Military Review

The myth of the "Ukrainian Thermopylae"

61
January 29 The 1918 of the year was a minor episode of the civil war - a battle at Kruty between the forces of the Central Rada and the detachments of the red soldiers, sailors and Red Guard workers. The latter went to the aid of the workers of the insurgent Arsenal, who at that moment were shot by the Petliurists.




I do not know why and who needs it,
Who sent them to death with a naughty hand?
Only so mercilessly, so evil and unnecessary
Dropped them into Eternal Peace!
A. Vertinsky


The battle of Kruty, like no other event of the revolution and civil war in Ukraine, generated an unprecedented amount of myths. Over time, the basis of the mythologeme crystallized: Kruty is the “Ukrainian Thermopylae”. Historical reality was dissolved in the myth of 300 students who took the battle with the "Bolshevik hordes" and almost all died.



Three hundred Spartans and Athens Feta

The Battle of Thermopylae itself has long turned into a colossal myth and is perceived by many through the prism of the American comic book, filmed in the movie "300 of the Spartans." This episode of the Greek-Persian wars 480 BC. e. went down in history as an example of rare courage and self-sacrifice. Against the 200-250-thousandth army of the Persian king, the Greek cities were able to expose, according to various sources, from 5200 to 7700 people. Their main task was to delay the advance of the Persian army into the territory of Hellas. With the defense of the narrow Thermopilsky passage, the Greeks could hope to solve this strategic task. Having located their forces in the narrowest places on the path of the Persian army, they leveled the numerical superiority of the enemy. After the traitor led the Persians to the rear, most Greeks retreated. The remaining detachment (about 500 people, including about 300 Spartans led by Tsar Leonid) heroically died, but made it possible for the rest of the army to retreat.

The battle of Thermopylae is one of the most famous battles of antiquity. When describing it, first of all emphasize the valor and courage of the Spartans. However, it became a heavy defeat for the Greeks. The path to the Persians in central Greece was opened. However, the sacrifice of the Spartans was not fruitless. It served as an example for the Greeks and shook the Persians' confidence in victory.

And yet, not 300 noble Spartans under Thermopylae, but the Athenian fleet, manned from the lowest qualified group of citizens - the Fet, played a decisive role in the expulsion of the aggressor. But it so happened that the feat of the Spartans remained for centuries, and the names of the Athenian Fet did not reach us. In less than 10 years, as the leader of the Popular Party and the creator of the Athenian fleet Themistocles was expelled from his hometown.

Episode of war echelon

The situation of January 1918 was a little reminiscent of the events of the Greco-Persian Wars. There was no invasion of the Bolsheviks. The authoritative diasporic historian Ivan Lisyak-Rudnytsky noted: “The legend that needs to be handed over to the archive is a fairy tale about the“ super-numerous hordes ”of enemies, under the blows of which Ukrainian statehood allegedly fell.” The main blow of the red troops brought down on the counter-revolutionary Don. The total number of troops advancing on Kiev, according to various estimates, ranged from 6 to 10 thousand. It was not a regular army, but detachments of soldiers, sailors and Red Guard workers, red Cossacks. The existing system of electing commanders and division of units according to party affiliation did not add combat capability. Georgy Lapchinsky, a member of the Soviet government of Ukraine, described the Red fighters as follows: “The warriors were fancy dressed, completely undisciplined people, hung with various weapons, rifles, sabers, revolvers of all systems and bombs. The fighting capacity of this army for me has been and remains very doubtful to this day. But she successfully moved forward, since the enemy was completely demoralized. ”

In contrast to the ancient Greeks, no patriotic upsurge was observed among Ukrainians: they did not see in the Soviet government the threat of enslavement, “Soviet occupation”, which some contemporaries say. The Central Rada had at its disposal up to 15 thousand soldiers. In Kiev, there were up to 20 thousand military. Almost all Ukrainian parts and shelves at the decisive moment refused to support the Parliament. Many of them have declared their neutrality. The British Soviet expert, Edward Carr, noted that at this stage the Ukrainian national movement did not evoke a wide response from either the peasants or the industrial workers. Not so much power remained under the control of the Central Rada: Haydamatsky Kosh of Sloboda Ukraine Simon Petlyura, Sich archers — former Galician prisoners of war, the Haydamatsky regiment to them. K. Gordienko and a number of small parts. According to Valery Soldatenko, Doctor of Historical Sciences, around the Central Rada at the end of 1917 — the beginning of 1918. created a vacuum. The population of Ukraine en masse joined the Red Guard detachments.

It was a strange, "echelon" war: military forces were concentrated along the railways. Red troops attacked Kiev with two groups of railways: Kharkov - Poltava - Kiev and Kursk - Bakhmach - Kiev. Vladimir Vinnichenko called this war a “war of influence”. “Our influence,” the head of the Central Rada government noted, “was less. It was already so small that with great difficulty we could make up some small more or less disciplined parts and send them against the Bolsheviks. The Bolsheviks, to be sure, also did not have large disciplined units, but their advantage was that all our broad masses of soldiers did not offer them any resistance, or even came over to their side, that almost all the workers of each city stood for them; that in the villages the rural poor were clearly Bolshevik; that, in a word, the vast majority of the Ukrainian population itself was against us. " Prior to major military action is not reached. As a rule, with the approach of the Reds, an uprising of workers arose in the city, and the local garrison declared neutrality or switched to the side of the Bolsheviks.

The promises of the Central Rada were believed only by the most trusting and politically unsophisticated part of Ukrainian society - the youth. 11 January 1918 was the newspaper of the Ukrainian Socialist-Federalist Party (the bourgeois party that appropriated the name of the socialist) “Novaya Rada” published a call for students to sign up for the Sich Riflemen. 18 January at a meeting of students of Kiev University and the Ukrainian People’s University was announced a record of volunteers. They were joined by students of the 2-th Ukrainian Gymnasium named after the Cyril and Methodius Brotherhood. In total, about 200 people who had completed initial military training for several days signed up. Initially, Kuren was created as an auxiliary military unit for the guard service in Kiev. To date, historians have not been able to figure out how untrained students came to the front.

There is a version that the students left for the front without permission at the request of the junkers, who, without receiving reinforcements, held positions in the Bakhmach area and sent a delegation to Kiev from despair. It was possible to persuade only students who arrived in the area of ​​the railway station Kruty. Bakhmach had already been delivered by that time.

The correlation of forces on the eve of the battle, which began on the morning of January 29, was as follows: the cadets of junkers (400-500 people) and a hundred student smokers (116-130 people) against several thousand Red Guards, soldiers and sailors. The fight itself was vividly described by the historian and politician Dmitry Doroshenko: “The unfortunate youth were taken to the station Kruty and landed here at the“ position ”. At a time when the young men (mostly never holding a gun in their hands) bravely entered the battle against the Bolshevik detachments, their commanders, a group of officers, remained on the train and organized drunken carriages; the Bolsheviks easily defeated a detachment of young people and drove him from the station. Noticing the danger that the command in the train quickly gave the signal to leave the train, not stopping for a minute to take the runners with them. ”

Vain victim

The Battle of Kruty did not attract the attention of contemporaries. However, with the return of the Central Council in March of 1918, relatives and friends of the victims raised the question of reburial. Doctor of Historical Sciences Vladislav Verstiuk explains that the battle near Kruty has become widely known due to the participation of a number of famous people, including the brother of the Foreign Minister of the UPR A. Shulgin. A scandalous publication appeared in the press accusing the leadership of the Central Rada of the deaths of young men.

And an experienced politician, Mikhail Hrushevsky, played in advance - a ceremonial reburial was organized. The losses claimed by Averky Goncharenko, who commanded the junkers (later served in the SS division “Galicia”) in 280 people, were not confirmed. Contrary to allegations of students being shot by 27, only 17 bodies were found that were buried at Askold's grave. Although originally prepared 200 coffins. The rest, apparently, fled. 8 injured prisoners were sent to Kharkov for treatment.

According to V. Soldatenko, in the absence of other vivid examples of the manifestation of national self-consciousness and sacrifice, the battle at Kruty is becoming increasingly active, implementing educational activities, especially among young people. At the same time, the workers of Arsenal, who fought for their rights, are exposed as “Moscow invaders”, “fifth column”. Although Ukrainian and Russian workers fought side by side for social justice and the right of peoples to self-determination.

The Battle of Kruty did not solve any military tasks. She did not stop the advance of the Red troops and did not cause a general patriotic upsurge among the population. But she gave the possibility to the Petliurists to cruelly deal with the rebel arsenalians, which, however, did not save the Central Rada. The attempt to return on bayonets of the Germans and Austro-Hungarians, which in modern textbooks is often bashfully called “international recognition of Ukraine”, once again proved the unviability of its power.

Ukraine has its Thermopylae

In fact, the “Ukrainian Thermopylae” exist, but they are not related to the events of 1918, but to the times of the national liberation war of the Ukrainian people under the leadership of Bogdan Khmelnitsky. During the battle of Berestechko in the summer of 1651, which ended with the defeat of the Cossacks, an episode occurred resembling the 300 feat of the Spartans.

An eyewitness to the events of the Frenchman Pierre Chevalier wrote: “In one place in the middle of the swamp, 300 Cossacks gathered and bravely defended themselves against a large number of attackers, who were pressing at them from everywhere; in order to prove their contempt for life, which they promised to give, and for everything valuable except life, they pulled all the money out of their pockets and belts and threw them into the water.



Finally, completely surrounded, they almost all died, but they had to fight with each of them. Left alone, beating against the entire Polish army, he found a boat on a swamp lake and, hiding behind her side, withstood the shooting of the Poles against him; having spent all the powder, he then took his scythe, which he beat off all those who wanted to grab him ... The Cossack, though pierced by fourteen bullets, met them with great zeal, which greatly surprised the Polish army and even its royal majesty, in whose presence ended this fight. The king was very enthusiastic about the courage of this man and ordered to cry out that life gave him when he surrendered; the latter proudly replied that he no longer cares about living, but only wants to die, like a real warrior. He was killed by a spear blow by another German who came to the aid of the attacker. ”

The death of these Cossacks, like the death of the Spartans, allowed the best Cossack troops to be withdrawn from the battlefield. And the victory of the royal troops, like the victory of the Persians near Thermopylae, turned out to be Pyrrhic - they soon faced with the people's war and were forced to get out.
Author:
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  1. Azaat
    Azaat 1 February 2014 08: 49
    +15
    Only the lines "Lyuba" "Old Man Makhno looks out of the window in the courtyard in a dark, dark" are remembered. The Reds themselves could have taken Kiev from the rear, but they feel sorry for the Cossacks.
    1. stroporez
      stroporez 1 February 2014 10: 36
      +6
      it’s a pity. because it was PEOPLE. it’s good that they don’t see what is happening on their Fatherland ..........
      1. ele1285
        ele1285 1 February 2014 18: 52
        +5
        Quote: stroporez
        it’s a pity. because it was PEOPLE. it’s good that they don’t see what is happening on their Fatherland ..........

        In what homeland? Skoropadsky, Petliura or the Romanov Empire?
        It’s a pity for the boys, and it doesn’t matter in the civil or in the Second World War, they didn’t see life, women didn’t matzah, they should live and live, and you are talking about Otchyzna.
        1. stroporez
          stroporez 2 February 2014 10: 15
          +1
          Quote: ele1285
          In what homeland?
          --------- in Russia ........
  2. Dovmont
    Dovmont 1 February 2014 08: 56
    +18
    But what about the epic victories of ancient ukrov over Neanderthals !! ??
    1. Bronis
      Bronis 1 February 2014 09: 13
      +14
      By the way, no kidding. As I understood from the textbook, "the Ukrainian people are at least 140 thousand years old." (http://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2014/834/aghb209.jpg) - a larger direct link.
      The Cro-Magnon migration to Europe took place somewhere 60-50 thousand years ago. And before that, Neanderthals dominated in Europe ... The curtain ...
      1. wadim13
        wadim13 1 February 2014 18: 56
        +3
        More handcuff. At us in Ukraine people didn’t think of life.
        1. smile
          smile 1 February 2014 22: 32
          +5
          wadim13
          Wah! FAQ. Have you basically forgotten Russian? :))) What is your life ... well, then, as in "Ivan Vasilyevich changes his profession", I hope you remember? :))) The Bandarlog life was only in the service of either the Austro-Hungarian or the dad Hitler, and it existed only for short periods when the likes of you were set against the Ukrainian people. Usually such a life ended in a persistent habit of standing cancer in front of the owner and tearing out normal Ukrainians with their teeth. who did not want to become slaves ...
          Twenty years ago, the bandarlogs were again released from zoos ... to which they brought the country, clearly visible to everyone. If they succeed in all their plans, the Arctic fox will come to Ukraine, you will turn your country into a garbage dump and a slave corral of Europe - you see, the limit of dreams of people like you ....
          And in general, your brain has performed an unacceptable operation - it will be removed ... :))) Yes, and why do you need it, you can do a great job without it, is it not? :)))
          1. siberalt
            siberalt 2 February 2014 01: 15
            +1
            The Ukrainian language is the funniest in Europe. Watch Russian films with Ukrainian translation - from laughter to tear.
          2. siberalt
            siberalt 2 February 2014 01: 15
            +1
            The Ukrainian language is the funniest in Europe. Watch Russian films with Ukrainian translation - from laughter to tear.
            1. wadim13
              wadim13 2 February 2014 16: 08
              +7
              Uv. Sibiralt. You, probably, and blacks cause unrestrained fun because of their black skin? Do the narrow eyes of Mongoloids generally lead to seizures? You can also laugh at Japanese films. They amuse my little son very much. These funny actors talk so emotionally that they seem to be fighting all the time. Toshiro Mifune, in general, probably, every word is a mother. It's so great that we are all so different and there is always a reason to laugh! ... Although, I absolutely agree - you need to read books and watch films in the language of their author. "Gentlemen of Fortune" lose a lot from the translation into Ukrainian.
    2. smile
      smile 1 February 2014 16: 45
      +4
      Dovmont
      So what to talk about ... Neanderthals won. :))) Therefore, humanity has evolved further, up to Homo sapiens. But if the Ukrainians had won, then there would have been no people on planet Earth - there would have been only continuous bandarlogs ... well, you can see them on the maydaun ... or in the zoo. :)))
      1. smile
        smile 1 February 2014 22: 35
        +1
        smile
        I re-read my comment and realized that I had incorrectly expressed my thought - I didn’t mean the Ukrainians, but those bandarlogs who talked about ancient Ukrainians from which dinosaurs descended ... I hope the difference is clear. I apologize to those normal Ukrainians whom my comment could hurt. I will try to be more careful.
  3. sichevik
    sichevik 1 February 2014 09: 02
    +20
    Plain propaganda duck. Swollen to the size of a nationwide tragedy. But it all started with pimple m e dak. Cool, famine. Now here are the heroes of the Maidan ...
    1. ele1285
      ele1285 1 February 2014 18: 55
      +5
      Quote: sichevik
      Plain propaganda duck. Swollen to the size of a nationwide tragedy. But it all started with pimple m e dak. Cool, famine. Now here are the heroes of the Maidan ...

      need to do so
      The Minister of Education 10 times could not pass the exam, the Minister of Health lost consciousness in the queue at the clinic, the deputy died of hunger, having lived for one month on child allowance ... Only after that the pensioner released a goldfish!
    2. Felix200970
      Felix200970 4 February 2014 20: 24
      0
      Quote: sichevik
      Plain propaganda duck. Swollen to the size of a nationwide tragedy. But it all started with pimple m e dak. Cool, famine. Now here are the heroes of the Maidan ...

      A little bit earlier. With the cunning Kravchuk. The article is at least similar to the truth. Without much distortion. I have been thinking about this nonsense for a long time. My military education did not fit either. Probably it was necessary to finish the history faculty in order to believe in this nonsense fool
  4. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF 1 February 2014 09: 32
    +17
    Any Enos, even such an artificial one, as a Ukrainian cue, needs sacred heroes, martyrs and victims in the fight against the enemy. Because the Russians were recorded as enemies, it was urgent to find heroes precisely in the wars with us. The described battle with the Poles does not fit - Poles are Europe, and Ukraine has centuries-old European aspirations.
    1. 8R63A
      8R63A 1 February 2014 16: 54
      -14%
      Ukraine has three troubles; fools, gorilka and Russia!
      1. wax
        wax 1 February 2014 20: 29
        +5
        Ukraine has three troubles; fools, gorilka and Russia!

        Ukraine has three troubles, but the third of its own preparation is called autonomy.
    2. 8R63A
      8R63A 1 February 2014 16: 54
      -5
      Ukraine has three troubles; fools, gorilka and Russia!
      1. smile
        smile 1 February 2014 22: 42
        +4
        8R63A
        Judging by this thoughtful text, you personify the second misfortune of Ukraine, right? :))) I sympathize with normal Ukrainians - against the background of troubles like you, all other Ukrainian troubles seem to be slight misunderstandings.
  5. crest
    crest 1 February 2014 09: 52
    +24
    Remember the old joke from the time of Brezhnev. They say to a veteran in the party’s district committee. It’s still necessary to find out whether you fought heroically on the Lesser Land or hid in the ruins of Stalingrad.
    All these heroic deeds, like the Battle of Konotop, the defense of Baturin, the battle of Kruty, were brought to light by our Natsiks under Yushchenko and are still procrastinating.
    No, to remember the battle near Brody and there is some kind of obelisk to cheer up, so shamefully even the SS division lay down to the fullest and not the cute gymnasium students and students.
    By the way, the organizer of this massacre, Grushevsky, quietly lived his life in Moscow, and begged for posts and privileges from the bloody tyrant.
    1. xan
      xan 1 February 2014 14: 29
      +7
      All these heroic deeds, like the Battle of Konotop, the defense of Baturin, the battle of Kruty, were brought to light by our Natsiks under Yushchenko and are still procrastinating.

      When Khmelnitsky Ukrainians have heaps of victories, why not remember them? Yes, because the Natsiks need battles with the Russians.
      1. Basarev
        Basarev 1 February 2014 18: 50
        +1
        It’s time to show Bandera’s little ones what the real is!
        1. builder
          builder 2 February 2014 17: 14
          +1
          Quote: Basarev
          It’s time to show Bandera’s little ones what the real is!
      2. Felix200970
        Felix200970 4 February 2014 20: 43
        0
        Quote: xan
        When Khmelnitsky Ukrainians have heaps of victories, why not remember them? Yes, because the Natsiks need battles with the Russians.

        Don't mention Hops at night. Ukraine does not need such a celebration of life as he arranged with his "victories and defeats"
    2. infinite silence ...
      infinite silence ... 1 February 2014 17: 56
      +6
      No, to remember the battle of Brody and there is some kind of obelisk to cheer up

      You expect adequate actions from inadequate people ... To raise people who have nothing to do with the word honor to the rank of "heroes" is adequate for a Ukrainian. There is generally no patriotic education in the country!
      You read about Shevchenko! Now is the year of his memory ... Yes, the poet ... a little artist ... But in essence a disgusting person! No shame, no honor ... nothing more. The truth is in the saying: where did you go with a fishing rod - there is nothing @@@ to the Jew with the network ... nothing, there immediately human values ​​undergo some mutations ...
      Please note, I spoke about Ukrainians ... Not about Ukrainians.
  6. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 1 February 2014 10: 01
    +15
    But it enabled the Petliurists to brutally crack down on the rebellious Arsenals, which, however, did not save the Central Rada. The attempt to return to the bayonets of the Germans and Austro-Hungarians, which in modern textbooks is often bashfully referred to as "international recognition of Ukraine", once again proved the viability of its power.

    For some reason, neither the government in Ukraine is unviable.
    23 Ukraine gained sovereignty a year ago, in terms of natural conditions and mineral wealth, it is not inferior to Russia and many countries of Europe, it seems to be prospering, but in fact it is heading towards the collapse and degradation of the economy.
    http://www.catalogmineralov.ru/deposit/ukraina/
  7. svp67
    svp67 1 February 2014 10: 05
    +8
    Promises of the Central Rada were believed only by the most trusting and inexperienced in politics part of Ukrainian society - youth.
    How does everything look like ...
  8. Asan Ata
    Asan Ata 1 February 2014 10: 46
    +21
    In modern history, many states have lost their central government, that is, ceased to exist. This trend is being developed by the US for a more calm and thorough robbery, without fuss. I remember talking with an Englishman in the early 90s, his name was Andrew King. He was the head of the Nelson Gold gold mining company in Tajikistan. There was a war in Afghanistan and Tajikistan. And his deposit was located right on the border of these countries. I ask - how do you manage to work for us? - And what is even better. No taxes, no laws. I have a small army there, I pay them, they protect me - and smiled slyly. This is what Europeans and now Americans are doing around the world. The main reason. And if there is something to steal in Ukraine, they will resist. This is what the whole mess is for. And they don't give a damn about peoples and their histories and heroism. They raise scum from the bottom - and they steal into it. hi
    1. Ivan Petrovich
      Ivan Petrovich 1 February 2014 10: 59
      +8
      all right ...
      and therefore again comrade Stalin is recalled
  9. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. 1 February 2014 10: 59
    +6
    I understand that around dur-house.
    But why does senility grow stronger over the years?

    I try to explain what is happening, but every time I am convinced that nothing is logically and reasoned.
    Now we got to the Neanderthals.
    Ukrov crystallized ...

    When the USSR collapsed, I most regretted that Ukraine had fallen off. For Belarus was calm.
    But Ukraine, granary, metallurgy, coal, shipbuilding, rockets ...
    And how many wonderful people ...

    But even then he understood the truth of the anecdote: "three Ukrainians - five opinions."
    But what really is?
    Can’t you do without medics?
    1. RoTTor
      RoTTor 2 February 2014 01: 45
      0
      one Ukrainian is the best host,
      two Ukrainians - three hetmans,
      three Ukrainians - a partisan detachment in which there are five traitors.
      Alas...............
    2. RoTTor
      RoTTor 2 February 2014 01: 45
      -1
      one Ukrainian is the best host,
      two Ukrainians - three hetmans,
      three Ukrainians - a partisan detachment in which there are five traitors.
      Alas...............
  10. rolik2
    rolik2 1 February 2014 11: 24
    +1
    Cools are “Ukrainian Thermopylae”. Historical reality was dissolved in the myth of 300 students who took the battle with the "Bolshevik hordes" and almost all died.

    An interesting expression, I hear it for the first time, as most Ukrainians probably also, in Ukraine this event was considered as a fact, there was such a clash, and students died, and they were stupidly sent to slaughter (in the history of the USSR, there were quite a few such facts), were patriots, and went to death for the idea AND ALL.
    Under Yusche, they began to pull up different versions and make a halo of heroes, but Yusch left and everything fell into place, and no one tells the children about the "Bolshevik hordes" and the occupation by the Bolsheviks, and the emphasis is on patriotism.
    1. kp-95062
      kp-95062 1 February 2014 11: 42
      +1
      Yes, I agree. I hear about the battle near Kruty as "Ukrainian Thermopylae" for the first time, and I heard about 300 Cossacks back in the 70s. The emphasis is now really on patriotism, and rightly so. By the way, in Russia patriotic education has been elevated to the rank of state policy, in Ukraine it is not yet.
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 1 February 2014 13: 42
        +8
        Quote: kp-95062
        Yes, I agree. I hear about the battle near Kruty as "Ukrainian Thermopylae" for the first time, and I heard about 300 Cossacks back in the 70s. Emphasis really coming now on patriotism, and rightly so. By the way, in Russia patriotic education has been elevated to the rank of state policy, while in Ukraine there is no.

        What kind of patriotism in the ass?
        The Red forces advancing on Kiev were mainly Ukrainians, it was patriotism, they were Petliurists, and later Germans were also driven out of Ukraine, whom the Central Committee called for for a war against the people of Ukraine. The people of Ukraine massively joined the Red Army.
        And these jerky students were just idiots who did not understand who should be fought for.
        1. rolik2
          rolik2 1 February 2014 15: 27
          +1
          Quote: Corsair5912
          The Reds, advancing on Kiev, were mostly Ukrainians

          Then there was a civil war where the brother went against the brother, and that on one side, on the other, the inhabitants of ONE country participated in this massacre.
          Quote: Corsair5912
          And these jerky students were just idiots who did not understand who should be fought for.

          For whom? Muravyov’s troops were characterized by low morale, drunkenness and desertion to join the ranks of this rabble?

          We didn’t live in those days, and it’s quite difficult to understand what was guided then, at the moment there is no unambiguous interpretation of that event even in Ukraine, historians disagree, where do we have to argue with them in their 10 classes laughing
          1. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 1 February 2014 18: 07
            +3
            Quote: rolik2
            Then there was a civil war where brother shol against brother, and that in one that on the other hand residents of one country participated in this massacre

            In January 1918, brother did not yet go against brother, Kiev and the Central Rada were defended by units of the Russian army that were there during the revolution, and later they went to Denikin.
            Quote: rolik2
            For whom? Muravyov’s troops were characterized by low morale, drunkenness and desertion to join the ranks of this rabble?

            Muravyov's troops in their mode of action were no different from the troops of the Central Rada under the command of Petliura, who shot the workers of the Arsenal plant. As it came back to haunt, and responded.
            And in terms of morale and discipline, the scam illiterate rabble, which consisted of just about anyone, does not equal the regular troops of the captain of the Russian imperial army Muravyov, who participated in the hostilities at the front and studied at the Paris Military Academy.
    2. Anper
      Anper 1 February 2014 11: 44
      +6
      Quote: rolik2
      but Yusch left and everything fell into place,

      Every year, schools hold events to commemorate the heroes of Krut and D.S.R. - teachers, sobbing, suffer from what unbearable torment these heroes suffered. History teachers, by the way. Plus Russian = Bolshevik = Soviet occupation (term from textbook of history) = Russia - why be surprised Maidan?
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 1 February 2014 14: 03
        +4
        Quote: Anper
        Every year, schools hold events to commemorate the heroes of Krut and D.S.R. - teachers, sobbing, suffer from what unbearable torment these heroes suffered. History teachers, by the way. Plus Russian = Bolshevik = Soviet occupation (term from textbook of history) = Russia - why be surprised Maidan?

        Some kind of crooked monkey history of Ukraine.
        It seems that the Bolsheviks were exclusively Russian, and the defenders of the UNR were only Ukrainians.
        In fact, in January 1918, the URR Central Committee was defended by the troops of the Russian army, who were in Kiev during the revolution, in which there were not many Ukrainians. Later, when the Germans entered Ukraine, they almost all went into Denikin’s army.
        The Bolsheviks were mainly Ukrainians, Ukrainian commanders Voroshilov, Parkhomenko, Schors, Dybenko, etc. known to all, just liberated Ukraine from parasites and invaders.
      2. rolik2
        rolik2 1 February 2014 15: 32
        -3
        Quote: Anper
        Every year, schools celebrate Krut heroes

        And what's wrong with that? We also remember the feat of Alexander Matrosov, Panfilov’s, the battle on the Kursk Bulge, the capture of Kiev, what’s bad here? What do we need for the sake of certain liberals to crap everything?

        Quote: Anper
        Plus Russian = Bolshevik = Soviet occupation (term from a history textbook) = Russia

        Dear where you heard this? take a history book and read, nothing of what you said is not there.
        So go troll yourself in ........ a bad person ......
        1. Anper
          Anper 2 February 2014 03: 00
          +3
          Quote: rolik2
          And what's wrong with that?

          Everything is bad here - the battle of Kruty is presented not so much as a historical event, but as a demonstration of the vile actions of the Bolsheviks. And February 2, the day of the liberation of the city from Nazi occupation, is the same DPS - not gu-gu. By the way, they hardly remember the name of the intelligence officer Kuznetsov, who acted in the city. And if they remember, how the same vile communist, after which the Germans shot the civilian population. And they don’t know anything about Medvedev’s detachment - their eyes bulge and wonder. But the brave warriors of the UPA liberated almost the whole of Ukraine. There are streets of Stepan Bandera, Shukhevych, Melnik, Konovalets and some already into no gates of the non-interfering Volyn Division.This is how teachers should be taught. so that later they learn worthy students. This is a real victory in the information war!But only after that it is not necessary to be surprised at the Natsiks and fascists on the Maidan.
          where have you heard that?
          Not only heard, but also read in the Ukrainian history textbooks for the 10th and 11th grade, which are used by the publishing house "Genesa" in Ukrainian schools.
          1. chehywed
            chehywed 2 February 2014 03: 29
            +2
            Sad Anya. In the late 80s, the guys from Ukraine with whom he served were already thinking that Ukraine was feeding the entire Union, “but without him we’ll live like a lord!” The information war had already begun then. There is no union and "lordly" too. Shaw? Are they guilty again? And the war continues ...
            1. Anper
              Anper 2 February 2014 11: 52
              +3
              Quote: chehywed
              Ukraine feeds the entire Union, "but without him we will live like a lord!

              Being in the early 90s special, more interested in personal life than public, I still remember very well this, by God, a large-scale campaign about lard and sugar, which was selected by the Union. Now, at almost all sugar refineries, you can shoot "Stalker". By the way, it was then All this fascist mold got out. And Yushchen, later, completed it - he printed school history textbooks, which are still being worked on now.
              Naturally, they don’t write directly that Mosk @ is to blame, but the concept is clear.
  11. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. 1 February 2014 11: 49
    +3
    Quote: rolik2

    ... yes, the students died, but they were stupidly sent for slaughter (in the history of the USSR there were quite a few such facts) ...


    And here is the USSR.
    Here, on the contrary, anti-communists sent children for slaughter.
    Is the anti-Bolshevik junker rebellion ordered by the Communists?

    And is the children's crusade also the work of the Communists?

    Just do not refer to the delusional libel of "Bastards".

    And what are children in war, read K. Stanyukovich's "The Sevastopol Boy", and the blockade diary of the Leningrad girl Tanya Savicheva.
    1. rolik2
      rolik2 1 February 2014 15: 35
      0
      Quote: Sergey S.
      And here is the USSR.

      I said this to the fact that in the history of the USSR there were not a few cases when, without any need, hundreds of soldiers were sent to certain death, only because of the incompetence of the commanders, the situation is the same here.

      And I do not need to pinpoint what you attributed below.
  12. Gray 43
    Gray 43 1 February 2014 11: 58
    +1
    Interestingly, and the current rioters will also be heroes, in the distant future, when all the dregs will settle down?
    1. wasjasibirjac
      wasjasibirjac 1 February 2014 12: 46
      +1
      there is a chance for this if what is happening in Ukraine becomes a "revolution." I myself hope that the Maidan will be recognized as a mutiny and will act accordingly.
    2. trooper
      trooper 1 February 2014 12: 55
      +1
      according to anyone, Germans and states have enough crosses for everyone
  13. captain
    captain 1 February 2014 12: 02
    +1
    I bow to the Cossacks, and the students are simply sorry, this mess in Kiev will end and many of them will understand that there were just dolls in the hands of some rich people.
  14. Pehmore
    Pehmore 1 February 2014 12: 41
    +5
    Who wants to listen to this nonsense, but for me the sailor Cat, the Heroes of the 1st and 2nd World Wars come from Ukraine, closer and more expensive. Ordinary people who created such a powerful potential that they have been able to steal for 23 years without stealing, it remains only through the Maidan to sell. And they write a story by order, whoever said it first has the right story. It’s bad when death is bad, when politics is built on it. Children need to be educated on the examples of popular love for the Heroes, and not on those who are appointed.
    1. xan
      xan 1 February 2014 14: 40
      +1
      Quote: Pehmore
      Who wants to listen to this nonsense, but for me the sailor Cat, the Heroes of the 1st and 2nd World Wars come from Ukraine, closer and more expensive.

      In the WWII, the regiments formed on the territory of modern Ukraine showed themselves to be no worse than the rest of the regiments of the tsarist army. And under Skoropadsky, the most reliable in the defense of an independent Ukraine were units formed from prisoners of war of the Austrian army. Even Old Man Makhno did not separate Ukrainians and Russians.
      1. Marat
        Marat 2 February 2014 01: 53
        0
        I heard that the so-called Ukrainian regiments, and in particular Skoropadsky, "showed themselves" in the "Kerensky offensive" when there was more than anyone to compare with (although I do not deny the heroism of the Ukrainians in WWI). It was then that units in the Russian still army began to be selected on a national basis.
  15. trooper
    trooper 1 February 2014 12: 45
    0
    Quote: Bronis
    By the way, no kidding. As I understood from the textbook, "the Ukrainian people are at least 140 thousand years old." (http://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2014/834/aghb209.jpg) - a larger direct link.
    The Cro-Magnon migration to Europe took place somewhere 60-50 thousand years ago. And before that, Neanderthals dominated in Europe ... The curtain ...

    sheer nonsense
  16. trooper
    trooper 1 February 2014 12: 47
    +1
    Adam is probably Ukrainian, and Eve is Polish
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 1 February 2014 14: 10
      +4
      Quote: trooper
      Adam is probably Ukrainian, and Eve is Polish

      God, judging by his behavior, is also a Pole. Squealed - Not permissible!
      Due to exorbitant ambition and one apple, he drove his children into the street, without documents, without specialty, without an apartment and without work. It’s a miracle that they survived.
    2. uizik
      uizik 1 February 2014 16: 27
      +3
      Take it higher! Adam is a purebred zapadentets! And the people of ukrov existed before Atlantis! Ukrnatsi say that Plato wrote about them in his treatises!
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 1 February 2014 18: 11
        +1
        Quote: uizik
        Take it higher! Adam is a purebred zapadentets! And the people of ukrov existed before Atlantis! Ukrnatsi say that Plato wrote about them in his treatises!

        Atlantis began to perish not from natural disasters, but from the Maidan.
  17. Roman 1977
    Roman 1977 1 February 2014 12: 52
    +4
    Yes, everything is so with Svidomo. Let's take the battle of Konotop, which was widely advertised by them, which svidomo historians still call "the great victory of the Ukrainian arms", although the main victory was won by the army of the Crimean Khan, for there were 35 Tatars, and the Cossacks of Hetman Ivan Vyhovsky, only 000, and in Russian sides, there were 16 Cossacks of the Zaporozhye hetman Ivan Bespaly. However, they cut out all the prisoners, without examining the Russians or the Ukrainians ...

    Svidomo picture of the battle of Konotop
    Vygovsky was the same ethnic mutant that most modern Ukrainian politicians are: “An ethnic mutant is at a loss in assessing his ethnicity, as he feels the struggle of opposing, mutually exclusive principles in his soul. Many representatives of the Cossack foreman of the Hetman era precisely represent such a nationally mutated type: Russians by blood, in their psychology, social life, cultural preferences, adjoined the Poles and were guided by gentry-caste values. Historical fate decreed that they were not destined to assimilate completely into the Polish ethnic group, but they no longer felt Russian, although they also called them by inertia ”
    Well, then came the "Ruin", about its morals best, evidenced by the Chronicle of the 17th century:

    “In the monastery near Baturin, a record of one of the seventeenth-century archimandrites was kept for a long time. Its name speaks for itself: “Ruin”, and it contains a description of “the acts and atrocities of the hetmans and other leaders of the Little Russian people”, giving their following list:

    Vygovsky Ivan - an oath, fratricide, the drive of the Tatars to destroy the Little Russian people, the sale of Russia to Catholics and Poles, a silver lover Veliy.

    Khmelnitsky Yuri - the oath-breaker three times, Christ seller of faith and people to the Lyakhs and Busurmans; Tatar drive.

    Doroshenko Petr is a bribe taker, a rascal, an oath-breaker, the culprit of fratricide and torment of the people from the Tatars who have undergone, a Busurman servant.

    Teteria Pavel is a money-lover, oath-criminal and servant voluntary lyashsky. The instigator of Yu. Khmelnitsky for treason.

    The many-sinful Damian is a crafty, double-minded slave, prone to betrayal, well-exposed and punished with retribution.



    In general, the criminal code rests ...
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 1 February 2014 14: 18
      +1
      Quote: Novel 1977
      Vygovsky was the same ethnic mutant that most modern Ukrainian politicians are: “An ethnic mutant is at a loss in assessing his ethnicity, as he feels the struggle of opposing, mutually exclusive principles in his soul. Many representatives of the Cossack foreman of the Hetman era precisely represent such a nationally mutated type: Russians by blood, in their psychology, social life, cultural preferences, adjoined the Poles and were guided by gentry-caste values.


      Precisely said.
      Vygovsky and the other hero of Ukraine are no better than hetman Sagaidachny (wild goat) who polls the Russian border villages during the Polish invasion of Moscow in 1619. Poured Crimean Tatar chasing a chicken.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Roman 1977
        Roman 1977 1 February 2014 14: 37
        +3
        "First of all, he [Sagaidachny] took and ruined the cities of Putivl, Livny and Yelets, destroying many men, women and children in them ...".

        I will add a few specific episodes to the dry description of Yavornytsky. So, in Putivl, the Molgansky monastery was looted, and all the monks were killed. The same thing happened in Rylsk with St. Nicholas Monastery.

        “Depending on Sagaidachny, Mikhailo Doroshenko acted with his comrades, who took the cities of Lebedyan, Dankov, Skopin and Ryaski, beating a lot of men, women, children into them“ to sheer babies ”; and then, bursting into the Ryazan region, set fire to many villages, beat several priests and proceeded to the city of Pereyaslav, but was repulsed and went to Yelets. Sagaidachny himself, taking Livny and Yelets, went to Shatsky and Dankov and from here sent Colonel the Gracious with 1000 ahead of him a man of Kozaks under the city of Mikhailov (Ryazan province), ordering him to break into the city at night and take him. Colonel the Gracious, hesitating for a long time as a result of the terrible thunder and heavy rain, managed to come to the city only on August 12 of the day, on the same day when 40 people of Great Russian military men came to the city of Sapozhkov. The latter, leaving Sapozhkov’s city with several of his inhabitants, did not allow the Merciful to Mikhailov “and defeated many warring constipation”. ”
        The next day, an enraged Sagaidachny announced to the residents of Mikhailov that he would take the city like a bird and put it on fire, and he would order all residents, young and old, to cut off his arm and leg and throw it to the dogs. 23 August Cossacks again began to prepare for the assault. And the defenders in plain sight of the Zaporizhzhya army made a procession with icons and banners on the walls of the fortress.

        With the beginning of the assault, the Mikhailovites again went on a sortie. Not only warriors, but also women and children fired from the city walls from cannons and squeakers. “And the all-pernicious enemy of Sagaidachny, with the rest of his consternations, departing from the city with fear and grief of August on the 27 day, and the inhabitants of the God-protected city of Mikhailov celebrate all summer long on those days, on the first day of August on 17 day, a miracle of the archangel Michael, and on the departure from the city of the constipation of August in 27 day is celebrated by the great miracle worker Nicolas "
        Yavornitsky D.I. History of Zaporizhzhya Cossacks. T. 2. C. 150.

        However, Sagaidachny did not forget about Russian money, when the Poles did not appreciate his zeal:
        As for the Sahaidachny himself, he apparently finally realized what he and the Little Russian Cossacks threatened with an alliance with the Poles. Sahaidachny publicly repented and asked for forgiveness from the Jerusalem patriarch Theophanes for the atrocities committed by him and his Cossacks in Russia in 1618. Moreover, he sends his chieftain Peter Odints to Moscow “with comrades” with a request to accept the hetman along with the entire Zaporizhzhya Army to serve to the king.
        In March 1620, Odinets spoke to the boyars. Here is her official record: “They were sent by the entire Zaporizhzhya army, hetman Sagaidachny with comrades, beating the sovereign with the brow, declaring their service that they all want to serve him as their great sovereign as before, as they had served the former great Russian sovereigns and in their state there were commands and went to their enemies, Crimean uluses were smashed and sent to the sovereign with Tatar languages: God is free and tsarist majesty, as they grant them, and they want to serve his tsar's majesty and his tsar's mercy with all their heads now they want to continue looking. In the spring we all go to Zaporozhye, and to Tsarist Majesty we all beat our brow, so that the sovereign grants us as his servants. ” The king sent the Sahaidachny 300 rubles of “easy salary” and sent a letter.
        Soloviev S. M._ History of Russia since ancient times. T. V. C. 439.
        Well, indeed, as the current ukro-Vlad ...
        1. rolik2
          rolik2 1 February 2014 16: 06
          -7
          Dear Roman 1977, I apologize in advance, but your interpretation of the history of Ukraine is somewhat, even very one-sided, you pull individual facts out of the context of history, choose the interpretation of events you need and present it as your own thought. Sorry, but foreigners are somehow not decent to criticize history (this is easy to say) In response to your one-sided, and clearly preemptive criticism, I want to answer with the song of the group "Leningrad"

          Once again, I apologize for the rude words of the artist, I didn’t mean them, but in general had the whole meaning of the song.
          1. smile
            smile 1 February 2014 17: 09
            +2
            rolik2
            Mdya ... as I understand it, the main argument you have is the fact that Roman is not Ukrainian? You didn’t find any others, right? Sorry .... sympathize :)))
            1. rolik2
              rolik2 1 February 2014 17: 56
              0
              Quote: smile
              rolik2
              Mdya ... as I understand it, the main argument you have is the fact that Roman is not Ukrainian? You didn’t find any others, right? Sorry .... sympathize :)))

              The argument is that you don’t know history, don’t talk nonsense, I learned this story both at school and at the institute, unlike Roman who studied it from articles on the Internet, and a world-renowned professor taught it to me, so he said that “History does not tolerate politics, we consider it WITHOUT linking to our political preferences "

              And the main argument, comrade Roman, reproaches us of our nationality, I don’t know who he is by nationality (the flags do not always display it correctly) I would say the same to the Belarusian, the Chinese, and the Englishman. And I don’t even want to bring them to the argument brush, because they will be perverted and filed because it protects you.
              He protects that there are two opinions of him and the wrong.
              I am not trying to distort the history of Russia, although there are a lot of controversial and far from hospitable moments in it, I do not poke him in the face and do not insult his ancestors.
              1. smile
                smile 1 February 2014 18: 11
                +2
                rolik2
                Firstly. Our ancestors do not differ ... nothing. Nothing at all. They were ordinary Russian people. As a nation, Ukrainians formed by the end of the 19th, beginning of the 20th centuries. What is your touchy pose for?
                Secondly. The novel does not blame anyone. Apparently. you yourself did not really understand the advice of your own teacher - because for some reason you are trying to find reasons for resentment where no one is trying to say anything bad about Ukrainians.
                Thirdly. I heard. what a great connoisseur of history you are ... heard what a Roman is not good and unreasonable compared to you ... a great historian ... but I still haven’t seen any of your arguments except to demonstrate my wounded ... let it be pride . Maybe you should stop waving it and glorify yourself, and state your arguments? :)))
                I no longer sympathize with you. :)))
              2. The comment was deleted.
              3. Roman 1977
                Roman 1977 1 February 2014 20: 05
                +7
                Quote: rolik2
                The argument is that you don't know history, don't talk nonsense, I learned this story both at school and at the institute, unlike Roman who studied it from articles on the Internet, and a world-renowned professor taught it to me, so he said that "History hates politicians, we consider it WITHOUT linking to our political preferences "And the main argument comrade Roman reproaches us about our nationality, I do not know who he is by nationality (the flags do not always display it correctly), I would say the same to both Belarusians and Chinese, and an Englishman. And on a bunch of arguments, I do not even want to give them, because they will be perverted and submitted as he shields the right ones. He shields that there are two opinions of him and the wrong one. I am not trying to distort the history of Russia, although there are many controversial and far from disagreeable moments, I do not poke them in his face, and I do not offend his ancestors.

                Well, let's start, comrade rolik2, this is where I reproached the Ukrainians with their nationality? Why juggle. Regarding nationality, half Ukrainian by mother, from Sumy region, I try to talk to my grandmother in mov, my wife is Ukrainian Ulyanchenko. That is, to reproach nationality, in your words, I need to reproach myself and those closest to me. Now, to the history of education, you represent it, I have - a red diploma from the history faculty of the Lobachevsky NNSU, in the department "Modern Patriotic History", though he studied in absentia. Well, now let's return to our rams, that is, the hetmans of the Ruins. As a matter of fact, I see you have nothing to argue. That they were selling their country to everyone who pays more is not a policy, but an indisputable fact, and that at such a pace Ukraine is waiting for "Ruin-3", for "Ruina-2" was already in the years of the Civil War. And with regards to the history of Ukraine, it is so distorted, first of all by Svidomo, when anti-heroes like Petliura, Bandera, Shlyukhevych and others like them become heroes and vice versa. Although what can you learn from textbooks like this:


                1. TiGRoO
                  TiGRoO 1 February 2014 21: 50
                  +2
                  Ahahah, the Ukrainian sea, great Ukraine is super)))
                2. kotvov
                  kotvov 2 February 2014 19: 12
                  0
                  thanks, they made fun of it. I had to take part in archaeological excavations somewhere, somewhere near the center of map 2, found four skeletons, they had their own custom of funeral. And imagine everything, Ukrainians, SHYUCHU. The time of burial was the beginning of our era. Representatives of the institute they said that they were representatives of the Turkic peoples. next to one, a horse was buried. such a little one. they thought a foal, they understood it as an adult.
          2. anarky
            anarky 1 February 2014 22: 32
            0
            http://bmpd.livejournal.com/730073.html?thread=35713753#t35713753

            I see you familiarize yourself laughing
  18. Cristall
    Cristall 1 February 2014 14: 16
    +6
    Hmm .. I’m just like a schoolboy when he was still a battle near Kruty, just presented as an attempt by students to close up the miscalculations of the Central Rada (government). Even the textbook says that it was bad, everything was bad, the students obviously went to dare. There was no feat.
    What makes a feat in general? The feat of Varyag - if we remember the governor Alekseev in general, he wanted to bring Rudnev to court because he could not use the international law of the hospital. From St. Petersburg they sent a decree "to consider" Rudnev's act a feat. Although this is unconditional heroism. But the very attitude of society can always be formed.
    For example, Yusch undertook to actively look for "heroes" they were looking for everywhere, near Kruti and Konotop, in Baturin and Petlyura, in Bender (special with a small) and the Nazis. Everywhere except the Soviet / Russian period. All the bandits / fighters for Ukraine - even this happened.
    It was necessary to compose your own "heroic" story. For some reason, neither Sevastopol twice, nor Odessa, nor Kiev itself (Bendera believed that Ukrainians had been betrayed there in the Second World War) were not suitable for the role of Ukrainian heroes. But Bendera slukhevych are cool Baturin, yes ... The true heroes of the nation.
    In general - what are we discussing here? History is a state prostitute. Corresponding constantly for the sake of the ruling party. The leader said - Bender a hero, they wrote the right textbook, said that they would have won Germany themselves without other republics - the same thing. Nothing is absurd, either - the main thing is to make a story.
    In general, I only learned in this article that they call it "Ukrainian Thermopylae." This is undoubtedly nonsense - children can spontaneously give a picture of a mess and then ask what was true and what was a lie in the mess. Never mind. Until the order comes. And then they will write the desired version of the story.
    Speaking of 300 Spartans in the War of Independence - there were no Cossacks there. Bogun took all the Cossacks when he crossed the swamp and saved the army. Remained 300 rebels from the villagers (corral) They had nothing to lose. The last one cried out, I want to die like a real Cossack, his reitars and stabbed. The battle of Berestechko became the Pirrova victory of the Poles, the Sejm did not recognize the treaty, Khmel managed not to fulfill, hiding behind the previous one, more profitable.
  19. xan
    xan 1 February 2014 14: 45
    +2
    Quote: Cristall
    In general - what are we discussing here? History is a state prostitute.

    History - a fallen woman living in the tent of the winner (Napoleon)
  20. oleko51081
    oleko51081 1 February 2014 15: 34
    +2
    What kind of power are these and not fallow heroes, to match the leaders.
  21. Valentine77 64
    Valentine77 64 1 February 2014 17: 52
    +2
    The mighty of this world have always been able to powder their brains. The story with students and high school students is very similar to the events with the Maidan. Young people, believing in the slogans about a beautiful life in geyrope, went to the barricades, and the gentlemen "drink vodka in the carriage." And if everything goes wrong, then they are already in Munich (in the hotbed of Nazism).
    The Ukrainian "elite" has always been famous for its "loyalty". Little Russians were sold for cookies and sweets.
  22. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. 1 February 2014 19: 06
    +1
    Quote: rolik2
    Quote: Sergey S.
    And here is the USSR.

    I said this to the fact that in the history of the USSR there were not a few cases when, without any need, hundreds of soldiers were sent to certain death, only because of the incompetence of the commanders, the situation is the same here.

    And I do not need to pinpoint what you attributed below.


    And I don’t ascribe - I read and realize.

    And again, and here the USSR.
    Every time a war is defeated, troops are sent to slaughter.

    Did you study at school?
    Remember the campaign of Prince Igor, or the battle of Kalka?
    Again the Bolsheviks, the Communists, the USSR are to blame?

    Your words about the incompetence of the commanders are almost true.
    But only if you agree, there are no greater fool commanders than the Fritz.
    Every war, a Russian soldier is lost, and every time on the same rake ...

    And our fool commanders are the most worthy in the whole world.
    SPECIALLY DURING THE SOVIET POWER.
    1. Sergey S.
      Sergey S. 1 February 2014 23: 04
      +1
      Okay!
      Minus for the defense of the homeland-this is ours.

      I'm not on the Maidan?
  23. TiGRoO
    TiGRoO 1 February 2014 19: 21
    +4
    In Kharkov, the Party of Regions initiated the creation of the all-Ukrainian civil union “Ukrainian Front”.

    According to an UNIAN correspondent, the decision to create the "Ukrainian Front" was made today during the All-Ukrainian rally of leaders of the primary organizations of the Party of Regions, which was held at the Kharkiv Sports Palace.

    According to the head of the Kharkiv regional organization of the Party of Regions, the chairman of the Kharkiv Regional State Administration Mikhail Dobkin, the new organization will include public associations and movements, representatives of political parties and individual members who support the ideology of the Ukrainian Front.

    According to Dobkin, the headquarters of the Ukrainian Front will be temporarily based in Kharkov, but will eventually be moved to Kiev. The civil union will have an official representation in each region of Ukraine. The symbol of the "Ukrainian Front" will be the St. George ribbon.

    Dobkin noted that the main tasks of the Ukrainian Front will be to “break through the information blockade” so that the Ukrainian Front can become a representative and express public opinion.

    In addition, the new public union will seek its participation, as a representative of public opinion, in negotiations between the authorities, the opposition and the Maidan.

    Dobkin also stressed that the "Ukrainian Front" will initiate an all-Ukrainian referendum, which will address issues of canceling parliamentary immunity and reducing the number of deputies of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine.

    Dobkin emphasized that, among other things, the "Ukrainian Front" requires the unconditional release of all captured administrative buildings and structures, without presenting any conditions for the liberation of streets and squares.

    He also noted that in order to protect the administrative buildings and release the already seized structures, the "Ukrainian Front" initiates the creation of a national guard, the first set of which will take place today in the Kharkov Sports Palace after the all-Ukrainian rally of the leaders of the primary organizations of the Party of Regions. Dobkin added that the people's guard will act within the law. “I think the first thing we will do is to force peace to those who have embarked on the warpath,” Dobkin emphasized, speaking at a rally of primary organizations of the Party of Regions.
  24. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. 1 February 2014 19: 42
    +1
    It's time.
    How not to be late.
  25. parus2nik
    parus2nik 1 February 2014 19: 52
    +1
    Vygovskoy, Sagaidachny, Mazepa, Gordienko, the last hetman Skoropadsky, S. Petlyura, S. Bandera ... on the one hand, show heroes, fighters for independence ... and dig deeper, they traded Ukraine ..
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 2 February 2014 12: 13
      +1
      Quote: parus2nik
      Vygovskoy, Sagaidachny, Mazepa, Gordienko, get

      Manor Skoropadsky-the last, S. Petlyura, S. Bandera.

      . On the one hand, show the heroes, fighters for the nezalezhnosti .. and dig deeper-traded Ukraine


      In fact, they are all initiators and executors of the genocide of the people of Ukraine, or even just traitors, assassins and punishers without the Fatherland.
      What kind of nepalezhnost and lack of simplicity there, they and such concepts did not exist, only selfish interest. For the sake of money and power, they were ready to lie under anyone.
  26. Valentine77 64
    Valentine77 64 1 February 2014 20: 30
    +3
    Quote: TiGRoO
    In Kharkov, the Party of Regions initiated the creation of the all-Ukrainian civil union “Ukrainian Front”.

    He also found the info: In Kharkov, at an extraordinary All-Ukrainian rally of leaders of the primary organizations of the Party of Regions in response to "the actions of Bandera, nationalist, radical forces," they decided to create the All-Ukrainian Public Union "Ukrainian Front" .http: //vz.ru/news/2014/2 /1/670622.html

    Only the question arises: who should save the state? common people again. And where is the army. The police, of course, have already been sold.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=tEw_7G0PSZA
  27. Captain45
    Captain45 1 February 2014 21: 08
    +4
    Quote: Sergey S.
    But even then he understood the truth of the anecdote: "three Ukrainians - five opinions."

    My company foreman spoke a little differently: "Three Ukrainians are a partisan detachment .. with a traitor." laughing
  28. anarh
    anarh 1 February 2014 21: 51
    0
    Song about the events near Berestechko.
  29. RoTTor
    RoTTor 2 February 2014 02: 45
    +5
    Go to Kiev and see: to whom were monuments erected in independent Ukraine? To the shitty historian Hrushevsky, who fled and hid from the theoretical possibility of arrest in Austro-Hungarian Lvov, he was a shameful figure in the shameful "central council", then, squandering money and finding himself unnecessary in emigration, he grew to return to the USSR. As a mockery, he was swept aside housing in the wing of the OGPU-NKVD, now there is a memorial plaque at the reception of the SBU. Other monuments: an unknown cat, a mythical Cossack, Golosokhvastov and Prona Prokopovna from the film "For two hares", "Ukrainian pilots (!!!) in the form of Leonid Bykov, who played a SOVIET pilot. In the early 90s, as massively as before 1991 - they erected monuments to Lenin, all over the country massively erected monuments to Shevchenko, who even wrote personal letters and diaries in Russian and was taken away from Ukraine by a child ...
    Because there weren’t, and never will be their heroes who fit into nationalistic nonsense. Ukraine did not have an independent history. This is especially obvious now.
    But in Poland and Austria-Hungary it was a tattered and clogged outskirts, in the Russian Empire and in the USSR - an equal, rich and strong sister. Accordingly, our heroes were common, not divided by nationality.
    Therefore, it was necessary to suck the bad fairy tale "the battle at Kruty" with the "Moscow hordes of Muravyov" from the 21st finger and whip up hysteria around it.
    And it seems that they did not even mention the 360th anniversary of reunification in Russia in Ukraine ...
    1. Des10
      Des10 2 February 2014 17: 08
      0
      Well, that’s why normal people are less audible than aggressive propaganda!
  30. Estray_
    Estray_ 2 February 2014 11: 10
    +3
    Quote: Corsair5912
    Quote: uizik
    Take it higher! Adam is a purebred zapadentets! And the people of ukrov existed before Atlantis! Ukrnatsi say that Plato wrote about them in his treatises!

    Atlantis began to perish not from natural disasters, but from the Maidan.

    Not a bad topic for dissertations.))
  31. terrible
    terrible 2 February 2014 19: 46
    0
    ) duck the whole history of Ukrainians consists entirely of betrayal. starting with Daniel Galitsky. what kind of heroes are such people and people. in a word.
    1. shevron
      shevron 2 February 2014 20: 42
      0
      And your ancestors are not from Kievan Rus? Probably in time emigrated to the Principality of Moscow :)
      1. terrible
        terrible 3 February 2014 06: 57
        0
        my ancestors, yes! It’s Russia. But where did the Ukrainians come from? Polovtsy in a word.
        1. shevron
          shevron 4 February 2014 00: 24
          0
          In Kiev, the Polovtsy? I have heard less and less Russians in Moscow. What will they say after 200 years WHO LIVES IN MOSCOW? No need to offend all the people ...
  32. shevron
    shevron 2 February 2014 20: 59
    0
    The latter went to the aid of the workers of the rebellious "Arsenal", who at that moment were shot by the Petliurites .-------- It would be ridiculous today if the Maidanites called for help from NATO troops and "BERKUT" which would restrain them would become the embodiment heroism. The workers of "ARSENAL" are not all of Ukraine, as are the supporters of the Maidan, and one cannot judge the will of the whole people by the several thousand inhabitants of the country. With such a scale, Russia should have liberated the Crimeans from independent Ukraine long ago
    1. terrible
      terrible 3 February 2014 06: 58
      0
      and it's time!
      1. shevron
        shevron 4 February 2014 00: 26
        0
        There was once a song "Do the Russians want war." Do other Russians live in Russia now?
  33. vo.dum
    vo.dum 2 February 2014 21: 00
    +1
    Soon the maydauns will yell that they were standing on the barricades ... only three ... a rabbit, a boxer and a Fuhrer and they threw a nuclear bomb at them and they survived and went on the offensive on the damned Jews and they were beaten by a couple of slaps in the face, but they did not give up and left for Brussels proud and unbroken .... wink
  34. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. 3 February 2014 03: 17
    0
    Quote: shevron
    The latter went to the aid of the workers of the rebellious "Arsenal", who at that moment were shot by the Petliurites .-------- It would be ridiculous today if the Maidanites called for help from NATO troops and "BERKUT" which would restrain them would become the embodiment heroism. The workers of "ARSENAL" are not all of Ukraine, as are the supporters of the Maidan, and one cannot judge the will of the whole people by the several thousand inhabitants of the country. With such a scale, Russia should have liberated the Crimeans from independent Ukraine long ago

    No need to provoke ahead of time.
    Unripe fruit is only suitable for compost.
    This is not about the Crimea.
    This is about Ukraine.
    Now, if a state is assembled, with a budget, with world-class achievements, with a common understanding of the problems, then we will decide how to deal with a fragment of the Russian world.
    I think that when Ukraine becomes strong, Russia, Belarus and Ukraine will form a single political association with the participation of several other former republics of the Soviet Union.

    An alternative is the dissolution of Ukraine and the assimilation of Ukrainians.

    History already knows an example.
    Alexander Nevsky defeating the Crusaders, went to negotiate in the Horde. Without defeat in battle.
    For he knew that the Europeans would not calm down, would turn up again.
    And so it happened. Yes, the Tatar cavalry rode on the flanks, and the crusaders retreated.

    But the Galicia-Volyn lands received "support" from the Europeans ...

    And now let's see where the real monuments of the times of Kievan Rus were preserved - In Vladimir, Suzdal, Rostov, Novgorod, Pskov, ... - In a word, the Golden Ring.

    And from Galich and Volynsk even traces can not be found.
    Europeans are not destroying their culture at the root.

    And if pripret, then for Russia will not rust.