Military Review

The activists who seized the building of the SBU in Lugansk, published a manifesto

68
The activists who seized the building of the SBU in Lugansk, published a manifesto



Antimaydanovtsy holding the building management SBU in Lugansk, organized a press conference for journalists. In the course of it, they told about the ideology of their actions, ITAR-TASS reports. The representative of the activists, detachment commander Oleg Desyatnichenko said that the manifesto of the "United Army of Southeast Ukraine" had been previously published, and revealed its contents.

In this document, activists refer to the residents of Lugansk and to all who disagree "with the armed coup in Kiev." Antimaydanovtsy point out that, having seized the building of the SBU, they took upon themselves the responsibility to protest the "Kiev junta." “We put ourselves outside the law, putting our lives and destinies under direct blow, not because of excessive ambitions, but in the hope of you, our fellow citizens,” the document says. “In the hope that you support us and the referendum. And together we will say our firm “no” to the reforms on blood and fear that today Kiev is holding in relation to the entire Southeast, and indeed to all of Ukraine. ”

The detachment commander, Oleg Desyatnichenko, also said that the protesters continue negotiations with representatives of the Ukrainian authorities. And until the authorities accept the conditions proposed by the activists, the building of the SBU, in which there are less than a thousand people, will be blocked. In the event of an assault, activists intend to fight back.
Originator:
http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=1462970
68 comments
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  1. ssskalinin
    ssskalinin April 10 2014 05: 56
    +1
    There is a serious doubt that the guys will hold out until the evening, the main thing is that the peaceful ones are brought out from under the fire, I'm afraid that the assault is inevitable
    1. mirag2
      mirag2 April 10 2014 06: 00
      +1
      Good morning.
      The doubt is very serious - the invaders completely untied their hands, and will use the pravosekov for tough suppression and dirty deeds.
      Maybe they saw? Fresh about the movement of military equipment in Ukraine:
      1. W1950
        W1950 April 10 2014 06: 17
        +2
        Absolutely stupefied, letting the army against the people is a complete lack of intelligence. Here, it is better for the Minister of Defense to put a bullet in the forehead himself.
      2. Patriot.ru.
        Patriot.ru. April 10 2014 07: 00
        +2
        When it went against the Crimea it was funny. And when it wasn’t funny against the people. But there is still hope that they will not dare to shoot.
    2. smel
      smel April 10 2014 06: 09
      +11
      I look at the results of the PACE meeting and am becoming more and more firmly entrenched in the idea expressed by the emperor that Russia has only two allies - this is the army and navy. Even if the fascist scum will tear Lugansk patriots to pieces, drink their blood, and organize satanist dances over the remains, Europe will say that these are quite democratic ways of observing the rule of law and fighting for a unitary state of legitimate power. That there are no problems with the Russian-speaking population. You can only wish the guys stamina and good luck. God bless you to achieve your holy goals !!!
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 April 10 2014 06: 22
        +12
        Quote: smel
        I’m looking at the results of the PACE meeting
      2. Yuri Sev Caucasus
        Yuri Sev Caucasus April 10 2014 09: 16
        +1
        Europe is false in essence, just like their American allies, There is nothing nicer to them than to recognize white as black and black as white !!! Syria is a confirmation of this. Yes, and a whole list of countries that felt the charms of Western democracy and their theory of controlled chaos.
      3. Moldovan
        Moldovan April 10 2014 12: 53
        0
        Yes, everyone already understands this. Europe started all this in Ukraine, not in order to retreat. But in vain they flooded the Russians. That nation has not yet been born on Earth so that Russians can be brought to their knees.
    3. domokl
      domokl April 10 2014 06: 12
      +5
      Quote: ssskalinin
      There is serious doubt that the guys will last until the evening

      It seems to me that there are no civilian shtafirki ... There the officers and soldiers who passed the war. And that means they won’t sit in a trap ... They will lure the equipment into the city by using grenade launchers. It is clear that the SBU building will be fired from anti-tank guns with safe gunners of distance.
      So, the group that remains the most trained is still in the building. So that they can evaporate in time. The rest will beat the enemy in street battles ... And there, as I wrote BMD and other equipment, the target is more.
      1. COLUN
        COLUN April 10 2014 09: 08
        -2
        It seems to me not bad to adopt the tactics of the militants in Syria (the more so the cities are miners) - dig tunnels !!!
        1. Day 11
          Day 11 April 10 2014 10: 38
          0
          Damn, what are you pumping up, what tunnels? There will be no Syria-2 in the center of Europe! This is not necessary for anyone! Even the assault will not
    4. Moldovan
      Moldovan April 10 2014 12: 46
      0
      Yes there will be no assault! Banderlogs are bold only against defenseless people. Well, in this case, yes, as in Kharkov. All Ukrainian Nazism in its roots is rewarded by Russian fears, cowardice and low self-esteem. Therefore, they take American mercenaries. Tonight in Kharkov, Kharkov self-defense captured one American mercenary. Watch the video at http://anna-news.info/node/14936
    5. APASUS
      APASUS April 10 2014 19: 39
      0
      Quote: ssskalinin
      There is a serious doubt that the guys will hold out until the evening, the main thing is that the peaceful ones are brought out from under the fire, I'm afraid that the assault is inevitable

      Have you tried to storm the building? What do you make such statements, it's not so simple
  2. Alex 241
    Alex 241 April 10 2014 05: 56
    +15
    AntiMaidan's appeal: We appeal to the Luhansk Berkuts, soldiers of the Internal Troops and police officers! tonight there will be an assault on the SBU! if you didn’t take our side just don’t climb "under the bullets" we do not want you to get hurt! All the same, you are ours!

    If you still follow the orders of the Kiev bandits, remember how they burned and killed you in Kiev by their orders and how we prayed for you here and thanked God that we returned alive, met you - our heroes with a loaf! don't make us disappointed!

    STAY OUR HEROES!
    1. Alex 241
      Alex 241 April 10 2014 06: 00
      +2
      In Kharkov near the regional military enlistment office. There is information that one mercenary was detained, although so far without confirmation.
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 April 10 2014 06: 06
        +6
        Quote: Alex 241
        There is information that one mercenary was detained

        Here is a video, the truth is in doubt
        1. kmike
          kmike April 10 2014 08: 16
          -1
          If this is true, then troops can be deployed.
        2. Sergey Minin
          Sergey Minin April 10 2014 17: 19
          0
          video circus. Where and by whom was this cunning SOKOL detained, with a grenade launcher ??) what did he do in this dark alley ??)) and like a shot at someone? From this grenade launcher ??)
      2. mirag2
        mirag2 April 10 2014 06: 08
        +1
        Perhaps, but I do not believe them there?
        And without them there is someone to do the dirty work, think such as Muzychko-ended?
        And mercenary fighters are needed only as a substitute for the army for large-scale clashes and battles.
        I think, mercenaries Turchinov + Avakov extra fawn.
        1. svp67
          svp67 April 10 2014 06: 41
          +5
          Quote: mirag2
          And without them there is someone to do the dirty work, think such as Muzychko-ended?
          And mercenary fighters are needed only as a substitute for the army for large-scale clashes and battles.
          I think, mercenaries Turchinov + Avakov extra fawn.


          All revolutions were successful only when foreigners who did not know compassion for the locals rushed to suppress the INTERNAL resistance of the population, so the emergence of these types is "LEGAL"
          1. RusKaz
            RusKaz April 10 2014 07: 25
            0
            Quote: svp67
            All revolutions were successful only when foreigners who did not know compassion for the locals rushed to suppress the INTERNAL resistance of the population, so the emergence of these types is "LEGAL"

            What are you talking about, yo-mayo? Here the situation is different. The army is not normal in Ukraine. And she does not submit fully to the Kiev junta. Because there appeared PMCs
        2. CALL.
          CALL. April 10 2014 06: 44
          +2
          Quote: mirag2
          And mercenary fighters are needed only as a substitute for the army for large-scale clashes and battles. I think, mercenaries Turchinov + Avakov extra fawn.


          On the Maidan, they caught one mercenary from America. Surname Boyarchuk

          1. RusKaz
            RusKaz April 10 2014 07: 37
            +2
            Quote: Z.O.V.
            On the Maidan, they caught one mercenary from America. Surname Boyarchuk

            guys, let's not talk about how in Ukraine they caught one someone there. Because it does not mean anything. In Ukraine, for example, they caught one nationalist from Russia, and now what?
        3. Tersky
          Tersky April 10 2014 07: 09
          +2
          Quote: mirag2
          Perhaps, but I do not believe them there?

          And you remember the civil war in Russia, and understand ..., or take a closer time frame - Syria ...
        4. Moldovan
          Moldovan April 10 2014 13: 01
          0
          These creatures are very big fools, they did not know that the Kharkovites were not armed and therefore sent mercenaries. All Ukrainian fascism is built on cowardice, remember at least the recent events in the Crimea ......
      3. RusKaz
        RusKaz April 10 2014 07: 29
        +1
        Quote: Alex 241
        In Kharkov near the regional military enlistment office. There is information that one mercenary was detained, although so far without confirmation.

        There is information that even a black man was seen on the bus. This is for those who doubt that the bus is generally foreign mercenaries.
        And this is not in Kharkov, but in Donetsk, it seems.
      4. Moldovan
        Moldovan April 10 2014 12: 58
        0
        There is a video here http://anna-news.info/node/14936
    2. domokl
      domokl April 10 2014 06: 15
      +3
      Quote: Alex 241
      : We turn to the Lugansk Golden Eagles, the soldiers of the explosives and the police!

      This is literate. Now in the units of these structures there is really confusion. They saw what happened to Berkut after the Maidan. And they do not want to repeat their fate at all ... In reality, it seems to me that the confrontation will be between dislocated groups (like Griffons), right sector and anti-Maidan ... BB will block the approaches, the rest will imitate the blockade ...
  3. forester
    forester April 10 2014 06: 02
    +4
    the wedge is knocked out with a manifest wedge is not protected only an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth in another way banderlogs do not understand and even better two eyes for an eye and two teeth for a tooth
    1. domokl
      domokl April 10 2014 06: 17
      +1
      Those who start, they will be to blame .. Rxioma ... Kiev must start ... But the answer must be prepared professionally ...
  4. dimdimich71
    dimdimich71 April 10 2014 06: 04
    +3
    Hold on Lugansk stop banderlog
  5. Smirnov Vadim
    April 10 2014 06: 04
    +12
    News from Lugansk!

    All cities of the region come together. Who is - Don Cossacks, the guys from Zaporozhye arrived last night, 400 km, passed 10 roadblocks. There is definitely a red ray. Anthracite, Perevalsk, Crimea. Miners began to catch up. Well, of course, Alchevsk (Alchevsk is best represented). Inside, the guys with full knowledge of the case, a sniper, firing points, all as expected. The decor is very friendly. Barricades strengthened in two rows, for departure in case of stripping. Everything is thought out for an adult (for BTRS there is a serious supply of fuel, everything is dispersed around the perimeter (a reserve for all the remaining equipment in UKRAINE). Negotiations are underway (everything is fine).

    Yesterday was Lyazhko - barely had time to carry his feet. Tigipko last night - the guys had to save him, ran faster than the wind blows, escorted to the hotel, Otherwise they would have torn like a hot water bottle. In short everything is fine. There are a lot of women, children, old people and, of course, real men on the square. We need everything and women and men (enough to sit on the ass, you do not need to argue and just come and you will understand everything yourself). If someone is afraid of an assault (you should not be a coward, and besides, there will be no assault on 99%. Everything is too serious). Everyone laughs with the ukrainian news, a complete nonsense. Hostages - Duck (they just do not need). In short, than to read, just come and see for yourself (for one you will feel like men).

    The tracks are free for one very simple reason (there was direct communication with the cops). All our regional offices are with us. At the posts, they are businesslike with a smile, pretending not to be allowed in or checking. At the same time, everyone is very friendly. They clearly assured that in the event of a military solution, they themselves would pull themselves up to the SBU from all over the region, with their own weapons. Traffic cops themselves often shout "RUSSIA" from their cars at the sight of the Russian flag.

    In the SBU, guys from different departments (Berkut, Sokol, Airborne Forces, Afghans, Pensioners of other structures). Crimeans in the 1000 area are waiting for people (they are already going).

    1. Alex 241
      Alex 241 April 10 2014 06: 10
      +4
      10papel-Crimea, and a video about Poroshenko.
      1. Corsair
        Corsair April 10 2014 10: 46
        0
        Quote: Alex 241
        10papel-Crimea, and a video about Poroshenko.

        "The most likely candidate for the presidency of all Ukraine ..." fellow negative cryinglol wassat laughing bully
    2. Ilja 22
      Ilja 22 April 10 2014 06: 13
      +4
      Now this is more real, well done, united, amicably, God be with you !! but don’t underestimate the enemy, you need to be on the alert, it’s not known that these crazy people will betray you, you can speak only after reaching your goal, and you will achieve your goal, everyone believes in you
    3. brelok
      brelok April 10 2014 06: 17
      +1
      Really gathering strength!
    4. W1950
      W1950 April 10 2014 06: 23
      +2
      God be with you guys.
    5. KOH
      KOH April 10 2014 06: 27
      +2
      Well done guys !!! Hold on !!!
    6. Corsair
      Corsair April 10 2014 08: 58
      0
      Quote: Smirnov Vadim
      Tigipko tonight - the guys had to save him, ran faster than the wind blows, escorted to the hotel, otherwise they would have broken a heating pad like an ace.

      Maybe everything is the same to Misha Dobkin, and not Tigipko? With Tigipko, who is, like Dopa, the presidential candidate, the Luganchans communicated quite politely ...
      We were “getting away” from Luganchan, in the next “order” - Lyashko (they missed it in vain ...) and Dobkin (who needs him) ...
      1. RusKaz
        RusKaz April 10 2014 09: 03
        -1
        And what Dobkin did not please, I did not understand
        1. Corsair
          Corsair April 10 2014 11: 03
          +2
          Quote: RusKaz
          And what Dobkin did not please, I did not understand

          To understand, you need to "deeper" delve into the process taking place in Ukraine and track the entire chain of events ...
          Briefly say: Dopa (nickname Dobkin) surrendered the interests of the inhabitants of the east, in exchange for personal security.
          Of course on him "the light did not converge like a wedge", there are many other Judas, but he goes to the polls ...
          And he came to Lugansk "to enlist the support of the voters of the east" ... "politician" fucking ...
          1. RusKaz
            RusKaz April 10 2014 12: 09
            0
            aa) Thanks
      2. The comment was deleted.
    7. Mhpv
      Mhpv April 10 2014 09: 35
      0
      and besides, the assault will not be at 99%. It's too serious

      Kerry has already stated with Lavrov about the inadmissibility of a military solution, so the owners of the junta gave the command to Avakov and Turchinov "Fu", "Sit"
  6. mamont5
    mamont5 April 10 2014 06: 09
    +4
    So the Americans are beginning to fear and respect, otherwise they have completely lost their scent:
    "In the US Congress, the Russian army was called a real threat for the first time since Soviet times
    The US Congress is preparing to resume the release of the annual report on the state of the Russian Armed Forces, interrupted by the end of the Cold War. The intentions of the congressmen indicate that the Russian army has become a real threat to the United States. "Until now, NATO and the United States have always said that the Russian army is just a shadow of the Soviet one," experts say. "
    http://warfiles.ru/show-52025-v-kongresse-ssha-rossiyskuyu-armiyu-vpervye-so-vre
    men-sssr-nazvali-realnoy-ugrozoy.html
    1. RusKaz
      RusKaz April 10 2014 07: 47
      +1
      perhaps, possibly. But how will things be if the information on the sale of Yuzhmash to the Americans docks on the SS-18 Satan rocket is confirmed?
      What if Americans relying on these docks can develop effective protection against such missiles?
      1. Corsair
        Corsair April 10 2014 09: 09
        +3
        Quote: RusKaz
        What if Americans relying on these docks can develop effective protection against such missiles?

        The rocket is essentially a "flying log", of greater interest are the HEADS (how they behave on the trajectory, and how their protection is provided ... And this is another "song".

        Missile technologies are primarily of interest to states wishing to obtain delivery vehicles for nuclear weapons ...
        1. RusKaz
          RusKaz April 10 2014 10: 07
          0
          Good answer. I did not know that. +
      2. MIRU-MIR66
        MIRU-MIR66 April 10 2014 13: 07
        0
        It seems like China broke the bargain, they suggested more - America is in a panic-- Satan in China is worse than Satan in Russia winked
  7. dmitrij.blyuz
    dmitrij.blyuz April 10 2014 06: 14
    +3
    The manifesto is a manifesto, but without real physical (fire) support, it's all "like white apple-trees smoke." They will be crushed. Weapons are needed. And those "cans" that spank-shoot in Lugansk can still.
    1. KOH
      KOH April 10 2014 06: 37
      +2
      These "cans", with the right approach, in urban conditions burn like boxes of matches ...
      1. Revolver
        Revolver April 10 2014 06: 59
        +2
        Quote: CON
        These "cans", with the right approach, in urban conditions burn like boxes of matches ...

        Yes, of course, but if it fries from 30mm, it will not seem enough. This is if there is someone who knows from which end to charge it. The government was completely overwhelmed - they moved against civilian armored vehicles.
        1. KOH
          KOH April 10 2014 07: 15
          0
          I think it’s more likely to be pulled to the border when they begin to storm, they are afraid that Russia will harness ...
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. PSih2097
            PSih2097 April 10 2014 14: 34
            0
            Quote: CON
            I think it’s more likely to be pulled to the border when they begin to storm, they are afraid that Russia will harness ...

            bmd against tanks? it's not even funny ...
        2. RusKaz
          RusKaz April 10 2014 07: 51
          0
          Quote: Nagan
          The government was completely overwhelmed - they moved against civilian armored vehicles

          Why did you get the idea that the technique will be used specifically against those who are in the SBU building? and generally civil. Cheetah will be assaulted and so on. special forces and this equipment for the Russian troops
  8. The comment was deleted.
  9. Quantum
    Quantum April 10 2014 06: 16
    +3
    Unfortunately, there is little to resist the rebels, where the promised militia
    tens of thousands of fighters? And negotiations with Bandera will not lead to
    solving the crisis in the southeast. The south of Ukraine is still neutral,
    the east is still holding on. Chances to survive are less and less.
    1. RusKaz
      RusKaz April 10 2014 07: 58
      0
      Quote: Quantum
      Unfortunately, there is little to resist the rebels, there are few of them.

      and nobody essentially sets such a goal for himself
  10. VNP1958PVN
    VNP1958PVN April 10 2014 06: 16
    +4
    All Ukrainians who donate money to the army, and now look who the army will crush with caterpillars! And whether the tank asks you to rent or not!
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. RusKaz
      RusKaz April 10 2014 08: 04
      +1
      Quote: VNP1958PVN
      All Ukrainians who donate money to the army, and now look who the army will crush with caterpillars!

      as far as is known, money transferred by citizens will go to a completely different way. And then obviously the residents of Lugansk, Donetsk and Kharkov did not transfer money, which are now on strike. And those who support the current junta. So they have nothing to regret. They would still add heat
  11. dmitrij.blyuz
    dmitrij.blyuz April 10 2014 06: 27
    +2
    Someone on the site, previously threw off about a grand schucher. The rights turned out. It’s not good for all the movement of the banderlog technique. They can even spoil the blood and rust. The anti-tank guns are dragging, this is serious. Why the hell? It will be hard for the east. Maydan for everything they’ll go in order not only to preserve power, but also to nail work areas. I feel that there will be a big mess. And there will be blood.
    1. RusKaz
      RusKaz April 10 2014 08: 09
      -1
      Quote: dmitrij.blyuz
      It’s not good for all the movement of the banderlog technique. They can even spoil blood and rust. They can drag anti-tank guns seriously. But what the hell? The east will be hard.

      This technique for the Russian troops. Obviously ...
      for protesters and special forces from other areas + law enforcement officers + American PMCs (if they really are there) is enough.
  12. Al_lexx
    Al_lexx April 10 2014 07: 05
    +1
    "United Army of the South-East of Ukraine"
    I like this phrase more than Donetsk or Luhansk partisans.
    1. Turkestan
      Turkestan April 10 2014 08: 24
      +1
      Or maybe the PEOPLE'S LIBERATION ARMY OF UKRAINE
  13. dmitrij.blyuz
    dmitrij.blyuz April 10 2014 07: 10
    0
    An optimist, however!
  14. sv68
    sv68 April 10 2014 07: 23
    +1
    and what else besides passing the SBU is captured — airport stations bridges the local television center — who controls all this? when all these people take control and control, then you will show yourself how the strength and probability of storming the city will sharply decrease — the Kiev shushara is cowardly and not against real strength trample
  15. UVB
    UVB April 10 2014 07: 24
    +1
    Quote: domokl
    It is clear that the SBU building will be fired from anti-tank guns from a distance safe for gunners.
    It is almost impossible, does not allow the location of the building, buildings and terrain. The maximum distance from which you can shell a building is about 150-200 meters, believe me, I am a Luhansk citizen. By the way, anyone interested can see on Google maps, the address of the building is 79 Sovetskaya Street. In my opinion, the problem for the defenders is that right behind the building there is a 25-story new building, which is not yet fully populated, a great position for snipers.
    1. egor 1712
      egor 1712 April 10 2014 08: 56
      +1
      She is supervised!
  16. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. April 10 2014 08: 18
    +1
    Quote: Patriot.ru.
    When it went against the Crimea it was funny. And when it wasn’t funny against the people. But there is still hope that they will not dare to shoot.

    Shooting people is a crime.
    especially since they did not shoot at banderlogs.
    I remain confident that the military will not shoot, and will not even climb into the fray with the people. It is against all the laws of nature - to choose the profession to protect the homeland, and ... become a punisher.

    Another thing pravoseki. These have no concept of honor and understanding about the verge of what is permitted in society. They have already shown what revolutionary expediency is in their execution ...
    And these can only be stopped by force.
    And if they were given uniforms and weapons, this is a humanitarian catastrophe. In fact, the crime of the Kiev government.
    Themselves are not adequate, and armed mentally not worthy ...
  17. Zomanus
    Zomanus April 10 2014 08: 19
    +1
    I think that if heavy equipment is used, then for a start everything will be documented for history, and then there will be means to combat this technique. Even if morally obsolete. In short, Ukraine will not have an army ... Well, the best thing is to solve everything in peace.
  18. Rusin Dima
    Rusin Dima April 10 2014 08: 41
    +1
    It is interesting, but what can those people in military uniform be called who swore allegiance to their homeland and people? Personally, I can’t name them officers of the Ukrainian army, it’s a disgrace when some high-ranking police chief speaks and declares that he submits to Avakov, it is necessary to sell his honor to an officer with giblets
  19. Cossacks
    Cossacks April 10 2014 09: 00
    +1
    To shoot or not to shoot is the question. In 93 they shot and many clapped their hands.
  20. Oleg Prophetic
    Oleg Prophetic April 10 2014 09: 11
    +2
    Keep people in the east, and Russia needs to organize the supply of permanent weapons and ammunition to the protesters, this is the best option
  21. Omsk
    Omsk April 10 2014 10: 03
    0
    I think that there will be a lot of volunteers if you open a section of the border ..
  22. Freemason
    Freemason April 10 2014 10: 16
    0
    Hang on guys! You are an example to many who still doubt !!!
  23. xvicx
    xvicx April 10 2014 10: 18
    0
    Nobody will go for a real assault! If this is so, then there will be blood! If I have blood, then Russia will have an official pretext for protecting its citizens. So we are waiting for a visit ..
  24. Lukich
    Lukich April 10 2014 12: 48
    +5
    a flame will ignite from a spark. why are there so many sparks and where is the flame? are waiting for the good GDP to come and ruin everything? maybe enough on the couch to drink beer and watch the zombie how it ends !!! or are you waiting for when you will be taken away with a load of 200? and these geeks from the west are ready for it
  25. razved
    razved April 10 2014 12: 48
    0
    It’s scary to be the first, it’s hard to be the first to attack. Courageous people. God and the Truth are with you !!!! There will be a victory !!!!
  26. Leshka
    Leshka April 10 2014 16: 06
    0
    Now you need to throw one match and everything will burn
  27. Sergey Minin
    Sergey Minin April 10 2014 17: 17
    0
    Quote: Z.O.V.
    Quote: mirag2
    And mercenary fighters are needed only as a substitute for the army for large-scale clashes and battles. I think, mercenaries Turchinov + Avakov extra fawn.


    On the Maidan, they caught one mercenary from America. Surname Boyarchuk


    rave!
    This is an international police association for veterans. almost all of the former cops and a bunch of ordinary people bought their ksiv, so that they would work off traffic cops for a couple of months, and then the traffic police did not care, as is often the case with such ksiv.