Military Review

Ukrainian trident god Neptune

66
Ukrainian trident god Neptune



... Well, here's what happened sooner or later was going to happen. Ukrainian fleet, which began its inglorious twenty-three years history, equally ingloriously "rested in the Bose." To be honest, sooner or later it should have happened, but no one imagined that everything would happen so quickly and so shamefully.

Yes, to have our own navy today is very prestigious for any state. The Navy is not just a symbol of the state, it is an extremely status thing. There is a modern Navy - it means that this state really is something like an independent political player, and as a full-fledged economic partner. No Navy - then did not take place. For this reason, the club of naval powers is very elitist, and therefore few in number. And this, of course, is not accidental. The fact is that the Navy is not at all a certain number of ships, as a man in the street thinks, but a most complex mechanism, the creation and adjustment of which takes decades, or even centuries. At the same time, this mechanism is so expensive that its creation and maintenance are within the power of stable and established states. That is why we today clearly see the trend of gradual folding of the navy in the states that have lost the status of politically and independent powers. There is no need to go far for examples - this is Poland (with its traditional exorbitant naval ambitions), and Romania, and Bulgaria, etc. Fighting their shipbuilding programs and such naval monsters as England, Spain and Germany. The Navy has always been very expensive, but today it is almost fantastic roads.

Therefore, each state today faces a choice - to create and maintain this expensive structure, or to actually part with it, taking up more pressing issues. Everything ultimately rests on the geopolitical tasks that a given state solves at a given historical moment and to the real economic power of the given state. Yes, and created naval fleets are not anyhow, as well as under the real geopolitical tasks of a particular state. If the state sees its tasks in the protection and defense of the coast - this is one fleet, in the protection of the sea economic zone - the other, in actions on the internal seas - the third, in solving global problems in the vast world ocean, the fourth.

By the way, and the Russian Navy in its development has passed a very difficult path. Created by the will of Peter the Great, he later survived all the inevitable childhood diseases and, in reality, he was on his feet only in the 70-x-80-s of the XVIII century. But Russia simply had no other choice. The fleet was vital to it (due to its geographical location and the foreign policy tasks that Russia had and must solve), and the oceanic fleet is numerous.

Well, now back to Ukraine. How pathetically began the history of its Navy in the early 90-s! How many were loud statements, pathos and arguments about Ukraine, as a new great maritime power.

Yesterday, Ukraine was only one of the many republics of the USSR, and now, having become an independent power overnight, it immediately decided to acquire all the state attributes, including the most prestigious of them - the navy. At the same time, nobody was particularly interested in the fact that at that time Ukraine had absolutely no prerequisites for this, either political, economic or psychological. There was only a whim and delusions of grandeur of the lords who had seized power. The fact that the fleet is created evolutionarily and gradually no one even wanted to think. Only revolutionary and only all at once. Yesterday we were still nobody, and today we will already be a great sea power! But was Ukraine really ready to create and maintain a modern naval fleet? What tasks would the fleet of this state have to solve? Today we can firmly say that Ukraine was completely unprepared for the creation and maintenance of the Navy. Yes, and the fleet for yesterday and today is not what it does not need, but even harmful, because until the last days of its existence, he ate most of the budget, without bringing any real benefits.

There is such a thing as a balanced fleet. This is a fleet in which all the component parts are thought out and verified: a certain number of specific combat ships built to solve specific combat missions correspond to a specific number of auxiliary vessels, data ships providing. Under these ships and vessels, a specific coastal infrastructure is being created, a system of personnel training, the most complex technological chain of shipbuilding cooperation has been built, science works, and propaganda work is conducted among the population. In Ukraine, nothing like this was in the bud. There were only exorbitant ambitions, stupid boasting and nationalist frenzy.

If you look at the history of the issue of birth, mournful life and the sad end of the Ukrainian fleet, it becomes obvious - this unfortunate child was initially unviable, and therefore the whole history of modern naval forces of Ukraine (Navy) is just a prolonged agony, which lasted almost a quarter of a century. Therefore, with a pure heart, we can state today that the poor fellow simply otmuchilsya. It seems that after the death of the Ukrainian fleet, they sighed with relief, above all in Kiev, because there is no fleet, and there is no problem! Perhaps, while they still do not understand it there, Ukrainian politicians are full of ambitions. But ambition is ambition, but reality is reality! And, alas, it is bleak for Kiev - the expensive experiment with the navy ended in a fiasco. However, it is common for our neighbors to again and again attack our own rake, and therefore I would not be surprised if soon in the next nationalist frenzy we will be announced about new grand plans for the creation of the great Ukrainian fleet. Well, we will have a reason to laugh again ...

Today, when crocodile tears are flowing on the Internet regarding the fact that independent warrants are being disarmed and escaped from ships based in Crimea, it should be recalled how it all began. The fact is that the history of the current Ukrainian fleet began from a very unattractive page — from an armed capture by a group of conspirators of the SKR-112 patrol ship and its hijacking to Odessa. According to all international norms, this was a real pirate campaign with all the ensuing consequences. At the same time, the Ukrainian press inflated this piracy to the size of a national feat. TFR-112 was declared the Aurora of the Ukrainian national revolution, and the criminal commander the hero. Particularly zealous dreamed of calling the rebellious guard "Ataman Sidor Bely" and even putting it on the Dnieper, like all the same "Aurora" to demonstrate to descendants. None of this happened. Arriving in Odessa, the demoralized insurgents staged a real orgy on the ship and in a matter of days brought the guard into total disrepair. At the same time they drank so fiercely that one of the officers died, choking on his own vomit. The failed Sydor itself was sold for scrap already in 1993, far from having reached its service life. Here is such a heroic ...

In principle, the entire history of the Ukrainian fleet is not a history of victories at all, as Ukrainian nationalists would have liked, but a history of permanent betrayal. So it was in 1918, when in order to avoid the capture of the German fleet in Sevastopol of the fleet, several pro-Ukrainian officers decided to raise the flags of Berlin’s union hetman Skoropadsky’s regime on ships, and then, literally in a few weeks, this danger disappeared, the yellow-blocking flags with such ease disappeared. The Ukrainian fleet was formed on the principles of betrayal in the 90 of the twentieth century. What is the attempt of the pirate capture of the submarine B-871, when the sailors, locked in compartments, threatened to blow up the submarine, if the Ukrainian nationalist officers did not leave it.

And what about the attack on the night of 10 on 11 on April 1994 of the Ukrainian military on the 318 division of the Black Sea Fleet reserve ships, located in the port of Odessa. Then the Ukrainian paratroopers in full arms broke into the base, beat the Russian sailors, looting, interrogated the midshipmen and officers with passion, and took the base itself into the Navy. And countless provocations in the military commander's office of Sevastopol, power seizures of ships in Nikolaev and coastal units — all of these are real “feats” of the Ukrainian military consortium. So do not Ukrainians complain about "polite silent people."

However, it was not necessary to expect anything else from the sailors of the Ukrainian Navy, as far from the best representatives of the naval officer corps went to the Ukrainian fleet. Naval Forces of Ukraine became the last refuge of losers, who tried to make a career on the wave of Ukrainian nationalism. A typical representative of this galaxy is the current Minister of Defense of Ukraine, Admiral Tenyukh, who at one time was decommissioned from the crew for professional incompetence to the coastal base. However, the worthless officer was distinguished by the highest national self-awareness and readiness to fight with Russia even now (at that time it was an obligatory condition for admission to the Ukrainian Navy), and therefore made a dizzying career. So what, that confused, but betrayed without flattery! And what about the behavior of the first commander of the Ukrainian fleet, Rear Admiral Kozhin, who, having pledged allegiance to the oath and to the Black Sea Fleet to Admiral Kasatonov, in the evening, the next morning, as well-known Mazepa, went over to the other camp. Well, what is not a hero of the Ukrainian nation! Not worse was the next commander of the Navy Vice Admiral Beskorovainy. Serving in the Northern Fleet, he considered that he was unjustly bypassed in the post there and immediately ran to Ukraine in order to satisfy his exorbitant ambitions. It is also a good example to follow, because where we pay more, we serve there. The third leader of the Navy Admiral Yezhel did not lag behind his senior comrades. Now, being the ambassador of the Maidan in Belarus, he fiercely calls for a crusade against Russia, which is quite natural - the admiral conscientiously works out his silver coins.

Surprisingly, the beginning of the Ukrainian Navy, as in a mirror, was reflected in its inglorious end - the flight to Odessa of the only Ukrainian frigate, the Hetman Sagaidachny. From flight to Odessa, the Ukrainian Navy began its history and completed the same flight. History tends to repeat, first in the form of tragedy, and then in the form of farce. At one time, a tragedy was a rebellion and an escape to Odessa of the Black Sea battleship Potemkin. Then everything repeated in the form of farce with TFR-112 and now for the third time with the escape to the same Odessa “Hetman Sagaidachny”. The fate of "Potemkin" was, as is known sad. The restless rebellious ship, after wandering a week across the Black Sea and receiving the nickname “wandering ship”, then surrendered to the Romanian authorities. TFR-112 ingloriously rotted at the pier and was sold for scrap. No need to be a visionary, to understand - the fate of the "hetman" will be just as bleak.

In addition to the ships and the coastal infrastructure in 90-s, Ukraine also acquired two naval schools, which were not needed at all. Well, why, for example, was the Square to take the Sevastopol Higher Naval Engineering School from Russia! After all, engineers of nuclear power plants for nuclear submarines were trained there. And nuclear ships in the Navy was not expected even in the distant future. But they took it anyway, partly from greed, partly from harm. Needless to say that SVVMIU soon ceased to exist, and VVMU it. P.S. Nakhimov dragged the most miserable existence. His graduates simply had nowhere to go, because Ukrainian fleet was simply not needed in such a number of graduates. So, the poor fellows went to serve as traffic police inspectors and firefighters. Here is a Ukrainian naval romance!

However, with regard to senior officers, they were regularly trained in NATO educational institutions, where they were taught not only to fight by Western standards, but also to hate Russia. This school was attended by many leaders of the Ukrainian Navy, including the current Minister of Defense of Ukraine. There was little confusion, however. Ukrainian ships have traditionally illiterately maneuvered, or else they were losing speed at joint NATO exercises, turning into a mockery for "strategic partners."

Probably, few people know, but in Lviv at the beginning of the 90-s a whole group of specialists worked, composing a special Ukrainian naval language and translating the Ship's charter and other documents into it. Of course, nothing good came of it either. And so, until the very last day, on naval command and control ships, teams were given in Russian, and technical documentation was also conducted in Russian, and Ukrainian military consortium also talked about service issues in Russian more than in readaway. The Ukrainian command words were used mainly in the inspections of Kiev chiefs.

For all the years of its stagnation, the Navy never became a real fleet, neither in combat training, nor in morale, nor in tradition. Recall that if the anthem of Ukraine is just a tracing from the anthem of Poland, the flag of the naval forces of Ukraine is tracing from the navy of Kaiser Germany. Who does not believe, compare these flags. Alas, but even in this, Kiev did not create anything of its own, as they say, neither the mind nor the imagination was enough.

I will not reveal a big secret, if I note that in Sevastopol the sailors of the Navy, unlike the Russian sailors, have always been disliked and even despised by the locals. How not to recall here the shameful provocation of the Ukrainian military authorities regarding the establishment of a memorial plaque on the Grafskaya quay of Sevastopol! Then the whole city got up against this Bandera action. It came to open confrontation and criminal cases, but the people of Sevastopol succeeded, and a memorial plaque in honor of the hated Ukrainian fleet was torn down and thrown into the sea.

The pirate birth of the fleet, defectors, commanders and contempt of the people of Sevastopol, as well as a sense of their own inferiority, almost immediately created an inferiority complex among the Ukrainian sailors. Psychologists know that this complex is manifested primarily in the creation of myths about their own greatness. And here Ukraine is truly ahead of the rest. What, for example, is the fact that after learning about the 1996 anniversary of the Russian fleet approaching 300 (in 1696, the boyar duma issued a decree that began: “The navy to be ...”), Lviv historians immediately declared that the fleet Ukrainian whole ... 500 years. True, at the same time, Western historians could not link the predatory Cossack ranks to the regular fleet. But is this a problem when it is necessary to prove that we are the best and most ancient!
And as it was loudly stated in Ukraine, the first submariners in the world are, of course, Ukrainian Cossacks, who allegedly turned their canoes, “gulls,” and in this “underwater form” swam across the abyss of the Black Sea for fear of the Turks. To actually prove their priority, the Ukrainian cadets of the former VVMU them. P.S. Nakhimov was ordered to conduct an experiment - to turn one of the pits up the bottom and swim as the brave Cossack submariners swam. Alas, nothing good came of it. Inverted Yal instantly sank, nearly burying the hapless submariners with him.

But does the funny story of the establishment of the day of the naval forces of Ukraine look like a joke? Ukrainian authorities changed the great day of the Ukrainian Navy, probably ten times. At first they tried to celebrate the spite of Russia their holiday before our day of the Navy, then, on the contrary, later. In the end, when it turned out that the Ukrainian Navy did not even have fuel oil to hold a naval parade, they immediately joined the Russians and walked for their money, as they say at your expense and to visit you. And it was quite anecdotal that the Kiev rulers in Sevastopol established a monument in honor of the Ukrainian fleet in the form of ... a drunken dancing Zaporizhzhya Cossack. Until now, I still could not understand why a drunk Cossack became the personification of the entire Ukrainian fleet? Maybe there is some great Ukrainian secret in this that we cannot understand! To the credit of the city authorities of Sevastopol, the eerie sculpture still had the sense not to put in the center of the city. She was hidden in the depths of one of the remote parks. We must pay tribute to the humor of Sevastopol, who today decided not to demolish the statues of the irresponsible Cossack, but leave it in memory of the brief convulsions of the Ukrainian Navy.

Of course, the ships captured and hijacked by the Ukrainian “heroes” by definition could never become a real fleet. However, this truth was not known to the independent naval commanders. Therefore, in the 1996 year, with the division of the Black Sea Fleet, they seized everything that could be grasped without thinking whether it was necessary or not. For example, the Naval Forces of Ukraine with joy tidied up part of the Black Sea Fleet’s arsenal, without even bothering to figure out what, in fact, is stored in the “Ukrainized” adits. The insight came later when, after examining the desired prey, the Ukrainian sailors became sad - the adits of the long-sawn cruisers of the 68-bis project and the battleships written off in the 50 of the 20th century were stored in absolutely no one's need. Counting how much it would cost to recycle all this grabbed "wealth" immediately spoiled the mood of the Ukrainian military leaders for a long time.

As you know, when the Black Sea Fleet was divided, Ukraine, foaming at the mouth, demanded exactly half of the ship and coastal infrastructure, claiming that this would be the beginning of the great Ukrainian fleet. Nobody wanted to think about any specific tasks for which the future fleet would be organized, about the real political and economic opportunities of Ukraine. The motto was one: grab as much as possible! In fact, everything turned out that almost all the ships and auxiliary vessels transferred to Kiev were immediately sold to foreign firms, fighting for scrap metal, and auxiliary to private firms. And the proceeds are divided between state men and naval commanders. It would seem, and sold everything, calm down! But it was not there. For nearly two decades, statements from Kiev and Lvov were heard about the imminent revival of the great Ukrainian fleet. Lviv theorists dreamed of an armada of amphibious ships, which would land the marines on the "Kuban belonging to Ukraine" and "liberate" the local Cossacks from Russian tyranny.

Well, and Kiev theorists, having long since broken away from the realities of life, dreamed of oceanic armadades. The product of these dreams was the development of the 58250 Corvette. These "ships of the twenty-first century" Ukrainian naval commanders intended to build as many 14 units to reveal their flag to the entire civilized world. But dreams are dreams, but realities are realities. Therefore, soon the 14 corvettes became 12, then 10, then 6, 4 ... Finally, it was announced that only one corvette would be built, but admirals of the whole world would see it from envy! The name of the future corvette was given with the claim “Prince Volodymyr”. Alas, it soon became clear that the lonely Volodimir would hardly ever come out to sea. The bravura messages about the planned course of construction quickly disappeared from the pages of the press, but there were reports of "some shortcomings in funding," then there was silence. Alas, but today we can say with confidence that if Ukraine is not able to contain even the ships it has, then what can we say about creating new ones! Therefore, the poor Volodimir apparently died in the womb of a shipbuilding plant, and did not see the sea. Eternal memory to him! However, you shouldn’t be particularly upset, because the newest nuclear submarine missile cruiser Prince Vladimir has already descended from the stocks at the famous Sevmash stocks. This “Vladimir” under the flag of St. Andrew’s really destined to conquer the world's oceans, inspiring respect and awe to our “strategic partners”.

The world naval history hardly knows such a wretched sight, which the Ukrainian Navy even represented during their heyday. What, for example, real combat tasks could be performed by a squadron of the Ukrainian fleet, when one enumeration of the types of ships included in it makes one doubt the mental normality of the Ukrainian naval commanders.

So, the flagship of the Ukrainian operetta armada - the border guard patrol ship of the ocean zone "Hetman Sagaidachny", deprived of not only the shock weapons, but also elementary air defense systems. From a military point of view, his combat capabilities are absolutely zero, and in a real naval battle he will be only an easy target, and at the same time a mass grave for his crew. The second miracle of the Ukrainian Navy is the Slavutych command ship, built as a self-propelled base for unloading and neutralizing nuclear submarine reactors. In the Navy, he portrayed the control ship! There are no comments at all. For what the Ukrainians needed this useless construction, does not lend itself to any logic.

About the firstborn of the Ukrainian submarine fleet, “Zvidorozhye”, the “fluids of the canoe”, so many anecdotes are told that only their retelling will take several pages. We only note that during the endless repair of this submarine, so much money was spent that would be enough to build several new submarines. As a result, the repaired "Zaporizhie" could only go once to the sea and, surrounded by all rescue forces, plunge into the periscope depth. Ukrainian submariners simply did not dare to dive further. On this actually all the combat activity of the Ukrainian submarine fleet and ended.

In addition, the panopticon in the Ukrainian fleet had three small anti-submarine ships, one of which was a border one and, therefore, also had no strike weapons and self-defense weapons. The landing forces of the Ukrainian Navy were represented by one large landing ship and one medium ship. There was, however, once and the newest landing ship hovercraft. But he was ruined by drunkenness, and therefore quickly blamed on needles. In addition, there were a couple of old minesweepers and several boats. That's the whole naval pride of Ukraine! In essence, Ukraine has not been able to create a real combat-ready fleet. A collection of random ships in its absurdity and absurdity more resembled a motley Cossack band than a regular naval unit. By 2010, it became apparent that the days of this “sea goblin” are numbered. Every year, fewer and fewer ships could not solve any real problems, and even just go to sea. Every year more and more ships were scrapped. At the same time, Kiev politicians strained themselves to pretend that everything was fine with the Ukrainian Navy, and he was already mortally ill, agonizingly agonizing. Therefore, even if Ukraine had not survived any of today's political upheavals, the Ukrainian Navy would have become history after all in 5-8 years.

The rapid development of events at the beginning of 2014, the fascization of Ukraine, the return of Sevastopol and Crimea to the Russian Federation did not constitute a last chance for survival for the Ukrainian Navy. One by one, the Ukrainian ships lowered their prokayzer flags and raised the St. Andrew flags. The fact that of the twenty-two thousand Ukrainian soldiers who served in the Crimea (and the lion’s share of them were officers and sailors of the Navy) only two thousand declared their desire to continue service in Ukraine, was a blow to the Kiev authorities. Although this fact is a completely logical result of the whole history of the Ukrainian fleet.

What, for example, cost messages, as on the ships blocked by the Sevastopol self-defense forces, the Ukrainian sailors proudly sang "Our proud Varyag does not surrender to the enemy, and allegedly shouted:" The Russians do not surrender! "Yes, the Russians really do not surrender, because serve their Russian Fatherland and the Russian flag, and the heroic Varyag, as is known, has no relation to the ostentatious "courage" of the Ukrainian military inspectors, since this is a song about the Russian ship under the Russian flag, but not about the Ukrainian ship: "We are in front of the enemy did not let down proud Andrew lag ... "It is significant, but there was no Ukrainian sailors of his example to follow than the example of the Russian cruiser" Varyag ". It is also indicative that none of the Ukrainian sailors did not even think to shout: “Ukrainians do not surrender!” And this is understandable, because, as a matter of fact, Ukrainians surrender and move from one camp to another everywhere and always. Not bad it turns out today and the Ukrainian sailors.

Bacillus of betrayal, which gave birth to the Ukrainian naval forces twenty-three years ago, eventually destroyed them. Admiral Tenyukh, already known to us, the deputy commander of the Ukrainian marine battalion, recently accused of betrayal on the air and defiantly left the air. In response, Tenyukh just mumbled something. All this is completely natural ...

Now in Odessa, the last of the Ukrainian ships, the Hetman Sahaidachny, and several fragile boats have found refuge. The fate of the remnants of the Ukrainian Navy is so sad that I feel only pity for them. These fleets of fleet are not needed today neither by trade Odessa, nor Kiev, which is on the verge of economic catastrophe. The circle closed - the fleet, which began its history with treason and betrayal, self-destructed itself as a result of the same betrayal.

When W. Churchill said a wise phrase: "In order to build a ship you need only three years, in order to create a sea nation you need three hundred years!" Alas, but the Ukrainian naval experiment proved once again the correctness of these words. In the twenty-three years of independence, Ukraine did not have either ships or a maritime nation like that. And therefore the trident crowning the coat of arms of Ukraine did not become the trident of the god of the seas of Neptune, yes, apparently, it will never be. But we should not grieve about this!
Author:
Originator:
http://www.simvolika.org/mars_147.htm
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  1. Trailer
    Trailer April 7 2014 08: 47
    -1
    Such naval monsters as England, Spain and Germany are also curtailing their shipbuilding programs.
    Is the author bitten? The Spaniards are building several landing helicopter carriers in Australia, the British - two aircraft carriers, the Germans - submarines for half the world. When did they curl up? Optimized, yes, but not minimized, for sure!
    1. seller trucks
      April 7 2014 09: 39
      +10
      my friend is nothing personal, but things are like this:

      and correctly writes thoroughly, the fleet is expensive and inaccessible to many in terms of money
    2. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee April 7 2014 09: 39
      +14
      We are talking about the Navy, but it really was not and was not at all. Peace be upon him!
      1. vladimirZ
        vladimirZ April 7 2014 18: 10
        +9
        It is impossible not to bring to this article the footage of the transition of "sailors" to the side of the Ukrainian Navy, the film "72 meters". Classic.
      2. Duke
        Duke April 7 2014 22: 28
        +3
        And it was absolutely anecdotal to establish a monument by the Kiev rulers in Sevastopol in honor of the Ukrainian fleet in the form of ... a drunken dancing Zaporozhye Cossack. Until now, I still could not understand why a drunk Cossack was the personification of the entire Ukrainian fleet? Maybe there is some great Ukrainian secret in this, which we are not given to understand!
        1. kumaxa
          kumaxa April 13 2015 06: 51
          0
          but what is there to understand! there was a dog.
    3. PSih2097
      PSih2097 April 7 2014 09: 45
      +3
      Quote: Karavan
      the British - two aircraft carriers

      The British are already thinking about building only one AB, because there is not enough money for the second ...

      Britain may be left without an aircraft carrier strike group until 2030

      The House Parliamentary Commons Distribution Committee on November 29 released a report criticizing the construction plan for two supercarriers Queen Elizabeth and Prince of Wales, Xinhua reported.
      Ships will cost the treasury much more and will be handed over to the fleet later than planned, while the operational potential of the only active carrier will be limited, and the carrier carrier strike group may not be on combat duty until 2030, said committee chairman Margaret Hodge.
      Let us remind you that two ships of the Queen Elizabeth class - the lead ship of the same name and the Prince of Wales - will be assembled at the Rosyth shipyard of Babcock Marine from blocks being built at several British shipyards. The general contractor for the construction is BAE Systems. Queen Elizabeth is expected to enter the fleet in 2020. Earlier, the British government intended to curtail the aircraft carrier program in order to save money, but it turned out that the abandonment of the ships would cost more than further construction. The departmental Strategic Defense and Security Review, released in 2010, contains a compromise clause on the operation of one aircraft carrier of a new type in the Navy and the mothballing of the second aircraft carrier at the end of construction in a state of “high alert” to reduce operating costs. According to the government, these measures will reduce the cost of the aircraft carrier program by 4,4 billion pounds over 10 years.
      However, according to the committee, the actual amount is 3,4 billion pounds.
      "And although the government believes it will save 3,4 billion, the real savings are only 600 million, the remaining 80% is just future expenses. Instead of two aircraft carriers, which would have passed to the fleet in 2016 and 2018 at a price of 3,65 billion pounds ( $ 5,7 billion), we will now spend more than £ 6 billion and get one operational ship in 2020, ”said Hodge.
      At the same time, an aircraft carrier will be able to stay at sea only 150-200 days a year. In addition, the electromagnetic launch catapult, which will be operated on the ship, has not yet been tested and is likely to increase the cost of operating an aircraft carrier. How much it will cost the defense department will become known at the end of 2012.
      According to Hodge, the Department of Defense was wrong to rely on "short-term feasibility and savings, and did not pay enough attention to the long-term balance of costs and benefits."

    4. Good cat
      Good cat April 7 2014 13: 59
      +2
      The key word is "own", because in the North Vikramaditya was built-completed-rebuilt, the Russian Navy is not cold, not hot.
    5. 52
      52 April 7 2014 18: 53
      0
      I absolutely and categorically agree !!!
    6. Dart2027
      Dart2027 April 7 2014 19: 22
      0
      The Spaniards are building - AUSTRALIA.
      The Germans are building - FOR HALF A WORLD.
      Of course they have their own fleet, but not that they are very large.
    7. dustycat
      dustycat April 7 2014 20: 37
      0
      Quote: Karavan
      When did they curl up?


      So they do not build on their own and not for themselves.
      Build a ship is a debit.
      Keeping a ship is a loan.

      Quite different articles.
  2. Berimor 2
    Berimor 2 April 7 2014 09: 12
    +16
    As the naval raft of Ukraine turned out to be insolvent, so the state itself turned out to be insolvent. It remains to believe that it will soon leave the historical arena.
  3. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF April 7 2014 09: 20
    +10
    Soon politely we will build a land bridge to Transnistria and a joke about a submarine in the steppes of Ukraine will come true.
  4. mihailmpmailru
    mihailmpmailru April 7 2014 09: 27
    +7
    I somehow corresponded with the Maydan, so for the most part they don’t know what their coat of arms and its history mean, but they don’t have any information about the flag, these patriots are independent)))
    1. nnz226
      nnz226 April 7 2014 11: 11
      +4
      Well, with the "sovereign ensign" everything is primitive! As the author wrote, svidomye themselves can not think of anything! No anthem, no flag for the Ukrainian Navy. And the flag was "presented" by the independent occupier, the Swedish king Karl 12th. When Mazepa went over to the Swedes, he brought with him a couple of thousand Cossacks. And since the latter did not have a form by which they could be distinguished (like a soldier in the army) from the Cossacks who remained loyal to Peter, then "from the master's shoulder" pennants of the colors of the Swedish flag were hung on the peaks of the Mazepians. the cross on the pennant a la flag would not have been visible, they managed with stripes of zhovto-blakitny. Hence the former sovereign ensign of Rokhlandia. I draw your attention to 2 facts: 1) not a single state flag of the Slavic states bears yellow (except for Rokhlandia)! 2) There is a photo from the European Football Championship 2012, where Swedish and Rohland fans are coming from the game, so you can't tell who is where ?!
      1. chudoudodelt
        chudoudodelt April 7 2014 16: 11
        +5
        yeah, about the flag they constantly confuse it with the Swedish one), and the coat of arms is generally small as it is meant to someday create a real one, but apparently the dabble of the budget is more important for our bureaucrats, there are some kind of coat of arms))
    2. spd2001
      spd2001 April 7 2014 11: 39
      +5
      The emblem of Ukraine is not a trident, but an attacking falcon-coat of arms of Rurik. Not everyone knows about this, but a pity. Rurik is a falcon
      1. Jaros81
        Jaros81 April 7 2014 13: 46
        +2
        The fact that they "made" of Rurik's coat of arms is a laughing stock. The Ukrainian coat of arms is a popular print ... Sorry for being rude. Yes, and the Great Coat of Arms of Ukraine (it really has not yet been approved, but the proposed options ... This is something) is better not to see ..
      2. dustycat
        dustycat April 7 2014 20: 39
        +1
        Only at Rurik did he take off.
        And at the fall he dived.

        As you call a ship - so it will go.
      3. Fedya
        Fedya April 7 2014 21: 03
        +2
        Sorry! Father told me that the falcon Svyatoslav! And directed downwards since the falcon attacks just like that. It’s shitty that Bandera has perverted this worthy sign, others do not perceive it! Just like Bandera.
  5. Ross
    Ross April 7 2014 09: 36
    0
    Quote: mihailmpmailru
    I somehow corresponded with the Maydan, so for the most part they don’t know what their coat of arms and its history mean, but they don’t have any information about the flag, these patriots are independent)))


    Because the Freemasons came up with symbols for them. Trident of Atlantis and the Rurik Falcon. A Bandera left only a trident!
  6. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
    Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2014 09: 36
    +16
    When Churchill said a wise phrase: “In order to build a ship it takes only three years, in order to create a sea nation it takes three hundred years!”

    This was not said by Churchill, but by Andrew Brown Cunningham, the British admiral. When the British troops were defeated in Greece, they retreated to Crete. They decided to defend Crete to the last extreme, the fleet received an order to prevent the landing of naval landing. But it was extremely difficult - the Germans pulled up very powerful air forces, over 400 bombers, and Krit was not far from the Greek coast. The British fleet was able to defend Crete from the sea, but suffered very heavy losses, the British troops were defeated in battle with the German paratroopers, they had to be evacuated, but ... Only the fleet could do this, and he was already on the verge of doing so. If the fleet were to be defeated, England would lose not only Crete, but all of Africa, not only several tens of thousands of soldiers in Crete, but also hundreds of thousands of soldiers in Egypt, etc.
    And then Churchill hinted to the commander of the Mediterranean British fleet that if he refuses to evacuate Crete in order to save the fleet, then all their lordships will understand ...
    Cannigham's answer went down in history. He issued an order for the fleet, beginning with the following words:
    "Hold on! We can and must overcome them. It takes only three years to build a ship, it takes three hundred years to create a sea nation!"
  7. Denis
    Denis April 7 2014 09: 39
    +3
    The failed Sidor itself was sold for scrap already in the 1993 year, far from having served its life
    If he was alone, how many ships these cubs were cut. Like the bums who steal the cable, they will burn it and sell it like copper. And you don’t understand that it’s worth much more like a cable
    Surprisingly, the beginning of the Ukrainian Navy as in a mirror was reflected in its inglorious end - the flight to Odessa of the only Ukrainian frigate “Getman Sagaidachny”
    So what? There, a little white fox will come to him. Will everything be available for home in Odessa?
    Yes, and one is not a warrior in the field
  8. Papabear
    Papabear April 7 2014 09: 47
    +2
    In fact, Ukraine once had a fleet. And the monument in the form of a drunk, but a Cossack, is not in vain. Fleet - small landing ships of the Zaporozhye Cossacks called "Chaika". According to some sources, residents of the shores of Kara Deniz still know and remember who the "Cossacks" are. But the current Svidomo-ragulnye authorities would rather snatch away from this fleet in full and run to the very Lyakhov borders
    1. nnz226
      nnz226 April 7 2014 11: 14
      +5
      Aha! Here Svidomye passed off Hetman Sagaidachny as a "great naval commander"! He already raided the Turks three times. To which the Russians replied that Stenka Razin, who went to Persia "for zipuns" as much as 21 times (the Caspian Sea is along, more of the Black Sea will be across) then can be equated with admirals Ushakov and Nelson!
      1. seller trucks
        April 7 2014 11: 43
        +6
        Quote: nnz226
        In fact, Ukraine once had a fleet.


        do not consider it work:
        1. when did the name Ukraine / Ukrainian appear?
        2.
        Zaporizhzhya Cossacks
        I recommend to get acquainted with the works:
        Shchegoleva S. N. "Ukrainian movement as a modern stage of South Russian separatism"
        Nikolay Ulyanov "The Origin of Ukrainian Separatism"
        In order to understand what an organized criminal group "Zaporizhzhya Sich" is

        Well, in order to separate the flies from cutlets, I will explain that if you call everything by their proper names, then Kozaki are pirates who existed solely due to robbery and free-mercenaries, and at any moment they could betray in favor of the one who pays the most. I really respect and appreciate the work of Nikolai Vasilievich, but in his novel, to put it mildly, got excited.
        1. Sirocco
          Sirocco April 7 2014 16: 53
          +1
          Quote: seller trucks
          then the Cossacks are pirates who existed solely due to robbery and free-mercenarism, and at any moment they could betray in favor of the one who pays the most.

          I recalled a joke about a partisan detachment with a traitor. As always, the story goes in a circle.
          And what is the Judas behavior of the first commander of the Ukrainian fleet, Rear Admiral Kozhin, who, in the evening swearing allegiance to the oath and the Black Sea Fleet, Admiral Kasatonov, the very next morning, as the notorious Mazepa crossed over to another camp. Well, what is not a hero of the Ukrainian nation
        2. podpolkovnik
          podpolkovnik April 8 2014 16: 54
          0
          Well, why got excited? As described, it is.
          Does Gogol's description of Rada in Taras Bulba remind you of anything?
          “Wait a damn fist! - said Bulba to himself, “you will know from me!” And he immediately put revenge on Koshov.
          Having conspired with one and the other, he asked everyone to drink, and the hoppy Cossacks, among several people, pushed straight to the square, where the timpani tied to a pole stood, which usually beat the gathering for the rada ...
          Timpani burst out - and soon black heaps of Cossacks began to gather in the square like bumblebees. Everyone gathered in a circle, and after the third battle, the elders appeared at last: a Kosheva with a club in her hand, a sign of her dignity, a judge with a military seal, a clerk with an inkwell and a Yesul with a rod ...
          “What does this meeting mean, what do you want, panov?” - said the cat. Scolding and screaming prevented him from speaking.
          - Put the club! put it, damn son, now this club! don't want you anymore! - Cossacks shouted from the crowd.
          Some of the sober smokers seemed to want to resist; but the smokers, both drunk and sober, went to their fists. Shouting and noise became common.
          Kosheva wanted to talk, but, knowing that the furious, high-handed crowd could beat him to death for this, which is almost always the case, bowed very low, laid a club and disappeared into the crowd.
          - Command, panov, and we put dignity? - said the judge, the clerk and the esaul and were preparing to immediately put an inkwell, a military seal and a rod.
          “No, you stay,” shouted from the crowd, “we only needed to drive the cat one off, because he is a woman, and we need a man in koshev.”
          - Who do you choose now in koshovy? - said the elders.
          - Choose a cuckoo! Shouted the part.
          - We do not want Kukubenka! - shouted another, - early to him: even the milk on his lips has not dried out.
          - Let awl be ataman! - shouted alone. - Sheila put in koshovy!
          - Sewed in your back! - the crowd screamed with abuse, - what kind of Cossack is he when he steals, a dog’s son like a Tatar? To hell with the bag drunk Sheela!
          - Bearded, Bearded will put in koshovy!
          “We don't want the Bearded!” to the unclean mother of the Bearded!
          - Shout to Kirdyagu! - whispered Taras Bulba to some.
          - Kirdyagu! Kirdyagu! Shouted the crowd. - Bearded, Bearded! Kirdyagu, Kirdyagu! Shila! to hell with Shil! Kirdyagu!
          All the candidates, having heard their names spoken, immediately left the crowd so as not to give any reason to think that they helped their personal participation in the election.
          - Kirdyagu! Kirdyagu! - was heard stronger than others. - Bearded!
          They began to prove the matter with their fists, and Kirdyaga triumphed.
          - Follow the Kirdyaga! They shouted.
          About a dozen Cossacks separated themselves from the crowd; some of them barely stood on their feet - they managed to load up to such an extent, and went straight to Kirdyag to announce his election.
          Kirdyaga, although an elderly but intelligent Cossack, had long been sitting in his kuren and, as it were, was unaware of anything that was happening.
          “What, panov, what do you need?” - he asked.
          - Go, you were chosen as a cat!
          - Have mercy, Panov! - said Kirdyaga, - where can I be worthy of such an honor! where can I be koshev! Yes, I don’t have enough reason to send such a post. As if no one was better in the whole army?
          “Go, they tell you!” Cried the Cossacks. Two of them grabbed him by the arms, and no matter how he rested his feet, but was finally dragged into the square, accompanied by abuse, pushing from behind with fists, kicks and exhortations: - Do not back up, damn son! take honor, dog, when they give it to you!
          Thus, Kirdyaga was introduced into the Cossack circle.
          “What, panov,” the people who brought him proclaimed to the whole people, “do you agree that this Cossack should be a cat of ours?”
          - Everyone agrees! The crowd screamed, and the whole field rattled for a long time from the scream.
      2. Denis
        Denis April 7 2014 17: 12
        +1
        Quote: nnz226
        Here Svidomye passed off Hetman Sagaidachny as a "great naval commander"

        Well, I needed my own someone.
        In one of the mattress states, the admiral can be for 20 $
        And already the details that the papers are valid only in this state and that, well, just a trifle, he does not have access to the sea
        Absolutely real, giving the right to command all warships. True, only in the state. For reference: Nebraska is located in the very center of the United States, and to the nearest sea from all sides two thousand kilometers.
        http://otvet.mail.ru/question/36010417
  9. Leader
    Leader April 7 2014 10: 50
    +4
    Quote: PapaBear
    In fact, Ukraine once had a fleet. And the monument in the form of a drunk, but a Cossack, is not in vain. Fleet - small landing ships of the Zaporozhye Cossacks called "Chaika". According to some sources, residents of the shores of Kara Deniz still know and remember who the "Cossacks" are.

    "Small airborne ..."? There is no need to intertwine modern terms with hoary antiquity. And the Cossacks are not Ukrainians.
    In addition, mercenary-predatory raids on neighbors in the era of barbarism are not a heroic example for posterity, and not an argument in this conversation.
    The hohl were and were cowardly looters ... They are not at all sorry for them.
  10. Stasi
    Stasi April 7 2014 11: 07
    +1
    For us, the fate of the Ukrainian fleet is very instructive. It is necessary to learn from this and take steps to ensure that such a fate does not happen to our fleet, now or in the future. Thank God, the Russian fleet managed to survive the dashing 90s, when he was threatened with the fate of the Ukrainian fleet, our fleet managed to survive and now it is pumping up muscles and gaining power. I hope that our Black Sea Fleet will become a formidable force and will dominate the Black Sea in order to inspire fear and awe to the Turks and other Westerners who dared to enter our Black Sea.
    1. pt730
      pt730 April 7 2014 12: 43
      -7
      But did the Navy prevent the Russian Black Sea Fleet from becoming invincible and inspire fear and horror in the world ??)) Russian news, as you look, it’s immediately clear that the AUGs in Gibralatar are pushing, trying to get to the Atlantic as soon as they know that the cruiser Moscow in Sevastopol is fuel takes on board)
      1. Stasi
        Stasi April 7 2014 14: 14
        +3
        Our politicians, together with Kiev, prevented our Black Sea Fleet from becoming invincible. Ordinary sailors and officers of both fleets of both Russian and Ukrainian maintained friendly relations with each other and with what they could help each other. So do not think that someone is gloating over the Black Sea Fleet of Ukraine, no. The fate of the Ukrainian fleet is an example and reflection of the policy of Ukraine and the quality of its power.
        1. pt730
          pt730 April 7 2014 17: 53
          -5
          The last Kiev politician, Yanukovych, who did everything to destroy the Ukrainian Armed Forces - this is Moscow, he is an independent figure and acted exclusively in the interests of the Kremlin, including in commercial ones. And the murder of a Ukrainian officer (unarmed) by a military officer of the 810th Marine Brigade of the Russian Federation last night is yet another confirmation of a true, friendly relationship.
          But we departed from the topic, in fact, the Navy has nothing to do with the fact that the Black Sea Fleet is inferior to the Turkish fleet. And due to the fact that part of the Navy has ceased to exist, the fleet of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation has not even approached the Turkish fleet by half a percent.
          1. Denis
            Denis April 7 2014 21: 44
            -2
            Quote: pt730
            And from the fact that part of the Navy has ceased to exist, the fleet of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation has not even approached the Turkish fleet by half a percent

            Yes, Goebels would be pleased:
            part of the Navy ceased to exist
            And most of the left?
            The main thing is not in quantity, the thing is fixable. The main thing is in order in the main base. And now it will be there!
          2. dmitriygorshkov
            dmitriygorshkov April 7 2014 23: 33
            -4
            Quote: pt730
            And due to the fact that part of the Navy has ceased to exist, the fleet of the Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation did not even approach the Turkish fleet by half a percent.

            Did the part cease to exist? Or is it not all, except for the first and how it is instituted in Ukraine named after the traitor? What kind of people are these and heroes!
            And you got a banderlozhik poking the Turkish fleet!
            For Svidomo idiots, I can add that Russia not only in the Black Sea has a fleet.
            And an officer who gets into a military unit while drunk ... read UG and KS!
            Although you did not serve in the army, and do not know what it is!
            I’m glad that you have only woodpeckers. This is an indicator!
            1. pt730
              pt730 April 8 2014 09: 24
              -3
              What does the people have to do with ?? Or the descendants of the Vlasovites have nothing more to say? Why are you, a victim of the Golden Horde, so nervous about the Turkish fleet?
              And the fact that he was drunk and where he climbed, did you see ?? he was there, or Kiselyov had seen enough, as it should be a sofa warrior?)
              1. dmitriygorshkov
                dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 09: 36
                -4
                Quote: pt730
                What does the people have to do with ?? Or the descendants of the Vlasovites have nothing more to say?

                You don’t know how to play, but you’re trying to distort! Where did I write about the people? I don’t confuse Banderlozhiks with the people! Do not speak on behalf of the people!
                Vlasov is a shame for Russia! And Bandera is a hero for you! Do you feel the difference?
                Victim of the Golden Horde ... finally killed! Read your textbooks about the Mongols in the Kiev region!
                Where did he go? He was killed at the post, and if he was sober, then even sadder!
                1. The comment was deleted.
                2. pt730
                  pt730 April 8 2014 16: 51
                  -2
                  For Vlasov, I explain, you wrote "what the people are, such are the heroes." So I asked what the people have to do with it?
                  Damn, how do you know who my hero is?) In the Moscow region, read about the Mongols)
                  Why should there be a post ??))) Where is the post there at all, do you imagine the object on the ground?) And he was killed inside the hostel in which he lived! There is blood and bullets in the walls!
                  1. podpolkovnik
                    podpolkovnik April 8 2014 17: 01
                    -1
                    Quote: pt730
                    Full name: Alex [Add to the black list]
                    Group: Visitors
                    Registration Date: 25 March 2014 17: 03
                    Last Visited: April 8 2014 16: 46

                    ICQ number:
                    Location: Sevastopol
                    Number of publications: 0 (View all publications)
                    Number of comments: 21 (Recent Comments)
                    Status: Online Online
                    Rating: - -872 +


                    What can you argue with this person?
                    Admin, ban this provocateur, pliz.
                    1. pt730
                      pt730 April 8 2014 17: 10
                      0
                      Justify! alas, some inhabitants of this site turn any conversation about weapons to politics)
                      1. dmitriygorshkov
                        dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 17: 55
                        -3
                        Quote: pt730
                        Justify! alas, some inhabitants of this site turn any conversation about weapons to politics)

                        Why are you justifying them? You're chasing the same nonsense in a circle!
                      2. pt730
                        pt730 April 8 2014 17: 58
                        0
                        Did you ask to justify ??
                3. dmitriygorshkov
                  dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 17: 54
                  -1
                  Quote: pt730
                  For Vlasov, I explain, you wrote "what the people are, such are the heroes." So I asked what the people have to do with it?
                  Damn, how do you know who my hero is?) In the Moscow region, read about the Mongols)
                  Why should there be a post ??))) Where is the post there at all, do you imagine the object on the ground?) And he was killed inside the hostel in which he lived! There is blood and bullets in the walls!

                  Do not ask the same questions. I already explained to you about the Vlasov! By the way, read more closely about General Vlasov.
                  Do not curse the poodle (m), what gods do you pray you showed!
                  About the Mongols, I read more than you read in your life in general! So for the ukroobrazovanny repeat-the Mongols in Russia was not!
                  1. pt730
                    pt730 April 8 2014 18: 02
                    +1
                    Without you I will figure out what and who to ask! You leave any questions unanswered, but simply carry some shnyaga. What could you read in your life if you were not able to read and understand the three posts?
            2. Viktor Shmagin
              Viktor Shmagin April 8 2014 15: 21
              +2
              The Ukrainian authorities did not allow changing the naval staff in Sevastopol, now this is irrelevant, and the Black Sea Fleet will increase
            3. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker April 8 2014 16: 59
              +1
              Quote: pt730
              And the fact that he was drunk and where he climbed, did you see ?? myself there would

              1. Do not touch Kiseleva - listen to your Bandero-TV.
              2. You were there ... maybe you shot?
              1. pt730
                pt730 April 8 2014 17: 13
                0
                in general in Novofedrovka was more than once. That evening was not there. Where the blood and bullet holes I saw. In addition, there are photos and videos.
                Go watch your goebels and rejoice that you are aware of all the events
                1. dmitriygorshkov
                  dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 17: 58
                  +1
                  Quote: pt730
                  Go watch your goebels and rejoice that you are aware of all the events

                  And you speak with you? Fascist himself, and calls others Goebels! While flawed! Tired of you!
                2. stalkerwalker
                  stalkerwalker April 8 2014 18: 24
                  +1
                  Quote: pt730
                  Go watch your goebels and rejoice that you are aware of all the events

                  You have to answer for the bazaar ...
                  Get with a vidsill, diving ...
          3. The comment was deleted.
          4. podpolkovnik
            podpolkovnik April 8 2014 16: 59
            0
            Do not pay attention - the man made a mistake on the sites ...
        2. podpolkovnik
          podpolkovnik April 8 2014 16: 57
          +1
          Nothing to mess with sites?
          Probably wanted to get to the censor?
          Or on the "Ear of Moscow"?
          Come on troll ...
    2. dmitriygorshkov
      dmitriygorshkov April 7 2014 23: 22
      -4
      Quote: pt730
      ) Russian news, as you look,

      Where did you see such “Russian news?” Not in the retelling of the 5th channel?
      1. dmitriygorshkov
        dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 17: 56
        0
        Quote: dmitriygorshkov
        dmitriygorshkov

        And who apart from this banderlozhik minuses has instructed me?
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker April 8 2014 18: 26
          +1
          Quote: dmitriygorshkov
          And who apart from this banderlozhik minuses has instructed me?

          They come into the gang here - one silly troll, and the rest of the minuses are riveting.
          But before "the songs are sung," sho b the right buttons to poke paws to get.
          Bandera ...
  • sso-xnumx
    sso-xnumx April 7 2014 11: 11
    +1
    "... just as ingloriously" rested in the Bose. "

    only it will be more correct not in the Bose, but in the convoy!
  • MolGro
    MolGro April 7 2014 11: 24
    0

    You can remember))
  • kodxnumx
    kodxnumx April 7 2014 11: 25
    +1
    it’s a pity only because these so-called Ukrainian authorities, since 90 years, have done so much evil and dirty tricks to us, remember the first atomic aircraft carrier sawn to needles, and it was not one on the list, China acquired at the price of aircraft carrier scrap other museum, cruisers frigates, one project the ati doshypor rots against the wall, it began to be built under the ussr and the dosihpor doesn’t rust before the mind, it’s how much labor and money they ruined, corrupt!
    1. UI-Spb
      UI-Spb April 7 2014 12: 13
      +4
      Excuse me, please, I agree with what you write, but you cannot make so many spelling mistakes. The Russian language is worthy of respect. Sorry for the notation again.
    2. No Name
      No Name April 10 2014 20: 01
      0
      Quote: kod3001
      , remember the first atomic aircraft carrier sawn into needles

      The Russian Federation refused ships, due to lack of funding, aircraft carriers gave the plant on account of debts.
      Ukraine had no money for completion. As the chief builder put it, when he was asked what is needed to complete the construction of a nuclear aircraft carrier: "USSR, Central Committee, State Planning Committee, Military Industrial Complex and nine defense ministries." Neither Ukraine nor the Russian Federation could then complete it.
      The only way to save the Ulyanovsk is to finish building it to the point of readiness, at which it could be launched, possibly mothballed, etc.
      BUT all this would have to be done for the money of ChSZ, which even then had to fight for its existence. That's why they sawed that the Americans promised orders - so that 60 factory workers would not remain without work.
      When they realized that they threw us - it was too late.
      P.S. I want you to understand: aircraft carriers were sold and cut not in spite of Russia, but simply because they suddenly turned out to be of no use to anyone.
  • parusnik
    parusnik April 7 2014 11: 42
    +5
    Ukraine with foam at the mouth demanded exactly half of the shipboard and coastal infrastructure And to contain plainly did not contain anything acted on the principle:
    I don't z'im, then I bite over
    1. pt730
      pt730 April 7 2014 12: 30
      -8
      The section got all the oldest and not combat-ready. All living ships were built after the partition of Ukraine independently.
      1. Artem1967
        Artem1967 April 7 2014 18: 12
        +2
        The entire Black Sea Fleet of the USSR was not particularly new in terms of ship composition, so there is no need to complain. Ukraine could not even maintain small ships with dignity, what to say about cruisers. Had you got "Moscow", you would have sold your soul for scrap metal!
        1. rebel
          rebel April 7 2014 18: 26
          -5
          Sagaidachny, Slavutich, Lutsk, Ternopil in good condition, are much more worthy than the cruiser Moscow or Inquisitive. BDK and KFOR too. Zaporozhye of course the scrap was full upon receipt at the section.
          Although judging by the comments it is clear that on this resource you need to write only about the unconditional superiority of the Fleets of the Russian Federation over everything that at least somehow walks (floats) across the seas and oceans.
          1. Artem1967
            Artem1967 April 8 2014 07: 46
            +1
            Quote: rebel
            Although judging by the comments it is clear that on this resource you need to write only about the unconditional superiority of the Fleets of the Russian Federation over everything that at least somehow walks (floats) across the seas and oceans.


            Do not be offended and continue to defend your point of view. An alternative opinion is always important to know. As a result, we find the truth. Good luck in everything!
          2. dmitriygorshkov
            dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 08: 05
            0
            Quote: rebel
            Although judging by the comments it is clear that on this resource you need to write only about the unconditional superiority of the Fleets of the Russian Federation over everything that at least somehow walks (floats) across the seas and oceans.

            On this resource, to lie it is necessary to be at least in the subject, what are you talking about, even discussing laziness!
            Quote: rebel
            Sagaidachny, Slavutich, Lutsk, Ternopil in good condition, are much more worthy than the cruiser Moscow or Inquisitive. BDK and KFOR too.

            I feel sorry for you! So I want to be proud of something, but nothing!
            It’s not our fault that you abandoned the common great ancestors and chose for your lack of the best heroes so insane that they probably have a separate block in hell!
            1. pt730
              pt730 April 8 2014 09: 15
              0
              Pity yourself) I don’t need an object for pride. I wrote that these ships are in better condition (not in terms of firepower) than Moscow, Bora, Samum, Inquisitive, Savvy. And this is not a reason for the Navy’s pride)))) It’s just a fact indicating the final state of the Russian Black Sea Fleet and the attempt of couch warriors to inflate its fighting capacity to unimaginable sizes) Although this is the norm on this resource) AUG easily drowns under the weight of the hats of potreota!
              1. dmitriygorshkov
                dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 09: 27
                0
                Quote: pt730
                I don’t need an object for pride.

                Of course you don’t need it! You have Bandera, Shukhevychi, Sagaidachnye ... and other heroes of the same plan!
                And you are proud of the Turkish fleet, probably you built it?
                And you need to read carefully, I already answered you that the Russian Federation has other fleets besides the Black Sea Fleet and the Black Sea Fleet is not the best component.
                As for the couch warriors, I hope you are silent? Unfortunately I’m not a couch, much to my regret.
          3. igorkuzik
            igorkuzik April 8 2014 09: 47
            0
            Slavutich stood almost the entire independence of the wall on the Kurina
          4. Viktor Shmagin
            Viktor Shmagin April 8 2014 15: 26
            0
            Now write contained
          5. sso-xnumx
            sso-xnumx April 9 2014 00: 55
            0
            The Russian Navy at least somehow walks across the seas and oceans, and everyone who is not blind shows the St. Andrew flag.
            And the Ukrainian only "floated" near the coast. Professional Sailors agree with me !!!
      2. rebel
        rebel April 7 2014 18: 22
        -3
        yes, everything was clearly divided, the Navy's minesweeper in 1976, for the CFRF MRK "Bora") and so on throughout the composition.
        1. Viktor Shmagin
          Viktor Shmagin April 8 2014 15: 29
          +1
          Why do you need a fleet, Bandera and Shukhevych not sailors
        2. podpolkovnik
          podpolkovnik April 9 2014 09: 30
          0
          Quote: rebel
          yes, everything was clearly divided, the Navy's minesweeper in 1976, for the CFRF MRK "Bora") and so on throughout the composition.


          So as not to fall when walking, take it on my own ...
      3. 52
        52 April 7 2014 19: 01
        -1
        Are you sane comrade?
      4. Denis
        Denis April 7 2014 21: 49
        0
        Quote: pt730
        All living ships were built after the partition of Ukraine independently.
        List please
        Or get a correspondent's honorary card
        Quote: sv68
        agency p - dun info Ukraine
        1. pt730
          pt730 April 8 2014 09: 19
          0

          All "living" in the Ukrainian Navy are precisely those who were built or completed by Ukraine and entered into the fleet. What's so surprising about that?
          Ternopol, U-209
          Lutsk U-205
          Getman Sagaidachny
          Slavutich
          Here they are the most alive.
          Olshansky and Kirovohrad are still in good condition, but they were introduced into the fleet even under the USSR.
          1. igorkuzik
            igorkuzik April 8 2014 09: 48
            0
            They were completed by ukriya, but not built!
            1. Denis
              Denis April 8 2014 12: 17
              -1
              Quote: igorkuzik
              They were completed by ukriya, but not built

              I admit that I’m wrong, in vain I started a dispute with Maydanutye
              The dispute was about built so intertwined
              Quote: igorkuzik
              Olshansky and Kirovohrad are still in good condition, but they were introduced into the fleet even under the USSR.

              And what is Ulyanovsk not mentioned? He was also somewhat peculiarly completed
              Demagogy, and only
              1. pt730
                pt730 April 8 2014 17: 06
                0
                Where did I write that Olshansky and Kirovohrad were built or completed by Ukraine ?? Or is it not interesting to read? I wrote that these two boxes were in good technical condition and normally maintained.
            2. pt730
              pt730 April 8 2014 17: 04
              -1
              Well, Ruskistan definitely has nothing to do with them. They came down to the water in Ukraine, two were being completed, two were being built. Slavutich was laid in Nikolaev, although in Soviet times, but in the Ukrainian SSR.
      5. Viktor Shmagin
        Viktor Shmagin April 8 2014 15: 25
        +1
        Yeah, a particularly prominent example is the cruiser Ukraine
  • sv68
    sv68 April 7 2014 12: 12
    +3
    as p-dong info agency reports, Ukraine began urgently restoring its navy from the African continent in the near future it is necessary to overtake thirty pie belonging to the once tribe Yumba tribe and donated to Ukraine by local shamans. the vessels received will become the basis of a new powerful fleet
    1. Denis
      Denis April 7 2014 17: 22
      +2
      Quote: sv68
      agency p - dun info

      + good
      It seems that all the media are united in this concern
  • serge
    serge April 7 2014 12: 16
    +6
    Fleet of Ukraine.
  • moremansf
    moremansf April 7 2014 12: 41
    +6
    This showed the short-sighted policy of the top leadership of Ukraine ...
  • Silent
    Silent April 7 2014 12: 46
    +3
    Sorry comrades, but the article is a minus. Not because the Ukrainian fleet is the best, of course it is not. But the Russian military, and not only the military, would do well to learn to respect their neighbors and not call everyone "who is against us" traitors.
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa April 7 2014 21: 14
      +3
      Quote: Silent
      But to the Russian military ...

      I am a Russian military man, and I did not like the spirit of the officer’s article in my equal rank.
      THIS WORDS IS NOT A SEAMAN, BUT POLICY! People of the sea are always very respectful of their peers. No other way: THE SEA WILL NOT FORGIVE!
      POLITICS ARE NOT SEAFARERS, just like most SEAFARERS are NOT POLITICS. We are alien to disassembling in a communal kitchen, turning inside out another's underwear.
      Everyone understands that the Navy rested in a Bose. Therefore, have leniency towards the deceased. The Ukrainian Navy died as a combat unit when they disengaged from the Black Sea Fleet of the USSR.
      Then there was degradation and agony, and not development and combat activity.
    2. dmitriygorshkov
      dmitriygorshkov April 8 2014 08: 14
      -2
      Quote: Silent
      ... But the Russian military, and not only the military, would do well to learn to respect their neighbors and not call everyone "who is against us" traitors.

      That is, in your opinion, the people whose heroes are Bandera, Shukhevych (by the way, you seem to be from Belarus ...) are worthy of respect and NOT TRADERS?
      Take a trip to Khatyn, I think not very far from you, and tell this to the chimneys, witnesses of the visit of the gentlemen you respect!
      1. Silent
        Silent April 9 2014 00: 04
        +2
        Let's do it in order. I am really from Belarus and I know very well who burned Khatyn. Neither to these people themselves, nor to their ideological descendants of sympathy, I can have.
        Here is just a footnote on how the people mentioned in the article give interviews about "their idols". But it is not even the facts in the article that are alarming, but rather its general tone, which actually implies that all who are "against us" are no other than traitors.
        Think about it, we all walk under God, if your region is separated from its state tomorrow, and you are bound by an oath, what will you do? And after all, what you will not do, someone will definitely call you a traitor.
        1. Sergey Minin
          Sergey Minin April 9 2014 12: 39
          +1
          Yes, the article is really political. And it’s clear that forum rules do not work for everyone)
  • [comment-show]
    igorkuzik
    igorkuzik April 7 2014 12: 53
    +5
    [quote The second miracle of the Navy is the Slavutich control ship, which was built as a self-propelled base for unloading and neutralizing nuclear submarine reactors. In the Navy, he portrayed a control ship!

    "Slavutich" has never been a base for a submarine - the author confuses it with pr 2020, which, simultaneously with the ship pr 12884 Pridneprovie (which is now Slavutich), was being built at the Black Sea shipyard in Nikolaev.
    "Pridneprovye" was supposed to serve in Kamchatka and its goals were completely different
    [/ comment-show] [comment-deleted]
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    [/ comment-deleted]
  • erofich
    erofich April 7 2014 13: 19
    -3
    Do traitors need to be respected?
    1. Denis
      Denis April 7 2014 17: 47
      -1
      Quote: erofich
      Do traitors need to be respected?

      You can reward
      The Order of Judah is an order made in a single copy in 1709 by order of Tsar Peter the Great to award the hetman Mazepa.
      Way fellow countryman
  • Kubanets
    Kubanets April 7 2014 14: 10
    +1
    It is not clear why they decided to call the "storm of the seas" Sidor Bely? Potemkin's white creature fought gloriously near Ochakovo for the glory of Russian arms; he rose to the rank of colonel in indelibility. Subsequently, the organizer of the resettlement of the Cossacks to the Kuban.
  • RoTTor
    RoTTor April 7 2014 14: 31
    -2
    1. flag of the Ukrainian Navy = "naval" flag of the operetta hetman "derzhava" German puppet "GET'man" Skoropadsky, a former Russian general who became a traitor.
    2. There is no fleet, but what to do with "admirals"?
    3. "As a ship you name so a ship will sail." Both Ukraine and the Ukrainian Navy are repeating the fate of the failed flagship of the ocean-going sea fleet - the large missile cruiser "Ukraine", which is completely unnecessary for Ukraine and rotting at the factory wall. And they don't want to buy it for scrap. Only the cost of not drowning.
    4. Judging by the number of merchant ships, with Ukrainian crews (a merchant fleet — three shipping companies that have been completely stolen by Ukraine, no merchant fleet and never will be) that seize, arrest, etc., the Navy does not fulfill one of the most important tasks of any navy - protection of merchant shipping.

    5. At the section, everything that was possible was enough to get the mooring front due to pennants, etc.


    6. Who blocked the service in Soviet times, the leadership of the Ukrainian Navy of that time - Rear Admiral Boris Kozhin, cap. 1 rank of Lupakov.
    It seems that the surnames are Russian, they were not offended by a career in the Navy of the USSR, what are disguised enemies, that Bandera are children in comparison with them.
    However, the first Minister of Defense of independent Ukraine, Major General Aviation K. Morozov was a Leninist cleaner than Lenin himself.
    That’s how many enemies the Specialists, personnel officers, political workers missed - the profiles of these traitors are correct. They were not looking for enemies there, or themselves - enemies.
    With the current Ministry of Defense of Ukraine, Tenyukh, everything is clear: despite the correct nationality, partisanship and education at the best naval school, 8 (eight) years without promotion, commander of the base minesweeper. Alcoholic? Moron? Not for nothing that in the Austro-Hungarian imperial royal fleet the Galicians and were not allowed to enter the service for a cannon shot. Due to dullness, deceit, and fear of water. But it was the Zapadentsy tenyuh who, on his minesweeper, was the first to raise the Ukrainian flag in the KChF and left Sevast. to Odessa. He came in handy to the Americans, quickly learned the intricacies of betrayal, like the other leaders of ukro-MO, and now that his friends-zapadentsi are in power, they urgently produced tenuhi from the reserve to the defense ministers. Poor Ukraine ... Again did not take place ...
  • pt730
    pt730 April 7 2014 16: 41
    0
    That someone slammed me minus, but for what ?? I didn’t write the truth that under the combat-efficient ships section they left for the Black Sea Fleet and the old ones left the Navy? What am I wrong ?? It is full of naval commanders, lay out a list of the naval staff after the section and everything will become clear.
  • Makyr
    Makyr April 7 2014 17: 23
    -2
    And therefore, the trident crowning the emblem of Ukraine did not become the trident of the god of the seas of Neptune ...

    The trident lacks only one symbol of Ukraine - a piece of bacon.
  • Sergei75
    Sergei75 April 7 2014 18: 47
    0
    And I do not agree with this formulation of the question, which means "The Ukrainian fleet, which began its inglorious history for twenty-three years, has just as ingloriously" rested in the Bose. "
    How he started this one, we ourselves don't have very faces (in the sense that we all started the same way and our fleet on the Black Sea also has nothing to brag about), but "rested in the Bose" - I disagree in principle, the author wanted Ukrainian sailors to accept the latter fight, opened the kingstones and gave God their soul with a song?
    No, I believe that he had almost finished his existence, most of the Ukrainian sailors did not go against the will of their people and the union of 2 fleets took place! These are now the glorious pages of Our History, even after so many years of deception, the Ukrainian sailors were able to preserve their honor, they did not shoot at their people, and some began in the 93rd year!
  • Kily
    Kily April 7 2014 19: 20
    +1
    They would give the submarine to the museum. There it is the place :))
  • Sergei75
    Sergei75 April 7 2014 22: 25
    -2
    In general, I do not like the style of the article, sailors who refused to start a war with their people, called traitors and deserters, someone wants to gradually hammer a wedge between Russians and Ukrainians, to hell with you, it will not work!
    You must have the courage to take the initiative into your own hands and prevent a direct confrontation between the Russians and Ukrainians from starting, while their leaders were putting out their brains and yelling - "Shoot, shoot!"
    I thank those Ukrainian sailors who remained faithful to their people and switched to the side of the Crimea!
  • Autolife
    Autolife April 7 2014 22: 27
    0
    Mentally written, read with great pleasure! Like a quote from Churchill! Which in fact very well drew a line under the article.
  • kodxnumx
    kodxnumx April 8 2014 01: 01
    0
    it’s a good man to stir up the water, I understand that you have some kind of resentment against RUSSIA, just humble yourself and take it for granted, Ukraine without RUSSIA ceases to be Ukraine, I understand it’s not nice to hear it, but it’s true! and now they are tearing Ukraine not from RUSSIA but from the west and the United States, Ukraine is now in the role of a game and the hunter is a game hunter, RUSSIA is simply trying to save Ukraine as best as possible, God bless you, but what about the fleet that you blame that they say the old ships were not like that if you don’t follow and repairing everything has the property of breaking down, you had a chance you didn’t realize it, you just ruined the military units, and how many new boxes with different percentages of readiness for the needles were put into operation, extended, the atlas is rotting against the wall. So if you were coming from here, be a man good luck and health to your family!
  • xomaNN
    xomaNN April 8 2014 14: 52
    -1
    In many ways, I agree with the author on the topic of random selection of boards of the Navy. What they grabbed was glad for the Ukrainian. admirals in the 90s winked
    And the Russian ships remaining in Crimea are going to be given back to the Naval Forces of Ukraine, judging by Shoigu's reports. Although, taking into account the 30-year period there is little worthy of attention of the seafarers, several MPK and both airborne (BDK + KFOR) may even "squeeze". A submarine "Zaporozhye" for a museum in Odessa, even in tow, you have to hold out.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Norman
    Norman April 11 2014 15: 49
    0
    And why can't Ukraine without Russia, maybe let's try. Take your separatists from the East of Ukraine. But whether the imperial "superpower" can do without Ukraine is the question. And the fact that the fleet was plundered by the Kremlin's henchmen in the form of our former rulers is a fact.
  • ppgt90
    ppgt90 April 11 2014 21: 04
    0
    I would like to say that it is not only about the Ukrainian navy. There is a crisis in the armed forces in Ukraine. The army did not become after the separation from the USSR. It is unclear why Ukraine needed armed forces at all? Initially, there were no resources for maintaining the army and navy in Ukraine. During its so-called independence, not only the army and the navy collapsed, the state itself collapsed. For more than twenty years this artificially created country has been constantly shaking and feverish. Its economy is not only impossible to reanimate, it is simply impossible to imagine what it looks like. A couple of separate regions cannot feed the whole country. Over the past twenty-odd years, Ukraine has not found a leader capable of uniting the country and carrying out reforms to create a single state, a state economy, and a single state ideology. It's just that on revolutions of all colors and the archaic ideology of the Banderaites, Ukrainians will never create anything worthwhile and will not achieve any positive results. And it's impossible to talk about the current rulers of Ukraine. These people are completely devoid of common sense. With them, Ukraine will disappear from the world map as a country in general. This path of the Ukrainian state can be described simply: "Hurry back to the colony." Everyone chooses his own path, but it must be chosen not by the strange slogans of the paranoid, but by common sense and pragmatic calculation.
    1. Norman
      Norman April 12 2014 22: 53
      0
      They wrote well in the plan, logically stated their idea without accusations (though Bendery’s again didn’t give you peace of mind), but it’s not bad for us to live with them. But from the beginning of independence, well, we almost did not have patriots with a national idea, all the former Komunyak sellers who have been selling the country all this time, do you really think that the civil protest on the Maidan is a fiction, people are so tired of this endless robbery and the inability to defend themselves legal by way. And the army has long been a hostage to the economic situation, but not so tragically if we do not betray our revolution, we will certainly rise.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • rusakov89
    rusakov89 7 August 2014 21: 25
    0
    I liked the article, but because of the stupid rule (10 comments) I could not put +1