Military Review

I offer "Karagach"

82



In the conditions of possession of the key powers of nuclear weapons the likelihood of the emergence and development of a global conflict with the use of weapons of mass destruction is impossible. Rather, it is unlikely. That, in turn, does not exclude the development of small and local conflicts of low intensity, the characteristic signs of which will be and are fighting various military gangs, private, terrorist, including illegally formed states on different ideological or financial platforms. This type of combat is a type of war where the active role will mainly belong to dispersed combat formations (tactics “hit-hid”, organization of ambushes, shelling of posts, military convoys, terrorist attacks, civilian terror, forest and especially in urban environments with the use of portable small weapons of war: machine guns, machine guns, RPGs, ATGM, MANPADS and small equipment).

The logical question is: how to most effectively conduct military operations with such an enemy in the given conditions? We immediately mention that the answer to this question can only be complex, including a combination of economic, political and military means. The most important from this list seems to be the military, the so-called “last” argument, which includes the use of various reconnaissance, UAV, spacecraft, and strike aviation, helicopters, artillery, MLRS and WTO. And, of course, ground army units, including special ones, as direct participants in the conflict, which bear the brunt of the tasks of fighting, cleaning up territories and protecting them. Since the enemy’s actions will be of a hidden and not always definite nature, combat units must be highly mobile and responsive to counter them.

What mobile military means do troops possess today? These are mainly light armored cars, armored personnel carriers, infantry fighting vehicles, or Tanks. Summarizing the experience of the combat use of such equipment, I believe that it is not always effective, and sometimes does not meet the requirements in such specific conflicts. For example, armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles have poor protection and are easily affected by portable grenade launchers, have low resistance to undermining on mines, and have insufficient means of observation and defense. Tanks, in turn, have much better protection characteristics, have the ability to use mine trawls, but here again, there is a problem with weapons, since the 125-mm gun is redundant, and the machine gun is insufficient. True, there is another option for using a new class of armored vehicles such as BMPT. With it, part of the problems of use in these conditions has already been solved, in particular, problems with weapons. This type of combat vehicle came closest to the issue of effective use in carrying out such tasks and has a variety of weapons and surveillance systems. But is that enough? As I see it, no, and the problem, obviously, is that such a machine alone will not be able to conduct combat operations in isolation from other units - due to the insufficiency and limited detection facilities.

Against the background of these calculations and reflections, I put the question: what type of armored vehicles would be most suitable for performing the higher tasks and would be the most effective in combat? So to say, I decided to fantasize a little on the topic and create a kind of concept for a new combat vehicle meeting this requirement, and try to draw its appearance.

First of all, it was necessary to determine the properties that are most important for the performance of these tasks in the form of questions, the answers to which are the solution.
1. Low cost, i.e. on the basis of existing machines.
2. Maximum firepower.
3. The presence of various weapons systems.
4. Simultaneous use of weapons.
5. High level of automation.
6. Multi-channel observation, guidance.
7. Multichannel shooting.
8. Versatility.
9. Security

The first point implies that I propose to create not just a new car, but to modernize the existing, the most common cars. Since security is indicated in paragraph 9, naturally, we will choose from tanks, and which tank today is one of the best and most popular, initially meeting our requirements, including the price? Of course, talking about the T-72. The decision to use it for these purposes, of course, repeats the decision taken in the design and creation of the Terminator BMPT, and since its creators are pioneers in this matter, we will call the variant I propose also T-72, BMPT, but under the name "Karagach"! So, with our choice of tank, we actually answered two questions: requirements are price and security.

We continue. Next, you will have to turn on your imagination, since I don’t have a photo or a picture of such a non-existent machine yet.

Let's start with the main thing - with weapons and its deployment.

Gun GSH-30-1 - 2 pcs.
PKT 7,62 mm machine gun - 1 pcs.

First you need to dismantle the 125-mm cannon and loading mechanisms from the turret of the tank. Instead of a cannon, of course, a corresponding alteration is required, it is necessary to install two automatic cannon GSH-30-1 and a PKT machine gun paired with them. The twin guns must have a vertical pointing angle of at least 60 degrees, in the horizontal plane approximately 45 degrees relative to a fixed turret. Must be stabilized in two control planes by means of electric servomotors.

Machine gun 12,7 mm "Kord" - 2 pcs.
AGS-17 grenade launcher — 2 pcs.

It is necessary to create two circular rotating guides and place them on the tower in the place of the commander’s and gunner’s hatches so that the hatch is inside the guide.

Two large-caliber machine guns are mounted on the edge of the guide, strictly in the center of the axis above the hatches of the commander and the gunner, and installing two grenade launchers on the same guide on the sides closer to the edges of the tower, and above the hatch of the commander and gunner on the guide, we get a paired installation. Both the machine gun and the grenade launcher must be removable. For protection, but not around the circle, you must install armor in the form of plates. The vertical guidance angle is also 60 degrees, in horizontal 300 degrees relative to a fixed tower. They should also be stabilized in two planes, but the electric actuators of vertical alignment should be: for the AGS - its own, for the machine gun - also its own. This is necessary in order to compensate for aiming and pointing at one point the difference in the flight path of the projectiles.

Mortar 80 mm - 1 pcs.

Mortar set inside the tower along the longitudinal center closer to the rear, between the operators of weapons in the tower, by hanging it on a hinge in the turret neckline. The mortar, of course, should be not quite normal, but automatic, with bureaucratic charging and a revolver drum for ten shots. The mortar must be stabilized in a vertical plane. Must be closed with a soundproof cover and have an air broach for cooling the barrel. On the roof of the tower on the mortar barrel should be installed silencer.

ATGM "Cornet" - 6 pcs.
PZRK Needle - 2 pcs.

To install rocket armament, you will need to weld an additional armored compartment of two spaced-up metal sheets 10 mm in thickness to the rear of the turret above the engine compartment, in which anti-tank missiles and anti-aircraft missiles will be placed across the tank. In the middle of the compartment should be mounted folding retractable launch strut for Chrysanthemum-type missiles, for example, two missiles, one ATGM and one MANPADS, anti-tank missile guidance devices should be placed between the missiles on the racks. The rack must rotate 360 degrees and be stabilized. It should also provide for an automatic missile reloading system. The mass of the additional compartment for rocket armament will lead to an imbalance of the tower, so it will be necessary to cut off part of the armor behind the tower and, possibly, add additional armor to the tower’s front.

Control. The 4 man, driver and weapon operators must control the combat vehicle. The driver is at his regular place, and next to him is one of the operators of the twin-gun guns GSH-30-1. The other two should be at the bottom, in a rotating turret, on the sides of the built-in mortar. Guidance, observation and aiming should be three independent stations, one between the barrels of the GSH-30-1 over WLD, the other two stations in the small turrets between the barrels of the paired machine gun and the grenade launcher. The stations themselves should have thermal imagers and cameras, etc. In addition, there should be one independent optical station with a circular view, with two channels per 180 degrees each, which should rotate continuously.

Arms control has three options: manual, semi-automatic and automatic.

1. Manual control involves the direct mechanical guidance of the weapon. Shooting is carried out using periscopic devices, this is not the main method, but an emergency or auxiliary one.

2. Semi-automatic mode. Weapon control operators must have two television screens and two control arms. One individual screen displays from the surveillance video cameras the sector of the battlefield of this weapon, range and other information about the targets, type, properties, danger, etc., the second monitor displays the graphical situation 360 degrees around the combat vehicle indicating sectors of shelling of all weapons and general information about the objectives, including the interactions with other similar machines. Arms control joysticks should be similar to aviation ones and should be on armrests. The armrests should have cushioning to compensate for the oscillations of the shooter when the car is moving and to fix the arms for a stable joystick control. The right joystick should be responsible for pointing the weapon horizontally and vertically, and buttons for choosing the type of weapon. For the operator, the first channel is from twin guns of the GSH-30-1, PKT, mortar, anti-tank systems, or MANPADS. For operators, the second and third channels, respectively, are either a machine gun, or a grenade launcher and anti-tank missile systems or MANPADS. In the semi-automatic mode, each operator himself directly observes on the individual monitor the battlefield, determines the targets, performs pointing of weapons and shooting with the help of the joystick.

3. In the automatic mode, each individual station and a circular review station themselves conduct observations and target recognition, issue target designations, determine the scale of the threat, the priority of destruction, the type of weapon and ammunition used, and make a tip. The operator, controlling the right joystick, moving the cursor on the main monitor screen, zooming in or out, switching between observation modes and controlling the machine’s computer in this way, monitor the operation of the weapon, recognize targets, approve and give permissions to destroy, including by watching for the process of quality of perfect work, defeat goals.

A combat vehicle must be equipped with powerful computer computing equipment, including communications and communications equipment for interaction in a group and with other types of military units, means of attachment protection and the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

Tactics and combat use. Combat use of this machine should not be limited. Such a machine should be the main ground-based means of warfare on the battlefield - both local and large-scale. Having three main channels of observation and firing, the combat vehicle can project fire in different directions or concentrate fire power in one direction. Such a machine should press the BTR and the BMP from the front line of the battlefield and, together with the tanks, should be the main means of solving combat tasks in the fight against the enemy, be at the point of the attacking or defending wedges. It is worth considering that at the present stage of development of military equipment and a wide range of weapons, for example, the probability of large-scale oncoming tank battles is unlikely. In turn, the variety of means used in conflict in the first place and will require the universality of the means of counteraction. Here we will need a machine that solves a wide range of tasks for the destruction of various enemy vehicles, from hidden personnel in the trenches or behind shelters to helicopters, airplanes and enemy armored vehicles. And finally, the most fully possible to use its combat potential when used for such local tasks as guarding and wiring columns, conducting combat operations in the mountains, forests, settlements and on city streets, to support assault units. Blocking around the perimeter of the outbreaks of hostilities, patrolling, duty and protecting borders, organizing ambushes and roadblocks, etc. Both the plane dominates the sky and Karagach should dominate the earth.

Of course, the implementation of this concept has a lot of technical issues, this is the placement of ammunition for grenade launchers and machine guns inside the tower and supplying them with weapons, this is the placement of a mortar. Synchronization of the moments of rotation of weapons, blocking and priority at the intersection of courses of fire, these and many other technical problems require solutions, but, I think, all this can be overcome. This idea is offered to respected forum users to discuss issues related to the need for such a machine and to determine the technical feasibility of such an upgrade option.

PS Karagach is a branchy and unpretentious ebony.
Author:
82 comments
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  1. delfinN
    delfinN 15 February 2014 08: 07
    +53
    Similar options have already been offered.
    1. PPL
      PPL 15 February 2014 08: 11
      +7
      The author of COSMOS (Demyan):
      ... I don’t have a photograph and drawing of such a yet non-existent car.

      It turns out there is ... laughing Thank you, pleased! good
      1. Sakmagon
        Sakmagon 15 February 2014 08: 38
        +22
        Demian, dreaming is not harmful - it is harmful to dream to no avail! Reread Dead Souls at your leisure - there was such a character - Manilov. He dreamed too "about courtesy, about good treatment, following some sort of science" ... "so that there would be such longing in my soul ..."
        So, offhand:
        Let's start with the main thing - with weapons and its deployment.
        Gun GSH-30-1 - 2 pcs.

        The cannon is aviation! Do you know what the main problems were after the adoption of the BMP- and BMD-2 with the 30mm 2A42 installed on it? Often wedges from dirt! as it was done "for the sky"!
        GSH-30-1 - barrel is water cooled (more precisely - alcohol). Alcohol, evaporating, passes through special grooves, cooling the bore. B / c - 150 shells, and rate of fire - 1500 / min! It’s good for the flyers - it flew to 2 for an hour, returned, the techies loaded up / down, they added alcohol ... and what will the infantry do with this gun? One clash - and take the machine to the rear? Or make an armored TZM (transport-loading vehicle) for it, the crew of which is in battle ... brrrrrrrrr, God forbid ... In the remaining parameters, pick yourself, laziness to spend time ...
        1. makarov
          makarov 15 February 2014 16: 35
          +3
          "What will the infantry do with this gun?"

          The same as the flyers - awl "eat" !!! wassat
          1. Nick
            Nick 15 February 2014 20: 39
            +1
            Quote: makarov
            The same as the flyers - awl "eat" !!!

            Switch to antifreeze ...
        2. Nick
          Nick 15 February 2014 20: 38
          +5
          Quote: Sacmagon
          Demyan, it is not harmful to dream - it is harmful to dream to no avail!

          Dear Samkagon-Vadim, dreaming is not harmful in principle! It’s harmful to drop ideas on the fly. Even in the seemingly crazy idea itself, one can find a rational kernel that can lead to a solution, quite possibly not the author of the idea, but his opponent. Therefore, even a crazy idea can be useful if you do not discard it on the go, but discuss it, think about it properly, it can lead you to the right decision.
          Sincerely ...
          1. and why
            and why 16 February 2014 02: 32
            +1
            And I read about the necessary decision right here, on the site, how American tanks fought with Iraqi anti-tank weapons. One group fires at itself, and the second shoots from a safe distance. And the biggest flaw of Karagach is his small penetration ability, how will he fight against illegal armed forces in urban, mountainous conditions, with well-equipped enemy positions. It’s the same as Schwarzenegger with two machine guns for embrasure. A good idea is to place a mortar on a tank.
            1. SPACE
              16 February 2014 12: 43
              +3
              Quote: why
              And the biggest flaw of Karagach is his small penetration ability, how will he fight against illegal armed forces in urban, mountainous conditions, with well-equipped enemy positions

              For small shelters there is ATGM, this is for the eyes, and if there is still thermobaric warhead in general, beauty. He does not need much penetrating ability, just as there is no need for him to fight well-equipped fortifications, there is a tank for this. These fortifications must first be identified and blocked, and who will do it? Send a special group to hell? Such work is just for Karagach, to detect and slam the trap, and the destruction of fortifications and bunkers is a matter of technology, aviation and artillery.
          2. and why
            and why 16 February 2014 02: 32
            0
            And I read about the necessary decision right here, on the site, how American tanks fought with Iraqi anti-tank weapons. One group fires at itself, and the second shoots from a safe distance. And the biggest flaw of Karagach is his small penetration ability, how will he fight against illegal armed forces in urban, mountainous conditions, with well-equipped enemy positions. It’s the same as Schwarzenegger with two machine guns for embrasure. A good idea is to place a mortar on a tank.
        3. and why
          and why 16 February 2014 02: 21
          0
          How will it do? To merge alcohol.
        4. and why
          and why 16 February 2014 02: 21
          0
          How will it do? To merge alcohol.
    2. Civil
      Civil 15 February 2014 08: 22
      +6
      The photo in the article is powerful! good
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. SPACE
        15 February 2014 09: 11
        +3
        Quote: Civil
        The photo in the article is powerful!

        Yes, the merit of the moderators!
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. Nikita_Pilot
      Nikita_Pilot 15 February 2014 11: 33
      +1
      what is this?
    6. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 15 February 2014 14: 47
      0
      The article is immature.
    7. Alekseev
      Alekseev 15 February 2014 15: 13
      +1
      Quote: delfinN
      Similar options have already been offered.


      Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye! good
    8. avg
      avg 15 February 2014 15: 19
      0
      Quote: delfinN
      Similar options have already been offered.

      And it will be called - the most crawl-diving flight, although it is similar to push-pushing. laughing
    9. ArhipenkoAndrey
      ArhipenkoAndrey 15 February 2014 16: 10
      0
      And I would still be whirling from a submarine with a scope and wings with torpedoes, and then firepower.
    10. Setrac
      Setrac 15 February 2014 16: 55
      0
      Quote: delfinN
      Similar options have already been offered.

      I’m embarrassed to ask, how will such a tank turn?
      1. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 16 February 2014 05: 16
        +1
        and nobody is going to retreat and turn off! wassat
    11. Corsair
      Corsair 15 February 2014 22: 01
      0
      Quote: delfinN
      Similar options have already been offered.
      You must understand this image of the tank "IF" (Behemoth).
      There is scant information about such a "wunderwaffe" on the Internet, but was there really such a project and such a "tank"?
  2. taseka
    taseka 15 February 2014 08: 11
    +1
    Come on "Karagach" - extinguish the enemies of Russia! Let them tremble and be timid !!!
  3. TELEMARK
    TELEMARK 15 February 2014 08: 12
    +2
    It would be better for the author to develop SPACE ships, fellow In general, the material from those that were recently discussed when the tank was laid with bricks
  4. krpmlws
    krpmlws 15 February 2014 08: 15
    0
    In terms of effective range and power of destruction, 30mm is significantly inferior to a 125mm cannon. For example, the task is to suppress a fortified resistance point in a building-tank to cope better, or to suppress a firing point at a distance of 2-4km - you also need to use a tank.
    1. SPACE
      15 February 2014 08: 33
      +4
      Quote: krpmlws
      to suppress the firing point at a range of 2-4km-it is also necessary to use a tank.

      What 2-4 kilometers in the city are we talking about? For the far zone, you can use ATGM. Will you bring a tank into the city, is it blind and slow, or from a 125mm gun point-blank on sparrows? Maybe a scalpel is better?
      1. Ruslan
        Ruslan 15 February 2014 11: 46
        0
        contradict yourself. your car is on a tank chassis, so according to your words it is also slow. about blindness. nothing prevents, to install the same means of observation, guidance, etc. on the tank To strengthen the tank, you can add a turret with a 30mm gun and in this version the tank will be better and more versatile than your car. but for operations and conflicts of low intensity, where there is no threat from heavy armored vehicles, you can create a tower like yours for a tank chassis, only the main weapon is either 30mm from an infantry fighting vehicle or 57mm anti-aircraft gun (I honestly don't know which is better), it’s also a mortar, a couple of machine-gun-grenade launchers turrets like yours, and cram rockets into the aft compartment of the tower. such a scheme is more acceptable and bmpt you and the fighters to drive, protect the columns, etc. so there is a rational grain in your idea.
        1. SPACE
          15 February 2014 13: 31
          +1
          Quote: ruslan
          contradict yourself. your car is on a tank chassis, so according to your own words is also slow

          I meant the slow one, not in terms of mobility, especially in the city it plays an insignificant role, but in the time required from the moment the target is determined to the shot. How long does it take, for example, to lean out of cover, take aim and fire a shot from an RPG?
          In addition, I do not propose to completely abandon classic tanks, I propose a "combine", which will conduct, including close battles, wherever it goes and where it goes, ie. must drive out the infantry, whose missions will remain, only where they cannot reach, for example, the assault on buildings around which Karagach has already worked along the streets and crossroads and continues to support with fire the storming special forces.
      2. Alekseev
        Alekseev 15 February 2014 15: 12
        +2
        Quote: SPACE
        You will enter the tank into the city, is it blind and slow or from a 125mm gun at point-blank range on sparrows? Maybe a scalpel is better?

        A tank with a modern LMS is a scalpel. In a battle in the city, so that the tank is not "blind and slow" and is not exposed to great danger from the infantry PTS, a special, well-known tactic is used, which is prescribed even in the sergeant's textbook. And the tank, and other armored vehicles, should never shoot "point blank at the sparrows" or anyone else. For this, sights and weapons are installed on combat vehicles, which are an order of magnitude superior in their capabilities to small arms. This distance makes it extremely difficult for the effective use of RPGs. The emphasis for the tank is 400-500 m. Or do you imagine a battle in the city in the form of a group of commandos moving in a column one by one behind an armored personnel carrier? As they show on TV, when they take an apartment or house with a terrorist. Already tired of writing about it. yes
        Small-caliber automatic guns from the arsenal of MZA, are just not so effective among urban neighborhoods with massive buildings, rather heavy mortar howitzers are needed here. In addition, this is a full-time weapon BMP-2. They are already in abundance in the troops. What garden to fence?
        1. SPACE
          15 February 2014 15: 44
          +1
          Quote: Alekseev
          A tank with a modern SLA is a scalpel.

          Do you think that the enemy is walking in a dense crowd and are shooting together from one window? It’s for sparrows, or rather, in 125 caliber for one sparrow laughing
          Quote: Alekseev
          The emphasis for the tank is 400-500 m

          Even 300 meters, if the city is with multi-storey buildings and not on the hills, not everywhere is available. And how will the infantry of your 400 hot meters pass? In this case, your infantry will have no advantages.
          Quote: Alekseev
          among city blocks with massive buildings, heavy mortar howitzers are more likely to be needed here.

          Or maybe a grenade thrown out the window is better ... and a dozen small trunks under the windows?
          Quote: Alekseev
          In addition, this is a full-time weapon BMP-2. They are already in abundance in the troops.

          And they, too, are fighting with 400 meters, or are they not affected by anything?
          Quote: Alekseev
          What garden to fence?
          1. Alekseev
            Alekseev 15 February 2014 17: 24
            +4
            Quote: SPACE
            And what do you think, the enemy walks in a dense crowd

            I explain:
            1. About the crowd. If every O / F tank shell destroyed at least one "sparrow" -arrow, enemy grenade launcher, it would be super excellent. In the village of Komsomolsk, only our 62s used up over 2000 shells, and besides them there were other fire weapons)
            2. The infantry on the streets should not walk "hot meters", but occupy house after house, possibly pre-destroyed from a tank gun, or artillery, or sappers, or aviation, the way it is possible (all professions are important, all professions are important) And it works ahead of BTT. yes
            3. It is best to start with a 152-mm "piglet", and then "a grenade through the window and a dozen small barrels under the windows," and not "under the windows", but in the battle formation of the assault group.
            4. BMP also firing from 400 m and more, the effective firing range for lightly armored (light defense structures, buildings) equipment is 1500 m.
            5. In order to ensure that in the city (fortified area, forest, mountains, etc.) targets are available for tanks, artillery systems, etc. engaged, sometimes with a fight, relevant positions - dominant heights, street crossings, etc. Those. again, combat planning, tactics. "And the units do not go at random in the war (they should not!), They are looking for roads on the plantations, they draw maps in the headquarters" wink
            6. Well, do you need a highly protected BMPT (assault tank)?
            In my opinion, it is necessary, but with the armament that will allow it to really provide support to the troops (see the website above), and not with the one that the gamer-theoreticians offer.
            And this is not a miracle - a weapon. Miracle weapons are tactics and training of troops.
            1. SPACE
              15 February 2014 18: 01
              0
              Quote: Alekseev
              In the village of Komsomolskoye, only our 62 shells used up over 2000 shells, and besides them there were other fire weapons)

              And why didn’t they immediately throw the fabs from the bombers from above? 2000 horror, such as the power is, no mind.
              Thanks anyway for the lecture.
              Quote: Alekseev
              And this is not a miracle - a weapon. Miracle weapons are tactics and training of troops.

              So on the other side, not the children and they know about your tactics and training.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  5. spech
    spech 15 February 2014 08: 17
    +1
    need to add 2-3 UAVs and 3-5 OTR fellow
    1. PPL
      PPL 15 February 2014 08: 24
      +2
      And if he himself still flew and swam? Then the torpedoes will not hurt ... what
      1. predator.3
        predator.3 15 February 2014 10: 47
        +24
        Quote: PPZ
        And if he himself still flew and swam? Then the torpedoes will not hurt ... what


        something like this ?!
        1. ArhipenkoAndrey
          ArhipenkoAndrey 15 February 2014 16: 11
          +1
          It is he "Karagach", someone has already slammed the project.
    2. alone
      alone 15 February 2014 12: 53
      +2
      Quote: spech
      need to add 2-3 UAVs and 3-5 OTR


      Why so trifles. Put 2 poplars and all))
  6. Owl
    Owl 15 February 2014 08: 23
    +5
    And why does everyone (including designers-manufacturers) want to install the twin 2A42 cannons? Laurels ZSU-23-4 "Shilka" do not give rest, but it was created to combat high-speed air attack vehicles, therefore they installed 4 guns, created a density of fire. The 2A42 cannon is a fairly reliable weapon, it makes no sense to duplicate it due to increased reliability, no matter how much you put it - "" will spoil it anyway. Two 2A42 are: four magazines for two types of ammunition (a universal projectile for confidently destroying everything and infantry, helicopters and light armored vehicles, as well as for target designation has not yet been created), four feed hoses, two cassettes for pyroreloading, successful work on loading tapes with shells and maintaining cleanliness, order in stores, in the feed sleeves. Better take pity on the crew, there will be enough work for him, it’s better to think over the space for the IED jammer, to install an additional power unit (when placing the solarium autonomously it is necessary to take care), think over the places for placing the spare parts and equipment outside the machine gun installation protected from bullets and shrapnel (all the same on the armor, someone from the crew is monitoring).
    1. stillrat
      stillrat 15 February 2014 13: 59
      +1
      He answered his own question. For this purpose, they installed two guns on the "terminator" so as not to fool around with selective feeding. Stupidly they installed two barrels, one for OFZ, one for BZ.
  7. TELEMARK
    TELEMARK 15 February 2014 08: 49
    +3
    Quote: delfinN
    Similar options have already been offered.

    Dear, your photo does not correspond a little to the author's project, he offered his "elm" on the basis of "72", and you, I see, have a more modern model!
  8. bairat
    bairat 15 February 2014 08: 59
    +5
    It seems that the weapons proposed by the author will not physically fit into the dimensions of the T-72.
  9. My address
    My address 15 February 2014 09: 44
    +3
    It makes sense to remake the old T-72 in the BMP in order to increase only the security. Ie of weapons for one installation 30mm, 7,62mm, ATGM. In Israel, decades ago, our T-54s were remade and still not getting excited. And they refused from the Khalawa amerovskih M-2 Bradley.
  10. maestro123
    maestro123 15 February 2014 10: 10
    +1
    The author forgot to mention one thing in the article! When adopting equipment for service, the factor of expediency of economic costs is taken into account.
    There are a lot of developments that have not been adopted due to the high cost.
    Plus dimensions of maneuverability of railway transportation.
  11. maestro123
    maestro123 15 February 2014 10: 11
    +1
    Quote: delfinN
    Similar options have already been offered.

    Like a ship, only on tracks. laughing
  12. svp67
    svp67 15 February 2014 10: 16
    +13
    Just as an airplane dominates the sky, so “Karagach” must dominate the earth.

    To choose from ...

    1. PN
      PN 15 February 2014 10: 56
      +3
      And then Ostap suffered ... laughing
    2. Kars
      Kars 15 February 2014 12: 44
      +2
      _________________
      1. svp67
        svp67 15 February 2014 12: 47
        +1
        ____________________________

        1. Kars
          Kars 15 February 2014 13: 16
          +1
          I was hoping today they would post a guru article, how about Ukraine at the moment, and how so

          What will we biathlon?
          Biathlon, biathlon ... and what are our warriors going to win? This question worries most of both amateurs of armored vehicles and specialists, literally right after the announcement of the new championship. The Minister of Defense himself gave in to the intrigue, who gave the command to the industry to issue some "new" machine as soon as possible. So the people went to puzzle over what Sergey Kozhugetovich had in mind by the "new" car. It is obvious that the old T-72Bs used in previous performances are no longer caning. "Armata" to wait for a very long time (by the way, all the statements of Messrs. Ragozin, Khalitov and other generals about some "preliminary" tests of this pepelats are a complete lie. Until now, there is not a single complete vehicle that could be presented to military representatives) ... the best option, in my opinion, would be the T-90MS (SM, MA, AM - whatever you want to call it) - a modernized vehicle with measures for the "Breakthrough-2" design and development project. However, the trick here again is that there were no state tests on this topic, and without them the car in our army is illegal. The problem could have been solved by urgently organizing these very GIs, but ... there was nothing to test in reality. The first prototype is dismantled. This is the one that we all saw in 2009-2011. Earlier I wrote that the layout of "Armata" was made on its basis. Sorry, I was wrong - bad people were misled. It turned out that in fact it was turned into a BMPT-72. The second prototype constantly disappears at various exhibitions, is not complete and thoroughly ushatan. If you look at the latest press and the Internet, you can read a lot of different proposals on the topic of possible candidates for "biathletes". But ... I am extremely interested in why our serial T-90A is always absent in them? You might think that the illiterate public is simply talking about this wonderful car, if again not one BUT ... the T-90A was planned to participate in last year's competitions. Photos of these cars, painted in the colors of the participating teams, appeared on the network. But these tanks did not even appear in the biathlon demonstration program. Why? Is it because our military knows something more about them than can be said?

          "Colored" T-90A, prepared for the biathlon -2013, but not involved in it either.



          Did the 30-year-old T-72B be considered better and more reliable ??? Everything turns out that way ... So what are we going to exhibit? Then I give absolutely unverified information based solely on rumors that passed through the “subchannels”, but nonetheless I paid attention to them.
          The first hearing. UKBTM and "Tagil platform" "Uralvagonzavod" received an urgent task to roll out a small series of upgraded, specially prepared for the competition of the type T-72. This is the so-called T-72B4. Modernization option in which the best practices are used on the Kalina LMS and the Proryv-2 ROC as a whole. The main difference from the T-72B3 is the commanding panorama. However, this machine also does not exist yet and it has not been tested.

          T-72B3 at the window in honor of the past biathlon




          The turret of the T-72B3 tank, on which the main feature of the modernization is clearly visible - the Sosna-U sight

  13. Asan Ata
    Asan Ata 15 February 2014 10: 43
    +8
    The question is topical. I believe that discussions of such systems will lead designers to the right decision. Offer, but to be afraid of wolves in VO - do not go to the forest. drinks
    1. AK-47
      AK-47 15 February 2014 11: 57
      +1
      Quote: Asan Ata
      I believe that discussions of such systems will lead designers to the right decision. ... and to be afraid of wolves in VO - do not go to the forest.
      Wise words. One should be more lenient to someone else's opinion.
    2. svp67
      svp67 15 February 2014 13: 33
      0
      Quote: Asan Ata
      The question is topical. I believe that discussions of such systems will lead designers to the right decision. P
      This fantasy ... Designers work on the terms of reference, and it is developed in the bowels of the General Staff ...
      1. Kars
        Kars 15 February 2014 13: 40
        +3
        Quote: svp67
        and it is being developed in the bowels of the General Staff ...

        I have suspicions that in the current General Staff of the Russian Federation (I’m not talking about Ukraine), they basically do it as it were.
        And innovation is usually driven by enthusiasts. As was the case with submarines, tanks, machine guns.
        Reading the story of the appearance of the tank on the battlefield, I am simply surprised how many efforts different senior military made that he did not appear.
        1. svp67
          svp67 15 February 2014 19: 15
          0
          Quote: Kars
          Reading the story of the appearance of the tank on the battlefield, I am simply surprised how many efforts different senior military made that he did not appear.

          And no less that he could appear there ...
          1. Kars
            Kars 15 February 2014 19: 16
            +1
            Quote: svp67
            And no less that he could appear there ...

            Oddly enough, very, very less. More just looks like a miracle.
    3. Setrac
      Setrac 15 February 2014 16: 59
      0
      Quote: Asan Ata
      I believe that discussions of such systems will lead designers to the right decision.

      Tests of equipment in the troops lead to the right decision.
      1. SPACE
        16 February 2014 13: 19
        +1
        Quote: svp67
        This fantasy ... Designers work on the terms of reference, and it is developed in the bowels of the General Staff ...

        Everything new, one way or another, is born out of fantasies and those tasks are also preceded by new ideas.
        Quote: Setrac
        Tests of equipment in the troops lead to the right decision.

        Before embarking on the tests, it is necessary to come up with this and create it, and it is at the stage of generating the idea and its implementation that the correct solution is laid down, during the tests, they are confirmed or not!
  14. nemec55
    nemec55 15 February 2014 10: 46
    0
    The logical question is: how to most effectively conduct military operations with such an enemy in the given conditions?

    It’s not necessary to go far, it’s GOOD Intelligence drones and a massive blow to the bases where thoughts arise and not at home when the enemy is already settled.
  15. K-36
    K-36 15 February 2014 10: 47
    +11
    Dear inverters. I’m never a tanker. As an excuse, I can only say that I have a higher technical education, received in the days of the USSR. I will not go into the idea of ​​"Karagach" at all, because I simply do not believe in an invincible tank alone. Fundamentally!
    I bring my method to your court. The bottom line: two components! 1. Drone. 2. Remotely controlled by all well-known BMPT "Terminator". Requirements for the drone: a) Small size (so that it is not so easy to shoot down); b) Equipment for digital terrain cartography with on-line transmission of images to the displays of their command centers. Requirements for the "Terminator": a) Remotely controlled; b) A radio beacon (for displaying it on a digital map of the alleged battle site; c) A sighting and navigation system (can be performed as a separate removable module) in full configuration (video optics, infrared, night, laser rangefinder, etc.)
    Application Option 1. A drone is sent out ahead of the attack to get the "terrain numbers" on all the tablets of its forces. 2. Immediately before the attack, a remote "Terminator" is sent, at which the enemy will open fire. All these targets are detected by the Terminator's equipment and transmitted to the command post of their forces. You just need a very good "program" for the classification of targets (both moving and stationary). Based on this information, the superior command post decides to suppress targets by forces of the attack line and main calibers from the depths of its defense. Something like this. I ask you not to throw your slippers (because I am not a tanker at all) smile
    A few words in defense of your "project". 1. Cheapness, because there is no need to invest in expensive projects to create new types of weapons. Everything is already there, you just need to ensure the pairing. 2. The minimum human losses! before clearing the field of the upcoming battle.
    Thanks to everyone who had the patience to read my fantasies to the end. drinks
    1. Setrac
      Setrac 15 February 2014 17: 04
      +2
      Quote: K-36
      The well-known BMPT "Terminator" is remotely controlled.

      An unmanned tank does not have to weigh 50 tons. It can be made two times smaller and ten times easier, especially if we refuse a large gun.
      That is, an unmanned tank in my vision is a car from 4 to 6 tons with a 57 mm gun and automatic loader, two to two and a half times smaller than the T-72.
      On the same chassis there is a 76 mm self-propelled gun, a fourteen 14 mm anti-aircraft machine gun, a missile tank with ATGMs and air defense systems.
      I almost forgot, 82-mm self-propelled mortar.
  16. marshes
    marshes 15 February 2014 11: 05
    +3
    I repeat. From the topic about the BMPT-100 that was yesterday.
    swamps KZ Yesterday, 18:30
    In Kazakhstan, too, they puzzled for a long time where the existing BMPTs could be used, and they found application: As of November 2012, BMPTs were adopted only in the Republic of Kazakhstan. The Army of Kazakhstan sees the use of BMPTs that have been adopted as an anti-tank unit commander’s machine: one BMPT armed with 9M120-1 (9M120-1F) missiles, for three 9P149 SPTRK-Sturm-S combat vehicles armed with 9M114 Sturm missiles ( 9M114F) and “Attack” 9M120 (9M120F) and 9M120-1 (9M120-1F). As such, BMPTs were demonstrated at a military parade on May 7, 2013 at the Otar training ground [1], while, after completing four launches of 9M120-1 anti-tank guided missiles with BMPT No. 501 and 503, BMPT capabilities were demonstrated to perform BMP 9P149 combat security functions fire of small arms.
    By the way, BMPT-72 is already without AGS.
    1. marshes
      marshes 15 February 2014 13: 18
      +1
      Not much to add: BMPT-72, can be renamed into Combat Security Vehicle, BMO-72 "ALABAY" smile. The same functions as the dog. smile Lays down on a hillock and looks after that the wolves do not get close to the flock. This is if, like we have, the "Storm" will look after.
      PS There is a GShG-7.62 machine gun, an interesting thing. Can it work in the field?
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 15 February 2014 13: 30
        +4
        [/ Center]
        The development of 1986, in my opinion (I can be wrong) was used on the PUF and UPC helicopters, I saw the infantry wearable version, but did not enter service.
        1. marshes
          marshes 15 February 2014 13: 39
          +2
          And on the YakB-12,7 they still produce ammunition? Does he have two bullets in his cartridge?
          1. Alex 241
            Alex 241 15 February 2014 13: 49
            +2
            I do not pretend to be true, but I think so. About 1000 helicopters were exported.
  17. delfinN
    delfinN 15 February 2014 11: 09
    +1
    The Yankes have already tried to go down this path: they gathered everything in a heap - honey, d ... mo and bees, called the F-35 (only for some reason they all call the flying ax of the 5th generation). As a result, it seems like a bull pisses and flies around and ate a lot of dough. What is the AK-47 famous for? Simple and reliable as 3 rubles. That's where the "dog rummaged" (c). It turns out that all ingenious is simple.
  18. Leshka
    Leshka 15 February 2014 11: 41
    0
    the car will be too heavy and slow excellent sel for ptrk type cornet
  19. marshes
    marshes 15 February 2014 12: 16
    +1
    Karagach-strong when it is dry, wet pricks at once two times, and so in texture is similar to BUK-Bavaria. smile
    1. Asan Ata
      Asan Ata 17 February 2014 17: 00
      0
      No, the texture is similar to oak))))). In this very unpretentious tree. Karagach - in translation - ebony, in Russia it is called elm. hi
  20. Hitrovan07
    Hitrovan07 15 February 2014 12: 32
    +2
    As generals prepare for past wars, so technology is built on the same principle. Any real battles put an end to the most promising types of weapons. Recently there was a war in which Israel lost a lot of tanks. So maybe the time of tanks in the standard sense has already passed ???
    The author correctly raised the topic - weapons are outdated for "another war", in Russia not to hand over for scrap metal, but to design on its basis for the tasks that the enemy sets before the army today.
    So the topic is correct - but the discussion has slipped in the wrong direction.
  21. Gardamir
    Gardamir 15 February 2014 13: 11
    +1
    With all the criticism, I will still support the author. How long does it take to knock a group of "terrorists" out of the house? Imagine, God forbid, a situation similar to the Syrian one. So the author is a plus, for what makes him think about the problem in advance.
    1. marshes
      marshes 15 February 2014 13: 22
      +3
      Quote: Gardamir
      ... How long does it take to knock a group of "terrorists" out of the house?

      And if the house is demolished? Anyway, then you have to demolish it, it's easier to build a new one.
  22. Capyar 48315
    Capyar 48315 15 February 2014 13: 41
    +1
    An ideal self-sufficient BM for all the challenges of modern realities cannot be created, if only because of the variability of these very realities. The point is in creating compounds from various BMs with different tasks in battle. In each specific conflict% the ratio of different BMs can be changed. the main thing for such connections is the unification of control systems and the maximum interchangeability of components and parts.
  23. Aleks tv
    Aleks tv 15 February 2014 15: 47
    +8
    Good day, Demian.

    I am glad that you are a supporter of the need for a combat vehicle based on a tank with small-caliber weapons.
    There is only one, but significant BUT, which almost ALL sin, who are trying to come up with a new concept of a combat vehicle - they are trying to stuff everything that is in the arsenal of the Army on it ...
    Yes, it’s not strange, but it is. I caught myself on this when I invented something similar in my head.
    ...................................
    Any combat vehicle is born from a certain concept of military operations. (you can call it a strategy), not vice versa.
    The concept of hostilities is a whole range of different criteria.
    And the use of weapons is only ONE of the criteria for the concept of military operations.
    Consider this "use of weapons":
    On a certain theater of operations should be present ALL REQUIRED ARMS LINE.
    For example:
    1. In the city it is desirable: a universal short barrel of a large caliber with low ballistics, small-caliber automatic artillery, machine guns of standard and large caliber. The basic requirement is the maximum HV angle.
    Perhaps this weapon put on one machine? Not. And how much?
    2: In the suburbs, coppices and other fuet of the theater, add to the above list more automatic grenade launchers and small-caliber mortars.
    Perhaps this weapon put on one machine? Not. And how much? And will these cars be unified with the cars of the first group?
    3. You shouldn’t forget about the battle in the field and the classic “adversary” ... Add here 125mm smoothbore barrel and 57mm for fighting BMP.
    Is it possible to install this weapon on one machine? Not. And how much? A unification with the above points?
    .................................

    And now we’ll try to unify as much as possible combat vehicles capable of performing these three tasks (otherwise, it would be necessary to create a fuvish cloud of BT).
    As a result, we get 2-4 Fighting vehicles capable of effectively performing tasks on various Тatrach Вof the Дaction.

    Let's try to compose:
    - We remove the option of using wheeled armored personnel carriers and floating tracked vehicles of medium security (they have their own "niche" on the battlefield).
    - Leave my favorite “tank base”:
    1.Tank.
    2. BMPT.
    3. TBMP (do not forget the infantry).
    And now it’s possible to try and place on THREE platforms the entire range of weapons indicated in 1, 2, 3. and these three “platforms” must act in concert.
    Then we get the answer, how many and which trunks should have modern “terminators”. BUT ONE BASIS IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO PLACE AN ALL REQUIRED ARMS LINE. And there’s nothing to it.

    This is a very, very crude example of only one aspect - the use of weapons.

    It's just IMHO. Wrote "offhand" and can be a little rude.
    Good luck, Demyan.
    Regards, Alexey.
    hi

    ps Do not forget about the crew - it should not be overloaded with weapons.
    1. SPACE
      15 February 2014 16: 36
      +1
      Greetings Alexey hi as I have promised...
      Quote: Aleks tv
      There is only one, but significant BUT, which almost ALL sin, who are trying to come up with a new concept of a combat vehicle - they are trying to stuff everything that is in the arsenal of the Army on it ...

      Not everything needs to be shoved there, but only what is needed to effectively carry out a combat mission in certain conditions.
      Further, I do not propose creating a new type of military equipment, but I propose my version of the BMPT and the difference in armament is only in that it added two DShKs and a mortar, ATGM is hidden and protected, MANPADS is an option. The DShK, this is like the experience of the Americans in Iraq, there were complaints about the redundancy of powerful guns and the lack of a large-caliber machine gun on Abrams when used in the city, a mortar is necessary for unexpected shooting at buildings in the courtyards with an air gun. So, in principle, with the exception of the mortar, there is nothing new in terms of weapons! Who spoke? "Sea of ​​Fire"!
      And the most important thing is the third time I repeat, multi-barrels and multichannel, something that is nowhere to be found, gives a quick reaction to hitting a target, coupled with protection and automation, gives such a combination that allows direct attack attacks against such a machine to actually replace BMP and a soldier on the front line. Imagine, in the city block occupied by the opponents, you are not entering tanks and infantry fighting vehicles wading through gullies, but Karagach, in the amount of 10-20-30 units, they will block all yards and approaches to buildings, streets and intersections, each side of the house, each the window is under observation, and after that, you can enter both BMP and armored personnel carriers with infantrymen, driving them directly to the entrance of buildings to capture ... and that's not all ...
      1. Aleks tv
        Aleks tv 15 February 2014 16: 46
        +3
        Quote: SPACE
        added two DShK and mortar, ATGM is hidden and protected, MANPADS is an option.

        hi
        Nevertheless, try to place all the necessary weapons on ... several platforms. (Do not forget about Mother Infantry, without it, any child prodigy kirdyk).

        Well, I cannot imagine such a small-caliber "mammoth of weapons" in practical real work.
        The crew will go crazy.
        request
        IMHO.

        wink
        1. Aleks tv
          Aleks tv 15 February 2014 16: 57
          +4
          Quote: Aleks tv
          such a "mammoth weapons" of small caliber.

          And yet - when infatuated with missiles, do not forget about artillery.

          Yes, there is a good saying: "it is better to get one missile than to send 20 rounds." This is good when you hit it in the "window" or in a specific place.

          But sometimes it is more effective to "plow and turn into dust" an object ... with 20 ordinary shells, where one rocket will be like an elephant's grain (expensive grain).
          And such cases are MUCH more often.

          Each weapon has its own "chip".
          Do not forget about 125mm and Nona (for example). They have a place to be at the forefront in the armament of combat vehicles.
          wink
          1. SPACE
            15 February 2014 17: 25
            +1

            Quote: Aleks tv
            But sometimes it is more effective to "plow and turn into dust" an object

            To do this, there should be artillery regiments of Non, MSTA S, Carnations, Peonies and Tulips, and from closed positions they will erase everything in powder. But I did not encroach on this. But after the art training, Karagach is needed! Well to check.
            Quote: Aleks tv
            do not forget about mother infantry, without it any child prodigy kirdyk).

            That's just what I thought about them!
            1. Aleks tv
              Aleks tv 15 February 2014 17: 59
              +1
              Quote: SPACE
              To do this, there should be artillery regiments of Non, MSTA S, Carnations, Peonies and Tulips, and from closed positions they will erase everything in powder. But I did not encroach on this.

              Demian, Duc I also write in "pure form", without the Gods of War ...
              request
              Quote: Aleks tv
              Do not forget about 125mm and Nona (for example). They have a place to be at the forefront in the armament of combat vehicles.

              I paraphrase:
              Fire direct fire large caliber LIFE is necessary in some cases. No way without it. Firing is a complex of measures.

              Those. one Karagach (without the support of other classes of combat vehicles) with such weapons ... alas, but will not cope with the whole spectrum of possible tasks.
              Something like this.
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. SPACE
                15 February 2014 18: 39
                0
                Quote: Aleks tv
                Demian, Duc I also write in "pure form", without the Gods of War ...

                It depends on what kind of fight you are talking about, in the article I talked about a set of measures and the proposed vehicle is one of them.
                Quote: Aleks tv
                Those. one Karagach (without the support of other classes of combat vehicles) with such weapons ... alas, but will not cope with the whole spectrum of possible tasks.

                What kind of tasks? In close contact with disparate groups of opponents, to cope alone, we are not talking about hundreds of people, although it will depend on the availability of portable weapons. On utuba, the mass of films of real battles, frankly speaking, viewing them prompted the idea that something needs to be done with this military mess.
                Z.Y. In general, to be honest, I thought that the discussion would be of a technical nature, placement, layout, etc. After all, it was not I who invented the BMPT and those who conceived it and made it guided by something, I believe that no one will seriously refute the need for such a machine.
                1. Aleks tv
                  Aleks tv 15 February 2014 18: 51
                  +1
                  Quote: SPACE
                  In general, to be honest, I thought that the discussion would be of a technical nature, placement, layout, etc. After all, it was not I who invented the BMPT and those who conceived it and made it guided by something, I believe that no one will seriously refute the need for such a machine.

                  I am a supporter of BMPT, even in such a truncated form as it is.
                  And discuss the technical details of your proposal ...

                  Demian, look at my first (big) post.
                  Something like this. I do not want to repeat myself.
                  Good luck. Sincerely.
                  hi
                  1. SPACE
                    15 February 2014 19: 12
                    +1
                    Quote: Aleks tv
                    Demian, look at my first (big) post.

                    Alexey, I can tell you the same thing, read my article carefully and think at your leisure.
                    Quote: Aleks tv
                    Good luck. Sincerely.

                    Thank you for the conversation and good luck to you, also sincerely drinks
          2. The comment was deleted.
        2. SPACE
          15 February 2014 17: 11
          +1
          Quote: Aleks tv
          Well, I cannot imagine such a small-caliber "mammoth of weapons" in practical real work. The crew will go crazy.

          It won't do. AUTOMATION! Have you watched "time dilation" or are you familiar with high-speed cameras and image processing systems? Miracles and only, at a speed of several dozen parts per minute determines a defective workpiece!
    2. SPACE
      15 February 2014 17: 04
      +1
      Quote: Aleks tv
      You should not forget about the battle in the field and the classic “adversary” ... Add here 125mm smoothbore barrel and 57mm for fighting BMP.

      I didn’t forget, there are still tanks, although I think that guided missile weapons are more effective, I wonder who can get away from Cornet ?.
      Remember the film about tankers, I don't remember the name, the plot is a training game, red against blue, there is an episode when they "shoot down" a helicopter from MANPADS in the parking lot of a column of tanks, I still don't understand where they were taking it in a tank or is it a linden tree, under the whistle of bullets is fraught with. And how do you like this plot: on the front line within sight of each other, within the reach of both vehicles. We place these units, mask them and the mouse will not crawl and the fly will not fly over and will inform the bombers or artillery, if anything, a mobile checkpoint.
  24. shtabs
    shtabs 15 February 2014 19: 59
    0
    ... He flies, puffs and gives tea ..
    samovar, steamboat, helicopter ..
  25. polkovnik manuch
    polkovnik manuch 15 February 2014 21: 35
    0
    They just erased it, now they sent an official WARNING, well, thanks! Hello to all my colleagues! I read, honestly, learned a lot. Why fence a garden? At the storage bases, there are so many old ones (new unused tanks are worth it), it’s much cheaper to remove the turret (gun), work out the layout and place new weapons. If not correct, but I think it’s not worth fantasizing with our shortage of capacities and budget.
  26. Aleks tv
    Aleks tv 15 February 2014 22: 57
    0
    A little off topic ...

    Just yesterday they talked about a crack in the breech of the gun ... it's about the deaths of guys near Khabarovsk ...

    Here is the latest info from the UVZ website:
    Quote.

    The delegation of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation at Plant No. 9
    A delegation of the Ministry of Defense of Russia paid an official visit to Plant No. 9 OJSC (Ekaterinburg), which is part of the UVZ Corporation. It included Major General Viktor Lizvinsky, the chief of armaments - the deputy commander-in-chief of the Ground Forces for Arms, and other officials.

    The purpose of the visit is to get acquainted with the plant, the state of its production capacities, evaluate the scientific backlog of the enterprise and the prospects for increasing production volumes as part of the implementation of the arms program for the 2016-2020 years.

    During the meeting, the General Director of Plant No. 9, Mikhail Matvienko, and his deputy, General Designer Anatoly Tarnayev, made a presentation of the enterprise. After the official meeting, the delegation went to the production workshops, where they evaluated the progress of the technical re-equipment of the plant, examined the promising, recently created workshop number 23, actively equipped with the most modern equipment, after which the delegation went to the Central Factory Research Laboratory, where they got acquainted with the unique works carried out by the plant’s specialists.

    The guests were actively interested in the features and subtleties of production, the chrome plating process, the technology of assembly and testing of products.

    http://www.uvz.ru/presscenter/release/499

    FUCKING SOME MATCH .........................................
  27. Massik
    Massik 15 February 2014 23: 49
    0
    Since the enemy’s actions will be of a hidden and not always definite nature, combat units must be highly mobile and responsive to counter them.
    Why ATGM and air defense systems ??? Is the enemy rolling out in tanks, under the guise of attack aircraft in the sky?
  28. Andrey_K
    Andrey_K 16 February 2014 01: 40
    +1
    I watched footage from the Syrian Chronicle.
    There the tank stands on the road, next to an aborigine pretending to sweep the street.
    Then he throws the broom, takes out a grenade launcher from the bushes and shoots at the tank.
    Or another episode - another aborigine throws a grenade into the tank.

    These are the dangers to fight.
    And for this you need a light machine gun on a movable mount and a monitoring system.
    The attendant sits with a joystick and only receives a picture that the computer considered suspicious stirring.
    The person on duty only needs to press the button: "shoot" / "do not shoot".

    With such a response capability, the tank will drive around the city and have time to shoot any militant popping out of the window.

    This would be a technique for the city and for a new kind of war.

    Something else needs to be done with the shooting of mines flying towards the guarded object.
    After all, terrorists can pre-install an automatic grenade launcher near the HF or crowded places and give the command to fire on the radio.
    And the tank should be able to bring down these mines in the air.
    A tank should not only be able to protect itself, but also a guarded object.
  29. SPACE
    16 February 2014 08: 34
    -1
    The Karagach concept is the only and logical solution to which events and time themselves lead! The dilemma is simple, either the completely creation of a completely new type of military equipment or the use of existing. Of the existing equipment, only the tank has initially part of the necessary security requirements, the most massive of which is the T-72. But the T-72 is not rubber and the proposed weapon kit is the only one possible for placement in this machine, practically end-to-end. There is another option, to do nothing at all, but to use what is.
    Z.Y. This option of modernization, given the prevalence of this tank, may interest many, and the modernization process as a whole will not take a lot of labor and money and can be carried out at any specialized plant.
    ZZ. Templates and forms, stamps for many as buoys for which it is forbidden to swim, this is the brakes of progress.
  30. Andrey_K
    Andrey_K 17 February 2014 23: 25
    0
    By the way.
    Nevertheless, the T72 was designed for another war - for large-scale tank battles, airborne tanks, assault forces, rear marching, etc.
    For anti-sabotage war and war in the city you need a heavy heavily armored tank.
    It does not need to be urgently transported by transport aircraft, but can be rushed to deliver by train.
    Those. a 50-ton limit is not necessary and a hundred-ton tank can be made - purely for local city battles, when the tank moves a little, but shoots a lot and shoot more at it.
  31. psiho117
    psiho117 1 May 2014 18: 35
    0
    Yeah. and you can make ten 10-ton unmanned. half with cannon-machine gun, half with guided missile weapons.
    And something tells me that the effectiveness, price, and ease of delivery of these babies will be many times greater than any 100-ton mastodon.
  32. Zakhar345
    Zakhar345 26 May 2019 12: 27
    +1
    this is a noble nonsense!