Expert opinion: about the situation in the DPR and its prospects

At the moment, the situation in the DPR is about the same as it was on the eve of the sudden retreat of the Strelkov army from Slavyansk.


1. All that is happening in the Donetsk People’s Republic is an attempt by Vladislav Surkov (who has been given exclusive powers to solve the “Ukrainian problem”) to optimize its controllability. Less controlled (in the person of Purgin, Aleksandrov and others) are replaced by more controlled (Pushilin and K˚). I think that for the same purpose, a series of well-known field commanders of Donbass were shot down consecutively.

2. All optimization of the controllability of the DPR is sharpened by the implementation of the so-called. "Minsk agreements".

3. Zakharchenko's prospects are foggy. Taking into account the fact that not so long ago, in one of his conversations with Surkov, he publicly sent him, I would not be surprised if the head of the DPR resigned soon.

4. It should be noted that forcing the DPR to the “Minsk agreements” is in fact a mirror reflection of the enforcement of the “Minsk agreements” by Poroshenko.

Pushing through the Verkhovna Rada amendments to the Ukrainian constitution and attempts to clear out the ardent Nazis, who are the main driving force for the continuation of the war, from the same series as Purgin’s isolation, mass arrests in Donetsk and the likely elimination of Zakharchenko.

These are parallel processes originating from the same source.

6. This source is one of the Kremlin "towers", on top of which is Vladislav Surkov, with the monopoly right to solve the "Ukrainian problem". For him, now almost everything is at stake. If the “Minsk agreements” are not implemented, this person’s public career will end. And forever.

7. It can be assumed that if the Surkov project does not work and the “Minsk agreements” are not implemented, the blank check for the solution of the “Ukrainian problem” will be given to its competitors.

8. The “Minsk Agreements” is an attempt to reanimate the Ukrainian oligarchic republic of a home-made type. At their core, they are a reversion to the past, an attempt to restore what has long been outlived and is now dying in convulsions.

The Donbass, in accordance with the “Minsk agreements”, is a kind of autonomous oligarchic principality, with the old regional “princes” who returned there, their attendants and the old orders. Formally, the Donbass will be Ukrainian. In reality, it will be a financial-economic and military-political enclave belonging to several rich and influential oligarchic clans possessing unlimited power on its territory. On the one hand, they will depend on Moscow, and on the other, they will play the main role in Ukrainian politics.

As far as I understand, the “Minsk agreements” should solve two main tasks.

First, create a kind of “control chip” in the form of Ukrainian autonomies from the DPR-LPR.

And, secondly, to implant this “management chip” into the state body of Ukraine in order to “steer” the whole country with its help.

In addition, the mechanism for the implementation of the "Minsk agreements" automatically starts a gradual return to power of the oligarchic clans that are now expelled from the country. The vanguard of this return is the Opposition Bloc. Rearguard - Azarov and K˚. The political reanimation of the defeated "regionals" can be a guarantee of the re-creation of the old, but modernized state system in Ukraine.

In theory, it all looks beautiful. But from the practical side - extremely "dumb." It is not clear where the creators of this plan are going to put together tens of thousands of ideologically motivated supporters of the independence of Donbass and no less motivated Ukrainian Nazis. The “Minsk agreements” are not inserted into the worldview of those and others. For them, they are a betrayal. To convince them of something else is impossible. Kill too.

To drive in the "stall" for the implementation of the "Minsk agreements" a huge mass of these people there is nobody. There is no third force capable of doing this in Ukraine.

Due to objective reasons, the “Ukrainian problem” can be solved only in two ways.

Either by proclaiming the complete independence of the DPR-LPR with their subsequent entry into the Russian Federation, or by the continuation of the war, as a result of which one of the warring parties will be completely defeated.

However, both real solutions to the “Ukrainian problem” are blocked by external forces. The final withdrawal of the DNR-LC is not beneficial to the United States. The war is not beneficial to the EU. And since the “Minsk agreements” are unrealizable, the solution to the “Ukrainian problem” is doomed to hang for an indefinite time. Until such time as a certain factor manifests itself, which will substantially change the stalemate situation.
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  1. Armored optimist 7 September 2015 05: 56 New
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    Hypothesis of course. But there are probably other explanations.
    1. Alexander Romanov 7 September 2015 06: 14 New
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      Quote: armored optimist
      . But there are probably other explanations.

      To know everything, you need to be present at closed meetings with Putin. The rest is about bad Surkov, who does what he wants to blizzard. Surkov will not move a finger without Putin.
      Although much is not clear, but wait and see.
      1. viktorrymar 7 September 2015 07: 03 New
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        Expert opinion: about the situation in the DPR and its prospects


        and here’s the expert’s opinion:
        Due to objective reasons, the “Ukrainian problem” can be solved only in two ways.
        Either the declaration of the complete independence of the DPR-LPR with their subsequent entry into the Russian Federation, or the continuation of the war, as a result of which one of the belligerents will be completely defeated ..


        very expert opinion
      2. Tanais 7 September 2015 07: 04 New
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        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        To know everything, you need to be present at closed meetings with Putin. The rest is about bad Surkov, who does what he wants to blizzard. Surkov will not move a finger without Putin.
        Although much is not clear, but wait and see.


        But progress, as I see it, there is none ... Little by little, there comes the realization that the processes taking place in our country are still controllable and directed from the White Stone. And just like “Surkov will not move a finger without Putin,” the DPR and LPR, “checks the clock across the Kremlin” ...

        Here I look at the FIRST SET of the Donetsk All-Arms Command School, on OPLOT TV, and I see:

        The cadets' uniform 1: 1 is Russian, the head of the school, gives an interview in the form, to the last detail, corresponding to the form introduced by Shoigu. The same “Ministry of Emergency Situations” cap, “rounded” sleeve chevron flag (I couldn’t find a photo of ours on the network, therefore I present Russian).
        1. atalef 7 September 2015 07: 11 New
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          Quote: Tanais
          Little by little comes the realization that the processes taking place in our country are still controllable and directed from the White Stone

          Good morning !
          As they say - morning is wiser than evening

          Quote: Tanais
          And just like “Surkov will not move a finger without Putin,” the DPR and LPR, “checks the clock across the Kremlin” ...

          those. it’s clear where this whole mess comes from, but they believed about a popular uprising
          Quote: Tanais
          Here I look at the FIRST SET of the Donetsk All-Arms Command School, according to OPLOT TV, and I see: The cadets' uniform 1: 1 is Russian, the head of the school, gives an interview in the form introduced to Shoigu to the last detail. The same “Ministry of Emergency Situations” cap, “rounded” sleeve chevron flag (I couldn’t find a photo of ours on the network, therefore I present Russian).

          Doesn’t play any role, at least put on pioneer shorts
          only one thing has a role, what will happen next.
          1. Tanais 7 September 2015 07: 31 New
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            Quote: atalef
            those. it’s clear where this whole mess comes from, but they believed about a popular uprising


            Good to you too!

            The uprising was just popular, and the war that we are now waging a People’s Liberation in fact.
            Many draw analogies of this war with the war in Vietnam, with the only difference that the involvement of the Russian Federation in the political processes of the republics (DPR-LPR) is not comparable anymore ...

            And this is essentially normal, and the time is different and the situation and the "participants" are somewhat different.

            But ONLY, I would like to be sure that they will not leave us halfway, like a suitcase without a handle, which was a pity, but was left at the side of the road ...

            Quote: atalef
            Quote: Tanais
            Here I look at the FIRST SET of the Donetsk All-Arms Command School, according to OPLOT TV, and I see: The cadets' uniform 1: 1 is Russian, the head of the school, gives an interview in the form introduced to Shoigu to the last detail. The same “Ministry of Emergency Situations” cap, “rounded” sleeve chevron flag (I couldn’t find a photo of ours on the network, therefore I present Russian).
            Doesn’t play any role, at least put on pioneer shorts
            only one thing has a role, what will happen next.

            It has . To understand that we are the same as the Russians. Let for now in the "short pants" ...

            And if somewhere they "stratified", "did not live up to expectations", then we must realize (and admit) that part of the responsibility for this lies with the Mission Control Center ....
            1. atalef 7 September 2015 08: 02 New
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              Quote: Tanais
              The uprising was just popular

              the uprising was not popular.
              maybe all who started all this newcomers. and raise local organized crime groups - there were no problems.
              And tell me the reason - the popular uprising 7 as you call

              Quote: Tanais
              we carry out FREEDOM in fact.

              Oh well
              Quote: Tanais
              Many draw analogies of this war with the war in Vietnam,

              you (not specifically you. and you in the sense of massively) are there with a dubur at all? which vietnam?
              Quote: Tanais
              But ONLY, I would like to be sure that they will not leave us halfway

              Yes? why should you care? is a popular uprising?
              Quote: Tanais
              It has . To understand that we are the same as the Russians. Let for now in the "short pants" ...

              You are not Russians, you are Russians. Ukrainians, in short, residents of the territory called the DPR and LPR - but not Russians and will never be (unless of course you move to Russia)
              Quote: Tanais
              And if somewhere they "stratified", "did not live up to expectations", then we must realize (and acknowledge) that part of the responsibility for this lies with the Mission Control Center

              Well, you are always always to blame.
              why did you raise the uprising 9 as you called 0 to become Russians? (let’s leave all this billiards about independence. countries without oligarchs, etc.) You personally see one goal - to become a Russian.
              Well, go to Russia and become. as 2.5 million residents of Ukraine did - why was it necessary to play war games and kill people 7
              1. Tanais 7 September 2015 08: 25 New
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                Quote: atalef
                you (not specifically you. and you in the sense of massively) are there with a dubur at all? which vietnam?



                Quote: atalef
                Yes? why should you care? is a popular uprising?



                "Combine" these two questions into one. And I will answer, question to question laughing

                Was the war in Vietnam a people's liberation? (I ask the short answer, "Yes-No")

                Could the DRV with its resources, alone, defeat Southerners and the United States without the full assistance of the USSR? (same answer, "Yes-No").
              2. Max_Bauder 7 September 2015 08: 43 New
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                Quote: atalef
                why it was necessary to play war games and kill people 7


                probably just to prevent the Ukrainians from pulling all the equipment and the army to the borders of Russia, to the Crimea, and to start shelling these border territories from all types of field artillery, having entered the US, NATO military alliance in advance, so that they would support them if the Federation responded . Do you think the United States just so supplies all sorts of forces, weapons, instructors ?! No matter how.
              3. Tanais 7 September 2015 08: 51 New
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                Quote: atalef
                Well, you are always always to blame.


                Quote: Tanais

                And if somewhere they "stratified", "did not live up to expectations", then we must realize (and admit) that part of responsibility for this lies with the Mission Control Center ....


                The phrase "PART OF RESPONSIBILITY"(bigger, smaller, in the situation, no difference), doesn’t tell you anything? In my comments, I don’t" jump "from the fact that we are to blame for something and somewhere ... Not saints .

                You are trying to deliberately distort what I wrote, and this is at least not beautiful.


                Quote: atalef
                Well, go to Russia and become. as 2.5 million residents of Ukraine did - why was it necessary to play war games and kill people 7


                I will live on HIS the earth. I don’t need to leave somewhere in order to become aware of myself as a Russian, just as you had to flee to Israel in order to become a Jew.

                "War game" with the Arab countries, how much does Israel have? So why aren’t you going to get much warmer?
                1. avt
                  avt 7 September 2015 09: 20 New
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                  Quote: Tanais
                  I will live on my land. I don’t need to leave somewhere in order to become a Russian, just as you had to flee to Israel in order to become a Jew.

                  "War game" with the Arab countries, how much does Israel have? So why don’t you get much warmer?

                  Quote: atalef
                  You are not Russians, you are Russians. Ukrainians, in short, residents of the territory called the DPR and LPR - but not Russians and will never be (unless of course you move to Russia)

                  Oh well . How is it in the movie then - never say never seem. They want to be Russians, because they will enter Crimea with their own land and live on it as part of a single, federal state today and it will be their choice, not yours. And you admit, or not, together with ,, progressive, civilized humanity "so it is to us to the lamp.
                2. Volzhanin 7 September 2015 13: 58 New
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                  You are trying to deliberately distort what I wrote, and this is at least not beautiful.
                  This is a typical Jewish way of communicating - turning everything inside out and presenting it in a favorable light. It’s time to get used to it.
                3. g1v2 7 September 2015 14: 25 New
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                  Do not worry so much about the voice from Israel. Just get it. that it’s the enemy and everything will fall into place. Is it so important to you that the enemy is talking about you? He expresses the point of view of Israel and the EU - you can already hear it on the Western channels. You see the real picture at home and get excited, proving that you are not a bandit from the big road is not worth it. For comrades from Israel and the EU, you are part of the gang, which is fighting against the government of Kiev controlled by them. This is normal and it’s stupid to argue with them. We and they are just on different sides of the trenches and each of us has our own truth. soldier
              4. 97110 7 September 2015 11: 49 New
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                Quote: atalef
                why it was necessary to play war games and kill people 7

                Really, why? We also used to think that "Moshe Dayan is a one-eyed bitch. Aggressive, beast, pure Pharaoh." But it turned out that someone had to
                Quote: atalef
                then play war games and kill people
                In your area now complete order, so your owners and decided that it was time to include ukroameri Americans. So that too, there was a complete order.
              5. Volzhanin 7 September 2015 13: 56 New
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                You are not Russians, you are Russians. Ukrainians, in short, residents of the territory called the DPR and LPR - but not Russians and will never be (unless of course you move to Russia)

                Is this the Jewish god told you?
                There is another option - the entry of the outskirts of Russia. And it will be. And it will be during our lifetime.
                And now, the best thing for Jews is to take care of themselves. Not even an hour ISIS will cover. laughing
                1. rosarioagro 7 September 2015 14: 07 New
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                  Quote: Volzhanin
                  There is another option - the entry of the outskirts of Russia. And it will be. And it will be during our lifetime.

                  or life is so long, or optimism is as big as the ocean :-)
            2. Awaz 7 September 2015 14: 35 New
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              actions of disobedience were originally provoked by the oligarchs, who were thrown off the Olympus as a result of the coup in Kiev. Well, they didn’t take it off, but lowered it a bit. If the people themselves got down to business, then everything would have been over long ago and there were no dill warriors near Donetsk. People just used. And here is the continuation of the story of blood and murders, the topic is not simple and now hardly anyone will say exactly who is to blame and why. Although, according to all the rules and laws, the Ukrainian authorities are to blame for everything. Personally, I believe that the official authorities of the Russian Federation joined the process when it became clear that the massacre was already unavoidably inevitable and maybe they hoped that if they were muscular, the junta would be afraid and begin to somehow solve the problem by non-military means. But somehow it all went wrong for everyone. And what happened then happened. Now, as I understand it, Kreml got stuck there seriously and will fight to the end. Maybe they really don’t want to make a separate state out of Donbass, but the longer the outrage and terror from Kiev lasts, the more likely it is that Russia will make maximum efforts to ensure its influence on this enclave. I think everyone believes that the junta itself will fall apart. From this, and so it goes
        2. g1v2 7 September 2015 14: 19 New
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          Well, both nm cases have long been under the control of our specialists, and there is no talk about any drain. Well, different Pushilins, Purgins, Tsarevs and Daineko have no real power for a long time. Sooner or later, Donbass will come to Russia and maybe not one wink . Just recognition from the Russian Federation will not solve a single problem, but it will bring a bunch of new ones. And so, the process of embedding Donbass in the Russian Federation is in full swing - only the chevrons can be changed for the NM corps and they can be part of the RF Armed Forces, the ruble has almost replaced the hryvnia, etc. I advise you to listen less to the talking heads in a box and look more at real affairs and processes. soldier
      3. avt
        avt 7 September 2015 09: 13 New
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        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        To know everything, you need to be present at closed meetings with Putin. The rest is about bad Surkov, who does what he wants to blizzard. Surkov will not move a finger without Putin.

        Yeah, another article, if not a smart Svidomo, then an adherent of the Strelkov sect, who knows exactly where that toilet in the Kremlin into which Surkov merges everything and everyone. laughing Well, analysts already got it, "with their letters about the Kremlin towers," well, they don’t even have an idea about how they make decisions, but they must certainly gurgle something.
        Quote: Tanais
        But ONLY, I would like to be sure that they will not leave us halfway, like a suitcase without a handle, which was a pity, but was left at the side of the road ...

        Have you heard Putin’s statement in Vladivostok on Kiev’s implementation of the Minsk agreements? Or just the statements of the guardians? Well, about the fact that Surkov has already leaked everything?
        1. Tanais 7 September 2015 09: 21 New
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          Quote: avt
          Have you heard Putin’s statement in Vladivostok on Kiev’s implementation of the Minsk agreements? Or just the statements of the guardians?


          And I heard the “guard patriots”, and I heard Putin, now and earlier ...

          But NOT ALL of his statements and decrees, I will write like this: "implemented" ...

          Hence the fears.
          1. avt
            avt 7 September 2015 09: 46 New
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            Quote: Tanais
            But NOT ALL of his statements and decrees, I will write like this: "implemented" ...

            ,, Drain "LDNR for GDP is a political death, all one that Crimea wins back.
            Quote: Tanais
            Hence the fears.

            This is no longer concern, but some kind of panic. request Which specifically sow. Well, we must look at things objectively, well, I’ve said it more than once. So how many specific units of the Armed Forces have been transferred to the LDNR? No matter how they scoffed at mobilization in Ukraine, the army is mobilized and poorly armed. There are no serious partisan actions in Kharkiv, well, no Kovpakov in Ukraine. So GDP does everything in accordance with the realities of life. Everything else is the same, old song about the main “-, Putin, send troops.” To different voices.
            1. Tanais 7 September 2015 10: 00 New
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              Quote: avt
              Here are how many specific units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine passed to the side of the LDNR? No matter how they mocked mobilization in Ukraine, the army is mobilized and poorly armed poorly. There are no serious partisan actions in Kharkiv, well, no Kovpakov in Ukraine


              There is no God with them ... Let us “narrow down” Wishlist from all over Ukraine until the end of the war with us (whether there is a peaceful withdrawal of ukrovsk, or the liberation of Donbass by military force) ...

              Actual task? Maybe yes. How is this feasible? And not in perspective, "for years"? ...

              Does Kremlin policy imply such a move? If so, why pull?

              But after the junta finally loses the "En" resources of the Donbass, and Ukraine will REALLY be on the "choke" + the radicals will "grow apart", it will be possible to talk about Kharkov and Odessa, and more ...
              1. avt
                avt 7 September 2015 10: 30 New
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                Quote: Tanais
                .. Let’s “narrow down” the Wishlist from all over Ukraine until the end of the war with us (whether there is a peaceful withdrawal of ukrovsk, or the liberation of Donbass by military force) ...

                no Will not work . That’s not, it’s narrowed down. One thing will pull the other, and you have to be prepared for this not in words, but in your own material and human resources. In order to at least stop the negative consequences for the liberated territories. And if you take into account the fact Since the USSR, with its mobilization and organizational capabilities to work in extreme situations close to catastrophe, is NO, the complexity of the solution increases by multiple. ,, Cadres decide everything "here the air forces / militia of the LDNR seem to have been specifically formed into real army corps. And the administrative building is ready to work with the civilian population of the liberated territories ?? I wrote for a long time - the war there is being waged not for the sake of the war itself and for the permanent permanent liberation of Ukraine right after Trotsky, but to create an acceptable standard of living for the population, ready to endure the hardships of the war, but not at all obliged to live in this state. you clearly understand the scale of the forthcoming work and the negative factor of Bandera Ukraine at hand, which cannot be blamed on by military victory - you can do almost everything with bayonets, but you can’t sit on bayonets, Again, emotions should not overwhelm consciousness, here they are, neither negative nor positive.
                1. Tanais 7 September 2015 10: 42 New
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                  Quote: avt
                  Will not work . That’s not, it’s narrowed down. One thing will pull the other, and you have to be prepared for this not in words, but in your own material and human resources. In order to at least stop the negative consequences for the liberated territories. And if you take into account the fact Since the USSR, with its mobilization and organizational capabilities to work in extreme situations close to catastrophe, is NO, the complexity of the solution increases by multiple. ,, Cadres decide everything "here the air forces / militia of the LDNR seem to have been specifically formed into real army corps. And the administrative building is ready to work with the civilian population of the liberated territories ??


                  But they didn’t try ... More precisely, they’re holding back “Minsk” ...

                  In my conviction, that the APU was stumbling away, they only need a large boiler and the loss of Mariupol.

                  Moreover, Mariupol does not need to be taken “forehead”, in order to avoid losses, which some people fear ...
                  Enough of his environment, the blockade ... And believe me, the situation will be resolved more "from within" than from "outside" ...

                  Someone, again, scares with the TOTAL cessation of water supply in Donetsk, at the beginning of active operations in the South ... And what is Kalmius for? Karlovskoe reservoir? Lobanovskoe?

                  Here you have "flashed", "Putin’s calls to send troops all over ..." But I don’t even hint at it ...

                  The DNR-LNR has enough forces of its own to at least exhaust the Armed Forces of Ukraine to oh .... after which it will be prudent for them to crawl away ... Well, you understand ...
                  1. avt
                    avt 7 September 2015 11: 50 New
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                    Quote: Tanais
                    In my conviction, that the APU was stumbling away, they only need a large boiler and the loss of Mariupol.

                    no Very dangerous delusion! If you have the forces and means of LDNR, as well as with the incomplete defeat of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, you will have to keep a longer front with the creation of a buffer zone from Berdyansk to Ieyum.
                    Quote: Tanais
                    And believe me, the situation will be resolved more "from within" than from "outside" ...

                    In Mariupol - yes. I would have believed in Kharkov - there the potential immediately after the Maidan was huge. But Dopa and Gepoy were stupidly merged, and Gepa was also a very serious passenger and was in a situation. Under it, it is almost impossible for anyone to turn around on a Kovpak scale. So if tomorrow is 08.08. if they don’t start, or until they get into a debauchery (that’s how symbolism doesn’t let me go - the universal people like symbolism more than life, but God forbid, I’ll be mistaken), then I will have to spend another winter in this suspended state.
                    Quote: Tanais
                    .. More precisely, the "Minsk" is holding back ...

                    Well enough already about ,, containment "then request Raise the thought above past boilers. The risks of GDP should be taken by everyone when making a decision, and then in Ukraine it will be a lot of support for a bunch of nuclear reactors and hazardous industries and banderlogs frostbitten and us, who strive to put the rods from Westin House into Soviet reactors.
                    Quote: Tanais
                    In fact, it is this “little thing” that is most annoying.

                    Annoying. It strains those who live under shelling - I understand, but frankly those who are at the computer get angry in the absence of news that allow angry and urapatriotic comments to write about VSUk and are waiting for the next batch of winning videos.
                    1. avt
                      avt 7 September 2015 15: 23 New
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                      Quote: avt
                      . So if tomorrow is 08.08. they don’t start, or until the debauchery (that’s how symbolism doesn’t let me go - the universal people like symbolism more than life, but God forbid I’ll be mistaken)

                      The Central Military District today, suddenly, "commander in chief to the Minister of Defense," suddenly "ordered to check ..... but this is really
                      Quote: Tanais
                      annoying.

                      request Again, like the shelling started yesterday .....
                  2. atalef 7 September 2015 12: 12 New
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                    Quote: Tanais
                    In my conviction, that the APU was stumbling away, they only need a large boiler and the loss of Mariupol

                    Come home - where is it? To the moon? Well, suppose you took Mariupol that it changed in your position (with the exception of an additional piece of territory and the need (for Russia) to feed another 500-600 tons of people?

                    Quote: Tanais
                    Enough of his environment, the blockade ... And believe me, the situation will be resolved more "from within" than from "outside" ...

                    Are you sure ? But something like Mariupol’s subpopulation is somehow inaudible, why did you decide that they really need it? What would you like to live? And what is better with you?
                    Quote: Tanais
                    Here you have "flashed", "Putin’s calls to send troops all over ..." But I don’t even hint at it ...

                    Why does Putin need this?
                    Quote: Tanais
                    The DNR-LNR has enough forces of its own to at least exhaust the Armed Forces of Ukraine to oh .... after which it will be prudent for them to crawl away

                    Again the question of where to crawl away?
                    1. Tanais 7 September 2015 12: 49 New
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                      Quote: atalef
                      Come home - where is it? To the moon? Well, suppose you took Mariupol


                      What you ...

                      They didn’t answer “Yes-No” to simple questions, in monosyllables, but here they posted a “Double” that their eyes ran wide ...

                      We will answer questions as they come ...

                      And so, my question is from 08.25 today:

                      Quote: Tanais
                      Was the war in Vietnam a people's liberation? (I ask the short answer, "Yes-No")

                      Could the DRV with its resources, alone, defeat Southerners and the United States without the full assistance of the USSR? (same answer, "Yes-No").
                      1. The comment was deleted.
                      2. Tanais 7 September 2015 13: 27 New
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                        Quote: atalef

                        Your question reminds me of a well-known thing, such as answer YES or NO
                        “Did you stop drinking your skate in the morning?”
                        But purely for you I will answer
                        In New Russia, unlike Vietnam, there is no national liberation war
                        Vietnam couldn’t do it myself
                        And you won’t cope with the same thing (and with someone the same) because you don’t have a root cause - war is not a people’s liberation.
                        Tell the truth
                        1.Vietnam didn’t intend to join anyone, they fought for themselves.
                        Tomorrow, Putin, tell you from the rostrum that Novorossia will never be annexed to Russia - the first half will scatter, and take away the Russian volunteers (and stop only the armament, as it was in Vietnam) - tomorrow the APU will calmly enter Donetsk and Lugansk.
                        You do not have a war of liberation, you have no idea and the support of the people is minimal.
                        Your whole dream is not to get rid of the oligarchs and become truly free (you are talking about the war of liberation), but to become just a part of Russia and nothing more.



                        I don’t understand ALL THISIs it YES or NO? Where is the monosyllabic answer, without the bukoFF heap I asked for?
                      3. atalef 7 September 2015 13: 37 New
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                        Quote: Tanais
                        I don’t understand, ALL THIS IS, “YES” or “NO”? Where is the monosyllabic answer, without the bukoFF heap I asked for?

                        What kind of baby talk?
                        You still start in * Who is the last * to play
                        The situation in Vietnam is in no way similar to your situation.
                        But if you want to know about Vietnam 9 and only by it) my answer
                        1.Yes
                        2.No
                        Now answer me and please, not in one word
                        What will the LC or DNR give a resident of Mariupol, so that he would fight for you?
                  3. atalef 7 September 2015 13: 21 New
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                    Quote: Tanais
                    And so, my question is today, 08.25: Quote: Was Tanais War in Vietnam a popular liberation? (I ask the short answer, “Yes-No”) Could the DRV, with its resources, alone, defeat Southerners and the United States without comprehensive assistance from the USSR? (same answer, "Yes-No").

                    Your question reminds me of a well-known thing, such as answer YES or NO
                    “Did you stop drinking your skate in the morning?”
                    But purely for you I will answer
                    In New Russia, unlike Vietnam, there is no national liberation war
                    Vietnam couldn’t do it myself
                    And you won’t cope with the same thing (and with someone the same) because you don’t have a root cause - war is not a people’s liberation.
                    Tell the truth
                    1.Vietnam didn’t intend to join anyone, they fought for themselves.
                    Tomorrow, Putin, tell you from the rostrum that Novorossia will never be annexed to Russia - the first half will scatter, and take away the Russian volunteers (and stop only the armament, as it was in Vietnam) - tomorrow the APU will calmly enter Donetsk and Lugansk.
                    You do not have a war of liberation, you have no idea and the support of the people is minimal.
                    Your whole dream is not to get rid of the oligarchs and become truly free (you are talking about the war of liberation), but to become just a part of Russia and nothing more.
              2. atalef 7 September 2015 12: 12 New
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                Quote: Tanais
                In my conviction, that the APU was stumbling away, they only need a large boiler and the loss of Mariupol

                Come home - where is it? To the moon? Well, suppose you took Mariupol that it changed in your position (with the exception of an additional piece of territory and the need (for Russia) to feed another 500-600 tons of people?

                Quote: Tanais
                Enough of his environment, the blockade ... And believe me, the situation will be resolved more "from within" than from "outside" ...

                Are you sure ? But something like Mariupol’s subpopulation is somehow inaudible, why did you decide that they really need it? What would you like to live? And what is better with you?
                Quote: Tanais
                Here you have "flashed", "Putin’s calls to send troops all over ..." But I don’t even hint at it ...

                Why does Putin need this?
                Quote: Tanais
                The DNR-LNR has enough forces of its own to at least exhaust the Armed Forces of Ukraine to oh .... after which it will be prudent for them to crawl away

                Again the question of where to crawl away?
        2. rosarioagro 7 September 2015 10: 36 New
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          Quote: avt
          ,, Drain "LDNR for GDP - political death

          if it is stretched in time, then no political death will occur, rather physical, from the old
          1. Tanais 7 September 2015 10: 55 New
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            Quote: rosarioagro
            if it is stretched in time, then no political death will occur, rather physical, from the old


            In fact, it is this “little thing” that is most annoying.

            It seems that the process of searching (establishing?) A compromise with some part of the Kiev establishment has been launched ...

            Purpose ? The goal is prosaic, so that those sheep who must remain intact remain intact ...

            But as a rule, this happens: "For every sage, quite simplicity" ...

            We are forced to wait, who will “be smart” whom ... And to whom it (except the people) will come out sideways.
            1. rosarioagro 7 September 2015 11: 00 New
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              Quote: Tanais
              It seems that the process of searching (establishing?) A compromise with some part of the Kiev establishment has been launched ...

              Rather, no, this kind of thing, in my opinion, is going through Merkel, she’s having problems right now in the form of migrants
            2. padded jacket 7 September 2015 13: 36 New
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              In fact, it’s necessary not only to “take” Mariupol so to speak, it is precisely to destroy the power of Poroshenko (Valtsman), Groisvna and various Yaytsenyuk, as well as other persons supporting fascists and how sad it is to contribute to the “disintegration” of Ukraine into at least three parts of Novorossiya, Zapadnaya Ukraine and Central Ukraine - it will be a "bloody" but the best solution.
  2. Rus2012 7 September 2015 13: 52 New
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    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Surkov will not move a finger without Putin

    Knowing the groundhog and early stories (for example, a stool), he still thinks there is carte blanche and freedom of action “in a highlighted clearing”. Those. he answers only "for large" and "for nothing" does not ring ...
  • vladimirZ 7 September 2015 06: 39 New
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    6. This source is one of the Kremlin "towers", on top of which is Vladislav Surkov, with a monopoly on the solution of the "Ukrainian problem" ...
    7. It can be assumed that if Surkov project won't work ...

    8. “Minsk Agreements” is an attempt to resuscitate the Ukrainian oligarchic republic of the haunted type ...
    - from an article by Andrei Vajra

    Something is not believed that it is "Surkov's project". The problem "Ukraine" is solved directly by President Putin V.V. It simply cannot be otherwise.
    These are all his failures and successes in relations with “fraternal” Ukraine, as well as the desire to “reanimate the Ukrainian oligarchic republic to the Maidan type”, when “everything was so quiet and calm” externally, and the oligarchs of both states “fed” on each other’s territory, forgetting about maintaining the true friendship of one people scattered across different states.
  • Max_Bauder 7 September 2015 08: 46 New
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    As for what will happen, everything will be as Russia needs, more precisely for its security. Listen to this.

  • yushch 7 September 2015 09: 27 New
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    Surkov is an ordinary manager, only on a statewide scale, even the most ingenious manager strictly follows the direction given by the leader, i.e. GDP in this case. Of course, in the process, Surkov can improvise, but strictly within the framework indicated above, otherwise he will be immediately removed from his post.
    I would also like to add that such analyzes, neither on our part, nor on their part, should be taken seriously, what only the GDP thinks and decides is known only to him. Even his ingenious analysts cannot know what CAM will solve, therefore the whole world respects him and reckons with him.
  • Tambov Wolf 7 September 2015 12: 24 New
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    No, dear, not a hypothesis, but a look at the root of the problem. "Our" and "not our" authorities are ready to choke everyone and everyone for loot. And you, on the forums, write about some New Russia, about justice, about the people. Yes die all the people here and there, nigger slaves will be delivered for the bread ration work budut.Neft gas pump a couple of Millon is necessary, and how many of us? of course, "optimistic" for the time being here enough, but once fried cock in the ass bite, let's see how many of them remain. Thatcher has already said how many of us should remain? She said. Everything’s coming to that. We’re letting the land out, letting it out, we’ll hardly get it back. Like it is still for sale, but we only have higher prices and higher payments. Again, the “Ukrainian brothers” are the gas prices themselves They offered to drop, and we have to raise tariffs without fail, and annually, regardless of prices. Is that? Also a "hypothesis? No, it’s to disintegrate Russia together with the KhPO. Something is still going on with us in the USA , even the turnover has increased, although we are “seemingly” “enemies.” Wait, we’ll wait from Europe and Arabs with blacks, we are good, we will help Europeans. We and our country have become a cash cow for everyone, and as a rule, we have the Yeltsin gang, And so it rules. And in the elections it will begin again, and someone is familiar, and they are robbing legally.
    1. Sling cutter 7 September 2015 19: 19 New
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      interesting thing facts ...
      Maidan-Crimea-Donbass (without fire) -Odessa-Strelkov -war-Minsk and drain melancholy.
      First, the anti-oligarchic revolution, then the national liberation movement of New Russia, then the perished revolution, Brain in the role of Robespierre and now two half-wanted (I mean the authorities) Russian regions ....
      what the authorities received on both sides in return:
      1. We found enemies to distract the population of Ukraine and the Russian Federation from pressing problems
      2. Through the Maidan, the ideas of the People’s Revolution were discredited, like don’t rock the boat, otherwise it will be the same as on the outskirts, you’ll say “you’re maidanut”
      3. "utilized" the most active citizens, well, part of the population in addition
      4. extinguished a revolutionary bonfire, which could easily spread to the Russian Federation.
      5. All the bourgeois remained with their own, and even with welding

      What next? and then the approval of the admin border of the m / y outskirts and the Russian Federation in the form of state.
      promotion in preziki of the outskirts of the brow a la gdp and eternal gratitude to the one and the one who was indelible for the end of the war and turmoil with an early vote of 146%.
      Oh yes, still Crimea !: for some, as the greatest achievement, and as an eternal irritant for others ...
      and the merged project of Novrossia, the united Russian World and People’s Revolution ...
      sadness ....
  • Revolver 7 September 2015 06: 03 New
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    No matter how you settle it, they will be asked on both sides of the front: "Why did they spill blood?" So the war will be until the victory of one of the parties. And what it will be - sluggish, as it is now, or acute, as in the days of Ilovaisk and Debaltsev, depends on a bunch of circumstances that cannot be taken into account in advance. Or it will flow from the sluggish phase to the acute and vice versa.
    Worst of all, not only active supporters of the war suffer, but also those to whom it has not surrendered. But these are practically all wars.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Uncle lee 7 September 2015 06: 24 New
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    some autonomous oligarchic principality- I'm afraid that’s going to this. And because of this, so many lives have been ruined ...
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Cat man null 7 September 2015 06: 33 New
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    It seems to me alone that the author contradicts himself?

    Pushing through the Verkhovna Rada amendments to the Ukrainian constitution and attempts to clear out the ardent Nazis, who are the main driving force for the continuation of the war, from the same series as Purgin’s isolation, mass arrests in Donetsk and the likely elimination of Zakharchenko.

    These are parallel processes coming from one source.

    That is, the Minsk agreement with a creak, but "trying to be fulfilled." The process, as they say, is ongoing.

    since the “Minsk agreements” are unrealizable, the solution to the “Ukrainian problem” is doomed to hang indefinitely. Until that moment, until a factor appears that will significantly change the stalemate

    Well, if it’s called “freezing” .. then I’m a telephone booth winked

    It is not clear where the creators of this plan are going to put tens of thousands of ideologically motivated supporters of the independence of Donbass and no less motivated Ukrainian Nazis. “Minsk agreements” are not inserted into the worldview of both of them. For them they are a betrayal. To convince them of something else is impossible. Kill too

    “To me, too, with Newton’s bin” .. IMHO, a dozen or two “Sashki Bilykh” will suffice as a good example, and the rest will repaint or hide over caches, from where they will be smoked for a finite time.

    Everything else in the article is just one of many options for interpreting the situation in the DPR. I prefer to skip this (like the others) interpretations past my ears, and just look with my eyes.

    The situation is simply obliged to resolve quickly, the uncertainty that has to be "for now" cannot last long.

    The final departure of the DNI-LC is not beneficial to the United States. The war is not beneficial for the EU

    ABOUT HOW .. Ukraine, which was conceived by our mattress "partners" as a "factor of discord" for Europe and the Russian Federation, suddenly becomes a "factor of discord" between Europe and the "partners" themselves .. bingo belay

    All IMHO, article minus no
  • Mountain shooter 7 September 2015 07: 01 New
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    The author is wrong. All the same, Russia can support LDN much longer than Europe can keep the dill economy from being stalled. So the time factor plays against dill. The main thing is that cities should not be beaten from the Grad and civilians should not be touched. And there it will be seen. There is no time for dill, well, no, from the word at all. But the weapons there, on the territory of the "Square", are now any number. And people who are ready to use it, too.
  • Loner_53 7 September 2015 07: 27 New
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    Good morning members of the forum! Tanais Hello! With utrechku yourself nerves shake politics wink We are one thing and the Kremlin is another, when only now we go parallel to it? repeat
    1. Tanais 7 September 2015 07: 44 New
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      Quote: Loner_53
      Good morning, forum users! Tanais Hello! With the words of our own self, we are wracking our nerves with politics. We are one thing and the Kremlin is different when we just go along with it?


      Good morning, namesake!

      Where without it, a policy cursed ... Really invigorates in the morning, substitute coffee ...

      Based on my insignificant experience in navigating, I will assume that for a start two wake columns should meet at some point, exchange signals, take steps to rebuild, and only then they will "saw" WHERE they want and HOW they want ...
      1. Loner_53 7 September 2015 07: 49 New
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        Quote: Tanais
        two wake columns should meet at some point, exchange signals, take steps to rebuild, and only then "saw" WHERE they want, and HOW they want ...

        Ouuuuuuu how many movements it is necessary to make, no, the Kremlin can’t cope with it, surrenders and let's go where winked
        1. Tanais 7 September 2015 07: 56 New
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          Quote: Loner_53
          Quote: Tanais
          two wake columns should meet at some point, exchange signals, take steps to rebuild, and only then "saw" WHERE they want, and HOW they want ...

          Ouuuuuuu how many movements it is necessary to make, no, the Kremlin can’t cope with it, surrenders and let's go where winked
          And this I CONSCIOUSLY "missed" measures to prevent the COLLISION of the "ships" yes .


          What does the common phrase say? Hope dies last ?

          So let's hope that, nevertheless, common sense will prevail, and “ship-driving skills” will be applied for the good ...
          1. Loner_53 7 September 2015 08: 10 New
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            Quote: Tanais
            So let's hope that, nevertheless, common sense will prevail, and “ship-driving skills” will be applied for the good ...

            Oh long we have to wait and hope
  • nikolaev 7 September 2015 08: 07 New
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    . In reality, the “leapfrog” visible to the whole world is a shame for the Russian authorities and a loss of respect for the population of Donbass. The fall of its prestige among the Russian people. And this is really dangerous! And no verbiage can fix it. You can only fix it with deeds: put things in order in the financial sphere, adopt laws instead of a number of ugly laws protecting Russia and its people from the lawlessness of international organized crime groups, .... finally bring people like Strelkov, Purgin, Bezler, Batman, and Mozgovoy to the LDNR power system instead of mediocrity and thieves such as Pushilin and Deiny.
    1. Loner_53 7 September 2015 08: 19 New
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      Quote: nikolaev
      finally return people like Strelkov, Purgin, Bezler, Batman, Brain into the LDNR power system instead of mediocrity and thieves

      No, the Kremlin won’t do it, he’s scared of such people himself
    2. Ruslan67 7 September 2015 09: 23 New
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      Quote: nikolaev
      return people like Strelkov, Purgin, Bezler,

      And Kvachkova to the heap fool
      1. Alexander Romanov 7 September 2015 09: 26 New
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        Quote: nikolaev
        finally bring back people like Strelkov, Purgin, Bezler, Batman, Brain

        Hello Ruslan! Don’t make a noise, you see the person of Mozgovoy and Batman offered to resurrect. lol
        Healthy hydrolysis drinks
        1. Ruslan67 7 September 2015 09: 36 New
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          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          the man of Brain and Batman offered to resurrect.

          I have a feeling that sending children from the site to school, everyone immediately switched to autumn exacerbation fool Without pauses and breaks request Over the last week I reread so much insanity here ... In short, the hammers stretched south and to the clave sad
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Healthy hydrolysis

          The alcohol-containing organism itself drinks
  • dima-fesko 7 September 2015 08: 09 New
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    It should be noted that forcing the DPR to the “Minsk Agreements” is actually a mirror image of the enforcement of the “Minsk Agreements” Poroshenko.

    These are parallel processes originating from the same source.


    My thoughts are:

    Yesterday, 09:57 | Coup in the DPR: who should congratulate on this? Part 1
    According to one version, a change of power in the parliament of the Donetsk Republic could mean the end of the era of dominance of the so-called “party of war”,

    It’s clear that the matter is dark ...., official Russia begins to push through the project of “unitary Ukraine ... ????


    It seems that neither I think so!
    there is also the concept of secret diplomacy. And the fact that backstage negotiations are ongoing is a fact. Another question is to whom, when, how much and on what grounds. As I understand it, the position of Russia (taking into account the previously stated theses and the non-recognition of LDNR) is a federation (confederation), autonomy, etc., and then the possibility of secession from an independent one. What to do - minus until the other in my thoughts stands up!
  • Zomanus 7 September 2015 08: 09 New
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    Well, in general, this version also has a right to exist.
    But as I think, we deliberately make concessions, expecting similar from opponents.
    Opponents, who are dead in the region, do not accept this by themselves and continue to bullish.
    And in this way we are building up the evidence base.
    Like, we did everything we could, made concessions to the detriment of ourselves, and they ...
    In case of exacerbation, this will help explain our offensive operation.
    1. Karabin 7 September 2015 18: 40 New
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      Quote: Zomanus
      And in this way we are building up the evidence base.

      Quote: Zomanus
      In case of exacerbation, this will help explain our offensive operation.

      To explain to whom? Those who are bulls?
  • dima-fesko 7 September 2015 08: 10 New
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    It should be noted that forcing the DPR to the “Minsk Agreements” is actually a mirror image of the enforcement of the “Minsk Agreements” Poroshenko.

    These are parallel processes originating from the same source.


    My thoughts are:

    Yesterday, 09:57 | Coup in the DPR: who should congratulate on this? Part 1
    According to one version, a change of power in the parliament of the Donetsk Republic could mean the end of the era of dominance of the so-called “party of war”,

    It’s clear that the matter is dark ...., official Russia begins to push through the project of “unitary Ukraine ... ????

    It seems that neither I think so!
  • Prutkov 7 September 2015 09: 03 New
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    Quote: nikolaev
    . In reality, the “leapfrog” visible to the whole world is a shame for the Russian authorities and a loss of respect for the population of Donbass. The fall of its prestige among the Russian people. And this is really dangerous! And no verbiage can fix it. You can only fix it with deeds: put things in order in the financial sphere, adopt laws instead of a number of ugly laws protecting Russia and its people from the lawlessness of international organized crime groups, .... finally bring people like Strelkov, Purgin, Bezler, Batman, and Mozgovoy to the LDNR power system instead of mediocrity and thieves such as Pushilin and Deiny.

    Alas, you will not return Bezler and Brain. Strelkov, I think, will not want to. It’s hard for people on the Dobass. You will not envy them. But we must understand that this is only the 1st Ukrainian front. And there is the 1st Syrian, 1st Karabakh, Transnistrian, Tajik fronts ... There is an internal front, no less bloody and dangerous for the whole country. And all actions on these fronts must be commensurate with each other. To do this, at the head of these associations and formations should be managed and at the same time authoritative commanders. There is a construction of a vertical of power with elimination of people. So it was in 17m - 20 years. in Soviet Union. Then, these commanders (Shchors, Kotovsky, Chapaev, etc.) will be erected monuments, they will write memoirs, call them street names. Following. Oligarchs ... Always, in all countries there have been and are elites. Call them what you want — aristocrats, party nomenclature, Red Princes, Rothschilds, Rockefellers, oligarchs, etc.
    1. Tanais 7 September 2015 10: 09 New
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      Quote: Rods
      Alas, you will not return Bezler and Brain.

      You are Bezler, then, that ... Don’t bury time before.

      Bezler ("Demon") and Bednov ("Batman") are not one person ...
    2. Karabin 7 September 2015 18: 42 New
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      Quote: Rods
      this is just the 1st Ukrainian front. And there is the 1st Syrian, 1st Karabakh, Transnistrian, Tajik fronts ...

      And everywhere their "Minsk".
  • Svetlana 7 September 2015 09: 20 New
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    I can’t dispute the justice of this article, because I am not an expert and not a direct participant in the events, but something intuition tells me that a person living in St. Petersburg cannot be an expert in behind-the-scenes events and processes that are hidden in the DPR and, therefore, more in the Kremlin. Somehow I don’t really trust this defector. Each of us can have an opinion on any issue, on any situation, but why is Vazhra called an expert? Who is he after all?
  • roskot 7 September 2015 10: 22 New
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    And the tarot cards say, until the junta is overthrown and the Nazis wrestle with the warriors, the conflict will smolder. Parsley Donbass will not let go in free swimming. Fashington will not allow it.
  • flSergius 7 September 2015 10: 40 New
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    Usually A. Vajra analyzes very well, as an expert, not a forum expert, but in this case he does not agree with the article. Firstly, stories about Surkov’s intrigues around Donbass resemble stories about the Zhidomasonsky Conspiracy. There is no doubt that such a character exists, but what he says there in his office and other major players, what he really plans and with whom even competent experts are not given to know in the union. Scarecrow themselves blinded. Secondly, from the 1st of the republic they switched to the Russian ruble. And in the republics, nothing is being done without the knowledge of the Kremlin. So why should they be converted to the ruble, if later returned to Ukraine? It seems to me more that Putin and the West act as an experienced veterinarian: he strokes the front and brings the syringe in the back.
    1. rosarioagro 7 September 2015 10: 45 New
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      Quote: flSergius
      So why should they be converted to the ruble, if later returned to Ukraine?

      As an option, they will make an offshore zone
  • akudr48 7 September 2015 11: 19 New
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    The author Andrei Vajra formulated in the least disturbing terms the current situation in the Donbass and the direction of its development, which is pushed by the logic of things, avoiding direct phrases such as “leaked / not leaked”.

    But he showed that after all Surkov merges, and not someone higher than Surkov. The beholder is to blame, and so far no one else. And the very procedure for ending the conflict through the technology of implanting LDNR in Ukraine with a view to subsequent management from the outside looks fantastic, which means it is not feasible.

    But tomorrow, if the surrender happens (the process is completed), they can appoint the militia and the people of Donbass, and Russians in Ukraine and Russians in Russia as guilty of this. The defeat is quickly reformatted into a new victory, for example, into a victory of peace over a party of war. And the movie will be shown, with honest interviews of peacekeepers.

    And the nightingales on TV immediately quickly bring to the electorate’s consciousness this brilliant geopolitical revolution from victory to defeat as a pre-planned strategy for the final triumph of the winners.

    But the Russian authorities will remain innocent and certainly innocent. And Surkov will not go anywhere, he will be all in white, not to mention the chef, they will continue to merge, trying to achieve understanding and forgiveness from the adversary.
  • lukke 7 September 2015 11: 44 New
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    Zakharchenko's prospects are foggy. Given the fact that not so long ago, in one of his conversations with Surkov, he publicly sent that ass ... st,
    Previously, Zakharchenko was treated on the principle of “I’m not personally familiar with it - I can’t judge”, but now I’m directly respecting!)
    I agree that the marmot dudaev acts strictly in accordance with the line from above ..., the politician does not make the impression of a politician, so that on a site of such a level (France, Germany) trust completely crazy initiatives like Vladislav or whatever it is by teip, even his subordinates.
    They will not ask for failures or non-fulfillment from the groundhog (few people know him in the EU), but from the GDP.
  • TOR2 7 September 2015 12: 25 New
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    In general, it’s somehow not logical for a person who is thousands of kilometers away (atalef) to argue with a person who is at the epicenter of events (Tanais).
    1. atalef 7 September 2015 12: 36 New
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      Quote: TOR2
      In general, it’s somehow not logical for a person who is thousands of kilometers away (atalef) to argue with a person who is at the epicenter of events (Tanais).

      the work is seen wider.
      I don’t argue about micro-things, I ask - macro.
      But there are no answers.
      And the question is all that Novorossia is better for residents of * not yet liberated * Mariupol than Ukraine (the same applies to Kharkov and other territories where PS seems to be rampant and kills Russians
  • Roust 7 September 2015 13: 10 New
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    Some kind of heresy ....)))
  • Barakuda 7 September 2015 13: 17 New
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    And I here Strelkova yesterday listened - how He drives on Zakharchenko, Plotnitsky, etc. I do not think that a person is not at all up to date. request
  • Yugra 7 September 2015 13: 30 New
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    The article is more suitable for publication in a new newspaper or on an echo ...
    1. SHILO 7 September 2015 15: 42 New
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      Quote: Ugra
      The article is more suitable for publication in a new newspaper or on an echo ...


      Like your comment ... good