Military Review

Academy of Strategic Missile Forces announced the creation of a combined air-rocket engine

84
In the Serpukhov branch of the Academy of the Strategic Missile Forces, a combined power plant has been created for a promising aerospace aircraft that will be used in both military and civilian areas, reports Look with reference to RIA News.




“The combined air-rocket engine with a direct-flow pulsating combustion chamber, a pre-chamber and an air launch system was created to enable the propulsion system to operate in both the atmosphere and outer space. A promising aircraft with such an engine can deliver cargo to orbital stations with greater advantage, ”an academy representative told the agency on the Innovation Day of the Russian Defense Ministry - 2015.

“The task of creating a combined powerplant of an aircraft for transferring an engine from an air mode of operation when flying in the atmosphere to a rocket in space is solved. The engine includes a power plant operating on two circuits (modes) - air and rocket, ”explained the source.

He gave an example of the work of the aviation complex: "The plane patrols the airspace, takes off from a conventional airfield, then receives a command to work out in space, for example, intercept warheads, destroy targets, go into outer space, work there and return to the atmosphere."

The representative of the university noted that the aircraft itself does not yet exist. “The draft of this model was sent to the leading Russian organizations, and feedback and comments were received. Two plants are already being taken to make a life-size prototype. NPO Molniya is currently developing a research and development project on a hypersonic aerospace plane, but they do not have a propulsion system, we are trying to start scientific work with them together. ”

According to him, "the dimension of the engine will depend on the starting weight of the aircraft and the payload it will carry." That installation, which is presented at the exhibition - is valid, has passed fire tests, i.e. performance of the unit is proven.

“Kerosene fuel was used in the power plant in the air mode, and methane and gaseous oxygen were used for space. The task of making an engine with environmentally friendly fuel is not yet worth it, as the future aircraft is returnable, reusable and will not have problems with spent levels, like conventional space rockets, ”said the source.

Presumably, the installation cost “will be about 90 million rubles, while liquid rocket engines for a single-stage rocket cost about 120 – 140 million,” the academy representative said. And if we consider that the installation is a unit of reusable use, the difference in costs will be even more noticeable.
Photos used:
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  1. The comment was deleted.
    1. Good me
      Good me 6 October 2015 15: 20 New
      +4
      Quote: LEVIAFAN
      Sorry that is not the topic. write the word Poland and press the spacebar and write Russia and press the spacebar. what the hell is this? who is the moderator?

      Also, not the topic.

      Posted by: Poland Russia

      What is the problem then?

      And now on the topic. Typo?

      "Combined air-rocket engine with ramjet pulsating combustion chamber, camera and an air launch system was created to enable the propulsion system to operate both in the atmosphere and in outer space.
      1. figwam
        figwam 6 October 2015 15: 22 New
        +15
        Orbital fighter "Spiral"
        1. zao74
          zao74 6 October 2015 16: 04 New
          +2
          Orbital fighter "Spiral"
          He is a little younger than me ... still a Soviet invention.
        2. GRAY
          GRAY 6 October 2015 17: 38 New
          0
          Quote: figvam
          Orbital fighter "Spiral"

          There are separate engines and turbojet engines.
          1. Bayonet
            Bayonet 6 October 2015 19: 38 New
            0
            Quote: GRAY
            There are separate engines and turbojet engines.

            There was no turbojet engine there!
            1. GRAY
              GRAY 6 October 2015 19: 54 New
              0
              Quote: Bayonet
              There was no turbojet engine there!

              It may not have been on the layout, but it should be on the project.
              The propulsion system included:
              - LRE orbital maneuvering 1,5 ton-force (specific impulse 320 s, fuel consumption 4,7 kg / s) to perform a maneuver to change the orbital plane and issue a braking impulse for de-orbiting; subsequently it was planned to install a more powerful LRE with a pitch in the 5 vs void with a smooth thrust adjustment up to 1,5 ts to perform accurate orbit corrections;
              - two emergency brake rocket engines with a load in the void 16 kgf, operating from the fuel system of the main rocket engine with a pressurized system for feeding components on compressed helium;
              - LRE block orientation, consisting of coarse orientation 6 engines with an 16 kgf thrust and 10 precision orientation thrusters with a 1 kgf thrust thrust;
              - turbojet engine with a stand-off draft of 2 tf and specific fuel consumption of 1,38 kg / kg x hour for flying on a subsonic and landing, fuel - kerosene. At the base of the keel is an adjustable bucket-type air intake that opens only before the turbojet engine starts.
              As an intermediate stage, the first samples of combat maneuverable operating systems provided for the use of fluorine + ammonia fuel for LREs.

              http://www.buran.ru/htm/spiral_5.htm
      2. Col.
        Col. 6 October 2015 15: 29 New
        +1
        Quote: Good I
        And now on the topic. Typo?


        Here's a typo in the main: in nature, there are no "air-rocket" engines yet. There are jet and rocket For doubters: http://www.airwiki.org/other/article/engines.html
        The idea is a good one, but as far as I know, the matter has not yet reached the embodiment "in metal". This at least pulls the Nobel Prize ...
        1. LVMI1980
          LVMI1980 6 October 2015 16: 01 New
          +3
          Classification is always conditional. Its purpose is to structure information
        2. opus
          opus 6 October 2015 17: 44 New
          +4
          Quote: Colonel
          in nature, there are no "air-rocket" engines yet. There are jet and rocket

          and rocket is he not reactive?
          A rocket, a subclass of jet engines, in it both the energy source and the working fluid are on board

          Quote: Colonel
          air rocket engines

          1. please wedgeair missile Engine Venture Star "(X-33), (Eng. Aerospike engine, Aerospike, KVRD)

          On the left is a conventional rocket engine, on the right is a wedge-shaped rocket engine.
          2. Skylon ("Skylon") - the name of the project of the English company Reaction Engines Limited,
          Skylon will be able to fly into the air like a regular plane and, having reached a hypersonic speed of 5,5 M and a height of 26 kilometers, switch to oxygen supply from our own tanksto go into orbit.
          What is not air-rocket?


          Key part of the project is a unique propulsion system - a multi-mode jet engine (eng. hypersonic precooled hybrid air breathing rocket engine - hypersonic combined jet / rocket engine with pre-cooling).

          Quote: Colonel
          This at least pulls the Nobel Prize ...

          unlikely
        3. gridasov
          gridasov 6 October 2015 19: 40 New
          +1
          If you focus on the prize, then no one will discover anything worthwhile or invent. The engine combined with the propulsion is possible. Moreover . This engine is for all environments. But since even the omnipotent military-industrial complex did not reach the "metal", then you should not rush.
      3. engineer74
        engineer74 6 October 2015 15: 30 New
        +8
        In the original: "pre-chamber", in the sense of afterburner. hi
        1. Rus2012
          Rus2012 6 October 2015 15: 52 New
          +5
          Quote: engineer74
          In the original: "pre-chamber", in the sense of afterburner.

          This refers most likely to the "pre-chamber ignition", i.e. indirect - direct, but through a special igniter, where ideal conditions for ignition are created. And then ignite the fuel components in the main chamber.

          At one time, we consulted them on these issues. In fact, there is nothing beyond the natural in such engines. They belong to the "combined" section. But, little has come to fruition. It always turns out that a separate layout is more viable.
          There was a ramjet-solid propellant rocket engine of the first stage of the Gnome ICBM missile system - in life the usual “Poplars” and “Yars”.

          There was such a booster block on which the engine was piled up for “planning and soft landing” after acceleration. He "hung up" ... Wait, the Yankees are trying to make reusable blocks. But so far, nothing has come of it.
          "Every fruit has its destiny" ...
          1. opus
            opus 6 October 2015 17: 52 New
            +2
            Quote: Rus2012
            This refers most likely to the "pre-chamber ignition", i.e. indirect

            PuVRD pre-chamber not needed





            or as wink


            because (both ignition and mixture formation and chamber dimensions there are completely different than a typical rocket engine):




            As for the camera, the release says:
            "The engine itself is equipped with a pulsating combustion chamber, an air start system, a camera, which will record breakdowns and instantly transfer data to the control center."/ Staff of the Serpukhov branch of the Peter the Great Military Academy
            one trouble:However, there are currently no suitable aircraft for such an engine in Russia.

            What delays them .... belay
            / bullshit
            1. skazochnik
              skazochnik 7 October 2015 01: 49 New
              0
              So it's a blowtorch, just a big one.
        2. Alex_Rarog
          Alex_Rarog 6 October 2015 18: 41 New
          +4
          I am ashamed! A pre-ignition chamber is a pre-ignition chamber. At one time, pre-chamber engines were installed on gas 3202.
          Technician-zhelezyachnik) with respect)))
          1. Bayonet
            Bayonet 6 October 2015 19: 45 New
            0
            Quote: Alex_Rarog
            At one time, pre-chamber engines were installed on 3202 gas.

            That's right! hi
          2. Good me
            Good me 6 October 2015 20: 54 New
            +1
            Quote: Alex_Rarog
            At one time, pre-chamber engines were installed on 3202 gas.

            Yes, and this made it possible then, at the beginning of the 80x, to “shoot” from the engine of a Soviet passenger car breathtaking, then, 105 l / s.

            But only the device, that one, was called "Volga" GAZ 3102 ...
            Beauty car. It is still found on the roads.
            1. Alex_Rarog
              Alex_Rarog 7 October 2015 20: 20 New
              0
              That's right, he was inattentive, a typo came out.
        3. evge-malyshev
          evge-malyshev 6 October 2015 20: 04 New
          0
          Quote: engineer74
          In the original: "pre-chamber", in the sense of afterburner. hi


          Sorry, but the fore camera is a pre (variable) camera in which the initial ignition of the "starting" fuel occurs, which provides ignition of the "main" fuel.
        4. evge-malyshev
          evge-malyshev 6 October 2015 20: 04 New
          0
          Quote: engineer74
          In the original: "pre-chamber", in the sense of afterburner. hi


          Sorry, but the fore camera is a pre (variable) camera in which the initial ignition of the "starting" fuel occurs, which provides ignition of the "main" fuel.
      4. WUS 068
        WUS 068 6 October 2015 15: 42 New
        +3
        typo. Not a camera, but a pre-camera
        1. Andrea
          Andrea 6 October 2015 16: 04 New
          0
          Everything new actually turns out to be a well-forgotten old one. In the USSR there were several programs of orbital planes that were successfully buried as a result. Above, Mr. “fig” showed the “Spiral” project, there was the “Lightning” project, there was another project, and now I forgot the name. By the way about typos, elementary technical illiteracy, the article was apparently written (written off) by the humanities.
      5. Azitral
        Azitral 6 October 2015 15: 57 New
        +3
        Actually FORCamera. But IT'S TOO good to be true. The combined single engine for the VKS (SZPVRD - GZPVRD - RD) was planned to be made and brought to mind by 2021. British scientists, it seems, even seriously, announced future successes of the year in 2009, but, recently, something calmed down. Apparently, in deep secret they are preparing for the first start. The closest to the normal gas scramjet (not "combined", ten times more problematic, but simple), they came to the United States, they are going to hit us globally, but, according to reports, this thing works for a minute and a half. And even from a good prototype to a reliable serial weapon, as you know, in this area for about fifteen years. So, in my opinion, a new SDI and wiring of suckers to twitch. Ours also did something in this area, but miracles do not happen, and they are unlikely to overtake the United States. The combined problem, I repeat, is an order of magnitude more complicated.
        1. Rus2012
          Rus2012 6 October 2015 16: 07 New
          0
          Quote: Azitral
          British Scientists, it seems, even seriously, announced the future success of the year in 2009

          British HOTOL and German "Senger" - have sunk into oblivion ... oops ...
      6. Rus2012
        Rus2012 6 October 2015 16: 00 New
        +2
        Quote: Good I
        pulsating combustion camera, camera

        it should be read here - "prechamber"
      7. evge-malyshev
        evge-malyshev 6 October 2015 19: 51 New
        0
        Of course, a typo. D.b.- "camera".
        Apparently, the article has already been fixed
      8. evge-malyshev
        evge-malyshev 6 October 2015 19: 51 New
        0
        Of course, a typo. D.b.- "camera".
        Apparently, the article has already been fixed
      9. kotvov
        kotvov 6 October 2015 20: 13 New
        0
        a pulsating combustion chamber, a camera and an air-launched system designed to enable the propulsion system to work ,,
        actually in the FORCAMERA article, apparently the afterburner.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. Mercenary
      Mercenary 6 October 2015 15: 30 New
      +7
      / LEVIAFAN /, what are you doing, reading IN ??? We need this Poland (with any letter, like a 5th wheel cart).
  4. The comment was deleted.
  5. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 6 October 2015 15: 22 New
    +3
    Well, we got all the same to the pulsating engine. This is good, although the Germans came close to this topic in the 40s. How many years it will take to finalize, but how many years to the glider - I hope not 30.
    1. Good me
      Good me 6 October 2015 15: 29 New
      +4
      Quote: iliitch
      Well, we got all the same to the pulsating engine. This is good, although the Germans came close to this topic in 40.


      The Germans, "got" to such an engine, in many ways only conceptually. And not only that.

      Ideas, quite realistic, were in other areas. But these are cases when "thought is ahead of action."

      Every vegetable has its own time ...
      1. WUS 068
        WUS 068 6 October 2015 15: 47 New
        +2
        Back in school, about 45 years ago, impulse direct-flow reactive engines were placed on aircraft models. And homemade
        1. engineer74
          engineer74 6 October 2015 16: 16 New
          +1
          Quote: VUS 068
          Back in school, about 45 years ago, impulse direct-flow reactive engines were placed on aircraft models. And homemade

          There was a book "Fly Model" of the sixty-sixth year of publication, there were blueprints for the aircraft model PuVRD. Here the country was the USSR - if desired, students could build the "miracle weapon" of the Third Reich (or maybe they did? wink )! And now where is it - technical creativity ??? Although the Strategic Rocket Forces Academy has survived .. sad
      2. Bayonet
        Bayonet 6 October 2015 19: 52 New
        +1
        Quote: Good I
        The Germans, "got" to such an engine, in many ways only conceptually.

        The Fau-1 projectile was equipped with a pulsating air-jet engine (PuVRD) and carried a warhead weighing 750-1000 kg. About 25000 units produced. hi
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Rus2012
      Rus2012 6 October 2015 15: 32 New
      +3
      Quote: iliitch
      nevertheless got to the pulsating engine

      ... wait a minute, the PuVRD in the USSR was ALREADY in 1944!
      At the end of the summer of 1944, Mr. Chelomey completed the preliminary design of the projectile with his D-3 air-launched rocket engine, called 10X, and on September 19 of 1944 he was appointed chief designer and director of the 51 NKAP plant. Previously, this plant was engaged in the design and manufacture of prototypes under the direction of chief designer N. N. Polikarpov, who died on July 30 on July 1944.

      The creation of 10X delivery from the UK and Poland of incomplete V1 accelerated. However, copying the device completely was not discussed. For example, when developing drawings for the AP-4 autopilot for the 10X projectile in order to quickly master it in the mass production of OKB-1 chief designer V.M. Sorkin, the emphasis was on the use of gyroscopic units of serial Soviet devices.
      1. The comment was deleted.
  6. sinukvl
    sinukvl 6 October 2015 15: 24 New
    +3
    What a news! To Smoked from Washington, it seems our polar, let's say, fox, was going to come!
  7. Aleksandr12
    Aleksandr12 6 October 2015 15: 25 New
    +7
    The Japanese, if my memory serves me, have been working on this engine since 1988 and no matter how. Let's hope that an airplane with such a hybrid engine will take off in the near future (in 10 years). This will be a breakthrough in the aerospace industry.
    1. engineer74
      engineer74 6 October 2015 15: 38 New
      +7
      This theme, from the 50s, is being sawed by everyone who is too lazy. EMNIP, last year, the British jumped with an interesting engine (they extracted liquid oxygen directly in the engine), yelled - "give the plane, a little money and tomorrow to the moon!" - now silence ... There will be flight tests - we'll see! We wish good luck and luck to OUR developers! smile
  8. Engineer
    Engineer 6 October 2015 15: 26 New
    +1
    Sooner or later, all the achievements of the Union are taken out of distant boxes. It pleases - the Union’s experience and achievements were enormous, but where are the modern developments, is it really enough to mind only to modernize what was invented long ago?
    1. emercom1979
      emercom1979 6 October 2015 16: 06 New
      0
      Or maybe just in those days, not all technologies were enough? Although everything stretches one after another ... But it's better late than never.
    2. Berthan
      Berthan 6 October 2015 16: 12 New
      +3
      ... but where are the modern developments ...


      So it’s been said a long time ago. That everything is new, it’s either good or VERY well forgotten old)

      1. engineer74
        engineer74 6 October 2015 16: 26 New
        +3
        Um ... I saw a turbine engine turbine disk lying in the ground for about 40 years, it looked like freshly turned, and after 10000 years it will not change much, even in sea water. Did you find many glands from aircraft during excavations? wink
    3. 2s1122
      2s1122 6 October 2015 17: 02 New
      +2
      So Leonardo had cutting-edge ideas at that time, but production technology wasn’t. And so long ago, they would have flown. And somewhere in 70-80 there was an article on the photon engine in the journal Technika Molodezhi, so we have paper calculations and technologies somewhere beyond the distant horizons of science.
  9. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 6 October 2015 15: 26 New
    +2
    Well, let's see in action ... But you don’t need to shout better ..
    1. evfrat
      evfrat 7 October 2015 10: 01 New
      -1
      It finally dawned on you, but how can you do it without chants? Can you handle it?
  10. Mercenary
    Mercenary 6 October 2015 15: 27 New
    +3
    It will be MIRACLE if they create such an engine! Mattresses are not something to create, copy our RD-180 can not but here is the news.
  11. Haettenschweiler
    Haettenschweiler 6 October 2015 15: 30 New
    +1
    - Aerospace expeditionary formations are not a new idea, but I would never have thought that the Federation would raise old developments and try to bring them to life. Not all, therefore, Siluanov drank money!
  12. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 6 October 2015 15: 31 New
    +6
    The Air Force was renamed the VKS for good reason.
    1. lpd1
      lpd1 6 October 2015 16: 19 New
      +3
      Duc, there’s what it was! Previously it was necessary to rename .. now open spaces would already fly and plow ... smile
  13. 31rus
    31rus 6 October 2015 15: 32 New
    0
    That's what it means to get down to business, it's high time
  14. Starik72
    Starik72 6 October 2015 15: 35 New
    +3
    Good news ! Maybe this will help to quickly master the near space, and this will first of all help the world states to cooperate, and will help to avoid wars and local conflicts, and the WORLD will develop in harmony and stability !!!
  15. kultiapin
    kultiapin 6 October 2015 15: 36 New
    0
    That and look that it will fly into space, as if to drive off vacation to Turkey.
  16. Strong
    Strong 6 October 2015 15: 40 New
    0
    And our whole world ...
    1. Executer
      Executer 6 October 2015 15: 58 New
      +1
      Why do we need it ALL?
  17. Klibanophoros
    Klibanophoros 6 October 2015 15: 42 New
    -5
    Our country still has growth points, just as the backward Russian Empire had them, just as then, as now, they will be given life by a completely different government, more capable and proceeding from national interests.

    Just as the GOELRO plan was fantastic for tsarism, so for Erefia it’s not just a flight to Mars and space exploration, but even the construction of normal roads.
    Let's say the bridge across the Kerch Strait stands like 5 Millau Viaducts. A comparison with Chinese engineering structures in recent years will be even more shameful.
    1. NordUral
      NordUral 6 October 2015 15: 48 New
      0
      I agree, not liberalists.
    2. 2s1122
      2s1122 6 October 2015 16: 21 New
      0
      Tsarist Russia was not so backward or backward, so well-known BAM was planned for us under Nicholas 2. And by 1920 they planned to telephonize the whole country (could mess up dates). A highly skilled worker received (I do not remember exactly) about 120 rubles. And the wedding could be celebrated for rubles it’s 50-80. Lead information programs for the 90s, it was interesting to listen to. It then went with the participation of the late Listyev.
      1. Klibanophoros
        Klibanophoros 7 October 2015 20: 36 New
        0
        so well wrinkled to us BAM was planned under Nicholas 2

        Better read about how the tsarist officials built the Murmansk railway. Given Russia's dependence on arms supplies, a vital target.
        The last construction site of Tsarist Russia.
        Everything was there: theft, unsuitable quality, failure to meet deadlines, Chinese migrant workers (yeah, in Karelia), inhuman working conditions and disregard for responsible persons.
        And all this during the World War, actually.
        After the revolution, the Bolsheviks, building the second track, actually built the road anew.
  18. 2s1122
    2s1122 6 October 2015 15: 43 New
    0
    This device was supposed to be 20 years old. The main thing now would not be pulled with the implementation of the project, but as usual some kind of bureaucrat would kill the bastard. It’s a pity the Queen wasn’t, the general designer was with ambitious projects.
  19. WUS 068
    WUS 068 6 October 2015 15: 49 New
    0
    Back in school, about 45 years ago, impulse direct-flow reactive engines were placed on aircraft models. And homemade
  20. iliitchitch
    iliitchitch 6 October 2015 15: 55 New
    0
    Quote: Rus2012
    Quote: iliitch
    nevertheless got to the pulsating engine

    ... wait a minute, the PuVRD in the USSR was ALREADY in 1944!
    At the end of the summer of 1944, Mr. Chelomey completed the preliminary design of the projectile with his D-3 air-launched rocket engine, called 10X, and on September 19 of 1944 he was appointed chief designer and director of the 51 NKAP plant. Previously, this plant was engaged in the design and manufacture of prototypes under the direction of chief designer N. N. Polikarpov, who died on July 30 on July 1944.

    The creation of 10X delivery from the UK and Poland of incomplete V1 accelerated. However, copying the device completely was not discussed. For example, when developing drawings for the AP-4 autopilot for the 10X projectile in order to quickly master it in the mass production of OKB-1 chief designer V.M. Sorkin, the emphasis was on the use of gyroscopic units of serial Soviet devices.


    I am aware of this. Then, as I understand it, I did not go into the series, because there were no composites. Yes, and this will be combined. I would not be surprised if now in a separate topic the pulsating has been singled out. Reactive close to the limit, it seems. Have you heard about the new MIG? Not verified (and who will say something?) - 4.3M speed, 7000km range, 62 tons on take-off. Here it may come in handy.
  21. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 6 October 2015 16: 01 New
    0
    which will be applied both in military and in civilian spheres

    This is unlikely. It has long been known that this scheme is not economically beneficial for a citizen. And if something is not profitable, it flies in single copies and for other reasons. An example of a supersonic Concord and Tu-144. Either economical flight on atmospheric engines, or economical launch into orbit by rocket engines.
  22. emercom1979
    emercom1979 6 October 2015 16: 03 New
    0
    The main thing is that everything would work out and work. I hope this is a sign of the awakening of the people from consumerism to creation. And concepts and ideas have always been drawn from the past and fiction. So to speak, the connection of generations ...
  23. Dmitry Donskoy
    Dmitry Donskoy 6 October 2015 16: 04 New
    0
    Our designers they are. They may not be so ... tongue
  24. opus
    opus 6 October 2015 16: 08 New
    -1
    Quote: AUTHOR
    "Combined air-rocket engine with ramjet pulsating combustion chamber, camera and an air launch system was created to enable the propulsion system to operate both in the atmosphere and in outer space.

    Especially pinned S PHOTO CAMERA
    poor fellows throbbing WFD ... how did they do without a camera before?

    "camera which will fix the damage and instantly transfer data to the control center. "
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 6 October 2015 22: 19 New
      0
      No, the camera will record all thermal and aerodynamic processes that occur during the operation of the high pressure engine in all modes - during testing.
  25. AIR-ZNAK
    AIR-ZNAK 6 October 2015 16: 28 New
    +1
    We started with KALOSHI (Spiral) The project was closed due to the loss of one KALOSHI in the Black Sea during an attempted controlled splashdown and the beginning of work on the Buran About Buran There was a Clipper project Something in between the Buran and the Spiral get only at the NPO Lightning originally designed for aerospace aircraft The engine is the main thing in this But the engine is not developed by itself but for specific tactical and technical tasks, and for this there is already a glider and other stuffing A in NPO Mo Nia just all tips converge Other aviaKB and aircraft factories for such work are not sharpened and NGOs energy too.
  26. Izotovp
    Izotovp 6 October 2015 16: 33 New
    0
    As far back as 1991, a graduate defended this engine for us. According to the head of the corresponding department, he was distributed in some research institute. Then silence (((.
  27. kil 31
    kil 31 6 October 2015 16: 45 New
    +1
    The patented Boeing engine creates jet thrust in a rather unusual way, and can be used not only on airplanes, but also in rocket technology - including spacecraft in airless space [gearmix.ru ›archives / 20836 Not only do we think about combined engines. Who's to go?
    1. gridasov
      gridasov 6 October 2015 18: 44 New
      0
      Even along the external contours, it is absolutely possible to justify that such an engine is neither perfect nor promising. Without delving into the subtleties, we can say that the limiting levels of its work are very limited because they cannot provide a high flux energy density.
      1. kil 31
        kil 31 6 October 2015 20: 06 New
        0
        Quote: gridasov
        Even along the external contours, it is absolutely possible to justify that such an engine is neither perfect nor promising. Without delving into the subtleties, we can say that the limiting levels of its work are very limited because they cannot provide a high flux energy density.

        I wrote in the sense that other countries are also trying to make a plant. He is an atomic scientist, everything, as always, in one word, a samovar, like nuclear power plants and other reactors. How they are going to move in space is a mystery to me. The power of thermonuclear mini-explosions is too insignificant (I think so) maybe they have a secret in Boeing? Just type a Boeing patented aircraft engine, maybe something interesting will seem to you, for me it's just dreams that have nothing with reality. request hi
        1. Vadim237
          Vadim237 6 October 2015 22: 02 New
          0
          Back in the eighties, we developed a hypersonic combined atomic rocket engine, then work stopped, and now it has resumed.
          1. gridasov
            gridasov 6 October 2015 22: 24 New
            0
            The key task of an effective device providing a reference flow is to create such physical conditions under which, due to the speed of the hydrodynamic flow at the ends of the blades, these blades ionize so as to change their polarization. Since everyone knows that the emf and the polarization vector of the blades during their centrifugal rotation is an obvious process, the new algorithms for the interaction of the hydrodynamic flow itself and the processes in the device’s “iron” allow these centrifugal forces, which are also destructive, to transform the process into non-destructive, and therefore allowing one to achieve an order of magnitude higher rotational speeds of the rotor and blades. The consequences of this process are obvious.
  28. JonnyT
    JonnyT 6 October 2015 16: 47 New
    0
    Dadad)))) all the players of the space shuttle dream of giving their feeder ....... unfortunately, sometimes the intention is to sabotage
  29. a71
    a71 6 October 2015 16: 48 New
    +1
    Quote: Good I
    Quote: iliitch
    Well, we got all the same to the pulsating engine. This is good, although the Germans came close to this topic in 40.


    The Germans, "got" to such an engine, in many ways only conceptually. And not only that.

    Ideas, quite realistic, were in other areas. But these are cases when "thought is ahead of action."

    Every vegetable has its own time ...

    If I don’t confuse, then the Germans had valves, and ours suffer with valveless valves (sorry, I don’t remember what they are called).
    1. gridasov
      gridasov 6 October 2015 18: 50 New
      0
      The reference flow can be created without resorting to valves or other methods in the form of other solutions. Schauberger was the only logical approach. However, its principles can be brought to a higher level of perfection. It is obvious that Schauberger was one of the first to come to the understanding that the hydro-gas-dynamic flow has both kinetic energy and potential. Hence, all modern engines without the ability to create sufficient flux density and resort to the implementation of potential energy extracted from hydrocarbon and other types of fuels.
    2. evge-malyshev
      evge-malyshev 6 October 2015 20: 41 New
      +1
      Quote: a71
      If I don’t confuse, then the Germans had valves, and ours suffer with valveless valves (sorry, I don’t remember what they are called).


      And they are called "direct-flow".
  30. AlexTires
    AlexTires 6 October 2015 17: 09 New
    0
    Like a one-stage spaceship? Something is not believed.
    I can imagine a plane capable of a suborbital “jump” for several minutes (takeoff to a height greater than 100 km is the formal boundary of space). But in order to gain orbital speed ... There is no methane, but hydrogen is needed, not otherwise. And that will be difficult, to say the least.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 6 October 2015 22: 05 New
      0
      Magnesium will be added to the combustion chamber.
      1. gridasov
        gridasov 6 October 2015 22: 29 New
        0
        The process must be balanced. This means that the rate of combustion of the same magnesium or another substance must be very high. Otherwise, burnouts are provided. Therefore, there are substances with a much higher combustion temperature, but !!! Moreover, the short duration of the conversion of this substance is very, very fleeting.
  31. TVM - 75
    TVM - 75 6 October 2015 17: 15 New
    +1
    Anyway, that's good. Progress is inevitable and it’s wonderful that Russia is ahead! ”
  32. rosarioagro
    rosarioagro 6 October 2015 17: 23 New
    +1
    "" Combined air-rocket engine with ramjet pulsating combustion "

    Lord, my goodness - Fau-1 :-)
    1. kotvov
      kotvov 6 October 2015 20: 27 New
      0
      Lord, my goodness - Fau-1 :-) ,,
      Yes, you generally read the article carefully? Then solid propellant rockets, these are Chinese bamboo.
  33. gridasov
    gridasov 6 October 2015 18: 57 New
    0
    scientists dealing with the problem of power email. magnetic energy are aware that even email. current cannot be transferred on a linear segment efficiently unless all the parameters of the power electromagnetic process are used. If it is simpler, then any pulse should have, besides the linear vector, also a rotation moment. And more. And in the same way, direct-flow engines cannot be effective, since increasing the energy density of the flow in a certain local space, it is necessary to instantly transform it into another plane. This is the law !!! The ripple frequency, if it is a “natural” pulsating flow, will always have parameters depending on the dimension of the structure.
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 6 October 2015 22: 08 New
      0
      You lagged behind life now everywhere superconductors are developing and testing, some managed to reduce the resistance to zero.
      1. gridasov
        gridasov 6 October 2015 22: 35 New
        0
        The stupidity is that the electromagnetic processes are very individual for each physical event. But for all, one quality of electric current is used. Therefore, there are more effective ways to solve the issue of conductivity or ensure their non-conductivity. This is the creation of such a new quality email. current, which will meet the stated requirements for the property of the substance. And these are much easier achievable effects. If you are talking only about certain types of matter, then we are talking about the superconductivity of absolutely all known substances in their various states of interaction with continuous media.
  34. Old26
    Old26 6 October 2015 19: 28 New
    0
    Quote: figvam
    Orbital fighter "Spiral"

    This is not a Spiral orbital fighter. This is a product flight model. MIG-105-11. From him to the Spiral - as you yourself understand how to Beijing. Moreover, it is a subsonic sample. And he didn’t go any further. There was no supersonic or hypersonic option ...
  35. Kaiten
    Kaiten 6 October 2015 20: 04 New
    0
    It is not possible to use liquid oxygen on a warship, the hypatorium with it will be worse than oxidizing peroxide at the time. A promising engine for airless space can only be built on hydrazine or meth-hydrazine (heptole).
  36. The comment was deleted.
  37. Gunther
    Gunther 6 October 2015 21: 07 New
    0
    Well, if we reach the level of the 80s (in a new round), and create a reusable transport space system like the Buran, it will be wonderful.

    gridasov Quote:
    ... The engine combined with the propulsion is possible ...

    I’m even afraid to ask you, Sensei, what do you mean by “mover”.
    1. gridasov
      gridasov 6 October 2015 22: 13 New
      0
      Well you give! An engine is a mechanical device in which, through the thermodynamic process of converting the energy of the externally supplied fuel, it is converted into a rotation pulse on the shaft. A mover is a mechanical device that uses the potential energy of its moving environment. Therefore, the lack of knowledge and how it is possible to use this potential energy of the environment efficiently, a person uses engines that transmit energy to the mover. The top of the current achievement is a rocket propulsion device that creates not a pulling force along a motion vector, but a reference flow of repulsion from the potential energy of the medium. Aircraft turbines also combine engine and propulsion elements, but in them incorrectly located blades or blades experience an algorithmically increasing resistance with increasing speed. Therefore, to compensate for this resistance, the energy of combustible hydrocarbon fuel is used. Based on this, a new type of engine-propulsion engine, without the need for any additional type of fuel, allows not only to use the force vector in the Earth’s atmosphere and directed “inward” and allows the use of this energy equivalent to an increasing speed, but also allows you to use the potential energy of this substance Wednesday. It’s probably not for me to tell that air and water are substances with their own parameters and properties. Let me remind you that in space the vector of force of the potential energy of the medium is directed "outside". In addition, in such an engine, the propeller-blades allow you to create not only a reference flow, but also a pulling force directed along the axis of the flow inlet into the device. These two vectors are always balanced in their energy potential. Such an energy device is also a generator of a highly variable electromagnetic flux. Of course, there is no finished device yet. But there is a deep justification for all the processes in it and it is very convincing.
  38. Rader
    Rader 6 October 2015 21: 24 New
    0
    It is not entirely clear about 2 types of fuel: kerosene for lashes in the atmosphere and methane + oxygen for airless space. Isn't it easier to adapt the engine to work on methane and in the air?
    1. Vadim237
      Vadim237 6 October 2015 22: 16 New
      0
      In the future, it will be possible to refuel with water, and on board the aircraft there will be a mini plant for the production of oxygen and hydrogen from water.
      1. gridasov
        gridasov 6 October 2015 22: 37 New
        0
        Water does not need to be transported or produced. It is always mutually reversible and in all respects its energy properties
  39. Gunther
    Gunther 6 October 2015 21: 39 New
    0
    Oh, I know that a propulsion device is a device for converting engine energy into half a job of moving.
    I am interested in your vision of the "mover".
    But, in your opinion, the prospects of the propulsion Nezhdanovsky in the light of SB-640 "Buran", but in the transposition of the theory of ether - what are the chances?
  40. Wolka
    Wolka 7 October 2015 05: 27 New
    0
    Well, they waited, the Buran program was finally taken from the cloth and will now be implemented in an updated form ...
  41. GSH-18
    GSH-18 8 October 2015 19: 32 New
    0
    The combined air-rocket engine with a ramjet pulsating combustion chamber, a prechamber and an air-launch system is designed to enable the propulsion system to operate both in the atmosphere and in outer space

    Not bad! Good luck with this endeavor!