The Russian government abandoned the idea of ​​creating private armies.

The Russian government refused to approve the draft law on the creation of private military companies (PMCs), initiated by State Duma deputy Gennady Nosovko, RIA reports "News".

According to the newspaper, during the examination, experts from the relevant departments - the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the Ministry of Defense and the FSB - considered that the bill was not timely and contrary to Russian legislation. However, the author of the project is going to rework the document and will try to prove to the authorities the need for PMCs in the Russian Federation. According to him, in November 2015, the finalized document will be handed over to the government for another examination.

“If this time the officials issue a negative verdict, I, without waiting for the opinion of government experts, will submit the bill to the parliament in 2015 year during the autumn session. Russia needs PMCs that will protect the country's economic interests in the Arctic and the Middle East, ”Nosovko stressed.

This draft law states that PMCs will provide security, military and consulting services for the country, as well as individuals and legal entities under strict control.

According to the authors, the creation of such organizations will allow to resolve the issue of the employment of several employees of power structures, as well as military personnel who quit or fell under the reduction.

Comments

[insafufa]

We also lack private armies

[Uncle VasyaSayapin]

PMCs in Russia are needed, but not inside the country, but outside. But then it’s somehow ugly to turn out: inside we forbid, but outside we allow.

[demo]

A classic example is the Foreign Legion.
At home, they do not have the right to act, and abroad, please.
Question.
And where does Russia need to use the aircraft abroad?
Not even the sun, but the ground forces?
Because PMCs have neither aviation, nor fleet, nor strategic missile forces, etc.

[Penetrator]

Quote: demo

A classic example is the Foreign Legion.
At home, they do not have the right to act, and abroad, please.

Invalid example. The foreign legion is subordinate to the French government. Therefore, it officially protects the interests of the French state abroad. PMCs are free to conclude contracts for the provision of their services. not being guided by a political situation, only being guided by the legislation of the country. With proper use and control, it is a fairly effective policy tool.

[Sergej1972]

There is no ban on the activities of the Foreign Legion domestically. Its units are partially deployed in the main territory of France, partly in overseas departments and territories. This is an integral part of the ground forces, a lightly armed elite formation. And the tasks can be performed both on the territory of the country and abroad. And the French Republic officially sends its units to perform certain tasks and does not hide it.

[varov14]

"With proper use and control, it is a fairly effective policy tool" - suppression of popular discontent, the army may not support.

[strannik1985]

For actions within the country, including to suppress riots (officially, i.e. they are completely openly preparing for this), there are explosives, special forces, riot police, this is only part of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, and there are detachments of the Federal Security Service, anti-drug special forces, Special Forces FSIN ... against this background PMC-0.

[varov14]

The foreign legion is not yet affordable for us, and the guarantor perfectly protects our oligarchs. All these PMCs are on our head with you, this prokhindey deputy has long been a non-people and apparently sleeps and then gets cold that they can once remove from the feeder.

[Penetrator]

Quote: varov14

Foreign Legion is not affordable for us yet

Is this 8 thousand servicemen "beyond our means" to support? And with a comparable salary with the French legionnaires? Do not make me laugh. It just isn't advisable. Now, if the citizens of the CIS and far abroad decide to recruit for service in the RF Armed Forces, then yes - it may be necessary to form such a unit.

[opus]

Quote: demo

At home, they do not have the right to act, and abroad, please.

1. Légion étrangère not PMCs, but military unit, part of the ground forces of France.
2. How many times have I been to France, Paris, etc.
so many times I saw a foreign legion (Légion étrangère) guarding important state objects and guarding ... a legion point

and in parades, well, there

and at the nursery school contests

I wonder why he is there if

Quote: demo

Domestically, they do not have the right

?
and yes:

----------------------
but these are not "mercenaries", but volunteers (recruitment principle)
Additional Protocol to the Geneva Conventions of 12, August 1949, concerning the protection of victims of international armed conflicts (Protocol I). Geneva, 8 of June 1977 of the year (entered into force 8 of June 1977 of the year. Ratified by the Supreme Soviet of the USSR on 4 of August 1989)
According to international and French laws, recruitment into the Foreign Legion on the territory of another state is prohibited. Therefore, you can enroll in the Legion only at specified points (France). The French Embassy does not assist in entering the Legion.

[Mic1969]

There are enough PSCs inside the country, but outside the country they are even needed

[PSih2097]

Quote: Uncle VasyaSayapin

PMCs in Russia are needed, but not inside the country, but outside. But then it’s somehow ugly to turn out: inside we forbid, but outside we allow.

And RosAtom, Gazprom, Rosneft, etc. etc. not the same PMCs? I saw something like their equipment, the army with the cops nervously smoking on the sidelines, except that SpetsNaz is more or less like it.

[strannik1985]

И

And RosAtom, Gazprom, Rosneft, etc. etc. not the same PMCs? I saw something like their equipment, the army with the cops nervously smoking on the sidelines, except that SpetsNaz is more or less like it.

Not the same, there are many nuances in knowledge of laws, preparation, knowledge of languages, etc. Let's analyze the case of the Prirazlomnaya platform
And I do not exclude that the guards in this chop are very decent people, but decent people are not a specialty. Each security guard must have a seaworthy book, seafarer's ID, SSO courses (Ship security officer onboard a ship), and they must take special SOLAS and STCW 95 courses (survival rates on a ship: the actions of each team member in the event of a breach on the vessel, fire, flooding, safe leaving the vessel, working with lifeboats, etc.).
Without these minimum documents, the security guards of the PSC do not have the right to be on board the ship, even in the economic zone of the Russian Federation. Without these elementary skills, in the event of a man-made disaster, they will be like ballast and will be among the first candidates for death at sea. And most importantly, this private security company lacks elementary experience in the fight against piracy. I'm not talking about armed pirates. The analysis of the video recordings of the Greenpish attack on the Prirazlomnaya platform shows that the security from the PSC was dormant, stupidly looking at the Greenpeepers on the platform, someone was shooting all the events on the phone for the home archive.
I am sure that if, at that moment, specialists from the RSB-Group were fighting against pirates at Prirazlomnaya, the events would have turned out quite differently. Using UAVs and HyperSpike acoustic guns, as well as employees trained under the “combat swimmers” program, we could provide a safety zone around the platform with a radius of at least 300 meters not only on the water surface, but also under water (by law, this is no less than 500 meters).
http://rusplt.ru/society/voennie-chastniki-8795.html

[PSih2097]

[

Quote: strannik1985

Not the same, there are many nuances in knowledge of laws, preparation, knowledge of languages, etc. Let's analyze the case of the Prirazlomnaya platform

These are different cases ... A guard or a fighter, he is a guard in Africa or from a fighter ...

[strannik1985]

These are different cases ... A guard or a fighter, he is a guard in Africa or from a fighter ...

Glad to know your point of view, will you argue your position?
So why did LUKOIL, which has "its own army" in Iraq, use the services of a British and now local PMC?

[Penetrator]

Quote: insafufa

We also lack private armies

Imagine not enough. PMCs are able to protect the interests of the state in cases where the use of the Armed Forces is undesirable or inappropriate. An example of the Ukrainian conflict to help you - European and American PMCs are quite actively involved in hostilities on the side of Kiev. Another thing is that we need a carefully developed legislative framework governing the organization and activities of private armed groups.

[vladimirZ]

The Ministry of Internal Affairs, the Ministry of Defense and the FSB, which gave a negative CV to PMCs, are bodies working within the state and whose tasks should not overlap with those of PMCs.
PMCs should be examined by special agencies working abroad, including such as the GRU, the Foreign Ministry, and others, as well as large Russian enterprises working abroad.

[varov14]

It’s abroad that Russian enterprises can create PMCs - the master of the master, if there are any money.

[Kilo-11]

In fact, the main task of the Ministry of Defense is to protect the country from possible external aggression, and the GRU is an integral part of the Ministry of Defense-GRU of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. So it’s not right to call the Ministry of Defense an internal body and separate the Defense Ministry and the GRU. units that operate abroad.

[afdjhbn67]

Russia should realize its geopolitical interests with the support of its own state institutions - the army, the foreign ministry and the special services.

Kolomoisky’s pocket army’s experience in Ukraine must have explained a lot to Putin, too, oligarchs up to x and more .. if they don’t shake the country, they will go to defend Putin (the state), but the interests of the oligarch-breadwinner.
The whole topic is clearly pushed at the suggestion of our oligarchs, because it is not our colleagues and I who will create them - our destiny is only to be "cannon fodder" ...

[afdjhbn67]

Well, citizens are minuscule people - pour water on the mill of the oligarchy ..

[varov14]

Finally a sound comment.

[PSih2097]

Quote: afdjhbn67

Kolomoisky’s pocket army’s experience in Ukraine must have explained a lot to Putin, too, oligarchs up to x and more .. if they don’t shake the country, they will go to defend Putin (the state), but the interests of the oligarch-breadwinner.
The whole topic is clearly pushed at the suggestion of our oligarchs, because it is not our colleagues and I who will create them - our destiny is only to be "cannon fodder" ...

If we rely on American experience, we will see that the main contracts for PMCs come from the US government, and not from left-wing businessmen, because there is very strict legislation regarding private owners (PMCs).

[varov14]

So at Amerov and private prisons, and there the gratuitous labor (slave) force is spent on corporations, why not introduce it. I am surprised at you by the military; in addition to the charter and special subjects, were you allowed to read anything in educational institutions, even in Soviet times?

[shtanko.49]

PMCs would be very useful in Ukraine and other conflicts.

[user]

Imagine not enough.

In pursuit of short-term benefits and temporary interests. We simply return to the beginning of the 90s, remember all kinds of security offices of Berezovsky and other comrades. If my memory serves me right, most of them were created by former KGB officers (even the first deputy chairman of the KGB was noticed), but they also covered themselves with statements of this kind about the device of dismissed law enforcement officers. First, they will allow the activity of such structures, then they will expand the scope of tasks to be solved, then they will expand their powers, then they will be taken outside the framework of certain legislative acts. Well, the country has already passed this, or everyone’s memory is short when a lot of all kinds of people traveled with cities with guns in the cities of our country, it’s not clear to anyone who belongs and who obeys, but with all the necessary and legally executed weapons documents. It’s just another attempt to release gin from a bottle that will not be controlled and controlled by no one but the owner (like it or not, but the owner will be, business is business). And the next oligarch (well, or a respected businessman, moreover, occupying some sort of high official post) will manage this private army.

[reklats34]

with 90 nothing has changed in this regard, they also have their own security offices and people where necessary

[afdjhbn67]

Thank God the mind prevailed .. apparently took into account the experience of Kolomoisky ..

[little girl15]

Each oligarch has his own small army? Very original ...

[Mic1969]

And what is your opinion on PSCs?

[SibSlavRus]

And nothing that Kolomoisky hired Western (already existing) PMCs, where citizens of any state (including the 404 country itself) have the right to join. Officially, Ukraine did not have its own PMCs and do not exist, except for private security companies, which actually became "personnel" mercenaries.
Plus, official terbats and national battalions (and this is already departmental units!), In comparison with which, by designation, even PMC contractors turn pale.
And the nat- and terbats are a full-fledged state hiring in the war zone!
So, what is it worth to be afraid of "limited" services of PMCs when it is only a matter of legal names?

[Babr]

"According to the authors, the creation of such organizations will make it possible to resolve the issue of employment of several employees of law enforcement agencies, as well as military personnel who quit or were laid off."
Under the reduction fall, or objectionable, or not suitable.
So this is not an argument.
PMC, this is an attempt to legalize the gangs of the 90s.

[Penetrator]

Quote: Babr

PMC, this is an attempt to legalize the gangs of the 90s.

Rave. Where was the last time you saw something like the "gangsters of the 90s"?
Once again, in our realities, PMCs are needed exclusively for use outside the borders of the Russian Federation. Only in this capacity they have the right to exist.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Penetrator

Once again, in our realities, PMCs are needed exclusively for use outside the borders of the Russian Federation.

The USSR did without any PMCs, quite successfully. You can recall the experience of Vietnam, officially, our troops were not there.

[Babr]

Quote: Stirbjorn

officially, our troops were not there.

Officially. At one time, a soldier of OSNAZ. Microphone interception. Intercepted, and Boeing bye-bye. But this was decided by the state, to which I took the oath.

[afdjhbn67]

did not "Purple" serve for an hour?

[Babr]

Quote: afdjhbn67

did not "Purple" serve for an hour?

Purple. I do not understand.
ARTEM. 71-73.g

[afdjhbn67]

Violet - call sign

[Babr]

Quote: afdjhbn67

Violet - call sign

Secrecy was at its best, so the call sign does not tell me anything.

[reklats34]

so when your conscript son will die somewhere in Syria, Ukraine or where else I will see how you sing

[Babr]

Quote: Penetrator

Brad.

Each private company is focused on increasing the profits of private owners.
Well, she fulfilled the state’s order. Over the hill. Positive.
And the rest? Plain? But the content lies on the shoulders of the private trader, not the state. Naturally, there is also a domestic market. And this is banditry.

[Cat man null]

Quote: Babr

Plain? But the content lies on the shoulders of the private trader, not the state

Yes it is.

Quote: Babr

Well, naturally there is also a domestic market

No, not on the inside.

PMCs are prohibited from working in the domestic market. Well, except for the tasks of the chop chop, so these chop-s - like dogs uncut .. competition, s ..

But there are tasks outside the Russian Federation. The same ship security on risk routes.

Quote: Babr

And this is banditry

Not bigger than it is now.

IMHO

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Babr

"According to the authors, the creation of such organizations will make it possible to resolve the issue of employment of several employees of law enforcement agencies, as well as military personnel who quit or were laid off."

Send these hefty foreheads to the fields, harvest the crop or there to the machine tools at the plants. And then some guards

[Babr]

Not my words, but support.

[Penetrator]

Quote: Stirbjorn

Send these hefty foreheads to the fields, harvest the crop or there to the machine tools at the plants. And then some guards

And you, apparently, write directly from the machine or from a rural field?

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Penetrator

And you, apparently, write directly from the machine or from a rural field?

I am an engineer.

[strannik1985]

Why not? After all, we are talking about officers dismissed from the ranks.
If agriculture provides a similar income (EMNIP O. Krinitsyn spoke about 2-2,5 thousand dollars for the pilotage of one ship, plus the cost of a ticket and insurance (up to 250 thousand US dollars)) "foreheads" themselves will come running to the fields to work :)))

[reklats34]

these healthy foreheads will come to you and send you to the field

[PSih2097]

Quote: Babr

PMC, this is an attempt to legalize the gangs of the 90s.

Do you even know what screenings go when accepting PMCs? in the same USA only hired military personnel with very fucking stress resistance (this is after haemorrhage with black water) and excellent recommendations from the army or law enforcement agencies are hired, a bandyuk will not even get there. and in hohland they got rabble a la ISIS - fanatics and perverts plus adrenaline addicts ...

[Babr]

Quote: PSih2097

Do you even know what screenings go when accepting PMCs?

Actually, I am aware of. With what system I live. Where everything is for sale and everything is bought. If it’s not for money, then for big, it’s necessary.

[strannik1985]

In order for the contractor to get entangled in the card and the guarded person was nearly shot upon leaving at checkpoint (a case from the practice of RSB-Group in Iraq)?

[KazaK Bo]

insafufa
We also lack private armies

Perhaps this is true ... that PMCs will not ... We like in Russia, love extremes - or kiss in a hickey to unconsciousness ... or beat to death!
Figuratively speaking - PMCs are unlikely to kiss anyone so passionately ... but to beat ... without question, immediately with initiative, and enthusiasm ... and only then figure it out ...

[vkl-47]

And to whom the PMCs will swear the oath ?? Yukos? There is CSN here it needs to be expanded

[Penetrator]

Quote: vkl-47

And to whom the PMCs will swear the oath ?? Yukos? There is CSN here it needs to be expanded

And what, SPC will, for example, organize logistics and support of cargo columns? Or protect civilian objects? This is me specifically on the issue of the use of PMCs in zones of armed conflict outside of Russia. Anyway, what does the special forces? The tasks are completely different between well-armed guards and the elite of special services.

[SibSlavRus]

PMCs swear an oath. To the state, as a rule. An international organization such as the UN, CSTO, SCO, when hired by a contractor.
Unfair or non-fulfillment of the state contract leads to the actual liquidation (disbanding and dissolution), after penalties, of the organization.
Private and individuals are limited only by security and consulting functions of PMCs.

[PSih2097]

Quote: vkl-47

there is a CSN here it needs to be expanded

CSN is a little creepy, all the same, the military personnel of the Russian Federation after all, but in the case of PMCs at your own peril and risk ...

[Chiropractor]

Not in the country - yes, not enough, not enough.
For what?
I explain that in order to officially make it possible to send volunteers (read - PMC employees) to points of strategic importance with the available funds.
Such as the LC and the DNI, Syria ...

And the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation are engaged only in the defense of the Russian Federation.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Kostoprav

I explain that in order to officially make it possible to send volunteers (read - PMC employees) to points of strategic importance with the available funds.

PMCs (mercenaries) and volunteers are already a contradiction in themselves. And then the experience of Ukraine showed that there is no need in PMCs, volunteers and "vacationers" are coping quite successfully.

[yushch]

Quote: Stirbjorn

Quote: Kostoprav

I explain that in order to officially make it possible to send volunteers (read - PMC employees) to points of strategic importance with the available funds.

PMCs (mercenaries) and volunteers are already a contradiction in themselves. And then the experience of Ukraine showed that there is no need in PMCs, volunteers and "vacationers" are coping quite successfully.

Who do you think the "vacationers" are ??? I will answer right away, these are "contract soldiers" in the Western sense of the word, i.e. military specialists who were offered to continue to use their skills and knowledge only not in the Russian army, but in a "private order", so to speak. One should not confuse the issues of state security and the issues of solving delicate problems, where officially the state should not shine.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: yushch

I will answer right away, these are "contract soldiers" in the Western sense of the word, i.e. military specialists who were offered to continue to use their skills and knowledge only not in the Russian army, but in a "private order", so to speak.

Wait, if vacationers went voluntarily, without monetary reward, then they are volunteers. And if on the instructions of the Ministry of Defense, then there were career soldiers, the same as in Vietnam. Kosarev has an autobiographical novel "Cardboard Stars" on this topic, including about conspiracy.
"Everything was invented before us"

[yushch]

So the point is that volunteers and vacationers are a little different. Volunteers cannot get together and appear in the right place and at the right time, but vacationers can. And they are not in military service at this point in time. That is why I say that Volunteer the corps existing on the money of sponsors and directly "not subordinate" to the state would solve such issues very effectively. After all, many sympathizers are stopped by the lack of structures that generate volunteers to coordinate in units and perform combat missions.

[yushch]

Why not create a "Volunteer Corps ???" as an option. especially without insignia, no one will have it because all the volunteers, and there will be a lot of them.

[varov14]

Just go .otov must be isolated in time, and not elected by deputies.

[does it]

Quote: insafufa

We also lack private armies

Byzantine script ...

[svetoruss]

And rightly, otherwise each governor will instantly acquire his own PMC.

[Krasmash]

Quote: svetoruss

And rightly, otherwise each governor will instantly acquire his own PMC.

Eeeee, one head of the region already has its own, not even PMCs, but a full-fledged army, yes.

[Andryukha]

But it is still illegal and it can be slowly clamped as needed.
And after the adoption of the law, ANYONE can organize PMCs.
Have you forgotten about NGOs?

[vovanpain]

But after all, Mr. Nosovko said that everything is under control. Only what control we have is clear to everyone, anyone who has money can get a private army and no laws are given to him. The army is the prerogative of only the state.

[SibSlavRus]

Don't bullshit please! Not a single civil servant (ilm municipal) privately has the right to hire PMCs.
A complete understanding of the problem in Russian realities is not worth using Western patterns. As the law prescribes, so it will be fulfilled.

[SibSlavRus]

Let me repeat myself in the comments. The activities of PMCs (registered in the Russian Federation) are both a mass of jobs for "specialists" trained by the state at one time, and taxes to budgets, and state orders, and will pull some economic organizations, etc.
The activities of PMCs are quite clearly regulated by federal law, as are the activities of private security companies. Not a single PMC is able to withstand, in the event of force majeure, the military and special forces of state structures. You understand that the possibilities will be limited by caliber and types of weapons, and controlled even by the same FSB and MO combined.
And what, sorry, to hell, mercenarism, if this is an official organization in our country in the commercial register. 
As an example, I will cite "hiring" by government agencies to both Chechen companies through military enlistment offices, or, if someone does not know, then there are already analogues of PMCs, in fact, large corporations (with appropriate weapons), VOKHRs and private security companies, some of them, in fact contractors. 
In the future, this is a unique Russian foreign policy toolkit. I will give another example (I had to observe and encounter by type of activity) from the former Yugoslavia, where some of our volunteers settled. So they are engaged in humanitarian demining! Territories such as Bosnia, where there are only registered minefields for 70 years of work. And they are hired by the UN! Is the question to the opponents of the PMC idea also an act of mercenary activity?
Our PMCs will quickly create real competition for foreigners. The Russian peasants, just from the best side, proved themselves in the world.
And the activity of PMCs is not only the protection and posting of columns, but also demining, training, humanitarian missions, ensuring the election process in countries with difficult military-political conditions, assisting the army of their country in peacekeeping operations, working for international humanitarian organizations and much more. The scale of organization and financing with state points of view - many times less in terms of mobility and efficiency, too.
Leasing of military equipment, defense industry products is also possible. And this, you know, stimulates the economy. Plus, the likelihood (most likely) to legitimize combat short-barrels, including and the civilian environment, and improving legislation on the necessary (and long overdue!) self-defense of oneself, loved ones, one’s land, home and property.
Why put Russian (possible!) PMCs on the same scale with the same "Black Water" or MPRI, which carried out the liquidation of the Serbian Caribbean. Its own code of honor and state ideology, like those of power state structures, and even legislatively supported, because no one will be against the implementation.
And the so-called. disassembly of "clans and organizations" is just effectively "taking place" within the "legal field" with the use of state power structures. The rest is from the field of the theory of "possible-probable" in the collapse of the socio-political system.

[Penetrator]

SibSlavRus, great comment! Sorry, I can’t put more than one plus Catch More +++++++

[SibSlavRus]

Grateful for the support of a competent and experienced person.

[Travian]

romantic. PMC is an instrument of the external cynical disgusting policy of the state. But we need to have it, since it will take a long time to fight everywhere. It is the PMC that should be assessed as a counter-argument to "Black Water" or MPRI. And do not be shy about it - you need to defeat the enemy with his own weapons and methods.

[SibSlavRus]

An impressive answer, Travian. Bravo!

[marlin1203]

Well, why do people in the world need PMCs, but we don’t need them? Are we worse?

[Roman1970]

Quote: marlin1203

Well, why do people in the world need PMCs, but we don’t need them? Are we worse?

I would not argue in this way ... better or worse ... There must be understanding. Namely: why are PMCs needed, is there any need for them? Then make an informed decision.

[zadorin1974]

As they wrote above, each aligarch will have his own small army. And to arrest an activist in the likeness of Gaiser, armored vehicles will have to be introduced into the cities with air support

[LVMI1980]

Well yes ... of course ... same-sex marriage is also allowed

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: marlin1203

Well, why do people in the world need PMCs, but we don’t need them? Are we worse?

But imagine that some local "oligarch-Fuhrer" acquired a private army (an example is Dudayev in Chechnya) and began to commit lawlessness. All attempts to reason or arrest the criminals ended in the defeat of the internal troops due to the presence in the private army of the most modern military equipment supplied from the United States. Russia that should start military operations against such an army? And if you do not begin to pacify, then soon this territory will secede from Russia and become a military base for America.

[SibSlavRus]

What are you all mixed up in one pile? Do not know the history of the issue.
What side did the events of the early 1990s draw into (if at all do you know what preceded those events?). You do not have cause-effect relationships.
As they say: "do not confuse warm with soft".
Sorry, but ... incorrect comparison.

[strannik1985]

Just imagine that some local "oligarch-Fuhrer" acquired a private army (an example is Dudayev in Chechnya) and began to commit lawlessness.

The existing legislation in Russia does not in any way limit the activities of Russian PMCs outside the country; moreover, the bill, if it were adopted to create such structures, would only interfere.
You are now confusing the law and the real state of affairs in the country, the creation of pocket militarized structures has nothing to do with any law (the mentioned Dudayev has done without any lawmaking), if the events of the early 90s are repeated, then pocket armies will appear (like gangs) regardless of the presence or absence of law.

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: strannik1985

Just imagine that some local "oligarch-Fuhrer" acquired a private army (an example is Dudayev in Chechnya) and began to commit lawlessness.

The existing legislation in Russia does not in any way limit the activities of Russian PMCs outside the country; moreover, the bill, if it were adopted to create such structures, would only interfere.
You are now confusing the law and the real state of affairs in the country, the creation of pocket militarized structures has nothing to do with any law (the mentioned Dudayev has done without any lawmaking), if the events of the early 90s are repeated, then pocket armies will appear (like gangs) regardless of the presence or absence of law.

I gave Dudaev only as an example - how difficult it is to cope with military formations that have gone out of submission and are creating lawlessness. We are still struggling with gangs.
And you all here (readers) clung to the fact that I don’t know something there and cannot be compared.
And judging by the phrase: "Dudayev managed without any lawmaking," then you are also in favor of the legislative recognition of such military groups.
Do you all want to destroy Russia? So in fact the first will perish in the fire of rebellions. Remember: "Whoever comes to us with a sword will perish by the sword."

[strannik1985]

And judging by the phrase: "Dudayev managed without any lawmaking," then you are also in favor of the legislative recognition of such military groups.

Which groupings? What are you talking about? PMC Act outside the country, what does the situation within the Russian Federation?

[Babr]

Quote: marlin1203

Well, why do people in the world need PMCs, but we don’t need them? Are we worse?

No worse. But Western values ​​are being imposed on us. Money is king and god.
And this is disgusting to the Russian spirit.

[sl22277]

Who will control them? Private Army, private Constitution ..... There is a state Army to protect the state. Some deputies seem to have snickered so much that their heads do not differ from the asses of American politicians, or they fulfill the Pentagon order for the collapse of Russia from the inside. The private army is a gang for destruction objectionable!

[strannik1985]

.Private army is a gang to destroy the unwanted!

There is such a thing as promoting the interests of the state abroad, protecting the interests of Russian companies abroad.
There are a lot of situations (for example, as it is now in Syria) when the use of state power structures carries too great risks both inside (public opinion) of the country and abroad (an occasion for sanctions). PMCs can be one of such instruments, because no one will treat the losses of contractors so reverently as ordinary military personnel and there will not be (apart from the buzz on the Internet and the yellow press) reasoned evidence of Russia's military presence in the country (for example, in Sudan there is a large group of Chinese contractors (up to 40 people), work on all matters, including the release of hostages together with the Sudanese Armed Forces).

[Magic archer]

Dear, in fact, everything is not so. They have existed for a long time. It's just not customary to talk about it.

[kirpich]

They exist illegally and illegally. If they are legalized, the oligarchs will turn in full force and it will be impossible to restrain them.

[strannik1985]

It’s ridiculous. We have only 182 thousand people in the Ministry of Internal Affairs BB, of whom 17 are in the composition of the Special Purpose Arms, all are armed with BMP-000, D-2 and PM-30, against ... whom?

[SibSlavRus]

Your truth! What is not customary to talk about, but exists, must be placed within the legal framework.

[A-Sim]

"... the employment of several employees of the security forces, as well as military personnel who quit or were laid off."
Is it for the sake of the device of several retirees he is busy?

[SibSlavRus]

Most likely, several tens of thousands. PMCs are a lot of non-combatant positions (from logisticians and lawyers to analysts and support staffs).

[SibSlavRus]

The activities of PMCs will very strongly pull many sectors of the economy: from financial and credit to (especially) insurance. From leasing and buying "products" of the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation to special service enterprises and services.
And to hire contractors at the expense of the state budget (or most likely - departmental) will have to. But the benefit (in every sense) is obvious.
You can use it absolutely everywhere: from peacekeeping and military operations (or rather, their support from engineering to rear) abroad and to teaching at DOSAAF and the centers for military-patriotic education and training of citizens (youth) for military service, military training, universities and colleges.
The selection will be no worse in these organizations than in the Airborne Forces and the FSB combined.

Many Russian experienced male professionals will be on hand!
And maybe we generally stop hearing about radical religious fanatics and terrorists in our country. And this is only a guaranteed minimum.

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

The activities of PMCs will very strongly pull many sectors of the economy: from financial and credit to (especially) insurance. From leasing and buying "products" of the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation to special service enterprises and services.

This is if the entire PMC is staked out, and several companies do not have a major impact.

Quote: SibSlavRus

You can use it absolutely everywhere: from peacekeeping and military operations (or rather, their support from engineering to rear) abroad

Nizya! According to the UN charter, peacekeeping forces are military contingents of UN member states. And it is a private military company by definition.

Quote: SibSlavRus

And maybe we generally stop hearing about radical religious fanatics and terrorists in our country.

Terrorism within the country, in fact, is fought by operational-search methods, and not
the military.

[strannik1985]

Nizya! According to the UN charter, peacekeeping forces are military contingents of UN member states. And it is a private military company by definition.

This is already a gray zone of law, for example, the notorious Executive Outcomes in January 1995-February 1997 prepared army units of the Sierra Leone Armed Forces and conducted military operations against the rebels of the United Revolutionary Front (285 employees, 3 Mi-17s and 1 Mi-24s).
Support for military operations (logistics, collection and destruction of unexploded ordnance and mines, removal from the battlefield and repair of wrecked equipment, food for military personnel, rear support, protection of military facilities and depots, prisons, etc.) are quite legitimate actions, and this Most of these organizations are involved.

[gudgeon]

Quote: strannik1985

This is already a gray zone of law, for example, the notorious Executive Outcomes in January 1995-February 1997 prepared army units of the Sierra Leone Armed Forces and conducted military operations against the rebels of the United Revolutionary Front (285 employees, 3 Mi-17s and 1 Mi-24s).

Were these peacekeeping operations authorized by the UN or a private contract of the Sierra Leone state with a specific PMC?

[strannik1985]

Were these peacekeeping operations authorized by the UN or a private contract of the Sierra Leone state with a specific PMC?

The second one. A private contract in which contractors actually replaced peacekeepers.

[SibSlavRus]

wanderer1985, you are my plus.
Well, if you also remind, as an example, your opponent about the elimination of the Serbian Krajina by the forces and means of MPRI, when the UN and "other NATO peacekeepers" were there.
You can offer Georgia to him (with the training and supervision of Western PMC instructors), model 2008, where our peacekeepers stood under the UN mandate.
This is just a snap.

[SibSlavRus]

Well, why are you so incompetent to oppose something, dear gudgeon?
Not ready for the question at all? Then, counterargument.
1. The whole country cannot be staked out; it will not work. But about five hundred and fifty experienced men who are not able to realize themselves to the fullest, can be provided with a completely worthy and profitable occupation.
A little knowledge of demography, sociology, the newest recent history of the countries of Western Europe and North America, international relations and especially statistics, as well as data from completely open sources on the forms, methods and number of organizations of existing and existing PMCs (and they have permanent composition and timelines) will help you with understanding the matter.
Using the services of only one "notorious" American PMC is, according to sources, about two billion dollars a year. And this is only the protection, wiring, engineering and logistic support of the army with about three thousand contractors.
The aggregate data are not amenable to refinement.
For potential Russian companies, only insurance, loans and leasing, weapons, licenses, taxes, investments (of course not immediately, but who knows?), For example, for 100 thousand people. (based on the binding, for example, of the number of official security guards alone at 500 thousand) - this is billions of rubles to the budget, coupled with a waste of money of the contractors themselves within the country. And this is only offhand, without the purchase of weapons and ammunition and its own infrastructure.
2. You can use PMCs anywhere and how. Glane as legally call it. Example (personal): countries of the Former Yugoslavia, in Bosnia (I already wrote about this upstream). Humanitarian mine clearance, engineering and logistics support, security, humanitarian operations support, etc. The customers are different: from the UN, the EU and to the military departments of the participating countries.
Read O. Valetsky, a volunteer in the wars of the Former Yugoslavia, now he is a PMC mine clearance contractor.
The UN Charter does not violate this. But NATO in general ... you know.

[SibSlavRus]

I will continue ...
3. Terrorism is fought by different methods. Carefully read the federal legislation and especially regarding the power structures.
And now, for an example, remember how both Chechen companies were officially called and what the Ministry of Defense did there.

I’m not even minus you, for it is a sin to offend ...

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

I will continue ...
3. Terrorism is fought by different methods. Carefully read the federal legislation and especially regarding the power structures.

Gee gee! I have always believed that 20 years of service in the relevant operational units allow me to reasonably competently discuss issues of the fight against terrorism, but it’s like you ... I don’t understand ...

Quote: SibSlavRus

And now, for an example, remember how both Chechen companies were officially called and what the Ministry of Defense did there.

And there was nobody else. Do you remember the state of power structures for that period? Ali prompt?

Quote: SibSlavRus

I’m not even minus you, for it is a sin to offend ...

From thanks! such a gift from an amateur!

[SibSlavRus]

Answer in order (appropriate form of your comments).
1. Gee-gee. It's bad, but you have knowledge of the legal framework governing the activities of law enforcement agencies (where even the customs authorities are recognized as the subject of the fight against terrorism and its manifestations). Only an amateur (in your words) will rely on one Federal Law "On the ORD".
Which department do you refer to the concept of "operational"? Many are guided by the Federal Law "On ORD".
Or is it troops? OBVR Defense of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, for example?

Do not be offended, but judging by your remarks, you are not that the Federal Law and doctrines, but departmental orders (especially in terms of interaction) did not pay much attention to your attention.
Well, the fact that you do not know the military component, in general, I already guessed which department you may belong to and the type of your past activity.
2. Even commenting is difficult for your opus. VV MVD, SOBROV, OMON, SpNov, in the aggregate, as I understand it, it was not enough for you.
The most paradoxical thing was that there was an overabundance of manpower and resources, but the effectiveness of application and interaction, coupled with "internal politics", is a question of a different nature.
Do you remember the tasks of the Ministry of Defense and other departments at that time?
Or the Syrian events? There, by the way, the army is fighting against terrorists.
Or are you ready to name armed conflicts of varying intensity, where the army is not involved?
3. Yet you manifest amateurish manners.
It’s a pity, but maybe we could intersect in the first and second companies. Even in the Former Yugoslavia (I did not meet in Bosnia, but I was present in Kosovo, because the military peacekeeping operation was transformed into a police one). Judging by your length of service and line of business, if not kidding.
I know a lot of guys from the Krasnodar Territory, with whom I had to serve in different ministries and departments. And I understand your closeness to the "region".
Sorry if I offended you in the comments.

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

Only an amateur (in your words) will rely on one Federal Law "On the ORD".

Okay, I'll conduct an educational program ... Operational activities are regulated by the Federal Law "On ORD". This is a fundamental regulatory legal act that defines the list of operational-search measures, the grounds and procedure for their implementation. There are simply no others. All departmental orders and instructions are issued in strict accordance with this law and should not contradict it. The concept of "operational" refers to all departments - subjects of the ORD.

Quote: SibSlavRus

Do not be offended, but judging by your remarks, you are not that the Federal Law and doctrines, but departmental orders (especially in terms of interaction) did not pay much attention to your attention.

I’m not offended, especially since you don’t know my orders and you can’t appreciate how familiar I am with them.

Quote: SibSlavRus

Well, you don’t know the military component

And did not hide, not my profile. But, with regard to the organization and holding of special events, the experience is quite large.

Quote: SibSlavRus

VV MVD, SOBROV, OMON, SpNov, in the aggregate, as I understand it, it was not enough for you.

No, not enough. And their effectiveness was already very different.

Quote: SibSlavRus

Yet you manifest amateurish manners.

No, dear. You climbed to talk about the prospects of the fight against internal terrorism from the perspective of PMCs. Despite the fact that, based on your reasoning, in the fight against terrorism, you absolutely do not understand anything.

Quote: SibSlavRus

It’s a pity, but maybe we could intersect in the first and second companies.

May be. By the way, "gudgeon" is not "who", it is "where" (if you know what I'm talking about).

[SibSlavRus]

Gudgeon!
If there is a misunderstanding of the issue, then probably it was not presented in detail and concretization.
In no case did not want to add PMCs to the Horde, God be with you. It is presented as assisting intelligence and information to specialists (and, most likely, an obligation). THEY ARE ABROAD to act, incl. will come from where all the infection (along with funds) to us and rushing. Or they can multiply any infection there by zero.

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

Gudgeon!
If there is a misunderstanding of the issue, then probably it was not presented in detail and concretization.

That would not "start" the dialogue with mentoring, it would be easier to find mutual understanding. And then: "it is sinful to offend", "it is sinful to offend" ...

Quote: SibSlavRus

Or they can multiply any infection there by zero.

They can and multiply, but maybe not. Simply, most perceive PMCs as an unpunished military instrument of foreign policy. And this is a very dangerous temptation.

[strannik1985]

In fact, a respected gudgeon is right, after billions of investments in the VV, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the FSB (so that they can really fight terrorism within the country) developing PMCs to work within the Russian Federation does not seem to be commemorative ...
Helping the same Syria is another matter (we recall the history of interest in PMCs-West, first of all, the USA found a way to reduce the losses of the military group in Iraq and Afghanistan, shifting some of the functions to PMCs, I met information that military losses to contractors are treated as 1 to 1,9 , XNUMX respectively, while PMC losses are not taken into account in official statistics), Donbass.

[gudgeon]

Quote: strannik1985

Helping the same Syria is another matter (we recall the history of interest in PMCs-West, first of all, the USA found a way to reduce the losses of the military group in Iraq and Afghanistan, shifting some of the functions to PMCs, I met information that military losses to contractors are treated as 1 to 1,9 , XNUMX respectively, while PMC losses are not taken into account in official statistics), Donbass.

I completely agree with this, but there is also a moral aspect. If we defend the interests of the state, then the state must defend them. I do not think that we should be like the United States, which in front of everyone's eyes "crap" in their neighbors' slippers, and then declare that they say - not us, these are all villains - private traders. If we are creating Russia as a state - an alternative to the West (with their double standards, the overthrow of unwanted regimes, "muddy" operations in other countries of the same PMCs), then we should not use their methods in everything either. PMCs are very light, but very dangerous tools to use. Statements that with the help of PMCs Russia can secretly realize its interests in other countries are simply untenable. PMCs registered in Russia will definitely be associated with the state. Ultimately, it will not be the state that will control the activities of such a company, but the owner - a private person. Personally, I would not want a Russian PMC employing some banana king to overthrow the government in a neighboring country. As for peacekeeping operations, this area has long been clearly spelled out and worked out. PMCs in this case simply want to bite their share of the pie.
If you really need "your own" PMC, then it can be registered in the Virgin Islands, PPD can be determined in Brazil and used for health, and where it recruits fighters and where the money from contracts ultimately goes is the "tenth" thing.

[strannik1985]

Let's deal.

If we defend the interests of the state, then the state must defend them.

For the people of Syria, this assistance will be from Russia as a state, as internal propaganda will explain, for Russians, I doubt that after the generally negative experience of Afghanistan, the majority of the population will support the sending of units of the Russian Armed Forces to help the ATS, contractors by definition are volunteers acting under the agreement with the government of Syria. For the West, the appearance of any appearance of Russian-speaking personnel in the B / D zone will be interpreted unambiguously, the question is in the evidence, if the PMC will act officially and within the framework of the contract, then what questions?

Personally, I would not want the Russian PMC to hire a banana king to overthrow a government in a neighboring country.

If this is a commercial business structure (MORAN-Group, RSB-Group), then of course such activity falls under the article on mercenarism, but what if it is a tool of special services? For example, the creation of Blackwater PMCs in 1997 was not a single retired fur seal by E. Prince, but a joint project of NAVSOC and the CIA Operations Department, which was transformed into the National Clandestine Service (NCS) on October 13.10.2005, XNUMX .
The outer side has changed, but the essence has remained the same, do you question the need to control "B" as part of the PGU of the KGB of the USSR?

If you really really need "your own" PMC, then it can be registered in the Virgin Islands, PPD can be determined in Brazil and used for health, and where it recruits fighters and where the money from contracts ultimately goes is the "tenth" thing.

It’s possible, of course, but how will Agência Brasileira de Inteligência / ABIN react to the work of someone else’s special services on their plot?

[gudgeon]

Quote: strannik1985

It’s possible, of course, but how will Agência Brasileira de Inteligência / ABIN react to the work of someone else’s special services on their plot?

I took Brazil from the lantern. Just for covert operations and the structure must be impersonal.

[strannik1985]

I took Brazil from the lantern. Just for covert operations and the structure must be impersonal.

This is understandable, just PMCs is the depersonalization of the structure at the official level.
A private person, no matter how he wants to present it to the media or the "official" statements of the US State Department.

[zadorin1974]

There is no other matter, not in Syria, not elsewhere. The transfer of the functions of supplying and protecting PMCs to Afghanistan and Iraq simply gave the Pentagon several advantages: the opportunity to earn several generals (kickbacks at the conclusion of contracts), to hide losses (the contractor wasn’t killed and killed), and all that. But much more problems were earned: the mercenaries scored on the orders of the Headquarters (for the military, the tribunals, the mercenaries simply won’t get any money), the mercenaries angered the local population with their lawlessness (the entire Internet is littered with videos).

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

The whole country cannot be staked out, it will not work. But about five hundred and fifty experienced men who are not able to realize themselves to the fullest, can be provided with a completely worthy and profitable occupation.

Uh-huh! Who will provide? Or will they take a loan from Sberbank? And what about the sale of military equipment and weapons to civilians in the country, how is it going? Even if we "settle" this question, what will we sell to private traders? Trash or modern weapons? If modern, what about ensuring secrecy? Will we introduce WRC bodies into PMCs, or what?

Quote: SibSlavRus

A little knowledge of demography, sociology, the newest recent history of the countries of Western Europe and North America, international relations and especially statistics, as well as data from completely open sources on the forms, methods and number of organizations of existing and existing PMCs (and they have permanent composition and timelines) will help you with understanding the matter.

I simply bow to your encyclopedic knowledge. Are you really free to operate with all of the above parameters? Especially about the knowledge of sociology
Western Europe and North America were pleased ... But since you yourself only declare knowledge in these areas, but do not bring, then I will not mind. Nothing.

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

You can use PMCs anywhere and how. Glane as legally call it. The UN Charter does not violate this.

According to UNGA Resolution 34/140 of 14.12.1979/XNUMX/XNUMX, Mercenary is “a threat to international peace and security and, like murder, piracy and genocide, is a crime against humanity everywhere”

Yes of course! Che there ... Just think!

[asar]

Vladimir! Good all!
But why advertise it ?!

[APS]

Private armies will protect private interests, the first thing that comes to mind is Mexico, where each new politician creates his own PMC and promises to put things in order and that’s all, we don’t need PMCs also because there will be different criteria for selecting military personnel ...

[Travian]

In the same way as Mexico, PMCs are not needed, but we need units that do not have the status of the RF Armed Forces, but are capable of solving tasks abroad (Ukraine, Syria, etc.), PMCs are not needed inside the country - they make no sense. PMCs may include "dismissals", "discharged" servicemen of the Defense Ministry, the GRU, the FSB - then the government will not have to make excuses for little green men, Buryat tankers in Donbass. PMCs simply hired the government of the DPR / LPR. Such PMCs are led by Zitspresidents under the control of the FSB (GRU). But you see, the Westerners will be less willing to go to such conflicts as on safari.

[SibSlavRus]

But what then do you not give as an example the French foreign legion? And the results of his work?
In fact, this is an analogue of PMCs. True massive.

[Travian]

the French Legion is subordinate to the French government. We do not need such a status in the Donbass

[SibSlavRus]

So we will have submission - contract + legislative. By the way, as in the Legion.

[Sergej1972]

No, this is part of the French Ground Forces. Officers are exclusively French citizens who graduated from military schools. Soldiers and sergeants, although they may be recruited from foreigners, are also serving in the French Armed Forces. That is, this is a military formation with a special status. Legionnaires are military personnel, not mercenaries or PMC employees. They are entitled to pensions and other social guarantees from the French Republic.

[roskot]

Than you need to publicize yourself. And then they would not have known about such a Nosovko. Gives birth to the law. The army was, is and will be a state structure.

[raid14]

Does Russia need PMCs that will protect the country's economic interests in the Arctic and the Middle East?
There is an army to protect the Arctic, in the Middle East it is much easier to conclude protection agreements with local representatives of state structures or private companies and our guys will not put their heads for the interests of business.

[strannik1985]

Not easier, look at the history of LUKOIL Overseas LTD. The company operates in Basra (West Qurna-2 deposit), first used the services of the British PMC (1 fst per day per person), then switched to local security, the quality of security decreased sharply. Those who come from the Middle East or Africa (especially with close family ties in power structures, militias, militants) by and large do not care about the guarded and reputation of the company, they can simply escape.

[tiras85]

We have enough of the Russian Armed Forces! Important, their equipment, training, supply, decent monetary maintenance.

[SibSlavRus]

Do you have any idea of ​​the cost of an army or special operation? Especially abroad? You will be the first to shout about unacceptable losses and "we did not send you there"!
And what is a state contract with a contractor (PMC), can you imagine? What about humanitarian demining? And taxes to the budget? And versatile help from the army? And much more.

The demand for time and the development of society is as follows.

[Andryukha]

The cost of a private trader is by definition more - because taxes and profits will be laid there

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

Do you have any idea the value of an army or special operation? Especially abroad?

I apologize for interfering, but do you yourself at least imagine the quantitative and qualitative parameter of PMCs that will be required to conduct an army operation (especially abroad)?

[SibSlavRus]

Imagine, dear, quite. For your information, PMCs for army operations are not sharpened (as many believe undergoing stereotypical perception of PMC abbreviations) and, as a rule, do not take part in them. The maximum is special police-type operations, instructor-methodological training, escort, security, reconnaissance, engineering and rear services, operations planning, etc. I don’t want to repeat myself, just read my comments above on the thread and the comments of people who know here.
To participate in army operations, he hires the state through its points (the example of the United States) to the state army of citizens of different countries, including and with us (through military registration and enlistment offices). Federal Law on Military Service Remember. Including for citizenship.

It’s too expensive, you know, to use PMC contractors in combined arms combat, an army full-fledged combat operation.
And peacekeeping missions and humanitarian operations are just that.
Based on the experience of the 1990s in Former Yugoslavia, Croatia and Bosnia, Kosovo, as part of the Russian contingent (Rusbats), I can say that many tasks (mine clearance, security, logistics, securing elections, etc.) can be trusted with Russian military organizations type. From rough estimates: two times cheaper and more efficient. Including equipment and aviation, quantitative composition, provision of a minimum from the battalion type.
According to the experience of Chechen companies and Balkan peacekeeping operations then and now, one can compare: 3 million for the deaths in the database, up to 1 million for injuries + benefits, pension and other social security. During the time in the BD zone, monthly salary + camouflage and provision of all types of allowances on the spot (now). In the Former Yugoslavia in the 1990s, an RF peacekeeper received an average of $ 1150 a month, on a soldier’s post + all types of allowances + travel expenses and a salary in rubles went to Russia. NATO, of course, is 3-4 times more.
And all these are civil servants for whom it is necessary to bear responsibility.
PMCs are easier and cheaper in every sense.
The main thing is that the state is not accountable to its citizens for the life of contractors.
It is necessary to discuss this topic in a very detailed manner, therefore I recommend reading Oleg Valetsky, a former volunteer in the Yugoslav Wars, now the mine clearance contractor there. In his works, a thorough approach to the topic under discussion. As well as our compatriots from RBC groups and others.

[gudgeon]

Quote: SibSlavRus

From rough estimates: two times cheaper and more efficient. Including equipment and aviation, quantitative composition, provision of a minimum from the battalion type.

That is, equipment and aviation are sovereign (respectively, the cost of their use), and for a private entrepreneur, who will definitely cost more daily than a military man? I don’t quite understand you, you can reveal it somehow (We don’t take death and injuries. Here I agree - the insurance company will bear the costs). As for social programs, it’s actually funny: 1600 per month, the ability to not pay the transport tax for certain categories of cars, and that’s all. The pension does not depend on participation in the database, it only counts in the length of service.

[SibSlavRus]

Consider the time, strength and means + methods, and work on the result, respectively, and not on the presence only.
Simulate the situation yourself.
Take for example the work of Western companies in the same Georgia or a striking example - 1995 - Serbian Krajina. Africa, at worst. I do not propose analyzing Iraq and Afghanistan; there are more of these companies than troops. I have not really figured it out yet.
They know how to count money there.

And by the way, here on the forum thread, many express their thoughts on the basis of effective stereotypes or imposed by negative information from Western examples, sometimes even without really examining the available information on the issue under discussion.
Although the Russian version is something else in content and basic principles.

Many are confused by the abbreviation and the word "private". From this and "wild" speculation.
In fact, this is a union, commercial, but specific. Military purposes, with appropriate (small arms!) Weapons. For some reason, nothing confuses anyone in security agencies, or departmental security, such as large corporations, which, in fact, have mini armies.
The main thing is how goals and objectives, principles and forms of activity will be spelled out.
It is worthwhile to study in detail the Western analogues.

[S_Baykala]

Quote: insafufa

We also lack private armies

A plus. Private armies in their own country are the key to instability, given the breadth of our souls: each oligarch considers it fashionable to maintain his military unit.

[corporal]

If it is prescribed in the law, what to do just outside and only in the interests of the Russian Federationthen why not?

[Andryukha]

those. when are they needed, they miraculously condense together with the weapons in the right place, and when the task is completed, they evaporate again with the weapons and other logistics and management?

[strannik1985]

That is, they work officially, under a contract or with the permission of the government of the host country. What is the problem?

[Engineer]

I thought that although this law was pushed through, so that our MO could send professional fighters to the Donbass, and indeed to any hot spot where it would be undesirable to send your regular army for political reasons. Apparently the security forces were scared for the cadres and for their position. After all, the same MO is more profitable to hire PMCs for various kinds of special operations and, in case of failure, do not bear any responsibility for this.

[SibSlavRus]

You have an excellent understanding of the situation, Comrade. Engineer!
And the reasons are still logical and worthy of understanding - the mass!

[Andryukha]

And what is more profitable? Not cheaper, not controlled, have the status of mercenaries.
These companies need to defend PRIVATE interests.
Let's just rename organized crime groups to PMCs. Is it easier to live?

[shelva]

Quote: A-Sim

Is it for the sake of the device of several retirees he is busy?

He is busy for those who pay for this initiative.

[made13]

PMCs have been and will be. We know about it or not. Russian including. And the absence of laws complicates their work in Russia. And thank God. Let them work in the USA, but in the interests of Russia.

[gladysheff2010]

I read the comments carefully and understood: there are so many people, so many opinions. The "suddenness" of pushing the bill is incomprehensible: “If this time the officials pass a negative verdict, I, no longer waiting for the opinion of government experts, will submit the bill to the parliament back in 2015 during autumn session. "Agree, it is alarming! I would like to understand the sources of such an acceleration, or is the Russian government depriving the army and retirees of its attention? The presence of special services in one or another country does not exclude the involvement of outside employees by them, which happens and is accepted throughout the world. But PMCs are exclusively militants, persons carrying weapons that, it is not known where can be used, another category, but in fact the same military personnel. And this is not only about the Oath! A comprehensive examination-assessment of the prospects for use is required with a clear indication of the goals and objectives of such organizations, with a mandatory reference to the existing laws of the Russian Federation. Do not forget about the assessment of the experience of foreign countries m, especially working out the issues of social adaptation of former employees of such organizations, including options for pension and medical care, psychological rehabilitation! Too many-sided area to make haste decisions on such an issue!

[ML-334]

PMCs are in demand so that there are no 200s among conscripts as well as contractors. And also for operations not related to publicity. It is necessary to legitimize mainly for their families with insurance (God forbid, of course) in connection with the loss of the breadwinner.

[atamankko]

This is a very serious question and amateurs do not need
solve it, even for deputies of various levels.

[SERGEI]

We would still have PMCs ... and we will live. There are 5000000 security guards in the country. There are practically no hard workers anymore, the country is turning into a crowd of managers, security guards, officials, policemen, military men. An engineer is no longer even called a mother, but a bachelor's degree is strength. The power of the intellect is immediately felt, and if the master is then "kirdyk america" ​​right away. At that time, only Karagandazhilstroy rented out 2 square meters of housing a year. Without fanfare, calmly, according to the plan. .Such we have great top managers. So where are we without PMCs in the Arctic especially?

[34 region]

And where is the answer to the main question? Who will finance PMCs? The UN does not count. At whose expense is the banquet?

[34 region]

It’s still not clear. Here I drive the thoughts (settled). Mine clearance. Only a private company can? Security escort of goods. ChOPov full. Again comes the thought of payment. Who will pay? Covert operations. Well, until today they were not? And who carried out these secret operations and is now a secret. Will there now be a complete list of undercover agents? In general, all this is dreary.

[Wolka]

even if not today, but still come to an understanding, development and adoption of this law, which requires really specific thorough study and study, because today it is no secret that, for example, Gazprom and other companies are equal in weight and strategic importance, in fact they already have their own private (departmental) armies under control, which protect production facilities, and private individuals, formally they are typical private security companies, but in fact they are already PMCs, respectively equipped with specially trained personnel, various small arms, including special purposes, and also means of communication ...

[plow]

And what is right about that? The state has the exclusive right to use force, what you list is the legacy of the dashing 90s. There are now more than 1,5 million security guards in Russia. All this mass of strong men does not sow, does not reap and does not plow, but protects someone else's good.
Large companies must pay taxes, and the state to protect their interests.
In addition, do not forget that these brave guys not only protect the good of their masters, but also help to grab someone else's in raider captures.
And if the interests of the owners of PMCs come into conflict with the state, what civil war to start? Here pen.dosy will be happy.

[vkl-47]

Quote: Penetrator

Quote: vkl-47

And to whom the PMCs will swear the oath ?? Yukos? There is CSN here it needs to be expanded

And what, SPC will, for example, organize logistics and support of cargo columns? Or protect civilian objects? This is me specifically on the issue of the use of PMCs in zones of armed conflict outside of Russia. Anyway, what does the special forces? The tasks are completely different between well-armed guards and the elite of special services.

PMC DOES NOT SERVE THE STATE !!! ON IT AND THE PRIVATE ARMY. IT IS NOT MONITORED AND DOES NOT SUBJECT TO THE STATE !!! MERCEDES EXECUTING AN ORDER FOR THE ABC.

[plow]

Mercenaries - dogs of war. Who pays for that and is killed. This is immoral. Russia will never do that.

[shadow]

Business, do you understand this word? This is when a lot of money. Minimum investment, maximum income. No one will guarantee that the leadership of such a company will not sell secrets to other countries at 4 expensive, receiving them from our developers. And then, wherever they take them, they will scream everywhere that Putin sent them. And the meaning of them?

[strannik1985]

It is better when the foreign intelligence services will work under the guise of foreign PMCs guarding Russian specialists abroad?

[carabiner sks]

I don’t understand everything - why do you need PMCs to protect Russian companies? Let agree with the MO. What is the point here to hide the state. membership of personnel? But instead of legitimizing PMCs, it might be better to adapt the Ministry of Defense to tasks that they want to assign to PMCs?

[strannik1985]

Eeeee ... and with us the MoD can independently send military personnel somewhere to Iraq, Libya, Sudan? Maybe you mean the government of the Russian Federation?

[Cat man null]

Enchanting Arctic fox .. okay, once again and by division ..

Quote: carabiner sks

why do you need PMCs to protect Russian companies

Because PMC is a company that provides professional services (including protection) for the client’s money.

Quote: carabiner sks

Let agree with the MO

Cool. That is, "without demand" from the country where the company operates, the Russian Federation is sending its troops there? To protect some kind of company?

Something it reminds me already ..

Quote: carabiner sks

And instead of legitimizing PMCs, it might be better to adapt the Ministry of Defense to tasks that they want to assign to PMCs

"To obtain barbed wire, cross a hedgehog with a snake .."

You would ask at your leisure:

- what status and what tasks does the municipality have
- What status and tasks does PMCs have?

And after that they would suggest something else .. well, these two things do not intersect. No way. From the word "absolutely".

[reklats34]

PMCs are necessary for Russia and we will not get anywhere from this

[tiras85]

Today it is impossible to squander the money allocated to the Armed Forces and Defense for the so-called. other "projects". After deep modernization and complete equipment of the Russian Armed Forces, and this is a long process, it is possible and necessary to invest in real equipment of the State Border of Russia! This is paramount!

[gammipapa]

Only one question - who pays Nosovko?

[carabiner sks]

Kotu Manulu. Regarding the first point, I still don’t understand the essence of your argument. Now further.
Quote: "Cool. That is," without demand "from the country where the company operates, the Russian Federation is bringing its troops there? To protect some kind of company?"
Well, first of all "with demand". Secondly, there will not be a special factual difference between escorting PMCs (the same armed forces, in fact) and escorting state armed forces, unless it is legal, but with the proper approach this can be solved.
Quote: "You would ask at your leisure:

- what status and what tasks does the municipality have
- What status and tasks does PMCs have?

And after that they would suggest something else .. well, these two things do not intersect. No way. From the word "absolutely". "
That is why I wrote "to adapt ..." It is clear that under the current legal situation this is impossible, so you may not be too sarcastic.

[Cat man null]

Quote: carabiner sks

so especially can not ulcerate

Ok, I answer, "not an ulcer":

Quote: Definition

Private military company (PMC) - a commercial enterprise offering specialized services related to the protection, defense (defense) of someone or something, often with participation in military conflicts, as well as with the collection of intelligence information, strategic planning, logistics and consulting

Your question was:

Quote: carabiner sks

why do you need PMCs to protect Russian companies?

Answer: precisely because they are specifically designed for this.

Quote: carabiner sks

Well, first of all "with demand". Secondly, there will not be much actual difference between escorting PMCs (the same armed forces, in fact) and escorting state armed forces

- "with demand" ... from the state on whose territory it is necessary to "protect", from the UN, who else is there? And for PMCs all this is not necessary - it is a private "security" company. No more.
- "PMCs (the same armed forces, in fact)" - no, not the same .. The Armed Forces are a state. With all that it implies.
Private traders - they are private traders, and there is no state behind them (officially, at least). They work at their own risk, this has already been mentioned a hundred times. "Maxim died - and ... with him," in particular.

Quote: carabiner sks

That's why I wrote "adapt ..."

Duc .. and why "pull an owl" and overload the Ministry of Defense with unusual tasks .. IMHO it is easier to allow private companies that are strictly controlled and operate strictly outside the Russian Federation.

Something like this..

[arrows]

In vain !!!

[carabiner sks]

Quote: Cat Man Null

Duc .. and why "pull an owl" and overload the Ministry of Defense with unusual tasks .. IMHO it is easier to allow private companies that are strictly controlled and operate strictly outside the Russian Federation.

And from this moment begins the endless and unresolvable, in the course of the dispute over the PMC accountability ...

[Cat man null]

Quote: carbine sks

And from this moment begins the endless and unresolvable, in the course of the dispute over the PMC accountability ...

- PMCs should work only outside the Russian Federation
- PMCs should be state controlled
- no "private armies" inside the Russian Federation the law on PMCs should not be allowed

This is my IMHA.

And so - yes, as the law is written, so it will be. They certainly won’t ask us. Democracy, mmm ..

[carabiner sks]

Quote: Cat Man Null

And so - yes, as the law is written, so it will be.

Your words, yes to God in the ears ...

[Nehist]

Wow!!! This is the discussion! In principle, why and for what "PMCs" are needed that some people competently and meticulously put on the shelves! But all the arguments against turned into one - not needed, period. I haven't read a single reasoned objection. The creation of PMCs has matured even during the Yugoslav crisis, and in these realities it is even more relevant. And yet, not one PMC without state control will not be able to exist.