Military Review

Is China an ally? ..

182



While the West at a loss breaks ties with Russia, Moscow is seriously thinking about cooperation with the countries of East Asia. Of course, first of all, we are talking about China - a powerful nuclear power that competes with the United States in the Asia-Pacific region, and in the future could become one of the global superpowers. But not everything is so simple: experts say that the Chinese economy will overheat in the coming decades, followed by a powerful social explosion. In order to contain negative tendencies, the Celestial Empire will try to channel the protest moods with the help of external aggression, and at the same time try to master the resources of the Russian Far East. Do we need such a "friend" and what to do with it?

Our far Eastern partner

China is one of the most important strategic partners of Russia, and Russia for China is a reliable support in foreign policy and a trading partner: thanks to friendly relations, the trade turnover between our countries is constantly increasing. At the same time, there is a political rapprochement between Moscow and Beijing, which are ready for joint confrontation with the countries of the West.

Despite the fact that during the Cold War, Russia and China were ideological opponents, now, in the 21st century, both states advocate a peaceful dialogue in foreign policy and insist on building a qualitatively new system of international relations, where there will be no law of force, and each country able to defend their interests without fear of aggression from overseas. Moscow and Beijing agree that there is no single development strategy for all states of the globe. Each nation has the right to choose its own special historical the path without regard to the powers that be. The mantras of the United States and the European Union that capitalism and democracy must win do not correspond to reality - as we see, there are countries where these forms of social relations have not taken root for centuries.

To defend independence from the West, Russia and China need to unite, create their own supranational structures. And work on this front is underway: the SCO and BRICS already exist, allowing to coordinate relations between countries that are skeptical of the Western project. Moreover, the United States and Europe are deprived of the opportunity to somehow interfere in the work of these international organizations, so that they cannot directly dictate their will to their members.

At the same time, China and Russia are helping less powerful countries that are not capable of alone resisting the West. These include Iran, Syria, North Korea, Venezuela, Ecuador and other states that can act as regional forces. The protection of countries is carried out through diplomatic means, primarily through the UN Security Council. Any attempts to crush the centers of anti-Americanism end in fiasco for the United States: Moscow and Beijing have the veto power in the Security Council, which means they can block unfair decisions.

However, the Celestial Empire is not entirely an ally of Russia. Do not forget that China has its own strategic interests, and they only partly coincide with the Russian ones.

but on the other hand

According to Alexander Khramchikhin, the author of the book “The Dragon Woke Up. China’s internal problems as a source of the Chinese threat to Russia ”, Beijing can become an enemy of Moscow if it faces a serious internal socio-political crisis. China will try to channel the energy of dissatisfied masses, and at the same time try to gain access to the resources of the Far East and Siberia.

Khramchikhin believes that the main problem of the PRC is a wasteful economy: the Celestial Empire consumes too many resources and does not at all consider what it has. According to the 2010 year, China’s share in world imports was 9,1%, with the bulk of Chinese imports being raw materials and energy: oil, gas, steel, coal. China has become the main buyer of oil despite being ranked sixth in the world in terms of reserves of “black gold”. At the same time, there is thoughtless pollution of water and land: 80% of the country's territory is recognized as zones of ecological disaster.

Alexander Khramchikhina is also worried about the rapidly growing inequality between rich and poor Chinese, as well as between the middle class and the villagers. For example, a Chinese peasant earns an average of 90 dollars during a month, and a citizen earns 300 dollars. Peasants pay 90% of the cost of medical services, and citizens - only 60%. Many peasants move to cities, and this creates a strong burden on infrastructure, and also leads to increased social inequality: about 10% of Chinese people are considered to be internal labor migrants, and live in undeveloped areas, earning pennies.

Such inequality caused serious social tensions. China does not publish data on protest actions, and for good reason: in 2005, according to the Ministry of Security of China, there were 87 thousands of protest actions in the country. For comparison, in 1994, the inhabitants of the Celestial Empire took part in protest actions about 10 thousands of times.

Russia has only two allies: army and navy

Alexander Khramchikhin writes that the government of China, known for its foresight, has prepared a plan in case tens of thousands of Chinese rebel against the existing order. Beijing will simply send them to a war of conquest, and even Russia can become a victim of this war.

The writer claims that the Chinese are psychologically ready for the invasion of a neighboring friendly state. The authorities have been training them since childhood, while still at school teaching them that the Far East and Transbaikalia are “originally Chinese” territories that need to be “returned”. Such radical sentiments are supported by practical actions: the Chinese are massively resettled in the Far Eastern regions of Russia. The exact number of immigrants is unknown to anyone.

And this fact is disappointing: according to the PRC Constitution, children from mixed marriages with Chinese citizens are considered Chinese and are subject to state protection. In 1979, the PRC used this standard of the main law to justify the war against Vietnam. Alexander Khramchikhin makes the reader think about whether China will not repeat the same trick with respect to Russia? ..

The growing power of the PLA is alarming: China already has enough strength to wage a defensive war of any complexity, but Beijing continues to strengthen the armed forces. For what? With whom the Middle Kingdom gathered to fight on foreign territory?

Of course, Russia needs to look for an alternative to Western countries, but not at the cost of losing the Far East. It is necessary to prepare for possible backstabs from China in anticipation of socio-economic destabilization within the PRC itself. And the warning signals are already noticeable: in the east of the Celestial Empire, Uighur separatists and representatives of radical Islam became more active. There is no doubt that other groups that wanted to destroy Chinese statehood came into the movement, and outbreaks of violence occur periodically within Chinese society - however, the government hides reliable information about them, and only the special services can judge the true situation in the PRC.

In any case, Moscow should not lose vigilance in anticipation of when the Chinese dragon wakes up. Partnerships and joint opposition to the United States, of course, are important, but for their sake you should not sacrifice national interests and state sovereignty.
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  1. region46
    region46 April 30 2014 08: 37
    +62
    Russia has only 2 faithful allies - this is its army and navy !!! The rest are maximum partners, and even then they are temporary!
    1. Alexey N
      Alexey N April 30 2014 08: 49
      +53
      good China showed its true face in the days of Mao. A nation is an unprincipled locust. The second threat, after the west.
      1. Canep
        Canep April 30 2014 08: 57
        +35
        There is no particular choice, it is better to be friends with China against the United States than to fight with those and others.
        1. Slavich
          Slavich April 30 2014 09: 14
          +73
          And you also need to be friends with India as opposed to China.
        2. Per se.
          Per se. April 30 2014 09: 29
          +59
          Quote: Canep
          There is no particular choice, it is better to be friends with China against the United States than to fight with those and others
          Dear Sergey, there is always a choice, for example, India instead of China. We were already "friends" with Hitler against England and France, this is a very dangerous game, who will jump off first and be in time first. There is no need here to flirt with a potential contender for world hegemony, who has territorial claims to neighbors for an area exceeding the modern area of ​​all of China, and, therefore, China is also a potential aggressor waiting in the wings. This does not mean that one should be at enmity with China, but it is also impossible to promote its ambitions. The more Russia flirts with China, the more it will alienate India, where they have a very sensible view of the threat. We need to strengthen India and Vietnam, other counterbalanced countries of the Celestial Empire, and this is the only way to "make friends" with the Chinese. There is no need to hope that China will help us, China has always kept and keeps its fig in the pocket for Russia, as well as for everyone else, and aliens rather than crafty Chinese friends will help us, and it would be a sin for us to complain and help as an orphan from someone then wait, Russia is a self-sufficient country, you need to increase your power, and not transfer this power potential to China.
          1. Alexey N
            Alexey N April 30 2014 09: 36
            +12
            ++++++ You can’t say better!
          2. Kite
            Kite April 30 2014 10: 12
            -7
            Quote: Per se.
            We were already "friends" with Hitler против England and France,

            - oops! We have a "historian" from a parallel world ?!

            what is it! Why is my mattress attached to my nickname? Give me back my Tricolor or red banner !!!
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 April 30 2014 11: 06
              +16
              Quote: Kite
              - oops! We have a "historian" from a parallel world ?!

              Just from the past. They really were friends with Hitler, there was a pact, there were promises of friendship and economic interaction. Therefore, the attack in the 41st and called treacherous. That’s why you don’t have to forget the story, and be friends with China very carefullyhi
              Quote: Kite
              Why is my mattress attached to my nickname?

              Internet via cellular?
              1. Setrac
                Setrac April 30 2014 12: 28
                +2
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                They really were friends with Hitler, there was a pact, there were promises of friendship and economic interaction.

                There was a non-aggression pact, dear Ingvar, are you ok with the Russian language? The Non-Aggression Pact is neither an alliance treaty nor a friendship treaty.
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                and be friends with China very carefully

                And you need to be friends with your armed forces.
                1. Ingvar 72
                  Ingvar 72 April 30 2014 14: 21
                  +5
                  Quote: Setrac
                  There was a non-aggression pact

                  Hello Sergey. hi But there was no economic cooperation? IT WAS! And it’s very active, much more than with the Entente. And in the military sphere it was very! close interaction, military experts drove experience to share.
                  Quote: Setrac
                  Is it normal with the Russian language?
                  Yes, I don’t seem to be complaining. laughing
                  1. maxxdesign
                    maxxdesign April 30 2014 15: 04
                    +1
                    that’s what Germany bought the resources from us and came to look at our new tanks, it was definitely ... around 1936-1940 ... at the beginning of 1941 relations were already tense
                2. SlavaP
                  SlavaP April 30 2014 23: 32
                  0
                  Only the Non-Aggression Pact ... maybe. Only another fact - the last train with bread for Germany crossed the border, if not mistaken, less than an hour before the attack ...
              2. Kite
                Kite April 30 2014 20: 24
                +3
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Therefore, the attack in the 41st and called treacherous.

                - they call treacherous because the war began without declaring and making claims. This is only a conditional formality. Everyone was informed about the inevitability of war for a long time! I did not surprise you with this statement?
            2. Goodmen
              Goodmen April 30 2014 11: 08
              +3
              Quote: Kite
              - oops! We have a "historian" from a parallel world ?!


              And what is wrong?
              1. Kite
                Kite April 30 2014 11: 18
                +1
                Quote: Goodmen
                And what is wrong?

                - it is not that C and AGAINST is written! And ask with whom (with which delegations and which countries) and at what level were the negotiations conducted in July-August 1939. Or will you argue that World War II was a war of the entire "democratic" world against Hitler and Stalin? This is a modern interpretation of the war in Galicia and the states.
                1. Goodmen
                  Goodmen April 30 2014 11: 37
                  +5
                  Quote: Kite
                  - it is not that C and AGAINST is written! And ask with whom (with which delegations and which countries) and at what level were the negotiations conducted in July-August 1939. Or will you argue that World War II was a war of the entire "democratic" world against Hitler and Stalin? This is a modern interpretation of the war in Galicia and the states.


                  "By 1933, 120 fighter pilots and about 100 airborne reconnaissance observers were trained in Lipetsk, many of whom later became officers of the Luftwaffe and gained great fame."
                  http://ww2history.ru/create_luftwaffe.html

                  Is this not a fact of friendship? And what about the Molotov-Rebentrop non-aggression pact? Secret! It appeared thanks to the aggravation of relations between the USSR and the Anglo-Saxons, who wanted to "unleash" Hitler on the USSR. And the threat of unification of Germany, Austria and Poland against the USSR?

                  And the supply of food, etc. to Germany right up to the start of the Second World War? Is this not a fact of partnerships?

                  In short, Hitler and I tried to be friends in order to defuse the emerging political situation. That is what Ingvar 72 wrote about. And there is logic in comparing friendship with Hitler with our friendship with China.
                  It is necessary to be friends, but not to unload! And keep your fist ready!
                  1. ksan
                    ksan April 30 2014 11: 53
                    +6
                    In short, Hitler and I tried to be friends in order to defuse the emerging political situation
                    Yes, not "trying to be friends", but trying to delay the war. And with the Anglo-Saxons, and not only with them, they tried to negotiate to "stop" Hitler. But unfortunately, these MORDs have always seen in Russia only an enemy or a Barbarian unworthy of equal cooperation.
                  2. Kite
                    Kite April 30 2014 11: 57
                    +3
                    They have written more and more detailed about the training center for pilots more than once, but all are trying to mention the fact with interpretations! The secret part of the Molotov-Ribentrop Protocol - what? In the section of zones of influence or in the unification of forces AGAINST France with England? Will it be a revelation to you that the non-aggression treaty was signed after it became clear that the delegations of France and England, who were in the USSR at the same time, were not authorized for real assistance treaties? What letters do you need to write in order for you to notice my remark about the distortion of the facts of history? State the facts more accurately, other readers will miss half of the ears and there will be only the conviction that the USSR was planning a campaign to the Atlantic in the UNION with Germany.
                    1. Goodmen
                      Goodmen April 30 2014 12: 23
                      +1
                      Quote: Kite
                      State the facts more carefully, other readers will half miss the ears and there will only be the conviction that the USSR was planning a campaign to the Atlantic in the UNION with Germany.


                      Well this is nonsense of course))))
                      About the Molotov-Rebentrop agreement - whoever needs it, let him read the text of the original.

                      Quote: Kite
                      Will it be a revelation to you that the non-aggression treaty was signed after it became clear that the delegations of France and England, who were in the USSR at the same time, were not authorized for real assistance treaties?


                      Well, what am I talking about?
                      Quote: Goodmen
                      It appeared thanks to the aggravation of relations between the USSR and the Anglo-Saxons, who wanted to "unleash" Hitler on the USSR.



                      Quote: Kite
                      What letters do you need to write so that you notice my remark about the distortion of the facts of history?


                      What is the distortion?

                      Quote: Kite
                      Quote: Per se.
                      We were already "friends" with Hitler against England and France,
                      - oops! We have a "historian" from a parallel world ?!


                      What is the fact of the pact, etc., that I indicated is not the establishment of partnership-friendly relations?
                      Ingvar-72 put it - were friends. Well, I forgot to put the quotes. So what?

                      All this fuss with Hitler was aimed at stabilizing the political situation. Naturally for the USSR, Hitler was an enemy, like the USSR for Hitler, but politics is a delicate matter!
                      Here is Ingvar-72 and wrote that with China, garbage can also turn out!
                      And then the distortion of facts? This is not a history lesson and educated people understand what it is about.)))))
                      So we are talking about the same thing and there’s nothing to argue about!))))
                  3. Setrac
                    Setrac April 30 2014 12: 29
                    +1
                    Quote: Goodmen
                    And the supply of food, etc. to Germany right up to the start of the Second World War? Is this not a fact of partnerships?

                    This is trade, nothing personal, no friendship.
                  4. abc_alex
                    abc_alex April 30 2014 13: 39
                    +6
                    Under 33, do you think it is with Hitler? Do not write nonsense!
                    All relations between the USSR and Germany took place during the Weimar Republic and were terminated after Hitler came to power. And it was so until the very 39-40 years. It was then that the Trade Agreement was concluded, which was SIGNIFICANT for the USSR more profitable and more important than for Germany.

                    The USSR was not friends with Hitler, but with GERMANY. Since all the other USSR simply ignored, or were brightly anti-Soviet. Since the 20s, for the USSR, Germany has been practically the only source of borrowed funds and available technologies. Even the Great Depression did not change the practice of the United States to trade with the USSR only in gold and on a prepaid basis.

                    And in the years 1939-1940 it was too late to defuse the political situation. The capture of the Czech Republic made the Wehrmacht almost the most powerful army in Europe, and the Reich a country with the most powerful military-industrial complex. And the defeat of Poland and France even set all points. The USSR needed resources for rearmament and he could get them only from its potential enemy.
                  5. Nikolay74
                    Nikolay74 April 30 2014 14: 48
                    +1
                    And in Kazan, German tankers were trained. And the Germans tested their tanks.
                    1. Kassandra
                      Kassandra 3 May 2014 06: 56
                      0
                      And also the USA and England armed Japan, which constantly arranged provocations on the border.
            3. And Us Rat
              And Us Rat April 30 2014 11: 55
              +2
              Quote: Kite
              Quote: Per se.
              We were already "friends" with Hitler против England and France,

              - oops! We have a "historian" from a parallel world ?!



              Yeah, in your face.
              I advise you to read carefully everything on the topic: "Soviet-German relations during the years of the Non-Aggression Pact." (Google for help)
              Very entertaining information ...



              1. Kite
                Kite April 30 2014 12: 03
                -1
                I don’t need Google help, but some commentators need to read more carefully, they don’t even notice the highlighted color!
                PS: during the war, the state traders continued to supply fuel and raw materials to Germany! War is war, and business is sacred?am
                1. Goodmen
                  Goodmen April 30 2014 12: 28
                  +2
                  Quote: Kite
                  I don’t need Google help, but some commentators need to read more carefully, they don’t even notice the highlighted color!


                  Google will not hurt anyone)))))
                  talking about the same thing)))
                  To argue that "red is red!", "No !!! no !!! red is red !!!", I see no point !!!))))
                  1. Kite
                    Kite April 30 2014 13: 29
                    +1
                    Quote: Goodmen
                    To argue that "red is red!"

                    laughing laughing laughing
                    - Well, that’s what they mentioned about red; nevertheless, they noticed what is highlighted in this color! And so many words were written not about that! wink
                2. And Us Rat
                  And Us Rat 4 May 2014 03: 46
                  0
                  Quote: Kite
                  PS: during the war, the state traders continued to supply fuel and raw materials to Germany! ...

                  And we are not discussing them now, what a habit is it - to translate arrows? negative
                  1. Kassandra
                    Kassandra 4 May 2014 04: 12
                    -1
                    discuss them better than the Rockefellers, but we are not worth it.
                    because of their supplies, the war dragged on and millions died in the camps.
                    so would Uncle Joe the possessed Adik back in 1943 pulled his eyes on LJ.
                    1. And Us Rat
                      And Us Rat 5 May 2014 01: 17
                      -1
                      Quote: Kassandra
                      better than them (Rockefellers) discuss ...

                      The Rockefellers have not solved anything for a long time and have no control over anything; today they are a screen and a poor beggar for those who are near.
                      The real puppeteers of today's world are LIKELY financial conglomerates, each of which does not have a single owner in which you can poke a finger, but there is only non-permanent the managers representing the interests of the faceless mass of shareholders, the crowd, and any crowd is stupid and primitive, even if it consists of geniuses.

                      For Jesus said unto him, Come forth, unclean spirit, out of this man.
                      And he asked him: what is your name? And he said in response: Legion is my name because we are many.
                      (Mark 5: 8)


                      The so-called "Shadow Government" - it's all of us and our immediate needs, it’s delicious to eat, it is beautiful to dress, go to a resort, make a European-quality repair, buy a new car ... we fight with windmills, and therefore always lose.
                      Our main enemy is ourselves, homo sapiens, a rational man ... who has put his mind in the service of natural instincts, covering them with beautiful civilized names.

                      So do not tell me the girl what to discuss.
                      1. Kassandra
                        Kassandra 5 May 2014 03: 31
                        0
                        Oh really? Maybe they didn’t even decide then, just tightening the war by 2g, boy? Learn the question. To this day, Jews, both in the Diaspora and in Israel, are afraid of a small trembling, although of course they were not the only ones involved in such matters. Adik was just their chain mongrel, like so many others.

                        I know everything as it really is, I eat and dress without frills, I don’t go to resorts (as you understand it), the car is old, there is no European-style repair.
                        I can really call the Arachnids on an occasion, and there will be no more artillery forks in both Venus and Jupiter in 2009. Therefore, behave yourself well.

                        Am I understood, Y / N?
              2. nerd.su
                nerd.su 1 May 2014 01: 01
                0
                Quote: And Us Rat
                I advise you to read carefully everything on the topic: "Soviet-German relations during the years of the Non-Aggression Pact." (Google for help)
                Very entertaining information ...


                The relationship was not easy. There was no particular friendship with the Germans. Here is one of the cases of that "friendship" with the Germans after the annexation of Western Ukraine and Western Belarus:
                And then a new, this time rather “delicate” task followed. The commander of the army V. I. Chuykov, realizing that another case might not be possible to get the latest gas mask from the Germans, ordered "to find a way to find it."

                Frankly, the task was not easy, and the commander ordered Margelov to complete it. There was a reason for the visit to the Germans - the demarcation line was drawn, and it remained only to put signatures on the map.

                The conversation with the commander went face-to-face:

                “All responsibility is on you, captain.” Good luck. But if you get caught by the Germans, rely only on yourself.

                The signing of the documents went without a hitch. And then the red officers were invited to the table. The Germans were generous: vodka and wine flowed like water. Toasts were uttered for Hitler, for Stalin ... Meanwhile, Margelov quietly watched that the soldiers standing on the outskirts of the outhouse were periodically visiting. When the feast was at its peak, the captain pretended to be drunk and left the table. The case went into his hands - near the booth, shifting from foot to foot, stood a German with a gas mask bag on his side. Stab. The second blow is to the one who sent the natural necessities. The corpses - into the latrine pit, and the gas mask - into the car.

                http://militera.lib.ru/bio/kostin_margelov/04.html

                If you want peace, prepare for war.
              3. Kassandra
                Kassandra 3 May 2014 06: 49
                +1
                What's so interesting about the photos? In Bosnia, the "peacekeepers" also walked, stood, sat and smoked. We even marched together at the same aerodrome.

                The Trotskyists were friends with Germany. As soon as Stalin came to power and shot them, that's all. They went to war. The fact that they were trading in front of her means it was necessary, and there was no alternative.

                The non-aggression pact (which Germany violated) is not an agreement on military alliance and mutual assistance, like the Entente or the Triple Pact.

                The USSR from Poland back ate in 1939 approximately strictly along the Curzon line. The USSR partition of Poland was generally not profitable, it was part of the Russian Empire until the WWII. What for it was necessary to give Warsaw to Germans? They just didn’t seem to ask ...
            4. Per se.
              Per se. April 30 2014 12: 34
              +1
              Quote: Kite
              - oops !!
              I do not pretend to be the ultimate truth, expressing my opinion, but I don’t write comments from the bulldozer either. If you are a "historian" not from a parallel world, then you should know that the USSR cooperated with the Germans since the 20s, the Germans designed tanks on our territory, bypassing the bans of Versailles, and a lot of other things were done in technical and economic matters. The training of pilots for the Luftwaffe on our territory is only a small part of that cooperation. We also collaborated with fascist Italy, in particular, the Italians helped us with the design of ships. As for yours:
              Quote: Kite
              State the facts more carefully, other readers will half miss the ears and there will only be the conviction that the USSR was planning a campaign to the Atlantic in the UNION with Germany.
              In general, there was a time when the alliance with the stern guys from Germany and Italy, advocating for the people, seemed more organic than with the bourgeois exploiters of England, France and the United States. About planning a trip to the Atlantic ... Everyone has their own heads on their shoulders, even historians do not have a common opinion on many known facts, what to say about our personal opinions in these comments. Thinking people will understand or double-check, and lovers of slogans can not explain everything.
              1. Kite
                Kite April 30 2014 13: 55
                0
                Quote: Per se.
                even historians don’t agree on many well-known facts,

                - and are hired by the State Department to compose versions and get money ?? belay
                Enough to strain, well, blurted out, and I remarked with excessive sarcasm that "not by malicious intent, not from the bulldozer" is written. Yet the poet-philosopher is right a hundred times when he wrote: "A spoken thought is a lie!" And although, I had to repeat several times where accentand the conversation didn’t go on.
                Not about "passionate love" and now negotiations are underway! But, since the Americans have taken off their masks, are threatening a blockade, then x .. on them! There will be other partners in trade with mutual development.
                1. Per se.
                  Per se. April 30 2014 19: 28
                  0
                  Quote: Kite
                  There will be other partners in trade with mutual development.
                  So no one disputed this, just, partner and ally, these are not synonyms. Personally, I strongly doubt that China is our friend and ally, and it is better to treat it as a partner. I can understand your emotionality, no offense.
                  1. Kite
                    Kite April 30 2014 21: 04
                    0
                    If you once become a politician and statesman, do not be a romantic like Alexander I!
                    In history, all treaties of "eternal peace" were soon broken up, but they gave the parties necessary pauses for reflection. You can call the treaty in any way, if in a wide range of issues - then it is closer to the union treaty. Just a conditional name to simplify the message.
                    PS: And about emotions - this is the post below, but I use emoticons in an attempt to put emphasis, and not to shout!
                  2. Boa kaa
                    Boa kaa April 30 2014 21: 58
                    +3
                    Quote: Per se.
                    Personally, I strongly doubt that China is our friend and ally, and it is better to treat it as a partner.

                    My mentor always said: before you say anything, study the facts, documents, analyze the events in their entirety. Wise advice. I propose to follow him.
                    RF and PRC July 16, 2001, in Moscow, signed an agreement "On good neighborhood, friendship and cooperation "for a period of 20 years. It was this agreement that served to bring our countries closer together, to develop mutually beneficial cooperation, including in the military sphere. Trade turnover by 2015 should amount to 100 billion dollars, and by 2020 - 200 billion. We are speaking with agreed positions on the mn arena, in the UN.
                    But, if you noticed: the first word in the name of the treaty "on good-neighborliness" - thereby acknowledging the friction that took place on border issues.
                    And here is our agreement with the Republic of India from 2007 - " About friendship(!), and cooperation. "Article 3 of the Treaty is devoted to cooperation in the military sphere. Interesting article!
                    I noticed some members of the forum doubt the correctness of the RF policy in the region. But this is not the case. India receives from us the weapons that it asks for: an aircraft carrier, a nuclear submarine (Project 971 "Chakra"), a joint anti-ship missile system "Bramos", T-90 tanks, Su-30MKI aircraft, air defense missile systems and other military equipment that they cannot produce it yourself, but only under a license. We do not give this to China, although we also sell MBT. There is a policy of checks and balances. And China knows about it. Yes, he is a powerful, economically developed power, but, unlike the Russian Federation, he cannot do anything to the States alone. It is 20 years behind us and the United States in terms of nuclear weapons. And he knows about it too. And the States are going to openly oppose China in the APR. Tell me: does China need a strong ally in the person of the Russian Federation or not? I think the answer is obvious. Therefore, he will be (forced) to be friends with us against the United States. And so that he behaves "well", he has India behind him, which has a corresponding agreement with us.
                    There is one more question. States really do not like this alignment. Therefore, following the Anglo-Saxon tradition - divide and conquer - they strive in every possible way to drive a wedge into our union. Unfortunately, they have followers. But we are not so naive as not to understand this and not to monitor the movements of allies and opponents. I think this policy will help us avoid surprises.
            5. maxxdesign
              maxxdesign April 30 2014 15: 01
              -1
              did you teach history at all? ... no, come on - did you go to school? ... did you hear the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact? in 1939 signed on non-aggression of the USSR and Gremyany. And how did Hitler shit on him and attack us on June 22, 1941? By the way, the war was the second world ... are you vkurse?
            6. SmileSimple
              SmileSimple April 30 2014 21: 13
              +2
              How to call, what happened between the USSR and Germany, everyone decides for himself. True, it is multifaceted - the Germans and we turned out to be losers in the 1 world, got into isolation and had limitations, therefore:
              - together began to deceive the AngloFrench
              - In 1939, Germany and the USSR jointly attacked Poland
              - by the way, until 1940, German propaganda called us "Eastern Aryans" ...
              - And we had a non-aggression pact.

              I would call the process between the USSR (Stalin) and Germany (Hitler) as "partnership against the winners."
            7. SmileSimple
              SmileSimple April 30 2014 21: 13
              0
              How to call, what happened between the USSR and Germany, everyone decides for himself. True, it is multifaceted - the Germans and we turned out to be losers in the 1 world, got into isolation and had limitations, therefore:
              - together began to deceive the AngloFrench
              - In 1939, Germany and the USSR jointly attacked Poland
              - by the way, until 1940, German propaganda called us "Eastern Aryans" ...
              - And we had a non-aggression pact.

              I would call the process between the USSR (Stalin) and Germany (Hitler) as "partnership against the winners."
              1. diff
                diff April 30 2014 22: 26
                +1
                How did we deceive the Anglo-French?
                they called us "Eastern Aryans" ...

                where is it from?
            8. Kite
              Kite 1 May 2014 16: 46
              0
              For those 18 and the author, whose quotation I cited, I propose to be more careful and accurate in presenting the point of view in disputes. Stating about "friendship""против"Do you recognize the correct interpretation of the Western opponent! But, did they not trade with Germany at the same time? Or did they not have non-aggression pacts? Wasn't France a treaty with Czechoslovakia on military assistance? Was it not England that promised Poland military assistance?" provoking a conflict with Germany? Who behind the scenes approved the seizure of both Austria and Czechoslovakia? And I could list many more dark deeds, but remember or find out for yourself.
              PS: If I offer you to buy from me a bag of onions or potatoes, or I want to buy a bicycle from you, then do not take this as an offer of friendship.
              And I called the parallel world that world in which events occurred differently, as Per se wrote. There, Germany must have divided the world in friendship with the USSR. I wonder how? wassat
          3. Nayhas
            Nayhas April 30 2014 10: 17
            +7
            Quote: Per se.
            We need to strengthen India and Vietnam, other counterbalanced countries of the Celestial Empire, and this is the only way to "make friends" with the Chinese.

            It is necessary ... But American ships in Vietnam are not a rarity for a long time, and a photo of an American officer (not a prisoner) in the "red corner" near the red banner does not surprise anyone. The choice of India and Vietnam is far from Russia ...
            USS destroyer John S. McCain (DDG 56) (yes! Yes! It is John McCain! In honor of the grandfather of the same senator who spent many years in Vietnamese captivity!) In the port of Da Nang, 07.04.2014/XNUMX/XNUMX.

            Captain Duane Sand against the background of the red banner and bust of Uncle Ho, next to Lieutenant Commander (I have no idea what the title is) Thaison Nguyen shares his experience in conducting deep-sea rescue operations.

            Class 3 security specialist Endalk Hailu explains to an unknown Vietnamese major .... generally watered. The side of the destroyer USS John S. McCain (DDG 56) (pay attention to the "Harpoon" anti-ship missile launcher, one container is empty, because before that they fired, this somehow does not coincide with the opinion that Harpoons were removed from the Berks)

            "My love for you for a long, long time!"

            So now they have peace-friendship,

            but it would seem 40 years ago ...
            1. Per se.
              Per se. April 30 2014 19: 42
              +1
              Quote: Nayhas
              The choice of India and Vietnam is far from Russia ...
              Dear Eugene, India and Vietnam had the "good fortune" to fight with China, reflecting its border claims. I have already said above that our military cooperation with the Celestial Empire cannot please India and Vietnam itself, our true allies. The fact that the Yankees were in a hurry there ... It is not necessary to confuse the shores with the trade in our weapons, and it is advisable to prefer diplomats with techies in these matters to hucksters-managers, that in the Russian arms export the momentary babos slobber.
          4. Turkir
            Turkir April 30 2014 10: 27
            +6
            I share your anxiety. Totally agree with you.
            I just want to add that such well-known scientists, Academician Konrad (incidentally, an intellectual, much to the displeasure of uneducated commentators), was an adviser to the Chairman of the Council of Ministers, Kosygin, on relations with China and Japan.
            It is difficult to do without such experts in building faithful and long-term relations with these countries. Three institutes of Oriental studies worked in the USSR and there was the best school of synologists in the World!
            One of the students, a Swiss professor, Myasnikov, published a book in two volumes, on Chinese strategies: Harro von Senger.
          5. Setrac
            Setrac April 30 2014 12: 26
            +3
            Quote: Per se.
            We were already "friends" with Hitler against England and France, this is a very dangerous game, who will jump off first and be in time first.

            Dear Per se., It was YOU who were friends with Hitler, the USSR was not friends with either Hitler, Churchill or Roosevelt, the USSR was forced to cooperate to obtain certain technologies.
            1. Per se.
              Per se. April 30 2014 20: 21
              +4
              Quote: Setrac
              Dear Per se., It is YOU who were friends with Hitler, the USSR was not friends with Hitler
              Dear Setrac, I wasn’t friends and wasn’t going to have such a fantastic opportunity. In general, my father's older brother, my own uncle, died in March 1945, I grew up in the memory of the war, and I never even played for the Germans in children's "war games". Do not confuse the concepts, everyone wanted the best then, but it turned out to be 1941, do not repeat this with China. This was discussed, the security of the Fatherland is not personal risks in lotteries. I wrote "friendship" in quotation marks, but, nevertheless, there was a completely official document dated September 28, 1939, which was called the "German-Soviet Treaty of Friendship and the Border Between the USSR and Germany." Words about friendship were also in the press, for clarity, you have a photo. I am impressed that you are rooting for our country, believe me, I am too, but we must not forget the cruel lessons from history, otherwise they will be repeated.
          6. washi
            washi April 30 2014 15: 58
            -1
            Quote: Per se.
            There is always a choice, dear Sergey

            There are a lot of words in your comment, but it makes little sense.
            Quote: Per se.
            China always kept and keeps the fig in a pocket for Russia

            They understand that without Russia they cannot survive.
            Russia brains and resources.
            China is the workforce.
            North of the so-called called the Wall of China - dead lands.
            Even the Chinese citizens who live there are not considered full-fledged Chinese.
            They have a section there as in Kazakhstan.
            It's like we hate Muscovites.

            Leftist (Moscow) companies are coming.
            Bankrupt or redeem locals (temporary price cuts: locals do not have Such financial security). Then the introduction of their orders. Salaries to the chief, chief accountant and security increase. The rest .............
            Fines are introduced.
            As a result, instead of local natural products - all according to import rules and prices.
            There are very few independent candy factories, as well as breweries. The rest is purchased and produced using foreign technologies
          7. benefactor21
            benefactor21 April 30 2014 20: 50
            0
            China - does not know how to fight - as history has shown ... But we have to be especially "frenzied" in defending our territories ...
          8. timer
            timer 3 May 2014 00: 58
            0
            I agree with a competent koment to all 100%. The ability to create, including in foreign policy, a system of checks and balances is the art of diplomacy, while keeping at the forefront the interests of one’s own country!
        3. Alekseev
          Alekseev April 30 2014 10: 28
          +2
          Quote: Canep
          There is no particular choice, it is better to be friends with China against the United States than to fight with those and others.

          Absolutely right!
          Politics is the art of compromise, but for this very compromise to be "in our favor", we must first of all, as tightly as possible, be friends with our economy and the army.
        4. timer
          timer 3 May 2014 00: 54
          0
          I don’t agree, there is always a choice! No one is stopping us at this stage, on the one hand, fighting together against the Americans, and on the other hand, raising the Far East and the Amur in two ways: 1) through a real restoration program developed by our government and restoring the military groupings on the border with China; 2) due to Chinese investment (but not Chinese).
          It is only necessary to arrange this cunningly and thoughtfully (as for example the Saudis did when they were puzzled by attracting investments); 3) in addition to China, develop partnerships with India, Brazil, etc. Do not get hung up on one partner!
      2. 225chay
        225chay April 30 2014 09: 38
        +1
        Quote: Alexey N
        China showed its true face in the days of Mao. A nation is an unprincipled locust. The second threat, after the west.


        Yes, China is prematurely considered an ally
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. invisibility
        invisibility April 30 2014 10: 05
        +9
        Quote: Alexey N
        China showed its true face in the days of Mao. A nation is an unprincipled locust. The second threat, after the west.

        I would say that for the Chinese, there are only the Chinese and the celestial.
        And I would not number the threats. Nobody needs Russia. The slightest weakness and swallow without choking.
      5. Revolver
        Revolver April 30 2014 21: 20
        +1
        Quote: Alexey N
        China showed its true face in the days of Mao. A nation is an unprincipled locust. The second threat, after the west.

        That's for sure. With such "allies" as China, enemies are not needed.
    2. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich April 30 2014 09: 22
      +2
      Is China an ally? .. request punctuation marks are true ...
      1. ksan
        ksan April 30 2014 11: 58
        +1
        Is China an ally? .. request punctuation marks are true ...
        Allies and US only the Army and Navy. wink And Khramchikhin is a well-known "yellow threat" blower, I sometimes get the impression that he works for MI6 or the CIA repeat
        1. MBA78
          MBA78 April 30 2014 13: 34
          0
          need to teach the Chinese to conquer the water element
    3. kodxnumx
      kodxnumx 2 May 2014 13: 34
      0
      Yes, I agree, I served on the border with China, Dalnorechinsk7, and there are no illusions on this score, the Far East, as well as the underwater direction, should have all the advanced and best weapons of the Russian Federation. there are many words, but as a war I would not want to offend the Chinese people, alas, the vein is weakish, but this is not a reason to break apart, but I think you can take it off, they also have no options!
    4. timer
      timer 3 May 2014 00: 44
      0
      I agree with koment by 200%. The only thing I add is that the article is VERY ACTUAL, and touches on the painful issue of developing the territories of the Far East and the Amur. The government does NOTHING ANYTHING TO RESTORE these territories !! And the potential of these territories is just GREAT. REAL PROGRAM for development is needed of these territories, including basic decisions on the main issues — demographic, economic, cultural.
  2. Nikich
    Nikich April 30 2014 08: 41
    +13
    That's right, the author is definitely a plus. I can only add that Russia also has many natural resources, and most of the fortified areas have been dismantled. Well, the Chinese army in a week can increase up to 10 million people (without taking people off from important industries) with fairly modern military equipment (for comparison, the army of Nazi Germany before the attack on the USSR is about 3-4 million people)
    1. Enjoy
      Enjoy April 30 2014 09: 39
      +16
      Fortifications ... I would not be surprised if 50 years later they will be saddened on the Internet. Rusty IS-2 tanks buried in the ground up the tower. Who will you stop them in modern warfare? Any OTRK and a good MLRS will fly over these fortified areas. Sense from them, as from the Maginot line and Tiger tanks.

      As for the threats to Russia. I will see how the PLA in a week will not only call on reservists, but also in the same proportions will increase the Air Force, Air Defense, tank troops and artillery, equipping the equipment with trained calculations. We live in a modern world where even well-trained Kalash soldiers are of little use. Moreover, against a nuclear power with several thousand shells of nuclear weapons.

      A dozen or two of them are used in large agglomerations (what are we animals, "Topols" to work?), The victims are several thousand, and several million they lose their housing and any desire to live in the vicinity of the affected city. Panic, humanitarian disaster, disrupted transport. Americans will clap their hands only.

      Stumble "channeled protest sentiments and seized the resources of Siberia"... In response, of course, he will fly too, they will fly back something more serious and that’s where the story of the world we know will end wink

      Minus. Minus. Minus for "fortified areas".
      1. Alexey N
        Alexey N April 30 2014 10: 14
        +10
        Minus. Minus. Minus for "fortified areas".

        And for the stools disbanded in the Far East, a few air regiments minus put? smile It's not about the earthen rampart. Modern warfare is a modern fortified area.
        But in general I agree with you.
      2. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 April 30 2014 11: 17
        0
        Quote: Enjoy
        A dozen or two of them are used in large agglomerations (what are we animals, to work with "Poplar"?), Several thousand victims, and several million lose their homes and any desire to live in the vicinity of the affected city.

        So China is also not "toothless", and their delivery vehicles are not Korean (north). hi
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. invisibility
        invisibility April 30 2014 12: 42
        +1
        Dear Enjoy, do not get me wrong, but a few nuclear explosions and all modern equipment will turn into scrap metal. Electronics will go out at the moment. And perhaps the IS-2 will be rusty, but combat-ready.
        And about 10 million - this is cannon fodder for the most part.
        I am afraid of the almost complete lack of personnel reserve in our army. And while the contract army does not contribute to the accumulation of this reserve.
      5. JonnyT
        JonnyT April 30 2014 16: 05
        0
        Moreover, against a nuclear power with several thousand shells of nuclear weapons
        So China is also a nuclear power
      6. Nikich
        Nikich April 30 2014 16: 12
        0
        Well fly so what? We have air defense systems and not weak ones. and the fortified areas are needed to restrain that horde of cannon fodder that will come running to seize the territory. And the Chinese will not bomb anything hard, what are they supposed to turn their fools into future desert territories?
    2. ksan
      ksan April 30 2014 11: 44
      +2
      Well, the Chinese army in a week can increase up to 10 million people (without taking people off from important industries) with fairly modern military equipment (for comparison, the army of Nazi Germany before the attack on the USSR is about 3-4 million people)
      The Union before the war had more soldiers and artillery and tanks, but the lack of coordination and inept command of the troops led from one defeat to another and retreat on all fronts. So the number of troops, especially in a modern war, is not an indicator of success fellow Especially against Russia, which has one of the best (if not the best) air defense systems and simply "deadly" nuclear weapons potential.
      1. Setrac
        Setrac April 30 2014 12: 36
        +2
        Quote: ksan
        The Union before the war had more soldiers and artillery and tanks

        Where did you get this? On the western border of the USSR, 5.5 million Wehrmacht soldiers and satellites came together in battle against 3.2 million Red Army soldiers, it was the Wehrmacht's total numerical superiority that caused the defeats at the beginning of the war.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. invisibility
          invisibility April 30 2014 15: 08
          -3
          Yeah, do not forget about the tanks, in the total number of which, almost everything was recorded on a track.
        3. 52
          52 April 30 2014 17: 26
          +1
          plus the factor of surprise, rapid deployment in a complete vacuum on the diplomatic front, and low adaptability at the theoretical and practical level to the conduct of modern hostilities. And we studied for a long time, and we had less strength. But they learned and broke, otherwise nothing.
  3. Nayhas
    Nayhas April 30 2014 08: 48
    +2
    Is China an ally? ..

    Where to go now? There is no alternative. The rapprochement between Moscow and Beijing is inevitable and the process has been launched long ago, the events in Ukraine are accelerating it. But you need to understand that in this alliance, Beijing will specifically indicate its leading role. Only he can dictate the conditions which should be adhered to, especially the price of gas and oil. Examples of the alliance with China of "rogue" countries are known, these are Iran and the DPRK. Yes, you can get a lot from China, but it will cost more than usual. The only thing that is encouraging is that now the government of pragmatic economists is in power in Beijing, and not the swordsmen who were driven under the bench ... So I recommend learning Chinese, it will be very useful.
    1. jungar
      jungar April 30 2014 10: 35
      +18
      Quote: Nayhas
      And where to go now? There is no alternative.

      Often I work in contact with the Chinese (alas, without them, there’s no way, but they won’t survive without us). And I noticed a very interesting thing - we have a lot in common with them. Love for booze, scuffle, for holidays, women, cheating, the ability to be friends and be faithful in friendship, once my Chinese friend pulled me out of an unpleasant mess, he did not stand aside, like many of ours. To my question, do they disagree with the fact that we are similar, upon reflection, they agree with surprise. It sounds strange, but when you get to know them better, you come to the conclusion that our two peoples are the most similar. I never loved them, for my ancestors, China was the main enemy, but another time has come and the former enemy can become a friend in the face of a more terrible enemy. I'm not saying that you can trust the Chinese without looking back (you always need to be strong and prudent yourself), but I want to say that if a Chinese person considers you to be a friend, he will be him, remember that the only strongest world leader Xi Jinping came to support us to the Olympics. And yet, the Chinese team came out at the ceremony with Russian flags. This is not hypocrisy, but a sign of recognition and respect for us.
      1. Turkir
        Turkir April 30 2014 11: 25
        +4
        Subtle observation. Yes, there are many similarities.
  4. KAVS
    KAVS April 30 2014 08: 51
    +9
    That's right, throughout the history of Russia, we have firmly realized that we should only rely on ourselves !!!!
  5. Alexey N
    Alexey N April 30 2014 08: 52
    +15
    China, like NATO, is holding back only atomic weapons from attacking Russia. Thanks to the rockets, pilots and sailors! Russia holds on to them, and not on different "partners".
  6. Dejavu
    Dejavu April 30 2014 08: 52
    +12
    A good friend of mine has been living in China for a long time, and when I asked if China is our friend, he answered unequivocally - "Yes!" There are many things that connect us with China, both from a historical point of view and from a purely economic point of view. The Chinese also remember such a concept as "Honor", which our Western "partners" have completely forgotten about. We can become very strong friends. Moreover, as never before, we have someone to be friends against. soldier soldier
    1. Alexey N
      Alexey N April 30 2014 08: 59
      +7
      The Chinese still remember such a thing as "Honor"

      Especially their memory on Damansky has become aggravated. Do not confuse the views of ordinary Chinese and national politics.
      1. Dejavu
        Dejavu April 30 2014 09: 14
        +3
        You will not believe it, but the Chinese politicians, and in particular their current chairman, come from the simplest people. Therefore, I do not confuse anything.
        1. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich April 30 2014 09: 25
          +5
          Quote: dejavu
          You will not believe it, but the Chinese politicians, and in particular their current chairman, come from the simplest people. Therefore, I do not confuse anything.

          politicians are no longer ordinary people .... we all come from childhood. hi
    2. polly
      polly April 30 2014 09: 38
      +1
      Dejavu, I agree with your opinion. I talked on a personal level with our Chinese neighbors and invited them to my home. Very sane people, calm, behave with dignity, remember our previous brotherly relations and are very friendly.
    3. Horst78
      Horst78 April 30 2014 09: 46
      +1
      Quote: dejavu
      to my question whether China is our friend, he answered unequivocally - "Yes!"

      Here I am about it. Tired of scarecrows about China. The Chinese are traders, it’s easier for them to negotiate than to fight. You can arbitrarily talk about the power of the PLA, but the Chinese are weak as warriors, the mentality is not the same.
      1. Yuri Sev Caucasus
        Yuri Sev Caucasus April 30 2014 13: 34
        0
        Speak rather weak, but take an interest in how they thrust Amers into the Korean War!
        Yes, in the First World War, the British wanted to attract them to the front, but after the words of their ruler, I do not remember their name, "If you teach the Chinese to fight, we will conquer the whole world" were forced to abandon such a decision.
    4. vvvvv
      vvvvv April 30 2014 10: 15
      +3
      For many reasons, I agree with you more than with the anonymous experts mentioned in the article, who knowingly by their rhetoric are bringing enmity with China. It is not for nothing that it is said "by deeds you will know them" ... As for Damansky, etc. - everyone is not without sin ... But as far as I have formed an opinion about China - it is not so bad as to expect from China what I can easily expect from Western "partners". I do not believe that China will deliver a global strike or a nuclear strike against Russia. Of course, if you persist in repeating "enemies", etc., then you can "whisper" so ...
    5. Goodmen
      Goodmen April 30 2014 11: 18
      +2
      Quote: dejavu
      A good friend of mine has been living in China for a long time, and when I asked if China is our friend, he answered unequivocally - "Yes!"


      I don’t want to offend anyone, but a tough analogy suggests itself ...
      Anyone who sits in a barrel for a long time with "go.nom" to the question "Does it stink?" Will unequivocally answer - "No!"
      Those. a friend's eye, as they say, "blurred" ... National policy is far from the opinion of ordinary Chinese with whom he communicates on a daily basis.
      1. Dejavu
        Dejavu April 30 2014 19: 24
        +1
        A friend himself is interested in politics and his eyes are not completely blurred. He also said that China really has a lot of problems, but they obviously will not solve them with a clumsy attack on Russia. Rather, they will be asked to help them solve these problems by joint efforts with our country.
    6. zarya
      zarya 1 May 2014 19: 44
      0
      Quote: dejavu
      A good friend of mine has been living in China for a long time, and when I asked if China is our friend, he answered unequivocally - "Yes!" There are many things that connect us with China, both from a historical point of view and from a purely economic point of view. The Chinese also remember such a concept as "Honor", which our Western "partners" have completely forgotten about. We can become very strong friends. Moreover, as never before, we have someone to be friends against. soldier soldier


      Here we must remember that their Chinese government may have a slightly different attitude. In fact, if you find a way to reset during a short war a If the government doesn’t kill too many Chinese, then it will be possible to take them. And so, one must be very, very alert.
  7. mitya24
    mitya24 April 30 2014 08: 56
    +1
    Beijing will simply send them to a war of conquest, and even Russia may become a victim of this war.-Complete garbage. The Chinese, of course, are guys frostbitten all over, but not to that extent. To unleash a war with a power possessing the largest arsenal of nuclear weapons is utopia. They cannot divide any rocks with the Japs, but here they will come so easily and Russia will push the Far and Trans-Baikal ..... nonsense.
    1. zao74
      zao74 April 30 2014 11: 04
      +5
      There is a concept - peaceful expansion - the settlement of the territory of neighboring states by refugees, defectors, loyal to their state and working for their state. And the Chinese are great adherents of the "Celestial Empire" ... even if they have citizenship of other countries. This is how the "fifth column" is being formed in the Far East.
      Russia has only two allies: army and navy
      and this must never be forgotten.
    2. INVESTOR
      INVESTOR April 30 2014 12: 52
      +1
      The Japs, by the way, are also 150 million people, the Chinese are rocking for them, because they don’t have yao.
  8. mamont5
    mamont5 April 30 2014 08: 57
    +5
    "In any case, Moscow should not lose vigilance while waiting for the Chinese dragon to wake up."

    Well, who argues with this? Partnership with China is possible only from a position of strength. Then they will respect.
  9. Stiletto
    Stiletto April 30 2014 09: 07
    +12
    The enemy of my enemy is my friend. China is one of the few countries that holds back the total US aggression against Russia, and diverts the enormous forces and attention of this Mordor. So far, this is so. And in the future ... In the future we will see. The main thing is not to forget the golden rule: friendship is friendship, and tobacco is apart. Practice shows that nothing lasts forever under the moon, and even a relationship like Russia and Ukraine can drive a wedge, alas request
    1. 225chay
      225chay April 30 2014 09: 43
      +2
      Quote: Stiletto
      The enemy of my enemy is my friend. China is one of the few countries that holds back the total US aggression against Russia, and diverts the enormous forces and attention of this Mordor.

      how long...
    2. Nayhas
      Nayhas April 30 2014 09: 49
      -2
      Quote: Stiletto
      China is one of the few countries that holds back the total US aggression against Russia, and diverts the enormous forces and attention of this Mordor.

      You are living in a world of illusion. China does not restrain anyone, on the contrary, it is he "straightening his shoulders" invading the area where the US previously dominated, forcing it to carry out containment measures. China and the United States are not enemies, of course not friends, but neither are they enemies. Rivals, that's the best definition.
      1. Setrac
        Setrac April 30 2014 12: 44
        +1
        Quote: Nayhas
        China does not restrain anyone, on the contrary, it is he "straightening his shoulders" invading the areas where the US previously dominated, forcing it to carry out containment measures.

        Oh, what poor and unfortunate States, how bad China is pressing them! Or maybe this is the United States for many years sitting in the sphere of interests of China, and China has just begun to restore its position!
        1. Nayhas
          Nayhas April 30 2014 13: 06
          +2
          Quote: Setrac
          Oh, what poor and unfortunate States, how bad China is pressing them!

          Well, what are you talking about, I do not consider the United States to be poor, and China is not good, for me they are absolutely identical. If you think that China is holding back the United States, then I ask for arguments. Probably only a blind man does not notice the growing influence of China in the world ... It is China who drove the United States from Pakistan and Central Asia, and not vice versa. This is China capturing Africa (the European patrimony is true here), this is China lowering the role of the United States in the Asia-Pacific region where the United States has reigned since 1945.
          Quote: Setrac
          China has just begun to regain its position!

          To restore it means to return to something lost that China lost in the past? Africa? Near East? To Indonesia? Philippines?
          1. Setrac
            Setrac April 30 2014 14: 16
            0
            Quote: Nayhas
            Well what are you screwing

            You think that China is an aggressor, but on the contrary, the aggressor is the United States, China does not force other countries to accept trade rules and even laws within third countries that are favorable to themselves. Compared with the Anglo-Saxons, the Chinese are just angels, although in absolute numbers the Chinese are not a gift either.
            Quote: Nayhas
            Probably only a blind man does not notice the growing influence of China in the world ...

            The increased Chinese influence is Chinese goods, not Chinese aircraft carriers.
            1. Nayhas
              Nayhas 1 May 2014 07: 19
              +1
              Quote: Setrac

              You think that China is an aggressor, but in fact, on the contrary,

              I find Chinese expansionary policies to be aggressive.
              Quote: Setrac
              Compared to the Anglo-Saxons, the Chinese are just angels

              Yeah. Where does the Chinese come, the earth groans. Their task in a short time is to suck out everything that is possible, and then even though the grass does not grow ...
              Quote: Setrac
              The increased Chinese influence is Chinese goods, not Chinese aircraft carriers.

              Chinese goods are killers of the economy. Not the Americans with the Europeans killed the Soviet economy, which went to Russia, but the Chinese. Most of them don’t even remember how Chinese consumer goods rushing across the open border flooded Russia, killing light industry first, and then everything else. I perfectly remember the points of reception of non-ferrous metal unfolded at each enterprise of the military industrial complex and gradually killed them, I know that the whole color. met. drove by trains to China. In my homeland all the bald hills are standing, cut down the whole forest and surrendered to China ...
              1. Kazbek
                Kazbek 1 May 2014 10: 28
                0
                Quote: Nayhas
                I find Chinese expansionary policies to be aggressive.
                Once the Mexican president Porfirio Diaz said: “Poor Mexico! So far from God and so close to the USA! ”
                I do not understand the enthusiasm from the supposedly allies of the Chinese and the hysteria about the enemies of the Pindocs request
                After all, America is far away, and China is nearby ..
                Now the situation around Ukraine plays in favor of China ..
                And Russia is falling into the clutches of China. And no matter what they say, Russia belongs to Western civilization ..
  10. Dejavu
    Dejavu April 30 2014 09: 10
    +2
    Never say never ... But the stories about the capture of Siberia are sheer nonsense. China has long owned huge manufacturing facilities that allow them to make unrealistic money in processing. purchased resources and production of everything for the inhabitants of almost the entire planet. So tell me, why the hell go to war on the state for the sake of some land of Siberia ... if you can just buy resources? Costs will more than pay off when selling finished products. Well, in response to attacks on Siberia, you can be slightly obliterated by a nuclear shock wave. True for various storytellers, these are trifles.
  11. Ordinary stock
    Ordinary stock April 30 2014 09: 13
    +2
    China and the United States - horseradish radish is not sweeter. Unless the US has no common borders with us. And hundreds of millions of potential "immigrants" to our territory. It is possible and necessary to "partner" with both, carefully and carefully playing on their contradictions and having a powerful army and navy that guarantee unacceptable damage to the aggressor. Sorry for some cynicism, but this is real life.
    1. Setrac
      Setrac April 30 2014 12: 45
      +1
      Quote: Private stock
      And hundreds of millions of potential "immigrants" to our territory.

      You dream, you will not have Chinese slaves. If the Chinese need new land for settlement, then this is definitely not cold Siberia.
    2. INVESTOR
      INVESTOR April 30 2014 13: 06
      0
      We have a common border with the USA, dear
      1. andj61
        andj61 April 30 2014 14: 00
        0
        Quote: INVESTOR
        We have a common border with the USA, dear


        Yes, marine, in the region of Alaska and a number of islands.
  12. Samurai3X
    Samurai3X April 30 2014 09: 14
    +2
    What kind of fantasy ... Where did he see hundreds of thousands of Chinese in the far? I'm wondering.
    And then I somehow read an article on a blog and asked at work from a Siberian who works in St. Petersburg, they say, is there half of the Chinese population there? He generally twisted at the temple. What are the Chinese?
    On the one hand, the story of the border between Russia and China is very dark, and in fact we moved the flags very far, on the other hand, there were no Chinese on the far ... in general. On the other hand, the Chinese remember very well who liberated them from the Japanese, who from scratch created the industry for them, drove modern tanks and planes for nothing and then helped with nuclear power plants.
    So one must think that he will defeat a very reasonable people who gave the world a whole darkness of philosophers who said that they should not be scattered by the allies: the desire to cash in here and now or to create a military-economic bloc that theoretically will rule the world in the future.
    1. Alexey N
      Alexey N April 30 2014 09: 48
      +1
      Hundreds of thousands - in one region vryatli, but in Russia it may well be. The main thing no one considers and does not control. I'm from Siberia. The Chinese work at every construction site. Trade in consumer goods (through local sellers). Start a business here. Get along. And Russian citizenship has 1 out of a thousand.
      1. kaa_andrey
        kaa_andrey April 30 2014 18: 04
        0
        Do you remember who built the CER and Transib in the 19th century? Chinese workers, Russian and Italian engineers ...
        Something not very many Chinese have remained in Siberia and the Far East since that time. And these will also eventually move to areas with a mild climate.
        1. Alexey N
          Alexey N April 30 2014 21: 38
          -1
          Ah, who turns out to be Transsib, built it! Sensation!!! And we didn’t know. Where does the information come from? Have you seen enough American Westerns?
          Neud You on the story!
          Something not very many Chinese have remained in Siberia and the Far East since that time.

          I will disappoint you, but there were few Chinese in those times in Siberia either. And they appeared here after the Russians, if that.
          And these will also eventually move to areas with a mild climate.

          Right. The mild climate is China, where they live. And there is nothing to do with "resettlement of peoples". laughing
          1. kaa_andrey
            kaa_andrey April 30 2014 23: 39
            0
            Afflicted:
            "In December 1918, a meeting of Chinese and Korean workers' organizations in Russia was held in Petrograd. At the meeting, it was decided to unite all Chinese organizations in Soviet Russia into the Union of Chinese Workers in Russia (TFR). Liu Jiezhong was elected its chairman. The tasks of the ICR were the organization of Chinese workers, the propaganda of communism among them and the return of Chinese workers to their homeland.
            The question arises - how did the Chinese end up in Russia? At the beginning of the 1906th century, driven by hunger and unemployment in China, many Chinese went to Russia. They mainly settled (most temporarily) in Siberia and the Far East, where they worked at gold mines, in ports, and on the construction of highways and railways. Only from 1910 to 550 about 1912 thousand Chinese arrived in the Far East. In 200, more than XNUMX thousand Chinese lived in the Amur and Primorsky regions alone. Before World War I, very few Chinese arrived in European Russia.
            During the years of World War I, in Russia, due to the mass mobilization of Russians, a shortage of labor was felt. According to the "Union of Chinese Citizens," from 1915 to the fall of 1917, about 80 thousand Chinese left for Russia, including European Russia.
            Chinese labor was not only cheap. The Chinese workers were distinguished by discipline, were able to quickly learn new professions and areas of activity. Naturally, at times social conflicts arose between Chinese workers and Russian workers because of competition in the labor market.
            Admittedly, the Chinese workers in Russia were subjected to brutal exploitation. For example, the working day for them at the construction of the Murmansk Railway lasted 12 hours. They lived in dugouts and huts, were deprived of medical care. Of course, that was not good. But: Chinese workers and peasants came to a foreign country in search of work, which was difficult to find in their homeland. Therefore, they did not have the right immediately upon arrival in a foreign country to demand for themselves the rights and guarantees that extended to Russian workers. Over time, yes.
            Some Chinese in European Russia from the first days of Soviet power joined the Red Guard units. Chinese units were also formed with their own Chinese command. The first Chinese battalion was created in Transnistria. His commander was the Chinese Communist San Fuyang.
            Why did many Chinese join the ranks of the Red Guard, then the Red Army? Did they see the differences between the foreign policy of Soviet Russia in China and the foreign policy of the capitalist powers? Or did the fate of the Russian revolution become close to them? It was not so. Just the Soviet government invited the Chinese to serve in the army with a salary, which many of them agreed to. The Chinese internationalists were very far from the people they were to lead to communism.
            Not only the courage of the Chinese internationalists (in Russia they were also called the "Chinese machine gunners") in the battles with the enemies of Soviet Russia, Soviet military leaders noted. Their inhuman, eastern cruelty was also noted. Chinese troops were thrown at the most difficult sectors of the fronts or used as punitive force to suppress peasant and workers' anti-Soviet actions. For this reason, the Chinese-internationalists preferred not to give up. If one of them nevertheless was captured by the White Guards or the “green”, the rebellious peasants or workers, they were also inhumanly killed.
            1. kaa_andrey
              kaa_andrey April 30 2014 23: 41
              +2
              Continued:
              The appeal of the Soviet government of July 25, 1919 to the Chinese people interested the Chinese living in Siberia and the Far East. As the Red Army approached the borders of China, they enthusiastically greeted its units and the Chinese Red Army. Many of them joined the Chinese Red Army units. The Chinese, who lived in Siberia and the Far East, took an active part in the partisan struggle against the White Guards and the "greens".
              The role of the Chinese diaspora in the Russian October Revolution is not small. The Chinese diaspora contributed to the formation of Soviet power in Russia by supporting its first steps, becoming one of the components of the Bolshevik social base. It is characteristic that V.I. Lenin was personally interested in the formation of Chinese troops. Of course, the participation of Chinese internationalists in punitive operations throughout Russia did not contribute to the strengthening of personal relations between the Russian (Soviet) and Chinese peoples on a personal level. The relations between the Soviet government and the Chinese people are not taken into account here.
              Literature
              Weller M., Burovsky A. Civil history of insane war. M., 2007.
              Weller M. Makhno. M., 2007.
              Dyatlov V.I. Migration of the Chinese and the discussion of the "yellow danger" in pre-revolutionary Russia // Bulletin of Eurasia. 2000.
              Chinese volunteers in the battles for Soviet Russia (1918 - 1922). M., 1961.
              Larin A.G. The Chinese in Russia yesterday and today: a historical outline. M., 2003.
              Sladkovsky M.I. Acquaintance with China and the Chinese. M., 1984.
              Soviet-Chinese relations 1917 - 1957. Collection of documents. M., 1959.
              Tikhvinsky S.L. Testament of the Chinese revolutionary. M., 1986.
              Cherepanov A.I. My military field. M., 1984.
              1. Alexey N
                Alexey N 1 May 2014 07: 57
                0
                ALL of the foregoing is an excerpt from ONE collection of articles by V. Opolev (the original source on the network: http://tank.uw.ru/books/opolev/) and a list of used literature from there.
                Meanwhile, links to this electronic page would be enough.

                After reading "your" text, I saw nowhere evidence that the Chinese built the Trans-Siberian Railway. Between us, you will not find them unless you come up with. Roughly speaking, the story of V. Opolev about the Chinese begins in 1917 and the period of the construction of the Trans-Siberian Railway does not cover.

                The great contribution of the Chinese to the October Revolution, the Civil War and the construction of the Murmansk railway - We leave on the conscience of Mr. Opolev. To look for information in books and the Internet, to argue and refute the nonsense of Opolev V.G. - I'm too lazy.

                The number of Chinese in Siberia at the beginning of the 20th century is surpassing. Opolev gives fantastic numbers. That's because half of his “primary sources” are in doubt. Such as: Weller M., Burovsky A., Weller M. Makhno M. And some, for example, Professor Dyatlov V.I. pulled out a couple of sentences.

                Your frivolous source of knowledge.

                Act like a troll. First, write something that you have no idea about, and then lay out two printed pages without knowing which text. And for what? Do you want to woo the Chinese with Siberia? Quoting the yellowish statues leave the enemies of Russia. There are so many of them on the net.
            2. nerd.su
              nerd.su 1 May 2014 01: 25
              +1
              Quote: kaa_andrey
              For example, the working day for them at the construction of the Murmansk Railway lasted 12 hours. They lived in dugouts and huts, were deprived of medical care. Of course, that was not good. But: the Chinese workers and peasants came to a foreign country in search of work, which was difficult to find in their homeland. Therefore, they did not have the right immediately upon arrival in a foreign country to claim for themselves the rights and guarantees that extended to Russian workers.

              Let us leave for now the very fact of using the Chinese in the construction of the Murmansk railway. But here
              Therefore, they did not have the right immediately upon arrival in a foreign country to demand for themselves the rights and guarantees that extended to Russian workers.
              is perplexing. Did the Russian workers have a shorter working day and live in better conditions? Before the revolution, these were the working conditions of any workers in Russia, which is why the revolution won. Around everything, the rest of the text about the Chinese Red Guards comes out a little. Trotsky's case and his speech are alive ...
              1. Alexey N
                Alexey N 1 May 2014 08: 10
                -1
                Right. It's time to audit bookshelves. Lies, slander, misinformation, but sold as a story.
          2. Boa kaa
            Boa kaa 1 May 2014 00: 19
            +3
            Quote: Alexey N
            that’s who the Trans-Siberian Railway turns out to be for us! Sensation!!! And we didn’t know.

            You know, it was also a sensation for me that at the beginning of the 150 century, 20 thousand Chinese people built the St. Petersburg-Romanov railway on Murom (now Murmansk).
    2. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 1 May 2014 00: 12
      +1
      Quote: Samurai3X
      On the one hand, the history of the border between Russia and China is very dark and we actually moved the flags very far

      Of course it's bad to give your land to a neighbor. But what is better: peace and harmony or tension, suspicion, expectation of a provocation that could escalate into a regional conflict.
      About the earth. The map shows a newly demarcated territory.
      1. Alexey N
        Alexey N 1 May 2014 08: 17
        0
        But what is better: peace and harmony or tension, suspicion, expectation of a provocation that could escalate into a regional conflict.

        Not a problem! China has a new claim. Now in Altai they have found native Chinese land.
  13. vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 April 30 2014 09: 15
    +6
    Life has shown that there are no eternal friends, for that matter, we all considered the Bulgarians brothers, so what? Russia in difficult times helped many, took many under the wing. Georgia, which Russia saved, today is not just a neighbor, an enemy. Back to China, Yes, China stands up to its full height, becomes strong both from the economic side and the military. However, we will not throw stones and sow panic ahead of time. In China, unlike the United States and Europe, politicians are smart and very pragmatic, because in this situation they understand that it is better to agree with Russia than to conflict. What will happen in the future? As one wise proverb says: Either the padishah will die, or the donkey will die. Therefore, let us live by realities today, and look at tomorrow without panic. We must build a country, raise the economy, industry, this is our tomorrow's strength. And China, well, if we are smart and strong, China will walk alongside, and not stand opposite.
  14. pink
    pink April 30 2014 09: 16
    +2
    “But not everything is so simple: experts say that in the coming decades the Chinese economy will overheat, followed by a powerful social explosion. To contain negative trends, the Celestial Empire will try to channel protest sentiments through external aggression, and at the same time will try to seize the resources of the Russian Far East. Do we need such a "friend" and what to do with him? "

    Overheating of the Chinese economy has been predicted for about fifteen years, but it (the Chinese economy) is not overheating. And why, even if it overheats, do we have to go to our Far East? Is there little Taiwan? Here are other experts who say that you need to be friends with China repeat
  15. Alez
    Alez April 30 2014 09: 18
    -3
    The population of the male part of the population of China is 140 million more than the female. Men of military age 450 million people. If this mass is sent to Russia, for China it will be insignificant, at least they will seize the raw material areas and equalize the imbalance in the population. We must not forget that the Asians in the wars are very cruel, our population will be cut to the root. They will not spend bullets, they will kill with improvised means. Moreover, we do not forget commonplace truths, wars have been waged since primitive times over resources and territories. I am more than sure that in the next decade, China will set us up, he will attack, our politicians know this, therefore the Army in the Far East is not strengthening, because it is useless to build defenses on the border, they will be circumvented as the Brest Fortress. Indirect evidence China builds rocky roads with us on the borders with us, for massive transportation of troops and the subsequent border crossing. It will not be possible to stop an avalanche of several millions if they advance along the entire perimeter. We are afraid to use nuclear weapons in our territory. So get ready for war who has eggs. First get permission for smoothbore, after 5 years for rifled. Have a way out, you need to have a house in the village with supplies and conditions where you can take your loved ones out of the city, where loved ones can survive for a long time while you are at war.
    1. Dejavu
      Dejavu April 30 2014 09: 25
      -2
      Have you tried writing fables?
      1. Professor
        Professor April 30 2014 10: 24
        0
        Quote: Alez
        The population of the male part of the population of China is 140 million more than the female.

        Your data is not accurate. Officially, the population of China is 1.355.692.576. Not officially 1.5 billion. Distribution by gender and age:
        0-14 years: 17.1% (male 124,340,516 / female 107,287,324)
        15-24 years: 14.7% (male 105,763,058 / female 93,903,845)
        25-54 years: 47.2% (male 327,130,324 / female 313,029,536)
        55-64 years: 9.6% (male 77,751,100 / female 75,737,968)
        65 years and over: 9.4% (male 62,646,075 / female 68,102,830) (2014 est.)
        Total men more than women on 43.013.184 officially, not officially 50 million. Otherwise, you are right. These peasants would never find a woman for themselves, not only to create a family, but also to satisfy hormonal needs. This is a disastrous problem for the Chinese government. Ideally, if they could reduce these 50 million men, then this would solve many problems for them. There are not many ways to reduce, war or emigration. The world can take up to a million Chinese hard workers, but it will not solve the problem. But the war with millions of victims can even the situation.
        1. vladstro
          vladstro April 30 2014 12: 03
          0
          Create small sabotage groups of one million people in each laughing and send them west and south laughing
          1. Canep
            Canep April 30 2014 19: 06
            0
            From the northern border with Canada for the southern with Mexico in the United States - 1800 km. If you build a Chinese army mobilized up to 70.000.000 from the northern to southern border with an interval of 1 meter, you get 38 lines. Even if you build an unmobilized army, you get almost 2 lines.
    2. Samurai3X
      Samurai3X April 30 2014 09: 32
      +7
      China has a huge number of neighbors who can be urgent Chineseization.
      I didn’t read such a stream of fables for a long time ... You did not think that roads could be for trade?
      And how do you imagine this, China is attacking Russia? NF of the Russian Federation will be applied not in its territory, but in China. Their missiles are the ultimate primitive and are easily intercepted. But if we shy away from industrial areas, then it will not seem enough.
      Moreover, now the war is not decided by the amount of cannon fodder, which China has a lot of. The sense of these 450 million if there is practically nothing to transport them on? Or do you think that in China there are so many armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles?

      Moreover, in 2012, 50% of the equipment of this military district was modernized
      http://topwar.ru/17376-voennaya-tehnika-v-dalnevostochnom-okruge-modernizirovana
      -na-50.html
      Whose fantasies are we reading?
      1. 225chay
        225chay April 30 2014 09: 50
        +2
        Quote: Samurai3X
        The sense of these 450 million if there is practically nothing to transport them on? Or do you think that in China there are so many armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles?

        back in the late 70s during military service we were shown the capabilities of the Chinese army.
        Infantry can safely move up to 80 km per day.
        But the technique of movement struck))
        1. Setrac
          Setrac April 30 2014 12: 51
          +2
          Quote: 225chay
          back in the late 70s during military service we were shown the capabilities of the Chinese army.
          Infantry can safely move up to 80 km per day.
          But the technique of movement struck))

          They may have at least a quadrillion infantry in China. The army must be equipped so that it can fight and simply did not die of starvation, but here China is far from ice. In the event of a hypothetical conflict between China and Russia in the Far East, troops of comparable strength will fight.
      2. JonnyT
        JonnyT April 30 2014 16: 15
        +1
        in addition, we can say that the Chinese also have poor air defense and air force, the Chinese systems are very poor in counteracting electronic warfare .... what's the use of armadas that cannot be covered from the air?
    3. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 April 30 2014 09: 47
      +5
      Do you even understand what you are writing?
      Quote: Alez
      The population of the male part of the population of China is 140 million more than the female. Men of military age 450 million people. If this mass is sent to Russia, for China it will not be significant

      In your opinion, the Chinese are something like ants, how many do not push them will attack anyway, they are the same people as everyone, and the death of several hundred and even more than several thousand people affects the psychology of the rest very negatively. This is the first. Second, how would you not want to belittle the abilities of our army, and our soldiers, and among other things those who are in reserve, nobody has taken away the ability to fight from the Russian soldier. And the last one is how many times you need to repeat that there is also nuclear weapons, maybe you think that we don’t have the courage to use it, you are mistaken. So stop talking nonsense
      1. Alez
        Alez April 30 2014 10: 43
        +1
        I do not belittle the abilities of our army, read carefully. You do not shine to fight by age. When we fight with weapons, you just have to write angry comments if the Internet is available. Politicians, not the people, use nuclear weapons. Plus, China is also developing nuclear weapons. In 20 years, China has achieved serious power, the technical backlog is minimal, and what will happen in 10 years? And what about us, the decline in demography, the mass departure of residents from the Far East. So when we have women with 3,4 children each, then I will become optimistic and believe that China is our ally.
        1. Boa kaa
          Boa kaa 1 May 2014 00: 48
          +1
          Quote: Alez
          That's when we have women on 3,4 baby will give birth,

          Demography is really a problem. But you are not an extra, but a normal, living person! Therefore, I want to ask you: HOW DO YOU REPRESENT 3 AND 0,4 OF A MAN AT CHILDBIRTH? belay
          It would be better if they wrote in a human way: "when each family will have 3-4 children."
      2. Common sense
        Common sense April 30 2014 14: 26
        0
        Yes, unfortunately for everyone else it is. Like ants, they will climb on a thorn and on machine guns, take in numbers. In Vietnam, they did so, the terrible truth. They are ideological, they do not mind themselves.
    4. ussr1960
      ussr1960 April 30 2014 15: 18
      -1
      Bravo! The US State Department is resting ... spring exacerbation. It happens. Will pass. lol
    5. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 1 May 2014 00: 35
      +1
      Quote: Alez
      We are afraid to use nuclear weapons in our territory.

      Why NUCLEAR at once? Have you tried a vacuum bomb? - No? OU highly recommend! And there is more ... However, you still have not heard about the "rubber bomb". A pity, a good anecdote!
      1. Kasym
        Kasym 1 May 2014 02: 01
        +1
        China would keep its territory. XUAR, Tibet, Canton (Guangzhou), Inner Mongolia. It has territorial disputes almost all over the east, south and southwest. Unresolved issue with Taiwan.
        And to have nuclear Russia in enemies as well, the PRC is not profitable. So do not escalate passions. The West is only dreaming of the PRC and the Russian Federation. hi
  16. inkass_98
    inkass_98 April 30 2014 09: 18
    +9
    The article is correct. I have always affirmed and will affirm - China is our partner and travel companion at this stage, but it cannot be recorded as allies, we are too different and see the future differently. You can’t rule them, they’ll sit on your head. It is also the East, and it understands and respects only power.
  17. The comment was deleted.
  18. Energet1k_
    Energet1k_ April 30 2014 09: 20
    +1
    I think in the short term (10-20 years) China will be our main ally, there is no other choice. We will not pull the war on 2 fronts. The main thing is to use this "respite" correctly - to develop the domestic industry and markets as quickly as possible, it is not stupid to sell raw materials until they are over! And then, when the Chinese have nothing to eat / drink / live, here and a fool, it is clear where they will direct their eyes!
  19. Roman1970
    Roman1970 April 30 2014 09: 27
    +2
    We need to be friends with China nowhere to go. But very carefully ... In general, the pace of their development can only be envied ...
    1. Boris55
      Boris55 April 30 2014 09: 35
      -2
      Quote: Roman1970
      We need to be friends with China nowhere to go.

      This has long been the case. Three major civilizations have formed in the world: European, Russian and Eastern. Nikita, pushing China doomed Russian civilization to defeat. The union of us with China - doomed European civilization to their defeat. Given the accelerating passage of time, we do not have to wait 40 years (53 + 40 = 93). Everything will happen much faster ...
  20. Orik
    Orik April 30 2014 09: 33
    -1
    NO and will not, if it is a good partner, it is already great.
  21. rezident
    rezident April 30 2014 09: 36
    +3
    Swift this business. It’s one thing that the drunken west, which, albeit an adversary, but which has something to lose, will not get into an outright adventure. Another thing is China, where one and a half billion people and the majority are poor fatalists. In general, they correctly say that the world is a system of checks and balances.
    1. Samurai3X
      Samurai3X April 30 2014 09: 42
      +4
      Are you talking about the West, if not about an adventurer? Seriously?
      Does the history of invasions, overthrows, and "democratization" of countries since the 1990s bother you? While China once poked into Vietnam, they slapped him there and he calmed down.
      For the 10 centuries, the population of China has been living purely for a meal.
      This is for the United States must now be monitored. They have a population that is VERY good living, now slipping into poverty. This is really dangerous.
      1. andj61
        andj61 April 30 2014 14: 10
        +1
        Quote: Samurai3X
        Are you talking about the West, if not about an adventurer? Seriously?
        Does the history of invasions, overthrows, and "democratization" of countries since the 1990s bother you?


        The West attacks only if it has an overwhelming superiority. Otherwise, he does not get involved in anything.
  22. ammunition
    ammunition April 30 2014 09: 45
    +9
    China and Russia are natural geostrategic allies. Like .. like two people pressed backs to each other.
    -------------
    But. When "perestroika" won in our country, China was seriously alarmed. Because getting America (USA) along the entire northern and western border was a wild nightmare for China.
    Therefore, China then took hasty steps for future defense.
    -------------
    Here is the Urals. On the picture. Do not think that this is grass on stones. These are decent Christmas trees. And the hollow behind them is located at 1 (one) kilometer lower. So the places are abs. impassable for any equipment.
    -------------
    So that's it. There is "one hole". Strategic pass Urenga. On which one company can hold back an army. You can't pass by. The nearest detour - either through Orenburg .. or Yekaterinburg.
    ---------
    Until the 1998 year, the Chinese held near this pass near the battlion. Disguised as agricultural workers. Then they quickly turned and left. Completely. Because there is no danger that Russia will completely fall under America.
    ------------
    So it goes. )))
    However - IMHO. winked
  23. umah
    umah April 30 2014 09: 49
    +8
    We look who Khramchikhin is:

    Participates as an expert in television and radio programs.
    Adheres to extremely pessimistic views on the prospects of the Russian army and military-industrial complex

    On sites and blogs devoted to the army and military development, Khramchikhin's ideas were harshly criticized. In general, Khramchikhin is reproached for exaggerating the Chinese threat to Russia. Critics believe that he is not analyzing the likelihood of China’s aggression against Russia, but interpreting any facts in favor of this idea.

    In addition, in the analysis of Khramchikhin's theses, carried out by a leading researcher at the Center for Strategic Problems of Northeast Asia and the Shanghai Cooperation Organization of the Institute of the Far East of the Russian Academy of Sciences, candidate of military sciences Yuri Vasilyevich Morozov, it is noted that Alexander Khramchikhin exaggerates the problem of overpopulation of China and the lack of minerals, which , in his opinion, can only be solved by the seizure of Russian territories, exaggerates the power of the Chinese army, and also does not understand modern tactics in Denia fighting, failure scenarios of Chinese invasion based on the experience of the Second World War and ignoring environmental factors.

    On 7 of August 2008 of the year, the day before the outbreak of war in South Ossetia, Alexander Khramchikhin stated that he excludes the scenario of armed conflict


    In short, iksperd and all-companion. These are the people who sing about the Chinese threat.
    1. ksan
      ksan April 30 2014 12: 22
      +3
      In short, iksperd and all-companion. These are the people who sing about the Chinese threat.
      And also this "analyst" in some of his opuses suggests almost lying under NATO in order to resist the "Chinese threat" ...... Leads to "bad thoughts" fellow
  24. Sergg
    Sergg April 30 2014 09: 59
    -1
    China must be prepared for possible backstabs from China


    Gold words!!! In the ears would be our leadership. Now we need to focus on protecting the East from the possible aggressor of China, not to wait when it smells fried.
  25. intsurfer
    intsurfer April 30 2014 10: 00
    +1
    Quote: Horst78
    The Chinese are traders, it’s easier for them to negotiate than to fight.

    Read Sun Tzu's "The Art of War" - it explains a lot. The army is the very last resort to profit. If you can buy the same oil and gas for a cheap price, why go to fight over them? To get millions of partisans later, do you have to strain yourself and live in difficult natural conditions?
  26. Alex_Popovson
    Alex_Popovson April 30 2014 10: 08
    +6
    - Is China an ally?
    - No, China is a cunning fellow traveler
  27. iulai
    iulai April 30 2014 10: 32
    +1
    We need to pray that the United States does not lose its power! The US will weaken, China will swallow us without choking! Then the Yankees will seem to be the pupils of a kindergarten. Only one thing can save Russia - the development of the Far East, and this will happen only if the country's capital is moved to the East.
    1. ammunition
      ammunition April 30 2014 10: 52
      +1
      Quote: iulai
      The US will weaken, China will swallow us without choking!


      If the United States is weakened, China will not make sense to go north at all. By the way, the border with China goes almost along the border of the permafrost. )
      --------
      If there is no USA, China will trample into Africa, the oil Middle East, and Latin America. And trample on almost empty Australia! The whole warm continent. In Australia, the cost of infrastructure in 10 is (ten) times less than in Siberia. Yes, and the Resort ..
      -----------
      China, even in Ukraine, was only interested in Crimea. laughing laughing laughing
      -----------
      Do you want him to float on Kolyma? belay
      1. Setrac
        Setrac April 30 2014 12: 56
        +1
        Quote: ammunition
        By the way, the border with China goes almost along the border of the permafrost. )

        I want to draw attention to the fact that the border of the NATO-countries of the Warsaw Treaty also ran along the temperature gradient, so the GDR was in the Warsaw Treaty, but Yugoslavia was not.
        1. ammunition
          ammunition April 30 2014 16: 20
          0
          Quote: Setrac
          I want to draw attention to the fact that the border of the NATO-countries of the Warsaw Treaty also ran along the temperature gradient, so the GDR was in the Warsaw Treaty, but Yugoslavia was not.


          Well yes! Exactly!
          China would also be glad if Russia joined the military bloc led by China! And to economically comply.
          But! voluntarily. Just .. like (for example) Poland voluntarily joined NATO.
      2. de bouillon
        de bouillon April 30 2014 13: 50
        +1
        For almost 200 years, Russia has fought with China in Siberian lands. And made them leave

        so the Chinese lived there and consider for themselves that these lands are theirs.

        you will find the rest yourself, as Siberia was mastered over the course of 16-19 centuries.
        1. ammunition
          ammunition April 30 2014 16: 09
          +1
          Quote: de Bouillon
          For almost 200 years, Russia has fought with China in Siberian lands. And made them leave

          so the Chinese lived there and consider for themselves that these lands are theirs.


          In truth. I don’t know anything about this.
          I even know about Ermak. But he did not fight the Chinese. And you can’t compare Yermak’s "war" ... for example, with the Battle of Molodi.
          ----------
          In the 16-19 centuries, Russia had many wars. And the battles were great.
          Maybe all the same it was not a war with great China. (and he was great). but just hassles? Not even with the Chinese, but with the Manjuris .. Manjurs in those days were warlike people.
          -----------
          If just skirmishes .. like in Damansky .. then this is "not
          considered " repeat
          ---------------
          I mean this .-
          If Suvorov and Rumyantsev fought in Moldova, and they took Moldova from the Turks. The way Moldovans lived in Moldova - they live like that.
          And in Siberia and the Far East, no Chinese population was observed. Absolutely.
          Where did they go (if they were)?
          So they were not there.
          Buryats remained .. even Orochs remained .. Yakuts by itself - by itself .. Where are the Chinese?
  28. Kornilovets
    Kornilovets April 30 2014 10: 42
    +4
    There is only one conclusion !!!

    How not paradoxically to study, study, study ....

    Develop the industry!

    Develop defense industry!

    Develop, rearm the army and navy!

    and rely only on yourself! and play on the contradictions of "partners" ... And there are a lot of them!
  29. yurik
    yurik April 30 2014 10: 54
    +3
    while the Chinese accumulate strength for world domination
  30. ururu
    ururu April 30 2014 10: 56
    +1
    You need to be friends with the head, the rest by itself will work out
  31. Anton K
    Anton K April 30 2014 11: 11
    +4
    In my opinion, the article is absolutely correct.

    In general, it is very sad that they are not looking for us as allies, as it was before, but we are trying to make friends more successfully. For a quarter of a century they entered western globalization, now we don’t know how to get out of there and are rushing to China for help.

    From forty to sixty percent we get food from the West, now we will replace (if necessary) Chinese? If you still haven’t gone too far from genetically modified products, there will certainly not be any salvation from Chinese chemistry — this is how Chinese agriculture is described in any case.

    And, most importantly, what I would like to ask military observers about and get an answer: we have been saying for a long time that our integrity depends on the nuclear shield that the USSR left us (thanks to Stalin and Beria). And in what condition is it today? I read here that Putin from the south-east of Ukraine is inviting us to deal with related experts in this area and reflect on what I asked above.
    1. abc_alex
      abc_alex April 30 2014 14: 08
      0
      Quote: Anton K
      And in what condition is it today? I read here that Putin from the south-east of Ukraine is inviting us to deal with related experts in this area and reflect on what I asked above.


      Well, Rosatom seems to be working, so we have enrichment. We can also get plutonium at fast neutron reactors. I don’t need to talk about rockets, I think.
      And you need to call specialists. In any case.
      1. Anton K
        Anton K April 30 2014 14: 29
        0
        Quote: abc_alex


        Well, Rosatom seems to be working, so we have enrichment. We can also get plutonium at fast neutron reactors. I don’t need to talk about rockets, I think.
        And you need to call specialists. In any case.


        Thank you!
        I think you speak competently. I just had to read specialists who say that factories of the South-East of Ukraine (regarding all flying and floating military equipment) are extremely important for our defense service, having lost which, we will have to create a lot at home. In this regard, specialists are, of course, necessary; but factories ...
  32. nahalenok911
    nahalenok911 April 30 2014 11: 43
    +1
    Yes, with the Chinese you need to keep an eye out! Watching how Chinese citizens behave in Russia, I am often horrified. And I judge not by the employees of bazaars and markets, but by those who can afford to stay at a 5 * hotel.
  33. GRune
    GRune April 30 2014 12: 18
    +2
    Yesterday I wrote that China is not an ally to us, maybe only in the short term we will be with them along the way, until the Pindos are exhausted, and then we will have to fight with them! Damn the pancake.
    Russia has only two allies: army and navy
    Here is a true thought from all sides!
    1. Sour
      Sour April 30 2014 16: 29
      0
      Quote: GRune
      Russia has only two allies: army and navy
      Here is a true thought from all sides!

      A true thought ...
      But in 1917 and 1991, neither the army nor the navy saved the country.
      Moreover, in 1917, the fleet was one of the main destabilizing factors.
      The armed forces are a good ally, but only if they are steered correctly.
  34. Diviz
    Diviz April 30 2014 12: 33
    -1
    If Putin raises with them for his health on his birthday, then I think it's worth it.
  35. SIT
    SIT April 30 2014 12: 40
    -1
    Yes, to hell with them to fight with us? From 2009 to 2012, the Rothschilds transported 1200 tons of gold to the Chinese banking zone. The headquarters of the Rothschilds moved from London to Hong Kong. When they close the American project and announce that the dollar is a type of indoor wallpaper, then China will become one of the new centers of the world. They will not have to fight. Everyone will queue up for their yuan and government bonds. We must have time to push forward in this line and become extremely beneficial to China. We are just in the middle between them and the EU. You can make great money on this.
    1. de bouillon
      de bouillon April 30 2014 13: 46
      0
      did the granny at the entrance say?
  36. Anton Gavrilov
    Anton Gavrilov April 30 2014 13: 00
    0
    Somehow the development of cooperation does not fit, will lead to the loss of the Far East ??? If the preconditions for confrontation suddenly begin, we just stop cooperation with them that's all.
  37. Dragon-y
    Dragon-y April 30 2014 13: 05
    0
    The author also read the book "The Bear and the Dragon" by Tom Clancy? .. :)
  38. Cossacks
    Cossacks April 30 2014 13: 08
    0
    China will cooperate, but on condition that Russia agrees to second roles. And with the accumulation of sufficient military power, it will definitely deal with Siberia and the Far East.
  39. de bouillon
    de bouillon April 30 2014 13: 45
    -1
    http://ru.jn1.tv/video/news/glava-pentagona-posetil-voennyy-parad-v-kitae.html

    And recently, the US Department of Defense visited China. I met with cadets and visited the parade ...
  40. abc_alex
    abc_alex April 30 2014 14: 01
    +1
    Those who scare China's expansion in the form of war forget that with such a ratio of nuclear arsenals as that of the Russian Federation and China, a war with us is simply meaningless for them. Their industrial production is located relatively compactly and it is much easier for Russia to "glaze" the overwhelming part of the Chinese potential than it is for China to hit all the facilities of the Russian strategic nuclear forces. And the fact that the war with China will be nuclear is not in doubt. With a ratio of 1, 12 committees are at war (1945), China is capable of mobilizing up to 100 million people. No country will be able to oppose anything to such an army except weapons of mass destruction. This is an axiom.
    For the war, the Chinese are much more interested in the southern direction. There are specials. The warhead is smaller and the climate is warmer. Why climb on the angry and frozen Russians when there are such "colossi" like Vietnam, Myanmar, Laos, Thailand, Cambodia, Malaysia nearby? And there you look, and the South China Sea can be made internal.
  41. delfinN
    delfinN April 30 2014 14: 03
    -4
    Angela Merkel presented this card, like the 19th century, to the Chinese during her visit to China. Red indicates the territory withdrew to the Russian Empire. The Chinese did not have such a card. Question: Why does Germany need this when Germany itself didn’t exist on the maps of that century.
    1. maxxdesign
      maxxdesign April 30 2014 15: 13
      +4
      don't tell my crutches! this is the same 19th century map as i am a black man! I studied as a cartographer ... there were no such colorful maps in the 19th century, in general there were problems with paper .. this is a modern map and drawn on a computer, not even by hand. and 19th century maps were something like this ...
      1. delfinN
        delfinN April 30 2014 17: 16
        0
        Of course, I am not a cartographer or a gambler, but I took the information here.
        http://zn.ua/WORLD/angela-merkel-podarila-si-czinpinu-pervuyu-tochnuyu-kartu-kit
        aya-s-territoriyami-rossii-na-ney-foto-142355_.html
        1. de bouillon
          de bouillon April 30 2014 17: 33
          +1
          if you carefully watched your link, you would see the original map and pay attention to where this border is. it doesn’t coincide with your picture, which was invented by stupid Hohlyad ruling authors

          partially only the coastal region falls near the border with the DPRK
  42. delfinN
    delfinN April 30 2014 14: 05
    -3
    And here is a map of Europe. Where is doychland?
  43. andj61
    andj61 April 30 2014 14: 26
    0
    In the long historical perspective, China has practically not won anyone. The truth was Tibet, Xinjiang, Mongolia, but their annexation was under foreign dynasties. The expansion of China almost always happened according to the same scenario: foreigners fought with China and defeated it (Huns, Mongols, Manchus, etc.) Further, the invaders founded a new dynasty, and after two generations there was no trace of the invaders: they all became Chinese.
    Russia, of course, should be wary of both "peaceful" and military expansion of China, but now, at this historical stage, China and I cannot be anything other than allies. But it is also necessary to look after China closely.
    At the same time, we should immediately take measures to settle Siberia and the Far East. The Chinese can simultaneously send 100-200 million people to Siberia to settle Siberia, and we have only about 20 million people living in the Urals.
    1. ussr1960
      ussr1960 April 30 2014 15: 42
      0
      Quote: andj61
      At the same time, we should immediately take measures to settle Siberia and the Far East.

      And where do you get those who want to populate Siberia and the Far East today? At one time in the USSR, people went there for earnings that exceeded earnings in the rest of the country. As a rule, people went already to a certain place of work, with a certain salary and normal living conditions. Plus, housing and lifting were provided upon arrival at the place of work. What is provided now?
  44. Bayonet
    Bayonet April 30 2014 14: 44
    0
    Somehow I came across such a statement by the Chinese regarding economic expansion to the Far East - “We are developing the Far East not because we need it, but because you don’t need it!” What is it?
  45. Lone wolf
    Lone wolf April 30 2014 14: 48
    0
    And I think that Russia and China should be friends! Katya must think that there wouldn’t be such garbage on their borders as Russia (Ukraine).
  46. twviewer
    twviewer April 30 2014 15: 00
    -1
    Nobody needs a weak ally, as long as you change gas to thongs, nobody will take you seriously. As for the seizure of the territory, it is certainly not for the Chinese to compete with the Russians. Is a long mutually beneficial cooperation possible? decide for yourself: we have thousands of years of experience in armed struggle, minerals, military-industrial complex. They have loans for the restoration of industry, equipment, production facilities, Western technology. Both we and they have a common rival ... so what are the conclusions ?! :)
  47. maxxdesign
    maxxdesign April 30 2014 15: 08
    +1
    all the lands that the Chinese rented in the Far East for growing agricultural products after them came into complete ecological unsuitability! the Chinese are like parasites ... they do not protect nature and do not think that it will be necessary to continue to live .. you can shit the whole globe .. and then what? evolve fast in waterfowl? and shit in the oceans? friendship, friendship, and grow the earth!
  48. Free Island
    Free Island April 30 2014 15: 14
    +1
    as already zae..alie these pi..boly with their "mass settlement" by the Chinese of the Far East..there is no mass settlement, it's me, as a resident of the Far East, I say, all this is nonsense! Masses of migrants from the former USSR with Asian stupid mugs who do not speak Russian and feel like masters here (until the first kick in the snout) - here THEY settle in, but about the Chinese, there will be enough fairy tales for people to put their booty in their ears
  49. Free wind
    Free wind April 30 2014 15: 14
    -1
    Is China our ally? What for such a friend. Saying that Chinese technology is bad or backward, aren't you tired? Yes, the Chinese are copying the technique, maybe ??? copies are worse than the original. but there are a lot of clones. Yes, here on the site, the other day there was information that the Afghan Mujahideen fought with our troops with Chinese weapons. This, as I understand it, is a friendly act towards the USSR? China is not a friend to us, as long as the partner is yes. Overpopulated China is just awful. When I hear a message like, a village of hin hu with a population of 180, eyes are climbing on his forehead. They bred there like locusts, and this is a huge problem. and they will decide it. And I don’t think that it’s at the expense of the south, well, why should China fight India? there are more than one billion of the wimps. Let’s take Malaysia, and so there are already more than 40% of the Chinese, also a creeping expansion. with yap, but why? why the conflict with the evil Yap, for bare land, in Japan, after all, there is nothing nichrome. The conclusion is disappointing. With the upcoming holiday for all, I wish everyone a good rest, and now I’m probably going to scrub a few grams that way! HOLIDAY !!!!!
  50. Signaller
    Signaller April 30 2014 15: 38
    0
    I think China does not need our land. It's cold here. Radish does not grow without warming the soil. Such a bad climate, however. Personal opinion, I do not insist.