The gun duel between Navalny and Rogozin, or Why did the Glocks go up ...

Some time ago, it was reported that a special batch of Glock pistols was planned for the special units of the Russian Defense Ministry. Two modifications of these Austrian pistols, namely Glock-17 and Glock-26, are subject to purchase. In this case, purchases are carried out through an open auction through the automated trading system of Sberbank - ETP Sberbank-AST.

If we talk about the technical characteristics of this Austrian weapons, most experts are inclined to call Glock one of the best modern pistols, which have indisputable advantages over the products of other manufacturers (including domestic ones). Top scores "Gloki" received for their reliability, which manifests itself even when shooting under water. Unlike many other pistols, this weapon is capable of hitting a target under water (albeit at a distance of no more than 2,5 m) without blow-up of the barrel and the danger of harming the shooter himself. This possibility is due to the use of special cartridges and a special percussion mechanism.
In addition, Glock can fire after heavy pollution during a sandstorm.

Today Glock-17 pistols are actively used by armies around the world. If we talk about the countries that have already adopted such pistols, here, besides Austria itself, many NATO countries should also be mentioned. They (pistols) are also used by the secret services of India, the USA, Saudi Arabia, and Mexico.

Due to the large scale of distribution and high reliability, the pistols of the Austrian manufacturer Glock are called “Kalashnikov pistols”. The only disadvantage of this small arms is the possibility of cracks on the frame and receiver at the time of use at temperatures below -40 Celsius, since the material from which they are made is polymer. Well, and since even the Russian special forces of the Ministry of Defense, whose representatives about the Glock small arms respond rather flattering, it is extremely rare to act at such low temperatures, it was decided to start purchasing these well-proven pistols.
By and large, here the choice of the Ministry of Defense (well, unlike the French helicopter carriers "Mistral" or Italian Iveco armored vehicles) did not cause any particular complaints from experts. Unless, we are talking about the fact that it would be nice to organize the production of domestic high-quality pistols for the needs of special units. Much more serious in its glow issues caused the publication of orders for these weapons on the web, or rather the issue price.

The customer of the weapon, which was made by Rosoboronpostavka, during the preparation of the auction, determined the contract price in the amount of 66846780 rubles. for 318 pistols Glock-17 and in the amount of 4586400 rubles for 24 pistols Glock-26. The order was placed on October 8. At the end of October, bidding applications must be completed, and 5 November will be held directly auction between those companies whose applications have been reviewed and approved - with the definition of the company, which will supply guns for the Ministry of Defense. The indicated amounts in the order are designated both as initial and as maximum. It turns out that it is for such amounts that the planned small arms are planned to be purchased.

If you make simple mathematical calculations, it turns out that the average price of a Glock-17 pistol according to this “estimate” is 210210 rubles, and a Glock-26 191100 pistol rubles. The average price of such a weapon from the manufacturer itself is no more than 20 thousand rubles, the price in Russia, taking into account the margins of intermediaries, does not exceed 60 thousand rubles. That is, the prices in the order are overestimated, at least 3-4 times. And this suggests that government money for the next batch of purchases may simply be stolen. Or, as they say, money will be spent inefficiently.

It should be borne in mind that Glock pistols are assembled in Russia. Engaged in the assembly of such pistols (most often we are talking about the production of sports modifications) at the facilities of the enterprise ORSIS in Moscow. The implementation of this weapon is the company "Promtechnology", working under a contract with the Austrians.

An interesting fact is that the situation with the price of public procurement acquired the greatest degree of tension after the bloggers paid attention to the amounts. One of them is such a person as a representative of the RosPil movement Andrei (Ipasserby). After its publication, the notorious Alexei Navalny seized upon the information about the “gold” “Glocks”.

He did not limit himself to disseminating information that someone in the Ministry of Defense (or in another Russian department) is going to make good money on the purchase of small arms for special forces, but put forward a version about who can heat hands on public procurement. According to Navalny, the son of Dmitry Rogozin Alexey can earn. Navalny claims that Alexei Rogozin was for some time the deputy general director of the same company, Protechnology, which concluded a contract for the sale of Glokov, assembled in Russia. The charge is serious, and Rogozin Sr. could not get past him.

The vice-premier decided to respond to Navalny in the same vein in which he actually accused his son of being able to cash in on government procurement for the Ministry of Defense, that is, via the Internet. If Navalny announced a possible conclusion of a contract with Promtechnologies in his LiveJournal, then Rogozin decided to give an answer via Facebook. We present an excerpt from the publication of Dmitry Rogozin - a response to the accusations of Navalny regarding the possible affiliation of the Rogozin family with regard to the purchase of Glock pistols for the main military department (the text is given without adjusting "VO")

Navalny - the leader of the organized crime group KirovLesRospil and the favorite of God's liberal dandelions - finally got to me, got to my family. I decided to water a competitor in advance). Only here I wrote nonsense, hurried. Let us see specifically what we are talking about.
1. The Ministry of Defense subordinate to the agency Rosoboronpostavka declares its readiness to purchase Glock pistols for army special forces. The stated price raises questions from the Military Industrial Commission under the Government of the Russian Federation and its service Rosoboronzakaz. Begins checking the validity of the price. (By the way, starting from 1 in January of 2014, the pricing issues for military products will be regulated by the new law on state order, and the situation should improve radically). In addition, it must be borne in mind that all cases of procurement of foreign weapons and military equipment are considered individually at meetings of the relevant interdepartmental working group headed by my 1 deputy I.N. Kharchenko. I hope everyone knows my attitude to foreign purchases.

2. A week after the start of the check, this Navalny post appears, where it casts a shadow on my reputation. At the same time, he writes about my "employed" son, Alexei, as a little interested in this transaction.

3. I answer: Alexey Rogozin was not "employed" in the company "Promtechnologii", but participated in the 2010-2011. in its creation as deputy director. As a result, private production of high-precision weapons complexes ORSIS appeared in Russia, with these sniper rifles our athletes have won the corresponding world championships for the second year already. At the same time, neither I, who worked at that time in Brussels as Russia's ambassador to NATO, nor my son were shareholders of this company, which is not difficult to verify.

4. After my appointment of 23 December 2011 to the post of Deputy Chairman of the Government of the Russian Federation responsible for the military-industrial complex, my family and I made the difficult decision about the need for him to leave his native enterprise in order not to give any reason to talk about “conflict” interests "(which the cynic of Navalny, by the way, did not stop). Soon, his son and his family left Moscow and went to the Tula region, where he was invited to work at the Alexinsky Chemical Plant as deputy executive director. Combine he got in "wonderful condition" (seen in the photo). The production of powders has long been stopped. Releases paint and something else. All in debt like silks. Former director under investigation.

But it didn’t bother the guy, and every day he works hard to revive this neglected production, which, by the way, has no defense significance, which means that KirovLesRospila, which does not even have the best will, has a relationship with the "defense deputy prime minister." But scoundrels, accustomed to shouting “Hold the thief!”, Again, this does not bother.

There are other points in the answer of Rogozin, but the most important thing is expressed here. At the end of the post, Rogozin writes that he was discouraged from responding to Navalny’s accusations, but he nevertheless decided to answer.

What conclusion can be drawn from the publication of the vice-premier? The conclusion that the price of pistols, which was determined by officials of Rosoboronpostavka, did not initially suit the military-industrial complex under the government of the Russian Federation. That is, Dmitry Rogozin himself did not suit either. That after the adoption of the new law on state defense order pricing will be more transparent. But the thing is that before 1 January 2014, the contract for the same “Glokam” will already be concluded. Information about the order can still be found on the public procurement website in the public domain (and if you can find it, then, therefore, someone is satisfied with such prices for pistols).

Order #0173100000813001049

Order #0173100000813001050

So far, no change in pricing policy has occurred. The contact person in both orders is Ekaterina Ezheleva. By the way, this is the same Ekaterina Ezheleva, who in March of this year refused to answer journalists' questions about why the Ministry of Defense needed to purchase Grot-M navigation equipment, which was discontinued three years ago. Why did not she suddenly become - a mystery ...

If the representatives of the Military Industrial Commission under the government of the Russian Federation are not satisfied with the cost of placed orders by Rosoboronpostavka, but the orders are still on the Web, then either the role of the military-industrial complex under the government is dubious, or this is Rosoboronpostavka (Federal agency for the supply of weapons, military, special equipment and materiel) - the organization that is able to determine the price of weapons, based solely on personal evaluations of their employees. And if the assessments are purely “personal”, then already the competent authorities should pay attention to the work of this department, well, if this department is in our hands, it’s possible for someone ...

Comments

[andrey903]

As a rule, the first new weapons arming staff

[Santa Fe]

Alexei Navalny exposed another scam of officials. With which I congratulate him

Funny interview of D. Rogozin for 2003:

[Bykov.]

Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN

... Alexei Navalny exposed another scam of officials ...

Yeah, ten! Not a THOUSAND !!! Whistleblower, plush!
In fact, all this "infa" is from the OPEN, I repeat - the OPEN-site about public procurement.
Exposed, damn it, otherwise no one can figure it out, go in and read it yourself! Without any A * Alny.

[Constantine]

Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN

Alexei Navalny exposed another scam of officials. With which I congratulate him

I thought that here they all piled up to reason)) I was mistaken

[cdrt]

I thought that here they all piled up to reason)) I was mistaken

It doesn’t matter what Bulk is.
Well, it doesn’t matter.
The numbers were known, but no one in the press shouted about them.
Now the scandal - you look or the prices will fall during the competition more, or in general the competition will be restarted - both are good.
It seems like it has long been known that "the sun is the best disinfection" (in the sense of the best fight against corrupt contracts - public discussion, scandals, swearing)

[Constantine]

Quote: cdrt

It doesn’t matter what Bulk is.
Well, it doesn’t matter.
The numbers were known, but no one in the press shouted about them.
Now the scandal - you look or the prices will fall during the competition more, or in general the competition will be restarted - both are good.
It seems like it has long been known that "the sun is the best disinfection" (in the sense of the best fight against corrupt contracts - public discussion, scandals, swearing)

If you looked at this story a little closer, you would be aware that a week before Rogozin ordered to check this tender. Navalny here not only missed, but generally fired the other way. And generally speaking. Bulk makes a farce and tries to score points. Show me at least one complete corruption case? there is no such. Meanwhile, for example, the guys from ONF are doing real work and getting real results. It’s true that one doesn’t speak in their style, and therefore Navalny is still not discredited a little more than completely.

[New Russia]

"In the meantime, for example, the guys from the ONF do real work and get real results. True, it is not their style to chat," Yes, tough guys) In fact, there is a fight against corruption, just no one knows) And they keep silent about the planting of thieves, so others can't be scared off, right?)

[Constantine]

Large media are generally silent about many things. How to douse someone with feces - they are always right there, but how to show the positive side of the process, then no one is around. Suffice it, for example, to see the difference between the amount of positive news on "Made by Us" and on an ordinary media site over a period of 24 hours.

[New Russia]

"It is enough, for example, to see the difference between the amount of positive news on" Made with Us "and" Of course!) After all, at Sdelanunas they make good news even from bad news. For example, they said that the national debt had decreased in a month, but they did not say that it had grown much since the beginning of the year)

[Doctorleg]

If you looked at this story a little closer, you would be aware that a week before Rogozin ordered to check this tender. Navalny here not only missed, but generally fired the other way. And generally speaking. Bulk makes a farce and tries to score points. Show me at least one complete corruption case? there is no such. Meanwhile, for example, the guys from ONF are doing real work and getting real results. It’s true that one doesn’t speak in their style, and therefore Navalny is still not discredited a little more than completely. [/ Quote]
Presumably, Navalny has already become the head of the Investigative Committee or another power structure? This is how he should bring corruption cases? It's like you write a statement to the police about a crime, it will be thrown into the trash, and to you with a claim: "What are you, my dear man, are messing around, do not bring things to an end." And Rogozin is similar to Shuvalov, who commented on the scam with Glonas (like he was waiting so as not to frighten off). If the ONF were cool, Navalny would not have had a chance to find something. Bulk, hated, what's the difference? The main thing is that someone was found who voiced all this, but it is not known that everything could have failed.

[Russ69]

Quote: Constantine

I thought that here they would pile everything up))

Adepts, Navalny - it's like a sect. They are ready to cherish anyone whom their idol points to and absolutely do not want to see the identical sins of their pastor ...

[Mairos]

Navalny too often shows himself as a verbiage and a demagogue .. with which I congratulate him. "True oppositionist".)))

[Constantine]

Quote: Mairos

Navalny too often shows himself as a verbiage and a demagogue .. with which I congratulate him. "True oppositionist".)))

So this topic with Navalny swept through all over the world. The Americans in the comments on this news about Navalny and Rogozin write that Lesha balabol and that with all due respect, the Russians did not learn how to cut the budget. See a selection on the Internet

[Magellan]

Quote: Mairos

Navalny too often shows himself as a verbiage and a demagogue ..

[Constantine]

AND? No need to replace concepts. He fulfills his promises, the fulfillment of which depends directly on him. The fact that MDA and the company sabotage this business does not mean that the GDP is idle and just stares at it. Your demotivator is designed for rams, and if you are not distributing it yet, then this is a completely separate diagnosis. Putin has done more for the country than his colleagues and many predecessors, and therefore you yourself know where to go with such statements and where you will be accepted as your own.

And here is Bulk daaa. I have never brought anything to the end. Well, maybe their budget cuts.

[Magellan]

Quote: Constantine

And here is Bulk daaa. Never brought anything to the end

removal of Pekhtin and several deputies with double civilian status

[Constantine]

Quote: Magellan

removal of Pekhtin and several deputies with double civilian status

They would be removed anyway as part of a general program to eliminate dependent characters. Where is landing for corruption? He’s a fighter against corruption, in general)) Well, he almost put himself in prison, yes, but others? And then, all of his revelations reek of order. Some have confirmed, and some give it with the appropriate scent, but they are all from the same piggy bank So, how did he himself understand?

Piled hello pass

[cdrt]

Quote: Constantine

Quote: Magellan

removal of Pekhtin and several deputies with double civilian status

They would be removed anyway as part of a general program to eliminate dependent characters. Where is landing for corruption? He’s a fighter against corruption, in general)) Well, he almost put himself in prison, yes, but others? And then, all of his revelations reek of order. Some have confirmed, and some give it with the appropriate scent, but they are all from the same piggy bank So, how did he himself understand?

Piled hello pass

EdRos edrosa not offend

[Russ69]

Quote: Magellan

removal of Pekhtin and several deputies with double civilian status

Only, here he himself with his Montenegrin company did not withdraw from the election ....

[Constantine]

Quote: Russ69

Only, here he himself with his Montenegrin company did not withdraw from the election ....

Yes, and with his wards, who raged on May 6, refused to sit

[New Russia]

May 6 provocation, do you really think that there were 50 thousand agents of the State Department and not just people rightly dissatisfied with the authorities?

[Russ69]

Quote: New Russia

May 6 provocation

Too much, there was video evidence to believe the opniks.

[New Russia]

Soaked ordinary people and not personally Navalny in the face

[New Russia]

"He fulfills his promises, the fulfillment of which depends directly on him." All election promises have already been forgotten, he promised to fight migration, and now he says that a visa regime with Asia is not needed, the import of migrants has increased in 2013 by 10% to 17 million. Nobody remembers about 25 million jobs, well, nothing, we will remind him) You can not remember about the fight against corruption, Serdyukov, Bilalov, Chubais and Vasilyeva are free, and even defend themselves by Putin (Direct Line), The APEC case is closed, no one sat down, who would doubt)

"Putin has done more for the country than his colleagues and many predecessors, and therefore you yourself know where to go with such statements and where you will be accepted as your own." Maybe you yourself will go, self-proclaimed "majority")

[3.7.964]

Quote: New Russia

"Putin has done more for the country than his colleagues and many predecessors

This phrase should sound like this: Putin did more for the collapse of the country than him .... and so on in the text

[Constantine]

Quote: 3.7.964

This phrase should sound like this: Putin did more for the collapse of the country than him .... and so on in the text

If compared with a carefree existence within the home and kindergarten, then maybe. In general, I suggest you open your eyes.

[New Russia]

"If you compare with a carefree existence within the home and kindergarten, maybe. In general, I suggest you open your eyes." When compared with ANY supreme ruler of Russia except Yeltsin. And even then it's not a fact that Putin is better, with such corruption and the importation of hostile migrants, the patronage of the Caucasian organized crime groups.

[Constantine]

Show me a country where there is no corruption. Show me a country with democracy. Show me the country where the opposition is treated as gently as in Russia.

Judging by the comments and conclusions, you are no more than 16-18 years old. there is no basis for comparison. No knowledge of the principles of the state, etc. Teachers should argue with students, not us. Of course, you want to earn some pocket money, well, so go to crap in LJ. They’ll pay there too

[New Russia]

"Show me a country where there is no corruption."
http://lenta.ru/news/2013/10/08/jailed/ Суд в Греции приговорил бывшего министра обороны Акиса Тсохатзопулоса к 20 годам лишения свободы за участие в коррупционных схемах. Об этом 7 октября сообщает Agence France-Presse.
Together with Tsohadzopulos, according to the Associated Press, another 16 people were found guilty in the same case, including his wife and daughter, who received 12 years in prison, as well as an ex-wife and cousin. There is a difference?

"Show me a country where the opposition is treated as softly as in Russia." There is no legal opposition in Russia, and only thieves and members of EdRa sing odes to Putin.

"Judging by the comments and conclusions, you are no more than 16-18 years old, since there is no basis for comparison." Sit on this site for a few more days and you will become my next victim) Smart guy)

[Botanologist]

Quote: New Russia

Sit on this site for a few more days and you will become my next victim) Wise guy)

Yektyl, the demon-dember was drawn
First, learn to answer the questions posed in essence, and then you will show the character. Flooding is easy and pleasant, only your Nazi ideals do not solve problems in the country.

[New Russia]

"Flooding is easy and pleasant, only your Nazi ideals do not solve the problems in the country." Not like your liberal ones)

"First, learn to answer the questions posed on the merits" Yes, you just do not want to listen, I always answer you)

[Botanologist]

Not that your liberal)

I understand that your horizons will not see the difference between a liberal, patriotic and other worldview, if it is not Nazi, but I can’t help in anything. This is with age if you read smart books and think.

Quote: New Russia

Yes, you just don’t want to listen, I always answer you)

Well then, I’ll repeat the question for the third time, to which I couldn’t hear the answer for 2 weeks already:
1. How do you separate patriots from non-patriots?
2. Once you start thinking about economics, take the trouble to answer at least such a simple question, how are you going to nationalize everything that is "unpatriotic." And at the same time - who will conduct?
3. Well, and yet it’s very interesting what are you going to do with Chechnya and Dagestan? There are two possible answers, as I understand it, but it’s interesting to hear your version.
4. On what principles will you negotiate with the same Syria and Iran, where your Nazi slogans are not the topic of conversation at all?

[3.7.964]

Quote: Botanologist

Flooding is easy and pleasant, only your Nazi ideals do not solve problems in the country.

Yeah, the problems in the country are solved by Caucasians, moreover, by very radical methods.

[New Russia]

Well, where are you?) I brought you references!)

[cdrt]

Quote: Constantine

Show me a country where there is no corruption. Show me a country with democracy. Show me the country where the opposition is treated as gently as in Russia.

Judging by the comments and conclusions, you are no more than 16-18 years old. there is no basis for comparison. No knowledge of the principles of the state, etc. Teachers should argue with students, not us. Of course, you want to earn some pocket money, well, so go to crap in LJ. They’ll pay there too

Germany, Italy, Spain, Sweden, Czech Republic, Switzerland, Portugal, Ireland, Norway, Finland, Canada - enough?

[Constantine]

Quote: New Russia

Maybe you yourself will go, self-proclaimed "majority")

Are you kidding me? Take a pie from the shelf

PS Kreakly today in shock

[New Russia]

"Joking?" Not a) you need to live in 2007 when the delirium about the majority and nationwide support of the authorities has not yet caused a smile and a desire to give you medicines)
"Kreakly is on fire today" you know better)

[Constantine]

Did she even understand what she said?

[New Russia]

Of course) If you think that with us most people love this power, I don’t know what to say)

[Eugeniy_369]

Quote: Constantine

PS Kreakly today in shock

No, judging by you, in the strike today is another zomboyaschik victim.

[Russ69]

Quote: Eugeniy_369

No, judging by you, in the strike today is another zomboyaschik victim.

Computer monitor, in principle, the same zomboyaschik. It's just that zombies go a little differently, and even the zombies themselves happen. Because people, most often pay attention, only on topics of purely interest, or are looking on the Internet for confirmation of their views. And frankly, worse is not yet known.

[LION]

Is this not enough? The site Rospil employs competent lawyers. Upon their requests to the prosecutor's office, many auctions and purchases are canceled. It’s necessary for Navalny to do this, and not to shout in the stands. Che from it worthless.
And if Navalny had not made a fuss, Russia in Morocco will start buying submarines at 100500 ducats per heap.

[Russ69]

Quote: LION

Is this not enough? The site Rospil employs competent lawyers. Upon their requests to the prosecutor's office, many auctions and purchases are canceled.

Yeah ... but that's not saying that. that almost all auctions are returned and held after the correction of application errors. In principle, this is precisely what the lawyers of the Lehi Distillery are doing.

[New Russia]

"almost all auctions are returned and held after bid errors have been corrected." If this were the case, the level of corruption in public procurement in 2011, even according to Medvedev's underestimated figures, would not have been 1 trillion rubles.

[Constantine]

Quote: New Russia

Medvedev would not have been 1 trillion rubles.

Where does this figure come from? Show the sources of the components of this figure. Only official. Or did Navaleno say that and without reflecting you are distributing?

[New Russia]

http://lenta.ru/news/2010/10/29/punish/ Медведев оценил воровство в системе госзакупок в триллион рублей в год. Поправка, 2010 год)

[Russ69]

Quote: New Russia

If this were so, the level of corruption in public procurement in 2011, even by Medvedev’s understated figures, would not have been 1 trillion rubles.

Madame, when "Rospil" appeared, I also fell in love and even transferred money (well, yes, a little ) And therefore, he began to monitor activity. As a result, after a year of work, this office. Lesha distillery made a report where he stated that he had saved several billion to the state. And when they counted (not everyone believes the word), then all the auctions were held again. Although it can be recognized, like 40 million, auctions were really banned ...
At one time, much was written about this ...

[New Russia]

Perhaps you are right that does not justify thieves. The bulk of the project itself is either Medvedev or Putin himself. The fact that he agreed to support PZHIV in the elections in Moscow is talking about something)

[They <b>accompany you</b>]

verbiage is the work (lifestyle) of any politician
they do not sow or plow do not stand at the machine tool their role redistribution of other people's labor is not always fair
(always not fair) * removal from the feeder
how to justify your decision without having gotten bogged down in the face?
right! to chatter everyone to death (sometimes not figuratively)

[dmitrich]

a bulk thief should be in prison.

[Starfish]

a bulk thief should be in prison.

I agree, in the same cell with Serdyukov, you can even Vasilyeva

[smile]

Starfish
No, they can’t be together, they’re robbing each other and letting bare-barefoot around the world, and then the colony administrations are responsible for them ... :)))

[Thunderbolt]

Yes ... but neither the first, nor the second, nor the third "individual" will sit on the campaign.

[3.7.964]

Quote: Starfish

a bulk thief should be in prison. I agree, in the same cell with Serdyukov, you can even with Vasilyeva

The entire leadership of Russia should be in prison. For those who point at my Ukrainian flag, I will say, for the leadership of Ukraine - execution, there is no alternative. Or do you still believe that Gazprom is a national treasure?

[Mature naturalist]

Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN

Alexey Navalny exposed another scam of officials

Yes, and it is better to read information about this from the original source - Navalny than in the retelling. Moreover, nothing new has been added to the article.

[7Hz]

the last 3 words in the interior view speaks briefly for everyone sitting in the kitchen and saying ...

[RussianRu]

If you make simple mathematical calculations, it turns out that the average price of a Glock-17 pistol in this "estimate" is 210210 rubles, and a Glock-26 pistol 191100 rubles. The average price of such weapons from the manufacturer itself is no more than 20 thousand rubles, the price in Russia, taking into account the margins of intermediaries, does not exceed 60 thousand rubles. That is, the prices in the order are inflated at least 3-4 times.

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? This is the price including ammunition. In the order summary is written

125 Explosives and Explosives
2927260 Other ammunition

So what's the sensation? Or another vparivanie "opinion about the fact"?

[Bykov.]

Quote: Russian

... So what's the sensation? Or another "noodles" for the ears? ...

Yes, as always, just a little bit of this and that. Surely budget money, our defense industry would not be in the way ... in the sense, but they are fucking fucking ,? Shoot to? but it’s impossible from domestic, right? .

[RussianRu]

If we talk about the technical characteristics of this Austrian weapon, then most experts are inclined to call Glock one of the best modern pistols, which have undeniable advantages over the products of other manufacturers (including domestic ones). Gloki received the highest marks for their reliability, which is manifested even when shooting under water. Unlike many other pistols, this weapon is capable of hitting a target under water (although at a distance of no more than 2,5 m) without swelling of the barrel and the danger of harming the shooter himself. This possibility is due to the use of special cartridges and a special impact mechanism.
In addition, Glock can fire after heavy pollution during a sandstorm.

I, too, for domestic weapons. But, the conversation is not about that now, but about price and corruption.

[Lapotnik]

Indeed, I, too, fell for another "sensation" ... And a lot of people are doing just that - without looking, without understanding ... hmm.

And Rogozin himself doesn’t know nichrome, and didn’t look, he could have explained it differently and all the exhaust of the "whistleblower" would have gone into the air.

PS Something a lot of comments - And why not domestic? And in articles about pistols glock for some reason you recognize one of the best ... The best fighters - the best weapons.

PPS Development of domestic can be carried out in parallel, while it is necessary to shoot.

[Constantine]

Quote: Russian

So what's the sensation? Or another vparivanie "opinion about the fact"?

Exactly. He was simply exhausted and began to work rudely and not covered up. In general, he lives out his political age, apparently.

[cdrt]

He was simply exhausted and began to work rudely and not covered up. In general, he lives out his political age, apparently.

Here is not a supporter of him even once.
Only now ... at the elections to the Duma - at the level of statistical error, for the mayor of Moscow from 27% of voters ...
Growth in any way (even taking into account the fact that Moscow votes differently).
So ... wait and see.
Moreover, judging by the decisions of a higher court, the authorities clearly support him (even if they keep him on a short lead of a conditional term)

[Constantine]

Quote: cdrt

Here is not a supporter of him even once.
Only now ... at the elections to the Duma - at the level of statistical error, for the mayor of Moscow from 27% of voters ...
Growth in any way (even taking into account the fact that Moscow votes differently).
So ... wait and see.
Moreover, judging by the decisions of a higher court, the authorities clearly support him (even if they keep him on a short lead of a conditional term)

No need to run ahead of the engine and make superficial judgments

[es.d]

Quote: cdrt

from the mayor of Moscow from 27% of voters ...

Of the number of voters

[New Russia]

30 million people voted ... From XNUMX% of those who came

[antonio]

Yes, these votes are not for anal, but against lawlessness and corruption in our state, against the power of degenerates.

[New Russia]

Yes. Look carefully with the words, here one almost called me crazy for the fact that I do not believe in the popular support of Putin

[antonio]

he can believe in both Martians and the universal mind, and this distinguishes lunatics from people with common sense.

[Constantine]

Quote: New Russia

Yes. Look carefully with the words, here one almost called me crazy for the fact that I do not believe in the popular support of Putin

So you are not sane because you carry a blizzard that is not connected and not backed up by data, either by stupidity or by duty of a well-known organization. So just do not carry such crap.

[Corporal]

"125 Explosive devices and explosives
2927260 Other ammunition "

This line the same in both orders, is in the column "Classification of goods, works and services" and no mention в
columns "Full name of the auction (subject of the contract)" and "The number of supplied goods, volume of work performed, services provided"

I am not a fan of Navalny, but it stinks of these orders specifically.

[RussianRu]

The amount of ammunition may be the same. The price is different due to the specifics.

[Mikado]

Quote: Russian

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? This is the price including ammunition. In the order summary is written
125 Explosives and Explosives
2927260 Other ammunition

You are wrong, "125 explosive devices and explosives" and "2927260 ammunition, etc." - this is the code in the classifier to which pistols belong, no more. About any cartridges in the order of the speech does not go.

[RussianRu]

Supply of special small arms and melee weapons for special forces according to the list approved by the Russian Ministry of Defense: 9 mm GLOCK-26 pistols in a kit for the needs of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation

Included. What comes in the kit? And ammo including.

[Mikado]

Quote: Russian

What comes in the kit? And ammo including.

Yes, where did you get that?)) And how many cartridges are included in the "kit", two boxes?)
"Included" means with an additional store, cleaning devices, overlays, laser designator.

Ammo included)))))

[RussianRu]

Supply of special small arms and melee weapons for special forces according to the list approved by the Russian Ministry of Defense: 9 mm GLOCK-26 pistols in a kit for the needs of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation

According to the list. And ammunition is what do you think? You can draw as many brackets as you like. Read carefully everything that is written. The paradox is that this list does not lay out nasral in its "exposure". You like that they hang noodles, yes, for God's sake. LADY.

[Mikado]

What the hell? And what does Navalny have to do with not laying out the "list"? Did he issue this order?)) Yes, and the list is laid out, it comes after the colon, in your quote - "9 mm GLOCK-26 pistols in a set for the needs of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation." What is "included" I already wrote to you. This has nothing to do with patrons. Where did you see the word "ammunition"? Did you add the "fight" to the "set" yourself?)) You will go far, probably to the heights of Rogozin. No, if you like how the well-fed face of this citizen profits from you, declaring his honesty, decency and incorruptibility, then for God's sake.

[RussianRu]

I apologize. Not ammunition but ammunition. Has it become easier? Share the list. Thank you, sent to the heights. Himself probably under the baseboard? Is it better to see from there? what and how.

[Mikado]

I have already written this list for you, it comes after the colon in the sentence - "Supply of special small arms and melee weapons for special forces according to the list approved by the Russian Ministry of Defense: 9 mm GLOCK-26 pistols in a set for the needs of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation." If you are familiar with the rules of the Russian language, then it will not be difficult for you to understand. The words "ammunition" or "ammunition" are not here. There is only the word "other ammunition" in the column "classification of goods, works and services", which means that this order was attributed to this category of goods, on a par with the category of "explosive devices" (by your logic, detonators were probably ordered for pistols then ?)). All this only indicates that the order was issued incorrectly, that they should have issued the code "weapon and its parts". The detailed completeness was described to you below, according to the posted technical assignment, there is no talk of any cartridges there.
Of course, under the baseboard, where else could there be disagreements with your opinion.

[RussianRu]

I will repeat myself. LADY. So the pistols were categorized; Classification of goods, works and services, ammunition and And cartridges do not in any way apply to ammunition. Probably the cartridges belong to the "canoe with gunpowder" category. Do they want to shoot with peas, or will they give the bullets to the load for free?

[Mikado]

Ammunition refers to ammunition and what's next? What did you want to say with this argument? I don’t know what they were going to shoot there, but I know for sure that the cartridges are not included in the amount indicated in the order, judging by the text and material of the order. Therefore, Rogozin did not refer to the cartridges, because he would have looked like a fool.

[atalef]

Quote: Russian

Supply of special small arms and melee weapons for special forces according to the list approved by the Russian Ministry of Defense: 9 mm GLOCK-26 pistols in a kit for the needs of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation

Included. What comes in the kit? And ammo including.

Apparently besides cartridges there are also kickbacks, and this is the main

[vpimen2010]

But the trick is that information about such purchases in general is in the public domain, it is necessary to prohibit. We divide the declared purchase price by the average price and, up to unity, set the number of combat-ready GRU specialists abroad.
We advertise this for whom? What would our leadership know? or every taxpayer? Do they need it? Where do not touch or brewing or sheep, which it cuts and on which (rams) anal PR.
Where SMERSH, Mercader, nominal ice axes ??? Where is the power?

[Starfish]

We advertise this for whom? What would our leadership know? or every taxpayer? Do they need it?


while different Serdyukovs will be possible - every taxpayer needs to know. Of course you’re right about secrecy, but as if corruption were not classified at all

[report4]

Quote: vpimen2010

But the trick is that information about such purchases in general is in the public domain, it is necessary to prohibit. We divide the declared purchase price by the average price and, up to unity, set the number of combat-ready GRU specialists abroad.

I don’t want to disappoint you, but the GRU is only army men and they are not engaged in any "undercover operations". Yes, there are "instructors" and "military advisers" and other guys who are directly involved in military operations, but they arm themselves from local arsenals.

[atalef]

Quote: vpimen2010

But the trick is that information about such purchases in general is in the public domain, it is necessary to prohibit. We divide the declared purchase price by the average price and, up to unity, set the number of combat-ready GRU specialists abroad.
We advertise this for whom? What would our leadership know? or every taxpayer? Do they need it? Where do not touch or brewing or sheep, which it cuts and on which (rams) anal PR.
Where SMERSH, Mercader, nominal ice axes ??? Where is the power?

Well, yes, they shared and determined, most importantly accurately and reliably, shkolota

[cdrt]

vpimen2010
Do they need it?


I need to.
Taxes (and I pay them really a lot) - this is my money, which the state took from me, for general needs.
And I want to know how they are spent.

Moreover, for all really secret contests, digital data is not published. Probably you should not be holier than the Pope (it's me about the FSB and others responsible for state security, state secret).
And so, the position - I do not like that they accuse of theft (by the way, it is possible and fair) - we close the data = protection of corruption.

Question to you - do you feed yourself from government procurement?

[timeout]

Quote: Russian

125 Explosives and Explosives
2927260 Other ammunition

Dear, and you tried to look at the register? This application must pass on the code No. 124 "Weapons and its details" Includes code (s) according to the classifier OK 004-93 (OKDP) - 2927010. 2927010 - Weapons and their details [2927100 - 2927197]. So the application itself was drawn up incorrectly, and for some reason it was missed by the financial supervision department in the Moscow Region. But from this we must already draw conclusions!
Here is a link to the codes: http://www.gov-zakupki.ru/odnoimenka/ Sorry for the replay!

[atalef]

Quote: Timeout

Quote: Russian

125 Explosives and Explosives
2927260 Other ammunition

Dear, and you tried to look at the register? This application must pass on the code No. 124 "Weapons and its details" Includes code (s) according to the classifier OK 004-93 (OKDP) - 2927010. 2927010 - Weapons and their details [2927100 - 2927197]. So the application itself was drawn up incorrectly, and for some reason it was missed by the financial supervision department in the Moscow Region. But from this we must already draw conclusions!
Here is a link to the codes: http://www.gov-zakupki.ru/odnoimenka/ Sorry for the replay!

You’d better conclude why pistols are 4 times more expensive than they should be

[timeout]

Quote: atalef

You’d better conclude why pistols are 4 times more expensive than they should be

Read the post carefully! I say that such an application should generally be wrapped at the stage of drafting! And someone is beneficial to miss it!
Conclusion on the cost? Well then, let's go from the stove, even if we take positions from those tasks.
1. Glock G26 Subcompact Handgun - 9mm. Price - $ 509
2. LTSU - LaserMax LMS-1161 - 300 $
3. Hip holster - $ 15
4. Holster belt - $ 21
5. An operational holster - $ 30
5. Weapon case - $ 40
6. Stores 6 pcs. - 180 $
7. cleaning kit - $ 10
Total: 1105 $ (prices from the most expensive sellers!) + 18% for customs clearance = 1305 $, which is 43500 rubles for our rubles with delivery! Cheaper than Orsis, just a barrel in a case. On Glock 17 the price is the same!

[ssergn]

In support of your words, I provide an excerpt from the official documentation posted on the site, which is called "TECHNICAL TASK":

Technical task
for the supply of 9 mm gun GLOCK-26 in the kit.


9 mm GLOCK-26 pistol in kit, designed to engage manpower at ranges up to 50 m.

Main performance characteristics:
Cartridge - 9x19mm "Parabellum";
Length, mm - 160 ± 1%;
Barrel length, mm - 88 ± 1%;
Weight without magazine, g - 560 ± 1%;
Shop, cartridges - 10.

Completeness:
- pistol;
- 6 stores;
- laser target designator;
- holster belt of carbide material;
- operational holster made of carbide material;
- a holster hip made of carbide material;
- weapon case;
- accessories for cleaning;
- operation manual in Russian;
- Passport products.


Here, it seems, people are all smart and competent, they mastered a computer with the Internet, but it wasn’t enough to download the documentation and get to those tasks. Che, the herd instinct works (thank God not everyone)? Just cry ...

And now a question for specialists: Gentlemen, comrades, evaluate how much this kit will cost. And yes, preferably, not unfounded, but with the price lists.

Very grateful

[igor36]

Quote: ssergn

- holster belt from carbide material;
- Holster operational from carbide material;
- holster from the hip carbide material;

What kind of stupid person wrote the technical task in this order?
Hard alloys are hard and wear-resistant metal materials capable of preserving these properties at 900–1150 ° C. They are mainly made of high-hard and refractory materials based on tungsten, titanium, tantalum, chromium carbides, bonded with a cobalt metal binder, with different contents of cobalt or nickel.

[ssergn]

Questions not to me, to those assignments

[igor36]

you have absolutely no complaints

[Misantrop]

Quote: ssergn

from carbide material;

What progress has come to - a plastic pistol in a carbide holster

Quote: ssergn

Estimate how much this kit will cost

Each SUCH holster - at the price of a minimum of a pair of pistols, carbides of complex shape and such dimensions as they are not cheap ...

[Ingvar 72]

Quote: Russian

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? The same price, taking into account the ammunition

Just don’t say that they bought 150.000 rounds per barrel. Believe it yourself? The price of a cartridge for Glock is about a dollar at retail. Count.

[Nayhas]

Quote: Russian

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? This is the price including ammunition. In the order summary is written

No need to make idiots out of people. 20 thousand for the barrel, 190 thousand for cartridges? 9 mm. they have been making steam in our country for a long time and it makes no sense to buy them in Austria, firstly, secondly, the cost of cartridges 9x19 186 euros per 1000 pcs., is it in Europe, how many rounds are there for horseradish per barrel?

[atalef]

Quote: Nayhas

Quote: Russian

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? This is the price including ammunition. In the order summary is written

No need to make idiots out of people. 20 thousand for the barrel, 190 thousand for cartridges? 9 mm. they have been making steam in our country for a long time and it makes no sense to buy them in Austria, firstly, secondly, the cost of cartridges 9x19 186 euros per 1000 pcs., is it in Europe, how many rounds are there for horseradish per barrel?

Well, why, for the purity of the experiment and proof of price, they say that to carry out the order it was necessary to build a cartridge factory ..... in Austria

[Dangerous]

time goes on, people change, but corruption and theft have both been and remain. Yes, I’m not digesting Navalny, but, damn it, if everything he said is true, then the question arises - what the hell is going on here ?? And what are such slurred excuses Rogozin ?? and how long will all this plundering last ???

[vlad0]

Everything is very simple: at stake 20 trillion rubles for 7 years. Serdyukov burnt on them, deciding to buy everything in the west. People have changed, but greed has remained. It doesn’t matter if there are pistols or nuclear submarines, all those involved will try to snatch something.

[cdrt]

vlad0
Serdyukov on them and burned

Serdyukov got burned, now Rogozin ... took a holy place.
Nothing changes under the moon

[Mikado]

As long as those who are sitting on the top are sitting, it will continue. For example, Rogozin was the second person in the Rodina Party (which was rapidly gaining momentum and is a competitor to United Russia), after the elections he quickly removed Glazyev, ruined the party, put his son in the Moscow City Duma from the United Russia party, and is now Deputy Prime Minister, surprisingly honest and a decent person. Now he tells us what his son is honest and noble, just like him, he is trying to raise an enterprise from his knees, he struggles and has nothing to do with pistols, he never "got a job", but "was" just a deputy director, on fools calculation.

[Drosselmeyer]

Well Rogozin is a famous populist. Yes, and explanations of his type tyk-myk-pyk-sam. After all, as soon as dad-mom reaches the budget, their wives-sons become brilliant bankers and leaders.
And I still remember how Mr. Rogozin sat on the podium of the congress of the Christian Liberal Party of Crimea, a sort of legalization of organized crime groups by the famous Crimean bandit Podanev.

[svp67]

Unless, it came to the conclusion that it would be nice to establish the production of domestic high-quality pistols for the needs of special units. Much more serious questions were caused by the publication of orders for these weapons on the Web, or rather the price of the issue.

It is true, but the guys from "special forces" should have excellent and reliable weapons "right now".
There are more questions to Ekaterina Valeryevna Ezheleva, here are some more:

With Rosoboronpostavki a more “interesting” story. The Ministry of Defense announced a tender on the electronic trading system for the supply of portable and mobile navigation equipment with a total volume of 1,68 billion rubles. The largest lot in 478 mln rubles is for the personal Grot-M 2010С14 “Grot-M” developed by the Scientific Research Institute of Space Instrumentation, taken out of serial production in 822. They are planned to be purchased in the amount of 2818 pieces, that is, at a price of almost 170 thousand rubles apiece. At the same time, tourist satellite positioning devices cost 10 – 15 thousand
On a simple one - the Ministry of Defense headed by Ekaterina Ezheleva buys discontinued navigators, which, when the characteristics are similar to civilian GPS, are almost 20 times more expensive! It’s still possible to understand how you can steal a budget eight times, this happens in Sochi. But to buy a product whose value is 20 times higher than the market savagery even in Russia.
In the course of work on the aluminum gadget, considerable propaganda efforts were made to promote it, since independent experts compared it with portable civilian navigators and the comparisons were not in favor of the Grotto-M. For example, tourist, sports and automobile devices of the American company Garmin in the Russian market cost no more than 20 thousand rubles. The first appearance of the navigator in public in 2009 caused a flurry of criticism from experts. In many ways, he lost the line of 60's Garmin navigators, which by that time had been discontinued. For example, the Garmin GPS 60 model worked 28 hours from one set of batteries at temperatures from minus 15 to plus 70 degrees, had a mass of 150 g, stored in memory up to 1 thousand waypoints, 20 saved paths, several location formats, not including determining the latitude –Long, and in all cases the accuracy did not exceed several meters.
“Such an application came to us from the Ministry of Defense (a contract for the supply of navigators). We cannot contradict her and prove that something is missing. Since the application is included in the schedule, it must go through certain procedures. Until they end, negotiations with the media are prohibited, ”said Yezheleva. Of course, there will be nothing to say everything is clear - we must warm up on supplies to the Russian army. They’ll conclude a contract, then they’ll say, we’ll finalize it, but for now it’s all right, and two billion rubles is affordable ...
All these technical and market characteristics speak about one thing - they steal mercilessly on the contract.

I don’t know, in my opinion, this "soldier of the Baba battalion of Serdyukov", it's time to retire ...

[PLO]

this topic has been procrastinating a lot in its time, despite the crookedly drawn up documentation and the remaining issue with prices, they nevertheless purchased a new version of the Grotto


here are two devices
both are called 14TS822 Grot-M

the one on the right is "old" and out of production in 2010, on the left is a deep modernization

here is more detailed

http://twower.livejournal.com/713578.html

[kafa]

Quote: svp67

I don’t know, in my opinion, this "soldier of the Baba battalion of Serdyukov", it's time to retire ...

but it’s better to collect them in a distant distant monastery

[Andrey Yuryevich]

why are you so "tolerant" then? this shoblu to the wall! and only so! there is an article "treason"! what the hell are the resignations?

[svp67]

Quote: Andrey Yurievich

this shoblu to the wall!

No, no, not you, that, it is so easy for them to get off, in the "camps", in the "monastery", so that ALL THE REMAINING LIFE SMELLED, SMELLED and SMELLED AGAIN ... and HAVE NOTHING ...

[svp67]

Quote: kafa

but it’s better to collect them in a distant distant monastery

We have a couple of these here, in the Ural outback, I can offer ...

[os9165]

I look at the case of Serdyukov and Vasilyeva livelier than all living things, when will the GDP come 37?

[Rustam]

os9165 I look at the case of Serdyukov and Vasilyeva more alive than all living

What are you, maybe the case of Messrs. Ivanov, Moskovsky, Mikhailov, etc., as well as the case of the generals of our military-industrial complex and other interested parties, who at one time successfully failed the rearmament program 2001-2010 and brought our army to 2008, without which either modern weapons

so we get unrealistic price tags for products that are by no means breakaway

example-T-90A price 118 mil. rubles (2011), export India-Algeria price 88 mil. rubles- who cares?-naturally in 2011 the RF Ministry of Defense refused to buy, a tank with such a price tag

the list can be continued indefinitely, and even bidding does not help, put such items in the order that certain firms win

[antonio]

Who are you asking the question to? The GDP itself is involved there, or again the boyars are to blame for everything and the holy king?

[Pashhenko Nikolay]

When the case is transferred to the Basmanny court, then the 37th year will come for Serdyukov and the company. In the meantime, the show seems like the fight against corruption continues.

[Anatole Klim]

It is strange that the best minister Shoigu is silent, maybe he chooses new emblems.

[svp67]

Quote: Anatol Klim

It is strange that the best minister Shoigu is silent, maybe he chooses new emblems.

The man is very busy, but I think that soon the answer will follow ...

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: svp67

Man is very busy

I understand that voyages in Latin America are also needed, but leave corruption in my department for later .. ???

[servant.]

It will follow ... Like I'm not me ...

[cdrt]

svp67
The man is very busy, but I think that soon the answer will follow ...

Wow.
Only for some reason I’m sure that after that everything will end simply - Rogozin is innocent, the Glocks simply will not be purchased.
And there will be special forces with our unclaimed.
Tolerate ...

[Russ69]

Quote: Anatol Klim

It is strange that the best minister Shoigu is silent, maybe he chooses new emblems.

And what should he say, in principle?
A check, about the validity of the price, was started another week later, then Anal hysteria.

[Anatole Klim]

Quote: Russ69

And what should he say, in principle? An audit about the validity of the price was started another week

The validity of the price must be checked before the tender is announced, and not vice versa.

[IRBIS]

Quote: Anatol Klim

may new emblems picks.

Sews, most likely. Just chose too much, not enough time ...

[Anubis]

Incomprehensible situation with public procurement, very incomprehensible. Why announce any tenders for procurement, if you can directly, without intermediaries to purchase everything you need at a lower price and good quality. I am familiar with the results of various tenders since the civil servant himself is retired. The results are such that I had to buy stationery at my own expense, because pencils were issued that I couldn’t normally sharpen, glue that didn’t stick, and pens that I didn’t write, and paper was never enough.

[Bykov.]

Quote: ANUBIS

... Why announce any tenders for procurement ...

According to the plan, in order to make the gostrats open, which is actually and obviously without any polit-kipeshists, but about efficiency, here is a question and a big one.

[cdrt]

According to the plan, in order to make the gostrats open, which is actually and obviously without any polit-kipeshists, but about efficiency, here is a question and a big one.

And as a result, gostrats became much more open.
About efficiency - in business, an increase in purchases that go through normal tenders in most cases reduces the cost of procurement (he observed a 5% drop and freezing prices for 2 years, with a tendency before that to increase by 6% per year).
The question is about organizing tenders.

[Mikado]

You, as a retired civil servant, should know 94FZ, and that according to him, you cannot conclude anything directly, only bidding (except if the order does not exceed 100 thousand rubles)

[alexeyal]

Bulk agent of the State Department. He himself does not deny that he takes money from the United States.

[Bykov.]

It seems that it is not Sharapov on the poster, but I just want to say Zhiglov's famous phrase ... "Well, you have p0zha!"

[Drosselmeyer]

+++ Bulk agent of the State Department +++
Great, only how does this relate to the purchase of MO pistols at the price of a budget car? The pseudo-patriot who plunders his homeland, in my opinion, is worse than any agents of the State Department.

[air wolf]

Well, why didn’t they like Swift?

[Rex]

Quote: air wolf

Well, why didn’t they like Swift?

It can not be sold to the army for $ 7 thousand ...

[Russ69]

Quote: air wolf

Well, why didn’t they like Swift?

It seems to me that the special forces should arm themselves with what suits him. Several hundred Glocks will not do the weather for our gunsmiths.

[PSih2097]

Quote: Russ69

Quote: air wolf

Well, why didn’t they like Swift?

It seems to me that the special forces should arm themselves with what suits him. Several hundred Glocks will not do the weather for our gunsmiths.

I have a friend who goes on raids in the mountains with the captured M1911, he says everyone has a good trunk, except for cartridges (expensive) ...

[Kurkin]

Why Glock and not Gyurza? Do we have our own little new pistols? In short, people are already holding for a dumb one. Sometimes I don’t even want to read the news, but I want to shoot the entire top.

[papas-57]

Why is GSh-18 bad for our special forces?

[Basarev]

And in fact - the lightest army pistol. The highest reliability and survivability with excellent penetration - will shoot anyone!

[Kurkin]

I agree. There are GSh18 and SR-1 Gyurza, and they buy glocks.

[Samminosh]

GSH-18's reliability is dull and the problem with stores with disgusting unification (like PPSh in the Great Patriotic War) is caused by the low quality of production.
The only significant advantage is the armor-piercing cartridge.

[Russ69]

Quote: Kurkin

Why Glock and not Gyurza? Do we have our own little new pistols? In short, people are already holding for a dumb one. Sometimes I don’t even want to read the news, but I want to shoot the entire top.

Quote: papas-57

Why is GSh-18 bad for our special forces?

Fighters, special forces, piece goods and for them, in principle, there is no peace. For me, let them have both the Glocks and the Colts, and in general, whatever your heart desires. If it’s more convenient for a fighter to go with one weapon or another, this is his business. Each fighter has his own view of the weapon, many buy the same body kits, they buy at their own expense, for themselves. And if the sale of weapons is prohibited in the country, then let the state provide them with every possible arsenal.

[Rinat 1]

This public procurement is completely inapplicable to the army.

[kpox]

Well, as you see, popular control is also needed here.

[kpox]

What has become of TopVar ... The anal one was caught in a lie, and the author of the article continues the sausage analytics "who will drink how much". The evil government is putting its purchases on the network (since 2006) ... to troll the people probably? Wellcome to the comrades website;) http://zachestnyezakupki.onf.ru/

[a.hamster55]

And why did you cling to these pestles - well, just like kids! Are they going to protect the Power? You need to think deeper - DEEPER! And staff and others who need it, at least two but one cartridge.

[servant.]

Yes, the question is not in the pistils, but in the price for the pistils! Where do these prices come from? And why? What is the price of corruption?

[Neighbor]

Maybe this is a toy for the Chechen "guard" from the president's guard?

[major071]

the same Ekaterina Ezheleva

Another "friend" of Taburetkin? Or just the heiress of the case?

[kontrol]

one relative at the top. and their children are just common prodigies and high-sitting parents, no matter how, the children make their own way. Who are the deputies, who are in the leadership of large state-owned companies. And this has nothing to do with the activities of their parents. It’s interesting to all of them do not press?

[erased]

Well, they steal, well, they get banged. And sho? And then we did not know!
We do not know how to make sure that all this trash in power and the money of the people is sent straight to hell. Well, like hard labor for 40 years.
Survive - add ...

[Mareman Vasilich]

I poop on Navalny, who he is, everyone knows. But for a long time I also do not believe officials in the Defense Industry. The fact that money will even be taken away and there is no need to talk. This is a disease, an infection that appears at the genetic level. The current bureaucracy simply cannot live without stealing state funds, they will go crazy. While they will not be shot and imprisoned (at least for 20), while the deportation of relatives to the Urals and Siberia is mandatory, the situation will not change, fundamentally. Like it or not, but it's true. There are no other ways.
Here is the confirmation of my words.
http://news.yandex.ru/yandsearch?cl4url=www.forbes.ru%2Fnews%2F246453-glavu-rosg
ranitsy-uvolili-za-perevod-1-mlrd-rublei-v-bank-ottsa & lang = ru & lr = 6

[kotvov]

dear MAREMAN, I think that most understand this. Only who will do it, do not you think that the “guarantor” of everything and everything?

[Powder donut]

again, the officials managed it, it would be better if they bought for 60 mp apiece, you see, there was no budget deficit, but I finally did not understand what Rogozin wrote, somehow off topic ...

[Kolyan 2]

Quote: Bulls.

Quote: Russian

... So what's the sensation? Or another "noodles" for the ears? ...

Yes, as always, just a little bit of this and that. Surely budget money, our defense industry would not be in the way ... in the sense, but they are fucking fucking ,? Shoot to? and from it’s impossible Yes? .

Makarov is outdated morally, but there are no new good ones. PJ gave it a heavy duck and like a makar in aiming range, one plus 16 rounds, we don’t have good pistols in Russia yet, and the glock is really not very bad.

[sys-1985]

When they already burst out of greed, then everything ..

[Tanysh]

The Glock really deserves to be put into service with OUR army. There has to be the best. But most of all I like the fact that an adequate answer was given for an attempt to bite out of a little bit. You have to answer for the "bazaar"! Yes they STEAL !!!!! But if the "sovereign man" disgraced the state by his action or inaction, then he must answer for it in full! For damage caused to the STATE, at least a year of general regime, and the rest how much the court will determine and without absorbing the terms

[Andrey Peter]

You don’t understand anything, they have a tender not for a minimum, but for a maximum But seriously, this is the result of impunity, and Serdyukov and his company are an example of this.

[Mareman Vasilich]

This purchase is a fact of the incapacity and backwardness of all power since the collapse of the USSR. Can't do anything. All that is is the Soviet legacy. Or products that are based on Soviet ideas. I want to believe that the authorities care about the country, but that there are no arguments in its favor. Either mediocrity, or ................

[VladimS]

So what's the sensation? Or another vparivanie "opinion about the fact"?

PR requires it. You have to be by ear, otherwise they will forget.
Oval has really already pulled up with its "revelations", because it is not accurate, not verified, rumors.
The manufacturer’s selling price and store price always, everywhere and in any country are two different costs.
The author of the article clearly sympathizes with Oval. Otherwise, it is difficult to explain the selection of the presented photographs.
After all, if necessary, you can pull the photo of an oval with an animal grin.
Sorry. For not objectivity and bias article undoubtedly fat minus.

[servant.]

The wholesale price will always be known to you lower! In the store, retail is even more expensive there. The question is not in the core, the question is why the price of the state contract was higher than the price in the store? And where (to whom) did the difference between the real price and the transaction price go?

[wax]

And what, in the store they sell glocks with a laser body kit?

[Volodin]

if necessary, you can also draw a photo of an oval with an animal grin.

Bravo!

Bias and prejudice in what: in the photo of Navalny or is it in the prices for pistols?

[Lolocat]

Have any of you ever participated in government auctions? There are many conditions there, the auction step, time, requirements not only for the product itself, but also for the company, etc., etc. They can at least a million set the price for a gun, but they still have to buy at the lowest price.

[understudy]

Your division ... why is the topic slipping into the discussion of Navalny, and not that criminals in uniform or without, who desired the Glocks by emptying our pockets ??? To hell with them, with these liberals, but the infa about the "golden" tapestries given out on the mountain corresponds to the harsh reality! Where is the harsh shaking of the Criminal Code and the harsh resignations of brown hands? Chatted, scolded and everyone remained in their own interests?

[Volodin]

Heinrich, the fact is that many "commentators" do not read the article at all: they came to the word "Navalny" - and saliva began to flow. And there at least 3 billion for a pistol! And what does this Navalny have to do with it (as a topic for discussion), if the information (without his efforts) is in the public domain ...

[understudy]

And laughter and sin with these ... to put it mildly "experts" - it is impossible to "lie around" on Navalny, another "stunning" argument was immediately put forward - the objective rise in price was due to the cost of ammunition. How can one utter the sacramental phrase - "Klava, I'm crap!"
Well, when politics overshadows thinking, it is difficult to turn to the Murzilka magazine, popular in the past, where it is quite intelligibly explained that the 9x19 Parabellum cartridges used in Glocks have the property of being used in domestic developments such as the PYa pistol.
______________________
The "accusers" somehow do not realize that Navalny is being read simply, massively and systematically. Unlike pages with quotes and other crap for the pros. My attitude to Russian liberalism is extremely negative, on the verge of Article 282 of the Criminal Code, but the undisputed merit of A.N. is that he agitated the "swamp". No, not on the "Bolotnaya", but jabbering the muddy water of an official freeman. Now we know not only that they "just steal" (this was already known), but where, who, how and in what volumes. And who will love it? The deputies were also worried when their real estate over the hill and other harmless pranks were highlighted ...
Here it would be necessary to somehow decide: who has more faith?

[Walker1975]

Moreover, hang up an article and a description of any Russian pistol - and the whole forum will scream - that’s it is a super Russian weapon, and as purchases, it’s Gloks who buy, and they discuss Navalny again. Does he make pistols? Offers alternative brands? Responsible for the supply of weapons for the army or special forces? And is he at all?

[lx]

Quote: Russian

If you make simple mathematical calculations, it turns out that the average price of a Glock-17 pistol in this "estimate" is 210210 rubles, and a Glock-26 pistol 191100 rubles. The average price of such weapons from the manufacturer itself is no more than 20 thousand rubles, the price in Russia, taking into account the margins of intermediaries, does not exceed 60 thousand rubles. That is, the prices in the order are inflated at least 3-4 times.

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? This is the price including ammunition. In the order summary is written

125 Explosives and Explosives
2927260 Other ammunition

So what's the sensation? Or another vparivanie "opinion about the fact"?

There is no sensation - they steal, as usual.
this is "Classification of goods, works and services"
the composition of the kit is indicated in the documentation attached to the tender
Completeness:
- pistol;
- 6 stores;
- laser target designator (LC);
- holster belt of carbide material;
- operational holster made of carbide material;
- the holster for the thigh under the gun with the LCC;
- weapon case;
- accessories for cleaning;
- operation manual in Russian;
- Passport products.
everyone has already counted. In world retail this costs around $ 1100, we are 3 times more expensive = ~ 100000 rubles. max in retailbut for the beloved min. defense specials wholesale price 210000

[ssergn]

Ogh, they wrote that the trunk itself costs approx 1000 $, this is what it is for:

- 6 stores;
- laser target designator (LC);
- holster belt of carbide material;
- operational holster made of carbide material;
- the holster for the thigh under the gun with the LCC;
- weapon case;
- accessories for cleaning;

TOTAL ONE HUNDRED BUCKS?

May I have one kit?

[Neighbor]

9 mm (9x19 mm) pistol cartridge with a steel core bullet
index 7H21 (steel sleeve) Developed at TsNIITOCHMASH (designers Kasyanov I.P., Kornilova E.S.). Initially, he received the index RG057, and after being put into service - 7N21. The cartridge consists of a steel sleeve, a bullet, a propellant charge and a KV-26 igniter primer. The sleeve is cylindrical, the flange is not protruding, it is formed by an annular groove. The bullet consists of a bimetallic shell, a heat-strengthened steel core (st. U10A, 70, 65G steel) and a polyethylene jacket. The nose part of the core protrudes from the shell, which reduces the energy loss for its penetration and, accordingly, increases the penetration effect on the barrier. The accuracy of fire at a distance of 25 m (R50) is 2,5 cm. The range of hitting targets protected by body armor is 40 m. At a distance of 35 m, a bullet pierces a 80-mm steel sheet in 5% of cases.
Distinctive marking: the top of the bullet is painted black. We have our own cartridges 9/19

[Koronik]

Yes, gentlemen, I still want to meet the son or daughter of our "big" official who would be engaged in medicine (doctors), education (teachers)? No, they are mainly state of emergency and the authorized capital of their "production" millions and billions. Where did they earn them? Without parental help? So I have to wash for my children (although I consider Rogozin a decent person and in his place. It's a pity.

[Mature naturalist]

Quote: Koronik

Yes, gentlemen, I still want to meet the son or daughter of our "big" official who would be engaged in medicine (doctors),

Daughter Shoigu.

[lx]

Quote: ssergn

Ogh, they wrote that the trunk itself costs approx 1000 $, this is what it is for:

- 6 stores;
- laser target designator (LC);
- holster belt of carbide material;
- operational holster made of carbide material;
- the holster for the thigh under the gun with the LCC;
- weapon case;
- accessories for cleaning;

TOTAL ONE HUNDRED BUCKS?

May I have one kit?

can. order. but there will be problems with the gun at customs. We have, as was written, ~ 60 rubles, and in world retailas follows:
http://www.glockmeister.com/GLOCK-17-Gen-4/productinfo/G17GEN4/
http://www.glockmeister.com/G17-34-17L-GLOCK-Factory-Magazines-17-Round/producti
nfo / G17MAGHF
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Red-Laser-red-dot-sight-fit-for-pistol-gun-Glock-17-19-2
0-21-22-23-30-31-32-/300946072342?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4611c8a316
holsters even in rubles with us
http://www.mopnex.ru/item.php?id_item=1748
http://stich.su/catalog/103/2210/
http://stich.su/catalog/103/2014/
case with spare parts comes with a gun

[ssergn]

Thanks, but still. Someone estimate the real cost of the kit, taking into account customs duties and taxes. After all, all this bodyagi should go on the officer. channels.
That current does not need to throw links, pliz. Count yourself, and I'm lazy. Yes, do not forget to calculate how much the bank guarantee in 80% of the contract cost will cost the supplier (documentation requirement), but the state wants to be calm for its money. Calmness is also worth the money (the merchant in any case will take into account the overhead in the form of a guarantee in the price of the contract).

[Nayhas]

Quote: ssergn

Thanks, but still.

Without all the same, when buying in bulk, the price usually falls ...

[New Russia]

"Bulk agent of the State Department" "Anal" It's all clear) Only if nothing but these words you have nothing to say to him about the next fact of corruption, you are doing him a favor. Rogozin tried to warm up with pistols? Had tried. His son had already brought the workers of IzhMash to poverty in his time. When you cannot say anything to Navalny except insults, you are defending the authorities that openly rob us, and this plays into the hands of Navalny. That is why you cannot be a pro-government patriot, defending this power and thieves, you become accomplices of the enemies of the people, real patriots don’t lick the ass of the government, as many people here think that you don’t love (a liberal) Putin means not a patriot, it just looks pitiful.

[lx]

Quote: ssergn

Thanks, but still. Someone estimate the real cost of the kit, taking into account customs duties and taxes. After all, all this bodyagi should go on the officer. channels.
That current does not need to throw links, pliz. Count yourself, and I'm lazy.

legal, collected from us (support of national manufacturer!) under a license from orig. component parts
http://www.orsis.com/production/catalog/981/78909/
The price in the basic configuration is 56 rubles. (the price is indicated on the 500nd tab below)
comment from a representative of the same ORSIS
http://www.novayagazeta.ru/news/133043.html
I note that the collimator sight is not indicated in the tender. Total, the maximum (so don’t pull it) is 100 rubles.

[ssergn]

Quote: lx

legal, collected from us (support of national manufacturer!) under a license from orig. component parts

This is where the dog may be buried. If you still need the original, then the price of the kit, taking into account customs duties and taxes, can vary significantly. I do not pretend to be true, we just all want to understand (well, or not all, but some). By the way, the Glock 26 model is not presented at Orsis, therefore it is an import with all that it implies. And do not ignore the cost of the guarantee (3 669 120,00 rub.) For a period of at least November 25.11.2014, XNUMX Do you calculate how much it costs? Contractors of the order only for this Wishlist must give the bank approx. 150 sp. That is the law.

[lx]

Quote: ssergn

Quote: lx

legal, collected from us (support of national manufacturer!) under a license from orig. component parts

This is where the dog may be buried. If the original is still trumpeted, then the price of the kit, taking into account customs duties and taxes, can vary significantly. I do not pretend to be true, we just all want to understand (well, or not all, but some).

You, as I understand it, do not want to. So how to count, read and follow the links too lazy. The tender documentation does not state anywhere that it should be of foreign assembly. Everyone has already counted in any versions, as I understand it, it's useless to give links

[ssergn]

Read everything I wrote again, counted something.


1. Links give the price in the usa. An example is a similar car with us and they can differ in price by almost 2 times.
2. I did not understand the issues of import duties and taxation on the import of weapons.

Here, I found it.
9302 00 000 0 Revolvers and pistols, except incoming
to heading 9303 or 9304
pcs 19%
(http://www.eurasiancommission.org/en/act/trade/catr/ett/Documents/ett93%2001.09
.2013.pdf)

That is, only the import duty - 19%. Further delivery, breaking, taxes.

The whole question is - why the hell are we importing?

[ssergn]

Yes, and Glock 26 ???

PySy. Do we deal with you?

[andrei332809]

that oval, that Rogozin, both balaboly. only the first has already "served" for theft, and the second has not yet been caught. the first did not arouse respect, and the second quickly lost it after loudly declared and unfulfilled promises

[andrei332809]

Quote: spirit

, I heard it, honestly)

my nightingale, nightingale ... one horseradish bird. from here the conclusion-cock-crowed, and there at least do not dawn

[kim. 230752]

Bulk, no matter who he is, well done, because he is telling the truth, and the rest are sitting, they have taken water in their mouths. They are afraid of losing something, because they believe that the personal is more important. And corruption is happening from the very top. Therefore, the fight against it is so toothless.

[ssergn]

And what is the truth then?

Here is an independent opinion on this truth-teller

http://sgolub.ru/audio/proekt-navalnyi

Have fun at your leisure.

[Tyumen]

How can corruption be eradicated if it grows upward? :-)

[Lech from our city]

Serdyukov is not subject to jurisdiction - then everything is logical, corruption in the person of senior officials is immortal like the MAFIA.

[Vasia kruger]

The article seems to be about pistols and their price, but they are discussing Navalny. Yeah, fuck at him. But we will buy pistols for 4 prices. But Navalny scold.

[alexpro66]

Quote: lx

Quote: Russian

If you make simple mathematical calculations, it turns out that the average price of a Glock-17 pistol in this "estimate" is 210210 rubles, and a Glock-26 pistol 191100 rubles. The average price of such weapons from the manufacturer itself is no more than 20 thousand rubles, the price in Russia, taking into account the margins of intermediaries, does not exceed 60 thousand rubles. That is, the prices in the order are inflated at least 3-4 times.

Explain good people to me. And what should pistols shoot? This is the price including ammunition. In the order summary is written

125 Explosives and Explosives
2927260 Other ammunition

So what's the sensation? Or another vparivanie "opinion about the fact"?

There is no sensation - they steal, as usual.
this is "Classification of goods, works and services"
the composition of the kit is indicated in the documentation attached to the tender
Completeness:
- pistol;
- 6 stores;
- laser target designator (LC);
- holster belt of carbide material;
- operational holster made of carbide material;
- the holster for the thigh under the gun with the LCC;
- weapon case;
- accessories for cleaning;
- operation manual in Russian;
- Passport products.
everyone has already counted. In world retail this costs around $ 1100, we are 3 times more expensive = ~ 100000 rubles. max in retailbut for the beloved min. defense specials wholesale price 210000

It is incorrect to operate with prices (not wholesale at that) of distributors - prices when buying directly from the manufacturer (and from the list, he operates with everything except the laser and holsters) and even with a consignment above 1000 pieces there can be no more than 12 to 15 thousand rubles today ( Austrians prefer to pay in euros rather than dollars) .. so the price of one set (given that the wholesale purchase price of laser lanterns and 3 types of holsters will be no higher than 200-250 euros per set) is all the above listed at a maximum of 25 thousand rubles !! ! Well, plus customs clearance there transport and other crap that does not affect the number of zeros in the final amount. It is clear that still usually a rollback from the manufacturer and a contract for the supply of spare parts and some other little things. I heard all of the above with my own ears from the assistants of the DR .. So officials warm their hands on our taxes ..

[Vittt]

Perhaps I will cause a storm of indignation, but in terms of the volume of thieves, you Russians are in first place in the world.
We, who live in Belarus, are a little shocked by the scale of this and, as they say, a lot is seen at a distance - you can jump. You live in some kind of looking glass - we cool, we steal what we want, and shit on us all .This is a terrible pose.
We are a small Slavic people (there are only a little less than 10 million of us - the population of Moscow), and you want the Ukrainians to be equal to you. How can you be equal to those who do not love you, but only want to squeeze out all the juices. The oligarchy is already brought the economy of Belarus to its knees. Instead of nationalizing the cattle of Karimov, your dvorkovichs, ... uyevichs are defending this gangster band. I don’t like Lukashenko, but the fact that we don’t have your bastards in the streets ... I bow to him. you, Russians, will not begin to love yourself, and not just hate, we will be restless (depending on you), because you have no Tsar in your head!

[7ydmco]

Quote: Vittt

Perhaps I will cause a storm of indignation, but in terms of the volume of thieves, you Russians are in first place in the world.

Yes, but if someone like Shushkevich had rules, then there would be no difference between us.

[Anubis]

Quote: Mikado

You, as a retired civil servant, should know 94FZ, and that according to him, you cannot conclude anything directly, only bidding (except if the order does not exceed 100 thousand rubles)

We know the laws, but they are written, in my opinion, by either persons interested or short-sighted.

[voliador]

In any case, the price is clearly overpriced!

[bunta]

The meaning of the article is not clear. Either discuss the prices for Gloki, or Navalny once again crap.

[artgrad]

And what kind of Russian development "The Strizh Pistol is the best among equals" ?! And joyful plans for introduction into the Russian army

[sergey158-29]

The raven will not peck out the crow ...

Only a "NEW" leader could SIT everyone, starting with "YOURSELF" - THE TOP ...

But THIS is, unfortunately, already from the realm of SCIENCE ...

[Captain45]

I don't remember the exact situation, but it seems like this: when Karamzin was returning from a trip to Germany, he met an acquaintance at the post station and asked: “What is in Russia?”, To which a laconic answer followed: “They are stealing!” So ​​there is nothing new under moon, not two hundred, not a hundred. Not a year ago. Then somehow they looked at the manufacturer's website for the cost of a valve for a Christmas tree - 8500 rubles at the plant, and the company buys for 108000 rubles. Here are such pies with kittens. But the optimization of the number with the purpose of increasing the economic effect.

[rpek32]

A bell to our armaments - pull yourself up as pistols

[I think so]

And where are they ... "our" gunsmiths? They rot in poverty without funding ... they rivet pots ... It got to the point that Makarov's pistols have forgotten how to make ... Newly released PMs do not shoot, jam, break ... what can we say about new developments, this is generally a disgrace ... -the same PYa ...

[saag]

What can Putin do inside the country? He has so many classmates, classmates, colleagues and just good acquaintances, each of them has so many business interests, and Putin himself said, “I don’t give up my own people.”

[saag]

And, by the way, this will continue until 2018, because now Sochi, then the World Cup, and then that’s it, gig projects will end, and the presidential term too, financial flows will dry up, it will be fun, everyone

[I think so]

Yes, and here Rogozin looks pale compared to Navalny... there is nothing to cover with... they steal, sir, they steal, sir, as before...

[bunta]

OK it's all over Now. The last one was found.
Be scared.

The Russian Ministry of Defense has decided to abandon the purchase of Austrian Glock pistols at a price of 200 thousand rubles per weapon. This was stated by Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin, commenting on the progress of the inspection of the purchase of these pistols.

The military department planned to purchase a limited batch of Glock pistols for the Senezh special forces. As the Deputy Prime Minister stated, a massive purchase was not planned. “I ordered an inspection, I was informed that it (the order) was laid down several years ago under the previous head of the Ministry of Defense,” Rogozin said.

[BorisBM]

They steal from us, as before, a lot and often, including from the budget. Navalny did not discover America. We know all this ourselves. He stung Rogozin, many will say and they will be partly right. D. Rogozin has too many responsibilities and too heavy a bag he took it upon himself. The person didn’t get around to such a small thing as a Glock. As for Navalny’s personality, there can’t be two opinions. This is a continuation of the “magnificent five” led by Chubais. They know that they don’t have There is no way for them in Russia to return to power, at least to elected power for sure. And that’s why Navalny appeared. Trained at Yale, he knows exactly how to ruin Russia to the ground. The last hope of liberals in Russia. If he doesn’t get at least somewhere anywhere where it is possible to influence government affairs, then the liberals in Russia are finished. The old ones, from DAM to Kasparov, have already crap so much that they are unlikely to be able to get elected anywhere. That’s why they are dragging Navalny with all their might, by the ears, but only the top. And the government is dragging it, urged on by the United States and Medvedev. And the Glock is a good pistol, since ours can’t do anything better yet, for special forces you can buy a couple or three thousand pieces.