Military Review

CSTO will help Russia with import substitution

53
The CSTO member countries will take part in the Russian defense defense import substitution program, TASS message of the Secretary General of the Organization Nikolai Bordyuzhi.

CSTO will help Russia with import substitution


“There are factories in Kazakhstan and Belarus, in Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Armenia where you can expand the production of components for our defense industrial complex. We will look at the potential of the CSTO member states in order to use their industrial capabilities for the production of weapons or components that were previously produced in Ukraine or purchased abroad, in the West, ”the Secretary General said.

CSTO will analyze and find out which factories have the necessary technological lines. “Then we put together the capabilities of a specific country and the needs of the Russian DIC, we will find the possibility of placing orders or organizing production in the interests of the defense industry of Russia. This work is being conducted today in the CSTO system, ”explained Bordyuzha.

For example, he cited Tajikistan, where "there are a certain number of proposals for those enterprises that used to be in the military-industrial complex system (the Soviet Union) and can now be used in the Russian MIC system."

Currently, the secretary general is in Belarus, where he meets with Alexander Lukashenko regarding the activities of the CSTO.
Photos used:
tass.ru
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  1. not Russian
    not Russian April 13 2015 17: 58
    +23
    The USSR is reborn. Rejoice is recommended for a quiet. I am glad.
    1. Giant thought
      Giant thought April 13 2015 18: 11
      +10
      But the real action will be the CSTO, and God forbid that this initiative be realized with good results.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. saag
      saag April 13 2015 18: 29
      -2
      Quote: non-Russian
      The USSR is reborn.

      Why's that? USSR is a completely different matter, decipher this abbreviation
      1. Homo
        Homo April 14 2015 06: 28
        +2
        Quote: saag
        Why's that? USSR is a completely different matter, decipher this abbreviation

        If you are an adult, then you need to think accordingly. The USSR - not by letter but in essence!
    4. ltshyi01
      ltshyi01 April 13 2015 18: 31
      +27
      It’s not worth rejoicing you need to create your own military-industrial complex, otherwise it will turn out like with Ukraine again! The defense complex should be your own at 100%!
      1. Reserve officer
        Reserve officer April 13 2015 19: 10
        +14
        Vadim, I agree! We have already been friends with Ukraine as part of the military-industrial complex. How it ended - everyone knows. And then little has been preserved for 20 years from the military-industrial complex of the USSR in these countries. Anyway, you have to build new production facilities. Train staff, raise new staff. And if so, then why abroad, and not in Russia?
        Who guarantees that these five listed countries will always have external interests coinciding with Russian ones?
        The rapprochement of economies in itself is pleasing. Even very happy. But there are many other areas of cooperation with the CSTO.
      2. veksha50
        veksha50 April 13 2015 19: 53
        +8
        Quote: ltshyi01
        It’s not worth rejoicing you need to create your own military-industrial complex, otherwise it will turn out like with Ukraine again! The defense complex should be your own at 100%!


        Moreover, the discussion is about import substitution ... These states (Belarus, Armenia, Tajikistan) are independent, and ambitions can manifest at any moment ...

        Although the Stalinist USSR (and even later) depended on imports, it was not as universal as we are now ...

        Again, instead of deciding on the most important issue of the revival of industry, they are looking for ways to eat fish and sit on the sixth ... They live today ...
        1. g1v2
          g1v2 April 13 2015 20: 41
          +5
          This is a way to more closely tied allied countries and give them money. They are friends with us not because we are so wonderful and adore us, but because it is profitable with us. Naturally, nothing secret or critical will be placed there, but they will be allowed to feed. It is the same with cx - the bulk of our needs will be satisfied by our cx-complex, but Belarusians and Kazakhs will be allowed to earn money, and the Greeks too. At the same time, food production, meat processing and livestock complexes are opened every week in the Russian Federation. On done, we can see it. So most of the meat and dairy industries will be ours, and the rest will be left to those who want to be friends with us. And let's be honest - they want to be friends with us because of the 140 millionth market and cheap energy, and not because of fraternal feelings or love. Accordingly, this should be supported by sharing the cake.
      3. NEXUS
        NEXUS April 13 2015 20: 18
        +4
        Quote: ltshyi01
        It’s not worth rejoicing you need to create your own military-industrial complex, otherwise it will turn out like with Ukraine again! The defense complex should be your own at 100%!

        I think the measure is more likely to be transshipment, so far. We will build our own in Russia, some production facilities will be located in the Union countries. And later these production facilities will be duplicated here.
        We don’t have time to wait until they build it with us and not release the necessary weapons. The decision is reasonable. At the same time, we’ll keep the Allied economies
      4. sergeybulkin
        sergeybulkin April 13 2015 21: 07
        +4
        Rejoice should not create your own MIC

        So I think - why this hell is sweeter than that radish. For any money will go abroad!
        NOT OUR workers and them, what good ???

        What a ... damn import substitution! This is even worse. What can be made for us in Tajikistan ??? Probably soldier's bowlers, footcloths will send a million, but no footcloths probably no longer use.
        am wassat fool
      5. Eugene-Eugene
        Eugene-Eugene April 13 2015 21: 23
        +2
        Rejoice should not create your own MIC

        Apparently, we are talking about the creation in the CSTO countries of a production that produces the primary elements of the technological cycle, that is, products of the "wedge key" type. At the factories of the Russian Federation, these products will already be saturated with high-tech products made in Russia. It makes no sense to produce "screws and nuts" if they can be made in countries with low salary, which guarantees a lower cost.
      6. Albert1988
        Albert1988 April 14 2015 15: 28
        0
        Quote: ltshyi01
        It’s not worth rejoicing you need to create your own military-industrial complex, otherwise it will turn out like with Ukraine again! The defense complex should be your own at 100%!

        You can’t argue with this, but the option described in the article is quite suitable as a temporary measure.
    5. Starover_Z
      Starover_Z April 13 2015 18: 34
      +7
      Quote: non-Russian
      The USSR is reborn. Rejoice is recommended for a quiet. I am glad.

      I’m only for, but ... Until recently, Ukraine was also from the USSR, a member of the CIS.
      So production must be accumulated in Russia!
      Raise personnel, build factories, increase production. And create science-intensive products without selling licenses! Our repair, maintenance - yes, technology transfer - no!
      Well, this is for distant foreign countries. And for the CSTO countries - commodity exchange!
    6. Kostyar
      Kostyar April 13 2015 18: 46
      +2
      The USSR is reborn. Rejoice is recommended for a quiet. I am glad.

      Why is it quiet? The worst nightmare for the USA, even if from all the speakers they hear about it constantly !!! They will rejoice for us .....
      1. bulatovvvas
        bulatovvvas April 13 2015 23: 41
        +3
        Our leadership cannot be made to really engage in the revival of industry and agriculture. What kind of "import substitution", when the presidential decrees in May are fulfilled by only 20 percent. Where are the 20 million new jobs when unemployment rises? None of the adopted state programs have been fully implemented, only boltology. Putin cannot be denied the art of "convincingly" to communicate with the people, of which we will "be convinced" once again on April 16!
    7. rpek32
      rpek32 April 14 2015 05: 41
      0
      “In Kazakhstan and Belarus, in Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Armenia there are factories where you can expand the production of components for our defense industry.


      And why these plants can not be deployed on its territory?
    8. silver_roman
      silver_roman April 15 2015 11: 08
      0
      this is certainly good, friendship within the framework of the union, etc., BUT do not forget about the rake on which the USSR jumped.
      Today in the same Tajikistan loyal pro-Russian power, but what will happen tomorrow?
      As if later we didn’t have to import-substitute what we import-substituting, transferring part of the order to our allies. Nevertheless, I am a supporter of the construction of the main defense industry units in the Russian Federation.
      But on the other hand, if the allied countries receive orders, they will receive funds for development, which is also good.
      The example of the gas turbine engine is extremely unpleasant for the domestic fleet. Repetition would not be desirable. That and also still did not solve this problem.
    9. Juborg
      Juborg April 15 2015 14: 16
      0
      No, well, spruces, why again put yourself in dependence on someone? Now father will be enraged and will not have tractors or simply break the price as an aircraft carrier. No, the military industry should be independent of no one and no one's whim.
      1. Basarev
        Basarev April 15 2015 15: 02
        0
        And not only the military industry - the whole country should be completely independent of anyone's whim. I am a supporter of radical absolute self-sufficiency.
  2. Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 13 2015 17: 58
    +15
    “In Kazakhstan and Belarus, in Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Armenia there are factories where you can expand the production of components for our defense industry

    I would think ten times ... After all, already burned! Is there little territory in Russia?
    1. hrych
      hrych April 13 2015 18: 21
      +5
      The Collective Security Treaty Organization will conduct an analysis and find out which factories have the necessary production lines

      We are talking about ready-made, available lines, ours are all busy, and introducing new ones is time. Theoretically, you can just think about the capacities already built by us under the USSR that can be restarted and made to work in our favor.
      1. veksha50
        veksha50 April 13 2015 19: 56
        +2
        Quote: hrych
        Theoretically, you can just think about the capacities already built by us under the USSR, which can be restarted and made to work in our favor.


        Do you think these enterprise lines have not lost their working capacity and technological documentation in so much time ??? Well, the shots, of course, did not lose ???
        1. hrych
          hrych April 13 2015 20: 18
          +2
          I think if you take Belarus, then everything is saved and practically ready for work, including personnel, as for the rest of the members, then a lot is probably sold out and destroyed, but there you need to look. So colleagues from the Republic of Kazakhstan say that something remains.
    2. Revolver
      Revolver April 13 2015 18: 23
      +3
      "There are factories in Kazakhstan and Belarus, in Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Armenia" - is this, excuse me, import substitution with what? Other imports?
      Quote: MIKHAN
      After all, already burned! Is there little territory in Russia?
      I agree, as they say, "one hundred poods."
    3. Kasym
      Kasym April 13 2015 18: 30
      +10
      Why think! Ukraine is not a member of the CSTO. Russia's retaliatory measures for any CSTO country will be "fatal" for their armies - no spare parts, no BC, no "aid". That Ukraine, without spare parts and ammunition, is what everyone sees. If they take it in the West, then all the weapons must be thrown into a landfill - neither cartridges nor shells will work. Stocks of Eastern Europe are also under suction, and how will they change (no one has money, but they will give rubbish like English armored cars for nothing) !? The Poles will give back their tanks - I don't think so ?! Those Georgians with bare butts are sitting after "the help of the West" - an obvious example for others and fools were found only in Kiev.
      It is high time. In one RK there were 19 large defense industry facilities. And money is never redundant - first of all, it is necessary to use the EAEU countries and their financial capabilities. Even the USA cannot cover with its military-industrial complex all the needs of the Pentagon, they will not go bankrupt - one must approach with such a head. And in your opinion it is necessary, for example, to grow cotton in greenhouses in order to produce cotton fabric - it's silly. Or build a met. a plant to receive rare earth metals for electronics - is in Kazakhstan. The same torpedoes. But you never know what.
      And the new one - money for production and personnel training - is expensive and long (it may not pay off at all). hi
      1. skeket
        skeket April 13 2015 18: 50
        +3
        Quote: Kasym
        The same torpedoes

        To the point, comrade! I myself just wanted to write that the Design Bureau of the Machine-Building Plant named after S. M. Kirova (Kazakh SSR, Alma-Ata) - was the flagship of Soviet torpedo building.
      2. Revolver
        Revolver April 13 2015 19: 45
        +2
        If the Slavic brothers-Ukrainians have thrown, then even more so Kazakhs will throw without hesitation, if someone is a thread (the candidates for these "someone is a thread" - Uncle Sam, the Chinese, Turks, ISIS, and we can and someone else will draw) will offer, figuratively speaking , large enough "cookies". Kyrgyz and Tajiks are even less reliable than Kazakhs, from there, unlike Kazakhstan, the Russian-speaking population was practically squeezed out. Armenia is a country in a state of war, to set up production there - there is a risk that Azerbaijan will be bombed with the next aggravation, and it will be right - after all, the object can be considered a military one with all the consequences. Only Belarusians can be trusted, and even then with caution.
    4. skeket
      skeket April 13 2015 18: 46
      +4
      Quote: MIKHAN
      I would think ten times ... After all, already burned! Is there little territory in Russia?

      Russia does not have enough capacity now, and new weapons are needed right now. Are you ready to wait a few years for a new plant to start in Russia?
      1. Vitaly Anisimov
        Vitaly Anisimov April 13 2015 18: 55
        +3
        Quote: skeket
        Quote: MIKHAN
        I would think ten times ... After all, already burned! Is there little territory in Russia?

        Russia does not have enough capacity now, and new weapons are needed right now. Are you ready to wait a few years for a new plant to start in Russia?

        If only for a while ... I agree! Until we build our plants .. hi Remember how the factories were evacuated deep into Russia and practically under the open sky they released products .. Ukraine is generally nonsense!
    5. VadimSt
      VadimSt April 13 2015 18: 48
      +3
      Just started reading and immediately highlighted this paragraph ... I look, and the thought flew.
      Indeed, there is the possibility of newer technologies, if they help, if their production potential in Russia is not enough, to free up - by transferring secondary tasks to the CSTO partners, and then, temporarily!
  3. avvg
    avvg April 13 2015 18: 00
    +2
    The CSTO doesn’t place between the countries it will also strengthen the economic union, not only in the field of arms production, there will not be superfluous. However, mainly arms production should be located on the territory of Russia.
  4. EvaFerrari
    EvaFerrari April 13 2015 18: 03
    +3
    Why then did they introduce a strategy of import substitution, if now the government is looking for opportunities to supply equipment, products and other things from abroad? Yes, the countries listed in the article are not so distant in terms of territory, but it is still abroad, close or distant - it does not matter anymore. There were some "brothers" in our history, what happened to them - everyone knows ...

    Do not step on the same rake, history may repeat itself
    1. combat66
      combat66 April 13 2015 18: 07
      +3
      Yes, the story may repeat itself. But not using the opportunities of friendly interstate cooperation will be an even bigger mistake.
      1. skeket
        skeket April 13 2015 18: 54
        0
        Quote: combat66
        Yes, the story may repeat itself. But not using the opportunities of friendly interstate cooperation will be an even bigger mistake.

        all the more so now, when time is running out for us, and tomorrow we ourselves will not be able to increase volumes and substitution. There is a way out, it will turn either to China, or to the Armenians and Belarusians. I would choose Armenians with Belarusians.
  5. Fat
    Fat April 13 2015 18: 04
    0
    let them do it. but a little. the main volume still needs to be done at home
    1. altay.kz
      altay.kz April 13 2015 18: 14
      +5
      this is not done from a good life ...
      1. altay.kz
        altay.kz April 13 2015 22: 14
        0
        "Production of goods in Russia per capita is ten times lower than in any developed country." http://expert.ru/expert/2013/31/myi-nichego-ne-proizvodim/?56789
        1. Aleksandr1959
          Aleksandr1959 April 13 2015 23: 19
          +1
          I apologize, but what criteria do you yourself use when choosing developed countries?
          Not "Expert", but yourself?
    2. altay.kz
      altay.kz April 13 2015 18: 20
      +3
      is anyone interested in economics, politics and statistics here?
  6. act
    act April 13 2015 18: 07
    +4
    That's right! The impossible cannot be claimed, and the contribution to the CSTO's defense capability should be integrated and feasible.
  7. Stinger
    Stinger April 13 2015 18: 12
    +4
    It would not be necessary to engage in profanation of import substitution. Especially in the defense industry.
  8. Ivan Tarasov
    Ivan Tarasov April 13 2015 18: 15
    +4
    Are we feeding our neighbors again at the expense of state security?
    Ukraine was fed - they were left without transport aircraft and helicopter engines ...
    How many times do you need to step on the rake, what would come of it?
  9. old pioneer
    old pioneer April 13 2015 18: 15
    +5
    And at whose expense is the banquet, ashamed to ask? If the matter is common, then everyone should be invested, if possible, of course. I’m happy to earn this denyuzhku in Russia and with no less quality than a Tajik. Or think that it will be cheaper there? Will there be specialists in Tajikistan who have worked in specialized factories? After all, love must be taught.
    1. Humpty
      Humpty April 13 2015 18: 37
      0
      Quote: old pioneer
      And at whose expense is the banquet, ashamed to ask?

      Combat shaitan-arba from craftsmen from the "Tajik defense", yurts with the ability to fly with a tailwind from "Kyrgyz specialists". Along with the technologies, it is necessary to bring people appropriate to Asia. They are naturally unique languages. They do not speak Asia, translations of documentation, adaptation of national personnel to the opportunity to work at a factory, labor discipline, etc.
      Nonsense to invent, not a feature of the modern, independently or anywhere in the SA, they are not able to produce. People who are capable of at least working in factories are now extremely rare due to the efforts of these countries.
      1. avt
        avt April 13 2015 19: 24
        +4
        Quote: Humpty
        Nonsense to invent, not a feature of the modern, independently or anywhere in the SA, they are not able to produce. People who are capable of at least working in factories are now extremely rare due to the efforts of these countries.

        Well, not only problems with personnel, what is the state of production? Something I strongly doubt that in Tajikistan, during the civil war, someone was engaged in updating equipment at the factories left after the USSR, again, two shake-ups in Kyrgyzstan, somehow, do not inspire confidence that the factories there will start working as if from a kick. Kazakhstan has undertaken to do ambitious assembly programs. , well, with the same helicopters, so after all, a screwdriver will hike. Of course, with RosAtom, but this is not import substitution. It turns out if quickly - only Butler, well, yes - he will drag something and someone from Ukraine, therefore Bordyuzha started and he sharpens the fritters with Butler. But let's say the same turbines for the fleet ... No. cheaper and faster by ourselves.
        Quote: Kasym
        ... At the Zenith in Uralsk to see - "Cliffs" did something else.

        The CORD on "Degtyarev" has long been cut out with might and main in various modifications - they have finished cutting to the handbrake 12mm laughing , again, the capacities in Izhevsk are such that they will be more than blocked, and I doubt that the same Kalashnikov will miss the budget line. And so, for the fact that you joined the CSTO - give money to upgrade production to meet your needs, and this will definitely be 100% prepayment and wait until we deploy everything? And even with a real struggle for the budget line ...... No. I really doubt sooo much.
  10. alone
    alone April 13 2015 18: 26
    +3
    )))) and in what condition are these plants import substitutes, no one was interested?

    looks like a specific PR!

    And yet, what prevented still doing this?))))
    1. sniper
      sniper April 13 2015 18: 50
      +3
      Quote: lonely
      But in what condition are these import substitutes, no one was interested?

      Most likely in no ... Decades of inactivity, attempts to switch to other products, this is at least a complete loss of personnel and inoperative equipment ... That is, only names are left from once really operating plants ... Alas, it’s easier to build new ones .. .
      1. Kasym
        Kasym April 13 2015 19: 00
        +3
        Until recently, "Tochka" was assembled in Petropavlovsk, torpedoes in Alma-Ata, repair plants (small batches of course - there are no such volumes as in the USSR). And there are personnel there and young people are being brought up (not enough, but with "volumes" it is possible to recruit). That 405 plant has been pulling up young people for the third year already. At the Zenith in Uralsk to see - "Cliffs" did something else.
        That which is "alive" must be used. hi
    2. Vitaly Anisimov
      Vitaly Anisimov April 13 2015 20: 09
      +1
      Quote: lonely
      )))) and in what condition are these plants import substitutes, no one was interested?

      looks like a specific PR!

      And yet, what prevented still doing this?))))

      That's right .. This is a distraction, called! good
      1. alone
        alone April 13 2015 21: 11
        0
        Vitaly must deal with matters))) and not be distracted))) wink
  11. wedmed5
    wedmed5 April 13 2015 18: 29
    +2
    There is a good proverb: "Trust in God, but don't do it yourself." CSTO assistance is great, but the ability to produce everything necessary for the defense industry on its territory should always be available, albeit not in full, but with a willingness to increase production as quickly as possible.
  12. shooter18
    shooter18 April 13 2015 18: 35
    0
    Apparently not to create from scratch they decided that it would be more economical to buy from neighbors
  13. Agent J
    Agent J April 13 2015 18: 52
    0
    Import substitution is necessary and can be developed jointly with the CSTO countries ... BUT, in Russia it is necessary to make "bookmarks" for the future in the form of empty production facilities in case someone suddenly starts throwing, like Ukraine ... And here is oppa, but we have in a couple of months, our own workshop for the production of the necessary garbage has already been opened! fellow
  14. lonovila
    lonovila April 13 2015 19: 08
    +1
    -Yes, even on the territory of Russia, and then-not everywhere is it worth deploying military production of certain "strategic components" of Russian weapons ... -For example ... -in the Caucasus (Chechnya, Dagestan, Ingushetia) ... -What really talking about "foreign states" ... -It is a monstrous mistake ... -then we will again have to bitterly regret this perfect "rashness" ...
  15. v245721
    v245721 April 13 2015 19: 14
    +4
    again outside the borders of Russia. Yes, when Russia wiser. ?????? people no discounts and they are outside fool all are taken out. MARASM FULL. !!!!! What Ukrainians did not teach ????? stop
  16. Abbra
    Abbra April 13 2015 19: 25
    +4
    All this, of course, is good ... But all THIS should be done only in Russia.
  17. Vlad5307
    Vlad5307 April 13 2015 19: 27
    -1
    No, this is not a mistake: 1. CSTO countries are bound by a defense agreement 2. Reasonable cooperation is no burden to anyone - only mutual benefits. The Russian empire grew in territories, taking under its protection weak state formations and helped them develop, unlike the British Empire, which pursued a predatory colonial policy. So if there is an opportunity for closer cooperation, then it is necessary to bring together the CSTO countries. This will help not only technical and military cooperation, but also cultural exchange and much more. No need to abandon the path of rapprochement, another thing is how to draw this rapprochement! hi
  18. tarahtung
    tarahtung April 13 2015 19: 30
    +1
    In Tajikistan, there was one plant for the production of aluminum spoons. The prospect is gorgeous.
  19. valentina-makanalina
    valentina-makanalina April 13 2015 19: 38
    +2
    And why the hell is sweeter than radish?
    Ukraine, too, seemed to have its own.
    There is a CSTO today. And tomorrow?
    Everything should be your own.
  20. tarahtung
    tarahtung April 13 2015 19: 44
    +3
    Again we will send Russian-speaking minds to Asia to build factories, then a new union will appear, something like the USSR, then it will fall apart again and Russian-speaking will again be humiliated upon obtaining Russian citizenship
  21. Yereke
    Yereke April 13 2015 19: 55
    +1
    yes we will help to make a shaitan pipe))
    1. gas113
      gas113 April 13 2015 21: 04
      0
      And shaitan stick for special forces)))
  22. Tribuns
    Tribuns April 13 2015 20: 22
    +3
    And the liberal economists of our Government are still "modernizing" the remnants of Russian industry ...

    We remember with sadness the dashing, gangster 90s, when Gaidar, Chubais and his comrades "grabbed" the people's property, destroyed industry and dragged our country into a liberal, market swamp, into which even nails began to be imported from China ...
    And now, the Russian government is talking about import substitution through the restoration of production at dilapidated Tajik and Kyrgyz enterprises ...
    And no one answered for the catastrophic collapse of domestic industry ...
    Moreover, all the demands of ordinary Russians for power on the actual modernization of our industry on the principles of the Stalinist mobilization economy Liberal Medvedev and his Gaidar-Yasinsky economic bloc in the Government are openly ignoring ..
  23. sagitch
    sagitch April 13 2015 22: 16
    +1
    How can! Again on the same rake! And especially the defense industry !!!
  24. atamankko
    atamankko April 13 2015 22: 16
    +1
    HEAVY, BUT IT IS NECESSARY TO FIGHT FOR ITS.
  25. ilyaspb
    ilyaspb April 13 2015 23: 12
    +1
    It is a pity that Azerbaijan is not our friend. They made analogs of "Ukrainian" Soviet connectors and, it seems, some kind of microcircuits that are still used in old products. It could be intercepted. Although, it is already clear that one should not seriously rely on the former "brothers".
  26. Seal
    Seal April 13 2015 23: 32
    +2
    Quote: Vlad5307
    The Russian empire grew in territories, taking under its protection weak state formations and helped them develop, unlike the British Empire, which pursued a predatory colonial policy.

    So what ? We helped our national suburbs to the detriment of ourselves - and they wipe their feet about us. And the British then wiped their feet on their colonies and pumped out wealth - and they (the former colonies of England) still look into the English mouth !!!
    1. tarahtung
      tarahtung 11 June 2018 20: 25
      0
      Now we are wiping our feet ourselves.
  27. Nirvanko
    Nirvanko April 13 2015 23: 52
    +1
    It’s high time, only from the listed countries as from a piglet of wool in terms of technology. It is necessary to create joint programs and not to share milk and cheese.