Military Review

20 T-14 Armata tanks prepared for transfer to troops

263
Representatives of Uralvagonzavod report that work has been completed at the enterprise to create a pilot batch tanks T-14 Armata. The report said that the party consists of 20 units of the latest armored vehicles, which are being prepared for transfer to the troops in the near future. RIA News cites a statement by the representative of the defense enterprise Vyacheslav Khalitov, who is the general director for special equipment at Uralvagonzavod:


We have made a pilot batch of Armata tanks from 20, now they are at the plant and are preparing to be transferred to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation.


20 T-14 Armata tanks prepared for transfer to troops


Recall that for the first time the general public was shown the newest tanks during a parade in honor of the 70 anniversary of the Victory. Tanks X-14 "Armata" marched through Red Square. After that, a film about the latest Russian tank was presented on Zvezda TV channel with a demonstration of its main features.

As soon as Russia demonstrated the functionality of the first samples of this technology, in Germany they stated that the German industry would urgently create their own developments of such a plan. It turned out something from the “catch up and overtake” series, but only in the German version.
Photos used:
http://www.globallookpress.com
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  1. Vladimyrych
    Vladimyrych 17 November 2015 18: 59 New
    129
    Beautiful car. Visually, it will look more harmonious with a 152 mm barrel, but still beautiful.
    It is very pleasing that the process of entering the troops has begun. Good luck!!!
    1. cniza
      cniza 17 November 2015 19: 02 New
      60
      Today is a day of good news, for the beginning and development of new technology is already not bad.
      1. Baikonur
        Baikonur 17 November 2015 19: 07 New
        42
        In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!
        1. Sterlya
          Sterlya 17 November 2015 19: 26 New
          18
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          I agree. The three. But so that it doesn’t fall into the hands of anyone.
          It will give a lot. Yes, even developers (not the main ones) in the tank!
          1. Abakan
            Abakan 17 November 2015 22: 23 New
            11
            ))) Does Si Xing give you something)))
            1. Temples
              Temples 18 November 2015 16: 36 New
              +5
              Can start with a tank biathlon?
              Accessible and clear to the layman.
              И на биатлоне на "обкатанных" машинах кто-то лучше, а кто-то в отстающих.
              And in Syria, a new technique in all respects to throw madness into my sofa look. smile
              1. da n ya 1914
                da n ya 1914 20 November 2015 16: 37 New
                0
                T 14 does not need to be thrown into Syria, it is true for Syria we have 15000 Soviet tanks.
          2. shasherin.pavel
            shasherin.pavel 17 November 2015 23: 30 New
            33
            Ну против кого там Т-14 воевать будет? Против РПГ -76? Что у нас пыли в стране не хватает? Грязи мало в России? Т-72 вполне подойдёт для Сирии или "Терминатор", вот это было бы в точку.
            1. glavnykarapuz
              glavnykarapuz 18 November 2015 12: 47 New
              +2
              Quote: shasherin.pavel
              Ну против кого там Т-14 воевать будет? Против РПГ -76? Что у нас пыли в стране не хватает? Грязи мало в России? Т-72 вполне подойдёт для Сирии или "Терминатор", вот это было бы в точку.

              And what kind of RPG-76?
              1. Semen Semyonitch
                Semen Semyonitch 18 November 2015 17: 15 New
                0
                Quote: glavnykarapuz
                And what kind of RPG-76?

                Some kind of Polish karamultuk ...
              2. shasherin.pavel
                shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 18: 03 New
                0
                RPG-7! Something has changed? Or are we just looking for fleas on a dog? But the dog itself is not trained!
                A weak answer: why RPG-7? Neither 8, nor 12, but 7?
            2. kostolom45
              kostolom45 19 November 2015 15: 07 New
              0
              against the TOU complexes and the Javelins and other Western ATGMs, where they are like dirt from the Ishilovites, watch the video as they are old Alahakbar tanks. Armata has just protection against ATGMs - the main feature, and it would be quiet to check it. As I understand it with my again philistine mind - in Syria they are testing everything new in real conditions. And the latest missiles and samoli, and infantry gadgets ...
          3. complete zero
            complete zero 18 November 2015 23: 32 New
            +1
            and it will be likely (it’s a sin not to run in real battles)
        2. Civil
          Civil 17 November 2015 19: 46 New
          +2
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          NOT worth it completely, but in parts is possible.
        3. Mujahiddin777
          Mujahiddin777 17 November 2015 19: 47 New
          +2
          And suddenly there is already ... wink
        4. SPACE
          SPACE 17 November 2015 20: 02 New
          12
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          And yet, your own testing ground is much more efficient, and test conditions can be created in a wide variety of ways.
          Z.Y. Promptly. With such rich experience in tank building and combat use of tanks as in the Russian Federation, with modern computer-aided design and modeling methods, as well as with the latest production technologies, tanks and in general all ground combat equipment should be immediately accepted from the first units that left the assembly line weapons and delivered to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for full operation, without any further modifications, bypassing the experimental batch and trial use time ... Wash it all goes.
          1. Altona
            Altona 17 November 2015 20: 06 New
            17
            Quote: SPACE
            And yet, your own testing ground is much more efficient, and test conditions can be created in a wide variety of ways.
            Z.Y. With such rich experience in tank building and the combat use of tanks as in the Russian Federation, with modern methods of computer design and simulation, as well as with the latest production technologies, tanks and in general all ground combat equipment should be immediately accepted from the first units that left the assembly line weapons and delivered to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for full operation, without any further modifications ... Wash this all goes.

            -------------------------
            It doesn’t happen ... A computer is of course a great help, but life makes its own corrections ... Virtuality does not replace reality yet ...
            1. SPACE
              SPACE 17 November 2015 20: 53 New
              0
              Quote: Altona
              It doesn’t happen ...

              This is a template ...
              Quote: Altona
              The computer is of course a great help, but life makes its own adjustments ... Virtuality does not replace reality yet ...

              I do not agree, business dictates its own strict rules, time is money, a chance is given only once and there is absolutely no right to make a mistake at all! Project, manufacturing, assembly, start-up. Experience says that it is possible. Compensate for the emerging scatter of small orders of reality, should be laid down in the basic functions of the machine, i.e. adaptability.
              1. Stena
                Stena 17 November 2015 21: 37 New
                +6
                Quote: SPACE
                business dictates its own strict rules, time is money, a chance is given only once and there is absolutely no right to make a mistake at all

                Hehe hehe ... And what about the business?
                And in it there are a bunch of errors of various levels - from small ones to strategic ones. Everything can be fixed - and whoever has a head and desire - he corrects.
                Quote: SPACE
                Compensate the emerging scatter of small orders of reality

                Скажите, а где такую "хи-хи-ха-ха" продают?
              2. kori
                kori 17 November 2015 21: 46 New
                +7
                Your lips, but honey to drink .. Only often in production everything is far from ideal .. I refer to my experience)
                1. Stena
                  Stena 17 November 2015 21: 49 New
                  +5
                  Quote: kori
                  Only often in production is everything far from ideal

                  Almost always, and especially when there are a lot of operations and a lot of people involved. Yes, and cars - also fail regularly ... And if you take not a standard product, but a completely new one or what kind of R&D - in general - it's a miracle if there are no strategic mistakes ...
                2. Yuyuka
                  Yuyuka 17 November 2015 23: 01 New
                  15
                  I refer to my experience)

                  I join - you design, draw - so beautiful! start to collect - your mother! how is there a key to crawl to that nut? where is this constructor ?? and you echo from behind picking up - where-where-where? ... and slowly into the department laughing so no one has canceled the finalization of the file, it just might have become less of the files during computer modeling repeat
                  1. shasherin.pavel
                    shasherin.pavel 17 November 2015 23: 37 New
                    +6
                    Yes! I recall with horror the practice in the convoy of the bus fleet in 77. Oh, these LiAZs ... To remove the air balloon, you need to remove the front wheel and unscrew the top and bottom eight bolts each, poking your hands through a tiny window in the case. The men’s hands simply did not crawl through this window, that was our practice ... As I recall, goosebumps ... with a fingernail the size of.
                  2. Sorokin
                    Sorokin 20 November 2015 12: 49 New
                    0
                    Less real files. They are simply not there.
              3. Altona
                Altona 17 November 2015 23: 01 New
                +4
                Quote: SPACE
                I do not agree, business dictates its own strict rules, time is money, a chance is given only once and there is absolutely no right to make a mistake at all! Project, manufacturing, assembly, start-up. Experience says that it is possible. Compensate for the emerging scatter of small orders of reality, should be laid down in the basic functions of the machine, i.e. adaptability.

                --------------------
                Ну прям...Право на ошибку у инженера должно быть, почему то у "эффективных манагеров" ошибки на миллионы рублей и сотни жизней и ничего, а инженера за гайку сгноить готовы...Опыт говорит, что ни о чём не говорит...F-35 до сих пор доводят, и как то не жужжат...И шанс, он то 10 раз дается, то не дается вообще...Вы мыслите как коммерсант, в технике так не мыслят, там есть вероятность, а вы как игрок в казино...Видел я 3D-шников, на которых сейчас каждый дирик молится, сто раз за ними говно подтирал, из-за их узкомыслия...
                1. kostolom45
                  kostolom45 19 November 2015 15: 14 New
                  0
                  Proper CAD actually does a lot of things and checks AUTOMATICALLY so that files are not needed later. Including the assembly order, and the availability of elements for the tool in the finished product, and the trace of vibro-loaded pipelines and temperature conditions, and the aerohydrodynamics of cooling systems and the optimization of strength, taking into account production technology. Only this is an order of magnitude more complex and expensive systems, of which we have once or twice neglected. From the western ones - the SolidWorks family, from our Compass (powerful CAD for shipbuilding). I'm majoring in CAD software, if that.
            2. Aleksey_K
              Aleksey_K 17 November 2015 22: 19 New
              +3
              Quote: Altona
              It doesn’t happen ... A computer is of course a great help, but life makes its own corrections ... Virtuality does not replace reality yet ...

              Where did you hear about the virtual tank test site? All tanks are tested for survivability by all types of anti-tank weapons, in various places of the tank. And after this shelling, it is checked whether he can move and fight. And in Syria, who will fight on them, the Syrians or what? So you can instantly convey all the secrets to the Americans, if you do not evacuate the tank from the battlefield. After all, it’s enough to smash the goose and immobilize the tank, and the caterpillar can be smashed from a heavy machine gun from a fairly close distance.
              1. Altona
                Altona 17 November 2015 23: 02 New
                0
                Quote: Алексей_К
                Where did you hear about the virtual tank test site? All tanks are tested for survivability by all types of anti-tank weapons, in various places of the tank. And after this shelling, it is checked whether he can move and fight. And in Syria, who will fight on them, the Syrians or what? So you can instantly convey all the secrets to the Americans, if you do not evacuate the tank from the battlefield. After all, it’s enough to smash the goose and immobilize the tank, and the caterpillar can be smashed from a heavy machine gun from a fairly close distance.

                ------------------------
                Write this to the cosmos, but not to me ... I know it no worse than you ...
              2. shasherin.pavel
                shasherin.pavel 17 November 2015 23: 44 New
                +3
                Quote: Алексей_К
                and the caterpillar can be smashed from a heavy machine gun from a fairly close distance.

                Yes, then a multi-million tank is needed, if it can be broken from a machine gun !? In the 41, the Germans reported to Berlin that they did not take the X-NUMX-mm high-explosive grenade to the T-37 caterpillar. But we must remember that our 34 is a licensed 45 mm anti-tank gun of the Wehrmacht. And you about some kind of machine gun in the 37 year. Well, no ... if the tank stands still and shoot the whole tape, then something can be achieved. But on the go ... Trucks then change all the time in front of the shooter and you cannot get into one track with two bullets.
                1. Aleksey_K
                  Aleksey_K 18 November 2015 15: 41 New
                  +2
                  Quote: shasherin.pavel
                  Yes, then a multi-million tank is needed, if it can be smashed with a machine gun!

                  The fact is that a heavy machine gun with 15 mm. projectile. this is actually an armor-piercing projectile and this projectile, even with a caliber of 12.7 mm., quietly pierces in our time 20 mm steel armor. So the truck, when hit by several of these bullets, long life does not shine. But a large machine gun in a normal combined arms battle is destroyed very quickly, because it has huge dimensions and is installed on a special rack or platform. The tank, having an advantage in range, destroys this target with one shot. But in Syria, the main fights are in the ruins of cities. Such a machine gun in ambush, in ruins, can completely blind a tank, destroying all the observation devices on the tower and immobilizing it, breaking a caterpillar. By the way, they can demolish all dynamic defense from their armor, and then shoot the tank from any RPG.
                  This is not a Kalashnikov light machine gun.
                  And here is a historical reference for you:
                  14,5 × 114 mm - Soviet cartridge for large-caliber machine guns и anti tank guns.
                  Currently, the construction of heavy machine guns are engaged in: USA, Singapore, Germany, Russia and China.
                  1. sharp-lad
                    sharp-lad 18 November 2015 16: 12 New
                    +2
                    В Российской армии появился крупнокалиберный пулемёт "Корд", можно и со станка, а если пулемётчик покрупнее среднего телосложения то и от бедра. hi
                    1. shasherin.pavel
                      shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 18: 30 New
                      +2
                      На испытаниях "Корда" военные чуть сума не сошли, когда из "Корда" начала стрелять 60-кг девушка. Когда мужики из "Корда" постреляли, то только одно и смогли сказать: "Как же мы раньше воевали?"
                  2. shasherin.pavel
                    shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 18: 25 New
                    +1
                    I don’t want to find fault with you: but machine guns do not shoot shells, only bullets. By the beginning of the war in the USSR there were anti-tank mines with 2-kg V.V. The Germans noted the multiple defeat of the tracks of their tanks, but not a single tank was destroyed. Urgently increased the weight of B.V. to 5 kg. The mass of the explosive in the shell from 10 to 12% of the mass of the shell. The 152-mm shell has a weight of about 42 -48 kg, which means the mass of V.V. 4.2 kg or 4.8 kg.
                    In total, the tank has about 98 tracks in both tracks, how many bullets do you need to get into the 3-4 bullets in motion? Everything else you have is related to the shooting of a wrecked or burned tank that does not shoot and does not move. I heard such a thing: there is an empty charge in the tank kit, in case the capsule does not work. A single shot of the T-72 along the street knocks out any constipation of the anus, not to mention the eyes and ears. Tankers never went to look at the dead from a single charge. So you try to demolish all the dynamic protection from the machine gun from the tank, and it’s single for you along the street. Although I understand that there is some drawback: the gunner inserts the capsule before the shot, the T-72 shell does not have shells, there is a burning capsule and a tray that is thrown through the window in the tower. But about a shot from a single six kilogram charge and told a tanker in a documentary about Chechnya.
                    1. Aleksey_K
                      Aleksey_K 18 November 2015 22: 51 New
                      +1
                      Quote: shasherin.pavel
                      I don’t want to find fault with you: but machine guns do not shoot shells, only bullets.

                      You just find fault with the words, please call - ammunition.
                      Quote: shasherin.pavel
                      A single shot of the T-72 along the street knocks out any constipation of the anus, not to mention the eyes and ears.

                      I was a tanker, we didn’t have such shells in tanks. But I’ll tell you about any shot. Standing in front of the tank with any shot is dangerous for the body. Concussion, hearing loss, internal and ear bleeding, and a many-month hospital stay are ensured. Even the smallest charges in the mortars make the mortar bow to the mortar, plug their ears and open their mouths.
                      1. Sorokin
                        Sorokin 20 November 2015 15: 00 New
                        0
                        From agree. Her legs are knocked down when the tank hits 50 meters.
                  3. Sorokin
                    Sorokin 20 November 2015 14: 50 New
                    0
                    At the SVPTAU shooting range in Eburg from the KVPT 60 pb, the ISU-152 was dismantled and brick mock-ups draw conclusions.
          2. Kasym
            Kasym 17 November 2015 20: 48 New
            12
            Байконур, одиночный танк (любой) приговорят быстро. Поэтому только "толпой". Танковый батальон (31 машина) будет нормально.
            Но прежде чем отправлять надо кучу всего сделать. Те советские Тэшки по всему Союзу гоняли - не хочется с Арматой в лужу на глазах всего мира сесть, а в Сирии за счастье Т-72. Им Т-55 с дин. защитой самое то и по-более. Шилок, да Градов (здорово было бы серию "Торнадо" испытать - и дальше и мощнее ВВ). Вот Т-90 проверить, пока Армату готовят - это было бы дело. hi
            1. Aleksey_K
              Aleksey_K 17 November 2015 22: 48 New
              0
              Quote: Kasym
              одиночный танк (любой) приговорят быстро. Поэтому только "толпой". Танковый батальон (31 машина) будет нормально.

              The experience of the Great Patriotic War and the experience of a tank attack in Grozny shows to all lovers of tank attacks that at present all tanks are burned with hand grenade launchers from the ruins of houses.
              Therefore, cities are taken by the coverage of cities with tank wedges with landing on the armor. When the ring is closed, cleaning of the city begins. Tanks do not play a decisive role here and serve only to suppress artillery and snipers, again under the guise of infantry from grenade launchers.
              I will say briefly that to take cities you need not 30-thu tanks, but 1000-th, at least. In this case, 30% of the tanks will be burned. And not divisions, but armies. One army is on the left, the second is on the right, and the third is on the forehead. Read about the fighting in the cities in the Great Patriotic War. By the way, during the storming of Grozny, this experience was completely marked. Grachev generally boasted that Grozny would take one Airborne Division. As a result, the first tank assault ended in failure for the Russian troops.
              Это информация "для размышления" для танковых шапкозакидателей. Вы думаете, почему в Сирии так долго берут совсем малюсенькие города вокруг Дамаска? Да нет у Асада армий и такого количества танков. Поэтому вытесняют бандитов потихоньку, берут измором, отсекают от поставок боеприпасов. И исламисты сами уходят и сдают позиции. А в некоторых местах эти мелкие города несколько раз переходят из рук в руки.
              1. vladkavkaz
                vladkavkaz 17 November 2015 22: 59 New
                25
                Aleksey_K
                The experience of using tanks in Grozny in one company speaks about one thing, disorganization of control, incorrect statement of the problem, betrayal from Moscow (Berezovsky and K), lack of infantry in battles.
                I’m telling you as a direct participant.
                After Grozny in 1 company, more than this did not happen.
                There is no need to flicker the army of the Tuda, the army of the Syud, the army in the trenches and the army in the jump, the realities of 1 company showed that even an enemy who knows the terrain perfectly, having superiority in infantry, in the engineering equipment of the terrain, suffered a crushing defeat. in 1 company, there were only FIVE thousand in combat units, against 30 thousand militants.
                And already in the middle of February, from the formidable they threw the whole gangster pack, then drove to the mountains. And if again, if not for the stop orders, Yeltsin’s stupidity and venality of Berezovsky and K oligarchs, by May 95, by September maximum, the whole bunch of bandits would be crushed.
                But it turned out only in the year 99, when some people were stolen from their posts.
                Танк в городе,с поддержкой пехоты,читайте БУСВ ч3,там все давным давно расписано,так что ваш посыл"Танки здесь решающей роли не играют и служат только подавления артиллерии и снайперов,"несколько не верен,спросите у любого пехотинца,воевавшего там.
                1. Aleksey_K
                  Aleksey_K 18 November 2015 00: 35 New
                  -4
                  Quote: vladkavkaz
                  Танк в городе,с поддержкой пехоты,читайте БУСВ ч3,там все давным давно расписано,так что ваш посыл"Танки здесь решающей роли не играют и служат только подавления артиллерии и снайперов,"несколько не верен,спросите у любого пехотинца,воевавшего там

                  Я не воевал в Грозном, но я танкист, офицер и Боевой устав знал. Но вот что пишет сам Рохлин: "Разгром был полный, — рассказывает генерал Рохлин. — Командование находилось в шоке." Второй этап операции федеральных войск в Чечне (штурм Грозного), получивший кодовое название „Лом“, провалился, как и первый (операция по блокированию Грозного).
                  Yes, then there were significant changes and Grozny was taken. But I wrote about the first attempts to capture Grozny.
                  And here is an example of taking the Council of Ministers building.
                  12 January Rokhlin set a task to storm the building of the Council of Ministers. An interaction was organized between the units of the 98 Airborne Division and the 74 Motorized Rifle Brigade. A connection was established with the spotters of fire, located on the "candle".
                  This is actually two divisions took one building. Just the same victorious assault. This is approximately from 15 to 20 thousand people per building.
                  Now about the tanks. Rokhlin:
                  "- Можно сказать, что именно артиллерия решила исход первых дней боев, Кириченко (начальник ракетных войск и артиллерии корпуса полковник Василий Кириченко) проявил высочайшее мастерство в управлении ею. Он фактически стал одним из тех, кто спас президента, правительство и министра от позора полного разгрома армии в Грозном."
                  Now about the timing.
                  Only two and a half months after the start of the battles for Grozny, the last area of ​​the city held by Chechen troops came under the control of federal forces.
                  If the Red Army at such a pace would take the cities occupied by the Germans, the Great Patriotic War would last a dozen years.
                  An example from the story.
                  The Kiev offensive operation was carried out from 3 to 13 on November 1943; as a result, Kiev and Zhytomyr were liberated. In just 10 days.
                  Minsk operation (June 29 - July 4 July 1944 years) - 6 days.
                  And this is against the German troops, which the Chechens cannot even compare with in terms of quality and number of weapons.
                  Я, офицер-танкист, был страшно возмущён, когда поступила первая информация о штурме Грозного и полным отрицанием уже имеющегося опыта в СССР. Я посчитал это предательством. И больше не тыкайте меня в БУСВ, война и есть война, когда надо применять не только знания, но и хитрость, смекалку и отвагу. Но при этом брать города не 30-ью танками, как это предложил читатель "Касым" и не шапками закидывать. Весь этот спор только из-за этих 30-и таков "Касым"а достаточных для победоносных баталий.
                  1. vladkavkaz
                    vladkavkaz 18 November 2015 10: 57 New
                    +7
                    Alex_K (3
                    ??????? WHAT TWO divisions ???? Where does this misinformation come from ?? Do you imagine 20 thousand people, in the same building ???
                    19 msd, advancing from the western direction, had 693 msp as part of the reinforced SME and part of the TB, ADN, part of the artillery regiment and part of the engineering, technical and rear support forces, all together constituted a group including the rear, a little more than 2000 people, which you are talking about ??
                    By February 1995, only the Chernorechye area remained behind the gangs; everyone in the remaining areas was cleaned to zero.
                    Therefore, there is no need to write nonsense here, saying that you are poked with your nose in BUSV, just poke so that they do not fight on paper, but understand that it says how to use it on the ground. They learn quickly in the war, I fought and I know about than I say, and the arguments of NOT warring, drawing information not from realities but from words, even Rohlin, not understanding what was happening then, are empty and frankly harmful.
                    The question was not that the units of the Armed Forces could not do something, but that TRIETS sat in the Kremlin, stopping successful operations, allowing the spirits to leave the attack, regroup, receive supplies and money, give the names of the culprits? Berezovsky, did you forget what kind of fruit it was? What position did you hold?
                    Somehow, at one of the meetings, General Troshev was presented with a package, a letter from Dudaev, saying that stop shooting from 24 .00, the issue is resolved with Moscow, the call to the higher headquarters, EXACTLY, the order from Moscow has snuck, so what are you talking about, army of tudes, syudas, ....
                    So they imposed on that Jewish order and until 6 in the morning, beat so that the radio howl stood from the hysteria of a gangster bastard.
                    1. Aleksey_K
                      Aleksey_K 18 November 2015 13: 24 New
                      -8
                      Quote: vladkavkaz
                      ??????? WHAT TWO divisions ???? Where does this misinformation come from ?? Do you imagine 20 thousand people, in the same building ???

                      Дивизия в СССР и в этот период составляла 11-12 тыс. чел. + бригада - вот вам и 15 - 20 тыс чел. Это Вы дезинформацию пишите. И, вообще, научитесь писать русские слова правильно: "успеные операции", "возмолжность" и т.д., а то трудно поверить, что и то, что Вы пишите - правда.
                      Тем более, что для Вас "рохлин" пишется с маленькой буквы, а "Березовский" Вы не забыли написать с большой.

                      On average, the personnel of the deployed motorized rifle division in foreign groups of troops reached 10500-15000 troops, and in the deployed motorized rifle regiment to 2200-2700 14. Motorized rifle regiments in the USSR had no more than 1800 people in the state.
                      So, for example, in Soviet times, the number of Taman divisions ranged from 10-12 thousand people.
                      At the beginning of the 90's there were 77000 people in the Airborne Forces. These are 5 Airborne Divisions and 7 Assault Brigades. The team is a little more than 2000 people. Thus, 5 airborne divisions are 60 thousand people. Count yourself how many people are in a real airborne division.
                      And the building of the Council of Ministers in Grozny was taken by the 98th airborne division and the 74th motorized rifle brigade.
                      1. shasherin.pavel
                        shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 18: 59 New
                        +3
                        Let's be objective, Aleksey K. And for starters, we subtract from the total number of the division a number of posts that are not participating in hostilities on the contact line with the enemy: the division commander, division headquarters, signalmen, sappers who equip the headquarters, division headquarters guards, a special department - let these be people, but they don’t fight, post office, campaign detachment, party organizers (dating back to modern times) veterinarian, convoy, storekeepers, service battalion (bathhouse laundry), repair teams of small arms and artillery, medical staff. And you won’t throw any of them out of the division’s staff, because in the division under 9 000 people fought in the trenches around 3 000. The cavalry division is about 3 000 people. So is the Airborne Division. It also has a headquarters, supply agencies, food supply.
                  2. Aleks tv
                    Aleks tv 18 November 2015 12: 00 New
                    +6
                    Quote: Алексей_К
                    But here is what Rokhlin himself writes:

                    Not everyone has enthusiastic illusions about this person ...
                    I do not have them.

                    By the way, there were no divisions in the Czechs, there were combined regiments and separate battalions (headquarters did not count).
                    There was a meat grinder in the Council of Ministers, as far as I remember, landing and marines were noted there. Vlad (Vladikavkaz), correct if you forgot that.
                    1. vladkavkaz
                      vladkavkaz 18 November 2015 17: 01 New
                      +4
                      Aleks
                      Абсолютно верно,десантура,морпехи и пехота 693 мсп ,сводные батальоны 74 бригады..да кого там только не было..,а не "дивизии", Алексей_К в своем комменте рассказывает штатные численности частей и соединений,а там этого не было ни у кого.
                      At that time I was a KomMSR, as I believe, a full-time MCP for 11 units of an armored personnel carrier 80 or is it rather half a battalion, since in that confusion I commanded two 1 companies, in the end I had 25 armored personnel carriers, Zil 131,3-cng9,3ags-17,25 PC well and every little thing ...
                  3. shasherin.pavel
                    shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 18: 38 New
                    +2
                    А там ничего не писали о том,что в Чечне воевали офицеры одной армии. Чтобы узнать слабые стороны вражеского танка, надо было взять такой танк целым. А здесь противостояли нам выпускники наших училищ и академий. Танки на улицах Грозного выбивали из колодцев: гранатомёт ставился вертикально и управлялся дистанционно. Какой танк может выдержать удар РПГ-7 в днище? Посмотрите в Сирии: есть на Ютюб родик как Т-72 получает на улице семь попаданий из РПГ и уходит пятясь назад. Конечно это может быть исключение из правил, но семь попаданий в упор... вот это исключение из всех правил ведения войны. Только и останется кричать вслед: "Шайтан-арба"!!!
                2. Susul
                  Susul 20 November 2015 10: 47 New
                  0
                  Surely a tank, behind the infantryman’s back, discourages the enemy from shooting at this infantryman.
                  Это как на знаменитом фото, где боец с РПК останавливает грузинскую колонну в Ю. Осетии. Вот только на фото есть боец-"стальное яйцо", а 125мм танковой ствол в отдалении в кадр не попал=)
              2. shasherin.pavel
                shasherin.pavel 17 November 2015 23: 48 New
                +8
                They found something to remember, they drove tanks into Grozny without infantry ... Without a tank, you won’t take the city, only the tank should be used, together with the assault group and the tank landing, of direct cover. You read a little about the Second World War.
              3. Aleks tv
                Aleks tv 18 November 2015 11: 41 New
                +6
                Quote: Алексей_К
                I will say briefly that to take cities you need not 30-thu tanks, but 1000-th, at least. In this case, 30% of the tanks will be burned.

                Surprised by your comments, namesake ...
                request
                No tanks in the city - no way. Everything else is from the evil one.
                The main thing in the city is the RIGHT organization and configuration of the STORM assault units, into which the tanks are part of the FIRE group.
                I described here how we built the Christmas tree in the Czechs. No tanks in it - NO.
                1. Aleksey_K
                  Aleksey_K 18 November 2015 13: 53 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Aleks tv
                  Surprised by your comments, namesake ...

                  A whole front took part in the operation to capture Kiev - 671 thousand people. This is the 38 Army, the 60 Army and the 5 Army Guards Tank Corps (three tank and one motorized rifle brigade). Our losses are the 271 tank and 125 self-propelled guns, while keeping in mind that at that time the Nazis did not have grenade launchers, but only anti-tank guns (guns), with approximately 1000 tanks in the hull. The operation lasted 10 days.
                  Minsk in the 1944 took the 1, 2 and 3 Belarus Fronts. And this is even more soldiers, tanks, artillery and aircraft. The operation lasted 6 days
                  Grozny is a large city filled with militants with grenade launchers, tanks and artillery. It could not be taken with the help of 200 tanks. and so few soldiers. Therefore, I wrote 1000 tanks, based on the experience of World War II.
                  1. Aleks tv
                    Aleks tv 18 November 2015 16: 23 New
                    +5
                    Quote: Алексей_К
                    Grozny is a large city filled with militants with grenade launchers, tanks and artillery. It could not be taken with the help of 200 tanks. and so few soldiers. Therefore, I wrote 1000 tanks, based on the experience of World War II.

                    I repeat -
                    Quote: Aleks tv
                    The main thing in the city is the RIGHT organization and configuration of the STORM assault units, into which the tanks are part of the FIRE group.

                    The organization and configuration of the assault group is the most important issue, plus interaction with the forces of a higher commander.
                    And how many fighters and equipment will be in it depends on the city itself and its features.
                    I’m writing not unfounded.
                    The best groups of our time were created with the Czechs-2. There were not so many vehicles in the four lines of the Christmas tree.
                    1. vladkavkaz
                      vladkavkaz 18 November 2015 17: 04 New
                      +4
                      Aleks tv
                      I confirm.
                      Therefore, there were no losses comparable to the first company in the second.
                      In addition, take for example Duba-yurt, if memory doesn’t change, a cement plant, Shamanov planned, despite the general superiority of spirits in l / s and engineering support, drove from there to hell with minimal loss.
                  2. shasherin.pavel
                    shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 19: 13 New
                    +2
                    Опять вам не вмётся! Потери это такая странная штука, что каждый смотрит на них по своему. Танк Тигр VI Н заводской номер 00003 был взят целёхоньким под Ленинградом и на выставке трофейного оружия в парке Горького, рядом с ним фотографировались маршалы и генералы, но в 1944 году были захвачены документы дивизии, в которой танк числился в зиму 1942-43 года. Так он в документах (танк № 00003) числился находящимся в ремонте. У нас же в потери входил танк попавший в ремонтную бригаду, то есть ушедший с лини соприкосновения с противником. Так же к потеря относились солдаты, попавшие в госпитали. Вы забыли вспомнить о графе "Безвозвратные потери". Но у тут есть исключения: После завершения Сталинградской битвы в строй вернули 647 танков зачисленных в безвозвратные потери во время отступления. Машины остались на оккупированной территории в июле или августе 1942 года, а вернулись в строй в марте 1943 года. Не останавливайтесь на графе потери, найдите после этого графу "Потери безвозвратные" или всегда будете выглядеть ... несколько глупо.
                2. Stena
                  Stena 18 November 2015 17: 40 New
                  0
                  Hello Alexey!
                  Tell me, please, but where can I find out more about this?
                  Thank you very much in advance.
                  1. Aleks tv
                    Aleks tv 18 November 2015 19: 25 New
                    10
                    Quote: Stena
                    Hello Alexey!
                    Tell me, please, but where can I find out more about this?
                    Thank you very much in advance.

                    Good day, Artem.
                    Вы про "елочку"?
                    This is the tactical construction of the assault group's technique.
                    It is always different depending on the tasks.
                    The goal is to provide fire and cover with armor the main SHG force in the city - an infantryman.
                    If possible, the technician is lined up with lines with the MUTUAL MUTUAL cover. Some two years ago I painted it here on the site ...

                    Quote: Aleks tv
                    The main force in the battle in the city is the infantryman.
                    Platoons and squads are divided into assault groups of 3-5 people in each.
                    The equipment performs the functions of fire support and cover.
                    Fighting vehicles are combined into a single fire group under one command.
                    The construction of the "Christmas tree" takes into account the features of the city and the streets and is always individual. The most difficult task when storming avenues with multi-story buildings. In this case, the company tactical group “takes” one street.
                    Cars become in two rows, clinging in order to the houses. No one pokes into the center of the street.
                    The task of the vehicles of the first line of the firing group is the most difficult - they open the firing points, actually taking fire on themselves. The fire sector is cross. Those. the car controls the building on the opposite side of the street in front of another first-line combat vehicle. Accordingly, that machine does the same.
                    Who to put in the head of the Christmas tree? BMP, BTR, MTLB - this is definitely to bury the fighters. The tank is more protected, but its long-barreled gun with the characteristics of a direct-fire gun with a small elevation angle is not always effective in fulfilling a task in an urban environment. BMO-T is good, but practically unarmed.
                    Here BMPT would be useful (there is nothing else in the metal). Unsuitable besides the AGS field here could “clean” the street in front. "Thirty" controlled all the floors of buildings in height. Reservations are appropriate. The use of ATGMs is unlikely. Even if the module is destroyed, the crew is intact. The hull side is protected at the level. Here, in conjunction with the BMPT, it is possible to use a tank, and not to keep it in the second line.
                    In the second line of Christmas trees, BMP-2 vehicles are also possible. They cover the buildings of the opposite street very well in front of the assault groups and insure the windows above the first line of the fire group, but only as second-line cars when they themselves are covered. This is followed by BMP-2 support groups and general reserve vehicles.
                    Those. vehicles of one line are blocked by fire in front and above the second line of combat vehicles. Without clear coherence, the Christmas tree is impossible and even dangerous for one's own.
                    Assault groups operate slightly in front of the first line, around the first line and jump on the floors. The task of the second line is not to confuse the threat with their fighters, installed by PC and LNG-9 in window openings.

                    The second tier is a closed topic. I do not think that it is possible to discuss it on an open site. I’ll say its general meaning - fixing on the occupied territory and ensuring the passage of intersections, storming the squares.
                    A second commander, a battalion commander, leads the second echelon and passage of the intersection.


                    Артем, к сожалению сейчас "не то время", что рассказывать об этом, кхм...более подробно. Все-таки Тактика - это самое главное оружие )))
                    Frets?
                    hi
                    1. Stena
                      Stena 18 November 2015 21: 35 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Aleks tv
                      Frets?

                      Thank you so much!
                      Extremely interesting and informative.
                      Thanks a lot!
                      1. Aleks tv
                        Aleks tv 18 November 2015 22: 24 New
                        +6
                        Quote: Stena
                        Quote: Aleks tv
                        Frets?

                        Thank you so much!
                        Extremely interesting and informative.
                        Thanks a lot!

                        It's my pleasure )))
                        I forgot to add - in the BUSW there are the Basics for constructing such actions.
                        Lisaped has long been invented.
                        A low bow for this to our Grandfathers.
              4. tag
                tag 18 November 2015 12: 58 New
                -6
                The use of armored vehicles in urban combat in a modern war is a massacre! (With what for the tankmen)
                1. vladkavkaz
                  vladkavkaz 18 November 2015 17: 06 New
                  +5
                  ferre
                  Let me be curious about your combat experience and direct participation in battles, is there such a thing?
                  И что вы ,подразумеваете по"майкопской бригадой"?
                  You were there, you saw what was there, do you know the conditions in which the consolidated battalion of Maykopians fell?
                2. Aleks tv
                  Aleks tv 18 November 2015 19: 32 New
                  +5
                  Quote: ferret
                  The use of armored vehicles in urban combat in a modern war is a massacre! (With what for the tankmen)

                  And you yourself, ahem ... were? Or use fashionable stamps?
                  Well - try it yourself, WITHOUT reservation.)))
                  .....
                  And there is no need for the 131 Brigade to drag it like that, okay?
                  Do not disturb Memory of Fighters.
                  We studied with them .................
                  Eheh.
                  1. vladkavkaz
                    vladkavkaz 19 November 2015 17: 37 New
                    0
                    Aleks tv
                    I confirm.
                    Colonel Savin, the commander of the combined brigade group, who died in those battles, did everything he could to save his own.
                    Yes, we really studied.
                    The deputy commander of the 131 brigade, Colonel Kozlov Oleg Aleksandrovich, the former commander of my regiment, after leading the same combined group of the brigade into battle, had no losses, but his spirits were very, very afraid.
            2. aba
              aba 17 November 2015 22: 56 New
              +3
              You say the thing! smile
            3. Susul
              Susul 20 November 2015 10: 43 New
              0
              Where to beat from Tornado? There he took the wrong elevation, got to another country, and even through one =)
              Вот ТОС "Солнцепек" там уже засветились
          3. Good me
            Good me 17 November 2015 21: 23 New
            +3
            Quote: SPACE
            With such rich experience in tank building and combat use of tanks as in the Russian Federation, with modern computer-aided design and modeling methods, as well as with the latest production technologies, tanks and in general all ground combat equipment should be immediately accepted from the first units that left the assembly line weapons and delivered to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for full operation, without any further modifications, bypassing the experimental batch and trial use time ...


            Quote: SPACE
            I do not agree, business dictates its own strict rules, time is money, a chance is given only once and there is absolutely no right to make a mistake at all! Project, manufacturing, assembly, start-up. Experience says that it is possible. Compensate for the emerging scatter of small orders of reality, should be laid down in the basic functions of the machine, i.e. adaptability.


            Но заметьте, к примеру,в автомобилестроении,даже у именитых фирм,что называется,собаку скушавших,при всём опыте,технологиях,компьютерном моделировании и испытательных стендах, при гонке - "новую модель раньше конкурентов",происходят досадные "ляпы", с последующим массовым отзывом "сырых" автомобилей.

            From field tests, there is no escape. And only the fields, troops, soldiers, are able to notice that then, in battle, they can crawl out sideways ...
            1. Susul
              Susul 20 November 2015 10: 57 New
              0
              Unfortunately today, field tests are almost completely abandoned.
              От концепта до конвейера порою проходит менее полугода, почти все ходовые испытания проходят на стендах (особенно у "европейцев")
              Which leads to the problems you described. Up to the stupid situation when not well laid brake hoses about the shock absorber are worn out
          4. crumb
            crumb 18 November 2015 07: 52 New
            0
            Well, you still offer WOT developers a new update to enter the game
            1. Susul
              Susul 20 November 2015 10: 58 New
              0
              No, this is another game already promised at level 10
        5. Vladimir 1964
          Vladimir 1964 17 November 2015 20: 20 New
          +1
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          Well, yes, with the help of crowbar, a sledgehammer and someone's mother. wassat
        6. ksv1973
          ksv1973 17 November 2015 20: 35 New
          +6
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          Do we have little of our dust, sand and heat ?! There, at least to the Astrakhan region or to Kalmykia in July-August. What is not Syria? This is about the break-in.
          Теперь про поводу пристрелки. Машина, дай ей Бог будущего, ещё молодая. Поэтому "пристреливать" её нужно в условиях родного полигона, а не в Сирии. Не дай Бог ошибиться и попасть не по ИГиловским шайтанам, а по нормальным мирным гражданам. Сначала надо отточить весь регламент стрельб на мишенях.
        7. The comment was deleted.
        8. Bronis
          Bronis 17 November 2015 21: 47 New
          +2
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot

          поспешили, любезнейший. "обкатка боем" - это не для первой опытной партии. "Обкатка боем" может иметь место только после: доведения машины до ума (техника - новая, во многом - принципиально новая), разработки методики ее применения, недлежащей подготовки личного состава под нее, да еще и в составе штатного подразделения. а это 2-3 года минимум.
          And besides, with whom should she fight there? With the Abduls? and what to try on them? DZ? wassat
          And most importantly, people. There are tankers there. And who wants to wave a saber with pride - let him go to Syria ... as a volunteer hi
        9. Maxom75
          Maxom75 17 November 2015 21: 48 New
          +1
          For starters, it’s better to capture Amer and Israeli PTKRs and check at your training ground if everything is okay then run in Syria, but not earlier than in a couple of years, while the crews train properly, while they break in. Although, as far as I understand, the T-14 is a breakthrough tank and is created to protect Russia.
          1. shasherin.pavel
            shasherin.pavel 17 November 2015 23: 55 New
            +2
            Quote: Maxom75
            Better to start to buy amerovsky and Israeli PTKR

            Love, everything is just bought. Do not forget that our Tu-4 had American rubber on their chassis. This was the only detail that our industry could not copy and produce. All Tu-4 wore American rubber. All the first Soviet jet aircraft flew on English engines, produced under license. The company did not find buyers for its engines and sold them to the USSR.
        10. Tollann
          Tollann 17 November 2015 22: 04 New
          -1
          just a couple of terrorist attacks and just sent. Yes, more, more ...)
        11. Duke
          Duke 18 November 2015 00: 50 New
          +4

          Recall that for the first time the general public was shown the newest tanks during a parade in honor of the 70 anniversary of the Victory. Tanks X-14 "Armata" marched through Red Square. After that, a film about the latest Russian tank was presented on Zvezda TV channel with a demonstration of its main features.

          1. Disant
            Disant 18 November 2015 03: 11 New
            +6
            I see that an electromagnetic impulse in the form of a nuclear explosion (at a distance of several kilometers) or a projectile (assault rifle, air-to-ground missiles, landmines)) equipped with an EMP generator that exploded even at a distance of up to 50-60 meters will damage all electronics. It’s criminal to make fully robotic machines, as the chief designer speaks of. the crew should be able to melee and fire, without the participation of diodes, transistors, resistors. T-14 should be like an AK automatic.
            1. shasherin.pavel
              shasherin.pavel 18 November 2015 20: 26 New
              +1
              Quote: Disant
              will disable all electronics

              А вот я удивляюсь: для амёров над нашей базой в Сирии "пузырь" где электроника не работает или даёт сбои, а наши внутри этого "пузыря" работают.Это же как дышать в воде без акваланга.
            2. kostolom45
              kostolom45 19 November 2015 15: 25 New
              0
              Of course, the military does not know about the Faraday cage. Burns out with amy CIVIL electronics, military - at least henna ...
              1. Susul
                Susul 20 November 2015 11: 05 New
                0
                Well, why, not all electronics can be crammed into a Faraday cage.
                All phased antennas and all kinds of communications can take decent damage.
            3. Susul
              Susul 20 November 2015 11: 01 New
              0
              A tank is the most protected vehicle from any type of electromagnetic radiation and radiation exposure. Only external modules will burn, and all that under thick armor and in a shielded power winding will remain working.
              It is hoped that the surveillance cameras in the T-14 is a consumable
        12. MolGro
          MolGro 18 November 2015 03: 17 New
          +2
          t90 is already there)
          PS until the sample passes the test of MO they will not be released for war!
          1. chinArmy
            chinArmy 19 November 2015 03: 37 New
            -1
            Quote: MolGro
            t90 is already there)
            PS until the sample passes the test of MO they will not be released for war!


            God, who is this big-bellied over there ?! What kind of disgrace is this ?! Is it an army in general, or a sanatorium ??

            Who allowed the bubbles to grow? He won’t get into any takka or even wring out - his hands won’t reach the floor

            I also fastened the vest
        13. Shuttle
          Shuttle 18 November 2015 10: 17 New
          +3
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          I do not agree.
          T-14 is not a lone fighter.
          The tank is generally a collective weapon. And the modern tank is even more so.
          For exposure to dust, heat and other extreme conditions, there are less costly, more effective and absolutely safe methods.
          What is there to check? MSA? Alone, without the rest of the infrastructure? This is not Wargaming!
        14. Aleks tv
          Aleks tv 18 November 2015 12: 43 New
          +3
          Quote: Baikonur
          In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

          Why the hell to drag a concept into the database area?
          Then we’ll put the rembats there and place a branch of the UVZ design bureau in tents with a couple of workshops.
          And also to ask the spirits to conduct a war on a schedule, and to compile a record of credited hits and misses. It is necessary to agree with the bearded on the termination of the database in the event of the breakdown of the experimental machine, in order to find the cause on the spot.
          And so forth ...

          The transfer of the experimental batch to 20 vehicles to the troops indicates the beginning of the stage military tests and climate.
          Something I did not hear about the end of state tests ...
          So they decided to COMBINE two actions - in a hurry.
          А когда "спешат" это не всегда айс.

          It is necessary that Armata go into the series not raw, as the first batches of the T-64 did in their time.
          Good luck to Mazut on trials.
      2. 79807420129
        79807420129 17 November 2015 19: 20 New
        10
        Well, that’s the process, great news.
      3. GSH-18
        GSH-18 18 November 2015 00: 29 New
        +2
        20 T-14 Armata tanks prepared for transfer to troops

        Very good news! With an initiative. We need more of these tanks. The process has begun! good
      4. Serafim-k
        Serafim-k 18 November 2015 04: 17 New
        +1
        Quote: cniza
        Today is a day of good news, for the beginning and development of new technology is already not bad.

        Gut-Gut chicken pecking a grain .. drinks
      5. edge
        edge 18 November 2015 07: 31 New
        0
        Quote: cniza
        Today is a good news day

        the ice has broken comrades assessors, this is already an industrial series, give BTV a new look and old traditions
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. gans_sp
      gans_sp 17 November 2015 19: 03 New
      40
      Figs knows where there is beauty, I think the tower will be redrawn.)) For my taste, the T90 is much more beautiful.
      1. figwam
        figwam 17 November 2015 19: 10 New
        41
        Quote: gans_sp
        Figs knows where there is beauty, I think the tower will be redrawn.)) For my taste, the T90 is much more beautiful.

        I like this...
        1. gans_sp
          gans_sp 17 November 2015 19: 18 New
          +5
          No, the content, I am sure, is at the right level and the modernization reserve with such a layout should be. But damn ugly with the current casing). Over time, pile.
          1. AUL
            AUL 17 November 2015 19: 24 New
            15
            A beautiful tank is the one that completed the combat mission and remained intact. And nice forms are for Porsches and other Lexuses.
            1. gans_sp
              gans_sp 17 November 2015 20: 03 New
              +5
              Хочется процитировать А.Н. Туполева "Хорошо летают только красивые самолеты".)) Но спор ниочём,красиво-некрасиво,брюнетки-блондинки.
          2. Nasty
            Nasty 17 November 2015 19: 39 New
            -2
            I think this form of tower is something like a stealth.
          3. Oleg 91
            Oleg 91 17 November 2015 20: 42 New
            +3
            Quote: gans_sp
            But damn ugly with the current casing)


            You know everyone has their own criteria of beauty) For example, I like it.
          4. just exp
            just exp 17 November 2015 20: 45 New
            0
            I also like a fantasy render more. but the engineers decided in their own way and they have reasons for this.
      2. Simon
        Simon 17 November 2015 19: 11 New
        +8
        We need tanks neither ugly, but not punctured, not visible by locators and with powerful weapons. So they not only fight in parades, but also have to fight.
      3. monah10
        monah10 17 November 2015 19: 11 New
        +8
        Look at the T-90 without a body kit. And here protection is thrown for photo shoots. And in battle, which tank will admire?
      4. Cartman
        Cartman 17 November 2015 20: 40 New
        +3
        if you remove all the canopies from the t90 tower, it will look like is-3 :))
      5. ksv1973
        ksv1973 17 November 2015 20: 47 New
        +8
        Quote: gans_sp
        Figs knows where there is beauty, I think the tower will be redrawn.)) For my taste, the T90 is much more beautiful.

        Man, you take a big risk.
        With similar thoughts to yours that I expressed here about the rationality of the T-14 tower on the eve of the 70 anniversary of the Victory, I had a mouth full of boogers! laughing
        Although I still think that the one that was demonstrated on Red Square under the guise of T-14 has nothing to do (in the sense of a tower) with the THAT that will be in operation in our own Armed Forces, God bless them with health and less mediocrity in higher command staff! hi
      6. The comment was deleted.
      7. Awaz
        Awaz 17 November 2015 21: 29 New
        +3
        I completely agree . T 90 is almost the perfect example of a modern tank. In any case, the appearance. I think that the tower will be changed in any case
    4. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 17 November 2015 19: 08 New
      0
      Quote: Vladimir
      It is very pleasing that the process of entering the troops has begun.

      ну скажем не в войска...но всё равно,главное "процесс идёт"...
      1. mirag2
        mirag2 17 November 2015 19: 15 New
        10
        Well, things ... Literally every minute amazing news ... On the one hand, it was lucky at such a time to live, interesting.
      2. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 17 November 2015 19: 42 New
        +8
        yes what kind of stupid people then? military tests, not deliveries to the troops! fool
        1. Paranoid50
          Paranoid50 17 November 2015 20: 26 New
          +5
          Quote: Andrey Yurievich
          military tests, not deliveries to the troops!

          Само собой,в войска позже. Ведь по итогам этих испытаний по-любому будет доводка,что-то изменят,что-то добавят или уберут. Никто не будет "сырую" машину "в строй" ставить. Отраден же сам факт поставки РЕАЛЬНЫХ машин на РЕАЛЬНЫЕ испытания. Не прошло и двух недель... Это я к тому, что менее двух недель тому назад один "эксперт" из "поколения WOT" пол-часа вещал мне о том,что "всё-муляж", видео - фейк и, вообще сама идея - тупиковая. На всякий случай спросив по поводу лучшего танка современности,я почему-то не удивился,когда он назвал... ну да, "Оплот". Осень. Бывает... P.S. Ждём испытания и их итоги.
    5. kodxnumx
      kodxnumx 17 November 2015 19: 20 New
      +2
      So they waited! This is great news, I wonder where they will be deployed.
    6. major124
      major124 17 November 2015 19: 20 New
      0
      The shape of the tower is not very .... high ...
    7. Tor5
      Tor5 17 November 2015 19: 29 New
      +3
      Great news! This is not a rivet box at a factory in Kharkov!
    8. gispanec
      gispanec 17 November 2015 19: 32 New
      +7
      Quote: Vladimir
      Beautiful car.

      not at all beautiful ..... just very good and probably excellent in combat use, but not beautiful ...
    9. vell.65
      vell.65 17 November 2015 19: 35 New
      +4
      Beautiful, but raw and brought to mind will be more than one year.
    10. demo
      demo 17 November 2015 19: 56 New
      0
      А кто визжал что "Армата" из картона!?
      1. ksv1973
        ksv1973 17 November 2015 21: 12 New
        +1
        Quote: demo
        А кто визжал что "Армата" из картона!?

        Ну вот он я, один из "визжащих". И "визжал" ЗДЕСЬ по этому поводу незадолго до крайнего Парада Победы. Посмотрите на башню на фото к статье - только ВНИМАТЕЛЬНО ПОСМОТРИТЕ. Сплошная маскировка и отсыл (по некоторым нюансам) к Pz 2 и Pz 3.
        А теперь попробуйте увеличить фото. Попробовали? И что видим? Кроме как "ерундой" такую форму башни для танка XXI-го века назвать нельзя. Для Парада, для запудривания мозгов наших потенциальных "партнёров" можно простить эту маленькую фанерную хитрость.
        I am sure that the real tower at the T-14 will be much more aesthetically pleasing.
        With which I bow! hi
    11. andranick
      andranick 17 November 2015 20: 53 New
      +3
      Quote: Vladimir
      Visually, it will look more harmonious with the 152 mm barrel

      Ну да, тюнех наше фсё! Катки на 20", траки с низким профилем еще поставить, ваще огонь будет :)))
      1. ksv1973
        ksv1973 17 November 2015 21: 18 New
        +2
        Quote: andranick
        Quote: Vladimir
        Visually, it will look more harmonious with the 152 mm barrel

        Ну да, тюнех наше фсё! Катки на 20", траки с низким профилем еще поставить, ваще огонь будет :)))

        They forgot about the anti-wing, my friend! hi
        И не мешало бы "прокачать", а ещё лучше - заменить, штатную аудио-систему. Ну что такое, как можно жить без сабвуфера?! crying
      2. The comment was deleted.
    12. Dimka off
      Dimka off 17 November 2015 21: 27 New
      0
      Quote: Vladimir
      Visually, it will look more harmonious with the 152 mm barrel

      да и не только визуально) Мощность будет тоже получше "смотреться на этом танке" smile We are waiting when they deliver)
      1. magician
        magician 17 November 2015 22: 59 New
        0
        a 152mm gun was developed under it, rather after testing in the troops or subsequent modernization.
      2. magician
        magician 17 November 2015 23: 00 New
        0
        a 152mm gun was developed and tested for it. Rather, they will install it during modernization.
    13. mvg
      mvg 17 November 2015 21: 27 New
      +3
      belay Вкусы у людей разные.. Я, когда в первый раз увидел, подумал, что конструкторам-дизайнерам плохую травку привозили.. Понятно, что "стелс", ну там много граней, плоскостей, всякие наклоны, трапеции.. Но даже Абраша смотрится эстетом. F-117 поставили на гусеницы.. Да еще и с "утра", без утреннего припудривания.. и "нарисую себе личико".
      152 mm, these are new BOPSs. Do you propose to launch 125 matches in the second wave? (T-90MS, T-72B3). And the ammunition will be 25-30 rounds.
      PS: And anyway, designers just bring vodka and ask them to make at least a false cap on top, like on type 99A2
      1. gans_sp
        gans_sp 17 November 2015 21: 41 New
        +2
        God be with him, with stealth, some kind of bulletproof casing should be (more beautiful)). And then the shaitan with the PKK will knock all nishtyaks and there is no KAZ.
    14. Awaz
      Awaz 17 November 2015 21: 27 New
      +5
      Well, about beauty and aesthetics, I would argue. I hope all the same that finally the tank will really please the eye. What we saw at the parade is hard to call beautiful. Always all the equipment in the USSR was outwardly pleasing to the eye, simple and concise, with the exception of some monsters that had sunk into oblivion.
      I didn’t see anything beautiful in the tank. I would like to take a look at how it will be developed at the training ground and what conclusions will be drawn.
      1. ksv1973
        ksv1973 17 November 2015 21: 39 New
        +1
        Quote: AwaZ
        ... I would like to take a look at how it will be developed at the training ground and what conclusions will be drawn.

        But THIS is the main thing !!! hi
        Without this, a tank is not a tank.
      2. The comment was deleted.
    15. shasherin.pavel
      shasherin.pavel 17 November 2015 23: 26 New
      0
      Quote: Vladimir
      Visually she is with
      155 mm caliber. It would not be a problem to put a rifled 152 mm, we have them, but the adoption of the 155-mm smooth barrel is slowed down, apparently.
    16. The comment was deleted.
    17. edge
      edge 18 November 2015 07: 29 New
      +1
      Quote: Vladimir
      Beautiful car. Visually, it will look more harmonious with a 152 mm barrel, but still beautiful.

      придется уменьшать б/к.ну а для 152 мм существует "коалиция" в нескольких вариантах
    18. Alexey-74
      Alexey-74 18 November 2015 09: 38 New
      0
      Great news, I hope all tests will be successful and we will finally see the arrival of the T-14 into the troops already as serial
    19. rBo3qb
      rBo3qb 18 November 2015 16: 42 New
      0
      There is something to please foreign partners
    20. Benya krik
      Benya krik 18 November 2015 22: 16 New
      0
      Цитата:" Визуально она со 152 мм стволом гармоничнее смотреться будет" так для этого, вроде как " коалиция" есть ...
    21. complete zero
      complete zero 18 November 2015 23: 30 New
      +1
      I don’t know what, apparently, I don’t like the turnover?))) Yes, God bless him, the main thing is that the tank be good
  2. kebeskin
    kebeskin 17 November 2015 18: 59 New
    +8
    Quickly. More to them. Now the situation is such in the world that many new models of equipment are categorically necessary in the troops.
    1. kil 31
      kil 31 17 November 2015 19: 05 New
      +9
      We can assume that the tanks are in order. At the factory, they drove them to their love and tail and mane. If they are transferred to the army, then the tanks withstood all the bullying of the factory workers. Now the crews will train.
      1. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 17 November 2015 19: 10 New
        10
        Quote: keel 31
        At the factory, they drove them to their love and tail and mane. If they are transferred to the army, then the tanks withstood all the bullying of the factory workers.

        "издевательства" сейчас начнутся.опытная партия,на то и опытная...
        1. AUL
          AUL 17 November 2015 19: 29 New
          +8
          The party went not to the troops, but to military trials - and these are two big differences!
          1. vorobey
            vorobey 17 November 2015 19: 44 New
            +3
            Quote: AUL
            The party went not to the troops, but to military trials - and these are two big differences!


            quote..
            В сообщении говорится, что партия состоит из 20 единиц новейшей бронетехники, которую готовят к передаче в войска в ближайшее время. РИА Новости приводит заявление представителя оборонного предприятия Вячеслава Халитова, являющегося гендиректором по спецтехнике "Уралвагонзавода":


            We have made a pilot batch of Armata tanks from 20, now they are at the plant and are preparing to be transferred to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation.
          2. aviator65
            aviator65 17 November 2015 19: 55 New
            +1
            Quote: AUL
            The party went not to the troops, but to military trials - and these are two big differences!

            Вот именно! Тот же Т-64 сколько до ума доводили? Между прочим тоже был в своё время революционной машиной. Поэтому, наверное не стоит "скорей бы в войска! fellow ". Слишком уж сложный и дорогой аппарат. Тут тщательнее надо! А в войска должна поступить уже реально готовая к боевому применению машина. Иначе всё выльется в непомерный "геморрой" и "головную боль" для танкистов.
        2. vorobey
          vorobey 17 November 2015 19: 42 New
          +2
          Quote: Andrew Y.
          Quote: keel 31
          At the factory, they drove them to their love and tail and mane. If they are transferred to the army, then the tanks withstood all the bullying of the factory workers.

          "издевательства" сейчас начнутся.опытная партия,на то и опытная...


          but where are those 14 that were at the parade? request
          1. Andrey Yuryevich
            Andrey Yuryevich 17 November 2015 19: 52 New
            +2
            Quote: vorobey
            but where are those 14 that were at the parade?

            Hi Sanya hi they were brought back to Tagil, it is possible that they are among these 20 wink
      2. Koshak
        Koshak 17 November 2015 19: 18 New
        +2
        Quote: Kil 31
        We can assume that the tanks are in order. At the factory, they drove them to their love and tail and mane. If they are transferred to the army, then the tanks withstood all the bullying of the factory workers. Now the crews will train.

        This batch is most likely intended for military trials.
    2. monah10
      monah10 17 November 2015 19: 05 New
      +1
      Moreover, in the Amy of New Russia and Syria. What a dream.
  3. Strezhevchanin
    Strezhevchanin 17 November 2015 19: 01 New
    +1
    Running in, we’ll find out more soon.
  4. Kars
    Kars 17 November 2015 19: 01 New
    27
    The Chinese stamped faster than the BM hit.
    1. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 17 November 2015 19: 12 New
      +1
      Quote: Kars
      The Chinese stamped faster than the BM hit.

      you already have? Hey Ya! hi
      1. Kars
        Kars 17 November 2015 21: 49 New
        +8
        Quote: Andrey Yurievich
        you already have?

        It will be vryatli, unless someone gives it. I personally do not believe that in this form it will go into series. The minimum gun on the 152 mm will be changed.
        In the meantime, I had a new goal - the first tank, I will save)) after the revolution .. dignity .. it's hard))
        1. Paranoid50
          Paranoid50 17 November 2015 22: 21 New
          +3
          Quote: Kars
          In the meantime, I had a new goal - the first tank, I will save)) p

          Масштаб 1:35? У меня таких два: "самец" и "самка",правда в 72м масштабе.
          1. Kars
            Kars 17 November 2015 22: 31 New
            +3
            Quote: Paranoid50
            Scale 1: 35?

            Yes, I haven’t seen one in 35 before.
    2. figwam
      figwam 17 November 2015 19: 15 New
      +1
      Quote: Kars
      The Chinese stamped faster than the BM hit.

      Well, if China, then saw, saw and saw again.
      1. tomket
        tomket 17 November 2015 19: 45 New
        +3
        Quote: figvam
        Well, if China, then saw, saw and saw again.

        Just China is now in the business of modeling ahead of the rest.
        1. figwam
          figwam 17 November 2015 19: 55 New
          +1
          Do not tell), all models from China have deviations, errors and require a long peeling.
    3. Nagaibak
      Nagaibak 17 November 2015 19: 31 New
      +2
      =Kars"Китайцы наштамповали быстрее чем в войска БМ попала."
      This they can!))))
    4. Albert1988
      Albert1988 17 November 2015 19: 41 New
      +1
      Quote: Kars
      The Chinese stamped faster than the BM hit.

      Хм... Скорее всего будет туча неточностей и искажения пропорций... Конечно это моё субъективное мнение, но ко всем китайцам, кроме "Трампов" имею некоторые подозрения...

      Так что буду ждать, когда "Трампетер" выпустит))))
      1. Maksus
        Maksus 17 November 2015 19: 59 New
        +2
        Вся сила в Dragon'е! Хотя Трамп неплох, но попроще будет. А по нашей технике сейчас Моделколлекта рулит, хотя Армату у них явно пьяный одноглазый криворукий слесарь делал)
        1. Albert1988
          Albert1988 17 November 2015 20: 25 New
          0
          Quote: Maksus
          Вся сила в Dragon'е! Хотя Трамп неплох, но попроще будет.

          I somehow didn’t notice the difference in the level of performance, although I judged by several different things - I have Trumpov’s MSTA-S from armored vehicles, my friend has the Dragon royal tiger — if you compare the quality, then it’s one level.
      2. figwam
        figwam 17 November 2015 19: 59 New
        +1
        Trumpeter is also kosyachny, I suffered with him.
        1. Albert1988
          Albert1988 17 November 2015 20: 24 New
          0
          Quote: figvam
          Trumpeter is also kosyachny, I suffered with him.

          How to say - I have Trump's MSTA, Moscow, Richelieu - everything is gorgeous, in Moscow even photo-etching of radar gratings is included directly in the set, except that for Richelieu with the Civil Code and generally trunks, I took rolled trunks to it (in general, from the Frenchman Tramp’s study is almost better than that of Tirpitz from Revel (!), but for everything else - the parts fit perfectly, there are no gaps, the detail is at the level, so everything is fine, I think they will work well, and Kars wrote below that there Meng agreed with UVZ, this is also good)))
      3. Paranoid50
        Paranoid50 17 November 2015 22: 24 New
        +4
        Выпустил Моделколлект,к новому году ждём от "ТАНКИ МИРА.КОЛЛЕКЦИЯ". Кстати, и в правду китайцы накосорезили: башня вообще не в размер.
        1. tomket
          tomket 18 November 2015 00: 02 New
          +1
          Quote: Paranoid50
          к новому году ждём от "ТАНКИ МИРА.КОЛЛЕКЦИЯ".

          Завидую вам откровенно. В связи с сокращением объемов данная радость к нам не попадет. Как и другие из серии. к новому году разве что "Волгарь" порадует.
    5. vorobey
      vorobey 17 November 2015 19: 45 New
      +3
      Quote: Kars
      The Chinese stamped faster than the BM hit.


      Hello missing ... how alive is healthy. drinks
      1. Kars
        Kars 17 November 2015 19: 53 New
        +4
        All hi

        Quote: Andrey Yurievich
        you already have?

        No, no.
        Quote: vorobey
        how alive is healthy

        slowly
        Quote: tomket
        Just China is now in the business of modeling ahead of the rest.

        That’s for sure, they turned my hobby into horror, horror as much as everything, and how much you want, and where they were three years ago))))

        Quote: Albert1988
        Так что буду ждать, когда "Трампетер" выпустит))))

        Then it’s better to wait for Meng, they have concluded a cooperation agreement with UVZ.
        1. Maksus
          Maksus 17 November 2015 20: 01 New
          +1
          These in 35, it seems? That would be in 72m, ehhh.
        2. Albert1988
          Albert1988 17 November 2015 20: 21 New
          0
          Quote: Kars
          Then it’s better to wait for Meng, they have concluded a cooperation agreement with UVZ.

          Good news, Meng is still serious.
        3. Per se.
          Per se. 17 November 2015 21: 22 New
          +3
          Карс, рад лицезреть живого и, надеюсь, здорового! За что "разжаловали", однако? Было решил, что призвали на самоходку, для неблагодарного дела, рад, если это не так и, что "воскрес" на сайте. С уважением.
          1. Kars
            Kars 17 November 2015 21: 30 New
            +4
            Quote: Per se.
            ыло решил, что призвали на самоходку, для неблагодарного дела, рад, если это не так и, что "воскрес" на сайте. С уважением.

            hi
            It’s a pity the function used to show who is online on the site. It would be clear that I’m here all the time.
        4. tomket
          tomket 17 November 2015 23: 58 New
          0
          Quote: Kars
          That’s for sure, they turned my hobby into horror, horror as much as everything, and how much you want, and where they were three years ago))))

          Вообще сейчас с данным хобби ужас. Если год назад от "Звезды" нос воротил, куда уж она родимая от меня денется, то теперь она засосала по самую маковку. Да и закосяченные модели при сборке или покраске теперь стоят в очереди на более качественную проработку. Уж слишком дорогое удовольствие стало в мусорное ведро отправлять даже закосяченную "пантерку" от Звезды в 1:72.
  5. ejov1976
    ejov1976 17 November 2015 19: 01 New
    +6
    Send them all to Assad, everything with them will immediately become obvious.
    1. Strezhevchanin
      Strezhevchanin 17 November 2015 19: 06 New
      +9
      Quote: ejov1976
      Send them all to Assad, everything with them will immediately become obvious.

      Can I bring the remnants of the caliphate to the Alabino training ground?
  6. viktor561
    viktor561 17 November 2015 19: 02 New
    +5
    Каждый день радуют - то новые катера и корабли - то ударные вертолеты - теперь долгожданный -Т-14 "Армата"!!!!!
  7. Terrible_L.
    Terrible_L. 17 November 2015 19: 03 New
    +2
    good news in the evening smile
  8. Egor123
    Egor123 17 November 2015 19: 04 New
    +2
    Well, now let's look at her in action! wink
  9. figwam
    figwam 17 November 2015 19: 06 New
    +4
    People do business, good luck!
  10. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 17 November 2015 19: 12 New
    +2
    Немцы догонять и перегонять собрались ... Они хоть знают , что такое "пятилетка в три года" ? fellow
    In general, the world is changing rapidly, they are already chasing us. When the states will catch up with us by means of electronic warfare, I wonder? That's where they are in flight specifically.
  11. bannik
    bannik 17 November 2015 19: 13 New
    +5
    Ждём-с фейков с окраины - "танковые батальоны России оснащённые "Арматами" воюют на востоке Украины".
    PS: I won’t be surprised.
    1. aviator65
      aviator65 17 November 2015 20: 00 New
      +3
      So they were already burnt there in packs of RPGs! fellow Only annoyance: for some reason, all the mobile phones were suddenly discharged, and the pictures did not work out. lol
      1. bannik
        bannik 17 November 2015 20: 18 New
        0
        Yes, they’ll draw right now. And on / in the outskirts, and in Syria, and ..., well, where they say, they will draw there. The main thing is that they paid pennies for dint!
  12. NEXUS
    NEXUS 17 November 2015 19: 15 New
    +6
    And there you look and live to see the big series. Did it seem to me alone that somehow everything happened quickly and soon?
    1. bannik
      bannik 17 November 2015 19: 55 New
      0
      Cross - it seemed! Personally, I was waiting!
  13. tinibar
    tinibar 17 November 2015 19: 16 New
    +3
    Quote: Vladimir
    Beautiful car. Visually, it will look more harmonious with a 152 mm barrel, but still beautiful.
    It is very pleasing that the process of entering the troops has begun. Good luck!!!

    Yes, I really want to see the 152 mm Armata!
    1. Albert1988
      Albert1988 17 November 2015 19: 43 New
      +2
      Quote: tinibar
      Yes, I really want to see the 152 mm Armata!

      Ничего - мы и "простой" Т-14 года 3 ждали, и со 152мм орудием годик-другой подождём))))
      1. Per se.
        Per se. 17 November 2015 21: 33 New
        +3
        Quote: Albert1988
        and wait a year or two with the 152mm gun))))
        If it were not for the well-known company in the leadership of the Moscow Region, including Popovkin and Postnikov, we would have received a super tank with an 152 mm gun for mass production already in the 2010-2011 year. In the photo, one of the options for the T-95 with the 152 mm 2A83 gun, on the side of the turret you can see the 30 mm automatic gun 2A42 (to save 152 mm shells for secondary purposes). The operating time did not disappear, most likely the tower on the T-14 will soon be different, like the gun.
        1. onix757
          onix757 17 November 2015 21: 38 New
          +1
          It seems that they didn’t bother at Uralvagonzavod, they dusted off the Soviet project and voila
          1. Albert1988
            Albert1988 17 November 2015 22: 20 New
            0
            Quote: onix757
            It seems that they didn’t bother at Uralvagonzavod, they dusted off the Soviet project and voila

            Ну а что? Все основные решения отработаны на Объекте 195, хотя советским его назвать трудно - да, его начали в 1988 году, но большая часть работ была выполнена уже после перестройки, так 2 опытных образца (утверждается что их именно 2) были собраны в начале 2000-х. А так Т-14 - это фактически реализация тех же идей, что были воплощены в 195-ом, на платформе "армата"...
          2. Per se.
            Per se. 17 November 2015 23: 55 New
            -3
            Quote: onix757
            dust off the Soviet project and voila
            Не "вуаля", приспособили корпус для перебрасывания движка вперёд-назад из-за заморочек на "платформу", на довольно дорогом шасси. Стоило ли это того, другой вопрос, но потеряли почти пять лет, плюс на ОКРы и НИОКРы вложили ещё 64 миллиарда рублей. Если Т-95 уже прошёл Государственные испытания к 2010 году, то "платформу" получили в ещё сыром виде лишь к маю 2015 года и со 125 мм пушкой, угол подъёма которой, в представленной башне, вызывает вопросы. Если Т-95 обвиняли в дороговизне (оценивался где-то в 450 миллионов рублей) и проблемности для освоения срочниками, то Т-14 в цене мало сбавил, а для срочников, судя по всему, вообще недоступен. Насколько нужна тяжёлая БМП Т-15, и стоило ли ради неё насиловать конструкцию танка, так же вопрос, как и целесообразность размена новой и дорогой танковой базы на перспективы строительства на ней мостоукладчиков, эвакуационно-ремонтных машин, САУ и так далее, что давно решалось на освоенном и надёжном шасси Т-72/Т-90. Остаётся ждать доводки Т-14, после испытаний уже в войсках.
            1. Albert1988
              Albert1988 18 November 2015 08: 36 New
              +1
              Quote: Per se.
              with a 125 mm cannon, the elevation angle of which, in the presented tower, raises questions

              И какие же вопросы он вызывает? И главное почему - вы так и не пояснили... У кого действительно угол вертикального отклонения орудия вызывал вопросы, и то - отрицательный угол - так это у старого доброго "чёрного орла"...
              1. Per se.
                Per se. 18 November 2015 10: 59 New
                0
                Quote: Albert1988
                And what questions does he raise?
                The pumping angle of the 2A83 gun on the T-95 in the vertical plane, at its height, was greater than on the T-72, T-90 tanks. Of course, in this case, my opinion will be purely subjective, but on the T-14, with the tower presented, the positive angle of vertical guidance of the 125 mm gun looks less than that of the T-95. Maybe I'm wrong, enlighten if you know.
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 18 November 2015 11: 43 New
                  0
                  Quote: Per se.
                  The angle of pumping of the 2A83 gun on the T-95 in the vertical plane, at its height, was greater than on the T-72, T-90 tanks.

                  And the height of the T-14 tower is less than the object 195? And if less, how much? And here’s what - basically the height of the tower affects the negative angle - because there is more space to raise the breech bar up, as for the positive angle - then everything is not so obvious, but if you derive a direct relationship between the vertical angle of deviation of the gun and the height of the tank’s tower, just search the Internet for photos of the moment when the tankman walked around the car during its parking in one of the streets in Moscow before the parade, or watch the video, you have a photo of object 195, which people are sitting on, so you can approximately Compare the height of the towers of both cars.
                  А в свою очередь подброшу вам другую фотку - это фотка опытной учтановки "голого" боевого модуля от объекта 195 с 2А83 на шасси т-72 - посмотрите - башня не такая уж и высокая (особенно если учесть размеры орудия)
                  1. Per se.
                    Per se. 18 November 2015 12: 40 New
                    0
                    Quote: Albert1988
                    А в свою очередь подброшу вам другую фотку - это фотка опытной учтановки "голого" боевого модуля от объекта 195 с 2А83 на шасси т-72 - посмотрите - башня не такая уж и высокая
                    Above there is a photo of the T-95, imagine for yourself the comparison of the T-95 and T-14 towers. The lower the gun’s barrel is in the tower, the more problematic are the positive angles of its vertical guidance. In this sense, the existing T-14 tower raises questions. There is no complete information for comparison, there is no point in arguing about this, I just expressed my opinion here, no more.
                    1. Albert1988
                      Albert1988 18 November 2015 13: 10 New
                      0
                      Quote: Per se.
                      Above there is a photo of the T-95, you yourself think in comparison the T-95 and T-14 tower.

                      So I wondered many times already - they are almost the same height, which by the way was not the only one that raised questions for me, because as many point out at 195, the height of the tower was primarily dictated by the size of the guns.
                      Quote: Per se.
                      The lower the gun’s barrel is in the tower, the more problematic are the positive angles of its vertical guidance. In this sense, the existing T-14 tower raises questions.

                      На этот счёт есть весьма правдоподобное предположение, что у Т-14 башня получилась несколько "утопленной" в корпус относительно того же объекта 195 из-за толстой брони в верхней полусфере, кстати если сравнить высоту корпуса у 195-го и Т-14 то явно видно что корпус у Т-14 немного выше, хотя общая высота машин примерно одинакова.
                      But you are certainly right - as long as there is no accurate information (it is pleasing that our secrets have not been forgotten), so it remains only to wait for its wider access.
        2. Albert1988
          Albert1988 17 November 2015 22: 16 New
          +1
          Quote: Per se.
          If it were not for the well-known company in the leadership of the Moscow Region, including Popovkin and Postnikov, we would get a super tank with a 152 mm gun for mass production already in 2010-2011

          Это вряд ли, у Объекта 195 ("Т-95 его назвала какая-то израильская газетёнка а наши подхватили) было множество недостатков, в том числе неимоверная цена и проблемы с электроникой. В связи с чем, видимо и решили, что лучше реализовать этот проект без 152мм дуры и на универсальной платформе, хотя без интриг, конечно же не обошлось, увы...
          1. Per se.
            Per se. 18 November 2015 00: 14 New
            0
            Quote: Albert1988
            T-95 some Israeli newspaperwoman called him and ours picked up
            Не израильская газетёнка, а министр обороны Игорь Сергеев. Кстати, как отмечалось, на него танк произвёл сильное впечатление, и машина должна была пойти в серию, после устранения отдельных замечаний (гос. испытания, повторю, танк прошёл). Проблемы с электроникой и сейчас проблемы, это у нас общее. Проект без "152 мм дуры", по большому счёту, теряет всё, ради чего и огород этот городили, создавая супертанк с полностью необитаемой башней, именно, из-за этой "дуры". Со 125 мм пушкой намного лучше было решение, что применили в "Черном орле" (кстати, предполагалась и установка более мощной пушки). Как видно на схеме, в нём намного просторнее, а в тесную капсулу выделен не экипаж, а автомат заряжания, при значительном усилении защиты экипажа, в более комфортном объёме, при разнесённых местах членов экипажа. Вообще, взять и обанкротить Омский танковый завод, это преступление, как и обгадить Т-80, потенциал которого может поспорить с Т-90. "Чёрный орёл" был новой машиной от Т-80, но "Орла" изначально рассматривало тогдашнее руководство МО, только в экспортной ипостаси, заинтересуйся им забугорные покупатели. Если интересно, всё это есть и в свободном доступе, почитайте и подумайте о мотивациях капитализма. Схема "Чёрного орла" взята из описания патента на него.
            1. Albert1988
              Albert1988 18 November 2015 08: 26 New
              +1
              Quote: Per se.
              Not an Israeli newspaper, but Defense Minister Igor Sergeyev.

              Сергеев ушёл в отставку в 1998 году, тогда в металле Объект 195 толком ещё не существовал. так что произвести впечатление на него мог разве что его проект, более того становится не очень понятно, о каком танке он говорил ещё и потому, что тогда омичи активно продвигали свой "чёрный орёл".
              Quote: Per se.
              Проект без "152 мм дуры", по большому счёту, теряет всё, ради чего и огород этот городили,

              Вовсе нет, пушка в 152 мм была установлена на объект 195 исключительно по настоятельному требованию куратора проекта от МО генерала Маева, который, кстати говоря, мотивировал это тем. что мол натовцы могут оснастить свои леопарды и абрамсы 140 мм орудиями и нам надо заранее добиться превосходства. Тем не менее, технологии не стоят на месте, и той огневой мощи, которая тогда достигалась только увеличением калибра, сейчас можно достичь и без этого, улучшая характеристики "маленького" 125 мм снаряда и баллистику 125 мм орудия. Стоит отметить, что для 152 мм однозначно придётся разворачивать мощные производства новых снарядов, а 125 мм 2А82 хотя и имеет новую линейку более длинных (900мм) снарядов, но может использовать и старые 125 мм (700мм) снаряды, которых на складах туча. Установка же 140 мм орудий на лео и абраши с треском провалилась. Более того - наше МО от проекта со 152 мм орудием не отказалось - заявляли официально, благо 2А83 уже давно разработана и вроде бы как доведена до ума. И потом - дело не только в пушке, например, у 195-го была очень слабая защита верхней полусферы, у Т-14 там очень приличная броня, у 195-го было простое днище, у Т-14 (и арматы в принципе) - оно U-образное (хорошо показали в "военной приёмке"), и это только малая часть недостатков объекта 195, которые во многом и склонили чашу весов в пользу арматы.
              Quote: Per se.
              Со 125 мм пушкой намного лучше было решение, что применили в "Черном орле"

              А вот не сказать - "орёл" по сути был проектом "переделки" Т-80, более того, омчане тогда были в таком состоянии. что только макет смогли построить - всё что показано на схеме - в металле не существовало, ибо башня была у "орла" что называется "фанерной" с муляжами приборов, омчане тогда продемонстрировали машину и просили денег на производство полноценного опытного образца, но в 1997 году, понятно, денег не было, тем более ещё было непонятно, что получится, ибо, как вы сами сказали, капитализм предполагает в первую очередь получение прибыли, а когда у вас нет хотя бы полноценного прототипа, то оценить риски практически невозможно.
              1. Per se.
                Per se. 18 November 2015 11: 29 New
                0
                Quote: Albert1988
                Sergeev resigned in the 1998 year, then in the metal the 195 Object really did not exist yet. so only his project could impress him
                Сергеев был министром обороны до 28 марта 2001 года, а "объект 195" был ему представлен при посещении УВЗ в 2000 году, именно Сергеев и вывел танк из понятия "объект" в название Т-95. Можно согласиться, что ресурс пушки 2А83 ниже, что снаряды нужны, так по этой логике, и старых танков больше. Нет смысла спорить, что Т-14 более поздняя и современная модель, грех, если бы на ней ничего не улучшили. Склонить чашу весов в пользу Т-14 ничего не могло, на момент заявления господином Поповкиным о прекращении финансирования практически готового Т-95 (апрель, 2010 года), "Арматы" не существовало. Про фанерную башню на "Орле", тогда и ходовая была шестикатковая, от Т-80, это эпизод на тогдашней выставке. Позднее, "Черный орёл" демонстрировался на семикатковом, родном по проекту, шасси, и уже без всякой "фанеры".
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 18 November 2015 11: 52 New
                  0
                  As for the Minister of Defense, he may have been dismissed by 2001, but only a competent military man will never call the experimental machine the name of the serial, this is the lot of illiterate journalists, usually.
                  Что же касается "орла" то, честно признаюсь, про демонстрацию его башни на 6-тикатковом шасси не знаю - ни одной фотографии в сети нет, но его "родное" семикатковое шасси тоже нельзя назвать полноценно родным, ибо по сути это было перепиленное шасси Т-80 - просто удлинённое на 1 каток, также как в случае МСТА-С удлинили шасси Т-72, в результате таких вот вещей естественно страдает развесовка, что в случае танка весьма критично, и более того - этот же аграгат, тот что на 7-ми катках также имел "фанерную" башню - я имею ввиду. что для него не было готово не прицелов соответствующих, ни конвеерного АЗ, ни БИУСа, ни новой ДЗ, которой лоб башни должен был быть обвешен - башня была полным макетом, хотя да - орудие было настоящим, только вот стрелять это всё не могло... А так да - всё естественно из металла выполнено...
                  1. Per se.
                    Per se. 18 November 2015 12: 46 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Albert1988
                    As for the Minister of Defense, he may have been dismissed by 2001, but only a competent military man will never call the experimental machine the name of the serial, this is the lot of illiterate journalists, usually.
                    Есть такое мнение, что за это и отправили в отставку. Сергееву показали натурный образец. Сам танк разрабатывался давно, создание новой машины было итогом разработки перспективного проекта танка Советского Союза, начатой в рамках конкурса НИР "Совершенствование-88" (1988 год). По "Орлу" могу Вам показать фото, с шестикатковым вариантом, по остальному воздержусь пока от комментариев.
                    1. Albert1988
                      Albert1988 18 November 2015 13: 05 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Per se.
                      There is an opinion that they dismissed for this.

                      Only for one is unlikely, although anything can be ...
                      Quote: Per se.
                      Сам танк разрабатывался давно, создание новой машины было итогом разработки перспективного проекта танка Советского Союза, начатой в рамках конкурса НИР "Совершенствование-88" (1988 год).

                      Вы какой танк имеете ввиду? "Чёрный орёл" который? Если он, то в рамках проекта "совершенствование 1988" он не разрабатывался - омичи действительно представили глубокую модернизацию Т-80, но всё же она была не настолько радикальной, как "чёрный орёл", который родился позднее, уже в 90-е, а что касается длины шасси - то, к сожалению, машины обе сфотканы не в профиль, так что определить на глаз трудно - но на второй фотографии где 6 катков промежутки между катками смотрятся гораздо больше, чем на первой, где катков 7, а значит можно предполагать, что 6-тикатковое шасси его тоже было удлиннено, но без добавления дополнительных катков (как у МСТА-С кстати!), а в более позднем варианте добавили седьмой каток для улучшения ходовых качеств.
                      1. Per se.
                        Per se. 18 November 2015 22: 37 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Albert1988
                        Which tank do you mean?
                        Имею ввиду танк Т-95 (объект 195). В своё время всё так запутали, перемешали, Т-95, "Чёрный орёл", Т-90М, плюс масса фантазий технического дизайна, что не приходиться удивляться. Думаю, Вы заблуждаетесь насчёт того, что на "Орле" банально удлинили базу, как на самоходке, корпус похож на Т-80, но это уже не то же самое. Фото кликабельно.
                      2. Per se.
                        Per se. 18 November 2015 22: 41 New
                        +1
                        Можно ещё по рисунку посмотреть. Есть (по крайней мере было) описание танка "Чёрный орёл" в патенте на него. Если интересно, наберите в поисковике.
                      3. Albert1988
                        Albert1988 18 November 2015 22: 52 New
                        +1
                        Проблема тут в том, что как раз самого корпуса и не видно, хотя судя по фотке комментом выше - ВЛД точь в точь как у Т-80, то же относится и к навесной броне на ВЛД - один в один с Т-80УД, как и бортовые экраны (хотя они у Т-80УД короче были), тоиливные баки в надгусеничных нишах тоже один в один с Т-80, но это всё обвес, его могли и сатрый поставить. Хотя видно что отсек двигателя стал значительно больше, но вот то что ВЛД такая же. как у стандартной 80-ки и даже "декольте" присутствует - то можно предположить, что корпус стад длиннее за счёт увеличения размеров МТО.
                      4. Per se.
                        Per se. 19 November 2015 11: 54 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Albert1988
                        The VLD is exactly like the T-80, the same applies to the hinged armor on the VLD - one on one with the T-80UD, like the side screens (although they were shorter on the T-80UD), there are also one loading tanks in the fenders one with the T-80
                        Это вполне естественно, "Орёл" дальнейшее развитие. Поинтересуйтесь ещё такой машиной, как Т-80У-М1 "Барс". По "Орлу", гусеница "Черного орла" аналогична Т-80 по конструкции, но слегка шире. Подвеска танка независимая торсионная с гидроамортизаторами. "Орёл" имеет удлиненный корпус с усиленной бронезащитой. Конфигурация лобовой части корпуса существенно изменена. Рабочее место механика-водителя расположено теперь не под люком, а за ним, что повышает защиту и улучшает эргономику. Почитайте ещё http://btvt.narod.ru/3/640/640.htm
                      5. Albert1988
                        Albert1988 19 November 2015 12: 57 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Per se.
                        Поинтересуйтесь ещё такой машиной, как Т-80У-М1 "Барс".

                        The leopard was a very interesting car, mainly due to the installation of the arena (actually, if I don’t confuse anything, it was tested on it), although as for me. so it was necessary to develop something similar for the T-72, for the T-80 for obvious reasons was decommissioned, and the T-72 remained the main machine.
                        Quote: Per se.
                        The configuration of the frontal part of the body is significantly changed.

                        Прошёл по вашей ссылке и на представленных там схемах не заметил никаких существенных изменений именно в лобовой части - та самая ослабланная зона "декольте" сохранилась в полном объёме, наклон ВЛД и НЛД точь в точь как у простого Т-80, и на схеме кстати хорошо видно, что водилу отодвинули назад не сильно, хотя это вряд ли на что-то повлияет, "декольте" осталось, так что если спереди что прилетит "удачно", то всё, разве что с бортов ему защиту добавили, что, конечно, хорошо. Так что корпус, судя по представленным чертежам, есть действительно просто удлинённый корпус 80-ки, а вот башня его - да, заслуживает пристального внимания - ибо можно увидеть, что верхняя полусфера очень хорошо бронирована, плюс сверху устанавливается КАЗ (у меня складывается вчепятление, что и верхнюю полусферу он будет прикрывать, а не только боковые проекции). Если честно я представлял, что наТ-14 будет стоять башня такого типа.
                      6. Per se.
                        Per se. 19 November 2015 21: 04 New
                        +1
                        Думаю, Вам будет интересно (если раньше не читали эту статью), статья "Современные танки России", - http://militaryexp.com/statyi/0005.html . All the best.
  • AlexTires
    AlexTires 17 November 2015 19: 17 New
    +2
    Ничего себе пополнение - целых 20 новейших танков! Чувствую, Запад сейчас не на шутку перепугаются - там ведь до сих пор обсуждают нашу "Армату" и её возможности! И ведь это всего лишь первая опытно-промышленная партия!
    1. NEXUS
      NEXUS 17 November 2015 19: 21 New
      +3
      Quote: AlexTires
      Ничего себе пополнение - целых 20 новейших танков! Чувствую, Запад сейчас не на шутку перепугаются - там ведь до сих пор обсуждают нашу "Армату" и её возможности! И ведь это всего лишь первая опытно-промышленная партия!

      So I think that something similar will happen with the PAK FA ... they say that 12 cars will be released, but in reality ... well, God forbid, we have more and faster such cars. Something started to accelerate ... I just can’t get rid of this sensation.
      1. g1v2
        g1v2 17 November 2015 19: 38 New
        12
        We live in an interesting time. Over these 2 years of events happened - like 20 years before. Every month, like a compressed year. Politics, economics, wars, sports, etc. There are so many in total that sometimes I sit and get sick. And the most important thing in the other - so that this all happens, the preparation was carried out over the last 5 years at least. And we saw only a drop from all this. Contracts, diplomacy, technology projects, factories, public debt payments, military doctrine, food security doctrine, military reform, etc., etc. And all this so that when I come home from work I sit with a sagging jaw and stupidly be proud of the country. wassat
    2. gladcu2
      gladcu2 17 November 2015 22: 49 New
      +1
      AlexTires

      Yeah. The West cannot enter Armata so far in AW.

      And here already 20 pieces were sent to the troops.
  • Wild_grey_wolf
    Wild_grey_wolf 17 November 2015 19: 17 New
    +3
    An unexpected message, direct progress is so significant, the school of tank building is felt.
  • erased
    erased 17 November 2015 19: 18 New
    11
    While the Russian army is preparing to accept tanks, ISIS accepts gifts from aviation. They probably like it ...

    1. Wild_grey_wolf
      Wild_grey_wolf 18 November 2015 08: 04 New
      +1
      Now they’ll understand what the real VKS look like, otherwise they seized the old plane and threatened that they would go to Russia. They are probably not far away and they think all states look like they have in Africa. One military plane and you are the god of heaven)))
  • UVB
    UVB 17 November 2015 19: 21 New
    +1
    Quote: gans_sp
    Figs knows where there is beauty, I think the tower will be redrawn.)) For my taste, the T90 is much more beautiful.

    My opinion, what we saw at the parade is camouflage so that no one would guess wink We will probably see the true face with real deliveries to the troops.
    1. Wild_grey_wolf
      Wild_grey_wolf 18 November 2015 08: 07 New
      +1
      so that the T90 version appears, which now, how long it took, new technologies, materials, and appearance will be worked out now, this is the basic PLATFORM design for technologies, now it doesn’t look like that, tomorrow it’s different - it seems like more than once was written about it PLATFORM - DESIGNER ...
  • marinier
    marinier 17 November 2015 19: 24 New
    -4
    West is definitely joyful. Post-admission Russia !!!
    Hotelos, it’s only a tactic, technical characteristics, familiarization.
    For example, the composition of the crew, speed, armor thickness, etc., etc.
    In my opinion a worthy tank.
    1. Halfunra
      Halfunra 17 November 2015 19: 29 New
      +5
      On mine the same! good hi
    2. AUL
      AUL 17 November 2015 19: 46 New
      10
      marinier, you are not tired of es4o vanat Valat? The Vedas and the Hesik are understood, the 4th Russian Iazik is your native. A bit is beaten on the passport of the V and the Dutch officer eats, but here you have four of the Russians, the foreigner will not be so mean. So 4to do not need a humpback to the wall sculpts and pontovatsia! Buy yourself a Russian claudia and write normally! crying
    3. Ramzaj99
      Ramzaj99 17 November 2015 19: 48 New
      +2
      Quote: marinier
      I wanted to, it’s only a tactical, technical description, familiarization. For example, the composition of the crew, speed, armor thickness, etc., etc. In my opinion, a worthy tank.

      That's all that is known. https://youtu.be/TCGdvMkDlVc
      The rest is a state secret. And the coming years, are not going to disclose)))))
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. Ajent cho
      Ajent cho 17 November 2015 20: 13 New
      +2
      Hotelos, it’s only a tactic, technical characteristics, familiarization.
      Respected marinier! First of all, I want to say that your Russian language is very good. But it’s somewhat strange to hear from the Dutchman (or am I mistaken?) So many praises addressed to Russia. We are quite sharp and straightforward people, excuse me - the climatic conditions are such.
      Could you have been a Cossack in terms of deriving characteristics?
      1. andj61
        andj61 17 November 2015 20: 25 New
        +5
        Quote: Ajent Cho
        Could you have been a Cossack in terms of deriving characteristics?

        Yes, he just takes part in the exercises!
        NATO’s largest military exercises over the past decade will be held in Italy, Spain, and Portugal. The maneuvers will be attended by 36 thousand soldiers from more than 30 countries, as well as 200 aircraft and 50 warships, reports RIA Novosti on Saturday, October 3 ...
        The scenario of the exercises provides for the involvement of all components of modern combat operations, including missile defense, counteraction to cyber attacks, actions in the conditions of a "hybrid war" and propaganda activities. Work on social networks will also be part of the exercises: a struggle will be worked out not only against a conditional opponent, but also against “real opponents”.http://lenta.ru/news/2015/10/03/nato/

        This message appeared on November 3, and Anthony registered on November 2. Symbolically, isn't it? repeat
    6. Wild_grey_wolf
      Wild_grey_wolf 18 November 2015 08: 10 New
      +1
      Go to the UralVagonZavod to you there and conduct a tour and show and tell everyone.
  • Sorokin
    Sorokin 17 November 2015 19: 27 New
    0
    Shebutnye you all, We have enough to wave.
  • GELEZNII_KAPUT
    GELEZNII_KAPUT 17 November 2015 19: 28 New
    0
    belay not a frail plant poppy ... belay good drinks
  • BARKHAN
    BARKHAN 17 November 2015 19: 31 New
    +9
    Tanks should work only in cooperation with other units, infantry, artillery, aviation, electronic warfare, reconnaissance ... And all these components must undergo combat cobbling together at training ranges and at different levels. Only professionally trained personnel should fight on modern equipment.
    Many who have not served in the army and are not aware of the importance (and sometimes the existence) of the supply of troops, how important and difficult it is. Often it is the supply problems that negate all other efforts.
    So that you can’t throw Armata into any Syria or Donbass. Even the best tanks in the world without support and in crooked hands will be burned very quickly.
    1. edmed
      edmed 18 November 2015 05: 15 New
      0
      Quote: Barkhan
      .Even the best tanks in the world without support and in crooked hands will be burned very quickly.

      Да ,это еще ладно,если просто уничтожены,вспомним Даманский,подбитый Т-62, несмотря на все попытки уничтожить его, есть утверждения что решение применить "Грады",помимо всего прочего стала 62-ка,или снять интересные "вкусняшки" дзаофани их умыкнули.
      1. BARKHAN
        BARKHAN 18 November 2015 10: 04 New
        +3
        Well, yes. You are right. And this is also the case. We have enough old equipment that is well known to the Syrians, that’s enough.
        But to be honest ... and it costs money, so ours must explain this to Assad in advance.
        And that is a historical example of Egyptian throwing between the USSR and the USA.
  • prawdawsegda
    prawdawsegda 17 November 2015 19: 32 New
    +6
    With tanks established. Rather, it is necessary to establish machine tools! In the meantime, THANKS for the work of those who created Armata !!!
    1. cergey51046
      cergey51046 17 November 2015 20: 28 New
      0
      The emphasis should be on missiles and mines, and tanks, some for a change.
    2. cergey51046
      cergey51046 17 November 2015 20: 28 New
      0
      The emphasis should be on missiles and mines, and tanks, some for a change.
  • Whowhy
    Whowhy 17 November 2015 19: 38 New
    -15
    And what's so beautiful ??? Full cadet! I don’t know anything about fighting qualities, but such a hoopoe cannot be a good tank, at least cut me ... request
    1. NEXUS
      NEXUS 17 November 2015 19: 44 New
      +5
      Quote: whowhy
      And what's so beautiful ??? Full cadet! I don’t know anything about fighting qualities, but such a hoopoe cannot be a good tank, at least cut me ... request

      Armata was not created in order to impress girls' clubs. And every bend and every complex is where it is needed. Today, all experts admit it, Armata is the most advanced tank in the world, with the best gun and the latest armor.
    2. AUL
      AUL 17 November 2015 20: 31 New
      +6
      Whowhy
      And what's so beautiful ??? Full cadet! I don’t know anything about fighting qualities, but such a hoopoe cannot be a good tank, at least cut me ... request

      Persuaded! We’ll kill for Christmas!wink
    3. Darkoff
      Darkoff 17 November 2015 20: 38 New
      +3
      What is the logic? Explain, please!
      The design of the tower is made exclusively in a practical manner, taking into account the placement of internal equipment and its maintenance, using stealth technologies, deepening external equipment into the armor niches for better preservation is a completely new solution.
      What does it like, don’t like it?
  • Shadowcat
    Shadowcat 17 November 2015 19: 42 New
    +2
    Nezhdanchik - here and the tests have begun ... large-scale ...
  • Gormenghast
    Gormenghast 17 November 2015 19: 44 New
    +3
    Какое счастье, что Уралвагонзавод не обанкротили эффективные менеджеры; что еще совсем недавно было реальным риском. Этим "cash flow managers" наплевать на то, что завод работает на оборону. Видимо, это те же самые деятели, которые АПЛ и самолеты резали на металлолом, по заказу госдепа (и за его деньги), и в качестве металлолома потом продавали "by weight".
  • t0x1c
    t0x1c 17 November 2015 19: 48 New
    +2
    To Syria for testing!)))
    1. cergey51046
      cergey51046 17 November 2015 20: 25 New
      +1
      It is not necessary to Syria, in our country there are many similar places.
      1. Thunderbolt
        Thunderbolt 17 November 2015 23: 24 New
        +1
        Quote: t0x1c
        To Syria for testing!)))
        And why not parachute parachute landing right on the green lawn in front of the White House? The whole experimental batch fellow!!! Неплохой козырь в "Большой Игре" bully
  • Diviz
    Diviz 17 November 2015 19: 48 New
    +1
    Faster would put a 152mm gun and tested a mini caliber or mini x56.
  • Old26
    Old26 17 November 2015 19: 50 New
    +3
    Quote: Vladimir
    It is very pleasing that the process of entering the troops has begun. Good luck!!!

    The troops put for military trials. This is not a series ...

    Quote: keel 31
    If they are transferred to the army, then the tanks withstood all the bullying of the factory workers. Now the crews will train.

    Now the tail and mane will be driven in the troops. In various climatic zones. This is not a supply to the troops
  • Old26
    Old26 17 November 2015 20: 00 New
    +1
    Quote: Baikonur
    In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

    With an experienced one, this can be done on our territory, rather than dragging a prototype HZ where, especially in a combat zone, not knowing how the engine, suspension, armor will behave ...
  • BULLIT
    BULLIT 17 November 2015 20: 01 New
    -7
    Damn the good news! To Syria for a test drive! It would help to identify weaknesses against a potential enemy! But I just don’t like the look !!! Well, he’s very kind of not kazy! Our campaign in Russia is like this! What about cars, what about tanks! Where the hell is futur design ???
    1. tatarin_ru
      tatarin_ru 17 November 2015 22: 50 New
      +1
      Quote: BULLIT
      But I just don’t like the look !!! Well, very much he is somehow not kazy!


      Look at the design of the latest developments (tanks of the latest generation), there are enough similar features (ugliness). These are modern technologies.
      This is a new generation of tanks, you need to get used to the design, a little time and it will become beautiful. As a girl fall in love, the most beautiful in the world, whoever says anything.
    2. Wild_grey_wolf
      Wild_grey_wolf 18 November 2015 08: 16 New
      +1
      As you imagine it, an experimental tank and to Syria for tests and where there is a potential enemy. . . everything has been tested for a long time and the platform will be involved in conjunction with other platforms. What to test how shoots? You can also test at the landfill, dust sand was tested and tested on other tanks, etc. . .
  • Maksus
    Maksus 17 November 2015 20: 03 New
    +2
    20 pieces are two companies. One will apparently be in the north, one in the south. Logically - SKVO and VVO. It’s unlikely that the Finnish and Norwegian ZVs are too close, and some are already close to NATO, others are marked.
    1. Thunderbolt
      Thunderbolt 17 November 2015 23: 41 New
      0
      Quote: Maksus
      By logic - SKVO and VBOs.
      В ВВО ну никак нельзя.Там китайцы "бдят" soldier )))
  • Old26
    Old26 17 November 2015 20: 05 New
    +1
    Quote: BULLIT
    Damn the good news! To Syria for a test drive! It would help to identify weaknesses against a potential enemy!

    Or maybe you should not put the cart in front of the horse? Military trials have not yet begun, and some ardent zealots are already talking about sending to Syria.
    Well, they will send him to Syria. And in battles for some city X, they will be sadanut into it from an ATGM. What `s next? Can you first test it with us, see how the active defense will work, shoot it with blanks, and only then, after half a year or a year, think about sending it somewhere ???
    1. Wild_grey_wolf
      Wild_grey_wolf 18 November 2015 08: 20 New
      +1
      You don’t have to send anywhere, he is testing about it here. Six months is a very short time.
  • cergey51046
    cergey51046 17 November 2015 20: 22 New
    +1
    Such events delight and inspire confidence in the future.
  • Denis Skiff
    Denis Skiff 17 November 2015 20: 36 New
    +1
    Quote: SPACE
    Quote: Baikonur
    In Syria, try at least one prototype! Run in and shoot In dust, sand, heat! May reveal flaws, hang something!

    And yet, your own testing ground is much more efficient, and test conditions can be created in a wide variety of ways.
    Z.Y. Promptly. With such rich experience in tank building and combat use of tanks as in the Russian Federation, with modern computer-aided design and modeling methods, as well as with the latest production technologies, tanks and in general all ground combat equipment should be immediately accepted from the first units that left the assembly line weapons and delivered to the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for full operation, without any further modifications, bypassing the experimental batch and trial use time ... Wash it all goes.

    Drive him in the heat in the sand and cold in the woods. Yes, at a distance of a thousand kilometers under its own power.
  • v.yegorov
    v.yegorov 17 November 2015 20: 50 New
    +2
    Finally, they began to catch up with us, and not us. More often so.
  • Val_y
    Val_y 17 November 2015 21: 11 New
    +1
    Quote: Sterlya
    It will give a lot. Yes, even developers (not the main ones) in the tank!

    Так и делается, японцы в 1944 создали эскадрилью (22-й сентай) из ки-84 "Хаяте" из заводских испытателей, которые таких чертей навешали на антату, что америкосов с бритами обратно чуть не погнали в Индию и на Бирму. А затем его перебросили на Филиппины и Окинаву. Так что...
  • HaKim
    HaKim 17 November 2015 21: 11 New
    +2
    It looks pretty, and its characteristics are not bad!
  • seyvon
    seyvon 17 November 2015 21: 18 New
    +1
    the news is good!
  • iouris
    iouris 17 November 2015 21: 22 New
    0
    You can march through Iraq-Iran to the eastern border of Syria in order to demonstrate high performance characteristics in practice.
  • shinobi
    shinobi 17 November 2015 21: 26 New
    +1
    Ну вот,теперь уже серьёзная "доработка напильником" начнётся. Полигон конечно замечательно,но обкатка девайса солдатом совсем другие нагрузки. Причём в идеале обкатывать срочниками.То что срочник нможет сотворить не всякое КБ додумается.И получится крепкая машина с заделом лет на 30 по модернизации.
  • Cympak
    Cympak 17 November 2015 21: 26 New
    +2
    Вопрос к любителям "длинней и толще": чем 152-мм подкалиберный снаряд отличается о 125-мм подкалиберного снаряда?
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 18 November 2015 13: 42 New
      +1
      For the sub-caliber it does not make sense to increase the gun
      from 125 to 152. But the 152 mm cumm. projectile makes sense
      create. With such a caliber, it will be equal in power
      with anti-tank missiles.
  • Forest
    Forest 17 November 2015 21: 29 New
    +1
    The main test will be - when something breaks in the tank and all the repairmen of the battalion + mechvody come to repair the machine using the experimental pump.
  • Cympak
    Cympak 17 November 2015 21: 31 New
    +1
    And one more question haunts me: what will a 152-mm projectile give to a tank if (as tank biathlon shows) from a 125-mm cannon cannot get into a stationary target?
    1. Albert1988
      Albert1988 17 November 2015 22: 32 New
      0
      Quote: Cympak
      And one more question haunts me: what will a 152-mm projectile give to a tank if (as tank biathlon shows) from a 125-mm cannon cannot get into a stationary target?

      Let it be known to you that the caliber of the gun does not affect its accuracy, it is affected by slightly different characteristics, both of the gun itself and of the sights that are used to aim this gun, and given that the biathlon is solid T-72 with antediluvian sights ...
  • Mikhail Krapivin
    Mikhail Krapivin 17 November 2015 21: 33 New
    +2
    Quote: Vladimir
    Beautiful car!


    И это радует. Как говорил Туполев - "хорошо летать будет только красивый самолёт".
  • KnightRider
    KnightRider 17 November 2015 22: 21 New
    +4
    Handsome tank! Photography can not always convey this beauty and power, it’s better to watch the video, and even better - live soldier
    1. BARKHAN
      BARKHAN 18 November 2015 09: 58 New
      +5
      And I like the look ... but unusual, you need to get used to it ...
      Но это не впервые.Такие же ощущения наверно были при переходе с винтовых на реактивные самолёты,с парусных на паровые суда...Всегда народ делился на "правильных" и "не правильных".
      And the effectiveness of this sample will be shown only by practice.
  • Amakc
    Amakc 17 November 2015 22: 23 New
    +1
    The main thing is that now that the production and fitting process has begun, oil tanks and gas warfare will not end ...
  • WU 37
    WU 37 17 November 2015 23: 42 New
    +1
    Beautifully and efficiently executed equipment, and especially the military one, causes RAPTURE !!!
  • Sinbad
    Sinbad 17 November 2015 23: 49 New
    +7
    I tried T34, on T44 - I drove once behind the levers, T54, T55, T62 - in the training, although the main one - T64. He served on the T72. Ah, in old age, on Armata would ride!
    1. Wild_grey_wolf
      Wild_grey_wolf 18 November 2015 14: 41 New
      +1
      What a wealth of experience you have, Respect to you.
  • exalex2
    exalex2 18 November 2015 00: 08 New
    0
    «Мы сделали опытно-промышленную партию из примерно 20 танков «Армата», в настоящее время они находятся на предприятии и готовятся к передаче в Вооруженные силы РФ», – приводит слова Халитова РИА «Новости».http://vz.ru/news/2015/11/17/778608.html . Так пишет газета "Взгляд". Из примерно это сколько? От одного до двадцати.
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