Military Review

The collapse of the state in Ukraine: what mistakes should Russia and the Union avoid

72
The collapse of the state in Ukraine: what mistakes should Russia and the Union avoidSo, the bidding of the Ukrainian president around the integration vector is expected to end with a riot. Euromaidan, which had already turned into a dreary state, was dispersed extremely harshly - with blood, beatings of people lying down and in the middle of the night.


It is only then that political scientists and historians will dig out who needed a violent aggravation. But the fact remains that unnecessary and senseless violence acted as a catalyst for the mobilization of all the discontented. And sooner or later, both sides begin to hate any traitors. Because, at first, “supporters of Eurasian integration” in the Southeast began to hate the “Donetsk”. Then, throwing supporters of European integration, the “Donetsk” turned against another part of Ukrainian society.

Representatives of business, small shopkeepers and other creative class of Kiev disliked the “Donetsk” from the 2004 year, and now, when Ukrainian citizens have become rapidly impoverished and have experienced all the charms of effective “Donetsk” government, and even more so.

But now it does not matter what exactly led to the riot. It is important that with the presence of the state in the Republic of Ukraine, and so there have been problems since the declaration of independence. Now the state has practically disappeared, and very soon it will be no more than in Moldova or Tajikistan.

But, given the size of the republic and the risks of turning it into a source of crisis for the whole of Eurasia, and first of all Russia and Belarus, one must be extremely honest in assessing and forecasting the unfolding collapse of the state in Ukraine. To avoid unnecessary illusions and fantasies.

The first. There is no success of Russia in the Ukrainian direction.

Ukrainian authorities long and hard fled to the flags. “Donetsk” didn’t believe until recently that the course they had chosen led to a total collapse of the state. They were warned about this both in Ukraine and outside.

The policy of multi-vector and permanent trading with the centers of power could be possible until the Customs Union was formed in Eurasia and Ukraine was not caught between two integration groups.

Since the beginning of 2011, Donetsk has had enough time to join one of the Unions. In one case, “Donetsk” would lose industrial assets, in the second - capital in the EU and offshore.

The choice, of course, difficult. But his absence, it seems, will lead to the fact that they will lose both.

However, it is completely wrong to consider the collapse of the state in Ukraine as a victory for Russia. Because those who will come to power after the “Donetsk”, may be more predictable partners. But the state of this in the Ukrainian republic will not increase.

The second. Do not participate in the oligarchic clashes in Ukraine

Whatever the revolt in Kiev, one thing is clear: the full power will go to the Ukrainian oligarchic groups completely. Names in this case have no meaning.

Ukraine is still waiting for a lot of aggravations of the political crisis, during which new characters will appear, who will receive momentary omnipotence, and then will be deposed.

The meaning of oligarchic power lies in the fact that the republic is in constant political and economic crisis. Because during a crisis, assets can be bought for nothing and endlessly shuffle political players. At the same time, the real rulers of the republic can be outside public authority: either abroad or in well-protected estates.

Agreeing with any Ukrainian authorities in the coming 2 – 3 of the year is simply meaningless due to the lack of a subject of power. The subject will be blurred between five to seven FIGs, and the center of power will constantly change.

When at one of the stages of revolt succeeds, then there will be a change in the state system.

Institutionally, this is likely to be in the form of a parliamentary republic — in order to give legitimacy to the absence of a subject of power and to make permanent changes in power legal.

The only thing that can be said with confidence is that people who have made a choice in favor of their capitals will come to power. And this means that Ukraine, after Moldova, will turn into the peripheral market of the European Union.

Third. Instead of an alliance with the Ukrainian state - to allied relations with Ukrainian citizens

However, despite the absence of a subject of power and the state in Kiev, the economic situation will be quite predictable.

Most likely, there will be a default and bankruptcy with the subsequent purchase of assets for a pittance. As a result, many Ukrainian citizens of working age will be without work.

Consequently, in the coming 1,5 – 2, Ukraine will become the main source of guest workers in Eurasia. Moreover, the Ukrainian guest workers will be more motivated to resemble Uzbek rather than Romanian ones. In the sense that the motivation will be a matter of survival, not earnings.

Some migrant workers will be able to swallow up the EU market, in which a plan to replace Arab, Gypsy and African illegal immigrants for white, loyal and well-educated migrants has long been ripening.

Therefore, the key task is to attract Ukrainian citizens to the construction sites of the new industrialization of the Eurasian Union. In particular, the collapse of the Ukrainian state can and should be used to change the demographic situation in the Far East.

Unlike the EU, which will not legitimize Ukrainian migrants under any circumstances, Russia and allies, on the contrary, are interested in organizing a mass relocation of residents, primarily cities in the Southeast. Moreover, it is necessary to stimulate resettlement: with families and simplified legalization, and not guest workers, as the EU will practice.

Ukraine, as a subject of politics, will be dealt with not earlier than in a few years, when the republic passes through a series of riots, electoral crises and changes of elites, after which, at last, there will be at least some kind of subject.

The catastrophic scenario — with the collapse of the republic — is not desirable to be considered, because then we will deal with a set of territories, each of which will have to develop its own methods of integration. And in today's situation it is a thankless task to build such forecasts.
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  1. makst83
    makst83 3 December 2013 10: 09
    13
    It should be understood that those who play in the Big Political Games are absolutely not interested in why (or why) people actually go outside. Their task is to use ANY popular indignation for their own purposes.
    Ukrainian politicians and oligarchs absolutely sincerely believe that it is better to have your own “piece of Ukraine”, which brings two pennies, and maintain sole control over it, than to participate in Eurasian integration processes. This logic has been around for many years, on it, in fact, the independent campaign of 22 was built years ago.
    It is correctly said that it is necessary to work directly with the people, and not with the watered "elite", using soft power!
    1. CTEPX
      CTEPX 3 December 2013 19: 47
      13
      Quote: makst83
      Their task is to use ANY popular indignation for their own purposes.

      The article absolutely does not take into account political realities. Ukraine, which offered itself to the EU as a "transit pipe" for duty-free delivery of EU goods to Russia, has broken off. The EU, hoping for Russian money to plunder Ukraine to the ground, has broken off. Russia managed to prevent these threats)).
      But the main threat is the inevitable start of the third world war, so much needed by some, a la "peace against Russia."
      Thanks to the cowardice, greed and stupidity of Janek and his predecessors (here everything is correct in the article), the Ukrainian state is bankrupt. But, I'm afraid, we may not be waiting for the fight of "AlEgarhs" for the steering wheel in Ukraine ... Wahhabi structures in Crimea will easily accept tens of thousands of rats from Syria to "stay", the Westerners will gladly host the US contingent from Afgan. All they need for this is the de-legitimization of the central government and the chaos of Ukraine. And, unfortunately, at an early stage, Russia cannot interfere!
      Let us wish the Ukrainians reason, strength and a leader.
      1. mirag2
        mirag2 4 December 2013 03: 55
        0
        Israel SHAMIR

        And you thought that the Europeans would allow Yanukovych to calmly leave and take away Ukraine, which was supposed to decorate the Christmas table in Europe, instead of a jellied pig!
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. avt
      avt 3 December 2013 20: 07
      +9
      ,, Third. Instead of an alliance with the Ukrainian state - to union relations with Ukrainian citizens "
      Quote: makst83
      It’s rightly said that you need to work directly with the people,

      With one significant addition. The people in Ukraine must clearly understand that they are part of the people who created the Empire and should henceforth, no matter how it is called, support and build it. Otherwise, when the groans about independence begin again, I don’t see any difference with the Central Asian guest workers, and I don’t want to see, it’s not interesting to slurp over everything that happened since the 91st year. Only in this case can we be subjects of politics, and not objects. It is much better to be a player than a toy - a figure in a strange game, than at present Ukrainians with their leaders of all stripes are. Only very stubborn in independence or simply dumb does not see this in the events. Although much more clearly demonstrated. Much cooler and grotesque than in Russia since the time of EBON I the most drunken. And besides, Ukraine needs a real leader, Kovpak is clearly not enough there, only Mazepa. And this, of course, is the trouble there on the ground, a leader from the local is definitely needed. Such is the historical pattern.
      1. Papakiko
        Papakiko 3 December 2013 20: 37
        +1
        Quote: avt
        It is much better to be a player than a toy - a figure in a strange game

        Comrad, your words have awakened in me;

        Quote: avt
        Only very stubborn in independence or simply stupid does not see this in the events

        1000 shekels need to be worked out.
        "Westerners" have something to lose.
        Or they will become guest workers. or they will be the rest of Ukraine to be hired. The choice is clear.
      2. Tra-ta-ta
        Tra-ta-ta 3 December 2013 20: 44
        +1
        .. and only so ! Otherwise, it will be like in a riddle where the son of the professor’s father killed the father of the professor’s son .. (Who killed whom?)
      3. Alekseev
        Alekseev 3 December 2013 21: 59
        +5
        Quote: avt
        The people in Ukraine must clearly understand that they are part of the people who created the Empire and should henceforth, no matter how it is called, support and build it. Otherwise, when groans about the independence begin again,

        All right.
        But a little surprising is a short historical memory. request
        Only 20 years ago they wrote stupid leaflets and held endless discussions, yelling about how rich Ukraine is, how great and powerful its industry is and how it is robbed by everyone, especially Moscow.
        Yes, there was a similar "op", albeit to varying degrees, in all or almost all of the former republics of the USSR.
        Well, young people don’t know about it, parents saw what happened then, in particular in Ukraine (although no one won from the collapse of the Union): they distributed candy wrappers (I was then proved to be normal, they were real pennies, not like wooden ones) ,
        a really huge industry collapsed, unemployment, out-of-pocket fishing in a number of regions. Of course, no one walks in rags and almost everyone is fed up, the 21st century is outside, but there is no war, and the situation is not improving much, infrastructure is being destroyed, the country is living in debt, the government does not know who to turn to. Is it really not smart enough to tell all this to your children? In order not to strongly believe in the "propaganda" that they are "allowed" on TV.
        Here's something to prove, like "in Russia, too, but the Asians and Moldovans are even worse, and Ukraine is harmed by enemies, the main Putin, but Europe will help us," these are amateurs. Not allof course but very many.
        1. spynet
          spynet 4 December 2013 02: 49
          0
          Only 20 years ago they wrote stupid leaflets and held endless discussions, yelling about how rich Ukraine is, how great and powerful its industry is and how it is robbed by everyone, especially Moscow.
          Yes, there was a similar "op", albeit to varying degrees, in all or almost all of the former republics of the USSR.

          Such jokes are not only in the former republics loved / love to do. Somehow, a man came to us (at a company in Moscow) to collect goods from Voronezh and told a funny story:
          - I am driving home from Moscow to Voronezh, and I listen to the radio ... somewhere in the Moscow region they say on the radio - "120 million rubles have been allocated for the restoration of roads in Voronezh." Driving up to the house, in the evening, on the local radio news announces - "Moscow has allocated 80 million rubles for road repairs in Voronezh." In the morning I turn on the TV, and there the mayor said, "Moscow, such a bunch, has allocated only 40 million rubles for road repairs."

          And Ukraine ... Ukraine (more precisely the government) is now in a stalemate:
          Europe will not change the agreement and agree with the current leadership of Ukraine. Europe is now easier to wait for a change of leadership, and a legitimate change will be or not legitimate for them on the drum. The main thing is that the right person would be (who will sign the contract without additional requirements).
          Ukraine will not join the CU now - it is first necessary to restore trade relations and reduce unemployment in the country in order to show the people the mutual benefit between Ukraine and the CU. And this takes time and money. And the current government has neither time (elections in a year), nor money, and the West will not allow easy accession to the CU (at any moment "Euromaidan" can turn into "Europogrom").
          Of course, there is an option that Yanukovych will now beg for money in China and then he will join the Customs Union in the backyard, and maybe he will sign the association. As they say - Everything can be! laughing
    4. Xroft
      Xroft 3 December 2013 21: 13
      +3
      As Yanukovych said today about Eurointegration, "What kind of agreement is this when they take us and bend us down" (c) ... Eurointegrators, where are you? yesterday so actively defended .... Are you ready to bend over? wink even the Croats refused laughing
      1. Genur
        Genur 3 December 2013 21: 17
        +1
        In http://ru-an.info/ today there are two good selections on the Ukrainian issue.
        The ball was blown away и Forcing Ukraine to European love
        1. Paul 23rus
          Paul 23rus 3 December 2013 22: 36
          0
          as it is too pathetically written, in the West or something ....
      2. Ascetic
        Ascetic 3 December 2013 22: 24
        +6
        Quote: Xroft
        "What kind of agreement is this when they take us and bend us down?"


        That's right. As in the fairy tale about the Hut on chicken legs, it’s worth Yanukovych to turn in front to the CU and back to the EU, and even bend a little while ... right there the geyropeytsy strive for an uid ... to arrange a maidan.
        Today they showed a typical maydanutye on TV, asking him on camera, they say, what are the benefits of association with the EU, and he said that young people would be free to travel to Europe and see how real people live. They say to him - they say that there is nothing in the agreement about "free to travel", visas are not canceled - but he says no, they are canceling visas, we will be able to travel freely to Europe, I read the agreement and there it is.

        Enchanting ... dill MDA.
        Although we also have enough of these. I know one who bought french potatoes super-environmentally friendly in an elite supermarket at a price of 300 rubles (it was even shown on TV) Then he cooked it for two hours and it remained like a stone. I tell him, do you know that from July supplies of potatoes from the EU countries have been banned? He looks at me through the eyes of a black fish and does not believe how everything is there for people and cannot be like a guano in the hated Motherland.
        Then it turned out he had a variety made of which they made glue, that is, not food but technical. However, despite the prohibitions, the eurocart comes to our markets where people from the Caucasus sell it under the guise of Azerbaijan almost by the seller itself. Although in the same Azerbaijan, as Apollo said, private farmers are forbidden to export vegetables abroad for sale. Only resellers on wagons.
        By the way, by European product standards, I have already posted a post recently. link
        1. Papakiko
          Papakiko 3 December 2013 22: 44
          0
          Quote: Ascetic
          Although we also have enough of these. I know one who bought french potatoes super-environmentally friendly in an elite supermarket at a price of 300 rubles (it was even shown on TV) Then he cooked it for two hours and it remained like a stone.

          Dumb iPhone. Onazhzh for raw food intended! laughing
          Quote: Ascetic
          Today they showed a typical maydanutye on TV, asking him on camera, they say, what are the benefits of association with the EU, and he said that young people would be free to travel to Europe and see how real people live. They say to him - they say that there is nothing in the agreement about "free to travel", visas are not canceled - but he says no, they are canceling visas, we will be able to travel freely to Europe, I read the agreement and there it is.

          I attach the video, you can watch it entirely, but you can only "raisins" from 8 to 10 minutes. By the way, this is a new movie about great victory) there is still a series Kursk Storm.
        2. Papakiko
          Papakiko 3 December 2013 22: 46
          +4

          I did not brace myself to attach immediately.
    5. Circle
      Circle 3 December 2013 22: 54
      +2
      An ancient quote that clearly works in Ukraine with the help of geyropa and others.
      "If you want to defeat the enemy, raise his children."
    6. Gluxar_
      Gluxar_ 4 December 2013 03: 23
      -2
      Quote: makst83
      It should be understood that those who play in the Big Political Games are absolutely not interested in why (or why) people actually go outside. Their task is to use ANY popular indignation for their own purposes.
      Ukrainian politicians and oligarchs absolutely sincerely believe that it is better to have your own “piece of Ukraine”, which brings two pennies, and maintain sole control over it, than to participate in Eurasian integration processes. This logic has been around for many years, on it, in fact, the independent campaign of 22 was built years ago.
      It is correctly said that it is necessary to work directly with the people, and not with the watered "elite", using soft power!

      One can agree with this formulation of the question. But what are the tools for reaching the "people"? Should we pay loans for the people? Give gas for a pittance?
      The article is emotional and very superficial ... with some kind of sweetheart, I would even say.
      What does it mean that Russia should not interfere and not negotiate with the authorities? Does the author think that the intergovernmental agreement is an empty piece of paper? Have new ones come and rewrote everything? They cannot rewrite the gas contract for 5 years. so on the contrary you need to be Ukrainian "lesson" while lukewarm. I agree that it's not worth physically getting into the current showdown, but it's worth supporting it with information.
      Yanukovych has more strength than is needed to win. So he just waits for the opposition and its leaders to push themselves even more into the swamp by treason, and the common people will let off steam. Then he records everyone. Moreover, the protraction of protests and "seizures" also plays into the hands of the Russian Federation and Yanukovych. Some state bodies do not work, because when the cold weather hits and there is not enough gas, the opposition can be blamed for this. For loans, the same, but on the sly of selling objects of interest to Russians for loans. And then let them figure out what and how.
      And when the time comes, then already issue an invoice to the "Caucasians" for all their efforts and calmly enter the vehicle. By the way, Yanukovych is no longer a handshake in Europe, because he does not have a second door. But he needs time to get the denyuzhka out of there, he and his son, as well as the whole family. So there will be no sudden movements until spring.
  2. The comment was deleted.
  3. A.YARY
    A.YARY 3 December 2013 19: 02
    14
    All this is ridiculous and sad!
    "Why didn’t they expel diplomats who openly and brazenly took part in the rally? !!!"

    And why from the very beginning the ambassador of Ukraine was not sent as soon as on Ukraine "formed" UPA and UNSO ?? !!
    When were veterans beaten ?!
    Abused Monuments and the Flag ?!

    Khloptsi, everything is very simple - Russia has never been involved in Ukraine! Not one!
    Can anyone imagine that SyShyA would let things flow in Mexico or Canada? Let Cuba confirm my thought!

    So everything that is now being raked in Ukraine due to the inaction of the Russian authorities.
    Otherwise, the issue would have been resolved!
    1. alexdol
      alexdol 3 December 2013 19: 27
      16
      A.YARY RU "everything that is now raking in Ukraine due to the inaction of the Russian authorities."
      -------------------------------------------------- -----------
      I absolutely agree with you! Moreover, I have said many times and will repeat again: if there were RUSSIAN POWER in RUSSIA, then there would be no "Ukraine" for a long time! Today, in another place here, I said that not acting is just a CRIME! After all, "Ukraine" is essentially the same RUSSIA! By the way, some kind of agreement was even mentioned under which troops could be sent - why not do this? Wait for something - while NATO sticks here? For the return of their territories, which are now occupied by the so-called "Ukraine", you need to FIGHT, and not let everything take its course!
      And the current government and the so-called opposition are facing each other! Their place on the bunk!
    2. Civil
      Civil 3 December 2013 19: 32
      -17 qualifying.
      I hope Ukraine will fall apart.
      1. A.YARY
        A.YARY 3 December 2013 19: 46
        +4
        Vadim-YOU are wrong!
        There is no greater loss in this situation than the collapse of Ukraine.
        In the foreseeable future this will not happen, but ......
        Russia will have to piece together what was one and the smaller the piece, the more "hemorrhoids". Forgive me for being frivolous.
        Only a single entry of Ukraine into Russia can be an acceptable outcome of this "soap opera" called "Nezalezhnosti"
        1. My address
          My address 3 December 2013 20: 00
          10
          Dear Andrew! hi
          Indeed, logically, we will have to pull out the "square". And the worse it gets there, the more effort we will spend. Although the "zapadentsev" are not sorry, it is a pity that no one will take them alone.
      2. SHILO
        SHILO 3 December 2013 20: 38
        12
        Quote: Civil
        I hope Ukraine will fall apart.


        Or maybe you're right. I do not know.

        In October last year, I walked around the Carpathians (nature, what I need - I recommend). So I tell you, they have a sense in Europe - they feed there. Im our economic calculations like a goat button accordion. Will industry fall? Violet! There, besides raising sheep, embroidered shirts (I note cool ones) and cutting down these same Carpathians, there is no industry, the male population is Gaster in Europe. Will Kamunalka rise? To the shit, they drown with firewood and drink from the well. Will gas rise in price? To the light bulb! They didn’t use gas there from the birth of Christ, and they stretch out so much more. At every intersection, Catholic saints, castles - Orthodoxy and does not smell. Spin it or not, and they have a place in Europe.
        1. Alekseev
          Alekseev 3 December 2013 22: 24
          +3
          Quote: SHILO
          At every intersection, Catholic saints, castles - Orthodoxy and does not smell. Spin it or not, and they have a place in Europe.

          Absolutely accurate definition! good
          But Galicia had long been hostile
          Russian empire "Europe", is it worth it "not to let" there and now?
          But to stop financing, let Europe pay them, it is necessary.
        2. Ascetic
          Ascetic 4 December 2013 00: 19
          +4
          Quote: SHILO
          So I’ll tell you, they have a sense in Europe - they feed there. Im our economic calculations like a goat button accordion.

          Typical villagers speak about such people. ... "It's mine, it's not mine." Everything inside the courtyard is valuable. But there, behind the fence: the price is not mine. And let’s figure it out if only the hut was “hefty rich” and if it’s not possible to buy cheap or some other disagreement, then “It’s not me, tse vovk”, or maybe ... they ate all the bacon, of course. And who else? And he sincerely does not believe that damned mo ... or often do not even suspect about his existence and have not seen the notorious fat in his eyes. We lost to the French in football. So it’s again ... or they smeared the grass on the field with lard so that the lads could slide. He is the center of the universe - "Tse i -zh" his opinion is correct, because this is his opinion. "And since he is the center of the universe, everyone owes him. And - for free. Therefore, he is easily bought for any promises, moreover, for the most absurd. Promise him that mushrooms will grow on the nose, they will cook themselves and will roll into their mouth - he will believe! In the evenings on the farm after joining the EU, dumplings themselves will be sent to the mouth. Promise him that the Germans will give him a lot, a lot of money and for nothing - he will believe again. And when it doesn’t come true, it’s the mo ... or the Jews will be guilty again. So, on the Maidan there are just such villagers. We have exactly the same hamsters, only they don’t "gag" and gadgets with fur coats and other "zhopogreykami" per soul. Although they shouted calls for Jewish pogroms as well. Class, social, and mental solidarity overrides national differences.

          Madame Spector, you know, tonsils were cut out from Lizochka’s husband.
          “Poor girl, she so wanted to have children.”


          PS
          Not without reason in the criminal jargon MAYDANSCHIK is a petty swindler-speculator and holder of a secret (illegal) gambling brothel or tavern
          1. SHILO
            SHILO 4 December 2013 01: 12
            +1
            Quote: Ascetic
            Typical Selyuki speak of such.


            I completely agree.
            The answer to my post (the same content) in "VKontakte":

            Mary Magdalene
            Therefore, Ukrainians and cool people that live original. And the Russian rabble was brought to Ukraine to the place of those killed by the famine and in the wars for Moscow’s goals. Ukrainians, these copans
            I like
            28 Nov in 15: 51 | Reply

            Mary Magdalene
            All sorts of metallurgical and other factories are not needed in such quantities even now, they are needed by the pits to manage the Ukrainian government and the oligarchy. It will take a long time for Ukraine to recover under the "supervision" of the Gebny and their Daunets satellites ... It's a pity. One hope is young.
            I like
            28 Nov in 15: 55 | Reply



            There is no need to explain what "yam" and "bskoy" are.
            1. Alekseev
              Alekseev 4 December 2013 19: 30
              0
              Well, such dol .... in (I hope it is clear), to x ... (I hope it is clear) laughing
              The fact is that there were more normal ones.
      3. APASUS
        APASUS 3 December 2013 21: 13
        +3
        Quote: Civil
        I hope Ukraine will fall apart.

        I think this will lead to even greater collapse than at the moment.
        In this endless struggle for a place in the queue for the gallows, the attitude of the people itself has always been surprising. After all, the Germans will not stand up to machine tools in Ukraine and will not endure shit ... maybe for Ukrainians when they join the EU - is that really not clear ???
        1. revnagan
          revnagan 4 December 2013 13: 49
          0
          Quote: APASUS
          the Germans will not stand up to the machines in Ukraine and will not endure the crap ... mo for the Ukrainians upon joining the EU - is it really not clear ???

          Imagine, many do not understand. They say so, when the ES comes here and sees our salaries, our oligarchs will feel ashamed, they will start paying salaries normally like in Europe, and for such salaries we agree to work and raise Ukraine. It is difficult to reach the consciousness of such people. But there are a lot of them. When you ask such, why do you need this Europe, they answer, to live like there. People are not able to establish a causal relationship! They do not understand that several strong economies with a high standard of living have united in the ES. And only then they needed lackeys, ready to spit at the word "Russia" for pennies and leftovers from the master's table. But Europe does not need many lackeys, and to feed Ukraine there will not be enough leftovers, this is not the Baltics. You need to raise the economy here, to direct order on the street, do not shit in the entrances. To catch up at least to the level of Belarus (syabry, forgive me, I’m writing, as I used to in the USSR), and looking back at Europe, say: “Huh, so we already have it all. us that Europewith her gomosyatinoy? Do we have a melting democracy with boltology and tolerance at our standard of living as in Minsk? We feel so good. "But, so sweetly believes that a good western uncle will come and put things in order here with a fair hand.
      4. Paul 23rus
        Paul 23rus 3 December 2013 22: 40
        +1
        I already wrote, but for you again, I have to express my complete disagreement with you about the joy of a possible division of Ukraine.

        The division of Ukraine is the same geopolitical defeat of Russia, as the complete departure of the aforementioned Ukraine to the West!

        Well, what difference does it make to us, will NATO bases stand under Lviv or near Kharkov?

        Flight time is the same.

        This is on the one hand.

        On the other hand, as the experience of integration of Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia shows, the West can integrate any significant objects only in parts (whoever taught higher mathematics will understand what this is about!). The degree of integration pain in parts for the integration object depends on the initial conditions, but the result is always the same - this or that degree of integration, or, rather, digestion.

        It was not possible to integrate Ukraine entirely in Vilnius, but as I wanted!

        Therefore, the integration process was launched in parts, in the form of a long-tested orange scenario.

        And now, the question is: why do we need to rejoice in Russia in the possible division of Ukraine, and even more so to help in this vile matter?

        On the contrary! In every possible way, it is necessary to fight for the integrity and unity of Ukraine and peace for all the fraternal (hold laughter, cornet!) Ukrainian people!

        If we allow us to dismember Ukraine, the West will go to pieces in pieces, as Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia have already eaten.
    3. My address
      My address 3 December 2013 19: 42
      10
      Quite rightly, Andrey.
      Ambassador to Ukraine, the memorable Mikhuil Zurabov. Appointed by our guarantor as a faithful approximate. Before that, I was ruining the social network with health care. Even articles about his worthlessness did not flutter the Kremlin for several years. Well, they reappeared.
      Ukraine is a state where the underdeveloped Yushchenko or Yanukovych are elected presidents. A state in which if something does not work out, then the leaders flee to other countries to complain and beg. State under 50 million population. A related and neighboring state. And our ambassador there Mikhuil Zurabov ?! You can be stunned!
      1. A.YARY
        A.YARY 3 December 2013 19: 49
        0
        Alexander shoves his hat! hi
    4. chehywed
      chehywed 3 December 2013 19: 55
      +2
      Quote: A.YARY
      So everything that is now being raked in Ukraine due to the inaction of the Russian authorities.
      Otherwise, the issue would have been resolved!

      There are no straight roads in politics. In 1991 it was Ukraine that did not want to stay with Russia, and there was no possibility of keeping the "sister" by force in the "family". Now ... I think that Russian analysts have calculated a similar scenario for the development of events in Ukraine, therefore, Putin's reaction to what is happening is calm. And Yanukovych has become a frequent visitor to Moscow for a reason. We will see.
      1. A.YARY
        A.YARY 3 December 2013 20: 57
        +2
        Vladimir, YOU have such a small mistake, but, principally alas -
        , and there was no possibility of forceful retention of the "sister" in the "family"

        And it was inappropriately strong. Just say
        "What a little sister you came and go!"
        And on this thought about "nezalezhnost" flew away like smoke in the wind.
        BUT you didn’t forget what kind of power was Tahda in Russia in power?
        1. chehywed
          chehywed 3 December 2013 21: 42
          0
          Quote: A.YARY
          And it was inappropriately strong. Just say
          "What a little sister you came and go!"

          Well, that was it, what was the mistake?
          Quote: A.YARY
          BUT you didn’t forget what kind of power was Tahda in Russia in power?

          Every nation has a government that has it.
          1. A.YARY
            A.YARY 3 December 2013 21: 54
            +1
            Vladimir, you probably don’t know
            Well, that was it, what was the mistake?

            that all the so-called eastern regions of Ukraine were transferred to that sister by comrade Khrushchev? And part of the Crimea was generally the Krasnodar Territory?
            Learn the story, be interested in your country and will be rewarded YOU.
            1. chehywed
              chehywed 3 December 2013 22: 01
              -1
              Quote: A.YARY
              Vladimir, you probably don’t know that all the so-called eastern regions of Ukraine were handed over to this sister by Comrade Khrushchev?

              My friend A. YARY, for some reason it seems to me that for me it was not a secret when you had not yet gone to school. I will explain why:
              Vladimir, you probably don’t know that everything, the so-called eastern regions of Ukraine, was handed over to this sister by Comrade Khrushchev?
              Something like this ...
              Quote: A.YARY
              Learn the story, be interested in your country and will be rewarded YOU.

              Yeah, I ran for a tutor. Exclusively in the hope that the Creator will appreciate my endeavor.
    5. 222222
      222222 3 December 2013 20: 18
      +1
      A. YARYY Today, 19:02 New
      It's all funny and sad! "
      Why has the Russian Ambassador been appointed NOT cadre diplomats to Ukraine since 2001?
      http://embrus.org.ua/ru/posol
    6. mihasik
      mihasik 3 December 2013 20: 26
      +2
      Pancake! Are they small children, so that Russia decides everything for them ?! Berezovsky, etc. what did the people kick out of the country? There is no leader in Ukraine. And the mind ..? In my opinion they outwitted themselves ...
  4. queen
    queen 3 December 2013 19: 04
    0
    I think it is necessary to hold a referendum in RUSSIA ... not to pick up, but to defend the Crimea.
    1. corn
      corn 3 December 2013 19: 49
      +9
      Ukraine is a sovereign state, today Crimea is part of sovereign Ukraine.
      You that you want to mention the word Ukraine in the Russian referendum to push away from us not only those who are turning or have turned to face us, but also our allies.
      You are a typical provocateur who does not care about Russia.
      1. queen
        queen 4 December 2013 14: 04
        0
        Quote: corn
        those who are turning or have already turned to face us

        And who did you say nothing backwards ... Putin’s provocateurs lack
  5. Migari
    Migari 3 December 2013 19: 09
    +4
    Ukraine, as a subject of politics, will be dealt with not earlier than in a few years, when the republic passes through a series of riots, electoral crises and changes of elites, after which, at last, there will be at least some kind of subject.
    More precisely, you can’t say it, the constant shyness of Yanukovych and the Ukrainian government, constant bidding, then with Russia and then with the European Union, until they decide and get off one stool, two fail.
  6. Migari
    Migari 3 December 2013 19: 09
    +1
    Ukraine, as a subject of politics, will be dealt with not earlier than in a few years, when the republic passes through a series of riots, electoral crises and changes of elites, after which, at last, there will be at least some kind of subject.
    More precisely, you can’t say it, the constant shyness of Yanukovych and the Ukrainian government, constant bidding, then with Russia and then with the European Union, until they decide and get off one stool, two fail.
  7. Evp Kolovrat
    Evp Kolovrat 3 December 2013 19: 13
    +8
    All this looks very sad for Ukraine, and for Russia.
    1. EdwardTich68
      EdwardTich68 3 December 2013 21: 12
      -1
      There is nothing bad for Russia, it will get its industrial areas back. And Poland
      get the zapadentsev brothers.
    2. AVV
      AVV 3 December 2013 22: 11
      +2
      Donets’s just need to turn on Donetsk! There’s no place to throw it, for them one wedge! Or they’ll lose their capital in the west, or they will lose industry in Ukraine! What’s more important for them! I think that in factories they will be able to earn capital, and by losing enterprises, they will lose everything !!!
      1. MG42
        MG42 3 December 2013 22: 25
        +4
        There is a third option to invest in offshore capital in the modernization of their enterprises, reaching a new competitive level of production. But this will deprive them of superprofits = oligarchs toad strangle.
        This is a chimerical slogan of the current government “We are building Europe in Ukraine!”. Then to bargain with the EU and Russia at a new level.
        Separately, it is easier to derban.
        Build the USSR 2.0, too, they will not understand why.
  8. Andrey57
    Andrey57 3 December 2013 19: 21
    +1
    Euromaidan was dispersed extremely hard - with blood, beating speed bumps and in the middle of the night

    The author should not shed crocodile tears about "extreme cruelty", the Kiev police did not put things in order in kindergarten, cobblestones, flares and a bulldozer are quite a sufficient reason to open fire to kill almost any police in the world, if you don't take it into account at all, that all this was planned and paid for by the kids from the EU, whom the GDP washed specifically, from which they rage. The most interesting thing is that Mr. Obama and the entire slap-company from the State Department amicably stuck their tongues into the source of "jam", therefore, Russia, in this case, confidently wins, whatever the author of this opus is babbling there. I give the article a bold minus.
    1. Jogan-xnumx
      Jogan-xnumx 3 December 2013 22: 45
      +2
      Who did you minus so? fool
      One minus I will fix. drinks
      1. vasiliysxx
        vasiliysxx 3 December 2013 23: 44
        0
        I support, plus.
  9. The comment was deleted.
  10. The comment was deleted.
  11. Bober
    Bober 3 December 2013 19: 31
    +7
    I'm sorry for the people. A whole generation spent life shy from side to side. And this pendulum is far from dying out yet. People are rams, and shepherds are scum.
  12. The comment was deleted.
  13. Gecko
    Gecko 3 December 2013 19: 38
    +2
    It is necessary not to oversleep the situation, as much as possible to facilitate the relocation to Russia, employment and citizenship of people from Ukraine.
    1. morpex
      morpex 4 December 2013 00: 10
      +3
      [quote = Gecko] It’s necessary not to oversleep the situation, as much as possible to ease the relocation, employment, and citizenship of people from Ukraine to Russia.



      Do you really think it's all that bad here? And where to go? From the fire to the fire? Do you even for a minute imagine what it is like to throw everything at one moment and leave? .Moscow is not rubber all will not accommodate, and to master Siberia and so who wants to go. Guys! Yes, uvas your problems a bunch and nah you Ukraine with its killed infrastructure? And the way out here is easier than a steamed turnip. We give you us. How not to twist and Ukraine is by and large an agricultural country. We give you products and you order us for our capacities. Build together fleet, tanks, airplanes, etc. And no handouts in the form of loans to our powers that be. They will steal from stsuki ... The question is, is it necessary for this to "enter" somewhere? The French are building "Mistrals" for you (I still won't give you a hollow Why do you need them, last century) and there is no vehicle with them. But you never know examples.
      And it is hare here all sorts of "strategists" to trade in Ukraine, we will take it away, we will give it back. Do you have such nonsense to speak on the spot? (I'm not your respected Gecko) Bzezhinsky nervously smokes after such statements ...
  14. bublic82009
    bublic82009 3 December 2013 19: 47
    0
    all write such scripts.
  15. Christian
    Christian 3 December 2013 20: 00
    +8
    Russia, Ukraine and Belarus are parts of a single Russian World. By the example of what is happening, one can easily track the development vectors of each of the states and the results of following them over 20 years of temporary separation. The Russian Federation and Ukraine have been and are on the path of the pro-Western liberal (alien and therefore destructive for us) imposed on us path. The results are obvious: the lack of an independent policy and the collapse of the internal production base and the Village, the moral and moral degradation of the people. Belarus, fortunately, led by the Patriot of its people, Lukashenko, is following the path of Development in all senses and directions, although they have an order of magnitude less resources than Russia. Belarusian society is strikingly and for the better different from the Russian Federation and Ukraine. The collapse of Russia and Ukraine is inevitable, if we do not take an example from Belarus. This is Belarus!
    1. EdwardTich68
      EdwardTich68 3 December 2013 20: 17
      +2
      What other example from Belarus will Luke leave and everything will begin to crumble.
      1. Angry reader
        Angry reader 3 December 2013 20: 37
        +1
        May God give our calf a wolf to eat (s)
      2. The comment was deleted.
  16. gorgo
    gorgo 3 December 2013 20: 18
    14
    The trouble is that even after 20 years of intensified anti-Russian brainwashing of the population (and especially young people!), Pro-Russian sentiments are still very strong in Ukraine. But for some reason the leadership of the Russian Federation does nothing to work directly with the people. Virtually no information campaign is being conducted that would promote the ideas of the Russian world. Everything is subordinated to some "pragmatic interests". Why, with such financial and other opportunities, a normal pro-Russian political force has not yet been raised in Ukraine, capable of offering its own vector of development? Is there really not a single promising politician among the 46 million who could make a normal pro-Russian presidential candidate? I don’t understand that ... As a result, we are losing the information war completely. Already today, it is difficult for zombie young people to explain what the Russian people are in general, and why we should all be together with our brothers. They just don't get it. They have in their heads only multi-colored balls of European values, which have been actively painted with Western money over the past 20 years. I understand that Moscow is fighting for Ukraine by putting pressure on the corrupt oligarchy in power. But people don't understand this! They perceive the pressure of the Kremlin as pressure on them personally! "If we are brothers, then why does Russia sell us gas at exorbitant prices ?!" And I don't know what to answer them.
    But it is surprising that even in such conditions half of the people still have not lost their Russian spirit, for which, I believe, they are honored and praised! You there in Russia do not understand the conditions under which you now have to live with us in Little Russia, when to doubt the inviolability of European integration and to advocate rapprochement with Russia means signing either your own ignorance or madness. When not a single prominent politician is campaigning for an alliance with Russian brothers. When all the media, all TV channels have been talking about "Ukraine", "Ukrainian Mov" and European values ​​for decades.
    1. CTEPX
      CTEPX 3 December 2013 20: 26
      0
      Quote: gorgo
      After 20 years of intensified anti-Russian brainwashing to the population (especially youth!) in Ukraine, pro-Russian sentiments are still very strong.

      In your phrase, the word "in Ukraine" can be easily replaced by "in Russia."
      Do you think that if we have Putin, then we have already won? Only a year and a half ago, it seemed to some that Russia was already gone. In addition, we still have to educate Putin and educate)). Like him - us)).
      1. Angry reader
        Angry reader 4 December 2013 12: 21
        0
        ..How did it cover you ..- one and a half or two years ago)))
        Go teach)) ..- how to teach, write))
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Theophanes
      Theophanes 3 December 2013 22: 43
      +6
      I completely agree with every word! The people of Ukraine are stupefied by euro-deceivers, and the zurab loafer and pro-European! He doesn’t move a finger to stand up for the Russians in Ukraine, he can sink it.
    4. Christian
      Christian 4 December 2013 05: 21
      0
      Alas! But in the Russian Federation, the same shitcrats are in power without a "flag and homeland" as in Ukraine ... They don't do any of this at home ...
  17. gorgo
    gorgo 3 December 2013 20: 18
    +4
    The trouble is that even after 20 years of intensified anti-Russian brainwashing of the population (and especially young people!), Pro-Russian sentiments are still very strong in Ukraine. But for some reason the leadership of the Russian Federation does nothing to work directly with the people. Virtually no information campaign is being conducted that would promote the ideas of the Russian world. Everything is subordinated to some "pragmatic interests". Why, with such financial and other opportunities, a normal pro-Russian political force has not yet been raised in Ukraine, capable of offering its own vector of development? Is there really not a single promising politician among the 46 million who could make a normal pro-Russian presidential candidate? I don’t understand that ... As a result, we are losing the information war completely. Already today, it is difficult for zombie young people to explain what the Russian people are in general, and why we should all be together with our brothers. They just don't get it. They have in their heads only multi-colored balls of European values, which have been actively painted with Western money over the past 20 years. I understand that Moscow is fighting for Ukraine by putting pressure on the corrupt oligarchy in power. But people don't understand this! They perceive the pressure of the Kremlin as pressure on them personally! "If we are brothers, then why does Russia sell us gas at exorbitant prices ?!" And I don't know what to answer them.
    But it is surprising that even in such conditions half of the people still have not lost their Russian spirit, for which, I believe, they are honored and praised! You there in Russia do not understand the conditions under which you now have to live with us in Little Russia, when to doubt the inviolability of European integration and to advocate rapprochement with Russia means signing either your own ignorance or madness. When not a single prominent politician is campaigning for an alliance with Russian brothers. When all the media, all TV channels have been talking about "Ukraine", "Ukrainian Mov" and European values ​​for decades.
    1. Anper
      Anper 4 December 2013 02: 09
      +1
      Greetings from Western Ukraine. I don’t know how Zurabov was, and Cyril (the patriarch) scored nails with us. A couple of years ago I came several times, saw enough on the way local schizophrenics screaming, weeping and twisting figs into the car window, all sorts of Protestant the chapels and churches of the UOC MP became larger. The old ones were repaired, new ones began to be built. Looks like we’re almost in the yard — the charm of how beautiful the church of St. Xenia of Petersburg is, from a material point of view — everything is fine, and the sea goes by. When Yushchen didn’t dream of this, they built giant UAOC cathedrals, but rats climbed into all the cracks sects, to the most expensive houses in the city center. And the activists got them sweaty in the streets, but then they went out something, just wandering around like ghosts. Although, maybe someone sweaty American munching a couple of disappointments went.
  18. EdwardTich68
    EdwardTich68 3 December 2013 20: 20
    -3
    I read a strange statement, saying that the issue of replacing Negroes, Arabs and Gypsies with more highly qualified Ukrainians has long ripened in the EU. Question: where do tens of millions of Africans go?
    1. Yarosvet
      Yarosvet 3 December 2013 21: 38
      -3
      Quote: EdwardTich68
      Question: where do tens of millions of Africans go?
  19. Grey68
    Grey68 3 December 2013 20: 20
    +3
    The article is of course cynical to the limit, but everything is in order with the logic in it. Such an option is quite possible, I would not want to.
  20. Grey68
    Grey68 3 December 2013 20: 20
    0
    The article is of course cynical to the limit, but everything is in order with the logic in it. Such an option is quite possible, I would not want to.
  21. The comment was deleted.
  22. Revolver
    Revolver 3 December 2013 20: 24
    +2
    That's sad - in fact, there is no choice. Not only between good and bad, but even between bad and very bad. All the options that the author painted are very bad.
    So, the collapse of Ukraine may be a lesser evil for Russia, although, as the author noted, a disaster for Ukraine. Russia will receive industrial east and south with the Black Sea, and possibly the center. And the west will go to ... that will be the question. It is clear that they would like to go back to Austria, but the current Austrians are not the same as under the Habsburgs, this hemorrhoids did not give them up. Poles, Hungarians, Romanians? Or an independent Galicia? Or maybe they twitch and decide that Russia is after all, and that would not know how well, but at least the least of all evils.
  23. MG42
    MG42 3 December 2013 20: 44
    +3
    About the collapse >>
    The administration of Yanukovych was blocked again at these minutes, the Rada and the Cabinet of Ministers were blocked, like a golden eagle, explosives and protesters. Yanukovych himself flew to China, because in Kiev he is not comfortable staying recently. No.
    This is a view of st. Banking on the other hand, not where there was a picture with a tractor enlarge the picture open with the right mouse button.
  24. vania122
    vania122 3 December 2013 21: 00
    +3
    Quote: makst83

    It is correctly said that you need to work directly with the people

    If we consider the Ukrainians to be Russians, then we need to accept them in Russia as Russians. Citizenship is ...
  25. vania122
    vania122 3 December 2013 21: 00
    +1
    Quote: makst83

    It is correctly said that you need to work directly with the people

    If we consider the Ukrainians to be Russians, then we need to accept them in Russia as Russians. Citizenship is ...
  26. Boris63
    Boris63 3 December 2013 21: 07
    0
    Subscribe to Europe Yanukovych is now not allowed at all. Now it will be supercabal conditions, with Russia - both orange and geyropa will rage. T.ch. he fell into a stalemate position or it is necessary to somehow restore the location of the east and south of Ukraine. Nobody needs the collapse of Ukraine, and Russia and Europe want everything. Russia has never announced the takeover of Ukraine, but Europe ....
  27. The comment was deleted.
  28. Stinger
    Stinger 3 December 2013 21: 14
    0
    I do not know if post is + or -. Usually such a "democracy" ends with a dictatorship.
  29. Andrey Peter
    Andrey Peter 3 December 2013 21: 38
    +5
    [quote = gorgo] The trouble is that even after 20 years of intensified anti-Russian brainwashing, the pro-Russian sentiments are still very strong in Ukraine (especially young people!) in Ukraine. But for some reason the Russian leadership does nothing to work directly with the people. There is practically no information campaign that promotes ideas.
    I completely agree with you, but apparently the authorities do not give a damn about the opinion of the peoples. They conceal other laws and more economic ones. Someone snarls more. The more I write, the more thoughts, but what's the point? Therefore round off hi
  30. vasiliysxx
    vasiliysxx 3 December 2013 21: 46
    +2
    Some migrant workers will be able to absorb the EU market, in which a plan has long been ripening for replacing Arab, gypsy and African illegal immigrants with white, loyal and well-educated migrants

    the feeling is not good, where then will the gypsies rush with blacks? Guard!
  31. cabakaaaa
    cabakaaaa 3 December 2013 22: 10
    +5
    An entertaining video, look who, and most importantly how, you are led, gentlemen of the Ukrainians, and think again!

    http://politobzor.net/show-8980-anatomiya-protesta-po-ukrainski.html
    1. SHILO
      SHILO 3 December 2013 23: 04
      0
      Very entertaining video - thanks. hi
  32. serge
    serge 3 December 2013 22: 53
    +1
    Strange conclusions in the article. The territory of Ukraine, they say, will pull to the West, and Russia must accept the runaway population. It is possible in another way, to accept territories that do not want one state with Galicia. Crimeans are now declaring that if Yanukovych is illegally toured, Crimea will depart from Ukraine.
  33. alone
    alone 3 December 2013 23: 03
    +5
    do not get into this showdown. Yanukovych already got everyone with his thieves and crooks. Therefore, there is no proper support for him even in the East. The Ukrainians themselves will figure it out and make their choice.
  34. Jogan-xnumx
    Jogan-xnumx 3 December 2013 23: 15
    +5
    What a coward it is! This Yanukovych ... Accustomed to measure the Donetsk Ponte that the loot decides everything. Dohitrzhopopilsya with his gang! am The cops feel sorry for the guys for his stupidity, cowardice and spinelessness grabbed with cobblestones. soldier And you can’t answer this Bandera’s bragging!
    This one is thirsty for a European choice:
    1. Cristall
      Cristall 4 December 2013 12: 57
      -1
      good sense of humour) repeat
  35. The comment was deleted.
  36. I. Timofeev
    I. Timofeev 4 December 2013 00: 15
    0
    I propose reading the most interesting material on what happened in Ukraine, published on the website Russian Sunday http://www.voskres.ru/taina/kornilov.htm

    You will not regret the truthful reporting of events - everything is put in its place and confirmed
  37. Ross
    Ross 4 December 2013 00: 18
    +1
    Quote: Alekseev
    Here's something to prove, like "in Russia, too, but the Asians and Moldovans are even worse, and Ukraine is harmed by enemies, the main Putin, but Europe will help us," these are amateurs. Not all, of course, but very many.

    This is all genetics ... Remember throwing the Cossacks.
  38. Ross
    Ross 4 December 2013 00: 18
    0
    Quote: Alekseev
    Here's something to prove, like "in Russia, too, but the Asians and Moldovans are even worse, and Ukraine is harmed by enemies, the main Putin, but Europe will help us," these are amateurs. Not all, of course, but very many.

    This is all genetics ... Remember throwing the Cossacks.
  39. Federal
    Federal 4 December 2013 00: 41
    -5
    As long as there is Ukraine, it is an awl in the ass of Russia, and this awl must be removed. If everyone understands this in the Kremlin, and even more so ,,, it is clear to everyone that Khokhlyandia is not a tenant, now if everything happens again in the elections in a year or two, Yakubovich will go to Donetsk and be the king there, some people's deputy will ask Pu on behalf of the South East. " then stabilize with troops "and start ... And no strong Hohlandia of Russia is needed, enough rubbish, you really need to crush along the Dnieper, if you don't want guerrilla warfare with these fucking ... in the Carpathians up to 20 ...
    Conclusion, the leadership of Pu and the company will take a course towards boosting the country in a good way, with the prospect of felling the whole country in 2 parts, and they will generally do it right, the states will not climb, nuclear weapons have not been canceled, there will be problems, but the game is worth the candle, Pu the Great Unifier! This is not Khuhra Mukhra, for it is the monuments and canonization, etc. Here is his dream, I think this is the beginning, but as if all the same, World War 3 had not come out, everything would be on the verge ....
  40. Onil
    Onil 4 December 2013 01: 45
    +2
    Unfortunately, time doesn’t work for us. As a result of Yushchenko’s reforms, the next generation in Ukraine will not speak Russian. The only way out is to divide the country as soon as possible!
  41. Onil
    Onil 4 December 2013 01: 45
    0
    Unfortunately, time doesn’t work for us. As a result of Yushchenko’s reforms, the next generation in Ukraine will not speak Russian. The only way out is to divide the country as soon as possible!
  42. Russ69
    Russ69 4 December 2013 02: 07
    +1
    Quote: Onil
    The only way out is the speedy partition of the country!

    The collapse of the country to wish, not ice of course. But Ukraine is too different. It can really be divided by itself into West and East. Then everything will settle down ... The main thing is that the process goes peacefully ...
    In another way, I just don’t know how ...
  43. piotr534
    piotr534 4 December 2013 02: 09
    0
    Author Semyon Uralov
    Article minus. Some sort of a heap of controversial and sometimes even delusional theses. The depth of analysis did not flash. request
  44. Prishtina
    Prishtina 4 December 2013 03: 03
    0
    [quote = morpex] [quote = Gecko] We must not oversleep the situation, as much as possible ease the relocation, employment and citizenship of people from Ukraine to Russia.


    Guys! Yes, uvas your problems a bunch and nah you Ukraine with its killed infrastructure? And the way out here is easier than a steamed turnip. We give you us. How not to twist and Ukraine is by and large an agricultural country. We give you products and you order us for our capacities. Build together fleet, tanks, airplanes, etc. And no handouts in the form of loans to our powers that be. They will steal from stsuki ... The question is, is it necessary for this to "enter" somewhere? The French are building "Mistrals" for you (I still won't give you a hollow Why do you need them, last century) and there is no vehicle with them. But you never know examples.
    [/ Quote]

    Sorry .. and you will give us products for that .. brotherly supply will be ..
    otherwise it’s like in Yanukovych’s dreams ..
    1. Do you give us products for our budget?
    2. power, can we load you for our budget?
    3. weapons to do together .. hmmm .. it was necessary 10-15 years ago or even not to stop. and now the share of Russian components of import substitutes from Ukraine is striving for 100% in the production of military and technical equipment
    4. Yes, they are building Franks .. and very quickly, not as an example (including the USC), but why are they needed .. hmm see Syria .. Syrian express ..
  45. shinobi
    shinobi 4 December 2013 04: 15
    0
    There is a feeling that Yanyk Maidan will blow up. And most likely will do it following the example of a swamp. It may be more rude and cynical. Europe will tryndit and calm down, once again.
    1. Corsair
      Corsair 4 December 2013 13: 14
      0
      Quote: shinobi
      There is a feeling that Yanyk Maidan will blow up. And most likely will do it following the example of a swamp. It may be more rude and cynical. Europe will tryndit and calm down, once again.

      At the moment, the authorities are organizing the transport of people from the regions to Kiev to demonstrate support for the government’s course. They bring ordinary people, not militants.

      And there is deja vu on the events of 2004 of the year, but then Yanukovych was not in power, that is, he could not use it to restore order ...
      But now, why pull people into a showdown, hiding behind them?
      The authorities are obliged to resolve the problem created by itself without reliance on the masses.
  46. vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 4 December 2013 06: 21
    +2
    in fact, those who hang out on the streets and squares of Kiev now are not Ukrainians, or, shall we say, not quite normal people. All normal people work on weekdays, they need to feed their families. And those who hang out are idlers and screamers. The revolution is shouting, Who? again, who has no mind. They did not study well at school, if they do not remember, after any revolution the people live even worse than before the revolution. And not the fact that the new government will lead the country to prosperity, the example of Libya, the example of Egypt. Although, of course, it is the "Ukrainians" who consider themselves to be the smartest, dementia always gives rise to overestimated self-esteem.
  47. boris697
    boris697 4 December 2013 06: 34
    +2
    Ukraine is trying to sit on two chairs - both ours and yours. It will not work.
  48. The comment was deleted.
  49. solovald
    solovald 4 December 2013 06: 38
    0
    It must be admitted that the social activity of the masses is surprising. Whatever she explains. It seems that there (RF) and there (Ukrainian.) - "brothers-Slavs", but the reaction to the unpopular measures of the rulers is completely different.
  50. ATATA
    ATATA 4 December 2013 06: 59
    0
    All this is strange! request
    The author writes about the collapse of the state of Ukraine and immediately writes that in 2,3 years, they say, it will be reborn in a parliamentary republic. Yes, there will not be any revival, there will be an epic collapse and absorption by neighbors, and another piece of Belarus will go to it.