Military Review

Recep Erdogan's Fatal Error

166
Shooting down the Russian Su-24 bomber, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan made a fatal mistake that can cost very much not only for him, as the President of Turkey, but also for Turkey to the state per se.


It seems that Recep Erdogan seems very poorly aware of the whole history relations between Turkey and Russia: after all, for all the time between our countries there have been at least a hundred and fifty direct military clashes and countless smaller incidents, as a result of which, in most cases, Turkey turned out to be the losing party. In this case, it suffices to recall only those crushing defeats that Turkey suffered only as a result of only Russian-Turkish wars of the 18th and 19th centuries.

One gets the impression that the Turks, like the Germans or the French, cannot or simply do not want to draw the right conclusions from their history of relations with Russia: and, based on this, from time to time they take the next completely unsuccessful attempts to talk with our country solely from a position of strength. However, each time, stepping on the same rake, they get so strong a rebuff from Russia, which makes them sit "at their fifth point" for a sufficiently smooth and long enough time so as not to take rash actions against their powerful eastern neighbor.

What happened in the sky on the Syrian-Turkish border can have far-reaching consequences, and above all for Turkey itself. With a great deal of confidence, we can say that Turkey deliberately took this step, thereby trying to show how important its role in politics in the Middle East is.

However, it seems that the Turkish government and Recep Erdogan personally are constantly playing to raise rates and exacerbate policies towards Russia, unwillingly, have gone over the line of what is permitted, after which all the militant rhetoric is now moving into the plane of open military confrontation with Russia.

One gets the impression that President Erdogan imagines himself to be one of the most omnipotent rulers in the entire history of Turkey, who has the historical mission associated with the revival of the former power of the Ottoman Empire, or if you can say so, “neo-Ottoman empire” that can take a leading place in the emerging geopolitical situations in the modern world.

However, such a policy can be very costly for Erdogan, since an incident with a Russian military aircraft can lead to tectonic changes not only in the Middle East, but also in the whole of Western Europe.

Proceeding from the fact that after the Russian plane was shot down, Erdogan immediately turned to Brussels to the leadership of NATO, this suggests that he is trying to find protection from the North Atlantic alliance, based on the provisions of the 5 article of the NATO Charter, and thus trying to translate the conflict with Russia into the mainstream of confrontation through the Russia-NATO line.

However, Turkey can not count on all-round assistance from NATO, only because the NATO leadership is unlikely to go into direct confrontation with Russia for several reasons.

First, after the terrorist attacks in Paris, NATO refused to help France in the fight against the Islamic state, thereby not taking advantage of the NATO Charter article 5, thereby leaving France alone in addressing the issue of combating Islamic terrorism.

Secondly, France and especially Germany are concerned about the situation that is developing in the South-East of Ukraine, which at any time can lead to the outbreak of hostilities that threaten to lead to a war against Russia in the worst situation, and in this situation in Europe no one interested.

Thirdly, there will be countries in the North Atlantic Alliance, for example, such as Germany, which will not deny themselves the pleasure that Turkey would learn a good lesson, and thereby suffer a kind of punishment, for that stream of refugees, who for the most part poured on the territory of European countries.

Fourth, Turkey will try to find protection from the United States, but here too Erdogan can comprehend a very bitter disappointment. Despite all of its aggressive and belligerent rhetoric against Russia, the Barack Obama administration will not accept an armed confrontation with Russia that is really possible in the current situation, because Obama understands that, in speaking in support of Ankara, Washington will in fact declare war on Russia and in reality it will be signify the beginning of the Third World War, which can simply lead to disastrous consequences ...

In addition, both Barack Obama and the Pentagon leaders are well aware that talking to Russia now from the perspective of ultimatums, and even more so from a position of strength, nowadays simply means committing suicide, especially after what the Russian strategic capabilities demonstrated aviation and the navy, inflicting massive missile and bomb attacks on the positions of the militants of the Islamic state.

Fifth, Turkey has placed itself at the same level with the states that are openly sponsoring terrorism, namely Saudi Arabia and Qatar, which may soon be responsible for their policies aimed at supporting terrorists in the North Caucasus.

For Russia, at present, there is simply an excellent opportunity to radically change the geopolitical situation in its favor, not only in the Middle East, but also in Europe as a whole.

Now Erdogan has actually driven himself into a hopeless situation, because, at best, the Turkish economy will be dealt a powerful blow, in the form of stopping revenues from the tourism business, which each year brought at least 4,5 billion dollars by the most conservative estimates, the export of Turkish agricultural products and no less sensitive blow in the construction industry.

In the worst case, if Turkey takes the path of military escalation against Russia, then the consequences will be disastrous for it, especially if Erdogan closes the Black Sea straits, for Russian ships that supply the grouping of Russian troops in Syria by imposing martial law in the country.

Then it is clear that Turkey will be on the one hand under the possible blow of the Russian air forces located on the territory of Syria, and on the other hand under the blow of the troops of the Southern Military District and the ships of the Black Sea fleet and the Caspian naval flotilla.

However, in the current situation, Russia and Vladimir Putin personally, have a wonderful historical chance not only to radically change the state of affairs throughout the Middle East and in the basins of the Black and Mediterranean Seas, but finally to make the dreams of Catherine the Great and subsequent Russian reality come true. emperors, to establish Russia's control over the Black Sea straits ...
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  1. avvg
    avvg 25 November 2015 07: 52 New
    12
    The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous, and for Erdogan it will have disastrous consequences.
    1. cniza
      cniza 25 November 2015 07: 56 New
      66
      Quote: avvg
      The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous.



      Just do not rush, but calculate and do everything so that it would no longer be disastrous.
      1. a52333
        a52333 25 November 2015 08: 03 New
        120
        Shield, Constantinople, straits!
        let's be realistic. Take this note and continue to bomb the tankers.
        According to the great, if we consider that there is a reaction of Erdogan (Su-24), then we are on the right track.
        2) Visa regime with Turkey. Tough, especially since this is a matter of our security. a visa-free regime cannot be opened for a country through whose territory terrorists and other crazy-minded barbarians are hanging out
        3) We must arm the Kurds. And Syrian and Iraqi. And they will create heartburn to Erdogan!
        1. Tatyana
          Tatyana 25 November 2015 08: 15 New
          64
          Erdogan in Syria has his own Turkish raider business in the robbery of Syrian oil with the help of the ISIS gangs that he personally controls. Due to the loss of this own business, he became inadequate.
          Erdogan is a high-ranking Turkish war criminal in the ranks of NATO!
          Erdogan on trial!
          1. severniy
            severniy 25 November 2015 08: 40 New
            20
            Quote: Tatiana
            Erdogan in Syria has his own Turkish raider business in the robbery of Syrian oil with the help of the ISIS gangs that he personally controls. Due to the loss of this own business, he became inadequate.
            Erdogan is a high-ranking Turkish war criminal in the ranks of NATO!
            Erdogan on trial!

            And they say the girls are not logical. + good
            1. sssla
              sssla 25 November 2015 09: 10 New
              +1
              Quote: severniy
              And they say the girls are not logical.

              There is no smoke without fire! They say there is such a thing !!
            2. severniy
              severniy 25 November 2015 09: 59 New
              0
              And why are comments on this article deleted, moreover, without explanation ?!
              The flock corrected, yeah, but this-
              flat opportunity open
              ....
          2. lukke
            lukke 25 November 2015 09: 50 New
            +7
            NATO verbally supports Erdogan in every way (they have their own game and Erdogan is a bargaining chip, but a very necessary figure now). So far, we have a difficult relationship with Turkey and the presence of mutual painful places. First of all, we will have to act with surgical accuracy, mobilizing all our shadow and non-shadow levers. For example, having overdone, Turkey with joy (including for NATO) can close the Bosphorus to us and here we have a problem with supplying the group in Syria, etc. Therefore, I now do not envy the GDP and the Government - on the one hand, it is necessary to respond harshly, on the other hand, to observe interests and fulfill other obligations. If GDP decides this knot - he really is a world politician!) I don’t really like his domestic policy)))
            И название статьи не совсем отражает ход событий, попахивает преждевременными выводами и ура-рекламациями, - "ошибка" для кого? лично сам надутый Эрдоган по-моему просто прется от сего действа. У него второй последний срок, бабки есть, а на то как турки потом жить будут - ему до ...Он не отец нации
            1. vostok68
              vostok68 25 November 2015 13: 08 New
              +6
              Даже вопроса такого нет "закрыть нам пролив", вопрос у них один, когда мы им пролив закроем! Они знают, что это будет, но не знают когда, поэтому бесятся! И провокации от бессилия!
            2. igorka357
              igorka357 26 November 2015 09: 22 New
              0
              Until Turkey declares war on the Russian Federation, it does not have the right to block the strait !!! Purely for reference to you !!! When passing in peacetime, we are only obliged to notify them .. we can walk along it as much as we like at any time !!!
          3. The comment was deleted.
          4. Geisenberg
            Geisenberg 25 November 2015 10: 39 New
            +2
            Quote: Tatiana
            Erdogan in Syria has his own Turkish raider business in the robbery of Syrian oil with the help of the ISIS gangs that he personally controls. Due to the loss of this own business, he became inadequate.
            Erdogan is a high-ranking Turkish war criminal in the ranks of NATO!
            Erdogan on trial!


            One must add the word ended at the end of the first sentence. Ended up his business, now guaranteed. There was no need to shoot down the plane.
            1. Tatyana
              Tatyana 25 November 2015 10: 55 New
              +3
              Geisenberg (3)
              One must add the word ended at the end of the first sentence. Ended up his business, now guaranteed. There was no need to shoot down the plane.

              Эрдоган и без сбитых российских самолётов это про свой рейдер-бизнес уже ВСЁ понял - заистериковал и в бешенстве засуетился. И при этом поставил себя выше интересов национальной безопасности Турции и репутации самого военного блока НАТО - со своей "самодеятельностью" персонального правления в Турции.
              Я не удивлюсь, если через некоторое время Эрдогану «придётся» застрелиться или что-то в этом роде с ним "случайно" произойдёт .
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. hydrox
          hydrox 25 November 2015 08: 25 New
          38
          Quote: a52333
          let's be realistic.


          We will :: all five provisions of the article are already promptly confirmed and completely not in favor of the Sultan ::
          1. France today is our ally, and without us it cannot carry out a retaliation operation and the French MP has already called for punishment of Turkey.
          2. Now the sultan will receive strong lyuli from France and Germany for the fact that he was given 3 billion oyro not at all so that he would bully the bear.
          3. In the bowels of NATO there are already sensible heads who have already stated that Stoltenberg did not express the common opinion of NATO member countries, but his own opinion and that this could cost Stoltenberg the position of Secretary General of the Alliance.
          4. The states have unsubscribed that the Sultan has the right to defend the air production of his country, but NATO will not help him in this.
          5. By this behavior, the Sultan identified himself as the leader of rogue countries (Qatar and KSA), whose flogging will soon take place on a global scale.
          A visa mode must be entered (and a very tough mode!).
          And so everything is heading towards the fact that the Sultan himself digs a hole for himself with such behavior, even if the Turkish General Staff disowned the lens on the position of the planes, saying that the Prime Minister did the lens - check out the strength of the Erdogan regime!
          And from Russia the requirement of immediate closure of the border and the inadmissibility of approaching the border of an aircraft of any nationality at a distance closer than 40 km (given the possibility of striped provocation using C130J) - this must be done!
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. Awaz
              Awaz 25 November 2015 09: 23 New
              -2
              Yes, I completely agree, the article itself is useless. Useless chatter. In reality, if some tough measures are taken all the way to the highest, then those who are supposed to do so should be quietly and without fuss. In general, something to be done in relation to Turkey must first be thoroughly comprehended and calculated, just do not have to make stupid and frankly weak statements and body movements for the sake of consumers.
              And so - all this is sad and again we see the Russian maybe, which led to such deplorable results.
              Well and most importantly - the Syrian Air Force (namely the Syrian) should really begin to control the airspace with Turkey and shoot down everything that flies from there
              1. Sergey Polt
                Sergey Polt 25 November 2015 10: 51 New
                +1
                Bydlostrateg, you are not on the Censor, damn it ...
          2. a52333
            a52333 25 November 2015 08: 39 New
            23
            Quote: hydrox
            The prime minister did the lens - check out the strength of the Erdogan regime!

            This creature contrived to spoil EVERYTHING.
            1. Europe is unlikely to forget the heartburn that he created for Europe with refugees
            2. Obama hates him (however, this is mutual between them)
            3. Syria - no comment
            4. Israel (Отношения между Турцией и Израилем резко обострились после совершенного 31 мая нападения израильских военных на международный морской конвой "Флотилия свободы", который следовал с гуманитарным грузом в Газу.))
            5. Iran and Iraq are unlikely to forget the role of edrogan and support for igil.
            6. Kurds straight without comment
            7. we
            1. Al_oriso
              Al_oriso 25 November 2015 09: 18 New
              +1
              There are two weights on the scales: Turkey and Russia.
              Turkey shit on everyone and Russia is a thorn in everyone.
              It is not yet clear how it will turn.
              NATO support for Turkey is quite realistic.
              Will NATO have the courage?
              1. Tatyana
                Tatyana 25 November 2015 10: 29 New
                +3
                Al_oriso
                There are two weights on the scales: Turkey and Russia.
                Turkey shit on everyone and Russia is a thorn in everyone.
                It is not yet clear how it will turn.
                NATO support for Turkey is quite realistic.
                Will NATO have the courage?

                For pragmatic reasons, NATO will be forced to surrender Erdogan in order to maintain its “face” in the eyes of the world community, since Erdogan has left NATO from under their subordination and control - arbitrarily. He became inadequate from his own greed and greed due to the loss of his own, personal oil raider business in Syria. For the reputations of international organizations are not lying on the floor - the reputations of organizations need to be protected.
                Therefore, Erdogan will be replaced in Turkey. The only question is - WHO, HOW and WHEN?
              2. The comment was deleted.
            2. dali
              dali 25 November 2015 09: 38 New
              +1
              Right except:
              Quote: a52333
              Obama hates him (however, this is mutual between them)
              , потому как это всё наиграно - обамка энтого турка только на публику "не любит" ... а так у них большой взаимный интерес ...
            3. The comment was deleted.
            4. Ustian
              Ustian 25 November 2015 12: 13 New
              +2
              8.Greeks.
              9.Armenians.
          3. PQ-18
            PQ-18 25 November 2015 08: 53 New
            -6
            And from Russia the requirement of immediate closure of the border and the inadmissibility of approaching the border of an aircraft of any nationality at a distance closer than 40 km (given the possibility of striped provocation using C130J) - this must be done!

            Сейчас только на словах "закрыть сирийско-турецкую границу\небо" можно...
            Until there are at least local zones of ground control along the border -
            border airspace CLOSE WILL NOT succeed!
          4. Stirbjorn
            Stirbjorn 25 November 2015 09: 29 New
            +2
            Quote: hydrox
            1. France today is our ally, and without us it cannot carry out a retaliation operation and the French MP has already called for punishment of Turkey.
            Complete nonsense, until recently they completely threw us with the Mistrals. All she can, planes take off from an aircraft carrier. The US is bombing itself and nothing ...
            Quote: hydrox
            2. Now the sultan will receive strong lyuli from France and Germany for the fact that he was given 3 billion oyro not at all so that he would bully the bear.

            Dream more ... The rest is the same. So far, none of the heads of state of NATO has condemned Erdogan, and the opinion of individuals does not solve anything. The Turks quite consciously shot down our Dryer and what will happen next no one knows.
        4. SANAY
          SANAY 25 November 2015 08: 44 New
          +2
          Вы правы. Нюансов много. Ни каких "безвизовых"!
        5. PQ-18
          PQ-18 25 November 2015 08: 46 New
          +4
          It is necessary to arm the Kurds. And Syrian and Iraqi. And they will create heartburn to Erdogan!

          "Турецкий гамбит" можно расписать,"как по-нотам"!
          If you DO NOT HURRY with an answer ..
        6. bornikrub
          bornikrub 25 November 2015 08: 55 New
          +9
          Erdogan claims to be the defender of the faithful, not only in the Middle East, but also in Russia.
          Arm the Kurds.
          "Однозначно".
        7. NEXUS
          NEXUS 25 November 2015 10: 34 New
          +5
          Quote: a52333
          Shield, Constantinople, straits!
          let's be realistic. Take this note and continue to bomb the tankers.
          According to the great, if we consider that there is a reaction of Erdogan (Su-24), then we are on the right track.
          2) Visa regime with Turkey. Tough, especially since this is a matter of our security. a visa-free regime cannot be opened for a country through whose territory terrorists and other crazy-minded barbarians are hanging out
          3) We must arm the Kurds. And Syrian and Iraqi. And they will create heartburn to Erdogan!

          It’s important not to rush. As long as our tourists and the deep mission are there, our hands are tied. As long as our citizens are taken out of Turkey, it is necessary to strengthen the fighter component of the airborne forces in Syria. I think the Black Sea Fleet has been put on alert, as well as the Crimean group. Again the Mediterranean squadron is also visible. When tourists are evacuated, I won’t be surprised at the appearance of the S-400 in Syria closer to the borders of Turkey, as well as the increase in the number of different electronic warfare systems of the Krasukha-4 type.
          As for the Kurds, the question is still hanging in the air as a result of what I said above. But I suppose that soon the Kurds will have our MANPADS and large-caliber systems.
          All this will be accompanied by economic and political steps.
        8. Geisenberg
          Geisenberg 25 November 2015 10: 37 New
          +4
          Quote: a52333
          Shield, Constantinople, straits!
          let's be realistic. Take this note and continue to bomb the tankers.
          According to the great, if we consider that there is a reaction of Erdogan (Su-24), then we are on the right track.
          2) Visa regime with Turkey. Tough, especially since this is a matter of our security. a visa-free regime cannot be opened for a country through whose territory terrorists and other crazy-minded barbarians are hanging out
          3) We must arm the Kurds. And Syrian and Iraqi. And they will create heartburn to Erdogan!


          Exactly. Arm the Kurds !!! And all of them are Syrian and Turkish and Iraqi. And by all possible means. Then there will be a stub from Turkey. And nothing will have to be done at all ...
        9. maxim1987
          maxim1987 25 November 2015 11: 05 New
          +3
          Quote: a52333
          let's be realistic. Take this note and continue to bomb oil tankers. According to the great, if you consider that there is a reaction of Erdogan (Su-24), then we are on the right track. 2) Visa regime with Turkey. Tough, especially since this is a matter of our security. a visa-free regime cannot be opened for the country through whose territory terrorists and other insane barbarians are hanging around3) We must arm the Kurds. And Syrian and Iraqi. And they will create heartburn to Erdogan!


          in my opinion there is one more point: the Turkish army that can carry out a coup (they say that you steal under amers, but the whole economy of the country will suffer) and goodbye Erdogan
        10. Maxom75
          Maxom75 25 November 2015 11: 33 New
          +3
          I wrote about these measures six months ago, only they minus me and told me about Erdogan’s friend. And he was never our friend, he is a greedy coward! Shit in a bowl and ran to ask for protection from NATO. You have to hit the arteries of Turkey, the gas pipelines and oil pipelines running through its territory indirectly through the Kurds. The Turkish Kurds will soon be able to supply the Syrian Kurds with anti-tank systems, MANPADS, artillery and all this, and the east of Turkey will already be flaming up there and Erdogan will creep on the armchair not childishly. To raise a question in the UN about creating a criminal court on the fact of the Armenian genocide in the Ottoman Empire and paying them compensation - a positive decision on this issue could cost Turkey up to $ 1.5 trillion, which will finally ruin the country.
          1. PQ-18
            PQ-18 25 November 2015 15: 32 New
            0
            To raise a question in the UN about creating a criminal court on the fact of the Armenian genocide in the Ottoman Empire and paying them compensation - a positive decision on this issue can cost Turkey up to $ 1.5 trillion, which will finally ruin the country.

            i to you + set, but ...
            "ВСЕГО-ЛИШЬ" 1,5 trillion"на ВСЕХ армян" ?...
            from US and EU ally?!?
            IT IS EXPRESSED TO ARMENIANS ... WILL BE LITTLE! ! ! crying
            fellow
            PS щаз по "+"определю количество армян, а по "-".... wink "их оппонентов" !
        11. Maxom75
          Maxom75 25 November 2015 11: 33 New
          +2
          I wrote about these measures six months ago, only they minus me and told me about Erdogan’s friend. And he was never our friend, he is a greedy coward! Shit in a bowl and ran to ask for protection from NATO. You have to hit the arteries of Turkey, the gas pipelines and oil pipelines running through its territory indirectly through the Kurds. The Turkish Kurds will soon be able to supply the Syrian Kurds with anti-tank systems, MANPADS, artillery and all this, and the east of Turkey will already be flaming up there and Erdogan will creep on the armchair not childishly. To raise a question in the UN about creating a criminal court on the fact of the Armenian genocide in the Ottoman Empire and paying them compensation - a positive decision on this issue could cost Turkey up to $ 1.5 trillion, which will finally ruin the country.
        12. marna
          marna 25 November 2015 13: 35 New
          +2
          a52333I would add one more item to yours:
          - Officially recognize the Armenian Genocide in 1915-1923.
          And there are so many of them around the world.
        13. meriem1
          meriem1 25 November 2015 14: 21 New
          +2
          Quote: a52333
          Shield, Constantinople, straits!
          let's be realistic. Take this note and continue to bomb the tankers.
          According to the great, if we consider that there is a reaction of Erdogan (Su-24), then we are on the right track.
          2) Visa regime with Turkey. Tough, especially since this is a matter of our security. a visa-free regime cannot be opened for a country through whose territory terrorists and other crazy-minded barbarians are hanging out
          3) We must arm the Kurds. And Syrian and Iraqi. And they will create heartburn to Erdogan!


          Kurds of Syrian, Iraqi and TURKISH !!!! Kakkov hi, that’s the answer!
          1. a52333
            a52333 25 November 2015 15: 24 New
            0
            Quote: meriem1
            Kurds of Syrian, Iraqi and TURKISH !!!!


            Iraqi, they themselves will bring to the territory of Turkey
      2. Vladimir71
        Vladimir71 25 November 2015 08: 24 New
        +7
        That's it, you still need a grief of vacationers to start returning home)))
      3. paxil
        paxil 25 November 2015 08: 32 New
        +3
        Quote: cniza
        Just do not rush, but calculate and do everything so that it would no longer be disastrous.

        No one will be in a hurry, our uncle Vova, a strategist, as we have already seen, thinks several steps ahead. So we will wait, observe, draw conclusions, take actions with far-reaching consequences.
        1. BARKHAN
          BARKHAN 25 November 2015 10: 05 New
          +3
          Очень на это надеюсь.Что он спокойно сойдёт с горы и "окучит" всё стадо.Вчера мне понравилась его фраза "Пособники террористов".А это уже серьёзное обвинение.Такими словами не бросаются в отношении государств.
      4. passerby1
        passerby1 25 November 2015 09: 02 New
        -10
        Какие последствия? НАТО сказало, что Турция была в своем праве, мы утерлись и заявили о "прекращении сотрудничества по военной линии". Так что все Эрдогану с рук сошло.
        1. tolancop
          tolancop 25 November 2015 10: 39 New
          +1
          Your suggestions? Sorry for the day since the destruction of our aircraft. What should we do? Bomb Ankara? And you wrote off 10 thousand of our citizens in Turkey in losses? Until they are pulled out, hands are completely tied ...
          1. passerby1
            passerby1 27 November 2015 04: 32 New
            0
            Прошло уже больше суток, российских граждан из Турции никто эвакуировать не спешит. Лавров сказал, что военного ответа не будет. Видимо всех устраивает, что у нас "руки связаны".
      5. subbtin.725
        subbtin.725 25 November 2015 09: 12 New
        +2
        Quote: cniza
        Just do not rush,

        And when was the GDP in a hurry?
      6. volot-voin
        volot-voin 25 November 2015 09: 24 New
        +5
        Quote: cniza
        Just do not rush, but calculate and do everything so that it would no longer be disastrous.

        Our president is a strong and treacherous political player, as recent events have shown, and I hope he has already calculated everything.
        The policy of Nicholas II, who overwhelmed a great state, cost us dearly. If there was a strategic mind at the head of the state at the beginning of the 20th century, no Turkey would have existed, there would have been no civil war, no peasantization, there would have been no 2nd world war with Germany, and there would have been at least 500 Russians million
        1. Alexey Lesogor
          Alexey Lesogor 25 November 2015 09: 36 New
          0
          History does not tolerate the subjunctive mood.
          1. dali
            dali 25 November 2015 09: 42 New
            +1
            Quote: Alexey Lesogor
            History does not tolerate the subjunctive mood.
            Do you need to analyze the story ?! belay
            In fact, the analysis section, which discusses the alternative development of history, has always been, is and will be !!!
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. Senior manager
          Senior manager 25 November 2015 09: 52 New
          +1
          By_ in history does not roll, but I have very high hopes for GDP, it will be fulfilled worthy of the sultanas-dummy. From me, plus.
      7. sherp2015
        sherp2015 25 November 2015 10: 02 New
        +1
        Quote: cniza
        cniza Today, 07:56 PM ↑ New
        Quote: avvg
        The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous.


        Just do not rush, but calculate and do everything so that it would no longer be disastrous.


        Erdogan made a specific jamb that the Yankees had been pushing him for a long time.
        Первое желание конечно у большинства запустить в сторону Турции какую-нибудь "кузькину мать" чтоб окончательно решить турецкий вопрос.
        But really, in addition to Erdogan, there are still people in Turkey ...
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. The comment was deleted.
      1. nimboris
        nimboris 25 November 2015 08: 11 New
        +4
        then not Pidorgan, but Perdogan am
    4. 79807420129
      79807420129 25 November 2015 07: 59 New
      20
      Erdogan puffs out his cheeks belligerently, but star-ears are sticking out of this provocation, Erdogan was used as a condom, not without reason he rushed to call NATO first, and not to apologize to us, now the word is ours. What will we see.
      1. bubalik
        bubalik 25 November 2015 08: 06 New
        -24
        This is all boltology, any escalation of the conflict in the Middle East, as a rule, leads to an increase in oil prices. No need to dig deep why our VKS in Syria, ,,

        money and more time money.

        ,,, pockets will not fill in any way ,,,

        The guys are truly sorry.
        1. dali
          dali 25 November 2015 09: 49 New
          +2
          Quote: bubalik
          This is all boltology, any escalation of the conflict in the Middle East, as a rule, leads to an increase in oil prices. No need to dig deeply, why our VKS in Syria, ,, money and more, just money. ,,, pockets will not fill in any way ,,,
          It seems like a smart man, but he wrote such crap at the beginning of the post ... it’s clear that money has a place to be the reason ... but the Turks are in the wrong weight category to run into this yourself ...
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. bubalik
            bubalik 25 November 2015 10: 01 New
            0
            Dali (7) RU  Today, 09: 49 ↑

            ,,, maybe you're right, but money does not have a place to beThey are always and in everything,
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. cniza
        cniza 25 November 2015 08: 08 New
        +8
        He is inadequate, this is from the words of his entourage, and from the deeds it is clear that let the punishment tremble and suffer.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Tra-ta-ta
        Tra-ta-ta 25 November 2015 08: 27 New
        16
        Now the word is ours. How it will be seen.
        It is important to understand that Turkish society and the Turkish state, because of their cultural specifics, are not a HARD response, they simply will not accept it and consider it an invitation to further acts of aggression against Russia ...
        http://delyagin.ru
      5. uralex
        uralex 25 November 2015 08: 34 New
        +2
        NATO refused France assistance in fighting Islamic State

        not without reason he rushed to call NATO first

        The boundaries of the side on which NATO is located are being more clearly drawn ...
      6. jovanni
        jovanni 25 November 2015 08: 56 New
        +3
        Actually about this situation we are inflating our cheeks for now. And the Turk killed our guys, M.raz ...
      7. gladcu2
        gladcu2 25 November 2015 22: 55 New
        0
        7987

        Do not forget two things.

        Capitalism still needs a third world. The contradictions of capitalism are not resolved.

        And the second one. The Turks have a strait. By which they hold the Black Sea Fleet.

        Therefore, the answer will not be military in nature.
    5. The comment was deleted.
    6. Trailer
      Trailer 25 November 2015 08: 11 New
      +8
      For me, the military consequences for Turkey will be minimal. Why:
      1. NATO member
      2. Relatively strong army and navy in the region
      3. The straits are easily blocked, and as a result, the blockade of the Black Sea Fleet and the lack of reinforcements in Syria

      But potentially they could:
      1. Minimize tourist flow
      2. Collapse nuclear power plant built for Rosatom’s money
      3. Support the Kurdish militia
      1. a52333
        a52333 25 November 2015 08: 14 New
        14
        Quote: Karavan
        But potentially

        4. Continue to bomb the tankers.
      2. andj61
        andj61 25 November 2015 08: 50 New
        +5
        Quote: Karavan
        But potentially they could:
        1. Minimize tourist flow
        2. Collapse nuclear power plant built for Rosatom’s money
        3. Support the Kurdish militia


        According to claim 1 - we will only increase revenues to the budget of our country - a clear plus!
        Clause 2 - Rosatom will save 20 billion rubles in the coming year by simply not investing them in the Turkish economy. It is better to build a modern nuclear power plant in Crimea, it seems that there was a construction project near Kerch, it will be possible to intensively develop the region, and even there will be energy to produce fresh water in the right amount.
        p.3 - you need to do this a long time ago! And then everyone tried to build equal relations with the Islamist Erdogan - the result is obvious !. And the delivery to the Kurds of some air defense systems - better with a refinement in the form of the impossibility of launching missiles on our aircraft - would be a good plop and an adequate response to the newly arrived Ottomans.
        But in the first group of your advantages - there are certain questions! The fact that Turkey is a member of NATO does not mean anything! NATO refused to support France because of the terrorist attack, it actually refuses Turkey, recognizing its right to self-defense, but transferring the whole thing exclusively to the relations between Turkey and Russia. One should not forget that Greece and Bulgaria are also members of NATO, and In this case, Turkish aviation violates their borders every year: in 2014, there were up to 3000 such incidents with Greece, and up to two dozen with Bulgaria. Do you think Greece and Bulgaria in such circumstances will support Turkey? Given that the plane did not violate the borders of Turkey?
        По поводу армии - армия действительно пока ещё самая сильная в регионе. Но при Эрдогане она существенно ослабла: в отставку были отправлены или даже осуждены масса влиятельных военных, которые выражали несогласие с исламистским курсом Эрдогана. По конституции Турции армия - это гарант светского характера турецкого государства. И армия, несмотря на репрессии, а может и "благодаря" им, весьма негативно относится к политическому курсу Эрдогана.
        Перекрыт проливы - такая опасность, конечно существует. Но такое действие со стороны Турции без объявления войны - это грубейшее нарушение конвенции Монтрё. В ответ Россия просто напросто может заблокировать проливы - и это ударит и по Турции тоже. Не говоря уже о том, что это прекрасный повод для "принуждению к миру".
        And with the help of the Kurds it is necessary to decide immediately!
        1. sssla
          sssla 25 November 2015 09: 14 New
          -2
          Quote: andj61
          NATO refused France support due to terrorist attack

          And what kind of fat will they get from this ??? Who to bomb ??? Homeless people from all over the world ????? ISIS is a mad dog that the Western Union uses against us, including !!! Your rolls began to relax so early that inadvertently and opportunity will happen !!!
        2. godun
          godun 25 November 2015 10: 43 New
          +1
          NATO supported Turkey, but will not really harness it, because it’s already clear that this is a planned provocation, our plane was waiting ... And point 1 is already starting to be realized, judging by the statement of the Foreign Minister, but there is no need to rush about the rest, we need well-designed and soberly weighted decisions, minimizing Russia's losses from our actions. In my opinion, the most correct answer now is to strengthen the work of our aviation for the goals that Erdogan supports.
      3. corn
        corn 25 November 2015 09: 05 New
        +6
        Quote: Karavan
        But potentially they could:

        To do what the Israelites do. Eliminate the pilots who shot down our plane. Eliminate the people who gave or transmitted commands for the destruction of the aircraft. To do this, you do not need to support the Kurds, you just need to find those who will do it for money. And do not tell that we Russians did it. Just in the media, after the liquidation, write that these nonhumans participated in the destruction of the aircraft, and we condemn such killings. To live with wolves - howl like a wolf.
    7. Metallurgist
      Metallurgist 25 November 2015 08: 15 New
      15
      So, what do we have?
      There is no conclusion from the article about WHAT and HOW the Russian Federation will respond to a downed plane.
      You can assume a lot: from a point nuclear strike to ... think for yourself.
      The author described well that NATO would not defend Turkey, it was immediately clear, and no matter what assurances Erdogan received, he would be left face to face with Russia in case of war.
      Let’s better think about what the Russian Federation really will answer.
      I think the most likely scenario is:
      1. EW cuts all the electronics on the border with Turkey. There is no connection, the satellites are silent and so on.
      2. All Turkish trade with ISIS for oil is covered by a copper basin, for ...
      3. On the MO line, bring to the attention of Turkey and NATO that ANYONE, whether it be an airplane, a ship, a fisherman’s boat, flying into our airspace or swimming in our waters, is shot down or sunk.
      4. Экономические санкции: как-то применив "административный" ресурс прикрыть или максимально усложнить работу турецких компаний на территории РФ, обнуление импорта и максимальные цены по экспорту.
      5. Armed Kurds, provide them with unspoken support.

      Это, конечно, все хорошо... но сейчас раздадутся крики либероидов "Россия утерлась", "Путина в отставку, мы хотим отдыхать в Турции", "Да зачем нам какой-то Асад" и так далее. Вот что напрягает. Именно эти крики доморощенных "правозащеканов". Поскольку Путин достаточно сильная личность, то за международный имидж я спокоен, а вот то, что внутри страны у нас одни дмитрииатаноличи - пугает.

      So a downed plane is a litmus test for the world and for the Russian Federation.

      Something like that.
    8. diver1977
      diver1977 25 November 2015 08: 23 New
      +6
      And if you look really? What are the implications? Well, the Russians will not go to Turkey to rest - they will be replaced by Europeans. Russians from tourist flow only 10%. And not everyone will refuse to go there, fly through third countries, I have no doubt. What joint projects are there? Hardly ever. The southern stream - with a pitchfork in the water, Erdogan wagged for a long time now and then or not.
      From a military point of view, the Turkish army cannot be underestimated. Neither by quantity nor by quality is it weak, as is No. 2 in NATO. The straits control completely, lock the fleet in one day.
      In short, apart from breaking up diplomatic relations at all levels and across all departments, and ending economic cooperation, there will be nothing. There are no crazy people ready to use nuclear weapons. Maximum - close the sky of Syria for all but those agreed with Damascus. Maybe they will bring down a couple of Turkish sides, which fly into Syria from time to time.
      And, and Kurds through third countries will support weapons.
      Sadly, this is an objective reality. Overslept special services preparing this provocation. Allowed unaccompanied flights 1 km from the border (or maybe with short-term approaches to adjacent territories) - who will tolerate this? Roughly speaking - framed.

      I feel sorry for the pilot. He fulfilled his duty to the end. Everlasting memory.
      1. Altona
        Altona 25 November 2015 08: 50 New
        +1
        Quote: diver1977
        And if you look really? What are the implications?

        --------------------
        Сбить пару турецких бортов, стереть в пыль "мирные туркоманские деревни", закрыть границу с Турцией где возможно. Это минимум.
        1. diver1977
          diver1977 25 November 2015 09: 26 New
          0
          Read carefully. I wrote that.
      2. bornikrub
        bornikrub 25 November 2015 09: 11 New
        +1
        "И не все откажутся туда ехать."
        Holidays in Turkey - Cainova Seal.
        Useful.
        1. diver1977
          diver1977 25 November 2015 09: 27 New
          +1
          Quote: bornikrub
          Holidays in Turkey - Cainova Seal.
          Useful.

          Bet you’ll go to rest anyway? They’ll fly through third countries, I give a tooth. Smaller, of course, but in order to declare a boycott of the whole country, this will not work.
          1. aleks 62 next
            aleks 62 next 25 November 2015 10: 03 New
            0
            .... Bet you still go to rest? ...

            .... If they introduce criminal liability, they will think ten times before traveling .... The country spends a lot of money on evacuation (both from Egypt), and they ... they’re flying their steam ....
      3. sssla
        sssla 25 November 2015 09: 20 New
        0
        Quote: diver1977
        will be replaced by Europeans

        What will the plan be lowered from Brussels to the EU countries ???
        Quote: diver1977
        Roughly speaking - framed.


        Everyone knew that the mattress side with their sixes was not clean at hand, but no one expected such and such VILLAGE after signing the memorandum !!
        1. diver1977
          diver1977 25 November 2015 09: 32 New
          0
          Experience shows that one cannot be naive in world politics. Meanness is a common thing for Anglo-Saxons and their hangers-on.
          And about the launching of the plan and substitution - everything is simple, the advertising companies in those countries that have not previously been involved will increase. There are tricky moves in the travel industry, this is a huge industry with its own rules. Discounts will give some Scandinavians, they will go. Then they get used to it and prices can be raised. They did it to us! This year, prices were already higher than usual.
          1. Ivo
            Ivo 25 November 2015 10: 48 New
            +1
            ПОлагаю, ИГИЛ тоже будет участвовать в етой рекламной кампании, как сделал етого в Париже:) Думаете тупых достаточно, чтоб' пойти на отдых в Ергоганистан? Ну и если есть, думаю в несколько раз меньше будет, чем прошлого лета.
            And if there is something ... at your own expense. Darwin Prize.
          2. Ivo
            Ivo 25 November 2015 11: 00 New
            0
            ПОлагаю, ИГИЛ тоже будет участвовать в етой рекламной кампании, как сделал етого в Париже:) Думаете тупых достаточно, чтоб' пойти на отдых в Ергоганистан? Ну и если есть, думаю в несколько раз меньше будет, чем прошлого лета.
            And if there is something ... at your own expense. Darwin Prize.
      4. aleks 62 next
        aleks 62 next 25 November 2015 10: 01 New
        +1
        ..... And not everyone will refuse to go there, fly through third countries, I have no doubt. ....


        ..... Good riddance !!!! ..... Only upon arrival back there will be a Turkish stamp in the passport ..... But to punish for it .... And where is the figure 10% ???? .... As far as the sources were concerned, almost half of the tourist flow is Russians .... hi
    9. Tatar 174
      Tatar 174 25 November 2015 08: 30 New
      +7
      Quote: avvg
      The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous, and for Erdogan it will have disastrous consequences.

      I am sure that yesterday Erdogan was deleted from all lists except the black list, where he is now among the first. After what happened, sane politicians no longer communicate with such a person. The Turks, who still know how to think sensibly, must begin the search for another leader, otherwise the consequences for everyone in this country will become irreversible. Think Turks and faster, you can start to lay straw.
      To the author, Denis Terekhov, we are not an eastern neighbor of Turkey, but a northern one. And then some sense of stereotyping arises in this moment:
      ... so as not to take rash actions against his mighty eastern neighbor
      A trifle, of course, but still.
    10. SANAY
      SANAY 25 November 2015 08: 39 New
      +2
      Извините, но писать надобно "будут плачевными" и "будут иметь". Еще раз дико извиняюсь. А по смыслу если, то ваши лозунги мне немного не понятны. Обоснуйте, пожалуйста, а пока минус. Нам "шапкозакидательство" не нужно. Нужна тонкая, взвешенная, но жесткая политика. А месть - блюдо холодное и его надобно вкушать долго и по кусочкам. В Турцию я теперь не поеду никогда. Не хочу.
    11. jovanni
      jovanni 25 November 2015 08: 50 New
      +1
      Пока что определение от нашего МО поступка турков как "недружественный акт" говорит о том, что ничего страшного Эрдогана не ожидает...
    12. varov14
      varov14 25 November 2015 09: 22 New
      0
      They rolled out a sponge, control over the straits, even the Union did not encroach. Restore the industry, otherwise the pipe will burst due to strain. Everything is done sequentially, and not in a swoop.
      1. corn
        corn 25 November 2015 09: 59 New
        0
        Quote: varov14
        control of the straits, even the Union did not encroach.

        You are wrong, attempted what caused Turkey to join NATO.
    13. Alexey-74
      Alexey-74 25 November 2015 09: 26 New
      0
      Прежде всего официальные извинения! Если нет найти повод и нанести удар крылатыми ракетами по приграничной с Сирией территории, предварительно потушив всю систему РЭБами, "уронить"несколько F-16 и т.д.
    14. Vend
      Vend 25 November 2015 09: 56 New
      0
      Quote: avvg
      The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous, and for Erdogan it will have disastrous consequences.

      May be so. However, I recall that in history, the West has repeatedly used Turkey (the Ottoman Empire) against Russia. It is very likely that history is repeating itself. Not any fantasy.
    15. max702
      max702 25 November 2015 10: 52 New
      +1
      All this warlike rhetoric is good, but you have to look at the realities .. Suppose this is not the last incident, and soon others will follow, and something will have to be done. Economic butting is not effective. because the USA will spit on Turkey there perfectly chaos, we are no less in losses in this bodyag. and all this will be delayed for a long time, which again is looking at the hand from behind a puddle. Let’s say that the military response doesn’t cause (irreparable our armed forces to conduct such an operation quickly) that irreparable damage that will force Turkey to reconsider its position radically. and what remains? The first option is by itself to strengthen the grouping in Syria ten times that way in case of something to give a truly adequate answer (but will we pull it) at the same time recognize the Kurdish state and give them all conceivable help in the struggle for independence. And the second option is more risky but at the same time less expensive, faster and potentially much more effective, is to prepare and strike tactical nuclear weapons on the axis of three ardent opponents of Russia .. Turkey CA, Qatar. These states must be partially wiped off the face of the earth, and someone completely .. You say this is the third world and sunset of civilization? I will say no! Reply to us in a similar way are NOT DECIDED! Just because of our use of nuclear weapons, it’s just that the other side will have no illusions that we will not answer with all the dope, and the nuclear weapons just applied perfectly confirms this! Yes, this is a risky bet. but there is NO choice! I do not believe that we can win a protracted conflict with WORLD CAPITAL (and ALL its participants will be drawn into a conflict) is not the country with a comprador elite and a mercantile economy so that in the image of the USSR, in the great Russian war, fight with the whole world (then even the United States and England did not crap especially) and the long-term conflict of death is similar! По этому выбора нам не оставили, рано или поздно мы все умрем, НО я не хочу видеть как одни мои внуки будут обслуживать педофилов, а других разберут на органы для стареющих "цивилизованны людей" , а так и будет если мы проиграем ! While we play cards with the sharpie according to his rules, sooner or later we will lose, but if you get an ax and chop off a hand with marked cards, then the sharpie will listen to what you say .. About the fact that NATO will start a database against us .. Will not start! The use of nuclear weapons is precisely the guarantee that nullifies the full potential of NATO! It was only in 50-60 g that they were going to fight after the use of nuclear weapons without knowing all the consequences of this. now they know and very well. But the use of nuclear weapons themselves will not allow fear to lose everything! Because there is something, they left us no choice, but they are used to acting by other methods, albeit taking a long time. And in this case it will be so .. Porut will rattle their weapons, arrange a couple of major sabotage but no more .. С уничтожение СА и Катар в мире наступит энергетический кризис , а энергоносители в товарных количествах останутся у нас и у Ирана, Венесуэлы что охладит "праведный" пыл, лучше иметь хоть что то чем потерять все! I repeat once again in a long-term conflict, we will lose; neither the Army nor the Economy or Politics are ready for this.
      1. Volzhanin
        Volzhanin 25 November 2015 14: 13 New
        0
        If you strike a TNW along the axis of three ardent opponents of Russia - Turkey, the SA, Qatar, then no one in the world will even scratch themselves to harness for them!
        These states must be partially wiped off the face of the earth, and someone completely.
        Who will argue with this, except for their inhabitants?
        1. max702
          max702 25 November 2015 15: 50 New
          0
          Quote: Volzhanin
          Who will argue with this, except for their inhabitants?

          These residents see me in two guises .. Either in SLAVES .. Or in damp land ... Therefore, I can repay them with the same conscience .. They tried to make friends, it turned out badly ..
  2. Altona
    Altona 25 November 2015 07: 55 New
    +9
    Now let's see where the curved goat path of Erdogan will lead. Turkey will close the straits is a declaration of war. In general, you need to bend the Turks, you can not lower. And the rhetoric is tougher, right down to non-diplomatic expressions.
    1. Zoldat_A
      Zoldat_A 25 November 2015 08: 01 New
      +8
      Quote: Altona
      Turkey will close the straits -this is a declaration of war.

      Find what to open. Calibrate for your ships.
      1. Cosmos1987
        Cosmos1987 25 November 2015 08: 05 New
        +9
        Why are the American berks in the photo?
        1. Zoldat_A
          Zoldat_A 25 November 2015 08: 29 New
          +1
          Quote: Cosmos1987
          Why are the American berks in the photo?

          Нашёл по запросу о старте "Калибров", а дальше - извините, не моряк. Даже совсем наоборот. hi The picture seemed similar to what was shown on TV.
          1. Altona
            Altona 25 November 2015 08: 56 New
            +1
            Quote: Zoldat_A
            Нашёл по запросу о старте "Калибров", а дальше - извините, не моряк.

            -------------------
            И я не моряк, но запрос надо формулировать правильно...А правильно "корабли Буян М"...
            1. Zoldat_A
              Zoldat_A 25 November 2015 09: 20 New
              +2
              Quote: Altona
              И я не моряк, но запрос надо формулировать правильно...А правильно "корабли Буян М"...

              Thanks for the science.hi We ourselves are dark people, we did not finish theses. And they did not hold anything more complicated than their native AKMS. And even then under the Union ...

              Если бы комментарий был посвящён анализу средств базирования "Калибров", то, конечно, я бы перелопатил кучу интернетов и нашёл те фотографии, которые нужно. А в контексте (умное слово случайно услышал - рядом со школой жил) моего комментария - море, корабль, пуск ракет. По-моему, достаточно... hi
              1. Altona
                Altona 25 November 2015 10: 11 New
                0
                Quote: Zoldat_A
                We ourselves are dark people, we did not finish theses.

                ----------------------
                И еще "кораблем" называется военный борт, гражданский борт называется "морское(речное) судно"...
    2. DEMENTIY
      DEMENTIY 25 November 2015 08: 20 New
      +1
      Quote: Altona
      Turkey will close the straits is a declaration of war.


      В статье "хорошо" про Проливы.

      "Однако в сложившейся ситуации у России и лично у Владимира Путина бу-бу-бу воплотить в реальность мечты Екатерины Великой и последующих российских императоров, установить контроль России над черноморскими проливами…"

      They still did not have time to really wipe themselves off from the Turkish spit, but he already uses the Straits.
    3. demo
      demo 25 November 2015 08: 55 New
      -1
      Like those that our foreign minister seemed to use?
  3. mojohed2012
    mojohed2012 25 November 2015 07: 55 New
    +9
    Without the consent of Washington and the main puppeteers, NATO did not manage, therefore, we are not deceived. This provocation is a provocation not of Erdogan the schemer, but the United States-NATO.
    1. inkass_98
      inkass_98 25 November 2015 08: 03 New
      +7
      Quote: mojohed2012
      This provocation is a provocation not of Erdogan-schemer

      "Скажи мне, Савва, а тебе-то это зачем нужно?" (С)
      Надо совсем не иметь чувства политического самосохранения, чтобы бахать такие вещи. Кролик с Порохом могут скрыться в Канадщине или Омерице, а этот куда рванет в случае чего? Был вполне уважаемый и относительно влиятельный политик, а стал шпаной подзаборной, еще и вне группировки, "ронин" на османский лад.
    2. Zoldat_A
      Zoldat_A 25 November 2015 08: 05 New
      +7
      Quote: mojohed2012
      Without the consent of Washington and the main puppeteers, NATO did not manage, therefore, we are not deceived. This provocation is a provocation not of Erdogan the schemer, but the United States-NATO.

      In the next branch I wrote - грузинский сценарий образца 2008-го. "Вы попробуйте, а мы, если чего - заступимся". Врут, не заступятся. А вот посмотреть, как Москва отреагирует - посмотрят. And, I suspect that in 2008 they didn’t like what they saw. It is necessary to make it even less enjoyable now.
    3. Tatyana
      Tatyana 25 November 2015 08: 08 New
      +5
      mojohed2012 (1)
      This provocation is a provocation not of Erdogan the schemer, but the United States-NATO.

      Oh, just do not whitewash Erdogan!
      Erdogan in Syria has his own Turkish raider business in the robbery of Syrian oil with the help of the ISIS gangs that he personally controls.
      Erdogan is a high-ranking Turkish war criminal in the ranks of NATO!
      1. bornikrub
        bornikrub 25 November 2015 09: 15 New
        0
        Не "обеляют" Эрдогандона:
        он - сопливая "шестерка" на побегушках у США.
        It is worth remembering his place.
    4. The comment was deleted.
  4. izya top
    izya top 25 November 2015 07: 55 New
    +5
    Kurds need to be seriously armed. and the settlements along the border with Turkey from the Syrian side to dust. and the Turetchian litaks, when approaching the Syrian border, mercilessly plant
  5. apro
    apro 25 November 2015 07: 57 New
    +8
    Nobody will officially bomb the Turks, but the support of the Kurds will lead to a drop in the business tour to zero and there will be no one to support the Turks in the fight against the Kurds, the Kurds are fighting against daish and have organized an excellent alibi for themselves, let's see what’s next, the Turks really drove themselves into a corner.
  6. aleksfill
    aleksfill 25 November 2015 07: 58 New
    +4
    Fewer words with idiots acting around the corner. Only decisive retaliatory measures and massive
    удар по тем шакалам, что издевались над сбитым лётчиком. "Китайских" предупреждений быть - не должно.
  7. Alexkorzun
    Alexkorzun 25 November 2015 07: 58 New
    14
    Russia and Vladimir Putin personally have a wonderful historical chance not only to fundamentally change the situation in the entire Middle East and the Black and Mediterranean Seas, but also to finally realize the dreams of Catherine the Great and subsequent Russian emperors, to establish control Russia over the Black Sea straits ...


    И хочется и колется. Возможно, что у Путина и есть яйца на такие поступки. А у нас ? Мы его поддержим, готовы мы перестать быть только "диванными вояками"?
    1. Zoldat_A
      Zoldat_A 26 November 2015 02: 09 New
      +2
      Quote: Alexkorzun
      It is possible that Putin has eggs for such actions. And we have ? Мы его поддержим, готовы мы перестать быть только "диванными вояками"?

      And we did not lose.

      Когда Юкрейн начался, поехали к нам беженцы. Делали у нас на работе ремонт. В бригаде были, среди прочих, два шахтёра с Донбасса - мужик моих лет, пенсионер, и его зять. Так я потихоньку, аккуратненько спрашивал про "молодость вспомнить", "руки-то помнят" и "автомат свой приносить или там дадут"... Он сказал, что сам пытался в ополчение - не взяли. После 55 - в обоз, картошку чистить... Не знаю, может, картошку чистить - тоже труд, но меня полжизни страна использовала по прямому назначению, тому, которому учила. И картошку чистить как-то на старости лет не очень...

      And it’s a pity that they don’t take it. Today Solovyov won Ivashov advisers to Assad. Ivashov, of course, is a right and smart man. Well, that’s how I’m not aligning myself with Ivashov ... That's what the general is for.
  8. magician
    magician 25 November 2015 08: 00 New
    +2
    действия неразумного дитя, а не политика, "лица государства", нагадил и под крылышко "родителей".
  9. Same lech
    Same lech 25 November 2015 08: 01 New
    +2
    One gets the impression that the Turks, like the Germans or the French, cannot or simply do not want to draw the right conclusions from their history of relations with Russia: and, on this basis, periodically make further completely unsuccessful attempts to talk with our country only from a position of strength.


    Once every hundred years, European nations gather in a crowd and go to conquer living space in RUSSIA.

    Each time they receive a snot from RUSSIA, they again sign their surrender ... until the next drang tries.
    I think that we are again approaching the same moment in the recent history of RUSSIA .... given the emergence of NATO at our borders and the increasing killing of our citizens.
    1. anfil
      anfil 25 November 2015 08: 37 New
      +2
      Years Name Winner

      1568 — 1570 Russian-Turkish War Russia
      1672 — 1681 Russian-Turkish War Turkey
      1686 — 1700 Azov war Russia
      1710 — 1711 (13) Prut campaign Turkey
      1735 — 1739 Russo-Turkish War status quo
      1768 — 1774 Russian-Turkish War Russia
      1787 — 1791 Russian-Turkish War Russia
      1806 — 1812 Russian-Turkish War Russia
      1828 — 1829 Russian-Turkish War Russia
      1853 — 1856 Crimean War No
      1877 — 1878 Russian-Turkish War Russia
      1914 — 1918 Caucasus Front (World War I) Russia
      1. dr. sem
        dr. sem 25 November 2015 15: 10 New
        0
        2015 - the liquidation of Churkestan.
  10. ImPerts
    ImPerts 25 November 2015 08: 01 New
    +7
    The approximate alignment and outlines of the future Kurdistan can be estimated on the photo below:
    1. apro
      apro 25 November 2015 08: 05 New
      +4
      A good pie for the holiday, there is something to chop off among the Turks, begin the revival of Kurdistan from the Turkish territories!
  11. sledge
    sledge 25 November 2015 08: 02 New
    +2
    Who set up the Turks? I do not think that they climbed into the loop themselves.
    1. sa-zz
      sa-zz 25 November 2015 08: 25 New
      +1
      The ba themselves were framed. What are your brains for?
  12. Decathlon
    Decathlon 25 November 2015 08: 02 New
    19
    Turkey ... Qatar ... Saudi Arabia .. A wonderful rule was in the Soviet Army: screwed up one, everyone wrung out!
  13. Mikhail Krapivin
    Mikhail Krapivin 25 November 2015 08: 05 New
    +1
    The article is certainly life-affirming, but a lot but. For example, who will allow us to establish control over the Black Sea straits? They barely survived Crimea, they still suffer, and Russia has more rights to Crimea than other countries. And the straits in the territory of another state, a member of NATO ... Only as a result of the war, and for this we still need to save up a little strength.
    1. apro
      apro 25 November 2015 08: 08 New
      +1
      NATO when amers need it, and when it’s inappropriate, sort it out yourself, the French were refused support, and the Turks with Euro-integration are constantly thrown.
  14. dchegrinec
    dchegrinec 25 November 2015 08: 05 New
    +4
    Beautiful words about the victorious procession on the planet, of course, are superb before going to bed. But such things are not done so quickly. With dope, you can break the hell! Of course we have many opportunities and we must do everything carefully and not make unnecessary gestures. The economy is not gigantic! But if we do everything carefully and in a timely manner, the result can exceed expectations. As long as our policy has always been tolerant, therefore it has been successful! We will expect positive changes, victories and events. Russia is the best ...
    1. IPSC-2008
      IPSC-2008 25 November 2015 09: 22 New
      0
      Совершенно с вами согласен. Ведь военная помощь курдам может привести к военной помощи "умеренной оппозиции" со стороны Турции в виде средств ПЗРК и т.д., а это уже будет нашей головной болью. И такая эскалация напряженности на пользу только самому "демократичному" борцу.
  15. kind
    kind 25 November 2015 08: 05 New
    +2
    establish Russia's control over the Black Sea straits ...

    here is the key phrase !!! Everything else is a saying. Erdogan shot himself in the head with an air raid, but his brain doesn’t seem to be hurt, since he ran to NATO to ask for protection.
  16. VasLis
    VasLis 25 November 2015 08: 06 New
    -2
    Ah yes Putin !!!! love
  17. Smoked
    Smoked 25 November 2015 08: 06 New
    +6
    It doesn’t fit into my head that, in fact, our soldiers were killed not by militants, but by the state of Turkey.
  18. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 25 November 2015 08: 06 New
    +3
    А не кажется ли любезному Эрдогану, что гора Арарат находится не в той стране, что должна? Да и минареты у "Святой Софии" плохо смотрятся?
    Думаю, до этого не дойдёт, но у Эрдогана достаточно врагов внутри Турции, чтобы с "лёгкой помощью" призвать зарвавшегося янычара к ответу. Без применения тяжёлых вооружений. Президент ПАРЛАМЕНТСКОЙ страны! Кто он такой вообще, по собственной конституции?
  19. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 25 November 2015 08: 06 New
    +1
    If Turkey, because of Erdogan’s ambitions, tries to close the straits, then this will put an end to Erdogan itself, since the consequences may be such that I don’t want to think. And for the deed, Turkey simply needs to be crushed both economically (including completely depriving oil supplies from bandits) and politically using its military capabilities.
    1. hydrox
      hydrox 25 November 2015 08: 49 New
      0
      If this fool would have no brains, then he would try to close the straits for Russia, and now, when Russia is leading, supported by the whole world ... such an attempt can at best lead to a change of power in Turkey, and at worst - I don’t even want to say ... but the straits for us will ALWAYS be open.
  20. as150505
    as150505 25 November 2015 08: 07 New
    +6
    I am now in Turkey to rest a foot. In Russia I will rest. Don’t support the Churian economy
    1. rf xnumx
      rf xnumx 25 November 2015 08: 12 New
      11
      Quote: as150505
      I am now in Turkey to rest a foot. In Russia I will rest. Don’t support the Churian economy

      And it is right
      1. Tra-ta-ta
        Tra-ta-ta 25 November 2015 11: 18 New
        0
        Something I do not want to relax next to the IG ..
        Me too...
  21. Mihalich17
    Mihalich17 25 November 2015 08: 09 New
    +4
    The Straits, historically, have always been our goal!
    I repeat, but I will say it again - Erdoогan will very much and repeatedly regret what he did! Very sorry!
    Some of our responses to this incident, for very many, will be unexpected and painful, and perhaps fatal on a national scale.
    Я уж не говорю про меры по "отдельным, конкретным виновным лицам"!
    Time is off!
  22. dchegrinec
    dchegrinec 25 November 2015 08: 09 New
    +1
    A typical example of how money drives people crazy! Some having lost business shoot in summer houses, and some like Erdogan are ready for reckless actions! But it just doesn’t fail. Because it’s not a private showdown, but interstate relations. And responsibility is much worse than just shooting yourself.
  23. ivan bogomolov
    ivan bogomolov 25 November 2015 08: 09 New
    +3
    I think there will be no open military confrontation, it is not profitable for us, but here Erdogad along the way, they bang him, that's for sure. negative there he and the road, ... cowardly.
  24. buywol
    buywol 25 November 2015 08: 09 New
    +2
    Having made this provocation by the hands of Turkey, the United States wants to look at Moscow’s reaction in order to understand what plans can be made for Russia further.
  25. sery volk
    sery volk 25 November 2015 08: 10 New
    +1
    immediately equip the Kurds with the most modern weapons, and only then they will tear Churkoturiya, Turkey is a misunderstanding of history - the Churkestan miscarriage
  26. gnv731
    gnv731 25 November 2015 08: 10 New
    +3
    На мой взгляд, помимо турпотока и овощей из османии, хорошо было бы запретить в нашей стране макдональдсы, колу и прочие "кулинарные" шедевры американских ТНК. При желании в этом фастфуде можно найти много гадостей, вредящих здоровью.
    And in the end, we must turn to our economy face, not the fifth point. If the military-industrial complex was able to revive, then the village will be able to revive. And on the shelves will be their vegetables and other products.
    This will be the best answer.
    А в турции надо помогать "оппозиционерам", печеньки возить что ли. "Оппозиционеры" сами трипитаки пирдогану устроят.
    1. Denis DV
      Denis DV 25 November 2015 08: 18 New
      +2
      Why forbid, just do not use this muck - they will close themselves. No legislative initiative needed for this hi
  27. Denis DV
    Denis DV 25 November 2015 08: 11 New
    +2
    Here, the teaser is ready: Erdogan, Erdogan - you’ll get the scimitar hi
  28. Stinger
    Stinger 25 November 2015 08: 13 New
    +3
    What mistake! He long made himself a Sultan.
  29. DMB3000
    DMB3000 25 November 2015 08: 14 New
    +2
    Quote: avvg
    The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous, and for Erdogan it will have disastrous consequences.

    we and another hadam were going to put gas on the cheap. Now, let yourself go soon from our actions. at the same time, I express my condolences to the families and friends of the pilots. I’m probably not mistaken that if I say that this incident was perceived by every citizen who respected his country as a personal tragedy.
  30. Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 25 November 2015 08: 16 New
    +7
    Oil is a very powerful drug! Hit in the head, so such an impulsive action, not thinking about the consequences. And the consequences will be inevitable!
  31. S_Baykala
    S_Baykala 25 November 2015 08: 17 New
    +3
    Turkey controls the Bosphorus. Tens of thousands of our tourists are actually voluntary hostages in Turkey. For decades, after the collapse of the Union, our diplomats, businessmen and management have pursued a very costly and time-consuming policy of building new relationships, promoting trade and business agreements: offhand - Turkish flow, tourism, nuclear power plants. I don’t want to equal the lives of our guys and money (blessed memory), but you won’t erase words from the song: the above are multi-billion dollar projects with people Turkey, not with Erdogan. It will take an hour or two to bring nations into a state of war or conflict, and reconciling them for decades may not be enough, breaking and not building.
    Plus turretchina still a member of NATO. Therefore, our leadership now has a very difficult time. The above items are very difficult to make an adequate decision. In fact, this is really a stab in the back. I believe that the answer will be unexpected, but harsh (better cruel) and fair.
    1. bornikrub
      bornikrub 25 November 2015 09: 27 New
      +2
      "Народ" не священная корова и должен нести свою долю ответственности.
      The Soviet people betrayed Stalin, betrayed the Union and thought that the Western cookie would break off for him.
      Турецкий "народ" не требует отставки своего фюрера, а бесится у российского посольства.

      By the way, in Russia, many support Putin in a whisper.
      A tick in the profiles.
  32. Horn
    Horn 25 November 2015 08: 19 New
    0
    Yes, you remember how five years ago Erdogan spoke in Egypt with the appearance that he was the new Turkish sultan! He seriously tried on the crown, and here such a bummer with Syria! Anyway: you can’t see a string of people eager to kiss the shoes of the new owner of the Shining Port!
  33. U-96
    U-96 25 November 2015 08: 22 New
    +1
    не понял, а в чем именно "фатальность"?
    but finally to realize the dreams of Catherine the Great and subsequent Russian emperors, to establish Russian control over the Black Sea straits ...
    Dreamers delight. A monumental conclusion from a border incident. This even Joseph Vissarionych did not succeed, and how it ended - is known. No one will redraw the agreement on the straits will be completely raving. As I understand it, the author decided to scratch such a code with the erogenous zone of patriots?
  34. Siberia 9444
    Siberia 9444 25 November 2015 08: 22 New
    0
    An interesting position of the author. We always got meanness from the Turks, and the fact that Turkey and Isis for one thing was clear from the beginning. But in any case, we must take revenge + economic blockade!
    1. U-96
      U-96 25 November 2015 08: 25 New
      0
      Quote: Siberia 9444
      An interesting position of the author.

      In particular, these are:

      Then it is completely obvious that Turkey will, on the one hand, be under the possible blow of the Russian Aerospace Forces located in Syria, and on the other hand, under the blow of the troops of the Southern Military District and the Black Sea Fleet and the Caspian Military Flotilla.

      On which couch such powerful thoughts are born? Although used to sit on the edge ...
      1. 3officer
        3officer 25 November 2015 08: 33 New
        0
        Quote: U-96
        Quote: Siberia 9444
        An interesting position of the author.

        In particular, these are:

        Then it is completely obvious that Turkey will, on the one hand, be under the possible blow of the Russian Aerospace Forces located in Syria, and on the other hand, under the blow of the troops of the Southern Military District and the Black Sea Fleet and the Caspian Military Flotilla.

        On which couch such powerful thoughts are born? Although used to sit on the edge ...



        Да хотелось бы узнать способ "прочистить" проливы военным путём,ну "чисто гипотетически".
        1. U-96
          U-96 25 November 2015 08: 49 New
          +1
          Quote: 3officer
          ну "чисто гипотетически".

          под видом туристов в Турцию перебрасываются две ДШБ на четырёх стратегах, замаскированных под чартеры "Уральских авиалиний". Сигнал к началу захвата мостов, проливов и телеграфа - "Таги-и-и-ил!!!!"
  35. Yves762
    Yves762 25 November 2015 08: 22 New
    0
    Всё будет "размазано" "на словах", и только. sad
    Всякая мелочь , типа снижения тур.потока, трансп. сообщения ... и т.д.(санкции по сути, которые "никого и никогда" - по Наших же мнению), не будут иметь существенного значения по сравнению с геополитическими понтами, что Эрдоган поимеет на Ближнем Востоке с факта, что Россия - не Израиль: можно и стрельнуть; в ответ не прилетит.

    I don’t believe in changes in South Stream, Akkuyu NPP or Turkey’s foreign policy position, even in Syria / terrorists. Even for hard currency ... No.
  36. SPLV
    SPLV 25 November 2015 08: 25 New
    +3
    Recently, trade with Turkey has totaled more than 30 billion US rubles. I personally make a personal contribution to its reduction - I have never been and I'm not going to go there wink. And the loss of 25-30 billion for the Turks (the Russian market) is in some way a blow to the Ottomans. Support personal sanctions against the tourist industry of the Turks?
  37. Grbear
    Grbear 25 November 2015 08: 27 New
    0
    Для контроля над проливами нужно, чтобы турция не просто "сдулась", а легла рядышком с натой (или нато отказалось от турции во весь голос). До этого не дойдет, а вот протекторат с "маленькой" базой поблизости — это более реально. hi
    1. U-96
      U-96 25 November 2015 08: 56 New
      0
      Quote: GrBear
      До этого не дойдет, а вот протекторат с "маленькой" базой поблизости — это более реально.

      where is it?
      Quote: GrBear
      To control the straits you need

      so-so-so ... and what-and-what-and-what ????
  38. VadimSt
    VadimSt 25 November 2015 08: 29 New
    +2
    Rave! No one to open confrontation, even for the straits, even for the mountains will not go. However, on the other side, this is even more feared - in terms of global war, Russia is the only rival to all at once, and to friends and enemies together. Yes, and Russia, to stand in a pose against all, there is no need. There will be some answer, but not the one that desires our sense of revenge - because we speak only from ourselves and are responsible, only for ourselves.
  39. vladimirw
    vladimirw 25 November 2015 08: 31 New
    0
    but also to finally realize the dreams of Catherine the Great and subsequent Russian emperors, to establish Russian control over the Black Sea straits ..
    Nonsense and complete nonsense. This Comrade Stalin could not do, but now ....
  40. vicdoc63
    vicdoc63 25 November 2015 08: 34 New
    0
    Quote: avvg
    The consequences for Turkey will be disastrous, and for Erdogan it will have disastrous consequences.

    It was smooth on paper. yes forgot about NATO.
  41. mikh-korsakov
    mikh-korsakov 25 November 2015 08: 34 New
    -1
    I quote: Russia and Vladimir Putin personally have a wonderful historical chance not only to fundamentally change the situation in the entire Middle East and the Black and Mediterranean Seas, but also to finally realize the dreams of Catherine the Great and subsequent Russian emperors, to establish control Russia over the Black Sea straits ... Автора понесло. Даже несерьезно обсуждать тему проливов. Предлагаю ввести звания у диванных стратегов. Автор достоин высшего звания "Кавалер пикейных жилетов".
  42. Roust
    Roust 25 November 2015 08: 34 New
    +4
    The point of no return is passed, we must go to the end. The Turks, as accomplices of ISIS, tore off the mask, now we need to turn into a mess what is under it. And at the same time give Qatar and the Saudis to the crotch and then the IS will disappear by itself.
    1. SergGrey318
      SergGrey318 25 November 2015 10: 46 New
      0
      Hurry, you make people laugh.
      Или как говорил товарищ Саахов, в фильме "Кавказская пленница": "Торопыца не надо".
      I understand that it’s not pleasant and insulting. Sorry for the pilots, sorry for the Marine. But to climb on the rampage now, and to knead everything and everyone, this is clearly not a way to a decent response. Moreover, that is precisely what provokes us.
      All subsequent steps should be clear and balanced. Beat only at a pain point. And not necessarily by military means.
      Мне больше нравиться идея: "Независимому Курдистану - БЫТЬ!".
      ;-)
  43. mikh-korsakov
    mikh-korsakov 25 November 2015 08: 35 New
    +1
    I quote: Russia and Vladimir Putin personally have a wonderful historical chance not only to fundamentally change the situation in the entire Middle East and the Black and Mediterranean Seas, but also to finally realize the dreams of Catherine the Great and subsequent Russian emperors, to establish control Russia over the Black Sea straits ... Автора понесло. Даже несерьезно обсуждать тему проливов. Предлагаю ввести звания у диванных стратегов. Автор достоин высшего звания "Кавалер пикейных жилетов".
  44. emercom1979
    emercom1979 25 November 2015 08: 35 New
    +2
    I’m going to tell a Turkish company that it’s not good to do this ... We have a lot of their construction and agricultural companies here ... Squeeze ... everyone should ... They can do it ...
  45. Bashibuzuk
    Bashibuzuk 25 November 2015 08: 36 New
    +2
    Interesting article.
    "..по отношению к своему могучему eastern соседу."
    We open the atlas, or there is a map above and look - and who is Turkey’s powerful eastern neighbor?
    Iran, damn it. Nowhere to the east.
    And Russia has always been northern a neighbor for Turkey.
    And only in the North there is a wonderful beast - PESEC.
    .
    I don’t know how anyone, but in this action of Turkey I see precisely the incitement from the States. Maybe from England. From Brussels, in short. But, not generally so that everyone knows, but precisely, surgically.
    Why? Because Italy has fallen asleep - Turkey entered the war on the side of ISIS.
    This means that in NATE itself there are also some of them more equal than others.
    And what do we see as a result?
    The same Pentagon flies over Turkey with a fly - our plane (Russian) flew in the Syrian zone, performed missions to combat ISIS.
    It turns out that the Turks are crazy, crazy turks?
    Mexico said the unpredictable state is not Russia, but Turkey.
    ....
    It seems to me that this unfinished Turkey was specially put up in a stupid form. Well, fools are beaten in the church.
    When they started to squeak, they say, Russian planes violate the border.
    .
    Russia will not support Kurds with finances and weapons, of course. Officially.
    Но, судя по всем раскладам, начиная с того времени, когда впервые услышали звенящую фразу - "будем мочить в сортирах" -
    oh, how I do not envy those who are impatient in the toilet.
    But looking at the speeches of Erdogan and his moron-grinning Prime Minister Davutoglu, he could not help feeling that they were having an attack of diarrhea about to begin.
    To the toilet, gentlemen of the Turks, to the toilet. They are waiting for you there!
  46. Geophizik
    Geophizik 25 November 2015 08: 37 New
    +4
    Откуда такие "шапкозакидательские" настроения? Очевидно, что предстоит непростой диалог с Турцией и сложнейшие всесторонние маневры с Западом в целом. Не следует забывать, что даже "на ровном месте" НАТО и Запад постоянно в чем-нибудь обвиняют Россию, что уж говорить о произошедшем инциденте! Стратегическая цель Запада - вовлечь Россию хоть в какой-нибудь прямой военный конфликт и экономически измотать её, сейчас имеет очень высокую степень вероятности выхода в практическую плоскость. К тому же вооруженные силы Турецкой республики представляют собой вполне современные, прекрасно вооруженные и хорошо подготовленные военные формирования, к тому же интегрированные в систему НАТО. Поэтому вызывает искреннее уважение взвешенная позиция России, высказанная высшим руководством. Ни о какой быстрой победоносной военной кампании даже мыслей не возникает - слишком велики риски. Должен преобладать разум и взаимная добрая воля, осознание колоссальной ответственности за судьбы всего мира.
    1. Volzhanin
      Volzhanin 25 November 2015 14: 21 New
      0
      Why do we get involved in a conflict?
      Ударить ТЯО по всем стратегическим и важным объектам турляндии и наблюдать издалека за "вполне современными, прекрасно вооруженными и хорошо подготовленными военными формированиями".
      What's the problem?
      And the English women to heal unconditionally - they are Turks and nauskali.
  47. Vladimir Lipov
    Vladimir Lipov 25 November 2015 08: 38 New
    +2
    Erdogan has gone too far, just like Mikhuil Saakashvili at one time. We all remember how it ended up by eating ties. We must make Erdogan do something similar.
  48. Mercenary
    Mercenary 25 November 2015 08: 39 New
    +5
    Dear Author Denis Terekhov! Article (-) of such a free historiography has not yet met.
    1 almost all of Turkey’s wars with Russia were provoked and supported by Europe, primarily England. (This is not an exception, and the United States passed the role of England, without their support Erdogan would not have allowed such a thing.)
    2 always when Turkey was on the verge of defeat, the troops of Europe were tightened (In this case, when the USA did not succeed with Ukraine, America will fight until the last Turk. By the way, ISIS is their joint brainchild.)
    3 it is naive to suppose an attack from two sides (Syria and Russia) With the blocked straits, the Syrian group will remain without proper supply.
    4 quiet condemnation of the attack of the Russian SU-24 by the Turks in Europe does not mean anything. From experience (the ruler at the helm craps Russia selflessly, it is worth resigning and calls for friendship and cooperation with Russia.
    Hence the conclusion - no need to fight with the heads of Kashchei (NATO, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, etc.) you must immediately take up the destruction of the death of Kashchei EGGS with a needle, but it is located behind a large puddle. As this is another question, the military path is the worst, but the economy and huge debts are a topic. am
  49. prostofily
    prostofily 25 November 2015 08: 40 New
    0
    No need to rush. What did the Turks think there, but they were terrified of Russia. Now let them be a little afraid, think. Even if they crawl themselves ... Well, there are a lot of options.
  50. BaLaLaykin
    BaLaLaykin 25 November 2015 08: 41 New
    -3
    oh these storytellers, they’ll blurt out stupidity, and there even the grass doesn’t grow. The author doesn’t know how the Turkish Straits became?
    The war of Russia with the coalition of the British Empire, the French Empire, the Ottoman Empire and the Kingdom of Sardinia for the Ottoman heritage, domination in the Black Sea basin, the Caucasus and the Balkans.

    At the beginning of the war, the Russian fleet managed to win a major victory over the Turkish in Sinop Bay. However, after the Allies entered the war, the situation changed. During the ensuing hostilities, the Allies succeeded, using the technological backwardness of the Russian army and navy, to successfully land an airborne corps in the Crimea, inflict a number of defeats on the Russian army and capture Sevastopol, the main base of the Russian Black Sea Fleet, after a year-long siege. At the same time, the allied landing in Kamchatka failed. On the Caucasian front, Russian forces managed to inflict a series of defeats on the Turkish army and capture Kars. However, diplomatic isolation forced Russia to capitulate. The Paris Peace Treaty, signed in 1856, demanded that Russia cede the Ottoman Empire to southern Bessarabia and the mouth of the Danube River. The neutralization of the Black Sea was proclaimed
    Now the coalition will be more, what straits do you dream of?
    1. KaPToC
      KaPToC 25 November 2015 09: 06 New
      +2
      Contrary to popular belief, the Allies could not capture Sevastopol, but took only part of it.
    2. U-96
      U-96 25 November 2015 09: 11 New
      +2
      Quote: Lalaika
      At the beginning of the war, the Russian fleet managed to win a major victory over the Turkish in Sinop Bay. However

      historical retrospectives are, of course, good. All branches with a Turkish subject abound in them. Just what practical benefit from them, except for purely informative?