Military Review

Turkey claims to part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus

296

For the modern foreign policy of Turkey, the Balkan Peninsula and the South Caucasus are priority regions. The basis of this policy is the ideology of neo-Ottomanism. Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said that Thrace, historical and the geographical area on the Balkan Peninsula, which is currently divided between Turkey, Greece and Bulgaria, is “one flag, one people, one state”. Erdogan specified which part of the Balkans historically belongs to Turkey, in his opinion, this is part of Macedonia, Bulgaria, Bosnia and Herzegovina, as well as Western Thrace.


Ankara quite successfully returned to the Balkans, where it all happens with the connivance and even complicity of the Balkan countries. In some respects it is a repetition of already passed, the historical material. At the time, the Ottoman Empire was able to capture the Balkans only because of the fragmentation and help the Balkan countries. Greeks, Slavs and Albanians odds with each other and allowed the Ottomans to intervene in their affairs, opening for them the Balkans.

The head of the Turkish government also said that Turkey will continue to invest in Thrace, work in areas that are primarily related to the study of the Turkish language, culture and the maintenance of religious buildings. Erdogan’s statement provoked an angry reaction from Greek and Bulgarian politicians. The co-chairman of the Bulgarian National Salvation Front, Valery Simeonov, speaking at the Bulgarian radio Focus, compared the words of the Turkish Prime Minister with the territorial claims of Hitler's Germany to neighboring countries and called Erdogan’s statement “a manifestation of extremism”. The Foreign Ministry of Bulgaria stated that the statement of the Turkish Prime Minister “does not contribute to the development of bilateral dialogue” aimed at solving contentious issues.

Greek Foreign Minister said that to ensure good-neighborly relations between Greece and Turkey, Ankara should respect the sovereignty and territorial integrity of all its neighbors. Historical and geographical tour, especially for a region with a strong historical load as the Balkans, should be used with caution. Athens could with his hand to give a lot of their own historical data to refute the Turkish identity of Thrace, noted in Greece.

Ankara went on the offensive in the Balkans a decade ago, when its hopes for a “peaceful conquest” of Europe (joining the European Union) were buried by the firm position of Germany, which wants to remain the only EU leader. It should also be noted such a geopolitical aspect of the problem as the division of spheres of influence in the Balkans between the United States, the EU, Turkey and a number of Arab countries. The Balkans are a special region of Europe, it is part of the Slavic and Christian world that preserves its identity. Naturally, this does not suit the owners of Western civilization. The Balkans are trying to crush and swallow. And this process is developing quite successfully. The Balkan countries became the sphere of influence of Western and Islamic projects. The remnants of the former Russian influence in the region are successfully squeezed out.

Under the concept of neo-Ottomanism, Turkey is trying to dominate the Balkans, as well as in the Arab countries that were part of the Ottoman Empire, in the Caucasus and in Central Asia. True, the Arab direction as a whole failed. Ankara was defeated in Egypt, and in Syria, the Turks did not dare to move to more active actions, limiting themselves to supporting gangs. The offensive of neo-Ottomanism in the Balkans goes in several main directions:

- political and diplomatic, when bilateral relations are actively developing, personal contacts are established with representatives of local elites. The policy of Ankara became particularly active since 2009, when the Foreign Ministry was headed by one of the proponents of the concept of neo-Ottomanism Ahmet Davutoglu. Balkan countries are tightly included in the schedule of foreign policy visits of the first persons of Turkey - Prime Minister R. Erdogan, President A. Gul, Foreign Minister A. Davutoglu, as well as high-ranking politicians, deputies and the military. Turkey abolished or facilitated the visa regime with a number of countries in the Balkan region - Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, Bosnia and Herzegovina and Croatia. In addition, Turkey is actively trying to engage in resolving conflict situations in the region, to become a mediator. Thus, Ankara successfully joined the peace negotiation process between Serbia, Croatia and Bosnia and Herzegovina. At the same time, Ankara assumed the role of mediator between the European Union and the countries of the Balkan region. Turkey is a conductor of European integration and closer integration of the Balkan states into the structures of the EU and NATO. Local politicians are actively involved in various integration programs. On the most important issues, such as the transit of goods to Europe through the Balkans, energy cooperation, the joint development of natural resources and minerals, are created supranational structures.

It must also be said that in the future it is possible to strengthen the military aspect of the Balkan policy of Ankara. Turkey has already participated in common operations with NATO in the territory of the former Yugoslavia, supported Bosnian Muslims, Kosovo Albanians, and became one of the first countries to recognize Kosovo's independence. Turkey actively involves the states of the region in the military programs of the North Atlantic alliance. In particular, we are working on a common strategy for action in the region. The local armed forces are reorganized according to NATO standards with the help of Turkish advisers. Simultaneously, Turkish military schools are conducting courses on studying Serbian, Croatian and Albanian languages. Military ties with Albania are especially intensively developing, which became a member of NATO in 2009;

- economic, within the framework of which trade and economic cooperation is developing, real estate is being bought, Turkish firms are awarded contracts for the construction of strategic facilities in the region. Turkish goods quickly mastered the region, and the balance of foreign trade is in favor of Turkey;

- cultural-religious, scientific-educational. Turkey finances religious movements, including radical, mosque construction. Ankara stands for the "revival" of Islam in the region. The massive construction of mosques in Bosnia and Herzegovina, in the Serbian region of Raska (Sanjak), is being funded, where a new Muslim enclave is being formed at an accelerated pace. In this process, along with Turkey, the Saudis are actively working.

At the same time, scientific and analytical, cultural organizations are being created to study the past and future of the Balkans - like the Balkan Institute of Turkological Studies in Prizren. Discussion platforms for expert exchange of views are organized on an ongoing basis. So, the International Balkan Congress annually works. A lot of attention is paid to cooperation in science and education, medicine, charity. General history textbooks are being created with Macedonia, Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina. A network of joint universities and schools is being created, students and scientific and pedagogical personnel are being exchanged. Turks finance the creation of international schools and universities, introduce Western education standards. Thus, the integration of local youth in the Western structure of education. It is also important that graduates of joint educational institutions become agents of Turkish influence in the region. They actively cooperate with Turkish business, which leads to their rapid career growth. Gradually, these people enter the business elite, participate in the social and political process. In fact, this is the process of creating the “fifth column” in the Balkan countries.

In themselves, certain elements of the Neo-Ottoman policy and the penetration of the Islamic project in the Balkans do not seem dangerous and are even useful for the economy and the cultural and educational sphere of the region. Young people receive education, enterprises, schools, cultural and religious facilities are being built, infrastructure of the Balkan states is developing. However, in general, all this means the final defeat of Christianity and Slavdom (with the inclusion of the role of Russia) in the region in the long term. Western and Islamic projects are actively colonizing the Balkans, rebuilding them for their own needs.

Turkey’s main partners in the region are Albania, Kosovo, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Macedonia and Romania. An important factor in the involvement of Turkey in their affairs was the presence of conflicts with its neighbors: Albania has a conflict with Greece (because of disputed offshore zones), Kosovo has Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina has Serbia and Croatia, Macedonian statehood is disputed by Greece and Bulgaria, Romania claims Moldova, and therefore Transnistria (there are claims against Ukraine). In addition, these states have a significant proportion of the Muslim population and areas with a population consisting of ethnic Turks.

Secondary partners are Serbia, Croatia and Montenegro. In geopolitical terms, Croatia will be more inclined towards Germany. Serbia and Montenegro are historical opponents, therefore relations with them are contradictory. Many Serbs and Montenegrins are suspicious of Turkish expansion. There is a fear that Sandjak (Raška) will become the new Kosovo. Turkey is actively trying to gain a foothold in these states. Thus, in 2011, a trade and economic center was established in the southern Serbia in Sandzak with residential and administrative quarters, as well as with a free trade zone with a total value of 1,6 billion euros (Turkey allocated 85% of funds, and Serbia) 15%. Also in Sandzak for Turkish money built a highway. The head of the Turkish Foreign Ministry Davutoglu has openly proposed "mediation in resolving the problems of Sandzak." In 2012, the Serbian authorities demonstrated a course for special relations with Turkey and Arab countries.

The main opponents of Turkey in the region are Bulgaria and Greece. These are the most integral states in the Balkans. They have strong anti-Turkish sentiments, and the attacks of the Bulgarian and Greek media on Turkey continue unabated. In 2009, Bulgaria opposed Turkey’s accession to the European Union. Turkish-Greek disputes are tied to the ownership of the islands in the Aegean Sea and the conflict over the problem of Cyprus, divided into Greek and Turkish parts. In addition, in Greece, despite the incompatibility of resources and potentials, the idea of ​​continuing to push Turkey further into Asia, with the restoration of the Byzantine heritage centered on Constantinople, was common. True, given the current deplorable state of the Greek economy, this idea is practically not remembered.

However, Greece and Bulgaria do not have the potential of Turkey, their economies are in a deep decline, so they are also gradually sagging under the pressure of Turkish expansion. The symbol of this defeat is the message about the construction of the first mosque on an area of ​​approximately 600 square meters in Athens. In the Greek capital, there was no official mosque for Muslims since Greece conquered freedom from the yoke of the Ottomans in the 19th century. And during a recent visit to Bulgaria of the Turkish Deputy Prime Minister Bekir Bozdag, Sofia gave permission to Ankara to take care of "hundreds of Muslim cultural monuments" in the country. Turkey and Saudi Arabia are actively developing in Bulgaria programs of religious education for both Bulgarian Muslims (“Pomaks”) and Bulgarian Gypsies, who, in their opinion, also have Muslim roots.

It’s a matter of time when the Balkans will once again become a “Turkish patrimony”. Fragmented, at war with each other, with a weak economy and degraded armed forces, the Balkan states cannot oppose anything to the expansion of the Islamic project, neoosmanism. Moreover, the offensive of Turkey is supported by the West. The de-Christianization and deslavianization of the region fully fit into the plans of the owners of the Western world.

However, the Turkish experience is very interesting for Russia. In the context of historical and religious hostility of the majority population in the Balkans, less financial and material resources (in comparison with Russia), the Turks were able to quite quickly regain its influence in the region, to consolidate its presence in politics, economy and culture, subordinate actions of their business and the public, religious organizations with a single purpose. Turkey has not complained about the lack of love for them in the Balkans, and acted.

Azerbaijan and Turkey to expand military cooperation

Turkey continues to strengthen its position in the South Caucasus. December 20 ended the two-day Azerbaijan-Turkey military dialogue that took place in Baku. The military dialogue between the two countries is held once a year, starting with the 2007 year. It discusses cooperation between the two countries in the military and military-technical fields, as well as in the field of personnel training. The Turkish delegation, which included representatives of the General Staff, the Ministry of National Defense and other structures, was headed by Colonel-General Alparslan Erdogan, head of the Planning Directorate and Principles of the General Staff of the Turkish Armed Forces.

Currently, military cooperation between Turkey and Azerbaijan is actively developing in such areas as the military-industrial complex of Azerbaijan, the joint production of rocket and space technologies, military exports, military intelligence, military education and joint maneuvers. Turkey, as well as Russia and Israel, is one of the leading suppliers weapons for the military department of Azerbaijan.

16 August 2010 Turkey and Azerbaijan signed an agreement on strategic cooperation and mutual assistance. According to a number of experts, the military dialogue between Ankara and Baku may lead to the signing of a document similar to the collective security agreement concluded in 1992. And this will lead to a serious change in the balance of power in the region.
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  1. makarov
    makarov 23 December 2013 08: 55
    +35
    "Turkey claims part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus"


    You cannot have eyes larger than the stomach.
    V.S. Pikul.
    1. INTER
      INTER 23 December 2013 09: 46
      +19
      Quote: makarov
      "Turkey claims part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus"

      Dreaming is not harmful, let them remember the beginning of the end of the Ottoman Empire and who helped, and then they will soberly evaluate whether they need to repeat the script and lose even more than before.))))))))))))
      1. smersh70
        smersh70 23 December 2013 10: 14
        +9
        Quote: INTER
        let them remember the beginning of the end of the Ottoman Empire

        they very well remember this, and draw good conclusions, as a result of which they are becoming stronger and stronger .... (an example is that Israel apologizes to someone, but are you wassat and to return the property of others - holy .. holy .. holy ... fellow .
        1. INTER
          INTER 23 December 2013 10: 23
          +9
          Quote: smersh70
          so that Israel apologizes to someone, but what do you mean, and so that someone else’s property is returned - holy .. holy .. holy ...

          Time will put everything in its place! Sooner or later_)
        2. Rusich51
          Rusich51 23 December 2013 18: 49
          +1
          Death, as you can see, everything goes to the 3rd world. How much does it take to destroy people in order for politicians to finally drown in this blood. Our descendants will study if the deceased civilization survives from its fragments.
      2. The comment was deleted.
        1. xetai9977
          xetai9977 23 December 2013 15: 17
          0
          I myself would really like for nationalist forces to come instead of Erdogan, but the reality is that Erdogan is supported by an absolute majority of voters
    2. A.YARY
      A.YARY 23 December 2013 10: 31
      +3
      "Turkey claims part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus"

      MONKEYS APPLY FOR THE WHOLE WORLD!
      THE WHOLE WORLD HISTORICALLY BELONGED TO THE MONKEYS! -Where.
      laughing laughing wassat
      1. Asgard
        Asgard 23 December 2013 11: 28
        +2
        Quote: A.YARY
        MONKEYS APPLY FOR THE WHOLE WORLD!

        Here I agree .... but that when the World ALREADY belonged, this is not true.
        What is Monkey, Image-Without-Yang (that is, very similar to a person but without Yang (creative)) energy .. you know about the Slavic square of the circle-Yin / Yang / Crap ...
        There is no Evolution in the world among biology and the animal world, everything was created immediately and perfect ... But degradation exists, it is when you lie on the couch, drink beer and watch football)))) get upset, then the nonsense comes, and the next state is this animal (monkey)))
        Here Erdogan pulls the country back to Muslimism, from which they were pulled by the pope of all Turks (ATATYURK)))
        So, count the chances of Erdogan to restore the Empire ...- 0%
        It will only ignite the GREAT WAR, as I see the chances of -100% ....))
        1. Andrey57
          Andrey57 23 December 2013 11: 50
          +5
          Erdogan did not count his chances correctly - he forgot that Russia can easily multiply any inequalities by zero, which will soon be, in our lifetime ... We will personally see the issue of straits and the fragmentation of Turkey into pieces. hi
          1. xetai9977
            xetai9977 23 December 2013 15: 22
            +3
            This is unlikely. Do not forget the proverb: "Do not dig another hole ..."
        2. mirag2
          mirag2 23 December 2013 18: 12
          0
          On the contrary, they now have Ataturk in favor.
      2. Christian
        Christian 23 December 2013 15: 34
        +13
        Great Russia, once again, has to put Ottoman on its knees. This is a matter of time. This will be the point in their history.
        1. xetai9977
          xetai9977 23 December 2013 16: 18
          -8
          No one will put anyone on their knees. The trend is that Russia is degrading, and Turkey, on the contrary, is strengthening from year to year and you yourself see it, but don’t want to admit. It's a shame ....
          1. Gecko
            Gecko 23 December 2013 16: 31
            +11
            I want to disappoint you, Russia is no longer degrading, under Putin it is recovering and developing.
            1. Russian
              Russian 23 December 2013 21: 09
              +2
              Quote: gecko
              I want to disappoint you, Russia is no longer degrading, under Putin it is recovering and developing.


              What? It develops as a raw materials appendage unless. The Slavic population is rapidly decreasing, the degradation of villages, everyone is going to the cities, and propaganda of tolerance, brainwashing of all sorts of shit, and so on flourishes in them. You must have washed well lol
              Your Putin is in the same gang with Serdyukov, Chubais and other Jewish-Masonic scum.
              1. Gecko
                Gecko 24 December 2013 22: 39
                +1
                Do you offer yourself to the head of state?
              2. StolzSS
                StolzSS 30 December 2013 07: 23
                -1
                Well, I don’t know, I don’t know, in my Murmansk they are building and building seriously, which means we are developing. 30 years they didn’t build like that and in the vicinity of the construction site. What stand 27 km of the Leningrad road. The mooring infrastructure is being updated ... They are working little by little and there it will be seen ....
            2. The comment was deleted.
          2. andrey682006
            andrey682006 23 December 2013 16: 31
            +7
            laughing
            So Turkey is strengthening ?, and Russia is degrading?
            Unproven.
            Funny.
            1. xetai9977
              xetai9977 23 December 2013 16: 54
              -2
              Laugh as much as you like. But the one who laughs the last laughs well. As the Japanese proverb says: "The bowstring is already lowered and the arrow flies at the target."
              1. andrey682006
                andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 16
                +5
                Where is it flying?
                Are you aiming right?
                In your not get?
              2. Rusich51
                Rusich51 23 December 2013 18: 55
                +1
                Quote: xetai9977
                Laugh as much as you like. But the one who laughs the last laughs well. As the Japanese proverb says: "The bowstring is already lowered and the arrow flies at the target."

                An arrow can fly past a target. Gringo other plans for Turkey, Kurdistan, Azerbaijan.
                Will the capital of Azerbaijan move to Tabriz?
                1. xetai9977
                  xetai9977 23 December 2013 19: 05
                  +2
                  GRINGO has very headaches. And everything will be bad there while Obama is sitting there.
          3. RUSS
            RUSS 23 December 2013 17: 20
            +5
            It is not correct to compare Russia and Turkey.
          4. mirag2
            mirag2 23 December 2013 18: 16
            0
            Turkey is growing, but not like Russia.
            Yes, and although, in principle, Turkey can also, if desired, acquire nuclear weapons, it needs to be earned this opportunity in the Muslim world.
            And with that trend of deflection before Europe, perhaps this will not happen.
          5. Reasonable, 2,3
            Reasonable, 2,3 23 December 2013 18: 26
            +4
            It is you who "want" the degradation of the Russians. It will not come out. We were selected from this kind of shit. Learn history.
            1. xetai9977
              xetai9977 23 December 2013 18: 40
              0
              And YOU study the culture! Who gets out of what shit can be seen from the comments ... there are not enough arguments, so immediately "poking", swearing ...
              1. Reasonable, 2,3
                Reasonable, 2,3 23 December 2013 20: 50
                0
                Who poked? We have different cultures. There are a lot of arguments. I'm tired of you.
        2. smersh70
          smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 03
          -1
          Quote: Christian
          Great Russia, once again, has to put Ottoman on its knees.

          That's why Putin said nothing at a press conference about his successor laughing It turns out he appeared and appeared here, .... under the nickname Christian wassat already making plans .... but if you please ask .. you will also wash your boots in the Indian Ocean or leave this fate to comrade Zhirinovsky))))))
        3. The comment was deleted.
      3. KuzmichDP
        KuzmichDP 28 December 2013 20: 14
        +1
        Quote: A.YARY
        "Turkey claims part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus"

        MONKEYS APPLY FOR THE WHOLE WORLD!
        THE WHOLE WORLD HISTORICALLY BELONGED TO THE MONKEYS! -Where.
        laughing laughing wassat

        I fully support MONKEYS, urgently return the whole planet to the monkeys, down with the people ... !!! GO FORWARD, MONKEYS !!!!)))))))))))))))))))))) wassat am
      4. KuzmichDP
        KuzmichDP 28 December 2013 20: 28
        0
        Quote: A.YARY
        "Turkey claims part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus"

        MONKEYS APPLY FOR THE WHOLE WORLD!
        THE WHOLE WORLD HISTORICALLY BELONGED TO THE MONKEYS! -Where.
        laughing laughing wassat

        I fully support MONKEYS, urgently return the whole planet to the monkeys, down with the people ... !!! GO FORWARD, MONKEYS !!!!)))))))))))))))))))))) wassat
    3. avt
      avt 23 December 2013 10: 53
      +7
      Quote: makarov
      You cannot have eyes larger than the stomach.

      Well, it depends on how you look at it. For example, let's take Bulgaria, where Zhivkov forced local Turks to take Bulgarian names, or they say the border - on the way out. Now, from 01/01/2014, the border to the EU will open. So guess how many Bulgarians will leave the country and who will remain? So when the youth leave, the Bulgarians themselves will liberate the country to the Turks. And there is Macedonia next to it, half with the Albanians, who have already slaughtered with the Macedonians, and so on. So the Turks have quite realistic claims to the Balkans. Moreover, organizing everything from within, in a completely "democratic" way, is not such a difficult task.
    4. Reasonable, 2,3
      Reasonable, 2,3 23 December 2013 18: 22
      0
      Well, they received little from us. Rake, as the main weapon they need to give.
  2. Igor39
    Igor39 23 December 2013 09: 02
    +10
    It is necessary to help some people play the Kurdish card so that it doesn’t seem too much ...
    1. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 10: 48
      -10%
      Quote: Igor39
      It is necessary to help some people play the Kurdish card so that it doesn’t seem too much ...

      Well, once the councils created the PAC, then received Chechnya, where Turkey actively helped, play the second time, the boomerang principle has not been canceled.
      1. Igor39
        Igor39 23 December 2013 11: 28
        +9
        Turkey is actively helping Islamic militants in Syria, I think this help will also come back to them. And the PAC has not been canceled, everything is still ahead.
        1. Yeraz
          Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 47
          -4
          Quote: Igor39
          Turkey is actively helping Islamic militants in Syria, I think this help will also come back to them. And the PAC has not been canceled, everything is still ahead.

          One link was missed, the present Assad’s dad very actively helped the PAC, he gave himself a shelter, Syria is buried in blood, as we see, the boomerang returned.
          And the Caucasus has not been canceled. And terrorist activity is several times higher than in Turkey. Although they have a meager numerical amount compared to the Kurds in relation to the titular nation, and the stench is several times greater.
          1. andrey682006
            andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 17
            +1
            Let's go back centuries to find out who is to whom and what should?
    2. typhoon7
      typhoon7 23 December 2013 19: 08
      0
      The idea is interesting. Turning against Syria, Turkey itself unwittingly launched the Kurdish flywheel.
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. Heccrbq.3
      Heccrbq.3 23 December 2013 09: 51
      -5
      One fact, as 15 million migrants in Russia say, in relation to our population every 10th, BUT there are more of them and if we take only Russian men 18-40 (most belly-bellied beer beers, with smoked lungs and a planted liver, and that's all disunited, I speak mockingly to me 37 I don’t smoke, I drink every five years and any chur .. I’ll twist the mutton horn, but not one), then in case of a serious mess we will lose too.
      1. RUSS
        RUSS 23 December 2013 10: 29
        +9
        I’ll argue about migrants, many drink and smoke, are physically mediocre, many have illnesses associated with hard work at 50 years old, plus an ignorance, I know this contingent.
        1. A.YARY
          A.YARY 23 December 2013 11: 12
          +6
          Maksim
          Let's not confuse the concept, because in this confusion, young people may have a brain twist.
          NOT MIGRANT- since a migrant is a citizen of a country who has all the rights to arbitrarily move around his country!
          A IMIGRANTis someone who came from another country to ours and has no right to have rights CITIZEN!
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 23 December 2013 11: 21
            +1
            Andrei.
            I agree with you about the terminology.
      2. George
        George 23 December 2013 10: 48
        +2
        Heccrbq.3, hi
        I am also for a healthy lifestyle, but just not in every healthy body there is a place for the spirit (Yu. Yu. Senchukov), and given the features of modern warfare, the child can pull the trigger.
        Therefore, we will not lose.
      3. Mairos
        Mairos 23 December 2013 12: 46
        +1
        Yeah, we inside Russia will start wall to wall with migrants chopping, and law enforcement agencies will watch how migrants cut out all civilians? Are you out of your mind?
      4. Chertkov Oleg
        Chertkov Oleg 23 December 2013 19: 36
        +1
        Remember the latest stories with a "migrant" tinge, the people are rising at times, compared to the early times. And you are an anica warrior, alone and not a warrior in the field.
  4. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF 23 December 2013 09: 15
    +6
    They in Syria have already overworked once. Once again on a large scale they’ll mess up and talk about the existence of Turkey itself
    1. xetai9977
      xetai9977 23 December 2013 09: 37
      0
      Many have already tried to bury Turkey. It didn’t work out, they overstrained. And why double standards? If Russia is trying to strengthen its influence, this is good, but if Turkey is bad? Personally, I think that the Turks chose the wrong vector of foreign policy under Erdogan. They chose a pro-Arab rather than a Protyurk policy. And what kind of idiotic card is posted? Karabakh and Azerbaijan. You will not like it if someone hangs out a map, where for example Astarkhan and Russia are indicated as separate entities
      1. baltika-18
        baltika-18 23 December 2013 09: 56
        +4
        Quote: xetai9977
        Personally, I believe that the Turks chose the wrong vector of foreign policy under Erdogan. They chose a pro-Arab rather than a Protyurk policy.

        And what about the Protyurk?
        1. xetai9977
          xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 12
          0
          Protyurkic is when the interests of the Turkic countries, primarily Turkey itself, are put at the forefront, since historically Arabs have always disliked Turks, and reverence in their direction will not change their mood. As well as the interests of Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan and other Turkic countries. If the integration of these countries If it intensifies, then a powerful alliance of Turkic states will be created.
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 23 December 2013 10: 35
            +6
            Pan-Turkism is utopia, the Türks are a completely different ethnic group in religion, race and mentality. By the way, I can add the same thing on panslavism.
            1. smersh70
              smersh70 23 December 2013 10: 42
              +2
              Quote: RUSS
              Türks are a completely different ethnicity in religion,

              what are you)) acre of the Gagauz, they all profess Islam ...
              Quote: RUSS
              race

              it doesn’t count ...)) but in square eyes, it would be the same in the head0))))
              Quote: RUSS
              Pan-Turkism-Utopia

              but yes, I agree)))
              1. RUSS
                RUSS 23 December 2013 11: 02
                +7
                In addition to the Orthodox Gagauz, there are Orthodox: Chuvash, Yakuts, Kryashen, Nagaybaks.
                In addition, the peoples of the far north are Dolgans, or for example, Altai people in the south of Siberia. It is clear that these are small nations and all of them live on the territory of Russia, but still.
                1. Nagaibak
                  Nagaibak 23 December 2013 20: 12
                  0
                  RUSS "or, for example, Altaians in the south of Siberia."
                  Some of them are shamanists with Buddhists mixed up. There are Orthodox Old Believers.
                  1. RUSS
                    RUSS 24 December 2013 09: 53
                    0
                    Quote: Nagaibak
                    RUSS "or, for example, Altaians in the south of Siberia."
                    Some of them are shamanists with Buddhists mixed up. There are Orthodox Old Believers.


                    Andrei, I didn’t indicate in the koment that the Altaians are Orthodox.
                    1. Nagaibak
                      Nagaibak 24 December 2013 18: 25
                      0
                      [quote = РУСС] "Andrey, I did not indicate in the comments that the Altaians are Orthodox."
                      I tried to just supplement your list. In general, the Turkic world is diverse and interesting. This world only benefits from its diversity.
            2. xetai9977
              xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 43
              -5
              In your words, the truth is that Turks, Azerbaijanis, not counting other small nations, belong to the Mediterranean species of the Caucasian race, and Central Asian Turks belong to the Turanian type of the Mongoloid race. But in terms of mentality, they hardly differ. And these peoples are mostly friends. What can not be said about the relationship, for example, Poles and Russians, Western Ukrainians, etc.
              1. RUSS
                RUSS 23 December 2013 11: 04
                +1
                Quote: xetai9977
                In your words, the truth is that Turks, Azerbaijanis, not counting other small nations, belong to the Mediterranean species of the Caucasian race, and Central Asian Turks belong to the Turanian type of the Mongoloid race. But in terms of mentality, they hardly differ. And these peoples are mostly friends. What can not be said about the relationship, for example, Poles and Russians, Western Ukrainians, etc.

                I briefly commented on the relations between the Slavs before that Pan-Slavism is even more utopian than Pan-Turkism.
              2. Mairos
                Mairos 23 December 2013 12: 52
                +1
                They are friends as long as there is no real ambition in politics and no conflict intersections, respectively. Well, or they are geographically far apart.
            3. The comment was deleted.
            4. Yeraz
              Yeraz 23 December 2013 10: 54
              +1
              Quote: RUSS
              Pan-Turkism is utopia, the Türks are a completely different ethnic group in religion, race and mentality. By the way, I can add the same thing on panslavism.

              The Türks are many times more similar in language and culture than the Slavs.
              And what does pan-Turkism have to do with it? Turkey, the accent should be properly placed.
              Regarding the Balkans, they have a strong position there, especially in Albania and Kosovo. Faith and comprehensive assistance to them during the conflict. Yes, Bosnian Muslims are also for them.
          2. baltika-18
            baltika-18 23 December 2013 10: 57
            +1
            Quote: xetai9977
            Protyurkic is when the interests of the Turkic countries are put at the forefront

            Pan-Turkism has come to be, or something like that.
            Quote: xetai9977
            .And also the interests of Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan and other Turkic countries. If the integration of these countries intensifies, then a powerful alliance of Turkic states will be created

            The alliance is always for something, for specific purposes, and usually against someone. Is there an answer to this question?
          3. Rusich51
            Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 15
            0
            Hetai.
            Protyurkic is when the interests of the Turkic countries are put at the forefront,

            Although history goes in a circle, it’s not so accurate. At the current stage, this is unrealistic, but the sea of ​​blood is real.
        2. The comment was deleted.
        3. avt
          avt 23 December 2013 11: 05
          +3
          Quote: baltika-18
          And what about the Protyurk?

          This is such a tempting, like, "in a single family", sort of like a world caliphate, but on the basis of nationality - the chimney is lower and the smoke is thinner. We played the Pan-Slavic games with the "brotherly" peoples, but it has not yet come to these and amuse themselves with glitches about
          Quote: xetai9977
          If the integration of these countries intensifies, then a powerful alliance of Turkic states will be created.

          Well, again, the presence of
          Quote: xetai9977
          Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan and other Turkic countries

          Where "others" is Tatarstan, Bashkiria, well, you can also do it in Siberia, it gets drunk and dizzy. Again, the ghost of the USSR looms, it seems to them that they will definitely do better, though they don't know how and subconsciously understand - only the Ottoman Empire led by the Anatolian Turks, all the rest will remain where they were in the same state, but this thought is driven away from themselves and they firmly believe that it will be better. And it will be as always.
          1. Basileus
            Basileus 23 December 2013 11: 29
            +3
            For Russia, both phenomena are equally dangerous, but Central Asian leaders are not fools - they understand that pan-Turkism can be opposed to the growing pressure of Islamism.
          2. Clegg
            Clegg 23 December 2013 12: 16
            +2
            Quote: avt
            Where "other" is Tatarstan, Bashkiria, well, you can also do it in Siberia, it gets drunk and dizzy.

            Unfortunately, Tatarstan is already lost for us, and there are very few Bashkirs in our country.

            I understand the negative perceptions of pan-Turkism among Russians. You probably think that this alliance will be directed against you. We should keep our own ...
            1. Basileus
              Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 22
              +12
              I saw "your" pan-Turkism in the grave. As a Bashkir Tatar I speak.

              At the expense of the small number of Bashkirs, a third of the population of Bashkortostan. Another third are Tatars. It is better to live in the center of Russia and speak Tatar (or Bashkir) than on the outskirts of the new Ottoman Empire, speaking Turkish.
              1. Clegg
                Clegg 23 December 2013 12: 58
                +3
                Quote: Basileus
                I saw "your" pan-Turkism in the grave.

                The evidence of my words, the Tatars are lost for Turkism.

                Quote: Basileus
                Like a Bashkir Tatar I speak.

                About the relationship of Bashkirs and Tatars in Bashkortostan, I heard a lot wink
                As one Tatars said, I'd rather be on the "Russian march" than together with the "Bashists".

                PS Bashkirs and Nogais those nations for which I really care, another question is whether they need it or not laughing
                1. Basileus
                  Basileus 23 December 2013 13: 03
                  +3
                  Nobody forbids you to live under the Ottomans.
                  1. The comment was deleted.
                    1. Basileus
                      Basileus 23 December 2013 13: 20
                      +4
                      Here I am about the same. Choose Ottoman assimilation. Also a choice.
                      1. Clegg
                        Clegg 23 December 2013 15: 11
                        +3
                        Quote: Basileus
                        Here I am about the same. Choose Ottoman assimilation. Also a choice.

                        I still do not understand you, I said that the Tatars do not want to be with us and you have confirmed this.
                        So what's the problem?
                        Ottomans ate, Ottomans.
                        Did I agitate you?
                      2. Basileus
                        Basileus 23 December 2013 15: 41
                        +1
                        So I’m not campaigning for you)
                    2. alone
                      alone 23 December 2013 20: 05
                      +2
                      Leave your advice to yourself. We will decide with whom and where!
                    3. Basileus
                      Basileus 24 December 2013 07: 54
                      0
                      Show me where I advise - then we'll talk.
                    4. The comment was deleted.
          3. Alibekulu
            Alibekulu 24 December 2013 21: 58
            +1
            Quote: Clegg
            About the relationship of Bashkirs and Tatars in Bashkortostan, I heard a lot
            In the last census in Bashkortostan there was an unspoken tendency - local Tatars were recorded by the Bashkirs.
            By the way, there are several scientific studies about Kazakh-Bashkir relations, history and culture ..
        4. Semurg
          Semurg 23 December 2013 13: 06
          +3
          Quote: Basileus
          I saw "your" pan-Turkism in the grave. As a Bashkir Tatar I speak.

          At the expense of the small number of Bashkirs, a third of the population of Bashkortostan. Another third are Tatars. It is better to live in the center of Russia and speak Tatar (or Bashkir) than on the outskirts of the new Ottoman Empire, speaking Turkish.

          Bayrat, like a Tatar from Tatarstan, wrote that language is dying and its destiny is interfamily communication. It was similar with us, but it seems to be slowly recovering, at least in our south. In the summer, in the north, everyone was surprised as if under an alliance, they only stopped sticking in public transport when you speak Kazakh. As for the new Ottoman Empire, it’s creeping up to China (far from the truth).
          1. Basileus
            Basileus 23 December 2013 13: 12
            +5
            So let the pan-Turkists develop cultural cooperation aimed at preserving the language and culture. Turkmen and Ottoman culture are not much closer to us than Russian.

            But in our comments, everyone yells about unification. And unification is just the new Ottoman Empire, there simply is no other option, no matter how the apologists try to prove it. But creeping to China is not very far)

            Wildly with you. Nobody ever poked at us)
            1. Semurg
              Semurg 23 December 2013 13: 28
              +3
              on the account of pan-Turkism, Beck at the bottom gave a detailed comment with which I agree. In terms of language, it was wildly changing now, if yours is not so, I am happy for you.
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. Nagaibak
              Nagaibak 24 December 2013 18: 34
              0
              Basileus "It's wild at you. Nobody has ever pounded here."
              Just a fantasy rushing at the person.
            4. Alibekulu
              Alibekulu 25 December 2013 13: 29
              +3
              Quote: Basileus
              Wildly with you. Nobody ever poked at us)
              Actually, this "cycling" largely contributed to the growth of national self-awareness among the Kazakhs. In December 1986 it exploded.
              T.O. Great Russian chauvinism provoked the so-called defensive nationalism of the Kazakhs.
          2. Clegg
            Clegg 23 December 2013 13: 48
            +5
            Quote: Semurg
            It was similar with us, but it seems to be slowly recovering, at least in our south.

            In the west, too, and Atyrau in general, along with Kyzylorda, are the most Kazakh regions wink
          3. Nagaibak
            Nagaibak 24 December 2013 18: 33
            0
            Semurg "In the summer I was in the north, everyone was surprised as if it was a union, the only thing was that they stopped poking in public transport when you speak Kazakh."
            Is this a jabber on you? Lying is bad. I can hardly imagine that someone would poke on the Kazakhs. In the Russian: Orenburg, Chelyabinsk, Kurgan, etc. provinces they do not rattle, but here it is necessary ... Kazakhs themselves can poke on anyone they want ... respect their fellow countrymen.
            1. Beck
              Beck 24 December 2013 18: 50
              +2
              Quote: Nagaibak
              Is this a jabber on you?


              Poked, poked. No, no, yes they poked. Explaining this by saying that they say they are going to kill me. As if in a bus or other crowded place it was possible to discuss the alleged such.

              When he studied in Leningrad for six months at the Institute for Advanced Studies, even teachers from the intelligentsia made a remark.
              1. Basileus
                Basileus 25 December 2013 08: 09
                0
                In Leningrad, this is normal. It is simply indecent to speak in a foreign country surrounded by people who do not understand your language. Remember the proverb about the charter and the monastery? So, speaking Kazakh in Leningrad, you behaved no better than the Russians clinging to the Kazakhs in Kazakhstan.
                1. Nagaibak
                  Nagaibak 25 December 2013 08: 16
                  0
                  Basileus "It is simply indecent to speak in a foreign country surrounded by people who do not understand your language"
                  Bravo!
                2. Beck
                  Beck 25 December 2013 17: 09
                  +3
                  Quote: Nagaibak
                  Basileus "It is simply indecent to speak in a foreign country surrounded by people who do not understand your language"
                  Bravo!


                  You, Nagaybak and Bazilevs, may know English, then go to the Philippines, to Honduras, to Kenya. When you arrive, for a day, for a week, for a month, then do not talk among themselves - It will simply be indecent to speak in a foreign country surrounded by people who do not understand your language. Walk silently or speak your fingers, but it will also be indecent, since there absolutely not everyone knows the language of the deaf-mute.

                  When you arrive, I will give you a triple bravo and a loud one - gip, gip - cheers.
                3. Basileus
                  Basileus 25 December 2013 18: 55
                  0
                  I missed the word, and you are already furious)
                4. Beck
                  Beck 25 December 2013 19: 00
                  +3
                  Quote: Basileus
                  I missed a word, and you are already furious


                  And even without this word your position is clear. And what infuriates me is not enough for everyone. I’m ironic, the absurdity of some statements, some of them, comes faster.
                5. Basileus
                  Basileus 25 December 2013 20: 20
                  0
                  No absurdity, for I'm right)
                6. Beck
                  Beck 26 December 2013 10: 27
                  +2
                  Quote: Basileus
                  No absurdity, for I'm right)


                  You can knock "I'm Right" on the memorial plate and attach this plate over your door.

                  And if you hang such plates around the entire perimeter of your house, then you will be the Circle of Law.

                  When you do this, let me know, I will send you a congratulatory telegram and two plates, for a complete set, put one down and the other on top.
      2. Semurg
        Semurg 25 December 2013 10: 19
        0
        I didn't understand if, for example, the Germans would speak German to each other, I should go up to them and say that it is not normal to speak German in Kazakhstan? (I took the Germans tourists around Shymkent and no one pulled them back). Once I was in China and somehow did not see that the visiting Russians would try to speak Chinese and they would not be pulled back. Now an example as asked below from life. The boys left on the sly from their parents from the aul to the city, we stand on the back of the bus, we talk, then the aunt turns and says, well, that's enough on your own ..... speak humanly in Russian. Since the parents were brought up in respect for their elders, they kept silent, but the sediment remained. And so having received a couple of times already automatically speak Russian if there is at least one Russian nearby. The conversation supposedly that it is not proper to speak Kazakh in the presence of a Russian is far-fetched, anyone who wishes (if desired) will master the spoken Kazakh in a year, but so far our Russian "dumb" are mostly in Kazakh, though they have stopped chuckling and pulling when they speak in front of them in Kazakh. Marek was banned mainly for his position that the Republic of Ingushetia and the USSR not only gave gingerbread to the Kazakhs, but often regaled them with a whip (apparently, the moderators considered it incitement to national hatred, although here on the site they directly write to dismember the neighboring state, cut out Caucasians, etc., and they do not consider this as appeals to nationalism. The fact that you personally relate to the Kazakhs exactly understood for a long time on this and I answer whether to believe or not decide for yourself, here are not only my posts about assaults on the language in the union. By the way, the return collision with the Russian language in modern Kazakhstan is not I approve of everyone, but the requirement for people working with people to know the Kazakh language at least at the level of take-and-bring by local Russian-speakers is correct.
      3. Basileus
        Basileus 25 December 2013 10: 58
        0
        Why do St. Petersburg learn Kazakh? In Russia, in a public place with knowledge of Russian, one must speak Russian. We are not talking about tourists, but about those who have been living in a foreign country for a long time - studying or working. So the teacher had every right. But Russians in Kazakhstan should know Kazakh - this is a fact.

        In transport, I, too, are all kinds of Caucasians and Central Asians, yelling in their languages, enrage.
      4. Semurg
        Semurg 25 December 2013 11: 25
        +1
        He wrote about Peter Beck, as I understand he wrote that he spoke Kazakh with another Kazakh and the teacher pulled them up, I don't think it was in the classroom, most likely it was outside the classroom. The niece studied in England says that no one jerked when she spoke Kazakh with other Kazakhs and even asked to teach Kazakh outside the classroom. Well, the teacher. the one who pulled them down for me did not do the right thing. Let's go away from the "cave" where any stranger was beaten in the head just for the fact that his eyes are different and his language is not clear. And to beat in the head if this person who speaks another language begins to break the law that is the same for everyone.
      5. Basileus
        Basileus 25 December 2013 12: 07
        0
        I will remain in my opinion. If you know the language of the country you are in, speak it. Otherwise, do not be offended that they look at you askance - you deserve it.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Beck
      Beck 25 December 2013 19: 23
      +3
      Quote: Basileus
      We are not talking about tourists, but about those who have been living in a foreign country for a long time - studying or working.


      I was born, studied, lived in the USSR, where the languages ​​of the republics had the same status. And according to the constitution, no one had the right, anywhere in the USSR, to forbid me to speak my native language.

      Who studied in the USSR, from the countries of the social camp, so they have the first two semesters and were devoted to the study of the Russian language. But in the subway, on the buses, they spoke their own languages.

      Separate migrant workers present. They need to learn the language of the country of residence, but among themselves they have every right to speak their native language.

      Quote: Basileus
      In transport, I, too, are all kinds of Caucasians and Central Asians, yelling in their languages, enrage.


      If you are furious, which is unbearable, it’s business to solve this problem, that two fingers ... piss.

      For Central Asians, close the border and work on rough, low-paying jobs yourself.

      For Caucasians. Separate from the Caucasian autonomies, along the administrative borders with barbed wire and a control and track strip. That is, give them full independence and send all Caucasians to Russia there.

      Then no one will enrage you.

      Only now it will be necessary for Russia? Of course not. This is only necessary for reckless terrified people.
  5. Beck
    Beck 25 December 2013 16: 35
    +2
    Quote: Basileus
    In Leningrad, this is normal.


    SUCH ANYTHING NORMAL.

    We lived in the USSR, in a family of fraternal and equal peoples. And every nation has its own language.

    You can imagine that in Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan, Moldova, Belarus, two or three Russian speaking Russian, Kazakhs, Azerbaijanis, Moldavians, Belarusians say - Why are you talking in your own way, maybe you want to kill us? Let's talk in Kazakh, Azerbaijani, Moldovan, Belarusian. And how does it feel? The sense and logic are the same, only the terms are rearranged, but the snobbery of national "superiority" does not change from the rearrangement of the places of the terms.

    After all, they did not say to tourists or business people who came from England, Cuba, Mongolia in buses, metro - And why do you speak English, Spanish, Mongolian. Maybe you want to kill us. Well, speak Russian.

    So, do not la la. Cases are past, but not subject to justification.

    And if I asked, in Leningrad, a neighbor on the training table, the Kyrgyz - Did his wife give birth? That is absolutely not a reason in the Equal Union, and the status of languages, too, swing the rights of national superiority, swagger and arrogance.

    Of course, this was not all of Russia, it was some part of the inhabitants. Even those who walked under the guise of an intellectual.
  • Nagaibak
    Nagaibak 25 December 2013 08: 13
    0
    Beck "Tsykali, tskali. No, no, yes tskali. Explaining this by the fact that they say they are going to kill me."
    As for the kill ... you got excited about it. Or a bad joke?
    1. Beck
      Beck 25 December 2013 19: 08
      +1
      Quote: Nagaibak
      Beck "Tsykali, tskali. No, no, yes tskali. Explaining this by the fact that they say they are going to kill me."
      As for the kill ... you got excited about it. Or a bad joke?


      And I did not think to get excited. There in Leningrad I argued about this with two Russian doctors from our group. Here they are, in contrast to my arguments, and they said - Or maybe you are going to kill us.

      And then there was no smell of jokes.
  • Semurg
    Semurg 24 December 2013 20: 48
    +2
    Nagaybak. I didn’t live in Orenburg, I don’t know, but as Marek wrote who lived there in the face they called him, sorry he was banned. In Kazakhstan, Russian-speaking people rattled everywhere in the south and in the north. You do not have knowledge about life in Kazakhstan but are you accusing me of lying? It turns out I did not live, but I know that you're lying? if you wanted to hurt your post were mistaken, after talking on this site I’m not offended, I was ill.
    1. Nagaibak
      Nagaibak 25 December 2013 08: 32
      0
      Semurg "You have no knowledge of life in Kazakhstan, but accuse me of lying?"
      I know firsthand about life in Kazakhstan. I have been there several times in the 80s. Your mentality is also familiar to me in the relatives of the Kazakhs. Brothers cousins ​​in their classes were the only Russians. Regarding the tsykaniya, everyone who spoke up and poked at you? Or have you heard about it? I understand the oral epic in your guys, but better examples from your own life. And then I will tell you how a Kazakh nurse told one acquaintance in Guryev when she brought a child "so that you die and your geek too." Etc. I'm not saying that all Kazakhs in Kazakhstan are like that. I understand that there are ur ... odes. So in Russia. People in the 90s left everywhere, and the mood of intolerance in society became embittered from here. Why should they now kiss all immigrants from the union republics in the gums? They were kicked out of the republics, and then they themselves also came in large numbers and still pump their rights? People think so especially who left the union republics and form public opinion. Therefore, nationalism rises. There is nothing to be surprised at.
    2. Nagaibak
      Nagaibak 25 December 2013 08: 37
      0
      Quote: Semurg
      Marek who lived there in the face called chu.kami, sorry he was banned.

      Why was he banned? And with whom am I to discuss now? Hmm ... it took a month to work.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Alibekulu
    Alibekulu 24 December 2013 21: 46
    +2
    Quote: Nagaibak
    Is this a jabber on you? Lying is bad.
    Not for the sake of it, but as the saying goes, "you can't throw out words from a song ..". There was such a topic ..
    Quote: Nagaibak
    I can hardly imagine that someone would poke on the Kazakhs. In the Russian: Orenburg, Chelyabinsk, Kurgan, etc. provinces they do not rattle, but here it is necessary ... Kazakhs themselves can poke on anyone they want ... respect their countrymen.
    In Soviet times, Kazakhs in Kazakhstan were in the minority, reaching up to 30%. There were so few Kazakhs in Kostanay that when urban Kazakhs met each other, they would definitely greet hi
    In the late 80s, after being called to the regional military registration and enlistment office in Kustanai, the nagash (mother's brother), upon arrival, told with surprise: "I saw Kazakhs in Kustanai!?!"
    1. Zymran
      Zymran 24 December 2013 22: 34
      +3
      It was, it was. I really found it already, but in the 90 it was met, though not everywhere through gritted teeth, but nonetheless.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. ayyildiz
      ayyildiz 24 December 2013 22: 39
      +2
      Kazakhstan needs to increase its population to at least 80-90 million! Then it will have the whole world!
      1. Semurg
        Semurg 25 December 2013 10: 49
        +1
        Quote: ayyildiz
        Kazakhstan needs to increase its population to at least 80-90 million! Then it will have the whole world!

        I think 40 million will be enough for a steady state, but population growth seems to be halting and probably will stop at 20-25 million if the authorities don’t stop saving money in a piggy bank and start investing in increasing the population.
  • Nagaibak
    Nagaibak 25 December 2013 08: 45
    0
    Semurg "Bayrat, like a Tatar from Tatarstan, wrote that the language is dying and his lot is intra-family communication"
    Yeah, he dies, we have food from work in Surgut, and every day I listen to how Tatar people speak to each other. Such they are Russified, there are no forces.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 25 December 2013 11: 07
      +1
      Bazilevsu replied that he was glad for the Tatar language, which is more alive than all the living. Ask the Tatars who drove them for the right to drive in which language they studied. We did not have a single school for obtaining rights in Kazakh during the union. Kazakh was purely everyday between the Kazakhs, I think the Tatar has not gone far.
      1. Nagaibak
        Nagaibak 25 December 2013 12: 37
        0
        Semurg "We did not have a single school for obtaining rights in Kazakh during the union."
        Take in Kazakh and ride in the Kazakh SSR. So what? There was one state and when you arrived in Latvia you could show all-Union rights. And they read them. And make sure that you have them according to the law, and not yourself painted. And in our Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug, 20000 thousand Khanty and 7 thousand Mansi and 1,5 million are not of indigenous nationality (although what does it mean not indigenous?) And we will hand over in their languages. Your example is unsuccessful. There are things that require training and standards in one language. Technical guests are written in Chinese? Or English? And to this day in Russian and approved by almost all the republics of the former USSR. And no one would be outraged about this. Because the conversation between the signatories is simple. Do not like it, go to the western guests and learn English.
        We have a lot of drivers from Central Asia who studied in their own language. They got it with their ride. They bought Corks, they drive like themselves in the villages. They mow on the roads to the fullest. Did you mean that? They consider why they are studying, and so are horsemen. Somehow I was driving with an Azerbaijani bombila and he told me an unforgettable phrase crossing two continuous stripes "Okay, today we will break it for the last time and we won't be any more ..."
        1. Semurg
          Semurg 25 December 2013 16: 19
          +2
          With the union of rights, it was written in Russian, but probably it was necessary to learn in the language that the students of driving schools knew better (or in different parts of the union, road signs and markings would be understood differently depending on the language of study?) What are bought in our time? very bad, but it is not related to the language of instruction. For violations of the rules of driving all the questions to your traffic police who takes a bribe and does not see anything, but this is again not related to the language of instruction. According to GOST, the transition to others is very expensive and therefore left the old ones, but ISO 9001 is being introduced at the same time. In general, probably we will not come to a common denominator in this issue, but this is not important in principle, we just voiced our points of view. Since we live in different states, it doesn’t matter now, but if our presidents begin to work towards a union this will become important, and this is one of the reasons why I do not really like the union.
        2. Nagaibak
          Nagaibak 26 December 2013 06: 29
          +1
          Semurg "Because how we live in different states, it doesn't matter now, but if our presidents begin to lead business towards the union, it will become important, and this is one of the reasons why I do not really like the union."
          Like dislike ... these are evaluation categories. Globally, there is no alternative. If some kind of integration for Kazakhstan is possible only with Russia. Or is China better? Oh yes, probably the Turkic project. There will never be a great pan-Turkic caliphate that can replace Russia - this is utopia. Everything rests on who will be the main thing. And your skirmish is permissible and the Uzbeks will become inevitable. Hmm ... but let's say the Tatars will never submit to the Kazakhs. I read how the Germans tried to create a Turkic legion and it fell apart precisely for this reason.
          Our current economic relative prosperity is not the merit of the people of Kazakhstan, Russia, Azerbaijan. This is just oil and its prices. Take her away and where will everything remain? I know the grannies in Kustanai in the 90s jumped out of the balconies, there was nothing to eat. People opened garages, and in them cellars with pickles. Perhaps you will argue and prove to me that in the 90s they lived wonderful.
          And then, just the oil prices went up, and you, and we, and Azerbaijan, went up with maz.
          Nazarbayev said we went to the level of Ukraine in economics. This does not mean that we are so cool, but how failed the Ukrainian economy. You remember what she was like in 1990. And now, the remnants of Soviet industry and infrastructure feed all our states. Or will you argue?
          Semurg "Under the union, the rights were written in Russian, but probably it was necessary to learn in the language that the students of driving schools were better at (or in different parts of the union road signs and markings would be understood differently depending on the language of study?"
          Maybe I agreed with you, but remembering Dagestan with its 30 nationalities and a plus of autonomy ... or didn’t they have to be given this opportunity? But only 15 union republics? But they would tell us?
        3. Semurg
          Semurg 26 December 2013 09: 20
          +1
          Nagaybak. A strange nickname for this site, but I read about the reasons for its appearance. In the union for me further TS we do not need to go. I respect your opinion on the current situation, but I am against a close union, as they often write here, what the hell kind of union are you ten times more than you are and what equality you have. As long as there are such views, the union will not be steady, the Russians will again begin to slowly squeeze out rights and freedoms, and in the end we will come to what we recently left. When orders are dropped from Moscow, and here they are executed, and then when 30-40% of Kazakhs die out, they say a kink in the field. Then millions of non-Kazakhs are resettled, making Kazakhs a minority in their own land, saying nothing terrible, but we saved you from complete destruction. About the 90s, it was absolutely crap to all Kazakhstanis, Russian friends and neighbors leaving said all the khan to you without us, survived nothing and now all the more so different states stimulate the departure from Kazakhstan of those people who do not see themselves in independent Kazakhstan, and for Russia they will the best patriots, and allied affairs stop them giving them hope that everything will be like in a union. I understand that you have a completely different view on the common history and the current situation, and therefore I think that a close union is not necessary for the CU, CSTO and SCO. NAS signed an election agreement I will vote against. But even with you an adequate Russian, I don’t have consent, much less between yours and ours extreme. Why create a union when good neighborly relations are enough. I understand that Putin needs an alliance for his idea of ​​alliance 2.0, Nazarbayev has a roof from color technologies and not only from the West. As for the training, we also don’t agree, you write, you don’t need to complicate it with the languages, the uniformity in the languages ​​is better than Russian and that's it, but I have a different understanding. And such conflicts of interest, even between the simple two representatives of their peoples, are a wagon and a small cart. The Pan-Turk project was already written about this thread if you are interested, read my point of view.
        4. Nagaibak
          Nagaibak 26 December 2013 11: 27
          +1
          Semurg "According to the union, we do not need to go further with the vehicle."
          Semurg, and I’m not calling anyone. This is a distant prospect. And I'm sure of that. Not because I profess imperial ideas there. Life makes you integrate. That's all. First of all, economically. And the economy dictates politics as you know. There will be a new USSR-2, this will not be a long-term business. This is almost independent of us. I’ll tell you one thing - when your economic aces will be of interest in Russia, have real estate here, factories, etc. then they will promote the union further. And they will not care about everything, most importantly grandmas. And it will be Kazakhs, not ours. Of course, at the same time they will beat themselves with a heel in the chest, they say they are patriots ...
          Semurg "Nagaybak. Strange nickname for this site, but I read about the reasons for its appearance.
          Nothing strange, there is the Horde, and the other Mongols and Tartaria hehe ...
          If Marek had told me this, I would certainly have snapped about the Russified 700.000 thousand Kazakhs and not Russified 11 thousand Nagaybaks. For me, the Nagaybaki, figuratively speaking, is a bridge between the Slavs and the Turks. They took their customs from there and from here.
          And be that as it may, the Russians and Kazakhs interacted more than they fought. Economic interests are mutual; therefore, economic integration is inevitable. And the political ... wait and see.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Basileus
    Basileus 25 December 2013 12: 14
    0
    Harassment and forcibly rushing of sulәshergә mәҗbүr itәlәr! What arrogance, isn't it?
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Christian
    Christian 23 December 2013 17: 22
    +2
    Right! The Bashkirs, the Tatars with the Russian superethnos, have much more in common than with the Turks!
    1. Rusich51
      Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 12
      +1
      Quote: Christian
      Right! The Bashkirs, the Tatars with the Russian superethnos, have much more in common than with the Turks!

      From the time of the Romanov era, by the way.
  • RUSS
    RUSS 23 December 2013 12: 33
    0
    Clegg
    What do you mean by saying that "Tatarstan is lost for us"?
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 23 December 2013 13: 01
      +4
      Quote: RUSS
      What do you mean by saying that "Tatarstan is lost for us"?


      Quote: Basileus
      It is better to live in the center of Russia and speak Tatar (or Bashkir) than on the outskirts of the new Ottoman Empire, speaking Turkish.


      I talked about this, I respect their choice hi
  • Yeraz
    Yeraz 23 December 2013 13: 30
    0
    Quote: Clegg
    Quote: avt
    Where "other" is Tatarstan, Bashkiria, well, you can also do it in Siberia, it gets drunk and dizzy.

    Unfortunately, Tatarstan is already lost for us, and there are very few Bashkirs in our country.

    I understand the negative perceptions of pan-Turkism among Russians. You probably think that this alliance will be directed against you. We should keep our own ...


    Yes, the Tatars in the majority are Russified, but they are not lost. The world of globalization is doing its job. On the one hand, Turkism penetrates young people from the other Islam. And although the latter are in the minority, they are much more accentuated and united than most Russified,
    Therefore, everything is yet to come.
    1. Nagaibak
      Nagaibak 25 December 2013 08: 42
      0
      Yeraz "Yes, the Tatars in the majority are Russified, but they are not lost"
      And where did you get this from? Tatar always remains Tatar, even if he does not know his own language. I have at work a lot of those who are not Russified. Go to the mosque. Normal guys.
  • avt
    avt 23 December 2013 15: 49
    +5
    Quote: Clegg
    You probably think that this alliance will be directed against you.

    Compared to the radicalization of Islam, which preachers like Gedar Dzhemal impose as a substitute for socialist ideology, your pan-Turkism is childish pranks in the sandbox of the younger group of kindergarten. Although especially zealous heralds need to be watched, within the framework of the newly adopted law on separatism. Here you really only have the Ottoman Empire looming, all the rest are glitches that, in the extreme case of the weakening of Russia as a single state, may well turn into a general stabbing between the Turkic brothers "easily, naturally and merrily. How the Kyrgyz cut the Uzbeks, and even earlier the Meskhetian Turks. You can recall the rest of the cases of" brotherly "showdowns yourself.
  • Rusich51
    Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 05
    0
    Quote: Clegg
    I understand the negative perceptions of pan-Turkism among Russians. You probably think that this alliance will be directed against you. We should keep our own ...

    There is no peace among men. Apparently he will come only with his disappearance.
  • Nagaibak
    Nagaibak 25 December 2013 12: 43
    0
    = Clegg "I understand the negative perception of Pan-Turkism among Russians."
    There will be no pan-Turkism as well as pan-Slavism descend already ... to the sinful earth. Why can you ask the Uzbeks with Kyrgyzstan.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 25 December 2013 15: 25
      +1
      with pan-Turkism, I think we’ll go no further than cultural ties, supposedly a mutual exchange of students and creative groups there is a theater, cinema, etc. In economics, everything will be considered profitable or not, not a single Turkic state will harm itself. will not come. In politics, I think we will not go beyond mutual assurances of friendship. Today, young Kazakhs may have different thoughts, but their time has not come yet.
      1. Basileus
        Basileus 25 December 2013 18: 56
        0
        Something your Azerbaijani friends say about one people, one language, artificial borders. Are they lying?
        1. Semurg
          Semurg 25 December 2013 20: 13
          +1
          Quote: Basileus
          Something your Azerbaijani friends say about one people, one language, artificial borders. Are they lying?

          Azerbaijan writes that they have a language close to 80% of the common words with the Turks, they write that the Turks are mentally close to them, but they seem to clearly divide that they are two peoples. By the way, in Tatar, what does Azeri -by-jan mean. They refer to the artificial border as Iranian, where Azerbaijan lives 25-30 million. You did not understand all this or do not want to understand.
          1. Basileus
            Basileus 25 December 2013 20: 19
            0
            He spoke about all the Turks, not Turks and Azerbaijanis.
            1. Semurg
              Semurg 25 December 2013 20: 35
              +2
              Quote: Basileus
              He spoke about all the Turks, not Turks and Azerbaijanis.

              Who are you?
            2. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. Zymran
        Zymran 25 December 2013 19: 02
        +3
        Wait and see. So far, I want more economic projects with Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan, Azerbaijan and Turkey. That's just the vehicle interferes.

        By the way, I went to Tarkan’s concert yesterday. smile
      3. The comment was deleted.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • sergey72
    sergey72 23 December 2013 09: 59
    +1
    “And what kind of idiotic card is posted?” Is such a card okay?
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 10: 08
      -2
      Quote: sergey72
      Is such a card suitable?

      Well you bent wassat it’s not about where the Turkish soldier’s boot will stand)) it’s all about economic relations ... good-neighborly trade relations .... otherwise, it’s a little bit that everyone sees war at once and only war)))
      1. sergey72
        sergey72 23 December 2013 10: 15
        +3
        Quote: smersh70
        Well you bent

        Yes, actually not me .... Correct if I am mistaken, judging by the inscriptions on the map, the relatives of the unforgettable Ostap Ibbrahimovic, who suffered ... laughing
      2. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 23 December 2013 11: 32
        +6
        Quote: smersh70
        ..a then, here it’s a little bit that, so immediately everyone sees war and only war)))

        So it always ended, only a warrior. There is no other story.
    2. Lelek
      Lelek 23 December 2013 11: 51
      +6
      That's right. The policy of silencing the tendencies resembles a joke: - the commander of the unit comes to the service in the morning, and the officer on duty reports to him - Everything is in order, the beaver is dead. - What bobik? - Stray. - Why did you die? - Horse meat is full. The fire mare died. - Why are you dead? - They drove in a fire. - What kind of fire? “So the drunken officers burned the headquarters.” “Have you reported this to anyone?” - That's right - to the politician. But for some reason he shot himself and left a note that you are to blame for what happened ... bully
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Basileus
    Basileus 23 December 2013 10: 24
    0
    There and so Dagestan is separate from Russia. The map is historical.
  • denis6799
    denis6799 23 December 2013 10: 46
    +4
    Is it not in Astrakhan that the same Russian people live as in all of Russia. Russia attacked Astrakhan, lost the war and agreed to peace? I do not remember
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Mairos
    Mairos 23 December 2013 12: 49
    +3
    The card is crazy. Well, if Turkey does not want to become a new Ottoman Empire, then no one will "bury" it. In fact, it was the Ottoman Empire that was "buried", and no one ever tried to "bury" Turkey. IMHO ..
  • Rusich51
    Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 01
    0
    Quote: xetai9977
    And what kind of idiotic card is posted? Karabakh and Azerbaijan. You will not like it if someone hangs out a map, where for example Astarkhan and Russia are indicated as separate entities

    Map of the last century or the year before last.
    1. alone
      alone 23 December 2013 20: 12
      +4
      Vladimir! Map of garbage, you look at the author Samsonov, he’s also an alarmist)) Turkic countries will not be reunited together. The talk is only about cultural and economic
      relations and their development. there is good to each other what to offer. but the creation of a new empire, no one even thinks about it. 21st century. empire has long been in the dustbin of history.
  • Chertkov Oleg
    Chertkov Oleg 23 December 2013 19: 49
    +2
    Many have already tried to bury Turkey. It didn’t work out, they got over ..... And what kind of an idiotic card was posted?

    You are a strange person. Argue with yourself and answer yourself. I will translate: the "idiotic map" is just about that Turkey that was destroyed and not torn, in the years of borders, read it carefully.
    . You will not like it if someone hangs out a map where Astarkhan and Russia are designated as separate entities

    And why argue with history, something when it was Turkish, and then it became Russian. Alaska was ours too, so what?
  • The comment was deleted.
  • major071
    major071 23 December 2013 09: 22
    +11
    Not a hat for Senka. (Russian proverb)
  • Stiletto
    Stiletto 23 December 2013 09: 35
    +4
    As the saying goes, "To want is not harmful. It is harmful not to want." laughing
  • Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 23 December 2013 09: 40
    +5
    If Turkey takes Georgia for itself, then in the light of the events of the 2008 year, I will not cry.
  • Per se.
    Per se. 23 December 2013 09: 45
    +9
    "Turkey claims part of the Balkans and plans to change the balance of power in the Caucasus," and "in Greece, despite the incomparability of resources and potentials, there was previously an idea of ​​continuing to squeeze Turkey further into Asia, with the restoration of the legacy of Byzantium centered in Constantinople. the current deplorable state of the Greek economy, this idea is practically not remembered, "but in vain. The Turks, after the death of the Soviet Union, dreamed about the former territories, they need to be reminded here more often that there were former territories even before their invasion from the wild lands.
    1. Basileus
      Basileus 23 December 2013 10: 33
      -1
      The Greeks themselves loved everything. And those Christians who remained in Asia Minor also became Turks. Why now remember what died five hundred years ago? The Ottomans at one time had a territory no smaller than the VRI under Justinian, and now represent the most significant force in the region. And if you recall the affairs of five hundred years ago, then Muscovy herself will be in flight.
      1. Per se.
        Per se. 23 December 2013 14: 02
        +6
        Quote: Basileus
        And if you recall the affairs of five hundred years ago, then Muscovy herself will be in flight.
        So, politics rests on the fact that everyone remembers what is beneficial to him. If we talk about Muscovy, then its main difference is that the Russians, expanding the boundaries, have never been likened to nomadic locusts. For hundreds of years, the Turks could not be prayed for their sins in the Balkans, and they, zasr @ ntsy, still remembered the borders of this yoke.
  • Humpty
    Humpty 23 December 2013 09: 48
    +6
    It seems that the "sick man of Europe" has another exacerbation.
  • Siberian19
    Siberian19 23 December 2013 09: 51
    +6
    Don't you think that history is repeating itself? Turkey, supported and abetted by the West, once again sticks its nose on the balconies and the Caucasus!
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 10: 09
      -6
      Quote: Siberian19
      Icy again sticks its nose on the balkans and the Caucasus!

      did she ever leave here laughing wassat
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 23 December 2013 11: 33
        +13
        Quote: smersh70
        did she ever leave here

        No, she didn’t leave; Russian soldiers kicked her in the ass.
        1. smersh70
          smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 16
          -3
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          she was kicked in the ass by Russian soldiers.

          YOU have everything, Alexander, through a rifle and boots laughing but in the heads and souls of people it remained ... and how else .. and in 1992 they returned .....))) and it’s not for nothing that you keep so many troops in Armenia)) ...
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 24 December 2013 06: 38
            +1
            Quote: smersh70
            but in the heads and souls of people she remained

            Well, of course, we remember how not only from the Caucasus, but also from Europe on pendals, the Turkish pasha was carried away.
            Quote: smersh70
            .and how ... and in 1992 they returned .....))

            Oh yes, but the paradox is, if not for Russia, then the Armenians would have taken Baku wassat
            Quote: smersh70
            ) and for good reason still keep so many troops in Armenia)).

            Yes, this is for Aliyev’s hothead, and Turkey is so a trailer.
      2. KuzmichDP
        KuzmichDP 28 December 2013 20: 31
        0
        This is true, she didn’t go anywhere, and her legs carried away wassat
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • ed65b
    ed65b 23 December 2013 09: 57
    +9
    Azerbaijan is friends with Turks exclusively because of Karabakh. How the problem will be solved Azerbaijan wags its tail. They have their own plans. And it's not a fact that the Turks do not plan to "integrate" Azerbaijan into their territory in the future.
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 10: 12
      +2
      Quote: ed65b
      not the fact that the Turks do not plan to "integrate" Azerbaijan in the future

      well it's too much wassat we don’t need a chukha, but we won’t give it back))))
      Quote: ed65b
      Azerbaijan is friends with the Turks

      not only, there are linguistic, cultural, historical relations ... although sometimes we are so at war with them that the Armenians are silent watching and smoking a pipe wassat so it was recently when they wanted to open the border with Armenia .... it came to the point that they removed the Turkish flag from the burial of Turkish soldiers ..... and the Turks gave the back .. smile
      1. Rusich51
        Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 24
        0
        Quote: smersh70
        Azerbaijan is friends with the Turks

        South Azerbaijan is more to the people than to Azerbaijan itself. Where to be the capital?
        1. alone
          alone 23 December 2013 20: 15
          +3
          In Baku, compared to Baku, Tabriz resembles a village!
        2. smersh70
          smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 09
          +1
          Quote: Rusich51
          South Azerbaijan is more to the people than to Azerbaijan itself. Where to be the capital?

          oh, what words .. your words yes to god in ears fellow and where to be the capital --- no problem ... of course in Ganja wassat
          1. alone
            alone 23 December 2013 21: 11
            +2
            Quote: smersh70
            oh, what words .. Your words are in God’s ears and where to be the capital --- no problem ... of course in Ganja


            laughing I suggest Sabirabad)) wassat
            1. wk-083
              wk-083 23 December 2013 22: 09
              0
              Quote: lonely
              I suggest Sabirabad)

              How do you like Moscow?
              1. alone
                alone 23 December 2013 22: 23
                0
                Quote: wk-083
                How do you like Moscow?


                Thank you. We'll get along somehow. There are enough cities))
            2. KuzmichDP
              KuzmichDP 28 December 2013 20: 32
              0
              I suggest, Shemakha wassat
    2. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 06
      +2
      Quote: ed65b
      Azerbaijan is friends with Turks exclusively because of Karabakh. How the problem will be solved Azerbaijan wags its tail. They have their own plans. And it's not a fact that the Turks do not plan to "integrate" Azerbaijan into their territory in the future.

      You are very deeply mistaken. We are one people. Yes, economic integration is high, and it’s mutual, not just one investing and one buying up everything.
      If the Karabakh problem is resolved, Azerbaijan’s gaze will be directed to the south and the North Caucasus. Turkey will also benefit from Karabakh’s solution, otherwise all the resources of the state of Azerbaijan will be aimed at solving the problem with Karabakh, and it could be used more rationally.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. sergey72
      sergey72 23 December 2013 10: 30
      0
      Is it possible to translate, it’s very interesting that in the original? laughing
      1. Basileus
        Basileus 23 December 2013 10: 44
        0
        The street is Abu Ishaq.
        1. sergey72
          sergey72 23 December 2013 10: 49
          0
          Quote: Basileus
          The street is Abu Ishaq.

          Thank.. hi
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. smersh70
        smersh70 23 December 2013 10: 48
        +1
        Quote: sergey72
        Is it possible to translate, it’s very interesting that in the original?

        he saw the native word Ishaq there ... laughing Rabbin Ishaq street))) it is interesting to see in Israel a street with the name of some Turkish mullah)))))
      3. xetai9977
        xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 50
        +1
        There is nothing here that you thought ... This is a sign that says "Abu Ishaq Street". Abu is Arabic for "father", in this case "father of Iskhak". In the Middle Ages, when there were no surnames, this designation was widely practiced. And Russian surnames occurred in a similar way. For example, Petrov - "son of Petrov" (they say, Peter's son). A donkey in the Turkic languages ​​"eshek"
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Basileus
          Basileus 23 December 2013 11: 39
          +3
          Someone has esheks, and some have ishk, some have Yesek, and Tuvans have generally Elchigen. So it’s not necessary for everyone, only for yourself)
          1. Yeraz
            Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 51
            0
            Quote: Basileus
            Someone has esheks, and some have ishk, some have Yesek, and Tuvans have generally Elchigen. So it’s not necessary for everyone, only for yourself)

            Reading the first 3 words, you feel such a huge difference between them, just never in your life to guess what remotely looks like)))))
            And Tuvans, let's not classify the endangered species of Turks here)))
            1. Basileus
              Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 12
              +1
              A donkey in the Turkic languages ​​"eshek"

              It does not say "something similar", etc. It is said that everyone is the same. I just gave an example that the author is wrong and wishful thinking.
            2. RUSS
              RUSS 23 December 2013 12: 15
              +3
              Yeraz
              About the disappearing Buddhist people, Tuvans, more accurately, do not offend Shoigu now in our favor. laughing
              1. Yeraz
                Yeraz 23 December 2013 12: 26
                +6
                Quote: RUSS
                Yeraz
                About the disappearing Buddhist people, Tuvans, more accurately, do not offend Shoigu now in our favor. laughing

                I think he will not be offended)))) most likely he considers himself Russian)))
              2. alone
                alone 23 December 2013 20: 16
                +3
                laughing so, only Shoigu knows better, but about the rest when I don’t hear a word
      4. The comment was deleted.
  • xetai9977
    xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 21
    0
    [quote = ed65b] Azerbaijan is friends with the Turks exclusively because of Karabakh.
    What are you .. Turks and Azerbaijanis are practically one nation, the identity of the words is 80%. One culture, religion, traditions ... They practically saved us in 1918 from the Bolshevik-Dashnak terror. There is no word, each state has its own interests, but we will never be at enmity with each other. I believe that after Erdogan a more pro-Turkic mood will come politician and our relationship will be further strengthened
    1. Basileus
      Basileus 23 December 2013 10: 45
      +1
      Sunnis and Shiites. One nation, yes.
      1. xetai9977
        xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 52
        +2
        Not quite. 25% of Azerbaijanis are Sunnis. But I assure you, we do not attach any importance to this
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. alone
        alone 23 December 2013 20: 18
        +3
        Tatars. There are Muslims and also kreshennye. Not one nation? And where does the nation and religious movements? fool
        1. Basileus
          Basileus 24 December 2013 08: 00
          +2
          Culturally - completely different. You know, the Serbs with the Croats speak the same language, but live in different countries, and cut each other very well.
    2. denis6799
      denis6799 23 December 2013 10: 50
      +10
      Turkey is a robbery country. K Marx


      "Everything in the Republic of Azerbaijan is artificial, unnatural - starting with the name, which was borrowed from one of the Persian provinces; artificial territory; artificial power that pursues the policy of pan-Turkism and pan-Islamism, being its outpost in the Caucasus; artificial statehood."

      General Anton Denikin on the establishment of the Azerbaijan Democratic Republic (ADR) in 1918
      1. xetai9977
        xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 57
        -5
        If Denikin is the ultimate truth for you, then for us he is a scoundrel and a criminal. And the words of a scoundrel and a criminal have no special price.
        1. Basileus
          Basileus 23 December 2013 11: 03
          +2
          Well, the word scoundrel against the word of the separatist, yes)
        2. garlik
          garlik 23 December 2013 11: 16
          +8
          The Turks destroyed an entire civilization. What can justify this? They tried to destroy one more strength. The Turks have always been disgusting towards the prisoners. They did not let the problem with the "sick man of Europe" Nicholas 1 be resolved. Our shuttles in the 90s raised their economy. Now the appetite is growing you see
          1. Basileus
            Basileus 23 December 2013 11: 40
            0
            What civilization did they destroy?
            1. Yeraz
              Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 53
              +1
              Quote: Basileus
              What civilization did they destroy?

              And I’m more interested in which second civilization they tried to destroy and it didn’t work)))
              1. garlik
                garlik 23 December 2013 11: 55
                +5
                The first is the Byzantine Empire. The second is Chrestian Europe. fool
                1. Basileus
                  Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 15
                  +2
                  Byzantine Empire? Or is it civilization? The empire finished itself off, and "civilization", if we consider Orthodoxy and the vision of the Eurasian, even Hellenistic, empire as its basis, to some extent still exists.
                  1. garlik
                    garlik 23 December 2013 12: 21
                    +3
                    It was an original CIVILIZATION distinct from the Roman Empire. The Russian third Rome is a receiver, but civilization is different. Themselves finished off by storming Constantinople?
                    1. Basileus
                      Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 25
                      0
                      And how does this contradict my words?
                      1. garlik
                        garlik 23 December 2013 12: 28
                        +1
                        but there are no Romans. Is it not true? or is there?
                      2. Basileus
                        Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 31
                        0
                        The Turks had a hand in this, yes. But the Romans destroyed themselves.
                      3. garlik
                        garlik 23 December 2013 12: 45
                        +4
                        Well, you kind of basileus are you writing crap. SAMI? how yourself? Storming Constantinople themselves?
                      4. Basileus
                        Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 50
                        +1
                        Do you know what borders Imperium Romanum was in 1453? How did the Turks get to Anatolia? It’s like blaming the barbarians for the missile defense of ZRI, forgetting who invited them there, and what internal problems have eroded its foundations for centuries.
                      5. garlik
                        garlik 23 December 2013 12: 55
                        +4
                        Of course, but the fact remains that there are no Romans and the Turks finished them off. They would have killed Armenians, Greeks if they could.
                      6. Basileus
                        Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 58
                        +2
                        Well, the Slavs would finish them off, what would it change? Sooner or later, someone had to do it. Just the Turks were at the right time in the right place.
  • RUSS
    RUSS 23 December 2013 12: 09
    +2
    Quote: Basileus
    What civilization did they destroy?


    The forum member garlik, probably believes that they destroyed the Byzantine Empire.
  • smersh70
    smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 27
    +1
    Quote: garlik
    The Turks destroyed an entire civilization. What can justify it?

    like what))))) civilization named Maidan laughing even they made their contribution to the Vashchu piggy bank of history)) after all, with their words is called YOUR main square)))
    Quote: garlik
    Our shuttles in the 90s raised their economy.

    it means zhkonomika did something))))))) they wouldn’t buy it)) but they would buy their own, Ukrainian) 0 who interfered with YOU)))))
  • andrey682006
    andrey682006 23 December 2013 11: 18
    +5
    If Denikin is the ultimate truth for you, then for us he is a scoundrel and a criminal. And the words of a scoundrel and a criminal have no special price.

    In vain you hit in emotions ...
    The massacre of 2 million Armenians also did not add humanity and did not make the Turks holy, Denikin, in comparison with them, is a humanist.
    And by the way, a clever man. You did not argue with his arguments. They were simply offended by what he called the ADR a puppet of the Turks.
    1. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 55
      -2
      Quote: andrey682006
      If Denikin is the ultimate truth for you, then for us he is a scoundrel and a criminal. And the words of a scoundrel and a criminal have no special price.

      In vain you hit in emotions ...
      The massacre of 2 million Armenians also did not add humanity and did not make the Turks holy, Denikin, in comparison with them, is a humanist.
      And by the way, a clever man. You did not argue with his arguments. They were simply offended by what he called the ADR a puppet of the Turks.

      Haha is already 2 million))) If Yarbai comes now, then your statement will fly to pieces.
      So many times this topic was procrastinated and no one could even give a decent counter argument))
      1. smersh70
        smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 29
        0
        Quote: Yeraz
        If Yarbai comes now

        and if Hasharat comes, he’ll bomb wassat
        1. Rusich51
          Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 43
          0
          Quote: smersh70
          Quote: Yeraz
          If Yarbai comes now

          and if Hasharat comes, he’ll bomb wassat

          Oh no. A week ago he was so sick of one topic. Do not let him write better in PM.
      2. andrey682006
        andrey682006 23 December 2013 13: 40
        +3
        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%93%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%86%D0%B8%D0%B4_%D0%B0%D
        1%80%D0%BC%D1%8F%D0%BD
        Estimates are different, but usually more than one million.
        Yarbai - who is that?
        Scientist historian?
        Why do you need more arguments? You have not yet answered Denikin's arguments.
        "Everything in the Republic of Azerbaijan is artificial, unnatural - starting with the name, which was borrowed from one of the Persian provinces; artificial territory; artificial power that pursues the policy of pan-Turkism and pan-Islamism, being its outpost in the Caucasus; artificial statehood."

        General Anton Denikin on the establishment of the Azerbaijan Democratic Republic (ADR) in 1918
        1. Yeraz
          Yeraz 23 December 2013 14: 14
          0
          Quote: andrey682006
          http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%93%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%86%D0%B8%D0%B4_%D0%B0%D

          1%80%D0%BC%D1%8F%D0%BD
          Estimates are different, but usually more than one million.
          Yarbai - who is that?
          Scientist historian?
          Why do you need more arguments? You have not yet answered Denikin's arguments.
          "Everything in the Republic of Azerbaijan is artificial, unnatural - starting with the name, which was borrowed from one of the Persian provinces; artificial territory; artificial power that pursues the policy of pan-Turkism and pan-Islamism, being its outpost in the Caucasus; artificial statehood."

          General Anton Denikin on the establishment of the Azerbaijan Democratic Republic (ADR) in 1918

          Quote: andrey682006
          http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%93%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BE%D1%86%D0%B8%D0%B4_%D0%B0%D

          1%80%D0%BC%D1%8F%D0%BD
          Estimates are different, but usually more than one million.
          Yarbai - who is that?
          Scientist historian?
          Why do you need more arguments? You have not yet answered Denikin's arguments.
          "Everything in the Republic of Azerbaijan is artificial, unnatural - starting with the name, which was borrowed from one of the Persian provinces; artificial territory; artificial power that pursues the policy of pan-Turkism and pan-Islamism, being its outpost in the Caucasus; artificial statehood."

          General Anton Denikin on the establishment of the Azerbaijan Democratic Republic (ADR) in 1918

          Yarbay is an old-timer on this site, though rarely right now.
          Here he laid out official documents of different countries about the number of Armenians in the Ottoman Empire and about the victims and stupidly checking them, you can easily cross out your statement about 2 million and about one and a half million.
          And if you read all his comments, you will also find out where the gorges of betrayal are coming from.
          And wiki, well, wiki is funny.
          And Yarbai indicates the sources and therefore, your choice is to trust or not.
          1. xetai9977
            xetai9977 23 December 2013 15: 54
            0
            In the 20s, they wrote about 300 Armenians killed, in the 000s it reached 30 in a strange way, and in the 600s it grew 000 times. We can already see that it reaches as much as 60 million. Are they growing on yeast? As for Denikin, then General A.A. Shikhlinsky, chief of artillery during the Port Arthur epic, and who knew him personally, rated his military abilities low.
            1. andrey682006
              andrey682006 23 December 2013 16: 10
              +4
              I don’t want to write about the number of killed Armenians - but the increase in the death toll is proved by facts. Maybe not 2 million, as the Armenians write, but not 300.

              With the opinion of Shikhlinsky about the military capabilities of Denikin is not familiar. Opinion about Denikin as a patriot and politician is rather high (IMHO).
              To prove the fallacy of his thoughts, one must explain why they are wrong.
              Instead, you are trying to belittle his personality.
              This is wrong.
              1. xetai9977
                xetai9977 23 December 2013 16: 32
                +1
                To begin with, the name "Azerbaijan" has appeared since the times of the Arabs in the 9th century. And after the arrival of the Seljugs in the 11th century, these Persians were under the Turks until the end of the 18th century. There were the states of Atabey, Garagoyunlu and Akkoyunlu, and then the powerful purely Turkic Safavid empire. From what hangover an ordinary tsar general became a great historian and gave clarifications to the names of the provinces and I did not understand the countries. And in 1918, the nation and the country naturally reached out with their half-brothers, what is so strange about this, taking into account the Bolshevik-Dashnak terror?
                1. andrey682006
                  andrey682006 23 December 2013 16: 50
                  +4
                  If the ADR "reached out to its half-brothers" - why didn't it become part of Turkey?
                  After all, it would be natural?
                2. xetai9977
                  xetai9977 23 December 2013 17: 01
                  +2
                  Firstly, the situation was not the same. And secondly, why should we be part of anyone.? We are brothers, yes, but Azerbaijan is Azerbaijan, and Turkey is Turkey ..
                3. RUSS
                  RUSS 23 December 2013 17: 24
                  +3
                  Quote: xetai9977
                  Firstly, the situation was not the same. And secondly, why should we be part of anyone.? We are brothers, yes, but Azerbaijan is Azerbaijan, and Turkey is Turkey ..


                  "Friendship is friendship, and tobacco apart"
                4. andrey682006
                  andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 25
                  +2
                  And what then is the Pan-Turkic project?
                  If everyone is for himself?
                5. xetai9977
                  xetai9977 23 December 2013 18: 54
                  +2
                  In order to work more closely, is it necessary to merge into a single state? It seems France remained France, and Spain Spain
                6. andrey682006
                  andrey682006 24 December 2013 15: 14
                  0
                  If cooperation is the main thing, then Turkey’s main partners in the Pan-Turkic project are China, Germany, and maybe also the USA. Yes, and Russia bypasses Azerbaijan in terms of trade with Turkey.
            2. Rusich51
              Rusich51 23 December 2013 20: 05
              +2
              Quote: xetai9977
              Firstly, the situation was not the same. And secondly, why should we be part of anyone.? We are brothers, yes, but Azerbaijan is Azerbaijan, and Turkey is Turkey ..

              So I am about the same thing - an ethnos is not a nation. There are Azerbaijanis in Iran too.
            3. xetai9977
              xetai9977 24 December 2013 10: 01
              +1
              "Azerbaijanis" are not a nation. The inhabitants of South Azerbaijan also call themselves Turks ..
            4. The comment was deleted.
  • Rusich51
    Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 47
    +1
    Yeraz
    Yarbey - Alibek. Specialist retired. Heavy artillery laughing
  • alone
    alone 23 December 2013 20: 20
    +4
    Quote: andrey682006
    The massacre of 2 million Armenians also did not add humanity and did not make the Turks holy,


    how can you kill so many people if they were not even there a million and a half?
    1. andrey682006
      andrey682006 24 December 2013 08: 37
      +1
      Who said there were less than 1,5 million?
      You?
  • Christian
    Christian 23 December 2013 17: 36
    +2
    For you, this is for the enemies of Russia !? I don’t understand how open enemies of Russia and the Russian people can participate in our discussion !? They are not even disguised! Remove them from the site !!!
    1. Arminian power
      Arminian power 23 December 2013 18: 33
      0
      Quote: Christian
      I don’t understand how open enemies of Russia and the Russian people can participate in our discussion !? They are not even disguised! Remove them from the site !!!
      hi good
    2. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 14
      0
      Quote: Christian
      I don’t understand how open enemies of Russia and the Russian people can participate in our discussion !?

      the whole week you don’t answer my question - why don’t you smoke right now wassat you do not want or it ended ..... bully
      1. Arminian power
        Arminian power 23 December 2013 22: 33
        -1
        I communicate with adequate people. you are zombie ottoman agitation with you to lead a discussion is useless.
    3. The comment was deleted.
  • wk-083
    wk-083 23 December 2013 22: 55
    0
    Quote: xetai9977
    If Denikin is the ultimate truth for you, then for us he is a scoundrel and a criminal. And the words of a scoundrel and a criminal have no special price.

    For me, Denikin is a patriot, eternal memory to him! And I personally would ask you to keep your opinion to yourself.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • smersh70
    smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 24
    0
    Quote: denis6799
    General Anton Denikin

    well, what else the historians of our neighbors have not quoted wassat otherwise we descended from the moon ... bully
  • Arminian power
    Arminian power 23 December 2013 18: 27
    +1
    Quote: denis6799
    which pursues a policy of pan-Turkism and pan-Islamism, being its outpost in the Caucasus;
    hi
  • The comment was deleted.
  • ed65b
    ed65b 23 December 2013 10: 50
    +4
    Quote: xetai9977

    What are you .. Turks and Azerbaijanis are practically one nation, the identity of the words is 80%. One culture, religion, traditions ... They practically saved us in 1918 from the Bolshevik-Dashnak terror. There is no word, each state has its own interests, but we will never be at enmity with each other. I believe that after Erdogan a more pro-Turkic mood will come politician and our relationship will be further strengthened

    Nobody argues that "while" you will not be at enmity. But everything flows, everything changes. Aliyev has his own vision of the process, while Erdogan has his own. And the restoration of the Ottoman Empire is not a halai balalay, it implies the return of territories.
  • garlik
    garlik 23 December 2013 11: 10
    +5
    And who saved you from the Persians?
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 30
      +1
      Quote: garlik
      And who saved you from the Persians?

      YOU is someone))))) and in general, it seems time to turn off gas and oil to Ukraine bully
      1. garlik
        garlik 23 December 2013 13: 34
        +6
        And what about the Azerbaijani trolls? Well, read the story buddy
        1. alone
          alone 23 December 2013 20: 24
          +3
          How can we save us from the Persians, if until 1925 Persia was ruled by the Turkic dynasty of the Shahs? Do you even know this?
      2. Yeraz
        Yeraz 23 December 2013 14: 17
        0
        Quote: smersh70
        Quote: garlik
        And who saved you from the Persians?

        YOU is someone))))) and in general, it seems time to turn off gas and oil to Ukraine bully

        Why brother answered his stupid question, specially ignored)))
        And so, do not drag in Ukraine, do not forget the national composition of Ukraine, especially its eastern part and not every user under the Ukrainian flag has a Ukrainian, although I admit it)
        1. garlik
          garlik 23 December 2013 14: 44
          +7
          You are Azerbaijanis together with Georgians at the beginning of the 19 century. SPAS Paskevich (heard of this?) Defeating the Persians in several battles fool fool
          1. Geokingxnumx
            Geokingxnumx 23 December 2013 15: 19
            +1
            Quote: garlik
            You are Azerbaijanis together with Georgians at the beginning of the 19 century. SPAS Paskevich (heard of this?) Defeating the Persians in several battles

            I heard
            but where were 1795?
            http://www.georgianpress.ru/tbilisi-week/our-past/12627-krcanisskaya-bitva.html
            1. garlik
              garlik 23 December 2013 15: 23
              +1
              I did not understand the question
              1. Geokingxnumx
                Geokingxnumx 23 December 2013 15: 32
                +2
                Quote: garlik
                I did not understand the question

                you said that you saved the 19 century from the Persians) do not want to remember the 18 century? 1795 year? where was the Russian army, which should have been zashishit Georgia!
                just remembered now that they say so many times that we saved you and blah blah blah! and I don’t deny it, I confirm it)
                1. garlik
                  garlik 23 December 2013 15: 41
                  +5
                  Well, Russia took Georgia under its "wing" after numerous requests in 1800. So what are the claims? Let's say the Serbs are grateful for their help to this day, but your brothers thanked you in 2008 hi
                  1. Geokingxnumx
                    Geokingxnumx 23 December 2013 15: 49
                    +2
                    Quote: garlik
                    Well, Russia took Georgia under its "wing" after numerous requests in 1800.

                    1783 year of the Geogrevsky treatise)
                    1. garlik
                      garlik 23 December 2013 15: 58
                      +6
                      I now cannot understand the claims, When they could help when they could not help but help. Russia always had a lot of fronts and worries. And the priteniya sodu- "but you gave me 100 rubles on Tuesday, but on Monday I needed it more. What are you squeezed ". After all, if I'm not mistaken, 150 thousand remained after the Persian massacre?
                2. andrey682006
                  andrey682006 23 December 2013 15: 46
                  +3
                  Maybe Russia had problems with Napoleon?
                  Maybe at least occasionally you need to protect yourself?
                  Maybe before concluding an agreement with the empire, it is necessary to understand that empires have their own interests?
                  Maybe you need to understand that it is not the tail that spins the dog, but the dog that spins the tail?
                  1. Geokingxnumx
                    Geokingxnumx 23 December 2013 15: 59
                    0
                    Quote: andrey682006
                    Maybe Russia had problems with Napoleon?

                    What is Napoleon 1795 year?
                    Quote: andrey682006
                    Maybe before concluding an agreement with the empire, it is necessary to understand that empires have their own interests?

                    yes this is the Caucasus
                    Quote: andrey682006
                    Maybe at least occasionally you need to protect yourself?

                    Quote: andrey682006
                    Maybe you need to understand that it is not the tail that spins the dog, but the dog that spins the tail?

                    maybe it wasn’t necessary to sign the treatise then! Of particular importance were 4 secret articles of the contract. According to them, Russia pledged to defend Georgia in the event of war, and in conducting peace negotiations, insist on the return to the Kartli-Kakheti kingdom of possessions that had long belonged to him (but were rejected by Turkey). Russia pledged to keep two infantry battalions in Georgia and in case of war to increase the number of its troops.
                    1. garlik
                      garlik 23 December 2013 16: 18
                      +1
                      But I wonder all the same about the 2008 dear?
                    2. Geokingxnumx
                      Geokingxnumx 23 December 2013 16: 39
                      +2
                      Quote: garlik
                      But I wonder all the same about the 2008 dear?

                      and what are interesting to you respected?
                    3. garlik
                      garlik 23 December 2013 17: 17
                      +1
                      Is it like a friendly act and thanks for everything?
                3. andrey682006
                  andrey682006 23 December 2013 16: 28
                  +4
                  Not Napoleon, but the French Revolution.
                  Is the Caucasus the only interest of Russia? Are you laughing Maybe the Georgians wanted it so much?
                  There are two versions of the failure to comply with the conditions of the treatise:
                  1. Violation of the terms of the contract by the Georgians (separate agreement with the Turks).
                  2. The disadvantage of the contract for Russia.
                  A. V. Potto writes about the same:
                  The two battalions left in Georgia could not bring substantial benefit in the event of a new invasion of the enemy, but only they themselves could easily fall victim to it. And since there was absolutely nothing to strengthen them, Colonel Burnashev was ordered to leave Tiflis and return to the Line. At the same time, all the fortifications arranged by Potemkin on the road to Georgia were destroyed. Russia's first attempt to establish itself firmly in Georgia ended in failure, therefore.


                  In April 1796, the Caspian corps in 13000 bayonets drove the Ottomans from the Caucasus.
                  )
                4. Geokingxnumx
                  Geokingxnumx 23 December 2013 16: 37
                  +1
                  Quote: andrey682006
                  Not Napoleon, but the French Revolution.

                  it's different
                  Quote: andrey682006
                  Is the Caucasus the only interest of Russia?

                  no) but it turned out to be very important)
                  Quote: andrey682006
                  . Violation of the terms of the contract by the Georgians (separate agreement with the Turks).

                  there was no one) Irakli would not have allowed)
                  Quote: andrey682006
                  2. The disadvantage of the contract for Russia.

                  Well, how many people were in the battalion
                  Quote: andrey682006
                  In April 1796, the Caspian corps in 13000 bayonets drove the Ottomans from the Caucasus.

                  ) after almost 6 months! when civilians were destroyed and Tbilisi too
                5. andrey682006
                  andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 33
                  +1
                  it's different - -What did you mean? About the French revolution? Was it different?
                  Was the Caucasus very important on the eve of 1812? laughing
                  there was no one) Irakli would not have allowed) Should I believe? what
                  Well, how many people were in the battalion I have no idea. And I do not understand how this could affect the outcome.
                  Yes, I agree, the Russians are late. Winning is not always possible everywhere.
                  What did you want to say?
  • xetai9977
    xetai9977 23 December 2013 15: 57
    -2
    Did Paskevich save us? From ourselves? The fact that he divided Azerbaijan into two?
    1. garlik
      garlik 23 December 2013 16: 13
      +6
      Spas simply from physical DESTRUCTION hi
      1. xetai9977
        xetai9977 23 December 2013 16: 37
        -3
        Saved from whom? So Aga Muhammad Shah Gadzhar himself was a Turk. The usual showdown took place. And then the Russians took advantage of the situation and seized half the country ..
        1. garlik
          garlik 23 December 2013 16: 44
          +2
          Hear the old Hottabych, there’s no need to speak further bully
          1. xetai9977
            xetai9977 23 December 2013 17: 03
            -2
            With YOU everything is clear!
            1. garlik
              garlik 23 December 2013 17: 47
              +5
              Pour from empty to empty. Tell me who ever helped Azerbaijan? How is he generally famous? Maybe an evil war immediately after independence for the Karabakh? Your representatives everywhere behave impudently, preposterously. What are you old Hattabych here you want to prove?
            2. xetai9977
              xetai9977 23 December 2013 18: 58
              0
              YOU, GARLIC, I won’t say anything. He who has eyes will read and understand.
            3. garlik
              garlik 23 December 2013 19: 03
              0
              Ah, what eastern wisdom. Ah well done!
            4. smersh70
              smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 21
              +3
              Quote: xetai9977
              Fuck, Garlic, I won’t say anything.

              ... I think I feel my dearest friend, Stoic bully he probably moved to Ukraine and scribbles from there ... winked
            5. KuzmichDP
              KuzmichDP 28 December 2013 20: 39
              0
              He just decided to breathe the fresh air of the Black Sea wassat
        2. Yeraz
          Yeraz 23 December 2013 19: 26
          +2
          Quote: garlik
          Pour from empty to empty. Tell me who ever helped Azerbaijan? How is he generally famous? Maybe an evil war immediately after independence for the Karabakh? Your representatives everywhere behave impudently, preposterously. What are you old Hattabych here you want to prove?

          Even so, to whom when is it? In modern Azerbaijan they have sheltered having their contingent of refugees, refugees from Chechnya and Meskhetian Turks,
          They helped Georgia, when Russia abruptly cut off gas supplies in the winter of Georgia, I had to cut consumption in my country 2 times and send it to Georgia, of course, with the help that Russia provided to Georgia on 08.08.08 it does not compare, but even so)
          Well, plus the charitable help of the Heydar Aliyev Foundation in Russia and in other countries.
          Oh yes, Old Man was given a large loan right away, when you pressed it against the wall, the young man returned it right away, and he did it.
        3. garlik
          garlik 23 December 2013 20: 36
          +2
          from all this I can conclude that the Russians in their history did not need to help anyone, they only needed to think about themselves. Then, truthfully, they would no longer be Russian. But at least the issue would be resolved once and for all: by the Bulgarians, Romanians, Azerbaijanis, Georgians, etc.
        4. cherkas.oe
          cherkas.oe 24 December 2013 00: 52
          0
          Quote: Yeraz
          They helped Georgia, when Russia abruptly cut off gas supplies in the winter of Georgia, I had to cut consumption in my country 2 times and send it to Georgia, of course, with the help that Russia provided to Georgia on 08.08.08 it does not compare, but even so)

          Well, then you have one owner, P-nd-osiya, and you helped Georgia by the fact that the owner bent you, at the same time they cut down the dough, it does not smell. And be friends with the Turks against Russia too, only you need to understand that if Turkey suddenly raises its tail to Russia, and you find yourself in their company, then there will be no time for us to sort you out.
        5. xetai9977
          xetai9977 24 December 2013 10: 10
          +1
          You can’t say anything except sarcasm and an exaggerated opinion about the role of Russia in the world. With the same success, we can say that Russia also has the masters of world freemasonry and the same capitalists from Wall Street. And it's more like the truth than your fantasies
        6. The comment was deleted.
  • KuzmichDP
    KuzmichDP 28 December 2013 20: 37
    0
    Quote: xetai9977
    With YOU everything is clear!

    I fully support you.good
  • smersh70
    smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 18
    -1
    Quote: garlik
    at the beginning of the 19th century SPAS Paskevich

    it would be better if he saved you .... laughing wassat he didn’t save anyone from anyone ... EMERCOM of the 19th century)))) he was a tsarist general and annexed new lands for his empire, more precisely the empire that he served ... that's all .... and all these stories about salvation, tell somewhere else. Well, for example, in the center of Maidan fellow .
    1. garlik
      garlik 23 December 2013 21: 22
      0
      TROLL appeared. I will tell the dudes further. It will not rust behind me. But we will save and cure you soldier
  • Rusich51
    Rusich51 23 December 2013 20: 08
    +3
    Quote: Yeraz
    Why brother answered his stupid question, specially ignored)))
    And so, do not drag in Ukraine, do not forget the national composition of Ukraine, especially its eastern part and not every user under the Ukrainian flag has a Ukrainian, although I admit it)


    In Little Russia only in Lviv and Galicia, there are lords. wassat
  • makarov
    makarov 23 December 2013 14: 23
    +6
    Hello Vurgun!
    What is it you respected lost his mind? You understand that problems arise not between nations, but by specific people. Do you and I really understand each other poorly? Or maybe in the process of communication did not find a generally understood and respectful treatment?
    You leave Yanukovych without gas and oil, and his factories, but don’t bother me to heat the house, otherwise I’ll go to the wood for her God and open an office for exporting lard to Turkey, and there’s a lot .. smile
    1. alone
      alone 23 December 2013 20: 28
      +1
      Quote: makarov
      Hello Vurgun!
      What is it you respected lost his mind? You understand that problems arise not between nations, but by specific people. Do you and I really understand each other poorly? Or maybe in the process of communication did not find a generally understood and respectful treatment?
      You leave Yanukovych without gas and oil, and his factories, but don’t bother me to heat the house, otherwise I’ll go to the wood for her God and open an office for exporting lard to Turkey, and there’s a lot ..


      laughing Do not worry Makarov, the heating will work for you, but Garlik will have to turn off the gas individually so that he does not argue about what he does not know))
    2. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 24
      +1
      Quote: makarov
      Hello Vurgun!
      What is it you respected lost his mind? You understand that problems arise not between nations, but by specific people.

      Priva! Yes, of course)) just this comrade writes all sorts of things)) here and sarcastically about)))) .. we will never leave YOU without oil and gas))) really send at least a piece of the real Ukrainians.sala)))))
  • Nagaibak
    Nagaibak 23 December 2013 20: 21
    +1
    Why did you betray them? Not much, then you resisted the Bolsheviks. And they could stand up as a wall. The Greeks then drove off the Greeks, but why are you? Not met the expectations of the Turks. There were almost no fights.
    1. alone
      alone 23 December 2013 21: 04
      +3
      Quote: Nagaibak
      Why did you betray them? Not much, then you resisted the Bolsheviks. And they could stand up as a wall. The Greeks then drove off the Greeks, but why are you? Not met the expectations of the Turks. There were almost no fights.

      who betrayed whom? and where did you get the idea that there were no fights? The Azerbaijani government was overthrown as a result of a coup by local communists, and the communists called for help to the 11th Red Army.
      read about the Uprising in Ganja in 1920. there were still very bloody battles with the 11th Red Army.

      http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%93%D1%8F%D0%BD%D0%B4%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%BD%D1%81%D0

      %BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%BC%D1%8F%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%B6_(1920)
      1. Nagaibak
        Nagaibak 24 December 2013 18: 21
        0
        lonely "read about the Uprising in Ganja in 1920. There were very bloody battles with the 11th Red Army."
        So there, something similar to the battles of Perekop or Warsaw? Where did you see the battles there. Then the Turks and the Turks and their own Musavatists got the Azerbaijanis. So they really did not resist. And the government of the Musavatists was captured and surrendered to the communists by their ally, a Turkish officer with his askers. Here is such a brotherhood hehe ...
  • Standard Oil
    Standard Oil 23 December 2013 10: 27
    +5
    I don’t want to offend the Ottomans, reading, for example, about the events of 1453, I was happy for the Turks who destroyed the two-faced scum in the face of the agonizing “Second Rome” or Byzantium (I never understood what the Russian people could find in this two-faced, venal, like Russian liberals, insidious irrational education), but something happened to them after Suleiman the Magnificent, and almost all wars of the 18th, and even more so of the 19th century, Turkey was kicked by all and sundry, no need to talk about the war with Russia, in the First World generally kept exclusively on "Yavuz Sultan Selim" and "Midilli" and on German military advisers, where there were no "floating" Germans and "land" Germans, the Turks successfully received lyuly whether it was the Russian army or the Bedouins with Lawrence of Arabia, in the Second World they had enough wits do not interfere. And now it turns out the USSR is not present, the ambition has appeared? "
  • xetai9977
    xetai9977 23 December 2013 10: 36
    0
    Well, everyone received luli, depending on the situation and the balance of power. Won Peter the Great also received them under Azov, and do not forget the Crimean War. And to confuse today's Turkey with Ottoman is oh how short-sighted ...
    1. sergey72
      sergey72 23 December 2013 10: 42
      +10
      Quote: xetai9977
      Crimean war do not forget

      Oh how! And that Turkey alone coped with Russia? By the way, and from what place to start remembering: from Sevastopol or from Sinop?
    2. Basileus
      Basileus 23 December 2013 10: 46
      +3
      The British won the Crimean with the French, if that)
      1. garlik
        garlik 23 December 2013 11: 18
        +6
        No, Russia lost it by misunderstanding fool
    3. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 11
      +6
      Quote: xetai9977
      Well, everyone received luli, depending on the situation and the balance of power. Won Peter the Great also received them under Azov, and do not forget the Crimean War. And to confuse today's Turkey with Ottoman is oh how short-sighted ...

      Speaking right.
      And the Ottomans at the end degraded, because they stopped developing, complete degradation.
      All empires that were at their prime, always had at that time the most modern weapons and a strong economy. This has always been the case.
      And in the First World War, more than half of the Ottomans fell stupidly from freezing, without even entering into battle.
      1. sergey72
        sergey72 23 December 2013 11: 33
        +2
        Quote: Yeraz
        to the Ottomans died stupidly from freezing, not even joining the battle

        Not only from this, but from the total theft of the quartermaster ... I know, I know ours have sinned with this, too, but not to the same extent ... hi
  • bistrov.
    bistrov. 23 December 2013 10: 48
    +4
    Turkey will not be able to do anything in modern conditions. Unless, something is worthless.
  • andrey682006
    andrey682006 23 December 2013 10: 54
    +1
    Quote: Heccrbq.3
    One fact, as they say there are 15 million migrants in Russia, every 10th in relation to our population, BUT there are more of them and if we take only Russian men 18-40 (men with big bellied beer belly, with smoked lungs and a planted liver, and even all are disconnected, I say with mockery t to me 37 I don’t smoke, I drink every five years and any chur .. I’ll twist the ram’s horn, and not just one), then in case of a serious mess we will lose too.

    Have a conscience.
    As they say - it's not a fact, it's gossip. Put them up as an argument and add that "there are more of them" - trolling or stupidity. What do you prefer?
    Stomachs, lungs, liver, I do not drink, do not smoke, ram's horn, mess ...
    :) funny You, who will believe such a troll? Who do you work for?
  • ed65b
    ed65b 23 December 2013 10: 55
    0
    Exclusively by the will of the Anglo-Saxons and corrupt Europe, Turkey entered into wars with Russia. Great people were simply fooled and sold like in a bazaar. And still they are doing it with success, to which Syria is an example.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 23 December 2013 12: 18
      +3
      Quote: ed65b
      Exclusively by the will of the Anglo-Saxons and corrupt Europe, Turkey entered into wars with Russia. Great people were simply fooled and sold like in a bazaar. And still they are doing it with success, to which Syria is an example.

      these wars were by mutual agreement.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. UmaR
      UmaR 23 December 2013 16: 33
      +1
      ed65b

      Absolutely correct!!!
  • andrey682006
    andrey682006 23 December 2013 11: 09
    +1
    Quote: xetai9977
    Quote: ed65b
    Azerbaijan is friends with Turks exclusively because of Karabakh

    What are you .. Turks and Azerbaijanis are practically one nation, the identity of the words is 80%. One culture, religion, traditions ... They practically saved us in 1918 from the Bolshevik-Dashnak terror. There is no word, each state has its own interests, but we will never be at enmity with each other. I believe that after Erdogan a more pro-Turkic mood will come politician and our relationship will be further strengthened

    Iran not related to Azerbaijan, its culture, identity? Russia too?
    In Azerbaijan, the identity of the Persians and Russians fits into the remaining 20%?
    It seems to me that you are greatly exaggerating. Historically, the Persians and Ottomans, and then the Russians exerted their influence on Azerbaijan. And not only them.
    And you write about 80% of Turkish identity ... :)
    How much do you leave for actually Azerbaijan?
    1. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 11: 33
      +2
      Quote: andrey682006
      Quote: xetai9977
      Quote: ed65b
      Azerbaijan is friends with Turks exclusively because of Karabakh

      What are you .. Turks and Azerbaijanis are practically one nation, the identity of the words is 80%. One culture, religion, traditions ... They practically saved us in 1918 from the Bolshevik-Dashnak terror. There is no word, each state has its own interests, but we will never be at enmity with each other. I believe that after Erdogan a more pro-Turkic mood will come politician and our relationship will be further strengthened

      Iran not related to Azerbaijan, its culture, identity? Russia too?
      In Azerbaijan, the identity of the Persians and Russians fits into the remaining 20%?
      It seems to me that you are greatly exaggerating. Historically, the Persians and Ottomans, and then the Russians exerted their influence on Azerbaijan. And not only them.
      And you write about 80% of Turkish identity ... :)
      How much do you leave for actually Azerbaijan?

      Do you even know how to read ???
      The identity of the words is 80% if it were not for the reform of the language carried out by Ataturk, it would be 90%.
      We are one people. Armenians call us dosihpors as Turks))
      Yes, some Persian themes are present. Well, the Baku identity was only with the Baku people, but this can be understood when you find yourself in the midst of a huge number of foreigners, and what about their state system and your repression.
      To better understand, an Azerbaijani who moved to Turkey after a short time will be fully integrated, and his children will already feel like a Turkish Turk. The difference in identity, exactly as much, is the difference between residents of Turkey from different regions.
      And living in Russia Azeri will remain Azeri. The same thing with the Turks, living in Azerbaijan.
  • Kyrgyz
    Kyrgyz 23 December 2013 11: 37
    +1
    Banal bravado for domestic consumption, the Turks began to invest a lot in the Balkans, so that the poor electorate had no questions why there and not here, we are restoring the empire. Turkey dependent on the US and the EU, it can not rock to the west
  • andrey682006
    andrey682006 23 December 2013 11: 46
    0
    Quote: Yeraz
    Quote: andrey682006
    Quote: xetai9977

    ..Turks and Azerbaijanis are practically one nation, the identity of words is 80% ...

    Iran not related to Azerbaijan, its culture, identity? Russia too?
    In Azerbaijan, the identity of the Persians and Russians fits into the remaining 20%?
    It seems to me that you are greatly exaggerating. Historically, the Persians and Ottomans, and then the Russians exerted their influence on Azerbaijan. And not only them.
    And you write about 80% of Turkish identity ... :)
    How much do you leave for actually Azerbaijan?

    Do you even know how to read ???
    The identity of the words is 80% if it were not for the reform of the language carried out by Ataturk, it would be 90%.
    We are one people. Armenians call us dosihpors as Turks))
    ...
    To better understand, an Azerbaijani who moved to Turkey after a short time will be fully integrated, and his children will already feel like a Turkish Turk. The difference in identity, exactly as much, is the difference between residents of Turkey from different regions.
    And living in Russia Azeri will remain Azeri. The same thing with the Turks, living in Azerbaijan.

    Yes, I read it inattentively, I admit. Vocabulary - can be 80% similar. Only linguists will answer exactly.
    The rest of the questions remain. You write in much the same way as Russians in relation to Ukrainians (those who consider themselves Russian). Moving to each other's countries and fast integration does not mean that countries will not pursue independent policies and have conflicts (like Russia and Ukraine).
    1. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 12: 44
      -1
      Quote: andrey682006
      Quote: Yeraz
      Quote: andrey682006
      Quote: xetai9977

      ..Turks and Azerbaijanis are practically one nation, the identity of words is 80% ...

      Iran not related to Azerbaijan, its culture, identity? Russia too?
      In Azerbaijan, the identity of the Persians and Russians fits into the remaining 20%?
      It seems to me that you are greatly exaggerating. Historically, the Persians and Ottomans, and then the Russians exerted their influence on Azerbaijan. And not only them.
      And you write about 80% of Turkish identity ... :)
      How much do you leave for actually Azerbaijan?

      Do you even know how to read ???
      The identity of the words is 80% if it were not for the reform of the language carried out by Ataturk, it would be 90%.
      We are one people. Armenians call us dosihpors as Turks))
      ...
      To better understand, an Azerbaijani who moved to Turkey after a short time will be fully integrated, and his children will already feel like a Turkish Turk. The difference in identity, exactly as much, is the difference between residents of Turkey from different regions.
      And living in Russia Azeri will remain Azeri. The same thing with the Turks, living in Azerbaijan.

      Yes, I read it inattentively, I admit. Vocabulary - can be 80% similar. Only linguists will answer exactly.
      The rest of the questions remain. You write in much the same way as Russians in relation to Ukrainians (those who consider themselves Russian). Moving to each other's countries and fast integration does not mean that countries will not pursue independent policies and have conflicts (like Russia and Ukraine).

      Nope, it’s completely different. Russia sees Ukraine as Russian and Ukrainians Russian. Languages ​​of Ukraine and Russia are different at times. When a Ukrainian speaks Russian, he does not understand him for the most part. Russians see that Ukrainians should speak Russian, be part of Russia.
      Ours is completely different.
      Regarding politics, they can do it, but we say that now, and not in 500 years. And the strategic vision is common about the union of the state-far. Yes, Azerbaijan is neutral, Turkey is stuck between Europe and the Arabs and does not know who to choose. But about that we brothers and allies are not in doubt and there are no attempts to drag each other somewhere through blackmail and threats.
      And there are no junior senior relations in the series at all, there are pieces of the same whole. And not like Great Russia and Great Russians and the breakaway parts, the incorrect Slavs of the Poles, and generally they are not really Slavs of Western Ukraine.
      1. andrey682006
        andrey682006 23 December 2013 14: 02
        +3
        Quote: Yeraz
        Nope, it’s completely different. Russia sees Ukraine as Russian and Ukrainians Russian. Languages ​​of Ukraine and Russia are different at times. When a Ukrainian speaks Russian, he does not understand him for the most part. Russians see that Ukrainians should speak Russian, be part of Russia.
        Ours is completely different.
        Regarding politics, they can do it, but we say that now, and not in 500 years. And the strategic vision is common about the union of the state-far. Yes, Azerbaijan is neutral, Turkey is stuck between Europe and the Arabs and does not know who to choose. But about that we brothers and allies are not in doubt and there are no attempts to drag each other somewhere through blackmail and threats.
        And there are no junior senior relations in the series at all, there are pieces of the same whole. And not like Great Russia and Great Russians and the breakaway parts, the incorrect Slavs of the Poles, and generally they are not really Slavs of Western Ukraine.

        Turks don't see Azerbaijanis as Turks? Yes, your views are a direct confirmation of this. You yourself write "one people".
        Russian and Ukrainian languages ​​are different, but not at times. If you are a philologist - if you please, facts, if not, do not write what you do not know.
        Ukraine is larger than Azerbaijan (well, the wrong scale and population) and the language in different areas differs more. Given the period of the Polish occupation, there is nothing unusual.
        You simply have smaller countries and populations.
        500 years old? Yes, in 50 years your "general vision" will change, it is already different. For example in Syria.
        "And there is no relationship from the junior senior series at all, there are pieces of one whole thing" - I would not know that this is about Turkey-Azerbaijan, I would have thought that this is Russian about Ukraine. :)
        Yes, listen to the nationalists about the Great Russians. You don’t know yet. :)
        1. Yeraz
          Yeraz 23 December 2013 14: 50
          -1
          Quote: andrey682006
          Quote: Yeraz
          Nope, it’s completely different. Russia sees Ukraine as Russian and Ukrainians Russian. Languages ​​of Ukraine and Russia are different at times. When a Ukrainian speaks Russian, he does not understand him for the most part. Russians see that Ukrainians should speak Russian, be part of Russia.
          Ours is completely different.
          Regarding politics, they can do it, but we say that now, and not in 500 years. And the strategic vision is common about the union of the state-far. Yes, Azerbaijan is neutral, Turkey is stuck between Europe and the Arabs and does not know who to choose. But about that we brothers and allies are not in doubt and there are no attempts to drag each other somewhere through blackmail and threats.
          And there are no junior senior relations in the series at all, there are pieces of the same whole. And not like Great Russia and Great Russians and the breakaway parts, the incorrect Slavs of the Poles, and generally they are not really Slavs of Western Ukraine.

          Turks don't see Azerbaijanis as Turks? Yes, your views are a direct confirmation of this. You yourself write "one people".
          Russian and Ukrainian languages ​​are different, but not at times. If you are a philologist - if you please, facts, if not, do not write what you do not know.
          Ukraine is larger than Azerbaijan (well, the wrong scale and population) and the language in different areas differs more. Given the period of the Polish occupation, there is nothing unusual.
          You simply have smaller countries and populations.
          500 years old? Yes, in 50 years your "general vision" will change, it is already different. For example in Syria.
          "And there is no relationship from the junior senior series at all, there are pieces of one whole thing" - I would not know that this is about Turkey-Azerbaijan, I would have thought that this is Russian about Ukraine. :)
          Yes, listen to the nationalists about the Great Russians. You don’t know yet. :)

          I explain in the Türkic language there is no separation of Türk and Turk !!!!! There is one word TURK !! Türk was invented by Russians !!!!
          Anatolian Turks are simply the only ones who gave the name of the people to Turkey. Turkey is from the word Turk, not Turk from the word Turkey. We called ourselves Turks before the advice of the Turks, and the Anatolian word is more Ottoman. Then Uncle Stalin banned. And the Turks took into circulation. We are all friend We call the friend Turks. We simply add the name of the place to the quality of the exact place of residence. Azeri-Turk, Kazakh-Turk, Uzbek-Turk, etc.

          Yes, what does a philologist have to do with it or not, can you watch a film in completely Ukrainian ??? Figos two. You won’t understand anything.

          And what does the size of the country and population and the Polish occupation have to do with it ???
          The Poles Slavs occupied the Slavs of the Ukrainians, and Persia and Russia in general, and the last 70 years under the Soviets were completely isolated from the Turks, but they continued to understand.
          There are 4 times more Russians than Ukrainians, 6 times more Turks than northern Azerbaijanis and 3 times bigger than Iranians, but we understand each other on both sides of the border, and you have one-sided things, which you tried to explain with a higher number of Russians.
          Therefore, I’m saying much closer than you and Ukraine. And what about at times, and other Slavs should not be discussed at all, looking stupidly, what kind of love for Russia is in Ukraine itself.
          1. Basileus
            Basileus 23 December 2013 14: 56
            +3
            I explain in the Türkic language there is no separation of Türk and Turk !!!!! There is one word TURK !! Türk was invented by Russians !!!!
            Anatolian Turks are simply the only ones who gave the name of the people to the country.

            I would say differently. The Ottomans usurped the name, that's all. Oh, yes, your examples sound as if the Russians did not call themselves Russians, but Russian Slavs, the British - the British-Germans.

            Yes, what does a philologist have to do with it or not, can you watch a film in completely Ukrainian ??? Figos two. You won’t understand anything.

            As if you understand the film in Yakut.

            70 years under the Soviets in complete isolation from the Turks, but still continued to understand.

            WOW. Over 70 years, definitely all languages ​​have changed, only Turkish and Azerbaijani have remained unchanged.
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 23 December 2013 15: 07
              +6
              Quote: Basileus

              As if you understand the film in Yakut.

              He will understand in Turkish.

              I understand in Nogai or Karakalpak language, I watched videos on YouTube. Identical languages. Sometimes I watch TNV, I don’t understand everything, but the essence is clear.
              1. Basileus
                Basileus 23 December 2013 15: 39
                +2
                Well, I understand the essence of Nazarbayev’s speeches. The same with Ukrainian films)
            2. Yeraz
              Yeraz 23 December 2013 17: 05
              +1
              Quote: Basileus
              I explain in the Türkic language there is no separation of Türk and Turk !!!!! There is one word TURK !! Türk was invented by Russians !!!!
              Anatolian Turks are simply the only ones who gave the name of the people to the country.

              I would say differently. The Ottomans usurped the name, that's all. Oh, yes, your examples sound as if the Russians did not call themselves Russians, but Russian Slavs, the British - the British-Germans.

              Yes, what does a philologist have to do with it or not, can you watch a film in completely Ukrainian ??? Figos two. You won’t understand anything.


              As if you understand the film in Yakut.

              70 years under the Soviets in complete isolation from the Turks, but still continued to understand.

              WOW. Over 70 years, definitely all languages ​​have changed, only Turkish and Azerbaijani have remained unchanged.



              And what does the Yakuts have to do with it ??? The argument began that my fellow countryman spoke our language with Turetsky by 80%, I said that Ukrainian is different from Russian at times, it started not at times. And I told him to try watching a movie in Ukrainian and the dispute will be over.
              So, what is your comment BOOM)) and please go ahead as an example, do not need to cite as an example the Yakuts, Khakas, mini-Turkic peoples, endangered species and numbers, among which there are 0.000000000000001 percent.

              About 70. And what does ALL languages ​​definitely have changed? B ??
              And the second thing you did wrong again, you didn’t say that Azeri and Turkish wrath have changed, I just pointed out the reform of the Kemal language, but even after accepting this reform and being isolated we are so close that we all understand each other.
          2. andrey682006
            andrey682006 23 December 2013 15: 39
            +3
            Yeraz (3)
            You moderate emotions.
            Turkic language group is a scientific term.
            "Azeri-Turk, Kazakh-Turk, Uzbek-Turk, etc." - Do you call each other that on the forums? Something in my life I do not observe such names.
            I already wrote to you about the fact that Russian and Ukrainian differ, but not much, I understand the film, but not all. Conversation, especially eastern Ukrainian dialects, I understand easily. Just as you do not understand literary Turkish, you will partially understand the film. But spoken language - yes, you will understand easily.
            If you do not know the word and concept of "language dialects" I cannot help you, you will have to do self-education. The larger the country and the larger the population, the more the dialects of the language differ in different parts of it. If Ukraine is larger than Azerbaijan, its population is larger - and dialects differ more. Eastern speech in Ukraine is very different from Western. And this happened precisely because of the Polish occupation. By the way, you write - "Can you watch the film in full Ukrainian ???" What is "completely Ukrainian"? So there is incomplete Ukrainian? That is, do you recognize the existence of two Ukrainian languages? Which of them will I not be able to watch the film?
            Based on the foregoing, I conclude that the Turkic peoples (even based on the opinions on this forum) are no closer to each other than the Russians and Ukrainians.
            Despite your desires to be a Turk more than the Turks themselves.
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 23 December 2013 16: 57
              +3
              Quote: andrey682006
              What is "completely Ukrainian"? So there is incomplete Ukrainian? That is, do you recognize the existence of two Ukrainian languages? Which of them will I not be able to watch the film?

              You yourself first learn to read, the film is completely in Ukrainian. This does not mean that there are two Ukrainian languages. It means that throughout the film the picture is in Ukrainian.
              I’ll tell you a secret, there are films where two or three languages ​​can be used laughing
              1. andrey682006
                andrey682006 23 December 2013 18: 27
                +1
                I can read, otherwise I would not read your words.
                You should read the text to which I replied.
                If a person cannot clearly express his thoughts - I have to decide for him what did he mean?
                The film can be in Ukrainian, Russian, Turkish. Without the word "completely".
                What does "completely in Ukrainian" mean?
                Maybe in Ukrainian half of the film?
                Or captions?
                Films come in several languages, but then either the audio tracks are selected with the desired language and the film goes only on it. Either the characters speak each in their own language without translation (maybe there is a translation in the credits).
            2. Yeraz
              Yeraz 23 December 2013 17: 25
              0
              Quote: andrey682006
              Yeraz (3)
              You moderate emotions.
              Turkic language group is a scientific term.
              "Azeri-Turk, Kazakh-Turk, Uzbek-Turk, etc." - Do you call each other that on the forums? Something in my life I do not observe such names.
              I already wrote to you about the fact that Russian and Ukrainian differ, but not much, I understand the film, but not all. Conversation, especially eastern Ukrainian dialects, I understand easily. Just as you do not understand literary Turkish, you will partially understand the film. But spoken language - yes, you will understand easily.
              If you do not know the word and concept of "language dialects" I cannot help you, you will have to do self-education. The larger the country and the larger the population, the more the dialects of the language differ in different parts of it. If Ukraine is larger than Azerbaijan, its population is larger - and dialects differ more. Eastern speech in Ukraine is very different from Western. And this happened precisely because of the Polish occupation. By the way, you write - "Can you watch the film in full Ukrainian ???" What is "completely Ukrainian"? So there is incomplete Ukrainian? That is, do you recognize the existence of two Ukrainian languages? Which of them will I not be able to watch the film?
              Based on the foregoing, I conclude that the Turkic peoples (even based on the opinions on this forum) are no closer to each other than the Russians and Ukrainians.
              Despite your desires to be a Turk more than the Turks themselves.

              Are you sick ??? There is no division in the Turkic languages, I tell you TURK XALQLARI is written, and then the enumeration goes on.
              What movie do you understand ?? The overwhelming majority of Russians will not understand, I grew up in Russia and live and forget for a moment that, in theory, I should also understand Ukrainian then, not a single Russian friend of mine speaks stupidly in Ukrainian.
              And it’s especially funny to understand the East Ukrainian dialect, and in the East Russians are the majority of the population.
              I also understand the east of Turkey by 100%, because the Kurds bypassed the reform of Kemal and they speak Turkish, which was before the reform.

              Completely Ukrainian, means that the entire film is in Ukrainian, without subtitles below in Russian.

              And now the climax of the destruction of your most stupid argument.
              You wrote I do not understand the Turkish film in part.
              I reveal a secret. ALL AZERBAIJAN WATCHES TURKISH CHANNELS DAILY !!! They are more popular than local ones. I’ll even say more the majority of Azerbaijanis who grew up and were born in Russia, as I also watch Turkish channels, or rather movies and TV shows on them. When the bath was not in Russian translated, I watched it via satellite in Turkish as a child.
              I lived here, I know Russian better than my native and it proves to me and hang up noodles how Ukrainian is close to Russian, how a Ukrainian perceives Russian and on the edge, it looks very funny.
              As for the Ukrainians, it’s more and blah blah. For at least 30 million, some of them live independently in Persian society (by the way, they also watch Turkish channels) We are more than Ukrainians, but we still understand each other well.
              So that your closeness does not stand close to our similarity and kinship.
              I thought you at least understood something, if you knew that you had even philistine knowledge to argue and prove, you didn’t start something, although your statement about 2 million murdered Armenians should already alert you.
              Come on Salam alaikum.
              1. andrey682006
                andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 42
                +1
                You are sick???
                ...........
                Come on Salam alaikum.


                Same to you.
          3. Rusich51
            Rusich51 23 December 2013 20: 55
            0
            Yeras again started up the tyagomotin. The Türkic ethnic group was not invented by the Russians. In my opinion, the Germans used this designation in the scientific literature. Common And the ethnic group is divided into nationalities - something like this.
      2. Berserk
        Berserk 23 December 2013 16: 58
        +5
        What nonsense? Where did you get what the Russians want: ". The Russians see that the Ukrainians must speak Russian, be part of Russia."
        Firstly, nice people, Ukraine is heterogeneous. And there really are a lot of Russians. The Ukrainian language (not to be confused with mova) is quite understandable to Russian people. But that newspeak, into which nemeryano Western words are crammed into, then yes, you won’t make it without a pint. Secondly - I’ll tell you more, some dialects of the Russian language, preserved in remote places, for example, the Vologda region, are less audible from the first time than the language of the center and east of Ukraine.
        I served in the same crew with guys from Ukraine, including the western one. There was no language barrier. On demobilization, he spoke a mixture of Russian Ukrainian, naval and abusive.
        So there is linguistic unity. It becomes especially clear when you consider from which provinces the Wild Field was inhabited at one time. Ukraine is South or Small Russia. If, for example, they were called by separation as Kievan Rus, and not Ukraine, I’m sure that there would be no problems now in Kiev.
        What can I say, even with the Poles linguistic unity is maintained. When you get used to their brzh and vshsts - everything becomes clear. And if you drink together, generally no communication problems.
        PeSe. "By the way, I don't drink, but it's a matter of principle" (c)
      3. cherkas.oe
        cherkas.oe 24 December 2013 10: 45
        0
        Quote: Yeraz
        .When a Ukrainian speaks Russian, he does not understand him for the most part. Russians see that Ukrainians should speak Russian, be part of Russia.

        You are a little wrong. Yes, Russian does not understand when a Western Ukrainian speaks (Gutsul, Magyar, etc.), and when a resident of central Ukraine, and even more so eastern, speaks no problems.
  • I think so
    I think so 23 December 2013 11: 58
    +1
    A holy place does not happen empty - Russia has left Turkey has come ... The trend will continue until ... until Turkey comes to the Caucasus, Crimea, and maybe further north. Continuing to destroy their country, the Russians, with inevitable evidence, encounter previously unimaginable threats and realities ...
  • Vadim-ragalevich
    Vadim-ragalevich 23 December 2013 12: 17
    +4
    The article is relevant. Turkey really seeks to expand its influence in accessible regions. In particular, the author, unfortunately, did not mention Crimea. Turkey actively uses all the levers of influence mentioned in the article in Crimea!
  • The comment was deleted.
  • gorgo
    gorgo 23 December 2013 12: 31
    -2
    What about taking and moving all the Turks back to Turkmenistan, where is their place? This will be historical justice. But then what? They came, conquered the developed territories, whom they killed, whom they converted to Islam ... It is ugly. No place for the Turks in Asia Minor. Their homeland is the Central Asian steppes and deserts. So let them go there for good health. And give the territory of present-day Turkey to the Greeks, this is their land.
    1. Basileus
      Basileus 23 December 2013 12: 39
      +3
      And let all the Slavs leave for Poland and the Czech Republic, and give the territory of present-day Russia to the Germans, Tatars, Ossetians - this is their land.

      Insanity grew stronger.
    2. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 33
      +2
      Quote: gorgo
      Their homeland is the Central Asian steppes and deserts.

      then please announce the entire list laughing and add some more Ukrainians)) they also came from Attila wassat because basically you are brunettes .... unlike the Slavs, who are mostly blondes ... hi
    3. xetai9977
      xetai9977 23 December 2013 16: 09
      0
      Why don't you try to "send them to the steppe" not sitting at your computer in slippers, but on the battlefield? or not enough strength?
  • Megatron
    Megatron 23 December 2013 12: 38
    +2
    Comrades, Azerbaijanis, but Turkey itself knows that you are so eager to lick her ass here?
    For whom are you even trying? ))))
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 13: 36
      0
      Quote: Megatron
      Comrades, Azerbaijanis, but Turkey itself knows that you are so eager to lick her ass here?

      Well, if you leave the backsides and everything else)))) to some other comrades who are not comrades to us at all))))))
      it was thanks to Turkey that Azerbaijan was recreated in 1918, and then Nakhchivan also remained thanks to Ataturk .... and in 1993, thanks to them, the Armenians supported by Grachov and Yeltsin did not capture Ganja .... hi
    2. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 13: 42
      +3
      Quote: Megatron
      Comrades, Azerbaijanis, but Turkey itself knows that you are so eager to lick her ass here?
      For whom are you even trying? ))))

      Quote: Megatron
      Comrades, Azerbaijanis, but Turkey itself knows that you are so eager to lick her ass here?
      For whom are you even trying? ))))

      Hmm, tell the truth is lick your ass?
      Or harnessing your brother is a lick ass?
      I know they don’t know, like the drum. Turkey and our land as well as the entire Turkic space and its inhabitants.
      We are also here, as you said, "licking the ass" to the Kazakhs and Caucasians, when misunderstandings, untrue infa, lies and insults are poured on them.
      So that the Ottomans are not exceptional in this regard, they are one of our brothers.

      Ara explained everything clearly ?? And then how many times have I heard this question from you.
    3. xetai9977
      xetai9977 23 December 2013 16: 12
      +1
      Those who are not familiar with ethics and make up for the lack of education with abuse and rudeness are engaged in licking asses and other crotches
    4. wk-083
      wk-083 23 December 2013 23: 46
      +1
      Quote: Megatron
      Comrades, Azerbaijanis, but Turkey itself knows that you are so eager to lick her ass here?
      For whom are you even trying? ))))

      Krasava !!! good
  • Beck
    Beck 23 December 2013 13: 09
    +8
    Yeah ?!

    The main hidden refrain of the article is that Turkey, here it is, will move its troops to the Balkans, create a neo-Yanichar corps, and eventually capture Vienna.

    Absurdity and Fornication. Fornication and Absurdity.

    All countries of the world, absolutely everything, strive to expand their influence in the regions, but in the current conditions not by military force, but by promoting their economic and cultural interests. And this is natural, the universe is so arranged. And strong countries strive to advance their interests on a global scale - Russia, England, the USA, Japan, China, etc. And this is also natural.

    If Russia creates a Customs Union, is looking for rapprochement with the Slavic countries - Ukraine, Belarus, is following its interests in Central Asia, then this is normal. If Turkey does exactly the same in the Balkans, then this is the Guard, this is the trouble, after which it’s not worth living, it’s easier to hang yourself. What is stopping Russia from promoting its economic and cultural interests in the Balkans? Nothing. Compete. And the Balkans will choose.

    Pan-Turkism The philistine understanding that pan-Turkism is a single state crowns with itself the last stage of insanity. Then only death follows. Pan-Turkism in the modern sense is one ancestral home, common origin, related languages, and on the basis of this, primarily cultural interaction, and then economic.

    Briefly chronology.

    The ancestral home of the Turks is the current steppes of Mongolia. The first written mention of the Turkic-speaking ethnic group is Chinese historical sources. These are the Turkic-speaking Huns mentioned in the 4th-2nd centuries BC It just so happened that, from their ancestral home, the Türks waved westward and thus reached the Bosphorus and the Dardanelles, and the Bug. And in some time periods, and to the Catalan fields of France and the plains of Northern Italy.

    In the 1st century AD part of the Huns moved to present-day Xinjiang and Southeast Kazakhstan where they assimilated the inhabitants of this territory - Indo-Europeans of the Iranian-speaking language group, Aryans. Saks, Ephthalites, Massagets, and others. In the 2nd century, another part of the Huns resettled in Central and Northern Kazakhstan, in the Urals, in the Volga region where they assimilated other Indo-Europeans of the Iranian group, Scythians, Sarmatians, and also Ugro-Finnish tribes. In the 4th century, a part of this cross, speaking Turkic, went further west to tear Europe. And it came to Italy and France under the Europeanized name of the Huns. Yes there and disappeared. In the 6th century, the Turks of the Turkic Kaganate settled Central Asia and assimilated the last Indo-Europeans of the Iranian-speaking group. That is why in the Turkic languages, in particular in Kazakh, about 25% of the words are of Indo-European, Iranian origin. These are the waves of the exodus, the last wave in the 13th century during the time of Genghis Khan, and depopulated the steppes of the ancestral home. Over time, these steppes were settled by neighbors, the Xianbi tribes of Manchu origin, which are now called the Mongols.

    In the 10th century, the Seljuk Turks withdrew from the lower reaches of the Syr-Darya and Amu-Darya of the south-west of Kazakhstan and the north of Uzbekistan and went west. Iran, the Middle East fought with the battles, pressed Byzantium and settled in Anatolia in the form of the Koni Sultanate. This was the core of the future Ottoman Empire and modern Turkey. Of course, the Seljuk Turks over these centuries did not assimilate the Byzantines and Iranians, but Arabs, Slavs, and Greeks. In the end, it turned out to be a modern Turk, which in appearance differs from the inhabitants of modern Central Asia and Kazakhstan, but the language of both is closely related - Turkic.

    That’s how, if you know history, it doesn’t strive for rapprochement of our modern countries and peoples.
  • alert_timka
    alert_timka 23 December 2013 13: 22
    +2
    [quote = Basileus] Sunnis and Shiites. One nation, yes. [/ Quote
    I had no idea that separate branches of religion or religion itself and the nation are the same thing))). Indeed, among the Russians there are quite a few atheists and Orthodox, but from this they are, that because of faith or not faith, different nations come out ?!
    1. Basileus
      Basileus 23 December 2013 13: 32
      +3
      One culture, religion, tradition ...

      It was necessary to give a quote. Is Catholicism or Nestorianism and Orthodoxy the same religion?
  • ed65b
    ed65b 23 December 2013 13: 45
    +5
    In ep Kazakhs agreed, and the Slavs assimilated laughing Soon, the steppe brothers swung the role of the Jews, the holy Jewish, Adam and Eve. Jews do not understand, the Holocaust will be attributed all life should wake laughing
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 23 December 2013 14: 09
      +4
      Quote: ed65b
      In ep Kazakhs agreed, and the Slavs assimilated

      Downed or not downed pilot (forgot what alibekuly calls you) how are you? hi
    2. Beck
      Beck 23 December 2013 15: 50
      +4
      Quote: ed65b
      In ep Kazakhs agreed, and the Slavs assimilated


      In all wars, assimilation takes place. What do you think, the Seljuk Turks did not take wives from the Slavic peoples conquered by the Balkans, or from Syria, or from Greece. This is not an exception, but a rule in empires.

      And the word Turk is a Europeanized pronunciation of the word Turk. Turks do not call themselves Turks. They speak Turk.
      1. Cpa
        Cpa 23 December 2013 20: 08
        0
        Quote: Yeraz
        I explain in the Türkic language there is no separation of Türk and Turk !!!!! There is one word TURK !! Türk was invented by Russians !!!!

        И
        Quote: Beck
        And the word Turk is a Europeanized pronunciation of the word Turk. Turks do not call themselves Turks. They speak Turk.

        wassat Turn off the "snobs" and decide among yourself laughing
  • andrey682006
    andrey682006 23 December 2013 14: 26
    +3
    Quote: Beck
    ..... These are the waves of the exodus, the last wave in the 13th century during the time of Genghis Khan, and depopulated the steppes of the ancestral home. Over time, these steppes were settled by neighbors, the Xianbi tribes of Manchu origin, which are now called the Mongols ....

    That is, today's Mongols - only call themselves the heirs of Genghis Khan?
    Are his real heirs the Türks? belay
    What language did Genghis Khan speak?
    In theory, his language should be similar to the language of his neighbors (in your opinion) - the Mongols.
    THOSE. Turkic should be similar to Mongolian, based on your words. But he does not look like. Somewhere you are wrong.
    25% of the words are not an argument, in Russian there are also many Turkic words. But we are not Turks.

    Pan-Turkism in the modern sense is one ancestral home, common origin, related languages, and on the basis of this, primarily cultural interaction, and then economic.

    Those. if Adam and Eve are our common ancestors - then the Slavs are Türks? Indeed, in languages ​​there are many common words, cultural interaction also took place. Economic interaction exists ...
    I'm turkish???? belay
    1. Basileus
      Basileus 23 December 2013 14: 45
      +4
      Yes, they only call. Genghis Khan's "real" Mongols are also Mongols, but they were a different people.

      As for the heritage of Genghis Khan. Oddly enough, the Turks. It was they who most fruitfully used the fruits of victory and quickly assimilated the few Mongols. At least in the western part of the empire. Similar processes took place in Persia and China.

      Turkic is similar to Mongolian as much as Slavic languages ​​are similar to Germanic. I think it’s even closer, because, as far as I remember, the Indo-European were divided before the hypothetical Altai.
      1. andrey682006
        andrey682006 23 December 2013 15: 11
        +3
        We do not consider ourselves Germans, even to the Romano-Germanic language group we do not include ourselves. Therefore, the Turks on this basis can not consider themselves heirs of Genghis Khan.
        And have we not assimilated the few Mongols? Saratov and Astrakhan - is this not a confirmation?
        I think that every nation living in the territory that was part of the Genghis Khan empire has the right to consider itself an heir. And Iran, and China and Turkey, and Russia, and Kazakhstan, and many others.
        In the end, it’s not in vain that I suffer when they call me a Mongol-katsap. laughing
        1. Basileus
          Basileus 23 December 2013 15: 56
          +1
          In my words there was nothing about the inheritance of the language.
          1. andrey682006
            andrey682006 23 December 2013 16: 43
            0
            The fruits of victory, we also took advantage. And the Chinese (or the Manchus?)
            1. Basileus
              Basileus 24 December 2013 07: 52
              0
              The fruits of the Golden Horde, and not the empire of Genghis Khan. I mean the conquered peoples who assimilated the victors. And there were three such groups - Turks, Han Chinese and Persians.
      2. Rusich51
        Rusich51 23 December 2013 21: 10
        -1
        Quote: Basileus
        As for the heritage of Genghis Khan. Oddly enough, the Turks. It was they who most fruitfully used the fruits of victory and quickly assimilated the few Mongols. At least in the western part of the empire. Similar processes took place in Persia and China.


        Yes, there was no Tatar-Mongol yoke as such. The collapse of Great Tartaria occurred, which Western historians turned into an invasion of great and terrible goodwin.
    2. Beck
      Beck 23 December 2013 15: 47
      +5
      Quote: andrey682006
      That is, today's Mongols - only call themselves the heirs of Genghis Khan?
      Are his real heirs the Türks?


      The real heirs of Genghis Khan and the Mongols and Turks. Before Genghis Khan, there was no people with the ethnonym Mongol. When Genghis Khan united 4 tribes of the Borjigins, Taichuit, Naimans, and Kereits, this association was not given an ethnonym, but a collective political name - Mynkol. You can translate from Turkic - Myn - a thousand. The count is the hand. The count also matters as a military corps. Body of the right hand, left hand. That is, Mynkol had a double meaning either Thousand-armed (people), or the Thousand troops.

      Some historians and I join this opinion agree that Genghis Khan was a Turk. (In the course of the story you’ll understand). When Genghis Khan went to China and crossed the Gobi Desert, he was met by the vassal forces of China, one of whose duties was to protect China from raids, troops of the Xianbi tribes of Manchu origin. Before the battle, they decided to talk. They sat in a yurt. When they got out, they mounted their horses and went with one army to smash China. Naturally, the Syanbi took upon themselves the common political name Mynkol. And for the Chinese, the Naiman, and the Kereites, and the Syanbi were one thing - Mynkolami.

      Actually, it is a Turkic tradition - to replenish troops of conquered peoples. In China, the first captured Chinese were the first to storm the fortress walls. When Batu Khan went to Poland and Hungary, Smolensk wars and A. Nevsky regiment were in his troops. And for the Poles and the Hungarians, they, too, were essentially all mykols. And much later, when they thought of going to Vietnam, to the assembly point in Beijing, the Russian army arrived. And for the Vietnamese, that too was all the essence of Mynkola. Over time, the word became Europeanized and began to sound like a Mongol. Syanbi participated in the southern campaigns and stood garrisons in the cities of China, in the western campaigns there were mainly Turks.

      One big absurdity for historians was, and even now is, that the type of Mongols (syanbi) conquered Kazakhstan, and after 15 years when they invaded the Russian borders, they suddenly completely forgot the Mongolian language, the language of the conquerors. The entire army spoke Bati Khan and Batu Khan himself and his entourage. In order to smooth this out, it was invented that the Syanbi-Mongols for 15 years have become indigenous to the steppes of Kazakhstan. How can this be? This Turks should have been honed. And they didn’t live in cities, but in villages. And as in a pure Mongolian aul, and from whom, one could renounce. This speaks only about one thing: the Turkic tribes of Kazakhstan, the Kypchaks, Argyns, and others. Won the Turkic tribes of the Naimans and Kereits. And united, after 15 years, they went on a Western campaign. I am a Kazakh, from the Naiman tribe, try my family again to thrash again for 15 years. None of this will work

      After the collapse of the empire of Genghis Khan, all tribes returned to their true ethnonyms - Naimans, Kereites, and others. But the syanbi remained with the name Mynkol, the Mongol. Which eventually turned into an ethnonym. And now, 2 million live in Mongolia, and about 8 million Mongols live in the Inner Mongolia of China beyond the Gobi Desert. This indicates the place of the motherland and the direction of resettlement.

      Something like this. Many facts, of course, do not fit into a limited commentary.
      1. andrey682006
        andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 14
        +1
        If the Turkic tribes of Kazakhstan, the Kipchaks and the Argyns conquered the Naimans and the Kereites (and Genghis Khan was among the winners as a Turk), then this should have happened before going to China. And only after that they went west.
        Then this could not remain among the documents of the same Chinese, agree?
        Is there any such evidence?

        Or was Genghis Khan among the losers? But how then did he become a khan?

        And if not the whole army spoke Turkic, but only part of it? Most of? And if the Mongols were few and had to learn the language already? And no one defeated the Mongols — did they offer to rob and send the locals into battle? And there were no such views as now on language and nationality. in 15 years to learn a spoken language, if around you they only speak it - it’s quite real. Mongolian remained only in families (family), but when communicating in public, they spoke Turkic.
        By the way, this also explains that Turkic turned out to be so widespread - it arose from the mixing of other languages ​​- from Yakutia to Persia.
        1. Beck
          Beck 23 December 2013 17: 49
          +6
          Quote: andrey682006
          If the Turkic tribes of Kazakhstan, the Kipchaks and the Argyns conquered the Naimans and the Kereites (and Genghis Khan was among the winners as a Turk), then this should have happened before going to China. And only after that they went west.


          First there was a trip to China. After China, the territory of Khorezmshah Mohamed, the ruler of the present territory of Central Asia and Kazakhstan, was conquered. And these are the Naimans and Kereites in the army of Genghis Khan conquered the Kipchaks and Argyns. And there are documents, and not only Chinese, but also Arab and Persian historians of that time.

          Quote: andrey682006
          And if not the whole army spoke Turkic, but only part of it? Most of? And if the Mongols were few and had to learn the language already?


          It is quite possible that the Syanbi-Mongols could and most likely participated in the campaign against Russia, but the main army was Turkic. And the main thing is different. Why are they the khans of the Golden Horde and their entourage, the conquerors, who must bring their own, spoke Turkic. And they wrote labels to the Russian princes in the Turkic, Turkic alphabet.

          Quote: andrey682006
          And there were no such views as now on language and nationality. in 15 years to learn a spoken language, if around you they only speak it - it’s quite real. Mongolian remained only in families (family), but when communicating in public, they spoke Turkic.


          In the top comment I specifically wrote about the aul. Suppose Naiman and Kereit Syanbi-Mongols. After the conquest, they moved to the territory of Kazakhstan. They and the local population are nomads who live in villages. Here is the Mongolian aul, after 20 kilometers another Mongolian and further. And after 300 kilometers, the village of Kipchaks, after another 20 another village. Is this how they talked? Both those and those communicated only with their fellow tribesmen and only in one aul. And what kind of communication with such dispersal is not a modern city. And even more so for 10-15 years living in his village, among his fellow tribesmen, how can you forget your language.

          Quote: andrey682006
          By the way, this also explains that Turkic turned out to be so widespread - it arose from the mixing of other languages ​​- from Yakutia to Persia.


          The Türkic language is spread geographically not because it was mixed, but because its speakers moved. The Yakuts, according to the Lena, came to the taiga and tundra open spaces somewhere in the 10-11th century, from the territory of present-day Mongolia. And they are Turks.

          And it is in the steppes of Mongolia there are stone steles with Turkic writings of 5-7 centuries, and not with Mongolian ones. Before Genghis Khan, there was no Mongolian writing. It arose among the Mongols after the death of Genghis Khan.
    3. Beck
      Beck 23 December 2013 16: 02
      +3
      Quote: andrey682006
      25% of the words are not an argument, in Russian there are also many Turkic words. But we are not Turks.


      Similar. The same butt and in the same place. We have 25% of the Indo-European words of the Iranian group, but we are not Europeans, but Turks.

      Quote: andrey682006
      THOSE. Turkic should be similar to Mongolian, based on your words. But he does not look like.


      And should not be like. Mongolian and Turkic languages ​​belong to the Altai language family. But the Mongolian belongs to the Manchurian group, and the Kazakh, for example, to the Turkic group.

      Quote: andrey682006
      Those. if Adam and Eve are our common ancestors - then the Slavs are Türks? Indeed, in languages ​​there are many common words, cultural interaction also took place. Economic interaction exists ...
      I'm turkish????


      Oh well. If you pull yourself up, you can and more clearly ironize. But in essence, we are all from East Africa from one black Eve.

      ALL WE ARE MAN.

      We think of things the same way, but express these thoughts in different sounds.
  • chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 23 December 2013 15: 14
    +1
    Well, at least people have eggs openly declare their claims. Leather poles climb to crush eastern Europe and make an empire from sea to sea, at least they are not shy about it. Only Russia has no ambitions, only peaceful coexistence with neighbors, under any conditions, if only there would be no war.
    Russia has centuries-old claims on the Bosphorus, the Baltic states, Finland, and Poland. But we cannot openly declare this, the spirit is not enough. Oh, what they think about us, oh we are not like that, we are waiting for the tram. At this time, all and sundry tear Russia to pieces. I’m not talking about the land 100 years ago, the former Russian. No one already seriously considers his lands lost only 22 years ago. The other day, literally practically took away the original Russian land - Ukraine. And what is the answer of citizens. - In vain they gave money, they are not ours at all, we do not need them, etc., etc. Openly declare - Ukraine is Russian land, was and will be under Russia, and whoever pulls his hands will chop off nafig and introduce the army, we don’t care. Declare - Limitrophs, at the first opportunity you will be ours and we will strictly ask for insulting the Russians, and do not care about your nagging. To declare Japan - in the event of not concluding a peace treaty on current conditions, we reserve the right to conduct military operations with the aim of capturing and joining Russia a Hokkaido, which is difficult, and let them rage, let them get ready, we have nuclear weapons, we do not care. At least declare intentions and then the spirit is not enough. So we will continue to live. Well, why the hell do we need this far east, oh, Siberia is not quite like ours, ah, the Urals, we don’t need the Tatars there, and in general the Russian only is the Moscow region, let the rest think for themselves. Forward to a brighter future, terpils are always needed.
  • andrey682006
    andrey682006 23 December 2013 15: 36
    0
    Yeraz (3)

    You moderate emotions.
    Turkic language group is a scientific term.http: //ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2%D1%8E%D1%80%D0%BA%D0%B8
    "Azeri-Turk, Kazakh-Turk, Uzbek-Turk, etc." - Do you call each other that on the forums? Something in my life I do not observe such names.
    I already wrote to you about the fact that Russian and Ukrainian differ, but not much, I understand the film, but not all. Conversation, especially eastern Ukrainian dialects, I understand easily. Just as you do not understand literary Turkish, you will partially understand the film. But spoken language - yes, you will understand easily.
    If you do not know the word and concept of "language dialects" I cannot help you, you will have to do self-education. The larger the country and the larger the population, the more the dialects of the language differ in different parts of it. If Ukraine is larger than Azerbaijan, its population is larger - and dialects differ more. Eastern speech in Ukraine is very different from Western. And this happened precisely because of the Polish occupation. By the way, you write - "Can you watch the film in full Ukrainian ???" What is "completely Ukrainian"? So there is incomplete Ukrainian? That is, do you recognize the existence of two Ukrainian languages? Which of them will I not be able to watch the film?
    Based on the foregoing, I conclude that the Turkic peoples (even based on the opinions on this forum) are no closer to each other than the Russians and Ukrainians.
    Despite your desires to be a Turk more than the Turks themselves. repeat
  • lukke
    lukke 23 December 2013 16: 15
    +1
    I think all the hot fervor of Erdogan will be sent by Uncle Sam to the Crimea and the Caucasus. Greece will not be allowed to touch (both Turks and Greeks - while NATO members). In general, of course, the Germans laughed - so zealously began to split Yugoslavia with the United States that removing this barrier in the Balkans opened an even bigger hole for the Islamization of the region, including in his distant underbelly. We need to look carefully and respond. And it’s better to advance ahead in building up the potential in the Black Sea region and think over economic counter-measures. From myself, I’ll add - I’m not going to rest to the Ottomans, I'd rather drink everything in the pristine outback with us)))
  • ko88
    ko88 23 December 2013 16: 48
    0
    it’s a fully feasible plan of Turkey, does not give birth to Europe, the population is aging, plus the legalization of homosexuals, and the total problem with illegal immigrants, but Turkey is getting stronger and stronger, so that in 50-70 years the situation could completely change.
  • Megatron
    Megatron 23 December 2013 16: 57
    +3
    Just the point is that in any topic about Turkey, there is not a single Turk, but there are a lot of Azerbaijanis who want to cling to the shadow of the once great Ottoman Empire.
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 23 December 2013 17: 00
      +1
      Quote: Megatron
      there is not a single turk

      firstly, the Turks do not know the Russian language, and why should they know that
      secondly, the forum has one Turk.
      1. RUSS
        RUSS 23 December 2013 17: 39
        +4
        Quote: Clegg
        Quote: Megatron
        there is not a single turk

        firstly, the Turks do not know the Russian language, and why should they know that
        secondly, the forum has one Turk.


        In the tourism sector of Turkey, many Turks from service staff and traders to managers speak Russian, but there are only a few Turkish-speaking Russians, with the exception of translators, teachers, diplomats and journalists. In general, learn Russian, great and powerful. For reference, the Russian language is more and more in demand from China to Western Europe.
    2. xetai9977
      xetai9977 23 December 2013 17: 20
      -1
      Any Azerbaijani is proud that he has the honor of upholding the interests of the Turkic ethnic group. But I will never understand a Russian who defends an Armenian with foam at his mouth ...
      1. chunga-changa
        chunga-changa 23 December 2013 17: 38
        +4
        Quote: xetai9977
        But I will never understand a Russian who defends an Armenian with foam at his mouth

        The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
        Like many here I got acquainted with the realities of "friendship of peoples" while serving in the ranks of the SA. And the conclusion for myself was extremely simple. If trouble comes, you can rely on an Armenian, there is no Azerbaijani, and most likely the trouble will come from the Azeri.
        1. Christian
          Christian 23 December 2013 19: 13
          +3
          That's right! But most importantly, we are Christians with Armenians!
          1. Apollo
            Apollo 23 December 2013 19: 32
            +4
            Quote: Christian
            That's right! But most importantly, we are Christians with Armenians!

            It is not necessary here on the forum to incite sectarian strife.
            In the south of Moldova, the Gagauz people live and speak the Turkic language.They profess Orthodoxy and are kindred to us and to me personally, people.
            More questions?!



            1. Beck
              Beck 23 December 2013 22: 08
              +3
              Quote: Apollon
              They profess Orthodoxy and are kindred to us and to me personally, people.


              I am from the Naiman tribe of the Kazakh people. My ancestors, who were with the Kereits, Taichuit and Borjigins, the basis of the original army of Genghis Khan, worshiped Tengri, the Eternal Blue Sky, somewhere around the 10th century. From the 10th to the mid-14th century, they were Nestorian Christians. The Nestorian Christians were also the Kereites. Their lord Van Khan always carried a large cross in his wagon train, and in the parking lot this cross was without a doubt set up on a Khan's yurt.

              And only in the middle of 1300, when the khan of the Golden Horde Uzbek adopted Islam in the state, which concerned only the nomadic population and did not affect the farmers of Christians, the Naimans with the Kereits converted to Islam.
        2. xetai9977
          xetai9977 23 December 2013 19: 25
          +2
          how shallow and banal is the "offense" inflicted by the Azerbaijanis on you ... And every day we see the "blessing" brought by the Russian government, no matter the empire or the communists in the form of a divided country, the Martyrs' Alley, grubby territories around Baku ... Please deign to spell the name of my people correctly. I do not distort the name of your people
          1. Thunderbolt
            Thunderbolt 23 December 2013 22: 42
            +1
            с
            Quote: xetai9977
            shallow and banal "offense"
            the assistance of the Turkish army, the traffic of Chechen fighters from Turkey and transit from Afghanistan, Allah’s fighters === insult is trite and banal, but you got really hot, and this is a very serious insult, 2 Arm.Kor.ne could and began to act razv.- Terr. actions.
        3. smersh70
          smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 33
          0
          Quote: chunga-changa
          and most likely the disaster from the Azeibardan will come.



          ..this trouble on our part came very little to you when you read your fabrications ... laughing
          1. chunga-changa
            chunga-changa 23 December 2013 22: 18
            0
            Yes, in our unit the fighters united and the Azerbaijanis were sick, we had to scatter you around the points. But then, at your place, carvings of Russians and Armenians were made glorious later. We remember what you need to do with you, and what you do if you are not driven into the room. And these tales about peaceful Turks whom bloodthirsty neighbors offend, you tell your wives, it will be more interesting to them.
            1. alone
              alone 23 December 2013 22: 28
              0
              Quote: chunga-changa
              Yes, in our country, the people united and the Azerbaijanis got sick, we had to scatter you around the points. But then, at your place, carvings of Russians and Armenians were made glorious later. We remember what you need to do with you, and what you do if you are not driven into the room.


              Judging by the way you relate to my people, it seems that you were exhausted by our people. Here and still keep the evil)) Smile more often and enjoy life. hi
      2. andrey682006
        andrey682006 23 December 2013 17: 48
        +2
        Maybe among Russian nationalism less?
        And more simple human interpersonal relationships, rather than abstract interethnic?
        Something very pathetic writing, do not you?
      3. Rusich51
        Rusich51 23 December 2013 19: 32
        +1
        Quote: xetai9977
        Any Azerbaijani is proud that he has the honor of upholding the interests of the Turkic ethnic group. But I will never understand a Russian who defends an Armenian with foam at his mouth ...


        No one protects them with foam at the mouth. They have their own cockroaches. Azerbaijan is normal men, if not Wahhabis and the like Natsik. I know from my own experience.

        Türkic ethnos? Forget you are Azerbaijan. You have your own sea problems.
    3. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 19: 52
      +3
      Quote: Megatron
      Just the point is that in any topic about Turkey, there is not a single Turk, but there are a lot of Azerbaijanis who want to cling to the shadow of the once great Ottoman Empire.

      Wise guy and ax is Che the most popular site of Russia? Yes, there are a lot of people here, but for 140 millionth Russia it is not too much.
      With the 2 millionth Azerbaijani diaspora, knowing the Russian language, I am only registered here. And the Turks in Russia about two times and ended.
      There are a couple of Azerbaijanis from Azerbaijan, but even then they are people of the Soviet generation.
      What is there that the Turks forgot ?? Odi Turks are here and live here, it is a miracle that he is here.

      But there are a lot of Turks in German resources. And English.
    4. Yeraz
      Yeraz 23 December 2013 19: 52
      0
      Quote: Megatron
      Just the point is that in any topic about Turkey, there is not a single Turk, but there are a lot of Azerbaijanis who want to cling to the shadow of the once great Ottoman Empire.

      Wise guy and ax is Che the most popular site of Russia? Yes, there are a lot of people here, but for 140 millionth Russia it is not too much.
      With the 2 millionth Azerbaijani diaspora, knowing the Russian language, I am only registered here. And the Turks in Russia about two times and ended.
      There are a couple of Azerbaijanis from Azerbaijan, but even then they are people of the Soviet generation.
      What is there that the Turks forgot ?? Odi Turks are here and live here, it is a miracle that he is here.

      But there are a lot of Turks in German resources. And English.
  • Leshka
    Leshka 23 December 2013 18: 13
    +2
    let the lip roll up laughing
  • The fat man
    The fat man 23 December 2013 18: 29
    +4
    Quote: Asgard
    Here Erdogan pulls the country back to Muslimism, from which they were pulled by the pope of all Turks (ATATYURK)))

    but what about the fact that it was precisely under Erdogad that there was a qualitative economy of horse racing in Turkey, and this is during the global economic crisis. Despite the fact that Turkey does not have significant natural resources
  • GUSAR
    GUSAR 23 December 2013 19: 06
    +1
    Fuck them and not the Balkans!
    1. ayyildiz
      ayyildiz 23 December 2013 19: 16
      +1
      Bulgaria is already controlled by the Turks, for your information!
  • kelevra
    kelevra 23 December 2013 19: 16
    0
    Well, what a jerk already! What kind of nonsense, to return the territories! The Russian Empire, in general, had half the world and what now. Let's elect Zhirinovsky as president and provoke wars around the world ?? !!!! Would these Turks sit silently, otherwise they would be taken and will be divided at the place where they already are!
    1. alone
      alone 23 December 2013 20: 40
      +1
      laughing But what about Putin? if he reads your comment, then Zhirinovsky’s career will very soon end! lol
  • Megatron
    Megatron 23 December 2013 20: 04
    +1
    There are some strange Azerbaijanis here, today I specially talked with familiar Azerbaijanis on this topic, they don't care about anything, they don't dream of any "Turan", they just want to live well and peacefully.
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 37
      0
      Quote: Megatron
      they just want to live well and peacefully.


      Yes, here all the tons in the Caucasus so want to live !!!!!!! that's just your friends and neighbors do not let you calmly breathe bully "how many of these Zhiguli have recently been divorced. everyone is spinning, spinning and spinning under their feet (MKRTCHYAN, Mimino)
      1. Thunderbolt
        Thunderbolt 23 December 2013 22: 24
        +1
        Quote: smersh70
        ! that's just your friends-neighbors do not let you quietly find out "how many of these Zhiguli have been divorced recently
        these are the conditions for maintaining peace in the region, about the Zhiguli Mountains it is strong, I did not know that this became a winged expression, but the fact that the military-political significance of the Russian base in Armenia is decided by the visits of military-parliamentary commissions is an initiative, but by and large it is a very serious issue, which even with great literature it is not solved, there are some hints from the Russian diplomats, and even though they firmly expressed themselves, they are also so vague, and thanks to them the Russian force remains to act flexibly, confidently and clearly. We are standing on bayonets, but trading well --- weapons deterrence is not the last tool in the geo-game. And the Turkish diaspora of Chechnya and the participation of the Turkish special services in the traffic of militants, weapons and special means, we all know, friends, we remember all the channels. We did not succeed in engaging the infantry, or even 2, in operations against Russian formations ? We have launched reconnaissance and sabotage work. But you have fulfilled your task, I hope everyone has been awarded the Chechen Order of the Borz, whom they have circumvented with this high award, go to the FSB of the Russian Federation and remain Rofeya wolf stars, come hang for the border guards, wasn’t that?
  • komel
    komel 23 December 2013 20: 17
    +1
    Armed conflict in South Ossetia, The Five Day War is an armed conflict that occurred in August 2008 between Georgia, on the one hand, and South Ossetia and Abkhazia, as well as Russia, on the other.
    Bosphorus is closed.
    Turkey does not let American warships into the Black Sea.
    Turkey has its own interests in the Caucasus, the west in these matters is not a decree for it, if it is necessary they will be beautifully denied.

    Bosphorus
  • Cpa
    Cpa 23 December 2013 20: 35
    +2
    Now, in the Rostov Region, the Kuban and Stavropol Territories, deaf villages are massively populated by Turks. The main thing is that they do not later declare the ancestral lands in this territory. And let the Bulgarians themselves figure it out, they have already helped out once, it did not help us either.
    1. smersh70
      smersh70 23 December 2013 21: 39
      +2
      Quote: KPA
      Ubani and the Stavropol region, deaf villages are massively populated by Turks. The main thing is that they do not later declare the ancestral lands in this territory

      well don't worry about that ... laughing Armenians hold the palm in these matters ... bully Fear Danians bringing gifts. smile so says the Greek proverb)))) ..
  • ed65b
    ed65b 23 December 2013 21: 27
    0
    The Turks have already pulled up, the Turks are Russian, that is, we are Slavs, we have torn everyone, we will tear and tear, sign up in the queue are dissatisfied laughing
  • voliador
    voliador 23 December 2013 23: 51
    0
    It is necessary to increase the pace of rearmament of the army, then it will be possible to sleep more calmly.
  • standby
    standby 24 December 2013 00: 32
    0
    To the author +, thanks, good analytics. True, there are a couple of questions. Does Macedonia really gravitate to Turkey? I think it could be the Albanians, who are shitty with the management and the mind in general, the Macedonians, of whom in the government - most do not have such a gravity, they are Orthodox and are closer to the Serbs in culture!
    The expansion of Turkey is fully justified - this is their ancient sphere of influence, even if not political, but economic, is also not bad, they have economic opportunities for this (Russians like to relax in Turkey and spend money). Yugoslavia was quite a self-sufficient state for itself, strong, one might say, its destruction was in the hands of many. Now the state - the regional leader in the Balkans is absent for a number of reasons. In general, they take that "lies badly", we don't go there at all, although Serbia and Montenegro could still be attracted, how justified it is - I don't know!
  • Sergg
    Sergg 26 December 2013 20: 58
    0
    I believe that Russian troops will expel the Turks from the territory of ancient Byzantium. This land was betrayed by the Western Crusaders to the Turks. Even now they are conducting crusades, which have nothing in common, as before, with Christ, against Russia, Ukraine and Belarus. This WAR WILL NOT BE SO MUCH AGAINST TURKEY HOW MUCH AGAINST THE WESTERN PAST CIVILIZATION. We do not want war, but if we have to take weapons as our grandfathers.
    &
    Most likely there is no other way than a military way out of the prevailing economic and political crisis in the world. In Russia, we see how Western forces are trying to undermine the situation from within by creating interethnic and religious discord, how Russian people become VICTIMS OF JUSTICE, this must stop!
    1. Beck
      Beck 26 December 2013 21: 44
      0
      Quote: Sergg
      I believe that Russian troops will expel the Turks from the territory of ancient Byzantium.


      No, but idiotic thoughts of an illiterate head, after all, they should end sometime. It’s blurt out that in a flask with sulfuric acid pry.

      How can modernity wish war and an unjust war doubly. Turkey is a member of NATO, which means that automatically, when attacking it, NATO troops will react. And most importantly, start, and then press the nuclear button for a short time. The result is a nuclear collapse of the planet. But Serge thinks only with emotions, does not include his head. A historical past that cannot be returned objectively, he wants to unfold.

      Quote: Sergg
      This land was betrayed by the Western Crusaders to the Turks.


      That's what I got in if there is no knowledge on the topic. Firstly, not only the Slavs of the Balkans lived in the Byzantine Empire, but also the Syrians, the Kurds, the Arabs, the Armenians, and another bunch. Secondly, no crusaders gave Byzantium to the Turks. On April 5, 1453, the Turks began a siege of Constantinople, May 30, Constantinople fell, the Byzantine Empire ceased to exist.

      Quote: Sergg
      In Russia, we see how Western forces are trying to undermine the situation from within by creating interethnic and religious discord,


      Interethnic and religious discord at all times, in all states, is primarily fueled by their religious fanatics and their chauvinistic-minded false patriots. Read the comments of Urashniki, no one shakes the federal structure of Russia as much as they do.
  • Robert Nevsky
    Robert Nevsky 29 December 2013 21: 11
    0
    SHIPCHENSKY FIGHT