Military Review

Leaders of hunger

51
Perhaps the most interesting thing in journalistic practice is to debunk the myths. Meticulously and mercilessly. When it turns out to reveal some socially significant lie, then you rejoice like a child, again and again checking the accuracy of all the accumulated facts. This time I was interested in a highly controversial and even scandalous topic in modern society - the tragedy in Ukraine in 1932-33. Together with the professional researcher of the Soviet era, historian Ivan Chigirin, who unselfishly helped me comprehend the secrets of archival work and provided materials they had acquired over the past seven years, I managed to find previously unknown documentary data that could shed light on the events of those years. To answer the main question: how did the famine arise in the republic and who was guilty of this, did not work out. However, using the original archival documents, you can come to the unequivocal conclusion that both the Soviet government and Stalin personally did everything possible to prevent a famine in Ukraine. Even to the detriment of other regions of the Union.


Leaders of hungerAll the house

The myth in which most modern people blindly believe, and even is voiced by many politicians, is that the famine in Ukraine in 1932-33 was artificially provoked by the USSR government. Allegedly, the industrialization of the country was then carried out through the mass sale abroad of grain and other food raw materials. However, any person can be convinced of the falsity of this assertion, if it is not too lazy to glance at the reports of the Conference of Wheat Exporting Countries, which took place from 21 to 25 in August of 1933 in London. Exporters strictly controlled the observance of mutual agreements, so the figures cited are beyond doubt. At the export rate established for the USSR in 50 million bushels (1 bushel = 28,6 kg), only 1932 million was exported in 17 year. During this, the Soviet delegation was literally scandalized to immediately restore deliveries in accordance with the commitments made. But the commitments were never fulfilled. Compared to the previous year, wheat exports decreased significantly and, according to the London conference, amounted to 486 200 tons. If in the 1931 year, through Turkey and Egypt, Palestine and to the islands of Rhodes and Cyprus, the USSR supplied only 714 tons of flour, in 1932 and later for three years such deliveries were not made at all.

On the contrary, it was in 1932 that our country for the first time in its stories It has become one of the world's largest importers of food products and agricultural raw materials. In connection with the crop failure, which took place both in the USSR and in most European countries, urgent measures were taken. With Persia (present-day Iran), grain and rice supply contracts were concluded. If the import of grain in grain in 1931 amounted to 172 tons, then in 1932 alone, in addition to other food products, 138,3 thousand tons of bread and 66,9 thousand tons of rice were imported into the Union. In 1931, Turkey bought 22,6 thousand heads of large cattle and 48,7 thousand heads of small livestock, and in 1932, these figures increased respectively to 53,3 (2,4 times) and to 186,2 thousand heads (3,8 times). In total, in 1932, the USSR purchased 147,2 thous. Heads of cattle and 1,1 million small, and also 9,3 thous. Tons of meat and meat products (an increase in 1931 times 4,8 a year) abroad.

Bread

Ukraine, on the other hand, was in a special position of the Soviet government. In the 1932 year, according to both the State Statistics Committee of the Ukrainian SSR (declassified in 2001 year) and the official statistical reference book "Socialist Construction of the USSR (1933-1938)", the gross yield of grain crops was 146 571 thousand centners. Under the then existing rules, collective farms and individual farmers were to sell the third of the harvest to the state at a fixed price. If we consider that the population of the USSR was 31,9 million people, the remaining grain was enough for 839 g per day for each resident. It was even more than the norm established in Germany (700 g). But this figure in the Stalinist government decided to increase.

From the Politburo's decision of 7 in January of 1933: “65 / 45 - on the grain procurement plan: 1. Reduce the grain procurement plan from the 1932 harvest by 28 million pounds. 2. In accordance with paragraph 1 of the resolution, to approve as final, subject to unconditional and full implementation of the annual plan of grain procurements (without garnetz): ... Ukraine - 280 million pounds. ” We consider: according to several (including Ukrainian) sources, the gross harvest of grain crops for 1932 a year was 146 571 thousand centners, rounded - 916 million pounds. Subtract the plan - 280 million pounds. It turns out that 636 million remains for food. We divide this number by 31 population 901,4 thousand people (by 01.01.1933) and by the number of days per year. We get 873. At that time, many developed countries in Europe would envy such provision with bread.

By 1933, even more interesting. Decree of the Central Committee of the CPSU (b) No. 129 of January 10 1933 for the Ukrainian SSR set the plan for 1933 million pounds of grain for XSSR (including 256 collective farms and 232 to individual farmers) for 24. A separate item added another 9,5 million. The total figure of the plan for the delivery has been 265,5 million poods (42 480 thousand centners). Gross grain harvest amounted to 222 965 thousand centners. In view of the 1933 plan for the year, 180 485 thousand is left in the republic. The population on 1 January 1934 was 30 051,1 thousand people. In terms of per capita, the indicator for a wealthy fist is generally 1,6 kg per day. This is almost 2 kg of baked bread! What hunger, comrades?

In terms of the availability of mechanized means of agriculture, Ukraine ranked first among all the Union republics and was among the top five in Europe, because both the tractor and other agricultural machines were delivered there as a priority in accordance with resolutions of the Central Committee of the CPSU (B). From 102 machine and tractor stations (MTS), organized in the USSR in 1929, 34 was created in Ukraine. 1932 worked there in 445, and already 1933 MTS worked in 606. Only in 1933, agriculture of the Ukrainian SSR received 15 000 tractors, 2500 combines, 5000 complex machines. Note that none of the Union republics received such a large amount of agricultural equipment from the center. Even virgin Kazakhstan received significantly less. As of 1 June 1932, the MNS of Ukraine had 18 208 tractors, and on 1 January 1934, 51 309. And this is for processing 19,8 million hectares!

Meat

As of 1 February 1932, the total number of livestock in Ukraine was 13 533 thousand heads, including farmers and sole farmers 4257,7 thousand. It is noteworthy that after four months, by 1 June 1932, the total number of cattle increased by 250 thousand. This indicates a sufficient supply of livestock feed, the absence of epidemics and diseases that not only excluded the death of animals, but also contributed to an increase in the herd. It turns out a strange situation: the cattle were fed, and they were dying of hunger? What dedication!

However, in this case, Moscow reduced the norms for the delivery of meat by the Ukrainian SSR relative to other republics of the country. So that, God forbid, fraternal Ukraine is not deprived. When the Central Committee of the Communist Party (Bolsheviks) of the Republic issued a decree on the delivery of meat in accordance with the plan, the center decided to cancel it and offered to lower the rate. P. 48 / 35 from 29 IV.1933 “On the Resolution of the Central Committee of the Communist Party (B) U on the delivery of meat. To propose the CC of the CP (b) U to cancel its ruling of 3 on April 1933 on the issue of the procedure for the mandatory delivery of meat. ” (Who cares: RGASPI, 17 Foundation, 3 inventory, 922 case, 12 sheet.) But, despite all the measures, an acute shortage of food from the population of Ukraine nevertheless arose. Therefore, the number of cattle began to decline. From 1 February 1932 to 1 July 1933 of the year - on 1226 thousand heads. Yes, they ate. But the question arises: if really starving, why not eat more?

The harvest was good, and in Ukraine already in July 1933 of grain delivery was performed on 87%, and in August - on 194,8%! The plan was almost completed twice. First Secretary of the Dnipropetrovsk Regional Committee of the KP (b) U MM Khataevich reported to the XVII Party Congress: “Comrade Stalin quite right yesterday, with the greatest urgency raised the question of animal husbandry. In our region, only the last 4-5 months are designated as fracture months, as months of a noticeable turn in the direction of raising livestock ... We had 1932 thousand pigs in our region at the beginning of 210, 1 thousand pigs in our region 1933 July, and on 80 January 1 g. 1934 thousand pigs. In five months, the pig stock has almost doubled. ” This and many hundreds of other documents clearly show that things were going well in Dnipropetrovsk. Yes, the number of animals was reduced, because they were simply eaten. In a year and a half, only pigs were eaten by 155 thousand. If 130 thousand cattle and sheep and goats are added to this figure and take into account that grain deliveries were also completed on time and in planned volumes, then why in 452,7 in the Dnipropetrovsk region from hunger died 1933 179 people? Some kind of paradox.

Fish

To provide the USSR with fish in 1932, four republican trusts were organized in the Azov-Black Sea basin: Crimean, Azov-Black Sea, Azov-Donetsk and Ukrainian-Black Sea. At that time they were very well equipped. So, for example, only the Ukrainian-Black Sea Trust had, in addition to hundreds of sailing and sailing-rowing, 415 motor vessels (including 350 in the mining navy and 65 - in the service). 9893 people worked in various divisions of the trust (as of 01.01.1933/34/18). And in the Ukrainian newspaper “The Voice of the Fisherman” No. 1932 dated May 8, 7, there was data on how much money the fishermen received for a centner of fish caught (in rubles): herring - 7, roach - 40, large piece - 300, red fish - 25 , caviar - 30. For comparison: even the fishermen of developed Italy in terms of the Soviet currency were content with 1932% lesser fees. At the same time, in XNUMX all fishing products remained in Ukraine. The Ukrainian People’s Commissariat of Supply forbade Ukrrybsbyt to conclude an agreement with Glavryba, citing the fact that Ukrrybtrest is republican and therefore everything caught should be distributed according to the orders of Ukrnrybsnab. And the Soviet center did not object to this state of affairs. Let them eat all the fish themselves, if only everything is safe in the republic. After all, this is our western outpost.

According to the surviving reports of Ukrrybtrest, in 1932 and 1933 years in Ukraine 4336,6 thousand centners, or more than 433 thousand tons of fish were caught. It was processed in artels and collective farms and delivered both fresh and frozen, and smoked, salted and canned. For example, the Azov-Donets Fish Trust in 1933 released 5285 thousand standard cans of canned fish. At the Trestovsky warehouses in Mariupol on 1 in January 1933 of the year (just during the hungry winter), due to interruptions in transport, 1336 centners were not exported, and on 01.01.1934 - 1902 centners of finished products. Moreover, from Donetsk, in which people were starving, to a warehouse a little more than 100 km. How can this be understood ?!

Yevgeny Shvedko, who at that time worked as chairman of the village council of the town of Bezymyanny, said: “... And in the 30s, the fish had nowhere to go. One gang of Nameless for the year 1933 handed over to the state almost 1000 pounds of valuable sturgeon - 16 tons. Each sturgeon went under the 2 meter, and the beluga and even more. Unless the dying men could lift such a catch from the sea, and, having raised, die from hunger? Understand, no one denies the tragedy of famine. But why lie and fake? Why, for example, the family from our village, burned down in a hut, and all our fishermen who died at sea, were recorded in the “famine” victims? .. This is a lie! ”

How is it “And in the 30-ies the fish had nowhere to go,” when the starving Donetsk region was nearby? From Donetsk to the coast of the Azov Sea, just 114 km. It turns out that the fish did not deliberately carried? Moreover, coal was delivered to the seaports by rail, and in order to take the fish in reverse, there were not enough wagons? Fantastic, isn't it? It is worth recalling that in the Donetsk region in the same year 1933 died 119 thousand people.

The Soviet government sought to provide the Ukrainian population even with delicious seafood. The meeting at the November Glavryba 17 of the year 1932 of the year made the following decision: “... 2. Ukrainian and Crimean rybtrestam immediately deploy production and processing of secondary seafood, to allocate the required number of floating units for the production of fishing ... 4. Trusts through fish canning plants to start the production of experiments on the preservation of oysters and mussels ... 6. Ukrrybtrestu simultaneously with the extraction of edible mollusks deploy in the area of ​​Odessa-Skaddov shrimp and sea grass. 7. The trusts named above will work out the question of using oyster and mussel valves, as well as small shrimps for feeding meal ... ”

In addition, Chernomorsverprom worked in Ukraine, which was engaged in catching a dolphin, a prickly shark (katran), a beluga, and sturgeon. In the 1932, they produced 56 163 dolphins, and in the 1933, 52 885. Of these, the Sevastopol Salotope Plant produced technical and medical fat, which, by the way, was supplied to the pharmacy network of Ukraine. For example, 1040 kg of fish oil was supplied to Vinnitsa, and 424 kg was supplied to pharmacies in Kherson. In total, Chernomorsverprom caught 1932 in the 2003 year, tons, and in the 1933-m - 2249,5 tons of fish and freezers. There was also industrial fishing in the areas of “small” fisheries (ponds, lakes, rivers), which in Ukraine amounted to 1932 23 770 tons in Ukraine and 1933 20 tons of fish in 100. And all this nutritious products remained in the republic, and in some cases even deliveries of fish from other regions were organized. Here is an interesting decision of the Politburo of the Central Committee of the CPSU (b): “p. 82 / 69 from 8 in May 1933. - “On the release of fish for Ukraine and CCHO. “Offer Narkomsnab to release 1500 tons of fish in the second quarter for collective farmers working on weeding, digging and chopping beets, of which 1200 tons of Ukraine and 300 tons of CCOs”.

Deliveries from the Center

For those who are particularly curious, I will immediately point out the way: The special folders of the Politburo, which reflect the entire course of deliveries to Ukraine, are located at RGASPI, 17, 162 inventory, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 storage units.

The volume of grain crops delivered from the Center at the expense of famine regions and territories of the USSR to Ukraine only from March 19 1932 to July 4 1933, is more than 1 million tons. Including: for 497,98 seeds (including 64,7 thousand tons for fodder) and for food 541,64 thousand tons. This is not counting food, machinery and fodder, the supply of which was regulated by special orders of the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR. It is interesting to analyze the data and budget projections of those times. The revenue part of the budget of Ukraine in 1933 amounted to 1033,4 million rubles while spending in 1021,5 million. Unlike all previous and subsequent years, in 1933, Ukraine did not transfer a penny to the all-union budget, and the subsidy to the republic from the all-union budget was 21,1 million rubles.

For comparison: Belarus transferred 1933 million rubles to the country's budget in 0,3 for the year. The area under crops in Belarus for grain crops in 1933 was occupied by 2,48 million hectares, in Ukraine - by 19,86. The tractor fleet of the BSSR on 01.01.1934 was 3,2 thousand units, in Ukraine - 51,3 thousand units. When the sown area was eight times smaller than in Ukraine, the number of tractors was less in 16 times, that is, twice the large areas were treated with a horse plow. But the money in the general budget transferred regularly.

The conclusion is unequivocal: such a quantity of grain that was collected in the Ukrainian SSR, even considering the cattle, sheep, goats and pigs sent from the Center, is enough to adequately feed the population of Ukraine in 1932-33. Where did this hunger come from? I want to add: Hello! Garage!

Working with the archives of the original documents of the Stalin era, I was dragged out like in my childhood playing DOOM 2. I wanted to dig further and deeper. There were such "tasty", impregnated with a piece of the soul of the author, circulars, that I would, if it were my will, bring them all in the article. Here is one of those. “No. 231-28ss by 17.VI.1933. I ask the Politburo to approve the decision of the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR on leave from the reserve fund of the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR Council of People's Commissars of the USSR 7 mil. rubles for the costs of maintaining childcare facilities in 1933 in connection with the need to expand their network. V. Molotov. "Behind". Stalin, Kaganovich, Andreev, Kuibyshev, Ordzhonikidze, Voroshilov. Wow: expanding the network of expensive childcare facilities during the period of total hunger! By the way, the number of school students who were provided with food and adequate living conditions by the state during the most hungry times (1932-33 years) in Ukraine increased by 1 096 141 people. And this, as we understand, is not due to population growth. That is, the socio-economic situation of Ukrainian children improved during this period. Also at the expense of the Center.

Another interesting fact: it turns out that in Ukraine there was a large and extensive network of resorts in 1932 and 1933. It was funny to read reports and testimonies of people about it. Here, for example, - "a report on the state of the resorts in 1933 year and the prospects for the development of the industry in the second five-year period." In 1933, the number of bed-months was 80 387, the number in fact: sanatorium patients - 66 979 people and attached “by quask” - 12 373 people. From the report: "... A significant failure to comply with the decision of the Council of People's Commissars was due to the fact that the collective farm organizations, despite a number of requirements of Ukrkuhrupr and other organizations, did not master the courtesy allocated to them." Although the budget expenditures on sanatoriums in 1933 amounted to 20,258 million rubles, including food for 10,275 million. Sorry, but this is some kind of nonsense: the republic is suffocating from mass starvation, in Kiev, 1933 thousand corpses are picked up in 9, and 10% (almost 7 thousand) of resort places already paid (and, respectively, provided with food) by the state are not mastered!

Mortality in the USSR

According to the declassified data of the Central Economic Committee of the USSR State Planning Committee, compiled on the basis of the UNHU Ukrainian SSR certificates, the decline in the population of Ukraine in 1932 from all causes (including death before the age of 1, old age and external causes, including hunger) amounted to 668,2 thousand. . In 1933-m - 1850,3 thousand people. And the average mortality in the period from 1927 to 1937 year (without 1932 and 1933) with an average population of 31,9 million was 456,6 thousand. Compare: in Ukraine, 2005 thousand died of all causes in the safe 782 year with population 47,1 million people. The numbers are quite comparable.

Number of cases of life-threatening infectious diseases in the country in 1933 year (in thousands) amounted to: typhoid - 50,4, typhus - 65,6, measles - 89, whooping cough - 46,8, dysentery - 30,5, diphtheria - 21,1, malaria - 767,2. In total, 1082 thousand people suffered from these diseases. According to the Ministry of Health of the Ukrainian SSR, mortality from contagious diseases accounted for 25,6% of total mortality, or 250,1 thousand. Let me give you an excerpt from a memorandum from the Dnepropetrovsk regional department of the GPU from 5 March 1933 to the chairman of the GPU of the Ukrainian SSR Balitsky: “In the Novovasilije district, high mortality is largely attributable to mass diseases of tropical malaria, which has assumed the nature of a massive epidemic with a large number of deaths.” It should be noted that after the revolution, an economic blockade was declared in our country and among the goods prohibited for delivery was quinine, which was treated for malaria. Soviet health care throughout the Union was free, and public health services were among the highest in Europe (even in those difficult times), but the health care system could not physically respond so quickly to the sudden epidemic of malaria that affected most regions of the USSR.

In books, movies and TV shows one can often find the statement that people were held in their places of permanent residence. Not a single original document has confirmed this fact. In 1931, 21 million people arrived in 1,212 in the USSR, 1932 in 18 cities - 962,5 thousand, in 1933 in 21 city - 790,3 thousand, in 1934 in 71 city - 2,676 million. There were many visitors from Russia. For example, in Zaporozhye in search of food came refugees from the Volga region, where there was the most severe crop failure.

About representativeness of data

In cities and villages, all acts of civil status (birth, death, marriage, divorce) were registered in civil registry offices. In the villages, village councils performed their functions.

An example of their conscientious work is the presence of very detailed figures on marriages concluded in the most hungry, 1933 year. This information is presented not only for each region of Ukraine, but also for each quarter and month separately by cities and villages. In total, 1933 229 was contracted in the Ukrainian SSR in 571, of which 70 799 was in the cities of 158 and 772 in the villages of 629. Once we started talking about weddings, we will ask only one question: “Did they manage without a traditional crowded feast?” Every day, on average, 194 marriages were registered in settlements of Ukraine. Of these, 435 weddings walked in cities, and more than twice as many in the countryside - XNUMX weddings per day. How can this knowledge be combined with information about widespread hunger?

These data, the same as for mortality, UNHU of Ukraine received from the same inspectors and sent to the Center, and there is no reason not to believe them.

Cheating Moscow

In November, 1933, the Ukrainian party leaders reported to Moscow about the unprecedented success of republican agriculture.

"The Central Committee of the CPSU (b) - Comrade. Stalin, Comrade. Kaganovich, SNK USSR - Comrade. Molotov

... the Ukrainian party organization ... ahead of schedule and in full by 6 in November, she completed blessing for all cultures and all sectors. In this victory, the tremendous assistance that the Central Committee of the CPSU (b) and the Council of People's Commissars of the Union played to the collective farms and individual farmers of Ukraine in the spring of 1933, with seeds, food and fodder, as well as a huge number of tractors, cars, combines and other agricultural machines. This victory was the result of the Bolshevik struggle of the Ukrainian party organization ... for the implementation in practice of the decision of the Central Committee of the CPSU (b) - to withdraw Ukraine’s agriculture from a breakthrough state to the leading positions. Kosior, Postyshev, Chubar ".

Such vigorous reports sounded against the background of unprecedented mortality in the republic. And in order to confuse the traces, the entire Ukrainian party organization 1932 and 1933 years was engaged in endless reorganizations of the administrative division of the republic. In 1932, 41 district was divided into 492 districts, which were subordinated directly to the republic’s leadership (what ailing brain could figure this out!), Then, in the very famine, in 1933 districts, eight areas were collected. And in order to make absolutely nothing at all in matters it was impossible, it was during the most cruel famine in 1933 that the transfer of the capital of Ukraine from Kharkov to Kiev began. From the speech at the XVII Congress of S. Kosior: “Comrade Stalin, then, before liquidating the districts, we were warned that we could not cope with the management of such a large number of regions as in Ukraine, and that it would not be better to create regions in Ukraine. We then essentially dissuaded from this proposal of Comrade Stalin, assured the Central Committee of the CPSU (b) that we ourselves - the Central Committee of the Communist Party (b) U - would manage to cope with the leadership of the districts without regions, and this caused a great deal of harm to the cause ... ”

Theft and sabotage

Here I will not argue and give assessments, but simply give a few documents without comments.

“Resolution No. XXUMX of the bureau of the Soviet control commission“ On illegal spending and squandering of funds by the NKJust USSR ”

The Soviet Control Commission found that the People’s Commissariat of Justice and the Prosecutor’s Office of the Ukrainian SSR, represented by their responsible employees, illegally spent, squandered and used 1933 to April 1934 from March to April 1202 ... ”For comparison, this is four (!) times more funds transferred by the Byelorussian SSR to the All-Union budget in 1933 year.

From the minutes of the Joint Meeting of the Presidium of the Central Control Commission of the CPSU (b) and the Collegium of the NC RCT of the USSR: “15Л / 1-33. About squandering products and raw materials in the confectionery factory named. Karl Marx in Kiev. The Presidium of the Central Control Commission of the VKP (b) and the Collegium of the NC RCT of the USSR note that the management of the confectionery factory named after Karl Marx ... for 1932 and 1933, she made massive waste of finished products (in 1932, 300 thousands of pounds of confectionery products to 20 million rubles) ... "


“From a memorandum of the Economic Directorate of the GPU of the Ukrainian SSR to the Secretary of the Communist Party Central Committee (b) Kosioru from 10 December 1932

... In Odessa region. 264 mills that secretly grind. According to one Dnipropetrovsk region. 29 secret mills have been discovered and approved for use without the permission of the 346 Mills Logging Committee. In Vinnitsa region 38 secret mills that secretly grind grain were discovered ... Only in the indicated areas, the GPU bodies detected only 20 secret mills in 750 days only. ”
Note that it is in these regions that the highest mortality was observed. In them, hunger and disease in 1933 killed 1,086 million people.

Note I.V. Stalin to the Secretary General of the Central Committee of the Communist Party (B) of Ukraine S. Kosioru:

"T. Kosior! 26 / IV 32

Be sure to read the attached materials. Judging by the materials, it seems that in some points of the Ukrainian SSR Soviet power has ceased to exist. Is this really true? Is it really that bad dealing with a village in Ukraine? Where are the organs of the GPU, what do they do? Maybe they would check this case and inform the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Russia about the measures taken?

Hey. I. Stalin "


In my research I was not able to draw an unambiguous conclusion about where all this huge amount of food went. This will be the subject of a separate laborious work. But absolutely all the documentary materials - Ukrainian, Moscow, German, international - show that the Soviet government paid the closest attention to the food well-being of Ukraine and did everything possible (sometimes even impossible) to prevent hunger in this republic. We only note that after conducting a thorough investigation in 1935-39, in which hundreds of leading investigators and criminologists participated, those responsible for the massive theft and the organization of an artificial famine in the Republic of Ukraine were found and their guilt was proven. In 1939, General Secretary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party (B) U 1928-38 S.V. Kosior, as well as the chairman of the Council of People's Commissars of the Ukrainian SSR in 1923-34 V.Ya. Chubar were convicted and executed by a court sentence.
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  1. Mikhail m
    Mikhail m April 10 2015 06: 41 New
    +3
    In my research, I was not able to make an unambiguous conclusion about where such a huge amount of food had all the same gone.

    and in Ukraine already in July 1933, grain deliveries were completed by 87%, and in August - by 194,8%

    This is where the grain went. For the sake of beautiful reports, they raked out all the grain, hence the famine.
    1. Mahmut
      Mahmut April 10 2015 07: 58 New
      -19
      And what is the sensation. If you have not complied with quotas for the export of grain, then no one is to blame? Since the republic is hungry on such a scale, what kind of grain export could be discussed at all. Again links to crop failure. He mentioned the signed contract with Persia for the supply of grain. And the fact that the Persians tore this contract under pressure from the British specifically forgot to mention. Grain and wood was indeed the only product paid to foreigners for engineering and technical assistance. Because the golden blockade acted. Or the golden blockade is also a myth. And why industrialization in the country could not be carried out on their own. Is it because their scientists and engineers were shot as a class alien element in the 17-20s. And the remains were sent on ships for the cordon. And who did this, if not the Bolsheviks.
      1. sdv68
        sdv68 April 10 2015 11: 48 New
        +10
        Quote: Mahmut
        Grain and wood was indeed the only product paid to foreigners for engineering and technical assistance. Because the golden blockade acted.
        It is the "golden blockade", and those who arranged it are indirectly guilty of the famine of 32-33. Although not in everything. The famine was incl. and in countries not affected by STs, for example in Poland.


        Quote: Mahmut
        And why industrialization in the country could not be carried out on their own.
        I can remind you that Russia is the only country participating in the WWII that did not have its own tanks. And in aviation, so even at the beginning of the WWI, Ilya Muromets was not a very bad aircraft in its class, but during the WWII, Russia (unlike other countries) did not appear to be essentially new. Even the "Murom" mostly flew on foreign engines. So what kind of "industrialization" on their own in this case can we talk about?
        1. oldkap22
          oldkap22 April 10 2015 22: 10 New
          +2
          At that time, Russia didn’t have: tin, wire ropes, taps, dies, bearings, ... engines
          bin ... and for all this a terrible price had to be paid. It’s not for nothing that T Stalin said. “Where other countries have spent hundreds of years on industrialization, history has given us 20 years ...
      2. EvilLion
        EvilLion April 10 2015 12: 41 New
        -9
        Do not understand a damn thing, remove your hands from the keyboard.
      3. midshipman
        midshipman April 10 2015 14: 28 New
        +4
        In the same 30s in America, all the people ate from the belly? And despite the fact that the grain was like shoe polish in a factory
      4. Will
        Will April 10 2015 18: 33 New
        +1
        And why, with all these Bolsheviks taking such vicious approaches, did 1933 come after 1945? Think about it.
        1. Mahmut
          Mahmut April 12 2015 05: 56 New
          0
          Before 1945 came, it was 1941. And now you think.
      5. Scraptor
        Scraptor April 15 2015 04: 23 New
        0
        Messrs. Trotskyists, whom Stalin gradually transferred from 1925 to 1938, did this. At this time, they continued to torment the country, especially the Great Russians and Ukrainians, as an ethnically state-forming element.
    2. ivan.ru
      ivan.ru April 10 2015 08: 45 New
      +7
      where is it raked if it is all left in Ukraine?
      1. Mahmut
        Mahmut April 12 2015 05: 53 New
        0
        It is now veterans of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union all their shoals on a poor harvest write off. And before the collective farm was given a plan. And try not to do it. Go directly to the competent authorities for a friendly conversation. And prove that you are not an enemy of the people. Excuses like drought did not roll. The fact that under such conditions the people tried to survive and hide part of the grain is quite natural and cannot serve as an excuse, like they themselves stole the grain and died of starvation from this.
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 09: 52 New
      +25
      Mikhail m
      They wrote a beautiful report, but where did they divide the grain?
      “This is where the grain disappeared. For the sake of beautiful reports, all the grain was raked out, hence the famine.” - WHERE did it go?
      If that same grain was shoveled somewhere, then it was stored somewhere, sent somewhere? Or rotted? And as a result, artificial hunger.
      Judging by the data presented, such an amount of food as was enough to feed everyone, the notes apparently set the task of the South of Russia, Ukraine, should have blown up by the fire of another war, everything strictly fits into the subsequent events, when the trotting gang was cut off their heads along with the rest causals, and now, the descendants of the Trotsky’s, howl in every way, saying that Stalin is a tyrant and the power is bad ..
      1. EvilLion
        EvilLion April 10 2015 12: 45 New
        +7
        And it is practically artificial, after which anti-Soviet elements of all types began to be cleaned away without further ado. Some of them were stolen, some were rotten, they didn’t plow something at all, because before that they had driven draft cattle so that they would not be handed over to the collective farm. By the way, in 35 they also started to plant for this matter.
        1. Will
          Will April 10 2015 18: 38 New
          +3
          I agree that everything is created by man "artificially" and hunger and "paradise." It is only art that diverges in applications to oneself and to others. Type - a paradise for yourself, hunger for others. It is unfortunate that this is so far more likely to succeed than not, and with any state devices. Conclusion - until we change the quotient, the general change will not work.
      2. dmb
        dmb April 10 2015 13: 04 New
        +2
        Dear Vlad. But it doesn’t seem to you that partly your comments are similar to the “howl of the descendants of the Trotskyites,” and that sometimes subjectivity in assessments is very similar to the speeches of the same Starikov and Fedorov. I absolutely share your beliefs about the inevitability of a return to socialism, but I absolutely do not accept the deification of any leader. And you look like sun-Stalin spots do not see. This, in my opinion, does much more harm to the cause of socialism than the primitive writings of the same Starikov. He is usually refuted by the authorities themselves with their actions.
        1. vladkavkaz
          vladkavkaz April 10 2015 16: 12 New
          +6
          dmb
          Show me where I look like a Trotsky herd, howling its crackling and so useless slogans? What is my subjectivity? And what is expressed by "deification"?
          There are shortcomings of Stalin, but if we take the scales of History, then his shortcomings, even in the worst case, will be balanced by the DIGNITY of the CASE done, which is not mentioned, for Trotsky and his fans.
          Famine in UKRAINE, the southern regions of Russia, partly Kazakhstan, in addition to natural conditions, is a political way to provoke indignation among the people = THIS WAS TROTSKIST.
          And if Stalin managed to drive this whole gang of rat-rats to drive where he drove, then he did everything right. Before the eyes of CHINA, they carefully study the history of the USSR and do not lose a single word with thieves of all stripes, in whatever ranks and ranks they are consisted. Socialism in CHINA? YES, with its own specifics.
          And they took a lot, a lot from Stalin, but immediately saw through the Trotsky corn destroyer ..
          1. dmb
            dmb April 10 2015 20: 43 New
            0
            In my opinion, this your comment directly confirms what I said. The author has carefully rummaged in the archives and studied a lot of genuine documents, however, directly indicates that he does not have
      3. andrew42
        andrew42 April 10 2015 16: 54 New
        +6
        I agree. All this artificial hunger suggests that in 1932-33, Stalin did not yet possess all the full power in the CPSU (B), and in the CP (b) U apparently did not possess at all. Despite the fact that the famine was not only in Ukraine, there is a terrible fuss inside the CPSU (B) as a unified system of governing the country, in which some internal party clans contributed to purely sabotage and sabotage actions, while others often took inappropriate measures in the form of a law on x spikelets (the fire was extinguished with gasoline).
        1. MrK
          MrK April 10 2015 22: 07 New
          +2
          In fairness, let’s say that the law “On Three (Five) Spikelets” did not discuss spikelets at all. And it was a question of mass thefts in transport and on collective farms. And these spikelets were taken away at a time, sometimes up to ten carts. The fact that excesses occurred on the ground, and often with the help of this and other laws, settled scores with objectionable ones - a characteristic feature of Russia. No matter how good the laws would be, they will be applied for personal selfish purposes, which can be seen quite often even today. And it is very doubtful that these are all innocent hungry peasants, although, undoubtedly, there were such. It only seems to me that the vast majority of those convicted under this law are different responsible comrades who are not comrades at all to us.
    5. Very smart
      Very smart April 10 2015 11: 24 New
      +4
      Quote: Michael m
      For the sake of beautiful reports raked all the grain


      UNMISSED !!!
      1. Scraptor
        Scraptor April 15 2015 04: 42 New
        0
        Then they began to shoot those who raked grain - in 1937
    6. Nina Czerny
      Nina Czerny April 10 2015 15: 54 New
      +5
      The mystery of the so-called The "famine" in Ukraine was that the bodies of the dead did not resemble people who died of starvation. Therefore, a commission of specialists = doctors from Moscow was even sent to establish the causes of mass deaths.
    7. Will
      Will April 10 2015 18: 28 New
      +2
      As in modern Ukraine, everything comes from its own bad “head,” while wine is sought somewhere on the side ...
    8. Scraptor
      Scraptor April 15 2015 04: 07 New
      0
      Not from here, but just so that he was! The population of the robbed villages, on pain of death, was forbidden to leave them in search of food.
      De-Slavization is again in its last 100 years (with a short break in 1937-1953) ... When softer, when harder. Try being an ethnic Russian just like that, even go to Canada to work, and from the south to Moscow and other large cities let everyone, but not Russians from the Russian backwoods. Pale-faced Indians are ...
  2. tianna
    tianna April 10 2015 07: 12 New
    +14
    Stole with their own citizens, bringing to a famine a large part of the population? This is the scope! Verily, there are no equal Ukraine, it is not in vain that these two words are so consonant ... And modern rulers of the last decades are worthy of their predecessors.
  3. 34 region
    34 region April 10 2015 07: 14 New
    +17
    No matter how much Russia helps the outskirts, everything is bad. For the sake of the outskirts, grain export was hindered, and state reserves were erased. We sell gas for cheap. All are bad. And how much territory they slaughtered! There are no words. Insolent red faces.
    1. Karbofost
      Karbofost April 10 2015 10: 06 New
      +4
      Yes, not red, but arrogant, dirty, fat smeared hari. Dirty hands grabbing everything and everything "to sebe." So that everything in his pants sagged. The impudent nation of beggars and envious. am
  4. parusnik
    parusnik April 10 2015 07: 44 New
    +13
    Theft and sabotage If anyone read Sholokhov’s "Virgin Soil Upturned", there is such an episode there, the farmers massively slaughtered draft cattle-bulls, oxen, which they plow .. And what is typical, such a slaughter of draft cattle took place throughout Chernozem-Ukraine, Don, Kuban .. .About this, Gorbatov writes in his memoirs ... There is nothing to plow, and nothing to plow, respectively ..
    1. EvilLion
      EvilLion April 10 2015 12: 46 New
      +6
      The issue is well covered in the article by Yuri Mukhin, “Whooping Starvation”. Although it was not just a slaughter.
  5. Sensey
    Sensey April 10 2015 08: 58 New
    +7
    Yes, everything is clear, more than 90% of the grain was infected with ergot in this former republic, and without proper storage conditions, when everything was buried in the hiding places in the ground, it was impossible to detect the infected grain, well, the infection spread further. Well, in the former republic, the same thing happened in medieval Europe. (Even then they managed to become familiar with European values;) http://lurkmore.to/%D0%90%D0%B1%D1%81%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%82%D0%B8%D1%81
  6. fomkin
    fomkin April 10 2015 09: 02 New
    +3
    We need the second consecutive article about major experts to compose myths, dill almost on equal terms with the Jews.
  7. Humpty
    Humpty April 10 2015 09: 15 New
    +10
    Instead of sorting out the real causes of the deaths during the famine of 32-33, Svidomo nationals concerned in two new countries turned the Holodomor into a state brand.
    A brand involves selling at an overpriced price.
  8. Leader
    Leader April 10 2015 09: 16 New
    -11
    The myth that most modern people blindly believe and is even voiced by many politicians is ...
    For those especially curious, I’ll immediately point out the way: Special folders of the Politburo ...

    Yeah, like that, I went in and looked ... How long has this opportunity appeared?
    Show the newspaper where all this data is printed.
    The Soviet and Russian authorities did everything so that the people (population of the country) were not penniless any "official data", even when they were.
    The secretion of everything and everything, and the direct deception of people led to the fact that most of the negative information was transmitted orally, overgrown with "details and details."
    It’s them, “in the West”, planes fell, ships sank, crime grew ... - but our plans were exceeded, crime self-destructed, and all our bosses were completely holy.
    This is how persistent myths are born that you will not get through with any arguments.
    And Russia continues this disastrous path:
    - Gorbachev: “there will be no monetary reform”;
    - Yeltsin: "There will be no devaluation";
    - Medvedev: "There will be no price increase."
    I still do not believe in newspapers or television.
    The country is ruled by thieves and scoundrels.

    And your data does not refute anything. Was there a famine? - was.
    And how they arranged it - this must be studied for a long time at the "Marxist universities"!
    And optimistic papers always send upstairs ...
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 10: 26 New
      +4
      Leader
      Why bother such a loud cry, where everything and everything, including an attempt to pull a fur skin on a mushroom, mixed up in a heap to make a hedgehog?
      The author answered the question.
      The hunger was, yes, an artificial hunger, yes, who provoked the famine-37 gave an answer, who lost their heads there, for what they were doing.
    2. sdv68
      sdv68 April 10 2015 10: 47 New
      +12
      Quote: Leader
      And how they arranged it - this must be studied for a long time at the "Marxist universities"!


      And in what "Marxist universities" did Pilsudski and Co. study, who organized a similar famine in what was then Poland.

    3. mervino2007
      mervino2007 April 10 2015 17: 46 New
      +3
      Quote: Leader
      Was there a famine? - was.

      There was something, and the main reasons were understandable - the slaughter of draft cattle, the Trotskyists also made a fuss about the damage to bread during storage. And the statistics experienced the apotheosis of lies, hence the concept of SCRIPTURES? It can also be assumed that a significant portion of the dead did not die of hunger, but from infectious diseases, such as the "Spanish". The article is sensible, the author needs to dig further. According to the data he cited, there should not have been a big famine. Although the doubling of the deaths in 1933 requires detail.
  9. press officer
    press officer April 10 2015 10: 04 New
    +5
    mdaaaaa ...... wonderful country 404 ..... wassat it’s not in vain that they say that Ukrainians have always been and will remain so! The only bad thing is that they have already fallen to the Nazis .... and that they always bring down all their hemorrhoids on us ... what But in due time they fattened, and we had a deficit ... recourse
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 10: 28 New
      -2
      press officer
      Are you a provocateur?
      I remember the same, just shouted in Ukraine, they ate our fat, how does your speech differ from their screams?
      1. RusOdessa
        RusOdessa April 10 2015 11: 10 New
        +3
        It differs in that there is documentary evidence of this.
        And the famine in Ukraine is the result of the excessive greed and thievery of the local leadership and the holy faith of many residents in a freebie (they created collective farms and state farms — let them feed me), which is confirmed by current realities.
      2. kotvov
        kotvov April 10 2015 13: 06 New
        +2
        I remember the same, just shouted in Ukraine, they ate our fat, how does your speech differ from their cries ?,
        I don’t agree with you. The press attache writes the truth. I’m from the Rostov region, and I remember how we went to Ukraine for TVs, refrigerators, we just didn’t have them on sale. Later for sweets, the same story. I don’t say that the Ukrainians ate us, but the supply was arranged in such a way that the center, Ukraine, and the Baltic were supplied first.
        1. vladkavkaz
          vladkavkaz April 10 2015 17: 02 New
          +3
          kotvov
          Do you watch in Solovyov’s program such a small, talkative and impetuous subject who is puffed up to defend the Svidomo interpretation of historical events?
          This is one of the leaders of the RUKh of Ukraine. In the 90th cousin’s brother, now the truth is hanging around in Moscow, to see fat in Kiev is over, eyes bulging and splashing snot, they eaten fat, so I’m right when I say that I don’t have to be like these Svidomo individuals ..
  10. Dragon-y
    Dragon-y April 10 2015 11: 04 New
    +4
    I read the protocol, and the words from the old joke were recalled: "Times are different, but people are all the same! .."
  11. sdv68
    sdv68 April 10 2015 11: 09 New
    +5
    Here is a pretty good selection of documents on helping the starving - http://colonelcassad.livejournal.com/1305371.html

    Here are a few excerpts.

    From the minutes of the meeting of the bureau of the Kiev regional committee of the Communist Party (b) U. February 27, 1933

    “... To oblige all the PKK to begin the immediate elimination of foci of extreme exhaustion among collective farmers and peers on the basis of acute malnutrition, so that by March 5th to eliminate all cases of swelling and raise to their feet all who have come to complete disability from exhaustion.

    To do this:

    1) All swollen or exhausted while lying down - both children and adults - within 48 hours should be identified in specially designed and adapted rooms, arrange for them food for the period necessary to eliminate the disease state of the body, not allowing in any if you leave them at home in this condition.

    2) In affected villages, it is considered obligatory to organize hot breakfasts in schools with the attachment to schools of all preschool children who are in a state of exhaustion by organizing special nutritional centers for them.

    3) Due to the facts of acute malnutrition among collective farmers who had many workdays - due to abuse on collective farms in the distribution of the subsistence share or large families - to consider it necessary to provide assistance to such families from collective farms, and these individuals in each individual case are determined by resolution of the collective farm.

    4) To persons who were in a state of extreme exhaustion and brought into working condition, to provide work on collective farms, state farms, timber industry farms, providing them with appropriate assistance in advance.

    5) To oblige the PKK to organize special funds for these purposes.

    Offer PKK immediately inform the regional committee:

    a) the number of villages where this assistance will be organized;

    6) the number of people who need help;

    c) the availability of resources from the funds of the district and collective farms that are needed and can be allocated for these purposes ... "

    p. 44/23 of 14.V. 1933. Telegram of Comrade Postyshev.

    “To release Ukraine for fodder assistance to collective farms 1700 thousand pounds of hay from the fund of the Reserve Committee according to the following distribution by regions:

    Kiev 500 thousand pounds

    Kharkov 500 thousand pounds

    Vinnitsa 300 thousand pounds

    Dnepropetrovsk 200 thousand pounds

    Odessa 200 thousand pounds. " (unit xr. 14, l. 141).


    The rest (with links to archives) in the link above.

    PS: witness of the famine.

    1. carbofo
      carbofo April 10 2015 21: 40 New
      +1
      Judging by what he said at the end, you can well understand who organized all this.
      Yes, and the actions of some in the West regarding supplies, raise questions about the role of the West in the famine on the outskirts.
      It seems to me that chocolate with a bunny took up the same batch.
  12. sdv68
    sdv68 April 10 2015 11: 14 New
    +2
    Robert Conquest (British researcher of "Great Terror") after reading a book by Whitcroft and Davis "Years of famine. Agriculture of the USSR, 1931-1933" abandoned the idea that hunger in Ukraine was deliberately caused to exterminate the Ukrainians. - http://ria.ru/radio_programmes/20150128/1044686070.html
  13. abc_alex
    abc_alex April 10 2015 12: 02 New
    +2
    Respect to the author with respect. I hope that further research will be abandoned. By the way, in the question "where so much bread was shared" it would be worth considering the issue of the movement of managerial personnel in Ukraine from the mid-20s to 1933.
  14. e2e4
    e2e4 April 10 2015 12: 42 New
    +2
    According to the stories of my grandfathers, and in Siberia, people did not "fatten". The "surplus" grains were seized, cattle and horses were stolen into collective farms, and they also became public and implements of production (plows, etc.). My grandmother said that she could not hear the "socialized" cows mooing with hunger. More courageous people stole their breadwinners at night and took them into the forest. And how did Ukraine starve with such chernozem and such a climate ?! I still do not fully understand.
  15. EvilLion
    EvilLion April 10 2015 12: 49 New
    +2
    The "mythology of the Holodomor" by Elena Prudnikova is a must-read.

    http://www.google.ru/url?url=http://www.labirint.ru/reviews/goods/366066/&rct=j&
    q=&esrc=s&sa=U&ei=eJwnVaz0FYuOsAHP7oKgBQ&ved=0CDcQFjAL&sig2=8hkHCrPFqoEFQLTm8nCu
    Kw & usg = AFQjCNEQr1rnmZSQuSdlkhEekUhDmMZT_w
  16. ava09
    ava09 April 10 2015 13: 36 New
    +4
    The famine of 33-34 years was provoked by the Trotskyists and those who did not like the fact that the Trotskyists were removed from power, and the USSR became impossible to use as a raw material colony.
  17. Denis
    Denis April 10 2015 13: 48 New
    +3
    an extremely controversial and even scandalous topic in modern society is the tragedy in Ukraine in the 1932-33 years.
    And all the rest directly gobble up?
  18. Black
    Black April 10 2015 13: 55 New
    +2
    Quote: e2e4
    According to the stories of my grandfathers, and in Siberia, people did not "fatten".

    My roots are from the upper Don. Not that they did not live, they lived extremely poorly. They survived in the garden and on the fish.
    1. zubkoff46
      zubkoff46 April 10 2015 18: 38 New
      +1
      The Kursk region is similar (I mean the 50s and the beginning of the 60s). He grew up on fish from the Psel river, thanks to his father, he caught both in summer and winter. Plus a garden. In order for me to eat meat, my mother sent me once a week to the district center to the dining room, where they sold cutlets for three rubles each. Parents were forbidden to keep animals (except chickens) - they were teachers. They tried to achieve the goal with this ban, so that rural teachers are more engaged in self-education, get acquainted with the latest educational ideas. There was a time...
  19. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 14: 29 New
    -1
    An interesting conclusion of course. "the culprits were found ... Kosior, Chubar." On the whole, I’m not quite, or rather, the logic is completely incomprehensible. That is - how the facts presented in the article cancel the fact of what happened in 32-33 in Ukraine.
    Regarding the famine in Ukraine, I do not think that any person who is more or less interested in history has doubts about this. Actually, in short, the mechanism of the onset of hunger was as follows: 1) 1930 a record crop 2) An increase in the plan next year. 3) The refusal to implement this plan led to the requisition of the sowing stock of the peasants; 4) on November 18, 32, the peasants in Ukraine were required to give surplus grain. 5) November 20, the 32nd, meat fines were introduced against the same peasants (Ukraine). That is, if you can’t fulfill the grain quota, give it back with meat. Cattle, especially a cow, is the last reserve to prevent hunger. 6) November 28, 1932 was presented the so-called "black lists". Peasant farms that failed to fulfill the plan for the delivery of grain were subject to 15-fold fines. As a rule, such farms were surrounded by the forces of the OGPU, with the subsequent requisition. 7) On December 5, 32, Stalin introduced the head of security of Ukraine V. Balitsky. 8) December 21, 32nd, Stalin approved the annual plan for the collection of grain in Ukraine. Kaganovich goes to Ukraine to ensure the implementation of this plan. (Ukraine was supposed to make about 1/3 of the total fee for the country). Actually, the critical moment is the approval of the plan of the Central Committee of Ukraine.
    Actually 32-33 itself, this is hunger itself and an estimate of losses. Most of all during the famine in Ukraine, it was always borne by the Kharkov region. About the famine in the 20s, you can read the "Chawengur" by Andrei Platonov. This may not be documentary work, but still.
    A considerable contribution to the level of losses was made by the passport system, namely the absence of such among the peasants.
    Cannibalism ... the taboo is a topic of course, but hunger has dehumanized. About 2500 officially registered cases 32-33. I am sure the number is much larger. I must admit that the nature of the occurrence of hunger and the process in Ukraine differs little from that described in the book http://www.amazon.com/Tombstone-Great-Chinese-Famine-1958-1962/dp/0374533997 (famine in China) I must say right away that I don’t see any sense in the lies of the author of this book; he, as a result of the described events, lost his father. Let's go back to the losses ... There is an estimate carried out through the census of the 37th, which found a decrease, or rather, a difference from the planned figures of 8 million. These are certainly not direct losses from starvation, lacking, let’s say, factors. 5,5 million total losses as a result of the events described are considered an overestimated figure, 2,2 underestimated. The closest to the truth is the figure of 3.3 million.
    Something like this .. My great-grandfather, from the Kherson region Chaplinsky borough, Chaplinka., Fought, was awarded the Order of Glory (KonigsbergG). So, despite the fact that the Kherson region passed this period relatively calmly, it still had to endure a lot to save 2 daughters. I myself studied at the institute bearing the name of the person described in the article (Chubar). I read later about the decision-making at the level of the Ukrainian Central Committee at that time ... there were not enough courageous, but they were not enough.
  20. SlavaP
    SlavaP April 10 2015 15: 04 New
    +1
    In those years, hunger was not only in Ukraine. In particular, in the Kuban. My grandmother (18-19 years then) was saved only by recruiting in Plavstroy - to drain the floodplains of the lower Kuban. Knee-deep in water and completely encircled by mosquitoes manually toss tons of Kuban chernozem. But - they gave rations there ...
  21. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 15: 09 New
    -1
    Actually, the whole fuss around hunger in Ukraine is not about hunger as such, but around the fact that Ukraine is seeking recognition of these events as "genocide". There are problems here ... problems of a more semantic nature. That is, Ukraine does not fall under the definition of genocide introduced by Lemkin at the UN. The main reason is the "fist" as a class. That is, the destruction of the "fist" as a class will be considered in a political context. Although, as such, the concept of "fist" does not exist.
  22. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 15: 42 New
    -5
    15.38 RBC has just said that “the economy of victory” was talking about the famine of 45-46: losses of 2 million. What in general is necessary for readers to know: 3 famines 25-26 / 32-33 / 45-46. After this, articles appear about the greatness of Stalin or about the absence of hunger as such.
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 17: 06 New
      +2
      Willywonka
      More often listen and read all this dregs in RBC, Echo of Moscow and other Rains, against which, they stimulate UD ..
      «09.02.2015.

      To the head of the Federal Agency for Press and Mass Media M.V. Seslavinsky.

      Dear Mikhail Vladimirovich!

      On December 22, 2014, the Main Investigation Department of the Investigative Committee of the Russian Federation opened a criminal case against Markvo A.V., Mylnikova A.V. And other unidentified persons on the grounds of crimes provided for by part 4 of page 159, part 3 of article 159 of the Criminal Code, on the theft of budget funds.

      Given the above, guided by Article. 21,38 of the Code of Criminal Procedure of the Russian Federation, I ask you to provide us with certified copies of substantial reports, payment orders, acts of acceptance of work performed and expert opinions on State contracts No. 69-14 / 15 of July 29.07.2014, 118 (“Organization and holding of the All-Russian Book Trailer Competition” ) and No. 14-15 / 21.10.2014 of XNUMX ("Organization and conduct of a series of events as part of the Russian Book Salon in Paris").

      In addition, I ask you to provide information on whether any funding was provided by the Federal Agency for Press and Mass Communications, from 2010 to the present, of the following media: Moskovsky Komsomolets newspaper; Newspaper Newspaper TV channel "Rain"; radio station "Echo of Moscow"; RBC Information Agency; daily analytical newspaper “RBC daily”; Internet site "Slon.ru" (LLC Elephant); Snob Magazine (Snob Media LLC); Big City website.

      If the answer is yes, please inform me on the basis of which documents the payments were made, when and in what amount.

      Taking into account the social significance of this criminal case, I ask you to provide the executed materials on purpose to the Main Investigation Department at the following address: Moscow, Technical Lane, 2.
    2. MrK
      MrK April 10 2015 22: 34 New
      +2
      In the nineteenth century, Russia experienced 40 periods of famine. In the XX century were hungry: 1901-1902 gg., 1905; 1906; 1907; 1908 g .; 1911-1912 years. In the 1901-1902 years, the 49 provinces were starving, in the 1905; 1906; 1907; 1908 starved from 19 to 29 provinces, in 1911-1912 years. for two years, the famine swept 60 provinces. 48 million people were on the brink of death. So, for example, in a memorandum addressed to Alexander the Third, dated 1882 year, the following was said: "Only from a loss, losses amounted to two million Orthodox souls."
      From a report to Nicholas II in 1901: “In the winter of 1900-1901. 42 million people were starving, of which 3 million 813 thousand Orthodox souls died. ”
      From the report of Stolypin to Nicholas II in the 1911 year: "Starved 32 million, loss of 3 million 235 thousand people." Modestly, as about something ordinary.
      According to various estimates in 1901-1912 years. more than 12 million people died from hunger and its consequences. There, Stalin is to blame. Question: After the 1946 year, there was a famine in the USSR.
  23. Ricard
    Ricard April 10 2015 16: 46 New
    -5
    My grandmother was an eyewitness to the whole family and the villagers, so your articles will never refute the fact that people were starving to the whole villages, and my great-grandfather, in particular the head of the collective farm, was imprisoned for allowing the widows to collect spikelets from the harvested field, so that the children did not die, all food was confiscated and sent by trains, people died in the hundreds. These crimes will never be forgotten despite mishandled "debunkers."
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 17: 08 New
      +2
      Ricard
      Variations of myths, change your grandfather, grandmother, sister-in-law, or someone somewhere or something, as he said ... They planted, then for three, then for five, then he stole the cow, or the chairman killed ... generally innocent ..
    2. sdv68
      sdv68 April 10 2015 18: 54 New
      +3
      This story about spikelets from the field and the predecessor who allowed them to be collected I have heard many times. That's just all its diversity makes one doubt its authenticity. But my grandfather’s friend actually planted me under the “3-spikelet law”. So a friend while his grandfather was still alive and wondered at him hastily needed to steal the spikelets in order to get a deadline. On this question, the grandfather laughed and said that he had stole 7 a cart with bread from his native collective farm. And just in the famine of 5-32 years. These were actually 33 spikelets (carts) and the real term for them. They did not shoot him just because he had returned everything. But I got the deadline.
      1. Wii
        Wii April 10 2015 22: 15 New
        0
        For 5 spikelets of children planted ....
        1. vladkavkaz
          vladkavkaz April 10 2015 22: 31 New
          0
          Three spikelets you say ...
          “It was in Vorkuta in 1947. Two 17-year-old boys got 3 years each. One got from 15 kg of young potatoes, and at home they found another 90 kg. The second - from 8 kg of spikelets, but it turned out to be at home 40 kg Both were hunted, of course, on uncleaned fields, and such a theft was stolen in Africa as well. The collection of residues from harvested fields was never considered theft anywhere in the world, and Solzhenitsyn lied here to kick the Soviet regime once again. .. "
          http://maxpark.com/community/1920/content/3404617
  24. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 17: 20 New
    0
    to VladKavkaz, you know that, my good young friend, I have no complaints about RBC. By the way, they are doing their job well, I mean business research. Regarding RBC TV, a good product. An example of good journalism is I mean the CNN style. Only news, I’ll make a conclusion myself + a platform for different parties. Echo of Moscow makes a magnificent magazine - "Amateur". In addition, I am interested in Venediktov as a historian, many of the books that I bought from Venediktov on Instagram through alib.ru
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 17: 48 New
      +3
      Willywonka
      Benedict historian ???
      Can you write what great truths in history "discovered, described) wrote the Benedictes, and who reviewed the works of the" outstanding "tantrum in the field of feeding yellow ducks?
      Glavred Snob ?? This is a value?
      Not, of course, an infanteriblle of a liberally preoccupied public, who does not have the slightest knowledge of the history of his country, but bravely banging his teeth and moving his lips in areas very far from the level of his undoubtedly “brilliant” intellect.
      Well, however, if according to Dilettant and Snob, you are studying something, then yes, you are undoubtedly a talent highly appreciated in VO.
  25. Goblin 28
    Goblin 28 April 10 2015 17: 48 New
    +4
    My father was born in one of the Ukrainian villages in 27 year. Still alive. So, when under Yushchenko a sign was hung up in the village council in memory of the victims of the famine, then grandfathers gathered around his age, asking each other - Do you remember the famine? No and you? - Me neither! - safely brought down this tablet - with the full consent of the remaining villagers! They remembered a lot in the village - how they dispossessed, how property was taken to the collective farm, about the war, about the Germans, about the post-war famine, but they never talked about 33 for a year! And the current mood in the village cannot be called pro-Ukrainian!
  26. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 18: 32 New
    0
    to VladKavkaz on the basis of which you conclude that a criminal case has been instituted against RBC or EkhoMoskva ... young man? By the way, I can remind you that the majority shareholder of Echo is not anyone but Gazprom. Now, in order ... 1) Has anyone published a historical journal in Russia, in general? There are excellent quality magazines of this kind in any country in Europe. This is the first magazine in Russia. As for the materials cited in it ... I don’t know Basovskaya, Weller, Tsvetkov, though not authorities for you, but not for me. The literary column is very well maintained by Bykov.
    2) “Venediktov the historian” primarily meant that he taught history for a long time at school. I apologize for not clarifying this point. But the style of his transmission, interviews, debates - all this inspires interest. I wonder what a person reads. I look at his instagram, I go to alib.ru and order. His view of many things is close to me, that’s all.
    3) Someone did not hurt the hunger. Probably? quite, however, this does not abolish the very fact of hunger as such. Kharkiv, Donetsk region most hit.
    4) In my opinion, I did not mention Snob anywhere.
    5) I do not study according to the Amateur. I collect it now ... then go up. The opinion voiced by me above I cited based on the work that was touched by me in another thread - Timoty Snider Bloodlands. The book was purchased based on the selection of the Economist. Believe me, this is a very reputable magazine in Europe.
    Listen, I try to look at any thing from two sides, that is, listen to an alternative opinion. But you, perceive any argument as "info-wipe, stupidity, nonsense." And then you still argue why we cannot make a Trident-2 level rocket. And all because ... we have vodka and they have calvados, viskar rum or cognac.
    PS This does not detract from the greatness of Russia, but IMHO, not everything is in order, so to speak
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 18: 42 New
      0
      Willywonka
      Yes, I perceive all these organisms, such as RBC, Echo, Snob, Amateur, Rain, as garbage.
      They are them.
      Bulls, among those who at least looked like a person whom you can believe and listen to, alas and ah, are not suitable, raving, lecherous and lying too much, plus are corrupt.
      Weller? And this multi-player and you and we don’t dance, with what admission has become something significant for society? He says a lot, sometimes entertaining, but in every river, to a greater, lesser extent, poison is laid.
      Basovskaya? Well, it’s still not enough for me to convince me of the value of this cesspool, for example Latynina, the arrows of an oscilloscope and Ksenia with a horse physiognomy — then I really believe that they are valuable to society, they are valuable as an example of what cannot be.
    2. sdv68
      sdv68 April 10 2015 19: 00 New
      +3
      Famine also affected those countries in which there were no Bolsheviks at all. Or do you think that Pilsudski was a secret Bolshevik and acted on the instructions of Stalin. And if not, where did the famine come from?
  27. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 18: 57 New
    -1
    to VladKavkaz Latynina not published in Dilettante. Bykov is lascivious ... I don’t know, I didn’t hold a candle, and I spit on it. The Literary Column is important to me, and he writes remarkably. "Ksenia with a horse physiognomy", spit on her physiognomy, if she writes well, I will read. She sells her articles, not physiognomy, sorry.
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 19: 07 New
      +1
      Willywonka
      She sells hallucinations, which her pretty sick brain produces, that Latynina, that Sobchak.
      Bulls are not always talented, in a clever mind, sometimes at Zilbertrud, and this is another matter, filthy talent on the way out.
  28. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 10 2015 19: 14 New
    0
    to vlakavkaz your hard work, however. Stitch this ....
    Do you somehow still think about the issue of vodka-calvados / cognac / viskar.
    1. vladkavkaz
      vladkavkaz April 10 2015 19: 19 New
      +1
      “vodka-calvados / cognac / viskar.” “Is that your problem? Heal yourself, my dear, at the bottom of a glass of truth, no.”
  29. Merlin
    Merlin April 10 2015 19: 41 New
    +1
    History repeats itself: the Ukrainian elite robbed their citizens, brought hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians to starvation, and blamed Moscow for justifying their crimes. Now the same thing is happening in Ukraine.
  30. kojemyakin
    kojemyakin April 10 2015 19: 43 New
    +1
    Very interesting look at a serious problem. It is difficult to call a full-fledged study, but as the beginning of a lot of work - more than!
  31. bbss
    bbss April 10 2015 20: 20 New
    +1
    And my mother, the kingdom of heaven to her, told me how their family withdrew from their native village in the Smolensk region and made their way to their grandfather, who got a job in Donetsk, at the mine. Hunger drove away, but in Ukraine there was food. It was just these years. From the age of 34, they moved to Moscow.
    Grandfather enlisted as a bricklayer for construction.
  32. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 11 2015 08: 13 New
    +1
    to Darkness, an interesting message, of course, about the famines of the 19th and early 20th centuries. But who argues. In Europe, Ireland, for example, the middle of the last century experienced famine, though without such losses. But, excuse me, the main reason for the famine of 1892 is the lack of agriculture, which was called "subsoil." The culture of grain reproduction in Russia is a separate issue. The three-floor system in the 20th century remained the main one for Russia, while in Europe it began to be abandoned from the 18th century. The threshold for the reproduction of grain is considered the ratio of 1 to 3. In Russia it was 1 to 3/4, in Finland 1 to 5/6, Germany 1 to 8, England 1 to 10 (the initial, "specific period" when the border of agriculture were the modern Tula region). In part, this explains why private property did not appear in Russia. Nobody needed such a land: a short sowing season, draft cattle that did not have enough time to gain mass, to sow wheat was a problem (there are no planting depths, sow rye). In terms of protein content ... 1.5 times rye loses (although the quality of the protein is higher). Actually, all of this is stated in R. Pipes "Russia under the old regime", which in turn quotes Solovyov.
    True, if in 32-33 the starving villages were surrounded by OGPU employees (blockade in general), then in the time of Alexander2 a red cross was attracted and a “hunger loan” was issued. However, obtaining such a loan became problematic under Nicholas 2, and the activity of the Red Cross was limited.
    Interesting data on agriculture in Russia of that period. The most significant is the production of grain per capita .... the second ten, given Europe, Canada and Australia. The most interesting thing is that Russia continued to export grain producing grains of less than 500 kg per capita, while the United States, Canada and Argentina exported 800-1200 in production. That is, due to the doom of part of the population to hunger.
    Nevertheless, the difference between the famines 32-33 / 25-26 / 45-46 and the famines 901-2 / 905/906 is fundamental, IMHO.
    Something like this. So I’m thinking ... the reason that we don’t have our own “viskar / rum / calvados / cognac” is exactly the same as the reason for the inability to produce a rocket analog Trident 2 for 30 years. If you carefully read Oleg Kaptsov, there are the same problems. (The inability to make a good solid rocket ... you need a different production culture. For amers, this rocket has been flying without problems for 30 years). Just in the case of alcohol, this is easier to explain. On the fingers of the same reasons are explained in the tale of the famous Russian writer Leskov - "Left-handed".
  33. Jääkorppi
    Jääkorppi April 11 2015 13: 52 New
    +1
    Lord! There was famine, but there was no famine. My great-grandfather Zakhary Ivanovich Chuprina, the St. George Knight, owned a farm in Zaporozhye, had 12 children, refused to join the collective farm, for which he was dispossessed, although he was not his fist to the full, but he hired farm laborers during the harvesting and sowing season. In 17, he yanked from a crumbling army (to give a damn, give a damn, tired of fighting, my hut from the edge, I know nothing). He did not participate in the civil. The famine was, crop failure coincided with the seizure of bread and seeds). People were starving, many could not stand it, they were cutting the last cattle and having eaten right there they were dying, but the grandfather slaughtered the horses and dried the meat (although this is the horse), and he gave small pieces of it and the rest of the bread! Not a single child in the family has died. War and the invasion of civilized Europe took the lives of many. My grandmother was educated and worked all her life as a teacher in a Ukrainian school! And I never heard from her a word bad about Soviet power. It’s bad to say so, but it’s fortunate that she doesn’t see modern hohland. She would be ashamed of the revelry of Bandera, for all who betrayed a unified Russian history from Rurik to the USSR's space victories!
  34. The comment was deleted.
  35. Jääkorppi
    Jääkorppi April 11 2015 14: 00 New
    0
    In the states during the Great Depression, 3 million died of starvation, and food was destroyed in order to keep prices down, but this is democracy, and in Russia there is a dictatorship and the Holodomor.
  36. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 11 2015 15: 40 New
    0
    But still .... where are you so proudly carrying such a blizzard "pioneers" come from? Running to school, college, to the library.
    to ääKorppi regarding the estimate in the USA 1880-1936 the table below, or here is another http://diletant.ru/blogs/1702/1687/
    Zaporozhye normally carried the famine, floods and the Dnieper ... it was difficult to die.
    Since he studied in Zaporozhye, and constantly in touch with his mother, relatives and friends, I have a question for you - Where in Zaporozhye is the rampant of Bandera? Maybe I missed something? And they urgently need to pack their bags and run to the station? Please in more detail.
    1. sdv68
      sdv68 April 13 2015 09: 14 New
      0
      And this is the difference between Omeriki and our liberoids. Real Americans will never shit on their country. Until you grab them by the hand (as with torture of convicts), everything will disappear.
  37. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 11 2015 16: 02 New
    -2
    Catch the difference. 1) States are a mobile nation. For them, changing jobs with a difference of several thousand kilometers is not a problem. It was not then, and even more so now. Free movement of capital and labor. Old Man Smith taught them this. By the way, mobility is a marker of culture.
    2) You cannot leave the village. Because the borders are closed for you, only because you do not have a passport or because your farm did not fulfill the plan for the delivery of grain. OGPU officers arrived and took your village into a blockade and imposed a fine on the farm.
    Feel the difference called.
  38. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 11 2015 16: 32 New
    -1
    Yes, here's a snack statement by the State Duma of the Russian Federation. Must remind in the end.
    So the data for Ukraine, the hunger loss of 3,3 million is not an exaggeration.

    1. sdv68
      sdv68 April 13 2015 09: 12 New
      0
      If you believe everything that the State Duma accepts, then you can believe in Katyn.
  39. The comment was deleted.
  40. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 13 2015 13: 13 New
    -1
    And what is wrong with Katyn? So it wasn’t that? Ready to listen to the next batch of snowstorm.
    No one is an authority ... neither Solzhenitsyn, nor Astafyev. The most authoritative magazine is garbage. RBC, ECHO, there too. The opinion of the State Duma of the Russian Federation does not coincide ... "so this is a state fool" who will believe her.
    Regarding the differences between America and Russia, this is here http://lenta.ru/articles/2015/04/12/rusvsusa/?f
    I wonder how.
    1. sdv68
      sdv68 April 15 2015 13: 19 New
      0
      Quote: WillyWonka
      And what is wrong with Katyn?


      Все.


      Quote: WillyWonka
      So it wasn’t that?


      In the form in which it is now presented offSMI, was not.

      Read the minutes of Nuremberg (volume number 17 of the meeting of the summer of 1946th). It is written in black and white that the blame for the shooting of the psheks lies with Goering and Jodle.

      In the meantime, read here you still infa for thought.

      You don’t find it strange that the Germans “discovered” the graves in Katyn and raised international hype right after Stalingrad. Interesting "coincidence" do not find.

      Or here's another interesting info, to which, by the way, the psheks themselves got to the bottom

      http://www.katyn.ru/index.php?go=News&in=view&id=253

      In the meantime, you will look for MNEs and compare the facts. Here's a couple of movies for fun.



  41. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 19 2015 21: 30 New
    0
    Dear sdv68, well what nonsense ...
    On November 26, 2010, the State Duma of Russia adopted a statement “On the Katyn tragedy and its victims”, in which it admits that the mass shooting of Polish citizens in Katyn was carried out according to the direct instructions of Stalin and other Soviet leaders [10] and is a crime of the Stalin regime [11].
    In April 2012, the ECHR classified the Katyn execution as a war crime [12].
    (Wiki)
    Here's another read carefully ... http: //diletant.ru/articles/57823/? Sphrase_id = 1408666
    And, in general, stop doing this blizzard. There Blokhin shot 280 people a day. Katyn, by the way, is not one camp for Polish prisoners of war. All of them were, if my memory serves me - four. One was near Kharkov, one was near Kalinin, the fourth will be a desire, I will inform you later.
    1. Scraptor
      Scraptor April 19 2015 22: 39 New
      0
      Tell me ... Katyn is the one that was captured by the Germans.

      next time look carefully at the domain of the link and at the last three digits in id
  42. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 20 2015 10: 53 New
    0
    I looked. camp in Kozelsk-Katyn, Starobelsk-Kharkov, Ostashkov_Kalinin, the Poles were also shot in Bukovina near Kiev, and Kurapaty near Minsk. Blokhin, as I understand it, "worked" in Kalinin.
    Something like this.
    1. Scraptor
      Scraptor April 20 2015 11: 00 New
      0
      Yes, I probably shot from a trophy walther in 1939, something like that.
      and tied the hands of those being shot with hemp before exhumation.
  43. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 20 2015 11: 17 New
    0
    Yes, I noticed that I used German weapons. All right. Blokhin, if my memory serves me right, Yezhov was a man. After the change of Berry / Yezhov / Beria, leaders of this rank were usually cleaned up. However, Stalin, in the case of Blokhin, did not allow this to be done. Court executioner, however. “We need such people” (that is, experts in dirty work).
    PS The bulk of the executions, this is still the 40th year.
    And in general, this is what you need to be foolish people to raise the topic of the greatness of Stalin, I do not understand, I will honestly say. By the way, on the issue that Stalinism and fascism cannot be put on the same level, I do not agree with GDP. At the time of the Final solution, in Germany there were less than 1% of Jews, that is, they had the opportunity to flee. In the case of Stalin, no one had such an opportunity.
    1. Scraptor
      Scraptor April 20 2015 11: 38 New
      0
      Why not American?
  44. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 20 2015 12: 02 New
    0
    I, I think, in matters of small arms, the Americans were not yet an authority. Although, I read that some members of the Central Committee were supporters of American technological progress. Kirov, for example, had the latest American refrigerator, a communication system that allows you to listen to Mariinsky from the office.
    1. Scraptor
      Scraptor April 20 2015 12: 09 New
      0
      Perhaps, but your executioner might not know anything about it ... repeat

      what's with the unflagged twine?
  45. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 20 2015 13: 52 New
    0
    What do you mean? "what's with the unflagging twine"
    1. Scraptor
      Scraptor April 20 2015 15: 07 New
      0
      and? You pretended to just pay attention?
  46. Willywonka
    Willywonka April 20 2015 23: 08 New
    0
    I apologize for the offtopic, I do not understand what you mean. In the LAN please.