Military Review

Dangerous flight of Americans from Manas to Aktau

167
Dangerous flight of Americans from Manas to AktauIn preparation for the withdrawal of its troops from Afghanistan, Washington does not want to leave the region and intends to transfer its military base from the Kyrgyz airport Manas to the Kazakh port on the Caspian Sea Aktau. Kazakhstan risks becoming one of the hundreds of countries where the Americans have established their military presence. At present, defense cooperation between Kazakhstan and the United States has already assumed a long-term character and is conducted on the basis of five-year planning. The five-year cooperation plan for 2013-2017 years was signed in Washington in November 2012. True, it does not say about the deployment of military bases on the Kazakh territory - the American-Kazakh military cooperation, according to the plan, is focused on cooperation in such areas as military education and peacemaking. Only here it is very difficult to find examples of American peacekeeping all over the world - the US military operations in Iraq and Afghanistan cannot be considered peacekeeping.


As you know, America spends almost as much on the army and armaments as all the other states of the planet combined. At 2014 fiscal year, the Pentagon is asking for 526,6 billion dollars from the congress, in fact, the US Department of Defense can get about 475 billion dollars. A significant part of these expenses is intended to finance an extensive network of permanent American bases covering all continents, as if the United States is going to fight the whole world. The Pentagon is the owner or tenant of hundreds of military bases abroad in all parts of the world, with the exception of Antarctica. The US military, once set foot in a foreign territory, rarely then leaves it at will; they remained even in Germany after its unification. Kyrgyz airport Manas will enter history as an example of the evacuation of Americans against their wishes.

American military aviation must leave Manas on July 11, 2014. The corresponding note from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Kyrgyzstan with an official notice of termination of the base was handed over last week to the US ambassador in Bishkek. Recall that the Manas air base began operating in December 2001, almost simultaneously with the start of the operation of the international coalition in Afghanistan. In 2009, then-President of Kyrgyzstan Kurmanbek Bakiyev was about to close the base, his decision was approved by parliament. However, soon the Americans increased the rent by almost five times, and the air base remained, replacing the sign with the more presentable name “Transit Transportation Center”. Now Washington, in an attempt to save its face, says that it is inexpedient to maintain military transport in the same amount after the withdrawal of US troops from Afghanistan in 2014, but the States are actively looking for a new place for their military base in Central Asia. So, getting the Americans consent to use the Aktau base is one of the possible compensations for their loss of the base in Kyrgyzstan. Having flown from Manas to Aktau, according to the calculations of the Americans, you can not only get the shortest transportation route, but also shake Russia's position in the region and help weaken the SCO, CSTO, and the Customs Union.

Back in April, 2013, at the conference of foreign ministers of the Istanbul process on Afghanistan, Nursultan Nazarbayev, said that Kazakhstan was ready to open the port of Aktau for NATO cargo to complete the Enduring Freedom mission in Afghanistan. Until the final decision to terminate the American presence at the base in Manas, the topic of using the port of Aktau then did not arise. The signature of the President of Kazakhstan under the Agreement on Security Cooperation in the Caspian Sea, reached by the leaders of the five Caspian littoral states 18 in November 2010 in Baku, in principle, should exclude Astana’s consent to provide its port Aktau for deployment at a local airport of the US military base. The very first article of this document ratified by Kazakhstan defines that “ensuring security in the Caspian Sea is the prerogative of the Caspian states”. Astana did not withdraw from this Agreement, but even if it were going to do it, it is obliged to adhere to its obligations before the expiration of 12 months after notification of such a decision. By this time there should be no Americans in Afghanistan. At least, those who should be evacuated will already be far away from Aktau, and from Central Asia in general.

If you look at the timetable for the withdrawal of American troops from Afghanistan, it will become absolutely obvious that after July 2014, when the lease period for the Manas airbase will be terminated, the United States will not need cargo transportation through Aktau, the main part of the antiterrorist coalition should have left Afghanistan. Therefore, recent statements by officials from the Ministry of Defense of Kazakhstan on participation in helping peacekeeping forces in order to maintain peace and order in Afghanistan are not very clear - we can talk about supporting the planned continuation of the US military presence in the DRA at nine bases with the remaining 10-12 thousand people ... And, of course, at this stage of the American occupation of Afghanistan, US troops are not going to solve peacekeeping tasks, they will fight to preserve America’s influence. It turns out that the Kazakh military, giving Aktau at their disposal, will help them in this? In vain, Rafik Tairov, head of the Directorate of the Center for Military Strategic Studies of the Ministry of Defense of Kazakhstan, reassures the public by saying that the presence of Americans in Aktau means only the transfer of not combat cargo, but mainly building materials, furniture and kitchen utensils. How they fail to withstand the criticism and assurances of the Kazakh general staff that the base in Aktau does not affect the interests of Russia in Central Asia.

In the documents of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization, it is not difficult to find a requirement to stop using the Manas airbase. This issue is also present in the decisions of the CSTO. All members of both organizations are well aware that no one was going to secure the right to permanently lease the Americans of Manas Airport for all time. In Kyrgyzstan, there is also a Russian airbase - in Kant, where attack aircraft of the RF Air Force are based, which are part of the collective security forces, where the Kazakh armed forces are also represented. For the Pentagon to remain in Kyrgyzstan, and after the withdrawal of its troops from Afghanistan, it means to throw a direct challenge to the interests of Russia.

According to the US Embassy in Astana, the cooperation between NATO and Kazakhstan is of a purely commercial nature, in which contractors transport goods for the American troops through the Northern Distribution Network. At the same time, less than 1% of cargo is being exported from Afghanistan through Aktau. So what's the commercial interest?

Washington’s assurances that the Americans will limit themselves to the creation of a transit center in Aktau look more like a cover for solving another task - ensuring the US military presence directly at the border with Russia. Distance from Aktau to Astrakhan 363 km, 40 minutes of flight in a passenger plane. Placing a contingent of US forces here would be an unprecedented step. In this way, the Americans would very much like to demonstrate to the world their disregard for the role of Russia in the Caspian region and to make an attempt to gain access to the Caspian oil and gas resources. The already fragile regional security architecture is staggering. And what do the statements of the Minister of Defense of Kazakhstan Adilbek Dzhaksybekov, who, at a recent meeting with his American counterpart Charles Hagel, point to in common with Astana and the Pentagon, an understanding of the issues of strengthening peace and stability, in these conditions?

Russia, as the successor of the USSR, assumed responsibility for stability in Central Asia not only in connection with threats emanating from Afghanistan. The regional hegemony of the United States and NATO in Central Asia and the security of Russia are incompatible. Speech on the establishment of any "parity" in the military balance between Russia and the West in this region can not be. In the 12 years of NATO’s presence in Afghanistan, it was already clear that American foreign policy in this region of the world, neglecting the interests of Afghanistan, India and Russia neighboring Afghanistan, failed. This strategy has no future in Central Asia.
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  1. major071
    major071 23 November 2013 07: 49
    15
    The presence of Americans in Aktau means only the transfer of not combat cargo, but mainly building materials, furniture and kitchen utensils.

    Are they going to open a building materials and furniture store? Yes, there are in my opinion enough of their stores.
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 23 November 2013 07: 57
      18
      Let’s just let the pendos sit down, but they strive to lie down right there.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 23 November 2013 12: 20
        +9
        Quote: Ingvar 72
        Let’s just let the pendos sit down, but they strive to lie down right there.

        From the series "Granny give me a drink of water, otherwise you want to eat so much that there is nowhere to sleep" laughing
        1. max702
          max702 23 November 2013 12: 40
          -6
          The only question is how profitable it is for the Kazakhs, how much they will pay and how much more than the nishtyaks from joining the TS .. Until they bargain, but then what decision will be made ..
          RS: I like the Kazakhs because of their healthy pragmatism, from everything that can be profitable and allowed to develop YOUR country, you need Baikonur, here’s the price tag, please .. sign the same thing again, and the head is with them for many years with a firm hand and rules with a cold head and does everything right ..
          1. Zymran
            Zymran 23 November 2013 12: 48
            -14 qualifying.
            Yes, there is no pragmatism in the actions of our government. If they were guided by the interests of Kazakhstan, then there would be no TS and CES.

            The vehicle is beneficial to the ruling elite of the country for maintaining and maintaining its power based on Russia.
            1. Jet
              Jet 23 November 2013 16: 36
              +1
              and 90% of Kazakhstanis (precisely Kazakhstanis, not just Kazakhs) understand this, but cannot do anything ...
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 23 November 2013 18: 22
                +1
                Quote: Jet
                and 90% of Kazakhstanis

                can you even bring statistics?
            2. biglow
              biglow 23 November 2013 18: 35
              +9
              Quote: Zymran
              Yes, there is no pragmatism in the actions of our government. If they were guided by the interests of Kazakhstan, then there would be no TS and CES.

              The vehicle is beneficial to the ruling elite of the country for maintaining and maintaining its power based on Russia.

              and what do you dislike about the vehicle?
            3. xetai9977
              xetai9977 23 November 2013 21: 32
              +4
              Kazakh Zymran does not want his country's membership in the CU and the CES, apparently having experienced all the "delights" of being there, and towards him there are disadvantages, they say, "sit and be silent, it is not profitable for you, but it is profitable for us, you will endure, you will not go anywhere" ... Something like this can be understood as the rejection of the majority of opinions of residents of Kazakhstan.
          2. waisson
            waisson 23 November 2013 19: 04
            -1
            It’s advantageous if the Kazakh military did not study at the Russian military academies, but in the US military in the states
            1. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 24 November 2013 19: 36
              +4
              Quote: waisson
              h Kazakh military to study not in the Russian military academies but in amer in the states

              They study there and there. In terms of practice, this is understandable.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Migari
        Migari 23 November 2013 16: 19
        21
        Yes, try etching later.
    2. w.ebdo.g
      w.ebdo.g 23 November 2013 11: 03
      13
      Apparently amers are very interested in Iran. Therefore, they do not leave the Caspian. Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan are also cut off, and if the democratic revolution begins there, then Kazakhstan may simply long agree on the deployment of CSTO troops for help or not allow it to use its territory to transfer troops to the territory of these countries.
      and Iran connects us directly with India (short sea route). So we can carry our pipe to India ... and this is completely collapse for the Amers and the British.
      Everyone knows that for more than 300 years England has been waging a war with Russia (by the wrong hands), categorically preventing us from entering India.
      Why are they so worried about India? I don’t understand myself, to be honest, but nevertheless such a struggle is taking place ...
      this decision immediately kills a bunch of rabbits, but I hope that the leadership of our country will find adequate solutions and will influence those who have long been given a pee ...))) wink
      Apparently, Putin anticipated such a decision, so he gave the command to build his own cosmodrome, and not to rely on Kazakhstan's Baikonur. Apparently our president’s intelligence works well))
      I think so
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 23 November 2013 13: 19
        +9
        Quote: w.ebdo.g
        Apparently amers are very interested in Iran. Therefore, they do not leave the Caspian. Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan are also cut off, and if the democratic revolution begins there, then Kazakhstan may simply long agree on the deployment of CSTO troops for help or not allow it to use its territory to transfer troops to the territory of these countries.

        So it is, the Yankees rustle with dollars in front of the natives and lie about transit, but in fact they are preparing bridgeheads for the invasion.
        In Kazakhstan and Central Asia, the population is diverse and you can always find outsiders who are ready to cut anyone for greenbacks.
        Vivid examples of population bleeding are Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yugoslavia.
        Who guarantees that half a million Kazakh Uzbeks will not demand "the creation of a sovereign state" tomorrow and take up arms?
        As soon as the massacre begins, a horde of armed mercenaries, "fighters for faith and democracy" will pour from the Yusov military bases there, as in Syria, Serbia, Libya.
      2. knn54
        knn54 23 November 2013 13: 58
        +7
        -w.ebdo.g: Apparently Amer is very interested in Iran.
        This is a stage in the creation of the "New Great Silk Road" as opposed to Russia and China. Having established themselves in the port, the Yankes will finally be able to encircle Iran from all sides. In the south, west and east of this country, respectively, in the Persian Gulf, Turkey and Afghanistan, there are already American bases. The States will be able to almost completely control Tehran's trade relations, including with Kazakhstan. The US gets a COMPLETE military presence in Central Asia, the Caspian and Transcaucasia. A good argument in negotiations with Iran ...
        PS If the Americans use Aktau as a base for invading Iran, Kazakhstan itself may be under attack.
        1. Andrey57
          Andrey57 23 November 2013 14: 55
          +3
          They will not be able to use Aktau to invade or attack Iran, it is problematic for them to fly there - only through Georgia and Azerbaijan, besides this, they also need to agree with Turkmenistan, but there Iran is at hand, and the waterway is completely controlled by Russia. And Aktau itself is directly opposite Makhachkala, so if anything, the ships of the Caspian flotilla will not miss hi
      3. Vasek
        Vasek 23 November 2013 17: 44
        0
        Quote: w.ebdo.g
        So we can carry our pipe to India ...

        Why does Iran need a Russian pipe on its territory?
        They themselves have "pipe fluid" like dirt.
    3. AVV
      AVV 23 November 2013 12: 33
      -6
      Let them take the stools there, this is a more specialized position for him, and he will sell the Americans with his female battalion at bargain prices !!!
    4. Kasym
      Kasym 23 November 2013 18: 56
      20
      Are they hauling furniture and building materials by airplanes? The price of transportation is higher than the cost of such goods! I recently received cargo from Guangzhou (south of China) to Alma-Ata, 6 bucks per kg. . So consider how much will be to America. It would be better if the Afghans were left, well, greedy. They didn’t build anything there, they just blew it up and destroyed it.
      Regarding the base, I’m tired of writing that there is a law in the Republic of Kazakhstan that it is forbidden to deploy military bases of third countries without the consent of the CSTO members. The warehouse differs from the base in that there is no corresponding armament, the required number of personnel, and headquarters with command. So do not pay attention to such information ducks. There will be no NATO base in Kazakhstan - we have already passed this stage. The question was acute when NATO entered Afghanistan. They persistently demanded an airfield in Almaty. At first they seemed to want to give, but then they sharply changed their position. Apparently consultations with Moscow and Beijing affected. They quickly passed the law, the parliament signed it just a day after submitting it for consideration. That is, it took a record three days to legally take into account the signature of the president. The maximum that was given is the alternate aerodrome in Chimkent, in cases of emergency. But they did not use it either. Now the troops began to withdraw; again, talk began about some base in the Republic of Kazakhstan. Sorry, but we already have an appropriate law. Therefore, all the speculation about the base is purely theoretical. You also need to know how the ROK is building its relations with its neighbors - for the sake of mythical benefits from the NATO base in the ROK in the Caspian, we are not going to quarrel with the Russian Federation and Iran. KAZAKHSTAN WILL NOT SOLVE ANY QUESTION WITHOUT AGREEMENT WITH RUSSIA. This is obvious for the Kazakhstani, but arouses suspicion among the Russians. hi
      1. hommer
        hommer 24 November 2013 01: 20
        17
        Kasym, I welcome you. A good and reasoned answer.
        The author of the article is undoubtedly a provocateur. Paid, most likely, by amers.
        I am surprised by the comments of members of the forum, often with big stars. Any garbage, being completely off topic, they write, even the buttons on the keyboard stick. Before throwing emotions, didn’t you try to think?
        Well, for starters, inquire, but is this generally possible under the laws of the Republic of Kazakhstan and international treaties signed by Kazakhstan?
        Whose mill are you pouring water on?
        Or - crowing, and then at least do not dawn?
        И to moderators a question - in front of our eyes, an aggressive pseudo-patriotic oligophrenic community has recently formed on the site, spewing out slogans without a hint of the thought process, but with pleasure complementing each other. Something reminiscent of LGBT people in the West. Are you going to do something?
  2. Belogor
    Belogor 23 November 2013 07: 55
    14
    It seems that they will not have a base in Aktau, the Russian Federation will find a consensus with Kazakhstan on this issue.
  3. makarov
    makarov 23 November 2013 07: 56
    +1
    The government of Kazakhstan must weigh everything soberly so that the Taliban would not come after the Americans to prey on the Americans.
    1. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist 23 November 2013 18: 01
      -11 qualifying.
      Well, I really doubt it ... oh, for some reason.
      The entire short history of the Kazakh state is just a complete bluff and the constant swindle of some, then others, then third .... and so on ad infinitum.
      Kazakhstan as such is a totalitarian police state. And the constant "maneuvering" between the Chinese and Russia, the Amers and Russia is an attempt to bargain for themselves more and fatter, the Kazakhs everywhere prove their Turks, but with what contempt they treat the same tribesmen as the Turks - Kirghiz, Tajik.
      So, as with the CSTO, it’s not so simple, the Kazakhs are still profitable for them, but if something happens (!!!) they will sell it right there and they will prove that the others themselves (whom they sold).
      Now in Kazakhstan there is one God and right - the "golden calf", money, money and more money, everything is sold and everything is bought. So that the amers really have such an opportunity to simply buy for Uncle Sam's candy wrappers and Aktau and Astana separately and together. It all depends on what the Kazakhs are promised ...
      1. FormerMariman
        FormerMariman 23 November 2013 18: 31
        +8
        Uncheck the lumpen!
      2. Semurg
        Semurg 23 November 2013 21: 37
        10
        Quote: ekzorsist

        The entire short history of the Kazakh state is just a complete bluff and the constant swindle of some, then others, then third .... and so on ad infinitum.
        Kazakhs everywhere prove their Turkasti, but with what contempt they treat the same tribesmen of the Turks - Kyrgyz, Tajiks.
        ....

        a man hates Kazakhstan, he will probably leave soon, but what Tajiks wrote down as tribesmen to the Turks speaks of his knowledge of the Kazakhs and their neighbors.
        1. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 00
          -3
          Do not tell the truth, oh not the truth !!!
          You do not hate Kazakhstan, but I can’t stand the FALSE and CHUVANIA.
          And if you are not lying, tell me - "Is there much truth in the words of the current leadership of the Republic of Kazakhstan?" ... Alas, even the citizens of this country themselves are simply already tired of nonsense.
          Did I invent something?
          http://www.zonakz.net/blogs/user/anatolij_i_k/27109.html
          or here
          http://www.russianskz.info/politics/5073-otsutstvie-vnyatnosti-kazahstan-v-plane
          -nesovpadeniya-mezhdu-slovom-i-delom-oboshel-mnogih-iz-svoih-vcherashnih-uchitel
          ey.html
          and also
          http://forbes.kz//finances/finance/kazahstan_strana_na_vyivoz/?mark=%D0%BF%D1%91
          %D1%82%D1%80%20%D1%81%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B8%D0%BA
          or as
          http://forbes.kz//finances/investment/derjateli_mirovoy_valyutyi_ispolzuyut_kaza
          hstan_po_oboyudnomu_soglasiyu /
          it's not me old or how are you trying to put me there ...
          Alas, it really happened in Kazakhstan - alas, population degradation has occurred.
      3. xetai9977
        xetai9977 23 November 2013 21: 49
        16
        Since when did the Kazakh Turks become relatives of the Iranian-speaking Tajiks?
        1. alone
          alone 23 November 2013 21: 57
          +5
          Rauf, hello! this is from an excess of knowledge! knowledge is just like the dough falls out of my head))
      4. alone
        alone 23 November 2013 21: 54
        +1
        learn the ethnography of the peoples of Central Asia. maybe then you will understand that the Tajik is as Turkic as the Japanese))
        1. alone
          alone 24 November 2013 00: 33
          +6
          laughing well persuaded, the Japanese and Tajiks are also Turks. wassat

          damn sometimes the stupidity of some transcends all sorts of borders. Not only do you ignoramuses, they also put cons.
      5. Rinat 1
        Rinat 1 25 November 2013 07: 17
        +3
        In advance and with a song from Kazakhstan, if something is not like. We have a free country, nobody holds anyone if something is not pleasant.
  4. Navigator2013
    Navigator2013 23 November 2013 08: 02
    +2
    This is called letting a goat into the garden. First airbase, then port. Control over transport communications of the Caspian Sea to the northern ports of Iran.
    1. Evgenij.
      Evgenij. 23 November 2013 11: 53
      +2
      what control? or in the Caspian aug float?
    2. alone
      alone 23 November 2013 22: 08
      +3
      and this is already a panic. How did alarmists act during the Second World War? Just shot on the spot. And panic, as we know, is already half of the enemy’s victory.

      After reading your comment, I already thought that the Caspian was in the hands of the American Navy.
  5. mountain
    mountain 23 November 2013 08: 08
    +4
    The presence of Americans in these countries depends on our coherent policy. And security conditions in these regions.
  6. Ihrek
    Ihrek 23 November 2013 08: 28
    +7
    This is the result of a slurred policy of the Russian leadership. The question is - if we can provide a transit zone in the Ivanovo region. why Kazakhs can’t. Or do we need more money than they do. Although in our case, the main thing was not money. And the Kazakhs most likely do not have money. But I think in general the option with their presence in Aktau or in Kazakhstan in general is unlikely.
    1. bairat
      bairat 23 November 2013 09: 01
      -3
      In the Ulyanovsk region. We were just bred as suckers. Sly Nazarbayev played a multi-move, the transit base was first offered to be located with us, when we agreed the Americans "changed their minds" and agreed on the same with the Kazakhs. We can no longer object to anything, at the sight of packs of dollars all leavened patriotism was blown away from our leaders, it remains only to admire the wisdom of the Kazakh leader.
      1. Ezhaak
        Ezhaak 23 November 2013 11: 24
        +1
        Quote: bairat
        when we agreed the Americans like "changed their minds" and agreed on the same with the Kazakhs

        They (amers) were categorically not satisfied with the requested price for transport. It turned out to be expensive. The Kazakhs will probably make it cheaper, and maybe even pay the minke whales.
  7. Aydar
    Aydar 23 November 2013 08: 28
    +3
    It is fully consistent with the plans for the secession of Western Kazakhstan.
    1. Vasek
      Vasek 23 November 2013 17: 53
      0
      So I think so. Controlling the Caspian from them "kontrolka" is a bit short, and they have an intriguing experience of bringing down states from within.
      Maybe Nazarbike’s heiress is already planning ...
    2. Clegg
      Clegg 24 November 2013 20: 32
      +5
      Quote: Aydar
      It is fully consistent with the plans for the secession of Western Kazakhstan.

      What is the plan? You can share right now, by the way, I am in the same city of Aktau
  8. Volodya Sibiryak
    Volodya Sibiryak 23 November 2013 08: 56
    +4
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Let’s just let the pendos sit down, but they strive to lie down right there.

    Yeah, let’s get warm, because there is a wish that there is no place to spend the night.
  9. pliev78
    pliev78 23 November 2013 09: 13
    +1
    I do not understand such "allies", all the time you have to be ready for a stab in the back! Rightly speaking, Russia has only one ally, his Army!
    1. avt
      avt 23 November 2013 09: 27
      +5
      Quote: pliev78
      Correctly say, Russia has only one ally, its Army!

      Actually two, or have you already tired of the Fleet? laughing
      1. Clegg
        Clegg 24 November 2013 20: 34
        +4
        Quote: avt
        Quote: pliev78
        Correctly say, Russia has only one ally, its Army!

        Actually two, or have you already tired of the Fleet? laughing


        He is right, Russia has only one ally and this is nuclear weapons.
  10. The comment was deleted.
  11. vlad.svargin
    vlad.svargin 23 November 2013 09: 18
    -3
    Former Temirtau, opposite Azerbaijan, Dagestan and Chechnya, is very convenient to "manage chaos" in the Caucasus and "control" oil flows. In Kazakhstan, it began with the sending of its military personnel to study in the United States. What do our ruling elite think about?
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 23 November 2013 14: 59
      12
      Temirtau and now Temirtau and it is not like the former and is located not opposite Azerbaijan but exactly in the middle of Kazakhstan (where in Karaganda or rather it’s near 20-30 km from Karaganda)
    2. romb
      romb 23 November 2013 18: 58
      +5
      Former Temirtau, opposite Azerbaijan, Dagestan and Chechnya - very convenient


      I don’t even know what ... and say about itcrying
      1. hommer
        hommer 24 November 2013 01: 00
        +5
        Quote: romb
        I don’t even know what ... and say about it
        - I'll try for you -
        vlad.svargin - did you study at school?
        Well, you don’t need to demonstrate your stupidity and dense ignorance here.
    3. Guun
      Guun 24 November 2013 07: 38
      +3
      Quote: vlad.svargin
      Former Temirtau, opposite Azerbaijan, Dagestan and Chechnya, is very convenient to "manage chaos" in the Caucasus and "control" oil flows. In Kazakhstan, it began with the sending of its military personnel to study in the United States. What do our ruling elite think about?

      Oh. Do the fruits of education by the Western standard bear fruit? Children are getting dull, sadly ...
    4. vlad.svargin
      vlad.svargin 24 November 2013 16: 10
      +3
      I ask the forum users to excuse me, I confused the village of Aktau in the Karaganda region, 25 km from Temirtau. It has not been in Kazakhstan for a long time (especially after the USSR), the names of cities have changed. Kazakhstan is now an independent country and we are not indifferent to the fate of neighbors, who may be influenced by our common enemies (Anglo-Saxons have only their own interests and more often their interests do not coincide with the owners). Ask why Kyrgyzstan expels them from their land — the Americans’ behavior towards the Kyrgyz was not adequate, they always feel not as guests, but as owners.
      1. marshes
        marshes 24 November 2013 16: 19
        +3
        Quote: vlad.svargin
        Ask why Kyrgyzstan expels them from their land — the Americans’ behavior towards the Kyrgyz was not adequate, they always feel not as guests, but as owners.


        Bishkek, October 29 / Kabar /. Today, at the request of the Government of the country, the Jogorku Kenesh’s Foreign Affairs Committee considered the draft law on writing off the debt of Kyrgyzstan to Russia as an extraordinary measure.
        The document was presented by Deputy Minister of Finance Mirlan Baygonchokov. After the adoption of this law, Russia will immediately write off the debt of Kyrgyzstan in the amount of $ 188,9 million and, starting in 2016, it will write off $ 30 million annually for 10 years. After clarifying questions, the deputies approved the draft law and submitted it to the Jogorku Kenesh.
        As Sapar Isakov, head of the foreign policy department of the President’s Office, previously reported, Kyrgyzstan has two big debts to Russia. The first in the amount of $ 189 million was recorded in the agreement of 2005, the second of $ 300 million in the agreement of 2009. It was agreed that $ 189 million will be debited in full in one installment. The second debt will be discussed until 2016. And then it is subject to write-off in equal shares for 10 years, while interest on the remaining debt will not be charged.
        An agreement between the governments of Kyrgyzstan and Russia on the settlement of the debt of the Kyrgyz Republic to the Russian Federation on previously granted loans was signed during an official visit of Russian President Vladimir Putin on September 20 of this year.
        Moreover, Gazprom Kyrgyz will buy gas with debts for a dollar, guest workers and much more ... I almost forgot to hunt in the TS.
      2. Netrocker
        Netrocker 24 November 2013 20: 18
        +4
        In the west we do not have such a village, there is an industrial city of Aktau with almost 190 thousand people ...
        Here is a photo:
    5. alone
      alone 24 November 2013 16: 44
      +2
      Quote: vlad.svargin
      Former Temirtau, opposite Azerbaijan, Dagestan and Chechnya, it is very convenient to "manage chaos" in the Caucasus and "control" oil flows


      belay I didn’t know that Chechnya has access to the Caspian Sea. I’ll have to sit and learn "new geography." crying
  12. awg75
    awg75 23 November 2013 09: 23
    -9
    here we have such a reliable friend and ally, Kazakhstan .... if all the same they build a common air defense system with it, then American planes (and NATO in general) in a friend or foe system will pass as their own ... in Russia only friends are the Army and fleet
    1. Guun
      Guun 24 November 2013 07: 39
      0
      There is nothing to write ... Ah people do not think with their heads. Neighbors are such neighbors.
  13. erased
    erased 23 November 2013 09: 24
    +4
    States consistently uphold their interests around the world. Even contrary to logic and international agreements. There is something to learn from them. The Yankees are astonishing and unceremonious.
  14. avt
    avt 23 November 2013 09: 25
    +2
    request Well ..? Also me a binomial of Newton! The Great Game has not been canceled, and the Yankees only come out of Afgan in the media, as well as from Kyrgyzstan. If they persuade the Kazakhs to one or another variant of their presence, and if they really want to, they will certainly persuade them, so that people in Kazakhstan will also be proud of their “wise, multi-vector choice” for evil to the Emperors and for sugrying the acquired national consciousness, then this can mean only the warming up of color revolutions in the region with an eye on us and China, but they will determine the order in the course of events depending on the resistance of the regimes in Russia and China. Gentlemen from the national republics may not worry, they are not taken into account by the Yankees for they have already decided everything.
  15. Netrocker
    Netrocker 23 November 2013 10: 21
    +5
    As far as I remember, only a transit terminal is planned in the Caspian, not a base. The author is purely a provocateur of some kind! After all, the terminal for American cargo is not at all what the NATO base is in Ulyanovsk. Why then do the local kvass patreots not remember her? :)
    1. Rashid
      Rashid 23 November 2013 10: 54
      11
      Yes, here in general "experts" on Kazakhstan have gathered. That steppe Temirtau turned out to be on the sea with them, then something else like that. And the author does not know Kazakhstan, I see it from the text: the word "Kazakh", "Kazakh" is used only when it is necessary to indicate belonging to the Kazakh nationality, in other cases, for example, an army, city, government, etc. the word "Kazakh" is used.
  16. avt
    avt 23 November 2013 10: 48
    +2
    Quote: Netrocker
    As far as I remember, only a transit terminal is planned in the Caspian, not a base. The author is purely a provocateur of some kind!

    Well, that's what I'm talking about, the experience of the Kyrgyz with "Manas" and a couple of changes of rulers called "revolution" does not teach anything, naturally you are smarter than the Kyrgyz and much more perspicacious.
    Quote: Netrocker
    this is not at all what the NATO base is in Ulyanovsk. Why then do the local kvass patreots not remember her? :)

    Why don't they remember, you just don't want to remember about all the "graters" in Russia on this issue and again carefully consider how overseas "common people" settled in "Manas" with an electronic intelligence system inclusive and the 10th team of green berets ", well, like in Ulyanovsk. Again, here's something that tells me that you won't even have the Ulyanovsk version, not according to Senka, they'll put the squeeze on if they need, at least for the Kyrgyz version with the specific presence of amerskoy "personnel", rather specific.
    1. Zymran
      Zymran 23 November 2013 11: 34
      +8
      Quote: avt
      Well, that's what I'm talking about, the experience of the Kyrgyz with "Manas" and a couple of changes of rulers called "revolution" does not teach anything, naturally you are smarter than the Kyrgyz and much more perspicacious.


      The second revolution was obviously not organized by the Americans, but by the Russians after Bakiev tried to throw Putin.

      The article is another hysteria from a pacreotic author, who has one enemy of the Anglo-Saxons / Zhidomasons / State Department / Hillary.
      1. avt
        avt 23 November 2013 14: 18
        +4
        Quote: Zymran
        The second revolution was obviously not organized by the Americans, but by the Russians after Bakiev tried to throw Putin.

        Yes Yes . And she was led by a woman who was learned by the Americans. laughing Yes, and Old Man, too, according to your logic and the instigation of the GDP, demanded the intervention of the CSTO and hid Bakiev, entangled in his own scams, in his place. Would make a “revolution”, would not have a firebrand after, for us, in fact, this is a change of sewn for soap and still a black hole in the budget with unclear prospects and a crowd of migrants.
        1. Zymran
          Zymran 23 November 2013 14: 38
          +3
          Quote: avt
          Yes Yes . And it was headed by a woman who was taught by the Americans. laughing Yes, and Father, too, according to your logic and the instigation of the GDP, demanded the intervention of the CSTO and hid Bakiev, entangled in his own scams, in his place. Would make a “revolution”, would not have a firebrand after, for us, in fact, this is a change of sewn for soap and still a black hole in the budget with unclear prospects and a crowd of migrants.


          Just like all the Middle East revolutions and the occupation of Iraq for amers, this is one sheer smut and a multi-billion dollar expense. wink
          1. avt
            avt 23 November 2013 14: 58
            +3
            Quote: Zymran
            Just like all the Middle East revolutions and the occupation of Iraq for amers, this is one sheer smut and multibillion expenses. wink

            Sit down, two! negative Well, that, but the Iraqi company has long been self-sufficient, not only have they, like Russia and the CIS countries, filled up the folks with dollars, securities that, when entering the United States, are withdrawn from the domestic monetary circulation and are merged back abroad. Haliburton, Dick Cheney's bunch rushed in. Well, who was he then? That's right, vice president. Well, how much do the Iraqis get for a barrel of oil? After the war, there were $ 12 dead amerskih, this despite the fact that they do not really need this oil in America, they also hold others by the throat with these supplies. And if they get excited, the Americans will create Kurdistan and work with it, but theirs "diplomats" with a gun and in uniform, who remained in decent numbers after the "withdrawal" of troops, will quickly and briefly explain everything to anyone there. In Afghanistan, everything is compensated drug trafficking, Libya was also torn apart, and now Cyrenaica appeared with oil fields that were also previously controlled by the Center by national, tribal minorities. Well, who really controls them? This is despite the fact that Muamor became a "tyrant and murderer" just for what he wanted to raise Libya's share of up to 50%, well, and the gold Dinar to introduce and receive for gas and oil is not the Fed's wrappers, but full-value gold. So hack to yourself where you want a simple and uncomplicated truth - NEVER the Americans and in general the Naglo-Saxons, at a loss to themselves, DO NOT wage a war. Only on self-sufficiency, and even better with a profit, like those Angles that pushed the Boers only because they became bankrupt during the time of Victoria, and the Boers in the Transvaal had immeasurable gold and nothing that the descendants of white colonists rotted them all without looking at age and gender. concentration camps are no worse than blacks and Indians.
            1. Zymran
              Zymran 23 November 2013 15: 16
              +3
              Who got the Iraqi oil. With translation from the Zhid-Masonic Bloc

              http://judeomasson.livejournal.com/4722.html

              The absence of American oil companies among the winners surprised many industry experts and refuted claims that they would ultimately be the main developers of huge reserves of Iraqi hydrocarbons.

              The following is a list of winning companies:

              West Qurna Second Stage
              Location: South Iraq.
              The winners are: Lukoil(85%) and Statoil (Norway) (15%), the as-yet unnamed Iraqi partner, will be added later with 25% of Lukoil and Statoil 63,75% and 11,25% respectively.
              Volume: 12,9 billion barrels of reserves. The winning consortium pledged to increase production to 1,8 million barrels per day (b / a) for a fee of $ 1,15 per barrel.
              Qayara and Najmah
              Location: Northern Iraq in the Mosul area.
              Winner: Sonangol(Angola)
              Volume: Reserves of 800 million and 858 million barrels, respectively. Sonangol has promised to increase production to 120.000 barrels per day and 110000 for nine years and will pay $ 5 and $ 6 per barrel, respectively.
              Majnun
              Location: Southern Iraq, near the Iranian border.
              Winners: Consortium Shell(Netherlands) and Petronas(Malaysia), led by Petronas.
              Volume: Stocks of 12580 million barrels. The consortium has promised to raise production to 1,8 million barrels per day for 10 years for a fee of $ 1,39 per barrel of production.
              Gharraf
              Location: South of Iraq.
              Winners: Consortium Petronas and Japex(Japan) led by Japex.
              Volume: reserves of 863 million barrels. The consortium has promised to increase production to 230000 barrels per day for 13 years for a fee of $ 1,49 per barrel.
              Halfaya
              Location: South of Iraq.
              Winner: Consortium Petronas Total(France) and "China National Petroleum Corporation", led by Petronas.
              Volume: Reserves of 4,1 billion barrels. The consortium has promised to increase production to 535000 barrels per day for 13 years for a fee of $ 1,40 per barrel.
              Badra
              Location: Eastern Iraq near the Iranian border.
              Winners: The Consortium "Gazprom", Korean Kogasи Petronasled by TPAO (Turkey).
              Scope: Reserves of 109 million barrels. The victory consortium pledged to increase production by 170000 barrels per day for seven years with a reward of $ 5,5 per barrel.
              1. avt
                avt 23 November 2013 17: 16
                +1
                Quote: Zymran
                Who got the Iraqi oil. With translation from the Zhid-Masonic Bloc

                http://judeomasson.livejournal.com/4722.html

                The absence of American oil companies among the winners surprised many industry experts and refuted claims that they would ultimately be the main developers of huge reserves of Iraqi hydrocarbons.

                request So what ? request Who remembers how the same Lukoil returned to Iraq? Well, when was West Qurna “recaptured for him?” And if you strain yourself and look for at least newspaper publications of those years, you can remember a lot, besides, who will open real agreements on work in Iraq? beneficiaries "of these companies, so who swims in what shares, this is a big secret for the public. By the way, Lukoil was very cool then, even in the USA it opened a network of gas stations, and this is very interesting. For what such merits they opened the company's internal market, and even so that the owners for the war for bright ideals, for democracy in the whole world "live well and never fight for their own account. Well, why bother yourself, why bother, you can always hire a subcontractor for a small share, the main thing is to stay "looking", why should I get my hands dirty with work, when it is possible, "pure concrete" to establish the procedure for fishing in the occupied territory. mania and totalitarianism. "We do not need to explain this, we were already allowed through this in the 90s, all together and separately.
  17. their
    their 23 November 2013 10: 54
    +5
    I doubt the successful move of the Americans to Aktau. Putin will replay them again
    1. avt
      avt 23 November 2013 11: 06
      +1
      Quote: sus
      I doubt the successful move of the Americans to Aktau. Putin will replay them again

      And who said that they would move !? They will not leave "Manas" as well as from Afghanistan, that is, they will remain under a new guise, it is not so easy to uproot them from there where they have climbed, and Putin is not a decree to them, do not overestimate his capabilities. Perhaps I still missed Iran, in In general, this does not change the picture, yes, it is imperative to add the claims of the past secretaries of state to the Volgo-Don canal to the Kazakh port, with the requirement to transfer it under international jurisdiction.
  18. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 23 November 2013 10: 56
    +2
    Central Asia is the most important region on the southern borders of Russia. And the most important task for the United States to gain a foothold there. Therefore, Americans and cling to every piece of this land. Americans always justify their aggressive aspirations with the goal of "defending democracy."
  19. their
    their 23 November 2013 11: 23
    +3
    Quote: avt
    Quote: sus
    I doubt the successful move of the Americans to Aktau. Putin will replay them again

    And who said that they would move !? They will not leave "Manas" as well as from Afghanistan, that is, they will remain under a new guise, it is not so easy to uproot them from there where they have climbed, and Putin is not a decree to them, do not overestimate his capabilities. Perhaps I still missed Iran, in In general, this does not change the picture, yes, it is imperative to add the claims of the past secretaries of state to the Volgo-Don canal to the Kazakh port, with the requirement to transfer it under international jurisdiction.


    They will leave Manas and Afghanistan in 2014, is it worth them hanging around there? In Afghanistan, drug trafficking is regulated, and the base in Kyrgyzstan is no longer needed; for the last year they paid fabulous money for it.

    In Aktau, they needed it primarily because of their proximity to Iran in order to respond in time to the threat to Israel. Putin recently at the height of the same fact, to beat such players is not a joke. Russia has leverage over Kazakhstan and it is unlikely that the United States will be able to do anything IMHO.
    1. Zymran
      Zymran 23 November 2013 11: 32
      +3
      Quote: sus
      Russia has leverage over Kazakhstan and it is unlikely that the United States will be able to do anything IMHO.


      Not to Kazakhstan, but to Nazarbayev. wink
    2. avt
      avt 23 November 2013 14: 42
      +2
      Quote: sus
      They will leave Manas and Afghanistan in 2014, is it worth them hanging around there? In Afghanistan, drug trafficking is regulated, and the base in Kyrgyzstan is no longer needed; for the last year they paid fabulous money for it.

      request You guys are weird. They have already "left" Iraq, leaving there not only PMCs, but also a large, limited "contingent of" advisers "in uniform and, attention, giving them diplomatic immunity! Okay !? A dozen, another thousand" diplomats " with a gun. And even practically nearby, in Qatar, a base was placed with the general command of the southern region. In Afghanistan, they simply and without trickery arrange bases, about which the article on the site is posted today.
      Quote: sus
      the base in Kyrgyzstan is no longer needed; for the last year they paid fabulous money for it.

      In one form or another, they will remain there, there will be at least a transshipment point to which the local route will not be under any pretext. Let it not be in Manas, but they will transfer to another airport.
      Quote: sus
      In Aktau, they needed it primarily because of their proximity to Iran in order to respond in time to the threat to Israel.

      There is no threat to Israel, but it is advisable to keep Iran under control, here I missed it in the previous comments, but the main threat nonetheless is for Russia and China, which by the way is your main investor today, so anyway, regardless of who is the first they will attack Naglosaks, Kazakhstan will not be left alone and will try to play it.
      Quote: sus
      . Putin recently at the height of the same fact, to beat such players is not a joke.

      request Well, this is only part of the game and it will not stop, or rather, as Kipling said, "Only when everyone dies, only then will the Big Game end."
      Quote: sus
      Russia has leverage over Kazakhstan and it is unlikely that the United States will be able to do anything IMHO.

      Well, the amers have "methods" and on GDP, the game is a game, who as their figures will place and move, from that and the gain will add up in one direction or another.
  20. Circle
    Circle 23 November 2013 11: 35
    +6
    It makes no sense to discuss similar articles: what if ...? So far, the facts are zero. And there were no agreements in the history of mankind. Wait and see. What is the time to waste in chatter?
  21. Zymran
    Zymran 23 November 2013 11: 36
    +5
    Washington’s assurances that the Americans will confine themselves to creating a transit center in Aktau look more like a cover for solving another task - to ensure the US military presence directly at the border with Russia. Distance from Aktau to Astrakhan 363 km, 40 minutes of flight on a passenger plane. The deployment of a US contingent here would be an unprecedented move.


    Does the author have evidence that Americans will not limit themselves to a transit center?
  22. bersar2
    bersar2 23 November 2013 11: 49
    +2
    damn I hope that nevertheless our government will have enough willpower not to let usovtsev come to us
  23. alone
    alone 23 November 2013 12: 08
    +4
    I think Kazakhstan knows what is beneficial for them and what is not beneficial. And it is definitely not for us mere mortals to decide what they should do. What is beneficial for them will be done
  24. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 23 November 2013 12: 10
    -6
    The signature of the President of Kazakhstan under the Agreement on Security Cooperation in the Caspian Sea, reached by the leaders of the five Caspian states on November 18, 2010 in Baku, in principle, should exclude Astana’s consent to provide its port of Aktau for deployment at the local airport of the US military base.

    The Yankees easily buy the signatures of the "presidents" of the animal republics around the world. 200 years ago they paid with beads and soup bowls to wear around their necks; now they pay with dirty green bills with portraits of swindlers and murderers to be carried in pockets and kept in banks.
    And no Agreements can be an obstacle for greedy savages, and it’s ridiculous to recall the security and interests of their people and neighbors.
  25. FormerMariman
    FormerMariman 23 November 2013 12: 17
    +7
    The article is minus for trying to accuse Kazakhstan with florid phrases of treason, while agreements are signed on a joint missile defense system with Russia, Armenia and Belarus! As a citizen of Kazakhstan, of course, I am against their presence in any form! And if the author’s hysteria is justified, then someone sold out to someone (on the 01th it doesn’t seem like he already has enough)!
    1. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist 23 November 2013 18: 19
      -8
      In-oh-oh - ".... I, as a citizen of Kazakhstan, of course ...", but I apologize - "Why not say so at home ??? - Former Mariman ...
      That's the thing !!!
  26. Yeraz
    Yeraz 23 November 2013 12: 19
    +1
    I love to look at mythological unions like the CIS, the Collective Security Treaty Organization, the Customs Union, unity and friendship directly cut eyes))))
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 23 November 2013 22: 05
      +1
      Quote: Yeraz
      I love to look at mythological unions like the CIS, the Collective Security Treaty Organization, the Customs Union, unity and friendship directly cut eyes))))

      The CIS most likely does not work (but it was created for the peaceful collapse of the union). The Collective Security Treaty Organization has so far given no reason for application by God and will not have to apply. The TS personally affected me negatively and I just can’t call it mythological because it hit my pocket, now I’m waiting for the advantages of the TS to appear like they said that there will be a lot of them to take away (here I think that you will carry away because they her will be).
      1. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 23 November 2013 22: 32
        +4
        Quote: Semurg
        Now I’m waiting for the advantages of the TS to appear, it seems they said that there will be a lot of them to take away (here I think that you will take it away, because there will be them).
        Shalom Semurghi
        "Among the small, acting, you become smaller, and among the big ones you grow yourself."
        With the collapse of the USSR, Kazakhstan experienced a strong lumpenization, a collapse ...
        And one way or another, it is necessary to develop an industry that will pull (the "multiplier effect") all other spheres along with it.
        Yes, it is preferable to be in the "Ourops", but they will not take us there, and the Central Asian Union does not work, but we will ...
        "In the absence of a stamp, we also write in simple ..." recourse
        1. Semurg
          Semurg 24 November 2013 10: 31
          +8
          Salem Alibek. Do you really think that modern Russia is interested in the development of industry in Kazakhstan? The color revolutions greatly scared the NAS from here I think all the allied affairs, and the economy went as an appendage to fears 01 (or vice versa, economics and fears 01. Until I decided for myself, on my pocket I still feel that personal fears came first, 01, and then already the economy). Time the main examiner will wait and see then we will draw conclusions.
          1. Alibekulu
            Alibekulu 24 November 2013 11: 26
            +5
            Quote: Semurg
            Do you think that modern Russia is interested in the development of industry in Kazakhstan?
            Of course not, but the Russian Federation is infected with the "imperial" idea.
            And, why RK, accordingly do not use it.
            Quote: Semurg
            Color revolutions greatly scared NAS
            I don't think so. His positions in the country are too strong and his authority is indisputable .. The only thing that Nursultan is to blame for is the absolutely ugly situation with "Prince Jofrri" (Rakhat Aliyev), for which he is directly responsible.
            Quote: Semurg
            Time chief examiner
            I agree. Actually, the National Academy of Sciences understands that it is not eternal and the end will soon be - Turkmenbashi ave. And before leaving, prepares "points of growth" (TS, EvraZes, "2020", "2050"). And it leaves Kazakhstan's balanced foreign policy position.
            1. Zymran
              Zymran 24 November 2013 13: 40
              +6
              Quote: Alibekulu
              I agree. Actually, the National Academy of Sciences understands that it is not eternal and the end will soon be - Turkmenbashi ave. And before leaving, prepares "points of growth" (TS, EvraZes, "2020", "2050"). And it leaves Kazakhstan's balanced foreign policy position.


              Not this way. Before leaving, he must secure and provide for his family, and only Russia can give such guarantees.
  27. FormerMariman
    FormerMariman 23 November 2013 12: 37
    +7
    Quote: Yeraz
    I love to look at mythological unions like the CIS, the Collective Security Treaty Organization, the Customs Union, unity and friendship directly cut eyes))))

    If the union was mythological, Kazakhstan would join the CU with Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan (which all the leading economists led by the head of the National Bank Marchenko rattled about) having received an oil and gas triumvirate, and not in the CU with Russia which is beneficial to ALL except Kazakhstan and for which now ordinary Kazakhstanis are paying out of pocket!
    The CU and the Collective Security Treaty Organization are primarily military-political unions enshrined in legal obligations, so I think there is hardly any betrayal on the part of Kazakhstan!
    1. alone
      alone 23 November 2013 12: 50
      +2
      Quote: Former Mariman
      If the union was mythological, Kazakhstan would join the CU with Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan (which all the leading economists led by the head of the National Bank Marchenko rattled about) having received an oil and gas triumvirate, and not in the CU with Russia which is beneficial to ALL except Kazakhstan and for which now ordinary Kazakhstanis are paying out of pocket!


      we don’t need dubious alliances. We don’t pretend to world domination. And without the CU we have very good relations with Kazakhstan, Russia, and Belarus. hi
      1. Zymran
        Zymran 23 November 2013 12: 52
        +4
        Quote: lonely
        we do not need dubious alliances. We do not pretend to world domination. And without a CU we have very good relations with Kazakhstan, and with Russia, and with Belarus. hi


        The above guide fellows! They do not climb anywhere and do not give up state interests.
    2. Zymran
      Zymran 23 November 2013 12: 50
      -3
      Quote: Former Mariman
      If the union was mythological, Kazakhstan would join the CU with Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan (which all the leading economists led by the head of the National Bank Marchenko rattled about) having received an oil and gas triumvirate, and not in the CU with Russia which is beneficial to ALL except Kazakhstan and for which now ordinary Kazakhstanis are paying out of pocket!


      The question is. What for us union unprofitable from all directions? Americans are weak now. Lost Pakistan, Uzbekistan, withdrawing troops from Afghanistan. In Iraq did not receive any benefit. From a military point of view, they carried out a brilliant operation, but did not receive strategic nishtyaks. The USA does not pose a direct threat to Kazakhstan. Same thing with China.
  28. tnship2
    tnship2 23 November 2013 14: 22
    +2
    Along the perimeter of Russia, there are only good neighborly friends. One half-witted independence crawls into the noose with his head to blackmail out dozens of another billions of American rubles. Others are ready to arrange jump airfields at the borders of Russia for grandmas. and nasty Russia, you will be sawed into economic clusters depending on your needs, but not your needs.
    1. Yuri Y.
      Yuri Y. 23 November 2013 15: 25
      -8
      Quote: tnship2
      you will be sawn into economic clusters depending on the needs

      Drank, drank you can have no doubt (I'm talking about the cons to you). But first, Russia so as not to interfere.
  29. shasha
    shasha 23 November 2013 15: 15
    -2
    friends themselves .....
  30. dnh1970
    dnh1970 23 November 2013 15: 16
    0
    someone should tell our neighbors that who is not with us is against us.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 23 November 2013 15: 36
      +6
      Quote: dnh1970
      someone should tell our neighbors that who is not with us is against us.

      The world in general is not black and white but multi-colored. True, there is a disease (it seems color blind) in which the world is black and white, probably it concerns you
    2. Jet
      Jet 23 November 2013 16: 46
      +3
      don’t worry about us, we already know who is who ...
  31. Arkan
    Arkan 23 November 2013 15: 21
    -3
    Part of the Kazakh elite wanted to earn green fantasycoffs, update the wallpaper in yurts.
  32. Semurg
    Semurg 23 November 2013 15: 29
    +4
    it would be good to remove all the bases of foreign states from the territory of Kazakhstan and not climb into any alliances. The economy allows us to build everything on bilateral relations, but our 01 decided differently, while we wait and see what it will give pros or cons (there is no unambiguous assessment of this yet, then when the bulk of the decision is made, the authorities will have to take this into account in any plans 01 is not forever, and if the candidate does not take into account the opinion of people will fly by the chair)
    1. Zymran
      Zymran 23 November 2013 15: 42
      +2
      I think that with the departure of amers from the region, the 01 regime will become even more repressive, and if he manages to maintain the continuity of power and the course towards integration with Moscow, they will put even more cynical opinion on the people.

      Quote: Semurg
      Build everything on a bilateral relationship, the benefit of the economy allows


      I totally agree. A good neighbor is better than a bad relative.
  33. FormerMariman
    FormerMariman 23 November 2013 16: 34
    +4
    Quote: Zymran
    Quote: Former Mariman
    If the union was mythological, Kazakhstan would join the CU with Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan (which all the leading economists led by the head of the National Bank Marchenko rattled about) having received an oil and gas triumvirate, and not in the CU with Russia which is beneficial to ALL except Kazakhstan and for which now ordinary Kazakhstanis are paying out of pocket!


    The question is. What for us union unprofitable from all directions? Americans are weak now. Lost Pakistan, Uzbekistan, withdrawing troops from Afghanistan. In Iraq did not receive any benefit. From a military point of view, they carried out a brilliant operation, but did not receive strategic nishtyaks. The USA does not pose a direct threat to Kazakhstan. Same thing with China.

    A huge common border, and the national composition in both states (only in the Astrakhan province. Kazakhs 16% of the total. Population), but a common history! There are many arguments, but the most important thing is better to dig the earth with men than to drink vodka with assholes! And China offers TS Kyrgyzstan, and this is an alarming bell! So we are on the way with Russia, although we will survive all sorts of misunderstandings in a large family!
  34. albai
    albai 23 November 2013 17: 56
    +4
    Kyrgyz Manas Airport will go down in history as an example of the evacuation of Americans against their wishes.
    I personally think everything is completely different. During the period of the existence of the American military base at Manas Airport, the Americans made from Kyrgyzstan the main transshipment base for the export of Afghan drugs to Europe and Central Asia. Currently, several alliance facilities are under construction in Kyrgyzstan, designed to carry out technical intelligence activities of all communication communication systems and information resources of Kyrgyzstan and neighboring states. In addition, there are facts confirming the secret laying of caches of weapons and ammunition on the territory of Kyrgyzstan, for the possibility of carrying out sabotage and terrorist acts in the future with a further expansion of the geography of hostilities in the territory of neighboring states.
    The US military, once stepping into foreign territory, rarely then leave it of their own free will;
    These bastards just won’t leave, they will certainly slam the door loudly, and will come back.
  35. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 23 November 2013 19: 08
    0
    Quote: albai
    In addition, there are facts confirming the secret laying of caches of weapons and ammunition on the territory of Kyrgyzstan, for the possibility of future sabotage and terrorist acts with a further expansion of the geography of hostilities in the territory of neighboring states.
    These bastards just won’t leave, they will certainly slam the door loudly, and will come back.

    Yusov military bases look like socks of the 3rd stage of pollution - socks have long been thrown away, and the stench (as well as from the betrayal of officials) remains for a long time.
    Surely the Yankees agents charged a lot of Kyrgyz officials and Kazakh officials with greens (like Hollywood victims' eggs from strangers), now guess who the monster will come out of.
  36. romb
    romb 23 November 2013 19: 26
    +4
    The article is funny. Practically everything related to Kazakhstan is clearly far-fetched. Look at the map of the Caspian Sea, and just think about what a normal country will create for itself almost the base of the Navy on the territory of the state, which is part of the military-political bloc, actually created as a real counterweight to the world domination of this very country. Definitely, Kazakhstan does not need extra headaches. We are very well versed in geography, as a result of which they perfectly understand that the United States is far from Aktau, and Russia and Iran are right under their nose.
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 23 November 2013 20: 21
      -1
      Quote: romb
      The article is funny. Practically everything related to Kazakhstan is clearly far-fetched. Look at the map of the Caspian Sea, and just think about what a normal country will create for itself almost the base of the Navy on the territory of the state, which is part of the military-political bloc, actually created as a real counterweight to the world domination of this very country. Definitely, Kazakhstan does not need extra headaches. We are very well versed in geography, as a result of which they perfectly understand that the United States is far from Aktau, and Russia and Iran are right under their nose.

      USAA is clearly not a normal country. 998 of their military bases are located mainly in Europe and Asia.
      Kazakhstan has oil, uranium, chromites (97% of the reserves of the USSR), etc. this is the most important thing that attracts the Yankees. The Yankees do not give a damn about Kazakhstan and the bloc and Russia, their task is to create military bases in Kazakhstan and will gain a foothold.
      And then you can pit the natives and make a profit. The fools, ready for the green candy wrappers to sell everything in the world, unfortunately, are not translated.
  37. Clegg
    Clegg 23 November 2013 21: 55
    +4
    I greet all my Turkic brothers whom I noticed here Khetai, Zymran, Yeraz, lonely, semurg
    I am a former user of Essenger, now on a subject. The military facility most likely already exists, and this case concerns only the USA and Kazakhstan. I do not understand where does Russia?
  38. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 23 November 2013 23: 32
    -15 qualifying.
    Quote: Clegg
    I greet all my Turkic brothers whom I noticed here Khetai, Zymran, Yeraz, lonely, semurg
    I am a former user of Essenger, now on a subject. The military facility most likely already exists, and this case concerns only the USA and Kazakhstan. I do not understand where does Russia?

    Kazakhstan is in the sphere of Russia's geopolitical influence and does not have the right to make tricks with our common enemies, without coordination with Russia. Too small and stupid for independence.
    1. xetai9977
      xetai9977 24 November 2013 10: 20
      +6
      Kazakhs are not small and far from stupid, at least not more stupid than their northern neighbor, who chooses beggars and aggressive, like Armenians, as allies, contrary to logic and common sense. And to declare some country a zone of "its influence", without taking into account its opinion, is typically imperial thinking. The Kazakhs themselves will figure out with whom to be friends and how to live on, and they do not need any tips.
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 24 November 2013 11: 35
        -10 qualifying.
        Quote: xetai9977
        Kazakhs are not small and far from stupid, at least not more stupid than their northern neighbor, who chooses beggars and aggressive, like Armenians, as allies, contrary to logic and common sense. And to declare some country a zone of "its influence", without taking into account its opinion, is typically imperial thinking. The Kazakhs themselves will figure out with whom to be friends and how to live on, and they do not need any tips.

        No need la la, I lived and worked in Kazakhstan in the 70's and talked with Kazakhs at a fairly high level, to the ministries. They never shone with either intelligence or quick wit.
        The current economic level of Kazakhstan is 95% created by the Russians and is essentially a legacy of the USSR. The number of Russians in Kazakhstan is constantly decreasing, and economic indicators are falling accordingly.
        Half of the Russians have already left for Russia, because of discrimination and the threat to the lives of their families.
        Without prompting and assistance from Russia, Kazakhstan will quickly turn into a colony of USA or China.
        1. marshes
          marshes 24 November 2013 11: 55
          +6
          Quote: Corsair5912
          The current economic level of Kazakhstan is 95% created by the Russians and is essentially a legacy of the USSR. The number of Russians in Kazakhstan is constantly decreasing, and economic indicators are falling accordingly.

          You can learn more about the economic level and economic indicators. And I can’t figure it out, I used to have a salary of about $ 200, now I earn a little more than $ 3000 as a family MP, from the Soviet legacy I have a drilling machine, but these are the 1932 junkers and oxygen tanks.
        2. romb
          romb 24 November 2013 12: 16
          +5
          Half of the Russians have already left for Russia, because of discrimination and the threat to the lives of their families.

          Can you present the facts?
          Without prompting and assistance from Russia, Kazakhstan will quickly turn into a colony of USA or China.

          God forbid the advice of such a prompter who, due to the "intelligence" of his political leadership, in a little over twenty years, in a servile impulse to please the growing appetites of uncles Liao and Sam in every possible way, managed to stupidly squander or sell out the overwhelming part of the scientific and technical developments of the USSR.
          As a fact, Russia is not close to the USSR, even more - it is the antipode in almost everything.
          1. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 24 November 2013 13: 23
            -6
            romb
            Half of the Russians have already left for Russia, because of discrimination and the threat to the lives of their families.

            Can you present the facts?

            “Fact” who abandoned his apartment and all his property in Stepnogorsk, who took only his wife and children, I meet every day at work, and in Russia and Germany there are more than one million such facts.
            I myself for 3 years in the 70s in Kazakhstan lived and had seen enough of the Russophobes and xenophobes there.
            1. Gooch v. 2
              Gooch v. 2 28 November 2013 15: 02
              0
              Quote: Corsair5912
              “Fact” who abandoned his apartment and all his property in Stepnogorsk, who took only his wife and children, I meet every day at work, and in Russia and Germany there are more than one million such facts.
              I myself for 3 years in the 70s in Kazakhstan lived and had seen enough of the Russophobes and xenophobes there.

              Argument, ala One grandmother at work Told.
        3. Clegg
          Clegg 24 November 2013 15: 53
          +3
          Quote: Corsair5912
          Without prompts and help from Russia, Kazakhstan will quickly turn into a colony of USA or China

          I do not mind being a colony of the United States))) The main thing is not Russia.
          I have nothing against, but when the backward are combined with the backward, nothing good will come of it)))
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 16: 06
            0
            Quote: Clegg
            I do not mind being a colony of the United States))) The main thing is not Russia

            you are right it would be necessary at least 10 years, so that you understand in your own skin how a gentleman differs from a "native".
            and hospitals will be built and universities and academies of sciences, everything will be
            1. Clegg
              Clegg 24 November 2013 16: 26
              +4
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              hospitals will be built and universities and academies of sciences, everything will be

              What for? We have already built Russian)))
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 17: 42
                0
                Quote: Clegg
                What for? We have already built Russian)))

                do not worry, close
                1. Clegg
                  Clegg 24 November 2013 20: 25
                  0
                  Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Quote: Clegg
                  What for? We have already built Russian)))

                  do not worry, close


                  Not Russian to solve it)))
                  The times when Russian taxied in Kazakhstan were irrevocable))) And that's good!
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 21: 01
                    +1
                    Quote: Clegg
                    Not Russian to solve it)))

                    Of course not, it’s those who you want to do in the colonialists.
                    1. Clegg
                      Clegg 24 November 2013 21: 16
                      0
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Quote: Clegg
                      Not Russian to solve it)))

                      Of course not, it’s those who you want to do in the colonialists.


                      Well, this does not concern you)))
                  2. The comment was deleted.
                  3. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 21: 04
                    0
                    Quote: Clegg
                    The times when Russian taxied in Kazakhstan were irrevocable))) And that's good!

                    in fact, Russians make up a quarter of the population of the Republic of Kazakhstan so that they too decide.
                    and about the fact that the Russians were steering, apparently you have little idea of ​​the period of the Kazakh SSR
                    1. Clegg
                      Clegg 24 November 2013 21: 18
                      +2
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      in fact, Russians make up a quarter of the population of the Republic of Kazakhstan so that they too decide.

                      Actually 22%, but it does not matter. Because the top is 99% Kazakhs.
                      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 22: 36
                        0
                        good a little less than a quarter, but you finally told the truth, otherwise you will forever breach that in the Republic of Kazakhstan dissemination on the basis of no.
                      2. Clegg
                        Clegg 25 November 2013 07: 50
                        +3
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        good a little less than a quarter, but you finally told the truth, otherwise you will forever breach that in the Republic of Kazakhstan dissemination on the basis of no.


                        dissemination? or discrimination?
                      3. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 10: 02
                        0
                        Do not spread snot on a plate. well understood that a typo but definitely need to show off
                      4. Clegg
                        Clegg 25 November 2013 12: 44
                        +2
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        well understood that a typo but definitely need to show off

                        Well, do not be offended, it turns out there is such a medical term. I thought maybe I didn’t understand something.

                        Well, personally, I am against discrimination on ethnic grounds, but FOR DISCRIMINATION ON LANGUAGE.
                      5. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 13: 19
                        0
                        Quote: Clegg
                        but FOR LINGUISTIC DISCRIMINATION


                        Article 5. Use of the Russian language
                        In state organizations and local governments
                        Along with Kazakh, the Russian language is officially used.
                        According to the Resolution of the Constitutional Council of the Republic of Kazakhstan dated May 8, 1997 No. 10/2: "This constitutional norm is understood clearly that Kazakh and Russian languages ​​are used equally and equally in state organizations and bodies of local self-government, regardless of any circumstances."


                        Article 7. Inadmissibility of obstruction of the functioning of languages
                        В The Republic of Kazakhstan is not allowed to infringe on the rights of citizens on the basis of language.
                        The actions of officials that impede the functioning and learning of the state and other languages ​​represented in Kazakhstan entail responsibility in accordance with the laws of the Republic of Kazakhstan.
                      6. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 13: 20
                        0
                        Quote: Clegg
                        but FOR LINGUISTIC DISCRIMINATION


                        Article 5. Use of the Russian language
                        In state organizations and local governments
                        Along with Kazakh, the Russian language is officially used.
                        According to the Resolution of the Constitutional Council of the Republic of Kazakhstan dated May 8, 1997 No. 10/2: "This constitutional norm is understood clearly that Kazakh and Russian languages ​​are used equally and equally in state organizations and bodies of local self-government, regardless of any circumstances."


                        Article 7. Inadmissibility of obstruction of the functioning of languages
                        В The Republic of Kazakhstan is not allowed to infringe on the rights of citizens on the basis of language.
                        The actions of officials that impede the functioning and learning of the state and other languages ​​represented in Kazakhstan entail responsibility in accordance with the laws of the Republic of Kazakhstan.
                      7. Clegg
                        Clegg 25 November 2013 14: 05
                        +1
                        Vasilenko and what ?!
                      8. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 14: 12
                        0
                        Can you read? !!
                        Why are you checking ?! !!!
                        linguistic discrimination is FORBIDDEN by your own (Kazakhstani) legislation, though this is universally violated, by you personally, including
                      9. Clegg
                        Clegg 25 November 2013 15: 30
                        +2
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        discrimination on the basis of language is FORBIDDEN by your (Kazakhstan) legislation

                        I am for removing the Russian language from the Constitution

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        by you personally including

                        Sure?
                      10. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 16: 13
                        0
                        Quote: Clegg
                        I am for removing the Russian language from the Constitution

                        Well, when you take it away, then you can talk about it, although this is by and large disgusting.
                        at the time of the formation of the Republic of Kazakhstan, Russians accounted for more than 50% of the population of the Kazakh SSR and the fact that Kazakhstan is today an independent state, Kazakhs should be grateful, including them
                        Quote: Clegg
                        Sure?

                        anyway you are calling for it
                      11. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 16: 14
                        +2
                        Quote: Clegg
                        I am for removing the Russian language from the Constitution

                        Well, when you take it away, then you can talk about it, although this is by and large disgusting.
                        at the time of the formation of the Republic of Kazakhstan, Russians accounted for more than 50% of the population of the Kazakh SSR and the fact that Kazakhstan is today an independent state, Kazakhs should be grateful, including them
                        Quote: Clegg
                        Sure?

                        anyway you are calling for it
                      12. Clegg
                        Clegg 25 November 2013 17: 11
                        +2
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        at the time of the formation of the Republic of Kazakhstan, Russians accounted for more than 50% of the population of the Kazakh SSR and the fact that Kazakhstan is today an independent state, Kazakhs should be grateful, including them

                        In terms of garlic, I am grateful to Lenin for creating mechanisms through which all 14 countries were able to withdraw from the union with you relatively bloodlessly.

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Well, when you take it away, then you can talk about it, although this is by and large disgusting.

                        Why so?

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        anyway you are calling for it

                        And whom did I call? I just expressed my opinion.
                      13. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 November 2013 18: 37
                        0
                        Quote: Clegg
                        Why so?

                        because the Russian citizens of the Kazakh SSR made up more than 50% and have the right to be considered the state as a forming ethnic group
                        Quote: Clegg
                        And whom did I call? I just expressed my opinion.

                        Well, personally, I ... FOR DISCRIMINATION ON THE LANGUAGE.
                        Alizovich also had his own opinion on certain issues
                      14. Clegg
                        Clegg 26 November 2013 08: 07
                        +1
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Alizovich also had his own opinion on certain issues

                        Vasilenko nothing more to say? laughing
        4. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 15
          -1
          Yes, all of you perfectly understood, only this is called ... as you like to say - "... Asian cunning ...", and in Russian - "... turn on the fool ...".
  • ekzorsist
    ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 12
    -1
    So your Russophobian moods appeared.
    So, it’s not necessary for people to drive the blizzard about what kind of fluffy you are ... only here the grin of an animal looks through.
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 24 November 2013 17: 56
    -2
    Quote: Clegg
    I do not mind being a colony of the United States))) The main thing is not Russia.
    I have nothing against, but when the backward are combined with the backward, nothing good will come of it)))

    What do you propose to do with the backward? Destroy? Drive to the reservation?
    One American explained to me why they could not achieve a high standard of living in the USSR, he said - We have Indians in the USA 1.5%, and you, Russians, have almost 50%, we have them on reservations, and you are free.
    1. Clegg
      Clegg 24 November 2013 20: 26
      +2
      By backward, I do not mean people, but countries
  • cayman
    cayman 24 November 2013 21: 26
    -2
    And here “essenger” appeared again, but already under the nickname “clegg”. Again he bore Turanian crap with Russophobia mixed up. I’m tired of it already, along with my Turanian brothers under Kazakh flags. I’m completely insolent here on the Russian site, like at home. Well, what did you imagine about yourself? At this forum I explained to “clegg” (when he was “essenger”) the geopolitical fate of Kazakhstan, but it didn’t seem to come. Well, I repeat once again for both Clegg (Essenger) and other Kazakh clever people. And so, delve into and remember.
    Kazakhstan is a buffer country, sandwiched between Russia and China, and this is what determines everything for it. There is another factor of influence, this is the United States, but it is a thing of the past. It is foolish to dream like a clegg (essenger) to become a US colony, for America is irreversibly blown away. She is no longer the only superpower in a unipolar world. America is replacing China unstoppably with cosmic speed. This, of course, does not please me, a Russian nationalist, but this is an objective fact. By the twentieth year, in just six years, China will surpass America in terms of GDP, and already surpassed in industrial production. By 2020, China will already have one and a half billion people, the yuan will replace the dollar as a world currency, and China will become the only superpower. And then, seriously, the expansion of the Chinese will begin. Not against Russia, as Russophobes hope, because even then we will remain a nuclear power. The very first object of expansion will certainly be Taiwan. Well, and secondly, Mongolia and Kazakhstan. China will not fight with us, but Mongolia, Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan will be taken away, and no one will interfere with it. Who the fuck do you need to fight for you. The only thing we will do is repatriate our Russian fellow tribesmen to their homeland. So China will gobble you up. There is a nuance. China needs territories for settlement and minerals, but it does not need Aborigines as labor. The question will be: what should the aborigines do with you? And since there is a huge gender imbalance in China (the number of men exceeds the number of women by eighty million), then most likely Aboriginal people are used to solve a sexual problem. Aboriginal women will be distributed to Chinese bachelors, and young male Aborigines will be distributed to Chinese barracks for sexual slavery. And that’s it. You will disappear altogether, and the road is there for you.
    1. alone
      alone 24 November 2013 22: 30
      +5
      Quote: cayman
      And here “essenger” appeared again, but already under the nickname “clegg”. Again he bore Turanian crap with Russophobia mixed up. Tired already, along with his Turanian brothers under the Kazakh flags.


      where did you notice Turanian crap and Russophobia in his comments? If you have nothing to argue with their arguments, then you shouldn’t blacken people, accusing them the devil knows what. Better tell the counter-conclusions to their comments. In one comment I did not read a single word against the Russian people. But criticizing the authorities does not mean criticizing the people.
    2. Clegg
      Clegg 25 November 2013 08: 15
      +3
      cayman, assalam ualeikum!

      First of all, I would like to say that your attention to my modest person is flattering me. And you unfortunately, I don’t remember (((Therefore, the fact that you repeated your thought is good.

      Quote: cayman
      Russophobia here on the Russian site, as at home, completely insolent.

      Give a quote or please novel.

      And now about China, these are all your fairy tales and horror stories. Wasn’t she tired of God?
      Usually, the Russians, after such comments below, conclude, let us in an alliance with us, we will "protect" you. Although thanks for not promising patronage)
      I think you still forgot to write about threats from Afghanistan)
  • ekzorsist
    ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 08
    0
    Well, you see how great!
    Only a word against the Kazakhs and .... you are a warrior.
    Got a minus?!?
    They just do not understand the words and any objection, no matter how reasonable or not, would immediately be in Ponte.
  • Gooch v. 2
    Gooch v. 2 28 November 2013 15: 00
    +2
    Quote: Corsair5912
    The current economic level of Kazakhstan is 95% created by the Russians and is essentially a legacy of the USSR. The number of Russians in Kazakhstan is constantly decreasing, and economic indicators are falling accordingly.

    without russians, savsenam badass, it’s not possible to customize narmalny, lady, please pajalusta a couple of thousand russian gasturbaytera, otherwise it’s almost impossible for us




    Astana is the capital of Kazakhstan, since 1997. I do not see the USSR.
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 28 November 2013 15: 56
      0
      Quote: Gooch v.2
      Astana is the capital of Kazakhstan, since 1997. I do not see the USSR.

      the truth is that all were built by the Turks, but Kuatov’s masterpieces in Alma-Ata were built by Kazakhs who were assembled in the countryside, garages are leaking, the cladding is crumbling, etc.
    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 28 November 2013 16: 25
      0
      Quote: Gooch v.2
      Astana is the capital of Kazakhstan, since 1997. I do not see the USSR.

      the truth is that all were built by the Turks, but Kuatov’s masterpieces in Alma-Ata were built by Kazakhs who were assembled in the countryside, garages are leaking, the cladding is crumbling, etc.
  • Clegg
    Clegg 24 November 2013 10: 29
    +7
    Quote: Corsair5912
    Kazakhstan is in the sphere of geopolitical influence of Russia

    If I were, there would be no such talk.

    Quote: Corsair5912
    without coordination with Russia.

    It is "Abkhazia" that is coordinating something with you, not us)

    Quote: Corsair5912
    Too small and stupid for independence.

    wink Have a bite)
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 24 November 2013 10: 53
      +8
      Quote: Corsair5912

      Kazakhstan is in the sphere of Russia's geopolitical influence and does not have the right to make tricks with our common enemies, without coordination with Russia. Too small and stupid for independence.

      Quote: xetai9977
      Kazakhs are not small and far from stupid, at least not more stupid than their northern neighbor, who chooses beggars and aggressive, like Armenians, as allies, contrary to logic and common sense. And to declare some country a zone of "its influence", without taking into account its opinion, is typically imperial thinking. The Kazakhs themselves will figure out with whom to be friends and how to live on, and they do not need any tips.

      No, let them write. We read and wag about our allies (already several people on our side wrote that they changed their views on the union under the influence of comments)
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 15: 28
        +2
        Quote: Semurg
        We read and wag about our allies (already several people on our side wrote that they changed their views on the union under the influence of comments)

        interesting after reading this, what opinions should be formed about our allies -

        The Russian-Moscow empire is not just a monster that is responsible for the deaths of entire peoples, nations and states. This terrible phenomenon presents an unpredictable threat to the entire planet.

        Whine white ears, whine. It won’t be sweeter in the mouth. Kazakhia will flourish and will flourish. As the rashka depended on the kz, it will depend on it. And it will not want so that NATO military bases will immediately appear along the rashka borders. So sit quietly and suck your paw.


        Russians are a hysterical nation of informers and brawlers. They carry what horrible in impotent rage, this is one of the types of agony.


        The fact that Ryak Akulak with the name Ivan is symbolic in my opinion,
        look cattle and licking them! The same will be with you!


        quotes from taken from discussions from the news site http://www.altyn-orda.kz and this is far from the only anti-Russian site in the kaznet
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 21: 05
          0
          minus argue weakly? !!
          you can be rude to insult, but apologize for this, well, no matter how
        2. ekzorsist
          ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 26
          -2
          That's about what I’m saying - Kazakhstan is a simple police state, where everything is imprisoned under the pressure of its own people, policemen, the army (well, if you can still call it that).
          Specifically, Kazakhstan is simply not able to withstand external aggression on its own and they understand this. Too big a gap in the social, and in material terms between people.
          It is very doubtful that the youth of Kazakhstan brought up in the mainstream - "milk milk", if something happened, would rush to defend the rich "Buratina" for a big "thank you". And there is NO national idea for rallying the people of Kazakhstan and it looks like it will never be.
          What all those present could see.
          So, the ally from Kazakhstan is useless and terribly not reliable.
    2. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 24 November 2013 11: 43
      0
      Quote: Clegg
      Quote: Corsair5912
      Kazakhstan is in the sphere of geopolitical influence of Russia

      If I were, there would be no such talk.
      Quote: Corsair5912
      without coordination with Russia.

      It is "Abkhazia" that is coordinating something with you, not us)
      Quote: Corsair5912
      Too small and stupid for independence.

      wink Have a bite)

      The "state" of Kazakhstan was created by the Bolsheviks in 1923. Before that, Kazakhs never had their own statehood, this is an irrefutable fact, despite the lies of "official" historians. Kazakhstan has a long way to go to real state thinking and awareness of responsibility in choosing friends, while they are still far from this.
      For this, there are geopolitical zones of responsibility of the great powers to keep underdeveloped states from irrational policies.
      Of course, smoked weed is hard to understand.
      1. Clegg
        Clegg 24 November 2013 12: 09
        -1
        Quote: Corsair5912
        The "state" of Kazakhstan was created by the Bolsheviks in 1923.

        Well, legally, a "state" called Russia was also created by the Bolsheviks in 1922.
        Russia is the successor of the USSR, but not of the Russian empire. Legally, your country is not even 100 years old.

        Quote: Corsair5912
        For this, there are geopolitical zones of responsibility of the great powers

        Well, we are under the influence of the United States. The American base will appear soon, (I think it already exists). Inshallah may join NATO. There is already fraternal Turkey, maybe fraternal Azerbaijan will join. You look at the Kyrgyz and the Uzbeks after we pull up. So I am optimistic about relations with a great country called the USA.
        1. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 24 November 2013 12: 47
          -1
          Quote: Clegg
          Well, legally, a "state" called Russia was also created by the Bolsheviks in 1922.
          Russia is the successor of the USSR, but not of the Russian empire. Legally, your country is not even 100 years old.

          Legally, the state of Russia exists at least from the 5 century BC. (according to archeology from 3 thousand BC) on the same territory and with the same national composition of the population, mainly Slavic. There were no breaks in the law of succession for 2500 years.
          Well, we are under the influence of the United States. The American base will appear soon, (I think it already exists). Inshallah may join NATO. There is already fraternal Turkey, maybe fraternal Azerbaijan will join. You look at the Kyrgyz and the Uzbeks after we pull up. So I am optimistic about relations with a great country called the USA.

          Something similar was promoted at the beginning of the last century by the pro-fascist organization of pan-Turkists who collaborated with Hitler, the people did not support it either in "fraternal" Turkey, or in "fraternal" Azerbaijan, or in the USSR. The traitors were simply turned up.
          Now the pan-Turkists are looking for a new master across the ocean, they cannot live without licking ...
          1. romb
            romb 24 November 2013 12: 56
            -1
            Legally, the state of Russia has existed since at least the 5th century BC.

            Everything is clear with you!
            All I have no more questions ...
            1. Corsair5912
              Corsair5912 24 November 2013 14: 52
              +1
              Quote: romb
              Everything is clear with you!
              All I have no more questions ...

              Well, okay, all the questions for Herodotus, who wrote about the country of Ros north of Scythia.
              1. romb
                romb 24 November 2013 16: 29
                +5
                Good!)))
                Where and in what work did Geradot point to the country of Ros?
                And right there in pursuit (so to speak - to help), he has practically one fundamental work, and it is called: "History". So, in it there is no indication of the country of Ros.
                Please, let’s do it without mystification, after all, the site is military-political and not a club of science fiction lovers. hi
                1. Corsair5912
                  Corsair5912 24 November 2013 16: 54
                  0
                  Quote: romb
                  Good!)))
                  Where and in what work did Geradot point to the country of Ros?
                  And right there in pursuit (so to speak - to help), he has practically one fundamental work, and it is called: "History". So, in it there is no indication of the country of Ros.
                  Please, let’s do it without mystification, after all, the site is military-political and not a club of science fiction lovers.

                  1 book of Herodotus Clio is dedicated to history
                  The name "rus" is indisputably ethnic. The existence of Rus on the right bank of the Dnieper was primordial. It can be seen in the "Borustenites" of Herodotus, Strabo: (V century BC - I century AD), "Borusks" of Pliny, Ptolemy (I - II centuries), "Borusts" of our Vlesov book : In essence, "bor-rus-stenites" (Greek) and "bor-rusks" (roman) are one and the same, composed of "bor" and "rus". This was natural, considering that the earliest predecessor of Kiev was first the city-temple Borusten (wall - the idol of Bora-Borey), then Borichev, and the inhabitants of the Dnieper region were Borustenite-Borusks
                  http://www.rusarch.ru/mokeev8.htm
                  1. romb
                    romb 24 November 2013 17: 01
                    +3
                    In the first book "History" - "Clio" there is no mention of Ros. There, most of the text is devoted to the Hellenic-Persian relationship!
          2. atalef
            atalef 24 November 2013 13: 21
            +1
            Legally, the state of Russia exists at least from the 5 century BC. (according to archeology from 3 thousand BC) on the same territory and with the same national composition of the population, mainly Slavic. There were no breaks in the law of succession for 2500 years.

            Wow, even Zadornov is resting belay
            1. Corsair5912
              Corsair5912 24 November 2013 14: 54
              -3
              Quote: atalef
              Wow, even Zadornov is resting

              Why even? He also has the right to rest.
              1. atalef
                atalef 24 November 2013 15: 57
                +2
                Quote: Corsair5912
                Quote: atalef
                Wow, even Zadornov is resting

                Why even? He also has the right to rest.

                It's like children of geniuses, nature can rest the same
          3. Clegg
            Clegg 24 November 2013 15: 46
            -1
            Quote: Corsair5912
            Legally, the state of Russia has existed since at least the 5th century BC. (according to archeology from 3 thousand BC)

            nonsense) close this topic. do not disgrace

            Quote: Corsair5912
            Something similar was promoted at the beginning of the last century by the pro-fascist organization of pan-Turkists who collaborated with Hitler, the people did not support it either in "fraternal" Turkey, or in "fraternal" Azerbaijan, or in the USSR. The traitors were just turned up


            Hitler is as negative a character as Stalin.
            But, Hitler's allies are not traitors for one reason. Due to the fact that they did not swear allegiance to the communist empire.
            If (Russia, China, the United States is not important, any foreign power) commits aggression against Kazakhstan, I’m personally ready to unite even with Wahhabis, at least with zombies, even with vampires.
            It is necessary that the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
            1. Corsair5912
              Corsair5912 24 November 2013 16: 38
              +1
              Quote: Clegg

              Hitler is as negative a character as Stalin.
              But, Hitler's allies are not traitors for one reason. Due to the fact that they did not swear allegiance to the communist empire.
              If (Russia, China, the United States is not important, any foreign power) commits aggression against Kazakhstan, I’m personally ready to unite even with Wahhabis, at least with zombies, even with vampires.
              It is necessary that the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

              Stalin was never a negative character, and with Hitler they are antipodes, like darkness and light, evil and good.
              Hitler's goal was to subjugate the Germans, the "superior race of masters", of all mankind to the "inferior race of slaves," all kinds of Asians, Americans, Africans.
              The aim of the Communists and Stalin was the liberation of mankind from the masters, slavery and oppression.
              The pan-Turkists did not betray Hitler and not Stalin, but their peoples, they tried to plunge them into war with the whole World, for the sake of personal selfish interests.
              They were only interested in power and money, they, like you, were ready to lick the anus for any villains, fascists, zombies, Wahhabis and other ghouls for this.
              1. Clegg
                Clegg 24 November 2013 16: 50
                +5
                Corsair,
                Are you not a seventh grader?
                From you it carries cheap propaganda))) It can be seen that it is not at all in the subject, they did not study this issue.

                Quote: Corsair5912
                for this they were ready to lick the anus of any villains

                I understand right now, homosexuality is fashionable (maybe you have sinned, nothing happens) in Russia too. Just recently, Putin spoke out in their defense.
                Well this is still a military site)))
                1. Corsair5912
                  Corsair5912 24 November 2013 17: 03
                  0
                  Quote: Clegg
                  Are you not a seventh grader?
                  From you it carries cheap propaganda))) It can be seen that it is not at all in the subject, they did not study this issue.
                  I understand right now, homosexuality is fashionable (maybe you have sinned, nothing happens) in Russia too. Just recently, Putin spoke out in their defense.
                  Well this is still a military site)))

                  No, I'm not a seventh grader, I'm 60 years old, so I understand the difference between Stalin and Hitler, unlike you.
                  Advocate the truth is the duty of every normal person, and you seem to believe solzhenitsers and other traitors and mercenaries of the US Department of State.
                  In the USSR, where I lived for 40 years, there were no homosexuals, and it’s not me who is going to grovel in front of any "friend", the enemy of the enemy.
                  1. Clegg
                    Clegg 24 November 2013 17: 07
                    -2
                    would immediately say that you are commies, then there would be no point in arguing)
                    1. Corsair5912
                      Corsair5912 24 November 2013 17: 28
                      0
                      Quote: Clegg
                      would immediately say that you are commies, then there would be no point in arguing)

                      Why are you not happy with the Communists?
                      Are you against the equal rights of people, regardless of nationality and color, do not agree with a fair wage? Are you for the right to oppress man by man, for unemployment and war?
                      All the rights of workers on planet Earth were recaptured from the rich and aristocrats by the Communists, millions of people died for a better life, in wars with mercenaries of capital.
                    2. atalef
                      atalef 24 November 2013 20: 57
                      +2
                      Quote: Corsair5912
                      Are you against the equal rights of people, regardless of nationality and color, do not agree with a fair wage?

                      I am in favor, recently the article was about Swiss communism, and I was hoping that Cuba with the DPRK would be the first
                      crying

                      Quote: Corsair5912
                      All the rights of workers on planet Earth are recaptured from the rich and aristocrats by the Communists,

                      Long live the Swiss Communist Party !!!!!!!!!!

                      Quote: Corsair5912
                      millions of people died for a better life in wars with mercenaries of capital.

                      In the Stalin camps as well.
                    3. Gooch v. 2
                      Gooch v. 2 28 November 2013 15: 17
                      +1
                      Quote: Corsair5912
                      Why are you not happy with the Communists?
                      Are you against the equal rights of people, regardless of nationality and color, do not agree with a fair wage? Are you for the right to oppress man by man, for unemployment and war?
                      All the rights of workers on planet Earth were recaptured from the rich and aristocrats by the Communists, millions of people died for a better life, in wars with mercenaries of capital.

                      Communism is an effective form of government only on the territory of Russia and against Russians, by virtue of their mentality.

                      For, historically, like you, Russians respect all kinds of Genghis Khan, Ivan the Terrible and other Vissarion. Moreover, they respect not for the useful things that these comrades did (well, let's say that they did - I’m not talking about that now), but solely because they brutally tortured someone. The Russian general understands the art of management as the art of priming, hanging on a rack and toasting the heels. Well and, of course, savor the aroma of unwashed fried heels, they are always the first.

                      Russians like you, as a rule, are patriots, in the sense of a patriot of a tarpaulin boot and opiz ** **. Of course, Russians cannot tolerate Russian nationalists, because this is the “opposite human type”. Under what pretext they do not tolerate - the second thing, but usually it comes down to the same cult of the all-conquering kirzach, stars and other anal caresses. Or, as Zakhar Prilepin says there, the cops before beating the head hero in meat: “Nothing in this country has changed and will never change. She must be loved and cared for as she is. ”
                  2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 17: 37
                    +2
                    Quote: Clegg
                    would immediately say that you commie

                    sometimes you need to think before you write something
                  3. ekzorsist
                    ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 31
                    -1
                    And they do not care, they are like bulls on a red rag, as soon as they hear about the USSR or about Russians ... well, how to speak, they warmed, fed ...
              2. atalef
                atalef 24 November 2013 20: 53
                +3
                Quote: Corsair5912
                No, I'm not a seventh grader, I'm 60 le

                But this is really a surprise. belay
          4. atalef
            atalef 24 November 2013 18: 24
            +3
            The aim of the Communists and Stalin was the liberation of mankind from the masters, slavery and oppression.

            with the distribution of passes through the NKVD (People’s Committee of World Kindness) to the resorts of the far north and the Far East - 37 campaign of the year - all inclusive, travel is free wassat
            1. builder
              builder 24 November 2013 18: 38
              +1
              Quote: atalef
              with the distribution of passes through the NKVD (People’s Committee of World Kindness) to the resorts of the far north and the Far East - 37 campaign of the year - all inclusive, travel is free

              to the resorts of the far north and the far east - 2013 action - all inclusive, travel is free. Many and now at such resorts is not a sin to ride.
              1. ekzorsist
                ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 33
                -2
                Kazakhs are lining up to go there now, so much so that the Russians can’t even get through!
            2. Corsair5912
              Corsair5912 24 November 2013 20: 20
              +1
              Quote: atalef
              with the distribution of passes through the NKVD (People’s Committee of World Kindness) to the resorts of the far north and the Far East - 37 campaign of the year - all inclusive, travel is free

              95% of Soviet people treated the NKVD with respect and there was a reason why they cleaned society of criminals, did not take bribes and did not take a roof. And in sunny Magadan, criminals received permits not in the NKVD, but in court. And deserved.
              3 MARCH 1938 P R A V D A. No. 61 (7386).
              THE PROCESS OF THE ANTI-SOVIET "RIGHT-TROTSKIST BLOC"
              Closing indictment
              in the case of Bukharin N.I., Rykov A.I., Yagoda G.G., Krestinsky N.N., Rakovsky H.G., Rozengolts A.P., Ivanova V.I., Chernova M.A., Grinko G.F., Zelensky I.A., Bessonova S.A., Ikramova A., Khodzhaev F., Sharangovich V.F., Zubarev P.T., Bulanova P.P., Levina L.G.,
              Pletneva D.D., Kazakova I.N., Maksimova-Dikovsky V.A. and Kryuchkova P.P., -

              SUSPECTS THAT THEY on the instructions of intelligence hostile to the Soviet Union of Foreign States to draw up a conspiratorial group called "Right-Trotskyite bloc" has set the goal of spying for a foreign state, wrecking, sabotage, terrorism and undermining the military power of the Soviet Union, provocation of military attack THESE STATES IN THE USSR RACHLENENIE USSR and isolation from it Ukraine, Belarus and the Central Asian Republics, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Primorye THE FAR EAST - THE BENEFIT REFERRED TO FOREIGN COUNTRIES FINALLY overthrow in the Soviet Union existing socialist social and political system and Recovery CAPITALISM, RESTORATION OF BOURGEOIS POWER.

              An up-to-date document, only the names should be replaced in court.
              1. atalef
                atalef 24 November 2013 20: 43
                0
                Quote: Corsair5912
                95% of Soviet people treated the NKVD with respect and there was a reason

                Yes, okay, a normal Russian never liked the cops, let alone the NKVD eshniks - they were afraid - Yes, they respected - well, there were probably such people.

                Quote: Corsair5912
                they cleaned society from criminals, did not take bribes and did not roof up.

                They also caught the enemies of the people, uncovered conspiracies and put my great-grandfather - a shoemaker (from Torzhok) - I don’t know what kind of intelligence agent he was in his boot booth, but after 2,5, he was activated (if you know what it is) and in 39 he died, my great-grandmother remained with 3 children in her arms - and of course, immeasurable respect for the NKVD

                Quote: Corsair5912
                . And in sunny Magadan, criminals received permits not in the NKVD, but in court. And deserved.

                of course, due to merit, especially in the USSR there was the most humane and independent court (which remains to this day), I don’t know his merits were not enough for Magadan. but for Lodeynoye Pole (near Karelia) - the resort was still waiting for him.
                Yeah . Hug and cry. How atoms are sometimes arranged in a strange way, well, they were crushed, crushed, and they also thank you in return.
          5. Gooch v. 2
            Gooch v. 2 28 November 2013 15: 12
            +2
            Quote: Corsair5912
            Stalin was never a negative character, and with Hitler they are antipodes, like darkness and light, evil and good.

            Hitler did not shred his people in piles.

            Hitler's goal was to subjugate the Germans, the "superior race of masters", of all mankind to the "inferior race of slaves," all kinds of Asians, Americans, Africans.

            Hitler's goal was the extermination of entire racial units, in his case Jews and gypsies, as well as any manifestations of communism (see Mein Kampf).

            The aim of the Communists and Stalin was the liberation of mankind from the masters, slavery and oppression.

            The purpose of the Communists and Stalin was the extermination of all who contradict their ideological values. If I live under capitalism and I feel great, I don’t give a damn about what Sr. Alin and Co. think about it.

            The pan-Turkists did not betray Hitler and not Stalin, but their peoples, they tried to plunge them into war with the whole World, for the sake of personal selfish interests.
            They were only interested in power and money, they, like you, were ready to lick the anus for any villains, fascists, zombies, Wahhabis and other ghouls for this.

            just like the Communists, led by Stalin, licked the anus of the Germans when they divided the spheres of influence in Poland, consistently seeking allied relations. An example of the Molotov Pact and the joint parade are proof of this.
        2. Misantrop
          Misantrop 24 November 2013 16: 45
          +4
          Quote: Clegg
          It is necessary that the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
          Make friends with rotten fish, it can very high quality poison any of your enemies wassat
          1. Clegg
            Clegg 24 November 2013 16: 55
            +3
            Quote: Misantrop
            Quote: Clegg
            It is necessary that the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
            Make friends with rotten fish, it can very high quality poison any of your enemies wassat

            what option)
      2. Netrocker
        Netrocker 24 November 2013 20: 41
        +2
        [quote = Corsair5912] [quote = Clegg] Well, legally, the "state" called Russia was also created by the Bolsheviks in 1922.
        Russia is the successor of the USSR, but not of the Russian empire. Legally, your country is not even 100 years old.
        Legally, the state of Russia has existed since at least the 5th century BC. (according to archeology from 3 thousand BC) on the same territory and with the same national composition of the population, mainly Slavic. There were no breaks in the law of succession for 2500 years. [/ quote]

        You see Levashov revised on YouTube !!! laughing The Slavs first appeared in history around the 9th century and not at all in the territory of modern Russia, but in Ukraine, Poland, Belarus. But before they were called Slavs by the Wends or Vendals ... Well, about the Slavic statehood in the vastness of the Russian Federation 3000 years ago, only a dreamer can speak - Fomenkovism is all! If you even read historical essays, you would know that it was on this territory that the Turkic Kaganate was from the borders of Korea to Europe. And this is from about the beginning of the 1st century to the 8th century A.D. The Turkic Haganate is just a succession from the Hun Empire, with which the Chinese principalities fought back in the 27th century BC, which they told the world about in their annals ...

        [Quote]
        Now the pan-Turkists are looking for a new master across the ocean, they cannot live without licking ... [/ quote]

        Pan-Turkists? Is it that in Turkey or something, the descendants of the Byzantine Greeks of the Anatolians, who were once Ottoman Ottomans? wink
  • Asan Ata
    Asan Ata 23 November 2013 23: 58
    +3
    To place weapons on the Adai land? Top frivolity. The guys can do this with their bare hands, but here is the base with weapons. Uzen events, but to slightly pick history, facts of disobedience both in Soviet times and after. No, you can’t play such games with these guys.
    Well, seriously, Nazarbayev is stronger than ever, and he does not intend to share the territory with anyone, even with the Yankees, rather wait for the Kazakh base in the United States. bully
    1. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 37
      -3
      Hmm, the Kazakh Arlan landed near the white house in Washington ... and condoleezza rice falls from fear !!!
      Oh laugh!
      But it’s not a secret why are they going to rake there? Not on the Caspian flotilla?
  • Serebryakov. 75
    Serebryakov. 75 24 November 2013 01: 40
    0
    America today looks extremely annoying. She no longer succeeds in smiling so chicly. In the Caspian, they also pinch their tail! yes
    1. ekzorsist
      ekzorsist 25 November 2013 22: 35
      -1
      Well, not so much fun.
  • Zomanus
    Zomanus 24 November 2013 02: 42
    -3
    With Central Asia, in general, everything is not easy. Some of our politicians still live memories of the USSR and the friendship of peoples. Although in fact there are bays and clans, the Middle Ages are shorter ... And these bays do not care about international agreements, they are most interested in their interest. So, about friendship and agreements, there can’t be any talk with them, just to intimidate or buy. And in my opinion, it would be better for us to equip the border with Central Asia, instead of summits and contests. Yes, we are friends with Kazakhstan. But through them comes a shaft of drugs and illegal migration. I am silent about Tajik-Uzbeks.
    1. smsk
      smsk 24 November 2013 10: 57
      +4
      And these bays do not care about international agreements, the main thing for them is their interest. So, about friendship and agreements and talk with them can’t go


      How can you throw such words when the mess itself is even worse in the country ??? Or do you have patriotic officials who love their homeland? One appointment Serdyukov is worth, spitting on the people. So, do not tell us what to do. Just funny honest word
  • Guun
    Guun 24 November 2013 07: 49
    +8
    I read what people write. I am surprised. To prove that the base with the military will not think too much. Calm down, THERE WILL BE NO DATABASES - it is forbidden by both the law of the Republic of Kazakhstan and the CSTO, and there will be NO ANYONE changing the good relations of the Russian Federation and the PRC with a dirty whore named usa, right? There is money at our top that they can build another city in the steppe with palaces and skyscrapers.
  • marshes
    marshes 24 November 2013 11: 24
    +2
    And what grandmothers are passing by the Russian Railways, and even leverage over the United States, although judging by the negotiations of the six, the United States and Iran have secretly agreed on something.
  • FormerMariman
    FormerMariman 24 November 2013 11: 28
    +5
    THE ARTICLE IS DRAWN FOR EARS BECAUSE IT IS NOT A BASIS AND A TRANSIT TERMINAL TO THE PORT OF AKTAU FOR FURTHER TRANSPORTATION OF MILITARY CARGOES! AND WHO WANTS TO SEE BETWEEN THAT IT WILL SEE BUT, BUT FIRST, LET EXPLAIN THE FOLLOWING FACT: http: //www.fondsk.ru/news/2013/11/22/rossija-i-saudovskaja-aravija-prodolzh
    ajut-peregovory-o-postavke-voennoj-tehniki-24165.html
    1. alone
      alone 24 November 2013 11: 35
      +4
      Max, hi ! The easiest and the loudest screaming about traitors!

      you know it’s easier to look for a speck in someone else’s eye, but not everyone is destined to notice a log in his eye.

      moreover, the author should get acquainted with the fact that NATO troops will leave Afghanistan through the port of Aktau-Baku-Tbilisi-Turkey-Europe. There is no other short route in the region. Among other things, they pay well for this transit.
  • avt
    avt 24 November 2013 11: 48
    -2
    Quote: Guun
    THERE WILL BE NO DATABASES - this is prohibited by both the law of the Republic of Kazakhstan and the CSTO,

    request The law is good. The law is a pillar! But the pillar can be circumvented, or both.
    Quote: Guun
    and no one will change good relations between the Russian Federation and the People’s Republic of China for a dirty whore named usa, does it make sense? D

    Again, today and now it is possible, yes, but your policy is “multi-vector,” and what will happen in the foreseeable future under the influence of external and internal factors, we can only judge “intact”, who will let the readers of the site go into the kitchen, hence the meaning of the actions is revealed sometimes after the past events.
    Quote: Guun
    There is money at our top that they can build another city in the steppe with palaces and skyscrapers.

    And where and in what banknotes does your and ours have money? So, if there is a smell of sulfur, it is better to organize the production of holy water on an industrial scale. "It is naive to believe that our bosom, overseas friends, at an opportunity, will not grab the Adam's apple in the name of the triumph of democracy in our countries. We are vodka, balalaika, bears, the KGB, and who are the Kazakhs, Sasha Cohen showed himself quite well, who will be Borat and even ten Blair advisers and enter the Latin alphabet, but even appoint English as the state one, you will still be such “Borat” for them. We have already gone through this, and judging by the increased percentage of polls regarding the growth of anti-American sentiments in Russia, it has finally reached ours who they are all holding us for.
    1. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 24 November 2013 12: 54
      +8
      Quote: avt
      but your policy is "multi-vector"
      Hello dear Imperial hi
      And, I am personally quite satisfied with the policies pursued by the Republic of Kazakhstan.
      I will give commonplace examples: Here you and Dmitry Medvedev congratulate the Kazakhs in the Kazakh language drinks And V. Putin personally invites Nazarbayev to the meeting of the G-20 summit .. good
      And the leadership of Turkey at every opportunity emphasizes the seniority and authority of Nazarbayev in the Turkic world, so wink
      Quote: avt
      overseas friends, when the opportunity arises, will not seize the Adam's apple in the name of the triumph of democracy in our countries.
      The grabber won't break ?!
      And, in general, we are very pleased with the Kazakhs that such a respected and respected forum member, how do you care about the future of Kazakhstan .. hi
      1. avt
        avt 24 November 2013 15: 10
        0
        Quote: Alibekulu
        And, I am personally quite satisfied with the policies pursued by the Republic of Kazakhstan.

        hi Well, there’s nothing to argue about, and to discuss too. Your government is also your chosen one, so if the majority are happy with its decision, then only a plus for your leadership.
        Quote: Alibekulu
        I will give commonplace examples: Here you and Dmitry Medvedev congratulate the Kazakhs in the Kazakh language drinks And V. Putin personally invites Nazarbayev to the meeting of the G-20 summit .. good

        The example is really trivial. For example, Reagan also spoke to Gorbachev in Russian a couple of phrases, for example, “do it but do it,” and something else. Polites at meetings, and even on camera, was not canceled.
        Quote: Alibekulu
        And the leadership of Turkey, at every opportunity, emphasizes the seniority and authority of Nazarbayev in the Turkic world, so wink

        So recently, Putin also held a press conference very nicely with Erdogan. So what? Again, you will put smiles under the camera in the frames of the "Turkic world" or all the same, the "Ottoman Empire". "By their deeds you will recognize them." This is somehow closer to me than looking out under a small scope and then comparing who and what in the protocol events more politeness let loose.
        Quote: Alibekulu
        how do you care so much about the future of Kazakhstan ..

        request Well, the interest is quite selfish, I don’t want to talk about the previous joint story with all the troubles and Victories, the neighbors are near and the border is not sour. So practically the vessels are communicating and touch someone what trouble, God forbid, the neighbor will certainly come across, do not even doubt .Good of course that are positive
        Quote: Alibekulu
        The grabber won't break ?!
        But it is good to have a sufficient number of “hats”, well-weighted and trained, loyal throwers, before declaring the type "We will throw our hats".
  • FormerMariman
    FormerMariman 24 November 2013 12: 38
    +3
    And how can it not be multi-vector when you have such imperial manners! You know more about America than they do about you! And we know more about you than you about us! Doesn't it remind anyone? And Russia needs the CSTO so as not to place or rent a military base from the Republic of Kazakhstan! And the CU is generally an economically "unequal marriage" at the expense of the wallet of ordinary Kazakhstanis. We are generally silent about the CIS! In any case, we are already in the same historical team and our cooperation is a military-political alliance in the first place. The thought of who will be after NAS is straining!
    1. avt
      avt 24 November 2013 17: 36
      -3
      Quote: Former Mariman
      But how can she not be multi-vector

      "In physics and mathematics, a vector is a quantity that is characterized by its numerical value and direction." ============ "Multi-vector" policy, this is from the field of psychiatry. Well, how can you deliberately move somewhere , if there is no direction of movement, but there is shuffling in different directions, or, as the saying goes, both ours and yours will dance for a ruble !? I would still understand if they operated on such terms as the balance of national interests, this is understandable and has nothing to do with schizophrenia.
      Quote: Former Mariman
      when you have such imperial manners

      Well, it means that you have an inferiority complex in terms of building your own state, and it is quite understandable because you are not an exception to the general rule of the former Soviet republics. After all, the basis of national building by new local "elites" is to one degree or another built on inferiority in relation to our common past This is where the desire and nostalgia to lean against something big and stable also grows. But since it is impossible to the former Empire. How then can you explain your national policy that has been hammered into your head for decades? There is simply no idea of ​​an equal socialist, that's the European Union and the "Turkic world" appear, by the way such attempts look very funny from our side, we have already passed this station with the "Slavic world" and the "union state" in particular.
      Quote: Former Mariman
      In any case, we are already in the same historical team
      Here I agree, there’s no getting away simply by virtue of geography, even without considering our common past.
      Quote: Former Mariman
      and our cooperation is a military-political alliance in the first place.

      And here so far, as before the flight to the moon, it is very far away and not through our fault. It's just that Kazakhstan's desires do not correspond to its capabilities. Otherwise, they would not constantly pedal the topic of "equality", the one who is equal does not require guarantees, he builds relations on the basis of mutually beneficial balance, and not seeks out with a magnifying glass - where is I "pinched national pride", even with hostile attitude equal as it is not rude, they are afraid to receive in response to Newton's law.
      Quote: Former Mariman
      The idea of ​​who will be after ANAS is annoying!

      And us, too, it will be a rapper point in the relations of our peoples, there is no doubt about it. But what will they be ?? request
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 17: 41
        -2
        Quote: avt
        Multi-vector "policy, this is from the field of psychiatry

        Brownian particle motion repeat
        1. avt
          avt 24 November 2013 18: 32
          -1
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          Brownian particle motion

          Perhaps even worse, there is at least some non-directed motion of a particle along a random trajectory, that is, at least some, but one direction is. Well, "multi-vector" - this is when a particle from place to career in different directions at the same time, it's just an explosion.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 24 November 2013 19: 06
            0
            Quote: avt
            it's just a blast
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 24 November 2013 13: 09
    -1
    Quote: marshes

    You can learn more about the economic level and economic indicators. And I can’t figure it out, I used to have a salary of about $ 200, now I earn a little more than $ 3000 as a family MP, from the Soviet legacy I have a drilling machine, but these are the 1932 junkers and oxygen tanks.

    I will comfort you, Nazarbayev, his family, and many more from the USSR who got much more than you.
    The economic level of Kazakhstan is estimated not by your salary, but by completely different indicators, more substantial. Russia is steadily buying raw materials from Kazakhstan, so far everything is in order, though geological exploration has been curtailed and the resumption of the mineral resource base has stopped.
    But engineering fell by 70% and foreign debt is growing rapidly.
    1. alone
      alone 24 November 2013 13: 15
      +6
      laughing Nikolay, you say so as if ordinary Russians are skating in oil.
      and your GDP is only for salaries and lives lol
      1. atalef
        atalef 24 November 2013 13: 26
        +5
        Quote: lonely
        laughing Nikolay, you say so as if ordinary Russians are skating in oil.
        and your GDP is only for salaries and lives lol

        Of course, for a salary, here is his declaration

        The government's website says that, in addition to income of 5 million, Putin has a land plot for individual housing construction with an area of ​​1500 square meters. m, as well as three cars owned: GAZ M-21, GAZ M-21R, "Niva" and the "Skif" trailer inherited from his father. Putin also owns an apartment of 77 sq. meters and another, which is in permanent use, with an area of ​​153,7 sq. m. The wife of the prime minister, Lyudmila Putin, earned only 146 rubles in a year.
      2. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 24 November 2013 15: 23
        -1
        Quote: lonely
        Nikolay, you say so as if ordinary Russians are skating in oil.
        and your GDP is only for salaries and lives

        Omar, we are talking about Kazakhstan.
        But in principle, you are right, we were all thrown and robbed of us all in 1991, and now they are also trying to play off.
    2. marshes
      marshes 24 November 2013 13: 34
      +4
      Quote: Corsair5912
      I will comfort you, Nazarbayev, his family, and many more from the USSR who got much more than you.
      The economic level of Kazakhstan is estimated not by your salary, but by completely different indicators, more substantial. Russia is steadily buying raw materials from Kazakhstan, so far everything is in order, though geological exploration has been curtailed and the resumption of the mineral resource base has stopped.
      But engineering fell by 70% and foreign debt is growing rapidly.

      Why not on a salary, a salary is taken from somewhere, it means someone is wasting if it is being spent it means taking money somewhere, in general I like tangible indicators that you can hold in your hands. There is no village where parents live before natural gas and asphalt roads and now there is a two-story outpatient clinic built, now the school is going to expand, otherwise the children are studying in three shifts, the kindergarten has all the best.
      Well, not only Russia buys raw materials, it is not even in the first place. Moreover, Kazakhstan invests 700 lemons more in investments in the Russian economy than Russia invested in Kazakhstan. Yes, and private money goes an order of magnitude more to Russia.
      Geological exploration has been going on since 1994, and no one turned it down, they even announced a maratorium, created a kind of fund for future generations.
      But with engineering, it’s a mystery what we produced, the final product that was bought on the foreign market, and torpedoes from China and India are still being bought.
      And about external debt can be more detailed.
      1. marshes
        marshes 24 November 2013 13: 51
        +4
        Former National Bank.
        The state of Kazakhstan's external debt does not cause any concern - G. Marchenko


        Kazakhstan's external public debt and state guaranteed debt is about $ 5 billion. This was stated by the Chairman of the National Bank of the Republic of Kazakhstan, Grigory Marchenko, in an interview with the Servant of the People program on the CPC channel.

        At the same time, according to the country's chief banker, the funds of the National Fund, which are fully placed abroad, amount to 45,5 billion dollars.

        “That is, in fact, the rest of the world owes more than $ 40 billion to our state. So we do not owe anyone, ”G. Marchenko explained.

        As for private debt, the head of the National Bank noted that almost half of it is the so-called intercompany debt. That is, large Western companies, bringing foreign direct investment to Kazakhstan, in order to pay less taxes, arrange them as loans to their subsidiaries operating in our republic. This is a total of about 60 billion dollars.

        “Neither the state nor the population of Kazakhstan will ever answer for these debts. Therefore, the state of external debt does not cause any concern, ”G. Marchenko assured.
        1. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 24 November 2013 16: 17
          -1
          Quote: marshes
          Kazakhstan's external public debt and state guaranteed debt is about $ 5 billion. This was stated by the Chairman of the National Bank of the Republic of Kazakhstan, Grigory Marchenko, in an interview with the Servant of the People program on the CPC channel.

          At the same time, according to the country's chief banker, the funds of the National Fund, which are fully placed abroad, amount to 45,5 billion dollars.

          “That is, in fact, the rest of the world owes more than $ 40 billion to our state. So we do not owe anyone, ”G. Marchenko explained.

          I wonder who lies Marchenko or the Kazakhstan portal and other Internet sites
          Kazakhstan's gross external debt as of September 30, 2012 amounted to $ 134,9 billion, compared with $ 125,2 billion at the beginning of 2012, the National Bank said.
          At the same time, according to the National Bank, the external debt of the banking sector during the reporting period decreased by 3,9% to $ 14,03 billion.
          Read more: http://news.nur.kz/244220.html
          1. marshes
            marshes 24 November 2013 16: 25
            +3
            Quote: Corsair5912
            I wonder who lies Marchenko or the Kazakhstan portal and other Internet sites

            Marchenko, a pro, that he was lying, he explained the structure of external debt in normal language. The larger part is investment. That is, large Western companies, bringing foreign direct investment to Kazakhstan, in order to pay less taxes, arrange them as loans to their subsidiaries operating in our republic. This is a total of about 60 billion dollars.
            1. Corsair5912
              Corsair5912 24 November 2013 17: 38
              0
              Quote: marshes
              Marchenko, a pro, that he was lying, he explained the structure of external debt in normal language. The larger part is investment. That is, large Western companies, bringing foreign direct investment to Kazakhstan, in order to pay less taxes, arrange them as loans to their subsidiaries operating in our republic. This is a total of about 60 billion dollars.

              In the Kazakhstan portal, they refer to the central bank, it must be assumed that kindergarteners do not work there either.
              Investments are essentially loans, they are not provided without collateral, and the terms on them are very tight, this is the same external debt that must be repaid with interest.
              Well, I’m no worse than a marchenka, I dealt with German, state and English banks.
              1. marshes
                marshes 24 November 2013 17: 58
                +2
                Quote: Corsair5912
                Well, I’m no worse than a marchenka, I dealt with German, state and English banks.

                Well, better still, Marchenko does not know, all the more he was one of the candidates for the post of chairman of the World Bank.
                I follow him and especially his statements, maybe things are going on and the crisis has gone through and I have no debts.
                By the way, there is an interesting info on gold at 2013year. Kazakhstan has 19% of gold from gold and foreign exchange reserves and Russia has only 8%.
                http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%97%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B9_%D1%80%D
                0%B5%D0%B7%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B2
                1. Corsair5912
                  Corsair5912 24 November 2013 20: 34
                  -1
                  Quote: marshes
                  I follow him and especially his statements, maybe things are going on and the crisis has gone through and I have no debts.
                  By the way, there is an interesting info on gold at 2013year. Kazakhstan has 19% of gold from gold and foreign exchange reserves and Russia has only 8%.

                  Where did you get such information?
                  At the beginning of the 2012 of the year, the reserves of the National Bank of Kazakhstan contained 89,5 tons of gold, at the beginning of the 2013 of the year the gold reserve was 115,15 tons.

                  Russia, according to the end of the period, retained the seventh place in terms of gold in international reserves, which amounted to 918 tons. Compared to the 2011 year, Russia increased the volume of gold in reserves by 9,7%.
                  1. marshes
                    marshes 24 November 2013 20: 51
                    +2
                    Quote: Corsair5912
                    Where did you get such information?

                    On Wiki, interest is the amount of gold in the gold currency reserve.
                    here is the position of Kazakhstan 26th place, 130,9 tons. 19%

                    Gold reserves in the Russian state reserve as of June 2013 amounted to 1 013,8 tons. The share of gold in the total volume of gold and foreign exchange reserves of Russia amounted to about 8%. In 2013, Russia ranks 7th in the world in terms of gold reserves.
                    But with China in general, they are interesting in 6th place and the share is only 1 percent, the rest is "paper".
          2. romb
            romb 24 November 2013 16: 38
            +4
            Do not confuse external gross debt, which consists largely of corporate obligations of residents of the Republic of Kazakhstan to entities (partners) from other countries that have arisen as a result of business activity (transactions) of participants, from the state (sovereign) debt of the country as a subject of international relations.
      2. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 24 November 2013 15: 30
        0
        Quote: marshes
        what’s not about salary, salary is taken from somewhere, then someone is wasting if it is being spent it means taking money somewhere, in general I like tangible indicators that you can hold in your hands. There is no village where parents live before natural gas and asphalt roads and now there is a two-story outpatient clinic built, now the school is going to expand, otherwise the children are studying in three shifts, the kindergarten has all the best.

        Salary depends not so much on the level of the economy as on the place of work.
        In 2009, I changed my job without changing my profession, the salary became 2 times higher.
        They are building everywhere now, builders also need to live.
        And from geological exploration in Kazakhstan, 10% did not remain in comparison with the USSR.
        1. marshes
          marshes 24 November 2013 15: 51
          +3
          Quote: Corsair5912
          Salary depends not so much on the level of the economy as on the place of work.

          Above, I wrote that I have a family MP, my salary is what I earn. There were hard days, 2007, it’s good that I prepared.
          Quote: Corsair5912
          And from geological exploration in Kazakhstan, 10% did not remain in comparison with the USSR.
          A map of the min.resource has already been drawn up; this is Russia still to search and seek.
          1. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 24 November 2013 18: 04
            -1
            Quote: marshes
            A map of the min.resource has already been drawn up; this is Russia still to search and seek.

            The map is about nothing, das ist fiction!
            For the economic valuation of objects, whether it is a deposit or a mineralized point, detailed exploration is needed, and there are no specialists left for scouts in Kazakhstan.
            1. atalef
              atalef 24 November 2013 18: 40
              +3
              Quote: Corsair5912
              Quote: marshes
              A map of the min.resource has already been drawn up; this is Russia still to search and seek.

              The map is about nothing, das ist fiction!
              For the economic valuation of objects, whether it is a deposit or a mineralized point, detailed exploration is needed, and there are no specialists left for scouts in Kazakhstan.

              It’s okay if there is money, they’ll hire, Russia is also attracting both foreign capital and specialists to the development of deposits
              1. Corsair5912
                Corsair5912 24 November 2013 19: 44
                -3
                Quote: atalef
                It’s okay if there is money, they’ll hire, Russia is also attracting both foreign capital and specialists to the development of deposits

                In Russia, its specialists have enough above the roof, and they travel quite a lot over the hill, they are in demand. In Russia, the best geological school in the world. Every month, according to several proposals, recruitment agencies send me work in Africa, L. America, Asia, Europe (Norway, Macedonia). There were offers from Kazakhstan, but something does not attract, the salary is low.
                Foreigners do not give money for new facilities. Here we are ready to invest in operating profitable enterprises, even if they buy 100% of the shares, just give.
                1. atalef
                  atalef 24 November 2013 20: 29
                  +2
                  Quote: Corsair5912
                  In Russia, its specialists are enough above the roof,

                  No doubt . nonetheless, the foreigners work the same

                  Quote: Corsair5912
                  , and they travel a lot over the hill, they are in demand

                  Great, it means Kazakhstan will have someone to choose from

                  Quote: Corsair5912
                  . In Russia, the best geological school in the world. Every month, according to several proposals, recruitment agencies send me work in Africa, L. America, Asia, Europe (Norway, Macedonia).

                  All the better . I’m sure that if she comes from Kazakhstan, for a decent salary, go explore them for new deposits.

                  Quote: Corsair5912
                  There were offers from Kazakhstan, but something does not attract, the salary is low.

                  This is one of two things that are either of little value or there is someone to choose from - the law of the market

                  Quote: Corsair5912
                  Foreigners do not give money for new facilities. Here we are ready to invest in operating profitable enterprises, even if they buy 100% of the shares, just give.

                  I don’t know where it is - they want it — they will buy it, they don’t want it — they won’t buy it — we have what.
                  Russian capital in Kazakhstan is the same as considered foreign hi
  • ia-ai00
    ia-ai00 24 November 2013 16: 56
    +1
    Netrocker KZ
    As far as I remember, it is planned in the Caspian only transit terminal not the base ...

    Naive, like children, but only those children who have not read instructive Russian folk tales, well, for example, about the FOX, from the ice house and the BUNNY, from the bast ... but apparently, if "in the know", then they hope for the BEAR PROTECT THE BUNNY ...
    1. alone
      alone 24 November 2013 17: 02
      +7
      Naive as children, but only those children who did not read instructive Russian folk tales
      Maybe the government and the leadership of Kazakhstan has concluded some kind of agreement or agreement on the deployment of a US base in Kazakhstan and which you know? If YOU have a link to this agreement, please submit it so that we all know and together would begin to curse the "insidious" powers that be Kazakhstan.
      and if all this is from the OBS cycle, then just say
  • Yeraz
    Yeraz 24 November 2013 17: 02
    +5
    Yesterday at work I met a girl from Kazakhstan, about 25 years old, and she does not know KAZAKH !!!!! I was shocked, when I asked how you worked, I said I had my own business and I don’t need Kazakh, but the business was covered husband receives citizenship. yes she was Russian))
    Yes he
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 24 November 2013 18: 10
      +2
      Quote: Yeraz
      Yesterday at work I met a girl from Kazakhstan, about 25 years old, and she does not know KAZAKH !!!!! I was shocked, when I asked how you worked, I said I had my own business and I don’t need Kazakh, but the business was covered husband receives citizenship. yes she was Russian))
      Yes he

      Most Russians living in Kazakhstan do not know Kazakh, like many urban Kazakhs. There were more than 100 nationalities in the USSR, it wasn’t for everyone to learn 100 languages, it’s easier for everyone to know Russian.
      Moreover, all the technical documentation at the factory was in Russian, Kazakhs do not have enough words in the language to replace Russian terminology.
      1. Yeraz
        Yeraz 25 November 2013 01: 30
        +1
        Quote: Corsair5912
        Quote: Yeraz
        Yesterday at work I met a girl from Kazakhstan, about 25 years old, and she does not know KAZAKH !!!!! I was shocked, when I asked how you worked, I said I had my own business and I don’t need Kazakh, but the business was covered husband receives citizenship. yes she was Russian))
        Yes he

        Most Russians living in Kazakhstan do not know Kazakh, like many urban Kazakhs. There were more than 100 nationalities in the USSR, it wasn’t for everyone to learn 100 languages, it’s easier for everyone to know Russian.
        Moreover, all the technical documentation at the factory was in Russian, Kazakhs do not have enough words in the language to replace Russian terminology.

        Notice I told the girl a maximum of 25 i.e. the generation of Kazakhstan, and not the USSR, I was surprised how much they had not kicked everyone out with such an attitude to the Kazakh language and Kazakhstan. This is the same Chechens and other nations would refuse to learn Russian and speak him.
  • Arkan
    Arkan 24 November 2013 19: 06
    +3
    Vigorous koumiss Kazakhs drink ...