The failure of the project "Ukraine" is inevitable

The Ukraine project is collapsing, which is understandable - the world does not tolerate artificial formations, they will be destroyed sooner or later. For two decades of independence, Ukraine has noticeably lagged behind Russia and Kazakhstan in terms of the average standard of living of people. And Ukraine, too, experienced the first wave of the global crisis much harder than other major CIS countries. And then with considerable help from Russia and the West, otherwise Kiev could have become bankrupt even then. It is clear that without major changes, the Ukrainian statehood can not survive the second wave of the global crisis, now the Ukrainian authorities want significant concessions in the "gas issue", reducing social programs.


Thus, the average dollar-equivalent salary in Ukraine in 2010 was 282 in the US dollar, which is a third less than in Belarus, and about two and a half times less than in Russia. Even 20 years ago, the political elite, and indeed a significant part of the population of Ukraine, had rather rosy moods: they had powerful industry, developed agriculture, fertile lands, strong science and education, huge reserves weapons (which is still being sold out in African countries), etc. It seemed that Ukraine had a chance to become one of the developed countries of Europe, at least in line with Poland and the Czech Republic. But already in 90, it became clear that this is an illusion - dreams of “European integration” are another myth imposed by the intelligentsia, a part of the people and led to a catastrophe that could end with the collapse of Little Russia into even more flawed parts or their absorption by stronger neighbors.

The failure of the project "Ukraine" is inevitableUkraine is just negative in multiple degrees, compared with the Russian Federation: a sharp decline in living standards forces Ukrainians to go to work in the EU countries (as well as residents of the Baltic countries) or to Russia so unloved by the Ukrainian Nazis. The society is permeated with the most powerful corruption, social inequality, people's distrust of all state and public institutions, constant internal political tensions, which threaten a new “color revolution”. So, even before the global financial and economic crisis in the 2007 year, according to a poll by the Pew Research Center, only 9% of the country's citizens were confident that Ukraine was moving in the right direction. Research & Branding Group from 1 to 9 in March 2011 conducted a opinion poll - according to it, if referendums on preserving the Soviet Union and supporting the Act of Independence of Ukraine were held today, then 47% of Ukrainian citizens would support the preservation of the Union, in the southeast of these it would be 61%; For 43%, the disappearance of the USSR is "the largest geopolitical catastrophe of the twentieth century."

Even in the 2007 year, the most prosperous year in the 20 years of independence, the level of production and consumption was lower than in recent years as part of the Soviet Union. Economic activity in 2009 fell by 15%, industrial production - by about 25%, the currency was devalued by almost half. If a miracle happens and the world crisis subsides, which is practically impossible, Ukraine will need at least 3-4 years to reach the pre-crisis level of production and consumption.

In Kiev, among the mass of problems, there are two outstanding: the oil and gas monopoly Naftogaz of Ukraine and the Pension Fund. In 2010, subsidies to Naftogaz from the country's budget exceeded health expenditures; to cover the deficit of the Pension Fund exceeded the expenditures of all law enforcement agencies of the state, plus more expenditures on education, science and sport. For these purposes in the 2010 year, the state budget allocated about 7% of GDP - one fifth of all tax revenues. In addition, gas prices are not going to fall, and the population of Ukraine is dying out and is rapidly aging. True, Kiev is trying to solve the problem, for example, the government of Y.Timoshenko, and then N.Azarov, signed agreements with the IMF on the growth of the price of gas for heating and for domestic use. Since April, 2011 has planned to raise them by 50%, but they did not dare - due to a possible social revolution, there are many political opponents who can use the anger of the people to their advantage.

They cannot solve the issue with pensions either, in principle, this is an unsolvable issue - it is necessary to launch another wave of impoverishment of the population, which is also fraught with even greater social tensions. For example, the treasury spends on pensions up to 18% of Ukraine’s GDP, this is one of the highest rates among the countries of the world (for comparison, Russia is 10% of GDP, which is also very much). But, even worse, if nothing is changed, then soon, due to extremely negative demographic trends, this indicator can reach a quarter of GDP in a decade or two. With the need for pension reform, the government of Tymoshenko agreed back in 2009 year. The government of N.Azarov promised the West to adopt a relevant law before the end of 2010 of the year. But it could not.

It should also be added that the producing south-eastern regions have to contain the depressed Galicia and the center. As a result, the economic collapse, and behind it, the political is inevitable, and then the collapse of Ukraine.

In the area of ​​power: corruption from top officials to the lowest level; fighting clans and groups; the weakness of the central government, pure oligarchic “democracy”, with its backstage system of “checks and balances”, shadow agreements.

The result: a complete failure of the idea of ​​"Square". Before the collapse of the Union in Ukraine, separatism was propagated, where household and economic arguments were cited - they say, the center (Muscovites) are taking more from Ukraine than we produce. And as soon as Ukrainians get rid of this injustice, then life will be carefree and rich, Ukraine will join the family of well-fed and rich European nations. An ordinary consumer myth, by the way, this card was played out in the RSFSR too, they say, we don’t need to feed Central Asia, the Caucasus, the Baltics — we separate and “live like people”. If other people were sitting in Moscow, they would have long ago taken advantage of Russophile sentiments of a significant part of the citizens of Ukraine, and the process of restoring the unity of the Russian world would have advanced much better.

Then other myths were created that also turned out to be a complete linden — myths about European integration; about the eternal "oppression of the Ukrainians" by Moscow; recently created the myth of the "famine of the Ukrainians"; the hardest thing was to introduce the myth of the “heroism” of the Bandera gangsters - the south-east of Ukraine was not led to it. As a result, if we discard a lot of myths, it remains that the people are robbed, and a handful of oligarchs are eating with puppets-politicians. Plus, the satisfied elites of the Western world - Russia is split, all its parts are dying out, the main geopolitical competitor on the planet "lies".

Is there a way out?

First, we need to understand that the West, Europe, and Ukraine do not need, they themselves have a severe crisis, and whether they will creep out of it is a big question. And in what form? It is quite possible that we will see the realization of the images of science fiction novels - with the Euro-evolution scenario, where the southern countries will be “left out” to the agrarian provinces and recreation areas, with an appropriate level of consumption. And the north will be the industrial, scientific core. The “European way” of Ukraine is a mirage ...

Secondly, it should be clearly understood that the “dead end” of the “Ukraine” project is the same dead end as in Russia and Belarus, as well as the “European way” of Russia. The Russian Empire has already died in this impasse. Therefore, the only correct, “direct” path of Little Russia, Great Russia, White Russia is a single power, with its own, non-European and non-Chinese, global and domestic policy.

Otherwise, we will see the collapse of Ukraine, and, if Great Russia stands, it will regain at least part of Little Russia, the remaining fragments will be polonization, Romanization and further degradation. Any Nazism is the way of the beast, which proves the example of the Reich.

Sources of:
Kalashnikov M., Buntovsky S. Independent Ukraine. The collapse of the project. M., 2009.
http://regnum.ru/news/fd-abroad/ukraina/1384373.html
http://regnum.ru/news/fd-abroad/armenia/1385198.html#ixzz1P58Oj0SH
http://expert.ru/expert/2011/23/nezadachlivaya-nezalezhnost/
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  1. mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 09: 31 New
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    That's right, author. They can't do a damn thing, only in their wise older brothers, Russians, throw shit. They even organize the European Football Championship without scandals (and in 2012 everything will be at a low, primitive amateur level). Prior to that, they had finished their “nezalezhnosti” that even Europe did not need.
    Everything from this eternal Khokhlak habit to try to sit on two chairs. And they want to be “Europeans,” and you don’t want to run far from Mother Russia, you never know.
    And the author’s conclusions are as correct as possible. I am sure that in the end it will be so in terms of unification. And we will conduct his opponents by the “March of Dissent” along the route Lviv - Kolyma.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 12: 21 New
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      Agree
    2. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 12: 30 New
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      And after such words, you wonder why in Ukraine the majority of the population is against integration with Russia? )))
      1. PSih2097 21 June 2011 16: 03 New
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        After the action in Lviv on May 9, I generally wonder why troops were not brought into the territory of western Ukraine to protect citizens of the Russian Federation from overgrown youngsters, in the village they bathe for such a fool.
  2. Andrei
    Andrei 21 June 2011 09: 49 New
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    A lot of truth was written by the author. BUT ... As a resident of Ukraine, I can say that ordinary citizens do not have particularly warm feelings for their so-called "older brothers", especially the last 10 years (after the conflict with Tuzla, many began to gain insight). The older generation is still reaching for Russia, but young people basically do not see themselves with it. So, dear "brothers" of Katsap, live for yourself, and we will really live like we ourselves. Dear mitrich, look in the wrong direction. As soon as the march Moscow-St.Petersburg your eastern "narrow-eyed" friends did not go through :)))
    1. Joker
      Joker 21 June 2011 10: 15 New
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      Quote: Andrew
      As a resident of Ukraine, I can say that ordinary citizens don’t have any particularly warm feelings for their so-called “elder brothers”, especially in recent years 10

      - speak for yourself, I know Ukrainians who don’t know the Ukrainian language either.

      And how can you hate your brothers? It is almost like self-hatred, but then the problem is not in the “brothers” but in the little wiggyman full of anger.
      1. Superduck
        Superduck 21 June 2011 11: 44 New
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        Hatred - it is said too loudly, rather it is a question of a certain rejection. I know only a few Ukrainians who vehemently hate Russia and Russians. But I know dozens of people who, after each speech by Rogozin, Luzhkov, Putin, Ivanov, say something like "What do these morons want from us ?!"
        Read the article and reviews again, the main points: inferiority, younger brother, unreasonable child, bankrupt, inability to do anything, country of thieves ((C) GDP) and you can continue on.
        If every day they’ll pour all this crap on your head, will you inflame with love?
        1. His
          His 21 June 2011 12: 23 New
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          What do you have to say? Well done?
          1. Superduck
            Superduck 21 June 2011 13: 00 New
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            You personally are better off always keeping silent.
      2. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 12: 34 New
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        And are you talking about hatred? And who in almost every post shouts about Pindos, wild Caucasians, Baltic fascists, inferior Ukrainians, Poles, etc.
        1. frame5 21 June 2011 15: 37 New
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          Accurately noticed.
        2. PSih2097 21 June 2011 15: 59 New
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          Well, the Poles, this is a separate conversation.
    2. His
      His 21 June 2011 12: 22 New
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      It depends on where you live.
    3. PSih2097 21 June 2011 16: 07 New
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      as soon as the march Moscow-St.Petersburg your oriental "narrow-eyed" friends did not go through :)))

      this is a joke about the war of the Chinese and Finns
      especially the last 10 years (after the conflict with Tuzla, many began to gain insight).

      so suddenly you (the tuzu) will give it to the Romanians or Turks like a snake.
  3. 5766
    5766 21 June 2011 10: 09 New
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    Andrey
    And yet their "narrow-eyed" friends will march! Russia type - heaven on earth. The project of the Russian Federation, which will sprinkle, is just artificial. The problem of Ukraine is not "Nazism", as the author claims, I doubt that he could give a definition of this concept and distinguish it from nationalism or patriotism. Although for them, the Nazis are those who do not like Russians. The problem of Ukraine is that all this communist cattle actually remained in power. A scoop rules the country, he destroys it. There is nothing wrong with this, an obsolete, rotten system should fail. So it falls. Everything is fine, it should be so.
    1. Joker
      Joker 21 June 2011 10: 17 New
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      Quote: 5766
      The RF project is just artificial

      - pinned, just no other words, not even offensive.
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 12: 37 New
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        For some reason, it seemed to me that this is the Russian Federation - a federation, and not unitary Ukraine. How many autonomous federal subjects do you have there?
    2. His
      His 21 June 2011 12: 24 New
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      Russia and the Russian people are greatness, and Ukraine is known only because it opposes Russia to please the United States
  4. Sanga
    Sanga 21 June 2011 10: 21 New
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    Andrew! I don’t belong to the young generation of “katsaps”, but I don’t belong to the older generation either. I can say the following, but you didn’t look at us dear “younger brothers” -hokhlov. And about the march of the “narrow-eyed” brothers along the route you have chosen, I think that in this case they won’t pass by you for sure
  5. Okuscher
    Okuscher 21 June 2011 11: 02 New
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    Nda, as always, the former Communists came to power after the collapse of the USSR, but after all Pendosov lackeys. Which to the interests of the population, as to the moon cancer. It is beneficial for pendos to crush-crush any state, because if it (the state) is standing on its feet confidently, then it will not listen to anyone. Well, as for the narrow-eyed, Sanga is right, you definitely will not be ignored :). I myself am "narrow-eyed."
  6. Prophet
    Prophet 21 June 2011 11: 02 New
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    The author wrote all correctly about the myths that the West imposed on Ukraine. But Russia now, unfortunately, has nothing to offer Ukraine, only the same myths.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 12: 27 New
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      Ukraine is cut off from energy. Russia can offer cheap energy resources. But this requires a political union, not the verbosity of Ukrainians about friendship and good neighborliness
    2. nmd_1
      nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 30 New
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      Does it need to be offered something to someone? Let them live their independence. Personally, I don’t care for them sometimes, I feel sorry for the Ukrainian culture, it doesn’t cause any rejection, it’s even better to rest in Crimea than in Sochi :)
      We need to deal with internal problems at home, you can see for yourself then to reach out, and just hang the burden on yourself. And for any narrow-minded ukraim council, get rid of the complexes and become Ukrainians.
  7. Zaporozhets
    Zaporozhets 21 June 2011 11: 37 New
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    Great disappointment from unacceptable orange to gangster-blue regionals. Gullible old people enjoy the verbiage of the politicians who got their teeth on the talk shows of Simon \ Savik \ Shuster and Evgeny Kiselyov. With the entry into the WTO, they finish off the village. Famous chernozems are crushed and depleted. Sugar is bought from Belarusians. A childhood friend, the director of an agricultural holding with foreign capital says that they plant mainly rapeseed and built a third biofuel plant, this crop is more profitable than sunflower and sugar beet. And in return we send Egyptian and French potatoes at French prices. One hope for summer cottages.
  8. Max79 21 June 2011 11: 59 New
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    ANDREI
    What kind of conflicts are we talking about? We look at these conflicts every year in Lviv on May 9. Do you ask your senior comrades who lived under the USSR if they lived badly with Russia? In my opinion, it’s not bad, but right now, you live in illusions. But you won’t be fed up with illusions alone, and wave your fists in our direction too.
    It is unfortunate that modern youth cannot understand one simple truth in any way, that only together we are power.
  9. Gur
    Gur 21 June 2011 12: 10 New
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    The West and the Amerokos divide us like God, a turtle with such love from each other ... time will tell how and what will be ..
    1. Superduck
      Superduck 21 June 2011 12: 17 New
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      Time shows that history is developing in a spiral, everything will be fine. But not right now.
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 12: 28 New
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        Not for Ukraine
        1. Superduck
          Superduck 21 June 2011 12: 35 New
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          Quote: Own
          Not for Ukraine

          And for Ukraine, too, unions with Russia have already happened 3 times, all that is needed is a good reason, and not the election of the President of the RF
          1. His
            His 21 June 2011 12: 45 New
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            The policies that they pursue will lead to the division of the outskirts into its constituent parts
            1. Winchester
              Winchester 21 June 2011 12: 56 New
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              You better watch your Chechnya)
              Over the years of independence, Ukraine has not had a single large-scale ethnic conflict. Dagestan, Ichkeria recall?
              1. His
                His 21 June 2011 13: 10 New
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                I must say that Ukraine is part of the former Russian Empire, in the subsequent USSR. These are all Russian lands donated to you by the Russian people in 1991
                1. Winchester
                  Winchester 21 June 2011 13: 27 New
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                  Twenty five again. Well, then Muscovy is the land donated to you by Kievan Rus.
                  1. His
                    His 21 June 2011 13: 28 New
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                    Is this written in a new history textbook in Ukraine?
                    1. Winchester
                      Winchester 21 June 2011 13: 44 New
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                      The simple question is when was Kiev founded and when is Moscow?
                      1. olifus
                        olifus 21 June 2011 14: 37 New
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                        Quote: Winchester
                        The simple question is when was Kiev founded and when is Moscow?

                        how do you want to link together the foundation of two cities and the territorial division of Russia and Ukraine?
                      2. Winchester
                        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 02 New
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                        Isn’t it clear? First, Kievan Rus appeared, which gradually annexed more and more new lands. In the 11th century, Moscow did not exist at all, and all the northeastern lands of Kievan Rus were a distant province)
                      3. olifus
                        olifus 21 June 2011 15: 15 New
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                        Quote: Winchester
                        First, Kievan Rus appeared, which gradually annexed more and more new lands. In the 11th century, Moscow did not exist at all, and all the northeastern lands of Kievan Rus were a distant province)

                        which and whose province? there were many principalities on the territory of present-day Russia, and "Great Kiev" had nothing to do with it! stop reading textbooks published by the Yushchenko’s Ministry of Propaganda (very similar to the Goebels’s Ministry)
                      4. Winchester
                        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 37 New
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                        But for some reason, it was Kiev, not Novgorod, that was the capital. For some reason, all the principalities paid tribute precisely to Kiev. For some reason, it was in Kiev that Oleg, Svyatoslav, Vladimir the Great, Yaroslav the Wise, Vladimir Monomakh ruled)
                        When the arguments end, some nonsense about the Nazis and Goebbels begins. As I understand it, for Russian commentators this is a hallmark)
                      5. nmd_1
                        nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 36 New
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                        You listed all the Russians :) The phrase says nothing: Kiev is the mother of Russian cities? not Ukrainian, but Russian, and the city of Russian means. you have narrow-mindedness on your face, times 2 * 2 you have 3
                  2. Superduck
                    Superduck 21 June 2011 15: 22 New
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                    You are wrong, if Moscow is a relatively young city, for example, Novgorod the Great can easily argue with Kiev on this issue.
                  3. Winchester
                    Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 35 New
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                    But for some reason, it was Kiev, not Novgorod, that was the capital. For some reason, all the principalities paid tribute precisely to Kiev. For some reason, it was in Kiev that Oleg, Svyatoslav, Vladimir the Great, Yaroslav the Wise, Vladimir Monomakh ruled)
                  4. solodova 21 June 2011 16: 40 New
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                    What are you leading to? Do you want tributes from Moscow?)))))))
                  5. PSih2097 21 June 2011 22: 56 New
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                    Winchester,
                    Yes, because the Varangians needed to be closer to Tsargrad, so that they could go there for zipuns, plus the path "from the Varangians to the Greeks", you can also peck money.
              2. PSih2097 21 June 2011 22: 52 New
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                Winchester,
                First, Kievan Rus appeared, which gradually annexed more and more new lands.

                Kiev and Kievan Rus in 883, the same Smolensk 862 - 863, Novgorod 859.
                So do not boast of age ... and Kievan Rus for 300 years you are asking ... whether.
      2. olifus
        olifus 21 June 2011 14: 35 New
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        Quote: Winchester
        Well, then Muscovy is the land donated to you by Kievan Rus.

        you are definitely out of your mind, the Yushchenko brainwashing has done its job.
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 14: 57 New
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          Just when Kievan Rus in the 9-10 century was one of the most powerful states in Europe, in the place of Moscow, bears walked through swamps)
          1. olifus
            olifus 21 June 2011 15: 03 New
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            Quote: Winchester
            Just when Kievan Rus in the 9-10 century was one of the most powerful states in Europe, in the place of Moscow, bears walked through swamps)

            about the most powerful state, you got excited of course ...

            Rome also fought with wild barbarians in the lands of modern Germany, where is Rome now and where is Germany? (I'm talking about technical and economic leadership)
          2. Winchester
            Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 11 New
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            And who in 907, 944 conducted sea trips to Constantinople? To whom did Byzantium pay a huge tribute of 907? Moscow, which appeared after 200 years?
          3. PSih2097 21 June 2011 22: 58 New
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            Winchester,
            Okay, I persuaded you, give us Kiev, we will make it the capital, and rename the Russian Federation to Kievan Rus.
          4. nmd_1
            nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 41 New
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            What do you want ???? Do you identify modern Ukraine with Russia of the 9-10th century ??? sit down deuce in history.
      3. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 08 New
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        You still say that the first people were Ukrainians. Che you are picking ancient Russia, what have you just achieved?
      4. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 34 New
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        And in response, silence
      5. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 38 New
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        It's not me who started shouting about the Russian Crimea, about the fact that Ukraine was never a state at all.

        I must say that Ukraine is part of the former Russian Empire, in the subsequent USSR. These are all the Russian lands donated to you by the Russian people in 1991 - these are not your words ???
      6. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 49 New
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        This is just an itoric truth. We will return everything anyway
  • olifus
    olifus 21 June 2011 14: 33 New
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    Winchester if you are so cold and independent, then what kind of question will you return Crimea to Russia? he was not yours, but was donated by one short-sighted politician, be honest to the ends shouting that Russia does not need anything, return what you don’t belong to historically.
    1. Superduck
      Superduck 21 June 2011 15: 06 New
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      Why not the Ottomans, or the Golden Horde?
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 50 New
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        Find her first
      2. nmd_1
        nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 42 New
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        They are not, but we are. So to us :)
    2. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 12 New
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      By your logic, the sex of Russia is the territory donated by Kiev to the traitor Yuri Dolgoruky.
  • nmd_1
    nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 32 New
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    but didn’t you have rams with the Armenians, no worse than our Kondopoga?
  • Gur
    Gur 23 June 2011 07: 46 New
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    I read it ... and I’ll say in the words of Filatov - "Everyone thinks of others as a freak despite the fact that he swearing is removed-" Lord slovenia ... well, what are you really .. to each other like dogs in a kennel .. alone about their independence breshet from which they don’t get bald horseradish .. others about their greatness from which the ass is also not covered .. in both states everything is stolen by a handful of people .. you still have crumbs and everyone in such ambitions .. wake up .. they threw a bone to you .. which you procrastinate to divert your attention .. from what is going on behind your backs mi .. With such conversations, you can reach the Mesazoic .. and understand who crap where .. you better pay attention to the gentlemen of the Great Russia .. (I don’t know how Ukrainians are doing) .. education is paid .. medicine is paid .. fuel and lubricants at a cost almost like in countries without oil .. wherever you throw a full paragraph .. what greatness is there .. the territory is huge ??? .. but we can’t even cover it ... To live separately ?? Yes, we can’t definitely .. you can’t chop off the continent .. if only a cataclysm .. We are the children of one mother .. and how everything happens and will happen in the family.
  • Splin
    Splin 21 June 2011 12: 23 New
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    AFTOR and critics like him. Come to football next summer and see the standard of living so you can clearly compare. And then because of the monitor is not very visible. I remember how friends came to us from St. Petersburg in 2005 with their "plastic" products to their taste, because they said on TV that there was nothing to eat in Ukraine.
  • Winchester
    Winchester 21 June 2011 12: 24 New
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    Before writing something, the author would be better off traveling to Ukraine and really sorting out the situation.

    It should also be added that the producing south-eastern regions have to contain the depressed Galicia and the center. As a result, the economic collapse, and behind it, the political is inevitable, and then the collapse of Ukraine.
    -------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------
    -----------------
    This myth has been lingering with us for about 10 years now. It happened to some extent in 2002-2003, but now Donetsk region is on the 10th place out of 24 in terms of budget revenues. Kiev is in the first place, then the main regions of Central Ukraine go further.

    As for the low standard of living, I do not argue - this is indeed so. But in Russia this is not much better - the difference can be explained by huge revenues from the sale of energy resources. And in Belarus, the average salary after the currency crisis (and it has not yet ended) has already become less than in Ukraine.
    And in general, what about the article where the first source is M. Kalashnikov?)
    1. Smirnov Vadim 21 June 2011 12: 42 New
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      Kiev and the rest of Ukraine are like Moscow and Russia in terms of standard of living - it’s impossible to compare. So you hardly know from Kiev how and the rest of Ukraine lives.
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 12: 47 New
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        I agree. The migration flow from Ukraine is simply enormous. All Russian-speaking outskirts are leaving.
      2. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 12: 59 New
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        I completely agree. Just the subsidization of the western regions has long become a myth. Now the largest subsidies are received by the coal industry of Donbass - not because the state understands its importance, but because most of the mines belong to Akhmetov.
      3. Superduck
        Superduck 21 June 2011 13: 02 New
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        There will be games in Donetsk, Kharkov, Lviv yet.
        1. Superduck
          Superduck 21 June 2011 15: 26 New
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          Quote: SuperDuck
          There will be games in Donetsk, Kharkov, Lviv yet.

          I wonder if there are only two mentally retarded people? One I even know. Write to the man of the minus only because he listed where the football matches will be held.
          1. Winchester
            Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 42 New
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            Are you saying that this does not correspond to the Kremlin training manuals - therefore, this is a lie! =)
      4. aL13n
        aL13n 22 June 2011 19: 01 New
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        Quote: VadimIS
        So it is unlikely that you from Kiev know how and how the rest of Ukraine lives.
        I absolutely agree.
    2. His
      His 21 June 2011 12: 43 New
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      You can live in Russia. I am satisfied
  • Passer
    Passer 21 June 2011 12: 59 New
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    Everything is right, everything is in Russian, Asia is bad, China is even worse, Ukraine is disgusting, Belarusians in general are a gang of thieves. Around Russia there are only enemies. Only the site left only patriots.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 13: 30 New
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      But what does the uterus pierce? So we have democracy, her mother
  • Shown
    Shown 21 June 2011 13: 00 New
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    There are probably a bunch of border guards here that they know so much about migration. Hu Jintao came to us. The BBC and CCN talked about it. But there is no "News" RTR. And since a simple citizen from the Lower Zhmury does not know this, it never happened.
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 13: 02 New
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    WINCHESTER,
    so you are still ahead, don’t worry. Only with what belt will you whip your separatists in the ass? After all, there is no belt, as well as a hand that should compress it. And there is no corresponding experience either.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 13: 14 New
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      They have nothing. Soon Romanians with Poles and Moldavians will begin to divide their lands. Then suddenly they will remember Mother Russia, the poor ones crawl to our little legs, like the Zaporozhye Cossacks at one time ...
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 13: 34 New
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        )))))
        Will Moldovans divide our lands? Made laugh.
        Over the past 20 years, there has never been a hint of territorial claims from the Poles, unlike such a friendly Russia.
        The only minor problems sometimes arise with Romania. But this is nothing compared to your Chechnya and most importantly, China.
        1. His
          His 21 June 2011 13: 41 New
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          Who are you telling soothing bedtime stories to?
          1. Winchester
            Winchester 21 June 2011 13: 47 New
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            And on the topic there is nothing to argue?
        2. PSih2097 21 June 2011 23: 07 New
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          What are you saying ... Poland wants to take away the shabby 39-40 from you, the same Romania and the snake is just the first swallow, it will be like Yugoslavia, there are criminals to the tribunal, and you have the territory of the former owner, and the process of reviewing the results of the 2nd world has begun .
    2. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 13: 35 New
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      Do you think nuclear weapons are needed to calm the separatists? )
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 10 New
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        Russia has never used nuclear weapons in a real war, unlike your well-wishers from overseas.
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 44 New
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          That is, to reassure the separatists, you need to have strategic aviation and a million-strong army, how are you?
          I understand everything, carpet bombing is the main weapon against the separatists)
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 13: 30 New
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    That's for sure, OWN. "Civilized" Polish pans or the same Crimean Tatars instantly set the brains on Ukrainians. Poor our Ukrainian friends know their story.
    It will be interesting then to read Winchester and other "yellow-black" comrades.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 13: 35 New
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      They will already be in suitcases in Moscow. And we will have to fight for them
      1. Superduck
        Superduck 21 June 2011 13: 44 New
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        you’ll have to whip sour cream with your tongue, I look good
        1. His
          His 21 June 2011 15: 12 New
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          We eat our sour cream
    2. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 13: 56 New
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      And where does Poland? Over the past 20 years there has not even been a hint of any territorial claims, unlike the “Russian brothers”.
      About the story. Poland occupied our lands from 1569 to 1654. Russia - the next 300 years with some interruptions. As a consequence of this, no one in Ukraine and Russia are going to unite, except for a handful of marginals. In the 20th century, Ukraine declared independence 6 times and 5 times lost it, and strangely enough - 4 times from Russia.
      1. Joker
        Joker 21 June 2011 14: 53 New
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        Quote: Winchester
        In the 20th century, Ukraine declared independence 6 times and 5 times lost it, and strangely enough - 4 times from Russia.


        - and until the 20th century it simply did not exist, it was to envelop Russia.

        Quote: Winchester
        And where does Poland? Over the past 20 years there has not even been a hint of any territorial claims, unlike the “Russian brothers”.


        - so they would have dared, I think the brothers would have forgotten about the contradictions for a while ..
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 16 New
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          And before the Mongolian bulk Russia did not exist, it was part of Kievan Rus. And what's next, joker?
          1. Joker
            Joker 21 June 2011 15: 46 New
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            Most likely the centers of the "Ancient Empire" was the "Country of Cities", now the Golden Ring.

            Yes, even Lomonosov spoke of the inconsistency of the theory of the Mongol yoke, Morozov supported him in his views.

            It was invented by two German scientists, delirium consists of this (even if not delving deeply):
            - the gene for "quick-sightedness" and "short stature" is dominant, if there was a yoke in 200 years, where is its manifestation?
            - a nation without a written language, with an embryonic level of development of metallurgy, a lack of statehood, could not physically rivet so many weapons and organize itself like that;
            - the Mongols do not reflect in any way the existence of a certain empire;
            1. Zerkalo 21 June 2011 17: 41 New
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              The latter is most revealing. And not because it’s a shame to remember this!
      2. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 12 New
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        You have never been outskirts in nature
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 46 New
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          Again) You again remind about KIEV Rus, that at that time there was no Moscow at all?
          1. Joker
            Joker 21 June 2011 16: 33 New
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            And Yaroslavl and others like him the "golden ring".

            You should not think that the history of the Slavs went off with Kievan Rus, our history is much older and the fact is that at the moment we are one artificially divided ethnic group.
  • Splin
    Splin 21 June 2011 13: 46 New
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    I went to the level of comments like "I do not need a cow if only the neighbor died!"
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 14: 03 New
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    WINCHESTER,
    it means that we will unite with marginals in the number of 90% of the population of Ukraine, and we will send you together with other "patriots" of our native land to build the Khabarovsk-Anadyr railway (the foreman of the station, prisoner Yushchenko).
    You know, the polemic with you really amuses me and gives me real pleasure.
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 18 New
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      For some reason, in 91 precisely 90% of the population in a referendum voted to secede from the USSR. Little problem, don't you think?
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 27 New
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        You confuse something. The majority in the referendum was for the preservation of the USSR
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 47 New
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          Ololo)))
          What can you discuss with a person who does not know basic things?
  • Ivan
    Ivan 21 June 2011 14: 09 New
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    Here it was said about yakі mіfі yakі boules that we’ve been handed to us by a stretch of rock independence, but propaganda was always awaited. Try to pick up chi not mifi tse about Malorosіyu, (native Russian lands).
    Ukraine is sovereign and independent power. We don’t pretend to be in foreign territory, but ale zazihannya on our own will rush up. As a matter of fact, you will need to fight with the rogues, and if you need to be Poles, well, as a matter of fact, you won’t be able to sit and show you deraki wintering.
    We are glad to see who we are talking to. America here is nothing to be wiped away; and Russia.
    I’m going to accept the Russian Federation to the warehouse of Ukraine, but as a matter of fact, then go and give me your brotherly love.
    Virshuete more beautifully internal food, at the same time again you name and fall apart, like your empire.
    ______________________________________________________________
    Here we were talking about myths imposed on the unconscious little brother during the years of independence, but after all, propaganda was and is everywhere. Is your Bolshevik view not the result of the myth of the great Russian people? How many Russians are there? Also myths created by the tsarist, imperial, Soviet authorities.
    Ukraine is a sovereign and independent state. We do not claim foreign lands, but all claims regarding our territory will be resolutely suppressed.
    if necessary, we will fight with the Rumans, with the Poles, and if you can’t sit, we will show you where the crayfish hibernate.
    We will deal with our problems ourselves, and still see who crawls to whom.
    America will receive nothing, and Russia too.
    I propose to accept the Russian Federation into Ukraine and finally unite the fraternal peoples, and if not, then go with your brotherly love for the Chinese and Kitasia will be for you.
    You’d better solve your internal problems. Once again, you’ll grab the atoms and fall apart like your empire.
    1. Joker
      Joker 21 June 2011 15: 02 New
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      Quote: Ivan
      I propose to accept the Russian Federation as part of Ukraine


      - I laugh nimagu, there are no other words.
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 21 New
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        So in all of Ukraine, at least in Central and Western neighing with you, Russian, your tears about Soviet Greatness)))
        1. Joker
          Joker 21 June 2011 15: 47 New
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          This story is useful to know and must be respected so as not to become a zombie tribe without a clan and tribe.
    2. His
      His 21 June 2011 15: 27 New
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      And who took Berlin?
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 49 New
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        The Red Army, which was composed of soldiers from all over the USSR.
        But where does it ??? Do you have the Great Victory - is it all a state fetish?
    3. MichaelVl
      MichaelVl 21 June 2011 16: 12 New
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      >> I propose to accept the Russian Federation into Ukraine and finally unite the fraternal peoples ========= You burst, baby :))))))))))

      Ivan, Russians call older brothers because the population and area of ​​the country is larger than that of Ukraine and Belarus. But Russia cannot enter the “composition of Ukraine,” because its economy is more powerful. What is shameful here? Therefore, with your "proposal" you show your complexes (on the subject that you have been belittled in the person of your younger brother), or you have such jokes, it is not clear :) And cope with your problems, who is against it? Only it is not necessary to mischief each other;) Then the grievances will pass, and it will seem sweeter!
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 17: 42 New
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        Don't you understand the jokes? More precisely, this is not a joke, but a banter from your constant cries for the unification of fraternal peoples)
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 14: 11 New
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    VLADIMIR,
    Your authoritative comment is required if you are on the air.
    And then I was very scared by the formidable user of IVAN. I almost crap by reading his comment. Just until I figured it out: either from laughter, or from fear.
  • cxb
    cxb 21 June 2011 14: 26 New
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    it means that we will unite with marginals in the number of 90% of the population of Ukraine, and we will send you together with other "patriots" of our native land to build the Khabarovsk-Anadyr railway (the foreman of the station, prisoner Yushchenko).
    You would really read a story with yours)
    I am Russian, I live in Kiev and you know with such blah blah about great Russia, it seems to me that Ukrainians will be better off being independent than with people who still have an empire. And the most interesting, if earlier conversations about a new union were sometimes conducted, now this topic has died out even in the Donbas.
    In general, the article is a provocation)

    PS
    About the baton)) Serdyukov does everything to prevent her in Russia
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 15: 18 New
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      Who freed you from the Nazis, rebzy?
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 22 New
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        Is communism so different from fascism?
        1. His
          His 21 June 2011 15: 36 New
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          So are you a fascist?
          1. Winchester
            Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 00 New
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            Are you all not Russian fascists?
            And in general, do you know what fascism is?
        2. Joker
          Joker 21 June 2011 15: 49 New
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          Approximately the same as the car from the cart, but in general at dusk and well-dated if possible and confused.
        3. Zerkalo 21 June 2011 17: 44 New
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          Actually, yes ...
  • rumpeljschtizhe
    rumpeljschtizhe 21 June 2011 14: 27 New
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    What got to the bottom of This Ukraine
    they lived without us and will live.
    Yes, we can cope without them (in Russia there are a lot of problems)
    I personally do not care about the problem Khokhlov:
    they will have a new famine or a richer edge.
    there’s nothing to inflate our cheeks — they will show us something there.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 15: 15 New
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      They want to receive our gas for nothing, while putting American missiles at their place, not to mention the Crimea and the Black Sea Fleet ...
    2. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 24 New
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      It turns out that you still have adequate people.
    3. Zerkalo 21 June 2011 17: 48 New
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      Yes, here you are right. Separated - wanted independence - get. Then do not just say that these are all the machinations of the damned Muscovites and Katsap ...

      History does not teach anything - you will be a dump of nuclear waste that the whole West will bring to you for big money (such rumors have been circulating before, now they have subsided).
  • Chuchupaka
    Chuchupaka 21 June 2011 14: 28 New
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    Yes, you guys with democracy did not work out ...
    They drove you to the stall and it remains only to stupidly bleat on the guys from Ukraine.
    You better remember who steered the Soviet Army, on whom the officer corps held. Think about what you are talking about.
  • Kiev
    Kiev 21 June 2011 14: 42 New
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    I agree. If you want, let's unite. We agree to include you in Ukraine. By the right of an older and wiser brother who has preserved the wasps of Old Slavic culture (90% of the Ukrainian language and 60:% of Russian have Old Slavic roots. And if a very simple example, then compare the names of the months in the calendar with their history and meaning)
    1. Joker
      Joker 21 June 2011 15: 28 New
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      not well it is necessary
      Quote: Kiev
      We agree to include you in Ukraine


      First, you will be a part of the village of Gadyukino, and then we'll talk.

      PS Unification is necessary and inevitable, the question is what means.
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 51 New
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        You have a little money for tiny Georgia, but you think about Ukraine)
        1. Joker
          Joker 21 June 2011 16: 30 New
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          If an order had been received, they would have walked along and across, but there was no order.
        2. MichaelVl
          MichaelVl 21 June 2011 16: 53 New
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          Winchester,
          Yes, no one thinks about you, don’t worry :)))) "Russian fascists" will not touch you, because we are not fascists :) Himself a fascist, but you call others fascists.
          1. Winchester
            Winchester 21 June 2011 17: 52 New
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            Argument that I am a fascist!
            Fascism is hatred based on national, religious or some other grounds, the result of which is xenophobic politics.
            Most Russian commentators here shout about scum-Pindos, wild Chechens, inferior Ukrainians, Baltic fascists, Poles, etc.
            Even the leadership of Russia, as we see, pursues a policy of inciting ethnic hatred. You want to say that Moscow does not kill citizens of Central Asia, blacks, etc.?
            Fascism is insults and crimes against a certain ethnic group. The idol of most commentators, as I understand it, is Stalin - the organizer of more than one genocide.
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 14: 43 New
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    And I get annoyed when different independent guys climb on the Russian site and preach their views. They like their independence, so let them sit on their ua., There, let them rub together, how cool and European they are. And then they start to crap on the forum, and when they are matushy in response, they are surprised how Russian you are, they say, angry and ill-bred.
    And so, RUMPELJSCHTIZHE (you’ve chosen a pseudonym for yourself, of course, and you want to write to you - you get tired of looking for letters) I also don’t care about Ukraine in the near future, the fact that we have enough problems without them is true.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 15: 16 New
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      Che let them on our site?
    2. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 27 New
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      And why are you constantly so much interested in the situation in Ukraine? We’ll figure it out without you. And your Lavrov, probably already tired of expressing concern about Ukrainian problems every day.)
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 39 New
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        If you didn’t crap every day in our direction, Lavrov would not pay attention to you
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 03 New
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          So take all the Russians from Ukraine and there will be no one to spoil. Take your Black Sea Fleet - nobody will remember about anyone - neither we about you, nor you about us) And everyone will be happy).
          1. Zerkalo 21 June 2011 17: 52 New
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            Well, just do not screw your own in the ass, otherwise we will have no one to build ...
    3. Zerkalo 21 June 2011 17: 52 New
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      I remember where I read on the Internet that in the Ukrainian army there are about 200 parachutes for 100 paratroopers ... And what they wrote about the country's air force, it became terribly terrible.
      Or maybe this is in our country and all sorts of nationalist parties sponsor so that (for the sixth time, God forbid) not unite?
    4. slan
      slan 21 June 2011 20: 54 New
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      And you would try to climb on ua, even worse than their roof would have gone from hopelessness)) Although I feel sorry for the wretched, it’s also annoying for a long time, not Ukrainians, of course, but ukry.
  • Something like that
    Something like that 21 June 2011 14: 59 New
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    O god-like MedvedoPut, everything happened as you predicted in 2008, and previously your great predecessors predicted. The fiend of the hell of the United States broke up into many states, there is a civil war, no one needs dolar, they wipe the ass with papers, the Americans stand in long lines to leave for Russia, a model of calm and with a rising GDP of 20% per year. The whole world is begging Russia to sell nanotanks, nano-planes, nano-ships and connect to the GLONASS system. The main ruble reserve currency was the wooden ruble, the central bank operates in three shifts and still does not manage to print new bills. Oil and gas remained only in the Russian Federation, Europeans crawling on their knees to Maskva, to each 1000000 rubles. (world currency) for a bucket to buy at least a couple, while they are ready to sell their children and soul. We look at all these “gentlemen,” banging their heads on the floor, high and letting their dirty shoes be kissed. The Japanese use only the Vorkuta 5000 PC and the Kolyma 2010 operating system. The film "Burnt by the Sun-2" is canonized around the world, the Zulus watch it three times a day for two months. Garison Ford runs for vodka for Nikita Mikhalkov, Angelina Jolie stuffs him a pipe, black Hollywood actors do not let him touch the ground, wear in a gold stretcher. They are naive, they can’t star in Nikitin films, this scum is too primitive and doesn’t drink much vodka. Amazonian Indians have become exclusively Russian-speaking and profess the canonical Orthodoxy of the Moscow Patriarchate (beards have to be glued). Liberal capitalism collapsed, the triumph of sovereign democracy came (your incomparable forerunners were right - the collapse of capitalism is inevitable). Haila Putin. Haile Stalin. Haile Rashism-Moskvofashizm.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 15: 31 New
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      How long did the fucker write?
    2. PSih2097 21 June 2011 15: 43 New
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      Somewhere I already read it ... Plagiarism?
      1. nmd_1
        nmd_1 22 June 2011 11: 29 New
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        Nope they force them to memorize it, before going to bed, to the level of a reflex, and so it jumped out of it.
    3. MichaelVl
      MichaelVl 21 June 2011 16: 33 New
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      You see, “Like that,” to make such a story, you won’t remember how many Russian achievements and great people I remembered :) And mention yours then;)
  • Andrei
    Andrei 21 June 2011 15: 04 New
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    mitrich so what's the problem? Write to Putin to make .ru closed from the outside, and for you, too, beyond it. Just do you know what the Internet is? Googling if not. Personally, I go to this site, because I like it with my materials. But sometimes extremely provocative articles come across, and commentary on them is a cock of inadequate our northern "friends"
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 15: 31 New
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      We don’t really need you
      1. Winchester
        Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 06 New
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        So you decide whether you need us or not? And then they pour mud over Ukraine for days, then offer to make friends, then they say that they do not need us, and then again they call in the CES, the Customs Union, etc. Purely Russian approach)
        1. MichaelVl
          MichaelVl 21 June 2011 16: 36 New
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          Winchester, you generally call Russian fascists. Here, personally, you definitely do not need anyone;)
          1. Winchester
            Winchester 21 June 2011 17: 55 New
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            I do not consider all Russian fascists. I hope that most Russians are normal people. But what can be called the Stalinists - supporters of the man who pursued an openly fascist policy - normal people?
            1. PSih2097 21 June 2011 23: 19 New
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              This is where he spent it? And why do you think the Stalinists are fascists, go up to any front-line soldier on May 9 and tell him in person that you are a fascist.
            2. Gur
              Gur 22 June 2011 11: 46 New
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              no, look at Mlyn ... but Bandera, and who else is with him ... God's aganists? and were not the Nazis ?? They are the heroes of Ukraine .... and Stalin, yes !! a fascist of pure water (and there should already be your entry .. such as "oh yes he did the famine, he joined Ukraine before the war .. he didn’t let us all resettle to Germany for work" and all that
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 15: 08 New
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    ANDREW,
    and the proverb "With their charter, they don’t go to someone else’s monastery" Did your mother not teach you?
    What do you achieve with your comments? Russia is not going to go to war on you, do not worry.
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 15: 29 New
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      and the proverb "With their charter, they don’t go to someone else’s monastery" Did your mother not teach you?
      ________________________________________-
      So why are you climbing with us with your pseudo-friends for about 400 years?
      1. His
        His 21 June 2011 15: 40 New
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        In general, these articles are for internal use, and not for you Ukrainians written
        1. Winchester
          Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 22 New
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          Well, right, you know better from Russia what is happening in Ukraine)
  • Ыыы
    Ыыы 21 June 2011 15: 24 New
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    it's time to remember the great words:

    KIEV - BL * D CITIES OF RUSSIAN !!!
  • Splin
    Splin 21 June 2011 15: 36 New
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    +1
    The conversations resemble old broadcasts, when Soviet citizens believed that only crowds of unemployed with placards walked through the streets of America and were crushed by passing gansters in limousines, and we have roaming bears and drunk Russian unshaven men in earflaps with caps (even in the summer) play all-day Russian roulette knockout. Visit first, then criticize!
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 08 New
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      I forgot the most important thing! Guys also go with balalaikas, and a red star on earflaps! )
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 15: 40 New
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    WINCHESTER,
    You, of course, mean the All-Ukrainian referendum of 01.12.1991/XNUMX/XNUMX. So you can see how you are taught at school that you not only know the ancient, but also the latest history of your republic.
    And about the All-Union referendum of 17.03.1991/70,2/28,0 do you know? But on it XNUMX% of the inhabitants of the Ukrainian SSR voted "for" the preservation of the USSR, "against" - XNUMX%. Google if you do not believe. Although someone like you will still write that the results are falsified.
    “Slaves” are good - two Soviet General Secretaries hail from Ukraine.
    After you, the thought of brotherhood and a single country can be discarded as unnecessary. There is hope, however, that normal Ukrainians do not have computers, or they don’t.
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 14 New
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      It’s not we who constantly shout about a united country and the revival of the USSR! It’s good that you understood at least now. As for the referendum, there really were 2. Only the second one took place in December 1991 and was fundamentally different from the first - 90% for independence.
    2. Superduck
      Superduck 21 June 2011 16: 54 New
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      You wrote everything correctly about both referenda, so pay attention to the sequence of dates. December was later and there they voted against the USSR. Of course, it’s clear to the hedgehog that the date and the wording of the question was correctly chosen, only Ukraine, unlike Belarus and Russia, voted in a referendum for independence.
      If anyone is interested in what happened during these 5 months, I’ll say that there was the State Emergency Committee which (or rather, it wasn’t itself, but the tanks firing cannons in Moscow) scared the Ukrainian population quite strongly, which was not used to such mansions. I didn’t vote both times then, more than 3 months of age was not enough for me, but I remember my feelings, the first time I would vote for the union, and the second time against.
  • rapmaxter
    rapmaxter 21 June 2011 15: 49 New
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    Ukraine follows the path of Poland. EU integration is a matter of the near future. and if not for the suffocating ultimatum of the Russian Federation, Ukraine was one level higher in development. Alas, the * brotherly * Russia has still not lost the ambitions of the empire, and there are enough ghouls in the Kremlin who still think conservatively and communistly. They shout in agony as in this article, as well. Understand that their time is up and they die like dinosaurs. Russia needs liberal people like Medvedev, who understand that the civilized world is a European world, but not Asian savagery.
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 15 New
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      Is Medvedev a liberal? o_O But what about such a liberal war in Georgia?
  • PSih2097 21 June 2011 15: 49 New
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    Every year I go to Ukraine, as a stubborn girl from Ivanofrankovsk came across to me, she gave me the following phrase (I don’t remember exactly, but I’ll convey the meaning): “I don’t need anything Moskalsky,” despite the fact that she has a mobile operator MTS, then showed her a map of Ukraine with territories attached to it (gifts from Muscovites), I somehow posted it here.
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 16: 18 New
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      Do you have any Western multinational corporations in Russia? Your nationalists do not drive on Pindos Ford and Chevrolet?
      1. MichaelVl
        MichaelVl 21 June 2011 16: 41 New
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        They ride and ride :) But no one here says that we don’t need anything from Pindos :)
  • MichaelVl
    MichaelVl 21 June 2011 16: 17 New
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    But Temka then again provoked heated discussions. This is always the case when Ukraine, Belarus and Russia are discussed. Even Mitrich is more emotional than usual :) This indicates that the topic is painful, people are painfully experiencing the current situation. Do not offend each other only, brothers! ;)
  • Andrei
    Andrei 21 June 2011 16: 23 New
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    MikhailVl. Brothers do not harm each other, do not suit the famines and go to Siberia for the better part of the fraternal peoples ...: ((((
    1. Smirnov Vadim 21 June 2011 16: 49 New
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      And what in power during the sounded period of time only Russian stood?
    2. MichaelVl
      MichaelVl 21 June 2011 17: 00 New
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      Andrew.
      Again, the famine begin to procrastinate? All Soviet people suffered then. It’s not necessary to highlight this in the subject “Russians have pacified the Ukrainians”, this is funny and not serious! Stupid! Then shout that there were a lot of Ukrainians in the management of the USSR and the Conscientious Army, but like the Holodomor, etc., etc., so YOU ​​alone killed the Russians. You are an adult, and are being driven to "orange bullshit" :)
      1. nmd_1
        nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 03 New
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        yeah, otherwise the Jews will come and remember them Khmelnitsky and the genocide of the Jews, like the Cossack women of Ukr at their peak roasted their children.
  • Pіvdnyak
    Pіvdnyak 21 June 2011 16: 58 New
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    About Moskalikіv tіlki you can say: "Dummy thought bagatіє."
  • Maxim Krivonos
    Maxim Krivonos 21 June 2011 17: 17 New
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    Dogs bark
    The caravan is coming
    (in Russia more than the artificial in its foundation and existence)
  • Andrei
    Andrei 21 June 2011 17: 26 New
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    MikhailVl From these "stupidities" in the villages of the central part of Ukraine there are practically not a single seven who did not die of starvation at that time. And the famine was artificial, initiated by Moscow. See more ORT and other "true" channels. I have a living grandmother who survived that period, and saw with her own eyes how the brave lads came with a Moscow accent and burning eyes, and they brought the last out of the house. And who is opposed to Siberia.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 19: 59 New
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      What are you all trying to make of Russian enemies. You yourself are not afraid of this. We will erase you
    2. nnz226 22 June 2011 01: 26 New
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      My mother-in-law's family lived near Zhitomir, she herself was born in 1931, and in her family (the most ordinary peasant !!!) everyone remained alive and grew up. "There is nothing to nod to the mirror ..." by the way, in% of the population loss from starvation of the 30-s, the greatest in Kazakhstan, and not on the current one, but the Kazakhs are smarter than stupid Svidomo and do not fight in cramps about the Holodomor! The population of the Kuban and the southern Volga region was also dying, so there was nothing the American fables about the "famine" to rehash ... Yes, there was a famine, but there was no "famine" (American slang) ... By the way, when in the 20 years of that 20 centuries ALL the Volga region was starving, the whole world was collecting food and funds for Russian peasants dying of hunger due to drought, I don’t remember something, so that the Ukrainian masters somehow participated in this ...
      1. nmd_1
        nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 09 New
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        This is due to the fact that the Ukrainians developed a complex, saying that they only offended them and now we owe them a coffin, only none of them will remember who was at the party and in power then, last names, for example, and not pseudonyms. As if the "Muscovite" spirit there and does not smell.
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 17: 34 New
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    Winchester, Andrey, 5766, SuperDuck, Ivan, cxb (who called himself a Russian Kiev),
    1) it is foolish to deny the state-forming role of Kievan Rus and the city of Kiev as the first capital of the Russian state. By the way, who formed Kievan Rus, you know? Prince of Novgorod Oleg with a squad, and not some peasant from the locals. Kiev gave the Russian state the Rurik dynasty, after the death of the last representative of which, Ivan IV the Terrible, in the Moscow state (Russia, simply put), strife and confusion began. Only Kievan Rus is not an individual history of Ukraine, but our GENERAL history with you, for modern Russia and Ukraine is ONE;
    2) 400 years of Russian occupation, you say? That is, the "northern" came to the "southern" with sabers at the ready? But what about the Pereyaslav Rada of 1654, which made the decision to enter Ukraine into the Moscow state, and where do we put Bogdan Khmelnitsky? Yushchenko from Mazepa the traitor forced you and your children to learn history, or what ?;
    3) not HUNGER, but HUNGER of the early 1930s, which took place not only in Ukraine, but also in Russia: the Volga region, the Don, the Kuban, the Urals, too; everywhere people were starving that year;
    4) The ECONOMY of Russia and Ukraine is too interconnected and interdependent, and yours is more than Russian. What about the West? I remember with what fanfare Tymoshenko sold Kryvorizhstal to its direct competitor Mital Steel for 5 billion dollars, in my opinion, and then what? Maybe Krivoy Rog is flourishing, of course, but I haven’t heard about Kryvorizhstal anymore. I think that the plant is already on its side.
    Nobody even thinks to unite, much less fight after 5 minutes or even 5 years, but we need to think about a common state, we will come to this anyway, since we are the ONE people with differences in language, nothing more. And the point here is not at all in Russia's "imperial" ambitions, but in the simple logic of things.
    1. Winchester
      Winchester 21 June 2011 18: 10 New
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      1. You might think that Oleg was a Novgorodian) Oleg was one of the leaders of the Varangians who came to Novgorod and established normal management there.
      2. Read the documents that have been preserved from the Pereyaslav agreement. There is not a single word about the reunification of Ukraine and Russia. It was an ordinary treaty on a temporary military alliance. Which, incidentally, the Russians immediately began to violate, i.e. he virtually immediately lost legitimacy.
      3. About the Holodomor you, Russian, it is better to be silent at all. Yes, in the Volga region, Kazakhstan, too, there was a famine. But it was caused by crop failure + large grain procurements. It’s not for you to tell me what happened in 32-33 in Central Ukraine. They took not just all the bread (which, perhaps, took place in some regions of Russia), but ALL FOOD. Where in Russia in these years the army and the NKVD blocked roads, railway stations? In Ukraine, at this time, all possible exits from the countryside were blocked.
      1. nmd_1
        nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 13 New
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        Winchester, read the history of the USSR, and not just Ukraine. Have you heard about the uprising on Tambov? So people in a similar situation took up arms, and you, like cattle, go to the slaughterhouse, what kind of war are you and the Cossacks then great? and if your famine was not there, maybe there was no rebellion, and if the surplus service was headed by local authorities, so say thanks to your ancestors for this.
    2. MichaelVl
      MichaelVl 21 June 2011 19: 52 New
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      Mitrich,
      ah well done! Well summed up, with the facts. Although everything has already been said a million times. But you won’t get rid of comrades like Winchester :)
      >> since we are the ONE people with differences in language, nothing more ==== TRUE! No options !!! Mentality, thoughts, customs, etc., etc. - this is one, one people! It’s a pity that we’ll have to wait until these throwings stop pro-Western.
  • Captain
    Captain 21 June 2011 17: 38 New
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    Ukraine in Europe - Scattering in the ASS!
    1. Joker
      Joker 21 June 2011 17: 45 New
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      No, in the ass then Europe.
    2. nmd_1
      nmd_1 22 June 2011 10: 17 New
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      Ukraine, under the ass of Russia (geographically or under another causal place, choose it yourself). and also the captain - removed curse - write the name of the country correctly - Russia.
  • DAGESTAN333 21 June 2011 17: 57 New
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    I wish the brothers not to quarrel. You have much more in common than disagreements.
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 18: 32 New
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    WINCHESTER,
    why do you write so categorically? Voted in Pereyaslavl in 1654, starved in 1933? Are you a DIRECT witness of what you are writing about?
    Here, one of the commentators wrote that Muscovites took away bread in Ukraine with revolvers in their hands (according to the grandmother). And can I admit that Ukrainians with Mausers took bread in the Saratov outback (after all, people of different nationalities served in food detachments and OGPU)?
    You are the same product of propaganda, like all of us here, just once the opinion drawn up does not give you the determination to agree with the opponent’s arguments. Perhaps for a start you will profess the principle of the “golden mean”?
    So you write that Stalin is a tyrant and a murderer. I also thought so at the dawn of a foggy youth. And now I’ll ask: who do you believe - you or the late Vladimir Karpov, who has much more reasons to be offended by Stalin than you (sat on article 58), but at the end of his life he still managed to objectively evaluate his work and write " Generalissimo. "
    So who to believe, the one who suffered in those days, or you born much later?
    Nevertheless, try to include your head and have your opinion for a change, rather than broadcasting the opinions of those who broadcast on the Inter channel.
  • Vladimir
    Vladimir 21 June 2011 18: 37 New
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    I tried to write everything from another office - it doesn’t work.
    Not for the sake of hohlosrach, but objectivity for.
    Communists, fascists, who freed whom, who betrayed whom, are lyrics. All our neighbors perfectly understand who they owe their lives to, but nonetheless. New historical trends ...
    I already wrote that each country has its own place in the world and the world division of labor. Let's look superficially where Ukraine is in this regard.
    Russia is a supplier of energy resources to Europe. Rather, Europe is a market for our resources. Ukraine has a very favorable geographical component - the transit territory for these millions of tons of oil and billions of cubic meters of gas. And almost all of the Russia-EU freight and passenger flow passes through them. Almost 90% of the foreign trade turnover between Russia and the EU is again through them. She doesn’t fit into this division in any way, because if she has anything, she doesn’t need it in the West — low quality and high cost. Those. Ukraine’s modern mission is to be the link between Russia and the EU. They would have lived like a god’s bosom, but no. It is necessary to position oneself as a dictator of conditions, requiring special preferences. That was until 2004. Then they began to build a joint venture, and from this year - UP. All transit capacities will be redirected from the territory of Ukraine bypassing. The cargo flow along the railway will also be taken to St. Petersburg. It’s cheaper and calmer. The main value of Ukraine - transit is blown away. The EU will never, under any circumstances, accept Ukraine either in the FTZ, and even less so in the EU. They have already abandoned them. Just by inertia, the tactics of neocons in the USA are rolling, and Obama needs to somehow justify himself to the voters for a second term. What will happen now - recently discussed on the site. The price of gas will certainly rise for Ukraine to 380-450 dollars. And that’s it. Just that. But Akhmetov, who set Yanukovych to force Azarov and the President to sign all the conditions of Russia, if only the gas was no higher than 280-320 - the threshold for profitability of the entire economy of Ukraine. It did not last long - 3-4 months.
    Everything else - Khokhlosrach and Moskalesrach - the lyrics of not very distant people. There are realities from which no one can hide in Ukraine and can not hide behind wailing about communism, the Holodomor, etc. By the way, so that Ukrainian comrades know that Ukraine in the USSR was a subsidized republic. I sat on the Union (RSFSR) budget and received subsidies.
    I’m not writing about the budget deficit, rising prices, inflation and the lack of gold and currency in reserves - some were taken away to the West by Tymoshenko, some were plundered recently. Gold reserves were paid for debts. This Old Man didn’t even allow himself.
  • Vladimir
    Vladimir 21 June 2011 18: 39 New
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    Read more.
    There is still a drop in consumer demand, unemployment, an increasing social burden on the budget, pensioners, an aging population and an outflow of youth. Cutting down state budget programs - museums, theaters, schools, educational programs, universities, kindergartens. And this is the brain and culture of the population. There are entire regions in Ukraine, in Bukovina, in Transcarpathia, in the Western Ukraine, where only up to 4 classes go to school. Like with Petlyura.
    I don’t even write about science, art, etc. And this is the soul of the people. The military budget of Ukraine, I know for sure, barely covers the cost of food and partly on PLANNED clothing supplies. A cry has been thrown in their army - wear any everyday clothes, you can combine casual trousers and a summer field jacket, etc., because there are already no money to put on officers. Their Sahaidachny went to the exercises with our Black Sea Fleet, so he ate the half-year budget of the entire Black Sea Fleet in three days. Now it will be fun until the end of the year. Unless to maneuver in the coastal zone, to teach sailors to moor and give ends.
    I don’t know about the collapse of Ukraine. This is disadvantageous to Russia, although the collapse will be necessary. The main thing is that Europe is also interested in this. If anyone thinks that Europe will save Ukraine or use it against us in the peak of Russia - well, let it think so, at least let it warm their souls, even this terrible illusion. Will Germany and France take the risk of aggravating relations with Russia for the sake of "friendship" with Ukraine? This is not even funny.
    I can confidently say that Russia does not need Ukraine as a territory that can be used for its own purposes. Nobody even in a nightmare even sees Ukraine as annexed to Russia - God forbid. Even the strongest Ukrainian lobby, which is strong and has a huge influence on Akhmeto-Firtash-Boyko, does not stutter here in Moscow about this, because he will immediately get something heavy on the head. We need only a market and a non-hostile territory, because we need secure borders. Therefore, they will be forced to enter the CU and the CES. They will lead to a complete collapse of Ukraine, then they will be asked for themselves. But if now they can at least reject something, then nothing. Yuatka got out too, people still hang potato pasta on their ears. And quietly, he proposed to buy everything for Russia - from MAZ, Beltransgaz and Belkali, to enterprises of the military-industrial complex and electric networks. And the people feed all the anti-Russian propaganda.
    Do not bark, let off steam, it does not matter. Scream into emptiness and despair. And you, comrades Russians, do not succumb to provocations. Carry the proud name of a Russian with honor, do not be like our smaller brothers.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 19: 10 New
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      I agree. But the second war will be felt according to the abbreviation of GUAM, after G goes U
    2. MichaelVl
      MichaelVl 21 June 2011 21: 44 New
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      Vladimir, 5 points!
  • ztk1
    ztk1 21 June 2011 18: 42 New
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    I suggest: you return OUR Crimea to us, and we immediately forget that there is such a state of Ukraine and do not meddle in your affairs for the next 25 years so that you can fully integrate into this EU structure.
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 18: 49 New
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    VLADIMIR,

    THANK. Your authoritative commentary is always impressive, puts everything in order and soothes the nervous system. Everything is clear to me. Further discussion of the topic with the Ukrainian comrades does not make sense. Thanks again.
  • konsul
    konsul 21 June 2011 18: 52 New
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    Винчестер и иже с ним-http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A3%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B8%D0%BD%D1%86%D1%8
    B
    it is written it seems is available.
  • Arpotemiy
    Arpotemiy 21 June 2011 18: 56 New
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    Svidomo like me with their memorized simple phrases that guide them treat them.
    They are "ancient" and "elder", because they are "Kievan Rus" appears.
    This is 100% nonsense and if they had more than one gyrus for the whole Svidomo fraternity, they would know such facts that there was no such state as “Kievan Rus”, there was just Rus, only a short period when the capital was moved from Novgorod to Kiev, until the moment when the capital was moved from Kiev to Vladimir, and then to Moscow. Those. it is one and the same state. Further, when Russia was already a powerful state with the capital in Novgorod and the head of the Novgorod dynasty Rurik, on that empty place was the Khazar wooden fortress, subsequently captured by Russia. Those. no Kiev was originally part of Russia. Then, having established wide trade with Byzantium, the Novgorod dynasty of Rurikovich builds its new capital here in the middle of the trade route. Russia, in the Greek tradition, Russia basically remained the same with the base language, with mats from the times of Novgorod birch bark letters, descendants of the population in old Russian cities.
    In Ukraine, everything is different. The main significant cities, roads and territory were cut off only after the defeat of the Turks, Poles and Tatars. When kakly declare "occupation" then specifically on the map they will not show you the "occupied" territory. On the contrary, the Novorossiysk province - from Odessa to Kharkov, is inhabited by the direct descendants of the Russians, who recaptured these lands from the Turks, there was no smell of Ukrainians here. There was a relatively small nest of male robbery Cossack robbers. For those who do not know, the Cossacks in Little Russia were of two types - the register, as an integral, albeit autonomous part of the Polish army, on the contents of the Polish treasury and Sich, which consisted mainly of fugitive people or people who wanted to rob.
    So there is still a very big question, whose territory is occupied and occupied by Ukraine, conceived by Lenin with the Germans, "Ukraine", to which they also illegally transferred the Russian New Russia - the defeated Donetsk-Kryvyi Rih and Odessa republics, as the Crimea torn off from Russia by the embroidered lover Khrushchev.
    1. Superduck
      Superduck 21 June 2011 19: 15 New
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      Quote: Arpotemiy
      The Novorossiysk province - from Odessa to Kharkov, is inhabited by direct descendants of the Russians, who recaptured these lands from the Turks, there was no smell of Ukrainians here.

      It’s not true that Slobozhanshchina is full of Ukrainian villages - these are descendants of the Maloros who fled from the Ruins — that is, the civil war that Khmelnitsky and his comrades fought.
      To be more precise, they started to fool at trifles so well, I even put a plus sign in haste.
  • Arpotemiy
    Arpotemiy 21 June 2011 18: 59 New
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    As for the language, Ukrainian for a quarter consists of Turkisms like tyutyun, Bashtan, Kylym, Maidan, another third of purely Polish words, a third consists of all-Russian words in the roots of which “o” and “e” were replaced by “i "and five percent of just made-up words. Those. it’s such a newspeak that is hard-won, but few speak it in the academic version, the basis of the Ukrainian language was not the Poltava dialect, as they try to imagine, but the Galician dialect. Malorussian language is used in the Southeast, its melody sounds similar to Ukrainian, but is based on the all-Russian lexicon with a small Polish component. Even according to genetic studies, part of the Ukrainians, which is typical, the most Svidomo part living in Galicia are not even Slavs, their genotype contains a pronounced Turkic and Romanian-Albanian components, which allow us to conclude that we are dealing with descendants of immigrants because of the Carpathians, whose competition with the Russian Slavs has developed a consistent and stable Russophobia and they are the most notorious and ardent enemies of Russia, already tearing large pieces from it and now infecting the descendants of Russia in light brown Nazism and hatred for everything Russian.
    1. His
      His 21 June 2011 19: 12 New
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      Ukraine was created after the war, how much dough was poured there, plus Crimea was presented
    2. Superduck
      Superduck 21 June 2011 19: 19 New
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      The presence of Polish words in Ukrainian is not an unnatural phenomenon, they are also full in Belarusian, and I can tell you a secret that the Poles are also Slavs. Half of the Russian words that have no analogues in Ukrainian are generally English and French, so it would not be worth boasting.
      Well, in general, in Ukrainian, of course, everything is heavily mixed and a lot of artificial, here I agree in part.
      1. huginn 22 June 2011 14: 58 New
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        I agree that Ukrainian is closer to the Slavic language, but this is not the point, but the fact that, for example, fundamental science is impossible in Ukrainian, either in Russian, or in English.
        1. Superduck
          Superduck 22 June 2011 23: 27 New
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          Quote: huginn
          fundamental science is impossible in Ukrainian, either in Russian, or in English.

          And that’s true, and not only science but simply technical terms, what does a sloop worth - a carburetor wink
  • mitrich
    mitrich 21 June 2011 19: 11 New
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    ARPOTEMIY,
    You are well done. Everything is clear, clear and authoritative, knowledgeable.
  • Arpotemiy
    Arpotemiy 21 June 2011 19: 14 New
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    And for the sake of brevity, the name "Kievan Rus" was given by modern historians to the period when the Russians kept their capital in Kiev, after Novgorod and Kiev was not even the second capital, and the third, after Ladoga and Novgorod, and the direct descendants of the Novgorod princes Rurikovich ruled there, as well then in other capitals - Vladimir and Moscow.
    Ukraine does not belong to Russia at all, its ideology appeared at the end of the 19th century and is based on Galician Ukrainian nationalism.