Military Review

The fleet's long arm: the future of the ships of the ocean zone

74
An important attribute of a superpower is a powerful naval force. To solve a number of tasks inherent the fleet leading state of the world, the Navy must meet a number of requirements. First of all, it is a quantitative and qualitative composition: there should be a large number of modern ships in service. In addition, the fleet of a superpower must be ready to carry out appropriate combat missions. One of the main capabilities of such naval forces is the ability to perform combat missions at a great distance from the bases, in so-called. ocean zone.


After a long break, Russia is taking steps to revive its navy. Contracts have already been signed for the construction of more than 40 ships and submarines, about half of which are already under construction. According to existing plans, over the next few years, the Russian Navy will receive several dozen ships, submarines and auxiliary vessels each year. The focus is now on the construction of guard ships of the near and far sea zone, as well as multi-purpose nuclear submarines and strategic submarine-launched missile carriers.

Despite the limited capabilities, the military department and the leadership of the shipbuilding industry should already take into account the prospects for the development of the Navy. One of the most difficult issues in this area is the creation and operation of ship groups capable of operating in the ocean zone. Now such capabilities of the Russian Navy are limited, since the number of ships capable of solving various tasks at a great distance from the bases is small. Of the existing surface ships in the ocean zone, only the Admiral of the Soviet Union Kuznets fleet, the nuclear-powered nuclear cruiser Peter the Great, three 1164 Atlant cruisers and nine large anti-submarine ships 1155 and 11551 Frigate can operate.

It is not difficult to guess that all the available ships of the ocean zone will remain in service in the foreseeable future. However, the moral and material obsolescence of equipment, equipment and weapons will require taking appropriate measures. It is already known about the plans of the Navy to modernize existing ships. As expected, the planned repair and upgrade of the ships will preserve or even increase their potential.



Now in the Russian Navy there is only one aircraft-carrying cruiser - “Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov”. Construction of new ships of this class is not planned yet, as a result of which timely modernization of the only available cruiser is required. Several years ago it became known that in the middle of the current decade (according to other data, in the second half of it) the aircraft carrying cruiser Admiral Kuznetsov would be docked for repair and modernization. According to reports, unused Granit missile launchers are being dismantled from the ship, which will increase the volume of aircraft and other payloads. In addition, it is possible that the composition of anti-aircraft weapons will be changed. The exact dates of commencement of work have not yet called.

While the “Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov” is waiting for the fleet command to determine the repair time, another large ship is preparing for transfer to the bulk basin of the Sevmash plant (Severodvinsk). The heavy nuclear missile cruiser “Admiral Nakhimov” of the 11442 “Orlan” project will be overhauled and upgraded before 2018. This ship was taken out of the fleet for a long time and was waiting for its fate. About a year ago, a repair contract was signed. Now the workers of the Sevmash plant dismantle some of the cruiser units and units and are preparing it for transfer to the bulk pool. Details of the modernization of "Admiral Nakhimov" has not yet been reported. Apparently, the ship will receive new missile weapons, both strike and anti-aircraft.



Shortly after the repair and modernization of the Admiral Nakhimov cruiser, similar work should be carried out on the Peter the Great ship of the same project. Details of this modernization also remain unknown, although it can be assumed that the flagship of the Northern Fleet will return to service in the early twenties. It remains an open question about the future of the two other TARK project 1144. The ships "Kirov" and "Admiral Lazarev", as well as the "Admiral Nakhimov", have long ceased their service in the military of the Navy. Their further fate in question. Perhaps, it will be decided later on the modernization of the ships, but we can not exclude a less optimistic outcome of events. For example, the cruiser "Kirov" has a serious damage to the units of the power plant, because of which its repair may be impractical expensive and difficult.

The Russian Navy has three rocket cruisers of the 1164 Atlant project. The ships "Moscow", "Varyag" and "Marshal Ustinov" serve as part of the Northern and Pacific Fleet. In the middle of 2011, the cruiser Marshal Ustinov arrived at the berth of the Zvezdochka shipbuilding plant (Severodvinsk), and repair work started soon. In accordance with the work plans, Zvezdochka employees had to replace half of the ship’s cable routes, replace some elements of electronic equipment, and also rebuild the Bazalt missile system with the П-500 missiles. Initially it was assumed that Marshal Ustinov would return to the fleet in 2014, however, some difficulties led to a shift in deadlines. By the end of this year, it is planned to complete repair work, and the missile system will be restored only in 2015.


Missile cruiser Marshal Ustinov


In the spring of 2013, the scheduled repair of the cruiser Varyag was completed. As far as is known, during the last repairs, the ships of the project “Atlant” have not been subjected to serious modernization, connected with a cardinal upgrade of equipment and weapons. Nevertheless, the works already carried out and being carried out now allow us to keep the ship characteristics at an acceptable level.

The task of fighting submarines in the ocean zone is currently assigned to large anti-submarine ships of the 1155 and 11551 projects. There are four ships of the 1155 project in the Northern and Pacific fleets. The only BOD of the 11551 project, the Admiral Chabanenko, serves as part of the Northern Fleet. The armament of these ships allows you to attack both the submarines and surface ships of the enemy, as well as to carry out air defense. Despite the fairly high performance, the 1155 BOD project needs to be repaired and updated for various systems. For example, the ship "Admiral Kharlamov" has been in reserve for several years and is awaiting a decision on the start of repair.


BOD project 11551, "Admiral Chabanenko"


In March last year, information appeared in the domestic media about the possible modernization of the existing ships of Project 1155. This was reported by the Izvestia publication, citing an unnamed source in the General Staff of the Navy. It was argued that as a result of the planned modernization, large anti-submarine ships will actually change their status, they can be considered destroyers. The source claimed that the ships would receive A-192 artillery mounts, the Caliber multipurpose missile system, and new anti-aircraft missiles. Until the end of last year, the 1st and 2nd central research institutes of the Navy were to prepare terms of reference for the modernization of ships. Given the time required for the development of the project and subsequent repairs with updating, the first modernized BOD will be able to return to operation no earlier than 2016-17. Within a year after the appearance News On the modernization of the BOD of project 1155, no new information appeared in this regard. Perhaps the relevant organizations are still engaged in the formation of technical specifications or the creation of a project. In addition, do not forget that the news was obtained from an unnamed source, and this may be the reason for the corresponding suspicions.

The main hope of the national fleet of the ocean zone is the program "Leader". As part of this project, it is planned to build a number of promising destroyers with modern radio-electronic equipment and the latest weapons. According to reports, in the late eighties, shipbuilding design bureaus began to study the prospects of destroyers. However, the main events around the new project began much later. Until the end of 2009, the Navy command intended to determine the developer of a new project. In 2012, the formation of requirements for a new destroyer was completed, after which design work began.

According to media reports, in 2013, various design organizations were working on their own options for the Leader destroyer. At 2014, the start of development work is scheduled. Thus, the construction of the lead destroyer of the new project will start no earlier than 2016-17, and it will enter the Navy only at the beginning of the next decade. At about the same time, the construction of Leader serial destroyers could begin. For obvious reasons, such dates are tentative and actual dates may differ significantly from them.


Model of one of the variants of the project of the destroyer 21956 Ave. Northern design bureau 2008, IMDS-2009, St. Petersburg, July 2009 (photo - A.V. Karpenko, http://bastion-karpenko.narod.ru)


The development of a promising ship is at its earliest stages, due to which all available information about the new project is extremely scarce and fragmentary. It remains only to make various assumptions that may not be confirmed. Last year it was reported that the destroyer of the project "Leader" can get a conventional or nuclear power plant. The total displacement of the ship can be estimated at 10-12 thousand tons. Apparently, the hull and superstructure of the ship will be made taking into account the so-called. stealth technology, because of what will have a distinctive appearance, formed by large intersecting planes.

The basis of the weapons of the destroyer "Leader", most likely, will be the Caliber missile system with a vertical launcher. Protection against air attacks in the far zone should be assigned to the C-300F. In addition, it cannot be excluded that by the end of the decade a ship version of the C-400 or C-500 complex will be created. At short distances, the destruction of airborne targets will be the task of the Polymer-Redut air defense missile system, as well as missile and artillery systems like the Palash or Pantsir-M complexes. To destroy the enemy's submarines, the ship must carry anti-submarine missiles and jet bomb bombs.

As we see, the construction of ships of the ocean zone is not yet a priority task for the Russian Navy. The economic and political problems of the last decades have forced us to pay more attention to the construction of new ships near and far sea zones. As a result, no new ships capable of operating in the ocean zone will appear in the fleet until the end of this decade. It should be noted that some plans of the Ministry of Defense will affect the total number of combat-ready cruisers and BOD, but this will only be the repair and modernization of existing equipment, and not the construction of new ones.

As follows from the available data, by the end of this decade, the list of Russian ships of the ocean zone will look something like this:
- 1 aircraft carrying cruiser "Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov";
- 2 heavy nuclear missile cruiser 11442 project "Orlan (" Peter the Great "and" Admiral Nakhimov ");
- 3 missile cruiser project 1164 "Atlant" ("Moscow", "Varyag" and "Marshal Ustinov");
- up to 9 large anti-submarine ships of the 1155 and 11551 projects;
- 1 destroyer "Leader".

Out of a dozen of these ships, only one is planned for construction, and about half in the future may be modernized. All this will increase the potential of the Russian Navy in operations in the ocean zone, but such opportunities will still be less than is necessary for a full return to remote areas of the global ocean.

The twenties should be the most important period in the development of the Russian Navy. Exact plans for the next decade have not yet been determined, but the available proposals and statements allow us to present approximate trends in the future development of the Navy. In the twenties, the serial construction of new destroyers "Leader" will begin. Over the past years, the possibility of creating new aircraft carriers, whose construction will begin no earlier than 2020, has been regularly mentioned. In addition, there remains a certain probability that after the cruiser "Peter the Great" repairs will pass his "sistership" - TARK "Admiral Lazarev". Finally, it cannot be excluded that by the second half of the twenties the fleet will receive cruisers or destroyers of a new project, which is not yet in current plans.

Now and in the very near future, the Russian shipbuilding industry will not be able to give the navy a sufficient number of ships of the ocean zone. This situation will change no earlier than the end of this decade. Nevertheless, shipbuilding and the fleet are not going to waste time and are actively engaged in the construction of ships and submarines of other classes. As for the ships of the ocean zone, the fleet will have to exploit the existing BOD and cruisers, from time to time carrying out planned repairs and, possibly, upgrades.


On the materials of the sites:
http://ria.ru/
http://interfax.ru/
http://izvestia.ru/
http://flot.com/
http://vpk-news.ru/
http://bastion-karpenko.narod.ru/
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  1. erased
    erased April 11 2014 08: 14
    +7
    Still, this is not enough for Russia. Although it is not planned to maintain a database far from its land, it is necessary to have at least two full-fledged squadrons, just to perform special tasks.
    1. Sakhalininsk
      Sakhalininsk April 11 2014 09: 00
      +6
      The fleet is a very expensive business, and we are primarily a continental power, so before you coordinate the billions to restore the fleet, you must completely restore the potential of our army, and only then take on the fleet.
      1. Lazy
        Lazy April 11 2014 10: 24
        +6
        It does not interfere!!! It is urgent to restore both the army and the fleet! And so all the 90s and 00s sat.
        1. Sakhalininsk
          Sakhalininsk April 11 2014 17: 01
          +7
          Quote: Lazy
          It does not interfere!!! It is urgent to restore both the army and the fleet! And so all the 90s and 00s sat.


          Do not confuse long with soft !!! The fact that the revival for the fleet of the far zone is necessary is clear, but the cost of toys such as the Eagles, Atlanta or Kuzma is too high, and you can break the navel with a fool. In addition, now it is much more important to ensure the restoration and renewal of air defense, air force and strategic nuclear forces, and you know this, too, is not worth 5 kopecks.
          1. mirag21x
            mirag21x April 13 2014 07: 33
            +2
            Yes, I'm looking strategists !!! You need this, you need this ... There are very competent specialists who are able to cope with this task. In my humble opinion, the task of ordinary Russian citizens is to prevent the degradation and fooling of our society, ESPECIALLY OUR YOUTH. Increasing our own self-esteem and measures of understanding what is happening around us, that is, world global processes. We Russians already have the bitter experience of the nineties, when we almost lost our homeland as a result of a global scam, the so-called "perestroika". Dismemberment of the state, shameful privatization (the people were simply robbed), deprivation of the spirit of patriotism and a sense of pride for their state, deep demoralization of society, this is only part of what our country has suffered. There are wise words: If you want to defeat a strong enemy, raise his children. And they have done this with us and continue to do this, for this in our country the "fifth column" has been created. We ALL need to work ahead of the curve, cleanse our homeland of the evil and the alien! This is the key to the success and revival of Russia!
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. goose
        goose April 11 2014 12: 20
        +3
        The most powerful SF ships are the Tu-22M3. Therefore, aviation is needed first. Instead of one Project 1155, you can buy and place 12 Su-34 + 2 Il-38. Well, what will be more useful for the Federation Council?
        1. Boa kaa
          Boa kaa April 11 2014 20: 44
          +3
          Quote: goose
          The most powerful ships of the SF are the Tu-22М3.

          Well, why not the Tu-160? In 2's, one should not confuse the solid with the long. Aviation has its own tasks, the naval fleet has its own tasks. You will not deny that the aircraft will not be able to stay 30 days off the eastern coast of USers and carry out the tasks of tracking the deployment of SSBNs.
          Quote: goose
          Therefore, aviation is needed first.

          That's just the point that you still need yesterday: both airplanes and ships. But the composition of aviation to increase faster than ship. And the cost of the aircraft is several times less than the ship of the ocean zone. But! The fleet is primarily ships: surface and underwater, for various purposes and displacement. Without them, the task of confronting the aggressor fleet is not feasible. The aircraft cannot for a long time fulfill the task of ensuring a military presence in a remote area of ​​the sea theater.
          Quote: goose
          Well, what will be more useful for the Federation Council?

          A combat-ready balanced naval association (NK + PLA), covered by ship and coastal aviation to the entire depth of the CSF responsibility area, will be more useful for the KSF.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. bvi1965
        bvi1965 April 11 2014 13: 57
        +3
        It is necessary, at least, to restore, repair and maintain what is present in a combat-ready state.
        1. mirag21x
          mirag21x April 13 2014 07: 47
          0
          There is no word "necessary", there is a word ... Our Russian language, our spiritual wealth, you need to know it, study it whenever possible. I don't want to offend you.
      5. Sergey Vl.
        Sergey Vl. April 12 2014 00: 26
        0
        We are a sea power: our shores are washed by the waters of three oceans. So let's behave accordingly.
    2. Army1
      Army1 April 11 2014 10: 45
      +3
      It would be great to return the Nikolaev shipyards.
      And what about the project 1143.7 "Ulyanovsk", why not just bring it up to date and that's it. Why come up with a triple-medium hypermedium project?
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 10: 51
        +1
        Quote: Army1
        It would be great to return the Nikolaev shipyards.

        What for? There is one continuous ruin.
        Quote: Army1
        And what about the project 1143.7 "Ulyanovsk", why not just bring it up to date and that's it. Why come up with a triple-medium hypermedium project?

        Complex issue. To know what the admirals want ...
        1. saturn.mmm
          saturn.mmm April 11 2014 13: 46
          +1
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          What for? There is one continuous ruin.

          In December, there were still plans to build gas carriers, a contract for 4 billion, now probably all.
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 13: 59
            +3
            We built TAVKRs on ChSZ, and now there are 40 000 of 2 000 workers, and as I understand it, there are three directors for one welder ...
            1. saturn.mmm
              saturn.mmm April 11 2014 16: 57
              0
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              We built TAVKRs on ChSZ, and now there are 40 000 of 2 000 workers, and as I understand it, there are three directors for one welder ...

              Something else is being produced there http://www.nikolayev-shipyard.com/.
          2. The comment was deleted.
        2. Army1
          Army1 April 11 2014 16: 27
          0
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          Complex issue. To know what the admirals want ...

          Here the decision is up to the President.
      2. alex86
        alex86 April 11 2014 18: 57
        0
        Quote: Army1
        It would be great to return the Nikolaev shipyards.

        And the talk about building a large dock for (conditionally) aircraft carriers and talk like that, it seems? ... They also called the cost - 10 billion rubles, I also wrote that I would build for 6 ...
        1. Spstas1
          Spstas1 April 11 2014 20: 40
          +1
          Small introductory - the Zaliv shipyard, Kerch. Already in Russia ...
    3. 1c-inform-city
      1c-inform-city April 11 2014 21: 36
      +5
      Sorry that is not the topic. Today one of the few remaining famous designers died. Creator of the "Oka" complex "Chrysanthemum" and much more. Sergey Pavlovich Invincible! For some reason this news was bypassed on the site. Such people are born once a century. Let the earth rest in peace and there will be worthy successors of his talent!
      1. mirag21x
        mirag21x April 13 2014 07: 50
        +1
        Eternal memory to him ...
  2. Bongo
    Bongo April 11 2014 08: 23
    +8
    Of the available surface ships in the ocean zone, only the Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov aircraft carrier, the Peter the Great heavy nuclear missile cruiser, three 1164 Atlant missile cruisers and nine large 1155 and 11551 Frigate projects can operate.

    Did the author forget about the destroyers of the 956 project?

    The Russian Navy has three missile cruisers of the 1164 Atlant project. ShipsMoscow", "Varangian" and "Marshal Ustinov" serve as part of Northern and Pacific Fleet.

    The missile cruiser "Moskva" is the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet, apparently the author is simply "not in the know."

    aircraft carrier cruiser "Admiral Kuznetsov" put in the dock for repair and modernization. According to reports, unused Granit rocket launchers are being dismantled from the ship, which will increase the volume for aircraft and other payloads.

    It's time.
    1. Nayhas
      Nayhas April 11 2014 08: 32
      0
      Quote: Bongo
      Did the author forget about the destroyers of the 956 project?

      It's time to forget. Boilers have nothing to change ...
      1. Gans1234
        Gans1234 8 September 2014 05: 21
        0
        All Buzzards will be upgraded to 20.
    2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 08: 45
      +2
      Quote: Bongo
      Did the author forget about the destroyers of the 956 project?

      I don't think I forgot, but what do you want from the 956th project? Due to the "peculiarities" of the chassis, these ships cannot be used in the oceanic zone. And to change them the EI ... firstly, it is very expensive, and secondly, a good warship will still not work.
      Quote: Bongo
      It's time.

      Where are the sea pilots? They need a deck, skill cannot be maintained on a thread
      1. Nayhas
        Nayhas April 11 2014 09: 18
        +5
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        Where are the sea pilots? They need a deck, skill cannot be maintained on a thread

        Kuznetsov has huge problems with the power plant. The boilers either not all work, or they do not reach the design capacity. 5-6 knots is the maximum that it produces now. Moreover, it eats fuel oil in huge quantities, according to the passport, it should travel 8000 miles in an economical way, in fact it is 1500 miles. What's the use of such an "aircraft carrier"?
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 10: 05
          +3
          Quote: Nayhas
          The boilers either do not all work, or do not reach their rated capacity. 5-6 nodes is the maximum that it now issues.

          I believe that it can still be more, but that’s not the point
          Quote: Nayhas
          Not only that, it eats fuel oil in huge quantities, according to the passport, 8000 miles must pass in an economical way, really 1500 miles.

          Again, highly unlikely. I remember that someone justified these 1500 miles by saying that the ship reached Britain and was refueling there, but who said that by the time it was refueling it was running out of fuel?
          Quote: Nayhas
          What's the use of such an "aircraft carrier"

          Dear Nayhas, I can't even imagine what needs to be done with the Kuznetsov in order to transfer it from the aircraft carrier to the aircraft carrier. There is no need for repairs, but a complete change of the chassis + a lot of work on fine-tuning the avionics and weapons to a modern and efficient level. In general, if you put it, then at least 5 years. And during this time we will lose what, in general, we need an aircraft carrier - pilots who are able to take off and land on it.
          For good, you need to build some kind of aircraft carrier (Allah with him, even at the level of Vikramaditya), confining himself to the current repair of Kuznetsov, and only when a new one comes into operation, put on a complete re-equipment of Kuznetsov. And he can also be a training AB with the 5 th move nodes.
          1. Nayhas
            Nayhas April 11 2014 12: 08
            -1
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            I remember that someone justified the 1500 miles by saying that the ship reached Britain and was refueling there, but who said that by the time it was refueling it was running out of fuel?

            Fueling at sea is called an operation and for good reason. This is a difficult event requiring qualification of performers. WHY do this if the fuel tanks are not empty? What is the sacred meaning of filling fuel tanks by a quarter?
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            In general, if you put it, it’s at least 5 years old. And during this time we will lose what, in general, we need an aircraft carrier - pilots who are able to take off from it and land on it.

            It’s not scary, there is a Thread, there is a complex in Yeysk. It is worse to lose a ship at all.
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            For good, you need to build some kind of aircraft carrier (Allah with him, even at the level of Vikramaditya), limiting himself to the current repair of Kuznetsov

            Even before the Crimea, I considered this idea illusory, but now I generally attribute it to the section of fiction.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 13: 37
              +1
              Quote: Nayhas
              Fueling at sea is called an operation and for good reason. This is a difficult event requiring qualification of performers. WHY do this if the fuel tanks are not empty? What is the sacred meaning of filling fuel tanks by a quarter?

              1) Training
              2) Replenishment of fuel in a convenient place for this. You read, well, did Rozhestvensky’s squadron load coal when coal pits showed the bottom?
              1. Nayhas
                Nayhas April 11 2014 21: 07
                -2
                Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                1) Training

                Training is when in class, and at sea it is already work. Skill for refueling? Well yes. But not in a military campaign. X-shame before the whole world? Did not have time to go to sea and are already refueling?
                Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                Replenishment of fuel in a convenient place for this.

                Andrei, Kuzya should replenish fuel supply at best in 6-7 thousand miles, that is, already in the Mediterranean Sea. You cannot find a better place for convenience, it is much calmer than off the coast of Scotland where in winter a storm of 6 points is an ordinary occurrence.
                Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                You read, well, did Rozhestvensky’s squadron load coal when coal pits showed the bottom?

                Nebogatov's squadron left Liepaja and the first load of coal was as far as I remember in the Red Sea. The average transition speed was 12 knots. It’s clear that from Liepaja there was no need to get coal loaded at all, because there were no friendly ports on the way, and loading even if anchored from transport is not an easy task. Coal is not fuel oil for you, which can be pumped ...
                1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                  Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 23: 17
                  +1
                  Quote: Nayhas
                  X-shame before the whole world? Did not have time to go to sea and are already refueling?

                  Sorry, but in my opinion only you see this shame.
                  Quote: Nayhas
                  But not in a military campaign.

                  So it’s not like that to a military campaign. And then - you know, when Kuznetsov came out. You know, when he came to the shores of England. But who knows what and how much he did along the way?
                  Quote: Nayhas
                  Andrei, Kuzya should replenish fuel at best through 6-7 thousand miles

                  In no case, you have already been answered below
                  Quote: Nayhas
                  Nebogatov's squadron left Liepaja and the first load of coal was as far as I remember in the Red Sea

                  I doubt it. Rozhdestvensky was loaded for the first time in Small Belta, then Tangier, then Dakar
            3. Boa kaa
              Boa kaa April 11 2014 21: 01
              +1
              Quote: Nayhas
              WHY do this if the fuel tanks are not empty? What is the sacred meaning of filling fuel tanks by a quarter?

              Eugene, good evening! There is such a thing as "irreducible reserves" for peacetime for any ship in the fleet. They are much more than 1/4 of the total!
              In 2's, the headquarters of the fleet will never launch a ship at sea with low reserves. And on the BS, everyone bunkers to the eyeballs and go to the BS bearing area in an economical way. (for pr 1143.2, if memory serves me right, the combat ek.speed was 18,0 knots). At the same time, the fuel oil consumption of the F-5 was 1t per 1 mile of swimming. This, of course, with normally functioning boilers.
        2. dustycat
          dustycat April 11 2014 17: 56
          +1
          Quote: Nayhas
          Kuznetsov has huge problems with the power plant. The boilers either do not all work, or do not reach their rated capacity.

          But who will explain what the hell did they make him a fuel oil rover?
          Vigorous EU goes to the topic itself.
          Or am I misunderstanding something tight?
          It seems that he was not planning to park in nuclear-free ports.
          1. Boa kaa
            Boa kaa April 11 2014 21: 11
            +1
            Quote: dustycat
            But who will explain what the hell did they make him a fuel oil rover?
            For economic reasons. Fuel oil is the cheapest.
            Quote: dustycat
            Vigorous EU goes to the topic itself. Or am I stupidly misunderstanding something?

            The nuclear power plant is good for everyone, except for biological protection. TARK "Kirov" was planned to be built with a displacement of 18 thousand tons. However, the iron-water biosecurity pulled by 7 thousand tons, a total of 25 thousand tons. This is now the VM-650 in a single unit, and earlier it was as it was.
            Quote: dustycat
            It seems that he was not planning to park in nuclear-free ports.

            It was not planned for another reason: as a ship the carrier of nuclear weapons.
          2. Nayhas
            Nayhas April 11 2014 21: 17
            0
            Quote: dustycat
            But who will explain what the hell did they make him a fuel oil rover?

            Because pr. 1143 went with the boilers on the project. To Nimitsy American aircraft carriers also went on boilers.
            Quote: dustycat
            Or am I misunderstanding something tight?
            It seems that he was not planning to park in nuclear-free ports.

            Well, there was a problem with access through the Turkish Straits. Turks could not let go. To exit Kuznetsov had to butt with the Turks, to prove that this is not an aircraft carrier. History is silent how much it cost the USSR. I’m not even imagining how Ulyanovsk was going to withdraw ...
            1. Boa kaa
              Boa kaa April 11 2014 23: 06
              +1
              Quote: Nayhas
              To Nimitsy American aircraft carriers also went on boilers.

              Not exactly. The first nuclear-powered AVU was the Enterprise.
              But you are right: after Nimitz, the states began to build only atomic AVMs.
      2. PLO
        PLO April 11 2014 10: 17
        +1
        Where are the sea pilots? They need a deck, skill cannot be maintained on a thread

        sooner or later Kuznetsov will have to be repaired anyway, but they hope that at this moment we will have a new aircraft carrier stupid (IMHO, it will appear not earlier than the 25th year, or even later). so this is some very illogical excuse
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 10: 50
          +1
          Quote: olp
          sooner or later, Kuznetsov will still have to be repaired,

          Yes, even tomorrow. The question is in the scope of this repair. If we simply make the capital of what is on the ship now (that is, we treat the existing chassis, and do not completely change it) and we carry out work on avionics and so on "raids" (this is how our LK "Marat" were repaired after the revolution. , "Paris Commune" and "October Revolution" - for the winter they stand up to the factory wall, but in the spring - at sea and in the fleet until winter), but at the same time, in the foreseeable future (3 years, say) we are laying a relatively small aircraft carrier (for an analog Nimitz, with this we may not be in time by 2030), then it is quite possible to stretch until 2025.
          1. PLO
            PLO April 11 2014 11: 02
            +1
            the type of repair with modernization should be determined by the tasks that set before it.

            if as you propose to make it just a training aircraft carrier and wait for a brighter future, then yes you can limit yourself to a simple periodic VTG.

            but if they are going to send him on campaigns from the Mediterranean Sea as it is now, then a full-fledged modernization with the replacement of the power plant is needed, otherwise it looks silly.
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 11: 29
              +5
              Quote: olp
              if as you propose to make it just a training aircraft carrier and wait for a bright future

              This is not quite so :) I propose to make Kuznetsov training and build a new aircraft carrier, and return to global modernization of Kuznetsov after putting a new one into operation (and there’s already thinking whether it is worth upgrading it or it’s easier to build a new one) There is no need to wait for a bright future - Ukraine won 23 is waiting for the year, but it still does not come ...
              1. PLO
                PLO April 11 2014 11: 39
                +3
                I myself would be glad if we had a new aircraft carrier, but unfortunately in the near future yes In the future, the conditions for the construction of an aircraft carrier are not visible either for economic or technical reasons (
                1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                  Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 12: 51
                  +6
                  How can I say? If we start building something like "slightly improved Kuznetsov" then we will succeed. Judge for yourself.
                  What is an aircraft carrier? This is, first of all, a large steel box. But there is no particular problem with the construction of large and steel hulls in the Russian Federation - all shipbuilders in chorus say that they will configure the hulls as much as they like, problems with what to install in these hulls
                  The second is EU. But we exchanged power plants for Vikramaditya, which means there is experience and proven technologies (only brickwork cannot be offered!) We already did this once at Vikramaditya, so we can repeat it
                  Third - the deck and everything on it (all sorts of tricks such as aerofinisher), as well as flight control systems - we did all this from scratch at Vikramaditya, we have experience, we have knowledge and relations with contractors were established.
                  And what else? Lifts? made on Vikramaditya. Ammunition supply systems? They did it too.
                  Fourth - aviation - MiG-29KUB is in our hands, at the same time, since they are not removing the people from the KLA, at least we will support MiG.
                  The fifth is money. This is several billion dollars nevertheless ... But we will build it in 7-8 years, not less (if not more) and spend a year of lyamy on 500 greens on such a useful thing - the navel will not untie.
  3. alex56
    alex56 April 11 2014 08: 33
    +3
    The review does not mention the destroyers of project 956. They also seemed to be going to be repaired and sent for modernization?
    Tell me, please, how are things going with them, if anyone knows?
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa April 11 2014 21: 34
      +3
      Quote: alex56
      Tell me, please, how are things going with them, if anyone knows?
      There are two of them left in the Baltic: "Persistent" and "Restless". "Persistent" on the move, last night personally saw him return from the seas. "Restless" sucks. Awaiting renovation. True, when it starts, no one can really say: the terms of production at the plant have already been postponed three times.
  4. Nayhas
    Nayhas April 11 2014 08: 35
    +1
    The modernization of ships of pr. 1155 and 1164 looks much more logical than an attempt to revive Nakhimov. At the same time, modernization of these ships will be cheaper. And it turns out that Nakhimov was not pulled out and workhorses died ...
  5. Bongo
    Bongo April 11 2014 08: 39
    +3
    Quote: Nayhas
    It's time to forget. Boilers have nothing to change ...

    Formally, a few pieces in the combat train.
    1. Nayhas
      Nayhas April 11 2014 09: 20
      0
      Quote: Bongo
      Formally, a few pieces in the combat train.

      In the 21st century, boilers are not even funny; changing a gas turbine is unrealistic, so unfortunately it's time to forget.
      1. goose
        goose April 11 2014 12: 27
        +4
        Boilers give a range of navigation that is cheaper and a bit more reliable with proper care.
        1. dustycat
          dustycat April 11 2014 18: 11
          +2
          Quote: goose
          Boilers give a range of navigation that is cheaper and a bit more reliable with proper care.

          Exactly. With proper care.
          And meanwhile, even land heating engineers, designers get such a mess on the mountain that my God.
          ITP of a new energy-saving house has to be completely redone immediately after commissioning - otherwise the house freezes.
          And how difficult it is to establish the thermal regime of a boiler swinging with a frantic vertical and horizontal amplitude - this is generally something with something.
          And the level of produced heat engineers is lower than plumbing - technical schools and institutes producing such specialists all changed their profile or brought their pilot boilers to free up space for rented areas.
          And as one old operator of the fuel-burning installation said, the boiler must be sensed by the spleen, each valve and valve should be recognized as a touch of the beloved girl by touch.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. dustycat
        dustycat April 11 2014 18: 02
        +1
        Quote: Nayhas
        Boilers in the 21st century is not even funny

        It’s not even funny for you, but for some reason japas are going to build a new aircraft carrier on the boilers.
        Although they seem to be even going to make turbine locomotives for the railway from old Soviet developments.
        In general, IMHO, the ocean fleet should be nuclear.
        Otherwise, a lot of tankers are needed.
  6. Bongo
    Bongo April 11 2014 09: 00
    +2
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    what do you want from the 956th project? Due to the "peculiarities" of the chassis, these ships cannot be used in the oceanic zone.

    Why can't it? These ships were designed specifically for the ocean zone.
    Where are the sea pilots? They need a deck, skill cannot be maintained on a thread

    The Su-33 aircraft of the 279th naval aviation regiment are constantly based on the coast, and there are no more than 8 of them left in flight condition. On "Kuznetsov" they are relocated only before the latter leaves the sea.
    "It's time"This means it is high time" to modernize Kuznetsov and turn it into a full-fledged aircraft carrier, removing anti-ship missiles from it. Or do YOU ​​disagree?
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 10: 16
      +2
      Quote: Bongo
      Why can't it? These ships were designed specifically for the ocean zone.

      So study the question a little bit. When was the last time you saw 956 in the ocean?
      They have a VERY capricious suspension. Requiring h-ski qualified personnel. The replacement of a boiler-turbine installation with a gas-turbine one began to be worked out literally almost the day after the head test.
      Quote: Bongo
      The Su-33 aircraft of the 279th naval aviation regiment are constantly based on the coast, and there are no more than 8 of them left in flight condition. On "Kuznetsov" they are relocated only before the latter leaves the sea.

      This is not important, it is important that pilots have the opportunity to do this and do it annually, although not all year round. Plus now come MIG-29CUB
      Quote: Bongo
      "It's high time" - it means it's high time "Kuznetsov to modernize, and turn it into a full-fledged aircraft carrier, removing anti-ship missiles from it. Or YOU don't agree?

      First, removing the missiles will not make Kuznetsov an aircraft carrier. RCC on AB is superfluous, here you are right, but in fact they take up little space. And the transformation of "Kuznetsov" into AV (change of the power plant, etc.) will take 5-7 years of repair work, by this time, when it is back in operation, there will be no one to fly from it.
      In general, you must first build something like that, even though there is nothing to do with Vikramaditya, so that you can already upgrade Kuznetsov there
      1. dustycat
        dustycat April 11 2014 18: 14
        0
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        The replacement of a boiler-turbine installation with a gas-turbine one began to be worked out literally almost the day after the head test.

        Horseradish radish is not sweeter.
        He needs a vigorous installation.
        Otherwise, tankers will not stock up for ocean walking.
  7. Cossacks
    Cossacks April 11 2014 09: 09
    +8
    Buzzers are all funny. BOD come out only accompanied by a tugboat. The question is, who brought the fleet to the handle. Maybe someone dares to voice the names at least for themselves. That's just not substituted with an alleged lack of money.
    1. dustycat
      dustycat April 11 2014 18: 15
      +3
      Well, start with the ministry of education.
  8. Wiruz
    Wiruz April 11 2014 09: 38
    +1
    Nuclear ships must be built. This also applies to aircraft carriers (we are talking about the Kuzi modernization so far) and Leader-class destroyers. By the way, in my opinion, it is also necessary to build a replacement for the Atlanteans, despite the fact that they are still running, all the same, a new project of such a ship is needed, and more than one ship per fleet.
    But in general, in my understanding, the ocean fleet is primarily submarines - both multipurpose and SSBNs. There would be more of them.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 10: 54
      +3
      Quote: Wiruz
      By the way, in my opinion, it is also necessary to build a replacement for Atlanta

      "Leader" is such a replacement. As far as can be understood, it is being designed as a single universal missile and artillery ship of the oceanic zone, capable of performing the functions of the RRC, BOD and destroyers of the USSR Navy.
    2. goose
      goose April 11 2014 12: 30
      0
      By the way, on an aircraft carrier, unlike the others, it is possible to provide for the replacement of the active zone without cutting the hull. This greatly reduce the cost of LONG-TERM exploitation. And even cheaper it will be the construction of a normal pier with heating so that the ship’s mechanisms do not drive in vain.
      1. dustycat
        dustycat April 11 2014 18: 23
        0
        Quote: goose
        By the way, on an aircraft carrier, unlike the others, it is possible to provide for the replacement of the active zone without cutting the hull.

        Rosatom has developed a good small-sized BN reactor with an intraband change of fuel elements and a lead coolant.
        To reload, you need only two hatch meters per meter in the deck, which is not a question at all with the requirement of a large and high technical deck.
        So that would be the interest of the admirals and their understanding for what for them aircraft carriers.
        But with this apparently a lot of strain.
        It’s time to tie up with the ocean-class fuel oil vehicles.
        He purely fuel oil for cabotage - he jumped out of the bay, heaped it, and ran away to the bay for refueling.
    3. The comment was deleted.
  9. tchoni
    tchoni April 11 2014 09: 39
    +1
    And please tell me, how many interests do we have in the ocean zone?
    It may be more logical to first deal with internal and cross-border problems (such as Hohland, the encroachment of Amers on the presence in Georgia and Turkmenistan, etc. by Afghanistan), and only then think about liberating the island of freedom from Pindo-Latin occupants?
    No, I don’t argue, you need to have a flag representation and all that - like, if you reduce the existing vessels into one squadron - something will turn out like that, even a couple of squadrons, if we say some other budget option for an escort aircraft carrier (with reconnaissance tasks and limited air defense functions) and plod bungle (by the way, it is possible that the Mistral with such an eye and ordered)). And, in my opinion, this Russia is enough for now.
    1. Dart2027
      Dart2027 April 11 2014 18: 06
      +1
      By the time we have a full-fledged fleet capable of performing tasks in the ocean zone, all problems with our neighbors will have already been solved. This is work for years to come.
    2. dustycat
      dustycat April 11 2014 18: 25
      +1
      Quote: tchoni
      How many interests do we have in the ocean zone?

      Well, for example, maintaining a no-fly zone over Libya.
      Absolutely flightless.
      Even for "allies".
      Tightly.

      Well, the export of instability, flightlessness to the shores of the SGA.
  10. Leshka
    Leshka April 11 2014 09: 41
    +2
    cruisers we really need soldier
  11. Lavrentiy
    Lavrentiy April 11 2014 09: 41
    +1
    How can surface ships with missiles with a launch range of up to 700 km, shipborne detection tools limited by the radio horizon, fight in the open ocean with US aircraft carriers - the main likely enemy?
    1. dustycat
      dustycat April 11 2014 18: 29
      -1
      Quote: Lavrentiy
      How can surface ships with missiles with a launch range of up to 700 km,

      If it can the SGA, what prevents it from being able to Russia?
      In addition, our over-the-horizon radar detectors are no worse.
      Well, drone drone based on the same KR or something new.
      Gut basalt or granite and stuff with new electronics with reverse broadcasting to the carrier ship.
      And weapons and means of additional intelligence.
  12. capex1
    capex1 April 11 2014 09: 47
    0
    Yes, it is extremely necessary for us to build up and at the same time accelerate the construction of the fleet of the ocean zone (thereby supporting the image of a superpower), but at the same time we need to build a fleet of near and middle zones at an accelerated pace to protect our own territory. We need to focus on ships (submarine and surface), which will carry on board the most accurate missile weapons. Indeed, in the event of a conflict, a squadron of missile cruisers can very much ruffle a vaunted carrier fleet of a potential enemy (to say the least).
  13. The comment was deleted.
  14. The comment was deleted.
  15. Per se.
    Per se. April 11 2014 10: 37
    +3
    Now, and in the very near future, the Russian shipbuilding industry will not be able to give the navy a sufficient number of ships in the ocean zone.
    For a presence in the oceanic zone, it is probably not necessary to have cruisers and destroyers right now, we could now use dual-use ships or mobilized auxiliary cruisers and scouts armed with modular weapons. We don't have time to build ourselves, buy a suitable trough from neutrals, he does not need a speed of 30 knots to drive the same pirates off Somalia, to be on duty at sea with helicopters and launch boats, plus comfort for the crew. Containers with missiles, modern reconnaissance equipment, and, to the United States, the nerves of the Yankees. In general, the topic of mob-reserve for our navy is no less urgent. Even an "ersatz" aircraft carrier or a helicopter carrier from a tanker will now be the solution, wait a hundred years is too long, the problem must be solved from what is real now.
    1. dustycat
      dustycat April 11 2014 18: 36
      +2
      Quote: Per se.
      We don’t have time to build ourselves, buy a suitable trough from the neutrals, he does not need a speed of 30 knots,

      There was a line of bulk carriers in the USSR with an exorbitant rate from the point of view of commerce.
      The truth seems to be just two built.
      But the peculiarity is the ice class, the possibility of loading with 60-foot containers and freights, and, as I already said, the exorbitant speed is 32 knots.
      To place ClubK the very thing. All that was lacking was a nuclear power plant.
      What is interesting - why the hell was the loading of containers "on the priest" provided.
      What would it be for?
  16. fktrcfylhn61
    fktrcfylhn61 April 11 2014 10: 42
    +1
    It’s not enough to build a fleet; you don’t need to mold a lot of dead people! Bad is the strategist who hopes for a limited strike by the enemy! First of all, the highest priority combat unit will be destroyed! Therefore, the enemy instantly activates maximum firepower! And I doubt that at least one combat unit of the fleet will be able to at least repulse and survive, Priority unit! In my opinion, it is necessary to strengthen the means of countering the enemy attack. That it would be impossible to break through the line of defense of a military unit with existing means! Then superiority will be justified and appropriate!
    1. RONIN-HS
      RONIN-HS April 11 2014 18: 01
      +1
      sculpt the deceased a lot of mind is not necessary!
      Comrade with the smartest nickname f ... 61, but what do you think that the fleets will cut the oceans for months, destroying each other ???
      Admirals (as well as generals))) ALWAYS prepare for the PAST WAR! This is where the strategy, R&D, construction program, hardware, infrastructure, and, as the apogee of the concept, "sculpting the dead ..." follow. That is, training and education of personnel.
      I dare to assume that for ALL ships, the first military campaign will be LAST. Fleet speeds are two orders of magnitude less than aviation, and the Fleet is absolutely open for attack by hypersonic drones from space. Therefore, the proposal of a colleague For itself about arming with modular weapons everything that can swim and shoot at everything that moves - is absolutely correct.
      Our geopolitical adversaries are the maritime powers; in order to slow them down, we must go to the Ocean and "kill" them there! Do not let your army roll over to the Eurasian continent. And finally - we must sometime loosen the shores of the Potomac ... negative To stare less at foreign shores! hi
      1. 52
        52 April 12 2014 13: 59
        0
        I absolutely and categorically agree with you, comrade! Wars are now multidimensional and multidimensional! Already in the years of that war, there was a break in the admiral's template - an upstart aircraft carrier became His Majesty. And then it started - submarines-hunters for the AUG, aircraft-missile carriers, suicide cruisers of the "Orlan" type, space systems. But without a versatile and modern fleet, we will again become the "Upper Volta" with missiles.
  17. malikszh
    malikszh April 11 2014 10: 51
    0
    and where are the Mistral helicopter carriers?
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 10: 52
      +1
      Why do you need them?
      1. PLO
        PLO April 11 2014 10: 56
        0
        these are the new "aircraft carrier killers"!
        haven't you heard? everybody talks about it request
      2. malikszh
        malikszh April 11 2014 12: 04
        0
        I don’t need, I wonder why not included in the list? did the French refuse or forget?
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 11 2014 12: 53
          +1
          The article talks about the ships of the ocean zone. And the Mistral helicopter carrier is not a ship, it is a VESSEL (which is under the bed).
    2. The comment was deleted.
  18. Alekst
    Alekst April 11 2014 12: 52
    +1
    I am in no way versed in maritime affairs, but I have several questions about the large "long arm" fleet, why is it needed now, and against whom, in this geopolitical and economic situation, should it be used ?! Against the United States and its allies, well, at the moment, and possibly in the medium term, this is impossible, and the current fleet is enough to support the allies, and, in principle, any ship flying the St. Andrew's flag. Against regional powers i.e. China, India, Brazil, etc., but why ??? it is hard to imagine that we will scare them with this, just as it is unlikely that the NATO fleet will scare them. Against small alien powers? so there will be enough one multipurpose nuclear submarine off the coast. It seems to me that the main task of the current fleet is to keep various missile defense bowls away from the shores of Russia.
  19. ar-ren
    ar-ren April 11 2014 13: 10
    0
    Quote: Nayhas
    This is a difficult event requiring qualification of performers. WHY do this if the fuel tanks are not empty? What is the sacred meaning of filling fuel tanks by a quarter?


    May I ask a question. Why did the marines land on a rope from a helicopter on a video if they could simply land a helicopter? :)
  20. The Art of War
    The Art of War April 11 2014 13: 16
    0
    It’s a pity we have been delaying the Leader project with the destroyer for so long ((China is already building an analogue of the Type 052 D destroyer project
  21. Ross
    Ross April 11 2014 13: 34
    0
    Quote: erased
    Still, this is not enough for Russia. Although it is not planned to maintain a database far from its land, it is necessary to have at least two full-fledged squadrons, just to perform special tasks.

    What happens to the Perfect-class destroyers? Not a word in any review, but the series was large and the ship seemed to be quite good. Especially in the current bezrybe.
  22. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa April 11 2014 14: 20
    +3
    The fleet of America surpasses the military fleets of all countries combined. Plus, the rest of the most powerful and modern fleets of the Americans in the allies. The advantage is overwhelming, if a database starts, any NK group of our fleet will be destroyed and there will be enough forces to carry out landing operations on our coast. Those. NK will not fulfill the task of defending the country's territory.
    Therefore, it is necessary to approach the issue of powerful NKs carefully, without overstressing the economy. That is, manufacturers clearly want to build as many large ships as possible, they have such a business, they live from this. But the payment for the construction, maintenance, modernization and operation fall on the shoulders of the budget, which means that some other expenses will have to be cut, this cannot be avoided. Therefore, with the fleet before you cut off, you need to measure a hundred times. In general, first of all, to solve the problems of strategic nuclear weapons and air defense of the country, then the fleet.
    1. The Art of War
      The Art of War April 11 2014 14: 28
      0
      Air defense in the first place! The Americans have the tactics of air supremacy and destruction of infrastructure, which proves their recent wars.
  23. Anton Gavrilov
    Anton Gavrilov April 11 2014 14: 40
    +1
    The Armed Forces must be balanced, the Fleet must also not be forgotten about it! To begin with, we need to build a sufficient number of corvettes and frigates, and then move on, everything should be phased, you can’t take it like that, and let's go straight to the building of the new nuclear cruiser. We are on the right track, although our path is difficult. The American Navy did not build immediately, look how long it took them to create their armada? Be patient, if everything is fine in our country, there will be good fleet as they say everything comes with time.
    1. The Art of War
      The Art of War April 11 2014 14: 48
      0
      I agree that a balanced approach needs to be approached! But in the US Navy they already have 61 destroyer Arly-Burke and they began to build them in the beginning of 90
      1. Anton Gavrilov
        Anton Gavrilov April 11 2014 14: 56
        +2
        That's what I’m talking about — they started building destroyers more than 20 years ago! And we are just taking the first steps, people have patience, you just have to wait. America has not even experienced the deepest socio-economic crisis, from which then had to get out. They are incomparably easier than us.
  24. kodxnumx
    kodxnumx April 11 2014 15: 19
    0
    There was one more atlant in Ukraine that wasn’t unfinished, even if it was repaid due to the repayment of a debt, one more combat unit can be used in the Crimea and modernize it!
    1. dustycat
      dustycat April 11 2014 18: 39
      0
      Quote: kod3001
      In Ukraine there was one more atlant not finished

      Even the Chinese refused to buy it.
      Too killed by long standing.
  25. dmitrij.blyuz
    dmitrij.blyuz April 11 2014 15: 46
    +2
    The article is good. But it doesn’t bring joy. We need ships of the ocean zone like air. Our power should show ourselves on the oceans. How it goes on longer is incomprehensible. Two Orlans, at least something. But the third, as if they are going to drive after Peter. that’s all. It’s time for Kuzyu to capitalize. He’s not getting out of the oceans lately. And Ukraine is not going to give us the cruiser. They want to sell. I wonder who will take it? === About Orlanov - http: // russian-ships. info / boevye / 1144.htm
  26. The comment was deleted.
  27. homosum20
    homosum20 April 11 2014 17: 29
    0
    "Nakhimov" will begin to be dismantled (with the removal of the propulsion system) in March 2015. "Petr" may be in the government's plans, but the plans of the Sevmash are not officially displayed yet.
    I do not understand how the fate of "Kirov" and "Lazarev" can depend on the state of the motor. installations - it is still removed and repaired. Another thing is that for each "Orlan" for 4 years - the last 2 will finally rust, until the only SevMash pool suitable for their repair becomes free. We need to build factories. Or pools in existing ones.
    1. indiggo
      indiggo April 11 2014 21: 03
      0
      pools? maybe a dry dock ...
  28. gregor6549
    gregor6549 April 11 2014 17: 37
    +1
    A long arm without a sufficient number of aircraft carriers and balanced in strength and means aircraft carrier strike groups can be shortened very quickly.
    Even in the USSR, they finally realized this and headed for the creation of just such groups, but, alas, did not manage to bring this matter to an end, and during the time that has passed since the collapse of the USSR, too much has been lost to unwind this badge in a new way, and money it's time to learn to count especially when they are not enough for the most urgent needs,
    Therefore, the only option remains, as in Soviet times, to rely on an "asymmetric" response. Let the Chinese compete with the United States in part of their long arm. And they are not going to catch up with the United States in terms of the number of aircraft carriers. They will do a couple of three in order to push the United States out of Hawaii or further away and cover the oil delivery routes in the Black East. How is it? What you protect is what you have.
    And against aircraft carriers, China already has quite a decent ballistic missile with the ability to search, recognize and destroy such "tasty" targets as an aircraft carrier. One or two will sink as if by accident and will be enough for the States to set their tail between their legs and be quiet.
    But Russia does not need to get involved in these swaras. Grievok is enough of his own, and if someone sticks closer than expected, then this already has something to answer without a long arm at sea.
    So it’s time for Russia to adopt Chinese wisdom, i.e. sitting on a high mountain and waiting for the Asian and North American tigers below to gouge each other. By the way, Stalin so-so thought of the role of the USSR in the circus arena under the name Mir. The main thing here is not to miss the moment how Joseph Vissarionovich missed him in 41, and everything will be like top.
  29. indiggo
    indiggo April 11 2014 20: 21
    0
    I didn’t understand something, but where is 22350? this is a ship of the ocean zone ...
    1. The Art of War
      The Art of War April 11 2014 21: 16
      0
      2 frigates were built for the Black Sea Fleet! And 3 more of the Northern Fleet 2 laid down 1 should seem to be laid this year!
      1. indiggo
        indiggo April 11 2014 21: 19
        0
        yes it’s understandable, in the article itself there isn’t at all about 22350
  30. Starover_Z
    Starover_Z April 11 2014 20: 50
    0
    I am not a sailor and not an aviator, so I apologize in advance because of the possible unnecessary imagination in the future.
    I believe that the Russian fleet needs to have aircraft-carrying cruisers in the near future. But not the shock type that they tried to do in Soviet times, but rather reconnaissance and defense purposes.
    That is, they need a deck-based AWACS aircraft, a torpedo attack aircraft, and helicopters to combat submarines.
    I believe that having in squadrons ships with an air group of this type, the squadrons will acquire "farsightedness", which they lack now.
    1. indiggo
      indiggo April 11 2014 21: 12
      +1
      you wrote correctly that you are not a sailor, you wrote a very stupid thing.
      First, what will you achieve by having such cruisers? in real combat conditions such ships are not capable. any AB must have an escort. we don’t have such ships yet.
      no need to come up with a bike. if you build an AB then it’s full-fledged, by the way, who do not know, the USSR even understood this, but did not manage to translate it into reality.
    2. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa April 12 2014 00: 06
      +1
      Quote: Starover_Z
      the Russian fleet needs to have aircraft carriers in the near future.
      Yuri, this is a long-passed stage in the development of our fleet. At the "Kiev" missile cellars were cut out to increase the volume of the hangar and the number of aircraft. Kuzyu is waiting for the same. And we had to resort to the type of "aircraft-carrying cruisers", because we did not have a full-fledged GDP aircraft. The radius of the Yak-38 = 150 km, the bomb load was declared 1000 kg, but in reality they flew with 2 UBK-32 and 2 R-60. Therefore, the P-500 was a panacea for enemy ships. Now there are Su-33 and MiG-29 KUB.
      Quote: Starover_Z
      We need a deck-based AWACS aircraft, a torpedo attack aircraft and helicopters to combat submarines.
      The AWACS aircraft (due to its weight) can only be lifted by a catapult. We don't have that yet. Therefore, the Ka-31 AWACS helicopter appeared. (The British also have AWACS helicopters). Yak-44 was made for Ulyanovsk. But the collapse of the Union put an end to everything.
      A torpedo bomber - "a legend of deep antiquity." Today, attack aircraft are armed with AvPKR, planning AB and other lethal things.
      As a rule, PLO helicopters are not part of the air wing of a modern AVM. Search performance is low. Until recently, their place was taken by PLO S-3V "Viking" aircraft. But when conducting a search anti-submarine operation, PLO MN-60R helicopters are used, the detachment of which is relocated to the AVM.
      You can read about modern naval aviation professionally and readily at http://topwar.ru/27077-palubnaya-aviaciya-chast-1-ya-ssha.html
  31. I think so
    I think so April 12 2014 21: 35
    0
    Yes-ah-ah-ah ... a depressing picture of the destroyed defense potential of the country ... and after all, the main thing is that there are no guilty ones ... in how ... "The best German of the year" travels with lectures and contains a fund ... r.o.d. MONUMENTS POSITION ... The third ... who ordered floating troughs from France, is now the chief in the government ... miracles ... And in what other country could this happen?
  32. shoroh
    shoroh April 13 2014 02: 17
    0
    The main strength of the fleet is fleet aviation. Focus on a large number of small self-supporting ships with air defense and pro systems. We know how to make airplanes, but also the best in the world. So it is necessary to make a marine version of the T50 and a scout, preferably an unmanned one. Ten ships with four dozens of T50 plus air defense when located near the SGA will make .... bricks guaranteed. Not even ten but enough heels. A pair of such small aircraft carriers and several frigates for support will be quite compelling. If we now have five hundred tons, then there would be no French ships in the Black Sea.
  33. xomaNN
    xomaNN April 13 2014 12: 16
    0
    The "failed" 90s have a very strong impact. And there is no backlog, and many large NKs thoughtlessly and not without self-interest of certain dark personalities, instead of conservation, were thrown into the junk for a pittance.
    And the question with the Nikolaev case of KR 1164 finally wilted bully
  34. unsermann
    unsermann 11 May 2014 03: 14
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    Yes, a lot of money is needed for this. Only now they are thrown into all sorts of games such as Sochi 2014, football championships 2018 ... And then they say that there is not enough for the fleet! Abram on his "Eclipse" only one handle in the latrine costs 40 thousand, what kind of cruisers are there with such appetites !!!
  35. asdick72
    asdick72 1 June 2014 07: 39
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    For some reason they forget about em 956, and yet they have a GEM similar to Adm. Kuznetsova. An aircraft carrier can go into the ocean and EM cannot, it’s strange like that! Although it is they who can make up the AUG. For some reason, it is forgotten that boilers can run on fuel oil up to the heaviest civilian brands sold in any port in the world (bunkering is simplified, the required number of bunkers is reduced and heating oil is several times cheaper than light fuel) With new technologies, water treatment can be significantly improved, for example, by installing auxiliary boilers for auxiliary and households. the need to install the latest water treatment and control systems, modern fuel treatment systems. These systems can also be purchased abroad, but they are not military. Electric power stations and civilian ships are equipped with such systems. It’s ok to train staff. After repairs, they will be good reliable and cheap to operate ships!
  36. Tishka
    Tishka 14 October 2014 02: 52
    0
    With ocean-class ships, we really have a big problem! I read here on the site, the pilot wrote that they were at the airport, painted the deck of the aircraft carrier with paint. They bought paint at their own expense. and when landing, there is a pilot. And taking pictures with a personal camera. Who and which line could catch, instead of cables! And the project to expand the existing bulk pools was put under the cloth, they say expensive, and we do not need it. Of course, personal yachts are much more important, especially if they are covered with gold, it is so aesthetically pleasing! And why do we need aircraft carriers, we are a land power, here is France, and everything is bad, and the economy is lame, but it also decided to cost an aircraft carrier. Yes, China, not only buys, but also decided to build its own with a dozen, in defiance of the American Navy, and they will build, and I think not a dozen, but much more! And why do we need them, the Arctic Ocean does not wash us, and many countries open their mouths to it. The Atlantic, too, well, somewhere from us across the seven seas, why do we need a fleet there at all! So, of course, you need to plan boats, like we still have a river, and an air defense system is at hand, and in the ocean, let the Yankees and the Chinese float! We are only aircraft carriers, and normal. Piece 6 is necessary, in no way less, and those that can have at least 50 aircraft on board. Moreover, there are such projects, but the government cannot form a portfolio of orders, we have no desire to build anything, but it is necessary, and a lot, and this is the task of not one year, or even decades! Apart from escort and support ships, and does not place them to equip UAVs, the more so, there was a project for a heavy UAV. On the basis of the MIG, but our army, it was not needed, and the system of automatic landing on an aircraft carrier does not hinder the pilots capable of landing on it were not a few, there is something to think about, if the "Buran" from space was automatically planted, then and this problem can be dealt with! Yes, in the USSR, it was not from a good life that they put all the weapons on the aircraft carrier, and to fight against the enemy’s AUG, and submarines, and enemy aircraft, because they also lacked escort ships, they tried to create a universal machine that and she could defend herself, and crush the enemy! So why not take this path now, try to minimize the AUG, but by placing on the aircraft carrier both air defense systems, and attack aircraft, and means of fighting the enemy’s AUG, well, support ships too, plus aviation, and get a universal AUG, but large enough tonnage. Of course, you can wait until they create a good electro-magnetic catapult, but according to the calculations of the Americans, the steam is less efficient, and the difference is only 4 planes per hour, but it still needs to be developed, but for now you can fly on the steam, nothing bad will happen! Well, not the crown of engineering, but how a workhorse will fit! So, the main task, in any way to protect the borders from landing, and enemy missiles, which are based in the ocean, and enemy aircraft on distant approaches, and this task, domestic AUGs must cope!