Military Review

Soon there will be a demonstration of a new anti-aircraft complex "Pantsir-SM"

81
The construction and supply to the troops of the Pantsir-S1 anti-aircraft missile-cannon complex (ZRPK) continues. To date, the armed forces have received dozens of such systems, in addition, a number of new air defense systems will be delivered in the near future. At the same time, the Tula Instrument Design Bureau (KBP), which created the Pantsir-C1 air defense system, is working on a project to upgrade the complex. Not so long ago, several Newsconcerning the new project "Shell-SM". It is this system in the future that should complement the existing systems in the troops, and in the future, possibly, replace them.


Soon there will be a demonstration of a new anti-aircraft complex "Pantsir-SM"



In mid-December last year, representatives of the Ministry of Defense spoke about the current plans for a new anti-aircraft complex. In accordance with current plans, the new ZRPK Pantsir-SM will begin to arrive in the army next year. As follows from the December statements of the military, the prototype of the new anti-aircraft complex is ready and shown to representatives of the Ministry of Defense. So, in mid-December, on the basis of the Tula KBP, trainings were held in which more than 90 officers from the Air Force and Air Defense, industry and the Ministry of Defense took part. As the press reports, for the first time the participants of the training camp were shown a modernized anti-aircraft complex.

In late January, it became known about the imminent "premiere" of a new anti-aircraft missile and cannon complex. Unfortunately, the exact date of the demonstration of the Pantsir-SM system, as well as its characteristics, has not yet been named. All information on this subject is limited to only the most general formulations: the complex will be presented in the near future, and in terms of its characteristics it is superior to the existing Armor-C 1.

On January 20, Russian President V. Putin, accompanied by the leadership of the Ministry of Defense, visited the KBP and the Shcheglovsky Val plant, where construction of the Pantsir-S1 ZRPK is underway. The delegations demonstrated various developments in the field of armaments and military equipment in the form of both finished samples and promotional materials. Of greatest interest is the animated video, which demonstrated a certain anti-aircraft complex. A number of features shown in the video of technology suggests that the promising system "Pantsir-SM" was so demonstrated to the president and the leadership of the Ministry of Defense.

The video shows two combat vehicles built on the base of the Typhoon chassis created by the KAMAZ plant. On the same chassis are mounted various complexes of equipment, differing from each other in several characteristic features. So, one of the cars carries a combat module, much like the one used in the Pantsir-С1 complex. On the roof of the combat vehicle there is a rotating turret with antennas of radar stations and transport and launch containers of missiles. It is impossible to draw precise conclusions about the use of automatic cannons from a freely available passage of an advertising video - if they are present on a painted car, they are not visible.

In general, the first of the cars shown in the video, much like the current ZRPK "Pantsir-С1", however, has several noticeable differences. First of all, it is a radar target detection radar antenna. It differs markedly from the existing modifications used on the complexes, from which it is possible to make some assumptions about changes in the composition of electronic equipment. On the tower, as before, it is proposed to install two blocks of six transport and launch containers with missiles.

The second car, shown in the video, has a different composition of electronic equipment, but it carries a greater number of missiles. It can be seen that it transports and can use 24 missiles in transport-launch containers. Between the two blocks of missiles placed antenna radar target tracking and guidance. There is a block in place of the target detection radar, apparently equipped with optical or thermal imaging surveillance systems. A greater number of missiles and a reduced composition of radio-electronic equipment can be considered as evidence that the Pantsir-SM anti-aircraft complex instead of a transport-charging vehicle or with it will include a starting-charging vehicle. This technique has already been used in some air defense systems of the last decades and has proven itself well.

If the assumption of the presence of a starting-charging vehicle in the complex turns out to be correct, then the basic method of increasing its combat effectiveness becomes clear. In this case, a combat vehicle with a target detection radar will be able to monitor the situation, produce target detection and target designation of both its own weapon systems and the start-up vehicle. Currently, the Pantsir-C1 combat vehicle can simultaneously fire up to 4 targets. In the upgraded version, this figure may double. At the same time, as follows from the available materials, both machines in the anti-aircraft complex will independently guide the launched missiles.

Previously, there were reports of a deep modernization of the missile complex "Pantsir-C 1", which will significantly improve its performance. As a result of this modernization, the maximum target range can reach 40 kilometers. In addition to the obvious consequences of a tactical nature, this may lead to a change in the class of the complex. At present, the Pantsir-C1 belongs to short-range anti-aircraft systems, and increasing the range of missiles will transfer it to the class of short-range air defense systems.

In the near future, the first demonstration of the new Pantsir-SM anti-aircraft complex should take place. It will allow you to check the assumptions made and learn the main features and characteristics of the new system. In addition, the demonstration of the complex will answer a number of important questions related to the new development. These are the exact characteristics of the renewed rocket, the presence of guns, the composition of electronic equipment, etc. The exact date of the first demonstration of the Pantsir-SM system has not yet been announced.


On the materials of the sites:
http://ria.ru/
http://vpk.name/
http://kbptula.ru/
http://bmpd.livejournal.com/
Author:
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  1. afire
    afire 4 February 2014 07: 57
    +10
    Terrific!
    Engineering thought does not stand still.
    We are developing in the same spirit! It is important that our life is protected from potential threats. Times are not calm now. Thinking of a weapon.
    1. Papakiko
      Papakiko 4 February 2014 14: 57
      +4
      Quote: afire
      Thinking of a weapon.

      Snickersney already.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Gakkoga
      Gakkoga 5 February 2014 14: 36
      +2
      Who decides to fly nearby, wash in blood)))
  2. VohaAhov
    VohaAhov 4 February 2014 08: 19
    +6
    Artillery component is not detected on "Pantsir-SM". No 2x1- 30 mm AU. Have they been abandoned?
    1. Nitarius
      Nitarius 4 February 2014 08: 45
      +2
      Well, I think NOT to the detriment of the complex!
      1. Geisenberg
        Geisenberg 4 February 2014 14: 48
        +3
        Quote: Nitarius
        Well, I think NOT to the detriment of the complex!


        They could have refused. And without harm. A rocket has more room to maneuver than a bullet. The cannons could be abandoned to increase the rocket ammunition and to simplify the task - there is no need to make a decision on the use of guns or missiles. Here on the forum there was already infa about the new shell, so there one of the designers said something like "tremendous accuracy, most targets are struck by an accurate head-to-head hit." If, indeed, such accuracy is understandable, the rejection of the gun is understandable.
        1. Windbreak
          Windbreak 4 February 2014 17: 53
          +4
          Quote: Geisenberg
          Here on the forum there was already infa on the new shell, so there one of the designers said something like "tremendous accuracy, most targets are struck by an accurate head-on-forehead hit."
          This info was about Thor
    2. Associate Professor
      Associate Professor 4 February 2014 08: 50
      +6
      Quote: VohaAhov
      Artillery component is not detected on "Pantsir-SM". No 2x1- 30 mm AU. Have they been abandoned?

      Yes, they refused.
    3. 123dv
      123dv 4 February 2014 09: 20
      +7
      Quote: VohaAhov
      What did they refuse from them?

      There were video footage from firing, where he easily hits targets with missiles, which he cannot take with artillery ....
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 10: 25
        +12
        Quote: 123dv
        where he easily hits targets with missiles, which he cannot take with artillery ....

        Using electronic warfare can reduce the results to zero, well, or significantly reduce the effectiveness of missiles, so to secure the artillery system it should still be left behind. My opinion.
        1. 123dv
          123dv 4 February 2014 11: 47
          +1
          In the conditions of dense operation of enemy electronic warfare systems, artillery fire is possible only in the daytime in conditions of good visibility ...
          As a means of self-defense against helicopters and ground equipment, yes, and no ... soldier
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 13: 41
            +4
            Quote: 123dv
            daylight hours

            EW on night vision devices and thermal imagers are not affected. laughing
            1. 123dv
              123dv 4 February 2014 16: 06
              +2
              EW is a general concept.
              It includes the struggle in the entire spectrum of electromagnetic waves, including and in the infrared and visible ranges.
              Smoke screen, clouds of volumetric IR light, heat traps, laser light of optics and MANY other things .... There is not enough space to list.
              1. Ev58
                Ev58 15 March 2014 12: 05
                0
                I support this opinion as a "techie". Any, absolutely any useful signal can be masked or its selection can be significantly hampered.
        2. Flooding
          Flooding 4 February 2014 12: 27
          +3
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Using electronic warfare can reduce the results to zero, well, or significantly reduce the effectiveness of missiles, so to secure the artillery system it should still be left behind. My opinion.

          I am joining. The car will rise in price, including due to the chassis.
          Not to make it more or less self-sufficient in defense is stupid.
          Automata are needed; let their use be strictly limited to ODA. tasks.
          Booking a car means increasing its survivability.
          But after all, the abandonment of trunks means lowering it in a real combat situation.
        3. Geisenberg
          Geisenberg 4 February 2014 14: 56
          +4
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Quote: 123dv
          where he easily hits targets with missiles, which he cannot take with artillery ....

          Using electronic warfare can reduce the results to zero, well, or significantly reduce the effectiveness of missiles, so to secure the artillery system it should still be left behind. My opinion.


          I doubt very much that EW, as it is now, may disrupt the operation of the air defense systems. First you need to remember the physics of sweating radio waves. So the power of the radio signal decreases inversely with the square of the distance. Again, it is also impossible to suppress the entire range in which the air defense radar locator works, and it will work so that each next pulse is emitted at a different frequency, count in all possible frequency ranges for it. Thus, the farther an REB station from an air defense system, the less its influence, inversely, so to speak, in proportion to the square of the same distance ... And who will launch an electronic warhead to an air defense system? Where is it seen? It’s only the Papuans who can throw tomahawks with impunity, try to touch us - there will be no escort aircraft or destroyers.
      2. Meteor
        Meteor 4 February 2014 11: 56
        +2
        Quote: 123dv
        There were video footage from firing, where he easily hits targets with missiles, which he cannot take with artillery ....

        The “shell” during the exercises could not shoot down the E95M air target with anti-aircraft guns.
        The E95M aerial target simulates subsonic type maneuvering targets cruise missilePlanning bomb, UAV.
        http://www.enics.ru/bla?product_id=22
        video 24: 15-26: 03

        But how much advertising "Shell" was. (Shock Force. 176 Tomahawk Hunter)
        It would be better if the Torah was purchased.
        1. Associate Professor
          Associate Professor 4 February 2014 12: 06
          +8
          Quote: Meteor
          But how much advertising "Shell" was. (Shock Force. 176 Tomahawk Hunter)
          It would be better if the Torah was purchased.

          Just in order for the anti-aircraft guns to work effectively, the Shell needs to be hung out on hydro-supports, in the Polygon it shot without hanging. That's all
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. Meteor
            Meteor 4 February 2014 12: 52
            +2
            Quote: Docent
            Just in order for the anti-aircraft guns to work effectively, the Shell needs to be hung out on hydro-supports, in the Polygon it shot without hanging. That's all

            Distinctly it can be seen that the supports are extended. Watch this moment (25:05-25:30) on youtube in high resolution, full screen.
            poligon1poligon1

            clickable
            poligon2
          3. Ascetic
            Ascetic 4 February 2014 13: 02
            +3
            Quote: Docent
            Just in order for the anti-aircraft guns to work effectively, the Shell needs to be hung out on hydro-supports, in the Polygon it shot without hanging. That's all


            The network posted a report "Assessment of the characteristics of the ZRPK" Pantsir-C1 " Authors
            V.V. Belotserkovsky, Candidate of Military Sciences, Associate Professor (Air Defense Forces) and I.A. Razin (VA VPVO VS). There are many controversial positions in terms of shortcomings. But in particular on the item
            17.when firing cannon weapons without
            use of jacks in directions not
            coinciding with the axis of the wheeled self-propelled,
            tipping over possible or significant
            buildup of sway and increase in errors
            aim shooting

            What we observe in this video. There is a video test in Cap-Yar in 2006. where the E95 target was hit by AU.
            1. Meteor
              Meteor 4 February 2014 13: 13
              +1
              Quote: Ascetic
              17.when firing cannon weapons without
              use of jacks

              Quote: Ascetic
              What we observe on this video

              In this video JACKS ARE USEDbut it doesn’t help.
              1. Ascetic
                Ascetic 4 February 2014 13: 27
                +4
                Quote: Meteor
                In this video jacks are USED, but this does not help.


                And in 2006 in Cap Yar helps smile



                On the video starting at 4:20
                1. Meteor
                  Meteor 4 February 2014 15: 10
                  -1
                  Quote: Ascetic
                  And in 2006 in Cap Yar helps smile

                  Quote: Ascetic
                  On video starting at 4:20

                  Wow! Only for some reason you forgot to mention that in your video “Shell” stands on a specially prepared site, possibly with concrete coating.
                  The “Carapace” support in your video is different from the ones that are visible in my video.
                  Part of the "Shell" is closed. They wanted to hide something? Additional support?

                  (http://s019.radikal.ru/i602/1402/03/755edc79b802.jpg)
                  Watch from 4: 20
                  1. Geisenberg
                    Geisenberg 4 February 2014 15: 41
                    -2
                    Quote: Meteor
                    Part of the "Shell" is closed. They wanted to hide something? Additional support?


                    Your head will not be prevented by additional support. Finish your tantrum already.
                  2. Evgeny_Lev
                    Evgeny_Lev 4 February 2014 16: 22
                    +6
                    Comrade, could you tell us where you read that the accuracy of the Pantsyr hit is 100%?

                    Please name at least one model of an anti-aircraft machine, which has 100% hits on the target.

                    What’s there, name at least one world model that would correspond to the real indicators of the Pantsyr.

                    Regards CEP.
                    1. Meteor
                      Meteor 4 February 2014 22: 12
                      -1
                      Quote: Evgeny_Lev
                      What’s there, name at least one world model that would correspond to the real indicators of the Pantsyr.

                      German MANTIS is superior to the "Shell". (excluding missile weapons)
                      1. Bars90
                        Bars90 4 February 2014 22: 31
                        +1
                        in terms of speed, yes, but in terms of performance ... mmm ...)))
                      2. Meteor
                        Meteor 4 February 2014 22: 51
                        0
                        Quote: Bars90
                        in terms of speed, yes, but in terms of performance ... mmm ...)))

                        Read the article first, and then moo ...
                        "Mantis": a hunter for shells
                        http://topwar.ru/26096-bogomol-ohotnik-za-snaryadami.html
                      3. Victor-M
                        Victor-M 4 February 2014 23: 17
                        +1
                        Quote: Meteor
                        "Mantis": a hunter for shells

                        Yeah, it catches perfectly, with the whole body. laughing
                2. Meteor
                  Meteor 4 February 2014 22: 16
                  +1
                  Quote: Evgeny_Lev
                  Comrade, could you tell us where you read that the accuracy of the Pantsyr hit is 100%?

                  “Carbon Monoxide”, “Military Secret”, reports on federal television channels.
                  1. Apollo
                    Apollo 4 February 2014 22: 27
                    +4
                    Quote: Meteor
                    «Carbon monoxide force ”,“ Military Secret ”, reports on federal television channels.

                    winked
                    Maybe it’s allshock force.
              2. mihai_md2003
                mihai_md2003 4 February 2014 22: 50
                +4
                In vain you are fellow patriots minus the person says business. It’s better now to know what and how to fix, then to be surprised and wave your hands
              3. toster666
                toster666 3 January 2015 07: 43
                0
                This is not a complete video. Actually, there were at least 4 lines and shot down almost overhead, by accident.
                If you watch the video with the Goalkeeper, then he throws several missiles into one missile from one line.
                Phalanx - gets into a mortar mine.
                1. SSeT
                  SSeT 31 August 2017 22: 29
                  0
                  Sometimes it gets. On tests in the greenhouse. And sometimes the Ax does not see point blank. It’s clear what I mean?
              4. The comment was deleted.
              5. The comment was deleted.
          4. typhoon7
            typhoon7 4 February 2014 18: 19
            +2
            Volcanoes from your destroyer also couldn’t knock down an ax, which entered it perfectly (it’s good that a blank), but it never occurred to anyone to remove it from armament. things happen.
      3. Boa kaa
        Boa kaa 4 February 2014 23: 10
        +1
        Quote: Docent
        he shot at the Polygon without hanging. That's all

        Two comments: 1. It seems that the artillery of the complex did not pass the adjustment before this shooting.
        2. There should be a gyro-stabilized platform so as not to hang out the complex on hydro-supports (jacks). In a real battle, no one will do this. Moreover, it was positioned as a direct fire without stopping vehicles.
        Thor is good, but there is no artillery, and much can happen in close combat. Recall the ambush tactics of turntables.
    4. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 13: 39
      +6
      Quote: Meteor
      It would be better if the Torah was purchased.

      TOR has other tasks. S-300, Tor, Carapace, each is responsible for its echelon.
      Quote: Docent
      The carapace needs to be hung out on hydro-supports; in the Polygon he shot without hanging. That's all

      Yes, they could have simply missed, but this is not a reason to refuse automatic machines. hi
      1. Associate Professor
        Associate Professor 4 February 2014 13: 50
        +4
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        TOR has other tasks

        Yes, the same as that of the Shell: short-range air defense systems. But Thor is not supplied to the air defense / aerospace defense, only to the air defense of the NE.
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        each is responsible for his echelon.
        If you are talking about an aerospace defense system, then its appearance should look something like this: S-500 - S-400 - S-350 - Carapace - Morpheus
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 15: 11
          0
          Quote: Docent
          Yes, the same as that of the Shell: short-range air defense systems.

          Medium and small.
          Quote: Docent
          then its appearance should look something like this: S-500 - S-400 - S-350 - Carapace - Morpheus

          Absolutely right. hi
          1. Associate Professor
            Associate Professor 4 February 2014 15: 36
            0
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            Medium and small.

            20 km range is average?
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 15: 53
              0
              Quote: Docent
              20 km range is average?

              Sorry, confused with Buk. laughing but the characteristics of Thor are still different from the Shell.
              1. Associate Professor
                Associate Professor 4 February 2014 16: 22
                +1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                but the characteristics of Thor are still different from the Shell.

                Well, of course, they are slightly different, but in general they solve the same problems
                1. Ingvar 72
                  Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 19: 54
                  0
                  Quote: Docent
                  Well, of course, they are slightly different, but in general they solve the same problems

                  Good comparative article.
                  http://3mv.ru/publ/pro_pvo_na_teatre_voennykh_dejstvij/3-1-0-10164
      2. mihai_md2003
        mihai_md2003 4 February 2014 22: 54
        +2
        As I understand it, several cars were fired at once; this is no longer easy to miss. It is necessary to eliminate the cause, whether it is to increase the area of ​​the supports or something else.
        1. Bad_gr
          Bad_gr 15 February 2014 10: 29
          0
          Quote: mihai_md2003
          As I understand it, several cars were fired at once; this is no longer easy to miss. It is necessary to eliminate the cause, whether it is to increase the area of ​​the supports or something else.

          The platform must be changed to tracked, like the Tunguska.

          As I understand it, before the TOR was engaged in covering the distant anti-aircraft systems and various objects, and Tunguska covered the columns in movements. Pontsyr-S was created as a further development of the Tunguska, but received a wheeled platform with which it can no longer fulfill its previous tasks and therefore it is already being pulled into the sector of tasks that were previously carried out by the TOR, and who should accompany the columns? for the old Tungusks with Shilka?
    5. Geisenberg
      Geisenberg 4 February 2014 15: 02
      0
      Quote: Meteor
      The “shell” during the exercises could not shoot down the E95M air target with anti-aircraft guns.
      ... But how much advertising of the "Shell" was. (Shock Force. 176 Tomahawk Hunter)


      And how many advertised f-117? And they shot him down with an ordinary Pecher, not even a modern one. So, in this connection, please tell me the American Apache helicopter, the crown, so to speak, of engineering, will be able to maneuver like a subsonic cruise missile or a planning bomb ?? But the cannon part was designed just to deal with helicopters.
      1. Patton5
        Patton5 4 February 2014 18: 24
        +4
        Well yes!!! pilots flying on "Apache" are taught how to enter the zone of destruction of cannon anti-aircraft systems, heroically maneuvering to approach the ZPU at a distance of 3000-2500 thousand meters, and hit the enemy with their self-control and composure !!!
      2. Meteor
        Meteor 4 February 2014 22: 19
        +1
        Quote: Geisenberg
        And how many f-117 were advertised? And they shot him down with an ordinary Pecher, not even a modern one.

        F-117 was shot down on third war day, and the whole war lasted 78 days! So, there was time and experience to share other F-117s down (they made about 850 sorties in Yugoslavia). But no more shot down, another was shot down, but he reached the base of Aviano in Italy ...
        1. Wolf
          Wolf 5 February 2014 12: 28
          +2
          After prigot zbitog 117, they established their flight over Serbia! The intelligence service of the TsIA, MI6, MOSAD worked so that the bi would recognize how Serbs had killed him. And we can beat them with hammers! :-))))))))!
          Then they and the manufacture and purchase of the US Army, F117 stopped. You think because they created 850 successful jacks over Serbia? , or the reason beat a friend? Nada only logically will see and swap lodges about the superweapon of the United States and NATO fall into the water! In addition to eta Pechora, it was only 30 years old that didn’t reach 50 years old, it’s a shame that Pechora’s weapon cannot work for 50 years as a nada! So, the brother doesn’t matter if the bi had beaten the air defense of the sample of the 90s of NATO, the bi still sent Tomahawk from the Middle Earth pestilence. 5a Colon Kudeo Masonov in Russia betrayed Serbia to NATO, did not want to supply modern weapons and signed many traitorous agglomerations in the Security Council of the UN. Kozirev and Chernomrdin! THERE ARE NO BEST WEAPONS IN THE WORLD THAN RUSSIAN! :-)))
      3. Meteor
        Meteor 4 February 2014 22: 44
        -1
        Quote: Geisenberg
        So, in this connection, please tell me the Apache American helicopter, the crown, so to speak, of engineering, will be able to maneuver like a subsonic cruise missile or a planning bomb ??

        In the United States is developing a new anti-tank missile JAGM. It is assumed that the new 3rd generation JAGM ATGM will be adopted by the U.S. Army in 2016, the firing range of the missile will be to 16 kilometers.
        "Shell"
        Cannon armament (2A38M)
        Effective maximum firing range: 4 km
  • Orik
    Orik 4 February 2014 11: 20
    +3
    Quote: VohaAhov
    Artillery component is not detected on "Pantsir-SM". No 2x1- 30 mm AU. Have they been abandoned?

    Looks like. The program "Polygon" showed shells shooting and ... the target from the cannons was not hit, they were finished off with a rocket.
    1. Ascetic
      Ascetic 4 February 2014 13: 53
      +8
      Quote: Orik
      Looks like. The program "Polygon" showed shells shooting and ... the target from the cannons was not hit, they were finished off with a rocket.


      Filming took place during the exercises and the guys decided to climb up, or the option of manual accompaniment was worked out within the scope of the goal, the exercises make up the most complicated tasks.
      In automatic tracking mode, the AU knocks down such targets at times
      Here is another video
      They started to shoot from 2.5 km and several times also missed, and they managed to hit at a distance of about 1.3 km. Starting from a kilometer, various KAB / ATGM guns hit) with guarantee, at a greater distance the effectiveness is naturally lower due to the large spread.
      1. Meteor
        Meteor 4 February 2014 15: 16
        -6
        Quote: Ascetic
        Filming took place during the exercises and the guys decided to climb up, or the option of manual accompaniment was worked out within the scope of the goal, the exercises make up the most complicated tasks.
        In automatic tracking mode, the AU knocks down such targets at times

        It’s not difficult to lie, the Internet will endure everything.
        Can you confirm your words?
        Quote: Ascetic
        Here is another video

        On your video you can’t see how the “Shell” knocks down E95 anti-aircraft guns.
        First they show shooting, then E95 immediately falls.
        There are no hits in E95.
        About your first video, I wrote above.
        1. vladkavkaz
          vladkavkaz 4 February 2014 19: 30
          +5
          Meteor US
          In short, AMER is better, are you willing to say this?
          Well, come on, somehow shovel-here you are not Iraq and Libya, the fried carcasses of your McCain cool take away the fields.
        2. Victor-M
          Victor-M 4 February 2014 23: 24
          +1
          Quote: Meteor
          It’s not difficult to lie, the Internet will endure everything.

          For this, the CIA bully it created it, and truth can only be seen with your own eyes, in vain. belay or fellow
  • beard999
    beard999 4 February 2014 15: 34
    0
    Quote: VohaAhov
    Artillery component is not detected on "Pantsir-SM".

    Unfortunately, on the video http://www.kbptula.ru/index.php/en/home/127-russkij/novosti/aktualnaya-informats
    iya / 301-visit-prezidenta-20-01-2014 where the frames for the article were taken from, it’s only visible that the Pantsir-SM modification has 24 guns with 12 missiles. But in the XNUMXth charging modification, the artillery weapons were quite possibly preserved, but this is not visible in the video. In any case, the KBP itself, so far, still designates the "Shell-SM" as an air defense system.
    In general, today, in general, it is difficult to understand the general concept of the Shell-SM, especially if the information is correct that the maximum interception range will be up to 40 km http://armstass.su/?page=article&aid=125044&cid=24. How will two BMs combine with each other? It is not clear whether one single missile for both BMs will be implemented or the principle of two-sided defense with two missiles with different maximum launch ranges will be implemented? In general, there are so many more questions than answers ...
  • KirZack
    KirZack 26 November 2019 19: 10
    0
    As part of the machine, where there are 12 missiles, there will be guns, where 24 are not.
  • Igor39
    Igor39 4 February 2014 08: 28
    +1
    These need not a couple of dozen but a couple of thousand.
    1. Associate Professor
      Associate Professor 4 February 2014 08: 38
      +7
      Give the shell to every yard
      1. Geisenberg
        Geisenberg 4 February 2014 15: 05
        +1
        Quote: Docent
        Give the shell to every yard


        They will give a courtyard in the Crimea laughing - I will give a place for the Shell, but at least there would be enough space for the S-300 ...
    2. AVV
      AVV 4 February 2014 11: 41
      +3
      Quote: Igor39
      These need not a couple of dozen but a couple of thousand.

      Modify, get feedback from the troops, and in the series then to the troops !!!
  • Associate Professor
    Associate Professor 4 February 2014 08: 42
    0
    Apparently, the principle of kinetic interception is implemented in missiles, as in the new Tor-M2.
  • Horn
    Horn 4 February 2014 08: 49
    .
    Pleases. But little, terribly little! We can stupidly not have time!
    No wonder the Chinese are building cities in which no one lives. Underground shelters are being built. They develop EXACTLY the land component of the PLA. They change the obsolete technique not 1:10 like us, but 1: 1. And this technique, I dare say, is modern.
    China is preparing for war. War with us. Nuclear war.
    1. Bronis
      Bronis 4 February 2014 09: 29
      +5
      Quote: Horn
      China is preparing for war. War with us. Nuclear war.

      But why?
    2. Horn
      Horn 4 February 2014 09: 31
      0
      Are there any arguments besides minuses?
      1. Bronis
        Bronis 4 February 2014 09: 50
        +27
        I do not put cons for ideological reasons.
        Arguments
        1. China will not survive a nuclear war with us
        2. If China needs a territory, why would nuclear weapons be hit on it?
        3. If desired, China has more subtle tools (even immigrants - why fight, if you can become an ethnic majority?) And access to our resource base for the Chinese is already quite tolerable and everything is expanding.
        4. China now has many problems in the Asia-Pacific region and the development of the Navy is becoming paramount.
        5. The simultaneous confrontation of China with the Russian Federation and the USA is impossible, because fatal to her. Everyone forgets that India is also nearby.
        The list goes on and on ...
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 4 February 2014 11: 07
          +1
          Quote: Bronis
          1. China will not survive a nuclear war with us

          And we? In a normal fight, knowing that the enemy is armed, will you get your gun? Or will you try to avoid shooting until the last?
          Quote: Bronis
          2. If China needs a territory, why would nuclear weapons be hit on it?

          China needs territories to the Urals, and not beyond it. And at the sight of nuclear weapons it is the European part of Russia.
          Quote: Bronis
          4. China now has many problems in the Asia-Pacific region and the development of the Navy is becoming paramount.
          the fleet can be successfully used in our Far East.
          Quote: Bronis
          5. The simultaneous confrontation of China with the Russian Federation and the USA is impossible, because fatal to her.

          The US is sleeping and seeing a conflict between Russia and China, and if it does, they will take on the role of observer, no more.
          “I would like to see Germany in the grave, and Russia on the operating table.” W. Churchill
          And I would not even consider India as an ally. hi
          1. Bronis
            Bronis 4 February 2014 11: 27
            +5
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            1. China will not survive a nuclear war with us
            And we? In a normal fight, knowing that the enemy is armed, will you get your gun? Or will you try to avoid shooting until the last?

            Right. therefore, there won’t be a nuclear war ... If we are pulled to the wall, there will be few options ...
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            China needs territories to the Urals, and not beyond it. And at the sight of nuclear weapons it is the European part of Russia.

            Rather, not territory, but resources. He can get access to them (and he does) with milder means. nuclear strike in Moscow - strike in Beijing ...
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            the fleet can be successfully used in our Far East.
            It is possible, but the SV, and not the fleet, come first. The Chinese appeared ambitions at sea, naturally the opposition of the United States and satellites. So the race begins there. And China is still noticeably behind, but is taking extraordinary measures to rectify the situation ...
            Quote: Ingvar 72
            The US is sleeping and seeing a conflict between Russia and China, and if it does, they will take on the role of observer, no more.

            That's right, but China also understands this. After a hypothetical conflict with the Russian Federation, the United States will not accept to take advantage of the situation against China.

            Quote: Ingvar 72
            And I would not even consider India as an ally.

            India is not an ally of Russia, but an adversary of China. And by the way, our Western "friends" began to use this.

            In fact, a major war between the Russian Federation and the PRC is unlikely (up to the stat. Error), because does not bode well on both sides. This situation will continue in the future if the Russian Federation has more or less significant military and economic potential. Otherwise, the country will simply collapse. Then China will take what it needs. But this is not war, but occupation of the territory - a semi-police operation.
            Thus, whether the Urals and the Far East will be Chinese depends not on the military preparations of China, but on the capacity of our government. It’s up to her to decide ... hi
            1. Horn
              Horn 4 February 2014 11: 51
              -8
              Rather, not territory, but resources. He can get access to them (and he does) with milder means. nuclear strike in Moscow - strike in Beijing ...

              1. Only in the Russian Federation there are no longer any shelters and NEW EMPTY houses waiting for immigrants from contaminated areas are not standing.
              2. Knowing the ubiquity of the Chinese and the venality of our officials from customs, it is possible with 90% probability to predict the existence of nuclear bookmarks in the cities of Russia carried out by the Chinese.
              3. The number of nuclear charges in China is underestimated, at least an order of magnitude.
              4. The United States (and any arrogant Saxons) will NEVER intervene in a conflict. What for? The mutual weakening of China and Russia is beneficial to them.
              5. India? Not even funny! Remember Romania too.
              6. For China, the war is beneficial even from a purely practical point of view: until capitalism has completely corrupted the no longer virgin brain of the Chinese communists, as long as China's propaganda apparatus is working successfully, you can not only grow in foreign territories, but also slightly "thin out" the overgrown male population of the country. With losses even 1: 5, for them it will be precisely thinning, and for us - destruction.
              1. Bronis
                Bronis 4 February 2014 13: 28
                +3
                Quote: Horn
                1. Only in the Russian Federation there are no longer any shelters and NEW EMPTY houses waiting for immigrants from contaminated areas are not standing.

                In the event of a nuclear war, there will be especially nobody and nowhere to relocate with us. Look where they are building - mainly in the same place where the majority of the population lives - where they will be beaten. The theme of cities is separate, but not directly related to civil defense
                Quote: Horn
                2. Knowing the ubiquity of the Chinese and the venality of our officials from customs, it is possible with 90% probability to predict the existence of nuclear bookmarks in the cities of Russia carried out by the Chinese.

                Knowing that the temperature in the Caribbean over the 300 years increased by 3 degrees, with a probability of 90% it can be assumed that the pirates died out there from this wassat
                Quote: Horn
                3. The number of nuclear charges in China is underestimated, at least an order of magnitude.

                Quite possibly. But we know exactly how much we have. And this is enough to destroy China 7-8 times without a trace.

                Quote: Horn
                4. The United States (and any arrogant Saxons) will NEVER intervene in a conflict. What for? The mutual weakening of China and Russia is beneficial to them.

                But then they will intervene "In the name of great justice." China understands this

                Quote: Horn
                5. India? Not even funny! Remember Romania too.

                Romania did not fight China, did not provide refuge to the Dalai Lamas, and India did. And now Pakistan and China are very friendly against it.

                Quote: Horn
                6. For China, the war is beneficial even from a purely practical point of view: until capitalism has completely corrupted the no longer virgin brain of the Chinese communists, as long as China's propaganda apparatus is working successfully, you can not only grow in foreign territories, but also slightly "thin out" the overgrown male population of the country. With losses even 1: 5, for them it will be precisely thinning, and for us - destruction.

                A large-scale conflict with us for China is not "thinning", but destruction. Not only the population is destroyed, but also the industry with the infrastructure.
                These are not units in the strategy ... laughing
                Moreover, too rude. Even the United States does not act like that now. Since 1945 the year has changed. He did not get better, but the methods became thinner ...
              2. Papakiko
                Papakiko 4 February 2014 13: 48
                +3
                Quote: Horn
                it is possible with 90% probability to predict the existence of nuclear bookmarks in Russian cities carried out by the Chinese.

                On the face of the consequences of using all kinds of chemicals. crying
                Quote: Bronis
                After a hypothetical conflict with the Russian Federation, the United States will not accept to take advantage of the situation against China.

                To do this, you just need to press the "Off" button, as in the previous press "On" and start the flywheel of the Chinese factory.
                Quote: Horn
                The number of nuclear charges in China is underestimated by at least an order of magnitude.

                Have you personally counted the number of charges in each officially recognized country and in those where hypothetically-supposedly could be? It seems that no.
                Therefore, it is better not to be measured by the fact that you do not hold in your hands.
                Quote: Bronis
                but resources. He can get access to them (and he does) with milder means.

                True comrade !!!
                Our climate Nafik did not give up to anyone.
                Resources are one thing, but living bare-handed on the permafrost is "no ice". wink
                1. Horn
                  Horn 5 February 2014 09: 12
                  0
                  1. I do not smoke or drink. I do not find it necessary to bind myself with bad habits.
                  2. The climate in China, in some places worse than ours. The Chinese NOW live in Russia in its terrible climate, and do not die.
                  3. Self-consolation has not saved anyone yet. I do not want to be Cassandra, but naive hat-takers and apochuists die in the first place. From the collapse of life values.
              3. Patton5
                Patton5 4 February 2014 18: 44
                +3
                my advice to you! watch less REN-TV!
        2. ver_
          ver_ 4 February 2014 15: 10
          0
          China has its mouth full of problems ... In the near future they are planning a strong aging of the nation, besides this - for us they are all Chinese, and they are not all equal to each other ... north and south are big differences, and there are no nationalities few ... and inner Mongolia ... and India and other neighboring countries ..., Taiwan, Japan ... USA ...
  • Doznanied
    Doznanied 4 February 2014 09: 17
    +2
    It is a pity that they abandoned the 30 mm AU, not to the detriment of universality, including in terms of self-defense of the complex?
    1. Mihail29
      Mihail29 4 February 2014 12: 23
      +1
      It is not a matter of self-defense at all, air defense systems will not be put on the front line and he will hardly be able to defend himself, but if only from infantry, but to increase his ability to combat flying targets is another matter.
      1. Metlik
        Metlik 4 February 2014 20: 08
        +2
        The shell was conceived by Gryazev and Shipunov as a universal machine for air and land. It was supposed to be a replacement for Tunguske, not Torah.
        1. Kasym
          Kasym 4 February 2014 21: 10
          +1
          Tunguska can work on the go (this is important) as part of the column. I expected that the modernization of the Shell would be such. But nothing is said from the message about this.
          And the guns are needed - if the helicopters manage to get close (because of the nearby hill will emerge) or to support the infantry with fire (Shilka - "Shaitan Arba" in Afghanistan distinguished itself by this).
          And I think it’s not worth turning into a likeness of the TOR. Long range is good, but I think the direct hi
  • Siberia 9444
    Siberia 9444 4 February 2014 09: 55
    +5
    We don’t fly the air defense motto ourselves and don’t give it to others! soldier
  • muhomor
    muhomor 4 February 2014 10: 25
    +3
    We need guns! They block the "dead" missile launch zone.
  • Peter76
    Peter76 4 February 2014 10: 55
    0
    An interesting expression: a few dozen and a certain amount, everything is extremely clear. But the development of technology is very pleasing.
  • tchack
    tchack 4 February 2014 12: 13
    +4
    It pleases 24 missiles on one machine, as well as 12 missiles on the S-350 ...

    But the fact that they abandoned the artillery component is a pity. Situations are different ...
  • wanderer_032
    wanderer_032 4 February 2014 12: 43
    0
    The video shows two combat vehicles built on the basis of the Typhoon chassis created by the KAMAZ plant.

    This is what I was talking about and what I expected, a vivid example for all those who like to talk about where Typhoons-K will be delivered in the first place.
    And also the answer to the question of why they will be made.
    1. Basileus
      Basileus 5 February 2014 12: 52
      0
      Toto trucks are ready, and the armor is just on the mock-ups.
      1. wanderer_032
        wanderer_032 5 February 2014 14: 09
        0
        Everything has its time.
        There is no carapace in this modification yet, something else is already there.
        A lot of design bureaus would like to get these chassis for installing their products on them, because they do not have analogues produced in Russia.
  • Sirop
    Sirop 4 February 2014 14: 47
    +8
    Well done Russians !!! They try, do something, create, not like ours (((. Good luck and success !!!!
    1. Doznanied
      Doznanied 4 February 2014 15: 51
      +4
      And good luck to you drinks Come on, calm down.
    2. ultra
      ultra 4 February 2014 18: 19
      +4
      Quote: Sirop
      They try, do something, create, not like ours (

      And we can’t do anything else !!!
  • Zomanus
    Zomanus 4 February 2014 16: 14
    +1
    He opened the article and came ... was struck by the number of missiles in one machine. Generally excellent. Put together a shell with a gun and a shell with missiles and everything will be normal. And it is advisable that more goals for one volley could hit. On ships this is necessary. Self-propelled air defense / air defense barge ...
  • Leshka
    Leshka 4 February 2014 19: 11
    0
    probably they have good gizmos and the range will be bigger
  • saag
    saag 4 February 2014 19: 53
    0
    guns canceled canceled as not self-justifying
  • max90.90
    max90.90 4 February 2014 23: 11
    +2
    Quote: wanderer_032
    This is what I said and what I expected, a vivid example to all those who like to talk about where the Typhoons-K will be delivered in the first place. And also the answer to the question of why they will be made.
    1. wanderer_032
      wanderer_032 5 February 2014 13: 58
      0
      The chassis is the same, the cabin is armored, there is protection against mines, what is needed for automotive equipment of this class.
      So what is on the right side is first and foremost, and everything else on request is in small series.
      And most importantly, the niche is free and there is little competition, and there are more options than on the left side.
  • voliador
    voliador 5 February 2014 00: 59
    0
    Well, all the same, the E-95 is smaller than the Harpoon, and, moreover, Tomogavka. So it’s clear that the probability of hitting it from the trunks is less.
  • Basileus
    Basileus 5 February 2014 12: 55
    0
    The only thing I don’t understand is why the chassis is not all-terrain - tracked or wheeled, it doesn’t matter - but automobile? Mine protection is not bad, but for the anti-aircraft gun it seems more important for me to be in the right place at the right time, and for this you need cross-country ability than not to be blown up by a land mine - they still do not move alone.
    1. Doznanied
      Doznanied 5 February 2014 15: 13
      0
      As I understand it, the complex is run in on a car chassis, and then modifications will be created both on a tracked chassis and up to ship-based.
      1. Basileus
        Basileus 5 February 2014 21: 53
        0
        Well, there are no caterpillar versions of the first shell yet)