Military Review

Russian army reborn ("The National Interest", USA)

133
Russian army reborn ("The National Interest", USA)One of the distinguishing characteristics of the presidency of Vladimir Putin is his desire to revive and strengthen the Russian armed forces. Putin, who has repeatedly noted that Russia's apparent weakness makes it vulnerable to pressure from outside and for internal division, insists on increasing army funding to turn it from the weakened remains of the old military machine of the Soviet superpower into a smaller, more modern, mobile, advanced technically and battle-worthy power of the 21 century.


Speaking this year with a speech on the Day of Defender of the Fatherland, the Russian president said: “Ensuring reliable defense capability of Russia is the priority of our state policy. The modern world is still far from a calm, secure development. New, equally complex conflicts are added to old, long-standing conflicts, instability is growing in vast regions of the world. ”

And these are not empty words. Such rhetoric is supported by appropriate cash. Russia today is conducting the largest military buildup since the collapse of the Soviet Union, which occurred a little more than 20 years ago. Every year, up to 2020, it will significantly increase its military allocations. Putin pushed through this program even against the objections of some Kremlin leaders concerned about the cost levels and their possible implications for Russian welfare. Opposition to the increase in military spending was one of the reasons for the departure of Finance Minister Alexei Kudrin from the Cabinet of Ministers of the Russian government.

The world does not leave these actions without attention.

If earlier for several years he looked at Russia as the “Upper Volta with rockets”, or as a country with a significant arsenal of nuclear weapons. weapons and by ordinary forces that did not crown themselves with special laurels of glory in the post-Soviet period, now Russian plans for military reform and rearmament cause him some concern. The US national security agencies, who previously believed that Russia was not able to project force beyond its borders, were particularly concerned. But she resumed bomber flights aviation in the skies over the Atlantic and the Pacific Ocean, she began sending warships (in particular, to the Caribbean Sea), carried out a military campaign against Georgia in 2008, and also increased the scope and complexity of the tasks being worked out for annual military exercises conducted in conjunction with the Chinese army and fleet. All this leads to the fact that they again begin to look at Russia as a military threat. Now, in the justification of US military spending, which had previously focused mainly on increasing Chinese defense spending, the fact of the buildup of Russia's military power is also taken into account.

If you look at the budget reports and memoranda on the state of affairs, then the Russian plans initiated by Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu and Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin, who is responsible for the defense sector, seem very impressive - and ominous. If just a few years ago, shipbuilding allocations for the Russian Navy amounted to less than 10% of the US Navy, now Russians are closing the gap. As for capital investments from the budget, Russia today spends on the construction of new ships about half of what the U.S. Navy will allocate for these purposes. By 2020, the Russian ground forces will have such a structure, in the center of which there will be combat ready and ready for quick deployment brigades. The goal is to have at least 70% of units equipped with military equipment and weapons of a new generation in the ground forces. If everything goes according to plan, then in the Russian armed forces, by 2020, one million military personnel will again be in active military service, 2300 new tanks, approximately 1200 new planes and helicopters, and the Navy will include 50 new surface ships and 28 submarines. And 100 new satellites will provide the Russian communications and command and control system. To fulfill these tasks, Putin promised to allocate approximately $ 10 billion in the next 755 years.

In addition, the buildup of military power is supported by an increasing number of Russians. According to a survey by the Levada Center, 46% of Russian citizens advocate an increase in military spending, even if it leads to a slowdown in the economy (and 41% is against if an increase in defense spending causes economic difficulties). This is partly due to the fear that Russia's vast mineral reserves, especially in the Arctic, will be in danger if the country does not have the means to protect them. Rogozin himself repeatedly warned that without modern armed forces, the country in the future will certainly be “looted”.

But often there is a noticeable difference between the declared Russian intentions and achievable results. How feasible are these ambitious goals of Russia?

Some observers are ready to dismiss lightly on these plans, calling them Potemkin villages. Or, they call them a new and very inventive way to divert public funds into private hands through tricky corruption schemes. Of course, any increase in the military budget creates tremendous opportunities for abuse. But it would be a mistake to ignore the clear evidence that such a build-up of military power leads to the restoration of the combat potential of the Russian armed forces, which was lost with the collapse of the Soviet Union. Over the past year and a half, Russia has been conducting military exercises of such proportions that the country has not known since the days of the Cold War (for example, the recently completed maneuvers in the Far East). They still point out problems in the command and control system and in the quality of military equipment, and yet these exercises also show that reforms are beginning to have an impact, and that Russia can get more mobile and efficient armed forces.

And that worries NATO very much. The actions of the North Atlantic Alliance to conduct operations outside its area of ​​responsibility, as well as the decisions of most European countries to significantly reduce defense spending, were based on the assumption that Russia no longer poses a threat. Nobody, of course, thinks that Russian tanks are about to rush through the Fulda corridor. But now America has to reconsider its calculations that Europe will become an “exporter of security” to other, less calm points on the world map, since Russia essentially refuses its “disarmament” position on which these calculations were based.

But at the same time, the process of building up military power does not promise the Russian government to be smooth and calm.

The first question is whether the Russian defense industry will be able to create the tools that the new military strategy requires of it. Dmitry Gorenburg from the Center for Naval Analysis notes that the plans of the Ministry of Defense are based on overly optimistic forecasts regarding the rate of transition of Russian factories and shipyards for the production of new equipment. Their developers assume that there will be no delays, technical and design problems, as well as bottlenecks. But design problems have already caused a two-year delay in the execution of the state order for the purchase of thirty-seven Su-35 aircraft, which will be completed no earlier than 2016 of the year. Gorenburg and other experts argue that plans to build up military power are unlikely to be fully implemented in accordance with the stated objectives.

Moreover, the Russian military-industrial complex is far from achieving the standard of "zero marriage" in the production of military equipment and weapons. A series of failures with missile launches (in particular, the Bulava missiles launched from submarines), failure to comply with the construction schedule of new ships (or, say, the Admiral Nakhimov / Vikramaditya aircraft carrier retrofitting) and quality problems vehicles - all this raises questions about the reliability of Russian-made military products.

In addition, there are serious concerns about the state of research and development work and the ability of Russia to create at home the equipment and technologies that are necessary for the manufacture of fifth-generation weapons systems. Former Defense Minister Anatoly Serdyukov steadfastly resisted pressure to order just slightly updated versions of the old Soviet technology, although Russian industry lobbied for an increase in just such a state order. He tried to buy some defense products abroad, including unmanned aerial vehicles in Israel, Iveco light multipurpose vehicles in Italy and Mistral-class amphibious assault ships in France, in order to equip the Russian armed forces with more advanced equipment that the domestic industry cannot produce. . However, dissatisfaction with Serdyukov’s desire and readiness to contact foreign suppliers was one of the reasons for his resignation from the post of defense minister last year.

Along with this, Serdyukov tried to reform the organizational structure of the Russian army (also causing opposition), trying to reduce the number of officers (especially the number of generals and admirals) and transfer the armed forces from recruiting to a professional basis. However, the announced plans to increase the size of the regular army contradict Russian demographic realities. In Russia, there is a shortage of labor resources. The revitalization in her economy has reduced the labor surplus, which was previously absorbed by the call-up for military service. Due to delays and the growth of health problems in the Russian population, approximately 60% of recruited young people do not go into the army. Attempts to make contract service more attractive (following the example of reforms implemented in the USA in the 1970-ies with the aim of switching to the voluntary principle of recruitment) provided some success. But although the Russian military leadership announced that it would create 2020 new brigades (in addition to existing 40) by 70, it will have to face the sad reality that many units today have an incomplete staff of about 25%. Shoigu should continue reforms in such matters as recruitment and treatment of recruits, because compulsory conscription and the unpleasant conditions of service created by the so-called hazing (mockery of sergeants and other senior servicemen over recruits) do not contribute to the creation of a more professional army capable of attracting and retaining volunteers. The sums of money that must be spent on attracting Russians to contract service (an increase in money allowances, benefits and incentives) may exceed the amount of funds that the military establishment is willing to allocate.

Much will depend on the following factors. The first is whether the Russian treasury will receive the expected amount of money from the export of oil and gas, which is able to provide transformations in the armed forces. Any serious reduction in energy prices will certainly put these plans at risk. The second is whether the Russian defense industry will be able to increase its dynamism, flexibility and adaptability. Will she be able to use the increase in government spending in order to create new models of equipment and weapons? This is important not only for fulfilling Putin’s demands, but also for preserving the traditionally lucrative export trade of Russian weapons. Russia will cede its competitive advantages not only to American and European rivals, but also to Chinese companies if it cannot keep pace with new developments of military equipment. The third factor is whether the Russian army will be able to get the number of personnel it needs - whether by improving the conditions of contract service or by recruiting Russian-speaking contract servicemen in the former Soviet republics.

But even if the ambitious plans of the Ministry of Defense for recruiting personnel and adopting modern military equipment are not fully implemented, the Russian armed forces are still getting stronger and stronger today. Moscow is unlikely to be able to directly challenge the United States, whose military spending far exceeds that of Russia. But if we take into account regional trends, especially in Europe, then it must be said that Russia is reviving its non-nuclear combat potential, thereby reinforcing its claims to the status of a great power. Whether such a newly acquired confidence of Russia in its forces will help increase its willingness to cooperate in the international arena, or, conversely, Moscow will take more obstructionist positions - this question remains open.
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  1. Stiletto
    Stiletto 10 October 2013 15: 31
    134
    "Opposition to an increase in military spending was one of the reasons for the departure from the cabinet of the veteran of the Russian government, Finance Minister Alexei Kudrin."
    - Why are there Kudrin! For the sake of building up the military power of the state, I think most of my compatriots, reluctantly laughing even ready to sacrifice the entire Cabinet of Ministers!
    1. experienced
      experienced 10 October 2013 15: 36
      64
      Former Minister of Defense Anatoly Serdyukov steadfastly resisted pressureaimed at ordering just slightly updated versions of old Soviet equipment, although Russian industry lobbied for an increase in just such a state order. He tried to purchase some defense products abroad, including unmanned aerial vehicles in Israel, light multi-purpose vehicles Iveco in Italy and landing ships of the Mistral class in France, in order to equip the Russian armed forces with more advanced equipment that domestic industry is unable to produce . However, dissatisfaction with Serdyukov’s desire and willingness to turn to foreign suppliers was one of the reasons for his resignation from the post of Minister of Defense in the past year.


      Bugaga, and we didn’t even know what happiness this ghoul wanted for our Army and Navy ... wassat
      He resisted, resisted, but found himself in bed in Vasilieva and then they showed him that he could plunder the Motherland, but if he encroached on the sacred and betrayed Zubkov’s daughter, then there was no forgiveness to him ...
      1. Nitup
        Nitup 10 October 2013 17: 33
        +4
        Quote: seasoned
        but if he encroached on the sacred and cheated on Zubkov’s daughter, then there is no forgiveness for him ...

        In my opinion, treason with Vasilyeva is not the reason for removing Serdyukov.
        1. old man54
          old man54 10 October 2013 20: 34
          11
          Quote: Nitup
          Quote: seasoned
          but if he encroached on the sacred and cheated on Zubkov’s daughter, then there is no forgiveness for him ...

          In my opinion, treason with Vasilyeva is not the reason for removing Serdyukov.

          one of them is the reason why it is a sin to hide? lol But the main thing, of course, is the split of the once united cesspool of the supreme pro-liberal sub-people in the Russian Federation at the 2 grouping. One grouping was put on Dimochka-iPhone, and Smerdyukov, of course, joined them. That is why the GDP after its inogration in 2012 went so tense and confused, until Shoygu put his post on the MVS post on the board, and so he immediately relaxed.
          In general, it’s strange, until now, most of them think that they are small children, that Smerdyukov made all decisions on the collapse of the armed forces for 5 years, and didn’t report anything to anyone and didn’t endorse the reduction program. Funny, I do not understand? fellow laughing He is the only one such a great one, Smerdyukov nicknamed Taburetkin, he broke and ruined everything, successfully, but no one saw anything or knew in the government and in the Kremlin that the bases were closing down and the army was shrinking. I wonder tongue
        2. kenig1
          kenig1 11 October 2013 08: 29
          +3
          this is the main reason, Taburetkin was thought to scare a little, and when they started to get out they themselves were scared.
      2. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 10 October 2013 18: 27
        +3
        As soon as AE Serdyukov was able to crawl into the position of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation? Some upstart out of nowhere.
        1. fedorovith
          fedorovith 10 October 2013 21: 36
          +4
          This is not an upstart, this is a special person, specifically aimed at trading everything that is possible
          1. gunnerminer
            gunnerminer 10 October 2013 22: 15
            +1
            This is not an upstart, this is a special person, specifically aimed at trading everything that is possible




            Has someone sent Serdyukov to trade? Who can send the Minister of Defense to trade everything that is possible?
            1. Starfish
              Starfish 10 October 2013 22: 39
              +1
              Has someone sent Serdyukov to trade? Who can send the Minister of Defense to trade everything that is possible?

              yes there is such a human being who can
              1. gunnerminer
                gunnerminer 10 October 2013 23: 12
                +1
                Quote: Starfish
                Has someone sent Serdyukov to trade? Who can send the Minister of Defense to trade everything that is possible?

                yes there is such a human being who can




                Bulk, is he really? (Joke).
        2. Simon
          Simon 11 October 2013 08: 18
          +3
          And many of us crawl like that. Gaidar was an economist in the PRAVDA newspaper, but became Yeltsin's right-hand man, Chubais traded flowers in the market, when Yeltsin put everyone on a voucher, Serdyukov made stools, became Minister of Defense. What not to say - from rags to riches (Russian proverb).
      3. Blackgrifon
        Blackgrifon 10 October 2013 19: 28
        +9
        Quote: seasoned
        what happiness this ghoul wanted for our Army and Navy


        Reduced to 200 professionals (officers, warrant officers), almost ditched the entire army - so they put him as an example. In 000 he would have been kicked out of state structures, in 1914 he would have been shot, and now he is already a "victim" of Vasilyeva's arbitrariness.

        And another moment - the author does not know what he is writing about - the Soviet / Russian army in his opinion in the post-war period has no merit. Let the US Navy (veterans of the Cold War) and veterans of Afghanistan, local conflicts of the 90s, Georgians tell us about this — we have been fighting in the Caucasus for 30 years and have won, despite financing, the supply of weapons and military hardware, and political support for militants from abroad, collapse of the superpower. What other country could survive in such conditions and not give up?
        1. Nitup
          Nitup 10 October 2013 20: 18
          +2
          Quote: Blackgrifon
          In 1914 he would be kicked out

          Well, now they kicked him out
          1. Blackgrifon
            Blackgrifon 10 October 2013 20: 48
            +1
            Quote: Nitup
            Well, now they kicked him out


            I forgot to add - "no pension", and now - and "pension" and the status of "victim" ...
      4. The comment was deleted.
    2. klimpopov
      klimpopov 10 October 2013 15: 44
      +9
      And State Dura!
      1. experienced
        experienced 10 October 2013 15: 52
        12
        Quote: klimpopov
        And State Dura!


        And the Federation Council! wassat (Pupil laughing )
        1. Apollo
          Apollo 10 October 2013 16: 20
          17
          Quote: seasoned
          And State Dura!

          Quote: seasoned
          And the Federation Council!


          I understand that you are both in a bunch laughing
          Matyuki is out of place here, I will briefly express my thought-damage caused by Serdyukov’s army and navy of Russia for a very long time will make itself known, the consequences of which we are still to the end not yet realized and felt.
          1. experienced
            experienced 10 October 2013 16: 35
            +6
            Quote: Apollon
            I understand that you are both in a bunch

            No, we are individually, but in one direction on this issue laughing ... But if we continue in a similar tone, we will definitely find ourselves "in a bundle" or "handcuffs" what

            Threat Klim, I just that from an organized group of people otmazyvat laughing

            And you are not a person, but flint about Serdyukov and without matyukov wassat
          2. svp67
            svp67 10 October 2013 16: 37
            +6
            Quote: Apollon
            the consequences of which we have not yet fully understood and felt.

            I almost agree here.
            We realized that we realized, albeit at the level of intuition, but really, we didn’t feel it up to the end, since a lot of what Serdyukov and Co did for a long time to come will “go around ...”
          3. silver_roman
            silver_roman 10 October 2013 17: 05
            +1
            I understand that conspiracy, but if it’s possible and not very difficult, can you write a brief summary of the consequences? by itself, the inertia of his actions is tough, but how much ????
            1. Nitup
              Nitup 10 October 2013 17: 37
              +3
              Quote: silver_roman
              I understand that conspiracy, but if it’s possible and not very difficult, can you write a brief summary of the consequences? by itself, the inertia of his actions is tough, but how much ????

              One of the main consequences is the future shortage of pilots due to the fact that for three years under Medvedev and Serdyukov there was no admission to flight schools
          4. alone
            alone 10 October 2013 19: 33
            +5
            Quote: Apollon
            Matyuki is out of place here,


            welcome

            talking about Serdyukov and not fumbling it requires tremendous effort and harms health.

            I demand 1 liter of milk per day for harmfulness wassat
            1. Apollo
              Apollo 10 October 2013 20: 21
              +3
              Quote: lonely
              talking about Serdyukov and not fumbling it requires tremendous effort and harms health.


              Do you know a colleague hi we have our own There are Serdyukovs in not a small amount !!! As for me and Matyukov personally, I would put it so that everyone on the forum would simply fall and moderation would not allow.
              Quote: lonely
              I demand 1 liter of milk per day for harmfulness

              so it’s not worth ironizing only, unlike you, not 1 liter of milk, but a liter of vodka is required.
        2. SPACE
          SPACE 10 October 2013 16: 47
          0
          Quote: klimpopov
          And State Dura!

          Quote: seasoned
          And the Federation Council!

          Interestingly, was it mockery of oneself or self-criticism?
          1. experienced
            experienced 10 October 2013 16: 50
            10
            Quote: SPACE
            Interestingly, was it mockery of oneself or self-criticism?

            It was an objective expression of the attitude to the performance of state structures about which we wrote hi
            It is probably difficult for Kazakhs to understand the Russians' "love" towards deputies and governors ... lol
            True, unlike the governors, the depots not only steal, but sometimes they amuse people with their antics ... The other day, Isaev made a "show" on the plane, we live happily. Of course, we are far from the live broadcast of hand-to-hand fighting in the Verkhovna Rada, but there is enough fun wassat
            1. SPACE
              SPACE 10 October 2013 17: 26
              +5
              Quote: seasoned
              It was an objective expression of the attitude to the performance of state structures about which we wrote

              As for objectivity, I’m not sure. There are bad people, but there are good people, that’s objectivity, I also think it concerns the government and the Duma and the council. And of course you have to fight with dermis, although And dermo can sometimes also be useful, for example, to fertilize the garden. hi
            2. Basarev
              Basarev 11 October 2013 10: 48
              +1
              Interestingly, someone before me noticed - The Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine - abbreviated as VRU
    3. clidon
      clidon 10 October 2013 18: 26
      +1
      I wonder if they (most compatriots) are willing to sacrifice part of their pensions?
    4. alone
      alone 10 October 2013 19: 30
      +1
      . Rogozin himself repeatedly warned that without modern armed forces the country in the future will certainly be "plundered."


      But have 110 billionaires from Russia no longer plundered Russia?

      2300 new tanks, approximately 1200 new aircraft and helicopters, and the Navy will include 50 new surface ships and 28 submarines. And 100 new satellites will provide the Russian communications and command and control system.


      Do you think industry is capable of fulfilling this volume of work until 2020?
      1. varov14
        varov14 10 October 2013 19: 59
        +1
        In the old years, they could, now, perhaps in theory. There is a tension with personnel, the new formation of "Kalashnikov" was shown on TV, so there are still machines of the 30s, write here yourself - a shipbuilding plant.
    5. Quiet
      Quiet 10 October 2013 19: 44
      +4
      - Why are there Kudrin!

      The topic is not about that !!! The Russian army, together with the Chinese army, is preparing for the unpredictable demarche of the US rulers regarding the lost positions of the dollar !!! America losing their positions in the bidding bucks are ready to shove the entire planet into the mouth of an atomic war volcano !!! VOVIK !!! RESPECT TO YOU hi (did you notice that the whole name with capital letters ???) It is trying softly (enough of us 1941-1945) to Solve the problem so that people in the USA do not die of hunger from the collapse of the bucks !!!! DO NOT WATER IT !!! History will show that HE RIGHTS !!!!! good soldier hi
    6. Quiet
      Quiet 10 October 2013 20: 57
      +1
      Russian army is reborn

      Notice At Fire Pace !!! Only Shoigu can work so fast - min. in emergency situations !!!! good
    7. kris
      kris 10 October 2013 22: 11
      +1
      Bullshit is complete!
      Golem agitation slop hack.
      Gorshkova mixed up with Nakhimov.
  2. fzr1000
    fzr1000 10 October 2013 15: 35
    +2
    Nicholas Gvozdev-from the former compatriots or what? Maybe it's time to think about returning to their historical homeland before it's too late?
    1. Quiet
      Quiet 10 October 2013 20: 49
      +2
      Nicholas Gvozdev-from the former compatriots or what? Maybe it's time to think about returning to their historical homeland before it's too late?

      They will rush back 5 minutes before the shame of the fugitives begins !!!
  3. fzr1000
    fzr1000 10 October 2013 15: 35
    0
    Nicholas Gvozdev-from the former compatriots or what? Maybe it's time to think about returning to their historical homeland before it's too late?
  4. andrei332809
    andrei332809 10 October 2013 15: 37
    13
    "Russia is being viewed again as a military threat."
    But I think, where the wars are spreading across the planet. It turns out that everything has returned to normal - Russia is the most aggressive and is the center of the axis of evil. and the author opened my eyes to the "service" of the stool, we scolded him, but we need to reward him. The stool worked with all his might so that the Russian army was "modern" and did not pose threats to the world
    1. 0255
      0255 10 October 2013 16: 14
      +8
      "Russia is being viewed again as a military threat."

      The West has always looked at Russia as a threat, both before the formation of the USSR and before the formation of the United States. With the same England, Russian troops united in only three wars - against Napoleon, the Kaiser and Hitler. And then these were temporary alliances against a common enemy.
      1. silver_roman
        silver_roman 10 October 2013 17: 07
        20
        yeah, nevertheless England helped us a lot in the war with Napoleon. Especially when Moscow was burning!
        all alliances with England are nonsense and nonsense.
        a couple of thousand square meters of show-offs, but nevertheless they brought evil to us exorbitantly!
        1. Quiet
          Quiet 10 October 2013 21: 21
          +3
          yeah, nevertheless England helped us a lot in the war with Napoleon. Especially when Moscow was burning!

          Is this your joke ??? laughing belay lol laughing I "appreciated" you put a plus! laughing
        2. mirag2
          mirag2 11 October 2013 08: 35
          +1
          Yes, the British have no friends, like the Jews. For both those and other partners only use ...
    2. k1964
      k1964 10 October 2013 16: 33
      21
      better to be a threat than a whipping boy. let them be afraid, you should not get used to it. they won’t love us anyway, so let them respect us.
      1. Quiet
        Quiet 10 October 2013 22: 05
        +1
        better to be a threat than a whipping boy.

        "Afraid means love" ....
        1. USMC
          USMC 10 October 2013 23: 37
          -8
          Quote: Quiet
          "Afraid means love" ....

          afraid of you (RF) unless an ignorant common people))))
          1. Simon
            Simon 11 October 2013 08: 25
            +3
            You, my friend, think about your people. Your Ukrainian government does not think about anything at all, soon you will go around the world with outstretched hands. And we will take care of ourselves somehow. tongue
          2. VADIMKRSK
            VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 12: 21
            0
            Mostly respected. And to be afraid when people with a high position or money are going to do dirty tricks. The ignorant ordinary people are afraid of the authorities, or of the one they say - byak!
        2. Simon
          Simon 11 October 2013 08: 30
          +1
          "They are afraid, it means they respect" - it would be more correct. Let homosexuals love, but we must be respected.
          1. USMC
            USMC 11 October 2013 10: 22
            -1
            Quote: Simon
            "They are afraid, it means they respect" - it would be more correct. Let homosexuals love, but we must be respected.

            and who interestingly respects you in the world? laughing
            but civilians are afraid of you. artificially escalate the situation to justify the enormous military spending.

            Quote: Simon
            You, my friend, think about your people. Your Ukrainian government does not think about anything at all, soon you will go around the world with outstretched hands. And we will take care of ourselves somehow.

            and I, unlike you, just understand what power is doing in Ukraine, and you continue to pray for your GDP wassat
            1. VADIMKRSK
              VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 12: 28
              0
              Is a Donetsk miner afraid of a Russian soldier from Rostov? What kind of people are you talking about? Where does he live?
              1. USMC
                USMC 11 October 2013 12: 41
                0
                Quote: VADIMKRSK
                Is a Donetsk miner afraid of a Russian soldier from Rostov? What kind of people are you talking about? Where does he live?

                I'm talking about Western countries
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. Quiet
      Quiet 10 October 2013 20: 24
      +3
      а I think where the wars on the planet come from. It turns out that everything has returned to normal — Russia is the most aggressive and is the center of the axis of evil.

      You are not right !!! As soon as Russia gives a slack - world wars begin !!!!
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 10 October 2013 22: 08
        0
        You are not right !!! As soon as Russia gives a slack - world wars begin !!!!





        Do you think that in 1991-2000 the Russian Federation was weak? Or did the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation meet the most modern requirements of the time?
        1. Simon
          Simon 11 October 2013 08: 47
          0
          Correctly "Quiet" said. While we were building capitalism and playing nice with the amers, bombed Yugoslavia, then Libya was destroyed, now we attacked Syria, next in line is Irann.
  5. Hikar
    Hikar 10 October 2013 15: 43
    +7
    And where does India and Central Asia Latin America Poland USA and Canada ???
    1. IRBIS
      IRBIS 10 October 2013 15: 49
      +7
      Quote: Hnikar
      And where does India and Central Asia Latin America Poland USA and Canada ???

      The same question arose. The author mixed everything in a heap. Nevertheless, there are some common thoughts in this opus. Few, but they are.
      1. VADIMKRSK
        VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 12: 33
        0
        A pair of sound thoughts is already an achievement! One more, then another - already understanding.
    2. experienced
      experienced 10 October 2013 15: 50
      +3
      Quote: Hnikar
      And where does India and Central Asia Latin America Poland USA and Canada ???


      On InoSMI, the title of the article "The Russian Army is Reborn" apparently there was a technical defect and was mistakenly stuck to the title and this laughing

      Here is the original: http://www.inosmi.ru/world/20131006/213608303.html
      1. IRBIS
        IRBIS 10 October 2013 16: 36
        10
        Quote: seasoned
        apparently there was a technical marriage and mistakenly stuck to the name and this

        Lying crocodile on the lake. Suddenly, a hippopotamus pops up next to him with a dejected, sad frog on his head.
        Crocodile: "- Why are you so sad, huh?"
        Frog: "- Well, I got sick. And then some thing stuck to my ass ..."
  6. GDP
    GDP 10 October 2013 15: 44
    +8
    The article is largely anti-Russian, but much is unfortunately true ...
    An attempt was made to record Serdyukov as a disgraced, but progressive reformer. A thief is a thief. In this case, there is also a nearby thief, they wouldn’t have caught a smart one ...
    Thank God that reformatting our army according to NATO standards has not reached its climax.
    He will only support the competitors of our own arms manufacturers, striking at our own production and making us dependent on potential adversaries.
    The means of producing weapons are also important, as are the weapons themselves, if not more important.
    1. Nitup
      Nitup 10 October 2013 17: 45
      +2
      Quote: GDP
      A thief is a thief. In this case, also a nearby thief, they wouldn’t have caught a smart one ...

      So he wasn’t caught. He is our witness. Till.
      But here's what I think about his insolent activities. He just thought that Putin would not go for a third term and that Medvedev would still be President and Serdyukov would not be anything for his business. Yes, and now there is nothing, only lost his post. But I think that everything can change
      1. alone
        alone 10 October 2013 19: 36
        +1
        Quote: Nitup
        Yes, and now there is nothing, only lost his post. But I think that everything can change


        nothing will happen. he is just a witness in the case. but whether the witness will be a prosecution or the defense witness, time will tell
        1. Nitup
          Nitup 10 October 2013 20: 21
          +1
          Quote: lonely
          Nothing will happen

          Well, if you said, then for sure there will be nothing
      2. v.lyamkin
        v.lyamkin 11 October 2013 10: 34
        +1
        After Stepashin’s words that he had already warned him about theft in the Ministry of Defense back in 2010, I completely ceased to understand anything. One way or another, he seemed to have somehow reacted to Stepashin’s information. Or was Serdyukov so untouchable?
    2. demel2
      demel2 10 October 2013 18: 08
      +1
      You might think we generally catch thieves even smart though stupid
      1. Nitup
        Nitup 10 October 2013 19: 06
        0
        Quote: demel2
        You might think we generally catch thieves even smart though stupid

        It happens. Recently, one governor or mayor, I don’t remember exactly, sat down on a 9,5-year strict prisoner, either for a bribe or for embezzlement. Generally at the level of mayors, many are sitting
        1. alone
          alone 10 October 2013 19: 37
          +3
          Quote: Nitup
          Generally at the level of mayors, many are sitting


          they sit because they decided to grab everything. and the one who regularly shares sits in place. it’s everywhere like that. not only in Russia
          1. Nitup
            Nitup 10 October 2013 20: 16
            +1
            Quote: lonely
            they sit because they decided to grab everything. and the one who regularly shares sits in place. it’s everywhere like that. not only in Russia

            I don’t know, they don’t share with me, so I can’t say why everyone is sitting. maybe with someone and so, but skem - in a different way
        2. saturn.mmm
          saturn.mmm 10 October 2013 20: 51
          +1
          Quote: Nitup
          It happens. Recently, one governor or mayor, I don’t remember exactly, sat down on a 9,5-year strict prisoner, either for a bribe or for embezzlement. Generally at the level of mayors, many are sitting

          Or maybe they are sitting for greed? As the saying goes
          - The greed of the fraer will destroy, probably forgotten.
        3. VADIMKRSK
          VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 12: 48
          0
          Detroit Mayor Gets 28 Years For Corruption. You can learn something from minke whales ... Land for a long time, but do not shoot, as in China. That would pass all in his memoirs ...
    3. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 10 October 2013 22: 12
      +1
      A thief is a thief. In this case, also a nearby thief, they wouldn’t have caught a smart one ...




      Theft is not the worst. The main criterion for assessing the activities of the Minister of Defense is the assessment of the achieved level of combat readiness of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. Did AE Serdyukov increase the combat readiness of the Armed Forces with his activity or reduce the combat readiness as a result of the 2007-2012 reform?
  7. Egoza
    Egoza 10 October 2013 15: 50
    14
    many units today have a staff shortage of approximately 25%. Shoigu should continue reforms in such matters as recruiting and treating them, because forced conscription and unpleasant conditions of service created by so-called bullying (bullying of sergeants and other old-timers over new recruits) do not contribute to the creation of a more professional army that can attract and retain in its ranks volunteers.


    Oh! I am begging you! Enough to put an ad:

    Voentur offers unique European tours on the T-72 tank!
    Warsaw, Berlin, Prague!
    Rest near the best hotels!
    You pay only for diesel fuel!
    Departure - as far as picking battalions! (from)

    And the equipment will be, and the volunteers will not hang up! laughing
    1. aksakal
      aksakal 10 October 2013 16: 05
      +5
      Quote: Egoza
      Voentur "offers unique tours in Europe on the T-72 tank!

      "Is there an" Armata "? I want a gamerope on the" Armata ", or at least on the T-90 MS.
    2. experienced
      experienced 10 October 2013 16: 07
      +7
      Quote: Egoza
      You pay only for diesel fuel!

      Elena, "Voentura" has diesel fuel for free laughing And it was always free, and there is food included.
      1. silver_roman
        silver_roman 10 October 2013 17: 09
        +5
        and three meals a day? and will there be compote? laughing
        then I'm FOR. where to sign?
    3. Apollo
      Apollo 10 October 2013 16: 30
      +3
      Quote: Egoza
      Oh! I am begging you! Enough to put an ad:


      Good day, Elena hi
      Stormy and prolonged applause, smoothly turning into a standing ovation. good
      1. Zhenya
        Zhenya 10 October 2013 16: 37
        +3
        Egoza And how much is the tour ??
        It can be for two weeks, for two to Rome. soldier
        1. family tree
          family tree 10 October 2013 20: 38
          +2
          Zhenya (1) RU Today, 16:37 ↑

          Fidget And how much is the tour ??
          It can be for two weeks, for two to Rome. soldier
          Look for a third. On 72, tour groups of three, firstly, all places are filled, secondly, for three, tradition is already drinks
          And yes, freebie + all inclusive wassat
    4. samoletil18
      samoletil18 10 October 2013 20: 22
      +2
      I would like to visit Riga (military unit 42216 1988-90).
    5. USMC
      USMC 10 October 2013 23: 45
      -2
      What if tourists come to you earlier? laughing
      or the Chinese will make a group walking trip to a picnic in Siberia. such a small group, thousand per 100 laughing
      1. VADIMKRSK
        VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 13: 08
        0
        A picnic in Siberia for the Chinese? !!! So many roads must be built here! 100000 will not be enough. And the "Wild Division" from the Caucasus will guard and drive on. Everyone will be happy. Even the Chinese - after the construction it will be possible to stay in Russia and have three sons.
  8. Muadipus
    Muadipus 10 October 2013 15: 54
    13
    Fear is a good feeling. It helps to survive and make the right decisions. It’s time to already understand the world that a Russian soldier with any weapon is scary.
    1. a52333
      a52333 10 October 2013 16: 08
      +5
      Recently showed interviews with the Germans who fought in Stalingrad. Most of all they were afraid to face melee. It’s right away - a sentence. Therefore, they tried to walk at least together.
    2. andrei332809
      andrei332809 10 October 2013 16: 37
      +7
      Quote: Muadipus
      a Russian soldier with any weapon is scary.
      1. Zhenya
        Zhenya 10 October 2013 16: 42
        +4
        I read an article by a former SAS officer (British elite unit), where he clearly said that it is better to keep Russian soldiers at a distance from a bullet and keep it close, since a blow to your shoulder blade is likely to become fatal for you.
        1. Know-nothing
          Know-nothing 10 October 2013 20: 11
          0
          Not surprising
          1. SAG
            SAG 11 October 2013 00: 10
            +2
            These wolves can only scoff at 18-year-old boys, they will rob him from a real fighter. And if a few normal men will shut up at all !!
            1. Letterksi
              Letterksi 11 October 2013 10: 05
              -2
              That is why the Erefi army is not taught anything but to be able to row and stand at attention to the senior in rank. to have less real men
              1. 528Obrp
                528Obrp 11 October 2013 12: 52
                0
                Quote: LetterKsi
                That is why the Erefi army does not teach anything


                Probably still taught. I do not advise checking.

                Yugoslavia (approximately 10 million) against the United States, Britain, France, Germany, Belgium, Hungary, Denmark, Spain, Italy, Canada, Holland, Norway, Portugal, Turkey. 23 thousand bombs and missiles were dropped. 2000 civilians killed
                The operation lasted more than 2 months. The combat potential of the army suffered slightly. The army was not demoralized. Result - Kosovo rejection
                Georgia (approximately 4 million) + NATO assistance (equipment, communications, instructors): part 58 of the army + militias - 3 days. Tanks near Tbilisi. Big trophies. The Georgian Army is completely demoralized, fleeing from the position ahead of its own squeal. The president chews his own tie. The result is a loss of 20% of the rebel territories.
      2. VADIMKRSK
        VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 13: 15
        0
        A piece of reinforcement is the very thing! The main thing is to get where you need to! Old: "To hit the target, you often need not accuracy, but courage."
    3. Alex Nick
      Alex Nick 10 October 2013 20: 03
      +1
      Fear is a good feeling. I agree. Only fools are not afraid of anything. Therefore, they fall in bundles.
  9. Alexandr73
    Alexandr73 10 October 2013 16: 25
    +5
    Quote: GDP
    An attempt was made to record Serdyukov as a disgraced, but progressive reformer. A thief is a thief. In this case, there is also a nearby thief, they wouldn’t have caught a smart one ...

    But he wasn’t caught. This is all Vasiliev, but he is not at work.
  10. sergant89
    sergant89 10 October 2013 16: 26
    +4
    Quote: Egoza

    Oh! I am begging you! Enough to put an ad:

    Voentur offers unique European tours on the T-72 tank!
    Warsaw, Berlin, Prague!
    Rest near the best hotels!
    You pay only for diesel fuel!
    Departure - as far as picking battalions! (from)

    And the equipment will be, and the volunteers will not hang up! laughing

    Plus you huge good
  11. old rocket man
    old rocket man 10 October 2013 16: 29
    +5
    Put a plus sign, although whining is enough.
    And on account of the remaining open questions, I can answer, if you do nothing, then nothing will happen.
    May not be fully implemented, but still drinks
  12. Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. 10 October 2013 16: 36
    +3
    But now America has to rethink its calculations that Europe will become a “security exporter” to other, less calm points on the world map

    Yeah, from their export security how many countries are in a state of perpetual war.
    Quote: GDP
    The article is largely anti-Russian, but much is unfortunately true ...

    In principle, yes, and cut, and industry, and financial resources. But this is as a means of getting out of the stupor, you need to force yourself to start moving at least a finger to start moving. Otherwise, we will remain dependent.
    Quote: fzr1000
    Nicholas Gvozdev-from the former compatriots or what? Maybe it's time to think about returning to their historical homeland before it's too late?

    Nafig, nafig marsh and so enough.
  13. Polovec
    Polovec 10 October 2013 16: 45
    +5
    Cool article! Especially felt in the part of Serdyukov! The author knocked out a tear! Trouble with Russia! Doesn't want to be "Upper Volta" with missiles. Doesn't want to be the escalator of the world! And he doesn't want to give up the territory! And even the people, so harmful, are ready to support the armament!
    And in terms of quality weapons I agree. But only vocational schools can fix it.
  14. ZU-23
    ZU-23 10 October 2013 16: 54
    +3
    damn already read this article somewhere, everything is going and arming with us, all that remains is to hope that we get armed faster and begin to devote money to peace processes within the country.
  15. Sorry
    Sorry 10 October 2013 17: 00
    +4
    Only with modern armed forces will the country be respected. And things will go uphill in all international negotiations. Not to produce army officials dressed in military uniforms, but to serve in the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. How many departments we have in uniform, few will say right away. They, officials, do not give authority to the country, but on the contrary, the more they are, the weaker the country. To further enhance the prestige of military service and not interfere with the police, the Ministry of Emergency Situations, bailiffs, jailers, etc. And then everything is in officer uniform, but in stripes, and there is no one to serve in the troops. It is necessary to abolish the wearing of insignia identical with MO in these departments. This will save the budget a bit, they will not consider themselves military and officers, and therefore they will simply not be able to demand that the state undertakes to officers.
    1. VADIMKRSK
      VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 13: 27
      0
      Separate the military from officials! But is it possible without executions?
  16. Migari
    Migari 10 October 2013 17: 02
    +1
    Thank God that such "crap" about Westerners go into opposition, they will put less sticks in the wheel, and the more such articles appear in the West, the more confirmation that we are on the right path. I hope that the "reformer" Serdyukov, with his detachment of ladies, will get what he deserves.
  17. SPACE
    SPACE 10 October 2013 17: 09
    +5
    advocate an increase in military spending, even if it leads to a decrease in economic growth

    A lie, an increase in military spending is an investment in the defense industry, which means in the economy plus education.
    that plans to build up military power are unlikely to be fully implemented in accordance with the stated goals.

    Russian plans are a misinformation operation. Haste is needed when catching fleas ...
    Moscow is unlikely to be able to directly challenge the United States, whose military spending far exceeds Russia's.

    It is interesting, but if on the contrary, their guts are already so thick that they can challenge Russia? They could not now, nor will they NEVER, even if in 100 times their military spending will be greater.
    1. v.lyamkin
      v.lyamkin 11 October 2013 10: 45
      +2
      I support: the article is murky - rearmament of the army with domestic weapons cannot lead to a decline in production, as large capacities in industry will be loaded.
  18. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 10 October 2013 17: 11
    +1
    I wanted to read a valid, interesting analysis of the state of the Russian military-industrial complex. Did not work out. An article from the category: what will happen if ... In order to consider such issues as the defense of the country, you need to know a lot (at least from open sources).
  19. shinobi
    shinobi 10 October 2013 17: 15
    +6
    Here I scratched something like there’s nothing to do with the old translated press of a foreign country. The picture is briefly as follows: The weapons of the Russians are primitive. The army is bad. throughout the history of Russia, any conquest ended for us not with frail lyuli with subsequent non-childish problems at home. Such is a sincere misunderstanding.
    1. USMC
      USMC 10 October 2013 23: 53
      -5
      Quote: shinobi
      Here I scratched something like there’s nothing to do with the old translated press of a foreign country. The picture is briefly as follows: The weapons of the Russians are primitive. The army is bad. throughout the history of Russia, any conquest ended for us not with frail lyuli with subsequent non-childish problems at home. Such is a sincere misunderstanding.


      you have a large territory, there is much to dry up for regrouping. plus the population is not small, with good mobilization with boots you can trample, even without weapons))))
      1. VADIMKRSK
        VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 13: 32
        +1
        Trample, do not hesitate. Do not attack only. And everything will be quiet.
  20. AndreyAB
    AndreyAB 10 October 2013 17: 18
    +5
    For some reason, in the article, the author speaks of increasing power and other miracles, he just probably forgot, like many Western "partners", that for more than 15 years Russia did nothing but disarm, its army was torn apart by the Yeltsins and Medvedevs, the Serdyukovs and other suckers of the "progressive "Western democrats, but as soon as there is an understanding that our country is a great and strong power, then an op about the build-up begins and our people are postponing it, but this is still only crumbs and it is still far enough to build up power and it makes me glad that at least only the realization that RUSSIA is a great power already frightens Western progressives who are fighting and killing around the world, and the fact that it will have to rebuild the army, so Russia has no other choice, the main thing is to remove the big friends of the West who are on salaries from "partners" from ruling the country
    1. v.lyamkin
      v.lyamkin 11 October 2013 11: 42
      +1
      The author is then a foreigner, and he was satisfied with yesterday’s pose of Russia, and even today's one is not satisfied
  21. bubla5
    bubla5 10 October 2013 18: 09
    +3
    Well, you can, if you don’t bring the matter to court, bring the furniture maker to a simple accident with a fatal outcome, and put a bone in your throat with Vasilieva, and that mood will rise, which is already 2 years old with these things.
  22. Agent 008
    Agent 008 10 October 2013 18: 17
    +1
    Of course, the army must be strengthened to repel the Basurman attack, but it happens in our country that after strengthening the "siloviki", the proverb begins to work: "beat your own people so that others are afraid" ...
  23. Sergey47
    Sergey47 10 October 2013 18: 18
    +2
    What a longing for farting! Iveka and Mistral are extolled as a miracle of technical thought. And the fact that we do not need them ..... doesn’t bother anyone. The article is disgusting, of course, but it highlights the mood of the West regarding the rearmament of the Russian Army. If this bothers them, then Putin and Shoigu are doing the right thing. And Rogozin’s energy and hatred of the West is EXTRAORDINARY.
  24. shitovmg
    shitovmg 10 October 2013 18: 54
    +1
    The main thing is that the world correctly understands what is happening with Russia! And they can’t stop it !!!!
  25. tank64rus
    tank64rus 10 October 2013 19: 13
    +4
    Article. certainly anti-Russian, but judging by the comments, our people have long learned to read as they should, and if the author would have read the comments, then he realized that he was trying in vain. Although when you read about the poor misunderstood by the evil patriots of Russia Serdyukov, there is a feeling that there, beyond the hill, they consider us clinical idiots.
  26. tank64rus
    tank64rus 10 October 2013 19: 13
    +1
    Article. certainly anti-Russian, but judging by the comments, our people have long learned to read as they should, and if the author would have read the comments, then he realized that he was trying in vain. Although when you read about the poor misunderstood by the evil patriots of Russia Serdyukov, there is a feeling that there, beyond the hill, they consider us clinical idiots.
  27. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 10 October 2013 19: 44
    +6
    The first question is whether the Russian defense industry will be able to create the tools that the new military strategy requires of it. Dmitry Gorenburg from the Center for Naval Analysis notes that the plans of the Ministry of Defense are based on overly optimistic forecasts regarding the pace of transition of Russian plants and shipyards to the release of new equipment.

    Russia has no choice.
    If our defense industry works, there will be people and tools. Professional knowledge and skills are accumulated during the production process. Optimistic forecasts are 1000 times better than pessimistic whining, even if they do not come true completely.
    If a person goes uphill, he will be closer to the top than a whiner sitting at the foot of the mountain.
  28. Santa Fe
    Santa Fe 10 October 2013 19: 48
    +3
    One of the distinguishing characteristics of the presidency of Vladimir Putin is his desire to revive and strengthen the Russian armed forces.

    lol

    The only nuclear submarine completed over the past 12 years - K-535 "Yuri Dolgoruky" (was laid down in 1996)

    For comparison, from 1991 to 1999 our Navy has replenished with FIVE new nuclear-powered ships + sixth, K-335 "Gepard", built in the 1990s, was commissioned in 2001

    Currently, the navy does not receive even 10% of what it received in the 1990s. The whole "arms race from the EdRo parity" is nothing more than a bluff and profanation

    The newest of the large surface ships of the Russian Navy - the BOD "Admiral Chabanenko", was built in the period from 1990 to 1999. I draw the attention of the stubborn supporters of GDP - a large anti-submarine ship with a full / and 9000 tons was honestly completed and surrendered to the fleet by the end of the 1990s. One can only dream of anything like this in our times.
    1. Arabist
      Arabist 10 October 2013 19: 50
      +2
      And Nevsky and Monomakh?
      1. Santa Fe
        Santa Fe 10 October 2013 20: 07
        0
        Quote: Arabist
        And Nevsky and Monomakh?

        lol
        another bluff, super-duper boats are actually rusty trash

        K-550 "Alexander Nevsky" - assembled from ready-made sections of the unfinished submarine K-333 "Lynx" (the boat was laid down in 1993, construction was stopped in the early 2000s)

        K-551 "Vladimir Monomakh" - assembled from sections of the dismantled nuclear submarine K-480 "Ak Bars" (project 971 Schuka-B)

        and then the usual story: "Nevsky" and "Monomakh" are still not accepted for service, there are serious problems with their main weapon - the Bulava SLBM. this is the "getting up from his knees" and "revival" of the Armed Forces request

        in return - mediocre disposal of super-boats of Project 941 "Shark". For comparison: the Yankees are converting their decommissioned strategic missile carriers into attack boats with Tomahawks
        1. Nitup
          Nitup 10 October 2013 20: 41
          +4
          Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
          another bluff, super-duper boats are actually rusty trash

          Firstly, almost all five nuclear submarines of Project 949, which you mentioned, were built during the Soviet Union and launched, from 1991 to 1995 they were put into operation. And in general, such a comparison is not correct, because then the defense industry complex was not collapsed and worked by inertia from the USSR. And already closer to 2000 there was a complete kayuk.
          And what about the fact that the design of the boats Nevsky and Monomakh used backlog from other boats, if these shells are suitable for the parameters? And why do you judge the revival of the army only by nuclear submarines?
          1. gunnerminer
            gunnerminer 10 October 2013 22: 02
            0
            And why do you judge the revival of the army only by nuclear submarines?





            Isn’t the nuclear submarine a shock component of the Russian Navy? By what criteria do you recommend judging the revival of the army, and by which you do not recommend judging?
          2. Santa Fe
            Santa Fe 10 October 2013 22: 25
            0
            Quote: Nitup
            Firstly, almost all five nuclear submarines of Project 949 that you mentioned were built during the Soviet Union and launched

            you just run into thinking that way (wishful thinking, as the Americans say)
            Everything was different in relativity.

            K-141 Kursk laid 22 March 1992 year... Two years later, on May 16, 1994, the boat was launched and on December 30 of the same year was accepted into the Northern Fleet. Even the United States will envy such a pace ... and this is the height of the "dashing nineties", on which EdRo usually blames all its (namely, its) failures

            K-295 Samara. 1993 bookmark Launching in 1994. Adoption of the fleet in 1995.

            K-419 Kuzbass. Bookmark 1991. Launch: 1992. Admission to the fleet in 1992.

            K-157 "Vepr". Bookmark 1990 d. Launching 1994 d. Admission to the fleet in the year 1995.

            K-150 "Tomsk": bookmark - August 1991, launching - July 1996. On March 17, 1997, the K-150 became part of the 1st Northern Fleet submarine flotilla. In 1998, the latest submarine nuclear submarine made the transition to the Far East under the ice of the Arctic Ocean. It is currently part of the Pacific Fleet.
            Quote: Nitup
            And in general, such a comparison is not correct, because then the defense industry complex was not collapsed and worked by inertia from the USSR.

            I wonder how such a strange thought could come into your head. BY INERTIA
            Is a 150 millionth country a four-wheeled cart?
            What the hell is inertia? People are not robots.

            Another thing is that there were specific plans and orders from the Navy for which money was allocated. They stole at times less. The result - the most difficult 18 thousand. ton nuclear powered ships were built in 3-4-5 years !!!
            Quote: Nitup
            And already closer to 2000 there was a complete kayuk.

            full skiff came in the mid-2000s and continues to this day. Another thing is that they began to shout loudly about patriotism and "getting up from their knees", and pass off any trifle as a cruise success (the "Grachonok" boat or a 500-ton IAC built for 7 years)
            Quote: Nitup
            And what about the fact that the design of the boats Nevsky and Monomakh used backlog from other boats, if these shells are suitable for the parameters?

            1. Then what kind of breakthrough technologies can we talk about? What are they nafig "boats of the fourth generation" if their design is a prefabricated hodgepodge of third generation boats ??
            2. Logically, it turns out that they were not built now, when "Russia is getting up from its knees", but much earlier - the same "Nevsky" - from the sections of a boat built in the 1990s
            Quote: Nitup
            And why do you judge the revival of the army only by nuclear submarines?

            you can count surface ships - surprise will be no less

            Now the RF Ministry of Defense does not receive 10% of what it received in the 1990, for which it is customary to blame all sins
            1. nycsson
              nycsson 10 October 2013 22: 35
              -2
              Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
              Now the RF Ministry of Defense does not receive 10% of what it received in the 1990, for which it is customary to blame all sins

              Totally agree with you. The title of the article is the bullshit of the mare. hi
            2. Nitup
              Nitup 10 October 2013 23: 45
              +2
              Listen, dear, I repeat to you once again, in the second half of the nineties, when money from oil and gas began to go past the budget, defense financing was stopped. After the introduction of the MET tax and the Yukos case, when it was possible to regain control of oil resources, the money went to the budget. It was possible only by 2006. So, there were simply no funds in the budget for the construction of boats from the mid-90s to 2005-2006. There would be a pension with salaries. And here Putin’s direct merit is that the money appeared. Naturally, during the time of lack of funding, the defense industry fell into decay, especially shipbuilding.
              1. Santa Fe
                Santa Fe 11 October 2013 00: 28
                0
                Quote: Nitup
                After the introduction of the MET tax and the Yukos case, when it was possible to regain control of oil resources, the money went to the budget.

                Money went to the budget when the price of a barrel of oil exceeded $ 100

                that's all the notorious "control over oil resources":

                Quote: Nitup
                So, there were simply no funds in the budget for the construction of boats from the mid-90s to 2005-2006.

                Strange, the ships were built throughout the 1990s - they were designed, built, completed, new ones were laid, for example, K-535 "Yuri Dolgoruky" (project 955 Borey) - laid November 2 1996 years in the slipway workshop No. 55 of FSUE PO Sevmash in Severodvinsk.

                In 1998 the heavy nuclear missile cruiser "Peter the Great" was delivered to the fleet - 26 thousand tons of steel structures and 4 missile systems, not counting other weapons.


                These ships were built in the 1990s. And GDP cannot solve the issue at least with the modernization of the three remaining Orlnans. Only yes - no roofing felts. And when? No one knows. By the twenty-fifth year


                In 1999 the fleet was replenished with the "Admiral Chabanenko"

                At the same time, they managed to actively work for export: in 1999-2000, they transferred to the Chinese Navy two destroyers of pr. 956 - "Hangzhou" and "Fuzhou", built a dozen "Varshavyanka" (recently exploded in India "Sindurakshak" - built in 1997)
                Quote: Nitup
                And here Putin’s direct merit is that the money appeared.

                Or maybe you should take a look at the oil price chart and stop eating unrealized illusions?
                Quote: Nitup
                Naturally, during the time of lack of funding, the defense industry fell into decay, especially shipbuilding.

                This is already the mid-2000s. The Russian military-industrial complex has reached the point of complete absurdity - in 2005 NPO Antey (the manufacturer of the beloved S-300 and S-400) lost its main assembly shop - since 2008 there is a nightclub with the longest bar in Europe

                And here, by the way, and she. Instead of S-400 missiles
                1. Nitup
                  Nitup 11 October 2013 09: 11
                  +2
                  Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                  Money went to the budget when the price of a barrel of oil exceeded $ 100

                  that's all the notorious "control over oil resources":

                  The money went when the severance tax began to operate, which Putin introduced on January 1, 2002. Prior to its introduction, a company owned by the oligarch created an offshore company somewhere in Gibraltar and sold resources to this offshore company for three kopecks, from these three kopecks and paid "honestly" taxes to the treasury of the Russian Federation. Further, this offshore company sold these resources at world prices. And all the fat remained in Gibraltar. With the introduction of severance tax, companies began to pay taxes not on the price at which they sold oil or gas for export, but on the amount actually produced. Therefore, before the introduction of the severance tax, oil and gas could cost at least $ 1000, but these days simply went past the budget and settled in foreign offshore areas. Besides, for some reason you don't take into account the inflation factor. The dollar has depreciated several times since 2000. This can be understood even by the real estate in Moscow that has risen in price several times in dollars. In fact, it was not real estate that went up, it was the dollar that depreciated. Therefore, it is not yet clear whether oil has actually risen in price, or maybe it has also fallen in price. So save these liberal noodles with charts for someone else. When the budget really allowed the start of large-scale rearmament, then this began to be done. Naturally, during the years of lack of funding, defense enterprises for the most part fell into decay and lost many specialists. Therefore, now there are problems with the release of military equipment, especially for the fleet.
                  1. Santa Fe
                    Santa Fe 11 October 2013 17: 13
                    0
                    Quote: Nitup
                    Therefore, before the introduction of mineral extraction tax, oil and gas could cost at least $ 1000, but these days they simply went past the budget and settled in foreign offshore

                    Now they settle in the Stabilization Fund in US banks)) After all, money is harmful to the Russian economy (then why does GDP attract foreign investors in the Russian Federation?)

                    By the way, the introduction of the MET tax for some reason did not affect the welfare of the Russian oligarchs (right, are they their own enemies in order to pass such laws?)

                    Roman Abramovich - purchase of Chelsea football club (2004)
                    2012 - Deripaska prepares to buy Milan

                    The world's largest private yacht "Eclipse" - the property of Abarmovich, built in Germany in 2009



                    Yacht "A" by Andrey Melnicheko. It is considered the most luxurious in the world. With gold toilets wink

                    Quote: Nitup
                    The dollar has depreciated several times since 2000.

                    how many times has the dollar depreciated since 1999?
                    what does "several" mean? one and a half, two, three, 10 times ??

                    Between 1999 and 2008, the cost of a barrel of oil increased 14 times
                    Quote: Nitup
                    When the budget really allowed to begin large-scale rearmament, then this began to be done

                    specific examples of "large-scale rearmament"?

                    The great mineral extraction tax was adopted on January 1, 2002 - as much as 12 years ago. 12 years is 1,5 times longer than the time of the EBN board. And things are still there ... on the contrary, the army does not receive 10% of what was under the EBN
                    Quote: Nitup
                    When the budget really allowed to begin large-scale rearmament, then this began to be done

                    specific examples of "large-scale" rearmament?
                    Quote: Nitup
                    Therefore, save this liberal noodle with graphics for someone else.

                    You and "illiberal" submarines with cruisers and the S-400 (Almaz-Antey) also did not like it)))

                    Lied, you, dear
                    1. Nitup
                      Nitup 11 October 2013 18: 28
                      +1
                      Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                      Now they are settling in the Stabilization Fund in US banks))

                      Yah? And from what is the budget mainly formed? Where did the money come from for the payment of salaries and pensions, for which under Yeltsin there was no money?
                      Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                      By the way, the introduction of MET tax for some reason did not affect the welfare of Russian oligarchs

                      And what did you think, the oligarchs will immediately become paupers? They get a lot of money. With the introduction of a tax, money has become much less left to the oligarchs, but still it is a lot of money.
                      Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                      how many times has the dollar depreciated since 1999?
                      what does "several" mean? one and a half, two, three, 10 times ??

                      At least 5 times.
                      Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                      specific examples of "large-scale rearmament"?

                      I did not say that it was implemented, I said that it was started. And it is necessary to judge at the end of the program.
                      Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                      And things are still there ... on the contrary, the army does not receive 10% of what was under the EBN

                      You tell that to those military men who had been sitting without a salary for months in the 90s, exercises at best, were carried out on maps. There was not even fuel to refuel aviation. Someone from them will give you a look in the face, I think, and will be right.
                      You and "illiberal" submarines with cruisers and the S-400 (Almaz-Antey) also did not like it)))

                      I like boats with S-400, and I also like two new plants for the production of S-400, S-500, etc., which are being built
                      1. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 11 October 2013 19: 07
                        -2
                        Quote: Nitup
                        And from what is the budget mainly formed?

                        Oil and Gas
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Where did the money come from for the payment of salaries and pensions, for which under Yeltsin there was no money?

                        Oil went up 10-14 times
                        Quote: Nitup
                        At least 5 times.

                        Those. To maintain the previous high damage to welfare, the wages of the US population had to increase by 5 times without exception. Like the value of all American goods.
                        But that did not happen.

                        The cost of building a Berk-class destroyer - 1,5 billion in 2000, 1,8 billion in our time.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        And what did you think, the oligarchs will immediately become paupers?

                        Not! They became much richer than in the 1990s, when there was no MET tax)))
                        And they became much more!
                        In 2010, the number of "dollar" billionaires in Russia has doubled - from 32 to 62 people.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        I did not say that it was implemented, I said that it was started.

                        And I said that he was not there.

                        Do you have specific facts that the army and navy now began to receive more equipment than they did, for example, in 2002 or 2005?
                        From what year did the "large-scale rearmament" begin and what does it consist of in specific figures (an increase in the number of ships, aircraft, etc. adopted for service in comparison with previous years)?
                        Quote: Nitup
                        exercises, at best, were conducted on maps. There wasn’t even fuel to refuel aviation

                        I don’t know how it was with aviation that year, but the new, 1995, K-410 "Smolensk" celebrated in the Sargasso Sea (off the coast of Cuba, otherwise you don’t know geography)
                        And in 1998 they received the prize of the commander-in-chief for firing anti-ship missiles granite from underwater

                        By the way, in the same year, from Vedyaevo (1st submarine flotilla) the nuclear-powered ship "Tomsk" was turned over under the ice of the Arctic to Krashenninikov Bay in Kamchatka

                        In the 1990s, they went to the sea 3 times more often than today.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        You tell this to those military men who in the 90s sat without a salary for months

                        Here’s such a trick - Kremlin crooks took into account the mistakes of 1917: if you save on military personnel, the army will make a military coup

                        Although, I’ll tell you honestly, they never sat in Vidyaevo without salaries.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Someone from them will give you a look in the face, I think, and will be right.

                        The K-410 crew will break your legs for everything that you wrote in the previous comment
                      2. Nitup
                        Nitup 11 October 2013 21: 22
                        0
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Oil and Gas

                        Yes, Christmas trees, sticks, and what about the mineral extraction tax there was no money from oil and gas?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Oil went up 10-14 times

                        In reality, she doubled the price of a maxim.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Those. To maintain the previous high damage to welfare, the wages of the US population had to increase by 5 times without exception. Like the value of all American goods.
                        But that did not happen.

                        This is external inflation, as the United States is transferring its inflation to other countries. Inside the US, inflation is low.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Not! They became much richer than in the 1990s, when there was no MET tax)))
                        And they became much more!

                        Anyone will become richer if time goes on and enterprises bring huge profits.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Do you have specific facts that the army and navy now began to receive more equipment than they did, for example, in 2002 or 2005?

                        For example, in 2012, the Air Force received about 160 new aircraft and helicopters in 2012 alone. In 400, the S-12 regiment and 1 Panzir-C2000 complexes entered the air defense forces. And how many planes and helicopters arrived in the early 90s and in the second half of the XNUMXs, for example?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Here’s such a trick - Kremlin crooks took into account the mistakes of 1917: if you save on military personnel, the army will make a military coup

                        First, we never had a military coup in history. Secondly, why didn’t the coup happen in the 90s?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        The K-410 crew will break your legs for everything that you wrote in the previous comment

                        I do not think so, for I have fairly accurately described the situation.
                      3. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 12 October 2013 01: 38
                        0
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Yes, Christmas trees, sticks, and what about the mineral extraction tax there was no money from oil and gas?

                        Not. After all, oil was 10 times cheaper
                        Quote: Nitup
                        This is external inflation since the United States transfer their inflation to other countries.

                        What is this strange process?

                        You can come to Greece (EU). Change rubles for $ 15 or € 10 and have lunch in a restaurant - what now, what 10 years ago. The standard of living is the same, prices have not radically increased (maybe the difference is 20-30% due to natural inflation)
                        Quote: Nitup
                        For example, in 2012, the Air Force received about 160 new aircraft and helicopters in XNUMX alone.

                        This exceeds the pace of deliveries of aircraft to the US Air Force and is contrary to common sense. What specific vehicles were delivered to the Air Force in 2012?
                        - 2 Su-30SM
                        - 8 Su-35S
                        - 10 SU-34
                        - 15 Yak-130 (training, specialists say it even lacks a radar)

                        In total, in 2012, 20 combat and 15 training aircraft were built for the Russian Air Force and 2 experimental fighters (Mig-29KUB and T-50-4).
                        Taking into account the administrative Tu-154M, An-140 and L-410UVP-E20 (produced by the Czech Republic), the Russian Air Force received 40 new aircraft and one more aircraft was received by the Naval Aviation. Also, the Navy and the Air Force received 1 new aircraft

                        as a result, they didn’t even score a hundred, of which almost half were combat, the rest are administrative (to roll over the bosses) or training
                        Quote: Nitup
                        in 2012, the S-400 regiment and 12 Pantsir-C1 complexes entered

                        The plan of the land plot with the designation of real estate objects belonging to OJSC "CDB" Almaz ", at the address: Moscow, Leningradsky prospect, 80 as of 2000:


                        as of 2012:
                      4. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 12 October 2013 01: 45
                        0
                        Quote: Nitup
                        First, we never had a military coup in history.

                        Do not know the story

                        The uprising on the battleship Potemkin, the cruiser Ochakov, the legendary shot of the Aurora. In 1905 and 1917, the army and navy were not only unable to defend the regime, but for the most part joined the rebels (the same General Karbyshev)

                        Now this will not work - Kremlin flies have become smarter and feed the military and the Ministry of Internal Affairs
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Secondly, why didn’t the coup happen in the 90s?

                        there was no combat capability nor incentive
                      5. Nitup
                        Nitup 12 October 2013 22: 25
                        +1
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Not. After all, oil was 10 times cheaper

                        Firstly, in reality oil was twice as cheap as possible. Secondly, why, if the state did not have money, did the oligarchs have it? Maybe this is a system of communicating vessels?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        What is this strange process?

                        This process consists in the fact that most countries of the world, including China and the Russian Federation, change their resources to empty, unsecured dollars. What are the USA doing? The United States prints these dollars. This does not apply to the EU because it has its own global reserve currency, the Euro. We entered this system just in your beloved nineties. Naturally there will be inflation when they receive empty pieces of paper, and real mater go there in return. good.
                        But once again I say, even if there was no inflation and oil actually went up 10 times, money would settle in offshore, and not in the budget. For some reason, Yeltsin did not think of introducing the mineral extraction tax, he was probably busy - he earned money, jumped out of his head.
                        This exceeds the rate of supply of aircraft to the US Air Force and is contrary to common sense
                        Shouldn't it exceed? And what kind of "common" sense does this contradict?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        as a result, they didn’t even score a hundred, of which almost half were combat, the rest are administrative (to roll over the bosses) or training

                        -2 Su-30SM
                        -8 Su-35S
                        -10 Su-34
                        -15 Yak-130 (combat training)
                        -18 Mi-28N
                        -21 Ka-52
                        -16 Mi-35M
                        Total: 90 combat and training combat aircraft only. The rest are military transport, reconnaissance, etc.
                        Land plot plan with designation of real estate objects belonging to Almaz Central Design Bureau

                        And what does this your plan have to do with the subject of discussion? You look at the new production capacities of Almaz-Antey: at the Obukhov plant in St. Petersburg, two plants under construction - one in N. Novgorod, the other in Kirov.
                        the same general Karbyshev)

                        General Karbyshev never rebelled against power. General Kornilov was accused of rebellion, although Kerensky himself sent him to clean up, and then stated that Kornilov rebelled, although he did not
                        there was no combat capability

                        So you admit that with the state of the army in the 90s it was much worse than now?
                        no incentive

                        Well, how, following your logic, the army is not combat-ready: there is no funding, fuel, no exercises, etc., just a good incentive to remove thieves and crooks who are ruining the army.
                      6. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 13 October 2013 02: 23
                        -1
                        Quote: Nitup
                        in reality, oil was two times cheaper.

                        you just like to think so
                        Quote: Nitup
                        This process is

                        On what specific examples can you feel that in the period 2000-2010 dollar depreciated 5 times (according to your own words)

                        The oligarch had $ 100 million. In 2000, he could order 10 yachts at the Blohm & Voss shipyard. Based on your logic, at present he will be able to buy only 2 yachts in Germany (China? Japan?) the dollar depreciated 5 times and the yacht began to cost 50 million. But this is contrary to reality.

                        ps / rise in property prices in Rublevka and Dubai is not an example - these are the personal problems of Moscow realtors and developers
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Secondly, why, if the state did not have money, did the oligarchs have it?

                        The oligarchs had less money, and the oligarchs themselves had less - because oil was worth 10 times cheaper

                        Now the residents of the Russian Federation are throwing scraps from the royal table in the form of beggarly pensions and salaries. For obramovichey became 10 times richer. And the number of Obramovichs increased several times.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        But should not exceed?

                        The US military budget is equal to the military budgets of all countries of the world combined.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        -15 Yak-130 (combat training)

                        Do you fly into battle on it? Without radar and even without a weather radar.
                        In the form of a light attack aircraft, it also will not work - there is no armored protection of the cabin and important units
                        Quote: Nitup
                        -18 Mi-28N

                        15.
                        Stop posting plans and "news in the future tense". Feel free to write real numbers
                        Quote: Nitup
                        -21 Ka-52

                        WHERE FROM ???
                        in fact did not pass no oneproduced in 2012

                        At the beginning of the year, a batch of 4 helicopters received a new gray color and tail numbers 96, 97, 98 and 99 “yellow” arrived at the Pulp and Paper Mill in Torzhok. Presumably, these machines were manufactured back in 2011 and transferred to the Air Force in December. During the year, several new Ka-52 helicopters were made and flown in Arseniev, but their final assembly at Rostvertol and the transfer of the Air Force will take place in 2013.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        -16 Mi-35M

                        10 were made, until the end of 2012 they managed to put 8
                      7. Nitup
                        Nitup 14 October 2013 18: 44
                        +1
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        you just like to think so

                        Yes, because I have every reason to think so.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        On what specific examples can you feel that in the period 2000-2010 the dollar depreciated 5 times (in your own words)

                        Yes, take at least the price of sugar in the world market. Now it costs more than 400 dollars per ton, and in 2000 - less than 100.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Now the residents of the Russian Federation are throwing scraps from the royal table in the form of beggarly pensions and salaries. For obramovichey became 10 times richer. And the number of Obramovichs increased several times.

                        Yes, salaries are low and pensions too. But Putin’s merit is that they generally exist and pay them on time. Let people also not take off responsibility for the situation of the country. No authority could behave this way if people figured out the reasons and began to act.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        The US military budget is equal to the military budgets of all countries of the world combined.

                        Yes, but we do not spend, like the Americans, so much money on the maintenance of more than 700 military bases around the world. We do not conduct military conflicts in several parts of the world at the same time. America is a world empire, if you still do not know, naturally they need to spend huge amounts of tribute that they take from all over the world and Russia, including to spend on maintaining the current world order and their dominance.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Do you fly into battle on it? Without radar and even without a weather radar.

                        I do not know what is there and what is not, due to the fact that this is classified information. I am sure that this also cannot be known to you.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        WHERE FROM ???
                        in fact did not pass a single produced in 2012

                        Yes, I mixed up. It is produced in 2012 21 Ka-52. Transferred to the Air Force - 4 units. According to Mi-28: produced - 18 transmitted - 15.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        10 were made, until the end of 2012 they managed to put 8

                        And even if so, it is still 27 helicopters in 2012, about which you, for some reason, "modestly" kept silent.
                      8. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 14 October 2013 20: 16
                        -1
                        Quote: Nitup
                        sugar prices in the world market. Now it costs more than 400 dollars per ton, and in 2000 - less than 100.

                        1. this is a specific example that has a distant relation to the dollar - everything determines the yield of cane and beet plantations
                        for the remaining groups of goods - food, machinery, IT, etc. - no 5-fold fluctuations in value are observed.

                        2. Once again, I have reason to doubt the veracity of your words

                        Quote: Nitup
                        But Putin’s merit is that they generally exist and pay them on time.

                        This is due to the high price of oil.

                        barely oil fell in price (2008) - the "well-fed zero" is over. None of the MET and Stabilization Funds helped - the ruble instantly depreciated against US $ from 23 to 32 rubles (marked minimum - 36 rubles / 1 $, February 2009)
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Yes, but we do not spend, like the Americans, so much money on the maintenance of more than 700 military bases around the world

                        The lion's share of the Pentagon’s budget is spent on the purchase of military equipment - and, lo and behold, these funds reach the final rezolatat.

                        In 2013, I saw:
                        - cabin of the destroyer under construction "Zamvolt" (14 thousand tons / s)
                        - launched nuclear submarine "Minnesota"
                        - accepted into the fleet corvette / LCS "Coronado"

                        About the same thing happens in aviation - a dozen F-22 squadrons, the number of F-35s built has exceeded one hundred, a bunch of drones, etc. etc. - all this was purchased in just 10 years

                        It must be understood that the Yankees spend enormous amounts of money on these goals, and it is simply unrealistic to exceed these rates with our SDO and the defense industry.
                        Quote: Nitup
                        this is classified information. I am sure that this also cannot be known to you.

                        The lack of armor, radar, sighting system and meteorological radar on the Yak-130 is open information, no one has ever hidden it. Moreover, this is an international project (Italian Aermacchi). This is a purely training aircraft with an "empty" fuselage - that is why they are built so quickly, in contrast to the sophisticated and electronics-rich combat Su-35
                        Quote: Nitup
                        it is all the same 27 helicopters in 2012, about which you, for some reason, "modestly" kept silent.

                        When?
                        my quote from the top comment
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Taking into account the administrative Tu-154M, An-140 and L-410UVP-E20 (produced by the Czech Republic), the Russian Air Force received 40 new aircraft and another naval aircraft received the Navy. Also, the Navy and the Air Force received 59 new aircraft

                        In general, the situation is predictable: out of "160 aircraft and helicopters" 100 were built, of which 20 were actually combat aircraft of the "first line" - fighters and bombers of all types, the rest were administrative, training and 50 turntables

                        Where is the "large-scale rearmament" ??

                        Assembly line "Raptors". That is why 180 new generation fighters were built in 10 years.
                      9. Nitup
                        Nitup 14 October 2013 23: 24
                        +1
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Once again, I have reason to doubt the veracity of your words

                        Mutually. Your problems. I gave you examples, the yield has not decreased so much that prices have jumped more than 4 times.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        This is due to the high price of oil.

                        This is the merit of Putin.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        barely oil fell in price (2008) - "well-fed zeros" are over

                        What is over? People stopped paying salaries and pensions, as they did not pay before Putin? If it weren’t for MET, there would be no funds from the sale of resources.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        In 2013, I saw:

                        Did I say that they’re not building anything?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        About the same thing happens in aviation - a dozen F-22 squadrons, the number of F-35s built has exceeded one hundred, a bunch of drones, etc. etc. - all this was purchased in just 10 years

                        First, the number of F-35s built is 72. Secondly, what do we compare who built how many in 10 years. Do you really want that after the collapse and plunder of the country that occurred in the 90s, we compete with America, which receives a tribute, and not only money, but also scientists from all over the world?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Moreover, this is an international project (Italian Aermacca)

                        The Italians left this project 20 years ago, apparently having received the necessary technology, and built a copy of the Yak-130 so this is not an international project.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        When?

                        Are these your words?
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        as a result, they didn’t even score a hundred, of which fighting - hardly half

                        And now let's count 35 planes + 27 helicopters = 62 combat aircraft.
                        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
                        Where is the "large-scale rearmament" ??

                        Is it more than in 2002 or 2005? And then, what, did I say that a large-scale rearmament has already taken place? I said that it began. supply rates will gradually increase. For example, the Su-14 supply plan for this year, scheduled for this year, will be exactly fulfilled, just like the Su-34M30 and Su-2. so, chickens in the fall count. The implementation of the program can be judged by its completion.
                      10. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 15 October 2013 02: 53
                        0
                        Quote: Nitup
                        yields did not decrease so much that prices jumped more than 4 times.

                        Sugar prices did NOT rise 4 times.
                        As with all other product groups

                        Fluctuations caused by productivity, rising fuel prices, demand and market conditions, natural inflation

                        Try to finally give a real example where the dollar depreciated over 10 years by 5 times.
                        Otherwise, your statement on the 5-fold devaluation of the dollar - to the cat under hvrst - is not confirmed by anything
                        Quote: Nitup
                        What is over? People stopped paying salaries and pensions

                        Are you ready to deny that thousands of enterprises stopped in the winter of 2008-2009? - A quarter of the country switched to a 2-3 day work week. The already fictitious growth of the country's GDP stopped, and queues lined up for exchangers.

                        Poverty pensions and budgetary salaries are paid out of hydrocarbon export revenues. After all, although the price of oil has decreased, but still was many times higher than in the 90s.

                        Although the Ministry of Finance officially recognized that oil would fall below $ 30-40 per barrel (I don’t remember the exact deadline right now), the 1998 bankruptcy will recur. No mineral extraction tax will save
                      11. Santa Fe
                        Santa Fe 15 October 2013 02: 54
                        0
                        Quote: Nitup
                        First, the number of F-35s built is 72.

                        More. will we argue? wink
                        in just 7 years of production! Moreover, the Yankees do not have the audacity to declare "large-scale rearmament". What is the name of the situation with the F-35? That's right! -Small-batch assembly
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Do you really want that after the collapse and plunder of the country that occurred in the 90s, we compete with America,

                        This is what you wanted
                        Quote: Nitup
                        <This exceeds the rate of deliveries of aircraft to the US Air Force and is contrary to common sense>But should not exceed?

                        Quote: Nitup
                        And now let's count 35 planes + 27 helicopters = 62 combat aircraft.

                        Stop equating the 10-ton unarmed Yak-130 to the 35-ton combat monsters Su-30/34/35.

                        The indicator is "first line" combat vehicles. It is they who set the trend in the aircraft industry. And only 20 such machines were delivered.Everything else is a trifle, a registry.

                        The same applies to helicopters - any Ka-52 is 3 times easier and cheaper than a supersonic generation 4+ fighter. While all types of turntables were installed 59 (from combat Alligators to training Ka-226).

                        Just a great result, especially considering how much money is poured into the military-industrial complex and how much they say
                        Quote: Nitup
                        Is this more than in 2002 or 2005?

                        In 2008-2009, the Russian Air Force was replenished with 28 MiG-29SMT fighters - originally built for the Algerian Air Force, but the contract was terminated

                        Well, about the 1990s, I’m not even talking about it - there, the supply of equipment conceived was exceeding today's pace, for example, the Navy received 20 decked Su-33s. built the family of the Su-27 and Mig-29

                        Navy - even nothing to compare

                        Great campaign of the ships of the Northern Fleet in the Atlantic and the Mediterranean Sea, 1996
  • saturn.mmm
    saturn.mmm 10 October 2013 21: 20
    +2
    Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
    K-551 "Vladimir Monomakh" - assembled from sections of the dismantled nuclear submarine K-480 "Ak Bars" (project 971 Schuka-B)

    Still, there are rumors that the flywheel at Sevmash has spun.
    And for the "Sharks" it's a shame, they were unique submarines.

    While free burn
    While hearts for honor are alive,
    My friend, dedicate to the fatherland
    Souls are wonderful impulses!
    Comrade, believe: she will rise,
    Captivating Star of Happiness,
    Russia will wake up from a dream,
    And on the ruins of autocracy
    Write our names!
  • Arabist
    Arabist 10 October 2013 19: 50
    0
    And Nevsky and Monomakh?
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 10 October 2013 20: 06
    +3
    The title of the article, I would alter the following way: "RUSSIAN (RUSSIAN) SELF-CONSCIOUSNESS IS REVIVED!) The army and people of Russia have always been and will always be like this! Otherwise, Russia cannot exist simply ..! Therefore, we are not defeated ..
  • DmitryMSK
    DmitryMSK 10 October 2013 20: 24
    +3
    Apparently, ****** s and gay men did not expect that our army would be reborn after the devastation and decline of the 90s. That’s chattered with fear lol
  • Boris63
    Boris63 10 October 2013 20: 42
    +3
    Westerners squeak such articles only to say to their own: the "monster" rises and arms, let's get more dough to "protect democracy."
  • Mark III
    Mark III 10 October 2013 20: 45
    +2
    A series of failures with missile launches (in particular, the Bulava missile launched from submarines), non-compliance with the schedule for the construction of new ships (or, say, the conversion of the Admiral Nakhimov / Vikramaditya aircraft carrier to transfer to the Indian Navy), as well as quality problems vehicles - all this raises questions about the reliability of Russian-made military products.
    And is that all that we managed to dig? Not a lot though.
  • samoletil18
    samoletil18 10 October 2013 20: 56
    +2
    He set his + for the fact that if they write this on the other side, then there is a catch. Not a damn thing is being done yet. In addition to turning divisions into brigades. Shopping Mistral, Israeli UAV. Even in the civilian aircraft industry they drive the SSJ-100 with our engines. Author! THANK! We have shit so far, but wait for us. Now I will go to the polls myself and I will force everyone. Fears in the US will become real.
  • samoletil18
    samoletil18 10 October 2013 20: 57
    +2
    He set his + for the fact that if they write this on the other side, then there is a catch. Not a damn thing is being done yet. In addition to turning divisions into brigades. Shopping Mistral, Israeli UAV. Even in the civilian aircraft industry they drive the SSJ-100 with our engines. Author! THANK! We have shit so far, but wait for us. Now I will go to the polls myself and I will force everyone. Fears in the US will become real.
    1. VADIMKRSK
      VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 13: 59
      0
      Turning divisions into brigades — in the east and in Siberia without roads and supplies — is criminal! Team - for solving clear problems for a limited time.
  • APASUS
    APASUS 10 October 2013 21: 23
    +1
    Thank you for the fact that I began to restore the Army.
    If only he had punched such money into the production sphere - there would have been a clever girl!
    1. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 10 October 2013 22: 05
      0
      If only he had punched such money into the production sphere - there would have been a clever girl!




      In your opinion, restoring the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, without updating the equipment of ship repair and shipbuilding enterprises, other enterprises of the military-industrial complex, can success be achieved in strengthening the combat readiness of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation?
    2. Santa Fe
      Santa Fe 10 October 2013 22: 34
      0
      Quote: APASUS
      Thank you for the fact that I began to restore the Army.

      specific examples of "recovery"?
    3. nycsson
      nycsson 10 October 2013 22: 43
      -1
      Quote: APASUS
      Thank you for the fact that I began to restore the Army.

      Ruined, and now restores. Thanks for the collapse do not want to say?
      Quote: gunnerminer
      If only he had punched such money into the production sphere - there would have been a clever girl!

      What is the use of this money when there are no production capacities and specialists ?! Therefore, they revised the SDO.
      1. Nitup
        Nitup 10 October 2013 23: 47
        0
        Quote: nycsson
        Ruined, and now restores.

        Ah, it turns out Putin has collapsed. Do you have any conscience at all, do you make such statements?
  • royk
    royk 10 October 2013 22: 25
    +1
    Why are military budgets compared without comparing prices and technology? Our technologies are cheaper, and there will be a big discussion on technical issues.
    1. Santa Fe
      Santa Fe 10 October 2013 22: 34
      +1
      Quote: royk
      Why are military budgets compared without comparing prices and technology?

      It is difficult to compare according to specifically constructed and adopted for service models of technology, the level of training l / s (number of exercises) and other objective parameters.

      And the truth will immediately appear. Not the same as in the article
      1. nycsson
        nycsson 10 October 2013 22: 39
        0
        Quote: SWEET_SIXTEEN
        And the truth will immediately appear. Not the same as in the article

        If our people knew how to analyze, then we would not have what we have. Well, this is not surprising, in Russia they drink 15 liters of pure alcohol per capita! How to analyze? hi
        1. Nitup
          Nitup 10 October 2013 23: 48
          +2
          Quote: nycsson
          If our people knew how to analyze, then we would not have what we have. Well, this is not surprising, in Russia they drink 15 liters of pure alcohol per capita! How to analyze?

          Judging by your analytical calculations, you drink all 30
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 10 October 2013 22: 55
    0
    Russia is simply trying to defend itself (the Soviet Union did the same, given that the retaliatory strike will be all-destructive. And inevitable) now all this is in question and the Anglo-Saxons are banging their teeth (but they are still afraid .. they have not destroyed everything in the 90s ..) .. And there is in stashes that the satellites are not visible .. heh heh
  • alex.limoff
    alex.limoff 10 October 2013 23: 07
    +1
    In September 1812, at a military council in Fili, where it was decided to give or not to give a battle at the walls of Moscow, Field Marshal Kutuzov said: "With the loss of Moscow, Russia will not be lost, but we will lose the Army, then we will lose both Moscow and Russia." 70 years later, the Russian autocrat Alexander III said: "Russia has only two loyal allies - the Army and the Navy." I agree that the Army does not produce useful things necessary both for the development of the economy and in everyday life. But our more than a thousand-year history, and even the present, show us that we cannot remain without a modern and well-equipped Army. The army is the guarantor of our safe existence and development.
    1. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 10 October 2013 23: 10
      0
      Quote: alex.limoff
      In September 1812, at a military council in Fili, where it was decided to give or not to give a battle at the walls of Moscow, Field Marshal Kutuzov said: "With the loss of Moscow, Russia will not be lost, but we will lose the Army, then we will lose both Moscow and Russia." 70 years later, the Russian autocrat Alexander III said: "Russia has only two loyal allies - the Army and the Navy." I agree that the Army does not produce useful things necessary both for the development of the economy and in everyday life. But our more than a thousand-year history, and even the present, show us that we cannot remain without a modern and well-equipped Army. The army is the guarantor of our safe existence and development.



      It’s precisely this idea that the leaders of the state and the Ministers of Defense repeat in every way and options. About 30 years ago! In the last 5 years, only about this has been heard at all speeches, rallies, and meetings.
  • voliador
    voliador 10 October 2013 23: 30
    +1
    Want peace, get ready for war. And we must be ready for it - this is modern reality. Therefore, it is necessary to rearm!
  • SAG
    SAG 11 October 2013 00: 00
    0
    I’ll honestly write - I did not like the article, the author did not say anything new. I arranged some chamomile here I remember, I don’t remember here ... I can - can not, it will work - it will not work ... I myself can return a bunch of questions for the sake of general stars, and even more soldier
    IMHO
  • kmike
    kmike 11 October 2013 01: 21
    +1
    I read and thought when they would begin to praise Serdyukov, I read that he turned out to be a patriot. The article is purely in the American style. ALL THAT IN RUSSIA IS BAD BY AMERICAN CONCEPTS, MEAN WE DO IT CORRECTLY. And we know without our Americans.
  • CAMS
    CAMS 11 October 2013 01: 52
    +2
    interesting wording- WILL PUTIN CAN? CAN KB? CAN INDUSTRY? but they are silent that we are at the beginning of the road and will increase momentum. I live in a city where they make SU and submarines and I answer that specialists and equipment are already set in the quantity standards
  • Tatarus
    Tatarus 11 October 2013 04: 09
    0
    Dmitry Gorenburg from the Center for Naval Analysis

    Not Ivanov, however. That spoils his mouth against Russia. When will the indigenous nations be in the authorities and analysts? I believe that priority should be given to representatives of peoples who have a historical homeland within the borders of the Russian Federation. Gorenburg ... City of grief or what?
  • KOH
    KOH 11 October 2013 05: 27
    0
    Quote: GDP
    The article is largely anti-Russian, but much is unfortunately true ...
    An attempt was made to record Serdyukov as a disgraced, but progressive reformer. A thief is a thief. In this case, there is also a nearby thief, they wouldn’t have caught a smart one ...
    Thank God that reformatting our army according to NATO standards has not reached its climax.
    He will only support the competitors of our own arms manufacturers, striking at our own production and making us dependent on potential adversaries.
    The means of producing weapons are also important, as are the weapons themselves, if not more important.


    Pisaka tries to soar us that Serdyukov wanted to buy new technologies (Iveco there, Jewish drones, etc.) and they didn’t give him (damn reformer), such as stupid, but he is sure that during the hostilities they won’t suddenly fall and stall, after when some uncle from NATO starts to press buttons ...
  • Koronik
    Koronik 11 October 2013 05: 31
    +1
    Well, stir, cry maybe can not? CAN and accomplish all that is planned do not hesitate. And for the safety and revival of the Army, we will say thanks to Ivanov and Shoig. Here are the Chinese in this regard, well done, silently doing their job. There were no such words before I was late, especially stolen. So the first thing is order in everything in the Army and VK, which the current Minister of Defense Shoigu and Mr. Ragozin will surely achieve.
  • Lukich
    Lukich 11 October 2013 08: 41
    0
    All the leading software companies ask hackers to check the reliability of the protection system of their programs and pay a lot of money for it.
    So, in order to test the country's defense system against threats of any nature, it is necessary to create a special research institute, to test the strength of the project's system - "Great Russia".
    Otherwise, it will work as with the Soviet Union - a lot of tanks and missiles in "Colossus with feet of clay". The wall turned out to be rotten - they poked a finger, and it crumbled!
    ... and new tanks are good ...
    1. VADIMKRSK
      VADIMKRSK 11 October 2013 14: 08
      0
      Who poked a finger? Poked from the inside. Chupa-chups sniffing and offshore with open spaces with impunity.
  • kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 11 October 2013 09: 20
    +1
    Yes, the Russian program for the revival of the country's defense power was hurt! And it seems that the article is positive, but actually from the category of those who are doing everything to undermine people's confidence in Putin's plans in the military field. What time for the Yankees gentlemen to change diapers? Yes, we hard, but you forgot about the historical experience of Russia with honor to get out of any difficult situations! Glory to Russia!
  • lotar
    lotar 11 October 2013 10: 25
    +1
    For the second time I see the phrase:Moreover, the Russian military-industrial complex is far from achieving the “zero defect” standard in the production of military equipment and weapons.
    My question immediately arises: who, in principle, meets the standards of zero marriage? There is not a single country that meets this criterion. The same Americans spend billions on new missile defense, and the fact that not launching always reveals some new problem. Any new technique that has just been created by its own logic cannot but have flaws, and for this it undergoes all kinds of tests, which can last from several years to decades before it enters the armed forces.
  • Basarev
    Basarev 11 October 2013 11: 28
    0
    And yet the NATO could not stop us
  • Altona
    Altona 12 October 2013 17: 12
    +1
    Army Advertising:
    During the First World War, among the dead, there were 90% of the military and 10% of civilians. During World War II, 50% of the military and 50% of civilians died. The 90th century ended with the bombing of Yugoslavia, during which 10% of civilians and 50% of military personnel died. The new millennium opened with war in Iraq. There are no exact statistics on the victims, but they are more or less agreeing that the ratio of dead civilians to dead military is 1 to XNUMX.
    Military service is your chance to survive in the upcoming war!
    -----------------------
    This is so ... For information ...