Military Review

Poland surprised by the protests of Russia in connection with the dismantling of the monument Chernyakhovsky

127
The Polish Foreign Ministry expressed surprise at the statements made by the Russian ambassador in Warsaw and the Russian Defense Ministry in connection with the dismantling of the monument to General Chernyakhovsky, reports RIA News.




“The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Poland was deeply surprised by the statement of the Ambassador of the Russian Federation and the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the case of the dismantling of the monument to General Chernyakhovsky in Penenzhno, as well as the statements by the spokesman for the Russian Foreign Ministry (Maria Zakharova),” the document says.

Earlier, Zakharova said that "the war unleashed by Warsaw against the monuments to Soviet soldiers erected on its territory entered a new round of escalation."

The Polish Foreign Ministry noted that Moscow "was informed in detail about the procedure for dismantling the monument to General Ivan Chernyakhovsky, which has been going on for several years."

Warsaw considers “allegations of allegedly unacceptable and completely unfounded historical amnesia of the Polish authorities and the formation of the soil for the revival of Nazism, which were made on September 17 on the 76th anniversary of the Soviet attack on Poland, based on a secret protocol between the authorities of two totalitarian regimes - the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany. ”

The Russian side "persistently bypasses this fact." In this regard, the Polish Foreign Ministry "considers this approach of the Russian Federation as a chronic case of historical amnesia and a manifestation of extreme cynicism."

“Without questioning the role of General Chernyakhovsky in the war with the Third Reich, we should not forget that he was responsible and actively participated in the liquidation of the Polish underground - the Home Army,” noted in Warsaw. “We have no doubt that the Russian side has detailed, documented knowledge in this regard,” the diplomats added.

“Poland has always treated and continues to treat the graves of all fallen soldiers, prisoners of war and internees, regardless of their nationality and the circumstances by which they ended up on our territory, with due honor and care,” the Foreign Ministry recalled. “From the day Poland gained full sovereignty in 1989, not a single cemetery of Russian and Soviet soldiers was eliminated.”

The Foreign Ministry “regrets that neither the Soviet Union nor the Russian side has so far shown interest in commemorating 800 in memory of the thousands of Red Army soldiers killed by the German Nazis during World War II, and prisoners of war killed in 1941-1945 years buried in what is now Poland. ”

“The Polish side declares its readiness for joint actions that could be useful in bringing the Polish and Russian positions closer on memorial issues. The lack of an answer to our proposals on this issue of the Russian side is seen as yet another proof of the instrumental interpretation of history by our neighbors in favor of the current political need, ”the statement said.
Photos used:
Press Service of the Russian Embassy in Poland
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  1. fregina1
    fregina1 21 September 2015 09: 31 New
    +94
    I think the leadership of Russia should just be silent .... be silent on the proposal of local authorities at the location to demolish the memorial, in memory of the gop. the company of freaks led by the former president who did not reach Smolensk! And to demolish and forget everything ..... there were flying only enemies of Russia! if you say so! And plus to demolish a couple of tablets in Polish in the monastery of Nilova deserts! Where the same freaks in the 90s it was written how the Red Army tortured Polish officers !!! next to the way is a plate in Russian with such grammatical errors that it’s immediately clear - the Poles wrote! In general, as it is now fashionable to say a "symmetric" answer is NEEDED!
    1. vadson
      vadson 21 September 2015 09: 38 New
      +31
      you still need to erect a monument to the Smolensk birch on the border with Poland, even if heartburn come
      1. marlin1203
        marlin1203 21 September 2015 09: 43 New
        +23
        In addition to the "Home Army" (pro-Western), there was also the "Polish Army", which together with the Red Army beat the fascists. It is they, like their communist past, who are letting down, ashamed. Anyway, they "merged" completely in the XNUMXth century and buried their "Commonwealth" out of their own stupidity and aristocratic arrogance. What to expect from them now? ..
        1. Victor jnnjdfy
          Victor jnnjdfy 21 September 2015 10: 45 New
          +27
          Compare AK and the Polish Army is not entirely correct. In contrast to the Home Army, with the support of the USSR, the Ludov Army was created (on the basis of the battalion of cotton), which later became a full force in the Polish Army.
          General Chernyakhovsky, first of all, died during the liberation of Poland, in which among its citizens were not only anti-communists but also allies of the USSR. The general acted cruelly with opponents of the USSR. But he gave his life, including for the fact that the Poles re-formed the State.
          And about "amnesia" ... Before the Molotov-Ribbentorop Pact, there was the Pilsudski-Hitler Pact in 1934. In 1938 there was a partition of Czechoslovakia between Germany, Hungary and Poland (while the Poles entered Hitler’s region of Silesia before Hitler). The Poles have a very selective memory: “I remember, but I don’t remember ...” Before the war, the USSR tried to create a coalition against Nazi Germany. But Poland torpedoed these attempts and, in the end, paid for it herself.
          Well, let the Poles, intellectually (if they still have at least some kind of presence), and are offended, first of all, by themselves.
          1. kit-kat
            kit-kat 21 September 2015 11: 43 New
            +3
            That's right, it remains only for our leadership to realize all this and draw the appropriate conclusions and steps for soaking these scum in their own bowel movements. Zadolbali already recall the Molotov Pact. Our state needed it, that’s what we should all understand, and spit on the Poles.
      2. Proud.
        Proud. 21 September 2015 09: 53 New
        +4
        Quote: vadson
        you still need to erect a monument to the Smolensk birch on the border with Poland, even if heartburn come

        A natural monument of the Smolensk birch, hundreds of planted birches. For example, in the Kaliningrad region, near the Polish border.
    2. BilliBoms09
      BilliBoms09 21 September 2015 09: 40 New
      +10
      “The Polish Ministry of Foreign Affairs was deeply surprised by the statement made by the ambassador of the Russian Federation and the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the dismantling of the monument to General Chernyakhovsky in Penenezhno, as well as the statements of the press secretary of the Russian Foreign Ministry (Maria Zakharova)
      I do not incite, but it is interesting that the Poles will howl, if only a hint about the memorial in Katyn. what
      1. Baikonur
        Baikonur 21 September 2015 09: 44 New
        +5
        We won’t get to such blasphemy!
        You cannot be like barbaric barons!
        1. Aleksandr12
          Aleksandr12 21 September 2015 09: 56 New
          +22
          Why demolish a monument in Katyn? It is necessary to put a sign next to it explaining that this massacre - a provocation of the Nazis and the NKVD has nothing to do with this, and the Polish government in exile knew all this and still roll the barrel to the USSR.
          1. Serg 122
            Serg 122 21 September 2015 12: 44 New
            0
            Quote...
            Why demolish a monument in Katyn? It is necessary to put next to the plate with explanations

            I support. Moreover, in several languages: Polish, German and English. In large block letters write in a prominent place! hi
            1. proletarian
              proletarian 21 September 2015 23: 31 New
              0
              Indeed, why demolish the memorial in Katyn? You just need to change the "resolution", that is. this memorial is dedicated to the victims of Nazism (Polish soldiers "interned" in the USSR and destroyed by the Nazi invaders in the summer of 1941 in order to "discredit the USSR" and prevent the growth of the partisan movement in the occupied territories).
        2. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 10: 32 New
          -12
          Quote: Baikonur
          We won’t get to such blasphemy!

          and what blasphemy? Did they defile someone’s dust?
          1. proletarian
            proletarian 21 September 2015 23: 35 New
            0
            That's exactly what they desecrated; they desecrated the ashes of General Chernyakhovsky who died on the outskirts of this city when he was liberated from the Nazis, so say the ruin of graves is not sacrilege?
      2. Thronekeeper
        Thronekeeper 21 September 2015 10: 13 New
        +2
        Interrogators will be interrogated, somehow “Armata” and “Leopard-3” will meet with sabotage of Europe and trolling of Russia in Warsaw.
        And on the pedestal, instead of the T-34 dismantled last year, the T-90S will be installed
        1. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 12: 56 New
          +1
          Quote: Thronekeeper
          Interrogators will be interrogated, somehow “Armata” and “Leopard-3” will meet with sabotage of Europe and trolling of Russia in Warsaw.

          funny fantasy. European Tank Biathlon Championship, what?
        2. Bayonet
          Bayonet 21 September 2015 14: 33 New
          +1
          Quote: Thronekeeper
          will meet somehow “Armata” and “Leopard-3” in Warsaw.

          What a wild fantasy! Peace and rushing!
      3. Niki
        Niki 21 September 2015 10: 30 New
        +2
        and so they’re just speculating on this topic:
        memorial 1 - Katyn
        Memorial 2 - Smolensk

        So Smolensk birches could be an asymmetric answer
      4. vladimirw
        vladimirw 21 September 2015 13: 12 New
        +1
        Fight with monuments? No need to do how in the 90 years the monuments were demolished in Russia.
        do not be like filthy psheks and Baltic states. But as it was already in komenty- a plate next to write in Polish and Russian that it was the Nazis who shot the Poles. It's a good offer.
    3. Conductor
      Conductor 21 September 2015 09: 50 New
      -26
      Such a decision, of course, is stupidity on the part of Polish officials, but it is worth noting that they DEMONSTATE the monument with the possibility of transferring it to Russia:
      Katarzyna Pelchynska-Nalench: “As far as I know, there have been such proposals from the Russian side. There are no objections from our authorities, we are ready to hand over the monument to interested organizations. ”

      Katarzyna Pelczynska-Nalench: “We have 1875 cemeteries and burial places of Soviet and Russian soldiers. The Polish authorities provide them with proper care, including repair and reconstruction, quite a lot of money is spent on this. We believe that worthy burials are very important, that all these people should be surrounded by respect. ”

      But in Russia there are monuments to soldiers of the Craiova’s army?
      1. Oladushkin
        Oladushkin 21 September 2015 10: 04 New
        +21
        And what did this same Craiova army do to erect monuments to it? Raised a doomed uprising in Warsaw? Here it is necessary to erect monuments to Ludova’s army. This Red Army liberated Poland with them. And then, to be honest, they cherished the Poles, felt sorry, put them on secondary tasks as far as I know.
      2. Das Boot
        Das Boot 21 September 2015 10: 11 New
        +13
        Quote: Explorer
        But in Russia there are monuments to soldiers of the Craiova’s army?

        funny question. To commemorate what merits AK put monuments to her in Russia?
        1. DenZ
          DenZ 21 September 2015 10: 23 New
          +1
          Quote: Das Boot
          To commemorate what merits AK put monuments to her in Russia?

          A good question can a gentleman from the European Union answer him? Why do we need such monuments in Russia? Who will read them here? (and why).
        2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Dazdranagon
        Dazdranagon 21 September 2015 10: 52 New
        +7
        Quote: Explorer
        But in Russia there are monuments to soldiers of the Craiova’s army?
        - did the Poles die for the liberation of Russia?
        1. Oladushkin
          Oladushkin 21 September 2015 11: 17 New
          -7
          You will be surprised but dying.
          Now the wave will rise here :)
          I mention Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky. As far as I know, a pure Polish nobleman. As a result, everything that he did for Russia turned out. And do not say that he is "gebnya and bloody executioner." You can think of Kolchak and Denikin as liberals and democrats. So I see.
          1. Das Boot
            Das Boot 21 September 2015 11: 22 New
            +5
            Quote: Oladushkin
            You will be surprised but dying.
            .
            I mention Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky.


            sorry, and what side of the FED to the Craiova Army? You did not mix up timelines?
            Quote: Oladushkin
            And do not say that he is "gebnya and bloody executioner"

            O_o ...
            1. Oladushkin
              Oladushkin 21 September 2015 14: 33 New
              0
              It was about the Poles in general :)
              But you are right, the example is somewhat incorrect.
          2. DenZ
            DenZ 21 September 2015 11: 31 New
            0
            No, we won’t be surprised. In the context of news and discussion, we are talking about cases of hostilities. The example of Dzerzhinsky is inappropriate, since this is a specific person, a Pole (whose merits are known and significant) and not tens and hundreds of thousands of people. Dzerzhinsky died of a heart attack. So all this looks somewhat dubious before the merits of the soldiers of the Red Army and its generals.
          3. The comment was deleted.
          4. The comment was deleted.
          5. Karabanov
            Karabanov 21 September 2015 13: 04 New
            +2
            Quote: Oladushkin
            You will be surprised but dying.
            Now the wave will rise here :)
            I mention Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky. As far as I know, a pure Polish nobleman. As a result, everything that he did for Russia turned out.

            So monuments were erected to him. You at least see on Wikipedia how many of them in different cities you are trained! How many streets, squares are named after him! The only monument to rabid stupid people (such censorship is here) in the 91st on Lubyanka was demolished. So now the question of his return is being decided. And many only for!
            I’ll add that each employee of the internal affairs bodies considers it an honor to have a picture or a bust of Felix Edmundovich in his office.
            1. Das Boot
              Das Boot 21 September 2015 13: 24 New
              +2
              Quote: Karabanov
              I’ll add that each employee of the internal affairs bodies considers it an honor to have a picture or a bust of Felix Edmundovich in his office.

              I’ll add that each cultural worker considers it an honor to have a DVD with the series “Four Tankmen and a Dog”.
              Although this also has nothing to do with sabzh, it’s somehow closer than Dzerzhinsky or Marylya Rodovich ...
        2. Bayonet
          Bayonet 21 September 2015 14: 41 New
          +1
          Quote: Dazdranagon
          and the Poles were dying for the liberation of Russia?

          In the second half of 1943, the 1st Polish Division. Tadeusz Kosciuszko went to the front and on October 12, as part of the 33rd army, received baptism of fire under the Belarusian town of Lenino. In the very first battles, her soldiers and officers showed valor and courage. The death of the brave was then fought by the deputy commander of the battalion, Communist Roman Pazinsky, political officer, Mechislav Kalinovsky, gunner of a company of machine gunners, 19-year-old patriot Anelya Kzhivon and others. 253 people were awarded Soviet and Polish awards, and V. Vysotsky and Anela Kzhivon became Heroes of the Soviet Union.
      4. NyeMoNik70
        NyeMoNik70 21 September 2015 11: 19 New
        +1
        "and in Russia there are monuments to soldiers of the Craiova’s army?" What are they supposed to do there? Killers, sadists, perverts, a hotbed of Judas and apostates. Betrayal in the genes. They smoked and watched the destruction of the Warsaw ghetto. With pleasure they destroyed everyone and everything, a petty, degenerate abomination, generously seasoned with Catholic and Jesuit heresies. And our fighters deserve these monuments and pedestals. They should Poland. Due to its existence.
      5. corn
        corn 21 September 2015 11: 39 New
        +1
        Quote: Explorer
        But in Russia there are monuments to soldiers of the Craiova’s army?

        And on the territory of Russia, the soldiers of the Craiova’s army took part in the hostilities?
        1. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 12: 07 New
          0
          Quote: corn
          Quote: Explorer
          But in Russia there are monuments to soldiers of the Craiova’s army?

          And on the territory of Russia, the soldiers of the Craiova’s army took part in the hostilities?

          Nope. But after the capture of Vilnius, Chernyakhovsky arrested AK commanders and part of the Akovites who refused to join the Ludov Army were taken to Kaluga. Those who did not take the oath fell down the forest until the 46-47th years.
          Maybe put monuments to them? laughing
      6. corn
        corn 21 September 2015 11: 43 New
        -1
        Quote: Explorer
        they are DISMANTLING a monument with the possibility of transferring it to Russia:

        As far as I am aware, instead of the word “transfer”, the words “sales for 18000 euros” should
      7. kit-kat
        kit-kat 21 September 2015 11: 45 New
        +1
        And what AK fought in Russia (USSR)? Liberated the USSR? With what fright should they erect monuments? There are cases when these wars attacked our soldiers and shot them.
      8. Doomph
        Doomph 21 September 2015 12: 12 New
        -2
        So these aniki warriors didn’t seem to die with us, Thank God!
      9. v1047883
        v1047883 21 September 2015 13: 34 New
        0
        What a fright !!!? They freed us from the Nazis !!!!
        1. Oladushkin
          Oladushkin 21 September 2015 14: 44 New
          +1
          Army Craiova with fugitive Polish bourgeois rulers from London liberated the USSR?
          Dear, you are confusing something.
          The Krai Army is at best a battle group of 10-15 battalions of Polish paratroopers. It was if the garbage of the special services of British politicians and corrupt Polish politicians who, for the sake of their interests, used Polish volunteers, paratroopers, I think "in the dark."
          Why do you think the Warsaw uprising began long before the Red Army could really support it? This was done with the goal of "preventing Bolshevism from entering Warsaw."
          And only when the Nazis pinched the paratroopers tail, then the Poles from London screamed, and save, help. Because of this, the offensive of the Red Army that had ended had to be continued WITHOUT NORMAL SECURITY;
          Result? Please - A lot of peaceful citizens of Poland were killed. In Warsaw, fascists from punitive battalions, the Red Army suffered heavy losses in fact, unjustified. Another breakthrough of the Craiova Army. And this, by the way, is almost a Bandera formation, for that matter.
    4. Now we are free
      Now we are free 21 September 2015 09: 58 New
      +23
      Warsaw considers “unacceptable and completely unfounded the allegations of the allegedly historical amnesia of the Polish authorities and the formation of the soil for the revival of Nazism, which were made on September 17 on the 76th anniversary of the Soviet attack on Poland, based on a secret protocol between the authorities of two totalitarian regimes - the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany. ”

      Come on, Psheki tell us how you absolutely legally and democratically shared Czechoslovakia with the Wehrmacht in 1938? Operation Zaluzhie ... Does Panova not tell you anything? ..

      The division and destruction of Czechoslovakia as an independent state with the participation of Germany, Hungary and Poland in 1938-1939 were not included in the official history of World War II. How did you behave the “victim” of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact one year before the “official” start of World War II. Take a look at the photo, they, unlike the Official Warsaw, will not lie ...

      Photo 1. Polish soldiers pose with the Czechoslovak coat of arms deposed near the telephone and telegraph building they seized during Operation Zaluzhe in the Czech village of Ligotka Kameralna-Polish, Komorní Lhotka-Czech., Located near the town of Tesin.
      1. Now we are free
        Now we are free 21 September 2015 10: 00 New
        +12
        Photo 2.
        Handshake of Polish Marshal Edward Rydz-Smiglá and German Attache Colonel Bogislaw von Studnitz at the Independence Day parade in Warsaw on November 11 1938 of the year. The photograph is notable for the fact that the Polish parade was especially tied to the capture of Tesinska Silesia a month earlier.
        1. Now we are free
          Now we are free 21 September 2015 10: 01 New
          +11
          Photo 3.
          Polish troops occupy the Czech city of Karvin during Operation Zaluzhie. The Polish part of the population meets troops with flowers. October 1938
          (Pay attention to the helmets of the Polish cavalrymen ...)
          1. Now we are free
            Now we are free 21 September 2015 10: 09 New
            +18
            Photo 4. As they say without comment ...

            “Without questioning the role of General Chernyakhovsky in the war against the Third Reich, we should not forget that he was responsible and took an active part in the elimination of the Polish underground - the Craiova Army”

            Ivan Danilovich Chernyakhovsky had to not only not help the beginning of the “Pro-Soviet uprising”, the uprising of the army of Radova and generally to bypass Warsaw (as well as the whole of Poland) by leaving it under the “Third Reich” as seen in the photo Psheks would perfectly live under the Hitlerites. Recently, I catch myself on the strange thought that I have more respect for the Germans than for the "Allies" and, in general, the Slavs Poles ...
            1. brelok
              brelok 21 September 2015 10: 43 New
              +6
              Quote: Now we are free
              that the Germans have a lot more respect than the "Allies" and generally the Slavs Poles ...

              I have the same opinion! Everything was fair with the Germans. Unlike "allies"
            2. alecsis69
              alecsis69 21 September 2015 13: 29 New
              0
              Here, and in the 39th, the Soviet army simply entered the Curzon line, that is, this territory should already belong to Soviet Russia.
          2. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 10: 27 New
          -9
          Quote: Now we are free
          Handshake of the Polish Marshal Edward Rydz-Smigly and the German attache Colonel Bogislaw von Studnitz

          Well? But under the cold little Zhiguli ...
          1. Now we are free
            Now we are free 21 September 2015 11: 22 New
            +5
            Guten Tag, Das Boot hi
            Quote: Das Boot
            Well? But under the cold little Zhiguli ...


            Na und? It was about the cries of the Poles that the Red Army (represented by Chernyakhovsky) did not help them during the Craiova uprising in Warsaw. For which, in fact, they demolish a monument to him ... I have given photos of quite friendly business relations between the Polish military and the Wehrmacht during the annexation and partition of Czechoslovakia. Brest, the Lithuanian world, as well as the joint parade of the Wehrmacht and the Red Army in Russia, in contrast to the Poles, do not deny the "victims" of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact. This story was sewn and it is better to recognize it and not deny the system of itself "Historically innocent int ... u."
            1. Das Boot
              Das Boot 21 September 2015 11: 58 New
              +4
              Quote: Now we are free
              This story was sewn and it is better to recognize it and not deny the system of itself "Historically innocent int ... u."

              it's hard to disagree with this, comrade. But, I think, this should be attributed not only to the Poles, but also to some of our indefatigable common people who invent all kinds of euphemisms regarding the MR pact and do not recognize the obvious: we tearing Poland together with the Wehrmacht. And for me, is it time to stop flirting - was the USSR an aggressor against Poland, the Baltic states and Finland? Well there was. So, what is next? So call Akhedzhakova, let him repent, but we, by and large, have nothing to repent of. They wanted a titan like the USSR to have the habits of a puberty gymnasium? Schyas. By the way, this also applies to the present.
              1. BIGLESHIY
                BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 12: 46 New
                0
                Quote: Das Boot
                We razderbanili together with the Wehrmacht. And for me, is it time to stop flirting - was the USSR an aggressor against Poland, the Baltic states and Finland?

                And when did the Wehrmacht enter Poland? And when do you know the USSR? If we had acted together, we would have entered one day. Well, in extreme cases, one two days later.
                And do not forget that we regained our lands. The Baltic states were also our land. So, we returned our lands under our jurisdiction.
                With Finland, it was much more complicated. To move the border away from Leningrad, we offered the Finns a territory much larger than we wanted to take, but the Finns settled down in the end, which is what happened.
                1. Das Boot
                  Das Boot 21 September 2015 13: 16 New
                  +1
                  Quote: BIGLESHIY
                  And do not forget that we regained our lands ... So that we returned our lands under our jurisdiction.

                  Have you heard about the Riga Treaty? I understand, of course, that I do not care about this treaty, as well as the non-aggression treaty of 1932. In my comment I said this: don’t hell with varnish and add whiteness and fluffy - they took revenge for the 1920-wide campaign spread by Tukh. And if it weren’t for the Weiss plan, they would not have entered the Curzon line.
                  1. BIGLESHIY
                    BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 15: 06 New
                    0
                    Quote: Das Boot

                    Have you heard about the Riga Treaty? I understand, of course, that I do not care about this treaty, as well as the non-aggression treaty of 1932. In my comment I said this: don’t hell with varnish and add whiteness and fluffy - they took revenge for the 1920-wide campaign spread by Tukh. And if it weren’t for the Weiss plan, they would not have entered the Curzon line.

                    not a big digression into history:
                    Riga Peace Treaty 1921
                    - signed 18. I II, after the end of the Polish-Soviet war of 1919-20.

                    Attacks of Polish troops on Soviet territory took place throughout 1918. In the spring of 1919, Poland, supported by the countries of the Entente, launched an offensive deep into Soviet territory. In an effort to peace, the Soviet government repeatedly invited Poland to start negotiations on a cessation of hostilities, but the Pilsudski government (see) left all the peace proposals of the RSFSR government unanswered.

                    2. II 1920 The All-Russian Central Executive Committee directly addressed the Polish people with an appeal "to abandon distrust of the Russian working people, to end the bloody war ..." 4. II the Polish government announced its intention to respond to Soviet proposals, but, delaying the start of peace negotiations , conducted intensive preparations for the offensive. When this preparation was completed, the Poles proposed (27. III 1920) to begin negotiations in the front-line city of Borisov, subject to the conclusion of a cease-fire only on a front section adjacent to the city. The trick was hidden in these proposals: preparing for an attack on Belarus, the Polish military sought to stop the supply of reinforcements to the Soviet troops and weaken their positions in the Borisov area.

                    The People's Commissariat of Foreign Affairs proposed that the Polish government conclude a ceasefire on the entire front and negotiate either in some neutral state, or in Moscow, Petrograd or Warsaw.

                    The Polish government responded to these proposals with an ultimatum statement that negotiations could only take place in Borisov, or they would not take place at all. Having thus broken negotiations, the Poles 25. IV launched a new offensive. However, the Red Army repelled the Polish offensive and then launched a counterattack, which soon led to a decisive defeat of the White Poles and to the deep penetration of the Red Army into Poland. The situation has changed radically. The leaders of the Entente powers, who were at the conference in Spa (5-16. VII) at that time, decided to intervene in order to give Poland the opportunity to gain time and strengthen its army.
                    1. BIGLESHIY
                      BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 15: 08 New
                      0
                      12. VII 1920 the British Foreign Minister, Lord Curzon, proposed Soviet mediation to conclude a truce with Poland and demanded that the Red Army be stopped on the line proposed by the Supreme Council of the Entente in 1919 as the eastern border of Poland (see Curzon line).

                      The Soviet government agreed to negotiate only directly with Poland (note from 17. VII). Curzon replied that he did not insist on mediation; Following this statement by the English minister, a request from the Polish government for a truce was received. At the same time, the governments of England and France sent a mission to Warsaw to assist Poland and expedited the supply of arms to it. The mission included British and French officers (including Weygand and de Gaulle), who took control of the Polish army. Encouraged by the support of the Entente, the Polish government was no longer in a hurry to resume negotiations, and the Polish delegation, which arrived 1. VIII in Baranavichy, was left without the authority to negotiate.

                      In the meantime, the Red Army's offensive against Warsaw began to develop successfully. 3. VIII Curzon addressed a harsh note to the Soviet government, demanding an end to the offensive and threatening intervention. 4. VIII British Prime Minister Lloyd George told the Soviet representative in London, LB Krasin, that if peace talks were not started, the English fleet would support Poland. Despite all these threats, the Soviet government replied that it did not want England to mediate, but was still ready to negotiate with Poland.

                      7. VIII The Polish government announced its readiness to begin negotiations, but in fact delayed their opening for a few more days, ending the regrouping of its troops and the supply of reserves. Only having gone over to the counterattack organized with the help of England and France, Poland began on 17. VIII 1920 negotiations in Minsk. The Soviet delegation put forward conditions for a peace treaty that were honorable for Poland, agreeing to deviations from the Curzon line (in the region of Kholm and Bialystok) in favor of Poland. But now the powers of the Entente no longer rushed the Poles with the conclusion of peace. France even insisted on ending the negotiations and continuing the war. England and Italy intervened in the negotiations and demanded that the Soviet government reject some of its proposals. 25. IX 1920 The All-Russian Central Executive Committee turned to Poland with new proposals containing a number of concessions.
                      1. BIGLESHIY
                        BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 15: 16 New
                        0
                        Despite temporary success, Poland was exhausted. The Polish government agreed to resume negotiations, and 12. X signed the preliminary terms of the peace treaty. The hostilities ceased 18. X. After 5 months of negotiations, R.M.

                        A border was established along R.M.P. that transferred Western Ukraine and Western Belarus to Poland (Article 2).

                        Both sides mutually refused to interfere in the internal affairs of the other side, from hostile propaganda and pledged to prevent the formation of terrorist organizations on their territory whose activities are directed against the other side. (The reactionary Polish government never fulfilled this obligation and systematically transferred armed gangs and saboteurs to Soviet territory.)

                        Art. 7 R.M.D. obliged to grant broad rights to national minorities located in both countries: Ukrainians and Belarusians - in Poland and Poles - in Soviet Russia; however, until their liberation in September 1939, Belorussians and Ukrainians in Pan Poland were subjected to national oppression and forcible poling. Both parties mutually refused the claim for reimbursement of expenses and losses associated with the conduct of the war between them (Article 8). All works of art belonging to Poland and evacuated to the east during World War 1914–18 returned to Poland (Article 11).

                        Diplomatic relations between the two countries were established immediately after the signing of the R.M. p. (Article 24).

                        R.M.D.was valid until 17. IX. 1939, when in connection with the collapse of the Polish state by the Soviet government, all treaties and agreements concluded with Poland were canceled. Western Ukraine and Western Belarus in accordance with the will of the population of these regions became part of the Soviet Union.

                        So there is no need to demonize us.
                        WE RUSSIANS COME FOR DEBT !!!Please pay. angry
                        And do not give the Poles fluffy, as Churchill said: - "Poland is the hyena of Europe."
                      2. Das Boot
                        Das Boot 21 September 2015 16: 17 New
                        +1
                        Quote: BIGLESHIY
                        WE RUSSIANS COME FOR DEBT !!!

                        which ones are they for? 30 million gold compensation, 18 million indemnities, valuables exported from Poland after January 1, 1772 and subject to return? De jure The world of Riga freed Poland altogether from any debts and obligations to the former RI.
                        Quote: BIGLESHIY
                        So there is no need to demonize us.

                        Yes, calm down, no one is demonizing. Everything is fine, our Wehrmacht "Give Warsaw !!!" put into practice, and we were content with Brest for this matter. And in Tehran and Crimea, Curzon was commemorated for the last and final time. Your pathos capsules are not entirely clear.
                  2. Das Boot
                    Das Boot 21 September 2015 18: 19 New
                    +1
                    Quote: BIGLESHIY
                    not a big digression into history:
                    Riga Peace Treaty 1921
                    - signed 18. I II, after the end of the Polish-Soviet war of 1919-20.

                    Attacks of the Polish forces on the council


                    figase - "small" ... You, by the hour, will not be from the lecturers of the "Knowledge - power and dream" society?
            2. SPLV
              SPLV 21 September 2015 13: 41 New
              +1
              Quote: Das Boot
              Was the USSR an aggressor against Poland, the Baltic states and Finland?

              I dare to recall that at that time the listed state entities had a very short history of independence compared to the time they were part of the Russian Empire. So I could assume that then it was a struggle against separatists and the restoration of Russia's own statehood.
              Poland: from 1815 to 1918 - RI (103 of the year), 1918-1939 - independent (21 of the year)
              Finland: from 1809 to 1918 - RI (109 years), 1918-1940 - independent (22 years)
              The Baltic states were in RI for another hundred years longer.
              1. Das Boot
                Das Boot 21 September 2015 14: 18 New
                +1
                Quote: SPLV
                I dare to recall that at that time the listed state entities had a very short history of independence compared to the time they were part of the Russian Empire. So I could assume that then it was a struggle against separatists and the restoration of Russia's own statehood.

                hurt yourself. And I could assume that you pulled your assumption by the ears. But "separatism" sounds quite opportunistic and in the spirit of the times laughing

                Well, the darling Adik simply wanted to correct the Versailles misunderstanding and return Schleswig, Prussia, Silesia, etc. It is too
                Quote: SPLV
                restoration of own statehood
                Germany. Desire is appropriate, but without war there is no way. Separatists - they are stubborn.
            3. Bayonet
              Bayonet 21 September 2015 14: 54 New
              +1
              Quote: Das Boot
              We razderbanili together with the Wehrmacht.

              The thing is done, you can comrade and smoke.
              1. Das Boot
                Das Boot 21 September 2015 15: 15 New
                +1
                Quote: Bayonet
                The thing is done, you can comrade and smoke.

                But...
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. Aleksander
            Aleksander 21 September 2015 12: 02 New
            +2
            Quote: Now we are free
            It was about the cries of the Poles regarding the fact that the Red Army (represented by Chernyakhovsky) did not help them during the Craiova uprising in Warsaw


            No, the Poles mean the assault on Vilnius, when the few AK detachments clung to the storming Soviet troops of Chernyakhovsky and supposedly also liberated the city, trying to declare themselves to be the current official authorities. After that, they were naturally interned and disarmed by the NKVD. Churchill, by the way, sharply condemned the actions of the Poles in Soviet territory. These are the Poles and cannot forgive the general.
            1. Das Boot
              Das Boot 21 September 2015 12: 29 New
              +1
              Quote: Aleksander
              No, the Poles mean the assault on Vilnius, when the few AK detachments clung to the storming Soviet troops of Chernyakhovsky and supposedly also liberated the city, trying to declare themselves to be the current official authorities.

              well, at first AK tried to storm the city on its own, even the day of the storm was postponed, although the defenders Germans tripled them. In general, I would put “the storming of Vilnius by the Army of the Craiova” next to the well-known myth of “zholner with sabers against armor in 1939” laughing The same garbage: AK partisans with small arms against four dozen tanks and self-propelled guns, 270 guns and even one armored train))
              TPC that, I think, Vilnius took 3 BF, not Pshek))
        4. The comment was deleted.
        5. Mig 31
          Mig 31 21 September 2015 23: 28 New
          0
          It’s interesting, what do you want to say by this? You are a Cossack mishandled !!
    5. The comment was deleted.
    6. Corporal Valera
      Corporal Valera 21 September 2015 10: 23 New
      +15
      I would also like to hear an explanation on the highlighted. When it is claimed that "the USSR attacked Poland," what is meant by Poland? If geo-referenced, then how can you attack the terrain? You can take it, log in, etc. If Poland is meant as a sovereign state, then again there is a disagreement. The state is, roughly speaking, an organization of political power that manages society on a specific territory. Where was the "political power of Poland" at the time of the "attack of the USSR"? And she was already ten days in London! Therefore, it is not possible to talk about Poland as a state. So it was, after all, an uncontrolled territory along which a probable enemy was moving towards the USSR border. That says it all! So, ladies and gentlemen, all complaints to your heroic government, and to the brave Marshal Rydz-Smigly personally! If the testicles have not grown, then do not brow to the bridge of the nose
  2. meriem1
    meriem1 21 September 2015 09: 59 New
    +4
    The answer is symmetric !!! ??? Rather than WE will be likened. Kam ??? Anyone who has forgotten his story, she will certainly slap on the dark! Just laughter. Inglourious nerds will always TRY to stir up the Bear. They are just waiting for a reaction from us. But I hope they will not wait
    P.S .... Chernyakhovsky gave his life for the Motherland. And for them. But they don’t understand this. Not a grateful tribe. They will soon be cleaning Bandera’s boots ......
  3. WKS
    WKS 21 September 2015 10: 22 New
    0
    Quote: fregina1
    I think the leadership of Russia should just be silent .... be silent on the proposal of local authorities at the location to demolish the memorial, in memory of the gop. the company of freaks led by the former president who did not reach Smolensk! And to demolish and forget everything ..... there were flying only enemies of Russia! if you say so! And plus to demolish a couple of tablets in Polish in the monastery of Nilova deserts! Where the same freaks in the 90s it was written how the Red Army tortured Polish officers !!! next to the way is a plate in Russian with such grammatical errors that it’s immediately clear - the Poles wrote! In general, as it is now fashionable to say a "symmetric" answer is NEEDED!
    Why be like wretched freaks fighting the dead and monuments. The Russian political leadership will never stoop to such a thing.
    1. Das Boot
      Das Boot 21 September 2015 15: 40 New
      +1
      Quote: wks
      Russian political leadership

      funny phrase. Neighing.
      Quote: wks
      never be humbled to that.

      the pepper is clear: he has begun the phase of installation of monuments. Then the pendulum swings - they will clean. Predictably bored.
  4. Vend
    Vend 21 September 2015 10: 40 New
    +1
    Quote: fregina1
    In general, as it is now fashionable to say a "symmetric" answer is NEEDED!

    Do not be like inadequacies. I think enough will be the monuments to defeat the Poles during their war with Russia. This is the answer you need.
  5. lelikas
    lelikas 21 September 2015 10: 44 New
    +8
    Quote: fregina1
    .there flew some enemies of Russia! if you say so!

    It is a pity that more than one plus point is not put.
    The plot for the monument -
    1. pilot8878
      pilot8878 21 September 2015 12: 28 New
      -1
      Quote: lelikas
      The plot for the monument -

      Ay thanks !!! Great photo!!! It’s a pity, more times it is not plus!
      1. zubkoff46
        zubkoff46 21 September 2015 13: 07 New
        -1
        And Lavrenty Pavlovich is so prudent! With a hatchet, however. Well done!
  6. INVESTOR
    INVESTOR 21 September 2015 10: 59 New
    0
    White birch under my window))
  7. Sweles
    Sweles 21 September 2015 11: 34 New
    -1
    the Poles decided to buy weapons for 40 mln.-everything is being prepared for war, the Amer’s aegis is in Poland, now the monuments are being demolished, I won’t forget how the Poles -fights fought with our fans at the World Cup are real enemies ...
  8. g1v2
    g1v2 21 September 2015 13: 05 New
    0
    Or maybe an ultimatum? If the Poles continue to carry monuments to our heroes, we demolish the memorial in Katyn, asphalt and make parking there. Yes, in Poland there are still many of our monuments and the Poles will demolish them then, but in fact this is happening, but gradually.
    1. builder
      builder 21 September 2015 13: 20 New
      +1
      To fight with monuments and cemeteries is the destiny of the wretched.
  • avg
    avg 21 September 2015 09: 31 New
    +15
    It is necessary to reconsider the question of installing a monument to the victims of the crash near Smolensk, until they return the monument to Chernyakhovsky.
    1. afdjhbn67
      afdjhbn67 21 September 2015 09: 41 New
      +6
      Of course they’ll be surprised at what, they spit in the whole country .. fucking holes
      1. jjj
        jjj 21 September 2015 09: 46 New
        0
        And it will pass, as one wisdom says
  • aleks 62 next
    aleks 62 next 21 September 2015 09: 32 New
    +8
    ...... Poland is surprised by the protests of Russia in connection with the dismantling of the monument to Chernikhovsky ...

    .... I think they need to prepare to be surprised in the near future by the price of gas ..... lol
    1. Das Boot
      Das Boot 21 September 2015 11: 06 New
      -2
      Quote: aleks 62 next
      .I think they need to prepare to be surprised in the near future by the price of gas .....

      aerobatics of diplomacy - twist the valve back and forth? Guys, you can’t wander around Europe with a gas bottle and crucify about your greatness. Maybe we’ll try differently?
      1. BIGLESHIY
        BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 12: 49 New
        0
        Quote: Das Boot
        Quote: aleks 62 next
        .I think they need to prepare to be surprised in the near future by the price of gas .....

        aerobatics of diplomacy - twist the valve back and forth? Guys, you can’t wander around Europe with a gas bottle and crucify about your greatness. Maybe we’ll try differently?

        And let, let us return that part of East Prussia that the USSR gave them.
      2. zubkoff46
        zubkoff46 21 September 2015 13: 09 New
        +1
        And why not with a balloon, if they don’t want to understand in a different way ... Our balloon, wherever I want, goes there.
      3. aleks 62 next
        aleks 62 next 21 September 2015 13: 33 New
        0
        .... aerobatics of diplomacy - to twist the valve back and forth? Guys, you can’t wander around Europe with a gas bottle and crucify about your greatness. Maybe we’ll try differently? ...

        .... Well, if there is a valve .... Why not ???? .... I am 100% sure that if pshek had such a valve, then they would have used it for a long time .... request.... Do you think it is better to answer monuments (for example, in Katyn) to blame ???? ....
        1. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 14: 54 New
          0
          Quote: aleks 62 next
          .... Well, if there is a valve .... Why not ????

          really. And then we crucify about the depravity of the commodity economy. But it turns out that the manager from the Diamond Hand is our everything.
          Quote: aleks 62 next
          I am 100% sure that if pshek had such a valve, then they would

          if everyone had a valve, a crane, a piece of black soil the size of Ukraine - you look, and there was nothing to talk about. Boredom. No wars, no refugees, no quotes in the morning. On TV World Cup Curling and TV shows ...
      4. Bayonet
        Bayonet 21 September 2015 15: 03 New
        0
        Quote: Das Boot
        Guys, you can’t wander around Europe with a gas bottle and crucify about your greatness. Maybe we’ll try differently?

        I fully support! hi To dabble with the valve, it's childish like that. Yes, and do not forget that from this valve money goes to our treasury.
        1. talot
          talot 23 September 2015 08: 05 New
          0
          Put a minus since I think that in such matters it’s not worth lingering. Americans unleashed a whole war for their own interests, and we are only engaged in verbiage even in such matters as the desecration of monuments to our soldiers, not to mention the generals, etc. We are witnessing a new round of eradicating the history of Russians in "Europe", and we only , sorry, in the "basin wash farts." After ... twenty years, Europe will declare that Russia and its tracks have never been to Europe, and it will be too late for us to do anything about it, because there are no monuments left.
  • Rurikovich
    Rurikovich 21 September 2015 09: 34 New
    +19
    Rinsing in dirty laundry will begin now .. what
    My personal opinion is to do as in diplomacy, so that the opponent understands that his actions will be opposed. After all, they respond to the expulsion of one diplomat with the expulsion of another. They removed a monument with their own motives - to take and demolish an analogous one. With their own motives. As you are, so is you. Near Smolensk won the monument to Kachinsky ... And why did he deserve this? By pouring dirt on us? Enough and a small tablet ...
    It's my personal opinion. And then the "partners" begin to crap even in memory ... hi
    1. builder
      builder 21 September 2015 13: 27 New
      +1
      How we will differ from the "partners". Not the same as Russia to the Poles and other pro-bomber is likened!
      1. Rurikovich
        Rurikovich 21 September 2015 15: 26 New
        +1
        Quote: stroitel
        How we will differ from the "partners". Not the same as Russia to the Poles and other pro-bomber is likened!

        Those. offer after hitting the cheek to substitute the second? And while still a voluptuous sigh ?? Then we will not be considered for people at all, and wiping our feet in a compartment with delicious spits in our faces will become the norm request what
        They will be respected by the only strong, able to defend their opinion, the right and, if necessary, to give back. Otherwise, with the Anglo-Saxons and their mongrel like Poland, the Baltic states and other rot can not be !! hi Having succumbed, do not expect that you will not be hit or bit in the second wink
        1. builder
          builder 21 September 2015 18: 38 New
          0
          Well, not to fight with the monuments! A great country and methods should not be small.
      2. talot
        talot 23 September 2015 08: 34 New
        0
        It is not good to defend the honor and dignity of one's own and one's own state. We can buy all the monuments, and in return, symmetrically increase gas prices, etc., taking into account all the costs of dismantling, transportation, installing the monument in a new place. And with the obligatory mention on the monument itself about where, when, to whom, etc. it was installed and under what circumstances was taken to a new place.
  • Roman1970
    Roman1970 21 September 2015 09: 34 New
    +6
    “Without questioning the role of General Chernyakhovsky in the war against the Third Reich, we should not forget that he was responsible and took an active part in the elimination of the Polish underground - the Craiova Army”
    These same “AKovtsy” were still abomination. This "underground" must be hung on birches ... Normal Poles, by the way, fought along with the Red Army, as part of the division to them. Tadeusz Kosciuszko ...
  • tlauicol
    tlauicol 21 September 2015 09: 35 New
    0
    correct the surname in the table of contents
  • bmv04636
    bmv04636 21 September 2015 09: 35 New
    +8
    So we erected a memorial in Katyn, but wasn’t it time in Poland in Krakow to establish our memorial? The Russian Military Historical Society (RVIO) not so long ago turned to the Polish side with a proposal to erect a monument on the territory of Poland to the Red Army soldiers who were tortured in Polish concentration camps during the Soviet years of the Polish war of 1919-1920. RVIO organized a fundraiser for the creation of such a monument and proposed to install it in Krakow at the Rakovitsky cemetery, where thousands of Red Army soldiers are buried in common graves.
    And the German lands donated to Stalin's psheks are not shaking the question. And isn’t it time for the Psheks to return the Germans to their historical homeland (East Prussia deported after 45 years about 4 million)
    1. Altona
      Altona 21 September 2015 09: 44 New
      +2
      Quote: bmv04636
      And the German lands donated to Stalin's psheks are not shaking the question. And isn’t it time for the Psheks to return the Germans to their historical homeland (East Prussia deported after 45 years about 4 million)

      ------------------------
      Poland, in general, is also an artificial state created by Stalin and Churchill ... Is it time to establish the Fourth Partition of Poland?
      1. V.ic
        V.ic 21 September 2015 10: 29 New
        +1
        Quote: Altona
        Is it time to establish the Fourth Partition of Poland?

        ...FIFTH...
      2. Das Boot
        Das Boot 21 September 2015 11: 18 New
        -1
        Quote: Altona
        Poland, in general, is also an artificial state created by Stalin and Churchill ..

        what's the difference - artificial or not? Interesting Darwinism, of course, but - what's the difference now?
  • Severomor
    Severomor 21 September 2015 09: 35 New
    +6
    USSR attacks on Poland, based on a secret protocol between the authorities of two totalitarian regimes


    What a syllable, it immediately became terrible and scary.

    And who saw this "secret" protocol? Probably in a secret safe in a secret territory in a secret room. Somewhere between Lake Baikal and the Arctic Ocean.
    1. Das Boot
      Das Boot 21 September 2015 12: 44 New
      0
      Quote: Severomor
      And who saw this "secret" protocol?

      laughing
      1. BIGLESHIY
        BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 13: 23 New
        +2
        You can wipe the 5th point with this piece of paper.
        the Molotov-Ribbentrop Act is a non-aggression treaty between the Soviet Union and Germany of August 23, 1939 [1]. This treaty itself does not contain anything special, but in the late forties in Washington at the end of the forties there suddenly appeared a “Secret Additional Protocol” to this treaty, published in the American collection Nazi-Soviet Relations 1939–1941. Washington, 1948 (Nazi-Soviet relations 1939-1941. Washington, 1948). This publication had no sources, but the United States is an uncivilized country, you can publish anything there: it is not a matter of sources or truth, but just dollars or politics. The mentioned publication is the only blind source of the “Secret Additional Protocol” blatantly blotted out by the American stunners, probably from the special services. Everything else, even with links to archives, is a lie.

        It is not clear how a “lexical examination” of a document with gross grammatical errors, “lexical”, for example, “by both sides” could pass, and this expression appears three times in the text. Even a schoolboy would have noticed this mistake: on both sides. We can hardly find at least one document of the highest state power with such a gross grammatical error. There are other errors, such as “delimiting”, with the letter “Z” attributed to the ink above. This, of course, is also absurd: there is probably no other document with a corrected grammatical error.
        1. BIGLESHIY
          BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 13: 25 New
          +3
          Gross grammatical errors should also include spelling instability, which is characteristic of semi-illiterate people: the Baltic States and two times the Polish State. In addition, neither the first spelling with a capital letter, "Baltic", nor the second, "State", does not comply with the norms of the Russian language. Try to find at least one literate text in Russian, which would even say, for example, “European states” instead of the usual European states, not to mention the word “State”. By the way, the English text of this protocol published on the Internet contains the indicated spelling instability: “Baltic States” versus “Polish state” [2]. This is an American darling: the name United States (United States) must, of course, be written in capital letters, but in general the word state (state) is written, of course, with a lowercase letter. In other words, the name United States is capitalized only because it is its own. The name Baltic states is not proper. Americans write all names and their derivatives in capital letters, for example Russians (Russians), but with us this is possible only if this is a proper name, subject, for example, Russian state, i.e., translating into the American way, defined in sense of the article. In the plural, the definite article is usually not used, for example, the combination of American states in Russian must be written with lowercase letters. This will correspond to the American indefinite article, i.e. the name is not objective, common, as a combination of the Baltic states. Certainty in this combination, the capital letter, would have arisen, for example, in the agreement of the three Baltic states with Russia.

          Total in the text of the protocol five grammatical errors on one page. Well, and what unfortunate person did “lexical examination”? This semi-literate daub could not stand the criticism even of a school teacher of the Russian language.
          1. BIGLESHIY
            BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 13: 26 New
            +2
            Another gross mistake of the falsifiers is that in office work the signature stamp of a document cannot be put out in its heading: “Secret Additional Protocol”. In addition, the essence of the document should be reflected in the title: an additional protocol to what? This is an extremely ignorant person who did not have any idea about office work. And to take this nonsense seriously could only individuals as mentally retarded as the falsifier

            There is a gross factual mistake in the document - the assignment of Finland to the Baltic states: “In the case of the territorial and political reorganization of the regions that make up the Baltic states (Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania) ...” - Not a single person in the USSR, not even Russian, I just couldn’t write this nonsense, and will we have the most important state documents with factual errors? For Russians, Finland is not a Baltic state - neither Poland, nor Germany, nor Denmark, nor Sweden is it. Again ignorant American daub. “What people don’t even know geography?” - “But we do business well ...”
            1. BIGLESHIY
              BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 13: 31 New
              +3
              Pay attention to the complete nonsense: "along the rivers of Narew, Vistula and Sana'a." Alas, in nature there are no Narew and Sana rivers - there are Narew and San rivers. This error was caused by the letter “Y” in the word “Vistula” that was poorly printed in the American copy and, of course, by the fierce ignorance of the falsifier of the “preserved typewritten copy” that was not joint with the Foreign Ministry service:

              Notice the remnants of the letter Y in the word "Hang?", And not the letter A, i.e. it is written correctly, albeit clumsily stylistically: “along the lines of the Narew, Vistula and San rivers” (usually in such cases the nominative case is used). Consequently, the supposedly “preserved typewritten copy” contains a stupid conjecture based both on a misunderstanding of the text of the American photocopy due to poor printing and on the ignorance of the falsifier of the “preserved typewritten copy”. It is clear that the source of the “preserved typewritten copy” was a photocopy from an American publication. Or, perhaps, the NKID of the USSR, headed by Molotov, who allegedly made up the “Secret Additional Protocol”, did not know what the rivers are called in Poland? It is unlikely.
        2. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 13: 51 New
          +1
          Quote: BIGLESHIY
          You can wipe the 5th point with this piece of paper.

          firstly, not ham.
          secondly, most of them have long given a damn whether there was a joint venture or not. This apocrypha has rather metaphorical meaning.
          1. BIGLESHIY
            BIGLESHIY 21 September 2015 15: 26 New
            0
            Quote: Das Boot
            Quote: BIGLESHIY
            You can wipe the 5th point with this piece of paper.

            firstly, not ham.

            Are we with you already?
            Before putting up a corrective linden, first of all, ask where is it from? By the way, quite recently on one television channel (unfortunately I do not remember which one) there was information about this libel where everything was sorted out.
            1. Das Boot
              Das Boot 21 September 2015 15: 53 New
              -1
              Quote: BIGLESHIY
              e (unfortunately I don’t remember which one) there was information about this libel where everything was laid out on the shelves.

              So what? Suppose someone is interested in analyzing linguo-stylistic signatures and other conspiracy theories (how did Volkogonov smooth out the found document on his knee and read it aloud to Korotich on the phone) - what does that change? Whether the division of Poland was directive or improvised is no difference.
      2. Severomor
        Severomor 21 September 2015 23: 56 New
        0
        wink Well, clearly, then like this, pay attention to the dates, although not the document (although compared to the linden tree above .....), but still:

        - In the West they persistently write that in 1939 a secret agreement was signed with the agreement ...
        - Nothing.
        - Did not have?
        - Did not have. No, it's absurd.
        - Now, probably, we can talk about this.
        - Of course, there are no secrets. In my opinion, rumors are purposely spread out in order to somehow soak it up. No, no, in my opinion, it is still very clean and there could be nothing like this agreement. I stood very close to this, actually dealt with this matter, I can firmly say that this is, of course, a fiction.
        29.04.1983

        ... I’m asking Molotov for the first time:
        - What kind of secret protocol was signed during negotiations with Ribbentrop in 1939?
        - I do not remember.
        - Churchill writes that Hitler did not want to give you Southern Bukovina, that this greatly affected German interests, and she was not mentioned in the secret protocol.
        - Oh well.
        “And he called you to join the triple alliance.”
        - Yes. Scoundrel. It is simply, so to speak, in order to gloss over the matter. The game, the game, is quite so primitive.
        “And you said you did not know Stalin’s opinion on this matter.” Did you know, of course?
        - Of course. With Hitler it was impossible to keep the soul wide open.
        09.03.1986

        / Felix Chuev. One Hundred and Forty Conversations with Molotov /
      3. The comment was deleted.
    2. zubkoff46
      zubkoff46 21 September 2015 13: 14 New
      0
      I personally saw in 1988 a copy of a typewritten (from a carbon copy) copy certified by the NKID official stamp. The vulture on it stood "C", which I was quite surprised that only "C".
    3. zubkoff46
      zubkoff46 21 September 2015 13: 23 New
      0
      I personally saw in 1988 a copy of a typewritten (from a carbon copy) copy certified by the NKID official stamp. The vulture on it stood "C", which I was quite surprised that only "C".
  • sa-zz
    sa-zz 21 September 2015 09: 36 New
    +7
    Donald Tusk:
    - Ukrainians, all to the front! All to the last person! And we, the brotherly people of Poland, promise to honor your memory forever, to love your homeland, as ours, to love your women, as yours, to plow and sow your lands as ours.
  • Leeder
    Leeder 21 September 2015 09: 37 New
    +2
    History does not know the "subjunctive" mood, but the feeling of gratitude seems foreign to the Poles ...
    1. Haettenschweiler
      Haettenschweiler 21 September 2015 09: 40 New
      -4
      They have nothing to thank us for.
      Another thing surprises me: they, therefore, remember and curse the Soviet occupation, but for some reason they bypass the German occupation. Although the USSR and Germany together divided Poland, and until the outbreak of war, they jointly occupied it.
  • rf xnumx
    rf xnumx 21 September 2015 09: 38 New
    +8
    The Poles are “offended” in life, for there is no other reason to demolish the monuments, but at that time in Germany ....
  • AdekvatNICK
    AdekvatNICK 21 September 2015 09: 39 New
    +1
    we will not be like degenerates.
    1. pv1005
      pv1005 21 September 2015 09: 52 New
      +4
      It is not necessary to become like, but there is no need to substitute a second cheek either. With a cattle you need to talk only from a position, otherwise they will sit on your neck and hang your legs. You don’t have to go far for an example; for 23 years we looked at Ukraine and wrote off all their tricks on the mentality; as a result, we have what we have.
  • Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 21 September 2015 09: 39 New
    +4
    Our fallen warriors should be taken out and buried in the homeland, with all due honors. And these, sprinkling bile zheks, no longer need to be saved, they quite clearly teach us this.
  • asadov
    asadov 21 September 2015 09: 39 New
    -1
    So the Poles want them to once again introduce them to Cousin Mom
  • azbukin77
    azbukin77 21 September 2015 09: 41 New
    +6
    The answer is only asymmetric - there is nothing to do to Russophobe Kaczynski on Russian soil! Panov to the house !!!
    1. voronbel53
      voronbel53 21 September 2015 10: 51 New
      +2
      What are the monuments near Smolensk? - if they are heroes in Poland, then let them erect a monument there, to whatever soul you like, where they were buried. And here we have Kaczynski ordinary foreigner who died in a plane crash on our land - it is enough to indicate the place of the crash and put a sign with the names of the dead, no more ...
  • Moore
    Moore 21 September 2015 09: 42 New
    +5
    Warsaw considers “unacceptable and completely baseless assertions about the allegedly historical amnesia of the Polish authorities and shaping the soil for the revival of Nazism, which were made on September 17 on the 76 anniversary of the Soviet attack on Poland, made under a secret protocol between the authorities of the two totalitarian regimes - the Soviet Union and Hitler's Germany. "

    With amnesia, the Poles, however, are not very healthy. Forgot something.
    1. “When the Polish government realized that its end was nearing, it fled from Warsaw to Lublin on September 6, from there it left on September 9 to Kremenets, and on September 13 to Zalishchyky - a city near the Romanian border. On September 16, the Polish government crossed the border. The people and the army, which at that time was still fighting the last fierce battles, were left to their own devices. ” (Kurt von Tippelskirch, “History of the Second World War”, vol. 1, pp. 23-25).
    In other words, the Red Army entered the country 404 - without the government and military command.
    2. Maybe then they will remember, nevertheless, what was the name of this cute "Polish" town in East Prussia before it was taken by the troops of the "liquidator of the Polish underground" and who transferred it by mistake to the Poles?
    1. Proud.
      Proud. 21 September 2015 10: 04 New
      +2
      Quote: Moore
      With amnesia, the Poles, however, are not very healthy. Something was forgotten. “When the Polish government realized that its end was nearing, it fled from Warsaw to Lublin on September 1

      Yeah. And the President of Poland, Ignacy Moscitsky, fled from Warsaw on the first day, September 1, 1939.
      Quote: Moore
      In other words, the Red Army entered the country 404 - without the government and military command.

      That's right. De facto, on orphaned territory.
      1. Das Boot
        Das Boot 21 September 2015 10: 45 New
        +3
        Quote: Moore
        In other words, the Red Army entered the country 404 - without the government and military command.

        Quote: Be proud.
        That's right. De facto, on orphaned territory.


        guys, do not discover America - all this is reflected in the note of the Soviet Government dated 17.09.39, handed to the Ambassador of Poland)
  • starshina78
    starshina78 21 September 2015 09: 42 New
    +5
    The smaller the nation, the more vindictive, venal and infamous it is. Pshikalki have always been like corrupt girls. Those who promise or give them more will play the main violin. In the days of the USSR, this was of course the Union, and in the current States, and so that the new master was more generous, stroking the head more they were ready to lie down with bones just to please. And the States need it! They need to erase from the zschilok everything that is connected with the Soviet Red Army. I won’t be surprised if in a few years it will be written in Polish textbooks that Poland was liberated by the "glorious troops" of the States. I know these zilchaloks - I studied with them in the glorious times of the USSR. The framework of the site does not allow me to describe my opinion in relation to these pshikalkam. I will say one thing - the negative is complete!
    1. Das Boot
      Das Boot 21 September 2015 10: 21 New
      +1
      Quote: starshina78
      The framework of the site does not allow me to describe my opinion in relation to these pshikalkam. I will say one thing - the negative is complete!

      for sure. Psheshto percent!
  • silver169
    silver169 21 September 2015 09: 43 New
    +5
    Just as calmly and calmly, Russia should declare that the Katyn Memorial, which is in the Smolensk region, will be dismantled. How then will the papa sing? We cannot speak differently with our historical enemies.
    1. asiat_61
      asiat_61 21 September 2015 13: 59 New
      -2
      There is a memorial to Polish officers shot by Germans in Katyn. These are two big differences.
  • ARES623
    ARES623 21 September 2015 09: 51 New
    +7
    “Without questioning the role of General Chernyakhovsky in the war with the Third Reich, we should not forget that he was responsible and actively participated in the liquidation of the Polish underground - the Home Army,” noted in Warsaw. “We have no doubt that the Russian side has detailed, documented knowledge in this regard,” the diplomats added.
    Diplomats only forgot to mention that a hospital with Red Army soldiers wounded during the liberation of Poland was cut out by the forces of the mentioned Craiova Army. Something they have one-sided memory ...
    Did the memorial sign at the site of the death of Kachinsky not stagnate? The Poles have not yet paid for restoring order and other costs in connection with the incident with flying mediocrity of the highest level. The word "Pole" has not caused anything but disgust recently.
  • shelva
    shelva 21 September 2015 09: 52 New
    +1
    I am surprised not by the actions of the Poles, but by our reaction to them - what else can you expect from these psheks, entirely bought by the Americans?
  • clerk theophan
    clerk theophan 21 September 2015 09: 53 New
    0
    And the day began to rename the Varshavskoye Shosse, Varshavskaya, Gdanskaya, Lyublinskaya Streets to such a mother ..... well, and the t-thread for the little things ....
    1. Das Boot
      Das Boot 21 September 2015 10: 13 New
      +4
      Quote: clerk theophan
      And the day began to rename the Varshavskoye Shosse, Varshavskaya, Gdanskaya, Lyublinskaya Streets to such a mother ..... well, and the t-thread for the little things ....

      and ban polka at children's parties Replace with the politically correct dance "Bullseye".
      1. Reducer
        Reducer 21 September 2015 11: 43 New
        0
        Well yes! "The Polish apple")))
        1. Das Boot
          Das Boot 21 September 2015 12: 38 New
          +1
          Quote: Reduktor
          Well yes! "The Polish apple")))

          b / \ in ... sanctioned ...
          How about a gypsy girl?
          1. Reducer
            Reducer 21 September 2015 14: 09 New
            +1
            does not roll - the mentality is different)))
            1. Das Boot
              Das Boot 21 September 2015 16: 47 New
              +1
              Quote: Reduktor
              does not roll - the mentality is different)))

              approx.
              1. Reducer
                Reducer 22 September 2015 04: 30 New
                0
                Two pirtops, three flocks. Not at all expressive))) The whole gang- "You are not in the dance!")))
  • astronom1973n
    astronom1973n 21 September 2015 09: 54 New
    +3
    Quote: Haettenschweiler
    They have nothing to thank us for.
    Another thing surprises me: they, therefore, remember and curse the Soviet occupation, but for some reason they bypass the German occupation. Although the USSR and Germany together divided Poland, and until the outbreak of war, they jointly occupied it.

    If the occupation were ... And there is nothing to thank us for? And how many USSR built enterprises in the territory of the NDP and how many repaid loans taken by the NDP? Do not remember? So soon we will agree that Poland is a country winner in the 2nd World War, like France (here's a misunderstanding !!!)
  • Vikxnumx
    Vikxnumx 21 September 2015 09: 54 New
    +4
    ..I think they need to get ready to be surprised in the near future by the price of gas .....

    Do not wait! Politics and money ....
  • 3 Gorynych
    3 Gorynych 21 September 2015 09: 55 New
    0
    Do not dismantle anything - do not become like these degenerates! We must recall our Russian proverb, "Whoever remembers the old is over, and WHO FORGET him two !!!"
  • noWAR
    noWAR 21 September 2015 09: 56 New
    +1
    Here it is undisguised hypocrisy of the West, I'm in ah ..
    The observers of the OSCE special monitoring mission were awarded the Otto the Great Prize for their participation in the settlement of the military conflict in the Donbass. This is the newspaper Nova Wave. This symbolic award is awarded by the authorities of the city of Magdeburg for their merits in strengthening mutual understanding in Europe.
    “For the first time in many months, we have a ceasefire in eastern Ukraine, which has led to a noticeable calming of the situation. However, this does not mean that everything has become easier, especially in the matter of how to move forward, ”said German Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier.
  • GUKTU
    GUKTU 21 September 2015 10: 00 New
    +1
    Fighting monuments is a manifestation of weakness, powerlessness and cowardice. The monument will not say anything and will not give change. But nothing ahead of Poland bright according to Muslim customs. Everything is relative
  • Russian Uzbek
    Russian Uzbek 21 September 2015 10: 03 New
    +2
    "" "a chronic case of historical amnesia and a manifestation of extreme cynicism" ""
    and to use the "totalitarian regime" donated by Prussia, Silesia, Pomerania - or, to be honest, original German lands - you see it is not "extreme cynicism" ... and they smashed Czechoslovakia together with Hitler and even got their bite from the master's table - Tesinska oblast! but this is certainly not "historical amnesia" ...
  • kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 21 September 2015 10: 03 New
    +1
    Here! And how would they react to the news of our media about the beginning of the dismantling of the So-called “Memorial to Polish Citizens” whom the Stalin NKVDists allegedly shot, although even in the years of the Great Patriotic War the guilt of this crime by the Nazi barbarians and only the traitor Gorbachev (as directed by Gorbachev Of the West) declared recognition for the USSR guilty of the destruction of Polish officers! I do not propose to demolish the monument to the dead Poles, but I propose to remove the "Memorial tablets" defaming the USSR from these graves and establish the real ones! And on these new tablets it is necessary to indicate the true murderers, and not those appointed by Gorbachev under the leadership of the West, those responsible for this atrocity! And on the memorial sign at the site of the death of the Polish delegation, headed by their President, it is necessary to indicate the present circumstances and the true cause of their death!
  • roskot
    roskot 21 September 2015 10: 10 New
    0
    Polish Foreign Ministry expressed surprise at the statements made by the Russian ambassador in Warsaw and the Russian Ministry of Defense in connection with the dismantling of the monument to General Chernyakhovsky

    The Poles turned on the fool.
  • ☆ Alexander ☆
    ☆ Alexander ☆ 21 September 2015 10: 18 New
    +1
    So we, in the Kostroma region, it seems necessary to remove the Polish monuments. And about Smolensk, I generally keep quiet!
  • solovey
    solovey 21 September 2015 10: 25 New
    0
    I wonder what liberals think about this. lol ? Without them, it’s not interesting lol .
  • solovey
    solovey 21 September 2015 10: 25 New
    0
    I wonder what liberals think about this. lol ? Without them, it’s not interesting lol .
  • provincial
    provincial 21 September 2015 10: 34 New
    0
    I think Russia needs to do something too, so that we ourselves would be more surprised than Poland.
  • Polkanov
    Polkanov 21 September 2015 11: 01 New
    0
    ... Polish gaskets are now the most absorbent in the world. It can be used repeatedly after washing ...
  • lilian
    lilian 21 September 2015 11: 15 New
    0
    And why is the article minus? This is just news, fact. The author just provided information, now we know more about what is happening in the world, what kind of relations are developing between the countries.
  • X Y Z
    X Y Z 21 September 2015 11: 53 New
    +1
    Everything that happened very clearly illustrates the idea expressed earlier that the Polish Ministry of Foreign Affairs gives true pleasure to dive with our Ministry of Foreign Affairs in sophisticated formulations and numerous misunderstandings and concerns. This is how a true nobleman deftly cleared up obscure claims from wild Moscow. This is much more pleasant than, for example, reporting to The Diet is before MPs from PiS, who demand gigantic memorials near Smolensk and are reproached for indulging Moscow.
  • andrew42
    andrew42 21 September 2015 12: 01 New
    +3
    It’s high time for the Poles to put in place with their cries for the “refusal of assistance” to the Warsaw uprising. My grandfather took Prague, a suburb of Warsaw. talked about fierce battles with the Germans. That is, the Germans didn’t have any garrisons there, but a powerful military group, which you cannot defeat from a raid. My grandfather also said that yes, they stood, did not advance. Yes, because in the tank brigade on the move there were 30 percent tanks, and experienced personnel were even less. And the Poles, who were "burnt under the British", they SPECIALLY before the start of the Warsaw uprising did not submit any requests for cooperation with the Soviet army. The task of the Home Army, and the task of their American-British patrons, was just THE WARSAW WITHOUT WITHOUT (!) AND BEFORE THE APPROACH (!) Of the Red Army. So what kind of "refusal of help" they vote ?! And then, when the Germans crushed them into powder (one might think there were other options - no, of course), they would show that the bloodless units of the Red Army did not go forward, and that the bodies of their Soviet soldiers did not pave the way for Poland to take possession of this Craiova . Insolence rolls over. They started on their own, they wanted to show off, then they wanted our army to put sticks in wheels on the road to Berlin — they got what they deserved. It is time for the Poles in this matter to poke their faces in their own, and officially, about ten times, through all channels. It is in the Polish Army that the heroes and patriots of Poland fought. And the AK leadership is adventurers and gesheftmahra losers. The Poles, of course, are our closest genetic relatives. But it is time for them to shut up with their attempts to hegemony in the Slavic world. They steamed it all 1000 years ago, when their lame Meshko 1st adopted Catholicism in order to subjugate all the surrounding Slavic lands. In fact, he adopted the religion of the enemy, under the banner of which the German feudal lords carried out Slavic genocide. Then, the Poles also dragged Lithuania into this rotten swamp, and all the achievements of the Gediminids went to dust. Since then, Poland has been spinning like a bacon in a pan: in Catholic clothes, and with Slavic inside. And Poland will never be a collector of land ever again. All Poles have already profiled in history, all the reasons and chances. It would be better if they thought how to correct their historical mistakes. And so, a perverted splinter of the Slavic world, a puffed spear tip of the Western "civilizers". Tfu, shame.
  • vladimirw
    vladimirw 21 September 2015 12: 20 New
    +1
    Psheks abandoned the alliance with the USSR, captured part of Czechoslovakia along with Hitler, and in 39g. received what they deserve. There must be a worthy response to Polish swine actions.
  • 4ekist
    4ekist 21 September 2015 12: 36 New
    -1
    Quote: fregina1
    I think the leadership of Russia should just be silent .... be silent on the proposal of local authorities at the location to demolish the memorial, in memory of the gop. the company of freaks led by the former president who did not reach Smolensk! And to demolish and forget everything ..... there were flying only enemies of Russia! if you say so! And plus to demolish a couple of tablets in Polish in the monastery of Nilova deserts! Where the same freaks in the 90s it was written how the Red Army tortured Polish officers !!! next to the way is a plate in Russian with such grammatical errors that it’s immediately clear - the Poles wrote! In general, as it is now fashionable to say a "symmetric" answer is NEEDED!

    Quite right, demolish the memorial near Smolensk and forget about it. And then marvel at the fact that the psheks will whisper.
  • DesToeR
    DesToeR 21 September 2015 12: 50 New
    0
    September 17, the 76th anniversary of the Soviet attack on Poland

    According to the USSR, he (the Soviet Union) did not attack Poland. On September 17.09.1939, XNUMX such a state as Poland no longer existed, because the leadership of the state had already fled, and there was no uniform command of the army. The deployment of troops on the territory of western Belarus and Ukraine was interpreted by the Soviet Union as the care and protection of an ethnic close (and essentially divided) people.
  • ARES623
    ARES623 21 September 2015 13: 04 New
    0
    Teaching Poles history is not grateful. They have their own bullet in the head, and you can only knock it out with another bullet. The mayor of Penenzno (a former locksmith, obviously deeply knowledgeable in history) clearly explained that we (Russia) have some heroes — those who liberated Poland from the Nazis (Red Army, Polish Army), and others — those who shot quietly in the back KA and VP soldiers from English weapons. About times, about morals ....
  • srha
    srha 21 September 2015 13: 11 New
    +1
    Yeah, you won’t understand the current leadership of the Poles ...
    Here they are indignant that they did not allow the Germans in the 39th to capture a part of what was then Poland abandoned by the leadership.
    And why are they indignant that they did not help the uprising in Warsaw in the 44th - then they did not drive the Germans out of there?

    By the way, well, they will demolish all the monuments to the Russians, but how will they explain who liberated them from the Nazis?
  • Prutkov
    Prutkov 21 September 2015 13: 16 New
    0
    Quote: bmv04636
    So we erected a memorial in Katyn, but wasn’t it time in Poland in Krakow to establish our memorial? The Russian Military Historical Society (RVIO) not so long ago turned to the Polish side with a proposal to erect a monument on the territory of Poland to the Red Army soldiers who were tortured in Polish concentration camps during the Soviet years of the Polish war of 1919-1920. RVIO organized a fundraiser for the creation of such a monument and proposed to install it in Krakow at the Rakovitsky cemetery, where thousands of Red Army soldiers are buried in common graves.
    And the German lands donated to Stalin's psheks are not shaking the question. And isn’t it time for the Psheks to return the Germans to their historical homeland (East Prussia deported after 45 years about 4 million)

    It seems that the memorial in Katyn makes sense to expand so that visitors to Katyn could, for one, bow to those who were martyred in the 20s. in Poland to the Red Army.
  • KRIG55
    KRIG55 21 September 2015 13: 50 New
    0
    I wonder how much Poland would be surprised if the memorial in Katyn was rolled out in a tank and forbidden for anyone to visit it ?????
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  • ZKB
    ZKB 21 September 2015 14: 04 New
    0
    [media = http: //tomsk.fm/watch/321500] - this is about the partition of Poland and historical memory ... or conscience
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  • Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 21 September 2015 14: 49 New
    0
    Quote: Das Boot
    Quote: starshina78
    The framework of the site does not allow me to describe my opinion in relation to these pshikalkam. I will say one thing - the negative is complete!

    for sure. Psheshto percent!

    With the surname Saakashvili, by the way.
  • Bayonet
    Bayonet 21 September 2015 15: 26 New
    0
    Recently I had a chance to ride in Crete on a sightseeing bus with a Polish couple. It is not clear how, but they alone were among the Russians. People over 40 years old, but they behaved simply defiantly - chatted loudly, so the guide was sometimes beaten. In the end, they threatened to land them, only then they calmed down a little. Most hostile people. negative
  • mamont5
    mamont5 21 September 2015 19: 02 New
    -1
    Quote: Das Boot
    Quote: Baikonur
    We won’t get to such blasphemy!

    and what blasphemy? Did they defile someone’s dust?

    They defiled the memory.