Military Review

Syrian tanks need a protective complex "blind"

105
Terrorist formations in Syria continue to receive from the states advocating the overthrow of Assad, the American anti-tank systems TOW-2A and missiles to them. Thanks to this, the opposition does not save ammunition, arranging a real hunt not only for the combat armored vehicles of the Syrian army, but also for engineering equipment. Lev Romanov writes about this in his article for Messenger of Mordovia.


Syrian tanks need a protective complex "blind"


"Available to the Syrians in parts tanks T-72 dynamic defense of the first generation Contact-1, developed more than 30 years ago, is not able to effectively counter guided missiles with tandem warheads, which are used in the TOW-2A complex. In addition, the very basic booking of export models of the T-72, as well as the later delivered T-72AV models, has long ceased to meet modern requirements, ”the author notes.

TOW-2A and T-72B3 tank-mounted 2 generation “Contact-5” installed on T-XNUMX tanks cannot withstand.

Meanwhile, in Russia, a universal modular protection complex “Relict” was created, successfully tested on T-72B2 and BMPT “Terminator”. However, today it can only be seen on experienced machines. The former leadership of the Defense Ministry refused to purchase complexes.

“According to military experts, at present, perhaps, the only and most effective method of protecting Syrian tanks can be equipping them with Blind-1 optical-electronic countermeasures. This would allow effectively enough to resist the ATGM using a semi-automatic guidance system, ”writes Romanov.

He notes that "due to the setting of infrared noise in the control circuit of the ATGM, the complex significantly reduces the possibility of missiles entering the tanks."

Of course, the Blind-1 is ineffective against the generation of 3 guided missiles, “but the United States is unlikely to venture to deliver extremely expensive and still secret Javelins to the Syrian militants,” the author notes. According to him, Americans should remember history with the Stingers, which at one time were handed over by the Afghan mujahideen to the worst at that time US enemy - Iran.

At the beginning of the year, information appeared that the Syrian army had already received the Blind complexes, but unfortunately this turned out to be untrue, and tank units continue to suffer losses without effective protection.
Photos used:
allrussian.info
105 comments
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  1. Same lech
    Same lech 22 October 2015 12: 39 New
    12
    Syrian tanks in need of dynamic protection "Curtain"


    Not only .... their wear and tear is very high ... this is clearly visible on the video as tanks of more than one year of production and more than once been in battle, continuous patches, various grates, sandbags of which only Syrian tankers do not hang them.
    1. MIKHAN
      MIKHAN 22 October 2015 12: 44 New
      +5
      Israel immediately activated ... So a good defense is developed! hi
      1. JACTUS RECTUS
        JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 14: 02 New
        +1
        Although the "Curtain", even the "Curtain", even the "Tulle" T-72 tank of any modification is a coffin, a coffin with an automatic loader. At one time, it was certainly not a bad tank, I emphasize a good one, but not good, compared to Western models. The disgrace that is being pushed into our army (T-72B3), in the event of a conflict with NATO, will be the same as the T-34 1940 L11 for the "first tiger" in VO, an easy target, which will lead to catastrophic losses for us, as was the case with the T34. The technological superiority of the same “tiger” and “panther” was leveled by our army due to the ingenuity and mass character of T34 and life tank, now would be the same ???
        The same T-72B3 showed its flaw in Ukraine, faced with anti-tank weapons of the 70s and 80s and obsolete the theme of the T-72 and T-64 (you can find confirmation in the internet completely, especially the patriots screaming that " ichtamnet ").
        Particularly annoying are the "praises" of this "modern tank" (greetings from Serdyukov).
    2. Maxom75
      Maxom75 22 October 2015 13: 42 New
      +8
      You want to live, not only you hang up the bags, but fasten the tables. It would be better if our furniture minister was sent to the front line in this tank, he would either be burned in it or justify .. for the rest of his life I would understand how to save on a thief’s army. (((
      1. JACTUS RECTUS
        JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 14: 06 New
        +2
        Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye.
    3. SOLGA
      SOLGA 22 October 2015 18: 36 New
      0
      TOW-2A ??? They even have our vampires, they do not care for curtains, you say they also took them from the amers?
  2. Professor
    Professor 22 October 2015 12: 40 New
    35
    “According to military experts, at present, perhaps, the only and most effective method of protecting Syrian tanks can be the equipment of their complexes of optoelectronic countermeasures" Shtora-1 ".

    No, he can not. TOU induced by cable. There is no laser radiation.

    When an adversary uses missiles or shells with a semi-active laser homing head operating on a laser beam reflected from a target, the complex detects the presence of laser radiation and determines the direction of its source. The crew is given sound and light alarms for the purpose of indicating. Automatically a smoke grenade is fired towards the source of radiation. The resulting smoke-aerosol cloud closes the tank from the enemy, weakens and partially reflects the laser radiation, disrupting the missile homing robot.

    Syrian tanks in need of dynamic protection "Curtain"


    Everything is mixed up, people, horses. The curtain is already dynamic protection. laughing
    1. Lt. Air Force stock
      Lt. Air Force stock 22 October 2015 12: 47 New
      +1
      Quote: Professor
      No, he can not. TOU induced by cable. There is no laser radiation.

      TOW does not hit the target with a direct hit, but detonates at the end above the target. What is a TOW detonator? Explicitly not a pin.
      1. Professor
        Professor 22 October 2015 12: 48 New
        11
        Quote: Lt. Air Force stock
        TOW does not hit the target with a direct hit, but detonates at the end above the target. What is a TOW detonator? Explicitly not a pin.

        It depends on which TOU. Those in Syria with a contact

        ATGM BGM-71 TOW
      2. just exp
        just exp 22 October 2015 13: 24 New
        +2
        it’s just breaking through with a direct hit, and the last model, which is not very widespread, TOW 2B aero, beats up the tower.
    2. Sukhoi
      Sukhoi 22 October 2015 12: 47 New
      0
      What are the options then? KAZ, modern, more advanced DZ, lattices, screens, composite mounted armor?
      1. Professor
        Professor 22 October 2015 12: 51 New
        +1
        Quote: Sukhoi
        What are the options then? KAZ, modern, more advanced DZ, lattices, screens, composite mounted armor?

        From ATGM TOW 2B only KAZ will help which neither Syrians nor ...
        1. Sukhoi
          Sukhoi 22 October 2015 12: 56 New
          +2
          From ATGM TOW 2B only KAZ will help which neither Syrians nor ...

          TOW 2B is understandable, but slippers do not yet have it. Not yet....
          With TOW 2A how to be? Does the operator control the rocket through the wire, but must it keep the target in the crosshair all the time, or track the flight of the rocket along the defendant in the tail?
          1. Professor
            Professor 22 October 2015 13: 01 New
            -16
            Quote: Sukhoi
            TOW 2B is understandable, but slippers do not yet have it. Not yet....

            As well as the "dynamic protection of the Curtain" in the Asodov junta.

            Quote: Sukhoi
            With TOW 2A how to be? Does the operator control the rocket through the wire, but must it keep the target in the crosshair all the time, or track the flight of the rocket along the defendant in the tail?

            And how does the Curtain prevent him?

            Quote: Thronekeeper
            In general, an osisk with a front speed of 170m / s is not a weapon.



            Quote: i80186
            Yes, where does the laser then? How do you think the semi-automatic guidance system works? That is, how does the launcher understand where the rocket is? By wire or what? There is a tracer at the back, and the PU reacts to the heat from it. Here the "Curtain" shines brighter than the tracer, as it were.

            How does Store know that there is a shelling? Did the radar appear there?
            1. i80186
              i80186 22 October 2015 13: 02 New
              +6
              Quote: Professor
              How does Store know that there is a shelling? Did the radar appear there?

              Why know? She shines ALWAYS. Naturally, protection works only in the direction the gun is looking. laughing
              1. Professor
                Professor 22 October 2015 13: 03 New
                -12
                Quote: i80186
                Why know? she shines ALWAYS.

                Where? To the moon? wink
                1. The comment was deleted.
                2. i80186
                  i80186 22 October 2015 13: 13 New
                  +9
                  Quote: Professor
                  Where? To the moon?

                  That is not too lazy to search even. smile
                  Along with PTS using laser homing heads and laser rangefinders, there are PTS using other guidance principles. The most common of these are anti-tank guided weapon systems, including a guided projectile (missile) with a tracer and an aiming device with a coordinator. The principle of operation of the specified guided weapons is as follows. The operator, observing in the sighting device, provides constant guidance of the sighting line (sighting mark) on the target. The coordinator automatically determines the deviation of the tracer, and hence the projectile from the aiming line, and sends correction commands to the projectile, for example, by wire or radio, ensuring the projectile travels strictly along the aiming line before it hits the target. For recognition by the project coordinator against the background of interference present on the battlefield, the projectile tracer emits a frequency-modulated light signal in the visible and near infrared range.

                  From the side of the tank without distracting the crew from its main combat work, an effective obstruction can be created in a wide sector that protects the object from ATGMs with infrared coordinators (such as Toy, Milan, Hot, Dragon, etc.). ), which are common types of anti-tank weapons.
                  A searchlight installation is capable of providing both illumination of the battlefield and radiation with a modulation frequency and spectral range close to those characteristic for tracer shells (missiles) of anti-tank guided weapons with optical determinants of the position of a guided projectile (missile) along the tracer.
                  An increased level of interference is created due to the displacement of the emitter of the lighting installation from the center of the silhouette of the tower and the use of a red light filter and a removable optical diffuser to form the output radiation flux.
                  (C)
            2. Sukhoi
              Sukhoi 22 October 2015 13: 14 New
              +1
              And how does the Curtain prevent him?

              So I'm trying to figure out what will help in this case. It turns out only KAZ and means of passive protection.
              1. IAlex
                IAlex 22 October 2015 13: 15 New
                +2
                In this case, only what they don’t help will help them ...

                T.ch. they will somehow deal with this organizational ...
            3. Lt. Air Force stock
              Lt. Air Force stock 22 October 2015 13: 47 New
              +2
              Quote: Professor
              And how does the Curtain prevent him?

              Alternatively, you can weld the grill around the tank along with dynamic protection should help. The grill dissipates the first cumulative charge (which was supposed to undermine the dynamic defense for the main charge), and the dynamic defense undermines the main combat charge.
              1. Professor
                Professor 22 October 2015 13: 57 New
                -5
                Quote: Lt. Air Force stock
                Alternatively, you can weld the grill around the tank along with dynamic protection should help. The grill dissipates the first cumulative charge (which was supposed to undermine the dynamic defense for the main charge), and the dynamic defense undermines the main combat charge.

                But what about TOU2B? There are impact cores.
                1. Lt. Air Force stock
                  Lt. Air Force stock 22 October 2015 14: 04 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Professor
                  But what about TOU2B? There are impact cores.

                  TOW-2B not yet in Syria, it seems?
                  "Laser and magnetic detonator sensors work together to determine the altitude profile and the presence of a large mass of metal armored vehicles and causing detonation of warhead charges when a rocket passes exactly over the target." - From Wikipedia.
                  This is where EW funds are already needed.
                  But what prevents welding the grid from above? Lattice + dynamic protection + armor should help.
                  1. Professor
                    Professor 22 October 2015 14: 09 New
                    -7
                    Quote: Lt. Air Force stock
                    TOW-2B not yet in Syria, it seems?

                    Already on the way from the military. In the meantime, the old TOU quite cope.

                    Quote: Lt. Air Force stock
                    But what prevents welding the grid from above?


                    Common sense. The lattice of the impact core is not an obstacle.
                    Quote: i80186
                    But how to bring it then?

                    And what prevents to direct? IR illuminator shining under your breath? And how does the Curtain cover the sides and stern?
                    1. i80186
                      i80186 22 October 2015 14: 13 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Professor
                      And what prevents to direct? IR illuminator shining under your breath? And how does the Curtain cover the sides and stern?

                      When irradiated with a laser, the second part of the curtain is automatically triggered. Which automatically shoots the smoke charge in the right direction, and also warns the crew. wink
                      1. Professor
                        Professor 22 October 2015 14: 15 New
                        -5
                        Quote: i80186
                        Laser irradiation

                        Is there a laser in TOU? Learn the materiel. ATGM BGM-71 TOW
                      2. i80186
                        i80186 22 October 2015 14: 19 New
                        +2

                        TOU-2B has one. smile
                      3. Professor
                        Professor 22 October 2015 14: 26 New
                        -5
                        Quote: i80186
                        TOU-2B has one.

                        Laser profilometer. Learn the materiel.
                      4. i80186
                        i80186 22 October 2015 14: 32 New
                        +5
                        Quote: Professor
                        Laser profilometer. Learn the materiel.

                        But is it not a source of laser radiation? smile
                        So the Americans invented and made the Javelins in vain. Again cut and rollback, oh horror. laughing
                      5. Professor
                        Professor 22 October 2015 14: 35 New
                        -5
                        Quote: i80186
                        But is it not a source of laser radiation?

                        This is my last comment to you. Total loss of time. sad
                        A laser profilometer emits downward rather than forward. When he flies over the tank, it will be too late drink Borj apply curtain. A wooden mac is more suitable.
                      6. i80186
                        i80186 22 October 2015 14: 43 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Professor
                        The Azeri profilometer radiates downward rather than forward. When he flies over the tank, it will be too late for Borzh to use Blind. A wooden mac is more suitable.

                        laughing A rocket exploding when flying over a small mound / ravine / brick wall. Bravissimo. laughing This is my really last comment.
        2. i80186
          i80186 22 October 2015 14: 10 New
          +2
          Quote: Lt. Air Force stock
          Laser and magnetic detonator sensors work together to determine the altitude profile and the presence of a large mass of metal armored vehicles and causing detonation of warheads when flying missiles exactly above the target.

          Well, this is if the target is motionless and, at least, visible to the gunner. And if she is in a thick club of smoke and moves, I think the shot will be into the void.
      2. i80186
        i80186 22 October 2015 14: 05 New
        +1
        Quote: Professor
        But what about TOU2B? There are impact cores.

        But how to bring it then? She suddenly protects the "curtain" from laser-guided missiles. Just shot, forgot. Only "Javelin" in general, only expensive hardcore. laughing
  3. Patton5
    Patton5 22 October 2015 14: 18 New
    +1
    How does Store know that there is a shelling? Did the radar appear there?
    Like a tow laser rangefinder wink
    1. Professor
      Professor 22 October 2015 14: 24 New
      0
      Quote: Patton5
      Like a tow laser rangefinder

      Yah? Do not tell me? Maybe Baby also has a laser dalmer? wink
  4. Zoilent
    Zoilent 22 October 2015 23: 44 New
    0
    In the afternoon, at full height, on the front line ... Yes, the maximum speed is 4 km., But it is mounted on the nose for about 10 minutes. This is not a demonstration of achievements, but a demonstration of puncture forces of the Special Forces.
  • IAlex
    IAlex 22 October 2015 13: 20 New
    +2
    I understand that you are from Israel, but don’t have to make an anonymity, in the Russian Federation there is a modern “Afghanistan” which is put on the Armata tracked platform as standard equipment and this is quite enough, the only problem is that these tanks will not be given to the Syrians, but in T -72 they will not fit ...
  • Thronekeeper
    Thronekeeper 22 October 2015 12: 51 New
    +6
    Well, yes ... The TOU does not have LDC, the range to the target is defined as Alla or Yahu put on the soul. In general, an osisk with a front speed of 170m / s is not a weapon. In June 82, I recorded 3 TOU kosherniks with one T-62 crew. In Chukhland, T-62 and T-72, some had 2 calculations "Competitions", which are superior to this antiqua from the word in everything. Although, the shameful cable guidance is outdated another pose-the day before yesterday. However, the Sodomitsky Ram and the Hussites forgot to explain this, as a result of which, a couple of Abrasheks well smoked the sky.
  • i80186
    i80186 22 October 2015 12: 53 New
    +9
    Quote: Professor
    No, he can not. TOU induced by cable. There is no laser radiation.

    Yes, where does the laser then? How do you think the semi-automatic guidance system works? That is, how does the launcher understand where the rocket is? By wire or what? There is a tracer at the back, and PU reacts to heat from it. Here the "Curtain" shines brighter than the tracer, as it were. So it goes. laughing
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. The comment was deleted.
  • Pimply
    Pimply 22 October 2015 17: 29 New
    -5
    Quote: Professor
    Everything is mixed up, people, horses. The curtain is already dynamic protection.

    "Herald of Mordovia", prof. A friend recently moved there. Howls mortal howl. The province itself is in its classic form.
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 22 October 2015 12: 40 New
    +5
    The Syrian Army is practically exhausted, after 4 years of confrontation ... We stayed at the expense of fighting spirit, well, Russia helped a little! Now everything has to change!
  • Thronekeeper
    Thronekeeper 22 October 2015 12: 42 New
    15
    What is * dynamic protection? A “curtain” is a CEP, with grenades creating an aerosol curtain, but there is an emphasis on confusing the LDC and / or illuminators, + detecting the bearing on the irradiating target, after which it catches “Arkan” or “reflex”.
    Zhurnolamer immortally ...
    1. Albert1988
      Albert1988 22 October 2015 13: 20 New
      +7
      Quote: Thronekeeper
      Zhurnolamerstvo is immortal ...

      What can I say, my dad was the chief designer of the optical component of the "curtain" system, and relatively recently (about 5 years ago) he was at the next exhibition along with a delegation from the factory, and it so happened that their modest company of four engineers another journalist rolled up, like a military-patriotic publication, began to ask questions, fellow engineers took turns lazily answering (questions were very boring from their point of view, but simply could not answer "not boring" for obvious reasons), but in which some moment Talk journalist asked something like: "But in your company do the same" curtain "that the shells On approaching knocks" ...
      My father corrected the journalist - they say that what you described is KAZ - "thrush" or "arena", and the "curtain" is a little different. But here the most “funny” thing began - the journalist did not let his father finish and began to prove to him that the “curtain” was precisely dropping the shells and anti-aircraft missiles ... At the same time, his father’s colleagues who listened to this conversation had difficulty holding back the rzhach ...
      I don’t remember how exactly they got away from this dear citizen of a journalist (I’ll have to ask Bati again), but then they joked for a week about the curtains being unexpectedly met by the very “chief designer”)))
      So the pearl in this article is not the very top of journalistic "skill".
      1. IAlex
        IAlex 22 October 2015 13: 27 New
        +2
        Was the journalist not the case with VO?
        1. Albert1988
          Albert1988 22 October 2015 13: 34 New
          +2
          Quote: IAlex
          Was the journalist not the case with VO?

          He didn’t remember where he was from already - there were a lot of them hanging around, of varying degrees of importunity, although some very literate people came across, but this fruit just killed everyone)))))
  • Afinogen
    Afinogen 22 October 2015 12: 42 New
    +9
    Syrian tanks in need of dynamic protection "Curtain"


    Is the "Curtain" dynamic protection? The "curtain" is a complex of optoelectronic suppression, but not as non-dynamic protection.
  • 35lisment35
    35lisment35 22 October 2015 12: 43 New
    +9
    Syrian tanks need skillful management and command
  • Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 22 October 2015 12: 45 New
    +4
    Pturs "TOU" - a serious weapon, and with poor organization of the battle, when the anti-tank launchers are not suppressed by all types of artillery on the battlefield, and tanks are used in urban areas, they lead to unjustified losses of armored vehicles. We need artillery that quickly responds to the demands of the battlefield, we need spotters with laser rangefinders, drones that monitor the battlefield. Snipers are needed, with large-caliber rifles. And the initiative is on the offensive. And not slow squeezing the enemy.
  • YGV-97219
    YGV-97219 22 October 2015 12: 46 New
    +5
    Assad, I think it was not in vain that they invited to Moscow, tea is not for pancakes!
  • Auralski
    Auralski 22 October 2015 12: 49 New
    +2
    Quote: Thronekeeper
    Zhurnolamerstvo is immortal ...

    That's for sure! Even useful information will be provided in such a way that it becomes disgusting.
    1. MIKHAN
      MIKHAN 22 October 2015 12: 57 New
      +3
      Quote: AUralski
      Quote: Thronekeeper
      Zhurnolamerstvo is immortal ...

      That's for sure! Even useful information will be provided in such a way that it becomes disgusting.

      Normally filed info ... hi Do you need Full TTX and their weaknesses, etc.? Here, many comrades with notebooks are sitting and waiting! bully
  • Maksus
    Maksus 22 October 2015 12: 57 New
    +2
    So here, dynamic protection is no longer needed, but active.
  • IAlex
    IAlex 22 October 2015 13: 01 New
    +1
    Overcooked cock pecked in the ass? It’s good even late for others than very late for us ...
  • The comment was deleted.
  • spech
    spech 22 October 2015 13: 03 New
    0
    sensible article but
    Syrian tanks in need of dynamic protection "Curtain"

    Damn change the title stop
  • Mama_Cholli
    Mama_Cholli 22 October 2015 13: 13 New
    -1
    Tanks in the city generally need to be used with great care. Without the cover of infantry, they are potential coffins in the city. This is a breakthrough weapon in open areas of the BD.
    History seems to teach no one.
    In addition, tank guns are ineffective against multi-story buildings, it is easier for infantry to adjust fire to buildings for howitzers with a caliber of more than 200 mm. IMHO
  • Bashibuzuk
    Bashibuzuk 22 October 2015 13: 26 New
    0
    The best defense for tanks would be Tos Solntsepek.
    Or as some may call - Cheburashka, say. Shapoklyak ...
    Here it will not matter anymore, by cable, dog or laser, a PT TOU rocket is induced or there, Javelin.
    Classic action: no man - no problem.
    No operator - no START.
    .
    What say gentlemen experienced in anti-tank battles?
    1. Mama_Cholli
      Mama_Cholli 22 October 2015 14: 43 New
      0
      Try to use the soncepe around the city and immediately in all civilized countries they will say that they kill innocent children, women, old people.
      I think that Assad does not need such an “advertisement”.

      I repeat I have to storm every house and here we can’t do without infantry and artillery.
      1. Bashibuzuk
        Bashibuzuk 22 October 2015 15: 08 New
        +1
        Yolas, indeed, I forgot that a tank is a car for urban combat.
        In the meadow fields they have nothing to do.
        That, basically, Terminators with Ikarus dwell.
        And, starting from 1994, December 31, tanks only roam the streets.
        Or biathlon.
        Sadness.
        ....
        Yeah, the joke didn't work out.
  • Engineer
    Engineer 22 October 2015 13: 36 New
    +3
    Quote: Professor
    No, he can not. TOU induced by cable. There is no laser radiation.


    You should at least read about the Curtain on Wikipedia, and only then would you show your knowledge, which is not there. The Shtora complex includes the OTShU-1-7 searchlight installation, and such ATGMs as Tou (up to the TOW-2B version, where the laser range finder appeared), Milan, Hot use infrared coordinators that determine the position of the rocket along the tracer in the infrared range. Here they are then illuminated by an ir-spotlight.
    1. Professor
      Professor 22 October 2015 13: 51 New
      -8
      Quote: Engineer
      You should at least read about the Curtain on Wikipedia, and only then would you show your knowledge, which is not there.

      I am not a reader, I am a writer. wink

      Quote: Engineer
      The Shtora complex includes the OTShU-1-7 searchlight installation, and such ATGMs as Tou (up to the TOW-2B version, where the laser range finder appeared), Milan, Hot use infrared coordinators that determine the position of the rocket along the tracer in the infrared range. Here they are then illuminated by an ir-spotlight.

      I repeat the question again. How does Store know that the shot was fired? And the second question again, where does the Shtor shine?
      And on the road. Will the curtain help here?

      1. Patton5
        Patton5 22 October 2015 14: 45 New
        +1
        Of course it will help! 70% -80% is not a little Pts, agree! You certainly are not a reader wink but here is a wonderful article on the principle of the "curtains" http://btvt.narod.ru/4/shtora1/shtora1.htm
      2. JACTUS RECTUS
        JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 14: 47 New
        +1
        This video is a confirmation of the brutal reality of “Nashitanki is the best in the world” burning and bursting like balls. I very much doubt that the same Armata and T-90 will withstand the hit of TOU 2 or Javelin, but there’s nothing to say about T-72 burn from RPG-7, although the "abrams" withstand multiple hits of RPGs without any problems, at least in the tower at least on board.
        Hurray patriots, push the minuses, RENTV to help))))).
        1. Pacifist
          Pacifist 22 October 2015 14: 59 New
          +4
          Real practice. T-72: 19 RPG hits, left on its own. What do you compare? If you peck on it (Abrams) from ... not even their cornet, but from the bassoon, it will burst in the same way. So don’t carry the crap, wise guy.
          1. JACTUS RECTUS
            JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 15: 02 New
            +1
            And not only against RPG-7, how much
            Although the ATGM tore it ...
          2. JACTUS RECTUS
            JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 15: 14 New
            +1
            Chukhnu))), wise guy))). If a person’s opinion differs from yours, this does not mean that it (opinion) is “chukhnia” (although I don’t know what it is), your comment smacks of snobbery.
          3. JACTUS RECTUS
            JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 18: 22 New
            +1
            These terrible shots are T-72 and RPG-7

            One was enough ...
            As always, the driver ...
        2. anti-Semite
          anti-Semite 22 October 2015 17: 01 New
          +4
          RPG SOMETIMES holds but a bassoon and a vampire break through both abrams and merkava in the forehead, which then can be said about a cornet which is much more powerful, there are no unkillable tanks
          1. JACTUS RECTUS
            JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 13 New
            +1
            I do not argue, it does not happen, it is a fact and I did not say that.
      3. An60
        An60 22 October 2015 15: 59 New
        +3
        The writer is more correct.
      4. Vadim237
        Vadim237 22 October 2015 23: 08 New
        0
        The tank is equipped with sensors that respond to laser irradiation of the tank and the system shoots aerosol grenades, and against missiles attacking the roof you need an electronic warfare complex similar to Mercury.
  • Pacifist
    Pacifist 22 October 2015 14: 37 New
    +4
    In general, it would be nice to put them and the Arena at least, since Afghanistan is very secret. The guys are fighting for a reason, but for us too. I don’t see much trouble if they are helped by these complexes, at least in the most difficult areas.
  • glavnykarapuz
    glavnykarapuz 22 October 2015 15: 00 New
    +4
    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
    This video is a confirmation of the brutal reality of “Nashitanki is the best in the world” burning and bursting like balls. I very much doubt that the same Armata and T-90 will withstand the hit of TOU 2 or Javelin, but there’s nothing to say about T-72 burn from RPG-7, although the "abrams" withstand multiple hits of RPGs without any problems, at least in the tower at least on board.
    Hurray patriots, push the minuses, RENTV to help))))).

    At the expense of “Abrams withstand RPGs without any problems”, it’s you yourself, in the process, you watched TV (only programs from “democratic” countries). On the same YouTube there are many videos where the same abrams cannot stand RPG-7 without problems.
    Anyway, it’s very difficult for almost all modern tanks to keep RPG-7 on board (because there are tandem ammunition and tactics on RPG-7, as with simple shots from RPG-7 to demolish any side protection).
    And here you are, so to speak, "throwing a blow at the fan" - the propaganda messages have gone west, have you not the URA "zapadenets" yourself? wink
    1. JACTUS RECTUS
      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 15: 08 New
      +1
      No, it’s not cheers and I’m not a Westerner, you can see my views in my profile, they are infinitely far from Western. I try to look at the world soberly.
      The funny thing is when ukrov troll for their naivety and obstinacy, and they themselves also hail base propaganda with a bang.
      1. glavnykarapuz
        glavnykarapuz 22 October 2015 15: 26 New
        +4
        Well, your expression “Abrams withstand RPGs without any problems” doesn’t look very sober at a world view.
        Well, your expression "themselves hawb base propaganda with a bang" sounds like that (to put it mildly) insulting. You do not bring all those who disagree with you under these "themselves hawala" under "one comb"?
        And in your opinion, it turns out that EVERYONE who does not agree with your point of view (or the “trolls” of the Ukrainian Nazis) sit and watch “RENT” and “fool around” with a happy look?
        And all this is written by a person who "tries to look at the world soberly."
        I want to tell you my purely personal opinion that you are very bad at "trying to look at the world soberly."
        1. JACTUS RECTUS
          JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 15: 37 New
          +1
          Firstly, you and everyone who did not agree did not let me down.
          Secondly, without "problems" I agree to exaggerate, but objectively, "Abrams" is more technologically advanced and better, and therefore more effective than any modification of the T-72.
          And the last, I try, does not mean that I am objective, it is not possible a priori.
          1. anti-Semite
            anti-Semite 22 October 2015 17: 07 New
            +3
            What is its manufacturability? stupidly increased the armor and that this mammoth could ride shoved a powerful GTD and all the manufacturability, what’s a breakthrough in it? the modern version of the tiger with a black man charging, from the point of view of modern technology, the same Japanese type 10 or leclerc for decades to come
            1. JACTUS RECTUS
              JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 14 New
              +1
              There is no desire to talk about the Abrams, but I didn’t mean only him, I basically speak of the superiority of NATO tanks over our old T-72.
              1. anti-Semite
                anti-Semite 22 October 2015 17: 26 New
                +3
                Romania, too, in NATO, tell me about the superiority of their version of T 55 or the superiority of m 60 of the same abrams every year less and less because the only US tank plant has long been demolished with bulldozers, leclerc is just like the T72 equipped with an automatic loader, so everything is debatable well, the idea itself contrast the tank from the 70s to modern cars request
                1. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 46 New
                  +1
                  Oh Lord !!!! Yes, you do not find fault. Well, NATO surpasses us militarily and their technology is more technologically advanced, this is an axiom. Accept, in the near future we are catching up.
                  1. anti-Semite
                    anti-Semite 22 October 2015 19: 03 New
                    +1
                    Napoleon’s army exceeded us by 3 times, the Wehrmacht was the strongest military machine, and so what? did you get a lot of NATO? list me their "glorious" victories, if the states had the opportunity to destroy us they would do it without hesitation
                    1. JACTUS RECTUS
                      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 50 New
                      +1
                      I don’t need a story, believe me, I know it no worse than yours. I agree that we won upwards when the ratio is not in our favor.
                      But now there is another system of state structure, we are playing according to the rules that were not invented by us and they were invented against us, now it will be much harder to win if at all possible, and patriotism will not help us with this.
                      1. anti-Semite
                        anti-Semite 22 October 2015 20: 49 New
                        0
                        but you have to sprinkle ash on your head and scream that everything is gone? even the cheers of patriotism are useful, it creates the necessary background in society and the Internet making the lives of liberals zapadentsev unbearable plus helps to persuade those who have not decided on the bright side for the person is following the crowd and if you choose between the crowd of liberals and the crowd of patriots I will choose the second, first I’ll seen enough in 90s
  • glavnykarapuz
    glavnykarapuz 22 October 2015 15: 12 New
    +3
    This lover of the "West" distracted me.
    Author, this is so illiterate - DYNAMIC protection "Curtain"! So I want to "attach" the old Internet ma'am DYNAMIC protection "Curtain"CARL ?!
    I would like to ask the author of this opus - did you skip a lot of school (vocational schools, institute) (those)? Sorry for the harshness of course.
    I would like to ask the moderators a question. How do such illiterate articles go home then? So do not last long and lose the level. This is purely my personal opinion.
    1. JACTUS RECTUS
      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 15: 19 New
      +1
      How wrong you are about the "lover of the west."
      And you probably objectivity ????
      I don’t like cheers and clumsy propaganda, it doesn’t mean that I’m western phil.
      Usually arrogance gives way to shame, but only in the plane of the defense, these are human lives.
      1. glavnykarapuz
        glavnykarapuz 22 October 2015 15: 34 New
        +3
        So write your opinion that you don’t like “Hurray cries”, but you don’t need to “label” ALL of those who disagree with you (I already described above in detail).
        I express only MY PERSONAL opinion and I understand perfectly well that it can be both OBJECTIVE and NON-REVERSE ("... the truth is only one. So said the pharaoh ..." quote from the song "Nutilus Pompilius").
      2. The comment was deleted.
        1. JACTUS RECTUS
          JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 15: 54 New
          +1
          The problem is that VO (meaning comments), unfortunately I turned into something like the censor "Censor", any opinion that does not coincide with a bang of patriotism and skepticism about the official point of view, they began to perceive with hostility, although before that there was not, compare with the comments from there (let’s tear everyone, death to fascism, we are the most) - these are the most popular statements and there are more and more of them, just swap us and them and it will become obvious.
          Obviously, propaganda influences people in such a way, and it’s sad that propaganda is degrading like in Ukraine, and people believe it more and more, this does not mean that I am against state propaganda. I was incredibly glad when last year the state’s voice sounded .prapogandy after so many years of broadcasting anti-state propaganda, it just needs to be of high quality and improve over time, and not turn into info-feces that offend the intellectual abilities of the people.
          1. anti-Semite
            anti-Semite 22 October 2015 17: 11 New
            +3
            So justify reasonably why armata is a bad tank? t 90 it is tuned t72 it is already well known and already in the USSR they worked on the subject 640 and t95, the flaws of the old layout were discussed 100 times and you didn’t open anything new, but criticism of the armata needs justification
            1. JACTUS RECTUS
              JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 49 New
              +1
              I did not criticize Armata and the T-90 and did not say that these are bad tanks. Read more carefully, I doubt their invulnerability against the latest generation ATGMs.
              1. IAlex
                IAlex 22 October 2015 18: 32 New
                +1
                Afghanit took into account the threats from Javelin, Spike and anti-tank missiles from helicopters, striking at high speeds at the top of the tower ... The question of how it all works, of course, remains open, but I think the Javelin and Spike samples are not a problem right now, because they there are in Ukraine and the Middle East frostbitten mercenaries who will sell them for sane babkits ... The only question is whether they will work on errors in the modern Russian Federation, in those research institutes where I worked, they persecuted a solid marriage and vparivali through their for "presents "...
              2. anti-Semite
                anti-Semite 22 October 2015 19: 04 New
                0
                call me a tank invulnerable to petur?
                1. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 25 New
                  +2
                  Read carefully.
                  No URA patriotism.
                  No tanks are not vulnerable to ATGMs.
                  The T-90 is an excellent tank. The T-14 is a new milestone in tank building and, according to the designers, exceeds all Western modern tanks by 30%, I would like it to be. But THERE ARE NOT in the army, the number of T-90 is minimal. The troops supply T -72B3 and in my opinion this tank is disgusting even Khokhlyat fakes based on 64ok and 80dok are superior to it.
                  That's all!!!!
                  1. anti-Semite
                    anti-Semite 22 October 2015 20: 42 New
                    0
                    that's about ukro tanks are not necessary! t 64 and the Union was not successful because they created t 72 and t 80, t 64 was a radically new machine in all of that and absorbed all the errors and problems it is a great laboratory on tracks but as a battle tank it’s a complete ram, they are exported could not sell a single piece
                  2. anti-Semite
                    anti-Semite 22 October 2015 20: 44 New
                    0
                    t 90 did not go far from t72, this measure was necessary because fatally there was not enough money, but back in the USSR it was planned to leave the t64,72,80 layout
              3. Vadim237
                Vadim237 22 October 2015 23: 22 New
                0
                The armature of tandem ATGM can stand in the sides, but the main thing is that the missiles striking in the roof do not fall into the armored capsule with the crew - the tank is a fig with it, but you can’t say the same about the crew.
  • raid14
    raid14 22 October 2015 15: 48 New
    +1
    What is the "Curtain" dynamic protection? This is a complex of optoelectronic countermeasures, like the Ukrainian Warta, the German MUSS, and the French KVSM. Soviet-Russian dynamic defense "Contact-1," Contact-5, "Relic", Israeli "Blazer". The author should not be confused. with a finger.
  • Hammer
    Hammer 22 October 2015 16: 12 New
    +4
    I recall that forum where a Jew spoke about the top-secret development of Israel for knocking off the course of cornet. When he was told that the cornet was receiving the laser in the ass and that it could not be drowned, he replied that Israel was somehow able to. When he was asked to bring a pruflink or to tell the principle of action, he referred to the fact that, he said, how did he know the development was secret, but this is possible and this is important! Since then I have been looking sarcastically at Jewish posts. Little is known of the curtain, but I recall the Greek tender, where the T-80U completely disgraced her, and since then I have been mistrusting her.

    Oh yes, about the loading machine. When the 62 mm gun was put on the T-115, the reload speed dropped to 4 v / m. Then they set the automatic loading and the speed increased to 10 V / m. When set to 125 mm, the speed dropped to 8 in / m. Do you think that the Soviet command was stupid by putting an automatic loader on Russian tanks? If so, then your head should not be all right. And if you say that “it was necessary to set up a barn like Abrams’s,” then go in the well-known direction. Abrams is the 3rd generation, T-72 - 2. If the USSR continued to work, we would have long ago seen the 3rd generation of domestic tanks (the T-80 was unsuccessful), something like a 640 object, with an adored reserved niche.

    And the one who says that our tanks are coffins, remind me where is the M60, the closest rival for 72 in those years? And the T-90 perfectly competes with world analogues. What potential had to be built into the machine so that after 42 years its modernization was not much worse than the next generation of modern foreign tanks? So succumb to JACTUS RECTUS saliva. The best tanks are tanks that provide victory. Let's see where will be your favorite sheds in 10 years, when the arms race is again gaining momentum.

    In fairness, I must say that they still did not think much about the crews of the turret gunners - the safety of the crew was realized simply - through the non-penetration of the armor. But now it is out of date, and the T-72 with the T-90 turned into turret launchers. However, do not forget that no modification can fully ensure the superiority of the previous generation over the next. It can only be compared using different methods and systems. I wonder how in the future abrams equals armature? (in no way) The debate about the pros and cons of Soviet and Western schools of tank building has been going on since ancient times, so I’ll omit this.

    need dynamic protection of the "curtain"


    Why is such a ***** about pouring?
    1. IAlex
      IAlex 22 October 2015 16: 42 New
      +1
      And what exactly did you expect from OUUP and VUUP (Patriotic / Enemy Stubborn Hurray Patriot) as a means of defeating an adequate consciousness ???

      All non-OUUP / VUUP are well aware that due to the collapse and not financing, the Russian troops remained in the past late 80s, in the 2000s they began to modernize, which at least retains their military potential, and only in recent years with the development and adoption of Armata, T-50, Caliber we will be equal and ahead of our opponents for some time, because most of the old technology has almost exhausted the potential of modernization in 25 years, and the only option to maintain combat effectiveness in the near future is simply to replace the current equipment with the previous about generation to a new ...

      All these arenas, curtains, minors, crap are useless trash which is too late to fasten to the old equipment and is actually pointless, because the new one is designed and created with the new systems provided and installed.
    2. JACTUS RECTUS
      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 11 New
      +1
      I don’t have any admiration for Western technology and the like, and I don’t drool, it’s just the T-72 in modern realities SHIT !!! And ALL !!!!!
      And by far the best tanks, these are tanks of victory, only the T 72 will not give this victory, and the sea will cause the deaths of our tankers.
      1. anti-Semite
        anti-Semite 22 October 2015 17: 29 New
        +3
        so on this and did fittings! for his age t 72 was a successful machine and his main opponent was m 60
        1. JACTUS RECTUS
          JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 52 New
          +1
          I am aware that for its age, the T-72 was not a bad tank. It’s just that they are still delivering crumbling to our troops and the Moscow Region is advertising and positioning this as a modern tank.
          1. Albert1988
            Albert1988 22 October 2015 19: 19 New
            0
            Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
            .Just deliver this crumbling to our troops so far

            Deliver? I heard right? Deliver? Do you even think that you are writing - no one has been supplying the T-72 to our army for a long time - there are already thousands of them. They upgrade part yes, to the level of T-72B3, but the fact that they chose such a budget modernization already indicates that the military does not see any particular prospects for investing in this machine and clearly rely on the T-14. Moreover, in the frames you quoted, which T-72 famously burn? That's right - export, but what about export versions? That's right - many characteristics are much lower than the version for "internal use", including booking. So draw conclusions.
            And finally - much depends on the arrow’s curvature - if his hands grow lower than his back, they won’t even beat the old T-55 as a vampire with a bassoon, and if there is a lot of experience, then the old RPG-7 will be able to paint that leo, that any Western prodigy to dig out))))
            1. JACTUS RECTUS
              JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 34 New
              +1
              Ukraine. See our tanks, not export.
              1. Albert1988
                Albert1988 22 October 2015 19: 44 New
                0
                Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
                See our tanks, not export.

                Well, let’s assume that the tank is really ours, only that’s interesting - and who said that it was hit, but, let’s say, not abandoned? It didn’t burn out, the tower wasn’t torn off, even the harp was whole ... At least from the angle from which it was removed absolutely no critical damage. Moreover, the Ukrainian in Vidio says that they wanted to seize this tank, but it would not start, then the question is - if it was hit, how did they want to take it for themselves? Obviously, the car was abandoned, most likely due to engine failure. The second allegedly padded tank is not shown in the video.
                And then, what did I say that our tanks cannot be knocked out? It’s possible, any tank can be knocked out, only you need to be able to, in the same Syria, the curved-handed bearded men managed to plant 10-15 hits from the same RPG-7 into the old export T-72 and it’s all useless, but someone can do it right away light it with the same RPG-7, and abrams by the way.
                So the survivability of tanks is largely determined by the competent tactics of their use.
                And so everyone perfectly understands that the T-72 is out of date, and many have worried that the T-90 is not being updated, although it is clear that they are already outdated in many ways, for which, do you think, did the T-14? Or do you think that our engineers think so “alternatively” that they did not provide for modern PT systems when designing it?
                1. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 20: 03 New
                  +1
                  This one is definitely hit.
                2. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 20: 04 New
                  +1
                  How about this one?
                  1. Albert1988
                    Albert1988 22 October 2015 20: 26 New
                    0
                    Here again, it is not visible what it is pierced by or where - if the cornet or bassoon flies in, it’s also on board, then it’s clear that these things and abrams are burned by my mother.)
                3. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 20: 09 New
                  +1
                  Yes, you finally hear me. It seems that the minuses of urapatriots are covering your eyes and you are not reading what I am writing.
                  I write, like you, that the T-72 is out of date !!! This is undeniable !!! But it prevails in the army !!! I do not like the sweeping allegations of the urapatriots.
                  I do not criticize the T-90 !!!
                  I understand why they developed "Armata".
                  The main thing is to catch time ...
                  1. Albert1988
                    Albert1988 22 October 2015 20: 24 New
                    0
                    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
                    Yes, you finally hear me. It seems that the minuses of urapatriots are covering your eyes and you are not reading what I am writing.

                    You can write in different ways, you can write: "unfortunately, the experience of fighting in Syria shows that the T-72 is extremely vulnerable in modern conditions, especially if the battle is in the city".
                    And you can write like you:
                    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
                    This video is a confirmation of the brutal reality of "our women in the best world" burning and bursting like balls

                    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
                    just a T-72 in modern realities SHIT !!! And ALL !!!!!

                    Agree - the meaning is the same, but it will be perceived very differently and then, about
                    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
                    I do not criticize the T-90 !!!
                    I understand why they developed "Armata".

                    but what about then:
                    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS
                    I very much doubt that the same Armata and T-90 will withstand the hit of TOU 2, or Javelin

                    So you actually say that our designers are so dumb that they created a new expensive tank without taking into account modern anti-tank weapons? Keep in mind that both Abrams and T-72 were calculated on PT means of incredible prescription, and T-14 (armata is still just a platform and not a tank) - is already being done with the expectation of modern toys.
                    As for being in time - let's be in time - the tanks are not critical now, and we need relatively few of them, now we need to be in time with the BMP and the MPA - now they need new and modern ones.
                  2. anti-Semite
                    anti-Semite 22 October 2015 20: 37 New
                    +1
                    so I don’t argue that the T72 is an old car and BMP2 and BTR 80 then what? I can list the NATO equipment from 70X, 80X at this particular moment there is nothing to replace the tank fleet, although a significant part will be converted to TOS, BMPT, BMO-T, the same abrams and ravings are also ancient mammoths
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. JACTUS RECTUS
              JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 41 New
              +1

              T-72B3 those which are not there.
              1. Albert1988
                Albert1988 22 October 2015 20: 15 New
                0
                Have you noticed one very interesting fact? What are all these same T-72B3s that are hit - the tower is torn out, but they are not burnt? At the same time, the adjacent T-64 and BMP-2 are all burnt as one? I am very interested in this. And then the question arises - how were they hit?
                And here is an example of one of the most famous photographs of the time of the operation in Afghanistan - the second operation in Iraq:
              2. Albert1988
                Albert1988 22 October 2015 20: 15 New
                0
                or here is an example too:
              3. Albert1988
                Albert1988 22 October 2015 20: 16 New
                +1
                So everything burns, that ours, that abrash - just need to be applied correctly in the first place and losses will decrease right away
              4. IAlex
                IAlex 22 October 2015 20: 24 New
                +1
                And how did you determine that it was the T-72 TB3, and not the T-72B ???
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 22 October 2015 20: 31 New
                  0
                  Quote: IAlex
                  And how did you determine that it was the T-72 TB3, and not the T-72B ???

                  Everything is determined by the DZ modules on the tower for protecting the front of the borotovyh screens and the hinged protection of the VLD, although the B3 still has a bunch of new devices, and there is nothing stopping it from hanging the same protection on the old T-72B, without changing the devices.
        2. JACTUS RECTUS
          JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 44 New
          +1
          M 60 is older than T-72 by more than 10 years and now M 60 is withdrawn from the armament of the SGA.
          1. anti-Semite
            anti-Semite 22 October 2015 20: 31 New
            0
            for military equipment in peacetime 10 years is not a term
      2. IAlex
        IAlex 22 October 2015 17: 52 New
        +4
        Comrade, you don’t worry most importantly, because at that rate you’ll not be far from a nervous breakdown, you will later be in a joke with "JACTUS RECTUS" mice, and you will not be able to explain to everyone in case of war that the T-72 is a complete G ... , and it is better to use the improvised tools of Mason and Phil (From Madagascar) in the fight against the enemy Abrams, Leclerc and Leopards wassat
        1. JACTUS RECTUS
          JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 17: 54 New
          +1
          Yes, they came simply, from all sides. Already become a zapadents smile
          1. IAlex
            IAlex 22 October 2015 17: 57 New
            +3
            Therefore, it flew ... You know how flies are straight ... yes You type joke a little more and make fun of the public OUUP ...
            1. JACTUS RECTUS
              JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 18: 06 New
              +1
              No pluralism winked .

              Okay: OUR ARMY IS ALL STRONG, ARMATA IS THE BEST TANK IN THE WORLD, WE ARE NOT UNBEATABLE, NATO IS FUCK AND FACILITIES AND THE MOST IMPORTANT T-72 AND MORE THAN T-72B3 EXCELLENT TANKS !!!!! Hurray !!! Hurray !!! T-72 !!!
              1. IAlex
                IAlex 22 October 2015 18: 10 New
                +2
                In general, probably because of the crisis in the country, problems with cucumbers, because by indirect signs they ended ... lol
                1. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 18: 20 New
                  +1
                  I don’t know, I have a full refrigerator, in soldering they give out, in three liter cans and tin, the most delicious cucumbers I tried smile
                  1. IAlex
                    IAlex 22 October 2015 18: 29 New
                    +1
                    Well, many see problems with their presence, because without a snack they write comments ...
                    1. JACTUS RECTUS
                      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 18: 51 New
                      +1
                      And that's sad. Alcohol is worse than any NATO ...
                      1. IAlex
                        IAlex 22 October 2015 19: 25 New
                        0
                        And the French and the Germans like it;))) He himself asked relatives ...
              2. anti-Semite
                anti-Semite 22 October 2015 19: 00 New
                +2
                We’ve been trying to insinuate our country for centuries and we’re still alive, so it’s quite possible that we are really invincible, the T72 is an old machine and the T90 closes the problem only for a while we wait for armature, and as for NATO and the states, neither in Korea nor in Vietnam, Iraq Libya Afghanistan Somalia they achieved nothing
                1. JACTUS RECTUS
                  JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 11 New
                  +1
                  You are mistaken. The stereotypical and very widespread opinion that the United States did not achieve anything in Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Somalia, they achieved what is happening there, that was their goal.
                  With Vietnam, it did not work then, but now they have crushed them under a trade partnership.
                  1. anti-Semite
                    anti-Semite 22 October 2015 19: 26 New
                    +2
                    on paper they have a partnership with China, do not exaggerate the omnipotence of the states, they are not the Reich and the Roman Empire, and even they ended their days without glory
                    1. JACTUS RECTUS
                      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 19: 58 New
                      +1
                      I do not exaggerate. Do not underestimate the enemy. There are no fools, believe me, their project is not one hundred there, and while they are achieving their goal no matter what. Obama and other clowns do not bother you, they are just talking heads, not different special intelligence.
                      China is not part of the US Trans-Pacific Partnership. The conditions there are enslaving, one might say vassal. But China, like most countries in the world, is in the bondage of the United States, you should not forget this either.
                    2. JACTUS RECTUS
                      JACTUS RECTUS 22 October 2015 20: 12 New
                      +1
                      Of course not Reich. Reich was their project. Conceptual management.
                      1. anti-Semite
                        anti-Semite 22 October 2015 20: 30 New
                        +1
                        but here I do not agree! the Reich was a German project that was created thanks to the wild persecution and humiliation suffered by the German people after the defeat in the WWI, the society itself was looking for a “Hitler” and it found it another matter that the Anglo-Saxons managed to direct this structure against us, in terms of intrigue we lose to them pure
                      2. JACTUS RECTUS
                        JACTUS RECTUS 23 October 2015 04: 37 New
                        +1
                        I wrote about this, conceptual management.
  • glavnykarapuz
    glavnykarapuz 22 October 2015 20: 55 New
    +1
    Quote: JACTUS RECTUS

    T-72B3 those which are not there.


    Something I didn’t see T-72B3 there. Yes, and the video you, "trying to look at the world soberly," from some kind of ukropogandonist site posted.
    Yes, and there were already discussions on this issue at VO - that Belarus was modernizing (or with the help of Belarusians, but themselves) parts of the T72. And it seems to be for our brothers in reason in Africa. So there (in the conflict zone in the Donbass) there could well be t-72s ("squeezed" into the ATU "ukrami") which look very similar to t-72B3s.
    It seems like the modification of B3 from just B differs mainly only in sight from Belarusians (here, of course, I could be mistaken) and some trifle.
    1. JACTUS RECTUS
      JACTUS RECTUS 23 October 2015 04: 42 New
      +1
      I don’t see the difference where to get the video, the main thing is the facts. From the point of view of ukrov, this site is also strictly propagandistic and what do we care?
      I don’t understand, you belong to that group of citizens who believe that ours were not in Ukraine at critical moments for DNRLNR ???
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. JACTUS RECTUS
      JACTUS RECTUS 23 October 2015 05: 05 New
      +1
      Among Ifo-delirium, here you can find interesting materials.

      I am not opposed to the supply of arms to New Russia.
    4. JACTUS RECTUS
      JACTUS RECTUS 23 October 2015 05: 08 New
      +1
      Here, certainly smooth out.
      1. JACTUS RECTUS
        JACTUS RECTUS 23 October 2015 05: 09 New
        +1
        It seems to me like.
        1. IAlex
          IAlex 23 October 2015 12: 41 New
          0
          Tank T-72BM 1989 delivered to all republics of the USSR


          Export Hohlanki T-72UMGExport Hohlanki T-72UMG

          And what?
          Have you seen the Ukrainian T-72UMG, well, or the ancient T-72BM ???

          Now compare the characteristics ... Oh, our God, it turns out there isn’t there ???