Military Review

Space trampoline for the United States. Tribute to Dmitry Rogozin

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The cessation of flights under the Space Shuttle program at one moment made Russia a monopolist in the field of manned cosmonautics. From now on, every state who expresses a desire to send its astronauts into orbit is forced to resolve this issue with Roscosmos. In the coming 7-10 years, there is no alternative to our "Unions" and never will. The US manned ship of the new generation, Orion, will appear no earlier than the next decade. The Chinese space program is in its infancy and is not yet able to become a serious competitor for our space industry.

The Federal Space Agency (Roscosmos) works like a clock. Only in the past 2013 year from three (out of five operating) Russian cosmodromes 30 successful launches were carried out, incl. The 4 manned missions on the Soyuz-TMA spacecraft to the International Space Station.

Space trampoline for the United States. Tribute to Dmitry Rogozin

The emblem of the mission "Soyuz TMA-10M", the launch of 26 September 2013.

The dizzying success of Roskosmos, accompanied by the apparent decline of foreign manned cosmonautics, suggests that our country, in spite of everything, is still the leading space power. Last week, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin bluntly stated this: “Having analyzed the sanctions against our cosmodrome, I suggest that the United States deliver its astronauts to the ISS using a trampoline.” Thus, emphasizing the leading role of Roscosmos in space exploration.

The mockery of NASA is a reasonable response to the threats against Russia. Nevertheless, the bold speeches of Mr. Rogozin are in clear contradiction with the statements of Gennady Padalka, a Russian cosmonaut, a member of four space missions and nine spacewalks:

“We fly on technologies 70-ies of the last century, and the astronauts do not have an emotional boost. When you see the achievements of partners, you understand that we have no progress. ”

- Press conference in Star City, September 20 2012

How does the only country in the world capable of regularly delivering people into space orbit turns out to be “lagging behind” in the space race with other powers whose astronauts fly on our own rockets? What did the Russian cosmonaut mean when he spoke of the "achievements of our partners"?


Run from the Plesetsk cosmodrome. View from the embankment in Yekaterinburg

The main intrigue lies in the cessation of the flights of American “shuttles”, the last of which flew in July 2011.

The reasons for the premature termination of the Space Shuttle program are commonly referred to as NASA budget cuts, aggravated by the overall inefficiency of the space shuttle and their safety problems (two of the five space shuttles were lost). Of course, shuttles were not ideal ships: heavy reusable designs were created for intensive work, based on the future. When you need to perform on 20 and more launches per year. The real needs of astronautics turned out to be noticeably lower: the number of launches did not exceed 4-5 per year, as a result, the cost of one launch increased to 400-500 million dollars, and the reusable system lost all meaning.

Nevertheless, it would be wrong to talk about “premature write-off”: the program “Space Shuttle” existed for 30 years and worked for all 100%. Space Shuttles performed 135 flights. How big is this figure? For comparison, the number of launches of domestic "Soyuz" of all modifications since 1967 of the year is currently 119 (the last 119 of the Soyuz-TMA-12М was launched to the ISS 26 of March 2014 of the year).

The intensive exploitation of shuttles contradicts various speculations about their damage and any shortcomings in their design. These were outstanding for their time spaceships with 7-local cabin and cargo compartment, designed for 20 tons of payload (lifting or returning cargo from orbit).


The crew of the shuttle "Columbia" serves the Hubble Space Telescope

In addition to the possibility of maneuvering in the atmosphere of the Earth, the shuttles were no less magnificent maneuverability in near-Earth space. This allowed them to carry out unique operations in outer space, associated with the launch, maintenance or repair of spacecraft. Five expeditions related to the maintenance of the Hubble orbital telescope (the launch of the telescope during the STS-31 and 4 repair missions of the STS-61, 82, 103, 109) were most famous. Astronauts had to move away from the Earth by 570 km - 1,5 times as far as the ISS orbit and spend several hours in outer space, replacing the gyroscopes and the radio-electronic "stuffing" of the telescope. Among other well-known missions of the Shuttle is the launch of the Magellan automatic interplanetary station for the study of Venus (the station was launched using the shuttle Atlantis, 4 in May of 1989).

Knowing firsthand about the “shuttle” abilities, Soviet specialists feared that the shuttles could be used to “steal” domestic spacecraft. For repulse against impudent robbers, the Almaz orbital stations were specially armed with an HP-23 automatic cannon (Shield-1 system) or space-to-space self-defense missiles (Shield-2 system).

That's what a space shuttle is! The real "fiend" of the Cold War and the consequence of unfulfilled dreams of the soonest development of outer space!


The most honored of the shuttles is Discovery. 39 member of space expeditions

So why did the secured Yankees lack the extra $ 400-500 million to continue operating these unique ships capable of carrying out any task in near-earth orbit ?!

If you are told that money is not the matter, but in principle, then it is money (F. Hubbard).


Of course, money is everything. However, despite the devastating impact of the global financial crisis, a reduction in allocations for space and the collapse of US government agencies (2013), NASA laboratories, together with their partners, continue to research and prepare for the launch of new spacecraft.

Only in the last three years (since the cessation of the flights of shuttles) into the icy blackness of space have been launched:

- Yunona automatic interplanetary station (August 2011) for the study of Jupiter. The cost of the mission over 1 billion.
- The Martian Science Lab (MSL), better known as the rover Curiosity (launch - November 2011 of the year). 899 kilograms of high-tech systems and scientific equipment crawling across the surface of the Red Planet at a speed of 140 meters per hour. Creating the largest and heaviest of Martian robots cost NASA 2,5 billion dollars;
- automatic interplanetary station MAVEN (November 2013) to study the atmosphere of Mars. A simple short mission worth $ 671 million. Almost a penny by the standards of the American space program.


Preparations for the launch of the automatic interplanetary station MAVEN


Among the less loud projects are known:
- Ebb and Flow probes for the study of the gravitational field of the moon (GRAIL program, launch - September 2011);
- automatic station LADEE to study the properties of lunar dust and the rudiments of the atmosphere of the moon (September 2013).

This is despite the fact that the MESSENGER probe is still roasting in the orbit of Mercury. The orbital reconnaissance LRO rounds the moon. On the surface of Mars and in its vicinity there are three of the previously launched stations and rovers. Near the rings of Saturn already 10 years is the station "Cassini". In the black gap between the orbits of Neptune and Pluto, warmed by the flame of two plutonium generators, the probe "New Horizons" is carried. In the summer of 2015 of the year, after 9 of years of wandering, he must fly past Pluto. And somewhere outside the solar system at a distance of 19 of light hours from the Sun, Voyager-1 and Voyager-2 probes, launched in the distant 1977 year, fly to infinity.

All of these devices are "hanging on the balance sheet" at NASA. Communication with each is maintained, regularly received telemetry and scientific data are analyzed, search and solution of emerging technical problems is conducted.


Space telescope "James Webb" (project)

Of course, a lot of money is allocated! The official NASA budget for 2014 is 17,7 billion dollars a year. However, no daring projects are yet planned - no flights to Neptune or drilling the ice shell of one of Jupiter’s satellites. In the coming years, NASA’s flagship program has become the Webb space infrared telescope worth 8,7 billion. NASA's management has delayed the schedule for 4, and now has to urgently finish the project. However, the complexity of the project is extremely high: the 6,5 ton telescope must be delivered at a distance of 1,5 million km from Earth (4 times the moon's orbit) and work there for 5-10 years. The launch of Webb is scheduled for 2018 year.

Of the “small” projects for the near future, only the next Martian station InSight and the landing on the asteroid with the help of the OSIRIS-Rex probe remained.

As you have already noticed, there is not a single manned mission here - everything is solved with the help of automatic devices.

“Both we and the Americans spent a lot of money and effort on manned flights and manned stations. But the main achievements are not connected with them at all, but with the Hubble telescope, which really brought a huge amount of fundamentally new information. The future is for automatic stations. The manned cosmonautics has no applied significance, neither in the present nor in the foreseeable future. ”

- Konstantin Petrovich Feoktistov, pilot-cosmonaut of the USSR, designer, leading developer of the Soyuz spacecraft, Salyut and Mir orbital stations.

This is what cosmonaut G. Padalka had in mind when he spoke about the absence of domestic projects and technologies comparable to the technologies of our “partners”. It is precisely this that is confirmed by the words of the leading Russian cosmonautics Konstantin Feoktistov.

The hitch lies in the fact that our "partners" deliberately abandoned manned flights in the coming decade due to the absence of any intelligible meaning and tasks for astronauts in space. The idea of ​​the “Shuttle” has completely exhausted itself. To preserve the skills and maintain the American segment of the ISS, it is enough to send a couple of astronauts a year as part of international crews aboard the Russian Soyuz-TMA.

All the necessary data on the effects of long-term space flight on the human body were obtained many years ago. At the present stage of technical development, the presence of a person in orbit is just an expensive walk without much practical meaning. Arguments about the greater reliability of the system with the participation of a person in it (if something breaks - fix it) are untenable. Opportunity Mars rover has worked on the surface of Mars over 10 Earth years and still continues to delve into the cool red dust of its creators for the joy of its creators. If suicidal fans could raise enough funds and make their dream come true by building a base on Mars, they could hardly have been able to stretch half that time. With that, the Opportunity Mars rover was created using 15 technologies a year ago.


Opportunity Mars rover prepares for flight

Of course, no one thinks to oppose manned spacecraft to soulless robots. Sooner or later the need will arise for the presence of man in space. In this case, the Yankees create a new generation Orion 25-ton spacecraft with an estimated autonomy of 210 days. In accordance with the conclusions of the Ognastin Commission (“Flexible Path”), “Orion” will be needed to fly to the Moon, to the Lagrange points and the asteroids nearest to the Earth. And in the future - for overflights of Venus and Mars.

The first flight of "Orion" in unmanned mode is scheduled for 2014 year. First manned launch - on 2021.


"Orion" is being tested




Space veterans or “cosmic taxi drivers”?

To the shame and disgrace of the Americans, they did not manage to build their own analogue of the “Union” - a simple and cheap “minibus” for delivering a couple of people to space orbit. But the domestic astronautics looks on this background is not the best way. The last major success is the Buran unmanned flight in the 1988 ...

The words of Dmitry Rogozin about the “space trampoline for Americans” will sound much more convincing if Roskosmos carries out the planned interplanetary expeditions “Luna-Glob” (2015) and “Luna-Resource” (2016), will repeat (this time successfully!) The mission “Phobos “Ground-2” (2018) and will be able to land the vehicle on the surface of the satellite of Jupiter (project “Laplace-P”). And from the Svobodny cosmodrome in 2018, the launches of Russian manned spacecraft of the new generation Rus-M will begin.

Without all this, Mr. Rogozin’s joke does not sound funny. Otherwise we can jump on the trampolines ...

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  1. karal
    karal 12 May 2014 08: 33 New
    +1
    Russia was, is and will be a great space power!
    1. -Patriot-
      -Patriot- 12 May 2014 09: 09 New
      +9
      It is, of course, true, but progress does not stand still, it is necessary to implement projects not on paper, but in reality. It's time!
    2. CRASHBULLET
      CRASHBULLET 12 May 2014 18: 39 New
      +5
      Yes, I beg you, the USSR is a great space power, and Russia, while stabilization sensors are confusing up and down.
      1. trenkkvaz
        trenkkvaz 12 May 2014 20: 44 New
        +9
        Quote: CRASHBULLET
        Yes, I beg you, the USSR is a great space power, and Russia, while stabilization sensors are confusing up and down.


        Да в СССР тоже "датчики стабилизации верх с низом путали", но в отличии от России тогда громко не кричали об этом в СМИ.Сейчас же любую неудачу мусолят так, что любая домохозяйка начинает считать себя специалистом по датчикам стабилизации. smile
  2. Fantazer911
    Fantazer911 12 May 2014 08: 55 New
    18
    To underestimate the enemy and believe in yourself too high self-conceit, it is necessary not only to develop but to improve the technology of the space industry itself, otherwise it’s not an hour and we can find ourselves in the place of mattress covers and live in twenty-year-old technologies of the past.
    1. Stasi
      Stasi 12 May 2014 15: 21 New
      +4
      Полностью с вами согласен! Необходимо не просто развивать технологии, а переходить с ракетной космонавтики на многоразовые корабли. Обидно что у нас так и остались нереализованными идеи и замыслы космического конструктора и ученого Лозино-Лозинского, продвигавшего идею создания многоразовых космических кораблей, способных самостоятельно без помощи ракеты стартовать в космос с Земли. Единственное что из идей Лозинского реализовали у нас, так это челнок "Клипер". Будущее космонавтики будет в многоразовых космических кораблях, которым не нужны ракеты для выхода в космос. Если Россия сумеет первой перейти на такую космонавтику, она сумеет сохранить свой статус космической державы. Также огромную отрицательную роль сыграло назначение "эффективных менеджеров" и явных непрофессионалов, вроде бывшего главы Роскосмоса Поповкина, который ровным счетом ничего не смыслил в космической отрасли и космонавтике. Кадры решают все, а вот с этим у нас как и в других отраслях проблема. Молодых ученых, способных решить стоящие перед нашей космонавтикой задачи и придумать новые смелые решения и идеи кот наплакал. Все держится на старой гвардии, которая редеет. Без решения этой проблемы невозможно решить и другие проблемы, стоящие перед нашей космонавтикой.
      1. Bayonet
        Bayonet 13 May 2014 08: 29 New
        +2
        Quote: Stasi
        Единственное что из идей Лозинского реализовали у нас, так это челнок "Клипер"

        Когда его "реализовали" ??? Пока все на бумаге!
  3. bistrov.
    bistrov. 12 May 2014 09: 07 New
    +8
    Не нужно приуменьшать значение достижений космических технологий ни СССР,ни России.Результаты говорят сами за себя: США отказались от своих "Шаттлов", а "Союзы" летают до сих пор.Кроме того, в России тоже ведутся работы по созданию перспективного космического корабля.
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 12: 15 New
      +5
      Quote: bistrov.
      The results speak for themselves

      Everything we know about the solar system is obtained from NASA
      Quote: bistrov.
      work is also underway in Russia to create a promising spacecraft.

      I want to believe it
      1. postman
        postman 12 May 2014 14: 08 New
        +9
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        Everything we know about the solar system is obtained from NASA

        Well you already gave ..
        1."Счетчик" Черенкова (Эффект Вавилова — Черенкова . Черенков Сталинская премия, 1952= участие в проекте синхротрон на 250 МэВ. В 1958 году вместе с Таммом и Франком был награждён Нобелевской премией по физике «за открытие и истолкование эффекта Черенкова». )
        -Если не ошибаюсь ,то Крессида,спутник Урана,открыт с борта космического аппарата Вояджер 2 (США, 1986) с помощью "счетчика"
        -I do not remember pro: CORDELIA - Uranus satellite, discovered from the Voyager 2 spacecraft (USA, 1986)
        - high energy physics for registration relativistic particles and determining their velocities.
        2.The first instrumental determination of density and strength the surface layer of regolith was carried out by the Soviet automatic station "Luna-13" December 24-31, 1966
        3.A January 2, 1959 Launch of the Dream rocket. For the first time going beyond gravity (THE USSR)?
        (I’m not talking about this, November 4, 1957 The first artificial Earth satellite (USSR) was launched. The beginning of the space age)
        4. And March 18, 1965 The first spacewalk was carried out by Alexei Leonov (Voskhod-2, USSR)?
        (keep silent about this, on April 12, 1961, Yuri Gagarin, on the Vostok spacecraft (USSR), made the world's first space flight)
        5.A January 31, 1966 Launch of the Luna-9 spacecraft (USSR), which for the first time in the world made a soft landing on the moon and transmitted to Earth image of the lunar surface (near)?

        Deny the obvious: Thanks to NASA’s telescope outside the sun’s atmosphere, our knowledge of the limits of the universe has increased 10 times and billions of new galaxies have been discovered.= Of course you can’t!
        But also to forget that in the 60s and 70s, the Owe astronautics occupied a leading position in the world, The USSR launched 10 times more satellites than all other countries of the world combined. (правда их,"запускантов" было не очень много... wink
        1. postman
          postman 12 May 2014 15: 04 New
          +4
          O. Kaptstsova (add)
          6.first animal-cosmonaut (is it possible, in principle, the existence of a living creature in zero gravity, beyond the ionosphere) = November 3, 1957, the second artificial Earth satellite "Sputnik-2" was launched, first living space creature, - the dog Laika.

          7. The first artificial satellite of the Sun - January 4, 1959 - the Luna-1 station passed 6 thousand kilometers from the lunar surface and entered a heliocentric orbit. She became the world's first artificial satellite of the Sun. This launch essentially carried out an experiment to create an artificial comet, and for the first time, an external radiation belt of the Earth was recorded using an onboard magnetometer.

          8. the first "bridge" between the two planets March 1, 1966 960 kg station "Venus-3" first reached the surface of Venus, delivering the pennant of the USSR. A large amount of trajectory measurements was of great value for studying the problems of ultra-long-range communications and interplanetary flights. We studied magnetic fields, cosmic rays, flows of charged particles of low energies, flows of solar plasma and their energy spectra, as well as space radio emissions and micrometeors.

          9.Впервые on Mars = November 27, 1971, the Mars-2 station first reached the surface of Mars. In the orbital compartment of the spacecraft there was scientific equipment designed for measurements in interplanetary space, as well as for studying the environs of Mars and the planet itself from the orbit of an artificial satellite (failed - crashed in the Valley of Nanedi in Xanfa Land (4 ° N; 47 ° W).
        2. Santa Fe
          12 May 2014 17: 14 New
          +1
          Quote: Postman
          Thanks to the NASA telescope, taken beyond the limits of the solar atmosphere, our knowledge of the limits of the Universe has increased 10 times and billions of new galaxies have been discovered. = Of course not!

          - Mercury and the incredible AMC expedition messenger
          - Mars
          - Pluto (waiting, from the summer of 2015)
          - radar map of Venus (Magellan)
          - giant planets
          - landing on Titan (paired with ESA)
          - outer regions of the solar system
          - interstellar space (40-year-old Voyager mission)
          - search for exoplanets in other stellar systems (KEPLER counted over 1000)
          - all the advanced space technologies - GPS, orbital observatories, the most complicated gravitational maneuvers, long-distance space communications systems, spacecraft radiation protection technologies ...

          NASA zhzhot in full


          70-meter plate in Goldstone (the same in Spain and Australia) - with the help of them, NASA maintains contact with its space reconnaissance.


          Mariners, Vikings, Pioneers, Voyagers, Magellan, Cassini-Huygens, Martian orbital reconnaissance, Phoenix, Soho, Pathfinder, rovers Spirit, Opportunity, Curiosity, StarDast, Messenger, Juno, Maven, New horizons are located near American stations Mercury, to the outer planets (Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune), and entered the interstellar space

          Here, whatever one may say, everything we know about the solar system was obtained using NASA's apparatuses.

          СССР лидировал лишь там, где можно было быстро, относительно просто и дешево получить ПРИОРИТЕТ и "щелкнуть" американцев по носу. Но когда потребовались настоящие исследования и сложные экспедиции на окраину С. системы - вперед стремительно вырвалось NASA
  4. gandalf
    gandalf 12 May 2014 09: 08 New
    12
    “We fly on technologies 70-ies of the last century, and the astronauts do not have an emotional boost. When you see the achievements of partners, you understand that we have no progress. ”


    I will even say more ...

    ... in the work "Spaceship" (1924 d.) Tsiolkovsky analyzed the planning of a rocket launch in the atmosphere that occurs without fuel consumption when it returns from an atmospheric flight along a spiral path that goes around the Earth.

    One of the pioneers of Soviet cosmonautics, Professor M. K. Tikhonravov, discussing the contribution of K. E. Tsiolkovsky to theoretical astronautics, wrote that his work “Exploring the World Spaces with Reactive Devices” can be called almost comprehensive. In it, for flying in outer space, a liquid fuel rocket was proposed (the possibility of using electric jet engines was indicated), the fundamentals of the dynamics of the flight of rocket vehicles were described, the biomedical problems of long interplanetary flights were considered, the need for the creation of artificial Earth satellites and orbital stations was pointed out, was analyzed social significance of the whole complex of human space activities.


    We fly on 1930 technology!

    А проблема в том, по-моему, что сейчас технологии развиваются в плоскости зарабатывания бабла. Сейчас новые технологии "на слуху" - это тычпады, 3Dтв и т.п.
    I do not think that KB Korolev or Chelomei thought, but how much profit will be given to them by the flight of Gagarin or Titov.
    And now?

    Fundamental science is not enough. Not only in Russia.
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 11: 50 New
      -8
      Quote: gandalf
      We fly on 1930 technology!

      Digging to the end, the first liquid-propellant jet engine was built by Robert Goddard in 1926.
      Quote: gandalf
      touchpads

      Do you offer to fly into space with mechanical scores?

      Microelectronics - the most important stage on the path to the stars
      Quote: gandalf
      I do not think that KB Korolev or Chelomei thought, but how much profit will be given to them by the flight of Gagarin or Titov.

      The Kremlin was thinking about this for them - the project had a defense and propaganda significance on a global scale. USSR did not spare funds for propaganda
      Quote: gandalf
      Fundamental science is not enough. Not only in Russia.

      Well, how little, over the past 30 years, we have managed to visit the vicinity of almost all planets (New Horizons will fly to Pluto in 2015), dozens of orbital observatories have been created, and the entire Mars have been searched by rovers.

      Probes and Mars rovers exploring Mars
      1. Bayonet
        Bayonet 13 May 2014 08: 23 New
        -3
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        USSR did not spare funds for propaganda

        It would be better if I didn’t spare my people, maybe I wouldn’t fall apart!
  5. Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 12 May 2014 09: 12 New
    +3
    If humanity does not colonize the cosmos, then it will die with the sun, and quickly and unexpectedly for itself. It is necessary to get out now, slowly, gradually, step by step, otherwise one may not have time to be trite.
    1. blizart
      blizart 12 May 2014 09: 29 New
      +1
      Do not have time, a couple of million years?
      1. postman
        postman 13 May 2014 02: 09 New
        0
        Quote: blizart
        Do not have time, a couple of million years?

        +4 billions.
  6. krot
    krot 12 May 2014 09: 25 New
    0
    But the fact remains!
  7. podpolkovnik
    podpolkovnik 12 May 2014 09: 26 New
    +5
    As for trampolines ....
    It’s not us anymore, it’s more about them ....
  8. Leopold
    Leopold 12 May 2014 09: 48 New
    +1
    Americans can be denied sanity about everything except money. Perhaps the ISS project for them has lost its financial perspective, and space exploration will give such an understanding in which it becomes clear:
    - either space exploration in the next 200 years does not bear any prospect. And this will be done much cheaper than creating any lunar and Martian bases.
    - either in a strategic perspective, it is possible to use outer space and objects in it with visible financial returns.
  9. jayich
    jayich 12 May 2014 10: 29 New
    11
    But how did the author forget about the hangar which will fly in June? And the project of an orbital nuclear tugboat does not need to be mentioned?
    The first modern RD-191 engines were assembled here in 2010. Since that time, designers have repeatedly worked them out on a test bench - it was necessary to find out what is the maximum load for a new brainchild.

    The most difficult thing is behind, all engine components have passed the necessary certification in three years of testing.

    "РД-191 развивает тягу в 200 тонн, при этом обладает высоким уровнем удельного импульса тяги в 370 секунд", — отмечает замначальника двигательного отдела НПО "Энергомаш" Владимир Гусев.

    The RD-191 engine in real conditions will be checked after a month and a half. However, work on it showed that the technical capabilities of modern rocket motors have been exhausted. We must look for other ways, because the goals of mankind in space are global.

    "Мы начали заниматься новым для нас типом двигателя – детонационным ЖРД", — признается заместитель начальника двигательного отдела НПО "Энергомаш" Владимир Гусев.

    Детонационный двигатель позволит и лететь дальше, и в космос выводить больше груза. Это новый проект "Энергомаша" и очередной вызов конкурентам.На "Энергомаше" считают, что через пару-тройку лет вместо макета они смогут представить реальный экземпляр, который станет новой страницей в космонавтике.
    Taken from here http://www.sdelanounas.ru/blogs/49437/#cut
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 12: 31 New
      +1
      Quote: jayich
      But how did the author forget about the hangar which will fly in June?

      An ordinary launch vehicle, unusual only in that it was developed for 20 years and spent 100 billion rubles.
      Quote: jayich
      And the project of an orbital nuclear tugboat does not need to be mentioned?

      No, because such projects around the world are a dime a dozen

      Moreover, the very idea of ​​a nuclear tugboat (the main thing is nuclear; why, why - nobody cares) looks, to put it mildly, unpromising
      Quote: jayich
      "РД-191 развивает тягу в 200 тонн, при этом обладает высоким уровнем удельного импульса тяги в 370 секунд",

      it's not enough

      Rocketdyne Rocket System 68, RS-68 - Delta-IV LV first stage engine

      The thrust of the RS-68A modification is 317 tons at sea level and 346 tons in vacuum. Specific impulse - 359 s (at sea level), 409 s (vacuum)
      Quote: jayich
      We began to engage in a new type of engine for us - detonation rocket engine

      They will build a working prototype and serial launch vehicle based on it - there will be well done
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 13: 06 New
        +7
        Conventional Booster

        Not really. It is modular. And it can have a different load.
        The thrust of the RS-68A modification is 317 tons at sea level and 346 tons in vacuum. Specific impulse - 359 s (at sea level), 409 s (vacuum)

        Do not compare hydrogen-oxygen engines with kerosene engines.
        1. postman
          postman 12 May 2014 17: 20 New
          +3
          Quote: Wedmak
          Not really. It is modular. And it can have a different load.

          Type Delta IV


          or Atlas


          not modular?
          And PN can not be different?
          Quote: Wedmak
          Do not compare hydrogen-oxygen engines with kerosene engines.

          And why actually?
          Technologically, a very complex product + the entire infrastructure.
          IMPORTANT: traction, impulse, launch vehicles and spacecraft.
          The ratio of PN to the total mass of KA- 18-19% for modern heavy Spacebase telecommunication platforms (French-Italian company Thales Alenia Space in the 80s)

          or
          Express 2000 (Russian company ISS OJSC,today)
          1. Wedmak
            Wedmak 12 May 2014 17: 54 New
            0
            Type Delta IV

            Like ... Do not forget that while NASA was developing, we stood for a while. Soon to catch up.
            And why actually?

            Well, as if the thrust of hydrogen is greater than kerosene. This is already out of the fuel.
            1. postman
              postman 12 May 2014 18: 27 New
              +2
              Quote: Wedmak
              we stood for a while. Catch up soon.

              I am familiar with the space rocket industry ... firsthand.
              No chance to catch upif something happens with the USA (default what thread)
              "Delta" (Delta) - Provides space launches in the USA since 1960.
              History of the Delta Launch Vehicle

              Quote: Wedmak
              Well, as if the draft of hydrogen is more than kerosene

              And fluorine is even more hydrogen.
              only trouble with it is MORE than with hydrogen
              1. Wedmak
                Wedmak 12 May 2014 19: 37 New
                +2
                I am familiar with the space rocket industry ... firsthand.
                No chance to catch up

                Well yes. Now, if you think so, there really is no chance.
                only trouble with it is MORE than with hydrogen

                Nobody argues with this. Made a lot of engines with VERY poisonous fuel components. The thrust is huge, but ... somehow sucks to live in the desert.
      2. Bayonet
        Bayonet 13 May 2014 08: 20 New
        +1
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN

        An ordinary launch vehicle, unusual only in that it was developed for 20 years and spent 100 billion rubles.

        I would say not ordinary, but UNIQUE!
      3. xtur
        xtur 14 May 2014 00: 42 New
        0
        >это же мало
        >Rocketdyne Rocket System 68, RS-68 - двигатель первой ступени РН Дельта-IV
        >Тяга модификации RS-68A составляет 317 tons at sea level and 346 tons in a vacuum.
        >Удельный импульс - 359 s (at sea level), 409 s (vacuum)

        it was worth comparing the sizes - these are different engines for different tasks.

        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/RS-68

        Weight: 6747 kg
        Height: 5207 mm
        Diameter: 2438 mm

        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%D0%94-191

        Weight: 2 200 kg
        Height: 3 780 mm
        Diameter: 2 100 mm


        and in terms of traction, the Amer engine is closer to the rd-180

        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%D0%94-180

        Dry weight: 5 kg
        Height: 3 600 mm
        Diameter: 3 200 mm

        Thrust: Vacuum: 423.4 tf
        Sea level: 390.2 tf
        Specific Impulse: Vacuum: 337.8 c
        Sea level: 311.3

  10. sataha666
    sataha666 12 May 2014 10: 51 New
    +8
    Странно что никаких упоминаний о "Спектр-Р", хотя он был запущен в 2011. И это при том, что статья пытается объективно указать, что у нас кроме отсталой пилотируемой космонавтики ничего нет. Думается мне, что есть еще другие моменты о который автор случайно(или намеренно) умолчал, для примера используемые матрасниками наши ракетные двигатели
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 11: 33 New
      +1
      Quote: sataha666
      Странно что никаких упоминаний о "Спектр-Р", хотя он был запущен в 2011

      Спектр-Р, он же российский космический телескоп "Радиоастрон"

      It was not mentioned for an obvious reason: NASA has more than a dozen such space observatories - Hubble (visible range), Compton (gamma), Spitzer (IR), Chandra (X-ray), Kepler (ultra-sensitive photometer to search for exoplanets), etc.

      So in the field of creating space observatories, Roscosmos looks very sour (the second in the world, with a big lag behind NASA). You should not touch this topic so as not to disturb the sincere feelings of patriots

      Quote: sataha666
      we have nothing but a retarded manned space program

      In general, it is
      Quote: sataha666
      our rocket engines used by mattresses

      РД-180 используются в первой ступени РН "Атлас-V"
      All other 10 American launch vehicles and booster blocks fly their own engines (the main developer is Rocketdyne)

      В использование РД-180 нет никакого секрета - янки не захотели разрабатывать ЖРД с "нуля", когда нашелся зарубежный аналог подходящих габаритов и мощности. Все средства уходят на дорогущие межпланетные миссии. Что до национальной гордости (используем зарубежный движок?) - об этом никто не задумывается, ведь они и так впереди планеты всей в области космических технологий

      Spitzer Infrared Space Telescope
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 12: 11 New
        +4
        The Americans made these machines when our country lay buried under economic problems. However, these devices are worthless and useless, remaining on Earth. I think ours chose the right direction of development, first carriers, then spacecraft. Step by step.
        Our electronics almost always lagged behind the American. But on one electronics you can’t get into orbit.
        Let's see what will happen in the next 10 years. Money has gone into space, developments are underway, tests are underway.
        1. Santa Fe
          12 May 2014 12: 49 New
          +3
          Quote: Wedmak
          The Americans made these machines when our country lay buried under economic problems

          The Hubble telescope was built in the 80 years and launched in 1990, even before the collapse of the Union

          What are the excuses for the failure of the Soviet Martian program? Who interfered with exploring the outer planets (the parade of 70-80x planets allowed Voyagers to fly around all 4 outer planets at a time). The fact is that everything we know about the solar system is obtained by NASA
          Quote: Wedmak
          However, these devices are worthless and useless, remaining on Earth.

          I did not understand your thought. space observatories in space above your head
          Quote: Wedmak
          carriers first, then spacecraft

          Both space powers have carriers. A wide range of media
          Quote: Wedmak
          Let's see what will happen in the next 10 years.

          Everything will remain the same. One domestic Phobos-Grunt-2 at NASA's 10 interplanetary expeditions (I exaggerate, but the proportion is approximately the same)
          1. Wedmak
            Wedmak 12 May 2014 13: 02 New
            +3
            The fact is that everything we know about the solar system is obtained by NASA

            So what? Will we bow and sing the NASA Ossana? Let's not forget the contribution of the Soviet and Russian cosmonautics to manned flights?

            Everything will remain the same.

            I really, really doubt it. We can throw automatic spacecraft at least every year. Only now it will eat all the resources for the development of new media. With the help of which, it will already be possible to implement more ambitious programs than the launch of dozens of machines.

            All their achievements are bought or stolen. They present joint achievements as their own. So do not elevate their dozens of spacecraft high - there are still many countries including Russia that took part. After all, an unaware reader might think that everything from designing to landing-walkways on another planet, the United States and NASA did alone. And this is not true.
            1. Santa Fe
              12 May 2014 13: 20 New
              +4
              Quote: Wedmak
              So what? Will we bow and sing the NASA Ossana? Let's not forget the contribution of the Soviet and Russian cosmonautics to manned flights?

              In the article, it was said that DO Rogozin is a populist and cheap balabol
              The amers have no lag in space, the lag in fact with us and we need to catch up as soon as possible

              Но кремлежуликам проще пустить "утку" про батут и замалчивать проблему, прикрываясь лже-патриотизмом
              Quote: Wedmak
              We can throw automatic spacecraft at least every year

              Not a modem. There are no funds, nor the necessary technology
              Quote: Wedmak
              They present joint achievements as their own.

              It's funny that Angaru was developing the LKE concern (Lockheed-Khrunichev-Energia). In 2006, Lockheed was tired of this unfinished building and the Yankees left the project, however, the Angara still does not fly

              Мы и наши бывшие партнеры по LKE/ILS - компания Lockheed Martin уверены, что космический центр имени Хруничева успешно продолжит на мировом рынке деятельность по предоставлению пусковых услуг ракет-носителей "Протон" и "Ангара", - обещает пресс-служба центра Хруничева.
              Quote: Wedmak
              from design to landing, the passages on another planet were made by the USA and NASA alone

              let's say, their contribution is much greater than the total contribution of all other project participants
              1. Wedmak
                Wedmak 12 May 2014 15: 24 New
                +4
                In the article, it was said that DO Rogozin is a populist and cheap balabol

                There is also a balabol.
                The amers have no lag in space, the lag in fact with us and we need to catch up as soon as possible

                This is not entirely true. The backlog is just in different areas. If we have vast experience in orbital flights, then they have extensive experience in operating reusable systems. But at present, EVERYONE is flying into orbit on our ships. But they send automatic stations.
                We are catching up. And you except criticize us and praise the Americans ... request
                Not a modem. There are no funds, nor the necessary technology

                Come on? Unions and Protons automatically reach the ISS and also automatically join. Not so long ago we tested a new system and delivery algorithm. Now they fly to the ISS not 2 days, but 6 hours. What prevents the construction of an automatic spacecraft for flight to Mars? Nothing. Only whether it is necessary. Swung to the moon, God help.
                It's funny that Angaru was developing the LKE concern (Lockheed-Khrunichev-Energia). In 2006, Lockheed was tired of this unfinished building and the Yankees left the project, however, the Angara still does not fly

                Something I did not find confirmation of the participation of LKE.
                Co-executors for individual parts and systems were installed:

                RKK Energy (Korolev) - throughout the entire construction of the 2nd stage;
                NPO Energomash (Khimki) - for engines of the 1st stage;
                Design Bureau Chemistry (Voronezh) - for engines of the 2nd stage;
                GRTs KB named after V.P. Makeev - for fuel tanks;
                Design Bureau of Transport Engineering (TsENKI NIISK, Moscow) - on the ground launch complex;
                NII HIMMASH (now FKP "SIC RCP") - on the ground development of CRC.


                ii ... WHERE ??? And since the customer is the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation and the Federal Space Agency, then ... proof please.
                Engines engines have passed fire tests, the system itself is currently being tested. Summer-fall fly. What does not suit you?

                let's say, their contribution is much greater than the total contribution of all other project participants

                I do not detract from their contribution. I am against what are called American rovers. Although there are half of the appliances from Europe and Russia.
                1. Santa Fe
                  12 May 2014 17: 34 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  If we have vast experience of orbital flights

                  Do you think they have it less
                  who built the first orbital station?
                  Hubble repair in orbit, etc.
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  What prevents the construction of an automatic spacecraft for flight to Mars?

                  Ask the creators of Phobos-Grunt

                  Seriously, we don’t have any technology (AMS reliability in long-distance expeditions, long-distance space communication systems, landing methods on Mars, experience)

                  why did the plans for the expedition to Europe change (Ganymede was chosen in return)? NASA refused to provide Roscosmos with radiation protection technology for spacecraft electronics, and the Chinese do not know how to do this - there’s nobody to buy
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  Although there are half of the appliances from Europe and Russia.

                  Devices are not the whole spacecraft
                  How about an air crane (otherwise it was impossible to lower the 900-kg MSL to Mars), 60 pyro-cartridges in a certain sequence, 500 thousand lines of program code, a support system, ground communication via Odysseus and MRO in Mars orbit, again plates in Canberra and Goldstone

                  Russian DAN spectrometer aboard Marsokhzod is a drop in the ocean
                  1. Wedmak
                    Wedmak 12 May 2014 17: 58 New
                    +2
                    Do you think they have it less

                    Ours, as it were, lasted longer.
                    why did the plans for the expedition to Europe change (Ganymede was chosen in return)? NASA refused to provide Roscosmos with radiation protection technology for spacecraft electronics, and the Chinese do not know how to do this - there’s nobody to buy

                    Yeah, we got to Venus, there were radiation protection technologies, but not to Europe? Something you darken.
                    How about an air crane

                    For a long time, the similarity is used when landing BMD from the aircraft. The same principle.
                    Russian DAN spectrometer aboard Marsokhzod is a drop in the ocean

                    Yes, of course ... That they themselves did not make this drop?
                    1. Santa Fe
                      12 May 2014 21: 57 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      Ours, as it were, lasted longer.

                      World older than xylum years on 10 with a ponytail
                      first manual docking (Gemini-8 - Agena)
                      135 Shuttle flights, repairs of telescopes and satellites in outer space, MMU jetpack, its own ISS segment


                      Astronaut Dale Gardner uses a jetpack to travel on the Westar VI satellite. November 1984 of the year.


                      There is no reason to claim that amers have less experience working in orbit
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      We got to Venus, there were radiation protection technologies, but not to Europe?

                      Venus is not Jupiter. there are no such radiation belts.
                      поэтому целью миссии "Лаплас" был выбран Ганимед - он расположен в 1,5 раза дальше от Юпитера, чем Европа

                      Quote: Wedmak
                      similarity is applied when landing BMD from the plane. The same principle.

                      Not the same
                      The principle of operation of a sky crane - with a rocket platform hovering above the ground, the rover was slowly lowered on ropes
                      1. rolik
                        rolik 13 May 2014 00: 28 New
                        +6
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        World older than xylum years on 10 with a ponytail

                        And there was also the Salute station, which was put into orbit earlier than Skylab. Correct if not so))))) Salute in orbit on April 19, 1971, launched by the Proton rocket. The mattress miracle laboratory was launched into orbit on May 14, 1973. Moreover, this is the only mattress station, and their achievements in this field have ended.
                        The world's first automatic docking was carried out on October 30, 1967 in the USSR, Soyuz unmanned vehicles under the names Cosmos-186 and Cosmos-188. Note unmanned vehicles and automatic docking.
                        А у нас своего на МКС ничего нет???)))) Это раз, а во вторых: мы смогли создать свою большую станцию " Мир" называлась. Матрасники с их " технологической мосчью" не могли в одиночку создать станцию наподобие нашей. И не надо говорить, что им это было не нужно. И было, и нужно..... вот только не смогли.
                        HHMU jetpack (Hand-Helded Maneuvering Unit), remembered ???? Why not remember UPMK ??????? Or do not know about this ????? I remind you that it was developed first for the Voskhod ships, and then, in 1965-1966, under the program of the Almaz military stations. The installation in the shape of a horseshoe seemed to hug the astronaut in a spacesuit. The movement was provided by two blocks - accelerating and braking, each of 42 powder engines. The operation of one engine accelerated the astronaut by 20 centimeters per second. Along the modern hundred-meter International Space Station (ISS) with this speed, one could fly in about 10 minutes. Moving slower was unprofitable, faster - dangerous and wasteful. Both accelerating and braking engines were placed so that the thrust vector passed through the center of mass without causing astronaut turns. The orientation system consisted of 14 miniature nozzles running on compressed air and was controlled by a “joystick” on the horseshoe armrest, and the automation limited the speed of the turn. The weight of the UPMK was 90 kilograms, and together with the pilot in a spacesuit - 250 kilograms. Batteries provided up to four hours of battery life in outer space. And the fuel supply, if spent entirely on acceleration in one direction, would be enough to accelerate to a speed of 32 m / s. This parameter in space is called the characteristic speed of the device. The use of solid rocket fuel and compressed air simplified operation and increased the safety of UPMK.
                        As for the Shuttles, remember the Soviet Bor, which was decades ahead of the Shuttle.
                        Nasa refused to provide radiation protection technologies, but did not refuse to use our landing technologies for its rovers. And the point is not that we do not have such technologies. We did not have processors capable of withstanding radiation, now we already have it))))) But what technologies we will now share with mattresses, after all that has happened, is a big question.
                        The great cosmic nation displays its rockets with the help of our engines. They tried to ban their supplies, and immediately reversed)))))) And as a result of all these frictions in their fist, mattresses will put our engines again)))))) Well, yes, yes .... be famous America )))))))
                      2. Santa Fe
                        13 May 2014 00: 42 New
                        +1
                        Quote: rolik
                        And there was also the Salute station, which was put into orbit earlier than Skylab. Correct if not so)))))

                        First, compare their internal volume
                        Quote: rolik
                        Great cosmic nation launches its rockets using our engines

                        If you are a connoisseur, tell us on which Amer launch vehicles our engines are. and don’t forget to calculate how many NASA and SpaceX launch vehicles and booster blocks have
                      3. rolik
                        rolik 13 May 2014 15: 20 New
                        +1
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        First, compare their internal volume

                        And here is the internal volume ????? The car is different from the bus ???? Nevertheless, this is a car. Then let's compare the only mattress station that did not last long, and Mir station)))) Who has more volume ???)))))
                        The first launch of the American Atlas IIA-R rocket (later renamed Atlas III), equipped with Russian engines, took place in 2000. Energomash and General Dynamics signed an agreement under which by 2018 the Russian side should supply 101 RD-180 engines worth about $ 10 million each. To date, most of the contract has been completed: the American space industry has received 70 engines.
                        Oh ..... please excuse me if this engine turned out to be our production and not a mattress. What a regrettable misunderstanding)))))))
                        Although I’m not such a great connoisseur of the space theme, but when I talk about something, I get ready for the topic)))))))
                        Well, and for dessert, a special one, the NK-33 engine was put on an Antares rocket. 37 NK-33 engines were sold several years ago to Aerojet, which finalized them for use on new American launch vehicles. As part of the modernization project called AJ-26, part of the equipment is dismantled from Russian engines and new components are installed, including a gimbal traction vector control system. Two AJ-26 / NK-33 engines are used in the first stage of the new Antares launch vehicles. On April 21, 2013, the first launch of this rocket took place, during which four small spacecraft and one weight simulator of the promising cargo spacecraft Cygnus were launched into orbit. To date, three launches of Antares family missiles have been carried out. All three starts ended with the successful launch of the load into orbit.
                      4. Santa Fe
                        13 May 2014 16: 22 New
                        +1
                        Quote: rolik
                        And here is the internal volume?

                        With all!
                        key parameter of the station, determining its tasks and capabilities
                        Diamond / Salute - 90 cubic meters
                        Skylab - 352
                        Quote: rolik
                        Then let's compare the only mattress station that did not last long

                        Peers of Skylab - Salutes of the first generation worked in orbit from 10 days to the spirit of years
                        Skylab lasted six years (1973-79)
                        Quote: rolik
                        and Mir station)))) Who has more volume?

                        These are stations of different generations.
                        The first block of the World was put into orbit in 1986

                        About the engines:
                        RD-180 and NK-33 - to equip the Atlas and Antares LVs

                        The rest of the Amer launch vehicles and booster blocks (Delta, Falken, Centaurus TP) - fly on their own engines

                        The reasons for acquiring RD-180 in Russia are purely business. The Yankees did not begin to develop rocket engines from scratch when they found a suitable copy at a bargain price
                      5. rolik
                        rolik 13 May 2014 22: 13 New
                        0
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        The Yankees did not start developing rocket engines from scratch,

                        More precisely could not. To develop an engine like 180 they would need (now) at least 5 years, this is a great optimism with an unknown result. The rest of the mattress rockets do not belong to the class on which they stand 180, we also have the Rokot rocket made on the basis of the ICBM can put satellites and other cargo into orbit. So we are doing mattresses here))))) That is, I hope you will not defend your statement about not using our engines with mattresses ???????
                        Since 1974, Skylab flew empty and dead cargo. So, the presence in orbit of a dead and non-working mass does not mean its useful use. We also recently found a satellite made in the USSR from orbit)))) And what, now is it considered a cool achievement in terms of flight duration ?? Despite the fact that he worked out his resource for a long time and dangled in orbit with a dead load))))))
                        And here stations of different generations. You were told about the volume of stations, I was given the answer corresponding to the question. And here are different generations ????? No need to wag aside if it is impossible to give a direct answer)))))))
                        Moreover, Scalab was a station in its pure form and Salutes (Diamonds) were dual-use stations. Despite the fact that military appointment was in their first place. If it was necessary to build just a station, it would be built. And unlike Skaileb, they would not use the upper stage of Saturn 1B for a residential module))))) But they made a normal and well-protected volume from solar radiation, which was done on the World. By the way, ours are going to stop cooperation on the ISS in 2020, despite persistent requests from the mattress to continue it. We will do our station with other partners. Rumor has it that we will pick up our modules, which are now on the ISS for the new station))))) Although I strongly doubt it, using space in space is more expensive.
                      6. Santa Fe
                        14 May 2014 00: 46 New
                        +1
                        Quote: rolik
                        More precisely could not.

                        Никогда не говорите "не смогли", когда речь идет о странах, претендующих на статус мировой сверхдержавы

                        Only money and business. It turned out to be more profitable to spend the funds on other areas of work - AMS, space observatory, etc.
                        Quote: rolik
                        That is, I hope you will not defend yours now statement about not using our engines with mattresses ?

                        Where and when did I write about there
                        Quote: rolik
                        To develop an engine like 180

                        Why this
                        To do this, there is a simpler and more effective way - modular missiles

                        To date, the most powerful LV in the world is the Delta-IV in the Heavy Varinate (Rocketdine and PrattWhitney engines)

                        На подходе самая тяжелая конфигурация Фэлкен 9 - "Хэви" - 28 небольших унифицированных движков Мерлин (керосин) во всех ступенях. Тяга чудовищна. По расчетам ракета сможет доставлять свыше 50 тонн на низкую орбиту
                        Quote: rolik
                        Since 1974, Skylab has been flying empty and dead.

                        1. Before 1974, three records were set there for the duration of orbit (EMNIP - up to 89 days)

                        2. The very appearance of the 77-ton orb. stations with a working volume of 300 + cubic meters - in 1973, no one had this

                        3. After 1974, the station was operational and could be used at any time - Shuttle missions were planned for it and its further use
                        Quote: rolik
                        that military assignment stood in their first place.

                        Military Purpose - High Resolution Camera
                        Skylab had the same thing + radar
                        Quote: rolik
                        would not use the upper stage of Saturn 1B for a residential module)

                        We didn’t have that.

                        Initially, the upper stage of the S-IVB was planned for the construction of a heavy interplanetary ship for flying around Venus (in conjunction with the Apollo spacecraft)
                    2. adept666
                      adept666 20 May 2014 15: 41 New
                      -1
                      The reasons for acquiring RD-180 in Russia are purely business. The Yankees did not begin to develop rocket engines from scratch when they found a suitable copy at a bargain price


                      Причина далеко не в этом ... Обратите внимание на параметр тяговооружённости RS-68(на водороде!) и РД-180(на керосине!), а потом на параметр тяговооружённости "отсталого" по вашему мнению РД-191(на керосине!) wink
            2. Wedmak
              Wedmak 13 May 2014 15: 11 New
              0
              There is no reason to claim that amers have less experience working in orbit

              There is. Ours have been flying there for years; the Americans have only recently begun long flights.
              Venus is not Jupiter. there are no such radiation belts.

              But there is hellish radiation from the Sun. Together with giant thermal, gamma, and other radiation.
              The principle of operation of a sky crane - with a rocket platform hovering above the ground, the rover was slowly lowered on ropes

              What's on the forehead, what's on the forehead. We have missiles slowed down by cargo, and here a hovering platform. Do not forget, the gravity of Mars is lower, therefore making such an elevator easier.
            3. Santa Fe
              13 May 2014 16: 40 New
              +1
              Quote: Wedmak
              Americans have only recently begun long flights.

              Ours conducted operations in outer space, like Hubble repairs?
              Quote: Wedmak
              But there is hellish radiation from the Sun.

              In the orbit of Venus?
              There is no such problem
              Quote: Wedmak
              . We have missiles slowed down by cargo, and here a hovering platform.

              Yes, and then carefully release the cable
              When the rover touched the ground with wheels - it is necessary to take the platform to the side
              Quote: Wedmak
              Do not forget, the gravity of Mars is lower, therefore making such an elevator easier.

              Do not forget that Mars has no atmosphere where you can parachute for free
              Практически на протяжении всего спуска аппарат "висит" на ЖРД - большой перерасход топлива; притом что Марс -не Луна, гравитация по-прежнему чувствительна.

              Mars is the most insidious celestial body in terms of landing. When they will once again discuss a manned flight to Mars - ask the developer how they were going to land an 100-ton ship with astronauts and an take-off stage with the necessary fuel supply

              PS / Parachute in the figure is an auxiliary tool that allows you to drop the first space velocity. Gently landing on Mars in this way is impossible
            4. adept666
              adept666 20 May 2014 15: 24 New
              -1
              Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
              Ours conducted operations in outer space, like Hubble repairs?


              Spent of course. How do you think the stations from Salyut-1 to Mir and the ISS were served?
    2. xtur
      xtur 14 May 2014 01: 06 New
      0
      >Думаете у них он меньше

      Soviet cosmonauts in orbit spent more than a year, Amer’s do not live so much. This is the difference in research by ten years, if not more
    3. adept666
      adept666 20 May 2014 13: 50 New
      -1
      Do you think they have it less
      who built the first orbital station?


      But really, who? smile
  11. Bayonet
    Bayonet 13 May 2014 08: 09 New
    +1
    Quote: Wedmak
    And you except criticize us and praise the Americans ...

    You can generally be silent, unless of course this is to the benefit of our space program.
  • postman
    postman 13 May 2014 02: 11 New
    +1
    Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
    In the article, it was said that DO Rogozin is a populist and cheap balabol

    YES!!!
    You just forgot to post the ISS FINANCING data from NASA and ESA in the article.
    ==============
    There would be no questions.
    I have a general suspicion that we are taking Americans to the ISS for FREE (to pay off the share for the ISS)



    Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
    It's funny that Angaru was developing the LKE concern (Lockheed-Khrunichev-Energia)

    Well, you really waved, so waved.
    LKE (or rather (LKEI)) -NOT ANY RELATIONSHIP to the Hangar

    LKEI (or rather, the International Launch Services project), this is commerce at Launches Proton and Atlas

  • xtur
    xtur 14 May 2014 00: 52 New
    0
    >Не стоило трогать эту тему дабы не тревожить искренние чувства патриотов

    I'm, nirus chock, and I know that the word patriot had to be quoted in accordance with the rules of the Russian language in order to indicate that in fact we are talking about pseudo-patriots.

    And so, according to what was written, the author looks like a cosmopolitan.
  • xtur
    xtur 14 May 2014 00: 58 New
    +2
    >В использование РД-180 нет никакого секрета - янки не захотели разрабатывать ЖРД с "нуля", когда нашелся зарубежный аналог подходящих габаритов и мощности. Все средства уходят на дорогущие межпланетные миссии. Что до национальной гордости (используем зарубежный движок?) - об этом никто не задумывается, ведь они и так впереди планеты всей в области космических технологий

    pure water trolling. Americans are literally they tear their anus for access to the rd-180 and shout that critical tasks for them depend on these engines, I will not provide links, the author of such a review article is obliged to know about such things.

    To develop such an engine for them means to lose many, many years and an immeasurable pile of dough, and requires the existence of an immeasurable amount of literate engineers
  • Kar Karych
    Kar Karych 12 May 2014 11: 18 New
    +1
    I do not know. But after reading this article, there was a feeling that it was a bend, like: smart Americans have already studied everything, and you just have nowhere to put money. This article is an insult to the trampoline, nothing more. Remember at least the flights of our satellites in Soviet times, where the Americans were, the question. Voyager1, by the way, they no longer control for 5 years, the information that they receive now does not have any value. Because she simply is not. Article fake no more.
  • pavel_SPB
    pavel_SPB 12 May 2014 11: 32 New
    +2
    nothing ..... break through .... there will be a holiday on our street :)
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. podpolkovnik
      podpolkovnik 12 May 2014 15: 47 New
      0
      Quote: pavel_SPB
      nothing ..... break through .... there will be a holiday on our street :)


      hi Right brother!
  • Wedmak
    Wedmak 12 May 2014 11: 44 New
    +3
    The article is somewhat one-sided.
    Neither Spektr-R, nor Electro-L, nor the Angara tests, nor the transition to the Unions number, nor the new cosmodrome ... New engines are also being worked on, options are being developed for a new space reusable system. So the trampoline for the Americans still looms on the horizon. By launching their spacecraft on our engines, they will not achieve much.
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 12: 09 New
      +1
      Quote: Wedmak
      Neither about Spectrum-R, nor about Electro-L, n

      About Spektr-R there is a comment a little higher
      About Electro-L - it would be funny if the country, positioning itself as a great space power, failed to launch a meteorological satellite
      Quote: Wedmak
      neither about the Angara trials

      It has been developed and tested for 20 years. And there will be as many
      Quote: Wedmak
      neither about switching to the number of Unions

      XXI century in the yard, the processor is in every washing machine
      Quote: Wedmak
      not about the new spaceport ...

      What about?
      Quote: Wedmak
      By launching their spacecraft on our engines, they will not achieve much.

      How many NASA active launch vehicles and booster blocks? (spoiler - 11) Which of them have Russian engines installed on (answer: Atlas-V second stage).

      The Delta IV Heavy variant, as of the 2012 year, has the largest payload among all operational launch vehicles in the world. Engines of all stages - Rocketdine (RS-68 and RL-10)
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 12: 50 New
        +2
        it would be funny if the country, positioning itself as a great space power, failed to launch a meteorological satellite

        It is only partially meteorological. But still, five years ago, and this was not.
        It has been developed and tested for 20 years. And there will be as many

        In October, they promise to test the launch of the light version, have already assembled and tested. 2015 will already go medium.
        XXI century in the yard, the processor is in every washing machine

        You still do not compare the washing machine and the most complicated spacecraft.
        What about?

        Have you heard of the East? Built at an accelerated pace. Given the complexity of the structures.
        How many NASA active launch vehicles and booster blocks?

        How many launches per year does NASA and how many Roskosmos? They have their own engines only on light rockets and second / third steps. The hardest are ours.
        1. Santa Fe
          12 May 2014 13: 05 New
          +1
          Quote: Wedmak
          In October, they promise to test the launch of the light version, have already assembled and tested. 2015 will already go medium.

          what?
          Private Falcon Heavy will fly to 2015 - will be able to deliver 20 tons to GSO

          Both countries have a wide range of launch vehicles. But India and China are approaching
          Quote: Wedmak
          You still do not compare the washing machine and the most complicated spacecraft.

          But you still do not compare the budget of Roscosmos and the Chinese factory for the production of washing machines and laptops
          Quote: Wedmak
          Have you heard of the East? Built at an accelerated pace.

          What is he new
          It is being built in the same place instead of the Svobodny cosmodrome disbanded in 2007
          Quote: Wedmak
          How many launches per year does NASA and how many Roskosmos?

          Approximately equal number of starts
          http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A1%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%BA_%D0%BA%D0%BE%D

          1%81%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%87%D0%B5%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D1%85_%D0%B7%D0%B0%D0%BF%D1%83%D1

          %81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2_%D0%B2_2013_%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%B4%D1%83
          Quote: Wedmak
          They have their own engines only on light rockets and second / third steps. The hardest are ours.

          Variant Delta IV Heavy, as of 2012 year, has the highest payload among all operational launch vehicles in the world. Engines of all stages - Rocketdine (RS-68 and RL-10)
          1. Wedmak
            Wedmak 12 May 2014 15: 41 New
            +4
            Private Falcon Heavy will fly to 2015 - will be able to deliver 20 tons to GSO

            At GSO ??? Freshly imparted. Maybe in a low orbit? I’ll believe it.
            But you still do not compare the budget of Roscosmos and the Chinese factory for the production of washing machines and laptops

            I did not compare, you were the first to talk about microcircuits in each washing machine. I thought you know the difference between the performance of chips for household appliances and for space.
            It is being built in the same place instead of the Svobodny cosmodrome disbanded in 2007

            Free nearby and:
            Инфраструктура "Свободный":
            - 5 silo rocket launchers
            - a platform for launching launch vehicles Start and Start-1.

            In fact, this is the launch pad of the Strategic Missile Forces. What side you are loading into the mines Angara or Union I do not know. And launch pads Start is nothing more than a fixed adaptation for launching missiles ... Poplar! Can bring light satellites into low orbit. And that’s all.
            East will have three launch sites for light, medium and heavy classes of launch vehicles. So the new one.
            Approximately equal number of starts

            M ... did you count on flags, or all the same on launch vehicles?
            The Delta IV Heavy variant, as of 2012, has the highest payload among all operational launch vehicles in the world.

            Why ... it flies on hydrogen. A more energy-intensive fuel didn’t seem to have been invented yet? If we are talking about the largest and most powerful ... (write what you want) Americans are always in the first place. But their astronauts fly in less powerful and safer Unions.
            1. Santa Fe
              12 May 2014 22: 23 New
              +1
              Quote: Wedmak
              At GSO ??? Freshly imparted. Maybe in a low orbit?

              20 + tons per GSO
              50 + tons at DOE
              Quote: Wedmak
              between the performance of microchips for household appliances and for space

              and for aviation, and ship BIUS. Inevitably a consequence of progress in microelectronics
              Quote: Wedmak
              Did you count on flags, or all the same on launch vehicles?

              Cosmodromes - Canaveral, California Vandenburg and Wallops in Virginia
              Quote: Wedmak
              But their astronauts fly in less powerful and safer Unions.

              In my opinion, a lot has already been said about the reasons for this decision.
  • Isum
    Isum 12 May 2014 12: 22 New
    +3
    Есть весомые аргументы в пользу того, что десятилетняя работа на Марсе марсохода "Оппортьюнити" это фэйк!!
    Here are at least a couple of them: rechargeable batteries cannot work for so long; the solar panels should have already been covered with a burnt-off layer of dust, due to which the efficiency of the panels would fall to a critical value. Also last year in the pictures from the Mars rover, a tin can got into the frame, then this photo was photographed for a quick ......
  • kit-kat
    kit-kat 12 May 2014 12: 52 New
    0
    Interesting and sad.
  • foma2028
    foma2028 12 May 2014 13: 01 New
    +2
    В дневниках Николая Петровича Каманина, изданных под названием четырехтомником "Скрытый космос" отлично описана ситуация, когда лидировавший в космонавтике Советский Союз проиграл Штатам "лунную гонку".
    Kamanin well described a mess in space management and much more, which became the reason for the lag, with past grandiose successes.
    Хорошо бы ее почитать "эффективным менеджерам от космоса."
    A very competent, state-minded person was Nikolai Petrovich.
    And very interesting, first-hand memories of the Queen, Gagarin, Titov and many other people ...
  • Lone gunman
    Lone gunman 12 May 2014 13: 02 New
    +2
    Ну на амеров (экономика) 80% планеты работает-вот откуда успехи у них,гордится или превозносить США не стоит, поскольку ,чем богаче американец ,тем беднее "человек Земли".Расставили по всей планете свои военные базы и что?! О планетарной безопасности не может идти и речи- всюду войны где американский "дух", есть какие то успехи у них ,но в целом (на мой субъективный взгляд)всё идёт в "тартарары".Я так думаю, после всех кризисов (созданных амерами или теми кто за ними стоит) стоило бы не о дальнем космосе "мечтать", а теоретическими и фундаментальными науками заняться,на новом принципиально другом уровне, если всё время будем ссылаться на "Энштейна" ,то цивилизация не на йоту не продвинется вперед, заговор господа - заговор.
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 13 May 2014 07: 59 New
      0
      These are tricks for suckers who, instead of attending physics classes, smoked around the corner!
  • ArhipenkoAndrey
    ArhipenkoAndrey 12 May 2014 13: 42 New
    +1
    I agree with you, and if you look at the financing of the space industry, or rather, its absence during the reign of Gorbi and other leaders, then even that is already an achievement.
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 14: 13 New
      0
      Quote: ArhipenkoAndrey
      financing of the space industry, or rather her absence during the reign of humpback and other leaders

      Dear, well, you have to think before you write

      Gorbachev reigned in the heyday of Soviet cosmonautics

      1986 year - two successful expeditions of AMS Vega (Venus and Halley's comet from the flying trajectory)

      1988 год - первый и единственный полет "Бурана"

      Орбитальная станция "Мир" (1986-2001)
      1. Turkir
        Turkir 17 May 2014 21: 52 New
        0
        Всё это было спланировано и сделано до Горбачева. И по инерции пришлось на его "правление".
  • saturn.mmm
    saturn.mmm 12 May 2014 13: 59 New
    +3
    Rogozin's statements are often stupid, but what can you do, a philosopher, however.
    К статье неоднозначное отношение. После распада СССР мы угнаться за американцами не могли к сожалению. Но если рассматривать хронологию событий то хотелось бы уточнить была ли в 1970-ом году у американцев программа подобная "Луне-16-17" или "Венера-7"
    Система "Энергия" была универсальна в отличие от "Шатла", "Буран" мог управляться в автоматическом режиме. В каком году у американцев полетел X-37В? Вот не знаю смогли ли посадить на поверхность Венеры аппарат американцы или нет? Оно то может и не надо, но все же. Никто не мог предположить что к власти в СССР может прийти такой человек как Горбачев. Достижения в космических станциях, в СССР, тоже не стоит сбрасывать со счета, эксперименты, в автоматическом режиме, которые проводятся в космосе, были бы не возможны даже с уровнем развития современных технологий.
    Когда занимаешься исследованиями, часто происходит, что ты добиваешься результата в одном а твой "партнер" в другом и это нормально. Вот когда не занимаешься, то и нет результата, а стало быть и сравнивать нечего.
    1. Santa Fe
      12 May 2014 14: 03 New
      +1
      Quote: saturn.mmm
      хотелось бы уточнить была ли в 1970-ом году у американцев программа подобная "Луне-16-17" или "Венера-7"

      Viking, Pioneer
      were the Americans able to land the apparatus on Venus’s surface or not?

      Could if you wanted

      Remember the bathyscaphe of Trieste and the plunge into the abyss of Challenger
      "Буран" мог управляться в автоматическом режиме.

      And what’s wrong with that? Descent and landing is not an air battle
      In what year did the X-37B fly with the Americans?

      Let's better remember the Interstate TDR-1
      1. lazy
        lazy 12 May 2014 14: 19 New
        +1
        And here is our Venus!
      2. jayich
        jayich 12 May 2014 14: 22 New
        +3
        And it’s nothing that the Energia launch vehicle could be launched not only by Buran, but also by any other spacecraft weighing up to 100 tons, and the shuttle only has a shuttle.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 15: 45 New
        +2
        Remember the bathyscaphe of Trieste and the plunge into the abyss of Challenger

        Recall 2 apparatuses of the WORLD. In my opinion, the only ones capable of diving to a depth of 6 km. This is certainly far from 11, but Venus is far from the bottom of the Mariana Trench.
      5. saturn.mmm
        saturn.mmm 12 May 2014 17: 03 New
        +1
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        Viking, Pioneer

        Did the Viking automatically fly to Mars, take a soil sample and come back?
        A pioneer is an interesting, important program, deep space, certainly a worthy program. But it has nothing to do with automatic, contact research on the surface of planets.
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        Could if you wanted

        They flew to Venus, tried, if I am not mistaken, the last flight in 1994.
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        Remember the bathyscaphe of Trieste and the plunge into the abyss of Challenger

        Undoubtedly the achievement of the United States, but at least the fact that there are no weight restrictions, I take this event to a different plane.
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        And what’s wrong with that? Descent and landing is not an air battle

        Yes, you can see nothing special, only the Americans shuttles to the X-37V on the machine did not fly.
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        Let's better remember the Interstate TDR-1

        The idea is very good. But not quite the same thing, besides the program was covered, not everything worked out.
        П.С. Американцы обычно подмазываются к совместной работе слизывают что им нужно и бросают партнера(про Ангару), пример совместный танк с немцами (и много других примеров), о России , тут целые КБ работают "партнерские" типа "Боинга".
        P.P.S.M. Rogozin also surprises me.
        1. Santa Fe
          12 May 2014 22: 44 New
          +1
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          Did the Viking automatically fly to Mars, take a soil sample and come back?

          Only six AWS delivered extraterrestrial matter to the earth - three Soviet moons, Genzys and Stardust (collected dust in outer space), as well as the Japanese Hayabusa (dragged a gram of soil from an asteroid)

          The Moon-16,20,24 is an unconditional achievement of the USSR, but this is too little to compete with NASA
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          contact studies of the surface of the planets is irrelevant.

          Viking? Which has been poking around the surface of Mars for six years?
          Or 7 launches under the Surveyor program - exploration of the lunar soil (1966-68 gg.)
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          but at least the fact that there are no weight restrictions

          So the conditions are different - 90 vs 1000 atm.
          creating a sealed capsule with thermal insulation for a couple of hours - that’s in those. no problem. the problem is in the flight itself - that’s why the USSR chose the closest Venus (it’s easier to establish communication, the shortest flight time and speed to reach the departure trajectory)
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          only Americans shuttles to X-37V on the machine did not fly.

          did they need it?
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          P.P.S.M. Rogozin also surprises me.

          Even the cool USSR, which did everything honestly - but even he had difficulty exporting space programs

          Then where are these balabol
          1. Setrac
            Setrac 12 May 2014 23: 27 New
            +2
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            but it’s not enough to compete with NASA

            Here, in the spirit of a demagogic argument, it is time to switch to a comparison of specific indicators.
            1. Santa Fe
              12 May 2014 23: 29 New
              -3
              Quote: Setrac
              Here, in the spirit of a demagogic argument, it is time to switch to a comparison of specific indicators.

              Enough to count the number of missions

              or work time on the surface and in the vicinity of celestial bodies
          2. saturn.mmm
            saturn.mmm 12 May 2014 23: 49 New
            +2
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            The Moon-16,20,24 is an unconditional achievement of the USSR, but this is too little to compete with NASA

            NASA did not have more progressive at that time.
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            Viking? Which has been poking around the surface of Mars for six years?

            The Americans are great here, I really liked the solution with the batteries.
            The USSR also launched a spacecraft to Mars, but it was somehow unlucky with Mars.
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            So the conditions are different - 90 vs 1000 atm.

            I believe that the USSR could solve this problem if desired, but to be second after the Americans, whose money was already sorely thrown away.
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            did they need it?

            Well, now it took.
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            Then where are these balabol

            I would like to believe.
            1. Santa Fe
              13 May 2014 00: 02 New
              +1
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              NASA did not have more progressive at that time.

              Before the start of the 70's, the Union confidently scored
              problems began when technology was needed, whose development was associated with other areas of science and technology. And here the USSR could no longer compete alone with the entire developed world
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              The USSR also launched a spacecraft to Mars, but it was somehow unlucky with Mars.

              Reds can't get to the red planet - NASA joke
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              I believe that the USSR could solve this problem if desired

              Of course ish
              The problem is not the bathysphere tightness. problems with many months of space flight
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              Well, now it took.

              Does X-37 duplicate shuttle missions?
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              I would like to believe

              Looking at the epic with the construction of our beloved frigate and the arrogant faces of deputies with villas in Miami - it’s not very
              1. saturn.mmm
                saturn.mmm 13 May 2014 10: 43 New
                0
                Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                Does X-37 duplicate shuttle missions?

                Not all, but some may.
                Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                Looking at the epic with the construction of our beloved frigate

                I’m watching the construction, swarming over it, but there are still no guns, they promise again, in June.
                Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                impudent faces of deputies with villas in Miami

                They are not guilty, sinners. But seriously, I can’t imagine when in Russia and here, the law and civil law will prevail, but this should be sought.
    2. postman
      postman 12 May 2014 16: 10 New
      +3
      Quote: saturn.mmm
      . After the collapse of the USSR, we could not keep up with the Americans unfortunately.

      already since 1981 (!!!!) of the year and, alas, to this day leadership in space is held by the United States.
      NASA releases monthly free magazine of its latest developments and sends it to everyone. These developments and finished samples are offered for implementation to all American firms.
      At times, the OKB employees in the USSR knew more about American technology than about the work of a related OKB engaged in the same problems.
      The civil and defense industries in the former USSR were tightly isolated from each other, and advances in the defense industry did not have any impact on the country's technological progress.
      Quote: saturn.mmm
      Система "Энергия" была универсальна в отличие от "Шатла"

      1. How many times he said: the most valuable (the most expensive rocket engines) - DROPPED, rocket launcher, the same. Unlike the Shuttle
      "Универсальна" ? м.б. Сложно судить за 2 тестовых полета
      2.
      -"Буран" летал 1 н раз,и без ЭКИПАЖА,как по другому? Шаттл -НАОБОРОТ
      and, which is characteristic, in spite of the fact that I personally personally observed during practice recording a chipboard landing in Baikonur (directly from the bunker) - you will not find information about software developers, algorithm, awards for this, records itself, in my opinion ..that is strange
      -Now in the world and our aviation such an ideology reigns: planes land "by default" on autopilot, and only as a last resort, the pilot takes control.
      If I am not mistaken: ABSU-154 on the Tu-154, it is necessary to immediately turn it off and turn it off after touching.
      In 1947 (!!!!), the US Air Force C-54 aircraft made a transatlantic flight completely under the control of an autopilot (including takeoff and landing)
      Quote: saturn.mmm
      хотелось бы уточнить была ли в 1970-ом году у американцев программа подобная "Луне-16-17" или "Венера-7"

      (O. Kaptsov does not quite correctly write below)
      Moon:
      The Ranger (1961-1965)
      Surveyor (1966-1968)
      “Lunar Orbiter” (1966-1967)
      as well as the MOON-BLINK project (direct from Earth)
      Venus:
      - In 1962, when the Mariner-2 American spacecraft passed near Venus and transmitted information that confirmed that its surface was very hot.
      Before that was Mariner -1
      - “Mariner - 10” approached Venus in February 1974 and transmitted the first pictures of the upper layer of clouds.
      -American AS "Magellan"

      -American Pioneer Venus Orbiter worked in orbit around the planet from December 1978 to October 1992
      http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/photo_gallery/photogallery-venus.html
      1. postman
        postman 12 May 2014 16: 15 New
        0
        Quote: Postman
        Moon:
        The Ranger (1961-1965)
        Surveyor (1966-1968)
        “Lunar Orbiter” (1966-1967)
        as well as the MOON-BLINK project (direct from Earth)

        Ranger

        Surveyor

        Lunar Orbiter

      2. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 16: 19 New
        +1
        Now such an ideology reigns in the world and our aviation: planes land "by default" on autopilot, and only in extreme cases does the pilot take control.

        Really? The autopilot leads along the route, but the pilot performs all maneuvers in manual mode while monitoring automation. Including takeoff and landing. Automation only helps to keep the plane in a given mode.
        1. postman
          postman 12 May 2014 16: 55 New
          0
          Quote: Wedmak
          Is it?

          Yes, for a long time, in the next flight, ask the commander (chz stewardess) of the ship.
          Quote: Pochatlon
          In 1947 (!!!!), the US Air Force C-54 aircraft made a transatlantic flight completely under the control of an autopilot (including takeoff and landing)

          (this is not the same video)
      3. saturn.mmm
        saturn.mmm 12 May 2014 21: 31 New
        +2
        Quote: Postman
        At times, the OKB employees in the USSR knew more about American technology than about the work of a related OKB engaged in the same problems.

        So how do you know that the USSR lagged behind in 1981?
        Quote: Postman
        .How many times he said: the most valuable (the most expensive rocket engines) - DROPPED, rocket launcher, same. Unlike the Shuttle
        "Универсальна" ? м.б. Сложно судить за 2 тестовых полета

        Definitely universal article here, in my opinion is not bad. http://www.buran.ru/htm/memory49.htm
        Quote: Postman
        -American Pioneer Venus Orbiter worked in orbit around the planet from December 1978 to October 1992

        I asked:
        - Has the American satellite landed on the surface of Venus?
        1. Santa Fe
          12 May 2014 22: 48 New
          -2
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          - Has the American satellite landed on the surface of Venus?

          He did a less loud but much more useful thing.

          "Магеллан" за 5 лет выполнил полное картографирование Венеры
          1. saturn.mmm
            saturn.mmm 12 May 2014 23: 19 New
            +3
            Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
            "Магеллан" за 5 лет выполнил полное картографирование Венеры

            Do you happen to have a clearer photograph of the surface of Venus? (Joke)
            The first detailed maps of Venus appeared in 1983 - 1984 after a radar survey conducted from the "Venus-15 and -16" satellites. The equipment for this survey was created at the Institute of Radio Engineering and Electronics of the Academy of Sciences under the direction of O.N. Rigi. These maps show parts up to 5 km across. The survey covered an area of ​​115 million km2 (1/4 of the surface of Venus). For this northern part of the planet (from 30 ° N to the north pole) a detailed map was compiled on 27 sheets and the world's first atlas of Venus.
            Based on the materials of the same shootings, Soviet and American cartographers jointly created a series of three overview maps of northern Venus as part of the first international project on extraterrestrial cartography, held under the auspices of the Academy of Sciences and NASA. This work involved the collaboration of the GEOCHI Laboratory of Comparative Planetology and specialists from the planet mapping department of the US Geological Survey. The presentation of this series of maps called the Magellan Flight Planning Kit took place in the summer of 1989 at the International Geological Congress in Washington. In addition, the US Geological Survey, deviating from the rules, for the first time in its 100-year history published a geological map compiled outside the United States.
            In the same year, the American automatic station Magellan set off to fly to Venus to survey the rest of the territory. The preparation of her work in orbit around the planet was carried out according to maps compiled from materials taken from satellites of the Venus series.

            This article has not been viewed? http://www.buran.ru/htm/memory49.htm
            1. Santa Fe
              12 May 2014 23: 40 New
              -2
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              The survey covered an area of ​​115 million km2 (1 / 4 of the surface of Venus)

              And who made the rest of 3 / 4?
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              Do you happen to have a clearer photograph of the surface of Venus?

              By the way, a good question
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              These maps depict details of size to 5 km across.

              Synthesized aperture radar made it possible to perform cartography with a resolution of 100 — 300 meters and height measurements with an accuracy of 30-50 meters

              By September 1992, the device had taken 98% of the planet’s surface. Since the Magellan repeatedly shot many areas from different angles, this allowed us to create a three-dimensional model of the surfaceas well as explore possible landscape changes. Stereo image obtained for 22% of the surface of Venus.
              1. saturn.mmm
                saturn.mmm 13 May 2014 11: 30 New
                +2
                Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                And who made the rest of 3 / 4?

                Ten years later. Easy to walk on beaten paths.
                Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                By September 1992

                In August 1991, a revolution took place in the USSR. Which on FIGS COSMOS, trade developed.
                1. Santa Fe
                  13 May 2014 12: 58 New
                  +2
                  Quote: saturn.mmm
                  Ten years later.

                  Magellan was launched in the late 80's
                  Quote: saturn.mmm
                  Easy to walk on beaten paths.

                  A typical method of the USSR is to do everything as quickly as necessary and declare your priority
                  Venus worked in orbit for a year. Magellan - 5 years
                  Venus captured - 30% of the surface with a resolution of 5 km
                  Magellan shot 92% with a resolution of 100-300 m

                  A similar story with Mars-3 that worked on the surface of Mars for 14 seconds. Priority achieved, first AMS on the surface of Mars (1971)

                  Через пять лет на Марс добрались "безнадежно отставшие" НАСА, чьи Викинги проработали на поверхности шесть лет
                  Quote: saturn.mmm
                  In August 1991, a revolution took place in the USSR. Which on FIG COSMOS

                  We are still talking about the end of 80's
                  1. saturn.mmm
                    saturn.mmm 13 May 2014 23: 44 New
                    +1
                    Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                    We are still talking about the end of 80's

                    The collapse of the USSR began in 1987 after a meeting between Gorbochev and Reagan.
                    Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                    Через пять лет на Марс добрались "безнадежно отставшие" НАСА

                    Never claimed to be hopelessly behind NASA
                    Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                    Venus captured - 30% of the surface with a resolution of 5 km

                    In the photo the surface of Venus.
        2. postman
          postman 13 May 2014 02: 02 New
          0
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          So how do you know that the USSR lagged behind in 1981?

          Well, in principle, the results speak for themselves and OyuKaptsov wrote about this, and in 1984 I entered

          Quote: saturn.mmm
          Definitely universal here is an article, in my opinion not bad

          -nonsense
          -статья хрень,популизм. "Сломаный меч империи", такая же хна,только глупее
          crap pole. BRIEF: in a vacuum, heat dissipation is important (there is no convection, ablation, you will not get enough), there was NOTHING at the pole, but there was a 3 kW HEATER (if I’m not mistaken)
          ГДЕ ОНА РН "Энергия" и кому нужна?
          Quote: saturn.mmm
          I asked:

          I do not understand. But EXACTLY landed on Mars and passes isho
          1. saturn.mmm
            saturn.mmm 13 May 2014 11: 50 New
            0
            Quote: Postman
            -nonsense

            Что в статье неясно написано о универсальности РН "Энергия".
            Quote: Postman
            crap pole.

            Я картинку вставил чтобы наглядно показать универсальность РН "Энергия", о пользе самого "Полюса" я ничего не утверждал.
            Quote: Postman
            - article crap, populism.

            I have doubts that you have completely read it.
            Quote: Postman
            ГДЕ ОНА РН "Энергия" и кому нужна?

            Я не спец в РН. Может объясните популярно, чем плох РН "Энергия". Может еще кому пригодится.
            1. postman
              postman 13 May 2014 12: 59 New
              +2
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              Что в статье неясно написано о универсальности РН "Энергия".

              Let's start with the concept of universality (as you understand it).?
              1.По НПО "Энергия" планы(частности приводить не буду),в общем и целом для решения вопросов:

              restoration of the ozone layer of the Earth;
              Earth radioactive waste removal beyond the limits of the Solar system;
              lighting of the circumpolar cities;
              creating large-sized space reflectors for relaying energy;
              creating a solar sail for interplanetary flights;
              use of the resources of the moon;
              creating a system of environmental control and ensuring strategic stability;
              creating a single international global information system;
              удаления космического "мусора" с околоземных орбит;
              exploring the galaxy with the help of large space radio telescopes.

              =носитель есть,"решателей "нет
              2. The problem of electromagnetic compatibility of all radio systems (airborne and ground = more than 400) that worked at the training, launch and launch site
              3.new ground launch complex, refueling, storage systems, logistics, transport infrastructure, etc. = and ONLY for her !!
              4. The most important thing about the layout:

              -position of the CM
              aerodynamic drag
              - FOR MON it was required a SINGLE (or many (!) Different) aerodynamic container with an accelerating remote control. That is very, very not cheap.
              Buran is one thing, satellites are another thing
              5.Сначала создать Ду с 10 циклом повторного использования,потом озадачится и не решить проблему возвращения на землю ступени и ДУ (РН с ЖРД не вернуть в "сохранности" таким споосбом)
              Quote: saturn.mmm
              чем плох РН "Энергия".

              no need to be a specialist, life has proved: no one needs!
              currently, there are simply no objects in outer space that would require flights (by the way, very expensive) of this huge rocket with a carrying capacity of over 100 tons.
              as well as RD-0120
              Glushko insisted on creating “from scratch” a new powerful carrier, Glushko won (satisfied ambitions), the budget was ruined.

              In principle, Dmitry Ilyich Kozlov wrote in more detail and correctly about this.
  • saag
    saag 12 May 2014 14: 09 New
    +1
    An interesting approach is if the Americans launch long-range missions to get information about the world around them, then the Russian Federation is no further than a geostationary station and what will be profitable now, you won’t get so far, why is there no radiation-resistant electronics? Because in China it’s cheaper to buy what and buy a budget on this?
  • teron
    teron 12 May 2014 14: 18 New
    +3
    Вся беда в другом. Руководство нашей космической отрасли не совсем понимает зачем нам нужна космонавтика. Это началось не в наше время, читал такую статью еще по СССР. Без такого понимания все капиталовложения уйдут в пустоту (во всех смыслах). Правительству тоже не очень понятно для чего нам это нужно. Ну там оборона, метео-наблюдения, полезные ископаемые, связь, экология - это понятно, но это - орбита. Да престиж первой космической державы, да только мы регулярно доставляем людей в космос - тут есть чем гордиться. Но вот дальше - Луна, Марс, остальные планеты, астероиды, изучение вселенной - все как в тумане. Понятно, что объем исследований велик, но так ведь на то и программа, чтобы расположить "хотелки" в нужной нам последовательности в сочетании с нашими возможностями. А то будет с нашей программой как с "Ангарой" - мутная история, с неизвестно куда ушедшими деньгами, и проваленными сроками. Я уж про историю с "Клипером" и не вспоминаю.
  • JonnyT
    JonnyT 12 May 2014 14: 36 New
    +3
    interesting article, but not very objective! Foreigners achieved their superiority in automatic space exploration systems during the collapse of the USSR and the subsequent poverty of the Russian Federation, moreover, during this period many advanced developments and brains flowed away ..... to take the same ISS. In fact, the same WORLD, only edited by foreign engineers ... in my opinion, now the difference in systems for space exploration is not real, because the fundamental and fundamental principles are known to us and them, and to claim that space industry enterprises cannot build a worthy product with us - mistake. And the fact that they have more devices for studying space does not mean anything. I agree with the above - the carrier is more important, this is the basis of all cosmonautics!
    1. ICT
      ICT 12 May 2014 15: 14 New
      0
      Quote: JonnyT
      in my opinion, the difference now in systems for space exploration of 9 is not real, for the fundamental and fundamental principles are known to us and them, and to say that space industry enterprises cannot build a worthy product with us is a mistake. And the fact that they have more devices for studying space does not mean anything. I agree with the above - the carrier is more important, this is the basis of all cosmonautics!


      as an example:
      there is our pain, the auto industry, in which we never dawn on the rest of the world
      * even the Chinese are already ahead of us) i.e. knowledge of the basics is not the main thing; experience and dexterity are no less important.


      Quote: JonnyT
      I agree with the above - the carrier

      what can leave us at the level of shaitan taxi, we need the full development of the entire industry in the complex
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 15: 49 New
        +1
        there is our pain, the auto industry, in which we never dawn on the rest of the world
        * even the Chinese are already ahead of us)

        I would not argue this so unequivocally. The auto industry is of course still ill. After a protracted illness. But the progress is already visible, another couple of kicks and see a modern car. Although for the price of 300-350 thousand it is very difficult to achieve quality cars for 400-450 thousand. As usual, we compare.
      2. JonnyT
        JonnyT 12 May 2014 16: 32 New
        +1
        Well, in the automotive industry, assemblers or manufacturers of parts are not responsible in the event of a breakdown, and the acceptance is significantly different ......
        Take for example the ISO standard (and earlier GOSTs) of acceptance for microelectronic components .... Space (as well as military) components have the highest category of importance and the requirements for verification and testing are highest there. Before sending parts for assembly they are tested in such a way that Mama don’t worry ..... if the parts have passed all the tests, then they are sent to the assembly after assembly, the final product is also subjected to severe tests. Plus, do not forget about the design features, survivability, reliability, spare options in the event of failure ... I assure you that products assembled according to the requirements of the standard and passed all the necessary tests do not suffer from poor quality ... .... Of course we are talking primarily about projects in which there is no corruption and cut .....
        A carrier is what matters .... without a cheap, reliable and most importantly with a high carrying capacity, a sharp jump in space exploration is not expected ... everyone is waiting for a high-speed carrier based on new operating principles
        1. postman
          postman 13 May 2014 02: 06 New
          0
          Quote: JonnyT
          The space (as well as military) component has the highest category of importance


          Quote: JonnyT
          they are so tested that Mama Do not Cry ...

          Something does not converge with Phobos, Glonas, etc.
          ====
          There is a tricky trick: get insurance for the air!
          РН "старая", со склада, можно отправить муляж,деньги распилить,а СТРАХОВКУ ПОЛУЧИТЬ!
          Well, as with CASCO, some practice
  • saag
    saag 12 May 2014 15: 29 New
    +1
    Quote: TIT
    i.e. basic knowledge is not the point

    well and well, the poke method is our all7

    Quote: JonnyT
    the carrier is more important, this is the basis of all cosmonautics!

    Well, if you look at the basis, it is important what kind of energy we will use, then the engine, and only then what will be around all this, that is, the carrier
    1. ICT
      ICT 12 May 2014 16: 51 New
      +1
      Quote: saag
      well and well, the poke method is our all7


      method scientific all of us
  • postman
    postman 12 May 2014 15: 35 New
    -1
    Quote: Author Oleg Kaptsov
    The Chinese space program is in its infancy and is not yet able to become a serious competitor for our space industry.

    ?
    A cartoon published in the Soviet press in the 70s ?:
    one hundred million Chinese hold a large slingshot, while another hundred million pull it. In a slingshot is an atomic bomb.

    Це когда было то? Когда по доменной печи,в каждом дворе и "охоты на муравьев"?
    Now they write OTHER:
    How China caught up with Russia in space

    The fourth - "Shenzhou-9", delivered in 2012 already three tyconauts into space, including a woman. The crew of this ship docked at the Tiangong-1 and spent 10 days on board.

    - The path from the first manned launch to the life and work of space explorers aboard China’s space station was one year faster than the USSR.
    “Shenzhou may split into orbit.” One compartment with taikonauts will return to Earth, and the other will remain in orbit and will work there as an automatic laboratory
    - “Shenzhou” is better equipped with energy than the Russian “long-liver” and has a much larger internal volume.
    - By 2020, China plans to assemble in the near-Earth orbit the three-module Tiangong-3 DOS weighing about 60 tons.
    At present, China has concluded 16 different international “space” agreements and memoranda with 13 countries, created cooperation committees and corresponding mechanisms for interaction in the space sector with a number of countries, including Brazil, France, the Russian Federation and Ukraine

    Quote: Author Oleg Kaptsov
    Nevertheless, the bold speeches of Mr. Rogozin


    Дмитрий Олегыч, такой же "публицЫст" (см.образование,деятельность и тд),как и ты, но обличенный(как ни странно) властными полномочиями(вероятно в году "псевдопатриотизму")

    -PDM called Dmitry Rogozin "big cheese, like Zhirinovsky"
    Populism for the wretched: the desire of Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin to transfer from BMW to the domestic Tiger (What did he not dissect in Lada in Brussels?)
    - Below his pearl, another
    1. postman
      postman 12 May 2014 15: 36 New
      +1
      Quote: Author Oleg Kaptsov
      What did the Russian cosmonaut mean when speaking of “the achievements of our partners”?

      NASA over the years has evolved into a powerful scientific and experimental organization with the most advanced technology in the world. This organization now includes 9 of the largest research centers scattered throughout America and providing jobs for thousands of scientists and specialists.
      Yes, at least (as an example of the vector of space technology, for earthly needs):
      После программы "Аполлон" : появление алюминизированного водоотталкивающего одеяла, защищающего человека от тепла и холода, радиоактивной пыли и т. д., а также изоляционного материала, применяемого в сельском хозяйстве, спорте, строительстве.
      The blanket is made in the form of individual sheets with an area of ​​2,6 m2 (2,15 × 1,22 m). It weighs only 57 grams and folds so compact that it fits in your suit pocket. Wrapped around a person, it reflects inward more than 80% of the heat. This is more than enough to maintain relative thermal comfort for a long time even at sub-zero temperatures.
      In 1976, the manufacturer donated “space” blankets to the American Red Cross for distribution in a number of states that had a harsh winter. Blankets were handed out to people whose lives were at risk due to cold or lack of fuel and helped them survive.

      Quote: Author Oleg Kaptsov
      наши "партнеры" намеренно отказались от пилотируемых полетов в ближайшем десятилетии ввиду отсутствия какого-либо внятного смысла

      -I'm understandable: drag 80 kg of live weight, with the life support system of manned vehicles (Zh.O.P.A) Yes, and return it .. WHY?
      Let me remind you that today's iPhone (or something based on android) will do MORE than intel 386, when it has a camera with 10MP, 4G, Wi-Fi, memory, graphics, etc.
      if automation will soon replace a person driving a car, then into space, and even far away, dragging a person is pointless!
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak 12 May 2014 16: 01 New
        +1
        Let me remind you that today's iPhone (or something based on android) will do MORE than intel 386, when it has a camera with 10MP, 4G, Wi-Fi, memory, graphics, etc.

        These are slightly different things. Signal processing does not require gigahertz and super graphics. Military communications generally work at 5-6 MHz. Nothing ... even the pictures convey. And pretty fast. In addition, the manufacturing process by which the iPhone microcircuit and other similar toys are made is not intended for harsh conditions. Modern high-tech phones even in a thunderstorm and in high humidity refuse to work ... what can I say ...
        1. postman
          postman 12 May 2014 16: 50 New
          0
          Quote: Wedmak
          These are slightly different things.

          These are the same things: fit in a minimum volume, maximum power, with maximum capabilities, with minimum power consumption.
          A technological masterpiece is a masterpiece
          Quote: Wedmak
          Signal processing does not require gigahertz and super graphics.

          tell it BIUS Aegis v.5 .F-22, F-35 (and helmet-mounted information system), as well as Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency
          Quote: Wedmak
          Military communications generally work at 5-6 MHz. Nothing ... even the pictures convey.

          Not true!
          Ничего не передает, с таким каналом будете передавать 100 лет(Вояджер,как пример, "выбивание" нулей), Даже связаться с другим подразделением не может.А в Чечне использовали западные и японо-китайские

          Quote: Wedmak
          In addition, the manufacturing process by which the iPhone microcircuit and other similar toys are made is not intended for harsh conditions.

          этот" тех процесс" ни как не связан с "суровыми условиями", побывайте на военно-технической выставке в Куала-Лумпуре:залитая в пластик саморазрушающая электроника (американские военные приступили к разработке технологии производства сенсоров, физически разрушающихся при поступлении соответствующего сигнала извне)
          - US Navy plans to start using Wi-Fi wireless communications networks on ships and submarines
          - Aerospace and military systems based on DRAM memory with a cell size of 32 and 20 nm

          Quote: Wedmak
          and at high humidity refuse to work.

          tell this to my NOKIA E51, after staying in the bathroom, dried and still working
          1. Wedmak
            Wedmak 12 May 2014 17: 39 New
            +1
            fit in a minimum volume, maximum capacity, with maximum capabilities, with minimum power consumption.

            Protection from EM radiation forgotten. And from penetrating radiation. And from overloads. And information integrity control. And a lot of other destructive effects on microcircuits.
            tell it BIUS Aegis v.5 .F-22, F-35

            That's what they bought 8080 processors for their mega superfoods. For insertion of more productive processors could not, for a simple reason. No, not the absence of these. And because of the huge rewriting of microcode for a new processor! Yes, and the wiring of new data buses, the replacement of controllers ... yy ... would fly to another F-22.
            By the way, the graphics in Aegis and other systems have nothing to do with the graphics that are on your computer. There are no stupid DirectX and OpenGL.
            Transmits nothing, with such a channel you will transmit 100 years

            We climb into our favorite Internet for examples.
            Радиостанция "Р-168-5КН" (Акведук-5КН) http://www.cqham.ru/trx/r_168_5kn.html
            and incurred http://www.cqham.ru/trx/index.html
            self-destructive electronics embedded in plastic

            And here it is, when it comes to confronting various external factors? Disabling a 22nm chip is much easier than 60nm. Just because the size of the transistor is small and when a quantum of ionizing radiation enters it, it simply burns out. Together with the entire chip.
            By the way, what prevents to give such a powerful signal to the receiver of this electronics that it stupidly burns out the input path?
            US Navy plans to start using Wi-Fi wireless communications networks on ships and submarines

            Yeah. Let's see how Wi-Fi will work for them in closed cabins FROM ALL PARTIES. In each room on a Wi-Fi point to put? Physics is still one for all. And about ships made of radio-transparent materials ... fantastic!
            Aerospace and military systems based on DRAM memory with a cell size of 32 and 20 nm

            This is not the size of the cell, this is the designation of the process when creating electronic circuits. But I have no doubt they will. And ... these modules are surrounded by 5 mm steel armor + parity systems + special low-voltage power systems. Y ... As if a random Su-24 flying with the Khibiny flies by accident, it does not accidentally burn all of its memory. wink
            1. postman
              postman 12 May 2014 18: 08 New
              0
              Quote: Wedmak
              Protection from EM radiation forgotten. And from penetrating radiation.

              forgot nothing. I saw all this when I received deducted from the Bundeswehr G and Uni. everyone dismantled, RA from Siemens was
              Quote: Wedmak
              destructive to microcircuits.

              К-Лумпура,залитые в пластик,новье(инерционного воздействия на эк нет,все "целиком"),тепловотвод у 20нм-минимален
              Quote: Wedmak
              And because of the huge rewriting of microcode for a new processor!

              Databases, empirics typed in test flights, cartography.
              It was.
              The problem is solved, the system of automated translation of the database and program code for new processors.
              Quote: Wedmak
              We climb into our favorite Internet for examples.

              do not.
              1) 1.5 - 30 MHz
              2)
              Terrestrial television broadcasting according to GOST 7845-92 It is carried out using ultra-high frequencies in the meter band (MV - 48,5 ± 230 MHz) and ..... In the “MV” band, TV radio waves are located respectively:

              I subband 48,5 - 6 MHz (radio channels 1 and 2);
              The lower limit of the frequency range is due to the technical efficiency of the transmission and reception of the video signal with a maximum spectrum frequency of 6 MHz, why it is necessary that the carrier of the radio signal is several times higher than this frequency.
              3) MGW system (using TDM technology (time division of channels), and in the reverse - TDMA (multi-access with time division of channels)), Operating frequency ranges - 1,4 ... 1,5; 2,4 ... 2,5 and 3,4 ... 3,5 GHz, speech coding ADPCM - 32 Kbpsspeed PD - 14,4 Kbps)
              What is LJ PHOTO / VIDEO FILE?
              Information from the Voyager to the Earth is transmitted parabolic, rigidly fastened to the body 3,65 meter diameter antenna which should be oriented exactly to the home planet. Through her to frequencies 2295 MHz and 8418 MHz send signals to two 23-watt radio transmitters.
              Most of the data is transmitted to the Earth at a speed of 160 bps
              Quote: Wedmak
              and when a quantum of ionizing radiation gets into it

              I assure you of a quantum, of a 20nm drum, or 90nm. (Until we reached the atom’s scattering, THE WHOLE ORDER IS)
              + your quantum will be absorbed by plastic, which is filled with EC
              Quote: Wedmak
              Yeah. Let's see how they will work Wi-Fi

              ничего, у меня как то связывается (как и блютус) м/у автомобилями("железными") между прочим,ЕДУЩИМИ по автодороге.Впрочем как и в доме(ЖЕЛЕЗО БЕТОН) на 4 этажа
              Quote: Wedmak
              . Like a random Su-24 flying with Khibiny flying by

              But there is a fact, and not la-la from (C) ru, that he SOMETHING REALLY BURNED?
              1. Wedmak
                Wedmak 12 May 2014 19: 52 New
                -1
                Quote: Postman
                The lower limit of the frequency range is due to the technical efficiency of transmitting and receiving a video signal with a maximum spectrum frequency of 6 MHz, which requires that the carrier of the radio signal is several times higher than this frequency.

                Well, I generally did not mean the radio frequency, but the frequency of the processors in such devices. And indeed, not HD is transmitted in most cases. And special processor power for decoding is not required.
                I assure you of a quantum, of a 20nm drum, or 90nm. (Until we reached the atom’s scattering, THE WHOLE ORDER IS)

                A quantum may be on the drum ... but a charged particle penetrating the pnp junction can easily cause a breakdown. And the smaller this transition, the easier the breakdown will occur. With all the ensuing consequences.
                your quantum will be absorbed by the plastic, which is filled with EC

                Plastic? Do high-energy particles (which are enough in space) also?
                ничего, у меня как то связывается (как и блютус) м/у автомобилями("железными") между прочим,ЕДУЩИМИ по автодороге.

                So the distance is very large? A couple of meters. Yes, and antennas are often placed in the reception area, under a window, for example.
                . However, as in the house (IRON CONCRETE) on 4 floors

                Yeah. If an ordinary router on the plain hits 200 or even 300 meters, then in a reinforced concrete house, a maximum of 50 meters. But the ship is such a thing, everything is closed with metal in general. Especially fighting.
                But there is a fact

                Bring a working magnetron or any other source of interference to the TV. If you can twist a pulse arrester in a couple of hours and knock them out with a screaming neighbor's media center through the wall ...
                1. postman
                  postman 12 May 2014 20: 27 New
                  0
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  Well, I generally did not mean the radio frequency, but the frequency of work

                  Yes? But what about:
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  Radio station "Р-168-5КН" (Акведук-5КН)

                  какой у нее "процессор"?
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  Military link out at all 5-6 MHz work
                  +
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  . Nothing... even pictures transmit.

                  ??
                  Quote: Wedmak
                  A quantum may be on the drum ... but here a charged particle penetrating the pnp transition,

                  window.edu.ru/resource/865/55865/files/rad_effect_ims.pdf
                  or
                  Radiation Stability of Bipolar Transistors: A Training Manual
                  Author / creator: Vologdin E.N., Lysenko A.P. Year: 2000
                  If flies into the space charge region due to thermal motion
                  minority charge carrier (an electron from the p-region or a hole from the n-region), then the contact field picks it up and throws it through this layer.
                  The temperature will have a BIG effect

                  Quote: Wedmak
                  Plastic?

                  and plastic and gel.
                  In the macrocosm, this interaction looks like the transition of electromagnetic energy into other types of energy, for example, to thermal energy.

                  Quote: Wedmak
                  So the distance is very large?

                  i have yes and speed
                  IEEE 802.11n
                  Wireless Internet on the beach wink

                  Columbia Rural Electric Association is trying to deploy a 2.4 GHz Wi-Fi network on an area of ​​9500 km²located between the Walla Walla and Columbia counties in Washington State and Yumatilla, Oregon.

                  The use of Wi-Fi devices in enterprises is due to the high noise immunity which makes them applicable in enterprises with many metal structures. In turn, Wi-Fi devices do not cause significant interference to narrowband radio signals.
                  will be: 802.11ac
                  IEEE 802.22 data at speeds up to 22 Mbps within a radius of 100 km from the nearest transmitter.
                  Few? use IEEE 802.16
                  1. postman
                    postman 12 May 2014 20: 29 New
                    0
                    Quote: Wedmak
                    there, in general, everything is closed with metal. Especially fighting.

                    not all, look at the material for Virginia-type NPS.

                    No need to exaggerate, in the active zone YaSU does not need Wi-Fi, and it is unlikely that they will contact the nearest Spanish lighthouse
                    Quote: Wedmak
                    Bring a working magnetron or any other source of interference to the TV.

                    But why?
                    Bring (try) a working magnetron to the MQ-9 Reaper UAV?
                    Will it work out?
                    Oh, did it happen?
                    Could it be easier then to knock down a UAV?
                    And at a distance = the inverse law of squares
                    1. Wedmak
                      Wedmak 12 May 2014 20: 50 New
                      -1
                      not all, look at the material for Virginia-type NPS.

                      Not all, I agree. Nevertheless, there is enough iron there to distort and damp the signal. But .. the meaning of Wi-Fi on the ship? Well, stick a small point in the wardroom, but .... why? The Internet is frail there, and even then under control. To play on a grid to play? It's easier and safer to throw a wire - as if no one would pick up a randomly left working Wi-Fi in the port.
                  2. Wedmak
                    Wedmak 12 May 2014 20: 40 New
                    0
                    какой у нее "процессор"?

                    I didn’t put it right, I misled you by radio stations. Sorry. These were graphic tactical computers, microelectronics for processing data from radars, on-board computer computers, and more.
                    minority charge carrier (an electron from the p-region or a hole from the n-region), then the contact field picks it up and throws it through this layer.

                    Strange .. we were told something else. Okay, let's say, but you're talking about a hole or an electron, and gamma radiation, X-ray?
                    Wireless Internet on the beach

                    There are no iron plates on the beach.
                    The use of Wi-Fi devices in enterprises is due to high noise immunity, which makes them applicable in enterprises with many metal structures.

                    Well what kind of devices are these ????? I have a TPLink router, with three antennas it can barely hit 50 meters, while there is only furniture between it and the receiver, one wall per meter and the entire ceiling in iron I-beams + metal roof. A tablet, if you go between two iron racks, generally loses the signal, although the source is 5-6 meters away.
                    EEE 802.22 data at speeds up to 22 Mbps in a radius of 100 km from the nearest transmitter.

                    Is this not Wi-Max or similar technology? Because ordinary Wi-Fi does not hit very far.
                    1. postman
                      postman 12 May 2014 22: 07 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      Because ordinary Wi-Fi does not hit very far.

                      Multiplicity of a wavelength:
                      Spiral antenna invented in the late forties by John Kraus


                      pull the hooch all over the body
                      We make a Wi-Fi antenna from improvised means
                      http://habrahabr.ru/post/151122/

                      or?

                      Do so
                      PLC - Power Line Communication (bulk cable)

                      + type
                      PowerLine AV + adapter with 802.11n wireless access point

                      USE metal is not a problem
                      when moving: from access point to point
                    2. postman
                      postman 13 May 2014 01: 57 New
                      0
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      These were graphic tactical computers,

                      Расскаказать Вам на основе чего сейчас делают "боевые" системы взлома кодов,линий,паролей и тд?
                      ?
                      Based on Nvidia and ATI GRAPHIC cards !!!
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      and gamma radiation, x-ray?

                      And who will deliver it to the object (GI and RI)? Nuclear explosion? Well yes, but there is a pico second
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      There are no iron plates on the beach.

                      A Wi-Fi router is located behind the reception desk (behind the wall, glass, metal potholes, electrical wiring, a restaurant with pots, etc.), and even p. Solar umbrellas, a metal rack (and there are many)
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      Well what kind of devices are these ?????

                      Industrial wireless networks Wifi (industrial Wifi) class IP68, yes even







                      Industrial Wifi for transport, railway, metro

                      Quote: Wedmak
                      TPLink router, with three antennas

                      for N it is necessary (at maximum speed) 4 to receive, and 4 to return
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      And this is not Wi-Max

                      no, this is WRAN (point-to-multipoint), GPS is needed
                      http://habrahabr.ru/post/125557/
              2. saag
                saag 12 May 2014 19: 57 New
                +2
                Quote: Postman
                ничего, у меня как то связывается (как и блютус) м/у автомобилями("железными") между прочим,ЕДУЩИМИ по автодороге.Впрочем как и в доме(ЖЕЛЕЗО БЕТОН) на 4 этажа

                it won’t be installed like in our hotel this same Wi-Fi, but it was messed up with the placement of access points at the ends of the corridors, in general, if the access point is not located near the door of the room, but three meters from it, then at the entrance to the room the signal stupidly breaks, hello reinforced concrete, the physics of the process however
                1. postman
                  postman 12 May 2014 20: 06 New
                  0
                  Quote: saag
                  will not be,

                  ?
                  My example says the opposite: 4 floors, with one D-link 655 router, without additional points. access.
                  Quote: saag
                  process physics however

                  realities of life however.
                  1. Wedmak
                    Wedmak 12 May 2014 20: 09 New
                    0
                    I admit that it breaks through 4 floors, but what is the signal strength? Is there anything you can download?
                    1. postman
                      postman 13 May 2014 01: 32 New
                      0
                      Quote: Wedmak
                      Is there anything you can download?

                      D-Link 655 (technical data there), but this is old.
                      For iPhones, iPads of all sorts, enough, of course, is a software update, ironForce, a video-youtube (there is a limitation on the graphic pro (or coprocessor) -with interruptions, etc.
                      Сутьто не в мощности(она ограничена),а в стандарте IEEE 802.11n (Полнуая теоретически возможная пропускная способность стандарта 802.11n в 600 Мбит/с лишь при использовании четырех передающих и четырех приемных антенн (конфигурация "4х4")) и в месте расположения (wi-Fi роутера).
                      А мощность сигнала и помехи-будут влиять на пинг,"пропажу пакетов"
    2. Wedmak
      Wedmak 12 May 2014 15: 55 New
      0
      The path from the first manned launch to the life and work of space explorers aboard China's space station was one year faster than the USSR.
      “Shenzhou may split into orbit.” One compartment with taikonauts will return to Earth, and the other will remain in orbit and will work there as an automatic laboratory
      - “Shenzhou” is better equipped with energy than the Russian “long-liver” and has a much larger internal volume.
      - By 2020, China plans to assemble in near-Earth orbit the three-module Tiangong-3 DOS weighing about 60 tons.

      Yeah. The USSR marched on its own, starting with the FAU-1 and 2 rockets and went all the way to the ISS and flights to Venus and Mars (albeit not always successful). What did China do? I bought engines, jointly developed a carrier, somehow developed a ship and a one-room station. OO ... and everyone screams China has caught up with Russia in space. If it weren’t for the help of other countries, I would still have launched my Shenzhou-15-23-45 with a great chance of turning into the ocean.
      And this .. China also developed spacesuits? Not? Something like the Russians.
      1. postman
        postman 12 May 2014 16: 38 New
        0
        Quote: Wedmak
        Yeah. The USSR was on its own

        Uh-huh.
        Tu-4
        In 1945, Soviet experts were shocked to see the FAU-2, huge at that time (SERIAL) LRE. After the fire launch of the FAU-2 liquid rocket engine, Isaev left for the USSR in great frustration ...
        (I remind you that we EXPERIMENTED with a liquid propellant rocket of several tens of kg, and the FAU-2 with 270 kN SERINO
        Atomic bomb
        TRD for Mig from Rolls-Royce
        in the 1980s, France accused a native of Yaroslavl, L. Varigin, who married Frenchman P. Verdier, of stealing the technology of a hydrogen engine for an Arian family carrier.
        etc


        Quote: Wedmak
        What did China do?

        It is the same as the USSR earlier (automobile industry, aviation, railway, sea).
        -I am, by occupation, in China regularly .. for 3 years in an open field an ultramodern factory, with a 4 * hotel in 27 floors
        ICE-3s are more THAN in Germany already
        -MATP Zabaykalsk (looking from them, XX1 century, and looking from us ...)
        -Bremenhaffen: giant container ships bring products from China,BACK ABOUT ALL-EUROPE'S SUPER-MODERN EQUIPMENT
        -Any exhibition in Germany: every time German customs arrests (he saw) the exhibition products of Chinese manufacturers (even porcelain, cups) = plagiarism. So what?

        Quote: Wedmak
        somehow developed a ship and a one-room station. OO ... and everyone screams. China has caught up with Russia in space.

        poor knowledge of the issue. The Soviet Communist Party (along with the defense industry), practically ate the Soviet economy, the Chinese Communist Party (and defense industry) ???? Give indicators of one of the largest economies in the world?
        GOST is ours, and the Chinese observe it
        The "Chinese" can do what the Soviet-Russian ship, which in 4 years will celebrate its half-century anniversary, did not even dream of.
        Quote: Wedmak
        If not for the help of other countries,

        INTERNATIONAL ROCKET TECHNOLOGY CONTROL MODE (MTCR)
        NATIONAL SYSTEMS OF CONTROL FOR EXPORT OF MISSILES IN THE LEADING COUNTRIES-PARTICIPANTS OF THE MTCR
        Quote: Wedmak
        Not? Something like the Russians.

        and not on American?
        As of 2005, according to the Washington Times, the United States operated
        3 firmsone way or another related with the Chinese armed forces.
        But nothing that the Soviet passenger "supersonic" Tu-144 in the West mockingly called the "Concord".
        ?
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak 12 May 2014 17: 50 New
          +1
          Tu-4, the atomic bomb - which side is it here? We are talking about rockets. The Americans went the same way. Along the way, slamming von Braun and making him work for himself. The queen had to figure it out herself. And on this basis to create your own. So the original Fau-2 did not fly long.
          But I agree, ours often bought either licenses or finished products. And they did better, based on them. And this was after the war, in the newly rebuilt USSR. And China has only just reached the time of manned flights for 10 days.
          BACK ABOUT ALL-EUROPE'S SUPER-MODERN EQUIPMENT

          Here about the equipment I agree. I saw examples. What prevents them from overtaking us with such equipment? I do not even know.
          The "Chinese" can do what the Soviet-Russian ship, which in 4 years will celebrate its half-century anniversary, did not even dream of.

          Modern Chinese? And what could he do?
          INTERNATIONAL ROCKET TECHNOLOGY CONTROL MODE

          What they have was slammed from our rockets. And with our support. Largely.
          But nothing that the Soviet passenger "supersonic" Tu-144 in the West mockingly called the "Concord".
          ?

          But nothing that the Tu-144 flew before? And how would their layout be a little different? However, neither one nor the other still no longer flies.
          1. postman
            postman 12 May 2014 18: 21 New
            0
            Quote: Wedmak
            Tu-4, the atomic bomb - which side is it here?

            This is an example about your own (it’s important if it is a rocket or a Tu-4). Slammed, done, got the output no worse, or even better.
            SO China will do
            Quote: Wedmak
            And on this basis to create your own. So the original Fau-2 did not fly long.

            the first with a BEARING tank (oxygen only) was the P-5 (it took (5!) years after the war
            True, on the N-1, they again returned to the SUSPENSIONS, like the V-1

            Fuel supply lines, pneumatic hydraulic circuit fittings and automation, high pressure cylinders, air reducers, nozzle head, turbo pump unit, gas generator, electro-hydraulic control system for starting and stopping the engine, autonomous programmed motion and angular stabilization system using gyroscopic devices, magnetic power converters, steering engines and executive bodies in the form of aerodynamic and gas rudders. The apparent speed control system, which includes speedometer (acceleration) accelerometers, conversion amplifiers, drives and engine thrust regulators controlled by them, two radio engineering systems - lateral correction of the flight path and telemetric control of the functioning of the rocket and its systems during launch and in flight -Остались или "ушли"?
            Quote: Wedmak
            ? And what could he do?

            wrote:
            Quote: Postman
            “Shenzhou may split into orbit.” One compartment with taikonauts will return to Earth, and the other will remain in orbit and will work there as an automatic laboratory
            - “Shenzhou” is better equipped with energy than the Russian “long-liver” and has a much larger internal volume.


            Quote: Wedmak
            But nothing that the Tu-144 flew before?

            for two months, the first flight does not mean anything
            http://www.tupolev.ru/tu-144
            An analysis of the conditions of existence of the future ATP conducted in the USSR in relation to the level of domestic aircraft construction and its immediate prospects, as well as the country's economic capabilities and the needs of the Civil Air Fleet, showed that the path is most preferable for the USSR создания отечественного СПС по своим ожидаемым летно-техническим данным близкий к англо-французскому "Конкорду"

            At the same time, the main US aviation companies, based on their vision of the future ATP market, began design work significantly более крупного СПС чем "Конкорд"
            1. Wedmak
              Wedmak 12 May 2014 20: 02 New
              0
              SO China will do

              So caught up or not? My opinion - did not catch up.
              Остались или "ушли"?

              Are there any new missile schemes?
              Shenzhou may split into orbit.

              Была информация, что и наш сегмент МКС может существовать автономно. А что может автоматическая лаборатория? Энерговооружен, это еще не значит что он лучше. А большой внутренний объем... это за счет двух модулей? Дык если присмотреться к Союзу, там тоже два "жилых" модуля. Спускаемый и шлюзовой. Последний тоже не раз использовался как лаборатория.
              for two months, the first flight does not mean anything

              As he says.
              предпочтительным является путь создания отечественного СПС по своим ожидаемым летно-техническим данным близкий к англо-французскому "Конкорду"

              So aerodynamics is the same for everyone. And the technology of those years was about the same level.
              Одновременно основные авиационные фирмы США, исходя из своего видения рынка будущих СПС, приступили к работам по проектированию значительно более крупного СПС чем "Конкорд"

              And where? HE? Another zilch?
              1. postman
                postman 13 May 2014 01: 43 New
                0
                Quote: Wedmak
                My opinion - did not catch up.

                OVERCOMING at such a pace ... I am amazed. China is already placing its production in all sorts of Vietnam and Cambodia = slave force and taxes LESS.
                Quote: Wedmak
                Are there any new missile schemes?

                Engines (launch vehicle of which everything was invented, like a tank armor rebound).
                Kaptsov here raised (a long time ago) the question of free radicals, I laughed, but no .. the Chinese are working
                Quote: Wedmak
                And what can an automatic laboratory do?

                Oh, now there are a lot of mights.
                Quote: Wedmak
                , там тоже два "жилых" модуля. Спускаемый и шлюзовой.

                Nothing can remain in orbit (with us)



                Quote: Wedmak
                So aerodynamics is the same for everyone.

                like physics ...
                напомнить ,как мы получили "атомную бомбу"
                Technological capabilities of industry, materials, R&D developments = this is important
                Quote: Wedmak
                And where? HE? Another zilch?

                Well, the Concorde then flew, and more than 144
                And the Americans, the lack of ATP, does not mean that they were not technologically able to realize it.
                Money
          2. Bayonet
            Bayonet 13 May 2014 07: 43 New
            0
            Quote: Wedmak
            But nothing that the Tu-144 flew before?

            The usual political show off - at all costs, but first! For the same reason, the crash of June 3, 1973 at the air show in Le Bourget.
            1. olliveiro
              olliveiro 13 May 2014 17: 00 New
              0
              Quote: Bayonet
              The usual political show off - at all costs, but first! For the same reason, the crash of June 3, 1973 at the air show in Le Bourget.

              it was a diversion ... but our plane was better than Concord
  • Beck
    Beck 12 May 2014 15: 40 New
    0
    As noted on the page, Rogozin is a balamut, and then a populist. But this populism is like a fig leaf. The bravado of Rogozin only to the detriment of Roscosmos.

    "НАСА перечисляет Роскосмосу около 71 миллиона долларов за полет одного астронавта туда и обратно на МКС. В добавление к тем сотням миллионов долларов, которые Россия уже получила от США, она должна положить на свой счет еще 457,9 миллиона долларов за предоставление аналогичных такси-услуг американским астронавтам до 2017 года включительно".

    Теперь этих денег Роскосмосу "богатому" не видать.

    The shuttles served their lawfully and retired as planned. NASA has planned to abandon manned flights ON TIME, preparing its new programs.

    «Похоже, наступило время сбросить "покрывало" с нового "Дракона Мк2", который SpaceX разрабатывал вместе с НАСА, И никакого батута не потребуется». Согласно британскому еженедельнику The Week, первый полет семиместного пилотируемого «Дракона» с людьми на борту может состояться уже в 2015 году".

    "В бюджете НАСА на 2015 год предусмотрено выделение 1,14 миллиарда долларов на продолжение работ по новому пилотируемому кораблю НАСА «Орион» и 1,914 миллиарда на новый носитель НАСА SLS".

    "Итак, не имея, с одной стороны, никаких технологий, интересных для будущих «дальнекосмических» проектов западных стран, а с другой – фактически лишившись «стратегического партнерства» с Западом, которое можно было бы заполнить космическим сотрудничеством, Россия предпринимает серьезные усилия к тому, чтобы вдобавок продемонстрировать себя непредсказуемым и ненадежным партнером".
    1. Wedmak
      Wedmak 12 May 2014 16: 03 New
      0
      В частные космические "извозчики" верится пока с трудом. У нас тоже в 2015 много чего полетит. По крайней мере обещают.
  • rotor
    rotor 12 May 2014 16: 16 New
    0
    Robots will conquer other planets, and a person will coordinate their work and populate the planets as the necessary infrastructure is created.
    1. rotor
      rotor 12 May 2014 17: 08 New
      +2
      Obviously, the lunar base should become the next stage in the development of the Russian manned space program after the orbital station.

      To create it, new economical carriers, space robots, highly efficient energy carriers, new generation materials and technologies, a healthy economy, the political will of the government ...
  • QWERTY
    QWERTY 12 May 2014 19: 08 New
    +1
    Там под фото подпись:" Запуск с космодрома Плесецк. Вид с набережной в Екатеринбурге".Плесецк в Архангельской области, что, запуск видно из Екатеринбурга?
    1. Wedmak
      Wedmak 12 May 2014 20: 05 New
      +1
      The launch from Kapustin Yar was visible in half of Europe and Kazakhstan. The height is great.
  • Eidolon
    Eidolon 12 May 2014 21: 06 New
    +1
    "Алмаз" не оснащался пушкой НР-23. На "Алмаз" ставился спецвариант уникальной пушки Р-23 Арона Абрамовича Рихтера.
  • pvv113
    pvv113 12 May 2014 21: 25 New
    +6
    When you see the achievements of partners
    The nearest potential achievement of partners is the development of a trampoline.
  • Kar Karych
    Kar Karych 12 May 2014 23: 50 New
    +2
    [Beck]
    So, having, on the one hand, no technologies interesting for future “far-space” projects of Western countries, and on the other, actually having lost a “strategic partnership” with the West that could be filled with space cooperation, Russia is making serious efforts to in addition to show yourself as an unpredictable and unreliable partner.

    Опять виновата Россия, в чём, непонятно. Наса насколько я помню вышло из сотрудничества в одностороннем порядке. Причина, якобы Украина. Россия деньги потеряла, но и Наса тоже ничего не приобрела, по моему только одни убытки. Если данной конторе "политика" ближе, пускай так и будет. Я думаю Россия ничего не потеряла а наоборот приобрела.
    1. Beck
      Beck 13 May 2014 11: 32 New
      0
      Цитата: Кар Карыч
      Again, Russia is to blame, for which it is not clear.


      Is that what you change?

      NASA did not go out of collaboration on the ISS. This is the administration of the White House imposed economic sanctions on your relationship with the Kremlin.

      And Russia is not to blame. This is the slogan of the Urashniki, to declare for yourself that Russia is to blame, and then yell to everyone with foam at the mouth that this is not so.

      The Kremlin is to blame (and the Kremlin is not Russia) and Kremlin balamutes like Rogozin.

      Цитата: Кар Карыч
      I think Russia has not lost anything, but on the contrary acquired.


      You don’t know how to read at all. Bend at least one finger calling at least one acquisition. What did you gain - money, technology, programs, new ships? What? Go say this to Rogozin. Together you will, with your eyes closed on reality, soar in dreams.
      1. Kadavercianin
        Kadavercianin 13 May 2014 12: 28 New
        +1
        As far as I know, Americans and Europeans haven’t been sharing technologies for the last 40-50 years with those whom they don’t consider their strategic friends, even the article was on this site about patent and technological restrictions imposed on a number of countries, for this reason in Russia some types of electronics are produced - no one sells equipment and production licenses, so technological exchange is a moot point.
        New ships ?????? from NASA, have they already passed the entire test cycle, or have they already been enough? The loss of participation in the programs, something tells me that if the Americans didn’t need the Russians in any way, then there would be no joint cooperation. Money is of course lost, well, you don’t write anything here.
        Of course, ideally, it’s easier to learn not the simplest task together than one at a time, but somehow it doesn’t work out, the code is half the business of politics, in this situation, what kind of collaboration can we talk about?
  • Free Island
    Free Island 13 May 2014 04: 14 New
    +4
    ахха..помню помню автор этой статейки в комментах по другому материалу спорил...фотки те же, слова все теже...видимо просто свои комменты с другой ленты скопировал и вставил....создал "аналитический материал международного эксперта по космосу"....автору не в обиду, но очень вы мне напоминаете моего одноклассника, который все 10 школьных лет дрючил мне мозг "америка то, у америки то! да СССР (а потом и Россия) лохи по жизни а вот АМЕРИКА!! Да США рулит" ну и все в том же духе...парень вырос...много раз сходил в "загранку" насмотрелся в том числе и на Америку..и закончились все его эти "США РУЛИТ!"..повзрослел парень..автору этой статьи тоже пора взрослеть
    PS to the author for reflection - everyone has problems everywhere. And you do not know that in the world's largest scientific projects, Russia occupies a leading position, supplying them with the minds and ATTENTION - its MICROTECHNOLOGIES ????? do not know? for example, the same andron collider .... there is another large example, but I unfortunately do not remember its essence, but its importance is often trumpeted on scientific (not political) channels ... so there’s just the whole stuffing of equipment in Russia and Europe and the USA mostly pay only contributions in cash. In addition, what are you stuck to this Rogozin? He is RIGHT and one hundred percent right! A US astronaut on the ISS will not wait until the USA creates its manned system to pick it up from the ISS and your laudatory songs to the American space program are unlikely to calm him down. Rogozin snapped and snapped aptly.
    By the way, on the rover that you already plugged here, the filling is also Russian ... that's right, breakfast food is for the mind
    "Первая после введения «санкций» со стороны NASA ночь не сказалась на работе российского научного прибора DAN на борту американского марсохода Curiosity"
    http://www.gazeta.ru/science/news/2014/04/04/n_6060421.shtml
  • Bayonet
    Bayonet 13 May 2014 07: 37 New
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    В отличие от высказываний г. Рогозина о " головокружительном успехе " отечественной космонавтики,заявление Геннадия Падалки, российского космонавта, участника четырех космических экспедиций и девяти выходов в открытый космос, выглядят более реально . Зачем напяливать нам розовые очки и заниматься самообманом, вместо того , чтобы реально работать ?
    1. olliveiro
      olliveiro 13 May 2014 16: 35 New
      +1
      Рогозин говорил не о " головокружительном успехе ", а о том, что американская космическая программа сейчас будет свёрнута без российских носителей. И это истина!
      And about the backlog of Roscosmos from NASA - it's ridiculous to say! If we had funding at least half of the amers, we could ask why we are not launching satellites to Jupiter ...
  • Zeus
    Zeus 13 May 2014 18: 35 New
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    Answer of D. Rogozin to O. Kaptsov on this article.

    Clever criticism. However, I already wrote in the WG about our tasks in space. And we have already begun this work. Link here http://www.rg.ru/2014/04/11/rogozin.html
  • nva8
    nva8 14 May 2014 11: 59 New
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    Quote: Stasi
    ... and obvious non-professionals, like the former head of Roskosmos Popovkin, who absolutely did not understand anything in the space industry and cosmonautics ...

    When he was at the cosmodrome, he was able to evaluate his experience and knowledge; therefore, I disagree with the above thesis.
    But the fact that corruption is not defeated is for sure.


    Quote: Stasi

    Cadres decide everything, but with this we, as in other industries, have a problem. The cat wept for young scientists capable of solving the tasks facing our space program and coming up with new bold solutions and ideas. Everything rests on the old guard, which is thinning. Without solving this problem, it is impossible to solve other problems facing our astronautics.

    The main thing is to ensure continuity, and it can only be implemented in joint projects.
  • lilian
    lilian 24 September 2014 11: 30 New
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    The thing is that at present a bunch of American projects are implemented and show the result. Russia is probably not far behind, it may soon reveal its achievements to the world, but the consequences of the 90s are still felt today, now there are few active AMSs, because work on them after the collapse of the USSR was stopped, and for the Americans it was a golden period. And from the USSR they received a lot of technologies and specialists.

    О двигателях. В Ютубе наткнулся на фильм "Ракета пришедшая с холода". Снят самими американцами. Там говорится что они долго не могли поверить что те параметры двигателей, что им русские называли - не фантастика. Америкосы утверждали что по ракетным двигателям они отставали от СССР лет на двадцать.

    And manned flights are needed, if only to understand whether a person will be able to fly to other worlds in the future. It can really, than endlessly strive to catch up and overtake the Americans in everything, to give them one of the niches. Let them be engaged in AMS, and for Russia to make manned flights a priority.
  • strelokmira
    strelokmira 4 August 2020 22: 19 New
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    The words of Dmitry Rogozin about the “space trampoline for Americans” will sound much more convincing if Roskosmos carries out the planned interplanetary expeditions “Luna-Glob” (2015) and “Luna-Resource” (2016), will repeat (this time successfully!) The mission “Phobos “Ground-2” (2018) and will be able to land the vehicle on the surface of the satellite of Jupiter (project “Laplace-P”). And from the Svobodny cosmodrome in 2018, the launches of Russian manned spacecraft of the new generation Rus-M will begin.

    Without all this, Mr. Rogozin’s joke does not sound funny. Otherwise we can jump on the trampolines ...

    Well, what can I say, 2020, none of the above voiced, was not launched, the Americans are successfully driving their reusable trampoline ... It seems that Mr. Rogozin really jumped