Military Review

Bloody lesson. Reflections on the tragedy in the Moscow school number XXUMX

259
Moscow. Basmanny court. The final word of Sergey Gordeev:


Sorry about what happened. Let me go home to my parents.


The court of Gordeev did not release the parents ... Judge Natalya Mushnikova decided to detain an 15-year-old student in Moscow school No.263 (Otradnoe) in custody for a term of 2 a month because of its potential public danger due to serious crimes.

Bloody lesson. Reflections on the tragedy in the Moscow school number XXUMX


Bloody drama, as literally every person already knows, at least occasionally getting acquainted with Russian the news, played out at the beginning of the week (Monday, February 3). The result of this drama is known to many: the murder of a school teacher and a police officer by the same 15-year-old teenager, and another law enforcement officer was seriously injured. The details of the course of events just today can hardly be described for the simple reason that access to materials from video recording cameras in the educational institution for the media is closed, and the performance of numerous witnesses often contradict each other. A pile of details and confusion in eyewitness accounts have already led to the fact that “distinguished”, for example, “Komsomolskaya Pravda”, “hot on the heels” came out with a photo of the criminal, which had nothing to do with the real criminal Sergey Gordeev ...

Of those testimonies that are presented by eyewitnesses, as well as for those materials of surveillance cameras that have become available to journalists, the approximate picture of bloody Monday at school No. XXUMX looks like this (once again it is necessary to clarify - it is an approximate picture of events).

Pupil of 10 class Sergey Gordeev (excellent student, participant and winner of many subject olympiads, visitor of school circles and sections) on Sunday blocked access to his page on the social network and informed his parents that the first three lessons at school would not be on Monday; when 3 February came, Gordeev easily took from his father's safe to store weapons rifle Tikka T3, as well as the second unit of firearms (according to some sources this is a Browning self-loading rifle), several dozen rounds of ammunition for them. Dressed in a long coat, Gordeev proceeded to the school, barely holding very weighty trunks with his hands.



A teenager without any obstacles hit the school around 11: 40 (5 minutes after the start of the fourth lesson). According to 57-year-old security guard Yury Egorov, who was on duty at that moment, he himself (Egorov) was absent from the post (at the entrance) because he was walking around the building of the educational institution and was in the other wing of this building. The guard explained the purpose of the round as follows: look, the students didn’t get anywhere ...

Returning "from a detour," Yuri Yegorov saw a student in a coat (from the back) walking along the corridor and called him. According to the same Yegorov, Gordeyev put something on the floor and approached him, pointing the barrel of a small-caliber rifle (this is how the guard characterizes the weapon). The teenager said that it was not a joke, and that he did not come to school to talk with him (with the guard).

Yuri Egorov (employee of the private security company Saturn) quotes Gordeev (for Life News):

I know who I can figure out. And you went outside the gate.


After that, Gordeev proceeded to the office where the geography was going, and security guard Egorov, as he himself declares, went to the director (this description of events leads to certain thoughts about the security readiness for emergency situations) and already on duty pressed the alarm button.

If everything was exactly as Gordeev said, then this indirectly explains why, after a few minutes, the private security officers came to the office, in fact, unaware of the serious danger. What is an alarm button pressed at school? In most cases, for the representatives of the guard or the police, this is a signal that some of the students are simply hooligans, and not a signal that something really serious happens in school ...

What happened in the director's office when the guard “reached” him (or “got him” ...) is unclear ...

At this time, Gordeev was already knocking (according to the testimony of 10 “A” pupils of the class) at the door of the geography room, in which the lesson was taught by the teacher Andrei Kirillov. The geography teacher got up and opened the door himself. Sergei Gordeyev entered the office, his classmates met quite actively (someone clapped his hands, someone laughed), but the laughter quickly broke off when Gordeyev fired at the teacher. A teenager class was ordered to get under the desks and sit quietly, saying that they (classmates) were “like” hostages, but he would not kill them. After Gordeyev re-shot the teacher (as it turned out later, the first shot seriously wounded Andrei Kirillov, and the second shot Gordeyev killed him when he heard the rattle of an 30-year-old man lying on the floor of the office).

Then within a few minutes, Gordeyev (according to the evidence of schoolchildren numb in horror at the time) said that before the teacher was killed, he had already killed the guard, that he was sick of this life, that he was an adherent of the ideas of solipsism (philosophy, which man recognizes his only consciousness as the only reality), and that he wants to die in order to see what is “at the end” there. At the time of the "monologue" of the murderer, calls were made to his telephone, he answered, and the monologues turned into dialogues. Gordeyev spoke with his mother, with his grandmother, with his father.

When private security officers approached the door, he fired a carbine several times. One employee (Sergey Bushuev, born 1976) died on the spot, the other (Vladimir Krokhin) is still in extremely serious condition.

Gordeyev walked between the rows, periodically firing shots at the ceiling and continuing to talk about what he wanted to see what death was and what he was not going to give up.

At that time, when a helicopter of the Ministry of Emergency Situations began to fly up to the school, Gordeyev fired several shots at him from a weapon that he did not let go of.

In one of the telephone conversations with his father (after his father had learned about the tragedy being played out), the teenager declared that he agreed that Gordeyev Sr. would come to school. The father did appear at school a few minutes later (according to some information, he was wearing a bulletproof vest, as the police were afraid that Sergei might start shooting, despite family ties). The teenager's father entered the office without any special obstacles, talked with his son for quite a long time, after which Gordeyev told the students that they could leave the classroom. Then, he took the weapon from his son, threw him on the floor, and both came out of the audience, where police officers put handcuffs on Gordeev Jr.

Naturally, this incident caused a huge resonance. Numerous deputy and public proposals, ideas, remarks, which, to be honest, in the overwhelming majority of cases resemble either something resembling a frank self-PR or a banal fever connected with non-possession of information about the cause and the course of events, were immediately identified. Some spoke in favor of the need to necessarily equip school teachers with taking courses in bullet shooting. Others offered to open a service that will go home to schoolchildren and check which computer games they play. And someone said that it is imperative to involve the Russian youth in productions of the Theater for Young People ... Doctor of Medical Sciences Mikhail Vinogradov, in an interview with Interfax, in general “put an eye on i, giving literally the following: problems could have been avoided if Andrei Kirillov ( geography teacher) would allow Sergei Gordeev to retake ...

UNESECTS and giving teachers the opportunity for students to retake something is certainly great, but does this have a direct bearing on the tragedy that took place on Monday? .. Or if someone from modern young people does not attend theaters, and someone from modern teachers puts well-deserved, but not the highest mark (if at all the matter of marks-marks ...), then this is a reason for some to suspect an abnormality, and to blame others for provocation of a crime? .. If it were so, then all psychology would be easier to do turnips ...

Everyone rushed to discuss what they had, to put it mildly, not the most accurate information. If they initially talked about the fact that this allegedly the most unfortunate geography teacher put the four on Gordeev, and that Gordeyev allegedly decided to kill him for it, then it turned out that the geography teacher, as they say, was not at the wrong place at the wrong time . Gordeyev himself told about this at the first interrogation. The only incident (if you can call it that) that 10 “A” students of the 263 school could recall, which occurred between Gordeyev and geography teacher Kirillov, is that their classmate supposedly noticed an inaccuracy expressed by the teacher some time ago. After that, Gordeev rarely attended the lessons of Andrei Kirillov. Well, if the teaching inaccuracy could be a reason for the massacre for Gordeev, then what can be said about the education of this young man, and the size of cockroaches in his head ...

Some time after the arrest, the “shooter”, who at the time of the commission of the crime presented himself either as the master of other people's destinies, or as a fearless cowboy, was taken to the first interrogation. And, figuratively speaking, Gordeev put in his pants - he closed in on himself, without uttering a word. A long silence was replaced by a request to bring him tea and biscuits (!) And call for a conversation a teacher of Russian language and literature, who led these subjects in the 263 school in the very same 10 "A" class.

Cookies with tea were given to Gordeev, the teacher was brought ... Already after the killer’s conversation with the Russian teacher Tatiana Babkina, it turned out (at least, Babkin herself said so) that Sergey did not go to the geographer, but to her ... And prove that she was wrong when she said that there is more good in this world than evil. The teacher noted that Sergey was supposedly walking only for his own death, but again, supposedly did not want to kill anyone. Gordeeva she called conflict-free, but very irritable.



Pupils of school №263 say that Sergey was often visited by his grandmother, who was waiting for the end of classes and his grandson behind the school fence. Gordeyev was very shy about this, tried to go home alone, shouted at an elderly woman, seeing that the arrival of her grandmother was mocking her classmates.

In general, all this bloody историяin which such moments as “I don’t want to live”, but “I want tea with cookies”, “supporter of solipsism”, but “let me go home,” grandmother’s parishes to meet a tenth-grandson, irritated by inaccuracies of the teacher, say that the teenage stage of growing up was extremely difficult for Gordeev. Icons in his room (a neighbor talks about them) and computer games in which you can easily kill everyone who gets in the way, words about the philosophy of egocentrism and fear of revealing both to peers and parents and teachers are the set of contradictions that clearly a teenager. There was a lack of public recognition, feeling, own “toughness” ... And then the picture - an excellent student with two trunks - “cool”, - apparently, Gordeev thought this way, making up a plan in his hot head and being in the “live until Monday” stage.

His position seems to be described in no other way than “I am the navel of the Earth, my position is the only correct criticism or negative assessment of my position — the verdict from me personally” rested on an objective and unjustifiable (not condemnable, but not for himself) dependence on senior (parents and teachers). If the majority of adolescents, even if not always cloudless, overcome all the difficulties of the period of maturation, then the Gordeev of those who could not overcome. The great inner world did not get along with the obvious weakness. The принято asleep mind, as they say, gave birth to monsters ... Another excellent student syndrome: there is no room for error, all or nothing, I and only me. Frequent practice in this case is suicide, and Sergey Gordeev also thought about suicide, but in a very peculiar manner - to go for his own death through the death of others. Yes, just chickened out! He was afraid of death ... Whether talking to his father, or realizing the reality of the picture of bloody corpses gave a sobriety pill. However, late ...

But this, if I may say so, psychological lyrics. And what is the reality?

In reality, an adolescent’s access with obvious problems of a psychological (or mental) nature to a weapon is a no less obvious omission in parental upbringing (now hyper, or some strange detachment). In addition - to put it mildly, unprofessional actions of the protection of the school. Protection of schools and other facilities has long been the talk of the town. They say that little protection is paid to protection, and therefore they are gaining retirees or people (often women), of pre-retirement age, who are not eager to perform their direct duties zealously. The guards are for show, the guards are simply not ready for such a development of events as the “murderous apprentice” “suggested” ...

Is Gordeev's crime a trend? Hardly. Someone from this tragedy would like to concoct a trend is a fact. But ... People with obvious kinks whose brains are clouded with nightmares of their own “composition” have been at all times. There were disgusting maniacs, and share-boys, who could kill only because their parents did not let go to the disco or did not buy them an expensive toy. Thank God, such a minority. But they were and, sadly enough, they will be ... Is it possible to make it so that they are not - unfortunately, it looks more like a utopia. And any utopia is beautiful and noble, but no more ...

Yes - Gordeev played computer games. Ban games? But millions of other people also play computer games, and often find in them a reason to throw out negative emotions in the “virtual”, without transferring them to reality. Bloody games are a fact. And again, but ... If tens of thousands of people die in traffic accidents on the roads of Russia every year, then this is not a reason for banning cars? .. If people are killed every day from a Kalashnikov machine gun, is it worth talking about a ban on Kalash? As Kalashnikov himself said: it is not a weapon that shoots, a person shoots.

Yes - he expressed irritation with the remarks of the elders, but millions of other teenagers also express irritations, they can become isolated or, on the contrary, behave aggressively. Is this a reason to send all adolescents to a psychiatric clinic? .. But at the same time, this is not a reason for not paying any attention to the inappropriate behavior of a teenager.

To variations of parental education is a question, like a question, and to medical commissions, which due to their age were held by Gordeyev, to professional educators, who worked closely with Gordeev, are also questions. If neither the parents, nor the medical psychologists, nor the teachers saw those monsters in the adolescent’s head that led him to crimes, then either he is a terrific actor, or there was a banal “finger-raising” or even lack of professionalism. On the other hand, the vigilance of the aforementioned syndrome of an excellent student could also manifest itself. Like, an excellent botanist, what to take from him - will mature! Only now Gordeev will grow up in another place, and the lives that he has taken away from people will not be returned by any kind of maturation.

It is possible to search for the last in this case for a very long time, but is this the main thing? The easiest way, of course, is to blame the teacher or director, the manufacturers of computer toys, self-loading rifles, the creators of social networks or the Gordeevs' neighbors on the porch ... But it would be better to weigh everything cold (as far as possible with your head) and take measures that are not only " here and now ", but also systematically. Which will not force, but will anticipate. Do not push the next legislative fever, do not hit "on the road and sloppiness" with a bureaucratic scale, do not bend! - that's the main thing today. But then, the prosecutor’s office is already working in almost every educational institution, and even with the appearance that all teachers are provocateurs of criminal activity of schoolchildren, and all students are criminals ... With regard to the effectiveness of this particular method of dealing with potential crimes and offenses of the nature, which was demonstrated in Otradnoe, there are big doubts.

PS With regard to Gordeev, a criminal case was initiated under the articles "hostage taking", "murder" and "encroachment on the life of a law enforcement officer."

Sergey Gordeev’s mother refused to represent her son in court.

Such is the result of solipsism ...

The publication "Military Review" expresses condolences to the families and friends of the victims.
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259 comments
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  1. Name
    Name 6 February 2014 06: 19
    +23
    Let the investigators sort out the reasons that prompted the 10th grader to murder (he will most likely go to the "durka"), but that's why the guard missed it and why he is there in principle. request
    1. Sunjar
      Sunjar 6 February 2014 06: 47
      +66
      Quote: name
      why the guard missed and why is he there in principle


      Because, despite his old age, he wanted to save his life. And you cannot blame him for this. Personally, would you throw yourself at a weapon? Would you give your life by adding only one more dead person to this story, but without changing anything?

      But the fact that the father did not properly store the weapons did not monitor the state of his son - this is really important.
      1. Snoop
        Snoop 6 February 2014 07: 03
        +48
        But the guard could even call the police on his cell phone and report that the problem was with a teenager with firearms. And not just press a button. On the other hand, what did he do when the staff approached? I would inform them already directly.
        1. artifox
          artifox 6 February 2014 08: 28
          +23
          Quote: Snoop
          But the guard could even call the police on his cell phone and report that the problem was with a teenager with firearms. And not just press a button. On the other hand, what did he do when the staff approached? I would inform them already directly.

          Well, judging by the fact that the police went to the office where he was - they knew where to go. And most likely just from the guard. Another question is why they were unprepared for the shots ... We won’t know this anymore ...
          1. Siberia 9444
            Siberia 9444 6 February 2014 11: 11
            0
            They are only ready to suck dust pockets to law-abiding tax payers!
            1. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 6 February 2014 16: 01
              +18
              Sorry for the off-top repeat .
              Vitaly Churkin is trolling Samantha Power:

              Representatives of Russia and the United States at the UN exchanged taunts after the American ambassador invited Pussy Riot members to a meeting. In response, Russia's envoy Vitaly Churkin invited his colleague to join the punk band and organize a series of joint performances in religious centers around the world.

              The meeting with members of the punk band in New York was organized at the initiative of Samantha Power, US representative to the UN. Curtis Cooper, an official of the American mission, later said that during the “no more than half an hour conversation” they discussed “disturbing trends in Russia in the field of criminal law, as well as government actions aimed at suppressing dissent and fighting public organizations that protect basic human rights” .
              In response to a request from journalists to comment on this event, the representative of the Russian Federation at the UN Vitaly Churkin said that he was surprised that the American ambassador had not yet joined the punk group. “I think she could arrange for them to speak at the National Cathedral in Washington or even go on a world tour together,” the Russian diplomat suggested. According to Vitaly Churkin, the program of such a tour could be quite extensive. “First St. Peter's Basilica in Rome, then maybe Mecca in Saudi Arabia, and as a result a gala concert at the Wailing Wall in Jerusalem,” he listed. “I will be disappointed if Ambassador Power fails to do this.”
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. Saburov
                Saburov 6 February 2014 21: 59
                +3
                Ordinary, I'm sorry for the expression that I couldn’t put myself in my environment, this often happens, such people very often try to go to senior positions, then to recoup on subordinates, I had three such prosecutors from the class now in 79, yes bosses, although I both sent them, I still send them in spite of their status, because they remained so nerds.
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. core
            core 6 February 2014 14: 00
            -4
            is it a police co-op, the guard came to school, how should they behave, throw grenades at the office? the best they could do was not get involved. and wait for the negotiator, and better a woman. we still have a normal mentality pack, WE DO NOT SHOOT WOMEN.
            1. stranik72
              stranik72 6 February 2014 20: 18
              +1
              core
              "we still have a normal mentality .."
              They should have arrived in bulletproof vests, the instruction so requires. So our mentality is sometimes expensive for us.
              1. Andreitas
                Andreitas 6 February 2014 22: 50
                +1
                All is correct. I myself worked for several years in this system, and saw how the staff of the PSB work. As a rule, they come to alarm without body armor and helmets (they remain in the car). Hands in pockets, machine gun behind. Complete relaxation, and the absence of a sense of danger. Of course there were normal crews, but this is rare.
                1. Shur
                  Shur 6 February 2014 23: 26
                  +2
                  Those. it's not professionalism .. just not "level".
              2. Shur
                Shur 6 February 2014 23: 25
                0
                In the reports they say. that the vest did not help, then it was .. (or began to be). And then, maybe he is a Voroshilov shooter? And the head and neck .. not in defense.
              3. core
                core 7 February 2014 12: 57
                0
                the bullet hit the shoulder, side, in an unprotected place. HIS MAJESTY CASE.
        2. Alekseev
          Alekseev 6 February 2014 10: 55
          +10
          Quote: Snoop
          But the guard could call the police on his cell phone and inform

          It turns out the problem is in the guard! Yes, he certainly did everything as you, very corny, suggest.
          It's just who's guarding there ... Grandfathers and grandmothers of God dandelions, like the school watchman from the movie "Big Change", without any powers (and skills), except to press a button ...
          So the police did not expect, it is clear that the young man will immediately start shooting at them. Without many words...
          The situation has changed, we need a security system, and not only at school.
          We need the activity of citizens, cooperation with the police, and the restriction of propaganda not only of homosexuality, but of various fucking ideas and much more. The current security guards in 90% of cases - this is a quirk or money laundering, and in 10% for general order and complacency.
          1. Canep
            Canep 6 February 2014 13: 33
            +8
            The guard, according to many, is to blame because he remained alive.
            1. Shur
              Shur 6 February 2014 23: 47
              0
              You can't put it that way, it's hard to judge. Suppose a brother said the local "brothers" are suitable, such as a friend, brother, matchmaker, they know let me pass or something else, but it is not allowed. He refuses politely, says all questions outside the territory. And there, according to the contingent, it is clear that they were not limited to the first trip, under the "gas" sometimes "fuss" begins, different topics, assaults, etc. And where is the guarantee that they will not put on the knife corny? I also spoke to him on .. you need it .. He says if you take it, then you need to work normally or just leave. And then he left. And the criminal situation in our Republic of Tatarstan is the same .. Especially in the youth community.
          2. Snoop
            Snoop 6 February 2014 15: 14
            0
            It turns out ... did you carefully read the thread? The man replied that the guard wanted to live, so he didn’t jump on the trunk, I answered I could at least give more details about the problem.
          3. niki233
            niki233 6 February 2014 20: 14
            -1
            with the current police, no one who is sober-minded who has at least once encountered her will not cooperate.
            1. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 6 February 2014 21: 24
              +3
              Quote: niki233
              with the current police, no one who is sober-minded who has at least once encountered her will not cooperate.


              Kamrad answer, only honestly, if you can:

              - How often did you come across our police and under what circumstances?

              looks carefully
              1. stalkerwalker
                stalkerwalker 6 February 2014 23: 40
                +2
                Quote: Karlsonn
                looks carefully

                Something "left-handed" is too much.
                1. rereture
                  rereture 7 February 2014 00: 05
                  0
                  It seemed to me that they can shoot both from the right shoulder and from the left.
                  1. stalkerwalker
                    stalkerwalker 7 February 2014 00: 11
                    +2
                    Quote: rereture
                    It seemed to me that they can shoot both from the right shoulder and from the left.

                    Carlsson knows ... Can clarify.
                    1. Karlsonn
                      Karlsonn 7 February 2014 01: 11
                      +4
                      Quote: stalkerwalker
                      Carlsson knows ... Can clarify.


                      Their photographer asked them to stand up so that the picture was photogenic, well, in general, training in shooting from the "wrong" shoulder is regular, and single-point with three-point belts, as it were, also hint that the weapon will be used depending on the situation, for example, when avoiding obstacles (buildings , car - anything) clockwise the weapon moves to point-blank on the left shoulder; there are also a lot of combat countermeasures, both here and abroad, based on the fact that the enemy is right-handed, which means that the classic schemes must be broken in order to more effectively send the enemy to the country of the Eternal Hunt.
                  2. alleksSalut4507
                    alleksSalut4507 7 February 2014 00: 53
                    0
                    and what else to do. the main thing is well-fed. don’t brush off cockroaches with kayla.
            2. 31231
              31231 6 February 2014 22: 44
              0
              Have you collaborated with her? May I have a closer look?
              1. Karlsonn
                Karlsonn 6 February 2014 23: 29
                +2
                Quote: 31231
                Have you collaborated with her?


                You could say that, but does it surprise you?

                Quote: 31231
                May I have a closer look?


                Why are you interested in?
          4. Shur
            Shur 6 February 2014 23: 39
            +2
            Not for everyone, yes. My brother worked conscientiously. Constantly stuck with the local punks. He had nowhere to go like a disabled person. But he is such a disabled person, as in the famous film, "Who is disabled here, well, me, why should I?" laughing He got away from the fact that there is no protection, and there the drug dealers hang around, threaten. And he was on the bird's rights. You have to live, that's how it worked. And he built all sorts of greyhounds, too, "Like, yes, I hear I'll pass, right?" In one school, after school, there was a showdown on the territory. A total of one 200 and a pair of 300 .. Gone again. When he ran up to separate it, it was too late. First of all, he waited for the students to pass, and only then ran to the other side of the territory where the "battle" was going on. But who cares, the incident, and there was a guard? You can't call the place quiet there. Constantly calling out the outfit. But while they arrived, they sometimes raised them. Yes, and he got it.
          5. alleksSalut4507
            alleksSalut4507 7 February 2014 00: 47
            -1
            quirk and grabbing money admitted to the tender.
          6. Anper
            Anper 7 February 2014 15: 58
            0
            Quote: Alekseev
            need a security system

            No security system will prevent the molecular civil war that has been going on for a long time in the West - multiple and seemingly senseless violence at all levels, from family and school to the top of the state. It is not organized by any party and does not pursue any goals. Even impossible to reassure it by satisfying some needs. Nobody directly puts forward them, and they are so contradictory that no middle ground can be found. Violence and destruction as an end in itself is a disease of the so-called. liberal society. There is only one hope for the Slavic mentality and that the media will not cover such school topics - teenagers are very prone to imitate, and this news is like a catalyst for the next disadvantaged by something or someone.
        3. Draz
          Draz 6 February 2014 12: 43
          +4
          I called the 112 number ... 30 min is busy, well, the situation was not so explosive (without weapons).
          The guard was probably at a loss, for he was not ready to be a student! Will come with a gun.
          Perhaps he could turn around and pretend that he was leaving, and when the teenager turns away and attacks him from the back, but what has been done, you will not return it ... Too late to talk about how he could act or could not.
          1. Shur
            Shur 7 February 2014 00: 00
            +1
            When I went to see my brother at the school where he worked as a security guard, I constantly saw how some students "like children", show aggression to put it mildly. He says yes, I don't pay attention anymore. Those who can really do something he knew and for them and their friends from the yard constantly kept watch. So it is difficult to keep track of, the window will be opened, just anyone, then they will fight themselves, then they will strangle someone. In general, there is enough. But many guards simply "don't notice" this.
      2. Hort
        Hort 6 February 2014 07: 28
        +14
        Yes, not the fact that he stored incorrectly. The son could well know where the keys to the safe are
        1. Tersky
          Tersky 6 February 2014 08: 54
          +36
          Quote: hort
          The son could well know where the keys to the safe are

          Papik had to carry the keys to the safe with him, and not stick them in the house, where he had learned all his son’s caches for 15 years as our Father. I have keys on my common bundle and are always with me, although the children are already under thirty. However, the grandchildren are growing up ...
          1. Canep
            Canep 6 February 2014 10: 19
            +11
            It’s better not to keep weapons at home. If you are afraid that someone will attack you, put an iron door. Using a firearm, even for self-defense, this is a 99% criminal case, with the defender landing.

            So that this does not become a regular occurrence in America, the guy should be imprisoned for the maximum term (although he would have looked at the tag, he would have been older than any lawyer and would not have dismissed him) and removed the dock about him in a year or two. a film with all the details of his stay in the zone and showing it to the widest public.
            1. rereture
              rereture 6 February 2014 10: 39
              +6
              Sorry, but you will not say where to store the weapon and how to use it.
              1. Siberia 9444
                Siberia 9444 6 February 2014 11: 07
                -2
                Totally agree with you rereture!
              2. The comment was deleted.
              3. 31231
                31231 6 February 2014 22: 51
                +1
                Sorry, but you will not say where to store the weapon and how to use it.

                There is a law that says that. And everyone must observe it. Only here for the violation, not many are responsible.
                Why do I, having access to explosive materials, realize the responsibility for their theft by an outsider and do not allow this?
                1. rereture
                  rereture 6 February 2014 23: 18
                  0
                  Because you are responsible in this matter. smile
            2. Tersky
              Tersky 6 February 2014 10: 53
              +16
              Quote: Canep
              It’s better not to keep weapons at home.

              An interesting point .. And where do you think the hunter should keep it, is it not in the gun of the local Ministry of Internal Affairs?
              Quote: Canep
              If you are afraid that someone will attack you, put an iron door

              For one, do not forget the iron windows, the minefield, and the Bruno spiral around the perimeter ...
              1. Canep
                Canep 6 February 2014 13: 13
                -4
                Quote: Tersky
                For one, do not forget the iron windows, the minefield, and the Bruno spiral around the perimeter ...

                Well, I don’t have SUCH persecution mania, if it seems to you that all this is necessary, then please, you don’t need to put mines, the police will not understand, I recommend that I limit myself to an electrified fence.
                1. Tersky
                  Tersky 6 February 2014 16: 49
                  +2
                  Quote: Canep
                  Well, I don’t have SUCH persecution mania, if it seems to you that all this is necessary

                  Sergey, I didn’t give advice
                  Quote: Canep
                  If you’re afraid that someone will attack you, put an iron door,
                  , I just continued the topic of your not quite successful comment. So do not take it as personal. laughing !
            3. Hort
              Hort 6 February 2014 11: 26
              +5
              very interesting, but where do you need to store weapons ?! Especially if you take into account the requirements of the federal law "On weapons"?

              As for the use of a firearm, if it is used in a house / apartment or in a manor - i.e. On the territory of the defender and will be used to suppress the attack (not theft), there will be no landing, although the nerves shake + condition can give
              1. Canep
                Canep 6 February 2014 13: 19
                +2
                If there will be 200, landing arrow is provided. Let 2 years but have to sit.
                1. Hort
                  Hort 6 February 2014 14: 22
                  +1
                  it will depend on the lawyer. Although if they do the 200th through the door, then 105 of the Criminal Code is definitely
                2. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 6 February 2014 14: 50
                  0
                  Quote: Canep
                  If there will be 200, landing arrow is provided. Let 2 years but have to sit.


                  Lies!

                  ... in half of the registered cases of the use of LLC in the Moscow region last year, only half were recognized as criminal, despite the fact that the authorities have a pronounced negative attitude against LLC ...

                  ...Amur Region, January 31, IA “Port Amur”. Russian Minister of the Interior Vladimir Kolokoltsev supported the petition of Amur public men to reward Khabarovsk police officers who opened fire on hooligans. ...
                  1. Hort
                    Hort 7 February 2014 07: 33
                    0
                    Well, there’s a little bit different things: OOP is a rubberblower, and we talked about hunting)
                    1. Karlsonn
                      Karlsonn 7 February 2014 14: 16
                      0
                      Quote: hort
                      Well, there’s a little bit different things: OOP is a rubberblower, and we talked about hunting)


                      Miles sorry, I was completely fooled at work who has something to hurt, but nevertheless, with our legislation on self-defense, only half of the cases of injuries were recognized as criminal, and this is also an indicator, although I admit that the firearm is another caliber.
            4. core
              core 6 February 2014 14: 04
              +7
              ANSWER THAT BETTER CRIMINAL RESPONSIBILITY, OR A DEAD FAMILY, BUT BY LAW.
              1. Canep
                Canep 6 February 2014 14: 20
                -2
                Quote: core
                ANSWER THAT BETTER CRIMINAL RESPONSIBILITY, OR A DEAD FAMILY, BUT BY LAW.

                I do not understand, in Russia, that there is still a gangster mess? To listen to you with Tersky, you come to the conclusion that you regularly have to shoot back from bandits, and the police do not come to calls at all, or just to count the 200s and 300s. Or for you to call the police not in a patsansky way? I am 42 years old and with arms in my hands I had to protect my family only in the army. And I live in a rather criminal city of Ekibas. Believe me, you have many times more chances to lose your family in a car accident, and no one will refuse the car from you. And then if the bandits decide, God forbid, to kill, then you will not even have time to reach your gun.
                You won’t carry the barrel with you everywhere, it’s only possible to use it at home, but if you’re at home, close and call the police.
                1. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 6 February 2014 15: 02
                  +5
                  Quote: Canep
                  And then if the bandits decide, God forbid, to kill, then you will not even have time to reach your gun.
                  You won’t carry the barrel with you everywhere, it’s only possible to use it at home, but if you’re at home, close and call the police.


                  As practice shows, your words are very controversial:

                  ...Five hooligans, having beaten the police, dragged them into the vestibule and tried to throw them off the train on the go. Fortunately for law enforcement officers, the train just approached the Grushevoy station.
                  Then the bandits, having taken the service weapon from one of the policemen, returned to the car, took money and documents from civilian passengers, took away several helmets and bulletproof vests from the soldiers, and jumped out onto the platform.
                  Four out of five young people decided to take possession of the car and hide on it, because, despite the strongest intoxication, they began to realize that this spree for them would not end safely.
                  The fifth, apparently the most insane, remained on the train, where he was detained.
                  Four of his accomplices broke into one of the houses near the station to demand a car from the owners. However, only the 15-year-old girl was in the house. Without thinking twice, scumbags took her hostage, and demanded to take her to a house where there is a car.
                  The child took the bandits to the neighbors, where the last act of this criminal drama broke out.
                  On the threshold of uninvited guests met the landlord, according to police, previously convicted. Threatening with weapons, the bandits demanded his car keys. There were small children in the house, and the owner, fearing that the four scumbags would not stop at the keys to the car, decided to resist them.
                  Grabbing a stool, he literally split it on the head of one of the attackers. The second bandit shot at the owner, injuring him in the leg, but the man grabbed a knife from the table, and several times hit him who shot in response.
                  ...


                  Quote: Canep
                  I do not understand, in Russia, that there is still a gangster mess?


                  Is this news for you? belay

                  Sagra, the village of Kushchevskaya and so on. etc..

                2. core
                  core 6 February 2014 18: 45
                  +1
                  you apparently live on the green line. either on the ruble behind the barrier. and do not know that pensioners are killed and crippled with a hammer for 100 rubles at the entrance.
                  that it’s no longer possible to go into nature without a gun, spend the night in a tent.
                  1. nerd.su
                    nerd.su 6 February 2014 19: 11
                    0
                    Quote: core
                    that it’s no longer possible to go into nature without a gun, spend the night in a tent.

                    Oops! Are you going to nature in Izmailovsky Park? If you want, I will advise you on routes, if in two weeks you meet people more than once, then you’re in a busy season smile
                  2. Walk
                    Walk 7 February 2014 07: 14
                    0
                    I live in Krasnoyarsk. About thirty years I’ve been traveling to nature. For all the time not a single excess with inadequate. True, the last few years began to get on jet skis. Previously, they didn’t get to the places where I usually go to rest, but now they have bred like cockroaches.
                3. core
                  core 6 February 2014 19: 16
                  0
                  here for the brothers of Kazakhs they are preparing a new revolution, as in Ukraine. that's where the revelry begins. Kazakhs are a nomadic nation and they are normal people while the power is strong and sane. But it will be like in Ukraine. you can’t drive along the roads in Kazakhstan, EVERYTHING IS STEPPE AND NEARBY, MY. WHO MAKES GOT THAT AND THE MAIN WILL. And believe me, you won’t meet any police, all your police will guard the current BOSOV.
                4. Shur
                  Shur 7 February 2014 00: 13
                  0
                  I don't believe it, not even once. Crime news is sometimes shocked, I don’t know how it is in Ekibastuz, but in the Republic of Tatarstan, this is in complete order. Plus, the "true" ones add color. There are many times more domestic crime in the republics.
                  When there was no limit, I went to work with an awl.
              2. rc56
                rc56 6 February 2014 17: 41
                +6
                It is true: "It is better for me to be judged by twelve than by six!"
                1. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 6 February 2014 17: 53
                  0
                  Quote: rc56
                  It is true: "It is better for me to be judged by twelve than by six!"


                  Agree hi , we even consider sporting achievements (titles, regalia) the court will consider aggravating circumstances if, during a fight or attack, one of the attackers leaves for a good hunting country.
            5. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 6 February 2014 14: 42
              +5
              Quote: Canep
              It’s better not to keep weapons at home.


              Respected Canep tell me what to do for those who are supposed to use personal weapons by the type of service (about hunters, collectors, weapon lovers and others have already written comrades below)?
              Maybe we will remove all the parking lots outside the city, and when issuing the car to the owner we will conduct a medical check - thereby solve the problem of drunken people on the roads? wink Since, according to statistics, the most widespread murder weapon among native aspens is a knife, can we forbid knives to hell and will we give out one knife for the front door, and two for the village?

              Quote: Canep
              The use of a firearm, even for self-defense, is in 99% a criminal case, with the landing of the defender.


              Why is this ridiculous exaggeration? Yes, we have imperfect legislation regarding self-defense, but the situation is far from 99%.

              Quote: Canep
              To prevent this from happening


              To avoid this, it is necessary to solve a huge number of complex problems, I will list only the obvious ones:
              - solve the problem with the district (their number, salary, amount of work and professionalism) so that monitoring compliance with the rules for storing weapons is not reduced to a check and a signature;
              - pay attention to the development in the country of a culture of handling personal weapons;
              - approach the problem of protecting schools not from the commercial side (like, let’s introduce metal detectors in schools (my company is ready to start deliveries)), but from a practical one;
              - yes, there should be state propaganda and a movie on the first channel in prime time is a great idea; there is much more, but writing a sheet is too lazy.
              1. Canep
                Canep 6 February 2014 15: 14
                0
                Then YESAA, it looks like the cops have weapons for beauty. In Kazakhstan, it seems calmer. And what is it every day in Russia?
                1. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 6 February 2014 15: 31
                  0
                  Quote: Canep
                  Then YESAA, it looks like the cops have weapons for beauty.


                  There is no beauty, but it is not necessary to dump everything in a heap - both the police, and self-defense, and cases of banditry, and this case.

                  Quote: Canep
                  In Kazakhstan, it seems calmer.




                  1. Karlsonn
                    Karlsonn 6 February 2014 15: 35
                    +1
                    Quote: Canep
                    And what is it every day in Russia?


                    Ukraine, in Kharkov, on North Saltovka, near the Klass supermarket on 36 Commandarka Street, in the evening of November 28 the collector's car was shot. Two employees of the State Guard died.

                  2. Canep
                    Canep 6 February 2014 17: 13
                    0
                    You forgot about Chelakh, 15 corpses! But what does this have to do with street crime that can be defended against with a gun, or do you seriously think you can prevent a bank robbery with a gun? And then you say to the police, - "and I walked past the bank from the hunt ..."
                    By the way the huntsman on Arkankergen a gun didn’t help; he was also killed.
                    1. Karlsonn
                      Karlsonn 6 February 2014 18: 06
                      +2
                      Quote: Canep
                      You forgot about Chelakh, 15 corpses!


                      I was not going to post the entire criminal report on our countries over the past decade.

                      Quote: Canep
                      Just what does this have to do with street crime, from which you can protect yourself with weapons


                      I reasonably showed that banditry has a place to be both in Russia, and in Kazakhstan, and in Ukraine.

                      Quote: Canep
                      or do you seriously believe that you can prevent a bank robbery with a gun?


                      I seriously believe that if the few hunting rifles that were on hand in Sagra would not be stored at home (as you suggest), but somewhere else this would lead to mass casualties.

                      Before writing naive, I recommend thinking about the situation from different angles.

                      Quote: Canep
                      By the way the huntsman on Arkankergen a gun didn’t help; he was also killed.


                      I will allow myself to develop from your argument a logical chain:

                      - Germans who defended Berlin did not even save tanks with howitzers ...
                      1. nerd.su
                        nerd.su 6 February 2014 18: 22
                        +2
                        Quote: Karlsonn
                        I reasonably showed that banditry has a place to be both in Russia, and in Kazakhstan, and in Ukraine.

                        I agree, but you just as reasonably proved that the presence of weapons does not save from an armed criminal. And the offender, if the rates suit him, the possibility of receiving an armed rebuff does not stop. But the likelihood that if you have a trunk, they will quickly overwhelm you, equal to almost 100%. Collectors then survive poorly ...
                      2. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 February 2014 19: 12
                        +1
                        Quote: bot.su
                        I agree, but you just as reasonably proved that the presence of weapons does not save from an armed criminal.


                        This is so.

                        Quote: bot.su
                        And the offender, if the rates suit him, the possibility of receiving an armed rebuff does not stop.


                        In this case, we are talking about something else:
                        - the comrade proposes to ban the storage of gunshots at home in general, which I am very surprised; Cases of an attack on collectors of armed gangs were cited in response to this statement.

                        Quote: Canep
                        I do not understand, in Russia, that there is still a gangster mess?


                        Quote: bot.su
                        But the likelihood that if you have a trunk, you will simply be overwhelmed quickly, equal to almost 100%. Collectors then survive poorly ...


                        we there again about something else:
                        - It’s one thing to attack collectors and completely different when people in Sagra (and in other similar cases) were saved from physical violence only by firearms, personal weapons.
                      3. nerd.su
                        nerd.su 6 February 2014 19: 30
                        -1
                        Quote: Karlsonn
                        - the comrade proposes to ban the storage of gunshots at home in general,

                        And, yes, I looked above, it really doesn’t offer a case.

                        I don’t know what Sagra saved from there. After a fight in our time, everyone without a lawyer refuses to speak, and they smoothly lay with a lawyer ...

                        But, in any case, in Russia there is no need for a legal short-barrel, and let anyone who wants to have hunting weapons.
                      4. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 February 2014 21: 26
                        0
                        Quote: bot.su
                        But, in any case, in Russia there is no need for a legal short-barrel, and let anyone who wants to have hunting weapons.


                        Kamrad - absolutely agree with you. drinks
          2. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 6 February 2014 19: 18
            +4
            Quote: Canep
            And what is it every day in Russia?

            Dear, maybe not every day, maybe not even every month ... But if every thirty years a person protects someone from a trick, it will be good. You probably don’t listen to the reports?
            It is time to instill responsibility at the level of fear of a shot at a turnip. The state should clearly understand that a 15-year-old trickster who thumps at night with friends is much less valuable than a law-abiding citizen returning home and having the misfortune to meet them. If the parents did not explain to the child that so good and what is bad ...
        2. Walk
          Walk 7 February 2014 07: 30
          0
          - solve the problem with the district (their number, salary, amount of work and professionalism) so that monitoring compliance with the rules for storing weapons is not reduced to a check and a signature;

          Just do not about the district. For information:
          1. The salary of district police officers is higher than that of an opera, with the same rank.
          2. The ceiling ranks at the precinct above. So, some operas have to be temporarily fictitiously transferred to district police officers in order to get the next rank, which limits the ceiling of the post.
          3. The precinct in most cases are not involved in work at all. Just for show.
          I once went to the district police officers in my area. Three elephants in the last stage of obesity are sitting and talking "through the lip". until he explained to them who paints the radishes in the ground red, they didn't even raise their seats.
          1. Karlsonn
            Karlsonn 7 February 2014 14: 21
            0
            Quote: Walk
            3. The precinct in most cases are not involved in work at all. Just for show.
            I once went to the district police officers in my area. Three baby elephants in the last stage of obesity are sitting and talking through the lip.


            Comrade, I had exactly that in mind.

            Quote: Karlsonn
            - solve the problem with the district (their number, salary, amount of work and professionalism) so that the control of compliance with the rules for storing weapons is not reduced to a tick and a signature;
    2. core
      core 6 February 2014 14: 03
      +1
      DO YOU NOT DRINK? you don’t go to the toilet, you don’t sleep with your wife, you don’t wash in the bath, and the keys on a pin to the coward’s firs are pinned? DO NOT RESCUE.
      1. Walk
        Walk 7 February 2014 07: 45
        +1
        It's not about who does what and how. Simply, in my opinion, if you have a weapon at home, you must be aware of the responsibility for ensuring that the weapon does not fall into the wrong hands. I don’t remember the exact quote, but Vysotsky-Zhiglov absolutely correctly said in the film that there are no unjustly punished people, and if the character of Jurassic correctly stored his weapons and sorted out his women, then nothing would have happened. In this case, not with women, but paid more attention to his son.
    3. ed65b
      ed65b 6 February 2014 15: 28
      +1
      Quote: Tersky
      Quote: hort
      The son could well know where the keys to the safe are

      Papik had to carry the keys to the safe with him, and not stick them in the house, where he had learned all his son’s caches for 15 years as our Father. I have keys on my common bundle and are always with me, although the children are already under thirty. However, the grandchildren are growing up ...

      this is how the card will fall, Pomazuna remember.
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. matross
      matross 6 February 2014 16: 41
      +5
      Quote: Tersky
      I have keys on my common bundle and are always with me, although the children are already under thirty. However, the grandchildren are growing up ...

      And in a dream, you clench them in a fist? In a family, if you don’t trust someone, it’s better not to have a weapon at all, you won’t follow ... I forgot, got sick, walked away for a minute, etc. The problem is not that dad h.erovo hid the keys, but that h.erovo raised his son.
    6. Scoun
      Scoun 6 February 2014 17: 17
      +6
      Quote: Tersky

      Dad should have

      I had to raise my son and not raise a "nerd" sorry, of course, but
      Pupils of school number 263 say that his grandmother often came for Sergey, who was waiting for the end of classes and a grandson outside the school fence. Gordeev was very shy about this, tried to go home alone, shouted at an elderly woman, seeing that the arrival of his grandmother caused ridicule from classmates.

      Naturally, this generates everything in the teenage mind (where hormones are raging)
      There was a lack of public recognition, feelings, their own "steepness" ... And then the picture - an excellent pupil with two trunks - “cool”, - apparently, Gordeev thought so, drawing up a plan in his hot head and being in the stage of “We'll Live Until Monday”.

      And the "seeds" for such terrible crap are sown by the media, savoring the breakvik and other "shooters"
      Chasing the "fried news"
      eg, "Komsomolskaya Pravda", "in hot pursuit" came out with a photo of the criminal, which is to the real criminal Sergey Gordeev had nothing to do ...

      It is necessary to punish the media for such zeal.
  2. 31231
    31231 6 February 2014 22: 47
    +2
    Well, at that! Dad is not to blame. He raised him and hid the keys. wink And in spite of him, his son was not brought up and found the keys. If you are not sure about your son, then bring the keys to the bank cell. Judging by the trunks, the pope had money for a bank cell and there was no time to look after his son and weapons.
    Why does a gross violation of traffic rules qualify for killing by negligence, and with careless storage of weapons does not qualify?
  • Name
    Name 6 February 2014 07: 35
    +3
    Quote: Sunjar
    , wanted to save his life. And you cannot blame him for this. Personally, would you throw yourself at a weapon? They would give their lives

    Since 2002 of the year, he has been guarding everything in security structures: objects, people, goods ... He is a security guard, otherwise why is he there ... a. The scope of basic duties in this case includes (in short):
    -Providing personnel safety;
    - ensuring the safety of material values;
    - ensuring the safety of equipment at the guarded facility.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Hon
      Hon 6 February 2014 10: 05
      +1
      Quote: name
      Since 2002, he has been guarding everything in security structures: objects, people, goods ... He is a security guard, otherwise why is he there ... a. The scope of the main responsibilities in this case includes (in short): - ensuring the safety of personnel; - ensuring the safety of material assets; - ensuring the safety of equipment at the guarded facility.

      work for 20 tr per month, in fact, such protection is the usual watchman watchmen. Do you require feats from them? you can take or hire a private security officer a level higher with weapons, etc. but it is much more expensive.
      1. Name
        Name 6 February 2014 10: 51
        0
        Quote: Hon
        ? you can take or hire a private security officer a level higher with weapons

        [i] [i] no comments [/ i] [i] [/ i]
      2. Name
        Name 6 February 2014 11: 25
        0
        Quote: Hon
        or hire a chop level up with weapons

        Tolerance is juvenile, Egyptian city .... tolerance with juvenile ...They must be sure TOUCHLESS!
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Hon
          Hon 6 February 2014 16: 38
          0
          Quote: name
          Tolerance in our country Juvenile, Egyptian city .... tolerance with juvenility ... They must be sure of the untouchability!

          What are you talking about?
      3. Walk
        Walk 7 February 2014 07: 50
        0
        What are you all about salary? Not happy - look for another job. But one must fulfill one's duties, especially if the safety of people depends on their fulfillment.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Hon
          Hon 7 February 2014 08: 34
          0
          Quote: Walk
          What are you all about salary? Not happy - look for another job. But one must fulfill one's duties, especially if the safety of people depends on their fulfillment.

          And he fulfilled his duties. He called the police, raised the alarm. More is not required of him. If you read the instructions of such guards, then they are even forbidden to use force. Moreover, what could he do against an armed man? Order posthumously receive?
  • Geisenberg
    Geisenberg 6 February 2014 13: 18
    -6
    Quote: Sunjar
    Quote: name
    why the guard missed and why is he there in principle


    Because, despite his old age, he wanted to save his life. And you cannot blame him for this. Personally, would you throw yourself at a weapon? Would you give your life by adding only one more dead person to this story, but without changing anything?

    But the fact that the father did not properly store the weapons did not monitor the state of his son - this is really important.


    Why then went to the guard. This is a job where it is guaranteed that you have to risk your life. They are therefore hired to work so that they take risks. A guard dressed up when he saw the trunk and that's the whole answer.
    1. Scoun
      Scoun 6 February 2014 18: 25
      +2
      Quote: Geisenberg
      A guard dressed up when he saw the trunk and that's the whole answer.

      The guard "got away" let us pass (that he was supposed to shoot at the child? And most likely he has no weapon) pressed the panic button, the outfit arrived - but the outfit did not expect that our child would start shooting at them like in a nightmare.
      (((((
      What is a pressed alarm button in an educational institution? In most cases, for representatives of the guard or the police, this is a signal that one of the students is simply hooligan, and not a signal that something more than serious is really happening at school ...
  • Algor73
    Algor73 6 February 2014 13: 50
    +2
    "... But the fact that the father improperly stored the weapon, did not monitor the condition of his son - this is really important."
    So almost all gun owners keep weapons. But this is not so important, since it is impossible to trace everything. And the guard’s behavior is not so important. Another thing is important. Previously, we gasped and gasped, reading the news about America, what is happening there in their schools. And now with us. So something is wrong. And not only in the process of education. Probably in the upbringing problemma. And you can’t do it on your own. We need a nationwide program, so that education comes from the kindergarten, and not as it is now - the parents are to blame. Everyone is to blame. School should not give only one knowledge. first of all, teachers were transferred. But the trouble is the race for the ruble.
  • core
    core 6 February 2014 13: 57
    +1
    do you have an adult son? if there is, then you must understand that living in the same house you can not save everything in SECRETS. the father could not carry the safe to work. do not repeat television nonsense. if needed. then the child will come up with a hundred reasons to hold the keys to the safe in his hands.
    1. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 7 February 2014 16: 32
      0
      Quote: core
      the father could not carry the safe to work.

      Did you come up with a digital (code) lock yesterday?
  • 222222
    222222 6 February 2014 14: 33
    +3
    1. What is the guard at the entrance of the school for? Do not miss outsiders respectable citizens.
    2. What is written by the guard in the instructions in case of penetration of an armed criminal? Naturally try to press the panic button. Private security -3- 5 minutes should be in place and not jump on a gun .. When he was at the time he himself instructed his guards (but not the school)
    3. What are the school guards armed with? At best, with a baton .. At best, can stop a drunkard ..
    4. Is it possible for one person to protect the school as an object? the answer is predictable .. I wouldn’t go through the door, I would crawl out the window ..
    5 And the main question is whether schools are protected from more serious intrusions and actions? ..... A serious organization is able to penetrate any object .. To minimize the threat ..
    6.What is the reason for the crime of a successful student ..? Demoralization of society .. Career-money-movie-zombie box ... But, "mani-money money" as Abba sang, first of all .. NOT MORALITY in the first place, but money ... (prestigious university-career ..) ..
    7. By whom, Why is society demoralized? ...
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 6 February 2014 14: 42
      -1
      Quote: 222222
      The demoralization of society .. Career -money -kino-zombie box ...

      Well, still very "kind" computer toys. As far as I know, in the USA and Europe, blood in shooting games should be blue or green, so as not to injure the psyche of children. And our government is more worried about smoking wolves from Nu pogodi than streams of realistic blood from monitor screens. hi
      1. rereture
        rereture 6 February 2014 15: 16
        +3
        It is only in Germany that the blood is green, but in the USA everything is fine, and there is everything in the gut and blood. But computer games have nothing to do with it. Yeah, damn it, with my grandfather from the age of 5 I went to cut and carve pigs, and I did not grow up a psychopath.
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 6 February 2014 16: 09
          -1
          Quote: rereture
          with his grandfather from the age of 5 he went to slaughter and carve pigs, and he did not grow up a psychopath.

          Pigs to pigs, I also slaughtered them, I beat rabbits and a bird myself, children watch, I do not forbid. You need to know what we eat. But in shooting games they shoot people, and this is different. If the moral barrier is crossed in the game, then in life it becomes much more transparent.
          Quote: rereture
          It is only in Germany that the blood is green, but in the USA everything is fine, and the intestines and blood

          Did not know. but this, by the way, can explain why in the States they shoot in schools much more often than in Europe. These are my conclusions.
          1. rereture
            rereture 6 February 2014 17: 41
            +2
            What is the moral barrier? You did not play war games in the yard as a child? There, too, the children, though not for real, shoot at each other, and pretend to be killed.

            In shooting games they do not shoot at people. And in moving models on the screen. There is more violence on TV and in religious books than in games. He played different games from the age of 6 when his father bought a game console. And in different games despite the age rating. He’s not a psychopath, there’s no desire to kill people.
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 6 February 2014 19: 22
              0
              Quote: rereture
              And in moving models on the screen

              Are Postal 2 and GTA not shooting at people? After such games, they look at people as models. I won’t prove it, talk to the psychologist about the contents of the comp game. hi
              1. rereture
                rereture 6 February 2014 19: 32
                +2
                As if I did not play Postal 2, do not believe it when I played it I was about 13 years old.
                Isn't Postal 2 shooting at people?


                No. In imitation of people, yes. Do you think the model women in the game are full-fledged people? Well, or a target in the shooting range, also consider a full-fledged person?

                For some reason, comedies with black humor are shown at 20:00, and games with black humor cannot be played.

                By the way, this game can be completed without a single shot.
    2. plut-k
      plut-k 6 February 2014 18: 51
      0
      many times to the second
      I fully support.
    3. plut-k
      plut-k 6 February 2014 18: 51
      0
      many times to the second
      I fully support.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Alexander Romanov
    Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 07: 41
    +23
    Sorry about what happened. Let me go home to my parents.
    Damn it, I would add, I won’t do it anymore. I have seen enough films, played enough games, why not shoot.
    Quote: name
    , but that's why the guard missed and why he is there in principle

    And if a guard rushed at him and tried to stop him and died, would you say that he is a bad guard? People are all different and getting into stressful situations, behave differently. Some without thinking about themselves and their loved ones rush to the trunk, while others fall into a stupor. Still others forget that they are security guards and run away. When we are sitting in front of computers, we become strategists who know how to behave properly in any situation — we talk a lot in short.
    1. invisibility
      invisibility 6 February 2014 08: 02
      +33
      Is Gordeev's crime a trend? Hardly. Someone from this tragedy would like to concoct a trend is a fact.
      This statement of the author suggests that he has not been in a modern school for a long time. I saw it myself, my friends told me how the children and the worst of THEM PARENTS behave. A parent with a mosquito may publicly insult a teacher for being unsuccessful in his subject. And the mutt will grin. The student can throw a tantrum right in the classroom. If you describe everything, you need another article ...
      Gordeev's crime is a trend! The crime of his parent is a trend! School security, the mental state of youth, the teacher’s lack of rights, and another million questions are all a trend.
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 08: 21
        +21
        Quote: invisible
        A parent with a mosquito may publicly insult a teacher for being unsuccessful in his subject. And the mutt will grin.

        Yes, let the teacher try at school to make the child wash the floors in the classroom, as was the case in our time. The next day, mother will come running and seal the whole school in the use of child labor. The state protects our children so that the deputies will need to come up with a law protecting us from children.
      2. Volodin
        6 February 2014 08: 48
        +9
        Dear Reader! The author is directly related to the education system. With the fact that teachers are being turned into robots with no rights, I completely agree, but how does this translate into the tendency that a person with obvious mental disabilities took up arms? Or, in our country, every teenager is capable of throwing a tantrum in class or shooting a teacher, even if the parents are "with money"? There have been diots, psychopaths and maniacs, as well as irresponsible parents at all times. So with the "trend" you are clearly excited. Only, mind you, no offense. You expressed your opinion, I - mine.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. invisibility
          invisibility 6 February 2014 08: 56
          +2
          Quote: Volodin
          Only, chur, no offense. You expressed your opinion, I - your

          Yes, I'm a stupid boy !!
          I do not agree. The trend is on the face. It is just beginning and ending it is not at school.
          Quote: Volodin
          Or, in our country, every teenager is capable of throwing a tantrum in class or shooting a teacher, even if the parents are "with money"?

          Alexei, if there is everyone, then this is no longer a trend, a fait accompli!
          Quote: Volodin
          psychopaths and maniacs, as well as irresponsible parents were at all times

          Of course and no doubt! And remember how many children from disadvantaged families the school put on its feet?
          Quote: invisible
          This statement of the author suggests that he has not been in a modern school for a long time.

          I'm sorry.
        3. The comment was deleted.
        4. invisibility
          invisibility 6 February 2014 09: 16
          +5
          Forgot ..
          Quote: Volodin
          I completely agree with the fact that teachers are turned into disenfranchised robots, but how does this flow into the tendency that a person with obvious mental deviations has taken up arms?

          Here! Is daddy's stupidity not a trend?
          And it's not even about the mental state of the son! WEAPONS IN YOUR HOUSE !!!!!!!
          I have no words.
          I am outraged. because there’s a safe with weapons in the house! Not like children, adult relatives do not have access to the safe !! The key is always with me.
        5. Volkhov
          Volkhov 6 February 2014 22: 50
          0
          The school shooter is a descendant of the Soviet superman (Gordeev), is this his final exam in the world of secret power, the first? resonant special operation.
          http://svyatorus.com/politika/2330-ispoved-sverhcheloveka.html
          http://atnews.org/news/ehto_ne_sergej_gordeev_ili_komu_nuzhny_tonny_vranja_pro_r
          asstrel_v_263_shkole/2014-02-05-12627
          http://atnews.org/news/pro_evrejskikh_strelkov/2014-02-06-12663
          http://www.mk.ru/social/article/2014/02/05/980811-posle-strelbyi-v-shkole-za-neb
          rezhnoe-hranenie-oruzhiya-hotyat-sazhat-na-2-goda.html
          You just need to limit the use of weapons, you need an example and it was created, and the speed of the proposal of the new law (there are long approvals) indicates the planning procedure.
          Rejoice that they are not improving the protection of chemical plants.
      3. Volodin
        6 February 2014 08: 48
        +2
        Dear Reader! The author is directly related to the education system. I completely agree with the fact that teachers are being turned into robots without rights, but how does this translate into a tendency that a person with obvious mental disabilities took up arms? Or, in our country, every teenager is able to throw a tantrum in the classroom or shoot a teacher, even if the parents are "with money"? , psychopaths and maniacs, as well as irresponsible parents have been at all times. So with the "trend" you are clearly excited. Only, mind you, no offense. You expressed your opinion, I - mine.
      4. skullcap
        skullcap 6 February 2014 13: 24
        +8
        Quote: invisible
        Is Gordeev's crime a trend? Hardly. Someone from this tragedy would like to concoct a trend is a fact.


        The trend is evident. You may not want to see her, but she is clearly visible for more than one decade. This is the trend of moral degradation of our society. And it is due to the reorientation of the “educated” and “progressive” strata to the Western model of building society: democracy, liberalism, human rights (where people of every kind are considered to be fundamentally every kind of renegade from various crooks to LGBT freaks and serial killers, and a healthy part of the population is forced tolerance: endure, feed, water and cherish this scum in every possible way), individualism (masking extreme egoism) and other similar “values”.
        And this bloody episode is only a particular manifestation of this tendency.
        A return to our eternal moral values ​​is needed to reverse this trend. And in the family, and at school, and, most importantly, in the ideological policy of the state. And for this you need to ensure that only decent people are in the power structures.
        The practice of the same US shows that no matter how much you increase the number and training of police officers in schools, this does not lead to a reduction in such crimes. On the contrary, their number continues to grow.
        It is necessary to take up EDUCATION, and children - first of all, for they are our future.
        So in school, everything must be done with the exact opposite in relation to what the Ministry of Education has recently done. Not to reduce, but to increase the number of hours in the Russian language and the great Russian literature, to study the history of the great Russian people from the standpoint of the interests not of the Western, but of our society. Because it is precisely it that is the most honest and fair. To teach children and remind adults that Russian culture has historically developed on the principles that Christ preached, and which in Soviet times were reflected in the Code of the Builder of Communism. “Thou shalt not kill,” “Thou shalt not steal,” “Do not commit adultery,” “He who does not work shall not eat,” “Everyone is for everyone, all for one,” “Man is a friend, comrade and brother,” Honesty and truthfulness, moral purity, simplicity and modesty in public and private life "," Irreconcilability towards injustice, idleness, dishonesty, careerism, acquisitiveness "and others.
        Instead of the current Western-style censorship in the media called “format”, go back to your previous model so that the flow of violence and slops does not flow into the still weak children's minds.
        And adults also need to take care. Why did the president decide to protect only children from pederastic propaganda? I also do not want to deal with this dirt and I do not know a single person who would at least care. Why doesn't the president protect my rights to a healthy life?
        But computer science is quite possible to begin to study together with physics, because earlier - from the 1 class - it is teaching children to electronic toys, their deliberate withdrawal from the real world to the virtual world - an illusory one.
        And in general, the school should be returned to the Soviet time, when it was not an organization for the provision of services, even educational ones, something like a bath-and-laundry combine, but an educational institution. And so that teachers and, especially, their heads from the ministry should be concerned not only with the level of “aikyu”, but above all with the state of the souls of the children.
        Only then no one will have the idea to deal with his neighbor through violence.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. invisibility
          invisibility 6 February 2014 16: 21
          +3
          Oh how right you are! It is strange that the authorities, who usually studied in a Soviet school, do not want to understand this!
      5. The comment was deleted.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. vasiliysxx
      vasiliysxx 6 February 2014 08: 38
      +3
      , but that's why the guard missed and why he is there in principle


      Then you need to ask this question first of all to the security agency, which employs untrained pensioners in the pursuit of profit.
      1. Babon
        Babon 6 February 2014 09: 55
        +3
        I remember my school, the guard knew all the students, and did not let us in, only without replaceable shoes. Why should this guard not let a student go to school? And he was also not obliged to search, then they went into the locker room themselves and hung up their jackets, there was already nobody there, there was a lot to carry. So it’s not a matter of the guard, but of the father, who did not keep track of the weapons.
        1. Vladimirets
          Vladimirets 6 February 2014 11: 38
          +4
          Quote: Babon
          And I’m not obliged to search either,

          Not only not obliged, but also not entitled.
      2. Gomunkul
        Gomunkul 6 February 2014 10: 08
        +8
        Then you need to ask this question first of all to a security agency that employs untrained pensioners in the pursuit of profit
        At one time, though not for long, he worked at a security agency as a security guard, and so, the security guard’s task is not to die heroically at the guarded object, his task is as quickly as possible, and most importantly not at the cost of his own life, to call the capture group to the object entrusted to him in case of an emergency. hi
      3. The comment was deleted.
    4. Name
      Name 6 February 2014 08: 42
      +4
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      People are all different and getting into stressful situations behave differently.

      "... Gordeev, according to all the same Egorov, put something on the floor and walked over to him, pointing the barrel of a small-bore rifle (this is how the guard characterizes the weapon). "- there was no stupor (determined that the rifle was a small thing), there was one sticky fear ... recourse
      1. Tersky
        Tersky 6 February 2014 08: 57
        +3
        Quote: name
        there was no stupor (determined that the rifle was a little thing), there was one sticky fear ...

        So Romanov in the commentary and emphasized:
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Still others forget that they are guards and run away.
    5. Vladimirets
      Vladimirets 6 February 2014 11: 36
      0
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      It’s us here, sitting in front of computers, we become strategists who know how to behave properly in any situation — in short we talk a lot.

      I can tell a couple of tricks. smile
    6. Same lech
      Same lech 6 February 2014 14: 37
      +4
      here is one such case
  • Boris55
    Boris55 6 February 2014 08: 25
    +5
    Quote: name
    , but that's why the guard missed and why he is there in principle

    A student of the 10 class came to school, armed with two rifles. The guard tried not to let him, but the gunshot argument turned out to be stronger, and the teenager nevertheless went to school.
    The key point of this story is security guardthe teenager was threatening with a weapon managed to press the panic button.

    1. Name
      Name 6 February 2014 08: 59
      +5
      Quote: Boris55
      The guard tried not to let him in, but the gunshot argument turned out to be stronger, and the teenager nevertheless went to school.

      I quote [i]: Returning “from the detour”, Yuri Egorov saw a student in a coat walking along the corridor (from the back) and called out to him. Gordeev, according to the same Egorov, put something on the floor and went up to him, pointing the barrel of a small-caliber rifle (this is how the guard characterizes the weapon). The teenager said that this is not a joke, and that he did not come to school to talk with him (with the guard). [/ I] -Not about what to prevent there’s no speech in the school’s premises "teenager" was seen from the back.hi
      1. BARKAS
        BARKAS 6 February 2014 10: 45
        +1
        We began to lose the current generation of Gordeev long ago when we entered the class with the weapons of children, it only made the teenagers clap their hands until they realized that the aggression was directed at them and not at the other .. request for sure there are Internet resources where this Gordeev idol!
      2. Boris55
        Boris55 6 February 2014 11: 11
        -1
        Quote: name
        approached him, pointing the barrel of a small-caliber rifle

        The fact that it is called small-caliber does not mean that it does not kill. In a revolver like a gun, almost the same cartridges are used.
        PS
        I have more confidence in official sources than in the "yellow press".
        1. Vladimirets
          Vladimirets 6 February 2014 11: 40
          +3
          Quote: Boris55
          In a revolver like a gun, almost the same cartridges are used.

          Do you think the 7,62 caliber rifle is small-caliber? what
  • siberalt
    siberalt 6 February 2014 11: 08
    +1
    I agree with the first post. Everyone crawls into detectives, go crazy! Here is another example of a "creative-liberal" journalist about whom D. Lekukh wrote.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Geisenberg
    Geisenberg 6 February 2014 13: 16
    +4
    Quote: name
    Let the investigators sort out the reasons that prompted the 10th grader to murder (he will most likely go to the "durka"), but that's why the guard missed it and why he is there in principle. request


    Again the advertisement of terrorism has gone. Now every sucker in the country wants to take crayons and sing to school. My opinion is - remove the arrow from the TV and from the newspapers, and urgently. Announce him sick. and all that will be there just to shut up. This is not a topic for public discussion.
  • bubalik
    bubalik 6 February 2014 14: 17
    0
    Checks whether they are wearing shoe covers, a pair of technicals, this is in our school when I come for a child.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • anomalocaris
    anomalocaris 6 February 2014 16: 22
    +1
    And what the hell did he have the keys to his father’s weapons safe?
  • Bezz
    Bezz 7 February 2014 00: 06
    +1
    Quote: name
    Let the investigators sort out the reasons that prompted the 10th grader to murder (he will most likely go to the "durka"), but that's why the guard missed it and why he is there in principle. request

    Meanwhile, as the journalists managed to find out, Sergey’s father is an employee of the classified FSBI Research Institute “Ether”, who “formally oversees the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the FSB,” and his grandfather is the FSB General.
    According to Sergei’s friends, the teenager did not hide the title of his maternal grandfather and the fact that his father, Viktor Gordeev, works in special services.
    Now guess how many months will the boy Seryozha stay in the hospital? And will his dad bear the responsibility?
    1. anomalocaris
      anomalocaris 7 February 2014 15: 49
      0
      Are you kidding me?
  • alleksSalut4507
    alleksSalut4507 7 February 2014 00: 38
    0
    What kind of protection is there for fearful pensioners? You yourself have never seen anything. You pay money, but to those who won the tender.
  • saber1357
    saber1357 8 February 2014 00: 45
    0
    I don’t know, not a lawyer, but daddy also needs to glue something, but bigger. Is there an article "for the upbringing of a moral monster"? This is necessary, my son is fond of solipsism, that is, "besides me, he will run away," from whom would he get it? And who did NOT prevent him from gaining this (if he got it from half-witted peers?).
  • smel
    smel 6 February 2014 06: 38
    +17
    It remains to once again express my condolences to the families of the deceased and injured. I consider the classmates as well, who have suffered psychological trauma for life. And they will talk about this case through 2, and 5, and 20 years. It is a pity that neither the guard nor the police did their job. The bosses do not require anyone to perform their functions. After 10 years, the 25-year-old killer will be released, turned into an inveterate villain in the zone. And he still has a lot of chances to ruin the life of normal people.
    1. report4
      report4 6 February 2014 11: 57
      +4
      Quote: smel
      In 10 years, a 25-year-old killer will be released, turned into a deadly scoundrel in the zone. And he still has a lot of chances to ruin the life of normal people.

      You can not worry about this - such as he breaks a zone in a couple of years. It is clear from the text that this infantile individual was stuck at the age of ten.
      1. Volkhov
        Volkhov 6 February 2014 23: 28
        0
        Almost getting him into the zone is almost impossible - the Clinic of Neurosis on Rublevka, light plastic and one of the spy schools.
  • Normman
    Normman 6 February 2014 06: 40
    +13
    All evil comes from childhood ... Adults do not even notice how they cripple the soul and consciousness of a child with their hysterical reaction to his "wrong" actions. Methodically, day after day, from infancy, they educate the neurasthenic. The ideas of solipsism fall on the ground in this way. And then they hypocritically ask the question: And who is he like? And they refuse to represent his interests ...
    1. Onizuka teacher
      Onizuka teacher 6 February 2014 07: 00
      +20
      Well, here I would add one more factor. Bullying peers! Children sometimes make monsters from other children. An example from school, in a Russian school in Temirtau where I studied there was one single Kazakh. So, due to the fact that he was not white, he was humiliated in every possible way, although he resisted. They broke it, spitting in the back and spoiled textbooks with notebooks are just flowers. I say right away that I was friends with him, and I also got bored. I met this colossus recently, a mountain of muscles and a fire of hatred in my eyes. A hand-to-hand coach and takes exclusively Kazakhs. He says he didn’t forgive anyone and was beaten by several offenders forcing him to ask for forgiveness, he doesn’t like only Russians, after a couple of glasses of friendly stories from life he was naturally poisoned in Kazakh. Do you think the parents are to blame? Sometimes children don’t tell how they torment him at school. Agree child cruelty insidious thing.
      1. mirag2
        mirag2 6 February 2014 07: 23
        +6
        Yes, I studied at school, too, my friend and I always fought before the fight, he is a Tatar, and I have relatives in Estonia, he called me "Estonian", I called him "Tatar", and what?
        Grew up in best friends ...
        His grandfather cracked the horse sausage with him, and I was at the Muslim funeral, his grandmother was buried sitting.
        Situations are always different, but PARENTS MUST LOOK FOR THIS!
        1. alleksSalut4507
          alleksSalut4507 7 February 2014 01: 36
          0
          Jews and Georgians and Tatars and Azerbaijanis studied with us but never remembered nationalities. Only in jokes. And they laughed all together.
      2. invisibility
        invisibility 6 February 2014 08: 04
        -1
        You indicate the causes, but the disease must be treated.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Zhaman-Urus
        Zhaman-Urus 6 February 2014 11: 07
        +9
        Hello from Temirtau. I myself studied in classes where there were 1, 2 Kazakhs and there was NEVER ANYTHING on national grounds, I finished school in 96. I agree that this is not an indicator, but your story looks like a fairy tale. Can you name the coach’s name? I can’t say that I know all the hand-to-hand trainers, but would a small city have flashed somewhere? If on the topic, yes, schoolchildren are worse than prisoners, but this is not a reason to kill or to meet and beat 10 years after school. Moscow youngster is definitely a 15-year-old strict child, and your friend, sorry for a psychologist.
        1. Flooding
          Flooding 6 February 2014 11: 44
          +3
          Quote: Zhaman-Urus
          Hello from Temirtau. I myself studied in classes where there were 1, 2 Kazakhs and NEVER ANYTHING on national grounds, I graduated from school in 96g. I agree that this is not an indicator, but your story looks like a fairy tale.

          Zhaman-Urus, intrigued. We are waiting for confirmation from the Teacher with a Japanese nickname and a photo of Zverev.
          1. anomalocaris
            anomalocaris 6 February 2014 16: 29
            +1
            Oh well. I’m, for example, a native Siberian. In my veins, arteries and other blood vessels, such a cocktail is mixed that you never dreamed of. But I didn’t try to shoot anyone in childhood.
            1. Flooding
              Flooding 6 February 2014 16: 39
              0
              Quote: anomalocaris
              Oh well. I’m, for example, a native Siberian. In my veins, arteries and other blood vessels, such a cocktail is mixed that you never dreamed of. But I didn’t try to shoot anyone in childhood.

              It’s strange. Judging by the branch, addressed to me. Although I did not state the opposite.
              By the way, in Moldova, too, many-degree cocktails are mixed: Bulgarians, Moldovans, Gagauzians, Ukrainians, Russians, Jews, Greeks, etc.
              1. anomalocaris
                anomalocaris 12 February 2014 16: 17
                0
                This is the answer to the leader from Temirtau. Let him not drive. I come from Kuzbass. We have never spied rot on anyone. That would be understandable for European users, Temirtau from my place of residence is right around the corner, about 600 km. Now it is considered the territory of sovereign Kazakhstan, only Semipalatinsk, Ust-Kamenogorsk, Akmolinsk, a bunch of other cities were founded by Russians (usually by exiled Cossacks). This was the "Eastern Line", which, by the way, did not just exist on paper, but quite really fought with China.
            2. alleksSalut4507
              alleksSalut4507 7 February 2014 01: 41
              0
              and we are from Siberia. and we have a cocktail. and were not going to kill anyone. the truth.
        2. Hleb
          Hleb 6 February 2014 12: 02
          +2
          although I studied and lived farther north, I read about such a plot for the first time. Why did I remember "Kickboxer" with Van Damme, when he came to the teacher: "Grandpa, teach me Muay Thai"
          learned and defeated everyone, all the evil in the person of Tong Po. True, they chanted "white warrior", but here it is a little the other way around, but the main thing is "holy revenge" and epic. You can also recall the film "Kerry", but this is too much
        3. ed65b
          ed65b 6 February 2014 15: 41
          +2
          Quote: Zhaman-Urus
          Hello from Temirtau. I myself studied in classes where there were 1, 2 Kazakhs and there was NEVER ANYTHING on national grounds, I finished school in 96. I agree that this is not an indicator, but your story looks like a fairy tale. Can you name the coach’s name? I can’t say that I know all the hand-to-hand trainers, but would a small city have flashed somewhere? If on the topic, yes, schoolchildren are worse than prisoners, but this is not a reason to kill or to meet and beat 10 years after school. Moscow youngster is definitely a 15-year-old strict child, and your friend, sorry for a psychologist.

          Onizuka's teacher is a complete Russophobe and storyteller, he craps everywhere. A youngster a maximum of 10 shines.
        4. Onizuka teacher
          Onizuka teacher 7 February 2014 09: 24
          -1
          Sorry, things were. We studied together at the Toktar Aubakirov gymnasium and graduated in 00years. I will not disclose the name, meaning? As my grandfather said, believe it or not, because there is no trial.
        5. The comment was deleted.
      5. svoboda1970
        svoboda1970 6 February 2014 12: 59
        +2
        I do not believe ... Composition.negative
      6. ed65b
        ed65b 6 February 2014 15: 37
        +2
        Quote: Onizuka's teacher
        Well, here I would add one more factor. Bullying peers! Children sometimes make monsters from other children. An example from school, in a Russian school in Temirtau where I studied there was one single Kazakh. So, due to the fact that he was not white, he was humiliated in every possible way, although he resisted. They broke it, spitting in the back and spoiled textbooks with notebooks are just flowers. I say right away that I was friends with him, and I also got bored. I met this colossus recently, a mountain of muscles and a fire of hatred in my eyes. A hand-to-hand coach and takes exclusively Kazakhs. He says he didn’t forgive anyone and was beaten by several offenders forcing him to ask for forgiveness, he doesn’t like only Russians, after a couple of glasses of friendly stories from life he was naturally poisoned in Kazakh. Do you think the parents are to blame? Sometimes children don’t tell how they torment him at school. Agree child cruelty insidious thing.

        Ostap suffered fool change the Kazakh to Russian, I will tell you such stories with a mountain of muscles and no farewell, but if I meet you I will beat you up and make you apologize 300 I can only tell you this is all fiction, and your friend is a ram and you can tell him that.
      7. TS3sta3
        TS3sta3 6 February 2014 15: 45
        +2
        very similar to autobiography, very realistic. except: "mountains of muscles", "hand-to-hand trainer" and "beat offenders" - this already looks like fiction.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. mirag2
      mirag2 6 February 2014 07: 19
      +7
      Yes Yes Yes Yes!
      That's it, PARENTS are responsible for raising a child!
      Well, not for teachers to educate them? Some of the upbringing falls on the teachers, but the main one is still on the parents!
      They, at home, in a family environment — which THEY must create and maintain in moral purity and health — must provide the child with observation of his psychological state and his correct correction.
      And if it doesn’t work out then contact the specialists.
      But they have to keep an eye on it.
      Just elementary to see.
      1. Boris55
        Boris55 6 February 2014 09: 04
        0
        Quote: mirag2
        That's it, PARENTS are responsible for raising a child!
        Well, do not teachers educate them?

        Do you understand the difference between a teacher and a lecturer? A child at school spends 6-7 hours and what - do you think he is obliged to drop out of the educational process at this time? In my opinion you are wrong.

  • vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 6 February 2014 06: 42
    +26
    Immediately after the shooting, the media broke into hysteria over the ban on computer shooter games, this supposedly encouraged the guy to shoot. Another hysterical panic of deputies. There are already proposals to ban. If I understood the guy was on the gold medal, so in this case, he was definitely not a gamer. Such nerds spend more time studying. What he has done is the result of the upbringing, the upbringing of the parents, most likely the father, the society, most likely the school. All are to blame. Our society today is a gathering of egoists, nobody cares about others, as long as I feel good. But when it is necessary for someone to understand, help, let others do it, there are experts, organs are different. And only when the result splashes out in the form of such an executioner, who has decided to condemn on his own, and carry out the sentence, is society choking in hysteria and panic. Probably taken today to appeal to all: gentlemen, get used to it is democracy, not socialism.
    1. Mart
      Mart 6 February 2014 06: 52
      +12
      Quote: vladsolo56
      Immediately after the shooting, the media broke into hysteria over the ban on computer shooter games, this supposedly encouraged the guy to shoot. Another hysterical panic of deputies. There are already proposals to ban. If I understood the guy was on the gold medal, so in this case, he was definitely not a gamer. Such nerds spend more time studying. What he has done is the result of the upbringing, the upbringing of the parents, most likely the father, the society, most likely the school. All are to blame. Our society today is a gathering of egoists, nobody cares about others, as long as I feel good. But when it is necessary for someone to understand, help, let others do it, there are experts, organs are different. And only when the result splashes out in the form of such an executioner, who has decided to condemn on his own, and carry out the sentence, is society choking in hysteria and panic. Probably taken today to appeal to all: gentlemen, get used to it is democracy, not socialism.


      “We currently live in cities alongside other people, without even knowing them. On election days, we meet with each other at meetings, listen to false promises or absurd speeches of candidates and return to our home. The state is in charge of all matters of public interest; it is his duty to ensure that individuals do not violate the interests of their fellow citizens, and, if necessary, to correct the harm done to them, punishing the guilty. On it lies the care of help to the starving, the care of education, protection from enemies, etc., etc.
      Your neighbor may die of starvation or kill his children to death - this does not concern you: this is a police matter. You do not know your neighbors; nothing binds you to them, and everything separates, and, in the absence of the best, you ask the Almighty (first it was God, and now the state) that he should not allow antisocial passions to their extreme limits. ”
      Kropotkin.
    2. Sunjar
      Sunjar 6 February 2014 07: 13
      +12
      It should also complement you. Bloody games are accused of a negative effect on children, but no less, and often more bloody (Rambo 4, The Expendables 1,2, etc.) are not. But everything is much more natural there. On television, they constantly show down, stabbed, shot and killed - blood, dirt, abomination. And this is all reality. If forbidden, then all at once.
      1. Mart
        Mart 6 February 2014 07: 24
        +25
        Quote: Sunjar
        If prohibit, then all at once.

        I do not watch television. Totally. And that's all. No restrictions are needed.
        All these lawmakers by "prohibitions", "restrictions" only justify their own uselessness, they create noise. Any suitable event, any tragedy for them is a conscious or unconscious reason for self-promotion. The deputies in their "proposals" will soon go so far as to force every resident of the country to undergo an examination by a psychiatrist once a quarter. Soon a psychiatric lobby will form in the Duma.
        Since the days of Kropotkin nothing has changed. The military-technical and technological progress is there, but the social one is progressing very tightly. Alas.
        1. ed65b
          ed65b 6 February 2014 15: 44
          0
          Quote: Mart
          Quote: Sunjar
          If prohibit, then all at once.

          I do not watch television. Totally. And that's all. No restrictions are needed.
          All these lawmakers by "prohibitions", "restrictions" only justify their own uselessness, they create noise. Any suitable event, any tragedy for them is a conscious or unconscious reason for self-promotion. The deputies in their "proposals" will soon go so far as to force every resident of the country to undergo an examination by a psychiatrist once a quarter. Soon a psychiatric lobby will form in the Duma.
          Since the days of Kropotkin nothing has changed. The military-technical and technological progress is there, but the social one is progressing very tightly. Alas.

          Well, how to make money on a social network? Neither cut the dough nor cut the budget. We have the only one who promoted in the positive is Astakhov. For the rest, this is a smut and a link.
    3. Greenwood
      Greenwood 6 February 2014 08: 30
      +3
      Quote: vladsolo56
      a gold medal, and so in that case he was not a gamer unambiguously. Such nerds devote more time to classes.
      Your untruth. I myself was an excellent student at one time and received a silver medal at the end of school, but at the same time I loved military shooters like Call of Duty and frankly limitless games like GTA.
      1. Maxsh
        Maxsh 6 February 2014 10: 15
        +1
        I agree - I also have a couple of such acquaintances.
      2. rereture
        rereture 6 February 2014 11: 29
        +1
        At his age, I did not take games seriously, just like movies, interactive films.
      3. vladsolo56
        vladsolo56 6 February 2014 12: 29
        +1
        Quote: Greenwood
        Your untruth. I myself was an excellent student at one time and received a silver medal at the end of school, but at the same time I loved military shooters like Call of Duty and frankly limitless games like GTA.

        If for him the gold medal was not so important, if he had not given a lot of energy to it, then he would not have gone to shoot people because of his low rating. It’s clear that this is not a bizky and not a fit. He spent a lot of energy to achieve the goal and suddenly on you. In that case, if he was just a normal guy, playing on a computer, it would never have occurred to him to arrange a lynching. I'm not a psychiatrist, but this is my opinion
      4. ed65b
        ed65b 6 February 2014 15: 48
        +1
        Quote: Greenwood
        Quote: vladsolo56
        a gold medal, and so in that case he was not a gamer unambiguously. Such nerds devote more time to classes.
        Your untruth. I myself was an excellent student at one time and received a silver medal at the end of school, but at the same time I loved military shooters like Call of Duty and frankly limitless games like GTA.

        And I forbade my GTA and constantly delete it when it is installed in a quiet place. I came to his room somehow, and he looked at his granny with bat and feet - EEE, I’m saying brother came. and put an end to this. Anything but not GTA.
        1. vladsolo56
          vladsolo56 6 February 2014 17: 21
          0
          Quote: ed65b
          And I forbade my GTA and constantly delete it when it is installed in a quiet place. I came to his room somehow, and he looked at his granny with bat and feet - EEE, I’m saying brother came. and put an end to this. Anything but not GTA.

          Delete GTA that you decided in this way, maybe you need to talk with your son, find out why he is like that? Removing the game you will not solve the psychological stereotypes of the guy. Here it is already necessary to sound the alarm and strain the brains.
          1. ed65b
            ed65b 6 February 2014 17: 37
            0
            Quote: vladsolo56
            Delete GTA that you decided in this way, maybe you need to talk with your son, find out why he is like that? Removing the game you will not solve the psychological stereotypes of the guy. Here it is already necessary to sound the alarm and strain the brains.

            Everything is fine, but male skin prophylaxis while small is sometimes useful, not so much in terms of physical pain as in moral and psychological pain. And then it will be too late when the hair on the pussy grows laughing
            1. rereture
              rereture 6 February 2014 17: 59
              -2
              Then you can pour it in yourself wink
          2. rereture
            rereture 6 February 2014 17: 46
            0
            What is the alarm? I played in GTA from the 7th grade like my friends, for some reason not a single psychopath became.
            1. nerd.su
              nerd.su 6 February 2014 18: 12
              -1
              And is there any help? By the way, do you know that doctors believe that there are no healthy people, there are people who have not been examined? laughing
              1. rereture
                rereture 6 February 2014 18: 18
                0
                Recently held a medical examination at the military commissariat. They said vision was like that of an eagle, hearing was like lizards, healthy as a bull. Apart from asthma. laughing
                1. nerd.su
                  nerd.su 6 February 2014 18: 29
                  0
                  So you urgently need to biathlon! The Norwegians have a lot of asthmatics in the team, so they row gold! And we have doping through one, but we need asthmatics! You won’t be taken to this Olympics, so there are four years ahead laughing And you will shoot and bring benefit to the Motherland!

                  So all the same, the psychiatrist then the stamp is valid and put a signature? laughing
                  And then there are such - healthy, like a bull, but with a white ticket!
                  1. rereture
                    rereture 6 February 2014 18: 33
                    -1
                    Changed conditionally valid to limited valid. True, they gave a delay of 5.5 years in connection with their studies. wink

                    And the Norwegians have doping in inhalers, they just don’t check laughing
                    1. nerd.su
                      nerd.su 6 February 2014 19: 04
                      +1
                      Well, as I say, with asthma we are not afraid of accusations!

                      Something I do not know the category of conditionally valid ... And limited fit - it was in my years and there was a white ticket ...
                      1. rereture
                        rereture 6 February 2014 19: 17
                        0
                        Yes, there is some kind of nonsense, I did not really understand, if the letters Was "B" - In wartime, it is subject to conscription, to complete parts of the 2nd stage.

                        Steel B4 - Special structures, security and defense specialists of combat missile systems; communication parts, radio parts; the rest of the armed forces of the Russian Federation, other troops, military units and bodies.

                        Since I did not agree to stay in the hospital for 2 weeks (I collected a month of help, as a result, the therapist did not get it right for me) agreed to a decrease in the degree of validity and postponement.
                      2. nerd.su
                        nerd.su 6 February 2014 19: 49
                        -1
                        Well, then this is an increase in the degree of suitability, about a decrease, this is your reservation "according to Freud" laughing

                        But what, there is no military department? Are you going to be a clinical psychologist? smile
                      3. rereture
                        rereture 6 February 2014 19: 53
                        0
                        There is no military department, I study for the specialty 240501 "CHEMICAL TECHNOLOGY OF MODERN ENERGY MATERIALS" specialization "Radiation chemistry and radiation materials science"
                      4. nerd.su
                        nerd.su 6 February 2014 20: 27
                        +1
                        Well, you’ll be more careful there at the laboratory. And then you will pick up a pocket nuclear bomb from boredom!
  • Name
    Name 6 February 2014 10: 10
    +4
    Quote: vladsolo56
    gentlemen, get used to it, democracy, not socialism.
    - It remains only to supplement:
  • Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 6 February 2014 15: 46
    +3
    Well said. Prince Kropotkin, whose words are given in the comment below, also saw the problem well. Who am I? The answer to this question determines everything. How did a man answer him before? I am part of Eternal Russia. Today's representative of a number of glorious ancestors - warriors, builders, plowmen, scientists ... Now WE represent our great power and lead it into the future.
    What answer does man give himself now? I am nobody. Spit on ancestors, on the country, on the past and the future. There is only now, in this now I and in me are my pleasures. Do not dare to impose anything on me, I am all! My positive emotions are wonderful, negative emotions are unbearable. It is such a system of personality that a consumer society needs.
    If we go exactly this way, through rotting and decay of a person into a consumer ... yes, we simply end! All our victories, all patience, sacrifices and accomplishments of all our ancestors, all current achievements will be destroyed. And soon ...
  • awg75
    awg75 6 February 2014 06: 50
    +2
    I hope this bastard will not have a future
    1. bomg.77
      bomg.77 6 February 2014 06: 59
      +9
      Quote: awg75
      I hope this bastard will not have a future
      There, another Gardeev was set up because of him. Let them say the photo of another guy was hanging on the show, and his own aunt and teachers, for an hour pretended to be their nephew and student, they asked who he was that they were trying to cover him up and expose him as a nerd on whom a non-Russian teacher was pushing hard and why? Here is a photo of that guy who everyone pointed with his finger, the first days. !!
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 07: 48
        +13
        Quote: bomg.77
        Let them say another guy’s photo hung on the show, and his own aunt and teachers, for an hour pretending to be their nephew and student, asked who he was that they were trying to cover him up and expose him as a nerd who was heavily pressed by a non-Russian teacher and why?

        Yes, because it’s a stupid show, for the sake of rating and stupid PR, for the sake of money and for money. Malakhov and those who are stuck there, do not give a damn who died, why, who killed, THIS SHOW.
        1. bomg.77
          bomg.77 6 February 2014 08: 23
          +6
          Alexander hiYes, no one even says that this is what? Where? When ?, but why and for what purpose did relatives and teachers pretend that he was in the photo? They had known him for several days and the difference in appearance was great.
          1. crbvbyjr
            crbvbyjr 6 February 2014 09: 10
            +5
            And look at the appearance and everything is clear why
            1. bomg.77
              bomg.77 6 February 2014 11: 07
              0
              Quote: crbvbyjr
              And look at the appearance and everything is clear why
              Self-centeredness, complacency. And the rest is dust underfoot. Education!
            2. Zhaman-Urus
              Zhaman-Urus 6 February 2014 11: 12
              +3
              As my Russian teacher said about such photos: "Kiss me at a run," the boy obviously has a very high self-esteem. This has not brought anyone to any good. Exactly such a photo was of my CCM classmate in kickboxing, handsome, wealthy parents. The result of overdoses and death a couple of days before the wedding ...
              1. bomg.77
                bomg.77 6 February 2014 12: 05
                +1
                Quote: Zhaman-Urus
                obviously the guy has a very high self-esteem.
                And who inspired him, if not his parents, and they have not a small position with him.
                The father of the school shooter turned out to be an employee of the secret department of the research institute, and his grandfather was the FSB general
        2. UzRus
          UzRus 6 February 2014 11: 06
          +3
          Yes, because it’s a stupid show, for the sake of rating and stupid PR, for the sake of money and for money. Malakhov and those who are pressed in there, do not give a damn who died, why, who killed, THIS SHOW - Yes, this garbage transfer has already gotten in order with its ever-screaming leading Malakhov!
      2. Letun
        Letun 6 February 2014 11: 55
        +5
        The Komsomol member, from a once respected publication, has finally turned into a yellow newspaper.
    2. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 07: 45
      +2
      Quote: awg75
      I hope this bastard will not have a future

      If you are not sent to a psychiatric hospital, then the maximum that he is shining is 10 years.
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. siberalt
      siberalt 6 February 2014 11: 15
      +3
      quot: I hope this bastard will not have a future.

      Recognized irresponsible at the time of commission, cure, and let go. But in fact - for more than 8 years he does not shine. Mal is still.
    5. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 6 February 2014 12: 44
      +4
      Quote: awg75
      I hope this bastard will not have a future

      he’s not a bastard, those bastards who raised him like that, not only his parents, but everything around him. We often close our eyes not the problems and troubles of children and adolescents, for many this is not important, the main thing is to be dressed, shod and full. So we get what we get. Who's guilty?
      1. Walking
        Walking 6 February 2014 15: 35
        +1
        Quote: siberalt
        quot:

        Recognized irresponsible at the time of commission, cure, and let go. But in fact - for more than 8 years he does not shine. Mal is still.


        Insanity is not noticeable there and there is no affect, the guy thought through everything and did as he wanted. Another thing is how they want to file it for the people.
  • Alex66
    Alex66 6 February 2014 06: 57
    +10
    The article in my opinion writes off the problem to one person, to the fact that he did not cope with his problems.
    But after all, his egocentrism is a problem of a new "tolerant" society when everything is possible, there are no taboos and in vain they say that there is no tendency, there is, but to confess means to recognize the new ideology as not consistent, this ideology where man is a wolf to man, and not a friend, comrade and brother. The new ideology makes it possible not to pay attention to real problems, the stratification of society, not an opportunity to get out of poverty, to get an education.
    1. Mart
      Mart 6 February 2014 07: 28
      +14
      Quote: Alex66
      The article in my opinion writes off the problem to one person, to the fact that he did not cope with his problems.
      But after all, his egocentrism is a problem of a new "tolerant" society when everything is possible, there are no taboos and in vain they say that there is no tendency, there is, but to confess means to recognize the new ideology as not consistent, this ideology where man is a wolf to man, and not a friend, comrade and brother. The new ideology makes it possible not to pay attention to real problems, the stratification of society, not an opportunity to get out of poverty, to get an education.

      I support. The current "ideology", or rather its complete absence, is one of the consequences of the capitalist atomization of society. Nobody needs anyone, but everyone needs money right away. All are equal to the golden calf. There are no ideological unifying factors, as in Soviet times, but what separates them is a carriage and a small cart. Well, plus we began to go crazy - like in America, from which we take an example. With a weapon, and even with two barrels, to school - it's purely American.
      1. Greenwood
        Greenwood 6 February 2014 08: 33
        +2
        Quote: Mart
        it is purely American.
        Perhaps this Gordeev before his "exploits" read a lot of information and watched a video about the Columbine school:
    2. Letun
      Letun 6 February 2014 12: 17
      -6
      Quote: Alex66
      The article in my opinion writes off the problem to one person, to the fact that he did not cope with his problems.
      .

      Well, just the author of the article is an ardent supporter of the legalization of firearms (including short-barreled ones) and he certainly cannot say that in the case when the gun is in every second family, we will read news like this several times a year. That's why everything falls here on one mentally unstable teenager.
      1. rereture
        rereture 6 February 2014 12: 28
        +5
        We have legalized firearms and OOOP. And as you can see, every 2 families have no guns, rifles or injuries.

        I repeat it’s not the gun that is guilty, the guy is to blame.
      2. Volodin
        6 February 2014 12: 33
        +1
        Well, just the author of the article is an ardent supporter of the legalization of firearms (including short-barreled)
        It came to you in dreams, or who prompted? Before you write such nonsense, you could personally ask.
        1. Letun
          Letun 6 February 2014 17: 54
          -1
          Quote: Volodin
          It came to you in dreams, or who prompted? Before you write such nonsense, you could personally ask.

          Well, well, after all, we have already discussed the topic http://topwar.ru/25721-pochemu-rossiyskie-vlasti-ne-vvodyat-razreshenie-na-korot
          kostvol-ognestrel.html # comment-id-1015255

          There, referring to a survey on our website, you claimed that 60% (or so) of Russians for the permission of the short barrel. Or am I confusing something? winked
          Here, I was not even too lazy and found your quote:
          This example clearly demonstrates that 66% of Russians who decide that they can be trusted with firearms for self-defense
          1. Volodin
            6 February 2014 18: 58
            +2
            How does this survey relate to my personal position? I wrote somewhere in the article that I support legalization?

            Or am I confusing something?


            Apparently, confusing, since 66% is not 100% ...
      3. lazy
        lazy 6 February 2014 16: 12
        +2
        several years ago, a student dissatisfied with a teacher met her at the entrance and killed her with a knife. Will we also remove knives and ban?
        1. Letun
          Letun 6 February 2014 18: 06
          0
          Oh, oh, about knives and drunken disassembly with stools this is the favorite answer of your supporters laughing You are not original. With a knife, a good man, not everyone can decide to stab another. This lover of tea biscuits is unlikely to dare to stab the teacher with a knife in the classroom. Anyway, to select knives and other primitive weapons, unlike firearms, is simply unrealistic, although I agree, if it weren’t for walking along the street it would be better. Do you disagree?
          1. rereture
            rereture 6 February 2014 18: 27
            0
            I do not agree, the ban does not make sense since.
            1. Not a single hunt, or do you propose walking a bear with primitive weapons such as cattle?

            2. Not any shooting sport, or do you offer to shoot with slingshots?

            3. There is no sensible self-defense, they are breaking into your house and you are using their stool?

            4. The fall of weapons culture, the decline in the country's defense.

            hardly would dare to stab the teacher with a knife in the classroom.


            You are probably clairvoyant and you can look into parallel universes.
            Why not? He could have stabbed with a knife, hit with a bat, an armature, a pipe cut-off, a gas key, he would have hammered a chain from a bicycle.

            But as I understand it, you do not care how people kill each other, if only it was not a weapon.
            1. Letun
              Letun 6 February 2014 22: 56
              -3
              What ridiculous arguments! What supporters of the gunshot to the people, the mass of such maximalists?
              Point by point:
              1) Do not compare the acquisition of hunting weapons with the acquisition of short barrels, hunters are enthusiastic people, and they need weapons not in order to mount.
              2) Sport is the same.
              3) For the defense of the house, the law provides for smooth-bore guns, but as someone wrote to you here, so as not to break in, put an iron door and in which case call the police. You won’t kill a man and you won’t go to jail yourself.
              4) This is the most ridiculous and funny argument laughing There is practically no weapons culture in our country. We are not the United States where for 200 (even more) years this culture exists and laws have been worked out, including the same defense of ourselves and those around us. And how does gun culture affect defense? belay Was the USSR not a defense country? Are you kidding me?

              I’m probably not clairvoyant, but sane. If this bumblebee even found the courage to stab the teacher, the teacher would resist, I think the boys from the class would help him and most likely he could be injured, but not killed. And 100% would not have killed a policeman.

              But as I understand it, you don't care about common sense, as long as people kill each other in a civilized manner. As one of the famous Germans said in the past: "Artillery gives seriousness to what would otherwise look like a banal quarrel" You should like this phrase wink
              1. rereture
                rereture 6 February 2014 23: 55
                0
                put the iron door and in case of which call the police

                How do you see this in a rented apartment?

                short-barrel acquisition

                Have you heard about the short-barrel hunting?
                Here, enlighten http://www.slezhke.net/oxota-s-revolverom.ph

                Sport is the same.

                That is, you are not against a weapon whose muzzle energy can exceed 3 KJ, when shot from which a person does not have a chance to survive, and against a weapon with a muzzle energy of about 0.5 KJ, when shot from which a person can survive if given timely medical help.

                they do not need weapons in order to mount.

                Do not judge all by yourself.

                If this stingray even had the courage to stab the teacher, the teacher would resist


                He shot without warning, and the knife would have stuck into the heart without warning, maybe yes, he had wounded but did not kill, and the policeman would have been alive. But to think that the gun is to blame is also not worth it.

                But as I understand it, you do not care for the arguments of common sense, if only people would kill each other in a civilized manner.


                No need to project your fears at all. Do not want do not buy.

                We are not the USA where for 200 (even more) years this culture exists and laws have been worked out, including the same defense of ourselves and others


                That is, you don’t need a weapon culture at all.
                She was, it is necessary to begin to revive her. For example, when cleaning at school I found old notebooks of the 80s. In the notebooks there was a record of cartridges, and the results of firing students from a small-caliber rifle (the name of the rifle was not) and a small-caliber pistol (the name was not), and at the end of the notebook were the results of the test shooting. The notebook contained both male and female surnames.

                And how does gun culture affect defense?


                It is not for nothing that in the USSR there were shooting ranges and lessons of NVP in schools.

                But as I understand it, you do not care about the arguments of common sense


                I almost got hit by a bentley car with numbers oo007o due to the fault of the Weed Major (c.uka was driving a red light through a zebra full of people),. But I do not shout that it is necessary to ban all cars, but I say that such drivers need to be punished for violating traffic rules.

                In our case, we need to punish the killer, and not all other people who want to acquire weapons.
                1. nerd.su
                  nerd.su 7 February 2014 01: 20
                  -2
                  Quote: rereture
                  How do you see this in a rented apartment?

                  As well as in fact, only at the expense of the owner. On account of payment. Better yet, take off immediately with an iron door.

                  Quote: rereture
                  He shot without warning, and the knife would have stuck into the heart without warning, maybe yes, he had wounded but did not kill, and the policeman would have been alive. But to think that the gun is to blame is also not worth it.

                  You talk about it so easily. Have any experience? These are not keys to push.
                  The gun is not to blame. Guilty of the specific owner of the gun.

                  Quote: rereture
                  It is not for nothing that in the USSR there were shooting ranges and lessons of NVP in schools.

                  Well, yes, there were shooting ranges, and lessons, and training machines, and a shooting range, and an obstacle course in the part that stood nearby. But we were not vaccinated with an armory culture, but with basic military training. Damn, we were even taught the composition and actions of a platoon of a potential enemy at school ... They were preparing to defend the country, only the traitors destroyed the country.
                  And there was no short-barrel among the people! No one even stuttered about it! If you want to shoot, go to the army. There, by the way, for two years and greatly cooled this desire laughing

                  I don’t see how people who want to buy weapons will suffer?
                  1. rereture
                    rereture 7 February 2014 01: 34
                    0
                    There are people here, read the comments that want to either remove all weapons, or so that they are stored in the Ministry of Internal Affairs, and issued under receipt sad

                    And given our deputies, and their initiatives ... Most likely, the tatupeds will go on toughening the rules for the circulation of civilian weapons and the law on weapons.

                    Although the new amendments had a relief.

                    Well, yes, there were shooting ranges, and lessons, and training machines, and a shooting range, and an obstacle course in the part that stood nearby. But we were not vaccinated with an armory culture, but with basic military training. Damn, we were even taught the composition and actions of a platoon of a potential enemy at school ... They were preparing to defend the country


                    Here, plus also gave initial skills in handling weapons, and basic knowledge of its use.

                    Plus, grandfather or dad hunters were almost everyone (well, or a friend).

                    If my memory serves me, then weapons began to be removed from the population from the 90s. There were many without licenses: inherited, or bought a long time ago.
  • VadimSt
    VadimSt 6 February 2014 07: 01
    +5
    Sorry about what happened. Let me go home to my parents.

    Well, yes, - "I won't do that anymore"! For this bastard, tortured by overwork, hunger, family troubles, unrequited love or something else, nothing supernatural and irreparable has happened. It's a pity there are no gas chambers.
    And the actions of the security guard, the responsibility of the security company and the actions of police officers in emergency situations are probably a separate issue both for the investigation and for organizational conclusions.
    1. Psyjoker
      Psyjoker 6 February 2014 07: 11
      +10
      Honestly, I don’t understand the point of these guards at all. After all, they have neither weapons, nor permission to use force, nor, actually, that force. They, if something happened, can not do anything. Strange affair request
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 07: 50
        +1
        Quote: Psyjoker
        Honestly, I don’t understand the point of these guards at all.

        There used to be gangsters racketeers-roof. Now they are all legalized in private security companies. Here and all the cheese.
        1. Horn
          Horn 6 February 2014 08: 01
          +6
          Why only private security companies, private security also has its own piece of bread and butter. In rural areas, where private security companies can’t especially go for a walk, but there is a police department, these comrades twist their hands to store owners, offering the installation of security alarms, to heat and water supply companies, offering conclusion of security contracts, but in reality do not protect anything. In case of failure - provocation.
          This is a feeding trough. Legalized racketeering.
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 08: 23
            +2
            Quote: Horn
            This is a feeding trough. Legalized racketeering.

            So I’m talking about this.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  • M72
    M72 6 February 2014 07: 18
    +8
    It is difficult to say who is to blame for what happened. I think that there is no clear guilt of any one, many factors converge that led to this tragedy.
    As I understand it, my father kept his weapons in a safe, but if there are hunters here, then they understand that for the family there is no secret where the keys are.
    Did your parents overlook the upbringing? And who of the parents (especially the father) would think that his son, especially an excellent pupil / nerd, is capable of this?
    Man is a social being, which means the whole society forms him as a person.
    What to do? ... I do not know. It seems to me that for sure there is no point in schools recruiting special forces as security guards. Prohibiting weapons or restricting their circulation is also meaningless. In this case, if they had even come to their father earlier to check the storage of weapons, then they would not have revealed any violations - they are standing in a safe under lock and key.
    In short, one cannot prepare for such a situation. If someone, outwardly, is quite normal, even the roof will successfully move off, then this is an accident that cannot be prevented.
    1. crbvbyjr
      crbvbyjr 6 February 2014 09: 17
      0
      What to do ? rabid dogs shoot. what better than crazy people.
    2. Svetlana
      Svetlana 6 February 2014 09: 30
      +2
      Agree with you. The causes of the tragedy may be a huge number. And on the spot to identify her, find the guilty - it is extremely difficult, but simply impossible. We do not know anything, we can only draw conclusions based on our life experience. It is clear that the murder was committed in cold blood and thought out in advance. But what could have happened to make a decent child, an excellent pupil (and not some ragged bully whose parents are drunk), make a deliberate murder? In 15 years, the teenager has a very unstable psyche, they can do things in a rage, but in this situation the murder was planned in advance. For this, indeed, it is necessary that a person lose the meaning of life, lose the feeling of its value. So what happened? What has broken inside him? Many people know that there are teachers in schools who should not be allowed near children. Illiterate, uncultured tyrants, having less knowledge than the student himself, smartly mocking children, feeling some pleasure from this, because the student always depends in many respects on the teacher, on his personal attitude to the student. Such can, indeed, bring an unstable children's psyche to a nervous breakdown. But we do not know whether the deceased teacher was such. Will there be a normal investigation in all circumstances? And this is necessary in order to draw conclusions - who is really to blame for what happened? In order to prevent bad teachers from children, to punish parents as people involved directly or indirectly in these killings, so that, if not the state, but we ourselves, as parents, know what our actions, rash words, lack of attention or our parental warmth to the child, or, conversely, excessive custody. We, the society, have the right in such situations to know all the smallest details of the life of this boy, the features of his personality, the characterization of this teacher, compiled from the stories of all the schoolchildren from whom he taught, and the feedback of his colleagues to make up the true picture of what happened.
  • hohryakov066
    hohryakov066 6 February 2014 07: 25
    +19
    Judging by the available facts of the killer's biography, he is a pronounced victim of a specifically Western lifestyle. This is expressed in the fact that from childhood this unfortunate man was completely provided for and did not feel any need for anything, his parents (who were engaged in obtaining "well-being") did not bother especially with upbringing, having access to the Internet, the guy perceived as truth all the pseudo-philosophical shit, which freely splashes around the edges of the screen of any site (including even on VO). Nobody (and, first of all, the daddy of an ignoramus) thought about how all this could end. Access to lethal weapons was practically free. Here is the logical result for you.
    Security for the school for the money available to the school can only be hired as it was hired (retired under 60). The police outfit, who arrived on the "alarm" - the driver and the OVO fighter did not expect armed resistance and were substituted in the most obvious way. Surely all the previous trips to trigger the alarm at this school were caused by the elementary appearance of not sober parents at the school or by disassembly of students. Nobody gave any information about possible armed resistance alongside (interestingly, the CHOPovets who pressed the "panic button" on "02" did not guess to call?). As a result, 2 corpses, one in intensive care, and created a gorgeous precedent for other mentally detained. And of course they will find the "extreme" ones! We bet that the school director, the entire vertical of commanders in the police, the private security company and the pensioner in person, the LRS inspection in full force will suffer (even if it turns out that the weapon was kept in accordance with all the rules during the check), the district police officer is obligatory.
    1. fennekRUS
      fennekRUS 6 February 2014 09: 36
      +2
      Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye. I'll figure it out as it should, and I will punish anyone horrible! (with)
  • kaktus
    kaktus 6 February 2014 07: 39
    +5
    It would be better if he shot himself ....
  • shitovmg
    shitovmg 6 February 2014 07: 48
    +4
    It's not about the guards, but the matter is about the legislators who pass laws that are not financially secure. That should be so, and then the grass does not grow ...
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 6 February 2014 08: 01
      +4
      Quote: shitovmg
      It's not about the guards, but the matter is about the legislators who pass laws that are not financially secure.

      And how do you think the law can prohibit juvenile d ****** from not killing? He is not the only one, there are a lot of murders involving youngsters in the country, but a small percentage of them is covered in the media.
  • polly
    polly 6 February 2014 07: 59
    +11
    The problem (and not a little one!) Is in this very prosperous family. The family is primary, and not school, society, etc. My grandmother, who went to meet an adult guy at school, says a lot. In general, it is necessary that more than one child grow up in a family: they are large families, as a rule, who are healthy and do not become psychopaths with fat!
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 6 February 2014 08: 35
      +2
      Quote: polly
      more than one child grew up in a family: large families, they are usually healthy
      Having more than one child in Russia is extremely problematic. I think it’s not worth explaining why ...
      1. hohryakov066
        hohryakov066 6 February 2014 11: 18
        +8
        Let me disagree with you. The number of children "more than one" facilitates both the upbringing and maintenance of children. Verified by personal experience. wink
      2. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 6 February 2014 12: 00
        +4
        Quote: Greenwood
        Having more than one child in Russia is extremely problematic. I think it’s not worth explaining why ...

        Let’s just don’t; it’s from a series that I don’t want to serve in this army, where ..., but in another I would be happy; I don’t want to abide by the laws, because they are like that ... but if they were good, please be forever. The emphasis is especially on Russia that in it de this is impossible, and it is impossible, not like they have there. Those who want it have 2, 3, and more children, who don’t want, they are looking for some excuses.
  • copper49
    copper49 6 February 2014 08: 03
    +15
    The excellent student had obvious schizophrenia. This is indicated by a lot. And this disease of his could not be noticed by his parents. Like his aggressiveness hidden from many. It should have been reduced to a psychiatrist, but how is this possible - a stigma for the rest of your life! But obviously his father taught him how to handle weapons, and did not hide the keys to the safe with weapons far from him.
    Throughout my life, I have met several people with schizophrenia (at least one in a hundred people has such a thing). None of them were dangerous to others, so - disorders of logic, delusional ideas about some things, hallucinations, persecution mania.
    But this one is a geek in the full sense of the word. Until the end of his worthless life, a thirst for murder and violence will sit in him. The death of others will be an object of admiration for him. But he will serve no more than 10 years, if in a psychiatric hospital - and even less, until cure.
  • saag
    saag 6 February 2014 08: 04
    +2
    This is information for everyone to think about introducing short-barreled firearms into wide circulation, with them the shots will be healthy in schools, and you don’t have to convince yourself and especially others that this cannot be, even as it will be
    1. rereture
      rereture 6 February 2014 11: 24
      +3
      Please tell me how the acquisition and storage of short-arms will differ from the storage of rifles and rifles?

      Do you think the guns will be sold on the side of the road?

      If a guy wouldn’t get a rifle, would he come with an ax, would anything change?

      No prohibitions will save anyone from a crazy person; he wants to kill a brick with a bang.
  • borisjdin1957
    borisjdin1957 6 February 2014 08: 10
    +3
    from the Don.
    I agree that we now have: john: society. The impact of the street, the media, the Internet, the irresponsibility of parents, spiritual emptiness is the cause of the tragedy. Condolences to the families of the victims!
  • DZ_98_B
    DZ_98_B 6 February 2014 08: 21
    +6
    Computer shooters take out the brains of children completely. But is it just them? "the class greeted him with laughter" And what's so funny about the fact that the person was late? ... The fact that the guy went crazy is a fact. But could it have been prevented ???? Unfortunately I know a similar case that happened in 84-86. A 10th grade girl, an excellent student, stabbed a Russian language teacher for giving her 4 .... this is about computer games, in those years, if only "just wait a minute"
    1. hohryakov066
      hohryakov066 6 February 2014 11: 25
      +1
      Children's collective is a very cruel society. It has always been that way. Just in the days of the USSR, children from childhood were instilled with certain patterns of behavior. This does not mean that such cases did not occur in Soviet times, but the fact that such emergency situations were extremely rare is a fact. It's just that now in schools, and in the family, completely different moral imperatives dominate.
  • DZ_98_B
    DZ_98_B 6 February 2014 08: 29
    -1
    I apologize, but it’s probably not worth blaming my father for the improper storage of weapons. And the fact that he taught his son how to handle weapons, shooting ... honestly, I am proud that my sons are good shooters. maybe I'm wrong.
    1. Max otto
      Max otto 6 February 2014 09: 34
      +5
      Quote: DZ_98_B
      I apologize, but it’s probably not worth blaming my father for the improper storage of weapons. And the fact that he taught his son how to handle weapons, shooting ... honestly, I am proud that my sons are good shooters. maybe I'm wrong.

      Not right unambiguously. My daughter, 14 years old, also knows how to shoot, I taught (in an ordinary dash), but I always carry my keys with me. The fact that he taught was okay, but the fact that he kept the keys to the safe in the house would not hurt to give a deadline. A person does not give a damn about all the rules; if you have a weapon, you have a responsibility to the whole society. Why should the keys to the safe be with the person who has the right to it, I think it’s not worth explaining?
    2. hohryakov066
      hohryakov066 6 February 2014 11: 32
      +6
      Exactly what it costs! A child (even a high school student) does not have the right to touch a weapon without permission! It should be literally driven into his head. Dad would keep his weapons as it should and there would be no tragedy! The fact that you teach your son how to handle weapons is wonderful, but you do not allow him to use weapons without your permission? If you allow, then he can use it just to say to respond to an insult from an outsider. By virtue of youthful maximalism. Would you like it?
      1. rereture
        rereture 6 February 2014 11: 40
        -2
        It should be literally driven into his head. Dad would keep his weapons as it should and there would be no tragedy!


        Do not carry nonsense.

        If a person goes to such actions, then he does not care about the prohibitions.
        Or do you think that he would ask Bati permission to take a gun at school to shoot?
        1. hohryakov066
          hohryakov066 6 February 2014 11: 49
          +4
          So I say - if the weapon were closed in the safe and the dad would carry the key with him and the kid would not get to him!
          1. rereture
            rereture 6 February 2014 12: 31
            0
            You put all the blame on the father and the gun.

            I wouldn’t get to the weapon, I would go to school with a knife or an ax. What difference would a person have been killed, the tragedy could not be avoided
            1. UzRus
              UzRus 6 February 2014 16: 59
              +1
              But it’s just not with a brick, and not with a knife, namely with firearms.
              1. rereture
                rereture 6 February 2014 17: 56
                0
                When you kill a father-in-law with a knife you don’t care, but how did you use a firearm, so immediately ban?
  • DZ_98_B
    DZ_98_B 6 February 2014 08: 30
    -1
    I apologize, but it’s probably not worth blaming my father for the improper storage of weapons. And the fact that he taught his son how to handle weapons, shooting ... honestly, I am proud that my sons are good shooters. maybe I'm wrong.
  • PValery53
    PValery53 6 February 2014 08: 39
    +5
    Several coinciding factors led to the tragic event. But this does not absolve the culprit who pulled the trigger! Even if it is crazy, it should be completely "closed" from society!
    1. Jarilo
      Jarilo 6 February 2014 10: 17
      +2
      Quote: PValery53
      But this does not absolve the culprit who pulled the trigger! Even if it is crazy, it should be completely "closed" from society!

      Yes, do not hesitate about this, it will be closed (for a long time) ....... but will the correct conclusions be made, why did this happen and how to avoid this in the future? Or, as usual with us, to ban everything, to bend everyone, well, as usual, to reward the uninvolved and punish the innocent ...
      I think the problem is not with the particular boy, or with the keys to the safe with weapons. In modern society, there is no morality, values ​​have changed, human life is not worth a penny. The problem of raising children is a difficult thing, and one family cannot cope here, both school and society must participate, and most importantly this should become an important task of the state.
      1. rereture
        rereture 6 February 2014 11: 18
        +3
        The school has no educational function, and everyone knows that those who study well always get from those who study poorly. In the program for Russia1 was his classmate, she was asked:

        -Do you know him as a person?
        -No
        -He studied well?
        Yeah
        -What can you tell about him?
        -Nothing
        -And he behaved somehow strange?
        - He was nervous, but I don’t know.

        They studied at the place for 10 years, and she does not know anything about him except that he studied well.
  • ArhipenkoAndrey
    ArhipenkoAndrey 6 February 2014 08: 44
    -2
    Such an event took place in Moscow and this is symbolic - all the reforms were blown from there and now another one has happened - now wait for a surge in Russia, and the boy just saw enough Chernukha on NTV and other channels, he popped up on the Internet and under some kind of psychological doping, only a question where did you get the weapon? Indeed, in the country it is forbidden to have military weapons on the farm, in the states it is understandable, but with us? A teenager easily gets a gun, then what about the action movies? They do not need to drag him from his homeland. Everything is on time, somehow simple, but a good organization can be seen, for some reason it looks like a rehearsal, God forbid that I make a mistake.
  • JonnyT
    JonnyT 6 February 2014 09: 03
    +4
    Birth of the next Pomazun!

    The guard did not fulfill his function! He must be judged for negligence!
    And this philosopher, who did not read Dostoevsky into prison, and for a long time .....
    Teachers, too, to check all for professional suitability ..... after all, apparently to his "smart" reasoning he came not himself, but with someone's help
    1. lazy
      lazy 6 February 2014 16: 20
      +2
      Dostoevsky also had a thought in my mind whether they had passed it already, and how he felt about Raskolnikov, by the way, is another example that the gun is not to blame, if something can happen with an ax. the main thing is in a person’s head
  • Sanyht
    Sanyht 6 February 2014 09: 04
    +2
    realistically: IT IS NECESSARY TO JUDGE KILLERS AND TERRORISTS BY THE LAWS OF WAR TIME ... and not by the terms of the Europeans! this one, given that he was teased, will receive a suspended sentence, and his parents a fine.
  • Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov 6 February 2014 09: 11
    +3
    I don’t like that such a hype is inflated in the media (alas, you don’t shut your mouth.) They make a hero out of a psycho .. Like an epidemic of such shootings in schools wouldn’t go .. At this age, teenagers have a vague concept between black and white .. I can imagine now you learn from teachers in Russia, you’re learning .. And then the bam came to shoot for 2. Psychologists need professional ones to school .. (my wife worked as a psychologist with my soul and I had a lot of conflicts with children and teachers) then I reduced the rate, I don’t need a psychologist but in vain .. And especially for such nerds watched .. Here such things!
  • VadimSt
    VadimSt 6 February 2014 09: 11
    +6
    Such is the result of solipsism ...

    Somehow flew past the epilogue.
    Solipsism? Snotty "mama sons"! From which both the army and society as a whole suffer.
  • Shurale
    Shurale 6 February 2014 09: 16
    -1
    And whether the guy was under the drug, it is very similar to the article, and I do not even exclude that he himself could not suspect that under the drug ...
  • UzRus
    UzRus 6 February 2014 09: 17
    +8
    Well, I don't even know ... I was also an excellent student, I finished school with a medal. Yes, there were frictions with teachers, but what about without it? There was dissatisfaction with the estimates, which, as it seemed to me, were somewhat underestimated. But this personally stimulated me even more: “Oh, teacher, did you give me a“ 4 ”? But to KILL the teacher because of this ????????? Excuse me, of course, but this is, to put it mildly, a sick person. And about upbringing ... Those who say that the main educator is the family are right. For me, my father's word was iron, because he is my father. And that's all.
    1. hohryakov066
      hohryakov066 6 February 2014 11: 41
      +1
      Totally agree with you! There’s nothing more to add. good
  • Vadim12
    Vadim12 6 February 2014 09: 19
    +2
    The police showed negligence, appearing without bronikov to the office. One victim and a destroyed family could be less.
    1. kotvov
      kotvov 6 February 2014 11: 43
      +2
      they were wearing bronics, but the injuries were strange. And the brains of this arrow are exactly curtailed. The deputies, as always, are nonsense. The problem, I think, is in the general upbringing trend both at school and at home, and throughout the country.
    2. hohryakov066
      hohryakov066 6 February 2014 11: 44
      +1
      Now without broniks they no longer serve. Most likely, either the bronik was in the light version (without plates) or shot the patient in the head.
  • Oleg Sobol
    Oleg Sobol 6 February 2014 09: 23
    +8
    Quote: vasiliysxx
    Then you need to ask this question first of all to the security agency, which employs untrained pensioners in the pursuit of profit.

    In our school there are grandmothers "security guards", they won't even press a button. The wave has already started yesterday. The governor ordered to check all schools for the quality of protection. And that they should be checked if there are grandparents in almost all schools ... And the result will be the same, the extortion from parents to "strengthen" security will increase.
  • Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 6 February 2014 09: 44
    0
    Poor child, read by philosophers. Who generally allowed the child to read books?
  • zorch
    zorch 6 February 2014 09: 51
    +3
    Alas, in my opinion we are starting to reap the first fruits of unresolved challenges.
    Today our children have a new educator - the Internet community. Unlike bad company or bad games or movies or books, this leverage on the younger generation is practically beyond the control of parents, school, state, and clergy. The interested forces have long been carrying out purposeful work to "educate" the future generation of Russia. Today, the Internet community has a huge impact on the formation of the value system and, therefore, the immature mind of the child. The state should actively protect the citizens of the country from ideological influence and support projects that bring up children.
    The family is often weakened when the parents work hard or the family is in trouble. It is necessary to carry out explanatory work with parents, to strengthen the family. School helps here.
    I would suggest online resources that have a harmful effect on fostering culture in children to fine or close.
    1. rereture
      rereture 6 February 2014 11: 08
      -1
      state, clergy.


      It was not enough for me that the state and religion climbed into my circle of contacts and indicated where to communicate with my child, I'm sorry, but somehow I'll figure it out myself. And the clergy, I will not let a step to the child.

      I would suggest online resources that have a harmful effect on fostering culture in children to fine or close.


      Or maybe it's easier, let's not let children on the Internet?
  • Dimkapvo
    Dimkapvo 6 February 2014 09: 53
    +5
    The average cost of a contract for the protection of educational institutions by state tender - 60 rubles per post (my former colleague heads a private security company in St. Petersburg) (these are 000 people with a regime of a day or three + taxes). What quality of security can you talk about for that kind of money? Therefore, they hire grandfathers and grandmothers who have a pension, and this is just "sit for a ruble." You have to pay completely different money for high-quality protection, but the state apparently does not need it. In general, I think that schools should be protected by "sovereign people" with appropriate training and wages.
  • DimychDV
    DimychDV 6 February 2014 09: 58
    +2
    Yes! c ** ko, now shiver, teachers !!! Sobbing lawyers will justify any failed killer. So now only this way: there is a computer - a march to a class with distance learning. There is a TV - there too. And only children from sectarian and low-income families will communicate with teachers - who, in principle, does not watch TV.
  • irka_65. irina
    irka_65. irina 6 February 2014 10: 14
    +1
    What demolished a teenager? Not we will understand this. Woe is it for everyone. For the whole country. And the fact that people died, and the fact that in a modern school is becoming a place of increased risk. Lord, it couldn’t even have crossed my mind in the Soviet years to hire guards at school. Baba Shura sat on watch, gave calls and carried chalk to classes. Survived, come. Americanization in full glory.
  • Alex
    Alex 6 February 2014 10: 33
    +4
    I believe that the main fault lies first of all with the daddy of this idiot. Before teaching his son to shoot, it is necessary to hammer into his head that this "toy" is extremely dangerous, the rules of handling weapons. My father, a hunter, taught me this at one time, that the first rule is still in my head: never point, even a discharged weapon, towards a person. And of course, you should only carry the keys to the safe with you. And as for the professionalism of the PSC staff, you should have seen what kind of contingent there is! And I must say that not the best are sent to guard schools. And the level of training of police officers leaves much to be desired. Just look at the mortality rate during various counter-terrorism measures.
    1. Bezz
      Bezz 6 February 2014 10: 48
      +1
      Quote: Ralex
      And as for the professionalism of the employees of the private security company, you would see what kind of contingent there is! And I must say that not the best are sent to the protection of schools. Yes, and the level of training of police officers leaves much to be desired. It is enough to look at the level of mortality during various counter-terrorism measures.

      I wonder if the policemen had weapons? Why without body armor, if without it? If there were weapons, what kind of guards? What are the awards for? Then immediately "Heroes of Russia" will be given after the "police academy behind the ear." Not law enforcement, but a bunch of amateurs, especially freebies and dough.
      1. Manul
        Manul 7 February 2014 05: 25
        0
        Quote: Bezz
        I wonder if the policemen had weapons? Why without body armor, if without it? If there were weapons, what kind of guards? What are the awards for? Then immediately "Heroes of Russia" will be given after the "police academy behind the ear." Not law enforcement, but a bunch of amateurs, especially freebies and dough.

        And how can we talk about the killed and wounded like this ??? At what they performed their official and civic duty. And you? It’s disgusting to hear such speeches. You still blame our soldiers that they died on the battlefield, because the orders were bad, the weapons were outdated and there were few cartridges.
    2. irka_65. irina
      irka_65. irina 6 February 2014 11: 26
      +3
      At the school where my daughter is studying, security is just a laugh. Ordinary watchmen. Anyone and anytime can come to school, to whom they go, why they go, nobody cares.
  • Bezz
    Bezz 6 February 2014 10: 42
    +3
    I watched the video about the shooter. The video shows very clearly how this nerd drags two heavy guns for him in cases. To uncover them, get them (and possibly collect them) takes time and obviously not three seconds. How long did it take for the valiant security to "PERFORM its work - to press the panic button, at gunpoint"? Truly - "Looking at the world, one cannot help but be surprised!" True, Kozma.
  • Isk1984
    Isk1984 6 February 2014 10: 59
    +2
    Well, actually, the case for our sick society is not so untypical, just another abscess burst, of course, the journalists inflated everything to the scale of an interplanetary conspiracy, found out that his dad was almost a special agent, that his mother reads him psalms from childhood, here mental disorder from childhood (God forbid anyone), an excellent student is not an excellent student, just in modern society, everyone at all ... you know, but the consequences of hysteria are improper storage of weapons and so on, how can you not trust your own son ( nevertheless, the boy is not 5 years old), of course, he knew where the guns were, in my family, for example, from childhood, my dad taught my son to arms and right now (6 years old), he and his grandfather sit on a pair of clean and carbines and pump action, rules weapons (from the childhood) are laid down from childhood; this is a case rather an exception to the rule, the subjective factor played a role, just now conversations about toughening the punishment for storage, and so on, when the devastation in the heads at the very top. But in general, the signs of a mediocre society, like the collapse of the USSR, do nothing good, from education to the construction of aircraft carriers ...
    1. UzRus
      UzRus 6 February 2014 11: 31
      +3
      Dear, if dad had the key to the "pyramid" with him, nothing would have happened. What does the culture of handling weapons have to do with it?
      1. rereture
        rereture 6 February 2014 11: 42
        +4
        It would happen, but in a different way, the guy would take a kitchen knife or hatchet for cutting meat. And he would have cut off the teacher. The tragedy as it was and remains.

        It’s not weapons that kill - people kill.
    2. nerd.su
      nerd.su 6 February 2014 12: 09
      +3
      Quote: Isk1984
      Well, how can you not trust your own son (after all, the boy is not 5 years old), of course he knew where the weapon lies

      If children have access to weapons, there is a chance of an emergency. True, grade 10 is really not small. This is at 8-10 years old, I remember, hunting cartridges equipped with bullets, a hammer on the capsule ... And then they found the bullets for some reason not in the board on which the cartridges were placed, but in different other places. On the other hand, fun with throwing live ammunition into the bonfire was submissive to all school ages.
      With all this, in my memory, all accidents with children were associated with uncontrolled access to hunting rifles.
      Yes, do not tighten storage. Legal storage precludes such wild cases. Tighten enforcement. At least after the state of emergency additional checks, conversations with those owners who are parents. But the police have a stopudovy excuse - the district policemen are sewing up work once. Can not argue with that.
    3. skullcap
      skullcap 6 February 2014 13: 34
      +2
      Quote: Isk1984
      of course, the journalists themselves inflated to the scale of the interplanetary conspiracy

      So journalists earn their own piece of butter. Fat-eaters, damn ...
      And none of them will ever "niv zhist" go to the machine or to schools! As once the officers, cut by a bald idiot
    4. The comment was deleted.
  • dmb
    dmb 6 February 2014 11: 01
    +5
    And again, the vile media showed itself in all its glory. Children were only freed from capture, and they poked their microphones in their faces. With pride, issued almost for heroism, they report that they reached the neighbors, and they told them about the moral appearance of the unfortunate family, choke with admiration, showing Kolokoltsev, who visited the wounded policeman. Kolkoltsev, maybe he did a good deed, but why his good deed should be reported to the whole country. Let’s tell you tomorrow that he, Kolokoltsev, transferred the old woman across the street.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • calocha
    calocha 6 February 2014 11: 06
    +3
    With such an education, it will not be that much !!! You need to engage in sports, in different circles ... The state should think about that !!! Much has been left "on its own". The EGE will be remembered for more than a decade.
  • Egoza
    Egoza 6 February 2014 11: 15
    +5
    I express my condolences to the families of the victims.
    And yet, let's consider: I'll make a reservation right away - all the previous opinions expressed are correct. But everyone considers particulars - parents, guards, teachers ... but these people are also members of society! And therefore, I believe that society is primarily to blame, which generates such situations and has already re-educated many of our people. Look around! After all, in order to become a "successful person" you need to reject all morality, sometimes walk over corpses in the literal and figurative sense of the word. And what parent does not want his child to be "successful"? And how many examples can be cited when parents frighten their child (who is undoubtedly the most talented, the most intelligent, worthy of a luxurious life) "What are you? Do you want to become a teacher? Will you work for a penny? Look at your teacher! How he dresses!" Study to become a lawyer, economist, manager ... "And a teacher? You noticed the phrase of your classmates: "He found an inaccuracy in the teacher's statement and since then he rarely attended his classes!" What is it like? Yes, before, both the teacher and the class teacher checked the magazine almost every day, but once a week it was a must! Skipping a lesson - a call to parents, an entry in a diary, a call to the director ... And here - silence. Capitalist society has elevated rudeness, ignorance, and disregard for work into dignity. Striving to achieve the goal at ANY COST! AND INDIFFERENT !!!
    Honor and praise to those who still preserve our family’s primordial values, morality, and cultivate respect for people, regardless of their salaries, nationality, or position. Who understands his responsibility, first of all, to his children. But the situation described in the article can be repeated more than once if significant changes in society as a whole are not introduced.
    1. UzRus
      UzRus 6 February 2014 11: 39
      +2
      Always carry the keys to the safe with weapons and the 15-year-old débils of teachers and police will not kill. Everything else you said is common truth.
      1. Per se.
        Per se. 6 February 2014 13: 49
        +2
        You can, of course, look for a causal connection in the teenager’s access to weapons, in the neglect of his duties as a security guard, and the insufficient professionalism of the task force. Yes, exclude any bad link in this sequence, and tragedy could have been avoided. Nevertheless, to me personally, the opinions of Elena and Oleg Chuvakin are closer, all these are consequences of one big problem - our society is in pain, and this disease is spreading all over the world like a virus, whose name is capitalism. The lack of spirituality from the cult of consumerism and the cult of profit, the world under the rule of a nest of ghouls, which have long been moral dead, but the dead endowed with power over the world, which they are more likely to destroy than release their tentacles from their blood-sticky blood. Even the church is no longer a panacea for morality, where the same Vatican is mired in sins, with cardinals pedophiles and priests homosexuals. It seems that the great mission of Russia consisted of this, during the creation of the Soviet Union, this is a counterweight to the dark side. Denying God, it was the Communists who were closest to the commandments of Christ. A boy with a gun is a litmus, an indicator of our disease. I don’t know if the elections are deciding now, but we can raise our children, we remember something different, not measured by money alone, we must pass this on to our children, like ourselves, remembering morality, to resist corruption in our hearts. Perhaps all this sounds idealistic, but is there really another cure for what is turning our whole world into Sodom and Gomorrah?
  • Internal combustion engine
    Internal combustion engine 6 February 2014 11: 23
    +6
    "Are Gordeev's crimes a trend?" the author asks and answers: "Hardly." Oh well. It is enough to look at the USA to the ideals of which the current authorities are leading us.
  • The gentleman
    The gentleman 6 February 2014 11: 28
    +4
    at one time I saw the movie "kids" in 1996, American production. and then thoughts arose: on the one hand, it's cool, all the same, adults, but on the other, it's good that it's not like that with us. We respect our elders and have always been afraid of teachers and God forbid the teacher would call the parents that your child behaved badly at school. and we ourselves were to blame for getting twos.
    in our time, there were also tough guys who were "outrageous", but nevertheless were equal to gaining knowledge, striving. children began to grow up early, there is no control. and here I agree with the author that this is not a trend, has not yet dropped to the state level, but this is a call. after all, in fact, what is happening in schools is silent. stories of students, teachers on the Internet shaft, but this is not submitted for discussion, for reflection. and let all sorts of doctors of sciences continue to study everything from books.
  • basil200
    basil200 6 February 2014 11: 48
    +6
    At school, we were afraid and respected by the teacher, now the children trample them with their rights. I myself have been playing PS since grade 6, then there were still doom games, fornication, karmageddon those who played knew. Now they say games spoil children (just reduce the time of the game). From childhood, I knew where Bati had a gun, under the bed and sofa. They are now in the safe. Who will go to school as a guard where the salary is 10000, and 1500 children should be looked after. There are old people and retirees, who cannot imagine that today's children are like that. Previously, the children were different. Previously, a Trudovik or a physical education instructor could have taught a lesson in a dark corner of the hall, now for this period. Class teachers go home and take a receipt from their parents saying that during the flood or vacation they are responsible for their children and not the class teacher. So do not run into security guards, teachers and educators. After the reform, they are engaged in paperwork. Throw stones at the ministers of education.
    1. The gentleman
      The gentleman 6 February 2014 14: 27
      0
      Quote: basil200
      At school, we were afraid and respected by the teacher, now the children trample them with their rights. I myself have been playing PS since grade 6, then there were still doom games, fornication, karmageddon those who played knew. Now they say games spoil children (just reduce the time of the game). From childhood, I knew where Bati had a gun, under the bed and sofa. They are now in the safe. Who will go to school as a guard where the salary is 10000, and 1500 children should be looked after. There are old people and retirees, who cannot imagine that today's children are like that. Previously, the children were different. Previously, a Trudovik or a physical education instructor could have taught a lesson in a dark corner of the hall, now for this period. Class teachers go home and take a receipt from their parents saying that during the flood or vacation they are responsible for their children and not the class teacher. So do not run into security guards, teachers and educators. After the reform, they are engaged in paperwork. Throw stones at the ministers of education.

      you said about the guard. so if the guard even makes a remark to the child, at least he will hear a good mate, and as a maximum the father will come and give the child this head on this guard
  • Terrible ensign
    Terrible ensign 6 February 2014 12: 00
    +7
    Article plus! Alexey very correctly put the emphasis.
    In the comments, as usual, emotions prevail over a sound approach. Moreover, some colleagues are eager to add, to pull into the discussion, the possible nationality of the teenager and other details of little relevance.
    I will try to speak essentially:
    1. The teenager was lost in the family - that is, the direct fault of the parents is that they did not take care of their own child.
    2. The teenager’s father is directly to blame for the fact that the child (though already a big one, but essentially still a child) had weapons - he did not provide control over the safety of weapons and ammunition - criminal negligence, which entailed a series of murders.
    3. Gaps in the upbringing of the child (primarily the lack of attention on the part of the parents and the lack of a normal dialogue) created psychological problems in the adolescent. A school psychologist, teachers, and a class teacher looked at the guy’s IT. There is an indirect fault of the school and teachers.
    4. Nominal protection at school is not absolutely necessary, if it is protection it should really protect.
    The RF Law on "CHODD" does not allow the guard to take active actions aimed specifically at protecting the life and health of citizens and maintaining the security regime, focusing on the protection of property. Fuck ... I then have it all? THIS IS THE FAILURE OF THE LEGISLATOR - THE STATE DUMA, THE FEDERATION COUNCIL AND THE PROFILE COMMITTEES ON SECURITY.
    Issuing batons to security guards in schools with the previous algorithm of actions will not correct the situation.
    5. Actions of a specific guard ... Coward, m.i.n.zh.o.v.k.a, disabled in the head. I was afraid to neutralize the boy. (Probably not a father, not a parent - I can't understand such a person) I could at least duplicate the pressing of the button by calling the central center (N) or service "02" with a description of the situation. Who is the devil head of a school to inform about an armed attack?! .. With regard to the situation - in the last place ...
    6. It is striking the carelessness of the State Defense Department. Gentlemen policemen relaxed. At one time I was constantly instructed, and then I myself, several times during the briefing and the divorce of the outfits, instructed and reminded the invaders: "Departure to trigger the panic button - exit to a serious crime being committed !!! Readiness for anything! .. Bulletproof vests and helmets - in obligatory! .. "(We have: LOW-RIFLE, two hits in the deceased - chest and stomach ... - WHERE IS THE ARMOR?!?) Employees themselves are indirectly to blame for the results of such" professional work "- one was killed, the other was wounded. Question: what to reward for?!? The leadership of such policemen should be punished.
    Conclusions: All are to blame. I'm sorry for everyone. Especially a geography teacher ... He is clearly an extreme and hostage situation at that time.
    If: the parents were parents - they brought up and looked after the child normally, the school workers noticed the boy's problems, and the psychologist tested and understood in a timely manner, .. the security guard did not treat his work as a sinecure causing the straightening of the brain "alarm" - there would be no resonant case.
    And the media would not have to write once again vulgarity and nonsense ...
    1. nerd.su
      nerd.su 6 February 2014 13: 15
      +2
      Quote: Scary ensign
      The RF Law on "CHODD" does not allow the guard to take active actions aimed specifically at protecting the life and health of citizens and maintaining the security regime, focusing on the protection of property.

      Try bringing a knife to a more serious nightclub. Well done there, wow! Bogatyrs! If you type in the search engine "the work of the security of the nightclub X in the city of U", you can see how the guys treat customers that are impolite from their point of view.
      So it’s better not to attract lawmakers here, they just again some kind of hu ... will make an unsuccessful decision.

      Quote: Scary ensign
      The disorganization of the GZ OVO is striking. The gentlemen of the police relaxed.

      There is a video, I watched it yesterday, I don't remember the name. There, in particular, the chief of police of the Moscow district, where this school is located, said that both were in armored vehicles, the first bullet entered the side through the arm, as I understand it, through the armpit. The second, it seems, the bulletproof vest did not save. Well, at least one "small bore rifle" was a 7,62 caliber hunting carbine.

      Quote: Scary ensign
      A school psychologist, teachers, and a class teacher looked at the guy’s IT. There is an indirect fault of the school and teachers.

      And what is it? What should they see? Nerds do not cause anything to anyone. The boy is studying well, he can debate with teachers - well done! The geographer on inaccuracies caught and ceased to respect - youthful maximalism. Now, if it turns out that the boy voiced his intentions like that - then yes, the pedagogical flaw. It was necessary to convey to dad, maybe he would put the key to the safe in his pocket.
    2. Genur
      Genur 6 February 2014 14: 42
      0
      Naturally - sorry for the innocent victims of this scumbag.
      It is not clear only why the "heroes" of the "Hero of Russia" were not given ..
  • Leader
    Leader 6 February 2014 12: 00
    +9
    Magazines are to blame for everything! This is not a pity ...
    And what does the guard have to do with it? Who is this anyway? The very idea of ​​private security in state institutions is utter nonsense.
    Russia is the birthplace of terrorism, and since the end of the 80s - the omnipotence of bandits at all levels.

    2 hours after the tragedy, no one knows anything yet, and the Investigative Committee is already commenting: the boy has a nervous breakdown ... Who are the parents of this ur ..... eh !!!
    Only the prohibition of the use of the term "parliamentary immunity", executions and confiscations will save the country.
  • drop
    drop 6 February 2014 12: 05
    +6
    Dear VO readers, this is a tragedy of our society. Let's start with TV. There are films about murders, criminals, mints, prosecutors, prostitutes, etc. Who will be a hero in society after that? Why this dirty trick is removed and shown in the country for budgetary funds, who is being corrupted by our media.
    I went to college in 15 years after the 7 class. At the post even before the oath, we stood with weapons, but without cartridges. Only at the warehouses there were military weapons posts, and this was in the center of Leningrad in the 1953-1957 years. No one had the idea to shoot the company commander, foreman, pomkomvzvoda for the outfit out of turn. Where are we going. When art tips begin to look what they give to the younger generation. I am a doctor of sciences, professor, merit. Scientist of the Russian Federation, Laureate of state. premiums. I was in alterations, in local wars, but I saw senior commanders insure the young and protect them. President of the country, we need to change the principles of education and find other priorities for young people. We will lose her.
  • Vasia kruger
    Vasia kruger 6 February 2014 12: 16
    +4
    The article is good.
    But the aftertaste of events in all Moscow schools is simply disgusting.
    Checks began on everything and everyone. Not only security, but also fire safety for example (this will help a lot damn)

    Blaming the shootings or the Internet ... this is unwise, I doubt that it even somehow affected.
    I see the reasons as follows.
    1. The psychological atmosphere (in the state as a whole, in the classroom, in the family)
    2. The internal head cockroaches of the offender, possibly serious mental disorders.
    3. Parents, or rather upbringing ... if a 10th grade student is met by a grandmother ... this is a paragraph.
    Are the teachers to blame ... but FIG knows there is no information, but IMHO's parents are obliged to monitor the child.

    The availability of weapons ... it’s not at all a fact that the keys to the safe were accessible, on the market there are fairly cheap models of safes that break with almost bare hands, and locks from mailboxes.

    Someone suggested equipping teachers? This is generally utter nonsense in my personal evaluative opinion. At school, losing a weapon is a hundred times easier than anywhere else, this is due to the high concentration of children, who may well stiffen it, including primitive hooligan considerations.
  • Rodriques
    Rodriques 6 February 2014 12: 17
    +5
    Something I did not understand, how much they paid to the participants of the program "Let them talk", classmates and teachers, that no one said that the photo in the hall was a completely different guy, innocent. Here are the bastards, inhumans.
  • Ser
    Ser 6 February 2014 12: 26
    +3
    It is a pity, of course, to the victims of the shooter, the shooter himself, condolences to loved ones. But this will not help anyone. You will not return it back. Now it remains to draw the appropriate conclusions for us, the parents, and all who owe it. First of all, why did all this happen? It seems to me that the parents, the school, or rather the education system are to blame, and, I don’t know how to express it, our time itself. I am the parent of a kid of the same age. The mistakes of parents are that we put pressure on the child, God forbid it lags behind in studies, God forbid it stays somewhere. He will lose time! He will sit down late for lessons! The child thereby stops communicating with others, and this is important. He withdraws into himself, into his "world." He leaves the realities. What is at school? The child does not come to school, but to some information center. Where he is stuffed with the necessary and unnecessary information (open the textbooks, you will see). Constantly remind about the exam. The child comes from school squeezed out, and then there are lessons. At least, if you work hard, from 3 to 5 hours. Because of this, we had to quit sports (judo). And he played sports for 8 years. Then he only has time to sleep. And so in a circle for 6 days. What about computer games? This is horror. Here is the KID and RAPED. Therefore, I allow the child to access the computer for 1 hour a day. Better to let him sleep more - this is the best medicine for relieving stress. For comparison. How did I grow myself? Finished high school without stress. After school, he threw textbooks so that he could hardly find in the morning. I finished on 4 and 5. I graduated from the institute without too much stress. And now, I think, I have not lagged behind new technologies in my specialty. The fault of the education system is that it relies on cramming, and not on explaining, understanding the basics of subjects. And this information flow, moreover, changes daily 6, sometimes 7 times. In this mode, not only a child, an adult will experience breakdown.Everyone is different.
  • Vadim2013
    Vadim2013 6 February 2014 12: 40
    +4
    TV affects youth. On TV series, where the murders and heroes of the bandits.
  • Klim podkova
    Klim podkova 6 February 2014 12: 48
    +4
    Now it is necessary for the media to correctly "play out" this situation. Not an "unfortunate boy", but a "geek, murderer, etc." so that other suffering schizophrenics do not want to draw attention to themselves in this way. Parents should be ostracized. Mother abandoned this bastard. With the murderer's father, normal people should stop greeting, should spit after. And don't: "They're not to blame!" - to blame! And I'm not sorry for them. I'm sorry for the victims.
    1. report4
      report4 6 February 2014 13: 37
      +1
      Quote: Klim Podkova
      Normal people should stop saying hello to the killer’s father, and they shouldn’t give a damn.

      In fact, they will initiate a case (or have already opened one) by 224 and he will most likely be judged and sentenced by it.
      1. mark7
        mark7 6 February 2014 18: 39
        0
        Quote: report4
        convicted and sentenced.

        Holy simplicity - read above, who they are, today showed Vasilyeva refused to go to court and the court transferred, as you