Military Review

“This picture insults the patriotic feelings of the Russian people”

235
You can not name the picture historicalsince this moment ... purely fantastic.
Konstantin Pobedonostsev


A number of historians and public figures asked to remove the painting of the Russian artist Ilya Repin, written in 1883 — 1885. - "Ivan the Terrible and his son Ivan," in the store. The appeal was sent to the Minister of Culture of Russia V. Medinsky and Director of the State Tretyakov Gallery I. Lebedeva.

According to the chairman of the organizing committee of the Popular Movement “Holy Russia” V. Boyko-Veliky, historian, professor of St. Petersburg University I.Froyanov, Repin’s painting, like a number of other paintings, contains slander against the Russian people, the Russian state and the Russian tsars. The great collection of the Tretyakov Gallery is intended to bring the light of enlightenment and creativity to the Russian people, and such works have no place in this collection of masterpieces. The picture reflects one of the “black myths” in relation to the great Russian tsar - Ivan the Terrible. Modern historical science has no evidence of the murder of Tsarevich Ivan Ivanovich by his father. Reliable information about this in the 16 century sources is missing. On the contrary, primary sources report the illness and death of the prince. Versions about the murder appeared later, as a rumor - with the prefix "Netsyi verb" (some say). This version was based on a very weak foundation - on the notes of obvious enemies of the Russian state, the foreign envoys of Jerome Gorsei and the papal nuncio Antonio Possevino.

The surviving originals of the materials of the Ambassadorial Order of that period, the case of the arrival of the Roman envoy Antonio Possevino, which included the Tsar's correspondence, allowed Academician N.S. Likhachev, who made these materials public in 1903, to conclude that Tsarevich Ivan died in Alexandrov Sloboda after an eleven-day illness, which seemed originally not dangerous. The reasons for this illness became clear in the 1963 year, when the tombs of Tsar Ivan Vasilyevich the Terrible and Tsarevich Ivan Ivanovich in the Archangel Cathedral opened. Scientific studies, medico-chemical and medical-forensic examinations showed that there is a presence of mercury in the remains of the prince, 32 times the norm of permissible content. An increased amount of arsenic and lead was also found. This is irrefutable evidence that the prince died as a result of poisoning with salts of mercury, arsenic and lead. In addition, the examination found no blood content in the prince's hair.

In the nineteenth century and in the beginning of the twentieth century. serious researchers and more prominent statesmen were doubtful about the version of the murder of his son by the king. Many considered the picture to be non-historical, including V. Stasov. A historian, academician S. F. Platonov, wrote about the slander of the tsar. In the modern period, Metropolitan of St. Petersburg and Ladoga John Snychev, I. Froyanov, A. Bokhanov, V. Shambarov and others opposed this slander. They argued that the "black myth" was created during the information war that was waged in the West against Russia. During the reign of Ivan the Terrible, the Russian kingdom fought hard for access to the Baltic Sea. In Europe, they then composed a whole series of various myths, “anecdotes” about Russia and the Russian tsar. Ivan Vasilyevich tried to turn into a real "beast in human form", "tyrant", "bloodsucker", "girl mate" and so on. Repin's picture became an echo of this slanderous campaign of the enemies of Russia. The myth was reflected in the picture and became very popular. Currently, the majority of Russian citizens are convinced that Ivan IV killed his son. Such is the power of the image created by a talented artist.

Patriotic historians and public figures believe that Repin "imbued with revolutionary theomachistic ideas," disregarded Orthodox traditions, and his picture was directed against the Russian autocracy, that is, against the Russian state. The picture, both in the past and at present, “has a profound psychological and emotional impact on the viewer, creating the effect of false“ psychological certainty ”, literally capturing in the memory of thousands and thousands of visitors to the Tretyakov Gallery. Especially dangerous is the impact on children who do not have a critical world view.

Tatyana Karpova, deputy director of the Tretyakov Gallery for Research, said that the artist painted the picture, relying on the work of the famous historian N. M. Karamzin, and the canvas is more likely not on a historical theme, but psychological, about the murder of a son by his father. In addition, if you remove the picture of Repin for unreliability, then what to do with the other picture on the mythological, biblical, fabulous themes. According to the director of the Tretyakov Gallery, Irina Lebedeva, this is a superficial view of our culture. If you follow the course of thought of the authors of the letter, you will also have to ban many movies that do not correspond to historical authenticity, etc. In addition, the artist has the right to his creative vision of the event. Lebedeva, in an interview with the journalists of the radio station Ekho Moskvy, said that the situation had arisen with the personal public relations of specific people.

Culture Minister Vladimir Medinsky called the statement by patriotic historians and public figures “a joke.” According to him, he refers to such statements ironically and expressed the hope that the authors were joking. The Minister also noted that it is necessary to distinguish historical facts from fiction, "there is art, but there is history."

“This picture insults the patriotic feelings of the Russian people”


From the history of the painting

The artist, in an interview with the correspondent of the newspaper "Russian Word" reported that the thought of the picture originated after being impressed by the symphonic work of N. A. Rimsky-Korsakov "Revenge". Repin described it as follows: “These sounds captured me, and I wondered if it was impossible to embody the mood that I created under the influence of this music in painting. I remembered King Ivan. ” In addition, he was affected by the death of Emperor Alexander II: "Some kind of bloody streak went through this year, my feelings were overwhelmed by the horrors of modernity, ... I worked spellbound."

The artist began working on this painting in Moscow, where a costume was made for Ivan the Terrible and his son. The throne, mirror, caftan of Tsar Ivan were painted by Repin from life in Armory ward; the artist found a chest in the Rumyantsev Museum. In 1882, a pencil sketch was ready. But in Moscow, the artist could not finish the work, he moved to the capital. However, during his visits to Moscow, Repin continued to work. So in the fall of 1884 he came to the old Russian capital, stayed here for more than a month, studying and sketching various historical objects for this picture in the Kremlin Armory. The picture was completed in St. Petersburg. The tsar wrote some old man found for him by the artist P.P. Chistyakov, from the artisan, whom he met on the street, from the composer P.I. Blaramberg, and from the artist G.G. Myasoedov. The image of the prince was written by writer V.M. Garshin. In him, the artist was attracted by a certain stamp of doom on his face (the writer really died soon after that). The painting was exhibited in March 1885 at the XIII Traveling Exhibition in Moscow. The picture turned out great both in mastery of performance and in power, in the strength of the psychological disclosure of the characters of people and the impact on them.

This power was also appreciated by its critics. The chief procurator of the Synod of Pobedonostsev wrote to Emperor Alexander III: “Today I saw this picture and could not look at it without disgust. Amazing art now: without the slightest ideals, only with a sense of bare realism and with a tendency of criticism and denunciation. " The picture did not like the sovereign. P. Tretyakov, who bought the painting, was instructed not to exhibit it. Repin's work was the first picture that was censored in the Russian Empire. True, after a few months the authorities softened their position, the painting was allowed to be exhibited in the Tretyakov Gallery.
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  1. Greyfox
    Greyfox 7 October 2013 09: 07 New
    +6
    A number of historians and public figures asked to remove the picture of the Russian artist Ilya Repin painted in 1883 — 1885. - "Ivan the Terrible and his son Ivan", in the storerooms.

    And these historians and public figures would go to .., to the monastery in short. It is advisable that the place is damp (neither TV, nor the Internet, nor depraved girls in mini-skirts, and even more so blasphemous pictures). And let there not offend anything their gaze.
    1. Mr. Gambu4aS
      Mr. Gambu4aS 7 October 2013 09: 27 New
      22
      It would be better if they asked to remove the history book to the storerooms!
      1. Ded_smerch
        Ded_smerch 7 October 2013 09: 49 New
        +2
        I think it's better to defiantly burn in the puddles, and aphors to the shameful pillar.
        1. predator.3
          predator.3 7 October 2013 14: 09 New
          +8
          that Tsarevich Ivan died in the Aleksandrovskaya Sloboda after an eleven-day illness, which seemed initially not dangerous. The reasons for this illness became clear in 1963, when the tombs of Tsar Ivan the Terrible and Tsarevich Ivan Ivanovich were opened in the Archangel Cathedral. Scientific studies, medical-chemical and medical-forensic examinations have shown that in the remains of the prince there is a presence of mercury, 32 times higher than the norm of permissible content. The content of increased amounts of arsenic and lead was also found. This is irrefutable evidence that the prince died as a result of poisoning with salts of mercury, arsenic and lead.


          to open the graves of other great people, whose death is in doubt.
    2. Ded_smerch
      Ded_smerch 7 October 2013 09: 39 New
      +2
      you dispute the fact that Ivan Vasilievich did not kill his son? Would you dispute the fact that the guides, leading up to the picture, mutter "that this picture depicts a historical fact ..."?
      1. Hon
        Hon 7 October 2013 09: 50 New
        +7
        Quote: Ded_smerch
        mutter "that this picture depicts a historical fact ..."?

        Have you been to the museum at least once? The guides never say such a thing, moreover, the author of the work himself didn’t say such a thing, from his words this picture is just an emotional expression in which he arrived after Alexander II was killed
        1. Greyfox
          Greyfox 7 October 2013 10: 08 New
          11
          And you can also remove all the naked aunts (Venus, and Danai all sorts), otherwise it offends and corrupts. The Hermitages have nothing to corrupt citizens with Orthodoxy of the brain. And leave only exhibitions of kosher Orthodox icons in museums. And from "Good nights, kids" to withdraw and burn Piggy demonstratively in Luzhniki, as an offender to the feelings of citizens with muslim-phimosis of the brain. And then think of something else to ban and burn.
          PS The guys who put the minuses, here we are not Saudi Arabia, where residents in duvet covers go to prove their religiosity. In our country, the church is separate from the state and should not interfere in the lives of ordinary people. At home, you can forbid your household to anything, grow beards to the navel, walk in Old Russian caftans or burqas (depending on faith), but do not meddle in the life of normal people.
          1. Odysseus
            Odysseus 7 October 2013 10: 51 New
            +5
            Quote: Greyfox
            And you can also remove all naked aunts (Venus, and Danai all sorts), otherwise it offends and corrupts. The Hermitages have nothing to corrupt citizens with Orthodoxy of the brain. And leave only exhibitions of kosher Orthodox icons in museums. And from "Good nights, kids" to withdraw and burn Piggy demonstratively in Luzhniki, as an offender to the feelings of citizens with muslim-phimosis of the brain. And then think of something else to ban and burn

            Alas, I’m afraid that if the decomposition of the intellectual and moral level in the Russian Federation continues at such a pace, then to save our, unfortunately few, artistic masterpieces, they will have to be kept under bullet-proof glasses. shoot.
            All hope is only for school. Nevertheless, despite all market reform, the school still carries the light of enlightenment and culture.
            1. does it
              does it 7 October 2013 22: 25 New
              0
              Quote: Odyssey
              Alas, I’m afraid that if the decomposition of the intellectual and moral level in the Russian Federation continues at such a pace, then to save our, unfortunately few, artistic masterpieces, they will have to be kept under bullet-proof glasses. shoot.

              And actually, what are you worried about? smile these will be removed to the storerooms and instead of them, they will be posted, for example, pictures of "heroes of our time" Chubais with a voucher, Medvedev with a smartphone, Serdyukov and co. and so on but seriously! zadolbali with rage and rage from unrelated energy with PGM.
              1. Odysseus
                Odysseus 8 October 2013 10: 07 New
                +3
                Quote: kvirit
                zadolbali with rage and rage from unrelated energy with PGM.

                If so ... Alas, this is worse.
                You see, there have always been lunatics and fools, but no one used them in political propaganda before.
                What would happen to a person who suggested something similar 40 years ago?
                Yes, they would have taken everyone to Durk ... And now they are giving a platform to such subjects and the Minister of Culture is forced to comment on this.
                The point is that the authorities, pursuing economic and social policies contrary to the interests of the overwhelming majority of citizens, are trying to hold on to power by conducting "patriotic" and even "nationalist" propaganda. On the principle that they would not notice that I stole and brought to the West a billion I will shout to TV that there are enemies in the West and talk about “spiritual bonds.” In this propaganda, the authorities began to rely on the wildest and most uncultured strata of the population, especially since the level of culture over the past 20 has fallen catastrophically.
                Actually, this is not new, similar technologies have already been used in some Latin American countries in the 3rd world in the 70-80s, but to see this in Russia .....
          2. Ded_smerch
            Ded_smerch 7 October 2013 11: 27 New
            +1
            and where did I write that the picture needs to be removed?
            1. atalef
              atalef 7 October 2013 12: 13 New
              -1
              Quote: Ded_smerch
              and where did I write that the picture needs to be removed?

              And where did he write
              what should it be left?
              In general, the impression is that these kademademiki have nothing more to do and that’s where all the problems in Russia will end. This is especially fun of Boyko-the Great
              In August 2010, Boyko-Veliky appealed to all employees of the companies included in your financial trustee holding. The document, in particular, stated that all employees of all enterprises during working and non-working hours should take the course "Fundamentals of Orthodox Culture"; in case of pregnancy, all employees retain the average monthly wage in full, up to the newborn child reaching one year; all employees who commit or contribute to an abortion are subject to dismissal by reduction from office. It was also announced that all employees who are married but not married are required to do this before October 14 of that year (before the Feast of the Protection of the Mother of God), otherwise their posts will also be reduced [23].
              1. Setrac
                Setrac 7 October 2013 15: 50 New
                0
                Quote: atalef
                In general, the impression is that these kademademiki have nothing more to do and that’s where all the problems in Russia will end. This is especially fun of Boyko-the Great

                Academics are right. The picture is lying on our story. This repin slandered the greatest man in our history, destroy all his paintings and erase his name so that no one would ever remember, put into oblivion the traitor.
                1. Aleksandr2
                  Aleksandr2 1 November 2013 15: 56 New
                  0
                  I also think that Ivan 4 is the best ruler in the history of Russia.
          3. Val_y
            Val_y 7 October 2013 14: 41 New
            0
            I completely agree with you, otherwise these "ministers of culture" got sick of it, they don't like it, it's unpatriotic, it's finally ..., and I suppose they are secret members of the LGBT society.
        2. vlrosch
          vlrosch 7 October 2013 10: 19 New
          -5
          St. Petersburg has already dragged some of the paintings (the ninth rampart and the appearance of Christ to the people) in the Russian Museum. Most likely this is another action to pull away the Tretyakov Gallery.
        3. Sinope
          Sinope 7 October 2013 11: 12 New
          +9
          Hon

          So I would draw Alexander II, and not Ivan IV.
        4. Ded_smerch
          Ded_smerch 7 October 2013 11: 25 New
          +2
          He used to be, and I heard this about paintings.
      2. Cynic
        Cynic 7 October 2013 16: 10 New
        0
        Quote: Ded_smerch
        "that this picture represents a historical fact ..."?

        Our prosecutors, together with the judiciary, are sewing the case, and is this picture used as evidence?
        belay
    3. DEfindER
      DEfindER 7 October 2013 11: 00 New
      +2
      Quote: Greyfox
      And would these historians and public figures go to ..., in a monastery in short

      Those who defend the picture, this terrible nonsense and an insult to the Russian people, would go better than the forest !!! How can you even publicize such a disgusting box ?! To insult the most famous and great ruler of Russia in the Middle Ages, Grozny he was only for foreigners, and among the people he enjoyed great respect and was an example in everything.
      Here is how Russia lived in the era of Tsar Ivan the Great:
      http://oko-planet.su/history/historysng/97530-moskovitskaya-roskosh-vremen-ivana
      -groznogo-meha-parcha-i-yahonty-lazorevye-na-valenkah.html
      1. Greyfox
        Greyfox 7 October 2013 11: 13 New
        -1
        Those who defend the picture, this terrible nonsense and an insult to the Russian people, would go better than the forest !!! How can you even publicize such a disgusting box ?! To insult the most famous and great ruler of Russia in the Middle Ages, Grozny he was only for foreigners, and among the people he enjoyed great respect and was an example in everything.

        To begin with, in order to speak on behalf of the Russian people, it would be nice to study the Russian language and find out that the word lie is written with a soft sign. And your nonsense about an example in everything (damn just like a pioneer bugagashenka) vividly characterizes people demanding to "remove and ban "the painting of the great Russian artist.
        1. DEfindER
          DEfindER 7 October 2013 12: 44 New
          +1
          Quote: Greyfox
          To start, to speak on behalf of the Russian people

          I speak only on my own behalf, and I say obvious things, insulting a people’s ruler is like insulting a people, or don't you think so?
          1. Greyfox
            Greyfox 7 October 2013 13: 09 New
            -2
            I speak only on my own behalf, and I say obvious things, insulting a people’s ruler is like insulting a people, or don't you think so?

            Is it true from her?
            this terrible nonsense and an insult to the Russian people !!!

            I am Russian and does not offend me. Next time so honestly and write - "me, Orthodox Defender, etc."
            The imposition of the postulate "all power from God" is convenient for rulers. Unlike you, I do not consider the tsar to be the people's ruler. And the fact that his image was used by Repin does not jar me. On the other hand, you probably should be bothered by Gaidai's film "Ivan Vasilyevich Changes His Profession", but these are problems for you personally and for the "common people" from the letter.
            By the way, according to your logic, EBNYa can’t be touched and criticized either, the ruler, and even chosen by the people.
            1. DEfindER
              DEfindER 7 October 2013 14: 24 New
              11
              Quote: Greyfox
              I am Russian and do not offend me.

              Well, not respect for the ancestors and their past is fraught with big problems in the future. Indifference to the fact that some people mix your story with dirt is disrespect first of all to oneself.
              Quote: Greyfox
              I, unlike you, do not consider the king to be a people's ruler.

              Those. the best years of Russia, the era of Ivan the Terrible, in your opinion did not depend on the Tsar and the people did not support him?
              Quote: Greyfox
              according to your logic, EBNya cannot be touched and criticized either — the ruler, and even chosen by the people.

              The rulers are judged by their deeds, the EBN Russia was lowered below the baseboard, and no one portrays him as a butcher, with Grozny, on the contrary.
              1. Greyfox
                Greyfox 7 October 2013 14: 58 New
                -8
                Those. the best years of Russia, the era of Ivan the Terrible, in your opinion did not depend on the Tsar and the people did not support him?

                Do you know the story yourself to talk about disrespect for ancestors? Is the reign of Ivan the Terrible the best years? Leaving aside the internal politics, but the catastrophic consequences of the Livonian War for Russia can be described by the expression “all polymers have disappeared.” Is this the best tsar and the best time? Worst then what?
                1. Setrac
                  Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 02 New
                  +5
                  Quote: Greyfox
                  the catastrophic consequences of the Livonian War for Russia can be described by the expression "all polymers have disappeared"

                  The consequences of the Livonian war for Russia are greatly exaggerated. In fact, Russia has not lost anything. They threw the aggressors out and stayed with their own.
                  1. Greyfox
                    Greyfox 7 October 2013 16: 22 New
                    -2
                    Setrac (2) RU Today, 16: 02 ↑ New

                    The consequences of the Livonian war for Russia are greatly exaggerated. In fact, Russia has not lost anything. They threw the aggressors out and stayed with their own.

                    Uh-huh, access to the Baltic Sea is, so ugh. Well, and so on, several "Kemsk volost" have been lost.
                    The war ended with the signing of the Yam-Zapolsky (1582 year) and Plyusky (1583 year) truces. Russia lost all the gains made as a result of the war, as well as the lands on the border with the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and the coastal Baltic cities (Koporye, Pit, Ivangorod).

                    Plus, the war ruined the state and, together with the reign of Ivan, paved the way for troubled times. Indeed, the bastards are exaggerating ...
                2. DEfindER
                  DEfindER 7 October 2013 17: 10 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Greyfox
                  Is the reign of Ivan the Terrible the best years?

                  If we discard all anti-Russian propaganda of which this canvas is a part, then even the fact that this person is the most famous and mentioned in the history of that time speaks of his significant contribution to the life of the country, and popularity among the people.
                  There are very different opinions about the Livonian war, but the version of serious losses does not hold water, you can read the discussion on the wikipedia article ..
                  Quote: Greyfox
                  Is this the best king and the best time? Worst then what?

                  Just right after it, the worst times of trouble for Russia, the civil war of the Romanov and Godunov clan with all the consequences ..
                3. Aleksandr2
                  Aleksandr2 1 November 2013 16: 03 New
                  0
                  He annexed lands to Russia more than anyone
            2. Realist58
              Realist58 7 October 2013 18: 03 New
              +1
              And how should it be contorted from the image of the king from this film, what is wrong with the king?
              1. Dober
                Dober 8 October 2013 01: 05 New
                +1
                Quote: Realist58
                what is wrong with the king?

                "Anise" was boozing in the frame. Nizzzzyayayahaaa ...
                Melee weapons were unregistered. Violations ...
                Probably... laughing
            3. Aleksandr2
              Aleksandr2 1 November 2013 16: 01 New
              0
              Greyfox (3) October 7, 2013 13:09
              You are pathetic
          2. old rocket man
            old rocket man 7 October 2013 16: 09 New
            -11
            Quote: DEfindER
            I speak only on my own behalf, and I say obvious things, insulting a people’s ruler is like insulting a people, or don't you think so?


            The people's ruler is Putin, his people chose, and no one chose Ivan 1V, this is firstly, and secondly, things that are obvious to you are not at all such to others, and you don’t have to push your opinion with such pressure ultimate truth
            1. DEfindER
              DEfindER 7 October 2013 17: 18 New
              +4
              Quote: Old Rocketman
              The people's ruler is Putin, his people chose, and nobody chose Ivan 1V,

              And what of this, why is it not popular then? It wouldn’t be the people would have dumped him! If he had not respected and revered his people, would not have called Tsar the Father, would not have built such temples in honor of his victories, such as for example St. Basil.
              Quote: Old Rocketman
              secondly, things that are obvious to you are not at all such to others

              You are absolutely right, propaganda is doing its job, and many believe the picture and not historical research ..
            2. Aleksandr2
              Aleksandr2 1 November 2013 16: 05 New
              0
              Your opinion is also not interesting to anyone.
        2. Setrac
          Setrac 7 October 2013 15: 54 New
          +2
          Quote: Greyfox
          ) vividly characterizes the people who demand to "withdraw and ban" the painting of the great Russian artist.

          In what place is he great? Can draw? There are many such people. The value of this picture is a negative value, although in the West it will be paid well for anti-Russian propaganda. You and Hitler will be a talented writer, over what kind of brochure I’ve sprinkled.
          1. Greyfox
            Greyfox 7 October 2013 16: 30 New
            -10
            Setrac (2) RU Today, 15: 54 ↑

            In what place is he great? Can draw? There are many such people. The value of this picture is a negative value, although in the West it will be paid well for anti-Russian propaganda. You and Hitler will be a talented writer, over what kind of brochure I’ve sprinkled.

            I noticed a tendency: as soon as the "expert of the Russian language" brochure meets an opinion different from his own, begins attribution of veneration of Hitler. The forum dwarf is trying to grow up, belittling the merits of the great (Repin in this case), and attributing his views to others.
            1. Setrac
              Setrac 7 October 2013 17: 09 New
              0
              Quote: Greyfox
              I noticed a tendency: as soon as a "expert of the Russian language" with a brochure meets an opinion different from his own, the attribution of reverence for Hitler begins. Forum dwarf tries to grow up, belittling the merits of the great (Repin in this case), and ascribing his views to others.

              Have you been sent for a long time? Who are you? Where do you live? Whose interests are you protecting? How much has the State Department sold?
              Do you sincerely believe that such dubious art is harmless?
              1. Greyfox
                Greyfox 7 October 2013 19: 02 New
                -5
                ABOUT! The conversation went to "you" with the intonations of cattle-hunters "Ty who is Uasya". You can see my previous posts, I was there to one forum marshal "In Pret" explained who I was. Why should I repeat myself.
                PS I sincerely believe that a person who carries nonsense about Hitler and the State Department in my address, dolb ... b.
          2. MG42
            MG42 7 October 2013 21: 06 New
            +1
            Quote: Setrac
            In what place is he great? Can draw? There are many such people.

            Well wow application.
            Quote: Setrac
            The value of this picture is a negative value.

            Are you an expert on art history? or spirituality?
            Quote: Setrac
            You and Hitler will be a talented writer, over what kind of brochure I’ve sprinkled.

            In fact, Hitler was an artist, too, you can say a landscape painter, he loved to paint city landscapes, failed examinations at an art school because he was not good at drawing people's faces, who knows if he had done everything in history differently ..
            One of the paintings of the artist Hitler, he has far more than a hundred of them >>
            1. Setrac
              Setrac 7 October 2013 22: 48 New
              -1
              Quote: MG42
              Well wow application.

              Of course, I exaggerated a little (a little wink ) Repin is undoubtedly a great artist! Claims must be put forward to Russophobic content, and not to the skill of the artist.
              1. MG42
                MG42 7 October 2013 23: 17 New
                +1
                Quote: Setrac
                Of course, I exaggerated a little (a little). Repin is undoubtedly a great artist!

                Who else could draw?, For example, this painting by Ilya Efimovich Repin was written in 1903 .. >>
                "Solemn meeting of the State Council on May 7, 1901"
                Quote: Setrac
                Claims must be put forward to Russophobic content, and not to the skill of the artist.

                Yes, there is no Russophobia, on the contrary, he loved and tried to convey the beauty of the Motherland, as for the picture in the subject, it's just his artistic vision, and not Russophobia ..
                1. Setrac
                  Setrac 8 October 2013 21: 46 New
                  +1
                  Quote: MG42
                  it's just his artistic vision, not Russophobia ..

                  The master was clearly mistaken with his vision.
      2. Max otto
        Max otto 7 October 2013 11: 20 New
        +5
        Quote: DEfindER

        Those who protect the picture would have walked better in the forest ...

        But do not decide for the entire Russian people. You need to have a brain, and to separate history from creativity, otherwise people like you have everything mixed up in your head, you look and your brain will explode soon. Flies separately, cutlets separately (folk wisdom).
        1. DEfindER
          DEfindER 7 October 2013 12: 47 New
          +7
          Quote: Max Otto
          It’s necessary to have a brain, and to separate history from creativity, otherwise people like you have everything mixed up in your head

          You need to have a brain and understand what history is, that it is reflected in all areas of people's lives, and not just a textbook written by one person with a subjective point of view. In your opinion, the reflection of great people in art, literature of painting, etc. is this not a story?
          1. Max otto
            Max otto 7 October 2013 14: 03 New
            -1
            Quote: DEfindER

            You need to have a brain and understand what history is, that it is reflected in all areas of people's lives, and not just a textbook written by one person with a subjective point of view.

            History is a science. Nobody forbids studying history. I have known all my life about this picture, I’ve seen it more than once, and in no way does it affect my attitude to Ivan the Terrible. Once again - flies separately, cutlets separately.
            Quote: DEfindER
            In your opinion, the reflection of great people in art, literature of painting, etc. is this not a story?

            Do not confuse history with antiques. hi
            1. DEfindER
              DEfindER 7 October 2013 14: 32 New
              +3
              Quote: Max Otto
              I have seen more than once, and in no way does it affect my attitude to Ivan the Terrible.

              Those who know history well are not susceptible to this, but such a minority, for most people, this picture is a source of information and not just art.

              In general, indifference to lies is scary ..
              1. Max otto
                Max otto 7 October 2013 15: 01 New
                +1
                Quote: DEfindER
                for most people, this picture is a source of information and not just art [c] yours.

                The picture is a source of information - yes, this five !!!
                Quote: DEfindER
                In general, indifference to lies is scary ..

                Another saying - do not shoot the pianist - he plays as best he can.
                Again, all in a bunch. There are official persons and at execution, they are forbidden to lie, and there are artists. You will bring Salvador Dali to court for distorting space and the laws of physics.
                1. DEfindER
                  DEfindER 7 October 2013 17: 31 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Max Otto
                  but there are artists. You still bring to court Salvador Dali

                  If you draw your world divorced from reality, do what you want there, and if you use a real person, and even the Tsar, to do this, not that it’s unethical, it’s wild .. Nowhere and never has happened, you can try to find for the sake of interest, this brainchild is the only precedent ..
              2. Doctorleg
                Doctorleg 7 October 2013 15: 56 New
                +4
                Those who know history well are not susceptible to this, but such a minority, for most people, this picture is a source of information and not just art.

                In general, indifference to lies is scary .. [/ quote]
                For some, "Seventeen Moments of Spring" is a historical source. But there is a lot of crap. Deny?
            2. Setrac
              Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 07 New
              +5
              Quote: Max Otto
              History is a science.

              This "science" is extremely unscientific. History is a corrupt propaganda wench. However, the so-called "art" also applies. Surely everyone saw this getting on with Napoleon talking to the terminally ill (I don’t remember what kind of illness).
              1. Max otto
                Max otto 7 October 2013 18: 52 New
                0
                Quote: DEfindER

                If you draw your world divorced from reality, do what you want there, and if you use a real person, and even the Tsar, to do this, not that it’s unethical, it’s wild .. Nowhere and never has happened, you can try to find for the sake of interest, this offspring is the only precedent.


                Quote: Setrac
                This "science" is extremely unscientific. History is a corrupt propaganda wench. However, the so-called "art" also applies.

                Here's what I will answer. I haven’t dealt with history, as well as with other humanities, because of my practical mindset, philosophy, for example, is torture for me, well, I can’t talk about anything for hours. In this regard, I have huge gaps in my history, I do not know it well. But I guarantee you that the very first bastard in NATO bots will receive a spade from me with a shovel that has turned up under my arm, regardless of these gaps. Therefore, the problems are not in art and not in history, the problems are in the heads, and in them is the ruin. Put things in order in your "garden", and then we'll talk about art. I think so.
      3. Prapor-527
        Prapor-527 7 October 2013 11: 41 New
        +3
        Let's assign to the terrible delirium all the works of great masters that are inconsistent with historical reality or even common sense. Do not forget that art is not documentary, and the author has the right to distort reality as he pleases - do not like it, don’t look!
        1. DEfindER
          DEfindER 7 October 2013 12: 50 New
          +3
          Quote: Prapor-527
          Do not forget that art is not documentary, and the author has the right to distort reality as he pleases - do not like it, don’t look!

          It depends on how you distort, if you denigrate a person who is significant for a person’s history, this can have serious consequences for the future.
          1. Prapor-527
            Prapor-527 7 October 2013 15: 55 New
            +4
            Serious consequences - Question to 16-year-old goof: "What kind of war started in 1941?" Answer: "The war in Chechnya." Did you mean that? I am more than sure that this "prodigy" has never seen the painting "Ivan the Terrible is killing his son", moreover, he does not even know who Ivan the Terrible is ... Yours faithfully. hi
            1. old rocket man
              old rocket man 7 October 2013 16: 16 New
              0
              Quote: Prapor-527
              Serious consequences - Question to 16-year-old goof: "What kind of war started in 1941?" Answer: "The war in Chechnya." Did you mean that? I am more than sure that this "prodigy" has never seen the painting "Ivan the Terrible is killing his son", moreover, he does not even know who Ivan the Terrible is ... Yours faithfully. hi

              Five points, +, I would bet more if I could drinks
            2. DEfindER
              DEfindER 7 October 2013 17: 41 New
              +1
              Quote: Prapor-527
              I am more than sure that this "prodigy" has never seen the painting "Ivan the Terrible kills his son", moreover, he does not even know who Ivan the Terrible is ...

              And then he hears somewhere the name of Ivan the Terrible and asks the one who saw the picture but did not read historical research "and who is Ivan the Terrible" and to him "this is a terrible and cruel man, a murderer who ruled Russia in the 16th century" and what Can this prodigy have respect for ancestors after this?
              1. bwo
                bwo 7 October 2013 21: 50 New
                -2
                Let's imagine that you talk about Ivan IV to this dunce.
                And he will immediately begin to respect the ancestors? Yes ... to him on Ivan, Stalin and all previous and subsequent. The train left. This customer is lost.
              2. tolyasik0577
                tolyasik0577 8 October 2013 18: 13 New
                -2
                What respect for tyrant and despot ?. are you completely confused in patriotism or something? Yes, not without reason the artist painted this picture. in that far 19th century the people were much more patriotic. I do not beg the great conquests of Ivan Vasilievich, but the horrors of that time should not be forgotten.
                1. Aleksandr2
                  Aleksandr2 1 November 2013 16: 13 New
                  0
                  In the 90s of the last century it was worse
      4. IRBIS
        IRBIS 7 October 2013 15: 24 New
        -2
        Quote: DEfindER
        Here is how Russia lived in the era of Tsar Ivan the Great:

        Did the inhabitants of Russia of that time write it? About a good, comfortable life and about "respect"? And what, nevertheless, is an insult to the Russian people?
        1. DEfindER
          DEfindER 7 October 2013 17: 51 New
          -2
          Quote: IRBIS
          Did the inhabitants of Russia of that time write it? About a good, comfortable life and about "respect"?

          There it is written under each paragraph who wrote, these are European and Asian travelers, because only they could appreciate everything from an unbiased perspective.
          Quote: IRBIS
          And what, nevertheless, is an insult to the Russian people?

          Well, what would you understand, for example, you are a footballer in a football team, and someone has terribly and undeservedly offended your coach, how do you feel about this? Surely do not disregard. Now imagine that for the people of that time, the Tsar is almost a holy person, the second after God, and they call him an infanticide ..
      5. Cynic
        Cynic 7 October 2013 18: 57 New
        +1
        Quote: DEfindER
        How can you even publicize such a disgusting box ?!

        Mmm.
        But you are not a Russian gentleman DEfindER This is not a photojournal for your information.
        For a Russian, this is a story about the tragedy of the father of the murdered son, and it does not matter who the father is and who the son is!
        Maybe we will ban Taras Bulba? He didn’t tolerate both the Poles and his son.
        1. Setrac
          Setrac 7 October 2013 21: 44 New
          -1
          Quote: Cynic
          Maybe we will ban Taras Bulba?

          "Taras Bulba" is a work of art without any claims to authenticity. Ivan the Terrible is a real and highly respected person.
        2. DEfindER
          DEfindER 7 October 2013 22: 25 New
          -1
          Quote: Cynic
          But you are not Russian Mr. DEfindER

          This is what you do not understand you ..
          Quote: Cynic
          For a Russian, this is a story about the tragedy of the father of the murdered son, and it does not matter who the father is and who the son is!

          This is crucial in this case, because the people deserve the ruler whom they have, and if they have a killer, then what can one think of the people?
          1. Cynic
            Cynic 8 October 2013 12: 31 New
            -2
            Quote: DEfindER
            This is crucial in this case, because the people deserve the ruler whom they have, and if they have a killer, then what can one think of the people?

            Not funny.
            I watched a program the other day Property of the Republic dedicated to the songs of Tukhmanov
            So we have
            Again the last train ran away from me
            And I'm on the sleepers, again on the sleepers
            I'm going out of habit.

            The song is about an irresponsible person and calls to violate safety rules and slanders the railway!
            You do not find that the positions of those party censors from culture and yours are consonant?
            1. DEfindER
              DEfindER 9 October 2013 09: 35 New
              +1
              Quote: Cynic
              The song is about an irresponsible person and calls for breaking security rules

              Well, you compared a pancake .. my conscience would not have allowed me to make such a comparison, and I don’t know the law prohibiting walking on sleepers, and where is the slander on the railway? It’s my fault that the last train escaped :)
              1. Cynic
                Cynic 9 October 2013 18: 28 New
                -1
                Quote: DEfindER
                Well, you damn compared .. I would not have the conscience would allow such a comparison

                And I mean she doesn’t, since I could. Interesting ephemeism.
                Quote: DEfindER
                I do not know the law prohibiting walking on sleepers

                Is railroad exotic for you?


                Quote: DEfindER
                where is the libel on the railway here?

                There was no last train, then there was round-the-clock movement.
                recourse
      6. Aleksandr2
        Aleksandr2 1 November 2013 15: 58 New
        0
        I support you
    4. Cynic
      Cynic 7 October 2013 12: 51 New
      0
      Quote: Greyfox
      And these historians and public figures would go ...

      Here recently our president spoke briefly and succinctly about one namesake of our prime minister.
      So you can say about them, only in the plural!
    5. Sashkessss
      Sashkessss 7 October 2013 17: 05 New
      -1
      And they do not want to go there, otherwise what will they swear at? On ourselves? They have no desire to swear at themselves.
    6. Realist58
      Realist58 7 October 2013 17: 19 New
      +3
      Indeed, who cares about historical reality, I am an artist who has the right to fiction.

      Therefore, I propose simply renaming the picture in accordance with my artistic vision.
      "George W. Bush, Sr. blows the brains out of George W. Bush with his award-winning Vesert Eagle."
      1. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 7 October 2013 17: 23 New
        +1
        Well, such precedents already exist ...
        "Minsk on July 3, 1944".

        "Liberation of Baghdad by the American Army"
    7. Very old
      Very old 7 October 2013 18: 42 New
      +1
      Exclusively current textbooks. Where Russia is just a Fool
    8. Horde
      Horde 7 October 2013 20: 36 New
      +5
      “This picture insults the patriotic feelings of the Russian people”


      welcome! people begin to wake up the mind and national Russian identity.
      It’s exactly what Russophobic customers of an unprincipled artist counted on to kill their OWN SON — a monstrous crime. They paid well.
      1. Horde
        Horde 7 October 2013 20: 53 New
        +1
        In August 2010, Boyko-Veliky appealed to all employees of the companies included in your financial trustee holding. The document, in particular, stated that all employees of all enterprises during working and non-working hours should take the course "Fundamentals of Orthodox Culture"; in case of pregnancy, all employees retain the average monthly wage in full, up to the newborn child reaching one year; all employees who commit or contribute to an abortion are subject to dismissal by reduction from office. It was also announced that all employees who are married but not married are required to do this before October 14 of that year (before the Feast of the Protection of the Mother of God), otherwise their posts will also be reduced [23].
        This measure was sharply criticized by a number of lawyers, in particular, Petr Bizyukov, chief specialist of the Center for Social and Labor Rights:
        The chief specialist of the Center for Social and Labor Rights Petr Bizyukov in an interview with “Newspaper. Ru "called the order of Boyko the Great" a violation of all that is possible. " “This is obvious discrimination, he has no right to it, it is generally illegal,” he said. [23]
        In December 2010, Boyko told the media that according to the results of an audit of the Russian Milk agricultural holding by the Moscow Regional Prosecutor’s Office in connection with his appeal to observe personal piety, the prosecutor’s office found no violations of existing Russian law:
        The check took more than one month. The prosecutors of the Ruzsky district of the Moscow region requested almost all personnel documentation at all enterprises of the Agroholding, prosecutors met with the employees of Russian Milk, the prosecutor of the Ruzsky district personally visited the dairy and talked with the employees. A comprehensive audit showed that there are no violations of the current legislation of Russia at the enterprises of Russian Milk. [24]
        The initiative of the entrepreneur received different ratings from the clergy of the Russian Orthodox Church. Archpriest Alexander Saltykov, Rector of the Resurrection Church in Kadashi, fully supported this initiative:
        It seems to me quite natural that an Orthodox entrepreneur tries in his work to rely on the values ​​of Christian culture and tries to attract his employees to them. Nowadays, this is one of the most urgent tasks in our country. I also believe that any sane person should support the fight against infanticide
        - [25]
        The initiative of Vasily Boyko the Great was also supported by Archpriest Dmitry Smirnov, head of the Regional Relations Service of the Moscow Patriarchate Department for Relations between the Church and the Society Maxim Parshin, Father Superior Peter (Kucher), many monks on Athos and many other clergy and laity.

        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%BE%D0%B9%D0%BA%D0%BE-%D0%92%D0%B5%D0%BB%D
        0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9,_%D0%92%D0%B0%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%92%D0%B0%
        D0%B4%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

        this smartly cool guy!
  2. svskor80
    svskor80 7 October 2013 09: 09 New
    +3
    Our figures would rather do something that does not lose their value over the centuries than blame the works of truly classical authors of the Russian art school. It must be remembered that a work of art is not a history textbook.
    1. xetai9977
      xetai9977 7 October 2013 09: 29 New
      11
      Fighting with paintings and books was already in history, and didn’t lead to anything good. As for Ivan the Terrible ... His mother, Princess Elena Glinsky, was also poisoned with arsenic, a favorite method of the killers of the time, not only in Russia. The brilliant astronomer Tycho Brahe also died from arsenic. Centuries later, the great Johannes Kepler was blamed. But we are unlikely to know the truth.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. Ingvar 72
          Ingvar 72 7 October 2013 10: 19 New
          13
          Quote: Boris55
          They fight not with paintings and books, but with the ideology that they carry to the masses.
          Don't you feel the influence of the media on society?

          I agree. But for some reason they start to fight with pictures and old Soviet cartoons, and textbooks, magazines, and other crap like STS and Pepper are not touched. Somehow our "cultural workers" work very selectively.
          1. Uncle lee
            Uncle lee 7 October 2013 10: 58 New
            22
            It would be better to fight with pop music and shut down "Dom-2" ... Not listening, not watching without vomiting! am
      2. Nayhas
        Nayhas 7 October 2013 14: 06 New
        0
        Quote: xetai9977
        As for Ivan the Terrible ...

        All the royal persons and their entourage died of their own death, from diseases ... For example, Paul 1 died of an apoplectic stroke, and if there was a picture "Guardsmen strangle the emperor", then "Holy Russia" would definitely require to remove such a picture as not corresponding to historical reality.
    2. DEfindER
      DEfindER 7 October 2013 11: 19 New
      +3
      Quote: svskor80
      It must be remembered that a work of art is not a history textbook.

      History is absolutely everything, not just a textbook! And architecture and painting, and books, and clothes and weapons! And lies, and even at such a high level, this is a crime, the level of treason to the motherland! Will you find somewhere in Europe a picture of their leader, even if he has really stained himself, in such a terrible image? Never, because it means insulting yourself!
      Those who say that then it is necessary to remove all the fabulous pictures do not include the brain at all, because in those pictures there are no real characters, and if you really wrote a real person, then be so kind as to write the truth!
      1. bwo
        bwo 7 October 2013 22: 10 New
        -1
        Cromwell at the tomb of Charles 1.
  3. Standard Oil
    Standard Oil 7 October 2013 09: 12 New
    18
    And let's better "remove" our leaders so that they do not offend the Russian people with their presence?
  4. lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 7 October 2013 09: 15 New
    +6
    It would be better to debunk myths in scientific works, but would not climb into art
    1. zvereok
      zvereok 7 October 2013 09: 20 New
      +5
      Quote: lewerlin53rus
      It would be better to debunk myths in scientific works, but would not climb into art


      Well, Duc reformist itch in one place does not give rest. In general, "ruin is not in the closets, ruin in the heads."
    2. Denis
      Denis 7 October 2013 09: 23 New
      +2
      Quote: lewerlin53rus
      It would be better to debunk myths in scientific works,
      They need to be written at least a little brain, this is not a throat to tear
      Throats, make up nonsense and scream, than not a swamp?
    3. DEfindER
      DEfindER 7 October 2013 11: 26 New
      -1
      Quote: lewerlin53rus
      It would be better to debunk myths in scientific works, but would not climb into art

      So this myth has long been debunked in scientific works, and for good people cannot be misled by such art, with all due respect to Repin's talent, this work has no place in the Russian museum! It's like exposing the Russian people as a complete moron and doing it in the main Russian museum! After all, children will ask themselves how such a beast could rule us, and if this was possible, they will easily believe in modern Western myths about Stalin and even about Putin!
      1. cumastra1
        cumastra1 7 October 2013 13: 50 New
        -2
        Well, they will remove it. And what will they put instead? Croup of Bryntsalov's wife? or Nikita Dzhigurd's poster? Oh no, now everything is like in Europe - Borya Moiseev should hang there, "in action." What? creative, tolerant.
        On the other hand, even if this is fiction, then this is not a reason to remove art objects. Then the frescoes from the Sistine Chapel should be cut down, and "the morning in the pine forest should be removed" - well, I don't believe that the bear posed for Shishkin ...
        Verbal nonsense. Those who are interested in historical accuracy do not work in art galleries, but in libraries and other places populated by highbrow citizens. But even they, knowing all the historical falsity of the plot depicted, will be horrified by the proposal to remove the picture from the exhibition.
        1. DEfindER
          DEfindER 7 October 2013 14: 06 New
          +5
          Quote: cumastra1
          Then the frescoes from the Sistine Chapel should be cut down, and "the morning in the pine forest should be removed" - well, I don't believe that the bear posed for Shishkin ...
          Verbal nonsense. Those who are interested in historical accuracy do not work in art galleries, but in libraries and other places populated by highbrow citizens.

          But is there really a lie in the frescoes? There are biblical stories, and to believe the bible or not is everyone’s business, but if they painted a saint who committed a sin on frescoes, I think the artist himself would be executed .. Show me at least one picture in the world where a real historical character is depicted as a mad man committing a sin ? But infanticide, by the way, is the worst sin in Christianity, no worse. You are very mistaken if you think that historians have a place only in libraries! History is happening everywhere, and first of all in the minds of people that are so easy to manipulate.
        2. Denis
          Denis 7 October 2013 18: 53 New
          -1
          Quote: cumastra1
          I do not believe that the bear posed for Shishkin ...
          And Dumas books in general to the stake for distorting history
      2. Mikhail3
        Mikhail3 7 October 2013 15: 38 New
        +4
        Ivan the Terrible killed many people during his reign. Dozens, even hundreds of times less than any successful ruler of that time, but ... Unlike everyone else, our Sovereign never sought an excuse for himself. He did not hide behind "nothing personal ... the interests of the state ..." etc.
        It was a deeply religious and, at the same time, absolutely Russian person. Therefore, for the sake of the Motherland, for the future, he went to the destruction of his soul and deliberately blurred his conscience. All his life he stood for Russian land ... and he was terribly, cruelly tormented by his guilt. Yes, of course, he didn’t kill the prince. But, once ceasing to forgive (and he forgave. Forgave, sent to exile, sent to the monasteries to pray ... again returned, believed ...) of obvious traitors, he began to execute them. And all death killed him too ...
        The artist, the great Russian artist Repin, perfectly understood this. The king, in horror and indelible guilt, presses a young, strong and irrevocably dead son to himself. What is his name, whose family he is, what he did ... the king doesn’t care, he knows there’s no forgiveness for the killer. And yet it stands between the Russian land and its enemies ...
        Do you really want to hide all this?
        1. Doctorleg
          Doctorleg 7 October 2013 16: 06 New
          -3
          Quote: Mikhail3
          Ivan the Terrible killed many people during his reign. Dozens, even hundreds of times less than any successful ruler of that time, but ... Unlike everyone else, our Sovereign never sought an excuse for himself. He did not hide behind "nothing personal ... the interests of the state ..." etc.
          It was a deeply religious and, at the same time, absolutely Russian person. Therefore, for the sake of the Motherland, for the future, he went to the destruction of his soul and deliberately blurred his conscience. All his life he stood for Russian land ... and he was terribly, cruelly tormented by his guilt. Yes, of course, he didn’t kill the prince. But, once ceasing to forgive (and he forgave. Forgave, sent to exile, sent to the monasteries to pray ... again returned, believed ...) of obvious traitors, he began to execute them. And all death killed him too ...
          The artist, the great Russian artist Repin, perfectly understood this. The king, in horror and indelible guilt, presses a young, strong and irrevocably dead son to himself. What is his name, whose family he is, what he did ... the king doesn’t care, he knows there’s no forgiveness for the killer. And yet it stands between the Russian land and its enemies ...
          Do you really want to hide all this?

          At that time and earlier, kings and princes defended their interests, and not the homeland. Just the country was their property. And only from this point of view she was dear to them. When he went to Novgorod did he say that Novgorod was my estate. Mine, not ours. Do not attribute patriotism to those who did not have it
          PS For some reason, the answer went wrong.
        2. Glory333
          Glory333 7 October 2013 19: 55 New
          +2
          Repin is not a Russian artist; he hated Russian people and Russia.
        3. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 7 October 2013 21: 05 New
          +2
          Quote: Mikhail3
          Ivan the Terrible killed many people during his reign. Dozens, even hundreds of times less than any successful ruler of that time, but ... Unlike everyone else, our Sovereign never sought an excuse for himself. He did not hide behind "nothing personal ... the interests of the state ..." etc.
          It was a deeply religious and, at the same time, absolutely Russian person. Therefore, for the sake of the motherland, for the future, he went to the destruction of his soul and deliberately blurred his conscience

          It’s hard to disagree.
          You can’t blame the king for the senseless massacre
          He affirmed the law uniform in the state.
          With the strife of the boyars, the king fought not in vain,
          Order became one in his vast kingdom.
          10
          A country cannot be changed without dirtying your hands
          And executions, and war, and not freedom for everyone,
          The great sovereign is always cruel and cool,
          A weak ruler is a misfortune for the people.
          11
          Unknown to the kings, humility and peace,
          Long-term labor - the dispensation of the kingdom,
          God holds their hearts with a ruthless hand,
          Do not separate their life from the life of the state.
          12
          He will soak his hands with people executed in blood,
          The rebel boyar is waiting for opal and an ax,
          He will conquer Kazan and Astrakhan with Siberia,
          He will accept the oprichnina shame.
          13
          Descendants cannot comprehend a cruel, formidable age,
          Who knew no battle, no rage, no fear,
          It is not for us to judge the king. He is the king! He is a human!
          But, how "heavy are you, Monomakh hat!"

          The childhood of Tsar John lV the Terrible.
          On the 475 anniversary of the birth of (25.08.2005 g.)
          1. kostella85
            kostella85 7 October 2013 21: 08 New
            0
            So a masterpiece (picture) here we shall !!! !!! ???
  5. zvereok
    zvereok 7 October 2013 09: 19 New
    11
    For some reason, I remembered Sharikov with his ideas. ER, this is the party of the Sharikovs.
  6. samoletil18
    samoletil18 7 October 2013 09: 22 New
    +5
    Well, of course! "all the crap with the stars" does not offend, but here it offends. All these figures - to Siberia, for spiritualization, remove the snow with a crowbar.
  7. Peaceful military
    Peaceful military 7 October 2013 09: 31 New
    +2
    Then, when this picture was written, there was a rampant liberalism, which Alexander III could not slam, which, as a result, RI collapsed.
    So this artistic libel is quite in the spirit of liberalism. We see this now, like the last decades, very vividly.
    As for inform. wars against Russia, then here is a good article about it. "Information wars have been waged against Russia since the 2196th century": http://www.russiapost.su/archives/XNUMX
    1. Nayhas
      Nayhas 7 October 2013 14: 08 New
      -2
      As far as I understand, the word LIBERALISM wildly annoys you and you sculpt it on everything that you do not like, what is the reason?
      1. Peaceful military
        Peaceful military 7 October 2013 14: 17 New
        +2
        As far as I understand, the word LIBERALISM wildly annoys you and you sculpt it on everything that you do not like, what is the reason?

        The word liberalism is absolutely neutral for me, but a vile phenomenon liberalism, makes me angry, I hate him fiercely and, at any opportunity, reveal his vile and anti-human essence. hi
        1. Nayhas
          Nayhas 7 October 2013 20: 43 New
          -2
          Quote: Peaceful military
          but the vile phenomenon of liberalism, makes me angry, I hate him fiercely

          give a definition, otherwise it’s not clear in what place of tsarist Russia you suddenly found how I understand liberals ...
          1. Tyumen
            Tyumen 7 October 2013 21: 03 New
            +2
            And who made the February Revolution and threw the king? Generals and liberals.
          2. Peaceful military
            Peaceful military 7 October 2013 22: 22 New
            +1
            give a definition, otherwise it’s not clear in what place of tsarist Russia you suddenly found how I understand liberals ...

            Eugene, you do not ask me, but those who taught you history.
            This is known to any high school student, if he studies, of course.
            The rampant liberalism began systematically with the assassination of Emperor Paul I, continued with the Decembrists' revolt, with all the previous and subsequent events bringing RI to defeat in the Crimea, the comprador reign of Alexander II in which the abomination of liberalism reached a familiar state, with the charms of revolutionary terror, etc. , etc. Further, the liberals killed Alexander II himself, sold mineral resources and other RI in the form of concessions and other kinds of investments. The unheard of development of the revolutionary movement, which Emperor Alexander III could not stop already, although it was known as a reactionary. Further Khodynka, the Russo-Japanese War, Bloody Sunday, 1905 - 1907, the murders of courtiers and rulers of various kinds, up to Prime Minister Stolypin. Etc. Until the accession of I.V. Stalin in 1929 (before that he absolutely did not rule Russia). This topic is not one dissertation.
            Good and capacious answered you Tyumen:
            And who made the February Revolution and threw the king? Generals and liberals.

            There is something, draw conclusions, but no, as you know, there is no trial. hi
  8. Yun Klob
    Yun Klob 7 October 2013 09: 34 New
    +5
    Taburetkin as Minister of Defense did not insult their conscience.
  9. DuraLexSedLex.
    DuraLexSedLex. 7 October 2013 09: 34 New
    +3
    I do not know the history of my state badly, but unlike these "... the chairman of the organizing committee of the People's Movement" Holy Russia "...", false patriots, I have no feelings other than admiration, I don’t have the brush of the author, who conveyed the entire depth of the experiences of that time in oil. There is still pride in my homeland, rich in talents such as Repin.
    It is necessary to earn authority by great deeds, and not by courts of insulting the "feelings of believers" ... cheap.
  10. hohryakov066
    hohryakov066 7 October 2013 09: 38 New
    +2
    Just look closely into the eyes of the king in the picture! They are horrified by the perfect! In terms of its impact on the viewer, it is truly a masterpiece. And the historical accuracy .... We were not there. Maybe it was worth banging my son. By the way, all the decoration of the royal chambers, clothes, household items are painted with photographic accuracy. The demand of the "zealots of the Russian spirit" to remove the painting in the storeroom is simply ridiculous. Such "scientists" invented science to get money and nothing else!
    1. cdrt
      cdrt 7 October 2013 10: 40 New
      +1
      And what is remarkable is that at all times there will be trash ("scientists", corresponding social activists) who will passionately fight for the feelings of the people - in 1933 in Germany, in 1963 in China. And to fight means to burn books, paintings, etc.
      Burn all this trash in hell
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 14 New
        -4
        Quote: cdrt
        Burn all this trash in hell

        In hell you will burn when you understand who you are defending.
  11. sergej30003
    sergej30003 7 October 2013 09: 38 New
    +7
    "what is written with a pen-brush, do not cut it out and with an ax", you just need to know that this picture is not based on historical events.
  12. vladek64
    vladek64 7 October 2013 09: 45 New
    +5
    Currently, most Russian residents are sure that Ivan IV killed his son. Such is the power of the image created by a talented artist.


    This power would be for peaceful purposes.
    But in general the task is not simple: If the picture has a powerful effect on the people, and this effect, in turn, distorts the history of the country in the minds of the people (towards a bad attitude to their own history), then what should be done?
    1. cdrt
      cdrt 7 October 2013 10: 46 New
      +2
      But in general the task is not simple: If the picture has a powerful effect on the people, and this effect, in turn, distorts the history of the country in the minds of the people (towards a bad attitude to their own history), then what should be done?


      Timidly so in response laughing
      improve the quality of history teaching in schools. Not doing it on the introduction of like-mindedness (aka "Single correct textbook", fighting with pictures), but so that children would like to read more books on the history of the country, form their own opinion
    2. DEfindER
      DEfindER 7 October 2013 11: 39 New
      -2
      Quote: vladek64
      If the picture has a powerful effect on the people, and this effect, in turn, distorts the history of the country in the minds of the people (towards a poor attitude to their own history), then what should be done?

      Maybe if they don’t want to remove the picture, rename it at least by removing the Tsar’s name from there, the old man depicted has nothing to do with the Tsar, and looks more like a drug addict in the last stage of madness ... it seems that he really allowed rampant liberalism at that time Repin so distort the bright image of the Russian Tsar. By the way, and during perestroika, our artist Ilya Glazunov tried in every possible way to demonize our general secretaries and Soviet heroes. If history is not learned then it is repeated.
    3. Setrac
      Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 15 New
      -1
      Quote: vladek64
      what to do?

      Yes, to plant a repin. On the count of it.
      1. Denis
        Denis 7 October 2013 19: 02 New
        +2
        Quote: Setrac
        Yes, to plant a repin. To stake him
        -Here you will be fucked, fucked and fucked!
        -And I thought to study, study and study
        -Who said?
        -Lenin
        -Radovoy Lenin, fail!

        mess, people in the company are dying, but they don’t report to me
  13. pahom54
    pahom54 7 October 2013 09: 55 New
    +5
    The problems of modern Russia-Russia to hell and more. And historical scholars have already become just like boyars in the Duma - don’t do it, so they took up both Repin and Ivan the Terrible ... One thing I can say is NOT ON THEM Ivan the Terrible, otherwise I would have chopped off idleness and verbiage or boshko, or exiled to hard labor ...
    Repin’s painting in the Tretyakov Gallery is for the reason that it belongs to the brush of the great Russian painter, and there is absolutely no reason to remove it. And I don’t understand how I, the Russian person, insult me ​​??? Well, I do not understand!
    Once again I’m convinced that there are a great many loafers in Russia ... They would have mastered production, since you are wasting time and money on solving a far-fetched problem ... Well, at the moment Russia doesn’t have this problem - did Ivan the Terrible kill his son or not !
    1. vladek64
      vladek64 7 October 2013 10: 02 New
      +2
      One thing I can say - NOT ON THEM Ivan the Terrible, otherwise I would have chopped off idleness and verbiage or Bosko, or sentenced to hard labor ...


      And what would Ivan the Terrible do with Repin! .... wink
    2. Glory333
      Glory333 7 October 2013 10: 28 New
      +5
      Well, the liberals, too, have nothing to do but how to take up Ivan the Terrible again to throw mud at modern Russia - see the film "Tsar" by Pavel Lungin. In the times of Repin, there was no cinema, and there was no slander about Russia as a "great Russian director" (in your expression) - Lungin, he could not, Repin could simply draw his libel.
    3. Setrac
      Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 17 New
      -2
      Quote: pahom54
      Repin's painting in the Tretyakov Gallery is for the same reason

      So let them write in lower letters on the picture in large letters - the picture is not true and written by a traitor in order to slander the Russian Tsar.
  14. Klin klinovv
    Klin klinovv 7 October 2013 10: 06 New
    +3
    do not understand Fomenko A.T. in small things and cling to them. he drags the rod itself into the light of God, and the branches and twigs themselves grow.
    and the picture is FALSE UNREADABLE, ktozh the truth that we would allow to introduce
    1. cdrt
      cdrt 7 October 2013 10: 51 New
      -1
      and the picture is FALSE UNREADABLE, ktozh the truth that we would allow to introduce


      Greetings, citizen Sharikov.
      I completely agree. Since childhood, I was outraged by the story of Pinocchio - all lies after all!
      Where is this kind of it, so that they make a child out of a log block.
      And they read to her children, accustom them to an alien way of thinking.
      I think that all books about Pinocchio should be removed!
      1. Klin klinovv
        Klin klinovv 7 October 2013 13: 15 New
        +1
        you understand nothing Candratius
        Pinocchio lived, Pinocchio lives, Pinocchio will live.
        and the fact that you read it there slipped so it's wrecking, also about Pinocchio
    2. Glory333
      Glory333 7 October 2013 19: 32 New
      +2
      Well, yes - to overcome the Great Power of Art with some kind of comments ... In any case, it is too late with Repin, here the liberalist Lungin is still alive.
  15. NORILCHANIN
    NORILCHANIN 7 October 2013 10: 06 New
    +6
    Quote: zvereok
    For some reason, I remembered Sharikov with his ideas. ER, this is the party of the Sharikovs.

    This is especially noticeable when giving speeches Dimon - iPhone!
  16. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 7 October 2013 10: 07 New
    +2
    Repin's gang in court!))
  17. Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 7 October 2013 10: 07 New
    +3
    I would like to know the opinion of "A number of historians and public figures" on Malevich's "Black Square", what kind of blizzard will they drive away? ... laughing
    1. Setrac
      Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 19 New
      0
      Quote: Valery Neonov
      I would like to know the opinion of "A number of historians and public figures" on Malevich's "Black Square", what kind of blizzard will they drive away? ...

      Let them be engaged in such "art" at their own expense and not at the expense of the state.
    2. I think so
      I think so 8 October 2013 00: 52 New
      +1
      Dear Valery Neonov.
      An ordinary person can also say about the black square - this is a Jewish project promoted by Jews and showing how stupid and stupid the philistine is. Having created the "popularity" of this square, they (the Jews) showed all the other LOCHAM how easy it is to breed them. And now many THOUSANDS of people (?) Admire (!) This daub of an unskilled painter. This picture and its popularity is a perfect example of how a crowd of mostly mindless people can be manipulated. That's all that a normal person can say about this "work" of a Jewish painter.
  18. vladek64
    vladek64 7 October 2013 10: 10 New
    +4
    Quote: Hon
    according to him, this picture is just an emotional expression in which he arrived after Alexander II was killed


    Well, this is just a miracle of logic: in an emotional state from the murder of the monarch, the artist created an anti-monarchist picture!

    More like an ordinary excuse. Otherwise, this "emotional state" can be deciphered as follows: "It was not enough that the king was blown up, he also had to hit him on the head with a club!"
    1. Hon
      Hon 7 October 2013 10: 28 New
      -1
      Quote: vladek64
      Well, this is just a miracle of logic: in an emotional state from the murder of the monarch, the artist created an anti-monarchist picture!

      More like an ordinary excuse. Otherwise, this "emotional state" can be deciphered as follows: "It was not enough that the king was blown up, he also had to hit him on the head with a club!"

      It is not very correct for me to speak for the author. My opinion Repin tried to show in this picture the state of society in Russia, a society where the tsar was killed, and one of the best rulers. Here and a look into the future (the prediction of the onset of the "time of troubles" is traced) and the impossibility of correcting the committed act, and the sin of murder.
      1. DEfindER
        DEfindER 7 October 2013 11: 43 New
        0
        Quote: Hon
        Repin tried to show my opinion in this picture the state of society in Russia,

        But why portray the greatest monarch of Russia as a murderer, especially if he was so concerned about the fate of the monarchy in Russia. With this picture, on the contrary, he fought against the autocracy!
        1. Hon
          Hon 7 October 2013 11: 52 New
          -1
          Quote: DEfindER
          But why portray the greatest monarch of Russia as a murderer, especially if he was so concerned about the fate of the monarchy in Russia. With this picture, on the contrary, he fought against the autocracy!

          But this is your opinion, and only your conclusions what Repin struggled with.
          1. DEfindER
            DEfindER 7 October 2013 13: 29 New
            0
            Quote: Hon
            But this is your opinion, and only your conclusions what Repin struggled with.

            Of course it’s mine, but here it’s already obvious that this art was carried by Russia.
            1. I think so
              I think so 8 October 2013 01: 00 New
              0
              Dear DEfindER. This picture is one of many actions aimed at the DESTRUCTION of the Russian people and in general all the Slavs. And the customer was THE AUTO POWER, oddly enough. But everyone knows all the subsequent monarchs after Ivan the Terrible were GERMANS. And they also came up with stories about the "wildness" of the Russians and their tsars. Moreover, the GERMANS rewrote the entire history of Russia, destroying almost ALL primary sources. That's it.
  19. goldfinger
    goldfinger 7 October 2013 10: 12 New
    +5
    Neighbor is Belarusian. The scandals shaking the Russian Orthodox Church - priests on Ferrari, knocking people down, hours for hundreds of thousands of dollars on Gundyaev, his palaces, nanodust in his apartment, will not lead to anything good. Consecration of weapons is a total waste! The priest of the Russian Orthodox Church consecrated the Satan rocket! Die with laughter! Obscurantism is coming. I don't want to compare, but there is no such thing in Belarus. Everything is quiet, calm. Our state is secular, although Russia too. Priests should know their place in modern life, and not go into all the holes.
    1. Combitor
      Combitor 7 October 2013 12: 27 New
      0

      Looking at what the Gundyaev flock is doing, you might think that we are rapidly flying back to the Middle Ages.
      The Bolsheviks were somewhat right in relation to the church.
    2. Setrac
      Setrac 7 October 2013 16: 26 New
      +4
      Quote: goldfinger
      Scandals shaking the Russian Orthodox Church - priests on Ferrari, knocking people down,

      Not on a Ferrari, the car was cheaper wink
      Quote: goldfinger
      The priest of the Russian Orthodox Church consecrated the Satan rocket!

      Weapons aimed at protection are sacred a priori, and the creator of "Satan" must be ranked among the saints. And this rocket is called in another way, "Satan" is called it in the West.
      Quote: goldfinger
      Priests should know their place in modern life, and not climb into all holes.

      - "Doesn't your uncle seem to you that your place is near the bucket?"
      1. goldfinger
        goldfinger 7 October 2013 18: 09 New
        -2
        [/ quote] "Doesn't your uncle think that your place is near the bucket?" [/ quote]
        I would be glad, but this is a dumb place for a long time, and deservedly (who would doubt it!) Firmly assigned to you, LIFE !!!
        1. Setrac
          Setrac 7 October 2013 21: 23 New
          -1
          Quote: goldfinger
          I would be glad, but this is a dumb place for a long time, and deservedly (who would doubt it!) Firmly assigned to you, LIFE !!!

          How cute. You accepted the quote from the famous movie as a personal insult.
          Quote: goldfinger
          Accept and so on. No respect, half-honored!

          Yes, I wanted to spit on your opinion. It’s not up to you to decide on the role of our church in our lives.
          1. goldfinger
            goldfinger 7 October 2013 22: 35 New
            0
            [/ Quote]
            Дand I wanted to spit on your opinion. It is not up to you to decide on the role of our church in our lives. [/ Quote]
            I did not express any opinion regarding boors.
            Unfortunately, Gundyaev, the head of the Russian Orthodox Church, is also related to my country.
            1. Setrac
              Setrac 7 October 2013 22: 44 New
              +1
              Quote: goldfinger
              I did not express any opinion regarding boors.

              That's right, you speak out on behalf of the boors, and then you wonder why you were sent?
      2. old rocket man
        old rocket man 9 October 2013 13: 47 New
        0
        Quote: Setrac
        Weapons aimed at protection are sacred a priori, and the creator of "Satan" must be ranked among the saints. And this rocket is called differently, "Satan"


        So I, one of the saints, that did not stop me from grabbing the minuses for the innocuous refusal to consider Grozny the people's ruler laughing
  20. Boris55
    Boris55 7 October 2013 10: 19 New
    +2
    Quote: xetai9977
    Fighting with paintings and books was already in history, and didn’t lead to anything good ...

    They fight not with paintings and books, but with the ideology that they carry.
    Any word, picture, book, film is a process of controlling consciousness, and as we think, we live like that

    Do you have any idea why "Mein Kampf" is banned? What about Wahhabi literature?
    .
  21. aszzz888
    aszzz888 7 October 2013 10: 22 New
    0
    In addition, if you remove the picture of Repin for unreliability, then what to do with others on a mythological, biblical, fairy-tale picture.


    Another quidon of woeful scientists!
    They dig, dig something, like those worms. And those who painted after sleep? Goya, Chagall ... How now do they believe what he dreamed?
  22. FunkschNNX
    FunkschNNX 7 October 2013 10: 30 New
    +4
    And who will protect my feelings from this obscurantism?!?!?!
  23. Ross
    Ross 7 October 2013 10: 46 New
    +5
    Quote: Ded_smerch
    you dispute the fact that Ivan Vasilievich did not kill his son? Would you dispute the fact that the guides, leading up to the picture, mutter "that this picture depicts a historical fact ..."?


    On so many distorted and perverted the activities of Ivan 4 of Grozny. And the picture is subliminal black PR commissioned by the same Russophobes.
  24. Strezhevchanin
    Strezhevchanin 7 October 2013 10: 56 New
    +9
    Does anyone know if the painting "Putin is killing Serdyukov" already exists?
    1. Alex Nick
      Alex Nick 7 October 2013 10: 58 New
      +1
      Yes, even planting bread.
    2. Tatanka Yotanka
      Tatanka Yotanka 7 October 2013 11: 42 New
      0
      Quote: Strezhevchanin
      Does "Putin kill Serdyukov" already exist?

      realists will not write such a picture, it’s for avant-garde or wanderers
  25. ausguck
    ausguck 7 October 2013 11: 42 New
    +3
    I think there is no need to remove the picture, this is complete nonsense and an attempt to promote on history. But to sign under it that the plot is fantastic and the author "saw it this way" (well, this is when the "artist" sculpts an installation out of go * on and then says that he "sees it this way") would be worth .... for especially stupid and other foreigners , who, as soon as it comes to Russian history, immediately recall "Ivan's Terribble" and with rolling zenoks broadcast about what a cruel sonicide he was and in general a bastard, completely forgetting their own, also not white and fluffy, rulers of that time.
  26. Black
    Black 7 October 2013 11: 54 New
    +2
    My national and patriotic feelings are offended by the forthcoming trial in the defense service case, and let Ilya Repin in the next world find Ivan at number 4 and punish him according to the picture.
  27. ed65b
    ed65b 7 October 2013 12: 10 New
    +4
    From the pioneering years I watched this picture and there was a reproduction in the history books. A heartbroken father, realizing that he had killed his own son, is holding him tightly to himself. and here it turns out to offend my feelings. Does not offend at all. But house 2 offends.
  28. Deadmen
    Deadmen 7 October 2013 12: 14 New
    +1
    I immediately said that they had in vain invented the law on insulting feelings. I can bring any thing or statement under the denominator of insulting my feelings. I think such a law will not last long. Courts are steaming over their head over delusional lawsuits.
    1. Boris55
      Boris55 7 October 2013 12: 25 New
      0
      If believers are offended
      What to do if a case has been brought against you for “insulting the feelings of believers”

      Instructions

      1) Write a statement to close the criminal case for the absence of victims. This statement from the investigator will require the collection of statements from the "so-called believers" statements that they suffered, in writing. The establishment of the fact that a person is a victim, according to the CPC, should be based on examination, the basis of the examination should be scientific research.

      2) Write a counter-defamation statement, a report of a knowingly false crime, perjury and fraud in order to use the judicial system for the purpose of enrichment.

      3) If a believer refers to Orthodoxy or Christianity, ask him to quote Matthew chapter xnumx verse xnumx. This verse clearly indicates the criteria by which a person has faith, i.e. is a believer, namely: a person must possess telekinetic abilities and move mountains or at least, based on the proportion of “mustard seed / mountain” (the minimum size in the universe, that is, for faith) - a brick weighing 1 kg 600 grams.

      Require a scientific examination to shift the strength of a word or prayer of this brick in court. If a person cannot do this, then he is no believer., with all the ensuing consequences, both for you (you make excuses) and for the so-called believer - imprisonment for knowingly false denunciation, perjury and fraud.

      Author - Alexey Borisov
  29. Combitor
    Combitor 7 October 2013 12: 21 New
    0
    <Constitution of the Russian Federation. Article 14.
    1. The Russian Federation is a secular state. No religion can be established as state or mandatory.
    2. Religious associations are separated from the state and equal before the law.>
    I would advise the Gundyaev flock not to go into state institutions with its ecclesiastical obscurantism. You have where to spend your gatherings, and go crazy there, as fantasy allows.
    I want to ask the Gundyaevites: but on the icons that you all kiss together (are not afraid to catch some infection?) And on which you pray all that is depicted, clear water is true? And your Jesus is exactly what is written on the icons? Or maybe he was a black man? Who saw him? The Shroud of Turin is not proof.
    PS The picture is called "Ivan the Terrible and his son Ivan". The title says nothing about the murder. Therefore, gentlemen, Orthodox fanatics, obscurantists, there is no need to look for the fifth end at the cross.
  30. ZU-23
    ZU-23 7 October 2013 12: 22 New
    0
    in short, the story is shrouded in mystery and it is not clear where the truth is, but they like to write pictures harder.
  31. Dymkovsky
    Dymkovsky 7 October 2013 12: 26 New
    0
    European insanity, give sprouts already with us. Alas
  32. Illyria
    Illyria 7 October 2013 12: 31 New
    +1
    This law is nonsense. That religious fanatics (not to name them differently) did not like the name of the store, they demand to rename it, now the picture did not please them. And what will happen next???
  33. helg717
    helg717 7 October 2013 12: 46 New
    0
    And let's ask Zurab Tsereteli to create a sculptural composition about the killing of these walkers, who had swung at Great Repin, and placed in the center of Moscow
  34. helg717
    helg717 7 October 2013 12: 46 New
    0
    And let's ask Zurab Tsereteli to create a sculptural composition about the killing of these walkers, who had swung at Great Repin, and placed in the center of Moscow
  35. Svarog
    Svarog 7 October 2013 12: 49 New
    0
    But it’s not easier to put a sign next to the picture, which briefly explains that this is a fictional picture. You can still forbid all cubists, since there is no scientific evidence that 3 cubes on top of each other is a tree ..
    PS I hope our "patriotic historians" will not evoke the same feelings among the people as the "English scientists"
    1. old rocket man
      old rocket man 7 October 2013 16: 26 New
      0
      Quote: Svarog
      But it’s not easier to put a sign next to the picture, which briefly explains that this is a fictional picture.


      Yeah, and also put signs on all the inscriptions on the fences that this information is not correct laughing
  36. erg
    erg 7 October 2013 13: 03 New
    0
    It seems, with such proposals, we are more and more like Americans. Those, for example, consider Mark Twain almost the father of all American literature, but nevertheless prohibit some of his works. Let's go their way or what?
  37. Admiral 013
    Admiral 013 7 October 2013 13: 06 New
    +1
    This is not patriotism; this is super idiocy! What are they trying to clean? A picture, an artistic creation of a Russian person! Sense where?
  38. Belogor
    Belogor 7 October 2013 13: 18 New
    +1
    A.S. Pushkin in the tragedy "Mozart and Salieri" also portrayed Salieri as the murderer of Mozart, although this is not true (in any case, no one proved the opposite). Following the logic of these fighters for truthfulness in art, is it necessary to prohibit this work or what?
  39. slaventi
    slaventi 7 October 2013 13: 21 New
    +4
    The painting Ivan the Terrible kills his son, written by Ilya Repin, has nothing to do with history. At that time, films were not filmed, but paintings were painted. The painting can be called a historical falsification. The painting "Ivan the Terrible and his son Ivan" is accompanied by ill fame. When purchasing the canvas, the patron of the arts Tretyakov made a reservation that it would never be exhibited. However, Tretyakov's ban was lifted and the result was immediately apparent.

    The canvas made a negative impression on the audience. They cried, fell into a stupor, fell to the ground. Finally, on one terrible day, the young icon painter Abram Balashov rushed to the picture with a knife and cut out the canvas. The vandal was tied up and taken to a mental hospital, but this did not save the gallery keeper. Seeing what had happened, he fell into insanity, ran out of the gallery and rushed under the train.
    After painting, the artist Repin's right hand dried up, and the sitters who posed for the painting suffered a terrible fate. The artist Myasoedov, from whom the image of the tsar was written, soon in anger almost killed his young son, who was also called Ivan. The tragedy befell the sitter, with whom the artist painted the image of the murdered prince. The writer Vsevolod Garshin, posing for the picture, went crazy and died in torment, throwing himself in a flight of stairs.
    1. Cynic
      Cynic 7 October 2013 13: 29 New
      0
      Quote: slaventi
      After writing the picture ...

      This can be a motivation, otherwise what is now being motivated ...
      One gets the impression that those who have problems have _ Either they are afraid for themselves, or they are afraid of others.
      Hmm, your fathers, you need to understand.
      sad
      1. Icestar777
        Icestar777 7 October 2013 13: 51 New
        +1
        Let the younger generation be better interested in history by looking at this picture than guessing in the real world we live or in a matrix wassat
    2. maklaut007
      maklaut007 8 October 2013 04: 48 New
      +1
      The picture urgently transported to the government !!!. so that the prime minister, and his ministers, as well as deputies of all stripes and levels, constantly watched her. You look at someone whose hand with an iPhone dries up, and some sort of redhead in pain will die. And let them quietly go crazy from a higher economic school.
  40. pinecone
    pinecone 7 October 2013 13: 35 New
    +2
    Quote: Ross
    Quote: Ded_smerch
    you dispute the fact that Ivan Vasilievich did not kill his son? Would you dispute the fact that the guides, leading up to the picture, mutter "that this picture depicts a historical fact ..."?


    On so many distorted and perverted the activities of Ivan 4 of Grozny. And the picture is subliminal black PR commissioned by the same Russophobes.

    I agree. Ilya Efimovich adhered to liberal views, life was bad for him in Russia, he settled in Finland. Some of his "barge haulers" are worth something. A bunch of wretched, emaciated drunks. It is not clear only where this rabble could get the strength to carry loaded barges against the current. True, he did the work under the state order for a decent remuneration. "State Council", for example.
  41. Dezzed
    Dezzed 7 October 2013 13: 38 New
    -4
    Here are bl * gentle and vulnerable patriotic souls of these learned historians and public figures.
  42. Icestar777
    Icestar777 7 October 2013 13: 39 New
    0
    Lord Poor Repin! He is probably now turning over in the grave from all these movements into the circle of his picture! Repin THE ARTIST, he painted PICTURES by a fit of heart, and not by government posters. What does the story have to do with it! What does it have to do with authenticity or unreliability, this is art, artwork, mastery of the brush and powerful transmission, experienced at that time, of the emotions of a very talented author! All! There is no need to look for anything else in this picture! As well as in other recognized works of art. hi
  43. pensioner
    pensioner 7 October 2013 13: 56 New
    +1
    According to the chairman of the organizing committee of the People’s Movement "Holy Russia"
    Wow! Serious to see the movement ... You can not hear its truth, but nothing. Let's wait. May prove themselves yet ...
    B. Boyko the Great
    Wow! Both brisk and great at the same time! Well so what organization leads! Holy Russia! Power! lol
    1. creak
      creak 7 October 2013 14: 55 New
      +1
      To the pensioner.

      It will not show, if we do not take seriously the nonsense of whoopes, who call themselves great without false modesty. Immediately I remember: "And Napoleon is in what ward?"
  44. sven27
    sven27 7 October 2013 13: 59 New
    +5
    In my opinion, this picture offends the patriotic feelings of Russians
    1. MG42
      MG42 7 October 2013 16: 41 New
      +2
      Quote: sven27
      I think this picture offends

      painting by a modern artistdo not put a hand to an empty head>
      Clickable, starts nodding his head >>
  45. morpogr
    morpogr 7 October 2013 14: 10 New
    +1
    Just add the inscription under the picture is not true, the artist’s fiction.
  46. vahatak
    vahatak 7 October 2013 14: 41 New
    +1
    I thought Repin is considered one of the greatest Russian artists, and his paintings are a manifestation of the Russian spirit. I don’t remember where, but I heard that it was he who symbolized the Russian (namely RUSSIAN) painting of his era. Wasn’t that a joke?
    1. Setrac
      Setrac 7 October 2013 17: 01 New
      -1
      Quote: vahatak
      Wasn’t that a joke?

      Well, of course not true.
  47. T-73
    T-73 7 October 2013 14: 54 New
    0
    We got out already to fight with windmills. Then the pictures of socialist realists should be prohibited, such as a lie and a lie, an insult to the feelings of the repressed, etc. Rimsky-Korsakov forbid as an instigator. If everyone begins to prohibit everything that they don’t like, what will we come to? Guardians of the Russian people sought out. They said correctly above - let them deal with the textbooks first, although there is nothing worth waiting for from such figures
  48. Drosselmeyer
    Drosselmeyer 7 October 2013 15: 00 New
    +2
    I hope they won't ban Vasnetsov's "Three Heroes"? There Alyosha, with the suspicious surname Popovich, looks suspiciously like Baskov.
  49. Cat
    Cat 7 October 2013 15: 16 New
    0
    According to the chairman of the organizing committee of the People’s Movement “Holy Russia” V. Boyko-Veliky, historian, professor of St. Petersburg University I. Froyanov, Repin’s painting, like a number of other paintings, contains slander against the Russian people, the Russian state and Russian tsars. The great collection of the Tretyakov Gallery is designed to bring the light of enlightenment and creativity to Russian people, and such works have no place in this collection of masterpieces. The painting reflects one of the "black myths" in relation to the great Russian Tsar - Ivan the Terrible. Modern historical science has no evidence of the murder of Tsarevich Ivan Ivanovich by his father. Reliable information about this in the sources of the 16th century is missing.

    In addition, it is necessary to remove in the storerooms the ancient Roman and ancient Greek paintings and sculptures - there are all kinds of Venus, Aphrodite, and other Hercules with the Apollo. There wasn’t them at all, fiction and myth, and here’s nefig to mislead people. For a complete set, it is also necessary to remove all the icons from the churches - otherwise the saints with the halo are painted there, because according to the reviews of contemporaries - everyone looked like ordinary people without a round yellow blaque on the head. Yes, and the angels on the clouds - too, not a single icon painter in my life saw why then draws, it is not good after all, historical authenticity is our EVERYTHING.
    1. Icestar777
      Icestar777 7 October 2013 15: 21 New
      -1
      In general, of course, not funny, but skated on the floor. laughing
      1. Cat
        Cat 7 October 2013 15: 53 New
        -1
        Quote: Icestar777
        In general, of course, not funny, but skated on the floor. laughing

        Yeah ... that would be funny if it weren’t so sad (s)
        1. Icestar777
          Icestar777 7 October 2013 15: 59 New
          +1
          In general, insanity is a contagious thing, and insanity in power is also dangerous.
  50. smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 7 October 2013 16: 04 New
    +5
    That is how it was ...

    In the 16 century, Ivan the Terrible came to power. During his reign in Russia:

    - jury trial was introduced;

    - free primary education (church schools);

    - medical quarantine at borders;

    - local electoral self-government, instead of governor;

    - for the first time the regular army appeared (and the first military uniform in the world was at the archers);

    - Tatar raids stopped;

    - equality was established between all segments of the population (did you know that serfdom at that time did not exist in Russia at all? The peasant was obliged to sit on the land until he paid for its rent, and nothing more. And his children were considered free from birth, in any case!).

    - slave labor is forbidden (source - the lawsuit of Ivan the Terrible);

    - The state monopoly on the fur trade, introduced by Grozny, was canceled just 10 (ten!) Years ago.

    - The territory of the country is increased by 30 times!

    - emigration of the population from Europe exceeded 30 000 families (those who settled along Zasechnaya line were paid lifting 5 rubles per family. Expenditure books were preserved).

    - The growth of the welfare of the population (and paid taxes) during the reign amounted to several thousand (!) Percent.

    - for all the reign there was not a single executed without trial, the total number of "repressed" was from three to four thousand. (And the times were dashing - remember St. Bartholomew's night).

    Now remember what you were told about Grozny at school? That he is a bloody petty tyrant and lost the Livonian war, and Russia was shaking in horror?
    http://planeta.moy.su
    / blog / chastnoe_mnenie_drugoj_vzgljad_na_istoriju_rusi_aleksandr_prozorov / 2013-01

    -28-41650
    1. Icestar777
      Icestar777 7 October 2013 16: 50 New
      +1
      Quote: Kuznetsov 1977

      Now remember what you were told about Grozny at school? That he is a bloody petty tyrant and lost the Livonian war, and Russia was shaking in horror?

      Let's not forget that We were told this in a Soviet school, then any monarch looked like a monster, a bloodsucker and an oppressor of the working people.))) However, the ideology ...
      1. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 7 October 2013 16: 54 New
        +2
        Dear Natalie, maybe we studied in different schools, but when I was in school, and I was already 36 years old, Ivan Grokhny was not watered much in history lessons, he took something like Kazan, Astrakhan took, choked the reactionary boyars, but unfortunately he went too far , in general everything is good. And in the textbook, I don't remember anything bad about him, except for the reproduction of Repin's painting. On TV, Eisenstein's brilliant film "Ivan the Terrible" was shown, with Cherkasov as the Terrible. Now I don't know what they say at school ... Best regards! hi
        1. Icestar777
          Icestar777 7 October 2013 17: 38 New
          +1
          Dear Kuznetsov 1977, we are of the same age and studied at the same time))) I can only assume that your history teacher was more objective than my historian (ISTERPI). We were presented with everything in the context of the fact that kings are bad uncles. I did not like history at school, it was not interesting.
        2. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 7 October 2013 20: 33 New
          +3
          Quote: Kuznetsov 1977
          but when I was studying, and I’m already 36 years old, I didn’t water it at the lessons of the history of Ivan Grokhny, I sort of took Kazan, took Astrakhan, strangled reactionary boyars, but unfortunately I went a little over, and everything is fine. And in the textbook, I don’t particularly remember anything bad about him

          In-in. I also remember history lessons in a Soviet school and neither a textbook nor a teacher made Grozny a maniac. Yes, it was mentioned that he was a cool character, but the emphasis was nevertheless placed on something completely different - the growth and strengthening of the Russian state during the years of his reign. Nicholas II was also more crippled than John Vasilievich.
          1. kostella85
            kostella85 7 October 2013 20: 41 New
            +1
            Marek, we don’t know what to do now, just not to do business !!!)))