Military Review

Mistral: file of a problem contract

70
French weekly magazine “Le Nouvel Observateur” last week published interesting material by Vincent Javert (Vincent Jauvert), entitled “Mistral: enquête sur un contrat qui dérange”. AST Center offers our readers to familiarize themselves with the translation of this article.

Mistral: file of a problem contract

Photo: Frank Perry, AFP


The pride of the French shipbuilding is the two Mistral-type DKVDs ordered by Russia during the Sarkozy presidency today more than ever put the current French President Francois Hollande in the awkward position.

5 July this year, Francois Hollande invited Barack Obama to the famous Parisian restaurant "Chiberta", located near the Champs Elysees. The meeting was held in a warm and friendly atmosphere at one of the best tables in the city. The next day, both presidents went to celebrations to mark the Allied landings in Normandy - to celebrate and consolidate the US-French friendship. However, a small mess smeared the festive picture a bit. "These damn Mistrali," as one of the representatives of the Elysian Palace put it. The two Mistral-type DKVDs, the contract for which was signed with Moscow under Sarkozy, and which, as the current President of France, Mr. Hollande hopes, will be fully implemented by next spring.

“This question is bothering me,” Obama begins pursing his lips. “After the annexation of the Crimea, this would be a bad signal. Why not give up on this deal? ”

“Because I don’t want to doubt the signature of the French state,” Hollande obviously tensely retorted.

On Monday, July 28, in the Elysee Palace again there was a stir. And again about the two helicopter carriers. 11 days after the crash of the Malaysian Boeing in the skies over the South-East of Ukraine, the Europeans tried to agree on new sanctions against Russia. Throwing lightning, the representatives of Germany demanded that Brussels completely ban the supply of military goods to Russia, including already existing contracts. Including two notorious "Mistral".

However, Laurent Fabius (Loran Fabius) did not yield to his German counterpart Steinmeier during the diplomatic squabble: “We will not change our decision,” the Frenchman snapped.

“You still have to, not today is tomorrow,” said Steinmeier, also not wanting to give in. As a result, the commission banned only the conclusion of new contracts, leaving the existing ones in force. “Damn Mistrali” saved. At least for a while.

The French victory in this matter is rather fragile. The point is not only in the USA and Germany. All, or almost all the allies of France, demanded to put an end to the supply of Mistral in the Russian Federation. According to a source close to the administration of Hollande: "We treat this transaction as a burden." France has not experienced such international pressure since the renewal of the nuclear program in 1995. As a high-ranking French official noted: “On this issue we are constantly on the alert. They attack us from everywhere. ”

3 June, the Polish Foreign Minister, said sharply: “When one country seizes the territory of a neighboring country by force, this is clearly not the best time to supply such complex weapons systems to it.”

July 21, British Prime Minister David Cameron (David Cameron) expressed the opinion that today the supply of "Mistral" to Russia is simply "unthinkable."

29 July, the Minister of Defense of Japan expressed doubt that Russia will not use the new DKVD in the Kuril Islands. “Stop this deal,” he demanded from his French colleague, Jean-Yves Le Drian.

31 July, the most influential publication in the world - The New York Times has published killer material. According to the publication, in the question of the postaka "Mistral" in the Russian Federation is at stake "the honor of France."

Weak consolation: the opposition in Paris is silent. And for good reason! The helicopter carrier contract was concluded between 2008 and 2011 for years when she was in power. Three comrades from the Union for the Popular Movement Party (UMP) - Sarkozy, Fillon and Juppe (Sarkozy, Fillon et Juppé) - gave the deal a green light. Even the Union of Democrats and Independent (UDI) is associated with the Russian contract, because the initiator of the process was none other than Herve Morin (Hervé Morin) - the then Minister of Defense. “Yes, I initiated this deal, and I have no regrets,” he says today. Only Bernard Kouchner (Bernard Kouchner), who at that time served as Minister of Foreign Affairs, now seems to be experiencing remorse. In Nouvel Observateur, he put it in his typical manner: “We made a mistake, but with the best of intentions.”

"I am interested in this ship!"

"French doctor" is right. History This extremely controversial deal boils down to the fact that Nicolas Sarkozy made erroneous strategic stakes, or even made criminal short-sightedness.

It all started almost 6 years ago, at the end of October 2008, at Euronaval in Le Bourget. Admiral V.S. Vysotsky, who was then commander-in-chief of the Russian Navy, approached the DCNS stand, pointed to the layout of a Mistral-type DKVD and told a company representative: “I am interested in this ship!”.

It was a stupor. Since 1945, Moscow has not bought warships abroad, and even more so from a NATO country, a potential enemy. Why would such a sudden and surprising interest?

-In connection with the war in Georgia, which took place three months earlier, explained in Moscow one of the most authoritative independent experts on the Russian army, a former Soviet officer, Alexander Golts.

“At the beginning of the conflict, the Russian command ordered an landing operation on the Georgian coast. However, the operation took ... five days, and they arrived when it was all over. So the idea arose to acquire a faster landing ship, similar to the Mistral, which our shipyards unfortunately were not able to build. ”

In fact, the Mistral type DKVD is an excellent tool for modern wars. Its characteristics make it the most impressive French vessel. fleet after the aircraft carrier Charles de Gaulle. At 199 meters in length, it can transport (relatively quickly and hundreds of kilometers) 450 foot soldiers, 16 helicopters, 70 armored vehicles, two operational units and a full headquarters. At the same time, managing a fleet of several ships, using electronic means of the latest generation. As one of the senior officers of the French Navy put it: "This is the pearl of French military technology."

“Imagine the outbreak of brutal violence against the Russian-speaking minority in Estonia. Thanks to the Mistral, our Navy will be able to deliver a sufficient number of infantrymen or helicopters in a matter of hours in order to protect the Russian people there. ”

Scenario, strangely reminiscent of very recent events in Ukraine. “Yes, we could use Mistrals in the Crimea,” says AST Center Director, Ruslan Pukhov. In the year 2008, when the Russian admiral expressed interest in acquiring the DKVD, the French authorities either could not or did not want to imagine such prospects.

"Despite the war in Georgia, Sarkozy decided to concentrate fully on building relations with Moscow," believes France's former Secretary of State for European Affairs, Pierre Lellouche. “He believed that Russian President Dmitry Medvedev was a kind of new Gorbachev.” Sarkozy took on too much, telling his associates that “Russian civilizes”. He wanted to attract them, he wanted to start a friendship.

Geostrategic rate

At a conference in Munich in February 2009, the head struck everyone even more when, just a few months after the “invasion of Russian troops in Georgia,” he said: “A country with so many demographic problems [like Russia] is not capable of spontaneous military aggression in respect of their neighbors. "

Naivety, cynicism or blindness? Meanwhile, Sarkozy is not the only representative of the French authorities who wanted to move closer to Moscow with leaps and bounds. The Prime Minister of his government, François Fillon, in November 2008 of the year stated that “Russia is now a democratic state.” Among his closest associates are also two serious Russian-speaking figures: Jean de Boishue and Igor Mitrofanov - very active backstage figures in relations with Moscow.

“They all wanted to revive the spirit of the Russian-French alliance of the 1892 model of the year,” recalls Pierre Lellouche. "Especially since he [Sarkozy] had to catch up on the Russian market, where the Germans and Italians were far ahead." The geostrategic bid was made and justified by a large commercial appetite.

Discussions about the supply of “Mistral” to Russia have been going on since the summer of 2009. However, it is only now that strong opposition from opponents of this deal appears in the corridors of power in Paris. One of them is Admiral Javier Petard (Xavier Païtard), who headed the defense cabinet Hervé Morin. “I agreed to take a step towards Russia, but why start with military cooperation, and also so sensitive technologies?” He recalls today. Is it even possible to offer such "toys" to Moscow?

The catastrophic situation at the shipyard STX

At the end of September, 2009, disagreements within the government forced Sarkozy to convene a narrow council to make a decision. In the green hall of the Elysian Palace gathered the main actors of this project. Two of them entered the heated debate: the Minister of Defense and the presidential adviser on defense - Admiral Edouard Guillaud.

“Let's move away from the thinking of the times of the Cold War. We cannot want to get close to Russia without giving it confidence. In any case, the Russian Navy is today in such a state that if they have one ship more or less it will not change the strategic balance of power. ”, Recalls Evre Morin (Hervé Morin). In addition, he added, the catastrophic situation at the San Nazaire shipyard. The shipyard's order book is desperately empty. Morin also noted that the refusal to supply Russia with the Mistrali would have been even more unfair compared to other countries, in particular Spain and the Netherlands, which were offered to purchase the same ships.

Admiral Gillot’s turn came, who, like many senior officers, especially naval officers, was strongly opposed to this contract. “Yes, Russia plays a significant role in the fate of Europe,” he said. “But what do we know about the future of this country? How will she change in four years when we will have to give her the "pearl" of French military equipment? Is it not irresponsible to take such a risk for a permanent member of the UN Security Council? The question that today, after years of 5, resonates strangely ...

And then, continued Guyot, what kind of signal will we send to our Eastern partners, with whom we want to create a truly safe Europe and who always see Russia as their main enemy? “In the end, since San Nazaire is experiencing enormous difficulties, then why don't we place an order for the Mistral for the French Navy before it is planned in the military spending program?”

Then Francois Fillon joined: "This is impossible because it will cost too much for the country." And the president decided in favor of the Morin-Fillon line.

Put, without technology transfer?

France will agree to sell the ships, but legally promised not to transfer sensitive technologies. This is a fundamentally unchanged position. Since the announcement of plans to sell Mistral, many countries have been among the opponents of this deal, and now they are actively trying to convince Paris to cancel the contract. The United States acts as the press secretary of Poland and the Baltic countries. In November 2009, Senator McCain and five of his colleagues wrote to the French ambassador in Washington: “We fear that agreeing to such a deal would give Russia reason to believe that France supports its increasingly militant and criminal actions.”

Later, several State Department emissaries secretly came to Paris. In February 2010, Erve Morin received Secretary of State for Defense Robert Gates. The American repeated: “Such a deal can send the wrong signals to Russia and our allies in central and eastern Europe.” Especially when France is the guarantor of the agreement between Moscow and Tbilisi, which Russia does not respect, it does not fulfill its obligations. During a joint press conference with Vladimir Putin, then Prime Minister, Fillon said that the possible refusal to sell Mistral "is based on reflexes that no longer have anything to do with reality."

In March, 2010, at the opening ceremony of the Russia-France year, Nicolas Sarkozy said that “exclusive negotiations” would soon begin on the sale of Mistral to Russia.

“Mistral” is a symbol of trust between our countries, Dmitry Medvedev said during the ceremony.

But behind the scenes, the French military diplomatic apparatus continued to resist. Let's put the ships, well, but naked, that is, without armament (there are not so many of them on the Mistral,) and, most importantly, without electronic equipment.

Russia raises the stakes

Obviously to convince Moscow the French did not work. In July, 2010, Chief of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, Army General Nikolai Makarov, said that Russia agreed to acquire “only ships fully equipped,” or would refuse the deal. Negotiations were frozen. To renew them, Nicolas Sarkozy hastily and secretly sent his new military adviser, General Puga, to Kaliningrad, to meet with real Russian negotiator Igor Sechin, Putin’s close friend. The French agreed to supply sophisticated equipment, including the Senit 9 combat control system with radars and communication systems developed by Thales. And that is not all.

As one of the best experts of the question stated: “Since the Russians understand that we absolutely want to sell these ships, they will continue to raise the rates.” They demanded that the stern of the hull of the first ship be built in St. Petersburg, and not in Saint-Nazaire. And again the French made concessions.

However, the Russians again wanted more. They demanded the transfer of technology, not only technical information on the construction of the DKVD, but also the technologies of sensitive electronic systems, which is contrary to the decision of the aforementioned council adopted in September 2009. Nicolas Sarkozy, who dreamed of announcing agreement until the end of the year Russia-France, hastily conceded. He also needed a positive decision from the interdepartmental committee that consents to export sales of weapons (CIEEMG). Getting this approval could take some time. Especially when you consider that it included many opponents of the sale of “Mistral”.

Agreement of 25 January 2011 of the year

In the Elysee Palace came up with a trick to speed up the process. An ad hoc committee was created that was to prepare and obtain consent from the CIEEMG in a very short time. In addition to this document, it was also necessary to obtain approval from the board of directors of DCNS, which was assembled at the December 13 special meeting of December 2010. Then an extremely rare occurrence occurred - union representatives (from CFDT) stated that of course this contract is vital for the shipyard, but they are worried about the “risks associated with technology transfer” and intend to refrain from supporting it.

However, the new proposal was accepted, and December 24 Dmitry Medvedev called Nicolas Sarkozy to announce that since the conditions of Russia were accepted, Russia agrees to buy two Mistrals made in France, and is also ready to buy 2 as part of the option the same ship, despite the fact that the last two will be built at Russian shipyards. Next, on January 25, 2011, an intergovernmental agreement was signed, signed by Igor Sechin and Alain Juppé, who took office as Minister of Defense after Herve Moreno. At the ceremony in San Nazaire, the creator of the UMP proudly stated:

Mistral is the most important project in this area ever implemented by Russia or another Eastern European country. ”

The commercial contract was pompously ratified by 17 June 2011 of the year in Moscow. The cost of two DKVD type "Mistral" amounted to 1,2 billion euros. Delivery of the first DKVD "Vladivostok" was scheduled for October 2014.

At the foot of the wall

That's all. Everything for this conflicting delivery is ready. Even last fall, the ship was quietly consecrated by an Orthodox priest in Saint Nazaire. In February, work was carried out on the basis of the Russian Navy in Vladivostok to prepare the location of the DKVD. At the end of June - four hundred Russian sailors arrived in Saint-Nazaire to learn how to operate a ship.

What will Francois Hollande do in September when it comes to making a decision on issuing a final export license and allowing him to sail to Russia? For some time, the position of France on this issue "swam". 18 March, the day Moscow officially annexed the Crimea, Laurent Fabius announced that France "plans" to suspend the supply. But the Ministries of Defense and Finance immediately fought, as did the Prime Minister. And this is not surprising because Saint-Nazaire is a stronghold of Jean-Marc Ayrault.

"Reputation of France"

The process cannot be reversed, they assure in chorus, putting forward two main arguments. First, the French side, in case of refusal to fulfill the contract, will have to pay Moscow a fortune. The amount already announced by the Russians amounts to 800 million euros, plus a penalty in the amount of 251 million euros.

Second, France will lose its reputation as a reliable partner in the arms market.

According to a high-ranking French official: “There is no good way out of the situation. Either we supply the Mistrals to Russia and we are accused of aiding Putin, or we do not supply ships and then they will say that France has caved in under the Americans. ”It remains only to decide which of the two evils is still the least.
Originator:
http://periscope2.ru/2014/08/15/8218/
70 comments
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  1. Koloradovatnik
    Koloradovatnik 19 August 2014 14: 54
    +10
    If Paris does not deliver Mistral to us, is it ready to pay a penalty of 1,5 billion €?
    1. Dazdranagon
      Dazdranagon 19 August 2014 14: 56
      +17
      Quote: Colorado
      then he is ready to pay a penalty of 1,5 billion €
      - on which we will order the ships! laughing
      1. PeaceByForce
        PeaceByForce 19 August 2014 15: 06
        +10
        Moreover, they have already given all the documentation.
        1. AVV
          AVV 19 August 2014 22: 37
          0
          If you do not fulfill the agreement, then you must sacrifice something, reputation and money, or State friendship !!!
      2. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 19 August 2014 15: 34
        +8
        Quote: Dazdranagon
        - on which we will order the ships!
        This money is virtual, and they will allow us to return it to Russia only in the form of bananas. laughing
        Upstairs (with us) they cannot but understand this. But then, why not upgrade the fishing fleet with this money? I don’t want to buy civil equipment for the most part? Green paper (embedded in other American papers) we do not need. Something material is needed.
        Although it may be that they started to do it, Dobrolet concluded a contract for the purchase of Boeing. But this must be done in parallel with the development of its capacities, and not instead. hi
      3. subbtin.725
        subbtin.725 19 August 2014 15: 53
        +10
        Quote: Dazdranagon
        on which we will order ships at our place!

        Rogozin said that with this money, we will build ourselves, as many as 4 ships, only with an even more reinforced hull; we already have the technology. So, Frenchmen, choose the first option.
      4. andrereu74
        andrereu74 19 August 2014 18: 05
        +1
        I'm all for it!!!!!
    2. Момент
      Момент 19 August 2014 14: 58
      +13
      Poor France, this is how everyone gets killed on Mistral shipments to Russia. Issue, and the contract is a contract.
      And honestly got with these Mistrals.
      1. max2215
        max2215 19 August 2014 15: 15
        +7
        France spoils, always had its opinion and did not bend under the mattresses, alas, it seems that nature is resting on the grandchildren of Charles De Gaulle .....
      2. Bastion ammur
        Bastion ammur 19 August 2014 18: 09
        0
        How poor they are. Friendship-friendship (and very dubious) and money apart, who else needs these ships except for us (although also questionable)? Americans? So they have enough of their own pieces of iron, they no longer know where to fuse them, they give out to everyone in a row. Who is from the euro union? So they have a "vegetable boom" there, they have no time for ships now. Therefore, all this hype is inflated only for one thing - self-promotion.
    3. armageddon
      armageddon 19 August 2014 15: 06
      +3
      Hmm ... Forfeit is certainly good ... But when they throw it, you can’t forgive !!! The matter is already about the prestige of Russia !!! And I think the French government understands this very well !!!
    4. spec.78
      spec.78 19 August 2014 15: 06
      +2
      That's just the penalty Paris to pay and is not ready. Everything else, such as the honor of France and blah blah blah, lyrics
    5. spec.78
      spec.78 19 August 2014 15: 10
      +4
      That's just the penalty France is not ready to pay. Everything else, such as the honor of France and stuff, lyrics. I recognize friends of mattresses ..... so load the budget of France smile wages to the workers have already been paid, metal and other has been spent, the technical documentation has been handed over and the penalty must be paid. Such a budget can not stand France wink
    6. Giant thought
      Giant thought 19 August 2014 15: 11
      +3
      On top of that, France will lose its good reputation as an arms supplier, which will subsequently affect the non-conclusion of multi-billion dollar contracts with other countries with it, that the losses from breaking the Mistral contract will look scanty.
      1. kodxnumx
        kodxnumx 19 August 2014 16: 26
        0
        It seems to me that the French would gladly exchange the allies with the United States, for example, Russia! We must move in this direction! And everything will be fine, the French know the Russians do not surrender their allies, but the United States has done this more than once in the short term of its existence!
    7. cap54
      cap54 19 August 2014 15: 48
      +2
      then the French economy, if it does not crash, then stumbles for a long time and will limp on both legs for the rest of its life!
    8. ajsRA
      ajsRA 19 August 2014 17: 55
      0
      Gentlemen, in the legislation of the parties to the agreement there is such a thing as "force majeure". If the EU, of which France is a member, imposes a ban on the supply of all types of weapons, and the FR, in this regard, will not be able to fulfill the contract, then it is likely that it will not pay fines.
      It seems to me that the main thing in this matter is still the business reputation of the FR, and not the monetary issue. Or maybe someone roughly holds the FR for kokushki :) Well, or FR sincerely counts on the Russian Federation.
    9. gav6757
      gav6757 19 August 2014 18: 51
      +1
      Well, and who will win?
      Pragmatic Reshel or greedy Mazarin ???
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. PeaceByForce
    PeaceByForce 19 August 2014 14: 57
    +4
    The commission decided that the Saka war began. What kind of aggression in Georgia are they talking about?
  4. kostyan77708
    kostyan77708 19 August 2014 14: 58
    0
    Quote: Colorado
    If Paris does not deliver Mistral to us, is it ready to pay a penalty of 1,5 billion €?

    let the penalty be paid better, it’s not warm from these boxes, it’s not cold .... we will build better ships for ourselves with this money, provided that they (the money) go where necessary!
    1. vitamin ky
      vitamin ky 19 August 2014 15: 17
      +3
      here I am, an absolute zero in this matter (-explain on your fingers preferably) -the need for these boxes for the Russian fleet ??????????? all the same, educational program is useful hi
      1. fiodor
        fiodor 19 August 2014 16: 03
        +3
        hi Well, I think once ordered, it was thought at that moment that there was a need, the admirals seemed to know better, but now why argue whether it is necessary or not, drive the frog's goods, because it’s paid off, nobody canceled the cash-money relations. Well, or money in double volume for the failure of the contract.
        1. vitamin ky
          vitamin ky 19 August 2014 16: 13
          +1
          hi Well, I’m not talking about it. Actually, I’m talking about exploitation and about the need for target. Where and how?
          1. shuhartred
            shuhartred 19 August 2014 21: 45
            0
            Quote: vitamin-ky
            hi Well, I’m not talking about it. Actually, I’m talking about exploitation and about the need for target. Where and how?

            I think technology was needed, the ships themselves are secondary.
      2. Alex_34
        Alex_34 19 August 2014 16: 17
        +1
        Mistral is a kind of bribe to France for supporting our position in Georgia. They do not fit into our military doctrine. Expensive, slow-moving 18 knots. Range more than 10000 miles. where are we going to land at such a distance? and where in the Baltic Sea, where do you turn around? they need small fast-moving hovercrafts or shallow ones. and more. and so one successful hit and all.
        1. fairmen
          fairmen 19 August 2014 16: 43
          +2
          So I think so in 80 projects like WIG were frozen a very promising thing I think in vain refused the whole strategy of the Navy could be reviewed
  5. Dazdranagon
    Dazdranagon 19 August 2014 14: 59
    +4
    3 June, the Polish Foreign Minister, said sharply: “When one country seizes the territory of a neighboring country by force, this is clearly not the best time to supply such complex weapons systems to it.”
    July 21, British Prime Minister David Cameron (David Cameron) expressed the opinion that today the supply of "Mistral" to Russia is simply "unthinkable."
    29 July, the Minister of Defense of Japan expressed doubt that Russia will not use the new DKVD in the Kuril Islands. “Stop this deal,” he demanded from his French colleague, Jean-Yves Le Drian.
    - Potryndely and parted! Do not stop adult uncles from continuing their business! How nice to wipe your feet on the opinions of these countries! bully
  6. A1L9E4K9S
    A1L9E4K9S 19 August 2014 15: 00
    +1
    Well, gentlemen, it’s up to you to decide which option to choose, for us (Russia) it’s so good, and it’s not bad, decide, but it seems to me the first option is preferable to have friendship with Russia is worth a lot.
  7. skate
    skate 19 August 2014 15: 01
    0
    Sometimes they write that we don't need these Mistrals. So it won't be a big problem if the delivery is refused.
  8. Mooh
    Mooh 19 August 2014 15: 02
    +3
    Get the little article. And the Mistals were raspiarist on all the money and the RF crap, and France is all white and fluffy. they are, after all, these gentlemen, free journalism.
  9. Good cat
    Good cat 19 August 2014 15: 03
    +4
    Okay, don’t laugh at the French because of one sou they strangle themselves. What are the forfeits there? All will be handed over in time. If only Babama pays all the fines for them. Which is also doubtful.
  10. awg75
    awg75 19 August 2014 15: 03
    +2
    something tells me that they will eventually bend under pind @ owl anyway ...
  11. nachprod
    nachprod 19 August 2014 15: 04
    +12
    We really need these ships, but what we need most is technology. There were many disputes between supporters and opponents of the purchase, I will not accept either side, only the facts:
    1. These ships will not be superfluous to us.
    2. Buy or not buy, we got the technology, and maybe even a little start to catch up with the technology lost time in development lost in the dashing 90s.
    3. Factories in Russia received orders - this is experience, production updates and salaries.
    4. The marine doctrine will probably be revised based on the experience gained in owning such ships.

    Something like that.
  12. pinecone
    pinecone 19 August 2014 15: 04
    -1
    Since 1945, Moscow has not bought warships abroad, much less from a NATO country, a potential enemy.

    And in 1944. bought?
    1. Koloradovatnik
      Koloradovatnik 19 August 2014 15: 08
      +3
      Lend-Lease.
  13. isker
    isker 19 August 2014 15: 09
    +3
    And what is there to think, paddlers ?!
    Well this is what PR you - free then ?!
    Now you can spray snot in front of other customers - here, they say, how much the French side is reliable in terms of fulfilling the contract - even in the conditions of a possible 3rd world - we have fulfilled our part of the Agreement! Few people can do that now! ..
    So - roll up the sleeves of your frock coats and urgently set about building a second ship!
    And - wakes you up right now!
  14. shitovmg
    shitovmg 19 August 2014 15: 09
    0
    We win politically anyway. In the military, most likely, too, although success is dubious here.
  15. Pro100Igor
    Pro100Igor 19 August 2014 15: 10
    +7
    Jokes, jokes, but anything can be.
  16. Rubmolot
    Rubmolot 19 August 2014 15: 10
    +7
    Deciphering attitude in the EU
  17. Andriuha077
    Andriuha077 19 August 2014 15: 13
    -1
    http://topwar.ru/37288-mistral-sdul-kazaka.html
    December 15 2013
    And finally, another “surprise” from the “Mistral”, which can shed light on the fierce lobbying activities of Russian officials in favor of the French DCKD. At the end of September of this year, the next edition of the authoritative American directory "World War Fleets" was published. It indicates that for the French Navy, the average cost of each ship of the Mistral type was about 236 million Doll. This is very similar to the truth. French politicians were not at a loss when they convinced their NATO partners, dissatisfied with the deal between Paris and Moscow, that the Mistrals were just passenger ferries designed to transport troops and helicopters. French DVKD are really built according to civil standards. And the cost of civilian courts rarely exceeds 100 million dollars.

    In Russia, each ship, as you know, costs 600 million euros. For clarity, we recalculate 236 million dollars and 600 million euros to rubles at the exchange rate at the end of November. And this is what we get: one Mistral of the French Navy weighs nearly 8 billion rubles, and the Russian Navy more than 27 billion rubles. The difference is more than three times.
  18. HU YOUR
    HU YOUR 19 August 2014 15: 19
    +2
    Quote: PeaceByForce
    The commission decided that the Saka war began. What kind of aggression in Georgia are they talking about?

    The Russian Federation is to blame for everything, from the point of view of geypops. They have a brain like this (soul)
    Obama said that the Americans won the 2nd world. hi
  19. Berrick
    Berrick 19 August 2014 15: 23
    +13
    True 100%. Personal experience.
    Paris. Spring. May 2014
    Early morning, beauty, flowering parks and .....
    Blood Red Flags ANYWHERE !! Flags of China!
    Everywhere it means even in the Louvre and on all the main streets.
    Further worse.
    Blocked the entire center. The tourist buses were piled up and fellow tourists were in a dense ring of machine gunners.
    “What happened and how long will it be?” We ask the military.
    - The President of China has arrived. We will not know how much we will stand.
    The joyful guide explains to us.
    - Yes, you what! What a joy! He brought us the contracts. To Airbases and something else!

    As a result, for two days, Paris was under siege.
    Why am I doing this ??
    And to the fact that they are in Jo.E !! Economics in Jo.E! On the way from the Airport for 10 km there are slums as in Africa.
    They looked at China as manna from heaven, and here they would once again refuse to supply the Mistrals!
    It's ridiculous! Generally funny!

    The more I travel around the world, the more pulls us home !!!
    1. Captain45
      Captain45 20 August 2014 19: 55
      0
      Quote: Berrik
      The more I travel around the world, the more pulls us home !!!

      Stirlitz bent over the globe. He VOMOTED home! Joke! lol
  20. Thompson
    Thompson 19 August 2014 15: 25
    +5
    interesting other, quote-“At the beginning of the conflict, the Russian command ordered an operation to land on the Georgian coast. However, the operation took ... five days, and they arrived when it was all over. So the idea arose of acquiring a faster landing ship, similar to the Mistral, “Imagine an outbreak of brutal violence against a Russian-speaking minority in Estonia. Thanks to Mistral, our Navy will be able to deliver a sufficient number of infantrymen or helicopters in a few hours to protect Russian people there. ”
    But interestingly, but for what purposes in general did they plan and build these ships themselves? Sparrow drive? Or, as always according to theirs, in the event of an outbreak of violence in Chad or Ghana, can the Mistrals use it there, but we can’t use it anywhere else? And huh huh not hoho. And without the Mistral we have you! We’ll ask you with your blades and bayonets!
  21. Xroft
    Xroft 19 August 2014 15: 25
    +4
    It was interesting to read. In the end, what about the technological filling? and Vladivostok and Sevastopol will be in full "stuffing"? Especially the senit 9 system will be installed and the Russian Federation will receive a license for it?
    1. Andriuha077
      Andriuha077 19 August 2014 16: 02
      +1
      Quote: Xroft
      license to it?


      A representative of Rosoboronpostavka told RIA Novosti that the government procurement portal contains information on a tender for the supply of the Sigma-E combat information and control system (BIUS) sets, which they plan to equip the Sevastopol landing ship with.

      SENIT-9 is focused on interaction with ships, aircraft, ground forces НАТО.

      In order to use, one would have to transfer all our Armed Forces to this NATO systemthat will result in such an amount that the country will not raise in the next 20 years.

      Where? What for? For what? As an EW target?
      1. g1v2
        g1v2 19 August 2014 17: 01
        +3
        Enemy technology is not always bought in order to use, but also to learn how to resist it or to create your own on its basis. Previously, we drove intelligence to obtain technology, but now we can buy peacefully.
  22. Seva
    Seva 19 August 2014 15: 28
    +3
    Europeans lack rigidity in managing their countries. In the face of some politico-democratic-prostitute frictions ... One word geyropa)))
  23. tol100v
    tol100v 19 August 2014 15: 29
    +1
    France is in the classic WILK! And since the question is money, the Mistrals will be ours, although according to the statements of the Navy experts they are not really needed! So the Russian Federation is in the black here: either ships, or money with compensation! And where they will look for them, the Russian Federation should not concern!
  24. K-50
    K-50 19 August 2014 15: 30
    +4
    “Imagine the outbreak of brutal violence against the Russian-speaking minority in Estonia. Thanks to the Mistral, our Navy will be able to deliver a sufficient number of infantrymen or helicopters in a matter of hours in order to protect the Russian people there. ”
    The author, and that Estonia and I have no land border, that we must sail there on a ship? wassat
    1. 97110
      97110 19 August 2014 17: 45
      +1
      Quote: K-50
      what you need to go there exactly on the ship to sail

      Dear K-50. In Russian they swim: 1. A flower in an ice-hole, 2. crew for ... years. They go to Estonia and Ukraine by ships. Regarding the presence of a land border. I remember well how we were driven from the Gomel region in a terrible rush to the Chernobyl nuclear power plant. With a course of 18 knots and there is no need to look for the keys to the park, which went to dinner with an outfit, the steamer is more convenient. And if you also consider that roads are not everywhere on the land, landing sites are not everywhere, and the facilities for the headquarters are so completely absent (comparable) - to Estonia only "Mistral".
  25. mamont5
    mamont5 19 August 2014 15: 32
    +2
    “There is no good way out of the situation. Either we supply Mistrals to Russia and we are accused of aiding Putin, or we do not supply ships and then they will say that France has caved in under the Americans. ”It remains only to decide which of the two evils is still the lesser."

    Think gentlemen of the French. You decide. And to us ... And so good, and that way - not bad.
  26. Matrosov
    Matrosov 19 August 2014 15: 37
    +2
    For a long time the French have not been put in such a position that even such an experienced "courtesan" as the Fifth Republic has a hard time. Honestly, I just want to say: "Return with money!"
  27. Mama_Cholli
    Mama_Cholli 19 August 2014 15: 43
    +1
    It seems that someone on this resource claimed that ships of the Mistral type are not adapted for operations in ice conditions.
    Then their use for the "normalization" of relations between the natives and the Russian-speaking population, for example, in sprat (as indicated in the article) turns out to be a big question. How then, or rather where to use them, even if the Black Sea is seasonal?
    1. 97110
      97110 19 August 2014 17: 55
      0
      Mommy. Well, have mercy. The setting is ICE. The population is Russian speaking. There is no ice belt on the absolute majority of ships and ships (I could be wrong here) sailing in the Baltic, the Far East and the Black and Caspian Seas. (They really do "float" here). How are they used? Is there an ice belt on the ships of the Northern Fleet? By the way Murmansk - nonfreezing port. I believe that adding a few hundred tons of cladding and a set to the ship’s hull will result in an icebreaker, that is, a ship.
  28. azbukin77
    azbukin77 19 August 2014 15: 54
    +3
    Quote: Berrik
    True 100%. Personal experience.
    Paris. Spring. May 2014
    Early morning, beauty, flowering parks and .....
    Blood Red Flags ANYWHERE !! Flags of China!
    Everywhere it means even in the Louvre and on all the main streets.
    Further worse.
    Blocked the entire center. The tourist buses were piled up and fellow tourists were in a dense ring of machine gunners.
    “What happened and how long will it be?” We ask the military.
    - The President of China has arrived. We will not know how much we will stand.
    The joyful guide explains to us.
    - Yes, you what! What a joy! He brought us the contracts. To Airbases and something else!

    As a result, for two days, Paris was under siege.
    Why am I doing this ??
    And to the fact that they are in Jo.E !! Economics in Jo.E! On the way from the Airport for 10 km there are slums as in Africa.
    They looked at China as manna from heaven, and here they would once again refuse to supply the Mistrals!
    It's ridiculous! Generally funny!

    The more I travel around the world, the more pulls us home !!!
    Generally stopped riding, I scorn the geyevropu. Great advantage.
  29. Anchonsha
    Anchonsha 19 August 2014 16: 02
    +1
    Yes, far from a controversial question for Hollande: to refuse the supply of the Mistrals means to lose face in business - many people will think about the unreliability of the agreement before dealing with France. In another case, increased friction with the United States. You always need to do what is beneficial for the country and in its interests.
  30. faterdom
    faterdom 19 August 2014 16: 16
    +2
    This cannot but make the same German business angry, which also had contracts for the supply of military and even space equipment - yes, sanctions!
    But the Germans are not Italians or French ... there will not be so much noise, but some negative decisions for Merkel and her CDU will be made and will be purposefully implemented.
  31. Wiruz
    Wiruz 19 August 2014 16: 16
    +2
    Mistral is good. But another thing interests me: when will the flag be raised above Ivan Gren?
  32. Vitalka
    Vitalka 19 August 2014 16: 20
    +1
    ”It remains only to decide which of the two evils is still the lesser

    On x.u. is it a trough of the Russian Navy? The point is not in the size of evil, but in its quality and in relation, again, to whom. There is the "Evil Empire" - the USSR, well, now we are the Russian Federation (successor), well, we have annexed Crimea (I think they have carried out restitution! The West is hurt and offended (Why do they need Ruin now?) - we will still be the "Evil Empire." Lies. "One dog, what is it worth. Let the Storage go to liars and double-dealing. Is this a trough of the Russian Navy?
    By the way, what about the Boeing? Where is Parashkin's request to declare the state that brought him down "terrorist"? It is high time to talk about zhovto-blakit impudent muzzle.
  33. fairmen
    fairmen 19 August 2014 16: 38
    +1
    “There is no good way out of the situation. Either we deliver the Mistral to Russia and we are accused of aiding Putin, or we don’t deliver the ships and then they will say that France caved in under the Americans. It remains only to decide which of the two evils is the lesser.

    - Well, let's say they caved in under the amerikosov for a long time. Well, at least once, we would be glad for ourselves that we did something good and helped honest people. Not all the time we help them, because we donated the aircraft of the Normania Neman squadron on which they fought, so take the money and be happy for Russia.
  34. Bolivar
    Bolivar 19 August 2014 16: 40
    +2
    The Americans persuaded the Saudis to buy the contract for the Mistals, and the Russians stole the contract in place with the car :-) :-) :-)
  35. thinker
    thinker 19 August 2014 16: 44
    +2
    “It remains only to decide which of the two evils is the lesser.

    Popular wisdom says: "A good neighbor is better than a distant relative."
  36. pinecone
    pinecone 19 August 2014 18: 51
    0
    Quote: Colorado
    Lend-Lease.


    Lend-lease purchases and supplies are not the same thing. I advise you to familiarize yourself with the content of the "Lend-Lease Act", passed by the US Congress on March 11, 1941.
  37. skeptic2999
    skeptic2999 19 August 2014 20: 55
    +1
    The French leadership was in a difficult situation. Tear apart political and economic interests. They need to sympathize, not flock. Let's stay human.
  38. SIROP73
    SIROP73 19 August 2014 21: 59
    0
    Quote: Armagedon
    armageddon (2) Today, 15:06 ↑
    Hmm ... Forfeit is certainly good ... But when they throw it, you can’t forgive !!! The matter is already about the prestige of Russia !!! And I think the French government understands this very well !!!

    The problem is that Russia will wait for this penalty and the return of money already paid for several years or decades. Claims in European courts, appeals and other tyagomotin will begin. So Mistral is better now than a billion in ten years. And whether the Navy needs it or not is already the tenth matter - bought, then it should be taken. Where they’ll come up with it.
  39. Drunya
    Drunya 19 August 2014 23: 35
    0
    Ukrainian Foreign Ministry: Kiev is concerned about France's decision to transfer Mistral to Russia

    19.08.2014/18/05 XNUMX:XNUMX, Kiev
    Ukraine is concerned about France's decision to transfer the Mistral aircraft carriers to the Russian Federation, Yevgeny Perebiynis, director of the information policy department of the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry, said on Tuesday.
    “We are convinced that, given the current foreign policy context, the transfer of powerful offensive weapons to Russia, which are the Mistral-class amphibious assault ships, could have negative consequences for security and stability in Europe,” the director of the Information Policy Department said.
    According to the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry, the appearance at Russia's disposal of ships of the Mistral type will radically change the balance of forces in the Black Sea basin. Kiev expects France to take measures aimed at stopping the supply of Mistral-class ships to Russia, Perebiinis concluded.
    1. Captain45
      Captain45 20 August 2014 19: 59
      0
      Quote: Dryuya
      Ukraine is concerned about France's decision to transfer the Mistral aircraft carriers to the Russian Federation, Yevhen Perebiynis, director of the information policy department of the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry, said on Tuesday.

      That really who would be silent in a rag! A submarine in the steppes of Ukraine is an old bearded anecdote. It would be better to attend to their own problem. "Here!" (C) to \ f "Brother-2". In the same place, "You will answer me for Sevastopol!"
  40. Santor
    Santor 20 August 2014 00: 47
    +1
    Quote: Dryuya
    According to the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry, the appearance at Russia's disposal of ships of the Mistral type will radically change the balance of forces in the Black Sea basin. Kiev expects France to take measures aimed at stopping the supply of Mistral-class ships to Russia, Perebiinis concluded.


    Yes, they all went to the ass, tired of ...

    According to the Mistrals, ships are needed, of precisely this class .. Gren can’t be compared with them, he’s a ship for a completely different one ... all the more so he stood there - now they work there day and night, welding sparkles like that ..

    Mistral picks up a battalion of marines with artillery and armored vehicles and is capable of landing it on an unprepared coast, for which it has a dock and hovercraft in it. In addition, helicopters for landing and fire support, in addition, it is an ideal headquarters ship.

    Still - if they refuse us, then in addition to unsettling, they will be obliged to cut both ships and send the stern parts back to St. Petersburg, where they were made.
  41. IAlex
    IAlex 20 August 2014 02: 49
    0
    Fu, fu ... The article stinks of European cynicism, hypocrisy and slaveholding thinking ...
  42. Wolka
    Wolka 20 August 2014 05: 37
    0
    the French: one must always adhere to one's own truly national policy, and not participate in dubious political alliances from the Yankees, where no one wins except the Yankees ... hi
  43. ktylxy
    ktylxy 20 August 2014 06: 41
    0
    Civilians do not understand what a defense order means and how it is done, it is not so scary to receive less than to receive it, but why? Because the "barge" will eat the loot even if it just stands at the wall. And no one in Europe has the dough to feed even one "extra" ship of this class, but what about the crew, equipment, passengers. This is where you have to laugh maliciously !!!
  44. Commissar
    Commissar 20 August 2014 13: 41
    0
    Mistral need China!