Military Review

"A few facts for Yanukovych"

353
"A few facts for Yanukovych"After weighing all the facts, tell me: would you, in the place of the head of Ukraine, agree to “go to Europe” with the prospect of being in a completely different place for yourself personally and with guaranteed destruction of your economy?


No matter how much you repeat "halva", in Ukraine this will not become sweeter. No matter how much you say "European integration", there will no longer be any plants from this, the number of jobs will not increase.

By the way, you need to understand that the number of jobs, and hence the incomes of Ukrainian citizens, will only decrease after the opening of their economy in Kiev to Brussels.

The fact is that for all Ukrainian enterprises the technical regulations of the EEC will start to operate. This means that Ukrainian factories, factories, giants and tiny cooperatives will not be able to sell their products (if it does not comply with European standards and regulations) not only in Europe, but also within Ukraine itself.

And Western corporations can and will do it. This means not “lower prices and increased competition”, but unemployment and impoverishment of the population with the prospect of losing the entire industrial potential.

According to the calculations of the National Academy of Sciences of Ukraine, for the transition to new technical regulations of Europe, Ukrainian enterprises need from 60 to 80 billion euros. Ukrainian industrialists do not have this money.

Take a loan? Do you know what percentage is today for those involved in the business? Money can be taken under 25% per annum.

In addition, Ukraine is committed to introduce these new technical regulations. DURING ONE YEAR. In Europe, they passed on for decades. I think that further developments for the Ukrainian manufacturers of all industries are easy to predict. We add to all these economic risks purely political risks. For the current leadership of Ukraine PERSONALLY.

West demands to release Tymoshenko. To adopt a very ridiculous law for this, according to which ... prisoners of Ukrainian prisons can go abroad for treatment!

It would be very funny if it were not so sad. If Julia is released, the threat to Yanukovych becomes enormous. It is a specific threat to take its place in the future.

But now, after weighing all these facts, tell me: would you, on the spot of the head of Ukraine, agree to “go to Europe” with the prospect of finding yourself in a completely different place for yourself personally and with guaranteed destruction of your economy? That your rating will kill without fail.

I think no. But Yanukovych and his entourage stubbornly go to their own political death, sending the Party of Regions to the bottom. Ukrainians do not need another “orange party”. And so in the Rada from the "orange" in the eyes dazzled.

We conclude: if Yanukovych commits, in our opinion, political hara-kiri, then you and I do not know anything. Not only Medvedev, but also Putin said that after signing documents with Brussels, the way to the Customs Union will be closed to Kiev. That is, the warning came from the clearest and most understandable source.

If Yanukovych still decides to sign documents with the West, it means that he received guarantees of personal immunity from this West. Or we should recognize the head of Ukraine as clearly seen in suicidal political inclinations.

In this regard, I would like to remind Viktor Yanukovych a few facts:

1. Saddam Hussein, Muammar Gaddafi, Hosni Mubarak, Egyptian President Mohammed Mursi, head of Yugoslavia Milosevic. All these politicians also thought that they had agreed with their Western "partners."

I am sure that Yulia Tymoshenko also thought so. However, the reality turned out to be much sadder.

2. Being the head of a nation, you need to think about your place in stories. It is difficult, but for a politician at the level of the head of the country it is imperative, otherwise you can not enter the history, but get into it.
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  1. shtanko.49
    shtanko.49 30 October 2013 12: 29
    21
    Probably something is hidden from the people, but to deceive the neighbor and rejoice, this is the favorite hobby in Yanukovych’s policy, and then he bit a bit and rushing to take it out. But for such decisions, a referendum is needed, the fate of the people, the country is decided, here you have to put your ambitions into one place...
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 15: 26
      14
      And Western corporations can and will do it. This means not “lower prices and increased competition”, but unemployment and impoverishment of the population with the prospect of losing the entire industrial potential.
      And the one to blame for all this is already known in Ukraine ............. hi
      One of the representatives of the Russian Federation threw a cue that Russia would make Ukraine’s entry into the EU very expensive. To this, the Ukrainian opposition replied: "It is already very expensive."
      “We appeal to our Russian partners to implement all bilateral and multilateral international agreements signed and ratified by Ukraine and the Russian Federation: Major agreement, free trade area agreement, WTO and a number of other agreements. Do it. And respect our sovereign rights, as we respect yours, ”Yatsenyuk urged.news.mail.ru/inworld/ukraina/global/112/politics/15381676/
      1. KCC
        KCC 30 October 2013 16: 16
        40
        History repeats itself, Russia is to blame for everything, mainly that it does not give everything for nothing. Let's go, dear Mr. Mazepa, pretend that we are with Russia and let's go west. It is sad that history does not teach anything, our Ukrainian brothers.
        1. In the book
          In the book 30 October 2013 18: 33
          +2
          Yes, no one (or you specifically) does not blame. A completely different policy is drawn here. The people of Ukraine, as well as Russia, are from the point of view of the leaders of these countries.
          1. In the book
            In the book 1 November 2013 11: 43
            +3
            Quote: Libr
            The people of Ukraine, as well as Russia, are from the point of view of the leaders of these countries.

            Sorry, did not add:
            The people of Ukraine, as well as Russia, are, from the point of view of the leaders of these countries, a disenfranchised mass, which is needed only in order to legalize themselves beloved in power under the so-called. "elections"
        2. MIKHAN
          MIKHAN 30 October 2013 18: 42
          11
          I remember Mazepa at school ... And also T. Bulba in the book "I gave birth to myself and I will kill." If Ukraine is "gayevropezed" it will be the hardest blow for Russia and, most importantly, for our peoples .. (in Romania, missile defense systems are already being deployed at a rapid pace there is understandable ..) I have no words. bloody ..)
          1. randomizer
            randomizer 30 October 2013 23: 57
            +4
            And they did not withstand such blows. Weathered and this. And we’ll take our own, if not now. Russia is holding a punch.
          2. silver_roman
            silver_roman 31 October 2013 11: 44
            11
            "I have begotten myself and I will kill."

            aha, and the anthem of Ukraine: "Ukraine has not died yet" ... somehow it sounds not happy crying
            I will say this: many segments of the population have already been led to the rhetoric of the West. Many already see directly the entry into Europe and all the consequences of this: excellent roads, high salaries and general living standards. But for some reason everyone notices only a spoonful of honey, and tar barrels do not see. For some reason they think that it will be like in Germany or France, but they don’t notice the Baltic countries. I personally am tired of arguing.
            Many have ridden across Europe and this fact becomes their main supporting conclusion, i.e. "I want how they are .. behind the hillock !!!"
            But this does not happen: free cheese only in a mousetrap.
            One thing offends me: people are divided and they will begin to destroy individually! So, comrades Russians, brothers and friends, allies and fellow soldiers, some kind of unrest is coming.
            Ps now I will get a slap in the face from brothers - fellow countrymen, whose brains have already been set in the "European Dream" by the corrupt media. Yesterday, leaving the metro, they almost put an ad campaigning for joining the EU in their teeth and slipped another flag. He looked very nice, developing in the wind over the trash can. I wonder how many people appreciated such a not double comparison ???
            P.p.s By the way, Ukraine has already acquired one of the main fundamental similarities with European countries: a huge public debt to the IMF, i.e. the needle has already been planted, then worse!
        3. Simon
          Simon 30 October 2013 21: 39
          +5
          What story!!! They spat on a true, true story and came up with their own. What, do not remember, their relatives are not Slavs, not Kievan Rus, but some other nation, but they are to blame for everything, although under the Union they lived better than the Russians.
          1. atalef
            atalef 30 October 2013 21: 42
            +2
            Quote: Simon
            What story!!! They spat on a true, true story and came up with their own.

            That's because they made fun of where you will find the REAL, TRUE .... HISTORY.
            Wash more than history, not one science, do not fuck.
            1. In the book
              In the book 1 November 2013 11: 51
              +1
              I don’t understand, but why are they being minuscule? What's wrong.
              They rewrite history as they want.
          2. Setrac
            Setrac 30 October 2013 23: 53
            -2
            Quote: Simon
            What story!!! They spat on a true, true story

            Do you mean the story that the Germans wrote for Russia?
            1. Oberst_71
              Oberst_71 31 October 2013 14: 03
              0
              What a story there! The very word history is from the Torah! So who writes the story!
              1. Setrac
                Setrac 31 October 2013 19: 57
                +2
                Quote: Oberst_71
                What a story there! The very word history is from the Torah! So who writes the story!

                This is a story for Jews - from the Torah, for Russians - a story from antiquity.
          3. Tarik2017
            Tarik2017 1 November 2013 22: 49
            -3
            Specifically registered to respond to this article. And for a few comments. One of them is yours ...
            Our relatives are still Slavs. And it all started with Kievan Rus. And we lived under the USSR as a whole better than the Russians. Better yet, the Balts lived. And the Georgians lived well ... Yes, and the Armenians seem to be too ... So what?
            Do you think that if we are from fraternal, very close peoples, we must live with you in the same huts and dance to your tune, and not to our kobza?
            I live in Kharkov and often ride to Belgorod by type of activity. Only 120 km, but you really feel like in another country. And I do not want to categorically in your country. At least beat me. We are different. Yes, we speak very similar languages, yes we have a lot in common history, but we perceive life in completely different ways.
            For some reason, for some reason, it always seems to you that we are your younger brothers and you should command us, albeit defend us. And they tell you this on TV ... Czechs, Poles, Serbs, Bulgarians, Slovaks, Moldavians, Prussians are also Slav brothers, but you are pulling yourself into an alliance and trying to crush you, for some reason you are trying to just us.
            What are your threats about preventing our products from entering your market? Escapades and bans Onishchenko? Selling gas to Ukraine at a price higher than to Germany. Are these fraternal gestures? Do you love us so much? Do you wish us well?
            Most Ukrainians and nafig did not give up Europe, but Russia is useless. We just want to live our own way - quietly, calmly, without the expectation that the great elder brother would hit his head and gas, for example, would become 100500 thousand altogether. Going to Europe is an attempt to protect your own so that it does not become yours. There wouldn’t be your kookies, for a long time Ukraine would have been in the Customs Union. Even under Yushchenko and Tymoshenko.
            And Yanukovych has no choice but to tick away from such "older" brothers to Europe. Although if you take the story, it’s not clear why the Russians became elders ... There was Kievan Rus and op-pa Moscow suddenly became the eldest. The couple does not grow together ...
            1. melan
              melan 4 November 2013 17: 03
              0
              Older brothers ... command ... kooky ... You are weaving the rubbish that Ukrainian politicians are rubbing. Try at least a little to sort out the economic issue. And then, except - we are different! want to live separately! there are no other arguments. Have you been living separately for 20 years? Has it become better?
              1. Tarik2017
                Tarik2017 4 November 2013 22: 30
                +1
                Justify, be so kind, where is the nonsense in my words?
                Let's take together the same notorious economic issue. Begin, I will try to answer.
                over 20 years of life separately, I personally became more comfortable. Explain why?
                1. rpek32
                  rpek32 6 November 2013 05: 28
                  0
                  command. who to command? by whom? complete nonsense. you ask an ordinary Russian - do you need to command Ukraine? Do you think that he will answer you.
            2. Macedonian
              Macedonian 5 November 2013 19: 59
              +1
              (I want to note right away that a lot of what I said below does not apply personally to the author of this comment, it is more a cry of the soul after the article I read and the comments on it.) I agree with your opinion in many ways, but I would like to note how much we all have Ukrainians and Russians having brains those in power clans that we are ready to cut our throats for gas, for oil, for supposedly independence and so on, to which ordinary citizens of our countries have nothing to do, because this has long been not ours but of family-oligarchic clans (FSBeshnyh, gangster, MVDeshny, judges, prosecutors, etc.) In fact, it is not so important in which of the unions to belong or be outside the blocs, but it is much more important to learn to unite and assert their rights at the level of housing offices, regional departments, district hospitals, tax inspections, traffic cops and many , many, many others. (By the way, they live better in Europe just because they learned to defend their rights)
              It’s not for nothing that it’s said to divide and conquer what they’re doing with us, and we, like a stupid fish, swallow bait and reason with a smart look about global problems in politics, economics, history, without enough information or knowledge for this. the landing, then we’ll live well, and not envy each other, and find out who owes to whom and who has stolen from whom, who is the most Slavic of all Slavs, whose Russia (Kiev or Moscow), who has sweets or sausage more chemistry (there is plenty of it in the Russian, Ukrainian, Belorussian, and European because it is not a matter of national pride, but the desire for the profits of their producers.)
              They are amazed at the pseudo-patriots who scream at every corner about their love for Russia, Ukraine, the Slav brothers, at the same time mercilessly rob their relatives, because the bastards have no homeland, their capital has long been offshore, families in the best corners of the planet, and they don’t give a damn what we eat, what we breathe, what we drink. For them, it's just a territory with resources.
              I want to believe that I reached out to someone’s soul, and we will begin to change the world from ourselves and our environment. I wish you good and kind neighbors hi
        4. roial
          roial 30 October 2013 23: 27
          -14 qualifying.
          I read another horror story, several questions appeared, the author writes
          No matter how you say "European integration", there will no longer be plants from this, the number of jobs will not increase.

          and immediately concludes
          By the way, you need to understand that the number of jobs, and hence the incomes of citizens of Ukraine will only decrease

          I would like to know on the basis of what he made such a conclusion ??
          Go ahead
          will not be able to sell their products (if they do not comply with European GOSTs and regulations) not only in Europe, but also inside Ukraine itself.

          Here I hung for a good five minutes, but did not understand why, a little google nashol.
          Clause 8 of Article 56 of the Association Agreement states "Ukraine will gradually introduce a set of European standards (EN) as national standards, in particular, European standards have been harmonized, the voluntary application of which will be deemed to comply with the requirements of the legislation specified in Appendix III to this Agreement. Simultaneously with such use , Ukraine to abolish conflicting national standards, in particular the application of interstate standards (GOST), developed before 1992. In addition to this, Ukraine should gradually take other necessary measures to fulfill the conditions of membership in accordance with the requirements applicable to full members of European Standards Organizations. "

          Question to the author WHY TIME ???

          In addition, Ukraine is committed to introduce these new technical regulations. FOR ONE YEAR.

          I didn’t find such information at all.

          If Julia goes free, the threat to Yanukovych becomes huge

          And what is this threat expressed in?
          1. Setrac
            Setrac 30 October 2013 23: 57
            +6
            Quote: roial
            I would like to know on the basis of what he made such a conclusion ??

            Ukraine in the Russian market, due to the introduction of customs restrictions, will lose an advantage over European goods, in addition, it will lose the opportunity to compete on an equal footing with vehicle manufacturers, the conclusion is closed plants, loss of jobs.
            1. roial
              roial 31 October 2013 00: 29
              -4
              Ukraine in the Russian market, due to the introduction of customs restrictions, will lose an advantage over European goods


              Why's that? Or do you think that now the duties on Ukrainian goods are less than on goods produced in the EU ?? If so, give examples.
              1. Setrac
                Setrac 31 October 2013 01: 05
                +8
                Quote: roial
                Why's that? Or do you think that now the duties on Ukrainian goods are less than on goods produced in the EU ??

                So you yourself didn’t even try to figure out hu from hu? Why are you even here if you are not interested?
          2. brr7710
            brr7710 31 October 2013 06: 17
            +3
            Well, compare with Latvia, see where the main population of Latvia works, where the Latvian youth goes to work. And everything will become clear to you.
          3. Oberst_71
            Oberst_71 31 October 2013 14: 04
            -1
            the basis is, Lithuania, Estonia.
        5. randomizer
          randomizer 30 October 2013 23: 55
          0
          This does not teach us - Mazep needs to be cleaned. It seems to be cruel, but this will allow in the future not to lose more.
          1. Tarik2017
            Tarik2017 3 November 2013 23: 34
            +1
            And what do you know about Mazepa, besides what is written in the history textbook?
        6. yurii p
          yurii p 31 October 2013 09: 30
          +1
          "It's sad that history doesn't teach us anything, our Ukrainian brothers." ................ why did you decide that they are brothers, judging by their actions, they do not even pull good neighbors ...
          1. Anper
            Anper 31 October 2013 11: 20
            +4
            Moreover, work is going on at all levels. To listen to Ukrainian football commentators is a joy not only because Ukraine wins or loses, but also because Russia loses in the next match. And we watch Russian sports channels - so there are still commentators never even maliciously spoke out about the defeat. Guberniev at the biathlon in general, in my opinion, any victory both Belarusians and Ukrainians rejoices as Russian. And the presentation of Klitschko’s win was very peculiar. This, of course, does not mean that everyone thinks so, BUT THE TREND is CLEAR.
            1. So_o_tozh
              So_o_tozh 31 October 2013 12: 57
              -3
              Moreover, work is going on at all levels. To listen to Ukrainian football commentators is a joy not only because Ukraine wins or loses, but also because Russia loses in the next match at that time.

              Are there any examples? Or is it so easy to touch? I have football with Ukrainian teams in Russian. I like to watch TV just because of a good commentator.

              And we watch Russian sports channels - so there commentators have never even sarcastically commented on the defeat. Guberniev at the biathlon in general, in my opinion, any victory both Belarusians and Ukrainians rejoices as Russian.

              Glad for Russian sports channels))

              And the presentation of Klitschko’s win was very peculiar. This, of course, does not mean that everyone thinks so, BUT THE TREND is CLEAR.

              Submission by whom or by what? The trend is clear than or to whom? You? I do not understand the nefica. The campaign is told by your wounded national pride, this nada in Ukraine is the strongest boxers in the world - the Klitschko brothers, the best footballer - Shevchenko, the strongest strongman - Virastyuk ... You are my friend just like a bear from a joke: And I, and I, and I will give you all ... s
          2. In the book
            In the book 1 November 2013 11: 53
            +1
            Quote: yurii p
            "It's sad that history doesn't teach us anything, our Ukrainian brothers." ................ why did you decide that they are brothers, judging by their actions, they do not even pull good neighbors ...


            So we agreed, started for health, finished for peace winked
          3. True
            True 5 November 2013 15: 51
            +2
            No, well, puten and personally you are dearer to Chechens and the like, but do not speak for everyone!
      2. Vadivak
        Vadivak 30 October 2013 16: 19
        +1
        Quote: ...
        Do you know what percentage is today for those involved in the business? Money can be borrowed at 25% per annum.


        This is, to put it mildly, not true. It depends on the refinancing rate and the client’s turnover. If a profitable business is given at 8-10% per annum. The guarantee of course will be real estate and means of production.
        1. Ascetic
          Ascetic 30 October 2013 17: 28
          +6
          Quote: Vadivak
          . It depends on the refinancing rate and the client’s turnover. If a profitable business is given at 8-10% per annum. The guarantee of course will be real estate and means of production.


          Let us assume a loan rate for equipment in Ukraine from 19 to 25%. Auto loan from 18 to 25% is if in hryvnia. in dollars an average of 13-15%. Overdraft ((individual entrepreneurs and legal entities with annual sales up to 250 million hryvnias) up to 22% per annum.
          Our Sberbank overdraft is leased with a 10,38% discount with a loan term of 6 months. The final interest rate depends on the financial condition of the Borrower. That is, it can be either reduced or increased, but not more than the consumer loan rate. And let’s say a loan for small business in Sberbank (“Business Trust”), the rate of about 14% for the first year
          1. Vadivak
            Vadivak 30 October 2013 19: 44
            +3
            Quote: Ascetic
            Our Sberbank overdraft is leased with a 10,38% discount with a loan term of 6 months.


            There are long loans in the savings, I repeat which security depends on
          2. Alexss
            Alexss 30 October 2013 21: 33
            +6
            if the real rate for business were there, then all of Russian business would already be with you! the real rate in Russia is 60-120% depending on the bank, and everything says that in Ukraine it’s about the same)
            1. atalef
              atalef 30 October 2013 21: 46
              +4
              Quote: AlexSS
              the real rate in Russia is 60-120% depending on the bank, and everything says that in Ukraine it’s about the same)

              Get fucked up, and they tell us if the loan interest rate of 8% is already bondage. and at 12% it can only take a full I.D.O.T.
              1. Oberst_71
                Oberst_71 31 October 2013 14: 12
                0
                and whose banks it is.
              2. Witch
                Witch 31 October 2013 15: 01
                0
                Quote: atalef
                Get fucked up, and they tell us if the loan interest rate of 8% is already bondage. and at 12% it can only take a full I.D.O.T.


                And we live, a couple of years ago there was even a joke damnation - so that they give you a mortgage at 25% ....
              3. True
                True 5 November 2013 15: 58
                +1
                All normal people already have three passports: American, Israeli and the colony country in which they have to work.
            2. randomizer
              randomizer 31 October 2013 00: 15
              +4
              In Ukraine, the same thing - above comments are written by people who took loans maximum for a vacuum cleaner and do not understand the difference between consumer and targeted loans.
            3. In the book
              In the book 1 November 2013 11: 57
              0
              Quote: AlexSS
              the real rate in Russia is 60-120% depending on the bank, and everything says that in Ukraine it’s about the same)

              Website Bank VBR (Ukraine)
              Conditions and rates:
              Client is a legal entity;
              loan term - up to 24 months;
              loan currency - UAH, USD;
              loan amount - from 50% of the market value of the pledged item;
              interest rates - from 19% per annum in UAH, 12% per annum in US dollars;
              base commission - 1% (one-time);
          3. atalef
            atalef 30 October 2013 21: 50
            +9
            Quote: Ascetic
            . Auto loan from 18 to 25% is if in hryvnias. in dolars an average of 13-15%

            I agree . I have a father-in-law in Kiev at such interest rates took a loan on a wheelbarrow (despite the fact that he had money) and the fact that his wife was generally a booger. I heard fucked up. a month later (due to the fall of the hryvnia), the interest jumped out more than 25%, and if my wife and I didn’t pay it back. then they probably would have paid it for another 5 years (as a result, having paid 3 cars) or grandmas would have been knocked down in the subway crossings.
            How can you take loans at such interest rates? we do not want to take a mortgage at 4% - it's expensive. and here 25%, that we are not friends with mathematics?
          4. randomizer
            randomizer 31 October 2013 00: 12
            0
            Do not confuse loans to the population from a foreign bank for the purchase of a foreign car from loans for production or trade for a short-term commodity market, or at least
            1. atalef
              atalef 31 October 2013 08: 02
              +1
              Quote: Randaltor
              Do not confuse loans to the population from a foreign bank for the purchase of a foreign car from loans for production or trade for a short-term commodity market, or at least

              never dkmal that there is a difference, we have a loan for a car (from the store) without interest at all
        2. Ascetic
          Ascetic 30 October 2013 18: 04
          +3
          Vadim! YARSs are already taking you to Novosib. Meet me!
          1. Vadivak
            Vadivak 30 October 2013 19: 49
            +3
            Quote: Ascetic
            Vadim! YARSs are already taking you to Novosib. Meet me!

            Stas thanks of course. If you tell me, then I'm much farther south, but my father and grandfather were from the Krasnoyarsk Territory. Commune "death of property".
        3. Millibyte
          Millibyte 30 October 2013 18: 30
          +3
          Yes Yes Yes! AZLK was also "refinanced" in Moscow. And in Russia there are innumerable "profitable loans". Capitalism is only interested in destroying competitors - teach Karl Marx!
          1. morpex
            morpex 30 October 2013 20: 08
            0
            Quote: Millibyte
            Yes Yes Yes! AZLK was also "refinanced" in Moscow. And in Russia there are innumerable "profitable loans". Capitalism is only interested in destroying competitors - teach Karl Marx!

            But Marx also said that capitalism is impossible without loans. The more loans, the faster it develops ....
          2. Vadivak
            Vadivak 30 October 2013 20: 37
            +5
            Quote: Millibyte
            Yes Yes Yes! In Moscow, AZLK was also "refinanced"


            Phew REFINANCE RATE The interest rate at which the country's Central Bank provides loans to commercial banks. The current Bank of Russia refinancing rate for October 2013 is 8,25%. So they will give at least 10%.


            AZLK bankrupted Luzhok and Astaryan, to please Renault there was such a car that Renault could not even dream of AZLK 2139 "Arbat" 1987 The car had a transforming salon with swiveling front seats, which, in addition, had adjustable cushion length, multifunction steering wheel, electronic instrument cluster engine front driving wheels; front engine equipped with a 175 hp fuel injection system; .s / 414-413 kW). he was awarded one gold and 65 silver medals at the Exhibition of Economic Achievements of the USSR. There was also AZLK Moskvich-47,8 82. There was also a sports car AZLK 85 "Yauza", AZLK 60,3 "Istra" A single side door opened upwards. The declared fuel consumption with a diesel engine is 62,5-8 l / 3733 km. \

            And all because They weren’t needed by the new government, Renault rolled back everything.
        4. randomizer
          randomizer 31 October 2013 00: 07
          +3
          8-10 per annum. Have you considered insurance, all kinds of commissions? What will be the estimated value of real estate and means of production, how much of the market value will give real money? 40 percent? So it runs - you have machines and apartments for milen tanks. will give a thousand 400. With all the insurance and commissions run up to almost 30% per annum. I will not lay out the analysis here - believe me, it happens more. This is the so-called hidden percentage. Answer - how much do you need to earn to get it all back? The answer is if you are not friendly with the government, go to work, serf!
          1. Vadivak
            Vadivak 31 October 2013 09: 29
            +1
            Quote: Randaltor
            8-10 per annum. Have you considered insurance, all kinds of commissions?


            You have actually described a fact that exists in nature. For my part, I want to say that the case you described takes place in credit institutions like "Fast money" God forbid from them. Large sharks like VTB, Raiffeisen, Sber can afford a low percentage if they see a fat cat. And if, as you wrote, you are friends with the authorities, then you can not return loans at all, because as they say in those circles, only a coward pays loans.
      3. Luger
        Luger 30 October 2013 17: 02
        23
        I also thought at first, why Ukraine in the EU? we are brothers! Like, even the insult was somewhere recourse , then I thought damn well, since we are brothers, we must be glad for the fraternal people that they are going to change and, as God says, to help (note not Russia). I think then everything will be sad, as a result, Eastern Ukraine will join us, but we don’t need to. Let these evil Ukrainian nationalists from western Ukraine endure the EU’s brain, and their neighbors beloved Poles and Hungarians.
        1. Basarev
          Basarev 30 October 2013 17: 45
          +7
          It seems that a bunch of corrupt officials cannot afford to spend on the Exclusion Zone. They really think that the EU will take over the maintenance of the Zone.
        2. Dilshat
          Dilshat 30 October 2013 18: 22
          +3
          The campaign here was not without betrayal of Yanukovych’s entourage. Someone knows how advanced the technology of NLP in the West is. This is my version. I cannot find other reasons.
      4. randomizer
        randomizer 30 October 2013 23: 54
        0
        Like Senya Rabbit something can ... Once and urged Russia to comply!
    2. seller trucks
      seller trucks 30 October 2013 15: 28
      12
      Quote: shtanko.49
      As the head of the people, you need to think about your place in history.


      Starikov, as always (+), but he was wise about the "place in history", the main principle of any Ukrainian politician is "nazaryuvats and vtikty"
      1. Scoun
        Scoun 30 October 2013 18: 33
        12
        Quote: seller trucks
        (+), but he was wise about the "place in history"

        Nope .. I didn’t make it, but just pointed a finger ...
        2. As the head of the people, you need to think about your place in history. It’s difficult, but for a politician at the level of the head of the country it’s absolutely necessary, otherwise you can not get into history, but get into it.

        as an example - Yushchenko "hit" tagged hit .. bastards.
        Yanukovych will soon get on the way, Putin came in and Medvedev got in.
        IMHA
        1. True
          True 5 November 2013 16: 08
          +1
          And the tip will hit, as soon as it turns out that everything is squandered and tarnished.
      2. In the book
        In the book 30 October 2013 18: 40
        +5
        The phrase from the article "As the head of the people, you need to think about your place in history" suggests that the author of this article does not fully represent the phenomenon called "Yanukovych".
        To begin with, he became the "head" of the people, partly by rigging the voting results with the help of his Pokémon locally, and partly by deceiving people who piously believed in his promises of "loss" (Russian - "improvement"). Let's continue by saying that "thinking about his place in history" is clearly not relevant to him. He thinks only about how to fill the purse while he has the opportunity, so there is a "loss" in Ukraine, only you know who. Then I will note that the meaning of the word "history" here would be more suitable in a different context: "bad story", "funny story", etc. As a young man, a couple of times already plunged into "history" (a couple, because the third seemed to be hushed up)
      3. Gronsky
        Gronsky 30 October 2013 19: 14
        +4
        In Ukraine it is called "nakoladuvati". Well, then, naturally, and vtikty, this is sacred. wink
      4. Galan
        Galan 30 October 2013 19: 24
        +3
        Only the Russian border should be closed for them. Let the "democratic West" deal with them
        1. ty60
          ty60 30 October 2013 21: 20
          +3
          cut off migrant workers. knock down prices Russians. Ready to work for half the price. In terms of the course and prices in Ukraine, it’s profitable for them. We don’t!
          1. vanaheym
            vanaheym 31 October 2013 04: 56
            -1
            A friend of mine works on the exterior decoration of cottages for a salary of 45000 rubles per month.
            For most Ukrainians working in construction - this is quite acceptable money. For Russians, this is probably a miserable penny and they are waiting for such a job at least 90000 rubles? That is their right. Again, for some reason, you don’t see people who want to work as janitors, minibuses (add the necessary ones) - probably Ukrainians and Tajiks took away jobs from a Russian person who wants to work? Or maybe just a real imperial wants to work only in a comfortable office, get 5k for a knock on the keyboard and drive her beloved Ford, and let every *** person work with her hands?
            1. Vitlek
              Vitlek 31 October 2013 13: 04
              +3
              I live in a small village (Bryansk region), the salary is 4-6 thousand rubles / month. at a dying foundry, minibuses in the village are not needed (he’s small), janitors too (we don’t have sidewalks) what is a cozy office ?, what are 90 rubles?
            2. Oberst_71
              Oberst_71 31 October 2013 14: 17
              +1
              it depends on what kind of Russians. in the majority receive 20 000-25 000 TR therefore, I am somewhat surprised.
      5. morpex
        morpex 30 October 2013 20: 13
        +3
        Quote: seller trucks
        Quote: shtanko.49
        As the head of the people, you need to think about your place in history.


        Starikov, as always (+), but he was wise about the "place in history", the main principle of any Ukrainian politician is "nazaryuvats and vtikty"

        Actually, the people of Ukraine think that the current government has a place in history. IN THE HANDBOOK ... negative
        1. vanaheym
          vanaheym 31 October 2013 04: 58
          +3
          Ideally - I really want them to finish like Ceausescu, by the wall
    3. DEMENTIY
      DEMENTIY 30 October 2013 15: 28
      30
      Lord! What are you speaking about! What a referendum, what the fate of the people! Why are all these "facts"? Our scumbags don't give a damn about all this. Do your thing - block imports, set prepayments, visa regime, etc. etc. - there will be more sense. In general, all this had to be done before and it was all sad and disgusting.
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 15: 45
        15
        Quote: DEMENTIY
        Do your job - block imports, set prepayments, visa regime, etc. etc. - there will be more sense.

        Well, already on the news, every day about Ukraine, special programs dedicated specifically to signing with the EU. So judging by the news, Russia has launched an info-offensive on Ukraine. There will be more closer to the summit. Yes, and gas has again gone graters.
        1. Hudo
          Hudo 30 October 2013 15: 49
          12
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Quote: DEMENTIY
          Do your job - block imports, set prepayments, visa regime, etc. etc. - there will be more sense.

          Well, already on the news, every day about Ukraine, special programs dedicated specifically to signing with the EU. So judging by the news, Russia has launched an info-offensive on Ukraine. There will be more closer to the summit. Yes, and gas has again gone graters.


          The main thing is that Putin does not stop half a road on this issue, "after consulting with partners."
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 15: 54
            32
            Quote: Hudo

            The main thing is that Putin does not stop half a road on this issue, "after consulting with partners."

            No, it won't stop. The stakes are too high. I do not know how, but Putin will beat both the EU and Yanukovych.
            1. DEMENTIY
              DEMENTIY 30 October 2013 16: 00
              14
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              Quote: Hudo

              The main thing is that Putin does not stop half a road on this issue, "after consulting with partners."

              No, it won't stop. The stakes are too high. I do not know how,but Putin will beat both the EU and Yanukovych.


              Your speeches to God for a meeting!
              1. Kars
                Kars 30 October 2013 16: 04
                +1
                Quote: DEMENTIY
                Your speeches to God for a meeting!

                why are you personally happy?
                Putin’s victory can be only in one case - during the collapse of the Ukrainian economy, there are no other options. And then the Russian aligarchs will buy everything for nothing and will ruin why they are competitors. (Ukrainian industry is not an EU competitor, namely Russia, we have similar technologies, and do almost the same thing)
                1. Ingvar 72
                  Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 16: 22
                  15
                  Quote: Kars
                  Putin's victory can only be in one case - in the collapse of the Ukrainian economy, there are no other options.

                  You yourself answered. By joining the EU, Ukraine will lose most of its contracts with Russia. And this will lead her to economic collapse. And with Putin, according to your logic, he will win.
                  1. Alexander Romanov
                    Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 16: 36
                    14
                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    And with Putin, according to your logic, he will win.

                    Well, for the victory, men drinks ......... laughing
                  2. Kars
                    Kars 30 October 2013 16: 40
                    +1
                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    By joining the EU, Ukraine will lose most of its contracts with Russia

                    And for what reason, in addition to Putin personally, will these contracts be lost? Do you think that instead of the wagons that were delivered earlier, there will be CHEAP European ones with a re-tagged tag?
                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    And this will lead her to economic collapse.

                    Or maybe he won’t. And then Putin will not only lose, but also lose his face.
                    Quote: Ingvar 72
                    And with Putin, according to your logic, he will win.

                    this is not my logic but Putin.
                    1. hrych
                      hrych 30 October 2013 17: 30
                      19
                      There are Europeans here named Greeks, so the EU can hardly give them credit, although the population of Hellas is much smaller. So a prerequisite for a loan (remember, a loan is not a gift, but money for a while at interest) is a reduction in government spending, and this is the dismissal of employees, an increase in taxes, a reduction in social programs and an increase in the retirement age. You can at least talk about Putin's victories now, but if the common population of Ukraine allows this to happen now, then later it will weep with burning tears, everything will be aggravated by the trade war with Russia and the so-called CU, which will lead to the disappearance of the promising market for Ukrainian goods (and let me remind you that even a short time of absence from the market leads to irrevocable substitution by local and not only manufacturers, a typical case with "Bush's Feet", they were limited for a short time, then for God's sake, but the place has already been taken all over). Painfully sorry for "Antonov", which will bend without Russia, and the EU aircraft industry itself is in a deep anus and will not tolerate a new competitor. The example of social unrest in Greece has not yet been burdened by the problems of dividing the state along ethnic lines (although some talk about a single Ukrainian ethnic group), and this is fraught with blood.
                      1. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 30 October 2013 18: 25
                        20
                        Quote: hrych
                        There are such Europeans by the name of the Greeks,


                        And also by the name of the Hungarians, who promised prosperity and received an average salary of 400 euros, unemployment among young people under 24 years of age up to 40% (total 11%) and compulsory community service. Promised foreign investmentAt the time of the collapse of the social camp, about two thousand large enterprises were state-owned. They were the foundation of the country's social stability. Now there are less than 100. The rest have gone under the hammer. To foreigners. The treasury from privatization received $ 11 billion, which it quickly and safely consumed. Now sits on loans, increasing national debt. The latter today reached 80% of GDP. In Hungary, 30 thousand foreign enterprises. All of them have a ten-year tax credit regime. Exactly as much as they usually exist. Earned taken home. They said that Hungarians feed the whole of Europe.So it was until the end of the 80s of the last century. However, since those blessed times, the situation has changed dramatically. Since joining the EU, agricultural production has fallen by 9,5 times. It turned out that Hungarian farmers could not stand the competition in the vast and common European market. Along the way, they were deprived of their internal. Due to product mismatch with European standards. Unemployment in some agricultural areas of the republic reaches 100%. Promised the rule of lawHungary is among the leaders of the European Union. According to the level of corruption. It has become so familiar that one third of the top management of the three hundred largest companies in Hungary, without embarrassment, admitted that they are ready to accept the corruption proposal if the rollback is not less than 10% of the transaction. The survey was conducted by the Hungarian Chamber of Commerce and Industry together with the Ernst & Young consulting agency.
                        Now the Hungarians are storming the National Bank and striving to free themselves from the guardianship of the IMF.
                        Hungary connects high hopes for overcoming the crisis with Russia, from which it thoughtlessly distanced itself during the entire period of “exemplary European integration”. The new Hungarian Economy Minister Gyula Plesinger has repeatedly stated the need to restart relations with Russia. Hungary relies both on Russian loans, not related to political conditions, unlike IMF loans, and on a colossal sales market for Hungarian goods in Russia.
                        Now new Europeans are next in turn, of course, everything will be different. not like some Greeks or Hungarians.
                        link
                      2. hrych
                        hrych 30 October 2013 18: 37
                        17
                        Your words again confirm the thesis that the destruction of the Warsaw block and the USSR is not for the new states, but for their capture. And the newly-minted Europeans in the form of Lithuanians clean the toilet bowls of despicable Irish and cannot understand that this is slavery. The Germans in World War II brought ostarbeiters to Germany from the occupied territories, and now exactly the same Latvians are traveling at their own expense, and they are also smiling. It’s like a hypnosis of a boa constrictor, when the victim herself goes into her mouth and rejoices, that’s what psycho-war or the war of psychos means.
                      3. vanaheym
                        vanaheym 31 October 2013 05: 06
                        +3
                        Well, that is, for example - if Tajiks / Kazakhs / Uzbeks / Ukrainians / Moldovans clean glasses / build / repair / drive minibuses and do other work that is not stylish for an indigenous person in Russia - this is friendship of peoples.
                        But if the Lithuanians do the same in Ireland for a larger sum - this is slavery. So it turns out?
                      4. saber
                        saber 31 October 2013 10: 39
                        +1
                        do not confuse Moscow with Russia!
                      5. Oberst_71
                        Oberst_71 31 October 2013 14: 19
                        +2
                        come on. we said goodbye to friendship back in 1991. Rather, after the referendum of 1991, when the people said yes, but no three morons!
                  3. rolik
                    rolik 30 October 2013 19: 02
                    15
                    Quote: Ascetic
                    And also by the name of the Hungarians,

                    And also the Bulgarians. There, too, a white and fluffy animal came to visit.
                  4. The comment was deleted.
                2. xan
                  xan 31 October 2013 18: 44
                  +1
                  Ascetic, thanks!
                  All Ukrainians read Ascetic’s post 50 times.
                  Under socialism, in terms of per capita GDP, Hungary was the third among the socialist countries and included in the 20 most developed countries of the world.
            2. Ingvar 72
              Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 18: 38
              +3
              Quote: Kars
              And for what reason, in addition to Putin personally, will these contracts be lost? Do you think that instead of the wagons that were delivered earlier, there will be CHEAP European ones with a re-tagged tag?

              Putin has nothing to do with it, any self-respecting state will use economic levers for political purposes. Russia for Ukraine is the most important economic partner, and Ukraine for Russia is just one of many. Judge for yourself who will lose more. I am surprised at the behavior of Yanukovych when he presses his country into the EU. Do you think that they are waiting for you on equal terms?
              Quote: Kars
              Or maybe he won’t. And then Putin will not only lose, but also lose his face.

              Yes, he will not lose anything, he will even present defeat as a victory, the KGB School. So even ssy in the eye ...
              1. Kars
                Kars 30 October 2013 19: 01
                +1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Putin has nothing to do with it, any self-respecting state will use economic levers for political purposes

                It turns out precisely because of the POLITICAL incursion of the Russian Federation that Ukrainian-Russian economic relations will have problems not caused by economic prerequisites? And it is PUTIN, not the state.
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                . Russia for Ukraine is the most important economic partner, and Ukraine for Russia is just one of many. Judge for yourself who will lose more.

                If gas is removed from trade, the Russian Federation is not such an important partner. Moreover, the Russian Federation does not want to be a partner, it wants to be the master.
                M is not a fact completely confused in the Russian Federation, where there are no special prospects, and every step is not regulated by the RULES, but by orders from above such as Onishchenko.
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Do you think that they are waiting for you on equal terms?
                More even than Putin is waiting for.

                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Yes, he won’t lose anything, he will even present defeat as a victory,

                We'll see.
              2. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 19: 32
                +9
                Quote: Kars
                It turns out precisely because of the POLITICAL incursion of the Russian Federation that the Ukrainian-Russian economic relations will have problems

                Again, you messed up everything, both in grammar and in the sense. Exactly because of the political creeps of Ukraine.
                Quote: Kars
                If you remove gas from trade, the Russian Federation is not such an important partner

                You look at the statistics, a third of the Ukrainian economy is focused on Russia.
                Quote: Kars
                More even than Putin is waiting for.

                Why are you clinging to him, what does he have to do with it? Exactly how do you think?
              3. Kars
                Kars 30 October 2013 19: 47
                +1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Again, you messed up everything, both in grammar and in the sense. Exactly because of the political creeps of Ukraine.

                It’s not for you to point out what I’ve messed up. And Ukraine is an independent country, and by the way, in political terms, does the association with the EU on the FREE TRADE ZONE have a political incentive? Has the GDP refused its claims?
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                You look at the statistics, a third of the Ukrainian economy is focused on Russia.

                All is only a third? And where did you read that?

                Quote: Ingvar 72
                why are you clinging to him, what does he have to do with it? Exactly how do you think?

                And who is your OWNER? Who became the president for a third term?
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                Do you think that they are waiting for you on equal terms?
                Than GDP is waiting.
              4. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 20: 07
                +7
                Quote: Kars
                And who is your OWNER? Who became the president for a third term?

                We have no owners, we have a lord, a great and terrible PU. wassat Lord, yes you are probably already crimson with anger. Lie down, sleep, and everything will pass.
              5. Kars
                Kars 30 October 2013 20: 14
                +1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                We have no owners, we have a lord, a great and terrible PU

                Picture.
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                and you are probably already crimson with anger. Lie down, sleep, and everything will pass.

                No, I enjoy it.
              6. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 20: 51
                +5
                Quote: Kars
                No, I enjoy it.

                In the language of psychiatry, this is called masochism. lol
              7. Kars
                Kars 30 October 2013 21: 05
                +1
                Quote: Ingvar 72
                In the language of psychiatry, this is called masochism.

                Can you prove it reasonably?

                By the way, did you go to my profile? If not, go to 3 point read about yourself))))
              8. Ascetic
                Ascetic 31 October 2013 01: 13
                +9
                Quote: Kars
                By the way, did you go to my profile?


                The trolling is weak, the soldier, the tops grabbed ...beginner troll level
              9. Kars
                Kars 31 October 2013 12: 40
                +1
                Quote: Ascetic
                In trolling is rather weak

                This is how you say the master))

                Quote: Ascetic
                soldier

                Is this an insult?)))
                Quote: Ascetic
                .leading troll level

                So there is room to grow.
              10. Same lech
                Same lech 31 October 2013 12: 42
                +1
                marshals grappled - went fun smile
      2. fedorovith
        fedorovith 30 October 2013 21: 27
        +8
        We have yes, President, but you have a double-backed question?
      3. svp67
        svp67 30 October 2013 22: 09
        +4
        Quote: Kars
        no

        You better look at your country, the faces of the Presidents seem to be different, but things are the same, they push the whole country into the abyss ... so that he laughs well who laughs without consequences ...
      4. Kars
        Kars 30 October 2013 22: 16
        +1
        Quote: svp67
        DYNAMIC, pushing the whole country into the abyss ...

        I’m just interested in your understanding. The abyss is any action directed at independence and departure from the Kremlin line?

        While I personally do not see anything extraordinary, they try as much as they can and do not forget themselves to regret. I will hope that they are all the same for good reason have become richer and more influential than me.
      5. svp67
        svp67 30 October 2013 22: 23
        +3
        Quote: Kars
        Is the abyss any action aimed at independence and departure from the Kremlin line?

        In my understanding, this is that the country's leadership deliberately does everything to deprive its country of industry, that is, thousands of jobs, forcing people to survive. You will travel around Europe everywhere, on the roles of guest workers I work 8 from 10 Russian-speaking - from the territory of Ukraine. Your people themselves vote for your power - with their feet ...
        And honestly, do you strongly see that Belarus and Kazakhstan are strongly "dancing to the tune of the Kremlin"? do not make me laugh....
      6. Kars
        Kars 30 October 2013 22: 49
        +2
        Quote: svp67
        In my understanding, this is that the country's leadership deliberately does everything to deprive its country of industry,

        It does not do this.

        Quote: svp67
        You will travel across Europe everywhere, on the roles of guest workers I work 8 out of 10 Russian-speakers - from the territory of Ukraine.


        And so what? We have not yet signed up to the EU and have not signed an association.
        And the economic problems of all states without exception.
        Quote: svp67
        And honestly, do you strongly see that Belarus and Kazakhstan are strongly "dancing to the tune of the Kremlin"? do not make me laugh...

        I see that they are not particularly happy. And they are dancing - they began investigations on Roshen after stuffing from the Russian Federation, and did not find anything)))
  2. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 30 October 2013 22: 28
    +5
    Kars
    If gas is removed from trade, the Russian Federation is not such an important partner. Moreover, the Russian Federation does not want to be a partner, it wants to be the master.


    and Brussels, in your opinion, that offers to be an equal partner belay !! you agreement on association in the EU honor a lot there about equal partnership said here about what you owe to them and a lot of things said here this is full of box and about partnership even more equal there is no word there!
    it is with such an equal partnership Ukraine has every chance to survive until the very entry into the EU))
    Remember the commercial about Lenya and the partnership of 90)) and how it ended)
    media = http: // mmm golubkov 4]
  3. Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 22: 50
    +1
    Quote: regressSSSR
    you agreement on association in the EU honor m

    You have said it 5 times already.

    And to quote, the clause of the contract that so guarded you was not deigned. From which it follows that you were told about this by Glazyev (through the media) and you gossip.
  4. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 31 October 2013 00: 15
    +3
    Kars
    And to quote, the clause of the contract that so guarded you was not deigned. From which it follows that you were told about this by Glazyev (through the media) and you gossip.


    yes, if you please, I certainly didn’t odd and nakoy it to me)) there I suppose there are more than in the novel of Lev Nikolaevich (war and peace) and maybe all of his works combined smile and for the benefit of the read information and tago below zero)) and they are reading from the dogma and so on the net and the media are a dime a dozen, I think you all know them so the question is not that.
    I just wanted to ask you. Have you read it? Well you gathered there, neither can I and tell me what they promise then? real equal partnership belay ? and do you really believe that? or just chose between the two words the CU and the EU and the EU turned out to be more attractive (well, anywhere just away from Russia)) and equal partnerships are all beautiful words, aren't they?)
    ps (By the way, is he just a complete agreement about the esaciation in the EU of Ukraine in the public domain?)
  5. Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 00: 22
    +1
    Quote: regressSSSR
    yes, if you please, I certainly did odd and even nakoy it to me))

    So why vomit?
    Quote: regressSSSR
    beshchat then? real equal partnership

    they promise rules that abide by.

    Quote: regressSSSR
    ps (By the way, is he just a complete agreement about the esaciation in the EU of Ukraine in the public domain?)

    Did your auto-corrector turn off? You disgrace the Russian Federation, it's my thing to write like that)))
    I don’t know, I never really was interested. Our authorities are very close to business, and there are plenty of advocates, economists. Our legal department wrote a memorandum that the signing of the Association Agreement will increase tavaroorto by 18%. Two years ago, standardization under the EU passed .
  6. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 31 October 2013 01: 35
    +1
    kars
    So why vomit?


    tyk is nauseous)) I’m worried about fraternal Ukraine, how would it be without us in the EU if foreigners would not hurt fools) and even in Crimea it doesn’t take pleasure to travel across the border, yes it’s real, and it’s still not clear in my head that everything this is happening for the truth

    kars
    they promise rules that abide by.


    well that's right! not partnership, but the rules that are not only respected, but are also followed)! only they wrote the rules in Brussels and you are in Ukraine)) notice the difference! and then partnership! equal partnership! but where it was seen that in the EU there was equal tailoring!

    kars
    You dishonor the Russian Federation, this is my chip so to write)))

    ha ha by I write right now with Belarus I write)) okay, I leave this brand for you)

    kars
    You have said it 5 times already.


    and yes I’ll write tea the hand will not fall off))
    and what’s new here can be said here, and so it’s already all about the TS and EU of the Criminal Code and the Russian Federation, it has long been said that it remains only to look at the result

    kars
    About himself writes: Hobbies - bench modeling-armored vehicles 1:35
    Military history
    Trolling !!!
    and the casket just opened)) I'm sorry, I just just read about your hobby I will keep in mind hi

    ps.sars can a personal question have long wanted to be interested in are you playing in World of Tanks ??
  7. Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 12: 45
    +1
    Quote: regressSSSR
    tyk is sick)) I'm worried I understand for the fraternal

    Licensing.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    only now they write EU Bruxelles and you are doing Ukraine)) notice the difference!

    Why? What are the rules not written in Moscow? And what are the bad rules?
    And you (the Russian Federation) date in case of entry into the CU Ukraine the rule itself to establish?
    Quote: regressSSSR
    but where it was seen that in the EU there was equal tailoring!
    more exactly than with Moscow

    Quote: regressSSSR
    and yes I’ll write tea the hand will not fall off))

    it's a pity.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    Yes, and what’s new can be said here, and so it’s already all about the hardware and technology

    Are you sure that HERE said not a lie?
    Quote: regressSSSR
    ps.sars can a personal question have long wanted to be interested in are you playing in World of Tanks ??

    no
  8. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 1 November 2013 00: 34
    0
    kars
    measure


    take away! I also have relatives in Ukraine near Paltava and I do not care about their fate!
    and the fate of that land, which is the cradle of Russia, washed by the blood of many of our grandfathers and great-grandfathers over the past many centuries in many wars against the invaders, is far from being not indifferent, and now you propose to forget all this so calmly and give Europe in exchange it’s not clear what belay
    no excuse without a fight for nothing!
    (even if trading)!

    kars
    more equal than with Moscow


    wait and see wait is not long))

    kakrs
    it's a pity


    you will not laughing

    kars
    no


    Well, it’s right to spend time on toys here, I agree

    kars
    I did not go, even despite the fact that they offered 100 thousand rubles and a two-room apartment in Moscow. (Payment of the lease naturally)


    and here you’re either lying or disingenuous! or hate Russia so much that give you at least a million rubles and an apartment overlooking the kremol anyway are we all bastards ?? and probably if they would have called to geramony they would have flown and worked for three euros ?? I’m just one nepoyma with such an attitude to things, why are you here just forgot the meaning on this site ??
    and the most interesting right there write

    kars
    Well, why summarize - basically across the throat is the great empire policy of the Russian Federation with regard to Ukraine.


    here, too, weirdness seems to write that treat Russia not bad BUT! it means that you do not live under Russia under any conditions and the Great Empire Policy of Russia is not to your liking, but the Great Empire Policy of the USSR means normal, although you are only a little over 30 and the USSR, then you are really unhappy even if you always refer to it where is the logic? dissemble kars!
    Well, you write directly that you hate Russia and everything will fall into place!
    CHO TRANSFER FROM EMPTY TO EMPTY!
  9. Kars
    Kars 1 November 2013 01: 07
    +1
    Quote: regressSSSR
    take away!

    Quote: regressSSSR
    (even if trading)!

    What can I say, the lycimer, and still wants life for those for whom he is type .. ill ... complicate.
    A good way to lose everything.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    wait and see wait is not long))

    How will you see this? Compare with what?
    Quote: regressSSSR
    you will not

    I am patient.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    and here you’re either lying or disingenuous!
    Discussion. And the offer came to me by the way from the user VO (I myself have never looked for work in the Russian Federation)

    Quote: regressSSSR
    or hate Russia so much that give you at least a million rubles and an apartment with a view of the kremol, are we all the same bastards?

    you don’t have any logic in these proposals. Who are we? why did you think that I hate Russia? she hasn’t deserved such emotions from me yet. as long as she is squeamish about leadership and some concerned .. great Russians.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    I’m only one nepoyma with such an attitude to the things Cho, you just do it here then forgot the meaning on this site ??

    What do you want the Ukrainian-phobic reserve to be here? And the site wasn’t like that before. It used to be a military review, and now it’s 3/4 swamp.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    here, too, weirdness seems to write that treat Russia not bad BUT
    Better than for example to Poland.

    Quote: regressSSSR
    it means that you do not live in Russia under any conditions, and the Great Empire policy of Russia does not suit you

    strange in your opinion 100 tr is the ultimate dream? and the great empire policy is absolutely not to your taste.
    And for example, I’m not particularly chasing money, otherwise I would have gone to Kiev a long time ago.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    great empire policy of the USSR

    USSR is not the Russian Federation
    Quote: regressSSSR
    The USSR, then you are plainly and not caught, although you always refer to it where is the logic?

    According to your logic, you can only see what you saw / found PERSONALLY?
  10. Kars
    Kars 1 November 2013 01: 07
    +1
    Quote: regressSSSR
    dissemble kars!
    You are too limited a person, as I already pointed out to you when he was joking with your nickname.

    Quote: regressSSSR
    Well, you write directly that you hate Russia

    fi)))
    Quote: regressSSSR
    CHO TRANSFER FROM EMPTY TO EMPTY!

    your problems, you can stop writing nonsense and prove that low intelligence is inherent in .. the Great Russians ..
  11. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 1 November 2013 03: 46
    0
    kars
    You are too limited a person, as I already pointed out to you when he was joking with your nickname.


    your problems, you can stop writing nonsense and prove that low intelligence is inherent in .. the Great Russians ..

    do not judge and do not be judged
    Yes, the artist can offend everyone))
    but not in this case! it’s impossible to get me out of the saddle and even more so to get out of patience with this children's scribbling and don’t bother yourself; nothing will come of it; I will not buy it and I had to deal with such people!
    well, about intellect, I see you just do the same answer right away like a true Aryan, I remember they also considered everyone but themselves loved by a low level of intelligence, just like you, they considered all of us Ross together, and apparently you think that finally, an intellectual ego for a couple of conceit is directly the top creation of evolution, it’s interesting by the way what you measure it and how)) this is a clinic to consider yourself smarter than others, even communicating with someone and why you just got what to write about (nonsense) is only your prerogative of superintellectual you purchased this patent
    Well, do not want me to write to you okay, then I'll draw a cartoon for you (remember the quote from Matroskin otresovannaya Sharikova))
    -We feed him here, and he draws us fig-bam here))
  12. Kars
    Kars 2 November 2013 20: 28
    +1
    Quote: regressSSSR
    do not judge and do not be judged

    Who said?
    Quote: regressSSSR
    ! it’s impossible to get me out of the saddle and even more so to get out of patience with this children's scribbling and don’t bother yourself; nothing will come of it; I will not buy it and I had to deal with such people!

    the fact that you wrote it is enough to say that you not only flew out of the saddle, your horse also trampled you.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    Well, about intelligence, I see you just do the same for everyone
    and what to do if only such limited individuals assume Great Russian responsibility.

    Quote: regressSSSR
    true aryan
    just a fairly educated person with well-developed thinking and logic.

    Quote: regressSSSR
    smarter than others

    we communicate on the Internet, so you are what you write and nothing more.
    Quote: regressSSSR
    why did you just get what to write ohinea (nonsense) is just yours
    No, I don’t take it away from you. But you can cite the stupidity that I wrote, and justify that it is stupidity, build a chain of your thoughts that will prove that I wrote stupidity.
  13. Firstvanguard
    Firstvanguard 5 November 2013 16: 54
    0
    What do you want the Ukrainian-phobic reserve to be here? And the site wasn’t like that before. It used to be a military review, and now it’s 3/4 swamp.

    Not without your help sad
    Kars I really liked the discussions with your participation on tank topics, even though sometimes with some bias. But this squabble with the transition to personality, you greatly discredited yourself in my eyes ...
    Best regards hi
  14. Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 31 October 2013 06: 03
    +8
    Yeah, an equal partnership ... Between the priestess of love and the client repeat
  15. gladysheff2010
    gladysheff2010 31 October 2013 00: 42
    +3
    Sorry for the indiscreet question: what’s your birth year? I’m not so interested because I have seen such individuals among the workers: how much they blaspheme Russia and go to work at our own expense. This is mainly the case among young people who are washed brains. What is it that all of you are Russian across the throat? Is it a shame, or is it atavism for you and your kind?
  16. Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 12: 48
    +2
    Quote: gladysheff2010
    what year of birth are you?

    1982
    Quote: gladysheff2010
    Why do they blaspheme the light, but they themselves go to work at our expense

    I did not go, even despite the fact that they offered 100 thousand rubles and a two-room apartment in Moscow. (Payment of the lease naturally)
    Quote: gladysheff2010
    Well, so you all Russian across the throat?

    Well, why summarize - basically across the throat is the great empire policy of the Russian Federation with regard to Ukraine.
  17. Ulan
    Ulan 31 October 2013 16: 49
    0
    Quote: Kars
    but despite the fact that they offered 100 thousand rubles and a two-room apartment in Moscow. (Payment of the lease naturally)

    -----------------------------------------------
    Thank you for the joke. I laughed heartily.
  18. Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 17: 00
    +1
    Quote: Ulan
    Thank you for the joke. I laughed heartily.

    Laughter prolongs life. Use it. I hope it compensates for the shortening of your life from envy.
  19. Ulan
    Ulan 1 November 2013 08: 44
    0
    Have you decided to play the role of a jester? To your health. To envy a poor country, European Honduras? Continue to make the audience laugh.
  20. Kars
    Kars 2 November 2013 20: 30
    +1
    Quote: Ulan
    Have you decided to play the role of the jester?

    Are you so worried that you will take this role away? I do not pretend to calm down.
    Quote: Ulan
    Envy a poor country, European Honduras?

    What self-conceit.))) How are people in Yakutia not starving anymore?
  21. vanaheym
    vanaheym 31 October 2013 09: 01
    -1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Russia for Ukraine is the most important economic partner, and Ukraine for Russia is just one of many. Judge for yourself who will lose more.

    Ukraine for Russia is one of the largest buyers of gas and some other raw materials, which makes up about 70% of Russian exports to Ukraine.
    The raw materials export of Ukraine to Russia is about 20%, the rest is metals, products, equipment, machinery, etc., including engines for Russian KR like X-55 and so on.
  • rolik
    rolik 30 October 2013 18: 58
    10
    Quote: Kars
    And for what reason, in addition to Putin personally, will these contracts be lost? Do you think that instead of the wagons that were delivered earlier, there will be CHEAP European ones with a re-tagged tag?

    Russia will buy its wagons and INEXPENSIVE from Belarus, (maybe) China. Holy place, it will not be empty))))
    Quote: Kars
    Or maybe he won’t. And then Putin will not only lose, but also lose his face

    Or maybe it won’t. Time will tell ))))
    Quote: Kars
    t, namely Russia, we have similar technologies, and we do almost the same thing)

    The keyword is almost. But as they say, almost - it does not count.
    This means that Russia will calmly survive the absence of "high-tech" products from Ukraine. We are not in the red, but Ukraine ..... this is her business.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 19: 07
      +1
      Quote: rolik
      Russia will buy its wagons and INEXPENSIVE from Belarus, (maybe) China. Holy place, it will not be empty))))

      And who doubts?
      Quote: rolik
      The keyword is almost. But as they say, almost - it does not count.

      For many, this is invisible.
      Quote: rolik
      So Russia will calmly survive the lack of "high-tech" products from Ukraine

      So we need such a partner? Who’s going to get over it right away? Sense of such a cycle? It’s necessary to look for breakthroughs to other markets. Europe, China, the Middle East, Africa.
    2. rolik
      rolik 30 October 2013 19: 42
      +8
      Quote: Kars
      So we need such a partner? Who’s going to get over it right away? Sense of such a cycle? It’s necessary to look for breakthroughs to other markets. Europe, China, the Middle East, Africa.

      Duck and I are about the same, you do not need such a partner. Break into the markets of Europe, China, the Middle East and so on.
      That's just how bad it turns out. Or maybe, as in the famous expression about a bad dancer, the whole thing ??? I wonder what prevents Ukraine from taking and .... making its way ??))) Probably a neighbor with his great imprespect manners))))
    3. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 19: 57
      +1
      Quote: rolik
      Break into the markets of Europe, China, the Middle East and so on.

      We make our way.
      Quote: rolik
      I wonder what prevents Ukraine, to take and .... break through ??)))

      So he wrote that all 100% of Ukraine’s exports go only to the Russian Federation.
      Quote: rolik
      Probably a neighbor with his great empire manners))))

      And this, by the way, too. You veiled with your TS soared that now there will be problems with Belarus and Kazakhstan.
      Along the way, your product is the only way to sell, if you arrange a patronage yourself.
  • Estray_
    Estray_ 30 October 2013 20: 42
    +5
    For example, in the Leningrad Region in January 2012, in the presence of Vladimir Putin, a new Tikhvin Car-Building Plant was opened to produce a full technological cycle for the production of new-generation freight cars with improved operational characteristics. Over 30 billion rubles were invested in its construction. http://vz.ru/economy/2013/10/29/657266.html
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 20: 56
    +1
    Quote: Estray_
    Tikhvin Car-Building Plant for the production of a full technological cycle for the production of

    As you can see - moreover, what is the catch with the Russian Federation? Otherwise, don't let Obama)) we’ll also start selling cars to us)))
  • Setrac
    Setrac 30 October 2013 21: 36
    +9
    Quote: Kars
    So we need such a partner? Who will survive just a little?

    Of course, why Ukraine needs a partner who buys from Ukraine goods that the EU WILL NOT buy.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 21: 56
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    Of course, why Ukraine needs a partner who buys from Ukraine goods that the EU WILL NOT buy.

    It’s good that buyers do not end up in the EU. In fact, I would like to trade with the Russian Federation - but the Russian Federation is too unpredictable partner, it buys today, and tomorrow it’s just cheese and palm oil (even though it was not there in life) and there is nothing .
  • Setrac
    Setrac 31 October 2013 00: 10
    +2
    Quote: Kars
    It's good that buyers do not end in the EU.

    You contradict yourself, there is no need for "other" buyers to join the EU. Accession to the EU does not open up other markets for you, which is now in fact it will be.
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 00: 15
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    You contradict yourself, there is no need for "other" buyers to join the EU

    Unlike you, I don’t contradict myself, but you can prove it.
    Quote: Setrac
    Joining the EU does not open you to other markets, which is now in fact it will be.

    And I said that it opens up other markets? EU accession allows us to open the EU market wider.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 31 October 2013 01: 12
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    And I said that opens up other markets?

    Spoke.
    Quote: Kars
    It's good that buyers do not end in the EU.

    Here are your words.
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 12: 49
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    Spoke.
    Quote: Kars
    It's good that buyers do not end in the EU.
    Here are your words.
    Reply Quote Report Abuse



    It’s strange where it says that EU access opens up other markets? You will learn to read.
  • Botanologist
    Botanologist 30 October 2013 22: 05
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    Do you think that instead of the wagons that used to be delivered, there will be CHEAP European with a re-tagged tag?


    What kind of cars did you recall? I often ride to Moscow - Simferopol, Moscow - Krivoy Rog, so these cars of the year with 1980 were not even washed. Only new in Russian Railways, Russian production.

    Quote: Kars
    Or maybe it won’t.


    Killer argument.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 22: 17
      +1
      Quote: Botanologist
      I often ride

      I hope not in commodity?
      Quote: Botanologist
      Killer argument.

      do you have better
    2. Setrac
      Setrac 31 October 2013 00: 14
      +4
      Quote: Kars
      I hope not in commodity?

      I work on the railway. Passenger trains come with new cars. and freight trains have a high percentage of new cars. And suddenly I look, what kind of train is going (passenger)? It even became interesting where such a rarity came from - Kiev-Adler.
    3. Kars
      Kars 31 October 2013 00: 23
      +1
      Quote: Setrac
      It even became interesting where such a rarity came from - Kiev-Adler.

      So what?

      but in fact it’s boring even until minus 2000. I’ll look in the morning))))
    4. Setrac
      Setrac 31 October 2013 01: 14
      +1
      Quote: Kars
      but in fact it’s boring even until minus 2000. I’ll look in the morning))))

      Yes, you are the champion, I have not reached more than five hundred a day. Wimp.
    5. Kars
      Kars 31 October 2013 12: 50
      +1
      Quote: Setrac
      Yes, you are the champion, I have not reached more than five hundred a day. Wimp.

      Well, who will put so many minuses to you here)
  • vanaheym
    vanaheym 31 October 2013 05: 49
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    And suddenly I look, what kind of train is going (passenger)? It even became interesting where such a rarity came from - Kiev-Adler.

    A train is like a train, the look is in class. Or are there WiFi, LED TVs and crystal vases with caviar everywhere in Russian cars?
  • Vadivak
    Vadivak 30 October 2013 16: 22
    13
    Quote: Kars
    Putin’s victory can only be in one case - during the collapse of the Ukrainian economy,


    Survived
    1. nickname 1 and 2
      nickname 1 and 2 30 October 2013 16: 46
      16
      Ukraine is very necessary for our economy, because according to the calculations of the same economists, the entry of Ukraine into the CU will give a significant economic growth (up to 50%) to all CU states (including Ukraine), and this is salaries and pensions for people. The question is what will the EU give Ukraine, except for the market for the EU itself.

      Oh la la! zvydkilya?

      Nikolay Starikov = something "on duty"! There is no such thing as "to smithereens"!

      And if so "from the outside" look then = the more our people try to intimidate those, the more persistently they stand on their own.
      In life there were such Ukrainians whom to convince, no, just nobody can talk. Will bump back !!!!!!!!!! Yeah, like ..... they! And then they will say (when the muzzle is on the table) = Thu! so shozh you did not say?
    2. gladysheff2010
      gladysheff2010 31 October 2013 00: 56
      +1
      I don’t know about the others, but unfortunately I have been living in this regime (problems with relatives) for quite a long time, decent people say this is the time. A well-known character named Woland said differently: "... the housing problem ruined them."
  • KCC
    KCC 30 October 2013 16: 26
    +7
    What kind of horror stories, Russia is vitally interested in both Nikolaev shipyards and An aircraft, etc. etc., and in general Ukraine is very necessary for our economy, because according to the calculations of the same economists, Ukraine’s entry into the CU will give a significant economic growth (up to 50%) to all CU states (including Ukraine), and this is salaries and pensions to people. The question is what will the EU give Ukraine, except for the market for the EU itself.
    1. Galan
      Galan 30 October 2013 19: 43
      13
      Have you seen these Nikolaev shipyards? What is left of the specialist training system? Who is currently being released by the former Nikolaev Shipbuilding Institute named after S.O. Makarov? Lawyers, economists and managers. When I was finishing it, only two groups of economists and 4 groups of electricians, 8 groups of mechanics (internal combustion engines, turbinists and nuclear power plants) and 6 groups of corps workers were graduated. I'm 60. My classmates will retire next year. Who will work in the shipyards? Current managers, lawyers, economists? So there is no need for loud phrases about the Nikolaev shipyards, they are almost gone. I'm not talking about the Black Sea Central Design Bureau, Progress Design Bureau, etc.
    2. Setrac
      Setrac 30 October 2013 21: 49
      +7
      Quote: KCC
      Russia is vitally interested in Nikolaev shipyards

      Russia is building new shipyards, it looks like the Nikolaev shipyards scored a bolt.
  • Russ69
    Russ69 30 October 2013 16: 31
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    T. And then the Russian aligarchs will buy everything for a song and ruin, why do they need competitors

    The fact is that there are so many Russian oligarchs that they bought up, but factories work and send products to Russia. Whether they will work further is already a question. If Russia imposes sanctions, then buying in Russia will not be profitable, but you will not sell to the West ....
  • Alexander Romanov
    Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 16: 35
    13
    Quote: Kars
    Putin's victory can only be in one case - in the collapse of the Ukrainian economy, there are no other options.

    It will not be Putin’s victory, but the EU’s victory. Putin doesn’t gain anything from the collapse of the economy. The collapse of the Ukrainian economy for Russia is a loss of the market in the sense that a poor Ukraine cannot buy goods.
    Quote: Kars
    .And then the Russian aligarchs will buy everything for a song and ruin, why do they need competitors

    By your logic, so who is leading Ukraine to collapse, is it Putin?
    Quote: Kars
    . (Ukrainian industry is not an EU competitor, namely Russia, we have similar technologies, and we do almost the same thing)

    But it’s in color, although you yourself didn’t understand it. European goods in Ukraine have no competitors, but in Russia there are. But despite this, the Ukrainian authorities say that the European market will be open for goods from Ukraine. For non-competitive goods hmm. And what does Putin have to do with it.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 16: 45
      +1
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      It will not be Putin’s victory, but EU’s victory

      And what is the EU geshevt? What Ukraine is experiencing a crisis with the EU will throw in the arms ..good ..uncle Putin?
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      The collapse of the Ukrainian economy for Russia is a loss of the market in the sense that impoverished Ukraine will not be able to buy goods

      And for the EU in your naobort))) not well, you sparkle with your mind already horror)))
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      By your logic, so who is leading Ukraine to collapse, is it Putin?

      And why did you get what lead to crash?
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      .European goods in Ukraine have no competitors

      So why should they destroy our enterprises? So that there would be no money to buy European goods?))))
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      But despite this, the Ukrainian authorities say that the European market will be open for goods from Ukraine.

      Well, is Ukraine selling something to Europe or not? Even NOW?
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      And what does Putin have to do with it.

      He himself decided what. For the sake of his great empire ambitions. At the same time, he LOUDLY did not reject the possibility of admitting to the TC a NATO member and an ASSOCIATED EU member of Turkey)))
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 17: 08
        10
        Quote: Kars

        And what is the EU geshevt?

        The EU receives an additional market for its companies and not a small market.
        Quote: Kars
        What Ukraine is experiencing a crisis with the EU kinets in the arms ..good..uncle Putin?

        No, rather, on the contrary, politicians will convince the population that this is Russia to blame for everything. So request
        Quote: Kars
        So why should they destroy our enterprises?

        Ukrainians will find money for grub. We all had plants at 93, but the people had money for Ankle Bens. Someone fussed.
        Quote: Kars

        And why did you get what lead to crash?

        Not really to prosperity. Give the figures, well, at least Ukrainian politicians benefit from the EU. Not general phrases that there will be investments, namely numbers.
        Quote: Kars
        Well, is Ukraine selling something to Europe or not? Even NOW?

        Of course it sells, but it also receives a lot of money from the duties of the EU on duties on goods from the EU. And now this money will not be available. Ukraine is not so rich to make such decisions.
        Quote: Kars

        He himself decided what, for the sake of his great empire ambitions.

        Well, I’m saying Putin is to blame.
        Quote: Kars
        . At the same time, he LOUDLY did not reject the possibility of admitting to the TC a NATO member and an ASSOCIATED EU member of Turkey)))

        Well, I’m saying Putin’s brains are working, it’s going to happen that the EU’s jaw drops
        1. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 17: 19
          +1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          The EU receives an additional market for its companies and not a small market

          You're so smart as much horror)))
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Quote: Kars
          Putin's victory can only be in one case - in the collapse of the Ukrainian economy, there are no other options.
          It will not be Putin’s victory, but EU’s victory

          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          The collapse of the Ukrainian economy for Russia is the loss of the market in the sense that the impoverished Ukraine will not be able to buy goods.

          Is it strange strange? The EU is gaining new markets)) and Russia is losing because the impoverished Ukraine cannot buy very high-quality and expensive goods)))

          This once again proves that people like you NU are just very smart and, well, a few are not victims of propaganda (I almost wrote a story)
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          No, rather, on the contrary, politicians will convince the population that this is Russia to blame for everything. So

          Well, unlike you, we have freedom of speech and information, and the skill level (well, after your argumentation) will be higher.
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Ukrainians will find money for grub
          Why is it for Europe? Will they drive cheap European food to Ukraine?

          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Not to prosper. Give the numbers

          You go Glazyev print or listen, feel better. Feel your own significance))
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Of course he sells, but he also receives a lot of money from the duties of the EU on duties on goods from the EU. And now this money will not be

          Well, you don’t know the economics of the campaign at all)) Why do you think it’s good in the Customs Union when Kazakhstan and the Russian Federation canceled duties for example, but for Ukraine it is bad when duties with the EU are canceled?
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Well, I’m saying Putin is to blame.

          And who? Is it his great empire ambitions that prevent, instead of pressing (even minus the Russian Federation) normal trade relations as with other countries (well, for example, Turkey)
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          I’m saying that Putin’s brains are working, it’s going to happen that the EU’s jaw drops
          I don’t know what works for him there, but the Russian Federation with such a territory and such natural resources shows such a low standard of living of the population. (Do not compare with Ukraine))))
        2. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 17: 44
          10
          Quote: Kars
          Is it strange strange? The EU is gaining new markets)) and Russia is losing because the impoverished Ukraine cannot buy very high-quality and expensive goods)))

          Of course, Russia will introduce duties and receive the same from Ukraine. Yes, and then not in a month, Ukraine will become poor.
          Quote: Kars
          You go Glazyev print or listen, feel better. Feel your own significance))

          Yes, what does my significance have to do with it. Kars, I ask you for numbers, but you don’t have them and you begin to suffer from nonsense.
          Quote: Kars
          ) And why do you think it is good in the Customs Union when Kazakhstan and the Russian Federation canceled duties for example, but for Ukraine it is bad when duties with the EU are canceled?

          Because Kazakhstan and Belarus have received what Glazyev says for Ukraine. Ukraine will not receive this from the EU.
          Quote: Kars

          And who? This is his great empire’s ambitions

          Well, I’m saying Putin is to blame. Only Putin is not dragging Ukraine into the EU, but Putin is the one to hell laughing
          Quote: Kars
          I don’t know what works for him there, and the Russian Federation with such territory and such natural resources shows such a low standard of living of the population

          Yes, for the money we don’t seem to live badly. Better than many EU countries.
        3. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 18: 02
          +1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Of course

          enough shame.

          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Yes, for the money we don’t seem to live badly. Better than many EU countries.

          And how many EU countries have at least approximate dimensions with the Russian Federation? And its minerals?

          By the way, are you better at drinking Norway? Are they also banning oil and gas?

        4. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 18: 09
          +7
          Quote: Kars
          enough shame.

          This is you Yanukovych good
          Given the poverty we got out not long ago, we live very well.
        5. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 18: 19
          +1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          This is you Yanukovych

          You type live better than Yanukovych?
        6. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 18: 29
          +6
          Quote: Kars

          You type live better than Yanukovych?

          Yulia Tymoshenko also lived better than me, and then oops .... like there in the song, Vladimir Central is the north wind, When I banked .....
          But not a point usually ruins.
        7. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 18: 39
          +1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Yulka Tymoshenko then

          Did you type so jumped?
          How are Serdyukov and Chubais doing?
        8. rolik
          rolik 30 October 2013 19: 13
          +9
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Yulia Tymoshenko also lived better than me, and then oops .... like there in the song, Vladimir Central is the north wind, When I banked ..

          Judging by Kars’s quote, they have freedom of speech there))))) so Julia herself locked herself up in extras)))) After all, they have freedom of speech)))) and actions)))
          And freedom of speech lies in Bendera’s marches, soon they will also have p.ed.p.i and columns will go down the streets. Hurray! Freedom of speech and European tolerance in action))))))))))))) But it is interesting if two demonstrations (Bendera and rear-wheel drive) meet, how they will behave ???))))
        9. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 19: 17
          +1
          Quote: rolik
          Judging by Kars’s quote, they have freedom of speech there)))))

          I look and marvel. Why are people like Roller and Romanov so smart and intelligent?
          But they don’t understand the differences between freedom of speech and responsibility for actions))) There’s nothing to say.
          Quote: rolik
          ak Julia herself locked herself up in extras)))) They have freedom of speech)))) and actions)))

          By the way, someone forbade her to speak?
          Quote: rolik
          I wonder if the two demonstrations (Bendera and rear-wheel drive) will meet, how they will behave ???))))

          This is probably the most interesting question for people like you? Are you interested in what you’ll go to in one of the columns (I won’t sin on Bendera)?
        10. rolik
          rolik 30 October 2013 19: 50
          +3
          Quote: Kars
          I look and marvel. Why are people like Roller and Romanov so smart and intelligent?

          Enviously go))))) that there are such smart people here))))
          Well, we’re just smart, and some (I won’t say who, again they will blame Great Empire ambitions) are already completely or completely smart))))

          Quote: Kars
          This is probably the most interesting question for people like you? Are you interested in what you’ll go to in one of the columns (I won’t sin on Bendera)?

          But this - the cadet, has already gone. Although it is not surprising that such thoughts come from your fully intelligent brain.
          Well, okay, poor things are not accepted well ..... I apologize (I'm afraid of accusations of great empire) hi
        11. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 19: 59
          +1
          Quote: rolik
          Enviously, go))))) that there are such smart people))

          Especially to you.
          Quote: rolik
          But this - the cadet, has already gone.

          Well, why, are you so worried about this topic that you’re burning yourself with a campaign.
          Quote: rolik
          Although it is not surprising that such thoughts come from your fully intelligent brain.

          What can I say when faced with different .. clever .. people like you have to analyze their writings, and evaluate.
        12. rolik
          rolik 30 October 2013 20: 10
          +3
          Quote: Kars
          comes

          As the adored Puchkov (Goblin) says:
          - With a soft sign!))))))
          And about "this" topic, only you got excited))) and somehow inadequate)))) Strange, strange all this lol
        13. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 20: 12
          +1
          Quote: rolik
          - With a soft sign!))))))

          Well, Puchkov knows better.

          As for this topic, then you have about every second comment about it)))))
        14. rolik
          rolik 30 October 2013 20: 15
          +2
          Quote: Kars
          Well, Puchkov knows better.

          Well esche would))) who would doubt))))
        15. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 20: 31
          +1
          By the way, yesterday - it was time to look at YouTube a couple of episodes of Blue Phil, especially I liked Stalingrad)))
  • vanaheym
    vanaheym 31 October 2013 06: 03
    0
    Quote: rolik
    And freedom of speech lies in Bendera’s marches, soon they will also have p.ed.p.i and columns will go down the streets. Hurray! Freedom of speech and European tolerance in action)))))))))))))

    For example, we have rear-wheel drive like this

    By the way, remind you how your "elite" walked around Moscow without the European Union, Holland, etc.?
  • rolik
    rolik 31 October 2013 12: 27
    0
    Quote: vanaheym
    For example, we have rear-wheel drive like this

    Well, that's fine))) (as they said in one film).
    only here is the hitch, when joining the EU will have to accept their rules. And the rules there now are that the rear-wheel drive the ball.
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 18: 52
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    You type live better than Yanukovych?

    You are not comparing the categories. When your logic ends, emotions begin. Do not go to the person. Calm, only calm, as the great Carloson bequeathed. laughing
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 18: 55
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    You are not comparing the categories.

    I didn’t start, and how did it end with my logic? Ramonov was lying so much on)))

    Quote: Kars
    By the way, are you better at drinking Norway? Are they also banning oil and gas?

    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Given the poverty we got out not long ago, we live very well.

    Doesn’t it sound pathetic? But about Ukraine he already has foam from his mouth ide.No that would be done from his super Rulers, who are in the forefront in Forbes a better life)))
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 19: 21
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    I didn’t start, and how did it end with my logic? Ramonov was lying so much on)))

    I'm not talking about grammar laughing. It’s ridiculous to compare the life of Romanov with the life of Yanukovych. Once again, Putin is not my ideal, but with this attitude to his people, Yanukovych is breaking all records.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 19: 32
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    I'm not talking about grammar

    so I'm not talking about her.
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    it’s ridiculous to compare the life of Romanov with the life of Yanukovych

    why? this vet does not prevent Romanov from disgracing Yanukovych.

    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Putin is not my ideal, but with this attitude to his people, Yanukovych is breaking all records.

    what exactly?
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 19: 39
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    why? this vet does not prevent Romanov from disgracing Yanukovych.

    Yanukovych is in the frontal place, and Romanov is at home, near the computer.
    Quote: Kars
    what exactly?
    So Putin did not succeed in spitting on the opinion of the people. Just do not give the WTO as an example, not that scope. Now, if Putin shoved Russia into NATO ...
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 19: 44
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Yanukovych is in the frontal place, and Romanov is at home, near the computer.

    Well, so I'm near the computer.
    You can shame on him, but tell me to tell him that he generally doesn’t tell anyone about a person who became the president of not the smallest country (as best I could, I don’t interfere with the theme of user use)
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    So on the opinion of the people, Putin has not yet succeeded.
    Oh well? Racking GDP-DAM-GDP is enough.

    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Just do not give the WTO an example, the wrong scope
    And why is this? And what about Serdyukov? He lays down on this issue for most local (VO) users)))

    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Now, if Putin shoved Russia into NATO ...

    And then what will he frighten the Russians with? By the way, what would be wrong with that? At the UN, you are a member)))
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 20: 03
    +4
    Quote: Kars
    You can disgrace him, but I should tell him

    You are not far behind him in criticizing Putin, do not worry. Although he mocks, but on the topic, and you turn to the person.
    Quote: Kars
    And then what will he frighten the Russians with? By the way, what would be wrong with that? At the UN, you are a member)))

    Ukraine. laughing And in the sense of what's wrong with joining NATO? For a tanker under the flag of the USSR, you are asking ridiculous questions.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 20: 09
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    You are not far behind him in criticizing Putin, do not worry

    I? Lagged behind the one who corrected the names of the emperor of all Russia Vladimir in posts 1))))
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Although he mocks, but on the topic, and you turn to the person.

    Which ones?
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    And in the sense of what's wrong with joining NATO? For a tanker under the flag of the USSR, you are asking ridiculous questions.
    And you try to answer. By the way, if it is so scary why the Russian Federation conducts joint exercises with NATO? Why does it buy weapons from a NATO member country.
    Shine eruditsmey, this is not a leopard to compare. Prove how bad it is if the Russian Federation enters the command structures of the North Atlantic Alliance?
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 20: 57
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    Prove how bad it is if the Russian Federation enters the command structures of the North Atlantic Alliance?

    I have no words fool You break all records on the Kashchenko scale. lol
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 21: 04
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    No words. You break all records on the Kashchenko scale.

    Well, you’ll open a couple of points. That would be immediately obvious that I’m in Kashchenko, and not YOU.

    Well, it’s not obvious (except that the Russian Federation will not be taken there) So the Russian Federation has become a member of NATO, what has become worse for the Russian Federation?

    NATO's 2010 Strategic Concept “Active Participation, Modern Defense” presents three of NATO’s most important tasks - collective defense, crisis management and cooperative security
    Where is the contradiction with NATO? And if you become a donor, even in the future the United States would also push it out of NATO))) would you let it sparkle with intelligence, otherwise Kashchenko will light up for you.
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 21: 24
    +5
    Quote: Kars
    Well, it’s not obvious (except that the Russian Federation will not be taken there) So the Russian Federation has become a member of NATO, what has become worse for the Russian Federation?

    If my grandmother had coca, she would be a grandfather. Is Russia in NATO? As one acquaintance told me, -I found my mink in the garbage dump. Her honor seems more than you had ...
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 21: 27
    +1
    Well, as with the Leopards, nobody pulled you for the LANGUAGE)))
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Now, if Putin shoved Russia into NATO.

    Quote: Ingvar 72
    said one familiar girl, -I found my mink in the trash

    Cool she fucked you. I never said that.
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Her honor seems more than you had ...

    How do you know? I assure you that I will also refuse)))
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 31 October 2013 08: 51
    +2
    Quote: Kars
    I assure you that I will refuse too)))

    I sincerely hope so. But I hope life doesn’t push me like that to address such proposals to you.
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 12: 52
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    But I hope life doesn’t push me like that to address such proposals to you.

    I hope so too.
  • Botanologist
    Botanologist 30 October 2013 22: 35
    +8
    Quote: Kars
    By the way, if it is so scary why is the Russian Federation conducting joint exercises with NATO?


    Joint exercises and introduction are slightly different things.

    Quote: Kars
    Prove how bad it is if the Russian Federation enters the command structures of the North Atlantic Alliance?


    belay can I ask a question from the ABC book .... NATO from whom it is defending ... there is a whole doctrine, by the way ....


    In general, I have one suggestion for your discussion - stop arguing about who is dumber and ruder, and try to find the answer to the main question - why Russia is not profitable for Ukraine to join the EU.
    On my own behalf, I can assume that Ukraine in this case simply turns from some kind of no partner, albeit wayward, into a country with external governance. And external management implies that it is necessary to agree on something not with the leadership of this country, but with the owners from Brussels. That’s the whole problem - we are losing the state under our side, and we are getting the bridgehead for economic expansion under the same side. And what for do we need it?
    As for your thesis that Ukraine will now press on the WTO and other agreements - this is not the problem. The problem is that within the WTO, Russia establishes special mechanisms for European goods. And as soon as Ukraine becomes "almost the EU", these mechanisms will work. Actually, this is what Putin is warning about. And this is VERY disliked by Ukrainian politicians. They even begin to remember that we are fraternal peoples.
    In this regard, I would like to quote the words of General A. Lebed: "Like the world, so are sons of bitches, and like war, so are brothers."
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 22: 45
    +1
    Quote: Botanologist
    Joint exercises and introduction are slightly different things.

    Maybe a LITTLE different, but the teachings should not be carried out kosher))))
    Quote: Botanologist
    but you can question from the ABC book .... NATO from whom it is defending.

    So answer from WHO (the Soviet Union broke up) that there is now in the doctrine?
    Quote: Botanologist
    In general, I have one suggestion for your discussion - stop arguing about who is dumber and ruder

    But vetting is fun.

    Quote: Botanologist
    the main question is why Russia is not profitable for Ukraine to join the EU.

    But to me, then, a citizen of Ukraine, why?
    Quote: Botanologist
    On my own behalf, I can assume that Ukraine in this case simply turns from no partner, albeit wayward, into a country with external governance

    And you naturally want the same thing, but what would external control be in your hands?
    Here, by the way, is Turkey a country with an External Administration? Israel? The Russian Federation, how does it trade with an associate member of the EU, Israel?
    Quote: Botanologist
    Regarding your thesis that Ukraine will now push to the WTO

    It is necessary to try - there is no sense in relying on the honest execution of contracts by the Russian Federation.
    Quote: Botanologist
    The problem is that in the framework of the WTO, Russia establishes special mechanisms

    The WTO is a WORLDWIDE organization and there is regulation not only of trade with EUROPEANS,
    Quote: Botanologist
    They even begin to recall that we are fraternal peoples.
    I’m not sure who remembers more often.
  • Botanologist
    Botanologist 30 October 2013 23: 18
    +5
    Quote: Kars
    So answer from WHO (the Soviet Union broke up) that there is now in the doctrine?


    the most interesting thing is that the doctrine has not changed. NATO is a military structure, and any military structure needs an adversary. You then as a military should understand this well. So the question is - what kind of adversary can a military alliance have in the Eurasian space? So, for fun.

    Quote: Kars
    RF, how does it trade with an associate member of the EU, Israel?


    Just as it will trade with Ukraine associated with the EU. With restrictions and barrier duties. The question is a little different - how will Ukraine trade with Russia.

    Quote: Kars
    The WTO is a WORLDWIDE organization and there is regulation not only of trade with EUROPEANS,


    So you do not simplify. Each market has its own points to the protocol. And for each type of goods as well. Actually, that’s what we are talking about. Exit to the EU transfers trade with Ukraine to a different jurisdiction, more stringent. And this entails losses for both Russia and Ukraine.
    And about the fact that you need to trade without looking at anything - this is unlikely. All countries are very interested. And any political movement gets an economic assessment, whether you like it or not. So do not pretend to be simpletons, there will be sanctions. just because you left our yard to the guys in another yard. And if you start shouting "it's not fair" - look at Libya, Yugoslavia, Iraq, Grenada, and understand that you got off with a slight fright. For if Russia today puts everything it has on the idea of ​​taking away, for example, Crimea, then it will take it away. It's just that nobody wants to pay a high price. This is me, for example, you do not worry about the Crimea. Let's take it, but later. And cheaper. When the Crimean Tatars arrange a second Grozny for you there, then we'll see.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 23: 29
    +1
    Quote: Botanologist
    the most interesting thing is that the doctrine has not changed. NATO is a military structure, and any military structure needs an adversary

    yes)))) By the way, how often did the USSR conduct joint exercises with NATO? You say that the most interesting doctrine has not changed))))
    Quote: Botanologist
    here's the question - what kind of adversary can a military alliance have in Eurasia?

    Terrorism, China, dictators)))
    Quote: Botanologist
    Just as it will trade with Ukraine associated with the EU.
    If it were SAME, then no questions would have arisen.

    Quote: Botanologist
    . The question is a little different - how will Ukraine trade with Russia.
    since the Russian Federation is DUST. You are insane with your LITTLE LITTLE.

    Quote: Botanologist
    So you do not simplify. Each market has its own points to the protocol. And for each type of goods as well.

    Here we will be judged by them.
    Quote: Botanologist
    Access to the EU transfers goods turnover with Ukraine to a different jurisdiction, tougher

    Where do you take it? Is there evidence?
    Quote: Botanologist
    For if Russia today puts everything that it has on the idea of ​​taking away, for example, Crimea, then it will take it away.

    IF I COULD I would already have done it. But it becomes an outcast country, and this will not cost you blood.
    Quote: Botanologist
    And cheaper. When the Crimean Tatars will arrange a second Grozny there, then we'll see
    And don’t hope. In Crimea, no one will leave 40 army depots in Crimea (I don’t remember the army number), Crimea is a peninsula - so it’s difficult to bring weapons in, so don’t hope.
  • Botanologist
    Botanologist 30 October 2013 23: 46
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    ) By the way, how often did the USSR conduct joint exercises with NATO?


    You are a little lost in historical and political realities. The ideology, the country, the global balance of power has changed. What could not be the USSR, it is possible to Russia. Question for training purposes.

    Quote: Kars
    Terrorism, China, dictators)))


    What are you saying! Is NATO going to climb to China or to North Korea? Where can I read more about this?


    Quote: Kars
    Where do you take it? Is there evidence?


    I’m lazy to dig sites now, but tomorrow I will pick links and drop you. And you yourself are comparing duty free trading today and the WTO tomorrow, okay?

    Quote: Kars
    And don’t hope. In Crimea, no one will leave 40 army depots in Crimea (I don’t remember the army number), Crimea is a peninsula - so it’s difficult to bring weapons in, so don’t hope.


    Yes, your ensign has long sold everything. And about Do not hope - history knows a lot of incredible analogies. After all, if Ukraine begins to plot Russia in the EU, then there can be all sorts of surprises about the Tatar caliphate in Crimea. Here, as politicians decide.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 23: 54
    +1
    Quote: Botanologist
    You a little

    And you did not answer a direct simple question))))
    Quote: Botanologist
    What could not be the USSR, it is possible to Russia

    So maybe NATO can?
    Quote: Botanologist
    What are you saying! Is NATO going to climb to China or to North Korea? Where can I read more about this?

    And the rest did not raise questions? As for where - you did not provide where to read that NATO is against Russia?
    Quote: Botanologist
    I’m lazy to dig sites now, but tomorrow I’ll pick you links and drop
    I do not forget.

    Quote: Botanologist
    m WTO tomorrow, okay?

    No.
    Quote: Botanologist
    Yes, your warrant sold for a long time
    Yah)))
    We have explosions in warehouses in the Crimea did not pass)))

    Quote: Botanologist
    And about Do not hope - history knows a lot of incredible analogies.

    which ones?
    Quote: Botanologist
    After all, if Ukraine begins to plot Russia in the EU, then there can be all sorts of surprises about the Tatar caliphate in Crimea.

    Can not.
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 31 October 2013 08: 57
    +2
    Quote: Kars
    Crimea is a peninsula - therefore, it will be difficult to bring weapons, so And do not hope.

    Strong reasoning. fool England, Cuba generally islands, so what?
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 12: 55
    +1
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    England, Cuba generally islands, so what?

    Yes, you are a strategist)) Are the dimensions of England up to date? The development of instrumental intelligence tools?

    The area of ​​Cuba is 110922 square meters. Km
    In the extreme south of Ukraine, the Crimean peninsula deeply rises into the Black Sea, resembling an irregular quadrangle.

    He is small. Its area is only about 26 thousand square meters. Km

    You have once again shown that you should not expect logic and knowledge from you)))
  • Hudo
    Hudo 30 October 2013 23: 16
    +6
    Quote: Botanologist
    In this regard, I would like to quote the words of General A. Lebed: "Like the world, so are sons of bitches, and like war, so are brothers."

    Not General Lebed these words.
    Here is the original source: Konstantin Mikhailovich Simonov poem "Suvorov"
    "... There is no worse garrison strap!

    We’re easier on ten wounds in battle,

    Overnight stay homeless, sleepless march

    And even death in a foreign land.

    Here the bayonet is more valuable than the galloons,

    Here, even the company man quit fighting.

    As the world, so - "sons of bitches",

    And as a war, so immediately - "brothers".


    Here, if forager steals

    And the quartermaster doesn’t feed us, -

    Suvorov bitches will find for them

    And at the request of a soldier he will pull up ... "
    http://fb2.booksgid.com/content/10/konstantin-simonov-sobranie-sochineniy-tom-1/
    34.html

    hi
  • Botanologist
    Botanologist 30 October 2013 23: 35
    +4
    Quote: Hudo
    Konstantin Mikhailovich Simonov poem "Suvorov"


    Thanks for the enlightenment. But I read this aphorism ascribed to Swan.
  • Hudo
    Hudo 31 October 2013 00: 00
    +3
    Quote: Botanologist
    Thanks for the enlightenment.


    Completeness! drinks The matter is everyday!
  • Setrac
    Setrac 30 October 2013 22: 11
    +4
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    Just do not give the WTO as an example, not that scope.

    I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the very fact of joining the WTO is not evil; on what conditions is it crucial to join.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 30 October 2013 22: 07
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    ? Ramonov so much lay)))

    I understand that you were mistaken, specify where!
    on lАsting or Рwas it?
    Ramonov or Romanov?
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 22: 13
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    I understand

    You flatter yourself.
    Quote: Setrac
    Ramonov or Romanov?

    as you wish.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 31 October 2013 00: 28
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    as you wish.

    But these are different people!
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 00: 38
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    But these are different people!

    Turn on logical thinking, and guess.
  • Ingvar 72
    Ingvar 72 31 October 2013 09: 03
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    Turn on logical thinking, and guess.

    So turn on the logic, or guess?
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 12: 37
    +1
    In your case, guess all the same. It would be logic would not ask.
  • rolik
    rolik 30 October 2013 20: 18
    +3
    Quote: Ingvar 72
    When your logic ends, emotions begin

    logics???? fig, this, in what koment was ????)))))
    Especially "emotions" leaped up when Bandera and gays were mentioned. There are EMOTIONS)))))
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 20: 33
    +1
    Quote: rolik
    Especially "emotions" leaped

    What then about the crown say about your reaction to the place)))


    Army General
    rolik (3) SU Today, 19:18 ↑
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Stanislav, for Ukraine speech. Yanukovych in what place
    21 - point))))))


    What is the most expensive?
  • Setrac
    Setrac 30 October 2013 22: 01
    +3
    Quote: Kars
    And how many EU countries have at least approximate dimensions with the Russian Federation? And its minerals?

    And how many EU countries have the same harsh climate?
  • rolik
    rolik 30 October 2013 19: 08
    +7
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    I don’t know what works for him there, and the Russian Federation with such territory and such natural resources shows such a low standard of living of the population

    Well, right)))) we are breaking into the Nezalezhnaya for work)))) Ukrainian border guards are already tired of Russians looking for a better share in Ukraine, to drive them away from the border)))))
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 19: 19
    +1
    Quote: rolik
    Well right)))) we are breaking into the Independent for earnings))))

    He also reads for sure in syllables.
    Quote: Kars
    I don’t know what works for him there, but the Russian Federation with such a territory and such natural resources shows such a low standard of living of the population. (Do not compare with Ukraine))))


    How many Europeans are there for you to earn money? And already Russians do not go to permanent residence and work in Europe?
  • rolik
    rolik 30 October 2013 20: 23
    +7
    Quote: Kars
    He also reads for sure in syllables.

    Pinocchio did not regret a few of the ABCs. Do not spare a couple of hryvnias for your primer (only Russian), it helps a lot in life))))))
    My father went to live in Bulgaria, went to him this summer. So he moved there because of the climate)))) in the North (Arkhangelsk region) the climate for the elderly is not very good. He has a Russian pension there much more than a good Bulgarian salary)))) But now he lives in Europe however)))
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 20: 30
    +1
    Quote: rolik
    Do not spare a couple of hryvnias for your primer (only Russian), it helps a lot in life))))))

    The secretary helps better. But here is my personal entertainment.

    It is necessary somewhere to save the answer about how losers begin to whine about spelling when they are interrupted)))
    Quote: rolik
    He has a Russian pension there much more than a good Bulgarian salary)))) But now he lives in Europe however)))

    How much if not a secret? And what did he do for this pension?
    If, for example, my income is three times higher than the average Polish salary, is it better in Ukraine than in Poland? Your logic?
  • rolik
    rolik 31 October 2013 21: 20
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    How much if not a secret? And what did he do for this pension?

    He is an order bearer, awarded the Order of the Red Banner of Labor, and awarded in the USSR. I went to work from 13 years old
    And the fact that you have a secretary, I hardly believe in that. Spoons like you don't have secretaries. And lying with a salary is not good. These are just your sweet dreams about a big salary. Dreaming is not harmful; it is not harmful to dream. Dream the rogue - dream.
  • Kars
    Kars 31 October 2013 22: 06
    +1
    Quote: rolik
    He is an order bearer, awarded the Order of the Red Banner of Labor, and awarded in the USSR. I went to work from 13 years old

    So why do you compare his Persia? Or in the Russian Federation all the order bearers? And his pension is the average size in the Russian Federation.

    Quote: rolik
    And the fact that you have a secretary, I hardly believe in it

    You can not strain yourself.
    Quote: rolik
    Spoons like you don't have secretaries.

    Do you know this from personal experience?
    Quote: rolik
    And lying with a salary is not good

    don’t lie. It’s nice that you confuse salary and income.
    Quote: rolik
    Dream the rogue - dream.

    How emotionally))))
  • vanaheym
    vanaheym 31 October 2013 08: 47
    0
    Well, we’ll put it not in Russia, but in Moscow. Unlike Azerbaijanis / Armenians / Tajiks / Uzbeks / xs whom Ukrainians do not particularly spread throughout the rest of Russia, without interfering with indigenous Russians working as laborers themselves.
    But this is not scary - the population of Moscow is a quarter of Ukraine, and we have a limited number of guest workers. By the way, your guest workers here are mostly flickering on TV - they don’t let us see houses, they’re spinning around here.
  • rolik
    rolik 31 October 2013 12: 31
    +1
    Quote: vanaheym
    Well, we’ll put it not in Russia, but in Moscow.

    And you come to our north, you will find so many compatriots))))) Not a pen to write, not a fairy tale to say)))))
  • Galan
    Galan 30 October 2013 19: 51
    +6
    "The EU gets new markets)) and Russia is losing because impoverished Ukraine cannot buy, probably, very high quality and expensive goods)))"
    You will not buy with your earned money. and for EU loans taken by you on the security of your land and subsoil. You never pay off loans. In order to pay, you need to really earn money, and even that is not a fact that it will succeed. And you can earn money by selling products manufactured according to EU standards. The whole circle closed.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 30 October 2013 21: 52
    +5
    Quote: Kars
    And what is the EU geshevt? What Ukraine is experiencing a crisis with the EU will throw in the arms ..good ..uncle Putin?

    Then you will no longer be able to "throw yourself into the arms of Uncle Putin." It is you who left the USSR without blood; the West will not let go of its vassals (slaves) so easily.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 22: 02
      +1
      Quote: Setrac
      then you left the USSR bloodlessly, the west of your vassals (slaves) so simply will not let go.

      We are bloodless, you are not what?

      And where does infa come from that you can’t terminate the Association Agreement? Is it written somewhere? How is it in your Gas Agreement?
    2. Setrac
      Setrac 31 October 2013 00: 34
      +3
      Quote: Kars
      And where infa that terminate the Association Agreement is impossible?

      It is possible to terminate and it is possible, I do not know the protocol. However, if Ukraine rebels, it could suddenly happen in a civil war, anti-government troops will appear, the American fleet will be pulled up to fight the cannibalistic regime of Yanukovych. what am I telling you, before your eyes an example is Iraq, Yugoslavia, Libya, Syria.
    3. Kars
      Kars 31 October 2013 00: 38
      +1
      Well, they don’t let go without laughing)))))
      Quote: Setrac
      It is possible to terminate and it is possible, I do not know the protocol.

      So why vomit?
      Quote: Setrac
      however, if Ukraine rebels, it may suddenly have a civil war happen, anti-government troops will appear, the American fleet will tighten up to fight the cannibalistic regime of Yanukovych

      Wai, wai how scary)))
      Quote: Setrac
      Iraq, Yugoslavia, Libya, Syria.
      And which of these countries has signed an association agreement with the EU?))))))
    4. Setrac
      Setrac 31 October 2013 01: 17
      +2
      Quote: Kars
      And which of these countries has signed an association agreement with the EU?))))))

      These countries were friends with the West, as Ukraine does.
      And yes, Libya and Syria were associative members.
    5. Kars
      Kars 31 October 2013 13: 01
      +1
      Quote: Setrac
      These countries were friends with the West, as Ukraine does.

      ))))))))) probably hard to be a victim of propaganda?
      Quote: Setrac
      And yes, Libya and Syria were associative members.

      And can show their applications for an exit? Or refusal?

      By the way, where are they on this list?
      http://www.fp7-energy.ru/EUmember.php
  • AVV
    AVV 30 October 2013 16: 46
    11
    Yes, Ukraine doesn’t seem to be the north pole, but the leadership’s brain is frostbitten, and Russia doesn’t need independent production, it’s just a pity the people will lose their jobs and aircraft manufacturing, motor building, metallurgy will collapse in a copper basin, and for many Russians, relatives live there and we care about what they do there Your werewolves from the state !!
  • avt
    avt 30 October 2013 16: 53
    +8
    Quote: Kars
    Putin's food can only be in one case

    Before you scare yourself with Putin and the Russian oligarchs, well, think about your own horror story.
    Quote: Kars
    Putin's victory can only be in one case - in the collapse of the Ukrainian economy, there are no other options.

    Well, in the event of a crash, in general, there are no valuable objects that
    Quote: Kars
    And then the Russian aligarchs will buy everything for nothing and ruin it, why do they need competitors.
    will not, all that you ascribe to us will be done by your universal human friends of Europe, you don’t have to go far for examples. Here in Greece, they figured out the olives, as well as agriculture in general, now they give another loan only with the condition of reduction not very large, but existing defense industry. True, when this happens, we will again be to blame, because we knew, but according to your covenant, we will not have time to do anything and thereby darken the illusions regarding the Euroopean Union. Here we are, insidious and Mperts. Or maybe you’ll come up with the idea that we specifically agreed with the Europeans that they’ll ruin you, but we’ll sell them cheaper gas. laughing
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 17: 04
      +1
      Quote: avt
      Well, you think about your own horror story.

      The prosperity of Ukraine is just beneficial for him, just like his family.
      Quote: avt
      Well, in the event of a crash, in general, there are no valuable objects that

      Something is always there, do not worry.
      Quote: avt
      will not, all that you ascribe to us will be done by your universal human European friends, you don’t have to go far for examples

      This is you about Zaporizhzhya Aluminum Combine that Rusall ditched?
      Quote: avt
      Here in Greece
      And what about Greece? By the way, did you hear about the island of the blind? As one of the examples of Greek diligent work. You can still remember Spain and Portugal - there, too, they rule the siests with an excellent economy.
      1. ultra
        ultra 30 October 2013 19: 05
        +6
        Quote: Kars
        This is you about Zaporizhzhya Aluminum Combine that Rusall ditched?

        Suppose he ditched not only him! Russal has debts of 14 lard green! He is still that "effective" owner!
    2. rolik
      rolik 30 October 2013 19: 16
      +5
      Quote: avt
      . Here we are, insidious and Mperts. Or maybe you’ll come up with the idea that we specifically agreed with the Europeans that they’ll ruin you, but we’ll sell them cheaper gas.

      They already have one completely clever deputy who said that the USSR pumped out all oil and gas from the Ukrainian bowels)))))
      1. In the book
        In the book 31 October 2013 10: 52
        0
        And you read the history of the USSR, where did the gas and oil come from before the discovery of deposits in Siberia? Ukraine, the Caucasus.
  • DEMENTIY
    DEMENTIY 30 October 2013 17: 11
    14
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: DEMENTIY
    Your speeches to God for a meeting!

    why are you personally happy?


    1. And I'm not at all happy! I am very sad, realizing that I will pay for the defeat of Ukraine, including from my own pocket.
    2. Not everything in this world is measured by personal gain and money.
    3. Our argument does not make sense, because its roots lie in the plane of worldview and, for me, the restoration of historical justice is for you a loss of sovereignty. Based on this and diametrically different concepts of victory and defeat.
    4. Just minus me and this will be a sufficient expression of position.
    1. rolik
      rolik 30 October 2013 19: 17
      +4
      Quote: DEMENTIY
      4. Just minus me and this will be a sufficient expression of position.

      Why, I wanted to plyusanut))))
  • fzr1000
    fzr1000 30 October 2013 17: 41
    +5
    About modern Ukrainian technologies can be more detailed? You can now do SOMETHING that is similar or competitive to the Russian one, and the list is small. The reality is now ...
    1. Walker1975
      Walker1975 30 October 2013 19: 37
      -1
      Good food industry, which is exported, here we are building tankers
      http://inpress.ua/ru/economics/16526-v-khersone-spustili-na-vodu-tretiy-tanker-d
      lya-maltiyskogo-zakazchika
      http://www.trans-port.com.ua/index.php?newsid=42304

      We sell weapons, Ours do not fall
      1. fzr1000
        fzr1000 30 October 2013 20: 45
        +2
        I agree, but all this goes mainly to the countries of the former USSR. The EU will not leave it like that.
  • Altona
    Altona 30 October 2013 19: 23
    +6
    Who in the EU needs Kharkov Tractor, Kremenchug Automobile, Black Sea Shipbuilding? Answer ... 95% of shipbuilding in China, German and Polish shipyards are living the last days ... Tractors and cars are about the same ... What will you earn? Is it beautiful to sing? So it’s only ... And how will you compete with us? If your factories get paid with the same regularity as desert rain ...
  • Altona
    Altona 30 October 2013 19: 26
    +6
    What will be the victory of Putin? In shifting the problems of 45 million Ukrainians to the shoulders of 145 million Russians? As it was approximately in the unification of Germany ... So both Germany have still not fully united ... So they live, rich tidings and poor worms ...
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 19: 34
      +1
      Quote: Altona
      Who needs the Kharkov Tractor, the Kremenchug Automobile, the Black Sea Shipbuilding in the EU?

      And who in the Russian Federation?
      Quote: Altona
      .What will you earn?

      Now we’re working like that.
      Quote: Altona
      What will be the victory of Putin? In shifting the problems of 45 million Ukrainians to the shoulders of 145 million Russians?

      So bring it to Putin. But it doesn’t matter to him, the glory of the collector is important to him .. Russian land .. important.
      1. Firstvanguard
        Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 08: 34
        0
        So bring it to Putin. But it doesn’t matter to him, the glory of the collector is important to him .. Russian land .. important.

        It looks like a clinic ... No.
        Comrades, are you tired of throwing peas at the wall ??? wassat wassat laughing
    2. Setrac
      Setrac 30 October 2013 22: 27
      +4
      Quote: Altona
      What will be the victory of Putin? In shifting the problems of 45 million Ukrainians to the shoulders of 145 million Russians?

      For this, Ukraine must join Russia by region, and so there will be no transfer of problems.
  • morpex
    morpex 30 October 2013 20: 42
    -6
    Quote: Kars
    . (Ukrainian industry is not an EU competitor, namely Russia, we have similar technologies, and we do almost the same thing)

    Strange. And why are you all minus the statement of Kars? After all, he told the truth! After all, high-tech products in Russia and in Ukraine account for only 10% of the total shaft. And you and we desperately need high technologies. Where are these technologies? Right ! In all the ridiculed Geyrope! Remember at least the Great Peter. With whose help did he build a new, Petrine Russia? So what is Kars wrong about?
    Dumb minus, already enrages! angry
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 30 October 2013 20: 52
      +7
      Quote: morpex
      Both you and we desperately need high technology.

      AND? Said "A", say "B"
      Do Russia and Ukraine need to increase the share of high-tech products? Yes.
      Will the unlimited access of high-tech products to the markets of our countries be harmful to the development of this sector? Yes.
      Does Europe need the development of this sector in our countries? Definitely not.

      And do not blame Peter, he very firmly defended the domestic market and its own production.
      1. morpex
        morpex 30 October 2013 22: 23
        -4
        Quote: Spade
        And do not blame Peter, he very firmly defended the domestic market and its own production.

        Day on! Yes, Peter gave inconceivable privileges for Western merchants and for his merchants.! What is the protection of the market? There was nothing to defend then!. You read well, at least not the story but A. Tolstoy. As well as now.
        Quote: Spade
        Will the unlimited access of high-tech products to the markets of our countries be harmful to the development of this sector? Yes.

        So now you need to learn from them! Do you still believe in fairy tales about Skolkovo? So here's the latest news for you: The Prosecutor General's Office revealed gross violations in the work of the Fund for the Development of the Center for the Development and Commercialization of New Technologies (Skolkovo Fund).

        "The Fund did not provide proper organizational management and coordination of the project, which contributed to the uncontrolled spending of funds, as well as causing damage to the fund and the interests of the state," the General Prosecutor's Office said in a statement to Interfax.

        The audit revealed multibillion-dollar damage inflicted on Skolkovo and the Russian budget. We are talking about 125 billion rubles.
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 30 October 2013 22: 40
          +4
          Quote: morpex
          Day on! Yes, Peter gave inconceivable privileges for Western merchants and for his merchants.! What is the protection of the market? There was nothing to protect then!. You read well, at least not the story but A. Tolstoy

          Dear, do not you think that even A. Tolstoy has an episode with Arkhangelsk, in which English merchants reduced prices, refusing to purchase and pus goods of Russian merchants. And Peter's reaction to this is the beginning of the construction of his own commercial fleet. "You read, well, at least not the story of A. Tolstoy" (c)

          Quote: morpex
          So now you need to learn from them! Do you still believe in fairy tales about Skolkovo? So here's the latest news for you: The Prosecutor General's Office revealed gross violations in the work of the Fund for the Development of the Center for the Development and Commercialization of New Technologies (Skolkovo Fund).

          "The Fund did not provide proper organizational management and coordination of the project, which contributed to the uncontrolled spending of funds, as well as causing damage to the fund and the interests of the state," the General Prosecutor's Office said in a statement to Interfax.

          The audit revealed multibillion-dollar damage inflicted on Skolkovo and the Russian budget. We are talking about 125 billion rubles.

          I apologize, but this heap that you dumped refutes at least one my thesis?
          Who is stopping you from learning? But by the way, there’s no reason for you to study; opening your own market makes this unproductive. You should go in for tourism in order to have at least a pretty penny. Well, the study of languages, the crisis in Europe is not eternal, they will still need migrant workers someday.

          And here we will study. Well, or buy technology that we are already doing.
        2. morpex
          morpex 31 October 2013 00: 53
          0
          Quote: Spade
          I apologize, but this heap that you dumped refutes at least one my thesis?

          No . Everything seems to be on business. By theses. It's just that I'm somehow tired of these "funerals" of Ukraine. There is no constructive dialogue between ordinary users of the site. So I hear from you just another, excuse me, of course, moronic advice about tourism, ( Maybe he’s this advice in the Carpathians and practical, by the way, you’re already late with him, this industry is already well developed there and vacationers from Russia praise it very much) By the way, look at least where I come from, so we are more engaged in agriculture and as you put it, We have a pretty penny. And we are not afraid of competition from Europe, And if they also cancel subsidies or we will be given the same !!!
          And temper your insulting imperial fervor. Not really. a little that at once guest workers! Yes, you are there in Russia, you should erect a monument to an unnamed guest worker, because they helped you to lift Russia from the ruins! And when the arguments end, you switch to the language of Father Fyodor from "12 chairs".
          In general, I have never been a guest worker. I believe that you need to build your country and not go to someone else's cattle. After all, there is such an attitude towards them. I don’t see any difference in Poland or Russia. It's just that the attitude of the Russians is doubly offensive. one nation. It’s bitter to realize this, but probably all this is already in the past.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 20: 58
    +1
    Quote: morpex
    .And why do you all minus the statement of Kars?

    What else can they do?
    1. rolik
      rolik 31 October 2013 12: 36
      +1
      Quote: Kars
      .And why do you all minus the statement of Kars?

      Not true, I didn’t put a single minus to Kars. I never sculpt cons to my opponent. Kars has his own position, he defends it, this is his right.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 31 October 2013 00: 41
    +5
    Quote: morpex
    Strange. And why are you all minus the statement of Kars? After all, he told the truth! After all, high-tech products in Russia and Ukraine make up only 10% of the total shaft. Both you and we desperately need high technology.

    This is a classic misconception, like if you have these technologies, you will immediately heal, but it’s not. In order to develop something, you need to have a sales market for this. If you do not have a sales market, then your entire high-tech industry (which is not yet available and it is not a fact that the EU will give it to you) will stand idle.
  • Botanologist
    Botanologist 30 October 2013 22: 00
    +6
    Quote: Kars
    why are you personally happy?
    Putin’s victory can only be in one case - during the collapse of the Ukrainian economy, there are no other options. And then the Russian aligarchs will buy everything for nothing and ruin it, why do they need competitors.


    What kind of economy is this that anyone can buy for nothing?
    And the second point - if the collapse of the Ukrainian economy depends solely on the goodwill of Russia, then why quit? For a long time we would agree on production cooperation, at the interstate level this is not a very difficult task, and does not really depend on the mood of the oligarchs. Putin is very patient, won’t listen to the old man silently and endure. And no one would have kicked your leaders if they hadn’t tried to show your ass at any opportunity.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 22: 10
      +1
      Quote: Botanologist
      What kind of economy is this that anyone can buy for nothing?

      Ask those who say that the EU will buy up the Ukrainian economy for nothing.
      This is a mirror answer for me.

      Quote: Botanologist
      And the second point - if the collapse of the Ukrainian economy depends solely on the goodwill of Russia,

      But I didn’t say this, it is what Russian users think / think here.
      Quote: Botanologist
      For a long time we would agree on production cooperation, at the interstate level this is not a very difficult task,

      Yes, on AN-70 already agreed ten times.
      Quote: Botanologist
      Putin is very patient, the old man silently listens and suffers
      Well, yes, I’ve already taken all that is possible, but the Old Man can only talk. And Ukraine did not want to give the GTS and became an enemy of the people)))
      1. svp67
        svp67 30 October 2013 22: 14
        +3
        Quote: Kars
        Yes, on AN-70 already agreed ten times.

        So take the first step to execution - complete the tests and issue the necessary documentation, for our plants, for the production of components and assemblies.
      2. svp67
        svp67 30 October 2013 22: 16
        +2
        Quote: Kars
        .A Ukraine did not want to give the GTS became an enemy of the people)))

        Ukraine "wanted" to sit on two chairs, not realizing that in this situation - a ticket is bought only for ONE SEATING SEAT ...
        1. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 22: 21
          +1
          Quote: svp67
          So take the first step to execution

          The best step is to do it yourself using the money of a non-politicized investor.
          Quote: svp67
          Ukraine "wanted" a mustache

          Probably it could never have come to mind that Ukraine might want something, and not just give it away?
  • In the book
    In the book 31 October 2013 10: 41
    -2
    And why minus, dear Kars wrote a lie? The way it is.
  • nickname 1 and 2
    nickname 1 and 2 30 October 2013 16: 33
    +2
    Your speeches to God for a meeting!


    in the ears
  • Ruslan67
    Ruslan67 30 October 2013 16: 26
    +4
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    I do not know how, but Putin will beat both the EU and Yanukovych.

    Very simple, the EU and Yanukovych will play Kozla and Putin in the towns wassat
  • Russ69
    Russ69 30 October 2013 16: 27
    +4
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    I do not know how, but Putin will beat both the EU and Yanukovych.

    The main thing is that the game does not drag on for a long time ...
  • Ascetic
    Ascetic 30 October 2013 17: 59
    +6
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    I do not know how, but Putin will beat both the EU and Yanukovych.

    Russian President Vladimir Putin topped the ranking of the most influential people in the world according to Forbes. The 61-year-old politician was ahead of last year’s leader, American colleague Barack Obama (2nd place) and Chinese President Xi Jinping (3rd place).

    link

    The first 10 people on the Forbes list:
    1. Vladimir Putin (President of Russia)
    2. Barack Obama (US President)
    3. Xi Jingping (Chairman of the PRC)
    4. Francis (Pope)
    5. Angela Merkel (German Chancellor)
    6. Bill Gates (Microsoft CEO)
    7. Ben Bernanke (head of the US Federal Reserve)
    8. Abdullah ibn Abdul Aziz (King of Saudi Arabia)
    9. Mario Draghi (head of the ECB)
    10. Michael Duke (Chairman of the Board of Directors, Wall Mart)
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 18: 12
      +6
      Quote: Ascetic
      The first 10 people on the Forbes list:
      1. Vladimir Putin (President of Russia)
      2. Barack Obama (US President)

      Stanislav, for Ukraine speech. Yanukovych in what place winked
      1. rolik
        rolik 30 October 2013 19: 18
        +2
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Stanislav, for Ukraine speech. Yanukovych in what place

        21 - point))))))
        1. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 19: 24
          +1
          Quote: rolik
          21

          That would be really cool.

          Quote: rolik
          point)))))))

          But it’s awful for you. What do you have about such associations, a point, a geyparad. Are you going to get LHPT yourself or latent ones?
          1. rolik
            rolik 31 October 2013 12: 48
            0
            Quote: Kars
            But it’s awful for you. What do you have about such associations, a point, a geyparad. Are you going to get LHPT yourself or latent ones?

            And you do not worry about me, I'm a normal heterosexual uncle)))
            And here you have the name of the card game caused (once again) a very unhealthy interest. That you are excited at the parades of rear-wheel drive and Bendera, now the cards have caused a keen interest)))))) Dear man, all this, at least, is strange)))) lol
  • morpex
    morpex 30 October 2013 20: 33
    +3
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    I do not know how, but Putin will beat both the EU and Yanukovych.

    Here is one more powerful lever for repulsing the hunt from Janek to sign the association.
    The Russian Federation makes it clear that it reserves the opportunity not to recognize the existing borders of Ukraine after it signed the Association Agreement with the EU, Russian Presidential Advisor Glazyev openly said. Before that, Glazyev said that Ukraine was violating the Friendship Agreement with the Russian Federation, intending to sign the Agreement with EU about association. “According to article 13 of our Treaty of Friendship with Ukraine, we pledged to bring our legislation closer, to strive to create the CES. The association agreement closes such an opportunity. That is, the Ukrainian leadership violates the basic friendship treaty with Russia, on which the entire foundation of our bilateral relations is built, ”said Vladimir Putin’s adviser.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 20: 36
      +1
      Quote: morpex
      we pledged to bring our legislation closer, to strive to create the CES.

      But does the agreement on the Customs Union not violate it from Russia?
      Or does the Treaty of Friendship (where is the delimitation of the border by the way from there?) Mention Belarus and Kazakhstan?
      1. morpex
        morpex 30 October 2013 21: 35
        0
        Quote: Kars
        But does the agreement on the Customs Union not violate it on the part of Russia? Or does the Belarus and Kazakhstan mention in the Friendship Agreement (where is the delimitation of the border by the way from there?)?

        I mean. that in order to bend Janek all means are good. Just this news, which was announced by Glazv, the "gas weapon" which was again put into operation and other methods of influence, everything will now be used. The end justifies the means!. Only Russian tactics can produce an effect opposite to the expected one: a trade conflict, even a summer one, convinces the Ukrainian elite of the correctness of its choice.
        1. Kars
          Kars 30 October 2013 21: 58
          +1
          Quote: morpex
          I mean. that in order to bend Janek all means are good

          There is nothing to offer something profitable. And only to bend.
  • Kars
    Kars 30 October 2013 15: 52
    +1
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Well, already on the news, every day about Ukraine

    Why are you so worried? Are you worried about the fraternal people?
    Quote: DEMENTIY
    visa regime

    By the way, for some reason, the Russian Federation refused such an idea, it’s strange like that.
    Quote: DEMENTIY
    install prepayments

    For what? For gas and so 5 years, all prepaid.

    Well, the fact that import is being suspended right now is BEFORE the association is an excellent indicator that it is not a matter of any association, but just wants to.
    1. KCC
      KCC 30 October 2013 16: 30
      +8
      A normal reaction to the behavior of Ukraine, and we are so worried because nobody will be well.
    2. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 16: 40
      10
      Quote: Kars
      Why are you so worried? Are you worried about the fraternal people?

      Yes, no, then worry about themselves. Do not worry Kars, Europe will help wink
      Quote: Kars
      By the way, for some reason, the Russian Federation refused such an idea, it’s strange like that.

      so far, still to come.
      Quote: Kars

      For what? For gas and so 5 years, all prepaid.

      As it turned out, no, they fraternally gave ... In the morning gas-evening money.
    3. Bezarius
      Bezarius 30 October 2013 16: 56
      10
      Quote: Kars
      Why are you so worried? Are you worried about the fraternal people?

      We don’t worry about the western suburbs, let them take and do whatever they want with them.
      We worry about our lands and the Russian people, which we foolishly gave. It is necessary to revise the treaties and restore justice, leaving only the primordial lands to Ukrainians.
      Quote: Kars
      By the way, for some reason, the Russian Federation refused such an idea, it’s strange like that.

      Nothing strange, they decided to temporarily leave the backdoor for ordinary, innocent residents of Ukraine. In other matters, this does not mean that this backdoor will be left forever.
      Quote: Kars
      For what? For gas and so 5 years, all prepaid.

      Where then are the debts from? :)
      1. Kars
        Kars 30 October 2013 16: 59
        +1
        Quote: Bezarius
        We are worried about their lands

        After this, you can not continue.


        Quote: Bezarius
        Where then are the debts from? :)

        What debts? How much?
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 17: 12
          +8
          Quote: Kars

          What debts? How much?

          Yes, almost a billion bucks in August or August were gifts?
          1. Kars
            Kars 30 October 2013 18: 06
            +1
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            Yes, almost a billion bucks in August or August were gifts?


            then the debts for the received GAS? or LOAN?

            By the way, one more proof of your low intellectual level.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. rolik
              rolik 30 October 2013 19: 23
              +6
              Quote: Kars
              then the debts for the received GAS? or LOAN?

              hi wassat wassat lol
              Here AT ALL, without any comments
              1. Kars
                Kars 30 October 2013 19: 35
                +1
                Quote: rolik
                Here AT ALL, without any comments

                Well why. Could shine with Intellect.
                1. rolik
                  rolik 31 October 2013 12: 53
                  0
                  Quote: Kars
                  Well why. Could shine with Intellect.

                  Here it is necessary not to shine with intellect, INTELEHTOM. And for this, MOSCOW is needed (not a typo - it is Mosk). And I only have a brain, so I pass)))))))
            3. general
              general 30 October 2013 19: 29
              -8
              The incendiaries of ho * salchi on this site are useless, it’s time to be dismissed by the respected editors, take a look at Alexander Romanov, for example, a person who seems to be working .. oh yes, he didn’t come out. He’s not interested in him, his visits are falling, etc. Look at the Sputnik pogrom; this is where the good workers and the best srach are, this is a question for the personnel department of the Military Review.
              1. Alekseev
                Alekseev 30 October 2013 20: 44
                +5
                Quote: chung
                For example, Alexander Romanov, a kind of working man ... oh, crazy little one, yes, he didn’t come out.

                Well, dear Chung (or Chang), do not talk about others, even if you do not like it. Take care of your own mind.
                But really, why argue with Karson?
                A completely useless exercise, how can one prove something to a deaf and blind, but, on the other hand, an eloquent opponent? request
                He knows that Putin is to blame for everything (not without reason, blasphemy, the most influential person in the world wink ) - and the point!
                1. Kars
                  Kars 30 October 2013 20: 55
                  +1
                  Quote: Alekseev
                  But really, why argue with Karson?

                  You do not touch Carson. There is already such a marshal.
                  We used to hang out on the Lair - a Russian communist. Maybe you will meet me - maybe remember about me - he will tell you how on the Lair (the Ukrainian site-lokalka Kyivstar / Beeline was) they called me a mask, because the RF was protecting. But then hanging out I became better than our right to understand)))
                  Quote: Alekseev
                  oh, but an eloquent opponent?

                  I will take it for a compliment.
                  Quote: Alekseev
                  He knows that Putin is to blame.

                  and who? In the prosperity of Russian citizens, is Putin's merit also worthy? or is he out of business there?
                2. rolik
                  rolik 31 October 2013 13: 00
                  +1
                  Quote: Alekseev
                  Well dear Chung (or Chang)

                  You see, even here only Chung remained, and Chung whistled far away))))))

                  Quote: Alekseev
                  But really, why argue with Karson?

                  That's right)))))))) (only not Carson, but Kars) anyway, what to write against the wind)))))
      2. rolik
        rolik 30 October 2013 19: 20
        +2
        Quote: Bezarius
        Where then are the debts from? :)

        This is such Ukrainian accounting)))))
  • Ruslan67
    Ruslan67 30 October 2013 15: 56
    13
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    , Russia began an infrontation on Ukraine. Closer to the summit there will be more. Yes, and gas has again gone graters.

    It is interesting that Yanukovych will chew when the final and irrevocable scribe arrives? what Sahaka was chewing a tie repeat Hi Sasha drinks
    1. pensioner
      pensioner 30 October 2013 16: 37
      +8
      Quote: Ruslan67
      It is interesting that Yanukovych will chew when the final and irrevocable scribe arrives?

      Julia ... Well, or she him ... Hello Ruslan !! drinks
      1. Ruslan67
        Ruslan67 30 October 2013 16: 40
        +7
        Quote: retired
        ..Well or she him

        The classic spider layout-the male did his job head or head what Down with laughing Hi Jura drinks
        1. pensioner
          pensioner 30 October 2013 16: 46
          +2
          Quote: Ruslan67
          The classic spider layout-the male did his job head or head off

          Those. you want to say that we should expect offspring from this sweet couple, or what? what I’m even afraid to imagine: WHAT can happen. negative
          1. Ruslan67
            Ruslan67 30 October 2013 16: 48
            +4
            Quote: retired
            I'm afraid to imagine: WHAT can happen.

            Mini Klitschko with a scythe wassat
            1. Semen Semyonitch
              Semen Semyonitch 31 October 2013 12: 36
              0
              Quote: Ruslan67
              Quote: retired
              I'm afraid to imagine: WHAT can happen.

              Mini Klitschko with a scythe wassat


              Mini Klitschko? Yes, and oblique ??? wassat
          2. Ruslan67
            Ruslan67 30 October 2013 16: 49
            +3
            Quote: retired
            you should expect offspring from this sweet couple

            While they were among themselves figuring out who used to sit for president angry former boxers climb and have a chance With which I congratulate them fool
            1. Egoza
              Egoza 30 October 2013 18: 08
              +6
              Quote: Ruslan67
              former boxers climb and have chances

              Well, you still need to be allowed into the ring! He pays taxes in Germany, he has a business there, a family in America, let him run there.
    2. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 16: 41
      +4
      Quote: Ruslan67
      It is interesting that Yanukovych will chew when the final and irrevocable scribe arrives?

      Baland in the camera. Hello Ruslan hi
      1. Ruslan67
        Ruslan67 30 October 2013 16: 43
        +4
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        The balance in the camera.

        It’s difficult to chew the balance - it usually slurp laughing But I'm more inclined towards a hospital ward with soft walls and porridge through a tube wassat
    3. Egoza
      Egoza 30 October 2013 18: 05
      +5
      Quote: Ruslan67
      It is interesting that Yanukovych will chew when the final and irrevocable scribe arrives?

      So already they took away (expropriated !!!) "the only varenichnaya" in Dnepropetrovsk, which belonged to Timoshenko's daughter - Zhuzhe. From this very varenichnaya they took food to the jail for mom, so that mom would not be poisoned! Apparently now in this varenichnaya Yanukovych will eat! fellow
    4. rolik
      rolik 30 October 2013 19: 24
      +2
      Quote: Ruslan67
      It is interesting that Yanukovych will chew when the final and irrevocable scribe arrives?

      I do not know to chew, but maybe he will .... suck ??? let's say .... paw ???))))
    5. yur
      yur 30 October 2013 22: 02
      0
      Duck they go to Oyropu, there they will find something to give to chew.
  • morpex
    morpex 30 October 2013 20: 26
    +2
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Yes, and gas has again gone graters.

    By and large, they, graters, never stopped the last seven years. In general, as for me, gas wars harm everyone, but do not benefit anyone.
  • Nike
    Nike 30 October 2013 20: 32
    +1
    Alas, it’s too late. About 15 years ago it was necessary to start this, but then probably there was no time, they shared their own.
  • In the book
    In the book 31 October 2013 10: 40
    +1
    Well, the fact that "Russian brother Miller" will once again begin to pout his lips is no doubt about it. I expect gas supply problems to begin closer to December. The bear has already voiced the topic of prepayment for gas supplies to Ukraine. This is only a statement so far, i.e. only flowers. We are waiting for the continuation.
  • Xroft
    Xroft 30 October 2013 15: 53
    +3
    Do we have the same situation, to ban migration? fight against corruption? everybody drank and put it in your pocket. The case of prosecutors, theft in the Ministry of Health, everyone’s favorite stool, etc. Only in the last 5 years you can dial 10-15 large cases that have been hushed up (large ones are more than 100 million thefts), and what can we say about the regional trifle where dozens poke and do not even pay attention. Take ANY city building, ANY repair is expensive in ANY city. The situation is one .....
  • Russ69
    Russ69 30 October 2013 16: 26
    +2
    Quote: DEMENTIY
    Do your job - block imports, set prepayments, visa regime, etc. etc. - there will be more sense.

    Deliveries of railway cars have already been frozen, which is like 0,5% of GDP.
  • INTER
    INTER 30 October 2013 15: 30
    +9
    This step is similar to the collusion of TNCs with the highest authority to expand markets and destroy industry and not only industry. Accordingly, these same guys will buy for pennies enterprises, and even entire industries (mainly raw materials) and echelons to Europe. The military-industrial complex will not remain on the sidelines;
    1. seller trucks
      seller trucks 30 October 2013 15: 36
      +2
      Quote: INTER
      Accordingly, these same guys will buy for pennies enterprises, and even entire industries (mainly raw materials) and echelons to Europe. The military-industrial complex will not remain on the sidelines;


      You laugh, in Ukraine everything has long been delayed ... and plundered, you can buy up there the shabby walls of factories.
      1. Hudo
        Hudo 30 October 2013 15: 42
        +1
        Quote: seller trucks
        You laugh, in Ukraine everything has long been delayed ... and plundered, you can buy up there the shabby walls of factories.


        In addition to farmland, there is no other fuel to keep the project afloat (stealing) afloat.
        1. seller trucks
          seller trucks 30 October 2013 15: 45
          +1
          Quote: Hudo
          In addition to farmland, there is no other fuel for plunder.


          as far as I understood with this, the same everything "right" was decided
          1. Hudo
            Hudo 30 October 2013 15: 51
            +3
            Quote: seller trucks

            as far as I understood with this, the same everything "right" was decided


            The redistribution process is in full swing.
            1. Renat
              Renat 30 October 2013 16: 16
              +8
              But Yanukovych's election program was focused precisely on rapprochement with Russia. All eastern regions have voted for the Party of Regions and for this slogan. The card has already been played, can I play the bito?
              1. Hudo
                Hudo 30 October 2013 16: 35
                +1
                Quote: Renat
                But Yanukovych's election program was focused precisely on rapprochement with Russia. All eastern regions have voted for the Party of Regions and for this slogan. The card has already been played, can I play the bito?


                Well, if regarding the EU-TS referendum, the actions of the occupying Ukrainian authorities can only be described as tweaks and jumps, then they will no longer vote - FACT,
              2. Alexander Romanov
                Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 16: 42
                +4
                Quote: Renat
                But the election program of Yanukovych was focused specifically on rapprochement with Russia.

                Politician, the most deceitful profession.
                1. Renat
                  Renat 30 October 2013 19: 51
                  +1
                  Yeah. And with the right behavior, it’s also very profitable. Well, those who have no shame, no conscience, no father, no mother, no homeland, no flag.
      2. INTER
        INTER 31 October 2013 08: 14
        +1
        Quote: seller trucks
        You laugh, in Ukraine everything has long been delayed ... and plundered, you can buy up there the shabby walls of factories.

        Let me give you examples: Together with Ukraine, Russia has a transport plane, Ukraine exports BMPs, Tai sells tanks, the abrasive plant exports its products to Russia, etc. still remained, but soon ........ And this is not the main thing, the main thing is the scientific potential, and with such a makar they will all probably leave!
  • old rocket man
    old rocket man 30 October 2013 16: 57
    +5
    Quote: shtanko.49
    here you have to put your ambitions in one place.

    And he thrust it in. Yanek long ago calculated that he would not shine for a second term, and after such a reign shine for him for a long time, and so he hopes that Europe will warm him, but, apparently, he hopes they didn’t throw them like that.
    He also has relations with Russia ... so the kirdyk to Janek will be danced by a witch on his bones laughing
    1. alone
      alone 30 October 2013 20: 39
      -4
      )) everyone is so worried about Ukraine. if honestly tired already.
      let them decide where to go. all these articles, arguments remind instructions to schoolchildren))
      1. rolik
        rolik 31 October 2013 13: 04
        0
        Quote: lonely
        )) everyone is so worried about Ukraine. if honestly tired already.

        I’m absolutely not worried, adults have already grown up. Let them take care of themselves.
    2. rolik
      rolik 31 October 2013 13: 02
      0
      Quote: Old Rocketman
      He also has relations with Russia ... so the kirdyk to Janek will be danced by a witch on his bones

      Not. it will be like in a song from the cartoon of one.
      - And I want to Brazil to distant shores)))))))
  • GSH-18
    GSH-18 30 October 2013 21: 28
    +5
    Viktor Fedorovich came here to Sochi the other day, to talk with Putin. The results are not published, as far as I know .. It can be seen a lot of requests. In general, his policy begins to look like some kind of blackmail. Blackmail suicide, standing on the eaves of the 10th floor.
  • zvereok
    zvereok 31 October 2013 05: 40
    +3
    Probably something is hidden from the people, but to deceive the neighbor and rejoice, this is the favorite hobby in Yanukovych’s policy, and then he bit a bit and rushing to take it out. But for such decisions, a referendum is needed, the fate of the people, the country is decided, here you have to put your ambitions into one place.



    And you did not think about Yanukovych and about the West and Russia. The final surrender of Ukraine, the largest catastrophe in Russian foreign policy and Putin's personal failure. Nothing has really happened yet and it’s not clear how it will end, but I don’t understand the screams, let’s go, they’ll find out why they’re fucking, very similar to Yeltsin’s "Take as much sovereignty as you can carry."

    PS: All this is good, but when will they put Serdyukov?
    1. Semen Semyonitch
      Semen Semyonitch 31 October 2013 13: 37
      0
      He will not be imprisoned ... Is it not clear?
    2. Firstvanguard
      Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 16: 14
      0
      zvereok probably the first one in this shit Holivare noticed the main thing. hi
      Under the shouts of "Putin's Great Russian imperial manners," the West bombed, ruined and / or occupied half of the planet and is not going to stop. Since they do not know and do not accept any other way. They have been going this way for more than one century. Grandpa Karl Marx will not let you lie.
      Russia is not a monolith, crime and oligarchs under EBN ut, took control of almost everything, including the courts and prosecutors, created a constitution for themselves. The president is not a king; he cannot be imprisoned by decree. So we have what we have, if Putin nevertheless does foreign policy, then a real war is going on inside, right up to the top. The myth of the Putin-Medvedev tandem has been inflated by the media in order to attribute the cause of one side to the other. You know the information war ... sad
  • 0504951601
    0504951601 1 November 2013 23: 19
    0
    Dear Russians! What anxious concern for our country, Ukraine! Apparently you have already solved all your problems? at the moment it is best to just look at 10 photos of the European "hinterland" and similar Russian photos. let everyone decide with whom and where to go, time will put everything in its place
    1. Firstvanguard
      Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 16: 29
      0
      It only remains to add that the "hinterland" in the post-Soviet space began to acquire this form just in the process of "sovereignty", "rapprochement" and "partnership" with the West. And if the "hinterland" needs to be rebuilt anew, then in the megalopolises there is still something to lose. Personally, I don’t want my children to see the processions of mummers and not so 3,14 daras. Perhaps through the scope, but it's better not to get to that. am
  • Ruslan67
    Ruslan67 30 October 2013 15: 23
    +7
    Yanukovych should take care of the reform of medicine in Ukraine and especially in the field of psychiatry, after all that he directed his place, not even in the cell, but in durkee. As you know, post-Soviet psychiatry is still pretty punitive. So, you should take care of the ward more comfortable and softer wassat
    1. DEMENTIY
      DEMENTIY 30 October 2013 15: 50
      16
      Ruslan67
      Yanukovych should attend to the reform of medicine in Ukraine and especially in the field of psychiatry


      Only in Soviet psychiatry! And nothing more! there was a diagnosis - sluggish schizophrenia (according to it, the current bulk, yushchenko, etc. holy fools were lying on the bunks).
      So it turns out they were right!
      1. zvereok
        zvereok 30 October 2013 19: 10
        0
        Quote: DEMENTIY
        Ruslan67
        Yanukovych should attend to the reform of medicine in Ukraine and especially in the field of psychiatry


        Only in Soviet psychiatry! And nothing more! there was a diagnosis - sluggish schizophrenia (according to it, the current bulk, yushchenko, etc. holy fools were lying on the bunks).
        So it turns out they were right!


        Serdyukov, Medvedev? Or do not need to generalize?

        PS: All this is good, but when will they put Serdyukov?
  • catapractic
    catapractic 30 October 2013 15: 25
    15
    there are too many descendants of lackey servants in Ukraine accustomed to licking the boots of Polish lords, Kaiser soldiers and Nazi executioners, and the main trouble is that these creatures are in power
    1. alexng
      alexng 30 October 2013 15: 40
      +3
      Quote: cataphractium
      ... used to licking boots ...


      Yes, they will soon lose this opportunity to lick their boots. Wait and see.
    2. zvereok
      zvereok 30 October 2013 19: 12
      0
      Quote: cataphractium
      there are too many descendants of lackey servants in Ukraine accustomed to licking the boots of Polish lords, Kaiser soldiers and Nazi executioners, and the main trouble is that these creatures are in power



      We have no less in Russia.

      PS: All this is good, but when will they put Serdyukov?
  • major071
    major071 30 October 2013 15: 25
    13
    If Ukraine, in the person of its leadership, is not afraid of the fate of the Baltic countries, where after accession to the EU the remnants of industry were destroyed, then the matter is not clean. We must verify that suddenly Yanukovych and his relatives are already citizens of another country, and Ukraine is being handed over to pay its betrayal.
    1. zvereok
      zvereok 30 October 2013 19: 18
      0
      Quote: major071
      If Ukraine, in the person of its leadership, is not afraid of the fate of the Baltic countries, where after accession to the EU the remnants of industry were destroyed, then the matter is not clean. We must verify that suddenly Yanukovych and his relatives are already citizens of another country, and Ukraine is being handed over to pay its betrayal.


      The Baltic states have been for a long time, and even now, partly a laundry for our diversionary finances. Plus, Europe can Ukraine sweeten the pill with loans, they have a euro tea machine. About five years, brothers hold out. Then Yanuk will be in London, and Ukraine will belong to Greece.

      PS: All this is good, but when will they put Serdyukov?
  • predator.3
    predator.3 30 October 2013 15: 30
    0
    If Julia goes free, the threat to Yanukovych becomes enormous. A very specific threat to take its place in the future.


    after the next presidential election, it will be so, Julia will change the bunk for the presidency, and the Donetsk lad will go through the stage, unless of course he arrives on the banks of the Thames in a timely manner.
    1. Hudo
      Hudo 30 October 2013 15: 39
      +7
      Quote: predator.3

      after the next presidential election, it will be so, Julia will change the bunk for the presidency, and the Donetsk lad will go through the stage, unless of course he arrives on the banks of the Thames in a timely manner.

      It is not a fact that the presidential election of U itself will survive in 2015 as a whole. In any case, the current Gauleiter made a tremendous personal contribution to bring this event closer.
    2. Egoza
      Egoza 30 October 2013 18: 13
      +2
      Quote: predator.3
      Julia will exchange bunks for the presidency,

      Nope! Painfully she has bothered everyone with her "sores". They will not choose!
  • ele1285
    ele1285 30 October 2013 15: 34
    +1
    To hell with them, you won't be forcibly sweet. How much can you explain and show on your fingers? may not be jailed, just an attack.
  • mak210
    mak210 30 October 2013 15: 36
    +9
    What does the Ukrainians have to do with it? And who asked us when slammed entered the WTO (there is still no translation of the treaty into Russian, as in the African colonies of the 18th century), the 2014 Olympics, the 2018 World Cup? Now they are also pulling into the Summer Olympics. "You chose us, then we do what we want, maybe we are pleased to sit in the Presidiums." Such a policy in Russia and Ukraine and the end to it can not be seen. The Ukrainians are being pitted against the Russian invaders, us against Rovshanov and Dzhamsudov, and we calmly swallow it all: "This is who is to blame!"
    1. old rocket man
      old rocket man 30 October 2013 17: 01
      +2
      Quote: mak210
      (there is still no translation of the contract into Russian, as in the African colonies of the 18th century), the 2014 Olympics, 2018 World Cup? Now

      Yes, there is a translation, just the contract itself is signed in English, this is a common practice when joining the WTO.
  • Misantrop
    Misantrop 30 October 2013 15: 40
    14
    Quote: predator.3
    Julia will exchange bunks for the presidency
    And then we will EXACTLY make sure that in Ukraine EVERY subsequent president is clearly WELL BETTER than the previous ... request
  • Jarilo
    Jarilo 30 October 2013 15: 45
    +8
    Yes, I wonder what Yanukovych hopes for. Gorbachev’s laurels just don’t shine for him. Either someone holds him tightly by the balls, or he simply.
    1. Ingvar 72
      Ingvar 72 30 October 2013 16: 25
      +4
      Quote: Jarilo
      Or someone holds it tight by the balls,

      Most likely this option.
    2. densh
      densh 30 October 2013 16: 40
      +9
      Europe holds tight to Akhmetov’s financial eggs (rumor has it that he hit hard with Cypriot banks). But he holds tight to Mr. Yanukovych.
      Such is the EU-Ukraine gear system. hi
    3. Bober
      Bober 30 October 2013 16: 46
      +3
      Suppose he has two of them. And each individually holds someone. And these someone are also two (separate entities).
      Then it’s time to move on to .. painfully delayed his end ..... for even the horse moves sometime end anyway.
      1. Semen Semyonitch
        Semen Semyonitch 31 October 2013 13: 42
        0
        Quote: Bober
        Suppose he has two of them. And each individually holds someone. And these someone are also two (separate entities).
        Then it’s time to move on to .. painfully delayed his end ..... for even the horse moves sometime end anyway.


        + + + good drinks
  • svskor80
    svskor80 30 October 2013 15: 48
    +1
    briefly and succinctly. Everything about the case. Article plus.
  • plotnikov561956
    plotnikov561956 30 October 2013 15: 48
    +3
    Fun times are coming for Ukraine ... if there will be a reunion, it is only in the status of provinces and not soon ... and it is prudent and tough to resolve their issues ... the fraternity is tired and goes sideways ...
    1. In the book
      In the book 30 October 2013 18: 52
      -1
      It got you as much as your media let you know. And you will visit Ukraine and see how different the "reality" of Yevgeny Kiselev is from reality.
      How did the fraternity personally come to you personally.
      By God, like small children.
      1. Botanologist
        Botanologist 30 October 2013 22: 47
        +3
        Quote: Libr
        And you will visit Ukraine and see how the "reality" of Yevgeny Kiselev differs from reality.


        I visit regularly. The general impression is that the country is not just on concepts, but to an extreme degree. With a poor population. Kiev still somehow holds on, the capital as it does, but then it’s completely sad. I especially note the attitude of enterprise management to employees - feudal law rests.
        1. In the book
          In the book 31 October 2013 11: 07
          0
          "I especially note the attitude of the management of enterprises to employees - feudal law is resting."

          My dear man, that in Russia, that in Ukraine is the same thing, if the leader is - then he will relate to his subordinates.
      2. rolik
        rolik 31 October 2013 13: 05
        0
        Quote: Libr
        And you will visit Ukraine and see

        Was this summer, absolutely not happy.
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 30 October 2013 15: 49
    +6
    The media published a huge number of articles by Ukrainian politicians-European integrators. But in no article did I come across a clear detailed analysis of the consequences of Ukraine’s integration into the EU. Only spells and optimistic dreams, which can be expressed by the phrase: West nm will help! It is not known where to get money for modernization within the association, how the people will live, and many, many other questions that Ukrainian politicians do not answer ...
    1. Egoza
      Egoza 30 October 2013 18: 19
      +5
      Quote: Ivanovich47
      The media published a huge number of articles by Ukrainian politicians, European integrators. But in no article did I come across a clear detailed analysis of the consequences of Ukraine’s integration into the EU.

      So the association agreement was not translated completely !!! ONLY THE GENERAL PART is stated on the official websites of the government! So it is used by "European integrators". But the APPLICATIONS - you will not find anywhere! And they are the specifics. But this is almost 800 pages! Our people's deputies won't be able to do that much! But in Kiev there are already "support groups" that explain to passers-by all the need to sign the association.
      1. Firstvanguard
        Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 16: 36
        0
        And I don’t think it’s free wassat
  • Mareman Vasilich
    Mareman Vasilich 30 October 2013 15: 55
    +3
    Although Nikolai Starikov is not always sincere, he acts according to the old, but true principle "We must tell the truth, always the truth, but not necessarily the whole", here it is difficult to disagree with him.
  • Vital 33
    Vital 33 30 October 2013 16: 10
    +1
    Well, thank God ... about Ukraine, otherwise I started to worry ...
  • Troy
    Troy 30 October 2013 16: 13
    +4
    Over the past month, a huge number of articles on the signing of this agreement by Ukraine were discussed. Why pour from empty to empty? The Ukrainian government has made its choice. Now all that remains is to wait for how this will end for them, and there is not much to wait by historical standards. A year or two will put everything in its place. And here the fun begins.
  • lotar
    lotar 30 October 2013 16: 14
    +2
    Concisely and intelligibly, I doubt that the main character of this play will finish well.
  • Shadowcat
    Shadowcat 30 October 2013 16: 16
    +6
    * Looks at Bulgaria, Greece, Romania and Hungary * Well forward Ukraine, forward
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 30 October 2013 16: 44
      +4
      Quote: ShadowCat
      * Looks at Bulgaria, Greece, Romania and Hungary *

      In Ukraine, they look at France, Holland, Germany, and these countries ........... well, as if they weren’t laughing
      1. Firstvanguard
        Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 17: 05
        0
        French, British, Dutch ... Germans, when necessary, know how to be very affectionate and responsive to untermensch lol
  • Peaceful military
    Peaceful military 30 October 2013 16: 41
    12
    The arguments of reason in such cases are useless. When A. Rosenberg, a native of Revel / Tallinn, declared Estonians to be racially close to the Germans, the Estonians were thrown into the Waffen SS and police battalions en masse. This territory was the first to announce the "Juden Fry" ...
    When the same Estonians were hammered into their heads in the 80s that they were a super-European ethnos, they happily gave up the entire industry, fishing and farming to the "brothers" of Heroes, just to hear that they are Europeans, unlike Russians inhumans.
    Now it was the turn of ho_khlov to be proud, the most ancient uk_ra, the progenitors of European civilization. To hear this to themselves, they, like the Balts, are ready to give everything. fool
  • pensioner
    pensioner 30 October 2013 16: 42
    +2
    Here again, the topic of gas debts arose. About 1 billion green Ukraine should in September. I'm wondering. Is Ukraine also recklessly calculating its obligations with other countries or only with Russia? Were Ukraine late in payments to Western enterprises, banks, etc.? And what were the consequences? Enlighten who is in the know.
    1. Djozz
      Djozz 30 October 2013 18: 20
      +4
      Well, you won’t get there at once, they’ll deliver cancer and drag them through the courts, democracy, with her mother!
  • ZU-23
    ZU-23 30 October 2013 16: 50
    +4
    As I sincerely regret Ukraine, these stealing Yanyks with oligarchs generally got out of control, put people on the border, disappeared or disappeared, it’s unlikely that anyone is going to extinguish Gazprom’s debts)))
  • Danil
    Danil 30 October 2013 16: 52
    +8
    I agree that everything that happens to Russia's closest neighbors is directed against Russia. But what Russia is today is a handful of oligarchs of incomprehensible origin, which keeps the whole people on a drain, uses natural resources and brains the people like them, that is, the people live well. If my parents living in the Urals, enjoyed all the benefits of natural resources that supposedly belong to them, then I am more than sure that the whole Soviet people would not even have thought about any other integration. And in the depths of deprivation, generally zero, as it was 25 years ago, it remained at the same level, well, of course, depreciation is the rent is 3 times higher than the Ukrainian - although they don’t buy gas anywhere, and they only announced at home.
    And nothing remains for Yanyku, as in Europe, otherwise the Magadan lads will spoil the entire Ukrainian common fund.
    1. Firstvanguard
      Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 17: 09
      0
      That way:
  • makarov
    makarov 30 October 2013 16: 56
    10
    For some reason, the author kept silent about the main reason for Yanukovych's desire to cram into the EU. All material resources of his so-called. "families" and the closest oligarchic circles are located in the eurozone and offshore zones controlled by the West and the United States. I suppose that he was simply hinted that in accordance with the convention on the fight against funds obtained by criminal means, ALL "penny" and real estate will be sequestered. and everything else (described) in secondary roles.
    1. ZU-23
      ZU-23 30 October 2013 17: 25
      +3
      And what a blow to Orthodoxy, the creatures of Kievan Rus merged, here they are, the shameful Judas, these Yanyks.
    2. Djozz
      Djozz 30 October 2013 18: 24
      +2
      Why hint, apparently they froze a couple - three accounts for spite someone who needs it, and the problem is solved.
  • 222222
    222222 30 October 2013 16: 59
    16
    There are a lot of letters and nothing .. Under capitalism, the law of conservation of capital applies ..
    1. Where is the capital of the new oligarchs of the new Ukrainians stored? Right-ZA Bugrom ..
    2. Who can guarantee the safety of these overworked capital earned? That's right, those who are over the hill ..
    3. Under what conditions can they guarantee the preservation of these capital ..? Correct, with complete obedience and not murmuring.
    And you say the economy .. The economy doesn’t smell like that ..
    1. Odysseus
      Odysseus 30 October 2013 17: 20
      +3
      Quote: 222222
      There are a lot of letters and nothing .. Under capitalism, the law of conservation of capital applies ..
      1. Where is the capital of the new oligarchs of the new Ukrainians stored? Right-ZA Bugrom ..

      Quite right. However, it also applies to the New Russian oligarchs. The difference between Ukraine and Russia is that the Ukrainian capitalists (bandits) are taken at least into association with the EU (of course, they will not accept the EU itself), and even the Russians are denied to facilitate the visa regime. Although they are desperate for this.
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 30 October 2013 23: 24
        0
        Quote: Odyssey
        Quite right. However, it also applies to the New Russian oligarchs. The difference between Ukraine and Russia is that the Ukrainian capitalists (bandits) are taken at least into association with the EU (of course, they will not accept the EU itself), and even the Russians are denied to facilitate the visa regime. Although they are desperate for this.

        You confuse such concepts as capital and money, abroad they store money, and capital is the totality of the means of production by which this money is earned and they will not go anywhere from the country of residence.
    2. ZU-23
      ZU-23 30 October 2013 17: 30
      +1
      Who will the brothers fight for, God forbid, for Europe or Russia?
      1. apostol88
        apostol88 30 October 2013 18: 24
        +1
        Are you going to fight Europe? belay
        1. ZU-23
          ZU-23 30 October 2013 19: 08
          0
          So you climbed sixes into sixes of Americans, and we don’t get along with idiots with them, you’ll see the American missile defense too laughing
        2. Botanologist
          Botanologist 30 October 2013 22: 51
          +2
          Quote: apostol88
          Are you going to fight Europe?


          The history of Russia knows many wars with Europe. So there is nothing new in this.
        3. Setrac
          Setrac 30 October 2013 23: 25
          +3
          Quote: apostol88
          Are you going to fight Europe?

          This is Europe and the USA are going to fight with Russia.
        4. Firstvanguard
          Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 17: 14
          0
          Are you going to fight Europe? belay

          She has been fighting with us for centuries, not with the sword, so with the dollar / euro, and she is not going to stop.
  • Samsebenaum
    Samsebenaum 30 October 2013 17: 03
    18
    Guys, take care of your nerves.
    Ukraine has already made its choice. She does not want to build further relations with us.
    If so, let us turn our faces to Russia, and to an independent ass.
    Imagine your wife seduced by a rich and prudent gentleman who only wants to have her. She, a fool, collected things and dreams of great love and other people's wealth, while she wants to go to bed with you in breaks ... And everyone knows about it.
    It is very similar to the desire of Ukraine to live with the EU and the CU.
    Like this: eat a fish and ... then you yourself know ...
    Well, will we persuade, sob or arrange our life? The best choice is to find another woman, better than the former ... And the first will be marred and abandoned.
    There are examples of this.
    Of course, we will have to build alternative factories on our own land and for ourselves.
    So it's great!
    Most importantly, new jobs will be added, domestic goods ... We will only become stronger ...
    Here we are, just and will be independent and independent.
    It’s a pity, of course, that Ukrainian politicians have sprinkled brains on people. This is understandable, because they are not for Ukraine, they are not thinking for the people, but for their loot ...
    In general, we go home.
    1. Troy
      Troy 30 October 2013 17: 16
      +5
      Dear, the saddest thing is that the government of Ukraine decided so, not the people. Therefore, I say that the most interesting is to come. When the east and the center break out and the people become impoverished, the finale of this drama will begin.
    2. ZU-23
      ZU-23 30 October 2013 17: 46
      +3
      Yesya, they are to my God’s heart and soul, I’m also from Kiev, this is a Judaic setup.
    3. In the book
      In the book 30 October 2013 19: 05
      +2
      I will express my opinion.
      I do not like the idea of ​​Ukraine joining either the CU or the EU. To be friends - yes, to cooperate - yes. And to go under someone?
      And for this you need to be a strong enough political and economic state. To my greatest regret, none of the presidents took significant steps to ensure that Ukraine, as a strong economic power, took place. As for the last people's "chosen one", it is written on his forehead how afraid he is of losing the presidency. In his terrible nightmares, Yulia Tymoshenko in the rank of president sends him to the zone.
      But there is something ...
  • vlad.svargin
    vlad.svargin 30 October 2013 17: 17
    +2
    Is Yanukovych bluffing! In either case, it's time for him to pack his things. It is not too late and there is time to "recover" from "Antlantic hypnosis" ...
  • IOwTZ
    IOwTZ 30 October 2013 17: 18
    +2
    In my opinion, Jan knocked out guarantees for himself, such as those from Gorbachev, Shevardnadze, the former Polish president (I can't remember the name), etc. The West went towards this systematically and, alas, it seems that it was able to wrest Ukraine from Russia (a piece of Russia from Russia). "Our" Politburo needs to learn this, although no, he wrote nonsense. "Our" Politburo is no longer ours and has long been trained in the interests of those countries where they received their education. The next generation is their kids. And Jan will lecture around the world and advertise pizza. Well, and we will still be indignant on the "military review" website or on other Internet sites. Something like this.
  • gameover65
    gameover65 30 October 2013 17: 18
    16
    yes tries do we need Ukraine, in that state of minds of people living there?
    We have few problems? little Caucasus with the same mood?
    it is not Ukraine that we need, but we are Ukraine!
    want to go to europe? let them kick!
    Stalin made a huge mistake by joining western Ukraine!
    the whole history of Ukraine is to gain independence, run into, and then ask Russia to help!
    in the furnace Ukraine! Donbass and Crimea Russian territories. zapadentsy let even where marching!
    1. Troy
      Troy 30 October 2013 17: 26
      +8
      You correctly divided Ukraine into western and eastern. Zapadensky prostitutes can go wherever they want, but eastern Ukraine is our brothers, and no one asked them whether to sign this agreement or not.
    2. Egoza
      Egoza 30 October 2013 18: 28
      +4
      Quote: gameover65
      Stalin made a huge mistake by joining western Ukraine!

      You should not think so. At that time, in those political conditions, Stalin created a SHIELD in front of Russia, which at least somehow slowed down the advance of the Nazis. He perfectly understood that Hitler would attack, only he didn’t calculate in time. But after the war, it was necessary to completely eradicate all of this Bandera shushera, regardless of the need for labor to restore the country. SUCH it was necessary to finish completely!
      1. xan
        xan 30 October 2013 19: 01
        +2
        Quote: Egoza
        But after the war, it was necessary to completely eradicate all of this Bandera shusher, regardless of the need for labor to restore the country. SUCH it was necessary to finish completely!

        To exile to Siberia, there are any in the second or third generation supporters of a single and indivisible.
        But Siberia is a pity.
        Maybe it’s right that they no longer send them there.
        1. Brother
          Brother 31 October 2013 11: 46
          +1
          I don’t need anyone in Siberia, everything is fine and calm with us, there wasn’t enough for us to send any human rot!
  • Irtysh
    Irtysh 30 October 2013 17: 27
    +4
    This summer I visited Western Ukraine. In particular, he was on a tour at the Lychakiv Cemetery, which is in Lviv. He was very impressed with the graves of Polish and Ukrainian soldiers. In 1919, they mercilessly crushed each other.

    A lot of Polish delegations visit this memorial EVERY DAY. I talked with the Poles. So you know, panov, they consider Western Ukraine their original territories, and Ukrainians-this is some kind of misunderstanding on these lands.

    Can't the Ukrainians see that after the signing of the association, all this Polish nationalist Kodla will rush to their former plots? Will there be a massacre again? Will you kill each other again? "Curses" just seem like a kindergarten.
    1. fzr1000
      fzr1000 30 October 2013 17: 54
      +3
      If you have read Gogol a lot and watched historical films, then you should understand that zap. Ukrainians and Poles practically did not differ in any way externally or internally. And not only from the Poles, but also from other inhabitants of Austria-Hungary, in which some of them lived. The Ukrainians to the east (but not from the present-day Eastern Ukraine) differed from the non-aristocratic Poles only in Orthodoxy, and so the way of life was very similar. The Cossacks were generally as "frostbitten" as the gentry. Therefore, there is nothing surprising here.
  • Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. 30 October 2013 17: 32
    +1
    Quote: retired
    Now it is the turn of _ov to be proud, ancient ukr_ami, the progenitors of European civilization. To hear this to themselves, they, like the Balts, are ready to give everything.

    In my opinion, the propaganda directed against us affects them even stronger (neighbors). We have nowhere to go, we will remain those who we are. And they think, when it affects us, it’s good that we are not Russian. And they’re over there, and it’s easier to believe about others. I'm not talking about those who have a direct interest.
  • rapid1934
    rapid1934 30 October 2013 17: 35
    +5
    Ukraine has already made its choice. request And we will still be nervous - a lot of relatives and friends live in Ukraine. And we understand what ... they are trying to shove them under the slogan of independence. hi I'd like to believe in the best, but it doesn’t work out .... request
  • sxn278619
    sxn278619 30 October 2013 17: 37
    +2
    In a normal economy, imports are equal to exports.
    Therefore, cheap imported goods will not get to Ukraine, because there will be no currency to buy them.
    And in addition, the closure of enterprises will lead to lower household incomes, i.e. Again, no one will buy imports.
    And it will go to Russia through Ukraine ..
  • toos_1799
    toos_1799 30 October 2013 17: 47
    +1
    Good article. Many people care about
  • MG42
    MG42 30 October 2013 17: 51
    +6
    Quote: Author Nikolai Starikov
    Ukraine is committed to introduce these new technical regulations. FOR ONE YEAR. In Europe, they went to them for decades. I think that it is not difficult to predict the further development of events for Ukrainian manufacturers of all industries.

    In addition to European standards, we will receive European prices with Ukrainian salaries, this is called shock therapy, Poland went this way in the 90s, but its economy was not particularly integrated, like the Ukrainian one, the starting conditions are different
    Quote: Author Nikolai Starikov
    It would be very funny if it were not so sad. If Julia is released, the threat to Yanukovych becomes enormous. It is a specific threat to take its place in the future.

    It’s impossible to enter the same river twice; the threat to \ Yanukovych is him and his oligarchs, there is a young rising star Vitali Klitschko who announced that he will participate in the presidential race in 2015, and they won’t remove any criminal record from Yulia and she can stay in that case in Germany, like her husband, Alexander Tymoshenko, now in the Czech Republic asked for political asylum ..
    If Yanukovych still decides to sign documents with the West, it means that he received guarantees of personal immunity from this West. Or we should recognize the head of Ukraine as clearly seen in suicidal political inclinations.

    The fate of Yanukovych is secondary here after 2015, he will be remembered as Yushchenko now, almost no one remembers Kravchuk and Kuchma. But the wood will break it yes .. apparently he will rake up money so that he and his great-grandchildren have enough and then the grass does not grow. << After me, even a flood! >>
    1. ZU-23
      ZU-23 30 October 2013 18: 16
      +3
      to buy, gasoline 2 euros, bread 2 euros, they will buy their own products at European prices.
  • Samsebenaum
    Samsebenaum 30 October 2013 18: 02
    +3
    Guys, we won’t change anything right now.
    Even the GDP decided with Yanuk not to discuss face-to-face neither entry into the CU nor the EU.
    Politicians of Ukraine are now in a crazy frenzy.
    Sadly, you will probably have to draw up a passport ...
    Now, if the Donbass with the Crimea, rose, it would be a serious argument.
    But people are promised a European standard of living. So they found a "sweet remedy" for the protests.
    Propaganda is a terrible force.
    1. In the book
      In the book 30 October 2013 19: 09
      +4
      "Even VVP has decided not to discuss one-on-one with Yanuca neither joining the CU nor the EU."

      What then did they grind for five hours in a row in Sochi?
      Yanukovych rushing around, rushing around. Everyone hopes that someone will give him some guarantees. Who needs it?
  • morpogr
    morpogr 30 October 2013 18: 11
    +4
    It’s a pity that the opinion of the people in power is sideways. Apparently the orange revolution which also promised a bright future in the West did not go off in vain. After a year, if the agreement is signed, there will be another redistribution of power if it is bloodless but the country will be divided into several parts.
    1. Troy
      Troy 30 October 2013 18: 13
      +1
      But you are sure that they will separate without blood, I’m not sure. Let’s live and see.
  • Samsebenaum
    Samsebenaum 30 October 2013 18: 23
    +5
    And here is the one who conducts everything, gave a voice:
    "The United States is ready to help Ukraine fulfill the terms of the Association Agreement with the European Union," US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyett said during a lecture at the Kiev Mohyla Academy on October 29, a REGNUM correspondent reports.
    ".. The American diplomat also added that the United States is ready to help Ukraine, including bringing Ukrainian technical regulations in line with European standards ..."

    And on October 29, in an interview with Russian television channels, Advisor to the President of Russia Sergei Glazyev said that the center and headquarters of Ukrainian European integration is located in the US embassy in Kiev.
    That's all.
    Goodbye Ukraine !!! Independent and independent, say ...?
    1. In the book
      In the book 30 October 2013 19: 13
      0
      Glazyev (Kiselev, Zhirinovsky, Onishchenko) to listen - do not respect yourself.
      Glazyev, by the way, is a Ukrainian, a native of Zaporozhye.
      And who hates drinkers the most? Former alcoholic.
  • Troy
    Troy 30 October 2013 18: 25
    -1
    Let's see what happens ..
    1. Samsebenaum
      Samsebenaum 30 October 2013 18: 34
      +3
      Troy
      Quote: Troy
      Let's see what happens ..

      And it’s already visible.
      Ukrainian and Russian border guards began to equip the border between the two countries with wire ...

      "Engineering equipment of the border in the most unprotected and dangerous areas is carried out both from the Russian and Ukrainian sides"
      According to "League", ... in addition to installing a wire fence, the border guards are digging ditches ... "
      So it began ...
      I think NATO will not miss such a tidbit in the future ... Moreover, our main argument is that nuclear weapons are useless
  • Walker1975
    Walker1975 30 October 2013 18: 39
    -1
    Article minus. But more I liked the other thoughts of Russians in the internet. For example,

    From the point of view of the majority of Russians, and even more so to the Russian authorities, the behavior of Ukraine is characterized simply and clearly: betrayal and stupidity.

    Do not count the horror stories that Russia promised, and at times has already demonstrated to Ukraine.

    Here is the price of gas. Here and South Stream bypassing the Ukrainian gas transmission system. Here and honest compliance with customs regulations by Russia. And the refusal to let us into their poisoned sweets. I do not even speak about visas for migrants and a passport for mutual trips. By the way, we are already building a fence at the border.

    The latest Russian warnings are generally like episodes from a horror movie. The collapse of agriculture. Mass unemployment. And our president generally expressed himself absolutely clearly and in the spirit that, with our close cooperation, Russia will still survive the divorce from Ukraine (the fact of divorce itself is not subject to discussion). But Ukraine is waiting for deindustrialization ...

    And we lured them like that !!

    Visa-free regime. Reduced gas price. Mutual privatization. Turn Crimea into a pearl of the Black Sea. Antonov we will buy them !! Loans are huge ...

    Does not help. Rested, and all !!! As usual…

    Europe, however, also inherits from Russia in this regard. Because the reception of Ukraine will result in a bunch of problems for it.

    And Ukrainian migrants to them will break irresistibly. And they will have to feed Ukraine. And pay for Russian gas.

    In general, again only Russia understands all the negative consequences of such a step for Europe. But Europe itself does not understand a damn thing, and is pulling, pulling this Ukraine to itself ...

    But this is not important, because I do not mind Europe at all !!!

    Personally, I don’t understand something else. And I absolutely do not care what they say, and what the Ukrainians are guided by. And they are right at the same time or not. And even if their motive is the one and only: THEY DO NOT WANT TO GO TOGETHER WITH RUSSIA!

    Well, they just don’t want to. They do not need Russia, but Europe.

    Right, wrong, not important. Another thing is important.
  • Walker1975
    Walker1975 30 October 2013 18: 40
    0
    RUSSIA TO UKRAINE - WHY? !!!

    Let them be stupid there. Unable to understand their own benefits, unlike Russian politicians. And the whole detriment of their actions for Ukraine is also not able to understand. They understand how stupid they are. But they themselves do not understand!

    It turns out that we - the Russians - are driven simply by elementary pity? To stupid neighbors who would be lost without us? And they don’t understand this? Somehow I don’t really believe in it ...

    Well, they will leave. It will be worse for them - not for us ?! Well, let it be !! We will live without them !! And let them saw the branch on which they sit. But when they saw it off, but with all the dope head down-grunting !! That apologize to us to ask for forgiveness !! And we ... All remember. With triumph.

    No!!! Now we are trying to reason, we dissuade ...

    Why? Maybe there are other reasons? Besides pity?

    For example, the elementary envy that Ukraine will now become (sooner or later) a part of the civilized world.

    What is forced, but will rebuild its economy to world standards, albeit difficult, but rebuild. Because it will have to do it. And he will live better than us. Without our gas and our fat market.

    Or we are driven by terrible irritation and amazement that the vast nuclear Russia says: "Nee-zee !!!" - but they are not afraid ...

    Or are we scared that other former fraternal peoples will also spit on their big brother and go to integrate into the world system, and not into the Eurasian Soviet Union ...

    Or that the Russian people will suddenly once ask: “Why didn’t Ukraine collapse, but it lives very well, having gone to Europe ?! Maybe for us? ... "

    I really don’t understand what’s the matter. And it would be very interesting to understand.
    1. ZU-23
      ZU-23 30 October 2013 19: 01
      +3
      Well, God forbid, of course, you would be civilized like Holland))), I would understand if you wrote this text in the early 90s, but today you can’t believe that everything will go smoothly, you will definitely have worse times than now, at least least 5 years at least. It’s just that Ukraine proved to everyone its independence, and now it will be in the snoop of those whom we together won, it’s sad.
    2. JIaIIoTb
      JIaIIoTb 30 October 2013 19: 04
      11
      You will live well, we will be happy for you.
      You will live better than us, we will be proud of you.
      You will live badly, we will worry about you.
      But you will pay for gas anyway.
      1. ZU-23
        ZU-23 30 October 2013 19: 14
        +2
        So the point is, well, they would be a powerful European country like Germany and with us in the neighborhood, who would be against everything just for, but since it would be European Honduras with us in the neighborhood, from which there is nothing to take. The fact that in Kiev itself will be good there is no doubt here, and the rest there will be incredibly stuck)))
    3. Old skeptic
      Old skeptic 30 October 2013 19: 13
      +3
      Imagine the situation:
      One of the three sisters fell into the bonds of a marriage swindler. The other two shout to her - "He will rip you off, wrap you around and leave you, come home before it's too late", and she answered them "I love him."

      Of course, there is a possibility that the scammer will fall in love with his sister and will tie up with an offensive past, but this probability is vanishingly small.

      And what will happen to my sister after this stormy romance? And where is she then?
      1. In the book
        In the book 30 October 2013 19: 17
        0
        Meanwhile, Russia has already begun to equip the border with Ukraine with barbed wire.
        "Similar structures have appeared, in particular, in the Luhansk region"
    4. xan
      xan 30 October 2013 19: 16
      +4
      Quote: Walker1975
      I really don’t understand what’s the matter. And it would be very interesting to understand.

      We do not need all of Ukraine, but our lands with our people. We doubt very much what they want in the EU; nobody asked them.
      And those who want to the EU are not ours, but yours, who mistakenly got their own, and who think that with this lack of power they can escape to Europe, they will protect them there.
      Where are you going to Svidomo with Europe?
      1. Walker1975
        Walker1975 30 October 2013 19: 43
        -2
        Quote: xan
        We do not need all of Ukraine, but our lands with our people. We doubt very much what they want in the EU; nobody asked them.


        Our? Did you buy them? So maybe protect the Russians in Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan?
        1. yur
          yur 30 October 2013 22: 54
          +1
          We’ll defend the time — everywhere in Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan and Ukraine.
        2. xan
          xan 30 October 2013 23: 10
          +5
          Quote: Walker1975
          So maybe protect the Russians in Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan?

          In Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan is not our land. And half of Ukraine is our land.
          Recently I read about Khmelnitsky at Valishevsky (Pole-Russophobe). The tsar who fled from the Poles of Ukrainians ordered the Belgorod voivode to settle on the lands that are now Ukrainian, and on which Kharkov is located. The Ukrainians under no sauce were given to the Poles for reprisal, although they should have been under contracts. Should I calmly watch how they turn them into Russophobes?
          Not to keep you the raguli of the Russian lands, because you are stupid, and Europe will not help you - they will soon have to pray for the Russians when they come to their senses.
          1. Walker1975
            Walker1975 31 October 2013 01: 47
            -1
            Or maybe the other way around? Half of Russia is our land ... Here, the Prince of Kiev founded Moscow. So the native Ukrainian land :)
            1. loisop
              loisop 31 October 2013 09: 40
              +2
              In which year he founded, do not remember? Are there any political maps about that period with the state of Ukraine expanding expansively to the North and East?
            2. xan
              xan 31 October 2013 18: 32
              0
              Quote: Walker1975
              Or maybe the other way around? Half of Russia is our land ... Here, the Prince of Kiev founded Moscow. So the native Ukrainian land :)

              The Kiev prince is not Ukrainian. Ukrainians are residents of territories controlled by Polish-Lithuanian feudal lords.
              Your land - the three regions that became part of Russia in the Pereyaslavl Rada, and the fact that the Ukrainian Stalin took away from Poland - it is true that you still need to resolve the problems with the Poles with uncertain prospects, the Romanians have jammed you.
    5. Setrac
      Setrac 30 October 2013 23: 42
      0
      Quote: Walker1975
      For example, the elementary envy that Ukraine will now become (sooner or later) a part of the civilized world.

      There is no civilization in the EU, there are killers, scammers and extortionists. Civilization is Russia, China and India.
      1. Kars
        Kars 30 October 2013 23: 55
        +2
        Quote: Setrac
        Civilization is Russia, China and India.

        How generous you are today. Even India and China threw a piece)))
        1. Setrac
          Setrac 31 October 2013 01: 21
          +3
          Quote: Kars
          How generous you are today. Even India and China threw a piece)))

          There are undoubtedly more civilizations, but of all civilizations, Europe and North America are the most uncivilized.
          1. Kars
            Kars 31 October 2013 13: 04
            +1
            Quote: Setrac
            however, of all civilizations, Europe and North America are the most uncivilized.

            On which scale?
            1. Setrac
              Setrac 31 October 2013 21: 59
              +1
              Quote: Kars
              On which scale?

              On a scale of decency, honesty, humanity - the West at the very end.
              But in terms of aggressiveness, greed, hatred - the West is ahead of the rest.
              1. Kars
                Kars 31 October 2013 22: 07
                +1
                Quote: Setrac
                On a scale of decency, honesty, humanity

                Oh well? And where to look at such a scale? And in which units is measured, for example, garlic?
                Quote: Setrac
                But in terms of aggressiveness, greed, hatred - the West is ahead of the rest.

                Well, do not be upset.
                1. Setrac
                  Setrac 31 October 2013 22: 59
                  +1
                  Quote: Kars
                  Which units are measured for example garlic?

                  Honesty can be measured by the amount of bad debt.
                  Country Government Debt at 2010
                  (billion USD)% of GDP per capita (USD) Government debt at 2008
                  (billion USD)
                  США 9133 62 % 29158 5415, 38
                  Япония 8512 198 % 67303 7469, 172
                  Германия2446 83 % 30024 1931, 66



                  top three
                  1. Kars
                    Kars 31 October 2013 23: 05
                    +1
                    Quote: Setrac
                    top three

                    Are you really that .. smart ..?
                    I am defeated.
                    Quote: Setrac
                    Country Government Debt at 2010

                    This is an overdue debt and they refuse to pay it? Do not make current payments?

                    And by the way, those who lent on which units the measurements are taken? Who gave the most the more honest? Or generous? Stupid?
                    And I wonder how it relates to civilizations?
                    1. Setrac
                      Setrac 31 October 2013 23: 20
                      0
                      Quote: Kars
                      Are you really that .. smart ..?

                      What do you think? This is not for you to twist sparrows!
                      Quote: Kars
                      And I wonder how it relates to civilizations?

                      This is all somehow too emotional, where are the objections with meaning?
                      1. Kars
                        Kars 31 October 2013 23: 24
                        +1
                        Quote: Setrac
                        where are the objections

                        Why mind? You wrote nonsense worthy of a schoolboy))

                        State debt sotstsnit with Honesty))) They borrowed money in deception? By the way, the Russian Federation also has state debt, are you aware?

                        I didn’t discuss the Superjet with you?

                        The SSJ-100 aircraft manufacturer Sukhoi Civil Aircraft (SCAC) increased its net loss almost threefold in January-September 2013 compared to the same period last year, according to the SCAC RAS ​​report.

                        The company's net loss increased from almost 2,545 billion rubles to 7,285 billion rubles. GSS revenue decreased from 4,1 billion rubles to 3,5 billion rubles. Cost of sales decreased from 5,23 billion to 4,49 billion rubles.

                        GSS management expenses increased 1,8 times - from 252 million rubles to 455,9 million rubles.
                        As of September 30, 2013, the company's long-term liabilities amount to almost 69,6 billion rubles (as of June 30 of the same year - 59,6 billion rubles), including the "borrowed funds" indicator - more than 62,6 billion rubles (three months ago it was 59,6 billion rubles).

                        Sukhoi Aviation Holding Company and Sukhoi Design Bureau own 75% plus 1 share of the SCAC, World's Wing SA (a subsidiary of Alenia Aermacchi, part of Finmeccanica) owns 25% plus 1 share.
    6. xan
      xan 31 October 2013 00: 37
      +1
      Quote: Walker1975
      For example, the elementary envy that Ukraine will now become (sooner or later) a part of the civilized world.

      Like Turkey, Libya, Syria, Mozambique, Algeria, Tunisia and other associated members.
      Lord, how can one be such a woodpecker?
      The whole story speaks of what can only be done by ourselves. And only to Ukrainians she says that it is possible to jam someone so that they will do everything for the Ukrainians.
      Extra evidence of why the Ukrainians in RI were sucking.
    7. loisop
      loisop 31 October 2013 09: 35
      0
      Sorry, friend, for a personal question. Do you seem to be alone in the family of your parents?
    8. Firstvanguard
      Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 17: 36
      0
      I really don’t understand what’s the matter. And it would be very interesting to understand.

      Everything is very simple. From the point of view of geopolitics, the geyropization of Ukraine is a major defeat for Russia in the global confrontation. And in the cold war, as in the hot war, defeat means losses and casualties, often irreparable. wink
      Or does someone think that the "cold war" is over ??? wassat
      For the naive I will explain. The end of the arms race with the USSR, due to its collapse, marked the largest victory of mattresses with mattresses in the Cold War. Such losses and victims of the Soviet people, even in the pink dreams of Hitler and Goebbels, were not expected. But even victory in a major battle is not the end of a war.
      And in order for people to die in the Cold War concentration camps and not even think about it, the concept of the "cold war" was replaced by the "arms race" which really stopped for a while. Unilaterally. soldier
  • Old skeptic
    Old skeptic 30 October 2013 19: 03
    +2
    Quote: Kars
    And then the Russian aligarchs will buy everything for nothing and ruin it, why do they need competitors. (Ukrainian industry is not an EU competitor, namely Russia, we have similar technologies, and we do almost the same thing)


    Have you bought an enterprise with similar technologies and will certainly try to drown it? Is this some kind of Ukrainian logic?
  • T-130
    T-130 30 October 2013 19: 07
    +3
    Damn got it! How much can I suck on this topic? Well, Ukraine will enter the EU then and see what happens!
  • Samsebenaum
    Samsebenaum 30 October 2013 19: 10
    +6
    Walker1975
    I will answer your comment. I’ll answer not for everyone, but only for myself.
    Perhaps someone shares my views.
    I'll start with your individual paragraphs:

    Quote: Walker1975
    For example, the elementary envy that Ukraine will now become (sooner or later) a part of the civilized world.

    Envy? This feeling never even came ...
    Rather, condolences over the entry into the world of gays, lesbians, drug addicts. Europeans will never, I repeat, never Ukraine, as Russia and Georgia and Moldova and Mongolia will not be considered equal.
    They have such a mentality.
    Quote: Walker1975
    What is forced, but will rebuild its economy to world standards, albeit difficult, but rebuild. Because it will have to do it. And he will live better than us. Without our gas and our fat market.

    Someday maybe rebuild. Forced. (What about the independence and independence?) If theft and corruption are defeated.
    And I very, very doubt it.
    .
    Quote: Walker1975
    Russia will still survive the divorce from Ukraine (the fact of divorce itself is not subject to discussion). But Ukraine is waiting for deindustrialization ...

    And why not?
    As soon as the first persons get access to European money, their mind will leave. Only focus on your own pocket. And this is our common mentality. It’s easy to ruin a country. We went through it.
    You’re gagging Europe with your freaks, don’t go to your grandmother ..
    Quote: Walker1975
    Or that the Russian people will suddenly once ask: “Why didn’t Ukraine collapse, but it lives very well, having gone to Europe ?! Maybe for us? ... "

    These are your dreams. Do you really believe it? Examples please go to the studio. I do not know such. All "integrators" have a very sour look and big financial problems.
    I will stop there. Understand yourself in your home. Dream, hope, believe.
    In general, as you want ...
    1. Walker1975
      Walker1975 30 October 2013 19: 49
      -3
      Quote: Samsebenum
      These are your dreams. Do you really believe it? Examples please go to the studio. I do not know such. All "integrators" have a very sour look and big financial problems.
      I will stop there. Understand yourself in your home. Dream, hope, believe.
      In general, as you want ...


      You better give me examples of lands that began to live better after joining the USSR or the Russian Federation. Let's look at examples: the GDR and the FRG, the DPRK and South Korea, the Korelia and Finland, the Kaliningrad region and Germany, the Kuril Islands and Japan, the Far East and Alaska. I am sure that in 50 years the difference between Georgia and South Ossetia will be clearly visible (if Georgia is not dragged under the influence of the Russian Federation). If the same land was divided and ruled by the Russian Empire or the USSR, and our probable adversary by the other, then the Russian part was desolate.
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 30 October 2013 20: 01
        +5
        That's where the legs grow from. In your examples, the source of economic recovery was US subsidies. In almost all, Finland, which built its well-being on excellent relations with the USSR, you should not have included in this list. Do not think, agree?

        Do you seriously think that the United States and Ukraine will be taken for maintenance like Georgia? Will they pull?

        Something tells me that Ukraine itself will be a cash cow. And the EU will solve its problems at its expense.
        1. Walker1975
          Walker1975 31 October 2013 01: 49
          0
          Quote: Spade
          In almost all, Finland, which built its well-being on excellent relations with the USSR, you should not have included in this list. Do not think, agree?


          By good relations do you mean the Soviet-Finnish war?
          1. Muadipus
            Muadipus 31 October 2013 02: 28
            +5
            Dear, Be ashamed! Okay, today's youth, but you, as I understand it, from the nickname born in 1975, that is, you were a pioneer in the Komsomol, perhaps you have visited .. I mean that the Soviet education system was the best in the world ... And you are carrying obscurantism. That the school was completely ignored? Everything that Finland has, it owes to Russia (well, with the exception of NOKIA :) of course). And the funny thing is, every Fin knows about it. in the city of Kotka there is a huge museum "Vellamo" where a very large part of the exposition is devoted to joint history with Russia. And let it be known to you that the first administrative formation in Finland was within the borders of the Russian Empire. And if you did not attend school at all, then I dare to enlighten you that the last Emperor of the Russian Empire - Nicholas 2, Officially had the following title: - All-Russian Emperor, Tsar of Poland and Grand Duke of Finland.
            And they fought with Finland for the reason that when the communists came to power, they began to squander the state land, including the free Finam was given. But they didn’t think, and when they did, it turned out that the original Karelian isthmus is of great strategic importance, they asked back, the Fins showed the "fig", they had to take it away by force ... History doesn’t remind you of anything ??? The story is one to one with today :) When Ukraine was given freedom (mind you, she did not take, but was given), they also did not think about the primordial and important lands ... Only Today the situation is different. Half of Ukraine is a Russian land inhabited by Russian people. This is the story. Oh, and great people are rare at all times, and Ukraine will not give birth to its own Mannerheim soon. Sincerely.
            1. Firstvanguard
              Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 17: 46
              0
              And they fought with Finland for the reason that when the communists came to power, they began to squander the state land, including the free Finam was given. But they didn’t think, and when they did, it turned out that the original Karelian isthmus was of great strategic importance, they asked back, the Fins - they showed the "fig", had to be taken away by force ...
              I do not agree a little. Stalin did not give the Finns free, although he had to fight with them. When the communists Communists came to power Lenin could not help but give, because that was his price for power at that moment. Subsequently, much has changed and Lenin "threw" customers, then Kaplan appeared.
            2. Firstvanguard
              Firstvanguard 6 November 2013 17: 47
              0
              And they fought with Finland for the reason that when the communists came to power, they began to squander the state land, including the free Finam was given. But they didn’t think, and when they did, it turned out that the original Karelian isthmus was of great strategic importance, they asked back, the Fins - they showed the "fig", had to be taken away by force ...
              I do not agree a little. Stalin did not give the Finns free, although he had to fight with them. When the communists Communists came to power Lenin could not help but give, because that was his price for power at that moment. Subsequently, much has changed and Lenin "threw" customers, then Kaplan appeared.
          2. loisop
            loisop 31 October 2013 09: 52
            +2
            Is Soviet-Finnish based on hostility and hatred? What abysses are opening !! And I thought that it was a clearly redistribution of borders between both sides. What is characteristic, previously repeatedly discussed with the Finns. The world offered them twice as much in exchange as requested.
      2. Samsebenaum
        Samsebenaum 30 October 2013 20: 29
        +5
        Walker1975

        Dear, do not forget that all the republics of Central Asia and the Caucasus were at an extremely low level of development before accession ..
        How much was not invested in them: the specialists and education, medicine, cities were built, electricity, trade, food, transport, infrastructure.
        Brought out of the Stone Age. Is anger at Russia overshadowed by memory?
        The GDR went completely destroyed, as did Poland and the Czech Republic. Königsberg, as well as thousands of other cities.
        Do not forget that the USSR threw all its forces not only towards the restoration of the Union, but raised all of Eastern Europe.
        Do you even realize this?
        The only thing I agree with is the Far East. But first of all, the Pacific fleet needed to be restored and modernized.
        At that time, there was a great threat of nuclear war.
        In such circumstances, not to fat, is not it?
        Or did the memory wander off too?
        Why do you blame? What helped you survive and get on your feet?
        Where is your conscience and mind, non-human people?
        Europe would die from such a load ...
        Do not worry about South Ossetia. This is no longer your business.
        1. Walker1975
          Walker1975 31 October 2013 01: 54
          0
          Well, dear, there has always been something in the way, wars, upheavals ... but there have been no wars for a long time, the most patriotic Putin has already been in power for 14 years, oil and gas revenues are huge, and probably the rest of the economy is producing something ... But the RF itself is far from cloudless. How many more years do you need?
          1. Muadipus
            Muadipus 31 October 2013 02: 31
            +2
            A good owner will always find work in the house. Still, the neighbors would not crap on the lawn ...
      3. xan
        xan 31 October 2013 14: 29
        0
        Quote: Walker1975
        If the same land was divided and ruled by the Russian Empire or the USSR, and our probable adversary by the other, then the Russian part was desolate.

        Both RI and the USSR had problems with competition, bureaucracy and ideology.
        There is no such society as it is now in Russia. So we will see. But one thing is clear - the Russians rely on themselves.
  • Garysit
    Garysit 30 October 2013 19: 16
    +2
    No need to explain and tell them anything, they wanted independence, they must drink their cup to the bottom !!! Introduce a visa regime and all customs restrictions that they were told about, then we will see their life, as they say, a yellow flea flag in their hands ....
  • makarov
    makarov 30 October 2013 19: 24
    +4
    Quote: Irtysh
    In particular, he was on a tour at the Lychakiv Cemetery, which is in Lviv. He was very impressed with the graves of Polish and Ukrainian soldiers. In 1919, they mercilessly crushed each other.

    And I want to give a different example. I had a chance to visit the Orthodox cemetery in Piotorkov-Tribunalsky. Formerly the provincial city of the Polish governorate. The cemetery is well-groomed, a lot of graves from the time of the Napoleonic invasion. The grave of the centurion of the Don Army of 1811, the head of the provincial gendarme administration, even the grave of the governor and his wife were especially remembered. Exploring the grave, I came across a guy with a girl who cleaned one of the tombstones with sponges and water, asked - this is probably your relative, and they answered, no, we just decided to look after this grave, because it is MEMORY ..
  • KSA
    KSA 30 October 2013 19: 41
    +1
    All the same, even the "processes" of the former brothers are proceeding in the same way ... they will have Tymoshenko, will make room for Yanukovych, we will have Khodorkovsky, will make room for Taburetkin ... and there will be a shaky balance in the elites for 10 years
  • zvereok
    zvereok 30 October 2013 19: 44
    +1
    US ambassador: US will help Ukraine adapt to European standards

    US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Payette. Illustration: US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Payette.

    The United States is ready to help Ukraine with the implementation of the terms of the Association Agreement with the European Union. This was announced on October 29 during a lecture at the Kiev-Mohyla Academy by the US ambassador to Ukraine, Jeffrey Payette, a REGNUM correspondent reports.

    http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1725895.html


    PS: All this is good, but when will they put Serdyukov?
  • vair
    vair 30 October 2013 19: 46
    +4
    Quote: Kars
    More even than Putin is waiting for.

    Going to the slaughter, to say such things is at least stupid. They need you as a bridgehead against Russia. Are you really so blinded by the hatred of Russia that you don’t see simple things.
    1. Kars
      Kars 30 October 2013 20: 01
      +1
      Quote: vair
      They need you as a bridgehead against Russia.

      But do we need Russia as cannon fodder and a buffer zone?
      Quote: vair
      are you really so blinded by hatred of Russia that you don’t see simple things.

      Are you so blinded by narcissism?
  • Migari
    Migari 30 October 2013 20: 07
    +2
    And what to speak for him, JUDAH.
  • dropout
    dropout 30 October 2013 20: 43
    +1
    In the tenth grade, the school is given an essay on the topic "What would I do if I became Prime Minister." All 30 people in the class wrote different stories, but they all ended with one phrase: "And x @ and you would have found me then."
  • Yus
    Yus 30 October 2013 20: 50
    +2
    My ancestors from Ukraine! I live in Russia myself. Many relatives in Ukraine. I never thought that such a question would arise at all. The people of Ukraine do not want to associate with gays, this is what politicians in Ukraine want. A referendum is needed on the issue of association, and then it will sink into oblivion, because the people of Ukraine are not gay and they are alien to such moral values.