Military Review

Battle of history. On the need to introduce the Russian (Slavic) concept of history

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Battle of history. On the need to introduce the Russian (Slavic) concept of history

Battle for history Russia continues. The question of the inadmissibility of attempts to distort the history of our Motherland was raised by President Vladimir Putin. Almost simultaneously, historians of Tatarstan stated that almost all of their proposals on a Russian textbook were included in the final version, which was presented to the court of the Russian president.


During the meeting of Russian President Vladimir Putin with the developers of the concept of a new educational and methodological complex on the history of the Fatherland, one of the leading themes was the inadmissibility of attempts to distort the history of Russia. According to the President of the Russian Federation, the very need to create a single textbook on the history of Russia was associated with the presence of a significant number of works that contain “ideological garbage”. As a result, schools received educational literature that contained such things that are “absolutely unacceptable” for Russia and the people and, in fact, insult Russian citizens.

Vladimir Putin drew attention to the fact of reducing the contribution of the Soviet people in the fight against fascism. At the same time, the president said that attempts to introduce “some kind of uniformity in thinking and evaluation” are not in question. He also urged not to refuse to work with foreign researchers: “Together we can develop the most objective approaches to the estimates.”

Thus, we see a clear duality. The president acted on the principle "both ours and yours". And he does this quite often. On the one hand, Vladimir Putin is right: all attempts to distort the history of Russia must be firmly stopped. The historical (chronological) priority of managing society is one of the highest. With the help of history, it is possible to bring up whole generations of “Ivanov who do not remember kinship,” to carry out a “recoding” of the matrix of entire branches of a single superethnos Rus. As already reprogrammed a significant part of the Rus (Russians) Little Russia (Ukraine). Several centuries of “cultural cooperation” and information warfare, which the Vatican, Austria-Hungary, Germany, Poland and the Anglo-Saxons waged against Russian civilization, led to the creation of the “Ukrainian people”. The current events in Kiev are one of the consequences of this process. It is impossible to allow the geopolitical opponent to “work” with the population, instill in it alien values, distorted knowledge.

Putin is fully right in the fact that it is impossible to downplay the role of the Soviet people and the USSR in World War II. The “black myths” about the Great War literally flooded the minds of Russians. Here and detachments, who shot their own, and terrible enkavedeshniki and Smerzhevtsy, who in vain mocked ordinary soldiers and commanders, and "corpses filled up," and "children saboteurs," and much more.

On the other hand, the words about “ideological garbage” are doubtful. If the new history textbook of Russia removes the liberal nonsense of the 1990-2000-s sample - great. Indeed, almost all the “ideological rubbish” in the history books was introduced during the existence of the Russian Federation, partly in the years of “perestroika”. It was during this period that Russia was subtly destroyed by information, ideological and historical weapons.

However, if the authors of the new textbook launch another campaign for desovietization and de-Stalinization, then the picture will come out grim. After all, the Soviet project is a model to which modern Russia should strive. It is clear that the USSR was not an ideal state, but there was never such a thing on the planet. Man and human society are subjective in nature. But it was the Stalinist USSR that gave all mankind hope for a different future than the one that the “architects” of the West and their clients are building on the periphery of the “developed world”.

Putin’s words about the absence of attempts to introduce “some kind of uniformity in thinking and evaluations” and the need to work together with foreign colleagues and the possibility to work together to develop the most objective approaches is even more doubtful. After all, a single history textbook of Russia, which can educate young people with patriots of Russia, is just necessary. Only a single ideology and history can make the nation strong, able to withstand external and internal threats. There should be no discord and vacillation. History should foster a sense of national pride.

Arguments about the need for "collaboration" with foreign colleagues - stupidity and strategic error. Historical science in the West, and in the East, always fulfills an ideological order. The method of "cultural cooperation" is a way of "information capture" of a foreign territory. At the same time, the western "partners" are recruiting a kind of Russian scientists. Trips abroad, conferences, grants, awards, publications, popularity - these are “gingerbread”. Part of the Russian scientists is being incorporated into a kind of “mafia” that controls the population through the introduction of false historical concepts. They are introducing ideas about the "secondary" of Russia in relation to European civilization, constant borrowing, the need to repent for the "historical crimes" of the Russian (Soviet) colonialists, Ivan the Terrible, Peter the Great, Catherine II, Stalin and other Russian emperors and statesmen, generals. Therefore, "foreign colleagues" on the cannon shot can not be allowed to Russian history.

The mite in creation of the uniform textbook have brought and scientists of Tatarstan. Scientists of Tatarstan declare that practically all their proposals on the all-Russian textbook were approved by the commission of Sergey Naryshkin and entered into the final version, which was submitted to the Russian president. According to the authors of the amendments, all of them will be approved and will be included in the final version of the textbook.

Thus, soon the well-known concept of the “Tatar-Mongolian yoke” will become a thing of the past, and students will learn a different “Tatar component” of the history of Russia. The term "Mongol-Tatar yoke" will be replaced by a politically correct one - "dependence on the Golden Horde." Also among the innovations is mentioned the Soviet poet, Hero of the Soviet Union Musa Jalil, who in German captivity created an underground group and was preparing an uprising, but the Gestapo revealed the underground workers, they were executed. They will also tell students about the contribution of the first President of Tatarstan M. Shaimiev, etc.

It must be said that here one can note both a positive start and a negative one. The term "Tatar-Mongol yoke" really does not correspond to historical reality. There were no "Mongols" in the territory of Russia and Eastern Europe. There are no anthropological, genetic and cultural traces of the “Mongols” (Mongoloids). Russian researchers have already destroyed the concept of the conquest of Russia by the “Mongols”, who came from Mongolia on their horses. Prior to this, the semi-wild shepherds allegedly smashed China, Khorezm and many other strong states. This issue is discussed in more detail in a series of articles. Russian land before the Batu invasion. The problem of the "Mongol" invasion of Russia.

An alternative version is becoming more and more interesting, according to which the invasion of Batu's army into Russia was connected with the process of internal “showdowns” within the Northern Power, the heiress of the Skifo-Sarmatian empire. Rus (Russians) and "Tatars" were the direct heirs of this empire. And those and others were Caucasians (representatives of the white race). There was a struggle between the various centers of the northern power, which passed the next stage of internal instability. At first, the Horde triumphed with its capital in Sarai. However, the process of Islamization of the “ulus Juchi” caused an internal split of the empire and its degradation. This led to the gradual strengthening of Moscow, to which “Tatars” began to move to the service. As a result, under Ivan the Terrible, the empire regained power over most of the former possessions, and Moscow was already the center of power. In this context, Russia-Russia has a history of many thousands of years, and the direct ancestors of the Rus are Sarmatians, Scythians, Cimmerians and arias (Indo-Europeans).

It is also necessary to take into account that the Kazan Tatars, like the Chuvash, are descendants of the tribal union of the Bulgarians. And the Volga Bulgaria during the war with the “Mongols”, which lasted from 1223 to 1240, suffered a historic defeat. "Mongolian" troops completely destroyed the entire Volga-Kama Bulgaria, and its territory became part of the Golden Horde. Therefore, the attempts of some Tatar nationalists to lean against the glory of Genghis Khan and Batu look miserable. Volga Bulgaria was the victim of a confrontation in northern Eurasia, and trying to transfer it backdating to the camp of the winners is clearly a bad idea.

In general, the attempts of local scientists, representatives of small nations to revise the history of Russia in their favor should be treated very carefully. The ideological discord of the last decades and the active work of representatives of the Western and Islamic projects in Russia have led many representatives of the local intelligentsia to work consciously or unconsciously against Russian civilization. Suffice it to recall the claims of “innocently repressed peoples” during the years of the Great Patriotic War, such as Chechens or Crimean Tatars.

You can agree with Anatoly Wassermanwho suggested that a history textbook that will satisfy most citizens of the Russian Federation can be done quite quickly. It is enough to take a Soviet history textbook and slightly “clean” it from Marxism-Leninism. And this material can be the basis for the upbringing and education of the patriots of Russia. It is also necessary to throw out all the “ideological garbage” that was littered with history during the years of “perestroika” and the domination of liberal values. Further, it will be possible to improve the history textbook through clarifications based on recent discoveries. And for this, Russia needs an analogue of the German Ancestral Heritage, but without mystical and occult nonsense.

The concept of the history of Russia should be expanded at the expense of the Sarmatian, Scythian, Cimmerian and Aryan (Pre-Slavic) periods. The Slavic (Russian) concept of history, which was defended by Lomonosov, Lyzlov, Tatishchev, Veltman, Gedeonov, Lyubavsky, Ilovaisky, Petukhov and many other devotees, should become prevalent in Russia.
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  1. Yoshkin Kot
    Yoshkin Kot 22 January 2014 08: 43
    -2
    "yawn" what's the difference? "Tatar" Russian history? or "Judeo-Marxist"? or "Judeo-New Pagan"? Forgive God, one and the same Russophobic
  2. Christian
    Christian 22 January 2014 09: 00
    +18
    Putin is a supporter of pluralism in everything and in history and ideology in particular. The author is right — no pluralism is needed in such areas and is extremely harmful — there is enough disorder and vacillations in our society! Only one story and ideology is the way of Russia !!!
    1. Orik
      Orik 22 January 2014 09: 22
      -9
      There is no pluralism. smile All this is in words, it is necessary to judge by deeds, and they are known "Russian" 282 article, the extinction of the Russian people, the liberal economy, the government, the slops corrupting the people in all the mass media, the settling of Russia by foreigners, stupid Soviet national policy, so he gets confused in the testimony (an amazing match of his surname Putin-confused). You will see the Tatar version will go down in history, and the Russian "ideological rubbish" will be thrown away, in general ...
      1. Canep
        Canep 22 January 2014 09: 33
        +4
        I agree. In words: - "it is not permissible to distort history", in fact it is not clear what is a distortion and which history should not be distorted, and which story to take as a basis, in this situation, it is possible to take the story invented by Rezun (Suvorov) as a basis and not allow its distortion, he, by the way, does not belittle the role of the Soviet people in the defeat of fascism. The idea of ​​pluralism is incompatible with the principle of not distorting history, since any alternative point of view is a distortion of history.
        1. Luzhichanin
          Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 09: 47
          +33
          Judging by the way the public reacts to lies about Stalin's times, I think they will not lie much about this in the textbook, so as not to provoke. But in earlier periods of history myths will be reinforced among the people ... For example: about the Romanovs and, in particular, about "Peter 1." This is exactly what the cycle of events and programs dedicated to the anniversary of the coming to power of the Romanovs showed.
          But even Lomonosov beat Miller for a lie about our history.
          1. shtanko.49
            shtanko.49 22 January 2014 10: 46
            +31
            It is deadly for Russia to attract the Geyropeytsy to our history, they have always belittled and insulted our Motherland.
            1. Ivan_Ivanov
              Ivan_Ivanov 22 January 2014 10: 53
              +20
              Putin is a supporter of pluralism in everything and in history and ideology in particular. The author is right - in such areas no pluralism is needed and extremely harmful ...

              In the scientific field, pluralism is REQUIRED. In the field of education, pluralism is UNACCEPTABLE.
            2. Theophanes
              Theophanes 22 January 2014 23: 57
              +7
              Let the President attract foreign scientists to create his own biography, and the history of Russia must be written by Russian scientists without the "help" of European scientists! They will paint ... an oil painting! Lomonosov beat their faces insolent and we must do the same! Today, apart from humiliation, we have not seen and will not see anything worthwhile from Euro-ass scientists.
              1. PValery53
                PValery53 23 January 2014 20: 47
                0
                It is necessary to show full "reciprocity" to European historians - not only to beat their "filthy muzzles", but, which is no less important, to humiliate them in the same way! .. - And historical justice will prevail!
          2. Orik
            Orik 22 January 2014 10: 56
            +3
            Quote: Luzhichanin
            But in earlier periods of history myths will be reinforced among the people ... For example: about the Romanovs and, in particular, about "Peter 1." This is exactly what the cycle of events and programs dedicated to the anniversary of the coming to power of the Romanovs showed.

            These are the myths, and do not wonder why ?! Almost the entire Romanov dynasty was pro-Western, they are ideologically (!) Close. Already all the favorites of Tsar Alexei Mikhailovich are Westerners, and then there is a continuous pro-Western aspiration of the "elites", so they even spoke Russian worse than French. The reign of Alexander III and Nicholas II may be an exception, but there were no coordinating decisions, no imminent contradictions in society, they froze a little, and then everything floated.
            1. Christian
              Christian 22 January 2014 11: 09
              0
              All of them were patriots of Great Russia!
            2. Luzhichanin
              Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 14: 23
              +1
              Quote: Orik
              and why not think ?!

              So why think, and so it is clear that in the WESTERN people of power fell ... They are sorry ... they could not resist the temptation.
            3. AntonR7
              AntonR7 22 January 2014 20: 56
              -2
              What nonsense. The Romanovs were not pro-Western, otherwise they would not have created an empire that the West was trying to destroy, because we had foreigners in our service, so there were enough newcomers everywhere.
              1. Orik
                Orik 22 January 2014 22: 25
                0
                For a start, better study the history, otherwise it seems like one TV set ...
                1. AntonR7
                  AntonR7 23 January 2014 20: 17
                  -1
                  If you are me, I have been reading historical literature since I was 7 years old, I suggest thinking, and not believing Putin, and for whom much of the past is not relevant since, according to his version, Russia is not for Russians.
          3. saber1357
            saber1357 23 January 2014 00: 48
            +2
            Yes, and also the Tatar scientists proved that there was no Tatar-Mongol yoke (almost quoted the article). I don’t know if they, the compilers of the textbook, will listen to such advice, they will prove many other things - for example, from the series "British scientists have proved that Russia, in essence, does not exist, there is only Tatarstan." This is all Wahhabi stuff, most likely, I don't know for sure, but it smells of this hypocritical Salafism ("oh, the main thing is that the Tatars do not take offense, but nothing that they sold hundreds of thousands of Russians in slave markets, this is a matter of everyday life").
        2. Klin klinovv
          Klin klinovv 22 January 2014 13: 19
          +2
          The author Samsonov Alexander, how can you not mention Fomenko A.T. Ko, a scientist who gave almost half his own life studying the history of the World, showing a lot of inconsistencies, or rather poking you in the nose with facts of falsification of history. And even after that you can’t see the elephant in front of your shop . you just blah blah blah
          1. Legioner
            Legioner 22 January 2014 21: 21
            +2
            I’m not a historian, but my opinion is that the theory of A.T. Fomenko and Co. deserves attention, but it’s not worth the truth in the last episode, for example, the chronicler writes the story of some event, and what do you think he will rely on when writing. what volume and style of description he will adhere to, of course, written earlier material, that is, in the image and likeness of previous records adjusted for the time and characters of his time.
            1. Klin klinovv
              Klin klinovv 23 January 2014 11: 10
              0
              Thanks for attention
      2. A.YARY
        A.YARY 22 January 2014 11: 02
        +10
        IT IS NECESSARY TO ENTER YOUR RUSSIAN HISTORY TEXTBOOK ARCHIVELY AND URGENTLY.
        The president here is not an assistant to us, but rather an adversary.
        1. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich 22 January 2014 13: 21
          +12
          The president here is not an assistant to us, but rather an adversary ..... Here you are right namesake .. with the help of the Unified State Examination all education is destroyed, what’s the story, current high school students don’t know either Stalin or Lenin, or when the war started ... for that Sure that the Americans won ... the wife at the college teaches, in horror what they come after school ....
      3. an-sar
        an-sar 22 January 2014 18: 39
        +8
        There will be no Russians, there will be no RUSSIA !!!
        1. Legioner
          Legioner 22 January 2014 21: 25
          -5
          Quote: an-sar
          There will be no Russians

          Who is stopping the Russians from multiplying and multiplying, doesn’t the president have it?
          Quote: an-sar
          there will be no RUSSIA !!!

          I agree, but do not forget that Russia is a FEDERATION, NOT a REPUBLIC!
      4. just exp
        just exp 22 January 2014 20: 25
        +4
        The Russian question was nearly solved by Eltsin, even from ten years of Eltsyn’s rule, and the next generation would speak a different language.
      5. Horde
        Horde 22 January 2014 20: 27
        +6
        The alternative version, according to which the invasion of the Batu army to Russia was connected with the process of internal "squabbles" inside the Northern Power, the heiress of the Scythian-Sarmatian empire, is becoming more and more interesting. Rus (Russian) and "Tatars" were the direct heirs of this empire.


        it’s time so already already venerable to stop separating the Scythians and Slavs, as different nations, such a story looks stupid.

        Therefore, "foreign colleagues" in a cannon shot should not be allowed into Russian history.


        fine, absolutely true, there are no HISTORIANS OF INTERNATIONALISTS, but only their own lure writers on a small town king or fulfilling an order of someone else's HOLY SPIRITUAL CONSISTORY.
        We do not need THEIR services ...
        I do not expect ANYTHING FROM the new textbook until THESE at the helm, fundamentally, nothing changes ...
      6. just exp
        just exp 22 January 2014 20: 27
        +2
        But what Putin said about the Battle of Kulikovo, I’m talking about the history of Russia from the Aryan tribes and Tartaria
        1. dzvero
          dzvero 22 January 2014 23: 01
          0
          Thanks for the clip. Your president is 100% president. A clever man and I don’t understand those who are kicking him in the net ... well, except for trolls, I see.
          1. just exp
            just exp 23 January 2014 07: 51
            +1
            we always had a king, he’s a national leader, undermine faith in the king, then society can also be undermined, therefore the enemy will always pour slop on our leaders, and lie, lie, lie, lie constantly and without any twinge of conscience.
    2. Luzhichanin
      Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 09: 39
      +11
      Quote: Samsonov Alexander
      The concept of the history of Russia should be expanded at the expense of the Sarmatian, Scythian, Cimmerian and Aryan (Pre-Slavic) periods. The Slavic (Russian) concept of history, which was defended by Lomonosov, Lyzlov, Tatishchev, Veltman, Gedeonov, Lyubavsky, Ilovaisky, Petukhov and many other devotees, should become prevalent in Russia.
      True says Comrade Samsonov.
      Now "lovers of history" will come running in and tell us tales about the great migrations of peoples, mainly of the Turks fellow Pan-Turkism rules hi laughing
      1. Max_Bauder
        Max_Bauder 22 January 2014 12: 26
        +8
        And you laugh in vain, because the migration of peoples was. Remember the Huns (Huns), because they somehow got from the territory of Mongolia where they lived in the second century before Rome.
        Remember the history of Rome, how they were torn apart by barbarians, aliens, and Ostrogoths. Visigoths, Alemans, Huns, Galas. Then, after all, there were no peoples, it is not better to say the nation what everybody looks like now.
        There were no Kazakhs, Russians, Italians, English. There were tribes that mixed. or from which they left. This is a complex and big process.
        After all, I hope you know how, for example, the Indians appeared in North America?
        it’s proven that they came from Asia, yes, yes, so many thousands of kilometers traveled. Look for example at Yakut and Eskimo Canada, one to one.
        The islands of a quiet window were also inhabited by people from Asia, thousands of nautical miles sailed on boats, a long time ago, which was proved by the Heyerdahl tour. and the Indians of South America are different from the Indians of North.
        You see, if it’s hard to understand something in history, this does not mean that it didn’t. The origin of heat was discovered only a century ago or a half. Shine.

        As for pan-Turkism, I do not believe in such a thing, the land of Kazakhstan was inhabited by various tribes from ancient times who spoke from Indo-Iranian to Turkic-Mongolian. Therefore, for example, Kazakhs are woven from different nations. But I know for sure that all Turkic-speaking people were different and are different now, both in appearance according to other criteria like culture, customs and way of life.

        Before the arrival of the Mongols, the south of Kazakhstan was Khorezm, everyone dressed and spoke like Khiva and Kokand in the picture of Vereshchagig, and the Kipchaks lived in the northern regions, we have such a tribe now, but this does not mean that only they lived, Kipchaks this name, like Kazakhs , for there were many tribes in the composition. Also, for example, the Naimans and Argyns were part of the Mongols, although they fought against them at the beginning when they attacked Khorezm, and these plmens are now part of the Kazakhs.
        So the Kazakhs were against the Mongols does not sound true. For the tribes were both pros and cons. The same thing about the Russians.

        When Batu conquered Russia, there were cities that helped, and there were those who were against it. And this thesis about the Scythians as if there was a single empire, with the capital in the barn and then in Moscow, is it funny, is this not amateurism? Do you distinguish Russian from Mongol appearance? Russians descended from the Slavs, who lived northeast of Byzantium, converted to Christianity, took their names, and then were reborn into a powerful state in the 10 or 11 century, this sounds true. Then he joined neighboring countries.

        There was no united empire since ancient times. peoples lived side by side, which were different and are different now.
        1. Luzhichanin
          Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 14: 21
          +4
          Quote: Max_Bauder
          Are you laughing in vain?

          Not in vain, I state a fact: you and I think your colleagues will catch up - this is on the verge of a diagnosis: just like fanatics with foam at the mouth you prove ... trying to persuade us to believe in what we yourself were persuaded to believe, although maybe you get paid for it!
          1. nerd.su
            nerd.su 22 January 2014 22: 38
            -2
            Quote: Luzhichanin
            this is already on the verge of diagnosis: just like fanatics with foam at the mouth prove ...

            Sadly, but fanatics are fans of the historical delights of Alexander Samsonov. How else can you call the fans of a man who draws inspiration from Nazi delights? "The legacy of the ancestors", we need, you see, without occult nonsense. Yeah, with historical nonsense in my head, some of the cases can be heaped too.
          2. Max_Bauder
            Max_Bauder 24 January 2014 15: 42
            0
            You beat around the bush, but you just can't say

            ... talk about what he was thinking. and he thought about what I thought ... laughing

            What should I understand from this? express the idea correctly, and we will discuss, amicably and politely smile
        2. Cynic
          Cynic 22 January 2014 16: 50
          +3
          Quote: Luzhichanin
          although maybe you get paid for it!

          Well, how does the "colleague" feel?
          Here you are not here - here you will quickly lose the habit of drinking vodka and disgrace disgrace.
          laughing
          There is a paradigm _ Whoever is not with us is against us - who is not with us. And the subject of discussion is not important!
          wink
        3. Besoffner
          Besoffner 22 January 2014 17: 21
          +12
          Tell me, dear comrade from independent Kazakhstan. Here are the Huns and Mongols - nomadic tribes. They lived for themselves as their ancestors, in separate groups of 20-30 people. A large group is difficult to feed, or rather, more difficult to feed horses for a larger number of people. And for some reason, all of a sudden these nomads united in a hundred thousandth army and, together with their families, moved 10 km from the halo of their habitat. What fed the horses? And what did horses eat in winter? I could agree with the idea that the horses dug up the snow and ate the surviving grass, but ... I don’t know how in Mongolia, but in the territory of canonical Russia the height of the snow cover can reach 3 meters. And if during the winter there were thaws, such an ice shell forms - it can only be taken with steel scrap.
          The invasion of Batu himself took place in the winter. They walked along the frozen riverbeds. But this is exactly the way the Russians act. In the summer, there was no time for Russians - sowing, harvesting, stocking up supplies for the winter. But in the winter it’s just to make a nefig, and they were going to ratify, go to fight enemies, and just rob the neighbors. But the steppes - they went hiking in the summer. We recall the Crimean Khanate. Why in the summer ??? but because we have horses fed on oats, and among the steppes on the steppe grass, they are smaller and weaker than Russians, therefore walking in the snow is worse. And the Russians are busy in the summer with sowing / harvesting, because they cannot set up strong barriers, it is better to fight Russians in the summer.
          1. AntonR7
            AntonR7 22 January 2014 21: 04
            -2
            Why on earth do nations unite in states ?! No wonder. Feed?! also not surprising, you can take the reserves plus rob the population that you enslave. In short, stop distorting history as Putinists. There was a story before 1991 and everything here does not need to be rewritten.
          2. Max_Bauder
            Max_Bauder 24 January 2014 15: 39
            0
            My dear dude! Have you been to Astana in winter? or in Ust-Kamenogorsk?

            Know that winter is fierce in the steppes than in the forests of Ryazan and Vladimir. Just the same, Russian horses do not hold out even a month in the steppes of Mongolia, when there is not even a stall, especially on oats laughing where will you find her there ??. Buranas are even here in Kazakhstan, of course ... you’re fucking, not like Mongolia.

            As for the army, why are you surprised at the 120 thousandth army of the Mongols, when Napoleon from the Bois de Boulogne (read almost from the shore of the Atlantic Ocean) brought to you 1812m 600 thousand troops, his army that fed the air ??? so do not be surprised if the supply is well developed and not such trips to do.

            What about Macedonian? he will have fewer horses than infantry, which means mobility is also lost, but he managed to get to India. Not surprising?

            That's the tact, I say again if you don’t understand it doesn’t mean that there is no solution (as the math teacher used to say) smile
            1. Cynic
              Cynic 24 January 2014 16: 31
              0
              Quote: Max_Bauder
              Know that winter is fierce in the steppes than in the forests of Ryazan and Vladimir.

              Yes, as if we ourselves are from Omsk.
              Quote: Max_Bauder
              Buranas are even here in Kazakhstan, of course ... you’re fucking, not like Mongolia.

              The conversation was actually about the depth of the snow cover, it’s kind of different.
              By the way, the depth of snow can not be reviewed! Do you know how many candidate and doctoral degrees are written on them? It’s better not to know, we’ll sleep better!
              In a battle, meteorologists VS historians would put on meteorologists, they always manage to dodge!
              Quote: Max_Bauder
              brought to you 1812m 600 thousand troops, his army that fed air?

              Do you even understand what kind of argument you used? Your level of knowledge is phenomenal!
              Napoleon lost in Russia about 580 thousand soldiers. These losses include 200 thousand killed, from 150 to 190 thousand prisoners, about 130 thousand deserters,


              Quote: Max_Bauder
              managed to reach india. Not surprising?

              It 'warm over there .
            2. AntonR7
              AntonR7 25 January 2014 18: 30
              0
              No wonder Napoleon said the war should feed itself. Those. invaders as a rule feed at the expense of those territories in which they are waging a war this is not new. Fodder and food, so finding the conquered is not a problem. This is also confirmed by the fact that in history there are a lot of cases (for example, led by. Resettlement of peoples) when mass armies invaded somewhere (Greco-Persian wars). Banal robbery of the conquered.
          3. nerd.su
            nerd.su 24 January 2014 19: 34
            +1
            Quote: Besoffner
            Here are the Huns and Mongols - nomadic tribes. They lived for themselves as their ancestors, in separate groups of 20-30 people. A large group is difficult to feed, or rather, harder to feed horses for more people

            You yourself came up with this to justify your subsequent statement that there is nothing to feed horses in winter. And in the summer, too, there is nothing, if you think, because the nomads live in small groups so as not to die of hunger. But if you follow this logic, then neither the Scythians, nor the Sarmatians, nor the Huns could not assemble large troops. And they did not go on military campaigns, and so, horses were stolen from neighbors.
            Quote: Besoffner
            I could agree with the idea that the horses dug up the snow and ate the surviving grass, but ... I don’t know how in Mongolia, but in the territory of canonical Russia the height of the snow cover can reach 3 meters. And if during the winter there were thaws, such an ice shell forms - it can only be taken with steel scrap.

            Your fantasy knows no bounds laughing Well, okay, about three meters I still agree. In very warm winters, it is also possible in ravines. But about the thaw and the scrap for breaking the crust - this is something from epic epics. "There are only mountains above us, only my balls are cooler than us!" laughing By the way, the greater snow cover is compensated by more abundant grass cover in comparison with the Mongolian steppes. Yes, and the thrifty local population can be shocked.
            Quote: Besoffner
            The invasion of Batu himself took place in the winter. They walked along the frozen riverbeds. But this is exactly the way the Russians act.

            In those days, this is the mode of action in Russia by any sensible leader of the cavalry army. In the summer, there is no maneuver and a large fleet is needed, because you have to move along the rivers. The Crimean Tatars, like the Pechenegs and Polovtsy, went to raids more often and did not want to freeze at all, all the same, southerners. The Mongols are from Eastern Siberia, if you know the geography and came not just a raid. They were just looking for a meeting with the whole army in order to solve the question whose letter was longer at once.

            Quote: Max_Bauder

            Know that winter is fierce in the steppes than in the forests of Ryazan and Vladimir. Just the same, Russian horses do not hold out even a month in the steppes of Mongolia, when there is not even a stall, especially on oats

            Well, where we do not. With normally organized intelligence, engineering services and logistics, any winter can be survived. And Russians - that people, that horses outlive anyone in any territory, so far the will of the political leadership.
        4. Grenader
          Grenader 22 January 2014 19: 13
          -2
          It is also necessary to take into account that the Kazan Tatars, like the Chuvash, are descendants of the tribal union of the Bulgars.
          These descendants of one tribal union, to put it mildly, strongly dislike each other.
    3. Asgard
      Asgard 22 January 2014 09: 44
      +23
      It is important who will approve this single concept ?!
      Our President repented of the execution of the Poles, although everyone knows that the Germans shot.
      It raises questions of "dancing" on the Kulikovo field, Putin was also taken there and he carried Achinea there ....

      Tartaria, Hyperborea (the country of Boreals) is the birthplace of Russia, Rus, Slavic tribes (flames of RA))
      The horde (order) is the military power, the military clans of the Rus, the Khans are the heads of the clans, they collected the tithe (Taxes) of the state of Tartaria and brought it to the capital of the metropolis, the Tsars are worldly power ....

      The khans took power into their own hands when the "Jewish project" began to be implemented in Russia. The horde introduced martial law, it issued "labels for rule" to princes, leaders of squads, the shock right was canceled (emergency regime))
      However, the military could not cope, they knew how to fight, the magi were also limited in rights, the ideology of Judah and bribery won .....

      Wait, we need to fix everything, again, It will be the Military, but under the leadership
      A Slav, a carrier of knowledge, here a textbook would be useful so as not to explain a thousand times - how to act .........
      1. Luzhichanin
        Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 09: 52
        +6
        Quote: Asgard
        It raises questions of "dancing" on the Kulikovo field, Putin was also taken there and he carried Achinea there ....

        Recently there was an article on VO where one of the visitors posted a video showing the president’s attitude to the Battle of Kulikovo, I don’t know how much it changes in time ...
        1. Asgard
          Asgard 22 January 2014 10: 11
          +1
          Well, here he is adequate (although of course there is not enough knowledge))
          I look "good" only understands Masonic signs))))
          On the field, when he spoke, he said different .....
          Well, what will you do, PARASIS AROUND, I suspect that Putin, too ...
          Some of these infected us during the implementation of the Jewish project,
          Moreover, this necessarily lives in every Jew) and the President)))
          1. rolik
            rolik 22 January 2014 13: 17
            +3
            Quote: Asgard
            And such lives

            Usually echinococcus in the head parasitizes, and then in the heart. Carefully let the children go outside for a walk. Especially in sandboxes, cats usually go to crap there, so that then they don’t drag dirty hands into their mouths. After the street, immediately wash with soap and water.
          2. Valkyrie
            Valkyrie 22 January 2014 13: 57
            0
            Honest mother, that’s rubbish, like in the most terrible American horror movies! Fu, well, an abomination! And you, as usual, are right. Our president clearly lacks diplomas to express himself more clearly, but his thought is correct. Judging by the frequent REN TV programs on such topics, the president is gradually pursuing a course towards restoring the historical authenticity of the role of Russia and Russia in world history. What will come of this, will it work out at all, and for what purpose does he do it will show time.
          3. Luzhichanin
            Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 14: 25
            +1
            Quote: Asgard
            On the field, when he spoke, he said different .....

            didn’t the references to the presentation survive? It is interesting to hear a different interpretation of events from the FIRST mouth.
            1. Asgard
              Asgard 22 January 2014 17: 17
              +9
              no links, from memory, the Russian army defeated paraboters ....

              although we know that only after the Battle of Kulikovo slavery (serfdom) was introduced) and slaves appeared on the galleys))))
              I duck I think that if you won the “opposite” side, then there would be 282 article in the legislation, but SLAVAN wouldn’t put him on it ...
              The Horde (order bearers) Kvachkov, Khabarov, Budanov, Ulman and a number of OFFICERS would not be in prison, but would serve YOUR KIND ....
              We would be proud of the army, we would respect the servicemen, the Negroes would not beat FSO officers in the face, Titorenko, the ambassador in Qatar, would open the doors to government offices with his foot, Booth would not sit in the United States, Ukraine would be a calm country with garnish diviners and good guys, ,,,,

              This is not such a Victory ,,,,,,,,,,,, We recently celebrated ......
              Eh heh heh ...... (but I love my land, I like to lie on the grass, look at the sky, where white clouds run and free birds fly, they have not changed their nature .....

              And we?????????
        2. Humpty
          Humpty 22 January 2014 11: 22
          0
          Luzhichanin.
          Looked twice. Sadly.
        3. just exp
          just exp 22 January 2014 20: 29
          0
          damn what does it mean not to read the comments to the end, but immediately to comment, I damn repeated.
      2. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 12: 01
        +8
        Quote: Asgard
        Wait, we need to fix everything

        The first step should be the introduction of the subject into the school curriculum - the Slavic alphabet, i.e. Russian language before its reform by Lunacharsky. First, it must be studied in parallel with the current language - a mutant, and later replace it. You can learn from the Jews in this; they revived a practically dead language. And plus to this, you need to adopt a law on the protection of the Russian language from foreign garbage. all this is done easily, there are no obstacles, enough initiative. But our government, judging by their actions, has opposite plans. hi
        1. Humpty
          Humpty 22 January 2014 13: 10
          +1
          It is depressing that students should KNOW that there are supposedly 6 cases in the Russian language, and 12 times in the toothless language (English). Another "cultured" Russian person should consider the word "lay down" obscene. This harm could not have been invented by the Russians for themselves.
          1. Power
            Power 22 January 2014 21: 58
            +1
            First the language, and then Chubais: two lifelong as a swindler?
            No - these guys will not give an inch of Russian land (voluntarily)
        2. baltika-18
          baltika-18 22 January 2014 13: 17
          +3
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          The first step should be to introduce the subject into the school curriculum - the Slavic alphabet,

          Here I agree. It is necessary that the children know.
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          First, it must be studied in parallel with the current language - the mutant

          Language does not mutate; it develops.
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          and later replace it

          I don’t agree here. This is superfluous.
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          And plus to this, you need to adopt a law on the protection of the Russian language from foreign garbage.

          But here I agree. This is very important. Save, developing further.
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 14: 25
            +4
            Quote: baltika-18
            Language does not mutate; it develops.

            At the beginning of the 20th century, it was cut, now terrible things are happening to the language, what was slang in 70-80, now in dictionaries. this cannot be called development.
            Quote: baltika-18
            I don’t agree here. This is superfluous.

            What is bad if, in the early stages of learning writing, children will remember letters not as simple sounds, but as voluminous, meaning-filled meanings?
            1. baltika-18
              baltika-18 22 January 2014 15: 20
              +1
              Quote: Ingvar 72
              What is bad if, in the early stages of learning writing, children will remember letters not as simple sounds, but as voluminous, meaning-filled meanings?

              I am for the study, deepened with the addition to the study of the course of linguistics. But I am against the replacement and reform of writing. This is superfluous. The language has come to its optimal form, both in pronunciation and in writing. It still remains the same capacious and sonorous, and at the same time perfectly comfortable.
        3. rolik
          rolik 22 January 2014 13: 20
          +2
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Russian language before its reform by Lunacharsky.

          That is, you propose to return to writing "yati" ???
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 14: 29
            +1
            Quote: rolik
            That is, you propose to return to writing "yati" ???

            Yes, and more. hi
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. Nikotin13
              Nikotin13 22 January 2014 15: 01
              +1
              I don’t know why my post was deleted: initial letter, 49 images that our ANCESTORS had before Christianity came to Russia
              1. Alexander Romanov
                Alexander Romanov 22 January 2014 15: 04
                0
                Quote: Nikotin13
                I don’t know why they deleted my post:

                So that srach would not be bred.
                1. John_Wood
                  John_Wood 22 January 2014 16: 47
                  0
                  What a neat ... Oskara and Yarosvet banned for this? In the old articles - not a single comment, I cleaned everything out. After the New Year, did you receive stricter instructions, or was it tired and scared to "fight"?
                2. The comment was deleted.
                3. Nikotin13
                  Nikotin13 22 January 2014 19: 53
                  +4
                  Russian man is unlikely to call OUR CAPITAL srach
                4. Nikotin13
                  Nikotin13 22 January 2014 19: 53
                  +1
                  Russian man is unlikely to call OUR CAPITAL srach
            3. rolik
              rolik 22 January 2014 16: 22
              +3
              Quote: Ingvar 72
              Yes, and more.

              Now, to be honest, I do not want to write. And why should Lunacharsky offend?
              The unconditional preservation of the alphabet after the Peter's reform of the alphabet in 1708 indicates that the pronunciation of the letters "e" and "ѣ" was probably still distinguishable at that time. But already in the second half of the 1885th century, Lomonosov notes that "the letters e and ѣ in common parlance barely have a sensitive difference, which in reading very clearly the ear divides and demands <...> in its stoutness, in ѣ subtlety." A century later, Groth directly states in the Russian Spelling of XNUMX: "there is not the slightest difference in their pronunciation." In some regional dialects, however, a specific shade of the "e" sound is still preserved in the syllables under the stress, which in the past were written with "ѣ".
              Already Trediakovsky in the XVIII century advocates the abolition of the nyat. There is a legend that later Nicholas I was thinking about whether to issue a corresponding decree, but abandoned the idea when he was told that they distinguish literacy from ignoramus. The draft spelling reform of 1911, developed by the Imperial Academy of Sciences, was mothballed by the highest command of Nicholas II. The letter "yat" remained a nightmare of Russian schoolchildren for a while: from the difficulty of mastering a long list of words, despite memorizing mnemonic verses, the saying "learn to yat" obviously appeared.
              Spelling reform was announced by several circulars of the Provisional Government in the summer of 1917 (the school was first translated into new spelling), confirmed by a decree of the Soviet government in December 1917; clerical work and the press on the new spelling were translated by decree of 1918.
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 19: 00
                +3
                Quote: rolik
                A century later, the Grotto directly states in the “Russian Spelling” of 1885: “there is not the slightest difference in their pronunciation”.

                Language is akin to the human body - it is not always possible to explain its work, even among doctors. And some organs seem at first glance unnecessary. Appendix for example. At first glance, the body can easily do without it, but some fine strings will still be broken. So with the letters, do not cut them off from the Russian language as an appendix. Or foreskin, after all. laughing
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. The comment was deleted.
        4. Luzhichanin
          Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 14: 28
          +3
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          You can learn from the Jews in this; they revived a practically dead language.
          Hmm ... there is another hypothesis that Hebrew was invented at the end of the 19th century by one prominent Jew from Belarus. It is interesting in this regard to hear the opinion of the natives of the promised land.
          1. Ingvar 72
            Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 14: 33
            +1
            Quote: Luzhichanin
            that Hebrew was coined

            It seems to me that this is nothing more than a version, the inscriptions in Hebrew date from much earlier dates. Although I would also listen with interest to the version from the left. laughing
          2. atalef
            atalef 22 January 2014 14: 41
            +3
            Quote: Luzhichanin
            Hmm ... there is another hypothesis that Hebrew was invented at the end of the 19th century by one prominent Jew from Belarus

            Hebrew was not invented, and inscriptions in Hebrew 1000-2000 years ago are also read freely and the words are exactly the same.
            They prayed in Hebrew, while Ashkenazi (European Jews) spoke in Idish, and Sephardim (Eastern Jews, usually in Arabic or the language of the countries where they lived), Judah Bar (in the 19th century) began to revive just the spoken language and, of course, in spoken language there were a lot of words, because they were not mentioned in the Torah (Old Testament). therefore, even such a word as carrots (geser) is a word invented by him, 90% of the words of the language are words of ancient, original Hebrew, but there is a whole institute that introduces new words into the language and they should be as close to the language as possible (more precisely, have a root base language) as an example, a computer (makhshev) from the word lekhashev - to think in general seems to be like a computer in Hebrew - a thinker.
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 15: 03
              +1
              Quote: atalef
              but there is a whole institute that introduces new words into the language and they should be as close as possible to the language (

              Yes, Jews take their traditions very carefully, but in the bosom of other nations they are the first reformers, especially in culture.
              P.S. Hi Sanya. hi
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. atalef
                atalef 22 January 2014 15: 08
                +1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                P.S. Hi Sanya

                Hi, Igoryanich.
                How are you ? Our winter is somehow gloomy, +25, I want to have rains and cold already. Pancake mushrooms do not grow. In general, some kind of crap.
                1. Ingvar 72
                  Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 15: 25
                  0
                  Quote: atalef
                  I want to have rains and cold

                  Come on vacation, I will provide with cold, we have -18. laughing
                  Quote: atalef
                  Pancake mushrooms do not grow.

                  I have not run out of banks yet.
                  1. The comment was deleted.
                  2. atalef
                    atalef 22 January 2014 15: 28
                    +1
                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    Come on vacation, I will provide with cold, we have -18.

                    You are just anti-Semite laughing
                    Is that a crematorium on the contrary?

                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    I have not run out of banks yet.

                    Do you mean Citibank, Sberbank and how many more banks?
                    So kidding. We have already eaten everything up and even at the brother-in-law are over (and he is an old mushroom picker, ready even at night with a flashlight to collect). We went to the email. mail a couple of cans laughing
                    1. Ingvar 72
                      Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 16: 26
                      0
                      Quote: atalef
                      You are just anti-Semite

                      You didn `t know ? laughing I have a mixed approach, first cold, then a bath, you look, and Russified.
                      Quote: atalef
                      We went to the email. mail a couple of cans

                      I would send it, but they won’t fit into the system unit, and if they got into it, then Romanov would have intercepted and ate them. laughing
                      1. atalef
                        atalef 22 January 2014 23: 18
                        0
                        Quote: Ingvar 72
                        then Romanov would have intercepted them and ate

                        Romanov is like that. he will intercept and eat mail as a moderator. crying
                        Let's drink something on Skype. You’ll show them on the camera. drinks
        5. Genur
          Genur 22 January 2014 15: 27
          0
          ... still not enough - consult with the Russian Orthodox Church. These Ridigers and the Gundyaevs will advise
          1. saber1357
            saber1357 23 January 2014 00: 52
            -2
            Instead, we must, of course, consult with the Genoa - the name is truly Gusian for everyone to understand.
        6. pan_nor
          pan_nor 22 January 2014 18: 45
          0
          only "Slavic" history will have to be invented?
  3. Old warrant officer
    Old warrant officer 22 January 2014 09: 06
    +9
    "Only one ideology"
    This is contrary to our most liberal constitution! Isn't it time to change her?
    1. Orik
      Orik 22 January 2014 09: 30
      +10
      Quote: Old Warrant Officer
      This is contrary to our most liberal constitution! Isn't it time to change her?

      It is useless to change the constitution without changing the authorities, in 1993 it was easily violated for the sake of power. Look at how many anti-corruption laws have been passed, and they steal even more. For a decent person, the law of his conscience is enough, and a thief will always try to steal. Moreover, those who, according to their duties, must fight corruption, steal more than others. System..
      1. Ivan Petrovich
        Ivan Petrovich 22 January 2014 09: 48
        +1
        right. The constitution is just a piece of paper ...
        1. Luzhichanin
          Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 09: 54
          +7
          Live according to Conscience and this piece of paper will be needed only in order to visit the sanitary room.
          1. Deniska
            Deniska 24 January 2014 16: 48
            0
            And will everyone live honestly? or only those who will go to the sanitary room with her?
        2. Deniska
          Deniska 22 January 2014 12: 17
          +2
          Simply at the moment "CONSTITUTION" is a piece of paper !!!!! But when it will be fixed and STRICTLY observed !!!!, for example, shooting !! for drug dealing or treasury. And the disruption of the state defense order is equated with the mass murder of Russian citizens. Then it will cease to be an unnecessary piece of paper !.

          PiSi: but unfortunately our "elite" will not agree to this, how can they live then ?!
          1. Doctorleg
            Doctorleg 22 January 2014 13: 47
            -1
            Quote: Deniska
            Simply at the moment "CONSTITUTION" is a piece of paper !!!!! But when it will be fixed and STRICTLY observed !!!!, for example, shooting !! for drug dealing or treasury. And the disruption of the state defense order is equated with the mass murder of Russian citizens. Then it will cease to be an unnecessary piece of paper !.

            PiSi: but unfortunately our "elite" will not agree to this, how can they live then ?!

            Yes Yes! For spelling mistakes - 15 years in the camps, for violation of punctuation rules - 10, and for incorrect stress - 5. So we will save the Russian language. And, of course, the Slavic language. Only not the one who reformed Lunacharsky, but the one on which the "Tale of Bygone Years" is written. belay
            1. Deniska
              Deniska 24 January 2014 16: 47
              0
              What are you about?? If you are satisfied with what we have in our country for the theft of millions - "there is no corpus delicti", but for resisting the police for 3 years! Do not go too fardear.
          2. Genur
            Genur 22 January 2014 16: 30
            0
            Moreover, to return CONFISCATION for unjustly acquired.
  4. ZU-23
    ZU-23 22 January 2014 09: 07
    +8
    It is necessary to write a clean story, if there were problems, then you must not forget about them, but you cannot deceive yourself, it will come back later.
    1. zzz
      zzz 22 January 2014 09: 59
      +2
      Quote: ZU-23
      It is necessary to write a clean story, if there were problems, then you must not forget about them, but you cannot deceive yourself, it will come back later.


      Society without a past is doomed, so they are trying to deprive us of the present story. And if you start writing the truth about Ancient Russia, then the Orthodox Church will be unambiguously against .... such a thread will stretch ... And nevertheless, people should know the truth, and they will draw conclusions themselves. If something has taken root in society, that means it was for the good.
      1. ZU-23
        ZU-23 22 January 2014 10: 19
        +2
        Ancient Russia is generally an old and little proven history, the same as we here recently discussed about the Tatar-Mongol yoke, whether it was or not.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Deniska
        Deniska 22 January 2014 12: 18
        +1
        And why would the Orthodox Church be against the history of the church and the Orthodox people? explain to the uncomprehending ...
        1. Luzhichanin
          Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 14: 32
          -4
          well, if only because the Orthodox Church in Russia only became under Stalin.
          1. saber1357
            saber1357 23 January 2014 00: 54
            0
            Oh, yes, you probably all know what when and why it happened, and with prof. Kant, probably also sat at breakfast?
            1. Luzhichanin
              Luzhichanin 23 January 2014 13: 14
              0
              I know a lot, but I don’t know anymore (s)
              Kant did not sit at breakfast.
              Any other questions? I think you have enough mind and find answers to them yourself.
            2. Luzhichanin
              Luzhichanin 23 January 2014 13: 14
              0
              I know a lot, but I don’t know anymore (s)
              Kant did not sit at breakfast.
              Any other questions? I think you have enough mind and find answers to them yourself.
        2. Poppy
          Poppy 22 January 2014 14: 52
          +1
          because not everything is clean and unambiguous
    2. SPLV
      SPLV 22 January 2014 14: 37
      +2
      Quote: ZU-23
      You have to write a clean story,

      To be honest, I don’t understand at all what "pure history" is. Non-existent concept. History is a statement of fact with a subjective assessment of cause and effect.
      Here's a sample of "clean history": From 1939 to 1945, a group of European states participated in hostilities, one was beneficial, the other was not, and at the end of hostilities peace agreements were signed, which did not suit everyone.
      As soon as you talk about the reasons for any of the participants in the war, or try to use the words aggressor and victim - immediately the story will cease to be "pure", having received a portion of subjective assessment, personally yours.
      I think that a history textbook should always be written in such a way as to instill a patriotic attitude in students, and without any connection with current political views. Moreover, the school history textbook must end in 1985 in order to stop the "democratic verbiage", otherwise history lessons will turn into a discussion club. Thanks.
      1. Nikotin13
        Nikotin13 22 January 2014 14: 57
        +4
        History began to be written in Russia with the advent of Christianity, and before that our ANCESTORS had a chronicle.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  5. invisibility
    invisibility 22 January 2014 09: 08
    +16
    On the one hand, Vladimir Putin is right: all attempts to distort the history of Russia must be strictly suppressed

    So let it stop!
    Isn't that Putin, who apologized to the Poles for Katyn and claimed that the Bolsheviks had ruined the Russian army? Excuse me, would you like to start with yourself?
    1. mirag2
      mirag2 22 January 2014 09: 23
      0
      But did not the Bolsheviks ruin and destroy the Russian army in the early 20th century?
      It seems that they were the main initiators of the destruction of the Russian State along with all its attributes (first of all, the "old Leninists" - the champions of the "world international") - after all, they are!
      We will not list these people and their real names.
      1. invisibility
        invisibility 22 January 2014 09: 46
        +8
        Have you heard about the February revolution? And who created the soldiers' committees? And when did the order No.1 come out?
        Russian Empire, you wanted to say.
        Instead of the Russian army, the Bolsheviks created the Red Army. Her success must be listed.
        1. Deniska
          Deniska 22 January 2014 12: 27
          -1
          From the post above !!

          no need to write that the greatest Empire of the USSR was created under them. You and I don’t know an alternative course of events during the ORTHODOX !!! Tsarist Monarchy.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Deniska
        Deniska 22 January 2014 12: 26
        -9
        Lenin, Trotsky, Stalin, Kamenev, Brezhnev, Khrushchev, Beria, Andropov, Chernenko, Gorbachev ... Unfortunately, this is who destroyed the Empire and the Imperial Army. And there are no Russians;))

        P.C. And do not write that under them the greatest Empire of the USSR was created. You and I don’t know an alternative course of events during the ORTHODOX !!! Tsarist Monarchy.
        1. invisibility
          invisibility 22 January 2014 14: 27
          +4
          He sat for a long time and thought to answer you.
          There is simply no alternative course of history! There is a HISTORY. If you want an alternative, read fiction. Only then do not refer to it as facts smile .
          But the facts are such that the royal monarchy is rotten and allowed itself to be overthrown.
          The USSR was built by the efforts of the entire Soviet people. And the Red Army was created that broke the ridge of fascism.
          For me, it makes no difference Russian people or not. If only he worked, served for the good of the country.
          And from the post above, you still did not answer the questions posed: did you hear about the February revolution? And who created the soldiers' committees? And when did the order No.1 come out?
      4. Poppy
        Poppy 22 January 2014 14: 53
        +3
        no, it was destroyed before them - under Kerensky
      5. saber1357
        saber1357 23 January 2014 00: 55
        +1
        The comment is not superfluous, which they set up the minuses, the person actually said nothing fundamentally wrong ....
    2. Luzhichanin
      Luzhichanin 22 January 2014 14: 35
      +3
      Quote: invisible
      in front of the Poles for Katyn

      Hmm ... even historians have recognized this as a farce. How can a special operation to propagate lies be identified with reality ?!
      1. Roman 1977
        Roman 1977 22 January 2014 14: 51
        +6
        Firstly:
        The Grand Chamber of the European Court of Human Rights (BP ECHR) made a final decision on the lawsuit of a group of Polish citizens demanding a new investigation into the death of Polish prisoners of war in Katyn. The court did not found the Russian Federation guilty of violating Article 3 of the European Convention for the Protection of Human Rights: “Prohibition of inhuman or degrading treatment”. The claim was not approved by the plaintiffs to conduct a new investigation.

        http://www.km.ru/world/2013/10/22/evropeiskii-sud-po-pravam-cheloveka-v-strasbur

        ge / 723547-reshenie-evropeiskogo-suda-

        Secondly, as the examination showed, the Poles were shot from pistols of the Walter brand, caliber 0, 7 mm, which were not in service with the NKVD, there were enough Nagans, Mauser and TT, while the Poles were tied with German twine, a method not accepted in the USSR ... Thirdly, some Polish officers who were allegedly shot in Katyn, for example General Anders, turned out to be alive, alive, subsequently created a Polish corps, which fled from the USSR in 65 in order not to fight the Germans.
        And thirdly, even if all of a sudden, ours shot the Poles, this is revenge for the brutal extermination of about 80 of thousands of Soviet prisoners of war by the Poles in the 1920 year, this is how noble gentlemen in the Confederates acted:
        A representative of the Polish administration in the occupied territories (the so-called Civil Administration of the Eastern Lands), someone Kossakovsky testified: "People were robbed, whipped with barbed wire, burned with red-hot iron to obtain false confessions." In the presence of General Listovsky (the commander of the task force in Polesie), a boy was shot dead - "because he allegedly smiled unkindly."

        And the Poles liked to put different experiments on prisoners of war. One of the favorite amusements of the Polish soldier, of which Kossakovsky was an eyewitness, was the following: “a living cat was sewn into someone’s open stomach and mortgaged, who will die first, man or cat”


        Soviet prisoners of war in Polish captivity
        1. Cynic
          Cynic 23 January 2014 15: 55
          +1
          Quote: Novel 1977
          as the examination showed, the Poles were shot from pistols of the Walter brand, caliber 7, 65 mm, which were not in service with the NKVD, there was enough

          You should at least read VO articles if you don’t want to follow other sources.
          There were Walters at the NKVD, there were!
          But not with firing squads, and indeed spend anything on enemies of the people bought for currency?
          It seems so in that article on VO dedicated to Katyn. There, by the way, this very Jesuit content of the decision is given.
  6. an_pearl
    an_pearl 22 January 2014 09: 08
    +12
    I completely agree with the author regarding the reprinting of the Soviet history textbook, or at least take it as the basis for the new.
    1. yehat
      yehat 22 January 2014 11: 08
      +1
      Soviet textbook lying here and there
      this is especially true of the events of 17 years, because the textbook does not understand why all of Europe, so white and fluffy, suddenly became afraid of us.
      For example, one cannot ignore the truth of an unsuccessful raid on Poland immediately after the civil war.
      The textbook is also silent on the role of the international in foreign policy, why Germany suddenly had a tooth on the USSR.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  7. skeptic
    skeptic 22 January 2014 09: 13
    +8
    That is why tales and legends appeared in order to preserve the real history of Russia in the memory of the people. And all sorts of momentary princelings always adjusted the story to their loved ones. "THE WINNER WRITS THE HISTORY" - and destroys the real history. Take care of Soviet HISTORY textbooks and bring it to your children and grandchildren until you can shake off the dirty foam of modern life from your shoulders.
    1. olviko
      olviko 22 January 2014 09: 32
      +18
      "That is why tales and legends appeared,"
    2. Pinochet000
      Pinochet000 22 January 2014 09: 50
      +14
      Quote: skeptic
      Take care of Soviet HISTORY textbooks and inform your children and grandchildren until you can shake off the dirty foam of modern life.

      I also think that I need to teach our children (grandchildren) ourselves ... for now
      1. Deniska
        Deniska 22 January 2014 12: 28
        +4
        Not so much to teach ourselves how to teach them to distinguish truth and fiction.
    3. Energet1k_
      Energet1k_ 22 January 2014 10: 03
      0
      And all sorts of momentary princelings always adjusted the story to their loved ones. "THE WINNER WRITS THE HISTORY" - and destroys the real history. Take care of the Soviet HISTORY textbooks and bring it to your children and grandchildren,

      You contradict yourself Dear! History was rewritten in 93, and in 17, etc. So where is this foundation on which to lean, where is the truth? You wrote "History is written by the winner" correctly, so maybe you should go back to history, until the moment where no one defeated anyone ??
    4. The comment was deleted.
  8. Pinochet000
    Pinochet000 22 January 2014 09: 14
    +5
    Alexander, as always to the point)) We really need a "Slavic University" ... or something like that, I also thought about it ...
  9. bairat
    bairat 22 January 2014 09: 17
    +4
    Today every "patriot" considers it his duty to walk through the hated Tatars. The country has no more enemies, but we’ll end these and happiness will come to Russia. They even got to Musa Jalil. I will note that no matter how the Germans tried to create combat-ready units from the Tatars, all their attempts ended in failure, at the first opportunity they left with weapons to the partisans. So look for problems in the wrong place.
  10. Ptah
    Ptah 22 January 2014 09: 26
    +7
    We were discussing here one of these days at one of the forums. And what will the date be called November 7, 1917? And all that follows.
    We came to the conclusion that it depends on the national composition of the "inventors".
  11. Boris55
    Boris55 22 January 2014 09: 32
    +5
    Who will allow us to get out of the biblical concept ... until Russia was put under it - we would not coexist, as it were. we will learn history starting from the 10 of the 20th century and not later ... Even the Jew Solovyov admits that the Slavs appeared in the 6-th century, and that nothing is written about it in the textbooks ... and Andrei the first-called in the first century to Russia He came to baptize her, Russia did not accept his faith and we are not in the history of that time, but since the forcible seizure of power in Vladimir in the 988 year and to this day - please, discuss this ...

    It’s like in a joke:
    There is a meeting. Speaker
    - There are two questions on the agenda: the first - to shoot all those present and the second - to repaint the fence in green. Any questions?
    - Yes. Why green?
    - But this question, I propose to discuss ...

    1. Boris55
      Boris55 22 January 2014 09: 54
      +1
      In addition to the foregoing:



      Putin knows about Tartaria, and what is written about it in the textbooks - not what ...
      1. v53993
        v53993 22 January 2014 18: 34
        +1
        Panmongolism! Though the name is wild
        But it caresses my ears.

        Vladimir Solovyov
        Millions are you. Us - darkness, and darkness, and darkness.
        Try, fight with us!
        Yes, maybe the Scythians are us! Yes, Asians are us
        With slanted and greedy eyes!

        For you - centuries, for us - a single hour.
        We are like obedient slaves
        Holding a shield between two hostile races
        Mongols and Europe!

        Century, century your old horn forged
        And drowned out the thunder of an avalanche
        And a wild fairy tale was a failure for you
        And Lisbon, and Messina!

        You have looked east for hundreds of years,
        Digging and melting our pearls
        And you, mocking, counted only the term,
        When to train cannon vents!

        Here - the time has come. Wings are beating trouble
        And every day resentment multiplies,
        And the day will come - there will be no trace
        From your Paestums, maybe!

        Oh, the old world! Until you perish,
        While you languish with sweet flour,
        Stop, wise as Oedipus,
        Before the Sphinx with an ancient mystery!

        Russia - Sphinx. Rejoicing and mourning
        And bleeding black blood,
        She looks, looks, looks at you,
        And with hatred, and with love! ..

        Yes, to love as much as our blood loves,
        None of you have loved for a long time!
        Forgot you, that in the world there is love,
        Which burns and kills!

        We love everything - and the heat of cold numbers,
        And the gift of divine visions,
        Everything is clear to us - and a sharp Gallic meaning,
        And the gloomy German genius ...

        We remember everything - hell streets of Paris,
        And the Venetian coolness,
        Lemon groves are a distant fragrance,
        And Cologne is smoky ...

        We love the flesh - both its taste and color,
        And the stuffy, mortal flesh smell ...
        Guilty if we crack your skeleton
        In the heavy, gentle paws?

        We used to get used to the bridle
        Playing horses zealous,
        Breaking horses with heavy sacra
        And pacify the slaves of the obstinate ...

        Come to us! From the horrors of war
        Come into peaceful embrace!
        Before it's too late - the old scabbard sword
        Comrades! We will become - brothers!

        And if not, we have nothing to lose,
        And we are not above treachery!
        Centuries, centuries - you will be cursed
        Sick later offspring!

        We are wide in the wilds and forests
        Before Europe, prigozhey
        Let's part! We will turn to you
        His Asian mug!

        Go all, go to the Urals!
        We clear the place of battle
        Steel machines, where the integral breathes,
        With the Mongolian wild horde!

        But we ourselves are no longer a shield for you now,
        From now on, we will not enter the battle ourselves,
        We'll see how the mortal battle is boiling,
        With his narrow eyes.

        We will not move when the ferocious Hun
        In the pockets of corpses will fumble,
        Burn the city, and drive the herd into the church,
        And fry the meat of white brothers! ..

        For the last time — come to your senses, old world!
        On the fraternal feast of work and peace,
        The last time for a bright fraternal feast
        Cries the barbaric lyre!
    2. Cynic
      Cynic 22 January 2014 17: 01
      +3
      Quote: Boris55
      - There are two questions on the agenda: the first - to shoot all those present and the second - to repaint the fence in green. Any questions?
      - Yes. Why green?
      - But this question, I propose to discuss ...

      If you retell something in your own words, then at least do not distort the meaning _
      I knew that there would be no questions on the first point!
    3. The comment was deleted.
  12. Scorpio
    Scorpio 22 January 2014 09: 37
    -8
    Both were Caucasians (representatives of the white race)


    some nonsense. Even on geographical maps, Tatars are people who are closer to the Turks than to the Europeans. Well, and the textbook of geography is also lying chtol now?
    1. Lapotnik
      Lapotnik 22 January 2014 10: 02
      0
      Why do you compare current cards with the affairs of days gone by? Take the cards of those times, there are not many of them, if it weren’t for the Internet to know about them at all, and watch, study.

      And then - the present Tatars have nothing to do with those referred to in the article.
      1. Scorpio
        Scorpio 22 January 2014 10: 47
        -6
        that is, Tatarstan and Kazan with the Tatars with whom the formidable fought have nothing to do? This is probably some kind of new race that arose from dust and settled in Tatarstan. Ok, I get it.
        1. v53993
          v53993 22 January 2014 18: 36
          -1
          Ok, I get it.

          You didn’t understand anything. Read the right books.
          1. Scorpio
            Scorpio 23 January 2014 10: 26
            -1
            Quote: v53993
            Read the right books.

            Exactly. before writing stupid articles, it’s better not to read and write books by scientists, but such a scientist would say this on the basis of this. And this ignoramus composes all sorts.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Cynic
      Cynic 22 January 2014 18: 34
      0
      Quote: Scorpio
      geography textbook also now lying chtol?

      All calendars lie!
  13. Tatanka Yotanka
    Tatanka Yotanka 22 January 2014 09: 37
    +11
    Students will also be told about the contribution of the first president of Tatarstan M. Shaimiev, etc.
    the most interesting proposal, about which contribution and where not reported, probably in their own independence, Wahhabi integration, etc.
  14. Orakyl
    Orakyl 22 January 2014 09: 38
    +9
    You need to understand that now we are not only fighting for history, but for the future of Russia. And once again we have no right to lose, because then everything else will already be meaningless. An open discussion of the textbook by all specialists is necessary, as well as an explanation of the reasons for this or that event. Only for God's sake, without liberals and foreign experts, who rewritten it a thousand times before, to please himself. To tell the story of Tartaria, the truth about the revolution, about Stalin, to explain the reasons. Perhaps the people have already ripened (woke up) to perceive a deeper truth described by Levashev. Personally, I, as a citizen of Russia, do not trust a narrow group of specialists, have already passed.
  15. S-200
    S-200 22 January 2014 09: 39
    +4
    History textbooks are always written to satisfy the existing socio-economic, political and religious structure of a state ...
    An impartial analysis of historical events and facts (non-religious, non-ethnic, non-ideological) should be the basis for writing a HISTORY textbook.
  16. Standard Oil
    Standard Oil 22 January 2014 09: 40
    +5
    To be honest, the USSR did not fight against "fascism" and the number of "fascists" killed by Soviet troops is equal to the number of Italian soldiers killed on the Eastern Front, and even then for sure not all were party members. I do not know who, when and why changed the word "Nazism" on "fascism." As for working with foreign historians, Putin famously said this, let the Soros Foundation write a textbook for us, or let "cooperate" help write history, I’ve got used to the principle that Putin is constantly lying, and now he also speaks nonsense, but in the end everything can be expected from a professional liar. And what does it mean, "There was no Yoke? Has he read Fomenko? Let him say that the Mongols were Russians and everything will be all right. I wonder what it would be the heroic defenders of Ryazan if they knew that some Putin and some vague "advice on history" would say that "There was no Yoke," that when the Mongols massacred the entire population of Ryazan in 1237, it was not " Yoke and invasion "and" Dependency ", I understand Moscow shehas always been a two-faced and deceitful principality and easily fell under the Mongols, for them, yes, it was "dependence", as the lackey depends on the owner. Why deny what is world-famous and recognized? You can call "Igo" "Dependency", as for a cancer patient can be called "oncology" "a mild cold" and self-complacency, stick his head in the sand and not see or hear anything.
  17. The comment was deleted.
    1. Black
      Black 22 January 2014 10: 28
      +2
      Something similar has already grown in your way, only inward ... crushing ...
    2. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 22 January 2014 12: 16
      +1
      Quote: Nitarius
      so you have something on your forehead that has grown in the form of a male body!

      No matter how something feminine has grown on your forehead. fool
  18. The comment was deleted.
    1. Gardamir
      Gardamir 22 January 2014 10: 37
      +4
      When the city of Leningrad was called, then it was not Lenin who built it. Something in history has long been confused, and the dates and names of cities. I come from the Kirov region, before Kirov was Vyatka, and even earlier Khlynov. Why was the city of Khlynov renamed to Vyatka? To call us Vyatichi, but then all mention of the Vyatichi tribe (which have nothing to do with the Kirov region) disappeared. And similar questions on the history of Russia are darkness.
  19. Volkhov
    Volkhov 22 January 2014 09: 47
    +2
    A real story is impossible for the authorities, it will immediately destroy their picture of the world and legitimacy - therefore, the story is attached to propaganda. The Soviet textbook is simply an older and simpler lie.
    If someone needs reality, he will have to create Anonerba himself, and after a while the security structures for the found Grail, then there will be a confrontation with the invaders, then you need to win the space war - the correct textbook costs about how much.
  20. vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 22 January 2014 09: 49
    +20
    Even when I was in school, I thought: why in the history of Russia there is no pre-Christian period, all peoples have, Russians do not. Strange vacuum. And only recently I understand that no one needed the history of Russia, and now does not need it. There are no programs for the study of pre-Christian Russia, no funds are allocated for historical research. Why? everything is just profitable to educate and conveniently lead those who in history have nothing to be proud of, savages and ignoramuses who can neither read nor write, who lived in a dugout, and walked in the shoes. That's all the Russians should know. Europe pulled Russia out of the wild community, because the Russians should always admire Europe, and do only what the Europeans do. For many years I have been pissed off by people from whom I can only hear, Ah America, Ah Germany, France, Japan. And all this despite the fact that the inventions and scientific discoveries of Russia either underestimate or steal, or even send them to the shelves in the archive. I’m wondering someday, there will come times when for the expression ah the American or German people will get in the face.
    1. Lapotnik
      Lapotnik 22 January 2014 10: 19
      +12
      have already arrived) At least to the point of hoarseness, I argue and swear about this with everyone) Unfortunately, the feeling of the closeness of Russians, a derogatory attitude to history and direct slavish admiration for geyrope with America is so hammered into the minds of the majority, that you can beat the figs. When you give arguments - figs believe, because you don’t understand who wrote it, "generally recognized" science says something else.

      It got to the point that when he described the life of peasants in comparison with European ones, and cited the notes and chronicles of the Europeans themselves who traveled around Russia - the question followed: why did they get that the peasant lived well in Russia? I say - so it’s written! No, this is his subjective point of view! I’m shocked, I say - what nonsense, according to other sources it is known that the peasants had farms with a honeycomb, which was not in Europe! Bullshit, it’s not historians who wrote, this is a subjective view, maybe he liked it, so he wrote ... And how to prove it? And most of these ...

      Or, it happened recently - about the impact on the opposition, the conversation came out - someone made a comment - so we get to the 37th year ... I was right there - and what was bad in the 37th? The answer is brilliant - but what's good? The conversation did not work, because apart from the emotions that it was bad no one could say anything. The prisoners didn’t even know the numbers - just like half the country in the camps. The result - embezzlers were planted, unfortunately they are not planting now ... And where is the pancake logic?
      1. takto.onotak
        takto.onotak 22 January 2014 15: 01
        +5
        I agree with you. You need to fight not only with id. garbage, but also with narrow-mindedness ... If there is culture and education, then identity itself will straighten out ...
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Genur
        Genur 22 January 2014 16: 57
        +2
        Quote: Lapotnik
        When you give arguments - FIG believe ... And where the hell is logic?

        Logic in that these zombies no logic.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. demel2
      demel2 22 January 2014 11: 22
      +2
      If the history textbook will write a narrow circle of experts and will sound in the context of the word political correctness and tolerance and also make their own corrections, for example, Tatar scientists, although I have nothing against the Tatars, such times will not come soon. IMHO.
    4. Genur
      Genur 22 January 2014 16: 51
      0
      Quote: vladsolo56
      I’m wondering someday, there will come times when for the expression ah the American or German people will get in the face.

      Here these "pluses" we give them in the face!
  21. RUSS
    RUSS 22 January 2014 09: 50
    +3
    Making amendments to the textbook on the History of Russia, on the absence of such a large-scale historical phenomenon as tat mongl.iga, will take a lot of time and unnecessary discus, the authorities need a new textbook today and, as has already been noted more than once, the textbook is politically correct. Let’s see it turns out to combine incompatible. The concept of the Great Russian Revolution is especially touching, such a mess from this, the teachers posed an interesting problem.
    1. Moore
      Moore 22 January 2014 10: 35
      +3
      Well, the French, for example, managed to (fully combine the incompatible) to the fullest. The Jacobin cannibals quite peacefully coexist on the same pages with the no less cannibalistic Directory, and Napoleon, in fact a usurper and a murderer of the same Duke of Engiensky (about the fact that half of the European part of RI was ruined, keep quiet) is generally a national hero.
      In France, it would never occur to anyone to consider their story flawed and deserving of condemnation because of the same Great (with a capital letter) French Revolution with its cute episodes such as drowning in the blood of Vendée: http://chessglum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic. php? f = 25 & t = 778
      Why? I suppose because the liberal kitchen gorlopans (and where without them?) Are put in their rightful place - the kitchen, and statesmen are engaged in ideological issues in history.
  22. Neophyte
    Neophyte 22 January 2014 09: 55
    +2
    It is necessary to clarify the origin of the word - Tatars. There was a certain tribe of Tatars who fiercely resisted the expansion of the Mongol conquerors. All who were above the wheel hub were cut out.
    Since then, the Mongols have called the Tatars the Bugars, who also resisted the Mongols. So, the current nationalists of Tatarstan are absolutely wrong.
  23. Sharingan
    Sharingan 22 January 2014 09: 56
    +2
    They have already stuck to this "Mongol-Tatar yoke". This is one of the indicators of Great Russian chauvenism: to call many of the peoples of the south Tatars, and then defend this "nickname" with foam at the mouth. At the same time, forgetting about how the "great" Russian princes went to bow to the khans, weaved intrigues, betrayed and killed each other for a shortcut to reign. And also forgetting about the Russian guards of the Mongolian guard, etc.
    The story must be true, not correct. And the truth is that the yoke was held not only by the Mongols and "Tatars", but also by a large number of other nationalities, including the Slavs. Therefore, it is historically correct to call the yoke of the Golden Horde.
    But our cheers patriots do not care for the truth.
    1. Lapotnik
      Lapotnik 22 January 2014 10: 25
      +2
      Here is more detailed. Who, whom and for what held.

      Mongolian Guard ?? This is something new. You are not confused with the modern case?

      Including the Slavs ... well, no. The Slavs are the foundation, and the rest can be included.


      PS Vinaigrette is your favorite dish?
      1. Sharingan
        Sharingan 22 January 2014 10: 49
        -2
        Quote: Lapotnik
        Here is more detailed. Who, whom and for what held.

        What do you mean?

        Quote: Lapotnik
        Mongolian Guard ?? This is something new. You are not confused with the modern case?

        Keshik, keshik (from Turkic kazik - “turn”, “change”) - the personal guard of the great khans (kaans) of the Mongolian state, established by Genghis Khan. Founded as a guardian of the khan’s headquarters, the guard also acquired the importance of an elite unit of the Mongolian army, as well as an important link in government, being, in fact, the main pillar of the khan’s power.

        Quote: Lapotnik
        The Slavs are the foundation, and the rest can be included.

        O_o. The first time I hear that the Slavs are the foundation of the Golden Horde. What are you talking about, my friend?

        Well, I do not comment on rudeness :)
        1. Lapotnik
          Lapotnik 22 January 2014 11: 25
          +3
          Rudeness? where did you see rudeness? They knocked everything and everything into a bunch. I have long understood - you are a supporter of official history. Do you support the Norman origin of the Slavs?

          It is strange that you have not heard that the Slavs are the foundation of the Golden Horde. This is just the main version, as opposed to official history, which is very widely discussed.

          Quote from the article:

          "There were no" Mongols "on the territory of Russia and Eastern Europe. There are no anthropological, genetic and cultural traces of the" Mongols "(Mongoloids). Russian researchers have already smashed the concept of the conquest of Russia by the" Mongols ", who arrived on their horses from Mongolia. And before that, semi-savage shepherds allegedly destroyed China, Khorezm and many other powerful states. This issue is discussed in more detail in a series of articles Russian land before the Batu invasion. The problem of the "Mongol" invasion of Russia. "

          That's how it was - the Mongols did not have written language, they did not conquer anyone, did not even have statehood, and they had a guard.

          It’s also interesting to think about who the khans, riches, etc. are. etc. Especially about Genghis Khan. Many interesting things, including among recognized historians.

          In principle, the dispute does not make sense here, since the opponent knows only one version.

          Substation Keshik, keshik (from Türkic kesik - “turn”, “shift”). The source from the wiki is strong. And here are the words individually:

          Gut is a mixture of wheat, kefir and spices. It is prepared in almost all Arab countries, as well as in Iran and Turkey.

          Separately, KEshik did not find (only on the wiki).

          Kasik ... well, it’s even become scary - it’s important only in the Kazakh wiki, I didn’t begin to read and conduct ... but offhand - a dung?
          1. takto.onotak
            takto.onotak 22 January 2014 15: 07
            +1
            Comrade Comrade is very interested in this matter. A. Fomenko hypothesizes (I highly recommend that you familiarize yourself)
        2. The comment was deleted.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  24. Sergey Medvedev
    Sergey Medvedev 22 January 2014 10: 03
    +5
    I also disagree with the term "yoke" (slavery). It would be more correct to call this period in our history "the two hundred year war".
    1. Black
      Black 22 January 2014 10: 34
      +5
      Quote: Sergei Medvedev
      it would be more correct to call it the "two hundred year war".

      bicentennial civil...
      1. Scorpio
        Scorpio 22 January 2014 10: 58
        0
        then even longer, and before the yoke we successfully fought with each other. It’s just that with the advent of the Tatar-Mongols, a common enemy appeared and a common goal to give them in the cabbage soup.
      2. yehat
        yehat 22 January 2014 11: 51
        0
        and then there were citizens?
      3. The comment was deleted.
  25. shelva
    shelva 22 January 2014 10: 12
    +4
    I do not agree with the definition of "ideological rubbish" - often it is a specially added ideological poison. And no matter at what time of Russian history it was added - its goal is the same - belittling Russia, belittling its merits in the general civilizational development.
    History and ideology - things are different (should be). Imagine ideological archeology - one of the main historical disciplines - it will be pseudoscience. Or ideological mathematics ...
    1. shapkin14
      shapkin14 22 January 2014 16: 08
      0
      All right!
      I do not agree with the "general civilizational development" - we are completely different civilizations.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  26. Black
    Black 22 January 2014 10: 24
    +4
    We are talking about particulars ......
    The main thing is that there will be no textbook in the foundation of which will be the greatness of the history of Slavism, Russia, Tartaria! There will be no textbook in which the greatness of the USSR of the period 30-70 years of the XX century will be absolute.
    This textbook was not even in Soviet times. For the sake of the nationalities, we are distorting our history, the historical code of the Russian people is being washed out.
    And now another monster with "alternative" assessments will appear, a scribble based on Russophobia.
    1. old rocket man
      old rocket man 22 January 2014 19: 45
      +2
      Quote: Chen
      The main thing is that there will be no textbook in the foundation of which will be the greatness of the history of Slavism, Russia, Tartaria! There will be no textbook in which the greatness of the USSR of the period 30-70 years of the XX century will be absolute.
      This textbook was not even in Soviet times. For the sake of the nationalities, we are distorting our history, the historical code of the Russian people is being washed out.
      And now another monster with "alternative" assessments will appear, a scribble based on Russophobia.


      It’s sad to realize this, but for some reason I have the conviction that it will be so
  27. Atash
    Atash 22 January 2014 10: 32
    +1
    Standard

    In addition to Ryazan, a bunch of other cities calmly reached an agreement with Batu without any patriotic complexes, which could not be: there was not a single people, not a single state for such feelings. The war went on among its own and with its own. Explain why they did not touch the richest Smolensk, while fighting in Poland, the Czech Republic and Croatia. The city was its own.
    1. Scorpio
      Scorpio 22 January 2014 11: 01
      -5
      Own? That is, it is Smolensk who cut out half of Russia, stole slavery in the steppe, and then went to rob Europe? You will probably say that these aliens helped them, but I still believe you.
  28. creak
    creak 22 January 2014 10: 43
    +2
    [quote = Tatanka Yotanka]Students will also be told about the contribution of the first president of Tatarstan M. Shaimiev, etc.

    Well, just the same Peter 1, the same large-scale figure, it is necessary to convey to the descendants information about the historical achievements of Shaimiev ...
    And in order for this insanity with political correctness to acquire a complete form, it would be necessary to supplement the proposed formulation: "Dependence on the Golden Horde" with a phrase - "resulting from the introduction of a limited contingent of troops of this Horde to Russia."
    1. Scorpio
      Scorpio 22 January 2014 11: 03
      0
      Quote: ranger
      : "Dependence on the Golden Horde" by the phrase - "resulting from the introduction of a limited contingent of troops of this Horde to Russia."

      laughing
    2. yehat
      yehat 22 January 2014 11: 53
      0
      performing his international duty: D
    3. The comment was deleted.
  29. Atash
    Atash 22 January 2014 10: 45
    +1
    If you remove all the lies from history, there will not necessarily be one truth; it may turn out that nothing remains. Said back in the 19th century. And he so simply wants to establish the truth once and for all. Theoretically, historical truth can be established through a normal court. Will power be needed, or even society, is truth? The courts will also need to be created, which already looks utopian.
  30. butch
    butch 22 January 2014 10: 59
    -1
    Beauty will save the world
  31. demel2
    demel2 22 January 2014 11: 03
    +2
    What kind of conception of the history textbook are we talking about if there are the concepts of tolerance and political correctness, if the Tatars make their own corrections, then why it is impossible to correct Russian history, for example, to the Chukchi or other peoples living in Russia, we are all the same. a new textbook if everyone is not too lazy to make their own corrections. Wasserman with his concept of a textbook is, as always, on top.
  32. alex-s
    alex-s 22 January 2014 11: 04
    +2
    Is it really impossible to find out once and for all what was and when! And when we find out - you need to pass a law that if someone distort our history, then he will sit for treason!
  33. Jurkovs
    Jurkovs 22 January 2014 11: 08
    +2
    Of course, history cannot be distorted, but the author was also not worth taking absolutely incomprehensible and alien concepts from the ceiling. This is also a distortion of history.
  34. Mviktor
    Mviktor 22 January 2014 11: 14
    0
    throw away all the "ideological garbage" that littered history.

    Ideological garbage (social parasites) at least send to their historical homeland. Let this nest of snakes and reptiles bite themselves, but it will be easier for Arabs to clear the ball
  35. siberalt
    siberalt 22 January 2014 11: 17
    +5
    Quote: Luzhichanin
    Recently there was an article on VO where one of the visitors posted a video showing the president’s attitude to the Battle of Kulikovo, I don’t know how much it changes in time ...

    The Kulikovo field has been plowed up and down many times. But there are no signs of fighting there. Simply no. And the field in size and landscape somehow does not correspond to that described in the "re-sources". The Kalka River also "evaporated" without a trace. This is different. There are actual burial sites (busty graves). With temples and chapels, as expected. At least in the same Moscow on Kulichki. But "historians" do not allow researchers to go there. Nope and that's it! Otherwise, how would history not be rewritten. Where then are the Mongols to go? All lies will climb out like ... out of the toilet.
    1. Scorpio
      Scorpio 22 January 2014 11: 26
      -5
      Everything and your whole life lies to you. There were no cripples, the Battle of Kulikovo, the Lake of Chud, Napoleon and Hitler. You are in the matrix.
  36. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 22 January 2014 11: 21
    +7
    The Russian (Slavic) concept of history should be yesterday. Western historians are climbing out of their skin to show Western civilization in a favorable light, educating the youth of the West in the right direction. At the same time, they do not shun the distortions of facts and direct falsifications, for the sake of their momentary political benefits. The Russian concept should be honest, open and fair. Studying the story our young generation must respect the country's past and get ready to protect her in the future.
  37. demel2
    demel2 22 January 2014 11: 51
    +4
    And yes, and those who, over the past 25 years, have been littering and perverting our history and the consciousness of our children, according to the president, as I understand it, live and flourish unless they deserve punishment wherever they looked at the council on pseudoscience at the Russian Academy of Sciences.
  38. kirgudu
    kirgudu 22 January 2014 11: 54
    +3
    Only in the new textbook is there no Great October Socialist Revolution. But there is simply a revolution in which the bourgeois February and the socialist October were mixed. At the same time, the leading role is highlighted in February.

    Here it is, it turned out, Mikhalych.
  39. Diviz
    Diviz 22 January 2014 11: 56
    +2
    People must be destroyed by greed and a dead end branch of development. The confrontation of 2 civilizations helps these branches of development survive. The result is a multipolar world. As a result, we have how many nations have so many stories. From this it is concluded that Slavic history is for Slavs only. History is intertwined with culture, technology, etc. therefore, it is not necessary to divulge the secrets of victories. If we have already given and are giving away part of the land to other nations, then we need to look for new territory in Siberia for the construction of new cities. And do not run away as before to Australia or China or America to England.
  40. 1536
    1536 22 January 2014 12: 24
    +1
    One thing must be understood: there is history as a science with its own scientific apparatus, research methods and the struggle of ideas and opinions, and there is "history" as an ideological concept of the ruling circles of the state. These are two big differences and mixing them is almost impossible and rarely happens. Why? Due to the fact that historical science is based on the study of documentary and material facts left to us by our ancestors, found in archives and archaeological expeditions. And these facts can be interpreted in different ways. There are sections of history in which the debate about "how it was" will never end. But this is interesting for a narrow circle of specialists. And ideology is based on completely different principles. You cannot study ideology, you have to follow it like an order from above. You must love your homeland, your country, your people. And for this it is not necessary to emphasize negative facts, as many "writers" and "scientists" do in our country from a small mind or by personal calculation. As one great Russian writer said: "Truth is good, but happiness is better." The summary is: do not give any "controversial" topics in the textbook. Everything should be clear and understandable. Ryazan was burned by Batu in 1236. Yes, it was. Batu was the leader of one of the tribes that roamed the steppe with which Russia bordered, a kind of field commander, "bad", in general, a man. But Ryazan was revived by the labor of our people and today it stands as it did - this is the main thing. And Batu can also be understood, he wanted his people to eat their fill. Such is the story.
  41. The comment was deleted.
  42. lobik
    lobik 22 January 2014 12: 44
    0
    Maybe they taught me wrong at school, but the Tatars are Mongoloids, and the Turks are Europeans. And according to old maps, Tartaria (as many consider Tataria), there is an opinion that they called the kingdom of the dead, i.e., the dead kingdom or uninhabited lands. there seems to be nothing there (no cities and fortresses, no monetary unit, empire of nomads in yurts?)
  43. Svobodny
    Svobodny 22 January 2014 12: 55
    +2
    Battle of history. On the need to introduce the Russian (Slavic) concept of history


    With whom the battle is, let me ask as a patriot patriot. If the battle with pseudo-historians - rooster, pro-shame and other neopagan pseudoscientific evil spirits, then I am ready to join the battle.
  44. Alex_Popovson
    Alex_Popovson 22 January 2014 13: 00
    +2
    About Hospadi. Why discuss something here? To return the Soviet history textbooks of the 70s and add to them the history of the 90-20s, without any ideologies, simply and briefly by date.
  45. lobik
    lobik 22 January 2014 13: 21
    0
    Yes, we are not the first to win these battles, and so the whole history of pre-Christian Russia has sunk into oblivion.
  46. Ross
    Ross 22 January 2014 13: 24
    +4
    Quote: Max_Bauder
    When Batu conquered Russia, there were cities that helped, and there were those who were against it. And this thesis about the Scythians as if there was a single empire, with the capital in the barn and then in Moscow, is it funny, is this not amateurism? Do you distinguish Russian from Mongol appearance? Russians descended from the Slavs, who lived northeast of Byzantium, converted to Christianity, took their names, and then were reborn into a powerful state in the 10 or 11 century, this sounds true. Then he joined neighboring countries.

    There was no united empire since ancient times. peoples lived side by side, which were different and are different now.

    Read the book by academician Klesov with his study of the haplotype of the Slavs R1a, 20000 years ago, the ancestor of the Slavs created civilization in Siberia, from where he populated Europe and Asia. Our today's haplotype with the last mutation arose 4900 years ago and its homeland is Arkaim, southern Urals. From there, he migrated to India and Iran, as well as to the territory of today's eastern Europe and Russia. What are the Turks and the Mongols? One and the same haplotype, one people. Huns, whether Dinlini, the same haplotype.
    1. nerd.su
      nerd.su 23 January 2014 01: 56
      -1
      Quote: Ross
      Read the book by academician Klesov with his study of the haplotype of the Slavs R1a, 20000 years ago, the ancestor of the Slavs created civilization in Siberia, from where he populated Europe and Asia.

      If a scientific hypothesis is true, it should be easy to understand and present. Don't try to use the authority of the word "academic". Educate the public about what a haploroup is? What is haplogroup R1a and why is it Slavic and not Lithuanian? And if the Huns have the same haplogroup, why is it Slavic and not "Huns"? By the way, are there any traces of a serious civilization in Arkaim? So serious that it is clear that from there people went to Iran, and not vice versa?
      1. Cynic
        Cynic 23 January 2014 16: 04
        0
        Quote: bot.su
        Enlighten the public, what is a haplogroup? What ...

        The argument is not for discussion on an online forum.
        Seek and find ye!
        .
        1. Basileus
          Basileus 23 January 2014 16: 47
          -1
          Nevertheless. The questions are correct, and Ross's sketch is just a sketch. Why sketch? Because the "Slavic" haplogroup turns out to be not only Slavic, but also a fairly large group of Iranians, as well as Turks who came to the Iranian substratum. That is why the "ancestor of the Slavs" sounds like it is correct, but in fact it is a substitution of concepts, because the carrier of R1a can also be called the ancestor of other Indo-Europeans, and after the emergence of the Turkic Kaganate - and a large number of Turks.
        2. nerd.su
          nerd.su 23 January 2014 16: 56
          0
          Quote: Cynic
          Seek and find ye!

          So I searched. That's why I ask. If you answer these questions simply, without unnecessary terminology, then the ravings of Academician Klesov scatter in the sand. Klyosov, by the way, is a chemist, not a geneticist, or at least a biologist. That’s the whole misfortune of our state that mathematicians do not do mathematics, and chemists do not chemistry. That's why the mess. First in the head, then in the country!
          1. Cynic
            Cynic 23 January 2014 17: 41
            +1
            Quote: bot.su
            So I searched. That's why I ask.

            Hmm _
            Quote: Ross
            Dear Botan. There is no room here to explain the male Y chromosome, which has not been changed for millennia in males. A haplotype is a genome code that is unique to all of us. Search search engines. Be sure to read A.A. Klesov, a professor at the Harvard University in the USA, the world's leading specialist in DNA genialology, our fellow countryman. The book is called: The Origin of the Slavs. DNA genialogy versus "Norman theory".

            Something is wrong in the "Danish kingdom"
            And which of you dear wattle can not come out of the shade?
  47. ars_pro
    ars_pro 22 January 2014 13: 58
    +1
    Developed by my good friends, a training manual on the history of the Cossacks in twelve volumes for cadet schools and corps, about each of the Cossack troops in Russia. Where a complete reference is made to both historical documents and the conduct of wars over years and dates, I consider this work important and necessary. Author Sazonov A.A. famous researcher of the history of Russia (Rus) and ancient civilizations
  48. dmb
    dmb 22 January 2014 14: 21
    +2
    The last paragraph of the article about the Soviet textbook is interesting. That's just what Wasserman was going to "clean" him from, I don't quite understand? Either he proposes not to mention Marx and Lenin at all, or is he going to register there that they were Jews and the main goal of their lives was "the extermination of the Orthodox people." In the latter case, the approval of such a textbook by Svanidze, Abramovich and Chubais is guaranteed. Or maybe it is not necessary to indicate in it that Kolchak and Denikin, Wrangel and Yudenich, possessing brilliant theoretical and practical training, were nevertheless beaten on all fronts. Or we will modestly keep silent that the revolution was caused not so much by the "intrigues of the Freemasons" as by the mediocrity of the authorities and the poverty of the bulk of the population. By the way, I wonder what textbook suggests taking Wasserman as a basis, not a case of the Gorbachev period? Undoubtedly, Soviet textbooks were ideologized to a certain extent, just like textbooks of any country and any era. But they reflected the history of our country more or less correctly, within the framework of the concept of a single state. And there was much more patriotic education in them than in the currently discussed version. Indeed, if the current concept develops, the Russian Orthodox Church should at least exclude A. Nevsky and D. Donskoy from among the saints, the Kulikovo Field memorial must be demolished. There is a lot more you can do, especially if you listen to everyone at once.
    1. Irokez
      Irokez 23 January 2014 23: 03
      0
      As well, Cyril and Mythodius will not be the inventors of Russian writing.
      But if you leave them alone, then admit that at that time they simplified the Russian language to a more understandable Europeans who have poorer languages ​​than Old Slavonic.
  49. kapustinmax
    kapustinmax 22 January 2014 14: 22
    +1
    The president acted on the principle of "both ours and yours." And so he does quite often. On the one hand, Vladimir Putin is right: all attempts to distort the history of Russia must be strictly suppressed. The historical (chronological) priority of managing society is one of the highest. With the help of history, it is possible to educate entire generations of “Ivanes who do not remember kinship”, to “transcode” the matrix of entire branches of a single superethnos of Russians. As already reprogrammed a significant part of the Rus (Russians) of Little Russia (Ukraine). Several centuries of “cultural cooperation” and the information war waged by the Vatican, Austria-Hungary, Germany, Poland and the Anglo-Saxons led to the creation of the “Ukrainian people”. The current events in Kiev are one of the consequences of this process. It is impossible to allow the geopolitical adversary to “work” with the population, to instill in him alien values, distorted knowledge.

    TOLD EVERYTHING CLEAR AND UNDERSTANDING - ADD NOTHING !!!

    Putin is completely right in the fact that the role of the Soviet people and the USSR in the Second World War cannot be belittled. - CAPITAL TRUTH !!!

    On the other hand, doubt about the words "ideological garbage." If the liberal nonsense of the sample of the 1990-2000s is removed in the new textbook of Russian history - excellent. Indeed, almost all “ideological rubbish” was introduced into history books during the existence of the Russian Federation, partly during the years of “perestroika”. It was during this period that Russia was subtly destroyed by information, ideological and historical weapons.

    AGAIN ON THE POINT !!!

    After all, the Soviet project is the model that modern Russia should strive for. It is clear that the USSR was not an ideal state, but this has never happened on the planet. Man and human society are subjective in nature. But it was the Stalinist USSR that gave all mankind hope for a different future than that which the "architects" of the West and their clients are building on the periphery of the "developed world."

    SO

    Indeed, a unified textbook of Russian history is needed, which can educate young people as patriots of Russia. Only a single ideology and history can make a nation strong, able to withstand external and internal threats. There should not be any confusion and reeling. History should instill a sense of national pride.

    Reasoning about the need for “teamwork” with foreign colleagues is stupidity and a strategic mistake. Historical science in the West, and indeed in the East, always carries out an ideological order. The method of "cultural cooperation" is a way of "information capture" of a foreign territory. At the same time, the Western "partners" carry out a kind of recruitment of Russian scientists. Traveling abroad, conferences, grants, awards, publications, popularity - these are “carrots”. A part of Russian scientists is included in a kind of “mafia”, which exercises control of the population through the introduction of false historical concepts. They introduce ideas about Russia's “secondary nature” in relation to European civilization, constant borrowing, the need to repent for the “historical crimes” of the Russian (Soviet) colonialists, Ivan the Terrible, Peter the Great, Catherine II, Stalin and other Russian emperors and statesmen, generals. Therefore, "foreign colleagues" in a cannon shot should not be allowed into Russian history.

    RESULTS - A BEAUTIFUL ARTICLE - TO THE AUTHOR 5 +++++++++++++++ - MORE THAN INFA IN MASMULTIMEDIA !!!
  50. Basileus
    Basileus 22 January 2014 14: 31
    +1
    It all began for health, and ended with pseudo-historical nonsense about the geopolitical and geopolitics of the XII century. Article minus.
    1. romb
      romb 22 January 2014 14: 49
      0
      Is it worth it to be surprised? This kind of article only makes me smile. Let your pride amuse yourself with imaginary medieval grandeur!
      1. Basileus
        Basileus 22 January 2014 15: 04
        +1
        I don’t understand this approach at all. Coming up with a story is like going to a plastic surgeon. Your nose will be corrected, but you will no longer be what you were. You have to live today and make sure that you can be proud of your deeds, and not come up with fairy tales about past greatness, getting a beggarly salary and each time agreeing to any measures of the authorities, which are trying to annoy even more.

        So here, the number of comments about all sorts of Hyperboreans and ancient Slavic civilizations, the historical knowledge of the authors of which are gathered only from the tabloid books of the next author who traveled, is simply amazing. Normal historical literature, in contrast to the aforementioned nonsense, is based on facts and proven methods of historical research. Unfortunately, the sweet nonsense about the greatness of the ancient Rus is much more pleasant sometimes bitter, but more or less true history of our country.
        1. romb
          romb 22 January 2014 15: 30
          +1
          It seems to me that articles of this kind do not appear out of the blue. I do not exclude that behind the shaft of such "information" there may be a desire of individual subjects to correct entire historical periods, thereby turning a frivolous hypothesis into a legislatively enshrined fact at the state level. If earlier, when he began to read an article about the Arians or Hyperboreans, the author immediately pointed out that he in no way claims to be the ultimate truth, and the information he presented is only the fruit of his personal fantasy regarding a hypothetically possible scenario for the development of historical events. Now, this very fantasy, for some reason, begins to transform into an iron-proven fact, which was so carefully hidden by the enemies of the people and the state. I'm afraid, but it seems to me that such manipulations do not end well. Well, at least for some comrades, the roof is clearly beginning to slide down against the background of these semi-delusional tales.
          1. nerd.su
            nerd.su 23 January 2014 17: 16
            0
            Quote: romb
            It seems to me that articles of this kind do not appear out of the blue. I do not exclude that behind the shaft of such "information" there may be a desire of individual subjects to correct entire historical periods, thereby turning a frivolous hypothesis into a legislatively enshrined fact at the state level.

            Yes, there are not just individual subjects. There are whole groups of subjects. Here is a quote from the article:
            Further it will be possible to improve the history textbook due to refinements based on recent discoveries. And for this Russia needs an analogue of the German Ancestral Heritagebut without mystical and occult nonsense.

            A. Samsonov has been representing the National Socialists for a long time and consistently. And people cling to such "former greatness" because they are tired of the liberal mourners with their lamentations, throwing mud at our history. The people need a simple and understandable story, not watered with crap.
            But she doesn’t want to study. Is that bad.
        2. Irokez
          Irokez 23 January 2014 23: 20
          -1
          In many ways I do not agree with you.
          Without knowing the past, history and values ​​with the customs of the ancestors, you simply get lost in the future and the line of movement in the historical line of development disappears.
          I already described an example of how, let’s say, neoliberals determined from some old found manuscripts which copies from the originals (the originals disappeared naturally on fire as always) established that the peoples of the twentieth country were engaged in gangbang blue-rose entertainment in the form of satisfactions at the law level and now they are neoliberals with full moral right can legislate a law to legalize these perversions in the law of this twentieth country. And here is the connection of the past, present and future.
          I mean, in no case should you forget the past, the legacy that your ancestors left for you and you need to keep it and dig further so that a complete picture of what is happening now and what will happen in the future emerges and this can be seen along the entire historical chain starting from the past. And to live in the present day is just the consumer, the stupid way of life of animals which the shepherds feed like a herd, but the shepherds know a lot of things, but are in no hurry to share information (very unprofitable from all points of view).
          Each nation has its pluses and minuses in history, but for some reason the Slavs have more minuses in official history, while tolerant and civilized ones have pluses.