than 10 thousand soldiers may be needed to complete this task.
            “It is not yet clear how Turkey will react,” the article says. “As Turkish officials said, they agree that it is necessary to tighten security measures at the border and that they have begun to take some measures.”
            "American officials warned Ankara that she could face a" serious response "from European states if Turkey could not close the border, and foreign fighters could once again escape from Syria and commit a terrorist attack in Europe," the article says.
            (transmits TASS)
            recourse Was this the original goal?
        2. INVESTOR
          INVESTOR 28 November 2015 08: 45 New
          28
          I visited Turkey more than once as a tourist, and every time I had an appetizer with the Turks, most often because of our women, and their Turks had an attitude towards them, although many of them are happy to spread their legs. The contemptuous attitude of the Turks towards the Russians is felt by the skin. By the way, the Poles have always stood up for us against cockroaches.
          1. Styx
            Styx 28 November 2015 10: 06 New
            -4
            The Turks have a holy custom: they deceived the European - he lived the day not in vain! This, by the way, is the general mentality of the Semitic group. Alas ... They continue to live with this, nothing has happened. Hypocrisy with diapers is brought up
            1. Aaron Zawi
              Aaron Zawi 28 November 2015 10: 30 New
              15
              Quote: Styx
              The Turks have a holy custom: they deceived the European - he lived the day not in vain! This, by the way, is the general mentality of the Semitic group. Alas ... They continue to live with this, nothing has happened. Hypocrisy with diapers is brought up

              Turks Semites? laughing What about the Iranians?
              1. atalef
                atalef 28 November 2015 12: 37 New
                +4
                Quote: Aaron Zawi
                Quote: Styx
                The Turks have a holy custom: they deceived the European - he lived the day not in vain! This, by the way, is the general mentality of the Semitic group. Alas ... They continue to live with this, nothing has happened. Hypocrisy with diapers is brought up

                Turks Semites? laughing What about the Iranians?

                Then the Iranians are Spaniards wink
                1. Styx
                  Styx 30 November 2015 08: 55 New
                  0
                  Irani, Jews, Turks, Arabs - hypocrisy and duplicity cannot be burned out by fire! The rest is bullshit. Yes, and the Turks in Turkey, what is the percentage ?? So how can you not name them, and what they can do, they can. If you only find fault with the Semites, then it’s ridiculous .... Without missing the fact of mentality, you look and you would avoid tragedy. And so .... As they say, nature and psychology rules .... Lord officers ....
              2. padded jacket
                padded jacket 28 November 2015 19: 55 New
                +1
                Quote: Aaron Zawi
                Turks Semites?

                Semites are still Jews laughing
            2. miru mir
              miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 12 New
              +3
              But the Turks, of course belong to the Semitic group? fool
            3. atalef
              atalef 28 November 2015 12: 36 New
              +2
              Quote: Styx
              This, incidentally, is the general mentality of the Semitic group.

              belay
              Turks are Turks.
            4. Pimply
              Pimply 28 November 2015 13: 00 New
              +6
              Quote: Styx
              The Turks have a holy custom: they deceived the European - he lived the day not in vain! This, by the way, is the general mentality of the Semitic group. Alas ... They continue to live with this, nothing has happened. Hypocrisy with diapers is brought up

              The Turks, child, belong to the Turkic group, and have nothing to do with the Semites
              1. bannik
                bannik 28 November 2015 16: 25 New
                +1
                And mentality?
            5. Seal
              Seal 29 November 2015 01: 41 New
              -1
              Who can they fool? The Turks actually engaged in trade by historical standards not so long ago. And back in 1912 (before the First World War), 80% of Turkey's domestic trade and more than 60% of export-import turnover were in the hands of the Armenians. And there were still Greeks and Jews. Well, what remained of the Turks themselves in Turkey before the First World War?
        3. pilot8878
          pilot8878 28 November 2015 14: 45 New
          +3
          Quote: icas
          Fighting with Erdogan does not mean fighting with Turkey and the Turks.

          Over the past 200 years, Turkey has not fought alone against Russia. But always with a "support group" in the person of England and France and Germany. Now the United States will join this gang.
          1. Cossack Ermak
            Cossack Ermak 28 November 2015 23: 03 New
            0
            Quote: pilot8878
            Quote: icas
            Fighting with Erdogan does not mean fighting with Turkey and the Turks.

            Over the past 200 years, Turkey has not fought alone against Russia. But always with a "support group" in the person of England and France and Germany. Now the United States will join this gang.

            You are about Germany, as you forgot ...
      2. Cetegg
        Cetegg 28 November 2015 06: 44 New
        17
        and no one is talking about an open war with Turkey. They are no matter how in NATO, but we are too early to compete with NATO. Press them economically so that their own Janissaries, Erdogan and his entire family are uplifted) PS No matter how the 21st century is the era of hybrid and economical wars!)
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 07: 05 New
          +5
          Quote: Cetegg
          and no one speaks about open war with Turkey. They are as if in NATO, and it’s too early for us to go with NATO.

          But NATO will not shake it, they are not profitable.
          1. Cetegg
            Cetegg 28 November 2015 07: 28 New
            +6
            I understood you correctly that in the event of a direct military clash between Russia and Turkey, NATO will not “stick up” -?!) And many “members” in NATO will remain when it is revealed that all the agreements on mutual assistance among the alliance are fiction ?!) Do not forget that all the NATO countries have troops deployed, our most sworn "friend" - the United States, who does not ask their "satellites" profitably for them - is not profitable)) for them it will be "beneficial" what they say to do in Washington, and then all of a sudden their regime is not "democratic" or they will oppress anyone in the country!)) And they will let us beat Tu radio stations and raise the prestige of Russia (we will be logical 1 on 1 the Turks have no chance) ?!)))
            1. Alexander Romanov
              Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 07: 41 New
              +9
              Quote: Cetegg
              I correctly understood you that in the event of a direct military clash between Russia and Turkey - NATO will not "get up" -?!

              And why should they get stuck, Russia will not attack Turkey first, but Turkey can now do it. The USA is delighted, they will be supported politically, but no more. Russia is dragged into a major warrior with heavy human and economic losses. Why should it be stuck in a nuclear warrior when and so everything is as it should.
              Quote: Cetegg
              And many "members" in NATO will remain when it is revealed that all the agreements on mutual assistance among the alliance are fiction ?!)

              There are many, as long as there is the United States there will be many, but Turkey-Turkey itself is to blame. Acted alone without consulting the alliance.
              Quote: Cetegg
              And they will give us a victory over Turkey and increase the prestige of Russia (we will be logical 1 on 1, the Turks have no chance) ?!)))

              Plsde began warriors diplomacy flies in the ass, then no one will listen to anyone. Especially Washington.
              1. Cetegg
                Cetegg 28 November 2015 07: 49 New
                +6
                Dear Alexander, do you seriously think that the provocation with the SU-24m was exclusively a Turkish undertaking and the ears of our overseas “partners” do not stick out from there ?!)
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                Russia will not attack Turkey first
                - At the highest state level, it was stated that the air objects that threaten our aerospace forces will be destroyed. What will happen if ours gets down a Turkish plane “accidentally” flying next to ours ?!) There’s a reason for you, then the “who” first shut down safely.
                1. Alexander Romanov
                  Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 07: 56 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Cetegg
                  Dear Alexander, do you seriously think that the provocation with the SU-24m was exclusively a Turkish undertaking and the ears of our overseas “partners” do not stick out from there ?!)

                  And what of that, even if this is so, the United States remains satisfied without incurring any losses whatsoever.
                  Quote: Cetegg
                  At the highest state level, it was stated that the air objects that threaten our aerospace forces will be destroyed.

                  The word threaten you saw? You are able to distinguish defense against attack?
                  1. Cetegg
                    Cetegg 28 November 2015 08: 08 New
                    +2
                    what you can provoke us into account you do not take?
                    1. atalef
                      atalef 28 November 2015 14: 57 New
                      -1
                      Quote: Cetegg
                      what you can provoke us into account you do not take?

                      And continue
                      Crimean truckers cannot leave Turkey due to the cancellation of the ferry service along the Zonguldak - Sevastopol line and the tacit ban on the passage of Russian freight transport across the border, Krymniform informs with reference to the owner of one of the trucks, Ivan Kuzemu. He claims that for the third day he cannot leave Turkey, and in this situation there are dozens of people. Crimean authorities verify the information, TASS said in the government of the republic.

                      “In Turkey, at the port of Zonguldak, there are Crimean cars with drivers and they can’t leave home. One ferry went to the Crimea, and they stopped it. No one can tell them how to get there,” the carrier said. “There are about 30 Crimean in Turkey cars, we keep in touch. Turkish ferries refused to transport cars with Russian numbers. "

                      Turkish Foreign Ministry recommended that citizens refrain from traveling to Russia, reports Reuters
                  2. soroKING
                    soroKING 28 November 2015 08: 58 New
                    +4
                    Alexander! Absolutely ... Americans in any situation in the pros ... and especially not worrying hi
                2. WUA 518
                  WUA 518 28 November 2015 08: 00 New
                  +3
                  Quote: Cetegg
                  threaten our videoconferencing

                  The threat should be real and not imaginary. Here is a wide field for various provocations.
                  Quote: Cetegg
                  will be destroyed.

                  Maybe only as they say after all warning measures and a warning shot up.
                  1. Alexander Romanov
                    Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 08: 08 New
                    +4
                    Quote: WUA 518

                    Maybe only as they say after all warning measures and a warning shot up.

                    Sanya is great! It will not matter, take Erdogan who yells that 10 times warned our-LIES? Of course he’s lying, and let ours make really 10 warning shots, he will lie that they were not.
                    1. WUA 518
                      WUA 518 28 November 2015 08: 17 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Alexander Romanov
                      let ours make really 10 warning shots, he will lie that they were not there.

                      Hi Sash. REB members will now write negotiations for anyone. And the effect of the aircraft which was forced to land, and put ..... This will be a real "bun."
                      1. Boa kaa
                        Boa kaa 28 November 2015 09: 21 New
                        +7
                        Quote: WUA 518
                        EW members will now write negotiations for anyone.

                        Rebovtsy, in fact, put obstacles, and the RTR talks writes ... bully
                  2. Cetegg
                    Cetegg 28 November 2015 08: 13 New
                    +4
                    Yes, at least 200 warnings and 88 warning shots up - who will the Western media blame ?! do you remember how the "Western" media coverage the events "honestly"?
                  3. Boa kaa
                    Boa kaa 28 November 2015 09: 19 New
                    +7
                    Quote: WUA 518
                    Maybe only as they say after all warning measures and a warning shot up.

                    Quote: Alexander Romanov
                    and let ours make real xnumx warning shots

                    Guys! Well, no C-400 missiles would be enough to make "fake" shots. You're not in the guardroom, damn it, however!
                    Yes, and Sushka, in order to show the route, you need to get close to Falcon on the range of visual contact ... Well, who the hell is this going to be when the ARLS exposure indicator blinks in your cockpit?
                    I am sure that after this incident, the coalition pilots received warnings about the ban (without special instructions) on flights in this zone.
                3. 33 Watcher
                  33 Watcher 28 November 2015 09: 21 New
                  +2
                  It will be exactly the same as with our Drying ... Yelling Erdogan and statements from NATO countries that, no need to go on an escalation. You all observed this three days ago. Nothing more will happen ...
                  While the Turks suspended their flights, it is possible that in a month they will risk checking, checking ... That's all. Nothing more will happen.
              2. Boa kaa
                Boa kaa 28 November 2015 09: 04 New
                +7
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                and Turkey-Turkey itself is to blame. Acted alone without consulting the alliance.
                Erdogan froze the provocation, blessing Obama when he expressed her plan at the G-20 meeting. The Arab media was talking about it, and for some reason I believe in it. yes
                1. Ascetic
                  Ascetic 28 November 2015 09: 53 New
                  +1
                  Quote: BoA KAA
                  Erdogan froze the provocation, blessing Obama when he expressed her plan at the G-20 meeting. The Arab media was talking about it, and for some reason I believe in it.


                  Greetings, Alexander! The fact that this provocation was planned and agreed upon in the White House or Langley is already an indisputable fact ... but there is one caveat / as in the bearded joke about Vasily Ivanovich and Petka / ... For some reason, the version is closer to me. Which the media and numerous analysts and experts, its essence is that the action was planned BEFORE the G20 summit began in Ankara and not AFTER ... Obviously, if this had happened before the summit, Putin would have been put in a difficult condition and it was impossible to go and not to go either. in both cases, “loss of face” and unpredictable political and diplomatic losses and failures ... And now there is a certain time lag for an adequate response without loss of face and diplomatic complications ... They are the Turks who gave the Turks a command to them and forgot to cancel. ..Now they’ll dissolve, now the Americans are already demanded that Turkey close the border for IS fighters
                  "US officials warned Ankara that she could face a" serious response "from European states if Turkey couldn’t close the border and foreign militants again managed to slip out of Syria and commit a terrorist attack in Europe,"


                  Well, a joke about the nuances of big politics. Have a happy and peaceful weekend!
                  Petka approaches Vasily Ivanovich and asks:
                  -Vasily Ivanovich, what is a nuance?
                  -Take off Petya’s pants, become in a pose, now I’ll explain to you.
                  Petka took off his covers, began to pose, Vasily Ivanovich inserts him as expected and says:
                  -That you see Petka - you have a bolt in the ass and I have one too, but there is one NUANCE ... laughing
                  1. Pimply
                    Pimply 28 November 2015 13: 03 New
                    +3
                    Quote: Ascetic
                    Greetings, Alexander! The fact that this provocation was planned and agreed upon in the White House or Langley is already an indisputable fact ..

                    This is just debatable. Turks have their own ambitions and often do things that make the same States clutch their heads
                    1. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 28 New
                      0
                      Quote: Pimply
                      This is just debatable. Turks have their own ambitions and often do things that make the same States clutch their heads

                      What difference does it make if the US essentially sets a common line of behavior. What they grab onto there and who grabs there is already the tenth matter.
                    2. zadorin1974
                      zadorin1974 28 November 2015 13: 51 New
                      -1
                      Not in this particular situation, Eugene. The Turks wouldn’t have enough brains to calculate the situation. Even look at how they failed 100% operation (if the Turks would have captured the pilots, we would have been in full operation)
                    3. Ascetic
                      Ascetic 28 November 2015 15: 40 New
                      +3
                      Quote: Pimply
                      This is just debatable. Turks have their own ambitions and often do things that make the same States clutch their heads


                      And I don’t argue, just if you carefully analyze the daily reports of the Ministry of Defense, you get the following picture. that in the period about 10-12 days before the Ankara summit, front-line bombers and attack aircraft in this area did not conduct a free search and did not attack objects. As you know, strategists worked and a couple of times the SU-34. which you simply cannot beat without risking engaging in a full-fledged air battle and raking accordingly. Based on the foregoing, we can assume. what
                      the Turks simply could not bring down an airplane with impunity near their border at that time.
                      However, when there were reports that our aviation began to use such a tactical device. As a free search by single planes, honestly the idea arose that it would not end well for us ... alas. It happened ...
                      By the way, with Israel, this alignment was initially impossible, because they agreed immediately right up to the mutual exchange of identification codes in order to avoid such incidents and to limit flight areas without coordination, relatively speaking, we do not work in the south, the Israelis do not fly into our region to the north and east of Syria. even conducted joint training sessions to work out technical aspects to prevent incidents in airspace.
                      With the Turks, this was not and never was ...
                      1. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 28 November 2015 15: 59 New
                        +2
                        And another interesting moment, as soon as your Bibi darted towards Putin and agreed on actions in Syria, clearly without the consent of his older brother, another Palestinian terrorist aggravation in the form of “knife attacks” arose immediately. which, incidentally, is not surprising and in its essence permanently predictable, but it really coincided again in time, which allows us to look for some cause-effect relationships in these events, and the prayers of orthodox Jews on the Temple Mount and the tightening of the "settlement policy" in the West Bank / Judea and Samaria / is just another reason and not a reason ... Again, this is only my controversial speculation if you want, but given the difficult relationship with Obama, I believe that this version also has the right to life what
                      2. miru mir
                        miru mir 28 November 2015 16: 25 New
                        -1
                        If this is so, sooner or later it will come out. Hussein did not have long ...
                2. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 25 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Ascetic
                  Now they’ll be dismantled, and now the Americans have already demanded that Turkey close the border for IS fighters

                  So what? I can also demand that the United States remove its military bases from Europe. smile
                  Quote: Ascetic
                  For some reason, the version is closer to me. Which is not voiced by the media and numerous analysts and experts, its essence is that the action was planned before the start of the G20 summit in Ankara and not AFTER ...

                  The same crazy version as all the others.
            2. miru mir
              miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 15 New
              +1
              It’s unlikely to reach nuclear. Yes, and no one needs war now, not Russia, not Turkey.
              1. IS-80
                IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 29 New
                0
                Quote: miru mir
                It’s unlikely to reach nuclear. Yes, and no one needs war now, not Russia, not Turkey.

                And here, as always, nobody will need a war, but everyone will fight. laughing
                1. miru mir
                  miru mir 28 November 2015 16: 27 New
                  +1
                  Quote: IS-80
                  And here, as always, nobody will need a war, but everyone will fight.

                  In this case, no laughing matter ...
            3. old Muscovite
              old Muscovite 28 November 2015 18: 13 New
              -1
              And why not Russia deliver an unexpected blow first when, for example, the Turks attack another country? Losses are minimal, and victory will be quick, a precedent is created by Erdogan, and V.V. never forgets anything and quickly learns. Geyrope will need to six months, then we’ll grapple with her to death. (authorship is not mine, but I agree with that.
          2. Lepila
            Lepila 28 November 2015 08: 32 New
            -8
            For all my dislike of Perdogan and Islamist Turkey, I would not be so optimistic in assessing the prospects of Russia in an open military conflict with Turkey (I do not take into account vigorous weapons)
            1. Andrea
              Andrea 28 November 2015 09: 22 New
              +5
              Quote: Lepila IL Today, 08:32 ↑ New

              For all my dislike of Perdogan and Islamist Turkey, I would not be so optimistic in assessing the prospects of Russia in an open military conflict with Turkey (I do not take into account vigorous weapons)
              And where, in your opinion, is the alleged theater of operations? In Syria, in the Black Sea? The biggest thing Turkey can do is close the straits. Everything else is connected with landing operations, and this, you know, is not a pound of raisins. What is the Turkish fleet I can’t say, but our calibers have already shown what they are capable of.
              1. Andrea
                Andrea 28 November 2015 10: 37 New
                +1
                P.S. I looked at the Turkish Navy, not a lot. Http://www.warships.ru/Turkey/
            2. 33 Watcher
              33 Watcher 28 November 2015 09: 26 New
              +5
              Quote: Lepila
              For all my dislike of Perdogan and Islamist Turkey, I would not be so optimistic in assessing the prospects of Russia with an open

              ... My hatred of Russia is much stronger!
              That will be true. And more honestly ... laughing
              Evil humor in the morning. But in every joke, as you know ... yes
              1. Lepila
                Lepila 28 November 2015 10: 09 New
                +2
                Talk nonsense. Russia is not our ally, but not an enemy. And Turkey is the worst enemy. Therefore, in this situation, my sympathies are clearly on the side of Russia.
                Another thing is that if the butting of Russia and Turkey begins at sea and in the air, then I am not very optimistic about the chances of Russia to win ... I would like to make a mistake
                1. APASUS
                  APASUS 28 November 2015 11: 29 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Lepila
                  Another thing is that if the butting of Russia and Turkey begins at sea and in the air, then I am not very optimistic about the chances of Russia to win ... I would like to make a mistake

                  There is no that Turkey, this is not the Ottoman Empire.
                  All the armed forces were built according to NATO standards, and we perfectly saw the weaknesses of the system built in Georgia. Three locators and a communications center were flooded, self-government began in the troops. Someone went into battle, and someone did not even budge.
                  And after analyzing the actions of the Turks in the same Syria, we can say that they act as nomads. They flew, seized the prey and back.
                  1. atalef
                    atalef 28 November 2015 11: 49 New
                    +5
                    Quote: APASUS
                    All armed forces are built according to NATO standards, and we perfectly saw the weaknesses of the system built in Georgia

                    Hi, you shouldn’t underestimate the enemy in vain - this is not right.
                    Turkey has a strong, combat-ready and large army with a dominant Navy and Air Force in the region.
                    The ground forces, and I don’t take it, can I consider landing and seizing the bridgeheads, which is pretty stupid here.
                    And to compare with Georgia - well, honestly. Turkey is stronger by orders of magnitude
                    It is necessary to define goals - and the goal is simple - to remove Erdogan and economic methods to do it much easier, more efficient and cheaper.
                    1. APASUS
                      APASUS 28 November 2015 12: 58 New
                      +1
                      Quote: atalef
                      And to compare with Georgia - well, honestly. Turkey is stronger by orders of magnitude

                      Maybe it didn’t quite successfully show the lack of a system in comparison with Georgia, but on the other hand, in what real hostilities Turkey took the last 50 years. Border conflicts with Greece or an attempt to confront the Kurds, but this is not a military conflict. Turkey does not give all the strength and confidence Army a 5 amendment to NATO charter and American buzz.
                      Of course, the Turkish army is not Georgian and the military conflict will unite the nation, but nevertheless, the Turks of recent years are more accustomed to baobabs smoking and hitting tourists' carpets rather than fighting. Yes, and Erdogan, only half of the Turks are respected even in Turkey.
                    2. atalef
                      atalef 28 November 2015 13: 08 New
                      0
                      Quote: APASUS
                      Maybe it didn’t quite successfully show the lack of a system in comparison with Georgia, but on the other hand, in what real hostilities Turkey has taken over the past 50 years.

                      not an indicator.
                      Quote: APASUS
                      The whole force and confidence of Turkey is not given by the army, but by the 5th amendment to the NATO charter and the American buzz.

                      in vain you are so, Turkey has a really strong Army and the Turks have never been easy opponents.
                    3. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 39 New
                      +1
                      Quote: atalef
                      in vain you are so, Turkey has a really strong Army and the Turks have never been easy opponents.

                      And who argues. But you forget how many times we defeated them.
                    4. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 16: 16 New
                      -3
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: atalef
                      in vain you are so, Turkey has a really strong Army and the Turks have never been easy opponents.

                      And who argues. But you forget how many times we defeated them.

                      You defeated them not once.)
                    5. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 16: 44 New
                      +2
                      Quote: Your friend
                      You defeated them not once.)

                      Specifically, I - no, specifically we - yes.
                    6. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 01 New
                      -3
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: Your friend
                      You defeated them not once.)

                      Specifically, I - no, specifically we - yes.

                      “We” didn’t either, the last who defeated Turkey has long been resting in the grave.
                    7. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 30 New
                      +2
                      Quote: Your friend
                      “We” didn’t either, the last who defeated Turkey has long been resting in the grave.

                      This is you talking nonsense.
                    8. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 35 New
                      -1
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: Your friend
                      “We” didn’t either, the last who defeated Turkey has long been resting in the grave.

                      This is you talking nonsense.

                      No, you’re talking nonsense. And I am the true truth.))))
                    9. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 48 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Your friend
                      No, you’re talking nonsense. And I am the true truth.))))

                      Your nonsense, I have nothing to palm off on her. smile
                    10. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 57 New
                      -2
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: Your friend
                      No, you’re talking nonsense. And I am the true truth.))))

                      Your nonsense, I have nothing to palm off on her. smile

                      Leave it to yourself, I do not need it.)
                    11. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 17 New
                      -1
                      Quote: Your friend
                      Leave it to yourself, I do not need it.)

                      Thanks to the stranger is not necessary. laughing
                    12. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 24 New
                      0
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: Your friend
                      Leave it to yourself, I do not need it.)

                      Thanks to the stranger is not necessary. laughing

                      What, stranger, you first remembered the "bullshit", forgot again, I’ll remind you:
                      "IS-80 SU Today, 17:30 ↑
                      Quote: Your friend
                      “We” didn’t either, the last who defeated Turkey has long been resting in the grave.
                      This is you talking nonsense. "
                      All the same, sclerosis is treated.)))
                    13. IS-80
                      IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 34 New
                      -1
                      Quote: Your friend
                      All the same, sclerosis is treated.)))

                      I do not know how to treat your sclerosis, I am not a doctor. laughing
                    14. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 36 New
                      -2
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: Your friend
                      All the same, sclerosis is treated.)))

                      I do not know how to treat your sclerosis, I am not a doctor. laughing

                      I have no sclerosis, you probably forgot about it, with your sclerosis.)
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. APASUS
    APASUS 28 November 2015 22: 11 New
    0
    Quote: atalef
    Quote: APASUS
    Maybe it didn’t quite successfully show the lack of a system in comparison with Georgia, but on the other hand, in what real hostilities Turkey has taken over the past 50 years.

    not an indicator.
    Quote: APASUS
    The whole force and confidence of Turkey is not given by the army, but by the 5th amendment to the NATO charter and the American buzz.

    in vain you are so, Turkey has a really strong Army and the Turks have never been easy opponents.

    A normal indicator. An indicator that with a sufficiently powerful army, the second to NATO, the Turks are really afraid to fight against a serious enemy. Immediately after the accident with the plane, contacts with NATO were urgently involved and only after 8 hours, an attempt to contact Putin. To this part, I would also referred to the conflict with Israel, I was seduced by Erdogan’s speech and already thought of a conflict not to be avoided, and Israel is not Russia
  4. Russiamoy
    Russiamoy 28 November 2015 15: 22 New
    +1
    I agree + help of the alliance. who do we have? our allies were silent, no one condemned Turkey, and militarily they are unlikely to help.
  5. Your friend
    Your friend 28 November 2015 16: 16 New
    -1
    Quote: Russiamoya
    I agree + help of the alliance. who do we have? our allies were silent, no one condemned Turkey, and militarily they are unlikely to help.

    What are you, down below, one of the kurpny local strategists offers Kazakhstan to our ally Volodya Straits. So allies with us, in vain you are so on them.)))
  • Pimply
    Pimply 28 November 2015 13: 05 New
    0
    Quote: APASUS
    There is no that Turkey, this is not the Ottoman Empire.
    All the armed forces were built according to NATO standards, and we perfectly saw the weaknesses of the system built in Georgia. Three locators and a communications center were flooded, self-government began in the troops. Someone went into battle, and someone did not even budge.
    And after analyzing the actions of the Turks in the same Syria, we can say that they act as nomads. They flew, seized the prey and back.

    The logistics of transporting and deploying the proper number of ships, aircraft, other equipment and people to the Middle East in such a quantity as to create parity with Turkey, at least roughly imagine?
    1. APASUS
      APASUS 28 November 2015 13: 52 New
      +4
      Quote: Pimply
      the logistics of transporting and deploying the proper number of ships, aircraft, other equipment and people to the Middle East in such a quantity as to create parity with Turkey, at least roughly imagine?

      I can’t imagine and am not going to represent.
      It has long been clear to everyone that going into the bayonet in the modern world is an anachronism. even allow this conflictthen it will be a technology conflict.
      And from the history there is a rather significant moment to the words of Gromyko, the reaction of Turkey:
      Curiously, in the late 70s, Turkey announced that it was considering closing the passage through the Bosphorus to the Mediterranean for the warships of the Soviet Union. This statement was made by Comrade Gromyko (USSR Foreign Minister) at a cocktail party in the White House to American journalists that for passage in the Mediterranean Black Sea Fleet of the USSR will need only a couple of volleys of missiles. As a result of this, in addition to the Bosphorus, two more passages will appear in the Mediterranean, but, alas, there will be no Istanbul. After these words, Turkey never again raised the issue of closing the Bosphorus to the warships of the USSR.
    2. Russiamoy
      Russiamoy 28 November 2015 15: 26 New
      +2
      Gromyko's words were under the USSR. then the ratio of weapons was different. we could afford to say that.
  • IS-80
    IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 37 New
    +1
    Quote: Lepila
    I would like to make a mistake

    You are already mistaken.
  • Boa kaa
    Boa kaa 28 November 2015 09: 35 New
    +8
    Quote: Lepila
    I would not be so optimistic in assessing the prospects of Russia in an open military conflict with Turkey (I do not take into account vigorous weapons)
    One on one, the Turks have no chance. The trouble is that they have behind them a NATO gang led by a striped godfather. But here you can’t do without nuclear weapons. In my opinion, all the "intrigued" parties understand this.
    Quote: Sirocco
    As V.V. said Putin
    Beat first when the fight is inevitable.

    So for smaller bandits! And here the main thing is not to allow yourself to provoke a big showdown "for Feng Shui." In order not to be an "aggressor". The situation is the same as that of the * father of peoples * in the 41 year. Therefore, before shooting, diplomacy and economic ryyagags, well, and everything else, will be "non-lethal’.
    1. atalef
      atalef 28 November 2015 11: 55 New
      +2
      Quote: BoA KAA
      One on one, the Turks have no chance. The trouble is that they have behind them a NATO gang led by a striped godfather. But here you can’t do without nuclear weapons. In my opinion, all the "intrigued" parties understand this.

      Alexander, well, suppose Russia and Turkey came together in a fight (you generally, as a former military man, understand that it is impossible to consider the military potential of Turkey outside the NATO bloc), but suppose NATo - not wanting to squander the ebfu. Erdogan - limited to declarations and calls for peace.
      Of course, it is clear that Russia will not be an infantry to capture Istanbul and nail a shield on the gates of Constantinople. as well as to keep occupied territories.
      those. the conflict (hypothetically) will be the Air Force, the Navy - well, maybe some sort of missile strikes (without the use of nuclear weapons)
      What do you think, how many dead will there be, and will this lead to the fall of Erdogan?
      1. IS-80
        IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 42 New
        +2
        Quote: atalef
        Of course, it is clear that Russia will not be an infantry to capture Istanbul and nail a shield on the gates of Constantinople. as well as to keep occupied territories.

        By the way about the shield, the idea is very interesting.
        Quote: atalef
        What do you think, how many dead will there be, and will this lead to the fall of Erdogan?

        Of course it will.
        1. Your friend
          Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 08 New
          -1
          Quote: IS-80
          Quote: atalef
          Of course, it is clear that Russia will not be an infantry to capture Istanbul and nail a shield on the gates of Constantinople. as well as to keep occupied territories.

          By the way about the shield, the idea is very interesting.
          Quote: atalef
          What do you think, how many dead will there be, and will this lead to the fall of Erdogan?

          Of course it will.

          Ukrainians lost territory, many killed. How's the fall of the parasite coming soon?
          1. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 14 New
            +2
            Quote: Your friend
            Ukrainians lost territory, many killed. How's the fall of the parasite coming soon?

            Who cares how soon it will be? It is simply historically inevitable.
          2. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 20 New
            -1
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: Your friend
            Ukrainians lost territory, many killed. How's the fall of the parasite coming soon?

            Who cares how soon it will be? It is simply historically inevitable.

            Well, when this happens, then we'll talk. In the meantime, these “historical inevitations” of yours are just words.
          3. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 24 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Well, when this happens, then we'll talk. In the meantime, these “historical inevitations” of yours are just words.

            So far, yes words. But it will be so.
          4. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 30 New
            -1
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: Your friend
            Well, when this happens, then we'll talk. In the meantime, these “historical inevitations” of yours are just words.

            So far, yes words. But it will be so.

            And these are also just words)
          5. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 40 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            And these are also just words)

            But it will be so simple. smile
          6. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 02 New
            -2
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: Your friend
            And these are also just words)

            But it will be so simple. smile

            Wang, move over.)
          7. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 31 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Wang, move over.)

            What would Wang have to do with it?
          8. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 41 New
            -1
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: Your friend
            Wang, move over.)

            What would Wang have to do with it?

            Well, just do not understand, explain, feel how I am to you with all my soul?
            Here is your phrase:
            So far, yes words. But it will be so.
            .
            Those. Poroshenko’s fall you can’t confirm with anything except your words (So far, yes words) and foresight of the future (But it will be so).
            As you know, there was such a seer as Vanga. She, too, like you, “pierced” the element of time with her gaze. So suddenly the spirit of Wanga was reborn in you. And what? Why are you worse than her? Won already gave the straits to Kazakhstan.)))
          9. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 58 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Those. Poroshenko’s fall you can’t confirm with anything except your words (So far, yes words) and foresight of the future (But it will be so).

            What do you think will be? Poroshenko will overcome the aggressor country, and Ukraine will rule the world?
            Quote: Your friend
            As you know, there was such a seer as Vanga. She, too, like you, “pierced” the element of time with her gaze.

            I don’t know who was piercing what and what, but I don’t do fortune-telling on coffee grounds.
            Quote: Your friend
            Won already gave the straits to Kazakhstan.)))

            I didn’t give anything to Kazakhstan.
          10. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 04 New
            0
            What do you think will be? Poroshenko will overcome the aggressor country, and Ukraine will rule the world?

            In my opinion, I don’t know how it will be, I’m not Wang.)
            I don’t know who was piercing what and what, but I don’t do fortune-telling on coffee grounds.

            Can you see the future on tarot cards? Strong.)
            I didn’t give anything to Kazakhstan.

            Che, seriously? Change your mind? Will Kazakhstan no longer own the straits? Byad.
          11. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 14 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            In my opinion, I don’t know how it will be, I’m not Wang.)

            Well, what kind of assumptions should you have about this. Or are you only busy with criticism of others and you are not up to it?
            Quote: Your friend
            Can you really see the future on the cards? Strong.)

            Why on the maps, if there is still information on the history of this wonderful region of the Russian land. And Ukraine and its current getmans are clearly following the same rake as before, but the result, in principle, is predictable.
            Quote: Your friend
            Che, seriously? Change your mind? Will Kazakhstan no longer own the straits? Byad.

            Let me remind you again, since you apparently have memory problems, I do not have such authority. smile
          12. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 22 New
            -1
            Well, what kind of assumptions should you have about this. Or are you only busy with criticism of others and you are not up to it?

            About criticism groundless statement.)))
            What assumption can I have about a country where black is white and white is sulfur-boromaline?
            Why on the maps, if there is still information on the history of this wonderful region of the Russian land. And Ukraine and its current getmans are clearly following the same rake as before, but the result, in principle, is predictable.

            It captures the history of the state of Ukraine for a little more than 25 years (together with the UPR), what kind of information and rake you saw there can not imagine. Well can share?
            Let me remind you again, since you apparently have memory problems, I do not have such authority. smile

            Why do you need authority, you have a FORECAST, this is much cooler)))
          13. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 44 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            About criticism groundless statement.)))
            What assumption can I have about a country where black is white and white is sulfur-boromaline?

            Well, at least some should be? Or am I hoping in vain?
            Quote: Your friend
            It captures the history of the state of Ukraine for a little more than 25 years (together with the UPR), what kind of information and rake you saw there can not imagine.

            Well, you won’t drink the local traditions. Rake like a rake, in short, then - where two Ukrainians there are three panas.
            Quote: Your friend
            Why do you need authority, you have a FORECAST, this is much cooler)))

            This is not foresight. In the sense in which you mean. My apocalyptic paintings do not arise before my eyes. I just think that if the conditions are the same and the same mistakes are made as before, the result will most likely be the same as before.laughing
          14. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 51 New
            -1
            Well, at least some should be? Or am I hoping in vain?

            Eeee ... I already answered your question twice. You ask me your question for the third time. It would seem that with your foresight of the future, you might have guessed that I would answer for the third time.)))
            This is not foresight. In the sense in which you mean. My apocalyptic paintings do not arise before my eyes. I just think that if the conditions are the same and the same mistakes are made as before, the result will most likely be the same as before.

            But then we understand that you are simply modest. Indeed, the mastery of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan by the straits is not some trivial analysis there, but certainly a brilliant foresight.
          15. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 00 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Eeee ... I already answered your question twice. You ask me your question for the third time. It would seem that with your foresight of the future, you might have guessed that I would answer for the third time.)))

            Here, and without foresight, everything is clear. There is nothing to say to you.
            Quote: Your friend
            But then we understand that you are simply modest. Indeed, the mastery of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan by the straits is not some trivial analysis there, but certainly a brilliant foresight.

            I don’t know what you understand. I don’t know you at all. And what is wrong in my opinion on this issue? You have not explained. Why is my assumption so bad?
          16. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 06 New
            -1
            Here, and without foresight, everything is clear. There is nothing to say to you.

            It happened !!!!! Ahahaha ....
            I don’t know what you understand. I don’t know you at all. And what is wrong in my opinion on this issue? You have not explained. Why is my assumption so bad?

            What is your opinion? You do not have an opinion, but a foresight. And above at 14.08, I have already explained everything to you.
          17. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 10 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            And above at 14.08, I have already explained everything to you.

            That is, you have nothing to say. And you have no arguments. You do not work in the State Duma for an hour? That would explain a lot. smile
          18. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 15 New
            -1
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: Your friend
            And above at 14.08, I have already explained everything to you.

            That is, you have nothing to say. And you have no arguments. You do not work in the State Duma for an hour? That would explain a lot. smile

            Hahahaha .... Yeah, I work in the State Duma. And as you rightly noted, the Chinese, Russophobe, Turkophobe and anti-Semite.
            When will we divide the straits?))))
  • Alexander Romanov
    Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 10: 45 New
    +9
    Quote: Lepila
    For all my dislike of Perdogan and Islamist Turkey, I would not be so optimistic in assessing the prospects for Russia in an open military conflict with Turkey (

    1. What does Turkey have? -200 Ф 16, the rest is old. It will be seen for three weeks to grind it.
    2. The whole of Turkey shoots far and wide, Turkey will not have a rear and in the same three weeks Turkey will have neither light nor gas, nothing. The economy will be completely destroyed.
    3. His army 700 thousand and still mobilizes well 2 million, this is really a problem, but here everything will depend on the motivation of the soldiers themselves.
    4. The Black Sea Fleet is stronger than ours, but the Black Sea is a pool that we shoot through completely.
    And now, dear about Turkey's prospects for success, announce the list so to speak.
    1. Andrea
      Andrea 28 November 2015 11: 11 New
      +1
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      in the same three weeks Turkey will have neither light nor gas
      Yes, without gas, she will sit without bombing, instantly, on the first day. laughing
    2. Lepila
      Lepila 28 November 2015 11: 31 New
      +2
      How are you going to grind Turkish F-16? Su-30? So the F-16 is at least no worse. Turks will be able to destroy the Black Sea Fleet, their troughs are much more modern than yours.
      Once again, I’m trying to objectively evaluate it. In this conflict, I unequivocally wish Russia success.
      1. atalef
        atalef 28 November 2015 12: 05 New
        +2
        Quote: Lepila
        How are you going to grind Turkish F-16? Su-30? So the F-16 is at least no worse. Turks will be able to destroy the Black Sea Fleet, their troughs are much more modern than yours.
        Once again, I’m trying to objectively evaluate it. In this conflict, I unequivocally wish Russia success.

        I don’t understand at all. this desire to get involved in war.
        War is the last resort (goal achievement) - if all others have exhausted themselves.
        Think about one thing, in case (I don’t even say war), but just armed conflict.
        Turkey will roll out the Russian base in Syria, for example, if it’s very fast, it’s just fast, because it simply doesn’t have protection against tactical missile weapons, and for this it’s not necessary to destroy personnel, as we all saw at the base, the planes are not in caponiers
        Further, blocking the Bosphorus for the courts of the Russian Federation - well, the consequences are clear.
        It’s easy to enter a war, it’s hard to get into it and no one knows how it will end.
        The problem is not in Turkey - the problem is in Erdogan.
        To remove it, you do not need the deaths of Russian troops, nor Turkish
        1. Lepila
          Lepila 28 November 2015 12: 12 New
          +1
          The problem is not Perdogan, the problem is in Turkey. Most Turks are extremely Islamized and sincerely support Perdogan and his Islamist-Sultan-Caliphate ideas.
          1. atalef
            atalef 28 November 2015 12: 35 New
            0
            Quote: Lepila
            The problem is not Perdogan, the problem is in Turkey. Most Turks are extremely Islamized and sincerely support Perdogan and his Islamist-Sultan-Caliphate ideas.

            I agree, but Erdogan and Davutoglu Islamized them.
            The army must take power into its own hands and revive Ataturk's secular path.
        2. 33 Watcher
          33 Watcher 28 November 2015 14: 10 New
          0
          Yes, nothing to talk about, there will be no war. What is the base? Which fleet? You describe the beginning of the 3rd world, we fought with half of the world, and won. What is Turkey? What is Euro-NATO? It will be no stop. All this will be at the level of a political showdown. Exchange of courtesies. And I think our Turkish plane will be watched if they, of course, are substituted and continue to fly to Syria. But everything will be the same as described in the article.
      2. Koshak
        Koshak 28 November 2015 12: 15 New
        +2
        Quote: Lepila
        How are you going to grind Turkish F-16? Su-30? So the F-16 is at least no worse.

        And why should they be destroyed only in aerial combat? And anti-aircraft missile systems? As already mentioned, Turkey, along with its air bases and ports, is shot through. Half of these F-16s can be destroyed on the ground, like everything that floats right at the piers.
        Threat. And besides the Su-30 there is also a MiG-31. So let the "bottles" stretch with them
        1. atalef
          atalef 28 November 2015 12: 38 New
          -4
          Quote: Koshak
          . Half of these F-16s can be destroyed on the ground, like everything that floats right at the piers.
          Threat. And besides the Su-30 there is also a MiG-31. So let the "bottles" stretch with them

          In the Black Sea, Turkey’s military potential is many times higher.
          This is also beyond doubt.
          But the Air Force will not solve the problem.
          1. Days
            Days 29 November 2015 23: 35 New
            0
            To be. And you again make the same mistake as when you sent the F-16 to fight only with the Su-30, forgetting about air defense.

            Russian coastal missile systems shoot through the Black Sea. In addition to the VKS and the fleet itself, it turns out quite several times and not even higher.
      3. Andrea
        Andrea 28 November 2015 12: 17 New
        +4
        Quote: Lepila
        How are you going to grind Turkish F-16?
        Well, let’s say, too, a masterpiece to me.
        I don’t understand one thing that the people were so divided about. Erdogan will get his without war.
        Today, what magnetic storms, all drawn to aggression? laughing
        Well, they will tame Turkey. Everything will gradually return to normal, only Turkey will be all in shit and will not be washed off forever and ever.
        Even if another president comes, the spot will also be dragged.
      4. miru mir
        miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 23 New
        +7
        And I do not wish Russia a military conflict at all. And if, God forbid, that either it begins, the development of events no one can predict.
        1. Your friend
          Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 05 New
          +1
          Quote: miru mir
          And I do not wish Russia a military conflict at all. And if, God forbid, that either it begins, the development of events no one can predict.

          They do not know what they are saying. The war with Turkey will be long and bloody, because there is no common border, and what troughs to transport troops to Turkey is not known.
          200 planes are going to grind, sitting at a computer and drinking a beer. (((
          The reaction of local "strategists" to the agenda from the draft board will be interesting.
          1. miru mir
            miru mir 28 November 2015 16: 31 New
            0
            Yeah ... War is a dirty and terrible thing. But most militants on the site of gunpowder did not smell.
          2. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 16: 51 New
            0
            Quote: miru mir
            They do not know what they are saying. The war with Turkey will be long and bloody, because there is no common border, and what troughs to transport troops to Turkey is not known.

            Quote: miru mir
            Yeah ... War is a dirty and terrible thing. But most of the militants on the gunpowder site did not smell.

            Speech is not boys, but grandfathers. Immediately visible two wise life commanders. Level at least Iskander and Buonaparte.
          3. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 00 New
            -1
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: miru mir
            They do not know what they are saying. The war with Turkey will be long and bloody, because there is no common border, and what troughs to transport troops to Turkey is not known.

            Quote: miru mir
            Yeah ... War is a dirty and terrible thing. But most of the militants on the gunpowder site did not smell.

            Speech is not boys, but grandfathers. Immediately visible two wise life commanders. Level at least Iskander and Buonaparte.

            Oh, baby ...))))
          4. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 02 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Oh, baby ...))))

            We are all children. smile
          5. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 04 New
            0
            Quote: IS-80
            Quote: Your friend
            Oh, baby ...))))

            We are all children. smile

            )))
      5. miru mir
        miru mir 28 November 2015 17: 44 New
        -1
        Quote: IS-80
        Speech is not boys, but grandfathers. Immediately visible two wise life commanders. Level at least Iskander and Buonaparte.

        ABIDYLS, warrior?
      6. IS-80
        IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 59 New
        0
        Quote: miru mir
        ABIDYLS, warrior?

        On whom?
      7. miru mir
        miru mir 28 November 2015 18: 01 New
        0
        Not? Well, good.
  • zadorin1974
    zadorin1974 28 November 2015 14: 19 New
    0
    Well, you are small children. Why are we chasing after airplanes? They are standing on the ground, they are taking off from it. We have no missiles (almost every product developed both vigorous and conventional warheads.) So, what will happen with an airfield and a runway if there’s one and a half tons of trotyl trotyl?
    1. Your friend
      Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 22 New
      -4
      Quote: zadorin1974
      Well, you are small children. Why are we chasing after airplanes? They are standing on the ground, they are taking off from it. We have no missiles (almost every product developed both vigorous and conventional warheads.) So, what will happen with an airfield and a runway if there’s one and a half tons of trotyl trotyl?

      Seriously? We have missiles, but Turkey, you think, does not have its own missiles, is the missile defense also missing? The trouble ...
      1. zadorin1974
        zadorin1974 28 November 2015 20: 15 New
        +1
        Well, yes, the Turks have a missile defense !!!! What name does their system cost? Especially name a Turkish missile weapon capable of delivering warheads at a distance of at least 800 km? And so byad !!! By long-range air defense systems though would read. One specialists, your division. Before you write something, read decent literature (and not only Russian) Missiles then they have their own or who sold them? belay
      2. Your friend
        Your friend 28 November 2015 20: 42 New
        -1
        Quote: zadorin1974
        Well, yes, the Turks have a missile defense !!!! What name does their system cost? Especially name a Turkish missile weapon capable of delivering warheads at a distance of at least 800 km? And so byad !!! By long-range air defense systems though would read. One specialists, your division. Before you write something, read decent literature (and not only Russian)

        Ohhh, the great specialist knows that the Spanish Patriot are located in Turkey? A great specialist will quote me where I wrote that the missile defense system is Turkish? Or a great specialist chatterbox?)
        A sluggish specialist confirmed that the Turks have missiles, with which the great spacialist argues unclear. Byad.
        Who cares whose rockets they have? Do you think it was important for their pilots which rocket to shoot down our plane, their own or bought? These are our specialists on the forum, readers of decent literature.
      3. zadorin1974
        zadorin1974 28 November 2015 21: 56 New
        0
        Before you write something, at least open the literature and familiarize yourself with the topic. First, not Spanish, but German (only three launchers). And then, after negotiations on Iran, they wanted to send them to their homeland (the contents of the complex are at the expense of Berlin, so the service is purely Bundesian) submission of this battery directly to Brussels, but since Turkey has no long-range air defense systems (they refused the Chinese systems (copies of our S-300), the Americans persuaded the Germans to leave the battery until the end of the year 16. Well, you know-it-all clogs up.
  • 33 Watcher
    33 Watcher 28 November 2015 14: 20 New
    +1
    F - 16, no worse. He is, in principle, in a different weight category, short-armed and short-sighted, so that he would jump 30s. In general, vessels, planes ... Imagine how airfields with aircraft on taxiways and ships near berth walls are on fire. And neither who nor where does not fly and does not go. This is OBJECTIVE, the outbreak of war with Russia in the geographical location of Turkey. If you fight honestly, for real. But there will be no war, everything is in the mind so far that.
    1. Your friend
      Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 29 New
      -2
      Quote: Observer 33
      F - 16, no worse. He is, in principle, in a different weight category, short-armed and short-sighted, so that he would jump 30s. In general, vessels, planes ... Imagine how airfields with aircraft on taxiways and ships near berth walls are on fire. And neither who nor where does not fly and does not go. This is OBJECTIVE, the outbreak of war with Russia in the geographical location of Turkey. If you fight honestly, for real. But there will be no war, everything is in the mind so far that.

      This is not objective, these are your fantasies. Nobody really knows how it will be there.
      1. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 28 November 2015 15: 35 New
        0
        Does anyone know that Russia is a missile power? What does Russia have rockets wherever possible? And that Russia produces them in large quantities? No one knows?
      2. Your friend
        Your friend 28 November 2015 16: 23 New
        -3
        Quote: Observer 33
        Does anyone know that Russia is a missile power? What does Russia have rockets wherever possible? And that Russia produces them in large quantities? No one knows?

        Cheat? Why are you doing this? Turkey has no rockets? Turkey is not a missile power? Turkey produces rockets in large quantities.
        If I wrote that no one knows how military operations will develop. It’s not that Russia has many missiles, but for some reason you began to write about missiles. It’s strange.
      3. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 28 November 2015 17: 01 New
        0
        What is so strange? If the offensive missile potential is greater than a certain side is able to repel, then a large part of the fleet and the Air Force are destroyed automatically at their base. If you are able to intercept 20 missiles, and 30 arrives, respectively 10 reach the goal. It’s even easier to explain, I can’t, as a teacher for correction groups, I didn’t study. request
        And what do you think sea battles and the landing will be? Nah laughing Welcome to the 21st century, battleships at sea and bayonet attacks on the earth are a thing of the past.
      4. Your friend
        Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 14 New
        -1
        Quote: Observer 33
        What is so strange? If the offensive missile potential is greater than a certain side is able to repel, then a large part of the fleet and the Air Force are destroyed automatically at their base. If you are able to intercept 20 missiles, and 30 arrives, respectively 10 reach the goal. It’s even easier to explain, I can’t, as a teacher for correction groups, I didn’t study. request

        Wah, what a magnificent analys. At the beginning of the war in the West, the USSR had 12780 tanks, Germany had 4334. Hto will win, according to the Observer, to this non-correction group teacher?))))
        The observer neither knows about electronic warfare, nor about the locations of the Russian and Turkish forces, nor about the readiness of "many missiles" .... nor about a bunch of other factors. Everything is simple for him, “automatically”, there are 30 missiles, they launched, intercepted part, profit.))))
        And what do you think sea battles and the landing will be? Nah laughing laughing Welcome to the 21st century, battleships at sea and bayonet attacks on the earth are a thing of the past

        Wah, and the Amyrykans didn’t know, they landed in Iraq, in Afghanistan they fired from rifles. It was necessary to ask the Observer about the 21st century. Here are the fools ...))))
  • Pimply
    Pimply 28 November 2015 13: 11 New
    -1
    Quote: Alexander Romanov

    1. What does Turkey have? -200 Ф 16, the rest is old. It will be seen for three weeks to grind it.

    Now imagine if Russia has the opportunity in the region to place the proper amount of aviation to create parity
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    3. His army 700 thousand and still mobilizes well 2 million, this is really a problem, but here everything will depend on the motivation of the soldiers themselves.

    And how much do you think the Russian army is now? This is she declared in a million people, in fact, less
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    4.The Black Sea Fleet is stronger than ours, but the Black Sea is a puddle completely shot by us.

    Not a puddle
    1. IS-80
      IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 53 New
      +1
      Quote: Pimply
      Now imagine if Russia has the opportunity in the region to place the proper amount of aviation to create parity

      Why so much aviation? Destroy their aircraft airfields with cruise and tactical missiles.
      Quote: Pimply
      And how much do you think the Russian army is now? This is she declared in a million people, in fact, less

      But this is the Russian army, not the Turkish one.
      Quote: Pimply
      Not a puddle

      Puddle.
  • IS-80
    IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 43 New
    0
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    1. What does Turkey have? -200 Ф 16, the rest is old. It will be seen for three weeks to grind it.
    2. The whole of Turkey shoots far and wide, Turkey will not have a rear and in the same three weeks Turkey will have neither light nor gas, nothing. The economy will be completely destroyed.
    3. His army 700 thousand and still mobilizes well 2 million, this is really a problem, but here everything will depend on the motivation of the soldiers themselves.
    4. The Black Sea Fleet is stronger than ours, but the Black Sea is a pool that we shoot through completely.

    Though, however, think correctly.
  • zadorin1974
    zadorin1974 28 November 2015 14: 09 New
    0
    Alexander, to yours, I would add that the Turkish Navy does not have strike weapons. Yes, there are Harper’s anti-ship missiles on submarines and surface ships, but this is 300 km and? The use of submarines on the Black Sea is problematic due to the shallow depths, respectively, the high probability of detecting submarines before entering the affected area. Well and another five cents: we don’t have to chase every F-16, can this aircraft take off, and most importantly land on a dirt road? In order to destroy all runways in Turkey, we don’t even have to move out of Russian borders.
  • IS-80
    IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 30 New
    0
    Quote: Lepila
    For all my dislike of Perdogan and Islamist Turkey, I would not be so optimistic in assessing the prospects of Russia in an open military conflict with Turkey (I do not take into account vigorous weapons)

    It will be necessary to inform our General Staff in order to take into account your optimism when it will plan something strategic.
  • theadenter
    theadenter 28 November 2015 08: 30 New
    0
    Shaken, but not open, but also hybrid. They just have a reason for such actions.
  • Tamila
    Tamila 28 November 2015 09: 50 New
    +1
    And for today, NATO has completely forgotten how to fight. Germans could have been there, but the USA has suppressed their German stereotype for very long years
    1. 34 region
      34 region 28 November 2015 10: 19 New
      +5
      Have you forgotten how to fight in NATO? Today, banks, NGOs, charitable organizations, grants, opposition and the oppressed are fighting instead of soldiers ... Not to mention armed militants. And in terms of this war, NATO is fighting very well. You can laugh how stuck their landing on the exercises. But armed conflicts are real and it’s not at all funny. The question is, are we able to fight like NATO? Many countries today moved to our camp? Many who want to join us? That's when the line of people who want to join us is lined up for us then we can talk about the success of Russia.
      1. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 28 November 2015 14: 24 New
        0
        So you need to fight as we can.
  • bannik
    bannik 28 November 2015 16: 30 New
    0
    Directly, maybe yes, but from around the corner - forever and with joy.
  • Your friend
    Your friend 28 November 2015 13: 51 New
    -1
    Quote: Cetegg
    and no one is talking about an open war with Turkey. They are no matter how in NATO, but we are too early to compete with NATO. Press them economically so that their own Janissaries, Erdogan and his entire family are uplifted) PS No matter how the 21st century is the era of hybrid and economical wars!)

    Che there, Poland was squeezed, how many zheks from their government had already been pulled up? Did the Germans also put a loop around Merkel’s neck? Stop writing about the economy, no one will squeeze anyone. Until we give weapons to the Kurds, nothing will happen to Erdogan.
    1. Cetegg
      Cetegg 28 November 2015 19: 44 New
      0
      Do not confuse the “warm” with the “soft”))) Something I do not recall the news in 2015 about German and Polish attempts to bring down our aircraft ?!) maybe I missed something and you remind me ?!) But economic measures to Turkey already taken!
      1. Your friend
        Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 51 New
        -1
        Quote: Cetegg
        Do not confuse the “warm” with the “soft”))) Something I do not recall the news in 2015 about German and Polish attempts to bring down our aircraft ?!) maybe I missed something and you remind me ?!) But economic measures to Turkey already taken!

        I remind you, remind you what you wrote. You wrote about economic sanctions, about downed planes, there is nothing in your phrase. Don’t you remember what you wrote?
        I write to you once again, no economic sanctions do not solve. Neither Cuba nor North Korea, the sanctions did not force to cast neither Castro nor Kimov in a tree. And there sanctions are worse than Russian ones in Turkey.
        1. Cetegg
          Cetegg 29 November 2015 00: 59 New
          0
          Now you are interfering with “sour and rotten”))) With all due respect, just look at how many votes the party of Erdogan won in the last election!) Once again, “Erdogan is a political corpse”! He does not succeed in rallying the people against the background of an external enemy in the face of Russia, only radical Islamists, who are still a minority, want war. Losing economic ties with Russia will make him popular?))) PS Castro is the leader of the revolution, a highly respected and beloved politician by his people . Kim Jong-un is not loved, but behind him is a combat-ready army. And who is behind Erdogan ?!) his fate is to chew a tie in the near future!)
      2. Cetegg
        Cetegg 29 November 2015 01: 05 New
        0
        Quote: Your friend
        Che there, Poland was squeezed, how many zheks from their government had already been pulled up? Did the Germans also put a loop around Merkel’s neck?

        - Well, not all at once, a drop wears away a stone!) Different events and different decisions. Wait, see where it all leads))
  • Alibekulu
    Alibekulu 28 November 2015 19: 59 New
    0
    Quote: IS-80
    And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.
    Well, thank you drinks but unfortunately this is far from the case .. recourse
    Quote: Cetegg
    and no one speaks about open war with Turkey. They are as if in NATO, and it’s too early for us to go with NATO.
    That drop the Turkish fighter business something.
    And Erdo will not decide to bomb your Syrian base.
    The Turks themselves recognize the moral right of the Russians ..
    And there will be no war. Yes, the Turks can calmly repeat the result of the Russian-Japanese, but it is not clear what to get into a big war, because of Erdogan’s bad ambitions no one will, neither the Turkish army nor NATO.
    And the escalation itself will hit hard on Turkey's ek-ke and itself raise the question of finding Erdo in power ..
    Turkey is not Russia, they have developed democracy and they do not need its adventures. Let's add to secular traditions laid by Ataturk in the army soldier which will not allow war and just remove it.
    Although maybe I'm wrong hi .
    1. IS-80
      IS-80 28 November 2015 20: 13 New
      0
      Quote: Alibekulu
      Well, thank you, but unfortunately this is far from true ..

      Why not? In the light of the tremendous economic and political processes that are taking place in Eurasia, it is very important. And the sizes? And resources, but economic potential. What about the important geographical location?
      Quote: Alibekulu
      And there will be no war. Yes, the Turks can easily repeat the result of the Russo-Japanese, but it’s not clear why it’s impossible to climb into a big war because of Erdogan’s ambition, neither the Turkish army nor NATO.
      And the escalation itself will hit hard on Turkey's ek-ke and itself raise the question of finding Erdo in power ..

      In the light of what is happening in Ukraine, I’m somehow not too sure about it. It may not be a war, but dirty tricks can also be done without it in order.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. Cetegg
      Cetegg 28 November 2015 06: 46 New
      +1
      I would say 8-2 in our favor and one draw!) but it’s so sarcasm, it’s not good to talk about war and loss of life!
    2. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 07: 06 New
      +3
      Quote: yuriy55
      No need to scare a Russian hedgehog with a naked Turkish train.

      Here you are the first, if anything, to send to a naked Turkish ass.
      Quote: yuriy55
      Russian-Turkish wars: 8: 3 in favor of Moscow

      Were the victories easy?
      1. afdjhbn67
        afdjhbn67 28 November 2015 07: 23 New
        +1
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Were the victories easy?

        Turks have now shown that they are not particularly afraid .. unfortunately ..
        1. Bayonet
          Bayonet 28 November 2015 08: 03 New
          +7
          Quote: afdjhbn67
          Turks have now shown that they are not particularly afraid .. unfortunately ..

          Like that little boy with two ambals behind him smile Hoping for their membership in NATO.
          1. afdjhbn67
            afdjhbn67 28 November 2015 08: 32 New
            +1
            Quote: Bayonet
            Like that little kid with two ambals behind them. They are hoping for their NATO membership.

            Unfortunately, the fact that they cost ...
        2. Andrea
          Andrea 28 November 2015 09: 39 New
          +3
          Quote: afdjhbn67
          Turks have now shown that they are not particularly afraid .. unfortunately ..
          But they are never afraid until they start drinking ... then they start to fear very much. This is so in Turkish they let out show-offs until they give it to the snout.
          I remember starting the war, the Turks of our ambassador were put in a tower, received in the face, released. Someone, it seems, managed to sit several times. smile
      2. Tamila
        Tamila 28 November 2015 09: 57 New
        +3
        Everyone can be bombed: Israel, the USA, France, and Russia can’t. Intimidate by sending to a meeting with naked Turkish dopa))
    3. Sirocco
      Sirocco 28 November 2015 07: 10 New
      16
      Quote: yuriy55

      No need to scare a Russian hedgehog with a naked Turkish train.

      There were attempts to intimidate the USSR in the 70s of the last century, then Ankara also scared and voiced the closure of the strait, to which it received an answer through partners from A. Gromyko


      To this statement, Comrade Gromyko Andrei Andreevich (USSR Foreign Minister) told American reporters at a White House cocktail party that the passage to the Mediterranean Black Sea Fleet of the USSR would require only a couple of volleys of missiles. As a result of this, in addition to the Bosphorus, two more passages will appear in the Mediterranean, but, alas, there will be no Istanbul. After these words, Turkey never again raised the issue of closing the Bosphorus to the warships of the USSR. Maybe the time has come for Russia to remind Ankara about this again?

      The fact that the Turkish Armed Forces is a serious opponent is not denied to anyone, but for (Alexander Romanov) it’s also not worth cheating, because Erdogan runs to meet the train and screams to crush. (True, a strange action) Well, Yuri was right that Turkey was always supported by Western “partners”. Now there’s a discord in the partner camp, and Erdogan’s actions are the actions of a crap child who shit in his pants, and hiding his shame, he hid dirty cowards under the table, and points a finger at his neighbor, saying that he shit, in the end it stinks everywhere. The last confirmation of his weakness is not a call to Putin, and an attempt to resolve the conflict, but a quick half-bent run to NATO members, they say save and save.
      This is cowardice, and weakness, like a trader and not a warrior.
      As V.V. said Putin
      Beat first when the fight is inevitable.
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 07: 27 New
        -4
        Quote: Sirocco
        There were attempts to intimidate the USSR in the 70s of the last century. Then Ankara also scared and voiced the closure of the strait, to which it received an answer through partners from A. Gromyko

        In Soviet times, the Black Sea Fleet was much stronger.
        Quote: Sirocco
        but it’s not worth fooling,

        And what does it mean to cheat in this case? -Sitting on a soft sofa, drinking "kefir" screaming that we will feed Erdogan with ties?
        1. Sirocco
          Sirocco 28 November 2015 07: 49 New
          19
          Quote: Alexander Romanov

          And what does it mean to cheat in this case? -Sitting on a soft sofa, drinking "kefir" screaming that we will feed Erdogan with ties?

          It seems to me that you are not correct, where are you sitting and on what? You are a fighter of the invisible front like me, and like many here.
          Let's go without sofas. I personally, if my memory serves me, did not throw hats, and do not urge to eat ties. Yes, there was anger on the first day like many, but I did not scream or hysteria, and I support the actions of our leadership. (Revenge must be served cold). Well, it’s probably our youth, part of the instigators, that is hysterical, and among us there are people with a liberal look, like Nadezhdin BB
          So, wait and see, the consequences of what the Turks have done will be judged by the time, as I wrote earlier, in the future, Erdogan is a downed pilot, and now he is not shaking hands like Mishiko. And is in a position like Poroshenko. Well, he spoiled everyone, and cut down the branch on which he sits, and the euphoria that is now present in the Turkish media will pass, after the introduction of the sanctions of the Russian Federation, businessmen will strangle him. It will not be sweet for us either.
          Well, who told you that in a fight, blood does not flow, and there are no bruises. Your neighbor will spoil you under the door, what will your actions be Alexander?
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 08: 02 New
            -4
            Quote: Sirocco
            where are you sitting and on what?

            On the chair.
            Quote: Sirocco
            You are a fighter of the invisible front like me, and like many here.

            No, it’s not the same; I have enough intelligence to understand that a warrior with Turkey will not be easy.
            Quote: Sirocco
            Let's go without sofas

            And why should I throw my couch out for you?
            Quote: Sirocco
            Well, it’s probably our youth, part of the instigators, that is hysterical, and among us there are people with a liberal look, like Nadezhdin BB

            For the most part, pensioners will hysteria.
            Quote: Sirocco
            I personally, if my memory serves me, did not throw hats, and do not urge to eat ties.

            Let me remind you, Saku ate his tie with fear
            1. Sirocco
              Sirocco 28 November 2015 08: 30 New
              +5
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              On the chair.

              Why not on the couch? not on the chair? afraid to get the title of sofa expert? laughing

              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              No, it’s not the same, I’m smart enough to understand that a warrior with Turkey will not be easy

              Not the same as all of us.
              I have the same thing with the logic and the current situation.
              Nobody says that if a fight starts, there will be no bruises.
              I think with a look like it’s easier for you to fall on your knees and turn the other cheek.
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              Let me remind you, Saku ate his tie with fear

              Did you remind anyone of this? Me or Cetteg.
              This is not my post.
              Well, how is it with the neighbor then under the door? Excuse me, too? After all, a fight is possible, and bruises.
            2. Boa kaa
              Boa kaa 28 November 2015 09: 55 New
              +4
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              For the most part, pensioners will hysteria.
              What are you saying !?
              Who I know (I have the honor to be in correspondence) is very consistent and really comment on what is happening. This is probably because they are all military professionals.
              I can’t say anything for the rest - I just don’t know. But wisdom (at least everyday) is inherent in old age, and not the ardor of youth, especially those who did not serve in the armed forces. Everything is easy and simple for them - like playing a shooter on a computer.
              So, namesake, reproach to the wrong address!
        2. soroKING
          soroKING 28 November 2015 09: 08 New
          +1
          Why are the ties (this food for over 7 years) nuuu ... there are fez no
        3. Boa kaa
          Boa kaa 28 November 2015 09: 44 New
          +4
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          In Soviet times, the Black Sea Fleet was much stronger.
          ???? What does this have to do with it? Then the economy was the 2 in the world (and not the top ten), against the NATO stood a cordon from the ATS, not the frail CSTO, and the Armed Forces totaled 3,5 million bayonets ...
          20 years of equipping the Army with weapons were not missed, so modern MBT models were 75-80%, and not 10-15, as now.
          And as an illustration of the promise - the state of the then / today's Black Sea Fleet.
  • afdjhbn67
    afdjhbn67 28 November 2015 07: 21 New
    +1
    good I agree that I already started to get tired of these comments, everything is simple with people, I pressed a button and cheers ...
  • Alekseev
    Alekseev 28 November 2015 07: 49 New
    +4
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Good throwing hats

    No need to throw hats ...
    And to fight the Turkish army, too, much less, we do not even have land borders.
    The war with Turkey is das ist fantastisch, they are naturally afraid of a nuclear power, therefore they cried into the NATO vest.
    But NATO does not want and will not risk its well-being and life.
    Well, what if Erdogan’s tower breaks down? Then it’s not the new Rymnik and Izmail, but the destruction of infrastructure: shipping through the Bosphorus, ports, power plants, oil and gas pipelines, etc.
    Up to the use of ultra-small special ammunition.
    Then Europeans will see a real refugee crisis ... wink
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 08: 05 New
      -2
      Quote: Alekseev
      Well, what if Erdogan’s tower breaks down?

      Already frustrated or not noticed.
      Quote: Alekseev
      Then it’s not the new Rymnik and Izmail, but the destruction of infrastructure: shipping through the Bosphorus, ports, power plants, gas and oil pipelines, etc.

      Given that the news has begun an active discussion of the possible closure of the Bosphorus, this does not bode well.
      1. afdjhbn67
        afdjhbn67 28 November 2015 10: 19 New
        -1
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Already frustrated or not noticed.

        And no one notices what Russia has done during these days ??
        Note of protest
        Attache Challenge
        government tambourine slurred
        regular pesticides in tomatoes
        and that’s all ... ??? fellow More important than all the cases for the opening of the EBN center, it’s necessary to shed light and shed tears of stingy tears ???? am
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Oleg14774
    Oleg14774 28 November 2015 08: 37 New
    +4
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Turkey is a strong enemy with a strong army.

    No one says that she is weak, everyone knows about it, so do not be smart, but you should not tremble before them. We did not tremble before Hitler with united Europe and his helpers-sponsors, the Anglo-Saxons, and here we will not tremble.
  • Tor5
    Tor5 28 November 2015 10: 15 New
    0
    We must take advantage of the situation and actively help any Erdogan opposition, up to the supply of "material" things, not Russian-made.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Altona
    Altona 28 November 2015 10: 30 New
    +1
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    It’s good to throw hats, Turkey is a strong enemy with a strong army. How many we did not fight with, and we did not have easy victories.

    --------------------
    This is not about a strong army. Now Erdogan cannot be beaten up much, because the next rulers may be even worse and more radical ...
  • WKS
    WKS 28 November 2015 11: 35 New
    +2
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Netanyahu made a lengthy statement that "... Israel regrets that Turkish citizens died

    I recalled a joke. One Jew insulted Rabinovich, calling him a "bastard." The court ordered the perpetrator to apologize right at the trial. Fulfilling the judgment, the Jew stands up and says:
    - Rabinovich is not a bastard? I apologize!
  • Finntroll
    Finntroll 28 November 2015 18: 28 New
    0
    I beg you, the Turks have not fought with us since the end of the 18th century, the ears of the British Crown always stuck out from behind the turban of the Sultan! Turks are a tool no more! (the fact that Erdogan imagines himself to be an independent political figure is his problems. The “masters” have already put him in place, he will have to be put again), if the Turks didn’t have Uncle Sam with “weighty arguments”, we would all forget about the existence of this misunderstanding on map back in 1947
    Z.Y. No cap-assumption, the technical level of the Russian Federation’s armament, allows destroying the Turkish Air Force “from the ground”, sinking the Turkish fleet without entering the ship’s air defense strike zone, and, in principle, leaving the scorched desert from Turkey (without even using nuclear weapons) without conducting ground operations . Something like this
  • 78bor1973
    78bor1973 28 November 2015 23: 16 New
    0
    The army of the Turks, although strong, is not without problems with the commander in chief, and is not designed for large-scale operations!
  • Vladimir71
    Vladimir71 28 November 2015 07: 16 New
    -1
    Ideally for Perdogan, Colombian at worst, a Spanish tie ...
  • Lepila
    Lepila 28 November 2015 08: 17 New
    14
    Onboard this "humanitarian flotilla" sent by Perdogan, "humanitarian activists" were the finalists of the Turkish kickboxing championship. Our naval commandos descended onto the ship along the helicopter's ropes almost unarmed (Glock pistols and paintball guns). And then the Turkish kickboxers began to kill them with metal bars. The soldiers had no other choice but to open fire on defeat. See for yourself.


    1. Mikhail Krapivin
      Mikhail Krapivin 28 November 2015 08: 37 New
      -7
      The stump is clear :) Unarmed and defenseless, like the Israeli commandos, the birds still managed to shoot (apparently from a finger, because Glock is not a weapon, right?) A crowd of brutal super-pumped Turks. Otherwise it was a miracle! On the legal aspect of the search by Israel of a ship going not to Israel, I will even stutter at it so that Srach does not start.
      1. Absurdidat
        Absurdidat 28 November 2015 09: 12 New
        18
        And you stutter. Imagine that infa arrived that on board a boat from Turkey several terrorist fighters are sailing to Georgia. Such dear children, they are pissing for jihad to us in the Caucasus. Do nothing? Right, the Jews did what they shot them, the video clearly shows that they also endured for a long time. Probably they would have known the situation — they would have sank quietly, such as a WWII mine surfaced, xs what happened then, Turkish cowards and poop on the waves, that's all business.
    2. cumastra1
      cumastra1 28 November 2015 09: 41 New
      +3
      And they did it right. Fewer terrorists - less problems.
    3. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 28 November 2015 10: 20 New
      +3
      Quote: Lepila
      Our naval commandos descended onto the ship along the helicopter's ropes almost unarmed (Glock pistols and paintball guns).

      DO NOT make my hooves laugh !!! (from)
      So it is tempting to say: Sculpted! don't sculpt a hunchback! or:
      - And what, * Uzi * is Israel already lacking in maritime special forces? And when did you get so poor?
      - Did you load rifles for paintball with explosive or armor-piercing * balls * loaded?
      Well and so on. If what you write about is true (personally, I doubt very much!), Then your command needs to be driven by a filthy broom for professional unsuitability! But this is not the case with you. The whole history of Israeli special forces is proof of this.
      Therefore, fairy tales about "guns for paintball" (a product of your dodgy media) - leave it for the gullible! Or those who don’t know that in Israel, even your female soldiers go home with military weapons to get fired. And then a special unit on a combat mission - and with "paintball guns" ... Not even funny! yes
      1. atalef
        atalef 28 November 2015 11: 03 New
        +1
        Quote: BoA KAA
        Quote: Lepila
        Our naval commandos descended onto the ship along the helicopter's ropes almost unarmed (Glock pistols and paintball guns).

        DO NOT make my hooves laugh !!! (from)
        So it is tempting to say: Sculpted! don't sculpt a hunchback! or:
        - And what, * Uzi * is Israel already lacking in maritime special forces? And when did you get so poor?
        - Did you load rifles for paintball with explosive or armor-piercing * balls * loaded?
        Well and so on. If what you write about is true (personally, I doubt very much!), Then your command needs to be driven by a filthy broom for professional unsuitability! But this is not the case with you. The whole history of Israeli special forces is proof of this.
        Therefore, fairy tales about "guns for paintball" (a product of your dodgy media) - leave it for the gullible! Or those who don’t know that in Israel, even your female soldiers go home with military weapons to get fired. And then a special unit on a combat mission - and with "paintball guns" ... Not even funny! yes

        Yes, Alexander - it was, after repeated attempts to stop and preduprezhdeniy- shaetet13 - descended from peytbolnymi guns - dumaoi disperse, pass the bridge and stopped the ship - one of their fire was not going to, maybe, know that the deterioration of inadequate Erdogan nobody wanted, and only after one soldier was thrown overboard, and the second was unconsciously dragged into the hold - one of the commandos opened fire from military weapons, Sash if you look carefully at the video, you will see that the special forces initially shoot from the pentbo linen guns, their specific silhouette is visible
        Look 19 or 50 seconds
      2. miru mir
        miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 37 New
        0
        I can never understand why absolutely no one owns the topic, many of you are experts on IDF affairs. It's funny to read you. But the so-called containment policythat our leadership adheres to really infuriates me angry
        1. Mikhail Krapivin
          Mikhail Krapivin 28 November 2015 15: 06 New
          +1
          Quote: miru mir
          I can never understand why absolutely no one owns the topic, many of you are experts on IDF affairs. It's funny to read you. But the so-called containment policythat our leadership adheres to really infuriates me angry


          And no one claims to be exPerD, as you aptly put it, my highly educated Israeli Friend. We express the opinion of slightly savvy inhabitants who are familiar with the subject through the media and the Internet. Like 99% of the total population of the Earth. Moreover, Israel, in principle, is closer to us than Muslim Turks. But injustice, it is injustice in Africa. When armed people ruthlessly kill unarmed people (meaning the absence of a gunshot and the ability to provide equal resistance), you will forfeit sympathize with the Turks, even if they are wrong. Nine dead for two wounded - is it Israeli arithmetic? And in the legs and arms it was impossible, and then judge? More in revenge in Israel seems to be full of Turkish kickboxers muzzle. And the policy of Israel, which put Palestine as a whole country in a concentration camp and completely deprived it of communication with the outside world (including the indicated case) is generally something ... And do not say that this is not you, this is Egypt, I already heard from atalefa.
          1. miru mir
            miru mir 28 November 2015 16: 52 New
            -1
            Well, I express the opinion of the same man in the street, but with the subject, I am not at all familiar with the subject.
            Palestine planted, as you put it, not us, but the FILYSTIN leadership is above all. It used to be a different situation, but Islamic radicals scored on their people, and neither the Jewish nor the Arab people are happy with the result. And then-atalef is right-there is Jordan and Egypt.
            What about the Turkish shootings Shaids, I will ask you a question - have you ever been thrown by a crowd of such gopniks with iron pins in their hands? It’s very easy to talk about hand-to-foot shooting while sitting on a sofa. And the real situation, in a crowd of Alahbabahs with knives and pieces of iron in their hands and passionately wanting to break you, you somehow cease to be uh ... "tolerant" and the intincts turn on.
            1. Mikhail Krapivin
              Mikhail Krapivin 28 November 2015 19: 31 New
              +2
              Quote: miru mir
              What about the Turkish shootings Shaids, I will ask you a question - have you ever been thrown by a crowd of such gopniks with iron pins in their hands? It’s very easy to talk about hand-to-foot shooting while sitting on a sofa. And the real situation, in a crowd of Alahbabahs with knives and pieces of iron in their hands and passionately wanting to break you, you somehow cease to be uh ... "tolerant" and the intincts turn on.



              And it seemed to me that we were talking about Israeli special forces. Like guys from steel ... Continuous training for years ... From any position to any place offhand, from any weapon ... And the crowd of amateur Turks, even kick-boxers, with pieces of iron in their hands, crushed them so badly that poor commandos forgot all your skills and stupidly shot the Turks? Next time, save money on special forces training and drop off one construction battalion with a gun, he will do the same and even better. Or hit the ship with humanitarian aid rocket, the result will be the same. They will not hate the State of Israel more than now, so what do you lose?
              1. miru mir
                miru mir 28 November 2015 20: 49 New
                -3
                And the special forces are not recruiting from people? These are not computer games, but terminators are only in the movies ... And far from the lovers were among the Turks. I see that recently false false patriotism has flourished on the site, and this will not lead to good. In and you about the construction battalion babble some nonsense, no offense is told to you. I consider this operation a failure, but I do not blame it on the specialist, but on the management. And all this "humanitarian aid"- the dirty provocation of Erdogan. It was suggested that they peacefully go to the Ashdod port and, after checking the cargo, peacefully transport it through one of the checkpoints in Azu.
                1. Nosgoth
                  Nosgoth 30 November 2015 14: 33 New
                  -1
                  You see poorly (i.e., you see only what you want to see, and when something does not like to either be silent or translate arrows).

                  This is not cheers-patriotism, but a simple disregard for you (as a people), as chosen as the rebels ... ugh. Therefore, do not look for respect and understanding here, come to terms with this already.
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  • esaul
    esaul 28 November 2015 06: 28 New
    26
    Today in the Russian spring I already read an article about Erdogan and his "principles" in politics. Extremely unprincipled and corrupt type. Looking at his throwing, a modified version of the statement emerges - "East is a delicate matter." In relation to Recep, I want to say: "The East is a vile business" wink
    1. icas
      icas 28 November 2015 06: 47 New
      0
      Not so he (Erdogan) and corrupt, just follow his actions and logic: "Turkey in the territories and glory of the Turkish Empire."
      1. guzik007
        guzik007 28 November 2015 08: 39 New
        +3
        The problem of perdogan and its danger to Russia lies in its impulsive and unpredictable nature. It’s impossible to calculate the logic of a psychopath. Many sensible politicians were pierced on this, trying to guess the further actions of opponents based on their own principles of approach to solving certain problems. Remember at least the “mistake” of the behavior of Stalin, who did not believe in the beginning of the war with Hitler.
        In short, politicians such as farts should be reliably isolated from society behind the quiet and comfortable walls of special treatment centers.
    2. Stanislas
      Stanislas 28 November 2015 09: 15 New
      -2
      Quote: esaul
      In relation to Recep, I want to say: "The East is a vile business"
      Stupidity will always remain stupidity, whether to express it in relation to Erdogan, or to anyone else. Express the same nonsense not about the East, but about Russia "applied" to Akhejakova, Makarevich or Gorbachev - they will immediately throw a blow at you, and the East will be sludge from the bottom of the heart, approving - 10 pluses.
  • venaya
    venaya 28 November 2015 06: 29 New
    +7
    Israel did not pay a cent to the Turks. Well, who would doubt it.

    To say here that the east is not a delicate matter, commercial interests prevail over all sorts of principles. As the Turks and the Israelis in general cares for everything, we just need to take this into account.
    1. Cetegg
      Cetegg 28 November 2015 06: 38 New
      0
      Alexander 3 was right "Russia has only two allies - its army and navy," but not so long ago they also fraternized with the Turks and Erdogan was good! Now it’s clear “who is who” am
      1. askort154
        askort154 28 November 2015 06: 47 New
        +8
        Cetegg .... Nikolay 2 was right "Russia has only two allies - its army and navy"

        Actually, it said Alexander-lll.
        Unfortunately, on our site, this expression has been turned into a rag.
        1. Cetegg
          Cetegg 28 November 2015 06: 50 New
          +3
          I apologize, from the day I’ve been awake, I'm stupid!)
          1. afdjhbn67
            afdjhbn67 28 November 2015 07: 26 New
            +1
            Quote: Cetegg
            days

            maybe geese? do not injure the psyche with comments - go to sleep and everything will pass ... wassat
            1. Cetegg
              Cetegg 28 November 2015 07: 36 New
              +6
              Quote: afdjhbn67
              geese

              you would not be rude mil-man! I made a mistake, I apologized.
              1. afdjhbn67
                afdjhbn67 28 November 2015 08: 28 New
                +2
                Quote: Cetegg
                you would not be rude mil-man! i d

                Joke sorry hi
        2. EvgNik
          EvgNik 28 November 2015 07: 25 New
          -2
          Quote: askort154
          Unfortunately, on our site, this expression has been turned into a rag.

          Yes, unfortunately it appears in the comments to every second article. Well, when beginners use, but sometimes marshals do not disdain.
      2. miru mir
        miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 39 New
        +2
        It's time to think about Iranian fox wink
    2. icas
      icas 28 November 2015 06: 53 New
      +3
      Yes you are right. The subtlety of the East is determined by tanga (in Russian - money). That is, if today someone pays a pretty penny more - he is the boss.
      1. Haettenschweiler
        Haettenschweiler 28 November 2015 07: 12 New
        +2
        Quote: icas
        That is, if today someone pays a pretty penny more - he is the boss.


        - That is, the all-Russian government officials-this is the East? We will know, we will know ...
        1. Paranoid50
          Paranoid50 28 November 2015 09: 50 New
          +3
          So we are half in Asia.
      2. soroKING
        soroKING 28 November 2015 09: 18 New
        +1
        Not only, my friend in the 90s worked at the Turks (Baytur) in Kursk as a doctor (abilities in the language are not only Turkish), his name was Andrey Bey
      3. Turkir
        Turkir 28 November 2015 09: 45 New
        +3
        The subtlety of the East is determined by tanga

        Not only this: don’t bow too low, cut off your head.
    3. Stanislas
      Stanislas 28 November 2015 18: 43 New
      0
      Quote: venaya
      As the Turks and the Israelis in general cares for everything, we just need to take this into account.
      Keep in mind that last year Netanyahu said that Iran is a greater threat than ISIS, about Turkey - everything is clear, ISIS is "controlled chaos."
      Saying here that the east is not a delicate matter
      And do not talk here about the East in general, because Iran, Syria is the East, and Israel, ISIS and Erdogan are the West.
  • Andrey Yuryevich
    Andrey Yuryevich 28 November 2015 06: 30 New
    +9
    is this conflict "frozen"? I will lose faith in people completely ... (and the Israelites are great ...)
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 28 November 2015 06: 40 New
      +7
      Quote: Andrew Y.
      is this conflict "frozen"?

      1. How?
      2. He was not fired up to freeze. A lot of people earn a lot of money on a warrior now. It’s not profitable to freeze. There are no prerequisites. The war will flare up more and more.
      1. Hello
        Hello 28 November 2015 08: 26 New
        +6
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        1. How?

        For example, they will lower them on the brakes and limit themselves to transfusion from empty to empty.
        1. 33 Watcher
          33 Watcher 28 November 2015 09: 35 New
          0
          So it will be most likely. Exchange of sanctions, swearing. Perhaps another Turkish plane will be shot down, unless of course they start flying again. And again, the exchange of sanctions, swearing, and NATO statements in the spirit, no quarrel, no escalation. Nothing more will happen, however ... No one wants a big war.
  • aba
    aba 28 November 2015 06: 34 New
    +2
    I see ... In a word - Eastern Bazaar.
  • yuriy55
    yuriy55 28 November 2015 06: 35 New
    10
    Specifically for the article and materialization.

    We are ..., women - to the waist, all the insinuations in relations between Israel and Turkey. We remember that under Hitler there were both SS and anti-fascists. Rush at all: guilty and innocent - a policy of nervous and reckless tantrums.

    Take a word, everyone in Russia is interested in the severity of punishment of those responsible and those involved. This is what you need to do. Reveal and crush. Even those who award the Turkish Embassy for the downed Su-24 ...
  • askort154
    askort154 28 November 2015 06: 36 New
    +6
    With the advent of Erdogan, Turkey quarreled with all its neighbors: Iran, Iraq, Israel, Syria, Greece,
    Egypt and, naturally, Armenia. Only Azerbaijan, Georgia and Kazakhstan remained friends, Ukraine still begs.
    1. Haettenschweiler
      Haettenschweiler 28 November 2015 07: 17 New
      0
      Quote: askort154
      With the advent of Erdogan, Turkey quarreled with all its neighbors: Iran, Iraq, Israel, Syria, Greece,
      Egypt and, naturally, Armenia. Only Azerbaijan, Georgia and Kazakhstan remained friends, Ukraine still begs.


      - Nonsense. Turkey has been and remains a member of NATO, and as long as this serious military bloc covers them, they can quarrel with anyone at all.
      1. Boa kaa
        Boa kaa 28 November 2015 10: 42 New
        +4
        Quote: Haettenschweiler
        while this serious military bloc covers them, they can quarrel with anyone at all.
        This is counterproductive for at least two reasons:
        - economically unprofitable,
        - politically dangerous.
        Turkish business began to understand the first,
        the second is the EU and NATO countries.
        Therefore, voices of discontent within the country and fears among the partners in the bloc are already heard. I am afraid that Erdogan will not be able to get out of the hole without a loss, which he himself dug up.
    2. Sirocco
      Sirocco 28 November 2015 07: 18 New
      +8
      Quote: askort154
      With the advent of Erdogan, Turkey quarreled with all its neighbors: Iran, Iraq, Israel, Syria, Greece,

      It's not Erdogan, I think deeper.
      This is already somewhere in the genetic level.
      They have conflicts with everyone, not just Russia.
      1. Rurikovich
        Rurikovich 28 November 2015 07: 39 New
        +6
        At our place of work, "Turks" are listed as synonymous with stupidity and nearness. what laughing
        1. Haettenschweiler
          Haettenschweiler 28 November 2015 07: 41 New
          +2
          Quote: Rurikovich
          At our place of work, "Turks" are listed as synonymous with stupidity and nearness. what laughing


          - I can be mistaken, but I’m almost sure that since a year ago or so you gave the same phrase about Ukrainians. Apparently, at your work they subtly feel the current political moment.
          1. Rurikovich
            Rurikovich 28 November 2015 08: 18 New
            +2
            Nah ... smile Ukrainians, they are also Ukrainians in Africa! But it’s the “Turk” that has been walking for more than a year, and any person who is sweeping is awarded with such an epithet. Without political implications wink
            And the whole situation in Ukraine has no influence on the "rewarding" of such nicknames and is grinded exclusively in the stoker on the morning "planers" with smoke breaks lol(it's warmer there)
            hi
          2. soroKING
            soroKING 28 November 2015 09: 20 New
            +1
            and Ukrainians say, you are Moldovan ...
      2. askort154
        askort154 28 November 2015 13: 34 New
        +1
        Sirocco ... It's not about Erdogan, I think deeper.
        This is already somewhere in the genetic level.

        You are absolutely right. I mean the last decade, and you are the era. Very interesting national sayings about the Turks.
        I can add one more - "What is the advantage of the Turks? A Turk knows from birth that he is a Turk. And some take a lifetime to understand that he is also a Turk." "(This is, of course, for soberly self-critical).
  • demo
    demo 28 November 2015 06: 42 New
    +5
    This is equivalent to the fact that if an aunt-justice of the peace of some 147 section of the city of Elektrougli in the Moscow Region recognized Barack Obama as guilty of Russia's troubles.

    But the uncle, a judge from the US District Court for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania in the city of Allentown, for example, decides, say, at the expense of a citizen of a foreign country, and the whole world fulfills.

    Do you feel the difference between uncle and aunt?
    1. Mikhail Krapivin
      Mikhail Krapivin 28 November 2015 08: 43 New
      +1
      This is because for a long time it was necessary to send this uncle ... (on foot erotic route) and charge for our oil and gas in rubles. Or RMB. Or any other currency, but not dollars. And after a few years, an uncle from Pennsylvania will be able to stick his decisions in .... (well, you understand).
  • Riv
    Riv 28 November 2015 06: 42 New
    -3
    Erdogan is somewhat reminiscent of Lukashenko ...
    1. EvgNik
      EvgNik 28 November 2015 07: 31 New
      +2
      Quote: Riv
      rdogan is somewhat reminiscent of Lukashenko ..

      No, rather Saakashvili. And he will end up as a criminal in his own country. By the way, today I watched an interview with Jacob Kedmi, the former head of the Israeli special services. There is also about it.
      http://politobzor.net/show-72505-zachem-erdogan-sbil-rossiyskiy-su-24-yakov-kedm

      i.html
    2. Bayonet
      Bayonet 28 November 2015 08: 09 New
      +1
      Quote: Riv
      Erdogan is somewhat reminiscent of Lukashenko ...

      Mustache! laughing
      1. Riv
        Riv 28 November 2015 08: 43 New
        +1
        And a long tongue. Lukashenko also constantly says before thinking: "Is it worth it to keep silent?"
        Ours, having shot down someone else's plane, would have scored water in their mouths. Well, who knows, who flew there and why did it fall? No luck man. And if the world public is outraged, then we can say that the fighter attacking the enemy was piloted by the drunken lieutenant BAO Usrashenko, who had stolen him from a military airfield. The defense minister will apologize, and then Usrashenko will receive the next rank.
        And that's it, the goal is achieved. No one flies at the border. Who wants to get involved?
        But the Turks - they are the Turks. The tongue is always ahead of the brain. "Here we are hit, what a fine fellow we are!" And society did not suddenly appreciate. Well, why was yelling first?
  • Fedor Bolts
    Fedor Bolts 28 November 2015 06: 44 New
    0
    No need to joke, although they are creatures, their army is in no way childish.
    1. askort154
      askort154 28 November 2015 07: 17 New
      +1
      Fedor bolts ... No need to joke, although they are creatures, their army is by no means children's.

      Theoretically considered the second in NATO. But practically, seriously,
      I haven’t fought for a long time, I didn’t even participate in the Second World War.
      He trains mainly in the Kurds. Naturally, by and large, Turkey is not a rival for Russia in a military confrontation (one on one). Turkey "is" under the roof of NATO, that is,
      USA.
    2. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 28 November 2015 09: 00 New
      +1
      Quote: Fedor Bolts
      No need to joke, although they are creatures, their army is in no way childish.

      Well, judging by how much he transplanted senior officers, yes, they were no longer children ...
  • Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 28 November 2015 06: 46 New
    +3
    All the eastern politicians who made themselves, went through such a school of humiliation and survival that they have no moral principles and concepts of honor and dignity. Examples are Erdogan and Hussein. These are people, “out of nowhere”, and the desire to create EVERYTHING for themselves and their family prevails.
    The grimace of democracy. In the East, it leads to the appearance of such monsters like Erdogan.
  • magician
    magician 28 November 2015 06: 49 New
    +5
    This incident should not be let down by the Turks. punish by economic, political and military methods (let the C400 constantly monitor the Turkish airspace, work out potential goals, should we study somewhere.)
  • ia-ai00
    ia-ai00 28 November 2015 06: 57 New
    +1
    In 2010, Turkey was so outraged by ... ... immediately sent the Israeli ambassador from Ankara, in one fell swoop ordered to immediately cease all types of economic cooperation, stop air travel and introduce visas for Israelis.

    I don’t understand why Russia didn’t do the same.
    Yes, economics is an important aspect, but what would you do if your neighbor would have dumped you with a club on the head for helping HIS neighbor to restore order in the yard? I think that they would cease all contact. And they would not discuss with him about exchanging their goose for his dead chicken. request
  • rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 28 November 2015 07: 01 New
    +1
    The fact that Erdogan is a political rude person is a squabbler (using the example of the conflict with Israel). But Russia needs to punish him for a crime against our country. With economic sanctions, it is more or less clear, some are already being introduced, others are being prepared. But what will we do if Turkish planes again appear over Syrian territory to bomb the Kurds? If we don’t beat, then this will be perceived as cowardice at Erdogan’s threats. Probably it is necessary that the Syrians bring down, protecting the integrity of their borders.
    About
    surprisingly able to quickly become a regional superpower with a nuclear arsenal.

    This is not surprising. If the Russians had such financial opportunities and a powerful lobby in America, it is not yet known how the world would be arranged today.
    1. tilix
      tilix 28 November 2015 10: 09 New
      +3
      Why do Russians
      such financial opportunities and a powerful lobby in America

      So much oil gas and other minerals like nowhere else. I’m not talking about spaces. Why do you belittle the possibilities of the Russians, they say, without American help, nowhere. Whose mill are you pouring water on?
      1. rotmistr60
        rotmistr60 28 November 2015 12: 22 New
        +2
        Why do you belittle the possibilities of the Russians, they say, without American help, nowhere.

        You obviously in Israel completely forgot the Russian language. You didn’t understand that the conversation is not about American help, but about the Jewish lobby.
    2. sherp2015
      sherp2015 28 November 2015 11: 27 New
      +2
      Quote: rotmistr60
      If the Russians had such financial opportunities


      The Russians do not have financial capabilities, because they are relegated to the background in all areas.
      At the helm and feeders are the so-called "God-chosen" and it does not matter that they have Russian, Ukrainian, Belarusian, Polish, Germanic and other names.
      Russians will be needed only for protection when the enemy attacks the country
      1. rotmistr60
        rotmistr60 28 November 2015 12: 26 New
        +1
        So the Jews did not even understand the meaning of my comment. He, poor fellow, thought that I mourn the lack of American help. Poor Russian speakers, what does the "promised land" do to you.
        1. tilix
          tilix 28 November 2015 20: 28 New
          +1
          If the Russians had such financial opportunities and a powerful lobby in America, it is not yet known how the world would be arranged today
          Did you write Why are you now wriggling like a worm? Exactly Arab, like pi ... eat so first and keep the answer for the bazaar, so I'm not me and this is not mine either.
          1. rotmistr60
            rotmistr60 29 November 2015 02: 16 New
            +2
            The meaning must be captured. And about the market would be silent. I politely talked to you.
            1. rotmistr60
              rotmistr60 29 November 2015 02: 53 New
              0
              Your comparison
              Exactly arablike pi ... eat so first and keep the answer for the bazaar, so I'm not me and this is not mine either.

              perfectly fits into Jewish snobbery. That's when you learn to treat Arabs as people, maybe then they will stop blasting and cutting you. And personally, do I still have to answer to you? They made fun.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. vgorlekost
        vgorlekost 28 November 2015 14: 22 New
        0
        Quote: sherp2015
        the so-called "God-chosen"

        Perhaps we will not mention God in such a context? And you don’t need to talk about the meaning of quotes - you are a “reasonable” person. You have no idea who God-chosen-heard the ringing ...... If you want to say about some nationality, then don’t be a coward and you don’t need to cover your cowardice with insulting meanings. Or say what you wanted - essentially, or be silent, a provocateur.
        1. sherp2015
          sherp2015 29 November 2015 19: 57 New
          0
          Quote: vgorlekost
          Perhaps we will not mention God in such a context? And you don’t need to talk about the meaning of quotes - you are a “reasonable” person.


          So the doctors will not take a bone out of your throat? God grant you health ...
          1. vgorlekost
            vgorlekost 30 November 2015 04: 59 New
            0
            Quote: sherp2015
            So the doctors will not take a bone out of your throat? God grant you health ...

            A bone in your throat, guess ...
            Accordingly, the nail you mentioned should stop you from sitting ...
            May God give you reason.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • ser-pov
    ser-pov 28 November 2015 07: 18 New
    +2
    Normal regional army. Nothing special. Losses in the conflict of course will be, then the conflict. Only in yard 21 and no one is going to fight with bayonets ... Only we don’t need this conflict, and we are peaceful people ... They are pushing us there until we rearm the army ... Just like in the 41st.
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 28 November 2015 08: 20 New
      +3
      Quote: ser-pov
      Normal regional army. Nothing special.

      There is no land border, and the Turkish fleet in the Black and Mediterranean Sea is a serious force. Despite its regional status, the Turkish fleet represents a well-balanced strike force - a strong argument in the troubled region of the Middle East. Rich traditions (the Ottoman fleet dates back to the 1915th century). Bright victories (which is worth the memorable pogrom of the Anglo-French squadron when trying to break through the Dardanelles, XNUMX). Modern technology (new ships and an upgraded second-hand from leading US and European shipbuilders). And most importantly - increased attention paid by the Turkish leadership to this type of armed forces.
      1. cumastra1
        cumastra1 28 November 2015 09: 52 New
        -3
        I hope in case of armed confrontation (God forbid, of course) we will not exchange a soldier for a soldier. Turkey is too strong in this region. It will not be possible to quickly create a superior force group. And they won’t give much time. The only way out is tactical yao. It’s risky, but you need to scare the neighbors with a club.
      2. ser-pov
        ser-pov 28 November 2015 14: 45 New
        0
        All this, of course, is a serious force, but we will not board their missile boats ... We need to think ..., but our fleet also does not need to be downplayed. You can always answer in a balanced way.
  • Cananecat
    Cananecat 28 November 2015 07: 23 New
    0
    Here you can minus what I say ... Personally, I have the opinion that ours knew about the impending provocation with the Su-24.
    They didn’t know where, but they knew how it would look. And the Turks were not framed with a new Dryer, but older. Pilots used in the dark. not long before that they allowed free hunting and voiced it in the media. But now we have a unique instrument of pressure on the Turks. Indeed, in the fall area there were not only groups of militants, but also groups of Syrian specialists and Hezbola. Did they pick mushrooms there, under the nose of the base and training camps?
    1. EvgNik
      EvgNik 28 November 2015 07: 35 New
      +4
      Quote: Canecat
      Personally, I have the opinion that ours knew about the impending provocation with the Su-24.

      They probably did not know, but did not exclude such an opportunity. And these, you see, are different things.
      1. combat66
        combat66 28 November 2015 07: 54 New
        +4
        By telling American partners when, where, who, and at what echelons will work, you can not only rule out, but be sure!
    2. WUA 518
      WUA 518 28 November 2015 07: 53 New
      +1
      Quote: Canecat
      what ours knew about the impending provocation with the Su-24
      http://topwar.ru/83487-samolety-vks-rf-nanesli-pervye-udary-po-poziciyam-islamis
      tov-v-sirii.html #
      Read here. "Ancient" on September 30 laid out everything on the shelves.
      1. cumastra1
        cumastra1 28 November 2015 09: 57 New
        +2
        Perhaps they knew. Vile of course, annoying. But the state has the right to blood, and politics is a dirty thing. There is a suspicion that the Americans themselves blew up their towers. And it is absolutely reliably known that Churchill allowed the Germans to bomb the whole city to smithereens, if only the Germans did not suspect that the British had decoded their codes.
    3. soroKING
      soroKING 28 November 2015 09: 26 New
      0
      Well, 080808 waited the same ... and then forced soldier
    4. 33 Watcher
      33 Watcher 28 November 2015 09: 44 New
      +1
      Well, it’s you bent, without a half liter, you won’t understand what
      Plus, for the version, but just a version !!! hi
    5. AID.S
      AID.S 28 November 2015 10: 15 New
      0
      And they pulled a gas pipe to the Turks (interestingly, we need to look for it - but now we still pull it?) To divert the eyes? Probably, everything is much simpler and in this party with the West we “openly yawned” and worsened our position. But this is more of a question for our analysts in the Kremlin. So far, the party, I hope, has not been lost ...
      1. AID.S
        AID.S 28 November 2015 10: 54 New
        0
        Sorry, they did not start pulling, the laying contract was closed.
      2. sherp2015
        sherp2015 6 December 2015 17: 57 New
        0
        Quote: AID.S
        And they pulled a gas pipe to the Turks (interestingly, we need to look for it - but now we still pull it?) To divert the eyes? Probably, everything is much simpler and in this party with the West we “openly yawned” and worsened our position. But this is more of a question for our analysts in the Kremlin.


        With such a government, we will "openly yawn" for quite some time ...
    6. Seal
      Seal 29 November 2015 01: 52 New
      0
      The main law of the investigation says - look for someone who benefits. That is, in any crime, the one to whom the results of this crime brought or could bring the greatest benefit is most likely to blame.
      And so, if you ask the question: “To whom was it most beneficial for the Turks to bring down our plane” - what will be the answer?
      1. Beneficial to Erdogan? Hardly. Elections have already passed and his party won them. It is no coincidence that Erdogan now looks like a puppy naughty on the carpet, who sees a pile on the carpet, understands that it is a pile - him, but he won’t understand how it happened. Yes, he said a lot of things. But really, he was not going to the carpet. Now he is rushing around, not understanding what to do and say in this situation.
      2. Is the USA profitable? Perhaps, but hardly now. The United States would do this at the very beginning of our operation in Syria, when ours bombed mainly the "moderate opposition" beloved by the States and really flew into Turkish airspace.
      3. Beneficial to Israel? Maybe. Turkey with its agricultural products blocked the way of Israeli products to our market. But this purely commercial problem for Israel poses no threat, either politically, geopolitically, or militarily. That is, it’s absolutely not worth it to bring down our plane.
      4. Beneficial to ISIS? Yes, ISIS, and indeed the entire Syrian opposition, is extremely beneficial for Turkey to bring down our plane. They could expect that ours would be distracted from the Syrian operation, mired in a showdown with Turkey. Does ISIS and other opposition have the resources to do this? Yes there is. The pilot or his commanders can be persuaded, bribed or intimidated.
      5. Profitable Turkish opposition? Yes too. After the recent elections, all Turkish opposition realized that Erdogan would not be removed in the near future by parliamentary means. And since anti-Erdogan sentiments are also strong in the Turkish army, it is not surprising that the Turkish opposition, including the army, found a pilot who might not even be a supporter of the Turkish opposition, but, on the contrary, a supporter of the “gray wolves” and gave him appropriate team. Which, moreover, was precisely in line with the loud public statements of Erdogan himself.
      6. And more. There is one country that is considered our "ally," but which has very jealously and extremely irritably watched the rapprochement between Russia and Turkey, intensified in recent years. Unlike Israel, for which the rapprochement of Turkey and Russia, although it was commercially unprofitable, was not threatened either politically or militarily, this country perceived the rapprochement of Turkey and Russia as a primary and obvious threat to its geopolitical interests. Moreover, representatives of the titular nation of this country have every opportunity to force the United States to participate in the preparation and provision of this provocation. After all, the lobby of the nation that inhabits this country is the second most powerful and powerful in the United States, after the Israeli lobby.
      And I won’t be surprised if one day it turns out that either the pilot who shot down our plane or his commanders were paid well from this country. Or, it is also likely that someone (a pilot or one of his commanders), although he was a Muslim and bore a purely Turkish surname, was not, let's say, from the Turks. And there are several million of these in Turkey. And since they, against the background of the Turks, stand out with their intelligence and quick wits, one damn thing is known in which Turkish bodies they have still settled.
  • dchegrinec
    dchegrinec 28 November 2015 07: 27 New
    +1
    Who cares how Turkey and Israel played backgammon? We have our own vector in foreign policy and Turkey is not our authority in this vector! She acted as an offended kid who kicked his uncle, it’s understandable that we can question the very existence of this state with one click, only this will be a clear excess. let us suffer better! Torment is better than any global response, because we need to reason it! Turkey with its treacherous manners we need economically. We don’t need to put Perdogan and the war in the region on the same scale. We need Syria now. And Turkey will not go anywhere. Now it will sit and not buzz, at this stage there is no other Russia.
  • SAM 5
    SAM 5 28 November 2015 07: 40 New
    +7
    The Turk, after reading tales about Ivan the Fool, asks the Russian:
    - Is it true that you have all of Ivana and are really fools?
    Russian:
    Well, not everything, but it happens. Only we call such Turks.
  • Hitrovan07
    Hitrovan07 28 November 2015 07: 54 New
    +4
    Erdogan MUST BE DESTROYED.
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 28 November 2015 08: 23 New
      +7
      Quote: Hitrovan07
      Erdogan MUST BE DESTROYED.

      Do you have one answer to all articles? smile
      1. WUA 518
        WUA 518 28 November 2015 08: 35 New
        10
        Quote: Hitrovan07
        Erdogan MUST BE DESTROYED.

        Give coal! Small, but many! Trolling is such a thing! laughing
      2. rotmistr60
        rotmistr60 28 November 2015 09: 36 New
        +2
        For bayonet

        With the world on a thread and a sweater will come out (and the rating has increased). Everyone earns as he can. Clearly "scolded."
      3. 33 Watcher
        33 Watcher 28 November 2015 09: 48 New
        +2
        Well, maybe he ...? From the Kurds will be ... what
    2. Oleg14774
      Oleg14774 28 November 2015 08: 40 New
      0
      Quote: Hitrovan07
      Erdogan MUST BE DESTROYED.

      Evil must be destroyed! Then we will honestly be friends with Amers, and with the British, and even with Israel, I emphasize honestly!
  • astronom1973n
    astronom1973n 28 November 2015 07: 58 New
    0
    Thus, the Turks behaved too emotionally from the very beginning, underestimated Israel and the pro-Israel lobby in Europe and the USA.
    This is the key difference in today's situation.
  • mamont5
    mamont5 28 November 2015 08: 15 New
    +3
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    But NATO will not shake it, they are not profitable.

    Naturally. After all, NATO is the United States, and the United States will be more profitable to pit Turkey with Russia, and to remain (as always) aside. Therefore, do not do what the United States wants. And all the GDP is doing right (to the best of reason, of course). So, to all "Putinersillers" who want a war with the whole West at once, I think we need to "shut up our fountain."

    Quote: Cetegg
    I understood you correctly that in the event of a direct military clash between Russia and Turkey, NATO will not "get up" -?!) And many "members" in NATO will remain when it is revealed that all the agreements on mutual assistance among the alliance are fiction ?!)

    And they already come to this conclusion. Even the most stubborn of the former "eastern bloc." Increasingly, doubts are expressed about the need for NATO.
  • dojjdik
    dojjdik 28 November 2015 08: 35 New
    -5
    Israel is a country steeped in terrorism and isil is a product of this country; we are already fighting Turkey on the side of Syria; a downed plane has no military significance - for anyone, the Syrian army will come out and cross the Turkish border; and then the Syrians will go to the Israeli border and will not help any igil; and Hezbollah will enter Lebanon and the issue with the Dutch can be resolved
    1. Mikhail Krapivin
      Mikhail Krapivin 28 November 2015 08: 49 New
      +7
      Our Israeli comrades are now reading your post about resolving the issue with the Dutch and drag on ...;)
      1. MACCABI-TLV
        MACCABI-TLV 28 November 2015 14: 59 New
        +1
        Quote: Mikhail Krapivin
        Our Israeli comrades are now reading your post about resolving the issue with the Dutch and drag on ...;)

        not that word. winked The holiday continues! yes
    2. Bayonet
      Bayonet 28 November 2015 10: 27 New
      +4
      Quote: dojjdik
      go to the Israeli border and will not help any igil; and Hezbollah will enter Lebanon and the issue with the Dutch can be resolved

      Ek how it happened! what
      1. atalef
        atalef 28 November 2015 13: 11 New
        +1
        Quote: Bayonet
        Ek how it happened!

        not childishly buggy today Fidel
        good morning, Alexander. hi
        1. Bayonet
          Bayonet 28 November 2015 16: 05 New
          -1
          Quote: atalef
          good morning, Alexander.

          Good afternoon! hi This is what "gollanami" he was going to deal with the Dutch? wassat
    3. miru mir
      miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 45 New
      -1
      Great porridge in your head good
    4. atalef
      atalef 28 November 2015 13: 09 New
      0
      Quote: dojjdik
      You can solve the issue with the Dutch

      Quote: Mikhail Krapivin
      Your post about solving the issue with the Dutch

      GoLanami hi
      1. Mikhail Krapivin
        Mikhail Krapivin 28 November 2015 14: 54 New
        +1
        Yes, even the Golanami, everyone understood and this is the main thing :)
        1. sherp2015
          sherp2015 1 December 2015 09: 50 New
          +1
          Quote: Mikhail Krapivin
          Yes, even the Golanami, everyone understood and this is the main thing :)


          )) Poor Dutch ...)))
  • Nymp
    Nymp 28 November 2015 08: 37 New
    +1
    To be friends with the Turks is the same as seeking honor from a swindler. How much history presented Russia with pods of turkey! Initially, when there was general enthusiasm for "friendship" with Turkey, I was waiting for a trick. I do not believe negative
    1. ser-pov
      ser-pov 28 November 2015 13: 57 New
      0
      There was a strategic move ... Although, judging by Putin’s speech (at the opening of the EBN center), when he learned about the downing of the SU-24, he realized that he had not fully calculated Erdogan. Apparently, very worried ..
  • solohan
    solohan 28 November 2015 08: 43 New
    +3
    I read our science fiction writer in the summer, I don’t remember the last name about the attack of the Turks on Urkain ... it was written about 10 years ago ... what I remembered belay ... and about 10 years ago I read in newspapers about how many madrasahs were built in Crimea by Turks to teach Islam am ... science fiction was saddened by science fiction writers and life every day is becoming more fantastic ...
    1. 33 Watcher
      33 Watcher 28 November 2015 09: 52 New
      +2
      And then, Turks also see Crimea in a dream. And here it is ...
  • guzik007
    guzik007 28 November 2015 08: 45 New
    +1
    starting with the ban on the import of harmful products.
    -------------------------------------------------- -

    Exactly ! Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye! While everyone in the relationship is all chpoki-chpoki, they close their eyes to all the rubbish, than stuff our people from behind the hill. Traders rule, bureaucrats close their eyes for kickbacks. The neck, figuratively speaking, twists its head, but rather, the tail wags the dog. And only when a threat arises, the head remembers who is the master in the body.
  • AID.S
    AID.S 28 November 2015 08: 47 New
    +4
    Quote: ia-ai00
    I don’t understand why Russia didn’t do the same.

    And it seems to me that we are doing the same thing. For a long time. But along this road we come across forks and rakes. After the sanctions began and the South Stream was blocked in Bulgaria by the West, we offended headlong into the tentacles of Erdogan (and those who spoke then they were right or skeptical right now), they announced with great fanfare about our “overpowering”, as about a settled case, and now we are scratching turnips, what to do with investments. So far, there is no clarity with China, there were similar actions and victorious statements too. We’ll see what happens later. As Nikolai and Alexander mentioned today have said more than once, “we don’t have allies, ..”
  • Varies
    Varies 28 November 2015 09: 17 New
    +2
    In the light of such a drain (political, economic) against Israel, we can’t talk about any miscalculations of the damage that Turkey could have caused a possible economic war with Russia, from this we can conclude that Erdogan assumed that the same eastern bazaar would turn out, but it didn’t grow together, and now they they simply contemplate how much the anger of the Russian people will be shed (in the form of various kinds of restrictions). The most logical thing is that they point blank do not want to take lessons from the history of their own state, because the very restrictions with anger can be so great and long that it will be easier for them to change the whole elite with the political system.
  • HAM
    HAM 28 November 2015 09: 28 New
    +2
    "Turks are such Turks."

    Rather, Erdogan did not run into those .... the Israelis "blabbed" "great and terrible," like a sucker.
  • Peacemaker
    Peacemaker 28 November 2015 09: 31 New
    +4
    I liked the article. On business and with humor. Especially liked the actions of Israel. I recalled a joke:

    A Jew met with a gypsy, it turned out to be.

    I respect the Jews. The peculiarity of the national mentality.
  • pvv113
    pvv113 28 November 2015 09: 38 New
    +2
    I remembered the old joke:
    The Turk, to pry off the Russian, says:
    - In Russia, whatever Ivan is, you are a “stupid person”.
    - Correctly. Our name is Turks
    wink
  • Rash
    Rash 28 November 2015 09: 51 New
    +3
    Quote: dchegrinec
    Who cares how Turkey and Israel played backgammon? We have our own vector in foreign policy and Turkey is not our authority in this vector! She acted as an offended kid who kicked his uncle, it’s clear that we can question the very existence of this state with one click, only this will be a clear excess. let us suffer better!


    Naturally, I have a nephew, whom I helped a lot in my time, and he imagined and began to bull and try to bend me. I explained everything to him intelligibly. Half a year passes and he declares - uncle, give me money! All this time he clearly did not suffer from his misconduct! And brazenly pressed himself against me.
    I want to say that the pain of misconduct happens with conscientious people. And insolent and greyhound (like Erdogan and my nephew) all P.O.H.
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 28 November 2015 11: 06 New
      +4
      Quote: Rash
      And insolent and greyhound (like Erdogan and my nephew) all P.O.H.

      Yeah ... With your nephew you are out of luck, as we are with the Turks. smile
  • Tamila
    Tamila 28 November 2015 09: 52 New
    +2
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Quote: Cetegg
    and no one speaks about open war with Turkey. They are as if in NATO, and it’s too early for us to go with NATO.

    But NATO will not shake it, they are not profitable.

    NATO intimidated us completely))
  • koksalek
    koksalek 28 November 2015 10: 05 New
    0
    Quote: nadezhiva
    US media are broadcasting about the possible entry of contingent to the Turkish-Syrian border.
    "US officials say that the additional contingent on the Turkish border, which will include infantry and artillery, could be the most effective way to block the key transit routes relied on by IS fighters in Syria, as well as stop the flow of foreign fighters to Europe," The Wall Street Journal.
    "The rules of the game have changed. Enough is enough. The border should be closed," the representative of the US administration quotes the issue as saying. "There is a threat of international proportions, it comes from Syria and passes through Turkey."

    Grushko: NATO understands that Turkey creates risks for the entire alliance
    The United States has not officially indicated how many troops are in question, the newspaper notes. According to estimates of its sources in the Pentagon, more than 10 thousand soldiers may be needed to complete this task.
    “It is not yet clear how Turkey will react,” the article says. “As Turkish officials said, they agree that it is necessary to tighten security measures at the border and that they have begun to take some measures.”
    "American officials warned Ankara that she could face a" serious response "from European states if Turkey could not close the border, and foreign fighters could once again escape from Syria and commit a terrorist attack in Europe," the article says.
    (transmits TASS)
    recourse Was this the original goal?

    yeah, close the door when everyone has already left
  • Thunderbolt
    Thunderbolt 28 November 2015 10: 06 New
    +4
    Turks are Turks.
    Boring to read fellow such articles .... after all, the same thing --- Turks are subhuman, and Erdogan is Hitler in general! His atom, atom. We saw that Turkey is a sponsor of IG UUR fellow Why didn’t such statues exist when Erdogan in the capital of our country recently solemnly opened a huge mosque together with Ramzan and Volodya? playing or Chapaevtsev. It was already when 3 lards were presented to Ukraine. You wanted to, you know, to buy Ukraine when she climbed into European integration. Our money didn’t cry. Now with partner Erdogan a tourist-tomato war.
    1. U-96
      U-96 28 November 2015 12: 04 New
      +1
      Quote: Thunderbolt
      It’s boring to read such articles .... after all, the same thing --- Turks are subhuman, and Erdogan is Hitler in general! Atu him, atu. We saw that Turkey is a sponsor of IG.URYA

      Well, what do you want? All the media field on the fan throws a Turkish theme. From the dirty laundry of the Erdi family to the worms in the meat. Conjuncture. But - finds a lively response among the masses. In particular, as rightly noted,
      Quote: Thunderbolt
      tourist-tomato war.

      In general, it is strange that there is no PRP statement that these are all the machinations of the Russian Federation in order to divert attention from Ukraine.
      1. Thunderbolt
        Thunderbolt 28 November 2015 13: 22 New
        0
        Parash probably already cast (from pure chocolate) the medal "For the Return of Krim." In people, it’s dumb to show up with such a high reward, probably darts at home with her. =))) However, these are my humorous conjectures.
        Quote: U-96
        In general, it is strange that there is no application
        His hands are short (besides they are tied in the Crimea and the Donbass). But it’s not for nothing that they say that he’ll bring the language to Kiev! In Syria, the Ukropresident speaks out a bit, negatively, as you might imagine, speaking about the actions of Russia. Here is the last:
        “A large number of international observers, including, referring to intelligence, irrefutable evidence of the presence of Russian troops in Syria belay . I believe that this is a key element in another destabilization of the situation in the Middle East. I issued certain instructions in order to close the Ukrainian airspace for Russian aircraft that deliver weapons and troops to Syria. We must do everything to prevent another round of tension in Syriahttp://www.politnavigator.net/poroshenko-prizval-prepyatstvovat-pomoshhi-rossii-
        zakonnomu-rukovodstvu-sirii.html
  • veksha50
    veksha50 28 November 2015 10: 26 New
    +2
    "And the Israelisto the same extent who did not believe a single word of Erdogan"...

    They did it right .... And ours also needs ...

    Honestly, when the Turkish Stream project began, I always thought that it contained some kind of dirty tricks from the Turks, that you did not need to trust Turkey, that tomorrow or the day after tomorrow they could wave their tail like a weather vane ...... Unfortunately, my fears came true ...
  • Stepan stepanovich
    Stepan stepanovich 28 November 2015 10: 36 New
    +1
    How Erdogan Israel punished


    The author staked out the title of a future article:
    "How Putin punished Turkey"
  • Stoler
    Stoler 28 November 2015 10: 41 New
    +2
    "How is the conflict between Turkey and Israel different from the conflict between Turkey and Russia?" - so that the kick is far away for us, and the rest is chatter!
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Major_Vortex
    Major_Vortex 28 November 2015 12: 08 New
    -1
    Erdogan is like a ping pong ball. Jews repelled now he flew to the Russian laughing
  • miru mir
    miru mir 28 November 2015 12: 10 New
    +4
    Pulling a completely secular country into the clutches of Islamism, Erdagan causes great harm to his people.
    1. atalef
      atalef 28 November 2015 12: 40 New
      +1
      Quote: miru mir
      Pulling a completely secular country into the clutches of Islamism, Erdagan causes great harm to his people.

      In general, I have a feeling that he and Davutoglu - end up as Mursi (in Egypt) - in prison and the death sentence.
      1. IS-80
        IS-80 28 November 2015 13: 57 New
        -1
        Quote: atalef
        In general, I have a feeling that he and Davutoglu - end up as Mursi (in Egypt) - in prison and the death sentence.

        In general, Turkey will fall apart. And the straits will be under the general control of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan, I believe.
        1. Your friend
          Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 10 New
          -1
          Quote: IS-80
          Quote: atalef
          In general, I have a feeling that he and Davutoglu - end up as Mursi (in Egypt) - in prison and the death sentence.

          In general, Turkey will fall apart. And the straits will be under the general control of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan, I believe.

          Kazakhstan?))))
          1. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 12 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Kazakhstan?))))

            Yes. What bothers you?
            1. Your friend
              Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 14 New
              0
              Quote: IS-80
              Quote: Your friend
              Kazakhstan?))))

              Yes. What bothers you?

              I look at the map and do not see Kazakhstan on the shores of the Black Sea or the Mediterranean Sea.
              I believe that Uzbekistan will want to control the straits, do you mind?
              1. IS-80
                IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 16 New
                0
                Quote: Your friend
                I look at the map and do not see Kazakhstan on the shores of the Black Sea or the Mediterranean Sea. No, everything is OK?

                So what? How can this interfere?
                Quote: Your friend
                I believe that Uzbekistan will want to control the straits, do you mind?

                Vs.
                1. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 18 New
                  0
                  Quote: IS-80
                  Quote: Your friend
                  I look at the map and do not see Kazakhstan on the shores of the Black Sea or the Mediterranean Sea. No, everything is OK?

                  So what? How can this interfere?

                  Of course not. Paraguay can not prevent anything from controlling the strait of Gibraltar.
                  1. IS-80
                    IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 21 New
                    0
                    Quote: Your friend
                    Of course not. Paraguay can not prevent anything from controlling the strait of Gibraltar.

                    What do you want to say?
                    1. Your friend
                      Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 24 New
                      0
                      Quote: IS-80
                      Quote: Your friend
                      Of course not. Paraguay can not prevent anything from controlling the strait of Gibraltar.

                      What do you want to say?

                      I want to say, from which side will Kazakhstan control the straits? What does it have to do with the straits?
                      1. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 31 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        I want to say, from which side will Kazakhstan control the straits? What does it have to do with the straits?

                        The most immediate. Both Turkey and Kazakhstan are Turkic states.
                      2. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 14: 34 New
                        0
                        Quote: IS-80
                        Quote: Your friend
                        I want to say, from which side will Kazakhstan control the straits? What does it have to do with the straits?

                        The most immediate. Both Turkey and Kazakhstan are Turkic states.

                        Uzbeks are also Turkic people, but you are against. You have problems with logic.
                        Kyrgyz, Turkmens, Azerbaijanis are Turkic peoples, too, it is necessary to connect to the ownership of the straits, the Turks are the same.
                        Though kill, what does it have to do with the straits, that someone is Turk and someone is not?
                      3. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 14: 44 New
                        -1
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Uzbeks are also Turkic people, but you are against. You have problems with logic.

                        That's no problem at all.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Kyrgyz, Turkmens, Azerbaijanis are Turkic peoples, too, it is necessary to connect to the ownership of the straits, the Turks are the same.

                        So what? Well, Turks and Turks, but Kazakhs are a key people. And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.
                      4. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 15: 03 New
                        0
                        Quote: IS-80
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Uzbeks are also Turkic people, but you are against. You have problems with logic.

                        That's no problem at all.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Kyrgyz, Turkmens, Azerbaijanis are Turkic peoples, too, it is necessary to connect to the ownership of the straits, the Turks are the same.

                        So what? Well, Turks and Turks, but Kazakhs are a key people. And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.

                        Here are those times, at the beginning you claimed that you just have to be a Turkic state to control the straits, now you say that you need to be some kind of “key people” (what a strange term), problems with logic, and big ones? And why is Kazakhstan "the most important Turkic state"? Did you designate him like that?))))
                      5. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 15: 06 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Here are those times, at the beginning you claimed that you just have to be a Turkic state in order to control the straits

                        These are your inventions.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        And why is Kazakhstan "the most important Turkic state"? Did you designate him like that?))))

                        But somehow it happened historically.
                      6. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 15: 11 New
                        -1
                        Quote: IS-80
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Here are those times, at the beginning you claimed that you just have to be a Turkic state in order to control the straits

                        These are your inventions.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        And why is Kazakhstan "the most important Turkic state"? Did you designate him like that?))))

                        But somehow it happened historically.

                        What fiction? Do you have sclerosis? I remind you of your phrase:
                        The most immediate. Both Turkey and Kazakhstan are Turkic states.

                        You can not thank for the search, but consult a doctor without fail.)))
                        Historically, Kazakhstan is "the most important Turkic state"? Ahahahaha ... If anyone claims to be a leader in the Turkic world, then this is Turkey, you are our historical one.))))
                      7. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 15: 29 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        What fiction? Do you have sclerosis? I remind you:

                        And I do not refuse these words.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        that you just have to be a Turkic state to control the straits

                        But these are your inventions.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Historically, Kazakhstan is "the most important Turkic state"? Ahahahaha ... If anyone claims to be a leader in the Turkic world, then this is Turkey, you are our historical one.))))

                        A sick person, a person in Europe, can claim anything. Though power over the universe. These are his personal problems. But in fact these are the same backyards as Poland. And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.
                      8. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 16: 14 New
                        -1
                        Quote: IS-80
                        Quote: Your friend
                        What fiction? Do you have sclerosis? I remind you:

                        And I do not refuse these words.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        that you just have to be a Turkic state to control the straits

                        But these are your inventions.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Historically, Kazakhstan is "the most important Turkic state"? Ahahahaha ... If anyone claims to be a leader in the Turkic world, then this is Turkey, you are our historical one.))))

                        A sick person, a person in Europe, can claim anything. Though power over the universe. These are his personal problems. But in fact these are the same backyards as Poland. And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.

                        This is not fiction, you yourself wrote it that way. Well, why are you unlocking?))))
                        Ahahahahhaaaa ... no words. This "sick man" has a housekeeper 4 times more than Kazakhstan, but such backyards, such backyards.)))
                        Have you already conveyed to the President of Kazakhstan your desire for Kazakhstan to control the straits? What did Nursultan Abishevich answer you? I hope he agreed with your idea about the historical role of Kazakhstan in the Turkic world and the control of the straits?)))))
                      9. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 00 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        This is not fiction, you yourself wrote it that way. Well, why are you unlocking?))))

                        This is some kind of mania to ascribe to me what I did not say. You take your advice about a doctor there.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        This "sick man" has a housekeeper 4 times more than Kazakhstan, but such backyards, such backyards.)))

                        And when did all of Europe tremble with the thunder of the Ottoman cannons, and where was the time?
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Have you already conveyed to the President of Kazakhstan your desire for Kazakhstan to control the straits?

                        I do not have such authority.
                      10. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 17: 19 New
                        0
                        This is some kind of mania to ascribe to me what I did not say. You take your advice about a doctor there.

                        No, these are your words, I quoted your quotes to you.)))
                        And when did all of Europe tremble with the thunder of the Ottoman cannons, and where was the time?

                        Cheat? And here it is? Are you raving What does this have to do with Kazakhstan being the “most important Turkic state”?
                        I do not have such authority.

                        Do not be discouraged, there is. You already know that it will be so))) Here is your phrase:
                        And the straits will be under the general control of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan, I believe.

                        Modesty.)))
                      11. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 17: 47 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        No, these are your words, I quoted your quotes to you.)))

                        You quoted your quotes and not mine.
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Cheat? And here it is? Are you raving What does this have to do with Kazakhstan being the “most important Turkic state”?

                        In addition to the fact that the economy is 4 times, this of course is all interesting. But Turkey's prospects are extremely bleak. And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.
                      12. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 01 New
                        0
                        You quoted your quotes and not mine.

                        Well, gods, these were your quotes, so you refuse your words. Not good.)))
                        In addition to the fact that the economy is 4 times, this of course is all interesting. But Turkey's prospects are extremely bleak. And Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.

                        Aahahaha ... Well, you, Vange, know better about the gloomy prospects of Turkey, with your vision of the future.)
                        How do you prove that Kazakhstan is "the most important Turkic state"?)))))
                      13. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 24 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        Well, gods, these were your quotes, so you refuse your words. Not good.)))

                        Words are not mine, but yours. smile

                        Quote: Your friend
                        How do you prove that Kazakhstan is "the most important Turkic state"?)))))

                        But why? smile
                      14. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 28 New
                        0
                        Words are not mine, but yours. smile

                        Yours-yours.)
                        What for? smile

                        I agree.) But really, why? Your "I think" is enough.)))
                      15. IS-80
                        IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 32 New
                        0
                        Quote: Your friend
                        I agree.) But really, why? Your "I think" is enough.)))

                        It happened !!!!!! laughing
                      16. Your friend
                        Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 39 New
                        0
                        Quote: IS-80
                        Quote: Your friend
                        I agree.) But really, why? Your "I think" is enough.)))

                        It happened !!!!!! laughing

                        Finally. Wow, I'm looking forward to sharing the straits. By the way, when does this happen, what are the cards there?)
  • Hello
    Hello 28 November 2015 17: 59 New
    +1
    Quote: IS-80
    In general, Turkey will fall apart. And the straits will be under the general control of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan, I think

    Okay, Russia, I understand, but Kazakhstan and Israel, and to these straits? Why not Greece for example? Or Romania? request
    1. Your friend
      Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 06 New
      +2
      Quote: Hello
      Quote: IS-80
      In general, Turkey will fall apart. And the straits will be under the general control of Russia, Israel and Kazakhstan, I think

      Okay, Russia, I understand, but Kazakhstan and Israel, and to these straits? Why not Greece for example? Or Romania? request

      Obviously the same. Israel is the most important Semitic state. Do not ask me where it is from the straits, but this is how the IS-80 sees it, and he cannot be mistaken.
      1. IS-80
        IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 45 New
        0
        Quote: Your friend
        Obviously the same. Israel is the most important Semitic state.

        Are you anti-Semite?
        1. Your friend
          Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 52 New
          0
          Quote: IS-80
          Quote: Your friend
          Obviously the same. Israel is the most important Semitic state.

          Are you anti-Semite?

          Ahahahaha .... I’m even afraid to imagine why you made such a conclusion?
          Kazakhstan is the most important Turkic state.
          - I can assume, based on your suggestion, that you are anti-kinases, ahahahahahahaahaaaaaa ....?
          1. IS-80
            IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 01 New
            0
            Quote: Your friend
            Ahahahaha .... I’m even afraid to imagine why you made such a conclusion?

            Why attack Israel then?
            1. Your friend
              Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 08 New
              0
              Quote: IS-80
              Quote: Your friend
              Ahahahaha .... I’m even afraid to imagine why you made such a conclusion?

              Why attack Israel then?

              What???? Where did I attack Israel? Are you raving Give me my phrase, where did I attack Israel?
              1. IS-80
                IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 19 New
                -1
                Quote: Your friend
                What???? Where did I attack Israel? Are you raving Give me my phrase, where did I attack Israel?

                Quote: Your friend
                Obviously the same. Israel is the most important Semitic state.

                What's this? You want to say that Israel is the most unimportant Semitic state? So understand your mockery?
                1. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 25 New
                  0
                  Quote: IS-80
                  Quote: Your friend
                  What???? Where did I attack Israel? Are you raving Give me my phrase, where did I attack Israel?

                  Quote: Your friend
                  Obviously the same. Israel is the most important Semitic state.

                  What's this? You want to say that Israel is the most unimportant Semitic state? So understand your mockery?

                  Oh, how everything is running. (((
    2. IS-80
      IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 08 New
      0
      Quote: Hello
      Okay, Russia, I understand, but Kazakhstan and Israel, and to these straits?

      For many reasons. For example, because Israel is a very strong and economically and politically-military state in the Middle East. And, perhaps, the most adequate.
      Quote: Hello
      Why not Greece for example? Or Romania?

      Why Greece or Romania? Why the hell are we these countries with no economy and external governance?
      1. Your friend
        Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 14 New
        0
        Quote: IS-80
        Quote: Hello
        Okay, Russia, I understand, but Kazakhstan and Israel, and to these straits?

        For many reasons. For example, because Israel is a very strong and economically and politically-military state in the Middle East. And, perhaps, the most adequate.
        Quote: Hello
        Why not Greece for example? Or Romania?

        Why Greece or Romania? Why the hell are we these countries with no economy and external governance?

        I agree with you completely. May Hello and Israel not tremble and take the straits. All the same, not every day such an offer arrives, otherwise we will change our minds. Right?
        1. IS-80
          IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 28 New
          +1
          Quote: Your friend
          I agree with you completely.

          Thanks, of course my friend. I held everything here. Do you agree or not. And it all turned out wonderfully. Already relieved from the heart. smile
          Quote: Your friend
          May Hello and Israel not tremble and take the straits.

          Well, so I made them such an offer that it is impossible to refuse. bully
          Quote: Your friend
          otherwise we’ll change our minds.

          And you don’t get on here. You were not standing nearby. smile
          1. Your friend
            Your friend 28 November 2015 18: 35 New
            0
            Thanks, of course my friend. I held everything here. Do you agree or not. And it all turned out wonderfully. Already relieved from the heart. smile

            Address ischo, you know, I’m uhhh for you. We, as Buonassier and Cardinal, will show them all.
            Well, so I made them such an offer that it is impossible to refuse. bully

            Finally, you are just beautiful in this story. Such a width of soul, truly Slavic scope.
            And you don’t get on here. You were not standing nearby. smile

            But this is insulting. Well, okay, the main thing is that the Jews take the straits, as you suggested, otherwise they will start to articulate, the fifth, tenth ... you know these Jews.)))
            1. IS-80
              IS-80 28 November 2015 18: 54 New
              +1
              Quote: Your friend
              Address ischo, you know, I’m uhhh for you. We, as Buonassier and Cardinal, will show them all.

              That was the irony.
              Quote: Your friend
              Finally, you are just beautiful in this story. Such a width of soul, truly Slavic scope.

              What does the scope have to do with it? This is quite an adequate solution.
              Quote: Your friend
              Well, okay, the main thing is that the Jews take the straits, as you suggested, otherwise they will start to articulate, the fifth, tenth ... you know these Jews.)))

              You are clearly anti-Semite. However, like Russophobe and Turkophobe. Chtoli Chinese?
              1. Your friend
                Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 02 New
                0
                Address ischo, you know, I’m uhhh for you. We, as Buonassier and Cardinal, will show them all.

                Was that irony? Oh my goodness, really? Fu, how uncomfortable it turned out, otherwise I thought .... ahahaha ...
                What does the scope have to do with it? This is quite an adequate solution.

                Stopudovo adequate. The most adequate of the adequate does not happen.
                You are clearly anti-Semite. However, like Russophobe and Turkophobe. Chtoli Chinese?

                Damn, brought to clean water, here you have a scent. And I don’t like borsch.
                Of course the Chinese, how could I hope to deceive you, with your foresight and tarot cards.))))
                1. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 17 New
                  0
                  Quote: Your friend
                  The most adequate of the adequate does not happen.

                  Whatever.
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Damn, brought to clean water, here you have a scent. And I don’t like borsch.
                  Of course the Chinese, how could I hope to deceive you, with your foresight and tarot cards.))))

                  Well, who are you? Judging by how you attack it, you don’t like the idea of ​​controlling the straits by Russians, Jews, and Kazakhs. You make fun of Kazakhstan, Israel and Russia.
                  So who are you after that?
                2. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 23 New
                  +1
                  No matter what

                  )
                  Well, who are you? Judging by how you attack it, you don’t like the idea of ​​controlling the straits by Russians, Jews, and Kazakhs. You make fun of Kazakhstan, Israel and Russia.
                  So who are you after that?

                  I mean, who am I? You yourself wrote a Chinese, anti-Semite, Turkophobia from the state. Have you forgotten what you wrote? Oh yes, your sclerosis.))))
                3. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 28 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Your friend
                  I mean, who am I? You yourself wrote a Chinese, anti-Semite, Turkophobia from the state. Have you forgotten what you wrote? Oh yes, your sclerosis.))))

                  I'm sorry that you are so embittered against everyone and everything. I see I can’t convince you. Your anger prevents you from adequately looking at things and seeing the objective reality as it really is. But maybe time will heal you and you will understand that I am right. hi
                4. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 33 New
                  +1
                  Quote: IS-80
                  Quote: Your friend
                  I mean, who am I? You yourself wrote a Chinese, anti-Semite, Turkophobia from the state. Have you forgotten what you wrote? Oh yes, your sclerosis.))))

                  I'm sorry that you are so embittered against everyone and everything. I see I can’t convince you. Your anger prevents you from adequately looking at things and seeing the objective reality as it really is. But maybe time will heal you and you will understand that I am right. hi

                  What is it? It seems that at some point in our communication you pereklinilsya, like talking normally, teasing each other. And then the Chinese went anti-Semites, anger. I did not say bad words to you, did not call names in any way. What happened, why this post about "reality" and anger. I didn’t offend you like ...
                5. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 19: 48 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Your friend
                  What is it? It seems that at some point in our communication you pereklinilsya, like talking normally, teasing each other. And then the Chinese went anti-Semites, anger. I did not say bad words to you, did not call names in any way. What happened, why this post about "reality" and anger. I didn’t offend you like ...

                  And then what caused your attacks? Why is my idea of ​​joint control of the straits bad? Joking as a joke, but you did not bring a single argument adequate against. Except ahahaa, how funny. And Israel is not right for you, and Kazakhstan and Russia.
                6. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 19: 55 New
                  +1
                  And then what caused your attacks? Why is my idea of ​​joint control of the straits bad? Joking as a joke, but you did not bring a single argument adequate against. Except ahahaa, how funny. And Israel is not right for you, and Kazakhstan and Russia.

                  Your idea is bad in that it is only your idea and it has nothing to do with life. I tried to convey this to you when I asked what Kazakhstan and the control of the straits have to do with it. Well, I swear, kindergarten and causes only laughter. So the Jewish comrade laughed, do you really not understand this?
                7. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 20: 02 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Your idea is bad in that it is only your idea and it has nothing to do with life. I tried to convey this to you when I asked what Kazakhstan and the control of the straits have to do with it. Well, I swear, kindergarten and causes only laughter. So the Jewish comrade laughed, do you really not understand this?

                  So please explain to me what is it bad? You do not speak. Here again, you are talking about "kindergarten and causes only laughter."
                8. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 20: 04 New
                  0
                  So please explain to me what is it bad? You do not speak. Here again, you are talking about "kindergarten and causes only laughter."

                  Ok, let's get started.
                  Who in the governments in Israel, in Kazakhstan, in Russia knows about your idea?
                9. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 20: 21 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Who in the governments in Israel, in Kazakhstan, in Russia knows about your idea?

                  Well, probably no one knows. But how does this affect whether a good or bad idea?
                10. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 20: 43 New
                  0
                  Quote: IS-80
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Who in the governments in Israel, in Kazakhstan, in Russia knows about your idea?

                  Well, probably no one knows. But how does this affect whether a good or bad idea?

                  Um ... my idea is to fly at a speed higher than the speed of light. Is that a good idea? What do you think?
                11. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 20: 46 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Um ... my idea is to fly at a speed higher than the speed of light. Is that a good idea? What do you think?

                  Good, I read such projects already exist. Only so far with the implementation is not very.
                12. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 20: 50 New
                  0
                  Quote: IS-80
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Um ... my idea is to fly at a speed higher than the speed of light. Is that a good idea? What do you think?

                  Good, I read such projects already exist. Only so far with the implementation is not very.

                  I assure you, there are no such projects, we are still far from the speed of light, oh, how far we have not reached, but here the superlight)))
                  So with the implementation of your project is not very.
                  I hope the analogy is clear?)
                13. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 21: 10 New
                  0
                  Quote: Your friend
                  I assure you, there are no such projects, we are still far from the speed of light, oh, how far we have not reached, but here the superlight)))

                  http://topwar.ru/?newsid=52267
                  Quote: Your friend
                  So with the implementation of your project is not very.
                  I hope the analogy is clear?)

                  So the situations are not similar. Your analogy does not fit here.
                14. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 21: 18 New
                  0
                  http://topwar.ru/?newsid=52267

                  Seriously? Is the warp engine referred to in the "project" invented? When will we see him in the metal?))) Read at least the comments of people under the article.
                  There are thousands of such “projects” in every science fiction book. Now, on a piece of paper, I drew a draft of an interstellar ship based on a string engine and the stump is clear, it will fly at a speed a million times faster than the speed of light.)))
                  So the situations are not similar. Your analogy does not fit here.

                  I regret that I have not conveyed to you my thought, let us remain at our own.)
                15. IS-80
                  IS-80 28 November 2015 21: 36 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Your friend
                  Seriously? Is the warp engine referred to in the "project" invented? When will we see him in the metal?))) Read at least the comments of people under the article.
                  There are thousands of such “projects” in every science fiction book. Now, on a piece of paper, I drew a draft of an interstellar ship based on a string engine and the stump is clear, it will fly at a speed a million times faster than the speed of light.)))

                  We are unlikely to see him. Those who will be after us will see. smile
                  Quote: Your friend
                  I regret that I have not conveyed to you my thought, let us remain at our own.)

                  I’m sorry if you didn’t understand that I played you a little.
                  smile hi
                16. Your friend
                  Your friend 28 November 2015 21: 40 New
                  0
                  We are unlikely to see him. Those who will be after us will see. smile

                  I think far, very far after us they will see.
                  I’m sorry if you didn’t understand that I played you a little.

                  Ueli.))))
  • Hello
    Hello 28 November 2015 23: 45 New
    0
    Quote: IS-80
    For many reasons. For example, because Israel is a very strong and economically and politically-military state in the Middle East. And, perhaps, the most adequate.

    In the context of strait control, this does not play any role. In my humble opinion, even if it happens that Turkey breaks up control over the straits, the countries for which they are vital will take over. For example, Russia, Ukraine, Bulgaria and Romania. To what honestly, Kazakhstan and Israel, here I do not understand, the hypothetical blocking of the straits will not affect Kazakhstan and Israel, but it will strongly affect the Black Sea countries.
    Best regards hi
  • SAXA.SHURA
    SAXA.SHURA 28 November 2015 13: 31 New
    0
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    r

    It is also not necessary to frighten us, how many times they fought with the Turks, so many times they cleaned their faces and there will NEVER be ANYTHING THERE differently.
  • Santjaga_Garka
    Santjaga_Garka 28 November 2015 14: 27 New
    +1
    "Turks are such Turks"

    Here it’s rather necessary to write "Erdogan such Erdogan"

    The political elite is not the whole nation, although it is its reflection ...
  • Mudroshvil
    Mudroshvil 28 November 2015 14: 36 New
    0
    Quote: Cetegg
    Erdogan is a political corpse! With p and n d about with and you will be led - you will get nipped by ties!)

    There are so many moseks on our elephant! ....
  • IAlex
    IAlex 28 November 2015 14: 52 New
    +1
    I would like to see how Erdogan will lay bricks throughout Turkey if it comes to a military conflict with Israel, the latter will not stand on ceremony in a snotty European style and just start to bend its line towards the Black Sea :)))
    And about Hitler - they know better because they fought with them on one side ...
    1. padded jacket
      padded jacket 28 November 2015 20: 18 New
      0
      Somehow, everything was a little distant from the initial topic, but the whole point of the article is that it was Israel that armed and equipped Erdogan, and it is Israel that currently supports, together with Turkey, the SA, Qatar and so on, the terrorists who are atrocious in Syria and Iraq and it is in Israel together with Erdogan lies the blame for the death of our guys.
      Here is a diagram of Israel and Turkey pumping oil from the wells of Syria and Iraq by captured terrorists. So the connection between Israel and Turkey with fanatics - killers is simply undeniable.

      And we must understand and soberly evaluate the fact that despite the propaganda that Israeli citizens spread here about their incredible whiteness and fluffy lol this country sponsors terrorism throughout the region and the ultimate goal of their “efforts” is to weaken Russia.
      1. Killj
        Killj 29 November 2015 01: 11 New
        0
        RF, how would the Turks build a nuclear reactor, now beat yourself with a heel in the chest and declare yourself a terrorist?
        padded jacket are you sorry for your patron pirdogan? say so.
  • Gavrohs
    Gavrohs 28 November 2015 15: 47 New
    +2
    when Erdogan fell off his horse, he hit his head! his gyrus turned, and we will see a lot more in his performance!
  • Cossack Ermak
    Cossack Ermak 28 November 2015 23: 13 New
    +1
    Quote: atalef
    Quote: Koshak
    . Half of these F-16s can be destroyed on the ground, like everything that floats right at the piers.
    Threat. And besides the Su-30 there is also a MiG-31. So let the "bottles" stretch with them

    In the Black Sea, Turkey’s military potential is many times higher.
    This is also beyond doubt.
    But the Air Force will not solve the problem.

    We have the means of turning the Turkish fleet into dust. Anti-shipable missile systems, flying torpedoes, submarine fleet and aviation. Yes, there are traditions of victories over the Turkish fleet.
  • Arzoo
    Arzoo 29 November 2015 00: 24 New
    0
    NATO will not fight for the alleged Erdogan. In the event of a conflict, Iran will permit the transfer of the Central Military District across the Caspian. Turkey will have to fight on land in its territory.