Military Review

Do we need allies in Gastarbeiterstan?

250
The reason for writing this article was a note I read on "Lenta.ru": "The guest workers offered to unite Central Asia." In short, the essence of the note is that the aforementioned chairman of the Russian movement “Tajik labor migrants”, Karomat Sharipov, has repeatedly initiated the unification of all the countries of the Central Asian region into a single political entity. Well, this comrade sent the corresponding statement to the heads of Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan.


Actually, there is nothing reprehensible in the idea of ​​unification - who, if not us, is not aware of this. But it was precisely the language used by Mr. Sharipov that strained me. I will give a few quotes.

"Central Asia has long been" the object of the claims of the world powers "and that fragmentation among the peoples inhabiting this region"allowed foreigners to devastate our grace-filled lands and dominate the Central Asian people "".

As for the claims, of course, it is true - Central Asia has long been a place where the interests of the powerful are intermingled. But it seems to me alone that lengthy arguments about aliens are directed exclusively against Russia? After all, only we were able to gain a foothold in this region for a long time - and also to develop it for a long time. But in response, we receive only claims ...

Further more.

Therefore, in order for the peoples of Central Asia not to be burned in the hellfire of the “cauldron of ethnic contradictions,” I believe that the time has come implement the idea of ​​the nationalists 20-ies of XX century "about the unification of different peoples of Central Asia into a single political unit," the leader of the movement sums up. - In this case, there will be a common regional interest and the Central Asian peoples will become less vulnerable.

"The appeal also notes that the mobilizing factor for unification is the common religion - Islam."

So, taking as an example “the 20 nationalists of the 20th century” - that is, all those Basmachs, Beks and Khans, whom the Red Banner of the Cheka long drove through the dunes, Mr. Sharipov proposes to unite on the basis of Islam. And here I have a question - which one Islam? Against the background of the flowering of all radical movements - from Wahhabis to Salafis - something tells me: not at all traditional.

And now, actually, why I started all this scribbling. Like any normal Russian person, I want my country to be strong. And protected. Both in terms of military and economic. So, the idea of ​​the Eurasian Union is, to a certain extent, positive.

But ... Hand on heart, without any thoughts about xenophobia, I don’t want to live in the same state with people like Sharipov who follow the path of the Baltic states: claims, hatred, demands.

But there are a lot of them, if not most. The parochial nationalism there blooms and smells - even from Gorbachev, who gave him the "green light". And sooner or later, these people will come to power - after all, the Soviet generation, those with whom you can still deal, leaves. And what will happen when the Nazis with a taste of "true" Islam on their lips will stand at the helm?

And here I am again at a dead end. Central Asia is a strategic region for us. Like Ukraine. If you go away from there, others will immediately come - the States (they are already there, but on a temporary basis), China (he is already "squeezing" the land of Tajikistan), Iran. And there is a crowd of armed bearded men in Afghanistan ...

So I want to ask - what do you think, gentlemen-comrades? It turned out, of course, somewhat messy, but as it is.
Author:
Photos used:
http://lenta.ru
250 comments
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  1. VirtusEtHonor
    VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 08: 16
    +14
    Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all, you can unite with the Tajiks and leave us alone.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. GreatRussia
      GreatRussia 16 January 2014 08: 22
      +24
      Do we need allies in Gastarbeiterstan?


      Russia has only two allies: army and navy.
      Alexander III
      1. Gardamir
        Gardamir 16 January 2014 08: 40
        -13%
        In the time of Alexander III, maybe. But now industry and agriculture are more important. Everything we use is made in China. China and the khan will be "offended" by us, no shells, no uniforms. And Tajiks will be offended, there will be no one to clean up the garbage in the cities, because Russians are not allowed to do this.
        1. sledgehammer102
          sledgehammer102 16 January 2014 09: 02
          +2
          Quote: VirtusEtHonor
          Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all, you can unite with the Tajiks and leave us alone.


          Exactly. Thats exactly what I mean. I very much hesitate that in addition to the Kyrgyz and Tajiks, someone out there wants to unite.

          This is the law of life. The weak try to find support among the strong, while covering their outstretched hand with words about brotherhood and mutuallyassistance (although there will be a one-goal game). Simply put, the author of this theory of unification terribly wanted dough those who have it, namely the Kazakhs and the Russian Federation.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. kirk82
              kirk82 16 January 2014 13: 58
              0
              Are Uzbeks easy to adjust? That is, polishers?
            2. Cherdak
              Cherdak 16 January 2014 17: 29
              0
              Quote: Vasya
              Kyrgyz are stupid and willful. Tajiks are dumb, but executive. Uzbeks are working, capable of learning, but not independent. Turkmens are good warriors.


              What about these?
          2. VirtusEtHonor
            VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 15: 06
            +1
            the author of this theory simply went too far or smoked too much. Kazakhs will never be friends with those that in history have only brought pain and suffering. For me, Uzbeks and Turkmens will remain enemies, blood enemies.
          3. alone
            alone 16 January 2014 20: 04
            +3
            Quote: sledgehammer102
            Exactly. Thats exactly what I mean. I very much hesitate that in addition to the Kyrgyz and Tajiks, someone out there wants to unite.


            what The latest events on the border of Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan are just the opposite. The region is too difficult. And the union of the republics into one whole is impossible.
            Who wants to lose control over their country? -None. Which of the local leaders will do this? -None. Yes, and the relationship between the republics as a whole suggests that the one who proposed this is not friends.
          4. smersh70
            smersh70 19 January 2014 00: 59
            0
            Quote: sledgehammer102
            The weak try to find support among the strong, while covering their outstretched hand with words about brotherhood and mutual assistance (although there will be a one-goal game)

            some words! I agree. the truth add here a couple of members of the Collective Security Treaty Organization, just do the class)))
        2. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 09: 06
          0
          I’m not the only one to notice this :)))) THAT this quote is a little outdated
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 16 January 2014 09: 31
            +1
            Quote: T80UM1
            I’m not the only one to notice this :)))) THAT this quote is a little outdated


            The last Great War showed that this quote is not out of date.
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 10: 01
              +6
              That is, only the army and navy won the Second World War? Neither industry, nor CX, nor diplomacy?
              1. RUSS
                RUSS 16 January 2014 10: 13
                +1
                Quote: T80UM1
                That is, only the army and navy won the Second World War? Neither industry, nor CX, nor diplomacy?


                The quote is not about resources and diplomacy, but about allies
              2. yur
                yur 16 January 2014 20: 05
                +2
                But without an army and navy in a war it is impossible to defeat a priori. The Netherlands has excellent industry and agriculture, but whether modern Holland is able to win any war is a BIG question.
            2. Gardamir
              Gardamir 16 January 2014 11: 27
              +5
              it was industry that built the tanks and machine tools on which these tanks were made, and it would be difficult for a soldier without bread. Then it was not China, everything was Soviet native.
            3. matross
              matross 16 January 2014 11: 45
              +1
              Quote: RUSS
              The last Great War showed that this quote is not out of date.

              Yeah? We had no allies in her? Or did their participation not play a role?
              1. RUSS
                RUSS 16 January 2014 12: 42
                +2
                Quote: matRoss
                Quote: RUSS
                The last Great War showed that this quote is not out of date.

                Yeah? We had no allies in her? Or did their participation not play a role?


                Well, if you consider the US allies with their lend-lease and "with a timely 2nd front"? Maybe this is so, but do not forget "from where the wind was blowing" (causes and consequences of the war, populism and incitement), and that in the 45th year the USA had a plan for nuclear bombing of the USSR
                1. matross
                  matross 16 January 2014 16: 32
                  +1
                  The USA and Great Britain were, of course, our forced allies and pursued their own goals, which they achieved. Well, about "we could do it ourselves," a moot point, but a long dispute ...
                  1. yur
                    yur 16 January 2014 20: 21
                    +2
                    We would have coped with even more blood of our fathers and grandfathers (ETERNAL MEMORY AND GLORY TO THEM!), But we would have coped. On the other hand, it seems to me that the threat from Western Europe (no NATO, no provocations, no gay pride parades) would be closed for centuries. This is what prompted the "allies" to enter the war, and not concern for Russia.
        3. Gardamir
          Gardamir 16 January 2014 11: 34
          +1
          It is understandable why the factories are closed and quinoa "spikes" in the fields. Since so many people have nominated. And I still insist that now allies are the worker and the farmer. Or maybe someone thinks to organize the delivery of pizza and shawarma to the battlefields.
          1. washi
            washi 16 January 2014 12: 55
            +2
            Quote: Gardamir
            It is understandable why the factories are closed and quinoa "spikes" in the fields. Since so many people have nominated. And I still insist that now allies are the worker and the farmer. Or maybe someone thinks to organize the delivery of pizza and shawarma to the battlefields.

            And you, by chance, not Bukhara?
            Abstracts coincide
            1. Gardamir
              Gardamir 16 January 2014 16: 11
              +2
              I am for a strong state, without a liberal infection. If thesis. strong production, developed agriculture, education, social guarantees, of course, a powerful army. Moving forward, it's time to build electric cars ...
        4. Nagaibak
          Nagaibak 16 January 2014 11: 51
          +5
          "Gardamir" "China and the khan will be offended by us, no shells, no uniforms."
          I will tell you a military secret - Russia produces shells itself.
          1. Gardamir
            Gardamir 16 January 2014 13: 00
            +6
            Shells say. Yes, here I do not argue. But look, screws, bolts. nuts where tea production is from. But now it’s the 21st century. And what kind of war will be? On the battlefields or behind a computer monitor. If we have Chinese computers too. It is necessary to objectively approach reality. What is the use of flapping a flag? We can’t even throw hats, because the hats are Chinese.
            1. Nagaibak
              Nagaibak 16 January 2014 13: 32
              +1
              Gardamir "But look, screws, bolts. Nuts, where is the correct tea production. But now is the 21st century."
              We have kept about 30% of the previous industrial production, somewhere I met this figure, I can’t say for sure. But even so, everything is visible in principle. Basic industries are still picking something. Ie they are not completely laid. The military-industrial complex also does something. So, in the defense industry we still have Chinese. It’s just that you don’t have to tryndet with your tongue, but lift it from your knees. That's all. And this is not a single year of work. Although they say the defense order, planes and tanks went into the troops. But, I want to think that this is only the beginning.
              About consumer goods, if the clothes come across Russian-made, I take them without looking any better than Chinese or Turkish-Polish. Although they have normal goods, too. But Russian consumer goods are better in quality, although there are few of them.
              And maybe everything you have is Chinese, but we still have something Belarusian. Good quality must be said.
              1. Gardamir
                Gardamir 16 January 2014 16: 14
                +2
                Again, I do not argue, but in order to lift off the knees there must be a competent government, and not those who strive to privatize everything (break it up).
            2. bask
              bask 16 January 2014 17: 42
              +2
              Do we need allies in Gastarbeiterstan?

              Categorically no-SELL AND TRAIN.
            3. yur
              yur 16 January 2014 20: 30
              +2
              Well, dear, there are Chinese computers on your desk and me, but in the Strategic Missile Forces there are Russian computers. So it's not that simple with the "caps".
        5. washi
          washi 16 January 2014 12: 35
          0
          Quote: Gardamir
          In the time of Alexander III, maybe. But now industry and agriculture are more important. Everything we use is made in China. China and the khan will be "offended" by us, no shells, no uniforms. And Tajiks will be offended, there will be no one to clean up the garbage in the cities, because Russians are not allowed to do this.

          Those. You can litter, and behind you take it to the bastard.
          Do you need personal slaves?
          Or maybe serfs?
          Allow Russians to plumbers, scavengers and janitors. And the salary is normal.
          And about "everything is made in China": consumer goods (this includes consumer electronics, including computers, cell phones), high-tech products, no, not yet.
          Problems in housing and communal services, where they are trying to launder finances, and these are already issues of the prosecutor's office and the Investigative Committee.
          1. Gardamir
            Gardamir 16 January 2014 13: 09
            +2
            Litter - remove - slaves - utilities. These are all words. Only in 1941 did people work, and when it was required, they went to the front. And now everyone is looking for work.
            You’ve preserved high technologies, well, of course, just look at how science is being fucked up. And at the household level, hammers, wrenches, etc. everything is not our production.
        6. Max_Bauder
          Max_Bauder 16 January 2014 12: 37
          +20
          So I don’t understand some of the Gaster, well, you came to Moscow, work, eat, but what for in the house will defecate away?

          and how else to calculate that statement of one illiterate Central Asian when he was asked the question: is Moscow Russian? - No, Allah gave us it!

          and I want to ask him: and when did he whisper this to you in your ear? in a dream? or when did you smoke afghan hash?

          Thanks to the Russians, you learned mathematics, geography, chemistry, all sciences, for before them you lived in the Middle Ages with bows and arrows. But no, they consider themselves smart, and the Russians are enemies, ooo, yes, Gaster would dream of reading namaz somewhere in the Orthodox Church after the burning, because since the time of SalakhAddin, reading namaz in the camp of the enemy, the top of the indicator that you conquered them, these "infidels" you are the master they are slaves. The Bosnians also acted when they seceded in Serbia, burned cathedrals. This is their "culture and respect for other religions." the recent incident with a black man proves the thoughts of these "Muslim" provocateurs.

          I understand Arabs and other blacks, alien in spirit and origin, but what the hell are Asians ???

          After all, we lived together, took into account, traveled to each other, even fought side by side with the Nazis, and suddenly, at the behest of some (stinking Arabs and the USA) sticks, we all became "true Muslims" wearing hijab and wanting a caliphate, who considered Russian colonialists and enemies.

          I propose to fight with such thoughts and live together, the former countries of the Union, in spite of all external enemies, I answer if they threaten Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and even Turkmenistan =) external enemies, but our state will harness, I will also go to fight together, I will not say "What for I help these strangers, what they force me, not my type of war." For we have many who served in Afghanistan and did not cry, saying that "they invaded in vain, someone else's war", they fulfilled their INTERNATIONAL duty and with honor.
          who do not like this word, I will say this, if our ancestors also separated, we would lose to the Nazis.
          1. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 16 January 2014 18: 22
            +1
            Quote: Max_Bauder
            Thanks to Russians, you learned mathematics, geography, chemistry, all sciences,

            This was relevant for the previous generation. The current generation is unlikely to have a secondary education. What for, then, who will unite? Everyone wants to live well, transfer power by inheritance. If even Lukashenko does not want ...
        7. Skiff
          Skiff 16 January 2014 14: 31
          +6
          I work as a loader and a janitor, replace people at work, having a different specialty, the extra money will not hurt me, but what about nationality I Rus, remove newcomers and you will see that wages will increase and the quality of work.
        8. Goodmen
          Goodmen 16 January 2014 14: 59
          +2
          ... Russia has only two allies: the army and the navy.
          Alexander III ...

          Quote: Gardamir
          In the days of Alexander the third may be. But now industry and agriculture are more important.


          Here it seems to me that you need to separate the grains from the chaff.
          The emperor’s phrase is universal for any time, because:
          - the state can survive without an army and navy (as science says under ideal conditions, in this case, if there is only one state on the planet and there’s no one to fight stupidly). And that is a fact.
          - hardly without agriculture and industry (unless you return to the primitive communal system). Those. in order to feed oneself, clothe, put on shoes, etc., etc. It follows from this that in a civilized modern state, agriculture and industry are its components. And the stronger they are, the stronger the state. Otherwise, there will be no civilized state even under "ideal conditions." And that's a fact.
          - proceeding from two statements it follows that the army and navy are auxiliary entities for the defense of the whole (i.e., the state)

          Well, the water and the conclusion itself - the phrase: "Russia has only two allies: the army and the navy" has a place to be relevant even now, given that only the lazy one does not covet the resources of our state.

          PS. If very tricky, I beg your pardon, tk. I write "from a burning tank" - the bosses have become more active ... full of determination to raise "morale"))))))))))))))
          1. Gardamir
            Gardamir 16 January 2014 16: 25
            0
            You said correctly. But I also agree that the army and navy are allies of the Russian state. Just recently, they rushed to strengthen the army, which is certainly good, but that they will defend. In my hometown, over 25 years all enterprises have been destroyed.
        9. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 16 January 2014 15: 12
          +3
          Quote: Gardamir
          But now industry and agriculture are more important.

          I don’t understand why you got the minuses. But you put it a little incorrectly. A strong army and navy cannot exist without a strong rear. And the rear cannot live without power support. Everything needs to be developed, but in our country this is done one-sidedly, we are building up muscles, but there is nothing to eat and wear. In this you are right. hi
          1. Gardamir
            Gardamir 16 January 2014 18: 05
            +1
            I agree with the amendment.
      2. ele1285
        ele1285 16 January 2014 08: 44
        +2
        Just do not forget that Allah Vova, who gives money to Kadyrstan, said, "Privatization is the most important thing."
        give life to common people.
        1. washi
          washi 16 January 2014 12: 58
          +4
          Quote: ele1285
          Just do not forget that Allah Vova, who gives money to Kadyrstan, said, "Privatization is the most important thing."
          give life to common people.

          Already lived in the 80s. And not only in the 20th, but also in the 19th century.
          What ended everyone knows.
          It is impossible for true descendants of the Aryans to calm down
      3. kirk82
        kirk82 16 January 2014 13: 56
        +6
        Correctly the army and navy, and a little more economic development, and then the republics of the SA themselves will enter the queue!
      4. fzr1000
        fzr1000 16 January 2014 16: 48
        +1
        Sometimes an enemy is better than such a friend.
    3. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 23
      -4
      I put a million pluses, with Kyrgyzstan you can still Issykkul :)
      1. Lk17619
        Lk17619 16 January 2014 08: 26
        -1
        If only because of Issyk-Kul.
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 28
          +1
          it’s good there, only the water is cool
          1. Lk17619
            Lk17619 16 January 2014 08: 43
            +4
            And what mountains ... Blue spruce grows, in 96 there was such clear water. Oh, I would have to roll there, but the tickets are a little expensive)).
          2. aksakal
            aksakal 16 January 2014 09: 07
            +9
            Quote: T80UM1
            it’s good there, only the water is cool

            - In the hot summer in the high. It is necessary to somehow squeeze out Issyk-Kul, or to buy in the end, the Kirghiz for many years have not been able to equip it normally. Last summer, I was resting at the same base there in Issyk-Kul, so at 11-00 an elderly cop showed up and demanded to turn off the disco, began to drive everyone by numbers, did not let the barbecue laughing laughing Nostalgia, thanks to the Kyrgyz for this! laughing laughing Reality show "Back to the USSR!" laughing laughing Only money - not rubles, but Kyrgyz soms. There, in Kirigizia, still in the USSR, the author of SABZH invented something about "claims, hatred, demands." They were grateful to the Russians for this and would not have bothered her by sending their sons as guest workers. The only requirement for these countries is that the local elite be in power. But after all, I clearly read all the comments from the Russians - the power there must be completely Russian, which means the Russian elite. That is, in a Central Asian country there should be a Russian elite. No, of course, the facts are also cited that at the same time Russians allow them to preserve their national identity, moreover, they accept and develop a program for the national development of this Central Asian country, well, there is a national education system in their own language, some cultural programs for the preservation of the national cultural heritage ... No one argues with this, and IT IS GREAT! But this is the same as demanding that people be happy only from the sausage. People should live in a state that has its own NATIONAL ELITE! THIS IS IMPORTANT not only for Asians. This is important for all ethnic groups. But then in the Russian comments it sounds - and then the bai will overwhelm the whole thing! They are bai! It won't go like this! Give up power and drive out the beys, give up the very idea of ​​having your own beys! At the same time, the Russians themselves do not like the idea of ​​having not their own national elite, but the elite of representatives of the smallest Russian diaspora with the capital in Birobidzhan. Interesting approach. Let the Asians eat that. that we ourselves do not want to eat. laughing
            The art of politics and geopolitics consists precisely in keeping the important and necessary state with all its elites and institutions in its sphere of influence. In all other cases, other forms of retaining influence (with the destruction of the elite or state institutions of the retained state) are called occupation.
            1. UzRus
              UzRus 16 January 2014 09: 23
              +5
              Akskal, about the elite it is said very true. But the elite is the elite of strife.
              1. aksakal
                aksakal 16 January 2014 09: 37
                +3
                Quote: UzRus
                Akskal, about the elite it is said very true. But the elite is the elite of strife.

                - at first, all nations have an elite so-so. In Russia, she and Seyas are terrible, in us - sheer nepotism and nepotism. You went to a quarrel between father and daughter - also because not from a good upbringing. What an elite there is! It is not necessary to choose the elite, there is only one choice - either one’s own or another’s elite. But there is an opportunity to improve their elite. The process is long, but there is nothing to be done.
                And the Russians need to take this into account and find a common language with the elites of Asian countries, as well as educate and train them. What is possible and what is categorically against Russia! Simultaneously with the creation of conditions so that the Uzbek and Kyrgyz would not have to go to Russia themselves, and instead, let the goods produced by him go to Russia.
                1. UzRus
                  UzRus 16 January 2014 09: 49
                  0
                  Aksakal, the fact of the matter is that both you and us have elite nepotism and nepotism. And what do we have really? You have the standard of living of the hoo compared to us, political life with real opposition (and not like ours - the opposition is only on paper), and so on. That's why?
                  1. washi
                    washi 16 January 2014 13: 15
                    +1
                    Quote: UzRus
                    Aksakal, the fact of the matter is that both you and us have elite nepotism and nepotism. And what do we have really? You have the standard of living of the hoo compared to us, political life with real opposition (and not like ours - the opposition is only on paper), and so on. That's why?

                    Appreciate family values.
                    Refuse individualism (egoism). Replace it with self-esteem.
                    Empire is above all.
                2. avt
                  avt 16 January 2014 11: 16
                  +2
                  Quote: aksakal
                  And the Russians need to take this into account and find a common language with the elites of Asian countries, as well as educate and train them. What is possible and what is categorically against Russia! Simultaneously with the creation of conditions so that the Uzbek and Kyrgyz would not have to go to Russia themselves, and instead, let the goods produced by him go to Russia.

                  Why did they come up with such a punishment for us !? Why should we be afraid to create these "conditions"? It is easier and more effective for us to pin down our hozyuk and snickering "law enforcement officers" than to puzzle over local employment. Everything, capitalism, locally only projects and bases that are profitable and necessary for us, yes, with taking into account mutual interests. But so far they are not going off scale with nationalist frenzy. Well, with the new Islamofascists like Sharipov dreaming - "So, taking as an example the" nationalists of the 20s of the XX century "- that is, all those Basmachi, beks and khans whom the Red Banner Cheka chased through the dunes for a long time, Mr. Sharipov proposes to unite based on Islam. “Let us calm down, we have experience, we’ll hold the Olympics, we’ll get busy. Only I think the unifiers“ will cut each other on the ground for a long time, incited by the “common people,” since there are more than enough examples in the same Levant, Pakistan.
                  1. aksakal
                    aksakal 16 January 2014 13: 18
                    0
                    Quote: avt
                    It will be easier and more effective for us to pinch our hosts and snickering law enforcement officers,

                    - easier? Dear, does he pay for the loyalty of the United States to Israel? Paying. How much does the Poles and their neighbors get for the missile defense deployment? So many that all these countries lined up in line, vying with each other to offer their lands for bases and they are not even frightened by the Russian Iskander. Well, for now, abstract "Iskander". In reality, it is necessary to make an accident with an erroneous launching of Iskander, so that this Iskander would actually fly in and really destroy something for them, otherwise these countries perceive the money for the deployment of missile defense systems REALLY, and the Iskander for some reason ABSTRACT. Well, yes, I digress from the topic. In short, in politics, the union can only be mutually beneficial. You give me a base for missile defense, I give you loot. Something like this. I ask again - what do you need in Central Asia? Safety belt? Be so kind as to work out a policy so that everyone would be interested.
                    And so - we will let down on Asians cool "nailed" law enforcement officers, all those who were caught, fell the forest in Siberia, and after that Americans do not let the Americans into Manas, sit there, starve, but the Americans are not on our feet! Father, do you know what it's called? Yes, you want to eat a fish, and ... but oh well! Did you understand. And they realized that it would not work! And the Kyrgyz will not go hungry for any reason! Don't you feed - there will be hunters to feed. Not a question at all. Only when, for the sake of others who want to feed, even timid decisions are made, for example, in the restrictions on the use of the Russian language (and the Russian language - you understand, in general, the language is important for increasing influence!), So you raise such a howl! Have you tried to keep quiet? In short, AVT, once again - choose either a fish, or ... And you won't be able to take something else - I'm telling you for sure. You see it easier for me! Right now! Easier? DO! DO! China will even pour money on the construction of a 5-meter-high fence around the entire perimeter, you won't even have to spend money, and you won't have a single Asian after the construction of that fence! I promise! GET STARTED!
                    1. avt
                      avt 16 January 2014 17: 28
                      +2
                      Quote: aksakal
                      How much does the Poles and their neighbors get for the missile defense deployment? So many that all these countries lined up in line, vying with each other to offer their lands for bases and they are not even frightened by the Russian Iskander.

                      Well, yes, they only need to speak in Kaliningrad - they immediately become silk. And note-no kookies about sovereignty, national dignity and so on, do not throw amers. They clearly know their place.
                      Quote: aksakal
                      And so - we will lower the well-trained "pricked" law enforcement officers on the Asians, everyone who was caught, to cut the forest to Siberia,

                      Which, in violation of the law - yes, together with those who gave them the green light for us and will be fine for everyone. The Vaudsons of all illegal immigrants send Pakistanis, Bangladeshis and Egyptians who are not registered different and nothing, full of comme il faut, and after all, brothers from faith from the future caliphate named after Sharipov
                      Quote: aksakal
                      and after that, don’t let the Americans go to Manas, sit there, starve, but not a foot to the Americans! Father, do you know what it's called? Yes, you want to eat a fish, and ... but oh well!
                      Yato is called - the language of 3,14 .., don’t turn the bags over, just like that Russia didn’t give anything to poor Kyrgyzstan, no money, no weapons, it just flatters guest workers.
                      Quote: aksakal
                      And the Kyrgyz will not starve for any! Do not you feed - there are hunters to feed. Not a question at all. Only when even timid decisions are made to please others who want to feed, for example, in the restrictions on the use of the Russian language (and you understand the Russian language, in general, the language is important for building influence!), So you raise such a howl!

                      What are our statements in language in comparison with the nationalist howl about the occupiers, and in the 90s and not only.
                    2. avt
                      avt 16 January 2014 17: 50
                      0
                      Quote: aksakal
                      ! And the Kyrgyz will not starve for any! Do not you feed - there are hunters to feed.

                      Already fed. Here in Kazakhstan, you have the main buyer-investor China, and without our will, and even more so the decree, solely with the decision of your elite, who got rid of the Imperial heritage and long before the TC that you are considering under a magnifying glass whether or not the insidious Moscow inflicted national humiliation.
                      Quote: aksakal
                      In short, ABT, once again - choose either a fish, or ... And

                      What does it bother you? Do you want to sit down yourself?
                      Quote: aksakal
                      . Do you see it easier! Right now! Easier? DO it! DO it! China will even donate money for the construction of a fence 5 meters high around the perimeter, you don’t even have to spend money. And you will not have a single Asian after the construction of the fence! I promise! START!
                      I would be happy if it were my will. With China it is somehow clear, there is no Soviet past, and even now there are different games with them in EVRAZES, there are no and will not be games with them, everything is clear business and nothing personal, everything the rest is diplomatic verbal husk, again it is clear what to do if they climb to the East and why, obviously not to build mosques for guest workers, well, and in response the hand will not flinch. Again, it is known for sure that if they go where, then snot about “They will not breed local elites, they will simply assimilate and digest everyone.
                3. washi
                  washi 16 January 2014 13: 12
                  +3
                  Quote: aksakal
                  What is the elite, is there such

                  The elite are the best.
                  The best in the army. They put their best heads in all kinds of peacekeeping and counter-terrorism operations.
                  And the "elite" from these operations divides the loot.
                  1. aksakal
                    aksakal 16 January 2014 13: 25
                    0
                    Quote: Vasya
                    The best in the army. They put their best heads in all kinds of peacekeeping and counter-terrorist operations. And the "elite" divides the loot from these operations.

                    - well, let's just say, citizens occupying key and important positions in important areas of the state. You cannot say that Fridman is not a representative of the Russian elite in this sense, since the structures controlled by him make up a significant share of Russia's GDP. You cannot do the same with Posner, because he is a very prominent player in the Russian media, to my regret. And therefore it should also be included in the elite. Understand. the term "Elite" itself is not very suitable for these comrades, but there is simply no other term, and therefore we will use it, guessing from the context what it is about
                4. VirtusEtHonor
                  VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 16: 22
                  +1
                  we have a handful of those who are ready to lick yourself you know to whom, while the Russians have a handful of Jews or close friends you know who. but only one fate will meet everyone - death, everyone is destined to rot in the earth, pah-pah, I bequeathed to be cremated and the ashes scattered over the steppe
            2. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 09: 53
              +3
              Quote: aksakal
              It is necessary to somehow squeeze out Issyk-Kul, or to buy in the end, the Kirghiz for many years have not been able to equip it normally.

              In the sense of squeezing? Will you fight? What stupid thing?
              The territorial integrity of Kyrgyzstan should not be called into question, otherwise I will consider you a provocateur
              1. Andrey KZ
                Andrey KZ 16 January 2014 11: 13
                +4
                Quote: Clegg
                In the sense of squeezing? Will you fight?

                The respected Aksakal probably meant to "squeeze out" economically. Buy out boarding houses, equip the coast, establish infrastructure, attract tourists. But all this should be done under the state guarantees of Kyrgyzstan, and while the government will change every year, no one will give such guarantees, unfortunately ...
                1. aksakal
                  aksakal 16 January 2014 13: 03
                  +3
                  Quote: Andrey KZ
                  Dear Aksakal probably meant to "squeeze out" economically

                  - exactly! But for 25 years we have been waiting for service and nifig, there everything just rots! Well, like a dog in the manger. Well, let them cope - so no, they won’t.
                  Well then, at least some intelligible rules of the game for Kazakhstani investors - and they are not there. And there is no stability. And the Kyrgyz gay men went off the chain, coming to rest on Issyk-Kul - as if they came to rob them, the same attitude. In general, so.
              2. Humpty
                Humpty 16 January 2014 13: 10
                0
                Quote: Clegg
                [
                In the sense of squeezing? Will you fight? What stupid thing?
                The territorial integrity of Kyrgyzstan should not be called into question, otherwise I will consider you a provocateur


                They made fun of Kazakhstan fought a lot with the Kirghiz when Karkaru "squeezed out"?
                There was no war with the Chinese either, even though their appetite was great. The Chinese were not sickly "squeezed." The Chinese almost brought the most important roads to mind in Kyrgyzstan, the Saudis were warming up money, what (who) would pay for it interestingly?
              3. washi
                washi 16 January 2014 13: 19
                +3
                Quote: Clegg
                Quote: aksakal
                It is necessary to somehow squeeze out Issyk-Kul, or to buy in the end, the Kirghiz for many years have not been able to equip it normally.

                In the sense of squeezing? Will you fight? What stupid thing?
                The territorial integrity of Kyrgyzstan should not be called into question, otherwise I will consider you a provocateur

                Naturally. But if the Russian Federation took over the debts of the USSRthen the territories of all-Union significance should belong to the Russian Federation (Sevastopol, the landfill in Issyk-Kul, Baikonur, etc.)
                1. Pilat2009
                  Pilat2009 16 January 2014 18: 33
                  +3
                  Quote: Vasya
                  But if the Russian Federation took over the debts of the USSR, then the territories of all-Union significance should belong to the Russian Federation

                  It was necessary to think about this before signing the Bialowieza Agreement
            3. avt
              avt 16 January 2014 11: 02
              +6
              Quote: aksakal
              That is, in the Central Asian country there must be a Russian elite. N

              This is when it happened, even with the tsar, even with the Communists, like that all Russian!?
              Quote: aksakal
              No, of course, the facts are also cited that at the same time the Russians allow preserving national identity, moreover, they adopt and develop a program for the national development of this Central Asian country, well, there is a national education system in its own language, some cultural programs to preserve the national cultural Heritage ... Nobody argues with this, and THIS IS HEALTHY! But this is the same as demanding that people be happy only from sausage.

              laughing When you wrote the text re-read it ??? Or am I missing something? That something didn’t catch the transition - how does this sausage fit into national cultural development?
              Quote: aksakal
              Nobody argues with this, and THIS IS HEALTHY! But this is the same as demanding that people be happy only from sausage. A person must live in a state that has its own national elite! THIS IS HUGE, not only for Asians. This is important for all ethnic groups.

              Well, it happened! Rejoice - here it is happiness in your national hands!
              Quote: aksakal
              But then it sounds in the Russian comments - and then the buys will overwhelm the whole thing! They are bais! Won't go that way!

              But what, to put it mildly - in some countries they did not fail!?
              Quote: aksakal
              Give power and drive out the buys, abandon the very idea of ​​having your own buys!

              Well, it won’t work, it won’t work, what a misfortune. And what exactly did you want? So that we can now restore everything with our money, rebuild a new one and, at the request of new buys, go to x ..., Back to Russia until everyone breaks a new one!? Oh no, buddy, capitalism and the USSR have long died in the yard. Now here are the fools to create a new elite, not to be confused with the bays which, for the sake of power, again according to Stalin, raised nationalist banners to fight socialism, at the expense of the entire USSR, now Russia. Now the most effective way, under capitalism, is the American one - the one you are talking about
              Quote: aksakal
              In all other cases, other forms of retaining influence (with the destruction of the elite or state institutions of the retained state) are called occupation.
              What they showed perfectly in Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan and would show in Syria. So you'd better get ready for the worst - the Americans have already called the region the "Asian Balkans", so it is quite clear what they are preparing for you there.
              1. aksakal
                aksakal 16 January 2014 14: 04
                +2
                Quote: avt
                This is when it happened, even with the tsar, even with the Communists, like that all Russian!?

                - puppet. All decisions were made in Moscow. Kunaev from Andropov got tin as nuts for an ordinary bathhouse "Arasan", which still pleases Almaty residents! You see, Muscovites can have "Sanduns", but Kazakhs and "Arasan" will be fat, let them wash in irrigation ditches. Isn't this relationship that December 1986 grew out of?
                Quote: avt
                When you wrote the text re-read it ??? Or am I missing something? That something didn’t catch the transition - how does this sausage fit into national cultural development?

                - just a figurative comparison. You say: "Within the framework of the USSR, everything was for you, social programs and all that, there were national schools and so on. Even the national elite, as it were, was in power! What were you dissatisfied with?" Well, as for the national elite, I have already said that a puppet is not called a national elite, a puppet is a puppet. So after all, the same thing can one man say to another: "no, well, here I have completely provided a hawk for you, your trough is always full, poke your grunt, fill your belly! What are you dissatisfied with? You can even walk here and here. Chomp and be happy. ! " Didn't catch a similar example? For me, as a Kazakh, it is important to have my own national elite (people occupying key positions in all spheres of the state, an ethnic group identical or friendly to me). The same goes for the Uzbek. The same is for you. This is what we are talking about.
                Quote: avt
                Well, it happened! Rejoice - here it is happiness in your national hands!
                - I'm glad. Even though I can see very well what the family of our most important "elite" is. As they say, whatever this elite may be. but she is OURS! And, by the way, your, in the sense of the Russian, elite will never be above us! She will be Jewish. For they will become our "first class", and they will take it with the help of your hands, you are just a club in their hands. So you sit with a club in their hands. but still at a distance from us. So I have a choice - either my dear bai, albeit g ... ki full, or these HIMS. The choice is small, but I made it, like most of the local Kazakhstanis. Don't flatter yourself about your own elite - I see it every day on the screens. The Russians do not have their own ELITE at the moment. And while she is gone - I will follow your advice
                1. aksakal
                  aksakal 16 January 2014 14: 06
                  -2
                  Quote: avt
                  Rejoice - here it is happiness in your national hands!

                  May I have it longer?
                  Quote: avt
                  But what, to put it mildly - in some countries they did not fail!?

                  - their problems themselves will cope. At least even using the fact that Amers are not allowed into their Manas. laughing And at the very least they are coping. Or will you deny it?
                  Quote: avt
                  So that we can now restore everything with our money, rebuild a new one and, at the request of new buys, go to x ..

                  - no one asks. There are mutually beneficial options. Build roads in your homeland in Siberia and set up only a few effective roadblocks to combat drug trafficking - and these will be only your roads. A Tajik will not go to your revenge on the street if he has the opportunity to grow watermelons and sell them to Russia with some kind of gesheft. And in your Kamchatka watermelons SHARE IN THE SEASON itself! In thought out! GESTURE !!!! I train strokes in watermelons in the season, breaking them, because during the season they have a freebie with these melons, and they buy SHARE OF THEM !!!! And this is just one example. Who will take these roads from you? Yes, attach a head - not one such mutually beneficial option can be worked out! And again - Onishchenko set, he, a little crooked movement from the Tajiks against Russia, will instantly find nitrates in watermelons!
                  Quote: avt
                  What they showed perfectly in Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan and would show in Syria. So you'd better get ready for the worst - the Americans have already called the region the "Asian Balkans", so it is quite clear what they are preparing for you there.
                  - it will not be sweeter for you. Get ready and you. And in general - the main goal of the amers is YOU! DON'T FORGET IT! We are small and useless fish.
                  1. RUSS
                    RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 33
                    +2
                    You are not a kid, you are part of the tool for the needs of amers.
                2. RUSS
                  RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 30
                  0
                  - puppet. All decisions were made in Moscow. Kunaev from Andropov got tin as nuts for an ordinary bathhouse "Arasan", which still pleases Almaty residents! You see, Muscovites can have "Sanduns", but Kazakhs and "Arasan" will be fat, let them wash in irrigation ditches. Isn't this relationship that December 1986 grew out of?

                  This is still an urgent problem for the Russian outskirts, "what is possible for a master, not for a slave," and the point is not nationality.
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 38
                    +2
                    Quote: RUSS
                    Kunaev from Andropov for an ordinary bathhouse "Arasan

                    Actually, Arasan is not a bathhouse, and construction began under Brezhnev
                    Isn't this the relationship that December 1986 grew from?
                    not one of those
                    1. RUSS
                      RUSS 16 January 2014 15: 28
                      +1
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Quote: RUSS
                      Kunaev from Andropov for an ordinary bathhouse "Arasan

                      Actually, Arasan is not a bathhouse, and construction began under Brezhnev
                      Isn't this the relationship that December 1986 grew from?
                      not one of those


                      The quote about "Arasan" is not mine, but AKSAKALA.
                3. avt
                  avt 16 January 2014 14: 49
                  +2
                  Quote: aksakal
                  May I have it longer?

                  Yes, on health, only for today it is not for us, it is for Blair, he is your "looking"
                  Quote: RUSS
                  - their problems themselves will cope.

                  Huh? So why do you still require us to create jobs in their homeland?
                  Quote: aksakal
                  cope somehow. Or will you deny it?

                  No, I won’t, it is the Americans who are coping poorly and poorly in one way or another, but in Manas they will remain with all their intelligence junk and staff.
                  Quote: aksakal
                  - no one asks.

                  laughing Well, well, especially the Kyrgyz and Tajiks. Can you look at the latest proposals of the President of Kyrgyzstan and the blackmailing of Rakhmon's 201st base?
                  Quote: aksakal
                  Build roads in your home in Siberia

                  And I am for it.
                  Quote: aksakal
                  you will not be sweeter. Get ready and you. And in general - the main goal of the amers is YOU! DON'T FORGET IT! We are small and useless fish.

                  request I already wrote about it here today, only you are not fishes - consumables in their game.
                  Quote: aksakal
                  - puppet

                  laughing A convenient position is kind of like an elite, but since it doesn’t fit into the new nat, it means with a sweet heart.
                  1. RUSS
                    RUSS 16 January 2014 15: 30
                    +1
                    Quote: RUSS
                    - their problems themselves will cope.

                    This is not mine either.
                    1. avt
                      avt 16 January 2014 19: 02
                      +1
                      Quote: RUSS
                      This is not mine either.

                      hi Yes, something was buggy with me at that time, I slowly added it and I don’t know how it popped up. It seems that I constantly quoted the post of the elder request Himself so got on someone else's comment.
            4. washi
              washi 16 January 2014 13: 07
              +2
              Quote: aksakal
              OWN NATIONAL ELITE!

              We have already gone through this.
              The national elite divided the USSR.
              The national elite provoked the killing and eviction of the Russian-speaking population.
              It all began in Alma-Ata.
              The national elite was afraid that they could be imprisoned for embezzlement of socialist property (including yours).
              1. aksakal
                aksakal 16 January 2014 14: 10
                +1
                Quote: Vasya
                It all began in Almaty. The national elite was afraid that they could be imprisoned for embezzlement of socialist property (including yours).

                - Gdlyan and Ivanov had to first finish where the diamonds of the browded General Secretary of the Pebble-Bond gave the Motherland left and right, because she could not live without shiny stones. And then the nakoselitas that were wearing hair were woolly. And so, Pebble-Bonds are possible. and you can’t write posts in cotton - you’re lying, brother, does not channel. With myself, dear, I had to start! Stalin because he could, because this was not, was not primarily in the Kremlin! Therefore, before scolding my bais, look in the mirror - didn’t the log fall there by chance?
            5. VirtusEtHonor
              VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 16: 20
              +1
              about birobidzhan, very thin and beautiful :) plus
          3. Clegg
            Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 30
            +2
            T80UM1 well done, finally took the Soviet flag)
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 13: 32
              +1
              Thank you for noticing. I'm glad)
      2. RUSS
        RUSS 16 January 2014 09: 33
        -1
        Quote: T80UM1
        I put a million pluses, with Kyrgyzstan you can still Issykkul :)

        You have a mercantile interest, but what about the unity of fraternal peoples?
        1. The comment was deleted.
      3. washi
        washi 16 January 2014 12: 59
        +1
        Quote: T80UM1
        I put a million pluses, with Kyrgyzstan you can still Issykkul :)

        It’s easier to pick up the territory.
        Moreover, polygons of union significance, i.e. belong to the Russian Federation.
    4. ele1285
      ele1285 16 January 2014 08: 37
      +7
      Quote: VirtusEtHonor
      Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all, you can unite with the Tajiks and leave us alone.

      Your state "Kazakhstan" was first formed thanks to the Soviet regime. In 1936 you left the RSFSR. Do not be like a banderlog. And I want to kick it at you, write without mistakes, and you will be happy and respectful.
      1. T80UM1
        T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 44
        -7
        Your state "RF" was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR. You left the union in 1991. Don't be prudes ... And I also want to kick you a little, a little more respect for the interlocutor's place of residence and you will be happy and respectful (I hate the English word in Russian "respect") when there are Russian counterparts :)

        Sincerely =)))
        1. RUSS
          RUSS 16 January 2014 09: 37
          +11
          Quote: T80UM1
          Your state "RF" was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR. You left the union in 1991. Don't be prudes ... And I also want to kick you a little, a little more respect for the interlocutor's place of residence and you will be happy and respectful (I hate the English word in Russian "respect") when there are Russian counterparts :)

          Sincerely =)))


          Maybe I will surprise you, but the USSR is Russia.
          And what does it mean - "Your state" RF "was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR" -. Thanks ???? Do we have to rejoice and thank the gentlemen for the collapse of the USSR and gaining independence? What is this nonsense?
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 11: 53
              -1
              cf * it is in Ukrainian, speak in Russian a representative of the Europioid community, or at school you just carried out the bowel movement ...
          2. T80UM1
            T80UM1 16 January 2014 10: 04
            0
            Just a mirror response to the previous comment, which also hurt? You see, therefore, it is necessary to write with mutual respect.
            1. The comment was deleted.
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. T80UM1
                T80UM1 16 January 2014 11: 42
                -3
                Speak up? go to the kitchen and take a pie from the shelf, do not forget to grease acne and other ulcers, otherwise it stinks ...
                1. washi
                  washi 16 January 2014 13: 34
                  +2
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  Speak up? go to the kitchen and take a pie from the shelf, do not forget to grease acne and other ulcers, otherwise it stinks ...

                  Rude in otvetku not worth it.
                  If you change your alphabet to Latin or Arabic, then I will stop respecting all the Cossacks. (sorry, but too lazy to change the alphabet on the keyboard, at the same time I'm trying to unite the Cossacks and the Cossacks). The same behavior (except for the main faith, and the same disregard for it until the end of the 20th century (window dressing)), Identical orders and internal laws (again until the 80s) Psychology is the same with Russians.
                  The language has much in common (Novokazakh not all Kazakhs understand)
                  All we have to admit is that the Kazakhs are Russians (Islam interferes).
                  1. Zymran
                    Zymran 16 January 2014 13: 37
                    -2
                    Do not wait. Although the local scoops may well be recognized.
                  2. Clegg
                    Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 46
                    +1
                    Quote: Vasya
                    If you change your alphabet to Latin or Arabic, then respect the cease of all Kazakhs.

                    I am for the Latin and violet to your respect or disrespect))))))

                    Quote: Vasya
                    All we have to admit is that the Kazakhs are Russians.

                    Believe it yourself?
                    1. RUSS
                      RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 01
                      +5
                      If the Russian alphabet was in Latin, then the Kazakhs would translate their own into Cyrillic. Anyhow, but not like in Russia, I suggest you introduce the Turkic runes, why do you need European alphabets and Arabic script?
                      1. Clegg
                        Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 06
                        +1
                        Quote: RUSS
                        If the Russian alphabet was in Latin, then the Kazakhs would translate their own into Cyrillic.

                        arguably

                        Quote: RUSS
                        You introduce Turkic runes, why do you need European alphabets and Arabic script?

                        It will take a lot of time to master, and the Latin is clear to everyone.
                      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 20
                        0
                        Quote: Clegg
                        and the Latin is clear to everyone.

                        did you try to parse the text written in Russian in Latin? !!
                      3. Zymran
                        Zymran 16 January 2014 14: 23
                        +1
                        I got several books from my grandfather, including a dictionary in Latin. There is nothing complicated in reading the Kazakh text in Latin letters. When they write Russian in Latin - yes, it infuriates.
                      4. Clegg
                        Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 30
                        -3
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        did you try to parse the text written in Russian in Latin? !!

                        Da konechno, ya kstati na saite inogda pishu latinskimi bukvami. Eto daje mne legche esli chestno))) I, na qazaqskom toje legche pechatat 'latinskimi bukvami
                      5. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 40
                        0
                        if you do not do something, then why make others break their eyes
                      6. Clegg
                        Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 55
                        0
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        if you do not do something, then why make others break their eyes

                        you are a strange person, ask a question and then .... laughing
          3. T80UM1
            T80UM1 16 January 2014 13: 48
            -1
            "You shouldn't be rude in return"
            Can you still advise to be "patient"? Unfortunately, the mentality is different ... Eastern and more rigid.

            Everything else can not be commented.
          4. alone
            alone 16 January 2014 20: 17
            +2
            Quote: Vasya
            All we have to admit is that the Kazakhs are Russians (Islam interferes).

            what belay this is from what hangover Kazakhs became Russian Russians?)))
      2. The comment was deleted.
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 13: 30
          0
          My?? in the Far East and in the Japanese Empire. What's next?
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 02
            0
            Quote: T80UM1
            My?? in the Far East and in the Japanese Empire. What's next?


            And then the United States ... laughing
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 08
              0
              No, the USA has nothing to do with me. soldier
        2. romb
          romb 16 January 2014 14: 02
          +2
          And where were yours? Are you really engaged in the creation and development of high-tech clusters in the field of nuclear energy? Or maybe, in truth, they were one of those — ninety-odd percent of the dark and uneducated peasants from some remote village.
  2. romb
    romb 16 January 2014 14: 17
    +2
    Here you answer me, just honestly. If the USSR is Russia, then why did a Caucasian and Jews become the head of this state? Is this possible in a nation-state, which the Russian Empire actually was? And what is interesting is precisely thanks to these non-Russians - "Russia" has reached heights that it has not reached before, and most likely will not reach.
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 20: 27
      -1
      Quote: romb
      Is it possible in a nation-state, which the Russian Empire was just the same

      and the Germans on the throne do not surprise you
      but for me, a Georgian seminarian is better than a Polish prostitute from a military convoy
    2. nevopros
      nevopros 16 January 2014 23: 59
      0
      Dislike. Immediately. For a Caucasian. Stalin: "I am Russian." Dot.

      Small-town self-identity in the Russian world in difficult times is treacherous.
  3. alone
    alone 16 January 2014 20: 15
    +2
    Quote: RUSS
    Maybe I will surprise you, but the USSR is Russia.


    The USSR is not Russia. The USSR is the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. hi
    1. RUSS
      RUSS 16 January 2014 21: 37
      0
      Quote: lonely
      Quote: RUSS
      Maybe I will surprise you, but the USSR is Russia.


      The USSR is not Russia. The USSR is the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. hi

      "The sum does not change from the change of the places of the terms" ie The territory of the Russian Empire and the USSR is Russia, but the fact that Russia has many names, well, it does not change anything. In your opinion, perhaps Russia is Moscow and the central regions? And what is Azerbaijan for you, what is now within the borders of the present or together with Iranian?
  • ele1285
    ele1285 16 January 2014 10: 03
    +5
    Quote: T80UM1
    Your state "RF" was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR. You left the union in 1991. Don't be prudes ... And I also want to kick you a little, a little more respect for the place of residence of the interlocutor and you will be happy and respect (I hate the English word in Russian "respect") when there are Russian counterparts

    The points.
    OUR state, unlike yours, was formed in the XNUMXth century, and tell the Union of Right Forces that they taught you to eat with a spoon. We did not leave the Union, we showed a referendum. That's what I hate for the phrase - "Your state of the Russian Federation", our The motherland is Russia, and I am proud of it, there is no better country in the world, though the state is crap, that is, that is.
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 12: 10
      +1
      the points

      1) Your state of the Russian Federation was formed as a result of the collapse of the USSR, the USSR was formed as a result of the collapse of the Republic of Ingushetia, the Republic of Ingushetia was formed from Muscovy and so on. The Russian Federation has a bone relation to Kievan Rus, the same as the Republic of Kazakhstan to the Kazakh Khanate of the 15th century, this is firstly. We will prove our rightness to each other with foam at the mouth, and everyone will be right (believe the candidate of science), but now you are not Kievan Rus which was formed in the 9th century for the simple reason that Kiev is in another state ...
      2) You left the Union on December 12, 1991, Kazakhstan was the last on December 16, therefore we have more rights to the successor of the USSR ... The referendum and the State Emergency Committee showed all this

      3) you cannot stand "your state is the Russian Federation" and I can not stand the phrase "your state is" Kazakhstan "" in quotation marks "taught to eat with a spoon" "to write while standing" what next?

      4) Maybe your homeland and Russia and you are proud of it, but this does not give you the right to speak in a humiliating tone about my country! I didn’t allow myself to write like this before your comment; you will also try in the future.
    2. FormerMariman
      FormerMariman 16 January 2014 13: 07
      +2
      Fuck on the wall Natsik unfinished will become easier! And you held a referendum in your kitchen, now meow about the USSR!
      1. T80UM1
        T80UM1 16 January 2014 13: 10
        -1
        is it addressed to me?
      2. alone
        alone 16 January 2014 20: 22
        0
        Quote: Former Mariman
        Fuck on the wall Natsik unfinished will become easier! And you held a referendum in your kitchen, now meow about the USSR!

        Max hi !! this is not meowing, this is moaning, moreover, plaintive))
        laughing wassat
  • Iamfromrurik
    Iamfromrurik 16 January 2014 10: 06
    0
    Quote: T80UM1
    Your state "RF" was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR

    Our state was formed in 862, thanks to the unification of disparate Slavic and Finnish tribes, the Vikings of Russia, led by Rurik.
    With disrespect.
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 16 January 2014 11: 13
      +8
      Quote: IamFromRurik
      Our state was formed in 862, thanks to the unification of disparate Slavic and Finnish tribes, the Vikings of Russia, led by Rurik. With disrespect.

      Our state was formed no later than the 5 century BC. and successfully resisted the invasions of nomads, Persians, Romans, Germans, etc.
      Many Russian cities have a continuous cultural layer over 3 000 years old, this is only possible in a stable, strong state. These are not speculations of priests and Germans, but irrefutable facts confirmed by archaeological material evidence.
      Earthen defensive structures in the south of Russia "Zmievy Shafts" (2-7 centuries BC) can only be built by a strong state with a large population.
      There were no Finnish tribes on the territory of Russia, the number of ugrofinans never exceeded 2-3% of the total population. The Varangians did not unite anyone, they were just mercenaries in the service of the Russian state. Several people from among the Varangians occupied the administrative posts of princes and squad commanders. Until Rus 11 century, not princes ruled in Russia, but Veche.
      1. romb
        romb 16 January 2014 14: 05
        0
        Have you read fiction again? crying
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 07
          0
          Quote: romb
          Have you read fiction again?

          I remember this grandfather) Again began to vparivat his rubbish))))))
          1. romb
            romb 16 January 2014 14: 09
            +1
            Salem!
            But at least some positive! smile
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 11: 44
      -2
      Our - that is, France?

      With a three letter promise.
  • avt
    avt 16 January 2014 11: 52
    +2
    Quote: T80UM1
    Your state "RF" was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR. You left the union in 1991.

    Yeah !? And I thought that at first, after 1917, the RSFSR was created, and only then, by uniting the republics, the USSR. It’s good that they enlightened.
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 11: 57
      -2
      Does everyone need to chew that it was a banter in response to a previous comment ??
      1. washi
        washi 16 January 2014 13: 51
        +5
        Quote: T80UM1
        Does everyone need to chew that it was a banter in response to a previous comment ??

        Конечно.
        I'm a stupid military man. I do not understand when banter, and when hitting.
        It is better to describe everything in facts, comments, with links to other sources ..
        Then everything can be evaluated, analyzed.
        Yes, and emotional growth can be ignored.
        Already, as I noticed, there were several visits to the site of emotional young animals.
        They grabbed titles here (with the help of their temporarily registered)
        Be calm.
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 54
          +1
          Quote: Vasya
          Already, as I noticed, there were several visits to the site of emotional young animals.

          What kind of hitting?)
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 13: 15
    +4
    Quote: T80UM1
    Your state "RF" was first formed thanks to the collapse of the USSR

    You may, of course, also be a candidate of science (by the way which), but you have frozen nonsense, I won’t even explain what exactly.
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 13: 25
      -1
      Vladimir, I respect you as an Almaty citizen and a former fellow countryman, let’s point by point:

      Candidate of Economic Sciences, area of ​​management and organization of production if in Russian ...

      This is not rubbish, it is a statement of fact for the formation of the Russian Federation in 1991. For ourselves, let's clarify two big differences between Russia and the Russian Federation, many are confused. As a legal entity, the Russian Federation appeared in 1991 after the collapse of the USSR with its borders and other organizational structures. Let's not talk about succession, just answer a simple question from Legal Law when (and not as a result of which) the subject of international law appeared.
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 13: 37
        +3
        You perfectly understand that this is sophistry, and the Russian Empire and the Union, and now the Russian Federation, is to have the same economically different relations, state structure, etc., but these are the same thing.
        I'm sorry for everything else
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 13: 44
          0
          I understand, but there are facts, but there are sensations, sensations are one thing and facts are another.

          Now, returning to the comment that started the fuss "the state of Kazakhstan was formed ... 1936 ... left the RSFSR" - this is a legal fact the same as "the Russian Federation was formed in 1991", but this is sophistry for Kazakhs, everything else for them also from the evil one. Did I explain it to you clearly?
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 03
            +2
            Quote: T80UM1
            Kazakhstan was formed ... 1936 ... left the RSFSR "- this is a legal fact

            Once again, without sophistry, in 1936, the Kazakh SSR was part of the USSR
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 09
              -2
              yes, and in 1936 the RSFSR was part of the USSR?
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 22
                +3
                Quote: T80UM1
                yes, and in 1936 the RSFSR was part of the USSR

                You are again engaged in sophistry, while you understand perfectly well that the USSR was formed around the RSFSR-Russia
                1. T80UM1
                  T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 26
                  -1
                  Vladimir, you do the same! The USSR was formed around everyone, and not just around the RSFSR!
                2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 30
                  +1
                  Well, here you can argue, you forgive
                3. The comment was deleted.
            2. The comment was deleted.
        2. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 29
          +1
          Quote: T80UM1
          the state of Kazakhstan was formed ... 1936 ... left the RSFSR

          and the citizens of which state were people living outside the territory of the Kazakh SSR? !!
          1. T80UM1
            T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 32
            -1
            citizens of the USSR. note not the Russian Federation, but the USSR
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 15: 40
              +1
              Quote: T80UM1

              T80UM1
              (1)

              Today, 14: 32

              ↑ ↓


              citizens of the USSR. note not the Russian Federation, but the USSR

              is it true, but I thought of Kazakhstan
        3. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 29
          +1
          Quote: T80UM1
          the state of Kazakhstan was formed ... 1936 ... left the RSFSR

          and the citizens of which state were people living outside the territory of the Kazakh SSR? !!
      2. Lindon
        Lindon 16 January 2014 14: 48
        -2
        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
        government structure, etc., but this is one and the same thing.
        I'm sorry for everything else


        State system - Empire is transformed into the Republic.
        Form - a unitary state is transformed into a federation.
        You are still dark Vasya, and you are still trying to teach others something.
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 18: 24
          +3
          for starters, we didn’t graze sheep together, but in the end, what did you want to say with your opus ?!
          what shape and device have changed?
          1. Lindon
            Lindon 17 January 2014 09: 00
            0
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            for starters, we didn’t graze sheep together, but in the end, what did you want to say with your opus ?!
            what shape and device have changed?


            You write opuses from your dense barn by twisting the tails of the cows.
            If you consider yourself an educated person - do not confuse the warm with the soft.
            The RSFSR is not a receiver of RI. The RSFSR lost most of the territory of the Republic of Ingushetia - Finland, Northern Iran, Eastern Poland, the Baltic States and 12 of the CIS republics.
            Lenin refused to recognize the RSFSR as a receiver and pay debts and everything else.
            Lenin created a new state from scratch. The difference between the Republic of Ingushetia and the RSFSR is enormous - this was manifested in everything. Power since the days of the RSFSR and is still in the hands of the minority oppressed in the Republic of Ingushetia. They cleared their way after interrupting part and crushing the remaining educated Russian nobles. And the illiterate and unwashed people-the mob of Russia fed the utopian idea.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 17 January 2014 09: 33
              +1
              Quote: Lindon
              You write opuses from your dense barn by twisting the tails of the cows.

              Well, rudeness didn’t seem to adorn anyone

              p / s / want to discuss, first, learn to do it politely
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 17 January 2014 11: 54
              +1
              Quote: Lindon
              Lenin refused to recognize the RSFSR as a receiver and pay debts and everything else.

              in addition to legal continuity, is there still cultural and historical, or do you think that everything until the age of 17 is not our ancestors, not our country, and not our culture? !!!
            4. The comment was deleted.
  • Andrey KZ
    Andrey KZ 16 January 2014 11: 20
    0
    Quote: ele1285
    Your state "Kazakhstan" was first formed thanks to Soviet power.

    Our state has existed for a long time. It became really Kazakhstan under the Soviet regime, but this does not mean that it did not exist before. If the state of the Russian Federation appeared in 1991, this does not mean that Russia did not exist before.
    1. avt
      avt 16 January 2014 11: 58
      +5
      Quote: Andrey KZ
      .If the state of the Russian Federation appeared in 1991,

      And how is the abbreviation for the name of the state created on the basis of the Empire - the RSFSR? Especially what is hidden under the letter F?
      1. Andrey KZ
        Andrey KZ 16 January 2014 13: 17
        0
        Quote: avt
        And how is the abbreviation for the name of the state created on the basis of the Empire - the RSFSR? Especially what is hidden under the letter F?

        I am not going to dispute that the history of Russia is ancient, rich and great. All this is onomastics and nothing more.
        1. avt
          avt 16 January 2014 14: 17
          +2
          Quote: Andrey KZ
          All this is onomastics and nothing more.

          This is too tricky for me. But still - how to deal with the RSFSR? Probably the countdown of existence was not since 1991?
          1. Andrey KZ
            Andrey KZ 16 January 2014 14: 28
            -1
            Quote: avt
            Probably the countdown of existence was not with 1991?

            Without a doubt! Like the statehood of Kazakhstan, it began much earlier than the 1936 of the year. It was called differently - Ak-Orda, the Kazakh Khanate.
      2. washi
        washi 16 January 2014 13: 54
        +3
        Quote: avt
        Quote: Andrey KZ
        .If the state of the Russian Federation appeared in 1991,

        And how is the abbreviation for the name of the state created on the basis of the Empire - the RSFSR? Especially what is hidden under the letter F?

        Fse ours. (Westphalian accent)
    2. washi
      washi 16 January 2014 13: 53
      +4
      Quote: Andrew KZ
      Quote: ele1285
      Your state "Kazakhstan" was first formed thanks to Soviet power.

      Our state has existed for a long time. It became really Kazakhstan under the Soviet regime, but this does not mean that it did not exist before. If the state of the Russian Federation appeared in 1991, this does not mean that Russia did not exist before.

      Show, at least one, a card until 1936 of the year where there is the STATE of Kazakhstan.
      1. RUSS
        RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 06
        +1
        Quote: Vasya
        Quote: Andrew KZ
        Quote: ele1285
        Your state "Kazakhstan" was first formed thanks to Soviet power.

        Our state has existed for a long time. It became really Kazakhstan under the Soviet regime, but this does not mean that it did not exist before. If the state of the Russian Federation appeared in 1991, this does not mean that Russia did not exist before.

        Show, at least one, a card until 1936 of the year where there is the STATE of Kazakhstan.


        Only Zhuzy.
      2. Clegg
        Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 23
        -2
        Quote: Vasya
        Show, at least one, a card until 1936 of the year where there is the STATE of Kazakhstan.

        Show me the map until 1917 where there is the Russian Federation
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 16 January 2014 16: 47
        +4
        Quote: Vasya
        Show, at least one, a card until 1936 of the year where there is the STATE of Kazakhstan.

        Vasya, where will he get such a card, if before the 1936 of the year and there were no words Kazakhstan and Kazakh, there was the Kyrgyz Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic as part of the RSFSR with the capital in Orenburg in which the Kyrgyz-kaisaki lived.
    3. RUSS
      RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 05
      +3
      Quote: Andrew KZ
      Quote: ele1285
      Your state "Kazakhstan" was first formed thanks to Soviet power.

      Our state has existed for a long time. It became really Kazakhstan under the Soviet regime, but this does not mean that it did not exist before. If the state of the Russian Federation appeared in 1991, this does not mean that Russia did not exist before.


      And here it’s not accuracy, the Kazakhs existed before the Russian Empire, but it was precisely the STATE that didn’t!
      1. Clegg
        Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 09
        +1
        Quote: RUSS
        but it was precisely-the STATE did not have it!

        Ak-Orda, the Kazakh Khanate? Is that what you think?
        1. RUSS
          RUSS 16 January 2014 15: 10
          +2
          Ak-Orda is a fragment of the Golden Horde, the Horde can hardly be called a state, the Kazakh Khanate is closer to the definition of a state.

          The state is an imperious-political organization of society, possessing state sovereignty, a special apparatus of control and coercion, and establishing a special legal order in a certain territory.
          The state is a set of political institutions whose main goal is to protect and maintain the integrity of society.
      2. Lindon
        Lindon 16 January 2014 14: 53
        -1
        Quote: RUSS

        And here it’s not accuracy, the Kazakhs existed before the Russian Empire, but it was precisely the STATE that didn’t!


        Victim of the exam? Khan Abulkhair began joining Kazakhstan in the 1731 year to Russia.
        There was neither a khan, nor a decision of the elders, nor a request for acceptance - it was so simply accepted.
        Georgia in the same way accepted the citizenship of Russia - Prince Bagration - a descendant of Georgian kings. Two of you in history.
        1. RUSS
          RUSS 16 January 2014 16: 12
          +1
          All these principalities, khanates for me are not state entities from a legal and historical point of view. Definition of-state in my previous comment.

          But I didn’t find the Unified State Examination, I graduated from school in the USSR.
          1. romb
            romb 16 January 2014 17: 17
            0
            All these principalities, khanates for me are not state entities from a legal and historical point of view.

            Yes of course. But it’s just that one such khanate, in fact, actually began the process of administrative and political centralization of lands into the Moscow principality. And who knows what it was, and who it became, and how long this very Moscow principality could have dragged out its miserable existence if the "Mongols" had not come to them in due time.
          2. Lindon
            Lindon 17 January 2014 09: 09
            0
            Quote: RUSS
            All these principalities, khanates for me are not state entities from a legal and historical point of view. Definition of-state in my previous comment.

            But I didn’t find the Unified State Examination, I graduated from school in the USSR.


            You can look like a person, but for me you cannot be one.
            Read Lenin's lecture "On the State", read the signs of the state - and then draw conclusions. And it turns out that every dropout will give his own definition to the state. No, let's rely on reliable, scientifically recognized definitions.
            1. RUSS
              RUSS 17 January 2014 09: 16
              0
              Lenin for me is not an authoritative person in political science.
      3. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 16 January 2014 16: 17
        +2
        Quote: RUSS
        And here it’s not accuracy, the Kazakhs existed before the Russian Empire, but it was precisely the STATE that didn’t!

        You're right. What state could the nomads have?
        Neither the government, nor the army, nor the cities, nor the administrative centers, nor the Kazakh education and health care system, before joining Russia, was in sight. From time to time a self-proclaimed khan appeared, who necessarily began with robbery, cattle breeders ran away or cut his throat and the state ended.
      4. The comment was deleted.
  • bazilio
    bazilio 16 January 2014 08: 56
    +4
    Quote: VirtusEtHonor
    Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all

    Calm Kazakhs, Uzbeks and do not say that they want to unite with you
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 09: 03
      +1
      What a mutual understanding: D Someone else out there stutters about the "great turan". But seriously, during the USSR, part of the territories from Kazakhstan was transferred to Uzbekistan ...
      1. UzRus
        UzRus 16 January 2014 09: 21
        0
        And what of this? In the days of the Union, a lot of things were given to someone who did not belong to him initially. Let’s bite because of this? Cho was - then gone!
      2. The gentleman
        The gentleman 16 January 2014 09: 29
        +4
        Quote: T80UM1
        What a mutual understanding: D Someone else out there stutters about the "great turan". But seriously, during the USSR, part of the territories from Kazakhstan was transferred to Uzbekistan ...

        Well, yes))) and how much it went to you))) and how much they took from Uzbekistan))) as a whole, you didn’t even have statehood, only steppes.
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 09: 55
          +1
          Quote: Gentleman
          in general, you didn’t even have statehood, only steppes.

          Uzbeks finally artificially created people)))
          1. The gentleman
            The gentleman 16 January 2014 10: 19
            +1
            Quote: Clegg
            Quote: Gentleman
            in general, you didn’t even have statehood, only steppes.

            Uzbeks finally artificially created people)))

            even put a plus)))) for sure, it is not clear who is who)))))
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 10: 24
              +7
              Quote: Gentleman
              for sure, it is not clear who is who)))))

              Let's leave the story, because the historical enemies of the Germans and the French coexist in the EU, what are we worse? all the more, kindred and fraternal peoples.
              The last thing I want to see is the srach between us, hi
              1. The gentleman
                The gentleman 16 January 2014 10: 40
                +2
                Quote: Clegg
                Quote: Gentleman
                for sure, it is not clear who is who)))))

                Let's leave the story, because the historical enemies of the Germans and the French coexist in the EU, what are we worse? all the more, kindred and fraternal peoples.
                The last thing I want to see is the srach between us, hi

                no one wants to swear, just such topics should be accepted as idiotic than the start for mutual claims
                1. alone
                  alone 16 January 2014 20: 27
                  +3
                  Quote: Gentleman
                  no one wants to swear, just such topics should be accepted as idiotic than the start for mutual claims


                  and Such articles are designed to ensure that there was arranged srach between nations.
                  1. RUSS
                    RUSS 16 January 2014 21: 43
                    0
                    Quote: lonely
                    Quote: Gentleman
                    no one wants to swear, just such topics should be accepted as idiotic than the start for mutual claims


                    and Such articles are designed to ensure that there was arranged srach between nations.


                    And no one is dragging you for the language, in this case, someone is typing on the keyboard for you?
          2. avt
            avt 16 January 2014 12: 06
            +6
            Quote: Clegg
            Uzbeks finally artificially created people)))

            Maybe, maybe, but then they may well send you an answer with a reference to the "Eurasian" Gumilyov that Kazakhs are a sub ethnos and this should not be a revelation for you or something unexpected.
            Quote: Gentleman
            even put a plus)))) for sure, it is not clear who is who)))))

            Why, every sandpiper praises its swamp - the Tajiks are the descendants of Iskender Macedoni. laughing It's just that Russians are forbidden to have an "alternative history", everyone is very offended suddenly laughing
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 12: 18
              +1
              Quote: avt
              but then they may well send you an answer with a reference to the "Eurasian" Gumilyov that Kazakhs are a sub ethnos and this should not be a revelation for you or something unexpected.

              Unfortunately I didn’t read Gumilyov, can you recommend books?
              1. avt
                avt 16 January 2014 12: 43
                +4
                Quote: Clegg
                Unfortunately I didn’t read Gumilyov, can you recommend books?

                As a keepsake, Rus and the Great Steppe, his first book - Ethnogenesis, From Rus to Russia. BUT! Look for lifetime editions! With the release date until 1992, somewhere in the libraries remained. Posthumous clearly, "- a completely different language of expressing thoughts, well, certainly not Gumilevian - abstruse and pseudo-scientific. He always expressed his thoughts simply and easily. There are still videos of his lectures, but I did not look for them on the Internet. In general, it stimulates the thought process a lot. You can object to him, but concretely, reasoned in his spirit.
              2. Alibekulu
                Alibekulu 16 January 2014 13: 10
                +3
                Quote: Clegg
                Unfortunately I didn’t read Gumilyov, can you recommend books?
                Salem Here is some Turanian if L.N. Gumilyov did not read ?! fool
                "Steppe Trilogy" should always be at hand for those who are interested in the ancient Turks.
                I constantly reread his "Ancient Turks" and "Huns. Huns in China"
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 25
                  0
                  Quote: Alibekulu
                  Here is some Turanian if L.N. Gumilyov did not read ?!

                  I consider myself a libertarian in the first place)
                  The ideal in politics for me is Ron Paul, a mixture of liberalism and conservatism.
                  If I’m not mistaken, he is one of the founders of Eurasianism, and I am an opponent of this idea.
                  At the expense of Turan, he spoke quite a bit, only for military-political and economic cooperation.
                  1. RUSS
                    RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 07
                    +1
                    Quote: Clegg
                    Quote: Alibekulu
                    Here is some Turanian if L.N. Gumilyov did not read ?!

                    I consider myself a libertarian in the first place)
                    The ideal in politics for me is Ron Paul, a mixture of liberalism and conservatism.
                    If I’m not mistaken, he is one of the founders of Eurasianism, and I am an opponent of this idea.
                    At the expense of Turan, he spoke quite a bit, only for military-political and economic cooperation.


                    For conservatism, you are a plus.
            2. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 16 January 2014 15: 22
              +1
              Quote: avt
              Tajiks are the descendants of Iskender Macedoni

              Only Pamir. hi
              1. RUSS
                RUSS 16 January 2014 21: 45
                0
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Quote: avt
                Tajiks are the descendants of Iskender Macedoni

                Only Pamir. hi

                It always wondered what the descendants of Macedon mean. If it's a banter, then okay.
                But seriously, the descendants of Alexander the Great or the descendants of the Greeks from the abandoned garrison? Or maybe the Persians settled there who came with Alexander?
                1. avt
                  avt 16 January 2014 22: 22
                  0
                  Quote: RUSS
                  If it's a banter, then okay.

                  No, in all seriousness and with pride, the natives of the Pamir told me. Moreover, Tajik, Afghan Mountain Badokhshan is one people. By faith - Karmatians, a kind of Ismaili - extreme Shiites. Their main Aga Khan is now like the 4th. In Afghanistan, if I don’t confuse the antiquity of years, the Ismailis have their main city, Herat.
            3. bazilio
              bazilio 16 January 2014 18: 02
              +1
              Quote: avt
              Maybe, maybe, but then they may well send you an answer with a reference to the "Eurasian" Gumilyov that Kazakhs are a sub ethnos and this should not be a revelation for you or something unexpected.

              Dear, with Gumelev you got ahead of me)) plus you))
            4. bazilio
              bazilio 16 January 2014 18: 02
              0
              Quote: avt
              Maybe, maybe, but then they may well send you an answer with a reference to the "Eurasian" Gumilyov that Kazakhs are a sub ethnos and this should not be a revelation for you or something unexpected.

              Dear, with Gumelev you got ahead of me)) plus you))
          3. washi
            washi 16 January 2014 13: 59
            +1
            Quote: Clegg
            Uzbeks finally artificially created people)))

            The Uzbeks had khanates with their territory.
            The rest of the Central Asians had nothing.
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 00
              0
              Quote: Vasya
              The rest of the Central Asians had nothing.

              did you decide so?)
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 16 January 2014 15: 47
                +1
                Quote: Clegg
                did you decide so?)

                Guys, no offense, but the Uzbek khanates at the end of the 19th century, were more developed in all respects than the lands inhabited by Kazakhs, Kirghiz, etc. hi
                Quote: Lindon
                Go teach history - section Kazakhstan’s accession to Russia.

                Yes, he does not deny the artificiality of the Uzbeks as a nation. hi
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 16 January 2014 16: 00
                  0
                  Quote: Ingvar 72
                  Guys, no offense, but the Uzbek khanates at the end of the 19th century, were more developed in all respects than the lands inhabited by Kazakhs, Kirghiz,

                  The question is not who WAS more developed, but in denying the existence of the Kazakh Khanate.
                  1. Ingvar 72
                    Ingvar 72 16 January 2014 19: 32
                    +1
                    Quote: Clegg
                    denial of the existence of the Kazakh Khanate.

                    And who denied? I'm something request not found. And the khanate was, with a strict hierarchy of juz. hi
            2. Lindon
              Lindon 16 January 2014 14: 59
              -1
              Quote: Vasya
              Quote: Clegg
              Uzbeks finally artificially created people)))

              The Uzbeks had khanates with their territory.
              The rest of the Central Asians had nothing.


              Go teach history - section Kazakhstan’s accession to Russia.
              The khans were, the embassies and the state apparatus were, the territory was - but there were no khanates !!! Oh how.
            3. The comment was deleted.
            4. Corsair5912
              Corsair5912 16 January 2014 16: 31
              +3
              Quote: Vasya
              The Uzbeks had khanates with their own territory. The rest of the Central Asians had nothing.

              Absolutely.
              Of all the Turks, the most educated, cultural and civilized people are Uzbeks. Tamerlan was Uzbek and the capital of his state was in Samarkand.
      3. washi
        washi 16 January 2014 13: 56
        +1
        Quote: T80UM1
        What a mutual understanding: D Someone else out there stutters about the "great turan". But seriously, during the USSR, part of the territories from Kazakhstan was transferred to Uzbekistan ...

        Quote: T80UM1
        What a mutual understanding: D Someone else out there stutters about the "great turan". But seriously, during the USSR, part of the territories from Kazakhstan was transferred to Uzbekistan ...

        And from the RSFSR - to Kazakhstan.
        Will we change?
        I agree.
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 05
          -3
          And vice versa. Just if the RF changes in the red will be.
    2. VirtusEtHonor
      VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 15: 14
      0
      glory to allalalahu and so on, you collect your cotton on and go on at our construction sites the way everything will remain so.
    3. Semurg
      Semurg 16 January 2014 21: 07
      +4
      Quote: bazilio
      Quote: VirtusEtHonor
      Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all

      Calm Kazakhs, Uzbeks and do not say that they want to unite with you

      I won’t speak for all Kazakhs personally. I’m not against uniting Kazakhs-Uzbeks-Kyrgyz-Turkmen into a confederation, the truth sounds fantastic.
      1. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 17 January 2014 10: 44
        +3
        I think Kazakhstan needs to seriously work out an analogue of the Marshal's Plan for Sr. Asia. And, preferably through the UN, for more careful planning and control and with co-financing. wink
        1. Semurg
          Semurg 17 January 2014 12: 19
          0
          Alibek. I think about the same thing, and Kazakhstan is vitally interested in this, in addition to economic benefits, there are political and humanitarian ones, and in general, living surrounded by prosperous neighbors is much better than surrounded by poor and hungry.
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  • ed65b
    ed65b 16 January 2014 09: 00
    +2
    Quote: VirtusEtHonor
    Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all, you can unite with the Tajiks and leave us alone.

    What do you think the Uzbeks want with the Kazakhs ???? do not tell my mom.
    1. VirtusEtHonor
      VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 15: 15
      +1
      is she a cold boxer? I went to Tashkent, with 100 dollars they were ready to lick me) fun))))
      1. Semurg
        Semurg 16 January 2014 21: 20
        +4
        Quote: VirtusEtHonor
        is she a cold boxer? I went to Tashkent, with 100 dollars they were ready to lick me) fun))))

        Ilyas. when I was little, about 10 years old, my grandmother told me about hunger and that they survived thanks to an Uzbek who bought her sister for a bag of millet. Then I began to make plans for revenge on the closest Uzbek neighbor, the grandmother apparently understood my thoughts and said that I was stupid and that she was grateful to this Uzbek, he could go to the neighboring village and pick up any child there, all adults either left or died of hunger, and he just wanted what if the parents were alive and gave "bata" to marry his grandson to her sister (thanks to this bag of millet they survived). And the fact that now they have difficulties so life is striped, then white, then black.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  • bazilio
    bazilio 16 January 2014 09: 05
    +5
    Quote: VirtusEtHonor
    Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all

    Calm Kazakhs, Uzbeks and do not say that they want to unite with you
    1. aksakal
      aksakal 16 January 2014 09: 29
      +2
      Quote: bazilio
      Calm Kazakhs, Uzbeks and do not say that they want to unite with you

      - in short, the second SABZH is a dreamer and a romantic. These people have nothing to do in politics, except to laugh at them. What kind of association are we talking about? For what purpose? What would be easier for guest workers in Russia? Then what do the Kazakhs have to do with it? They don't go to Russia as "ghasts"! Why did the author of SABZH drag us here? What do Kazakhs have to do with it?
      And I do not think that we were robbed. But this is my IMHO. We were protected, of course, from the Dzungars, but then the danger arose of complete Russification - so we also happily avoided it. At the same time, we have got industry, good state institutions like the education system, healthcare and other things. There were also tragic periods like the Goloshchekinsky ones, but who does not have them? Well, for the first time, Goloshchekin is not Russian, but you know ... The Russians themselves suffered no less from them. There is Bela Kun with a companion, the grandmother of a non-living Udaltsov, which they did in Crimea!
      So what's the question? What kind of robbery? The usual politics, the usual relations between a large and a small state, everywhere in the world. The exception is Israel, which spins the United States.
      Let it unite the countries whose income from "gastronomy" is one of the main ones. And the Uzbeks are the first rivals of the Kazakhs, I say without enmity, in their claims to geopolitical dominance in Central Asia. Everyone has their own trump cards. Uzbeks have large human resources (however, they do not know and do not know how to use these resources. For example, taking into account musical traditions, Uzbeks could easily make money in show business like Sweden, in music they are even better than Swedes, but they DON'T KNOW There are episodic breakthroughs of certain personalities, but there is no SYSTEM! Although they boast that traders can sell snow to a passer-by in winter for money-)))). We have an economy that is already three times larger than the Uzbek economy, together with the Kyrgyz, Turkmen and Tajik economies combined. What the hell is union here? Let's play a game, and then we'll see. And before that - no unification. There are many interesting things in Uzbekistan that could be bought, but all the LIBERALIZATION OF THE UZBEK ECONOMY will never come laughing
      1. washi
        washi 16 January 2014 14: 11
        +1
        Quote: aksakal
        And I do not think that we were robbed. But this is my IMHO. We were protected, of course, from the Dzungars, but then the danger arose of complete Russification - so we also happily avoided it. At the same time, we have got industry, good state institutions like the education system, healthcare and other things

        This is the main thing.
        Used and abandoned, or rather created the conditions for the Russian-speaking to abandon their homes, work.
  • ele1285
    ele1285 16 January 2014 09: 29
    +5
    I want to give you
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • RUSS
    RUSS 16 January 2014 09: 29
    +4
    Tajiks generally stand apart in Middle Asia, because unlike other (Turks) peoples inhabiting this region, the "Indo-European people" are the closest to the Persians, if with whom they will unite so it is with Iranian relatives. By the way, the number of Tajik students in Iran is growing every year.
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 09: 57
      0
      Quote: RUSS
      closest to the Persians, if they unite with whom it is with relatives of the Iranians.

      One catch is that they are Sunnis and Persians are Shiites
      1. RUSS
        RUSS 16 January 2014 10: 16
        +1
        Quote: Clegg
        Quote: RUSS
        closest to the Persians, if they unite with whom it is with relatives of the Iranians.

        One catch is that they are Sunnis and Persians are Shiites


        In geopolitical terms, this is not so important, especially as Tajiks for the most part are not particularly religious.
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 43
          +1
          Quote: RUSS
          especially Tajiks, for the most part, are not particularly religious.

          Uzbeks and Tajiks are more religious than us or the Kyrgyz
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 16 January 2014 14: 12
            0
            Quote: Clegg
            Quote: RUSS
            especially Tajiks, for the most part, are not particularly religious.

            Uzbeks and Tajiks are more religious than us or the Kyrgyz


            In Gorno-Badakhshan, it may be so, but for the most part I disagree, here the traditions and customs are strong among Tajiks, but there is less of religiosity in them, especially among young people, and if we compare with residents on the other side of the Pyanj, then Tajiks are completely "secular nation" ...
            1. Yeraz
              Yeraz 16 January 2014 23: 27
              +1
              Quote: RUSS
              In Gorno-Badakhshan it may be so,

              So there the main population is Pamiri, who are extreme Shiites and do not like Tajiks and vice versa, Tajiks are very afraid of them. Pamiris were more friendly with Azerbaijanis and with some Caucasians who did not have a show.
        2. alone
          alone 16 January 2014 20: 31
          +2
          Quote: RUSS
          In geopolitical terms, this is not so important, especially as Tajiks for the most part are not particularly religious.


          For Iran is of great importance.
        3. Yeraz
          Yeraz 16 January 2014 23: 24
          +1
          Quote: RUSS
          especially Tajiks, for the most part, are not particularly religious.

          You are greatly mistaken of all the former alliances, they are the most religious and I studied with them and the Persians are our brothers, but it sounded so cold compared to the Turks. Their religion was higher than nationalism.
      2. avt
        avt 16 January 2014 12: 17
        +2
        Quote: Clegg
        One catch is that they are Sunnis and Persians are Shiites

        Is there nothing hundred and half there that the Ismailis occupy in Gorny Badokhshan - Shia, and even the extreme?
        1. Yeraz
          Yeraz 16 January 2014 23: 29
          +1
          Quote: avt
          Is there nothing hundred and half there that the Ismailis occupy in Gorny Badokhshan - Shia, and even the extreme?

          THESE PAMIRIANS, who hate the Tajiks and Tajiks for 5 years, have been observing this, and it was the religious theme that really separated them, the Tajiks were especially madly enraged by their Shiite themes, but not national, but they did not help, the Pamiri people are stronger in physical and spiritual terms.
  • Clegg
    Clegg 16 January 2014 09: 51
    +6
    Quote: VirtusEtHonor
    we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all

    who authorized you to speak on behalf of the Kazakhs?
  • Max_Bauder
    Max_Bauder 16 January 2014 12: 16
    +9
    I understand the message of such "unions" - the creation of a certain caliphate with an Islamic state and social system! like the Khiva or Bukhara khanate! mhm! schA, just scatter!

    How will the Central Asians not understand that Islam, what it looks like in other countries, is not at all conducive to political and economic development.

    Use religion in your personal life for education? you are welcome!
    But what for these rallies, demonstrations near the mosque, is simply a provocation to the state in favor of the rich instigators from Arabia.

    I am for a secular, but moral life, as it was in the Union. I do not need gay Europe and illiterate Muslims. We will live in separate states, but with a common military-political course, namely, to prevent the penetration of the United States and China into Asia.

    And you don’t have to play blackmail with the Russians, if you don’t do something, then we will conclude an alliance with these, just like prostitutes, excuse me, it is better to be in alliance with the Russians, they, unlike China, do not need your land. and if the United States flirts with you, it will create opposition from the militants with the help of the Arabs, and to those you are civil, you need it? not! then it’s better to keep the course right.

    and Everything that is going on in Gasteurs in Moscow is very bad, you’ll slaughter the Russians for the sake of the west, then you will get a kick from them, from the west (because they are scammers), maybe later from Russians, for the betrayal of your neighbor.

    And you will go down in history as a people who did not manage to find their right place under the sun and who did not manage to wreck their historical role. We’d better be friends, do not shoot at the border guards, even when there is a reason, and keep the border locked up so that we can work, and the flow of drugs into Russia hit the border each time. hi
    1. avt
      avt 16 January 2014 12: 27
      +2
      Quote: Max_Bauder
      How will the Central Asians not understand that Islam, what it looks like in other countries, is not at all conducive to political and economic development.

      Yes . But I really want and so attractively replace it with the ideology lost with the collapse of the USSR, so I want that even Egypt is not a lesson with the Muslim Brotherhood, it seems so great - they introduced Sharia in kings.
      Quote: Max_Bauder
      And do not play blackmail with the Russians,

      request A voice crying in the desert.
      Quote: Max_Bauder
      If the United States flirts with you, it will create opposition from the militants with the help of the Arabs, and you are civil for those, do you need it?

      What to do . The pride is captivated, it seems that we’re definitely smarter, it’ll certainly blow us over and don’t touch us. And the mechanism is running and the plans are quite voiced. And with the development of their scenario it will be bad for everyone, including Russia, which it is aimed at first of all, as on the player of the Big Game. The ultimate goal is Russia and China, they keep the locals as fuel for the process, just as Trotsky and his comrades kept the Russians as consumables for the world revolution.
    2. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 12: 34
      +1
      Quote: Max_Bauder
      We will live in separate states, but with a common military-political course, namely, to prevent the penetration of the United States and China into Asia.

      laughing How can China be prevented from entering Asia if China itself is in Asia?

      Quote: Max_Bauder
      it is better to be in alliance with the Russians; they, unlike China, do not need your land.

      Well then the Russians occupied us
      1. RUSS
        RUSS 16 January 2014 13: 15
        0
        Quote: Clegg
        Quote: Max_Bauder
        We will live in separate states, but with a common military-political course, namely, to prevent the penetration of the United States and China into Asia.

        laughing How can China be prevented from entering Asia if China itself is in Asia?

        Quote: Max_Bauder
        it is better to be in alliance with the Russians; they, unlike China, do not need your land.

        Well then the Russians occupied us


        Again you are about the occupation, it was the annexation of Kazakh lands with a partial resettlement of Russians in the northern regions of Kazakhstan.
        Occupation (from the Latin. Occupatio - "capture, occupation") in the general case - the occupation by the armed forces of a state of territory not belonging to it, not accompanied by the acquisition of sovereignty over it, usually temporary. The occupation should be distinguished from annexation, the act of annexation by the state of all or part of a foreign territory unilaterally.
      2. Max_Bauder
        Max_Bauder 16 January 2014 14: 39
        +3
        Quote: Clegg
        How can China be prevented from entering Asia if China itself is in Asia?


        Sorry compatriot! I meant the central, land of Turan hi

        Quote: Clegg
        Well then the Russians occupied us


        And thank God! with them we gained independence! smile
        unlike the Uyghurs languishing in the grip of China for about 12 centuries.
    3. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 16 January 2014 13: 13
      +3
      Quote: Max_Bauder
      I understand the message of such "unions" - the creation of a certain caliphate with an Islamic state and social system! like the Khiva or Bukhara khanate! mhm! schA, just scatter!
      In fact, Nazarbayev spoke of the creation of the Central Asian Union in the 90's.
      1. Max_Bauder
        Max_Bauder 16 January 2014 14: 41
        0
        exactly! about military and economic cooperation! but nothing about the unification of land under one flag and government!
  • Fin
    Fin 16 January 2014 12: 22
    0
    Quote: VirtusEtHonor
    Sharipov took the initiative to unite all the countries of the Central Asian region into a single political entity. Well, this comrade sent this statement to the heads of Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan.

    Dear, you need to read carefully:
    Sharipov took the initiative to unite all the countries of the Central Asian region into a single political entity. Well, this comrade sent this statement to the heads of Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan.

    Where is it about Russia?
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. GreatRussia
        GreatRussia 16 January 2014 08: 29
        +5
        Quote: T80UM1
        The army is ruined

        About ten years ago, I would have believed it myself.

        PS Your comment has been deleted? It’s strange.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 16 January 2014 08: 34
          0
          Quote: GreatRussia
          PS Your comment has been deleted? It’s strange.

          He deleted it himself.
          1. GreatRussia
            GreatRussia 16 January 2014 08: 37
            0
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            He deleted it himself.

            I realized that I blurted out something or something? smile
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 40
              -1
              wrong answer, I thought that you blurted out something wrong and deleted :) in general, we did not understand each other.
              1. GreatRussia
                GreatRussia 16 January 2014 08: 43
                +1
                Quote: T80UM1
                wrong answer, I thought that you blurted out something wrong and deleted :) in general, we did not understand each other.

                You said that the army was ruined, the fleet was sunk ...
                What state are you talking about?
                Maybe I really didn’t understand you ....
                1. T80UM1
                  T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 45
                  0
                  It was sarcasm in the direction of the king’s quote made in the 19th century ...
        2. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 38
          0
          you just deleted yours, mine has lost relevance.
          1. GreatRussia
            GreatRussia 16 January 2014 08: 40
            +1
            Quote: T80UM1
            you just deleted yours, mine has lost relevance.

            In my opinion, it lost relevance +/- seven years ago. )))
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 47
              0
              Of course, but the meaning of my comment was that it was necessary to be more modern, now not only the army and navy are two allies, but also the Air Force Diplomacy, economics, etc.

              Once again I will write specifically for you
              "The army has collapsed, the fleet is flooded ... :) We must look for something new to replace the thesis of the 19th century ... after all, the 21st century is in the yard"
              1. GreatRussia
                GreatRussia 16 January 2014 08: 53
                0
                Quote: T80UM1
                one must be more modern, now not only the army and navy are two allies, the Air Force is also Diplomacy, economics, etc.

                In your opinion, all this was absent in the 19th century, esno except for the Air Force? smile Of course, you can also recall missile defense with the Strategic Missile Forces, aerospace defense, etc., if you really find fault. )))))
                1. T80UM1
                  T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 58
                  +1
                  Of course it was present :) But for some reason the king did not indicate it))) Although the economy is much more important than the army and navy, without it there will be neither one nor the other.
                2. Gardamir
                  Gardamir 16 January 2014 11: 42
                  -1
                  Yes, in the 19th century there were both industry and agriculture. Now this is not.
              2. washi
                washi 16 January 2014 14: 21
                +3
                Quote: T80UM1
                "The army has collapsed, the fleet is flooded ... :) We must look for something new to replace the thesis of the 19th century ... after all, the 21st century is in the yard"

                I agree.
                Army and navy, the Strategic Missile Forces is the "last argument of the kings"!
                The media, the Internet, diplomacy, the FSB, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the Foreign Intelligence Service, etc. should work.
                That Stalin was too soft, that GDP.
                Although the situation is the same.
                Then the Trotskyists and agents of capital (mostly Jewish), what now. Although Bukhara’s people come to light, the essence does not change.
  • Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 16 January 2014 08: 24
    +14
    I would very much like to unite all the Central Asians in the Russian expanses into a heap and a COLUMN EIGHT TO THE BORDER, and there let them understand ... yeah.
    1. GreatRussia
      GreatRussia 16 January 2014 09: 03
      +3
      Quote: Valery Neonov
      I would very much like to unite all the Central Asians in the Russian expanses into a heap and a COLUMN EIGHT TO THE BORDER, and there let them understand ... yeah.

      Why only them? Why not all illegal immigrants?

      1. Lk17619
        Lk17619 16 January 2014 09: 19
        +2
        Beautifully lead)))
  • Predator-74
    Predator-74 16 January 2014 08: 25
    +6
    In the near future, I am sure that this is simply a utopia to unite, but Russia needs to strengthen its influence on the leaders of these countries, the most dangerous thing there is of course China.
  • Lk17619
    Lk17619 16 January 2014 08: 26
    +7
    Damn, it seems that little of their Cheka drove in the 20s, they won’t be able to unite, there was always such a cesspool ... For the most part, people who live in cities outside the brain development level remained somewhere in the 5th century BC e. These are mainly nomadic peoples and they do not need anything except yurts and animal husbandry. And they are bandits, steal from your neighbor.
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 38
      +11
      To expand horizons: nomads: Kyrgyz, Kazakhs; settled: Uzbeks, Tajiks and in yurts they never lived. Türks: Uzbeks, Kazakhs, Kyrgyz. Tajiks belong to the peoples of Farsi and are related to the Iranians (Persians). The Cheka drove the Uzbeks, Turkmens and Tajiks (the main contingent of the Basmachi), but not the Kazakhs and partly the Kyrgyz. In villages and villages people are much better than in cities, simpler and more affable, but the fact that they live there is not so hot and according to tradition, it happens, if you were born in a village, I doubt that you would have much better living conditions.
      1. Lk17619
        Lk17619 16 January 2014 09: 05
        -3
        At the expense of the Uzbeks, I agree, but the Tajiks .... Their small part was settled, and the rest wandered anywhere)).
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 09: 12
          +3
          But Tajiks are definitely not nomads :)
          1. UzRus
            UzRus 16 January 2014 09: 52
            0
            That's it. They are also a little highlanders.
  • major071
    major071 16 January 2014 08: 31
    +9
    The Kyrgyz are already "uniting" with the Tajiks at the border with the help of weapons. Kazakhstan will never agree to such a union, and other claims to each other dofig. They cannot divide the territory in any way.
  • makarov
    makarov 16 January 2014 08: 34
    +6
    "Karomat Sharipov came up with an initiative to unite all the countries of the Central Asian region into a single political entity. Well, this comrade sent a corresponding statement to the heads of Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan ..."

    To the opinion of Comrade They listened to the "compromising material" and opened fire on the Tajik-Kyrgyz border fellow
  • predator.3
    predator.3 16 January 2014 08: 37
    +6
    Chairman of the Russian movement “Tajik Labor Migrants” Karomat Sharipov took the initiative to unite all countries of the Central Asian region into a single political entity. Well, this comrade sent this statement to the heads of Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan.


    This is called collecting spiders in one jar, well, Kazakhs and Turkmens saw this union in their coffins, but there was an idea to create a "great Turkic caliphate" after the revolution, but this idea, as it appeared, died!
    Chairman of the Russian movement Tajik Labor Migrants wassat sounds proud! almost like the president of a corporation end is migrant workers!
    1. Asgard
      Asgard 16 January 2014 09: 12
      +7
      Really funny)))
      But We understand that such "nonsense" are being put on his lips by "narrow-minded world rulers" who have already profiled the Kaganate, the Caliphate, the British Empire ...

      well, if the gaster will unite, then exactly before the "Lunch", since the Bowl for everyone is INDIVIDUAL))))
      They already started shooting at each other there, they share WATER)))), they CANNOT organize the work of the HOUSE .... they go to Russia, because the qualifications are NOT VERY ....
      (only serve))
      Technologies ...... and create "PRO-DUCT" - they are not able ...
      Since they cannot do “builds” beyond the “food chain”.

      Therefore, it is extremely funny and amazing to hear such for * Phenomenon from Sharipova kampromata))))
      I WILL TRANSLATE IN RUSSIAN Language, What did he say, "We unite into an even larger herd, and the unfaithful be afraid of us," because the religion of Islam allows you to come with your charter to someone else's "monasteries" and show the local our ASS))))))
    2. washi
      washi 16 January 2014 14: 30
      +2
      Quote: predator.3
      This is called collecting spiders in one jar, well, Kazakhs and Turkmens saw this union in their graves, but there was an idea after the revolution to create a "great Turkic caliphate", but this idea, as it appeared, and died! The chairman of the Russian movement "Tajik labor migrants" sounds proudly! almost like the president of the corporation and guest workers!

      Sorry, but when the IDEA was ALL NORMALLY LIVED AND WORKED IN ONE COUNTRY.
      It is necessary to change the Constitution of 1993 to the Constitution of 1936, in the original (Stalin's version), or (at least) in the current version. Or accept the proposals of the IVS at the 19th Party Congress and the laws of the Stalinist USSR.
  • svoi
    svoi 16 January 2014 08: 39
    +4
    Quote: VirtusEtHonor
    Polekhce, Uzbeks, we Kazakhs do not want to unite with you at all, you can unite with the Tajiks and leave us alone.

    If the Uzbeks want only peace - why there are so many of them here (Khomutovo, a village under construction near Irkutsk), there are fewer Kazakhs, but there are also, sometimes you feel like in the eastern bazaar. Here Siberia is far from the climatic range of these nationalities. And then they see, whether they don’t need Russia, they need peace, but they don’t sit at home, or again, the damned Russian imperialists are to blame for everything?
    1. VirtusEtHonor
      VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 08: 47
      +9
      completely moved your head? firstly, Kazakhs have been living in Siberia for a long time, and they are indigenous in that area, as in Astrakhan. secondly, it’s more expensive for us to hang out with Uzbeks and Tajiks, they are like cheap slave power. about peace - from these initiatives from the good southern neighbors, they will fire at our border guards, they will move the border, these cotton growers will be completely greyhound. And where do you see the Russians that I somehow mention? Or paranoia is already eating up, we are not Poles, not Baltic, we are normal towards the Russian Federation.
      1. Old_kapitan
        Old_kapitan 16 January 2014 08: 53
        +5
        Firstly, in Siberia, Kazakhs have long lived
        A Kazakh colleague told me that in northern Kazakhstan there is such a climate - Siberia is resting.
        1. VirtusEtHonor
          VirtusEtHonor 16 January 2014 08: 55
          +3
          Well, it’s unlikely, but yes, there is no sugar, at -40 -50, and there is little steppe and forest belts, the wind makes its way to the bones.
          1. Old_kapitan
            Old_kapitan 16 January 2014 08: 58
            0
            but yes, there is no sugar, under -40 -50, where there is little steppe and forest belts, the wind makes its way to the bones.
            Exactly. That's exactly what he told. Not Oymyakon, of course, but the people are accustomed to the cold.
          2. washi
            washi 16 January 2014 14: 45
            0
            Quote: VirtusEtHonor
            Well, it’s unlikely, but yes, there is no sugar, at -40 -50, and there is little steppe and forest belts, the wind makes its way to the bones.

            and who planted these forest belts? (he took part). Who dug ditches, ponds, built reservoirs?
            On the day of the city, flies came from somewhere and showed us races on some ponies, put yurts.
            I still wonder: where did they get them?
            The Kazakh initiative was urban or sent from the region.
        2. washi
          washi 16 January 2014 14: 38
          +2
          Quote: Old_Kapitan
          Firstly, in Siberia, Kazakhs have long lived
          A Kazakh colleague told me that in northern Kazakhstan there is such a climate - Siberia is resting.

          Northern Kazakhstan is the former territory of the RSFSR. And this is also Siberia. Sharply continental climate. It’s cold in winter. It's hot in summer.
          Historic Kazakhstan begins south of Lake Balkhash. To the north drove the weakest tribes.
          1. Zymran
            Zymran 16 January 2014 14: 42
            +4
            Vasya, do you want to sleep, huh?
          2. Yeraz
            Yeraz 16 January 2014 23: 31
            0
            Quote: Vasya
            Northern Kazakhstan is the former territory of the RSFSR.

            hahha, yeah how come)))
      2. T80UM1
        T80UM1 16 January 2014 08: 56
        +6
        I agree, Astrakhan was not a Russian city from the beginning, the Astrakhan or Siberian Khanates, this is so offhand ... So the Kazakhs live on their land.
        1. washi
          washi 16 January 2014 14: 46
          +2
          Quote: T80UM1
          I agree, Astrakhan was not a Russian city from the beginning, the Astrakhan or Siberian Khanates, this is so offhand ... So the Kazakhs live on their land.

          Cossacks live on their land.
          1. T80UM1
            T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 48
            +3
            .......................deleted by moderator Apollo In Kazakh, if you want
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 50
              +1
              [quote = T80UM1] .....................deleted by moderator Apollo [/ Quote]
              I am Kazakh and did not understand what you wrote, why write a Russian in a language incomprehensible to him?
              1. T80UM1
                T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 58
                0
                Do you know Kazakh? belay
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 16 January 2014 15: 07
                  +1
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  Do you know Kazakh?

                  .........................deleted by moderator Apollo)) Well, how are there doubts?
                  1. T80UM1
                    T80UM1 16 January 2014 15: 13
                    0
                    It’s great, and now my move, they taught me that way, if you don’t understand what I wish you to go to be a teacher of the Kazakh language, it’s not important to go to school or university, because they teach it badly both here and there, the most important thing is without a soul.
                    1. Clegg
                      Clegg 16 January 2014 15: 26
                      +2
                      T80
                      You may or may not know the Kazakh language, this is your personal matter. I do not condemn and I have no right to condemn.
            2. Semurg
              Semurg 16 January 2014 21: 37
              +2
              Quote: T80UM1
              ...................deleted by moderator Apollo In Kazakh, if you want

              Alexei. a few words if it changes correctly and I really liked the desire to write Kazakh, don’t complex write and speak Kazakh with Kazakhs and even if some Kazakhs chuckle do not pay attention. True, on this site in the rules it is forbidden to write in languages ​​other than Russian.
            3. The comment was deleted.
      3. svoi
        svoi 16 January 2014 10: 16
        +2
        [quote = VirtusEtHonor] completely moved your head? firstly, Kazakhs have been living in Siberia for a long time, and they are indigenous in that area, as in Astrakhan. I have never seen a single native Kazakh; I did not pass a single Kazakh settlement; I traveled quite a few across Siberia. You do not drill with the Tuvans, you mean, with the Kazakhs these ethnic groups have little in common.
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 11: 48
          +2
          southern Siberia: Omsk, Orenburg, part of the Urals, southern Volga, just there the Slavs appeared in the 15th century ...
        2. FormerMariman
          FormerMariman 16 January 2014 13: 15
          +3
          Ridiculous fellow! He "drove a lot", before you and all your Ermakovs and other "heroes-conquerors", all these are our nomads and our lands. So shut up and read history, not only after the Stolypin reform, but many centuries earlier!
  • Old_kapitan
    Old_kapitan 16 January 2014 08: 44
    +5
    We have Bandera, in Central Asia - Basmachi ... However, the trend. Bad trend ... One hope - they will tear each other's throats for a long time, not before unification.
  • Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. 16 January 2014 08: 48
    +3
    They invented another caliphate. And like living under feudalism like this, radical Islam will sooner or later lead to this. Probably being a buy count.
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 10: 00
      +2
      Quote: Yuri Ya.
      They invented another caliphate.

      Should anyone say that they are Muslims, they immediately gathered to build a caliphate))) what kind of primitive thinking?
  • UzRus
    UzRus 16 January 2014 08: 49
    +6
    Sharipov is still that * udak from the barn, "famous" for his statements. There will never be such a union that he wants. Turkmenistan is neutral in life, it is happy with itself. Uzbekistan and Tajikistan? Don't tell my panties! The same can be said about Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan. Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan are also very unlikely. Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan - well, if only because of Issyk-Kul ... fellow Kazakhstan and Tajikistan - what's the point? Tajikistan and Kyrgyzstan - maybe there are no such contradictions between them. As a result, taking into account Sharipov's ugly statements about the "occupants" (he lives, mutaham, in Russia and also crumbles a loaf on it) - drive him na.he.r out of there!
    P.S. Dear administrators, a huge request to you - remove this mattress flag for God's sake! I'm in vain!
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 16 January 2014 12: 12
      +2
      Quote: UzRus
      remove this mattress flag for God's sake! I'm in vain!

      Sanya check the box opposite born in the USSR, should change. I have different mobile phones.
    2. aksakal
      aksakal 16 January 2014 14: 29
      0
      Quote: UzRus
      P.S. Dear administrators, a huge request to you - remove this mattress flag for God's sake! I'm in vain!

      - Moderators, yes respect the request of a respected forum member, stop the sophisticated mockery! UZRus sympathize, but I think soon you will be under the flag you need and more worthy of you -))))
    3. polkovnik manuch
      polkovnik manuch 21 January 2014 14: 35
      0
      I completely agree with you. Why hasn’t this deer (Caliphate builder) been deported yet?
  • ed65b
    ed65b 16 January 2014 09: 02
    +7
    people are you seriously discussing the nonsense of the "mountain donkey" ???? It is high time for this leader to send home to visit Rakhmon, they are waiting for him there.
  • Goodmen
    Goodmen 16 January 2014 09: 03
    +7
    "... I think that the time has come to bring to life the idea of ​​the nationalists of the 20s" about uniting the different peoples of Central Asia into a single political whole, "sums up the leader of the movement ..."

    A good application for victory, b..t ... and this stub with such ideas is the head of the gastorbiter movement in the Russian Federation? .. hello to the secret services ... Who has doubts that he is already trying to realize part of his crazy ideas in the Russian Federation? ?
    Already, the rally of the Caucasians was going to support ...
    Or maybe he is so cunning .. bann .. I am a puppet in the hands of our security forces? belay Can I panic in vain? And the situation is under control ... Maybe he is an agent 007-A-381-CHF? wink

    And on the question of the author ... you need to put them in their place so that they would be afraid and respected. And sweep first all this locust from the Russian Federation. Allow only very limited and trained specialists. And with Asian countries (Kazakhstan and Turkmenistan, I don’t mean it, everything is fine with them) to conduct a business, tough policy, taking into account the specifics of the regional mentality. A stick and a little gingerbread ... just like that ...
  • Mikl1977
    Mikl1977 16 January 2014 09: 07
    +1
    Good article. Thanks to the author! There is something to ponder ...
  • Humpty
    Humpty 16 January 2014 09: 14
    +3
    This Karomat Sharipov is an ordinary provocateur, and a stupid one. Another goat-head "thinking globally". Surely his paid pearl is not directed to his sponsored victims of incest. This is rather the dumbest appeal to the Russians. With regards to the Tajiks, not all of them are abgemakht among themselves. With whom in Asia they can find unity, except for their brothers in mind from northern Afghanistan. Instead of uniting, for example, in the Ferghana Valley, they are more willing to tear each other's nostrils because of the irrigation ditch or the fact that why your ram kyushli my grass.
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 09: 14
    +6
    Quote: aksakal
    These countries need help in building an economy. They were grateful to the Russians for this.

    ______________
    They had an industry right up to aircraft factories ... What kind of economy did they have? The economy of shovels and spatulas has not yet been invented ...
  • kagorta
    kagorta 16 January 2014 09: 29
    +5
    This desire will unite from simple. All they want is that they would not be robbed at the borders between each other. But only on our lol
    What should we want from the Central Asian states? These should be stable secular regimes capable of protecting themselves. Must be our high-tech product markets. We must receive from there raw materials and other resources (including labor, but only in an organized manner, and not as it is now). In general, the format of soft colonialism.
  • Z.A.M.
    Z.A.M. 16 January 2014 09: 33
    +5
    I answer the author (pRofF).
    I have long understood ... wrote, it’s very funny. Only the baby will not understand this. I realized that the BORDER is necessary Its: 1) to have, 2) to strengthen, 3) to fasten, and once again to strengthen and fasten.
    For me, fables and "snot" are length and landscape. Yes, even bury everything with mines, even level where necessary, at least shoot off the areas of penetration or POSSIBLE penetration with missiles.
    The first is a reliable border. There are locks on each door.
    But then you can be friends, from afar.
    All talk about Хe-politics and Шstrategic interests, too, fed up with the order. As an analogy - almost seriously discuss manned flights to Mars fool , having at hand, under the FEET, the world UNKNOWN OCEAN, count the second COSMOS. No, fuck, give Mars. Strategists ... geo ... no - cosmopolitan laughing What a funny word ...

    The second one. Want to team up? Yes to health. Don’t touch Russia. And all - to himself, home ... even settled down. I would even change to compatriots.
    And I support Neon
    Quote: Valery Neonov
    I would very much like to unite all the Central Asians in the Russian expanses into a heap and a COLUMN EIGHT TO THE BORDER, and there let them understand ... yeah.

    And I agree with
    Quote: predator.3
    This is called collecting spiders in one jar, well, Kazakhs and Turkmens saw this union in their coffins, but there was an idea to create a "great Turkic caliphate" after the revolution, but this idea, as it appeared, died!


    So, you need to rely only on yourself (Russia) and DO NOT trust ANYONE. Listen, HEAR and ... do not trust. But having a STRONG border. Hello to all the border guards.
    Auto RU hi
    1. UzRus
      UzRus 16 January 2014 10: 03
      +5
      Here is the first Russian in this thread who remembered his compatriots and would like to pick them up (exchange) ...
  • mak210
    mak210 16 January 2014 09: 46
    +6
    Complete nonsense. The author, obviously, does not represent the mentality of the Central Asians at all. "We unite and I cease to be a big BOSS? And what will my children and relatives (teip, tribe) say?" Unscientific fiction. And religion has nothing to do with it, look at Asia Minor or North Africa. Do you think they care for the people? No matter how it is, they dream of becoming a boss, no matter what is around the devastation, but I command and do nothing.

    How many lunatics walk the earth. If you listen to their delusions, you yourself will become so.
  • Celmz
    Celmz 16 January 2014 10: 52
    +2
    and in general, such provocative statements so casually do not come across the eyes, such nonsense can only be purposefully found
    1. FormerMariman
      FormerMariman 16 January 2014 13: 25
      +1
      And this site lives on this! He takes out different nonsense from behind the baseboard, publishes it, and that’s all, then we will cross ourselves, redistribute the land and declare war on each other!
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 16 January 2014 10: 52
    +4
    Therefore, in order for the peoples of Central Asia not to be burned in the hellish fire of the "cauldron of ethnic contradictions", I believe that the time has come to bring to life the idea of ​​the nationalists of the 20s "about uniting the different peoples of Central Asia into a single political whole." sums up the leader of the movement. - In this case, a common regional interest will appear and the Central Asian peoples will become less vulnerable.

    The nationalists of the 20s are the watchdogs of Small Britain, the pan-Turkists cursed by the peoples, the builders of the "Great Turan" under Turkish rule, the initiators of the Basmachism, financed and armed by the British until 1943 (before the meeting of the Big Three in Tehran).
    During the Great Patriotic War, the Pan-Turkists sniffed out with Hitler, recruited emigrants of Tatars, Turkmens, Tajiks, Uzbeks into the "Eastern Legion", collaborated with German spies, tried to organize sabotage on Turksib, sabotage and uprisings of nationalists and other anti-Soviet elements in the rear of the fighting RKKA.
    Again these creatures creep out into the light.
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 16 January 2014 12: 17
      +3
      Quote: Corsair5912
      During the Great Patriotic War, the Pan-Turkists sniffed out with Hitler, recruited emigrants of Tatars, Turkmens, Tajiks, Uzbeks into the "Eastern Legion", collaborated with German spies, tried to organize sabotage on Turksib, sabotage and uprisings of nationalists and other anti-Soviet elements in the rear of the fighting RKKA.

      There is such a thing and the Kazakhs about their "Vlasov" even made a film glorifying his activities. And they are quite proud of their Bandera.
      1. Clegg
        Clegg 16 January 2014 12: 25
        0
        Quote: ed65b
        There is such a thing about Kazakhs about their "Vlasov"

        If you mean Mustafa Shokai, then he is a hero for me and no traitor, for the USSR was not his homeland and, accordingly, it is impossible to betray that country that you do not consider homeland.
        Clearly explained?
        1. ed65b
          ed65b 16 January 2014 12: 57
          +5
          Quote: Clegg
          Quote: ed65b
          There is such a thing about Kazakhs about their "Vlasov"

          If you mean Mustafa Shokai, then he is a hero for me and no traitor, for the USSR was not his homeland and, accordingly, it is impossible to betray that country that you do not consider homeland.
          Clearly explained?

          No, it’s not clear. Why is he a hero for you and people like you, because they killed Soviet citizens? Ukrainian Natsiks are also considered heroes of Bandera and his cove. How then are you different from this beast? For you, Hitler is a hero, because the USSR was not his homeland fool
          1. Clegg
            Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 18
            -5
            Quote: ed65b
            Why is he a hero for you?

            Patriot of his people

            Quote: ed65b
            the fact that they killed Soviet citizens?

            Soviet citizens excite me as well as English or German citizens, that is, they do not care at all.
            You can consider me a beast, a Natsik, and someone else, but WWII is a strange and senseless war where the Kazakhs were dying for the Russian country without their own.
            Is Hitler a hero or a beast? Violet
            PS: I don’t have to tell stories here in advance that if Hitler defeated he would destroy all the Kazakhs, etc.
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 19
              +6
              just "great comment", especially cynical: "they died for the Russian country" and "WWII". And what are you in a personal indignant for a supporter of National Socialism?
              1. Clegg
                Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 39
                -2
                Quote: T80UM1
                And what are you in PM outraged for the supporter of National Socialism?

                Well, I’m not a supporter of National Socialism,

                Quote: T80UM1
                were dying for the Russian country

                The USSR was essentially a Russian country,

                Quote: T80UM1
                WWII

                Well, yes, WWII, not WWII
                1. T80UM1
                  T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 41
                  +4
                  That is, when we build, we do something in the Kazakh SSR at a common expense, it is a common country of the USSR, but how to fight for it is a "Russian country"
            2. The comment was deleted.
              1. The comment was deleted.
                1. ed65b
                  ed65b 16 January 2014 16: 37
                  +6
                  Quote: Clegg
                  Quote: ed65b
                  Then I will answer you simply YOU M.U.D.A.K. fool and B.A.P.A.N

                  answered in a personal, given it was necessary to ban you inadequate

                  only such nameless feces as you can swear in a personal and shake the air with "bans". In fact, you are what you wrote to me only covered with flies.
            3. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 34
              +4
              Quote: Clegg
              You can consider me a beast, natsik and someone else

              you guessed it fool
              1. Clegg
                Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 37
                -2
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                you guessed it

                I sympathize
              2. matross
                matross 16 January 2014 16: 52
                0
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                You can consider me a beast, natsik and someone else
                you guessed it

                This opinion is general and therefore correct! negative
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 16 January 2014 16: 55
                  -2
                  Quote: matRoss
                  This opinion is general and therefore correct!

                  Well, the opinion of the padded jacket)
            4. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 34
              +1
              Quote: Clegg
              You can consider me a beast, natsik and someone else

              you guessed it fool
            5. UzRus
              UzRus 16 January 2014 16: 39
              +4
              Is Hitler a hero or a beast? Violet - Hmm ... That is, if you follow the logic, millions of tortured and burned in concentration camps, every fourth killed Belarus is so nonsense, and Hitler is a hero-liberator? To go nuts - do not get up !!!!!! When you write this, you need to think about the fact that many on this site (regardless of nationality) grandfathers fought and died ...
              where the Kazakhs were dying for the Russian country without having their own - But then what are you doing on the Russian military-patriotic site?
              WWII is a strange and senseless war - For you - yes, but for the fighters of the Panfilov division - no.
              1. Clegg
                Clegg 16 January 2014 16: 50
                0
                Quote: UzRus
                But then what are you doing on the Russian military-patriotic site?

                should i leave?
                1. UzRus
                  UzRus 17 January 2014 08: 49
                  0
                  should i leave? - Yes, I am violet! This is not necessary to write!
                  1. Clegg
                    Clegg 17 January 2014 09: 09
                    -1
                    Quote: UzRus
                    This is not necessary to write!

                    Will you now tell me what to write? What I consider necessary, I will write
                    1. UzRus
                      UzRus 17 January 2014 11: 33
                      +1
                      Yes, I don’t indicate anything to anyone, just respect the feelings of other people ...
                      1. Clegg
                        Clegg 17 January 2014 12: 42
                        -1
                        Quote: UzRus
                        just respect other people's feelings ...

                        What is hi, such is the answer, it depends on them. Ball on their side
                      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 17 January 2014 13: 04
                        0
                        Quote: Clegg
                        What is hi, this is the answer, it depends on them

                        for the sake of self-interest, say it once
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 16 January 2014 18: 15
            +5
            Quote: Clegg
            You can consider me a beast, a Natsik, and someone else, but WWII is a strange and senseless war where the Kazakhs were dying for the Russian country without their own.
            Is Hitler a hero or a beast? Violet

            That rot and climbed.
            Kazakhs were citizens of the USSR and Soviet people, such as Russians, Ukrainians, Uzbeks, Tatars.
            If the enemy invaded the territory of Kazakhstan, all citizens of the USSR would also fight shoulder to shoulder against a common enemy, except stateless people like you.
            So it was during the border conflict with China on 12 on August 1969 of the year near Lake Zhalanashkol (south of Lake Alakol) when the Russian border guards knocked out the Chinese from Kazakhstan.
        2. Zymran
          Zymran 16 January 2014 13: 21
          +1
          He did not kill Soviet citizens; he actually died at the end of 1941.
          1. ed65b
            ed65b 16 January 2014 14: 31
            +2
            Quote: Zymran
            He did not kill Soviet citizens; he actually died at the end of 1941.

            He is not, he just recruited, and others killed. This does not change the essence.
            1. Zymran
              Zymran 16 January 2014 14: 37
              +1
              He didn’t actually recruit,

              ... seeing how representatives of the nation that brought up such geniuses as Goethe, Feuerbach, Bach, Beethoven, Schopenhauer are treating prisoners of war ... I can’t accept the offer ... to lead the Turkestan legion and refuse further cooperation. I recognize all the consequences of my decision.
              1. ed65b
                ed65b 16 January 2014 16: 42
                +3
                Quote: Zymran
                He didn’t actually recruit,

                ... seeing how representatives of the nation that brought up such geniuses as Goethe, Feuerbach, Bach, Beethoven, Schopenhauer are treating prisoners of war ... I can’t accept the offer ... to lead the Turkestan legion and refuse further cooperation. I recognize all the consequences of my decision.

                M. Shokai came to a concentration camp accompanied by the German military. His fellow countrymen were lined up on the parade ground and he addressed them with a speech explaining the situation and making it clear that the mediocre military leadership threw them into the meat grinder of the war without any support, and was completely not going to rescue them from captivity. To join the Muslim, as the Germans called it, the legion, he proposed to volunteers.

                and what's that? distribution of ice cream ??
    2. Lindon
      Lindon 16 January 2014 15: 13
      +3
      Quote: ed65b

      There is such a thing and the Kazakhs about their "Vlasov" even made a film glorifying his activities. And they are quite proud of their Bandera.


      Fairy tales. Surname and facts in the studio - about his Vlasov. Where, when, what units and on which front commanded. In what camps did I recruit volunteers and how many.
      No need to feed bikes.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 12: 11
    +5
    article minus for only one title.
    the question is so stupid that it’s not even clear which side to start answering it.
    1. Do we need a CA or not, with the same success you can ask whether we need air or not, if we leave the CA after 15-20 years at the borders we will get extremely hostile states that our sworn friends will set us on
    2. if we still want to be respected there, then such headings do not need to be written when I read "zagRashka" on their sites, etc. then it does not add love and respect
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 12: 29
      +1
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      if we still want to be respected there, then such headings do not need to be written when I read on their sites "zagRashka", etc. then you don't add love and respect

      for once I agree with you)))
  • Neophyte
    Neophyte 16 January 2014 12: 35
    +1
    They will never be a single state! Tribal ties, a clan system of power, long-standing feuds between tribes are a natural communication in the coming centuries. For Russia - Central Asia is an eternal headache since entering the 19th century, trying to resist the Englishwoman .Remind and commemorate the Russians
    soldier in the paintings of Vereshchagin: shoulder to shoulder in the ring of wild basmachi! Everything remains now. We pay
    Great price for the nomads from Asia invading us.
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 12: 56
      0
      Quote: Neophyte
      Central Asia is an eternal headache

      once again, look at the map, and then think if we need an even bigger headache, it is not realistic to close the entire border, and when those who are extremely aggressive towards the Russians, brought up in hatred of Russia, will trample across the border to hunt for "heads", then the Crimean Khanate incited by the Ottomans will seem to us a matinee in kindergarten
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 16 January 2014 18: 22
        +1
        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
        brought up in hatred of Russia will trample across the border to hunt for "heads", then the Crimean Khanate incited by the Ottomans will seem to us a matinee in kindergarten

        Do not trample, not those times, there are no and will not be Ottomans at the Gaster.
        The Krymchaks would not have had the support of the Ottomans, they would have been cleaned up after the first raid.
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 18: 46
          0
          Quote: Corsair5912
          Do not trample, not those times

          will trample and shit, for the sake of interest, read the "patriotic" sites
          1. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 16 January 2014 19: 01
            +1
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            will trample and shit, for the sake of interest, read the "patriotic" sites

            Those who act from sites from a young age are not capable of much in real life.
            There are some heroes who were Georgians in their speeches, and as it came to a showdown, they drapanuli, abandoning equipment and weapons.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 19: 12
              0
              Quote: Corsair5912
              There are some heroes who were Georgians in their speeches, but how it came to a showdown

              and dismantling and minor dirty tricks are different things, in the second case, courage is not needed
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • FormerMariman
    FormerMariman 16 January 2014 13: 22
    +7
    I know that I am speaking rudely, but add that the Caucasus and Tatarstan and all of you ardently hated non-Russian peoples will leave you. You will remain as a truly white race with its Moscow, Oryol, Novgorod and other provinces. Your intolerance rolls over and with your antagonism towards non-Russians you are kindling a fire in yourself, you yourself do not understand!
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 13: 29
      0
      Former Mariman to you such a question, if I may, on your profile is written "Patriot of Kazakhstan". The Soviet flag is how to understand it?
      1. T80UM1
        T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 10
        +1
        As I can understand ... Apparently you are surprised?
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 14
          +1
          Quote: T80UM1
          As I can understand ..

          You at least openly wrote that it is not a "small town" and for you the homeland is the USSR. And, you are not a patriot of Kazakhstan. IMHO
          1. T80UM1
            T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 22
            +2
            Correctly, I am a patriot of the USSR is more than just Kazakhstan, Kazakhstan is part of the USSR and Kazakhs are Soviet citizens who have all the rights to all the achievements and victories of the USSR, including the victory in the Great Patriotic War, space flight. They are citizens of a superpower. What does not suit you?
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 14: 24
              +1
              unfortunately, this does not suit many young Kazakhs
              1. T80UM1
                T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 29
                +2
                The amendment does not suit the National Socialists of Kazakhstan and Russia, because they can offer nothing in exchange except for national intolerance ...
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 15: 47
                  +1
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  The amendment does not suit the National Socialists of both Kazakhstan and Russia

                  Unfortunately, this rhetoric is absorbed by the younger generation.
                2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 15: 47
                  +1
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  The amendment does not suit the National Socialists of both Kazakhstan and Russia

                  Unfortunately, this rhetoric is absorbed by the younger generation.
            2. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 28
              0
              Quote: T80UM1
              Kazakhstan is part of the USSR and Kazakhs are Soviet citizens,

              Fortunately for me there were, in the past tense it is necessary to write, and the rest is your dreams and nothing more.

              We discussed this more than once, why again? For the Soviet Union alien, finally understand. I choose Kazakhstan and that's it! I don't need any superpower
              1. T80UM1
                T80UM1 16 January 2014 14: 39
                +3
                It is clear that you choose Kazakhstan, but I am Kazakhstan in the USSR and that’s the point. And I need a superpower, because the current world order system is rotten through and through thanks to your beloved Atlantists ...
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 48
                  -2
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  It is clear that you choose Kazakhstan, but I am Kazakhstan in the USSR and that’s the point.

                  Well, a mustache then, everyone will remain with them. So what's the problem then?
                  I just asked Mariman what kind of patriot he was of Kazakhstan or the USSR, and you got hooked. I have already expressed all my views to you, why ask again?
                2. romb
                  romb 16 January 2014 15: 01
                  +3
                  Well, I am Kazakhstan in the USSR and the point.

                  Alexei! This is no longer possible to return. Over the past twenty-odd years, a lot of things have changed, and first of all, the attitude of citizens and national elites of the CIS countries to processes of closer integration. If even the usual issues of economic cooperation between countries cause very serious debate, what can we say about such serious things as the prospect of loss / transfer as a whole or of a separate part of their state sovereignty to some supranational structures, or newly-minted state formation. The little that we can afford now is the strengthening of economic and military-political cooperation in the framework of bilateral or collective agreements. And everything else - from the evil one!
              2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 18: 08
                +2
                Quote: Clegg
                I choose Kazakhstan and that's it! I don't need any superpower

                but simply without cunning, when Kazakhstan was better - socially economically scientific then or now ?!
      2. FormerMariman
        FormerMariman 16 January 2014 15: 28
        +1
        Born in USSR!
        1. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 22: 08
          0
          Born in USSR! +)))
  • Neophyte
    Neophyte 16 January 2014 13: 26
    +1
    A headache is the constant help to medieval entities in exchange for refusing to place Amer bases in Central Asia. That's such an Asian politician!
  • Kasupogatr
    Kasupogatr 16 January 2014 13: 35
    +1
    It is useless to argue. We desperately need military bases abroad, and they are located precisely in Tajikistan, Armenia, Abkhazia and South Ossetia. So they have to be friends with them from geopolitical and military considerations. In Tartus, the base is only providing - repair. In Cyprus, if there is one, then that too. But real military bases only in the near abroad
    1. Sour
      Sour 16 January 2014 17: 22
      +2
      Quote: Kasupogatr
      We desperately need military bases abroad, and they are located precisely in Tajikistan, Armenia, Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

      We desperately need normal roads, normal sidewalks, an efficient housing and communal services system, bridges and overpasses, new metro stations in large cities, affordable medical services, allocations for basic science, and so on. And the rest is not desperately needed, but as the main problems are resolved. I do not see the connection between the improvement of the situation in the country and the military bases in Tajikistan or Armenia. A great country is one that everyone is jealous of, and not that everyone is afraid of (for example, Turks or Afghans are afraid).
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 14: 02
    +1
    In general, the scenario is that only one is realized - the power suppression of local elites, the placement in the leadership of the territory of the Russian governor in the form of a governor general; the construction of local enterprises at the beginning of the lower redistribution, agricultural production, primitive assembly; the gradual demolition of feudal customs with the cultivation of the population, and so on ... That is, the colonial model, but with inverse investment and cultural ties ... But this also does not work very well, they do not want to leave feudalism ...
  • pRofF
    16 January 2014 14: 08
    +2
    Thanks to everyone for the comments, even negative ones (criticism is also useful). If I involuntarily provoked some sort of clarification of relations, then I sincerely apologize. I did not plan anything like this and did not want to. The purpose of writing a note was to listen to the opinions of visitors to VO. That's all. If in the future it is still possible to write, then by all means I will take into account all the errors and wordings so that it looks less annoying.

    Sincerely, Egor.
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 14: 11
      +2
      Quote: pRofF
      If I involuntarily provoked some sort of clarification of relations, then I sincerely apologize.

      Gasterbeiterstan is normal in your opinion?
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 15: 44
        +1
        Quote: Clegg
        Gasterbeiterstan is normal in your opinion?

        the person kind of apologized
      3. pRofF
        16 January 2014 16: 10
        +3
        If hurt by something - forgive generously. The title of the note proceeded from the activities of Mr. Sharipov and others like him. You will not deny that he and people like him are now actively operating throughout the space of the Central Asian republics? Indeed, Kazakhstan can be taken out of the brackets - you have industry, education, and good living conditions for most citizens of the state. But on the other hand, Nazarbayev is very old. And who will replace him is a big question. If a strong and charismatic leader, then he will be able to maintain order. If the exact opposite is the case, a mess actively developing in other countries of Middle Asia will come to you, and then to us.

        The topic is really extremely difficult to discuss. In general, I’m not glad that such an ardent debate began with the transition to the individual. Counted on more calm opinions and discussions. I will consider errors.

        Sincerely, Egor.
        1. Zymran
          Zymran 16 January 2014 16: 13
          +2
          Yes, good. In disputes, truth is born.
    2. dropout
      dropout 16 January 2014 14: 54
      +1
      all those Basmachi, Beks and Khans whom the Red Banner Cheka drove for a long time along the dunes,

      This phrase from your article is the answer to all questions.
  • zol
    zol 16 January 2014 14: 16
    +2
    The article is a provocation, and unfortunately there are quite a lot of similar articles published on this site. It feels like this is being done intentionally. Their goal is to bring schism and confusion along the line, Russians are Asians, Russians are Caucasians, Christians are Muslims.
    1. mak210
      mak210 16 January 2014 14: 42
      +3
      Logic is a class! They beat all the Russians (Kazakhstan did not drive out, but all the bosses somehow happened - the Kazakhs. Obviously by chance), they destroyed the industry, and now we have to kiss them in the ass? Suitcase, station - Dushanbe. I did not come up with this motto; I saw it in Frunze on fences. To understand what is waiting for Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, just look at the chronicle of Afghanistan. Decaying shacks covered with donkey dung, poppy fields and babies with AK-47.
    2. pRofF
      16 January 2014 16: 11
      +2
      If hurt by something - forgive generously. The title of the note proceeded from the activities of Mr. Sharipov and others like him.

      The topic is really extremely difficult to discuss. In general, I’m not glad that such an ardent debate began with the transition to the individual. Counted on more calm opinions and discussions. I will consider errors.

      Sincerely, Egor.
  • striker
    striker 16 January 2014 14: 56
    -7
    Author pRofF
    So I want to ask - what do you think, gentlemen-comrades?

    We think we need to give the entire Central Asian menagerie (Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan), together with all their Islamic "mobilizing factor" and "ideas of nationalists of the 20s of the XX century", to China, and Kazakhstan should be divided along the Aral-Balkhash line. Let the southern part go to the Chinese, and Russia will regain the northern lands of the Semirechensk Cossacks and the western Caspian part.
    Well, as for the Kazakhs, let's leave the Karaganda region. Enough for them and "Great Karaganda". laughing

    We do not need such "allies". Let the Han people "assimilate" these Islamists Sharik-Sharipovs.
    1. romb
      romb 16 January 2014 15: 03
      +5
      Ah-ah-ah-ah ... krasava, let trolyatina, burn on. laughing
      1. striker
        striker 16 January 2014 19: 57
        -2
        Learn Chinese, maybe you will pass for a Han, in Russia an Asian "Russian" cannot be all the same No.

        1. alone
          alone 16 January 2014 20: 46
          +2
          In fact, more than half of the territory of Russia is geographically related to Asia.
  • Shpagolom
    Shpagolom 16 January 2014 15: 08
    +3
    .... some kind of nonsense and not a polit.unification .... Kazakhstan can’t do this, at home, and so it’s working!
  • ed65b
    ed65b 16 January 2014 16: 50
    +3
    So much for independence in Kazakhstan. "nameless feces" glorify German lackeys. The rest are to blame for the Russians for not wanting to lick Asians in the ass. Why are you sitting on our Russian sites and trying to urinate on us? can you delete your aki and settle in your Kazakh segment of the Internet? there and throw feces at each other. And here you are guests, and behave like guests.
    1. Shpagolom
      Shpagolom 16 January 2014 17: 11
      +2
      ... respected in a helmet, it is just as important for us as things are in Russia, we are not enemies of it, many things bind us, much less you forget. That a lot of our Russian, Russian, Soviet people live in the SA!
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 16 January 2014 17: 49
        +2
        Quote: Shpagolom
        ... respected in a helmet, it is just as important for us as things are in Russia, we are not enemies of it, many things bind us, much less you forget. That a lot of our Russian, Russian, Soviet people live in the SA!

        I have nothing against. but when the "feces" tries to pour out the stool from the mouth on everyone, I emphasize, all Kazakhstanis, and the old people who died on the fields of the great war and praises Hitler's lackey. patience is running out.
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 17: 53
          0
          Quote: ed65b
          praises the Hitler lackey. patience ends.

          dalbich quote where I praised the Germans?
        2. T80UM1
          T80UM1 16 January 2014 22: 19
          +2
          You are no better, and you are not ashamed of anyone either, and you have nothing to pretend to be offended, according to you, all of you should be on the coffin of your life, "licking ass" as you put it. Regarding our sites, some unique people come from the Russian Federation to our forums and write similar comments that humiliate the nation and the state, so where where and we have such bans on the vine, and in the worst case, God forbid, they find! So there's nothing to point everyone to the door in the direction of local sites. You behave at a party not better, but worse than we on your site ...
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 22: 44
            +1
            Quote: T80UM1
            You are not behaving better at a party, but worse than we have on your site ...

            go to the Altyn Horde, that's where the trash natspatovskaya
            1. T80UM1
              T80UM1 17 January 2014 06: 51
              0
              And about serious forums. In RuNet too many trash can be found
    2. romb
      romb 16 January 2014 17: 22
      +3
      And you give - sue us. Here most of you are not able to play honestly, returning blow to blow. Everyone loves to play with the giveaways. Well, if you don’t give it a ride, then you’re trying - take a lot. No.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 16 January 2014 17: 43
        +3
        Quote: romb
        And you give - sue us. Here most of you are not able to play honestly, returning blow to blow. Everyone loves to play with the giveaways. Well, if you don’t give it a ride, then you’re trying - take a lot. No.

        It is not for you to judge what we can and what cannot. Unlike you, a Russian person is always alone waving to the last, but just like you, according to the old "batyr" habit, you are piling up in a crowd. so the post is more for you.
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 16 January 2014 17: 48
          -2
          Quote: ed65b
          Unlike you, a Russian person is always alone waving to the last, but just like you, according to the old "batyr" habit, you are piling up in a crowd. so the post is more for you.

          do not drive, the Russians always took a number, not skill, and this is a fact.
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 16 January 2014 18: 08
            +2
            Quote: Clegg
            Quote: ed65b
            Unlike you, a Russian person is always alone waving to the last, but just like you, according to the old "batyr" habit, you are piling up in a crowd. so the post is more for you.

            do not drive, the Russians always took a number, not skill, and this is a fact.


            About what you took by number, and not by skill (there are thousands of facts that refute this), you certainly "bent", and you yourself understand, but write something completely different, and it won't take long to turn into a troll. am
          2. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 16 January 2014 18: 42
            +1
            Quote: Clegg
            do not drive, the Russians always took a number, not skill, and this is a fact.

            Looks like it, always the same? but the facts say different.
            Battle of the Young
            date
            30 July - 2 August 1572
            Place
            Young, in 50 versts south of Moscow
            opponents
            Crimean Khanate, Ottoman Empire
            Russian kingdom
            Commanders
            Khan Devlet I Giray
            Michael Vorotynsky
            Dmitry Khvorostinin
            The forces of the parties
            120 thousand Crimean Tatars and Janissaries
            25 of thousands of archers, Cossacks, noble cavalry, serving Livonian Germans,
            Losses
            Krymchaks and Ottomans - 100 thousand,
            Russians 4 - 6 thousand killed and wounded
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 18: 56
              +3
              I once wrote in the comments to the article "Forbidden Victory":
              Molodinskaya battle, for the time being almost unknown to anyone, over time, in the wake of historical patriotism, overgrown with cheerful details, and almost dialogues of characters. and, of course, in numbers.
              120-150-200 thousand Crimean riders are considered as quite objective figures.
              hence the logical conclusion in the fate of the battle and comparison with the sandpiper or Borodino.
              let's figure it out. second half of the 16th century: the Moscow kingdom borders on the remnants of the Golden Horde: Kazan, Astrakhan, Crimean Khanates and Nogai Horde.
              what these states were (estimated numbers):
              - Kazan Khanate - a population of 450 thousand people. (including Tatars -210 thousand)
              - Astrakhan Khanate - population of 25 thousand people. (yes, only 25, such a ridiculous khanate)
              - Crimean Khanate - population 250-300 thousand people. (including Jews, Armenians, Karaites, slaves)
              - Nogai horde - from 300 thousand to 1 million (the spread in numbers is due to geography, what can be considered the Nogai horde as only the steppes of the former large horde or even half of Kazakhstan).
              thus, where the figures of Crimean hordes come from is simply not clear. the maximum that the Crimea could expose in 1572 was 40 thousand people, if they all died under their youth, then in the Crimea there were no adult men of Tatar nationality. some Armenians and Jews.
              further - the thousands of Janissaries who died in this glorious battle. the sultan, who has at his disposal 12 thousand of the Janissary corps, i.e. in fact, guards, sends to help his vassal 7 thousand Janissaries (15-20 thousand according to other descriptions). and all this during a tough confrontation with the Holy League and the struggle for the Mediterranean. fiction or insanity of the monarch, what is it?
              Well, and what is the result of this glorious battle that destroyed the entire male population of Crimea? the fall of the Crimean Khanate - no, the liberation of Moscow from paying the wake of the Khan - no. very strange results.
              one gets the impression that either there was no battle at all, or it was a small skirmish, of which there were many in the 16-17 centuries. This is the reason that this event is "undeservedly forgotten" and does not even come close to being compared with the sandpiper field, standing on an eel or the Crimean campaign of 1571.
              (c) user Alexandroid
            2. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 19: 00
              +1
              Corsair you are a storyteller, you should not respect yourself with a discussion,

              I just quoted a Russian, the local user. They do not like him here, because he does not suffer from cheers-patriotism like the local Russians (99 percent of them)

              Tell tales to your grandchildren, and it will be more useful for you than to make people laugh.

              Valeikum assalam

              And do not write more, I still will not answer
              1. Corsair5912
                Corsair5912 16 January 2014 20: 32
                +1
                Quote: Clegg
                Corsair you are a storyteller, you should not respect yourself with a discussion,
                And do not write more, I still will not answer

                Yeah, began to be Russian history is it all tales?
                The Russian hordes of the Khazars, Pechenegs, Polovtsy and other Tatars did not smash.
                The Russians did not take Ottoman cities on the shores of the Black Sea, did not defeat the Turks, and did not clear Russian lands of them. There was neither Ushakov, nor Suvorov, nor Potemkin.
                Ermak did not smash with the 840 army the man of the 10-thousandth army of Kuchum and did not conquer Siberia.
                And Napoleon, with his 600-thousandth army, the Russians did not drive to Paris.
                And Hitler and his allies, for whom all of Europe worked, were not defeated.
                Tales are everything, and Russia is a fantastic fairy-tale country such as Middle-earth.
        2. romb
          romb 16 January 2014 17: 53
          -5
          Wow, on "You", this is progress. fellow
          Unlike you, a Russian person is always one waving to the last ....

          You better tell your fantasies to Caucasians. Let them laugh.
          1. romb
            romb 16 January 2014 18: 21
            +1
            Here I am again convinced. Silence. And the cons went laughing
            1. ed65b
              ed65b 16 January 2014 19: 55
              0
              Quote: romb
              Here I am again convinced. Silence. And the cons went laughing

              You know, it's easier to keep quiet with "stupid" people. (I don't want to offend this from the proverb, therefore the quotes)
              1. romb
                romb 16 January 2014 20: 04
                0
                That's right!
                Silence better - seem smarter wink
          2. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 16 January 2014 18: 51
            +1
            Quote: romb
            You better tell your fantasies to Caucasians. Let them laugh.

            While we laugh
            Caucasians in our peaceful Russian cities roam with armed crowds and petty dirty tricks, and when we come armed in their villages, they crap under themselves and hide in crevices and burrows.
            Attacking civilians in their home, taking children and pregnant women hostage, like Caucasians, is not heroism, but a cowardly meanness.
            1. romb
              romb 16 January 2014 19: 08
              +2
              You turned in a completely different direction. Did I write about those creatures that kill and take hostage civilians of the Russian Federation?
              They definitely need to be destroyed, or rather, primarily those who stand behind them.
              In short, it was about another ...
              1. Corsair5912
                Corsair5912 16 January 2014 20: 43
                0
                Quote: romb
                You turned in a completely different direction. Did I write about those creatures that kill and take hostage civilians of the Russian Federation?
                They definitely need to be destroyed, or rather, primarily those who stand behind them.
                In short, it was about another ...

                What other?
                Why are the creatures hiding behind pregnant women better than the creatures attacking teenagers with knives at metro stations with monkey cries of "alah barn", molesting women on the streets, behaving rudely in public? The same dirty brutes and savages.
                1. romb
                  romb 16 January 2014 21: 08
                  +2
                  In general, I responded to comments ed65b
                  Unlike you, a Russian person is always waving to the last one ..

                  This was the reason for my ironic remark. A person lives in some other reality, and tries to give out his secret desires as a real argument. If this were at least partially true, then a separate category of residents of the Caucasian republics of the Russian Federation would not feel at ease in Russian cities. I have to communicate with the Chechens who lived in Kazakhstan, so they just openly and declare: "if we, at least a tenth, behaved in Kazakhstan as we do in Russia, the Kazakhs would have buried us long ago." If you take into account how many you are, and how many there are, then the question directly arises: how weak or disoriented a nation should be to allow a small number to feel masters of the situation.
                  IMHO, all the formidable statements of the Internet warrior about how they will crush the highlanders are nothing more than the rhetoric of the cowardly majority.
                  By the way, until I forgot how to understand your words:
                  While we laugh

                  Explosions and killings of civilians, is there a reason for you to have fun?
                  1. Clegg
                    Clegg 16 January 2014 21: 39
                    +2
                    in vain try to polemicize with him what to expect from a dude who considers all Caucasians to be terrorists
      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 19: 24
        +1
        Quote: romb
        And you give - sue us. Here most of you are not able to play honestly, returning blow to blow. Everyone loves to play with the giveaways. Well, if you don’t give a ride, so try - take a lot

        no one takes a lot, by the way, if the Kazakhs were treated here as on the Kazakh "patriotic" sites, you would forgive the voice to submit and did not have time to post your posts for more than 5 minutes
        1. romb
          romb 16 January 2014 19: 52
          +6
          You, as a person who often visits Kazakhstan sites, probably noticed what kind of rotten comments individual comrades write, both on the one and the other. For such things, in real life you need to break, and not try to enter into a discussion with this kind of people. We (Kazakhs - users of VO), in turn, on this site do not allow ourselves such comments, and most often, try to understand someone else's point of view, and if possible look for ways to reach a compromise on the most important issues. In this regard, the contingent of military personnel, at least the vast majority, is worthy of all respect. Here you can at least voice your point of view.
          Honestly, I myself am not thrilled with the scuffles on Kazakhstan sites, and they believe that the virtual graters between the Kazakhs and the Russians certainly do not benefit the two peoples.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 20: 36
            +1
            Quote: romb
            For such things, in real life you need to break, and not try to enter into a discussion with this kind of people. We (Kazakhs - users of VO), in turn, on this site do not allow ourselves such comments

            I agree, but the main thing that I noticed on such sites (in the kaz nete) is that as soon as you try to refute the stupidity of another UNT victim or an idiot who writes on behalf of the Russians, such comments are immediately deleted, creating on the one hand irrefutable arguments in "oppression" and oppression during the time of "Russian colonialism", and on the other hand, the trashness of Russians writing all sorts of nasty things about Kazakhs.

            VO allows the discussion to be sometimes irreconcilable, but the discussion, but in the Kazet, there was never a chance to discuss
            1. romb
              romb 16 January 2014 20: 42
              +4
              Unfortunately this is the case. That is precisely why, I try not to write comments on Kazakhstan sites. There you will be instantly made into Natsik or declared a victim of Kremlin propaganda.
            2. Clegg
              Clegg 16 January 2014 20: 53
              +3
              Vasilenko
              VO allows discussion?
              And how many times have you banned Hasharat? Why are Yarbai and Marek banned? I was at least banned twice, after the second time I didn’t want to re-join. But, they asked me if the third time I’m banned, I won’t return)))
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 21: 03
                +1
                Quote: Clegg
                VO allows discussion?

                what are you doing now?
                n go over the borders, marek sorry just boor
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 16 January 2014 21: 37
                  +2
                  Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                  cross borders

                  when it will pour mud on my people or country, I will answer the same
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 21: 50
                    0
                    Quote: Clegg
                    when it pours dirt on my people or country, I will not answer the same

                    then what are the problems, by the way especially violent
                    1. Clegg
                      Clegg 16 January 2014 21: 57
                      +1
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      then what are the problems, by the way especially violent

                      there is a typo the word is NOT superfluous
                      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 22: 27
                        0
                        let everyone speak for themselves and I don’t need to ascribe your thoughts
                      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 22: 27
                        0
                        let everyone speak for themselves and I don’t need to ascribe your thoughts
        2. FormerMariman
          FormerMariman 16 January 2014 19: 56
          +3
          Have you decided where you are better?
          1. Clegg
            Clegg 17 January 2014 09: 26
            +1
            Quote: Clegg
            when it pours dirt on my people or country, I will not answer the same

            Quote: Clegg
            there is a typo the word is NOT superfluous


            I meant it

            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            let everyone speak for themselves and I don’t need to ascribe your thoughts
      3. The comment was deleted.
  • Sour
    Sour 16 January 2014 17: 11
    0
    There will be no unification of Central Asia for the same reason as the unification of Russia with Belarus or Ukraine.
    This is a fantasy of mentally unhealthy people, nothing more.
    Quote: mak210
    To understand what is waiting for Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, just look at the chronicles of Afghanistan. Decaying shacks covered with donkey dung, poppy fields and babies with AK-47.

    But this is no longer a fantasy, but a sober look into the near future.
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 18: 45
    0
    Quote: zol
    The article is a provocation, and unfortunately there are quite a lot of similar articles published on this site. It feels like this is being done intentionally. Their goal is to bring schism and confusion along the line, Russians are Asians, Russians are Caucasians, Christians are Muslims.

    ---------------------------
    What split? Do not slaughter sheep on the street defiantly, do not treat Russian women as whores, respect your neighbors, behave yourself, do not brag about money and you will be happy! The rest is how you will behave ... And if you carry the pathos of a "split", then go to your aul or kishlak and pray on all fours to your Allah!
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 19: 03
    +1
    Quote: Corsair5912
    the Asians in our peaceful Russian cities roam with armed crowds and petty dirty tricks, and when we come armed in their villages, they shit under themselves and hide in crevices and burrows.

    ---------------------------
    They shit by themselves when they just come and ask ... In Baku (1988) my sergeant Zhenya Kuznetsov (Stavropol Territory), after an incident with a soldier from our platoon, built the entire "wild" company on the parade ground and made them walk in single file for 50 minutes ...One! I forced 200 horsemen to plow the asphalt with their knees for 50 minutes in the heat of 28 degrees!
    1. FormerMariman
      FormerMariman 16 January 2014 19: 18
      +3
      With such a level of nationalism and intolerance towards non-Russian (even Russian non-Russian) NATO and the Saudis are not your enemies, you yourself will destroy it. You will finally live like a white race in the Moscow, Novgorod and Pskov provinces! You can’t do this, guys, because of a sub-plinth delusional article, pulled out by the moderators especially for the popularity of the site, to muddy entire nations!
    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 19: 28
      0
      Quote: Altona
      He made 200 horsemen 50 minutes to open the asphalt knees open in the heat at 28 degrees!

      it's not from a big mind
    3. pRofF
      16 January 2014 20: 06
      0
      In short, can I just ask the moderators to delete my note? I was hoping for a calm discussion of the problematic issue, but it all turned into some kind of "holivar" ... recourse
      1. Clegg
        Clegg 16 January 2014 20: 26
        +3
        Quote: pRofF
        In short, can I just ask the moderators to delete my note? I was hoping for a calm discussion of the problematic issue, but it all turned into some kind of "holivar" ...

        No need to build yourself noble, with such a title on what counted?
        1. pRofF
          16 January 2014 20: 40
          +2
          Young man (well, or elderly, your age is unknown to me), show a bit of courtesy. No need to travel. I wanted to discuss an important and problematic issue, I recognized that I was somewhat mistaken with the wording. As for the title - has already explained why he chose this way.
          I'm not trying to build one myself. I may be a bit of an idealist, but I thought that there would be a constructive and relaxed discussion, without personal conventions.
          I was already here ten times called a provocateur, and admins were accused of public relations. Well, everyone has their own opinion and opinion on these issues. On the other hand, the reaction in the comments shows that the topic that I touched on is really important and needs to be discussed - but without that, with .... cha, whose unwitting organizer I became.

          Let's proceed as follows. On the basis of everything that is written here (in the comments, I mean), well, and my note - write your own vision of the problem-problems that surfaced during the discussion and publish - taking into account my mistakes, of course. Accordingly, we can discuss your point of view. Well or not we can - it all depends, of course, on you.

          Sincerely, Egor.
          1. Clegg
            Clegg 17 January 2014 09: 31
            0
            Quote: pRofF
            on the other hand, the reaction in the comments shows that the topic I raised is really important and needs to be discussed

            In fact, no one was discussing anything, the topic, as I understand it, was supposed to be the Russia-Central Asia relationship. But in reality it turned into an insult to the peoples of this region and nothing more.

            Quote: pRofF
            Let's proceed as follows. On the basis of everything that is written here (in the comments, I mean), well, and my note - write your own vision of the problem-problems that surfaced during the discussion and publish - taking into account my mistakes, of course. Accordingly, we can discuss your point of view. Well or not we can - it all depends, of course, on you.

            Based on my attitude to the Eurasian Union and the CU, administrators are unlikely to miss my note.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 17 January 2014 09: 34
              0
              Quote: Clegg
              But the case turned into an insult to the peoples of this region and nothing more.

              tell your compatriots like "London", and then you will teach the rest
              1. Clegg
                Clegg 17 January 2014 10: 34
                0
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                you will tell your compatriots like "London"

                you tell your type "ed65" or "Vasya"
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 17 January 2014 10: 51
                  0
                  the fact is that when "their" people overdo it, they are told about it, but you are somehow not very good, and sometimes you carry such things yourself that sometimes you just want to ... spit
                2. The comment was deleted.
            2. The comment was deleted.
      2. saygon66
        saygon66 16 January 2014 23: 05
        0
        - But there is no need to hurry with this! Each of the visitors to the page visits it to express their opinion, not having a goal to please everyone (I hope)! And since "such a booze has gone" - it means that everyone is hooked and there is a problem!
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 03
    0
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    it's not from a big mind

    ----------------------
    I would argue about his mind ... And about charisma, he will give anyone a 300% head start ... And he did it not for self-affirmation, but for educational purposes, he knew how to educate and did it very skillfully and tactfully by army standards ... He did this not for himself, but so as not to offend the soldiers subordinate to him ... In the army there is a principle of solidarity - one for all and all for one ... Therefore, the horsemen had to suffer in solidarity, nothing can be done, there was no military police then, "humanism" also came later, after three years ... And if you do not know the ethnic composition of the SA at the end of the USSR, then it consisted half of immigrants from Central Asia ...
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 20: 06
      0
      Quote: Altona
      And he did not do it for self-affirmation

      well, coming down from how you presented it, just for that
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 12
    0
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    well, coming down from how you presented it, just for that

    --------------------
    Does it matter how I presented? He is a training sergeant and did what he saw fit, the incident was over and was not repeated ... And do you think he should have shown gospel patience?
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 20: 16
      0
      Quote: Altona
      Does it matter how I presented?

      it's important
      you can write - a man killed 10 people and experienced a sense of satisfaction
      and you can - a soldier defending his homeland killed 10 enemies
      agree the attitude will be different
  • ed65b
    ed65b 16 January 2014 20: 13
    0
    "A piece of decayed d .... a", "nameless feces" - from Suvorov - "To fight not by number but by skill." I don't even want to talk about this topic, can you remember one of your own ???? But you don't need to look into the Stone Age.
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 16 January 2014 22: 04
      0
      Quote: ed65b
      I don’t even want to talk about this topic, can you remember someone from your own ????

      Our last khan crushed your ancestral invaders and did the right thing, the bosom really fought with skill, not number.
      So then stink shit
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 16 January 2014 23: 25
        0
        Quote: Clegg
        Quote: ed65b
        I don’t even want to talk about this topic, can you remember someone from your own ????

        Our last khan crushed your ancestral invaders and did the right thing, the bosom really fought with skill, not number.
        So then stink shit

        Duck this stinks nameless stool from you. From every word you say, it stinks like a rotten camel, you sit there in your yurt and jerk off. the portrait of Hitler is an unfinished uproot. but it’s better to remove ak.
        1. Clegg
          Clegg 17 January 2014 09: 53
          0
          Quote: ed65b
          you sit there in a yurt and masturbate there. the portrait of Hitler is an unfinished uproot.

          regarding drochki and homosexual relations this is probably a peduard to you))))

          Quote: ed65b
          but it’s better to remove ak.

          Ok, I can’t leave just because 1 person wants it, when it’s 50, I will do it.
          You number 1 still need 49 people)))
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 17
    0
    Quote: pRofF
    In short, can I just ask the moderators to delete my note? I was hoping for a calm discussion of the problematic issue, but it all turned into some kind of "holivar" ...

    --------------------------
    What for? It is necessary to finish the question to the end, not to keep such a volume of impressions in oneself ... Whoever needs it, let him read the list of claims, so as not to complain about someone's "aggressive" mentality and "nationalism" ...
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 29
    0
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    it's important
    you can write - a man killed 10 people and experienced a sense of satisfaction
    and you can - a soldier defending his homeland killed 10 enemies
    agree the attitude will be different

    --------------------
    This is the lyrics ... The sergeant in the training does not kill enemies, he performs a more difficult task - the education of personnel ... He should not show any feelings, because his task is to educate the unit to perform a combat mission ... As for rewards and punishments, then all this is also part of the upbringing of subordinates ... If he carried out enhanced exercises in another unit, then this is a flaw of the commanders of this unit, and not a whim of Sergeant Kuznetsov ... And he "humiliated" wild ones not for his own self-affirmation, but to to show the wild that they are the same part of the army like any other soldier, and not a privileged caste ... As for his mind, he knew a lot, owned three VUS, wore the Master badge, was a warrior-athlete, knew all the statutes by heart , owned hand-to-hand combat at the level of a veteran of the landing and shooting training perfectly ... And he was just a sergeant in a company for training signalmen ...
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 20: 41
      0
      Quote: Altona
      This is lyrics ... A sergeant in training does not kill enemies, he performs a more difficult task - educating personnel ... He should not show any feelings

      this is not lyrics, the main thing at the end of "He shouldn't show any feelings," but from your post, I just understood the opposite, or you presented it like this
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • Power
    Power 16 January 2014 20: 40
    0
    Russia will be strong and will grow large and small nations, but in any other way. It all depends on us.
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 44
    +1
    Quote: pRofF
    Young man (well, or elderly, your age is unknown to me), show a bit of courtesy. No need to travel. I wanted to discuss an important and problematic issue, I recognized that I was somewhat mistaken with the wording. As for the title - has already explained why he chose this way.
    I'm not trying to build one myself. I may be a bit of an idealist, but I thought that there would be a constructive and relaxed discussion, without personal conventions.

    ----------------------
    In general, there is a discussion of the rules of social hostel and the limits of tolerance for visitors ... And since the characters and mentality are different, there are diametrical points of view due to the personality characteristics of each forum member ...
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 47
    0
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    this is not lyrics, the main thing at the end of "He shouldn't show any feelings," but from your post, I just understood the opposite, or you presented it like this

    ------------------
    You, as a young lady, read about feelings? Or sentimental in life? I thought you were trying to catch the point ...
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 16 January 2014 21: 28
      0
      Quote: Altona
      you are trying to catch the essence ...

      the essence in a particular post was simple, the person enjoyed the humiliation as a process
  • alone
    alone 16 January 2014 20: 51
    +3
    And these people dream of restoring the Union)) there is no better one than in such a union.
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 20: 54
    0
    Quote: lonely
    people dream of restoring the Union)) there is no better one than in such a union.

    -------------------------
    These people, as you say, in the youth of the district, they fought for the district, so what? We lived in the same city ...))
    1. alone
      alone 16 January 2014 21: 37
      +1
      Trying to create a union, we cannot talk about the fact that some are Aryans and a higher race, while others are Churkobesy and a lower race. I understand the hint.
  • stranik72
    stranik72 16 January 2014 21: 03
    0
    "Do we need Gastarbeiterstan as allies?"
    The man who so titled his note with one name answered his own question, all the other arguments are from the evil one, so for the most part they didn’t ask us for history, we won them, Russian tsars and Soviet general secretaries knew why they shed their blood and their peoples, and not in order to colonize them, they tried (and to a large extent it turned out) to bring them to their level of an enlightened nation, for someone they created the alphabet, built schools and roads and much more and they answered what they could, and that’s it was generally called the great empire (Russian / Soviet). So, let's answer for ourselves the following questions: what kind of state do we want to build and what do we lack for this. Well, everything seems to be clear to everyone on the first question, a successful state with a high standard of living for the majority of its citizens, but in order to answer the second question, we need to list a lot of things, but everyone will agree that we have a shortage of labor and an insufficient market for selling our goods, and the borders of the enemies were even a hundred kilometers away. In the past, it worked. By the way, 3 percent of our population (Russian citizens) are also listed as guest workers, and under certain conditions, our country can become a guest worker.
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 21: 12
    +2
    Quote: Former Mariman
    With such a level of nationalism and intolerance towards non-Russian (even Russian non-Russian) NATO and the Saudis are not your enemies, you yourself will destroy it. You will finally live like a white race in the Moscow, Novgorod and Pskov provinces! You can’t do this, guys, because of a sub-plinth delusional article, pulled out by the moderators especially for the popularity of the site, to muddy entire nations!

    ----------------------
    Well, pour me mud, I'm half Chuvash, half Komi-Permyak mixed with Finnish and all sorts of other bloods, so you have to speak Russian ... Komi-Permyaks are only 140 thousand, in life have come across different nationalities, and who seemed to me what I wrote about him ... If you disgrace the nation, then do not blame me, I won’t say good ... But was it necessary otherwise? Play along with someone? I studied myself, acted, used the capabilities of my homeland ... And not like some, having received a diploma from the Tashkent Automobile College, they don’t know the multiplication tables, they’re coming to Moscow, they’re coming ... Tell me, I’ll write something good ... If work in Baku, to the part the Russian major Zaitsev arrives at 412 Moskvich, and the ensign Mamedov at 24 Volga, what should I think? Answer ... Let's argue about the fate of the empire, from Brest to the Golden Horn ...
    1. FormerMariman
      FormerMariman 17 January 2014 10: 05
      +3
      1. Reptile I will not any people did not pour mud and do not intend to!
      2.Not Russianness for Natsik is striking in a foreign appearance and culture, and not your origin, so you have nothing to fear.
      3. Anyone knows how to give examples to convince of their own rightness (I am about ensign Mamedov)
      4. Let your rulers argue about the fate of the empire when they conquered and annexed foreign peoples and lands, and now the Russian people cannot get along with them because they say they are alien to them in culture and religion! Is not that absurd!
  • Altona
    Altona 16 January 2014 21: 39
    +3
    The point is not in the tolerance or intolerance of the Russian and the peoples allied with him ... To state the question in this way is initially provocative ... Tolerance is also tolerance, prostitution is also a kind of social tolerance ... The Russian people are patient and unpretentious in general. ..The point is that some of the newcomers from the south violate the laws of the hostel in those places where they were not particularly invited, except for the greedy employer and the noisy "diaspora", they violate, put forward unreasonable demands, consider themselves privileged ... Under patent leather shoes they wear foul-smelling holey socks repeatedly sprayed with perfume ... What are their reasons for this? Bribed officials and hysterical aunts, decorated with rings? Answer ...
  • APASUS
    APASUS 16 January 2014 21: 41
    +3
    Russia needs working hands, of course I mean welders, turners, milling machines, doctors, teachers. At one time I knew good doctors, Turkmen, Georgians and nothing. And we are offered a herd of untrained and often just illiterate people for completely unskilled work. the work that they perform loses quality criteria.
    And when our redneck businessmen begin to pay a real salary to the janitor, then I think our Russian population will slowly stretch out of the hinterland as janitors. In the meantime, buying a mini tractor with communal nozzles is considered more expensive than 10 Tajiks!
    Since you decided to invite visitors, do it like in Japan - visitors are paid more than local ones, so it is enshrined in law. The problem can be solved in 20-30 days !!!