Russia and Ukraine: reunification is inevitable

279

It should be noted that frank enemies of Russia and the Russian people sometimes say things that many people do not understand in modern Russia and in Ukraine. So, at the beginning of the 1990-s, Zbigniew Brzezinski said the following: “It is impossible to overdo it, stressing that without Ukraine Russia ceases to be an empire, but with Ukraine ... Russia automatically becomes an empire”. And two years ago, he spoke on the same topic: "If Ukraine does not survive, Russia will again become an empire."

Interestingly, Brzezinski actually repeated the words of the famous unifier of the German Empire - “Iron Chancellor” Otto von Bismarck (at least, this phrase is attributed to him). Bismarck said that the power of Russia can only be undermined by the separation of Ukraine from it and the opposition of Russia to it, the bleeding of two parts of a single people in a fratricidal war. And for this it is necessary to “find and cultivate traitors among the national elite,” with its help, change the self-consciousness of one part of the Russian people “to such an extent that it will hate everything Russian, hate its kind without realizing it”.

And it is hard not to note the fact that they are right. Ukraine is, after all, a part of a united Rus, Russian civilization, and Kiev is one of the ancient capitals of Russia, “the mother of Russian cities”. Ukrainian land (Little Russia-Rus) is one of historical, the spiritual cores of the Russian world. Without integration, or rather, without the reunification of parts of a single entity, it will be very difficult to go into the future, to build a “Eurasian Union”.

The independence of Ukraine is the work of the enemies of our united civilization. Even the very origin of this word - “Ukraine” - contradicts the current political reality. “Ukraine, Ukraine” is a border region, a suburb, a part of the whole, and the inhabitants of a “border region” - “Ukrainians” are a kind of “border guards”, residents of the border of united Russia.

You can not go on about the so-called. "Westerners", which are the periphery of the Western world. They are not the majority of the population of Ukraine, and they should not determine the future of this country. It is clear that the true national interest of the population of Ukraine is the reunification of Little Russia with Great Russia (it is reunification, and not the incorporation of one core-core into another). And Kiev should become the third capital of the united Russia, along with Moscow and Petrograd.

It is time to openly talk about the fact that there is no separate Ukrainian and separate Russian people. These are chimeras that have created for the joy of the enemies of united Russia-Russia. There is one people - the Russian people (or the superethnos of the Rus). All who are against the reunification of a single whole are the enemies of Russia-Russia. Only together all parts of our people can build a full-fledged power, which will survive under the blows of the global crisis. Political leaders who do not follow this path are doomed to defeat, the question of the emergence of the new Bogdan Khmelnitsky and Pereyaslav Rada-2 is only a matter of time.

Recent ones newswhich can be evaluated as steps towards reunification

“Yulia Tymoshenko’s verdict, with all its surprisingness, has a positive side - they condemned the consistent enemy of Russia, a supporter of the“ European choice ”of Ukraine.

- Brussels postponed the visit of the President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych to the capital of the European Union because of the case of Y. Tymoshenko. Thus, European officials once again showed their attitude towards Kiev as a possible third-rate province of the European empire. The EU-Ukraine Summit, which was expected to sign an agreement on association and a free trade zone, key for cooperation between Brussels and Kiev, was postponed until December.

After the verdict, the Western media, politicians began to threaten Kiev with disfavor, which is also a clear plus. Kiev will have to seek friendship from Moscow. To retreat is no longer possible.

- Kiev has confirmed its position on Tymoshenko with the fact that it is threatened with a new term - in the case of debts to the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation.

- CIS heads of government in St. Petersburg unexpectedly for the media signed an agreement on a free trade zone. According to ITAR-TASS, the leaders of the Commonwealth governments also put their signatures on the documents on the basic principles of the policy in the sphere of currency regulation and currency control and on the establishment of a unified accounting system for citizens of third countries who enter the territory of the CIS. In total, this package of documents includes up to 30 agreements. Kiev also signed an agreement on a free trade zone. True, the document was not signed by Azerbaijan, Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan, but, according to Putin, they can join the agreement by the end of the year.

This is a real step towards the construction of the Eurasian Union. This step looks particularly impressive against the background of the situation in the European Union, which is facing the threat of collapse. Greece is on the verge of revolt of the masses, the difficult situation in Italy and Spain.

- It was reported that the issue of concluding a mutual agreement on the transfer of Ukraine and Russia to bilateral settlements in rubles will be considered.
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279 comments
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  1. Aleksey42
    +39
    24 October 2011 07: 47
    I agree with the author. There are two ways: if Ukraine and Russia reunite, then we get a strong union that can serve as an example to other countries and peoples. Or the inevitable collapse of our countries and the gradual degradation of peoples. I think that all the adequate people in post-Soviet times understand that when we were together, it was much better. It is up to the political leadership. Of course, no one should be dragged by force, so that later there would be no accusations against Russia.
    1. Sergh
      +27
      24 October 2011 16: 48
      The whole crowd together Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, still Kazakhstan! Guys, yes, neither China nor NATA is scary for us, and the Anglo-Saxons will not have time to change their pants. We won’t even ask them, hint, they will bring them to the entrance to everyone. Yes, this is the same power MIGHTY, ARMOR! This is pitchfork EVERYTHING! (If anything..)
      Well, take a look at what's going on in the world, well, like that, you can not continue !!!
      1. Uncle Sam
        -47
        24 October 2011 20: 42
        yes there was already this crap, yes grunted, the scoop was called
        1. 0
          25 October 2011 00: 50
          "Scoop" was crap in terms of suppressing the personality of a single person, as the saying goes: "If you don't know how, we will teach, if you don't want to, we will force it." People were hammered in communist ideals from the cradle. But it was a great power !!! To make it "grunt ", institutions were created in America. But our people never give up, tested
        2. Antagonist
          -9
          5 November 2011 16: 06
          He is a scoop - a rotten scoop, however much you want to rewrite the hymn "Unbreakable Union" in words.
        3. +1
          9 March 2012 21: 54
          What are you happy about? God willing, reason will prevail and the divided Russian people will unite. And such people calling the great state a scoop, as the earth wears.
    2. Antagonist
      -4
      5 November 2011 16: 04
      There are no "two Ukrainians".
  2. -41
    24 October 2011 08: 10
    Remember who was sitting on the CP SAM SAM BUK and TOP. Who fought on the katso side in August 2008 and shot down our planes? For a piece of fat, they will hit us in the back. Our only allies in the post-Soviet space are Belarusians.
    1. eJik
      +17
      24 October 2011 08: 52
      again, "Ukrainians" fought against us in 2008 and not Rusichi! the meaning is clear
      There are also differences in "Russian" and "Russian"
    2. mar.tira
      +17
      24 October 2011 09: 20
      And you remember who blew up our convoys of troops in Chechnya and sabotage in Russia. Who instructed the bombers and martyrs? Russian Wahhabi .. It seems to me it’s not a matter of people but the zombie of the masses, and the weakness of education as a nation’s patriots. We need to do as the Israelis do. One stands for the whole country, and the whole nation stands for one.
    3. +12
      24 October 2011 09: 42
      Russia and Ukraine: reunification is inevitable

      Yeah, like the collapse of imperialism, we will not be naive until there is a mess in power in Ukraine, as long as Svidomo calls the streets the names of executioners, there will be no reunion, Ukraine soon faces a split into a right-bank and left-bank, why? Because it has already been, and so it is necessary for NATO.
    4. +33
      24 October 2011 10: 26
      In Chechnya, Russians fought on the side of the militants.
      Everywhere there are enough creatures.
      Therefore, talking about all Ukrainians as enemies is not necessary.
      1. +8
        24 October 2011 18: 35
        Traitors were at all times; they hated and cursed. But for some reason, the treacherous elite of the 90s found the support of a zombie people. It is time for everyone to come and make the right choice.
    5. Uncle Sam
      -27
      24 October 2011 20: 50
      Here the Germans inhabit Germany, Austria, Luxembourg, Switzerland, the north of Italy, and no one screams that it is urgent to unite. And they live very well by the way
      And then there were screams - groans, again the communal apartment should be stirred up, everything should be stolen to Moscow and distributed from there. This garbage will not take a ride, this scoop has been consumed in the dustpan. The time of empires in the 20th century has ended
      1. ESCANDER
        +10
        24 October 2011 20: 57
        Nemchura once united ... More - she doesn’t want to.
        Is your Pindostan not an empire?
      2. -1
        9 March 2012 22: 01
        Yes, we need to unite, I am convinced of this from the lamentations of propinda ... an aspirant. To withstand various ridges. Divide and conquer their purpose.
        1. CBT Pinocchio
          0
          9 March 2012 22: 17
          Quote: Sandov
          To withstand various ridges. Divide and conquer their purpose.

          That is, to warm at our expense the dreams of the poor and miserable Omperts? We don’t need you and you still have a khan - the tendency of hatred towards you and your weakness is clearly visible on the site.
    6. rkt7
      -1
      12 November 2011 14: 32
      Allies will be in a strong state. When will Russia become a strong state? I find it difficult to answer, probably again through revolutions, wars, a sea of ​​blood, tears, deprivations and losses ...
    7. Peter maloros
      +1
      11 March 2012 15: 55
      Remember who was sitting on the CP SAM SAM BUK and TOP. Who fought on the katso side in August 2008 and shot down our planes? For a piece of fat, they will hit us in the back. Our only allies in the post-Soviet space are Belarusians.

      You do not wander the Western ragul, who have the essence of a traitor, and maloros, who is a true Russian man and is not capable of betraying his brother.
  3. -7
    24 October 2011 08: 34
    I doubt that a complete reunion is possible.
    On the other hand, the variant of the "union state", like with Belarus, can only add extra hemorrhoids (they want to feed themselves, but do not want to work).
    1. +18
      24 October 2011 09: 11
      What makes you think that they do not know how to work in Ukraine? Are they just for loans that live like Russia under Yeltsin? Is the industry worth it? Be objective.
    2. +5
      24 October 2011 18: 37
      Failure to fully unite with Belarus on Yeltsin’s conscience and theirs. Shame on them all. Unfortunately. and now many opponents of the union are in power.
  4. Tjumenec72
    +16
    24 October 2011 08: 41
    And in order to make it more difficult to separate us later, we need to “assimilate” as much as possible and call ourselves - RUSAMI
    1. legion 13
      +6
      24 October 2011 10: 35
      this is the key idea. it is NECESSARY
    2. Tjumenec72
      +6
      24 October 2011 16: 09
      There you look Serbs will catch up - Soul guys
      Message of the Serbs - Russia. Red Star - Zenith
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJF_ZClALgw
      “Elder brother, kiss our mother, and tell her that we are worthy,
      that we are fighting and that we will fight, tell her that we love her! ”
      1. Odessa
        +4
        15 November 2011 19: 39
        Serbs are generally Slavic brothers, and the Serbian language is included along with Russian, Ukrainian and Belarusian, and if I am not mistaken and Bulgarian is in the same language group, past this the Orthodox faith was dominant. And when communicating with young Serbs, the fact from the history of the Serbian people is striking that they relate to the last Russian emperor Nicholas, they talk a lot about him, interestingly and sincerely.
    3. +2
      24 October 2011 18: 31
      Not the name of the matter. One people should be together.
      1. Odessa
        +5
        15 November 2011 20: 14
        Slovenian tribes even before the baptism of Rus by Vladimrom verbally spoke in similar languages, from where the alphabet was also called a glagolitic, and after baptism, because of the translation of the gospel from Greek to Slavic, people baptized began to read in one language, which formed a common language base. Many came to the land of Russia .... And Kievan Rus really was a princedom with powerful and natural resources, and many people could only admire the physical strength of the people. What God combined, man didn’t separate, Kievan Rus, and what Rus without Kiev? Only border posts and Customs. Many Ukrainians have relatives in Russia ... whatever you do, Russia and Ukraine have been tied with family ties for centuries. And in Russia Vladimir called the people a red sun in love. Interestingly, are there countries where loving people call their prime ministers so?
  5. itr
    -33
    24 October 2011 08: 52
    Already with whom with whom and to connect with these well
    Only shit pours and always poured
    Black Sea pick up and close the borders!
    even in Chechnya, not on our side fought
    1. +26
      24 October 2011 09: 16
      Shit is pouring purely on the Internet and it is impossible to judge everyone by individual pouring.

      Quote: itr
      Black Sea pick up and close the borders!


      Did they understand what they said? Reminds proverb about the king, who ordered to flog the sea ... The sea, oddly enough, will remain there ...

      As for those who fought on the side of Chechnya ... For example, I have two friends who fought in Yugoslavia on the side of the Muslims against the Serbs. Not by conviction, but purely because the board was appropriate. The same with those. mercenaries have any people.

      And those Russians, who supplied Dudaev with modern weapons, did they fight on their side?
    2. Aleksey42
      +11
      24 October 2011 09: 17
      Traitors are always and everywhere. And do not because of them our Brothers dirty. And in Afghanistan they fought shoulder to shoulder, and you never know where. And in Chechnya there were mercenaries from Russia.
      1. +7
        24 October 2011 09: 57
        And I'm talking about. Everywhere there is enough trash.
        1. Marat
          +3
          24 October 2011 21: 24
          I support Aleksey42, Banshee, Vibelugin - that's right - you can't generalize and repel the whole of Ukraine because of a small part of the "Westerners"
          Ukraine will definitely join the integration in the post-Soviet space - this is in the interests of the Ukrainians themselves
    3. German
      +11
      24 October 2011 09: 20
      Do not confuse Ukrainians with Bandera (Western) kami! at least 80 percent of the inhabitants of the east and south-east of Ukraine have relatives and roots in Russia!
    4. ZHORA
      -18
      24 October 2011 09: 52
      Silenok is not enough ...
    5. GLORY TO THE HEROES
      +8
      24 October 2011 21: 46
      itr. Do not confuse ordinary people with politicians! There are our brothers Slavs, for the most part. We are one people. An open vote must be held on this issue, as a referendum. I am sure that the majority of the population of the fraternal republics of Ukraine-Belarus-Russia will support. Author 5 per article
      1. evg5835
        +4
        24 October 2011 23: 16
        What are the Slavs? Our siblings and cousins) We are relatives. If we have President Crest), and what if worthy. Not all of us Moskal rule. In general, I would have voted for Lukashenko)
    6. vadimus
      -6
      25 October 2011 03: 11
      ugh on you
  6. sirToad
    +14
    24 October 2011 09: 19
    such a reunion of good (both) would be more than harm. God forbid that it turned out
  7. NUT
    NUT
    0
    24 October 2011 09: 49
    "We will then defeat Russia when Ukrainians and Belarusians believe that they are not Russians."

    Who said?
    1. lightforcer
      -3
      24 October 2011 11: 57
      NUT said.
      1. +2
        24 October 2011 19: 42
        This was said by those with whom we do not drink!)
    2. 0
      9 March 2012 22: 08
      This was said by the unforgettable Goebels, who is now worshiped in the west.
  8. rnb1983
    +7
    24 October 2011 09: 50
    Everything will turn out ... time is different now. Or now or never .. TOGETHER WE ARE POWER !!!
  9. ZHORA
    -4
    24 October 2011 09: 50
    We are Russians

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ql3wF9Xg1mI
    1. lightforcer
      -3
      24 October 2011 11: 58
      Shalom, Russian.
    2. stalker
      0
      24 October 2011 16: 31
      We hesitated to throw links to this clown, we also have one, Zhirinovsky’s surname)) Also from Ukraine, by the way))
      1. sirToad
        0
        24 October 2011 16: 39
        yeah nafig! Fat from Alma-Ata!
        1. mitrich
          +4
          24 October 2011 17: 06
          Let's fight because of Zhirinovsky ... Take this diamond, do not mind, even to Ukraine, even to Alma-Ata.
        2. stalker
          +1
          24 October 2011 17: 07
          I had in mind the roots, in some program showed about him, he talked about his father, grandfather, that they, from under Lviv, seemed to own a factory small before the Revolution.
          1. Superduck
            0
            24 October 2011 22: 40
            Ivano-Frankivsk
            1. stalker
              0
              24 October 2011 23: 05
              Thank you for clarification, otherwise I just remembered from western Ukraine, and specifically where I forgot it from.
    3. 0
      9 March 2012 22: 11
      Well, no ukrov, no matter how you twist we are one people. Being together is our strength.
  10. -19
    24 October 2011 10: 00
    Let's plant another spinogry on the neck, feed the Caucasus and feed Ukraine. They themselves have dirtied their country, and now we have to add it to us.
    For some reason, they separated from the USSR, dumped and betrayed us, and now they want to tuck their tails back. Feed them again, give money and they will disconnect from us. Well, there we have a high standard of living in the country, you can feed other countries.
    1. +10
      24 October 2011 10: 34
      Well, firstly, they themselves are not really asking, rather we are actively inviting them.
      Secondly, there is no need to compare the Caucasus and Ukraine. With the right approach, Ukrainians will be able to feed themselves and share with others. Third, the industry of Russia and Ukraine is to a certain extent mutually integrated, the same military-industrial complex. Fourth, about betrayal, is a moot point. Traitors - Gorbachev and the participants of the Belovezhskiy conspiracy (I think there is no need even to explain). Fifthly, the "zapadentsy" and Eastern Ukraine differ greatly in their political views. And, as always, the real relations between Ukrainians and Russians are significantly different from those that the media impose on us to please the West. It seems to me that the peoples of our countries will only benefit from the entry of Ukraine into Russia (in any capacity).
    2. +20
      24 October 2011 11: 00
      But why did you get the idea that Ukraine was a spin-nibbler? Compare the Caucasus and Ukraine! Yes, there people just work, come on, and it’s good that for now there’s where and on what, not all yulka-s --- but stole. God forbid unite.
      1. +5
        25 October 2011 11: 51
        In the USSR, the entire budget was held by the RSFSR, Ukraine, Belarus and Azerbaijan. With Azerbaijan, and so it is clear. And all the rest were the fortress on which the power of the USSR rested. This is from official data in the newspapers of the time. Of course, I would like to unite and it would be beneficial for everyone, but then, and first you have to invest in the economies of these countries. We need to weigh: will we pull? Perhaps at first it will be very difficult, but if you look ahead, there is no alternative to unification. The West is our common enemy and has always been an enemy of Russia, and any Russia. The split between our countries is a blessing for our enemies.
        And now we will descend from the clouds to the sinful earth. Who destroyed the USSR? Russians, Ukrainians or Belarusians? No! Our rulers destroyed the USSR, because everyone wanted to "steer", and even now no one has diminished this desire! What happened after the collapse? Legalized by the same rulers the plunder of their own countries. And they all do not care about the states that they govern. Well, we are lucky! There are too many in Russia left after the USSR, they still cannot plunder everything. But, it is already felt that the end of the Soviet legacy is coming and we must live within our means, all budgets are being drawn up with a deficit! Like this? Imagine that I planned my family budget with a deficit! This is impossible in principle, but our rulers have it in the order of things! And so it is in Russia and Ukraine and Belarus. All these deficiencies will have to be covered from the common "boiler". And who will put the most in this "cauldron"? It is clear and so. Consider the example of Belarus. How much I was ringing with the "union" state! And there is nothing! Old Man wants to receive money, but does not want to be accountable for it. Those. As I said above, everyone wants to steer on their own, to receive money, but not as part of a truly union state, with all the ensuing not only rights, but also obligations.
        Nevertheless, I agree that there is no alternative to unification! However difficult and costly it may be for Russia. Otherwise, the west will eat us one by one.
    3. Aleksey42
      +3
      26 October 2011 20: 42
      Firstly, the Union was destroyed far from ordinary citizens. The referendum showed that the majority of the population of the Union was FOR its preservation. And secondly, on the scale of the centuries-old history of our people, this is just an instant, a minor episode. Understand, while we were together, we were a real force that could withstand such a strong organization like NATO. And apart from dreams, almost no one is considered. Is it not visible? And where did you get the idea that Ukraine and Belarus do not want to work? I didn’t notice it.
  11. +4
    24 October 2011 10: 04
    "Without an alliance with Russia, a free and independent Ukraine is impossible." - VI Lenin. Read the classics.
    1. -19
      24 October 2011 10: 07
      They at one time considered that it was possible, and now let them creep in front of everyone who gives them a penny at least, they themselves have chosen such a fate. No need to warm the snake on the chest.
      1. mar.tira
        0
        24 October 2011 11: 05
        Why are you so, on your little brothers. Didn’t you share salom?
        1. -5
          24 October 2011 13: 39
          In the sense of? Since when have they shut up with my brothers?
          1. +1
            24 October 2011 18: 41
            And who are your brothers? Probably not real people, but scumbags.
            1. -6
              24 October 2011 18: 53
              Why did you decide this? Let's insult each other if it gives you pleasure?
      2. +2
        24 October 2011 18: 40
        You have to beat kinder to people. And you have rot in your soul.
        1. -6
          24 October 2011 18: 41
          So I’m kind enough, I just don’t want to feed their officials, there are enough of mine.
  12. SL.Kocegar
    +4
    24 October 2011 10: 12
    negative attitude, this is a matter of propaganda of the West. who prevents us from starting an informational struggle, there are not enough forces, ask for help from the church
    1. -16
      24 October 2011 10: 16
      Unite please, just in 5 years then you will debate the topic "Russia is feeding Ukraine", there is already such a topic about the Caucasus.
      Just think, what can Ukraine give us? We then understand that.
      1. +5
        24 October 2011 10: 32
        No need to compare Ukraine with Chechnya and other banana republics.
        Ukraine has great industrial potential, highly qualified specialists.
        1. -15
          24 October 2011 10: 46
          Yes, yes, yes, but for some reason, with great industrial potential and highly qualified specialists, they are now falling apart, strange as that.
          And in my opinion they don’t have anything, all that was so was what the USSR gave them, on this they lived a little on their own and they still need it, otherwise they themselves couldn’t do anything. But Europe has enough of its loafers, and somehow unexpectedly in Ukraine they remembered that it was better to live in the USSR.
          Drive them with a broom ... Once they betrayed faith, now they don’t ...
          1. NUT
            NUT
            +5
            24 October 2011 11: 24
            "We will then defeat Russia when Ukrainians and Belarusians believe that they are not Russians."
            Adolf Hitler (table talk)

            and now Joker, think who said it and for the good of whom you serve
          2. SL.Kocegar
            +5
            24 October 2011 12: 55
            that’s the point, that power is in unity
          3. +3
            24 October 2011 15: 34
            you won’t be with such thoughts, my friend, Jokerom. So die a half poker
            1. -4
              24 October 2011 17: 30
              Have you ever played poker? wink
          4. Tolia
            -6
            24 October 2011 21: 25
            Falling apart in your dreams ... and for 10 years already, they should have fallen apart according to the forecasts of the patreots, and Ukraine is livelier than all the living)))
            1. raf
              +2
              24 October 2011 21: 30
              Well, well, ".. Ukraine has not died yet .."! Hai chew, God bless her!
            2. zczczc
              +1
              31 October 2011 02: 52
              Tolia, if it weren’t for Natsi’s frenzied, it would have been even more beautiful.
      2. +13
        24 October 2011 11: 10
        It’s somehow pointless and unprovenly stupidly oppressing your line, excuse me if it’s rude. Ukraine has always been called the breadbasket of the USSR, it provides bread and other agricultural products, in addition to a lot of minerals and developed metallurgy, and even the cool military-industrial complex, which still works, even It’s not worth talking about. Well, which of the Ukrainians of Spinogryz? Stop already.
        1. +4
          24 October 2011 12: 00
          The main thing is that the association benefits, and the game does not work out with one goal. I wanted the country to develop, and upon unification, all deputies will rush to launder money. Conveniently, such as a region develop.
          1. SL.Kocegar
            +4
            24 October 2011 12: 57
            do not confuse deputies with the people
        2. Graaf
          +1
          24 October 2011 18: 00
          100% agree!
      3. Graaf
        +10
        24 October 2011 17: 57
        Correctly, Joker writes - do you think that Ukraine can give us? We understand that.
        Actually sir, you wrote nonsense. What can you give her? Are you personally
        I explain.
        Ukraine itself produces and consumes up to 73% of the products grown, harvested, produced in the country. And it sends a lot of things for export. Including in Russia (sausages, sweets, lamb, etc. with pleasure eaten in Russia). Now tell me - how much does the Russian Federation produce and how much does it consume its Russian product? I think that you will not find the answer. Most likely its component is very small. And what Russia produces is energy resources (I understand you, you don’t have any grudges for them in terms of dribaning money from proceeds from the sale of oil or gas) and military equipment. All! Paragraph. Imports to Russia amounted to (if I'm not mistaken - see the Internet) about 69% of total GDP. And this is only for food. And if you don’t know this honey, don’t write heresy! Try to less watch officialdom on TV, and delve deeper into the information on the Internet that no one will present to you on TV in Russia. Russian TV sometimes resembles the days of early Leonid Ilyich. You don’t remember this time due to your young age and you won’t be able to understand our generation which grew up and got on its feet. So there you go! TV of those is an exact copy of modern Russian television, which was called propaganda. There was no porn, music, glamor, etc. crap. But then the thesis of equality was constantly hammered into my head. I do not want to spread this topic. Somehow then I will answer you. All were siblings, all fed someone and everyone owed everything. The fact that the Caucasus is sitting on your neck, the failures and mistakes of your politicians. Do not pour dirt on the neighbors (I mean the country’s neighbors). This, first of all, gives you a profane claver of claudia.
        Do not be offended by my criticisms, it is better to carefully look around and eagerly absorb the information. Know how to separate the grain from the chaff, will help in life!
        Good luck!
        1. -2
          24 October 2011 18: 46
          I am not offended, this is your personal opinion. In no case do I insult ordinary Ukrainian hard workers, but only there is such a leadership that it is scary to connect, otherwise they will cooperate with ours and will bring democracy together in the country. I am 36 years old, so I have my head on my shoulders, this is about propaganda. I don’t watch TV at all, not even the news.
        2. ballian
          -6
          25 October 2011 10: 11
          it's funny to read "thinkers" who talk about whether Ukraine will sit on Russia's neck or not - uh, you look at the GDP of Russia and Ukraine and compare, ignoramuses, - and you will understand everything - you will feed them like cute, and then the "brothers" Russia nafig is unnecessary :))))),
          1. Graaf
            +1
            25 October 2011 13: 01
            ... and you, dear, look at the GDP of China or the United States. Compare with Russia and what will it tell you? The promise itself is not correct, compare what is not compared. As for the ignorant, I think that you are yourself. Because to write that someone is feeding someone is very stupid. This is an old Soviet counter-propaganda - to pour mud, to yell for the whole world - they say look they bastards eat us, and then wash themselves with mud with a quiet glanders! And ask - And you join our customs union, while we invite you for good. But don’t enter (remember Putin’s words) - we will show you Kuz'kin’s mother! Clever, huh? Imagine yourself in the place of the president (prime minister) - and how do you respond to such a message? Is this a formidable power patriotism (a connector of Russian lands)? Remember the laws of physics - the harder you push, the more you resist! So who is a fool? And where is the folk wisdom of the Russians? Or that she finally drank and slept? So no need here la la breadwinner You are ours!
            1. ballian
              -3
              25 October 2011 13: 25
              If I didn’t put it clearly, I’m talking about GDP per SHOWER of the population., Look here and here and compare. - The message is elementary - in Russia there is a redistribution of tax deductions and equalization due to this standard of living. Anyone who thinks that the annexed Ukraine will live by their wallet is naive, it is unnecessary for them, in fact, the USSR Ukrainians sent them with 90% vote precisely because of greed and join if they will for the same reason.
              1. zczczc
                +2
                31 October 2011 03: 02
                ballianif only for this reason, they would have already joined Belarus, and Georgia would have declared themselves the territory of Russia so long ago:



                But no. Hence, greed does not always and does not steer everyone.
                In fact, this graph shows that Lukashenko is really a dad - a father to everyone and everything at home. Without any resources, it has gross domestic product as we do with resources.
                1. lightforcer
                  0
                  1 November 2011 13: 05
                  It is strange that resource-rich Uzbekistan ended up in the end.
        3. oper66
          0
          15 November 2011 00: 44
          THE GRAPH WELCOME YES AGREES IT = BECAUSE SELF-SUFFICIENT PRODUCTION- NONAROD THEN ONE AND WE SHOULD BE ONE AS YOU CAN NOT POSES WITH AUSTRIANS CLOSER THAT YOU HAVE BEEN OPEN AND SUCCESSFULLY LOST. (SHIT) YES IN THE PRINCE OF A BATH HOUSE AT LEAST NOT WASHED BUT SORRY
  13. Andrey2302
    +6
    24 October 2011 10: 20
    Joker - You look narrowly, if you consider Ukraine - a spin-gnaw. Yes, and even if this is so, what is wrong. That is, there is still such a thing as strategic importance and much more important related. Whatever brother he is, brother. And Ukraine, no matter how Brother, is capitalized.
    1. -2
      24 October 2011 10: 27
      Brother, say, can we first put things in order, and then we will accept our brother?
      1. +11
        24 October 2011 11: 09
        And we are "with us". According to your logic, let's split up to the bitter end altogether - let's throw out all subsidized regions from the country.
        Ukraine is Russia, I hope everyone has already seized independence. It is hard for both us and them, to get out together is necessary. With Belarus and Khokhl, I personally am ready to share my money.
        1. -3
          24 October 2011 11: 17
          And to be honest, I’m not ready to feed freeloaders, I don’t really want to. Although, on the other hand, we do not see the money that is allocated to the regions. Nov for the fact that you first need to raise the standard of living in Russia, and then they will unite. It’s like a large family - they don’t have money, but still they have children. From this, is it better for children to live? So when you have a rich family, then you can raise many children, and when you have barely enough money for one, then the 2 child will not fix the first situation.
          1. +2
            25 October 2011 05: 01
            Etad can always rise and all the time consider that it is necessary "to rise a little more." Ukraine + Russia will just rise at the expense of the common market, cooperation and distribution of labor. Invest now oil tanks in Ukrainian arable land and the issue of food imports will disappear altogether.
          2. Gur
            +9
            25 October 2011 12: 28
            If you read you Joker and doubt that you are 36 years old, write a couple of such crap that I simply will not hold back so as not to unsubscribe. Of course, according to the comments of some of the Aryans, I am not delighted with Ukraine after that, and in alliance with their slogans about disconnection, I also heard a lot. But the point is not in individuals, not in those and not in the present. The point is global, we are historically one people, one linguistic group and the same roots. Russia should not be dominant and play the role of a sow about ten titties, but unite on equal terms, and together build a future with both Ukraine and other joining republics. Everyone's potential is now about the same (if you exclude the oil pipe), you can build a normal union state on an equal footing. You propose .. first to raise Russia, so that then with high dictate conditions to those who decide to join. Firstly, it will be like a strong country in the EU will pull the weak .. and secondly .. while Russia is getting stronger .. in these republics to stop time or what? Other kind people can be found who can "help" these republics with a choice. And whether these republics will want to unite later is another question. And why are you so worried about your business? many that you fed ?? And about your example, I can say one thing, maybe in large families they do not live richly, but they will be able to give a thread of one to the offending one very well. At the moment I think this is more important.
            1. -4
              25 October 2011 12: 48
              This is your personal opinion, but mine is different from yours, but this does not mean that it is crap. As for me, your opinion is so crap, but I am silent and avoid aggressive statements.
              If you want to unite, please, but if there is a vote, I will vote against. Personally, my opinion.
              And as far as hell, well, there will be a large family of 6 people consisting of and 2 brothers who went to the boxing sections who worked in the gyms will go out against them, they pay these 6s at once, because 6's don’t have money on the section and there is nothing to eat.
              Do you propose again how to crush the world’s 2? Stupidly to drive the crowds, you look at one of 10 and run.
              Yes, it’s better that our army will consist of 600 000 people, but it will be well funded, soldiers will be well trained dressed and armed.
              There will be a technique of all new generations. In my opinion, this is more effective than an untrained crowd.
              As for how many I fed, I fed my family, I help my relatives, my parents and this is enough for me.
              1. mitrich
                +1
                25 October 2011 13: 01
                Join JOKER
                Firstly, in Russia we have so far many problems.
                Secondly, the costs for Ukrainian little brothers will require the same amount of billions as for Chechnya, but not in rubles, but in dollars.
                Thirdly, it’s impossible to see Ukrainian comrades kneeling along the border, crying tearfully: "Let's take us back! We ask you very much!" I went here the other day to purely Ukrainian forums, so there this topic is generally irrelevant.
                For now, we will strengthen unity with Belarus and Kazakhstan. In about 20 years, you see, Ukrainians will grow wiser, Bogatyr will mature, then it will be possible to talk about something that way ...
                1. Gur
                  +5
                  26 October 2011 10: 15
                  mitrich Joker, if you read my comment carefully, you would have noticed that I wrote, Russia should not act as a nurse and a patronizing older brother, but I’m looking at you so much I want to poke everyone’s face and show who is the boss or at least who will be. I think that this will not happen, what do you expect from the example of Chechnya, I think it will not be possible .. since it is unlikely that the union republics will be part of Russia, (Chechnya subject) and this will be a union state with its capitals and government, not one of the republics It’s unlikely to agree to lie completely under Moscow, and dance from here. Yes, of course, Russia will most likely have to reconsider its gas policy, etc. with respect to Ukraine and Belarus, but not only Russia but Kazakhstan with its gas and oil are already speaking here. But is it not for the purpose of creating an alliance so that we can help each other and share what we have, while creating a strong union state.
                  The fact that Ukrainians and Kazakhs, Belarusians are not all eager to unite, it is understandable .. firstly, not everyone wants to be blamed for their marriage, secondly, in many republics their own class of bourgeoisie has formed, and the integration of Russia into their republics is not beneficial for them , they can surpass .. there are facts, and thirdly, there are nationalist-minded masses who because of this blinker do not want to see further, and many comrades also create a name for themselves on this. Waiting for some to grow wiser (I wonder how long it will take) and others to mature (the same question) may just not have enough time, and we risk being stupid and not developed, we just might not be allowed to do this.
                  About two brothers boxers .. of course vital)))) But from experience everything is not at all so, I think that these 6 ro are also not suckers and dystrophanes .. and the proverb is a confirmation of this "It is easier to beat the dad"
                  As for the 600 thousand army with all the tricks .. of course it would not be bad, but this army without an idea for what and for what, believe zilch.
                  (amer example) We have always won not only by the power of weapons, but also by the strength of the spirit and the power of ideas.
                  About the fact that he fed the family and relatives, for that they gave birth to you .. and more ??
                  1. mitrich
                    -1
                    26 October 2011 10: 50
                    Gur,
                    my friend (it’s nothing that I’m so easy for you), this does not happen even in marriage that you described (I tried to read your opinion more closely feel ) And there was already a country created on such principles - the USSR, but all the same, a bunch of piglets sucked one uterus, which was called the RSFSR.
                    We will assume that your soul is broad and kind, and we have a philistine, petty-bourgeois one.
                    With a compliment!
                    1. Gur
                      +5
                      26 October 2011 11: 32
                      It’s pretty awesome wink , So buddy, of course marriages are different, and are made in heaven))))) we are all prosaic and not the same situevina, I’m not so much older than your age, and you and I should know at least that under the USSR all republics accused Moscow of pulling money from all regions onto itself. The fact that Moscow and Russia as a whole (as well as Belarus and Ukraine) for the rest of the community in the USSR was the brain and dated all the construction of factories, newspapers, parades, there is no dispute. But this was already needed not by individual republics, but by the entire USSR, and its collapse, as it were, was not supposed. At the moment, with the introduction of a single customs union, do you know what percentage of customs duties is deducted as a percentage of Russia Belarus Kazakhstan ?? if they didn’t lie to me from 70-75%, Russia gets the rest, Kazakhstan and Belarus share; moreover, the percentage of Belarusians is less than that of Kazakhs. I think this is a good example. True, what is the reason for this, I do not know. Perhaps the fact that Russia is now building customs terminals in Kazakhstan, maybe the situation will change later .. I don’t know. My soul may be kind, but I, as a Russian person, especially living in Kazakhstan .. are very interested in a strong, developed Russia, and as a Soviet person I am no less interested in a large and strong state .. call him anything, in the state where everything should be adequate and equivalent. And so that God forbid what, I would not have to listen to such speeches that are often heard on the internet from both Kazakhs and Ukrainians .. and from the Russians themselves.
                      Yours!
                      1. Marat
                        +1
                        26 October 2011 21: 03
                        I, too, Gur think that we will not be enough with the Russians and Belarusians. It is necessary to tighten Ukraine - no one canceled geopolitics - with Ukraine it will no longer be the CES but a revived "empire" - so necessary for all of us now
      2. evg5835
        -2
        24 October 2011 23: 32
        Is it better to restore order together, or you don’t have a brother?
        1. -3
          25 October 2011 00: 56
          There is a younger brother, and before he comes to visit me, I clean the house, but in your opinion I have to wait for my brother and he will clean it in my house with me. Came to visit, clean. This is similar to merging.
      3. Aleksey42
        +4
        26 October 2011 20: 50
        I'm afraid it’ll be too late. The point is not even in external threats, but in the fact that a generation that does not know what the USSR is will grow up. With all the ensuing consequences. Well, I agree, it’s urgent to put things in order.
  14. +10
    24 October 2011 10: 27
    The reunification will surely happen, as they say, a matter of time, life itself will force you to do it, it's just that the Ukrainians need time to understand that Europe, Ukraine, in its composition, is not needed under any sauce, so they will keep like Turkey on a tight leash - they will not let go far, but not close they will admit, at first they may even be accepted into NATO, "cannon fodder" is never superfluous (how many state secrets have been taken away in Afghanistan as part of NATO), but in order to really provide economic assistance, implying the modernization of production, the injection of investments into industry - never. So the Slavs "left-bank" and "right-bank" Europe need you only to solve their mercantile interests.
  15. Sobibor
    -5
    24 October 2011 10: 40
    lol patstal

    Do you even believe that?
    The only politician in favor of reunification is gaining less than 0,3% of the vote. For example, far-right nationalists gain 6%.

    For new generations - Russia is a zilch, not a fraternal country
    1. +2
      24 October 2011 10: 42
      Absolutely.
  16. -2
    24 October 2011 10: 41
    It is clear that the true national interest of the population of Ukraine is the reunification of Little Russia with Great Russia

    The author is clear, but the Ukrainians think differently. Even despite the eastern Ukraine and Crimea, most Ukrainians are still for independence.
    1. +2
      24 October 2011 11: 16
      What sources do you get information from? Yes, it’s so lame? I visit Ukraine every year and I know the mood of people, I repeat, people, not those creatures who plunder the country, and they lick the west for dachas.
      1. +3
        24 October 2011 11: 20
        So in my opinion for independence most of the inhabitants were, and now they have somehow changed their opinion radically. For what they fought for it and ran, let them now disentangle themselves.
        1. Mahamont
          -2
          24 October 2011 18: 46
          - "So in my opinion" .. (Joker)
          That's it, in your opinion. They just forgot to ask the Ukrainians themselves.
          1. +2
            24 October 2011 19: 02
            I do not live in Ukraine, I could be wrong. Truth is born in a dispute.
      2. -1
        24 October 2011 11: 31
        I also go there very often - my relatives live in Nikolaev. The sentiment of the elderly is back to the USSR, while young people and middle-aged people are in no hurry to reunite. Moreover, everyone understands who will be the "elder brother" in the new union.
        It may seem strange to you, but Ukrainian industry has survived the collapse of the USSR better than Russia. In the absence of (Donbass coal does not count) hydrocarbons for export, Ukraine had to be content with its own. There, in stores, local products are orders of magnitude greater than in Russia. In Nikolaev, the Southern Turbine Plant, Alumina Plant, Shipbuilding industry, and the food industry are working pretty well.

        Another source that I can refer to was the election. In the elections before last, turnout was higher and pro-Western forces prevailed, in the latter, on the contrary.
      3. Graaf
        +4
        24 October 2011 18: 08
        ... You visit every year, and I live here and see much more than you!
        My business trips in Ukraine and heartfelt conversations (not under the recorder of the KGB-shnik) ... for a snack with friends, partners, and colleagues showed that after all, most Ukrainians are for independence. I will not write a percentage. But believe me, I know what I'm talking about. Yes, the older generation is still sleeping and seeing in the pink dreams of the USSR, but the generation of 20-30 year olds is already different. They see everything differently. And most importantly, for them the cult of money means much more than the cult of the CPSU for us at one time.
        1. +4
          24 October 2011 20: 15
          So they have already matured faith in the bright future of independent Ukraine, but that's what it (this faith) is based on, please enlighten, Count?
        2. Aleksey42
          +1
          26 October 2011 21: 00
          When the generation grows up, integration not living in the USSR will be very difficult.
  17. +4
    24 October 2011 11: 29
    Che-billines with tolins are not visible yet have not crept out of their holes or something
    1. stalker
      +1
      24 October 2011 16: 35
      And the hero)))
  18. 0
    24 October 2011 11: 31
    I also go there very often - my relatives live in Nikolaev. The sentiment of the elderly is back to the USSR, while young people and middle-aged people are in no hurry to reunite. Moreover, everyone understands who will be the "elder brother" in the new union.
    It may seem strange to you, but Ukrainian industry has survived the collapse of the USSR better than Russia. In the absence of (Donbass coal does not count) hydrocarbons for export, Ukraine had to be content with its own. There, in stores, local products are orders of magnitude greater than in Russia. In Nikolaev, the Southern Turbine Plant, Alumina Plant, Shipbuilding industry, and the food industry are working pretty well.

    Another source that I can refer to was the election. In the elections before last, turnout was higher and pro-Western forces prevailed, in the latter, on the contrary.
  19. +3
    24 October 2011 11: 52
    hang Western provocateurs without trial, who wants to divide our people, we are one whole whole RUSSIA is Kievan Rus !!!
    1. ZHORA
      -7
      24 October 2011 14: 31
      Mom - Dmitry Donskoy

      Hello dear brother Dmitry!
      A rumor reached me that you, having fallen under the influence of the nationalist Sergius of Radonezh, succumbed to the persuasions of the separate boyars-separatists, headed for the separation of the Moscow principality from the Golden Horde. That your people everywhere are shouting about some kind of "Mongol-Tatar yoke". That the Tatar soldiers are already called occupiers in the Moscow region. That my baskak was beaten in Suzdal. What do you demand that the Moscow soldiers who have sworn allegiance to the Horde now give a new oath to the Moscow principality ...
      Think about it, brother Dmitry! How can you cut Muscovy from the Horde alive? You know that I am not a great-power Genghisist, but almost half the Moskvite. My nanny was a barbarian of Barbara. And who said that there is a separate Moscow people? We are the united Golden Horde nation. Our people were divided (not for long) only in the XNUMXth century, when the Kiev predator Oleg conquered part of the Khazars, our common ancestors. Look at yourself, how many among you Muscovites are slanted, cheeky and snub-nosed? Not without reason there is a saying: scrape Muscovite thoroughly and you will find Tatar. Your
      language is almost ours. A hero, a dressing gown, a watermelon, a sofa, a barn, a taiga, a pencil, money, a horse, a stocking, a coachman, an attic, a halva, a suitcase, a fool, a demob, a lazy altlyn, a label, a bondage, a prison, a commotion, and hundreds of others - these are yours and ours the words.
      It was only later, during the Kiev subtraction, the non-folk Moscow language was grown, stuffed with Slavic words and the temptation to wean Muscovites from the Tatar speech and the temptation of Moscow nationalism. It comes to the ridiculous, popular ignorance that "Moscow, Vladimir, Novgorod are all Russian cities." As if we don't know here that only a strip of land from Tmutarakan to the Carpathians is called Rus? As if the Moscow or Novgorod chroniclers, noting the trips of their princes to Kiev, did not write "... I went to Russia on such and such a date ..."
      For thousands of years we have had one faith. Our ancestors worshiped the same Sun and the same idols. Kiev imposed Christianity on us. But there were many Nestorian Christians among Baty's warriors. In 1260, the Christian Mongols went to Palestine to free the Holy Sepulcher from the Muslims. Then, however, in 1312, Khan Uzbek himself converted to Islam. But we have never infringed upon your old faith. About Khan Dzhanibek your chronicler says that "this tsar Chyanibek Azbyakovich is very good to Christianity." Khan Berke allowed the Muscovites who lived in Sarai to openly conduct their divine services, so that Metropolitan Kirill established a special Sarsk monastery for them. And in general, to share on religious grounds is barbaric. In addition, Muscovites and Tatars very often mutually changed their faith. Since ancient times, the Horde people have settled in Moscow cities and accepted Orthodoxy. The Tatar official Bucha, collecting tribute from residents in Ustyug, fell in love with a local girl Maria and, in order to marry her, was baptized under the name of John. Subsequently, he built the Church of St. John the Baptist, which, you know, still stands today. And in Yaroslavl, the monk Zosima accepted our Mohammedan faith. Remember, Batu made Alexander Nevsky his adopted son and trusted him with the leadership of the Tatar-Russian troops, when some "independent" cities flatly refused to help defend the sacred borders of the Horde from the Teutons. Together we drowned enemies on Lake Peipsi. And without any fleet.
      Today, separating Muscovy means cutting through millions of families and people: what a mixture of population; whole regions with a Tatar preponderance, how many people are at a loss to choose their nationality from two ... Aksakov, Asadovs, Baksakovs, Basmanovs, Bekhterevs, Bulgakovs, Korsanovs, Beklemishevs, Chaadaevs, Kolychevs, Karamyshevs, Buturlins, Kurakins, Sabyurovs, Ogurovs, Ugyuroshov, Sabyurovs, Ogyrovs, Arakcheevs, Mansurovs, Saltykovs, Bakhmetyevs, Musins, Muratovs, Isaevs, Sheremetyevs, Yusupovs, Bulatovs, Izmailovs - who are they? Muscovites? Tatars? And where is the border between Muscovy and Tatarstan? For hundreds of years we have lived together without knowing any boundaries! Who will turn the tongue to say that Tula, named after Queen Taydula, wife Dzhanibekova, is a Moscow city? And the bottom one? If Tokhtamysh foolishly or drunk gave Vasily I a label on the Principality of Nizhny Novgorod, it does not follow from this that the Tatar people will abandon the lands that are the lands of Tatar glory. No one asked the hundreds of thousands of Tatars living in the Lower House whether they would like to be presented as something. Our muftis examined this shameful act and came to the conclusion that the label of Tokhtamysh has no legal force, since the universal Kurultai of the Tatar-speaking population was not held when transferring the Principality of Nizhny Novgorod to Muscovy. So far we have decided to declare Lower as the eleventh ulus, and then we'll see. And the lands along the upper Volga and Kama? Expand the fourteenth scroll
      "Golden Horde history". We read: "Novotatariya. This is the name of the space conquered by the Most Serene Khan Baty and includes the Vologda, Kostroma, Chukhlomskaya and Vyatsky uluses." Maybe you, Dmitry, would like to include Crimea in Muscovy too? Or hehe! - Siberia? All Europe is uniting (I heard that over there Lithuania is going to unite with Poland), and you decided to disunite. Yes, it is bitter to remember Batu's harsh actions against Kozelsk and some other cities. But, after all, Kozeltsy was the first to attack our ambassadors, who came with peace proposals? There were many more positive examples. Together we stopped the onslaught of the German hordes to the East on Lake Peipsi. Muscovites and Tatars fought shoulder to shoulder against aggressive Lithuania and its vassals - Russian princes. The reunification of Muscovy with the Golden Horde - and this was how it was perceived by everyone - opened the way to your lands for Khiva and Bukhara merchants, which had a beneficial effect on the economy. The wise elder Tatar brother helped the younger Moscow brother to master the firm Horde discipline, military prowess, truly Asian character and mercilessness towards the enemies of the Horde ...
      Some Muscovites scream as if the Tatars were robbing them. This is a shameless lie. Show me where we looted? Look how the Muscovite lives. He lives in a hut, eats rich cabbage soup and a hare pie. A simple Tatar lives in a wagon, suffers dust and cold, feeds on millet and raw horse meat. So who is robbing whom?
      With particular anxiety, I follow the pulling of troops. Let us recall our military friendship, sealed with blood, as the Tatars, together with Gleb Smolensky and Roman Bryansk, conquered Lithuania, like your grandfather Ivan Kalita and the Khan Uzbek beat Tver traitors! Now from the warriors who have sworn an oath to the Golden Horde, they demand an oath to Moscow! Where is your military honor, Dmitry? Who honored you with grand dignity? Murut! Who did you swear allegiance to on your knees? The horde! But a real man swears only once in his life! Traitor! And now you also declared the spears made in the Kopeysk yard as your property. But the Kopeyny Yard, Dmitry, was built at the expense of the entire Horde. Crush an army - create thousands of difficulties. For example, Kasimov artisans supply horseshoe nails to the whole Horde. This is the same single agricultural complex! And where do you get experienced temniks? And how will the Muscovites command horses if they obey only Tatar commands? You want to have your army immediately and immediately. Moreover, you do not provide chambers to my centurions who did not want to swear an oath to you, and they are forced to suffer, living with their families in torn yurts. Okay, I’m allowing you some power (say 100 light archers) to have at your disposal to maintain internal order. But pull away the whole army?
      I ask you, Dmitry: come to your senses! Do not push our fraternal peoples against our foreheads.
      History will not forgive you.
      Your brother MOMAI


      17.12.2006/19/50 - 1:1993 First published in Russia, in the newspaper of the Kuban Cossacks "Kozatske Slovo" NXNUMX, XNUMX, edited by the turkologist VL.KOVALENKO. (from)
      1. Evil Tatar
        +2
        24 October 2011 15: 50
        I see ...
        Everything could be ...
        But time passes and everything changes.
        From Ivan the Terrible everything is girlfriend. Five centuries already.
        An interesting interpretation. But annoying almost like Dom-2 ...
        So many events, but they did not report to us. Here you go ...
        It is worth seriously considering the Russians, Ukrainians, Belarusians !!!!!!!!
        For a ravine to turn into a precipice, another generation will have to live apart. 25 years old and all ...
        Our great-grandchildren will read a similar text and do not hesitate - what the hell?
        Mom, Dmitry, etc.
        Gorbachev, Kuchma, Yeltsin, Putin, Yanukovych, Medvedev?
        Aaaaaaa, are those the ones that made us live like that? Is it so inglorious for our fathers and grandfathers to die?
        A shame!
      2. +1
        24 October 2011 15: 59
        ZHORA - very interesting infa ... it would be interesting to know about the source
      3. NUT
        NUT
        -2
        24 October 2011 16: 12
        Well, Zhora, I ate a pound and almost without a bite, while I read everything, I realized and checked out

        I have no words
        well done
        respect
      4. +6
        24 October 2011 16: 14
        A miserable little article, historical facts taken out of context mixed with cheap irony, written after the collapse of the USSR to strengthen centrifugal forces, designed to consolidate success in the post-Soviet space, was written to cultivate nationalist sentiments in the former USSR and BSSR. There were a lot of such statues in those days, I just served in the ranks of the armed forces of the Russian Federation at that time, fathers commanders showed us such a lot, but they say they’re doing something.
        1. +3
          24 October 2011 20: 22
          By Miserable article I mean the one that ZHORA pushes us
      5. stalker
        +4
        24 October 2011 16: 58
        And what do you want to prove with this bullshit? Lord Veliky Novgorod, Suzdal, Vladimir, Yaroslavl were founded before the Mongol invasion, founded by the Slavs. Yes, in addition to the Slavs, Finno-Ugric and Turkic peoples lived on these lands, there was a mixture, so what? Culture, traditions and faith have not changed, and this is the basis of the people. And about "scrub well", so you scrape yourself and "scrub" your Pechenegs, Polovtsians, Lithuanians and Hungarians with Wallachians)
        1. +6
          24 October 2011 20: 39
          Some sources claim that there was no invasion either. There is no evidence: the old frescoes are zbit, the annals are burnt, the icons are redrawn. Something unintelligible.
          Erase the story of the heroic past of the people, and it will not be difficult to control these people, and Zhora the fucking pump, confirmed this with the help of his writings. George directs you. Do not confuse liberation with a split.
      6. +2
        25 October 2011 05: 07
        Only in this post-"letter" there is one problem - Dmitry Donskoy was not going to disconnect from the Horde. In the Horde there was Tokhtamysh Khan, Mamai was an ordinary rebel, something like PoNos in Libya, and he wanted to grab a separate power for himself, for which he fought.
        In general, I am a supporter of the theory that this very "Tatar yoke" in the West was invented, otherwise it turns out to be fucking inconsistent - right up to the Battle of Grunwald, when the Tatar cavalry fought together with the Poles and Russians against the Germans. And Alexander Nevsky for some reason saw the threat not in Baty, but again in the Germans. In short, everything is complicated.
      7. Aleksey42
        +2
        26 October 2011 21: 02
        So, by the way. Ivan the Terrible was a descendant of Dmitry Donskoy and Mamaia. And during the Battle of Kulikovo, who would have thought.
    2. +3
      24 October 2011 21: 38
      Why hang up, have mercy. In the family, in the family! In the family, as they say, not without a freak)
      1. +1
        24 October 2011 22: 09
        Usually freaks in the family are sent for forced treatment so that they are human.
  20. lightforcer
    +1
    24 October 2011 12: 01
    Ukraine with such a population, industrial potential, and the legacy of the Soviet army must was to become the best post-Soviet power. However, something did not.
  21. +3
    24 October 2011 12: 13
    remember World War II when Hitler wanted to solve his economic problems by capturing the European part of the USSR Hitler was not ready to wage protracted wars, so he came up with a plan for a quick war because there was a crisis in Europe but he underestimated our people so that Europe needs us as raw materials and nothing else
  22. kesa1111
    +1
    24 October 2011 12: 19
    An objective criterion for assessing: compare over the years the number of people wishing to obtain Russian citizenship. What happens here and the standard of living they know.
  23. VALENOK
    +8
    24 October 2011 13: 02
    I’ve been to Ukraine for 15 years and I know the mood of the people there, they started to live by their own law and not by order from Moscow, then they decided that they would be taken to the European Union faster and more accurately without Russia, then America would help them if he they will be on the NATO side, then Poland promised to lobby their interests in Europe and help with integration with the West. As a result, now, apart from us, the Slav brothers are not needed. When I talked with a Ukrainian nationalist, he told me that they were true Slavs and not Russian by the fact that in the beginning there was Kievan Rus, and when I proved to him that there was before Kievan Rus, the great Novgorod he immediately became silent, so do not pay attention to their nationalists they are stupid sheep. And Ukraine is our land of our common ancestors, and the Ukrainian people are our people, and their brothers are not reproached with a piece of bread
    1. ZHORA
      -7
      24 October 2011 14: 38
      There were no Ugric-Finnish tribes of Novgorod, Chud, Meria, and the same Slavic tribe of Slovenia mixed with them ...
      1. lightforcer
        +4
        24 October 2011 16: 52
        That's right, there was no Novgorod. It was just Russia, which captured Kiev and moved the capital.
        1. Tolia
          -2
          24 October 2011 19: 56
          Yah?!?

          The Novgorod Chronicle of the younger edition mentions Novgorodians in undated times of the legendary Kiy.

          "In the times of Kyev and Shchek and Horyv Novgorodsti people, the recommendations of Slovenia, and Krivitsi and Merya: Sloven had their volost (their reign - in many other chronicles) they had, and Krivitsi theirs, and Mere theirs; kozhd his own ruler."

          Do not confuse the Finno-Ugrians and the Vikings who were in Novgorod in transit)
          1. lightforcer
            0
            24 October 2011 21: 58
            I will say just two words. Khazar Khaganate.
        2. +2
          24 October 2011 21: 04
          You are claiming that you lived in those times. Here you are attached, Moscow and Kiev, here, in general, we are talking about peoples, and you come up with some political insults.
      2. Aleksey42
        +7
        26 October 2011 21: 09
        Jora, so many nationalities are mixed in me that God alone knows who I am. Grandmothers are Polish and Ukrainian, Russian grandfathers (in the foreseeable past), most likely there are Tatars and someone else. My wife is Tatar, so the children are still a mixture. And still I consider myself RUSSIAN. Because I think, I speak, I write in Russian. I was born here, I hope to die here (though not yet soon). And I consider Pushkin and Gogol RUSSIAN! And I spat from a high bell tower on your theories. Let us be one people, it’s better for everyone.
  24. Max
    Max
    +2
    24 October 2011 13: 04
    Europe needs Ukraine, because if the empire does not expand - it will perish, this is eternal wisdom. But Russia needs Russia even more, because as Samson correctly noted, only together with Ukraine can Russia restore its former greatness. Here is such a tidbit.
    Yanukovych insists on euro integration, but if the association with the EU is postponed due to Tymoshenko’s affair, it’s worthless to say that we did everything to take us, and if you interfere in our sovereign affairs, you don’t go to the meeting, and even impose sanctions on politicians. And quietly, sideways, he will sign an agreement after an agreement with Moscow, at that time an information machine will work, formatting the consciousness of Ukrainians to the other pole of the union. And somewhere somewhere in 3-4 years, Ukraine will enter the Customs Union. And then to the Eurasian Union. Only this is the same as going from Kiev to Brussels through Moscow. Because The Russian Federation itself is now integrating frantically with the EU in all plans, and the issue of unification of the Eurasian Union with the EU will be resolved within 20 years. Thus, a Mega mainland union will be formed in the likeness of the North or South American or African unions.

    Z.Y. I want to remind some members of the forum that the country's accession to the EU or the Eurasian Union is not a loss of independence since a country can leave this union at any time. And cooperation does not occur as in Soviet times, but on equal terms. You should not think in stereotypes.
    1. +6
      24 October 2011 15: 01
      inappropriately confuse the gift of God with Iishnetsa Europe this sucks cesspool for RUSSIA future !!!
  25. abzrais
    0
    24 October 2011 13: 10
    It’s time to unite for a long time. To make the hryvnia, rather than the ruble, by payment currency, it is so convenient to pay hryvnias in Ukraine. As in Soviet times, prices are obtained. And you just need to hold a referendum. The people will not be against. And now in the near future it is possible to cancel border guards and customs at the borders.
  26. +6
    24 October 2011 13: 23
    Eco suffered a lot for the worse !? Most of these opponents of reunion probably after the 80s release ....
    Those who write against reunification, that something in other posters shouts most of all about the inseparability of the Russian lands, about the restoration of historical lands.
    The author wrote ... for those who do not remember the lessons of history (in the tank), Russia was originally Kievan ... many of our ancestors were from these lands. And many screamers would probably be surprised that their ancestors were from the Chernihiv region, the Kiev region.
    Lost roots, distant, close relatives live there. Why shouldn’t we reunite with them?
    Or do we have to wait until Shlyakhtichi, Germans, Pindos come to us?
    They sit there and sharpen ...
    They then bring discord and confusion into our peoples, so that we would not go to reunion. They then feed the money Tymoshenko, Yushchenko and other autocrats ...
    And, to ordinary people what? Correctly....!
    Ukrainians! A working people, and as an example to many of our ...
    And if our rulers systematically conducted work in this direction, not only diplomatic. And, Ukraine would enter into a single customs space, and the standard of living would gradually level out. And, there, and to reunion is not far.
    Ah, doing nothing. Gouging only into the gas pipe. Not pursuing an offensive policy, not taking "sufficient measures" to strive for unification. Nothing will happen!
    And, about zapadentsev .... yes, they should be taken, they are Lyakhi, yes Magyars, and there is no blood ....
    1. +3
      24 October 2011 13: 53
      CORRECTLY SPEAKING WE ARE ONE WHOLE WE ARE ALL FROM UKRAINE TO THE FAREST EAST
      1. +1
        24 October 2011 13: 56
        Guys, I'm sorry for being rude, but stop masturbating on a poster from the USSR.
        1. -1
          24 October 2011 14: 58
          Regarding the USSR, I myself am against it. I think that RUSSIA should remain RUSSIA and no one has recently the right to rename it. I myself am against the USSR, but FOR RUSSIA I HAVE ALL HANDS FOR !!! TAKE THE SAME FRANCE how many revolutions no one renamed
          1. +1
            24 October 2011 17: 33
            Ukrainians after the reunification will whine, it seems to me they will not want to be called Russia.
            1. Gur
              +1
              28 October 2011 11: 46
              ))))))) pi pe c ... what do you have with your head then ?? In general, it is about creating a union state and not a single Russian Empire with the composition of Belarus Belarus, Kazakhstan, where you picked up such vulgarity .. this was possible only in the old days, and was not even under the USSR. Yes, in fact, everything was controlled from Moscow, but each republic was legally and actually separate republics with their governing bodies included in the united state of the USSR. And the fact that you thought up it is only possible .... yes, there is no nonsense ... even now the composition of the Russian Federation includes republics.
  27. TAMERLAN
    +2
    24 October 2011 14: 34
    the people should decide the fate of any country and not the official who needs only power and money, the referendum of the peoples of these countries is NECESSARY and I think that the common people will decide everything correctly - we are brothers and we must live together we do not need borders that separate families and relatives
    1. ZHORA
      -10
      24 October 2011 14: 44
      A very typical nickname for a "relative"))))))
      1. Evil Tatar
        -4
        24 October 2011 16: 05
        Zhora, do not drive ...
        The letter And, on the keyboard, right next to the letter T ...
        What are you just like a little?
        A referendum is an unreliable thing ...
        Forged. And then what?
  28. mitrich
    +5
    24 October 2011 15: 08
    What surprises and amuses me is that Gazprom, from time to time accusing the Ukrainian side of gas theft (in the language of legal verbiage - "selection"), calls those: "Our Ukrainian COLLEAGUES" wink !
  29. zczczc
    +4
    24 October 2011 15: 29
    Everything is correctly said in the article - without Ukraine we are not an Empire. And Ukraine without Russia for sure.

    I will say even more - if we find the strength in ourselves to overcome the differences with Poland imposed by the Catholics and reunite with it, then this will be a blow throughout Western Europe. Blow in the good sense of the word. Following will join the Czech Republic, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Serbia. We will be closer than ever to the reunification of the Slavic world. Only the eastern part of Germany, which is historically ours, but not practically, will remain.

    ----------
    About Tymoshenko - this is a bargain, do not have illusions.
    1. +1
      24 October 2011 16: 12
      Well, you said something, Poland! I’d better give up my words about the detachment (actually I won’t refuse) of the Caucasus. But not this. It is this. Poland does not deserve more.
      1. +1
        24 October 2011 16: 41
        Poland is not ours at all not yours, it can’t figure it out at home, it’s hard at home trying to learn so that Poland knows that other countries of the Euro have lived out of themselves so that Europe is a complete degradation
      2. zczczc
        0
        24 October 2011 16: 47
        almost demobilizationwithout Poland we can’t see influence in Europe. It is Poland that is watering us in the eyes of Europeans. Brzezinski one is worth something.

        In fact, not everything is so scary. If the Poles were bombed by Catholics at one time, then they can change their mind again. And they’ll change, I’m sure. The Pole's mentality is special - he proves himself right to the end, but if he understands the wrong, he will acknowledge the error. The main thing is to be able to convey the arguments. Therefore, Poland on the side of Russia is not just a country, but an ideological weapon against all of Europe.

        Compared to many Caucasians - the opposite is true. A Caucasian can admit that he is wrong, but cannot help but save face. Those. does not publicly recognize. For example, Armenia can assure at any time that it is on your side, but it is never on your side :)
        1. +4
          24 October 2011 18: 37
          Poland has never been a friend to us and constantly pours us dirt on it clings to every little thing to spoil RUSSIA probably offended by the fact that MININ POGARSKY piston inserted Poles
          1. Tolia
            -10
            24 October 2011 20: 23
            It is on such historical myths that the patreots who do not know history are brought up ..

            From the final fall of Moscow in front of the Polish-UKRAINIAN troops commanded by the Ukrainian hetman Sagaidachny (who did not lose a single battle either on land or at sea, the Poles still keep his saber as a holy relic in the royal Wawel castle in Krakow) saved the cold November came, and there was nothing to plunder, all the surroundings were cleaned out, Moscow was no longer of any value. Sagaidachny lifted the siege (some say also because of Christian compassion "... tormented by reproaches of conscience, on behalf of the entire Zaporozhye Army, he asked the Jerusalem Patriarch Theophanes" for absolution of the sin of the Christian blood spill in Moscow ", to which Patriarch Theophanes" ... they went to Moscow, saying that they fell under the curse, indicating for this the reason that Moscow is Christians "), and according to the terms of the peace that Muscovy concluded with Speech pospolita (Deulinskoe agreement), Vladislav renounced his rights to the Moscow throne, for which Poland the Smolensk and Chernigov-Seversk lands (29 cities in total) retreated Zaporozhye Cossacks for the ruin of the lands of the Russian kingdom received payment from the Polish king - 20 thousand gold and 7 thousand pieces of cloth.

            What do you call the inserted piston giving your land?!?

            And by the way, for the courage and courage shown during the capture of Smolensk, King Vladislav awarded the future hetman of Ukraine Bogdan Khmelnitsky a gold saber. And Pozharsky was defeated, captured and executed in the battle of Konotop under the command of another Ukrainian hetman Vygovsky.
            1. Sergh
              0
              24 October 2011 20: 47
              In the process of formation of the old Russian feudal power - Kievan Rus, which ended by the 1054th century, Chernigov-Seversky land also became a part of it. The further development of feudal relations and the strengthening of the power of local feudal lords led in 1503 to the formation of the Grand Duchy with its center in Chernigov, uniting Chernihiv-Seversky land and Tmutarakan. As a result of the Russian-Lithuanian war in 1653, Chernigov-Seversky land remained part of Russia, with the exception of a small part near Oster. In 1667, it was decided to reunite Ukraine with Russia, and another war broke out between Poland and Russia. The hostilities ended in 1781 with the Andrusov Armistice, according to which Left-Bank Ukraine and Chernihiv Oblast became part of Russia. In 1796, the Chernigov and Novgorod-Seversk governorates were established, and in 1802, the Little Russian province was created in their place with the center in the city of Chernigov. In 1923, the Little Russian province was divided into two: Chernihiv and Poltava. In the years 1932-1932. several administrative reforms were carried out, the last of which led in XNUMX to the creation of the Chernihiv region.

              The territory of the modern region has been inhabited since the early Paleolithic. In the 7–8 centuries. Here lived the East Slavic tribes of the Siverans. With education in the 9th century. Kievan Rus Chernihiv - Siverskaya land became part of it. In the 11th century. the Chernigov Principality was formed. Its population waged an almost continuous war with the Polovtsy.

              Everyone knows the campaign of Prince Igor Svyatoslavovich from the “Tale of Igor's Campaign”.

              Throughout 11 - 12vv. The Principality of Chernigov disintegrated into Novgorod - Siverskoye, Putivlskoe, Rylskoe, and in 1127 the Murom-Ryazan land and other specific princedoms were allocated. In 1239, the Tatar-Mongol army swept over the edge. In the 14th century The Principality of Chernigov was captured by Lithuania. Since 1503, Chernihiv - Sivershchina has been a part of the Russian state. In 1618, according to the Deulin ceasefire, it was ceded to Poland. In 1635, the Polish government formed the Chernihiv Voivodeship, which was liquidated at the beginning of the war of liberation 1648-54. and on its territory the Chernigov, Nezhinsky, Pryluksky and Starodubsky regiments were formed.

              In 1654, Chernihiv as a part of Left-Bank Ukraine was connected with the Russian state. Participation in the war with Russia on the side of the hetman Ivan Mazepa and the Swedish king Charles XII cost the region the complete destruction of the hetman's residence - Baturin in 1708. After the liquidation of the Second Zaporizhzhya Sich and Cossack self-government in 1775, the regimental administrative-territorial division was liquidated. the composition of Chernihiv and Novgorod - Siversky governorates (1782 - 96), the Little Russian province (1797 - 1802), and from 1802 - the Chernihiv and Poltava provinces.
              1. zczczc
                +1
                24 October 2011 21: 09
                Simply put, all vertically oriented (on the map) interlayer states between Russia and Europe are doomed to decay, because they find themselves between a rock and a hard place. And what is significant - the hammer and the anvil (Europe and Russia) through the interlayer can calmly be friends.
                Therefore, the Commonwealth was doomed initially.

                1. Tolia
                  -13
                  24 October 2011 21: 43
                  If it were not for the Polish desire to plant Catholicism by any forces and not the ambitions of their gentry ... That would have lived up to this day, the Speech, which consists of three equal peoples of Ukraine, Poland, Lithuania (the same Belarusians). From sea to sea! And so, because of their shortsightedness and the peculiarities of the political structure of the Political Speech, which caused the oppression of the Ukrainians, they raised them to revolt. As a result, the Ukrainians "killed" Speech by Cossack wars, and the result was taken advantage of by Moscow, which was sitting in the darkness of ignorance in forests and swamps. Ukraine made Russia an empire ... "It was not Peter's Germans, but Catherine's Ukrainians who made Russia an empire," said some Russian classic .... He was talking about the scientists of the Kiev-Mohyla, Ostrog academies who were the first teachers in the academy created by Peter sciences about hundreds of Cossack elders who received the nobility and joined the new formation and helped build this German woman a new state. About people like Rozumovsky, Bezborodko., Kochubei, Zavadovsky and others ...
                  1. raf
                    +4
                    24 October 2011 21: 53
                    Well, yes, yes, the Ukrainians made Russia an empire, a GREAT EMPIRE from the Baltic to the Pacific Ocean, no one else! laughing
                  2. Tyumen
                    0
                    24 October 2011 22: 07
                    Quote: Tolya
                    "It was not Peter's Germans, but Catherine's Ukrainians who made Russia an empire," said some Russian classic ..


                    Is it your Zaporozhye Cossacks or something that Potemkin either dispersed or collected?
                    1. Tolia
                      -9
                      25 October 2011 01: 38
                      I don’t have time to spend on your education ... If someone wasn’t taught at school or taught only the facts that are beneficial and which is beneficial on the other hand, these are problems of his insufficient education .... Ukraine is not limited to Cossacks if you don’t know I’ll tell you that even the development of the artificially created Church Slavonic language, which was created on the basis of the Solun dialect of the Bulgarian language and which was later called Russian, in literary Russian took place at the Kiev-Mohyla Academy. Since there was no academy in wild Muscovy. This is not to say that the ideological mentor of Peter in building the empire was Ukrainian Feofan Prokopovich, his political convictions, which were based on the theory of the so-called "enlightened absolutism", were completely shared by Peter I.

                      http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A4%D0%B5%D0%BE%D1%84%D0%B0%D0%BD_%D0%9F%D1%80%D
                      0%BE%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

                      In Muscovy then there were problems with educated people, this vacuum was filled by immigrants from Ukraine such as Feofan Prokopovich, Stefan Yavorsky, Ivan Mazepa (In February 1700, Mazepa became the second holder of the Order of St. Andrew the First-Called, established by Peter. Peter personally placed the order signs on the hetman “ for many of his in military labors, noble and assiduously-loving faithful services. ”) and others. Regarding Mazepa, a well-known philanthropist and enlightener who did not accept and was seriously offended by Peter after the military council in Zholkva in March 1707, which discussed a significant limitation of Ukraine’s autonomy and independence of the hetman, which violated the Pereyaslovsky agreements with the Russians, discusses this person from his mouth like that of Peter who considered him his close associate. But Mazepa was simply far-sighted and realized that the barbaric Muscovy where the tsar personally participated in torture and executions would bring nothing good to his country. And in this he was right .... Cossacks were subsequently eliminated, and the Ukrainians turned into serfs ...
                      1. zczczc
                        0
                        25 October 2011 02: 22
                        Tolia, untruth, Church Slavonic and Russian developed simultaneously. The first, before Peter the Great, besides, actually, spiritual application, partially carried the function of recording scientific knowledge. From the time of Peter he remained only as a liturgical.

                        And Russian independently developed from ancient times, since the time of Peter began to cover all spheres of life, including the superset, even purely church concepts. Russian is understood as Ukrainian, and Belarusian dialects, and many less common.

                        In general, for the phrase that Russian came from an artificially created Church Slavonic, it is necessary to give ears to the author where you read it. Russian was tens of thousands of years before Christianity and descended from Sanskrit.

                        Childhood, damn it, frantic books to read with an unhealthy bias.
                      2. Tolia
                        -5
                        25 October 2011 08: 58
                        "Russian was tens of thousands of years before Christianity and originated from Sanskrit.")))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

                        ))))

                        Patsreot studies, studies and studies again .... the Ukrainian will easily understand the Czech, Slovak, Pole, Croat, Sloven ... because their languages ​​have a lot in common, because their languages ​​are based on national Slavic languages ​​... Russian can not even be understood by a Ukrainian, but as a rule Bulgarian understands ... and all because Cyril and Methodius artificially created language and brought by the clergy and nobility, the Church Slavonic language was learned as a language of business communication in territories where there were no national Slavic languages, since they were inhabited by Turkic-Ugro-Finnish peoples ...

                        “... According to Academician Shakhmatov,“ in its vocabulary composition at least half, if not more, remained Church Slavonic. ”This feature of the Russian literary language is explained by the fate of Russian writing: the written language of the era of feudalism was the language of Church The complex struggle for the merger of the written language with the oral, in other words, for the creation of a national literary language, begins in the second half of the XNUMXth century and ends in the XNUMXth century; it leads to a significant reduction of Slavisms in the Russian literary language, but by no means to their elimination. .. "

                        "... The first Slavs appeared on the territory of Russia relatively recently.

                        This is Vyatichi and Radimichi in central Russia, and Slovenia in Novgorod.

                        These tribes found numerous Finnish tribes there: Chud, all, Muroma, Meria, Mordovians, Cheremis, Votyaks, Perm, Ziryani, etc., which already had their cities. The Kiev chroniclers did not even bring the Vyatichi and Radimichi to the list of Slavic tribes, either through the Polish origin of these tribes, or, more likely, because these tribes had already mixed with the Finno-Ugric peoples at the time of writing the annals.

                        The current Russian language is Slavic in origin, although it has some features inherent in the Finno-Hungarian languages ​​- the "Akane" characteristic of most Russians, the spread of double words, characteristic philological constructions, in particular the frequent placement of the surname in front of the name, etc. ...

                        The Slavic language of the Russian language could be formed in three ways: either thanks to the Vyatichi and Radimichi, or through the influence of princes and Slavic immigrants from the Kiev region, or the third way - thanks to the adaptation of the artificial Slavic language - or the so-called Old Slavic - language that was used in the local Finnish-Slavic population religious services and administration.

                        Most scholars are sure that the Russian language was formed primarily in the third way - due to the adaptation by the local population of the Church Slavonic language, instilled by the church and the authorities. Although one should not underestimate the role of Slavic immigrants in the primary introduction of the Church Slavonic language in Russia.

                        Church Slavonic language gradually replaced local Finno-Hungarian dialects from the territory of modern Russia, but incorporated local features.

                        Similar processes took place in the Roman Empire, where peoples of very different ethnic origins - the ancestors of the French, Spaniards, Portuguese, Italians, Romanians, adopted Latin and, having adapted it, gradually formed their own languages. The newly formed Russian language made it possible for absolutely heterogeneous ethnic groups to understand each other ... "

                        "... The Church Slavonic language for about ten centuries was the basis of the religious and cultural communication of Orthodox Slavs, but was very far from everyday life [5]. The Church Slavonic language itself was close, but did not coincide either lexically or grammatically with NATIONAL Slavic However, its influence on the Russian language was great, and as Christianity became an everyday phenomenon, an integral part of Russian reality, a huge layer of Church Slavism lost its conceptual foreignness (the names of the months are January, February, etc., heresy, idol, priest and others) ... "

                        "The goal of the XNUMXth century Slavic enlighteners, Cyril and Methodius, was to create an artificial language that would be understood by all Slavs, from Bulgarians to Czechs and Moravians. The Church Slavonic language was created on the basis of the Solun dialect of the Bulgarian language.

                        It was used as international - by the Bulgarians, Serbs, Croats, moraves, as well as in Kievan Rus.

                        For a long time, until the XNUMXth century, it was also used as a written and religious language among the non-Slavic peoples of Moldova and Voloshchina.

                        The Russian historian Klyuchevsky noted the following peculiarities of the pronunciation of Kievan Rus: speaking about, okanie; soft ending of verbs in the third person of both numbers ("write", "immotion"); g is pronounced as a sublime Latin h, etc.

                        Everyday, practically folk language was present in the princely, legislative collections of "Russian Pravda", and especially in household inscriptions and in princely letters. These texts were created in order for the population to understand them accurately and unambiguously.

                        It is these written in princely letters, on weapons, utensils, etc. the texts are closest to the Ukrainian language, and can be identified as archaic Ukrainian.

                        In the old chronicles written in the Church Slavonic language, there are numerous Ukrainian inclusions: a well, arable land, wool, a dam, repair, a jug, a blacksmith, a casing, a large ravine, not enough, pity, an hour, lie, taut, calf, tyn, hire, bchely , hotel 'way', pakoshi, eye, host, damp and many others.

                        The Kiev prince Vladimir Monomakh was fluent in Church Slavonic, but, when writing a lesson to his children, he could not avoid the Ukrainian words: marvel, dirty, wretched in the meaning, 'poor', repair, watchman, parobtsi, fortunetelling, lipshi, dam, odtyati, laziness , goof, shame, widow, etc.

                        Nouns in the dative case of the singular accept the endings characteristic of the Ukrainian language -ovi / -ovb, -evi / -ev - massev, Moses, God, Caesarean, Romanov, Volodarev, horse, pigeon, according to Ruchaevi, monastery, oxen.

                        The proper names of Russia, which are found in the annals, are also typically Ukrainian: Dmitry, Vasily, Vasilko, Volodymer, Aleksey, Elena, Mikhalko and others, as well as geographical and proper names - kyans, Lybid, etc.

                        In chronicles among the names of princes and princesses of the Rurikovich dynasty from all, even Moscow lands, up to the XNUMXth century, such typically Ukrainian names were found as Ivanko, Vasilko, Volodymer, Elena.

                        It is noticeable that the ancestors of the Russians addressed the princes with the vocative case inherent in the Ukrainian language: "princely", and to the princess "princess".

                        All the annals are dominated by the full accord characteristic of the Ukrainian language - Volodyslav, Volodymer, captivity, divination, etc. There are also local names for the months in the annals - August and December. "
                      3. zczczc
                        0
                        25 October 2011 14: 14
                        Toliaread this post and below:
                        http://topwar.ru/7836-osnovnye-rusofobskie-mify-rozhdennye-na-zapade-esche-v-god
                        y-carskoy-rossii.html # comment-id-52483

                        Nobody argues about the fact that Russian and Ukrainian have a common basis. What do you prove? Who used to settle on what land (Kiev or to the north) is the first language. For a couple of centuries, that in the many-thousand-year aspect does not matter.

                        If I told a girl, knowing Ukrainian from Sofochka's songs, "hold your ticket" or "what's the sum, yak nobody" (sorry, there is no Ukrainian layout), then do you think I spoke Ukrainian? :) Russian, Ukrainian - these are Slavic dialects of one language, which is rooted in Sanskrit. It's just that our languages ​​have gone a very different path - Ukrainian remained frozen in a state close to ancient Slavic, and Russian absorbed Latin, then German, French and now English, and became the language of description and technologies, incl. Ukrainian remained at the household level. Pay attention, this does not diminish the beauty and importance of Ukrainian, which I personally consider the most beautiful of the group of Slavic dialects. What else can you compare the phrase "Viter is like a hilarious wife in the sky, and I'll show you back"? In Russian it will completely lose all its splendor and color. But! Nor should Russian be belittled and considered the language of barbarians. Let me remind you that when Yushchenko demanded to translate the documentation on the ships into his native language, he was told: "There are no words in Ukrainian to designate the necessary entities." And barbarians do not fly into space.

                        In general, I believe that every Russian should know at least two other Slavic languages ​​- one of which is Ukrainian, and the other one from the Slavic countries of Eastern Europe (Czech, Polish, etc.). Ukrainian is certainly a pearl in the frame of Slavic dialects.

                        I studied at a music school as a child, so we made songs in Ukrainian from the first grade and did not ask if we knew the language or did not know. One girl asked, how to sing if we do not know the language? The teacher answered her - if you do not know - you know, take it and sing, with time you will understand everything. This attitude to language and people! And you breed discord, think better what your speeches are aimed at. You sit and grains of discord carefully collect, germinate them - the seedlings will destroy you. Well, in fact, nothing will sprout, that’s clear. If I love Ukrainian, then some Ukrainian also lives and loves Russian.

                        By the way, not captured, but full. Ukrainian, damn it :) And in Russian it was "full" until the 19th century. And Pushkin has a "sumny" somewhere.

                        By the way, who wants to feel the beauty of Ukrainian, listen:
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQfZqnkwXNM
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XolO5uz8e34 - оригинал в исполнении автора. Кстати, Ивасюк - любимый композитор Ющенко. Так что ж теперь застрелиться и выкинуть Червону Руту и массу других песен, что он написал. Так и до фашизма недалеко докатиться...

                        You see, there is no problem between Ukrainians and Russians. No problem. There are those who suck these problems out of the finger. And their time is melting before our eyes.
                      4. lightforcer
                        0
                        25 October 2011 20: 29
                        In words, you are Taras Shevchenko, but in reality ... It's funny that ukry can not even understand Polish. It's very funny to read skirmishes on YouTube and forums.

                        In fact, the Ukrainian language is very independent. When I see an incomprehensible Ukrainian word, I take the Polish-Russian dictionary and find its meaning. There have been no exceptions so far.
                      5. zczczc
                        0
                        26 October 2011 00: 24
                        lightforcer, appreciate, half is clear for sure:
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqK1d8X8y6U
                        "That is one! God kokhaniy, the new one!" :)))))

                        In fact, people in Western Ukraine understand Polish, of course. In the east - nifiga. Eastern Ukrainians cannot explain the words "smereka" (spruce) and "beskid" (ravine, precipice), which in itself suggests an idea. My dad knows what Smereka is, he specifically asked me, but he wouldn't connect two words in Ukrainian. The first VIA in Ukraine was called "Smerichka". When I listen, my soul sings:
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ueap5-cIDKc
                        This is where our national culture really is! The song is about "this", and no vulgarity, blacks, no thumping sounds on the ears, folk melody, folk text, but it looks modern (for 1975, for sure).

                        Who cares, can practice by ear to perceive the entire lyrics. Translation requires only two words: chicher - flower, claw - rooster.

                        By the way, the seventh verse eloquently shows that nefig Ukrainians call us drunks:
                        Oh, Marichko, chіcherі,
                        chіcherі, chіcherі,
                        Rochesi mi kucherі,
                        Kucherі, Kucherі. | (2)

                        I scratched my head,
                        scratched, scratched,
                        Yakby mother didn’t know
                        did not know, did not know. | (2)

                        Mom will be a divity,
                        dividends, dividends.
                        I’ll be ganbiti,
                        ganbiti, ganbiti. | (2)

                        Oh, Marichko, I love thee,
                        I love thee, I love thee
                        Zarіzh menі kogutya,
                        claw, claw. | (2)

                        Yak kogut se zapіє,
                        zapіє, zapіє,
                        Get your hands on Marіє,
                        Marіє, Marіє. | (2)

                        Oh, Ivanko, disappearing bis,
                        disappearing beater, disappearing beater
                        Chi on a zucor
                        without giving beats, without giving beats. | (2)

                        Vol_v bi I will drink, // I had the will to drink, if not sugar I would buy
                        impregnate, impregnate
                        Buy yak tsukor,
                        buy, buy.
                        | (2nd)

                        Oh, Marichko, chіcherі,
                        chіcherі, chіcherі,
                        Rochesi mi kucherі,
                        Kucherі, Kucherі. | (2)


                        This song has some very indecent sequels (synthesizer to colin), but it does not become vulgar from this.
                  3. zczczc
                    -1
                    24 October 2011 22: 36
                    Tolia, it was not a Polish desire - the guys (Christian hierarchs) shared the cash desk from the parishes. Everything is trite - everyone pulled a blanket over himself. Poland is a huge territory, huge revenues. There was an invisible war of influence on power. It is clear that the population then did not understand the difference in the currents of Christianity.
                  4. -1
                    27 October 2011 00: 24
                    Tolya, you again plunged into a puddle. According to YOUR story, FIRST teachers appeared at the Academy of Sciences created by Peter I under Catherine II? And for 50 years, students of the Academy were sitting in classrooms and waiting for Ukrainians-teachers? You are burning !!!
                    1. Tolia
                      -3
                      27 October 2011 07: 45
                      Patzreot stop watching the "star" TV channel and read patsretic govonosites that have nothing to do with history ... and lucky fart into a puddle ...

                      The Significance of the Old (1615-1817) Kiev-Mohyla Academy

                      The Kiev Academy has become a source of education in Russia. It was the graduates of the Kiev Academy who founded the first higher educational institutions in Russia, and more than 80 percent of their teaching staff were also graduates of the Academy. Ukrainians, Russians, Belarusians, Romanians, Moldavians, Serbs, Bosnians, Montenegrins, Bulgarians, Greeks, Italians studied at the Academy. Cultural figures of Serbia, Bulgaria also requested to send teachers from the Kiev Academy.
                      The Academy gave a significant number of public figures. Her pupils became teachers in the Moscow Slavic-Greek-Latin Academy, the St. Petersburg Alexander Nevsky Seminary and the Kazan Academy.
                      In the encyclopedia “Kiev-Mohyla Academy in names. XVII-XVIII centuries ”, published in 2004, the names of 1 figures associated with the academy are given. 482 hetmans of Ukraine left the walls of the Kiev-Mohyla Academy. Among them: Ivan Mazepa, Philip Orlik, Pavel Polubotok, Daniil Apostol, Yuri Khmelnitsky, Ivan Vygovsky, Peter Doroshenko, Ivan Skoropadsky, Pavel Teterya, Ivan Bryukhovetsky, Mikhail Hanenko, Ivan Samoilovich. Metropolitans Dmitry Tuptalo, Pyotr Konyushkevich, Ivan Maksimovich recognized as saints. The fate of Meletius Smotrytsky, Feofan Prokopovich, Lazar Baranovich, Grigory Skovoroda, Maxim Berezovsky, Artemy Vedel and others is connected with the Academy. Mikhail Lomonosov studied at the Academy for some time.
                      Among the figures of this collegium, the most famous are: Innokenty Gisel, Joasaf Krokovsky, Lazar Baranovich, Ioannikiy Golyatovsky, Anthony Radzivilovsky, Gabriel Dometsky, Varlaam Yasinsky, Stefan Yavorsky, Feofilakt Lopatinsky, Feofan Prokopovich, Saint Innocentius Kopilovich, Gaviniya Bishop, Konstantin Gavinilius Kopilovich, Konstantin Gavinilius Kopilovich, Konstantin Ivincius Kulich, Konstantin Ivincius Kulchich, , Lavrentiy Zizaniy, Alexander Mytura and others.
                      Many prominent public figures, cultural and educational workers worked and raised in it: Epiphanius Slavinetsky, I. Galyatovsky, I. Gizel, D. Samoilovich, Konanovich-Gorbatskov. Porfiry Zerkalnikov, who performed the tsar’s diplomatic missions during the War of Independence, studied at the academy, then collaborated with Epiphanius Slavinetsky in Moscow, Karion Istomin, author of the first illustrated Russian Primer and Small Grammar; Konon Zotov, a famous military figure, author of the first Russian book on the technique of ship control; Field Marshal Boris Sheremetev, associate of Peter I, and others. Belarusians constantly studied at the Kiev Academy. Among them, the famous future scientist Simeon of Polotsk (1620-1680).
                      Academy graduates were the founders of a number of schools in Russia and Belarus, especially in the XVIII century. They founded schools and seminaries in almost all cities of Russia: Moscow, St. Petersburg, Smolensk, Rostov, Tobolsk, Irkutsk, Kholmogory, Tver, Belgorod, Suzdal, Vyatka, Vologda, Kolomna, Ryazan, Pskov, Veliky Ustyug, Astrakhan, Kostroma, Vladimir on Klyazma and other cities. The teachers in these schools were mostly graduates of the Academy. A seminary was opened in Mogilev by the archbishop, enlightener, scientist, pupil and rector of the Academy Georgy Konissky, which became the center of education in Belarus.
              2. Tolia
                -10
                24 October 2011 21: 19
                We remember Baturin, where even all the children were cut out under the command of Menshikov.


                Moskal is not my brother ...
                1. zczczc
                  +1
                  25 October 2011 00: 25
                  ToliaDo you know whose enmity is the strongest in the world? The feud of siblings. She is even stronger than spouses. Because they came out of one mother, and each of them was sure of the second that he thinks and acts exactly like him. Hence the exaggerated demands on each other. But even brothers are not the same, so there are problems that sometimes develop into enmity. To make matters worse, they both understand that their native bloodline and having fled, are still looking for ways to meet, sit by the river, dangling their legs in the water from the pier.

                  Since we are publicly hostile, we are brothers. And if so, then there is reason to fraternize :)
            2. +3
              24 October 2011 21: 26
              Tolyan close your ..... in normal people, stools from another hole climb and what is it with you? And do not touch Pozharsky
              Dmitry Pozharsky died on April 30 (April 20 according to the old style) in 1642 at the 65th year of his life. A note on the day of Pozharsky’s death was found in the monastery of St. Nicholas of Zaraysk in the following words: “ZRN, April K, boyar Prince Dmitry Mikhailovich Pozharsky stopped on Wednesday, second week at a time”
              1. raf
                +4
                24 October 2011 21: 41
                Comrade Misha Tolyan still will not believe (about Pozharsky)! He has his own sources, adapted specifically for people like him!
              2. Tolia
                -3
                24 October 2011 21: 55
                According to Naim Celebi, they initially wanted to release Russian prisoners for ransom (according to the usual practice of the time), but this was rejected by “far-sighted and experienced Tatars”: we “... should use all efforts to strengthen the hostility between Russians and Cossacks, and completely block their path to reconciliation; we should, not dreaming of wealth, decide to cut them all ... Before the khan’s chamber, the heads of all significant prisoners were chopped off, after which each soldier separately betrayed the captives who had fallen to his share ”[57] [58].
                According to Russian archival data, “In total on Konotop’s in a big battle and on an allotment: a regiment of the boyar and governor of Prince Alexei Nikitich Trubetskoy with comrades of the Moscow rank, city nobles and children of the boyars, and newly baptized, murz and Tatars, and Cossacks, and the Reyta system of initial people and the raider, dragoons, soldiers, and archers were beaten and full of 4769 people ”[9] [59]. The main losses fell on the detachment of Prince Pozharsky. The ents regiment of Anz Georg von Strobel (Fanstrobel) was almost completely killed, the loss of which amounted to 1070 people, including a colonel, lieutenant colonel, major, 8 captains, 1 captain, 12 lieutenants and ensigns. The Zaporizhzhya army, according to the report of the hetman I. Bespaly, lost about 2000 Cossacks. The cavalry accounted for the main losses of the army, the infantry for the entire time of the battle lost only 89 people killed and captured [60]. The total losses of the army of Prince Trubetskoy during the retreat to Putivl amounted to about 100 people [56].
                Two okolnichniks died or were executed after the battle: S. R. Pozharsky and S. P. Lvov, stolnik E. A. Buturlin, 3 solicitors: M. G. Sonin, I. V. Izmailov, Ya. G. Krekshin, 79 Moscow nobles and 164 residents. A total of 249 "Moscow ranks" [60]. Semyon Pozharsky by order of the khan was executed at his headquarters. The centurion of the Nezhinsky regiment Zabela, who was present at the execution of Pozharsky, told Prince Trubetskoy: “the khan asked Prince Semyon Romanovich about the Tartar beaten up, and what kind of beatings was unknown to the prince, Semyon Romanovich, the khan spoke disgusting to the traitor Ivashka Vygovan and g. And for this, de Khan, the out-of-town prince Semyon Romanovich, ordered an article in front of him ... ”[61]. As a reason, it is also said that Prince Pozharsky spat in the face of the Crimean Khan [45] [62].
                Trubetskoy had to leave three siege mortars in trenches under the city, one of which was heavy, four siege guns “that lay on the ground”, 600 cores and 100 grenades [63].
                Vygovsky’s losses amounted to about 4 thousand people [12], Crimean Tatars lost 3-6 thousand people [11].

                In a number of narrative sources (Vygovsky’s report [64], Polish messages of the 65th century, the chronicle of Samovidets [100] and Velichko), the number of the Russian army is estimated from 150 to 30 thousand people, and losses from 50 to 66 thousand people [100]. These data are repeated by historians of the XIX century. So, according to the Russian historian Sergei Solovyov, Trubetskoy's army consisted of 150-30 thousand soldiers, and the losses near Konotop amounted to about 1654 thousand. His dictum is known that “the color of the Moscow cavalry, which made happy campaigns of 1655 and XNUMX, died on the same day” [
                1. +2
                  24 October 2011 22: 19
                  Tolyan, when will the reunification of Russia with Ukraine emigrate or will you leave for the forests? You can write fairy tales both there and there, but it’s more comfortable in emigration, so it's time to think about your unsightly future.
                  1. Tolia
                    -5
                    25 October 2011 01: 11
                    Rather, the unification of Russia and China will happen)))
                2. evg5835
                  0
                  25 October 2011 00: 25
                  What do you write stupid person? You learn to read. Names compare. Dmitry and Semyon
            3. Tyumen
              +2
              24 October 2011 21: 53
              in the battle of Konotop

              This is when Vygovsky Khan swore an oath, as did the Polish king and the Russian tsar? And the Tatars, having lost a lot of people, and not waiting for the booty, with the filing of Vygovsky, raided the Ukrainian villages, having stolen 20 people. This three times traitor is your hero today. In the end, the Poles themselves shot him.
              1. raf
                +3
                24 October 2011 21: 59
                Tyumen 35, what kind of a person are such and heroes!
                1. +2
                  27 October 2011 00: 42
                  All of you comrades do not know the History! And only Tolya knows it, because before him lies a UKRAINIAN history textbook, from which he draws knowledge! That is where the problem is. Even years 15-20, and such a fraction will be a legion.
  30. Maksim
    0
    24 October 2011 15: 35
    collapse of powers or a perfect new power, (my opinion): a perfect new power.
  31. dred
    0
    24 October 2011 16: 17
    Purely my opinion, to be honest, we need to reunite with Ukraine so it will be added to the army and there will be no opponents on their part.
  32. rnb1983
    0
    24 October 2011 16: 25
    Wait and see ... at least a shift is already taking place in a good direction
  33. raf
    +2
    24 October 2011 17: 28
    All for the reunion with Ukraine (including myself), that's just no one asked the Ukrainians what they think! Oh, where are the Ukrainians!
    1. +2
      24 October 2011 17: 36
      and what to ask you are yourself Ukrainian !!!
      1. raf
        +1
        24 October 2011 20: 32
        kress42rus I am not Ukrainian, I am Tatar!
    2. Tolia
      -5
      24 October 2011 20: 00
      WE ARE AGAINST !!! Your macaws, your pleasure))))
      1. raf
        +2
        24 October 2011 20: 34
        Tolya doesn’t need to say WE are not the whole Ukrainian people! Speak me!
        1. Tolia
          -8
          24 October 2011 20: 41
          I asked everyone who is nearby also against))))
          1. raf
            +2
            24 October 2011 20: 56
            Speak for yourself anyway!
          2. lightforcer
            0
            24 October 2011 22: 00
            After the unification happens, all your brothers will change their flags.
    3. Sobibor
      -5
      25 October 2011 10: 29
      Definitely against
    4. SAVA555.IVANOV
      +5
      25 October 2011 14: 19
      I WILL TWO HANDS VOTE FOR THE UNION !!!
  34. +2
    24 October 2011 17: 42
    we are all Ukrainians
  35. +4
    24 October 2011 19: 28
    In the early 1990s, Zbigniew Brzezinski said the following: “It is impossible to overdo it, emphasizing that without Ukraine, Russia ceases to be an empire, but with Ukraine ...

    The only thing that impresses me in Brzezinski’s speeches is that he honestly says:
    -Our goal is to destroy the centuries-old foundations of the two peoples of Russia and Ukraine and make them enemies. No, this crap about democracy, human rights, reboot! He clearly emphasizes who is friend and who is enemy!
    1. +1
      24 October 2011 20: 55
      By the way, Brzezinski is neither a Pole nor a Catholic, nor a Christian at all, he is a Jew.
      And with the Ukrainian guys I served 1,5 of the year. With Sumy. Normal guys, shit, no more than Russians.
      1. lightforcer
        +1
        24 October 2011 22: 02
        Poles - they are.
  36. ESCANDER
    +4
    24 October 2011 20: 32
    Tolia
    --- "November came from the final fall of Moscow in front of the Polish-UKRAINIAN troops commanded by the Ukrainian hetman Sagaidachnyi."

    What are you going to do ...
    This Moscow is forever saved by the cold ...
    Cho from the Getmans, cho from the Führer.
    You, your mother, would at least look at each other, but choose the time of year! ...
    1. raf
      +2
      24 October 2011 20: 46
      You are right ESCANDER, forever these shit (all sorts of different Fuhrer, hetmans, and so on and so forth) cold interfere! Well, in our country there is no one else to fight winked
    2. Tolia
      -6
      24 October 2011 20: 48
      Vladislav’s money ran out, and all that could be taken away was taken by the Cossacks ..

      “And he came, Pan Saadachnaya, from Cherkasy under the Ukrainian city near Livny, and took Livny with an attack, and shed many Christian blood, many Orthodox peasants and his children and children were innocent, and many Orthodox Christians reproached and defiled the temples of God and "He ravaged and robbed all the Christian houses, and captured many wives and children." The Lebanese voivode Nikita Ivanovich Egupov-Cherkassky was also captured, the second voivode, Pyotr Danilov, was killed in battle. Leaving the ashes in place of Liven, Sagaidachny went further to Yelets. Yelets was well fortified and the garrison numbered 1969 people. Yelets kept the frontier defense from the Tatar raids on a plot of about seventy kilometers along the front and up to forty in depth. Yelchans locked themselves in fortresses, heroically repulsed attacks. The defense of Yelets was led by governor Andrei Bogdanovich Polev. Seeing that the city could not be taken by force, Sagaidachny went on a trick. He lifted the siege and pretended to be retreating. Voivode Polev believed and ordered to pursue the enemy, "with all the people left the city."
      Carried away by the persecution, the Elites moved away from the city, and at this time a detachment of Cossacks, sitting in ambush, burst into the defenseless Yelets. The city was ravaged and burned to the ground, its defenders and civilians, including women and children, were killed "

      By the way, the Cossacks did not want to go to Muscovy at first, but they caught a Moscow messenger who was traveling to Crimea and found a letter with him in which Muscovy promised money to the Tatars for raids on Ukrainian lands entering the Commonwealth (to divert the forces of the Commonwealth for the defense of these lands). After torture, he said where is the gold. The Cossacks were angry, Vladislav promised to thank Sagaidachny for help and went ...
      1. raf
        +1
        24 October 2011 21: 05
        Tolya responds to your attempt to pin up: "... Muscovy promised money to the Tatars for raids on the Ukrainian lands ..", and "... they caught a Moscow messenger who followed to the Crimea ...". So, your attempt failed. I am not a CRIMEAN Tatar, I am ORENBURG!
        1. Tolia
          -6
          24 October 2011 21: 11
          Congratulations! Only here is historical injustice, your country is incorrectly named, Tataria-Muscovy should have been, as it was called before Peter 1 freaked out and called Russia at the beginning of the 18th century ...
          1. ESCANDER
            +1
            24 October 2011 21: 17
            Well, crazy because this Peter.
            It was necessary to leave everything as it was, so that Tolya would be calmer.
          2. raf
            +4
            24 October 2011 21: 19
            You are mistaken Tolya, my country is very correctly named! I would even say GREAT RUSSIA! And the greatness of Russia will not decrease from the fact that people like you are trying to denigrate it! Many have already tried, but nothing came of it!
          3. lightforcer
            0
            29 October 2011 17: 48
            And who freaked out and invented Ukraine? Probably called Ukraine prestigious Russia.
          4. zczczc
            0
            31 October 2011 03: 22
            Tolia, if you list all the lands from the GDR to China, which in one way or another at different times were under the cultural influence of the Slavs, then, I think, a long name would work out. There was probably a logical desire to shorten in one word :)
  37. 0
    24 October 2011 21: 54
    There is no need to equate bandits of all nationalities on the side of Chechens and air defense personnel officers from Ukraine. And there were not zapadentsi, but from the Kharkov region. And with regard to the Wahhabis, they were given the best sanatoriums in Ukraine in order to lick their wounds.
  38. andreypilot
    +1
    24 October 2011 23: 12
    The peoples are friends, this is one thing, the leaders are another .. I want our main heads to learn how to make friends and communicate normally, otherwise you’ll look at Belarus, like a union state, but how dad will begin to blame us, and ours snapping back, so for some reason all the optimism down the drain .. sad
  39. Max
    Max
    +1
    24 October 2011 23: 38
    Everything will be Coca-Cola, in the courtyard global globalization, one fig all united, and the whole civilized world will have no borders and visas. And the armies will be reduced until they turn into small quick-response brigades to destroy some fictitious pseudo terrorists)) Everything is going to this, humanity is getting smarter and more and more in contact with each other.
  40. mind1954
    +2
    25 October 2011 04: 46
    Well, where to unite? They see that we have power
    belongs to traitors and thieves! First at home
    you need to put things in order, then others reach out!
    1. kesa1111
      +4
      25 October 2011 05: 04
      True, but perhaps not all. The scum in power managed to create a talent pool - also scum (middle managers). Just migrant workers have to communicate with them. Throw, humiliate, mock, these managers are able to excellently. It is possible that they will remember and want to be counted. God forbid, of course.
  41. +2
    25 October 2011 05: 15
    It is interesting, but if the Russians said that after the unification the capital would be in Kiev, would the Ukrainians also feel like younger brothers? Personally, I would not mind - I like Kiev more than Moscow (though still less than St. Petersburg)
    1. Sobibor
      -7
      25 October 2011 10: 39
      And still, to take the historically correct name - Rusyns, otherwise Russians somehow ... Well, of course, unification is possible only on the conditions of Slavic territories - without the Caucasus, the Urals, Siberia and the Far East
      1. ESCANDER
        +1
        25 October 2011 18: 41
        Bandera, you are Bandera.
        And as far as “only Slavic territories” are you, what will you put forward such conditions to us?
      2. SAVA555.IVANOV
        +2
        25 October 2011 18: 47
        SOBIBOR SO IT IS RUSSIA !!!! IN BUSINESS !! How old are you ???
        1. Sobibor
          +3
          25 October 2011 22: 46
          The fact of the matter is that this is RUSSIA-not Russia.
          Do you catch the difference? It is like Romania and the Roman Empire

          They, too, consider themselves Romans there - but as they were Dacians they remained, they only changed their name.
          1. Tolia
            -1
            26 October 2011 00: 15
            I support ...
            1. lightforcer
              +1
              29 October 2011 17: 46
              Support bloomers.
          2. Antagonist
            0
            6 November 2011 13: 20
            Quote: Sobibor
            The fact of the matter is that this is RUSSIA-not Russia. Do you catch the difference? It is like Romania and the Roman Empire

            Super, Russia is Belarus and Ukraine.
            1. lightforcer
              0
              15 November 2011 18: 40
              And if you look closely? Are we to blame for building an empire?
      3. Maksim
        +1
        25 October 2011 22: 21
        Bendery and in Africa Bendera, and I am not Bendera angry and ready to take it off am fight
        1. Maksim
          +1
          25 October 2011 22: 52
          Bob, don’t be offended, but Bendera’s are fascists, but if you have the current surname Bandera, then I'm sorry.
          1. Tolia
            -2
            26 October 2011 00: 18
            Apparently Bandera joined fascism in a German concentration camp, where he sat until 1944 and in which he lost two of his brothers? The Russians have obvious problems with the interpretation of historical facts, they still live on Bolshevik agitation ...
            1. 0
              26 October 2011 00: 23
              We have a clear problem in being lazy to rise up and crush you ... "Remember, never go to the north, there are barbarians, they will crush your armies and come for you" Gaius Julius Caesar (from unpublished) ...
              1. 0
                26 October 2011 00: 28
                And anyway, who taught Europe hygiene ???
            2. 0
              26 October 2011 00: 36
              Apparently Bandera joined fascism in a German concentration camp, where he sat until 1944 and in which he lost two of his brothers?

              Your PI ... you will drive the children in the garden ... I know in many cases, because My great-grandmother was a teacher of the Ukrainian language and literature, so she told how they were una-upa, and everyone knows who they obeyed Bender, Shukhevych — they burned a village of 2 thousand people just because there were teachers from the USSR.
              So Tolian -1 ...
            3. 0
              26 October 2011 20: 27
              Tolya! Did he understand what he wrote? That is, if Bandera came to Kolyma, would join Marxism? You push hard !!!
              1. ZHORA
                -1
                27 October 2011 09: 50
                Typical patreot. There is a lot of enthusiasm, a little mind ....
  42. URB
    URB
    0
    25 October 2011 14: 08
    reunification of almost all republics into a single state! and let all the ill-wishers who wreak havoc among the nations forever be silent!
  43. +1
    25 October 2011 16: 15
    Only together the Slavs need to be, only together. Belarus, Ukraine, the peoples of the former Yugoslavia, Bulgaria are proven unions. I’m talking about nations, not short-sighted politicians. All talk about who owes whom and who feeds or will feed, is simply unacceptable in this case. The truth is that today we are divided and everyone who is not too lazy to use it is kicking us all individually. All of the above have their own different potentials. At the same time, we all still have no allies, and everyone is looking for a panacea for all ills in the European Union and NATO. The Russian Federation and the Republic of Belarus for how many years can no longer put together a normal union, although it formally exists. There are governing bodies, a budget, and even the media, and then it comes down to rip each other off. And all the same, this will happen when we are together and even very likely in one state. Russia will soon end up with oil, gas, forest, and the village is broken up, there’s nothing to eat, then we’ll recall Ukrainian lard and Belarusian potatoes.
  44. +1
    25 October 2011 16: 16
    First, it is necessary that Ukraine at the legislative level would ban Bandera movements. because the place of these fascist traitors is exclusively in prison.
    1. Tolia
      -5
      26 October 2011 00: 19
      Ukraine needs to massively deport dual citizens as citizens of another country ...
      1. ereke
        -3
        26 October 2011 00: 36
        Tolia,
        Do you have people with dual citizenship?
        Very stupid move. This is the fifth column inside your country, i.e. subversive elements from among your citizens who will always work for Russia. (Remember the Sudeten Germans in 1938, they self-proclaimed themselves in a separate republic and separated from the Czechs, and Germany to protect their citizens in a foreign country ?! entered their military units and took the Sudeten from the Czech Republic, further occupation of the rest of the Czech Republic was a matter of technology)


        By the way, Tolya, maybe they settled here and are campaigning against Ukraine in favor of Russia

        Take an example from us. Even Cossack sheaths were canceled, not that dual citizenship, either leave or take Kazakhstan, there is no other way))
        1. SAVA555.IVANOV
          +1
          26 October 2011 00: 59
          UKRAINE, RUSSIA AND BELARUS IS blood brothers We're like the face, body and spirit, is nothing surprising in it is not that there are people Vote for the reintegration of these fraternal republics, WHICH BECAME why that country, and in Kazakhstan already CHINESE MORE than natives, the Chinese YOU QUICKLY REMEMBER HOW WITH RUSSIANS YOU EVERYTHING WAS KAZAKH-PEOPLE, AND FOR FUTURE OWNERS YOU WILL BE A PEOPLE, A MINING MINISTRY YOU UNDERSTAND BUT IT WILL BE LATE !!!
          1. ereke
            -1
            26 October 2011 01: 15
            We have more Canadians, British in general, Anglo-Saxons and Turks and Koreans (BP companies, Harikeyn, Samsung, etc. and international universities English-Kazakh Kazakh-Turkish and Turkish lyceums), the Chinese only work in one place and live in Aktau in Karachagan , an oil company there is a Chinese company, they were there even earlier in the 90s, it’s everywhere in the USA
        2. Gur
          +2
          26 October 2011 12: 03
          Well, you are honestly lying, and we have people living with dual citizenship, only this is not given to you and me and is not fixed by the legislation. A Canadians and others more than anyone ?? more Russians or Chinese? If about China, of course, you can lie to Russians and others in the internet, I can give an article where it is described how much, or rather how much Kazakhstan has already sold itself to China. If you are talking about Russia, go behind the state district power station (Utegen Batyr) and see what is being built there and why. And find out who is the owner of such store chains as Alser, Sulpak, I don’t need to talk about Bilain. Yes, all these joint universities, the trough is frank, the level of education is practically "0" and is valued only on the territory of the Republic of Kazakhstan, it is not for nothing that their licenses were taken away from half of them. About the fifth column .. so you overpower them voluntarily under the guise of Uralmans. One of these has already poked me with a red certificate .. a Chinese with a Chinese .. but a Kazakhstani with dual citizenship (that's allowed). And there is no need to sling and drink to the obvious nat freaks, you think he will kiss you as gladly, I will not voice who you are to him. And as for the Cossacks .. legally yes it is forbidden .. but you go to the church on the days of the festivities .. and you will see them .. and there are also Kazakhs.
          1. ereke
            -5
            26 October 2011 16: 33
            You are Russian as enviable bears with a kind face
            China will shower you with hats, they sold everything ... As far as history knows, Kazakhstan was a colony of the Russian empire, not China. You have not heard about the armed confrontation of Kenesary Kasymov (Khan Kene) against the tsarist empire or the uprising of Amangeldy Imanov against the Russian tsar, or about the "Alash Orda" their activities were aimed at preserving the Kazakhs as the basis on their lands.

            In the south of Kazakhstan, almost all retail outlets in bazaars and boutiques are in the hands of Uzbeks, or rather ethnic Uzbeks (they have Kazakh citizenship). I named the biggest business project of the Chinese here. And if so, the Koreans have created a joint venture with Kazakhstan in the dzhezkazgan Kazakhmys and Samsung for the extraction of non-ferrous metals (long ago in the 90s) the Canadian company "Harikane" owns the largest oil refinery in Shymkent, which provides fuel and lubricants to Kazakhstan. Turkish companies are numerous, and the inter-th Yassavi University in Turkestan with branches in Shymkent, and Kentau also colleges and lyceums. In the north-east the company in ust-kemen Asia-auto JV together with Koreans, JV with the Korean "Daewoo" for the production of trucks in Talgar district of Almaty region. In Astana last year, a university was opened where the British teach, BP together with Kazmunaigaz in the Caspian shelf near Atyrau continue to extract oil?

            And where did you see this in our legislation, the law on dual citizenship? And where do we have these? Use Nenados of local Slavs as an instrument of political fraud. They are Kazakhstanis, and the point is that they have nothing to do with the Russians. You kick them yourself, but when you need to use them for political purposes, you immediately refer to them

            I have always been against the unification of Russia. And he always voiced his positions. Now there are rumors and national TV shows that meat will go up in price and will be equal to the prices of the Russian Federation. people are slowly starting to get angry
            1. +3
              26 October 2011 16: 39
              So I am against unification, there is nothing to add second-rate states to Russia, there are enough of my own fools.
            2. ESCANDER
              0
              26 October 2011 19: 16
              ereke
              --- "meat will rise in price and will be equal to the prices of the Russian Federation"

              Well, after all, the Russians are to blame again!
              Everything is simple with Yorik: they didn’t give the meat - it slowly begins to get angry ...
              GIVE YORIKU MEAT !!! Well, to the people, of course ... what remains ...
          2. Ivan35
            +1
            26 October 2011 16: 54
            What are you saying all here! They are not forbidden anything - they are officially registered and are members of the assembly of peoples of Kazakhstan

            Here are excerpts - https://sites.google.com/site/olegdankir/Poriadnik/kazacinie/ataman/pocetnyj-ver
            hovnyj-ataman
            The President of the Republic of Kazakhstan, Nazarbayev Nursultan Abishevich, for his services to the cause of state building, respectful and careful attitude to the Cossack traditions and customs, high international authority, was elected by the Cossack people of Kazakhstan for this position for life. He personifies the banner of the Cossack people.

            or-- Representatives of ministries and other government agencies congratulated the Cossacks on the anniversary date, which indicates the official recognition by Kazakhstan of the right to the existence of the Cossacks with their traditions and culture.
            Nursultan Nazarbayev, elected by the Cossacks last year as honorary chieftain .........
            .... Russian Cossacks awarded the President of Kazakhstan with the Order of Merit for the Cossacks. Nursultan Nazarbayev became the second holder of this award, the first order was received by his Russian colleague Vladimir Putin.
            http://www.kp.kz/node/932
      2. zczczc
        0
        31 October 2011 03: 26
        Tolia, you will probably be surprised, but we will only be happy. Firstly, these are our people, and secondly, after this expulsion Ukraine will not even be taken to the EU, because there are formal requirements for economic indicators, which after expulsion will prostrate themselves. Think about what Ukraine will do in this case.
  45. +2
    25 October 2011 16: 41
    Sevastopol. This is all superficial, like foam in difficult and troubled times. Same as our nation. With normal politicians, the general unanimity of peoples, all this will instantly go away, there simply will be no fertile soil for the development of these movements.
    1. Tolia
      -4
      25 October 2011 19: 15
      Your nats are against others, and Bandera is not against others, but for their .. you feel the difference?
      1. lightforcer
        +2
        25 October 2011 20: 38
        And then who is the enemy of Bandera? Why Tyagnibok calls to fight Muscovites and the Jew? Why is Lviv Dudayev Street? And ento for a poster?
      2. +1
        25 October 2011 21: 19
        Great Tolyan!
        How healthy is he alive? Well, let’s omit the courtesies. Tell us better, to those here present, how you are a proud descendant of the Bandera movement, a purebred Slav, unlike the hated ones, I’m a Nazi snout, s - “descendants of the horde”, I allowed myself to be a true bearer of Slavic culture, such an obscene “nickname” - Tolya, this is a diminutive derivative on behalf of Anatoly, and what do the sources tell us about the meaning of this name, are you ready Tolya?

        The ancient Greeks called Anatoly the inhabitant of Anatolia (the ancient name of Asia Minor, located in the east of Greece). `Anatole` - translated from Greek means` east`.

        Ai-Ii Tolya, if you don’t believe the buzz came with a nickname, or it was your parents who treated you so cruelly when they called you how you, a purebred Slav, to call you such an infamous name Anatoly, which in translation means “Asian” as Tolya further ah? That the right guys, bearing the correct names Vasil, Taras will say, you’ll probably have to change your name and don’t forget to change your homeland, change Tolya to your homeland on the island where the Anglo-Saxons concentrate, because you love reading books written by them, we have already noticed all of this here, because the story of your small homeland written by “Brita” is the most correct story, is it true, Tolya?

        Well, don’t get sick Tolya, health in a foreign land will come in handy for you, it’s dank and damp there, and there are some mists ...
      3. +2
        25 October 2011 21: 25
        Great Tolyan!
        How healthy is he alive? Well, let’s omit the courtesies. Tell us better, to those here present, how you are a proud descendant of the Bandera movement, a purebred Slav, unlike the hated ones, I’m a Nazi snout, s - “descendants of the horde”, I allowed myself to be a true bearer of Slavic culture, such an obscene “nickname” - Tolya, this is a diminutive derivative on behalf of Anatoly, and what do the sources tell us about the meaning of this name, are you ready Tolya?

        The ancient Greeks called Anatoly the inhabitant of Anatolia (the ancient name of Asia Minor, located in the east of Greece). `Anatole` - translated from Greek means` east`.

        Ai-Ii Tolya, if you don’t believe the buzz came with a nickname, or it was your parents who treated you so cruelly when they called you how you, a purebred Slav, to call you such an infamous name Anatoly, which in translation means “Asian” as Tolya further ah? That the right guys, bearing the correct names Vasil, Taras will say, you’ll probably have to change your name and don’t forget to change your homeland, change Tolya to your homeland on the island where the Anglo-Saxons concentrate, because you love reading books written by them, we have already noticed all of this here, because the story of your small homeland written by “Brita” is the most correct story, is it true, Tolya?

        Well, don’t get sick Tolya, health in a foreign land will come in handy for you, it’s dank and damp there, and there are some mists ...
        1. zczczc
          0
          31 October 2011 02: 51
          comrade Misha, well said :)
      4. KASKAD
        0
        26 October 2011 18: 05
        "You will answer me for Sevastopol!" (k \ f "Brother 2")
  46. KB-1
    0
    25 October 2011 21: 10
    Thank!!! Laughing, honestly. One question - is the author sane? (although judging by the clement you are all here):
    “Even the very origin of this word -“ Ukraine ”- contradicts the current political reality. borders of united Russia. "
    - Well, I don’t know what it means in the neighboring language, but in Ukrainian - KRAYINA = country.

    "You cannot follow the lead of the so-called" Westerners "who are the periphery of the Western world. They are not the majority of the population of Ukraine, and they should not determine the future of this country."
    - Zapadentsi are still shots, so what? Ukraine is one - from the Don to Xiang.

    "It is clear that the truly national interest of the population of Ukraine is the reunification of Little Russia with Great Russia (namely, the reunification, and not the incorporation of one core-base into another)."
    - And we were asked by the Alene breeders? Do you know the difference between the concepts of "small" and "great" for the countries-territories?
    "And Kiev should become the third capital of the united Russia, along with Moscow and Petrograd."
    - This is you telling the long-armed Andrei, the first separatist in Russia, who captured the capital, being the specific prince.
    “It’s time to talk openly about the fact that there is no separate Ukrainian and separate Russian people. These are chimeras that have created to the delight of the enemies of a united Russia-Rus. There is one people - the Russian people (or the super ethnos of the Rus).
    - there were Rusyns, then someone smerds appeared - Russians.
    "All who are against the reunification of a single whole are the enemies of Russia-Russia."
    - Do not cling to Russia. Your historical name is Zalesye, right outside the city of Debryansk.
    "Only together all parts of our people can build a full-fledged power that will withstand the blows of the global crisis."
    - "only together", they knew and read - a full-fledged intra-sufficient country needs 300 million people, and Ukraine can give 40-50 million at a time - it's a sin not to take it.
    "Political leaders who do not follow this path are doomed to failure,"
    - here Fedorich didn’t like you, although for the first time 3 times your tsar congratulated you on your election, but the bear sucked candy.
    "the question of the appearance of a new Bohdan Khmelnitsky and" Pereyaslavskaya Rada-2 "is only a matter of time"
    - voice the provisions that were approved by the Council.
    1. ESCANDER
      0
      25 October 2011 21: 19
      --- “there were Rusyns, then someone smerds appeared - Russians.”

      Well, yes, do you see Dartanyan?
      1. KB-1
        -3
        25 October 2011 22: 07
        As in the joke:
        - by no means, the same cattle as you.
  47. 0
    25 October 2011 21: 25
    Great Tolyan!
    How healthy is he alive? Well, let’s omit the courtesies. Tell us better, to those here present, how you are a proud descendant of the Bandera movement, a purebred Slav, unlike the hated ones, I’m a Nazi snout, s - “descendants of the horde”, I allowed myself to be a true bearer of Slavic culture, such an obscene “nickname” - Tolya, this is a diminutive derivative on behalf of Anatoly, and what do the sources tell us about the meaning of this name, are you ready Tolya?

    The ancient Greeks called Anatoly the inhabitant of Anatolia (the ancient name of Asia Minor, located in the east of Greece). `Anatole` - translated from Greek means` east`.

    Ai-Ii Tolya, if you don’t believe the buzz came with a nickname, or it was your parents who treated you so cruelly when they called you how you, a purebred Slav, to call you such an infamous name Anatoly, which in translation means “Asian” as Tolya further ah? That the right guys, bearing the correct names Vasil, Taras will say, you’ll probably have to change your name and don’t forget to change your homeland, change Tolya to your homeland on the island where the Anglo-Saxons concentrate, because you love reading books written by them, we have already noticed all of this here, because the story of your small homeland written by “Brita” is the most correct story, is it true, Tolya?

    Well, don’t get sick Tolya, health in a foreign land will come in handy for you, it’s dank and damp there, and there are some mists ...
  48. His
    0
    25 October 2011 22: 09
    Why Russia this convoy. I think except Crimea we don’t need anything there
    1. SAVA555.IVANOV
      0
      25 October 2011 23: 36
      Your YOU LIKE IN THAT KALAMBORE))) "IT WAS NOT LONG SINGING, BUT HOW STARTED SINGING SO AND H..YU SINGED" !!))) HOW IS IT ONLY CRIMEA!? And ZAPOROZHYE IS THE HOMELAND OF THE COSSACKS, BY THE STATE AND THE DON AND KUBAN, AND KIEV IS THE CAPITAL OF KIEV RUSSIA, AND DONBASS !? BY THE MOTHERLAND OF COLONEL BUDANOV WHICH KILLED FOR RUSSIA, DOES WE GIVE YOU OUR SONS FOR YOUR SERVICE !? AND YOU ARE NOT LITTLE THAT THEM BEND THEM SO YOU STILL GIVE YOU ONLY TO THE Crimea !! ?? THANKS!! BY THE COURSE YOU ARE NOT JOKING THERE TATARS LIVE THEM TURKEY SUPPORTS THE TRUTH ONLY AT THE HUMANITARIAN LEVEL, BY THE BACKGROUND AND THE CHECHEN ARE THERE A LOT LAST TIME YOU HAVE APPEARED THAT IF YOU WANTED YOU "WANTED YOU"
      1. KB-1
        -6
        26 October 2011 00: 02
        and to hell with honey you can’t smear northern aleni (well, the site, well, a bunch)
        1. Ho ho
          0
          31 October 2011 00: 11
          Bandera?
  49. SAVA555.IVANOV
    +1
    26 October 2011 00: 08
    KB-1 And you from which site came here ?! I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW, I DO NOT WANT TO OFFEND YOURSELF!
    1. lightforcer
      0
      27 October 2011 15: 13
      http://www.banderivets.org.ua/
  50. prus
    0
    26 October 2011 00: 10
    Broke about Bandera. And what kind of man was he, what was he fighting for, why was he fighting? No one really knows. What the school told 20-30 years ago, and today Svanidza, so everyone sculpts. Why did you decide that he was a traitor? Whom did he betray? Once worse than Denikin, Wrangel, etc. there were no people, and today are heroes. And the red ones are also heroes. So who was worse? There is so much literature on this topic, but there is no sense. There is little literature about Bandera and the whole is one-sided. They appointed a ghoul and are glad.
    1. 0
      26 October 2011 00: 15
      So type: the history of the 2nd World War - una-upa ... if you do not understand what they were doing, then move to Ivano-Frankivsk ... you have a place there!
      1. URB
        URB
        0
        27 October 2011 02: 35
        immediately believe what is written is also not necessary =)
    2. SAVA555.IVANOV
      0
      26 October 2011 00: 41
      Prus BANDERA- ASSISTANT OF FASCISTS, FASCIS-AGGRESSORS, FASCISM- CONDEMNED BY EVERYONE INCLUDING AND WEST, NOW IT IS UNDERSTANDING? WE BEFORE BEEN TOLD SUFFICIENTLY TRUE, NOT AS SOMETIMES HEARED NOW
  51. prus
    0
    26 October 2011 00: 55
    So it turns out that at 39 he should have been inflamed with love for the Soviets, when they began to export people from Western Ukraine to Siberia? Just don’t say that this is all lies about Siberia. Both my grandfather and my great-grandmother told stories.
  52. SAVA555.IVANOV
    -1
    26 October 2011 01: 07
    BANDERA IS A SMART MOVE OF ANTI-UKRAINIAN FORCES AND THAT'S ALL, HE SIMPLY DIDN'T HAVE TO GO TO THE FASCISTS ABOUT THEN HE WOULD BE A NATIONAL HERO, AND HE'S JUST A POLITICAL SUCKER, HE FOUGHT WITH THE FASCISTS IN THE ALLIANCE FOR INDEPENDENT UKRAINE, AND WITH FUR AND SIN WHAT TAKE IT FROM HIM, BY THE WAY ALMOST ALL OF IVANO-FRANKOVSK IN THE NORTH WORKED FOR GOOD MONEY THEY COULD NOT BE KICKED FROM THERE WITH A STICK, THAT’S WHAT IT WAS WITH THE ADVICE
    1. KASKAD
      0
      26 October 2011 18: 02
      Turn off caps lock
      1. SAVA555.IVANOV
        -2
        26 October 2011 22: 39
        KASKAD IF A PERSON DOESN'T HAVE ARGUMENTS AND FACTS, THEN HE HAS AN ITCHING IN HIS LESS ABOUT ALL THE THINGS, SO SHOW WHO YOU ARE AND WHAT YOU ARE)))
        1. +4
          27 October 2011 00: 00
          SAVA555.IVANOV You have already been reprimanded more than once for your strange manner ALL comments write in capital letters. (what kind of show-off??)
          On the Internet, there is an established culture of communication with the interlocutor, text typed in a similar way (like yours) is associated with SCREAMING, is it really possible in everyday life, in a dialogue with an opponent? YOU ALL THE TIME YELLING!?? (respect others).
          ps There are only two such loudmouths on the site - You and "LEKHA BLIN".
  53. SAVA555.IVANOV
    0
    27 October 2011 02: 58
    FoMaS Maybe we are deaf or blind?))) And the font is too small, we are impairing each other’s vision to please the inventors of the Internet (and our conditional enemies) I don’t care anymore, but the young people are quickly going blind, maybe we’ll think about this “time bomb” , you'll have to try)
    1. +2
      27 October 2011 03: 23
      1) There are only two real enemies for us, and for the whole world (Zionism and Nazism).
      2) Nobody bothers you to install on your own computer the display of text information at any scale. (it is not difficult).
      3) If you personally need this, then there is no need to strain others. smile
      1. Volkhov
        0
        27 October 2011 03: 49
        There is even one real enemy - the one who created them (Venusians). They are easily distinguished by their blue blood and gray faces (when without makeup). In the magazine “Secrets of the 20th Century” No. 43 October 11 (now on sale) page 12 there is an article “Blue bones in the royal tomb” - this is about them, and the star on the casket is their symbol (the memory of the outbreak of Venus). A little logic and you can win.
  54. Comrade
    +2
    28 October 2011 00: 31
    Voice from Donbass: If Bandera wants to go to the West, let them separate the Lviv and Ternopil regions and become part of Poland...And let them not interfere with people’s lives....

    In my opinion, the new state must absorb all the best that was in the USSR, discard all the worst, clearly formulate the ideas of socialism of the XNUMXst century and put PEOPLE at the forefront......and sweep away all the oligarchs and corrupt officials as unnecessary garbage (both in Russia and Ukraine)... After all, it is they, their mercantile business interests that are aimed at destroying the bridges between our fraternal peoples.

    Conclusion: Unification is REAL, but not on the basis of rotten capitalism....
    1. 0
      28 October 2011 00: 50
      If Bandera wants to go to the West, let them separate the Lviv and Ternopil regions and become part of Poland... And let them not interfere with people’s lives...

      Why, let them immediately move them to the “Rzeczpospolita” - that is, Poland... They will be especially welcome there... Or to the Austro-Hungarian Empire.
    2. ZHORA
      -4
      28 October 2011 09: 45
      It is better to separate this AIDS-prone region from the Donetsk and Lugansk regions... the coal industry is already subsidized, the metallurgical enterprises are not modernized in order to somehow maintain their profitability, there is a constant swing with this gas for the Donbass oligarchs who do not invest money in production, but withdraw it to offshore...they built a stadium for the cattle, bought gypsies and blacks for the team and rejoice, Donbass lumpen...not to mention the level of drug addiction, crime and the AIDS epidemic in the Donbass region...If they love Russia so much, then let them fuck off. ..
      1. stalker
        +1
        28 October 2011 12: 11
        What do you have in Western Ukraine? I suppose everyone has become a migrant worker, so these oligarchs can build dachas))
        1. Antagonist
          0
          6 November 2011 13: 11
          Quote: stalker
          What do you have in Western Ukraine?

          - Well, for example, factories that supply equipment for Su-27-35 aircraft, both now and when Russia allegedly did not purchase it under Yushchenko.
      2. Antagonist
        0
        6 November 2011 13: 16
        [quote=ZHORA]
        No Zhora, that's right - suitcases and on the way... And in the region there are enterprises producing radar, electronic warfare, optics, space launch complexes, diesel locomotives, machine tool products, presses and machines for metal production, cars, cranes, harvesters for resource extraction . And all this is bought from us both in the world and in Russia. They lie - “what will they (we) do with our mechanical engineering”, they bought and will continue to be ours.
    3. Antagonist
      0
      6 November 2011 13: 18
      Quote: Comrade
      Conclusion: Unification is REAL, but not on the basis of rotten capitalism....

      - Yeah, the main thing is for the Russians to continue building the road to Tuzla, otherwise they only worked out this direction during exercises.
      And 85% of Ukraine will immediately want to join the EU, and 15% will want their suitcases and boost the economy of Magadan...
  55. prus
    0
    28 October 2011 01: 22
    Everyone is so smart today. From the height of a certain number of years they know how and what. And who knows why the next generations will curse him? On the Internet, pi..... *don’t move bags*.
  56. Orion
    0
    28 October 2011 23: 31
    In principle, life under the Union was more calm, meaningful, and the future was less guaranteed. And at once - vanity of vanities. Look, if it’s a little bit, then it’s great. And when it’s daytime, it’s already cold. I want to go back to the USSR!
    1. sirToad
      0
      29 October 2011 07: 54
      garneau saying!
      1. Antagonist
        0
        6 November 2011 13: 09
        Tse ne mova is surzhik, and in Russian phonetics.
  57. 0
    29 October 2011 07: 34
    Thanks to Orion, I heard “read the language” and nostalgia began. I haven’t been to Ukraine since perestroika times, my family is from there, the village of Vasilkovka, Dnepropetrovsk region, and how is it now...
  58. Cossack
    0
    29 October 2011 20: 10
    Yes, everything is fine. Like everywhere else. Who moved to the city, who drank himself to death, who plowed.... The village - what will happen to him? smile
  59. 0
    30 October 2011 10: 10
    Ukraine is also plundered like the Russian Federation, but if everything is united into a single state and under normal presidents who would really want the people to prosper, and therefore nationalize everything, then there will be “Glory to Ukraine” and good luck for everyone together. Nazarbayev somehow managed put his oligarchs in line, Lukashenko did not allow the economy to be plundered at all. These are the two leaders you need to have, but the ambitions of the Russian Federation in general are somehow incomprehensible. Do we have a Ministry of Foreign Affairs or not?
  60. 0
    30 October 2011 10: 27
    About Bandera. Every nation is free to choose its own national hero and must bear historical responsibility for this to other nations. Bandera definitely fought for independent mother Ukraine and against the fascists and against the Soviets, and then against the Soviets together with the Nazis. For example, we still have names streets named after Pugachev, Razin, Budyonny and others. Rubak. This must be treated calmly, it will end with a good joint economy. When there is something to eat and drink, what kind of power rules, the people care about one place.
    1. Antagonist
      0
      6 November 2011 13: 07
      Quote: Pardon
      together with the Nazis

      - This did not happen, these are lies of the NKVD and the KGB.
      Quote: Pardon
      Pugacheva

      By the way, he is Ukrainian - he rebelled against the milking of the Moscow horde of the Ukrainian people.
  61. SIA
    SIA
    0
    30 October 2011 20: 39
    We need to unite with Ukraine. How come our and Ukrainian leaders don’t understand this? This should have been done a long time ago.
    1. Cossack
      0
      31 October 2011 01: 48
      Why? And it wouldn’t hurt to ask citizens.
      1. Antagonist
        0
        6 November 2011 13: 04
        Quote: Cossack
        Cossack

        - Here another emphasis needs to be made - it’s customary for everyone to divide Ukraine into different things (let them look in the mirror), but I have a different accent.
        You are from the industrial southern center - Zaporozhye, I can probably already be attributed - from another center of the south of Ukraine, Nikolaev. These are the cities that do a lot and sell very high-tech HF in the Russian Federation. It is customary to cook up Krylov’s fables - that the south is for Russia - well, we understand that these are the groans of those raw materials who have nothing.
        PS
        - So you can see the voice of the people in the face of us - Ukrainians, by your empty verbiage.
  62. 0
    31 October 2011 00: 33
    I’m wondering why any discussion of Ukraine and the idea of ​​reuniting with it as a single space evokes a big Khokhlosrach of Holactic proportions?
    Is it not these endless “communal” quarrels that prove our complete blood and spiritual kinship?
  63. Cossack
    0
    31 October 2011 01: 31
    Yes, there is such a fuss on all forums. Some on ours, some on yours. Everyone proves to us that we don’t exist, and how cool it will be under the wing of Moscow...
    1. Antagonist
      0
      6 November 2011 12: 37
      Quote: Cossack
      Everyone is proving to us that we don’t exist, and how great it will be under the wing of Moscow...

      - Moreover, for some reason, no one except the Muscovites sees any particular benefit and doesn’t really want to go somewhere there.
  64. 0
    31 October 2011 05: 05
    Cossack - not under the wing of Moscow. Kyiv is the mother of Russian cities. Where did the Ukrainians even get the idea that they were under some kind of wing?! The capital moved from Kyiv to Moscow, so what? If she moves to Kazan, I will not consider myself under the wing of the Tatars.
  65. Cossack
    0
    31 October 2011 11: 12
    Yes, honestly, I like Kiev better. The rest is your internal affairs, no need to comment. I just sometimes go through sites like this one, I’m interested in the opinions of my neighbors. I’m a nationalist, like most of those present here, so I understand the futility of arguing on fundamental issues. Everyone has their own interests and must defend them. There are many similar internal...
    1. 0
      1 November 2011 01: 48
      What, you will be very happy in free swimming? Have 20 years of timelessness really taught us nothing? Is it necessary for Russia to become half Muslim, and Ukraine to be half depopulated, so that the Slavs finally wise up and admit that they cannot survive without each other?
      And yes, I consider the term “nationality - Ukrainian” to be ephemeral, invented by the enemies of Russia in Vienna and Warsaw and subsequently imposed by the Bolsheviks to make Russia more manageable.
  66. serge
    0
    31 October 2011 20: 40
    Regarding the origin of Russians, Ukrainians and other Slavs.
    Breaking copies around the names of places or who killed whom,
    These are usually opinions close to the narrator himself.
    Objective research is only possible
    with the help of geneticists.
    So, genetics among Russians, Ukrainians, Belarusians, Slovaks,
    Poles (!!!) are almost the same. They are actually different
    names of one people.
    The data differs from the Finns and Germans by 7-8 times.
    The Balts and other Slavs are close.
    Not very Serbs and Bulgarians (but closer than the Germans).

    http://haplogroup.narod.ru/russ.html
  67. 0
    2 November 2011 04: 23
    Who cares who is a hero and who is a traitor. You need to think and analyze with your own head, and not cram what you were taught at school (info changes every year, under a different editorship). If my memory serves me correctly, before Ukraine joined Russia, several options for a “merger” were discussed. Ivan Bogun (national hero of Ukraine) proposed unification with Turkey. But the story went as it did. The people have made their choice and there is no need to shout about the occupation. The strength of the Slavs is in unity. We need each other, and Russia is stronger for Ukraine. Otherwise it will simply turn into a US colony
  68. 0
    2 November 2011 05: 09
    Besides. Why label? Any person commits an action based on his personal worldview and assessing the situation. Did Bandera go to war wearing only a helmet? He had like-minded people, and the people followed him.
    1. -1
      2 November 2011 23: 54
      Of course, I cannot consider Bandera a hero, but if he is from the western lands of Ukraine, then somewhere you can understand him. At least he owed nothing to anyone and did not violate any oath. He simply fought for what he considered necessary in accordance with his conscience, which rebelled against communism.
      1. Antagonist
        0
        6 November 2011 12: 33
        Quote: Magadan
        Magadan

        - Wow, you’re already productive. I also need to add - for the Ukrainian people and statehood.
  69. 0
    3 November 2011 10: 17
    Ukrainians are our brothers and there is nothing worse when brother is against brother, And when we are together the devil himself is not our brother.
  70. Antagonist
    0
    5 November 2011 16: 07
    The most important thing is that in Manilovism, they forgot to ask Ukrainians for their opinion. winked
  71. 0
    9 November 2011 03: 37
    I agree both about the people and about statehood, but if we imagine that Soviet troops would have left Ukraine, I sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo option are it possible that Bandera’s partisanship would have made it possible to see Ukraine on the map at all.
  72. Black Shark Pilot
    0
    18 November 2011 10: 35
    Yes I agree! But if we unite, no America is afraid of us!
  73. MpiR
    0
    11 December 2011 19: 29
    Although we don’t have an army “instead of machine guns, brooms and mops,” but let’s say we have weapons of deterrence)) not nuclear and atomic missiles, but a dozen nuclear power plants and each with 4 reactors and even 40 reactors, and now imagine that these 40 reactors will blow up)
    as they say, Ukraine is not like that for us))))
    That is, if someone occupies us, they will regret it))
    Maybe, but who knows what we are capable of for the sake of independence)

    and I don’t remember who said “Kyiv is the key to Moscow”
    like Napoleon.
    1. 26vova06
      0
      19 October 2012 16: 37
      you are talking complete nonsense! if Russia decides to return the same Crimea by force, then few of those living in this region will resist, the same with almost all of Ukraine, with the exception of the current western regions
  74. MpiR
    0
    12 December 2011 12: 43
    Well, if you look into history, you can see how many times you robbed us, oppressed us, etc.... even in Soviet times, we were like a raw material base, pumped oil from us, etc., that in the end, after the collapse of us, they... I not left)
  75. 0
    14 August 2012 14: 53
    Agree. Someone really benefits from the quarrels between our fraternal countries! In that case, I even know whom profitable! The United States had a twenty-year plan for the collapse of the USSR. Now they seem to be back to their old ways! Meanwhile, they did not take into account that it was impossible to defeat us! No matter how pretentious it may sound. But Ukraine, Belarus and Russia are one people, one country.

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