Military Review

"" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"

349
I decided to write an article that would provoke the anger of both the “kremlebotov” and the “fifth column”. I want to play the role of a “devil's advocate” for a person who is hated by both those and those - Anatoly Serdyukov.


"" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"


So, yesterday Serdyukov was again widely heard, as he was appointed to Rostec, which caused outrage among absolutely all political forces.

I am not (not) an exception. If you look through my FB in the years when he was a minister, then you will immediately see that I have repeatedly published over critical articles about him.

But let's analyze his actions without unnecessary emotions. So Serdyukov became Minister of Defense in 2007. A year later, our army 08.08.08 barely managed to win the war against Georgia. If it were not for the heroism of the peacekeepers and militias in Tskhinval, if not for the operational and coordinated actions of the Pskov paratrooper and the Chechen battalion "Vostok", then the Georgians could have reached the Roki tunnel and won their operation "Clean Field".

In that war, an obese 58 Army commander was wounded, as he rushed to Tskhinval on the Volga almost without cover and was ambushed, in which several of our guys posthumously became “Heroes of Russia”, covering up the journalists who were to cover the victorious entry of the general to the capital of South Ossetia.

In the war, Russia also lost including the Tu-22MR, as the commander-in-chief of the Air Force, who, according to sources, commanded the war on an ordinary cell phone, sent the plane intended for bombardment from high altitudes to reconnaissance at low altitudes.

This was our army in 2008 when Serdyukov arrived. He left in November 2012-th, and in February 2014-th, that is, after just 15 months, the world appeared "Polite People" and the Russian army, which NATO recognizes more than all the European armies combined.

Either we now believe that “Serdyukov ruined the army”, and Shoigu, in a little over a year, brought it to an unprecedented level of training and combat capability, or we realize that such processes are not done so quickly, and, therefore, “Polite people” and fashionable pilots VKS in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukovskim reforms.

Already after Serdyukov’s resignation, he read an article (unfortunately, I cannot find it now) that he did the impossible with the Defense Ministry - he cleaned the department from the generals, who were used to the fact that the soldiers were free labor for the construction of summer cottages. He spent huge federal money on actual bribes to transfer the sons of the generals, who did not know anything about the art of war, to other non-military posts, in order to leave real professionals in the Ministry of Defense.

He demanded that the military-industrial complex justify its prices, and produce new types of weapons, while the generals, accustomed to kickbacks and the “hand washes” scheme, did not want to change with the era.

In this regard, the generals and the military-industrial complex, whose usual muddy charter Serdyukov destroyed, hated him, and constantly shared this with the press.

There were a lot of mistakes in his reforms - for example, the abandonment of the Cadets at the Victory Parades, and of course the poet Vasilieva.

But in general, Serdyukov received those still Augean stables, clearing them up, and having pretty much smeared shit, he became a whipping boy, giving way to the real hero and public favorite Shoigu.

But everyone who understands the slowness and slowness of such a colossus as the Russian Army cannot but understand that without Serdyuk reforms there would be no “Polite People”, the Crimea, Syria, etc.

Putin understands this, and, apparently, for those services to Russia (about which textbooks will never be written stories) and allows the former minister to now get a normal position in the state corporation.

But if you think and analyze. And if you just do at least a pro-Kremlin, even a pro-liberal populism, then, naturally, you have to shout, be indignant and indignant.
Author:
Originator:
http://russia-insider.com/ru/oborona-i-bezopasnost/vezhlivymi-lyudmi-i-modnymi-letchikami-vks-v-siriyskom-nebe-my-obyazany-v-tom
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  1. Hammer
    Hammer 2 November 2015 05: 27 New
    +3
    So the first went
    1. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 2 November 2015 05: 53 New
      27
      "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"
      короче говоря,сердюков с васильевой,оплачивают сирийскую кампанию из наворованных денег! вот за чей счёт "банкет"!(автор искренне порадовал)
      1. subbtin.725
        subbtin.725 2 November 2015 07: 12 New
        26
        Пора икону писать.И малевать будет "талантливая" поэтесса Васильева.
        1. Letun
          Letun 2 November 2015 07: 22 New
          11
          She will also sing a hymn and dance in slippers wink
          1. Eugene-Eugene
            Eugene-Eugene 2 November 2015 09: 20 New
            21
            Предположим, что Сердюков, со слов автора, "получил те еще авгиевы конюшни, расчистив которые, и изрядно измазавшись дерьмом, он стал мальчиком для битья". И что дальше? Для народа он стал символом коррупции. Общественность в лучшем случае не хочет его видеть и слышать. Так зачем его снова двигать по служебной иерархии? Он что, такой незаменимый? Выбросить и забыть, есть масса более способных людей с незапятнанной репутацией.
            1. Mahmut
              Mahmut 2 November 2015 09: 39 New
              29
              A year later, 08.08.08 our army was barely able to win the war against Georgia

              Well, firstly, defeating the state’s army in 5 days is not barely possible.
              Secondly, not our army, but just a military district, developed and implemented this military company, and in a very limited time. Hence the errors. The General Staff, on these days, by pure coincidence, was moving.
              1. Alexey RA
                Alexey RA 2 November 2015 10: 05 New
                31
                Quote: Mahmut
                Secondly, not our army, but just a military district, developed and implemented this military company, and in a very limited time.

                Вот не надо про "разрабатывал в ограниченные сроки". Планы подобной операции должны были быть в округе начиная с момента ввода миротворцев. И планы эти были: если кто не помнит - в аккурат перед 08.08.08 закончились очередные учения "Кавказ-2008", на которых отрабатывались как раз действия округа в случае нападения на миротворцев в ЮО.
                Second, the just a military district had 2 combat ready (according to documents) divisions - out of 5 available in all ground forces. And he got the gain - Airborne Forces, Air Force, Black Sea Fleet.

                Moreover, the aggravation of the situation around Tskhinvali was well known a week before the start of the fighting.
                1. Azitral
                  Azitral 2 November 2015 10: 16 New
                  16
                  Did not fight, no? So in the war 08.08.08 the level of mess was minimal. The operation was quite worthy, and there are only parades to the music, in orderly rows, and without casualties. Smart Germans were still wary, noting the speed of reaction and the level of organization of actions. This staff continued to laugh. Let them continue on. It would be good.
                  1. Alexey RA
                    Alexey RA 2 November 2015 10: 25 New
                    35
                    Quote: Azitral
                    Did not fight, no? So in the war 08.08.08 the level of mess was minimal. The operation was quite worthy, and there are only parades to the music, in orderly rows, and without casualties.

                    Yeah ... the commander who was wounded in an ambush, the downed DA reconnaissance reconnaissance unit, half of the downed Su-25s were on their own conscience, working for two days directly on the enemy’s advanced radar station ... a minimal mess.
                    И это я ещё не вспоминаю про то, на чём воевала армия. "Лысые" Т-62 (без "бровей Ильича" и ДЗ), БМП-1 без ПТУР, сами ПТУР с истекшими сроками, "чугуний", вываливаемый ВВС. И неизменная "форма №8" на военнослужащих, включая даже трофейную.
                    We were very lucky that the Georgians got into opponents.
                    1. biznaw
                      biznaw 2 November 2015 10: 45 New
                      +3
                      Quote: Alexey RA
                      We were very lucky that the Georgians got into opponents.


                      If instead of a Georgian polyphonic choir there would be performers of American folk songs, the result would be the same. Since the plans and actual leadership were carried out by American military experts. Planning is one thing - smoothly on paper, and there are ravines - this is the nature of the soldiers. After naval bombardment with Genocides and infantry combat with soldiers shod in rubber Chinese sneakers, the Georgians would flee faster than the Georgians fleeing towards the Canadian border
                      1. Baikonur
                        Baikonur 2 November 2015 11: 27 New
                        +7
                        we are obliged, including Serdyukov


                        In gives author-Cossack!
                      2. afdjhbn67
                        afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 44 New
                        10
                        Quote: Baikonur
                        In gives author-Cossack!

                        Well, the author proved about the Kremlin boats and the fifth column .. laughing
                        Hold my plus buddy ..
                      3. podpolkovnik
                        podpolkovnik 2 November 2015 12: 22 New
                        +9
                        In that war, Russia also lost, including the Tu-22MR, since the Air Force Commander-in-Chief, ... poisoned a plane intended for bombing from high altitudes, exploration at low altitudes.

                        Is everything normal with my eyesight?
                      4. Company
                        Company 2 November 2015 15: 55 New
                        +1
                        In-in, and the letter P says that this is a scout.
                  2. Dormidont2
                    Dormidont2 2 November 2015 12: 10 New
                    10
                    It remains to declare Khodorkovsky Putin's successor laughing this, thanks to Hodor of the Russian Federation, increased oil sales, at one time
                  3. Good me
                    Good me 2 November 2015 12: 47 New
                    14
                    Quote: Baikonur
                    In gives author-Cossack!


                    Раз такой "компот", то вот, в довершение,"ВИШЕНКА НА ТОРТ". Чтоб плебс помнил, и не забывался, на КОГО "батон крошит", критикуя тем или иным образом то, что связано с сердюковщиной...

                    02.11.2015, 12: 14
                    The head of the presidential administration, Sergei Ivanov, commented on the appointment of former Russian defense minister Anatoly Serdyukov to the post of industrial director for the aviation industry at Rostec state corporation.

                    According to Ivanov, the Kremlin learned about the appointment of Serdyukov from the media yes yes yes (people hawala). "Neither the prosecutor’s office, nor the judiciary have any complaints against him, but there is no trial fellow », - RIA Novosti quotes a statement by the head of the presidential administration.

                    https://russian.rt.com/article/127354

                    Mock, male, to white ... Kennel am

                    At least, I wouldn’t mention the authorities that MUST ensure the rule of law in this situation, shameful for the Kremlin ...
                2. Alexey RA
                  Alexey RA 2 November 2015 12: 27 New
                  14
                  Quote: biznaw
                  Planning is one thing - smoothly on paper, and there are ravines - this is the nature of the soldiers. After naval bombardment with Genocides and infantry combat with soldiers shod in rubber Chinese sneakers, the Georgians would flee faster than the Georgians fleeing towards the Canadian border

                  Какие геноциды, откуда? БТГ в Грузии имели максимум - "Акации" и "Сани" с "Нонами". Даже "Мста" - и та не засветилась.

                  Шапкозакидательство к хорошему не приводит... а мантры про "боевой дух", "характер солдат" и "изнеженных янки" в прошлый раз кончились для их любителей "специальными отрядами" и грибами над городами.
            2. max15243
              max15243 2 November 2015 11: 01 New
              19
              That's just the food was completely forgotten, they didn’t give out sukhpai, they didn’t organize field kitchens. On the third day, the staff was crawling through the gardens, since the month of August was good, in those parts only the lazy ones would die of hunger at that time.
          2. afdjhbn67
            afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 46 New
            +6
            Quote: Alexey RA
            Secondly, only the military district had 2 combat-ready (according to documents) divisions - out of 5 available in all ground forces. And he got the gain - Airborne Forces, Air Force, Black Sea Fleet.

            In short, as always - the Russian team won
            1. Alexey RA
              Alexey RA 2 November 2015 12: 57 New
              +6
              Quote: afdjhbn67
              In short, as always - the Russian team won

              This is yes.

              I just wish that instead of a hodgepodge from all over the air traffic police, units and formations of the okrug would be at war - which, according to all the okrug’s reports, was quite enough then. And in fact the divisions in 2008 could put up a maximum of 3 BTG.
        2. comprochikos
          comprochikos 2 November 2015 10: 26 New
          -8
          Serdyukov was just a well-designed screen under which military reform was carried out. Brains were powdered to the West, like everything is bad with us. And then bang, get and sign, adversaries. Therefore, he does not sit yet, he did his job and he left
          1. Good me
            Good me 2 November 2015 11: 13 New
            13
            Quote: comprochikos
            Serdyukov was just a well-designed screen under which military reform was carried out.


            А ещё, Васильева, за этой ширмой,практически "каменной горой", любимые красные тапочки держала...

            Comfortable, such, SCREEN ...
            1. afdjhbn67
              afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 39 New
              +7
              Quote: Good Me
              Comfortable, such, SCREEN ...

              In the meantime, the West fooled the West with the help of Serdyukov .. The CIA, MOSSAD, BND and so forth dismissed their agents on vacation ... a strong argument of supporters ... Serdyukov laughing
              1. tomket
                tomket 2 November 2015 12: 36 New
                +4
                Quote: afdjhbn67
                etc. disbanded their agents on vacation ... a strong argument of supporters ... Serdyukov

                Anyway, everything became pacifists there)))) the army dismissed))))
          2. tomket
            tomket 2 November 2015 12: 35 New
            +3
            Quote: comprochikos
            Serdyukov was just a well-designed screen under which military reform was carried out

            Tricky iPhone Wanderer Plan?
            Quote: comprochikos
            Brains were powdered to the West, like everything is bad with us.

            Well yes. everything is shitty, they bought a breakthrough t-72БЗ that would use the West to powder their brains ....
            Quote: comprochikos
            And then bang, get and sign, adversaries

            And then bang, get it! how were t-72 bz remained! tremble West !!!!
            1. Independent
              Independent 2 November 2015 15: 17 New
              10
              Quote: tomket
              Sly plan

              В Ваш список еще можно добавить закрытие военных училищь с целью продажи земли, на которой они находились - результат - несколько лет пропали и военспецов не обучили,работают старые кадры. Закрытие и разрушение аэродромов. Ох как много в этот список добавить можно. До сих пор аукается. До сих пор в нашу часть хлеб возят за 300 км, хотя в городе 2 хлебозавода. "Славянка",блин, не хочет подыхать.
              1. dyksi
                dyksi 2 November 2015 17: 29 New
                15
                Также хочется напомнить слова одного из руководителей ВВС, после серии авиакатастроф военных самолетов, что главной причиной этих катастров, является уничтожение системы подготовки техсостава и вс его прочего что связано с обслуживанием военных самолетов. Эта статья в архивах ВО у нас имеется. И кто занимался всем этим? "Товарищ" которого пропихнули в "Ростех" и который будет заниматься приватизацией оборонных предприятий, которые по "чистой случайности" туда передали вместе с назначением этого перца (ВОРА). Не плохо, пригласит весь свой гарем и продолжат "привычный образ жизни". Вор на воре и вором подгоняет. Ничего у нас не меняется. Поделили между собой промышленность, скважины и развешивают людям лапшу, о непорочности и нестяжании. Последнее доверие после таких статеек испаряется, вы уж лучше вообще ничего не пишите, народ все равно знает как вы там загребаете, но по крайней мере не лицемерили бы.
          3. Independent
            Independent 2 November 2015 15: 06 New
            +7
            Quote: comprochikos
            Serdyukov was just a well-designed screen under which military reform was carried out. Brains were powdered to the West, like everything is bad with us. And then bang, get and sign, adversaries. Therefore, he does not sit yet, he did his job and he left

            Not naive yet.
            1. ancient
              ancient 2 November 2015 18: 22 New
              +3
              Quote: Independent
              Not naive yet.


              Ну..не такие уж они и.."наивные"...спасать то.."хозяина" надо..хотя чего его спасать..он непотопляем, как авианосец wink ..with such a rating .. how much already ..99%? wassat
          4. dmi.pris
            dmi.pris 2 November 2015 21: 02 New
            +1
            Wow ... A terrible MILITARY SECRET has opened ... In the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation there are such troops .. they don’t even give out machine guns .. (but no, not a battalion) -CORRUPTION ..
            Quote: comprochikos
            Serdyukov was just a well-designed screen under which military reform was carried out. Brains were powdered to the West, like everything is bad with us. And then bang, get and sign, adversaries. Therefore, he does not sit yet, he did his job and he left
        3. seos
          seos 2 November 2015 14: 16 New
          +4
          Во время "разгрома" было допущено огромное количество тактических и стратегических ошибок повлекшие потери в технике и имидже страны. На мой взгляд основная ошибка -жадность ... пытались победить с минимальными финансовыми затратами использую просроченные и устаревшие боеприпасы и оружие... если бы жахнули по наступающим воскам кассетными бомбами, то война бы закончилась не за 5 дней а за 5 минут.
      2. Asadullah
        Asadullah 2 November 2015 10: 25 New
        10
        For the people, it has become a symbol of corruption.


        And what did he corrupt there? Vasilieva? Frankly, her financial situation corresponds to the position of the head of the operational department of which Moscow police department. At the very same Serdyukov declared property is very modest. There is a suspicion of a son, relatives? Probably something is, but not in such quantities that may surprise and interest.

        As for army affairs, one must realize what the Russian army represented before Serdyukov. It was a huge clumsy bureaucratic machine, devouring huge budget funds for other purposes. It was his task to remove everything superfluous, everything that interferes with combat effectiveness. He completed the task. Perhaps rude, awkward, not particularly ceremonious with the highest command staff. Yes, without ceremony, I was just watching stripy fat grandfathers, with red faces from anger, running around with bypass sheets. I watched with pleasure.

        A separate issue of the military industrial complex, namely under Serdyukov, was the rule to exclude offshore zones from the work of defense enterprises. Somehow it does not fit with the image of a corrupt official. For this, squealing walkers the whole year besieged the Kremlin, predicting the collapse of enterprises. But they didn’t fall apart somehow .... Yes, Serdyukov was an unpleasant person and was cut by a leader who left a lot of unpleasant impressions, but he reminds me more of a surgeon who had surgery without anesthesia, anesthesia is now expensive. It was painful, but everything healed quickly and nothing was inflamed.

        Enraged by his new appointment? But he is a team man, and only solves the assigned tasks, and does not flee to London and does not become a fighter against the regime. Yes, given his methods, and in a new place, it will hurt someone .....
        1. Jack-b
          Jack-b 2 November 2015 10: 51 New
          +1
          Quote: Asadullah
          . Yes, given his methods, and in a new place, it will hurt someone .....

          Не думаю. Мавр сделал своё дело, мавр может отдыхать. Вспомните как в своё время на пост премьера подоткнули Кириенко. Он охватил по полной программе за дефолт, хотя назначен был на пост премьера всего за полгода до него. Отхватил, вывел из под удара черномордина и ушёл на "отдых". Теперь посиживает себе тихо мирно на спокойных должностях, последнее время в росатоме. Так что и Сердюков возможно пойдёт по тому же сценарию.
          1. tegezen
            tegezen 2 November 2015 11: 43 New
            +6
            Kiriyenko is sitting peacefully .. well, that’s not so at all, he is the head of Rosatom, the most important direction, this is one level of Gozprom, Rosneft, Rostec. Minister for the Nuclear Industry.
            1. Jack-b
              Jack-b 2 November 2015 12: 27 New
              +3
              Что значит "не так"? А с кем он воюет? Сидит себе тихо, особо не высовывается, изредка всплывает на подписание договора и снова в тенёчек. Реформ не проводит, ни с кем не ссорится. Да направление важное. Но местечко то спокойное.
        2. afdjhbn67
          afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 42 New
          +8
          Quote: Asadullah
          but he reminds me more of a surgeon who had surgery without anesthesia, anesthesia is now expensive. It was painful,

          We had a similar surgeon throughout the country -Gaidar clicked .. well, this is only for the army ..
          1. Good me
            Good me 2 November 2015 13: 39 New
            +1
            Quote: afdjhbn67
            We had a similar surgeon throughout the country -Gaidar clicked .. well, this is only for the army ..


            Narrow specialist ...
        3. The comment was deleted.
        4. tomket
          tomket 2 November 2015 12: 39 New
          +5
          Quote: Asadullah
          Enraged by his new appointment?

          infuriates.
          Quote: Asadullah
          But he’s a man of the team, and only solves the assigned tasks,

          tasks how to steal more?
          Quote: Asadullah
          rather than fleeing to London and becoming a fighter against the regime.

          so why should he run? initially nobody was going to touch him. so why should he fight with benefactor Putin?
          Quote: Asadullah
          Yes, given his methods, and in a new place, someone will be hurt.

          millions of about Xnumx will get hurt.
          1. alexng
            alexng 2 November 2015 13: 06 New
            -6
            Я не защищаю табуреткина, мне он лично не нравится, но надо быть более конкретным в обвинениях. Интересно, кто-нибудь может назвать хоть примерную сумму сворованную табуреткиным. Или тоже взято,как у Псаки, из "либерального" инета?

            This is so much a spoon for dect ... for high prosecutors.
            1. alexng
              alexng 2 November 2015 20: 09 New
              -7
              Во пошли, "подтабуреткины" - америкосовские подстилки минусовать дружно! Как последние дешевки без коментов. Ах дух захватывает!
              1. afdjhbn67
                afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 03: 55 New
                +1
                Quote: alexneg
                "подтабуреткины" - америкосовские подстилки

                Do not you think that it is difficult after that to wait for another reaction?
                one minus mine .. don't blame me ..
                1. alexng
                  alexng 5 November 2015 00: 53 New
                  -1
                  By the way, I didn’t put a single cheap thing on VO minuses -principally. As I consider it inability to lead discussion and cowardice.
                2. alexng
                  alexng 5 November 2015 00: 55 New
                  0
                  Duc, Taburetkin seems to be not being appointed to a new post, and who are you after that? I know that for sure.
        5. korvin1976
          korvin1976 2 November 2015 13: 26 New
          +2
          Almost completely agree with Asadullah
          Everything has two sides of the coin, and we saw only one side, so to speak, the front of this same coin, now there is another side.
          1. Хочется отметить даты "руководства" Сердюкова начало 2007г, конец 2012г. Что характерно, в 2007г у власти еще был ВВП, и в 2012г. уже стал ВВП. Значит ВВП Сердюкова назначил на данную должность, в конце своего правления, и уволил практически сразу при начале нового правления. О чем то это говорит? При всем этом думаю ни для кого не будет секретом, что во время правления ДАМ, ВВП играл практически главную роль, а ДАМ по факту был ширмой.
          2. In order to build something new, as a rule, it is necessary to break the old, but the one who will break this oldest will be for those who participate (feed) from this old, the worst enemy, and such things just will not forgive him. And then the principle begins to work: a bad and a good cop. A bad builder is being replaced by a good builder.
          3. For me, GDP has been and will be a talented strategist and tactician. It is quite difficult to calculate all combinations of the strategy and tactics of GDP. And all this can be read on our same forum: merged, not merged, merged, not merged. One can only guess in the process, and partially guess after all this, but unfortunately we have not been given the whole picture, the wrong level of access to information. It's like looking at a huge panorama from a distance of 50 cm.

          Serdyukov is a protege of GDP, he is also an employee of the GDP team. What is the last appointment.

          I agree with the hatred of Serdyukov, we have nothing to love him for, but as I wrote above, each medal has two sides.
          1. R-140
            R-140 2 November 2015 15: 54 New
            +1
            Totally agree with you. Serdyukov was not just staged.
          2. demo
            demo 2 November 2015 17: 31 New
            0
            3. For me, GDP has been and will be a talented strategist and tactician. It is quite difficult to calculate all combinations of the strategy and tactics of GDP. And all this can be read on our same forum: merged, not merged, merged, not merged. One can only guess in the process, and partially guess after all this, but unfortunately we have not been able to understand the whole picture .....

            Let me remind you of some facts.
            GDP has been in power for 15 years.
            It may be that he does not understand what he plans to do tomorrow or the day after, but if you read the newspapers with his statements from 2001-2005 and see what is made of what was promised, and what turned out to be a simple chatter, then certain conclusions can be drawn.
            It is advisable to look at a picture, especially of a large size, from far away.
            Here you are right.
            But conclusions about a person, about his mental abilities, about his tactical skills and strategic planning can be made in 5-7 years from the moment he came to power.

            В чем нельзя упрекнуть ВВП, так это в том, что он сдает "своих".
            Even if their own are already in the eyes of their people - finished .....

            If Serdyukov disgusts the overwhelming majority of the people of Russia, but his activity was necessary and useful, then to relieve tension in society it is NECESSARY to give detailed information in the form of a series of articles or programs (work for Solovyov) where we, the poor and the wretched, will explain everything and shelves laid out.

            And somehow it’s not comme il faut.
            1. korvin1976
              korvin1976 2 November 2015 18: 48 New
              -1
              It’s not always good to open all the information to the public. Don't you think so? The fact that the GDP has been in power for 15 years is not an indicator of what you are hinting at.
              Могу в очередной раз повторить уже по факту историческую справку про тандем ВВП и ДАМ. В первые два срока ВВП начал охоту на "крыс", и достаточное количество этих "крыс" вывел, но...... у "крыс" есть тенденция забиватся в глубокое подполье, из которого их достаточно сложно выковырять. И тут на смену "крысолову" ВВП, приходит либеральный "котенок" ДАМ. Как я писал выше, Сердюкова назначили еще при ВВП, и сняли уже при ВВП. На момент правления ДАМ "крысы" почувствовали ослабление и начали вылазить на ружу, а о том что они это почувствовали говорят пр-т Сахорова и Болотная площадь.
              In summary:
              - ВВП вытащил "крыс" на белый свет;
              - broke what had to be broken, using the zits of the chairmen (Serdyukov and others)
              - raised its rating, due to the removal from the posts of these same zits of chairmen;
              - Поставил на подготовленные места нужных людей, которые могут повести за собой "обиженных" предшественником;

              The fact that Serdyukov worked out the material, I fully agree, and his appointment to such a new position is either a miscalculation of the hatred of the people for this figure or a sober calculation for something else.

              It may be that he does not understand what he plans to do tomorrow or the day after, but if you read the newspapers with his statements from 2001-2005 and see what is made of what was promised, and what turned out to be a simple chatter, then certain conclusions can be drawn.
              Well, given the fact that at the moment Russia is not the same Russia as in 2001, and that the standard of living has clearly risen, then with a simple idle talk I just don’t dare to call it all.
              And the fact that GDP uses almost all known resources to achieve results, I consider it a big plus.
          3. win
            win 3 November 2015 15: 15 New
            +4
            Serdyukov is a protege of GDP, he is also an employee of the GDP team. What is the last appointment.


            The investigator of the prosecutor's office reports to the president:
            "Васильева показала на Сердюкова, Сердюков на Чубайса, Чубайс на Суркова, Сурков на Медведева, Медведев на..."
            "Достаточно..." - прерывает Владимир Владимирович:"...и так вполне очевидно, что никто ни в чём не виноват..."
          4. The comment was deleted.
        6. Uncle Joe
          Uncle Joe 2 November 2015 14: 57 New
          +8
          Quote: Asadullah
          And what did he corrupt there?
          The fact that pulling an owl on the globe qualified as negligence.

          As for army affairs, we must realize what the Russian army represented before Serdyukov
          Exactly the same as after.

          It was his task to remove all unnecessary
          And bury it too much on the way to a private recreation center?

          And what is superfluous, including military medicine and education?

          A separate issue of the military industrial complex, namely under Serdyukov, the rule was introduced to exclude offshore zones from the work of defense enterprises
          А в подтверждение этой Вашей фантазии ссылочку на "правило" дадите?

          Enraged by his new appointment? But he is a team man
          Namely (like Medvedev, Kudrin, Chubais, etc.) - otherwise, he would not have had a new position, but at least five strict workers.
          1. Asadullah
            Asadullah 2 November 2015 15: 42 New
            -4
            А в подтверждение этой Вашей фантазии ссылочку на "правило" дадите?


            Dear, you can find this without my modest labors. A discussion of working issues on the forum is not even stupid.

            В остальном, оставляя за скобками детали, скажу, что согласен почти полностью с вашей позицией, только, у меня другой ракурс и другой горизонт. И как всегда без аллегории этого не понять, потому представьте, вы начальник котельной маленького городка, оборудование дышит на ладан, трубы ржавые, вентили капают, время от времени на трассах прорывает. Взять бы да заменить все на новое. Только вот городок, замерзнет....от того латаем дыры, по возможности заменяем узлы, постепенно, что бы город не почувствовал. Параллельно "боремся", с теми, кто орет, - долой котельню! Да, будет все новое, хорошо работающее, но не по мановению волшебной палочки.

            And in detail, when I am on business in Moscow, I go to my former commander, who is in the high office of one office. I remember about three years ago, I look out the window at the parking lot of brand new premium cars parked, I ask whose car is this? Answers such a subordinate. Another car, another subordinate. And immediately abruptly breaks me: - Just don’t ask about anything! I don’t ask, because he himself rides on very low-cost vehicles, and he puts me a mattress to spend the night in the kitchen. I could have been in my guesthouse, but I don’t want to offend Dad. What is it for? I hope to explain too much that it is impossible to stop the untwisted flywheel with one desire, but if it was possible to isolate it from destruction, then it is a victory. And then, slowly stop.
            1. Uncle Joe
              Uncle Joe 2 November 2015 20: 58 New
              +4
              Quote: Asadullah
              Dear, you can find it
              So the reference is not able to give.

              Otherwise, leaving the details behind the brackets, I will say that I agree almost completely with your position
              You expressed your position, I said that your position is bullshit, and you agree with me on this?

              And as always without allegory
              This is not an allegory, but a meaningless set of phrases with a predefined statement instead of a conclusion.

              What is it for?
              To the fact that in the Russian Federation state-monopoly oligarchic capitalism with elements of feudal relations?
        7. esaull
          esaull 2 November 2015 15: 36 New
          +9
          Or maybe it's not the team but the Zubkov test?
        8. BEGA2015
          BEGA2015 2 November 2015 15: 46 New
          +8
          "...а не бежит в Лондон и не становится борцом против режима"- странный аргумент. Человека без элементарных знаний назначать на такую должность?! Вы хоть понимаете, что Вы написали полную чушь?
        9. SibSlavRus
          SibSlavRus 2 November 2015 16: 18 New
          0
          The only thing that speaks in favor of the author’s conclusions and his arguments is that the preparation and adoption of state decisions regarding the country's defense and national security are NOT ALREADY DEVELOPED or ACCEPTED, dear forum users.
          Corruption issues in the Ministry of Defense (including personnel issues related to this) are the level of organization of the performance of the organization’s management apparatus.
          Want to know the REAL leaders of the State, the level of development and adoption of government decisions? This is a deliberative governing body - the Security Council of the Russian Federation.
          And what happens there at the operational, tactical and strategic level of decision-making is not for open access. Many decisions are not published and will never be publicly available.
          If someone is in doubt, I can recommend not to be lazy and conduct a small analysis of at least constitutional and federal legislation, in part regarding.
      3. TiRex
        TiRex 2 November 2015 10: 55 New
        +3
        show these capable ...
      4. VOLOD
        VOLOD 2 November 2015 15: 48 New
        -1
        well, okay, someone who needs to clean the stables. to see and in ROSTEH their ossified generals formed.
      5. korvin1976
        korvin1976 2 November 2015 19: 10 New
        0
        The fact of the matter is that you may need a person in this position with a tarnished reputation. Why and for what, and what goals are being pursued here, I think we will soon find out.
        Но если считать, что это назначение тупо "своего" на теплое местечко, то тогда ВВП у нас не далекого ума, а этого за ним как то не наблюдалось. Вам так не кажется?
      6. Dart2027
        Dart2027 2 November 2015 19: 17 New
        -3
        Quote: Eugene-Eugene
        So why move it again in the service hierarchy? Is he so irreplaceable?

        And maybe that's why? It is possible that the same story with the stables will be repeated again.
      7. Foxmara
        Foxmara 2 November 2015 20: 27 New
        +3
        Yes, then, that does not give up. Throw one - the rest will run away. If you did what you were instructed, they won’t leave you, everyone should know this. And Pyakin chewed everything in detail a year or two ago in detail. [Media = https: //www.google.ru/webhp? Sourceid = chrome-instant & ion = 1 & espv = 2
        & ie = UTF-8 # q = pyakin% 20о% 20serdyukov]
  2. Nikolay K
    Nikolay K 2 November 2015 08: 32 New
    29
    They stole so much money that not enough for such an article. Years through 10, we were convinced that Serdyukov and Vasilyeva were crystal honest people who saved our army and world peace.
    1. Karabanov
      Karabanov 2 November 2015 08: 55 New
      12
      Tired of these custom articles with attempts to whitewash the feldmebel Taburetkin. Such an article is far from the first, and presumably not the last.
      1. Rostov Papa
        Rostov Papa 2 November 2015 09: 29 New
        +4
        Fresh joke - Serdyukov’s appointment to Rostec is the US response to the IS bombing in Syria.

        But seriously speaking, where to put it? He knows a lot, and so sits under the supervision, shifts the papers. Comrade Stalin resolved such questions very quickly, a bullet in the back of his head, but now the times are not the same.
        1. kit-kat
          kit-kat 2 November 2015 10: 51 New
          +3
          Where to go? The cartridge costs 16 rubles. And so how much should he pay?
      2. Scoun
        Scoun 2 November 2015 10: 42 New
        10
        Quote: Karabanov
        Tired of these custom articles with attempts to whitewash the feldmebel Taburetkin.

        And if you do not whitewash and reason?
        Quote: Karabanov
        Such an article is far from the first, and presumably not the last.

        Это вы статьи "очерняющие" Табуреткина? или только однобокое "что мне гоже"?
        Quote: Mahmut
        Secondly, not our army, but just a military district, developed and implemented this military company, and in a very limited time. Hence the errors

        )) тут вы не правы ))) ещё весной 2008 года, люди спецы на учениях в горах на границе с Грузией, чётко знали что "скоро будет". (Это я точно знаю, но ничего больше не добавлю).
        Quote: indeveral
        Of course! And Serdyukov also personally led troops in the war against Georgia!

        Well, here the comrade is malicious)))
        It is known for certain that the leadership was in Beijing and Serdyukov was on the prowl)) and they could not reach him for a day.
        Quote: Tambov Wolf
        Either the son in 24 years of age will be given an order for great service for the good, then the minister will be brought to power and the order will be thrown, and she, having stolen a hillock, will wander off.

        Вот сынков у дачных генералов было с избытком. )) Сейчас ордена и наворовавшие сидят в "Науке", администрациях городов и гебернаторствующие (take the governor of the Sverdlovsk region .... he doesn’t even have a secondary education and two diplomas were bought ... in Yekaterinburg there was even a share .. find a fellow student get a million)
        Quote: vladimirZ
        This is not thanks to Serdyukov-Taburetkin, but contrary to him, patriotic officers retained the Russian Army.

        Sorry Komrad)) of course patriotic but reminded - only a Russian person has a Trinity icon on his dashboard and an unfastened seat belt. )))
        Quote: Stas57
        that the army is fat cats at the top, forgotten how to fight, but having summer cottages, stars and so on. about it
        , emnip Putin said, said that at 888 they were barely picking battle-worthy from all over the country, and with that number.

        that’s what the revelry in the army’s generals was .. it’s a true truth .. I was building a construction site for high military ranks in Barvikha in 2003 - 2005))) but about 08.08.08 you were wrong))) GDP said about the invasion of militants in Dagestan in 1999 year.
        PS. laughing
        Комрады, я не хочу ни кого обелять ни очернять... но народ в основном кидается "лозунгами" и клише а людей старающихся реально порассуждать.. где быль а где небыль... очень мало. Лозунгисты )) впишите три любимых лозунга себе в профиль )) и будет вам "вечный кайф" как в анекдоте )))

        Have a good week for everyone and may there be no sad tragedies in November ...
        1. Karabanov
          Karabanov 2 November 2015 10: 57 New
          +9
          Quote: Scoun
          And if you do not whitewash and reason?

          I've already reasoned enough and heard enough about this topic ... Want, look for comments in my profile.
          The hero is molded of thieves and there are still furious defenders of it.
          Because I am so succinctly and express myself. Tired of ...
          1. Scoun
            Scoun 2 November 2015 11: 16 New
            +5
            Quote: Karabanov
            I've already reasoned enough and heard enough about this topic ..

            Простите пожалуйста.. но это первый признак сформированного "клише" по "горячим следам" а ведь на самом деле ... реалистичная оценка делам и поступкам приходит по происшествию определенного времени.. и только сейчас приходит время давать первые оценки тем реформам что произошли в Армии за последние скажем 8 лет и только сейчас на спокойную светлую голову можно рассуждать )))
            PS.
            This is how the people of Onishchenko made an icon for themselves))) and yes, I’m not afraid to anger a particularly hot egg, the patriotic part of the forum users will say))
            1. Who knows what legacy the Ministry of Emergencies (GO) received from the USSR ?! )))
            2. Who knows what is the current situation in the Ministry of Emergencies ?! )))
            3. Кто в курсе каким образом Шойгу за год создал "вежливых людей", эскадрильи вертолётов, "калибры", "Буяны" с "калибрами"...
            PS
            November 6th will be exactly three years since Shoigu became Minister of Defense.
            1. Karabanov
              Karabanov 2 November 2015 12: 03 New
              10
              Quote: Scoun
              Простите пожалуйста.. но это первый признак сформированного "клише"

              Yes, I don’t have any cliches. But there is a formed, albeit subjective, view of things.
              Все подобные рассуждения в защиту Сердюкова строятся по принципу - ну да... ну сукин сын, ну воровал, женский батальон завел, кадровых офицеров обижал, разваливал училища... Но он же и строил, реформировал армию, эдакий управленец (эффективный менеджер) с незамутненным армейским взглядом. И чаша весов принесенной "пользы" склоняется в его сторону, поболее чем привнесенного вреда... Что за рассуждения такие? Новая формируемая система оценок - он не только воровал, но еще чего-то там делал... Оригинально.
              Who is he? Is this mug? It was just after time that it became clear what the character holding the post of minister was most concerned about. Profit, plundering of money and other corruption affairs. And now some are urging to almost love the embezzler and his rogue and impudent, protégé spitting on the law and public opinion.
              He saw if he didn’t sleep at night, he cared about the strengthening and prosperity of the armed forces.
              He was given a task and he performed it, or do you think it was his initiative? But he fulfilled this task according to the principle - a step forward, two backward.
              Another person, more competent and really concerned about the state of our aircraft (and not the former director of a furniture store), would have done incomparably more and more successfully. But the leadership of the country did not find such a person or did not make out, but most likely played the principle of clan and kindred proximity to some high-ranking comrades.
              И справедливости ради, его нынешнее ухмыляющееся "табло" должно с кайлом на рудниках бегать, а не занимать руководящие посты в гос.корпорациях.
              1. Scoun
                Scoun 2 November 2015 12: 44 New
                +1
                Quote: Karabanov
                He was given a task and he performed it, or do you think it was his initiative? But he fulfilled this task according to the principle - a step forward, two backward.
                Another person, more competent and really concerned about the state of our aircraft (and not the former director of a furniture store), would have done incomparably more and more successfully.

                Mdya ... what can you say?
                Sergei Borisovich Ivanov was born in Leningrad in 1953. I received an offer to work for the State Security Committee while studying at the philological faculty of LSU. After graduating from the Higher School of the KGB of the USSR, he met Vladimir Putin, who worked in the same department. In 1998, thanks to this acquaintance, Ivanov, after the reorganization of the KGB, served in the Foreign Intelligence Service, received the post of deputy director of the Federal Security Service of Russia. Putin, then head of the FSB, made Ivanov the head of the Analysis, Forecasting and Strategic Planning Department, which was responsible for the Kremlin’s information support.
                In 1999, Putin, who became acting President of Russia, made Ivanov secretary of the country's Security Council. On November 9, Ivanov 2000 was dismissed from military service, and on March 28, 2001 he was appointed Minister of Defense. The Minister initiated reform of the army, which implied significant
                reduction in the number of military personnel, replacement of conscripts by contract soldiers, rearmament and change of the control mechanisms of the Armed Forces. He canceled the postponement of military service for conscripts and reduced the number of universities with military departments, and officially announced that he had rescued conscripts from military service in Chechnya.
                The Minister achieved an increase in the military budget, restored the practice of conducting large-scale military exercises, including joint exercises with the armies of other countries. At the end of 2005, Putin appointed him deputy prime minister, retaining him as head of the defense department. It was assumed that Ivanov would be responsible for the state of the military-industrial complex, the quality of manufactured products and their prices, however, Prime Minister Mikhail Fradkov retained a number of important powers in the defense industry.

                The reform did not start yesterday ..
                http://www.peoples.ru/state/minister/russia/ivanov/index2.html
                1. Karabanov
                  Karabanov 2 November 2015 14: 14 New
                  +7
                  Quote: Scoun
                  Mdya ... what can you say?

                  Here below, one user has a sound reasoning on this subject:
                  The performance by an official or official of his direct duties is already called a feat.
                  Survived ...
            2. tomket
              tomket 2 November 2015 12: 50 New
              +4
              Quote: Scoun
              Кто в курсе каким образом Шойгу за год создал "вежливых людей", эскадрильи вертолётов, "калибры", "Буяны" с "калибрами"...

              Сердюков был "крестным отцом" всех этих систем?)))Сутками с полигонов не вылазил тестируя лично Ми-28 и Су-34?)))) Позвоночник угробил на маршах на "Армате"?) Вот не надо в достижения сердюкову ставить закупку вооружение. Если у нас стали вливать деньги потоками в закупку вооружения, это не значит что сердюков приложил руку к их появлению. Те же самые су-34 появились на свет еще в 94году. МиГ-29к появился благодаря индусам. Как и Су-30СМ. Заслуга сердюкова в том что он выписал чек? ну так более чем уверен , что сердюков не обивал пороги правительства с просьбами выделить еще немного средств.
              1. Jack-b
                Jack-b 2 November 2015 13: 26 New
                0
                Quote: tomket
                Here it is not necessary to put the purchase of weapons in the achievement of Serdyukov.

                Ну в общем так же как нельзя ставить в достижения Путину подъём страны с начала его правления. Нефть добывали и до него, не он пахал на заводах, не он делал научные открытия и новейшие разработки. Не Путин мастерски действовал в Крыму и не он пилотирует самолёты в Сирии. "Мы с вами" конечно молодцы что всё это сделали. И ни Путин ни кто либо в стране персонально не может поставить себе это в достижения.
                1. tomket
                  tomket 2 November 2015 14: 17 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Jack-B
                  to achieve Putin’s rise in the country since the beginning of his reign. Oil was extracted before

                  Well, according to Siluanov’s forecasts, the little egg will end next year, and we’ll see what Putin built there and raised the economic one.
                  Quote: Jack-B
                  he did not make scientific discoveries and the latest developments.

                  Putin made scientific discoveries ???? But.....
                  Quote: Jack-B
                  It was not Putin who masterfully acted in Crimea and he was not piloting airplanes in Syria

                  But I don’t think that he acted masterfully ....
                2. Jack-b
                  Jack-b 3 November 2015 13: 01 New
                  0
                  Quote: tomket
                  Well, according to Siluanov’s forecasts, the little egg will end next year, and we’ll see what Putin built there and raised the economic one.

                  Well, they kind of promised that last year it should have been all over, we are waiting.
                  Quote: tomket
                  But I don’t think that he acted masterfully ....

                  And so I wrote: he did not act!
        2. afdjhbn67
          afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 24 New
          +2
          Quote: Karabanov
          Quote: Scoun
          And if you do not whitewash and reason?

          I've already reasoned enough and heard enough about this topic ... Want, look for comments in my profile.
          The hero is molded of thieves and there are still furious defenders of it.
          Because I am so succinctly and express myself. Tired of ...

          I agree .. but bites when this is not done professionally and frankly stupid .. hi
        3. tomket
          tomket 2 November 2015 12: 44 New
          +6
          Quote: Karabanov
          Because I am so succinctly and express myself. Tired of it.

          Against the background of such statues, Putin’s naivety, who is dissatisfied with the pace of construction of the cosmodrome, sincerely surprises. One would like to ask, what did you want after awarding Serdyukov? Mass enthusiasm and crystal honesty?
      3. afdjhbn67
        afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 17 New
        +1
        Quote: Scoun
        )) тут вы не правы ))) ещё весной 2008 года, люди спецы на учениях в горах на границе с Грузией, чётко знали что "скоро будет". (Это я точно знаю, но ничего больше не добавлю).

        But what about the tank hazardous areas of the militia detachment was not at least from the RPG ??
        or didn’t the experience of storming Grozny teach us anything? in the fight against armored vehicles in urban environments and in mountainous areas?
        It turns out you need a picture more terrible and bloodier on TV? so what .... I am also more than sure that the GRU and the SVR and just informants sympathizers brought this information .. And in 2008 I had a question when I watched TV and showed the intersection - I thought oh if there would be an ambush with the shaitan - they drove around Tskhinval through a pipe of figs ..
        1. Scoun
          Scoun 2 November 2015 11: 43 New
          +2
          Quote: afdjhbn67
          I, too, are more than sure that the GRU and the SVR and just sympathetic informants brought this information ..

          back in February-March they knew and brought all the other questions to the generals ... Serdyuk was on the hunt and was inaccessible, the GDP was in Beijing at the opening of the Olympic Games ... and now the real picture is a day! no one in the Ministry of Defense and the Government of Russia could make a DECISION! brainless bastards .. and at that time our peacekeepers died!
          ** ki .. this situation really showed hu hu ... these big hereditary bosses in uniform ... could not make a decision in the absence of Taburetkin ... and who are they after that?
          Это что.. если сейчас вдруг Шойгу "пропадет" на день... наши генералы снова памперсы оденут?
          I’m starting really start ... everyone rests on the horn in Serdyukov .. and that his general’s environment was ...... complete!
          I do not want to swear and splatter other, innocent people.
          1. afdjhbn67
            afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 12: 03 New
            +3
            Quote: Scoun
            I don’t want to swear and splatter other, innocent people.

            В чем то вы и правы но такая штука как загряд отряды делается оччень задолго до основных событий так как включает в себя - создание, обучение, привязку к местности, вооружение - можно по серьезнее чем РПГ, хотя шайтан- труба в умелых руках "Фаготу" не уступит laughing
          2. Fin
            Fin 2 November 2015 12: 46 New
            +1
            Quote: Scoun
            ** ki .. this situation really showed hu hu ... these big hereditary bosses in uniform ... could not make a decision in the absence of Taburetkin ... and who are they after that?

            To start b / d against another state - whose level is this? Or shield any general has the authority to do so?
            Quote: Scoun
            and that his generals environment was ...... complete! don't want to swear

            Were you among them there? Certification can be carried out?
            1. Scoun
              Scoun 2 November 2015 15: 07 New
              0
              Quote: Fin
              To start b / d against another state - whose level is this?

              1. But to protect the peacekeeping contingent under the UN mandate - whose level?
              2. Do not forget about the phrase about the Government
              3. do not miss a word about the President .....
              4. but in the end all built by the Prime Minister, though ....
              Quote: Fin
              Or shield any General Does the prime minister have the authority to do so?

              Everything else from verbiage ... I can take anything .. but the facts remain facts .. only the GDP turned out to be iron bells. Medvedev was stupidly confused, although after the exercises the army left a couple of battalions disguised on the border with South Ossetia already knew that the matter was soon ..
              Russia was preparing for the fact that Georgia could attack the republic. The response plan was developed by our military and approved by the country's leadership long before the Georgian aggression.
              This was stated by Vladimir Putin, answering a question from a RIA Novosti correspondent about his personal participation in those events.
              Вопрос: "Сегодня 8 августа, четвертая годовщина конфликта в Южной Осетии. Вчера я спрашивал вас о фильме, который подготовили югоосетинские коллеги о событиях того времени. В частности, там утверждается, что вы, находясь в Пекине 8 августа, звонили оттуда сюда. Действительно ли вы звонили или не звонили оттуда? Это первое. А второе, неужели у России не было плана действий на случай военной агрессии Грузии в Южной Осетии?"
              "План был и, по-моему, это не секрет. Именно в рамках этого плана российская сторона и действовала. Я уже об этом говорил публично и раньше. Это не секрет, повторяю еще раз. План был подготовлен Генеральным штабом где-то в конце 2006 или в начале 2007 года, он был мною утвержден, согласован. Более того, в рамках этого плана проводилась и подготовка югоосетинских ополченцев. Правда наши военные специалисты, скажу откровенно, полагали, что это более или менее бесполезное дело.

              http://berlogamisha.mybb.ru/viewtopic.php?id=237
              there you will find links.
              It was then that everyone laid out that Medvedev was making a decision.
            2. goblin xnumx
              goblin xnumx 3 November 2015 09: 53 New
              +1
              помнится один генерал не побоялся китайцам ответить из всего что было под рукой- даже грады применил- но похоже сейчас такие повывелись- строители рулят с" солитерами"- даже супер центр для этого построили:)
          3. tomket
            tomket 2 November 2015 12: 55 New
            +2
            Quote: Scoun
            these big hereditary bosses in uniform ... could not make a decision in the absence of Taburetkin ... and who are they after that?

            Примерно как и в 41м . одни принимали удар плюя на "ценные указания свыше".Другие не поддавались на провокации. Обратная сторона медали вертикали власти. Нижние чины скорее под топор супостата пойдут , чем посягнут на святое -инициативу свыше.
          4. Uncle Joe
            Uncle Joe 2 November 2015 15: 11 New
            +4
            Quote: Scoun
            Serdyuk was on the hunt and was inaccessible

            these big hereditary bosses in uniform ... could not make a decision in the absence of Taburetkin ... and who are they after that?
            Ситуация, когда министр обороны "находится вне зоны действия сети" - она вообще нормальна?
            1. Scoun
              Scoun 2 November 2015 16: 18 New
              -5
              Quote: Uncle Joe
              Quote: Scoun
              Serdyuk was on the hunt and was inaccessible

              these big hereditary bosses in uniform ... could not make a decision in the absence of Taburetkin ... and who are they after that?
              Ситуация, когда министр обороны "находится вне зоны действия сети" - она вообще нормальна?

              Are you asking me this? )))) laughing
              The question is not for me))) but for the Moscow Region, and then they suddenly got a secretary to smoke, or someone forgot their mobile home ... but this is their question and their business.
              1. Uncle Joe
                Uncle Joe 2 November 2015 20: 30 New
                0
                Quote: Scoun
                Are you asking me this?
                You.

                The question is not for me
                To you.

                Not MO, but you are now reporting the lack of communication with the Minister of Defense as a matter of course, blaming everything on the abstract chiefs in uniform.
    2. subbtin.725
      subbtin.725 2 November 2015 14: 42 New
      +2
      Quote: Karabanov
      field furniture Taburetkina

      Oh how. Not weak.
  3. indeveral
    indeveral 2 November 2015 09: 05 New
    +2
    Of course! And Serdyukov also personally led troops in the war against Georgia! For what he received a war veteran!
    1. afdjhbn67
      afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 25 New
      +2
      Quote: indeveral
      Of course! And Serdyukov also personally led troops in the war against Georgia! For what he received a war veteran!

      With all its shortcomings, this is not its level of task .. minus is not mine
  4. indeveral
    indeveral 2 November 2015 09: 05 New
    +1
    Of course! And Serdyukov also personally led troops in the war against Georgia! For what he received a war veteran!
  5. Tambov Wolf
    Tambov Wolf 2 November 2015 10: 11 New
    +6
    Подождите,года через два появятся статьи ,обеляющие Чубайса.Будут писать как о "самом лучшим в мире и галактике управленце" с присвоением тайным указом Героя Российской Федерации,как "маршалу Табуреткину".А если покопаться,то сколько таких "тайных"указов имеется?То сынку в 24 года орденок дадут за великую службу на благо,то министра приведут на власть и орденок кинут,а она,наворовавши за бугорок сматывается.Ну "канешно",царь то не причём,а вот проклятые бояре,гады"...
    1. afdjhbn67
      afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 11: 33 New
      -1
      Quote: Tambov Wolf
      Wait, in two years there will be articles whitewashing Chubais.

      Just love Putin and don’t pay attention to anything ... wink
  6. Asadullah
    Asadullah 2 November 2015 10: 33 New
    +4
    They stole so much money,


    Nikolay, do you know something, have a killer texture? You can write in a personal letter, I promise, I will provide a report on the work done on the invoice and the result.
    1. afdjhbn67
      afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 04: 11 New
      0
      Quote: Asadullah
      Nikolay, do you know something, have a killer texture? You can write in a personal letter, I promise, I will provide a report on the work done on the invoice and the result.

      Wow Big Brother is looking at us .. bully
  7. win
    win 3 November 2015 14: 40 New
    +4
    They stole so much money


    Not caught - not a thief, but caught - still not a thief.
    © Anatoly Serdyukov
  8. The comment was deleted.
  • Good me
    Good me 2 November 2015 08: 40 New
    +4
    Quote: subbtin.725
    Пора икону писать.И малевать будет "талантливая" поэтесса Васильева.

  • Sasha 19871987
    Sasha 19871987 2 November 2015 11: 28 New
    -1
    the only reason you can thank Serdyukov despite these savage thefts is that with him the level of funding for the army has grown very much, at least thanks for it. but anyway, THIEF SHOULD BE SITTEN IN Jail !!!
    1. Uncle Joe
      Uncle Joe 2 November 2015 15: 17 New
      +3
      Quote: Sasha 19871987
      the only reason you can thank Serdyukov despite these wild thefts is that with him, the level of funding for the army has grown very sharply
      "При" не равно "благодаря".

      For the increase in funding, thank the State Duma of the Russian Federation, the host budget.
  • Ramzaj99
    Ramzaj99 2 November 2015 12: 28 New
    +7
    Quote: subbtin.725
    This is understood by Putin, and, apparently, for those services to Russia (which history books will never write about) and makes it possible for the former minister to get a normal position in the state corporation.

    Yeah ..... and I thought it was a sinful thing that all this is because the First Deputy Prime Minister Viktor Zubkov is the son-in-law of the former Minister of Defense Anatoly Serdyukov.)))))
  • podpolkovnik
    podpolkovnik 2 November 2015 12: 39 New
    +9
    Quote: subbtin.725
    Пора икону писать.И малевать будет "талантливая" поэтесса Васильева.

    Serdyukov received those still Augean stables, having cleared them, and pretty smeared with shit, he became a whipping boy, giving way to a real hero and favorite of the public Shoigu

    Lord, again? ...
  • gav6757
    gav6757 2 November 2015 14: 24 New
    +8
    The author of the article claims what needs to be done, first worse, so that later it is better!
    A highly controversial statement!
    Пример тому - революции и слова из песни "Весь мир насилья мы разрушим, а потом..."
    Or maybe you don’t need to ruin anything?
    Maybe you need to improve what is?
    What did our grandfathers leave us?
    Автор пишет про Сердюкова как про "мальчика для битья" взявшего на себя грязную работу, не благодарный труд.
    А, почему бы не вспомнить, разворованную казну? Продажу имущества по заниженным ценам, через родню? Это враг народа и коррупционер, которого прикрывают его подельник(и) в правительстве! Он враг! Страшный враг! Человек готовый продать Родину за коврижки и не факт, что эти коврижки, не будут заокеанскими!!! А то, что этого подлеца перевели работать в "Роснано", говорит о многом! И в первую очередь, о том что это за корпорация! Кому интересно, поинтересуйтесь деятельностью "Роснано", сколько у неё затрат и какова прибыль? Как из Китая закупаются технологии, а своих зажимают... Это тема другого разговора.
    Serdyukov is an enemy! And this is understandable to any Soviet citizen, maybe young people do not understand this, but here is our flaw.
    1. Dart2027
      Dart2027 2 November 2015 19: 36 New
      0
      Quote: gav6757
      Or maybe you don’t need to ruin anything?
      Maybe you need to improve what is?
      What did our grandfathers leave us?

      This would be true if we were talking about the army of the 70s, not to mention the 40s. In the 90s, the army was almost destroyed. I saw it with my own eyes. I do not claim that Serdyukov alone saved her from the final collapse - this is physically impossible. But the talk that he destroyed and plundered also does not agree with the results. As a matter of fact, these are two extreme points of view that are equally wrong. He most likely really got his post thanks to family ties, but at the same time he did what he was ordered to. And the work on modernization and re-equipment was carried out by just the same professionals, those same patriotic officers.
  • Jack-b
    Jack-b 3 November 2015 21: 00 New
    0
    In catching up there is still a link to an article in the topic. The original seems to be from facebook, but I don’t really read facebook, so the link to the reprint in the politrash
    http://politrussia.com/control/paru-slov-o-276/
  • vladimirZ
    vladimirZ 2 November 2015 07: 38 New
    31
    Bullshit, not an article. This is not thanks to Serdyukov-Taburetkin, but contrary to him, patriotic officers retained the Russian Army.
    А сколько ещё нужно восстановить то, что этот "реформатор" успел сломать и разворотить, десятилетия не хватит. Вспомнить только сколько военных учебных заведений разрушил, передававших опыт старших поколений, сколько воинских частей, военных городков, аэродромов закрыл, и которых нужно теперь, тратя миллиарды бюджетных денег, восстановить.
    And there are still people trying to whitewash this destroyer, to justify his appointment to the next public post in order to continue to harm Russia. It’s sad. Want to make candy out of shit? Will not work!
    1. tegezen
      tegezen 2 November 2015 11: 57 New
      +1
      And what about Serdyukov, patriotic officers did nothing? And the minister was Sergey Ivanov, a good guy. The army, my dear, was plundered just before Serdyukov. Money went as a breakthrough, new weapons were purchased in unit quantities
    2. g1v2
      g1v2 2 November 2015 12: 02 New
      -4
      Rare nonsense. Especially about patriotic officers saved the Russian Army.
      I hope that the new appointment of stools will bring as much benefit as he brought to my. The specific scope of his responsibilities is not yet clear, but I think that things in the aviation industry will go uphill. And when, after several years of dense digging of sk and prosecutors to cowards, they find only one road built by the thieves, this is of course a malicious corruptionist. laughing I knew the battalion commanders, before whom Serdyukov is a rogue. And for some reason I have not heard of any account he found abroad or villas abroad. Well, for sure - a thief. am You should not take a picture in the media at face value - reality usually differs from it. hi
    3. Your friend
      Your friend 2 November 2015 12: 35 New
      +1
      Quote: vladimirZ
      Bullshit, not an article. This is not thanks to Serdyukov-Taburetkin, but contrary to him, patriotic officers retained the Russian Army.
      А сколько ещё нужно восстановить то, что этот "реформатор" успел сломать и разворотить, десятилетия не хватит. Вспомнить только сколько военных учебных заведений разрушил, передававших опыт старших поколений, сколько воинских частей, военных городков, аэродромов закрыл, и которых нужно теперь, тратя миллиарды бюджетных денег, восстановить.
      And there are still people trying to whitewash this destroyer, to justify his appointment to the next public post in order to continue to harm Russia. It’s sad. Want to make candy out of shit? Will not work!

      Список "офицеров-патриотов" в студию. Страна должна знать своих героев.(
  • SSR
    SSR 2 November 2015 07: 45 New
    14
    Quote: Andrew Y.
    "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"
    короче говоря,сердюков с васильевой,оплачивают сирийскую кампанию из наворованных денег! вот за чей счёт "банкет"!(автор искренне порадовал)

    Quote: Uncle Lee
    Again this topic is Serdyukov the secret savior of the Russian Army!

    Одна из (версий) назначение Сердюкова на должность Мин. Обороны, это слом выстроенной за десятки лет системы финансово кадровой политики высоких чинов, ведь ни для кого не секрет как на руководящие должности выдвигались и назначались в общем-то серые мыши или до Сердюкова у генералов количество загородных дворцов было меньше? В общем если представить себе что в военную среду "вживить" постороненного человека очень сложно - то Сердюков (тогда еще зять Зубкова) а потом еще и хахаль двоюродной сестры супруги Медведева, идеально на это подходил......
    Но все это из разряда Высшей конспирологии и боюсь что не все так "героически". )))) но дыма без огня как говорчт не бывает, определенный слом распила денег в МО прооизошел, но как по мне так процентов на 30%, основная система отжима денег на местах (частях) так и осталась.
    1. andj61
      andj61 2 November 2015 08: 11 New
      16
      Serdyukov broke that ineffective system that was in the army - and in manning, and in the structure, and in the procurement system? Broke it! Honor and praise be for him! And he was not awarded poorly as a result! That is, the state has already appreciated it. And did the money all go to the budget as a result of the sale of state property during the reform of the army? Not all - a bunch of people on this hand warmed up! Serdyukov was involved in this - of course, he was involved, but he has not yet been brought to justice.
      And there are a lot of mistakes in reforming - starting from leapfrog with military schools and ending with holding parades without Suvorovites and in everyday, not at all formal, form.
      A year ago, immediately after the Crimea, many voiced their voices in the same vein — in Shoigu, in a little over a year (it was in 2014), he could not make the army so effective! So, not only ministers make an army effective, but also a bunch of professionals in the army itself - a low bow to them for that!
      So the figure is ambiguous, and rather negative than positive.
      1. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 32 New
        +1
        Definitely negative.
    2. Stas57
      Stas57 2 November 2015 08: 47 New
      0
      One of (versions)

      This is not a version - it is a fact.
      that the army is fat cats at the top, forgotten how to fight, but having summer cottages, stars and so on. about it
      , emnip Putin said, said that at 888 they were barely picking battle-worthy from all over the country, and with that number.

      The fact that it was necessary to break it - to change the big and the voracious and ineffective to the small and effective - became an extremely important fact.
      Only an extraneous one, not a clan one, and not a family member could break it.

      Broke, created, Serdyukov here rather a scalpel in the hand of the GDP. One of the scalpels and tweezers.
      А мог же АЭС при жизни заработать себе памятник по итогам Сирии и Крыма, но "баба сгубила такого хлопца"(с)
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Aleksander
        Aleksander 2 November 2015 09: 18 New
        +9
        Quote: Stas57
        The fact that it was necessary to break it


        Breaking is not to build. And good deeds are not being done in gangster ways; gangster results will be obtained — theft and nepotism. And rejoicing that a small part was nevertheless used for good deeds is, in my opinion, a perversion.
        1. Stas57
          Stas57 2 November 2015 09: 30 New
          +1
          Quote: Aleksander
          Breaking is not to build. And good deeds are not being done in gangster ways; gangster results will be obtained — theft and nepotism. And rejoicing that a small part was nevertheless used for good deeds is, in my opinion, a perversion.


          what a ... you know what makes me happy ...


          I am glad that the army is at war, eats well, often flies, shoots a lot, they WANT to go at it.

          In my army of 94-95, the lines of people who wanted to serve at the military registration and enlistment office did not line up, it is understandable, Chechnya, black PR NTV and so on did not contribute. And I also remember how the GBV was taken out to the field, and the Germans seemed to give money ... and then how it all went into the sand, and the equipment itself went into the sand, and this is Serdyukov?

          to consider that the army of the dying USSR and Yeltsin’s Russia was perfect, was not sick, and that it had to be treated was some kind of childish infantilism ...
          I think that here Putin is right for 99% in the reform process, and we see the result thereof.
          Результат без реформы - см соседнюю "братскую" страну
      3. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 33 New
        +2
        It was necessary to change, but not to kill.
  • Veteran of the Red Army
    Veteran of the Red Army 2 November 2015 08: 03 New
    +7
    Nothing in this country has changed since Brezhnev:
    OUR (read the nomenclature) DO NOT RENT !!!
  • afdjhbn67
    afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 09: 29 New
    +4
    Quote: Andrey Yurievich
    (the author sincerely pleased)

    will cause the anger of both the “Kremlin boats” and the “fifth column”

    He beautifully supplied all those who disagree with it immediately.
    Now Andrei Yurievich understood who we are ... and not only we ... request
    пс. Причем здесь "кремлеботы" только, они согласно логики должны наоборот защищать таких вот "кремлеботских" авторов?
    Dialectical contradiction arises according to Hegel
    Если он сайте то путь не пишет что " Мы диалектику учили не по Гегелю
    Бряцанием боев она врывалась в стих.."
    I will not believe.. laughing
    To summarize - a dumb propaganda, not a very smart author .. most likely a victim of the exam fool
    1. Good me
      Good me 2 November 2015 09: 43 New
      +2
      Quote: afdjhbn67
      He beautifully supplied all those who disagree with it immediately.
      Now Andrei Yurievich understood who we are ... and not only we ...

      Give me a shortcut yes .

      ON THE PRINCIPLE repeat lol

      And then, it’s not even an hour, the field assistant will get some ...
      1. afdjhbn67
        afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 09: 47 New
        +3
        Quote: Good Me
        ON THE PRINCIPLE

        Take it and Volodya .. laughing
        Didn’t remind you of Monday?
        1. Good me
          Good me 2 November 2015 10: 04 New
          +3
          Quote: afdjhbn67
          Take it and Volodya ..
          Didn’t remind you of Monday?

          Да, повылазили,"дети понедельника"...
    2. Scoun
      Scoun 2 November 2015 10: 50 New
      0
      Quote: afdjhbn67
      He beautifully supplied all those who disagree with it immediately.

      + labels as well as slogans are easily given)) and for many they work on a reflex)))
      Quote: NordUral
      It was necessary to change, but not to kill.

      Вот например по логике Нордурала. армия после Сердипука умерла ((( и только восставший "зомби" сделал 08.08.08, Крым 2014, Сирия 2015.. как раз в минимальный срок в "зомбака" переродилась )))

      Quote: Good Me
      Give me a shortcut ...

      Here, the labels are still a little queue)))) but there are still a lot of vendors)))
  • Azitral
    Azitral 2 November 2015 10: 09 New
    -1
    Автору - жирный плюс (поставил). Спасибо за мужество и способность не поддаваться эмоциям. Такие статьи очень нужны, поскольку ВО - аналитический портал, предполагается, что его читатели патриоты, способные отличить видимость от сути. И, по идее, должен приучать к самостоятельному мышлению, анализу, а не "одобрямсу" либо "единогласному, гневному осуждению". Только одно поправить: не авгиевы конюшни, которые надо чистить. Безнадежная руина, которую пришлось сносить и, по сути, создавать заново. Сла-абенькие живые ростки после начала 2-й чеченской на фоне необратимого, тотального развала. И сносить-то пришлось не шалаш, а железобетонный бункер, где окопались такие воры и рабовладельцы, по сравнению с которыми его воровство (Кстати, - всего навсего недоказанное!) - копейки. Его положение, - конфликт с интересами могущественнейших групп и кланов, - усугублялся тем, что все позитивное, что он делал, НЕЛЬЗЯ было освещать. Наши американо-европейские друзья и партнеры должны были НЕПРЕРЫВНО получать сигналы: "Все, как всегда, воруют и ляпают, работать некому, получится, как всегда, во главе распила - ВООБЩЕ Табуреткин!!!" Такое вот противоречие: о сколько-нибудь реальных позитивных сдвигах, об эффективных в потенциале решениях и президенту, и ответственным исполнителям как раз и приходится молчать! Чтобы не обратили внимания, не насторожились, не начали ставить палки в колеса. Чтобы продолжали веселиться, хихикать и показывать пальцами. Только это имеет свою цену: народ, не умея видеть позитивных сдвигов, скисает душой, заражается всеразъедающим скепсисом. И это противоречие, в наших условиях, когда недоброжелатели занимают господствующие позиции, к сожалению, неустранимо. А насчет "массы способных людей с незапятнанной репутацией", извините меня, - глупость. Управленцы экстра-класса, доказавшие свою эффективность в почти безнадежном деле, - редкость страшная.
    1. tegezen
      tegezen 2 November 2015 12: 37 New
      +1
      I disagree with you only in one thing that positive signals could not be covered, much was covered, almost everything was possible, but they did not notice this point blank, they were used to living in the atmosphere, everything was lost and a mess everywhere. All the arrivals of new weapons, all the changes in the structure of the armed forces, reductions, down to the new form and life of the soldiers, were all in sight. People hardly change the patterns of thinking, and see what they want to see, and here we get surprises, since the new army fell right from the sky.
  • Alexey-74
    Alexey-74 2 November 2015 10: 11 New
    +2
    а не задумывался ли автор, если бы Табуреткин до сих пор был министром обороны, были ли "вежливые люди", Крым, Сирия....новая техника (Армата и др.) думаю ответ очевиден....
    1. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 2 November 2015 10: 33 New
      +1
      Quote: Alexey-74
      а не задумывался ли автор, если бы Табуреткин до сих пор был министром обороны, были ли "вежливые люди", Крым, Сирия....новая техника (Армата и др.) думаю ответ очевиден....

      And where would all this go? The army still receives equipment on the orders of the furniture maker and on the concept of the furniture maker.

      Кстати, "Армата" - это как раз детище Табуреткина. Одно из тех решений, за которое его полоскали почём зря: ибо решение по концентрации всех сил на разработке менее навороченной "арматы" шло в комплекте с отказом от продолжения работ по вундерпанцеру "объект 195" и отказом от закупки Т-90 (взамен которых пошли Т-72Б3).
      1. Good me
        Good me 2 November 2015 10: 59 New
        +9
        Quote: Alexey RA
        The army still receives equipment on the orders of the furniture maker and on the concept of the furniture maker.


        Яркие элементы "концепции" :
        - "Мистрали"
        - "Рысь"
        - "отечественные танки ни на что не годны, будем закупать "иномарки"...
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 2 November 2015 12: 37 New
          +4
          Quote: Good Me
          Яркие элементы "концепции" :
          - "Мистрали"

          All questions are for Mr. Dragon. smile
          Quote: Good Me
          - "Рысь"

          Which is the only mine-protected machine in our aircraft.
          И после начала закупок которой ГАЗ внезапно начал исправлять все те косяки, на которые ему указывали с начала эксплуатации "тигров".
          Quote: Good Me
          - "отечественные танки ни на что не годны, будем закупать "иномарки"...

          And how - they began to buy? wink
          Или Вы не в курсе про контекст этой фразы - она была сказана в аккурат тогда, когда ВПК поднял цену на Т-90А вдвое. Результат - переход на закупки Т-72Б3 и заказ на "армату".

          А куда делись "сердюковские" Су-30МК2, Су-30СМ, Су-34, ФР проекта 11356, БТР-82 всех модификаций, туча систем РЭБ и прочее, прочее, прочее? wink
      2. TiRex
        TiRex 2 November 2015 11: 10 New
        -5
        And the story with the Mistral was on hand for us ...
    2. Jack-b
      Jack-b 2 November 2015 11: 04 New
      0
      Quote: Alexey-74
      а не задумывался ли автор, если бы Табуреткин до сих пор был министром обороны, были ли "вежливые люди", Крым, Сирия....новая техника (Армата и др.) думаю ответ очевиден....

      And didn’t you think that Serdyukov was exchanged for Shoigu when he completed his task? Or do you think that he lost his job due to suspicions of corruption?
  • Loner_53
    Loner_53 2 November 2015 10: 50 New
    +4
    Quote: Andrey Yurievich
    короче говоря,сердюков с васильевой,оплачивают сирийскую кампанию из наворованных денег! вот за чей счёт "банкет"!(автор искренне порадовал)

    Andrei, can you really not see that they are just leading us for a fool. This was during the time of Comrade Zheglov a thief in prison.
  • PV KGB of the USSR
    PV KGB of the USSR 2 November 2015 12: 33 New
    -7
    And if the plot is this:
    Для накопления всего того, что наша армия имеет сейчас было необходимо время, а наши американские "партнёры" никогда не позволили бы нам активно проводить реформу в армии. На место министра обороны сажают человека который должен выглядеть полным профаном в армейской теме, да ещё и "ворюгой". Для большего скандала ему, по легенде, необходима любовница, которая помогает ему "разворовывать" армию и флот. Американская разведка спокойно курит думая, что всё, вот он конец армии России. На самом деле, в обстановке повышенной секретности, начинает работать ВПК, проходит чистка кадров. Времени немного, если противник заподозрит подвох, может нанести удар по стране. Даже с приходом Шойгу проект "Табуреткин Вор разваливший армию" не сворачивают, а ещё добавляют остроты событий с делом Васильевой. И вот финал - у России оказывается есть отличная армия и флот, ракеты летают через несколько государств, самолёты эффективно отрабатывают в Сирии. Всё это может быть хорошо спланированной операцией ГРУ и лет через 20-30 мы можем неожиданно узнать, что Сердюков и Васильева выполняли очень ответственное задание,под прямой курацией ВВП и Шойгу и являются теми, про которых как говорили раньше в газетах не пишут. Поживём увидим.)))
    PS The CIA is not sitting around fools and Serdyukov would not have collapsed, they would not have believed something in reality. Well, the money, but was it?)))
    1. Jack-b
      Jack-b 2 November 2015 13: 18 New
      +4
      This is from the field of conspiracy theory. Everything is much simpler.
    2. Karabanov
      Karabanov 2 November 2015 13: 23 New
      +7
      Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР
      And if the plot is this:

      Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР
      All this can be a well-planned GRU operation and in 20-30 years we can suddenly find out that Serdyukov and Vasilyeva carried out a very responsible task, under the direct supervision of the GDP and Shoigu

      Great story! Brothers Grimm and the CIA nervously smoke on the sidelines ...
      But do not stop. We must assume that there are more than a dozen GRU agents, for example, such as Khorshavin, Gaiser, Luzhkov, Gudkov (by the way), Skrynnik, etc. ... and do not forget the most important secret agent - Tolik Chubais.
      1. PV KGB of the USSR
        PV KGB of the USSR 2 November 2015 13: 43 New
        -6
        Well, how then to explain that the army was falling apart, and, looking, are we ahead of the rest?))) There are no miracles! So under Yeltsin, the army was in f ** ne and suddenly blossomed in a couple of years ??? )))
        1. PV KGB of the USSR
          PV KGB of the USSR 2 November 2015 14: 17 New
          -3
          And why minus-the army was under Yeltsin W ** PE! And this is a fact (not by hearsay I know, not from couch troops)! It's good that we have a president who pulled her out of there and revived!
        2. ancient
          ancient 2 November 2015 18: 52 New
          -1
          Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР
          So under Yeltsin, the army was in f ** ne and suddenly blossomed in a couple of years ???


          And Mr. Putin, how many years at the helm .. do not tell me? And as with him .... the army .. in what place was ???? wassat

          А то,что она,эта армия...начала преображаться,то "спасибо" надо сказать Галстукоеду..что "попёрся" 08.08.08 ,а не где-нибудь в 10-12 годах..тогда бы точно...."грызунов" под Москвой ..останавливали recourse

          А так.."клюнул петух" в одно место и сразу начали...."шевелиться" и "думать" soldier
          1. PV KGB of the USSR
            PV KGB of the USSR 3 November 2015 09: 28 New
            0
            You are probably one of those who knows better than the president knows how to govern the country? From the category, take everything and share. Putin got the country in ruins and the fact that 08.08.08 we were able to do something is his direct merit. It is easier to water the swabs of power and assume that they are simply MUST AND OBLIGED. I have 100% confidence in the authorities, and if GDP does not raise Serdikov’s theme, then everything is going as it should. You need to look at things more widely, not always black is black and not always, then that truth is on the surface. You probably don’t play chess, only checkers.
    3. Loner_53
      Loner_53 2 November 2015 13: 45 New
      +7
      Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР
      and in 20-30 years we can suddenly find out that Serdyukov and Vasiliev performed a very responsible task, under direct supervision

      Do you yourself believe in what you wrote? If yes, then I’m just sorry for you, but I think you can see through the time specified by you hi
      1. PV KGB of the USSR
        PV KGB of the USSR 2 November 2015 14: 12 New
        -2
        Do you yourself believe in what you wrote? If yes, then I’m just sorry for you, but I think you can see through hi

        I do not believe, I suppose. We can discuss anything, but ..., we do not know even 5% of all undercover games and combinations. You believed a year ago that Crimea will return? Or maybe someone 5 years ago would have believed that finally in our country such a feeling as patriotism would begin to develop again, when most of the gorlopans scolded our president? Or maybe 5-6 years ago we would have believed that Ukrainians would consider us aggressors (although there were already prerequisites then)? Once again, this is only a version! But the truth does not always lie on the surface! And sometimes the less realistic, the more true. hi
        1. Loner_53
          Loner_53 2 November 2015 14: 19 New
          +1
          Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР
          Once again, this is only a version! But the truth does not always lie on the surface! And sometimes the less realistic, the more true.

          Yes, here you are right about the truth, with us it’s not on the surface, but behind seven locks, in a bunker and still covered with earth hi
    4. Oleko
      Oleko 2 November 2015 19: 37 New
      -4
      Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР

      PV KGB of the USSR


      Today, 12: 33

      ↑ ↓


      А если сюжет такой:Для накопления всего того, что наша армия имеет сейчас было необходимо время, а наши американские "партнёры" никогда не позволили бы нам активно проводить реформу в армии. На место министра обороны сажают человека который должен выглядеть полным профаном в армейской теме, да ещё и "ворюгой". Для большего скандала ему, по легенде, необходима любовница, которая помогает ему "разворовывать" армию и флот. Американская разведка спокойно курит думая, что всё, вот он конец армии России. На самом деле, в обстановке повышенной секретности, начинает работать ВПК, проходит чистка кадров. Времени немного, если противник заподозрит подвох, может нанести удар по стране. Даже с приходом Шойгу проект "Табуреткин Вор разваливший армию" не сворачивают, а ещё добавляют остроты событий с делом Васильевой. И вот финал - у России оказывается есть отличная армия и флот, ракеты летают через несколько государств, самолёты эффективно отрабатывают в Сирии. Всё это может быть хорошо спланированной операцией ГРУ и лет через 20-30 мы можем неожиданно узнать, что Сердюков и Васильева выполняли очень ответственное задание,под прямой курацией ВВП и Шойгу и являются теми, про которых как говорили раньше в газетах не пишут. Поживём увидим.)))P.S. В ЦРУ сидят не дураки и не развали Сердюков что-то в реалии не поверили бы. Ну а деньги, а были ли они?)))
























      О том, что была проведена операция прикрытия, уверен на все 100%. Чем больше читаю комментов, то всё больше убеждаюсь, что Сердюков "бил" по сложившимся у военных десятилетиями представление о министре обороны. Приехал Сердюков в Балтийск, мрачно посмотрел, поговорил о землях и уехал. Естественно с ним "шикарная чмара". А как же фуршет? Все его действия вызывали возмущение военных. Это возмущение выливалось в соцсети и не только. А они под контролем не только ФСБ, но и просматриваются аппаратурой Лэнгли. Сноуден всё сказал и дал материалы, как работает ЭВМ ЦРУ и АНБ. Таким образом, была создана мощнейшая дезинформационная завеса, которая должна была создать видимость развала для наших "партнёров".Сердюков сыграл великолепно. А фото, где Медведев, ВВП, и Анатолий парад принимают сидя, чего стоит? А "ссора" Кудрина с Медведевым? Только он заикнулся о многократно возросшем бюджете МО, как его тут же вышибли. Да и расследования - фарс. Всё было сделано, чтобы вызвать в армии возмущение. А в БалтФлот тихонько шли корветы с завода " Янтарь". Возводились котеджи для моряков у терминалов. Зарплата увеличилась, но под видом "подкупа моряков" Путиным. Одним словом, страну использовали "в тёмную".
    5. Oleko
      Oleko 2 November 2015 19: 37 New
      -3
      Цитата: ПВ КГБ СССР

      PV KGB of the USSR


      Today, 12: 33

      ↑ ↓


      А если сюжет такой:Для накопления всего того, что наша армия имеет сейчас было необходимо время, а наши американские "партнёры" никогда не позволили бы нам активно проводить реформу в армии. На место министра обороны сажают человека который должен выглядеть полным профаном в армейской теме, да ещё и "ворюгой". Для большего скандала ему, по легенде, необходима любовница, которая помогает ему "разворовывать" армию и флот. Американская разведка спокойно курит думая, что всё, вот он конец армии России. На самом деле, в обстановке повышенной секретности, начинает работать ВПК, проходит чистка кадров. Времени немного, если противник заподозрит подвох, может нанести удар по стране. Даже с приходом Шойгу проект "Табуреткин Вор разваливший армию" не сворачивают, а ещё добавляют остроты событий с делом Васильевой. И вот финал - у России оказывается есть отличная армия и флот, ракеты летают через несколько государств, самолёты эффективно отрабатывают в Сирии. Всё это может быть хорошо спланированной операцией ГРУ и лет через 20-30 мы можем неожиданно узнать, что Сердюков и Васильева выполняли очень ответственное задание,под прямой курацией ВВП и Шойгу и являются теми, про которых как говорили раньше в газетах не пишут. Поживём увидим.)))P.S. В ЦРУ сидят не дураки и не развали Сердюков что-то в реалии не поверили бы. Ну а деньги, а были ли они?)))
























      О том, что была проведена операция прикрытия, уверен на все 100%. Чем больше читаю комментов, то всё больше убеждаюсь, что Сердюков "бил" по сложившимся у военных десятилетиями представление о министре обороны. Приехал Сердюков в Балтийск, мрачно посмотрел, поговорил о землях и уехал. Естественно с ним "шикарная чмара". А как же фуршет? Все его действия вызывали возмущение военных. Это возмущение выливалось в соцсети и не только. А они под контролем не только ФСБ, но и просматриваются аппаратурой Лэнгли. Сноуден всё сказал и дал материалы, как работает ЭВМ ЦРУ и АНБ. Таким образом, была создана мощнейшая дезинформационная завеса, которая должна была создать видимость развала для наших "партнёров".Сердюков сыграл великолепно. А фото, где Медведев, ВВП, и Анатолий парад принимают сидя, чего стоит? А "ссора" Кудрина с Медведевым? Только он заикнулся о многократно возросшем бюджете МО, как его тут же вышибли. Да и расследования - фарс. Всё было сделано, чтобы вызвать в армии возмущение. А в БалтФлот тихонько шли корветы с завода " Янтарь". Возводились котеджи для моряков у терминалов. Зарплата увеличилась, но под видом "подкупа моряков" Путиным. Одним словом, страну использовали "в тёмную".
  • ancient
    ancient 2 November 2015 18: 46 New
    +2
    Quote: Andrey Yurievich
    in short, Serdyukov with Vasilyeva, pay for the Syrian campaign of stolen money!


    Ага..очередные "спасители Отечества" wassat

    Question to the author .. here honestly .. they don’t understand belay... your quote is - "Решил написать статью, которая вызовет гнев как «кремлеботов», так и «пятой колонны». Хочу сыграть роль «адвоката дьявола» для человека, которого ненавидят и те, и те - Анатолия Сердюкова."

    На сколько я в курсе.."кремлеботы" это те,которые наоборот только tongue и fellow по любому поводу и действию.."Кремля"..та к почему они должны быть в гневе от назначения Табуреткина? request
    Or do you naively assume that Mr. Chemezov did not agree on this appointment (or simply received an order from ... himself) what would ... be assigned? wassat

    Так вон у вас сколько "+" в статье...одни "кремлеботы2..."испрожнаются", а вы говорите..."гнев". lol

    Теперь про 5-ю колонну..зная какой вред нанёс табуреткин 5-я колонна наооборот должна будет "пищать от радости" от..очередных "успешных рехформирований" lol

    Ну а то,что вы решили стать " адвокатом" табуреткина, при этом напомнив,что де раньше вот был таким честным и правильным, а сейчас....что..Ц"переобулся", "поменял цвет" или.."стал на.... "довольствие"?
    Правильно...надо искать..."хде теплее" wassat
  • MrK
    MrK 2 November 2015 23: 26 New
    +3
    Quote: Andrey Yurievich
    "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"


    What nonsense. I served in the USSR Armed Forces, and then Russia for 37 years. Recent years under Serdyukov. For the fact that he did it to shoot a little. This is the opinion of all my colleagues and mine.
  • zenion
    zenion 3 November 2015 16: 29 New
    -2
    Of course, they are obliged to Serdyukov. How obliged to the Nazis for the victory in World War II.
  • the most important
    the most important 2 November 2015 09: 54 New
    +4
    For merit - a medal! For theft - a prison! For stupidity (the collapse of airfields, towns, military units, military schools ...) - contempt !!! Received medals, scorned a hack, it remains only in prison !!!
    1. afdjhbn67
      afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 12: 33 New
      +3
      Quote: the most important
      (collapse of airfields,

      He gathered them in large airbases - convenient from the point of view of logistics .. but well laid down under the concept of Global Strike .. (
      1. the most important
        the most important 2 November 2015 22: 17 New
        +4
        One strike and no airbase ... three hits and no aviation in Russia ... but how can you fight from an airbase if there are, for example, two divisions ??? this is the same as sitting on one toilet for five.
        1. afdjhbn67
          afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 01: 58 New
          +1
          Quote: the most important
          One strike and no airbase ... three hits and no aviation in Russia ... but how can you fight from an airbase if there are, for example, two divisions ??? this is the same as sitting on one toilet for five.

          So I wrote about the same thing hi
  • BEGA2015
    BEGA2015 2 November 2015 10: 30 New
    18
    Работу в министерстве Сердюков начал с капитального ремонта и замены мрамора и панелей из ценных пород дерева на дешевку, но за большие деньги. Набрал штат симпатичных девушек и обрядил оных в "усовершенствованную" форму одежды по последнему слову "армейской" моды, привлекая лучших модельеров столицы. Можно утомиться перечисляя его нововведения, не имеющие ничего общего с работой главного армейского органа. Дилетант в армейской науке не сделал ничего, что могло повысить боеспособность армии. Целый ряд сомнительных но очень дорогих проэктов, в том числе и "Мистрали". Просьба- перестанте петь диферамбы господину "Табуреткину", ведь эта кличка неспроста укрепилась в армейской среде во времена его правления. А успехи в армии, в том числе и в войне в Северной Осетии, были не благодаря, а вопреки его "деятельности" и достигались они мужеством и работой рядового и офицерского состава, выполняющих долг перед Родиной в соответствии с уставами, к которым Сердюков не имел никакого отношения!
    1. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 2 November 2015 10: 36 New
      +7
      Quote: BEGA2015
      Целый ряд сомнительных но очень дорогих проэктов, в том числе и "Мистрали".

      А вот про "Мистрали" - не надо. Министр обороны такие вопросы не решает. Ну не может он взять - и купить корабли в стране НАТО. smile
      Решение по "Мистралям" принимал Господин Дракон. И было оно платой за позицию Франции в 08.08.08.
  • marlin1203
    marlin1203 2 November 2015 10: 45 New
    -8
    Many more copies will be broken about this. But the military must remember exactly that monetary allowance was raised to a decent level precisely under Serdyukov. I don’t know because of him or not, but with him that's for sure. soldier
    1. Belousov
      Belousov 2 November 2015 11: 05 New
      10
      They raised monetary allowance because of the events during the election, so that they would be more loyal, in case of emergency, to use against the people. Or according to your increase in salaries in the Ministry of Internal Affairs, etc. also merit Taburetkina?!?
      1. marlin1203
        marlin1203 2 November 2015 11: 35 New
        -9
        Чего-то не помню я народных волнений, чтобы "лояльность" армейцев покупать. А в комменте указал обычный и упрямый факт, что денежное довольствие подняли при сердюкове. Так и за что минусы -то?
        1. podpolkovnik
          podpolkovnik 2 November 2015 12: 32 New
          +7
          Quote: marlin1203
          Чего-то не помню я народных волнений, чтобы "лояльность" армейцев покупать. А в комменте указал обычный и упрямый факт, что денежное довольствие подняли при сердюкове. Так и за что минусы -то?

          Yeah! And the procedure for calculating pensions for military personnel is the same. With a decreasing factor ...
          Thank you so much and low bow!
          Let me kiss you red slippers!
          Who is the last in line?
          1. marlin1203
            marlin1203 2 November 2015 18: 33 New
            -5
            So I didn’t understand what they’ll be minded for ... some emotions ... what
    2. Belousov
      Belousov 2 November 2015 11: 05 New
      +2
      They raised monetary allowance because of the events during the election, so that they would be more loyal, in case of emergency, to use against the people. Or according to your increase in salaries in the Ministry of Internal Affairs, etc. also merit Taburetkina?!?
  • biznaw
    biznaw 2 November 2015 10: 51 New
    -8
    104 against 111 for. I also put +.
    Because dialectics. If someone remembers from the course of Marxism-Leninism, what kind of thing is this. Or Razor Blade from Efremov.
  • Cherdak
    Cherdak 2 November 2015 12: 47 New
    0
    Quote: Hammer
    So the first went

    In one I agree with the author - it's time to separate the flies from cutlets.
    В этом плане мне нравятся китайцы - надо как и они спокойно анализировать "без фанатизЬму" и фанфаронства.

    The official point of view of the Chinese Communist Party on the role that Mao Zedong played in the history of this country: the Great Helmsman was wrong by 30 percent in his activities.

    Still simple. The goals set are completed tasks. Now there is no analysis at all, but only journalistic snot and excesses.

    Что-то мне до сих пор все это напоминает "золотой батон" Януковича и "личные дачи, больницы, космодром и яхты" Путина.
  • varov14
    varov14 2 November 2015 15: 11 New
    -3
    And what the author can do and is right, we, however, the majority is based on opinions, but you can write at least that way, at least that way. And the information in different sources is at least different but always biased.
  • mihasik
    mihasik 2 November 2015 16: 18 New
    +1
    Quote: Hammer
    So the first went

    soldier belay love
    Alexander Chopov, Last name is interesting from the author. Why for example not Special Forces?)
  • AM10101946
    AM10101946 2 November 2015 17: 43 New
    +1
    It is beautifully written !!! As to the presentation for the award of the Order of Merit to the Fatherland !!! It must be judged !!!
  • maiman61
    maiman61 2 November 2015 19: 39 New
    +1
    Serdyukov does not send to NATO! Those eggheads aren't capable of anything!
  • Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 2 November 2015 05: 32 New
    26
    Again this topic is Serdyukov the secret savior of the Russian Army!
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Petrovich1952
      Petrovich1952 2 November 2015 06: 20 New
      +2
      Again this topic is Serdyukov, the secret savior of the Russian Army! And how do you like? He is a friend, moreover, a secretly sent Cossack to the Augean stables. Cleaned and you yell at him. It turns out he is a HERO in how.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    3. Vladimir 70
      Vladimir 70 2 November 2015 06: 46 New
      +1
      Again this topic is Serdyukov the secret savior of the Russian Army!
      Причем здесь "Сердюков тайный спаситель Армии Росии"? автор ясно написал - Сердюков выполнил свою роль и "уступил" место Шойгу для построения новой Армии.
      1. kenig1
        kenig1 2 November 2015 07: 57 New
        20
        If he hadn’t instructed his wife (daughter of Zubkov) and would continue to lead the horns.
        1. Egevich
          Egevich 2 November 2015 15: 36 New
          +4
          Quote: kenig1
          If he hadn’t instructed his wife (daughter of Zubkov) and would continue to lead the horns.

          by the way. about the horns. only deer. the deer horns from Goering’s office, which were stored in the museum of the North Caucasian Military District, went to the cottage to the country house, they talk ... and some other interesting things, antique and rare, we won’t see in the museum anymore ...
      2. Aleksander
        Aleksander 2 November 2015 09: 02 New
        13
        Quote: Vladimir 70
        ясно написал - Сердюков выполнил свою роль и "уступил" место Шойгу для построения новой Армии.


        His role is criminal. Destroyed military academies, institutes, schools, design institutes and others. Fired thousands of professionals. BY COURT, much of this qualifies as a crime.
        Не делаются благие дела тайными и кривыми путями, особенно в условиях коррупции и кумовства. Это гарантия того, что остались не лучшие профессионалы, а умельцы "занести", "связисты", люди, умеющие пускать пыль в глаза и подобные им, а также дикого воровства.
        Would any of those present entrust their work to Serdyukov? Not to life!
        Calling 2008's army incompetent is complete incompetence! An army that went through two Chechen wars!
        And yet, with the funding of the army, which was under Serdyukov, houses for the military and new equipment should have been, I think, two times more ....
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 2 November 2015 10: 18 New
          +2
          Quote: Aleksander
          Calling 2008's army incompetent is complete incompetence! An army that went through two Chechen wars!

          The experience of the Chechen wars by 08.08.08 in the army was long ago and firmly put on the farthest shelf. Evidence of this is the circumstances of Khrulev’s wound: the next column in an uncharted area without communication and protection entered directly into an ambush. Exploration, gas processing facilities, head and side guards, helicopter escort of the convoy - forgotten as completely unnecessary things. It was lucky that they were Georgians ...

          In addition, no experience of the two Chechens could tell - how to act in the event that the enemy has air defense and air force. But the Charter and the instructions prescribing intelligence and organization of interaction were forgotten in the army. As a result, the Air Force sends single vehicles to the zone of unsuppressed enemy air defense, and the air defense of the enemy joyfully shoots at all that flies, knocking down its own ... At the same time, the district had the technical means to solve these two problems.
        2. TiRex
          TiRex 2 November 2015 11: 16 New
          +2
          here we have (it was) in our region several design institutes on the balance of the Moscow Region, but only the director, the watchman, the locksmith (pipes to repair) and accounting remained from the whole institute. Well, traditions, of course, as without them. The rest is leased.
          Well, what's the point of such an institution?
      3. Aleksander
        Aleksander 2 November 2015 09: 02 New
        +6
        Quote: Vladimir 70
        ясно написал - Сердюков выполнил свою роль и "уступил" место Шойгу для построения новой Армии.


        His role is criminal. Destroyed military academies, institutes, schools, design institutes and others. Fired thousands of professionals. BY COURT, much of this qualifies as a crime.
        Не делаются благие дела тайными и кривыми путями, особенно в условиях коррупции и кумовства. Это гарантия того, что остались не лучшие профессионалы, а умельцы "занести", "связисты", люди, умеющие пускать пыль в глаза и подобные им, а также дикого воровства.
        Would any of those present entrust their work to Serdyukov? Not to life!
        Calling 2008's army incompetent is complete incompetence! An army that went through two Chechen wars!
        And yet, with the funding of the army, which was under Serdyukov, houses for the military and new equipment should have been, I think, two times more ....
        1. TiRex
          TiRex 2 November 2015 11: 19 New
          -1
          she was incompetent, there were mistakes in the sea, overlays and inconsistencies too ...
    4. Alekseev
      Alekseev 2 November 2015 07: 12 New
      47
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      Again this topic is Serdyukov the secret savior of the Russian Army!

      Да, то ли вольных, то ли невольных апологетов вороватого и похотливого "спасителя" хватает.
      НО... "Но давайте проанализируем его действия без лишних эмоций." статью непрошенного адвоката.
      1. Насчет "ожиревшего" ген.Хрулева, с которым, в отличии от всезнайки автора (т.е. незнайки) мне пришлось некоторое время послужить.
      Doesn’t it reach the brain that the commander knew that he didn’t really have a place in the advance detachment?
      Now it is known for certain that he received a command to advance to the advanced units? Why? Yes, so that, in which case, there was a ready responsible. And not some colonel who was supposed to be on staff, but personally, the lieutenant general, commander of the troops 58 A ...
      In the defeat of the Georgians, it was BTGr 58 A that played the main role, not the paratroopers, the East, which carried out the mopping-up operations, and not the militias and peacekeepers heroically defending themselves at local sites.
      Once perverts in one, then in the other too. yes
      2. Commander in chief of the Air Force on cell? What kind of nonsense? Cell phones were used sometimes in the troops, and this is not good. But the loss of aviation occurred because it was thrown into battle suddenly, without first of all preparing electronic warfare and suppressing air defense. Who is to blame for not going to fight with Sahaka? Well, probably not only the Air Force Commander.
      3."...вычистил ведомство от генералов, которые привыкли, что солдаты - это бесплатный труд для строительства дач."
      Together with the normal and scored women who began to steal in such a way that no dachas are good enough.
      4. Глупые шапкозакидательства - дескать "вежливые люди" сильнее всех армий. Что, в Крыму были боевые действия?
      What spetsnaz brigade can replace the combined arms formation, which are now just beginning to rebuild?
      That an air group gathered from all over the country in Syria (a mixed regiment, two) in the absence of air defense is a great achievement, inaccessible to either the United States, NATO or the PRC?
      Where are our mob.resources? Where is the established work of the military command bodies in the field? According to Perdyukov, they didn’t need to say that it was expensive, but about 2000 km of the border with Bandera Ukraine, he, the audience with his henchman Makarka, did not think ... request
      Yes, work is underway on rearmament, which was conducted not in Perdyuk, but Rogozin and others, but the funds were allocated, not Perdyukov, not his personal and not his women, but folk.
      The strengthening of the armed forces has not yet plowed the field of work. And farts are just an unsuccessful start to this very work.
      And do not insinuate. No. laughing
      1. Altona
        Altona 2 November 2015 07: 49 New
        14
        Quote: Alekseev
        .Head of the Air Force commanded on cell? What kind of nonsense?

        -----------------------
        Мне почему то вспомнилось, как упразднялись учебные заведения ВВС и выводились за черту города Москвы...Наверное для "уменьшения коррупционной составляющей" лакомые комплексы зданий так вычищались...А из двух институтов создали "академию Жугарина"...
      2. kenig1
        kenig1 2 November 2015 08: 06 New
        +5
        But the loss of aircraft occurred because she was thrown into battle suddenly
        I’ll say for sure that a combat order for the use of aviation was prepared after 2 days of warfare.
      3. andj61
        andj61 2 November 2015 08: 20 New
        +9
        Quote: Alekseev
        Насчет "ожиревшего" ген.Хрулева, с которым, в отличии от всезнайки автора (т.е. незнайки) мне пришлось некоторое время послужить.

        good hi Many sources skipped that it was the commander of the 58th army who was the key figure in making the decision on Georgia - Putin was in Beijing at the orchestra of the Olympics, Serdyukov was on a cruise with his mobile phone turned off (!), The chief of the General Staff asked to wait until the situation clears up, and Medvedev hesitated. The Roki tunnel and its entrance from the side of South Ossetia ordered Khrulev to be occupied, and he gave the command to advance the advance group to Tskhinval. How he himself appeared there is a mystery, but there is a lot of evidence that it was Medvedev who gave him the order to be in the advance group.
        1. afdjhbn67
          afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 12: 17 New
          +6
          Quote: andj61
          , Serdyukov was on a cruise with his mobile phone turned off (!)

          Why are you tearing your heart defenders Serdyukov
          hit right under your breath mercilessly .. laughing
          1. Aleksander
            Aleksander 2 November 2015 20: 01 New
            +2
            Quote: afdjhbn67
            Quote: andj61
            , Serdyukov was on a cruise with his mobile phone turned off (!)

            Why are you tearing your heart defenders Serdyukov
            hit right under your breath mercilessly .. laughing



            Well, you give ... Yes, it was another HP !!!
        2. Egevich
          Egevich 2 November 2015 16: 08 New
          0
          Quote: andj61
          Quote: Alekseev
          Насчет "ожиревшего" ген.Хрулева, с которым, в отличии от всезнайки автора (т.е. незнайки) мне пришлось некоторое время послужить.

          good hi Many sources skipped that it was the commander of the 58th army who was the key figure in making the decision on Georgia - Putin was in Beijing at the orchestra of the Olympics, Serdyukov was on a cruise with his mobile phone turned off (!), The chief of the General Staff asked to wait until the situation clears up, and Medvedev hesitated. The Roki tunnel and its entrance from the side of South Ossetia ordered Khrulev to be occupied, and he gave the command to advance the advance group to Tskhinval. How he himself appeared there is a mystery, but there is a lot of evidence that it was Medvedev who gave him the order to be in the advance group.


          Egevich EU June 20, 2014 13:07 | Summary from Igor Strelkov marked URGENT (full version)
          Quote: Prometey
          Want to reveal a secret? The decision to send troops to Georgia was made by Medvedev as the Supreme Commander-in-Chief at that time and President of the Russian Federation. Putin was not even in Moscow and he was notified of the decision made at a meeting of our Security Council later. Therefore, liberal Medvedev at that time was tougher than authoritarian Putin.
          it would be better if you kept silent than revealed such a secret ... the decision to send troops was made by the Commander of the troops of the South-Eastern Military District and Commander 58A, based on the situation, for which they later nearly paid ...
          1. afdjhbn67
            afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 02: 09 New
            0
            Quote: Egevich
            Egevich EU June 20, 2014 13:07 | Summary from Igor Strelkov marked URGENT (full version)

            Link to link, link chases ....
      4. The comment was deleted.
      5. creak
        creak 2 November 2015 09: 44 New
        +7
        Quote: Alekseev
        But the loss of aviation occurred because it was thrown into battle suddenly, without first of all preparing electronic warfare and suppressing air defense. Who is to blame for not going to fight with Sahaka? Well, probably not only the Air Force Commander.


        Not in defense of Serdyukov, but in terms of objectivity
        I would like to note that during the war 08.08.08. aviation not only suffered unjustified losses ... There, the troops simply did not have the proper aviation support on the battlefield, the Air Force Commander in charge
        not having time to adequately respond to a rapidly changing environment ...
        And why - yes, because in 2003, army aviation, contrary to the experience of the Afghan war and categorical objections of specialists, was transferred to the Air Force and the land pilots lost their aviation (I think the functions of army aviation are known), that's why TU-22 is the leading airborne reconnaissance ..
        ТОлько вот это "гениальное" решение принял не пресловутый Сердюков, а бывший министр обороны С.Иванов, ныне благополучно пребывающий в должности главы админстрации ПРезидента.
        After the conflict with Georgia, army aviation, of course, was returned to the Ground Forces, so to speak, once again heroically overcome the difficulties created by their own hands ...
        So you don’t have to hang all the dogs on Serdyukov, he has enough of his sins and don’t have to hang strangers on him ....
        Но я полагаю, что страна наряду с Сердюковым должна знать имена и других своих "героев".. hi
        1. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 2 November 2015 11: 47 New
          +2
          In my opinion, army aviation is still part of the Air Force (VKS).
      6. Loner_53
        Loner_53 2 November 2015 13: 53 New
        +3
        Quote: Alekseev
        The strengthening of the armed forces has not yet plowed the field of work. And farts are just an unsuccessful start to this very work.
        And do not insinuate.

        RIGHT article analysis and accurate conclusion, thanks hi
      7. afdjhbn67
        afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 14: 37 New
        +1
        Quote: Alekseev
        And do not insinuate

        Reinforced Concrete Arguments good
        Judging by the comments of the opponents, there is nothing to say hi
      8. Alexandr-NVR
        Alexandr-NVR 2 November 2015 17: 30 New
        +2
        Я тоже "закипел", прочитав эту ересь.
        Автор далек от армии, но для ваяния подобной заказухи знание армии изнутри и не требуется. Хотелось сначала разложить по-полочкам откровенную некомпетентность "адвоката дьявола", как автор сам себя красочно нарек, но аргументированный разбор статьи занял бы объем раза в 2-3 больше самого "произведения".
        А вообще - бесполезно автору чего-то объяснять. Он - выполнил заказ. Выполнил кривовато, бестолково-поверхностно, то что в народе называют "тяп-ляп" и не интересует его ничье мнение. Это - монолог, не подразумевающий какого либо обсуждения. Это и удержало от ответа в Вашем стиле smile
      9. Independent
        Independent 2 November 2015 18: 06 New
        0
        Quote: Alekseev
        вольных, то ли невольных апологетов вороватого и похотливого "спасителя" хватает.

        Bravo. Do not decrease, do not add.
    5. Sling cutter
      Sling cutter 2 November 2015 07: 33 New
      16
      Quote: Andrey Yurievich
      ! (The author sincerely pleased)

      Yeah... laughing clearly pleased, just licked laughing about hpppppppp
      и ещё вот эта цитата:"наша армия еле-еле смогла выиграть войну у Грузии".
      the author apparently plays cards ..., stratechhh, damn it ....
      my miiinus is unlikely to reflect the whole gamut of feelings in relation to author ...
      into the furnace of such writers! into the furnace! am negative
      1. afdjhbn67
        afdjhbn67 2 November 2015 09: 53 New
        0
        Quote: Stroporez
        Yeah...

        Oh, you're a Kremlin boat and the fifth column .. in one bottle ... laughing
        rise above my comment read .. (as advertisements) laughing
        1. Sling cutter
          Sling cutter 2 November 2015 10: 58 New
          0
          Quote: afdjhbn67
          Oh you kremlebot and the fifth column .. in one bottle

          Я ещё и "белоленточник" вот такая ,блин, гремучая смесь laughing и порой, когда хочется сделать"ку" и описаться от счастья при виде кремлядей в зомбодуроскопе,я со всей пролетарской неистовостью наступаю на аицы собственной стерховой песне belay
          And mohhhh continues to repeat We are not slaves! Slaves are NOT WE!
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. creak
        creak 2 November 2015 13: 19 New
        +2
        Quote: Stroporez

        In my opinion, army aviation is still part of the Air Force (VKS).


        No, in 2010 the army aviation was transferred to the subordination of the commanders of the USC (districts) of the Ground Forces.
        For the Air Force (VKS) there were only questions of combat training.
    6. Good me
      Good me 2 November 2015 08: 52 New
      +7
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      Again this topic is Serdyukov the secret savior of the Russian Army!


      W-oh-oh ... And you all wonder: For whom, yes for whom, Putin, if so, leave the state ... What is not an example of dedication and other, very, very secret benefactors?

      Do not despair, Russia, the savior Serdyukov is coming! We, all, will have happiness and prosperity ...
      1. Karabanov
        Karabanov 2 November 2015 09: 03 New
        +3
        Quote: Good Me
        Do not despair, Russia, the savior Serdyukov is coming! We, all, will have happiness and prosperity ...
    7. Loner_53
      Loner_53 2 November 2015 10: 57 New
      +4
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      Again this topic is Serdyukov the secret savior of the Russian Army!

      Vladimir think correctly hi Как яро своего верха взялись отмазывать.А не проще было бы указом правительства памятник в стиле "статуи свободы"
  • Same lech
    Same lech 2 November 2015 05: 34 New
    31
    Already after Serdyukov’s resignation, he read an article (unfortunately, I cannot find it now) that he did the impossible with the Ministry of Defense - he cleaned the department from the generals


    Yeah, and put their crooks in their place .... than SERDYUKOV is better than them .... the author is a little cunning ...

    But I agree that SERDYUKOV was used as a tool for solving sensitive problems .... and I probably gave him guarantees of inviolability at the highest level ... the only way I can explain its jurisdiction to our law.

    Hehe and me brains soar that the law is the same for everyone.
    1. Private IITR
      Private IITR 2 November 2015 08: 18 New
      -7
      In some ways, the author is right, Putin would not have allowed him back into power if he had such a radish
      1. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 41 New
        +7
        And if you think about it? There, above, there is a whole garden of such radishes and it is time to weed.
      2. Tambov Wolf
        Tambov Wolf 2 November 2015 10: 24 New
        +5
        Putin has in power how many rogue sits, eh? How many he kicked out? He throws it from place to place in order to steal in different ways, in one - rubles, in another - dollars, in the third - land, in the fourth - buildings and constructions, etc. Variety is obtained. And thieves are pleased, it doesn’t have to be spent on anything. This is not the Russian people, but they don’t give up their own.
      3. BARKHAN
        BARKHAN 2 November 2015 10: 35 New
        +5
        Why is it covering him?
        Yes, because the Commander-in-Chief is personally responsible for the actions of the one he appointed.
    2. Good me
      Good me 2 November 2015 14: 01 New
      +3
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      Hehe and me brains soar that the law is the same for everyone.
  • ML-334
    ML-334 2 November 2015 05: 36 New
    -4
    In fact, the author is right. Recently I got minuses for the Mistral, but in my common sense I think I'm right. Good luck!
    1. aksakal
      aksakal 2 November 2015 06: 53 New
      -4
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      But I agree that Serdyukov was used as a tool for solving sensitive problems

      Quote: ML-334
      In fact, the author is right. Recently I got minuses for the Mistral, but in my common sense I think I'm right. Good luck!
      - Не люблю Сердюкова, но мне тоже кажется, что автор САБЖа где-то в чем-то прав. Реорганизовать силовой орган и взять гнев генералов на себя - тоже ведь не сахар. И потому наверняка гарантии были ему даны... А насчет "поэтессы" - так ведь гарантии были даны ему лично, а насчет любовниц базара не было laughing laughing In any case, there is a result, in any case, Shoigu did not cancel much, canceled only the most odious ones - moving military establishments, etc., purchasing foreign equipment, etc.
      Пусть гуляет, что называется. Ему тоже не позавидуешь и сейчас любовница в тюрьме, сам себя ощущает использованным презервативом, использовали в грязной работе и выкинули к черту в должность среднего звена "Ростеха" бумажки перекладывать с места на место laughing Let it go, damn it
      1. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 2 November 2015 07: 54 New
        +7
        Quote: aksakal
        . Reorganizing the power body and taking the anger of the generals upon themselves is also not sugar.

        yeah, handsome and hey
      2. Karabanov
        Karabanov 2 November 2015 09: 08 New
        +5
        Quote: aksakal
        Let it go, damn it
      3. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 44 New
        +2
        You are a good person.
      4. The comment was deleted.
      5. creak
        creak 2 November 2015 11: 03 New
        +1
        Quote: aksakal
        in any case, Shoigu did not cancel much, canceled only the most odious ones - moving military establishments and so on, purchasing foreign equipment, etc.



        Did Shoigu cancel the decision to move universities - what about moving the Strategic Missile Forces Academy from Moscow to Balashikha and setting up another VUNC there, like under Serdyukov ...
        1. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 2 November 2015 11: 54 New
          +1
          Well, I think that in the near future Balashitha, like a part of the Moscow region, will inevitably become part of Moscow. Everything goes to this. The unification of Moscow and the near Moscow region is inevitable.
      6. BARKHAN
        BARKHAN 2 November 2015 20: 10 New
        +5
        Dear aksakal, in such cases I always cite A. Vlasov as an example ...
        He proved himself during the defense of Moscow - he was awarded, then he betrayed his homeland - he was hanged ... And no confusion, believe me.
        What he did good at his post was his work, a routine, so to speak. He received a salary for this. And the fact that he himself stole and created the thieves' community is already life-long. And these two stories do not overlap in the head from citizens. People are not stupid, believe me. If a doctor of science steals a wallet, he also sits down like a pickpocket. No preferences. And this is fair. And any attempt to whitewash him now is perceived as a spit on the people.
    2. NordUral
      NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 42 New
      +2
      Why do we need Mistals, can you clearly explain? Where are you going to land? And the author is a supernumerary slime. I looked in the internet - I did not find one in Yandex.
      1. creak
        creak 2 November 2015 10: 20 New
        0
        Quote: NordUral
        Why do we need Mistals, can you clearly explain? Where are you going to land?


        And can you clearly explain on what the troops and equipment were transferred to the same Latakia? You can’t throw everything by air, I know this firsthand, I had to participate in something myself ...
        Да на тех же далеко не новых БДК, коих у нас совсем немного и сухогрузах... И универсальный десантный корабль типа "Мистраль" был бы для этого совсем не лишним...
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. creak
          creak 2 November 2015 10: 50 New
          -1
          I want to add to the above that the Mistral can carry 12 heavy or 32 light helicopters even to the battalion of the Marine Corps - after landing it can be used as a control point, floating base or hospital ...
          I hope my explanation is quite intelligible - especially not the fact that the operation in Latakia is extreme ...
          So we will live by the principle - until the thunder strikes ...
          1. afdjhbn67
            afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 02: 22 New
            0
            Quote: ranger
            The Mistral can carry 12 heavy or 32 light helicopters even to the Marine Corps battalion - after landing it can be used as a command post, floating base or hospital ...

            Maybe someone argues .. the Egyptians ....
        3. NordUral
          NordUral 2 November 2015 11: 41 New
          -1
          Ground forces in Syria do not need to be led, there will be either a second Afghanistan, only more terrible than the first, or we will play a game before World War II.
          And for the transfer of equipment and weapons, there are transport ships.
          Our country has other tasks - the defense of its territories and assistance to the military-technical allies. For this, landing ships are not required.
      2. Tambov Wolf
        Tambov Wolf 2 November 2015 10: 29 New
        +2
        Interestingly, I put you a plus, a minus flew out. Do we have it moderated the other way around? And where should there be a plus, it’s zero. Or again with the general line the pros and cons themselves are put.
      3. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA 2 November 2015 10: 50 New
        +4
        Quote: NordUral
        Why do we need Mistals, can you clearly explain? Where are you going to land?

        And why does the marine corps regularly practice landing on exercises? smile

        "Мистрали" нужны были нам по двум причинам:

        "Военная" - быстро получить новые корабли и начать отработку новой для нас тактики применения (и вообще концепции "дистанционного" десанта). Потому как высадка десанта с помощью БДК при наличии противника, хотя бы минимально превосходящего грузин, приведёт к большой мясорубке на подходе к пляжу. Медленно ползущие к берегу огромные коробки, набитые людьми и техникой - это просто мишени для всех средств БО, включая ПТРК и миномёты.
        Плюс к тому, "Мистрали" могли обеспечить десанту авиаподдержку бортовыми вертолётами - чего у морпехов до этого вообще не было.

        "Техническая" - дать нашим КБ документацию на "живой" корабль. Чтобы они не варились в собственном соку, проектируя воздушные замки на основании нечётких данных из непроверенных источников.
        1. NordUral
          NordUral 2 November 2015 11: 54 New
          0
          The question is different - why should we drop somewhere? We need to defend ourselves against real threats, and not climb to fight abroad.
          Вот пуски "калибрами" и показали, какие к примеру корабли нам нужны, а не эти плавучие и ненужные мишени.
          1. Alexey RA
            Alexey RA 2 November 2015 13: 07 New
            -3
            Quote: NordUral
            The question is different - why should we drop somewhere? We need to defend ourselves against real threats, and not climb to fight abroad.

            Well, ask the Marines a question - why do they conduct landing exercises annually? smile

            What about do not go to war abroad - Actually, we are already fighting abroad. wink
            Quote: NordUral
            Вот пуски "калибрами" и показали, какие к примеру корабли нам нужны, а не эти плавучие и ненужные мишени.

            Ах-ха-ха... заказ МРК-носителей "калибров" для Каспия и вообще концепция вооружения Каспийской флотилии носителями КР - это как раз Сердюков. А ведь как тогда поливали МО за совершенно ненужные и избыточные МРК на закрытом море...
  • xavbek7
    xavbek7 2 November 2015 05: 37 New
    24
    Если следовать логике автора-то "бориске пьяному" тоже спасибо сказать надо.За "добрые девяностые".
    1. v0802r
      v0802r 2 November 2015 05: 42 New
      24
      And to Hunchback for pots in the defense industry. It turns out that everyone around is fools.
      1. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 2 November 2015 05: 54 New
        13
        Quote: v0802r
        It turns out that everything around is fools

        no, only you and I ... what
      2. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 46 New
        +3
        Isn’t that so? Recall how worried about Boris. I am ashamed of my stupidity. It is a pity that the GKChP members turned out to be insignificant.
    2. Jack-b
      Jack-b 2 November 2015 06: 15 New
      -2
      С логикой у вас туго. Сердюков оставил после себя реформированную армию, которая через год отработала в крыму, а еще через год отрабатывает в Сирии. А за что хотите сказать спасибо "бориске пьяному"?
      1. Finches
        Finches 2 November 2015 07: 44 New
        18
        Kamrad, I’ll tell you so, if Ivanov or even Marshal Sergeyev had such funding for the army and carte blanche from the Supreme, then we would now have an army several orders of magnitude more powerful! Not like Crimea, so-so operation is not Amin’s palace they would have taken in a foreign country and not Grozny, packed with inveterate fighters and armed to the teeth with Saudi Arabia ... Alaska and California could have been attached. The army from the very beginning of the 90s did not crawl out of armed conflicts: Transnistria, Dagestan, two Chechnya, South Ossetia has everywhere fulfilled its tasks, with the most meager financing and the lack of everything, and even with the constant betrayal of politicians ...
        1. Jack-b
          Jack-b 2 November 2015 12: 47 New
          -4
          They say history does not know the subjunctive mood. Judge for yourself. Knowing that reform of the army and increased funding are brewing, Ivanov is being exchanged for Serdyukov. At the same time, Ivanov is not thrown out of the cage, he goes to deputy chairmen. Those. Ivanov didn’t fault anyone, they simply thought that he would not be able to do this for some reason. If we exclude from the reasons that moment that Serdyukov could better cope with the reforms and assume that Ivanov did this at least as well, then what were the reasons for changing the price of soap? Serdyukov more thieves than Ivanov? Does he give more kickbacks than Ivanov? Is he a closer relative than Ivanov?
          1. Finches
            Finches 2 November 2015 18: 01 New
            +2
            But didn’t you think that Ivanov was just a friend and he wasn’t set up under public opinion while maintaining his authority? Or the fact that Ivanov simply answered, no, I won’t do it, don’t pi ... s! But they told Serdyukov - work hard and earn full confidence? Serdyukov did something and was digested, but what I like about the Supreme, he doesn’t give up his team, even moral freaks, but who personally didn’t let him down, it is respectable ... Here Joseph Visarionovich consistently removed stupid and presumptuous performers .... Who of these, history has made more judgments for Russia, but I express my opinion of a person from military service to Lieutenant Colonel (today) who have given good years of youth to the service, I may not be quite right, but ...- Serdyukov is a traitor to national interests and his The reforms were not aimed at the benefit of the Motherland, but solely for the benefit of his pocket and his peace! All that he did was exclusively criminal !!!!

            I have the honor! soldier
            1. afdjhbn67
              afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 02: 33 New
              +1
              Quote: Finches
              Serdyukov did something and was digested, but what I like about the Supreme, he doesn’t give up his team, even moral freaks, but who didn’t let him down personally, it inspires respect

              В этом его беда и главная ошибка, избито и банально но "Свита делает короля".. свиту не очень любит(мягко) народ и это началось транслироваться на Путина,,Живой пример я сам если сравнительно недавно я готов был стоя аплодировать ВВП, глядя на всю движуху как в правительстве так и в Кремле у меня начали возникать вопросы об утрате пассионарности Путина и о начале нового "застоя" которому я лично благодарен счастливым детством( сейчас начинаю понимать..) но которой привел к последующим событиям - развалу страны, реставрации капитализма в самой его уродливой форме итд hi
              and agree with the rest
      2. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 47 New
        0
        Have you joked about stools?
  • Finches
    Finches 2 November 2015 05: 37 New
    25
    "Вор - должен сидеть в тюрьме!" - почему то именно эта фраза мне всегда приходит на ум при упоминании этого господина! Это раз. Второе армия в 2008 году была,и она выполняла поставленные задачи, но она была другая, не совсем одетая и со старым вооружением, но боеготовная!Прошедшая через горнило двух Чеченских компании! За 5 дней обратить в бегство натовских выкормошей - это что то должно значить! На 20 профнепригодных военнослужащих ушли из армии 100 профессионалов, причем многие офицеры с уникальным боевым опытом, про военное образование промолчу - старого нет, новое еще не построено и пожинать плоды этой реформы еще лет 8...Сердюков свою задачу сделал - резал по живому и сломал советскую систему в армии везде где только успел... В любом случае лично я его никогда не зауважаю и не полюблю, даже если тысячи "адвокатов" напишут оправдательные памфлеты и будут петь дифирамбы с утра до вечера!Черного кобеля до бела не отмыть...
    1. KOH
      KOH 2 November 2015 05: 57 New
      +5
      Я вот на все 100% с "Зяблицевым" согласен, так что и мне можете минусы ставить...
    2. Angara
      Angara 2 November 2015 06: 19 New
      15
      I’ll add: how many military institutes did I multiply by zero? In Chelyabinsk, there are as many as two automobile and tank. And they delivered good shots. Is that the same merit? negative
      1. Nyrobsky
        Nyrobsky 2 November 2015 09: 03 New
        +5
        Quote: Angara
        I’ll add: how many military institutes did I multiply by zero? In Chelyabinsk, there are as many as two automobile and tank. And they delivered good shots. Is that the same merit?

        I will add from myself - in Ordzhonikidze (Nana Vladikavkaz) there were three military schools, and now not a single one. But there was a good base there, taking into account mountain tactics, which, based on the nature of the conduct of the latest military operations (along the way and forthcoming), is relevant for the army.
        Получается, что этот "реформатор" тупо резал военные училища не учитывая потребностей армии.
        1. Finches
          Finches 2 November 2015 09: 25 New
          +5
          And I will add about military education, with your permission!

          Before Serdyukov it was (if I'm not lying):

          15 academies, 4 universities, 46 institutes and schools.

          Now:

          9 academies, 1 university, 3 educational and research centers, 11 institutes and schools.
      2. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 50 New
        +1
        Looking from which side to look ... If because of two puddles, then a very big achievement.
    3. NordUral
      NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 49 New
      +4
      I subscribe to your words. All thieves should be in prison and will, I have no doubt, when the people get out.
    4. WINovikov
      WINovikov 2 November 2015 10: 51 New
      +4
      ... the army was in 2008, and it fulfilled the tasks ...
      Fulfilled, despite the stupid orders because of the distant lands of the chiefs who did not fight, but with big stars.
    5. afdjhbn67
      afdjhbn67 3 November 2015 02: 51 New
      +1
      Quote: Finches
      если тысячи "адвокатов"

      Yes, the author did not pull the devil into a lawyer .. and Serdyukov also does not pull on such a hellish role - an ordinary bureaucrat who was snickering from impunity, seized power due to circumstances ..
  • Stinger
    Stinger 2 November 2015 05: 40 New
    22
    Выражение автора "командир 58й Армии" говорит о многом. Так обозвать командующего может только шпак. Дальше читать не о чем. Обычный либеральный трёп.
    1. Finches
      Finches 2 November 2015 05: 41 New
      +2
      Totally agree with you! hi
    2. Same lech
      Same lech 2 November 2015 05: 44 New
      15
      [quote] [quote] In that war, the obese commander of the 58th Army was wounded, as he rushed to Tskhinval on the Volga almost without cover and was ambushed

      [/ Quote]
      How can I say so .... all the same, this officer was injured and not the author of the article ....
      honestly, I can’t take such an author seriously ... a badly respected author to humiliate an officer.
      1. WINovikov
        WINovikov 2 November 2015 10: 55 New
        +6
        ... a badly respected author to humiliate an officer ...
        Not everyone who wears epaulettes with big stars deserves to be called an officer.
    3. Misha Honest
      Misha Honest 2 November 2015 07: 14 New
      16
      In that war, an obese 58 Army commander was wounded, as he rushed to Tskhinval on the Volga almost without cover and was ambushed, in which several of our guys posthumously became “Heroes of Russia”, covering up the journalists who were to cover the victorious entry of the general to the capital of South Ossetia.

      The author of the article trampled into the mud not only the military general, but the soldiers who served under his command. Where are only such .... born on Russian land? :(
  • Zomanus
    Zomanus 2 November 2015 05: 41 New
    +4
    An interesting look ...
    Met articles with similar content.
    More about the provision of military housing, the author forgot to write,
    it also began under Serdyukov.
  • N-SKiy
    N-SKiy 2 November 2015 05: 42 New
    +8
    I am not (not) an exception. If you look through my FB in the years when he was a minister, then you will immediately see that I have repeatedly published over critical articles about him.

    You work out the gingerbread or become a liberalist.
  • Armored optimist
    Armored optimist 2 November 2015 05: 43 New
    +3
    Muddy question. We will never know the details.
  • KOH
    KOH 2 November 2015 05: 44 New
    +9
    What can an accountant do in MO ...? It's like sending Volochkov to a lathe ... but there must have been something positive ... If the engine stuck, but the car washes regularly, it looks good too but does not go ...
    1. Angara
      Angara 2 November 2015 06: 21 New
      +5
      Quote: CON
      Send Volochkova to the lathe

      Interesting idea! And to the foot of the dynamo, let it produce electricity! wassat
    2. BMW
      BMW 2 November 2015 06: 25 New
      +8
      Quote: CON
      .If the engine is stuck on the car, but the car is regularly washed, then it also looks good, but does not go ...

      If you put to such a car, even Volochkova, even an accountant, even Taburetkin, even an academician in physical sciences, he will not go anywhere anyway. There will only be dances with tambourines. Only a simple locksmith will help, and ideally a mechanic.
      As soon as Vasiliev was released, articles such as from the cornucopia rained down. negative
  • svp67
    svp67 2 November 2015 05: 50 New
    22
    "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"
    Ну вот началось "обеление черного". Нет, автор не прав, все что произошло, а именно "вежливым людям" и ВКС мы обязаны не Сердюкову, а тем людям, которые ВОПРЕКИ Сердюкову сохранили "боеспособное ядро". И не будь "дурных реформ и действий" Сердюкова и больше у нас было бы "вежливых" и ВКС могли бы действовать более большими силами
    1. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 2 November 2015 05: 56 New
      +7
      Quote: svp67
      "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"
      Ну вот началось "обеление черного". Нет, автор не прав, все что произошло, а именно "вежливым людям" и ВКС мы обязаны не Сердюкову, а тем людям, которые ВОПРЕКИ Сердюкову сохранили "боеспособное ядро". И не будь "дурных реформ и действий" Сердюкова и больше у нас было бы "вежливых" и ВКС могли бы действовать более большими силами

      Seryoga, it's five! S +! Hi.. hi
    2. olimpiada15
      olimpiada15 2 November 2015 06: 20 New
      +9
      Quote: svp67
      "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"
      Ну вот началось "обеление черного". Нет, автор не прав, все что произошло, а именно "вежливым людям" и ВКС мы обязаны не Сердюкову, а тем людям, которые ВОПРЕКИ Сердюкову сохранили "боеспособное ядро". И не будь "дурных реформ и действий" Сердюкова и больше у нас было бы "вежливых" и ВКС могли бы действовать более большими силами

      Here is an accurate and correct estimate! The one who preserved and strengthened the army did contrary to Serdyukov!
      Comment 10000000 + !!!!
      And do not excuse Serdyukov: he was engaged in finances, the harem, he did not care about the army.
      1. NordUral
        NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 55 New
        +3
        It was - to destroy it was his business, what is there to fint.
    3. Jack-b
      Jack-b 2 November 2015 06: 30 New
      -18
      Quote: svp67
      Despite the Serdyukov saved

      Those. according to your army sample 2006g. was quite capable of conducting operations like the Crimean and Syrian with the same efficiency?
      1. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 2 November 2015 07: 21 New
        10
        Quote: Jack-B
        Quote: svp67
        Despite the Serdyukov saved

        Those. according to your army sample 2006g. was quite capable of conducting operations like the Crimean and Syrian with the same efficiency?

        and what, in the Crimea there were databases ??? and in Syria they would have done, in Afghanistan they could have no Syria? (XP, lick a bit, and blame the army ...)
        1. Jack-b
          Jack-b 2 November 2015 07: 36 New
          -8
          Quote: Andrey Yurievich
          and what, in the Crimea there were databases ??? and in Syria they would have done, in Afghanistan they could have no Syria? (XP, lick a bit, and blame the army ...)

          В Афгане могли, а через пять лет всего в 1994-м в чечне не смогли. В 2008 по идее должна была быть лёгкая прогулка, но "что то пошло не так". В Крыму БД не было только благодаря идеально проведённой операции, сработали скрытно и на опережение. О Сирии говорить еще рано по большому счету, посмотрим по итогу. Но пока о сирийской операций складывается гораздо лучшее впечатление чем, скажем, о второй чеченской.
          1. NordUral
            NordUral 2 November 2015 09: 56 New
            +6
            You yourself would have walked there then, I would have looked at you.
          2. Vladimir 1964
            Vladimir 1964 2 November 2015 09: 58 New
            10
            Quote: Jack-B
            В Афгане могли, а через пять лет всего в 1994-м в чечне не смогли. В 2008 по идее должна была быть лёгкая прогулка, но "что то пошло не так". В Крыму БД не было только благодаря идеально проведённой операции, сработали скрытно и на опережение. О Сирии говорить еще рано по большому счету, посмотрим по итогу. Но пока о сирийской операций складывается гораздо лучшее впечатление чем, скажем, о второй чеченской.

            Позволю несколько замечаний к Вашему комментарию, Уважаемый Евгений. Что касается чеченской войны и грузинского конфликта, то Вооруженные силы России обвинять в том, что происходило на начальных этапах этих боевых действий по меньшей мере нелепо. Ибо Армия это не самостоятельный организм, это орган государственной власти, предназначенный для реализации политики государства в вопросах его обороны. На момент начала Чеченской войны государство не способно было управлять ни чем, в следствии чего Армии пришлось взять на себя функции абсолютно ей не свойственные, в результате чего пройдя путь тяжелейших потерь и ошибок Армия смогла загнать противника в горы и готова была его уничтожить, но была предана опять таки руководителями. В грузинском конфликте ситуация ещё парадоксальней, на момент принятия решения, ни одного руководителя либо "не оказалось на месте", либо в результате ступора они не могли принимать решения. И опять Армия взяла на себя функции государства, и не известно как-бы вообще развивались события, не прими на себя инициативу "ожиревший" генерал Хрулёв. Не в Армии дело. Дело в том, что на момент начала этих событий можно сказать, перефразируя одного исторического персонажа, в креслах руководителей сидели люди, способные лишь к сидению в оных но не способные к руководству.

            Something like that, dear colleagues. hi soldier
            PS The author of the article is far from understanding the problems of the Armed Forces, a typical spack! negative
            1. Jack-b
              Jack-b 2 November 2015 10: 41 New
              -6
              Quote: Vladimir 1964
              The Russian Armed Forces are at least ridiculous to blame what happened at the initial stages of these military operations

              Позвольте не согласится. Что значит "нелепо"? Вы пишете:
              Quote: Vladimir 1964
              At the time the Chechen war began, the state was not able to control anything, as a result of which the Army had to take on functions completely uncharacteristic of it

              What functions in that war did the army take upon itself that were not characteristic of it? The army began to rule the state? Yes, the order to storm Grozny without proper preparation was criminally wrong. But the Army did not have a normal command that could explain this miscalculation to the country's leadership. The command of the army could not plan and ensure this operation. The command of the army threw unburnt boys into hell. This is precisely the problem of the army. It is difficult to blame her for this, because as you rightly said, there were big problems in the state, and the army is part of our state with all the consequences. But in light of the topic of the article, we must admit that the army was in deep decline at that moment. And it was not able to conduct normal hostilities. The difference between the army of the 1994 model is clearly seen. and 2015g.
              1. Vladimir 1964
                Vladimir 1964 2 November 2015 11: 18 New
                +5
                Quote: Jack-B
                The command of the army threw unburnt boys into hell.


                Евгений, приказ о начале войны был рождён в пьяном мозгу, на тот момент главного дерьмократа Российской Федерации, и исполнялся он тем что смогли "наскрести" на тот момент. Кто подсунул мысль Борьке, понятно, но этот вопрос требует отдельного разговора. Если в двух словах Паша, по сути своей не был министров, в государственном понимании, "сторожем-охранником", гарантом безопасности и лояльности Армии был. Ну а всё остальное я повторять не буду, коллега. hi
                1. Alexey RA
                  Alexey RA 2 November 2015 13: 13 New
                  -3
                  Quote: Vladimir 1964
                  Евгений, приказ о начале войны был рождён в пьяном мозгу, на тот момент главного дерьмократа Российской Федерации, и исполнялся он тем что смогли "наскрести" на тот момент.

                  The problem is that the army, for its part, has made the maximum possible for the notorious New Year events in Grozny. To enter a potentially hostile city, go to the train station - and get up without worrying about guarding and monitoring the terrain - how is this?
      2. Azitral
        Azitral 2 November 2015 10: 55 New
        0
        Не. В 2006 году армия, - это уже пол-беды. В 1999 году ВВП, не имея ни сил, ни времени, ни денег, ни ресурсов для реформу армии сделал единственно возможное: собрал все, что было мало-мальски боеспособно в одну кучу, как собирают вместе едва тлеющие головешки, оно и загорелось потихоньку. По сути, до реформ, - две параллельных армии, гниющий труп СА и очень небольшая группировка ЮФО. Вполне боеспособная, мобильная, жилистая, только плоховато снабженная. И Хрулев, - поспорю с автором! - сработал вполне достойно. А все остальное, - это не "армия 2006 г." это армия 1-й Чеченской. Помните грязных, тщедушных "срочников" по всем каналам ТВ? Помните победоносных генералов советского разлива? Нашелся хоть один, на что-то годный? И ведь всех выпустили училища, о которых вы так безутешно рыдаете! А бородатых могучих красавцев-моджахедов из Чечни - помните? Вы хотите сказать, что это могло как-то так само собой преобразиться? Вы лучше про Деда Мороза, это куда меньшая сказка. И насчет "мне бы такое финансирование". Без нефтеденег "нулевых", понятно, ничего не вышло бы. Но и прогадить можно ЛЮБЫЕ деньги. Даже без злого умысла. Просто по бездарности и неумению.
      3. svp67
        svp67 2 November 2015 16: 49 New
        +2
        Quote: Jack-B
        Those. according to your army sample 2006g. was quite capable of conducting operations like the Crimean and Syrian with the same efficiency?

        Нет, не была способна. Но она оказалась способна переломить ситуацию и победить в войне 08.08.08, и опять же ВОПРЕКИ действиям Сердюкова. Очень надеюсь, что его не благовидные деяния в первые часы этого конфликта, когда решалось многое, все таки станут известны не только широкому кругу общественности, но и следственным органам...хотя надежд на это все меньше и меньше, но СПАСИБО русским солдату и офицеру, что они способны выйти победителями из самых не простых положений. И имея таких солдат и офицеров Шойгу просто добавил современные способы управления и обеспечения, да показал армии, что она не "мои зеленые человечки" (А.Сердюков),а действительно нужна стране и благодаря этому очень быстро и появились "вежливые люди".
  • Denis DV
    Denis DV 2 November 2015 05: 58 New
    10
    since he rushed to Tskhinval on the Volga almost without cover and was ambushed

    nonsense, the battle was with the headquarters column, and everything happens in war.

    or we realize that such processes do not happen so quickly, and, therefore, “Polite people” and fashionable airborne pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov’s reforms.


    And I realize that it could have been even cooler if you had appointed Shoigu earlier.

    But this is if you think and analyze.


    Author! Where is the analysis in the article?

    negative
    1. Same lech
      Same lech 2 November 2015 06: 05 New
      +8
      Author! Where is the analysis in the article?


      What other analysis am then they don’t smell close ...
      the author clearly said ...

      I decided to write an article that will cause the ire of both the “Kremlin bots” and the “fifth column”


      that is, he recorded us in Kremlin boats and the fifth column .... is it an analyst what

      The analyst has a completely different task ..... to reveal the essence of finding the cause and effect ... this is not here.
      1. Dr. Livesey
        Dr. Livesey 2 November 2015 09: 20 New
        +3
        Quote: Denis DV
        Author! Where is the analysis in the article?

        Quote: The same LYOKHA
        What other analysis doesn’t it smell like ...

        Yes, kaaak smells! Just analyzes for worms. Article with a choke. laughing
        Quote: The same LYOKHA
        I decided to write an article that will cause the ire of both the “Kremlin bots” and the “fifth column”

        that is, he recorded us in Kremlin boats and the fifth column .... is it an analyst

        Вспомнились слова из песни Талькова: "И бомбит "жлобов" с трибуны самый главный в мире ЖЛОБ!" hi
    2. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 2 November 2015 06: 10 New
      +9
      Quote: Denis DV
      Author! Where is the analysis in the article?

      статья сама-"анализы"...
      He spent huge federal money on actually taking bribes to transfer the sons of generals who did not know anything about military art to other non-military posts in order to leave real pros in the Moscow Region.
      neighing ...
      But everyone who understands the slowness and slowness of such a colossus as the Russian Army cannot help but realize that without Serdyukov’s reforms there would be no “Polite People”
      опять ржу...("вежливых людей"после сердюковщины,срочно переодевали и переобували,забыли как Шойгу "модельеровюдашкиных" оттягивал? и так далее...бред статья. медсанбаты,аэродромы,специалисты,военные училища- не он это разрушил...ага...
    3. Jack-b
      Jack-b 2 November 2015 06: 22 New
      -10
      Quote: Denis DV
      And I realize that it could have been even cooler if you had appointed Shoigu earlier.

      А с чего вы взяли что Шойгу бы справился лучше? В вас вселяет уверенность то, что на Шойгу небыло таких накатов в СМИ как на Сердюкова? Что вы знаете о МЧС времён Шойгу? У меня друзья работали и работают в МЧС, так могут многое порассказать как закупали снегоходы, катера и много еще чего якобы для работы, но в работу они не идут. Оседают на заимках для развлекухи "высшего состава партии". И вы мне после этого будете говорить что Шойгу смог бы реформировать армию лучше Сердюкова?
      1. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 2 November 2015 07: 24 New
        +3
        Quote: Jack-B
        My friends worked and work in the Ministry of Emergencies, so they can tell a lot

        понеслась она по кочкам! "у меня друзья" бла-бла-бла! и ещё добавить:одна бабка сказала!"какие ваши доказательства?"(какое то старое кино с Арнольдом Ш.) laughing
        1. Jack-b
          Jack-b 2 November 2015 07: 42 New
          -11
          Quote: Andrey Yurievich
          What is your evidence?

          Ну если о доказательствах разговор вести, то давайте начнём с доказательств по Сердюкову. Статья ведь о нём. Суд доказательств не нашёл. У вас против него что нибудь есть? Или "бла-бла-бла"? Я своим друзьям верю, им нет смысла мне врать на эту тему. А у вас какие причины не доверять этой информации? Или разрыв шаблона?
          1. cuzmin.mihail2013
            cuzmin.mihail2013 2 November 2015 08: 58 New
            +4
            The court did not find evidence.
            He didn’t really look for Vasilyeva either !!!
        2. nazar_0753
          nazar_0753 2 November 2015 14: 20 New
          0
          Фильм "Красная жара", если не ошибаюсь hi
      2. Denis DV
        Denis DV 2 November 2015 09: 07 New
        +4
        Quote: Jack-B
        And after that you will tell me that Shoigu could reform the army better than Serdyukov?


        Shoigu came to the reformed army, all ready? No.
        1. Jack-b
          Jack-b 2 November 2015 11: 12 New
          -5
          Quote: Denis DV
          Shoigu came to the reformed army, all ready?

          Не на всё, но задел был. Или вы полагаете он с "нуля" всё за год поднял?
  • Vladimir71
    Vladimir71 2 November 2015 06: 14 New
    +7
    Похоже этому клоуну "Сердюкову" пора вешать звезду героя России но в его случае деревянную. Ему с мебелью привычней)))
    1. Astronomer
      Astronomer 2 November 2015 06: 42 New
      10
      Order of the Sutuly, first degree, with a twist on the back ...
      But seriously, the destruction of the military education system alone deserves the highest ... no, they didn’t guess, they didn’t reward ... social protection measures ...
      А про "умника", написавшего статью, скажу - он ни разу, ни одним местом не военный...
      Не только потому, что пытается выставить бестолковыми людей, которые сумели провести классическую операцию в масштабах армейского корпуса, классическую по организации, взаимодействию видов ВС, срокам и минимизации потерь. И не потому, что путает командира и командующего. А лишь только потому, что издевательства "мебельщика" над Армией и Флотом воспринимает с восторгом.
      Just in case, I do not have Kazakh citizenship, but was, is and will be a citizen of the USSR.
  • BecmepH
    BecmepH 2 November 2015 06: 25 New
    +7
    В 2009 4 месяца лежал в Бурденко. Как-то со мной в палате лежал очень большой чин, близкий к генералитету. Со слов его приятеля, генерал-лейтенанта, Сердюков, заходя в зал говорил: "Что, пи*орки, собрались?" Это одна из строчек в его характеристике...
    1. ICT
      ICT 2 November 2015 06: 50 New
      +2
      Quote: BecmepH
      "Что, пи*орки, собрались?" Это одна из строчек в его характеристике...



      это характеристика, как раз генералитета( если байка правда ), все взрослые мужики просто е"бальник бы разбили и всё за такие слова и ни кто бы их не осудил ().
  • natakor1949
    natakor1949 2 November 2015 06: 26 New
    10
    Этот очаровашка "дьявол" виноват уж тем, что позволил окружить себя воровками и ворами, что строил коробки домов без инфраструктуры, за что С.К.Шойгу неоднократно ему "пендалей выписывал" на совещаниях, а он при этом ещё и огрызался, зная о своей безнаказанности. Это тысячная доля его "производственного творчества", а закрытие медицинских и других академий по стране сколько, это почерк вообще то - врага. Охамевший субъект, нет ему прощения.
  • Yrsh.2008
    Yrsh.2008 2 November 2015 06: 29 New
    18
    Already after Serdyukov’s resignation, he read an article (unfortunately, I cannot find it now) that he did the impossible with the Ministry of Defense - he cleaned the department from the generals
    А также от опытнейших, молодых (относительно) офицеров уровня командир батальона - командир полка, прошедших войну (а кто и не одну) и все "ступеньки" от взводного, в не самые безоблачные годы для Армии, но не сломавшихся и не сбежавших в "народное" хозяйство (на чиркизон например) как многие...
    Вот вам всего один примерчик - офицер, командовавший парадным расчётом артиллерии на параде Победы 9 мая 2009 года - полковник Константин Строкатов - на тот момент командир артиллерийского полка (а в 1999 мой командир дивизиона)уже 15 мая (того же года)!!! "расформирован" вместе с дивизией и полком.
    Ежели кому кажется - что лес рубят - щепки летят, то в случае с Армией, где для подготовки высококлассного специалиста требуются колоссальные финансы и продолжительное (не менее 10-ка лет) время - за такие "щепки" нужно нести ответственность, иначе это, на мой взгляд, предательство Родины!
    Yes, he really did the impossible - in the head of a NORMAL person - who lives in Russia and raises his children for life in Russia - it doesn’t fit in his head, what can this be impudently done?
    1. NordUral
      NordUral 2 November 2015 10: 00 New
      +6
      That's it. In the case of Serdyukov, we must first talk about high treason, and theft is already a trifle.
      1. Uncle Joe
        Uncle Joe 2 November 2015 16: 03 New
        +4
        Quote: NordUral
        In the case of Serdyukov, we must first talk about high treason, and theft is already a trifle.
        A trifle ... Kemsk parish ...

        Theft committed by a state person is always treason.
  • zakamsk1971
    zakamsk1971 2 November 2015 06: 30 New
    +6
    Order clean water! No - no, I do not defend S. He, of course, is a son of a bitch, but he is our son of a bitch. Hypocrisy in every line!
  • V.ic
    V.ic 2 November 2015 06: 38 New
    13
    The author would better remember how they tried to find Сэра Дюкова 08.08.08? А то ведь напрочь исчез "министер"... когда "жареным запахло"...You can’t wash a black male to white! Is it necessary to launder? I believe that it is not necessary. Article minus.
  • dog1965
    dog1965 2 November 2015 06: 41 New
    +5
    Почему-то как только садят(или, что чаще- отстраняют) в среде руководства кого-то за взятки, так считают (власти имею в виду), что борются с коррупцией. А ничего так, что новые руководители просто сами желают посидеть на денежных потоках? Опыт имею. Видел, как отстраняли старых руководителей, которые тоже правду будем говорить "не были чисты на руку", но как-то "не лояльны", в отличии от вновь назначенных. Зато они были профессионалы в своем деле и что они к тому "намывали себе финансы" можно было догадываться. Зато новые тут же сажали своих людей, которые как профи - полный ноль, зато сразу пытались прибрать в свой карман денюжку. Причем порой так топорно, что эти усилия прямо выпячивались невооруженным глазом. И видимо ничего не боялись, поскольку считали, что есть надёжная "крыша". Считаю, что точно также абсолютно, судя по общедоступной информации действовал и НЕуважаемый Сердюков. И нечего его тут обелять, люди не дураки, на мякине не проведёшь. И если после полтора десятка безденежных лет остались в армии люди (имею в виду тех, кто не на "денежных" должностях был), то это те, кто по духу и есть настоящие ВОИНЫ. И из таких при соответствующем отношении и финансировании можно быстро сделать ПРОФЕССИОНАЛЬНУЮ Армию.
  • SAM 5
    SAM 5 2 November 2015 06: 49 New
    +6
    he cleaned the department from the generals, who were used to the fact that soldiers were free labor for building summer cottages. etc.

    Well, he would have done nothing. But all this fades after the essentially betrayal of the motherland.
  • sa-ag
    sa-ag 2 November 2015 06: 59 New
    +3
    The base has adjusted, and obviously not for the past, but for the future
  • tomcat117
    tomcat117 2 November 2015 07: 00 New
    +6
    "Гарем сердюкова" у нас и "гарем реформатора саакашвили" в Одессе, ну прямо братья близнецы по этому делу.
  • astronom1973n
    astronom1973n 2 November 2015 07: 13 New
    +2
    No one argues that it was necessary to reform and reorganize the existing system of the RF Armed Forces, but this could not be entrusted to Serdyukov in all its manifestations. Reforms should be preceded by a thorough study of all aspects of the military structure, and in the future, a clear and thoughtful implementation. Yes, who would not be in the place of Mr. s. I wouldn’t be popular, I hope everyone understands this. But when the reform in most cases came down to the principle of being built, put aside, this is already too much! The positive thing is that finally the monetary allowance has been increased, sets of weapons have gone to the troops, a new field uniform (just not office winked ),военнослужащие начали получать жилье конечно это здорово!Однако...все военное образование в основе своей сосредоточено в европейской части,основная масса полководцев высокого уровня до сих пор не понимает реалий современного боя и продолжает "управлять " из стратегической ямы в статике!Видеоконференции по жк тв -это не показатель,это показатель низкой устойчивости и помехозащищенности системы связи!Поймите правильно ,не ищу крамолы!Прошу просто проанализировать существующую обстановку. Взгляните здравым взглядом на существующие реалии,не надо себя стучать в грудь ,еще не выиграно сражение!
    The generals who were with Mr. s. at the sources and before his reforms, they applauded him first, and then applauded Shoigu. I am sure that they will clap to another later, and they will keep their opinions (even if they are balanced). That's something like that ..
  • jetfors_84
    jetfors_84 2 November 2015 07: 14 New
    +8
    Уже не первая статейка, о "незаслуженно" забытом благодетеле и реформаторе армии. Пока робко, но думаю потом настойчивее будут пиарить табуреткина.
  • Oleko
    Oleko 2 November 2015 07: 20 New
    -11
    Сердюков начал борьбу "раковой" опухолью армии. Неуставными отношениями среди солдат и сержантов. Откровенными издевательствами над младшими по призыву. Может не всё получилось, но вскрывались факты. Относительно "вежливых людей", то именно Сердюков на базе Курсов "Выстрел" создал Центр по подготовке Сил Специальных Операций ""Сенеж". Разведка НАТО и ЦРУ о нём прекрасно знают, так что воентайны не выдаю. Относительно Сердюкова есть ещё статья на ВО "Об "обороне Сердюкова" и не только о ней" 15 мая 2015. на ВО.
    The answer of the military prosecutor’s office of the city where I live is kept at my place, which speaks of the activities carried out by her to identify hazing. Answer from February 2012. About Vasilyeva. What are you all about her stolen. Everything has been returned. This is a court recognized.
    1. SAM 5
      SAM 5 2 November 2015 07: 39 New
      +1
      The answer of the military prosecutor's office of the city is stored at my place

      А на стене, поди, висит портрет этого "товарища".
      1. Oleko
        Oleko 2 November 2015 08: 48 New
        -4
        Кро
        Quote: SAM 5
        А на стене, поди, висит портрет этого "товарища

        Кроме смеха ничего не вызвало. А вот рассказ майора, с которым работал. Ремонтировал он электроустановку. Рубильник отключен. Саша поставил у рубильника бойца. "А почему не повесил плакат запрещающий "Не включать. Работают люди"?" "Какие в армии плакаты...". Подошли дембеля и молодого забрали. А установку включили. Сашу спасли сапоги.
        I have a memory of service in the GSVG (a group of Soviet troops in Germany). What would the demobilization take the warrior ordered by the major? We didn’t know that.
        1. Colonel
          Colonel 2 November 2015 12: 40 New
          +2
          Quote: Oleko
          And here is the story of a major,

          Думаю ни этот "майор" ни вы никогда не сдавали в армии зачет на допуск к электроустановкам.
          Quote: Oleko
          "Какие в армии плакаты..."

          I do not believe!
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  • avia12005
    avia12005 2 November 2015 07: 21 New
    +6
    The author did not serve exactly at that time in the army. Otherwise, I would have known that officers from a lieutenant to a colonel general did not have censorship to evaluate Serdyukov.
  • Rom14
    Rom14 2 November 2015 07: 37 New
    0
    The guy forgot to write - they took bribes for fighting bandits and officers, hazing was breathtaking (it’s better to go to prison but not to the army), and what kind of a brake was there in re-equipping in all directions, it’s better not to remember, Serdyukov is not bad, he’s just a follower of Yeltsin and humpbacked and regularly performed the command - finished off the Army. And the fact that Shoigu and his team put things in order in a short time - what kind of owner, such and such a house.
  • rubin6286
    rubin6286 2 November 2015 07: 39 New
    +4
    The fact that Serdyukov got the post is encouraging: not everything is stolen.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Finches
      Finches 2 November 2015 09: 09 New
      +5
      laughing Song of Serdyukov!

    3. NordUral
      NordUral 2 November 2015 10: 05 New
      +1
      As I understand it, your glass is always half full, the correct attitude.
  • 31rus
    31rus 2 November 2015 07: 45 New
    +9
    Так ,так,а давайте Сердюкову орден дадим,а что Медведеву уже дали.Уважаемый автор,если что то и было "хорошего",все "зачеркнуто",взятками,воровством,развалом,что вы называете реформами.Все не могу дальше писать,бесит
  • Morf
    Morf 2 November 2015 07: 45 New
    -9
    army structure is tough - received an order to follow, do not like go for a walk;
    но результат вижу и слышу, а ностальгирующим воинам - идите поплачте над "черными годами сердюковщины" и не смотрите новостей
  • Andrei from Chelyabinsk
    Andrei from Chelyabinsk 2 November 2015 07: 45 New
    +9
    Ерунда, от слова "полная", ну а автору - огромный жирный минус
    Автор "забыл" упомянуть один нюанс. Финансирование. Дегьи в армию пошли именно во время прихода "на царство" табуреткина.
    That is why the army revived. Despite everything that Serdyukov had done, the army did manage to achieve something, as a result of which it was possible to improve both supply and training. And this happened thanks to the very generals whom the author reproaches.
  • ALEA IACTA EST
    ALEA IACTA EST 2 November 2015 07: 51 New
    +2
    Serdyukov - the destroyer who buried the old army.
    Однако, было бы лучше "разобрать стену, а не взорвать"...
  • AlNikolaich
    AlNikolaich 2 November 2015 07: 51 New
    +8
    Guys, the article writes a lot about Serdyukovism, but there is only one grain!
    The author calls us Kremlin bots and the fifth column! Think it over! This is a promise!
    1. NordUral
      NordUral 2 November 2015 10: 07 New
      +3
      No, to make it easier to write - you -. But everything is so, if the country has endured this and wiped it off.
  • Roust
    Roust 2 November 2015 07: 53 New
    +3
    As soon as Serdyukov was appointed to this position, our plane crashed in Egypt ... A strange coincidence. Whatever this official takes, he is not doing well. The eternal memory of the dead, and this must be driven into oblivion.
  • Colonel
    Colonel 2 November 2015 07: 56 New
    +7
    "" Polite people "and VKS pilots in the Syrian sky, we are obliged, including Serdyukov"

    You can write with the same success that we owe it to the Führer and NATO to use the magnificent Russian weapons.
  • SAM 5
    SAM 5 2 November 2015 08: 02 New
    +5
    Yes, what to argue about, if one thing is how he became a minister says a lot.
  • TT62
    TT62 2 November 2015 08: 04 New
    +1
    В Советское время было такое выражение "перемещение материальных ценностей в пределах одного государства, воровством не является". Самое большое воровство, откаты, взяточничество как раз и происходит когда сокращают и реформируют.
  • gena555
    gena555 2 November 2015 08: 12 New
    +9
    The site begins to degrade. So it turned into unreasonable, I think about Strelkov’s weakened persecution, then I began to praise Serdyukov before appointing him to a new responsible position. The circus and only. How can praise Serdyukov, who ditched the army?. Is there any success in Syria, but this is not thanks, but contrary to the actions of Serdyukov at the post of Moscow Region. And Russia will have to restore the army for a long time after its so-called reforms.
    1. NordUral
      NordUral 2 November 2015 10: 09 New
      +2
      There is such a thing, it comes to mind to me. Too much pathos and a lot of flattering lies became in the articles.
  • max15243
    max15243 2 November 2015 08: 14 New
    +1
    Год назад брательник служил, по его рассказам за десять лет (с тех пор как я служил) изменилось только то что раньше говорили "найди" а сейчас "роди". А так тот же самый идиотизм. В увал сходить заряжают на что-нибудь (четыре утюга или швабры и т п). Так что для рядового состава призванного на срочку мало что изменилось в плане условий прохождения службы (на учебке у брательника были и кабинки для душа и стиральные машинки, только пользоваться ими не разрешалось).
  • anfreezer
    anfreezer 2 November 2015 08: 18 New
    +5
    Если что-то и делалось в армии, то это вопреки, а не благодаря стараниям Сердюкова...при таком то финансировании..надо было бы быть совсем идиотом, что бы за несколько лет совсем, повторюсь именно СОВСЕМ развалить ВС и прибрать себе ВСЕ деньги... так мозги у персонажа были, да и кто позволил бы так совсем наглеть...поэтому где-то что-то двигалось, создавая видимость "бурного" процесса обновления армии. Но только это "движение" не надо вписывать в заслугу Сердюкову, в этом "движении" был залог его выживания, как вида "HOMO SERDUKOVUS", это были инстинктивные сокращения..
  • Stalnov I.P.
    Stalnov I.P. 2 November 2015 08: 18 New
    10
    Смотрите как они сразу стали хвалить табуретку, армия развивалась в противовес действиям этого мебельщика и его "бабской команды", а вот шурик написавший эту статью как то забыл сколько рядовых солдат и офицеров погибли на полигонах и арсеналах при взрывах боеприпасов которые должны были быть ликвидированы промышленным образом, но по "желанию" министра уничтожались простыми рядовыми, при чём не подготовленными, объясни своё отношение родителям, жёнам и детям этих погибших. Сколько денег он с экономил на этой "ликвидации. Посмотрел бы я на твои писульки если бы погиб кто нибудь из твоих родственников. Любое действие этого человека, хотя он не человек это "обезьяна с гранатой"
    it’s directed only for one thing - to grab more money and once again I say you look at his RYLO and look at him on his forehead is written BOP. That's the shurik.
  • Mihalich17
    Mihalich17 2 November 2015 08: 19 New
    -6
    Не буду долго "рассусоливать" и напишу прямо.
    Уверен, что свою "роль" Сердюков сыграл блестяще!
    Сама "комбинация" с ним во главе МО РФ, была разыграна мастерски!
    Special Respect to Sergey Ivanov!
    Интересно, наградили его(Скердюкова) в "закрытом" режиме? Я бы наградил! :))
  • Oleko
    Oleko 2 November 2015 08: 21 New
    -9
    В статье, о которой я писал, говорится, что было задумана операция прикрытия. Он должен был сыграть роль туповатого "пиджака" и показать, что в армии полный развал. Это удалось. Я тоже ненавидел Сердюкова. Но вот какой казус. Все твердят, что власть "отмазала" Сердюкова от двух расследовний. Но Сердюков подчинялся Путину. Значит, в течение многих лет Путин, бывший разведчик, держал придурка, а потом прикрыл его? Путин снял Иванова, на которого ни у кого ничего, и отправил его на ОПК. Иванов, тихо и незаметно, начал перевооружать производсто. Достаточно посмотреть несколько репортажей с поизводств ОПК. Новейшее.
    At the end. Tolika at Zhenya's opera was caught. Well, this is top class. Who would let them go there? Serdyukov is a top-secret official, a former member of the Security Council of the Russian Federation. Protected by the FSO. And here is TFR. Brain composter. And then Jack was completely exhausted. Either the exhibition scribbled, or a sobbing poem, or even like Buba Kastorsky to Colonel Kudasov, transmitted in the clip a cipher program with a very high degree of decryption resistance. So far, glare has not been deciphered. All. I go against everyone. There is safety in numbers? Right There is no one to fight with. Waiting for cons. And the facts, not rudeness. I know how to be rude.
    1. Gardamir
      Gardamir 2 November 2015 08: 59 New
      +9
      Who would let them go there?
      Guess whose son-in-law. This show was arranged only so that Tolya would not bury himself and return to his wife. And the people they do not care, as in your opinion.
  • exalex2
    exalex2 2 November 2015 08: 24 New
    +4
    Бред сивой кобылы..Значит можно воровать и дальше. Ведь как известно, что чем больше своруешь, тем меньше "дадут". Странно, но вот такой парадокс.
    "Как стало известно "Ъ", зять экс-министра обороны Анатолия Сердюкова Валерий Пузиков, обвиняемый военным следствием в особо крупных растратах (ч. 4 ст. 160 УК РФ), начал знакомиться с материалами проведенного расследования. По версии следствия, коммерсант Пузиков заключил с Минобороны сомнительный контракт, а затем похитил деньги военного ведомства в то время, когда им руководил его влиятельный родственник. Однако сам господин Сердюков в уголовном деле упоминается лишь вскользь.
    Read more: http://www.kommersant.ru/doc/2825813
  • LEVIAFAN
    LEVIAFAN 2 November 2015 08: 24 New
    +7
    he dispersed the generals and brought an honest basil, closed military schools. ah well done. the author of the article needs to advocate for this order to this great man.
  • Defense
    Defense 2 November 2015 08: 27 New
    +1
    Here is another point of view ....

  • Was mammoth
    Was mammoth 2 November 2015 08: 29 New
    +8
    The trend, however!
    The performance by an official or official of his direct duties is already called a feat. And, it's not a matter of a specific Serdyukov. My opinion about this state official has not changed.

    PS Now the Swiss have waved another patriot, but in a different sphere. I liked the irony in today's publication:
    "1:35, 02 ноября 2015
    The scandal that occurred last week in Russia is of an international scale, although it concerns not even an acting state official, but the former - Elena Skrynnik, who recently held the post of Minister of Agriculture.
    Приостановлено членство Елены Борисовны в партии "Единая Россия". Сразу после того, как она отказалась от 60 миллионов франков в швейцарском банке.
    The Secretary-General of United Russia, Sergei Neverov, virtually expelled her from the party with the wording: for actions that discredit the party, as well as for losing contact with a political organization.
    Logically, it turns out that if Elena Skrynnik has no accounts, then this is either discrediting United Russia, or a separation from the party. Or Sergei Neverov is fully convinced of the validity of the allegations by Switzerland, but simply does not reveal to us everything that he knows.
    "Мадам Лизинг" — так называли ее полушепотом коллеги и подчиненные."
    Source: http://ren.tv/novosti/2015-11-02/za-kvalificirovannoe-otmyvanie-skrynnik-grozit-
    tyuremnaya-pyatiletka © REN.TV
  • Gardamir
    Gardamir 2 November 2015 08: 55 New
    10
    "Страна погрязла в коррупции и Горбачёв ценой своей отставки почистил страну". Автор (*****), почему автор не пишет о закрытых госпиталях, военных училищах, когда все военные аэродромы свели к четырём на всю страну. Скоро придумают про сахалинского губернатора. Я стараюсь не давать резких оценок, но это уже издевательство высшей категории! Автор изначально всех считает скотом, который поверит в любую пропаганду.
    1. Mwg
      Mwg 2 November 2015 11: 59 New
      -4
      Because the principles of warfare have changed. This has been perfectly proven by missile launches from the Caspian to Syria. But. What we see now is calculated 5-7 years ago. Calculation always gives a direction in which direction it is necessary to develop. Armadas of aircraft and tanks are a thing of the past. High-precision weapons are now entering the scene.
  • SAM 5
    SAM 5 2 November 2015 09: 02 New
    12
    The defense power of the country is being strengthened.