Southeast alignment: a look from Russia

Many opinions and many disturbances. There are naturally two main ones: we enter or merge. Themselves, of course, everyone is looking at the sofa. Let's try to put everything in its place. Emotionless. One argument - one paragraph.

Arguments against

Great war

The UN and the OSCE scored water in their mouths. The US is just waiting for the start of the mess. Europe has been occupied almost all of the United States since 1945 and does not have its own will. Consequently, they will not provide us with any excuses for sending troops. The entry of troops from the point of view of international law is aggression. In the same Moldova, the contingent was allowed to enter into an agreement with Moldova itself. In Ukraine, there is no one to negotiate with. When crossing our tanks borders on us with a clear conscience will let down all the dogs. The Great War looms on the horizon.

To hate blood. How will you explain to the Ukrainian recruits that the guy with the tricolor on the patch over the sight who’s attached to the scope is not an enemy of Ukraine? And then they will tell their grandchildren like this: well, they say, we fought with the Russians ...

Mortgage

The corpses torn apart by shrapnels, the murdered journalists and in general all this surrealism makes the blood of workers and employees of Novosibirsk, Vladivostok, Yekaterinburg and Tula freeze their blood. And the workers of Kharkov and Lvov amicably repairing tanks and re-launching aircraft for the junta. Are they “Right Sector” driving the factories? Or do not see whose hands these tanks fall into? Apparently everything is simpler: mortgage, vacation, renovation of a new apartment ...

Miners

Most of all, the industrious miners, metallurgists and the handy proletariat in general are surprised. This is from whom you should wait for the fist to strike the table first, and then between the horns. The second month of the heroic defense of the shooters is coming, and the miners ... earn money. Weapons not? When going to really mass, special weapons and is not required. Or the concept of guerrilla to Ukraine no longer applies?

Other men

Already Strelkov himself, and his assistant, and assistants to assistants, and all who could be, called upon men to take up arms if they were still men ... Sorry, Southeast, but a handful of shooters-enthusiasts for the seven million people of the LC and DRN are disgrace. If we merge the Southeast, it turns out that only “150 shooters” will be able to blame a country with a 300-million population for non-intervention? Hmm ... Yes, in general, the public is small ... we can endure.

culture

Modern Russian culture, with rare exceptions, is a full barn. "To a tee", "One to One" - some talentless people compete with others; crooked mirrors and petrosianism. The actors did not laugh out loud with 90's. Not nakrivlilis yet There are almost no real people in the culture. To inspire us frankly to no one. Only proven hits 1941-1945, only hardcore.

Information support

Has anything changed with 08.08.08? Even Russia Today has not yet bothered to translate into all European languages. So far, only English. Maybe there is a purely military units for information counteraction? No, have not heard…

Мы

A big war is a mobilization economy, discipline and known deprivation and hardship. Sitting on blogs and shooting tanks is awesome. And on the horizontal bar for a long time pulled up? You are not like a shot, you are still on the march all take a breather ... (I ask you not to worry about some correct comrades.)

They

And heard, Lukashenko tanks pulled off to the border? No, have you heard? And Nazarbayev, they say, he himself offered Putin a whole Kazakhstan battalion? Also no?

Pros

International prestige

The whole world is looking at Slavyansk. All our future victories and successes for decades to come are decided there. China, Syria ... They are watching too. And make decisions.

Crimea

No illusions: Crimea will be surrendered after the South-East. Did you manage to buy cheap tickets?

Humanitarian disaster

Food and water will be over soon. Autumn and winter are also inevitable. So let's look at how the Russians will starve or freeze? Yes, of course, we will then have a good reason to remind Svidomo their own "famine." And we need it?

All that is alien to you is no longer yours.

The country, with the stubbornness of a maniac bombing, burning, humiliating the Donetsk and Lugansk regions, is losing the right to consider these regions as its own every day. Purely logical reason - iron. It is strange that it has not yet been picked up by networks and analysts.

What outweighs and which option is better? For me, so far, “both are worse” (© JV Stalin).

Now the pendulum has swung, but so far nothing has moved. I wish the leadership of Russia not to miss the moment. And the people of the South-East - to consult with their own conscience. This is primarily their land. And by and large, except for them, no one will solve anything there.

Comments

[comprochikos]

The author is right. Apart from the residents of Yu-V themselves, no one will solve their problems. But to help in any way you need.

[Reasonable, 2,3]

Inconvenient article. But correct. I support. It is necessary to think.

[Ivan Petrovich]

on the debilitation of children http://www.contrtv.ru/repress/4949/
oh yes, not a word about football, which is strange, about millionaire idlers ...

[WKS]

At the moment, the Russian army is capable of defeating all the armed forces of Ukraine within a few days on fingers. But what's next? There is no Ukrainian army, we were gouging it, the rebel army is in its infancy, at best several thousand people, and 35 zombified Ukrainian mass media (000 now sympathizing), a poor population willingly jumping to confirm their loyalty. In New Russia there will be problems with establishing a peaceful life, not to mention Little Russia and Galicia. What to do with the international reaction to such overt aggression? And there is no doubt that the reaction will follow immediately. Ukraine is now a legally independent state. What to do with the reaction inside Russia when zinc boxes with 000 are brought here.
Isn't it better to wait for the natural development of civil confrontation in Ukraine? Those efforts of the existing government that exist there today and sluggish social processes will lead not later than autumn to the fact that a mass of 35 zombies will thinn sharply. And by the new year will be a clear minority. And when there are only frank Bandera people among the zombies, it is possible that the then authorities would expel all American advisers from the country and would turn to Russia for help in the fight against Kolomoisky and Poroshenko.

[GRune]

It seems to me that the number of zombies will not decrease, they will also become aggressive as they will be explained to them that Putin was personally to blame for all the troubles ...

[irina.mmm]

When there will be hunger, cold, poverty, the zombie PR will quickly pass. This is now Russia is the enemy of current interest. As soon as they sign an agreement with the EU, everyone will understand right away.
And in the EU they will not lamb.
By the way, the miners of 80 people went to war (that's great). And at the rally, how many miners were there. Where are the others? Are they waiting another two days?

[UFO]

Quote: wks

What to do with the reaction inside Russia when zinc boxes with 200 are brought here.

That's for sure, the wounds of the 2 Chechens are still too fresh.

Quote: wks

What to do with the international reaction to such overt aggression? And there is no doubt that the reaction will follow immediately.

But is it necessary? If Russia is so obvious ...

Quote: wks

Isn't it better to wait for the natural development of civil confrontation in Ukraine? Those efforts of the existing government that exist there today and sluggish social processes will lead not later than autumn to the fact that a mass of 35 zombies will thinn sharply. And by the new year will be a clear minority. And when there are only frank Bandera people among the zombies, it is possible that the then authorities would expel all American advisers from the country and would turn to Russia for help in the fight against Kolomoisky and Poroshenko.

I adhere to exactly the same conclusion. It can be added that in order to "speed up the process" it is necessary to help various kinds of "humanitarian aid".
"Set fire to the steppe" - to spread the hostilities to other regions of Novorossiya and Kiev, tk. the local society will need time to decide on the parties to the conflict (this is for the paragraphs "mortgage", "miners" and "other men" in the article), let them feel the "charms" of the ATO on their own skin,

[nikbor]

We are still talking about inconvenience! So everything is clear for a long time, and everything is harnessed by the Russian people ... and surrender everything for a short time - and yourself loved ones ...

[Predator]

Thinking is always necessary. But there are a lot of questions. The mobilization resource of the LPR and the DPR is clearly not 2-3 thousand people. Where are the others?! Weapons will be delivered, by hook or by crook, but you can or may not need to repair the Junta’s equipment? They know where it will be applied, but it will be repaired. Remember the words, the revolution should be able to defend itself?! So why are some at checkpoints with machine guns, others at work in Kiev, and still others at home?! The first have every right to ask, where are you from Russia? heroes, but very few! Everyone will rise, they will be recognized, and they will receive full help. In the meantime, to hold on and hold on! Without the aid will not leave!

[Letun]

Correct, but not in everything. It has become very fashionable now to say that after the Donbass dill will take over the Crimea? I wonder how the author (and the rest) imagine this? Will they be taken away by force? Or do you think Putin, under pressure from the Empire of Good, will say: "Well, ok, I was wrong, I am returning Crimea back to Ukraine"?
Are you seriously?

[brisk]

Quote: Letun

Correct, but not in everything. It has become very fashionable now to say that after the Donbass dill will take over the Crimea? I wonder how the author (and the rest) imagine this? Will they be taken away by force? Or do you think Putin, under pressure from the Empire of Good, will say: "Well, ok, I was wrong, I am returning Crimea back to Ukraine"?
Are you seriously?

And you also read Glazyev Sergey Yuryevich, the last statements about this whole story. He is Putin’s personal adviser. Not a simpleton, therefore. This is not the same Sergei Yurievich who loves to talk with the TV. Something yes understands. And a native, by the way, of Zaporozhye, the very, most, so to speak, Southeast. He knows the local area and its inhabitants firsthand.

[slava777]

about the fact that we surrender the Crimea I do not believe. here I’ll surrender the extra word inserted. I meant what exactly will be engaged. then of course they have no strength to take away. explanations - below on a forum.

[hiryrg]

It's time to act, stop chewing snot. Cover the whole of Ukraine with one night throw, return the legitimate Yanukovych, let him sit until legal re-election. During this time, catch all extremists and throw them into Poland. Otherwise, upholding only the South-East will take a protracted, bloody character with sabotage war on Russian territory.

[azbukin77]

General phrases, no specifics! All this is idle talk.

[krpmlws]

Quote: azbukin77

General phrases, no specifics! All this is idle talk

I support. The author of the article from the very beginning of his article sets a false restriction:

Quote: azbukin77

enter or merge

The author is maliciously silent about the third option — helping Novorossia, thereby diverting the attention of readers from the essence of the problem. Obviously, we are dealing with yet another pro-government creation that has the only goal: to whitewash the inactive policy of the authorities. The author of the article does not seek to delve into the situation, find the truth , therefore, the article is replete with lies and speculation, banal and nagging arguments flooding this site. Designed for the undemanding level of readers. Unfortunately, many support the position of the article, despite but the fact that all the arguments of false positions repeatedly refuted, but zombie readers continues with admirable tenacity.

[slava777]

laughed a perfume :-)
you take everything to heart very much.
Regarding the claim under the third option - I agree. but here I cut the article too short. it is not malicious. about this - hereinafter referred to as my belated comment.
less cliches and accusations. but more concrete proposals and a clear analysis.

[krpmlws]

Quote: slava777

laughed a perfume :-) you take everything to heart very much

But I’m somehow not funny, knowers, the situation in New Russia does not have humor.

Quote: slava777

Regarding the claim under the third option - I agree. but here I cut the article too short. this is not malicious

Based on the fact.

Quote: slava777

less cliches and accusations. and more concrete proposals and clear analysis

My commentary revealed the essence of your creation, a more detailed analysis would have drawn to a separate article. In addition, all your ideas and concepts were repeatedly voiced in similar articles and comments on this forum, respectively, articles and comments (including mine) were published containing rebuttals. If you are interested (I doubt it), you can think of a more detailed answer to your article, which I can send to you in PM.

[woron333444]

What specifics are on the forum? We’ll expect specifics from the Kremlin.

[Evgesh91]

When the real mass is going, special weapons are not required.
right? against tanks, planes and generally the army how? throw caps, or wave footcloths ??

[tor11121]

When you lock it, you'll be tearing your teeth. And GIVE ME A TANK UNDER THE BACK OF YOURSELF THEN I CAN AND A NEW RESPONSE.

[GDP]

When you lock it, you'll be tearing your teeth. And GIVE ME A TANK UNDER THE BACK OF YOURSELF THEN I CAN AND A NEW RESPONSE.

And how will you tear a tank with your teeth? Seals do not fly?
A plane over 3,5 km? - can you put a stool?

It's always easier to talk about someone else’s heroism. But when you have a family, work, an apartment for which you have to pay, then you often have to put heroism somewhere ...

And this is not the only point. We are all used to living in a peaceful country and until the war touches - IT IS YOU, you will not take a gun and go to kill people on the street, all who act differently - Heroes, there are thousands of them in the Southeast and this is not enough ...

Reasons why Russia is afraid to send troops - 3

1 - Turkey, in case of troop entry, promised to block the straits for all of our ships
2. - multibillion-dollar investment losses in the West and at the same time the insufficiency of own resources and production base in distinguishes from the USA or the USSR.
3 - the collapse of Russia's concept of a multipolar world and the rule of international law, which we opposed the US imperial world and its cult of power, and this is a geopolitical check and checkmate.

[tor11121]

DO NOT HERE TO SPEAK FOR ANOTHER HEROISM. EVERYONE MUST RESPOND FOR MYSELF. WHAT BEFORE TANKS AND AIRCRAFT, THEY ARE ALSO ON THE EARTH AND FILL AND SERVICE IS PASSED AND MANAGED BY SIMPLE DEATH.

[slava777]

here I am about it. true thought understood.

[ArhipenkoAndrey]

Or maybe for the better, so that Turkey cut off the straits? I am an Opponent of troop entry, but I did not hear about the fact that the Turks promised to block the straits, but what about the fear of all the same, the loss of investment? Or maybe just start to work for yourself, not for Western or Eastern money? Then maybe, but what kind of country is it independent?

[GDP]

NATO countries have put our country in a very uncomfortable position and are actively using it now, in fact, we are offered a choice of two options:
1 - continue to endure and blushing with shame in front of the whole world, swaggering and bullying his nose. (I think they are sure that we will go with this option)
2 - Send everyone to .... Intervene openly and force Ukraine to peace, Lock itself in the Iron Curtain, lose international influence and remain with holey pockets, but proud and undefeated.

It seems to me that Putin is trying to find a third option ... On the one hand, he does not seem to intervene officially, does not violate international law, on the other hand, he tries to help the Southeast at an unofficial level, in the hope that they themselves will solve the problem ... (In any case we will remain Crimea)

The junta, in principle, is also satisfied with the third option, since, using the advantage in heavy weapons, they continue to slowly crowd and surround the rebels. The main thing for them is not to weaken the onslaught on Russia and prevent the supply of heavy weapons, so the border is being isolated by all means. As a result, the first option is still implemented. NATO’s bloc will demonstrate to the whole world that we are not only not a world power, but not even a regional power, and only the USA is a real force that everyone should reckon with ...

As for the economic independence of our country, this takes time and resources, which we can get only if the government takes very unpopular measures and restrictions that affect the entire population of Russia for many years. As a result, Putin and United Russia may lose the support of the people and lose power ...

[slava777]

I have a general suspicion that all attempts to understand Comrade. Obama is devoid of any sense. maybe nicknames and no options? usual vitamin deficiency? most likely not only vitamin D :-)

[aleks700]

Reasons why Russia is afraid to send troops - 3

1 - Turkey, in case of troop entry, promised to block the straits for all of our ships
2. - multibillion-dollar investment losses in the West and at the same time the insufficiency of own resources and production base in distinguishes from the USA or the USSR.
3 - the collapse of Russia's concept of a multipolar world and the rule of international law, which we opposed the US imperial world and its cult of power, and this is a geopolitical check and checkmate.

But what when the guarantor asked for permission to send troops to Ukraine, he did not know about it? Analysts did not calculate? In any case, they are worthless on a market day. Investments will be lost in any case. Crossing the straits unilaterally is a violation of international treaties. Russia's concept of a multipolar world and international law is nonsense. There is the right of the strong. USA in this case. The surrender of positions by Russia automatically means that it is possible to impose sanctions with impunity, shelling the territory and all that the gentlemen in the State Department will think of.

[GDP]

Soul and heart, I agree with you ...

One could obtain official permission to send peacekeeping troops from Yanukovych ...

One could recall the Montreux Convention, which Turkey did not dare to violate even in the Second World War.

You can spit on the UN to send troops, as the United States often does, there would be no third world war, that's for sure ...

What part of our population is ready to make the price of 30-40% soar for our pride and, accordingly, our salaries will decrease by the same amount? I think I'm ready to make these sacrifices, how many more are ready? 90% 70? 40? 10? What do you think?

In our schools, for 25 years there has been virtually no patriotic upbringing, In the society there is a cult of money, a cult of individualism ... I think this figure will not exceed 20%, and in Moscow, among officials and businessmen, it will be a maximum of 5%. I wish I was wrong ...

[slava777]

exactly. they answered their own question. about patriotism. for example, I donate a little to the militia every month. but how many are capable of self-restraint? judging by all those who care, everyone is already here. sparsely comes out ...

[SIROP73]

I fully support your opinion. The President, the State Duma assured that they would not allow the extermination of Russians in Ukraine, and when Donbass took up arms everyone was silent. The referendum in Crimea was supported by the whole of Russia, rallies across the country were broadcast on all news channels, and the referendum was broadcast Donbass was simply ignored, as if it didn’t exist. Until now, no one has recognized either the DPR or the LPR except South Ossetia, who themselves have been in this situation. As a result, after Donbass, Poroshenko will go to Crimea, Russia will not wage war Avoid. Except Russia does not recognize the Russian Crimea.

[Val_y]

I agree, either another "couch strategist" as they say "piz..there are no bags to carry, you can as much as you like", or a provocateur, then worse, it means he is at work. But still, as one classic said, "a significant advantage in artillery, a serious argument in negotiations", so ... Strength is also needed and diplomacy I’ll add by the way this pep about miners http://russian.rt.com/article/37666

[saag]

"... I was really scared for the whole time in Semenovka only at the moment when I was filming the bodies of Sever and Gypsy. We saw from a neighboring position: their crew was covered with a direct hit from a tank. It crashed so that the concrete blocks jumped And the corpses (they must have been thrown and then slapped into the asphalt) looked kind of elongated, twisted, soft like plasticine in the sun ... "

It’s for those bells and whistles. which will tear all teeth

[tor11121]

FOR HORROR YOU CAN NOT EXPLAIN. NOT ONE YOU SEE THEM. SPEECH TOTALLY ABOUT OTHER. ABOUT THOSE HOUSES SITS AND MOANS.

[armageddon]

Hmm ... Weapons WENT ... and WILL GO ... !!! While the last bender is not dug ... !!!

[saag]

Quote: Armagedon

Armament WAS GOING ... AND WILL GO

"..." Fucking bogeyman and rotten footcloths of a Pravosek! Past, into the sky! What the hell? "The boatswain is indignant indescribably." Everything is done correctly, but the rocket flies to zero. Come on again!

The next three shots also went to the sky. The bottom line: the ammunition for the ATGM and the device itself has long developed a resource. All. We are fighting against tanks with grenade launchers and sniper rifles (snipers hit optics
and fuel tanks, sometimes extremely efficiently). "

This is for the "suppliers"

[tux]

Quote: Evgesh91

When the real mass is going, special weapons are not required.
right? against tanks, planes and generally the army how? throw caps, or wave footcloths ??

And what did the partisans fight in the Second World War? But then everything was occupied and there were millions of invaders.

[armageddon]

Hmm ... Same as now ... WERE DELIVERY FROM THE CENTER ... !!!

[SHAKESPEARE]

Quote: tux.topwar

Quote: Evgesh91

When the real mass is going, special weapons are not required.
right? against tanks, planes and generally the army how? throw caps, or wave footcloths ??

And what did the partisans fight in the Second World War? But then everything was occupied and there were millions of invaders.

At present, militiamen are defending their cities, they have not yet been occupied, if you go to partisans on someone else’s territory, then the war will be pointless, because whom we defended will be destroyed, and some will be stolen to the camps for filtering, that's all to you. And what the author writes about the miners, it is rightly said that if every one left their deep bomb shelter and took up arms and went on the offensive, they would have won already long ago, there would have been plenty of weapons, the Russians had already spoken. there is no one to give it to, but now time is lost and will be much harder. Of the seven million two regions, at least 500 thousand people could be put under arms.

[tux]

Quote: SHEKSPIR

At present, militiamen are defending their cities, they have not yet been occupied, if you go to partisans on someone else’s territory, then the war will be pointless, because whom we defended will be destroyed, and some will be stolen to the camps for filtering, that's all to you. And what the author writes about the miners, it is rightly said that if every one left their deep bomb shelter and took up arms and went on the offensive, they would have won already long ago, there would have been plenty of weapons, the Russians had already spoken. there is no one to give it to, but now time is lost and will be much harder. Of the seven million two regions, at least 500 thousand people could be put under arms.

Entirely and completely agree.

[slava777]

What I mean is the concrete work to eliminate the Kiev Kaule Gauleiter. literally a few people were involved then. from the center of course. but nothing supernatural. then it was called the line t (terror). that’s how they fought fascism. no discounts. but it must be really desperate to be. but this is again a return to the question of the readiness of the east to act.

[rf xnumx]

Quote: Evgesh91

When the real mass is going, special weapons are not required. right? against tanks, planes and generally the army how? throw caps, or wave footcloths ??

They still (MLRS) tornado pulled, really will level everything

[Bobxnumx]

As I understand it, everything is in order with weapons; there is no one to fight.

[Nahum]

People are sitting in tanks, and partisan-sabotage methods must be fought against them. They are not in tanks for 24 hours. Places of deployment of personnel, communication systems, supplies, control - these are the objects of sudden point night strikes. Plus a mine war. Avoid direct clashes. Ukrobands can not be considered a real army. These are punitive detachments and should be dealt with accordingly.
Russia should not send troops into Ukrlandia, it is necessary to help with weapons, ammunition, humanitarian aid, intelligence, volunteers, and to use electronic warfare forces to suppress control and communications. Well, you can come up with something. I am a purely civilian person and this is my personal incompetent opinion. Competent - for professionals. Definitely - it is not necessary to give in to provocation. The Americans are just waiting for this from Russia. Here, emotions are not an assistant to us. Only a pure calculation, both military and political. As if his hands were not scratched.

[SIROP73]

Plus mine war. And you think in Donbass mines are sold in stores. My brother-in-law enrolled in volunteers, for 10 people a couple of hunting rifles, and so on sticks and cocktails. Do you stand on this at the checkpoint. Do you get a lot of equipment against machine guns and armor? There are no commanders, these are all military specialists, and there the men who served urgent 20-30 years ago, and not everyone in the Airborne Forces.

[Nahum]

SO AND HELP OVER weapons, mines and specialists. Train local rebels. At the volunteer checkpoints they put not to fight, but to monitor the situation and check the vehicles. They have nothing to do against armored vehicles. They reported what was noticed - and quickly fell into the bushes. Nefig heroes make up themselves. It’s necessary to fight wisely!

[Egen]

omitting some small nit-picking points by point, everything has long been clear and understandable; did not understand the main thing from the article - and what? :) Explain, please :(

[kombat58]

And nothing!
So pat your tongue! SHOW YOURSELF!
Brevity is not always talent, but only in the presence of CLARITY!
There is a continuous fog of slogans, and a lack of understanding of what is happening.

[A. Yaga]

And while the Kharkov workers are collecting tanks to kill their compatriots drinking beer in front of the TV in New Russia, the Russian troops have nothing to do there.

[slava777]

the purpose of the article was not propaganda or complacency like Leontyev or the old man, they say everything is fine there, everything is ruled by itself ... but just to estimate facts without emotions. no propaganda or calls. or do you need an obligation to call for something?

[Giant thought]

It is necessary to officially recognize Novorossia, or the DPR and LPR separately, to conclude an urgent agreement with them and provide them with full assistance, only in this way we can save them.

[nikolaj1703]

Do they want to be saved?

[gsg955]

The author is right - we cannot be southeast residents more than themselves ...

[potap48a]

The development plan will be as follows: now they are clearing the southeast, and then the Americans give the junta an order to go to the Crimea. What will Putin do then. You’ll have to fight anyway.

[GDP]

They won’t go to Crimea, but there will be sweeps in the southeast
And a new hostile state will appear on our borders ...
And millions of Russian-speaking Russophobes who are ready to undermine our state from the inside will also appear, and it is not known which of this is worse ...

[a52333]

And then they will continue to tell their grandchildren: well, they say, we fought with the Russians ...

so they will all the same ... despite the fact that we will introduce troops or not. This is the case if kuev remains kuev and a traitor city (they refused the title of a hero. At 30% - FOR and 70% - abstained)
And if you spit to the west? Swallowed. Crimea, Ossetia, Syria, Abkhazia swallowed?

[bif]

Quote: a52333

despite the fact that we will introduce troops or not.

Sanctions in any case ... but

When our tanks cross the border, all dogs will be lowered on us with a clear conscience. The Great War looms on the horizon.

There won’t be a big war, the states until they are sure that they will win, they won’t go for it, and when they are sure they will have a reason and will not be needed ...

[brisk]

Quote: a52333

This is if kuev remains kuev

What kind of people! The hand will fall off to write or the language to say: "Kiev"? From all this, relationships are formed. This site was created for serious people, not for "real padonkoffs". It doesn't seem to be here http://udaff.com/

[snifer]

Scary, creepy and not clear, all this, what is happening in the world now . Suddenly out of nowhere ...

[asar]

The article is somehow "diverse"! "I stand at a crossroads - I don't know where to go"! One thing I agree - the male population of the SE, with the exception of the "Strelkovites", is "sleeping"! Or runs to Russia! But this is your land, your houses ...! (For your information - on the horizontal bar "I twist the sun", I pull myself up 30 times, I do push-ups "fifty dollars", "I ran on the strip" - I’m not dead! And I’m already under the "fifty dollars"!)

[bif]

Quote: asar

The article is somehow "diverse"! "I stand at a crossroads

Yes, as a well-known fairy tale: "If you go to the right, you will lose a horse, if you go to the left, you will disappear yourself, you will go straight - ..."

[Agat]

I wish there was a third way! A small chance that Poroshenko will be with Putin on one side of the barricades. Poroshenko and earlier knew how to adapt to current events. Then America is left with nothing! You never know!

[psg72]

Poroshenko dancing to the American tune.

[VNP1958PVN]

"If you go to the right, you will lose your horse, if you go to the left, you will disappear yourself, you will go straight ahead - ..."

You’ll go straight, you’ll be all in shit, but proud!

[mrDimkaP]

The fact is that if you merge, then simply merge. And if you rock it then something can still come out. Perhaps it will work out.

[nickname 1 and 2]

such as oh, ah, but there is no noticeable argument: if they themselves rise !?

That's it! And will we grind up the grind? And the enemies will start yelling: who called you? where are they? Yes it seemed to you! Yes, because of a handful of dissenting people, you have grind the mule of the people. The killers!

After all, now the press is a PROJECTOR! and then - prove it !!!!! These are your falsifications!

ARTISTIC WHISTLE EVERYTHING - there are no recorded facts yet! It must be recognized facts, evidence, all sorts of international organizations! So that.

[Junior, I]

Sooner or later, we still have to send troops.
But those who still in the LPR and the DPR have not picked up automatic machines, but are cutting loot, It’s a shame.
They think of sitting out on kennels. So they get to them.
Miners like 2 gave days, nothing is heard about them.

[Max_Bauder]

Quote: Younger, I

Miners like 2 gave days, nothing is heard about them.

I saw the news, have already taken up arms.

[muhomor]

Yes sir! 11 fresh battalions were formed. (From related sources) But I don’t know the full-time staff.

[nickname 1 and 2]

Sooner or later, we still have to send troops.

EARLY - impossible; LATE - silly! TIME - it is necessary!

[Evgesh91]

When you lock, you will tear your teeth so it’s also necessary to reach the teeth, and the teeth do not look against the tank ...

[Pavellio]

And I personally got this panic in the media and the Internet already.

[Vit0c]

To help ... Do not leave the Russians ... I agree!
But a reasonable question arises - why should I give up "making money", leave my family and go to Rostov (go to the military registration and enlistment office for mobilization), while the DOBASS miners continue to "earn money" in the adit ?!

[SHOCK.]

Too much information, contradictory. That Strelkovtsev ten thousand, then twenty, and now only three hundred. Only recently there was an article about the formation of military units from miners, before that I read almost about the army of Ukrainians working in Russia. Where is that !! ?? What or whom to believe?
Therefore, it is better to think with your head and not throw up hysteria. The truth is somewhere in the middle.

[FASO]

Quote: Younger, I

Sooner or later, we still have to send troops.
But those who still in the LPR and the DPR have not picked up automatic machines, but are cutting loot, It’s a shame.
They think of sitting out on kennels. So they get to them.
Miners like 2 gave days, nothing is heard about them.

That's for sure, except for 3 battalions in Donetsk gathered, and so they sit in the mines. It's just not clear to whom they cut the coal ???

[frostof63]

arguments "against" - everything is mostly correct, in one form or another they have already flashed in the press and the internet, I do not quite agree with the paragraph "We", but maybe I belong to the "separate correct comrades" ??))) arguments "For "- what I strongly disagree with is about Crimea and the humanitarian disaster, more like from the realm of fantasy, or after watching imported films about life after a nuclear disaster))) trade contacts with the West, Europe, this is certainly very good, but this is not a panacea , there is China and India, because it was no coincidence that they decided to build a new pipe to China

[nahalenok911]

The result of integrating all the differential parts of the article is that we, in the general mass, do not have all the necessary information to analyze and predict a decision, which we will not make anyway. And to argue with each other, "swing" .. well .. not new. In a heightened desire for Truth and Justice to prevail, and not to betray the People.

[Iskander Khan]

Who is registered on ukrosaystaykh. Please re-post. Great article for them and for our alarmists. Start to reach.
Is it really a hangover?
http://warfiles.ru/show-62122-neuzheli-prishlo-pohmele.html

[Landwarrior]

Link is dead, empty

[White53]

The matter of rescuing the drowning is the work of the drowning themselves! Well, let us put trucks with weapons to the South-East and who to distribute? But in Russia there are already quite a lot of not only women and children, but also lads of quite defensive age! and laughter and grief! Everywhere they shoot and they chop a coal for the oligarch! Top of idiocy !!!!!

[Hyperboreas]

That's what interests me! If ALL residents of the South-East want freedom and independence so much, and the Kiev junta wants to destroy them for this, then why is only a small handful of militias fighting for freedom and independence. The rest of the respectable men either bring them to Russia under the guise of refugees or try to sit out confessing the slogan "My hut is on the edge." In my opinion, this implies the following either there everything is not as simple as it seems at first glance, or most of the population there, excuse me, are just cowards and egoists who think exclusively about themselves and who want someone else to rake in the heat and die in the struggle for independence, but he is so smart and handsome, he will look from the outside and come when everything is resolved somehow. This does not in any way apply to the militias who defend their freedom with weapons in their hands.

[Iline]

The article tried to collect opinions on the situation of different groups, although these opinions are already known even in this forum. The point is - to send troops in the absence of support from the bulk of the population is direct aggression against a sovereign state with all the ensuing consequences. Help can be provided, but specifically to whom? Strelkova guys, this is my personal opinion, no problem. Who else? And no one asks, everyone is so good. Here sit and think.

[Yellow white]

whether the southeast rises or not, to disentangle us!

[papont64]

Quote: Evgesh91

When you lock, you will tear your teeth so it’s also necessary to reach the teeth, and the teeth do not look against the tank ...

And why did you forget about Molotov cocktails, on Maidan and Odessa they worked right-wingers with a bang, miners they just haven’t stepped eggs yet they don’t get out of the mines, they don’t know that they won’t sit underground and get cleaned, like cattle. But obviously they have not yet peppered ...

[Rigla]

Sooner or later, any trash such as law enforcement officers and private armies of oligarchs will begin to climb into the Crimea for anyone, to carry out terrorist attacks there and in every possible way to spoil, so we won’t have to sit out. In the event that New Russia falls, Bandera will not give us rest.

[psg72]

Do you think any trash under the guise of refugees has not already leaked to RUSSIA? What a convenient chance you will check so many people. Yes, and take off will be many times more difficult than a Ukrainian from a Russian in appearance you will not distinguish. We are one people.

[region46]

the author made fun of Crimea .... about the fact that he will be handed over ... they know how to count everything, but a large amount has already been invested in Crimea, and it’s not for that that he was taken to give

[slava777]

about draining the Crimea got excited. I don’t know how it happened. I wanted to say that the Crimea will inevitably take. to give then of course we will not give up in any situation. provocations, terrorist attacks and other things are quite real to themselves.

[Hyperboreas]

Yes, when the author wrote about Crimea, his brain obviously turned off or turned off at that time !!!

[Egoza]

Now I cannot find exactly in which (LPR or DPR) republic, but FOR THE FIRST TIME everything earned by the miners remained "in place", i.e. was not sent to Kiev. Accordingly, they were able to issue benefits, pensions and salaries. Despite the cries of our media that people are sitting there without money. So it's not for nothing that miners work, although not everywhere, of course.

[BMVIK]

Quote: Evgesh91

When the real mass is going, special weapons are not required.
right? against tanks, planes and generally the army how? throw caps, or wave footcloths ??

You can recall Odessa, Chabanka, miners who only armed with grenades, carried out the Fritz. Weapons were obtained in battle. Of course, I do not call for the same, but there were precedents.

[Bobxnumx]

Everything is painted right! Indeed, few are fighting, I mean the male population, the rest are engaged in verbiage and are waiting for someone to do something for them. Whether it’s a very serious question to get into Russia or not, and what is more, pluses or minuses is a question of questions.

[97110]

I will try to give my thoughts about the deployment of troops.
1. How many troops are there? Well, there are 76, 86, something else super - duper. And who will be banal to keep the front, to protect communications, to carry out a lot of other work, without which there has been no war for 2500 years, if not more. These are the ones that "I can't forgive Putin"? Who were mowed down by the army, because the boys from the older group offended them in kindergarten and they know what bullying is. Who will "steadfastly and courageously endure the hardships and deprivations of military service"?
2. Who will forge Victory in the rear? Managers, traders, security guards? Please look at the APU. They are? All the time, returning from Ukraine, I thought: "like ours, only worse."
3. Who will be in command? I remember when I served as an urgent, they said about some of the officers - Zhukov's training. They didn’t write on combat papers, the personnel spoke. And often these tough and demanding people were called "dad" behind their backs. And they didn't have hazing. They are no longer there, and there will not be enough of 76 paratroopers for the entire army. What are the repeat lieutenants taught? I'm not talking about technology. Can they command people? Will they be able to send a soldier who had a "quiet hour" and suction service to death?
4. Well and the main thing. Who will lead us. Who will inspire personnel with a personal example? Putin? Or maybe Serdyukov, Prokhorov, Abramovich?

[Hyperboreas]

Do not exaggerate so much! There are still normal commanders who can both ask and take care of a fighter, maybe not in active service but in reserve certainly (the consequences of Taburentin reforms). And there are two-year-old officers who, by their moral and business qualities and level of training, can give odds to staff officers. So not everything is so bad. Although scary from the one who serves in our army.

[bistrov.]

I put the article a plus, but I do not completely agree with the author. Firstly, there is also a third way or method that is now being applied is the conduct of hostilities by highly trained limited groups and volunteers. Another thing is not active and fast enough. Few diplomatic, economic, propaganda methods are used; they need to be intensified. And the second, about the Crimea, the author broke the nonsense. Who will give it now? Climbing there by the military forces for Ukraine is tantamount to suicide. Even stupid Turchinovs and Yatsenyuk understood this. And thirdly, every day of military operations against its people weakens Ukraine (the fascist regime) not only financially, but also psychologically and draws its end as a state. It is clear that Russia can’t avoid a big war for Ukraine, but even win for half a year- year of peace and using it to strengthen the Army is already a big deal.

[slava777]

I don’t be too lazy about Crimea for the third time; wrote on the stoves and fast.
but about the propaganda straight plus. this is a real misfortune with us. I wrote about it below on this fork below.

[mackonya]

Why, the one who does not own all the information on this situation, begins to give advice or blame someone. If the author limits himself to only two options "we enter or merge", which can still be discussed here, there are a lot of options, from political to economic.

[Vit0c]

There will be a war - IMHO, many of those who have the opportunity to board the ship - and to Brazil ...

[slava777]

it’s easier for me, I know Prussian :-)

[Samsebenaum]

Weighing all the pros and cons in global politics is not necessary now, after catching yourself.
This is done years earlier ... Options and preventive measures are calculated there.
This is me to the topic.
The article is "dead". About nothing.
I do not like that they took the fashion to bring everything to the miners. Like, they don’t fight ...
My question is: miners, who are they? Personnel military, pros - thugs?
We want them to do the dirty work for us:
I am firmly convinced that Ukraine is our failure, defeat. We "screwed up" in full.
We rake.
If cockroaches or rats are wound up in your home, they need to be poisoned, not negotiated a peaceful coexistence.

[Anchonsha]

Samsebenaume Well, you sweetened up a dear friend in Ukraine, so go and rake there. Russia did not mow there in any way, and our country is not a country that could, like the United States, allow itself aggression against other countries. Our motto is: act in accordance with international law. Or maybe Ukraine allowed you to decide on their internal affairs, how did it work for them from the USA? So Russia will not again sprinkle ash on its head, which is to blame for the current situation in Ukraine. We already poured ash on our heads with the help of crappy liberals (among whom there are few purely Slavs bearing Russian names and surnames) that now we are reaping the fruits and looking for in our past what was good and what was bad. the people of Donbass itself have not fully risen, so there is something to think about and there is no need to justify the miners that they are not military experts. Where are the specialists then to protect their land? In such minutes, everyone becomes specialists.

[saag]

"... Hmm ... Yes, in general, the audience is small ... we will endure."
I believe that there was already shelling on the Russian side, they endured it, and so it will reach Moscow with such patience, "one time not ..."

"There is clearly no one to inspire us."
So far, more than half of the population is inspired by GDP

"... When a really mass is going, special weapons are not required."
What nonsense, all this mass will start to scatter when they start to hit it with machine guns and mortars, but they have nothing to answer.

"... No illusions: Crimea will be surrendered behind the South-East."
You are good at it, although Crimea was handed over in any military mess, even in the science fiction novel "Island of Crimea"

"... What outweighs and which option is better? For me, so far" both are worse "(© I. V. Stalin)."
There is a third option with the supply of heavy weapons, this is not the deployment of troops, but they are not in a hurry to resort to it, probably taking a storage base in Artyomovsk stops, so at least they helped specialists with spare parts and ammunition, not fate ...

[cheega69]

To begin with, there is no and will not be a good deal for Russia, not for that, all the porridge was brewed. For miners, I fully support it. Could at least take control over the territory, so as not to pull the fighters. Touching healthy men in the form of refugees, even crying. The question is who is fighting the junta there?

[The Art of War]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eL-G3Zdjig

[yana532912]

About Crimea - it's cool. This is a subject of the Russian Federation. Although I’m a middle-aged girl, but if necessary, I will bring cartridges, but the topic of Crimea should be closed forever. Look at the refugees, especially in the Crimea, because the young men have fled, but they scream that the GDP has passed them. They do not want to protect their land, then welcome to us in the Far East, to develop the territory. No one will decide for them.

[yulka2980]

I support you! As you look at the healthy men running from there, it becomes so disgusting. And even today in the morning I watched the news as one aunt accused us, saying that you don’t send your soldiers to help ?? !! And there’s an ambul behind you, a relative So why should we send our children and husbands if they take care of our Guess the cons

[Semurg]

Quote: yana532912

About Crimea - it's cool. This is a subject of the Russian Federation. Although I’m a middle-aged girl, but if necessary, I will bring cartridges, but the topic of Crimea should be closed forever. Look at the refugees, especially in the Crimea, because the young men have fled, but they scream that the GDP has passed them. They do not want to protect their land, then welcome to us in the Far East, to develop the territory. No one will decide for them.

About 50 years ago, Charles de Gaulle uttered the phrase "French Algeria" (as if we will protect the French everywhere), and on this motto he became President of France for the second time after the break. Over time, realizing that "Algeria" was hard to drag, he merged it and made peace with the leader of the Algerians, and got a war from himself 1) military specialists that they thought he had thrown them against the world 2) civil-patriots and civilian French residents of Algeria, who became the rear base of the French military that opposed the president. In general, he survived 9 or 10 assassination attempts on himself and a surge of terrorism and banditry in France, until he defeated the military organizations and civil activists did not understand that France should be built in France and not in Algeria. History also has such a scenario.

[slava777]

for the fifth time I admit - in the Crimea there’s a drain in vain in the article. wrote nonsense. but problems are provided there.

[Veteran of the Red Army]

If the author limits himself to only two options "we enter or merge", which can still be discussed here, there are a lot of options, from political to economic.

So when are we going to turn them on? When will the government rule from the Urals?

[valentina-makanalina]

Lately people have disaccustomed to do everything with their own hands, even their own destiny. Most have become dependents in this life. There are only a few handy and big-headed ones. These are the units who are fighting for their land, their freedom, their family. And the rest are waiting, whose will take. Maybe it will. We will win - good. And if we do not win, then nothing too - "I didn't take part ...". Such begin to twitch only when this war touches them. Conscientious - in the militia, passive dependents - will run (I mean the men), and some will continue to wait.
So help do not help Russia, but until all the people of the southeast rise, a good result is not to be expected.
The war for the Crimea - only during the third world war. Pah-pah, so as not to jinx it.

[Deff]

until all the people of the southeast rise, a good result is not to be expected.

You can’t wait, + 50 a thousand bayonets are delivered monthly by the Ukrainian army - by autumn it will have 250-300т ..
The question is where the United States will send this army. Answer: See Syria analogue. And the statements of the same Poroshenko, and of all the others about the Crimea-were. Crimea is already Russia.
With a military response, hysteria can again be fanned, about Ukrainian territory and aggressive acts. Statements about NATO exercises in Ukraine this year. Provocations are easily created with damage to NATO personnel and retaliation. Although the vector changes easily, create provocations on the same Rostov border. Say to clean up the remnants of the partisans.

[Anchonsha]

Novorossia daily gnaws at the unrest, murders that are taking place there, and as if guilty of something, although you are in Russia and completely not involved in what is happening in Ukraine. Pros and cons to get in and put things in order. Will order be restored from our presence there? NO. Moreover, a guerrilla war can begin there against us. The Ukrainian people themselves are surprised by their inertness, indifference to their own fate, everyone works together and regularly pays taxes to the junta, while the Harikovites and Odessa residents cook tanks and weapons for the junta against the Donbass and Luhansk oblasts. Or are they hoping for Russia? No, my friends are in quotation marks, you decomposed silently for 23 years separately from Russia, you were satisfied with the growth of the Russian community, spitting on Russia and friendship with the geyropa, and now it suits almost everyone except those fighting for the DPR and LPR.

[yulka2980]

The provocateur writes, lying on the couch and reasoning. Although he does not hide it. About Crimea is bullshit! You still write that we will give the Sakhalin and the Kuril Islands to the Japanese after the South-East! Our Crimea and all!

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: yulka2980

You still write that we will give Sakhalin and the Kuril Islands to the Japanese after

Listen, I'm sure: in the 90s, Moscow was seriously considering the possibility of "surrendering" part of the Kuril Islands to Japan. If you carefully look at all the speeches of the Moscow leadership, you can conclude: "The door is not completely slammed in front of the Kuril contenders" - the "crack" remained. Maybe now, after Crimea and Novorossia, you can be completely calm for the Sakhalin region ?!

[brisk]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Nikolaevich I (1) Today, 12:22 ↑
Quote: yulka2980
You still write that we will give Sakhalin and the Kuril Islands to the Japanese after
Listen, I'm sure: in the 90s, Moscow was seriously considering the possibility of "surrendering" part of the Kuril Islands to Japan. If you carefully look at all the speeches of the Moscow leadership, you can conclude: "The door is not completely slammed in front of the Kuril contenders" - the "crack" remained. Maybe now, after Crimea and Novorossia, you can be completely calm for the Sakhalin region ?!

No you can not. If a peace treaty between Russia and Japan is signed, if the Japanese agree to sign it as proposed by the Russian leadership, and the Russian leadership constantly shows its readiness to discuss and conclude a peace treaty on those Khrushchev promises of 1956, then Shikotan Island and a group of small islands Habomai will be transferred to Japan. This is 325 square kilometers of island land plus an adjacent shelf and sea waters. The questions are different, is - does Russia need such a peace treaty? And for what? Is it good for Russia?

[slava777]

there are so many screams about the provocateur that it seems to me such screamers are the very first provocateurs themselves.
Smaller and bigger in the case.

[His]

We must proceed from what will happen if the South-East is cleaned out. Do you know about Plan B for Waltzman Pig? It consists in asking NATO forces to create a 10 km buffer zone along the borders with Russia. By the way, the main Korean in the UN supported the buffer zone. Then hello to all the militias will be. We will watch how the ovens smoke in Kramatorsk.

[chunga-changa]

Whatever the miners stand up or jump, Donbass will either stand up or merge on its own. In the end, people can escape to Russia, but that is not the point. Putin personally, officially and quite clearly on camera stated: "We will not abandon our Russian people in Ukraine, just try and know the power of our anger." About two weeks after these words, Strelkov captures Slavyansk. And what do we see next. Vukrainians tried in Odessa and nothing. Tried with cannons - again nothing, tried by airplanes - the same story. Now tank units are driving around the Donbas, hailstorms are working, God knows what else is planned, and in response there is silence.
Silence begs questions. The questions are not about the Donbass, everything is clear there, rather questions about Russia. The question is, who pulled Putin's tongue. If he had kept silent then there would have been no war. There would be repressions, but there are no dead old people and children who will be responsible for this blood. The second question is whether the president can silently move away from the topic on which blood is shed and which arose from its submission. Although everyone understands that this is a stupid betrayal. The third and most important. What can Russians expect from such a president. Does this mean that he himself does not care about his words and they do not cost anything at all. Can he then continue to be president. Where is the guarantee that he just as well will not surrender the people of Russia tomorrow. Or maybe he passes? All these juvenile justice, the defeat of education and health. Maybe the theory about bad boyars and a good king is not true, maybe the king is promoting everything bad with us, and the boyars choose for themselves. Or maybe the president doesn’t decide anything at all and says on TV what they tell him. Let’s then choose Bezrukov, or a beautiful woman. The sense will be the same, but it looks nicer. The most interesting thing is that Russian citizens should understand that if they allow the president to do what he does or does not do, then in the eyes of the people of the surrounding states they will participate in what is happening.
If anything, I am against the deployment of troops, but the republics need to be recognized and helped in all areas. It’s better to help people clean their house than to think about how to place and feed millions of people at home.

[Ivan 63]

And yet, apart from entering the aircraft, we were not left with options. I would very much like to hope that the actions of the Air Force and the weapons of the volunteers will be enough. It is impossible to sit behind the "fence" - after the East of Ukraine it will be our turn. It is necessary to completely neutralize our "fifth column" and begin.

[gunya]

Quote: mackonya

Why, the one who does not own all the information on this situation, begins to give advice or blame someone. If the author limits himself to only two options "we enter or merge", which can still be discussed here, there are a lot of options, from political to economic.

I agree that there is not enough information to create a complete picture. Mostly from the media, and they have a god-hearted soul, but where can I get a more complete one?
About the militias: for some reason, actions are not carried out at the level of at least the enemy's bases, the persons of interest are not taken, military equipment is not "confiscated"? In the SA, such actions in some units were not badly taught, are there really no such specialists among the militias?

[Agent 008]

Pay attention: Putin, in his recent TV appearances, looks very insecure, it is noticeable! Vladimir Vladimirovich, as the wise men say: "if you don't know what to do, take a step forward!" And the people will support ...

[His]

Something will pinpoint. Looks like an old one. It's time to change

[krok1984]

Maybe this is because the rates soared to the skies in this game.

[Vend]

No tantrums. No one will hand over the Crimea. Enough to escalate the situation.

[bubla5]

80 miners woke up, already trumpeting about all