Military Review

Kazakhstan has begun to "indigenization"

376
Kazakhs



The events in Ukraine, and especially in the Crimea, unexpectedly reminded the country's leadership of the existence of Russians and the fact that these Russians also have serious problems associated with the violation of their rights. During the campaign for the return of the peninsula, all our leaders vied with each other about the need to protect Russians and Russian-speaking people around the world. They talked about the fact that this is a sacred duty and an important mission of the Russian state and society agreed with the authorities on this topic. But the world outlined by them, for some reason surprisingly exactly coincided with the borders of revolutionary Ukraine, and yet, among the Russians of Central Asia, about which our leadership stubbornly remains silent in a rag, there are also very serious problems. And a new round of such “ethnic problems” will soon begin in the closest ally and partner of the Russian Federation - in Kazakhstan.

Apparently, Kazakhstan closely followed the Ukrainian events, and decided not to allow the “Crimean scenario” on its territory.

The leadership of Kazakhstan has decided to dramatically increase the Kazakh population of the north of the country. While we are talking about the resettlement of thousands of Kazakhs 300 Kazakhs from the south of the country in the northern regions. Well, help the Kazakhs in this regard, China. And it will help not only with investment projects, but also with additional labor. And not from somewhere, but from the Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region and precisely from those areas that are inhabited by the Kazakhs and the Uighurs. So, China, it seems, can send to Kazakhstan its own Kazakhs and Uighurs, who live in this autonomous region.

According to the agreement, Kazakhstan will give China the right to lease and use land, and China will take over all the issues related to the financing and provision of necessary equipment. And all the products that will be produced thanks to this contract will be sold in the Kazakh and Chinese markets.

But the economic component of this decision is not as interesting for our country as its national component. But we are talking about the beginning of replacement migration and the “indigenization” of Northern Kazakhstan.

At the moment, Russians make up 23,7% of the population of Kazakhstan, or 3 million 869 thousand people. Moreover, they live very compactly in the north of Kazakhstan, in the region whose historical the name is Southern Siberia and which was given by the Bolsheviks of the Kazakh SSR formed by them. If you look at the ethnic map of this country, you can easily make sure that these regions have a very distant relationship with Kazakhstan and more like a piece cut off from Russia, because the share of the Russian population is very significant. And judging by the statements of the Kazakh leadership, they decided to correct this "misunderstanding" by changing the ethnic composition of the region.

In general, with regard to ethnic enclaves, there are four main strategies of state behavior: first, this is full recognition of the rights of national minorities and securing them a compact territory with rights of autonomy or even a national republic. The second is the policy of assimilation and gradual dissolution of the foreign culture population in the array of the titular nation of the country. The third is extrusion, which in radical forms assumes the character of mass exile and genocide. Well, the fourth tactic, which China has actively used and continues to use, is the replacement migration of the representatives of the titular nation to the territory of national minorities.

And, apparently, Kazakhstan decided to follow the Chinese route, starting to stimulate Kazakh migration to the Russian north of the country. Of course, the demographic potential of the Kazakhs is much lower than the Chinese and they are physically unable, like the Hans, to completely change the ethnic map of the region for a couple of years, becoming an absolute national majority in it. But still they chose this path. The path of the forced “indigenization” of the historically Russian regions.

Of course, the Chinese Uygurs and Kazakhs will also help them in this, but still their number will not be enough. This means that in addition to the simple settlement, they will have to use other methods. For example - the gradual squeezing of the Russian population, as it is already actively being done in the south of this country, from where the main stream of Russian immigrants to Russia is now coming.

Of course, Kazakhstan is not Tajikistan, where the policy of the real genocide was pursued against the Russian population. The Kazakhs have other methods - discrimination and extrusion. And now a substitute migration has been added to them. So in a short time we can well expect a significant increase in Russian refugees from this country.
resettlement map



It can be said that Kazakhstan has started the final solution of the “Russian question”. And from this a logical question arises: will our political leadership somehow protect the rights of Russians and Russian speakers in Kazakhstan, or will the “Russian question” be officially recognized only in Ukraine and the Russians of Kazakhstan will remain a “ghost people” for the Kremlin?




Senator Svetlana Dzhalmagambetova proposed to resettle southerners in the northern regions of Kazakhstan, the correspondent of UN Tengrinews.kz.

According to the deputy, per capita financing, which is introduced in Kazakhstan, "puts the northern regions of Kazakhstan on its knees." She raised this problem during the consideration of the draft republican budget for 2014-2016 years in the Senate of Parliament.

"I just have the impression that in the north or it is necessary to close all the villages and say, or let's move people from south to north. Or do some coefficients in the north. Because we just stay with the whiskers, the distances huge between settlements. If there is no school in the village, if there is no settlement in the village, no post will be - no one will live there. The President moved the capital to have a population here. But everyone is around Astana, and no one wants to live there. "- She said.

Opinions of experts.

Arman Shuraev, general director of KTK TV channel:

I fully agree with the proposal to relocate the Kazakhs from south to north. In Northern Kazakhstan, auls are closed every year in bundles. They close up primarily because there are no children in the schools. The school is closing - that's all, it means that the village is automatically closed. 20 teachers are left without work, people are breaking down from their homes and settling down in the suburbs, in shacks, abandoned summer houses, sitting without work. The part goes to crime-theft, robbery, robbery, etc. and etc. However, in the south of terrible overcrowding. If you throw a cry and each family of immigrants provide an empty house in the village and a couple of cows and a dozen sheep, you can forget about the notion of an unpromising settlement and save our crib, our villages ...

Askar UMAROV, Chairman of the Board of Trustees of the KazBussinesMedia Foundation:

It was proposed to resettle the population from South Kazakhstan to the north of the country. Very correct and practical solution. Moreover, spontaneous and uncontrolled resettlement is already underway. On the basis of economic and political tasks it is necessary to give consistency to this process. We have an almost ethnically homogeneous, overpopulated south and a sparsely populated ethnically diverse north. Any demographer will tell you in this the risks to the country. But I do not agree with the fact that migrants from the south need to fill auls. Let me explain why: more than 40 percent of the population of Kazakhstan live and work in auls. The process of the evolution of agriculture, the increase in people's demands for their standard of living, their comfort and security, forces people to move to cities in search of work, in search of a better life. Urbanization is an objective process dictated by time. According to UN forecasts, 2050 percent of the population of the Earth will live already on the asphalt by 70. And these figures are even more indicative for the northern countries: in neighboring Russia, according to the same international estimates, more than 2025 percent of the population will become citizens in 90 already in the year. And the world can cite many examples of rurally developed countries where the majority of the population is urban. After all, food security has ceased to require the exhausting labor of the overwhelming majority of the population, as it once was. For example, Australia: a state that feeds high-quality meat and other agricultural products to a significant part of the world, a state whose 61% territory covers more than 135 thousands of farmers and cattle farms, remains a country where almost the entire population is concentrated in cities along the coast. But the Congo, where 90 percent lives in the countryside and where you can shoot four crops a year, is somehow not seen on the world agricultural market. The work that the Soviet collective farm performed while losing health, thousands of people, today are able to perform hundreds, if not dozens of trained specialists on modern "smart" machines. Therefore, the question arises: what to do with the released people. Only in the city and create a housing and production base for them there. The increase in the number of citizens is an undoubted benefit for the country. Cities are the scientific, cultural and industrial points of growth, the place where the main resource of our time, information, is concentrated. A state in which a larger share of the population lives in comfortable, developed cities is more competitive, and this is an indisputable fact. But urbanization is a challenge to the state. How to take in our cities people from auls, most of whom are young people, how to provide them with decent housing, work, education, how to promote their cultural adaptation in the city? We are now in the process of "false urbanization", an uncontrolled process. And it needs to be systematized. Start with the relocation of the rural population of the South to the cities of the North, starting a large-scale program of national urbanization.

There will be public resistance, including from the "Soviet" national intelligentsia and their young followers. They will begin to express their regrets related to the withering away of the Kazakh aul, the loss of the traditional way of life adopted by our ancestors. However, nostalgia, no matter how explicable, should not slow down the movement of a nation forward, should not conflict with common sense. Progress cannot be stopped. Around the world, the seemingly unchanged national lifestyles are breaking down, and this is a natural phenomenon. I doubt that any of our metropolitan “guardians of the village” will agree to voluntarily give up a comfortable apartment and move to the steppe. A strong nation whose representatives strive for a better life, comfort, knowledge and high-quality medical care. And this is possible only in cities.


Opinions are taken from the personal pages of experts in the social network "Facebook"
376 comments
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  1. Sergg
    Sergg 31 March 2014 07: 15
    +16
    A populist statement, in Russian - nonsense.
    It is extremely difficult for people to leave their "familiar places", and what is the point of leaving the favorable south to the north of the same country, where it is not yet known where the wheel of history will turn.
    1. Ptah
      31 March 2014 07: 21
      +9
      Quote: Sergg
      It is extremely difficult for people to remove themselves from their homes.

      If it is not supported by the state. programs and is not raised to the rank of almost a "national idea"
      1. ArhipenkoAndrey
        ArhipenkoAndrey 31 March 2014 09: 50
        +7
        And such things are never done without the knowledge of the state, albeit hidden, but there is always support, but here at the government level and the tip-off they concoct the necessary one, as in the Baltic states, the genocide will be trampled upon.
        1. jjj
          jjj 31 March 2014 12: 48
          +2
          They will thus only aggravate the situation. Let me give you one curious fact. There is one interesting enterprise in Russia - "Mayak". About forty years ago there was an accident there, and radioactive waters were dumped into the rivulet. The level was off scale. Four villages were in the danger zone. Two residents were evicted, and two were left in place. So, those people who moved, almost all died within a few years. And those who remained to live in a dangerous place, practically all survived, with the exception of a few people. So extreme relocation leads to population decline. The number can only recover after generations
    2. GELEZNII_KAPUT
      GELEZNII_KAPUT 31 March 2014 07: 23
      +9
      And how the locals will relate to the migrants! hi
      1. atalef
        atalef 31 March 2014 09: 58
        +13
        Quote: GELEZNII_KAPUT
        And how the locals will relate to the migrants!

        Actually, this is one country and is called like Kazakhstan hi
        By the way, today it is one of not many allies of the Russian Federation and a member of the CU.
        In general, all these conversations are provocative in nature and their inflation will lead to only one thing --- Kazakhstan will begin to look for alternatives.
        1. Day 11
          Day 11 31 March 2014 10: 09
          0
          Hi Sanya. How are negotiations going on about Israel’s entry into the Customs Union? We have information-0
          1. atalef
            atalef 31 March 2014 12: 02
            +2
            Quote: Den 11
            Hi Sanya. How are negotiations going on about Israel’s entry into the Customs Union? We have information-0

            Hi Denis .
            In general, we have the same thing - zero.
            Believe me, Israel will not join the CU, maybe there will be some kind of partnership agreement and it will be - but nothing more.
            Do you understand the situation such that everything that is connected with the TS is very unsteady, and what is the gain for us? Without a single transport system, the vehicle turns into a fiction.
        2. Semurg
          Semurg 31 March 2014 11: 20
          +10
          Quote: atalef
          Quote: GELEZNII_KAPUT
          And how the locals will relate to the migrants!

          Actually, this is one country and is called like Kazakhstan hi
          By the way, today it is one of not many allies of the Russian Federation and a member of the CU.
          In general, all these conversations are provocative in nature and their inflation will lead to only one thing --- Kazakhstan will begin to look for alternatives.

          The program of resettlement of Kazakhs from outside of Kazakhstan worked for about 20 years and about 1 million Kazakhs moved to Kazakhstan through it (now this program has been temporarily stopped). If they now start a program of internal movement of Kazakhs from the overpopulated south to the empty north, this will be correct. From the West, the same thing needs to be relocated, for example, the events in Zhana-Ozen, along with other reasons, were also caused by its overpopulation (over 20 years, its population increased from 35 thousand people to 130 thousand.) And why does it bother the Russians I don’t understand or want to introduce for the Kazakhs in Kazakhstan ban on moving? In principle, even now, young people are going north from the south, and with the help of the state this will be easier to do (if in the Russian Federation they start the resettlement program in the Far East, I will not mind laughing ). Those warriors who unsubscribed on the branch that it is necessary to start spinning "primordially Russian lands" - a machine gun in hand and run around and start to do it. Now, regarding the lease of land to China, this topic greatly annoys us Kazakhs and does not smile at us to see Han, Uyghurs, Dungans, etc. in Kazakhstan, if China proposes to resettle ethnic Kazakhs from Xinjiang, it still works (they are a bit different from Soviet Kazakhs, but their children are already ours Kazakhs), and why this question strains the Russians again I don’t understand (unless the maniacal desire of Russians to be a plug in all barrels). Now a lot of all sorts of garbage is written here by clans and Juzes, and the main delusion of Russian Kazakhs are not divided into clans and Juzes they consist of them (by the way, the historical lands of the middle Juz go in a strip from the middle course of the Syr Darya to Omsk and Tyumen, and the Kazakhs of the middle Juz from the south will go north to their historical nomad laughing ) By the way, the southern Kazakhs did not cut out local Russians; I don’t think that they will change their habits by moving south (if the Russians are concerned about this issue). In local Russian, I want to say why Kazakhization is annoying, if you know the language of Kazakhs, Russianness will disappear from you? One smart person once said that a guest, or-de-ot or occupier (instilling his own language) may not know the language of the country of residence. The Republic of Kazakhstan took place as a state and the Kazakh language is state language and ignoring its study, you are doing a disservice to your children by depriving them of their prospects in the Republic of Kazakhstan, of course, if you do not plan to a) move to Russia b) try to move together with the land of North Kazakhstan.
          1. Setrac
            Setrac 31 March 2014 11: 34
            +7
            Quote: Semurg
            In local Russian, I want to say why Kazakhization is annoying, if you know the language of Kazakhs, Russianness will disappear from you?

            Not everyone will be able to learn a new language, and not even the majority, this is real discrimination.
            1. vovan50
              vovan50 31 March 2014 13: 04
              +4
              From the fact that the Russians in the Republic of Kazakhstan will learn the Kazakh language (and many more or less understand it), nothing will change for the Russians. Little depends on knowledge / lack of language; the main thing is who steers. If Kazakh, then he will pull his own.
              1. Setrac
                Setrac 31 March 2014 13: 27
                +6
                Quote: vovan50
                From the fact that the Russians in the Republic of Kazakhstan will learn the Kazakh language (and many more or less understand it), nothing will change for the Russians. Little depends on knowledge / lack of language; the main thing is who steers. If Kazakh, then he will pull his own.

                They, instead of the Kazakh language that was absolutely unnecessary to them, and also to the native Kazakhs, could study science, technology, and develop statehood. After all, there is no technical and scientific part in the Kazakh language. As a result, the state Kazakh language will throw Kazakhstan away in the Middle Ages, you will be like any other Bundustan of a banana republic.
                1. dustycat
                  dustycat April 5 2014 22: 44
                  +2
                  Quote: Setrac
                  They, instead of the Kazakh language that was absolutely unnecessary to them, and also to the native Kazakhs, could study science, technology, and develop statehood.


                  Polyglotness ventilates the brains very well and teaches thinking outside the box.
                  In addition, to learn Kazakh to a level so as not to amuse the local problem is not great.
              2. Natrix
                Natrix April 6 2014 16: 13
                +2
                Not true! Kazakhs greatly respect Russians who know the Kazakh language. In principle, knowledge of the state. language is quite a normal requirement. Is it not so in Russia?
            2. Natrix
              Natrix April 6 2014 16: 38
              +1
              There is no strict requirement for compulsory knowledge of the Kazakh language, only for the state. employees. But even there, this requirement is usually not fulfilled.
          2. smile
            smile 31 March 2014 13: 42
            +3
            Semurg
            Meanwhile, Kazakhs continue and continue to move to the Kaliningrad region ... not Russians, not employees of the Almaty Regional Committee, as the Russophobic part of our Kazakh colleagues on the site likes to lie :))), namely Kazakhs, who are probably being exchanged for Chinese Uighurs ... in 2005, it seems, in Kaliningrad, the Regional Public Organization "Kazakh Cultural Society" Orken "was created ... the head arrived in 2004 (probably served in the Almaty Regional Committee :)))).
            For reference, if special programs are constantly being adopted for the Russian Kazakhs to move to our Region, then the Kazakhs go on their own, at their own expense, without any help ... go and go ... Maybe they are more comfortable with us, huh?

            These are the things, I will not comment.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 13: 50
              0
              Quote: smile
              we have in Kaliningrad

              Are you in the sense of KO?
              1. smile
                smile 31 March 2014 14: 31
                0
                Vasilenko Vladimir
                Yes.
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 14: 49
                  0
                  where if not a secret
                  1. smile
                    smile 31 March 2014 15: 24
                    0
                    Vasilenko Vladimir
                    The house is a short drive from Kaliningrad. I can’t say the address? So, let's say, employed - in Kaliningrad.
                    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 15: 40
                      0
                      Yes, I just asked, I live almost next to you in the Pravdinsky district
                      1. smile
                        smile 31 March 2014 15: 46
                        0
                        Vasilenko Vladimir
                        The world is small. :))) Yes, it really is not far.
                      2. Luzhichanin
                        Luzhichanin 31 March 2014 19: 35
                        +1
                        you still need to make friends, otherwise such things in the world ... will not hurt wink
                      3. The comment was deleted.
          3. Zymran
            Zymran 31 March 2014 14: 00
            +1
            Quote: smile
            Meanwhile, Kazakhs continue and continue to move to the Kaliningrad region ... not Russians, not employees of the Almaty Regional Committee, as the Russophobic part of our Kazakh colleagues on the site likes to lie :))), namely Kazakhs, who are probably being exchanged for Chinese Uighurs ... in 2005, it seems, in Kaliningrad, the Regional Public Organization "Kazakh Cultural Society" Orken "was created ... the head arrived in 2004 (probably served in the Almaty Regional Committee :)))).


            According to the census of 2002, 631 Kazakh lived in Kaliningrad. smile I did not find data for 2010.

            An exchange for Chinese Uighurs is a duck.
            1. smile
              smile 31 March 2014 14: 37
              -4
              Zymran
              :))) Yes, this is not a duck, I blinked. Here are excerpts from an interview with the head of the Kazakh public organization Orken:

              ... To date, a lot has been done. We participate in all cultural events organized in the city of Kaliningrad and the region, help compatriots in solving everyday and business issues, help the Consul General of Kazakhstan in St. Petersburg to host Kazakhstanis in Kaliningrad, etc.
              ...- There are many Kazakhstanis in the region. Who would you name first?

              - It is not so easy to name even the most famous ones. It takes a long time to list. Vladimir Gerasimovich Khan, a citizen of Zhambyl, came here after serving in the tank forces of the Soviet Army in Germany. Now he is the head of one of the world's best fireworks organizations (Khan Fireworks Center). His awards in international competitions are hard to count.

              In the dental clinic "Centrodent" (http://www.centrodent.ru/) clients are not only from Kaliningrad and the region. People travel from Germany and other countries specifically to see the doctors of Yevgeny Mushkatovich Akhmetov. But what can I say, Kazakhstani Kaliningraders are a special big topic.

              - And what about the ongoing resettlement program for compatriots? One of the officials of our regional Government urged those wishing to use it, not to rush, to weigh everything, but rather, come and see on the spot so that there would be no disappointment.

              - A man was born in order to be free. The desire to live wherever you want is his priority right. And it does not depend on any programs. In Russia, there is now a demographic decline, a shortage of workers, primarily qualified specialists. Initially, the program was aimed at Russian-speaking residents of the Baltic republics, infringed on civil rights. But mainly Central Asian residents responded to it ...

              ... Life has shown (once again!), Centrifugal tendencies, the desire to divide peoples and drive a wedge between them lead to grief and suffering, degradation of society. Development, progress are possible only on positive trends. In the Kaliningrad region there are objective and subjective prerequisites for this, and the Kazakh diaspora is an excellent driving force and a good example.

              We believe that the prospects for cooperation between the Kaliningrad region and the cities and regions of Kazakhstan should be built, first of all, on the basis of common cultural values. Twin cities, exchange of students, organization of student practice, conducting mutual tours, exchange of television and radio programs, materials of newspapers and magazines are few of the possible directions.

              http://articles.gazeta.kz/art.asp?aid=119765
              1. Zymran
                Zymran 31 March 2014 14: 50
                +1
                The dentist has been living in Kaliningrad since Soviet times, as well as Khan, who, judging by the last name of the Korean. And where are the thousands of Kazakhs moving to Kaliningrad?
                1. smile
                  smile 31 March 2014 15: 29
                  0
                  Zymran
                  Firstly. These are not my words, but the words of the founder and head of the Kazakh Cultural Center Maxim Muratovich Saidkarimov, who arrived either in 2004 or in 2005. I think if you google, you will find a lot of his interviews, they often get him from him.
                  Secondly, I did not talk about thousands :))) We have a small area and not so much influx of people arriving for permanent residence.
          4. Semurg
            Semurg 31 March 2014 14: 13
            +1
            Quote: smile
            Semurg
            Meanwhile, in the Kaliningrad region

            These are the things, I will not comment.

            And you know, even more of our people go to London, and I'm more than sure that they feel good there. And why comment on each other, we all seem to have clarified a long time ago, I am for you "natsik-Russophobe", you are "glamorous" for me.
            1. smile
              smile 31 March 2014 14: 46
              +3
              Semurg
              For me, Natsik among yours are those who claimed that the refugees who arrived in the Kaliningrad region are all employees of the Alma-Ata regional committee, and in general, all refugees are liars and villains who are to blame for everything. By the way, there are no more refugees since the late nineties, you see everything has settled down there, thank God. But there are migrants. Also, for me, Natsiks are those who scream about our skins, point-blank not noticing their chauvinists, who differ from ours only in that we crush skins, and in some places some do not. :))) I don’t remember if you said that ... :))) Perhaps, judging by your reaction, the cap is on the thief and it’s on. :)))
              1. Semurg
                Semurg 31 March 2014 15: 15
                0
                Yes, in the fall I saw the "Russian march" in Moscow. When the "Kazakh march" in Astana is held in Kazakhstan with the permission of the authorities, then the hat will light up, and while it is burning on your head laughing . Next to you in KO Vasilenko he is living according to you who is a refugee or a migrant?
                1. smile
                  smile 31 March 2014 15: 44
                  +1
                  Semurg
                  Well, how do I know who Vladimir Vasilenko is? I do not know him personally.
                  :))) I don’t have anything burning :))) The march of marginals personally provoked, to put it mildly, a very negative reaction, which I set out, including on this site. But there were very few of them. Moreover, according to the organizers, he had to take a different form than this. Although, those who allowed, I believe, understood WHO would crawl out onto this march.

                  In addition to the fact that this crowd was strolling along the street, other SYSTEM manifestations, for example, dismissal from work on a national basis, deprivation of lodging, etc. that you had in the nineties, we never had and never will. And not only that ... is it really necessary to remind? You already know everything and have seen everything. Moreover, we did not have and do not have what you stated in the press in the nineties and sometimes now. And the fact that our Natsiks are crushed - so there are a lot of cases of bringing them to criminal liability - and they give them quite tangible terms (even some on the site are very indignant :)))). And you have any of the titular Natsik planted for assaults on Russian propaganda of Russophobia, huh? So who is burning what? :)))
                  1. Semurg
                    Semurg 31 March 2014 20: 00
                    +7
                    Nat. harassment as a system for me consists of several floors. The first floor is an organization of supposedly skins that beat for the fact that the cut of the eyes is different in the Russian Federation and not in the RK. The second floor is when representatives of one nation are marching around the city with slogans like "Russia for Russians" and this is in Russia and not in Kazakhstan. The third floor is when there is a certain treatment of people in the media by the type of whipping up hysteria in international relations, this is in the Russian Federation and not in the Republic of Kazakhstan. The fourth floor is when there is a state policy on oppression on national grounds, this is not in the Russian Federation and Kazakhstan. So I think who is burning wink If you were personally outraged by this march, which is good, but on the site in the fall I saw the approval of this march and from many. And the fact that you have skins planted and there is no unas, so there is no one and nothing to plant because there are no skins in the Republic of Kazakhstan. Last year, in the summer, the youth held a dombra party in parks a couple of times. It was when about 20 people gathered to play the dombra and sang in Kazakh, so they were forbidden to do so because some Russians did not like it and they called and complained to the police. Now they do it from home, so as not to displease vigilant people. laughing who in this discerned oppression on a national basis.
                    1. Natrix
                      Natrix April 6 2014 16: 33
                      +2
                      I completely agree with you. You very modestly gave only one example of the "dombra party" type, in fact there are a lot of them. I am 37 years old, I am rather Russian (rather, since I have Ukrainians, Belarusians, Czechs and Poles in my family). So, for all my life here (in Kazakhstan), oddly enough, I more often met with cases of Russian nationalism, and not Kazakh.
                    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir April 6 2014 18: 44
                      0
                      Quote: Natrix
                      more often met with cases of Russian nationalism, and not Kazakh.

                      can you give examples?
                    3. Natrix
                      Natrix April 6 2014 21: 19
                      +2
                      It’s easy, but I won’t, because otherwise I’ll be like those whose behavior I don’t accept, and no matter what nationality they are. I can give indirect evidence - many of my friends who are abroad prefer to say that they are from Kazakhstan and not from Of Russia. At the same time, they note that the behavior of the attendants towards them immediately changes for the better. Probably, this says something.
                    4. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir April 6 2014 22: 46
                      -1
                      Quote: Natrix
                      Easy, but I won’t

                      then not over and blame said A say B
                    5. Natrix
                      Natrix April 7 2014 07: 24
                      +1
                      I gave an indirect example. And in relation to everyone else, how do you like it - with dates, passport details, written certified documents? Some kind of unhealthy curiosity.
                      This is firstly, and secondly, I did not blame anyone, I just outlined the scope of my own experience. Perhaps someone else is different. Nationalism is a supranational concept, it is more an indicator of the social culture of each individual than of the people as a whole.
          5. The comment was deleted.
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  3. Guard
    Guard 31 March 2014 20: 03
    +9
    Quote: smile
    Meanwhile, Kazakhs continue and continue to move to the Kaliningrad region ... not Russians, not employees of the Almaty Regional Committee, as the Russophobic part of our Kazakh colleagues on the site likes to lie :))), namely Kazakhs, who are probably being exchanged for Chinese Uighurs ... in 2005, it seems, in Kaliningrad, the Regional Public Organization "Kazakh Cultural Society" Orken "was created ... the head arrived in 2004 (probably served in the Almaty Regional Committee :)))).
    For reference, if special programs are constantly being adopted for the Russian Kazakhs to move to our Region, then the Kazakhs go on their own, at their own expense, without any help ... go and go ... Maybe they are more comfortable with us, huh?

    The number of Kazakhs in the entire Kaliningrad region is 630 people. In any seedy Kazakhstani village near Shymkent, Russians are even more.
    In addition, the Kaliningrad "Kazakh Cultural Society" Orken "is not for ethnic Kazakhs, but for people from Kazakhstan, and these are Russians, Germans, Koreans, and Tatars.
    Horseradish knows why this Maxim Seidkarimov moved - maybe he is half Russian, he may have fallen in love with Kaliningrad, he may want to stupidly live by the sea, but his move is in no way a sign of the alleged mass migration of ethnic Kazakhs to Russia, and in particular to the Kaliningrad region. There are many more ethnic Russians moving to Kazakhstan than ethnic Kazakhs moving to Russia. And the Russians come here even more to work than the Kazakhs in Russia.
    Kazakhs usually come to you for four years to get an education. After graduation, you do not delay.
  • dustycat
    dustycat April 5 2014 22: 35
    +1
    Quote: Semurg
    and why this issue is annoying Russian I again do not understand

    Yes, this is a real Russian to the bulb.
    Properly steer your country without succumbing to the provocations of white-tape and all right.
    Of course, the southern Juzes were trying to buzz something about the type "Russians remain our slaves" in the late 1980s, but they quickly calmed down.
    And in other areas, local mainly party elites were engaged in the eviction of Russian invaders, but I'm sorry - an apartment in a 9-story building with even an improved layout is interesting only while the elevator, water supply and sewage system are working.
    Therefore, hysteria with the topic of occupation quickly vanished.
    And therefore, to Russian normal citizens, your internal problems are of little interest.
    And to liberals and provocateurs - what to take from illnesses ?!
  • The comment was deleted.
  • s1н7т
    s1н7т 31 March 2014 12: 41
    +1
    Quote: atalef
    Kazakhstan will begin to look for alternatives.

    And it will find problems for itself, however.
  • dustycat
    dustycat April 5 2014 22: 21
    -1
    Quote: GELEZNII_KAPUT
    And how the locals will relate to the migrants!

    What migrants ?!
    Where from ?!
    If only from China itself, but certainly not the Uyghur region
    However, the climate in the north of Kazakhstan is very different from the Uygir region.
    There the land is swampy, rotten and vile in real form - there are clouds of vile there every summer. DIE out in a couple of winters.
    From the south of Kazakhstan? From AlmaAty? So there are practically no Kazakhs there.
    And the other southern regions of Kazakhstan are occupied by the Kyzylkum desert.
    There, the density is less than 0,2 people per square kilometer, and it is precisely in these areas that the Chinese have very great interest. But where does the population come from?
    The Chinese certainly need land, but so that the climate is not very different.
    Of course, the north of Kazakhstan has the best energy supply from the West Siberian energy transit, but there are big problems with the rest.
    A particular problem is the clan nature of the Kazakh society.
    Nazarbayev is just the president appointed at one time.
    But he is not from the Kazakh clans, he is not from the bais of Kazakhstan who really ruled Kazakhstan even in the times of the USSR and in the Russian Empire.
    Of course, he cleverly and wisely balances between the interests of Russia, China and the bayonet for several years. But he has no real fullness of power.

    The Uyghur people know what it is and will not want to move from their clans to the rule of other clans.
    Nazarbayev moved the capital to Astana at the request of these bays.
    All other explanations bullshit.
    There is no single Kazakhstan.
    There is the south of Kazakhstan and the Aral Sea area, divided into bayas.
    There is AlmaAta.
    There is the virgin north of Kazakhstan, there is the Urals. There are no clans. There, Nazarbayev has a chance to arrange his outrage.
    But will Uigurs allow themselves to command a stranger?
    From this point of view, it is much more profitable for Nazarbayev to create his autonomy based on the Russian-speaking population, the population who escaped from the bais and entered it into Russia.
    This will give him a chance to ensure the future life of his children.
    East is a delicate matter.
  • Tersky
    Tersky 31 March 2014 07: 29
    +12
    Quote: Sergg
    A populist statement, in Russian - nonsense.

    Such populism in Ukraine turned into just the same delirium in the flesh. There is a song with the words - "Do you remember how it all began?" At the expense of familiar places and difficult removal, do not forget that Kazakhs are a nomadic people ...
    1. Igor39
      Igor39 31 March 2014 07: 47
      +10
      Yeah, southerners will go to the north, the article is written by those who are completely unfamiliar with the Kazakhs, the north and south of Kazakhstan are two big differences. on this lure.
      1. Canep
        Canep 31 March 2014 07: 54
        +8
        I agree with 200% and about nudity, my friend left, she is not married, she has no children, she fell into her historical homeland, she was settled in the village of Lgov, Kursk Region, a hole-hole compared to Ekibas, her salary is lower than the baseboard.
        1. 11111mail.ru
          11111mail.ru 31 March 2014 08: 28
          +3
          Quote: Canep
          about nudity also

          Where is it?
      2. Ptah
        31 March 2014 08: 02
        +3
        Quote: Igor39
        resettlement program offers to go to some sort

        There is no such settlement in Kazakhstan, if only in a parallel universe ... laughing
      3. 77bob1973
        77bob1973 31 March 2014 08: 21
        +4
        Southern Kazakhs are more prosperous and neglect the northern ones!
        1. waisson
          waisson 31 March 2014 09: 09
          +1
          someone is divided into clans-teips and Kazakhs have juses. The first Kazakh state was formed under Kasym Khan (reign of 1511-1523). Under Hak-Nazar (1538–1580), in the nomadic regions of various tribal groups, the Elder Juz (Semirechye), Middle Juz (Central Kazakhstan) and the Junior Juz (Western Kazakhstan) were formed; each jazz had a clan structure
          1. waisson
            waisson 31 March 2014 10: 48
            0
            some were warriors others hard workers but others you know
        2. Semurg
          Semurg 31 March 2014 12: 04
          +6
          Quote: 77bob1973
          Southern Kazakhs are more prosperous and neglect the northern ones!

          the southern ones are not wealthy but more adventurous due to tightness, they have to move more. A living example while you are driving south, here you have places to relax and eat and drink, and in the north it’s hard for those catering establishments that often appear to be held by southerners. Neglect there is no understanding of how you can live near the road and complain about the lack of work and earnings.
        3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 08: 40
        +2
        Quote: Igor39
        Yeah, southerners will go north, the article is written by those who are completely unfamiliar with the Kazakhs, the north and south of Kazakhstan are two big differences.

        they also said when they moved the capital, they drove like nice
        1. Rider
          Rider 31 March 2014 10: 33
          +6
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          they also said when they moved the capital, they drove like nice

          you make a BAAAL mistake.
          it’s one thing to go to the capital, to the city, to capital salaries.
          and another to break away from the acquired place, into a bending state farm, often without light, or even water.

          and consider the serious climate difference.
          not without reason in this program emphasis is placed on Chinese Kazakhs - oralmans.
          those people are not picky, they are comfortable living in a yurt, and electricity and water supply are just a nice addition.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 10: 37
            0
            Quote: Rider
            it’s one thing to go to the capital, to the city, to capital salaries

            for the bureaucrats, the move was also similar to death, and Auger did not want to. and the villages will drive the aul poor
            1. Rider
              Rider 31 March 2014 10: 50
              +2
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              for bureaucrats the move was also similar to death

              I'm sorry, but you are AGAIN mistaken, all the suburbs of the city are built up with PALACES (well, cottages) worth tens of millions of dollars, especially in the area of ​​the new city.
              please who lives in them?
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 11: 03
                +2
                Quote: Rider
                all suburbs of the city are built up with PALACES

                when the bureaucrats were driven away, tsilinograd was a provincial town with an ugly climate, mosquitoes and lack of amenities.
                bureaucrats lived in 2 cities, on the train Tsilinograd-Alm-Ata on Friday and Sunday it was impossible to buy tickets
                1. Rider
                  Rider 31 March 2014 11: 15
                  +2
                  Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                  when the bureaucrats were driven, tsilinograd was a provincial town

                  Well, I myself know it perfectly laughing

                  however, you see how everything has changed.
                  whole microdistricts of "elite" housing were built for officials.
                  and they themselves did not deprive themselves.

                  and it’s another matter to move to the steppe. to the village without communications.
                  that's why they focus on the oralmans (however, I already said)
                  and if they also get subsidies tossed all the same, Kazakhstan is not a poor state, there is money.
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 12: 52
                    +1
                    Quote: Rider
                    and it’s another matter to move to the steppe. to the village without communications.

                    Excuse me, but that in all Kazakh villages there is water sewage?
                    as far as I know there are problems with electricity
                    1. Rider
                      Rider 31 March 2014 14: 11
                      +4
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Excuse me, but that in all Kazakh villages there is water sewage?

                      yes you forget about the auls.
                      in the north, mainly former collective and state farms, similar to ordinary Russian villages and urban-type villages.
                      nobody has been living in yurts for a long time.
                      there almost everywhere there is light, water supply, sometimes even central heating (in the urban settlement)
                      another thing is that now much has changed since Soviet times.
                      many boiler houses are stopped, production shops (like MTS) are destroyed.
                      and the villages themselves are gradually becoming empty.
                      who reaches out to the city, and who permanently.

                      stop thinking cliche.
                    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 14: 52
                      0
                      Quote: Rider
                      yes you forget about the auls.
                      in the north, mainly former collective and state farms, similar to ordinary Russian villages and urban-type villages.
                      nobody has been living in yurts for a long time.
                      there almost everywhere there is light, water supply, sometimes even central heating (in the urban settlement)

                      I liked the first especially about central heating, in fact I lived in Alma-Ata for 40 years
                    3. Rider
                      Rider 31 March 2014 16: 50
                      0
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      the first one was especially about central heating,

                      Well, in the south, they are definitely not needed.
                      but in the north in the town, quite often met.
  • Semurg
    Semurg 31 March 2014 12: 34
    +3
    Quote: Igor39
    Yeah, southerners will go to the north, the article is written by those who are completely unfamiliar with the Kazakhs, the north and south of Kazakhstan are two big differences. on this lure.

    Where do you live ? Probably in Almaty? They will not go from Almaty, but they will go with SKO with pleasure, and especially with state support. In the summer I was in Borovoye there are now a lot of southerners appeared, so Shuchinsk jokingly called the locals Sheshensk if you talked with the southerners understand the joke.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Canep
    Canep 31 March 2014 07: 51
    +13
    Greetings Victor! hi
    In the south live mainly the Kazakhs of the elder zhuz. It has a mild climate, there is nature, mountains, rivers, relatives and a Chinese flea market. To the north, where mainly the Kazakhs of the middle zhuz live, they will not go for anything, if only to Astana. Relations between the senior and middle Zhuz are strained, to put it mildly, with a greater likelihood the Kazakhs will start an inter-jus war than a war with the Russians. The main reason for the transfer of the capital to Astana is the NAS from the middle zhuz, and does not enjoy special authority in the south.
    In general, the likelihood of the Ukrainian scenario in Kazakhstan is more than 50%, with the difference that the Kazakhs will hold the Maidan with a senior zhuz and it will all start with the departure of Nazarbayev.
    1. Tersky
      Tersky 31 March 2014 08: 21
      +7
      Quote: Canep
      and it all starts with the departure of Nazarbayev.

      Sergey, hi ! That's right, because behind Nazarbayev’s back I don’t see the receiver ...
      1. Canep
        Canep 31 March 2014 09: 10
        +3
        Quote: Tersky
        Nazarbayev, I do not see the receiver ...

        The presence of a receiver from the Nazarbayev family is a Maidan with a probability of 100%.
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 31 March 2014 11: 50
          +2
          Right now .... There will be Tasmagambetov after ANAS he is from the younger zhuz and a good manager !!!
          1. dustycat
            dustycat April 5 2014 22: 58
            0
            Quote: T80UM1
            Right now .... There will be Tasmagambetov after ANAS he is from the younger zhuz and a good manager !!!


            SHCHAZZZ
            He will not be allowed - he is from a junior jazz.
            Yes, and do not want the Maidan, neither the middle nor the older, nor the younger.
            It will be either as rootless as Nazarbayev, or purely technical, but from an older jazz.
    2. kocclissi
      kocclissi 31 March 2014 09: 46
      +3
      Yes, plus if they help, avid friends from across the ocean! But they will help you touch something! Therefore, now you need to take some steps to preventively say so ..
    3. polite people
      polite people 31 March 2014 10: 41
      +3
      Yes, Kazakh civil strife is tin. But I would say that the probability of her 30 to 70. Still, they have brains.
    4. T80UM1
      T80UM1 31 March 2014 11: 49
      +5
      Is it NAS from the middle?)))) Haha))) He was born out of fear in the Almaty region, by the way about the Atzons, the Almaty residents do not recognize her capital ... Astana, that is, Akmola, tobish Tselinograd, that is, a big village - just a geographical center ...
    5. Zymran
      Zymran 31 March 2014 14: 09
      +5
      Quote: Canep
      The main reason for the transfer of the capital to Astana is the NAS from the middle zhuz, and does not enjoy special authority in the south.


      What the heresy? Was it really hard to even look at the wiki? NAS from the Elder Zhuz. The main reason for the transfer of the capital to Astana is to weaken the centrifugal forces and prevent the separation of the North Kazakhstan region from Kazakhstan.
    6. Netrocker
      Netrocker April 6 2014 12: 23
      +1
      Lord, what insanity! Between the Middle and the Elder Zhuz there is and cannot be any "tension", it is only present in your sick fantasies! And by the way of the National Academy of Sciences he is from the Shaprashty tribe - this is the Elder Zhuz in general, not the Middle one! In short, the dreamer is already lying completely!
  • ed65b
    ed65b 31 March 2014 08: 07
    +8
    Quote: Tersky
    do not forget that the Kazakhs are nomadic people ...

    He was a nomad at the time of the king of peas. and now a normal sedentary people. yes, and to move people from the south to the north seems problematic, who will send himself into exile? But the promise with the Chinese is incomprehensible7 Kazakhstan decided to export several million Uighurs and Kazakhs from China to the south or north? If to the south then it is completely incomprehensible. to populate the border areas with Chinese speaking and already mentally alien supposedly Kazakhs is far from a stupid move, and give them the north, then why relocate your people there?
    1. Tersky
      Tersky 31 March 2014 08: 27
      +7
      Quote: ed65b
      Kazakhstan decided to export several million Uighurs and Kazakhs from China to the south or north?

      Rather, replace the south, resettle their north, and replace them with Chinese .. The question is, what would resettle the people need at least his consent. Needless to say, immigrants from China will only be in favor, but for their homegrown it will look like a hidden deportation. Edward, hi !
  • Setrac
    Setrac 31 March 2014 11: 40
    0
    Quote: Tersky
    At the expense of habitat and heavy lifting, do not forget that the Kazakhs are nomadic people ...

    Do not exaggerate, you can feed one hundred thousand people throughout the entire territory of Kazakhstan by nomadic farming, most Kazakhs lead a sedentary lifestyle.
  • Siberian19
    Siberian19 31 March 2014 12: 00
    -2
    here it should be, to be honest!
    1. Guard
      Guard 31 March 2014 20: 17
      +2
      Quote: Siberian19
      here it should be, to be honest!

      and you don’t have a map of the Jochi ulus? How will we divide the land - honestly or fairly?
      1. Siberian19
        Siberian19 31 March 2014 22: 50
        0
        Learn a respected story, and everything will be clear to you!
        1. Guard
          Guard 31 March 2014 22: 53
          +1
          Quote: Siberian19
          Learn a respected story, and everything will be clear to you!

          if you knew her, you’d talk. and so - boring. How long have Russian cemeteries appeared in Siberia and Altai, by the way? Did your Ermak come to the Siberian desert? He probably died of boredom and loneliness on the banks of the Siberian river. Or did someone already live in Siberia?
          1. dustycat
            dustycat April 5 2014 23: 21
            -1
            Quote: Guard
            . How long have Russian cemeteries appeared in Siberia and Altai, by the way?

            This is if from Ivan the Terrible movie twist.
            And if you rewind the coil away, where did the customs of the ancient Slavs come from?
            Where did the ancient Slavic religion system (the one that existed before dazhdbog and perun still) come from the southern Yakuts and are drilled unusual for the tribes surrounding them?
            And the so-called mogolotatars from China and Tibet were not the first time under Mamaia and not through empty lands went invasions of Russia.

            Everything is very ambiguous and not so simple.
            And the same notorious Altai princess was not very similar to the well-known Buryats, or to the Altaians, or the Kazakhs, or the Uighurs.
            Even DNA analysis asked more questions than answered something - the haplogroup R1a - the Aryans are Eastern Slavs. And this is in the burial of at least the fourth or third century BC.
            And how many such princes and princesses have not yet been found in permafrost?

            So not everything is so transparent with the development of Siberia.
            1. Netrocker
              Netrocker April 6 2014 12: 42
              +1
              Don't bullshit here! For your information, the Eastern Slavs have the halogen group L1, not R1a! R1a is a Turkic halogen group - over there, up to 80% of the same Kyrgyz people! The Slavs never lived in Siberia before Yermak, they reached the Volga only under Ivan 4, so that is enough Vedic nonsense! And no ancient Slavic culture of the Buryats, i.e. the Mongol does not exist - these are just your fantasies, and even more so for the Yakuts (Sakha), who are Türks ...

              And for your information, the Slavs do not relate to the Aryans in any way - you should watch Blevash videos less! :)
  • Sergg
    Sergg 31 March 2014 07: 55
    +1
    A populist statement, in Russian - nonsense.


    I clarify that populism here lies in the fact that the northern territory of Kazakhstan is essentially Russian land. Russia can harshly stop this process, it is extremely unprofitable for Kazakhstan to quarrel with its northern neighbor, and why not.
    This is well understood by the Kazakhs, but politicians - they are trying to undermine the existing balance of the Russian and Kazakh world.
    Here in northern Kazakhstan, Russians are even closer to their historical homeland than in Crimea.

    Let's not forget that now is not the 90s and the wheel of history is now turning Russia.
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 31 March 2014 09: 10
      +5
      But Nazarbayev did not comment on the annexation of Crimea to Russia.
    2. Vinnipukh
      Vinnipukh 31 March 2014 12: 54
      +3
      No need to arrange a provocation. This is not Russian land. If the government of Kazakhstan plans to carry out such a program, this is the internal affair of Kazakhstan. And Russia cannot harshly stop anything, Kazakhstan is not Ukraine, it is an accomplished sovereign state. It can be said with the same success that the Far East and Siberia are originally Chinese land, and if the Russian government wants to implement a program to resettle the population from the European part of Russia, China can harshly stop it.
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 31 March 2014 13: 08
        +4
        Quote: VinniPukh
        And Russia cannot harshly stop anything, Kazakhstan is not Ukraine, it is an accomplished sovereign state.

        Believe me, you better not check. Different weight categories in our countries.
        Quote: VinniPukh
        It can be said with the same success that the Far East and Siberia are originally Chinese land, and if the Russian government wants to implement a program to resettle the population from the European part of Russia, China can harshly stop it.

        The Han people have never lived on the territory of Russia, moreover, the Han people (Khans?) Until the 19th century did not live north of the Great Wall of China. On the contrary, Russia can lay claim to Manchuria.
        1. dustycat
          dustycat April 5 2014 23: 31
          -1
          Quote: Setrac
          The Han people have never lived on the territory of Russia, moreover, the Han people (Khans?) Until the 19th century did not live north of the Great Wall of China. On the contrary, Russia can lay claim to Manchuria.


          And can you recall the Altai princess - a purebred Aryan or eastern Slavic?
          So the territorial issue is a very interesting question.
      2. Siberian19
        Siberian19 31 March 2014 22: 53
        -1
        Ukraine by the way has shown its viability !!!
    3. Guard
      Guard 31 March 2014 20: 27
      +5
      Quote: Sergg
      I clarify that populism here lies in the fact that the northern territory of Kazakhstan is essentially Russian land.

      With what fright? The fact that in the 18-19 centuries the Russian army poked military bases between the Kazakh auls on the Kazakh land does not mean that this is "the primordially Russian land." Until the end of the 19th century, there was no peaceful civilian Russian population in Kazakhstan at all. Exclusively military personnel and officials.
      Take the census of the population of the northern and eastern Kazakhstani regions for the 19th century and you will see that the Russians there are with a gulkin nose compared to the indigenous Kazakhs. Russians became the majority in these areas only under Soviet rule. The main factors are a twofold decrease in Kazakhs after the famine of the 30s, deportation of "elements" to Kazakhstan, evacuation during the war years, and mass migration of the Slavic population to the Kazakh SSR to Komsomol construction sites and virgin lands.
      Quote: Sergg
      Russia can harshly stop this process

      Gyyyyy)))) Sounds like "Nicaragua can rigidly stop the migration of local residents from the regional centers of the Omsk region to the regional center."
  • Evgen_Vasilich
    Evgen_Vasilich 31 March 2014 09: 15
    +7
    when I lived in Omsk, it was often heard: Omsk region is originally Kazakh land, Russians came in large numbers, bring down to Russia, this is our land !!!
    1. Guard
      Guard 31 March 2014 20: 31
      +4
      Quote: Evgen_Vasilich
      Omsk region - native Kazakh land

      Kazakhs have always lived there. And when did the Russians appear there? In the days of Kievan Rus?
      I will tell you a terrible secret. Tyumen was once called Chingi-Tura and was the FIRST capital of the Uzbek Khanate. And now I'm completely confused - then the Kazakhs were called Uzbeks, and the current Uzbeks were called Sarts))))
      1. dustycat
        dustycat April 5 2014 23: 36
        -1
        Quote: Guard
        Kazakhs have always lived there. And when did the Russians appear there?

        Um.
        Well, in the Altai, the Slavs lived at least in the fourth century already.
        And the peace-loving Tibetans - for some reason very similar to the Kazakhs - also remember campaigns to conquer the northern lands in the antediluvian times.
        So who settled there before is a very interesting question.
        So well, to the devil this rotten topic.
        1. Netrocker
          Netrocker April 6 2014 12: 55
          +2
          in Altai, the Slavs never lived at all! Altai for your information is the ancestral home of all Turkic peoples! So leave your nonsense for the victims of Fursenko’s reforms! laughing
  • atarix
    atarix 31 March 2014 09: 26
    +3
    the Chinese will come with pleasure.
    this is a bet, besides, China
  • ArhipenkoAndrey
    ArhipenkoAndrey 31 March 2014 09: 48
    +1
    Yes, you know, they can dream very quickly, they will promise the property of Russians, Germans, Belarusians living in Kazakhstan, and the Kazakh tearing into bosses will take place already in the 90s, only then no one defended the Russians.
  • polite people
    polite people 31 March 2014 10: 39
    +4
    He himself lived in Kaskelen. Paradise lands. And then he was in the north. No one will go of their own free will.
    1. Walking
      Walking 31 March 2014 11: 19
      +10
      Who is launching such information here? It is not clear where one grandmother, taken by type, said? Who identified these people as experts? It seems to me such stuffing provocations to escalate mistrust of interethnic relations and fool Internet-dependent citizens. Do not trust it is not clear to whom.
      1. Natrix
        Natrix April 6 2014 17: 11
        0
        Agree. But by and large the article itself is already a provocation. No Americans are needed here - just more articles like that.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 31 March 2014 11: 28
    +1
    Quote: Sergg
    A populist statement, in Russian - nonsense.
    It is extremely difficult for people to leave their "familiar places", and what is the point of leaving the favorable south to the north of the same country, where it is not yet known where the wheel of history will turn.

    First, let this Svetlana Dzhalmagambetova go to live in Taimyr, and then sing songs about the resettlement of people from south to north.
  • Max_Bauder
    Max_Bauder 31 March 2014 17: 05
    +9
    The author is a natural co. and Kazakhophobe!

    If you do not distinguish a Kazakh from an Uzbek or a Tajik, then do not write articles on topics of interethnic relations at all.

    Our country is the most peaceful in the region thanks to the mentality of our people. Our first peacefully joined Russia, and not as Khiva, Bukhara and Kokand, which had to be conquered. When Soviet power came, we Kazakhs also supported the Russian peasants, did not lead the Basmach movement as Turkmens and Uzbeks defending Sharia life, and 10 wives. Amangeldy Imanov, who led the uprising in 1916, stood up for the soviets, and did not wage separatist wars, for he was against tsarism and not Russian.

    Almaty was founded as the city of Faithful precisely because it was faithful. It was in Almaty that the famous 316 Panfilov divisions were formed, which showed heroic qualities in the defense of Moscow, on the Volokolamsk highway. Dubosekovo. It was the Kazakhs, after the Ukrainians and Russians, who so vehemently defended the Union during the Second World War.

    When Stalin deported Chechens, Koreans and other suspicious, it was the Kazakhs who began to help them so that they would not die, sharing cattle and food, when they themselves had little. I doubt that anyone else can do this if only we were sent to them.

    Now, regarding the territory, look at maps of the Middle Ages as they have changed to this day and all questions will disappear. We can say the last heirs of the Golden Horde, then the Akorda, and then the Kazakh Khanate, the rest - the Crimean, Siberian, Kazan and others lost their sovereignty long before our accession.

    And finally, don't write inflammatory articles anymore. God forbid if war broke out with you, I would not punish civilians, but instigators like you, who, as fascists in Ukraine now, are inciting ordinary Ukrainians to kill Russians, hiding behind them, right in the military enlistment office.
    1. Natrix
      Natrix April 6 2014 17: 20
      0
      Gold words. hi
  • Floock
    Floock 31 March 2014 07: 19
    +7
    The key phrase of the article - "According to the concluded agreement, Kazakhstan will provide China withequal to rent and use of land, well, China will take care of all the issues related to financing and providing the necessary equipment. "
    Everything is as usual, Kazakhstan again leases land to China, now under a new murky pretext.
    1. Ptah
      31 March 2014 08: 05
      +4
      Quote: Floock
      Kazakhstan leases land to China again

      It is not the Kazakh countries that "give", but China takes.
      The problem of a shortage of food on the ball, otherwise land suitable for agriculture, is becoming more acute. Kitais solve it in the most "humane" and familiar way.
      In Russian, "they take a thorn" ...
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 31 March 2014 11: 47
        +2
        Quote: Ptah
        The problem of shortage of food on the ball, otherwise land suitable for agriculture, is becoming more acute.

        There is no problem of food shortages; there is a problem of lack of CHEAP food. ANY land is suitable for agriculture, it only requires the investment of a different amount of funds.
        1. Ptah
          31 March 2014 12: 23
          +1
          Greetings, Sergey!
          There are PROBLEMS of RIGHT, GOOD FOOD, and from here the problem for creating conditions also follows.
          Quote: Setrac
          ANY land is suitable for agriculture, it only requires the investment of a different amount of funds.

          Of course. But something is the location of zones with stable (not extreme) conditions inversely related to areas with population growth.
          Hence the desire for relocation. And the possession of such zones.
          1. Setrac
            Setrac 31 March 2014 12: 38
            +3
            Quote: Ptah
            Of course. But something is the location of zones with stable (not extreme) conditions inversely related to areas with population growth.

            Population growth correlates with climatic conditions, but food can be grown in less favorable conditions.
            1. Ptah
              31 March 2014 20: 09
              0
              Quote: Setrac
              Population growth correlates with climatic conditions,

              Not at all, Sergey ... The areas of confident agriculture in Canada, Europe (especially Russia), Australia are practically empty, population growth due to migration.
              But, at the same time, countries with natural growth are located almost in unsuitable climatic conditions. Afghanistan, African countries, to a lesser extent, middle China, etc.
              Quote: Setrac
              food can be grown in less favorable conditions.

              And who is arguing. For example, greenhouses in the Arctic or forced irrigation in the Sahara. But the price will increase tenfold, which is cheaper to buy than to grow.
              Or, alternatively, switch to GAMnO. And this is not food. These, in the opinion of biologists, are "biological SUBSTANCES, similar in appearance to habitual cultures", but having nothing to do with the USE for the organism. But it is affordable (?) At a price for the growing human population.
              I remember a couple of years ago, the World Food Organization (?) Was born a circular about the need to consider the use of food, attention, INSECT. belay
              This is for RUSSIA ... With its arable land. By the way, over the past 20 years, more than 40 milins (!!!) hectares suitable for agricultural production have been taken out of circulation ... fellow
              1. Guard
                Guard 31 March 2014 23: 01
                +8
                clever people gathered ... they themselves invented a horror story, they themselves discuss it.
                No one has given land to China and is not going to give it. No one in Kazakhstan was going to and is not going to invite either the Chinese or promote the mass migration of Xinjiang Kazakhs to Kazakhstan. The Kazakhs live there on their own land (two regions of the Xinjiang Autonomous Republic of China - the lands historically inhabited by the Kazakhs, except for them no one has ever lived in a new history and even now does not live - neither the Chinese, nor the Uighurs).
                Some idiot sucked a nonexistent sensation out of his finger, the others picked it up as an excuse to shout "Kazakhs are traitors" and "Kazakhs are unreasonable." Do not forget to "fatherly" clap on the shoulder. Wipe off the snot. Let America watch Alaska, and Russia watch the Far East. Unlike Russia, Kazakhs do not allow Chinese people to visit them. You cannot imagine how many spikes are put in the wheels of a Han who wants to move to KZ. You can be mocking and continue to write about the "Chinese occupation" and "the need to save Kazakhstan", but, by God, it would be better to close the hole in your Far Eastern fence.
                1. Ptah
                  31 March 2014 23: 11
                  -5
                  Quote: Guard
                  clever people gathered ... they themselves invented a horror story, they themselves discuss it.

                  Exactly ... And the wise men both thought up and discussed, but I don’t remember others in my sandbox to be invited. hi
                  Yes, and Setrak and I are grinding the food problem on a global scale ... fellow laughing
                  Therefore / with due respect and inherent courtesy / -

                  1. Refugee from Kazakhstan
                    Refugee from Kazakhstan April 1 2014 15: 54
                    0
                    After such an article and comments it is disgusting for me to live side by side with the Russians, do not be offended! However, the author and forum users are a vile folk! And such fighters for truth are already disgusting. If in China there are approximately 1250000 ethnic Kazakhs, and there are enough ethnic Uigurs! How did they get there? We will ask the Russians who Goloshchekin is and why 2000000 Kazakhs became extinct in 1931-32.
                  2. Natrix
                    Natrix April 6 2014 17: 29
                    +1
                    And where did you get the idea that this is your sandbox. If you can’t answer in essence, then you shouldn’t be rude.
                2. Setrac
                  Setrac April 1 2014 14: 43
                  0
                  Quote: Guard
                  Unlike Russia, Kazakhs do not let the Chinese into their country.

                  Well, it was impossible to do without attacks on Russia, Russophobia manifests itself in you like that, then you wonder why you are so sharply answered.
                  Quote: Guard
                  You can’t imagine how many sticks are put in the wheels of a Han, who wants to move to the KZ.

                  Apparently less than the Russian, whose ancestors lived here for several centuries.
                  Quote: Guard
                  You can be mischievous and continue to write about the "Chinese occupation" and "the need to save Kazakhstan", but, by God, it would be better to close the hole in your Far Eastern fence.

                  There are no holes.
                  Quote: Guard
                  Let America follow Alaska, and Russia follow the Far East.

                  The United States, and even more so Russia, has already proved its ability to defend its lands, unlike such new countries as Ukraine, the Baltic countries, the states of the Caucasus and Transcaucasia, the countries of Central Asia, including Kazakhstan.
                3. Max_Bauder
                  Max_Bauder April 4 2014 09: 50
                  +3
                  Quote: Guard
                  the clever people gathered ... they themselves came up with a horror story, they themselves discuss it. No one has given land to China and is not going to give it. No one in Kazakhstan was going and is not going to invite either the Chinese or facilitate the mass migration of Xinjiang Kazakhs to Kazakhstan. Kazakhs live there on their own land (two regions of the XUAR of the PRC are lands historically inhabited by Kazakhs, except for them no one has ever lived there in modern history, and even now does not live - neither the Chinese, nor the Uighurs). Some idiot sucked a nonexistent sensation out of his finger, the others picked it up as an excuse to shout "Kazakhs are traitors" and "Kazakhs are unreasonable." Do not forget to "fatherly" clap on the shoulder. Wipe off the snot. Let America watch Alaska, and Russia watch the Far East. Unlike Russia, Kazakhs do not allow Chinese people to visit them. You cannot imagine how many spikes are put in the wheels of a Han who wants to move to KZ. You can be mocking and continue to write about the "Chinese occupation" and "the need to save Kazakhstan", but, by God, it would be better to close the hole in your Far Eastern fence.


                  Well said brother, just as I think of the article.
                  1. Natrix
                    Natrix April 6 2014 17: 30
                    +1
                    Join good
              2. Setrac
                Setrac April 1 2014 14: 46
                0
                Quote: Ptah
                Not at all, Sergey ... The areas of confident agriculture in Canada, Europe (especially Russia), Australia are practically empty, population growth due to migration.

                Well, I’ve talked about climate, in Canada and Russia the climate is not ice, or rather, quite the contrary - ICE, but only in the literal sense of the word. And the most favorable climate on the planet is in China and India.
  • VNP1958PVN
    VNP1958PVN 31 March 2014 07: 19
    +8
    Kazakhs do not need to exacerbate nationalism! And then it turns out that the capital is Astana, in the Semipalatinsk region!
    1. askort154
      askort154 31 March 2014 07: 41
      +7
      VNP1958PVN ..... Kazakhs do not need to exacerbate nationalism! And then it turns out that the capital is Astana, in the Semipalatinsk region!

      Therefore, Kazakhstan "abstained" from voting in the UN on Crimea.
      1. Refugee from Kazakhstan
        Refugee from Kazakhstan April 1 2014 16: 23
        +2
        Your wife is on the toilet! What have women and Kazakhs changed for you? What near Omsk and Orenburg Pershing wanted!
    2. f.lourens
      f.lourens 31 March 2014 07: 55
      +4
      Correct ... There is no Semipalatinsk region. There is East Kazakhstan with the capital in Ustkamenogorsk. Semey has long been a non-regional city. hi
    3. Humpty
      Humpty 31 March 2014 08: 00
      +3
      Quote: VNP1958PVN
      Kazakhs do not need to exacerbate nationalism! And then it turns out that the capital is Astana, in the Semipalatinsk region!


      Semipalatinsk (Semey according to the modern version) is located on the Irtysh River thirty kilometers from the Altai Territory ((
  • Sars
    Sars 31 March 2014 07: 22
    -2
    Moscow was friends with Nazarbayev!
    The Kazakh allies of Russia are no better than Bendera.
    Two million Russians have already left Kazakh spruce, what are we waiting for when everyone leaves?
    1. mak210
      mak210 31 March 2014 08: 22
      +12
      Left, that's right. Only you were in Northern Kazakhstan? Sun-steppe, salt marshes, in summer plus 40, minus in winter. And wind, wind, wind. There is neither a tree nor a blade of grass on the streets. Local cottages look exactly the same, despite the titanic efforts to ennoble the land. A large percentage of the population are former chemists or exiles from Stalin's time.

      You have to be a strong patriot to stay there. In addition, a large percentage of Russians there are not indigenous, but came ("come in large numbers") in the virgin years for romance or a long ruble ("northern" allowances).

      Of course, it’s not very pleasant when Kazakhs are gradually appointed to all leading posts, moreover, in those cities in which they are a clear minority. We must take an example from the Crimean Tatars: cultural autonomy,% representation in government, Russian - the state language. Only our bosses are not up to them.
      1. Gecko
        Gecko 31 March 2014 11: 59
        +2
        If in Tatarstan the Tatars are a little more than 50% and occupy leading positions more than 90% ...
    2. Natrix
      Natrix April 6 2014 17: 34
      +1
      And you really do not want the Russians to leave Kazakhstan! So left in particular like you.
  • afdjhbn67
    afdjhbn67 31 March 2014 07: 23
    +4
    such nonsense certainly wanders in the minds, but what is worse than the Uzbeks and Uighurs from China and they are backed or Russian? China rummages Kazakhstan at the same time as Russia turns away ..
    1. tokin1959
      tokin1959 31 March 2014 07: 31
      +3
      Yes, China will devour them, but hatred of the Russians overpowers.
      1. sub307
        sub307 31 March 2014 08: 05
        +5
        China in general is capable of "devouring" anyone by only one demographic factor, and now multiply this factor by the steadily increasing military power of China, and think in which direction the vector of application of the considered force will be directed, presumably ....
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Refugee from Kazakhstan
        Refugee from Kazakhstan April 1 2014 16: 14
        +2
        So that I do not see what the Americans would eat Singapore! Otherwise, some Russians deserve it!
    2. Humpty
      Humpty 31 March 2014 07: 51
      +2
      Quote: afdjhbn67
      such nonsense certainly wanders in the minds, but what is worse than the Uzbeks and Uighurs from China and they are backed or Russian? China rummages Kazakhstan at the same time as Russia turns away ..


      There is a slight clarification, there are almost no Uzbeks in China, and there is no sense in resettling the Uyghurs, they are not doing anything useful outside of China.
  • igorra
    igorra 31 March 2014 07: 24
    +4
    Quote: Sergg
    A populist statement, in Russian - nonsense.
    It is extremely difficult for people to leave their "familiar places", and what is the point of leaving the favorable south to the north of the same country, where it is not yet known where the wheel of history will turn.

    I agree, it is one thing to say, another to find people who agree for ten sheep to go nowhere. Well, eat these sheep, then what, where is the work?
    This is not China, the party ordered, the people took the visor and forward with songs.
  • siberalt
    siberalt 31 March 2014 07: 26
    +6
    There is a problem of assimilation. In Kazakhstan, the concept that hybrids turn out to be beautiful has long taken root. But here it is important not to miss the moment as with Ukraine. Our politicians should think about this. Although the movement from south to north in droves is doubtful. Besides the climate there are zhuzes. They do not get along very well.
    1. Canep
      Canep 31 March 2014 07: 41
      +3
      Quote: siberalt
      They do not get along very well.

      That is to say the least. Rather, a war will begin between the Zhuzes (the south is the eldest, against the north-west is the middle and the youngest) than between the Kazakhs and Russians.
      1. T80UM1
        T80UM1 31 March 2014 11: 51
        +4
        Rave! there will be no war with anyone other than chinas or sov!
  • Scandinavian
    Scandinavian 31 March 2014 07: 28
    +4
    Nazika probably went to China immediately after the events in Crimea in order to agree on the transfer of land for rent to the Chinese and the investment of the Katai dough in the North of Kazakhstan ... here it is multi-vector ...
  • w2000
    w2000 31 March 2014 07: 30
    +9
    We also need to organize the resettlement of 5-7 million from Moskvabad suffocating from overpopulation to the dying Far East, otherwise only the Chinese will soon remain in the Far East.
  • Blackmokona
    Blackmokona 31 March 2014 07: 31
    +3
    Every year the Russians in Kazakhstan became less and less quantitatively, and in%.
    And now they are also forcingly destroying the compact living areas of the Russians.
    And these are our closest allies sad
    1. Vinnipukh
      Vinnipukh 31 March 2014 12: 55
      +7
      In more detail, who destroys how, when?
  • tronin.maxim
    tronin.maxim 31 March 2014 07: 33
    0
    According to the agreement, Kazakhstan will give China the right to lease and use land, and China will take on all issues related to financing and providing the necessary equipment. WHAT NON FANCY! They poorly know China. request
  • bomg.77
    bomg.77 31 March 2014 07: 35
    +4
    It will be Nazarbayev’s big mistake if he brings this plan to life. Squeezing out from established and settled places is tantamount to stealing. Nazarbayev should not do this.
    1. their
      their 31 March 2014 08: 02
      +1
      He was not the first time, such squeezing was massive in the 90s, and now it is full of cases.
      1. bomg.77
        bomg.77 31 March 2014 08: 50
        0
        Quote: sus
        He was not the first time, such extrusion was also massive in 90x
        In 90 x, not only Kazakhstan suffered from this ... there was confusion and confusion.
        Quote: sus
        , and now it’s full of cases
        Nazarbayev should, like a politician with a good political sense, toughly stop this.
        PS It's time to end with fascism in the post-Soviet space and not only in Kazakhstan.
        1. their
          their 31 March 2014 08: 55
          -3
          Kazakh nat. Shiz personally affected me and my family at 90 and my friends, when we threw everything and sold for a penny to leave, the invaders are real Russians for us from the KZ.
          1. Serg65
            Serg65 31 March 2014 09: 02
            +6
            Quote: sus
            Kazakh nat. Shiz personally affected me and my family at 90 and my friends, when we threw everything and sold for a penny to leave, the invaders are real Russians for us from the KZ.


            Is it possible to find out specifically from which settlement of Kazakhstan did you have to escape? And what is the reason for your flight?
            1. their
              their 31 March 2014 09: 07
              -1
              East Kazakhstan, Ust-Kamenogorsk, illegally converted by occupants to Oskemen

              Why are you asking me these questions? Do you think I'm fooling you?
              1. their
                their 31 March 2014 09: 27
                +2
                What are the cons? Really don't like it? The invaders did not have the right to rename the original Russian names of cities and streets, to remove historical monuments. This all comes back to you someday.
                1. Ram chandra
                  Ram chandra 15 July 2014 13: 29
                  +1
                  O - Kazakhs are already occupiers in Kazakh lands. Arrived. If you want tomorrow, take away the floor of Kazakhstan calling us invaders. It's funny
              2. Serg65
                Serg65 31 March 2014 09: 34
                +8
                According to the census on January 1 2010. In Ust-Kamenogorsk, Russians are 201 842 people, Kazakhs are 82 539 people. For the period of the collapse of the USSR, U-Kamenogorsk was the capital of the East Kazakhstan region! What occupation are you talking about? So what is the true reason for your departure from Kazakhstan?
                1. their
                  their 31 March 2014 10: 19
                  -2
                  There are many reasons: Kazakhs killed my father’s friends, my father was taken away from the business threatening to kill him, they also wanted to take the apartment, my mother was fired from work putting a Kazakh woman without education, Kazakhs beat me several times in the street.

                  And now you answer the question: When you live in Kyrgyzstan, how do you know about how we lived?

                  In the 90s Russians in Ust-Kamenogorsk it was 75-80%, what you wrote clearly shows that we lived in the occupation, when the minority dictates and imposes its rules on the majority.
                  1. Serg65
                    Serg65 31 March 2014 10: 58
                    +10
                    Dear sus, this is not the same in Russia Moscow and the Urals, but life in Central Asia and Kazakhstan +, - is the same. At the beginning of the 90, they were killed for no reason in all the expanses of the former USSR, and business was selected. My brother opened a store in Kemerovo, six months later the brothers took the store, he barely took his feet. I have partners in Ust-Kamenogorsk, they are engaged in business, of course, not without difficulties, but they live and do not complain.
                  2. Setrac
                    Setrac 31 March 2014 11: 55
                    +4
                    Quote: sus
                    There are many reasons: Kazakhs killed my father’s friends, my father was taken away from the business threatening to kill him, they also wanted to take the apartment, my mother was fired from work putting a Kazakh woman without education, Kazakhs beat me several times in the street.

                    The same thing happened in Russia, only it was not Kazakhs who did it, crime, it is international.
                  3. Vinnipukh
                    Vinnipukh 31 March 2014 12: 57
                    +4
                    Oh, let's go. Another provocateur appeared, whom the Kazakhs offended. There are a lot of such people in Ukrainian forums now, they just write how Russian Ukrainians are offended.
                  4. Yerlan
                    Yerlan 31 March 2014 13: 56
                    +10
                    You at least embellish, if I may say so. As a resident of Ust-Kamenogorsk, who was born, raised and live in this city, I declare to you - no one changed the name of the city. Another thing is that Oskemen speak Kazakh. However, in official documents Ust-Kamenogorsk is always written in Russian.
                    As for the 90s, EVERYONE suffered from banditry, regardless of the nation!
                    Regarding survived and expelled:
                    Only Chechens were really kicked out, and even after the murder of 4 Kazakh students, Chechens. They were indeed evicted in 2 days, but the police did not allow the massacre and riots, they just took the settlement into the ring and note that they protected the Chechens from lynching by the Kazakhs. No one else survived.
                    About "only Kazakhs are in positions everywhere"
                    Of those whom I remember in the 90s and 00s: the akim (town governor) of the city is Vera Sukhorukova 1999-2003, the akim of the region is Vitaliy Mette 1997-2003, Victor Khrapunov 2004-2007.
                    About "renamed everything"
                    Yes, there are excesses, but in Ust-Kamenogorsk the monument of Ushanov, with the same area, has been preserved; Kirov Park; Slavsky Embankment; Gagarin Boulevard; Embankment named after Alexander Protozanov; st. Voroshilov, Manor, P. Lumumba, Permitin, Bazhev, Kirov. Ordzhonikidze, etc. And these are the central streets of the city.
                    And from myself, I have Russian friends, no less than Kazakhs. And they always fought shoulder to shoulder, and we were not worried about what nationality our opponent was.
                2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 10: 22
                  -5
                  Quote: Serg65
                  Russian-201 842 people, Kazakhs-82 539 people

                  what did you mean by that?
                  1. Serg65
                    Serg65 31 March 2014 11: 00
                    +8
                    Mr. Vasilenko, 201 842-m Russians it is a sin to say that they are infringed on 82 539 Kazakhs!
                    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 11: 04
                      0
                      the problem is not in quantity, but in organization
                      1. Rinat 1
                        Rinat 1 April 3 2014 12: 55
                        +1
                        If you, take offense only at yourself
                      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir April 3 2014 17: 40
                        0
                        and what did you mean by that?
                  2. Refugee from Kazakhstan
                    Refugee from Kazakhstan April 1 2014 15: 57
                    +1
                    Vasilenko Natsik finished useless to explain something to him, his wife and Kazakh cheated on him in Kazakhstan!
                    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir April 1 2014 20: 41
                      -1
                      couldn’t say anything smarter? !!
        2. bomg.77
          bomg.77 31 March 2014 11: 52
          +1
          My acquaintances also left Baku ... they sold everything for a penny and into the unknown, a lot of things were told, but it is not worth remembering the past. With the collapse of the USSR, everyone grabbed grief.
  • Humpty
    Humpty 31 March 2014 07: 38
    +4
    Shcha will begin a hubbub of statements about the "legal article." The policy of apartheid of the 90s continues in more hidden forms.
    Kazakhstan forges its future, in isolation from historical and geographical realities. In this case, the future of Kazakhstan is great as a flight to distant planets without a clue about the structure of the solar system.
    1. bomg.77
      bomg.77 31 March 2014 08: 16
      +1
      Quote: Humpty
      Kazakhstan forges its future, in isolation from historical and geographical realities
      Alexander hi remember a month ago I laid out a world map, what will it look like in 2038 a year? I have a feeling that it really will be so if our neighbors and partners make such mistakes ....))
      1. Humpty
        Humpty 31 March 2014 08: 35
        +1
        Aleksey smiled, but there will be a little less red (because "what for a goat button accordion") than on this card, and there will be more yellow. lol
        1. bomg.77
          bomg.77 31 March 2014 08: 53
          +1
          Quote: Humpty
          Aleksey smiled, but there will be a little less red (because "what for a goat button accordion") than on this card, and there will be more yellow. lol
          We are not greedy, let it be a little more yellow))
          1. Rider
            Rider 31 March 2014 10: 43
            -3
            Quote: bomg.77
            We are not greedy, let it be a little more yellow))

            well then paint over the earth north of china with yellow
            1. bomg.77
              bomg.77 31 March 2014 11: 36
              0
              Quote: Rider
              well then paint over the earth north of china with yellow
              According to experts, China will expand south and southwest
              P / S The card is not mine; I have no moral right to correct it.
              1. Rider
                Rider 31 March 2014 11: 50
                +1
                Quote: bomg.77
                According to experts, China will expand south and southwest

                according to many predictors, the 300 million army will pass through Afghanistan, Pakistan and further west to the Sr Sea. will take Bl east, sowing Africa and south Europe.

                who will be these new gogs and magogs that will begin the midday battle of good and evil in the valley of Megido?
                1. bomg.77
                  bomg.77 31 March 2014 12: 04
                  0
                  Quote: Rider
                  who will these new gogs and magogs be,
                  Alexander do you think that the Chinese are the very Gog and Magog?
                  Quote: Rider
                  will pass through Afghanistan, Pakistan and further west to the Sr Sea. will take Bl east, sowing Africa and south Europe.
                  Maybe in 70-100 years
                  1. Ptah
                    31 March 2014 13: 58
                    +1
                    Quote: bomg.77
                    new gogs and magogs

                    I don’t know their names, and they don’t have a decisive role. But these comrades are certainly Georgians with Dagestan. laughing laughing
                2. atalef
                  atalef 31 March 2014 12: 58
                  +1
                  Quote: Rider
                  who will be these new gogs and magogs that will begin the midday battle of good and evil in the valley of Megido?

                  An hour ago I drove past Megido, I did not see either Gogov or Magogov there wassat
                  1. Rider
                    Rider 31 March 2014 13: 23
                    0
                    Quote: atalef
                    I drove past Megido an hour ago

                    each vegetable has its own time
        2. Setrac
          Setrac 31 March 2014 11: 57
          0
          Quote: Humpty
          Aleksey smiled, but there will be a little less red (because "what for a goat button accordion") than on this card, and there will be more yellow.

          How's Lube?
          “Give back to Manchuria.”

          We will return China to the historical borders - the Great Wall of China.
          1. Semurg
            Semurg 31 March 2014 12: 09
            0
            Quote: Setrac
            Quote: Humpty
            Aleksey smiled, but there will be a little less red (because "what for a goat button accordion") than on this card, and there will be more yellow.

            How's Lube?
            “Give back to Manchuria.”

            We will return China to the historical borders - the Great Wall of China.

            Give back Manchuria. Sounds ambiguous laughing
            1. Setrac
              Setrac 31 March 2014 12: 40
              +1
              Quote: Semurg
              Sounds ambiguous

              You can't erase a word from a song laughing
          2. The comment was deleted.
      2. Uncle lee
        Uncle lee 31 March 2014 09: 19
        +11
        My question is - Why did Sakhalin and the Kuril Islands surrender to Japan? I disagree !
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 31 March 2014 09: 22
          +1
          Quote: Uncle Lee
          My question is - Why did Sakhalin and the Kuril Islands surrender to Japan?

          Precisely, not an order.
          Quote: bomg.77
          bomg.77

          Lech, the card is red-URGENT!
          1. bomg.77
            bomg.77 31 March 2014 11: 43
            +2
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            Lech, the card is red-URGENT!
            Hi Sash hi I can’t interrogate, copyrights,)) Yes, and Putin’s brush, and there he is already, I’m not his adviser winked
        2. bomg.77
          bomg.77 31 March 2014 11: 38
          0
          Quote: Uncle Lee
          My question is - Why did Sakhalin and the Kuril Islands surrender to Japan? I disagree !
          The most interesting thing there is the Crimea near England.
  • sv68
    sv68 31 March 2014 07: 39
    0
    the biggest mistake is to give China land for lease. whether you turn back is a difficult question. And as for the Russians in Kazakhstan, for now, there are reasons to grab a weapon with shouts, kill-no
    1. tokin1959
      tokin1959 31 March 2014 07: 50
      +1
      "for now, there are reasons to grab hold of weapons with shouts, kill, no" - that's it - for now.
      But you have to wait and bring to this?
      in Ukraine they shout - they’re scribbling for knives, and not only shouting, but they are fraternal people with brainwashed.
    2. atalef
      atalef 31 March 2014 13: 00
      +2
      Quote: sv68
      the biggest mistake is to give China land for rent. whether you turn it back is a difficult question.

      In general, in Crimea, the land was leased to the Chinese and something tells me that no one will cancel this agreement
  • mamont5
    mamont5 31 March 2014 07: 40
    +2
    Kazakhstan naturally pursues its own policy. And the survival of the Russians they had from the very beginning of their independence. We had a woman who, together with her family, at the beginning of the 90's, fled from there, having actually sold for nothing or abandoned all her property.
  • Astana_KZ
    Astana_KZ 31 March 2014 07: 41
    +13
    Some kind of provocative article .... "The Kazakhs have other methods - discrimination and squeezing out" in general, bullshit, the Russians, like the Kazakhs, have all rights, no one infringes on anyone - I personally have half of my friends Russian (myself from Astana) and no division on the nation.
    1. Ptah
      31 March 2014 07: 59
      -11%
      Quote: mamont5
      We had a woman who, together with her family, fled from there in the early 90s, having actually sold for nothing or abandoned all her property.

      Quote: Astana_KZ
      I personally have half of my Russian friends (myself from Astana) and no division into nations.

      I have more reason to believe the "mammoth" than you. And also one person with whom I had a chance to work together for some time, 10-11 years ago.
      He is a Kazakh, a Tatar wife, a Muslim family, engineers from Karaganda, worked in mines and were considered very wealthy people. When this mess began, they abandoned everything and went to their wife's homeland (Tatarstan), the money, minus the relocation and documents, was only enough to buy an old house with "amenities" on the edge of the garden. Otherwise, he says, it was simply impossible to survive in KZ, the teenage daughters tried for two years not to go out - they were afraid.
      Then I met him a year later. Says - "The fool was that he did not" drop anchor "immediately after studying in Russia. So much time wasted down the drain, but how to calculate the hassle ..."

      Kazakhs, like everyone in the east, are historically corrupt. Some more, some less.
      1. Sma11
        Sma11 31 March 2014 09: 27
        -3
        Kazakhs, like everyone in the east, are historically corrupt. Who is more, who is less

        The statement is too harsh. It will immediately raise a wave of cheers-patriotism and, as a result, minus one. But true. Kazakhs are good performers, but as leaders, alas. This is, in principle, observed in all republics and states where community-clan ties are strong (zhuzes, teips, clans, etc.). Any boss pulls all relatives and relatives to himself, to the detriment of development.
        1. Day 11
          Day 11 31 March 2014 09: 51
          +4
          To tell you the truth, this is also practiced by the Russians. If you weren’t the boss, would you really have taken your own blood?
          1. Sma11
            Sma11 31 March 2014 10: 10
            +2
            This is practiced by dimwitted bosses who are afraid for their place "as if someone did not sit up." And I was the boss and if the "blood" is stupid, then he tries not to me. Dealing with protectionism is always sideways. Because they think you owe them.
      2. foxxi
        foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 24
        +7
        Yes, all this is nonsense ... just at that time all enterprises were closed and everyone who worked were left without work, banditry flourished as a "natural" factor at that time, there was no nationalist condition under this, so they broke into Russia ... so the majority left ... and then they started wailing about the fact that they had been expelled .. my friend is Russian, he left for permanent residence in Belarus and Russia three times, and now again in Kazakhstan ... is it not a fact that everything is fine ...
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 10: 27
          0
          Quote: foxxi
          Then they began to vote about what they had expelled.

          let's not, the pressure is different; it’s not always necessary to chase the Russians with knives in the streets, it’s enough to write that the Russian occupiers are drunk
        2. Rider
          Rider 31 March 2014 11: 01
          +1
          Quote: foxxi
          my friend is Russian, I went to Belarus and Russia for permanent residence three times, and now again in Kazakhstan ... is it not a fact that everything is fine.

          sorry, but not a fact.
          millions have left (from 4 to 5) have returned, well, let several thousand.
          incompatible numbers.

          however, the situation is far from so tragic.

          and yet, to me, as a Russian living in Kazakhstan, the breeze coming from the very tops is incomprehensible.

          in Russia, 80% of the indigenous population, but it is officially considered a multinational country.
          in Kazakhstan, the indigenous population is slightly more than half, but the leaders decided to move to a mono-ethnic country.

          WHAT FOR ?

          and even the Chinese will be called.
          decided to replace them with Russian?

          well, your land, you live on it

          with them.
          1. foxxi
            foxxi 31 March 2014 14: 11
            +8
            Those who understood life, they returned ... and who was a temporary worker all the time in Kazakhstan, those left ... Most honestly to Germany, but in fact, I have a fellow villager - all his life he was an activist - a Komsomol member, then he joined the party - became a Raykomovsky instructor, never seriously worked. He didn’t build anything, neither sowed nor cleaned ... only he scratched his tongue sweetly ... yes he subservient to his superiors ... so that, although no one drove him anywhere, in the mid-90s he left for Russia and in one of the programs on The Central Committee on the problems of immigrants sang an aria about oppression, you would see the reaction of those who did not leave and did not think to leave the North of the Republic of Kazakhstan, except for an epithet with ... ka! I didn’t hear then ... everyone lived together, since childhood we had been together, one bread, cuffs, upbringing, the army ... were very close to each other ... and now someone somewhere I heard something ... interferes gangster raids with nationalism and stirs up water ...
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 14: 53
              0
              Quote: foxxi
              who were temporary workers during their stay in Kazakhstan, they left.

              when you hear regularly - you were allowed to live here, the colonialists, this is our land, you will not think about moving
              1. foxxi
                foxxi 31 March 2014 16: 49
                +3
                Vasilenko - "when you regularly hear - you were allowed to live here, the colonialists, this is our land, you will not want to think about moving", but it's not about that, after all ... as it is written and read ... otherwise some kind of childish logic. ..where I wrote about the colonialists ... although in the historical sense it was a Russian colony ... by the way, I also heard phrases like "come in large numbers ...", but is there really little culture in a person, then why nod at all the people? So you are thinking about moving out of false fear and also, for reasons known to you alone ... subjective.
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 17: 42
                  +1
                  Quote: foxxi
                  Yes, not about that, because

                  first, this is my remark to the article, it has nothing to do and was said in a polemic with an opponent
                  secondly, no one on the Kazakhs as a people "rolls a barrel" I have enough friends among the Kazakhs and we have never shared according to the Kazakh-Russian principle, according to courtyards, streets, districts, but not according to nationalities. At the same time, it is stupid to deny that nationalism is cultivated and hatred of Russia and the Russians is stupid, for 23 years in Ukraine they have managed to raise more than one generation that simply hates Russia, if hiding their heads in the sand in Kazakhstan will be the same
          2. Guard
            Guard 31 March 2014 20: 50
            +5
            Quote: Rider
            and even the Chinese will be called.

            Yes, no one is calling the Chinese. duck it. in Kazakhstan, even the program for the resettlement of ethnic Kazakhs-oralmans was suspended, not to mention the Chinese.
            you yourself know how Kazakhs relate to the Chinese.
        3. Sma11
          Sma11 31 March 2014 11: 15
          0
          yes, all this is nonsense ... just at that time all enterprises were closed and everyone who worked were left without work, banditry flourished as a "natural" factor at that time, there was no nationalist condition under this,

          This is nonsense. In the beginning and middle of the 90's, Kazakh chauvinism simply fantanized. And the local Natsiks went to their houses, and their faces were beaten and smashed. Not only Russians left, but also Germans and other nationalities. Speaking of birds. And why do the Semirechye Cossacks want to leave Kazakhstan? It’s normal for you.
          1. Rider
            Rider 31 March 2014 11: 25
            +2
            Quote: Sma11
            . And why do the Semirechye Cossacks want to leave Kazakhstan? It’s normal for you.

            I do not know, I have long lost contact with the Cossacks. but really, many have a "suitcase mood"

            while the economic recovery was up (until 09g) everything seemed to be in order.
            then the crisis, lower salaries, real estate prices fell.
            etc
            Well, recently, the "national policy" has become more active, we, Russians, and before that did not feel much delight that we were a different state.
            and increasingly there are reasons for reflection.
            the attempt to introduce office work in Kazakh, the proposal to switch to the Latin alphabet, and the last "state of the Kazakhs" do not bring much joy.

            waiting.
            1. Guard
              Guard 31 March 2014 23: 34
              +4
              Quote: Rider
              while the economic recovery was up (until 09g) everything seemed to be in order.
              then the crisis, lower salaries, real estate prices fell.
              etc

              if the crisis will help to throw out from Kazakhstan those who have a permanent suitcase state, then I am ready to endure such a crisis.
              Kazakhstan needs a monolithic nation as an army. and all whiners and wimps will only undermine our gene pool. let them go, I’m even ready to financially help someone thread partially, if he undertakes to dump as soon as possible.
              let the best representatives of Russians, Germans, Koreans remain, with whom you can build 2050, go to reconnaissance, and fly into space. let the other cornflowers and ay-ai clog other countries.

              ZY out of a hundred thousand million "refugees from Kazakhstan", as I once said, not one has achieved at least something worthwhile in their historical homeland. both in Russia and in Germany, someone is again hindering them, oppressing them, offending them ...
            2. Rinat 1
              Rinat 1 April 3 2014 13: 12
              +3
              I’m wondering why you don’t learn the language of your country? If you do not consider Kazakhstan your country, the path is open to you. Let’s then we will also say why Kazakhs are not taught in Kazakh in the Russian Federation? Why is the paperwork not in Chechen or in Ingush? Everyone is talking about double standards, but don't you think double standards? Kazakhstan is an independent state, and you are dictating to us how to live. No one in the Republic of Kazakhstan oppresses Russians and other nations. What happened in the nineties was happening in all the expanses of the former USSR. Now is another time, and even another century. Since the beginning of the 90s, the Republic of Kazakhstan has been an ally and partner of the Russian Federation. After such comments by some people, the question arises, is the RF really an ally to us?
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir April 3 2014 17: 42
                -1
                the comparison is extremely incorrect, Kazakhs in Russia are less than a percent, Russians in RK 23
                In addition, schools including those with Kazakh education in the Russian Federation are
          2. Walking
            Walking 31 March 2014 11: 32
            +4
            Such horrors are told directly by the second Chechnya, only after living all my life here I have never encountered this
          3. foxxi
            foxxi 31 March 2014 16: 51
            +4
            nothing gushed ... do not be stupid ... this is 1. prosecuted by law.
            2. persecuted among the masses. Of course, there have always been enough domestic nationalists at all times and among all peoples ... but your imagination is still gushing ...
          4. Guard
            Guard 31 March 2014 21: 20
            +3
            Quote: Sma11
            In the early and mid-90s, Kazakh chauvinism simply fantanized. And the local Natsiks went to their houses, and their faces were beaten and smashed.

            It seems to me that you are a balabol.
            Quote: Sma11
            Not only Russians left, but also Germans and other nationalities.

            Sorry for the uncomfortable question - how many Russians left Russia in 20 years? And where did the Germans of Russia go? Accidentally didn’t go to the same place as the Kazakh Germans?
            Quote: Sma11
            And why do the Semirechye Cossacks want to leave Kazakhstan?
            And who said they want to leave? They were going to volunteer like to go to the Crimea to wave a saber in the event of the Russian-Ukrainian war. But since they did not go anywhere, the war did not happen.
      3. Natrix
        Natrix April 6 2014 17: 44
        +2
        In the West, too, everything is corrupt. So, Russians as Eurasians are doubly corrupt. love I follow your logic. And then, you already decide what time you are discussing - a long-standing mess or modern realities bully
    2. gas113
      gas113 31 March 2014 10: 59
      0
      everything is fair. namely discrimination and squeezing. personal relations have nothing to do with it. I also have Kazakhs friends. especially with the kaz nazi faced while working in the south. really maydauny but not all of course
  • upasika1918
    upasika1918 31 March 2014 07: 42
    0
    What to do. What clever rulers have always done. Targets have designated themselves.
  • parus2nik
    parus2nik 31 March 2014 07: 43
    +2
    The Uigur region has always been a problem for China and they will give money and anything, just to whitewash Uiguriya .. And the fact that Kazakhstan kisses Russia, the Customs Union, the Eurasian, dust..Kazakhstan objectively has nowhere to go ..
  • krpmlws
    krpmlws 31 March 2014 07: 44
    -7
    Kazakhs do not learn anything, they step on the same rake, continue to wipe their dirty feet on the Russian people, walk in the channel of the Balts and Ukrainians. Nationalism and Nazi stupefaction reign at our borders. We have a good memory, the process has begun, but the reasons for retaliatory actions The Kazakhs are laying a mine under their own state with their own hands. Then the wringing of hands will begin, yelling: "Save us from these aggressive Russians", but in all this you yourself will be to blame.
    1. tokin1959
      tokin1959 31 March 2014 07: 51
      +1
      no, they won’t scream.
      will shout - save from the Chinese, but if they expel the Russians, no one will help them
      1. foxxi
        foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 27
        -1
        exactly ... kara kytay kelsa - sary orysty baurday korersyn ...
        1. Zymran
          Zymran 31 March 2014 19: 03
          +3
          Quote: foxxi
          exactly ... kara kytay kelsa - sary orysty baurday korersyn ...


          How much can a fictional proverb be replicated?
          1. Ptah
            31 March 2014 20: 28
            0
            Quote: Zymran
            replicate a fictional proverb?

            It wouldn’t hurt to translate ...
            Or she doesn’t have a place on the site in any case.
            Violation of the rules will result in a warning. Or at least a CAUTION (shot in the knee) if from Apollo hi
            1. Zymran
              Zymran 31 March 2014 20: 38
              +3
              Quote: Ptah

              It wouldn’t hurt to translate ...


              Literal translation: if black Chinese come, you will take a red Russian for a brother.
              A proverb invented in the 90 years from the original:

              When the black Chinese breed, the end of the world will come.

              It was an old Muslim belief that existed in Central Asia.
            2. Guard
              Guard 31 March 2014 20: 41
              +5
              The proverb translates meaningfully as "When a black Chinese comes, the red-haired Russian will seem like a father." The trick is that this is a popular saying among Russians in Kazakhstan, although the Kazakhs never considered it their own. With this invented saying, the Russians are trying to show that the Kazakhs were allegedly afraid of the Chinese. In fact, historically, these steppe dwellers mutuzili the Chinese, whom even the Wall did not save.
              China was ruled in the last centuries by the Manchus steppe (Qing dynasty) and the army was Manchu, not Chinese. The Manchus were called by the Kazakhs "shurshut" (from their ancient name "jurchen"). The Chinese ("Kytai") at that time were pressed to the nail by the Manchus, and the Kazakhs never confused the Chinese with rustling.
              Relations with the Qing Empire were quite diplomatic. The Kazakhs were not conquered, no one imposed tribute on them. We learned that the Kazakhs were allegedly citizens of the Chinese from the Russians in the 20th century under the Bolsheviks. The correspondence of Kazakh khans and Qing emperors is still preserved, and Kazakhs are not called subjects of the Qing empire there. The usual chatter of two monarchs, like "I have a cold, and you have good healers in your country - send me a doctor and medicine. And I'll give you a beautiful white steppe horse for that ..."
              ZY If you read Russian-Chinese documents of the 19th century, you will find complaints from Qing officials that the Kazakhs put a bolt on the state inviolability of the great Chinese land and constantly visit the peace-loving Han people and rob them politely. And they plunder so "politely" that the cultured Qing soldiers of the Xinjiang garrison can do nothing but wipe a mean man's tear with the hem of their robe.
              1. Zymran
                Zymran 31 March 2014 20: 45
                +3
                Quote: Guard

                Relations with the Qing Empire were quite diplomatic. They did not conquer the Kazakhs; no one imposed tribute to them. The fact that supposedly the Kazakhs were citizenship of the Chinese, we learned from the Russians in the 20 century under the Bolsheviks.


                The tribute was one ram with 1000 and one head of cattle from hundreds, but it was very interesting:

                For this tribute, collected only to maintain the right to call all Kyrgyz Cossacks subjects, the Peking court annually sends gifts incomparably more than what it is worth. The bogdokhan's ministry has already made him several ideas about [364] the abolition thereof. Travelers (See "Journey to China" by Mr. Timkovsky (part I, p. 254) and further an extract from the Chinese book "Si-yui-vyn-tsyan-lu", in which there is a curious answer given by the Kyrgyz to the Chinese during the first demanding taxes from them. Here it is: "The sky produces grass and water, cattle is a gift from the sky, we graze it and saturate ourselves: why will we give to another?") they say that greedy Kyrgyz Cossacks come to Beijing annually under the guise of worship only to receive gifts: the Chinese sovereign gives them ranks and distinctions, but they, having left China, for the most part destroy all of these and throw signs of merit. They do the same with the awards they receive from the Russian court, excluding money and robes, which have intrinsic value.
                1. Guard
                  Guard 31 March 2014 21: 06
                  +5
                  Quote: Zymran
                  Travelers (See "Journey to China" by Mr. Timkovsky (part I, p. 254) and further an extract from the Chinese book "Si-yu-vyn-tsyan-lu"

                  The trick is that the Chinese annals of all neighbors are called their subjects. Chinese megalomania. The ambassador came to visit the Qing emperor, brought gifts from his ruler. The translator announces to Bogdykhan:
                  - This is Ambassador Myrkymbay from Bukhara. He brought jewelry for you and a couple of white horses.
                  - Bukhara? What is this?
                  - Bukhara is your land in the west of the Middle Kingdom, a great goddess!
                  - Ahhh ... Yes, yes, I remember. What a nice gesture from my subjects. Give him one hundred robes, two hundred concubines and one hundred bales with silk fabrics ...
                  And Bukhara Myrkymbay stands smiling, and is not aware that he was called a subject of the Chinese emperor. He only sees that they patted him on the shoulder, and the translator explained to him that they gave him 50 robes, a hundred concubines and 50 trunks with silk.
                  Everyone is happy, everyone is free.

                  ZY There is a good work on the relationship between the Qing Empire and Central Asia: Kuznetsov Vyacheslav Semenovich "The Qing Empire on the borders of Central Asia (second half of the XNUMXth - first half of the XNUMXth century)". It says why the Chinese chroniclers recorded everyone as the subjects of the Chinese emperor.
  • vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 31 March 2014 07: 46
    +2
    If everything that is stated here is true, then Kazakhstan, or rather its politicians, are even more separated from Russia, and are pushing the country even more into the abyss. I do not think that the Crimean scenario can be repeated in Kazakhstan. But with this approach, Russia-Kazakhstan relations will drift away. There are, of course, some clever people, like in Ukraine, who, in a frenzy, believe that Kazakhstan is expected in Europe, that America will definitely help them. Well, such European integrators do not learn anything from help, Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan. If you still soberly remember that almost the entire economy is still integrated with Russia. That the population of Kazakhstan is waiting for "fun" times, but in a national frenzy. I am sure that even Kazakhs who still have something to think about will inevitably leave to live in Russia. Well, those who have nothing to think about will, following the example of the Banderaites, shout who does not jump, that is, but in Kazakh. I don’t want to believe in such a scenario, only the latest events show that the policy of the authorities of Kazakhstan is going in this direction.
    1. Day 11
      Day 11 31 March 2014 08: 19
      0
      It is unlikely that the Kazakhs have "smart people" who want to get into Evropu. There they gravitate more towards others, following the example of Libya. Living according to the laws of Sharia is not happiness?
    2. T80UM1
      T80UM1 31 March 2014 11: 54
      +1
      Yah!? And where do you think it is moving away? To China East? South to Afghanistan? or west to the Caspian Sea?
  • Kazakh
    Kazakh 31 March 2014 07: 49
    +8
    It is important for Kazakhstan now not to succumb to provocations and remain calm. Now there is parity and unnecessary gestures in one direction or another will only harm both Kazakhs and Russians.
    1. Ptah
      31 March 2014 08: 17
      -6
      Quote: Kazakh
      they will harm both Kazakhs and Russians.

      Again, pugnacious words ... And again, Russian. Is few Russians already scared in the 90s and dumped D OMO!
      The article has a THICK clue that either you are turning your narrow eyes to the north, and accordingly * gangbang to China and, through this giggle * gadget, get the infiltration of the Uighurs fed up with the Han Chinese. Otherwise, when you try to smile at the Chinese people, you have a chic * pecker from Russia.
      And also that in the future ... Sly and terrible Pu "organizes" you a personal Maidan and federalization.
      Russia is growing in the northern lands of the Kazakh country. The Russians are asking for protection and they are given national autonomy. Uighurs build up kilometers of greenhouses with cucumbers south. What about the Kazakhs? Cossacks wander ... Everyone is happy ... Curtain.
      1. Rider
        Rider 31 March 2014 11: 08
        +1
        Quote: Ptah
        And also that in the future ... Sly and terrible Pu "organizes" you a personal Maidan and federalization.

        chur me - chur.
        this will not be.

        I hope Kaa will find a way to give the necessary thoughts to the ears of "Elbasy", and without the Crimean scenario.
        1. Ptah
          31 March 2014 12: 31
          +1
          Greetings, Sasha!
          "Elbasy" is not eternal, unfortunately. And the option should not be ruled out.
          Tyrtyr-stan. Under Babay Shaimiev, no one dared to blather about the "national identity" of the Tatars exclusively.
          And last year there was so much news that in different regions and districts of the republic they drove and wah-hobbits and seized all kinds of "evil green books" falling under extremism in mosques.
          So what about "chur-chur" - it's too early to relax ...
    2. foxxi
      foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 28
      +2
      absolutely sober judgment ...
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 31 March 2014 07: 49
    +1
    The king of beasts imagined himself a great ruler.
    But in vain he relies on wild Chinese Kazakhs and Uighurs,
    they behave too arrogantly and they have constant conflicts with the "Soviet" Kazakhs.
    Kazakhs resettled in comfortable houses quickly disable sewers,
    plumbing, heating and mess up the whole area. And all around the cabins in the steppe
    "mined" by heaps of feces, nowhere to step, and the stench is constant.
    He lived in Kazakhstan and he saw all this disgrace.
  • kind
    kind 31 March 2014 07: 51
    +4
    The article makes predictions invented in the west. Explicit order.
    1. kind
      kind 31 March 2014 08: 02
      0
      The fact that I was minusanuli proves the above!
      1. Humpty
        Humpty 31 March 2014 08: 22
        0
        No.
        Quote: Good
        The fact that I was minusanuli proves the above!


        None of which your bezopelatsionnoe expression does not prove. My "-" to you for not objectively blaming home-grown problems on the machinations of the West, Jews, etc.
        1. Stanislas
          Stanislas 31 March 2014 10: 19
          +9
          Quote: Humpty
          not objectively dump homegrown problems on the machinations of the West, Jews, etc.
          What problems? The article deals with the resettlement of southern Kazakhs in northern villages (not counting the point of view of A. Umarov).
          In Northern Kazakhstan, auls are closed in packs every year. They are closing primarily because there are no children in schools.
          . Are there many Russians in the villages that are going to be squeezed out of there? They are not there. What is the problem?
          Kazakhstan has embarked on a final solution to the “Russian question”.
          This is a direct analogy between Nazarbayev and Hitler. How did he deserve it? By what he thinks not only about the Russians living in the northern part, but about the whole state? But this is how the president should think. If there was such a leader in Ukraine, there would be no Euromaidan there, and they would already be in the Customs Union. How would you act in his place if you had a huge and strong neighbor in the North, whose policy changes 180 degrees depending on who is at the helm? There is no need to automatically turn your fears and concerns about possible interethnic problems into facts and use these "facts" to throw mud at Nazarbayev and all Kazakhs, as the "historically incorruptible" Ptah does.
          Quote: Ptah
          Kazakhs, like everyone in the east, are historically corrupt.
          Otherwise, these problems will arise ourselves earlier than in the Republic of Kazakhstan.
    2. their
      their 31 March 2014 08: 21
      -1
      This is the action plan of the American intelligence services, as well as in Ukraine. The Americans want to defeat Russia with the hands of their border allies.

      It is necessary to begin Russia to take accelerated measures to take back Ukraine and Kazakhstan, otherwise there will be the most idiotic third world war in history.

      American funds are still operating in Kazakhstan, 23 years of "independence", in general, the same kirdyk is maturing as in Ukraine, if Nazarbayev does not take the right steps now.
    3. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 31 March 2014 09: 07
      0
      the point is not where they were invented, the fact is that all of the above is quite possible. And if possible, the consequences are predictable. So what do you doubt?
  • Name
    Name 31 March 2014 07: 52
    0
    Here is a question of questions: and for what, RUSSIA is not loved for something, but ... Well, how can I not believe it: GOOD INTENTIONS LEAD(with changes),-ASKED AND SCREAMING IN HELL !!All the post-Soviet ones are waiting ... who whom ... bets on the future ... I’m sure that it will be like this:
  • Nester
    Nester 31 March 2014 07: 53
    0
    "If there is no school in the village, if there is no settlement in the village, mail - no one will live there. "
    This, excuse me, how?
  • Tor hummer
    Tor hummer 31 March 2014 07: 53
    -3
    Soviet leaders gave Russian lands, along with millions of Russians in addition. And now we are dismantling the consequences of their criminal activity.
    "Northern" Kazakhstan is neither northern nor Kazakhstan - it is a seized Russian land and it must be returned to Russia.
    Otherwise, the dogs are quite morose: they want to "root" the Russians living in their ancestral lands.
  • their
    their 31 March 2014 07: 54
    -5
    This begs the question, which of the southern Kazakhs will go to the North of KZ voluntarily to the "damned Russians"? - Practically no one, only for money and for everything ready, and you also have to work somewhere, given that for all 22 years the KZ government has simply not invested in the Northern regions of KZ.
  • kvnvolga2008
    kvnvolga2008 31 March 2014 07: 56
    +2
    I don’t think we need to dramatize the situation so much. We also have the problem of emptying villages. It is not a fact that "resettlement" (which is possible only in the minds of politicians) can actually be realized.
    1. foxxi
      foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 32
      +2
      it will be realized by the introduction of the Chinese and the subsequent rejection of the local population of the south ... why should China take the north, give him a more prosperous South.
  • f.lourens
    f.lourens 31 March 2014 07: 58
    +3
    I saw these immigrants from China, their Kazakhs call the Uralmans they do not want to work, they don’t know the language ... the future criminal element hi article minus
  • Bayonet
    Bayonet 31 March 2014 08: 00
    0
    Was in Kazakhstan for cleaning in 1973, Kustanai region. I remember the endless steppes, rare wretched settlements and unbridled drunkenness of the local population. Kazakhs saw only a few times.
    1. foxxi
      foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 33
      +2
      what about drinking is not quite true ... we drank a little ... worked a lot ..
  • buzer
    buzer 31 March 2014 08: 00
    +13
    only the State Department could come up with such a crazy article. 300 thousand Kazakhs from CHINA !!! Horror !!! Why not from Russia ??? Are there many Kazakhs too? Or from Uzbekistan? Well, the most favorite feature is "land rent by China" !!! People are already actively moving from the south of Kazakhstan, but not to North Kazakhstan, but to large cities with a developed industrial sector. I think there will be many such articles. The State Department needs a nosebleed to shake the situation in Kazakhstan ...
    1. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 31 March 2014 08: 19
      +11
      Quote: buzer
      The State Department needs to be shaken up by the situation in Kazakhstan ...
      laughing Why the State Department, Russian-shoviki cope themselves, the main thing is not to interfere.
      For Zadornov: "We are Russians - a proud people, they did not let America collapse the Union. We did it ourselves ..."
      Quote: sus
      such extrusion was widespread in 90x, and even now it is full of cases.
      Perepost..in 4 times ..
      Quote: Alibekulu
      So what about the "title nation" survived
      The titular nation at the time of the collapse of the USSR in Kazakhstan was a minority. "Russians", as a rule, in all spheres constituted the majority or were on par with the Kazakhs.
      And the Russians could calmly take everything into their own hands. But, but the Russians chose - "legs" ..
      The 90s are generally characterized by the exodus of Russians from the post-Soviet space. In Russian legends about oppression, even timid Tajiks distinguished themselves.
      I have again and again asked how it turned out that Kazakhs of which were slightly more than 30% - were they able to drive out Russians of which more than half ??!
      And in Kazakhstan cities, as local users write, Russian 90% !!!!
      That the minority would drive away the majority, I see only in the west, where gays drive away the "Bolsheviks" ...
      You are not ashamed of the Great Russians to write about the fact that the Kazakhs drove you away? !!
  • Anuarkz
    Anuarkz 31 March 2014 08: 04
    +20
    Recently, the number of anti-Kazakh articles has been increasing. Apparently, the West began to slowly but surely wage an information war in order to quarrel Kazakhstan and Russia. The article is completely nonsense, I live in the very south of the country and it is ridiculous to read about some kind of oppression of the Russian population, they are so oppressed that many have their own business, and three children are born without any state programs. Unless the number of chauvinists on the site really amazes, after all, it was with such small steps for 20 years that quarreled Ukraine and Russia
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 31 March 2014 08: 32
      +6
      Anuar everything will be fine. We have no Natsik. You will grow to understand the stars. We argue, discuss articles. There are obvious provocative throws. however, we live in peace and harmony. Oppose, convince the people. hi
    2. Serg65
      Serg65 31 March 2014 08: 32
      +12
      Quote: AnuarKz
      Recently, the number of anti-Kazakh articles has been increasing. Apparently, the West began to slowly but surely wage an information war in order to quarrel Kazakhstan and Russia. The article is completely nonsense, I live in the very south of the country and it is ridiculous to read about some kind of oppression of the Russian population, they are so oppressed that many have their own business, and three children are born without any state programs. Unless the number of chauvinists on the site really amazes, after all, it was with such small steps for 20 years that quarreled Ukraine and Russia


      I agree with you completely! The article, from my point of view, is delusional and provocative. To relocate the Kazakhs from south to north, this is the same as the Russians from the Kuban to Yamal, how many people will be? And screaming here about squeezing out the Russians, I advise you not to go to Turkey on your vacation, but to visit Chimkent, Taraz, Almaty and drive through the north of Kazakhstan. Until you feel, do not scream!
    3. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 08: 46
      -6
      Quote: AnuarKz
      the number of anti-Kazakh articles increases

      and the number of anti-Russian articles in the Republic of Kazakhstan ?!
      1. Sarmatian
        Sarmatian 31 March 2014 09: 18
        +10
        the number of anti-Russian articles is also increasing, it is written by pro-Westerners or 5 Column which is ready to sell their homeland with giblets both for you and for us, so Mr. Vasilenko does not need question marks! and people like you are even more oppressing the situation around our peoples and playing into the hands of the State Department, these bastards (amerikosy) have completely gone nuts.
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 10: 15
          0
          Quote: Sarmatian
          and people like you oppress the situation around our peoples even more

          and what is the injection ?!
          in addition, the general attitude towards each other is also quite different, in the Russian Federation both towards the National Academy of Sciences and the Republic of Kazakhstan as a whole, the attitude is quite positive, which can not be said about the attitude of Kazakhs to Russia
      2. foxxi
        foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 35
        +3
        I haven’t even seen such yet ... No.
      3. Walking
        Walking 31 March 2014 11: 45
        +3
        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
        Quote: AnuarKz
        the number of anti-Kazakh articles increases

        and the number of anti-Russian articles in the Republic of Kazakhstan ?!


        Minimally, and if it happens, then on duty we stop. By the way, there are much fewer such articles than in Russia.
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 12: 56
          -4
          Quote: Hiking
          Minimally, and if it happens, then on duty we stop. By the way, there are much fewer such articles than in Russia.

          just don’t, go to the sites of Azattyk, Altyn Horde (coming out with the support of the presidential fund), etc.
          1. foxxi
            foxxi 31 March 2014 14: 16
            +2
            these are ultra sites ... what should we do there ... behind each of them is Uncle's beard ...
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 14: 55
              +1
              Quote: foxxi
              these are ultra sites

              about a month ago, on one of your compatriots, Altyn the Horde called a patriotic site.
              besides, the question arises if, as you put it, "these are ultra sites .." why are they allowed to broadcast ?!
              what does the Prosecutor's Office of the Republic of Kazakhstan on my electronic application acknowledge the incitement of ethnic hatred by this site, but since I am not a resident of the Republic of Kazakhstan refused to initiate UD, it turns out that everyone is aware, but at the same time they pretend that this is not
              1. foxxi
                foxxi 31 March 2014 16: 54
                +1
                and you ask the prosecutor’s office ... you think traitors are there and there are no enemies of the people ... completely full + dumbasses escaping in the form of foam to the top ... there are almost no smart ones.
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 17: 45
                  0
                  I asked, I was politely sent.
                  By the way, living in the RK a couple of times from the cops I heard I don’t like to go to Russia or nobody called you here, despite the fact that my great-grandfather was among those who created Fort Verny
                  1. Guard
                    Guard 31 March 2014 21: 28
                    +6
                    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                    a couple of times from the cops I heard I don’t like Wali in Russia

                    If my Russian acquaintances in Almaty were told this, they would have rolled this cop under the asphalt, because Almaty is their city, and no one has the right to kick him out of the house. Even the "evil" Kazakh court is not able to deprive you of your citizenship.
                    Well, if you yourself do not follow the language and were advised to get out of here, and you obediently did this, then Kazakhstan and Almaty have never been your home. Here the hell is who will drive me out of my house. And they didn’t even kick you out, but simply blew you.
                    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 22: 22
                      -5
                      for starters, I don’t remember that we would graze sheep together, therefore try not to poke

                      secondly, what makes you think that I left it just like that

                      and thirdly, tired of arranging scuffle every two times
            2. Guard
              Guard 31 March 2014 21: 15
              +3
              Quote: foxxi
              these are ultra sites ... what should we do there ... behind each of them is Uncle's beard ...

              yes, he was already explained that these are American sites in fact. Azattyk is generally a branch of Radio Liberty. Just a tracing paper into the Kazakh language. He doesn't understand this. They wrote to him more than once that it is like calling the Silver Rain TV channel and the Ekho Moskvy radio - the mouthpiece of the Kremlin and the voice of the people. On these sites, commentators are the same Kazakhs as I am a ballerina - 99% do not know who with pseudo-Kazakh nicknames and 1% knocked down room natsiks (with Wahhabbit beards). I have tried many times to leave comments on RFE / RL and NOT ONE of my comments have been moderated.
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 22: 24
                -2
                Quote: Guard
                Azattyk is generally a branch of Radio Liberty.

                dear, I know better than you what azattyk is, but Kazakhs write there, and not evil Americans
    4. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 31 March 2014 09: 53
      0
      Quote: AnuarKz
      Recently, the number of anti-Kazakh articles has been increasing. Apparently, the West began to slowly but surely wage an information war in order to quarrel Kazakhstan and Russia. The article is completely nonsense, I live in the very south of the country and it is ridiculous to read about some kind of oppression of the Russian population, they are so oppressed that many have their own business, and three children are born without any state programs. Unless the number of chauvinists on the site really amazes, after all, it was with such small steps for 20 years that quarreled Ukraine and Russia

      Please note that such articles do not appear in Russia, but just in the former Soviet republics, and why? simply because there is appropriate soil, and here it’s not worth touching the supposedly peaceful calm.
    5. Loki
      Loki 31 March 2014 10: 18
      +9
      And you are not surprised. When I read the Russian press, my hair stands on end. It turns out that poor Russians are almost killed in all republics, genocide and morally humiliated. But all the same, for some reason, this picture will never catch my eye.

      lately, the general impression on the site is that the Russians turned into some kind of Pavlov’s dog - no brain work, only conditioned reflexes - showed a bone - and let's bite off the territory from Kazakhstan, and immediately let everyone drool. And they do not care about all that a union country, they immediately hammer a bolt on it and only saliva drips
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 10: 24
        -2
        Quote: Loki
        no brain work only conditioned reflexes

        or maybe you need a little more polite, otherwise the dog can cling to the throat
        1. Loki
          Loki 31 March 2014 10: 44
          +2
          Can not. Pavlov’s patients on this site are good at yapping and barking, and also at salivation. Do not confuse Russia as a whole with its individual representatives - these are different concepts
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 11: 05
            +1
            Quote: Loki
            Can not. Pavlov’s patients on this site are good at yapping and barking, and also at salivation.

            and what are you doing here then?
            1. Loki
              Loki 31 March 2014 12: 09
              0
              I study cynology and get rid of illusions regarding Russia. Including in your example.
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 13: 00
                0
                well then you can study silently.
                pay attention to you personally, no one is rude, and you already managed to offend everyone
      2. vladsolo56
        vladsolo56 31 March 2014 11: 27
        +1
        cite the official press of Russia, not the yellow tabloid, namely the national one, give examples, if you can’t advise eating a hat.
        1. Loki
          Loki 31 March 2014 12: 16
          +5
          No problem. Open any official Russian press and read about Crimea. Then find 10 differences from what they are now talking about Kazakhstan - they say the Russian land, etc. In Crimea everything started exactly the same, just earlier. The same assurances about fraternal peoples that are together forever, the same assurances at official levels about eternal love and rejection of even the possibility of a conflict between Russia and Ukraine. Even on this site there were a lot of statements about solidarity, Slavic brotherhood, blood was shed together, etc. But this skin slipped quite quickly and the essence was revealed. The same applies to Kazakhstan - and this is perfectly understood by Nazarbayev, since he began the program of resettlement to the north of the country. This is not because he has a bad attitude towards Russians in the country, but because he understands that the Russian population has become a threat to the statehood and integrity of his country as a result of Russian modern politics - the use of the Russian population as an excuse for pressure and expansion.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 15: 44
            0
            Quote: Loki
            No problem. Open any official Russian press and read about Crimea.

            but let’s not do this, quote
          2. vladsolo56
            vladsolo56 April 1 2014 05: 51
            -3
            I don’t know how old you are, but your mind is still not enough, any policy of ousting Russians will lead Kazakhstan to collapse. And the settlement of the northern and eastern regions by the nationals is the policy of crowding out. Who do you think will come to Kazakhstan from China? Maybe highly intelligent professionals? no matter how they feel good there. And I will resettle the villagers, by the way, those who are clearly anti-Russian. So if you think soberly, it’s very simple to understand what will happen to these regions of Kazakhstan. You take an interest in how they live in Afghanistan, this is what awaits you if you are rude to Russia, if Russia turns its back on you.
  • alatau_09
    alatau_09 31 March 2014 08: 06
    +10
    the audience of VO is becoming smaller, smaller ... not like 2 ... 3 years ago ... more and more distant populist chauvinists and less and less thinking patriots ...
  • ed65b
    ed65b 31 March 2014 08: 17
    +4
    Interesting thoughts voiced by the author of the article. Let's see the further course of events, it may turn out that these are just thoughts in the ear. We also have all kinds of thinkers, but this does not mean that everything will be embodied in life. The NAS is a cautious and wise politician; I don’t think that following the example of Sahak or the Kiev junta, he will begin to chop with his sword right and left. Rather, nothing will happen in terms of accelerating processes, the way of life of the indigenous population cannot be reversed by slogans and force, you can reverse it, but the farther the big question will turn out, the Kazakhs are patient people, but if you get excited, it doesn't seem enough, the Russians are the same with the Kazakhs.
    1. their
      their 31 March 2014 08: 24
      +1
      Nazarbayev is a wise politician, but the Americans need the same scenario as in Ukraine, so they will simply overthrow him like Yanukovych and launch the Bandera pendulum with a natschiza
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 08: 47
        -4
        Quote: sus
        Nazarbayev is a wise politician

        he is not wise he is cunning, would be wise would not ruin his industry
        1. their
          their 31 March 2014 09: 00
          +1
          I will correct, the Soviet industry built by the Russians, I ruined and squandered everything at the suggestion of American "friends", and where I didn’t ditch it, I sold it to Western owners for next to nothing.
          His wisdom is that while the Kazakhs have not yet begun to do what is happening in Ukraine in relation to the Russians.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 10: 20
            0
            Quote: sus
            His wisdom is that while the Kazakhs have not yet begun to do what is happening in Ukraine in relation to the Russians.

            it is not wisdom, but the instinct of self-preservation
          2. Guard
            Guard 31 March 2014 21: 45
            +8
            Quote: sus
            Soviet industry built by Russians

            It is very difficult to sit on two chairs at the same time. You will decide who was the culprit of all the nishtyaks and disasters in the Soviet era. If the Russians want gratitude for the "construction of Kazakhstan", then be so kind as to answer for the famine of the 30s, for repressions, and for the destruction of the Kazakh language and culture. And it turns out interestingly - Baikonur was built by the Russians, and the entire Kazakh intelligentsia in 1937 was shot by aliens. The Russians taught us to read the Cyrillic alphabet, and the aliens left us the contaminated lands near Semipalatinsk and the dried-up Aral.
            Or maybe we will stop pulling out convenient facts and admit that not a single Vanya from Tambov woke up in the morning with the thought: "Shouldn't I go to the Kazakh steppe to build a metallurgical plant out of the kindness of my soul? We have such factories in Tambov, five thousand every yard, but the Kazakhs have nothing. It's unfair somehow ... "
            The decisions were made not by the Russian people, but by the Communist Party. And not for the good of the Kazakh people, but for the good of the Soviet economy. In the end, mining plants were built in Kazakhstan, and not for the "meat" of Kazakh cattle breeders, but for the entire USSR. 80% of Kazakhs, until the collapse of the USSR, lived in villages and did not use the nishtyaks of the Soviet regime, which were available to urban Russian residents. Why hide something? Who lived in the cities in the Kazakh SSR? You know the answer yourself. Cities were built not for Kazakhs, but for immigrants from the European part of the USSR, who were brought here to work at strategic enterprises.
            Well, and most importantly. The volume of industrial production in Kazakhstan is above the Soviet level. Although people like Vasilenko are ready to fight against the wall with their heads so as not to admit it. He also wants to see a picture that with his flight from Kazakhstan everything collapsed here and the ungrateful chuchmeks climb to kiss his legs, tearfully persuading him to return laughing
  • Arkan
    Arkan 31 March 2014 08: 19
    -3
    Allies are afraid of us, according to our actions, evaluate the possibilities.
  • VladimirRG
    VladimirRG 31 March 2014 08: 23
    +6
    Actually, the policy of ousting Russians from Kazakhstan has been going on quietly for a long time. Istrian textbooks study the period of occupation of Kazakhstan by Russia. Russians are by definition the descendants of the Occupants. In the yoke of the country, all state institutions are translated into the Kazakh language for civil servants of Kazakhs there 99,9%, not to mention the petty everyday natalism that rushes and rushes and only "naive" people can talk about the friendship of peoples in Kazakhstan. But this is not the worst problem yet. Settlers "aralmans" have extremely low potential in culture (look at the auls all in the village ....) and most importantly, they CANNOT BE MADE WORK !!! they have no idea what it turns out to be dress taxes, pension benefits, etc. for them it is alien in principle !!!! And when this contingent finally becomes the title contingent, it will be possible to forget about the Republic of Kazakhstan as a state in general. At the same time, there are certainly Kazakhs who are competent who are alien to the ideas of national politics, but there are fewer and fewer of them, thanks to such Kazakhs they still manage not to get involved in the Ukrainian scenario.
    1. foxxi
      foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 44
      +5
      The funny thing is that the oralman is trying to evaluate in our living conditions ... see for yourself - a migrant from Mongolia has been a pastoralist and nomad his whole life, having arrived in the Republic of Kazakhstan it became unclear who. he never harvested hay, fodder, did not keep cattle on a stall, and in the Republic of Kazakhstan, for example, in the North or at the Center, it is impossible and impossible to engage in nomadic cattle breeding, since everywhere there is sowing land and pastures are already occupied by local people, he’s mowing and harvesting forage he doesn’t know how, here’s the answer for you ... he doesn’t want to work, but simply doesn’t know how to do it ... who is to blame for this? But hell knows ... maybe the one who called him to the homeland of his ancestors ... didn’t plan where, how and when to bring him ... In my memory ... one of the oralmans, a smart guy came to the Republic of Kazakhstan just to live on time .. looked and returned to Mongolia .. because there is a paradise for him there on earth ... then the Oralmans are Mongols ... they don’t know the division into zhuzes ... in other words, they may never have lived in Kazakhstan .. but they lived in Mongolia from the beginning of time.
    2. T80UM1
      T80UM1 31 March 2014 11: 56
      +6
      What year did you graduate from school? In 2004, the words "occupation" were not in either old or new textbooks. I had to learn the whole history of Kazakhstan (thanks UNT!)
      1. vovan50
        vovan50 31 March 2014 13: 54
        0
        The textbook “History of Kazakhstan” by Zhambyl Artykbaev and Saken Razdykov, published in 2007 and recommended by the Ministry of Education of the Republic of Kazakhstan for primary and secondary educational institutions.
        “At the beginning of the twentieth century, the territory of Kazakhstan was one of the colonies of Russia. The natural course of ethnic development was interrupted. The political structure of the Kazakhs was destroyed, territorial unity was violated, the formation of a nation and the unity of culture were difficult. It became impossible to create a common economy at that time, its infrastructure was developing in favor of the interests of the metropolis. Colonial domination suspended the original development of the ethnic group. ”
        “The national awakening of the Kazakh people in an embryonic state was interrupted by the October Revolution, which plunged Kazakhstan into a state of chaos. And then decades of terror and genocide came, leading the Kazakh ethnic group to terrible tragedies. ”
        “The Soviet government ... trying to preserve the empire, began to fight against the intelligentsia from national minorities, including the Kazakhs. For seventy years, the best representatives of the freedom-loving people were constantly destroyed, repressions were carried out every twenty years to eliminate the pride of the nation in subsequent generations. In parallel, the Soviet government strove to survive its heroic history from the memory of the people ... And when the people despaired, when many Kazakhs turned into mankurts, 1991 came. ”
        1. Guard
          Guard 31 March 2014 22: 48
          +6
          Quote: vovan50
          “At the beginning of the twentieth century, the territory of Kazakhstan was one of the colonies of Russia.

          1) The occupation and the colony are two different things. Very different.
          2) The term "colony" in relation to Central Asia and Kazakhstan was used in Soviet textbooks and encyclopedias. Tsarist policy was called directly - "colonial policy". Moreover, before the revolution, this term (and its derivatives - colonization, colonists) was calmly used in official Russian documentation, the titles of newspaper articles, and in literary works.
          Why are you like this - it is possible to write Russian in textbooks, but not Kazakhs?
          Quote: vovan50
          The natural course of ethnic development was interrupted.
          Study the question of how the Kazakh nomadic pastoral stumbled on the boundary drawn by the Russian Stolypin colonists.

          Quote: vovan50
          The political structure of the Kazakhs was destroyed, territorial unity was violated,

          The tsarist government, in violation of the agreements by which the Kazakh Khanate became part of the Empire, forcibly eliminated the Khanate (the Kenesary rebellion). There was a restructuring of the Kazakh steppe under the governor general. The autonomous Kazakh Khanate was liquidated; instead, provinces led by the military administration appeared.
          The tsarist authorities took away plots of land on which mineral deposits were found and sold them to their Russian dealers, and more often to foreigners (primarily the British).

          Quote: vovan50
          “The national awakening of the Kazakh people in an embryonic state was interrupted by the October Revolution, which plunged Kazakhstan into a state of chaos. And then decades of terror and genocide came, leading the Kazakh ethnic group to terrible tragedies. ”

          And in Russia at this time a golden age has come? Yes, Kazakhs say. But we in Russia know that on the second day after the October Revolution, peace, grace and the apotheosis of philanthropy came to Russia.
          1. Guard
            Guard 31 March 2014 22: 50
            +7
            Quote: vovan50
            “The Soviet government ... trying to preserve the empire, began to fight against the intelligentsia from national minorities, including the Kazakhs.

            It is a pity that you do not know that by 1937 the entire Kazakh intelligentsia was destroyed. For you, these are just hateful and incomprehensible signs in the form of street names. And I have that from my father's side, that from my mother's skating rink of the Bolshevik repressions was thoroughly ridden. On the mother's side, for "bai origin" (he also had a princely title), on the father's side, where there were never rich people, for "espionage in favor of Japan", although grandfather's brother was a railway engineer in Karaganda and never met a single foreigner saw.
            Take a look at the data on the number of Kazakhs for the last hundred years. Tsarist, Soviet data! I am not asking you to read Kazakh sources, because you do not trust them by default. Read Russian materials! Over the course of a hundred years, the Kazakhs naturally genocide several times - first, the massive weaning of lands necessary for the nomadic economy of the Kazakhs, then the massacre of 1916, when the tsarist army and Cossacks tried to exterminate unarmed Kazakhs (we were forbidden to have weapons), then the terrible famine of the 20s, 10 years later, another famine staged by Goloschekin and his associates, then a skating rink of repression (almost all Kazakhs fell under the definition of "bai origin", since a nomad always has more cattle than a Russian peasant), then losses during the Second World War (Kazakhs did not mow from the army, went voluntarily, in addition, the Kazakhs did not have "armor", since there were few technical specialists among them), as a result, only in the years of stagnation, the Kazakhs barely restored their numbers as before the Stolypin reform. At the same time, the number of other peoples of the USSR increased significantly. One hundred years ago, there were 8 times less Uzbeks than Kazakhs. Now there are several times more of them than us. I will not talk about the growth of other nationalities.
            It was not because of the good life that the Kazakhs lost the lion's share of their ethnicity. Not because of sweet gingerbread and the care of their "elder brother" did the Kazakhs strew their steppe with white bones. So it is not necessary for the Kazakhs to hang on their ears that textbooks are supposedly not written that way. In addition to textbooks, we also have a "genetic memory" many centuries ago. Although, of course, people who do not know the name of their own great-grandfather can scoff at this. And I know where my ancestors lived, how they lived, what they did, how they died, what they saw and did in their lives. Therefore, Kazakh textbooks do not cause rejection among Kazakhs. They are surprising only to those who do not know not only Kazakh history, but also their own.

            In general, the Russian point of view on history amazes me. It's normal when Russians scold tsarism. When the Russians swear at the repression and "excesses" of the Bolsheviks, this is normal. But for some reason, Kazakhs should perceive this as "carefree time"?
            1. corn
              corn April 1 2014 01: 40
              -2
              Guard
              Quote:
              "A hundred years ago, there were 8 times less Uzbeks than Kazakhs. Now there are several times more of them than us. I will not talk about the growth of other nationalities."

              Logical inconsistency: Russia, as a colonialist, loves Uzbeks (cherishes them and cherishes them), and does not like Kazakhs (starves, represses and uses in war)
              No offense.
              1. Guard
                Guard April 1 2014 19: 55
                +2
                Quote: corn
                Logical inconsistency: Russia, as a colonialist, loves Uzbeks (cherishes them and cherishes them), and does not like Kazakhs (starves, represses and uses in war)

                Some plants bend and do not break. Other plants do not bend, but break.
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir April 1 2014 20: 34
                  -3
                  Quote: Guard
                  Other plants do not bend, but break.

                  and which plant is Kazakhstan?
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir April 1 2014 20: 50
                    -1
                    quite funny
                    he himself compared RK with a plant and he himself was indignant when asked a question
        2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Guard
      Guard 31 March 2014 22: 08
      +6
      Quote: VladimirRG
      In Istrian textbooks, the period of occupation of Kazakhstan by Russia is studied. Russians are already, by definition, descendants of occupiers.

      Have you ever seen a Kazakh history textbook? Where is the word "occupation"? Buy a school textbook, open your eyes and go through all the pages in search of "occupation". And at the same time, buy a spelling dictionary of the Russian language before writing such a "complex" word.
      Quote: VladimirRG
      On the yoke of the country, all state institutions are translated into Kazakh

      In the south and west of Kazakhstan, internal office work in state offices is conducted in the Kazakh language, since the population of these regions speaks Kazakh better than Russian. Even local Russians speak this language calmly, in contrast to the "northern" Russians.
      Quote: VladimirRG
      Kazakhs there 99,9%
      Or maybe it is worth serving in the army and learning the state language before waving at the civil service? With a fig, do we need officials who do not know the language of their people? To each such dumb translator official? And if Russian youth does not want to join the Kazakh army, then why is it offended that they are not given the opportunity to serve in the civil service?

      Quote: VladimirRG
      not to mention the petty everyday nationalism which rushing rushing and rushing

      Much more often Kazakhstanis are confronted with everyday Russian nationalism than with Kazakh. That is why ignoring the Kazakh language is normal, and when Kazakhs speak their native language, is it "nationalism"? Tell me bluntly that only the Russian-language version of Kazakhstan will suit you, and everything that is connected with the Kazakhs, their language, history and culture - stupidly scares and annoys you.
      Quote: VladimirRG
      Migrants "aralmans" have extremely low potential in culture (look at the villages all in the village ....) and most importantly, they CANNOT BE MADE WORK !!! they have no idea what it turns out to be dress taxes, pension benefits, etc. for them it is alien in principle !!!!
      And here is a sample of Russian chauvinism. Why are these Kazakhs repatriates - wild, stupid and lazy? Are you familiar with them? All their "wildness" consists only in the fact that they do not know your language. At the same time, after a few years, these "stupid oglo-eaters", pushing carts in the bazaar or raising livestock in the open air, manage to collect money for normal housing, send a child to a paid school and learn Russian at the very least, but the "smart and beautiful" remain on the same financial and linguistic level. And people like you, of course, will never be able to learn Kazakh. For you to write in Russian is already a problem)))))))))
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 22: 26
        0
        Quote: Guard
        For you to write in Russian is already a problem)))))))))

        and for you, apparently politely communicate
  • Orakyl
    Orakyl 31 March 2014 08: 26
    -3
    Kazakhstan is one of those countries that can never be fully independent. Even now, when the number of Russians who want to leave this country is not decreasing, everything possible is being done at the state level to reduce the outflow of the Russian population by introducing limits on the issuance of documents for emigration (I’m not speaking by hearsay). This is a country of nomads and pastoralists, whose entire industry rested only on Russian specialists. For 20 years, all the enterprises where Russian specialists who had left previously worked, either went bankrupt or leased to foreign workers who mercilessly exploit the labor of local workers and stupidly export minerals from the country.
    Therefore, the only question is with whom Kazakhstan will be, and not whether it will remain an independent state.
  • Sarmatian
    Sarmatian 31 March 2014 08: 27
    +8
    Gentlemen, chauvinists, to your note, from Kazakhstan left for permanent residence for 20 over 4.5 million Slavs and 2.5 million returned back, I think if the Slavic people were oppressed here, they would not have returned. Speaking about the territories of the Saratov Region, Altai Territory, Omsk Region, Astrakhan were originally Kazakh lands, we do not pretend to these territories, and Northern Kazakhstan was and will remain ours, since not only Slavic people were not oppressed and will not oppress any people. Before writing chauvinistic dregs, think about it. Those who write nonsense I think are not completely friends with the head. Analyze, then say otherwise the Westerners are not asleep and will use you as chauvinists. How many I live I have not seen oppression and I do not advise you to write all this crap if you do not live in Kazakhstan. Kazakhs are not close to us, not the Chinese, and especially the Americans, the latter apparently work well together with the Russian chauvinists, so good gentlemen, be peaceable WE ARE BORN IN THE USSR !!!!
    1. Anuarkz
      Anuarkz 31 March 2014 08: 35
      +6
      When I told a guy from Orenburg that his city was our former capital, he did not even believe me.
      1. their
        their 31 March 2014 08: 44
        +1
        The city was created by the Russians, as part of the Russian Federation, for the younger Zhuz Kazakhs who themselves requested protection. He stayed in the capital for 5 years, then moved to the city of Perovsk (Kyzyl-Orda)
    2. their
      their 31 March 2014 08: 36
      -4
      What are your territories what are you talking about? Kazakhstan as a state was created by the Bolsheviks, on the ruins of the Russian Empire with Russian cities. Northern Kazakhstan is primordially Russian lands with Russian cities, where the Kazakhs are occupiers and behave accordingly in relation to the Russians, squeezing out, replacing the "titular" nation. History has not taught you anything like that, again Russia will have to save you from the American "Dzungars". And your history books are something written on grants from Soros.
      1. Serg65
        Serg65 31 March 2014 08: 52
        +8
        Quote: sus
        What are your territories what are you talking about? Kazakhstan as a state was created by the Bolsheviks, on the ruins of the Russian Empire with Russian cities. Northern Kazakhstan is primordially Russian lands with Russian cities, where the Kazakhs are occupiers and behave accordingly in relation to the Russians, squeezing out, replacing the "titular" nation. History has not taught you anything like that, again Russia will have to save you from the American "Dzungars". And your history books are something written on grants from Soros.

        My friend, my minus for your complete lack of knowledge of the history of your country, do not knock yourself on the chest, and you can be crippled! hi
        1. their
          their 31 March 2014 09: 02
          -4
          Correct me if I don’t know the story, maybe disprove it?
          1. Serg65
            Serg65 31 March 2014 09: 20
            +6
            Quote: sus
            Correct me if I don’t know the story, maybe disprove it?


            I hope you heard about Comrade Yermak and his travels beyond the Urals?
      2. Anuarkz
        Anuarkz 31 March 2014 09: 23
        +5
        That's because the Bolsheviks, great people back in 1465 helped us Kazakhs organize their state after the collapse of the Golden Horde. Orenburg and it was founded by order of Empress Anna Ioannovna in the territory of the Turgay region.
      3. washi
        washi 31 March 2014 11: 55
        +2
        Quote: sus
        What are your territories about what are you talking about? Kazakhstan as a state-created by the Bolsheviks

        Quote: Sarmatian
        Speaking of the territories of the Saratov Region, Altai Territory, Omsk Region, Astrakhan were originally Kazakh lands

        I agree with both. Kazakhstan, as a traditional state, did not exist before Soviet power. Kazakhs remained at the level of tribal relations with a nomadic way of life. For nomadism, large territories were required, which were located, including in the modern territory of the Russian Federation.
    3. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 08: 49
      0
      Quote: Sarmatian
      Gentlemen chauvinists you note

      dear, but poorly read, what does the term chauvinism mean?
      Quote: Sarmatian
      How many I live I have not seen oppression and I do not advise you to write all this crap if you do not live in Kazakhstan

      I have seen and very much both in everyday life and in state. level
      1. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 31 March 2014 10: 48
        +6
        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
        I have seen and very much both in everyday life and in state. level
        Comrades, let's impose a matrix of "oppression", for example, Vasilenko in the Republic of Kazakhstan and the Russian Federation ?! wink
        I) In Kazakhstan, Vasilenko lived in the "southern capital" in Almaty
        In Russia, he lives in the wilderness of the Kaliningrad region ..
        II) In Kazakhstan, Almaty, Uncle Vova lived in the center of the metropolis in a comfortable apartment .. good
        In the Russian Federation lives on in a ground house, where all the amenities were on the street .. fellow
        III) Vasilenko worked in a prestigious, highly paid position in Kazakhstan ..
        In the backwoods of the Kaliningrad province, he breeds goats because of despairing belay I note, not cattle even ...
        P.S. So ask yourself a simple question, so where was he really "oppressed" ?! request
        In Kazakhstan, the evil Kazakhs, or in a ridiculous eReFII ?!
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 11: 52
          -1
          Quote: Alibekulu
          I) In Kazakhstan, Vasilenko lived in the "southern capital" in Almaty
          In Russia, he lives in the wilderness of the Kaliningrad region ..
          II) In Kazakhstan, Almaty, Uncle Vova lived in the center of the metropolis in a comfortable apartment ..
          In the Russian Federation, lives on in a ground house, where all the amenities were on the street

          well let's impose
          1) you have a terrible provincial complex - if not in a large metropolis life has failed
          2) "respected" I live in a "ground house" in 3 levels with a total area of ​​250 squares, on a land of 7 hectares, plus I have another 15 hectares, a house with all amenities - water (hot, cold), sewage, steam heating, fiber optic the Internet.
          Quote: Alibekulu
          II) In Kazakhstan, Vasilenko worked in a prestigious, highly paid position ..
          In the outback of the Kaliningrad province, he bred goats from despair. I note, not cattle even ...

          Do not be offended by you - (damn moderators will run over again)
          I worked at OWN ENTERPRISE, moving here I decided that I would farm not out of hopelessness, but quite consciously and now I enjoy it.
          not counting "not even cattle ..." it just speaks of the absence, sorry, intelligence
          1. Alibekulu
            Alibekulu 31 March 2014 14: 10
            +5
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            1) you have a terrible provincial complex - if not in a large metropolis life has failed
            You got me crying
            By the way, Vasilenko, you joined "aitys" with half of Kazakhs on "VO".
            And, including Marek and Aksakal. Do they, by your logic, probably snobbishness of the capital ?!
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            moving here decided that I would farm
            It always surprised me that I really needed to climb so far that I could breed my hoofed animals request Cattle breeding is historically even easier in steppe Kazakhstan. By the way, subsidies for animal husbandry are now quite good - for example, "Sybaga" ...
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            , but quite consciously and now I get pleasure from it.
            A self-sufficient and contented person, I think, will not throw himself like a silly dog ​​on people (Kazakhs) .. recourse
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            I worked at OWN ENTERPRISE
            NDA, the grandfather worked as a sickly cashier, my mom also had a position and he himself had an OWN ENTERPRISE .. Eh, and now .. sad Straight "Regression of the USSR". As in that joke:
            “The Liliput family.
            Father is 150 cm tall, mother is 140 cm tall, and son is 130 cm tall.
            So, somehow the son brings his bride home, and her height is 120, see
            Father looks at her so attentively, and says: “Son, you would have thought ... would not be in a hurry to get married, otherwise we’ll go to the dotra mice ...”
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 15: 02
              -5
              Quote: Alibekulu
              I was always surprised that it really was necessary to climb so far to breed artiodactyls with Cattle breeding, historically even easier in steppe Kazakhstan. By the way, subsidies for animal husbandry are now quite good - for example, "Sybaga" ...

              firstly tired of listening - "we allowed you to live here"
              and in the second I was looking for a region where you can find enough free land
              Quote: Alibekulu
              A self-sufficient and contented person, I think, will not throw himself like a scoundrel dog at people (Kazakhs).

              "dear" you still follow the language.
              Quote: Alibekulu
              Nda, grandfather worked as a sickly nasalnik, my mother had the same position and he had his OWN ENTERPRISE .. Eh, and now .. Straight "USSR Regression". As in that joke

              this nonsense in general what for, with a brain of a problem ?!
          2. Alibekulu
            Alibekulu 31 March 2014 14: 16
            +4
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            I live in a "ground house" in 3 levels with a total area of ​​250 squares, on a land of 7 hectares, plus I have another 15 hectares, a house with all amenities - water (hot, cold), sewage, steam heating, fiber-optic internet.
            Entot ?! yes
          3. Guard
            Guard April 1 2014 00: 06
            +4
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            "Dear" I live in a "ground house" in 3 levels with a total area of ​​250 squares, on a land of 7 hectares, plus I have another 15 hectares, a house with all amenities - water (hot, cold), sewage, steam heating, fiber optic internet.

            and I thought that "refugees" come running to Russia with only one suitcase of underwear ... it turns out that you are not sickly, Vasilenko, you earned money in Kazakhstan. and you create the impression that at night you were kicked out of your home apartment by evil village guys smelling of the fumes of cheap port with a shout: "Shshnsgn! Valinakh Reseige, kutakpas! Kazakstan is for Kazaktars! I noticed you, such a shoshka, back in 1986 near the school! Bey Orysov, save Zhetysu! " And you, overwhelmed by fear, holding in your hands a hastily assembled suitcase with simple belongings, at night crossed the Kazakh-Russian border. And there you were caught by the same vicious aul mambets (but in the uniform of customs officers and border guards) and with similar shouts they took away the last panties and a toothbrush ...
            But no! Enough for the house even ... Fiii, you are some kind of inconsistent refugee. You all have an uninteresting aktaban shubyryndy of some kind. There is not enough drama. In addition to a crooked grin, nothing arises from your whiny stories. Take lessons from the Russians who cannot even find KZ on the world map. Here they write with anguish: "They slaughtered Russians, raped furniture, drank the blood of kittens of 5-year-old Masha Petrova, fired them from work, deprived of salaries, took away toys, dressed up in leather suits and lashed lonely Russian passers-by in the streets ...". Learn, Vasilenko!
        2. foxxi
          foxxi 31 March 2014 14: 19
          +1
          Quote: Alibekulu
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          I have seen and very much both in everyday life and in state. level
          Comrades, let's impose a matrix of "oppression", for example, Vasilenko in the Republic of Kazakhstan and the Russian Federation ?! wink
          I) In Kazakhstan, Vasilenko lived in the "southern capital" in Almaty
          In Russia, he lives in the wilderness of the Kaliningrad region ..
          II) In Kazakhstan, Almaty, Uncle Vova lived in the center of the metropolis in a comfortable apartment .. good
          In the Russian Federation lives on in a ground house, where all the amenities were on the street .. fellow
          III) Vasilenko worked in a prestigious, highly paid position in Kazakhstan ..
          In the backwoods of the Kaliningrad province, he breeds goats because of despairing belay I note, not cattle even ...
          P.S. So ask yourself a simple question, so where was he really "oppressed" ?! request
          In Kazakhstan, the evil Kazakhs, or in a ridiculous eReFII ?!
          here ... it’s correctly noticed ... and in general - where I was born there and came in handy ... nefig goats where I can’t breed right now ... the trouble is different, we’ve got a lot of idiots per square meter ... and some smart ones are in a panic escaped ...
    4. Scandinavian
      Scandinavian 31 March 2014 09: 13
      +1
      Sarmatian KZ Today, 08: 27

      Gentlemen, chauvinists, to your note, from Kazakhstan left for permanent residence for 20 over 4.5 million Slavs and 2.5 million returned back, I think if the Slavic people were oppressed here, they would not have returned. Speaking about the territories of the Saratov Region, Altai Territory, Omsk Region, Astrakhan were originally Kazakh lands, we do not pretend to these territories, and Northern Kazakhstan was and will remain ours, since not only Slavic people were not oppressed and will not oppress any people. Before writing chauvinistic dregs, think about it. Those who write nonsense I think are not completely friends with the head. Analyze, then say otherwise the Westerners are not asleep and will use you as chauvinists. How many I live I have not seen oppression and I do not advise you to write all this crap if you do not live in Kazakhstan. Kazakhs are not close to us, not the Chinese, and especially the Americans, the latter apparently work well together with the Russian chauvinists, so good gentlemen, be peaceable WE ARE BORN IN THE USSR !!!!


      Sarmat, first read what chauvinism is ... literate ....

      Chauvinism (fr. Chauvinisme) is an ideology, the essence of which is to preach national superiority in order to justify the right to discrimination and oppression of other peoples.
      1. foxxi
        foxxi 31 March 2014 10: 59
        +1
        chauvinism is ... there is a direct glimpse of superiority ...
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 12: 57
          0
          Quote: foxxi
          here excels directly

          let’s with examples
    5. Burmistr
      Burmistr 31 March 2014 10: 23
      -1
      Saratov Region, Altai Territory, Omsk Region, Astrakhan were originally Kazakh lands


      Apparently you were brainwashed "correctly" there too.
      1. Sarmatian
        Sarmatian April 1 2014 16: 39
        +5
        Dear Burmister! They do not wash their brains there, perhaps they have gone too far with history, but in general, the story that these regions were Kazakh is undeniable. What happened, you won’t return, it’s history and you need to live in peace and harmony looking to the future. For me, this is part of the story and that's it! But I advise you to study history. S.U Sarmat
        1. Setrac
          Setrac April 1 2014 16: 57
          -2
          Quote: Sarmatian
          They do not wash their brains there, perhaps they have gone too far with history, but in general, the story that these regions were Kazakh is undeniable.

          There is such a science - archeology, which says that Kazakhs (and others not Indo-Aryans) came here in the middle of the first millennium. And before that, there lived people with Indo-Aryan genetics, identical in Russian genes.
          1. Guard
            Guard April 1 2014 19: 16
            +3
            Quote: Setrac
            There is such a science - archeology, which says that Kazakhs (and others not Indo-Aryans) came here in the middle of the first millennium. And before that, there lived people with Indo-Aryan genetics, identical in Russian genes.

            You would read archeology materials to the end. Maybe then he would have understood that the ancestors of the Slavs appeared on the territory of the conditional "Soviet Union", at best - in the 6th century AD, when the Germans drove the Slavs to the east. Even in Soviet times, no matter how much the main ideologist of "Russian history" academician Rybakov was puffed up, they could not bring the scientific basis to the theory that the Slavs were autochthonous inhabitants of the "Soviet" land.

            The Indo-Aryans of Eurasia have the same attitude to the Slavs as the Papuan to the Spaniards. The Scythians spoke Iranian and led a nomadic lifestyle (with the exception of a small group of "ploughmen"). After the invasion of the Turkic-speaking tribes, the Scythians were assimilated by the Mongoloids, as a result of which the so-called. "Turanian" (South Siberian) race, which is transitional from Mongoloid to Caucasoid. It is to this race that the Turks, Kazakhs, Tatars, Uzbeks, Uighurs and others belong. When the Slavs appeared on the territory of the future Ukraine, nothing remained of the Scythians. On the territory of the USSR, the Slavs encountered the Turks, Germans, Greeks, Alans and numerous "mestizo" peoples, and later with the Finno-Ugric peoples.
            Even an Afghan Pashtun has more rights to the "Scythian" inheritance than a Russian or a Belarusian.

            ZY And if you nevertheless begin to carefully read the serious literature on archeology, you will see that a smooth transition / cross-breeding took place in the Steppe - the Caucasian skulls gradually acquired Mongoloid features. Any archaeologist will confirm to you that Kazakhs are direct descendants of Indo-Iranian inhabitants of the Eurasian steppes. Simply mixed with Mongoloid nomads, as a result of which the "Mongoloid" type of face won. But until now, the average "Kazakh" skull is one third Caucasian. Ever wondered why Kazakhs and Koreans look so different from each other? Although they both formally belong to the same race.
            1. Setrac
              Setrac April 1 2014 20: 52
              0
              Quote: Guard
              Maybe then I would have understood that the ancestors of the Slavs appeared on the territory of the conditional "Soviet Union", at best - in the 6th century AD, when the Germans drove the Slavs to the east.

              Paleogenetics suggests otherwise. In Siberia, Altai and Taimyr, and even in the Far East, auto-Khonts - Slavs (Indo-Europeans), Mongoloids came to the north of Eurasia at the beginning - the middle of the first millennium AD. Dig out settlements that are older than the Egyptian pyramids.
              Quote: Guard
              Even in Soviet times, no matter how much the main ideologist of "Russian history" academician Rybakov was puffed up, they could not bring the scientific basis to the theory that the Slavs were autochthonous inhabitants of the "Soviet" land.

              Nobody puffed up, the Communists did not like Russians, when the republics were formed, the Russian people were cut as they say alive. The entire Russian history that we know was written by the Communists. They, the Communists, for example, did not consider it necessary to correct all the shit that they wrote about Russian Germans.
              Quote: Guard
              Any archaeologist will confirm to you that the Kazakhs are direct descendants of the Indo-Iranian inhabitants of the Eurasian steppes.

              Kazakhs have too pronounced Mongoloid features, the only question is in what percentages.
              Quote: Guard
              Even an Afghan Pashtun has more rights to the "Scythian" inheritance than a Russian or a Belarusian.

              You think about something else, once ALL peoples were nomadic breeders, and only then some developed to farmers, at one time the Slavs (their ancestors) were also nomads.
              There are works by geneticists, which say in what nations how many percent of Indo-Aryan blood. The highest percentage of Russians.

              I would like to draw your attention to the idea that I praise my beloved, but it’s not so, I have too much Armenian and Turkish blood, but my children will be more Russian than me.
  • Sosed_26
    Sosed_26 31 March 2014 08: 37
    +1
    Kazakhstan is divided into 3 parts, or rather into 3 clans (Senior Zhuz, Middle Zhuz, Younger Zhuz) So the North is the younger Zhuz. And I doubt that the South is the elder Zhuz will agree to move to the North without financial assistance from the state. And the Southern Kazakhs They do not particularly like the North because they do not know their native language well. The Kazakh language even has differences between the north and the south. Kazakhstan already had a similar project when "Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, etc." were already resettled from other Asian countries. So these settlers spent everything the money allocated by the state ate up all the cattle and returned.
    1. foxxi
      foxxi 31 March 2014 11: 00
      +1
      North and center is middle ... junior is not north.
      1. Guard
        Guard April 1 2014 00: 14
        +3
        Quote: foxxi
        North and center is middle ... junior is not north.

        Don't bother him, fellow countryman. Do not you see what - the "great expert on Kazakhstan" is reasoning.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  • Flipman
    Flipman 31 March 2014 08: 56
    +5
    the article is very controversial! in Almaty, the Russians feel wonderful, the only thing is that they are trying to drive a wedge for a little bit! though the Kazakhs themselves are severely punishing them!
    Sarmat, here you started about the territory and it’s wrong! In America, when democracy was built, the indigenous population was almost cut out, the Russians defended against the Chinese from the Dzungars, they enlightened, for example, the Kazakh alphabet is built on the basis of the Russian and now they want to switch to Latin, but the most terrible pearl is renaming Kazakhstan =) and the city well, why is it necessary, the streets too! and the main question is the most important, do they deny everything Soviet or Russian?
  • saag
    saag 31 March 2014 09: 04
    +2
    Quote: Sosed_26
    So North is the junior zhuz

    west however ...
  • Cossacks
    Cossacks 31 March 2014 09: 05
    +4
    I read smart reasoning. The number of Russians from 91 was halved. It was 6 million, it became 3. Arithmetic speaks for itself. Maybe someone remembers the events in the early 90's. and how the Kremlin reacted. here in fact an exhaustive answer to the questions of the article.
  • Aldo
    Aldo 31 March 2014 09: 07
    +3
    The article is sucked from the finger. the argument is a statement by the senator and not decisions or policy documents.
  • Kyrgyz
    Kyrgyz 31 March 2014 09: 17
    +5
    I don’t know how to resettle 300 thousand people in a poor country with a low population density, Nazarbayev is certainly respected but not Stalin, and frankly speaking, the reasons are vague, in general the plans given in the article are just a good recipe to sow discord and destroy the state, without solving any problems at all. Following the logic of the authors of the resettlement plan, it’s better to shoot yourself immediately, because in the end you’ll die one day anyway laughing
    If we talk about past borders, then as if Ulan Bator did not have to give everything laughing
    I communicate with the Kazakhs, the border is near, nationalism somehow does not really bother them, but the lack of dough is annoying, I must say in this they are not original.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 31 March 2014 13: 11
      +3
      The business of the state is to regulate the internal migration of the population from south to north from aul to a city, and money can be spent on this, the main obstacle is how to do this with the least possible losses for the migrants and for the entire Republic of Kazakhstan. And the process itself is still spontaneously so the state needs to regulate it, help and interest so that "shanyraks" do not arise.
  • Goodmen
    Goodmen 31 March 2014 09: 19
    +2
    Quote: mak210
    We must take an example from the Crimean Tatars: cultural autonomy,% representation in government, Russian - the state language.


    About Crimean Tatars:

    "The kurultai of the Crimean Tatar people held in Bakhchisarai on Saturday decided to start the creation of a national-territorial autonomy in Crimea, according to a resolution adopted at an extraordinary session of the kurultai, the body of the people's representation. BBCRussian.com"

    "The decree says" about the beginning of political and legal procedures for the creation of national and territorial autonomy "of the Crimean Tatars on their historical territory - in Crimea. Interfax - Russia"

    I believe that the above is very important and relevant at the moment.
    How could we not get another Kosovo in Crimea ... I understand that the Tatars in Crimea have lived for centuries ... BUT! it was not necessary constantly g.a.di.t Russia !!!
    And now we are going to a surprise in the form of the Crimean Tatar time bomb lay ...

    Yes, inappropriately we should flirt with anyone, please, rehabilitate ... all the peoples of the Russian Federation should have the same rights, and all peoples together create a single state!
    And whoever doesn’t like ... whoever doesn’t understand well ... the special services should work well here, because without leaders and ideological inspirers, unrest does not happen ...
    (as for the "annexation" of Crimea, it cannot be compared with Kosovo, because we returned ours. And in Kosovo, the Albanians took the land from the Serbs ... uro ...)
    1. Day 11
      Day 11 31 March 2014 09: 59
      +2
      The old man, I absolutely agree with you! The autonomy of the Crimean Tatars is a time bomb. Some people mistakenly compare them with our native Kazan Tatars --- I dare to assure you (since I became related to them) these are ABSOLUTELY different nationalities!
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. atalef
        atalef 31 March 2014 13: 32
        +1
        Quote: Den 11
        Old man, I absolutely agree with you! Autonomy of the Crimean Tatars is a time bomb

        Denis, but without autonomy - this is a bomb without slowdown.
        Do you doubt that they will settle for less than autonomy?
        By the way, according to the constitution of the Russian Federation, they have the right to do so.
        Now, something else excites me — my mother-in-law’s neighbor (mother-in-law in Kiev), has an apartment in Yalta — inherited from her parents (by the way WWII veterans), they certainly privatized her and came to rest there every year, 3 days ago they received an official letter - or take Russian citizenship, or the apartment is confiscated. (by the way S. Rotaru wrote about the same problem) - how do you like it?
        What are people to blame for? And who is privatizing these apartments?
        What do they have the right to do, private property is how?
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 13: 51
          0
          Quote: atalef
          days ago they received an official letter - either take Russian citizenship, or the apartment is confiscated.

          a letter from whom? !!
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. atalef
            atalef 31 March 2014 15: 25
            +2
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            a letter from whom? !!

            As I understand it from the Crimean authorities, but in general I can clarify
            In general, some kind of nonsense is to deprive people of property, why
            My wife and daughter Sonya and I have been living in Kiev for a long time. And Sofia Mikhailovna, although she is constantly on the road, loves to be at home more in Yalta. I am Ukrainian and will not change my citizenship. I don’t feel Russian, ”said Rotaru’s son.

            Sofia Mikhailovna, too, according to Ruslan, does not plan to change citizenship.

            "If the situation gets complicated, we will issue a residence permit. But now there is a complete mess with the documents. There is only a clear mechanism for issuing Russian passports, but there is no mechanism for refusing them. In fact, there is only one option - to leave Crimea," he said.

            "But real estate, it is real estate, which, unfortunately, cannot be destroyed. Moreover, the house in which I grew up, in which I spent the best years, we will never sell. And no matter what territory it appears in tomorrow, this is my home. All that remains is how to cut off your hand! "Ruslan was indignant.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 31 March 2014 15: 42
              +1
              Quote: atalef
              As I understand it from the Crimean authorities, but in general I can clarify
              In general, some kind of nonsense is to deprive people of property, why

              enough fools I won’t be surprised if the letter to the leadership of the Crimea is not by any means.
              nationalization of private property of individuals was not announced, another question is that re-registration should occur
    2. Burmistr
      Burmistr 31 March 2014 10: 36
      +1
      It would be necessary to give them this autonomy, and take taxes as from the rest. Very quickly they themselves will refuse it. Yes, it seems to me that only a small handful of paid morons can claim this.
      They talked about how these devils live there. This is not even the Middle Ages. For the so-called Crimean Tatars, a very sharp increase in living standards awaits after the peninsula became part of Russia. Whoever opposes this is either a complete fool or a paid traitor.
      In general, the new generation grew up on the idea of ​​"sell everything", they were taught that the main thing is money. So, from here comes the fifth column - a normal, civilized objective reality.
  • Aldo
    Aldo 31 March 2014 09: 21
    +3
    And the card is left.
    There is a minority of Kazakhs only in Ust-Kamenogorsk, Kostanay, Rudny, Lisokovsk, Pavlodar and Petropavlovsk, and in only a few districts of North Kazakhstan and East Kazakhstan oblasts. And in all other areas more than 50%.
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 31 March 2014 12: 04
      +1
      To the mouth of Kamenogorsk ???)))) There are few Kazakhs?)) Haha Naimanyans are Russians))) that’s scream))) 50:50 in Ustkamenka, I knew! in Kostanay 30:70 in Rudny 40:60 in the other cities you were not overpowered. By the way, in the north, almost all Kazakhs are all for an alliance with Russia, in the south and in the center there are most of them, but in the west they are a minority, so think before writing such articles ...
  • EvilLion
    EvilLion 31 March 2014 09: 30
    -8
    The work that the Soviet collective farm performed while losing health, thousands of people, today are able to perform hundreds, if not dozens of trained specialists on modern "smart" machines.


    The level of equipment in Russia is about 4 times less than in the USSR with the same performance. So thousands of people on collective farms did not hunch over in sweat, but only drank and ruined the equipment made in the cities, which under Stalin was very justified, they were afraid to give in to their hands and concentrated in the MTS. But then there was Khrushchev, after him there was not only Crimea and confidence in the Soviet system in the world, but also MTS.

    With Kazakhstan, the issue needs to be resolved unambiguously, we now do not care for what reasons the Kazakh SSR was created, if we could not have created and would not have such a state now. Came out of the Union - return what he gave you. I do not see any reason to consider the Kazakhs as any friendly people; they, like other Central Asians, do not like Russians pathologically, and if so, let them live separately. It’s just that their leadership turned out to be at least a little smarter than the others and in Kazakhstan the state, as such, has been preserved.
    1. washi
      washi 31 March 2014 11: 59
      +9
      Quote: EvilLion
      Left the Union - return what he gave you

      The Kazakh SSR did not leave the union. The Russian Federation, Ukraine and Belarus came out
      1. foxxi
        foxxi 31 March 2014 14: 23
        +4
        absolutely right...
    2. Serg65
      Serg65 31 March 2014 13: 29
      +7
      [quote = EvilLion] [quote] [quote] [/ quote]

      The level of equipment in Russia is about 4 times less than in the USSR with the same performance. So thousands of people on collective farms did not hunch over in sweat, but only drank and ruined the equipment made in the cities, which under Stalin was very justified, they were afraid to give in to their hands and concentrated in the MTS. But then there was Khrushchev, after him there was not only Crimea and confidence in the Soviet system in the world, but also MTS.

      With Kazakhstan, the issue needs to be resolved unambiguously, we now do not care for what reasons the Kazakh SSR was created, if we could not have created and would not have such a state now. Came out of the Union - return what he gave you. I do not see any reason to consider the Kazakhs as any friendly people; they, like other Central Asians, do not like Russians pathologically, and if so, let them live separately. It’s just that their leadership turned out to be at least a little smarter than the others, and the state, as such, remained in Kazakhstan. [/ Quote]

      My dear, did you live under Stalin? Have an idea about the principle of MTS? Worked on a collective farm? How long has it been unhooked from my mother’s skirt that I have the right to talk about Stalin, collective farmers and the friendship of peoples? fool
      1. EvilLion
        EvilLion 31 March 2014 13: 48
        -7
        The friendship of peoples we have seen throughout the post-Soviet space.

        I also know how the MTS worked, the collective farm paid them for services, and they took care of the equipment. So shove your "adulthood" at me here do not show off.
        1. Serg65
          Serg65 31 March 2014 14: 56
          +12
          What did you saw??? Have you seen how Kazakh, Uzbek, Kyrgyz large families took half-dead Leningrad children under their shelter? Have you seen how Kazakh and Kyrgyz boys of 18 years, not understanding the Russian language, climbed tanks near Moscow? Have you seen how children, without asking for nationality, bathed in irrigation ditches and rode on pussies? What have you ever seen in this life besides your show-offs?
  • Humpty
    Humpty 31 March 2014 09: 34
    +2
    [quote = Serg65]

    "I agree with you completely! The article, from my point of view, is delusional and provocative."

    Hello, hello. If the article is a continuous publication, then tell me how to relate to the current names of the nearest villages located next to us across the river from us? Kaynar, Betkaynar, Korday, Karasu. Or maybe Blagoveshchenka, Uspenovka, Georgievka, Black River.
    1. Serg65
      Serg65 31 March 2014 10: 07
      +9
      Hello, Alexander. Do you, as a cartographer, not know that this is a recognized world practice? After all, we say Kaliningrad, not Konigsberg, Sevastopol, not Akhtiar, Tallinn, not Revel, Helsenki, not Helsingfors, Sokuluk, not Novo-Troitsk. How to relate? To be calm, these are realities; you cannot enter the same water twice. True or false, but new states appeared on the territory of the former USSR and this is a fait accompli.
      1. Semurg
        Semurg 31 March 2014 12: 54
        +6
        Quote: Serg65
        Hello, Alexander. Do you, as a cartographer, not know that this is a recognized world practice? After all, we say Kaliningrad, not Konigsberg, Sevastopol, not Akhtiar, Tallinn, not Revel, Helsenki, not Helsingfors, Sokuluk, not Novo-Troitsk. How to relate? To be calm, these are realities; you cannot enter the same water twice. True or false, but new states appeared on the territory of the former USSR and this is a fait accompli.

        I read the entire thread. It's good that there are Russians like you, otherwise it would be completely sad if only "guardians of the Russian land" were unsubscribed. To be honest, there is much that is not arranged and destroyed in the Republic of Kazakhstan, and in the Russian Federation is no less than ours, but any action of the Republic of Kazakhstan - the settlement of the north by Kazakhs, the purchase of weapons not from the Russian Federation, the construction of a pipe to China, the conduct of exercises and training of our military in the United States cause a storm of negativity with reproaches in nationalism and threats to begin to defend compatriots and to squeeze the primordially Russian lands. Sometimes it's sad, sometimes funny, as the Kazakh proverb says "a bad mother threatens to die, a bad wife threatens to leave," but both of them do not do it realizing that they are not bad here globally, and their threats and shouts are blackmail and show-off.
        1. Serg65
          Serg65 31 March 2014 14: 07
          +11
          Dear Salmur. Unlike many "heroes" who write here, I am no longer 20 and unfortunately not even 40 years old. I saw the dawn, sunset and death of a Great Power. The same external and internal forces that destroyed my country are trying to prevent its revival. But it will be reborn, although not in its former form, but it will be a Strong Union. Many young people in Russia and Kazakhstan, without realizing it, are playing into the hands of these forces. Look how cunning people from over the hill skillfully beat the situation in the Crimea! This article immediately appears, and under the guise of raising patriotism in Russia, the heartbreaking cry "atuuu, Russians are being beaten !!" At the same time, many who do not even have a clue about the life of Russians in these parts, pick up this cry, begin to weave historical fables and draw hasty conclusions. All this is sad!
          1. Semurg
            Semurg 31 March 2014 14: 38
            +7
            You know, I have a fellow countryman at VO Andrey KZ when he writes that in our south Russian users accuse him of betrayal more or less in interethnic relations. And he lives in the south where the most rampant Kazakh nationalism should be. You are for the revival of the union, I am cool about this idea, but it doesn’t stop being people, and it’s not related to age. Kazakhs say that the wise person is not the one who lived for a long time, but the one who saw a lot. In my garden, the apricot blossomed, spring has come, do not grieve and peace to your house.
            1. Serg65
              Serg65 31 March 2014 15: 13
              +9
              good Thank you dear, God bless the prosperity of your home!
            2. Natrix
              Natrix April 6 2014 21: 27
              +1
              And we have not yet bloomed peaches. Cottage in the foothills of Almaty. love
          2. Guard
            Guard April 1 2014 19: 28
            +4
            Quote: Serg65
            Unlike many "heroes" who write here, I am no longer 20 and unfortunately not even 40 years old.

            Live long! I sincerely wish you to maintain good health, a sharp mind and a good mood.
            There would be more "Central Asian Russians" like you, and then we would not even have a hint of any interethnic tensions. You yourself know that we have a mentality as simple as five cents - we do not put ourselves above others, but we cannot stand it when someone tries to put themselves above us. Even if he tries to do it, patting him condescendingly on the shoulder. One desire arises - to hit in the face.
            As a gritsa "Do not humiliate yourself before the khan - he is not Allah, do not humiliate the poor man - he is not your slave."
            Once again, all the best to you!
            1. Serg65
              Serg65 April 2 2014 13: 58
              +6
              Dear Karauyl, I grew up among the Kyrgyz, Kazakhs, Turks, Uighurs, Koreans, Germans, what kind of interethnic tensions can there be in such an environment? I do not argue that life is not without freaks, but in any nation they are present. My neighbors always congratulate me on Easter, Christmas and I say to them on Kurmanayt "Alah is risen". People should respect each other and live their lives so that at the end of their journey they would not be ashamed of their deeds. The fate was such that our country was cut alive and how long would it take for these wounds to heal? I want to address both the Russians and the Kazakhs, you shouldn't throw feces at each other, remember how much good and good it was between us !!!!
            2. Natrix
              Natrix April 6 2014 21: 50
              +3
              good I am Russian and Kazakhstan. I believe that the majority of Kazakhs are very wise and hospitable people, like Russians. They are greatly helped in this by respecting tribal customs deeply rooted in the national mentality and, in particular, respect for elders, knowledge of their place in the tribal hierarchy, which is a strong stabilizing factor. Nationalism, by and large, is not a national concept, but a social and cultural one.
          3. Rinat 1
            Rinat 1 April 3 2014 15: 13
            +1
            Serg65 reading the comments of our allies, I wonder, are they really allies to us? Thank you for having people like you who are telling the truth.
  • nnnnnn
    nnnnnn 31 March 2014 09: 37
    +7
    The article is a compote, people who think will understand that in the voice of the clown Zhirinovsky, nat-bol fagot Limonov, director Sokurov, statements were made to check whether the next country of Russia's neighbor could be ruined, the world turned upside down, three Jews turned out to be patriots and thought about the fate of Russians in another country, it's nothing to you does not remind? By the way an interesting fact against your Zhirik there are no sanctions?
  • T80UM1
    T80UM1 31 March 2014 09: 39
    +6
    Gentlemen. Comrades as you please, the article is nonsense! I speak as a representative of nat minorities in Kazakhstan.
    1. TS3sta3
      TS3sta3 31 March 2014 10: 06
      0
      Quote: T80UM1
      Gentlemen. Comrades as you please, the article is nonsense! I speak as a representative of nat minorities in Kazakhstan.

      A national minority, or ethnic minority, are representatives of an ethnic group living in the territory of a state, its citizens, but not belonging to the indigenous nationality and who are aware of themselves as a national community.
      Russians in Kazakhstan are indigenous, not national minorities.
      1. T80UM1
        T80UM1 31 March 2014 11: 33
        +2
        I am not russian.
        1. TS3sta3
          TS3sta3 31 March 2014 11: 42
          +2
          were you born here or migrated here?
          root - the one who was born here, and not moved; who all relatives live here. but someone does not like it.
          1. T80UM1
            T80UM1 31 March 2014 12: 06
            +6
            I was born here, but my ancestors were exiled here, and I am grateful to the Kazakhs for their attitude. But I'm not an indigenous people
            1. Semurg
              Semurg 31 March 2014 12: 15
              +4
              Quote: T80UM1
              I was born here, but my ancestors were exiled here, and I am grateful to the Kazakhs for their attitude. But I'm not an indigenous people

              Here is my house. Here I was born. Here the living water got drunk. So they sing JSC and in simple words without slogans explain what is homeland.
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. TS3sta3
              TS3sta3 31 March 2014 12: 24
              +4
              As you wish.
              and I am the root and this is my land.
              1. Guard
                Guard 31 March 2014 23: 42
                +9
                Quote: TS3sta3
                and I am the root and this is my land.

                Pretty boy!
                You can be Ivanov, Schneider or Tskhai, and at the same time be a 100% indigenous resident of Kazakhstan, which no bulldozer can move. Such people inspire respect from me. And I’ll give it directly to that Kazakh who will say that this Ivanov supposedly has less rights to this land than the representative of such and such a zhuz.
                In the end, the Kazakhs are in itself a mixture of different peoples, which this land has united. Who says this process has stopped? laughing If you think that this is your land, and it is saturated with your sweat and blood, then this is your land.
                1. foxxi
                  foxxi April 1 2014 07: 08
                  +4
                  and I also think so! lived in a village that in 2009 celebrated the 120th anniversary of its founding, in fact migrants according to the Stolypin reform ... and now, consider them stupid occupiers, they have already absorbed into this steppe, here are the graves of their ancestors, grandfathers and fathers were friends, sons, now grandchildren ... it happened of course and muttered at each other, but at the household level and then they felt shame for their words and thoughts .. because everyone has the same life and the joys and troubles are the same for everyone. ..and who didn’t get comfortable, who bought with the virgin money or didn’t yet grow to this land and people, he left ... not regretting.