Victory Day: Why was Baku not given the title of Hero City?

Without oil Baku, the USSR could not win the war with Hitler

The further we move away from the terrible war of 1941-1945, which took the lives of more 30 millions of citizens of the USSR, the more we realize that victory over fascism was achieved not only thanks to the heroism of Soviet soldiers. No less significant was the contribution to the common feat of those regions of the Soviet Union that, although not occupied by Hitler’s troops, played a vital role in ensuring the combat capability of the Red Army.

One of these rear cities was the capital of the Azerbaijan SSR. It's no secret that almost 90% of fuel for refueling Soviet tanks and aircraft were delivered to the front line from Baku. In wartime, there was practically no alternative to Baku oil. So, in 1941, a total of 33 million tons of oil was produced in the USSR, of which 23,6 million tons were produced in Azerbaijan.

In other words, the Azerbaijan SSR, which became the main supplier of oil and oil products for the Red Army, played a key role in the great Victory. Former Russian ambassador to Azerbaijan, Vasily Istratov, admits: “Without the natural resources of Azerbaijan, there would be no victory in the Great Patriotic War.” And Marshal Rokossovsky wrote in his memoirs: “In every raid of the Soviet tankmen, in every victory over the German fascist forces, a considerable part of the success belongs to the Baku oil industry workers.”

Nevertheless, Stalin, and later other Soviet leaders for some reason did not dare to assign Baku the honorary title of the “Hero City”. Only the cities of the RSFSR, Belarus and Ukraine, which were under German occupation and became the scene of fierce battles, were awarded this high status. However, according to many experts, Baku, given its exceptional role in the rear, was rightfully worthy of the name of the “Hero City”.

"Gray Cardinal" of the Stalin era

Stalin’s refusal to confer honorary status on the capital of Azerbaijan is largely associated with the name of his closest ally, Commissar Anastas Mikoyan, who during the Great Patriotic War occupied key positions in the leadership of the USSR. From 1941, he headed the Committee of Food and Apparel Supplies for the Workers 'and Peasants' Red Army, and also was a member of the Council for Evacuation and the State Committee for the Rehabilitation of the Economy of the Liberated Regions. In 1942, by order of Stalin, Mikoyan was included in the USSR State Committee of Defense.

According to historians, it was on the recommendation of Mikoyan that Stalin organized in the late forties the so-called “resettlement” from Armenia to Azerbaijan 200 thousand Azerbaijanis. In fact, it was legalized exile, which was carried out according to the Decree of the Council of Ministers of the USSR No. 4083 from December 23 1947. It lasted until the year 1950.

Mikoyan, who was called Stalin's "gray cardinal", did not hide his negative attitude towards Azerbaijan. When, after the victory over Hitler in the Kremlin, the question of assigning the honorary title of “Hero City” to several cities of the USSR was discussed, Mikoyan strongly opposed the inclusion of Baku in this list.

In the next few decades, the leaders of the Azerbaijan SSR and cultural figures of the republic have repeatedly appealed to the highest state and party instances of the USSR with a request to reconsider this issue. However, their calls were not heard.

Red commander Hazi Aslanov

However, the contribution of Azerbaijan to the common "piggy bank" of victory in the Great Patriotic War was based not only on the oil achievements of this Soviet republic. Many Azerbaijanis then volunteered for the front - to defend their homeland. For four years, over 600 thousand people from Azerbaijan were called up to the ranks of the Red Army. By the end of the war, 128 natives of Azerbaijan became Heroes of the Soviet Union.

A native of the Sabunchi village in the suburb of Baku, Richard Zogh, being on the eve of World War II in Japan, was one of the first to inform Stalin about the exact date of Hitler’s attack on the USSR: the end of June 1941. Azerbaijan was glorified all over the world and the fighters from Azerbaijan: Mamedov, Ahmedzade, Berezhnoy, Andreev and Mejidov, who hoisted the Victory Banner over the Brandenburg Gate in Berlin in the early morning of May 9 2.

9 May 2013 in Baku commemorated the heroes of the Great Patriotic War. Azerbaijani President Ilham Aliyev laid a wreath at the monument to the Hero of the Soviet Union Azi Aslanov. There were legends about Major General Aslanov in his lifetime. 19 November 1942 began a counteroffensive by the Soviet forces at Stalingrad. During the day, the tankers Aslanova fought over 40 kilometers with fights! By decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR from 22 December 1942, Azi Aslanov was awarded the title Hero of the Soviet Union. 24 December 1942, the newspaper Krasnaya Zvezda wrote: “History wars have not yet seen the fighters who fought so bravely as Azi Aslanov and his fighting friends. No matter how strong the enemy tanks and infantry are, they cannot be compared with the part led by the powerful, strong-willed commander, Hero of the Soviet Union Azi Aslanov. ”

13 January 1943, the newspaper of the Stalingrad Front, Son of the Fatherland, noted: “... how to link tank operations with infantry and artillery actions, you need to learn from the part of the guard, Colonel A. Aslanov. Let the combat skills of the tankers of the Hero of the Soviet Union A. Aslanov be a model for all our units. ” Tankmen Aslanova participated in the liberation of the cities of Belgorod, Sumy, Akhtyrka, Poltava and Mirgorod. 24 January 1945, Azi Aslanov died in battle. He was 35 years old ...

"Fearless Sons and Daughters of Azerbaijan"

7 May 2013 of the year in the Crimea, on Sapun-gore, opened a monument to the 77 of the Azerbaijan Red Banner Order of the Suvorov Simferopol Rifle Division. On his pedestal is written dedication "Fearless sons and daughters of Azerbaijan". 77-division participated in the liberation of the North Caucasus from the Nazi troops, then led the fighting against the Nazis in the Crimea. For the liberation of 13 on April 1944 of the city of Simferopol, she was given an honorary name - Simferopol.

7 May 1944, the division stormed Sapun Mountain, the key height on which the subsequent fate of Sevastopol and the whole Crimea depended. The next day, the units of the 77 Division took another strategic height of Sevastopol - Malakhov Kurgan. Then, along with other units of the Red Army, she liberated the center of the city. During the storming of Sapun Mountain and the liberation of Sevastopol the division was awarded the Order of Suvorov, II degree.

Ilham Aliyev paid attention to veterans of the Great Patriotic War

23 on April 2013, the President of Azerbaijan signed an Order on providing one-time financial assistance to participants of the Great Patriotic War 1941-1945, widows of fighters who died or later died, as well as persons who were awarded orders and medals for hard work in the rear. According to the decree, material assistance in the amount of 500 manats will be provided to participants of the Great Patriotic War 1941-1945, and according to 200 manats, widows of those killed in the Great Patriotic War or fighters who died later will receive.

Comments

[Humpty]

Each region in the rear has contributed. Now, if it weren’t for Baku oil and Khamjay mercury, etc. ...
Did the front line pass near Baku, and if so, when? Did people work less in Tashkent? However, Tashkent does not claim to be a hero city, despite the fact that rumors about the "Tashkent Front" exist.

[Apollo]

Good morning everyone.

Quote: Humpty

Did people work less in Tashkent? However, Tashkent does not claim to be a hero city, despite the fact that rumors about the "Tashkent Front" exist.

There will be an article about Tashkent, write enough, why and how !!! In this case we are talking about Baku and not about Tashkent. Where did you find the word Tashkent in the article?! Instead of analyzing the contribution of the people of Azerbaijan to the Second World War,"led away" the topic from the discussion in a completely different plane.

[Walking]

And the contribution of other nations was less?

[Andrey Skokovsky]

some kind of enemy liberal little article

in his phrase
“Nevertheless, Stalin, and later other Soviet leaders, for some reason did not dare to assign Baku the honorary title of“ Hero City. ”This high status was awarded only to the cities of the RSFSR, Belarus and Ukraine, which were under German occupation and became an arena However, in the opinion of many experts, Baku, given its exceptional role in the rear, rightfully deserved to bear the name of the "Hero City."
the author of the article not only answers his own question !!!, but also shows the method of manipulation used by him to create this opus!
the fact that the title was awarded only for feats of arms does not raise his doubts, but the fact that they were awarded only the cities of the RSFSR, Belarus and Ukraine is already somehow suspicious for him !!!
only the enemy of Russia, the one who wants to bring confusion and discord may have a similar perverse logic

moreover, the article does not stand up to criticism even from the point of view of the author’s perverse logic, I’ll explain what I mean:
we have, for example, the t -34 tank on the battlefield, it turns out that the people who created the fuel for the tank made a much greater contribution to the victory than those who created it, meanwhile it is clear to any sane person that making the tank is a much more difficult and difficult task than making fuel for it

[Ezhaak]

Quote: Humpty

Now, if it weren’t for Baku oil and Khamjay mercury, etc. ...

Without specific ideas about what was happening in those years, it’s better to sit and look for the history of those events than to carry nonsense.
The transportation of that oil was fatal for many sailors of the Caspian flotilla. Survivors were noted as participants in the war, although it was far from the front. German aircraft bombed them steadily at sea. One of these surviving sailors is my father-in-law. The kingdom to him is now heavenly.
And you, if the brains worked, it's time to look for a story. How did the Caspian flotilla fight without contact with the front line?

[Setrac]

Quote: Hedgehog

And you, if the brains worked, it's time to look for a story. How did the Caspian flotilla fight without contact with the front line?

And what does Baku have to do with it?

[experienced]

Quote: Humpty

Each region in the rear has contributed.

It's a shame that now they are starting to find out who contributed more to the Victory.
The victory was won by Soviet people !!! And I don’t care that Baku is not a hero city, it is a beautiful city with the descendants of those who ensured the Victory over fascism, shedding blood on the fronts and sweat in the oil fields and accepting evacuated citizens. I would be offended if Grozny became the hero of the city (Kadyrov wanted).
Well, let Aliyev himself decree assign this title and everyone will calm down

[alone]

Hi Alexey! why do we need it? what will it change? well, let’s say Aliyev will assign the status of a hero to the city of Baku, do you think this is changing something? All this is useless. I would not want to repeat it, it’s not for this that our grandfathers worked and fought. For the victory everything was done!

[predator.3]

The oil industry of the USSR during the Great Patriotic War

In July 1941, the State Defense Committee decided to develop a military-economic plan for the defense of the country. N. A. Voznesensky was entrusted with control over the production of metal and fuel. Under the People’s Commissariat of the Oil Industry, a special headquarters was established to provide the front with fuel, which was headed by N.S. Baibakov

The whole industry was transferred on a 12-hour working day until the end of the war, without days off and holidays.

The GKO Decree of July 30, 1941 on the development of oil production and refining in the eastern regions of the USSR increased the capacity of oil fields and oil refineries, boosted the construction of the Ufa, Syzransky, Saratov, Ishimbaevsky and other oil refineries. 2500 enterprises were relocated to the eastern regions of the country, 12 million people were evacuated. In Ishimbay was sent to them. Stalin, in Sterlitamak - the Baku factory of oil engineering "Red Proletariat", in Perm - the plant named after Myasnikov, in Sarapul - plant them. Dzerzhinsky. In the fall of 1941, the Aznefterazvedka trust was relocated to the Volga region; the well-known oilman A.F. One of the centers of oil evacuation is Ufa. There was relocated to the Moscow Petroleum Institute. I. M. Gubkina, temporarily placed People's Commissariat of the oil industry. Narcomneft was proposed to speed up the construction of a number of refineries and the introduction of new facilities, including at the Ufa, Saratov, Syzransky, Orsk, Ishimbaevsky and other plants. By decision of the GKO in 1941-1942. and in the first half of 1943, new refineries were built on the basis of evacuated equipment between the Volga and the Urals. For 7 months, a lubricant oil plant was built in Perm. In 1941, Kherson and Odessa cracking plants were evacuated to the Kuibyshev region. In 1942, the Syzran Oil Refinery was commissioned. The Kuibyshev Refinery was put into operation. By the end of 1942, a refinery was built in Komsomolsk-on-Amur. On August 31, 1941, in accordance with the decision of GKO, an experimental turbine drilling office was sent from Baku to Krasnokamsk (Perm Region), headed by director E.N. Tagiyev (the inventor of a multi-stage turbodrill), and the Machine Plant named after A.F. Myasnikov, who by May 1, 1942 produced the first batch of turbodrills.
http://do.gendocs.ru/docs/index-7496.html

I want to say that it was not only Baku that extracted oil, especially during the Stalingrad battles, the Germans actually cut supplies from Baku, then the fuel mainly came from Bashkiria!

[Nagaibak]

predator.3 "I want to say that not only Baku was producing oil, especially during the Stalingrad battles, the Germans actually cut off supplies from Baku, then the fuel came mainly from Bashkiria!"
I completely agree with you. Maybe they don't know about the "second Baku"? This was the name of the oil fields in the Volga region. Samara province, Bashkiria, Tatarstan, Western part of the Orenburg region. So oil is still being produced there, even if not in the same volumes as before ...
And the cities of the Urals and Siberia forged weapons with them how? Are they not heroes?
In general, the main thing in a war is the will to resist. I assure everyone, if there weren’t Baku oil in the country, we would have won. Before the war, plants for the production of synthetic gasoline and all business would be built.
This would be if Azerbaijan did not enter the USSR. And since he was part of no one shared anything. And there is no need to share the victory. She is one at all. Therefore, all the talk about don’t be Baku oil to us is crap.
And the title of cities of heroes is for a combat role in the war. And not for labor. According to work, the whole country should have been in heroes. Let's all the rear cities and assign .. hehe ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

And the title of cities of heroes is for a combat role in the war. And not for labor

there are 2 medals, Hero of the USSR and Hero of Socialist Labor ... and why not for labor .... they don’t say that they would give a military one ... they could have a labor one ... it’s easy to judge right now, if only would ... and why there are no others .... I don’t know others ... but the contribution of BAKU is clearly laid down ... 90% - imagine what your tanks would do without solarium or gasoline ...

[Pilat2009]

Quote: smersh70

90% - imagine what your tanks would do without a solarium or gasoline ...

For this, we had a wise Stalin to think about. Therefore, he made the Azerbaijan SSR. All acute issues in supply were successfully resolved.

[Nagaibak]

[quote = smersh70] there is 90% - imagine what your tanks would do without a solarium or gasoline ...
But CAN OUR TANKS? Or do you consider any other tanks your tanks in World War II?
I understand you closer Turkish, but they were not there ....

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

I understand you closer Turkish, but they were not there ....

remembered April 90)))) we sit and watch football .. USSR-Turkey. 5-0 OUR won .. notice ours .. that is, the Soviet ... at that time the police comes in and checks the documents in the hostel ... checked. .. there’s nothing to complain about ... well, guys, students. there has never been anything like this ... so that the documents are checked ... excited ... become serious ... and suddenly OMONOVETS tells another ... look ... how sad .... . THEIR lost ... here and sad .... it became somehow sad of their words ... while they were explained ... the Komsomol ..SSSR..Lenin.party .. served in the army .... Omonovets Niv what ... You Turks and all)))) biased attitude.

[xetai9977]

You know, paradoxically, we should be grateful to our enemies ... They made us remember that we are really Türks.

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "What a riot policeman ... you are Turks and all)))) in such a prejudiced attitude. There were many similar moments in the life of any Caucasian in Russia. Even among the Armenians you do not like, since for such riot police you are all united. But not all Omnivites are the same. And conclusions are drawn from one thing.
Well, Azerbaijanis are different too.

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

Before the war, plants for the production of synthetic gasoline and all business would be built.

when..kem .... even for ILs there were no factories .. in the open place they built ... right now it’s easy to reason .. if so .. then so ...

[Nagaibak]

smersh70when..who .... even for the ILs there were no factories .. they built in an open place ... right now it is easy to argue .. if so .. so ... "
If before the war, Stalin gave the task would not be built a question. As soon as possible. And ahead of all schedules hehe ... I wrote presumably if you did not understand the text it is not for me. I wrote - do not be Azerbaijan in the Soviet Socialist Republic with its oil. The Germans provided themselves with synthetics. That is the question. Therefore, the main will to resist the country. And she was. If the USSR did not have Baku oil, the question of preparation for a future war would be resolved taking into account its absence. That is what I wanted to say. I hope this is clear?

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

If before the war, Stalin gave the task would not be built a question.

you just don’t know the history of the creation of IL-2 and IL-2mod .. also remember Stalin’s telegram to the director of this plant .. and how they built it .. these factories .... it even took place in our school ....

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "you just do not know the history of the creation of the Il-2 and Il-2mod .. remember also Stalin's telegram to the director of this plant .. and in general how they built .. these plants .... it even took place in our school ..."
And where does Ila do not understand.

[Very old]

N. Baibakov (my godfather) told: they removed the tanks from the railway platforms, they threw them into Ilyich’s Bay, tied them up, as sausages towed to Astrakhan and higher along the Volga. It is a fact.

[smersh70]

Quote: predator.3

the Germans actually cut supplies from Baku, while the fuel mostly came from Bashkiria!

then why the goal of the whole company for 42 years was BAKU !!!!!! if it was cut ... then why was the attack on Stalingrad and Baku .. even left Moscow and Leningrad .. learn my friend’s story .... compared oil in Bashkiria and Baku ..you say the same 90% ... according to your words, Hitler should have stepped on Bashkiria ... ..

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "then why the goal of the whole company in 42 years was BAKU !!!!!"
They just did not know that in the Volga oil to hell !!!!

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

They just did not know that in the Volga oil to hell !!!!

ah-ah-ah ... you had to be with Hitler instead of Canaris. would tell ...
but seriously ... they could not know what would happen in the future .... at that time they were going there ... where was the most oil ....

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "but seriously .. they could not know what would happen in the future .... at that moment they were going there .. where was the most oil ..."
Seriously, their intelligence was not very good. So they went where they knew.
And the "second Baku" has been developed since 1932, it seems, and in the 1950s 78% of the country's oil was extracted in the Volga region. Then the total production decreased due to the Siberian deposits. In the 1970s, up to 58% if the memory does not fail. This is me, for example.
Although belittling the importance of Baku and Azerbaijan is also stupid.
It’s the same nonsense to beat your heels in the chest and say that if we hadn’t had Baku oil, we would have lost the war. This I, dear SMERSH, explain my position. I hope I clearly bring my idea.

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

I hope I clearly bring my idea.

Well, that’s how they would write in the morning ..and they lost the account .. did I say so ... it was about the delivery of the hero of social labor .. and that's it notice ... not fighting .. and social labor ... there would be a precedent))

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "Well, this is how they would have written in the morning .. and lost the account .. I didn’t say so ... it was about awarding the hero of social labor .. and mind you all ... not fighting .. but social labor .. . would be a precedent)) "
Good ...

[Setrac]

Quote: smersh70

but seriously ... they could not know what would happen in the future .... at that time they were going there ... where was the most oil ....

If Moscow or Leningrad had fallen, no Baku oil would have helped.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Setrac

If Moscow or Leningrad had fallen

Moscow fell repeatedly. Russia did not die from this

[domokl]

I advise the author to read the status of the city-hero. If we proceed from the author’s logic, then we have a lot of heroes — almost the entire Urals (tanks), Mordovia (small arms), Omsk (radio transmitters for aviation and tankers) and other, other, other.
Another thing is interesting. It seems that the already forgotten Soviet city hero is still relevant. And rolling onto specific soldiers and officers does not fit into any framework at all. I recall the Soviet era, Kirovobad (in my current Ganja) and a small Armenian village about .. . From which three Marshals and fourteen generals of the Red Army came out. This is also on the territory of Azerbaijan. I do not want to see the name of the village, but read to anyone interested in the biography of Marshal Baghramyan .. He is also a native of this village.

[Valery Neonov]

++. I support the opinion!

[Apollo]

Quote: Valery Neonov

I support the opinion

What exactly do you support?! Commentary in its entirety, its individual parts, or of the most commented person.

[Valery Neonov]

I support in terms of the inadmissibility of the preference of any given city (region) in the victory over Germany.

[Apollo]

Quote: domokl

This is also in Azerbaijan. I do not want to see the name of the village, but read to anyone interested in the biography of Marshal Baghramyan .. He is also a native of this village.

Good afternoon Alexander
quote from article- exactly on the recommendation of Mikoyan In the late forties, Stalin organized the so-called “resettlement” of 200 thousand Azerbaijanis from Armenia to Azerbaijan. In essence, it was legalized exile., which was carried out in accordance with the Decree of the Council of Ministers of the USSR No. 4083 of December 23 1947. It lasted until the year 1950.
Please comment on this quote above.

[domokl]

Quote: Apollon

"Resettlement" from Armenia to Azerbaijan 200 thousand Azerbaijanis. It was essentially legalized exile,

Greetings to Apollo. You twisted my comment. I wrote about Azerbaijan and the Armenian village on its territory. And not about the resettled Azerbaijanis. This is not correct on your part.
And it seems to me that the conversation about the resettlement of 200 thousands has been going on for 20 years. Moreover, with variable activity. In Azerbaijan and in Armenia there are periodically people who reproach Stalin for the genocide of some people. Just let me remind you one for some reason fact-Stalin, who was forgotten by such commentators, came from the Caucasus. And he knew the situation in the Caucasus from the inside. But to say that there was someone who could put pressure on Stalin was contrary to historical truth.

[Gari]

Quote: domokl

And to say that there was someone who could put pressure on Stalin contradicts historical truth.

No one could even theoretically not put pressure and not influence Comrade Stalin.
And Stalin's faithful comrade-in-arms, and he was next to him starting with the revolution, People’s Commissar Mikoyan, did nothing but benefit for his USSR country, otherwise, you yourself know where you would be.
Since 1941, A.I. Mikoyan was the chairman of the committee for food and clothing supplies of the Red Army, as well as a member of the Evacuation Council and the State Committee for the Restoration of the Economy of Liberated Areas; since 1942, he was a member of the State Defense Committee
By decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR of September 30, 1943 for special merits in the field of organizing the supply of food, fuel, and property to the Red Army in difficult wartime conditions, Anastas Ivanovich Mikoyan was awarded the title Hero of Socialist Labor with the Order of Lenin and the Hammer and Sickle Medal ".

[Apollo]

Quote: Gari

A faithful companion of Stalin and he was next to him since the revolution People's Commissar Mikoyan

Tricky and treacherous rat.

[Walking]

Quote: Apollon

Quote: Gari

A faithful companion of Stalin and he was next to him since the revolution People's Commissar Mikoyan

Tricky and treacherous rat.

Apollo you're wrong

[Apollo]

Quote: Hiking

You are not right

The Admin will deal with you and you know why.

[smersh70]

Quote: Hiking

Apollo you're wrong

you probably know about the story of 26 Baku commissars .... a prison notebook for delivering food in the Krasnovodsk prison was recently published .. so everyone was shot from that cell, except for Mikoyan ... probably you heard about the internal chamber development .... and how they later released him ..... and the scammers just don’t let go .. Stalin hinted at Mikoyan a little ....- if we start digging about the commissars ... then handed over to Stalin .. ,,, Khrusheva .. I would have handed over Brezhnev ... yes death came to him ....

[Apollo]

Quote: Hiking

Apollo you're wrong

Wrong in what for the contribution of Azerbaijanis to the Second World War, hundreds of thousands of Azerbaijanis were evicted. And this immediately after the victory. The Soviet leadership "appreciated" the contribution of my republic.

[Walking]

Why deal with me? I did not insult anyone, did not call names.

[Apollo]

Quote: Hiking

Why deal with me? I did not insult anyone, did not call names.

read my post below

Apollon AZ Today, 11: 22 ↑

[Gari]

Quote: Hiking

Why deal with me? I did not insult anyone, did not call names.

Threats went, it’s interesting, but the truth for what?

[Gari]

Quote: Apollon

Tricky and treacherous rat.

Well, well, here you’ve shown your true face, you are simply an inveterate Armenian phob, but as I see it, not only the Armenians have such an attitude.
Mikoyan was not only a patriot of his USSR country, but he also raised sons.
Stepan, born in 1922, test pilot. He went to the front as a volunteer, was shot down in battle, wounded. Honored Test Pilot of the USSR, Lieutenant General of Aviation, Deputy Chief Designer of NPO Molniya Zhukovsky, Candidate of Technical Sciences, lives in Moscow.
Hero of the Soviet Union.
Vladimir, born in 1924, a fighter pilot. He went to the front as a volunteer. Three months before the front, he worked in the aviation inspectorate, circled both our and Messershmites’ planes. In 1942 he was shot down in battle.

Alexey, born in 1926, volunteered for the front, pilot. Combat Lieutenant General, commander of a regiment, division, corps, district.

Vano, born in 1929, is an aircraft designer, has been working at the Mikoyan Design Bureau for forty-six years, and in recent years he has been deputy chief designer.

Sergo, born in 1931, graduated from the Institute of International Relations, specialist in Latin America.

[smersh70]

Quote: Gari

but he also raised sons.

but they forgot how the sons organized an anti-Soviet organization .. in 44-45 years .. for Stalin putting them in place .. only Mikoyan’s intervention at the level of Stalin’s stupa helped to free them ....

[Corsair]

Quote: smersh70

but they forgot how the sons organized an anti-Soviet organization .. in 44-45 years .. for Stalin putting them in place .. only Mikoyan’s intervention at the level of Stalin’s stupa helped to free them ....

And you THIS "on complete surrender"?, But if there was at least something in this "case", everyone would "thunder" together with dad - Anastas ...
Not such "values" and their relatives "shook" the term ...
The Commissar Molotov had a wife in the camps, and many, many, many ..

[smersh70]

Quote: Corsair

And you THIS "on complete surrender"?

Yes, my dear friend !!!!!! did not know .. look .. you will find .. Learn excellent history .....

[smersh70]

Quote: Corsair

And you THIS "on complete surrender" ?,

The investigation began with the fact that it was found that the Walter pistol, from which Shakhurin shot, belonged to the youngest son of Anastas Mikoyan Vano. He and his older brother Sergo were arrested. They admitted to creating an anti-Soviet organization and named all its members. Those were also arrested. All members of the “Fourth Reich” stated that the entire organization was just a children's game, but no one paid attention to it. On July 23, 1943, eight members of the organization were placed in the NKGB internal prison. The investigator in their case was Leo Wlodzimirsky. On December 18, 1943, the brothers Mikoyan, Leonid Barabanov, Armand Hammer, Pyotr Bakulev, Leonid Redens, Artyom Khmelnitsky and Felix Kirpichnikov were sentenced to one year’s deportation to various cities of the Urals, Siberia and Central Asia without any trial. The verdict was signed by the People’s Commissar of State Security Vsevolod Merkulov and the Prosecutor General of the USSR Konstantin Gorshenin.

[Gari]

Quote: smersh70

but they forgot how the sons organized an anti-Soviet organization .. in 44-45 years ..

Finishing it up, this is the only record, but they are the same as the one you got.
And you THIS "on complete surrender"?, But if there was at least something in this "case", everyone would "thunder" together with dad - Anastas ...
Not such "values" and their relatives "shook" the term ...
All of the above.

[smersh70]

Quote: Gari

And you THIS "on complete surrender"?, But if there was at least something in this "case", everyone would "thunder" together with dad - Anastas ...
Not such "values" and their

In 1942-1943, a group of students of the "government" school 175 under the leadership of Vladimir Shakhurin (pictured), the son of the People's Commissar of the Aviation Industry of the USSR Ivan Shakhurin, created an underground organization "The Fourth Empire": they admired the aesthetics of the Third Reich, formed a shadow government, called each other by the Gruppenführer and Reichsführer. After the mysterious death in June 1943 on the Kamenny Bridge in Moscow, a student of this school - the daughter of the USSR Ambassador to Mexico Nina Umanskaya, who, according to the official version, was shot by Shakhurin and then shot at himself - eight teenagers were arrested. Among them are two sons of Mikoyan, Stalin's nephew, the son of Academician Bakulev, who were part of the Fourth Empire. Stalin, having learned about this case, according to legend, said: "Wolf cubs." The guilty children of the leaders were expelled from Moscow, the case was hushed up.
While studying at school, Shakhurin Jr. met the following students who later became members of his Fourth Reich organization:

Sergo Anastasovich Mikoyan (son of Anastas Mikoyan)
Vano Anastasovich Mikoyan (son of Anastas Mikoyan)
Leonid Stanislavovich Redens (son of Stanislav Redens, nephew of Joseph Stalin)
Artyom Rafailovich Khmelnitsky (son of Rafail Khmelnitsky)
Pyotr Aleksandrovich Bakulev (son of Alexander Bakulev)
Felix Petrovich Kirpichnikov (son of Peter Ivanovich Kirpichnikov)
Armand Viktorovich Hammer (Armand Hammer's nephew)
and a number of others.

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

who reproach Stalin for the genocide of some people

just not Armenians and Georgians !!!!! look and give at least one example of the mass resettlement of Armenians of Georgians in Central Asia or the Urals or Siberia .... there are no examples ......

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Apollon

In the late forties, Stalin organized the so-called “resettlement” of 200 thousand Azerbaijanis from Armenia to Azerbaijan.

Taking into account how you love each other is a very correct measure. If he settled both peoples separately, there would be no Karabakh

[Gari]

Quote: domokl

and a small Armenian village near ... From which three Marshals and fourteen generals of the Red Army emerged

The Armenian Village of Chardakhlu - Of the natives of the village, 1250 people left for the front. Of these, half were awarded orders and medals, two became marshals (Amazasp Babadzhanyan and Ivan Baghramyan), twelve - generals, seven - Heroes of the Soviet Union.
Before the battle, the Chardakhlins put on a shoulders and back a twisted white shroud in the form of a cross. They went to certain death - to protect their land. Everyone wanted his family to be proud of him.

[Apollo]

Quote: Gari

Everyone wanted his family to be proud of him.

comment me
1: The deportation of Azerbaijanis from Armenia in the 1948 year.
2. Why did Turkey end up in NATO ?!

[Gari]

Quote: Apollon

1. Deportation of Azerbaijanis from Armenia in 1948

This question is addressed to the author of this article.
Nowhere except your sites, I have not found anything like it.

[Apollo]

Quote: Gari

This question is addressed to the author of this article.
Nowhere except your sites, I have not found anything like it.

I addressed you, if I considered it necessary I would have addressed it to the author without your prompting.
And so, M.V. Stalin, not without insulting Mikoyan, put forward a demand for Turkey to tear away the 6 provinces of Turkey from Armenia.
Regarding deportation, your leadership has a lot of experience in expelling civilians from acquired places.

[Gari]

Quote: Apollon

I addressed you, if I considered it necessary I would have addressed it to the author without your prompting.

Then the question is for you, bring me at least one link, not from your sites and works of your scholars, such as Jamil Hasanli, but others.

[domokl]

Quote: Apollon

comment me
1: The deportation of Azerbaijanis from Armenia in the 1948 year.
2. Why did Turkey end up in NATO ?!

It seems to me that you are trying to shift the conversation towards Armenian-Azerbaijani relations. And the Armenians are to blame for the fact that Baku did not receive the title of a hero city? Well, excuse me, you have to use your own way of asking questions and demanding answers ...

[Apollo]

Quote: domokl

It seems to me that you are trying to shift the conversation towards Armenian-Azerbaijani relations.

The answer is incorrect, we are talking about Mikoyan, who used his official position for his nationalist and mercantile interests.

Quote: domokl

And the Armenians are to blame for the fact that Baku did not receive the title of a hero city?

Mikoyan, what is Georgian ?!

Quote: domokl

Well, excuse me, you have to use your own way of raising questions and demanding answers ...

Without comment, there is nothing to comment on since the question is not answered.

[Gari]

Quote: Apollon

The answer is incorrect, we are talking about Mikoyan, who used his official position for his nationalist and mercantile interests.

I understand the envy that you did not have a person like Mikoyan.
Yes, and Marshals Baghramyan, Babadzhanyan, Khudyakov (Khanferyants), Admiral Isakov, by the way Twice Hero of the USSR, Major General of the Tank Forces Azi Aslanov, a native of Lankaran, the legendary son of the Talysh people
you can read about it -http: //www.talish.info/news/azi_aslanov_legendarnyj_syn_talyshskogo_naroda/2010
-05-08-1153
The heroes of the Soviet Union were Russians - 7998 people, Ukrainians - 2021 people, Belarusians - 299 people, 161 Tatars, 107 Jews, 96 Kazakhs, 90 Georgians, 89 Armenians, 67 Uzbeks, 63 Mordvinians, 45 Chuvashs, 43 Azerbaijanis, 38 Bashkirs, 31 Ossetians, 18 Maris, 16 Turkmens, 15 Lithuanians, 15 Tajiks, 12 Latvians, 12 Kyrgyz, 10 Komi, 10 Udmurts, 9 Estonians, 8 Karelians, 8 Kalmyks, 6 Kabardins, 6 Adyghes, 4 Abkhazians, 2 Yakuts, 2 Moldovans , 1 Tuvinian.
There was one Great country, which was attacked by the treacherous enemy, and everyone stood up for defense, all as one people.
And the Great Victory was shared!

[smersh70]

Quote: Gari

Twice Hero of the USSR, Major General of Tank Forces Azi Aslanov, a native of Lankaran, the legendary son of the Talysh people

you're lying, my friend ... you're lying ... looking straight in the eye ... say this to his son ... grandson ... that's how you determined ... by birth certificate chtoli ....

Quote: Gari

Khudyakov (Khanferyants), Admiral Isakov

the same thing and I can say that they are not Armenians .. you attributed them to yourself ...

[Gari]

Quote: smersh70

you're lying, my friend ... you're lying ... looking straight in the eye ... say this to his son ... grandson ... that's how you determined ... by birth certificate chtoli ....

Èâåël css -http: //www.talish.info/news/azi_aslanov_legendarnyj_syn_talyshskogo_naroda/2010


-05-08-1153 read and then nod in a lie,
Khudyakov (Khanferyants), Admiral Isakov
the same thing and I can say that they are not Armenians .. you attributed them to yourself ...
yes you can say anything your problems

[sergey32]

Listen gentlemen!
On what basis did you appropriate heroes based on nationality? And Baghramyan, and Aslanov, and Kozhedub and millions of others were SOVIET heroes, and therefore OURS.
If they could read this srach, I think they would pour it on everyone on the first number.

[Gari]

Quote: sergey32

And Baghramyan, and Aslanov, and Kozhedub and millions of others were SOVIET heroes, and therefore OURS.

100500 +++
Dear to you!

[Pilat2009]

Quote: sergey32

If they could read this srach, I think they would pour it on everyone on the first number.

Yes, they simply would have shot the perpetrators of the collapse of the USSR
Under Stalin, I would try to blather somebody about the right to self-separation

[domokl]

Quote: Apollon

The answer is incorrect, we are talking about Mikoyan, who used his official position for his nationalist and mercantile interests.

Alas, such an accusation was not confirmed by anything except your words. I specifically visited Azerbaijani sites ... The usual idle talk is a la Ukrainians are the progenitors of all. If Mikoyan used something there for the benefit of the Armenians, then why Yerevan is not a city - hero?

Quote: Apollon

Mikoyan, what is Georgian ?!

And who is Stalin? And Stalin and Mikoyan (by the way) repeatedly emphasized their Russianness. They called themselves Russian ... Or is work in favor of the USSR also unnatural for you?
Your love for the neighboring people knows no bounds ... And blind love for the good does not lead ... Remove the blinders from the eyes, look around.

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

And who is Stalin? And Stalin and Mikoyan (by the way) repeatedly emphasized their Russianness

would not call ... otherwise it would be posed. how can an Armenian and a Georgian lead almost Russian homudism ... it was after them that the question of the leadership of the USSR of the national minorities was never discussed ...

[Gari]

Quote: domokl

It seems to me that you are trying to shift the conversation towards Armenian-Azerbaijani relations.

As always, to provoke srach on the site.

[Apollo]

Quote: Gari

As always, to provoke srach on the site.

Well, it’s hard for me to keep up with you, the USSR collapsed with its miatsum. The first in the post-Soviet space proved to be separatists. For your information in Moscow, we did not blow up the subway but your fellow tribesmen.

[domokl]

My dear. I would in your place stop watering everyone who opposes your opinion. Everyone has patience, but insults and provocations do not paint you personally.

Quote: Apollon

Well, it’s hard for me to keep up with you, the USSR collapsed with its miatsum

If you lead a discussion, yes. If you listen to a market chatter, no ... Not that level and not that situation.

[Apollo]

Quote: Gari

As always, to provoke srach on the site.

Srach bred you. Sew and further slander on me, the compass keyboard will endure everything.

[T80UM1]

Apollo with all due respect to Azerbaijan. Stalin also wanted to take northern Azerbaijan from Iran in favor of you know who ...

[domokl]

Quote: Gari

Armenian Village of Chardakhlu-Iz

Thank you for the comprehensive information ... I was still a cadet in Kirovobad during an internship. And of all that I remembered about this city, for some reason everywhere there are hands, more precisely palms, monuments, many cognac factories and this village ...

[Apollo]

Quote: domokl

I was still an internship student in Kirovobad. And from all that I remembered about this city, for some reason everywhere there are hands, or rather palm-monuments, many cognac factories and this village ...

Alexander You left my questions unanswered and nevertheless found time to answer another visitor. I suppose you either have nothing to answer or do not have "time", which of course raises doubts.

[domokl]

My answer is just above Gary's answer. But again, you are trying to translate the topic of conversation into a plane that has not been studied enough. The Azerbaijani position is fundamentally different from the Armenian one. And I don’t see the point of talking about what I’m not sure about ... This will be an empty idle talk, or rather verbiage.

[Apollo]

Quote: domokl

But again, you are trying to translate the topic of conversation into a plane that is not well understood.

The article has a resolution, google or you are too lazy to study, but maybe it’s not profitable for you ?!

Quote: domokl

This will be an empty idle talk, or rather verbiage.

so far I see from you.

[Ezhaak]

Quote: domokl

palms-monuments, many cognac factories and this village ...

And the fact that the city is essentially divided into two parts, Azerbaijani and Armenian, didn’t they tell you cadets? Probably it was useless. In Kirovabad, everything is calm!

[domokl]

Quote: Hedgehog

And the fact that the city is essentially divided into two parts, Azerbaijani and Armenian,

But they didn’t tell us about the city at all. We didn’t come on an excursion, we did internships as platoon commanders. We did what we did. But there was no such division. We were Soviet. The truth was one nuance of this city. Rodopi cigarettes then they were produced with a short and long filter for some reason. So for some reason they didn’t cost 35 kopecks everywhere, but 50 with a long one ... And the second thing that struck me was that many people wore cigarette packs in socks ... For us, shock, but it was .... Wine, in my opinion, Al Sukhra and Al Sherab sold as ours you kiosks and the same half-liter mugs ... And the Armenians then sewed chic fashion Cossacks ... We're all torn kupili.pravda a month, two ...

[Ezhaak]

Quote: domokl

cost not 35 cents as everywhere else, but 50

This is in the order of things. A cheap prima instead of 14 cost smokers 15 kopecks.
I'll tell you a small example: the goods were brought to a store near the campus. 2 saleswomen worked in it. Who's in charge of carrying fish packs into the freezer? No not like this. The saleswomen remained at the counters, the store manager "phoned" a person practicing such work. Bargained and he endured everything. Where does the store manager get the money to pay for the work done? From these cigarettes and other "markups" on the goods. But you also have to pay off the freight forwarder for the timely delivery of hot goods, etc. And there the police, the Soviet will look. She's guarding the store! There are a lot of calculations, but my salary is not enough.

[smersh70]

Quote: Hedgehog

A cheap prima instead of 14 cost smokers 15 kopecks.

You say so, as if all the troubles of Soviet trade began with Ganja everything went, my dear from Moscow ... remember, for example, the OKEAN store in Moscow .. or a deli if in Ganja they stole 1 kopeck .. then YOU have whole wagons and bags of money .....

[Ezhaak]

Quote: smersh70

. Remember, for example, the OKEAN store in Moscow

I recall Baku more as a living in Baku since 1950. And there I have something to remember. By the way, this message does not honor you and does not add respect.
Yusif Samed-oglu, the son of a man who bore a name similar to yours, was a much more educated and decent person. I personally knew him. And he lived in a 16-story building, in which the Book House was located in the Soviet years. You see, I know a lot about Baku! Maybe even more of some comrades.

[smersh70]

Quote: Hedgehog

Yusif Samed-oglu, son of a man who bore a name similar to yours

not like ... but in honor of him Well, everything ... you killed .... you are ours ..... Right now your skyscraper is one of the most expensive .. there prices are fixed .... if you hadn’t left .. right now you would be a millionaire ...

[Ezhaak]

I lived elsewhere. In the 4th microdistrict. There the prices are low. :) But the family of my friends I do not know, she also lived in the same house a couple of floors below. The very center of the city. Therefore, such prices.
As for the name, for Samed Vekilov it was like a pseudonym.

[domokl]

Quote: smersh70

You say so, as if all the troubles of Soviet trade began with Ganja

He says so, in my opinion, simply because it was so ... And all these oceans, Eliseev’s very different scale

[smersh70]

Quote: Hedgehog

divided into two parts, Azerbaijani and Armenian, didn’t they tell you cadets? Probably it was useless. In Kirovabad, everything is calm!

Yes, many cities in the Caucasus were divided ..... the same thing happened in Yerevan .. and in Tbilisi .. in the center of Tbilisi, generally Azerbaijanis live .. the same thing happened in the center of Yerevan ....
and about Ganja --- they lived in the second part of the city .. came from neighboring villages and settled on the outskirts .. so this part was formed ... by the way, Armenians also live there ... for your information ....

[domokl]

Quote: smersh70

Yes, many cities in the Caucasus were divided.

I don’t know how cities are, but the buses definitely remembered. They were in the Mengichaur valley (I’m sorry if I didn’t write the letters correctly, that’s not the point). So the Azerbaijani bus went there-Tbilissi-Mengechaur, and the Georgian one along the same route -Tbilissi-Mengechauri ... The Russian guys were funny and not clear to us, there’s a chip in it ... After all, everyone was lazy in the healing springs. And in the blue mud everyone is equal, the muzzle of the face, and the bodies of all are pale blue like aliens

[Ezhaak]

Quote: smersh70

By the way, Armenians also live there ... for your information ....

What am I talking about? And domokl himself, who started the conversation about it, started the same thing! We are not talking about Armenikend in Baku itself. And by the way, there is Erzurum in Baku itself, or rather, it has been and ceases to exist today.

[Corsair]

Quote: Hedgehog

And the fact that the city is essentially divided into two parts, Azerbaijani and Armenian, didn’t they tell you cadets? Probably it was useless. In Kirovabad, everything is calm!

Back in 1989, being called up for active military service, at first I had to serve with a boy - an Armenian, drafted from Azerbaijan, Baku, district "Bailov".

A good, correct kid, ... but only at night he did not let the "spirits" sleep - he shouted in a dream with a wild shout, raising the barracks "on the ears" several times during the night ...
We were striving for a long time, until we "got used" and learned how he and his family had it during the Armenian pogroms in Baku ...

[Ezhaak]

Quote: Corsair

found out how he and his family had to during the Armenian pogroms in Baku ...

Darling, you are confusing something. In Baku, 1989 no pogroms existed. I say this to you as a Russian who lived in Baku at that time. But I will say that something like this was in Sumgait in February 1988 for a couple of days.
PS From Sumgait to Bailov more than 30 km in a straight line. Draw conclusions, gentlemen!

[Corsair]

Quote: Hedgehog

In Baku, 1989 no pogroms existed.

During a meeting in Nakhijevan with American journalist Thomas Goltz, Aliyev talks about those responsible for the events of Black January. “These were the KGB Center and Azerbaijan, as well as the entire leadership of Azerbaijan.” All of them were involved in the attacks on the Armenians of 12, 13, 14 on January, and then on 20 on January, when Soviet troops stormed Baku. This was the plan of Moscow, in the implementation of which the Azerbaijani leadership - Vezirov and Mutalibov also took part. ”

And November-December? Or EVERYTHING, in your opinion, happened "instantly"?
On December 31 of the 1989 of the year, everything is dignified, but the 12 of the pogroms?
Everything smoldered "gradually", and it was NOT a FACT that if they did not "come" to you, then the pogroms did not exist BEFORE.

And I’m not sure that you are ready, with a fair amount of confidence, to EXACTLY state WHERE and WHEN the infection arose ...

[Ezhaak]

Quote: Corsair

And November-December?

Deal with your thoughts properly!
Sumgait - February 1988.
Black January - January 1990
you were drafted into the army in 1989. The Armenian who served with you could not see what was happening in Baku, just physically could not. He served in the army! I saw that same Black January, this is my family hiding the Armenian family. It was my wife who woke me up, waking up on January 20 from the approaching machine gun bursts on the streets of the city and the roar of armored vehicles.
Therefore, get used not to listen to anyone, but to communicate only with eyewitnesses. Yes, and an eyewitness can easily change and trick.
And where and when I said relatively true a little lower on the forum for xetai9977

[Corsair]

Quote: Hedgehog

You were drafted into the army in 1989. The Armenian who served with you could not see what was happening in Baku, just physically could not.

The call is the autumn of the 89go, I was held back at the end of November, Vadik Akopov (that was the name of this Azerbaijani Armenian) apparently even later, because the unit arrived in the beginning of January of the 90go ...
TOTAL he may not have seen (his happiness), butWHAT he MANAGED see was enough.

[Ezhaak]

Quote: Corsair

TOTAL he may not have seen (his happiness), but THAT he HAS LIVED to see was enough

Your Vadik is lying, until January 12, 1990 it was quiet and relatively calm. No casualties! Your Vadik is spreading rumors about what was happening in Sumgait and not otherwise. Or what relatives later wrote to him. There is no need to talk about the fact that rumors are always exaggerated. There were rumors in Baku that corpses were taken out and drowned there after the troops entered the sea. Can they be trusted?
And 12 and the next three days were really difficult for the city. Even the Azerbaijanis themselves, from decent families, urban, were afraid to take to the streets.

[smersh70]

Quote: Hedgehog

Your Vadik is lying, until January 12, 1990 it was quiet and relatively calm.

Quote: Hedgehog

Or what relatives later wrote to him

Quote: Hedgehog

And 12 and the next three days were really difficult for the city.

it is immediately clear that the person owns the information !!!!!!!!!!

[xetai9977]

Eugene, do not bother yourself! For some, we walk on the site with recorded enemies, and no matter what we say, it will not matter. The title of Heroes in Soviet times could have any meaning, but now why do we need regalia of a non-existent state? Although I am happy about any occasion for communicating with Bakuis like you, Eugene! Nice to meet a fellow countryman !!!

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

for some reason everywhere hands, or rather palm-monuments,

removed this monument.)))) and a lot of wine and cognac)) 1-2 was a wine festival so we invite ... and at the table weathered some of your bias towards us ..

[domokl]

Quote: smersh70

... and at the table weathered some of your bias towards us ..

I’m absolutely sober about everything and everyone. It’s just that I always have a negative point that any question regarding Azerbaijan by its citizens comes down to Nagorno-Karabakh. Have you hated the Armenians so much? Or the Armenians, but to us here in Russia your dismantlings do not seem very correct .A touch the memory of the Second World War, in order to achieve something for himself in general causes a negative.

[Ezhaak]

Quote: domokl

touch the memory of the Second World War in order to achieve something for himself in general causes a negative.

Today, when Russia in itself, Azerbaijan in itself, to start such a conversation, one can only remember the past and remind oneself. For he will not change anything and decide nothing.

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

So much did you hate the Armenians?

if they were prejudiced, the Unas wouldn’t live right now for 30000 Armenians ... by the way, the opposite of Armenia ... there is a mono-ethnic state built ... it’s just annoying that the Armenians always put themselves in a kind of humiliated ... oppressed ... genocidal .. .and then under these signs they shout about some kind of massacre by the Azerbaijanis and do their dirty deeds to seize foreign territories, hiding behind large states .... we are not against the people ... we are against the policy pursued by the state of Armenia ... and we are even him, as an invading country .... and as for the people, I also have friends, the Armenians

[domokl]

Quote: smersh70

if they were prejudiced, then the Unas would not live right now 30000 Armenians ..

This really amazes me. If honestly ... I have many friends and colleagues of both nationalities. We are all brothers. We can walk on the nose talking (for some reason, I’m also mountain ), we can walk through modern life, but we are brothers. Namely brothers. And I know that. If it will be shitty to me, both from Azerbaijan and from Armenia, and from Ukraine will come brothers who will break up, but help .. And their children will come same. And my children too.
And most importantly, they won’t ask who you are or what kind of brother .. He’s either brother or not ...

[xetai9977]

Why on earth does the village of Chardakhly become ChardakhlU? Is it from the same opera that Shusha became Shushi, and Khojaly became KhojalU? I agree that all citizens living in the territory of the Azerbaijan SSR, regardless of nationality, including Armenians, contributed to the Victory in the Second World War, but why rename the names of settlements in the Armenian way? Isn’t this the creeping separatism that began? And the deportation of Azerbaijanis from Armenia to low-lying regions of Azerbaijan in 1948 is pure truth. This was done to make way for the Armenian migrants from Turkey and Iran who were massively settled in 1947-1948. I and my whole family witness this. I come from Yerevan. Unas was a neighbor, an Armenian from Turkey, who always spoke in Turkish with us. She said that they were tritely thrown, promising a paradise life. And when we arrived and were convinced that this, to put it mildly, was not true, but there was no turning back.

[Ezhaak]

Good day, Rauf!

Quote: xetai9977

And the deportation of Azerbaijanis in 1948 from Armenia to the low regions of Azerbaijan is pure truth.

But attempts to evict the Armenians from Nakhichevan are beyond doubt!
All this has very ancient roots. and all this is mutual.
The saddest thing is that there will always be someone who does not like the quiet life of peoples.

[xetai9977]

Good afternoon, Eugene! The genie had already escaped from the bottle. They did not cover separatism in Karabakh, they got the collapse of the USSR. We are already used to the fact that separatism is good for us and bad for others.

[smersh70]

Quote: Hedgehog

All this has very ancient roots. and all this is mutual.

You are mistaken Dear ... give at least one example when the Azerbaijanis started the war against the Armenians or cut off their lands .. in ALL cases, our actions were directed after the Armenians started everything ... and what did you think ... that let's say the Germans will delay you have land and you let them live in peace ... cheto in 41, you did a completely different thing with respect to the Germans ....

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

interesting biography of Marshal Baghramyan .. He is also a native of this particular village.

I beg only not Bagryamyan gave the entire South-Western Front ... disgraced near Kharkov ... Stalin wanted to shoot him twice .. but he never commanded a company. regiment ... division .. a typical staff promoter .....

[domokl]

Quote: smersh70

..typical staff promoter .....

That's right. Stalin, Zhukov and others were fools, and we are smart ... Maybe it’s enough to revise the story already? Is it either there or it is not. For us in Russia it is, and we don’t look who was of ethnicity century ... On the same square in St. Petersburg are two monuments to the saviors of Russia from Napoleon. Two monuments to the Russian commanders-Kutuzov and Barclay de Tolly ...

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

Stalin, Zhukov and others were fools, and we are smart.

at least you did not answer my question .. where did he command a company ... platoon ... regiment ... division ... and the facts are there .... where he was ... there was always complete ..... remember also about a bottle from the Baltic coast ... you know, yes, how he sent Stalin a bottle of water and what Stalin answered ...

[knn54]

At that time there was not a single city that would not be completely surrendered to the approach of victory. Someone with oil, someone with bread, and someone shared a roof over their heads and food with refugees from the destroyed cities. Everyone did something, the whole country worked.
There is no longer either the USSR, or the orders of Lenin, or the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR. WHO will give this title? It was not done then, and whether recognition is necessary after the fact? The world already knows that Azerbaijan gave the country of Soviets during the Great Patriotic War.
Residents of the hero cities not only worked, but also fought / defended.
Thank God that Baku did not see what the hero cities saw during the war.
And ALL claims to Aliyev Sr. I could have gotten it. His authority was STRONGER than that of Mikoyan. Rather, Georgadze and Shivarnadze (with that he Mikoyan) were pissed off - how can we assume that only ONE city in the Caucasus became a hero city ...

[smersh70]

Quote: knn54

Rather, Georgadze and Shivarnadze (with that he Mikoyan) were pissed off - how can we assume that only ONE city in the Caucasus became a hero city ...

gold words!!!!!!!! here we have, if and what was happening in the USSR .. it should have belonged to all 3 republics), thank God, at least right now we pulled ahead

[Ascetic]

Quote: domokl

I advise the author to read the status of a hero city.

Title "Hero City"
established by decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR on 8 on May 1965 and was timed to coincide with the 20 anniversary of the victory over Nazi Germany and its allies.
The honorary title of a hero city was assigned in the USSR to cities whose residents showed

«mass "heroism and courage in defending the motherland in the Great Patriotic War of 1941-1945."

Regulation on the highest degree of distinction - the title of "Hero City"
link
In total, 13 cities-Leningrad possess this title: Odessa, Sevastopol, Stalingrad, Kiev, the Brest Fortress -hero, Moscow, Kerch, Novorossiysk, Minsk, Tula, Murmansk, Smolensk.
These are all cities where the most significant and bloody battles of the war took place, accompanied by the massive heroism of the army and residents of the cities. The participation of Baku apparently did not fall under the condition of "mass heroism and courage" as, for example, besieged Leningrad, besieged Sevastopol or Stalingrad.
This honorary title is no longer awarded.after the collapse of the USSR.
In Russia today is awarded the title "City of Military Glory" in the USSR it did not exist.
the federal law “On the honorary title of the Russian Federation“ City of Military Glory “” In 2006, Vladimir Putin signed.
Federal Law of the Russian Federation of 9 May 2006 N N 68-FZ
According to this law, the title of a city of military glory is assigned to cities,

«in the territory of which or in the immediate vicinity from which during fierce battles defenders of the Fatherland showed courage, stamina and mass heroism».

All cities of military glory can be found on the website. Cities of Military Glory of the Russian Federation
I think nothing bothers lack of political will the leadership of all the former republics of the USSR to introduce a similar honorary title in their own countries, with the goal of perpetuating the memory of fellow-countrymen and home front workers in a common victory over the enemy and patriotic and military education of youth.
All made a feasible contribution in Victory, Won in Kharkov, despite the absence of the Law on Cities of Military Glory at the local level, deputies received a refusal from the Supreme Soviet Parliament to give this title independently.

[bomg.77]

Quote: Ascetic

Title "Hero City"
established by decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR on 8 on May 1965 and was timed to coincide with the 20 anniversary of the victory over Nazi Germany and its allies.
The honorary title of a hero city was assigned in the USSR to cities whose residents showed
"Mass heroism and courage in defending the homeland in the Great Patriotic War of the 1941 – 1945 years."

For this reason, it is possible to award the title of "Hero of the Village" to Khojalu (ethnic Armenians), and not to Baku, especially since the oil was not supplied by the city of Baku, but the Republic of Az-an.

[bomg.77]

Quote: bomg.77

"Hero village" Khojalu

I beg your pardon "Chardakhlu"

[makarov]

SW Author. We should not forget that Azerbaijan owed its appearance as a separate republic, and then the state, to the Soviet Government. And personally, when I never had to see any materials that reduce or derogate the role of Azerbaijan in the Second World War.

[smersh70]

Quote: makarov

It should not be forgotten that Azerbaijan owes its appearance as a separate republic, and then the state, to the Soviet Government

Well, you turned down)) although one of the most objective visitors !!!!!!! we will not go into details .... but I will say that in 1918 an ADR was formed, which was recognized by almost all European and US states .... by the way one of the conditions for the Bolsheviks to join BAKU was the independence of this state .....

[makarov]

Dear Vurgun!
Let's objectively admit that before the revolution of 1917, Azerbaijan did not exist as a separate state autonomy with state rights.
Into the ADR account. A similar stage went through many republics and territories. I will not list, but on the network this information is enough. Remember, there was even the Donetsk-Kryvyi Rih Republic, in the form of a sort of conglomerate. Within a year or two, all this was soldered (sometimes, or often by force), as a result of which the Republics were formed. I am grateful to you that you consider me objective, but I always try to be just as I am, to be independent of anyone and from nothing.

[smersh70]

Quote: makarov

even the Donetsk-Kryvyi Rih Republic existed

I agree. Such republics ... like Gorsky ... Krymsky ... and then it was in bulk ... even Old Man dumbly created .... but the point is that the ADR existed for 2 years ... on a par with neighboring states .... the recognized were invited to Versailles in January 20, it seems ... and even the Bolsheviks had a faction in parliament .. and the Bolsheviks gave the ultimatum to this republic .. promising to leave independence ... only on this condition they surrendered power to the Bolsheviks ....
though history showed ... that independence nevertheless restored its historical rightness ... and the members of this faction were shot by the Communists themselves in the year 37 ... and Rasulzade was right when Stalin asked him ..- what did you give your country in 2 years ... he replied - You’re right .. we couldn’t do much, but we gave the people to feel how they should and should live in an independent country ... the banner raised once, will never fall !! which happened in 1991 .. .

[Corsair]

Quote: smersh70

Well, you turned down)) although one of the most objective visitors !!!!!!! we will not go into details .... but I will say that in 1918 ADR was formed, which was recognized by almost all European and US states ....

You are "asking for" with your comments on the analogy with the recognition of Kosovo ...
Do not revel in the knowledge that you have been "recognized", but set out to find out, "WHY WAS RECOGNIZED?"
In that historical period, the MAIN goal of the SEQUENCE of such "confessions" was the dismemberment of the EX-Russian Empire, with the further placing of "independent" subjects under the control of Britain, the main political player at that time ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Corsair

You are "asking for" with your comments on the analogy with the recognition of Kosovo ...

not a gram !!!!! we generally reacted negatively with Kosovo ... because we have the same problem ... and after the recognition we pulled out our military contingent from there .. and we have excellent relations with Serbia ... but Kosovo is happy supported by our neighbors ... and poke this on occasion)))

[Corsair]

Quote: smersh70

.and we have excellent relations with Serbia ... but Kosovo gladly supported our neighbors ... and poke this on occasion)))

You and your "neighbors" would have to twist the "sticks".

Got it: "A OH,but THEY... ", I would like to make" ugh "on both, but you will grab your throats IMMEDIATELY without" supervision "...

[smersh70]

Quote: Corsair

You and your "neighbors" would have to twist the "sticks".

true eyes hurts yes when there is nothing to answer on dry land .. immediately take a stand above all and we are all on the drum

[Corsair]

Quote: smersh70

true eyes hurts yes

And why should the truth be stabbing me for Armenians and Azerbaijanis? Indeed, in my commentary I meant EXACTLY (if you didn’t understand), Azerbaijan and Armenia.

This you (both sides) should be ashamed of mutual srach.

[George]

domokl, support.
The article is designed to split, rather than unity. I always read articles published on the pages of the site about the heroism of Soviet citizens with pleasure, and most importantly in the comments, people as one speak with respect and respect to the merits of grandfathers-great-grandfathers, regardless of the nat. affiliation.
Dear! I ask you to refrain from s..ch, our ancestors did not die for that, so that we weigh their merits, dividing the gained Victory by kilograms. IMHO of course.

[domokl]

In my opinion, the whole point is that separatism is now not only in Russia, but also outside of Russia. What is the article about that, allegedly at the instigation of the Armenian, the heroic Azerbaijani city was not given the title of a hero ... But in fact, what ? about the fact that the Armenians, even under Stalin, plotted the intrigues of Azerbaijanis.
The logic of the child from the sandbox. If you accept it, then Yerevan should be exactly a hero city.
But in general, another attempt to start a dispute about who is who in Nagorno-Karabakh.

[Walking]

Unfortunately, some who are trying to raise their authority on the holy for many of us, in memory of those who died in World War II.

[smersh70]

Quote: domokl

the fact that the Armenians, even under Stalin, plotted intrigues on Azerbaijanis.

And how it was the desire of the Armenians in the power structures of the state into which they entered, thereby striving to protect themselves as oppressed and to get more and more benefits for themselves and for their people, always sideways turned out for us ... here we were talking about generals .. do not forget .after the accession of the Azerbaijani territories to Russia, the Azerbaijanis were freed from military service ... everything was done to kill the militancy in them. to excommunicate from military service ... so that God forbid, if they, as the alleged opponents of the regime, didn’t turn their weapons against Russia. ..that the tsar achieved in general ... and the Armenians were always pushed into military service ... they were always cannon fodder for the state ... and it turned out that there were more Armenians in the leading structures of the army ....
by the way a small addition ... to the collapse of the USSR in the ranks of the Armed Forces 10000 Armenians served only senior officers .. whereas we had 2000, including even the younger ones ...

[Gari]

Quote: smersh70

by the way ... a little addition ... to the collapse of the USSR in the ranks of the Armed Forces 10000 Armenians served only senior officers .. whereas we had 2000, including even the youngest .....

And in the Soviet army, too, you were not allowed to serve, but were you pushing the Armenians?
Who did not let, who pushed, it is possible this tale in more detail.
Marshal Baghramyan was pushed, Admiralal Isakov was pushed.

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "after the annexation of Azerbaijani territories to Russia, Azerbaijanis were freed from military service ... everything was done to kill militancy in them. to excommunicate them from military service ... so that God forbid, if they, as alleged opponents of the regime, did not turn their weapons against Russia .. "
Do not invent nonsense. Azerbaijani cavalry fought on the side of Russia in the Russian-Persian and Russian-Turkish wars in the 19th century. And in wars with the highlanders of Dagestan. Then they may not have taken to the service, but not only them. They didn’t take Russian into ordinary soldiers. Moreover, both Armenians and Georgians and Central Asians. And nobility served among all nations.

[Arthur]

ti naverno poputal, pushechnim myasom bili vi, a armyane vsegda bili na rukovodyashix doljnostyax.

[Very old]

I support you. It is said in essence. You must not allow xenophobia to walk around the military site.

[Ihrek]

There would also be no victory without friendship, brotherhood and solidarity of the Soviet people. What do we owe to Stalin.

[Revolver]

If Baku is a hero, why not Sverdlovsk, Chelyabinsk, Izhevsk, Gorky and other cities where the weapon of victory was forged? Then the victory was not divided into "yours" and "ours", it was one for all, and everyone did not stand up to the price.
The feat of the rear workers is priceless and great, but it cannot be compared with the feat of the front-line soldiers who fought under the walls of Moscow, Leningrad, Stalingrad, Sevastopol and other front-line cities. It was not for nothing that by the end of the war the front-line soldiers' chest was in gold and silver orders and medals "For Defense", "For Liberation", "For Taking", and most of the home front workers only had a modest bronze medal "For Valiant Labor in the Great Patriotic War." But Stalin's profile and the inscription "OUR BUSINESS IS RIGHT, WE HAVE WINNED" are the same as on the medal "For Victory over Germany" awarded to the front-line soldiers.
Something like that.

[Apollo]

Quote: Nagan

If Baku is a hero, then why not Sverdlovsk, Chelyabinsk, Izhevsk, Gorky, other cities where the weapons of victory were forged?

Each city is worthy of fame, but in this case, the city of Baku is being discussed. I personally consider it rightfully his city-hero, regardless of whether they give him status or not.
It amazes me that visitors never once said a good word about those heroes, sons and daughters of Azerbaijan who bowed their heads in the name of victory over fascism. They reduced the discussion to a topic without a substantive discussion about whether he is worthy or not worthy !!! Well, for example, he’s not worthy what has become easier for you all ?! Not the first or second or third time I notice that some people just want to annoy, hurt or simply downplay the role of Azerbaijan in the Second World War.The question is, why and for what purpose ?!

[domokl]

Quote: Apollon

It amazes me how visitors never once said a good word about those heroes, sons and daughters of Azerbaijan who bowed their heads in the name of victory over fascism

Again, distort. What does Baku and the heroes of the war veterans-Azerbaijanis have to do with it? Exactly the same heroes were in any city of the USSR, in any village, in the most forgotten places of God. The Soviet people fought for their homeland, for the USSR, and not for Armenia, Tatarstan, Uzbekistan and all other republics of the USSR. Each soldier was part of the army of the great Union of Peoples.
Unlike you, I, on the contrary, notice that the representatives of your country are very painful towards everything that somehow is not consistent with your position.
Are you writing about belittling the role of your people? But who, besides yourself, belittles this role? Who wrote that Azerbaijanis fought worse than Russians, Armenians, Tatars, Belarusians, Ukrainians?
So you need to complain first of all about yourself. You ask yourself, answer yourself, hang up the labels yourself and draw conclusions on the basis of this internal dialogue .. And then you are offended that others disagree.

[Arthur]

da im naverno paru neftemanatov daut shto bi vsyakie commenti pisali pro svoi "veliki Azerbajan"))))

[Nagaibak]

Apollon] It amazes me how visitors never once said a good word about those heroes, sons and daughters of Azerbaijan who bowed their heads in the name of victory over fascism.
Not only they perished in that war; no need to stick out.
But if the Russian people weren’t for everyone, the khan would come ... maybe you can challenge it?
Compare the contribution of each, then quarrel. Judging by the photo, the Russian oil was extracted by Baku women ... If they shot it not there, then this is the Volga region.
Better let's remember all the peoples who fought and whose sons died on the battlefield ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

Judging by the photo, the Baku oil was extracted by Russian women.

quite an oak tree was given ... namely, the oil workers in BAKU were in the quota .. they weren’t taken to the front .... they belonged to the first category ... on a par with pilots. on a salary and so on .... what kind of women ... maybe some pictures somewhere else ..... by the way, mind that it was the Baku oil workers who later raised Siberian oil .. found it .... and not what kind of women there .. . and thanks to which right now Russia is one of the largest exporters of oil ...

[Nagaibak]

smersh70 "quite an oak was given"
Judging by the photo, I wrote ... Be careful! If I wrote there, it means the Volga.
Do not worry Farman Salmanov. We remember the good, unlike some. There are streets on his behalf and in my opinion a monument or a bust is installed.
And I am amused by the manner of some colleagues on the site to blame the Armenians for all troubles. Like if there is no water in the tap, then they drank ... Armenians? Albo Jews? For you, the Armenians along the way. Your constant grievances, they say, didn’t remember the Azerbaijani fighters ... so they weren’t the only ones who fought.
You constantly complain that you are biased. It's all nonsense.
I look just any topic affecting the Caucasus in the discussion with the Azerbaijanis goes into the discussion, the Armenians. Did they give me a damn thing? There’s nothing more to talk about?

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagaibak

Did they give me a damn thing? There’s nothing more to talk about?

I agree)))))))

Quote: Nagaibak

And I am amused by the manner of some colleagues on the site to blame the Armenians for all troubles. Like if there is no water in the tap, it means they drank ... Armenians

You still do not know them .. YOU God did not send such neighbors ... nevertheless, the old Jewish man was right, dying, sentencing .....-- continue further or guess yourself (someone recently posted a joke on this subject on the site)

[Very old]

Countryman, you are wrong. We have never had cities of "non-heroes"
A huge country stood up for life, for its very existence. Who did not fight on the fronts of the Second World War?
All. All. All.

[xetai9977]

Apollo, my dear, I personally am not at all surprised that "visitors never once said a kind word about those heroes, sons and daughters of Azerbaijan." As if you don't see their true attitude towards us every day. We are a priori enemies for them. And all our arguments and explanations will remain unanswered. Those who tore off some parts of their bodies because of the events in Biryulyov, even though they mentioned almost ten of our compatriots killed by nationalists, about a disabled child who was beaten on a bus in Zelenograd by a Nazi, as a result of which the boy was completely blind? tolerate separatism (which is correct), but foaming at the mouth they defend the separatists here. So take care of your nerves. As we say, a waterless well will not become full of water, even if someone starts pouring water there.

[Apollo]

Quote: xetai9977

Natsik, as a result of which the boy was completely blind? Those who do not tolerate separatism (which is right), but with foam at the mouth they protect the separatists from us.

Something I did not see a single Natsik saving the citizens of the Russian Federation residents of Khabarovsk from a burning tram.

[smersh70]

Quote: Apollon

It amazes me how visitors have never once said a good word about those heroes, sons and daughters of Azerbaijan who bowed their heads in the name of victory over fascism

it amazes me too ..... many here are biased towards us ..... and in the first place. because of religion .. the Armenians are Christians .. they are closer to them .... spit many more here are military .. and in schools have always been biased towards the East and Islam.
and now we are pursuing an independent policy. We are not joining the TS ... we are not dancing to the tune of Russia ... here, many Russian patriots do not like this ........

[Arthur]

A kto skazal shto ne plyashete ????

[Revolver]

Quote: Apollon

Each city is worthy of fame, but in this case, the city of Baku is being discussed. I personally consider it rightfully his city-hero, regardless of whether they give him status or not.

And I would be glad if Baku didn’t have the chance to become a hero. And he would bow to the feet of those who stopped the Nazis in the North Caucasus, not even allowing them to admire Baku from a distance through Zeiss optics of artillery sights. I would bow to everyone, indiscriminately.
You can be sure that most Leningraders would gladly give up the title of hero so that the blockade never happens.

[Corsair]

Quote: Nagan

And I would be glad if Baku didn’t have the chance to become a hero. And he would bow to the feet of those who stopped the Nazis in the North Caucasus, not even allowing them to admire Baku from a distance through Zeiss optics of artillery sights. I would bow to everyone, indiscriminately.

"Plus" - definitely, without "any" ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Nagan

Sverdlovsk, Chelyabinsk, Izhevsk, Gorky,

there was no oil .. why it is not clear ... as Hitler or Tukhachevsky said, the future war is the war of motors .. and without oil there was nothing ... look and now, where is the oil .. there is always a fight ... .. why in many countries there are other fossils .. there are no such big wars ... by the way the biggest operation was carried out by Hitler in 42 because of BAKU .... he even left Moscow alone ... and Leningrad too. .......

[domokl]

Quote: smersh70

there was no oil .. why it is not clear

Interestingly, do you really think that the Russians are so hated by the Azerbaijanis and the Armenians are so beloved? Guys, you have. I'm sorry, paranoia. And faith has nothing to do with it.
and about oil .. but why would it be needed if there were no Ural tanks, Omsk radio transmitters and airplanes, Mordovian assault rifles, Soviet soldiers?
There is a specific article about a hero city. None of these cities, which we have listed, alas, is not only a hero city, but also a city of military glory ... There is a status and no one is going to change it for the sake of some kind of local ambitions. ..

[Revolver]

Quote: smersh70

Quote: Nagan

Sverdlovsk, Chelyabinsk, Izhevsk, Gorky,

there was no oil ... why it is not clear ... as Hitler or Tukhachevsky saidfuture war is this war of motors..and without oil there was nothing to do ...

There they made motors without which the oil wouldn’t give up.

[Walking]

And for what to appropriate? There were many such cities in the rear and everyone worked under the slogan Everything for the Front, Everything for the Victory.
We should not exaggerate the role of Azerbaijan alone in the Great Patriotic War, we in Kazakhstan also have something to be proud of at least the famous 8th Panfilov Guards Division, all Soviet soldiers fought for one single country and not for separate republics.

[pan grizian]

Why this article? The USSR collapsed 22 years ago, so the Golden Star of Baku cannot be seen unambiguously.
And today, mindful of the Sumgayit massacre and Biryulevo, somehow the language does not turn to call Baku a hero.

[alone]

Quote: Pan Gritsian

And today, mindful of the Sumgayit massacre and Biryulevo, somehow the language does not turn to call Baku a hero.

Is Biryulyovo somehow connected with Baku? and where does the Moscow region?

[smersh70]

Quote: Pan Gritsian

Sumgait massacre and Biryulevo

we're talking about boob ... and he ... first read about Sumgait .. who did there ... and then about Biryulovo .... there is a good Russian proverb - neither ..... nor to the Red Army ....

[Pushkar]

Shameful, mean and nasty article.

[Apollo]

I bring to your attention videos for those who are really interested.

[Apollo]

Quote: Pushkar

Pushkar Today, 09: 57
Shameful, mean and nasty article.

What exactly is it ?!

[Apollo]

No comments

[Apollo]

Only FASCIST could promote video clips about WWII.

[Walking]

It may be enough to oppose its Azerbaijanis to soldiers of other nationalities, this is nationalism. Among the Russians, Ukrainians, Belarusians there were much more heroes and much more died.

[Walking]

Dear Apollo, maybe the minus was not delivered to the rollers, but specifically to you? All who fought in that war no matter what nationality he was, all the heroes and we respect the memory of them without dividing them by nation and republic.

[Apollo]

Quote: Hiking

maybe the minus was not delivered to the rollers, namely to you?

You had the audacity to contact me, read point h) of the VO rules if you are too lazy to read at least here on the branch.

h) A purposeful methodical reduction of the opponent’s rating, i.e. multiple minus one user’s comments. Similar actions are easily traced by site administrators. Intruder rating will be reduced by 50%.

[domokl]

Not in court ... Everyone can express their opinions on the site. And it doesn’t matter what this opinion is about an article, a comment or a person. It seems to me that too many words have been written that are quite provocative and offensive for other nations. Without noticing, you unobtrusively spat in the soul of many of the representatives of these peoples. So you got exactly what you got.
For all the peoples of the former USSR, regardless of the country in which we now live, the theme of the Patriotic War is sacred. There is no such family where there is no hero of the war who has died. We can swear about the present, but the graves of our ancestors are sacred.

[Apollo]

Quote: domokl

Not in court ...

You cannot tell me.

Quote: domokl

Everyone can express their opinion on the site.

That's right, but the rules of the site concern everyone for me and Including you.The site rules are registered for everyone and they were not invented by me.
On point h) of the rules of VO, I think you have heard too, including you.Adhering to the rules is not a right, but an obligation of everyone, including you. What example are you setting yourself violating the rules of VO ?!
I will not comment further because of your categorical statements.

[pahom54]

The article caused a split among the forum users ... And indeed, its essence boiled down to the fact that the Armenian Mikoyan was guilty of not having been awarded the title of a hero city ... At the same time, this Armenian arranged almost genocide with the resettlement ...
The article is provocative. Without defending either Armenians or Azerbaijanis, I put the minus article.

[Very old]

Jura-pahom54, I am from Baku and it is especially unpleasant for me to see the squabble on our forum. I am friends and az. and arm. Xenophobia is not a place on our forum. We are military people.

[pahom54]

For the Old
Totally agree with you.
And once, at the end of the 70s, he was resting in Kislovodsk in the most pleasant company, which consisted of (!!!) - Russian, Armenian, Azerbaijani and Georgian !!! And after all, no enmity, friends - forever !!! For 24 days no one thought about the nationality of another !!! And no one was rude !!! Yo

[Bagatur]

A native of the village Sabunchi in the suburbs of Baku, Richard Zoge, being on the eve of World War II



Sorge is a great scout, but by June 22 he had nothing to do with it. His main merit. He gave Stalin evidence that Japan would go to the Pacific and not fight against the USSR. Thanks to this, Siberian divisions to withdraw from the Far East turned out to be near Moscow ...

[Sergey Medvedev]

Of course, the city of Baku has merits, but they are labor, not combat. There are many such settlements on the territory of the USSR. The city of Voronezh definitely deserves the title of "Hero City". The battle there was no weaker than the one in Stalingrad. And the cauldron for the occupiers is no worse. There are still many blank spots in our history.

[alone]

good morning! 50% of comments have nothing to do with this article.
for me personally, they gave the city the title of a hero, they didn’t anymore have any importance. Not for this, the Baku oil industry extracted oil for the front, not for this all the city’s enterprises produced military products right up to the fighter planes, not for that the city sheltered a million refugees. everything was done for the victory over the FASCISTS. they didn’t give, they didn’t.

as for deportation he was. was carried out in 1947-1950 according to the Decree of the Council of Ministers of the USSR No. 4083 of December 23, 1947. One of the paragraphs of the resolution read:

Allow the Council of Ministers of the Armenian SSR to use the buildings and houses freed by the Azerbaijani population in connection with their relocation to the Kura-Araksin lowland of the Azerbaijan SSR to use to resettle foreign Armenians arriving in the Armenian SSR.

anyone in doubt can search the archives for the entire text of the decision and read. I myself am a descendant of those who were deported in 1947-1950.

[Vitaly Anisimov]

The article is controversial ..
One of these rear cities was the capital of the Azerbaijan SSR. It's no secret that almost 90% of fuel for refueling Soviet tanks and aircraft was delivered to the front line from Baku
Recently I read the same thing about Chechen oil ...))) This is not the main thing ..
But the only thing I can say for sure Azerbaijan was a reliable rear! Deliveries went through Iran and further They say the most powerful in comparison with the Northern Sea Route! He is now our reliable rear! A stable and rapidly developing state .. and most importantly well-armed! I think so!

[alone]

Quote: MIKHAN

But the only thing I can say for sure Azerbaijan was a reliable rear! Deliveries went through Iran and further They say the most powerful in comparison with the Northern Sea Route! He is now our reliable rear! A stable and rapidly developing state .. and most importantly well-armed! I think so!

apparently Vitaly does not give rest to some, that's what they are trying to drive a wedge into relations between states

[bomg.77]

Quote: MIKHAN

But the only thing I can say for sure Azerbaijan was a reliable rear!

Mikhan, I always treated you normally, but to sing diffirambs to a prostitute and still convince that this is a reliable rear

Azerbaijan was a reliable rear!

the top of prostitution. I hope they at least paid you normally, otherwise it’s a shame yes!

[smersh70]

Quote: bomg.77

I hope they at least paid you normally.

Well, everywhere you see Baku oil money

Quote: bomg.77

but singing praises to a prostitute

and about the prostitute .. choose the expression .... the whole world is clear who the prostitute ....

[bomg.77]

And why are you not happy with Smersh? Prostitution is the way the authorities in Azerbaijan behave. And I did not see anything friendly after the collapse of the USSR, in relation to Russia.

[alone]

Do not sew your profession to strangers!

[Yeraz]

Quote: bomg.77

And I did not see anything friendly, after the collapse of the USSR, in relation to Russia.

hahah, yes, you pray for the Aliyevs, with the support of the Armenians because of which our lands are occupied and Aliyev restrains more or less calm sentiment towards the Russians and Russia. Although there is open support for the invaders of our lands. Would Elchibei have any other people then you saw unfriendly attitude towards Russia and attitude would be really justified.
But Russia is systematically doing everything to ensure that even Aliyev has minimal opportunities for at least some justification and more and more goes to hostility between peoples. If the young people managed to incite Orthodox Georgians against themselves, then they will outstrip the Muslims with Azerbaijanis about 2 times.

[Vitaly Anisimov]

Quote: lonely

Quote: MIKHAN

But the only thing I can say for sure Azerbaijan was a reliable rear! Deliveries went through Iran and further They say the most powerful in comparison with the Northern Sea Route! He is now our reliable rear! A stable and rapidly developing state .. and most importantly well-armed! I think so!

apparently Vitaly does not give rest to some, that's what they are trying to drive a wedge into relations between states

Yes, not that word .. they are shamelessly ..! I just remembered from school "27 Baku commissars" ... Not Tbilisi, not Alma = Ata Tashkent or Kiev Minsk ... (no offense) It was a symbol in the USSR and for good reason ..

[experienced]

Quote: MIKHAN

I just remembered from school "27 Baku commissars"... Not Tbilisi, not Alma = Ata, Tashkent or Kiev, Minsk .. (no offense) It was a symbol in the USSR and not for nothing ..

Bugaga, I have been since 1967 and these commissars were somewhere "in the backyard" of history, I still do not know what they did heroic and I do not want to know ...
However, I asked

“Bakin Commissars” (“26 Baku commissars") - the leaders of the Baku Council of People's Commissars (the executive body of the Baku Commune), who went down in historiography as their deaths: on September 20, 1918, they were beheaded in Krasnovodsk by decision of the local authorities for surrendering Baku to Azerbaijani troops [1].

Of course, for you this may be a super feat ...
List:

Avakyan, Baghdasar Ayrapetovich - commandant of the city of Baku (according to other sources, Avekyan).
Azizbekov, Mashadi Azim-bek-oglu - Baku provincial commissar.
Amiryan, Tatevos Minasovich - member of the Dashnaktsutyun party, commander of the cavalry detachment.
Amiryan, Arsen Minasovich - editor of the newspaper “Baku Worker”
Basin, Meer Velkovich - member of the Military Revolutionary Committee of the Caucasus Army.
Berg, Eigen Avgustovich - sailor, communications chief of the Soviet troops in Baku.
Bogdanov, Anatoly Abramovich - an employee.
Bogdanov, Solomon Abramovich - member of the Military Revolutionary Committee
Boryan, Armenak Artyomovich - journalist.
Vezirov, Mir-Hasan Kyazim oglu - People's Commissar of Agriculture.
Gabyshev, Ivan Yakovlevich - Commissioner of the brigade
Japaridze, Prokofy Aprasionovich - Chairman of the Baku Council of Workers, Peasants, Soldiers and Sailor Deputies.
Zevin, Yakov Davidovich - People's Commissar of Labor.
Koganov, Mark Romanovich - member of the Military Revolutionary Committee.
Korganov, Grigory Nikolaevich - People’s Commissar for Naval Affairs.
Kostandyan, Aram Martirosovich - Deputy People's Commissar of Food.
Malygin, Ivan Vasilievich - Deputy Chairman of the Military Revolutionary Committee of the Caucasus Army, member of the board of the People’s Commissariat for Naval Affairs.
Metaxa, Irakliy Panaitovich - Shaumyan’s personal guard.
Mishneh, Isai Abramovich - clerk of the Military Revolutionary Committee.
Nikolayshvili, Ivan Mikhailovich - personal guard of Japaridze.
Osepyan, Suren Grigorievich - editor of the Izvestia of the Baku Council
Petrov, Grigory Konstantinovich - military commissar of the Baku region, commander of the Red Guard detachment.
Polukhin, Vladimir Fedorovich - member of the collegium of the Commissariat for Naval Affairs of the RSFSR.
Solntsev, Fedor Fedorovich - military worker, commissar of the military instructor school.
Violetov, Ivan Timofeevich - Chairman of the Council of National Economy.
Shaumyan, Stepan Georgievich - extraordinary commissar of the Caucasus, chairman of the Baku Council of People's Commissars.

[smersh70]

Quote: seasoned

List:

which was required to prove! the bulk of the Armenians .. that they committed the massacre in March 18 with the help of the Dashnaks ..... and thanks to their activities .. The Soviet government fell like a house of cards, because the bulk of the inhabitants turned away from them .... after the perpetrated massacre .... which incidentally is reflected in the documents of the Central Committee of the CPSU of Azerbaijan in 23-24 years ...

[smersh70]

Quote: MIKHAN

27 Baku commissars ".

Bravo! YOU are right here, As never before! and the 27th was MIKOYAN .. sold everyone and fled .. ...

[Ezhaak]

Quote: smersh70

and the 27th was MIKOYAN.

Yes, it was in our time, but only the 27th called someone from the environment or showed a finger at themselves.
By the way, when creating Park 26 and when transferring the bodies of the commissars, there were specific conversations that not all bodies were present in the grave, which later found some confirmation.

[alone]

found only 23 remains.

[Vitaly Anisimov]

Quote: seasoned

Bugaga, I have been since 1967 and these commissars were somewhere "in the backyard" of history, I still do not know what they did heroic and I do not want to know ...

And you boogaga! I wish! I don't care what you think there and what you pick out of Google .. Now there are a lot of "historians and theorists" thanks to Google .. (ugh damn it) .. So go ahead (don't forget to wash the flag ... so as not to get dusty ..)))

[experienced]

Quote: MIKHAN

I don’t care what you think there and what you pick out from Google ..

It's better to pick out from Google than to mess up, showing your ignorance ...

[Altona]

And I served here ... Maybe someone will find out? Bucky is a city of winds ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Altona

And I served here ... Maybe someone will find out

locally Shykhov seems ..... part on the beach ....

[Altona]

Your truth ... It is so ... In the distance, the buildings of the barracks are visible, they still remain from the tsar-father ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Altona

. In the distance, the buildings of the barracks are visible, they still remained from the tsar-father ...

it was in this part that 1 battalion of the national army was formed ..... I was there .. a wonderful place .. I especially liked how I got up in the morning after drinking in DOS .. no salting for you .. no beer)) .. after a morning wind in an instant it immediately became normal))))

[Altona]

Former training regiment for signalmen ... Military unit 89598, the beach is good, the air is healing, offshore platforms are far away ... The breeze is directly filled with cations, you feel a surge of strength ... The Caspian water in that place tastes like cucumber pickle .. .I served there in 1988, troubled for those places, but I didn’t see the riots myself, on November 7 they were cordoned off only in the area of ​​the embankment ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Altona

I served there in a troubled place in 1988

Oo friend, so we are co-workers !!!! and I'm at the pumping station 88-89 .. at the airport ... upon arrival from training, from under Leningrad ... Gorskaya station ... I got knocked out with the squad))) even the paratroopers didn’t help .. we watched because of the cordon at the station and all .... helped out by saying that we came to serve and their Ganja himself ..

[Altona]

It turns out that something like this ... I also wanted to stick a picture, something does not accept the site ... Later I stick it ...

[Ezhaak]

Quote: smersh70

in this part, 1 battalion of the national army was formed

Is it from the mosque to the source, down to the sea? And on the mountain the locator stood. It was. In that area, from the dam, Kutum was caught. Oh, good fish.

[nnz226]

A strange article: according to the "results" of the WAR, the people had an opinion only about FOUR hero cities: Leningrad, Odessa, Stalingrad, Sevastopol. I emphasize - THIS IS THE PEOPLE'S OPINION AND THE SPEECH !!! I think that in these cities no one will have doubts about their glorification, they speak for themselves. Official titles were already assigned to 6 cities for the 20th anniversary of the Victory: moreover, there was no Stalin, and his criticism, the bald corn man, was thrown out of power. Under the "unforgettable and dear" Leonid Ilyich it happened. To the 4 already mentioned cities, about which the people already knew, they added Moscow - otherwise it is not comilfo that the capital is not a hero (although the question of the heroism of its inhabitants in the light of the October 1941 mass exodus can be considered for a long time), and before Ukraine caved in, giving the hero to her capital - Kiev. And what does Stalin have to do with it ??? Mikoyan ??? and others like them ??? They were given the title for the feat in defending the city in battles with the German invaders, the heroism of the inhabitants, etc. And what has Baku to do with it ??? If you assign, then the title of the city of the hero-socialist labor (not the star of the Hero of the USSR to hang, but the Star of the Hero of the socialist labor), but there are a dozen more such cities that can be called: Sverdlovsk, Chelyabinsk, Kuibyshev, etc., etc.

[propolsky]

The main thing in that war was not attempts to win the honorary title, but Victory! Who fought on the front line, and who worked in the rear. Everyone got it ...

[Bakht]

The article is just silly. A typical example of how journalism has degraded. Hero city status was introduced in the 65th year. In the same year A. Mikoyan was removed from office. Mikoyan could never offer any sharp resistance to Stalin (even to the deceased). On the contrary, he became famous as a very flexible People's Commissar. He managed to "live from Ilyich to Ilyich without a heart attack and paralysis." So all the nonsense about Mikoyan can be safely dropped into the trash can.

Azerbaijan’s contribution to the Victory is enormous. But the labor feat does not give grounds for conferring the title of Hero City. Unfortunately, recently this title began to be distributed everywhere. Which leads to erosion of this title.

[experienced]

Quote: Hiking

........................................

It is necessary to communicate with the forum users without dividing them by ethnicity and not looking at virtual shoulder straps

[Walking]

Yes, I am not opposed, but when nationalism begins to roll over it is already too far from Nazism. It's my opinion

[domokl]

Vitaly, you are absolutely right. We talk a lot about Russian nationalism, about separatism, about ethnic hatred, but we’re afraid to tell the vile person that he is bending ... Strange of course eito on a military site. Like most officers, knees should not tremble. But, alas, it is.
In general, it’s a worthless, mediocre article for this purpose and was written to provoke such a scuffle as it is now ... and not just a scuffle ... You can already hear the cries of the Muslim Brothers and something like that ...
But it’s not all aimed at some countries, it’s directed specifically at Russia. It’s about the citizens of Russia, people from other countries now. It’s very well aimed ... not dedicated and will not notice.
So that you know, before you is a wonderful example of ideological sabotage.

[alone]

put up with a Cossack, you’ll become an ataman! It’s forbidden to bet + on each other. They’re taking off the floor of the rating. + I put it only on those who say real things. For example, one guy wrote recently: RUSSIA is stronger than NATO because we defeated Georgia. would you bet +?

[smersh70]

Quote: Hiking

....................................

By the way, yours, Kazakhstan’s nemereno ...))) and that’s good .... but unlike you, they just write objectively, don’t look enough .. especially Marek ... smart guy .. you read it ... just cool becomes in the woods ... unlike YOU .... some speculation slogans ...

Quote: Hiking

And who do not stick marshal, strange

try so hard we want to have more here, unlike our neighbors ..

[EdwardTich68]

Because fighting and trading are not the same thing

[alone]

Yes of course! here you see I’m very, very belligerent! Militancy straight from the monitor rushing !!

[mark021105]

People!!! What are you about??? It was a common war for us, in which the Soviet people won the Victory, no matter what !!! Now what? In 70 years, we should quarrel over the "gingerbread" we got or did not get ??? These are the articles that divided us all at one time !!!

[smersh70]

Quote: mark021105

In 70 years, we should quarrel over the "gingerbread" we got or did not get ??? These are the articles that divided us all in due time !!!

Gold words!!!!!!

[EdwardTich68]

By the number of bombs dropped, the city of Murmansk is in second place after Stalingrad, and how many bombs fell on Bakkh?

[smersh70]

Quote: EdwardTich68

and how many bombs fell on Bucks?

Dear ... before asking questions ... know the topic .... I don’t enter with Lopatov, let's argue because of artillery or tanks ... and now, by dry land, you should know that there was an order from Hitler to prevent the bombing Baku in order to preserve oil wells .... and in case of the capture of Baku .. Baibakov invented a method of flooding these wells .. read his book .. by the way, this method is still secret ... it was used in Mozdok and Grozny .. thanks to which the Germans could not open these wells ...

[alone]

firstly, not Bakhi, but Baku. in one word, two mistakes. Not the number of bombs is considered the importance of the city. It took one raid on the tank so that the whole city turned to ashes.
in Baku a whole army of air defense stood. Do you think Stalin did not know what was going on, he understood the significance of the city, and Hitler understood what Baku means. Because he didn’t bomb.

[kush62]

What calls have flooded. Muslim brothers. The next call is the Slav brothers. And there are also Buddhist brothers and others are missing. Because of the article where the comrades decided to show their exclusive significance, the Armenian-Azerbaijani website dissension began, as always. And if there were no Chelyabinsk tanks, where would this oil be poured? The USSR was a single organism, and the Victory came about thanks to the heroic struggle and no less heroic work of all the peoples of our former (unfortunately) huge country.
Next to living laborers there is nothing to share. And conflicts are caused specifically and you yourself know who benefits from this.

[alone]

Quote: kush62

And if there were no Chelyabinsk tanks, where would this oil be poured?

Well, it's like an eternal dispute about who the first was: an egg or a chicken. Well, let's say a Chelyabinsk tank without Baku oil or Baku oil without a Ural tank)))
about a single organism you are 100% right.
Now, when Ivan, Ahmed, Mikola, Armen, Givi, Fayzulla will understand that ALL PEOPLES defeated fascism, then there will be no such articles.

[Setrac]

Quote: lonely

then there will be no such articles.

When the US State Department goes broke then there will be no such articles.

[The fat man]

Azerbaijani yueers take it easy
Full Minus Article
Since when should the administrative center of the Russian colony (Baku) be given some kind of title? !!!! where is it seen in history?
Azerbaijan was a free raw materials appendage of Russia --- yes, it was precisely its purpose that was free.
Baku is not Yerevan or Tbilisi to give titles for such hellish Works
do not forget and forget about the Christian Factor (solidarity)

I will bring the ayat from the holy Quran

and they will argue with you and humiliate you - and you will be ridiculed when you bring them the truth and it will be until you fall under their banners (faith)

what would happen to Baku and Ganja instead of Tbilisi (08.08.08/XNUMX/XNUMX) I think you know everything perfectly Baku would lie in ruins of the loss would be hundreds and hundreds of thousands
what happened to Baku in Soviet times and what it has become now you don’t see
or did you forget 90% of the city consisted of Slums (Soviet street.kubinka.vorovskaya) and why was it like this with such fuss?
PS This comment is intended exclusively for my fellow citizens
and I’m not aiming to offend anyone

[Nagaibak]

Fat Man "Azerbaijan was a free raw material appendage of Russia --- yes, such was its purpose, free of charge."
How many Azerbaijanis are 40 million Azerbaijanis in Iran. Do they live there better than you? Learn in your native language? Do they have theaters and libraries? Figures of culture. Prominent scientists, athletes, writers? Your place would not be in the USSR, but in Iran. They would clean you up. Or Turks, but they would treat you as equals, too, no one would relate to.
Nobody would give you to be independent. How they do not give this to Azerbaijanis in Iran. So, you can thank the Russian colonialists. For the independence granted to you. Other peoples do not make such gifts.

[The fat man]

Russia was the initiator of the division of Azerbaijan as a result of the Russ-Persian wars
and on Iran’s account, don’t worry, there are theaters and cultural figures there are more than enough
Googoosh and Arash are an example.
and also Freddie Mercury if you want to know UTB
and at the expense of gifts in the form of independence, it was not a present; rather, it was a bloody and very painful process that lasts 20 years in the form of occupations

[Nagaibak]

Fat man] and also Freddie mercury if you want to know it "
Lying is bad. Gugush was banned from singing in Iran and since 1979 she has not lived there. It works in Europe. Arash is also in Sweden, whether he lives and works. Do not give them work in Iran. Google pliz better ... examples are unsuccessful.
Wow ... Freddy is an Azerbaijani u-haha .... Got it. I won’t bother. Bye.

[The fat man]

[quote = lonely] [quote = kush62] And if there were no Chelyabinsk tanks, where would this oil be poured? [/ quote]
like where to panthers and tigers that would have reached the Urals, maybe the fate of our people would not be so bitter

[Nagaibak]

Fat man as far as the panthers and tigers would have reached the Urals may be the fate of our people from this would not be so bitter.
She would be beautiful !!! There would be enough room for everyone in their camps. And would you not be a fat hehe ...

[alone]

Quote: Fat Man

like where to panthers and tigers that would have reached the Urals, maybe the fate of our people would not be so bitter

wrong reasoning. Hitler did not keep any Azerbaijan in his plans. there would have been a Reich commissariat of the Caucasus led by Shikedan. all of us would have the same fate. (hunger death camp and cremation furnace). he needed Baku with oil and that’s all. We didn’t have any plans for him. Before writing like that, sometimes think about it. It looks ridiculous and stupid.

[The fat man]

We didn’t have any plans for him. Before writing like that, sometimes think about it. It looks ridiculous and stupid. fool
I think I see and reason, but I do not impose
why Rommel didn’t commit genocide in Africa and why should he arrange it as a job for oil workers for the Wehrmacht
Apparently, we, too, were not in the plans of the Soviets' People's Commissars in Western Azerbaijan, because you wrote above about this, why are you contradicting yourself?

[Nagaibak]

lonely "wrongly reasoning. Hitler did not have any Azerbaijan in his plans. It would be the Caucasus Reichskommissariat headed by Shchikedan."
In vain you explain it to him, he won’t understand ... Everything is somehow hard there ... you can see from subsequent posts. Once he monuments the Second World War as a spit in the face.

[The fat man]

don't get personal
I do not impose my opinion on anyone
probably really pricks his eyes
and as for your advice to a lonely one, in my opinion he doesn’t need your opinion
divide and rule as always

[Yeraz]

Quote: lonely

wrong reasoning. Hitler did not keep any Azerbaijan in his plans. there would have been a Reich commissariat of the Caucasus headed by Shchikedan. all of us had the same fate.

Brother, you are deeply mistaken. These were Soviet fairy tales, they said Hitler would come and kill everyone. The Slavs were not going to kill in the first place. At that time, Turkey was on the side of Germany and did not dare to enter the war because it was not confident in the Germans. And if Stalingrad had been lost, Turkish divisions would have entered the Caucasus !! And guess what would have happened ??? Yes, the distribution of weapons to Azerbaijanis, the creation of Azerbaijani divisions and, as a result, the second wandering of Armenians around the world, only unlike the Turks, Azerbaijanis would have really arranged would be the genocide of Armenians.
And according to this title, there must be one hero of World War II, because the Azerbaijanis on the German side fought for independent Azerbaijan, and they both died for their homeland.

[ayyildiz]

Quote: Yeraz

And at that time Turkey was on the side of Germany and did not dare to enter the war because it was not confident in the Germans. And if Stalingrad were lost, Turkish divisions would enter the Caucasus !! And guess what would happen ??

Was not! Ismet Inenu tried his best to protect the country from war! And he succeeded. There was a war of agents of the USSR and Germany in Turkey!

[alone]

Quote: Yeraz

Brother, you are deeply mistaken. These were Soviet fairy tales, they said Hitler would come and kill everyone. The Slavs were not going to kill in the first place. At that time, Turkey was on the side of Germany and did not dare to enter the war because it was not confident in the Germans. And if Stalingrad had been lost, Turkish divisions would have entered the Caucasus !! And guess what would have happened ??? Yes, the distribution of weapons to Azerbaijanis, the creation of Azerbaijani divisions and, as a result, the second wandering of Armenians around the world, only unlike the Turks, Azerbaijanis would have really arranged would be the genocide of Armenians.
And according to this title, there must be one hero of World War II, because the Azerbaijanis on the German side fought for independent Azerbaijan, and they both died for their homeland.

Hi Ali! how are you?
Yes, I am not mistaken! I know what I’m saying. In 1941, when the war of Azerbaijanis started, who were captured, they began to gather in camps. Then, Hitler began negotiations with Azerbaijani emigrant figures. The question was discussed
on the independence of Azerbaijan. then the Azerbaijan Legion was created as part of several battalions that were supposed to participate in the battles for the Caucasus. But Hitler was critical of the plan for independence of Azerbaijan. He clearly expressed that Azerbaijan will become part of the 3rd Reich as a province of great Germany .as all nations were awaited by the camp and death. after the plans of Germany were found out, the emigrant figures, through their people, gave the Azerbaijani legion officers the order that they should leave the Wehrmacht troops with all subordinates and join the European resistance forces. That is why it appeared a large number of Azerbaijanis in the ranks of the Italian, Yugoslav and French resistance forces. My grandfather’s brother was drafted into the army, found himself in the legion, escaping from there with the whole company joined the Yugoslav partisans. After the war he returned to the USSR and received 25 years for treason .let after 10 he was released with an apology. all that I say I listened with my own ears from his lips .and was extremely surprised that he did not hold the grudge against the Soviet regime for arrest and believed that it was right. And yet, being an officer of the Soviet army, he was captured during the Kharkiv operation of 1942 and remembered the actions of the entire highest command composition of the front. but this is a completely different story and has nothing to do with this topic.

[Yeraz]

Quote: lonely

Hi Ali! how are you?

Aleikuma, everything is as always 36.6)))
I don’t know, given the Turkish factor and oil, everything would not be so terrible as you described. And by and large, what difference does a German boot or Soviet make. Thanks to tsarist Russia and then to the Soviets, they created Armenia from my Irevan khanate and took away our lands, therefore , for me that these are the same. The only difference is that I specifically know what tsarist Russia and the Soviets did, and what the Germans would do is just speculation.

[Bakht]

Refine your words. Not on the side of Germany, but on the side of Nazi Germany. I understand that not far from the SS man. It is good that there are still much fewer such people in Azerbaijan than normal people.

[The fat man]

given the Germans harrater think yes
Personally, my opinion and what is the difference to a Pole or an Azerbaijani whose boot is German or Russian

when I see monuments of World War II in Azerbaijan, it’s like a spit in my face. It is high time to demolish them and replace them with monuments of grief for the fallen in the Second World War.
and the words of many members of the forum indicate that there is no role for the Azerbaijani people in this victory and they are largely right unfortunately
Since the metropolis must know its place

[Yeraz]

Quote: Fat Man

and the words of many members of the forum indicate that there is no role for the Azerbaijani people in this victory and they are largely right unfortunately
Since the metropolis must know its place

This was always the case with the brother. The role of the mother country and religious affiliation has always played. And the friendship of peoples is good when there is an all-powerful KGB, the KGB does not and immediately this friendship was covered with a copper basin.

[Setrac]

Quote: Fat Man

Since the metropolis must know its place

And that's it. Here it is the consumer attitude of the Limitrophs to the mother country.

[PUHACH]

Ilham Aliyev paid attention to veterans of the Great Patriotic War. According to the decree, financial assistance in the amount of 500 manat will be provided to participants in the Great Patriotic War of 1941-1945, and the widows of those killed in the Second World War or subsequently died soldiers will receive 200 manat each.

This is generosity ... at least now the participants of the Second World War should be 90 years old, I wonder how many of them are left, something reminds me of our caring Rygoravych ... It is said loudly, and the costs are small

[Yeraz]

Quote: PUHACH

This is generosity ... at least now the participants of the Second World War should be 90 years old, I wonder how many of them are left, something reminds me of our caring Rygoravych ... It is said loudly, and the costs are small

Well, Aliyev might not have done this either, because there are not so many of them in Azerbaijan and they have no influence on public opinion. This is really his concern that there are just a few of them left and they worked for their homeland. Literally a couple of years and into oblivion.

[alone]

the main thing is not that how many of them remain. the main thing is that the state considered it its duty to help these veterans and their widows.

[Altona]

A lot has been written here ... I'll put in my five kopecks ... To be honest, the city of hucksters does not pull on the hero city, you just need to go there, breathe in the atmosphere, as they say ... Citizens-heroines of oriental appearance with caps and characteristic "Uh, devyushka, look around, buy it, listen! " I can't imagine ... Of course they will object to me, but Baku does not need this status, taking into account the Turkish vector ... It is already a self-sufficient modern eastern metropolis ...

[Bakht]

What is hello, so is the answer. Then you are surprised that they don’t like Russians in Baku. But I must say that Baku was the most international city of the Union. You have a biased view of things. And it’s very primitive. I do not call Moscow the city of drunks.

I still think that Baku did not deserve the title of a hero city. But for very real reasons. There were no fights here, the Germans did not reach Baku. And thank God.

In addition to oil (and this is a very, very primitive view of things), Baku had a powerful industrial production. All plants worked for war. Mostly shells were made for Katyusha. At all times (!) In Baku schools there were memorial plates that in this school there was a evacuation hospital number such and such. Hundreds of thousands of wounded passed through Baku. Thousands of Azerbaijanis went to the front. It is unlikely that they were all traders. And people in caps worked at factories.

So, Baku and Azerbaijan contributed to the Victory. And without oil, the contribution was quite significant. Just ignoramuses from history except stamps do not know anything. And ask them why the famous Balakhanskoye field watered will moo and carry nonsense.

I repeat once again - the article is stupid and does not correspond to the facts.

[Altona]

As for oil ... So for Russia proper it wasn’t pumped for so long, before that the British successfully pumped it for the British, and it was the British of Baku who trash abandoned towers and pumps, black oil lakes among snow-white sand ... Now oil is taken from the bottom of the Caspian and in connection with this factor, the role of Azerbaijan for Russia as an oil-producing territory is negligible ...

[The fat man]

I saw the British pump oil
and it’s not the British who dirtied the tank, but the Russians don’t bother with black oil lakes as a result of predatory exploitation of natural resources and neglect of the local population

[Altona]

I saw, I saw ... You first study the history of your land, then wave your fists here ... I am writing to you the words of your local historians, from the distant 80s ...

[Yeraz]

Quote: Altona

Prior to this, Baku and the British were successfully pumping it for the British and trashing abandoned towers and pumps, fuel oil lakes among the white sand for waste.

Yeah, we are furry again, and the British are bad for a short period of oil pumping, they all made a guess))))

[Altona]

Yeah, opt, the British conducted all their activities observing exceptional environmental standards, they are megademocrats and everywhere respect the local population ... True, during these years they stained Boers in concentration camps in South Africa, shot sepoys from cannons in India, fed Russians rotten fish in the Lena goldfields ... And the rest, a beautiful marquise, all is well, all is well!

[Bakht]

Another wrong thesis. Oil was pumped for the Union and the crap territories were inherited from the Union. And they didn’t download for long. Out of 150 years of oil production, for the Union and Russia they have been rocking for 120 years. This is of course not for long (by your standards).

[smersh70]

Quote: Altona

dumped waste oil-abandoned towers and pumps,

it was all in the past .. now instead of the Black City, the White City is being built ... the boulevard stretched almost to your part. there a lot has changed .. come .. see ... ...

[Altona]

For some reason, the peak of oil production occurred at the beginning of the XNUMXth century, when foreign companies were in charge, rocking chairs with foreign brands were lying all over the coast, but for some reason Russians ...

[The fat man]

[quote = Altona] For some reason, the peak of oil production occurred at the beginning of the XX century
just the same peak occurred in 40-50 years
but at the expense of foreign hallmarks
maybe they had to be replaced with pre-revolving equipment, but this was not done because of complete indifference and incompetence

[Bakht]

History must be taught, my dear. The peak of oil production occurred in the Soviet period. And the mass of rocking chairs (on Bibi Heybat they all eliminated and planted trees) all with Soviet brands.

You are clearly not in the subject, comrade.

[Altona]

So isn't it you, in Baku, that the bulk of oil-producing equipment was designed and produced? Or did the Martians bring him? That is, everything was done with you and your hands, and the "abstract" empire is to blame ... History must be taught, of course, but there is no need to pull the skin of the Karabakh donkey on everything, comrade ...

[Bakht]

What is the skin of the Karabakh donkey? This she seems to you. Of course, in Baku there were engineering plants and oil engineering plants. But it is you who write about foreign hallmarks on the rocking chairs. All equipment was our own. So learn the story.

Returning to your thesis on English oil. For over 100 years, oil has been rocking for the Russian Empire and the Soviet Union. After the collapse of the Union, foreigners came. But as before, the bulk of the equipment is produced in Baku. I was only at ZGO a week ago (if you are a former Bakuer, you should know what it is). Everything works and new foundations descend.

So we have been pumping oil to the British for the last 20 years. You would think that all the other ex-Soviet Union is pumping oil to someone else? You ask your tankers (again, I do not decipher the term. If you are in the subject, you should know). Azerbaijani oil was pumped under the Contract and now most of it goes to the budget of my country. And where do we get these "petrodollars"?

Not everything is so cloudless. And there are still many miscalculations and shortcomings. But I saw Bibi Eibat of the Soviet period and modern. Do not believe me - I'm not going to convince anyone.

[The fat man]

I don't wave my fists. do not poke me. with you a girl in three d - ki not t ---- l
Give the facts and who are our local historians?
I understand you the same attitude towards the local population (contemptuous) I had in Angola and Nigeria, but I did not feel hatred for them later, I even fell in love with these nations
at the expense of the eastern metropolis you are right not to compare with London, New York and Singapore.
I advise you to skip the photo of Baku, however, and you don’t need to and you already know everything.

[Altona]

So you poke here the first ... you personally ran around the coast and went around and walked ... the first scrap metal that I saw was of foreign manufacture ... Maybe you can tell you about the extraction of marble, otherwise you don’t know?

[The fat man]

so everything is clear with you
Was it weak to replace this scrap metal of the 19th century or not?
but I don’t know about marble on the drum.
good luck, please do not disturb anymore

[Altona]

Everything is clear with you too ... Yes, under Soviet rule, oil production increased, but production itself moved to the sea, which has nothing to do with the Baku coast ... The city was built and grew under the Soviet regime, as it became international ... As the Soviet regime left, the British again came in the person of BP, since there was not enough local investment and competence ... These are only Russians who are stupid in your understanding, and their clever and handsome ones ...

[Yeraz]

Quote: Fat Man

so everything is clear with you
Was it weak to replace this scrap metal of the 19th century or not?

Don't even try to get fat. Here we persistently inculcate in everyone the most wonderful empire, all the rest are insignificant, we should be thanked by the peoples we have joined (about the capture of a word) and we have been taught to sit there, eat culturally, write, read, etc. But still, we remain stupid monkeys for them))
By the way, I am grateful to Orkhan Zeynalov, because after these events the true essence of many came out of Naru, and if there were small assimilation processes of non-Russian nares, then right now the cross is put up even though the child is born here and the only non-Russian assimilation process will not affect him))

[Altona]

I’m not saying anywhere that we are the most wonderful ... Personally, I didn’t capture Azerbaijan, I didn’t even have a staff machine in training, I was one for two ... I consider Baku a beautiful city, although besides hills and gray blocks in the vicinity I especially I didn’t see anything ... The Caspian is also beautiful ... Local residents left a double impression on the contrast, as they say ... There are very interesting and well-read, so there are opposites ... So it’s already impossible to instill in me in the fifth ten lived years will crush it in the bud ...

[Altona]

By the way, Mr. Yeraz, as an "imperialist" to an "imperialist", a small remark ... Your nickname is unpatriotic, no offense ... It is not appropriate to call yourself the Yerevan Automobile Plant ..

[Yeraz]

Quote: Altona

It’s not worth calling yourself the Yerevan Automobile Plant.

just the same patriotic, you see you were in Azerbaijan up to 90.
Eraz is Yerevan Azerbaijanis, specifically I am not Yerevan, but this name stuck because tsarist Russia began to evict the first Azerbaijanis from Yerevan and because of this, all Azerbaijanis come from Armenia in Azerbaijan are called Erazy))
By the way, Georgian Azerbaijanis, who in Georgia are called half a million Graz i.e. Georgian Azerbaijanis.

[Altona]

I have no more questions ... But ERAZ in Russia has a stable image of such an iron coffin on wheels, created by crazy hands in distant Yerevan ...

[Yeraz]

Quote: Altona

I have no more questions ... But ERAZ in Russia has a stable image of such an iron coffin on wheels, created by crazy hands in distant Yerevan ...

Well, Russia has a very narrow circle of people in Russia, generation 88-2013 did not hear about it, and few also knew about the older ones, the machine was not very noble, I myself accidentally found out that there was such a machine)

[xetai9977]

Yeraz, Fat Man, I already spoke to Apollo and Hedgehog above, take care of your nerves, well, they don’t like us. Why talk about this? And recently, this dislike has become mutual. And why do we need regalia of a non-existent state? We did without it in the past, but now we can do without it. And imperial thinking will go away from them. How gone from the British and French. Only time is needed.

[Altona]

I do not operate with the concept of "love-not love" ... Yesterday I threw several controversial theses on the subject of "breaking through" into the conversation ... I was satisfied with the result ... What impressions I had 25 years ago, they remain so .. Poorly hidden Russophobia and rejection ...

[vahatak]

Yes of course! Who would doubt that? The Armenians are to blame. Now, if Mikoyan were shot along with Shaumyan, what reason would the author (customers) of the article come up with?

[Bakht]

Mikoyan, of course, had to be shot along with Shaumyan. Those are still scum. Both wholesale and retail. But Mikoyan has nothing to do with the Hero City.

The fact that the Armenians are to blame is not to go to a fortuneteller.

[Altona]

Evening Caspian ... Offshore platforms in the distance ...

[Altona]

Previously, somewhere there were baths ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-training communications regiment ...

[Altona]

The village next to the part ... A kind of such a landscape ... Photos were taken on the site of the former military unit 89598-communications training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

It's the same road ... Such a highway ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598 training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[smersh70]

Quote: Altona

All the same road.

this photo is already old .. they all changed ... the autobahn passes and the road leaves on the right side ... in Flag Square .... there is already a boulevard .... all the buildings are old and the towers .. the factories have all been removed. ...

[Altona]

So I more or less ancient photos and picked up, as it was approximately ... They are even newer than it was then ...

[Altona]

A hill and a lighthouse on it ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-communication training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

Now this is the square in front of the mosque ... Pictures were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-communication training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

That's actually the mosque itself ... When I didn’t have it ... The photos were taken on the site of the former military unit 89598 training regiment of communications ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

Here is another landscape ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-communication training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

Here is the very structure of the lighthouse ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-communication training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

View of the Caspian Sea ... In the distance is a rig on the shelf ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-training communications regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

Another view of the Caspian ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-training communications regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

Another view of the lighthouse ... Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-communications training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Altona]

The Baku area is so harsh ... Well, as Chelyabinsk, in the same way ... I apologize for the large illustrative material posted in the comments on this article ...
Photos were taken at the site of the former military unit 89598-communications training regiment ... Shikhovo village ...

[Bakht]

Well, you gave a photo. So what? Absheron Peninsula is not the best part of Azerbaijan. Solonchak soils.

By the way, now everything has changed there. I'm not going to give so many photos. Who wants to google - will find. How many did not meet with foreigners (come to Baku to work) all in a state of shock. Just ten days ago my old friend arrived. Scotsman. The last time he was in Baku 10 years ago. Cannot recover from delight. Everything has changed. He likes everything. The Poles (also had to communicate) are crazy about the old city. Even at night we went out into the city. How happy the children were when I told them about the houses that Ploshko built.

By the way, all, without exception, note absolute safety. But the night city can be walked absolutely calmly. At least in a burqa, even in a miniskirt. Who likes what. No one bothers or hurts.

Strange .... Especially considering your posts here ....

[Altona]

I illustrated my presence in the military unit ... I saw such a landscape, the photos are not mine by the way, they were taken from the forums ... In the city itself I was probably 5-6 times, and then I was passing in the back of an army truck ... economic activity, so to speak, to food warehouses (ZakVO) for loading and unloading products, to quarries for loading a "cube" (sand brick), to marble quarries (to load a battle of pink marble) ... The city itself, if you do not count such black dust that settled on wild grapes and apricots, quite neat, but the color of the buildings is depressing ... And so in architecture there is a great mixture of styles, in some places Italy, in some places Turkey, in some places even the USA ... There is Empire, Rococo, and all sorts of styles you want. .. It is on the basis of personal impressions, which are really quite old, 25 years already, I write, and then I watch history ... Because it does not happen, history is separate, modernity is separate ... And then, you read some, then you lived we didn’t grieve, we drove merciers, we ate caviar with spoons and then it was a razz, and the Russian empire ptala ... And the Ottoman and Persian did not trample?

[Bakht]

Being in a military unit, you could not know the city. Your attitude to the "city of traders" just outraged me. I do not draw conclusions from individual cases. And in no case do I generalize to the whole people. It so happened that I traveled around the world and worked in the most international teams. But no one has ever made such generalizations as on this site.

In Soviet times, Baku was called handsome. And now he is simply unrecognizable. What to do, it is on green pieces of paper. But this just suggests that we are not pumping oil to the West. In any case, not in such quantities as in the early years. There are purely technical mining issues that are out of the question here. But we needed funds to get on our feet. And clean our ecology. How this was done, there are diametrically opposed opinions. In general, the problem was successfully solved.

And about the article, I can only repeat it again. The title of Hero City has been devalued so much that there’s nothing to talk about.

[Altona]

In the city, I was nonetheless ... In the sense that I saw him ... By generalizations, what is so embarrassing in my generalizations? I know normal Azerbaijanis, but they have become normal in communicating with Russians and respecting them ... This is another such generalization, and you won’t take it either ...

[Altona]

And by the way, if I hadn't gotten involved with my comments and "generalizations", how would you popularize your city here? And so that there are no generalizations, it is necessary that your compatriots, and mine too, behave normally with guests, and not in a boorish way ... Although Baku in the 80s is hardly different from Kazan or Ufa in the 80s? ... the same fights, probably "district" against "district", youth groups ... But probably the "Armenian" aspect was also ...

[Altona]

Now let's speculate about the "empire of the era of decline", at the time of this very decline ... I actually do not hide that I am not Russian by origin, I am a typical representative of small peoples, to which Russia came with the campaigns of Ermak ... That is, those peoples who for centuries weaved bast shoes and plowed their loams ... My great-grandfather, they say, was dispossessed, but then there was a school in that house where the scout Nikolai Kuznetsov (Paul Siebert) studied until grade 4 ... Now this house, or rather a log house from him rotting in the Ural forests, because these places are emptying ... Mother and father met at the timber industry enterprise and then left for Chuvashia (where there are no minerals) ... I was born there, finished school, entered an institute in Moscow and from the second year was drafted into the army ... Today, when everything is paid, it is practically inconceivable ... And from the Ugreshsky assembly point to the Kursk railway station and through Ukraine we arrived in Baku ... The funny thing is that I lived next to the Baku cinema in Moscow ... Baku in 1988 did not live in poverty at all in comparison with other cities of the "empire", the shops were full of everything and there was no need for anything ... In Baku, I first tasted baklava and other eastern sweets ... I learned that Gagauz people live in Moldova, and that Russians and other Slavs are "unfaithful" and the word given to them does not mean anything ... Well, here are about the first impressions about Azerbaijan of an 18-year-old guy from the center of Russia ... The most "terrible" thing for me is that I am friends with a Karabakh Armenian, but at school I was a desk with an Azerbaijani girl, by the way, she is beautiful now, even though she is already a grandmother ... So, this is ce la vie ...

[Bakht]

Everyone has different ideas. Baku of 88 was in poverty. And for everything that we didn’t have, we went to Moscow. A word is a word. And nationality never mattered to me. He gave the floor to the Slav - this is the same word as the Azerbaijani. I have not seen any nationalism in Baku. That would be funny. According to statistics, in a city with a population of 1,2 million there were 300 thousand Armenians, 300 thousand Russians and about 300 thousand Jews. These are approximate numbers. But very close to the truth. In Baku of the 80s, except for Russian, no other language was spoken. This is now a thing of the past, but I am sure that as many Russian schools as there are now in Azerbaijan are not found in any other former republic.

The fact that we were divided and pitted is not our fault. Azerbaijan was the last to leave the Union. And the events in Osh, Karabakh, and Abkhazia began to collapse. That's who has his hands to the elbow in the blood. And the Agreement on the collapse of the USSR was signed by the Slavic peoples. Ukraine, Belarus and Russia. So the small nations are the least to blame. And now we have what we have. A small country, Azerbaijan, should have a shoulder of support. This is an axiom. We alone cannot stand it. A holy place is never empty. we will have other friends.

But Russia has strong positions in Azerbaijan. Still strong. But every year they weaken. A new generation has grown. The second generation is already growing up, for which Russia, if not the enemy, but also not a friend for sure.

And the fact that we are going to work for you, I did not say that everything is cloudless here. But ... they already said here. Enter the visa regime, close the borders and you will be happy. By the way, I am completely for this step. Whoever wants independence, let him slurp a full spoon. But politicians and politicians know the consequences. And the geopolitical consequences will be very, very unpleasant. For all of us.

[Altona]

Well, you see, with the example of Baku, you can discuss so many problems, but for many it’s just a 2-million city far beyond the Caucasian ridge, where Eurovision took place ... And the fact that this is generally a serious center of the Caucasus with key positions, many are not know ...

[Marek Rozny]

Good article. There is not a drop of nationalism here, as some thought. Azerbaijanis do not appropriate the Victory and do not emphasize their role.
More articles about the labor rear - about how Soviet people worked in Siberia, Central Asia and Kazakhstan, in Armenia, Georgia and so on.
The topic of World War II is one of the few topics where Azerbaijanis and Armenians can speak respectfully about each other. This is already a sufficient reason for articles about the sons and daughters of these two peoples to appear on the site.
As I understand it, the article appeared on the site in some connection with recent events in Biryulyovo. And if this article calms down some heated Muscovite, who recently demanded that all Caucasians be expelled from the Mother See, then that’s good.
If in Kazakhstan or Ukraine they raised a cry because of every criminal of Russian origin, then there would be a complete attack. are found in any nation, keeping statistics based on ethnicity is meaningless and unacceptable. A maniac or petty thief may turn out to be a Kazakh, a Jew, a German or a Chukchi.
Russia is the homeland for many people of non-titular nationality. This is the real wealth of the country. Each ethnic group has its own traditional strengths and weaknesses, and there are also a large number of people who are exceptions to existing cliches.
We need to write more about the contribution of each numerous and small people of the USSR to the common Victory. And thereby prepare for the fact that there will be more ahead general Victories.

However, Baku could not receive the title of hero city not for national reasons, but because of the essence of this title. The status was assigned, as you all know, only for combat (defensive) actions. Unfortunately, in the USSR there was no concept of a “city of labor glory”, as is now being introduced in Russia, but republics, cities and even individual enterprises were awarded orders and medals for labor achievements. Azerbaijani oil workers received these awards personally, and Azerbaijani oil enterprises also received them. I agree that this is much less than the title of “hero city,” but for rear cities this was the maximum that existed in Soviet times.

PS. And the contribution of Baku industry during the war is truly difficult to overestimate. For example, the Kazakh Emba field (Western KZ) was proudly called “Second Baku” in the 40s, which once again emphasizes the high status of Azerbaijani oil producers. The Azerbaijanis did not commit sabotage, did not raise anti-Soviet uprisings during the war, did not defect to Hitler, who promised “freedom for the Caucasus,” and did not succumb to the cautious Turkish propaganda that the Azerbaijanis were “not on the same path with the Russians” (Turkey was neutral in this conflict , but was ready for the USSR to collapse and worked to integrate the Turkic regions of the Soviet Union). The Azerbaijanis, like other peoples of the USSR, valiantly fulfilled their military and labor duty.

[Bakht]

Still, I’ll put a few photos that you won’t find on the Internet. Made by me personally just a month ago. I wonder who brought us this installation? Are they really English?

[Bakht]

And this was also done in Baku. So oil production at sea is all ours....

[Bakht]

The photos aren't exactly secret. So you can post them. But where all this was collected is considered classified information. I can only assure you that I am also in Baku. So not everyone here is running around in caps and pestering people with offers to buy oranges. We can work too. It may not seem strange to you. But, taking into account your “experienced years”, I will not dissuade you.

Let everyone stay with their donkey.

[Altona]

I’m not interested in oil production, neither oil production, nor oil cracking, nor petrochemicals interest me... So whether it’s secret or unclassified, I’m not interested... Extract, process, pump, send to Father in Novopolotsk or anywhere else, I don’t care at all ...

[FormerMariman]

Many people on this site are undergoing metamorphosis! If an article or opinions (sometimes provoking) of forum members touch his nationality or the role of his state in building global good, then he immediately remembers historical grievances, forgetting about our common heroic past (which gave us a lot)! And vice versa, if in his opinion there is no such thing, they write about our heroic past! Well, or about NATO and the Middle East (for example)!

[Altona]

Yes, there are no metamorphoses... This is an eastern mentality, in the south they like to show off, to show that they live on a grand scale and beautifully, these are the national habits, to show off... Those in Russia have always lived meagerly, modestly, this has now broken through. ..Houses with three floors up and the same number down... Concepts came, generated by you know who, how to throw and divert... Yes, a lot has changed... We all turned out to be different... But why from Azerbaijan, which is developing 3 times faster than China, are they coming to Russia?

[alone]

Quote: Altona

But why do they come to Russia from Azerbaijan, which is developing 3 times faster than China?

If you don’t like it, introduce a visa regime and don’t let these people into your country. Are we really to blame for this too?))

[Altona]

The issue of visas is the competence of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the State Duma...I am not a member there and have no right to give advice to them...We lived in the same "empire", the empire turned out to be "bad", we now live on opposite sides..."Empire “I tried as hard as I could to “digest” the peoples included in it, good or bad, that’s how it turned out... It seems like they’ve already fled, but still the “former” fellow citizens are going to the “bad” imperials...

[alone]

This is a completely different question and is not related to the topic. But I advise you to take a vacation for the summer and come to Baku for a week. You will see a lot of things. And it’s better to see once
than to hear 100 times))

[smersh70]

Quote: Altona

But why do they come to Russia from Azerbaijan, which is developing 3 times faster than China?

By the way, as far as I know...the Chinese come more than us. You probably forgot about the Far East........

[Altona]

About 10 years ago I wanted to visit Baku and Minsk, but something didn’t work out... Here, by the way, one more aspect was not touched upon, the oil one... After all, the West needed oil in the 30-40s... The British even seem to they wanted to bomb the oil fields of Baku and act with the Germans against Stalin for possessing this wealth... But the West did not want to accept oil from Stalin, they only demanded food and gold, thanks to which the whole country had to malnourish and tighten the straps on its skinny belly... This moment is like something was missed in the historical context...

[alone]

I read that the British suggested that Stalin send British troops into Baku to prevent the Nazis from capturing the city. But Stalin would not have been Stalin if he had allowed this. But no one was going to bomb the city. The late Baibakov, who was born in Baku and grew up there , was responsible for damaging wells in the event of a threat of capture of the city. He spoke about this in a documentary. And the command of the Wehrmacht and Lutwaffe had strict instructions from Hitler, who forbade bombing the city because of its oil derricks. And if you delve deeply into the political map of that time, one could understand that there were only three large oil areas in the world. These were Mosul oil in Iraq (Iraq was a British colony), Baku oil (USSR) and Romanian oil. But Romanian oil was too little for Hitler’s plans, and the Iraqi rebellion under the leadership of Rashid Gagliani failed.
and the British wanted to send troops to Baku and keep all the oil in their hands. It was not for nothing that Hess flew to London. There is such a concept in English politics. They have no friends, they have interests. London and Berlin could have made a deal about dividing the pie. The moment was not missed, after the victory they simply did not talk about it.

[Altona]

In general, hypothetically, it would be easy to carry out such a raid, like... Was the city well guarded in terms of air defense? And why didn’t (the Luftwaffe) bomb? To “slam the door”, for example...For the abandoned Stalingrad, for the abandoned Ukraine...

[alone]

Baku was guarded by an entire separate air defense army. Suffice it to say that in total 6 German reconnaissance aircraft broke through to the city and were shot down. In addition to air defense systems, the airspace was also guarded by 7-8 regiments of fighter aircraft. Even in such difficult times, Stalin did not withdraw these forces from defense of the city. The air of the city was silently closed; “slamming the door” would not have worked.

[Bakht]

Facts say that there were more than 3 major oil regions in the world. For example, Iran, Saudi Arabia (the deposits were discovered in the 30s). Borneo, East Holland, Venezuela (main supplier for the States).

In the summer of 42, Stalin suggested that the British send several divisions to the Eastern Front. But the British had problems in the North. Africa. And Churchill refused. Moreover, Churchill did not believe that the USSR would hold Baku. And therefore, under pressure from Churchill, Stalin released Anders’ Poles to guard English oil fields and pipelines in Mesopotamia.

Stalin, impressed by the failures, in the summer of 42 asked Roosevelt for several American divisions on any section of the Soviet-German front under American command. The Americans also refused. But for different reasons. They simply did not have any free divisions.

[alone]

Quote: Bakht

Facts say that there were more than 3 major oil regions in the world. For example, Iran, Saudi Arabia (the deposits were discovered in the 30s).

One thing is discovered in the 30s, and another is actually mining, which has been carried out for decades.

[Bakht]

Oil production in Azerbaijan in 1942 - 18 million tons;
Oil production in the Middle East in 1942 - 19 million tons.

[alone]

Quote: Bakht

Oil production in the Middle East in 1942 - 19 million tons.

Well, that’s right. But what about Mosul oil, American?

[Bakht]

Evgeniy, it seemed like we had a good conversation and didn’t quarrel. But I love history. Well, you can’t interpret everything so wrongly... :-(

The West (that is, England) did not need Baku oil. They had Iranian. And even more than necessary. With a tanker fleet and a route through Suez, there was more than enough.

The British wanted to bomb the oil fields of Baku in the spring of 41. But we didn’t have time. The war in Finland is over. The Germans found photographs of the Baku oil fields in the French General Staff and kindly provided them to Stalin. One of the reasons why Stalin did not believe the British and their “warnings”.

The British and Americans wanted gold. But not so much as to strangle the USSR. They needed Soviet troops at the front more. Therefore, they did not demand, but gave the USSR food. Everyone has heard about the “second front”. And about “egg powder”.

PS Plato is my friend, but truth is more precious.

[Altona]

I meant the period of collectivization and industrialization, and not the actual eve of the war...Speaking about possible bombings of Baku, I already meant the end of 1943, the beginning of 1944...I just read a specialized forum on this topic, they write that the technical capabilities of Heinkel bombers HE-111 and Junkers Ju 88A-1 (or A-4) still wouldn’t be enough...

[Bakht]

During the period of collectivization and industrialization there were no plans. These were the late 20s, early 30s. Hitler was not yet in the project. I made a mistake with the date in my previous message. The British and French had plans to bomb Baku in 40. Even airfields in the Middle East were being prepared. But in March the war in Finland ended, and then the blitzkrieg in Norway and the defeat of France began.

To bomb Baku, it was necessary to send bombers accompanied by fighters. The performance characteristics of the aircraft were allowed. But.... The Germans used all their forces at Stalingrad and Rzhev. And when it became clear that we had to get out of the North Caucasus, all bomber aircraft (together with transport aircraft) worked to supply Paulus. Moreover, it was necessary to build airfields and supply them with fuel. The difficulties of supplying Kleist's 1st Panzer Army are quite well known.

The problems of home-grown strategists were well described by American generals. “While amateurs are discussing attack directions, professionals are solving supply problems.” This is the very moment that does not make, for example, Rommel a great strategist. He was an amateur.

[Bakht]

Quote: lonely

Baku was guarded by an entire separate air defense army. Suffice it to say that in total 6 German reconnaissance aircraft broke through to the city and were shot down. In addition to air defense systems, the airspace was also guarded by 7-8 regiments of fighter aircraft. Even in such difficult times, Stalin did not withdraw these forces from defense of the city. The air of the city was silently closed; “slamming the door” would not have worked.

A very controversial statement. According to the link, Baku’s air defense was formed on a residual basis and could not withstand a massive attack.

http://www.sultanov.azeriland.com/istoria_neimeet/page_17.html

[alone]

The Baku Air Defense Army was formed in early May 1942 (GKO decree of April 5) through the reorganization of the Baku Air Defense Corps Region. Its management was created on the basis of the reformed management of the 3rd Air Defense Corps.
In May-October 1942, during the period of active operations of German reconnaissance aircraft within the army’s borders, its combat personnel included:
8th Air Defense Fighter Aviation Corps (6 fighter aviation regiments)
7 anti-aircraft artillery regiments
1 regiment of anti-aircraft machine guns
1 searchlight regiment
barrage balloon regiment
regiment VNOS
other separate parts.

and this is what you call the residual principle?