Ship for all occasions

74
"Vladivostok" and "Sevastopol", being built for the Russian Navy, will be able to solve both military and humanitarian tasks

Universal amphibious assault ships (UDC) are designed to solve a wide range of expedition tasks that are currently becoming the main ones for the naval forces of many states. It is about participation in international or coalition military and peacekeeping operations in areas remote from the national territory. Representing the largest subclass of amphibious ships, UDC on combat potential corresponds to light and even medium aircraft carriers, which characterizes their importance in the system of modern naval forces.

Domestic terminology with respect to amphibious force ships is very vague, but it is considered that the UDC (a term that appeared in the USSR in 70-s for the American ships of the Tarawa type) is a large unit that unites the amphibious assault ship and the helicopter carrier. They have a carrier-based architecture with a solid flight deck and a hangar for the permanently-based helicopters, as well as a docking chamber for landing craft and with significant landing holds. The initiators of the creation of such units were the United States, where these ships were originally designated Landing Helicopter Assault (LHA). The lead ship of the new subclass LHA 1 Tarawa was ordered by the US Navy in 1969 and commissioned in 1976 (actually in 1978). Before 1980, four more units of this type were built (LHA 2 - LHA 5). Tarawa UDCs were capable of carrying a CH-30 or 46 CH-19 transport helicopters in the 53 hangar, had a docking chamber 81 meter in length and space for 1900 marines with equipment, that is, a reinforced battalion. The integration of such significant capabilities into one unit required a sharp increase in the size of the ship, the total displacement of which reached 40 thousand tons, the size of the average aircraft carrier.

America

Since the advent of the UDC, they have become the basis of the expeditionary and amphibious capabilities of the US Navy and have become an example of imitation for the rest of the fleets of the world. In the United States, the empowerment of amphibious forces was associated with the introduction of amphibious assault boats (LCV) of the LCAC type, which began to enter the fleet in the 80s. This required an increase in the size of the ships' dock chambers. Therefore, the next series of UDC of the Wasp type with a full displacement of 41 thousand tons was built with an increased size of the dock and was considered oriented mainly for disembarking using LCAC, and not helicopters as opposed to ships of the Tarawa type. Wasp type ships, built on the basis of the Tarawa hull and preserving their architecture and helicopter capacity, received a new designation - Landing Helicopter Dock (LHD). It should be noted that all foreign UDC consider the LHD type ships in the USA.

Ship for all occasions


Another feature of the Wasp-type UDC was the provision of the vertical take-off and landing of the AV-8B Harrier II-type aircraft on them, which gave the ships the combat potential of light aircraft carriers. In the version with full aircraft vertical takeoff and landing, Wasp can carry up to 20 AV-8B aircraft and up to six anti-submarine helicopters. From 1989 to 2001, the American fleet received seven Wasp UDCs (LHD 1 - LHD 7), and the last, eighth ship of this type, LHD 8 Makin Island, was built according to a modified design with gas turbine power plant and put into operation in 2009 year.

Although the United States was the first to take the step in shaping the appearance of the UDC as a hybrid of the landing helicopter carrier and dock ship, on the ships of the next generation they decided to abandon this concept in its purest form. New ships of the type America, designed to replace the Tarawa and also classified as LHA (UDC), do not have a docking chamber and, in fact, returned to the type of landing helicopter carrier, although they retain significant cargo and equipment transportation capabilities. The landing of America ships is supposed to be carried out exclusively aviation in a way using MV-22B convertiplanes and CH-53K heavy transport helicopters with providing air support for AH-1Z combat helicopters and F-35B aircraft. In total, up to 23 F-35B is constantly based on the ship, and the standard air group should consist of 10 F-35B, 12 MV-22B, four CH-53K, four MN-60S and eight AH-1Z.

America type ships are the basis of Expeditionary Strike Group (ESG). They are planned to have 11. Each should include one UDC and two amphibious assault ships (LPD and LSD), which are assigned the main tasks for the transportation and landing of equipment. The group has on board a Marine Expeditionary Battalion. Now the US Navy has ten ESGs, each usually includes three surface warships and one atomic multi-purpose submarine.

UDC America is in many ways a development of the Wasp type ships, and its full displacement will reach 45 thousand tons, and the assault force will be 1687 people. The gas turbine power plant (EC) of the ship is similar to Makin Island UDC, but it has two additional electric motors for low speed. The lead ship of the new type LHA 6 America was handed over for testing in November 2013. An order has been issued for the construction of a second ship LHA 7 Tripoli. Originally, the construction of a new type of 11 units was planned, but the current long-term shipbuilding program includes only seven units, and probably no more than four will be built. Since there was criticism among the US naval leadership over the abandonment of the dock cell on ships of the America type, it has now been decided that the dock will be restored starting approximately from the third ship of this type.

The rest of the world

The development of the UDC subclass outside the United States began with the end of the 90-s, which was primarily due to the fundamental change after the Cold War. The Western Navy reoriented from the task of gaining dominance at sea to combat operations against the coast during expeditionary and military campaigns around the world. An important task was also participation in humanitarian missions. Given the limited economic opportunities, the new amphibious ships should have the maximum multifunctionality.

Modern non-American UDC are also considered as means of controlling expeditionary groups of forces and assets or ship formations, which is why they often have enhanced staff capabilities. In addition, in peacetime they are used as training. It is considered necessary to have on board a hospital with the possibility of a rapid increase in capacity.

France was a pioneer here, putting into operation in 2006-2012 three UDKs of the Mistral type, combining the functions of a landing helicopter carrier, dock ship and control ship, with a total displacement of 21,3 thousand tons. Ships are a kind of smaller version of the classic American UDC. This is a balanced project for specific French requirements - expeditionary ships for long-term operations in remote waters, including use as a control ship, with minimal requirements for the combat component. They have a high degree of automation, were designed to a large extent according to commercial standards, and for the first time in the world, out of large combat units, they are equipped with an electric power plant and throttle propellers. They accommodate up to 500 landing personnel in high habitat conditions (2-, 4- and 6-berth cabins), and headquarters premises can accommodate up to 200 employees. Opportunities for transportation of equipment are 110 units, including up to 13 major tanks. There is a hospital for 89 beds. The dock can accommodate four landing boats of the LCM type, or two American LAC LCACs, or two high-speed boats of the L-CAT catamaran water-cutting type. The hangar is designed for the permanent base of eight NH90 helicopters or six NH90 and four combat Tiger. The maximum helicopter capacity of 16 units is achieved when placing six more cars on regular runways on the deck.

The second European ship of the UDC subclass was the Spanish Juan Carlos I, commissioned in the 2010 year. Compared with the Mistral, it is a larger (27 thousand tons) ship with enhanced combat characteristics and much greater airborne and airborne transport capabilities. In fact, it is considered as a new light aircraft carrier, adapted for the permanent deployment of the AV-8B or F-35B aircraft and is equipped with an airborne springboard. The hangar is designed for seven F-35B, or 12 NH90 helicopters, or eight CH-47. Taking into account the seats on the flight and landing decks, the ship is able to carry up to 30 aircraft. Four landing craft of type LCM-1E or one KVP LCAC are placed in the docking chamber. The landing capacity of the Juan Carlos I is 900 man and 77 units of equipment (including up to 43 main tanks), there are staff premises for 100 man. The area of ​​the airborne cargo decks is 6000 square meters, which is more than twice that of the Mistral. The Spanish ship has an electropower installation with propellers, but the EC includes gas turbine generators and provides a full speed to the 21,5 node.

In the 2007 project, Juan Carlos I won the Australian Navy competition for the construction of two Canberra and Adelaide UDCs with a delivery period of 2014 and 2015.

South Korea became another owner of a full-fledged UDC, introducing fleet in 2007 the ship of national construction LPH 6111 Dokdo. With a total displacement of 19 thousand tons, Dokdo has a docking chamber with two LCAC LCVs and an under-deck hangar containing up to 10 UH-60 helicopters. Landing capacity is 720 people and up to 40 pieces of equipment (including six tanks). The ship carries significant defensive weapons. Diesel EC provides a speed of up to 23 knots. UDC Dokdo, unlike others, is oriented not to overseas expeditionary, but to operations in Korean coastal waters. The fleet plans to have three such ships as the flagships of the formed strike groups. The second ship was ordered in 2012. The possibility of basing on these UDC and F-35B aircraft is being considered.

The construction of the UDC of national projects currently involves several more countries: Germany, Italy and, apparently, the PRC. In India, announced a tender for the construction of four UDC. In 2011, the customer of UDC was Russia, having signed a contract with the French shipbuilding association DCNS for the construction of two Mistral-type ships. The contract cost is 1,2 billion euros, while the actual construction is estimated at 980 million euros, while the remaining costs imply the transfer of technical documentation and licenses, training, etc. The contract parameters provided Russia with the purchase of two UDCs that are being built in France with the DCNS shipyard leading role STX Europe in Saint-Nazaire (the stern parts should be manufactured in St. Petersburg at OJSC “Baltic Shipbuilding Shipbuilding”), and an option for two more ships entirely Russian-built.

The first ordered UDC of the Mistral type - “Vladivostok” has already been launched and is to be delivered to the Ministry of Defense of Russia in the autumn of 2014, the second - “Sevastopol” is scheduled to be delivered in the autumn of 2015. Both will be part of the Pacific Fleet. Interestingly, the contracted ships were credited to the lists of the Russian Navy in January 2012, not as UDC, but as amphibious assault ship docks (DVKD).

Combat application

To date, only Tarawa, Wasp and Mistral have combat experience. The extremely wide and versatile use of French ships for solving a wide variety of tasks draws attention, despite their relatively short time in the French Navy (two from the 2007 and the third from the 2012). A special feature of the military use of UDC is their versatility - these units were used in various roles, however, never in their original quality - for the landing of significant landings.

The American UDC is traditionally actively involved as the nucleus of amphibious or naval connections in various regions of the world. They carry contingents of marines and complement aircraft carriers in operations against the coast. For example, during the Gulf War in 1991, the LHA 4 Nassau was used as a light aircraft carrier with AV-8B aircraft to support the actions of marines on land. In 1999 against Yugoslavia, LHD 3 Kearsarge was used as a control ship and at the same time a light aircraft carrier with AV-8B aircraft. Against Iraq in 2003, the same functions were performed by LHD 5 Bataan and LHD 6 Bonhomme Richard, and Kearsarge against Libya in 2011. The MV-22 converting gliders from this UDC 22 in March 2011 picked up the pilots of the F-15E American fighter-bomber that crashed during a sortie flight in Libya.

Otherwise, the main tasks of the UDC in peacetime, in addition to the “expeditionary presence”, are troop transfer, humanitarian and evacuation measures. In all these cases, they play the role of large multi-purpose high-speed transports with significant auxiliary (aviation, medical, etc.) capabilities.

The United States uses its UDC as flagship anti-piracy missions off the coast of Somalia, and their advantage remains significant helicopter air groups. The most famous episode is the release in April of 2009 of the year by special forces, parachuting from helicopters with LHD 4 Boxer, captured by the American container ship Maersk Alabama.

In connection with the upcoming commissioning of the Russian Navy two Mistral, of particular interest is the experience of the use of these ships by France. In a short period of time, the French managed to break in a variety of ways to use them. The lead ship, the L 9013 Mistral, began with the 1500 evacuation of French citizens in July of the 2006 from Beirut to the Turkish port of Mersin. In view of the crew and the landing, there were 2200 people on board. It was reported that the UDC could take a maximum of 4400 people. At the same time, Mistral delivered 650 troops and 85 wheeled vehicles, including five cannon armored vehicles AMX-10RC and 20 of VAB armored personnel carriers and light armored vehicles VBL, to the French peacekeeping contingent in Lebanon.

During the long trip to the Indian and Pacific oceans in 2008, Mistral delivered a cargo of humanitarian aid from India to Thailand for the population of Myanmar who had suffered from a cyclone (the Myanmar government did not give permission to call the ship directly into the territorial waters of the country). UDC L 9013 Mistral and L 9014 Tonnerre during Operation Harmattan, French participation in NATO military operations against Muammar Gaddafi’s forces in the Libyan civil war in 2011, was most famous for the French use of both cash at that time.

The first to the coast of Libya came from Toulon 17 in May 2011, the UDC Tonnerre. On board were 19 helicopters of the French Army Aviation - 13 Gazelle, two Tiger NAR and four Puma. One Gazelle was unarmed with the SA.341F control machine, eight were equipped with ATGM HOT (SA.342M1), two were equipped with 20-mm cannons (SA.341F2), and two were Mistral air-to-air missiles. Both combat Tiger NAR staffed only had 30-mm cannon, 68-mm unguided and Mistral missiles. Equipped with ATGM Hellfire II Tiger helicopters modifications HAD by that time had not yet arrived in army aviation. Two Puma were used as search and rescue, although not carried special equipment. Tonnerre conducted military operations with his helicopters on targets in Libya from 3 June 2011 of the year, interacting with British military helicopters WAH-64D Apache, operating from the Ocean helicopter carrier.

12 July 2011 th to replace Tonnerre from Toulon to the Libyan coast arrived Mistral, on board which flew from 12 to 14 July helicopter air group. As a result, 20 helicopters were deployed on the ship, with two Puma being replaced with specialized CSAR Caracal machines. July 17 Tonnerre departed to Toulon and returned to Libya to replace the Mistral 9 of September, also with the transfer of the air group from Mistral. For ten days, both French UDCs acted together until September’s Mistral 18 went to Toulon. In October, additional search and rescue support was provided by three Tonnerre-based American HH-60 helicopters. A hospital was also deployed at Tonnerre, and he returned to his homeland on October 25 2011, after the complete victory of the opposition in Libya and the death of Gaddafi.

In total, during the period of hostilities in Libya, 23 French helicopters operated from both UDCs. 43 group sorties were made, a total of 316 helicopter flights with 1115 hours of flight. SA.342M1 Gazelle helicopters launched 425 (according to other sources - 431) ATGM NOTET, and Tiger HAP - 1618 millimeters of unguided rockets of 68 caliber and three Mistral missiles on ground targets. Both types of machines also fired 13,5 thousands of 20-mm and 30-mm projectiles from cannons. They worked almost exclusively at night using round-the-clock search and aiming systems. It was claimed defeat 600 targets, including 400 vehicles. At the same time, French helicopters did not suffer any losses.

Taking into account the active use of Mistral in the French fleet as control ships, the experience of the creators shows that the Russian Navy in the person of Vladivostok and Sevastopol, with a responsible approach to their operation, can get really valuable and multi-purpose units.
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  1. +12
    11 July 2014 14: 39
    Sevastopol and the Black Sea, the sea of ​​our Russian glory, and to be our glory forever in the ships or the consciousness of all Orthodox there is no difference, so we are waiting ...
    1. +15
      11 July 2014 14: 45
      URGENTLY:

      URGENTLY:

      z Grada shot the camp of Ukrainian security officials, about 30 dead
      Date: 11.07.14
      Category: Conflicts
      Views: 1508

      In contact with
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      Photo: previously captured BM-21 Grad launcher

      The well-known activist of Euromaidan Vladimir Parasyuk reports on his facebook page that this morning terrorists bombarded the positions of anti-terrorist operation forces from the Grad MLRS, there were many victims and wounded.

      “We have just reported very unpleasant news. Today, at 5 o'clock in the morning near the village of Zelenopolye, Luhansk region, our guys from the 24 motorized brigade (Yavorivshchyna, Lviv region) were fired from the Grad installation. A large number of wounded and killed. burned down. No reinforcements coming. "

      My brother, who is now there, told me about this horror. According to unofficial data, the number of our guys killed about 30 and more than 100 wounded.

      At the same time, "Russian Spring" reported, with reference to the militia commander Igor Strelkov, that everything happened on the morning of July 11 near Zelenopolis (Lugansk region).

      Igor Strelkov said in this regard: “I confirm. The column has been smashed into the trash. He did not give data on losses among the military.

      The National Security and Defense Council has not yet confirmed or refuted information that appeared on the Internet. According to an UNIAN correspondent, the speaker of the NSDC information center Andrei Lysenko, at a briefing in Kiev today, answering journalists' questions, he noted that the information was being clarified. “We are now specifying information about the military personnel and by 17:00 we will give a clear answer,” Lysenko said. According to him, as of 12.00 there is information that during the last day three servicemen were killed and 25 were injured, all wounded are given the necessary medical care and treatment.
      1. +5
        11 July 2014 14: 49
        So their reptiles Bandera, so that for thousands of years the hunt for human blood has been repulsed ...
        1. +6
          11 July 2014 15: 00
          z Grada shot the camp of Ukrainian security officials, about 30 dead

          How to react to such news when it’s both joyful and sad? ...
        2. Roman070280
          0
          11 July 2014 15: 18
          The trouble is that the "sofa experts" do not understand all this until they personally encounter them .. And while some are discouraged, there are more and more new ones taking their places .. And this process will never end ..
          1. +1
            11 July 2014 16: 30
            No, Roman070280! Not everyone came to the "couch" from the "couch"! Many at the Forum and "personally encountered"! And the "smell of gunpowder" is not known on the Internet!
      2. +8
        11 July 2014 14: 57
        You can still like this
        1. +9
          11 July 2014 15: 00
          A bar for personnel was excluded from the Mistral helicopter carrier project being built by the French company STX for Russia. According to the representatives of the Russian Navy, foreign standards of personnel entertainment are incompatible with the traditions of the Russian Navy. The wardroom will become a place for receiving delegations and resting the sailors of the Vladivostok and Sevastopol, as well as other ships of the fleet. In addition, Russian sailors will feel less comfortable than their French counterparts - the project provides for two-seater cabins with a bathroom, but in the domestic version of the Mistrals, only the officers will get them. This was reported to the Izvestia newspaper by a source in Rosoboronexport.
          According to a source in Rosoboronexport, the decision to amend the design of the Mistrals, which are being built for Russia by the French shipyard STX, was made by the Navy.
          - The room for the bar was not included in the contract - it does not correspond to our traditions. The fleet decided so, the source said. The representative of the Navy's main headquarters, familiar with the details of the contract, confirmed that the ship’s entertainment unit had undergone changes during the construction - the bar would be replaced by a traditional wardroom.
          - Indeed, there will be no bar on the Russian Mistrals. According to the naval charter of the Navy, every soldier must refrain from bad habits, including drinking alcohol. On our ships, the place where personnel gathered for rest and entertainment has always been and remains a wardroom, '' the Navy headquarters said.
          Just as in the original project of the ship, Vladivostok and Sevastopol will be equipped with a gym with treadmills, barbells and dumbbells, added a representative of the Navy headquarters. - Sport is an integral part of multi-week sea voyages, - said the source.
          1. +9
            11 July 2014 15: 05
            What will the brothel also take away? But what about sailors to be on long trips? They don’t think about people at all! bully
            1. +12
              11 July 2014 16: 20
              Nothing, but in the hands get stronger ... wassat
            2. The comment was deleted.
          2. +4
            11 July 2014 15: 08
            MOSCOW, July 10 - RIA Novosti. The Russian Ministry of Defense denied information from the media about the introduction of design changes in the design of the Mistral-class amphibious assault helicopter carriers, as a result of which Russian sailors would be less comfortable than their French counterparts.

            "The Russian side did not make any constructive changes in the premises intended for the residence of personnel, as well as their rest, in the project of the Mistral-class amphibious assault carriers. All the insinuations of individual authors on this topic with the citation of" opinions "that have nothing to do with the construction ship of "sources" and "experts", nothing more than a newspaper "duck" - emphasized in the military department.

            The Defense Ministry explained that the four so-called bars for the rest of various categories of the ship's personnel, envisaged in the project by French designers, were simply renamed "lounges for rest." All salons are equipped with upholstered furniture, video and audio equipment, as well as other accessories for off-duty relaxation. The only exception is the lack of utensils, storage (spillage) and, in fact, the alcoholic beverages themselves, which, perhaps, contradicts the convictions of some "military experts", but fully corresponds to the Russian maritime culture. It is also noted that the presence of four crew lounges on the ship under construction did not in any way affect the arrangement in accordance with the long-standing naval tradition on the ship and wardrooms.

            Also, the Russian Ministry of Defense called "stupidity" the message about placing the rank and file of the command in "cockpits with a capacity of 6 to 12 people" with the minimization of the amount of sanitary equipment (showers and latrines (toilets)). As explained in the Russian military department, the area and number of premises for accommodating personnel remained unchanged.

            "For the accommodation of the ship's crew, there are 1, 2 and 4-berth cabins (for the rank and file), each of which is equipped with a bathroom and a shower with a constant supply of cold and hot water. And the few 6-berth cabins available on the helicopter carrier, each of which also equipped with plumbing fixtures and a shower, intended only for temporary accommodation of troops of the landing force, which, depending on the tasks performed, can take on board a helicopter carrier of the Mistral type, the ministry added.
          3. +8
            11 July 2014 16: 50
            request
            Quote: herruvim
            the project provides for two-seater cubicles with a bathroom, but in the domestic version of the Mistrals, such will only go to the officers

            For some reason, it is customary for us to artificially create "hardships and hardships" and then "steadily overcome" them. I remember a bucket (parasha) in An-12.
          4. +2
            11 July 2014 19: 12
            Actually, the original was another paragraph -
            "We do not need a bar - we are not accustomed to this, we are not brought up like the French. There are many entertainments in our fleet, everything is the same as what young people live, only there are no girls - sailors watch films, play KVN, write letters to their homeland ", - said retired rear admiral Vladimir Zakharov.
            It is clear that the admiral himself does not drink strictly, is not brought up that way, has fun in other ways, and it is clear that he constantly goes in for sports. Thanks to the supported harmony of the body, he lives quietly in the cockpit with four other admirals of the same kind.
            Everyone understands that in a long, difficult campaign, sailors still drink to relieve tension. Why admirals strive to treat subordinates not as people, but as brainless clowns is not clear. And why it’s not possible to allow a can of beer, referring to certain mythical traditions, is also not clear. Especially if you dig into the traditions of the pre-revolutionary fleet, then everything was exactly the opposite.
            1. +3
              12 July 2014 12: 03
              Quote: chunga-changa

              Everyone understands that in a long, difficult campaign, sailors still drink to relieve tension. Why admirals strive to treat subordinates not as people, but as brainless clowns is not clear. And why it’s not possible to allow a can of beer, referring to certain mythical traditions, is also not clear. Especially if you dig into the traditions of the pre-revolutionary fleet, then everything was exactly the opposite.

              I've spent 10 years almost bezvylazno in the "box" and I now do not understand how sailors still drink to relieve stress? What do they drink? Yes, it happened that the saved money sewed once a week for the Motherland, but the awl was not endless and accountable! What else can a sailor drink? Regarding traditions ... under the tsar-father, the lower ranks were supposed to have a glass of rum, but ... only in the sea, during the Soviet Union, 100 grams were allowed to be marked. red wine a day but ... when in the tropics. smile At the same time, the doctor gently advised to dilute the wine with some water.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. +1
        11 July 2014 15: 38
        GREAT NEWS!!
      5. 0
        11 July 2014 16: 26
        If - YES, then why not! To water reptiles!
      6. +3
        11 July 2014 16: 58
        Quote: subbtin.725
        z Grada shot the camp of Ukrainian security officials

        Here it seems about Mistral speech. Why all the blame to the heap ???
    2. +2
      11 July 2014 15: 20
      The money was mostly paid, you need to take the UDC, and the future will show how to use it, because we have not had such warships yet.
    3. +1
      11 July 2014 18: 37
      an attempt to justify a "valuable acquisition" ... what, we bought it, we bought it, we won't terminate the contract, we will now develop a concept of application, although any hold man understands that this money could be ...
      1. +3
        12 July 2014 12: 10
        Quote: Andrey Yurievich
        an attempt to justify a "valuable acquisition" ... what, we bought it, we bought it, we won't terminate the contract, we will now develop a concept of application, although any hold man understands that this money could be ...

        Andrei Yuryevich, instruct such a foolish person as I .... what does every hold understands? In this situation, for Russia is it realistic to build a UDC of this class ?? And the concept of application has already developed an unstable international environment! Criticism is good, it’s right, but it’s also useful to move convolutions. soldier
  2. wk-083
    +2
    11 July 2014 14: 54
    I hope they will plow the oceans, and not the bay shooter!
    1. +9
      11 July 2014 14: 59
      In this regard, maybe secretly in our minds we’ll skip a stool for a year or two. Because Mistral, in fact, is not such a waste of state funds. Rogozin said that we will build the next two at home. Well, that’s for the needs of the Black Sea Fleet .
  3. 0
    11 July 2014 14: 54
    And she asked the little one: explain to me once, but it is clear - is the Mistral good or bad?
    1. -3
      11 July 2014 16: 23
      Good, but expensive, building your own is much cheaper.
      1. +4
        12 July 2014 12: 25
        Quote: zao74
        Good, but expensive, building your own is much cheaper.

        Aleksey, I’m surprised by God !!!! Shipbuilding capacities are overloaded, Nevskoye design bureau also does not hose, working specialists are chronically short, designing a new concept for a landing ship will take years and will cost a pretty penny. The construction of 1-2x ships of this class will be more expensive than buying because the French company DCNS has already developed the technology and all the equipment is ready, but we need to invent it all from scratch !!!! Without knowing the ford, do not get into the water !! hi
    2. The comment was deleted.
  4. +1
    11 July 2014 14: 56
    Without a good fleet, our borders are difficult to guard. We need to continue to develop it further! Keep it up!
  5. Roshchin
    +3
    11 July 2014 15: 00
    The Mistral-class ships were developed by the French as a weapon of aggression, a continuation of the remnants of their colonial policy and intervention wherever they ask. In our country, they will be an instrument for protecting Russia from aggressors. Given the ability to transport a lot of equipment and people, let them swim through the Kerch Bay for training, transporting equipment and people to the Crimea. Both benefits and combat training.
  6. 0
    11 July 2014 15: 07
    I remember how Barabanov, like a sugary nightingale, poured about Serdyukov and his "army of a new look."
  7. 0
    11 July 2014 15: 13
    Just one installation, and so many things done.
  8. +3
    11 July 2014 15: 13
    Rather, these Mistrals would have been handed over to Russia. The Russian Navy needs an early update and modernization. May God wait!
  9. +5
    11 July 2014 15: 15
    Our half of Sevastopol passed the English Channel.
  10. 0
    11 July 2014 15: 26
    Why didn’t the Juans order ??? they are bigger and cheaper. Can the French build better?
    1. +1
      11 July 2014 16: 20
      Because they were designed based on technology owned by the United States.
  11. +3
    11 July 2014 15: 27
    The second pontoon designed for docking the heavy nuclear missile cruiser (TARKR) "Admiral Nakhimov" was withdrawn from the 42nd workshop of Sevmash. The Central Naval Portal was informed about this by a source familiar with the situation at the enterprise.
  12. Iero
    +5
    11 July 2014 15: 29
    A little expensive for humanitarian tasks. Where is the expedition planned? Not to the shores of Nigeria, girls are being abducted there, can we really help? Or to Cuba, in vain did they write off $ 35 billion?
    1. 0
      11 July 2014 16: 06
      fine! the same thoughts visit me. I can’t even hypothetically imagine why the Russian Navy needs it.
      1. +4
        11 July 2014 17: 10
        And why does our Navy need a BDK ?! No need to think narrowly. From time to time, the tasks of our Navy change. Recall, for example, a Georgian company - UDC would not be in the way.
  13. +3
    11 July 2014 15: 39
    In Russia, we are also going to build ships similar to the Mistral, they will build in St. Petersburg if I am not mistaken. Good luck to these ships soldier
  14. hoard
    +7
    11 July 2014 15: 42
    The article is a plus. Normal review.
    The practice of building decent ships abroad is not new. The famous "Varyag" was built in America, and the 2nd rank cruiser "Novik" was built in Germany.
    1. 0
      11 July 2014 18: 08
      Normal review.
      The practice of building decent ships abroad is not new ....

      All this is so ... but without being connected in the \ service with the marine theme ... I am concerned about the survivability of the ship. Indeed, if you estimate, then the ship will have up to a regiment of fighters (according to the plan - a battalion, but knowing our mentality, I’m sure ... there will be up to 1000 of them). And how many modern shock military equipment ....!
      Maybe someone is more literate than I and will explain in a separate article the organization of anti-mine, anti-torpedo defense, air defense system. Are there places for combat posts on MISTRAL itself ... etc ...? Or to escort them requires a special convoy ... sort of ... of 15-20 warships ... like an aircraft carrier (which would mean distracting them from other combat missions) ... If you need a separate convoy, then in the Pacific we will be forced to engage almost the entire combat structure of ships only for the purpose of combat protection ...
      Maybe I'm wrong ... and wrong, but if so, then questions arise about the appropriateness of engaging such ships in real military campaigns ...
      Explain to me ... stupid in maritime affairs!
      1. hoard
        +1
        11 July 2014 18: 47
        Of course, such ships do not go alone. The composition of the guard order is determined depending on the tasks ahead. For the Mistral there are on average 2-5 ships.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. +4
        11 July 2014 21: 06
        Any landing ships need protection. I don’t remember how many times this was said. They are always covered by a warrant of ships with shock and defensive weapons. Mistral in this sense is no exception, although being a helicopter carrier can serve as a base for helicopter anti-submarine defense.
    2. -2
      11 July 2014 19: 57
      Cr. I rank "Varyag" and cr. Rank II "Novik" - decent ships? Don't joke like that anymore.
      Here is the destroyer "Novik" (Russian project) - a decent ship!
      1. +2
        11 July 2014 21: 07
        And what is “Varyag” to blame? A whole squadron drowned him.
        1. hoard
          -1
          11 July 2014 21: 49
          Cynically speaking, both "Varyag" and "Novik" were rather ineptly lost in terms of naval art, which does not detract from the heroism of their crews.
          1. +3
            12 July 2014 12: 30
            Quote: magot
            Cynically speaking, both "Varyag" and "Novik" were rather ineptly lost in terms of naval art, which does not detract from the heroism of their crews.

            What is the mediocrity of the loss of "Varyag" and "Novik"? Especially I ask you to clarify your idea on "Novik" !!!
            1. hoard
              0
              13 July 2014 19: 06
              Agree, the breakthrough of the Russian squadron from Port Arthur to Vladivostok cannot be considered an example of operational-tactical thought. The squadron was defeated, the ships were lost. From Wiki:
              "After the battle in the Yellow Sea on August 10 (July 28, old style), 1904 broke through to the port of Qingdao. Then, having rounded Japan from the east, he came to Korsakov on Sakhalin Island for coal. Not having time to take the bunker, he was forced to take up the battle with the Japanese cruiser. “Tsushima.” Received 3 hits under the waterline and over 10 hits in the superstructure, after which it left the battle - the enemy was not pursued. The commander, having received radio interception data about the presence of other enemy ships, decided to sink the cruiser. 20 August 1904 at 23 hours 30 minutes cruiser lay down on the ground. "(c)
            2. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. hoard
        0
        11 July 2014 21: 44
        Sorry, combat, minus you accidentally, already corrected))
        The destroyer (and originally a mine cruiser) "Novik" appeared largely thanks to the cr. 2nd rank - light mine cruiser "Novik" and not without reason inherited its name. The cruiser, one might say, became the ancestor of the class of destroyers. From Wiki:
        "Russian armored cruisers of the II rank, of the Novik type, despite some shortcomings, proved themselves well during the Russo-Japanese war. Therefore, after the Russo-Japanese war, large series of high-speed small-displacement cruisers, intended for combat actions as part of squadrons and fleets. [5]
        In Russia, from August 1907, on the instructions of the Marine General Staff (MGSH), the Baltic was involved in order to establish the possibility of creating a high-speed small displacement cruiser with a steam turbine propulsion system designed for: “Exploration service at the battleship squadron or joint operations with the destroyer squad” factory. [6]
        In accordance with the tactical and technical assignment (TTZ) for design, the pre-production experimental cruiser "Novik" was actually ahead of its time, the only one in the world! "One hundred percent" - "armored destroyer leader" (at that time the destroyer class had not yet been officially adopted ), since fulfilling the counter-destroyer functions provided for by the TTZ, he was quite capable of performing all the functions first defined for the British "leaders of the flotillas" at the beginning of World War I ... "(c)
      3. The comment was deleted.
  15. +12
    11 July 2014 15: 49
    Honestly, my service was not held in the Navy and I am not a specialist in the problems of the Navy. But what is visible at first glance - the ship is able to provide serious air support during special operations in areas of different water areas. Whoever has ever been under fire, but there was no support from the air or from artillery, he will understand me.
    1. hoard
      +2
      11 July 2014 23: 59
      Another main task, as a helicopter carrier, is to provide anti-submarine defense of the formation of ships (as part of the KPUG - a ship strike group or KPUG - a ship search and strike group, DESO - an amphibious formation and convoys. In the history of our fleet there were 2 projects that solved this problem: " Moscow and Leningrad pr. 1123 and, as a continuation, pr. 1143 "Kiev", "Minsk", "Novorossiysk" and "Baku".
    2. The comment was deleted.
  16. -1
    11 July 2014 16: 08
    if the mistralka can support the Belarusian fleet in case of aggression
  17. +1
    11 July 2014 16: 26
    By the way, there are a lot of girls on the French Mistrals, and the situation on the ship is more calm and liberal, there are bars for communication and dating.
    Channel 1 report on service on the Mistral, there are a lot of girls in the frame)))
    http://www.1tv.ru/news/other/162712
    This is how the bars looked on the French Mistral, and which will not be on the Russian
    1. +4
      11 July 2014 17: 14
      There will be no bars and hell with them! The commanders will be calmer. Unlike the French, the sea becomes knee-deep for our drunken sailor. And if there are girls, then .... In general, it is better not to.
    2. 0
      11 July 2014 17: 45
      Why are bars or girls not so?
      And if on the topic, then although I did not serve, I think Mistral is useful in the household. hi
  18. The comment was deleted.
  19. -5
    11 July 2014 17: 06
    Not without reason "Menstrual".
    It can be used as an amphibious unit and a ferry to transport equipment and military contingent. The landing can be supported by attack helicopters. For such a task, it requires escort ships, that is, combat units with missile defense and anti-ship missile functions, which could be used to solve more serious tasks, will be diverted to it. And also as a "successful war chariot" for the war against some "Papuan" and police operations. Which "Papuasia" is the Russian Federation going to fight against?
    In solo voyage, this "shalanda" is powerless against aircraft and submarines, even non-submarine submarines, since it has a limited speed, while during the excitement in N points and limited (or impossible) use of ASW helicopters, which is seen as a potential "victim".
    In most other cases, it can be used as a command ship (with the installation of the appropriate equipment only) of the type of the US Navy "Mount Whitney" or a hospital ship, but the presence of a huge number of aircraft will be defective in this case, or the higher command personnel will be "transported by helicopters to their cabins "? Or not, not so - humanitarian aid to the natives will be delivered by helicopters!
    That is - "ship for parades"? Or is there not enough doctors in the Russian Federation? Are we studying technologies of hospital and staff ships? Awesome money laundering! It would be better if NNS units of 6 were built additionally with this money!
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. 0
        11 July 2014 19: 41
        Is it impossible without expressions? Or did the whole mind "come out" to the expressions? For each point, you can comment on what and where is not true?
        1. +4
          12 July 2014 12: 38
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          Is it impossible without expressions? Or did the whole mind "come out" to the expressions? For each point, you can comment on what and where is not true?

          Andrey, you can use expressions too! You managed to turn the landing ship into a Belarus tractor with all attachments! This is a modern over-the-horizon landing ship !!! The methods of using amphibious assault ships in a theater of operations are specific and there is no need to convert them into cruisers, destroyers, tugs, floating cranes, etc.
    2. hoard
      +2
      11 July 2014 18: 34
      "successful war chariot" for the war against some "Papuan" and police operations. Which "Papuasia" is the Russian Federation going to fight against?
      You, apparently, inattentively read the article. And there, in the section on the experience of combat use, Somali pirates were mentioned. We sent "Yaroslav the Wise" there not so long ago. So, it is very poorly suited for such tasks, but the UDC would be ideal.

      Quote: andy.v.lee
      In solo voyage, this "shalanda" is powerless against aircraft and submarines, even non-submarines, since it has a limited speed, and during waves of N points and limited (or impossible) use of helicopter anti-submarines, which is considered a potential "victim".

      Such ships do not go alone (this was also in the article), only with an escort. With a wave of N points, any warships have restrictions on the use of military means (and missiles, and artillery, and torpedoes).
      There is no sense in answering the rest of the nonsense. Judging by the extremely dismissive tone, you, apparently, are a cool expert in naval matters)))))))
      1. 0
        11 July 2014 20: 03
        And the operation against the pirates is not a police operation? True, the number of helicopters exceeds all reasonable limits against pirates, here is an uprising where to suppress a thread - that’s it! And against the pirates, something from 22460 and 22100 is enough.
        Quote: magot
        With a wave of N points, any warships have restrictions on the use of military means (and missiles, and artillery, and torpedoes).

        And sho? Japanese aircraft with AWACS (or even without it) will not be able to sink this "bandura" in a 6-7 seven-point storm, when the use of carrier-based aircraft will be seriously limited, and only "Guardians" will go in escort ships?
        So with whom is this "bandura" going to fight, or more precisely in what operational space it will be used?
        The pirates? - Something expensive, and even extremely expensive! Georgia or Ukraine? Where else did not go. Turkey is already problematic! Japan - especially!
        Ah .. Apparently, the state of Vanuatu!
        1. hoard
          +2
          11 July 2014 20: 58
          The fight against piracy has always been and will be relevant for a long time, as you might not call it - the police or something else. The projects you mentioned have insufficient autonomy for this task. But to suppress the uprising and a dozen UDC is not enough, look at Ukraine. Where UDC will be used - where problems will arise. The fleet must have different types of ships.

          Quote: andy.v.lee
          And sho? Japanese aircraft with AWACS (or even without it) will not be able to sink this "bandura" in a 6-7 seven-point storm, when the use of carrier-based aircraft will be seriously limited

          What is the wind force in a 6-7 ball storm?))) The use of any aircraft will be limited. Planes do not fly in the storm.
          1. 0
            12 July 2014 14: 07
            Quote: magot
            The fight against piracy has always been and will be relevant for a long time, as you might not call it - the police or something else. The projects you mentioned have insufficient autonomy for this task. But to suppress the uprising and a dozen UDC is not enough, look at Ukraine. Where UDC will be used - where problems will arise. The fleet must have different types of ships.

            Yah! Maybe even "099" should be driven once? They have normal autonomy, and are even "sharpened" against such tasks.
            In general, it’s easier to manage now. My friend is floating on container ships and bulk carriers. An operational anti-piracy special forces group is being taken aboard at the port and dangerous areas are being transported with it. It is much cheaper. PMCs and the like work, everyone is safe and sound.
            Quote: magot
            What is the wind force in a 6-7 ball storm?))) The use of any aircraft will be limited. Planes do not fly in the storm.

            The wind strength at the surface of the water and at different altitudes is still different. And for real aircraft carriers, with a sea state of 5 points, flight restrictions are already imposed, about this "bandura" I will not say that it can be better than an aircraft carrier with an "upper ball point" of 6-7 points for the release and reception of aircraft. This is about aviation.
            And will the submarine miss a torpedo in case of a wave of 6-7 points in the absence of anti-aircraft helicopter in the air?
            1. hoard
              0
              13 July 2014 20: 17
              You still have very primitive ideas about the use of ships and weapons of the fleet. Read specialized articles, not forum posts.
            2. The comment was deleted.
        2. hoard
          +1
          11 July 2014 20: 58
          The fight against piracy has always been and will be relevant for a long time, as you might not call it - the police or something else. The projects you mentioned have insufficient autonomy for this task. But to suppress the uprising and a dozen UDC is not enough, look at Ukraine. Where UDC will be used - where problems will arise. The fleet must have different types of ships.

          Quote: andy.v.lee
          And sho? Japanese aircraft with AWACS (or even without it) will not be able to sink this "bandura" in a 6-7 seven-point storm, when the use of carrier-based aircraft will be seriously limited

          What is the wind force in a 6-7 ball storm?))) The use of any aircraft will be limited. Planes do not fly in the storm.
          1. -1
            11 July 2014 21: 20
            All the uselessness of these semi-ferries for the current "underflot" of the Russian Federation has long been described here - http://flot.com/forum/index.php?PAGE_NAME=read&FID=15&TID=4076&PAGEN_1=88 (read from the first page).
            1. In the period from 2002 to 2006 (this is when Russia is rising), 2 destroyers of project 956EM were built from scratch according to an actually new project (deep modernization). In four years! But! For China. smile =)
            2. In the period from 1999 to 2013 (this is also when Russia is rising), 6 frigates of project 1135.6 were built (14 pennants in 6 years). But! For India.
            3. With long mudovy sobbing, but nevertheless, perestroika (deep modernization) of the TAVKR "Admira of the Soviet Union Fleet Gorshkov" into the aircraft carrier "Vikramaditya" But! For India.
            4. Against this background, ten years for yourself! one single BDK 11711 "Ivan Gren" is under construction. And immediately ferries with helicopters are purchased from the NATO country. Those. the creation of jobs in France is being financed and the dependence on imports is being laid in a virtually hostile country, which at any moment can take by the balls and refuse service. In short, dictate conditions. Now we woke up bustlingly, having crumpled up to the fullest with "Zarya-Mashproekt" (Nikolaev). I would like to say - good morning! smile :) Isn't it obvious where the big money thrown on "Georgettes", useless without the "dance group", should have been spent? After all, if in 2011 this money were spent on the creation of their own power plants, then by this year it would have been possible not to cry awkwardly?

            This, to the word, "where is the stove?" And did they choose the right dance.
            1. hoard
              +1
              11 July 2014 22: 22
              Quote: andy.v.lee
              All the uselessness of these semi-ferries for the current "underflot" of the Russian Federation has long been described here - http://flot.com/forum/index.php?PAGE_NAME=read&FID=15&TID=4076&PAGEN_1=88 (read from the first page).

              Read. The opinion of the amateur. Particularly funny about combat ACS. In fact, the term BIUS (combat information management system) has long been fixed in the Navy.

              And, in general, the need for Mistrals for our fleet is one issue, the economic justification for their construction is another, and how much money was stolen in this case is the third. Don't throw everything in a heap.
            2. The comment was deleted.
        3. +2
          11 July 2014 21: 30
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          out of 22460 and 22100

          Project 22460 patrol ships - type border patrol ships territorial sea.
          Patrol ship of project 22100 "Ocean" - borderline patrol ship ice class.
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          escort ships will go only "Guard"

          Wait and see, now a lot of things are being built.
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          Japanese AWACS aircraft

          Do we have airplanes?
      2. 0
        12 July 2014 08: 08
        Quote: magot
        "successful war chariot" for the war against some "Papuan" and police operations. Which "Papuasia" is the Russian Federation going to fight against?
        You, apparently, inattentively read the article. And there, in the section on the experience of combat use, Somali pirates were mentioned. We sent "Yaroslav the Wise" there not so long ago. So, it is very poorly suited for such tasks, but the UDC would be ideal.

        Nda .. Somali pirate boats are an ideal combat mission for a "pan" with a helicopter regiment and several escort ships!
        Quote: magot
        Such ships do not go alone (this was also in the article), only with an escort. With a wave of N points, any warships have restrictions on the use of military means (and missiles, and artillery, and torpedoes).
        There is no sense in answering the rest of the nonsense. Judging by the extremely dismissive tone, you, apparently, are a cool expert in naval matters)))))))

        Here are just N points for different equipment - different.
        About personalities - I don’t think it was worth writing here.
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. +2
      11 July 2014 21: 18
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      For such a task requires guard ships

      That is, you need to completely abandon landing ships as such? They are always guarded.
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      submarines even NPL

      For your information, non-nuclear submarines are much more dangerous than nuclear submarines, because they are much quieter. Submarines are needed solely because of autonomy.
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      Which "Papuasia" is the Russian Federation going to fight against?

      Against what it will be necessary against such and we will. Hint - they decided to buy them as a result of Georgia's peace enforcement and theoretically should have been received by the beginning of the presidential elections in Ukraine. And then there are the Syrian "fighters against the regime", etc.
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      against planes ... since it has a limited speed

      Do you know a ship that can escape from an airplane? Hm ...
      1. -2
        11 July 2014 21: 41
        I’m not going to drag out - the link to the Navy has already said the resource. This is the first.
        About this one:
        Quote: Dart2027
        Do you know a ship that can escape from an airplane? Hm ...

        Run away - why? To survive - what's wrong with "Dountless"? True, he has not yet taken part in real combat, and everything else is all in theory. And there is also "Aegis", which is good at shooting back during exercises, however, well, the Japanese did not finish something there.
        Quote: Dart2027
        For your information, non-nuclear submarines are much more dangerous than nuclear submarines, because they are much quieter. Submarines are needed solely because of autonomy.

        For my information - it doesn't matter which of them it will be sunk ("Virginia" or "Sorryu").
        1. +1
          11 July 2014 22: 58
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          Run away - why?

          You wrote that the Mistral is vulnerable to aircraft and submarines - as it has a limited speed
          So I'm interested in how you can escape from aviation due to speed. Reasoning logically - to flee. But how? Do not explain.
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          anyway, which one will be sunk

          Also, you wrote about the vulnerability for - submarines even NAPL.
          That is, apparently you think that a non-nuclear submarine is like that, a trifle? Not at all.
          1. -2
            12 July 2014 07: 16
            Quote: Dart2027
            You wrote that the "Mistral" is vulnerable to aircraft and submarines - as it has a limited speed
            So I'm interested in how you can escape from aviation due to speed. Reasoning logically - to flee. But how? Do not explain.

            You are very much like a debater. It was necessary to take an interest earlier, before these "pots" were purchased.
            Quote: Dart2027
            Also, you wrote about the vulnerability for - submarines even NPL.
            That is, apparently you think that a non-nuclear submarine is like that, a trifle? Not at all.

            I believe that theoretically the underwater speed of the submarine and that of this "pot" are similar, while that of the submarine is higher. Having predicted the course of this "pan", the nuclear submarine in a given area "lays out" several "smart" torpedoes, which after a while will attack this non-aircraft carrier. Such torpedoes are already in the process of being tested in the US Navy. But when this "saucepan" (5 years or 7) will enter full combat readiness, it is difficult to say. Moreover, 2 more regiments of helicopters need to be tested.
            1. +1
              12 July 2014 20: 51
              Quote: andy.v.lee
              It was necessary to be interested earlier, before these "pots" were purchased

              That is, you can’t say anything intelligible.
              Quote: andy.v.lee
              I believe that theoretically the underwater speed of the submarine and this "pot" are similar, but the submarine has more

              Speed ​​is not the most important characteristic for submarines. They do not play catch-up with the enemy, but sneaking up to goals on low noise go and attack.
              Quote: andy.v.lee
              Predicting the course

              On coffee grounds? Information about the enemy is obtained from intelligence.
              Quote: andy.v.lee
              A nuclear submarine in a given area "lays out" several "smart" torpedoes

              And here they are so stupid that they don’t think about anti-torpedo protection. Or do you think these torpedoes will only be dangerous for Mistrals? If they even have these torpedoes, that's not a fact.
  20. +2
    11 July 2014 17: 19
    Jack of all trades, master of none. An approximate translation - somehow everyone knows how, but masterfully - nothing. But this is the price of universality almost always, in everything.
  21. The comment was deleted.
  22. -1
    11 July 2014 21: 14
    I don’t understand what to break spears for the hundredth time. It’s for comfortable transportation of the battalion to a helicopter safari. Game, poorly protected goals. And such a game is found in Papuan, so it is urgent to find a victim and declare war on it. Hooray!!! Taburetkin and Medved!
  23. -4
    11 July 2014 21: 56
    Quote: Dart2027
    Wait and see, now a lot of things are being built.

    No longer - Ukraine "waved" the handle (power plants)! Its own is not foreseen in the near future, i.e. - delay indefinitely!
    Quote: Dart2027
    Do we have airplanes?

    So this "bandura", in addition to guarding the NK (which is not yet available), also requires an escort in the air? Straight ahead - some kind of aircraft carrier, without aircraft, however, and "coastal voyage"! Is it not bold?
    Once again - On the forum of the Navy, everything has been said for a long time!
    1. +2
      11 July 2014 23: 19
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      His until soon is not expected

      NPO Saturn has received an order for the production of gas turbine units (M70 and M75) for ships of the Russian Navy. Not tomorrow, but not indefinitely.
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      also requires escort in the air

      And for you, the news is that during the fighting, with any serious adversary, any squadron requires air cover?
      Quote: andy.v.lee
      And again - on the forum of the Navy, everything has been said for a long time!

      Quote from an article on the forum:
      build instead of the Mistral 10 nuclear submarines, or dozens of S-400, or hundreds of aircraft, helicopters
      A little help
      The cost of ONE multipurpose destroyer is estimated at about $ 2-2,5 billion.
      The cost of ONE PAK FA is estimated at about $ 100 million
      The cost of one Yasen nuclear submarine is about $ 1 billion.
      The cost of ONE frigate project 22350 is about 500 million dollars.
      The cost of the Mistral contract is 1,2 billion euros.
      Questions?
      1. 0
        12 July 2014 07: 25
        Quote: Dart2027
        NPO Saturn has received an order for the production of gas turbine units (M70 and M75) for ships of the Russian Navy. Not tomorrow, but not indefinitely.

        Received but did not complete! The time is not certain. Delivery of the same 11356 after the second building is delayed for at least one year. And at 22350 - generally it's time to write the fairy tale "Geese-Swans". Estimated time of full combat readiness (actual start of the ship's service) 2017?
        Quote: Dart2027
        And for you, the news is that during the fighting, with any serious adversary, any squadron requires air cover?

        For me, the news that this helicopter "basin" must also be covered from the air near its shores, "well, I didn’t accidentally scratch the Japanese woman there."
      2. -3
        12 July 2014 07: 30
        Quote: Dart2027
        Quote from an article on the forum:
        build instead of the Mistral 10 nuclear submarines, or dozens of S-400, or hundreds of aircraft, helicopters
        A little help
        The cost of ONE multipurpose destroyer is estimated at about $ 2-2,5 billion.
        The cost of ONE PAK FA is estimated at about $ 100 million
        The cost of one Yasen nuclear submarine is about $ 1 billion.
        The cost of ONE frigate project 22350 is about 500 million dollars.
        The cost of the Mistral contract is 1,2 billion euros.
        Questions?

        For this I did not give a link to the already discussed topic, in order to discuss someone's "bloopers" from there, but in order for people to read and highlight some rational grain, that’s all.
        For me, one thing is clear today - this purchase was not worth it! That's the point on this!
        1. 0
          12 July 2014 11: 37
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          Received, but failed to fulfill ... (the actual beginning of the ship's service) 2017

          A year or three is not an indefinite time, unpleasant, but tolerant.
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          this helicopter "basin" must also be covered from the air near its shores,

          That is, the fact that during the hostilities, with any serious adversary, any squadron requires air cover, is this news for you?
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          in order to discuss someone's "bloopers" from there

          That is, you yourself admit that the article is, to put it mildly, dubious, but at the same time you refer to it and assure that there is a "rational kernel" there.
          Quote: andy.v.lee
          For me, one thing is clear today - this purchase was not worth it! That's the point on this!

          That is nothing more to say?
  24. coserg 2012
    0
    11 July 2014 22: 44
    For pirates, it’s too much honor to use such ships. Here in the Far East they will probably have the right place. The maritime frontiers should, on human terms, serve and rest!