Military Review

Russia Ukraine. Paralysis of trade partnership beneficial to a third party

76
To put it mildly, not the best times have come for full-fledged cooperation between Russia and Ukraine. The situation is such that today even the word “cooperation” looks out of place when it comes to hypothetically possible contacts between Moscow and Kiev. At this time, up to 99% of all “tangible” contacts between the Russian Federation and Ukraine in a very peculiar way are carried out through, perhaps, the media. First, statements of some about others are published in the media, because others through the media respond first. Even the mat slips - another hello to Tymoshenko ...

Full-time controversy - while nonsense.

Against the background of the development of such a situation, an increasing number of mutually useful connections (useful for both Ukraine and Russia) are breaking, and there are no options yet to keep the remaining threads intact. Russian-Ukrainian trade is plunging into a deep crisis. The level of trade between our countries began to fall even a few months before the "victory of the Maidan" in Kiev. The first “swallow” of falling mutual trade volumes manifested itself at a time when the Cabinet of Ministers of Azarov, with the declared consent of President Yanukovych, was about to sign an agreement on economic association with the EU. Russia was forced to announce that it would protect its domestic market and the market of the Customs Union from European goods that could rush across the Russian border through the territory of Ukraine opening for them. This alone led to a chain reaction in the form of a “correction” of joint programs with a blow to the volume of trade. "Correction" stopped when Yanukovych announced that the signing of an agreement with the EU postponed. What started after that is known to all.

Today, the self-proclaimed authorities in Kiev say that the decline in mutual trade with the Russian Federation is already already benefiting the Ukrainian economy. However, not all Ukrainian politicians and economists speak in the form of ceremonial speeches “about the benefits” of falling commodity circulation with Russia. The so-called Minister of Economic Development and Trade of Ukraine, Pavel Sheremeta, who studied at the time at a business school in an American university, said this (the words UNIAN):

Trade with Russia, of course, decreases, since it requires favorable conditions on both sides. But at the same time this situation is favorable from the point of view of the EU. And there is growing trade.

As you can see, Mr. Sheremeta in this case does not even conceal for whom the fall in commodity circulation between Ukraine and the Russian Federation is favorable. So says: "favorable from the point of view of the EU." So he says: “it grows there” ... Well, at least what is in the current Ukrainian political system there are people who can call things by their proper names.

The growth of Ukraine-EU trade turnover since February of this year has indeed increased by about 14% on an annualized basis. It would seem that the Ukrainian partners need to rejoice - they were able to bring their products to the European market - a real trade victory for Ukraine. But Kiev with fanfare and festive processions still have to wait, because the turnover, as the minister said well, is growing "there." The fact is that the foreign trade deficit over the same period of time (from February 2014 of the year) in Ukraine grew by about 11-12% compared to the same period last year. Foreign trade deficit is the excess of imports over exports. If we combine information on the growth of Ukraine’s trade with the European Union with information on the growth of the foreign trade deficit in Ukraine, it turns out that it is growing European imports that ensure the said trade. In fact, this means that Ukraine still opened its doors to imports from Europe, but Ukrainian exports cannot squeeze into the same doors in any way - either the movement through the doorway is one-sided due to the skillful EU economic policy, or the Ukrainian economy itself So far, it is not able to offer anything substantial to "partners" in Europe. Ukrainian “authorities” in the person, for example, Yatsenyuk can say anything, but the figures mentioned are able to say much more than all the “Maidan leaders” put together.

Let us return to the trade between Russia and Ukraine. One of its large-scale segments is trade in the military-technical sphere. And here at the forefront is placed not only profit from mutual trade, but also getting the finished equipment or the necessary components for it. If cooperation in this sphere between Ukraine and the Russian Federation will soon be completely curtailed in the near future, then the blow will be delivered to two countries at once.



And if Russia in recent years has systematically (albeit not without thorny paths) moved towards a gradual reduction in the dependence of the military-industrial sphere on Ukrainian imports, opening its own production facilities (OJSC Klimov, which conducts a full cycle of engine development for aviation technology - as one example), then in Ukraine they didn’t even think about “reducing dependence” on Russian investments. Why think about it when the GP ZPorya Zorya alone - Mashproekt (an enterprise in Nikolaev) was loaded with orders for gas turbine engines for the Russian fleet, as they say, to the eyeballs.

This is hundreds of millions of dollars in profits plus jobs for professionals in a wide variety of industries. Apparently, already now the management of Zori - Mashproekt, predicting that Kiev can order to interrupt all trade relations with Russia, is trying to find buyers for its products abroad. Search decided in China. Last entry on this site GP NPKG Dated 18 March:

From 19 to 21 in March, the 14 International Petroleum and Petrochemical Equipment and Technology Exhibition will be held in China. The power equipment of the Nikolaev production will be presented in the exhibition center "New China International Exhibition center".

China remains one of the key partners of the State Enterprise “Zorya” - “Mashproekt”. SE "Zorya" - "Mashproekt" seeks to strengthen and expand its presence in this market.


Since 21 March, almost 2 weeks have passed, and information about the real "strengthening and expanding its presence in this market" is not published. Did you find new partners? - Silence ...

In the event that Zore - Mashproekt and dozens of other enterprises focused on cooperation in the military-technical sphere in Russia, Kiev declares the need to curtail trade relations with Russian customers, then the losses will, of course, not only the enterprises themselves , but also the Ukrainian treasury as a whole. Already billions of losses!
Russia will suffer losses as well, for with all attempts to create their own generating facilities, it was not possible to achieve full-scale success here. Apparently, close cooperation, high-quality order fulfillment by many Ukrainian enterprises, not delayed in time, suited the Russian defense industry to the full. Now the question becomes an edge: how to maintain close ties in the areas of vital importance for both countries against the background of large-scale confrontation? Will it be possible to answer this question, what is called, with a sober head?

It will probably be possible to fully maintain productive cooperation if Ukraine becomes a full-fledged federal state, when Kiev (as a center) takes into account not only the interests of people rushing to state power, but also the interests of the regions, including the interests of regional business. And if some of the candidates for the presidency (for example, a woman with a scythe) are categorically opposed to federalization, then another question arises - who benefits? The answer is simple: it is beneficial for those who, in order to please their own ambitions, want to finally bury Ukrainian production, turning Ukraine only into an additional market for selling foreign goods without any economic barriers.
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  1. Sergg
    Sergg April 3 2014 08: 16
    +22
    With the stoppage of industry in Donetsk and Dnepropetrovsk, the end of the Ruin is even closer, and with it the division of one nation of Ukrainians and Russians into two.
    1. xsapranx
      xsapranx April 3 2014 08: 18
      +12
      Donetsk is not quite the industry. The Dnieper and Zaporozhye are there and something else is breathing.
      1. Geisenberg
        Geisenberg April 3 2014 09: 38
        +8
        Quote: xsapranx
        Donetsk is not quite the industry. The Dnieper and Zaporozhye are there and something else is breathing.


        Do you think it matters? Here they grind the whole country, and you mind a separate region. If pravoseki now gave a real, 100 poody occasion, then in the Dnieper, and in Donetsk, and in Zaporozhye, polite people in military uniforms without insignia and weapons would already be walking.
        1. Sergei75
          Sergei75 April 3 2014 19: 35
          +4
          Just like in the famous film ... There were plenty of signs, my slippery friend ... What other signs are needed, in Poltava, nationalists break into Russian houses, rob (for the right front), they burn houses, you look at their slogans, the Balts are resting ! It is not clear why this is not shown here, they are afraid to set us up against the Ukrainians, so those bastards of the same nationality, it’s called that - a nationalist!
          They will end the Russians, take up the Jews with the Poles, and there are not far from the Tatars.
          1. allexx83
            allexx83 April 3 2014 22: 36
            0
            In the Poltava region? And where? (the question is not idle and without a kick)
      2. Val_y
        Val_y April 3 2014 11: 16
        +9
        Well, metallurgy (Azovstal, Ilyich plant) is that not industry? Still what, and a lot of people work, and the dough brings to the treasury tons hi
      3. zmey_gadukin
        zmey_gadukin April 3 2014 12: 44
        +5
        Quote: xsapranx
        Donetsk is not quite an industry

        ??
        http://donetsk.ukr-prom.com/
        Read and learn how many industrial enterprises we have. And this is far from all, but only those that are cataloged.
        1. smile
          smile April 3 2014 13: 54
          +12
          zmey_gadukin
          Well, your revolutionaries and European integrators are doing everything possible and impossible so far to quickly turn the remnants of the Soviet industrial heritage of Ukraine into a catalog - "dead Ukrainian enterprises that prevented the self-styled from feeling truly free". :)))
      4. infinite silence ...
        infinite silence ... April 3 2014 18: 54
        +3
        Is Donetsk not quite an industry?
        The industrial potential of the city takes 1st place in terms of industrial production.
        1. velikoros-xnumx
          velikoros-xnumx April 3 2014 20: 34
          +2
          Quote: infinite silence ...
          Is Donetsk not quite an industry?
          The industrial potential of the city takes 1st place in terms of industrial production.

          occupied. It's time to get used to talking in the past tense; Ukraine is not prepared for anything else.
    2. avt
      avt April 3 2014 09: 05
      +10
      Quote: Sergg
      and with it the division of one nation of Ukrainians and Russians into two.

      Everything is better than 23 years of education in ancient, new Great-Ukrainian, and even in the Nazi, Bandera version.
      Quote: xsapranx
      . the next half-year will be a steep peak and the search for a b @ lyadsky ring from a nonexistent braking parachute. And there it is somewhere to taxi

      Well, in Kiev, taxiing around is understandable, they act according to the precepts of Bandera, but almost according to Shlyukhevych - to kill all those who do not want to be a great-Ukrainian, only the option of killing was chosen not one-time, but longer - by slowly killing the dissenters.
    3. polite people
      polite people April 3 2014 11: 56
      +7
      Indeed, how simple it is.
      The Kiev authorities would compromise - and everything was fine.
      But here we see something else - they are forced to confront us with us,
      even if they don’t want it.
    4. Sergei75
      Sergei75 April 3 2014 19: 30
      +2
      Damn, why did a bunch of shitheads seize power in Ukraine, do what they want, where people and lots of parties are watching, is there really no leader who will take the liberty and cleanse Ukraine of the junta ruling now? Or does the people deserve the government that has it ?!
  2. xsapranx
    xsapranx April 3 2014 08: 16
    +22
    Not any new partners ... in the next half-year there will be a steep peak and the search for a b @ lyadsky ring from a nonexistent braking parachute. And there it is somewhere to taxi
    1. Geisenberg
      Geisenberg April 3 2014 09: 40
      +6
      Quote: xsapranx
      Not any new partners ... in the next half-year there will be a steep peak and the search for a b @ lyadsky ring from a nonexistent braking parachute. And there it is somewhere to taxi


      Six months ago, I said that we should already consider the option of how to do without Ukraine. Even then, it was clear that this country was leading the goat into the crack. Apparently he was not mistaken and, apparently, the time for the search for the ring was already over, there was only time left to remember what he wrote in the will. Now you’ll have to make your Ukraine, without fighting homosexuals ...
      1. xsapranx
        xsapranx April 3 2014 09: 50
        +3
        What kind of "serious" you are, please do not overstrain yourself, you are still needed ***** This problem is at least 15 years old and the trouble is that you need to think and learn to live at the same time and in no case look into the mouth above the person sitting in anticipation " gracious command. "
        If people are proactive and do not walk in the blind, then they never "lay eggs in one basket" but try to work so as not to be a "temporary"
        Well, if in your head there is one gyrus and that of a cap, then who do you dohtur?
        1. Anper
          Anper April 3 2014 15: 03
          +5
          Quote: xsapranx
          Well, if in your head there is one gyrus and that of a cap, then who do you dohtur?

          This last sentence suggests that you are a frequent visitor to Censor.net - after Crimea, everyone turned to such arguments there.
          1. Stanislas
            Stanislas April 3 2014 17: 11
            +6
            Quote: Anper
            suggests that you are a frequent visitor
            I have not yet seen so much unreasonable hatred of Russia for censor.net, expressed in quite Russian language. Real zombies.
          2. xsapranx
            xsapranx April 3 2014 19: 21
            +1
            A censor is only if there is any news there, nor any polemic is useless.
            And the statement exclusively from the stage passed in the life devoted to serving the people of Ukraine in the Armed Forces is all simple and ordinary.
      2. Skif
        Skif April 4 2014 07: 47
        +1
        Send yourself INTO THE CRACK, and ALL THE STAFF, ALL the people of Ukraine who gave you the right to obserat? Not only Bender live here, the east and south are FOR RUSSIA, but thanks to people like you and many others who consider themselves a great "empire", Russia will not have a chance here. Once again I am convinced that there is no place for "hahla" even on the Russian forum, print anything further about my Motherland, you will be supported a lot, but not in Ukraine, that's for sure.
  3. pts-m
    pts-m April 3 2014 08: 17
    -2
    Yes, let them give up money. Only in RUSSIA it seems that there were no patriots left in state structures, otherwise they would have established their production long ago, but for this it’s up to you to think it’s easier to get a rollback.
    1. Letun
      Letun April 3 2014 09: 07
      +10
      Building a factory is half the battle, but finding good staff is a problem! Who will work at the new plants? Do we now have at least some graduates of technical universities working in their specialty? Does anyone go to working specialties? What for! It’s more profitable not to stand at the milling machine, but to work as a security guard in a shopping center.
      1. sled beach
        sled beach April 3 2014 16: 14
        +2
        But it’s not a matter of benefit, but with respect to the worker. In leading positions, the majority are sitting like a flail. Yes, and with the current economic policy, production is not something important and necessary for the state, but a means of making money with an appropriate attitude towards the worker: earn money and wait from obedience and bow to your feet, no matter how much you work 10,12,16, XNUMX, XNUMX hours, a worker should bow. There will be respect will be experts.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Wheel
        Wheel April 4 2014 02: 25
        0
        Quote: Letun
        Building a factory is half the battle, but finding good staff is a problem! Who will work at the new plants? Do we now have at least some graduates of technical universities working in their specialty? Does anyone go to working specialties? What for! It’s more profitable not to stand at the milling machine, but to work as a security guard in a shopping center.

        All will God's high leadership. bully
        Give a guarantee free receiving housing in a reasonable amount of time (naturally, when fulfilling certain agreed obligations), and there will be no end to those who wish to work in such an enterprise.
    2. Loki
      Loki April 3 2014 10: 46
      +7
      It is not so easy to build and launch production. You never wondered why, with all the achievements and discoveries in the defense industry, the troops are still using old equipment. And this applies to all the armies of the world. Because it is insanely difficult to launch a new production line - at the prototype level - please, but in series - this process is not for one year and not at the level - to build 1 plant. And to build 10ki factories, each of which will produce certain components.
      1. Wheel
        Wheel April 4 2014 03: 12
        0
        Quote: Loki
        It is not so easy to build and launch production. You never wondered why, with all the achievements and discoveries in the defense industry, the troops are still using old equipment. And this applies to all the armies of the world. Because it is insanely difficult to launch a new production line - at the prototype level - please, but in series - this process is not for one year and not at the level - to build 1 plant. And to build 10ki factories, each of which will produce certain components.

        Once again I will refer to the will divine.
        A classic example: the creation of the Soviet atomic bomb.
        By time 2 years 8 months.
        About 50 enterprises were built and launched.
        We note in parentheses that this happened in the most difficult post-war period.
  4. Santor
    Santor April 3 2014 08: 25
    +20
    Yesterday I received news that Ukraine closed its market for a number of Russian goods including products of the Vichunay concern ..... Since the head super-modern plant is in my city, I can safely say that the Ukrainians either did it at random or simply did not own the information .... This is a joint venture located in the Russian Federation. 50% belongs to South Korea, 10% of Russia, 20% of Lithuania, 10% of Estonia, 10% of Sweden ... So who was Ukraine butted? Yesterday, they said to Vichunai that they would completely review their exports to Ukraine (fish products and prepared semi-finished products), because you cannot deal with such a partner. All products are distributed uniformly to all the Baltic countries, Scandinavia, Europe.
  5. sv68
    sv68 April 3 2014 08: 25
    +8
    Russia will lose money from broken contracts of non-received goods - and ukroin can, in addition to money, completely lose the Russian market, which is much worse
    1. Loki
      Loki April 3 2014 10: 49
      .
      Russia will lose money from broken contracts of non-received goods - and ukroin can, in addition to money, completely lose the Russian market, which is much worse


      Well, Ukraine is unlikely to have a choice; against the backdrop of the capture of Crimea, it was ridiculous to pretend that nothing happened in relations between Russia and Ukraine. Not all the same, it comes down to money
      1. Havoc
        Havoc April 3 2014 11: 11
        +14
        Well, Ukraine is unlikely to have a choice; against the backdrop of the capture of Crimea, it was ridiculous to pretend that nothing happened in relations between Russia and Ukraine. Not all the same rests against money [/ quote]

        Dear, Russia didn’t capture Crimea, returned its own, historical justice triumphed by direct expression of the will of the citizens of Crimea. And about the capture, it’s on Ukrainian sites.
        1. smile
          smile April 3 2014 14: 04
          +12
          Havoc
          You could even say otherwise - Russia did not return anything - just the population of Crimea made a decision, and we just agreed with this decision. :)))
        2. balyaba
          balyaba April 3 2014 19: 46
          +4
          From end to end ... in the end after all! Nobody captured and returned anyone !!! THE PEOPLE OF CRIMEA MADE THEIR CHOICE! AND EVERYTHING! And BASTA !!!
        3. Setrac
          Setrac April 3 2014 20: 20
          +5
          Quote: Havoc
          Dear, Russia didn’t capture Crimea, returned its own, historical justice triumphed by direct expression of the will of the citizens of Crimea. And about the capture, it’s on Ukrainian sites.

          What do you mean "returned"? Crimea itself "returned"!
      2. Curculum
        Curculum April 3 2014 13: 38
        +6
        Quote: Loki
        amid the capture of Crimea is funny

        Really funny: are there any injured / crippled / killed from "capture"?
        Although I have to admit: the war didn’t kill all the sick, some of them calmed down.
        1. smile
          smile April 3 2014 14: 07
          +5
          Curculum
          But what about - look at the new Euro-fascist junta - there are only cripples there ... :)))
          1. nov_tech.vrn
            nov_tech.vrn April 3 2014 14: 24
            +9
            These Euro-calibers from the junta perfectly translate the arrows, and the Berkutovs turned out to be shot at the Maydanuts, on the personal instructions of Yanukovych, I can't even imagine what these "law enforcement officers" are doing with the guys, although they can simply kill and then draw a confession. Burn these creatures on fire.
      3. smile
        smile April 3 2014 14: 03
        +4
        Loki
        Tell me, why capture? When Ukraine was created - is it, in your opinion, the will of the people, the struggle for independence - when the people of Crimea "self-determined" - is it seizure and aggression? Maybe then you will be really consistent and say that the will of the people also took place in Karabakh and the people of Karabakh have determined themselves? :)))
        Or do you nevertheless admit that in all your assessments the decisive factor is that you are an abnormal Russophobe? :)))
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. atalef
          atalef April 3 2014 14: 10
          -9
          Quote: smile
          ? When Ukraine was created-this is, in your opinion, the will of the people

          Not entirely correct, then the will of the people did not exist a priori. In general, which countries were created by the will of the people. In modern history, there are only a few (after the destruction of colonialism), and before the 20th century it is generally not a single one (well, in any case, I don’t know)

          Quote: smile
          when the people of Crimea "self-determined" - is it a seizure and aggression?

          This is who is looking. Chechnya under the Dudaev - is the struggle of the people for their indifference and independence - or a gangster coup?
          Clear definitions do not exist at all
          Quote: smile
          Dear, Russia didn’t capture Crimea, returned its

          Then why didn’t Taganrog return? (if in fairness - as you say)
          Or a surprise for you that having given Crimea to Ukraine, the RSFSR received Toganrog and the region that were part of Ukraine.
          1. Curculum
            Curculum April 3 2014 14: 32
            +8
            Quote: atalef
            Not entirely correct, then the will of the people did not exist a priori.

            In 1991 "did not exist a priori"? Or are you about the expression of the will of the ancient ukrov?
            Quote: atalef
            and before the 20th century - generally no one (well, in any case, I don’t know)

            Until the 20th century, the state of Ukraine existed?
            Quote: atalef
            Chechnya under the Dudaev - is the struggle of the people for their indifference and independence - or a gangster coup?

            Question to question: the struggle of the Palestinian people for their identification and independence - or a hotbed of terrorism?
            Quote: atalef
            Then why didn’t Taganrog return?

            Taganrog was part of state Ukraine? I know the following: in 1920−1925 Taganrog was part of the Donetsk province USSR, in 1925 was returned to RSFSR - Well? (I hope there is no need to "decipher" the abbreviated ones).
            1. atalef
              atalef April 3 2014 14: 47
              -5
              Quote: Kurkul
              In 1991 "did not exist a priori"? Or are you about the expression of the will of the ancient ukrov?

              And what story began in 1991?
              Quote: Kurkul
              Until the 20th century, the state of Ukraine existed?

              So Siri was not (as an example), so what?
              Quote: Kurkul
              Question to question: the struggle of the Palestinian people for their identification and independence - or a hotbed of terrorism?

              here I am about
              Quote: Kurkul
              I know the following: in 1920−1925 Taganrog was part of the Donetsk province of the Ukrainian SSR, in 1925 it was returned to the RSFSR

              So he was in the Ukrainian SSR, but why was they seized?
              1. Curculum
                Curculum April 3 2014 15: 30
                +3
                Quote: atalef
                And what story began in 1991?

                History of what? I asked a specific question based on
                Quote: atalef
                When Ukraine was created-this is, in your opinion, the will of the people
                Not entirely correct, then the will of the people did not exist a priori

                But if you are talking about the times of ancient ukrov - I grazed, I read the histories of Bebik-Grushevsky historians, but did not perceive them.
                Quote: atalef
                So Siri was not (as an example), so what?

                And Israel (only one example), so what? Where is the dispute?
                Quote: atalef
                here I am about

                So otozh.
                Quote: atalef
                So he was in the USSR

                Do not go aside — but what was the Ukrainian SSR: a state or part of a state?
                Quote: atalef
                why seized?

                Taganrog was "withdrawn" in 1925, so that Crimea was "transferred" in 1954 - this is the context of your
                Quote: atalef
                Or a surprise for you that having given Crimea to Ukraine, the RSFSR received Toganrog and the region that were part of Ukraine.

                You yourself are not funny?
                1. klopik
                  klopik April 3 2014 18: 53
                  +4
                  Can you imagine who you have to live with in one non-state?
          2. smile
            smile April 3 2014 14: 52
            +4
            atalef
            Oh, come on ... didn’t you notice a bunch of emoticons there? Yes, and I was not going to seriously talk with this finished Russophobe - it is simply useless - his training manual is not designed for a normal dispute, it’s very short at all. :)))

            In international law, there are two mutually exclusive postulates - the right of nations to self-determination and inviolability of borders. They have been arguing about these concepts for more than a century, and I am not going to join the debaters - I feel sorry for the time. Better to read something interesting .. :)))

            So, atalef, I have no desire to get involved in the discussion with you, excuse me.
            I hope you don’t think that I have nothing to say and you won’t swear at me. :)))
            By the way, I have not said anything about "justice" in international politics - I have not yet. it seems that he has not survived from his mind ... in any case - not completely. :))))
            1. atalef
              atalef April 3 2014 15: 19
              +2
              Quote: smile
              So, atalef, I have no desire to get involved in a discussion with you, forgive me. I hope you don’t think that I have nothing to say and you won’t swear at me. :))) By the way, I have not said anything about "justice" in international politics - I have not yet. it seems that he has not survived out of his mind ... at least not completely. :))))

              I absolutely agree with you, there are things in which it is not realistic to come to a common denominator, as you can always find a candidate in one direction or another.
              therefore, in general, appealing to international law is simply ridiculous.
              more precisely useless.
              hi
            2. The comment was deleted.
          3. sled beach
            sled beach April 3 2014 16: 42
            +1
            "It is not entirely correct, then the expression of the will of the people did not exist a priori" and immediately "having given Crimea to Ukraine, the RSFSR received Toganrog" i.e. the RSFSR did all the same a favor, had mercy, so to speak. Did it ever occur to you that Ukraine was wholly and completely created by the same RSFSR. Or the averse patrons do not allow to think about this?
          4. The comment was deleted.
          5. sinukvl
            sinukvl April 3 2014 16: 47
            +8
            Dear, why are you not returning the Palestinian lands captured by Israel to Arabs?
        3. Loki
          Loki April 3 2014 15: 08
          .
          Well, the choice of words depends on the side. And in terms of context, it fits - precisely because Ukraine thinks that it is a seizure, annexation, support for separatism, etc. - as a result, military-technical cooperation stops. Those. in Ukraine, Russia is considered the enemy, since such painful measures are being applied, including for themselves. If they thought otherwise there, then they would not stop cooperation.

          As for Karabakh - again - it depends on the point of view. They may think they are self-determined. This does not suit us. Therefore, we honestly call each other enemies and periodically shoot at each other. You pretend that nothing special happened. This is not so for Ukraine.

          Regarding my Russophobia - it is quite possible that there were some post-Soviet illusions before. Now I understand for sure that you are not friends to us, you are not friends at all. And this must be remembered and this must be said.
          1. Curculum
            Curculum April 3 2014 15: 39
            +5
            Quote: Loki
            Regarding my Russophobia - it is quite possible that there were some post-Soviet illusions before. Now I understand for sure that you are not friends to us, you are not friends at all. And this must be remembered and this must be said.

            Thanks for the honesty, of course. But you do not exactly understand, that's for sure.
            And your memory is too short, since Russia was recorded as an enemy. But time will judge, only I suggest you recall at least the last significant date - 1945, then too many were mistaken. Do not take the wrong path, I do not recommend.
            1. Loki
              Loki April 3 2014 16: 59
              -4
              Thanks for the honesty, of course. But you do not exactly understand, that's for sure.
              And your memory is too short, since Russia was recorded as an enemy. But time will judge, only I suggest you recall at least the last significant date - 1945, then too many were mistaken. Do not take the wrong path, I do not recommend.


              In Az-no, this date has never been forgotten. Our grandfathers also fought there, and what they did for us - we will always remember and honor them for this. Only you need to understand the difference between Russia and the USSR. In WWII everyone fought for the USSR, and now in Russia they are trying to pretend that this is a Russian victory. This is not so - Russia has 1 \ 15 part, well, if without the Baltic states, then 1 \ 12. I recently watched an interesting program with Solovyov - there the Ukrainian deputy said very correctly - the Russian-speaking population of Crimea and the South-East can not have any nostalgia for Russia - they did not live in Russia. There is nostalgia only for the USSR.
              1. smile
                smile April 3 2014 17: 15
                +6
                Loki
                Ahhhhhh ... to eat! :))) Russia is one fifteenth of the USSR? :))) You do not think so. what should be the limit of freakishness and resourcefulness, eh? Or do you think, for example, that Lithuania played the same role in the USSR as Russia? What if there were three million Lithuanians and 155 million Russians. then every Lithuanian cost 52 Russians? :))) Is it even funny to answer your delights? Byad is. what further. all the more I am convinced of this - Russophobia. this is not a point of view - it is such a bacillus. which primarily affects the ability of the body to healthy thinking and completely wipes out conscience. :)))
                By the way, Turks conquered you in due time. enslaved and destroyed. You even united with the Georgians and Armenians in an attempt to repulse, well, and naturally to us, such wicked things. :))) Now you are declaring that you are all Turks. I’m wondering where did you get nostalgia?

                And as to whether Crimeans have nostalgia for Russia or not, maybe, still Crimeans know this better than you, huh? Do you understand how ridiculous your ranting is on this subject? :)))
                1. Loki
                  Loki April 3 2014 17: 28
                  -5
                  What kind of arguments do you have at the child’s level - 1 Lithuanian 52 Russians, etc. If you have enough brains only for this - well, ok. Cook in your juice. I will tell you only one thing on the topic - you have turned Ukraine into an enemy. And you will disentangle it for a very long time. And yet - you will betray the Southeast - all your statements about protecting the Russians are not worth a damn - you will drop the Russians there, because you received such a command from the West. And you do it, as you have done for the past 20 years.
                  1. Curculum
                    Curculum April 3 2014 18: 26
                    +2
                    Quote: Loki
                    And you will disentangle it for a very long time. And yet - you will betray the Southeast - all your statements about protecting the Russians are not worth a damn - you will drop the Russians there, because you received such a command from the West. And you do it, as you have done for the past 20 years.

                    Just do not vang. Otherwise - I’m ready to argue with you (for cognac, for example) that everything will be wrong by April 1, 2015 - do you agree?
                  2. Curculum
                    Curculum April 3 2014 18: 34
                    +3
                    Quote: Loki
                    What kind of arguments do you have at the child's level - 1 Lithuanian 52 Russians, etc.

                    And you didn’t try to figure out the ratio of all the former Soviet republics to the territory of the RSFSR (modern RF) on a map (globe)? Try, even in percentage terms, tads, and you will understand that these are not childish arguments.
                  3. avt
                    avt April 3 2014 18: 48
                    +7
                    Quote: Loki
                    . I will tell you only one thing on the topic - you have turned Ukraine into an enemy. And you will disentangle it for a very long time. And yet - you will betray the Southeast - all your statements about protecting the Russians are not worth a damn - you will drop the Russians there, because you received such a command from the West. And you do it, as you have done for the past 20 years.

                    But I won’t even say anything. Pushkin said everything, but he is our everything. ,, What are you talking about, folk orbits?
                    Why anathema threaten you Russia?
                    What angered you? unrest in Lithuania?
                    Leave: this is a dispute between the Slavs,
                    Home, old dispute, weighted by fate,
                    A question that you will not solve.

                    For a long time among themselves
                    These tribes are at war;
                    More than once bowed under a thunderstorm
                    Theirs, then our side.
                    Who will stand in an unequal dispute:
                    Puffy Lyakh, il true Ross?
                    Will Slavic streams merge in the Russian sea?
                    Will it run dry? here is the question.

                    Leave us: you have not read
                    These bloody tablets;
                    It’s incomprehensible to you, alien to you
                    This is a family feud;
                    The Kremlin and Prague are silent for you;
                    Pointlessly seduces you
                    Fights of desperate courage -
                    And you hate us ...

                    For what? answer: for whether
                    What is on the ruins of flaming Moscow
                    We did not recognize the brazen will
                    Who were you trembling under?
                    For the fact that they plunged into the abyss
                    We are idol over kingdoms
                    And redeemed with our blood
                    Europe, freedom, honor and peace? ..
                    You are formidable in words - try in practice!
                    Or the old hero, deceased on his bed,
                    Unable to screw up your Izmail bayonet?
                    Is the Russian tsar already powerless to speak?
                    Or should we argue with Europe new?
                    Il Russian weaned from victories?
                    Or a little of us? Or from Perm to Tauris,
                    From the Finnish cold rocks to the flaming Colchis,
                    From the shocked Kremlin
                    To the walls of immobile China,
                    Shiny bristles,
                    Will not the Russian land rise? ..
                    So send us, vitias,
                    His angry sons:
                    There is a place for them in the fields of Russia,
                    Among the coffins unfamiliar to them. "
                    1. Curculum
                      Curculum April 3 2014 19: 40
                      +4
                      Quote: avt
                      Pushkin said everything, but he is ours.

                      Powerfully !!!! Thank! hi
                  4. smile
                    smile April 3 2014 19: 33
                    +2
                    Loki
                    When Leo Tolstoy wanted to express his positive attitude towards his hero, he compared him to a child .... I hope you are Leo Tolstoy. :)))

                    And about the arguments - you know what a thing - you point blank do not see not only argumentation. you just don’t see reality ... and not because you are blind, but because you don’t want to see .... or you just deliberately lie that you don’t see?
                    Why should I give you serious arguments in this case? What is your worldview. such are my arguments:))) ... I’m explaining, I’m just mocking you because you are not good for a serious dispute ... Alas.

                    And we didn’t make anyone enemies - cast aside illusions at least for ourselves - those who yell that we are enemies are initially our enemies, regardless of our actions. they were fostered and pushed by other enemies - old ... that's all. Yes, part of the Ukrainians fell under the propaganda of Ukrainian neo-fascists - that’s how it would have happened, so they were put there .... You know, it seems to me that you are not as brainless as you are pretending to be, you are just our original enemy and you are offended, that the Russophobic plan was far from completely due to the fact that we are defending ourselves .... I dare to assure you that you will miscalculate. :)))
                    And once again I want to remind you - always, when you were friends with us, and it was useful for you, when you climbed into a conflict with us yourself, or the owners pushed you into the ass, it was bad ... you .. .is always...:)))
                    Think again. Goodbye, and let's turn off the discussion. Nothing to talk about. Alas.
                  5. Setrac
                    Setrac April 3 2014 20: 36
                    +3
                    Quote: Loki
                    What kind of arguments do you have at the child's level - 1 Lithuanian 52 Russians, etc.

                    Did you study math in your cave? 150 million from 250 is 60% of Russians from the entire population of the USSR, which is 3/5, but not 1/15 as you say.
                  6. oldstaryi
                    oldstaryi April 3 2014 22: 05
                    +3
                    Very interesting. Then why are all our markets clogged with yours? They would live on their own and would not climb to us! By the way, according to the latest census of ukrov, 83% of the population answered the questionnaire in Russian .... wassat
                  7. The point
                    The point April 6 2014 14: 55
                    0
                    Quote: Loki
                    I will tell you only one thing on the topic - you have turned Ukraine into an enemy.

                    Actually, it was not Russia that invented the myth about other Ukrainian people, the "great" Bandera and other nonsense.
                    PS By the way, change the nickname. Loki is a deceiving god in ancient German mythology. Come on, sweetheart.
              2. Curculum
                Curculum April 3 2014 18: 17
                +2
                Quote: Loki
                I watched an interesting program recently with Solovyov - there the Ukrainian deputy said very correctly - the Russian-speaking population of Crimea and the South-East can not have any nostalgia for Russia - they did not live in Russia.

                In principle, to the answer "smile", I will add the following: the USSR is the heir of the Russian Empire (territorially), and, therefore, of Russia, and it was only recently (relatively). Another thing is that the Bolsheviks took it into their heads to divide the counties along ethnic lines - this turned out to be a time bomb for undermining the foundations of state integrity. But together we were able to defeat hunger and devastation, and the worst enemy, ready to destroy everyone and everything, leaving a minimum for slaves.
                Regarding Ukraine: until you and many others understand that the term "Russian-speaking population" is a contrived dictum and has begun to be used often quite recently (for which I recommend thinking about), then you will always be imagining a "Russian threat". You need to know the history of these lands. But this is your business.
                Russians are either there or not. The registration of this population regarding statehood is the third question, and in this case it does not matter. By analogy, for example: Have you ever heard the statements of state officials about the "French-speaking population" of Switzerland or Canada? So why're coming out-figures allow themselves like that? Think about it. Then you will understand what they are talking about here. And if you don’t want to understand, no one will force you, "a woman with a cart is easier for a mare."
                1. smile
                  smile April 3 2014 19: 35
                  +2
                  Curculum
                  Great addition - thanks.
              3. Setrac
                Setrac April 3 2014 20: 23
                +3
                Quote: Loki
                Only you need to understand the difference between Russia and the USSR. In WWII everyone fought for the USSR, and now in Russia they are trying to pretend that this is a Russian victory.

                You yourself refuse this victory; it is not kosher for you.
          2. Curculum
            Curculum April 3 2014 16: 18
            +5
            Quote: Loki
            Regarding my Russophobia - it is quite possible

            I will add: if you are one of these that are shown in the picture, then you are an enemy for us, and we wet such ones even in the toilet, and quite successfully.
          3. smile
            smile April 3 2014 16: 30
            +7
            Loki
            1. You are mistaken if you think that in Ukraine everyone believes that we have captured Crimea — these are your illusions. Naroimer is my Ukrainian relative. living in Fastov and Lubny, very happy for the Crimea - I repeat. for the Crimea. and not for Russia, and constantly tyrannizes me on Skype - when will we help get rid of Bandera, we will save and accept it. To my attempts to fall back on, that, they say, it’s not easy, that they themselves have to decide - they are offended and curse, poke me at that. that Europeans and Americans are not embarrassed to intervene, while we, with our sincerity, are conducting a treacherous policy, leaving Ukraine to the mercy of the Euro-fascists.
            Perhaps they know better the opinion of Ukrainians or do you know better from home? :))) But in the same way as you, you are just Bandera neo-fascists and the duped part of Ukrainians, mostly young. which they carefully hammered from the cradle that we are enemies.
            And about the fact that we sacrifice military-technical cooperation with the junta imposed on Ukraine from outside for the sake of our salvation, this is an argument from the category - from a gun into a puddle, I do not even want to answer.

            2. We do not recognize and are not going to recognize Karabakh, and even more so, the capture of 7 adjacent areas. Well, you would like to ask - is it preferable for you to shoot at each other, or is it better to agree with the Armenians? Moreover, we never fought with Ukrainians. on the contrary, the Poles were beaten together. fascists and Bandera henchmen of the Germans. The difference between us and you and the Armenians is cardinal.

            3. If all of you, under the influence of propaganda like Bandera, which is simply part of the American global - and in your case - also neo-Ottoman, as Erdogan put it :))) become Russophobes - please tell us more about this in order to save us from illusions, and we could soberly realize whose bedding you are. Or is it precisely your goal - to quarrel Azerbaijanis with Russians? So far, you're doing great.
            1. Loki
              Loki April 3 2014 17: 18
              -6
              You know, they spoke smoothly on paper, but they forgot about the ravines. We are all witnesses to the fact that Ukraine, for all its history that has not gone away, is seeking protection from NATO from Russia. NATO is an enemy of Russia. So something happened in their worldview, that the Slavic factor, the facts of the Second World War, the factors of cohabitation in one country - no longer outweigh the fear of Russia. They can be easily understood - they want to live in Europe, and Russia - is it socially unattractive or something. You have the psychology of a besieged fortress, and people just want to live normally. you offer them, in fact, the second Yanukovych and his system, which is simply more respectable. But personally for them nothing will change. Therefore, you can’t raise the Southeast without troops there, no one there especially wanted to change the needle;

              Regarding your statements in paragraph 3, I am sure that you all know about bedding. And you can’t imagine another way of thinking when you are not someone’s bedding. But I'm not going to assent to you, just to please you. Sorry, I am not very familiar, unlike you, with bedding thinking. If your world is exclusively black and white, these are your problems and your misfortune. In addition, your opinion about Azerbaijanis does not matter, you still form your attitude on the team - they will tell you tomorrow that we are bad - you will beat yourself in the chest and talk nasty things about us. This is all over the past few months on this site we have seen on the example of Ukrainians.
              1. xsapranx
                xsapranx April 3 2014 19: 39
                -6
                Clearly and truly noticed.
                Fables are fables but there is no such material and article that diarrhea would not whip.
                It's hard for people to understand, and even more so no one explains what the "Russian world" is? It would be fine to say and tied to something tangible, otherwise, apart from slogans, there is nothing else.
                On duty, I repeatedly took part in various international exercises and peacekeeping missions, I saw a lot of people of character and manners in one thing I can agree - "Russia cannot be understood with the mind, ...."
                1. smile
                  smile April 3 2014 21: 56
                  +4
                  xsapranx
                  Are you a supporter of the Bandera Nazis after the last? I also talked with the NATO military .... moreover, quite difficult with the warriors .. :))) normal guys, so what? .... the marsh brother of your maydaunov did not. I want to remind you - those who, not understanding Russia with their heads, begin to run into Russia and the Russians, sooner or later they explain everything through the ass.
                  Or do you just like the Russophobic rhetoric of the Bandera community, which began long before Russia responded - moreover - long before we stopped sponsoring aggressive autonomy by providing all sorts of preferences from our pocket. And if your fascists have already taken up the Russian-speaking ones, then ignore them .... by the way, I suppose if you yourself don’t take over your fascists and they will arrange what they declare in South-Vastok. we will come there ... to beat the Nazis ... we have such a habit, you know .... :))) So, I still advise you to think with your mind.
                  1. xsapranx
                    xsapranx April 3 2014 22: 19
                    -1
                    Sorry, but a lot of text through our teeth ... We are not in the store, so without labels and price tags -Lada?
                    How would you explain it so softer and more profitable ...
                    1. Ukraine is multifaceted, and it is only necessary to answer for your near and dear ones
                    2. Yes, we served side by side for 21 years with the Russian Georgians and Armenians, my ZKV was a Moldavian from the Tashkent border guard detachment (one of the 3 survivors from the outpost), I didn’t see any tears in front of your BBL in front of Boris from Ussuriysk whose father passed 2 Chechnya and graduated with the rank of lieutenant general.
                    3. It’s deeply to me *** what do you mean by Fascism, since any one who considers himself a superman and dictates to others how and what to do falls under my concept of this infection (honestly, to me personally it’s exactly what’s with a swastika on the hand that has the same swastika in the form runes or ligature)
                    So who is there and what is there for you "gebels" I don’t know my own, I don’t listen to yours and you feel sick
                    1. smile
                      smile April 3 2014 23: 42
                      +1
                      xsapranx
                      Ok, no shortcuts. Accepted. And I apologize. Perhaps I went over.
                      Everything else....
                      You do not notice that in your newborn country the fascists are eager for power ...
                      You do not notice that it is in your country that children from kindergarten begin to accustom to the fact that Russians are enslavers ...
                      You do not notice who and by what methods supports the independents, that the same Goebbels mentioned by you is in solidarity with your independents ...

                      What do you think, are you too deliberately blind?

                      Question. What do you see at all? What do you care about? Judging by your statements - you are not completely blind and you open your eyes ... slightly ... to see exactly the propaganda of the last of the Goebbels you mentioned ... you know ... it is useless, honestly .... sorry, but I can appreciate your comment only as a pose - "I am above politics, but you are the aggressors" ... I tried to find another word, but "pose" is the only suitable one, it did not work.
                      Regarding your Castle - what are the events in the Tashkent border detachment? Personally, I do not know about the existence of such. Maybe you mean the battle at the 12th outpost of the Moscow border detachment of the GPV RF in the Republic of Tajikistan? Yes. there the guys fought to the last, by the way, with those who, like banderlogs, were being attacked by us ... only three of them remained ... Far away ... maybe you were mistaken?
                      By the way, I also know what Chechnya is. Personally. And Bandera, we, by the way, were there, although I did not see them, even corpses. But on operational info - were. So what?
                      1. xsapranx
                        xsapranx April 4 2014 00: 07
                        -1
                        What does over politics mean? over politics is that if in the Army you do not divide the citizens of your country into all sorts of reasons, but you must clearly respond to citizens who have chosen the flags of another country, which in this case is a banal "aggressor" (squeezed out on occasion and to raise the rating and self-esteem)
                        second, yes, deep on my side, what does one believe, caught by the collar on a hot "last-Stepan Bendery or a miscarriage of ROA" caught on a hot man answer me. The white hammer seems to be from the Dnieper and at the core there are the majority of Russians, and "athletes from Kharkov are typical skinheads", with Bendera, everything is clear and predictable, but with these mottle it is still tougher.
                        In general, the farther I observe all this paranoia, the more I am convinced that it’s not there, you dear fascists, look for it probably because you look through the optics (look under your nose for maybe garbage will be less on both sides of the cordon
                        (ZKV Misha Kushnir, if there is access to the archives, you can break through him and there were medals)
                      2. smile
                        smile April 4 2014 01: 12
                        +1
                        xsapranx
                        Is it clear now.
                        You do not want to answer unpleasant questions ... and not because you do not want to. but because there is nothing to answer. And I say this without any hahanek. Just stating a fact.

                        Judging by what you said here about the "Tashkent frontier detachment", you are quite young - from the generation of thirty, who were brought up from school in the spirit of independence .... by the way, for reference, members of Hizb ut Tazrir - consider the relatives of those whom beat your Castle, briskly migrated from Crimea to Lviv - fascists to fascists ...

                        Yes, in the Army you can’t divide citizens into yours and strangers, all yours ... but when in your country power is seized under fascist banners and slogans, and to hell with it that thief-yanukovych was thrown off, but at the same time no less thieves, and even with fascist rhetoric .... is it time to think? What, once an army man, will you follow the orders of the Nazis? I am silent - how can you like being a European slave corral of cheap labor ....

                        In general, it’s a strange thing - it matters to you that the trapped last name of Bandera is squealing, but you consider it normal for Bandera to rhetoric your unsuccessful presidential candidates ... continue?

                        And the last one, I, as an artist, I report to the artist by voice - the day when the Ukrainian army finally takes up the position of eurofascists and begins to kill opponents of eurofascists, will be the first day from which it is worth counting the end of the project of Ukrainian statehood, the bankruptcy of which was proved on the Maidan, and which the maydaunas slaughtered in winter this year .... you prove by your actions that the communists were wrong, for the first time in history, giving you quasi-statehood .... goodbye.

                        By the way, you should not blame me for the fact that I am subject to propaganda of Moscow - first of all, I am subject to propaganda of my Ukrainian relatives.
                      3. xsapranx
                        xsapranx April 4 2014 02: 04
                        -2
                        One more time:
                        The name of the detachment is not about "screws" since 22 years have passed, he came from there and we studied and served together ...
                        I consider as a fascist those who marked the houses of the Crimean Tatars with crosses and forced them to flee from their small homeland. I am outraged that in my country "b" with swastika tattoos on his body will divide my fellow citizens and contribute to the split of the country.
                        I am against the Information War and misinterpretation of the facts (mutually)
                        And I am opposed to the fact that labor on the Yamal Penalty was presented for the benefit of censuring labor in Poland, Finland and other countries.
                        Smail -V.V. Putin is building RI, and not restoring the USSR, and this, as they say in Odessa, is two big differences.
                        And yes, the world has really changed since the annexation of Crimea, and I have no illusions about the likelihood and results of b / d between the Russian Federation and Ukraine. But I also want to protect you from further escalation and deepening of the split that reigned between the Ukrainian and Russian peoples.
                      4. smile
                        smile April 4 2014 03: 35
                        +1
                        xsapranx
                        Yes, the fascists are those who, created by the fascists, fought for the cause of Hitler's father - the Bandera and Crimean Tatars. Yes, and the houses were also marked by the Crimean Tatars, but only the houses of the Communists and Russians. By the way, now, according to your compatriots, figuratively speaking, on this site, on every pillar in the Donetsk region, something is written about the need to drive us in ... but, of course, you do not see this ... and by the way - the Crimean Tatars should have praised comrade Stalin's hosanna for humanism - after all, according to the laws of wartime, a significant part of their male population deserved a wall .... Stalin regretted it - he simply moved, providing funds and even "lifting" .... and he also regretted the Banderaites - since the spring of 47, we have abolished the death penalty, so that if the bandit is not destroyed when caught. then he, bastard, just sat in the camp, instead of communicating with devils .... :)))) Where is thanks for humanism? Moreover, excessive ...

                        Strange, here I agree with you. I, too, am outraged that "b" - Bandera - divides Ukrainians into people (those who are for the fascists) and "m ... lei" Well, where is your indignation at your fascists? :)))

                        You cannot be against the information war — the whole theory of self-propensity is a complete lie and a continuous information war unleashed at the end of the 19th century — even before the final formation of the Ukrainian nation from part of the Russian people. It is difficult to talk about the distortion of facts in the Ukrainian media. I watch them - a solid crap, seen by an unprofessional look .... :))) Our media in this case pleasantly surprised me - not a single run over the Ukrainian people. it’s all for the Euro-fascists, each hit is justified by a video with the words of the person involved, the proof is such that even the most punched bandarlog has nothing to say specifically - solid general phrases. :)))
                        You see, the World has really changed - but not from the moment we agreed with the decision of the Crimeans. moreover, and since Putin’s Munich speech ... google, if not laziness .... since then we have been punching, since then we are finding ourselves ... you are not .... I don’t think you worth it to be proud .... honestly ....

                        Regarding the database between us ... I believe that they are possible only in one case - if your politicians make your army support the actions of children from the right sector or realize the dreams of Mrs. Yulia about the destruction of the Russian population of Ukraine ... otherwise there’s no fight between us it simply can’t .... Until you are sent to destroy your politicians by Russian politicians, there can be no question about any databases between us.

                        Regarding the split ... you know, we can watch your media ... we clearly see that your junta provokes an escalation of the conflict, such a heresy rises. that the ears are wrapped in a tube ... after that blame us for that. that we are arranging a split - it's just dishonest .... excuse me ....
                        To be honest. I really hope so. that your politicians will no longer spread rot on the Russian part of the Ukrainian people and everything will settle down there .... but, damn it, who will take down your fascists? So you don’t want to see it point blank ... do you think they really, nurtured by independent propaganda over these 23 years, will suddenly take it and dissolve themselves? all the more so since Tymoshenko is not going to shoot - she is going to shoot 8 million Russians .... by the way, there are much more Russians in Ukraine .... Oh yes, I forgot - but you know, we are not going to shoot Ukrainians at home, can you imagine? We, probably because - fascists? After all, it is only the Democrats who say that Russians need to be shot by millions .....
                      5. xsapranx
                        xsapranx April 4 2014 07: 48
                        -2
                        Sorry, but against a difficult case, and even under such a flood, it just becomes silly to argue. And yes, we really do not exist .. we as a people do not exist --- this is a mantra. You see, people ask me to shuggle your flyers, or else they are ** flying over our territory (and every time you have to ask "uncles" who are not even part of them and will get to cool down)
                        So who, what provokes after the Crimea, we have no questions ...
                        And so and where to our "enthusiasts" to the Glavpolit - there are 100% right.
                        Who is going to shoot whom ?! Pane, I’ll remind you in one line that people of different nationalities are really-not even funny. Since you will see all the signs of National Socialism looking in your mirror that you are like a zombie? Or is it hard to admit because of the pixels on the uniform of the forum?
                      6. smile
                        smile April 4 2014 12: 38
                        0
                        xsapranx
                        Well, why are you offended? For the fact that I said that the Ukrainian people formed in the late 19th century? So it is true. Or do you believe in unimaginable nonsense about ancient stolen? This does not mean that you are not there, for one simple reason - then I will also almost be gone .... :))) I’m a Ukrainian by a quarter .... In general, what a habit to choose something and proudly take offense ... By the way, choose from what I said any historical moment with which you do not agree - we will discuss ... we will try to prove our version ... we will neigh over the extent to which the independents have misinterpreted the truth ... :))) All by myself you will see ...
                        Regarding the shootings, excuse me, you are not aware of Tymoshenko's statements? Tyagnybok and other figures about "hanging" and "shooting"? Have you seriously not heard the direct speech of your comrades? Or are you pretending? If you haven't heard, I think you tried very hard not to hear ... even with the total censorship of the media of your junta, nobody canceled the Internet ...
                        Well, well, you declare that you will not fulfill the commands of your own politicians to destroy the Russians? I really hope so ... just do not have to condition this on the fact that your army is multinational ... the Nazis were also multinational ... who wasn’t there ... including the Russians and Bandera and Crimean Tatars .. ..And among Bandera’s people, it’s all about broad Ukrainians ... however, they behaved ....
                        But you really have brainwashed ... at what it is somehow tricky - so that you simply are not interested in moments that are extremely uncomfortable for your secessionists, a kind of selective blindness, moreover conscious ... keep it up, look. where will the eurofascists lead you and what will suit you - after all, gangs will not go anywhere .... unless they deal exclusively with that. what they are doing now - redistribution of property ... okay. maybe you will begin to see clearly ... or does a real PVOchnik need vision?
                2. The point
                  The point April 6 2014 15: 02
                  0
                  Quote: xsapranx
                  - "Russia cannot be understood with the mind ...."

                  The mind of Russia does not understand
                  You can not measure the general with a general.
                  She has a special to become.
                  You can only BELIEVE in Russia!

                  Never pull out quotes, otherwise you will fall into a stupid position again.
              2. smile
                smile April 3 2014 21: 43
                +1
                Loki
                All your construction is destroyed by one small detail - only a handful of coupists came to power with the help of NATO and the United States. Only that part of Ukrainian society wants to become ancillaries in Europe. which is stupefied by the propaganda of theses. whom I mentioned above. and who simply cannot imagine what it is - European life. :))) I’m wondering - you can’t imagine. or pretend to be a felt boot? :))) I say this as a person who has three quarters of the relatives I know live in Enta Europe itself - from Lithuania to Scotland. :)))
                And as an alaverda about psychology - you have the psychology of a raped girl who thinks that they will not marry her now, and she began to be proud that although she was raped, she was made by a strong man. :))) Forgetting about that. that this strong man at the next attempt to rape just tore his ass and thrown in the trash .... :))))
                In fact, slavish psychology, once again I urge you to recall how the Ottomans conquered you, and how you agreed with the Georgians and Armenians on countering enslavement .... and, by the way, they turned to us too .... :))))

                And as for the South-East of Ukraine - I will answer you the same as my Ukrainian relatives - despite all the actions of the eurofascists inspired by their Western masters (yours, by the way, yours too), we will come either when the majority of the population decides for themselves unequivocally and join us without nuances, or when eurofascists start killing them, we’ll come to save. We will not decide anything for them.

                About bedding. :))) Yes, I can’t imagine another way of acting for the American litter - all of the litter are identical, regardless of nationality. And everyone has a cain stamp and inventory number. :)))) Just do not be discouraged - you cannot not know anything about your own, formed under the influence of a certain propaganda of thinking. Or do you not realize the meaning of what you say? :))) Are you a zombie? :))))

                As for the fact that you declare that I am speaking on command .... :))) Well, this is another argument in favor of the fact that the price of your "analytics" is a cockroach wrote .... :))) The best part, that you should understand this .... :))) you just wanted to hurt me .... :))) I admit that I accept your attempts as a compliment - when people like you start praising me, I decide that it's time to shoot so as not to pollute the planet .... :))))
              3. oldstaryi
                oldstaryi April 3 2014 22: 13
                +1
                Let them live in Europe, BUT AT YOUR ACCOUNT! And even pay for gas at the expense of our credit!
          4. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 April 3 2014 16: 37
            +3
            Quote: Loki
            Now I understand for sure that you are not friends to us, you are not friends at all

            And what is a friend? Go to ferment? Sit at a beer? Go to the cinema?
            Yes, in the broadest sense, we are not friends with you. We don’t owe you anything. We can sell something, please. We can also buy. We can even lend and lend. But we’ll take a steam bath in the bathhouse and kiss her gums, we won’t
          5. The comment was deleted.
          6. The comment was deleted.
          7. The point
            The point April 6 2014 14: 51
            0
            Quote: Loki
            Now I understand for sure that you are not friends to us, you are not friends at all.

            Yeah, a goose a pig is not a friend!
      4. sled beach
        sled beach April 3 2014 16: 25
        +3
        For a long time already I already forgot about Crimea. It was not yours and never will be. It was not you who took it from the Turks and it was not for you to take care of it.
      5. sled beach
        sled beach April 3 2014 16: 25
        0
        For a long time already I already forgot about Crimea. It was not yours and never will be. It was not you who took it from the Turks and it was not for you to take care of it.
  6. soul
    soul April 3 2014 08: 32
    +3
    A third party is ALWAYS interested in any conflict. Look for who benefits from this. I don’t think that the USA is happy about the situation with Crimea (but it’s their own fault), but who is fueling the conflict? Whose oblique ears are peeking out from behind a mound? Who wants to take advantage of the situation?
    1. their
      their April 3 2014 10: 54
      0
      Beneficial to the entire Western community, America, Europe, Israel, as well as beneficial to the countries of the CU.
      1. soul
        soul April 3 2014 11: 37
        0
        Yes, only China is forgotten.
  7. gandalf
    gandalf April 3 2014 08: 56
    +2
    Maybe, if anything, evacuate enterprises from eastern Ukraine to the territory of Russia, as in 41-42?
    smile
    1. Alekseev
      Alekseev April 3 2014 09: 10
      +2
      Quote: gandalf
      Maybe, if anything, evacuate enterprises from eastern Ukraine to the territory of Russia, as in 41-42?

      So, probably. and they will do it. Moreover, the owners of Ukrainian enterprises themselves.
      For the Russian Federation, all these attempts are inconvenience, for many Ukrainian it smells like a fox. yes
  8. borisjdin1957
    borisjdin1957 April 3 2014 09: 10
    +6
    from the Don.
    With the termination of industrial relations with Russia, the end of industrial production in Ukropia is inevitable. Anticipating this, Rogozin went to Father’s for the development of cooperation in the defense industry! And Dill abroad is waiting for Dill! laughing
    1. xsapranx
      xsapranx April 3 2014 09: 36
      +11
      Cool "toad"
      Why worry about the Russian Federation?
      1 have a wise and determined leadership
      2 Scientific and production potential ahead of the rest
      3 There is no need to even mention the bowels of the earth
      4 ... and most importantly, these are ordinary people as the property of the country
      so I see no difficulties for the Russian Federation. Go ahead and do not look back ...
    2. The comment was deleted.
  9. ya.seliwerstov2013
    ya.seliwerstov2013 April 3 2014 09: 27
    0
    Partnership paralysis beneficial to a third party
    There was complete paralysis. Not the first, not the third party, I think I did not expect this and someone does not know what to do and how it all ends.
    1. xsapranx
      xsapranx April 3 2014 09: 42
      +4
      it’s vryatli ... I wildly doubt that Vladimir Vladimirovich has bad analytics in the team (here, most likely everything is laid out on the shelves and played by notes)
      And what role was assigned to representatives of Ukraine - time will tell ...
      Since before doing something, you have to think well, and not be guided by a "grasping reflex"
      1. avt
        avt April 3 2014 15: 41
        +3
        Quote: xsapranx
        Since before doing something, you have to think well, and not be guided by a "grasping reflex"

        If you mean the proposal to federalize the project "Ukraine 1991" with the consent of our probable friends, then this would be the best option for preventing the Ruins, but first of all the USA will not go to it, and the European Union alone will be afraid. But in general, try to understand, well, there was no it was a very malicious intent even in the annexation of Crimea. If they really wanted to, they would have done it back in Meshkov's time. The Ukraine 1991 project was generally supported by Russia's goodwill. Ukraine stupidly missed its chance to become a really strong regional power with extremely strong starting positions in the 91st. That would have gone on the way But father - there would be peace and order, and the international weight is not sour. But they outplayed nationalism, and even in the Bandera version, moreover, at the suggestion of the USA, which just recently hung their flag on the SBU building in Kiev. , the great chessboard "began to move, then after the next move - the Euroassociation went on to the Bandera Sabbath in the center of Kiev, followed by breeding pigs there and digging up a vegetable garden, the GDP, as a current player, simply had no other choice but to make a retaliatory move - to take Crimea , fortunately, the people living there at 80% were in favor. But they continue to play you despite the offer to somehow pause. Well, the reciprocal move will not be long in coming, otherwise we will lose. And Ukraine is a bargaining chip - USA is playing against Russia, and The GDP naturally counteracts, from this the forelocks will crack for a long time and not childishly, alas. I'm afraid even with federalization, to preserve the country, they are very late. And the hasty elections,where the right sector will agitate and count the votes to the result that the USA needs, like on the first Maidan of Yushchenko, only worse, it will generally bring the situation to a complete paralysis of even the current semblance of power. God forbid that I was wrong, but I see no prerequisites for optimism. And there is only one prerequisite - a check for 50 billion at once and now without enslaving conditions for the economy, with the only condition - control so as not from 3,14 .... whether.
        1. xsapranx
          xsapranx April 3 2014 19: 50
          -6
          Men, Any imposition on my country of federalization (of tourists) will be sent to the South with accompanying documents.
          You, with your mantra and attempt to make a good mine at a mediocre game, have slightly hesitated. Give you Federation so that in three years you quietly slaughter all Ukrainians or grind them.
          You, with your ultimatoms, are pushing the people into NATO's paws. And there is still an ass there that is not Slavic for *****.
          1. avt
            avt April 3 2014 22: 28
            +2
            Quote: xsapranx
            Men, Any imposition on my country of federalization (of tourists) will be sent to the South with accompanying documents.

            If the current owners, that they still hung their flag on the SBU in Kiev, all the same decide to negotiate with the GDP - take it under the hood and you will say that you yourself thought of it. This time. Nobody imposes federalization, they only propose a solution that has already been 15 years late. These are two.
            Quote: xsapranx
            You, with your mantra and attempt to make a good mine at a mediocre game, have slightly hesitated.

            Nobody plays with you, they play you, these are two big differences. These are three.
            Quote: xsapranx
            so in three years you quietly slaughter all Ukrainians or grind federation.

            But we are tired of creating at our own expense, and even in the Bandera version, the unitary state of the ancient Great-Ukrainian. Kharosh, as the Georgians created the state for you in the USSR, they registered at the UN immediately after the war, so what did we get except for the pains and groans about the troubles in which we are to blame ?? It’s painfully expensive in every sense. These are four. Well, in the end - you will grind yourself, but you won’t really blame yourself, you will regret, letting the drunken tear back and gritting your teeth from anger, again, naturally, Russians from Russia, well, yes already put it deeply with the device - for 23 years of your independence, you’re already used to such a scam.
  10. Cormorants
    Cormorants April 3 2014 09: 31
    +4
    China fusses not badly, no matter how cool the technology from the Soviet Union remained in Ukraine, why not take advantage of China.
    1. xsapranx
      xsapranx April 3 2014 09: 54
      0
      China is bustling everywhere - it has such a huge work to do.
      About 50 different students, practitioners, and sales agents were sent to us without any noise (now they really have expanse)
  11. Dimyxa
    Dimyxa April 3 2014 09: 36
    +7
    Quote: alma
    A third party is ALWAYS interested in any conflict. Look for who benefits from this. I don’t think that the USA is happy about the situation with Crimea (but it’s their own fault), but who is fueling the conflict? Whose oblique ears are peeking out from behind a mound? Who wants to take advantage of the situation?


    Who benefits? And here it is not necessary to go far. England! England from time immemorial considered and considers itself an imperialist country, and has always politically influenced other countries very competently and skillfully, and England for the most part has never physically intervened (since the mid-19th century, if I'm not mistaken), but only informatively and financially. With the help of England (although France was also an ally then) the Russian Empire was destroyed. The USSR was collapsed, despite the fact that basically the conflict was only between the USSR and the USA as the Cold War (England was just on hand, no matter how it had anything to do with it). In general, England was the main source of the problem, it’s even a pity that Hitler, instead of killing England and destroying it in the bud, went against the USSR, and for England it was like a breath of air for a drowning person, i.e., Hitler scattered his troops throughout Europe, and began to fight on two fronts, which he did worse only for himself, and to the joy of England.
  12. Name
    Name April 3 2014 09: 50
    +3
    From Confucius:Before you take a step forward, make sure that there is no abyss ahead.- but apparently this is not for Kiev concerned in BP ... The restrictions on the part of Ukraine in Russian sweets, fish and cheese indicate that MENTAL DEVELOPMENT is a reflex acquired and lost in the 23 year. It’s a pity, everything needs to be instilled from the beginning Pavlov's method ...
    1. Curculum
      Curculum April 3 2014 14: 15
      0
      Quote: name
      Before you take a step forward, make sure that there is no abyss ahead.

      Confucius makes a small mistake: sometimes steps need to be taken in other directions, not only forward. Therefore, one must look under the feet before any step.
  13. xsapranx
    xsapranx April 3 2014 09: 56
    +1
    there is still not "meat" but an electric shock (it comes faster)
  14. OPTR
    OPTR April 3 2014 10: 34
    +6
    Now the question becomes an edge: how to maintain close ties in areas vital for both countries against the backdrop of large-scale confrontation

    Incorrect formulation of the question.
    It would be right - how to ensure guaranteed deliveries of certain products, especially taking into account various interference, special conditions, etc.
  15. stayer
    stayer April 3 2014 10: 43
    +5
    The situation is difficult of course. Russia, of course, will be able (albeit at a high price) to establish the production of what is now being purchased (purchased) for the military-industrial complex and outer space. Only here for Ukraine it is a complete seam. Even if the pro-Russian government and the president come, it will not make sense to establish old contacts. Russia will already have its own production. Those. the current break in relations can forever put an end to the heavy industry of Ukraine.
  16. Seamaster
    Seamaster April 3 2014 11: 08
    +5
    For some reason, one more factor is not taken into account.
    May 25th, elections in Ukraine.
    24 candidates for preziki are registered.
    According to a long-standing Ukrainian tradition, only one candidate recognizes the winner as an election.
    All the rest say - do not recognize! - and begin to maidan (remember 2004).
    Well, about 18-20 candidates - no one can call them.
    But somewhere around 4-5 - like vicious scorpions or vipers, fondly loving each other.
    And now these "scorpions in the bank" have their own armed groups.
    Welcome, Ruin 2014!
    Makhno, Old Man Angel, Gritian Tauride and Ataman Maruska nervously smoke aside.
  17. Semenov
    Semenov April 3 2014 11: 40
    +1
    If May 9 goes well, then Ukraine will still flounder, but if the Pravoseki, "Svobodovtsy" and other Bandera trash with a fascist swastika pass through the center of Kiev, things will start to spin more rapidly. Not the fact that both Europeans and Russians will like it.
  18. Cristall
    Cristall April 3 2014 11: 42
    +6
    In general, it "froze for the period" of escalation. What does this mean (for how long) I don't know yet
    It is a completely resolved issue by one intergovernmental agreement. The fact is that it is difficult to do this for the Russian Federation (non-recognition of the Kiev government) and for KIEV itself (Crimea)
    A very familiar scenario of China and Taiwan. Yusa and there.
    In principle, cooperation is easy to renew. But the question is who and how.
    Our sorrow experts considered that we would incur losses of 600 million and you by 2 billion and the state program would be violated. Well, for us, 600 million is extremely important in conditions of shortage. You 2 billion are also important.
    Collapsing cooperation is an extremely unpopular topic for businesses. That is, when in Kiev or at the memory they applaud - like we will not give the aggressor "our" engines and turbines, - I do not see the employees of the MS and ZM (Zorya-Mash) who would be happy about this step. Like the owners and others.
    I don’t know how to proceed - Kiev itself does not solve anything, but only carries the engine forward.
    Most Ukrainians are extremely upset by the situation with Crimea and what followed it (denunciation and rise in gas prices), therefore, even a suicidal step to curtail cooperation will warm up a little. Not for long, but a small injection. How else to declare the "withdrawal of the Crimea"? War is an option. But we can't do it ourselves.
    We lose both - someone is more, someone is less ... but this is a loss.
    1. 31231
      31231 April 3 2014 12: 30
      +1
      Your "X-perts" are like your "media" burning with a verb.
      Did your "X-Perts" think about the fact that Russia will take analogs, albeit much more expensive? Russia has money. Or do you doubt that the Russian Federation is not able to pay a few more lemons for components?
      1. xsapranx
        xsapranx April 3 2014 19: 57
        -1
        So what prevents you from taking analogues? on the contrary, with the course that you asked you, it is imperative to release all that is indicated only at home and from your material and preferably on your own equipment.
        This is logical and more correct for such a country as you are positioning yourself.
        this is the guarantee of sending everyone else with their sanctions and threats.
    2. Turkir
      Turkir April 3 2014 12: 36
      +2
      Honor the Americans. The matter is much more serious.
      Ukraine is a bargaining pawn in the hands of the USA.
      Paul Craig Roberts: If the Russians do not wake up, they will become history!
      More details: http://globalconflict.ru/analytics/52654-pol-krejg-roberts-esli-russkie-ne-prosn
      utsya-to-stanut-istoriej
      и
      http://worldcrisis.ru/crisis/1381293
  19. wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 April 3 2014 12: 17
    +3
    Russia has two options:
    1. Set up its production of necessary equipment and components for its production.
    2. Play political intrigues with the West and, losing the initiative, dance to their "tune".
    The situation with the gas turbine engine, which is described in the article, is a "game of political intrigues with the West."
    Considering this, I personally would choose option number 1, if only because it is "reinforced concrete", "armor" as Professor Preobrazhensky said.
    At first, the personnel issue can be resolved as follows: simply lure the best personnel of this enterprise to Russia by creating the best conditions for them to work and support families.
    In Ukraine, now everything will be shitty in terms of living, there will be a long time to share power.
  20. 31231
    31231 April 3 2014 12: 26
    +2
    Alexey, the article is good. I enjoyed reading. Although not a large segment covers.
  21. wizarden
    wizarden April 3 2014 12: 37
    +2
    Russian horseback ride! Something can be delivered to Belarus, respectively, assembly sites will be organized there, well, I think some of the Ukrainian products will go directly to Russia in transit.

    ============

    Alexander Lukashenko has set the task of creating a Belarusian plane and a helicopter, and organizing the production of his own armored vehicles. Experts see here the underwater part of the iceberg: Belarus can become a mediator in the preservation and development of Russian-Ukrainian cooperation in the defense industry.

    Читать полностью: http://naviny.by/rubrics/politic/2014/04/02/ic_articles_112_185108/
  22. Papabear
    Papabear April 3 2014 12: 50
    +3
    Curtailing cooperation, oddly enough, is beneficial to SE. In this case, Ukraine receives the southeastern Maidan from people who woke up from work, and more stringent polemics and actions from them. Because it’s one thing to wobble stupidly, the third force will shoot, and it’s quite another to run into actions that can be calculated even with spontaneity, which should bring results. And not aimless sitting with beer on the Maidan in anticipation of the victory of the world revolution
  23. furious
    furious April 3 2014 13: 08
    +3
    Unfortunately, Ukraine systematically continues to dig a hole for itself ...
  24. Farvil
    Farvil April 3 2014 15: 10
    0
    Ukraine sold everything that it could to the Chinese and the Chinese had a technological breakthrough, of course, here our sales people also had a hand. But it’s essentially sad that they make us enemies.
  25. Buivol
    Buivol April 3 2014 15: 34
    +1
    "Alexander Lukashenko set the task of creating a Belarusian aircraft and a helicopter, organizing the production of his own armored vehicles. Experts see here the underwater part of the iceberg: Belarus can become an intermediary in the preservation and development of Russian-Ukrainian cooperation in the defense industry."
    http://www.belvpo.com/ru/36392.html
  26. tolyasik0577
    tolyasik0577 April 3 2014 15: 45
    0
    Ukraine and we will have to get used to the idea of ​​ending economic relations. Crimea is too strong resentment. no matter how bad things happened in the independence, while the ruling elite is a banderlog, we are enemies of number 1. We will have to look for partners in other lands.
  27. Buivol
    Buivol April 3 2014 15: 47
    +1
    I did not pay attention to the fact that this article was already quoted here. In general, judging by the negotiations between Turchinov and Lukashenko, the Kiev junta is looking for ways to normalize relations with Russia through the mediation of Belarus. And judging by our too cautious position in the Crimea, with the position clearly agreed at the very top with Russia, Putin is also not opposed to playing bad and good cops with the Ukrainian Natsiks. In general, it’s quite interesting to look at all this from the side. The truth is not from the Ukrainian hard workers employed in the defense industry.
  28. fregina1
    fregina1 April 3 2014 17: 35
    +1
    Ukrainian maydanutye are similar to the type who, before the wedding on a Jew, ran to the doctor and shouted: “Doctor, do me castration!” The doctor persuades him, saying that you are still young, still ahead! He insists on castration! After the operation, he says to the doctor with joy that tomorrow is the wedding! The doctor is surprised: "Well, then it was necessary to do circumcision!"
    The type is surprised: "What did I say?" wassat
  29. sled beach
    sled beach April 3 2014 17: 46
    +1
    Are they offended by Crimea, but the Russians didn’t interfere with crushing you? Or didn’t you know that the main population of Crimea was Russian? You got what you deserve and you can be offended only by yourself. hunger, the mind erupted in the bulk of the population.
  30. homosum20
    homosum20 April 3 2014 17: 52
    0
    As a person working in the field of mechanical engineering, I want to say many thanks to everyone who created the Russian-Ukrainian crisis. May God grant you health and good luck in future projects!
    You can’t imagine how it became easier to breathe in the market when the Kharkov VET Plant, Novokramatorsky Plant, Starokramatorsk Plant, Zaporizhzhya Power Plant, Azovmash and others located in Ukraine flew out of there. So it was hard to earn your salary at 53 years old, dangling along our Immense - and suddenly happiness. God is fair. The products of Russian enterprises are in demand in Russia and there are no dumping r.v.o.l.o.o.e.
    If this continues - every day I will put a candle in a centimeter of thickness.
  31. Aleksandr1981
    Aleksandr1981 April 3 2014 17: 59
    0
    News on the Ukrainian correspondent:
    Ukraine plans to repay gas debts at a price of $ 385 per thousand cubic meters, Prodan said.
    The Ukrainian authorities intend to take a loan of $ 2,2 billion from Russia to pay off debt for gas consumed. On Thursday, April 3, Minister of Fuel and Energy Yuri Prodan announced intentions to seek financial help from Moscow, UNIAN reports.

    "We are ready to take out a loan and clearly fulfill our obligations," the minister said.
    ON THIS TOPIC
    Russia abolishes zero gas duty for Ukraine
    Russia abolishes zero gas duty for Ukraine
    14:56
    Sold also clarified that the debt for deliveries of Russian gas to Ukraine in 2013 amounted to $ 1,45 billion, in February - $ 261 million, in March - $ 550 million.

    Asked by journalists, at what price they plan to repay debts for gas, Prodan replied that at 385 dollars.
    On Thursday, April 3, Gazprom CEO Alexei Miller said that Naftogaz’s debt, taking into account March deliveries, amounted to more than $ 2,2 billion. Russia also raised the price of gas for Ukraine to $ 485 per thousand cubic meters.
    Are they scoffing or is it fake?
  32. mig31
    mig31 April 3 2014 18: 09
    +1
    The final is near. The whole Slavic world will defend Ukraine, and we will live as before, even better ...
  33. Cristall
    Cristall April 3 2014 19: 15
    -1
    everything is not easy.
    You have no idea how difficult it is to "wash" the Russian Federation in the eyes of the Ukrainian people. And if you do nothing, everything will still get worse.
    Just think, because today we have come to the point of completely curtailing everything in common, an economic war is already underway, a psychological one too.
    Here, the shots are not far away ...
    As for cooperation - of course, it can be delivered through Belarus. I don’t know how this is possible. But part of the product is really possible. After all, the boycott is only the Russian Federation. Belarus is still held in high esteem.
    Although Lukashenko said that it was necessary to shoot so that it would not be in order to save the Crimea.
    The future is foggy and anxious.
    1. Setrac
      Setrac April 3 2014 20: 44
      +2
      Quote: Cristall
      Here, the shots are not far away ...

      What cannot be avoided. But you don’t care why we should care. Annoyingly, but okay, shoot.
  34. Arkan
    Arkan April 3 2014 20: 43
    +1
    Pastor Shlak, a slanted-headed woman, an old woman, Humpty Dumpty, Roshenmen and other living cadavres of Urkain reality, put it on the high-tech industry.
  35. Cristall
    Cristall April 3 2014 21: 07
    0
    Quote: Setrac
    What cannot be avoided. But you don’t care why we should care. Annoyingly, but okay, shoot.

    Yes exactly. I don’t care at all. Even the presence of the wife of a citizen of the Russian Federation.
    Will I fight with her? In bed or what? For the blanket?
  36. skymit
    skymit April 3 2014 22: 19
    0
    The cessation of GTA deliveries from Dawn-Mashproekt will hit our plans for the rearmament of the fleet, in particular, the Black Sea. Frigates of projects 11356 and 22350, for example, are equipped with their units ... I think ours will crush, and there are no options to push deliveries, unless we stockpiled these engines, as the Americans stocked our rd-180 a couple of years in advance ...
  37. kocclissi
    kocclissi April 3 2014 23: 58
    0
    It is beneficial for mattresses why they need developed economies of Russia and the EU! And so ... they didn’t give a shit, there they gave a shit, there’s a coup! A chicken pecks at the grain! And the mattress will not let you go forward calmly! Strangle the nada, these initiatives of them ..... before it’s too late!
  38. rocketman
    rocketman April 4 2014 01: 02
    -1
    Quote: smile
    You do not notice that in your newborn country the fascists are eager for power ...

    very much even notice. the "freedom" rating became kefir - 3%.
    Quote: smile
    You do not notice that it is in your country that children from kindergarten begin to accustom to the fact that Russians are enslavers ...

    Concrete nonsense. My son goes to kindergarten "Slavyanochka" in Vinnitsa. Here they celebrate the day of the defender of the patronymic - February 23 and Victory Day - May 9. By the way, on the Victory Day in Vinnitsa, 20 thousand people came to the parade last year. Let's see, after Russia's friendly actions, how many will come this year. I will personally come with my family. And once again, by the way - only 24 people came to the UPA monument on the cover - I personally counted, walked in the park.
    Quote: smile
    You do not notice who and by what methods supports the independents, that the same Goebbels mentioned by you is in solidarity with your independents ...

    We notice. Also, we notice, as your VVP said, “we will let women and children in front of us, and we ourselves will stand behind them. And God forbid the Ukrainians to shoot.” I know only one army that did this - the German fascist. I’m already silent about his speeches about the annexation of Crimea - one to one is similar to the Fuehrer’s cries about Austria, Danzig, the Sudeten Germans ...
    And from myself I’ll add something else.
    the difference between Russians and Ukrainians, in my opinion, is in relation to the authorities. For you, the person of the ruler (king, secretary general, president, prince) is sacred, his power is sole. You see the Bandera people in power in Ukraine - and you think that everyone in Ukraine meekly submits to them. This is far from the case. Three fourth Ukrainians turned them on x ____... (in one place). And they are not considered power. And the elections will show it. Yes, and we don’t need to sculpt that Yanuk is a legitimate pres. The Commander-in-Chief, who fled from the battlefield, sold everyone and everything - the Golden Eagle, the army, people from the east and the west, cannot be the president (ruler, king, etc.). You can imagine Putin or Lukashenko fleeing - I do not. And our president was a piece of shit Yanukovych, my fellow countryman, by the way, who sold everyone for gold loaves. Like this.
    1. Filon
      Filon April 4 2014 05: 36
      +1
      Quote: rocketman
      Also, we notice, as your VVP said, “we will let women and children in front of us, and we ourselves will stand behind them. And God forbid the Ukrainians to shoot.” I know only one army that did this - the German fascist.

      Do not be lazy, go to kremlin.ru and read a speech whole, and pay attention to the context in which these words were spoken. As the Ukrainian media presented this speech to you, we are aware, and the result is obvious. Well, you still read for yourself, at the same time you will understand the veracity of the media, it will be on your note. ... There it was that women and children would be theirs protection, and God forbid someone would risk encroaching on their (women and children) safety.

      Quote: rocketman
      For you, the person of the ruler (king, secretary general, president, prince) is sacred, his power is sole.

      Bgg! As well as with you - only if the president’s course coincides with the aspirations of each individual. And what you have
      Quote: rocketman
      Three fourth Ukrainians turned them on x ____... (in one place). And they are not considered power.

      only shows that these 3/4 are ready to recognize the power of someone else. Moreover, of these three cheuterteys, each has its own candidate, with whom the other three quarters will disagree ... And so it can continue until the victorious "stopizzotogo" Maidan. Yes, we are aware, we also notice it.

      Quote: rocketman
      and we don’t need to sculpt that Yanuk is a legitimate pres

      Bljad! Do you know the difference between "by law" and "by conscience"? I think you know. Well, we don't need to sculpt what we sculpt you, that Yanuca is a legitimate prez! By law - legitimate, by conscience - g @ clearly, both as a prez and as a person. But this does not negate its legitimacy and, in light of this, potential usefulness. Yanuca is an utterly soiled toilet brush! Nobody's going to kiss him, but he might come in handy to clear the shit. After which he will definitely be thrown into the trash without any delay and even more regret.
    2. Setrac
      Setrac April 4 2014 13: 08
      0
      Quote: rocketman
      You see the Bandera people in power in Ukraine - and you think that everyone in Ukraine meekly submits to them. This is far from the case. Three fourth Ukrainians turned them on x ____... (in one place).

      Well, well, turn it over, Bandera will strengthen their power and will turn you around, and now the question is, to whom will you run for protection?
  39. Akimichs
    Akimichs April 4 2014 06: 22
    0
    office computer software download programs http://ideal-figura.ru/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=7832&sid=f50258af
    e182108a7902dc5795b73d70
  40. rocketman
    rocketman April 4 2014 07: 04
    -2
    Quote: Filon
    Do not be lazy, go to kremlin.ru and read the whole speech, and pay attention to the context in which these words sounded. As the Ukrainian media presented this speech to you, we are aware, and the result is obvious. Well, you still read for yourself, at the same time you will understand the veracity of the media, it will be on your note. ... There it was a question that women and children would be protected, and God forbid someone would risk encroaching on their safety (women and children).

    Yes, I read. In any case, embroiling women and children in men's affairs is shameful.
    But Yanukovych is not even fit to clean up - and Maidan showed, especially at the beginning
  41. abc_alex
    abc_alex April 4 2014 15: 02
    0
    If on the topic of the article, it is very, very sad. Yes, I understand that Crimea ... But to lose, although not the most trouble-free, but still an independent partner that can solve part of our problems in the production of new equipment is very bad. No matter how patriotic anyone may be, in six months or a year neither ship power units will be able to start producing, nor Motor Sich’s power to compensate. And most importantly, it will not work to find a qualified developer with your own, and not our budgetary funds. Still, the same Sich improves engines at the expense of its profits.

    In short, we hold our fists and hope that all this canoe will be resolved.
  42. igor.borov775
    igor.borov775 April 5 2014 16: 12
    0
    Quote: smile
    xsapranx
    Is it clear now.
    You do not want to answer unpleasant questions ... and not because you do not want to. but because there is nothing to answer. And I say this without any hahanek. Just stating a fact.

    Judging by what you said here about the "Tashkent frontier detachment", you are quite young - from the generation of thirty, who were brought up from school in the spirit of independence .... by the way, for reference, members of Hizb ut Tazrir - consider the relatives of those whom beat your Castle, briskly migrated from Crimea to Lviv - fascists to fascists ...

    Yes, in the Army you can’t divide citizens into yours and strangers, all yours ... but when in your country power is seized under fascist banners and slogans, and to hell with it that thief-yanukovych was thrown off, but at the same time no less thieves, and even with fascist rhetoric .... is it time to think? What, once an army man, will you follow the orders of the Nazis? I am silent - how can you like being a European slave corral of cheap labor ....

    In general, it’s a strange thing - it matters to you that the trapped last name of Bandera is squealing, but you consider it normal for Bandera to rhetoric your unsuccessful presidential candidates ... continue?

    And the last one, I, as an artist, I report to the artist by voice - the day when the Ukrainian army finally takes up the position of eurofascists and begins to kill opponents of eurofascists, will be the first day from which it is worth counting the end of the project of Ukrainian statehood, the bankruptcy of which was proved on the Maidan, and which the maydaunas slaughtered in winter this year .... you prove by your actions that the communists were wrong, for the first time in history, giving you quasi-statehood .... goodbye.

    By the way, you should not blame me for the fact that I am subject to propaganda of Moscow - first of all, I am subject to propaganda of my Ukrainian relatives.
    I don’t want to add anything just this answer everyone answered as they say removed from the tongue, To everyone present on the website of good health