Military Review

More than 6 thousand officers will be fired from the Ukrainian army

7
The army is preparing for mass layoffs of officers. Only to 2017 will be reduced about 6,5 thousands of lieutenants, majors, colonels. They are waiting for a new life in the civilian world. This was reported by the Ministry of Defense in response to an official media inquiry. However, what changes will affect the top officers, which includes generals and admirals, while not exactly know. According to a source in the ministry, every fifth out of a hundred Ukrainian generals (20 people) will lose their jobs. Layoffs are part of an army reform program that will be fully contractual until 2017. Optimization will cost the budget a tidy sum. As told in the press service of the Ministry of Defense, the dismissed servicemen are promised to be given mother aid: “Everyone will receive a one-time payment in the amount of 50% of salary for each year of service. But those who served in the army for ten years or more will be able to rely on payment. ” That is, if a major received on average 2500 UAH per month, then after being fired for ten years of service, he can count on 12,5 thousand.


More than 6 thousand officers will be fired from the Ukrainian army


The retired military will be offered retraining. Over the course of several years, this program will include more than 21 thousands of troops. “The cuts will no longer affect combat units, but rear ones - warehouses, repair shops, etc.,” said a source in the Ministry of Defense. - The retraining program is already in place. Many officers have an education other than a military academy. For example, many engineers. And after leaving the reserve, they will pass training courses and will be able to work in the civilian world. Many people choose a managerial direction - such people are especially valued in the labor market. ” There is a wide range of professions where the military can try - an economist, a photo designer, an engineer, etc. "Often the retired military are headed by security companies or subdivisions," said Valentin Badrak, director of the Center for Army Research, Conversion and Disarmament. “There is no panic among the military — for several years now they have been talking about the contractual basis, and our military is morally ready for reduction.

True, the military itself at the expense of its "moral readiness" for dismissal could argue. “Our army has nowhere to cut. Under the slogan "Equal to the leading world and European states", it is proposed to reduce by more than 50% of the supply, eventually leaving about 50 thousands of rear bayonets, - one of the officers of the mechanized coastal defense brigade in Crimea shares. - High-ranking military officials refer to the experience of our Western European partners. Like, they have few support units. Nonsense! For example, in the American army, the ratio of combat soldiers and those who provide them is of the order of one to three. Yes, not all of them carry epaulets on their shoulders, but without reliable logistics it is useless to talk about the effective implementation of combat missions. ” In 2014, thousands of officers will be laid off in 3, thousands in 2015 - thousands, in 1,5 - thousands of 2016 and in 1,1 - 2017 thousands.
Originator:
http://polemika.com.ua/news-131486.html
7 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. tronin.maxim
    tronin.maxim 20 November 2013 07: 02 New
    23
    Hmm, what's the shortcut? They said honestly: the complete elimination of the remnants of the army. recourse
    1. mirag2
      mirag2 20 November 2013 07: 40 New
      +4
      Yes, fellow officers, go home (if any), and say hello to Europe. Your army, service and life in Europe are not needed. Enough for ten thousand to die in Afghanistan and Iraq instead of Amers and British.
    2. artemiy
      artemiy 20 November 2013 08: 19 New
      +1
      Euro integration has begun.
      1. Hudo
        Hudo 20 November 2013 09: 59 New
        0
        And after leaving the reserve, they will undergo training courses and will be able to work in civilian life.


        By whom? "in his native collective farm as a watchman" (c)? Or walk around apartments with a pack of Tide washing powder, and ask the housewives of Balzac's age on camera: "Are you still digesting? Then we are coming to you."
      2. AVV
        AVV 20 November 2013 13: 24 New
        0
        Well, what else was to be expected, now the military will feel the euro-choice of the country's leadership, the military industry will begin to perish after the army, and then it will be that no one really knows! But the officials will transfer all their money to Western banks, will prepare yourself a springboard for a retreat from a sinking state through their own fault !!!
    3. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 10: 09 New
      -1
      Quote: tronin.maxim
      They said honestly: the complete elimination of the remnants of the army.

      When the officers and warrant officers were being reduced in the Russian army, this was called restructuring; in our country, the collapse was not applied. Kalina is no better than Chance. Both that and that G ...
      Call a spade a spade!
      1. Corsair
        Corsair 20 November 2013 18: 25 New
        +3
        Quote: Akim
        Kalina is no better than Chance.

        Already by its "adaptability" to the Ukrainian road "conditions" "Kalinka" will give a head start to ALL models created on the basis of the "Lanos-Anus" platform.
        Where the "Anus" sit on the "belly", the VAZ, due to the proportions of the chassis, passes on "Hurray" ...
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 18: 37 New
          0
          Quote: Corsair
          to the Ukrainian road "conditions" "Kalinka" will give a head start to ALL models created on the basis of the "Lanos-Anus" platform.
          Where the "Anus" sit on the "belly", the VAZ, due to the proportions of the chassis, passes on "Hurray" ...

          Shas! More than 4 years has been Sens. Of course not Moskvich 412, but went everywhere where the grandfather’s penny took place. And by softness Kalina will give odds. But overall the same AS.
          1. Corsair
            Corsair 20 November 2013 18: 47 New
            +2
            Quote: Akim
            I went everywhere where the grandfather’s penny passed.

            Don't "la-la", climb under both cars (Chance-Kalina), measure the ROAD CLEARANCE and LENGTH OF THE BASE, take into account the GEOMETRIC OVERHEADS ...

            What is it?
            "Lanos" was made for Asian roads, and "Kalina" ... for b-z-d-o-r-o-zh
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 19: 01 New
              -4
              Quote: Corsair
              "Lanos" was made for Asian roads, and "Kalina" ... for b-e-z-d-o-r-o-z-z

              And imagine Fiat 124 was made for Italy, but then it was finalized. So it is in Lanos. He went to the American market with a clearance of 151 mm. We have 160 mm. This is less than a penny, but also enough. The main thing is to back into the curb correctly. Do not tell through third ears. In Lanos, and even more so in Sens, there is a lot of other stuffed, but not the suspension.
              1. Corsair
                Corsair 20 November 2013 23: 11 New
                0
                Quote: Akim
                In Lanos, and even more so in Sens, there is a lot of other stuffed, but not suspension.

                There was no talk about the suspension, this is a separate issue. Read carefully.
                1. Akim
                  Akim 21 November 2013 06: 47 New
                  0
                  Quote: Corsair
                  There was no talk about suspension, this is a separate issue

                  Lanos "was made for Asian roads, and" Kalina "... for b-e-z-d-o-r-o-z-z

                  Ea this is exactly the suspension. Clearance. body kits are all conventions. In general, the most passable of our cars apart from SUVs - now it’s Bogdan-Cross (dozens of wagons)
      2. APASUS
        APASUS 20 November 2013 19: 36 New
        +3
        Quote: Akim
        When there was a reduction in officers and warrant officers in the Russian army, it was called restructuring; in our country, the collapse was not applied. Spell things by their proper names!

        Do you yourself believe in these payments and the opportunity to undergo retraining?
        In the country, a huge shortage of funds and a reduction in the army (resembling flight!) Are carried out precisely for this reason. And here it is necessary to make payments and give the opportunity to get a profession, and the country needs new workers, can they find themselves?
        I do not believe a single word, the people will be left without money and without work.
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 19: 52 New
          0
          Quote: APASUS
          Do you yourself believe in these payments and the opportunity to undergo retraining?

          I believe. About six people have already quit my course. This is the best option (benefits and payments are retained and the right to housing). But retraining nafig is not needed. We need skillful hands and that’s it. Demand for you then will always be.
          1. builder
            builder 20 November 2013 20: 05 New
            0
            Quote: Akim
            We need skillful hands and that’s it.

            We need qualified professionals with experience. Retraining is a fiction. especially smiled "economist, photo designer ...". Rather, a guard, a policeman.
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 20: 13 New
              0
              Quote: stroitel
              . Rather, a guard, a policeman.

              None of my friends went to the guards or the police. In security structures - yes. But this is not to portray the chopper’s spray. Although there are different people. It all depends on the individual.
              1. builder
                builder 20 November 2013 20: 20 New
                0
                Glad for your friends (I sincerely write). What military specialty did they have? and age. Himself to reduce the withdrawal from the Army in 2000. Thanks to the Army for the education (civil engineer). Settled without any problems. Others had a harder time.
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 20: 36 New
                  0
                  Quote: stroitel
                  What military specialty did they have? and age.

                  Different and specialties and ages. It's not about what is written, but what you can do. Himself an electrical engineer by civilian profession, and electric motors could only distinguish by color. But he knew about lasers, optics, and radar. However, not this path. Everything has to be able to. At the military institute, they laid down the masonry, and put the tiles and toilets, pulled the electrician. My classmate with old age quit - he puts down stoves. Rows good money. Another captain. Third major, etc. Even simple farmers profitable to be.
                  1. builder
                    builder 20 November 2013 20: 43 New
                    +1
                    I agree.
                    My classmate with old age quit - he puts down stoves.

                    Although not about that, he probably dreamed of going to a military school.
                    It's a shame you understand.
                    1. Akim
                      Akim 20 November 2013 20: 53 New
                      0
                      Quote: stroitel
                      Although not about that, he probably dreamed of going to a military school.

                      Someone is given, someone is not. Someone was walking with romance, but saw that it was hard work. I saw the infantry flyings crying. They came to the first year to become commanders, and in the fourth year they submit requests in part, in search of the posts of political officer (deputy for educational work).
                      1. builder
                        builder 20 November 2013 20: 59 New
                        +1
                        They came to the first year to become commanders, and in the fourth year they submit requests in part, in search of the posts of political officer (deputy for educational work).

                        On the contrary, we had requests for some of the units. Distribution mainly. And then it turns out the future officer himself is looking for a place of service. belay )
                      2. Akim
                        Akim 20 November 2013 21: 16 New
                        0
                        Quote: stroitel
                        And then it turns out the future officer himself is looking for a place of service. (Surprising near

                        No. The distribution remained so. But everyone is looking for a better place for themselves. And there are buyers from other law enforcement agencies. For example, I was invited to the National Guard, and someone went to the border guards. I wanted to go to Topaz, and even there I did my first practice (the second in Lvov at a radar plant) and wrote my diploma on this topic. But because of discipline I was shoved into the very For ... part. negative
                      3. builder
                        builder 20 November 2013 21: 26 New
                        0
                        Quote: Akim
                        Not. The distribution remained the same. But everyone is looking for a better place.

                        And then I thought, some sort of nonsense request
              2. Corsair
                Corsair 20 November 2013 23: 16 New
                -1
                Quote: Akim
                My classmate with old age quit - he puts down stoves. Rows good money.

                In Ukraine, he simply "sabbat", respectively, without a "social package", abroad in general a guest worker without a license ...
                1. Akim
                  Akim 21 November 2013 06: 49 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Corsair
                  In Ukraine, it is simply "sabbat", respectively, without the "social package"

                  Do not know - do not balabolte! angry
                  1. Corsair
                    Corsair 21 November 2013 20: 59 New
                    -1
                    Quote: Akim
                    Do not know - do not balabolte!

                    So you "frame your thought with text" so that everything is clear and understandable.
                    And it turns out: a hungry officer, wandering through the villages, lays down stoves for grandmothers in a scattered collective farm, for good money, 800-1200 hryvnias apiece, and where there is no money, he takes "in kind".

                    He does not pay taxes, generally happy as an elephant ...
                  2. Akim
                    Akim 21 November 2013 21: 15 New
                    0
                    Quote: Corsair
                    And it turns out: a hungry officer, wandering around the villages, lays down stoves for grandmothers in a scattered collective farm, for good money, 800-1200 hryvnia apiece, and where there is no money, he takes it "in kind"

                    That's how BS is in everything, you see one dirty trick. Your sarcasm pisses me off. No, he opened a small emergency and together with his partner lays down Russian ovens. The cost of such labor is 3-5 thousand dollars. They asked at least. As with the ravist then: "I don't know, but I'll fart anyway."
                    PS I don’t want to talk to you anymore, but I won’t put it on the BLACK LIST. This is not in my rules.
                  3. Corsair
                    Corsair 21 November 2013 21: 38 New
                    -1
                    Quote: Akim
                    PS I don’t want to talk to you anymore, but I won’t put it on the BLACK LIST. This is not in my rules.
                    Your "rules" are somehow on my side, you have established them for yourself, stick to ...
                    Rabies was previously treated with 40 injections in the stomach ...
                    It was written to you in Russian: Don't write "vague", unsaid comments.
      3. builder
        builder 20 November 2013 20: 23 New
        +1
        economist, photo designer, probably no one got a job wink
        The guard is me in the broad sense of the word.
  2. APASUS
    APASUS 20 November 2013 21: 11 New
    +1
    Quote: Akim
    But retraining nafig is not needed. We need skillful hands and that’s it. Demand for you then will always be.

    Once again I came home and went to my friend for good luck, what if at home?
    And it’s true at home. Well, I drank it here and asked about his work (the man worked abroad in the place with the squad for 8 years) Serezha has been sitting at home for half a year. And the answer was amazing and he just demolished me. ? inquired of him. Have not yet been offered!
    So where does this confidence come from?
    We are building modern chemical plants around the world, everyone needs polymers. We built them in Denmark, Norway, Poland, Finland, Russia, and only orders from Ukraine were not received at all. There is a complete technological crisis in the country, and it turns out you need hands. If I weren’t there if I lived I wouldn’t write - all this is a fairy tale!
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 21: 23 New
      -2
      Quote: APASUS
      So where does this confidence come from?

      For go, two work changed and still sorted out.
      As for polymers, Ukraine also produces and exports them. Not a specialist - I don’t know.
      1. APASUS
        APASUS 21 November 2013 19: 37 New
        0
        Quote: Akim
        As for polymers, Ukraine also produces and exports them. Not a specialist - I don’t know.

        I can competently say that Ukraine does not produce such polymers, even Russia did not produce them, everything was imported.
        Quote: Akim
        For go, two work changed and still sorted out.

        If this is not a secret, what do you work for?
        1. Akim
          Akim 21 November 2013 19: 56 New
          0
          Quote: APASUS
          If this is not a secret, what do you work for?

          The first half a year in a travel agency, the second half a year on television. Despite the fact that my group is not considered working under the Labor Code and in medicine, I should sit in a wheelchair, and not run in the mornings.
          Taken as a specialist. If a person is needed - he and an old pensioner will be invited.
  • sapran
    sapran 21 November 2013 01: 36 New
    +1
    You don’t believe it, your right to do so, but getting under the reduction for the underground is acceptable. the system is worked out and its return was expected only to doubt the amount of payments. What is shown in the article with the amounts is nonsense. I received conditionally speaking 5200 UAH before the demobilization. per month, now in my position they get 6700, and ahead of them a 20% increase before the new year. where are the author's figures from HZ ?!
    Escape is when they themselves put the report on the table, the rest is verbiage.
    Now, for retraining, my boss, having come under this article 6 years ago, passed retraining courses that included advanced English, and the system administrator (by the way, works on shifts in the MTS just in this direction), he finished KVIRTU, I did not wait for this article I left on my own, I’m already working, although by conscience it would be necessary to finish applying for a pension (with registration as a mess and bestiality), in general, I gave it up but I had to quickly go out for a new job ... I’m getting used to it.
  • Same lech
    Same lech 20 November 2013 07: 03 New
    +8
    God grant that people find their place in life.
    The main thing is that the situation with the 90s should not be repeated when the military was thrown as an unnecessary ballast to the mercy of fate.
    1. 225chay
      225chay 20 November 2013 08: 32 New
      +5
      Quote: The same LYOKHA
      God grant that people find their place in life.
      The main thing is that the situation with the 90s should not be repeated when the military was thrown as an unnecessary ballast to the mercy of fate.

      Why not invite them to Russia?
      The majority of Ukrainians were very worthy and well served ... Reliable warriors and, moreover, brothers ...
      1. Akim
        Akim 20 November 2013 10: 11 New
        -3
        Quote: 225chay
        Why not invite them to Russia?

        But what about the change of oath? Or what doesn’t count for yourself?
        1. randomizer
          randomizer 20 November 2013 12: 59 New
          +5
          Is Russia an enemy state? So, after being fired to go on a trip to Russia it’s normal, but is it a duty and an oath to change citizenship and continue working in your favorite job? You cannot feed the oath of children.
          1. Akim
            Akim 20 November 2013 13: 10 New
            -2
            Quote: Randaltor
            Is Russia an enemy state?

            So the US is not. I wish they waved to the USA or Poland. The military has more salaries there.
      2. randomizer
        randomizer 20 November 2013 13: 01 New
        +3
        Right. To simplify the issue of citizenship - with employment in military units - everyone will move. This will be a huge plus for Russia.
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 13: 08 New
          0
          Quote: Randaltor
          To simplify the issue of citizenship - with employment in military units - everyone will move.

          Who told you? TV?
      3. Slobozhanin
        Slobozhanin 20 November 2013 18: 10 New
        +2
        Quote: 225chay
        Quote: The same LYOKHA
        God grant that people find their place in life.
        The main thing is that the situation with the 90s should not be repeated when the military was thrown as an unnecessary ballast to the mercy of fate.

        Why not invite them to Russia?
        The majority of Ukrainians were very worthy and well served ... Reliable warriors and, moreover, brothers ...

        Do you miss the people in the rear services?
  • Edward72
    Edward72 20 November 2013 07: 17 New
    +3
    It is being said that they will feed the army of Zimbabwe.
    1. Same lech
      Same lech 20 November 2013 07: 21 New
      +5
      Well, they won’t be ZIMBAVES. THERE ARE THE ROMANIANS.
      ROMANIA has a great appetite for the Transnistrian territories up to Odessa.
      1. Edward72
        Edward72 20 November 2013 07: 27 New
        0
        So this is the same
      2. Akim
        Akim 20 November 2013 10: 12 New
        -2
        Quote: The same LYOKHA
        in Transnistria there is up to Odessa.

        Do not shine your teeth - catch a cold!
  • saag
    saag 20 November 2013 07: 19 New
    +4
    Long-range air defense is no longer
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 20 November 2013 07: 26 New
      +1
      Quote: saag
      Long-range air defense is no longer

      Shaw also reduced?
      1. Akim
        Akim 20 November 2013 10: 14 New
        0
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Shaw also reduced?


        Yeah. But why the heck is it necessary. It is logical for Russia to have long-range missiles.
  • predator.3
    predator.3 20 November 2013 07: 21 New
    +4
    In 2014, 3 thousand officers will be dismissed, in 2015 - 1,5 thousand, in 2016 - 1,1 thousand and in 2017 - 1 thousand.

    Hmm, the Serdyukov case now lives in Ukraine! It would be better to cut officials, that would be a saving, and in Russia in our country it’s completely absurd! officials -2 million, in the Ministry of Internal Affairs -2 million, and in the army, something ok. 800 thousand people, although everything should be the other way around!
  • en 45
    en 45 20 November 2013 07: 22 New
    +3
    "Director of the Center for Army Research, Conversion and Disarmament Valentin Badrak." I read "Mess" the first time. Probably it would be more correct.
  • Oskar
    Oskar 20 November 2013 07: 23 New
    +7
    After the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine got one of the most powerful military potentials in the world, weapons and material and technical support sufficient to conduct hostilities over a very long period. Now, in the event of any open confrontation, they will not be able to hold out for several days.
    And all this - against the background of a constant growth of threats ...
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 10: 17 New
      -5
      Quote: Oskar
      After the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine got one of the most powerful military potentials in the world, weapons and material and technical support sufficient to conduct combat operations over a very long period

      And there was nothing to feed this horde. And about a long time ... For example, Ukraine did not produce cartridges and already in the middle of the 90's officers went on guard with TT.
      1. Hudo
        Hudo 20 November 2013 10: 54 New
        0
        Quote: Akim
        . For example, Ukraine did not produce cartridges

        About Lugansk cartridge plant, you, Akim, apparently have not heard? In vain, my friend! A noble breeder by the way ... was.
        Quote: Akim
        90s officers went on guard with TT.

        I don’t remember. Rumors of replacing PM with TT were, but that ended.

        Quote: Akim
        And there was nothing to feed this horde.


        Well, it’s already closer to the 2000s, when it was stolen what was at the warehouse in warehouses. I recall how the soldiers were fed boiled corn crying, and ... salted chum salmon from barrels.
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 11: 07 New
          +1
          Quote: Hudo
          About Lugansk cartridge plant, you, Akim, apparently have not heard? In vain, my friend! A noble breeder by the way ... was.

          Lugansk cartridge did not produce then neither 5,45x39, nor 9x18, nor 14,5x114. As for TT, it’s not rumor. Did not have. In Odessa itself with Makar. Near Odessa (Chabanka, Tatarbunary, Belyaevka, Berezovka, etc. - went. Witness and participant himself).
          1. Hudo
            Hudo 20 November 2013 17: 58 New
            0
            Quote: Akim
            Quote: Hudo
            About Lugansk cartridge plant, you, Akim, apparently have not heard? In vain, my friend! A noble breeder by the way ... was.

            Lugansk cartridge did not produce then neither 5,45x39, nor 9x18, nor 14,5x114.


            USSR Lugansk cartridge plant. The range of cartridges of the Soviet period includes:

            5,45x39 / PS
            5,45x39 / US
            5,45x39 / PP
            7,62x54R / D
            9h18 PM
            9x18 PM / P
            Almost everything is exactly as you say, just the opposite.
            http://ammo-collection.com/index.php?title=%D0%9B%D1%83%D0%B3%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%81%
            D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9_%D0%B7%
            D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B4


            So "ambush" only with 14,5x114. Apparently the reason for the PM or TT lies in a slightly different plane.
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 18: 11 New
              -1
              Quote: Hudo
              USSR Lugansk cartridge plant. The range of cartridges of the Soviet period includes:

              I was not talking about the Soviet era and about now, but about the first half of the 90s. In general, the army began to receive the first 9x18 pistol cartridges from Shostka.
              1. Hudo
                Hudo 20 November 2013 18: 33 New
                0
                Quote: Akim
                I was not talking about the Soviet era and about now, but about the first half of the 90s.


                The time gap, Akim, is simply colossal - both between yesterday and today. fellow laughing Extremely unconvincing!

                Quote: Akim
                In general, the army began to receive the first 9x18 pistol cartridges from Shostka.


                Ku? And what is there in Shostka, except for chemists, where for sure gunpowders, warehouses were engaged? I did not hear about the cartridge production there, enlighten.
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 18: 52 New
                  0
                  Quote: Hudo
                  I did not hear about the cartridge production there, enlighten.

                  Now there, it seems, they only produce smoothbore, but there was a period when they produced pistol combat 9x18 and 9x17 and traumatic. Then the production was moved, either to Cherry or to Vinnitsa.
                  1. Hudo
                    Hudo 20 November 2013 19: 06 New
                    0
                    Quote: Akim
                    but there was a period when they released pistol combat


                    Well, this is quite in the style of the Ukrainian authorities. If there is a DEBUGGED cartridge production, sculpt something in semi-artisan conditions !!! It approximately looks as if having a wife preparing a wide variety of food is better than any restaurant, it’s necessary to have a meal with a side-cooked cookbook where even scrambled eggs burns every time.
                    By the way, did you have the pleasure of shooting these cartridges? In the sense of accuracy, delays in shooting, etc.
                    1. Akim
                      Akim 20 November 2013 19: 15 New
                      0
                      Quote: Hudo
                      By the way, did you have the pleasure of shooting these cartridges? In the sense of accuracy, delays in shooting, etc.

                      I had such an opportunity. And from Makar and from Stechkin and from Fort. The officer standard is 50 meters. laughing Here go determine the accuracy. It has always been good. However, TT is more like it.
                      1. Hudo
                        Hudo 20 November 2013 19: 24 New
                        0
                        Quote: Akim
                        I had such an opportunity. And from Makar and from Stechkin and from Fort


                        I’m telling you about the quality of Shostkin cartridges (by the way, can you tell me the code on the bottom of the cartridge case?), And who shot what and what results in fire training you achieved - let's not, as first-year cadets, measure by pipes before girls are fired, who what shot from there. laughing

                        Quote: Akim
                        However, I like TT more.


                        Our man (c) drinks
                      2. Akim
                        Akim 20 November 2013 19: 58 New
                        0
                        Quote: Hudo
                        I’m telling you about the quality of Shostkin cartridges (by the way, can you tell me the code on the bottom of the cartridge case?),

                        Do you remember the taste of kefir, which opened with a finger on top? So I am. That was a long time ago. Only common features. They brought a lot of them to the institute, but got into the troops, there for another two years there was only a reserve for wartime, and so they scoffed at 7,62x25.
      2. randomizer
        randomizer 20 November 2013 13: 05 New
        0
        The Lenin plant was called. He fed half the city. Some corps remained, Efremov With Zhvania on this rose strongly.
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 13: 24 New
          0
          Quote: Randaltor
          The Lenin plant was called. Half the city fed

          Do not trifle Nadia (Hippolytus)
          This is the same as saying that the DMZ fed the floor of Donetsk. There were many enterprises there.
          And now it works. Of course, the scale is not the same.
    2. Corsair
      Corsair 20 November 2013 11: 36 New
      +3
      Quote: Akim
      And there was nothing to feed this horde. And about a long time ... For example, Ukraine did not produce cartridges and already in the middle of the 90's officers went on guard with TT.

      The "World Granary" (the Agrarian Center) could not cultivate the fields, the "All-Union Forge" (the economically developed East) stopped "forging", the "All-Union Health Center" (Crimea + partly the West) could not heal ...
      Just tell me, the Ukrainian authorities, for all the apparent changes in the courses, PLANNED and CONSISTENTLY followed only one thing - ENRICHMENT by RIPPING.

      And on the side of what, their own economy or Russian gas.

      And the noble cartridges in Lugansk under the USSR did ...
      1. Akim
        Akim 20 November 2013 11: 46 New
        0
        Quote: Corsair
        "World Granary" (Agricultural Center) ...

        Listen, I'm wrapping you now
        What do you constantly transfer the 90s to now? Or is memory only stuck on this? Tea. You didn’t run away from a full stomach to Russia? There was an overabundance of professions including the military. In Russia, the officer, too, did not boom very much then. 7-8 billion for the entire huge army and the war in Chechnya. Or ask how the divisions from Germany then lived in the fields.
        1. Corsair
          Corsair 20 November 2013 11: 58 New
          +2
          Quote: Akim
          Listen, I'm wrapping you now
          What do you constantly carry 90 on now?

          Apply your "Matyuk" to the leadership of Ukraine (from 1990 to the present), thanks to which the country firmly "settled" in the 90s ...
          And then, you see, he had no cartridges (maybe "grenades of the wrong system?). It was necessary to work, and not to play tricks on the Maidan ...
          About "Maidan" the claim is not against you personally ...
          1. Akim
            Akim 20 November 2013 12: 16 New
            0
            Quote: Corsair
            It was necessary to work, not Maidan to play tricks ...

            It was necessary to. But you see, Ukraine alone did not master the pressure of America. Ataman then did not have a gold reserve. In general, after the year 2000, it was better to supply the army then. And so it went on until the 5th (inclusive).
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 12: 34 New
              -1
              PS In pursuit. We now have bourgeoisie such as Landik (Nord factory) asking them to give them another year. Like, do not rush to sign, we are not yet ready to switch to European standards. And who was bothering him before that? They earned profits and made tin iron appliances. Tip. Do not take the Nord. It can’t - figs with him. There are buyers at the plant (and already have).
              1. Corsair
                Corsair 20 November 2013 12: 40 New
                +4
                Quote: Akim
                Tip. Do not take the Nord.

                Take "Dnepr", it is also Landik's and the same "tin" ...
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 12: 56 New
                  0
                  Quote: Corsair
                  Take "Dnepr", it is also Landik's and the same "tin" ...

                  I have not even seen such in the store. Generally. Do not take the Ukrainian (Landikovsky) refrigerator - buy Belarusian or Lithuanian.
              2. zmey_gadukin
                zmey_gadukin 20 November 2013 15: 45 New
                +1
                Quote: Akim
                Tip. Do not take Nord

                I have Atlant. While Belarusians are satisfied.
                But the Germans are still better)
                and Nord - shit, even though I'm from Donetsk
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 15: 57 New
                  0
                  Quote: zmey_gadukin
                  and Nord - shit, even though I'm from Donetsk

                  That's why I don’t advise everyone to the former Donetsk citizen. A friend works for me there - he doesn’t keep anything Nordic in the house.
            2. Corsair
              Corsair 20 November 2013 13: 14 New
              +1
              Quote: Akim
              In general, after the 2000, the army began to be better equipped then. And so it went on until 5 (inclusive).

              Is it like in a joke about a "wealthy" family ?:
              "Our family began to live in TWO times better before ONE the tea bag was on TWOand now each YOUR OWN!" wink
              1. Akim
                Akim 20 November 2013 13: 31 New
                0
                Quote: Corsair
                "Our family began to live TWO times better, before ONE tea bag was for TWO, and now everyone has their own!"

                Well, let it go. In any case, I no longer dragged a bag of potatoes from the warehouse, so that I would pay for the hut and eat something (because Yusch had canceled the rations), and the cat cried out for the allocation.
        2. Corsair
          Corsair 20 November 2013 12: 14 New
          +3
          Quote: Akim
          In Russia, the officer, too, did not boom very little then. 7-8 billion for the entire huge army and war in Chechnya. Or ask how the divisions from Germany then lived in the fields.

          Several times, personally, I tried to "drum into" that Ukraine and Russia in the 90s were in EQUAL conditions.
          The fact that Russia is "pulling out" is a FACT, and the fact that Ukraine has not only slowed down in its development, and is also degrading, is also a FACT.
          1. Akim
            Akim 20 November 2013 12: 22 New
            0
            Quote: Corsair
            The fact that Russia is "pulling out" is a FACT, and the fact that Ukraine has not only slowed down in its development, and is also degrading, is also a FACT.

            See more of Kisilev am I told you. There is a work. You need to be able to search.
            1. Corsair
              Corsair 20 November 2013 12: 36 New
              0
              Quote: Akim
              See more of Kisilev

              Kiselyov TWO, one in Russia, the other "fugitive" "entrenched" in Ukraine and not on them "Light converged like a wedge", and without them I have a lot of sources about the economic and financial situation in the economically developed East, the "heat" of which speaks a lot about the "average temperature in the ward" ...

              And the "chamber" is increasingly reminiscent of the work of the Great Russian POET A.P. Chekhov "(Variation on a quote from Yanukovych) ...
              1. Akim
                Akim 20 November 2013 12: 50 New
                0
                Quote: Corsair
                Kiselyov TWO, one in Russia, the other "fugitive" "dug in" in Ukraine

                This poz is in London already. Let him sit there. I’m talking about Dmitry, who also sang for a long time in 2004 on the Ukrainian TV channel for money, as everything is fine here.
                Well this is a retreat.
                Yes, the east of Ukraine is tied to the Russian market and no one denies this, that the fall in trade hit them harder. But since the Kremlin went for it, it means they found a replacement. Or do you think he will throw new partners if Ukraine does not sign the association? There is already a replacement and there is no turning back. Putin himself burned the bridges, and Yanukovych brought him a torch. People still have little understanding. But maybe it's for the best.
                1. Corsair
                  Corsair 20 November 2013 13: 04 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Akim
                  Yes, the east of Ukraine is tied to the Russian market, and no one denies this, that the fall in commodity circulation has hit them harder.

                  The question is not "tying", but that the economy has been in a fever for a very long time and without the participation of Russia.
                  1. Akim
                    Akim 20 November 2013 13: 14 New
                    0
                    Quote: Corsair
                    The question is not "tying", but that the economy has been in a fever for a very long time

                    The economy has been in a fever since the arrival of Prime Minister Tymoshenko in 2005.
                    1. Corsair
                      Corsair 20 November 2013 13: 18 New
                      0
                      Quote: Akim
                      The economy has been in a fever since the arrival of Prime Minister Tymoshenko in 2005.

                      Before HER, the indicators are "not a fountain", but AFTER generally "burnt earth" ...
                    2. Akim
                      Akim 20 November 2013 13: 34 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Corsair
                      Before HER, the indicators are "not a fountain", but AFTER generally "burnt earth" ...

                      Yes, I will not go broadcast. Live in Russia and rejoice. I feel good here.
                    3. Corsair
                      Corsair 20 November 2013 16: 52 New
                      0
                      Quote: Akim
                      Yes, I will not go broadcast. Live in Russia and rejoice. I feel good here.

                      Yes God forbid! Live on health, but do not be lazy to ANALYZE what is happening around you ...
            2. The comment was deleted.
  • randomizer
    randomizer 20 November 2013 13: 03 New
    0
    Vigorous bonbs were.
  • predator.3
    predator.3 20 November 2013 07: 29 New
    0
    It is worth remembering that with the collapse of the USSR, the infrastructure of three military districts remained on the territory of Ukraine, which included a missile army, three combined arms and two tank armies, one army corps, four air armies, a separate air defense army, and the Black Sea Fleet of the USSR Navy . The entire group of troops and forces numbered about 780 thousand personnel, 6,5 thousand tanks, about 7 thousand armored combat vehicles, up to 1,5 thousand combat aircraft, more than 350 ships and support vessels, 1272 strategic nuclear warheads of intercontinental ballistic missiles and almost 2,5 thousand units of tactical nuclear weapons.

    Today, international agreements allow Ukraine to have a powerful European army. In particular, according to the Treaty on Conventional Armed Forces in Europe (CFE), Ukraine can have: 450 personnel of the Armed Forces; 000 tanks (4080 in regular units); 3130 armored fighting vehicles (5050); 4350 artillery guns of caliber over 4040 mm (100); 3240 attack helicopters; 330 combat aircraft.

    http://warfiles.ru/show-42820-chto-stoit-za-reformoy-vooruzhennyh-sil-ukrainy-i.
    html
  • major071
    major071 20 November 2013 07: 31 New
    +7
    The state should take care of its citizens, before the reduction of military personnel, it is necessary to create jobs, and in connection with the collapse of industry in Ukraine, I think that there will be no work. To create new jobs need cash investment, but money is not known. fool
    1. Hudo
      Hudo 20 November 2013 10: 02 New
      +1
      Quote: major071
      Before the reduction of military personnel, it is necessary to create jobs, and in connection with the collapse of industry in Ukraine, I think that there will be no work. To create new jobs need cash investment, but money is not known.


      All decent places are already taken. It turned out as in the army saying: "Serve, you will get a badge." sad
      1. Akim
        Akim 20 November 2013 10: 26 New
        -3
        Quote: Hudo
        All decent places are already taken.

        I’ll take friends to my work if that’s it. And there are many like me.
        1. Hudo
          Hudo 20 November 2013 10: 35 New
          +1
          Quote: Akim
          Quote: Hudo
          All decent places are already taken.

          I’ll take friends to my work if that’s it. And there are many like me.


          Akim, people simply wiped the ass with this decision.
          1. Akim
            Akim 20 November 2013 11: 10 New
            0
            Quote: Hudo
            Akim, people simply wiped the ass with this decision.

            And everywhere like that. That and the people themselves will leave if the defense budget is not increased next year, or even reduced. Up to twenty years, two or three can be endured, but they did 25!
        2. Corsair
          Corsair 20 November 2013 11: 17 New
          0
          Quote: Akim
          I’ll take friends to my work if that’s it. And there are many like me.

          Akim, if you are a "PP" (private entrepreneur), then imagine in what "framework" the Ukrainian financial and fiscal legislation places such enterprises ...
          Vital unprofitable Ukrainian "PP" to have OFFICIALLY DRAFT hired employees.

          ... Or maybe you are the oligarch Renat Akhmetov, hiding under the guise of Afro-American, the owner of factories, newspapers, ships ???
          1. Akim
            Akim 20 November 2013 11: 22 New
            0
            Quote: Corsair
            Akim, if you are a "PP" (self-employed)

            There is nothing to take on such hemorrhoids. Just at work, my word is something and it weighs something.
    2. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 10: 20 New
      0
      Quote: major071
      osudarstvo must take care of its citizens,

      Yes, the police annual reductions more. As for staff officers, they are willingly hired. Before captains it is desirable - until the brains are numb.
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 20 November 2013 07: 32 New
    +1
    “Our army has nowhere to reduce. Under the slogan “We are equal to the leading world and European states”
    Quiet Ukrainian night .... and the fat must be hidden ..))) Ah Slavs ..
  • ZU-23
    ZU-23 20 November 2013 07: 39 New
    0
    It’s a pity for men to see half going to Syria to earn money, it’s better that this army puts everyone in their place as the Egyptian army did, but Ukrainian generals have obviously already pumped their loot into Europe and the west.
    1. Slobozhanin
      Slobozhanin 20 November 2013 18: 20 New
      +1
      Quote: ZU-23
      It’s a pity for men to see half go to Syria to earn money.

      Who will go? Former accountants and economists, supply managers in uniform? :) Perhaps a small percentage of techies, but for people with the mind and hands in Ukraine, a lot of work ...
      1. Hudo
        Hudo 20 November 2013 18: 39 New
        0
        Quote: Slobozhanin
        but for people with the mind and hands in Ukraine there is plenty of work ...


        You see, dear Slobozhanin, for people with mind and hands, ways to earn decent money enough everywhere and everywhere. One sad thing is starting from scratch is getting harder every year.
  • Stinger
    Stinger 20 November 2013 07: 54 New
    0
    Yes, the army is usually strangled in a strong embrace of love, drenched in burning tears.
  • strel212
    strel212 20 November 2013 07: 58 New
    0
    Quote: predator.3
    Hmm, the Serdyukov case now lives in Ukraine! It would be better to cut officials, that would be a saving, and in Russia in our country it’s completely absurd! officials -2 million, in the Ministry of Internal Affairs -2 million, and in the army, something ok. 800 thousand people, although everything should be the other way around!


    This is a war against the people, keep him in check
  • Nitarius
    Nitarius 20 November 2013 07: 58 New
    0
    Quote: Stinger
    Yes, the army is usually strangled in a strong embrace of love, drenched in burning tears.

    I support ..... OH I feel that something will be in UKRAINE .... it will not lead to anything GOOD .....
    It’s a pity that I’m strange ... what they’re doing ..... here our local Russians are sometimes ready to put on the KOL for reform, but the neighbors are no better ..
  • Indifferent
    Indifferent 20 November 2013 08: 06 New
    +2
    And I would have suggested that these Ukrainian officers join our army in Shoigu’s place! No need to cook their own. FREEBIE! How much money can be saved from what the previous leadership stole.
  • awg75
    awg75 20 November 2013 08: 11 New
    +1
    Ukraine soon awaits crisis cleaner than Greek
  • makarov
    makarov 20 November 2013 08: 12 New
    +2
    Quote: Oskar
    After the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine got one of the most powerful military potentials in the world, weapons and material and technical support sufficient to conduct hostilities over a very long period.


    Yeah! They still can’t sell it. They are going to stuff 10 pockets for another XNUMX years.
  • saag
    saag 20 November 2013 08: 18 New
    0
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Shaw also reduced?

    In connection with physical wear, stationary S-200s are dismantled
  • shark
    shark 20 November 2013 08: 54 New
    +1
    "Many choose a managerial direction - such personnel are especially appreciated in the labor market" - an addition is expected in the regiment of plant-man))) An interesting approach. To fire the right people and retrain them as useless. Management is a sump for the most empty and undertrained people. Personal observations.
  • morpogr
    morpogr 20 November 2013 09: 30 New
    0
    I will not be surprised if Ukrainian officers go to the Russian army as ordinary contract soldiers.
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 10: 24 New
      -3
      Quote: morpogr
      Ukrainian officers will go to the Russian army as ordinary contract soldiers.

      Or maybe you can take me as a cleaner or dishwasher? Yes, you went with such an assumption !!!
    2. shark
      shark 21 November 2013 12: 10 New
      0
      no, well, this is overkill. There is professional ethics. The officer will never become ordinary. They don’t starve there.
  • HAM
    HAM 20 November 2013 09: 44 New
    +1
    I especially liked the offer to the officers to be a photo designer, do not forget to give the rifle with optics, otherwise the "retraining" is a fig.
  • taseka
    taseka 20 November 2013 10: 09 New
    +1
    Torn apart politically, destroyed by clans, economically, sold geopolitically - the army of Ukraine now destroyed without war - will be replaced by SBU and police Cerberus! Sad !!!
  • Jurkovs
    Jurkovs 20 November 2013 10: 18 New
    +1
    The number of Ukrainian geese in Syria and other hot spots will increase again, and they will usually oppose us.
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 10: 29 New
      +1
      Quote: Jurkovs
      Again, the number of Ukrainian geese in Syria and other hot spots will increase,

      Oh well. The major loggerhead, who spent 10 years on a hard box from under the stew, is a super wild goose!
      1. Misantrop
        Misantrop 20 November 2013 11: 11 New
        0
        Quote: Akim
        The major loggerhead who spent 10 years on a hard box from under the stew is a super wild goose!
        For some reason, the experience of all the reforms suggests that it’s just such rear-guard personnel that such reductions slip through without any special problems ...
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 11: 19 New
          +1
          Quote: Misantrop
          For some reason, the experience of all the reforms suggests that it’s just such rear-guard personnel that such reductions slip through without any special problems ...

          Here are the crap. This was a saying in the institute: Better to sit on a stew’s hard box than on a BMP soft chair.
          If there are no posts letech shoved without remorse into the infantry. I fell out of laughter when I was deciphered by AGS-17 (washing unit at 17kW). In our battalion, three of the Zhytomyr space communications served as ordinary commanders.
      2. Corsair
        Corsair 20 November 2013 11: 47 New
        0
        Quote: Akim
        Oh well. The major loggerhead, who spent 10 years on a hard box from under the stew, is a super wild goose!

        And take it to your company, where:
        Quote: Akim
        Just at work, my word is something and it weighs something.
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 12: 18 New
          +1
          Quote: Corsair
          And take it to your company, where:

          I will take those that I trust. I told FRIENDS.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • rolik2
    rolik2 20 November 2013 10: 52 New
    +1
    recently he spoke with army men (parts near), no one is going to fire anyone, they are being reduced by officers who do not have officers, and those officers who are assigned to reductions are immediately offered positions to replace the reduced ones, and not sergeant like yours and equivalent.
    1. Hudo
      Hudo 20 November 2013 10: 57 New
      0
      Quote: rolik2
      there are no officers

      What is it like? Are these posts vacant, or are these positions NOT officers?
      P.S. In general, you yourself have served, or judging by the style and vocabulary of what you wrote from room-keepers for ukrotekstvo.
      1. rolik2
        rolik2 20 November 2013 15: 49 New
        0
        very simply, on the example of his unit, after the last staff changes, the number of officer posts increased from 11 to 18.
        But in reality, there were never more than 8 officers, the remaining posts were either not staffed or they were occupied by ensigns.
        The states were initially a little inadequate, as an example, the position of the head of the workshop from senior director was made major. Now seeing these excesses, the states begin to correct, removing officers' posts and replacing them with ensigns. And in the statement of financial and economic justification they write REDUCE the officer position, and at the same time calculate how much money is needed for the severance pay if they dismiss, lifting if they transfer to another part, etc.
        Although there was never a real officer in this position.

        And I would ask you to follow the bazaar, otherwise I can send for the fatherland and send it by mother.
    2. Misantrop
      Misantrop 20 November 2013 11: 16 New
      +1
      Quote: rolik2
      there are no officers
      And for what reason are there vacant posts at the same time not interested? For example, the communication center for the control of explosives in Simferopol is a very small part. There are not many officers. And all sergeant posts at the moment are vacant. Young people do not want to go on a contract, get a lot of anxiety, a complete absence of days off and disgusting future prospects for as much as 1500 hryvnias per month ... request
      1. Kars
        Kars 20 November 2013 11: 59 New
        +3
        Of course, I wouldn’t go to the army for that kind of money. But someone will do it.
        And the reduction of armies, especially in Europe, is a trend. Who is not cutting now? All the same, we do not live in Africa.
      2. rolik2
        rolik2 20 November 2013 15: 55 New
        0
        And for what reason are there vacant posts

        He wrote above and on the example of his site. The number of officer posts was introduced excessively, educational institutions were not designed to train such a number of officers, do not equal Simferopol with the rest of Ukraine, where 90% of military units are located in small towns
        already for 1500 hryvnias

        Where did you find such salaries? In the first year of the contract I have at least 2500 UAH. and for towns where the average salary of 2000 UAH is pretty good money.
        1. shark
          shark 21 November 2013 12: 13 New
          0
          2500grv. What is this? poverty allowance? here is 25000 I would still understand
          1. Akim
            Akim 21 November 2013 12: 52 New
            +1
            Quote: shark
            here is 25000 I would still understand

            I somehow can’t believe that in Russia a contractor gets 3 thousand bucks. And than. The increase in salaries leads to an inapplicable increase in consumer prices. In more expensive Odessa, food prices are completely different than in Nikolaev and especially in Kherson.
  • komsomolets
    komsomolets 20 November 2013 11: 15 New
    0
    In Ukraine, the army and a VV-serviceable supplier of personnel to various private security companies. The state is unnecessary, and the oligarchs always need a guard to maintain the honestly earned good. This is a fact in our country.
  • Ivan Sirko
    Ivan Sirko 20 November 2013 12: 55 New
    -1
    That's right, stop feeding the parasites. In Ukraine, most military officers are opportunists and alcoholics. No, to juggle some junta, so they swore an oath to the accused twice. And now I had to pay.
    Choosing bread, you lose freedom, and the beggar is always not free.
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 13: 07 New
      +5
      Quote: Ivan Sirko
      In Ukraine, most military officers are opportunists and alcoholics.

      Usually I do not put cons, but I will put it to you. Yes, and alcoholism is a conditional concept. A bottle of vodka / cognac once a week is not an alcoholic.
      1. Corsair
        Corsair 20 November 2013 13: 30 New
        +1
        Quote: Akim
        Yes, and alcoholism is a conditional concept. A bottle of vodka / cognac once a week is not an alcoholic.

        For your comment, my (+). By American standards "Bottle / once a week - a goner pathological drunk laughing .
      2. Ivan Sirko
        Ivan Sirko 20 November 2013 14: 22 New
        +1
        Akim, no offense, I'm an alcoholic too good or for prezika insulting?
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 14: 31 New
          +2
          Quote: Ivan Sirko
          or for prezika insulting?

          For insulting officers. I served neither Kuchma nor Yushchenko, but Ukraine. And so that young officers do not get drunk after high schools they must be chased without sleep and rest. They drove me - I did not drink too much. And now I can measure cubes with youth.
          1. Ivan Sirko
            Ivan Sirko 20 November 2013 14: 56 New
            +1
            Agree that you belong to the minority. The matter is not in cubes, but in what is inside, in the soul.
            About 10 years ago I saw cadets of the Bohun School selling camouflage and berets. Now they are officers. What, interestingly, are they selling?
            And as to whom you served, those who served themselves and their beloved say so. The commander in chief is a twice-convicted felon, and where is the honor of the officer?
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 15: 15 New
              +1
              Quote: Ivan Sirko
              About 10 years ago I saw cadets of the Bohun School selling camouflage and berets. Now they are officers. What, interestingly, are they selling?

              And I was selling. And the spoons and plates hanging from the warehouse as well. Because the new OK commander came and introduced the strictest control. Cadets and could not earn money, expelled immediately. Even for seeing you driving. What else to do? If the scholarship is 14 hryvnias, and for the chevrons, badges, blood types and soap and soap we had to spend 18. So there were two ways out: either sell non-worthwhile or donate blood in a self-propelled gun, because the army blood-collector gave only tea with sugar.
              Cadets did not chase after millions.
              Salary went - everything stopped.
              1. Ivan Sirko
                Ivan Sirko 20 November 2013 15: 36 New
                +1
                Salary went - everything stopped

                Fresh tradition, but hard to believe.
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 15: 52 New
                  0
                  Quote: Ivan Sirko
                  Fresh tradition, but hard to believe.

                  Why do I need more. The lieutenant's salary was 450 hryvnias. I gave 200 for an apartment. Family in the hostel 120. I practically didn’t spend money on food. Clothes, too, In Kiev, or in Odessa, there would still be much to go, but in parts where there were forests and a town with colonel daughters and the officers' house where films were played for free, there were no places of entertainment. One bar - from which the patrol drove us. Yes, and there was no time to have fun. And on vacation or a business trip, like a king with extra dough. A bottle of Obolon 2000 cost 1,20. When he was transferred to a big city, he was missed. So inflation, and salaries are not indexed.
                  1. Ivan Sirko
                    Ivan Sirko 20 November 2013 21: 21 New
                    +1
                    Yes you are straight Mahatma Gandhi belay In 2000, my workers paid $ 300 and were slightly unhappy request
                    All this is strange - the officer is ashamed to be poor, especially against the background of the bourgeois part of the population.
                    I remember "The Man with the Gun" ...
                    1. Akim
                      Akim 20 November 2013 21: 31 New
                      0
                      Quote: Ivan Sirko
                      All this is strange - the officer is ashamed to be poor, especially against the background of the bourgeois part of the population.

                      Mamo te shcho mamo. In 2005, as a journalist, I received 240 dollars in Odessa and it was considered a good salary. Sens also managed to buy.
  • vkrav
    vkrav 20 November 2013 13: 18 New
    0
    vmsuk, too, that - "reorganize." One type of major jumped from the ninth floor when his sharaga was disbanded. I asked one "deputy" - what, ukram army is not needed at all? He happily answered - And what for? when there were a lot of them, they were the electorate. And now they are of no interest to anyone - only the costs ... I have never looked at the problem from this point of view ... Not a Ukrainian because.
  • leon-iv
    leon-iv 20 November 2013 13: 28 New
    0
    Ukrainians, and what is your real income on hand is considered average?
    Otherwise, the RFP does not appreciate.
    And yes, we get a summer after school gets more than your brigade commander?
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 13: 40 New
      +2
      Quote: leon-iv
      And yes, we get a summer after school gets more than your brigade commander?

      Yes, the salary of a Russian lieutenant is approximately equal to a regiment in Ukraine. Did you decide to gloat? So compare with the salaries of the US military. Or are we strong only in front of Ukraine?
      1. Corsair
        Corsair 20 November 2013 14: 28 New
        +1
        Quote: Akim
        Yes, the salary of a Russian lieutenant is approximately equal to a regiment in Ukraine. Did you decide to gloat? So compare with the salaries of the US military. Or are we strong only in front of Ukraine?

        Again "twenty five" ...
        But how can you still not understand that the Americans are overseas, and let them stay there for themselves! ..., and WE are two peoples who have emerged from the same "short pants", neighbors at the beginning with almost EQUAL starting opportunities, however - they were equal in different ways ...

        Ukraine is a country of illusions and pipe projects ...

        Compare Ukraine with Poland or Romania and the "alignment" will also not be in your favor ...
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 14: 46 New
          0
          Quote: Corsair
          Compare Ukrana with Poland or Romania and the "alignment" will also not be in your favor ...

          I will compare. Indeed, the alignment is not in favor of the Ukrainian economy. But neither in Romania nor in Bulgaria they play according to their own rules - they invented themselves, but they play according to general rules. As for Poland, there have always been signs of capitalism, as in Hungary. In Debrecen, in the 80s I went to a private ABC chain of stores (lat.), And in Poland, on excursions, to drink juice in cafes (beer was not allowed then) and ate freshly baked bread bought in stalls.
          We came to this much later. And in the CIS, laws were developed with the goal of being grabbed. Since you have long had one big grabber - it distributes the feeders. And we have a lot of these big hoppers. In the second term, he lets them go. That's all.
          1. Corsair
            Corsair 20 November 2013 15: 43 New
            0
            Quote: Akim
            And in the CIS, laws were developed with the goal of being grabbed.

            The CIS, as a formal organ of the "divorce" of the republics of the USSR, has never been "supranational".
            Each took the laws exclusively "for himself", with some "eye" on the neighbors ...
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 16: 01 New
              0
              Quote: Corsair
              The CIS, as a formal organ of the "divorce" of the republics of the USSR, has never been "supranational".

              I did not say CIS laws, CIS laws
              1. Corsair
                Corsair 20 November 2013 16: 24 New
                0
                Quote: Akim
                I did not say the laws of the CIS, but in the CIS laws

                Yes, "rested in the Bose" that did not want ESSEN Kravchuk. In the courtyard at least some 21 century ...
                More actual are already other "formations" between de facto independent and not very states of the former USSR ...

                And regarding your "fourth grabber", I think you will be somewhat upset by his behavior on the "second term" (if he even lives to see him) ...

                Hunchback ...
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 16: 33 New
                  0
                  Quote: Corsair
                  You will be somewhat upset by his behavior in the "second term" (if he even lives to see it) ...

                  I do not support Yanukovych, but I will vote for Yanukovych because the rest are even worse.
  • uhjpysq1
    uhjpysq1 20 November 2013 13: 48 New
    -3
    ) the good news) and even better that Russian troops would be in Ukraine.
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 13: 57 New
      0
      Quote: uhjpysq1
      and even better that Russian troops would be in Ukraine.

      And a tricolor developed over the Capitol. fellow Remake of the movie "Red Dawn". soldier
      1. Corsair
        Corsair 20 November 2013 14: 35 New
        +2
        Quote: Akim
        Quote: uhjpysq1
        and even better that Russian troops would be in Ukraine.
        And the tricolor developed over the Capitol. Remake of the movie "Red Dawn".

        The Russian Navy and the Army have their own base in Ukraine, and they won’t leave unless there was an order from the Supreme, despite not some political alignment.

        А DOWN is a diagnosis ...
        1. Kars
          Kars 20 November 2013 14: 45 New
          +7
          Quote: Corsair
          , and will not leave from there until there is an order of the Supreme,

          the one I think why Putin wanted the extension of the lease so much. I could just stand there. In fact, let them stand, you just need to increase the lease proportionally. Customs duties on the Black Sea Fleet must be levied from the TS. They charge the electricity price. , for gas))) environmental charges --- the scarves are old - they pollute the waters of the Resort Crimea, and let them stand. They still do not need anyone, and especially do not interfere.
          1. Corsair
            Corsair 20 November 2013 15: 47 New
            +1
            Quote: Kars
            the one I think is why Putin so wanted an extension of the lease. he could just stand there.

            After Putin there will be other Supreme ...
            1. uhjpysq1
              uhjpysq1 20 November 2013 15: 59 New
              +2
              and Kiev is the mother of Russian cities !!!
            2. Kars
              Kars 20 November 2013 16: 48 New
              +1
              Quote: Corsair
              After Putin there will be other Supreme ..

              And so what? Maybe another lease will be.
              1. uhjpysq1
                uhjpysq1 20 November 2013 17: 04 New
                +1
                ) may not be needed) due to the lack of Ukraine as a state)
                1. Kars
                  Kars 20 November 2013 17: 12 New
                  +1
                  Quote: uhjpysq1
                  ) may not be needed) due to the lack of Ukraine as a state)

                  Or the Russian fleet. Well, if only the Black Sea.
                  1. uhjpysq1
                    uhjpysq1 20 November 2013 17: 53 New
                    +1
                    dream, dream)) our fleet is 300 years old, and the state is 1000.))) such as you come to diarrhea with your sons. you want to squeeze Russia from the light. but to hell to you all over the face))))))) beat you and the kings and Stalin.)) Bandera deficiencies.)) and beat again)))
                    1. Kars
                      Kars 20 November 2013 20: 50 New
                      +2
                      Quote: uhjpysq1
                      dream, dream))

                      I personally mainly according to FIG League would have been nuclear deterrence.

                      Quote: uhjpysq1
                      our fleet is 300 years old

                      Only?

                      Quote: uhjpysq1
                      How do you come to diarrhea with your panas.

                      You're kind of free? Still tell the president you choose?
                      Quote: uhjpysq1
                      they beat you both under kings and under Stalin.))
                      It means that they were at least, and they even deny the vet to be lichtie. Although you were slaves under the kings, they also beat you, but they changed them for greyhound puppies.

                      Quote: uhjpysq1
                      ) and beat it again)))
                      finish off the Chechens. otherwise they chose the rat king and pay him tribute)))
        2. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 14: 50 New
          0
          Quote: Corsair
          The Russian Navy and Army have their own base in Ukraine

          The army is not. Fleet - yes. Well, let them stand - since it amuses you so much. I'm not cold nor hot from his presence.
          And the diagnosis should not be emphasized not from emoticons, but from what is written.
          1. Corsair
            Corsair 20 November 2013 15: 46 New
            0
            Quote: Akim
            And the diagnosis should not be emphasized not from emoticons, but from what is written.

            Why are you suddenly so "overreact"? DIAGNOSIS was not delivered to you ... but if I may say "film" fellow
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 16: 02 New
              0
              Quote: Corsair
              and if you may say "film"

              At me he is quoted worse.
          2. Corsair
            Corsair 20 November 2013 18: 55 New
            0
            Quote: Akim
            The army is not. Fleet - yes.

            Yes, I "went overboard" a little, counting the marines as army men ...
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 20 November 2013 14: 36 New
    -1
    Yes, everything will be fine Ukraine! As if yours and our government didn’t twist it, we’ll still be together (our grandfathers and great-grandfathers crushed half of Europe together) It's just that we can’t get it out of our memory .. drinks
  • knn54
    knn54 20 November 2013 14: 59 New
    0
    - About 6,5 thousand lieutenants, majors, colonels.
    And HEIs will recruit and train new ones.
    - out of hundreds of Ukrainian generals, every fifth (20 people) will lose their job.
    Today in the Armed Forces of Ukraine more than 80 generals. On the whole, there are more than 130 generals in the Ministry of Defense. ”
    In the United States, 5/6 people for every 10 thousand members of the regular army, aviation and navy. If you look to the West ... it is necessary to LEAVE every fifth.
    - eventually leaving about 50 thousand rear bayonets,
    Is there nothing to "tyry"?
    In the same American army, the ratio of military soldiers and those who provide them is about one in three. And without reliable logistics, talking about the effective implementation of combat missions is futile.
    -predator. It would be better to cut the officials .. the Ministry of Internal Affairs ..., that would be a saving, and even in Russia we are completely absurd!
    And who will take bribes and feed the higher authorities. And the army will not go against the people. And the SBU and the Ministry of Internal Affairs are slowly increasing ...
    PS Khrushchev reduced the army, how it ended for the army and personally everyone knows.
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 20 November 2013 15: 49 New
    +1
    The Russian army has experienced similar purges on several occasions, with thousands of young officers leaving the military. The last "reform" was carried out by the ever-memorable Serdyukov. Therefore, we express our deep sympathy to the officers of the Ukrainian Armed Forces. We wish stamina and endurance!
  • sapran
    sapran 20 November 2013 16: 02 New
    +1
    and so what is the actual panic?
    Let's miss the absurd figures on officers' salaries and compensation (there’s not even an average temperature in the ward)
    1. only 2 months after retiring from the lavas of the Zbroyni Forces. So the panic about the upcoming reduction of some officers is known to me.
    2. First of all, vacant plantings are reduced, although there are precedents with the reduction of whole parts (under the root), but they offer equivalent plantings in other regions (here you decide)
    3. The reduction of the army is generally a "trick" which adheres to all the governments of my Motherland, regardless of political color (orange blue red and color)
  • Poruchik 90
    Poruchik 90 20 November 2013 16: 03 New
    +2
    Hmm, I don’t know how it will all end. But if you have already decided to eliminate such a type of Armed Forces as the Air Force and distribute them into units subordinate to the operational commands, then this is complete .................. (though they gave us a year for the party all questions). But the Air Force (read the Air Force) will not be in the country. Tin.
    1. Akim
      Akim 20 November 2013 16: 10 New
      0
      Quote: Poruchik 90
      But the Air Force (read the Air Force) will not be in the country.

      When air defense was combined with the air force, air defense did not. Here is the same dregs can wait for these associations.
      1. sapran
        sapran 20 November 2013 16: 25 New
        0
        Yes, the akim as soon as united so everything and *****. Since the blanket was pulled in favor of the Air Force. And after the collapse of the last, they decided to cut the blanket into shreds ...
        1. Oleg Kharkov
          Oleg Kharkov 20 November 2013 21: 37 New
          0
          When I studied, the Air Force will be united with us, then we will be assigned to the Air Force. Generally funny were the times, to be sure.
  • Poruchik 90
    Poruchik 90 20 November 2013 16: 12 New
    0
    So it will be, unfortunately.
  • builder
    builder 20 November 2013 18: 46 New
    +2
    Favorite passage of 72 meters
  • alone
    alone 20 November 2013 19: 20 New
    0
    Who cares what Ukraine is doing with its army. Notice with your army.
    orykh
    they do not reform their own, and not someone else's. and secondly, if something is not right here, but still this is their problem.
    and we can only wish good luck and prosperity. hi
    1. Hudo
      Hudo 20 November 2013 19: 28 New
      0
      Quote: lonely
      they do not reform their own, and not someone else's. and secondly, if something is not right here, but still this is their problem.
      and we can only wish good luck and prosperity


      Sorry, but you always wish good luck and prosperity even those who intended to rush head down into a deep well, or panting with zeal, sawing the branch of the tree on which they are sitting?
      1. builder
        builder 20 November 2013 19: 51 New
        +1
        Who cares what Ukraine is doing with its army.

        Lonely and do you know what the Kiev Special Military District is?
        It is better for us that between Russia and the West there should be Ukraine (friendly or neutral (independent)) with a strong army than Ukraine with no army (NATO army on its territory).
        1. Akim
          Akim 20 November 2013 20: 02 New
          +1
          Quote: stroitel
          Lonely and do you know what the Kiev Special Military District is?

          SPECIAL status was canceled after the war.
          1. builder
            builder 20 November 2013 20: 10 New
            +1
            Yes I know. Only the campaign Russia surrenders the Kiev Special Military District without a fight.
            1. Akim
              Akim 20 November 2013 20: 17 New
              0
              Quote: stroitel
              Only the campaign Russia surrenders the Kiev Special Military District without a fight.

              Who is it for? I’ve spoken a thousand times already. When Ukraine moves to the blue signs in the topography and when the officer’s line becomes irrelevant, then start to worry. Bye, false start.
              1. builder
                builder 20 November 2013 20: 24 New
                0
                Your words to God in the ears. Although a lot is alarming ...
                1. Akim
                  Akim 20 November 2013 20: 40 New
                  +1
                  Quote: stroitel
                  . Although a lot is alarming ...

                  And me too, in relation to Russia to the Ukrainian people. Although it all depends on the flow of information. Analyze simpler things. Those can say a lot.
                  1. builder
                    builder 20 November 2013 20: 48 New
                    0
                    What do you think
                    in respect of of Russia к Ukrainian people
                    ?
                    1. builder
                      builder 20 November 2013 20: 51 New
                      0
                      those. the attitude of the ruling "elites" of Russia and Ukraine towards each other, or of individual representatives of these peoples towards each other?
                      1. Akim
                        Akim 20 November 2013 21: 07 New
                        +1
                        Quote: stroitel
                        those. the attitude of the ruling "elites" of Russia and Ukraine towards each other, or of individual representatives of these peoples towards each other?

                        Any information pressure from the government is transmitted to society. I faced an insult from the teaching staff in Novorossiysk, I know each other at the border. Even on the Moscow-Kiev train. And Ukrainian numbers on the car are a magnet for your traffic police. Here at the forum, one Russian told how his father was a veteran of the USSR armed forces - a Marine major with a Ukrainian passport, the district headquarters came and how the old man wrote to him that he would not help a veteran of a hostile state. We have the same. And this is a common misfortune.
                      2. builder
                        builder 20 November 2013 21: 13 New
                        0
                        I faced an insult from the teaching staff in Novorossiysk, I know each other at the border. Even on the Moscow-Kiev train. And Ukrainian numbers on the car are a magnet for your traffic police. ....

                        As the saying goes: "A village without a fool, that a military unit without a banner."
                        the old woman said
                        laughing It is necessary to remember (to communicate with the district (I could not find the whole word)) wink
      2. alone
        alone 20 November 2013 21: 37 New
        +2
        I know what the Kiev Military District is. Actually, signing an associative membership in the EU does not mean that Ukraine will immediately be in NATO and Western fighters will plow Ukraine’s skies like in a big theater. !! As for NATO, at the borders of Russia, it’s for a long time reality. only 400 km from St. Petersburg.

        we are not to blame for the fact that your pseudo-leaders, whom you yourself pushed into the tank, destroyed the country called the USSR. Moreover, both Ukraine and Azerbaijan, in which I am a citizen, spoke in favor of preserving this state.
    2. alone
      alone 20 November 2013 21: 31 New
      +1
      the one who saws the branch on which he sits will fall himself. and also the one who jumps deep into the well will hurt his head, not me, or not you (figuratively speaking) .a you think
      for two whole months to spread rot one and the same music make Ukraine change its mind?
      Is it really incomprehensible that the USSR IS NO MORE. Ukraine must decide where it is and with whom it will be better. And wish them good luck, after all they have lived together for so many years. And what do you suggest, curse the country and the people? You won’t wait !!
      1. builder
        builder 20 November 2013 21: 42 New
        0
        Quote: lonely
        and what do you suggest, curse (curse?) country and people? do not wait !!

        Who specifically offers? Fortunately or unfortunately, the decision is not made by us. (to be honest from your comment I didn’t even understand what decision, what did you want to talk about?) We only express our modest opinion about the reduction of the Ukrainian army.
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 20 November 2013 19: 39 New
    +2
    On the one hand, you are right .. But there is one main "but" is that our peoples are too close to each other in spirit and blood! Our Army and Navy were almost destroyed by "bawlers!" To the whoop and applause of Western "well-wishers" .. Now, thank God, we have come to our senses and we will remember that for a long time ... rape all gayevropy and we can not help anything And these scum look into our eyes, enjoying our impotence .. In any case, Russia will not abandon Ukraine ... It's all sad and insulting .. As they say, God's will for everything!
    1. alone
      alone 20 November 2013 22: 31 New
      +2
      Quote: MIKHAN
      But there is one main "but" is that our peoples are too close to each other in spirit and blood!


      Vitaliy, welcome! You, like me, have been reading articles about Ukraine on the website almost every day for more than two months. Agree that sometimes it comes to ordinary insults. Who needs it? Do you think this helps to something? I think the opposite. And yet. reading all the comments within two months I came to the conclusion that, except for the LGBT topics, most do not give any arguments. as if as soon as they sign the treaty, the whole of Ukraine will become a homosexual country. although it should be noted that there were very sensible discussions.

      No one needs such a fraud. Judging by the reforms, Ukraine does not want to fight with anyone and moreover is not going to fight because of someone. That’s why they are cutting back. Although another option may be a banal lack of funds. But this is not my thing hi
  • Mercenary
    Mercenary 20 November 2013 20: 33 New
    0
    Boys, come to us in RUSSIA. THEN AFTER the civil service officer, 50% of military schools are closed, officers have nowhere to cook, and here they are their own and ready.
  • Algor73
    Algor73 20 November 2013 20: 52 New
    +4
    Anyway, I wonder what is being done in a neighboring country. I understand the Russians, they are not indifferent to Ukraine, as I am interested in what is being done in the Russian army. So far, you can call the mess of the army of Ukraine and Russia. And to be honest, I worry about the image of my country, I am not indifferent to the fate and the army. But to put the army above the welfare of ordinary citizens is stupid. An army for a country or a country for an army? I am for the reform of the army. But, of course, for reasonable reforms. I am for the reduction in numbers. But not combat officers. I am for arms optimization. But due to old designs. Recently, while in Baranavichy, Lukashenko said that the Su-27 was ineffective for his country, which was small in territorial terms, but that they should be mothballed. Here I am for such a reform - something that is burdensome for peacetime, let it be mothballed for future modernization. But how the next reform will end, time will tell. But the fact that reform is needed (not just this one) is a no brainer.
  • mithridate
    mithridate 24 November 2013 19: 01 New
    +1
    it would be better if more than 6 thousand officials were fired