Military Review

Chinese experts responded to the transfer of the aircraft carrier "Vikramaditya"

62
Chinese experts responded to the transfer of the aircraft carrier "Vikramaditya"

In the 1994 year, due to the lack of financial resources, Russia offered India to acquire the aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov. The contract was signed in 2004, the initial estimate was increased from 400 million to 700 million dollars, then to 1,5 billion dollars with a transfer date in 2008 year.


However, the repair and modernization of the ship was delayed, which was the reason for the difficult negotiations between the two parties. In 2010, the parties agreed on the amount of 4,33 billion, including the supply of 45 deck fighters MiG-29K to the sum of 2 billion dollars with the transfer of the ship in December 2012. However, during the sea trials, a boiler-turbine power plant crashed, and the delivery date was again postponed. Finally, yesterday the ship was transferred after the 6-year delay.

Vikramaditya has the largest displacement 45 thousand tons, length 283,3 m, maximum width 59,8 m, 30 fighters MiG-29K, as well as anti-submarine Ka-27 helicopters and helicopters of the radar patrol Ka-31 can be placed on it. The crew of the ship 2000 people.

Indian media write that "Vikramaditya" will become the flagship of the country's Navy, will ply in the Arabian Sea to demonstrate the military power of the state. “This is a moment of pride for the country,” write Indian publications.

However, Chinese military experts say that this aircraft carrier without an escort group in the form of warships equipped with the Aegis system or their analogue (the PLA Navy has such ships) significantly reduces its value. Expert Zhen Wenhao said that although the Indian Navy has many years of experience in operating aircraft carriers, they have never had carrier strike groups. He said that the United States could sell India decked DRLO aircraft of the E-2D Advanced Hawkeye type, equipped with the latest radar with active phased array, and then the combat capability of the Indian Navy will grow significantly. “Nevertheless, the Americans believe that the Hokai cannot be based on the Vikramadithi, which has no takeoff catapults, and these aircraft can be based only on the coast. But in fact, as the calculations showed, subject to the presence of headwind, an E-2D aircraft with engines of increased power can take off from an Indian aircraft carrier, but the Americans probably do not want to significantly increase the capacity of the Indian Navy, ”said the expert. Without a DRLO aircraft, an aircraft carrier cannot have a high level of situational awareness, which will adversely affect its combat potential.

Regarding the fleet review, Chinese experts believe that the MiG-29K fighters are significantly inferior in their combat characteristics to the American F / A-18E / F Super Hornet and the Chinese J-15, especially in range, flight duration and combat load.

Both Chinese "Liaoning" and Indian "Vikramaditya" have both advantages and disadvantages. But the Chinese aircraft carrier has a much larger displacement, based on it the J-15 fighter jets, which have a take-off weight of up to 30-35 t, whereas the MiG-29K can take off with a mass of just 20 t. In addition, for the "Liaoning" a conservation group in the form of Type 052D class destroyers, equipped with a powerful air defense system and missile defense.
Originator:
http://www.militaryparitet.com/ttp/data/ic_ttp/6244/
62 comments
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  1. experienced
    experienced 18 November 2013 12: 27
    46
    There is nothing like leather... winked
    1. Phantom Revolution
      Phantom Revolution 18 November 2013 12: 32
      +5
      Just wanted to write the same, ahead of it)
      1. afire
        afire 18 November 2013 12: 35
        14
        Ooh, the Chinese "truth" sounded. And here we are ..., and here we have ..., and you are all loshars and so on.
        True face, they with "their" J-15 want to argue with dryers in the air ?? laughing
        1. GSH-18
          GSH-18 18 November 2013 13: 00
          +7
          Quote: afire
          Ooh, the Chinese "truth" sounded. And here we are ..., and here we have ..., and you are all loshars and so on.
          True face, they with "their" J-15 want to argue with dryers in the air ?? laughing

          Yes, everything is as you wrote. Only now we have ALREADY aircraft-carrying cruisers (the sky-ready Kuzya does not count), but there are STILL no normal aircraft carriers! Because of this, Rogozin’s show-offs are not clear, we can do everything, but so far we don’t need it! (regarding the construction of Russian AUGs) belay
          1. Vadivak
            Vadivak 18 November 2013 14: 37
            +4
            Quote: GSH-18
            Only now we have aircraft carriers already


            We don’t have much, but soon it will be no more, although what are we talking about? Modern Russia does not have the opportunity to build an aircraft carrier at its own shipyards,
          2. Civil
            Civil 18 November 2013 19: 42
            0
            we both need ... and the Varangian and Gorshkov ... yes the kefir is a little liquid
        2. Sirocco
          Sirocco 18 November 2013 15: 07
          +7
          Quote: afire
          True face

          What did we all expect here? China and India, if I am not mistaken, have territorial problems, and not only, so just a reason appeared CHEEKS POOL, In the place of the Chinese, I would be silent in a rag about weapons and equipment, everything is muffled and stolen, with us, and with the same Americans. What do they have their own? They began to fly into space thanks to us and our Unions. If our technique is bullshit, then why is China copying it?
          1. Boa kaa
            Boa kaa 18 November 2013 18: 06
            +5
            Quote: Sirocco
            In the place of the Chinese, I would be silent in a rag about weapons and equipment, everything is slime and stolen,

            They still need to be modestly silent about the EXPERIENCE of using aircraft carriers, which they (unlike the Indians) do not have. Therefore, they stress that without an integral control system of the "Aegis" type, the Indian AUG will not be able to do anything, forgetting about the presence of "Chakra" in its composition (project 971 Nerpa). It seems to me that our low-noise "Pike-B" will become an underwater nightmare for the Chinese AUG. Their pr.092 submarines are an order of magnitude worse in noise level, and, according to the Americans, are at the level of our first generation submarines. Considering that the Indians are ready to invest in the construction of a new SSBM with BrahMos missiles (a section of the UVP behind the wheelhouse, like Ash's) and lease this boat for $ 1,2 billion for 10 years, one thing can be said: they are serious to the territorial claims of the northern neighbors. They have our frigates pr "11356" - 6 units, plus 3 stealth frigates, I think you can create a full-fledged AUG to counter the Chinese. But it’s better not to.
        3. Boot under the carpet
          Boot under the carpet 18 November 2013 15: 14
          0
          So we are talking about instantly)
        4. Retx
          Retx 18 November 2013 16: 48
          0
          unlike the western comrades, they are in awe. NATO spies on Vikra in full: airplanes, buoys, ships, etc. Here is their opinion more interesting. the Chinese have nothing so far.
        5. Cynic
          Cynic 18 November 2013 17: 11
          +2
          Quote: afire
          they with "their" J-15 want to argue with dryers in the air ??

          Your J-15?
          Ripped off the Su-33 and are happy without memory.
          1. Cynic
            Cynic 18 November 2013 17: 15
            +2

    2. Polovec
      Polovec 18 November 2013 12: 42
      -7
      As for the MIG-29, they are right. Cool airplane for an air show. The radius of combat use is really small. And the excellent aerodynamic characteristics with good weapons and avionics do not compensate for this.
      1. DEfindER
        DEfindER 18 November 2013 13: 13
        16
        Quote: Polovec
        As for the MIG-29, they are right. Cool airplane for an air show. The radius of combat use is really small.

        Why is it small, you look at Wikipedia, the same Hornet F-18 has a maximum radius of 1065 km, and the Mig-29K - 1300 km. There are no exact data on J-15 yet, but I don’t think there will be more ..
        1. the polar
          the polar 18 November 2013 13: 42
          12
          Quote: DEfindER
          Quote: Polovec
          As for the MIG-29, they are right. Cool airplane for an air show. The radius of combat use is really small.

          Why is it small, you look at Wikipedia, the same Hornet F-18 has a maximum radius of 1065 km, and the Mig-29K - 1300 km. There are no exact data on J-15 yet, but I don’t think there will be more ..

          MIG-29 is a great front-line fighter, the best in its class, and MIG-29K will perfectly cope with the task of covering the squadron and attack throughout the Arabian Sea. Now the Indians, in addition to the aircraft carrier, are riveted and escort destroyers
          1. Andrey Yuryevich
            Andrey Yuryevich 18 November 2013 14: 12
            +3
            Characteristics

            MiG-29 Fulcrum-A

            FA-18C

            First flight 6.10.77 3.09.1986
            Engines 2 x Klimov RD-33 for 8300 kgf for afterburner 2 x F404-GE-402 for 7980 kgf forburner
            Span, m 11.36 12.31
            Length, m 17.32 (with LDPE) 17.07
            Height, m ​​4.73 4.66
            Wing Area, m2 38.00 37.16
            Empty weight, kg 10900 10455
            Normal take-off weight, kg 15240 (fighter) 16652 (fighter)
            18500 (percussion) 23541 (percussion)
            Maximum speed at high altitude 2445 km / h (2.3M) 1915 km / h (1.8M)
            Rate of climb, m / min 19800 13715
            Ceiling, m 17000 15240
            Range 1500 km without PTB 740 km - combat radius
            Cannon armament 1 30mm GSh-301 gun with 150 shells 1 20mm M61A1 gun with 570 shells
            Max combat load 3000 kg 7031 kg
            Air-to-air missiles R-60M, R-73, R-27 AIM-120, AIM-7, AIM-9
            Radar RP-29. Tracking up to 10 targets, one shooting channel. The detection range of an air target is 100 km. Multi-mode digital pulse-Doppler radar AN / APG-65 (73). Accompaniment up to 10 goals, mapping mode.
            There is no EDSU
            Helmet sight there is no
            on the photo MiG-29 and f-18, the sky over Germany is patrolling very amicably ...
          2. Polovec
            Polovec 18 November 2013 15: 30
            +2
            Beautiful then he is beautiful. Who would argue! But to gain air superiority "over the short range drive". I think that "Sushki" are more interesting in terms of use on an aircraft carrier, including as a means of strike. And their weapons are better in terms of range, besides.

            I like the MiG -29! I love them with all my heart! wassat
            1. tomket
              tomket 18 November 2013 21: 15
              0
              For drying, the Nimitz class deck is more suitable, have you ever noticed that those flying from Kuzi Su-33 practically carry nothing under the wing ???
      2. 123dv
        123dv 18 November 2013 13: 25
        +6
        Even used flying saucers are significantly superior to existing and promising deck aircraft. And it would not be bad to have them, but not for the money!
        So the Indians figured to their nose and made the right decision.
      3. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 18 November 2013 14: 06
        +1
        http://topwar.ru/2291-fulcrummig-29-protiv-hornet.html
      4. tomket
        tomket 18 November 2013 21: 12
        0
        you forget about air refueling
      5. APASUS
        APASUS 18 November 2013 21: 17
        0
        Quote: Polovec
        As for the MIG-29, they are right. Cool airplane for an air show. The radius of combat use is really small. And the excellent aerodynamic characteristics with good weapons and avionics do not compensate for this.

        What are they right about?
        They took a comparison of the Mig-29 with the F / A-18E / F, these are cars of different classes and their comparison is not correct.
        Lada with Kamaz not compare
    3. mark1
      mark1 18 November 2013 12: 54
      11
      Quote: seasoned
      There is nothing like leather.

      There would be something to brag about. Well, two rival states acquired one former Soviet aircraft carrier, the ships are more combat training, their main task is to train personnel for future national aircraft carriers. Now, when it’s put into operation, then it’s worth it to measure it — for whom the deck is longer and the springboard is steeper, and for whom the catapult is more fashionable and the planes fly on.
      1. Botanologist
        Botanologist 18 November 2013 14: 12
        +5
        Quote: mark1
        There would be something to brag about.


        I believe that comparing Chinese clones and MiG-29 is still better based on the results of real databases, and not according to Chinese experts.
    4. Gluxar_
      Gluxar_ 18 November 2013 12: 58
      +5
      Quote: seasoned
      There is nothing like leather...

      Pleases something else. China feels a real threat to its interests from India, with its cooperation with Russia. In any case, this will make the Chinese more accommodating on a number of issues. They want to develop their technologies themselves, hold the flag. In 15 years they will get some kind of experience in operating the AUG, will they make it up to such a deadline in "peace of mind"?
    5. Lord of the Sith
      Lord of the Sith 18 November 2013 13: 00
      +6
      In vain the Chinese are so. The Indian Navy also has destroyers and destroyers and frigates. And there are enough submarines. Yes, and the Big Anti-Submarine Ships. Also, the Indians are building a light aircraft carrier.

      The light aircraft carrier Vikrant is designed to replace the Viraat aircraft carrier that is refining its resource. This ship should become the flagship of the western group of the Navy of India. The aircraft carrier was built on the basis of a joint project 71 Indigenous Aircraft Carrier, developed jointly with the Russian Nevsky Design Bureau, as well as with French and Italian assistance. The ship will not be much smaller than Vikramaditya.

      Main characteristics
      Standard Displacement 37500t
      Xnumx length m
      Crew up to 1400, of which 160 officers
      weaponry
      Aviation Group
      12-14 MiG-29K aircraft
      helicopters Ka-28, Ka-31, HAL Dhruv
    6. Vadivak
      Vadivak 18 November 2013 14: 24
      +5
      Quote: seasoned
      There is nothing like leather


      Not everyone. Our sandpiper, for example, is curling that aircraft carriers are not needed. Faithful follower of the Yeltsin case At the shipyards of Nikolaev, the first Soviet full-fledged nuclear aircraft carrier Ulyanovsk, which was laid down in 1991, was destroyed
    7. sens99.ru
      sens99.ru 18 November 2013 17: 46
      +1
      What? Mig-29K worse than Hornet and the Chinese Su-33 ... oh sorry J-15. Well, still Drying, and Hornet what? stop fool
  2. SEM
    SEM 18 November 2013 12: 31
    10
    In India, too, the military is not fools who understand everything and will be able to provide protection to the aircraft carrier, otherwise why do they need it at all. Everything has long been thought out for several moves in front. Remember where chess was invented and how many centuries ago. And my opinion is that they will get everything we need from us or have already acquired ...
    1. GSH-18
      GSH-18 18 November 2013 13: 05
      0
      Quote: SEM
      Everything has long been thought out for several moves in front. Remember where chess was invented and how many centuries ago. And my opinion is that they will get everything we need from us or have already acquired ...

      What will they get from us? Do we have aircraft carrier formations or experience in their operation ?? request
      The Russian Federation is simply getting rid of old Soviet trash, the operational use of which is doubtful, and the content is unprofitable.
      1. Boa kaa
        Boa kaa 18 November 2013 18: 46
        +5
        Quote: GSH-18
        What will they get from us?

        Good evening GeSha! We have them - 3 more frigates pr. "11356" (ordered at PSZ "Yantar").
        We are ready to pay for the construction of a new SSBN (a missile insert for BrahMos will be inserted into the building of 971 ave.) And lease it for 10 years for $ 1,2 billion;
        They finance and jointly develop PAK FA, buy SU-30MKI, T-90 tanks, participated in the development of BrahMos, are ready to buy Lada-type nuclear submarines from VNEU.
        We bought a MiG-29K, a Ka-31 helicopter (RLD), are going to buy a Ka-52.
        With aircraft carriers, you are right, you bought what you could pay. You can, of course, and "Lizka" English, but then everyone will walk in loincloths, and if the American "Nimitz", you will have to return back to slavery.
        The main thing is that our weapons suit them in terms of price / efficiency.
        1. GSH-18
          GSH-18 19 November 2013 05: 35
          0
          Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
          You can, of course, and "Lizka" English, but then everyone will walk in loincloths, and if the American "Nimitz", you will have to return back to slavery.
          The main thing is that our weapons suit them in terms of price / efficiency.

          Good evening, Alexander!
          In my comment I (answering) had in mind the purchase from us of equipment for aircraft-carrying cruisers / aircraft carriers by the Indians. Regarding conventional ships, and other weapons, no question. The Indians are in fact armed with our weapons))
  3. major071
    major071 18 November 2013 12: 34
    20
    Only the Indians managed to rejoice at their new aircraft carrier, when the Chinese climbed out of the ambush and vulgarized everything. And the fig carrier and the planes are useless (according to the Chinese they have any cooler!) And there is no combat guard. The aircraft carrier had not reached India yet, and he was already sunk in words. Potential enemies, however!
  4. Onyx
    Onyx 18 November 2013 12: 35
    +1
    And the Indians do not have ships for an escort?
    1. Metlik
      Metlik 18 November 2013 12: 48
      +7
      Six frigates of project 11356 will cover it with their air defense.
      1. 123dv
        123dv 18 November 2013 13: 28
        +5
        They’ll cover it. No wonder they were bought. Yes, and Indian-built ships of recent years are almost fully equipped with Russian weapons, modern and complimentary.
    2. Lord of the Sith
      Lord of the Sith 18 November 2013 13: 21
      +7
      frigate of the Shivalik type F47 INS Shivalik 29.04.2010/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate of the Shivalik type F48 INS Satpura 03.2011
      frigate of the Shivalik type F49 INS Sayadri 05.2011
      frigate type Talwar F40 INS Talwar 18.06.2003/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate type Talwar F43 INS Trishul 25.06.2003/XNUMX/XNUMX
      Talvar frigate F44 INS Tabar 19.04.2004/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate type Talwar F45 INS Tag 27.04.2012/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate type Talwar F46 INS Tarkash 09.11.2012/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate type Talwar F50 INS Trikand 29.06.2013/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate of the Brahmaputra type F31 INS Brahmaputra 14.04.2000/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate of the Brahmaputra type F37 INS Bias 11.07.2005/XNUMX/XNUMX
      Brahmaputra frigate F39 INS Betva 7.06.2004
      Godavari frigate F20 INS Godavari frigate 10.12.1983/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate of the Godavari type F21 INS Gomati 16.04.1988/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate of the Godavari type F22 INS Ganga 30.12.1985/XNUMX/XNUMX
      frigate of the Nilgiri type F41 INS Taragiri 16.05.1980/XNUMX/XNUMX
  5. svskor80
    svskor80 18 November 2013 12: 44
    +8
    What a grief for the Chinese, can someone honestly and calmly buy equipment, and not steal and slap a fake claiming that it is "the most". And I think the Indians will find ships for escort and AWACS planes, compared to an aircraft carrier, not the greatest costs. And it's a shame for Russia - they sold out projects of their ships in the 90s, and it is not clear when we will build for ourselves now.
  6. silver_roman
    silver_roman 18 November 2013 12: 46
    10
    MiG-29K fighters in their combat characteristics are significantly inferior to the American F / A-18E / F Super Hornet and the Chinese J-15,

    Standard phrase.
    In addition, the j-15 is a cheap clone of the Su-27 ... in principle, it can not be compared with MiGs, because they are not competitors, but complement each other - different classes.
    And at the expense of comparing Mig and Hornet, then at one time the NATO troops on the basis of the Yugoslav MiGs experimented and stretched their Hornets. As the results showed, MiGs at least were not inferior.
    Although Hornet today and Hornet then - different cars, but ours did not stand still.
    Specialists I think will confirm .... Dear Vaf ... AU !!! hi
    1. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 18 November 2013 13: 48
      +3
      well, "hornet" is first of all an attack aircraft, and "moment" is a fighter, the comparison is at least not correct ... hi
      1. silver_roman
        silver_roman 18 November 2013 17: 32
        0
        The Super Hornet is primarily a fighter-bomber, and due to the fact that it was specifically fortified, it can also perform the functions of an attack aircraft, but it seems to me that he is not very good in this capacity. Take the same A-10 ThunderBolt or our "Rook" Su-25 - these are attack aircraft with enhanced protection for the crew.
        MiG -29k is a fighter, but by weight they belong to the same class and are analogues!
      2. tomket
        tomket 18 November 2013 21: 19
        0
        What MiG do you mean? The one that say 9-12 or the one that is still 9-62 ????
  7. Muadipus
    Muadipus 18 November 2013 12: 52
    +1
    Well ... "Admiral Gorshkov" -al- "Vikramaditya" is not a bad acquisition for India, especially when compared with the Mistrals for Russia.
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 18 November 2013 19: 14
      +1
      Quote: Muadipus
      Vikramaditya is not the worst acquisition for India, especially when compared with the Mistrals for Russia

      They cannot be compared: different classes of ships are designed to solve different problems. Now, if we were honored and gave birth to something better than the Yak-141 or F-35, then the Mistral could (conditionally) be compared with the "America" ​​or with the "Vikramaditya".
  8. Bashkaus
    Bashkaus 18 November 2013 12: 56
    45
    For example, I understand the Chinese very well. Well, judge for yourself, first we quietly bought our aircraft carrier, then for 10 years they tried to understand what it is. Then he decided to buy our fighter and aerofinisher for copy-paste, but when they realized that Russia had sent them far and for a long time in this matter in view of hostile klipomania of technologies, they did not come up with anything clever how to disgustingly steal technologies on the Su-33 from Ukraine by buying an abandoned prototype very different from modified car. We got into a puddle with aerofiners, somehow gave birth to "like a deck fighter" and at the very first landing on an aircraft carrier they sent the chief designer to the next world, who must be commended for daring to be the second crew member during landing. People, we are adults and we understand that the chief designer died not from stage 4 cancer by accident during landing, but from a critical overload during on-line, which indicates the inoperability of the system in the form in which the Chinese have it today and unclear terms of its completion. The plane itself, although it is slamzy, but to bring it to mind, oh, how long.
    And here is such a "zapadlo", the bitter enemy has brought to mind, equipped with full minced meat with all the additional options, the unit, to which the Chinese are like cancer to Berlin. And most importantly, for the Indians, Russia did not want to transfer the very technologies to the request of which the Chinese responded with a laconic "break off".
    So the article is still very restrained emotionally, I can imagine how they are raging there now.
    1. Armata
      Armata 18 November 2013 13: 02
      +6
      This is the most accurately summed up good
    2. GSH-18
      GSH-18 18 November 2013 13: 16
      +2
      Quote: Bashkaus
      And here is such a "zapadlo", the bitter enemy has brought to mind, equipped with full minced meat with all the additional options, the unit, to which the Chinese are like cancer to Berlin.

      Thank you for koment smiled heartily! laughing Also pretty close to the truth. In addition to the fact that the Chinese Su-33 (we will call a spade a spade, Russian) is still more serious than the MiG-29K.
      1. Andrey Yuryevich
        Andrey Yuryevich 18 November 2013 13: 54
        +3
        from what crossroads the Chinese (how did you mark them there?) oh yes! su-33! more serious than MiGs? You please argue ...
        1. GSH-18
          GSH-18 19 November 2013 05: 41
          0
          Quote: Andrey Yurievich
          from what crossroads the Chinese (how did you mark them there?) oh yes! su-33! more serious than MiGs? You please argue ...

          You are welcome! The take-off weight of the Su-33 is much more than the deck moment, as well as the range of use. Is that enough? Or will we climb into the nuances?
      2. Mhpv
        Mhpv 18 November 2013 16: 24
        0
        Quote: GSH-18
        In addition to the fact that the Chinese Su-33 (we will call a spade a spade-Russian) is still more serious than the MiG-29K.

        Do not forget that this J15 is based on Su 33 purchased from Ukraine
        AVIA.RU
        The Chinese J-15 aircraft is unlikely to compete in the foreign market with its Russian counterpart, the Su-33 deck, due to its poor performance, RIA Novosti reports with reference to the director of the Center for Analysis of the World Arms Trade (TsAMTO), a member of the Public Council under the Russian Ministry of Defense Igor Korotchenko.
        China is working on the creation of its carrier-based fighter, taking as a basis one of the first prototypes of the Russian Su-33 carrier-based fighter, the T10K, purchased five years ago in Ukraine. Foreign media report the start of flight tests of this aircraft.
        "The Chinese clone J-15 is unlikely to be able to achieve the characteristics of the Russian carrier-based Su-33 fighter in its parameters, so it is possible that China will again turn to Russia with a request to sell a commercial batch of Su-33 fighters," Korotchenko said.
        According to TsAMTO experts, the acquired sample cannot become the basis for the creation of new technologies. T-10K, purchased in Ukraine, was one of the earliest versions and was used as part of the research program in preparation for production. For this reason, there are a lot of flaws in its design that were fixed later, the expert explained.
        Media reports that Chinese experts managed to solve the problem of the folding wing mechanism are hardly true, noted in TsAMTO.

        And here is the information from the MiG Corporation: http: //www.migavia.ru/military/MiG_29_K_KUB.htm
    3. old rocket man
      old rocket man 18 November 2013 14: 38
      +1
      Quite in the "tunic" and quite reasonable drinks
      1. Mhpv
        Mhpv 18 November 2013 16: 37
        +1
        In terms of their ability to shake air, the Chinese are not inferior to the Americans. Their J15 has not yet been accepted by the state commission, is undergoing flight tests and should be accepted in the 2015 program, and the Chinese have already announced that they have launched mass production. Maybe it is superior to the MiG 29K, but since couldn’t rip off our engines, then the resource at their J15 may end already in flight laughing
  9. stalker
    stalker 18 November 2013 13: 12
    +6
    Chinese experts apparently toad smothers laughing
  10. Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 18 November 2013 13: 17
    +5
    For Russia, all the same, cooperation with India in the distant (distant!) Future is more useful. An ordinary (layman) resident of the South of Primorye. recourse
  11. makarov
    makarov 18 November 2013 13: 35
    +3
    That’s what the head of the people is (?), If only to spoil both the neighbor and the far. I suppose the toad presses that they did not get it.
    1. Tatarus
      Tatarus 18 November 2013 15: 54
      +1
      The same neighbors as Russia and Ukraine. I generally see that love for neighbors is measured in kilometers. And at all.
  12. Kibalchish
    Kibalchish 18 November 2013 13: 35
    +5
    The list of ships of the Indian Highway ... escort, you say, is not enough?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_Indian_Navy_ships
  13. mithridate
    mithridate 18 November 2013 14: 11
    +1
    I wonder when the Chinese became experts?
  14. slovak007
    slovak007 18 November 2013 14: 15
    0
    Quote: GSH-18
    Quote: afire
    Ooh, the Chinese "truth" sounded. And here we are ..., and here we have ..., and you are all loshars and so on.
    True face, they with "their" J-15 want to argue with dryers in the air ?? laughing

    Yes, everything is as you wrote. Only now we have ALREADY aircraft-carrying cruisers (the sky-ready Kuzya does not count), but there are STILL no normal aircraft carriers! Because of this, Rogozin’s show-offs are not clear, we can do everything, but so far we don’t need it! (regarding the construction of Russian AUGs) belay


    And what do you want from a philologist.
  15. indiggo
    indiggo 18 November 2013 14: 17
    -3
    there is no for full protection, all that is can not be fully considered an escort ...
  16. gladysheff2010
    gladysheff2010 18 November 2013 14: 38
    +3
    Regrets about "Gorshkov", perhaps not at the right time, because. It was already indicated here: the project is outdated, but the fact that our shipbuilders skated on the Indian project of construction technology is undoubted progress. Rogozin is right, we need a different, new aircraft carrier with different characteristics.
  17. starhina01
    starhina01 18 November 2013 14: 43
    +2
    envy must be silent! fellow Chinese soldier
  18. Semen Semyonitch
    Semen Semyonitch 18 November 2013 14: 46
    0
    ... However, Chinese military experts say that this aircraft carrier without a security group in the form of warships equipped with the Aegis system or their equivalent (PLA Navy has such ships) ...

    Oops on ... Am I missing something? China has an analogue of Aegis ???
  19. ed65b
    ed65b 18 November 2013 14: 48
    +1
    What did you expect from the Chinese? Speeches? Clear pepper that it is like a sickle in the balls of Chinas. that’s sprayed with saliva.
  20. Georgic
    Georgic 18 November 2013 14: 55
    0
    Quote: Polar
    Quote: DEfindER
    Quote: Polovec
    As for the MIG-29, they are right. Cool airplane for an air show. The radius of combat use is really small.

    Why is it small, you look at Wikipedia, the same Hornet F-18 has a maximum radius of 1065 km, and the Mig-29K - 1300 km. There are no exact data on J-15 yet, but I don’t think there will be more ..

    MIG-29 is a great front-line fighter, the best in its class, and MIG-29K will perfectly cope with the task of covering the squadron and attack throughout the Arabian Sea. Now the Indians, in addition to the aircraft carrier, are riveted and escort destroyers

    Are riveted? Maybe it means - they will order more talwar? hi
  21. lucidlook
    lucidlook 18 November 2013 15: 24
    +4
    On the question of the Russian response to the Aegis system.

    Combat information and control system "SIGMA-E"

    Designed for combat control of the ship and tactical connection based on the combination of electronic systems into a single complex and automation of the processes of development and decision-making on the combat use of forces and their weapons.

    INSTALLATION OBJECT - surface ships of any rank
    DELIVERY TIME - from 18 months
    DELIVERY COMPLETENESS - determined by contract specification
    RELIABILITY AND VIVILITY - comply with the requirements of the Russian Navy
    TRAINING AND TRAINING - an advanced delivery of the training complex is possible
    MAINTENANCE - warranty and post-warranty service

    http://www.npomars.com/ru/products/sis_upr_voen/bius.php



    By the way, specialists, how do you comment on the capabilities of this BIOS? Especially in the part related to the collective security of the warrant (response to the memorable Cooperative Engaging Capability of the Aegis system)? Ideally, an article would be nice winked
  22. VADEL
    VADEL 18 November 2013 15: 35
    +3
    One aircraft carrier against another aircraft carrier, which are Trivia. But ONE billion and yes against another ONE billion, and even with a strong potential, this is OH! good
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 18 November 2013 19: 43
      +1
      Quote: VADEL
      But ONE billion and yes against another ONE billion, and even with a strong potential, this is OH!

      Exactly, OH! And God forbid, maybe it could be a prologue to the universal BIG BAD BOOM.
      2's, at the very least, but it's against USA. (At least for now - China for sure).
      Thirdly, it is at our side, and where the driving wind will turn after collecting the "MUSHROOMS" it still needs to be thought. For any of our Far East will not be sweet. There is no one there anyway, and after the "rain" on Thursday you can't keep anyone at all and you can't lure anyone with a roll. (although they say that everything on Pripyat is growing extremely violently).
      And in-4's, it's somehow cannibalistic! War, it does not happen to any of the normal people. So then, brother Vadim.
  23. andrei332809
    andrei332809 18 November 2013 15: 40
    0
    the Chinese people are simply angry that they have missed the moment and haven’t put their technique on the Indians request
  24. Sochi
    Sochi 18 November 2013 15: 43
    +2
    I did not understand that the Chinese were accepted into the club of large uncles who create the latest weapons?
    1. Andrey57
      Andrey57 18 November 2013 16: 12
      +1
      No, they wrote themselves to this club as "big uncles" fellow
  25. moremansf
    moremansf 18 November 2013 15: 55
    +2
    Time will tell, but I think that Indians will go to sea more often than the Chinese.
  26. dimon-media
    dimon-media 18 November 2013 16: 54
    +1
    yes we, yes we have, your MiGs are dumb! I just want to say to my Chinese friends: - do aircraft engines yourself, gentlemen, the Chinese. "I would like to believe that you will do them better than ours. That's when you have a plane with 100% Chinese components (and the engine, I think, is the most important component), then you can dare say here it’s better here, but you ... It’s not necessary to blame for the equipment that you yourself buy and copy. And then they riveted a glider, put Russian engines ... but you can’t do it yourself turbojet, fly on a screw machine.
  27. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 18 November 2013 16: 57
    +2
    Well, the Chinese sayings are understandable: a serious competitor has appeared nearby (with whom there are territorial disputes), and the question is how this competitor will behave and on whose side it will be if something happens! And the groundless statements that their "clone" Su-33 is the best, well, by no means a copy is always worse than the original (especially the stolen one)!
  28. Sergey Medvedev
    Sergey Medvedev 18 November 2013 17: 08
    +1
    Now the main thing for the Indians is not to buy anything from the Chinese for Vikamadritya. And it will turn out as with a submarine. Our boat, Chinese missiles. Something exploded. We have no complaints. I hope the Indian comrades have drawn the right conclusions.
  29. alone
    alone 18 November 2013 22: 31
    0
    everyone is used to praising his cow))) and China is no exception
  30. ab_hybac
    ab_hybac 19 November 2013 13: 48
    0
    what it is???