F-35 first tested the gun in the air

In the US, at the Edwards Air Force Base (California), the X-NUMX-generation F-5 Lightning II multi-purpose aircraft tested its 35-mm gun in the air for the first time, reports Rossiyskaya Gazeta with a link to the Flightglobal resource.

The first tests were not spectacular and very modest. According to the publication, “test pilot Major Charles Tricky made one turn from 22 shots and two from 30 from the integrated four-barreled gun GAU-60 / A. The shooting itself lasted a few seconds.

Resource notes that "the developers of F-35 against the background of the unceasing criticism of the fighter tried to" demonstrate the progress in equipping the aircraft, which they were able to achieve. Hence, apparently, and the publication of the video with the test, laid out in the network for a wide view.

“It turns out that there is some progress. The ground tests of the guns were completed before the deadline, and the air tests began earlier than the originally planned date, ”the newspaper says ironically.

The intention to abandon the purchase of F-35 previously announced the new Prime Minister of Canada Justin Trudeau. The Pentagon has already considered that because of the demarche of the neighbors, the American economy will not receive at least $ 65 million in profits.

Comments

[Irokez]

Yes, even if she broke or the penguin would crumble from her.
Damn how much they test and bring, and only tested the gun.

[just exp]

it is worth recognizing that all the same, not only the gun, they tested some of the weapons back in 2013.

[Major Yurik]

The Yankees aviators wanted to come true, before the gun flew separately, and the airplane separately! Praise the Pentagon, now they fly together, luck however!

[Temples]

The intention to refuse to purchase F-35 was previously announced by the new Prime Minister of Canada Justin Trudeau. The Pentagon has already decided that because of the demarche of neighbors, the US economy will receive at least $ 65 million.

Canadians only wanted to buy a tail for 65 million?
Today, every F-35 costs $ 138 million.

[Maxom75]

Do not confuse profit and cost! In the US defense industry, the cost of development includes kickbacks to the military, senators and congressmen, a bunch of different commissions and lobbyists. All these "respected and influential people" love to eat very much. In your opinion, perhaps the F-22 is called gold? It costs exactly as much as the same weight of gold costs, well, at least at the time of release. You can laugh a lot, but our T-50 has not yet been adopted for service, and oh, how we need it.

[beer-youk]

Well, they took the F-35 into service. So what? Flies with a creak, only learning to shoot. Maybe it was worth bringing to mind and adopting a fully ready unit? Therefore, the T-50 has not yet been accepted. VKS RF semi-finished products are not needed.

[NEXUS]

Quote: beer-youk

Well, they took the F-35 into service.

State test F-35 did not pass. Therefore, there is no adoption.

[abrakadabre]

You tell Microsoft this. And then they first sell each operating system, and then another ten years shoals in the program code finish with all sorts of service packs and updates.

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: Temples

Today, every F-35 costs $ 138 million.

Why is that?

Lockheed Martin received a contract for the 9th lot for the production of 55 F-35 Joint Strike Fighter fighters in the amount of $ 5,37 billion, defensenews.com reports on November 3.
The lot includes 41 F-35A fighters (26 for the US Air Force, six for Norway, seven for Israel and two for Japan), 12 F-35B (six for the United States Air Force and six for the United Kingdom) and two F-35C (US Navy) . Aircraft must be delivered until December 2017 (en.wikipedia.org reports that the cost of one F-35A without an engine is $ 98 million, F-35B - 104 million, F-35C - 116 million - approx. Military Parity) .
It is reported that some of the work will be performed by companies in other countries, of which 20% will be in the UK (Wharton) and 5% in Japan (Nagoya).

[Asadullah]

it is worth recognizing that all the same, not only the gun, they tested some of the weapons back in 2013.

If possible, in more detail. And then it is surprising to me, I understand that the Gatling principle does not need special advertising. but still, to sell two years of weapons, and after shooting him once more? I do not understand.

[i80186]

Quote: Asadullah

If possible, in more detail. And then it is surprising to me, I understand that the Gatling principle does not need special advertising. but still, to sell two years of weapons, and after shooting him once more? I do not understand.

The engine - he needs oxygen, not powder gases. Sometimes engines just stall. Well, the controllability of the aircraft when shooting also plays a role, the return is still.
Here is a quote.
However, during the flight firing tests of the GAU-1974A gun mounted on the A-8A aircraft (in March 10), abnormal operation of the aircraft engines caused by the ingress of powder gases generated during firing was detected three times. (C)

[Prapor-527]

Quote: i80186

abnormal operation of aircraft engines caused by the ingress of powder gases generated during firing. (FROM)

Surge however ...

[Stena]

Quote: i80186

The engine - he needs oxygen, not powder gases. Sometimes engines just stall. Well, the controllability of the aircraft when shooting also plays a role, the return is still

This is called - "surge", if my memory serves me. Our MIG-9 engines stalled when fired from guns. Then we figured out what was the matter - now everything is normal (with ours, I mean) ...

[just exp]

they tested rockets and bombs earlier, in 2012 and 2013. the trials were successful.

[NEXUS]

Quote: just EXPL

they tested rockets and bombs earlier, in 2012 and 2013. the trials were successful.

Separately, it can do everything well, but together with all the systems and in all modes, everything will go smoothly. The big question is how many people will find hemorrhoids before the series (the last ICG). So we’ll see that the Americans will give birth there.
Sincerely.

[just exp]

Errors and shortcomings will be on serial, eliminate.

[kotvov]

errors and shortcomings will be on serial, eliminate. ,,
and all that you know, tell us better about the F-117. about how successful it is and where it went.

[just exp]

and why is he not successful? he has an excellent percentage of targets destroyed and only 1 shot down per thousand sorties.
and they replaced him because he was no longer satisfied because the raptor who was going to replace him was significantly better than him.

[NEXUS]

Quote: just explo

and why is he not successful? he has an excellent percentage of targets destroyed and only 1 shot down per thousand sorties.

F-117 was used against whom, remind me? The enemy had modern air defense, air force and so on?
What serious enemy were these bombers used against?

[just exp]

and not recall how these "Papuans" in Iraq "landed" a bunch of other planes? but they could not shoot down the nighthock, and even in Serbia it was shot down because of the overconfidence of the United States, the nighthock flew without cover along the same route.

[Asadullah]

and why is he not successful?

Absolutely not maneuverable. Other cars coped with the same tasks, no worse. The stealth is relative, it is suitable to bomb Honduras, or Congo. By the way, after a lane in Yugoslavia, they instantly stopped flying there. Because after launching a rocket from the ground, the pilot can immediately leave the board.

[just exp]

in other wars, a bunch of planes are lost, nighthock lost times.
and the fact that it is not maneuverable is essentially a bomber, not a fighter, despite the letter F in the name, the warthog is also not su-35, but it was a very efficient aircraft.

[Pimply]

Quote: just explo

in other wars, a bunch of planes are lost, nighthock lost times.
and the fact that it is not maneuverable is essentially a bomber, not a fighter, despite the letter F in the name, the warthog is also not su-35, but it was a very efficient aircraft.

Well, about the F-15 and F-16 losses in the battles were not fixed, as far as I remember

[just exp]

were, and Turkey and Greece, and other countries.
if you are talking about the United States, you shot down both, at least in the same Iraq in both companies, it’s another matter that the F-15 was not shot down by the enemy in an air battle. and air defense shot down him, F-16 and was shot down in air battles.

[Pimply]

Quote: just explo

F-15 was not shot down by the enemy in a dogfight. and air defense shot down him, F-16 and was shot down in air battles.

F-15 has only recently been really shot down, by the Hussites, the rest is a loss in operation. F-16 yes, more often. But it was used more often and more actively. Of the 64 F-117, 8 is lost, 7 in air accidents, one shot down. In general, the indicator is normal, but not outstanding

[Saburov]

Already discussed http://topwar.ru/23890-nepobedimyy-f-15-kak-siriycy-podrezali-orlam-krylya.html

[Prapor-527]

Quote: NEXUS

. So we will see what the Americans will give birth to at the exit.
Sincerely.

To be honest, I would like to see what will come out with the T-50 ... We hope for the best ...

[NEXUS]

Quote: Prapor-527

To be honest, I would like to see what will come out with the T-50 ... We hope for the best ...

Until the 16th we’ll wait and see if everything happens without freelance troubles. But I think, in general, everything will be pretty good. Of course, any sores will pop up in the series anyway, but I’m sure that such flights as the amers with F-35 are for sure will not be.

[GSH-18]

Quote: just EXPL

they tested rockets and bombs earlier, in 2012 and 2013. the trials were successful.

Did the pilot manage to eject in time?

[GSH-18]

F-35 first tested the gun in the air
In the USA, at the Edwards airbase (California), a multifunctional aircraft 5th generation F-35 Lightning II first tested its 25mm cannon in the air, reports

Well, they flatter themselves very much. F-35 does not seem to be attracted to the 5th generation, if only because it is subsonic. And this completely crosses out all their attempts to the 5th generation And there are still all sorts of nishtyaks there, on which he does not channel on the 5th.
Farther. All the same, they put a gun ... And now this is a very serious turn. I will explain. This is a change in the philosophy of aviation, definitely! The Americans did not invest in the 5th generation the possibility of maneuverable aerial combat in direct line of sight. But after demonstrating the capabilities of our electronic warfare systems, a roasted cock pecked at ..... In this situation, it is very likely to state that our Dryers currently have overwhelming superiority over these expensive pepelats

[just exp]

if only by the fact that it is subsonic

Can you name his maximum speed? or about that the F-35 doesn't have a super cruise? so it is.
and with stealth, everything is fine with him.
it’s another matter that he has maneuverability at the seams, and he turns out to be a jack of all trades, only in every case he is inferior to a specialized machine, that is, it’s both a nedobomber and a nedosturmovik and an underfighter, but in general, do not underestimate the enemy and his technique, it can be painful, and pain in such matters is the death of one of his own. and it’s better to overdo it than underdo it.

[GSH-18]

Quote: just explo

and with stealth, everything is fine with him.

This is where his "5th" generation ends - Amen!
As for speed, look here.
Flight characteristics:

Maximum speed: about 1900 km / h (this is afterburner)
Cruising speed: 850 km / h
The 5th generation should fly on supersonic WITHOUT afterburner!

Taken from here: http://www.vonovke.ru/s/lockheed_martin_f-35_lightning_ii_-_taktiko-tehnicheskie
_characteristics_f-35

[just exp]

and if I take other sources, and not all sorts of wonders? there cruising is completely different, there are even sources that indicate cruising at Mach 1.5 (super cruise).
PS Your link does not open.

[GSH-18]

Quote: just explo

and if I take other sources, and not all sorts of wonders? cruising there is completely different

So I’m saying that, you’ll still take the Lokhidovsky report for the Senate, and finally everything is true
Read between the lines information on its design and debugging - more than 20 already! years drank continues. And what are they doing ?? They (shame!) Are trying to reduce the weight of the aircraft by throwing out "unnecessary" knots! By the fact that he flies too slowly. Well, of course, yes, how was it originally designed? Handsome men, this plane to Lohid is needed to cut the dough in the first place. And what a heap there will be adopted, this is the tenth thing. So it goes

[just exp]

I won’t even argue that the project is good, especially since there is one thought, our compatriots who have gone there are also developing it, and it’s not a fact that one of them is not working against them. that is, such a saboteur, they also had little things that they had to redo almost everything, although drinking it was a convenient occasion.
but in fairness, they rely on an excellent avionics, and although it will turn out to be a flying disabled person, he can shoot (that is, use what was crammed into him) perfectly (though we must take into account that our EWs are also on the alert).

[GSH-18]

Quote: just explo

they emphasize the excellent avionics, and although it will turn out to be a flying disabled person, but to shoot (that is, to use that stuffed into him) he can perfectly (the truth must be borne in mind that ours with EW also do not sleep).

Generally not a fact! They have major software problems. Watch the video, I posted it, there only software development will be completed (as they think) only by the 20th year. Lohids simply tightly stuck to the military budget. The quality of the finished product is very doubtful and foggy. Well, only if they do not design a new plane, even more futuristic and more powerful

[just exp]

The radar and firing are ready. there they finish the little things on the next Wishlist from the military, that is, they constantly come up with new features and dock them for implementation. The initial version of the software they have long written.

[GSH-18]

Quote: just explo

The radar and firing are ready. there they finish the little things

How did it happen? How can it be a trifle that controls everything EVERYTHING on an airplane? Erase the OS from your computer and put some Beta version
And this is not a computer, this is a combat aircraft. And the software on it controls in particular weapons. Estimate what could happen?

[just exp]

there is not a beta version, there is a type of Windows seven, but while it was being done by the military, they wanted to type Windows XNUMX.

[GSH-18]

Quote: just EXPL

there is not a beta version, there is a type of Windows seven, but while it was being done by the military, they wanted to type Windows XNUMX.

What problems? In any store in the United States! True, there are only bugs and bookmarks .. It may come to the point that the Fu-35 will fly into the air on command from the office of Vindovoz!

[just exp]

Actually, I'm talking about Windows as an analogy.

[GSH-18]

Quote: just EXPL

Actually, I'm talking about Windows as an analogy.

I was also kidding.

[retardu]

Can I have a link to an Amer source about 2020? Or is it like a fairy tale gun?
And yes, it’s still unclear whom the cock pecked there, in the US airborne electronic warfare there are absolutely no lags

[GSH-18]

Here, especially for you: http://www.vonovke.ru/s/lockheed_martin_f-35_lightning_ii_-_taktiko-tehnicheskie
_characteristics_f-35

I'm opening up.

[just exp]

it only opens a list of sections for me, maybe the browser mows, it happens.

[Maxom75]

But here it should be borne in mind that it was designed as an "air punisher" for underdeveloped democracies and crumbling Russia, but it turned out that the money was thrown up, and in Russia its own VKS and he clearly does not pull against them.

[Pimply]

Quote: just explo

it’s another matter that he has maneuverability at the seams, and he turns out to be a jack of all trades, only in every case he is inferior to a specialized machine, that is, it’s both a nedobomber and a nedosturmovik and an underfighter, but in general, do not underestimate the enemy and his technique, it can be painful, and pain in such matters is the death of one of his own. and it’s better to overdo it than underdo it.

With maneuverability, he’s actually doing quite well



And maneuverability in modern aerial combat is not the most critical value

[just exp]

Well, if you compare, it may not be bad, I don’t know about the Chinese maneuverability, but the fact is a fact, even Eurofighters broke the raptors in the BVB, I generally keep quiet about our drying, and the F-35 is much inferior to the raptor in terms of maneuverability, that is, Eurofighter and dryers will merge even faster.
Threat Americans already once hoped that they would shoot down an enemy from afar that would not do anything to them, I'm talking about starfighter, and removed the guns from their planes, saying that the BVB will no longer take place in battle. reality puts everything in its place with nothing to do in the wrong places for which the US strategists were counting.

[Morrow]

Is stealth not more important than maneuverability?

[NEXUS]

Quote: Morrrow

Is stealth not more important than maneuverability?

Amers and I have different views on the 5th generation fighters. They rely on stealth, saying that the time of "dog dumps" (close combat) has passed, and our designers make our fighters not maneuverable, but SUPER MANEUVERABLE. they and we win, but in some ways we are inferior. But in my opinion, our concept is more correct and balanced.

[just exp]

more important, but there is one BUT, this is the reality of inconspicuousness, as practice shows. FULL invisibility only happens in fairy tales, and there are such people, called Russians, who have talented engineers, and they develop methods as you can find by other methods, you can discover what traditional methods it’s not detected, for example, to change the radar range, optical detection, passive detection, etc., and here ALL the concept of states goes along the beard. and the same rake comes as in Vietnam with a cannon. full drain begins. and if stealth can be a panacea for Arabs or Africans who do not have such a military-industrial complex as they are in Russia, then in the case of us, stealth will not play the role that the states assigned to it and the BVB will begin, and then oops, fu-35 will merge even 4 generation.

[sharp-lad]

This is only in the first part of the battle, in rapprochement with the enemy, and in the second, when it is necessary to move away from the enemy’s missiles, without maneuverability, oh how bad.

[Morrow]

Americans traditionally rely on DVB, and maneuverability is not needed there.

[Nick]

Quote: GSH-18

Well, they flatter themselves very much. F-35 does not seem to be attracted to the 5-generation, if only because it is subsonic.

Here you are mistaken. Subsonic cruising, yes. But in the afterburner mode, he develops speed in Mach 1,2, and in afterburner 1,6.
Do not underestimate the opponent

[GSH-18]

Quote: Nick

Here you are mistaken. Subsonic cruising, yes. But in the afterburner mode, he develops a speed of Mach 1,2, and 1,6 afterburner

Maybe. If you recklessly believe Lockheed Martin .. That’s only the American Congress doesn’t believe them, they even fined him for the bribes and delays more than once. But they have no choice - Lohids seized the monopoly

[GSH-18]

That's what the Americans themselves say about him.

[kamil_tt]

and long ago f-35 you have become subsonic? maybe he is still plywood and turboprop? and the fact that its maximum speed is about 1900 km / h (about 1200 mph or M = 1,6 with full armament in the internal compartments) and M = 1,2 without turning on the afterburner, albeit for ~ 240 km , irrelevant?

[Tusv]

Quote: kamil_tt

and the fact that its maximum speed is about 1900 km / h (about 1200 miles per hour or M = 1,6 with full armament in internal

With such a glider and, to say the least, futuristic aerodynamics. 1900 km / h is a real breakthrough. But something tells me, looking at the barn with firewood, that the inscription is still not true

[just exp]

what if he is capable of 1900 mph? then what? what would you convince in the war should our pilots die until they come up with a new tactic?

[Tusv]

Quote: just EXPL

what if he is capable of 1900 mph? then what?

In my time in air defense, enemy pepelats were thrown on top of 400. So we're used to

[GSH-18]

Quote: just EXPL

what if he is capable of 1900 mph? then what? what would you convince in the war should our pilots die until they come up with a new tactic?

No one argues with you what he gives out on FORCING about! 1900km / h But SUCH regime does not correspond to the 5th generation. Do you understand the difference? Afterburner mode is short-term, very very wear-resistant for the engine. It can be used when taking off or maneuvering / evading. In general, very briefly. All the rest of the time is a flying low-speed target for the Su-30, Su-33, Su-35, T-50

[Pimply]

Quote: GSH-18

No one argues with you what he gives out on FORCING about! 1900km / h But SUCH mode does not correspond to the 5 generation. Do you understand the difference? Afterburner mode is short-term, very very wear-resistant for the engine.

240 km - afterburning supersonic flight at f35a, if that
Thanks to the engine - and the engine there is a masterpiece - fully armed with F-35A with full fuel tanks, it is able to make maneuvers with overloading in the 9 g

Quote: GSH-18

All the rest of the time is a flying low-speed target for the Su-30, Su-33, Su-35, T-50

Are you really sure about that?

[just exp]

Well, actually, it can fly by 1.2 miles at 240 km, but it’s as if it weren’t in the neighboring store sgonzant.

[mvg]

You have an extremely narrow idea of ​​the% generation .. "Dog dumps" for this generation are not a panacea .. And in them, this guinpin will not be a whipping bird .. WITH ANY of the modern aircraft ..
Its tasks - it is desirable to get as close as possible, quietly get close, complete the task and shed .. if the BB cannot be avoided, then the Sidewinder 9x are very good all-round missiles. And in terms of electronic warfare and other avionics, the 35th will give odds to many .. Plus there will be a "Hawkeye" hanging next to some thread .. and cover the ambush ..
What overwhelming superiority are you talking about? What will we suppress? Will we be surprised by the number of caps? There are already hundreds and a half of them flying .. and even 186 F-22 .. And here, excuse me, how many 30 and 35 combined?
And for the money .. F-35 will cost 85-90 million, how much are we selling India 30MKI? And how much is the cost of the 35C contract to China? And there will be more than 3000 of these "pepelats" ..

[Sergei1982]

F-35 will cost 85-90

That's when it will be later and say.

how much do we sell 30MKI to India?

40-50mil, but for example, Kazakhstan Su-30SM cost 5 mn rubles for 4 units, that is, 1,25 mn rubles per unit or 20 mil.

And there will be more than 3000 of these "pepelats" ..

Makein requires a reduction in procurement f-35.

[Pimply]

Quote: Sergei1982

And there will be more than 3000 of these "pepelatsev" .. Makein demands reduction of purchases of F-35.

He is actually a republican politician who advocates for budgetary restrictions in principle. And now there was just a brawl for the budget, if you are not in the know.

[just exp]

McCain for reducing spending on weapons? I have a question - who blocked the recently increased military budget? Isn't Obama? But didn’t McCain supporters push this budget?

[Pimply]

Quote: just explo

McCain for reducing spending on weapons? I have a question - who blocked the recently increased military budget? Isn't Obama? But didn’t McCain supporters push this budget?

Are you well versed in the intricacies of US domestic politics?

[just exp]

I think better than you are trying to protect them.
Details on the topic are on the network, do not be lazy to read the article.

[just exp]

Well, about the advanced avionics and electronic warfare I agree, and in close combat they will not have sidewinders but more advanced CUDA, but our aviation should not be underestimated, ours also have something to shoot from a distance until the F-35 reaches the CUDA launch distance.

[gladcu2]

mvg

Everything is fine. Their hundred flies out of range of air defense. Therefore, the difference in quantity is balanced by the type of task.

[gladcu2]

mvg

The presence of an air defense zone will compensate for the difference in quantity.

If an offensive task is set, then the number is important. In this case, ground-based air defense is a deterrent. Which may well balance triple superiority.

[Pimply]

Quote: GSH-18

Well, they flatter themselves very much. F-35 does not seem to be attracted to the 5-generation, if only because it is subsonic.

Do not smack nonsense.

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

In this situation, it is very likely to state that our Dryers currently have overwhelming superiority over these expensive pepelats

Perhaps you are right. But let's see how things are going with fighter platforms of the 5th generation ... PAK FA, although it flies and is tested, but the state tests are still at the implementation stage. The series will be, the question is how much and with what problems in the course of operation in the army. Further, the MIG design bureau is developing enthusiastically the 5th generation LFI, and perhaps after 5 years, God grant (taking into account the MIG 1.44 and PAK FA developments) we will be pleased with the appearance of a prototype. And it’s not at all a fact if the Mikoyanovites bring the new LFI to the state of a production car, the Moscow Region will purchase it.
Americans in this regard are much more perspicacious, already signing contracts for the supply of F-35 to all their allies.
It’s clear that dear Lightning and the elimination of all problems have no end in sight, but they already have a series (although they have not passed the state test). Perhaps the F-35s will be retrained (I'm talking about the main F-35 of the three modifications) into something otherwise, but one consolation is that the deadlines are postponed until 19, and then we'll see.
We would have to gloat less, and think more about our LFI, which so far has not existed, but sadly.
God forbid that everything went smoothly with PAK FA and finally brought to the series.
Best regards

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

Perhaps the F-35 will be retrained (I'm talking about the main F-35 of the three modifications) to something else, but one consolation is that the deadlines are postponed until 19, and we'll see.

Until the 20th, for reasons of software development and debugging. And there, in addition to software problems, a wagon and a small cart. The fact that they riveted a "series" of raw aircraft for testing in the Air Force before state acceptance looks like firefighting measures to speed up the development, not the fact that it will work the way they would like. Improvisation in such a business is not the best technique. And when do we plan to start delivering the T-50 to the troops ??

Serial deliveries of the aircraft to the troops should begin in 2016. Earlier it was reported that the current state armament program provides for delivery to the Air Force 60 serial PAK FA aircraft until 2020.

Here from here: http://vpk.name/news/128356_v_2015_godu_na_ispyitaniya_vyiidut_eshe_tri_istrebit


elya_pyatogo_pokoleniya.html

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

And when did we plan to start deliveries of the T-50 to the troops ??
Serial deliveries of the aircraft to the troops should begin in 2016. Earlier it was reported that the current State Arms Program provides for the delivery to the Air Force of 60 serial aircraft of the PAK FA program until 2020.

That's right. But there are some points. The first, the number in the first series. And the second, what problems will arise (and they will) during the operation of serial machines that will need to be fixed.
Also, PAK FA is a HEAVY fighter platform and it is not correct to put it mildly, to put it mildly. And therefore I touched on the topic of OUR LFI, which is not there, unfortunately.
Sincerely.

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

Also, PAK FA is a HEAVY Fighter Platform and leveling it with the F-35, to put it mildly, is not correct

I don't even match. Everything is just fine. It is better to have a heavy version of the 5th fighter platform than a light one in our Russian conditions of long distances.
We have so historically evolved that we have an undisputed leader in the production of tactical aircraft - this is Sukhoi Design Bureau.
And in my opinion it is absolutely deserved.
In addition, the question generally arises of the need for a light fighter in the Air Force if there is a further transition to the 5th and subsequent generations. Such versatility
And if that, we already have a Yak-130

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

It is better to have a heavy version of the 5th fighter platform than a light one in our Russian conditions of long distances.

Excuse me, did the fools come up with the concept of a fighter couple? The tasks for a light and heavy fighter are different and the possibilities. Or do you think it would be reasonable to shift all responsibilities to a heavy fighter? Then the question arises of the redundancy of use.

Quote: GSH-18

We have so historically evolved that we have an undisputed leader in the production of tactical aircraft - this is Sukhoi Design Bureau.

The MIG KB has a different specialization. Now the Mikoyanites are working hard to create a new interceptor (let's call MIG-41) about the speed characteristics of which the Americans have been squealing for a year, and even voiced them: 4,5-5 max (and this, by the way, is a hyper sound ). So CB MIG also has enough work.

Quote: GSH-18

Such versatility

We have not yet matured either technically or scientifically to a universal combat flying platform. For example, the Americans with their Lightning, in which they are trying to just push a little into it. It turns out? We see that it is not very.

Quote: GSH-18

And if that, we already have a Yak-140

Sorry, not the Yak-140, but you probably meant the Yak-130. So from the Yak-130 LFI the 5th generation will not work. Here is the shock UAV, I think it will be excellent.
Best regards

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

Or do you think it would be wise to shift all responsibilities to a heavy fighter?

This is not me thinking. Everything goes to this.

Quote: NEXUS

The MIG KB has a different specialization. Now the Mikoyanites are working closely on creating a new interceptor (let's call MIG-41)

I'm all for it! Let them deal with air defense planes. But now they’re not talking about them.

Quote: NEXUS

We have not yet matured either technically or scientifically to a universal combat flying platform.

Where did you get such information? If the mattress did not work the first time, then this does not mean that it will not work with us. Remember the story of space travel? We Gagarin pulled around the Earth, and they brought Armstrong and Co. to the moon. Right now, the reverse situation can be with the 5th generation very easily.

Quote: NEXUS

Sorry, not the Yak-140, but you probably meant the Yak-130. So from the Yak-130 LFI of the 5th generation it won’t work out

Yes, I already fixed it, thanks. But I insist that the concept of a fighter couple is starting to recede into the past. And in my opinion let the MiG-29s reach their resources, and it’s better to direct the money to the development of the 6th generation aircraft

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

This is not me thinking. Everything goes to this.

It is coming, but it will not be soon.

Quote: GSH-18

Where did you get such information? If the mattress did not work the first time, then this does not mean that it will not work with us.

Yes, because for now, the use of a heavy fighter in events for which the LFI is redundant and expensive. Their tasks are different, respectively, and the performance characteristics are different and the arsenal is also different. Well, and the price, respectively, too.

Quote: GSH-18

But I insist that the concept of a fighter couple is starting to be a thing of the past

Your right. This concept will undoubtedly go away, but I am convinced that it will not be soon. Maybe in 30 years, who knows.

Quote: GSH-18

and it’s better to direct the money to the development of the 6th generation aircraft

Even there are no requirements for the 6th generation and there is no concept of use. It has been argued for how many years that the 6th generation will be unmanned or manned.

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

Yes, because for now, the use of a heavy fighter in events under which the LFI is sharpened is excessive and expensive.

Dear NEXUS, the concept of EXPENSIVE in wartime DOES NOT EXIST. There is a concept EFFECTIVELY! And no one will convince me that a fighter flying TWO times farther, seeing twice as good and taking on board twice as many weapons is worse than the one I cited this example Namely, such a difference between the same MIG-29 and Su-27.

Quote: NEXUS

Even there are no requirements for the 6th generation and the concept of use

Well, here you are wrong. The mattress has already started developing 6-ki. They officially declared it.

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

the concept of EXPENSIVE in wartime DOES NOT EXIST.

In the military maybe, but what about peacetime then?

Quote: GSH-18

And no one can convince me that a fighter flying TWO times farther, seeing twice as good and taking on board twice as many weapons is worse than the one I gave this example with respect to, namely, such a difference between the same -29 and Su-27.

A heavy fighter and an easy one is generally not correct to compare! Explain the range to the fighter, if there is a battle over the front line? At the same time, a heavy fighter "eats" the same fuel much more gluttonous than a light one. ? LFI in the series is done faster. Remember the Second World War. The Germans Tiger on the line collected as much as we managed to make 4-5 T-34s during the same time.

Quote: GSH-18

Well, here you are wrong. The mattress has already started developing 6-ki. They officially declared it.

It can be stated that the 7th generation of LA is also being developed. What requirements for the 6th generation of LA have they voiced?

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

In the military maybe, but what about peacetime then?

Combat use always occurs during hostilities, regardless of the extent and location of the conflict.

Quote: NEXUS

A heavy fighter and an easy one to compare is not correct at all! Explain to what range the fighter, if there is a battle over the front line?

That's just the point! The front line is mobile, but a limited number of airfields, no! Unless it's certainly an Aircraft Carrier

Quote: NEXUS

And they will knock him down, how many quantitatively thinning heavy fighters will you restore?

To bring it down you need to try very hard Pts, in contrast to the light visually impaired easier armed and not far flying airplane. Well, I wrote about this combat comparison.

Quote: NEXUS

It can be stated that the 7th generation of LA is also being developed. What requirements for the 6th generation of LA have they voiced?

Nope, it's secret. But ours, I think, are already xeroxed for copy to Moscow

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

That's just the point! The front line is mobile, but a limited number of airfields, no! Unless it's certainly an Aircraft Carrier

That's right, but let's take a look at the run of the same MIG-29 and SU-27 and compare. And then we'll see to whom which airfield is enough.

Quote: GSH-18

To bring it down you need to try very hard Pts, in contrast to the light visually impaired easier armed and not far flying airplane. Well, I wrote about this combat comparison.

To listen to you, LFI is not a fighter whose duties include "sticking" everything into the ground that flies from that side, but the hang glider is weak. LFI has "teeth" and it is sharpened to use them.
Best regards

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

That's right, but let's take a look at the run of the same MIG-29 and SU-27 and compare. And then we'll see to whom which airfield is enough.

I have a better offer. Let's take a look at the composition of the air group at our Khmeimim airbase in Syria. Is the hint clear?

Quote: NEXUS

Listen to you, so LFI is not a fighter

No, I didn’t say that. The 29th Migi, as part of its application, is a great car! One of their indisputable advantages is the ability to take off / land from federal highways (if there is some infrastructure for the service team). But we are discussing with you what we need for a prospect, and not what we already have. My statement: PAK FA will eventually squeeze out all this small fry. Just the principle of its creation, this implies. The unification of all that is possible in one machine, as a result, halving the number of cars in comparison with the concept of a two, cheaper for the same reasons, increasing the combat capabilities of each unit, as a result, increasing efficiency! Etc. Something like this.

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

I have a better offer. Let's take a look at the composition of the air group at our Khmeimim airbase in Syria. Is the hint clear?

And forgive me, why is LFI, which is sharpened for air combat and a "dog dump", in Syria?

Quote: GSH-18

PAK FA will eventually squeeze out all this small fry.

That's when PAK FA will cost as LFI, and just as quickly leave the assembly shops (I'm talking about assembly speed), then there is no question, of course it will crowd out.
Question - Three LFIs against a single heavy band, who do you think will feel more comfortable?

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

And forgive me, why is LFI, which is sharpened for air combat and a "dog dump", in Syria? wink

I see the hint is not understood.
We are using the Su-30SM as a fighter in Syria now.
By your logic, we should have used the MiG-29 in Syria to cover the Su-24 and Su-25. After all, its use is much cheaper and more effective according to your words. And for some reason we use the Su-30SM. Do you think ours do not know how to count money?
Just Using four Su-30SM replaces twice as many MiG-29. By the fact that the Su-30 can be twice as much in the air performing combat missions of airspace control. This means that you need half the space on the airfield, half as much technicians, half as much maintenance time, half as much kerosene and half as much bandwidth! Here is such an interesting math, with the same efficiency

Quote: NEXUS

That's when PAK FA will cost like an LFI

I already wrote about the cost. You can add only the famous statement by Monsieur Napoleon: Whoever does not want to feed his army will feed someone else's.

Quote: NEXUS

Question-Three LFI against one heavy

And the cost of maintenance and the amount of burned kerosene during operation? I think the answer in favor of one PAK FA is obvious.

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

I see the hint is not understood.
We are using the Su-30SM as a fighter in Syria now.

Apparently you didn’t understand the hint ... SU-30SM is a machine that can work not only for air targets, covering our bombers and attack aircraft, but it can work out very well on the ground, and climbing deep enough behind the front line. Therefore, the choice is quite logical.

Quote: GSH-18

I already wrote about the cost. You can add only the famous statement by Monsieur Napoleon: Whoever does not want to feed his army will feed someone else's.

So for this, until the price of PAK FA becomes less acceptable for our MO, and we can purchase T-50 in sufficient quantities, we need to update the fleet of aging LFI, for which there will be work and application. Moreover, if we recall the speed characteristics of the same MIG-1.44 (which was then an MFI, multi-purpose, and not easy) for about 3 mach, and imagine for a moment that the new LFI will not be inferior in this indicator, then I think the machine will turn out very nimble.

Quote: GSH-18

And the cost of maintenance and the amount of burned kerosene during operation? I think the answer in favor of one PAK FA is obvious.

Which is more likely to be shot down by a triple LFI. And then what kind of kerosene will you talk about?

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

Apparently you didn’t understand the hint ... SU-30SM is a machine that can work not only for air targets, covering our bombers and attack aircraft, but it can work out very well on the ground, and climbing deep enough behind the front line. Therefore, the choice is quite

Su-30SM is used in Syria only as a fighter. Please read carefully.

Quote: NEXUS

So for this, until the price of PAK FA becomes more or less acceptable for our MO, and we can purchase T-50 in sufficient quantities, we need to update the fleet of aging LFI

That's exactly why you should not spray money. Where then to put all this outdated fleet of conceptually outdated aircraft, why rivet them at all? You must immediately invest in novye, that is, the 5th and subsequent generations.

Quote: NEXUS

Moreover, if we recall the speed characteristics of the same MIG-1.44 (which was the IFI

Let's not, a hundred times have already been discussed! 1,44 conceptually outdated fuselage weft layout ... No further discussion. That is why at one time the state order money was given to the Sukhoi Design Bureau and not to the Migovtsy. Their lot Airplanes Air defense-narrow specialization

Quote: NEXUS

Which is more likely to be shot down by a triple LFI. And then what kind of kerosene will you talk about?

What is the three LFI? What kind of fairy tales? A heavy fighter, in the first place, has a larger radar diameter than LFI, simply because it is larger in size. Accordingly, your LFI will be detected and attacked earlier. Can carry more weapons and more long-range. Well further tell, I think it’s not worth it Although you can and more
Understand, my friend, the LFI has no chance at a real meeting with the PAK FA. Unless he suddenly emerges from the ground.

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

Su-30SM is used in Syria only as a fighter. Please read carefully.

So in fact, the operation of the videoconferencing takes a little more than a month. It's not evening yet. Or do you think that nothing can change?

Quote: GSH-18

That's exactly why you should not spray money. Where then to put all this outdated fleet of conceptually outdated aircraft, why rivet them at all? You must immediately invest in novye, that is, the 5th and subsequent generations.

And I'm talking about creating a 5th generation LFI! And in the light of new developments, this will not be trash at all.

Quote: GSH-18

Let's not, a hundred times have already been discussed! 1,44 conceptually obsolete fuselage weft layout ...

Did I really talk about starting to produce it? I talked about the developments that Mikoyan residents use to create 5th generation LFIs. But the glider and the filling in it will certainly be different.

Quote: GSH-18

Accordingly, your LFI will be detected and attacked earlier.

Not at all a fact. Network-centric warfare has not yet been canceled, I believe when the enemy fighter approaches, the three LFI will know about it.

Quote: GSH-18

Understand, my friend, the LFI has no chance at a real meeting with the PAK FA. Unless he suddenly emerges from the ground.

Say no chance ... hmm ... that is, do you think that they will be on the radar at the cord?

Quote: GSH-18

Can carry more weapons and more long-range.

So, my friend, to shoot down a fighter, you need only one rocket, not a hundred.

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

So in fact, the operation of the videoconferencing takes a little more than a month. It's not evening yet. Or do you think that nothing can change?

Su-30SM in the amount of 4 units are routinely used strictly as fighters to cover bombing groups in dangerous areas and to control airspace in target areas. They carry only short and medium-range air-to-air missiles. Other use of the Su-30SM multifunctional heavy fighters in this company is not provided for by the regulations for the use of the air group. Only as fighters. Bombers and attack aircraft Su-24, Su-25 are there. There are also Su-34 multifunctional bombers, which are mainly used to destroy "difficult" targets with special ammunition in the daytime and at night.

Quote: NEXUS

Or do you think that nothing can change?

Whatever changes, functionally, the Su-30SM will still perform only the functions of heavy fighters. The air group is formed taking into account any possible tactical changes in the theater.

Quote: NEXUS

I talked about the developments that Mikoyan residents use to create a 5th generation LFI

He will not be accepted into our Air Force for the above reasons. Most likely for export. This is correct and useful for the budget.

Quote: NEXUS

Not at all a fact. Network-centric warfare has not yet been canceled, I believe when the enemy fighter approaches, the three LFI will know about it.

Well, the same situation can be from the side of the heavy fighter Only on his side is a clear technological advantage.

Quote: NEXUS

Do you think that they will be in full view on the heavy radar? And the smaller ESR of the smaller LFI in general is not taken into account here?

This is not what I think. This is radiophysics. EPR PAK FA is a soccer ball. EPR LFI gate of the fire department (with each of the three) Mig-29 is taken, because LFI-5 does not exist in nature.

Quote: NEXUS

So, my friend, to shoot down a fighter, you need only one rocket, not a hundred. hi

Only this rocket should fly where necessary. And it must be brought before the enemy to the target, and this goal must naturally be captured earlier. In general, it turns out again that the advantage is on the side of the heavy multi-functional fighter And one more clarification. Better TWO rockets. From one he can still dodge. There are all kinds of cool evasion maneuvers.
Yes, and more intermeddle rockets, and other useful nishtyakov!

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

Whatever changes, functionally, the Su-30SM will still perform only the functions of heavy fighters. The air group is formed taking into account any possible tactical changes in the theater.

I wouldn’t speak so self-confidently. And only the command knows about the strategies and plans of our VKS.

Quote: GSH-18

He will not be accepted into our Air Force for the above reasons. Most likely for export. This is correct and useful for the budget.

Oh, why such confidence then? We need LFI-5 no less than for export, because as I said above the tasks and, accordingly, their implementation should be commensurate with the efforts made.

Quote: GSH-18

This is not what I think. This is radiophysics. EPR PAK FA is a soccer ball. EPR LFI gate of the fire station (with each of the three)

I’m not talking about MIG-29, but about LFI-5, which will be created with stealth technologies. What does MIG-29 have to do with it? It will probably be less than a soccer ball.

Quote: GSH-18

Only this rocket should fly where necessary. And it must be brought before the enemy to the target, and this goal must naturally be captured earlier. In general, it turns out again that the advantage is on the side of the heavy multi-functional fighter

Again, by. We are talking about the confrontation of equals in the issue of the generation of machines, which means that we can confidently say that the LFI-5 will not only have a "small and medium hand", but also a "long" one. So it is very debatable how everything will be there. Even after losing 2 out of three light fighters, but shooting down a heavy one, all the same, even in an economic sense, the side with the LFI will win in this battle.

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

Quote: GSH-18
Whatever changes, functionally, the Su-30SM will still perform only the functions of heavy fighters. The air group is formed taking into account any possible tactical changes in the theater.

I wouldn’t speak so self-confidently. And only the command knows about the strategies and plans of our VKS.

So what are the problems ?? If anything, maybe work on the ground! This only adds points to him compared to LFI. That is why the Su-30SM was included in the air group, and not the MiG-29. You practically answer your own question.

Quote: NEXUS

Oh Li. Why such confidence then?

Under it there is no article in the state order. The emphasis is on more powerful and multifunctional Su aircraft.

Quote: NEXUS

I’m not talking about MIG-29, but about LFI-5, which will be created with technology

You are a funny person, don't be offended. If LFI-5 will be created, it will only be funded by the MIG Corporation. This means that all his parameters "5" will be mediocre without state support and naturally he will not be accepted by the Air Force. For sale only. The creation of "5" is a huge front of research and development work. The MIG itself will not pull it, and it's a no brainer. In addition, they do not even have normal developments on this topic, so only projections and advertising for dummies. So, well, you got me

Quote: NEXUS

Again, by. We are talking about the confrontation of equals in the issue of the generation of machines, which means that we can confidently say that the LFI-5 will not only have a "small and medium hand", but also a "long" one.

I'm not very clear now what we are talking about? About Wishlist? There is not only at least one experimental LFI glider, but even tasks for the "planned" weapon. It is rather pointless to discuss what is not in nature. Do you agree with me?
The Russian Air Force has decided, we are moving to the concept of multi-functional front-line fighters based on the Sukhoi Design Bureau.

[NEXUS]

Quote: GSH-18

That is why the Su-30SM was included in the air group, and not the MiG-29. You practically answer your own question.

This is the answer to your question, why in Syria is the SU-30, and not the MIG-29.

Quote: GSH-18

The emphasis is on more powerful and multifunctional Su aircraft.

I understand that you know in detail both the orders of the Moscow Region and the plans ... or do you think that even the official sources on the internet publish all the truth or the whole truth? In my opinion, the concept of state secrets has not been canceled, or Did I miss something?

Quote: GSH-18

This means that all his parameters "5" will be mediocre without state support and naturally he will not be accepted by the Air Force.

If the Mikoyanites decided to bring the LFI-5 project to its logical conclusion, it means that it’s not just that from doing nothing. And what they announced does not mean at all that it is so in fact. Think for yourself, the meaning of our MO ahead of time "please But what about the concept of "surprise", with which the last few years have been pleasing amers, starting with Armata.

Quote: GSH-18

In addition, they don’t even have normal experience on this topic, because there are only projections and advertising for dummies. So, well, you understand me

About how. Say no to the operating time ... Well, let's start with the fact that ALL design bureaus are united into one concern, which means that the developments somehow become common. I don’t think that Sukhoi Design Bureau will not share and will not help, putting rivalry higher than the interests of the state.

Quote: GSH-18

There is not only at least one experimental LFI glider, but even tasks for the "planned" weapon

Here you’re cheerful and a pleasant conversationalist, by God. Although it’s certainly healthy, but I initially designated you such a moment as that KB MIKOYAN was engaged in the development of LFI-5. Notice that she does not want to do it, but is already doing it. And I think that with a glider and other moments everything will be decided soon.
Best regards

[NIKNN]

GS-18 (6) EU Today, 15: 32
This is a change in the philosophy of aviation, definitely! The Americans did not invest in the 5th generation the possibility of maneuverable aerial combat in direct line of sight.

It seems to me that the installation of the 25mm cannon is projected for use according to the NC, for the BMVB they have a spent "Vulcan".

[GSH-18]

Quote: NIKNN

It seems to me that the installation of a 25mm gun is projected onto the application of the SC

Not. They have problems with this. In addition to the gun, no rifle art systems were installed there. It’s just that now it’s necessary to modify the OS, vparivaya in his body more than 900 lines of gun control software. Initially, this was not intended. And because of this, the fire control software from the gun is periodically buggy. They want to be able to hit any targets at any heights, but the current software embedded in the OS doesn’t allow this to be done. So they will rewrite until the 20th year (according to their own statements)! And this is only one of the problems of this pepelats.

[Thronekeeper]

Chota, it reminds me ...
The best in the Abrams M1A1 tank is the Chobham armor from the British Challenger, the 120mm cannon from the German leopard and the gas turbine engine from the Russian T-80.
In the F-35 - the best is a project copied from the Russian Yak-141, the British aden-25 cannon copied from the Russian GSh-6-23

[Pimply]

Quote: Thronekeeper

Chota, it reminds me ...
The best in the Abrams M1A1 tank is the Chobham armor from the British Challenger, the 120mm cannon from the German leopard and the gas turbine engine from the Russian T-80.
In the F-35 - the best is a project copied from the Russian Yak-141, the British aden-25 cannon copied from the Russian GSh-6-23

Do not repeat strangers caressing your own hearing stupid things

[Secta haki]

Do you just have to repeat them after you? About the "indestructible" Israeli-American aviation and other invisible people?

[mvg]

This is not such an important element for a tactical bomber. On the MiG-31 and Su-24, the cannon with restrictions is still used .. on the number of shells in the queue .. and so much like a verified gun .. And then the gliders become completely khan and avionics breaks down ..
They just showed that if it is locked behind a cannon, then it can sometimes shoot .. At the same time, the penguins do not "faint" from de-energizing the on-board network .. and stalling engines

[GSH-18]

Quote: mvg

On the MiG-31 and Su-24, the cannon with restrictions is still used.

You should understand, when you write this, that the F-35 is positioned by the Americans as the 5th generation with the goal of very profitably selling the Allies for loot. And the Mig-31 (interceptor, long arm of air defense) and Su-24 (which is generally a bomber), well, as if the gun is not the main thing here, they never positioned themselves as the 5th generation! Do you understand what I'm talking about? The 5th generation is, first of all, MULTIFUNCTIONALITY, stealth and cruising supersonic, well and further down the list. The list of differences and features of the 5th from all lies in the public domain on Wikipedia. Read and compare tth. Everything is simple.

[gladcu2]

GSH-18

You correctly noticed that the concept of the use of close combat has been developed. In connection with the recognition of the need to install a gun.

Well, of course, no one canceled commercial projects.

[GSH-18]

Quote: gladcu2

GSH-18

You correctly noticed that the concept of the use of close combat has been developed. In connection with the recognition of the need to install a gun.

Well, of course, no one canceled commercial projects.

And it was developed not only because the Russian Federation appeared in the presence of electronic warfare of the required quality, but also due to the fact that the Lochids cannot give the long-suffering B-35 all the properties of a fifth-generation fighter. This is indicated not only by the installation of the gun (which was not planned at all initially), and as a result, by a change in the concept of use, but also by the refusals of the Allies to purchase the initially declared volumes. It’s impossible to deceive everyone despite aggressive advertising.

[Pimply]

Quote: GSH-18

You should understand when you write that the F-35 is positioned by the Americans as the 5-generation with the goal of very profitably selling the allies for loot.

And again, nonsense. In fact, the main deliveries - 3 / 4 - fall on the US Armed Forces.

Quote: GSH-18

5-th generation is primarily MULTIFUNCTIONALITY, stealth and cruising supersonic, well, and further down the list.

No, actually. The 5 generation is a sum of factors determined primarily by the main customer, and not the ancient list. The Americans reached all of his points in F-22. And do not consider them fools if they decided to embody not everything that was in it. The experience of the real fifth generation is only with them. The advent of modern all-angle missiles, new homing heads and promising helmet-mounted target designation systems somehow sent super-maneuverability to hell. Not until the end, of course, but very much.

[NIKNN]

Pimply
The advent of modern all-angle missiles, new homing heads and promising helmet-mounted target designation systems somehow sent super-maneuverability to hell. Not until the end, of course, but very much.

It’s even getting scary Well, let's dream a little. and so we have an F22 with all-angle missiles, a promising helmet-mounted system of the CU and the Su35, by the way, which has the same thing. The pilot of the 22nd turns his head as far as he can and ... at this time, the TGSN located inside the weapons compartment, well, it cannot capture through the hull, trouble, but they have a system that is even more promising (for example, it materialized from desires), through a helmet-mounted designator missile received a target designation program and press "start". The rocket unhooks, turns to the point where the program indicated, and there ..., above the maneuverability damn it. At the drying P73, while still on the pylon, it will grab the target and will not let go.
Well, God forbid that not all fantasies come true.

[GSH-18]

Quote: NIKNN

Somehow it’s even scary to recourse Well, let's fantasize a little

The fact is that the possibilities of super-maneuverability are primarily important in close combat. Namely, such a battle will be in a dense network Air defense and electronic warfare over our territory!
Farther. As soon as the radio signatures (and other physical markers) of these pepelats are calculated, our air defense will shoot them like a dash. Unless they rub their belly against the ground, they will begin to rub. But here, too, they are not comfortable, the Mig-31 will not be asleep. And it’s not worth talking about Drying.

[Pimply]

Quote: GSH-18

Namely, such a battle will be in a dense network of air defense and electronic warfare over our territory!

Do you realize that UAVs and guided missiles will be capable of carrying out these rich air defense systems (if Gd forbid such a collision)? And that by the time the pilots arrive, this air defense will be seriously thinned out (as we say in 1982 in the Bekaa Valley)

[NEXUS]

Quote: Pimply

And that by the time the pilots arrive, this air defense will be seriously thinned out

The fact is that the air defense and missile defense will not sit as well. And in the conditions of Network-Centric War, not everything will be so rosy and easy. The carriers of the Kyrgyz Republic, various Avaks and others like them, as well as GPS satellites, will be destroyed in the first queue. And subject to layered air defense and missile defense, thinning out all this will be oh, how easy.

[Pimply]

Quote: NIKNN

Somehow it becomes even scary Well, let's fantasize a little. and so we have an F22 with all-angle missiles, a promising helmet-mounted system of the Central Control Center and the Su35, by the way, which has the same thing. The pilot of the 22nd turns his head as far as he can and ... at this time, the TGSN located inside the armament compartment, well, it cannot capture through the hull, trouble, but they have a system that is even more promising (for example, it materialized from desires), through a helmet-mounted designator missile received a target designation program and press "start". The rocket unhooks, turns to the point where the program indicated, and there ..., above the maneuverability, damn it. At the drying P73, while still on the pylon, it will grab the target and will not let go.
Well, God forbid that not all fantasies come true.

Do you understand, at least, that the overloads that electronics can experience are much higher than those that people can endure. And that no over-maneuverability in such a situation will help

[mvg]

Quote: NIKNN

Pimply
The advent of modern all-angle missiles, new homing heads and promising helmet-mounted target designation systems somehow sent super-maneuverability to hell. Not until the end, of course, but very much.

It’s even getting scary Well, let's dream a little. and so we have an F22 with all-angle missiles, a promising helmet-mounted system of the CU and the Su35, by the way, which has the same thing. The pilot of the 22nd turns his head as far as he can and ... at this time, the TGSN located inside the weapons compartment, well, it cannot capture through the hull, trouble, but they have a system that is even more promising (for example, it materialized from desires), through a helmet-mounted designator missile received a target designation program and press "start". The rocket unhooks, turns to the point where the program indicated, and there ..., above the maneuverability damn it. At the drying P73, while still on the pylon, it will grab the target and will not let go.
Well, God forbid that not all fantasies come true.

I'm embarrassed to ask: Will the R-73 itself capture? Her little GOS, 600-800 km, will even see something? Or maybe the aircraft's radar will see the target, the smart on-board computer will tell you the most terrible target and how to deal with it? The pilot will sadly agree with the computer and press "PLI", after which the AIM-120 will jump out of the combat compartment, turn towards the target and go to the intended meeting with the target. Km so for twenty, the missile seeker will turn on, it will see the target from 12-17 km, if it does not see it, it will "search" along the course, then it will capture it, and fly to a meeting, swell, with your favorite airplane to the brudenshaft ... And you , sorry, how did you imagine? What are all sorts of rackets 7, 9, 120 sitting there (in the combat compartment) and twisting their noses, following the pilot's helmet?

[kamil_tt]

perhaps for this purpose a slightly reduced caliber, to reduce vibrations and problems associated with them ..

[GSH-18]

Quote: kamil_tt

perhaps for this purpose a slightly reduced caliber, to reduce vibrations and problems associated with them ..

Yes, EVERYTHING is reduced there, down to the number of valves on the fuel system. Well, at least the pilot remained alive. I don’t want to talk about the real combat situation ..

[sancho]

And, all the same, what are their pretty faces and speech ... Straight James Bond ...


I just want this face to shout on the air "- Mayday ... Mayday ... Mayday, I'm under fire, I attacked Russian .... aaaaaa"

Tired already ...

[theadenter]

Suffered a gun. They ditched so much time and money.
And I doubt that this gun is dangerous for modern combat.

[viktorrymar]

They shove this shnyaga to all the allies for several years, and they only tested the gun. Ohrenet !!!!! You buy the main thing, and then we will teach him to fly and shoot, well, and the service package in pursuit)))))
Gow. But. Aircraft!!!!!

[marlin1203]

Are they seriously counting on close maneuverable combat on this gold electron microscope? ..

[bad]

[quote] [/ quot About the intention to refuse the purchase of F-35 previously announced the new Prime Minister of Canada Justin Trudeau. The Pentagon has already decided that because of the demarche of its neighbors, the US economy will not receive at least $ 65 million.e] ... problems ???

[just exp]

it is the Canadians along the way wanted to buy half the plane.

[DarthVedro]

Probably, they meant billions, because the fighter itself is only a small part of the costs. There is also an alteration of infrastructure, maintenance, spare parts, a production license (Canadians as well), training of instructors and promotion.

[gladcu2]

DarthVedro

Who to defend against? Or attack?

What is the meaning?

While there was money, you could play politics. And as the crisis in the yard and opinions were divided.

[NEXUS]

Quote: bad

.Problems???

Yes, so far, problems. Problems will begin when Australia backtracks, which has been hinted at for many years, and Norway and other customers have begun to reduce their announced purchases of this miracle pipelats. In the meantime, we sit still, chew popcorn and enjoy this comedy. It is important that with all these delays, shortcomings, and disruptions, we have time to bring the PAK FA to the series, and to seriously advance in creating our new LFI

[Pimply]

Quote: NEXUS

Yes, so far, problems. Problems will begin when Australia backtracks, which has been hinted at for many years, and Norway and other customers have begun to reduce their announced purchases of this miracle pipelats. In the meantime, we sit still, chew popcorn and enjoy this comedy. It is important that with all these delays, shortcomings, and disruptions, we have time to bring the PAK FA to the series, and to seriously advance in creating our new LFI

Bet that won't happen?

[GSH-18]

Quote: NEXUS

to bring the PAK FA to the series, well, seriously advance in the creation of your new LFI hi

It's funny But I will translate for you your own phrase. PAK FA-Perspective Aviation COMPLEX Frontline Aviation. Do you hear the word complex? This word does not imply further use of LFI, since COMPLEX includes its capabilities, while at the same time reducing the cost and increasing the effectiveness of the application. One can argue with this, but the very presence of PAK FA is an iron argument.

[cniza]

Some strange information that they wanted to say is not clear.

[figwam]

Quote: cniza

Some strange information that they wanted to say is not clear.

Apparently: - Now I will beat everyone.

[Aleksandr72]

Yes!
Interesting - the reaction of Russia - oh-wei! or "Katz always offered to surrender!" (although this is of course unlikely - the Russians do not give up!)
It remains now to wait for the United States to once again announce the change of the Lightning's image - this time to a purely strike aircraft, and that the gun is available - there is something to shoot at ground targets (another matter - is it necessary?), It remains to hang bonbs ( heck even vigorous) and air-to-surface missiles. So that is all! Wunderwaffe is done. Wait and see.
I have the honor.

[gladcu2]

cniza

GSH-18

Correctly summed up the resume. Revised the concept of close combat. This is the point of the article.

But there is always the possibility of information sabotage. To support the economically costly response of a potential adversary.

[Dezinto]

Well, go nuts now ....

[Mama_Cholli]

Really spectacular ...
Here the full-scale tests on the F35 of the SU 37 gun (in a real dog fight) would be much more spectacular ...
True, an interview with the F35 pilot after these tests would not have been necessary, for a good reason ....

[samara-58]

Nuuuu ... Oh, and not live !!!

[gjv]

And in our Penates the flight tests of the long-awaited PD-14 at the flying laboratory Il-76LL began.

The Il-76LL (tail number RA-76529, serial number 08-07) is equipped with the PD-14 engine No. 100-07. It was manufactured by Aviadvigatel OJSC (Perm) and sent to LII im. M.M. Gromov at the end of September 2015. During the tests of the PD-14 on the wing of the Il-76LL, the operational parameters of the engine operation will be recorded, telemetry will be carried out and the performance of the fuel and oil systems, as well as the automatic control system, will be evaluated.

[Maksus]

The main thing is that the pilot is alive.

[Asadullah]

The main thing is that the pilot is alive.

In honor of this event, he will present his watch to his son!

[Tusv]

Quote: Maksus

The main thing is that the pilot is alive.

Lucky. But it also happens

During the tests, the pilot of the F-11 Tiger tested a 20-mm cannon and managed to catch up with the shells that were fired from the guns of the aircraft.

[Buffalo]

Not only not spectacular, but also ineffective. Ours used 23 mm guns, with a higher rate of fire than the Yankees, and found that 30 mm were more suitable.

[voyaka uh]

Multi-barrel aviation?
The American has 4 trunks. 3000 rounds per minute.
And how many were 23 mm?

[gladysheff2010]

Our answer to Chamberlain (notice from 2 trunks):
GSh-2-30 (GSh-2-30K)
GSh-2-30 on a Su-25 airplane
Media
Su-25, Su-39, (Mi-24P)
Dimensions, m
Length
1978
Width
156
Height
185
Weight
Shell weight, g
390
Chuck weight, g
832
Mass of gun, kg
105 (126)
Features
Caliber, mm
30
The number of trunks
2
Ammunition, cartridges
250 (750)
Rate of fire
Rate of fire, rds / min
3000 (300-2600)
Initial speed, m / s
900 (940)
Continuous queue length
standing
250

[voyaka uh]

Thank you.
Interesting. The Russians use Gast's 2-barrel scheme (with connecting rod)
and the Americans - the multi-barrel Gatling scheme (revolving principle).
The Gast scheme is simpler and lighter in weight; the Gatling scheme allows you to achieve more
rate of fire with less barrel heating.

[GSH-18]

Quote: voyaka uh

The Gast scheme is simpler and lighter in weight; the Gatling scheme

You want to say that 4 trunks weigh lighter than 2? I thought the Jews know how to count ..
And so, for erudition, Gryazev and Shipunov are considered world legends of machine gun and cannon aviation weapons. I highly doubt that they designed heavy and low-speed weapons for the aircraft This is rather the destiny of our American and other NATO partners. Feel free, but it is.

[Pimply]

Quote: GSH-18

You want to say that 4 trunks weigh lighter than 2? I thought the Jews know how to count.

Do you even know how to read? The Gast system is used in the construction of GSH-23. YOU DIRECTLY WRITE THAT THIS SYSTEM IS EASY.

[sabakina]

The question is how much BK he takes with him ...

[Secta haki]

And what a result is an insignificant density of fire.

[dvg79]

6 and 12000 respectively.

[Secta haki]

Looking for what

[gjv]

And today at the Admiralty shipyards a solemn ceremony of transferring diesel-electric submarines of project 636.3 "Krasnodar" to the Navy took place.

[Mama_Cholli]

Quote: gjv

And today at the Admiralty shipyards a solemn ceremony of transferring diesel-electric submarines of project 636.3 "Krasnodar" to the Navy took place.

The news is certainly good, but a bit in style, and I also have a brother boxer. )))) +
But if it were written that for the first time diesel-electric submarines of project 636.3 "Krasnodar" tested a cannon in the air !!! That would be .... number))

[gjv]

Quote: Mama_Cholli

if only it were written that the first diesel-electric submarine of project 636.3 "Krasnodar" tested a cannon in the air !!!

Krasnodar "- Project 636.3 diesel-electric submarine" Varshavyanka. "Designed to combat enemy submarines and ships, to defend naval bases, coastal and sea communications, reconnaissance and patrol activities on enemy communications.
The boat was launched on April 25, 2015.
The surface displacement is 2350 tons, the underwater displacement is 3950 tons, the maximum length is 73 meters, the maximum hull width is 10 meters, the average draft is 6,2 meters, the surface speed is 17 knots, the underwater speed is 20 knots, the working depth is 240 meters, the maximum immersion depth is 350 meters, the crew is 52 people, the autonomy is 45 days, the diving range at an economic speed of 400 miles.
The Krasnodar is armed with 6 533 mm bow torpedo tubes with automatic loading, 18 torpedoes, 24 mines, 4 missiles "Caliber", MANPADS "Strela-3" or "Igla", 8 missiles. “Are these airborne test tricks?”

[SPLV]

Quote: gjv

diesel-electric submarine of project 636.3 "Varshavyanka"

The lead submarine of Project 877 (Halibut), according to NATO classification Kilo (Varshavyanka), entered service in 1980. By and large, it differs from the improved project 636 only in the absence of the "Caliber".
For the Black or Caspian Sea, of course, this is a good option, but for ocean-going fleets - the North and Pacific Oceans, it would be time to think about air-independent power plants. That way a few years ago. Or will we try to ride on the Soviet past? Such an event is not a triumphant, but an ordinary, normal one, not worthy of such discussion after an article on aviation. Now, if VNEU was installed on the 636th, there would be a reason for conversation. Otherwise, soon we will install "Calibers" on the reserve rolling stock with steam traction and rejoice at how smart WE are, this will definitely be unparalleled in the world.

[gjv]

Construction of the Varshavyanka series for the Black Sea Fleet began in August 2010. The first boat "Novorossiysk" was transferred to the fleet on September 17, 2014, the second - "Rostov-on-Don" - on December 30, 2014, the third - "Stary Oskol" - on July 3, 2015, the fourth - "Krasnodar" - November 5, 2015 ...
Two more boats - "Veliky Novgorod" and "Kolpino" - are currently under construction at the Admiralty shipyards in St. Petersburg.
The transfer of a series of Project 636.3 Varshavyanka submarines to the Black Sea Fleet will be completed on November 25, 2016. This was announced by Rear Admiral Viktor Kochemazov, Head of the Combat Training Directorate of the Russian Navy, during the ceremony of raising the Andreevsky flag on the fourth boat of the series.
All six boats will be based at the Novorossiysk naval base. Now Novorossiysk is already based there.

[kamil_tt]

and how does news about a submarine, even repeated twice, relate to the F-35 cannon?

[samara-58]

Well, seven feet under the keel and "gauge" in the shafts !!!

[GSH-18]

Quote: gjv

And today at the Admiralty shipyards a solemn ceremony of transferring diesel-electric submarines of project 636.3 "Krasnodar" to the Navy took place.

To us, in the Black Sea will go!

[PlotnikoffDD]

Charles Tricky made one burst of 22 rounds and two of 30 from the integrated four-barreled GAU-60 / A cannon. ”

After 5 years, new tests, try to get out of the gun somewhere.

[Same lech]

the 5th generation multifunctional aircraft F-35 Lightning II for the first time tested its 25-mm cannon in the air,

The mountain gave birth to a mouse ... what an achievement.

[Tusv]

Promise to customers. Although the National Interest sent the F-35 to the top five worst American pepelats, the cannon can fire even in the air

[Appius]

Americans even have nothing to boast about)))

[Morrow]

What about stealth technology?

[NEXUS]

Quote: Morrrow

What about stealth technology?

Stealth technology was originally invented not by the Americans, but in the USSR.

[cniza]

[quote = gjv] And today, at the Admiralty shipyards, a solemn ceremony of transferring the diesel-electric submarines of project 636.3 "Krasnodar" to the Navy took place.
[center] [img]



And also a decision was made to extend this series.

[Caustic]

The Turks comment so ... IN THE WORLD THE MOST STRONG AGAIN HE (THIS)

[Wedmak]

Well, at least kill, I don’t understand the Americans and their system for the release of new aircraft. Already riveted more 150 boards. And ... tests are still underway .. now we got to the gun! Ept. 2013 tested the missile launch system. Prior to this, in 2012, patching (i.e. standing on the ground, model bombs were thrown into the pit from the bomb bay) were tested for bombs.
I'm actually in ah ... e. We have T-50 (the first flight in 2010), 6 copies at this moment, and testing the tail and mane. From 4 they began to fly for combat use. And then ... from 2006 of the year !!! come testing guns !!!
And still so pathetically they say that they say that contrary to criticism, IT WORKS SAME! And such money, it should work 5 years ago and cause fear !!!!
And if they find a serious jamb in a critical system? All 150 boards redo?

[kunstkammer]

at least kill I do not understand Americans

but why is it incomprehensible? They collect money from all over the world, including Russian, and they want it and what they want riveted.
If Che - Nabiulina call .. she still throws tugriks.

[DarthVedro]

So they reworked when they discovered the problem of fuel ignition during fuel discharge. Then, of course, there were fewer boards, but the cut was obvious

[Wedmak]

but the cut is obvious

I drank it with a cut, but damn it’s not too lazy ... and how can one be friends with such a conscience?

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: Wedmak

And if they find a serious jamb in a critical system? All 150 boards redo?

Yes, this is nonsense - 150 boards. Vaughn Volkswagen must recall 2 million cars due to low-quality diesel and they don’t cry. The main thing is that they are already sold at a high price.

[Morrow]

The Pentagon wanted a family of fighters, and so it is necessary to work out on different prototypes.

[mvg]

Do you know for sure that all 6 aircraft fly? Only recently we drew an article that the 6th copy went to repair the 5th, whose engines surged on takeoff .. and the glider caught fire .. so, 3 gliders fly, 2 more on the ground, strength tests, and then .. then gliders fly, with engines of the previous generation (ed 117), with an incomprehensible AFAR (in the sense that they will leave it or put something better) with an incomplete set of avionics .. each glider tests its own piece of equipment. Big doubts that there is at least 1 !!! a pre-production sample, on which everything that will be on the first series in the promised 2016 is worth. It's just looking TRUTH in the eye. If there were, they would have already boasted not at one MAKS or Le Bourget .. The DB rocket generally does not fit into the fighting compartment, bastard, it does not physically fit .. There is still GSE for years, if you really look .. we will get something in 2018. planes 8-12 .. The bourgeoisie will already have several hundred. They promise to make 120-150 pieces per year ..

[Altona]

Now I don't understand anything ... There is a cannon, it means there is a melee weapon to resist the enemy in dog-fighting, close combat ... The commentators wrote about this above, the clumsy and not outstanding airplane deviates from its main mission "invisible long-range strike "... Then what was all this created for? We will see how this wunderwaffe will manifest itself in real, and not in ideal conditions ... So far, it is not particularly impressive and not even in terms of entertainment, but in terms of design and achieved result ...

[kunstkammer]

the pilot looks just lucky ... uh, it cost, although he didn’t shoot himself .. and that’s joy!

[Diviz]

The information was that the laser gun will be put on f35. Not well, maybe they just test the prototype of next fighters on which there will be a fundamentally new engine. And so this plane into the furnace.

[yuriy55]

The first tests were not spectacular and very modest. According to the publication, “test pilot Major Charles Tricky made one turn from 22 shots and two from 30 from the integrated four-barreled gun GAU-60 / A. The shooting itself lasted a few seconds.

I want to laugh at such progress and quickness. He tested a gun at the age of fourteen (of an airplane) ...
The question itself begs itself: "And at 13 years old could not yet? Late puberty?" Well, of course, the first time the "shooting" lasts a few seconds and this process should not be advertised ...

[polite people]

Our electronic warfare systems nullify all the efforts of American aircraft designers.

[yuriy55]

So they test aircraft guns:

[parafoiler]

Well, somehow collapsed, I hope ?!

[sabakina]

F-35 first tested the gun in the air

Mmmmmmm, have you been in vacuo before?

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: sabakina

Mmmmmmm, have you been in vacuo before?

No, they tested it on a stand on the ground. Well, of course in the air, but not on the plane during the flight.

[search engine]

Quote: Temples

The intention to refuse to purchase F-35 was previously announced by the new Prime Minister of Canada Justin Trudeau. The Pentagon has already decided that because of the demarche of neighbors, the US economy will receive at least $ 65 million.

Canadians only wanted to buy a tail for 65 million?
Today, every F-35 costs $ 138 million.

After testing the gun, the price will skyrocket to $ 150 million

[kamil_tt]

Quote: just EXPL

what if he is capable of 1900 mph? then what? what would you convince in the war should our pilots die until they come up with a new tactic?

convince what? what is it subsonic? what does the death of pilots?

[v1tz]

Either shooting, or airing the "bunch" outgoing from the cockpit ...

[Major Yurik]

Sorry, Vitaliy! I accidentally pressed the wrong one, probably getting old, do not demand!

[Kostya]

It is time for them to think about the means of salvation ...)

[kamil_tt]

Quote: Pimply

Quote: GSH-18

Well, they flatter themselves very much. F-35 does not seem to be attracted to the 5-generation, if only because it is subsonic.

Do not smack nonsense.

not in sports, they will zamusuyut nevertheless, the person decided that it’s not sound and that’s all, even though you crack, but the characteristics are all faked)

[Altona]

http://rusvesna.su/news/1446729835

On "Russian Spring" there is an article about the five worst fighters, so there is a fighter that "knocked out" itself, caught up with its own shells from a cannon ... A joke practically ...

The third place is occupied by the carrier-based fighter of the American Navy Grumman F-11 Tiger, known primarily for the fact that in the literal sense of the word he knocked himself out. During the tests, the F-11 Tiger pilot tested a 20-mm cannon and managed to catch up with the shells that it fired from the guns, writes The National Interest.

[Pimply]

Quote: Altona

On "Russian Spring" there is an article about the five worst fighters, so there is a fighter that "knocked out" itself, caught up with its own shells from a cannon ... A joke practically ...

On "Russian Spring" they write a lot of things

[mvg]

Quote: Sergei1982

F-35 will cost 85-90

That's when it will be later and say.

how much do we sell 30MKI to India?

40-50mil, but for example, Kazakhstan Su-30SM cost 5 mn rubles for 4 units, that is, 1,25 mn rubles per unit or 20 mil.

And there will be more than 3000 of these "pepelats" ..

Makein requires a reduction in procurement f-35.

Not true. The F-35s of Turkey and Italy are sold for 116 million, they sell themselves for 86 million, there are more links there .. And this is also that they will be produced in a number of countries. Italy, Japan, Holland ... i.e. the local budget will take away more money. And India's Su-30MKI "go" 100 million. $, otherwise they would not have considered Rafal and Eurofighter's offer of 120 million each. Kazakhstan and Belarus are not an indicator, this is the CSTO, we practically "give" them weapons, just as the "God's chosen" demand "gifts" for themselves ... in the amount of 3.1 billion. $. Even an old F-20 is not worth 16 million, the cheapest is about 36 million, about 30 million is China's export FC-1.
For the Su-35S, Su-30SM (MKK, MKI, etc.) there is no sighting equipment on the ground .. These are now pure interceptors. There passive headlamps, such a resolution as 30x30 cm, were not seen spawn ..
How much do you think the price tag for the T-50 (FCPGA if any) will be for Russia and India if we buy it in the amount of 150-200 pieces? I am afraid that we will catch up with the F-22A .. Only those have ALREADY been flying since 1997, there are trained pilots, a bunch of "childhood" diseases have been fixed, there is a tactic of application ..
PS: Not everything is so fun, but not everything is so bad .. But one should not underestimate the ENEMY .. Even those planes on which Europe flies .. and BV. Rafali, Typhoons, Needles, Vipers .. Very worthy rivals.

[starec.luka]

Explain to me who doesn’t understand, why a gun on a fighter ... if I blow our air off it .... sorry .... but I'm an infantry
what for....
now in Syria we throw bombs

[Vlad5307]

Quote: Maxom75

You can laugh a lot, but our T-50 has not yet been accepted into service, but oh, how it is already needed.

I strained my budget, which ultimately delayed testing and refinement for another 5 years! But I do not think that the appearance of 5th generation aircraft will give such serious advantages in the air - so far this is a very expensive toy and nothing more! In practice, these advantages (supposedly inconspicuous) will be offset by the use of electronic warfare and good AFAR, not to mention the counteraction to them from modern air defense.

[Wolka]

in agony, but gave birth

[mosquito]

I don’t understand, because they announced the "achievement of combat readiness" ...

[iov]

Quote: just EXPL

the warthog is also not a su-35, but it was a very efficient aircraft.

the warthog is an A-10 ????