Military Review

Tamer "Panther". Interview with Tank Ace, Dr. Ion Degen

56
Tamer "Panther". Interview with Tank Ace, Dr. Ion Degen


On the evening of September 9, at the memorial of the IDF armored forces in Latrun, the premiere of a film dedicated to Ion Degen - one of the best tank aces of the Red Army. On his combat account - 16 destroyed and one captured tank.

A native of Vinnytsia region went to the front in 16 years in June 1941. In January, 1945, during the East Prussian offensive, was seriously wounded. After recovery, he became an orthopedic doctor, defended his doctoral dissertation. In 1977, he repatriated to Israel.

Was twice presented to the title of Hero of the Soviet Union. The first submission was for the battle, during which its platoon destroyed 18 Panther, the second for the heroism shown during the battles on the outskirts of Koenigsberg. The star of the hero Degen never received.

The man who started the war in June 41-th, almost no chance of survival. At the front you had the nickname "Lucky." You are not afraid to tempt fate?

After the start of the war, I fought about a month. Then he was wounded, lay for five and a half months in the hospital - it means he did not fight. Then he waited another four months for his leg to get stronger. He began to fight again in the summer of the 42 year, October 15 was again wounded, lay again in the hospital. After this year he turned over to the school. So I did not fight. He began to fight in June 44-th year and fought another eight months with a little.

Losses were very many. In a tank brigade, especially - in a breakthrough tank brigade ... Usually in our brigade it was said this: the fate of the tankman was either “the people's health department” or “the people's commissar’s land”. After the second offensive, they already looked at me with surprise. To go through so many attacks and stay alive was incredible. Just lucky. And sometimes this luck was determined by the fact that I understood what to do.

Of course, I was scared, but even more I was afraid that someone would think that a Jew is a coward, that a Jew is afraid. Therefore, always climbed first ... Land mines incredibly afraid. It's funny, because what's the difference - to die from a multi-kilogram bomb, or from a nine-gram bullet ... It's hard to explain ... This is war ...

What was the worst fight for you?

Probably fighting in the Caucasus in the year 42 and the last battle. Then I decided that my shell exploded in my tank. And we just simultaneously shot at each other. I set it on fire, and he hit me.

It was scary when I went with my friend to the Dnieper, and I had to quit weaponto swim across to the left bank. After all, how can you part with a weapon? And when I came to the left bank and heard the German language, I started crying.

I thought that on the third day of the war I would be in Berlin, that the German proletarians would meet us with flowers. And here I am on the left bank of the Dnieper, without weapons, and here are the Germans. It was incredibly scary morally. After all, moral experiences are worse than physical pain.

Your share fell both heavy retreat of the Red Army - 1941 and 1942 of the year. Which one was harder?

The second. In the first retreat, I still did not understand, was a 16-year-old boy. And we fought, we did not retreat. My platoon all the time was surrounded, and I had to get out. There was no feeling that you are retreating. But I did not understand what was happening, I did not see the commanders.

And the second retreat is from Armavir almost to Beslan. It was incredibly scary. We departed and thought "where else" ... When I saw the signpost "To Rostov - 648 km". And how much more to Berlin? After all, I was sure that we would be in Berlin.

Where did you have this confidence that you will be in Berlin?

From kindergarten. My brain was washed out so that I dreamed that I would be 18 years old and I could join the party. When I was accepted to the party, I was happy. Now I am amused and even a little ashamed, but what to do if I was so.

How did the epiphany come?

Too late. The "Doctors' Case" shocked me. I was a doctor and realized that this could not be. I thought: how can my party make a mistake? And even earlier - the struggle against cosmopolitanism. I understood that certain people may be mistaken, but not the party.

And only in 69, my 15-year-old son came to me with a book in front of me and asked if I read the article "Party Organization and Party Literature". I answered that of course. He says to me: "Look, Lenin is the basis of fascism, that's where Mussolini drew his ideas from."

First, I cursed him so that I had to apologize, and then I reread it and grabbed my head. After that, I re-read "Materialism and Empirio-Criticism" - Christmas trees are green! After all, I read it all 18 years ago. So I stopped being a communist.

On your account 12 lined tanks, four self-propelled guns and one captured "Panther". 16 tanks are an outstanding result. But still, how did you manage to capture the “Panther”?

In that battle, we (three tanks) hit a Panther 18. The gunners of the 184 th rifle division who had returned to their positions seemed to have hit another six vehicles. The Germans fled, leaving the whole car. Infantry began to set fire to them. And then I rushed to my tank and climbed into the "Panther".

I was very interested to see what it is. I sat down to the place of the driver, started this "Panther" and began to prance on it. I also drove "beteshki", and "thirty-three", and the English "Valentine", and the American M3. They are all the same. And then the battalion commander took me by the collar: "You are an idiot, they will beat you!"

I really liked the optics in the "Panther". I was just in awe. And then they asked me: "How did you manage to bring it, it stalled, and the crew ran away." As it was possible - clicked on the starter, and it started up.

You talked about how the insight came to me, how I was transformed. In some matters, I have not changed. Everything related to war is holy for me. We honestly fought. I do not know how there are generals and marshals, this is not my business. I am not a historian, I have a very narrow field of view. And in this sight, everything that I see was right and fair.

We have already touched on the sacramental Jewish question. How important was the feeling of being a Jew to you, and how did you feel that you were a Jew, people around you at war?

No one ever let me know that I was somehow different. One case was. Our battalion commander was Guard Major Dorosh, a very good man. Somehow, before entering the battle, we drank, and he says: "You know, you are such a guy, not at all like a Jew." Then he asked for my forgiveness, but it was very difficult for me to restore normal relations with him.

Another case was. I had a shooting crew in the crew — I think that there was a unique one in the whole Red Army — Zakharya Zagiddullin told me: “You are a Jew? But they told me that Jews have horns.” In addition to these two cases, there was nothing.

But for me, being a Jew was very important. I remember how in front of one of the battles, when the tanks were at the starting position, around the fire, everyone is scared. And one of the drivers of the first battalion, Weinstock, climbed onto the tower and began dancing the tap dance. Here is a guy!

Just like in the movie "In war as in war."

I did not watch ... In the first battalion there was a company commander - Abraham Cohen. Outstanding tankman. The brigade commander, Colonel Dukhovny, was also a Jew. Then I did not know it, then I did not pay attention to it. But the fact that I am a Jew, I knew very well. He knew that I had no right to give the slightest reason to doubt that the Jews are wonderful warriors.

You were twice presented with the title of Hero of the Soviet Union, but you still did not receive an award. Is it related to Jewish origin?

How do I know this? The three of us for that fight with the “Panthers” were presented for this award by Major General Gorodovikov. He promised, but we did not know for sure whether he presented or not. And only 20 of January, I and my slave, senior lieutenant Fedorov, saw behind the stable where our battalion was supposed to be, not only the brigade commander, but also the front commander General Chernyakhovsky with all the "Kahal" ...

I jumped off the tank, and I was slapped on the arm of a splinter. Next to Chernyakhovsky!

Then, when my wife and son came to say good-bye before leaving for Israel, I measured the distance from the self-propelled gun, which I hit, to the place where the front commander stood. 300 meters! This is just incredible.

In short, I saw him, confused, I say: "Comrade General of the Army, let me turn to Comrade Colonel-General." He says: "Report to me." I reported to him. And he says to some lieutenant colonel: "Write down: Degen - to the hero of the Soviet Union, both crews - to the Order of Lenin." And then they say to him: "Comrade Army General, he has already been represented once." So I found out that I was represented.

And for that fight against "Panther" I did not receive the Hero, but the medal "For Courage". Like this.

In February 22 hospital I found out that Chernyakhovsky was killed. And on February 23 I received the Order of the Red Banner. You know, such an order instead of the title of Hero is quite. So I decided that I received my reward.

Time passed, I am a student, and just September 8 of 1948, I come to classes and my friend Senka Resnik, who lives now in Yavne, tells me: "Listen, why didn't you say that you are a hero of the Soviet Union?" I, knowing that he always plays me, did not even pay attention. But he convinced me that they had reported it on the radio. Then my nephew also told me about it.

The next day, my friend Zunya Kogan, also a tanker, junior lieutenant, took me to the military enlistment office. A colonel came out, very handsome, and as it turned out later - the noblest man, by the way, the Hero of the Soviet Union. “I know, I know, they have already written a request to the Supreme Soviet,” he said. Somewhere in a month I met him, he says: "Wait for the decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet." I was terribly surprised, because I thought that I had already received an award.

The time passed, I graduated from the institute, moved to another city. And in May 1965, I was summoned to the military enlistment office, and the colonel, the head of the political department, an intelligent person, showed me the answer: "Given that Lieutenant Degen Ion Lazarevich’s guards have a large number of awards, there is an opinion not to confer the title Hero." I laughed at the phrase "have an opinion," and the colonel felt uneasy - I saw it. He was more worried than me. And that was the end of it.

How did poetry come to your destiny?

I have no idea. I believed that my first poem - "Beginning". But the elder brother of my classmate came here and reminded me that I still wrote poetry at school. And I absolutely do not remember. There was one more thing: when I was caring for my future wife, I, ohmurya, read her the poem To the death of Stalin. I do not remember a single line. I remember now front poems, which, as I thought, had long been forgotten. And this poem, like everything I wrote before the war, disappeared. I do not remember anything.

My favorite poem was written in the Caucasus. After a hard day, a very hard fight, I leaned against the trunk of an olive tree. A shot rang out, and a branch fell on my tank tank. And when I read this poem now, I have the same skin frost that was then:

The air started.
Shot. Smoke.
On the old trees chopped off the branches.
And I'm still alive.
And I am safe.
Happening?

However, your poem became popular.


My companion, in death agony.
Do not call friends in vain.
Let me warm my palms better. I
Over your steaming blood.
Do not cry, do not groan, you're not small,
You're not hurt, you're just killed.
Let me take off your felt boots.
We still have to attack.

Why do you think it happened?

Who knows? But I receive letters ... I was written by one artist from Leningrad: "We fought with you, I am a year older than you, and what you conveyed in the poem is war." As you understand, I did not take off these boots with anyone, and no hands over the blood ... It turned out that something like Vereschagin's "Apotheosis". Such is the thing.

So this is a metaphor. And what was really?

In fact, I took off my boots from the deputy commander of the battalion for the captain Baranovsky's household unit - a very good man.

He survived after this stories?

He did not just survive, he turned out to be a decent person, and nowhere did he report that we did it in a drunken state. Although before I did this to him, he threatened to shoot me: "You will receive the highest measure, and I will shoot you myself."

How much has your military experience predetermined your postwar fate?

Fully. The fact is that in the hospital, seeing the work of the doctors, I decided that I myself would become a doctor. I used to work thoroughly. Now you see, the hand is no longer obeying. But I was an orthopedic surgeon, the first in world practice I sewed an amputated hand. This is not a matter of itself.

As a student, I learned to sew stitches on a pillow. Technician coached all the time. I studied the anatomy so that when I came here, the doctors were simply amazed by my knowledge of the subject. How else? Is it possible to become a doctor otherwise? Accuracy, perseverance, perseverance - all I have from the war.

Have you thought about how your fate would be if you were in Israel in 1947-48?

The fact is that at the beginning of December 1947, my friend Motya Tverskaya and I wrote a statement to the Central Committee of the CPSU (b) that we, two communists, two officers of the Red Army, ask to send us to Palestine to fight against British imperialism. Then we, like tzutsiki, trembled, but it remained without consequences.

After 30 years, I got out of the trolleybus and met my personal "angel" - the KGB major, adjutant of General Chursin, my patient and patron. He asked: "Decided to go?" and recalled this statement. I told him: "Have not you forgotten?" And he: "Yes that you, Ion Lazarevich, we do not forget anything."

But still, God does everything very well. I came here in the seventies, a doctor. At first, we were all greeted with caution, they say, the purchased diplomas ... But when they saw what level my colleagues were, what wonderful guys they were, the attitude immediately changed, and the doctors with “purchased diplomas” became favorite - department heads, district therapists.

I heard that in 70 the attitude in Israel to World War II veterans was not the warmest. Like, we have our own wars, our own heroes. Is it so?

I dont know. I can judge only by myself. Israeli tankers took me as a mother. We met Avigdor Kahalani in the bathhouse. Both of us are lovers of baths - not saunas, but real baths. I saw his scars ... We had a fight with him, like two drops of water, only he was 29 years old, and I was 19, and he had Jewish tank crews, and I had a collection of thieves and beggars. We made friends with him. General Haim Erez, Brigadier General Menashe Inbar are just my friends. When I was operated on, they constantly came to visit me at the hospital.

Today Zvi Kan-Tor called, asked if I needed anything on the day of the premiere. Yes, I do not do it at all, it's not my business. Zvi is a surprisingly delicate, intelligent person. They introduced me to another tanker, Zvi Gringold. An interesting guy, kibbutznik, and what a warrior! I have 16 tanks and one captured, and he has somewhere 60 tanks. From the "Centurion" line up T-55 and T-62, which are much better ... Amazing guys!

How do you feel about the initiative of Zvi Kan-Tora to create a museum of Jewish soldiers of the Second World War?

The only thing that strikes me in this matter is that the museum has not yet been built. No money. Shame, shame, shame! No money for what Zvi does! It will be a unique museum. And it is incomprehensible to me: there are Jewish millionaires, can they not donate some seven million dollars to complete this museum? Just a shame!

9 September in the memorial center of the armored forces in Latrun will premiere a documentary film about you. Do you feel like a movie hero?

Of course not. In my opinion, this is all unnecessary business. I relate to all this, so as not to offend the director, I will say this: indifferently. Now, if it was about my profession, there would be something to tell me.

Author:
Originator:
http://newsru.co.il/israel/08sep2014/degen_201.html
56 comments
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  1. borisjdin1957
    borisjdin1957 13 September 2014 07: 22
    +15
    from the Don.
    Among any people there are aces, and there are 3,14 daras.
    1. ECT
      ECT 13 September 2014 07: 58
      +21
      Awesome man. I read a semi-documentary book about tankers, so their life lasted one or two attacks. Really lucky.
    2. Giant thought
      Giant thought 13 September 2014 08: 34
      +5
      Lucky, he is lucky. As the saying goes: whoever is destined to be hanged will not drown.
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 11: 23
        +19
        21 January

        ... I’m not celebrating my birthday, but 21 of January (1945) -
         the day of my last wound
         when i was killed. This is my birthday.

        Ion degen
        The sun was smoldering.
        Death whispered: "Do not breathe!".
        Life followed drop by drop
        from a shot soul.
         Without an end, the minute lasted.
        Life was beating a pale glare.
        God of war gave as mercy
        interrupted moment.
        My body was missing a breath
        exhaled air, gasping for breath.
        Long asterisk flew
        on the reddened groove. 
        Clouds stretched toward paradise.
        Black snow smelled of hell.
        The salt of the earth came
        on bitten lips.
         Reflected in the cornea
        fluff of earth and sky.
        Dying to be born
        into life melting death.
        And the soul, exhausted,
        flipped the calendar.
        Another life began.
        Twenty first. January.
  2. sergey32
    sergey32 13 September 2014 07: 28
    +12
    Apart from everything else, he only erected a monument not made by hands with his "My comrade, in mortal agony".
  3. dojjdik
    dojjdik 13 September 2014 07: 30
    +3
    and whether to put us a monument to Lenin in the center of tel Aviv or whatever it is called this town
  4. rexby63
    rexby63 13 September 2014 07: 32
    +1
    About the film and the book "In war, as in war", comrade is disingenuous. And so the interview is normal, although a lot has already been written about Degen.
  5. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 13 September 2014 07: 58
    +19
    Of course, a lot has been written about how the Jews fought and the galaxy of heroes is much more than what is said in the interview! Among the "children of Israel" there are not only Kolomoisky, but also Degens, Dragoons and many, very many wonderful people!
  6. Anatole Klim
    Anatole Klim 13 September 2014 08: 05
    +8
    I read at the beginning of the article:
    I had a gunner in the carriage - unique, I think, there was no other such in the entire Red Army - Zakhary Zagiddullin

    I read further:
    We met Avigdor Kahalani in the bathhouse ... and he had Jewish tankers, and I had a collection of thieves and paupers.

    I did not understand, Zakharya Zagiddullin was a unique shooting of the Red Army or a thief and a beggar ???
    1. max702
      max702 13 September 2014 10: 49
      +3
      Yes, everything is so a Jew will remain everywhere a Jew .. There are no big racists than Jews, but they don’t hide it, they and all the others .. But for some reason they are offended by the whole world ..
    2. Wheel
      Wheel 13 September 2014 10: 59
      +11
      Quote: Anatole Klim
      I read at the beginning of the article:
      I had a gunner in the carriage - unique, I think, there was no other such in the entire Red Army - Zakhary Zagiddullin

      I read further:
      We met Avigdor Kahalani in the bathhouse ... and he had Jewish tankers, and I had a collection of thieves and paupers.

      I did not understand, Zakharya Zagiddullin was a unique shooting of the Red Army or a thief and a beggar ???

      Also rezanul.
      In general, the article makes a double impression.
      There are a bunch of contradictions.
      It’s not clear how 16-year-old in June 41st he joined the regular army, if before
      It is not clear how he crossed the Dnieper and heard German, if after a month of war he was wounded and stayed in the hospital for 5 and a half months, and the Germans crossed the Dnieper only in September.
      The Tatar (?) / Bashkir (?) Zagiddullin is absolutely not a typical Jewish name for Zakharya.

      IMHO The interview was deeply revised by a journalist with the introduction of the "Jewish question" and throwing poop in the direction of Russia.
      Quote: FC SKIF
      And who and why puts the article?
      Here is therefore a minus article.
      1. matross
        matross 13 September 2014 13: 57
        -7
        Quote: Wheel
        There are a bunch of contradictions.

        The "contradictions" can be clarified here:
        http://iremember.ru/tankisti/degen-ion-lazarevich.html
        About the "handful" and
        Quote: Wheel
        poop
        I will not tell you - by g @ inside you, I see, special.
        Quote: Wheel
        Therefore, the article is a minus.

        Sorry for you and minus - a lot of honor, scoundrel.
        1. Bayonet
          Bayonet 13 September 2014 16: 41
          0
          Quote: matRoss
          Sorry for you and minus - a lot of honor, scoundrel.

          I support. There is such a breed of people - all of them would cheat! So the hero got a veteran. Probably the same and clamped the Star - Count 5th embarrassed!
      2. Sirocco
        Sirocco 13 September 2014 15: 46
        +5
        Quote: Wheel
        Also rezanul.
        In general, the article makes a double impression.

        Similar opinion. Moreover, knowing that Ion Degen is a poet and writer, then fiction is 100% present. nevertheless, this does not diminish his exploits committed by him in the Second World War. I read on the site, Feat of the people, his award sheets, I did not find there 12 destroyed tanks. (2 tanks, 4 anti-tank guns, 2 bunkers, 1 armored personnel carriers) .2. (from July 29, 1944. 5 anti-tank guns, 3 t-4, 3 mortars, 3 machine gun points. ) from 19-23.10.44g. (2 T-4, 4 PTO, 1 PO,) So judging by the official data from the archives, 7 tanks, the rest is fiction. Those who wish can easily check on http://podvignaroda.mil.ru/?#tab=navHome So the truth is somewhere nearby.
        1. Sirocco
          Sirocco 13 September 2014 16: 57
          +1
          laughing strange thing, provided the facts are undeniable, and the people zealous in hysteria, laughing Here in relation to the feat of Kolobanov http://topwar.ru/58114-dvadcat-dva-protiv-odnogo-kak-tankist-kolobanov-unizil-tr
          etiy-reyh.html there is no doubt, and there are facts confirming this event, and with respect to I. Degen, with his 12 or 18 tanks, there are only legends, do not be lazy from the author to go to the Feat of the People and see. Or did the 5th graph prevent someone from the Archive again ????
          1. matross
            matross 13 September 2014 17: 26
            +4
            Quote: Sirocco
            in relation to I. Degen, with his 12 or 18 tanks, only legends

            It's not about the numbers, dear. Moreover, if we are talking about the war - whoever understands, he will confirm, especially on the award. The point is in relation to ... I don’t know how to even explain, I need to feel it. Not with a calculator here, it is necessary and not with an 5 clause, simply conscience can be in the on position. to deliver. I gave the link above to an article about Degen, read, do not be lazy.
            1. Bayonet
              Bayonet 13 September 2014 21: 36
              +1
              Quote: matRoss
              who understands, he will confirm, especially on the award.

              Anyone "on assignments" who were spinning with their superiors always had complete order with their awards! It will not get lost there and the reward will not pass by.
            2. Sirocco
              Sirocco 14 September 2014 10: 35
              +2
              Quote: matRoss
              It's not about the numbers, dear.

              Of course, not in numbers, but in their quantity. I do not need to be called to conscience, if you carefully read my comment, you should note that the merits in the Second World War of the respected poet writer, I do not belittle. Honor and praise be to him for his exploits. BUT there is one thing, but I do not like, and many, this whole circus with artistic fiction, is sick of thin. films, and other rubbish, from which the opinion of young people about the history of our state is then formed. And in a simple way, I’ll say this is a historical lie, and distortion with repainting of facts. Now, in fact, the Panther is the T-5 medium tank, not the T-4, which are indicated on the Degen award sheets. Add these 12 t-16s to 7 (4) tanks (panthers), we get 19 (23) tanks + armored personnel carriers. SO WHERE is the truth ?????????? In childhood, I came across a neighbor who was a veteran, he told us not such tales about the war, then he learned from his grandfather that he (a veteran neighbor) had spent the whole of the Second World War in the cellar, for which he served his 12 years. But all the breasts in the late 80s (when the witnesses died) were in orders and medals. Dear MatRoss, let's get closer to the facts, and not deal with the flood in the network.
      3. tundra
        tundra 13 September 2014 23: 01
        0
        In the extermination battalion, the pH fought.
  7. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF 13 September 2014 08: 09
    +14
    And who and why puts the article? Interview with a normal anti-fascist hero. Jew, so what? Horn then he does not grow?
    1. sgazeev
      sgazeev 13 September 2014 11: 05
      +6
      Quote: FC SKIF
      And who and why puts the article? Interview with a normal anti-fascist hero. Jew, so what? Horn then he does not grow?

      I experienced the notorious 5th point on myself in my childhood, I was not offended that you would take from the wretched, and then in the army I learned that I was more Russian than Ivan Ivanov. Life goes on, but only people, some, in their own way understand "friendship peoples. "I do not deny there are moral idiots, such as Svidomo ukrov, everywhere. But thank God in Russia they began to understand that the country is one for all the peoples living on it. About the fact that Berezovsky is embarrassed that he is a Jew:
      “If I am a Jew - why will I be shy! I'm really not a Jew
      ". The words of Chernomyrdin. I am not a Jew, I am a representative of the people who are the second largest after the Russians. Guess the three notes? request
    2. Bayonet
      Bayonet 13 September 2014 16: 42
      0
      Quote: FC SKIF
      And who and why puts the article?

      Any rot and puts.
  8. 11111mail.ru
    11111mail.ru 13 September 2014 08: 30
    +8
    Beat the Nazis = our man! May God grant him long life and good health! By the way, the brigade commander Krivoshein Semyon Moiseevich was also Jewish by nationality. Among the colleagues (technical staff) were also Jews. Some normal guys are more reliable than Russians and Ukrainians. My ensign was M. Limonnik (Rostov).
  9. saag
    saag 13 September 2014 08: 35
    0
    "... Very late. The" Doctors' case "shocked me. I was a doctor and understood that this could not be. I thought: how can my party be mistaken? And even earlier - the struggle against cosmopolitanism. I understood that certain people may be wrong, but not the party. "

    But what did not remember who led the party then?
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 09: 28
      +2
      Quote: saag
      ;
      But what did not remember who led the party then?

      In 1952 year? And who ? I looked at the Wikipedia list of the Poltburo, so it seems that the okrom Kaganovich and there were no Jews there.
      1. saag
        saag 13 September 2014 09: 34
        0
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        I looked at Wikipedia

        Oh, you need Wikipedia for this, but time is changing, but it was the work of a teacher of all times and peoples, the leading man of all sciences, and so they knew :-)
      2. sgazeev
        sgazeev 13 September 2014 11: 29
        0
        Quote: Aaron Zawi
        Quote: saag
        ;
        But what did not remember who led the party then?

        In 1952 year? And who ? I looked at the Wikipedia list of the Poltburo, so it seems that the okrom Kaganovich and there were no Jews there.

        Well, yes, he shone "metro named after Kaganovich."
    2. sgazeev
      sgazeev 13 September 2014 11: 18
      +1
      Quote: saag
      "... Very late. The" Doctors' case "shocked me. I was a doctor and understood that this could not be. I thought: how can my party be mistaken? And even earlier - the struggle against cosmopolitanism. I understood that certain people may be wrong, but not the party. "

      But what did not remember who led the party then?

      There were times when you would forget yourself. Parents with children at all did not start talking about the leaders of the party and the state. There were enough everyday problems, they did not grumble, otherwise you would create "big problems" for yourself somewhere in the felling. Although I was seven then, I remember everything, the child's mind quickly grasps. When Nikita went "liberties".
  10. ruslan207
    ruslan207 13 September 2014 09: 24
    0
    saag continue?
    1. saag
      saag 13 September 2014 09: 28
      0
      I like to ask questions so that people begin to answer them, more to themselves, and not to me
      1. ruslan207
        ruslan207 13 September 2014 09: 41
        +3
        I’ll continue well after the 37 year. There are almost no Jews left in the party. Regarding the ideology of the Communist Party, the Israeli ideology is no better than a zombie. It’s not enough to watch especially anti-Russian forums.
        1. 11111mail.ru
          11111mail.ru 13 September 2014 10: 42
          +3
          Quote: ruslan207
          after 37, there were almost no Jews left in the party

          Really? Offhand I will fasten to Lazar Moiseevich Lev Zakharovich Mekhlis ... Since 1930 editor of the newspaper "Pravda" and at the same time head. department of press and publishing houses of the Central Committee of the CPSU (b). Until 1949, Pearl Karpovskaya (Polina Zhemchuzhina) was in plain sight. And this is only the visible part!
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 11: 09
            +3
            Quote: 11111mail.ru
            Quote: ruslan207
            after 37, there were almost no Jews left in the party

            Really? Offhand I will fasten to Lazar Moiseevich Lev Zakharovich Mekhlis ... Since 1930 editor of the newspaper "Pravda" and at the same time head. department of press and publishing houses of the Central Committee of the CPSU (b). Until 1949, Pearl Karpovskaya (Polina Zhemchuzhina) was in plain sight. And this is only the visible part!

            There were plenty of communist Jews. There was just a hint that when deciding on the "Doctors' case", the Jews had some kind of special influence on the country's leadership. The Politburo list from 1952-53 suggests otherwise.
        2. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 11: 04
          -1
          Quote: ruslan207
          I’ll continue well after the 37 year. There are almost no Jews left in the party. Regarding the ideology of the Communist Party, the Israeli ideology is no better than a zombie. It’s not enough to watch especially anti-Russian forums.

          Especially when there are 14 parties in the Knesset, from the Palestinian BALAD and RAM-Tal and the left-radical MERETS to the right-radical Baitha Yehudi. Zombie do not want to.
          1. ruslan207
            ruslan207 13 September 2014 11: 34
            +1
            You reko especially listen to Medvedenko as they are these ventriloquists say that Russian troops in Ukraine
            1. Aaron Zawi
              Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 11: 38
              +3
              Quote: ruslan207
              You reko especially listen to Medvedenko as they are these ventriloquists say that Russian troops in Ukraine

              I have been in Israel for 25 years. What "Draka"? belay
        3. Oprychnyk
          Oprychnyk 13 September 2014 11: 39
          +1
          Not true. Lena, a Jewess, worked for us, everyone refused to join the party, and she joined in the late 80s. So she went to Israel as a communist. We were joking about everything.
          I don’t know what about Marxism-Leninism, but about the peasants she was much.)))
          1. Ptah
            Ptah 13 September 2014 18: 37
            -1
            Quote: Oprychnyk
            about the men she was much.)

            Distinctive feature. National trait. The eternal "uneasiness translated into the sectoral sphere". Well, etc.
            A lot has been written on this subject -

            http://marmuz.dreamwidth.org/142487.html?thread=3292311
  11. An-mi
    An-mi 13 September 2014 09: 30
    +1
    Great difference, Jew and Jew!
    We have chaos in our heads. And this chaos is specially supported by various sectarians, Satanists = occultists and other rabble.
  12. Olegmog
    Olegmog 13 September 2014 09: 36
    +22
    I read an article about a tanker, not a Jew!
    Who cares, Jew, Kazakh, ....!
    Long life, health, grandfather to you!
  13. lexa333
    lexa333 13 September 2014 09: 43
    +12
    grandfather for many years.
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 11: 00
      +5
      Quote: lexa333
      grandfather for many years.

      Yes, he really is "Lucky".
      The war ended for him in East Prussia when, by personal example, he tried to drag a tank company into the attack. But the company did not go. The Germans missed the lone “thirty-four” for the first line of trenches and set fire to it, firing on the landing on the armor. Despite a serious wound to the head, Degen managed to get out of the tank, having received a machine-gun burst on his hands and shell fragments on his legs
      .
  14. Russian Uzbek
    Russian Uzbek 13 September 2014 10: 52
    +4
    ceased to be a communist - became a Zionist ... to listen to how some Jewish heroes fought! and "unique" Zakharya (???) Zagidullin ...
    1. 11111mail.ru
      11111mail.ru 13 September 2014 16: 12
      +5
      Quote: Russian Uzbek
      "unique" Zakharya (???) Zagidullin ...

      Dear, you most likely did not serve in the Soviet Army. For some reason, it was customary in the Russian-speaking environment to appropriate the Russian analogue to its own name. For example, in military unit 32937 I had a mechanic Ivadulla Nurlybaev. Guess three times what his name was in the barracks ... And what about yours (???), um. three bends, so it is also elementary calculated by the nearest Turkic counterpart: Zaki /Zakir/ Zahir. And the Slavs remade the brothers in Zakhar.
      1. Russian Uzbek
        Russian Uzbek 13 September 2014 18: 33
        0
        I didn’t serve in Russia! and it’s not worth explaining common truths to me
        Zaharya is a Jewish name, so he remade it not in Russian but in Hebrew
  15. revnagan
    revnagan 13 September 2014 10: 58
    +2
    Equalize between Lenin and Mussolini? Communism and Nazism? Shame. Moreover, for a Jew. But there were plenty of brave people everywhere, both among us and the Germans.
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 13 September 2014 21: 40
      +2
      Before changing and founding the fascist party, Mussolini was a socialist.
      He is the proletarian, the son of a blacksmith, after all. He and Lenin met. There is a photo where
      they play chess. Mussolini knew the works of Lenin and often quoted.
      Mussolini denied the existence of nations - he believed that there were only cultural and linguistic communities.
      This acquaintance does not throw a spot on Lenin.
  16. Balaganov
    Balaganov 13 September 2014 13: 39
    +3
    Grandfather had his own motivation, pure hatred, pure red.
  17. padded jacket
    padded jacket 13 September 2014 14: 03
    +1
    Perhaps it’s true that he said here, among the Jews there really were heroes who distinguished themselves in that War.
    But the fact that he betrayed his homeland, where he was born and raised which raised and taught him, and fled from it, is definitely a betrayal.
    And note in 1977 smileotherwise local Jews like to scream the USSR was a closed state and they didn’t let anyone out of it, but they also oppressed poor Jews, oh how much smile
    The article is purely propaganda, definitely a minus.
  18. provincial
    provincial 13 September 2014 14: 42
    +1
    We must learn to live with such Jews.
    1. padded jacket
      padded jacket 13 September 2014 14: 49
      +1
      Then you didn’t say correctly, accidentally or intentionally?
      We must learn to liveNOT SUCH JEWS, BUT JUST JUST ORDERED, HONEST AND PATRIOTICALLY TUNED TO PEOPLE'S HOMELAND.
      And it does not matter whether they are Jews or not.
  19. Thompson
    Thompson 13 September 2014 14: 48
    +2
    Quote: ECT
    Awesome man. I read a semi-documentary book about tankers, so their life lasted one or two attacks. Really lucky.

    Alas, statistics showed that for every wrecked German tank there were 9 of ours at the beginning of the war and 4-5 at the end. I bow my head to the tankers, To all warriors of the Second World War in general !!!
  20. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  21. Grandfather Victor
    Grandfather Victor 13 September 2014 16: 22
    +5
    Real Hero and Real Man.
    1. apro
      apro 13 September 2014 17: 44
      -1
      real homeland do not change.
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 19: 50
        +3
        Quote: apro
        real homeland do not change.

        Well, you are not real yet
        http://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ушполис,_Григорий_Саульевич
        http://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Фельзенштейн,_Миля_Лазаревич
        http://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Форзун,_Яков_Цалевич
        http://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Вайнруб,_Евсей_Григорьевич
  22. skeptic2999
    skeptic2999 13 September 2014 18: 27
    0
    Quote: apro
    real homeland do not change.

    And you, dear Apro, know all the life circumstances of Jon Degen? He betrayed someone, watered his homeland with mud, finding himself abroad? Such people, of course, cannot be considered real. But our hero is certainly not the case.
  23. Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 13 September 2014 20: 02
    0
    "I never got a star" ... That's it, you don't have to read the advertisement further. When is enough for you, is there a measure of your appetite, guys? And I immediately want to check the combat path "and immediately doubts arise - why did he fight? And did he fight, excuse me. Moans about not received medals are uncharacteristic for real veterans.
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 20: 30
      +3
      Quote: Mikhail3
      "I never got a star" ... That's it, you don't have to read the advertisement further. When is enough for you, is there a measure of your appetite, guys? And I immediately want to check the combat path "and immediately doubts arise - why did he fight? And did he fight, excuse me. Moans about not received medals are uncharacteristic for real veterans.

      Yes Yes. Everyone lies . For the Jewish Freemasons. :-))
      http://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Рапопорт,_Иосиф_Абрамович If this is not enough, I can still give examples of those submitted to the GSS and not approved.
      1. Cenij150814
        Cenij150814 13 September 2014 20: 45
        0
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        Yes Yes. Everyone lies . For the Jewish Freemasons. :-))
        http://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Рапопорт,_Иосиф_Абрамович Если этого мало могу еще примеров о Представленных к ГСС и не утвержденных.

        Interestingly, interestingly Czechs so disliked the Jews under Stalin, because they say he was also one of the "elite" you happen to not know ?? winkedYes, and Lenin is a child of Israel !! I’m silent about Marx yes
        1. andj61
          andj61 13 September 2014 20: 59
          +3
          Quote: Cenij150814
          Interestingly, interestingly Czechs so disliked the Jews under Stalin, because they say he was also one of the "elite" you happen to not know ?? and Lenin is a child of Israel !!


          When Adam plowed and Eve spun, then who among them was a Jew, Russian, German, or brazenly Saxon? All of us on this Earth are related to each other, all people are descended from a single woman who lived about a thousand generations ago - it's about 20 years, or a little less.
          With all the inconsistencies in the article, this is a grandfather - a real hero!
          1. Cenij150814
            Cenij150814 13 September 2014 21: 07
            -2
            Quote: andj61
            When Adam plowed and Eve spun, then who among them was a Jew, Russian, German, or brazenly Saxon? All of us on this Earth are related to each other, all people are descended from a single woman who lived about a thousand generations ago - it's about 20 years, or a little less

            Stop reading false books, you know the word degeneracy !! By the way, many say that the Jews face it.
            1. Bayonet
              Bayonet 13 September 2014 21: 46
              +1
              Quote: Cenij150814
              you know the word degeneration !!

              It’s good that this does not threaten you, because there is nowhere else to go!
              1. Cenij150814
                Cenij150814 13 September 2014 22: 10
                0
                Quote: Bayonet
                It’s good that this does not threaten you, because there is nowhere else to go!

                Your comments addressed to me are painfully of the same type, I have doubts if you are a bot ?? I mean your comment, which unfortunately was deleted along with mine!
        2. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 21: 28
          +3
          Quote: Cenij150814

          Interestingly, interestingly Czechs so disliked the Jews under Stalin, because they say he was also one of the "elite" you happen to not know ?? winkedYes, and Lenin is a child of Israel !! I’m silent about Marx yes

          How do I know why. For example, in the Stalin government during the Second World War, there were 4 Jewish People's Commissars, Jews massively served in foreign intelligence, worked in the atomic project, showed themselves quite worthy during the war years and nevertheless, from 1949, everyday anti-Semitism was transferred to the state level.
          As for Mr. Stalin, judging by the church books of the Kurdish, those born and died in the city of Gori were recorded, 150 years before his birth, neither his father nor his mother had Jewish relatives.
          Mr. Lenin’s mother, indeed, his grandfather was a baptized Jew, but since his Jewish origin in the Republic of Ingushetia did not add any advantages, this was apparently hushed up. At least in the autobiography of Anna Ilyinichna it was indicated that the ancestors of her mother were baptized Scots.
          Mr. Marx’s grandfather was indeed a rabbi, but his father was baptized and left Jewry. At least Mr. Marx wrote extremely negatively about Jews. I recommend reading.
          1. Cenij150814
            Cenij150814 13 September 2014 21: 45
            +1
            Quote: Aron Zaavi
            How do I know why.

            Shaw, even no versions crying and for the rest of the note, I didn’t say anything, I’m so by the way, nevertheless, thanks for the excursion into history, so to speak. And books and more, you and I understand "History is written by great people and rewrite small "and vice versa laughing
  24. STALGRAD76
    STALGRAD76 13 September 2014 20: 42
    +3
    Heroic grandfather soldier
  25. samoletil18
    samoletil18 13 September 2014 22: 57
    +1
    There is such a profession - journalism. From a hero-winner can make a Zionist, just like that, if only printed.
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 23: 22
      +2
      Quote: samoletil18
      There is such a profession - journalism. From a hero-winner can make a Zionist, just like that, if only printed.

      I will tell you a secret, a Jew living in Israel, regardless of his desire, is a Zionist, for Zionism is a political movement that aims to gather all Jews in Israel.
      1. Cenij150814
        Cenij150814 13 September 2014 23: 37
        0
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        the purposeful assembly of all Jews in Israel.

        Our dear ones, that we (I) can do something to help you in this good deed soldier
        1. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 13 September 2014 23: 46
          +4
          Quote: Cenij150814
          Quote: Aron Zaavi
          the purposeful assembly of all Jews in Israel.

          Our dear ones, that we (I) can do something to help you in this good deed soldier

          How can I tell you? The safer and more attractive Israel will be for Jews, the faster those who feel themselves to be Jews, and there are those who, being Jewish by origin, for various reasons do not feel themselves Jews, will move to "Eretz Israel".
          1. Cenij150814
            Cenij150814 14 September 2014 00: 01
            -4
            Quote: Aron Zaavi
            How can I tell you? The safer and more attractive Israel will be for Jews, the faster those who feel themselves to be Jews, and there are those who, being Jewish by origin, for various reasons do not feel themselves Jews, will move to "Eretz Israel".

            Guys, what are you like little, you have an eternal war there, and you and I perfectly understand that Muslims will bend their line, today the "iron bath" saves you, and tomorrow, they also do not sit still, you must admit this is a utopia, of course, if anyone some of you, well, you understand thatrepeat so, not one "healthy" Jew will come to you for permanent residence, I will say more, I generally expect that you will crawl to the whole cohort well, for example, to the Crimea, but how do you?
            1. Aaron Zawi
              Aaron Zawi 14 September 2014 00: 39
              +4
              Funny. :-))
      2. Wheel
        Wheel 13 September 2014 23: 48
        -1
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        The purpose of the meeting is all Jews in Israel.

        And this is nothing that some Jews categorically do not want to gather in Israel?
        This is so, by the way ...
        And in the case, Zionism is a form of fascism, by and large (and, by and large, too). Not?
        1. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 14 September 2014 00: 46
          +3
          Quote: Wheel

          And this is nothing that some Jews categorically do not want to gather in Israel?
          This is so, by the way ...
          And in the case, Zionism is a form of fascism, by and large (and, by and large, too). Not?

          Well, of course. Therefore, some Jews are assimilating, some are moving to Israel, and some are leaving for religious orthodoxy and simply being fenced off from the modern world.
          Compare Zionism with fascism is nonsense. Well, why don’t you read the book on Zionism and don’t use Google?
          Well, at least this http://www.eleven.co.il/article/13819
          1. padded jacket
            padded jacket 14 September 2014 12: 19
            0
            Well then, for example, you can compare Zionism and National Socialism.
            So probably it will be more accurate?
          2. Wheel
            Wheel 14 September 2014 20: 46
            +2
            Quote: Aron Zaavi
            Well, of course. Therefore, some Jews are assimilating, some are moving to Israel, and some are leaving for religious orthodoxy and simply being fenced off from the modern world.
            Compare Zionism with fascism is nonsense. Well, why don’t you read the book on Zionism and don’t use Google?
            Well, at least this is http://www.eleven.co.il/article/13819

            Taki, I understand that every sandpiper praises its swamp, there’s no escape from this.
            On the other hand, because of the trees, the forest is often not visible, in the sense that in order to see the forest it is necessary to move a certain distance, it is more visible from the side.
            I am quite familiar with the theory of Zionism, and since the person is completely not interested, therefore I can judge fairly impartially.
            So, I think that it will be difficult for you to refute that the movement is nationalistic.
            Further, we note in parentheses that, by definition, Jew = Jew and vice versa, with the exception of the Hera. In principle, any individual, if desired and persevering, can go through a giyur and become a hero, even if he was at least an Eskimo, even a Papuan, it means little to men, but the children of a woman conceived and born after the rite are already full-fledged Jews.
            A small but important fact - nationality (?) Is determined by faith.
            Yeah, I almost forgot, the rite of circumcision is obligatory for men who have proved their Jewishness and have arrived in Israel. The end of the brackets.
            So, if Jewry is defined by Judaism, then it will not be superfluous to recall some of the tenets of faith, namely, that Jews are God's chosen people, and all the rest are the so-called goyim.
            Tell you who the goyim are and what they are for? I think that you know it better than me, since you absorbed this with your mother’s milk.
            Summarize.
            A nationalist movement based on the idea of ​​racial superiority and setting the task of world domination in the future.
            Find differences from fascism.

            Something like that.
  26. goryacheff2013
    goryacheff2013 14 September 2014 06: 24
    -4
    Quote: revnagan
    Equalize between Lenin and Mussolini? Communism and Nazism? Shame. Moreover, for a Jew. But there were plenty of brave people everywhere, both among us and the Germans.

    I would definitely put it. One GMO.